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Speaker 1: Welcome to How to Money. I'm Joel, I'm Matt, and

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Speaker 1: today we're talking about Crushing your Money Goals with Bernadette Joy.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Joel, So we're joined today by expert money coach

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Speaker 2: Bernadette Joy, who we actually met for the first time

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Speaker 2: last year at this nerdy personal finance and media conference

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Speaker 2: that we often go to. We actually gave a talk

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Speaker 2: while Bernadette was the host for the entire conference, and

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Speaker 2: I've got to admit, I don't know if I've ever

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Speaker 2: met someone who was more enthusiastic about personal finance. So

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Speaker 2: we're pumped to be talking with Bernadette today her new book,

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Speaker 2: Crush Your Money Goals that came out last month, and

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Speaker 2: we're excited to dig into a ton of topics today,

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Speaker 2: like her one dot why she hates the term emergency fund.

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Speaker 2: Of course, we're going to cover her crush strategy for

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Speaker 2: goal setting as well, and hopefully we'll have time to

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Speaker 2: maybe we'll dig into her history as well, because she

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Speaker 2: has an incredible debt payoff story as well. But Bernadette,

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Speaker 2: thank you for taking the time to speak.

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Speaker 1: With us today.

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Speaker 3: Oh, thank you so much. You for having me, and

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Speaker 3: that was the best intro I've had in a long time.

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Speaker 1: Okay, I mean, who's introducing you? Then? Come on, you's

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Speaker 1: got to get better.

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Speaker 3: In Oh great question.

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Speaker 2: Right, So the enthusiasm for personal finance is that more

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Speaker 2: of like a you're stepping into the role of being

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Speaker 2: host at a conference or is this like a deep

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Speaker 2: seated desire of yours to spread the personal finance gospel.

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Speaker 3: I think it was both. I definitely have a deep

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Speaker 3: seated passion of the biggest word that people often use

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Speaker 3: for me is energy, But I think it was probably

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Speaker 3: times ten because at the time that you and I met,

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Speaker 3: we were at the end of the conference. I was like, woaho,

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Speaker 3: we're going to go to a happy hour after.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that doesn't motivate anyone, right, Well, the first question

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Speaker 1: we got to ask you, Bernadette, is what do you

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Speaker 1: like to splore? John Matt and I we call it

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Speaker 1: our craft beer equivalent because we spend decent trucks of

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Speaker 1: change on good craft beer. Boy, Hey, it's okay because

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Speaker 1: we're still being smart, saving and investing for our future.

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Speaker 1: What's that thing for you?

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Speaker 3: So my craft beer equivalent is k pop and it

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Speaker 3: comes in a lot of different forms. It's going to concerts,

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Speaker 3: it's buying merch, it's supporting the artists. It's something I

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Speaker 3: spend a lot of money on that a lot of

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Speaker 3: people may not understand.

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Speaker 2: All right, So is BTS? Are they still the biggest

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Speaker 2: oh good yeah pop band out there?

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Speaker 3: So K pop?

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Speaker 2: Because I feel like they disbanded because some of them

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Speaker 2: had to serve in the South. So I'm half Korean

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Speaker 2: by the way, so I have some familiarity with kpkay

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Speaker 2: and all things k k okay.

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Speaker 3: So BTS has not disbanded because people get very upset

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Speaker 3: if you tell them that they disbanded. They're just basically

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Speaker 3: on hiatus right now while they serve in the military.

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Speaker 3: They will be back in twenty twenty six, they said,

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Speaker 3: with a new album. In concert tickets, But I follow

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Speaker 3: a lot of different groups in K pop, BTS is

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Speaker 3: my favorite. I've spent a lot of money. I've seen

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Speaker 3: them in concert four times and those tickets are not cheap.

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Speaker 3: And as a K pop fan I mentioned to you earlier,

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Speaker 3: I actually do go to Atlanta quite a bit because

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Speaker 3: K pop never comes to Charlotte. They usually stop in Atlanta.

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Speaker 3: So if you add up all of the money that

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Speaker 3: you have to spend to just get to these concerts.

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Speaker 3: It can add up to a lot. But I can't

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Speaker 3: tell you where else in the world or where else

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Speaker 3: in history have I felt more joy than being at

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Speaker 3: a btsest.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean when you know that it's worth of

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Speaker 1: poning up the money and yeah, it's not like you're

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Speaker 1: going into debt for it, So it's totally fine. Right.

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Speaker 2: Would it be so sad if the guys come back

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Speaker 2: in twenty twenty six and it's like so much more

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Speaker 2: serious because of their exposure to the military.

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Speaker 1: They say the drama album.

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Speaker 3: Well, it's funny because they're actually they've all done solo

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Speaker 3: albums and there's already been some of that happening. So

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Speaker 3: I think we're a little more prepared for when they

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Speaker 3: all come back.

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Speaker 2: Okay, man, I know who to go to if I'm

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Speaker 2: looking for some behind the scenes, Right, But did that

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Speaker 2: Let's kind of dig into your your past a little

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Speaker 2: bit what happened back in twenty sixteen, because it sounds

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Speaker 2: like that that was the year that you know, maybe

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Speaker 2: you start taking personal fight and it's a little bit

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Speaker 2: more seriously.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, So twenty sixteen was the year that I was

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Speaker 3: set to graduate from my master's in business. I went

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Speaker 3: to the Kingdon Flagler School and expensive degree. It was

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Speaker 3: over one hundred and twenty thousand dollars when I looked

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Speaker 3: back on it. I didn't realize it was that much

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Speaker 3: when I signed up for it. And I was in

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Speaker 3: my last semester of my program in January and I

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Speaker 3: had ten weeks left, and I said to myself, I

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Speaker 3: should probably go check out how much I owe in

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Speaker 3: student loans. But it can't be that much because I

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Speaker 3: have been paying for it some along the way. I

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Speaker 3: did get a little bit of a scholarship, so how

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Speaker 3: much could it possibly be? Not realizing it was seventy

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Speaker 3: two thousand dollars, and I essentially had what I called

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Speaker 3: my quarter life crisis, where I literally dropped to the

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Speaker 3: floor and started crying about how I had gotten into

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Speaker 3: so much debt.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you're not alone in that, right that. I think

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Speaker 1: that's a common experience for people, and especially hopefully we're

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Speaker 1: more more cognisant of student loan debt on the front end.

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Speaker 1: Now maybe there's a little bit more education around it,

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Speaker 1: but there's still a lot of seventeen eighteen year olds

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Speaker 1: going to college not thinking about the costs, and then

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Speaker 1: four years later, they're like, oh my gosh, what have

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Speaker 1: I done? You had what three hundred thousand dollars in

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Speaker 1: debt overall? And I believe you said your plan was

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Speaker 1: just to work hard, maybe take some of the notes

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Speaker 1: of the grindstone mentality. How did that work out?

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Speaker 3: It worked for a little while until I got completely

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Speaker 3: burned out and started rethinking all of my life choices.

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Speaker 3: And I'm first generation Filipino American. My father had nine kids.

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Speaker 3: I'm the eighth of the nine kids, and there is

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Speaker 3: just always this mentality that you have to work hard,

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Speaker 3: and that money is scarce, and that it's actually hard

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Speaker 3: to make money. And so I thought that the solution

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Speaker 3: to this was, Okay, after I graduate from this prestigious program,

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Speaker 3: I'm going to get a really great paying job and

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Speaker 3: then just work on paying off the student loans and

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Speaker 3: work off paying all of these other debts, and then

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Speaker 3: everything will be fine. Right. Except when I was planning

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Speaker 3: to graduate, I had no desire to go back to

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Speaker 3: a corporate job, and I was actually thinking about becoming

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Speaker 3: an entrepreneur someday. And that's where I realized that working hard,

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Speaker 3: especially working hard for another employer, might not be the

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Speaker 3: right path for me.

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Speaker 2: Did any of the fact that you being a Frisian immigrant,

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Speaker 2: I guess how much did that impact maybe how you

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Speaker 2: viewed the world, how you viewed your debt, how you

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Speaker 2: viewed your career, and maybe sort of the path that

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Speaker 2: you might pursue.

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Speaker 3: It was a huge part of how I viewed not

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Speaker 3: just the world, but finances in general and specifically personal finance.

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Speaker 3: My father was actually an accountant by trade, my mom

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Speaker 3: was a bookkeeper, and then my younger brother ended up

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Speaker 3: becoming an accountant also, and so there's this whole idea that, oh, well,

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Speaker 3: if you're good with money kind of academically, that it

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Speaker 3: should be fine personally. But it turned out that my

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Speaker 3: father was not great with money personally for a lot

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Speaker 3: of different reasons. He had a ton of debt actually

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Speaker 3: throughout his lifetime also, and he was someone who was

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Speaker 3: supposed to be good with money because he did finances

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Speaker 3: for a company. So when I realized specifically that there's

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Speaker 3: also these kind of cultural values in Filipino culture where

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Speaker 3: you don't talk about how much money you have, but

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Speaker 3: you show people by your nice car and your nice

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Speaker 3: house and your nice clothes, but you are never allowed

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Speaker 3: to tell people that you're struggling. I really had a

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Speaker 3: hard time reconciling my cultural values with what was actually

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Speaker 3: happening to me personally.

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Speaker 1: What did your debt payoff strategy look like? What were

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Speaker 1: you tapping into and what sort of route were you

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Speaker 1: trying to take when you realize, because that could be

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Speaker 1: an overwhelming amount to be like, okay, three hundred thousand

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Speaker 1: dollars in debt racked up, where do I even start?

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Speaker 1: Some people get just completely frazzled, up ended in the

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Speaker 1: beginning and they just kind of go Ostrich effect and

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Speaker 1: buried their head in the sand. What were the practical

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Speaker 1: steps for you when it came to kind of getting

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Speaker 1: rid of that debt going down that path?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well, if I'd be totally honest, I did bury

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Speaker 3: my head in the sand for a good forty eight

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Speaker 3: hours for I let myself feel my feelings about what

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Speaker 3: kind of decisions they had to make, and really thinking

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Speaker 3: about what I wanted to do next. But once I

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Speaker 3: got my head out of my butt, I would say

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Speaker 3: I started first looking at just the student loans, which

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Speaker 3: was seventy two thousand dollars of the three hundred thousand dollars,

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Speaker 3: and I went and looked at what that total amount

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Speaker 3: was broken up to, and it was actually broken up

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Speaker 3: into several smaller loans. A couple and we're twenty thousand dollars.

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Speaker 3: A couple of them were ten thousand, a couple of

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Speaker 3: them were five thousand dollars. And I decided to go

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Speaker 3: with a snowball approach because truth be told, back then,

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Speaker 3: all I did was google what was out there, and

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Speaker 3: at the time, the guy with the most advertising dollars

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Speaker 3: was Dave Ramsey, and so I just listened a lot

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Speaker 3: to his podcast, and I tried this snowball method, which

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Speaker 3: felt felt like it resonated with me in the sense

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Speaker 3: of I am the type of person who if I

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Speaker 3: don't see progress in a short amount of time, I

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Speaker 3: will just give up. I will just get home and

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Speaker 3: not keep going.

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Speaker 1: I think most people know what the snowball method is,

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Speaker 1: but will you just quickly explain what and why you

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Speaker 1: went with that and kind of the thinking behind why

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Speaker 1: that's superior?

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Speaker 3: Sure, So, the snowball method simply says that, regardless of

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Speaker 3: interest rate, you go for tackling your debts from smallest

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Speaker 3: amount to biggest amount. So in the case of my

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Speaker 3: student loans, I decided to tackle these smaller five thousand

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Speaker 3: dollar loans first before I tried to tackle these twenty

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Speaker 3: thousand dollars loans. And I broke it up into these

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Speaker 3: different segments versus thinking, oh, I have seventy two thousand

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Speaker 3: dollars all together, I don't know where to start with that,

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Speaker 3: But can I figure out how to just pay off

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Speaker 3: this first five thousand dollars to get some momentum. And

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Speaker 3: that was hugely helpful for me to actually see these loans,

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Speaker 3: say closed, have zero balance on them before I moved

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Speaker 3: on to the bigger ones. But I will say that

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Speaker 3: I did that snowball method in the sense of you

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Speaker 3: have to pair that with well, how are you actually

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Speaker 3: going to get money to pay towards the debt? And

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Speaker 3: I did what everyone else did in the beginning. I

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Speaker 3: just I hustled a lot. I got my husband to

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Speaker 3: hustle a lot. I mean we were doing all sorts

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Speaker 3: of stuff. We were extras on TV, we were I mean,

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Speaker 3: he was driving uber, I was selling jewelry. I mean

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Speaker 3: I started I actually started charging people to help review

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Speaker 3: their resumes because back then I was in HR and

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Speaker 3: that eventually turned into my financial education program. I never

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Speaker 3: knew that was going to turn into my next career,

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Speaker 3: but we tried a lot of different things of okay,

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Speaker 3: instead of trying to figure out new skill sets, like

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Speaker 3: what skill sets do we already have and how could

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Speaker 3: we make even a little bit of money towards it

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Speaker 3: better than trying to waste time trying to figure out

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Speaker 3: something new.

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Speaker 1: So, okay, I'm curious. I want to dig just a

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Speaker 1: little bit on the side hustle. Thing Like driving for

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Speaker 1: Uber is one thing, right, I think that's like the

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Speaker 1: easy button. But it sounds like you were able to

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Speaker 1: find other ways to make money that were more in

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Speaker 1: line with the skill set that you had, that could

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Speaker 1: potentially earn you more than just like the lowest common

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Speaker 1: denominator side hustle. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I had two side hustles back then. Both of

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Speaker 3: them ended up turning into full time businesses later down

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Speaker 3: the road, and they were completely unrelated. One of them

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Speaker 3: was to help people review their resumes. I would literally

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Speaker 3: either just give them feedback on their resume or I

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Speaker 3: would edit their resumes for them. Obviously, editing them would

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Speaker 3: cost them more money, and I started charging nineteen dollars

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Speaker 3: for that, and then I eventually over time was able

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Speaker 3: to charge four hundred dollars for that. See a pretty

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Speaker 3: big increase, Yeah, pretty big increase. It was little by little,

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Speaker 3: But I actually had a really great client one day

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Speaker 3: who told me he was the nicest person. He told me,

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Speaker 3: you severely undercharged me for this, so you did a

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Speaker 3: really good job. Yeah. I thought that was really nice.

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Speaker 3: I'll always remember that. And then my other side hustle

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Speaker 3: was actually helping women get dressed for special occasions. And

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Speaker 3: so I collected all of these dresses from different women

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Speaker 3: who weren't using it at the time. I said, let

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Speaker 3: me borrow these dresses and lend them to other women

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Speaker 3: and help them get dressed for these events. And that

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Speaker 3: turned into another side hustle that I actually found to

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Speaker 3: be really fun, but also started started helping me think

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Speaker 3: about personal finance because I saw how much women were

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Speaker 3: spending on these dresses that they were only wearing one time.

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Speaker 1: That's like rent the runway, but on a very individual level.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I was. Actually I built it as the local

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Speaker 3: rent runway in Charlotte. I was the only game in

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Speaker 3: town Belk at the time. I used to have people

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Speaker 3: who would come to me and they would say, oh,

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Speaker 3: I went to Belch to go look for address there

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Speaker 3: and they told me to come here, and so that

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Speaker 3: was pretty fun that people did.

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Speaker 2: That's amazing, And so you eliminated all that debt. And

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Speaker 2: at this point, you know, it seems like you're set

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Speaker 2: to retire like in your forties because of all this

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Speaker 2: hard work and the smart money moves that you've made.

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Speaker 2: But I've heard you say too that you don't have

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Speaker 2: any desire to actually retire early. And maybe that has

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Speaker 2: something to do with the energy that you.

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Speaker 1: Bring to life.

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Speaker 2: Why then, have you worked so dang hard and invested

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Speaker 2: in the way that you happen over the past few years.

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Speaker 3: You know, I'm still unraveling what that might mean for me.

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Speaker 3: I turned forty this year, and I never imagined that

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Speaker 3: I would have enough invested that I could retire if

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Speaker 3: I wanted to. So I spent so much time I'm

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Speaker 3: in the last couple of years, and I think this

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Speaker 3: is some of the downside I think of being very

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Speaker 3: enamored with personal finances that you can get wrapped up

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Speaker 3: in it so much so that you don't really think

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Speaker 3: about what you would do once you actually complete the

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Speaker 3: goal later on. And so I'm unraveling that right now.

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Speaker 3: And I've had really interesting conversations with other financial experts

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Speaker 3: in their fifties and sixties. I had another financial expert

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Speaker 3: who told me, he said, you know what, BS, I

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Speaker 3: bet you you're going to be back in three years

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Speaker 3: if you decided to retire now, because you're not going

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Speaker 3: to be able to sit still. And I said to him,

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Speaker 3: you know what, that might be true three.

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Speaker 1: Years, more like three months.

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Speaker 3: I said, that could be true. But you know what,

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Speaker 3: I have never had in an extended period of time

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Speaker 3: in my forty years on Earth where I just did

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Speaker 3: whatever I wanted and I didn't think about money. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: and so I just want to try it. So this

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Speaker 3: year I'm planning to travel a ton more than I

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Speaker 3: have before. My husband and I are actually going to

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Speaker 3: do that whole full time digital nomap. We were kind

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Speaker 3: of part time at this point. And I also decided

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Speaker 3: that I want to just focus on some of the

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Speaker 3: things that I have been interested in but have been

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Speaker 3: scared to do. So I mentioned to you before we

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Speaker 3: got on here that I am taking improv classes and

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Speaker 3: I'm excited for that. I just signed up for swimming lessons.

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Speaker 3: Here's a fun fact I don't know how to swim.

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Speaker 3: I have never carved out the time to go learn

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Speaker 3: how to swim, and it's kind of embarrassing to go

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Speaker 3: look for adult swimming lessons because all of the swimming

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Speaker 3: lessons are for kids. But I found one yesterday and

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Speaker 3: I'm really excited.

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Speaker 1: Great.

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Speaker 2: You don't understand full immersion swimming is evidently what it's

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Speaker 2: all about.

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Speaker 1: Oh really, what does that mean? I think you were talking.

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Speaker 2: About it like a decade ago, but like basically like

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Speaker 2: there's a natural instinct to keep your face above water,

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Speaker 2: but it's sort of like the exact opposite of the

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Speaker 2: natural inclination and just literally maybe forcing your face into

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Speaker 2: the water because that's how you're able to essentially streamline,

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Speaker 2: and that's how you swim, and not only swim, but

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Speaker 2: swe fast. But aside from that, Oh, you said something

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Speaker 2: about y'all doing like the full nomad thing like you've

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Speaker 2: done sort of like maybe the part time digital no

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Speaker 2: mad life. I think a part of maybe what allows

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Speaker 2: you to do that is the fact that you don't

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Speaker 2: own your own home.

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Speaker 1: Is that right?

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Speaker 2: Is that still the case? From what I understand?

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Speaker 1: You rent?

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Speaker 2: And is that flexibility a big part of what factored

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Speaker 2: into that for y'all.

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Speaker 3: Yes, So, my husband and I, part of some of

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Speaker 3: that debt that we had paid off was also a

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Speaker 3: mortgage debt, and we decided one day to sell all

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Speaker 3: of our real estate that we had and we decided

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Speaker 3: to go back to renting, and people around us really

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Speaker 3: thought we were crazy. They were like, I don't understand

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Speaker 3: why you would have a paid off home and then

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Speaker 3: sell it, And my husband and I one day we

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Speaker 3: realized and unfortunately it wasn't a kind of happy scenario.

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Speaker 3: But my father passed away suddenly in twenty twenty one,

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Speaker 3: and it was still when the pandemic wasn't allowing people

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Speaker 3: to have these mass gatherings, and so my husband and

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Speaker 3: I had to fly to Las Vegas, where my mom

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Speaker 3: and my father lived, to help take care of things,

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Speaker 3: and I had to take some time off of work,

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Speaker 3: which I was so grateful by that point that we

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Speaker 3: had saved up enough money that if I needed to

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Speaker 3: take time, an extended period of time off of work,

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Speaker 3: I could do that. But when we came back and

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Speaker 3: we had done the whole airbnb situation, we were like, Okay,

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Speaker 3: well we still need to make money off of this property.

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Speaker 3: Let's try to airb and be it, and I had

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Speaker 3: this airbnb guest who was complaining about she didn't know

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Speaker 3: where to put the soap in the shower, and at

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Speaker 3: the time, I was thinking, Okay, my father just passed away,

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Speaker 3: Like this is really not a problem that I care

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Speaker 3: about right now. And so I thought about, well, if

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Speaker 3: we're going to travel like this for extended periods of time,

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Speaker 3: either we leave the house empty or we're going to

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Speaker 3: rent it out, but have potential scenarios like this where

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Speaker 3: people are reaching out to us for things that we

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Speaker 3: need to do for property management. So we said, you

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Speaker 3: know what, let's see what it looks like to not

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Speaker 3: have real estate. And we also wanted to live closer

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Speaker 3: to where we wanted to be. We had lived out

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Speaker 3: in the suburbs, and there's no shade against the suburbs.

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Speaker 3: I really enjoyed living there, but for us at this

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Speaker 3: moment in our our our lives, we were more interested

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Speaker 3: in being closer to the arts and closer to where

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Speaker 3: my clients were, and so we decided to rent. But

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Speaker 3: now it's afforded us the ability to not only travel

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Speaker 3: more frequently, but I've taken the amount of money that

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Speaker 3: we took from real estate and started practicing other types

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Speaker 3: of investment.

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Speaker 1: I think you're pointing out something here like this is

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Speaker 1: like a perpetual debate in personal finance. Right is the

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Speaker 1: rent versus buy conundrum? And there are brilliant points on

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Speaker 1: both sides of the equation. There was somebody the other

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Speaker 1: day in our Facebook group who lambassed us for offering

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Speaker 1: any sort of nuanced take about buying versus renting, and

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Speaker 1: he was basically saying buying is always the right decision.

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Speaker 1: Buy now before prices continue to go up. And that's

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Speaker 1: just not taking into account people's different individual situations, their hopes,

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Speaker 1: their dreams, their desires, like their desired level of flexibility,

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Speaker 1: And yeah, I don't know. How do you help people

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Speaker 1: think through whether they should be buyers or renters.

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Speaker 3: I do this frequently with all of my coaching clients.

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Speaker 3: And one of the first things I do when I

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Speaker 3: take them on as a coaching client is I do

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Speaker 3: this exercise with them. It's called it would be cool

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Speaker 3: if and for five minutes, I just have them do

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Speaker 3: this stream of consciousness, just keep answering this question. It

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Speaker 3: would be cool if X, y Z and almost always

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Speaker 3: travel comes up. It would be cool if I could

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Speaker 3: travel the world. It could be cool if I travel

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Speaker 3: to Europe, or it would be cool if I could,

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Speaker 3: you know, spend more time in these other places. It

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Speaker 3: has never come up on anyone's it would be cool

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Speaker 3: list to say it would be cool if I, you know,

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Speaker 3: had chores and mowed the lawn and had to fix

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Speaker 3: the roof. Like, no one ever says that on there

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Speaker 3: it would be cool if. But they do say it

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Speaker 3: would be cool if I owned a home. But then

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Speaker 3: when I ask them, well, what does it mean to

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Speaker 3: be a homeowner to you? Maybe it's because some of

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Speaker 3: the clients that I work with tend to be kind

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Speaker 3: of older millennials or Gen xers, But their immediate reaction

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Speaker 3: is quite surprised because they've never been questioned on why

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Speaker 3: they even want to own a home in the first place.

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Speaker 1: It's almost like they've been indoctrinated and that our culture

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Speaker 1: has told them, Hey, when don't you reach a certain age,

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Speaker 1: that's what you're supposed to do. And the essentially the economics,

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Speaker 1: the facts be damned, because it doesn't matter if it's

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Speaker 1: like fifteen hundred dollars a month cheaper to rent and

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Speaker 1: you could massively you know, increase your investments and fast,

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Speaker 1: you know, fast track your financial success and continue to

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Speaker 1: grow your net worth. It's like, well, that's the thing

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Speaker 1: I'm supposed to do, so I guess that's the direction

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Speaker 1: I'm going in.

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Speaker 3: That's literally what they say, they've said to me. I

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Speaker 3: had one person in particularly, she said, what do you mean?

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Speaker 3: And I said, why do you want to own a home?

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Speaker 3: And she said to me, isn't aren't I supposed to

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Speaker 3: want to? And I said, well, are you? And then

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Speaker 3: she said, oh my god, no one has ever asked

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Speaker 3: me this question before. My whole world is turned upside down.

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Speaker 3: And and so before you decide that you want to

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Speaker 3: buy home. I do think it's important to weigh the

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Speaker 3: pros and cons of owning a home. I was a homeowner,

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Speaker 3: so don't get me wrong. I do there's value in

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Speaker 3: owning a home. But I also think that there's value

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Speaker 3: in owning home homes at certain stages of your life.

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Speaker 3: And I also think that there is always a trade

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Speaker 3: off when you decide to put most of your money

439
00:20:10,840 --> 00:20:14,440
Speaker 3: or most of your wealth building kind of energy towards

440
00:20:14,680 --> 00:20:17,639
Speaker 3: real estate versus For me, as a trade off, I

441
00:20:17,760 --> 00:20:19,960
Speaker 3: decided to take a lot of that money, as I mentioned,

442
00:20:19,960 --> 00:20:24,119
Speaker 3: and put it towards other investments, particularly looking towards becoming

443
00:20:24,160 --> 00:20:27,639
Speaker 3: an angel investor for other underrepresented companies, but then also

444
00:20:27,920 --> 00:20:31,080
Speaker 3: to invest into my own business, which just for me personally,

445
00:20:31,119 --> 00:20:33,800
Speaker 3: I get a lot more joy out of running this

446
00:20:33,920 --> 00:20:36,600
Speaker 3: membership that I have writing this book than I ever

447
00:20:36,720 --> 00:20:42,880
Speaker 3: did on painting my bathroom. And you know, planting every

448
00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:45,440
Speaker 3: I don't know if you guys have this in Atlanta tube,

449
00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:47,680
Speaker 3: but in Charlotte, clay is such a thing where it's

450
00:20:47,720 --> 00:20:51,160
Speaker 3: really hard to plant things. And so I was constantly

451
00:20:51,240 --> 00:20:53,240
Speaker 3: fighting with my yard, and I finally just decided I

452
00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:54,640
Speaker 3: don't want to fight with my yard anymore.

453
00:20:55,920 --> 00:20:56,080
Speaker 1: Do that.

454
00:20:56,160 --> 00:20:58,560
Speaker 2: Let's just go ahead and zero escaping enough but rocks

455
00:20:58,920 --> 00:21:02,320
Speaker 2: exactly exactly, But no, I think that's so true. It

456
00:21:02,359 --> 00:21:06,400
Speaker 2: oftentimes folks aren't taking the time necessary to self examine

457
00:21:06,560 --> 00:21:09,280
Speaker 2: and to figure out and it takes time. You can't

458
00:21:09,320 --> 00:21:11,240
Speaker 2: just like decide you know what it is that you're

459
00:21:11,320 --> 00:21:14,480
Speaker 2: drawn to like. It takes some exploration, and oftentimes we

460
00:21:14,560 --> 00:21:16,480
Speaker 2: are not giving ourselves the space to be able to

461
00:21:16,480 --> 00:21:18,520
Speaker 2: do that. But Bernadette, we've got more to get to.

462
00:21:18,680 --> 00:21:21,960
Speaker 2: Of course, we're going to talk about your crush framework

463
00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:22,880
Speaker 2: to attacking your goals.

464
00:21:22,920 --> 00:21:32,800
Speaker 1: We'll get to that and more right after this. All right,

465
00:21:32,840 --> 00:21:35,160
Speaker 1: we're back. We're still talking with Bernadette Joy. We're talking

466
00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:39,640
Speaker 1: about crushing your money goals. So much fun information already

467
00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:44,080
Speaker 1: and great conversation. But let's specifically get to goal setting, Bernadette.

468
00:21:44,080 --> 00:21:46,760
Speaker 1: And this is the time of year still where people

469
00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:49,480
Speaker 1: are really thinking about their goals and what they want

470
00:21:49,480 --> 00:21:52,560
Speaker 1: to accomplish in a new year. And we've all heard of,

471
00:21:52,600 --> 00:21:56,320
Speaker 1: I think at this point, smart goals. But you say

472
00:21:56,320 --> 00:22:00,000
Speaker 1: that your crush approach is superior. What is your crush

473
00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:01,720
Speaker 1: approach to goal setting? And why?

474
00:22:02,119 --> 00:22:04,600
Speaker 3: Okay, so I do have a beef with smart goals

475
00:22:04,600 --> 00:22:06,880
Speaker 3: because I was an HR professional that used to teach

476
00:22:06,920 --> 00:22:09,200
Speaker 3: smart goals in the corporate.

477
00:22:08,800 --> 00:22:11,359
Speaker 1: World and it sounds demoralizing.

478
00:22:11,560 --> 00:22:14,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, And actually that's really what my beef with it

479
00:22:14,160 --> 00:22:16,000
Speaker 3: was was that, you know, one of the things that

480
00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:19,480
Speaker 3: smart Goals teaches is about being realistic or relevant, which

481
00:22:19,520 --> 00:22:22,439
Speaker 3: I understand the concept of it in the R but

482
00:22:22,600 --> 00:22:24,800
Speaker 3: what I found is that people end up making goals

483
00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:28,680
Speaker 3: that are too small and then really not being able

484
00:22:28,680 --> 00:22:30,960
Speaker 3: to reach financial freedom. And that's really what I teach

485
00:22:31,040 --> 00:22:34,639
Speaker 3: versus financial literacy, and so crush is my kind of

486
00:22:34,760 --> 00:22:37,560
Speaker 3: anecdote to the smart goals where if you want to

487
00:22:37,600 --> 00:22:40,280
Speaker 3: be more than just financially literate, but you actually want

488
00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:43,639
Speaker 3: to reach financial independence, you can use this framework that

489
00:22:43,760 --> 00:22:45,760
Speaker 3: spells out the word crush and it's fun.

490
00:22:45,840 --> 00:22:49,000
Speaker 1: By the way, the goal setting inside of a company,

491
00:22:49,880 --> 00:22:52,600
Speaker 1: you want to make it really easy to attain. That's

492
00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:55,600
Speaker 1: so that you look good to your boss at the

493
00:22:55,600 --> 00:22:58,200
Speaker 1: goal review time, Whereas when we're talking about setting goals

494
00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:00,159
Speaker 1: for your personal life, you can be a lot more

495
00:23:00,200 --> 00:23:01,280
Speaker 1: ambitious and audacious.

496
00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:03,200
Speaker 3: You know, that is a great distinction. I never thought

497
00:23:03,200 --> 00:23:05,640
Speaker 3: about that until you said it. So thank you that

498
00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:07,240
Speaker 3: that is so true.

499
00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:09,240
Speaker 1: And I mean I remember setting mine back in the

500
00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:10,520
Speaker 1: day and I was like, I'm not going to make

501
00:23:10,560 --> 00:23:11,200
Speaker 1: this too hard.

502
00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:14,679
Speaker 3: That's exactly right. You want to put stuff that you

503
00:23:14,720 --> 00:23:16,360
Speaker 3: know you can achieve, so when you come at year

504
00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:18,320
Speaker 3: end review, you're like, oh, I did all that stuff.

505
00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:21,679
Speaker 3: And oddly, what I train people to do and it's

506
00:23:21,760 --> 00:23:25,720
Speaker 3: not for everyone, but I train people to reach financial independence,

507
00:23:25,720 --> 00:23:28,280
Speaker 3: which is a very lofty goal for the vast majority

508
00:23:28,320 --> 00:23:31,159
Speaker 3: of us. And so the thought process is to really

509
00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:33,560
Speaker 3: train more like an Olympian and say all right, I'm

510
00:23:33,560 --> 00:23:34,920
Speaker 3: going to go for the gold medal. But you know

511
00:23:35,000 --> 00:23:37,639
Speaker 3: what if I end up only reaching silver or bronze,

512
00:23:37,720 --> 00:23:39,560
Speaker 3: or not even making the podium, or not even making

513
00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:41,280
Speaker 3: it to the Olympics, I think I'm going to still

514
00:23:41,280 --> 00:23:42,560
Speaker 3: be better off if I give.

515
00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:42,720
Speaker 1: It a go.

516
00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:46,600
Speaker 3: And I really like that mentality for financial freedom, but

517
00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:48,800
Speaker 3: it takes a lot of rewiring for people because we're

518
00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:50,920
Speaker 3: so used to, like you said, setting the bar low

519
00:23:50,960 --> 00:23:52,480
Speaker 3: for ourselves so we can feel like we checked it

520
00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:55,399
Speaker 3: off a list, versus setting the bar high and even failing,

521
00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:56,920
Speaker 3: which will be better than where we are now.

522
00:23:57,040 --> 00:23:58,639
Speaker 2: I totally get that, but I guess that thinking back

523
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:01,680
Speaker 2: to your story, there's something to be said about checking

524
00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:03,840
Speaker 2: things off your list, right, Like for you, you mentioned

525
00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:07,320
Speaker 2: the snowball method to paying down your debt, and like

526
00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:10,640
Speaker 2: when you get those little wins, like that's so encouraging

527
00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:12,640
Speaker 2: to have that win at your back. But maybe maybe

528
00:24:12,880 --> 00:24:14,400
Speaker 2: the idea is to be able to transfer that into

529
00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:18,159
Speaker 2: something bigger, something more audacious. But we want you to

530
00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:22,919
Speaker 2: unpack this crush approach and the sea stands for curating

531
00:24:23,160 --> 00:24:25,080
Speaker 2: our accounts? Can you explain that?

532
00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:25,240
Speaker 1: Why?

533
00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:26,560
Speaker 2: Why is that the first thing you want?

534
00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:27,040
Speaker 1: Folks? To do.

535
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:29,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, So to your point, I realized I used to

536
00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:31,720
Speaker 3: have people start off with a big lofty goal first

537
00:24:31,800 --> 00:24:33,960
Speaker 3: and then and then people would get really deflated and

538
00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:37,160
Speaker 3: not do anything. And so the sea stands for getting

539
00:24:37,200 --> 00:24:39,520
Speaker 3: a quick win fast, which is just to figure out

540
00:24:39,520 --> 00:24:42,679
Speaker 3: where all your accounts are, get them into one tool

541
00:24:43,119 --> 00:24:45,400
Speaker 3: that you can see everything that goes in and out

542
00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:50,560
Speaker 3: of your assets and liabilities, and having a clear picture

543
00:24:50,600 --> 00:24:52,800
Speaker 3: of what you have. What I found with most people

544
00:24:53,080 --> 00:24:55,040
Speaker 3: is that they have no idea where all their stuff is.

545
00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:58,200
Speaker 3: For example, I mean everyone doesn't know where they're for

546
00:24:58,280 --> 00:24:59,760
Speaker 3: to one k from their old company is sitting. They

547
00:24:59,760 --> 00:25:01,920
Speaker 3: have no much, they have no idea how much it is,

548
00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:04,199
Speaker 3: They don't know exactly how much their debt is. And

549
00:25:04,280 --> 00:25:07,080
Speaker 3: so curating your account simply says to act like a

550
00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:10,480
Speaker 3: curator and not a hoarder and make sure that every

551
00:25:10,480 --> 00:25:13,360
Speaker 3: account that you own actually has a very clear purpose

552
00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:16,719
Speaker 3: and is accounted for. And I like to use the

553
00:25:16,720 --> 00:25:19,199
Speaker 3: tool of monarch money. It's not something I'm sponsored on

554
00:25:19,320 --> 00:25:21,119
Speaker 3: or anything. I just really like the tool where I

555
00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:23,320
Speaker 3: can see every single account that I own in one space,

556
00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:26,520
Speaker 3: versus just looking at my checking account or my savings account.

557
00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:28,240
Speaker 1: One of the one of the accounts that a lot

558
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:30,199
Speaker 1: of people have and that a lot of personal finance

559
00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:32,800
Speaker 1: experts US included. So you're charding on some toes. Over here,

560
00:25:32,840 --> 00:25:35,679
Speaker 1: Bernadette is having an emergency fund. We talk about that.

561
00:25:36,040 --> 00:25:38,400
Speaker 1: You don't like that term, so let's battle it out.

562
00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:42,000
Speaker 3: So I call it my keep comm fund. What I

563
00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:44,800
Speaker 3: found I had a specific client. This is why I

564
00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:49,119
Speaker 3: changed it is she was so excited. She never had

565
00:25:49,119 --> 00:25:51,840
Speaker 3: an emergency fund before. And so when she finally saved

566
00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:56,399
Speaker 3: up her emergency fund, two months later, her basement legit

567
00:25:56,480 --> 00:26:00,120
Speaker 3: flooded and I'm talking about, you know, up to your

568
00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:03,119
Speaker 3: knees kind of flood. And she ended up putting it

569
00:26:03,200 --> 00:26:07,280
Speaker 3: back on a credit card, and I when she when

570
00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:10,280
Speaker 3: she and I met, she said, oh, yeah, my basement flooded,

571
00:26:10,320 --> 00:26:12,000
Speaker 3: and so now I have to pay off this credit card.

572
00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:14,359
Speaker 3: And I said, wait, why did you put it on

573
00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:16,000
Speaker 3: the credit card? Why didn't you use the cash that

574
00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:17,639
Speaker 3: you had on hand? And she was just like, I

575
00:26:17,720 --> 00:26:20,879
Speaker 3: thought that was for emergencies. I said, what other emergency.

576
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:22,600
Speaker 2: Is there.

577
00:26:23,119 --> 00:26:26,600
Speaker 3: Other than your basement flooding? And so I realized that

578
00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:30,160
Speaker 3: a lot of people literally think of emergency as life

579
00:26:30,280 --> 00:26:34,560
Speaker 3: or death and so that framing wasn't working for a

580
00:26:34,560 --> 00:26:37,119
Speaker 3: lot of my clients. But I also reframed it to

581
00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:40,000
Speaker 3: say it's a keep calm fund, as in, this is

582
00:26:40,040 --> 00:26:42,760
Speaker 3: the fund that you can tap into, not even when

583
00:26:42,760 --> 00:26:45,800
Speaker 3: there's just emergencies, but when you need to stay calm

584
00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:48,600
Speaker 3: and you need to just get through something versus you know,

585
00:26:48,680 --> 00:26:51,040
Speaker 3: trying to save every bit of money. So as a

586
00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:53,320
Speaker 3: prime example, this is, I hope my in laws don't

587
00:26:53,320 --> 00:26:56,240
Speaker 3: hear this, but sometimes my in laws will just like

588
00:26:56,440 --> 00:27:02,240
Speaker 3: magically appear, and for some people they're in laws, showing

589
00:27:02,320 --> 00:27:05,879
Speaker 3: up unexpectedly can be a little bit anxiety into sing.

590
00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:10,399
Speaker 3: But it's not an emergency, right, So I tried to

591
00:27:10,440 --> 00:27:12,800
Speaker 3: tell people, here's this fund that you can use for

592
00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:15,520
Speaker 3: anything that's unexpected, not just in an emergency fund, but

593
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:18,600
Speaker 3: for a lot of people it still serves at similar purpose.

594
00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:21,160
Speaker 3: The other reason that I to kind of straight away

595
00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:23,760
Speaker 3: from the emergency fund because the age old advice of

596
00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:26,159
Speaker 3: three to six months, which is a great intent, but

597
00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:28,200
Speaker 3: the vast majority of people that I worked with were

598
00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:31,280
Speaker 3: still very riddled with debt and we're oftentimes living paycheck

599
00:27:31,280 --> 00:27:33,920
Speaker 3: to paycheck, so three to six months felt very overwhelming.

600
00:27:34,359 --> 00:27:36,120
Speaker 3: So I tell people to start off with a one

601
00:27:36,160 --> 00:27:39,240
Speaker 3: month's keep calm, fun and just focus on getting that

602
00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:41,000
Speaker 3: one month first, and then we can figure out three

603
00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:42,160
Speaker 3: to six months down the road.

604
00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:43,000
Speaker 1: I like it.

605
00:27:43,119 --> 00:27:45,080
Speaker 2: No, it sounds like your in law showing up is

606
00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:47,240
Speaker 2: a social emergency. And are you using some of that

607
00:27:47,320 --> 00:27:49,680
Speaker 2: money to put them up in a hotel or go

608
00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:51,919
Speaker 2: ahead and order take out because you're not going to

609
00:27:51,920 --> 00:27:52,480
Speaker 2: cook for him.

610
00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:55,919
Speaker 3: It's the latter, order takeout. And then I usually get

611
00:27:55,920 --> 00:27:56,920
Speaker 3: a massage after.

612
00:27:58,000 --> 00:28:00,439
Speaker 2: A little bit of self care phat in there. Well,

613
00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:03,440
Speaker 2: all right, so let's see talk to us about r

614
00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:09,199
Speaker 2: which for you, that's reversing into financial independence. Why is

615
00:28:09,640 --> 00:28:11,560
Speaker 2: why is it important to start with five and then

616
00:28:11,640 --> 00:28:12,680
Speaker 2: kind of backing into it?

617
00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:15,639
Speaker 3: Yes, So going back to what I said earlier, I

618
00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:18,800
Speaker 3: just I just taught a investing class for women and

619
00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:21,600
Speaker 3: I asked the group. There's one hundred women on the call,

620
00:28:21,800 --> 00:28:23,480
Speaker 3: and I asked them, how much money do you need

621
00:28:23,520 --> 00:28:26,000
Speaker 3: to save up for you to be able to retire?

622
00:28:26,040 --> 00:28:28,360
Speaker 3: And no one knew the answer. So I said to them,

623
00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:32,120
Speaker 3: this is not you know, the hard and fast, absolutely correct,

624
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:34,679
Speaker 3: but it's a good, you know, back of the napkin

625
00:28:34,880 --> 00:28:36,560
Speaker 3: kind of math that you can do. And it's the

626
00:28:37,240 --> 00:28:40,280
Speaker 3: four percent rule, which I'm sure you may have talked

627
00:28:40,280 --> 00:28:42,080
Speaker 3: about in the past, but essentially it says that if

628
00:28:42,120 --> 00:28:45,400
Speaker 3: you save twenty five times your annual expenses, if you

629
00:28:45,480 --> 00:28:48,120
Speaker 3: invest that money, you theoretically would not run out of money.

630
00:28:48,320 --> 00:28:50,680
Speaker 3: And so immediately a lot of people will go into

631
00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:54,320
Speaker 3: what about inflation, what about interest rates? What if I

632
00:28:54,320 --> 00:28:56,240
Speaker 3: put into the wrong investment? And I always have to

633
00:28:56,240 --> 00:28:58,920
Speaker 3: tell people, hey, let's just have this number first, and

634
00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:01,640
Speaker 3: then let's just back in to the simple steps you

635
00:29:01,680 --> 00:29:04,280
Speaker 3: can take today that might get you closer to that number.

636
00:29:04,640 --> 00:29:07,360
Speaker 3: And so for me, that goes back to some of

637
00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:09,840
Speaker 3: the story I told you earlier of Okay, once I

638
00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:11,960
Speaker 3: calculated that number for myself at the time it was

639
00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:15,160
Speaker 3: nine hundred thousand dollars, then it became very clear to

640
00:29:15,200 --> 00:29:18,040
Speaker 3: me that I had to pay off my debt versus

641
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:21,360
Speaker 3: thinking of debt as just a separate goal. Debt was

642
00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:24,720
Speaker 3: actually a smaller milestone in this in this quest for

643
00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:27,040
Speaker 3: financial independence. And I was able to do that because

644
00:29:27,040 --> 00:29:30,800
Speaker 3: I said, well, if I pay off this these student loans,

645
00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:33,440
Speaker 3: even though they have low interest rates, I would say,

646
00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:35,560
Speaker 3: you know, X amount of money, and that can go

647
00:29:35,640 --> 00:29:39,360
Speaker 3: towards my investments instead, And so I really like this

648
00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:43,760
Speaker 3: idea of reversing into independence, meaning that you actually calculate

649
00:29:43,760 --> 00:29:46,920
Speaker 3: that number, and for everyone it's overwhelming because it's likely

650
00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:49,240
Speaker 3: over a million dollars, especially if you live in the US.

651
00:29:49,680 --> 00:29:51,960
Speaker 3: But at least now you know, and then you can say, well,

652
00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:54,360
Speaker 3: am I really going to reach that number or even

653
00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:56,040
Speaker 3: have a shot at it if I don't make some

654
00:29:56,120 --> 00:29:56,800
Speaker 3: changes today.

655
00:29:57,360 --> 00:30:00,680
Speaker 1: I remember starting off and being so over whelmed at

656
00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:03,200
Speaker 1: some of the things that people were suggesting, whether it

657
00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:05,040
Speaker 1: was like max out your four O one K and

658
00:30:05,080 --> 00:30:08,160
Speaker 1: I was like, who does that? How's that possible? And

659
00:30:08,200 --> 00:30:10,800
Speaker 1: I get I think especially for younger listeners who are

660
00:30:11,240 --> 00:30:13,240
Speaker 1: you know, half student loan debt or a car payment

661
00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:16,920
Speaker 1: on top of a student loan debt, and they haven't

662
00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:19,240
Speaker 1: progressed very far in their career, those things do seem

663
00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:23,240
Speaker 1: completely unattainable. And yeah, breaking it down into bite sized

664
00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:27,680
Speaker 1: pieces that allow you to make small but significant moves

665
00:30:27,720 --> 00:30:31,160
Speaker 1: over time, like continually in the right direction, it pays off.

666
00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:33,160
Speaker 1: And then you find yourself ten, twelve, fifteen years later

667
00:30:33,160 --> 00:30:35,120
Speaker 1: and you're like, wait a second, I'm like I've made

668
00:30:35,120 --> 00:30:36,719
Speaker 1: a lot of progress towards this thing. It's just one

669
00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:38,440
Speaker 1: of those slow moving things. I think we're used to

670
00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:41,880
Speaker 1: get rich quick. It sounds so good on the surface,

671
00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:45,280
Speaker 1: but then underneath it's pretty rotten to the core. But

672
00:30:45,360 --> 00:30:47,440
Speaker 1: the opposite is true. It doesn't sound very sexy on

673
00:30:47,480 --> 00:30:49,680
Speaker 1: the surface, but like deep down, it's pure gold, and

674
00:30:49,720 --> 00:30:51,280
Speaker 1: that's actually how you get to where you want to go.

675
00:30:51,520 --> 00:30:53,200
Speaker 1: One of the things you talk about is budgeting with

676
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:56,720
Speaker 1: other people. You call it positive peer pressure. And you're

677
00:30:56,760 --> 00:30:58,400
Speaker 1: not just speaking of married folks, right, You're not even

678
00:30:58,440 --> 00:31:01,200
Speaker 1: just talking to like people who have a spouse or

679
00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:04,080
Speaker 1: a long term partner. What are you advocating in terms

680
00:31:04,120 --> 00:31:06,240
Speaker 1: of budgeting, but doing it with your peers.

681
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:11,600
Speaker 3: So I first advocate for finding two peers specifically just

682
00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:13,000
Speaker 3: in case one of them is busy. Then you have

683
00:31:13,040 --> 00:31:16,480
Speaker 3: a backup person and every month at the beginning of

684
00:31:16,520 --> 00:31:20,240
Speaker 3: the month at least running some ideas by them or

685
00:31:20,280 --> 00:31:23,960
Speaker 3: things that you are considering for things that you want

686
00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:27,040
Speaker 3: to potentially accomplish during that month, or just want accountability

687
00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:29,200
Speaker 3: and say to someone out loud. So I have a

688
00:31:29,320 --> 00:31:31,440
Speaker 3: client who I just worked with recently. She was like

689
00:31:31,560 --> 00:31:35,040
Speaker 3: star student client, and one of the biggest challenges that

690
00:31:35,080 --> 00:31:37,200
Speaker 3: she had was up until this point, she had nobody

691
00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:39,160
Speaker 3: to talk to about these finances, and so one she

692
00:31:39,240 --> 00:31:41,120
Speaker 3: was just going around with a lot of preconceived notions

693
00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:45,120
Speaker 3: that just actually were not materially accurate. But too she

694
00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:47,680
Speaker 3: always felt like she was worse off than she actually was,

695
00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:52,320
Speaker 3: And so she came for coaching with me, and in

696
00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:55,200
Speaker 3: her last session she had all of these updates. There

697
00:31:55,240 --> 00:31:56,720
Speaker 3: was nothing for us to even talk about in terms

698
00:31:56,760 --> 00:31:58,840
Speaker 3: of next step. She just said, I just want to

699
00:31:58,880 --> 00:32:00,760
Speaker 3: share with you all these things that I did. I

700
00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:03,240
Speaker 3: just paid off this credit card. I actually have my

701
00:32:03,280 --> 00:32:06,640
Speaker 3: one once worth contingency fund, and I told my parents

702
00:32:06,720 --> 00:32:08,840
Speaker 3: about what I was doing. They were actually really supportive.

703
00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:10,080
Speaker 3: I thought they were going to be mad at me.

704
00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:14,360
Speaker 3: And I say that to anyone who's listening here, is

705
00:32:14,360 --> 00:32:16,600
Speaker 3: that a lot of what we could tastrophize about our

706
00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:20,400
Speaker 3: finances is in our heads a lot worse than they

707
00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:23,000
Speaker 3: actually are. And when I talk about the you and crush,

708
00:32:23,040 --> 00:32:26,080
Speaker 3: which is understanding your net worth, it is really helpful

709
00:32:26,360 --> 00:32:29,000
Speaker 3: to have at least one other person other than yourself,

710
00:32:29,040 --> 00:32:30,880
Speaker 3: whether it be a spouse or a friend or whoever,

711
00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:33,959
Speaker 3: who actually knows what your net worth is, so that

712
00:32:34,040 --> 00:32:36,760
Speaker 3: they can make some recommendations that are based off of

713
00:32:36,920 --> 00:32:40,000
Speaker 3: realistic numbers or the reality of what your situation is

714
00:32:40,120 --> 00:32:42,400
Speaker 3: versus oh, just max out your four o one K. Well,

715
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:45,040
Speaker 3: if my net worth is negative three hundred thousand, that's

716
00:32:45,040 --> 00:32:46,680
Speaker 3: probably not the first thing I'm doing today.

717
00:32:46,840 --> 00:32:47,160
Speaker 1: Yeah.

718
00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:50,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, So you just touched on understanding your net worth,

719
00:32:50,440 --> 00:32:52,360
Speaker 2: like you talk about pretty early on in the book too,

720
00:32:52,400 --> 00:32:55,120
Speaker 2: just how your self worth combined with your net worth,

721
00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:58,720
Speaker 2: Like that is what you need. So You've worked with

722
00:32:58,720 --> 00:33:00,840
Speaker 2: a lot of folks, and you've come across a lot

723
00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:04,480
Speaker 2: of different just individual scenarios and life stages that folks

724
00:33:04,520 --> 00:33:07,800
Speaker 2: are in. How debilitating have you seen that this lack

725
00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:10,960
Speaker 2: of self belief is for most folks? Like, have you

726
00:33:11,040 --> 00:33:13,160
Speaker 2: found that that led has led to just slower progress

727
00:33:13,160 --> 00:33:16,280
Speaker 2: with folks? Has that led to just continued poor decisions?

728
00:33:16,680 --> 00:33:19,800
Speaker 2: Talk to us about that self worth, that self belief

729
00:33:19,960 --> 00:33:20,600
Speaker 2: aspect of it.

730
00:33:20,880 --> 00:33:21,080
Speaker 1: Yeah.

731
00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:23,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, So when I talk about understanding your worth, I

732
00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:25,800
Speaker 3: talk about both your net worth and to your point,

733
00:33:25,840 --> 00:33:30,840
Speaker 3: your self worth. And I can genuinely say that the

734
00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:36,640
Speaker 3: everyone that I've worked with as a client, their picture

735
00:33:36,680 --> 00:33:40,640
Speaker 3: of self worth was not accurate. It just literally was

736
00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:43,680
Speaker 3: not true. They were, so in doing this exercise of

737
00:33:43,680 --> 00:33:47,480
Speaker 3: self worth, I forced my clients lovingly to actually calculate

738
00:33:47,520 --> 00:33:49,520
Speaker 3: what their net worth is. As of today, I have

739
00:33:49,680 --> 00:33:53,920
Speaker 3: never had a client who actually was accurate about what

740
00:33:53,960 --> 00:33:55,920
Speaker 3: their net worth was. They always thought it was worse

741
00:33:55,960 --> 00:33:59,160
Speaker 3: than it actually was, even the ones who both had

742
00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:01,040
Speaker 3: a lot of money and who didn't have much money

743
00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:02,840
Speaker 3: at all. The ones who didn't have much money at all,

744
00:34:03,040 --> 00:34:07,120
Speaker 3: they thought they were, you know, just completely hopeless. And

745
00:34:07,160 --> 00:34:08,680
Speaker 3: then the ones who had a lot of money just

746
00:34:08,719 --> 00:34:10,960
Speaker 3: couldn't believe they had that much money and so tying.

747
00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:13,120
Speaker 3: While I say, you know, your net worth is not

748
00:34:13,200 --> 00:34:16,080
Speaker 3: your self worth, it should at least be based off

749
00:34:16,120 --> 00:34:19,320
Speaker 3: of some accuracy of the data. But to your question

750
00:34:19,400 --> 00:34:22,760
Speaker 3: of you know, how debilitating it is, I have found

751
00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:26,319
Speaker 3: the area that where it's most abilitating for people is

752
00:34:26,360 --> 00:34:31,440
Speaker 3: in fact in investing, because I have to consistently convince

753
00:34:31,560 --> 00:34:35,080
Speaker 3: women in particular that they are already investors, and they

754
00:34:35,080 --> 00:34:37,000
Speaker 3: always say, oh, I'm not smart enough, or I just

755
00:34:37,040 --> 00:34:39,799
Speaker 3: don't know enough, or I'm not a math person, I'm

756
00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:43,960
Speaker 3: not a numbers person, and I have to consistently have

757
00:34:44,120 --> 00:34:47,439
Speaker 3: these conversations and messages to say, hey, if you had

758
00:34:47,440 --> 00:34:49,960
Speaker 3: student loan debt. Guess what, You're an investor. If you

759
00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:53,280
Speaker 3: have ever bought any sort of property, you are already

760
00:34:53,280 --> 00:34:56,560
Speaker 3: an investor. If you've ever spent any money on something,

761
00:34:56,560 --> 00:34:58,120
Speaker 3: whether or not you made money or not on it,

762
00:34:58,160 --> 00:35:02,400
Speaker 3: you are already an investor. And having those conversations combined

763
00:35:02,560 --> 00:35:05,319
Speaker 3: with the self worth aspect and also the reality of

764
00:35:05,360 --> 00:35:08,279
Speaker 3: what it requires to become financially independent. You cannot become

765
00:35:08,320 --> 00:35:12,040
Speaker 3: financially independent if you don't ever invest is really critically

766
00:35:12,080 --> 00:35:13,719
Speaker 3: important and a lot of it is based off what

767
00:35:13,719 --> 00:35:16,040
Speaker 3: you said, This stabilitating idea that I'm less than what

768
00:35:16,080 --> 00:35:16,839
Speaker 3: I actually am.

769
00:35:16,920 --> 00:35:18,440
Speaker 1: What do you think it is? It fuels that? Is

770
00:35:18,480 --> 00:35:21,960
Speaker 1: it that we see other people out there touting maybe

771
00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:26,360
Speaker 1: faux examples of wealth or we just assume that everyone

772
00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:28,680
Speaker 1: knows more than we do, and how do we maybe

773
00:35:28,719 --> 00:35:31,560
Speaker 1: like counteract whatever negative thing is in our brain. I

774
00:35:31,640 --> 00:35:35,279
Speaker 1: was just thinking that Matt Matt has and I just

775
00:35:35,280 --> 00:35:37,520
Speaker 1: started running like a year ago, and Matt's always like,

776
00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:39,000
Speaker 1: you're a runner, and I have not thought on myself

777
00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:41,200
Speaker 1: as a runner literally until like a week ago. I

778
00:35:41,239 --> 00:35:42,920
Speaker 1: was like, wait, I think I'm a runner and I

779
00:35:42,920 --> 00:35:45,040
Speaker 1: don't know why, because I've been doing it long enough

780
00:35:45,040 --> 00:35:47,480
Speaker 1: and consistently enough. But really I was probably a runner

781
00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:49,239
Speaker 1: like nine months ago or ten months ago or something

782
00:35:49,239 --> 00:35:52,359
Speaker 1: like that. Why do we always like think less of

783
00:35:52,400 --> 00:35:55,360
Speaker 1: ourselves than we actually should? And it does seem like

784
00:35:55,680 --> 00:35:57,480
Speaker 1: the less inclinent we are to think of ourselves in

785
00:35:57,480 --> 00:36:00,520
Speaker 1: a positive light, the less in client we are actually like,

786
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:02,560
Speaker 1: continue doing the thing and continue rocking it.

787
00:36:02,719 --> 00:36:05,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, we could have an entire other episode

788
00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:07,279
Speaker 3: about the reasons why we all think that we're less

789
00:36:07,320 --> 00:36:11,920
Speaker 3: than I mean, the patriarchy, like systematic you know, exclusion

790
00:36:11,960 --> 00:36:15,399
Speaker 3: of certain groups. Also culture, also just you know, good

791
00:36:15,400 --> 00:36:19,320
Speaker 3: old fashioned media. But I think in particular, like right now,

792
00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:23,719
Speaker 3: in this moment, I honestly believe social media is the

793
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:28,520
Speaker 3: biggest contributor to this because, just like you, I don't

794
00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:32,719
Speaker 3: consider myself a dancer, right because in my head, I'm thinking, Oh,

795
00:36:32,760 --> 00:36:35,440
Speaker 3: a dancer is someone who's a backup dancer for Justin Timberlake,

796
00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:38,040
Speaker 3: or who's a dancer in music videos, or can actually,

797
00:36:38,160 --> 00:36:40,879
Speaker 3: you know, memorize a dance after just half an hour.

798
00:36:41,000 --> 00:36:44,400
Speaker 3: I'm not any of those things, obviously, but I love dancing,

799
00:36:45,120 --> 00:36:48,280
Speaker 3: and I think the same thing goes with personal finance.

800
00:36:48,320 --> 00:36:52,200
Speaker 3: Oh I'm not rich. For example, in the US. I

801
00:36:52,520 --> 00:36:55,000
Speaker 3: find this so fascinating as someone who, again who grew

802
00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:58,920
Speaker 3: up with immigrant parents. Anyone in the US is by

803
00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:01,160
Speaker 3: far richer than the vast jority of people in the Philippines,

804
00:37:01,600 --> 00:37:04,719
Speaker 3: where my parents are from. But social media keeps making

805
00:37:04,760 --> 00:37:07,479
Speaker 3: it trying to convince us that our life isn't enough

806
00:37:07,640 --> 00:37:10,719
Speaker 3: and that you need this extra thing in order to

807
00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:14,040
Speaker 3: then become the dancer or the runner or whatever it is.

808
00:37:14,080 --> 00:37:16,800
Speaker 3: And so one of the things that I really advocate

809
00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:21,080
Speaker 3: for is what I call screenless Sundays, where I literally

810
00:37:21,239 --> 00:37:23,880
Speaker 3: lock up my phone in my glove compartment in my

811
00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:27,480
Speaker 3: car and then I along with my family members. Of

812
00:37:27,560 --> 00:37:30,080
Speaker 3: my family members are with me. We are not allowed

813
00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:31,759
Speaker 3: to look on our phones, we're not allowed to look

814
00:37:31,800 --> 00:37:34,360
Speaker 3: on television, and we're not allowed to look at laptops,

815
00:37:34,560 --> 00:37:36,520
Speaker 3: and we just have to talk to each other. I know,

816
00:37:36,600 --> 00:37:40,520
Speaker 3: it's a wild well concept. We go analog for the day.

817
00:37:40,520 --> 00:37:42,680
Speaker 3: We play board games, and we listen to records, and

818
00:37:42,680 --> 00:37:44,479
Speaker 3: we go take walks in the park, and we meal prep,

819
00:37:44,480 --> 00:37:47,319
Speaker 3: we do all these other things. And just one day

820
00:37:47,520 --> 00:37:50,200
Speaker 3: of not constantly being hit in the face with you're

821
00:37:50,200 --> 00:37:52,319
Speaker 3: not enough, you're not good enough, your house is not

822
00:37:52,520 --> 00:37:55,240
Speaker 3: nice enough, your car is not fancy enough. It actually

823
00:37:55,280 --> 00:37:57,600
Speaker 3: does a lot for It doesn't completely solve the problem,

824
00:37:57,600 --> 00:38:00,560
Speaker 3: but at least for me, it helps me RESETX dictations.

825
00:38:00,800 --> 00:38:02,680
Speaker 1: I think it's great advice. And I saw I've read

826
00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:05,840
Speaker 1: that about your screenless Sundays, and it's just it's like

827
00:38:05,880 --> 00:38:07,839
Speaker 1: this old it's like a version of a sabbath, right,

828
00:38:07,880 --> 00:38:12,320
Speaker 1: Like there's certain religious practices that institute a sabbath of sorts,

829
00:38:12,680 --> 00:38:16,799
Speaker 1: and sometimes that is like typically the more conservative that

830
00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:19,120
Speaker 1: sect is, the more likely they are to make the

831
00:38:19,160 --> 00:38:22,799
Speaker 1: Sabbath even stricter and including no screens or potentially like

832
00:38:23,040 --> 00:38:24,680
Speaker 1: no lights or you can flip on the light switch.

833
00:38:25,280 --> 00:38:27,800
Speaker 1: And we might think of that as antiquated in this

834
00:38:27,880 --> 00:38:31,840
Speaker 1: day and age, but there are significant benefits in psychological benefits,

835
00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:34,839
Speaker 1: especially given kind of the society we're in right now,

836
00:38:34,880 --> 00:38:37,600
Speaker 1: the always connected society, that they can be derived from it.

837
00:38:37,640 --> 00:38:39,839
Speaker 1: So I think that's really good advice and something that's

838
00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:42,960
Speaker 1: well worth considering. It's something that I need to consider

839
00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:45,920
Speaker 1: more for my family. Brendeat, We've got more to get

840
00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:48,080
Speaker 1: to with you, including we want to talk about the

841
00:38:48,120 --> 00:38:50,800
Speaker 1: one dollar rule and why you say eating out is

842
00:38:50,880 --> 00:38:53,439
Speaker 1: good for our budgets. Oh hot take, we'll talk about

843
00:38:53,440 --> 00:38:54,080
Speaker 1: that right after this.

844
00:39:02,080 --> 00:39:04,520
Speaker 2: We are back from the break talking about how we

845
00:39:04,600 --> 00:39:07,680
Speaker 2: can all crush our money goals this year with Burnanette

846
00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:11,880
Speaker 2: Joy and you talk about choice overload when it comes

847
00:39:11,920 --> 00:39:14,400
Speaker 2: to all the different decisions we have to make. Do

848
00:39:14,440 --> 00:39:16,799
Speaker 2: you have any just practical tips for folks when it

849
00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:19,560
Speaker 2: comes to simplifying in order to reduce all of the

850
00:39:19,560 --> 00:39:22,399
Speaker 2: decisions that we have to make on a not even

851
00:39:22,520 --> 00:39:24,640
Speaker 2: just a daily basis, but like I don't on the

852
00:39:24,719 --> 00:39:25,799
Speaker 2: hour kind of.

853
00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:29,840
Speaker 3: Basic Yes, yes, I am not an advocate for tracking

854
00:39:29,840 --> 00:39:31,880
Speaker 3: at all, and so when people hear that the S

855
00:39:31,960 --> 00:39:35,160
Speaker 3: and crush stands for spend intentionally, their automatic assumption is

856
00:39:35,160 --> 00:39:37,279
Speaker 3: that I have to track every single penny that goes

857
00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:40,600
Speaker 3: out of my budget. And what I actually advocate for

858
00:39:40,719 --> 00:39:43,320
Speaker 3: people is not to track, but to spend more time

859
00:39:44,080 --> 00:39:46,040
Speaker 3: planning at the beginning of the month and using what

860
00:39:46,080 --> 00:39:50,200
Speaker 3: I call the dollar rule, which I absolutely love. I

861
00:39:50,239 --> 00:39:53,160
Speaker 3: get questions about it all the time, where it's very simple.

862
00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:55,960
Speaker 3: It basically is just a slight twist on the cost

863
00:39:56,040 --> 00:39:58,520
Speaker 3: per use idea, and it just says that if you

864
00:39:59,040 --> 00:40:01,319
Speaker 3: are going to buy something, and this works with material goods,

865
00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:05,759
Speaker 3: so clothes and accessories and tech gadgets and furniture. If

866
00:40:05,800 --> 00:40:07,840
Speaker 3: you're going to buy something and it comes out to

867
00:40:07,880 --> 00:40:10,400
Speaker 3: a dollar per use, just go ahead and buy it.

868
00:40:10,560 --> 00:40:12,239
Speaker 3: Don't make it a big deal, don't make it a thing.

869
00:40:12,640 --> 00:40:14,560
Speaker 3: You're going to get a good use out of it,

870
00:40:14,600 --> 00:40:16,719
Speaker 3: and it's going to actually be worth it. And what

871
00:40:16,840 --> 00:40:19,160
Speaker 3: I found is that helps a lot of people actually

872
00:40:19,200 --> 00:40:22,560
Speaker 3: feel relieved about not feeling so guilty about spending things

873
00:40:22,560 --> 00:40:25,560
Speaker 3: that they don't quote unquote need, and also not spending

874
00:40:25,600 --> 00:40:28,680
Speaker 3: all of this time trying to find the best deal

875
00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:31,239
Speaker 3: ever if it's going to be an inordinate amount of time.

876
00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:33,080
Speaker 3: I will give you a prime example. One of my

877
00:40:33,120 --> 00:40:37,360
Speaker 3: best friends, he has hated his couch for years, and

878
00:40:38,160 --> 00:40:40,640
Speaker 3: it's because he just keeps saying, well, I can't spend

879
00:40:40,800 --> 00:40:43,160
Speaker 3: more than this amount of money on a couch. But

880
00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:45,040
Speaker 3: I said to him the other day, this was literally

881
00:40:45,040 --> 00:40:48,279
Speaker 3: over Thanksgiving. I said, hey, had you just employed the

882
00:40:48,320 --> 00:40:50,520
Speaker 3: dollar roll back, then it would have paid off by

883
00:40:50,560 --> 00:40:53,360
Speaker 3: now for a couch that you actually really liked and

884
00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:54,160
Speaker 3: so rad So your.

885
00:40:54,120 --> 00:40:55,640
Speaker 2: Budding it once a day because you said it all

886
00:40:55,680 --> 00:40:56,040
Speaker 2: the time.

887
00:40:56,120 --> 00:40:59,359
Speaker 3: So yeah, and he's a big college football fan, so

888
00:40:59,400 --> 00:41:03,160
Speaker 3: he's been. He's in there all day long, right, and

889
00:41:03,360 --> 00:41:06,520
Speaker 3: suffering and suffering, And so I really like the dollar

890
00:41:06,600 --> 00:41:09,279
Speaker 3: rule to remove some of that back and forth and

891
00:41:09,320 --> 00:41:11,719
Speaker 3: over analysis for decisions that are in the grand scheme

892
00:41:11,760 --> 00:41:14,640
Speaker 3: of things not going to be that detrimental to your budget.

893
00:41:14,719 --> 00:41:17,120
Speaker 1: All right, we've gone through CRUs. What's the H?

894
00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:21,640
Speaker 3: So the H is my most underrated topic and I

895
00:41:21,640 --> 00:41:23,800
Speaker 3: don't think we talk about it enough in personal finance.

896
00:41:23,920 --> 00:41:27,840
Speaker 3: It's what we call healing your money wounds. And specifically

897
00:41:28,360 --> 00:41:31,480
Speaker 3: I wrote about this because I noticed that a lot

898
00:41:31,520 --> 00:41:34,120
Speaker 3: of people who do not do well with money, or

899
00:41:34,120 --> 00:41:37,000
Speaker 3: so they think, they think it's because they don't know enough,

900
00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:39,200
Speaker 3: or because they're not smart, or they're just bad with money.

901
00:41:39,440 --> 00:41:41,759
Speaker 3: But what I found is that usually I can pinpoint

902
00:41:41,800 --> 00:41:45,960
Speaker 3: almost an exact incident that caused them to be afraid

903
00:41:46,000 --> 00:41:48,879
Speaker 3: of making money choices. I will give you a prime

904
00:41:48,920 --> 00:41:53,640
Speaker 3: example for myself. I am turning forty. Like I mentioned earlier,

905
00:41:54,040 --> 00:41:57,040
Speaker 3: So in my first job in two thousand and seven,

906
00:41:57,280 --> 00:42:02,000
Speaker 3: I was an HR professional in financial services, and then

907
00:42:02,000 --> 00:42:04,799
Speaker 3: in two thousand and eight I was in New York

908
00:42:04,840 --> 00:42:08,640
Speaker 3: City laying people off. In two thousand and eight and

909
00:42:09,080 --> 00:42:12,759
Speaker 3: occupy Wall Street was literally outside my tour and I

910
00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:17,279
Speaker 3: remember realizing, Wow, you know, you can do exactly what

911
00:42:17,360 --> 00:42:21,239
Speaker 3: everyone tells you you're supposed to do, but still end

912
00:42:21,320 --> 00:42:23,680
Speaker 3: up basically out on the street, like people were literally

913
00:42:23,680 --> 00:42:25,720
Speaker 3: getting walked out if you remember that, people were getting

914
00:42:25,719 --> 00:42:29,839
Speaker 3: walked out with their boxes that day. And that also

915
00:42:30,040 --> 00:42:32,840
Speaker 3: led me to realize how many people were on that

916
00:42:32,880 --> 00:42:34,719
Speaker 3: other side of the table from me. I remember, this

917
00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:37,319
Speaker 3: Guy'll never forget. There was this one guy who I

918
00:42:37,360 --> 00:42:39,759
Speaker 3: was handing in his severance papers and he said, I've

919
00:42:39,760 --> 00:42:41,880
Speaker 3: been working at this company longer than you've been alive.

920
00:42:41,920 --> 00:42:44,399
Speaker 3: Why do you have a job And I don't. And

921
00:42:45,360 --> 00:42:49,200
Speaker 3: I have encountered so many clients, for example, who were

922
00:42:49,280 --> 00:42:51,960
Speaker 3: laid off at some point in their career, or maybe

923
00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:55,040
Speaker 3: they saw their parents finding about money, or maybe they

924
00:42:55,080 --> 00:42:57,160
Speaker 3: made a bad investment choice one time and now they're

925
00:42:57,160 --> 00:42:59,600
Speaker 3: afraid to make other investment choices, and that's actually what

926
00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:03,120
Speaker 3: holding what's holding them back, not lack of knowledge.

927
00:43:03,040 --> 00:43:06,160
Speaker 2: Like what's the balance I guess between because you want

928
00:43:06,200 --> 00:43:08,840
Speaker 2: to address those wounds, some of the events that happened

929
00:43:08,840 --> 00:43:11,760
Speaker 2: in your past and your history, but at the same time, man,

930
00:43:11,920 --> 00:43:14,920
Speaker 2: you don't want to dwell too much on some of

931
00:43:14,960 --> 00:43:17,200
Speaker 2: those things that happened in the past, Like, how do

932
00:43:17,200 --> 00:43:19,640
Speaker 2: you recommend to your clients to address those things without

933
00:43:19,640 --> 00:43:23,359
Speaker 2: having them like totally consume their thoughts and everything about them.

934
00:43:23,440 --> 00:43:26,279
Speaker 3: M hmm. Well, one thing is therapy, of course, and

935
00:43:26,440 --> 00:43:28,960
Speaker 3: I don't bill myself at all as a therapist, so

936
00:43:29,000 --> 00:43:32,440
Speaker 3: I actually require most of my clients to also have

937
00:43:32,480 --> 00:43:34,560
Speaker 3: a therapist on hand while they are working with me,

938
00:43:34,600 --> 00:43:37,080
Speaker 3: because sometimes we uncover things and they're like, wow, I

939
00:43:37,080 --> 00:43:39,000
Speaker 3: didn't realize that was hurting me as bad as I thought,

940
00:43:39,000 --> 00:43:40,399
Speaker 3: And I said, okay, great, now go talk to your

941
00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:42,480
Speaker 3: therapists and come back to me, come back to you later.

942
00:43:42,600 --> 00:43:43,240
Speaker 1: Oh that's true.

943
00:43:44,000 --> 00:43:46,440
Speaker 3: But I also the reason I say healing your money

944
00:43:46,440 --> 00:43:48,839
Speaker 3: wounds is because I really do think of it as

945
00:43:48,840 --> 00:43:51,200
Speaker 3: a wound. If you think about a wound on your body,

946
00:43:51,440 --> 00:43:54,399
Speaker 3: if you keep scratching it, then it'll just keep staying open,

947
00:43:54,400 --> 00:43:57,000
Speaker 3: it'll keep stinging, and it'll never heal. But if you

948
00:43:57,040 --> 00:43:59,680
Speaker 3: acknowledge that it's a wound, and you actually you know

949
00:43:59,760 --> 00:44:02,719
Speaker 3: true it as in, you try to talk about it,

950
00:44:02,760 --> 00:44:05,759
Speaker 3: You try to have conversations with people, you try to

951
00:44:05,840 --> 00:44:10,239
Speaker 3: find some you try to in my case, find some

952
00:44:10,360 --> 00:44:13,720
Speaker 3: other people who have overcome it and get some ideas

953
00:44:13,719 --> 00:44:15,319
Speaker 3: on how you might be able to heal from it.

954
00:44:15,760 --> 00:44:17,480
Speaker 3: Then it might not ever go away, and you still

955
00:44:17,560 --> 00:44:19,680
Speaker 3: might have a scar, but at least you're not scratching

956
00:44:19,719 --> 00:44:21,760
Speaker 3: it open every single time you make a money choice.

957
00:44:21,920 --> 00:44:24,239
Speaker 1: All Right. One of the pieces, one of the things

958
00:44:24,280 --> 00:44:26,759
Speaker 1: you suggest in your book is that eating out is

959
00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:30,799
Speaker 1: good for your budget, which never heard that one before, Bernadette,

960
00:44:30,840 --> 00:44:33,279
Speaker 1: That's usually it's the opposite. So like cooking home to

961
00:44:33,280 --> 00:44:35,000
Speaker 1: save money. You know, you can do it for like

962
00:44:35,480 --> 00:44:37,560
Speaker 1: two to three dollars per person per meal, right, whereas

963
00:44:37,560 --> 00:44:40,160
Speaker 1: you go out to eat, and it's that adds up quickly,

964
00:44:40,280 --> 00:44:42,960
Speaker 1: especially given what's happened over the past few years and

965
00:44:43,280 --> 00:44:45,920
Speaker 1: how expensive it is to eat out. So I don't know,

966
00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:47,319
Speaker 1: can you explain that one for me?

967
00:44:47,840 --> 00:44:52,640
Speaker 3: Yes, So one of my clients, who's Latina, she said,

968
00:44:52,719 --> 00:44:54,719
Speaker 3: when I told her this, I said, hey, you can

969
00:44:54,760 --> 00:44:58,239
Speaker 3: actually go eat out, she said, Bernadette in Spanish, we say,

970
00:44:58,600 --> 00:45:00,919
Speaker 3: you know, I komita and casa, right, there's food at home.

971
00:45:01,000 --> 00:45:04,279
Speaker 3: You're not You're literally not supposed to do that. And

972
00:45:04,640 --> 00:45:06,239
Speaker 3: so she was just baffled as to why I was

973
00:45:06,239 --> 00:45:08,400
Speaker 3: saying that she could eat out, And I said to

974
00:45:08,520 --> 00:45:11,000
Speaker 3: her in particular, I think it'd be good for you

975
00:45:11,040 --> 00:45:12,680
Speaker 3: to go eat out once a week because all you

976
00:45:12,719 --> 00:45:14,480
Speaker 3: do is work and you don't talk to any of

977
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:16,479
Speaker 3: your friends, and I don't, and I think you should

978
00:45:16,480 --> 00:45:17,600
Speaker 3: go out to eat if you're going to go hang

979
00:45:17,600 --> 00:45:19,440
Speaker 3: out with what are your friends? Because I think you're

980
00:45:19,440 --> 00:45:21,839
Speaker 3: a little lonely right now, and I and I think

981
00:45:21,840 --> 00:45:24,440
Speaker 3: that's where we've gotten so far away with personal finance

982
00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:28,560
Speaker 3: advice to say at all costs, we should save every

983
00:45:28,600 --> 00:45:34,640
Speaker 3: penny at the sacrifice of cultural experiences, community and actually

984
00:45:34,719 --> 00:45:38,680
Speaker 3: having some healthier, uh healthier choices at times. Now. I

985
00:45:38,719 --> 00:45:41,480
Speaker 3: know most times, especially again in the US, that the

986
00:45:41,480 --> 00:45:43,240
Speaker 3: food that you're eating out isn't going to be that healthy.

987
00:45:43,280 --> 00:45:44,719
Speaker 3: But at least where I live in Charlotte and I

988
00:45:44,719 --> 00:45:48,000
Speaker 3: know where you guys are, that there are definitely places

989
00:45:48,040 --> 00:45:52,240
Speaker 3: that you can go and get relatively affordable choices for

990
00:45:52,760 --> 00:45:54,640
Speaker 3: if you if you're smart about it. So what I

991
00:45:54,680 --> 00:45:57,360
Speaker 3: say in the book is one, we know that American

992
00:45:57,960 --> 00:46:01,360
Speaker 3: American portions are out of out of control. They're usually

993
00:46:01,560 --> 00:46:03,120
Speaker 3: two and a half times the size of what you

994
00:46:03,120 --> 00:46:04,799
Speaker 3: should be eating. So if you can take that same

995
00:46:04,840 --> 00:46:06,920
Speaker 3: meal and split it up into two or three meals.

996
00:46:07,200 --> 00:46:08,200
Speaker 3: You're saving money there.

997
00:46:08,400 --> 00:46:11,520
Speaker 1: Just stay my leftover Chinese food for lunch parnadette and.

998
00:46:11,640 --> 00:46:14,520
Speaker 3: There you go. You see, you're making good choices on that.

999
00:46:15,000 --> 00:46:20,359
Speaker 3: And for me in particular, food is very much part

1000
00:46:20,480 --> 00:46:23,719
Speaker 3: of how I experience other cultures. And so no, do

1001
00:46:23,800 --> 00:46:26,120
Speaker 3: I think that eating uber outs and eating McDonald's every

1002
00:46:26,200 --> 00:46:29,360
Speaker 3: day is a good use of your food food budget

1003
00:46:29,480 --> 00:46:30,720
Speaker 3: or your health choices?

1004
00:46:30,840 --> 00:46:30,920
Speaker 1: No?

1005
00:46:31,200 --> 00:46:34,680
Speaker 3: But do I think, For example, yesterday I went to

1006
00:46:35,320 --> 00:46:38,640
Speaker 3: an Asian festival in Charlotte. And when I tell you

1007
00:46:38,680 --> 00:46:43,960
Speaker 3: there's very few Asian festivals in Charlotte, I was you

1008
00:46:44,040 --> 00:46:46,000
Speaker 3: sure bet I was going to go there, and I

1009
00:46:46,040 --> 00:46:48,879
Speaker 3: was going to support every business owner there and make

1010
00:46:48,920 --> 00:46:51,680
Speaker 3: sure that they know that, you know, they're appreciated. And

1011
00:46:51,719 --> 00:46:54,399
Speaker 3: so I got so much joy out of going there.

1012
00:46:54,440 --> 00:46:56,239
Speaker 3: And of course, you know you're not going to go

1013
00:46:56,320 --> 00:46:58,680
Speaker 3: and spend, you know, frivolous amounts of money on eating out.

1014
00:46:58,680 --> 00:47:00,320
Speaker 3: But when I think you're doing it intentional for the

1015
00:47:00,360 --> 00:47:03,640
Speaker 3: sake of culture and community and connection, then I think

1016
00:47:03,640 --> 00:47:04,800
Speaker 3: it's worth spending the money.

1017
00:47:05,000 --> 00:47:05,480
Speaker 1: I love it.

1018
00:47:05,640 --> 00:47:07,480
Speaker 2: No, I you know, this kind of takes me back

1019
00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:11,239
Speaker 2: to the second letter in your acronym the R, which

1020
00:47:11,320 --> 00:47:14,080
Speaker 2: is reversing into financial independence. Like then the way you

1021
00:47:14,080 --> 00:47:15,799
Speaker 2: get there right, you start with the end in mind.

1022
00:47:15,880 --> 00:47:17,759
Speaker 2: Essentially you look at the number that you need and

1023
00:47:17,840 --> 00:47:20,480
Speaker 2: so in a similar way, we sacrifice the kind of

1024
00:47:20,480 --> 00:47:24,120
Speaker 2: life that we want to lead. We don't envision what

1025
00:47:24,160 --> 00:47:25,880
Speaker 2: we want that end result to look like, but I

1026
00:47:25,880 --> 00:47:28,240
Speaker 2: think we can think about, like you said, the community,

1027
00:47:28,320 --> 00:47:30,040
Speaker 2: the kind of culture that we want to be a

1028
00:47:30,080 --> 00:47:32,600
Speaker 2: part of, and then essentially back into it from there,

1029
00:47:32,640 --> 00:47:35,880
Speaker 2: like you start their plan backwards, and then that can

1030
00:47:36,239 --> 00:47:38,319
Speaker 2: inform the decision that we're making today, even if they're

1031
00:47:38,440 --> 00:47:40,879
Speaker 2: not the most financially optimized. And I love that you've

1032
00:47:40,920 --> 00:47:43,719
Speaker 2: got that built into your framework as well, But we

1033
00:47:43,840 --> 00:47:46,680
Speaker 2: really appreciate you sharing your thoughts just how you approach

1034
00:47:46,680 --> 00:47:49,480
Speaker 2: personal finance, especially with your clients and all that note, Actually,

1035
00:47:49,480 --> 00:47:52,920
Speaker 2: how can folks learn about this the coaching community that

1036
00:47:53,000 --> 00:47:55,640
Speaker 2: you've put together, and where can folks also learn.

1037
00:47:55,560 --> 00:47:56,200
Speaker 1: About your book?

1038
00:47:56,520 --> 00:47:58,279
Speaker 3: Yes, well you can learn about both of them at

1039
00:47:58,360 --> 00:48:01,440
Speaker 3: Crush Yourmoney Goals dot com. You can find how you

1040
00:48:01,480 --> 00:48:04,040
Speaker 3: can buy the book as well as the audiobook, and

1041
00:48:04,080 --> 00:48:07,759
Speaker 3: then we host regular monthly masterclasses if people just want

1042
00:48:07,800 --> 00:48:10,239
Speaker 3: to check it out. And what's really lovely is that

1043
00:48:10,280 --> 00:48:12,600
Speaker 3: once a month we open up our membership to anyone

1044
00:48:12,640 --> 00:48:14,359
Speaker 3: who's interested in joining, so you can see what it's

1045
00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:16,560
Speaker 3: actually like to be part of our community. And if

1046
00:48:16,560 --> 00:48:18,879
Speaker 3: you're just interested in hanging out on social media for now,

1047
00:48:18,920 --> 00:48:22,080
Speaker 3: you can check me out at Bernardette Joy, primarily on

1048
00:48:22,160 --> 00:48:25,560
Speaker 3: Instagram and on YouTube. And then I also write a

1049
00:48:25,560 --> 00:48:28,640
Speaker 3: ton of articles for places like Forbes and CNBC and

1050
00:48:28,680 --> 00:48:30,799
Speaker 3: c net, So if you just google my name, you

1051
00:48:30,840 --> 00:48:33,280
Speaker 3: can find articles where we talk about these different topics

1052
00:48:33,280 --> 00:48:33,640
Speaker 3: as well.

1053
00:48:33,840 --> 00:48:36,120
Speaker 1: Cool. Just do not try to connect with Burnet on

1054
00:48:36,160 --> 00:48:37,960
Speaker 1: social media on a Sunday. She won't respond.

1055
00:48:38,040 --> 00:48:39,399
Speaker 3: I will not respond to you at all.

1056
00:48:40,280 --> 00:48:42,200
Speaker 1: Bernadett, thanks so much for joining us today. We really

1057
00:48:42,239 --> 00:48:42,879
Speaker 1: appreciate it.

1058
00:48:42,920 --> 00:48:44,680
Speaker 3: Thank you so much for having me all right.

1059
00:48:44,800 --> 00:48:46,880
Speaker 2: Kind of feels like we're chatting with an old friend,

1060
00:48:47,120 --> 00:48:50,319
Speaker 2: even though we've all hung out with Bernadette once or twice. Now,

1061
00:48:50,520 --> 00:48:53,600
Speaker 2: do you consider virtual hangs as like real hanks or friends.

1062
00:48:53,920 --> 00:48:55,920
Speaker 2: That's a good question, Probably not, because I'm not. Typically

1063
00:48:56,200 --> 00:48:59,000
Speaker 2: I'm never virtual hanging with my friends.

1064
00:48:58,680 --> 00:49:01,080
Speaker 1: That I have in real life, I guess. But texting

1065
00:49:01,080 --> 00:49:03,839
Speaker 1: this sets something up, irl, That's that's how I roll. Yeah.

1066
00:49:03,920 --> 00:49:06,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, But that being said, I'm not gonna look a

1067
00:49:06,120 --> 00:49:07,680
Speaker 2: gift horse in the mouth. And this felt like a

1068
00:49:07,719 --> 00:49:10,160
Speaker 2: treat being able to sit down and chat with with Bernadette.

1069
00:49:10,160 --> 00:49:12,920
Speaker 2: But did you have a big takeaway from our conversation

1070
00:49:13,040 --> 00:49:13,879
Speaker 2: with heard today? I did.

1071
00:49:13,920 --> 00:49:16,239
Speaker 1: It came really early on in the conversation when she

1072
00:49:16,440 --> 00:49:19,880
Speaker 1: was talking about her side hustles and how she turned

1073
00:49:20,239 --> 00:49:24,000
Speaker 1: multiple side hustles into legit businesses that were profitable.

1074
00:49:24,440 --> 00:49:27,240
Speaker 2: And this is why we talk.

1075
00:49:27,160 --> 00:49:30,400
Speaker 1: About starting your own business even if it's small and

1076
00:49:30,440 --> 00:49:32,479
Speaker 1: making very little money in the beginning, Like you can't

1077
00:49:32,520 --> 00:49:34,840
Speaker 1: instantly turn it on and start making money like you

1078
00:49:34,880 --> 00:49:36,920
Speaker 1: can driving for uber or something like that. But the

1079
00:49:36,960 --> 00:49:41,960
Speaker 1: possibilities are much larger, right What it can become is

1080
00:49:41,960 --> 00:49:44,960
Speaker 1: is much more grand. So learn from Bernadette. Realize that

1081
00:49:45,000 --> 00:49:46,719
Speaker 1: there are all sorts of little things that you can

1082
00:49:46,760 --> 00:49:49,960
Speaker 1: do to start a business where you live, based on

1083
00:49:50,040 --> 00:49:51,680
Speaker 1: your interest and based on the needs you see in

1084
00:49:51,719 --> 00:49:55,280
Speaker 1: your community. Starting that business could be far more lucrative

1085
00:49:55,600 --> 00:49:58,360
Speaker 1: than just kind of going with the tried and true

1086
00:49:58,840 --> 00:50:01,160
Speaker 1: side hustle that's going to be essentially training time for

1087
00:50:01,239 --> 00:50:04,640
Speaker 1: money without the ability to build something larger and more scalable.

1088
00:50:04,680 --> 00:50:05,240
Speaker 1: That's true.

1089
00:50:05,360 --> 00:50:08,840
Speaker 2: That's a big vote for entrepreneurship. My big takeaway is

1090
00:50:08,840 --> 00:50:11,880
Speaker 2: gonna come from when she was talking about this exercise

1091
00:50:11,880 --> 00:50:14,239
Speaker 2: that she does with her clients as they're sort of

1092
00:50:14,320 --> 00:50:16,440
Speaker 2: looking off into the future and envisioning what life could

1093
00:50:16,480 --> 00:50:18,919
Speaker 2: look like. She called it the it would be cool

1094
00:50:18,920 --> 00:50:22,120
Speaker 2: if I love that exercise and it's just okay, write

1095
00:50:22,120 --> 00:50:24,319
Speaker 2: down all the things like brainstorm, it would be cool

1096
00:50:24,360 --> 00:50:27,720
Speaker 2: if I could fill in the blank. And I really

1097
00:50:27,719 --> 00:50:31,560
Speaker 2: really like that, But at the same time, there's something about.

1098
00:50:31,320 --> 00:50:32,880
Speaker 1: It that it doesn't worry me.

1099
00:50:33,000 --> 00:50:36,319
Speaker 2: But I would hate for folks to conflate that which

1100
00:50:36,400 --> 00:50:38,799
Speaker 2: is cool with that which is rewarding. And I think

1101
00:50:38,840 --> 00:50:41,120
Speaker 2: a lot of times your mind, like if I think through, oh,

1102
00:50:41,120 --> 00:50:43,440
Speaker 2: it would be cool if my mind immediately goes to

1103
00:50:44,080 --> 00:50:46,439
Speaker 2: like things that are easy, things that are like in

1104
00:50:46,520 --> 00:50:49,680
Speaker 2: the moment, super fun, but like there's a difference between

1105
00:50:49,680 --> 00:50:53,319
Speaker 2: that versus something that is hard that takes a whole

1106
00:50:53,320 --> 00:50:55,279
Speaker 2: lot of work, where there's a lot of sacrifice on

1107
00:50:55,320 --> 00:50:57,080
Speaker 2: the front end, but then at the end of that

1108
00:50:57,320 --> 00:50:58,880
Speaker 2: or even like part way through that, you're able to

1109
00:50:58,920 --> 00:51:02,359
Speaker 2: look back at at something and say to yourself, man,

1110
00:51:02,880 --> 00:51:05,080
Speaker 2: that is cool, right, and like I think about just

1111
00:51:05,160 --> 00:51:07,760
Speaker 2: the it's not easy to start to start a family

1112
00:51:07,800 --> 00:51:10,160
Speaker 2: and like raise kids, but that is something where the

1113
00:51:10,200 --> 00:51:12,200
Speaker 2: older I get, like and the more I'm able to

1114
00:51:12,239 --> 00:51:14,000
Speaker 2: look at the years I've had with him in particular,

1115
00:51:14,040 --> 00:51:16,319
Speaker 2: I'm like, that is cool, and it just makes me

1116
00:51:16,360 --> 00:51:18,360
Speaker 2: want to do more and more cool things with them.

1117
00:51:18,520 --> 00:51:20,799
Speaker 2: And it's not something I would have said, well, it'd

1118
00:51:20,840 --> 00:51:22,440
Speaker 2: be cool if I could do that, like on the

1119
00:51:22,480 --> 00:51:24,360
Speaker 2: front end. And so I think there's just a slight

1120
00:51:24,440 --> 00:51:25,719
Speaker 2: delineation between those two things.

1121
00:51:25,800 --> 00:51:28,040
Speaker 1: Basically when you're saying, wouldn't it be cool if don't

1122
00:51:28,080 --> 00:51:30,360
Speaker 1: just think about going skydiving, although like that could be

1123
00:51:30,400 --> 00:51:32,319
Speaker 1: on your list, nothing wrong with that, but like maybe

1124
00:51:32,320 --> 00:51:34,960
Speaker 1: think about the bigger, more meaningful things that take a

1125
00:51:34,960 --> 00:51:35,640
Speaker 1: lot more effort.

1126
00:51:35,760 --> 00:51:38,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And I think that just the thinking through

1127
00:51:38,200 --> 00:51:39,960
Speaker 2: just some of the fun things could be a great

1128
00:51:39,960 --> 00:51:42,439
Speaker 2: way just to spark some creative thought and to cause

1129
00:51:42,480 --> 00:51:44,120
Speaker 2: you to really buckle down and do some of these

1130
00:51:44,160 --> 00:51:46,000
Speaker 2: things that you've never thought would have been possible. A

1131
00:51:46,040 --> 00:51:48,520
Speaker 2: lot of oftentimes it is travel. But if you only

1132
00:51:48,560 --> 00:51:52,080
Speaker 2: focus on what feels like these like sugar rushes, like

1133
00:51:52,120 --> 00:51:56,000
Speaker 2: these quick hits of things that might fill the bucket immediately.

1134
00:51:56,160 --> 00:51:58,839
Speaker 2: I think over the long term, that could potentially leave

1135
00:51:58,880 --> 00:52:01,800
Speaker 2: somebody feeling hot over the course of years and decades.

1136
00:52:01,840 --> 00:52:03,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I think some of those pursuits, if

1137
00:52:03,760 --> 00:52:07,120
Speaker 1: taken to the extreme, can be incredibly self centered, right,

1138
00:52:07,200 --> 00:52:08,960
Speaker 1: and so we want to say, like, no, push yourself

1139
00:52:08,960 --> 00:52:10,800
Speaker 1: to think about the things are going to be ultimately

1140
00:52:10,880 --> 00:52:13,319
Speaker 1: gratifying over the years and decades too. So I think

1141
00:52:13,360 --> 00:52:15,920
Speaker 1: that's a good one. All right, Well, Matt, let's get

1142
00:52:15,920 --> 00:52:17,319
Speaker 1: back to the beer we had on this episode. This

1143
00:52:17,400 --> 00:52:21,840
Speaker 1: is Asahi. It is a Japanese super dry beer. Although

1144
00:52:22,200 --> 00:52:24,359
Speaker 1: made in Italy. There's product of Italy, so I don't

1145
00:52:24,400 --> 00:52:26,560
Speaker 1: know what that's about. I have no idea. We aren't

1146
00:52:26,560 --> 00:52:27,280
Speaker 1: they brewing that Japan.

1147
00:52:27,360 --> 00:52:29,400
Speaker 2: I mean, I thought it was a Japanese brew. No,

1148
00:52:29,440 --> 00:52:32,359
Speaker 2: I think it is originally, yeah, because it says here

1149
00:52:32,480 --> 00:52:36,320
Speaker 2: that it's brewed under the supervision of Japanese brewery.

1150
00:52:36,760 --> 00:52:38,120
Speaker 1: They flew one dude over to Italy.

1151
00:52:39,000 --> 00:52:42,560
Speaker 2: He's like hanging out, living the life and wherever they're Lalan,

1152
00:52:42,680 --> 00:52:46,640
Speaker 2: wherever they're Oh, I'm supervising, all right, But I will

1153
00:52:46,640 --> 00:52:49,680
Speaker 2: say I did enjoy this. It was just an easy drinking,

1154
00:52:49,920 --> 00:52:51,160
Speaker 2: light and dry lagger.

1155
00:52:51,360 --> 00:52:54,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, really dry, like it almost evaporates off your tongue.

1156
00:52:54,440 --> 00:52:58,200
Speaker 1: I haven't had many beers that are this dry. There's

1157
00:52:58,200 --> 00:52:59,520
Speaker 1: only like one of the beer I remember it was

1158
00:52:59,560 --> 00:53:01,799
Speaker 1: like a serra bought a collab that it like hit

1159
00:53:01,840 --> 00:53:03,680
Speaker 1: your tongue and it flew right off of it. It was crazy,

1160
00:53:04,080 --> 00:53:06,000
Speaker 1: and and that was like I think, more of a

1161
00:53:06,040 --> 00:53:07,680
Speaker 1: sour and there were yeasts in it.

1162
00:53:07,719 --> 00:53:09,640
Speaker 2: But it's hard to explain the lightness.

1163
00:53:09,719 --> 00:53:11,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, it really is. It's hard to explain how it's

1164
00:53:11,880 --> 00:53:12,360
Speaker 1: a butterfly.

1165
00:53:12,440 --> 00:53:14,640
Speaker 2: It just barely lands before flittering off.

1166
00:53:14,680 --> 00:53:17,160
Speaker 1: Which is just kind of it's a It's an interesting

1167
00:53:17,200 --> 00:53:21,920
Speaker 1: sensory technique, so I like this one. It's it's probably

1168
00:53:21,960 --> 00:53:24,960
Speaker 1: something especially probably more of a summer beer in my

1169
00:53:25,320 --> 00:53:28,120
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, or if you're just really thirsty in the winter,

1170
00:53:28,200 --> 00:53:31,560
Speaker 1: I guess, although your ear doesn't say siate your thirst.

1171
00:53:31,680 --> 00:53:34,439
Speaker 1: But still I could see why it's wet, Joel, isn't

1172
00:53:34,440 --> 00:53:36,880
Speaker 1: it It might feel like it? No, in fact, it's dry.

1173
00:53:37,360 --> 00:53:39,920
Speaker 2: But yeah, this is a style that we don't typically have,

1174
00:53:40,000 --> 00:53:41,359
Speaker 2: and it's kind of fun to have some of these

1175
00:53:41,680 --> 00:53:45,239
Speaker 2: more foreign ish on the show.

1176
00:53:45,280 --> 00:53:46,840
Speaker 1: But hey, Italy still foreign.

1177
00:53:46,760 --> 00:53:48,959
Speaker 2: I know exactly it's like, well it is technically foreign,

1178
00:53:49,000 --> 00:53:50,640
Speaker 2: but yeah, glad you and I got to enjoy it.

1179
00:53:50,640 --> 00:53:53,680
Speaker 2: We will make sure to link to Bernadette Joy's site

1180
00:53:53,760 --> 00:53:56,080
Speaker 2: where it did. You can buy her book The Mastermind

1181
00:53:56,120 --> 00:53:58,440
Speaker 2: Group that she has all that up on the website

1182
00:53:58,480 --> 00:54:00,680
Speaker 2: at how tomoney dot com. But buddy, that's going to

1183
00:54:00,719 --> 00:54:02,879
Speaker 2: be it for this episode. So until next time, best

1184
00:54:02,880 --> 00:54:04,640
Speaker 2: Friends Out, Best Friends Out,