WEBVTT - Week in Tech: Nintendo Thinks Sideways 0:00:13.480 --> 0:00:17.360 Welcome to tech Stuff, a production of iHeart Podcasts and Kaleidoscope. 0:00:17.800 --> 0:00:20.160 I'm Mas Valoshian and today Cara Price and I will 0:00:20.160 --> 0:00:23.439 bring you the headlines this week, including the future of 0:00:23.520 --> 0:00:28.440 search on the web, Ukrainian drone striking deep within Russia, and. 0:00:28.680 --> 0:00:31.400 The very real security risks of vibe coding. 0:00:32.120 --> 0:00:34.800 Then on tech Support you'll talk to Dexter Thomas of 0:00:34.920 --> 0:00:39.559 the kill Switch podcast all about Nintendo, its history and 0:00:39.560 --> 0:00:42.440 where it's a new console. The Switch too fits into 0:00:42.440 --> 0:00:43.080 its legacy. 0:00:43.320 --> 0:00:46.879 Google Yokoy is the person who may Nintendo what it 0:00:46.960 --> 0:00:51.200 is today without him, if they still existed, they would 0:00:51.280 --> 0:00:53.120 still be making playing cards. 0:00:53.440 --> 0:00:56.680 All of that on the weekend. Take It's Friday, June 0:00:56.760 --> 0:00:58.440 sixth Cara Price. 0:00:58.480 --> 0:00:59.400 It is good to be back. 0:01:00.560 --> 0:01:02.240 I don't even recognize that voice. 0:01:03.040 --> 0:01:06.760 What hell, it's better now, but my voice. I lost 0:01:06.800 --> 0:01:09.160 my voice. I had laryngite. It's like this. 0:01:09.600 --> 0:01:12.880 Which is a nightmare for a podcast host in heaven. 0:01:13.000 --> 0:01:16.440 For your wife, well, I get even more needy when 0:01:16.440 --> 0:01:19.760 I can't speak. It turns out read me exactly, and 0:01:19.880 --> 0:01:21.920 she has read notes. In fact, I was on a 0:01:21.959 --> 0:01:24.720 flight back from London on Monday last week and. 0:01:24.720 --> 0:01:27.280 My voice was literally couldn't speakers like this. 0:01:27.840 --> 0:01:29.720 And it was freezing cold on the flight, and I 0:01:29.720 --> 0:01:32.960 already wrapped one blanket around my neck and to try 0:01:33.000 --> 0:01:35.760 and kind of preserve the last hint of whisper. So 0:01:35.800 --> 0:01:37.200 I wrote a note on my phone for the airs 0:01:37.240 --> 0:01:39.720 tudors and said, it's very cold. Do you have any 0:01:39.720 --> 0:01:42.560 more blankets? And I handed it to her and she 0:01:42.600 --> 0:01:45.720 went from quite stern to totally lit up and so 0:01:45.959 --> 0:01:47.880 talking to me in sign language. She was so excited 0:01:48.360 --> 0:01:52.720 to show off the sign and you were like, it 0:01:52.800 --> 0:01:57.120 was like, I felt so ashamed that I couldn't speak 0:01:57.160 --> 0:01:58.320 sign language at that moment. 0:01:58.440 --> 0:02:00.640 But that's another that's for another day. 0:02:00.760 --> 0:02:02.960 Actually, And actually I was nervous were landing because you know, 0:02:02.960 --> 0:02:05.400 obviously you hear all these stories about your non US 0:02:05.440 --> 0:02:07.000 citizens crossing the border. I was like, oh my god, 0:02:07.040 --> 0:02:08.880 imagine if this is the day they choose to interrogate me. 0:02:08.919 --> 0:02:10.519 I literally can't speak. I'm gonna be there for a 0:02:10.520 --> 0:02:11.079 long hass the time. 0:02:11.080 --> 0:02:15.120 It'll also be the best excuse. Sorry I can't do it, 0:02:15.160 --> 0:02:19.600 but you were somehow last week given the gift of speech. 0:02:19.760 --> 0:02:22.320 Gift of technology gave me the gift of speech. So 0:02:22.520 --> 0:02:24.640 I found this app called WISP, And. 0:02:24.560 --> 0:02:26.799 While I was asking, did you just google this? 0:02:27.160 --> 0:02:30.839 I googled apps that can turn whispers into speech. 0:02:31.200 --> 0:02:32.680 And that would go figure. There is one. 0:02:32.760 --> 0:02:35.520 It's called WISP. And obviously I was at home feeling 0:02:35.560 --> 0:02:38.040 sorry for myself being able to speak, so I was like, 0:02:38.360 --> 0:02:43.440 how can I get some attention? I made a video 0:02:43.480 --> 0:02:46.959 of myself in WISP and it revoiced me, and I 0:02:47.000 --> 0:02:47.639 put it in our slack. 0:02:47.639 --> 0:02:49.000 So you've lays, So I'm going to play it again, 0:02:49.639 --> 0:02:52.639 ais As you know, I can literally only talk in 0:02:52.680 --> 0:02:55.720 a whisper. Right now, I just got a lot of writers, 0:02:56.600 --> 0:02:59.600 but maybe something we could lead next week's episode with. 0:03:00.040 --> 0:03:01.960 So I was right, we are leading this week's episode, 0:03:02.120 --> 0:03:03.560 and here we are leading the episode. 0:03:03.680 --> 0:03:08.800 You sound sort of like a Dutch survivor after a 0:03:08.960 --> 0:03:15.280 very long mission being rescued. Only it's true the end 0:03:15.280 --> 0:03:15.840 of a mission. 0:03:15.960 --> 0:03:16.840 It's a Dutch app. 0:03:17.000 --> 0:03:19.200 Yeah, and so I think you can train it on 0:03:19.240 --> 0:03:20.920 your voice to sound like you, but I didn't have 0:03:20.960 --> 0:03:22.880 a voice to train it all, so I had to 0:03:22.960 --> 0:03:25.200 use the default, which was indeed Dutch. 0:03:25.240 --> 0:03:25.959 There's two options. 0:03:26.040 --> 0:03:28.680 You can make a selfie video whispering that revoices you, 0:03:29.240 --> 0:03:32.600 or you can call on the phone, and of course. 0:03:33.960 --> 0:03:35.360 Were you speaking in real time? 0:03:35.520 --> 0:03:37.440 I was speaking like this and it was translating in. 0:03:37.400 --> 0:03:39.040 Real in real time. That's incredible. 0:03:39.080 --> 0:03:40.880 I called my mum with it. She said, I hate this. 0:03:41.040 --> 0:03:41.960 Never do this to me again. 0:03:42.160 --> 0:03:43.920 It was I mean, I just think it was incredible 0:03:43.920 --> 0:03:45.640 that you could do. Because if you remember when we 0:03:45.680 --> 0:03:47.400 did sleep, we had to pre record. 0:03:47.600 --> 0:03:50.560 This was our podcast that we hosted together six years ago. 0:03:50.440 --> 0:03:54.480 Six years ago now, and basically I had to train 0:03:55.320 --> 0:03:58.800 an AI model on my voice and then I couldn't 0:03:58.800 --> 0:03:59.720 do it in real time. 0:04:00.120 --> 0:04:02.840 Yes, obviously I'm lucky. I normally have a voice. 0:04:02.920 --> 0:04:05.720 Yes, as you know, yes I do. I do, but 0:04:05.720 --> 0:04:07.480 there are some people who don't. And you know, I 0:04:07.480 --> 0:04:11.160 think Whispy isn't really designed for the laryngitis sufferer who 0:04:11.200 --> 0:04:13.960 needs some extra attention. It's designed for people who've actually 0:04:14.280 --> 0:04:16.719 lost their voices, either to cancer or to trauma or 0:04:16.720 --> 0:04:19.280 to other illnesses. And you know, with that in mind, 0:04:20.080 --> 0:04:22.680 the modifications required to make this slightly better and more 0:04:22.720 --> 0:04:24.320 functional feel pretty achievable. 0:04:24.480 --> 0:04:25.600 And what a miracle. 0:04:25.600 --> 0:04:30.800 Frankly, yeah, absolutely, but it's always a but. 0:04:30.800 --> 0:04:33.160 But my next story is a turn in the other direction. 0:04:33.520 --> 0:04:37.200 And are you familiar with Cory Doctor Rowe and this 0:04:37.360 --> 0:04:40.000 concept he came up with of in shitification. 0:04:40.320 --> 0:04:42.440 Yes, I read about it in the Financial Times. 0:04:42.240 --> 0:04:43.880 And what did you take away from it? 0:04:44.600 --> 0:04:47.080 That the Internet has become a slop festival? 0:04:47.120 --> 0:04:49.440 The Internet has become a slop festival. That is better 0:04:49.480 --> 0:04:51.240 put even than Doctor himself about it. 0:04:51.200 --> 0:04:53.680 As a sort of the Internet as a slime, sort 0:04:53.720 --> 0:04:55.039 of cascading down. 0:04:55.400 --> 0:04:59.200 What he said specifically is in certification is quote a 0:04:59.240 --> 0:05:02.440 theory about what happens when you have power without consequence, 0:05:02.839 --> 0:05:05.120 And he goes on to describe platforms that have hollowed 0:05:05.120 --> 0:05:08.200 themselves out where there's just no value left in them 0:05:08.279 --> 0:05:10.360 except this kind of awful look in So I mean 0:05:10.360 --> 0:05:12.240 that makes me think about what happens if you open 0:05:12.279 --> 0:05:15.919 your Instagram reels today, there's just tons of which is 0:05:15.960 --> 0:05:16.400 not even right. 0:05:16.520 --> 0:05:18.760 I generated it's like, you know, it's like Tom Cruise 0:05:18.800 --> 0:05:20.000 talking to Barack Obama. 0:05:20.080 --> 0:05:22.560 In my case, it's like worms eating dragons and then 0:05:22.560 --> 0:05:28.800 getting a sex back a reflecting my subconscious I mean, 0:05:28.800 --> 0:05:30.960 this concept of incentification, I think is one of the 0:05:31.040 --> 0:05:36.159 kind of great guiding constructs to think about what's happening 0:05:36.240 --> 0:05:40.960 right now. But I think concerningly it's actually happening right now, 0:05:41.279 --> 0:05:45.120 potentially the world Wide Web itself. Of course, I'm talking 0:05:45.160 --> 0:05:47.880 about AI summaries. We all know about them from chet 0:05:47.920 --> 0:05:51.479 GPT and how they're overlaid on Google, but now Internet 0:05:51.480 --> 0:05:55.760 browsers themselves are building them in this appointed to Axios, Firefox, 0:05:55.839 --> 0:05:58.320 Microsoft Edge. All you have to do is hover your 0:05:58.360 --> 0:06:01.320 mouse over a weblink and you get an automatic summary, 0:06:01.640 --> 0:06:04.640 which is kind of crazy, like the click through rate, 0:06:05.160 --> 0:06:07.760 the great metric, Yes of our age. 0:06:08.000 --> 0:06:09.480 Yes, it is going to be gone, It's going to 0:06:09.560 --> 0:06:10.080 be gone. Yeah. 0:06:10.120 --> 0:06:11.320 What does that means people. 0:06:11.120 --> 0:06:14.440 Are rolling their mouse over a link? Yeah, nobody's going 0:06:14.480 --> 0:06:18.280 to click through wild to your point about in sitification, 0:06:18.480 --> 0:06:21.600 the only reason that good content exists on the Internet 0:06:21.640 --> 0:06:24.200 that is even worth summarizing in the first place is 0:06:24.200 --> 0:06:27.200 because people had an incentive to create it. It would 0:06:27.240 --> 0:06:30.200 drive traffic and maybe even add dollars to their websites. 0:06:30.240 --> 0:06:32.720 But it's definitely a blow to creatives out there, Like, 0:06:33.400 --> 0:06:36.200 is there an incentive to publish on the web anymore? 0:06:36.480 --> 0:06:36.720 Yeah? 0:06:36.839 --> 0:06:39.200 Look to your point, I think a world where there's 0:06:39.320 --> 0:06:42.960 no reward for posting online will be a poorer world 0:06:43.560 --> 0:06:47.320 for us, but also ironically for AI. Because obviously AI 0:06:47.480 --> 0:06:50.080 needs new days to train on, and so a few 0:06:50.160 --> 0:06:52.719 people are posting news and opinions and arguments on the 0:06:52.760 --> 0:06:55.400 internet that will ultimately lead to a poorer AI. 0:06:55.520 --> 0:06:57.520 So this is like the opposite of a virtuous circle. 0:06:57.920 --> 0:07:00.440 Yeah, you know, an AI is already so fast. It 0:07:00.440 --> 0:07:03.640 feels like every week I see an embarrassing story of 0:07:04.279 --> 0:07:05.880 a mistake that AI made. 0:07:06.000 --> 0:07:09.080 I mean, the pizza with the glue is obviously time classic, brilliant, 0:07:09.080 --> 0:07:09.720 but it doesn't end. 0:07:09.760 --> 0:07:11.520 I mean, that's the thing two years ago. 0:07:11.440 --> 0:07:16.000 And everything, and it's creating more interesting shit. Yeah, that's 0:07:16.560 --> 0:07:19.440 what keeps happening. And I think one of my recent 0:07:19.520 --> 0:07:23.160 favorites was the AI generated summer reading list that this 0:07:23.240 --> 0:07:25.920 is not AI's fault, that made its way to being 0:07:26.040 --> 0:07:28.720 published in the Chicago Sun Times. Like there's a photo 0:07:28.720 --> 0:07:31.680 of a librarian holding up a fake summer reading. 0:07:31.480 --> 0:07:33.880 List of fake books, of fake books. 0:07:33.840 --> 0:07:36.960 One by Isabelle a Ende, a very famous author, one 0:07:37.000 --> 0:07:39.280 by Percival Everett who just won the Pulitzer Prize. 0:07:39.320 --> 0:07:41.280 And these are fake titles of books they never read. 0:07:41.040 --> 0:07:44.160 Bake titles of books, no vetting. But I mean, that's 0:07:44.160 --> 0:07:47.520 not AI's fault. Actually, that's the fault of the Chicago 0:07:47.520 --> 0:07:50.520 Sun Times. I think in that one it definitely does, 0:07:51.000 --> 0:07:56.200 but it doesn't. I think what's so kind of upsetting 0:07:56.360 --> 0:08:00.600 is that it doesn't surprise me in the age of 0:08:00.800 --> 0:08:03.440 automation of everything, that we just sort of accept it 0:08:03.480 --> 0:08:04.000 to be real. 0:08:04.200 --> 0:08:05.560 Yeah. Yeah, Yeah. 0:08:05.600 --> 0:08:07.720 And Google, which for as long as I can remember, 0:08:07.800 --> 0:08:10.800 has been the king of search, is doubling down on 0:08:11.000 --> 0:08:14.520 AI summaries. Essentially, it just released something called AI Mode, 0:08:14.960 --> 0:08:18.200 and this turns straightforward Google search queries into an AI 0:08:18.360 --> 0:08:19.160 chat conversation. 0:08:19.640 --> 0:08:22.520 Yeah, you know, it sounds like how a lot of 0:08:22.560 --> 0:08:25.320 people are already using chat GPT but in your browser. 0:08:25.480 --> 0:08:27.760 Well exactly, that is designed to prevent them from using 0:08:27.840 --> 0:08:30.440 chatpt and instead staying in their browser. There was this 0:08:30.560 --> 0:08:32.200 article in the FT a couple of weeks ago with 0:08:32.240 --> 0:08:36.079 the headline can Google still dominate search in the age 0:08:36.120 --> 0:08:39.800 of AI chatbots? AI Mode shows you, in real time 0:08:40.080 --> 0:08:42.760 how they're trying to answer that question, which could ultimately 0:08:42.800 --> 0:08:46.320 be existential for them. Of course, to no unsurprised. Earlier 0:08:46.320 --> 0:08:50.080 reviews of AI mode have found some pretty unreliable information. 0:08:50.640 --> 0:08:52.880 A reporter at The New York Times actually used AI 0:08:52.920 --> 0:08:55.360 mode to plan his daughter's birthday. 0:08:55.000 --> 0:08:57.680 Party parenting presented by Google. 0:08:58.040 --> 0:09:01.199 Yes, and needless to say, it go very smoothly. The 0:09:01.320 --> 0:09:03.760 reporter asked Google AI mode to find parks in his 0:09:03.880 --> 0:09:07.680 area with picnic tables, and Google provided the reporter with 0:09:07.720 --> 0:09:10.520 a bulletedist of parks with some helpful information about each, 0:09:11.360 --> 0:09:13.800 and so he went out to scout two of the suggestions, 0:09:14.240 --> 0:09:16.840 but of course neither had picnic tables. 0:09:16.559 --> 0:09:19.280 So he basically was given nothing that he needed. 0:09:19.120 --> 0:09:21.040 Nothing of value, and thank goodness, I think he didn't 0:09:21.080 --> 0:09:23.160 have his disappointed kids in terms. 0:09:24.040 --> 0:09:25.800 So anyway he was during the scout, he was writing 0:09:25.800 --> 0:09:27.120 a story, so he soldied on. 0:09:27.440 --> 0:09:29.880 He went back home and told AI mode that the 0:09:29.920 --> 0:09:34.360 parks didn't have tables. AI apologized and spat out another list, 0:09:34.920 --> 0:09:37.640 but it included the same parks he'd already visited and 0:09:37.760 --> 0:09:39.360 knew that they didn't have a picnic table, so it 0:09:39.400 --> 0:09:40.640 didn't take on the new information. 0:09:41.000 --> 0:09:45.040 So getting Google's AI mode to plan your kid's birthday 0:09:46.200 --> 0:09:48.320 essentially at this point he should have just let his 0:09:48.400 --> 0:09:49.559 kid plan the kid's birthday. 0:09:49.720 --> 0:09:52.680 I guess less candy in Google ai mode, but yes. 0:09:53.800 --> 0:09:57.040 The reporter also asked Aimo to find an affordable car wash, 0:09:57.320 --> 0:09:59.360 and it listed one business as having a twenty five 0:09:59.400 --> 0:10:02.360 dollar car whah. When he got there, the real cost 0:10:02.400 --> 0:10:05.679 was sixty five dollars. What's interesting, though, is that when 0:10:05.720 --> 0:10:08.800 the journalist did the same queries through regular, good old 0:10:08.840 --> 0:10:11.559 fashioned Google about the picnic tables and the car washes, 0:10:12.040 --> 0:10:14.760 guess what, go figure, he got the information he wanted 0:10:14.760 --> 0:10:15.520 and it was correct. 0:10:15.960 --> 0:10:17.640 You know, I don't like to be a doomer about this, 0:10:17.760 --> 0:10:21.280 but your reference to incertification makes sense to me. Like, 0:10:21.640 --> 0:10:24.120 here's Google, Yeah, the search engine that we've been all 0:10:24.200 --> 0:10:27.839 using for twenty five years, with a mode that's making 0:10:27.920 --> 0:10:28.680 Google worse. 0:10:28.880 --> 0:10:29.160 Yeah. 0:10:29.240 --> 0:10:31.640 I mean, for all intents and purposes, Google works, We'll 0:10:31.640 --> 0:10:34.120 work pretty well, but they're trying to keep up with 0:10:34.480 --> 0:10:39.120 what the Internet is right now, and as such are 0:10:39.160 --> 0:10:40.600 in shitifying it. Yeah. 0:10:40.640 --> 0:10:43.640 And of course the question I have is, in this 0:10:43.760 --> 0:10:47.480 new world, how long will normal people bother to post 0:10:47.600 --> 0:10:51.480 helpful information online if the default becomes an AI mode 0:10:51.520 --> 0:10:54.400 that is unreliable and that doesn't reward the content creator 0:10:54.440 --> 0:10:57.440 for their contribution. I was actually talking to a friend 0:10:57.440 --> 0:10:59.040 of ours the other day and she mentioned that she 0:10:59.080 --> 0:11:01.040 actually no longer used is Google, which I was pretty 0:11:01.040 --> 0:11:01.480 shocked by. 0:11:01.600 --> 0:11:02.760 That's such a bold class. 0:11:04.640 --> 0:11:04.840 Yeah. 0:11:05.240 --> 0:11:08.240 Specifically for search. She used this search engine called Kagi, 0:11:08.840 --> 0:11:13.199 which is Japanese for key. I learned thirty seconds ago Google. 0:11:13.600 --> 0:11:16.079 I googled it and it touts itself as being a 0:11:16.160 --> 0:11:19.960 quote premium search engine. Users can tailor their search results 0:11:20.000 --> 0:11:23.120 their own preferences, and they don't get shown ads because 0:11:23.200 --> 0:11:25.959 the service monetizes through subscription rather than ads. 0:11:26.000 --> 0:11:32.440 Interesting. Well, no offense to the Kagigs coagistas there, but 0:11:32.600 --> 0:11:36.120 I do think people will generally stick to the devil 0:11:36.160 --> 0:11:38.640 they know, and the devil they know is Google. You know. 0:11:38.720 --> 0:11:43.200 At the same time, progress is not linear right now. 0:11:43.480 --> 0:11:46.600 Should Google's AI mode be your preferred method for birthday 0:11:46.600 --> 0:11:50.360 party planning? Probably? Not. In a year, maybe it could. 0:11:50.400 --> 0:11:52.480 Maybe it will show you where the picnic table is, 0:11:52.840 --> 0:11:55.720 you know, lest we forget, I used to ask Jeeves. 0:11:55.480 --> 0:11:57.080 Well, was the last time you asked you something? 0:11:57.440 --> 0:11:59.240 I don't know? But you know, we actually live in 0:11:59.280 --> 0:12:01.920 a world where I could build my own ass, Jeeves, 0:12:02.120 --> 0:12:04.640 which is what are you talking about? Well, I wouldn't 0:12:04.679 --> 0:12:07.200 do it myself, but this has a lot to do 0:12:07.240 --> 0:12:10.600 with my headline of the week, which is, you know, 0:12:10.720 --> 0:12:14.480 I don't even know if I like vibe coating. I 0:12:14.559 --> 0:12:16.800 just like the term vibe coating. It's a great You know, 0:12:16.840 --> 0:12:19.840 there's this app called Lovable, and it's a sweetest startup 0:12:19.880 --> 0:12:24.640 that calls its product the last piece of software, the 0:12:24.760 --> 0:12:29.440 last of us. It might be, it might be. So. 0:12:29.760 --> 0:12:32.360 The way it works is that you basically, Lovable has 0:12:32.400 --> 0:12:35.560 a chatbot and you tell it to make an app 0:12:35.559 --> 0:12:38.120 for you, and you can say, can you build me 0:12:38.120 --> 0:12:40.520 an app where I can track all the hats that 0:12:40.559 --> 0:12:42.520 I own, so I will stop spending money on hats 0:12:42.520 --> 0:12:44.880 when I reminded of how many hats I own. Same 0:12:44.880 --> 0:12:47.760 thing with glasses, and maybe Lovable would generate an app 0:12:47.760 --> 0:12:50.400 where I can log my extensive hat or glasses collection. 0:12:50.520 --> 0:12:51.440 That does sound pretty cool. 0:12:51.640 --> 0:12:54.440 It is. There is a problem with it, though, which 0:12:54.440 --> 0:12:59.360 is that it's having some issues in the security department. Semaphore, 0:13:00.040 --> 0:13:02.679 you know, trust the old Semaphore. Yes, ran a headline 0:13:02.840 --> 0:13:06.319 the hottest new vibe coding startup maybe a sitting duck 0:13:06.800 --> 0:13:07.360 for hackers. 0:13:07.400 --> 0:13:08.360 You know, I saw that headline. 0:13:08.400 --> 0:13:10.120 I didn't actually read the story, but it was fascinating, 0:13:10.120 --> 0:13:11.199 so I'm glad you'll bring it today. 0:13:11.240 --> 0:13:13.440 There's always a whistleblower at a competing company and it's 0:13:13.480 --> 0:13:16.880 like your company is doing wrong. And so an employee 0:13:16.920 --> 0:13:22.440 at a competing vibe coding company called Replet not confused 0:13:22.440 --> 0:13:26.040 with Reddit Yes, release a report that shows some serious 0:13:26.160 --> 0:13:30.680 vulnerabilities for users, and on lovable site, the company showcases 0:13:30.720 --> 0:13:32.960 some of the apps and websites that users have made 0:13:33.000 --> 0:13:36.640 with the software. There's one called Can't Make This Stuff Up. 0:13:36.760 --> 0:13:38.200 There's one called scam. 0:13:37.920 --> 0:13:39.800 Nail, Scam nails, ay, hangnail but. 0:13:39.920 --> 0:13:42.480 Yeah, which is a community platform for users to get 0:13:42.520 --> 0:13:45.200 expert advice on whether or not they're dealing with a scam. 0:13:45.520 --> 0:13:48.080 There's another I mean, these names. I wonder if Lovable 0:13:48.120 --> 0:13:51.680 comes up with the names. There's another website called info rid, 0:13:51.760 --> 0:13:55.320 which promises to remove your personal information from around seventy 0:13:55.400 --> 0:13:57.839 data brokers so you receive less spam. That sounds good, 0:13:58.200 --> 0:14:00.720 I mean, they all sound like great ideas, but this 0:14:00.800 --> 0:14:04.559 report found that of the over sixteen hundred web apps 0:14:04.559 --> 0:14:08.240 featured on Lovable Site, one hundred and seventy of them 0:14:08.400 --> 0:14:09.520 had vulnerabilities. 0:14:10.000 --> 0:14:12.000 And when you say vulnerabilities, I know it. 0:14:11.960 --> 0:14:14.960 Sounds they're not emotional vulnerability. Things that I think people 0:14:14.960 --> 0:14:18.320 find very important, which is like their name, their email address, 0:14:18.440 --> 0:14:22.840 and most importantly financial information, like anything that's extremely personal. 0:14:23.000 --> 0:14:25.000 So the advice from parents and children that we used 0:14:25.000 --> 0:14:27.040 to be don't get into a stranger's car, it's now 0:14:27.120 --> 0:14:29.960 don't use software that you find online because what I say. 0:14:29.880 --> 0:14:33.200 You know, there are pitfalls. Even if AI can write 0:14:33.280 --> 0:14:36.680 flawless code, there can be security flaws. For example, when 0:14:36.680 --> 0:14:38.960 you tell Lovable that you want to make a website, 0:14:39.000 --> 0:14:41.440 it's just going to make the website plain and simple. 0:14:41.640 --> 0:14:43.600 But for a website to work, it has to be 0:14:43.680 --> 0:14:46.280 connected to a database that can store things like user 0:14:46.320 --> 0:14:51.640 accounts and payment information. And that's the work historically of 0:14:51.880 --> 0:14:56.320 seasoned software developers, who even season software developers can make mistakes. 0:14:56.560 --> 0:14:58.720 Yeah, I mean it's I joked about don't go into 0:14:58.760 --> 0:15:01.280 strangers at but like, you know, it's going to get 0:15:01.280 --> 0:15:02.320 hard or not to use the web. 0:15:02.320 --> 0:15:04.840 You've got AI summaries overlaid everywhere, and. 0:15:04.760 --> 0:15:06.240 Then when you do get to a website or an 0:15:06.240 --> 0:15:08.360 app that you want to go into, you know, you 0:15:08.400 --> 0:15:10.000 have to think about whether or not it's been VIBE 0:15:10.000 --> 0:15:12.680 coded and whether the security on the back end will 0:15:12.680 --> 0:15:15.040 be functional. I mean, it's just like it's kind of 0:15:15.040 --> 0:15:16.160 a little bit of a headspin there. 0:15:16.440 --> 0:15:19.440 Yeah, and you know, Lovable does offer an easy way 0:15:19.800 --> 0:15:22.920 to connect to a properly managed database to store payment 0:15:22.960 --> 0:15:26.120 information and like it's a service called sounds a lot 0:15:26.160 --> 0:15:30.840 like a Nicki Minaj song super Base. But the vulnerability 0:15:30.880 --> 0:15:34.320 report found that on some of these Lovable made apps, 0:15:34.640 --> 0:15:38.400 the super base database was not configured correctly, which led 0:15:38.440 --> 0:15:41.880 to the security flaws. So that might be pointing to 0:15:41.920 --> 0:15:44.320 the issue that you're flagging as that people don't really 0:15:44.400 --> 0:15:47.520 know how to check their work yet and that doing 0:15:47.560 --> 0:15:49.840 that takes some creative thinking and actually a little bit 0:15:49.840 --> 0:15:54.360 of paranoil, like how might my passion project be vulnerable? 0:15:54.440 --> 0:15:54.920 Yeah, I mean, I. 0:15:54.920 --> 0:15:57.160 Guess a lot of software developers do this red teaming, 0:15:57.240 --> 0:15:59.080 like they try and get into the headspace of an 0:15:59.120 --> 0:16:01.240 attacker and the attack their own product. 0:16:01.760 --> 0:16:04.320 Most vibe coders are not self. 0:16:04.680 --> 0:16:07.200 Not necessarily coders, No exactly. 0:16:07.560 --> 0:16:13.200 So repltu replit raised their hand and said, heyre's the 0:16:13.200 --> 0:16:16.240 problem over there? Yeah sevenphore around the story. Yes, how 0:16:16.280 --> 0:16:17.200 did Lovable respond? 0:16:17.480 --> 0:16:21.400 Lovable responded on x formerly known as Twitter, saying, quote, 0:16:21.520 --> 0:16:24.360 we're not yet where we want to be in terms 0:16:24.400 --> 0:16:27.560 of security, and we're committed to keep improving the security 0:16:27.600 --> 0:16:32.720 posture for all Lovable users. It just reminds me if 0:16:32.760 --> 0:16:35.240 like all of a sudden, someone who didn't work at 0:16:35.320 --> 0:16:37.920 Nike was like, I'm going to be Nike today and 0:16:37.920 --> 0:16:39.080 I'm going to make these sneakers. 0:16:39.120 --> 0:16:41.200 Well, that happens, right, I mean, as a whole, this 0:16:41.240 --> 0:16:44.400 company spend billions of dollars on pattern and protection and 0:16:44.840 --> 0:16:47.920 infringement on their copyright and stuff because they don't want 0:16:47.960 --> 0:16:51.040 to erode trust in their brand by having knockoffs, injured. 0:16:50.760 --> 0:16:51.960 People, a hut and whatever it is. 0:16:52.040 --> 0:16:54.760 Yes, exactly, but now we're in this weird error on 0:16:54.800 --> 0:16:58.120 the Internet where you know, we've developed this shared sort 0:16:58.120 --> 0:17:01.560 of status quo understanding of about like you can trust 0:17:02.240 --> 0:17:05.040 an app that you find in the App Store or 0:17:05.040 --> 0:17:09.119 an Android or like most legit seeming websites probably are legit. 0:17:09.720 --> 0:17:11.560 You know, obviously have to be have a spearfishing and stuff, 0:17:11.560 --> 0:17:14.879 but like this whole kind of shared basis of like 0:17:15.040 --> 0:17:17.280 being able to input your data with some degree of 0:17:17.320 --> 0:17:20.040 confidence online. And of course there's amazing things that you 0:17:20.080 --> 0:17:21.960 can do with vibe coding. It's pretty cool that you 0:17:21.960 --> 0:17:24.239 can make a functional prototype for an idea and get 0:17:24.280 --> 0:17:27.000 people excited within just a few moments or a few days, 0:17:27.400 --> 0:17:29.600 and that really is cool, but at the same time, 0:17:29.720 --> 0:17:33.200 like at the cost of blowing up this security architecture 0:17:33.400 --> 0:17:35.080 that we built over the last twenty. 0:17:34.920 --> 0:17:37.640 Years, right, and security has actually been a key concern 0:17:37.720 --> 0:17:40.800 ever since the beginning of the Internet, and security measures 0:17:41.160 --> 0:17:46.320 and hackers have gotten more sophisticated, so it's kind of 0:17:46.400 --> 0:17:50.199 unreal that the big fad is to make products that 0:17:50.240 --> 0:17:51.359 are less sophisticated. 0:17:51.440 --> 0:17:51.760 Totally. 0:17:51.840 --> 0:17:54.639 I really really want to get one of the vibe 0:17:54.640 --> 0:17:58.080 coding people on the show, whether it's Cursor or Replet 0:17:58.200 --> 0:18:00.000 or Lovable, it'd be very interesting to have someone from 0:18:00.040 --> 0:18:01.400 those companies, So Will maybe. 0:18:01.240 --> 0:18:03.800 We should have Replet and Lovable in a Frost Nixon 0:18:03.880 --> 0:18:05.680 wow of. 0:18:06.320 --> 0:18:08.480 So we'll work on that. But in the meantime, we've 0:18:08.480 --> 0:18:09.600 got some brief headlines. 0:18:10.000 --> 0:18:13.359 So if you're someone who thinks that ring doorbells are 0:18:13.400 --> 0:18:15.760 a step too far in the direction of surveillance, I 0:18:15.800 --> 0:18:18.880 would like to present to you the world of New 0:18:18.960 --> 0:18:23.439 York City Facebook mom groups, which I'm very familiar with 0:18:23.480 --> 0:18:25.920 because a lot of my friends are in them. According 0:18:25.920 --> 0:18:31.240 to the Daily Mail me some nannies in New York 0:18:31.240 --> 0:18:34.400 City's Upper East Side are paranoid that they are being 0:18:34.440 --> 0:18:36.720 spied on, and this reminds me spy cam has been 0:18:36.760 --> 0:18:38.439 a thing with Nanni's for a long time, Like this 0:18:38.520 --> 0:18:41.320 is not people used to embed them in like stuffed animals. 0:18:41.359 --> 0:18:45.479 But in a Facebook group aptly titled maybe embarrassingly titled 0:18:45.480 --> 0:18:48.720 Moms of the Upper east Side, members have posted pictures 0:18:48.720 --> 0:18:52.320 of Nanny's with captions like if you recognize this blonde 0:18:52.320 --> 0:18:55.840 girl with pigtails I saw yesterday afternoon around seventy eighth 0:18:55.880 --> 0:18:58.520 and Second Avenue, Please dm me. I think you will 0:18:58.560 --> 0:18:59.879 want to know what your nanny. 0:19:00.200 --> 0:19:01.440 Oh my god, it's like a horror movie. 0:19:01.480 --> 0:19:05.080