WEBVTT - Erin Walsh on Styling Anne Hathaway, The Devil Wears Prada 2, and the Real-Life Andy Sachs Arc 0:00:03.240 --> 0:00:05.840 No one has all the answers, but when we ask 0:00:05.880 --> 0:00:10.680 the right questions, we get a little closer, closer to truths, 0:00:11.440 --> 0:00:16.560 closer to each other, even closer to ourselves. I'm journalist 0:00:16.600 --> 0:00:19.240 Danielle Robe, and each week my guests and I come 0:00:19.360 --> 0:00:22.800 together to challenge the status quo and our own ways 0:00:22.800 --> 0:00:27.360 of thinking by daring to ask what if, why not? 0:00:28.320 --> 0:00:29.080 And who says? 0:00:30.480 --> 0:00:30.600 So? 0:00:30.680 --> 0:00:35.920 Come curious, dig deep, and join the conversation. It's time 0:00:36.280 --> 0:00:41.720 to question everything. So there's this scene in the first 0:00:41.800 --> 0:00:44.120 Devil War's Prada, the one from two thousand and six, 0:00:44.159 --> 0:00:47.400 where Andy Sachs changes, and I don't mean just her clothes, 0:00:47.440 --> 0:00:50.240 it's her whole posture that shifts. She walks through Manhattan 0:00:50.560 --> 0:00:54.800 a completely different person, right, more confident, more radiant, more 0:00:54.920 --> 0:00:57.720 legible to the world around her, and the lesson The 0:00:57.760 --> 0:01:02.080 movie quietly hands us is this style is what you 0:01:02.160 --> 0:01:05.280 put on to become who the room expects you to be. Now, 0:01:05.319 --> 0:01:08.200 today's guest watch that movie. The year it came out, 0:01:08.480 --> 0:01:11.120 sitting in the offices of Vogue with her colleagues at 0:01:11.200 --> 0:01:14.360 Vogue at her first real job at Vogue, she called 0:01:14.400 --> 0:01:20.800 it extremely accurate, but she lasted eighteen months and Now 0:01:20.880 --> 0:01:23.880 Aaron Walsh is the stylus in partnership with some of 0:01:23.920 --> 0:01:28.120 the most iconic women in culture, Sarah Jessica Parker, Carrie Washington, 0:01:28.319 --> 0:01:32.720 Selena Gomez, and yes Anne Hathaway herself, which means as 0:01:32.760 --> 0:01:35.920 Devil Wears Prada, too enters the world, the woman who 0:01:35.959 --> 0:01:39.040 once watched the film as a junior fashion assistant is 0:01:39.040 --> 0:01:41.440 now the one dressing its star. It's kind of a 0:01:41.440 --> 0:01:44.760 full circle moment that sounds inventive. And here's what I 0:01:44.760 --> 0:01:48.520 find so interesting. Aaron's philosophy flips the original film's lesson 0:01:48.600 --> 0:01:51.480 completely on its head. The first movie asked what should 0:01:51.520 --> 0:01:53.280 I wear to become who they want me to be? 0:01:53.600 --> 0:01:56.560 Aaron asked the total opposite, Who do I want to be? 0:01:57.080 --> 0:01:59.480 And how do I start showing up as her right 0:01:59.520 --> 0:02:02.360 now to before anyone else has waited in It's the 0:02:02.400 --> 0:02:05.640 central question of her new book, The Art of Intentional Dressing. 0:02:05.880 --> 0:02:08.680 Her argument is that we don't get to control most 0:02:08.720 --> 0:02:12.359 of what happens to us, but we do control the rituals, 0:02:12.680 --> 0:02:15.480 the three words we choose for the day, the closet 0:02:15.520 --> 0:02:18.480 we walk into, the version of ourselves we decide to 0:02:18.480 --> 0:02:21.120 embody before the world even has a chance to ask 0:02:21.200 --> 0:02:22.079 anything of us. 0:02:22.360 --> 0:02:24.320 You don't get to decide how you wake up feeling. 0:02:24.600 --> 0:02:26.639 You don't get to decide what her balls get thrown 0:02:26.680 --> 0:02:29.600 your way. But you can keep reconnecting with that intention, 0:02:29.639 --> 0:02:31.680 and that's what's going to keep you in integrity with 0:02:31.720 --> 0:02:33.280 yourself and that woman that you want to be. 0:02:33.560 --> 0:02:37.640 She calls closets portals of possibility and says that getting 0:02:37.720 --> 0:02:40.320 dressed can be a form of therapy, which I honestly 0:02:40.320 --> 0:02:42.839 thought might be nuts, but after talking with her, I'm 0:02:42.840 --> 0:02:46.000 fairly convinced she's right. So today we're getting into it. 0:02:46.040 --> 0:02:48.640 The three word practice she does every morning, why she 0:02:48.680 --> 0:02:50.959 thinks every woman needs to clean out her closet four 0:02:50.960 --> 0:02:53.480 times a year, what it actually feels like to dress 0:02:53.480 --> 0:02:56.440 someone for a moment that two hundred million people will see, 0:02:56.520 --> 0:02:59.680 And most importantly, the question we are circling, which is 0:02:59.720 --> 0:03:02.200 how should you be getting dressed? I'm just kidding. The 0:03:02.280 --> 0:03:04.560 question we're really circling, who do you want to be? 0:03:04.720 --> 0:03:08.360 In this room? It's time to question everything. With Aaron 0:03:08.400 --> 0:03:15.320 Walsh erin the Devil Wars Prodatu is about to come 0:03:15.320 --> 0:03:18.160 out into the world, and your connection to the movie 0:03:18.160 --> 0:03:22.480 feels so kismet because when I was looking into your background, 0:03:22.480 --> 0:03:25.200 I kept thinking, this is almost full circle. You have 0:03:25.240 --> 0:03:28.720 a real life Andy Sacks arc to your personal story 0:03:28.919 --> 0:03:31.840 going back to two thousand and six, Can you tell 0:03:31.840 --> 0:03:34.239 me about your introduction to the fashion world. 0:03:34.520 --> 0:03:38.000 Yeah, so I fell into fashion by accident. I went 0:03:38.040 --> 0:03:41.280 to NYU to be an actress, and I graduated and 0:03:41.360 --> 0:03:44.000 panicked and decided that did not seem like a proper 0:03:44.080 --> 0:03:46.440 route to success, and I just quit immediately. It was 0:03:46.480 --> 0:03:49.800 like within two months. I'd always loved clothes, I'd always 0:03:49.800 --> 0:03:53.440 been entrusted in fashion to the point like even growing up, 0:03:53.480 --> 0:03:55.840 I would like lie in bed thinking about outfits for 0:03:56.040 --> 0:03:59.200 going to sleep. But in terms of getting a job 0:03:59.280 --> 0:04:02.320 in fashion, like because I stopped acting, I needed to work, 0:04:02.360 --> 0:04:03.800 so I got a job in a store, and then 0:04:03.800 --> 0:04:05.400 I worked in PR for a second and hated that 0:04:05.440 --> 0:04:08.640 because I'm not a very good salesperson, And so I thought, well, 0:04:08.680 --> 0:04:10.680 maybe I could write like I loved writing. I was 0:04:10.720 --> 0:04:12.520 even like working on writing a movie at the time, 0:04:12.560 --> 0:04:14.800 and I'd written plays, and so I thought, well, maybe 0:04:14.840 --> 0:04:16.839 I can write for a magazine like I love fashion, 0:04:16.880 --> 0:04:19.880 And I started tempting a Conde Nast, and there was 0:04:20.080 --> 0:04:22.279 an opening in the fashion department. I thought, well, like, 0:04:22.320 --> 0:04:24.760 I don't even know that much about photo shoots, but 0:04:24.800 --> 0:04:26.320 maybe that's the way and I can get into features 0:04:26.360 --> 0:04:28.919 and start writing that way. And I immediately got a 0:04:29.000 --> 0:04:32.640 job with Phyllis Posnik, who was executive fashion editor at Vogue, 0:04:33.240 --> 0:04:36.640 and she had been there longer than Anna, like the 0:04:36.760 --> 0:04:39.400 editor was there the longest, longer than Grace, longer than anybody. 0:04:39.839 --> 0:04:41.960 And yeah, that was my first big fashion job. And 0:04:42.000 --> 0:04:44.240 it was in two thousand and six, the year the 0:04:44.240 --> 0:04:47.880 Devilwaar's product came out, and we all watched it together 0:04:48.120 --> 0:04:51.480 and it was extremely accurate. And it's funny, like being 0:04:51.520 --> 0:04:53.919 on a tour like this. It's like so meta in 0:04:54.000 --> 0:04:56.400 so many ways, and like the twenty year arc of it, 0:04:56.400 --> 0:04:57.240 it's funny. 0:04:57.040 --> 0:04:59.039 And you were living it. You wrote, this is where 0:04:59.040 --> 0:05:03.600 I will be for the next thirty years. That first day, you. 0:05:03.560 --> 0:05:05.480 Know, I don't even have that good of a memory, 0:05:05.520 --> 0:05:08.559 but there's certain like very seminal moments in your life. 0:05:08.560 --> 0:05:11.400 And I remember my first day walking into Vogue, like 0:05:11.560 --> 0:05:14.640 seeing like the letters on the wall. I consider myself 0:05:14.680 --> 0:05:17.360 to be an intuitive person, but I had this hit. 0:05:17.400 --> 0:05:19.240 I'm like, oh my god, I'll be here for the 0:05:19.240 --> 0:05:21.240 next fifty years, like I can feel it. And I 0:05:21.279 --> 0:05:23.240 was obviously very wrong because I was not the right 0:05:23.279 --> 0:05:25.600 fit for my boss, and I did it last longer 0:05:25.640 --> 0:05:29.040 than a year and a half. But I think what 0:05:29.120 --> 0:05:33.560 I felt was this deeper connection to fashion and its 0:05:33.600 --> 0:05:36.679 possibility and its potential purpose in our lives. And that's 0:05:36.680 --> 0:05:41.479 something that in starting my career at Vogue, I really 0:05:42.240 --> 0:05:45.159 learned to live and breathe and embody and appreciate because 0:05:45.600 --> 0:05:47.480 working at Fogue we were working with like the best 0:05:47.520 --> 0:05:50.960 of the best photographers and talent and teams in the world. 0:05:51.200 --> 0:05:53.200 And as they you know, alluded to in the first 0:05:53.279 --> 0:05:55.640 Devil Wars product film, the respect for the art of 0:05:55.680 --> 0:05:58.279 fashion that was my training. So I've always seen it 0:05:58.320 --> 0:06:00.440 as something that's not so much more more than just 0:06:00.480 --> 0:06:01.000 the clothes. 0:06:01.160 --> 0:06:03.560 I love that you said that, because when I started 0:06:03.600 --> 0:06:07.799 working with really brilliant photographers, I started seeing things differently, 0:06:08.000 --> 0:06:13.120 almost everything architecture, product, clothing. There's something about the way 0:06:13.200 --> 0:06:17.839 they view the world that is so artistic and incisive. 0:06:18.080 --> 0:06:21.440 I love what you're saying about that, Lens, because I 0:06:21.440 --> 0:06:24.520 think a lot of people remove themselves from the conversation 0:06:24.839 --> 0:06:28.440 of fashion and they choose to not turn on their 0:06:28.520 --> 0:06:32.320 lens themselves, even they remove themselves from the conversation because 0:06:32.360 --> 0:06:34.839 it might seem complicated or maybe their lives don't need it. 0:06:34.880 --> 0:06:36.960 But everybody has to get dressed in the morning, So 0:06:37.720 --> 0:06:39.560 like it or not, you are using a lens, so 0:06:39.760 --> 0:06:44.040 why not get intentional about it? And in terms of inspiration, yeah, 0:06:44.200 --> 0:06:48.200 like you talking about photographers who inspire you. I think 0:06:48.320 --> 0:06:51.120 the more you can train your brain to be intentional 0:06:51.160 --> 0:06:54.120 about every single thing, the more your antenna picks up 0:06:54.360 --> 0:06:58.159 to receive information and keep growing and evolving and living. 0:06:58.240 --> 0:07:02.360 A life of design is just doing, doing, doing and 0:07:02.400 --> 0:07:03.400 losing the plot. 0:07:03.920 --> 0:07:06.719 So that's how it started in two thousand and six. 0:07:07.360 --> 0:07:11.360 That was twenty years ago, and now you're styling Andy 0:07:11.400 --> 0:07:15.520 Sacks herself the amazing Ann Hathaway. That story alone is 0:07:15.560 --> 0:07:18.320 sort of a plot in a movie. Did you ever 0:07:18.440 --> 0:07:21.320 imagine that you'd be on the other side making the 0:07:21.360 --> 0:07:24.880 star of that film look equally iconic as that character. 0:07:25.240 --> 0:07:27.840 My life is such a series and especially workwise of 0:07:27.960 --> 0:07:31.720 like serendipitous moments that might be too good to be true. 0:07:32.000 --> 0:07:34.760 When I was introduced to Annie seven or eight years 0:07:34.800 --> 0:07:37.320 ago was not lost on me. Like I loved the 0:07:37.400 --> 0:07:40.880 movie Stella War's product, and it affected us who were 0:07:40.920 --> 0:07:43.840 working that way because the layers of it, and one 0:07:43.880 --> 0:07:46.120 of the themes in that movie is this idea of 0:07:46.600 --> 0:07:49.000 not enoughness and not feeling like you're enough to do 0:07:49.080 --> 0:07:51.280 the job, to fulfill the role, to be the person 0:07:51.320 --> 0:07:54.360 to do that responsibility. And I think those themes resonated 0:07:54.400 --> 0:07:57.080 so deeply with me at that time, and it's one 0:07:57.080 --> 0:07:58.960 of the reasons why I wanted to make a book 0:07:59.080 --> 0:08:01.440 later on. It's in the making of art and being 0:08:01.480 --> 0:08:04.000 creative and looking at ourselves and we heal like art 0:08:04.080 --> 0:08:07.200 is a healing mechanism. I know, I keep like going 0:08:07.240 --> 0:08:10.080 on tangents, but it has been so beautiful because in 0:08:10.160 --> 0:08:13.480 working with Annie, there's so many mirrors in both of 0:08:13.520 --> 0:08:18.120 our lives that have been healing and helpful together. And 0:08:18.200 --> 0:08:22.000 I do think the silly synchronicity of that even like 0:08:22.240 --> 0:08:24.200 just the nuances of that time. It was a time 0:08:24.240 --> 0:08:26.160 in two thousand and six when you're like sending facts 0:08:26.240 --> 0:08:28.200 is of shows like back and forth to Paris, of 0:08:28.240 --> 0:08:31.160 the reviews, and it was such a different time. So 0:08:31.520 --> 0:08:33.640 nobody's been able to see the new film yet, I 0:08:33.679 --> 0:08:36.960 haven't even seen it. Working behind the scenes on that Yeah, 0:08:37.040 --> 0:08:39.280 it's not lost on me. It's pinched me. But I 0:08:39.320 --> 0:08:43.000 think living in that pinched me consciousness of the wildness 0:08:43.040 --> 0:08:45.040 of our reality and being grateful for that is a 0:08:45.120 --> 0:08:48.200 key to happiness and living and joy too. So it 0:08:48.320 --> 0:08:52.400 is crazy, cool, hilarious, and it's not lost on me. 0:08:52.520 --> 0:08:55.120 Ever, when you look back at it, does it feel 0:08:55.160 --> 0:09:00.320 like manifestation or destiny or years of quietly building towards 0:09:00.360 --> 0:09:01.360 something all of it? 0:09:01.520 --> 0:09:05.200 I think I must be a crazy manifestor because these 0:09:05.280 --> 0:09:08.320 kinds of like people and synchronicities that have happened over 0:09:08.360 --> 0:09:10.960 the course of my life just seems so magical, and 0:09:11.040 --> 0:09:14.040 it's not without thought or effort. Like I work very 0:09:14.080 --> 0:09:18.280 hard and I put all of myself into every single thing, 0:09:18.559 --> 0:09:21.360 Like my work ethic is intentional, the same as my 0:09:21.800 --> 0:09:24.000 relationship with my children and how I want them to 0:09:24.040 --> 0:09:28.000 grow up to be. But I believe manifestation that comes 0:09:28.040 --> 0:09:31.679 from living consciously in a place of intention right and 0:09:31.760 --> 0:09:34.760 taking the actions that align with that intention. And so 0:09:34.880 --> 0:09:38.280 whether that's prepping for a press chur or raising humans 0:09:38.280 --> 0:09:40.719 that you want to be considerate in this world, it 0:09:40.760 --> 0:09:43.880 all comes down to living in integrity and taking responsibility 0:09:43.920 --> 0:09:45.880 for your choices and how you treat other people, and 0:09:46.320 --> 0:09:50.359 the words you say to yourself, how you dress obviously, 0:09:50.559 --> 0:09:53.840 because you know every single thing kind of could be 0:09:53.840 --> 0:09:56.200 a ceremony when you get intentional about it. That's why 0:09:56.240 --> 0:09:59.000 it was so important to me to start a movement 0:09:59.040 --> 0:10:02.520 that gave women and back the means to embody the 0:10:02.600 --> 0:10:05.760 version of themselves that we sometimes lose in the doing 0:10:05.880 --> 0:10:07.760 and in the business of life. 0:10:07.920 --> 0:10:11.079 Well, when I looked back at your career thus far, 0:10:11.200 --> 0:10:13.400 one of the things I found so interesting was that 0:10:13.760 --> 0:10:17.360 so many of your clients are attached to these iconic 0:10:17.640 --> 0:10:23.199 fashion films or fashion moments. So Sarah, Jessica Parker, Carrie Washington, 0:10:23.480 --> 0:10:27.200 of course, Anne Hathaway now Selena Gomez. But you're the 0:10:27.240 --> 0:10:30.640 one that's helping them live up to that image that 0:10:30.760 --> 0:10:33.960 we all have in our minds. Is there added pressure 0:10:34.160 --> 0:10:38.040 when people already have this fantasy of who that person 0:10:38.120 --> 0:10:38.920 is supposed to be. 0:10:39.440 --> 0:10:41.959 Absolutely, But I would also say I would always put 0:10:42.000 --> 0:10:45.000 that pressure on myself too, because I have such high 0:10:45.240 --> 0:10:48.960 standards and the honor to work with people that you 0:10:49.040 --> 0:10:50.720 look up to, that I look up to, that so 0:10:50.760 --> 0:10:53.199 many people look up to. Got to keep the bar 0:10:53.320 --> 0:10:56.960 high in terms of the pressure of course since there 0:10:57.000 --> 0:11:00.160 when there's so many eyes, but I try to use it. 0:11:00.240 --> 0:11:03.720 It's like you want to alchemize it into the product, 0:11:03.920 --> 0:11:06.439 into the moment. So that's always a part of it. 0:11:07.000 --> 0:11:09.959 When did you realize that you weren't just dressing someone 0:11:10.120 --> 0:11:13.280 that you were like helping shape how culture sees them. 0:11:13.559 --> 0:11:16.720 I feel like probably in the past ten years. I 0:11:16.760 --> 0:11:19.679 think I always loved what I was doing, and I 0:11:19.760 --> 0:11:23.280 loved clothes and I loved lighting people up. I think 0:11:23.360 --> 0:11:25.679 like even at the beginning, working with someone like Carrie 0:11:25.679 --> 0:11:28.280 and watching the cultural response to that and the zeit 0:11:28.360 --> 0:11:31.520 guys shift around her and people really respond to like 0:11:32.240 --> 0:11:34.960 this iconic character she was putting out there and what 0:11:35.000 --> 0:11:39.360 that represented and honoring that moment like that definitely felt 0:11:39.640 --> 0:11:42.280 more than just about clothes. And that was at the beginning, 0:11:42.440 --> 0:11:47.320 like fifteen sixteen years ago. Definitely along the way, you know, 0:11:47.400 --> 0:11:50.560 with Sarah Jessica, there were some really big moments and 0:11:50.600 --> 0:11:53.760 I had looked up to her so much from when 0:11:53.800 --> 0:11:55.880 I first moved to New York City. She was like 0:11:56.520 --> 0:11:59.760 fashion icon and you know very much still is so 0:12:00.360 --> 0:12:03.360 like even meeting her for the first time and working 0:12:03.480 --> 0:12:06.920 with her, that metanis that that happened was never lost 0:12:06.920 --> 0:12:08.920 on me either. And there was a moment with her 0:12:08.960 --> 0:12:11.719 too where we did a commercial like before they did 0:12:11.720 --> 0:12:13.360 and just like that when you know, Sex and the 0:12:13.400 --> 0:12:16.280 City was still in the past and I had to 0:12:16.360 --> 0:12:20.240 help costume her as that character and it was like, 0:12:20.840 --> 0:12:25.000 this is crazy, it's too wild to be true. And certainly, yeah, 0:12:25.040 --> 0:12:28.520 the eyeballs on a Selena and Annie, there's a lot 0:12:28.559 --> 0:12:30.800 And so you could just take that in and let 0:12:30.840 --> 0:12:33.280 the pressure overwhelm you, that wouldn't serve the work. So 0:12:33.360 --> 0:12:35.240 it's okay to be conscious of it, but you have 0:12:35.280 --> 0:12:38.120 to focus on the invention, which ultimately to me is 0:12:38.160 --> 0:12:41.959 always rising up to the moment and helping somebody embody 0:12:42.000 --> 0:12:44.480 their best self and really, you know, help tell the 0:12:44.520 --> 0:12:46.319 story of who they want to be with the world. 0:12:46.360 --> 0:12:49.760 Which the reason why my lens of fashion it's for 0:12:49.840 --> 0:12:53.000 everybody is because I don't think like the movie stars 0:12:53.040 --> 0:12:54.680 are separate than us. I think we look up to 0:12:54.720 --> 0:12:56.880 movie stars because we see in them something we want 0:12:56.880 --> 0:13:00.440 for ourselves, something we want to embody. So that's how 0:13:00.920 --> 0:13:03.440 I got to this place of designing a method centered 0:13:03.440 --> 0:13:07.400 around how do you want to feel whether you're at 0:13:07.400 --> 0:13:10.320 a movie premiere in front of two hundred million people 0:13:10.840 --> 0:13:12.840 or just you and your closet in the mirror in 0:13:12.840 --> 0:13:14.480 the morning. How do you want to feel? What do 0:13:14.520 --> 0:13:15.880 you want your life to look like? What do you 0:13:15.880 --> 0:13:18.400 want it to feel like? How can your choices, starting 0:13:18.440 --> 0:13:20.959 with what you wear and the ritual that you give 0:13:21.000 --> 0:13:23.560 yourself to get started. How does that serve you and 0:13:23.600 --> 0:13:24.880 then help you better serve others. 0:13:25.080 --> 0:13:28.359 Have you ever gotten a Miranda priestly look of disapproval 0:13:28.440 --> 0:13:29.120 from a client? 0:13:29.520 --> 0:13:32.439 Of course, but you know what, I love criticism. That 0:13:32.559 --> 0:13:34.160 was one of the first lessons I learned at Vogue. 0:13:34.200 --> 0:13:36.719 You could like be a martyr and take everything personally 0:13:36.800 --> 0:13:40.000 and all like poor me, they didn't like this dress, 0:13:40.080 --> 0:13:43.600 and like, you can't control everything's received. This is one 0:13:43.640 --> 0:13:46.400 of the reasons why I love mel Robbins. You got 0:13:46.440 --> 0:13:49.960 to use the criticism, and that's the alchymization part too. 0:13:50.280 --> 0:13:52.600 Use it, understand it, let it become a part of 0:13:52.640 --> 0:13:57.080 your process. There's been so many wonderful criticisms I've heard from, 0:13:57.080 --> 0:13:59.960 whether it's clients or teams, that have been so healthy, 0:14:00.080 --> 0:14:03.920 full and you know, productive and making it better, making 0:14:03.920 --> 0:14:06.400 the work better, making the product better, making the person 0:14:06.440 --> 0:14:10.200 feel better. So don't use criticism to feel bad about yourself, 0:14:10.280 --> 0:14:12.320 channel it and what doesn't work like brush it off 0:14:12.400 --> 0:14:13.040 or solters. 0:14:13.360 --> 0:14:16.880 I always try and take it critically, not personally or 0:14:16.960 --> 0:14:18.479 seriously and not personally. 0:14:18.720 --> 0:14:22.440 Yeah, you can try, and I will sing sometimes sure, 0:14:22.640 --> 0:14:25.240 Like we're all human and I definitely live with an open, 0:14:25.280 --> 0:14:27.720 big heart and you can be aware of that. But 0:14:27.920 --> 0:14:30.520 like you also have to learn to like keep changing, 0:14:30.600 --> 0:14:31.720 keep it all and keep moving. 0:14:32.120 --> 0:14:35.760 So curious about your theory and the story you're telling 0:14:36.000 --> 0:14:39.360 when you dress people for premiers, because I feel like 0:14:39.400 --> 0:14:46.800 the Barbie movie premiere Saga changed things so dramatically. I 0:14:46.840 --> 0:14:49.720 see celebrities like dressing to the theme of the film. 0:14:49.960 --> 0:14:53.640 But it's like, in this elevated, kitchy way, what is that. 0:14:53.560 --> 0:14:57.000 Called well method dressing? That would be like dressing like 0:14:57.040 --> 0:15:00.280 the theme of the movie. That's certainly a thing. I 0:15:00.400 --> 0:15:03.600 was talking with Mickayla, who styles Merrill, and she was 0:15:03.600 --> 0:15:05.560 saying she calls it like for this film, she's calling 0:15:05.600 --> 0:15:07.880 it meta dressing because there's so many layers to like 0:15:07.920 --> 0:15:09.640 that then and now for both of us. She was 0:15:09.680 --> 0:15:13.240 an Internet folk, so I love a world of telling stories, 0:15:13.280 --> 0:15:15.640 so I definitely love to use elements of that but 0:15:16.040 --> 0:15:18.920 it's always collaborative. I don't mean to sound so dorky 0:15:18.960 --> 0:15:21.080 about it, but it's rooted in service. I want people 0:15:21.120 --> 0:15:23.120 I work with to shine and to feel great, and 0:15:23.160 --> 0:15:25.920 then you like weave all the elements of storytelling into it, 0:15:25.960 --> 0:15:27.920 but a method, a little bit of referential. 0:15:28.160 --> 0:15:31.320 Part of me feels like because you were an actor yourself, 0:15:32.040 --> 0:15:36.920 that you deeply understand the roles that they're stepping into. 0:15:37.280 --> 0:15:37.560 I do. 0:15:38.360 --> 0:15:41.320 The reason I loved acting is I just think one 0:15:41.360 --> 0:15:44.680 of the fundamental best parts of being alive is the 0:15:44.800 --> 0:15:48.040 embodiment and like when you can fully feel, as Joseph 0:15:48.120 --> 0:15:51.360 Campbell says, the rapture of being alive, you know, so 0:15:52.200 --> 0:15:56.080 helping people to do that is just so much fun. 0:15:56.120 --> 0:15:58.320 And when things don't land or they don't work as 0:15:58.400 --> 0:16:00.240 we want to, I feel that too. 0:16:00.320 --> 0:16:02.200 But I was reading that even when you were acting, 0:16:02.240 --> 0:16:04.600 it was about clothing for you, Like do you remember 0:16:04.720 --> 0:16:06.840 the first time that you fell in love with a 0:16:06.840 --> 0:16:07.560 piece of clothing? 0:16:07.880 --> 0:16:09.880 I mean, there are so many visceral moments of like 0:16:09.920 --> 0:16:12.960 my mom and my grandma. My mom was a lawyer, 0:16:13.200 --> 0:16:15.840 Like she had this ceremony of getting dressed every day 0:16:15.880 --> 0:16:20.280 and like always very elegant and my grandmother too, just 0:16:20.360 --> 0:16:23.440 really intentional about style as a little girl, like it 0:16:23.520 --> 0:16:25.520 was important even to my mom to dress us a 0:16:25.520 --> 0:16:28.120 certain way and especially for like church on Sundays, and 0:16:28.720 --> 0:16:31.440 in terms of like fashion, definitely, when I moved to 0:16:31.440 --> 0:16:34.480 New York to go to NYU, I got into some 0:16:34.600 --> 0:16:36.800 vintage shopping. One of the first things I bought at 0:16:36.840 --> 0:16:39.840 the vintage shop down from NYU was this, because it's 0:16:39.840 --> 0:16:42.160 almost famous. I was like a couple of years out then, 0:16:42.480 --> 0:16:44.400 and I got like a Penny Lane jacket that I. 0:16:44.360 --> 0:16:45.160 Was obsessed with. 0:16:45.400 --> 0:16:46.960 And I also bought a lot of two too, is 0:16:47.000 --> 0:16:50.120 that like Geminola, And thought I was SJP And I 0:16:50.240 --> 0:16:53.600 was very good at thrifting, like you know, warm heels 0:16:53.640 --> 0:16:57.120 and step then two and I really made every weekend 0:16:57.200 --> 0:17:00.000 like let's tear up. I thought living in New York 0:17:00.240 --> 0:17:02.920 was extremely cool and I wanted to dress the part. 0:17:03.080 --> 0:17:05.800 I love that you mentioned your mom and your grandmother 0:17:05.880 --> 0:17:08.399 because I loved reading about them in your book. You 0:17:08.440 --> 0:17:11.239 said your mom was a lawyer and you grew up 0:17:11.359 --> 0:17:13.800 loving watching her get ready. 0:17:14.000 --> 0:17:16.040 I loved watching her get ready. I loved watching her 0:17:16.040 --> 0:17:17.920 get ready for work. I loved watching her get ready 0:17:17.960 --> 0:17:20.359 for dinner. I loved watching her come home and change 0:17:20.400 --> 0:17:22.440 and take a bath, and like the ceremony of that. 0:17:22.920 --> 0:17:26.600 I was witnessing this attention to detail and the ritual 0:17:26.640 --> 0:17:29.880 of both getting dressed and undressed. And it's something too 0:17:29.960 --> 0:17:31.840 like people forget when they get home. That's a whole 0:17:31.840 --> 0:17:34.600 other demarcation of your day, and that can be a ceremony. 0:17:34.760 --> 0:17:37.200 Even now, if I have a crazy day at work, 0:17:37.520 --> 0:17:40.119 I always change when I get home, take off the jewelry, 0:17:40.480 --> 0:17:43.159 take a moment, just that presence with yourself, even for 0:17:43.240 --> 0:17:46.359 like one minute, it honors well you have been embodying 0:17:46.440 --> 0:17:48.199 during the day. How do you need to feel when 0:17:48.240 --> 0:17:50.960 you get home? What's the shift? And the more you 0:17:51.000 --> 0:17:53.600 can be conscious of all these shifts and all these 0:17:53.640 --> 0:17:55.359 needs all the time, I think, the more of a 0:17:55.400 --> 0:17:59.200 sense of calm and gratitude you'll find even when things 0:17:59.200 --> 0:18:01.080 feel chaos like or overwhelming. 0:18:12.600 --> 0:18:15.560 I was reading that people were telling you at a 0:18:15.600 --> 0:18:18.959 young age that you needed to be in fashion, truly 0:18:19.040 --> 0:18:22.840 aerin if I showed you my childhood photos, nobody would 0:18:22.880 --> 0:18:25.440 be saying that about me. I was wearing like tied 0:18:25.520 --> 0:18:32.359 ie shirts and cowboy boots and mismatched absolutely everything. What 0:18:32.440 --> 0:18:36.000 do you think you were doing that made people recognize 0:18:36.119 --> 0:18:38.280 that in you from such a young age. 0:18:38.440 --> 0:18:40.600 I don't know if it was my style per se, 0:18:40.640 --> 0:18:44.000 although I was always like experimenting. I know, I've always 0:18:44.080 --> 0:18:47.360 liked things just so, and I'm not OCD, but it's 0:18:47.400 --> 0:18:50.880 more like, I think I'm just very feminine, like even 0:18:50.920 --> 0:18:53.679 thinking in high school, I was always doing things slightly different. 0:18:53.680 --> 0:18:56.720 I wasn't afraid of doing things outside of box. But 0:18:57.080 --> 0:18:59.280 I think it was just like this. You could call 0:18:59.320 --> 0:19:01.040 it girly, but I think it's more of like this 0:19:01.520 --> 0:19:05.080 elevated way of looking at things and seeing things or 0:19:05.119 --> 0:19:07.120 wanting them to be in any case, even if they 0:19:07.119 --> 0:19:07.879 weren't so. 0:19:08.160 --> 0:19:10.840 Anne Hathaway wrote the forward of your book, and she 0:19:10.960 --> 0:19:14.560 wrote that you both share grandmother energy. I was laughing 0:19:14.600 --> 0:19:17.359 because I too feel I have grandmother energy, but I 0:19:17.400 --> 0:19:19.639 need to double check and make sure that it's the 0:19:19.680 --> 0:19:22.000 same grandmother energy as she's talking about. 0:19:22.119 --> 0:19:24.560 Oh my god, that's so. I feel like I was 0:19:24.600 --> 0:19:26.960 born a thousand year adults. And what's so funny about 0:19:26.960 --> 0:19:29.679 that is my oldest daughter, Matilda is ten, she almost eleven. 0:19:29.840 --> 0:19:32.040 When I looked at her when she was born, she 0:19:32.200 --> 0:19:34.640 had that too. It was like I saw it from 0:19:34.640 --> 0:19:36.280 the second and a friend of mine had told me, 0:19:36.320 --> 0:19:38.440 when you have your baby, like to take a moment 0:19:38.560 --> 0:19:40.200 just to like look at them in the eyes, because 0:19:40.240 --> 0:19:43.560 you see their essence, you see their soul. And I 0:19:43.640 --> 0:19:45.800 recognize that in her, and it's just so out of 0:19:45.840 --> 0:19:49.879 this world. Yeah, the grandmother energy, it's many things at once. 0:19:50.160 --> 0:19:53.640 I think like this sense of time, you know, certainly, 0:19:53.760 --> 0:19:56.520 and not wanting to lose time or waste time. I 0:19:56.560 --> 0:20:00.360 think this sense of value for like the ground durer 0:20:00.520 --> 0:20:02.800 of things. There's so many layers to it. We can 0:20:02.840 --> 0:20:05.240 unpack this more. But that was very wise of her. 0:20:05.320 --> 0:20:06.360 We're very Sopotico. 0:20:06.560 --> 0:20:09.280