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Speaker 1: Hey, you welcome to Weird House Cinema. Rewind. This is

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Speaker 1: Rob Lamb. Today we are reairing our episode that originally

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Speaker 1: published eleven one, twenty twenty four. It is our episode

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Speaker 1: on John Carpenter's nineteen eighty seven film Prince of Darkness.

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Speaker 1: This one is a lot of fun. Love this movie.

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Speaker 1: Let's jump right in.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: Hey, welcome to Weird House Cinema. This is Rob Lamb.

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Speaker 3: And this is Joe McCormick. And hey, if everything is

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Speaker 3: going according to plan, this should have published the moment

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Speaker 3: after midnight on the night of Halloween. So so happy Halloween, everybody.

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Speaker 3: We are bringing you horror accordingly. Today we're going to

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Speaker 3: be talking about the nineteen eighty seven John Carpenter horror

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Speaker 3: film Prince of Darkness. And somehow I think this is

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Speaker 3: our first John Carpenter movie.

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Speaker 1: It is, And we did talk about the Carpenter produced

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Speaker 1: and Carpenter scored Halloween three a while back, but this

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Speaker 1: is the very first time we're actually going to be

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Speaker 1: talking about a John Carpenter directed film. And we managed

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Speaker 1: to wait until our one hundred and eightieth Weird House

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Speaker 1: cinema selection to do this, so some of you might

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Speaker 1: find that a little surprising. I kind of find it

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Speaker 1: a little surprising, I guess in retrospect, because obviously you

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Speaker 1: and I are both big John Carpenter fans. Some of

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Speaker 1: his films are among our favorites, and we keep talking

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Speaker 1: about them on the show. Anytime there's a John Carpenter

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Speaker 1: connection in a movie or in a core episode of

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Speaker 1: Stuff to Blow Your Mind, we'll talk about it. Lord knows,

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Speaker 1: we'll talk about it. Why did it take us so long, though,

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Speaker 1: you know, I despite the fact that obviously we really

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Speaker 1: like John Carpenter films, and we also have listeners writing

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Speaker 1: and suggesting John Carpenter films a lot. I'll have to

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Speaker 1: get your thoughts on this, Joe. But for my own part,

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Speaker 1: I feel like I've always kind of been reluctant to

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Speaker 1: tackle one of the all time great favorite John Carpenter films,

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Speaker 1: you know, something like The Thing or Big Trouble in

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Speaker 1: Little China, because they're just so well known, they're beloved

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Speaker 1: and in some respects kind of perfect in their own way.

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Speaker 1: And on the other hand, I've been perhaps more tempted

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Speaker 1: to cover something like Ghosts of Mars one of his

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Speaker 1: late period pictures, but it also felt wrong for our

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Speaker 1: first Carpenter selection to be one of his less well

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Speaker 1: received movies. So I think nineteen eighty seven's Prince of

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Speaker 1: Darkness is perhaps the perfect pick. It's Carpenter during his

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Speaker 1: heyday and also Carpenter at peak creative control. It's also

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Speaker 1: one of his truly weirdest films, I think, and it

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Speaker 1: has a strong cult following.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, this is a Carpenter sleeper the sleeper awakens. In fact,

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Speaker 3: even some people who are fans probably haven't seen this one.

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Speaker 3: It took me a long time after you know, I

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Speaker 3: first started watching Halloween, An Escape from New York and

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Speaker 3: all the big ones everybody sees first to get around

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Speaker 3: to Prince of Darkness, and when I did, I was

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Speaker 3: quite wowed by it. It remains very much in the

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Speaker 3: top tier of horror movies for me, especially in you know.

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Speaker 3: It's a great example of a concept we've talked about

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Speaker 3: on the show that I think maybe applies more to

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Speaker 3: John Carpenter films than to anything else, and that is

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Speaker 3: a rub the fur movie. Prince of Darkness is a

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Speaker 3: rub the fur movie. It is about a textural experience

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Speaker 3: an experience of sights and sounds that conjures a mood.

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Speaker 3: This movie is absolutely amazing at creating a feeling and

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Speaker 3: a mood through its use of music, through its use

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Speaker 3: of imagery, through its use of interesting ideas. And I

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Speaker 3: really like the way that it throws different themes together.

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Speaker 3: So one of the things that I think must have

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Speaker 3: been behind John Carpenter's like creative process for Prince of

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Speaker 3: Darkness is he must have read like a pop physics

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Speaker 3: book or like watched a documentary about quantum mechanics, Because

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Speaker 3: this movie is full of ideas about both science and religion.

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Speaker 3: He was trying to do some kind of sort of

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Speaker 3: sort of Christian infused but also sort of maybe Lovecraftian

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Speaker 3: or Eldrich demonic awakening idea, but then also mixing that

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Speaker 3: with ideas about quantum weirdness, some stuff about astronomy. He's

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Speaker 3: clearly like trying to put a bunch of different kinds

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Speaker 3: of themes that are usually kept separate into the blender.

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Speaker 3: And that's an impulse I really like. And I think

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Speaker 3: if you don't look too close at the way he

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Speaker 3: uses the scientific ideas, it really works if you start

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Speaker 3: if you actually know what he's talking about and start like,

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Speaker 3: you know, reading between the lines too much kind of

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Speaker 3: falls apart. But if you just lean back, you kind

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Speaker 3: of you kind of tune out just a little bit

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Speaker 3: during the scientific parts. I think it is super nice.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I mean this this is ultimately a pretty

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Speaker 1: ambitious film, right, I mean, it's from a number of standpoints.

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Speaker 1: It's like it was a three million dollar picture, it

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Speaker 1: was an independent picture coming off of a lot of

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Speaker 1: studio work for Carpenter, and it attempts to weave in

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Speaker 1: all of these quantum physics and quantum mechanics ideas that

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Speaker 1: the Carpenter, you know, says that he'd been reading a

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Speaker 1: lot of this kind of thing. He'd read several books

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Speaker 1: about quantum mechanics, and that it had kind of like

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Speaker 1: a profound impact on him. Like he described it as

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Speaker 1: kind of like a shift in worldview based on what

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Speaker 1: he was reading. So you have that going on, and

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Speaker 1: then at the same time, this is something that really

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Speaker 1: came out when I was listening to the the commentary

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Speaker 1: track for this film, which I'll discuss more about that

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Speaker 1: in a bit. But he's talking with one of the

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Speaker 1: actors in the picture, Peter Jason, and it's neat because Jason,

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Speaker 1: of course is coming at it with a very actor's

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Speaker 1: standpoint when it comes to the questions, he's asking Carpenter

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Speaker 1: about the production and the process, and Carpenter of course

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Speaker 1: is approaching it from the view of the director and

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Speaker 1: the writer, but especially from the standpoint of the director.

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Speaker 1: And I think one detail that kind of from the

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Speaker 1: commentary track that kind of highlights these different views is

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Speaker 1: when they're talking about the scenes where they're first going

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Speaker 1: down into the basement. We'll get to the basement and

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Speaker 1: all this as you know, this sort of ruinous basement

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Speaker 1: that has lit by like hundreds of candles, and you know,

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Speaker 1: they're kind of having fun with the picture, riffing almost

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Speaker 1: a certain extent, and Jason's like, who who let all

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Speaker 1: these candles? And you know, Carpenter's like, well, you know,

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Speaker 1: this is just this is just great lighting. You know,

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Speaker 1: this just it just looks really cool, you know, And

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Speaker 1: I think that gets to the rub the fur aspect

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Speaker 1: of the picture. And then rub the fur, you know,

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Speaker 1: you can talk about again, you can definitely think about

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Speaker 1: it in terms of just sights and sounds, but it's

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Speaker 1: also there in the ideas, you know, in the way

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Speaker 1: ideas are sprinkled through it. And it's not only about

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Speaker 1: like what is given to you, but oh also what's

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Speaker 1: not given to you. There are a number of scenes

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Speaker 1: in this picture where we get audio free clips of

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Speaker 1: characters clearly discussing the implications of whatever is going on.

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Speaker 1: So we don't even have all the details. We just

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Speaker 1: have various nuggets of quantum physics and theology thrown at us.

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Speaker 1: And you know, again, yeah, if you lean back into

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Speaker 1: the chair and you let them wash over you, it's

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Speaker 1: a pretty great experience.

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Speaker 3: I agree. I think that's exactly right, and I would

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Speaker 3: phrase it this way. I think the use of both

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Speaker 3: science and religion, the scientific and religious themes in the

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Speaker 3: movie is primarily esthetic. It is not primarily about how

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Speaker 3: either one actually works or what is actually true. It's

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Speaker 3: to create an aesthetic effect. And that's not a bad thing.

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Speaker 3: I mean, like, I think it is used quite well

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Speaker 3: as another type of texture. It's an idea texture, a

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Speaker 3: theme texture that fits in with the sights and sounds

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Speaker 3: and ultimately the whole it's all adding up to a feeling,

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Speaker 3: a mood, and it is a powerful, powerful mood.

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Speaker 1: Well, I'll tell you what I have an elevator pitch

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Speaker 1: for this movie, and it is the following The Devil's

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Speaker 1: in the details and also in a big cylinder of

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Speaker 1: green liquid.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, it's an idea that works better in

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Speaker 3: practice than it does in theory. If you were to

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Speaker 3: actually explain the concept here that, yeah, Satan is physically

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Speaker 3: real and he is a volume of green liquid inside

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Speaker 3: a jar. I don't know. That just doesn't sound as

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Speaker 3: effective as the movie actually is.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I think in one of our most recent episodes

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Speaker 1: of Weird House, or maybe it was a core episode

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Speaker 1: I mentioned in Passing like movies that talk about evil

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Speaker 1: as an actual physical presence or substance, and this movie

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Speaker 1: kind of gets into that territory, but also ultimately I

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Speaker 1: think makes it work within the context of the film

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Speaker 1: in ways that it maybe doesn't in others.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, we were talking about this in the House of

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Speaker 3: Ushare episode.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, Well, let's go ahead and listen to

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Speaker 1: a little bit of trailer audio here, which is we're

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Speaker 1: not gonna listen to the whole trailer, but hopefully we'll

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Speaker 1: get just a little splash of some of the dialogue

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Speaker 1: from it and a little taste of that excellent John

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Speaker 1: Carpenter Alan Howarth score that we're gonna be talking about.

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Speaker 1: All right, So hey, if you want to go see

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Speaker 1: Prince of Darkness before we proceed here. It is widely available.

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Speaker 1: You can stream it, you can rent it, you can

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Speaker 1: buy it physically. I watched it on the Shout Factory

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Speaker 1: Blu ray, which is pretty great, complete with three bonus

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Speaker 1: interviews and a full audio commentary track from Carpenter and

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Speaker 1: actor Peter Jason, who has a minor part here but

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Speaker 1: is a friend and frequent Carpenter cast member. This was

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Speaker 1: his first Carpenter film. Carpenter's audio commentaries with folks are

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Speaker 1: always entertaining and insightful. This one's no exception. I actually

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Speaker 1: I generally say I don't have time for audio commentaries

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Speaker 1: on movies anymore, and that's mostly true. And yet somehow

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Speaker 1: I ended up watching this movie all the way through,

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Speaker 1: and then watching half of it again with the commentary track.

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Speaker 3: It's just that good. I remember listening to Way Carpenter

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Speaker 3: and Jamie Lee Curtis commentary track somewhere that was adorable.

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Speaker 3: It was great.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah I haven't. I haven't done that one. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: they're they're generally very well regarded. You know, it's just

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Speaker 1: very cool to hear Carpenter, you know, shoot the ball

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Speaker 1: with people that clearly he you know, pre picks knowing

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Speaker 1: that this is somebody that he has a rapport with

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Speaker 1: and can chat with about the film.

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Speaker 3: I think Peter Jason does he play the He's like

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Speaker 3: a chemistry professor in this movie who spends a significant

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Speaker 3: amount of time walking around doing like kazoo noises with

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Speaker 3: his mouth. Yes, yeah, that's the one, Peter, I've got

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Speaker 3: the perfect part for you. All right, Well, let's let's

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Speaker 3: talk about the folks involved here, starting of course with

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Speaker 3: John Carpenter. He directed it. He wrote it under a pseudonym,

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Speaker 3: but it's pretty obvious that you know, everyone knows this

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Speaker 3: is a On Carpenter scripted film. Did he call himself

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Speaker 3: Martin quator Mass.

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Speaker 1: Yes, yes, a reference to the films that he was

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Speaker 1: inspired by. That also, you know, have some direct inspiration

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Speaker 1: on the plot of this picture, you know, ancient evil

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Speaker 1: buried beneath the ground, that sort of thing. Nice And

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Speaker 1: of course yes see he did the score as well.

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Speaker 1: Born nineteen forty eight, living legend director of some of

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Speaker 1: the most iconic horror and sci fi films. Of the

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Speaker 1: late seventies and the entire nineteen eighties, who also played

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Speaker 1: a very key role in the birth of an entire dark,

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Speaker 1: ambient synth wave sound like There's just you know, there

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Speaker 1: are other important influences on that kind of sound out

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Speaker 1: there from horror and sci fi soundtrack, but John Carpenter

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Speaker 1: is a very important part of that equation.

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Speaker 3: I had some plans to talk about this later, but

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Speaker 3: I might as well mention it now. I think that

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Speaker 3: John Carpenter not only creates great scores electronic scores for

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Speaker 3: his own movie. I think in many cases the movie

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Speaker 3: is only as effective as it is with his score.

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Speaker 3: Not to take away from the rest of the movie.

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Speaker 3: I mean, like, you know, he's got a great sense

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Speaker 3: of where to put the camera. You know, he's got

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Speaker 3: a good photographic style, and I like the stories he

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Speaker 3: writes and all that. So other filmmaking elements are strong

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Speaker 3: as well, But it is the score he creates for

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Speaker 3: the film that locks it all into place, that creates

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Speaker 3: the feeling that you associate with the movie. Try to

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Speaker 3: imagine Halloween without the John Carpenter score just sub in

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Speaker 3: what you would imagine for some other generic horror movie score.

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Speaker 3: It would still be, I think, a pretty good movie,

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Speaker 3: but it would not be anything like what it is.

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Speaker 3: And I think the same is true for all of

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Speaker 3: the movies that Carpenter scores himself. It's definitely the case here.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, So we really don't have to tell most

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Speaker 1: of you who John Carpenter is. You know, he's responsible

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Speaker 1: for such iconic films as seventy eight, Halloween, eighty on's

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Speaker 1: Escape from Me Go, eighty two is The Thing, eighty

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Speaker 1: six is, Big Trouble in Little China in nineteen ninety

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Speaker 1: four is in the Mouth of Madness, just to name

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Speaker 1: a few. He came out of the USC School of

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Speaker 1: Cinematic Arts in the late sixties and ultimately skyrocketed with

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Speaker 1: the success of Halloween. This film, eighty seven's Prince of

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Speaker 1: Darkness is notable for being his first independent film after

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Speaker 1: a string of big studio commercial movies, coming immediately on

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Speaker 1: the heels of the box office disappointment of Big Trouble

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Speaker 1: in Little China, which of course has gone on to

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Speaker 1: become a much loved cult classic, but at the time

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Speaker 1: it did not succeed.

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Speaker 3: I think a lot of people didn't get it when

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Speaker 3: it came out. It was only kind of looking back

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Speaker 3: that people started to realize the genius.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so he's coming off of that. Carpenter has said

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Speaker 1: in interviews that he was worn out by the big

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Speaker 1: studio process and really wanted to make a lower budget

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Speaker 1: film that was completely on his own terms. And that's

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Speaker 1: what Prince of Darkness is. It's a weird, doomy contemplation

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Speaker 1: on religion and quantum mechanics, which Carpenter, you know, always

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Speaker 1: a science nerd, had been reading about leading up to

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Speaker 1: this production. And it's also a film that may comment

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Speaker 1: to some degree, maybe even almost subconsciously or subliminally on

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Speaker 1: the on his desire to break free from the tyrannical

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Speaker 1: order of big studio productions, you know, like you can

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Speaker 1: you can maybe pick up on a little sort of

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Speaker 1: like post studio angst in the in the way that

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Speaker 1: he's formulating things.

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Speaker 3: Oh, there is a great part where they're discussing the

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Speaker 3: secrets kept by the Brotherhood of Sleep and Donald Pleasant

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Speaker 3: starts talking about how, you know, we we fed the

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Speaker 3: people what we thought they wanted a lie. It was

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Speaker 3: all a lie. I want to tell them the truth now.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, so it's it's in a way, this movie's

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Speaker 1: kind of. It has a meanness and you know, also

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Speaker 1: kind of a graphicness that you don't see in a

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Speaker 1: lot of other Carpenter films. I mean not to say, yeah,

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Speaker 1: you can look at the Thing and it's grotesque, but

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Speaker 1: this movie is also pretty violent and grotesque in its

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Speaker 1: own way. It's often situated with the Thing and in

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Speaker 1: the mouth of madness as being part of his Apocalypse trilogy. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's one of the bloodier ones. It also is clearly

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Speaker 1: a siege film, which he's quick to point out. And

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Speaker 1: it has a Howard Hawksian ensemble cast featuring several actors

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Speaker 1: that Carpenter handpicked to work with. Again, you know, mostly

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Speaker 1: people he liked working with and was excited to have

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Speaker 1: on a production like this. It made a reported fourteen

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Speaker 1: point two million off of a budget of three million,

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Speaker 1: and so he followed it up with They Live, which

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Speaker 1: was nearly identical in terms of creative control, budget and

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Speaker 1: box office. Carpenter's last full length director oorial effort was

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Speaker 1: twenty tens The Ward, but he's remained active, of course

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Speaker 1: as a composer, often working with his son Cody.

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Speaker 3: Now, did you say in one of the commentaries you

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Speaker 3: were listening to that, Carpenter admitted to his obsession with

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Speaker 3: video games because I don't remember where I came across this,

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Speaker 3: but I generally had it in my head that is

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Speaker 3: like obsessed with playing like I don't know, NBA JAM,

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Speaker 3: like like sports, video games for the PlayStation and stuff.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I mean numerous interviews will bring up video games.

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Speaker 1: And even in this commentary track, which was I think,

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Speaker 1: you know, over a decade ago that it was recorded,

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Speaker 1: you know, he's mostly like, yeah, I'm not as tuned

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Speaker 1: into the you know what people, you know, what's going

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Speaker 1: on with horror movies these days, and mostly just do

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Speaker 1: sports and video games. And I've seen other interviews where

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Speaker 1: people ask him with what he's playing, and there's always

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Speaker 1: some sort of like shooter sports game I guess that

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Speaker 1: he's into. So, you know, you know, more power to him.

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Speaker 1: He's a big gamer.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, fair enough, John. You know, you made a bunch

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Speaker 3: of good ones. You don't have to keep up with

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Speaker 3: what's what's great this year. Yeah, play video games.

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Speaker 1: I should also point out Carpenter points to several influences

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Speaker 1: on the plot of this picture, one of them being

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Speaker 1: Gregory Benford's novel Timescape from nineteen eighty. That's a I

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Speaker 1: haven't read it, but apparent it's a novel that involves

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Speaker 1: messages from the future sent via hypothetical faster than lie

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Speaker 1: Tachyon particles.

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Speaker 3: Oh, this ties into one of my favorite things in

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Speaker 3: the movie, The Dreams and from the Future. I guess

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Speaker 3: we'll get into that in the plot section. But I

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Speaker 3: love that convention here and the way it's realized as

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Speaker 3: a kind of staticky like you know, third generation VHS

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Speaker 3: copy video message is so good.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Now, again, this is a fairly expansive ensemble cast,

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Speaker 1: and we can't cover everyone here or do go into

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Speaker 1: great detail, so I'm probably gonna have to be a

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Speaker 1: little briefer than usual. All right, First of all, top billing,

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Speaker 1: we have Donald Pleasants playing an unnamed priest. He's just

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Speaker 1: credited as priest.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I was trying to so some sources I found

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Speaker 3: online called him. I think father Loomis. I don't think

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Speaker 3: that name is ever said in the movie, and I

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Speaker 3: don't see that in anything official. That might just be

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Speaker 3: something the Internet made up.

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Speaker 1: He's he is very Loomis esque, Like it's impossible not

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Speaker 1: to compare this role as a troubled priest fighting against

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Speaker 1: evil to the other major role in she played a

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Speaker 1: troubled priest fighting against evil as Loomis and Halloween. It's

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Speaker 1: also similar to the character he played in The Devil's

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Speaker 1: Men that we previously discussed on the show.

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Speaker 3: Oh no, the Devil's Man. He's much better in this

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Speaker 3: than he was in The Devil's Men. Yeah, but it

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Speaker 3: is very similar to his Halloween performance. In both cases,

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Speaker 3: he is playing a He is playing a haunted, disturbed

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Speaker 3: cleric of sorts who is motivated by a fear of

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Speaker 3: what's to come and guilt for what he in some

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Speaker 3: small part, played a role in releasing into the world. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Pleasants lived nineteen nineteen through nineteen ninety five, and he,

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Speaker 1: of course not only appeared in Carpenter's Halloween. He was

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Speaker 1: also an Escape from New York, in which he played

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Speaker 1: the President of the United States.

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Speaker 3: May God have messy on you all.

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Speaker 1: He often played these really like, very dry, serious characters,

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Speaker 1: but it's said to be quite humorous behind the scenes,

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Speaker 1: and you know, everybody seems to have really nice things

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Speaker 1: to say about working with him. All Right. Up next,

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Speaker 1: we have the actor and character that are essentially positioned

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Speaker 1: as the leading man. But again very strong ensemble sensibilities here.

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Speaker 1: But this is the character Brian Marsh played by Jamison

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Speaker 1: Parker born nineteen forty seven.

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Speaker 3: Is this supposed to be our Tom Atkins for the film?

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Speaker 1: I think so, our mustachioed, handsome eighties leading man. Sometimes

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Speaker 1: he just hangs out like he's working alone in his

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Speaker 1: apartment or house at night. He's just he's got his

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Speaker 1: shirt open so he can show off his muscles to nobody.

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Speaker 3: He's got some muscles, though he does.

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Speaker 1: A man's in good shape. Jamison Parker was mostly known

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Speaker 1: for playing the Simon without a mustache on TV Simon

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Speaker 1: and Simon, so in this movie he's the one with

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Speaker 1: the mustache. And he worked several times with Simon and

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Speaker 1: Simon co star Gerald McRaney, the dad from The Never

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Speaker 1: Ending Story. So I mean this is mostly what he's

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Speaker 1: known for, also, of course remembered for this picture. And

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Speaker 1: you know he's perfectly fine in this no complaints. Again,

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Speaker 1: He's essentially the leading man that exists mostly within an

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Speaker 1: ensemble cast of characters.

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Speaker 3: You know, I will say I love love Prince of Darkness,

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Speaker 3: but I will say I think deeply developed characters is

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Speaker 3: not this movie's strong suit. Instead of having characters that

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Speaker 3: we get to know super well and are very well defined,

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Speaker 3: we have a lot of characters. I would say the

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Speaker 3: most interesting singularly defined character in the movie is the

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Speaker 3: physics professor Barak, played by Victor Wong.

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Speaker 1: Yes, Victor Wong, who of nineteen twenty seven through two

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Speaker 1: thousand and one Chinese American character actor, easily best remembered

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Speaker 1: for his role as the wizard egg Shin in Carpenter's

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Speaker 1: Big Trouble in Little China, but he also had a

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Speaker 1: great role in the cult classic monster film Trimmers, which

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Speaker 1: also had a great ensemble cast, and he was also

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Speaker 1: in nineteen eighty seven's The Last Emperor. Other credits include

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Speaker 1: eighty five's Year of the Dragon, eighty six is Shanghai

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Speaker 1: Surprise that as it's a Madonna movie, Memory Serves, and

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Speaker 1: also The Golden Child with Eddie Murphy nineteen ninety three,

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Speaker 1: is the Joy Luck Club in nineteen ninety seven Seven

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Speaker 1: Years in Tibet.

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Speaker 3: I always love Victor Wong. Of course I love him

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Speaker 3: in Big Trouble in Little China, and I love him

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Speaker 3: in this. He has such a strong, like good magic,

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Speaker 3: comforting aura. He's almost like the good Witch Glinda when

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Speaker 3: he appears, you know, does that make any sense?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, it's like there's he's able to bring a

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Speaker 1: certain wisdom to everything that he's saying, you know. And

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Speaker 1: we'll get into when we can do examples from his

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Speaker 1: various physics lectures. But I think it's interesting because I

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Speaker 1: think you could say the same for Donald Pleasants and

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Speaker 1: Victor Wong. Both of them are really great at making

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Speaker 1: you believe the things that they're saying, no matter what

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Speaker 1: kind of dialogue they're given. You're like, Yeah, this guy

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Speaker 1: knows what he's talking.

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Speaker 3: About absolutely, And I really like the way he plays

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Speaker 3: this character too, So not just in delivering, say, these

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Speaker 3: strange physics lectures about you know, the other characters say

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Speaker 3: about like the student characters say about him that he

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Speaker 3: is a physics professor, but he's almost more interested in

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Speaker 3: turning his students into philosophers than scientists, because he's really

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Speaker 3: captured by the ideas the implications of the quantum mechanics

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Speaker 3: that he teaches, and so he does come out he

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Speaker 3: does portray that well as like the man wrapped up

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Speaker 3: in not just how the science works, but what it

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Speaker 3: means for our lives, and he clearly like he gets

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Speaker 3: lost in thought about that and wants other people to

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Speaker 3: understand to the extent he does, how strange all this

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Speaker 3: is and how much it should shake them to their core.

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Speaker 3: But I also like the way that he plays this

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Speaker 3: role as as physically feeble but mentally tough. Like he

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Speaker 3: sort of plays the character. He's very kind of slow

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Speaker 3: moving and almost sort of with a limp or something

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Speaker 3: in the way he walks, but he doesn't get as

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Speaker 3: easily mentally shaken as a lot of the other characters.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, again, it's you know, it's probably that strong

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Speaker 1: wisdom rating for his character. All right, let's see next,

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Speaker 1: we have the character Catherine Danforth played by Lisa Blount,

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Speaker 1: who lived nineteen fifty seven through twenty ten. Along with

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Speaker 1: most of the characters, she's part of the Professor's assembled

434
00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:23,120
Speaker 1: science team, and as we'll see, she's also the love

435
00:24:23,160 --> 00:24:28,160
Speaker 1: interest of the character Brian Marsh. Best known for her

436
00:24:28,160 --> 00:24:30,719
Speaker 1: Golden Globe nominated performance in nineteen eighty two as an

437
00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:33,600
Speaker 1: officer and a Gentleman. Her other credits include nineteen eighty

438
00:24:33,600 --> 00:24:37,480
Speaker 1: one's Dead and Buried, nineteen eighty four's Radioactive Dreams, and

439
00:24:37,600 --> 00:24:41,240
Speaker 1: What Waits Below, eighty seven's Night Flyers and nineteen eighty

440
00:24:41,320 --> 00:24:46,000
Speaker 1: nine Blind Fury. She also produced three projects, including the

441
00:24:46,040 --> 00:24:49,040
Speaker 1: Academy Award winning short film The Accountant in two thousand

442
00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:52,400
Speaker 1: and one that starred and was directed by her husband

443
00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:56,560
Speaker 1: Ray McKinnon and co starred Walton Goggins, both both fine actors.

444
00:24:56,800 --> 00:25:00,200
Speaker 3: Oh Goggins connection. As I said earlier, a lot the

445
00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:03,600
Speaker 3: student characters, maybe including our supposed leading man Brian, are

446
00:25:03,920 --> 00:25:06,760
Speaker 3: not super well defined. I think Catherine is one of

447
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:11,840
Speaker 3: the slightly more interesting ones. She has there's something unspoken

448
00:25:11,920 --> 00:25:15,800
Speaker 3: about her backstory, Like there are moments she has with

449
00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:19,080
Speaker 3: Brian where they're talking about like why she seems to

450
00:25:19,119 --> 00:25:22,359
Speaker 3: have a kind of pessimistic outlook about say love, or

451
00:25:23,160 --> 00:25:25,800
Speaker 3: about the future. Why she seems to have a lot

452
00:25:25,800 --> 00:25:29,080
Speaker 3: of doubts about herself, and she often doesn't want to

453
00:25:29,119 --> 00:25:31,480
Speaker 3: explain what the cause of that is, and so we're

454
00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:35,359
Speaker 3: just sort of left to fill that in ourselves. But yeah,

455
00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:39,240
Speaker 3: she's presented as this character who has I don't know,

456
00:25:39,280 --> 00:25:41,719
Speaker 3: who has a kind of darkness, who has doubts, but

457
00:25:41,840 --> 00:25:44,600
Speaker 3: she does essentially save the day in the end, the

458
00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:48,680
Speaker 3: bridging into the dark world where the father of Satan resides.

459
00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:52,959
Speaker 3: More on that later is ultimately that is stopped by

460
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:54,760
Speaker 3: an act of heroism by Catherine.

461
00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:58,679
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, all right. Next we have the character Walter

462
00:25:58,920 --> 00:26:02,119
Speaker 1: played by Dennis Dunne born nineteen fifty two. This is

463
00:26:02,119 --> 00:26:05,600
Speaker 1: another big trouble in Little China alumni. He also appeared

464
00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:07,560
Speaker 1: in nineteen eighty five's A Year of the Dragon and

465
00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:10,920
Speaker 1: eighty seven's The Last Emperor American actor of Chinese descent

466
00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:14,360
Speaker 1: with the credits and TV film and stage. His role

467
00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:18,679
Speaker 1: is interesting because he is the funniest character, but he

468
00:26:18,760 --> 00:26:22,000
Speaker 1: is also it's important to distress, not a comic relief character,

469
00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:24,840
Speaker 1: Like he is not there just to make a few

470
00:26:24,920 --> 00:26:26,720
Speaker 1: jokes and then get killed by a monster or anything

471
00:26:26,760 --> 00:26:29,840
Speaker 1: like that. Like, he has a lot of personality and

472
00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:32,760
Speaker 1: he brings a lot of legitimate humor to the role.

473
00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:36,199
Speaker 1: But he's also a character that you're pretty invested in,

474
00:26:36,240 --> 00:26:38,280
Speaker 1: So I don't know, he feels almost like co male

475
00:26:38,359 --> 00:26:39,560
Speaker 1: lead in the film.

476
00:26:39,960 --> 00:26:42,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would say it's not that he functions as

477
00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:44,800
Speaker 3: comic relief within the plot. I would say that the

478
00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:48,679
Speaker 3: character the main characteristic of his character is that he

479
00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:51,639
Speaker 3: is a jokester and he in fact deals with fear

480
00:26:51,720 --> 00:26:53,760
Speaker 3: by making jokes, which is the thing a lot of people.

481
00:26:53,840 --> 00:26:56,439
Speaker 3: Do you know that's a common character, You know, you

482
00:26:56,440 --> 00:26:58,800
Speaker 3: can recognize that character trait in others, the people whose

483
00:26:59,280 --> 00:27:02,119
Speaker 3: impulse when things start getting tense or scary is to

484
00:27:02,160 --> 00:27:04,639
Speaker 3: start trying harder and harder to be funny.

485
00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:10,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right. Next we have Kelly. Kelly is played

486
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:15,720
Speaker 1: by Susan Blanchard born nineteen forty four. She's another member

487
00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:18,119
Speaker 1: of the science team. I don't remember what her discipline

488
00:27:18,160 --> 00:27:19,639
Speaker 1: is off the top of my head. She has a

489
00:27:19,640 --> 00:27:22,000
Speaker 1: bit the physics group by physics. Grip Oh, she's physics.

490
00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:25,440
Speaker 1: She's the blonde member of the team. She becomes really

491
00:27:25,520 --> 00:27:28,560
Speaker 1: important in the final act. So more on that in

492
00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:31,359
Speaker 1: a bet. She also appeared in They Live and was

493
00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:34,199
Speaker 1: on tpe's Policewoman. All right. Then we have the character

494
00:27:34,440 --> 00:27:38,680
Speaker 1: Susan Cabot played by Anne Marie Howard born nineteen sixty

495
00:27:39,160 --> 00:27:41,640
Speaker 1: This is the science team member with the piercing eyes.

496
00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:43,320
Speaker 1: Do you remember what her discipline is?

497
00:27:43,480 --> 00:27:46,560
Speaker 3: Also, I don't remember her discipline. But she's the one

498
00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:49,760
Speaker 3: who's working down in the basement with the cylinder of goo.

499
00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:54,080
Speaker 3: She has the glasses. Multiple characters refer to her by

500
00:27:54,080 --> 00:27:55,040
Speaker 3: saying glasses.

501
00:27:55,359 --> 00:27:58,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, And then of course she becomes the first person

502
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:01,879
Speaker 1: to be possessed. So minor spoiler there, but hey, and

503
00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:05,120
Speaker 1: she loses the glasses and becomes the creepy possessed woman

504
00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:06,639
Speaker 1: for the rest of the film, which she does a

505
00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:07,480
Speaker 1: great job at.

506
00:28:07,800 --> 00:28:11,960
Speaker 3: She goes around essentially urinating satanic fluid out of her

507
00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:14,320
Speaker 3: mouth into other people's mouths.

508
00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:17,919
Speaker 1: Exactly, which is great. I mean, how many other films

509
00:28:17,920 --> 00:28:20,960
Speaker 1: do you have this sort of like possessed zombie vampire

510
00:28:21,160 --> 00:28:26,760
Speaker 1: that uses like a projectial green liquid to infect others.

511
00:28:27,359 --> 00:28:30,440
Speaker 1: That is pretty great. This is essentially her first film role,

512
00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:32,399
Speaker 1: which she followed up with a stint on Days of

513
00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:35,320
Speaker 1: Our Lives and has had a long career acting in

514
00:28:35,359 --> 00:28:38,920
Speaker 1: mostly television. I think some solid stage credits as well.

515
00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:41,360
Speaker 1: All right, up next, we have the character Lisa played

516
00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:44,520
Speaker 1: by Ann yin one of only a handful of credits

517
00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:47,800
Speaker 1: for her that include According to IMDb, anyway, there's always

518
00:28:47,840 --> 00:28:51,680
Speaker 1: possibility something's crossed here, but they have listed a nineteen

519
00:28:51,720 --> 00:28:56,000
Speaker 1: eighty Chinese film called What Is Love? And then she

520
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:57,920
Speaker 1: does a few other things. She does this movie and

521
00:28:57,960 --> 00:29:00,200
Speaker 1: then finally has an episode of TVs in a in

522
00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:03,120
Speaker 1: color and then I don't know, well what happened to

523
00:29:03,160 --> 00:29:05,400
Speaker 1: her after that, but I thought she was pretty good. Here.

524
00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:07,200
Speaker 1: She's like a computer person, right.

525
00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:09,640
Speaker 3: No, no, no, she's well, she's using a computer. But no,

526
00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:14,760
Speaker 3: she's brought in as a theology student because they need

527
00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:18,080
Speaker 3: someone to translate the ancient languages in the book that

528
00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:20,280
Speaker 3: is kept by the Brotherhood of Sleep. That's right, So.

529
00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:22,680
Speaker 1: She's doing a lot of translation work on the computers.

530
00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:25,920
Speaker 3: Yes, she's like just looking at the book and apparently

531
00:29:26,000 --> 00:29:29,040
Speaker 3: not needing to use any reference resources or anything. She

532
00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:31,840
Speaker 3: just like looks at the Brotherhood of Sleep book and like, okay,

533
00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:34,360
Speaker 3: that's Coptic, and then just starts typing in English on

534
00:29:34,440 --> 00:29:36,920
Speaker 3: the computer, doing it straight from the head. I mean,

535
00:29:36,960 --> 00:29:42,440
Speaker 3: that's impressive. I think even most professional, you know, language

536
00:29:42,440 --> 00:29:45,600
Speaker 3: scholars probably need to use some reference materials when they're

537
00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:49,880
Speaker 3: translating things. But yeah, so she's the one who's like

538
00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:52,200
Speaker 3: translating the book. So she gives us a lot of

539
00:29:52,240 --> 00:29:55,440
Speaker 3: like creepy statements that are coming from this ancient tone.

540
00:29:55,520 --> 00:29:58,160
Speaker 3: But then also she has one of my favorite scary

541
00:29:58,200 --> 00:30:01,120
Speaker 3: moments in the movie, where after she gets possessed by

542
00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:04,760
Speaker 3: the Satanic fluid, she's sitting at the computer and just

543
00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:07,160
Speaker 3: like staring ahead, not not looking at the screen, but

544
00:30:07,200 --> 00:30:10,120
Speaker 3: like looking off to the side and just typing repeatedly,

545
00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:12,160
Speaker 3: over and over, and then you see the screen and

546
00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:15,680
Speaker 3: it just says I live. I live, like a million times.

547
00:30:16,760 --> 00:30:19,520
Speaker 1: Peter Jason, in the commentary tract did comment that, hey,

548
00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:23,280
Speaker 1: she's like acting and using a computer and it looks believable.

549
00:30:23,600 --> 00:30:26,440
Speaker 1: I can't do that. He's like making a case like

550
00:30:26,480 --> 00:30:27,880
Speaker 1: most actors can't do that. We don't know how to

551
00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:31,720
Speaker 1: use computers. That's why we're acting. So found that amusing.

552
00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:34,920
Speaker 1: So I'm going to skip various members of the science

553
00:30:34,920 --> 00:30:37,240
Speaker 1: team here, but yeah, I'll mention that. Yeah. Peter Jason

554
00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:39,560
Speaker 1: born nineteen forty four appears here in the first of

555
00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:45,040
Speaker 1: seven collaborations with John Carpenter. Alice Cooper the rock Star

556
00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:47,600
Speaker 1: born nineteen forty eight has a small role as a

557
00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:52,360
Speaker 1: possessed man who, as we'll discuss, also essentially brought his

558
00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:56,720
Speaker 1: own special effects with him for one scene, and then

559
00:30:56,840 --> 00:31:02,240
Speaker 1: visual effects supervisor Robert Grasmere is also in it as

560
00:31:02,280 --> 00:31:04,880
Speaker 1: an actor. He has a memorable role in the film

561
00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:08,280
Speaker 1: because he gets to die not once, but twice. This

562
00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:12,720
Speaker 1: was only Grassmere's third movie as a visual effects supervisor,

563
00:31:12,760 --> 00:31:14,400
Speaker 1: but he went on to serve on such films as

564
00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:17,480
Speaker 1: eighty seven is the Running Man, nineteen nineties Predator, two,

565
00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:21,560
Speaker 1: ninety three's Demolition Man, and twenty twenty one's Barb and

566
00:31:21,640 --> 00:31:23,960
Speaker 1: Star go to Vista del mar So in a lot

567
00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:24,760
Speaker 1: of different films.

568
00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:26,959
Speaker 3: Oh, but if we're talking about the scientists, we got

569
00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:29,680
Speaker 3: to talk about one of my favorites, which is Calder

570
00:31:29,880 --> 00:31:31,760
Speaker 3: the Microbiologist.

571
00:31:31,840 --> 00:31:35,760
Speaker 1: I think, yes, he's tremendous. Jesse Lawrence Ferguson, who lived

572
00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:40,640
Speaker 1: nineteen forty one through twenty nineteen. He's kind of forgettable

573
00:31:40,640 --> 00:31:44,480
Speaker 1: early on, you know, he's just one of the scienced crew,

574
00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:47,760
Speaker 1: but he goes on to seemingly just have a blast

575
00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:51,960
Speaker 1: playing a possessed version of his character, engaging in all

576
00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:55,400
Speaker 1: manner of like strange facial expressions, and I think he's

577
00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:58,000
Speaker 1: the only one that laughs. And he has this just

578
00:31:58,120 --> 00:32:02,800
Speaker 1: completely unhinged laugh that he does that really adds to

579
00:32:02,840 --> 00:32:07,680
Speaker 1: the creepiness deering, Like like the final part of the picture.

580
00:32:07,560 --> 00:32:10,120
Speaker 3: It's it's so good, hats off to him. It's like

581
00:32:10,240 --> 00:32:13,240
Speaker 3: I am the devil now and it's hilarious and he's

582
00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:16,360
Speaker 3: it's only but it's a laugh that he's not just

583
00:32:16,520 --> 00:32:21,120
Speaker 3: laughing maniacally like outright laughter. It's like he is trying

584
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:24,760
Speaker 3: to keep from laughing, but he can't stop himself. And

585
00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:26,200
Speaker 3: that's what makes it so good.

586
00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:29,840
Speaker 1: Demonic laughter like bubbling out of him. It's so good.

587
00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:30,680
Speaker 3: Yeah.

588
00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:32,360
Speaker 1: Now he was a He was an actors stage and

589
00:32:32,440 --> 00:32:35,680
Speaker 1: screen who appeared in a fair number of things, including

590
00:32:35,720 --> 00:32:39,640
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty four's Buckaru Bonzai eighty six is Neon Maniacs.

591
00:32:39,680 --> 00:32:41,920
Speaker 1: I do not remember him from theon MANIAX, but I

592
00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:45,280
Speaker 1: have seen that film, nineteen nineties dark Man, and nineteen

593
00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:49,080
Speaker 1: ninety one's Boys in the Hood. Great voice, great voice, talent,

594
00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:53,160
Speaker 1: let's see of note. Gary B. Kibbi is cinematographer on

595
00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:55,760
Speaker 1: this with nineteen forty one through twenty twenty. He'd previously

596
00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:58,200
Speaker 1: worked as a camera operator on some films, and this

597
00:32:58,360 --> 00:33:01,200
Speaker 1: was his first film as director of photoghography. Followed by

598
00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:04,160
Speaker 1: They Live, he went unto work on several different John

599
00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:08,320
Speaker 1: Carpenter films and then finally Yes the score we already

600
00:33:08,360 --> 00:33:12,080
Speaker 1: credited Carpenter and again this is one of several collaborations

601
00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:16,200
Speaker 1: with musician Alan Howarth. You can find the score wherever

602
00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:18,680
Speaker 1: you get your music streaming or otherwise. But if you

603
00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:22,560
Speaker 1: want something physical, Sacred Bones Records, who have worked extensively

604
00:33:22,600 --> 00:33:25,800
Speaker 1: with John Carpenter, have a really beautiful box set that

605
00:33:25,840 --> 00:33:28,800
Speaker 1: includes a blu ray of the film. Real quick, now

606
00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:30,880
Speaker 1: that I'm looking at the picture of the blu ray,

607
00:33:31,040 --> 00:33:35,400
Speaker 1: I'm again reminded of the box art for this film.

608
00:33:35,440 --> 00:33:37,680
Speaker 1: The poster art for this film with like the screaming

609
00:33:37,760 --> 00:33:40,560
Speaker 1: face and the green lightning stemming from some sort of

610
00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:45,520
Speaker 1: a church. Long before I ever actually watched this picture,

611
00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:49,520
Speaker 1: I do distinctly remember seeing that VHS box art on

612
00:33:49,600 --> 00:33:53,160
Speaker 1: the shelf at VHS rentals stores, and it always kind

613
00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:55,880
Speaker 1: of like scared me and captivated me from a very

614
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:59,080
Speaker 1: young age. So solid, solid poster.

615
00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:02,520
Speaker 3: Who's face is this? Is this anybody from the movie?

616
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:03,480
Speaker 3: Not that I recall.

617
00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:06,640
Speaker 1: I don't know for certain that it may Yeah, it

618
00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:11,040
Speaker 1: may just be nobody. It's just an evocative poster, which is,

619
00:34:11,080 --> 00:34:12,040
Speaker 1: you know, sometimes the case.

620
00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:14,319
Speaker 3: Can I say something about the marketing for the movie.

621
00:34:14,560 --> 00:34:18,240
Speaker 3: I am impressed that they managed to resist just putting

622
00:34:18,360 --> 00:34:19,800
Speaker 3: Alice Cooper on the cover.

623
00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:24,280
Speaker 1: Yes. I also think it is very admirable that despite

624
00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:27,320
Speaker 1: the fact that Alice Cooper has a song title Prints

625
00:34:27,320 --> 00:34:32,120
Speaker 1: of Darkness that is like technically on the soundtrack, and

626
00:34:32,239 --> 00:34:35,279
Speaker 1: yet is not the closing credits song, or at least

627
00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:37,239
Speaker 1: I don't. It's not the initial closing credit song. Maybe

628
00:34:37,239 --> 00:34:39,760
Speaker 1: they play it later on after I stop watching the credits.

629
00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:44,560
Speaker 1: But this is a film that has a tremendous music obviously,

630
00:34:45,160 --> 00:34:49,279
Speaker 1: and a tremendous endpoint, like the final shot in the

631
00:34:49,280 --> 00:34:52,160
Speaker 1: film is perfect, and the music matches with it perfectly

632
00:34:52,200 --> 00:34:56,760
Speaker 1: and feeds into the end credit song that is Carpenter

633
00:34:56,800 --> 00:34:59,799
Speaker 1: and Howarth. I wouldn't change that for the world. I'm

634
00:34:59,840 --> 00:35:02,120
Speaker 1: so glad we don't switch over into a rock number

635
00:35:02,120 --> 00:35:02,680
Speaker 1: at that point.

636
00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:05,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's right. I mean, as I said earlier, the

637
00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:08,880
Speaker 3: use of music in this movie is perfect and it

638
00:35:09,080 --> 00:35:12,640
Speaker 3: is what makes the film work as well as it does.

639
00:35:12,680 --> 00:35:14,439
Speaker 3: Not that there aren't a lot of other great things

640
00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:17,480
Speaker 3: about the movie, but the music is the glue that

641
00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:20,680
Speaker 3: holds everything together and does the most work of anything

642
00:35:20,719 --> 00:35:24,560
Speaker 3: to establish the intended feeling of the movie. So yeah,

643
00:35:24,600 --> 00:35:28,400
Speaker 3: you couldn't mess with that, I think. Yeah, I totally agree.

644
00:35:28,440 --> 00:35:30,200
Speaker 3: If as soon as you cut to the credits you

645
00:35:30,239 --> 00:35:32,640
Speaker 3: went to a rock song, I think that would be

646
00:35:32,680 --> 00:35:34,839
Speaker 3: a real bummer. That would really spoil it.

647
00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:45,520
Speaker 1: All, right, Well, let's dive into the plot proper here.

648
00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:49,480
Speaker 3: So the action opens with that ominous theme music. It

649
00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:54,000
Speaker 3: consists of a deep electronic pulse that bounces kind of

650
00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:58,080
Speaker 3: like a hammer on a harpsichord string. But then it

651
00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:02,120
Speaker 3: also has these high synthesized tones that sound kind of

652
00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:06,719
Speaker 3: like choirs, but not so much singing but sighing. I

653
00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:10,440
Speaker 3: love that sighing voice they've created there. I don't know

654
00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:14,000
Speaker 3: exactly what that is, but this music keeps playing as

655
00:36:14,040 --> 00:36:17,400
Speaker 3: we go through the opening shots of the movie, and

656
00:36:17,480 --> 00:36:19,960
Speaker 3: the first I would say the first ten minutes or

657
00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:24,000
Speaker 3: so of the movie function kind of like a montage

658
00:36:24,120 --> 00:36:30,160
Speaker 3: where we don't follow any individual character character all that long. Instead,

659
00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:32,839
Speaker 3: it's more like a montage where we cut back and

660
00:36:32,880 --> 00:36:38,000
Speaker 3: forth between credits and then different characters, settings, and important props.

661
00:36:38,080 --> 00:36:40,719
Speaker 3: So it's kind of like a survey of the game

662
00:36:40,840 --> 00:36:43,920
Speaker 3: pieces being laid out on the board, except it is

663
00:36:44,080 --> 00:36:49,880
Speaker 3: charged with this incredibly strong combination of dread, anticipation, and

664
00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:54,400
Speaker 3: unstoppable forward momentum, all created by the music. And I

665
00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:58,200
Speaker 3: think somewhat famously, this opening credits montage goes on for

666
00:36:58,239 --> 00:36:59,520
Speaker 3: like nine or ten minutes.

667
00:37:00,120 --> 00:37:02,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, it's a good one though. It really brings

668
00:37:02,760 --> 00:37:06,319
Speaker 1: the intrigue following these characters around, establishing who they are

669
00:37:06,440 --> 00:37:07,920
Speaker 1: and what's happening in this world.

670
00:37:08,520 --> 00:37:10,920
Speaker 3: So the first thing we see is the full moon

671
00:37:11,239 --> 00:37:14,960
Speaker 3: in a black sky with reflected moonlight almost a shade

672
00:37:15,000 --> 00:37:15,480
Speaker 3: of pink.

673
00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:18,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is one of many great mate paintings in

674
00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:21,200
Speaker 1: the film by Jan Dan Janfirth Here. Anytime you see

675
00:37:21,239 --> 00:37:23,280
Speaker 1: characters looking up at the sky and there's something weird

676
00:37:23,320 --> 00:37:25,400
Speaker 1: going on with the sky, it's a great mat painting.

677
00:37:25,880 --> 00:37:27,840
Speaker 3: And by the way, I'm going to describe this opening

678
00:37:27,840 --> 00:37:30,120
Speaker 3: montage in a good bit of detail to kind of

679
00:37:30,160 --> 00:37:33,640
Speaker 3: help create the feeling. But then, so after we see

680
00:37:33,680 --> 00:37:36,480
Speaker 3: the moon, we see inside a room and the moonlight

681
00:37:36,520 --> 00:37:40,040
Speaker 3: falls through a circular window that's criss crossed with bars.

682
00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:44,280
Speaker 3: Underneath the window, an old an old man lies alone

683
00:37:44,440 --> 00:37:47,680
Speaker 3: in a small bed. Across from him, there's a heavy

684
00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:51,799
Speaker 3: black wooden door on the far wall, a crucifix, a candlestick,

685
00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:54,600
Speaker 3: and a framed image of a saint, so we think

686
00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:58,040
Speaker 3: this guy's probably a priest. Then we close on his face.

687
00:37:58,440 --> 00:38:01,680
Speaker 3: He seems to be struggling, drawing his last breath, and

688
00:38:01,719 --> 00:38:04,200
Speaker 3: then his hand falls away. From something that he has

689
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:08,200
Speaker 3: been clutching. It is a tiny silver box. Then we

690
00:38:08,239 --> 00:38:12,440
Speaker 3: get the title John Carpenter's Prince of Darkness. Next, we

691
00:38:12,560 --> 00:38:15,759
Speaker 3: open on daylight on a university campus and there are

692
00:38:15,800 --> 00:38:19,800
Speaker 3: students gathered under shady green trees. They're walking along paved

693
00:38:19,840 --> 00:38:23,200
Speaker 3: pathways between the buildings and we fall in with one

694
00:38:23,200 --> 00:38:25,880
Speaker 3: of our main characters. This is Brian Marsh played by

695
00:38:25,960 --> 00:38:30,200
Speaker 3: Jamison Parker. He's fit, blonde with a mustache, wearing a

696
00:38:30,239 --> 00:38:34,279
Speaker 3: neatly tucked red polo shirt, carrying a leather satchel, and

697
00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:36,520
Speaker 3: he walks to the foreground of the shot and pauses

698
00:38:36,560 --> 00:38:38,759
Speaker 3: while the music kind of pulls you along, and this

699
00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:42,480
Speaker 3: is the camera getting to know him. Across the courtyard,

700
00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:46,360
Speaker 3: he sees another major character, Catherine Danforth played by Lisa Blount,

701
00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:50,880
Speaker 3: talking to another woman before class. Catherine is red haired,

702
00:38:51,040 --> 00:38:54,160
Speaker 3: dressed casually in a denim jacket, holding a stack of

703
00:38:54,200 --> 00:38:56,920
Speaker 3: books and binders in the crook of her arm. She

704
00:38:56,960 --> 00:39:01,200
Speaker 3: looks she's like a good natured nerd. Then back to

705
00:39:01,239 --> 00:39:03,200
Speaker 3: the room of the priest in the morning, a nun

706
00:39:03,280 --> 00:39:06,320
Speaker 3: knocks on the door, comes inside and finds him dead

707
00:39:06,400 --> 00:39:09,960
Speaker 3: with the silver box resting on his midsection. Later, we

708
00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:13,160
Speaker 3: see the nun talking to Donald Pleasants also a priest

709
00:39:13,280 --> 00:39:15,239
Speaker 3: dressed as a priest. Don't know if that needs to

710
00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:19,000
Speaker 3: be said, but yeah, we established he's a priest. She's

711
00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:21,120
Speaker 3: talking to him about the fact that she found this

712
00:39:21,200 --> 00:39:24,680
Speaker 3: other priest unconscious. His name was Father Carlton, and he

713
00:39:24,760 --> 00:39:27,360
Speaker 3: was taken to the hospital, but he never woke up again.

714
00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:31,040
Speaker 3: Donald Pleasant asks why Father Carlton was here in the

715
00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:33,560
Speaker 3: first place. Where are they? Well, they appear to be

716
00:39:33,600 --> 00:39:37,640
Speaker 3: in some kind of headquarters of the Catholic hierarchy, because

717
00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:40,200
Speaker 3: the nun says he had an appointment with his Imminence

718
00:39:40,239 --> 00:39:44,080
Speaker 3: this afternoon. Oh, his Eminence, so important business going on

719
00:39:44,160 --> 00:39:49,880
Speaker 3: within the church. Donald Pleasance sits down and begins investigating

720
00:39:49,920 --> 00:39:53,719
Speaker 3: what happened here by reading doctor Carlton's handwritten journals, and

721
00:39:53,760 --> 00:39:57,239
Speaker 3: the header on this handwritten journal entry is the Brotherhood

722
00:39:57,360 --> 00:40:00,239
Speaker 3: of Sleep. Now it cuts away before you can read

723
00:40:00,320 --> 00:40:04,239
Speaker 3: everything on the page. I actually did stop to see

724
00:40:04,239 --> 00:40:07,000
Speaker 3: what it actually says and take down everything. It's actually

725
00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:09,319
Speaker 3: not as interesting as they didn't intend for you to

726
00:40:09,360 --> 00:40:11,000
Speaker 3: read this whole part. It starts with like I can

727
00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:14,040
Speaker 3: no longer keep silent as to this dreadful secret. We'll

728
00:40:14,040 --> 00:40:17,160
Speaker 3: get more intriguing Brotherhood of Sleep stuff as we go along.

729
00:40:17,880 --> 00:40:21,200
Speaker 3: It does eventually zoom in on one particular part that

730
00:40:21,320 --> 00:40:25,400
Speaker 3: says says the sleeper awakens, I have witnessed his stirrings,

731
00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:29,680
Speaker 3: felt the cold, hellish blast. Now next, we're going to

732
00:40:29,760 --> 00:40:33,960
Speaker 3: meet the character of the physics professor Howard Barrack played

733
00:40:33,960 --> 00:40:37,400
Speaker 3: by Victor Wong. He is walking class with the heavy briefcase,

734
00:40:37,520 --> 00:40:40,800
Speaker 3: dressed in a wool blazer with at least five pins

735
00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:43,000
Speaker 3: in his shirt pocket, so he is a professor, but

736
00:40:43,080 --> 00:40:48,440
Speaker 3: he's also dressed very classically professorially, and he comes off

737
00:40:48,480 --> 00:40:52,799
Speaker 3: as preoccupied with his obscure curiosities and research questions. And

738
00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:55,560
Speaker 3: as he heads to class, something gets his attention in

739
00:40:55,640 --> 00:40:58,840
Speaker 3: the sky, so he puts things down and he crosses

740
00:40:58,880 --> 00:41:01,480
Speaker 3: his fingers over his eyes to block the light, and

741
00:41:01,480 --> 00:41:04,320
Speaker 3: then looks up toward the sun. We see the sun

742
00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:07,040
Speaker 3: shining through the clouds, and then right next to the

743
00:41:07,080 --> 00:41:10,080
Speaker 3: sun in the middle of the day is a crescent moon.

744
00:41:10,760 --> 00:41:13,120
Speaker 3: And then the camera shows us he doesn't see this,

745
00:41:13,239 --> 00:41:16,480
Speaker 3: but the camera shows us nearby on the ground, red

746
00:41:16,680 --> 00:41:21,120
Speaker 3: ants swarming ferociously over a mound in the grass, and

747
00:41:21,160 --> 00:41:23,480
Speaker 3: this will establish a theme that happens a lot in

748
00:41:23,520 --> 00:41:26,600
Speaker 3: the movie where characters stop and they kind of look

749
00:41:26,680 --> 00:41:29,839
Speaker 3: up in the sky or look toward the sun as

750
00:41:29,840 --> 00:41:33,279
Speaker 3: if they feel like something is wrong. And then we

751
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:35,839
Speaker 3: see the sun and it's just sort of hidden by

752
00:41:35,880 --> 00:41:39,160
Speaker 3: the clouds sometimes or partially hidden. It's like shining through

753
00:41:39,200 --> 00:41:44,280
Speaker 3: some thin clouds and music lets It's like the music

754
00:41:44,400 --> 00:41:47,120
Speaker 3: lets us know that there is something wrong with the sky,

755
00:41:47,360 --> 00:41:50,320
Speaker 3: something wrong with the sun, but nobody is ever able

756
00:41:50,360 --> 00:41:53,000
Speaker 3: to say what it is. People don't really talk about it.

757
00:41:53,000 --> 00:41:57,120
Speaker 3: It's just this feeling of unease about the atmosphere. And

758
00:41:57,160 --> 00:41:57,919
Speaker 3: I love this.

759
00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:01,400
Speaker 1: Yeah. Quick note on the bugs. There are a lot

760
00:42:01,440 --> 00:42:04,520
Speaker 1: of bugs in this picture. And there was just one

761
00:42:04,600 --> 00:42:08,320
Speaker 1: really brief moment in the audio commentary where Peter Jason

762
00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:11,520
Speaker 1: asked Carpenter says, like a lot of bugs here, where

763
00:42:11,680 --> 00:42:13,319
Speaker 1: did they come from? And Carpenter's like, oh, you know,

764
00:42:13,360 --> 00:42:16,480
Speaker 1: we had a bug wrangler, And Jason says that sounds expensive,

765
00:42:16,560 --> 00:42:19,920
Speaker 1: and Carpenter says, it's not that bad. I don't know

766
00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:21,239
Speaker 1: why I love that exchange so.

767
00:42:21,239 --> 00:42:24,600
Speaker 3: Much compared to getting Alice Cooper come.

768
00:42:24,480 --> 00:42:27,399
Speaker 1: On Alice Cooper, by the way, that it was kind

769
00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:29,719
Speaker 1: of funny. He was cast in the film because his

770
00:42:29,880 --> 00:42:33,640
Speaker 1: agent was one of the producers of the picture. So

771
00:42:33,840 --> 00:42:35,680
Speaker 1: like that was kind of like the meet up, like

772
00:42:35,719 --> 00:42:37,399
Speaker 1: how they kind of like I think they also met

773
00:42:37,400 --> 00:42:40,760
Speaker 1: at WrestleMania or something Wrestleman. Heir three, I want to say,

774
00:42:41,920 --> 00:42:43,840
Speaker 1: And so he was like, I'd love to be in

775
00:42:43,840 --> 00:42:45,799
Speaker 1: a horror movie a big horror movie fan, and they're like,

776
00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:49,800
Speaker 1: you know, it came together. And then also, as we'll discuss,

777
00:42:50,760 --> 00:42:53,759
Speaker 1: Alice Cooper had a particular impalement gag that he would

778
00:42:53,840 --> 00:42:56,840
Speaker 1: do on stage and they were like, Oh, that's great,

779
00:42:56,920 --> 00:42:59,000
Speaker 1: let's do a version of that in this picture.

780
00:42:59,080 --> 00:43:02,000
Speaker 3: And they do, Oh, is this where he stabs the

781
00:43:02,360 --> 00:43:04,200
Speaker 3: stabs the nerdy guy with a bicycle?

782
00:43:04,680 --> 00:43:07,920
Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, I think the stage version is a microphone

783
00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:11,080
Speaker 1: stand and they adapted it for to be a bicycle

784
00:43:11,080 --> 00:43:13,880
Speaker 1: in this Yeah. It's pretty great. Though, more on that

785
00:43:13,920 --> 00:43:14,600
Speaker 1: when it occurs.

786
00:43:14,960 --> 00:43:16,680
Speaker 3: I can't promise more on that because I don't know

787
00:43:16,680 --> 00:43:19,120
Speaker 3: what else to say. He just gets stabbed with the bicycle.

788
00:43:19,239 --> 00:43:21,319
Speaker 1: Well, okay, I'll go ahead and say. What happens is

789
00:43:21,360 --> 00:43:26,360
Speaker 1: Alice Cooper's character, who's zombified, stabs a guy through with

790
00:43:26,400 --> 00:43:28,920
Speaker 1: the bicycle's got half a bicycle with like a you know,

791
00:43:30,280 --> 00:43:33,080
Speaker 1: like a part of the frame sticking out that you

792
00:43:33,120 --> 00:43:35,799
Speaker 1: can pail somebody with. And then that leaves the guy

793
00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:40,200
Speaker 1: to like slump over, impaled over like the bicycle wheel

794
00:43:40,440 --> 00:43:45,120
Speaker 1: and so forth. However, nobody then you kind of expect

795
00:43:45,120 --> 00:43:47,400
Speaker 1: a zombie to then come behind the victim, pick up

796
00:43:47,400 --> 00:43:50,239
Speaker 1: his legs wheelbarrel style, and then turn him into a

797
00:43:50,280 --> 00:43:54,600
Speaker 1: wheelbarrow and wheelbarrow him off. That does not happen. It's

798
00:43:54,640 --> 00:43:56,000
Speaker 1: still a great scene though, all.

799
00:43:56,000 --> 00:43:59,400
Speaker 3: Right, So the montage continues. Oh, we get one I

800
00:43:59,440 --> 00:44:02,719
Speaker 3: thought funny shot of Donald Pleasant standing in the courtyard

801
00:44:02,760 --> 00:44:07,520
Speaker 3: of this church office building dramatically opening the silver box

802
00:44:07,600 --> 00:44:11,680
Speaker 3: and pulling out a comically oversized key. And then we

803
00:44:11,719 --> 00:44:15,000
Speaker 3: get one of these classroom scenes with dialogue. So some

804
00:44:15,040 --> 00:44:19,160
Speaker 3: of these scenes are silent, some talking in them. In

805
00:44:19,200 --> 00:44:22,600
Speaker 3: this one, we hear Professor Barak delivering a lecture on

806
00:44:22,680 --> 00:44:26,280
Speaker 3: quantum physics to a classroom of graduate students, including Brian

807
00:44:26,360 --> 00:44:29,120
Speaker 3: and Catherine, the characters we saw earlier, and a bunch

808
00:44:29,160 --> 00:44:31,400
Speaker 3: of the other characters that we'll see get possessed by

809
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:34,000
Speaker 3: the devil or killed later. And I'm just going to

810
00:44:34,080 --> 00:44:37,600
Speaker 3: read the quote what Professor Barack says. He says, let's

811
00:44:37,600 --> 00:44:40,200
Speaker 3: talk about our beliefs and what we can learn about them.

812
00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:44,160
Speaker 3: We believe nature is solid and time a constant. Matter

813
00:44:44,239 --> 00:44:47,560
Speaker 3: has substance and time a direction. There is truth in

814
00:44:47,680 --> 00:44:51,080
Speaker 3: flesh and the solid ground. The wind may be invisible,

815
00:44:51,120 --> 00:44:55,640
Speaker 3: but it's real. Smoke, fire, water, light. They're different, not

816
00:44:55,760 --> 00:44:58,759
Speaker 3: as to stone or steal, but they're tangible. And we

817
00:44:58,800 --> 00:45:01,920
Speaker 3: assume time has an because it is as a clock.

818
00:45:02,320 --> 00:45:06,040
Speaker 3: One second is one second for everyone. Cause precedes effect,

819
00:45:06,400 --> 00:45:11,239
Speaker 3: fruit rots, water flows downstream. We're born, we age, we die.

820
00:45:11,600 --> 00:45:15,879
Speaker 3: The reverse never happens. None of this is true. Say

821
00:45:15,920 --> 00:45:19,440
Speaker 3: goodbye to classical reality because our logic collapses at the

822
00:45:19,480 --> 00:45:22,560
Speaker 3: sub atomic level into ghosts and shadows.

823
00:45:23,080 --> 00:45:25,719
Speaker 1: That's pretty great, especially the way it's punctuated there, and

824
00:45:25,800 --> 00:45:27,440
Speaker 1: it ties into one of the basic themes of the

825
00:45:27,440 --> 00:45:31,120
Speaker 1: film that everything you thought you knew about science, religion,

826
00:45:31,120 --> 00:45:34,440
Speaker 1: and the universe is wrong. So you know, some strong

827
00:45:34,560 --> 00:45:38,800
Speaker 1: cosmic horror elements there, like the safety net that you

828
00:45:38,880 --> 00:45:41,040
Speaker 1: thought was there is not there at all, and the

829
00:45:41,360 --> 00:45:45,040
Speaker 1: yawning cosmos is more terrifying than previously assumed.

830
00:45:45,600 --> 00:45:49,200
Speaker 3: Yes, it's cosmic in that sense. In that the threatening,

831
00:45:49,880 --> 00:45:52,319
Speaker 3: the threatening malevolence in this movie is not just like

832
00:45:52,360 --> 00:45:55,520
Speaker 3: a single embodied entity that's coming in to attack us,

833
00:45:55,560 --> 00:45:58,320
Speaker 3: but it is threaded through the very physics and fabric

834
00:45:58,400 --> 00:46:02,279
Speaker 3: of the universe. There's something in the laws of physics,

835
00:46:02,320 --> 00:46:04,920
Speaker 3: in all of the atoms and particles and bits of

836
00:46:05,040 --> 00:46:09,600
Speaker 3: energy in the universe that contains bits of this malevolence

837
00:46:09,600 --> 00:46:15,040
Speaker 3: and evil. It's just waiting for us in the universe itself. Now,

838
00:46:15,040 --> 00:46:18,239
Speaker 3: after this, we get our first establishing shot of the

839
00:46:18,360 --> 00:46:21,239
Speaker 3: church where most of the movie will take place. This

840
00:46:21,280 --> 00:46:25,120
Speaker 3: is a church called Saint Goddard's in the film. It's

841
00:46:25,160 --> 00:46:28,800
Speaker 3: a stately old brick chapel topped with an ornamental cross,

842
00:46:28,840 --> 00:46:31,520
Speaker 3: with columns on the front and a fire escape leading

843
00:46:31,560 --> 00:46:35,239
Speaker 3: down the side. It's situated on a kind of run

844
00:46:35,280 --> 00:46:38,239
Speaker 3: down looking city block. Actually, when you get some other angles,

845
00:46:39,000 --> 00:46:42,000
Speaker 3: you see more activity going on sort of across the

846
00:46:42,000 --> 00:46:44,440
Speaker 3: street or further down the street. But I think just

847
00:46:44,480 --> 00:46:47,160
Speaker 3: by showing a tighter shot they create the feeling that

848
00:46:47,480 --> 00:46:49,440
Speaker 3: maybe not much is going on here. We see a

849
00:46:49,480 --> 00:46:53,520
Speaker 3: building with some shuttered windows, there's trash piled up on

850
00:46:53,560 --> 00:46:56,640
Speaker 3: the sidewalk, So I think the idea is that this

851
00:46:56,719 --> 00:47:00,000
Speaker 3: is in. It's on a disused city block. Maybe nobody

852
00:47:00,120 --> 00:47:03,480
Speaker 3: goes to this church anymore. And the church is surrounded

853
00:47:03,520 --> 00:47:07,680
Speaker 3: by a white iron fence with an extremely creepy bronze

854
00:47:07,719 --> 00:47:10,680
Speaker 3: statue of a cloaked figure out front. Is that supposed

855
00:47:10,680 --> 00:47:12,640
Speaker 3: to be the Virgin Mary? I can't quite tell.

856
00:47:13,520 --> 00:47:15,560
Speaker 1: This is a real church in LA, by the way.

857
00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:19,000
Speaker 1: At the time it was the abandoned former Japanese Union

858
00:47:19,080 --> 00:47:22,320
Speaker 1: Church of Los Angeles, and today it's the Union Center

859
00:47:22,360 --> 00:47:24,880
Speaker 1: for the Arts. You can visit it in LA's Little

860
00:47:24,880 --> 00:47:27,680
Speaker 1: Tokyo district. And I was reading a little bit about it,

861
00:47:27,719 --> 00:47:33,760
Speaker 1: like it also has an important role in Japanese American history.

862
00:47:35,239 --> 00:47:39,480
Speaker 1: I believe this is a place during Japanese Internment that

863
00:47:39,560 --> 00:47:44,200
Speaker 1: a lot of people's affected people's possessions were stored. And

864
00:47:44,239 --> 00:47:46,560
Speaker 1: of course, you know, the people affected by this often

865
00:47:46,719 --> 00:47:50,480
Speaker 1: lost a great deal of what they previously owned, you know,

866
00:47:50,560 --> 00:47:54,479
Speaker 1: real estate or otherwise. But yeah, it's currently the Union

867
00:47:54,520 --> 00:47:56,359
Speaker 1: Center for the Arts, and you can visit it, get

868
00:47:56,400 --> 00:47:58,040
Speaker 1: your picture taken in front of it. Just you know,

869
00:47:58,160 --> 00:48:01,319
Speaker 1: be respectful, obviously, spit any green stuff out of your

870
00:48:01,360 --> 00:48:02,560
Speaker 1: mouth at it, and so forth.

871
00:48:03,040 --> 00:48:04,919
Speaker 3: So we zoom in here in front of the church

872
00:48:04,960 --> 00:48:07,920
Speaker 3: and see Donald Pleasant standing out front on the sidewalk,

873
00:48:07,920 --> 00:48:11,480
Speaker 3: and he looks filled with worry and doubt. He goes inside,

874
00:48:11,600 --> 00:48:15,280
Speaker 3: walks down a long hall and finds that the silver

875
00:48:15,400 --> 00:48:19,000
Speaker 3: key from the box he opened it unlocks a heavy

876
00:48:19,120 --> 00:48:22,120
Speaker 3: iron door marked with a sign of the Cross. He

877
00:48:22,200 --> 00:48:25,799
Speaker 3: pushes open the door and goes inside. Later we see

878
00:48:25,840 --> 00:48:28,880
Speaker 3: him typing out a letter to Professor Barak, saying he

879
00:48:29,040 --> 00:48:32,319
Speaker 3: has discovered a most unusual phenomenon that should be of

880
00:48:32,360 --> 00:48:35,080
Speaker 3: interest to him, and it's urgent that they meet it once.

881
00:48:35,840 --> 00:48:38,680
Speaker 3: And then we pop in on another one of Barak's lectures.

882
00:48:39,040 --> 00:48:42,759
Speaker 3: This time he's saying from Job's friends, insisting that the

883
00:48:42,760 --> 00:48:45,840
Speaker 3: good are rewarded and the wicked punished, to the scientists

884
00:48:45,880 --> 00:48:48,600
Speaker 3: of the nineteen thirties, proving to their horror the theorem

885
00:48:48,640 --> 00:48:52,400
Speaker 3: that not everything can be proved. We've sought to impose

886
00:48:52,560 --> 00:48:56,000
Speaker 3: order on the universe, but we've discovered something very surprising.

887
00:48:56,400 --> 00:48:59,080
Speaker 3: While order does exist in the universe, it is not

888
00:48:59,280 --> 00:49:03,359
Speaker 3: at all what we had in mind. And then after

889
00:49:03,440 --> 00:49:07,440
Speaker 3: class we see a conversation between Brian and another student.

890
00:49:07,480 --> 00:49:10,440
Speaker 3: This is Walter played by Dennis Dunn. They see a

891
00:49:10,520 --> 00:49:15,200
Speaker 3: nun delivering Donald Pleasance's letter to their professor, and they're like, oh, none,

892
00:49:15,280 --> 00:49:19,440
Speaker 3: that's interesting, and then they remember, well, apparently Professor Barack

893
00:49:19,520 --> 00:49:23,560
Speaker 3: participated in a series of televised debates on the BBC.

894
00:49:23,920 --> 00:49:29,560
Speaker 3: I think with Donald Pleasance. I wonder what they were debating.

895
00:49:31,280 --> 00:49:35,760
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know, evolution, free will. I'm guessing

896
00:49:35,760 --> 00:49:38,520
Speaker 1: it's something a little headier like free will. That's gonna

897
00:49:38,520 --> 00:49:40,919
Speaker 1: be my inclination here.

898
00:49:41,400 --> 00:49:44,560
Speaker 3: But apparently were they were good natured debates because they

899
00:49:45,040 --> 00:49:47,560
Speaker 3: have something of a friendship now, and you know that

900
00:49:47,840 --> 00:49:51,000
Speaker 3: Donald Pleasance can call upon Barack for help. So they

901
00:49:51,040 --> 00:49:54,040
Speaker 3: meet up in this ornately decorated room and Donald Pleasance

902
00:49:54,080 --> 00:49:57,800
Speaker 3: gives the diary to him to read, imploring him for help.

903
00:49:59,480 --> 00:50:02,200
Speaker 3: Now we get one of these scenes where just like

904
00:50:02,280 --> 00:50:06,360
Speaker 3: the ominous tension is mounting because we see Brian alone

905
00:50:06,400 --> 00:50:10,320
Speaker 3: in his apartment, playing solitaire and watching a TV news

906
00:50:10,320 --> 00:50:14,120
Speaker 3: report about a recently detected super nova five hundred million

907
00:50:14,200 --> 00:50:17,200
Speaker 3: light years away, the light from which is just now

908
00:50:17,280 --> 00:50:21,319
Speaker 3: reaching us. And then also on Brian can't see this,

909
00:50:21,440 --> 00:50:24,640
Speaker 3: but we see that red ants are massing inside the

910
00:50:24,640 --> 00:50:28,719
Speaker 3: back panel of his television seto. This is funny because

911
00:50:28,719 --> 00:50:33,320
Speaker 3: We've done episodes in the past about ants getting inside

912
00:50:33,320 --> 00:50:37,000
Speaker 3: of electronics devices. Did we talk about Prince of Darkness

913
00:50:37,000 --> 00:50:37,239
Speaker 3: in that.

914
00:50:37,480 --> 00:50:39,640
Speaker 1: I don't think we did. I'd kind of forgotten about

915
00:50:39,800 --> 00:50:43,719
Speaker 1: this element of the picture. Ants going into the television set. Yeah,

916
00:50:43,760 --> 00:50:46,600
Speaker 1: but it is. It is not just something you've seen

917
00:50:46,640 --> 00:50:49,160
Speaker 1: in horror movies. I forget the details. I think the

918
00:50:49,160 --> 00:50:52,239
Speaker 1: crazy ant was one of the main ones that has

919
00:50:52,239 --> 00:50:54,680
Speaker 1: been recognized as a TV crawler. But in general, you

920
00:50:54,719 --> 00:50:57,160
Speaker 1: want you want your insects to stay out of your

921
00:50:57,200 --> 00:50:58,000
Speaker 1: television sets.

922
00:50:58,480 --> 00:51:00,240
Speaker 3: Raspberry crazy Ants was that.

923
00:51:00,120 --> 00:51:01,600
Speaker 1: It sounds delicious.

924
00:51:01,680 --> 00:51:04,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, but what's this all working up to? Our

925
00:51:04,560 --> 00:51:07,960
Speaker 3: cleric and our wizard. Donald Pleasance and Victor Wong have

926
00:51:08,080 --> 00:51:12,040
Speaker 3: to visit the dungeon together. So they arrived by limousine

927
00:51:12,040 --> 00:51:14,840
Speaker 3: and they head into Saint Godard's I like this idea

928
00:51:14,880 --> 00:51:18,640
Speaker 3: that like professors and priests travel by limousine, do they?

929
00:51:21,320 --> 00:51:24,000
Speaker 3: But they arrive at the church and they go in.

930
00:51:24,760 --> 00:51:27,360
Speaker 3: Of course, we learned that the priests who died earlier,

931
00:51:27,400 --> 00:51:29,719
Speaker 3: he was the guardian of this church. This is where

932
00:51:29,760 --> 00:51:33,279
Speaker 3: he lived, and he was tasked with keeping watch over

933
00:51:33,320 --> 00:51:37,120
Speaker 3: something in the basement below. Pleasance unlocks the heavy iron

934
00:51:37,160 --> 00:51:40,280
Speaker 3: door and leads the professor down into the underground chambers,

935
00:51:40,880 --> 00:51:43,600
Speaker 3: which we learn were built in the fifteen hundreds by

936
00:51:43,600 --> 00:51:47,279
Speaker 3: the Spanish. And as they move along we get some

937
00:51:47,400 --> 00:51:51,000
Speaker 3: exposition on the Brotherhood of Sleep. They have existed for

938
00:51:51,680 --> 00:51:55,279
Speaker 3: going back a couple thousand years in secret, not even

939
00:51:55,360 --> 00:51:59,640
Speaker 3: known to the Vatican, though through hidden mechanisms they wielded

940
00:51:59,680 --> 00:52:02,600
Speaker 3: an orm power within the church. And finally the two

941
00:52:02,640 --> 00:52:06,839
Speaker 3: men arrive at their destination, a subterranean stone cathedral lit

942
00:52:06,880 --> 00:52:10,480
Speaker 3: by hundreds of candles, and at the far end the

943
00:52:10,520 --> 00:52:13,480
Speaker 3: goo oh boy, this is this is what it's all about.

944
00:52:14,200 --> 00:52:16,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, And this is a great set piece, you know,

945
00:52:16,440 --> 00:52:18,560
Speaker 1: and it's it is just about like all the feelings

946
00:52:18,560 --> 00:52:22,080
Speaker 1: that it invokes. Because you have like tons of crucifixes

947
00:52:22,120 --> 00:52:26,280
Speaker 1: on the wall, so it's like holiness established religion, Catholicism.

948
00:52:26,800 --> 00:52:28,920
Speaker 1: You have all the candles as well as part of

949
00:52:28,920 --> 00:52:34,879
Speaker 1: this like sacred scene that you're greeted with. But then

950
00:52:34,920 --> 00:52:39,760
Speaker 1: in the center this unholy cylinder, a swirling with green

951
00:52:40,040 --> 00:52:44,560
Speaker 1: liquid slime or energy that's dripping in corrosion. And next

952
00:52:44,560 --> 00:52:47,279
Speaker 1: to it you have computer equipment with that wonderful like

953
00:52:47,440 --> 00:52:52,200
Speaker 1: black and green screen that you know, sinks nicely with

954
00:52:52,280 --> 00:52:55,640
Speaker 1: the green glow of the cylinder, and so you have

955
00:52:55,719 --> 00:52:58,200
Speaker 1: all the key elements of the picture kind of merged together,

956
00:52:58,360 --> 00:53:03,640
Speaker 1: you know, science, religion, unholy terror from beyond realms that

957
00:53:03,680 --> 00:53:05,520
Speaker 1: can be touched by our sanity, and so forth.

958
00:53:05,800 --> 00:53:08,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, the green screen matching the green of the ouze

959
00:53:08,440 --> 00:53:12,520
Speaker 3: almost implies that the essence of the devil is already

960
00:53:12,600 --> 00:53:14,440
Speaker 3: in what makes the computer work.

961
00:53:15,040 --> 00:53:17,279
Speaker 1: You know, it's probably too late for this year, but

962
00:53:17,320 --> 00:53:21,440
Speaker 1: if you need a head start on next year's Halloween costume,

963
00:53:22,000 --> 00:53:25,160
Speaker 1: somebody please dresses the cylinder of green liquid from Prince

964
00:53:25,239 --> 00:53:28,320
Speaker 1: of Darkness. You can just be straight up the cylinder

965
00:53:28,400 --> 00:53:30,160
Speaker 1: from Prince of Darkness, or you could be the sexy

966
00:53:30,200 --> 00:53:32,920
Speaker 1: cylinder from Prince of Darkness. You could be this is

967
00:53:32,960 --> 00:53:36,640
Speaker 1: a great toddler outfit as well, So please somebody make

968
00:53:36,719 --> 00:53:39,359
Speaker 1: this happen and send us photographs.

969
00:53:40,000 --> 00:53:42,920
Speaker 3: All my favorite Halloween costume ideas are things that nobody

970
00:53:42,960 --> 00:53:43,399
Speaker 3: would get.

971
00:53:45,000 --> 00:53:47,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, this one would pre one of those where I

972
00:53:47,920 --> 00:53:50,319
Speaker 1: would get really excited about it and then nobody would

973
00:53:50,320 --> 00:53:52,000
Speaker 1: guess it. Like maybe it would be like, are you

974
00:53:52,040 --> 00:53:54,640
Speaker 1: the ooze from Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles? And I'd be

975
00:53:54,800 --> 00:53:56,480
Speaker 1: just like, yeah, fine, that's what.

976
00:53:56,480 --> 00:54:00,360
Speaker 3: I There's a line about this later in the movie

977
00:54:00,400 --> 00:54:03,840
Speaker 3: that Victor Wong says that made me laugh, where he's

978
00:54:03,880 --> 00:54:06,000
Speaker 3: talking about the devil and he's like, there could be

979
00:54:06,040 --> 00:54:08,000
Speaker 3: a limit as to what he can do as a

980
00:54:08,080 --> 00:54:09,080
Speaker 3: volume of liquid.

981
00:54:11,000 --> 00:54:12,480
Speaker 1: That's true. He's got to he's got to get out

982
00:54:12,520 --> 00:54:12,759
Speaker 1: of there.

983
00:54:13,120 --> 00:54:13,719
Speaker 3: Yeah.

984
00:54:13,760 --> 00:54:13,960
Speaker 1: You know.

985
00:54:14,040 --> 00:54:16,160
Speaker 3: Another bit of imagery here that I would like to

986
00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:19,239
Speaker 3: point to rob is on the walls in this room

987
00:54:19,239 --> 00:54:22,960
Speaker 3: with all the candles. There's also this swarm of crucifixes,

988
00:54:23,239 --> 00:54:27,640
Speaker 3: multiplicity of apotropaic crucifixes, which kind of reminds me of

989
00:54:27,960 --> 00:54:28,880
Speaker 3: in the Mouth of Madness.

990
00:54:28,920 --> 00:54:33,680
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, in the padded cell that the John Trent

991
00:54:33,800 --> 00:54:37,120
Speaker 1: occupies in that picture. Yeah, he's he's put he's drawn

992
00:54:37,200 --> 00:54:41,640
Speaker 1: crucifixes over everything and also all over his his clothing

993
00:54:41,719 --> 00:54:44,680
Speaker 1: and over himself. I'm speaking of Halloween costumes. I did

994
00:54:44,800 --> 00:54:48,759
Speaker 1: dresses him for Halloween one year, and virtually nobody got it.

995
00:54:49,080 --> 00:54:51,880
Speaker 1: I got it, You got it, Yes, a few people

996
00:54:51,920 --> 00:54:54,239
Speaker 1: got it. But when I just walk around on the street,

997
00:54:54,280 --> 00:54:57,200
Speaker 1: people are like, huh, I guess he likes Jesus and

998
00:54:57,400 --> 00:54:57,640
Speaker 1: was No.

999
00:54:58,280 --> 00:55:00,360
Speaker 3: We ran into you guys at the Halloween for and

1000
00:55:00,400 --> 00:55:02,239
Speaker 3: I got I think that was Was that the year

1001
00:55:02,360 --> 00:55:04,680
Speaker 3: that Rachel and I were dressed up as Jack and

1002
00:55:04,680 --> 00:55:05,440
Speaker 3: Wendy Torrence?

1003
00:55:05,640 --> 00:55:08,640
Speaker 1: Yes, I believe. So yeah, yeah, some people got the

1004
00:55:08,640 --> 00:55:10,000
Speaker 1: people who got it loved it.

1005
00:55:10,040 --> 00:55:11,600
Speaker 3: Only some people got that one as well.

1006
00:55:11,920 --> 00:55:15,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, but it is a great part of the scene.

1007
00:55:15,480 --> 00:55:17,439
Speaker 1: It's kind of like this idea that this is how

1008
00:55:17,520 --> 00:55:20,880
Speaker 1: much just insistent faith has We've had to muster to

1009
00:55:20,960 --> 00:55:23,719
Speaker 1: keep this thing in check for so long, and it

1010
00:55:23,840 --> 00:55:29,040
Speaker 1: no longer is working. The fail safes are failing, and

1011
00:55:29,360 --> 00:55:32,040
Speaker 1: stuff is beginning to corrode and leak out.

1012
00:55:32,520 --> 00:55:37,640
Speaker 3: Yeah. So right next to this volume of liquid there

1013
00:55:37,760 --> 00:55:41,239
Speaker 3: is a huge ancient book on a lectern, So, like,

1014
00:55:41,360 --> 00:55:43,400
Speaker 3: what is this book? Is it the Diary of the

1015
00:55:43,480 --> 00:55:46,319
Speaker 3: Keepers of the Ooze? I think the answer is yes, Yes,

1016
00:55:46,360 --> 00:55:49,040
Speaker 3: that is what it is. It's it's this extremely old

1017
00:55:49,120 --> 00:55:52,160
Speaker 3: tome written in many different languages. They say it's full

1018
00:55:52,160 --> 00:55:55,840
Speaker 3: of over writing and emendation, attempts to erase certain parts.

1019
00:55:56,560 --> 00:56:00,399
Speaker 3: And so the professor is asking what is it, and

1020
00:56:00,520 --> 00:56:03,000
Speaker 3: Donald Pleasant says, it's a secret that can no longer

1021
00:56:03,040 --> 00:56:05,439
Speaker 3: be kept. Do you feel it? It was never here

1022
00:56:05,520 --> 00:56:08,400
Speaker 3: before it started a month ago, a change in the

1023
00:56:08,440 --> 00:56:14,360
Speaker 3: Earth and the sky his power. Okay, so that's the religion.

1024
00:56:14,360 --> 00:56:16,319
Speaker 3: But we got to check back in with the science again.

1025
00:56:17,160 --> 00:56:19,520
Speaker 3: So we go back and there's a funny scene between

1026
00:56:19,560 --> 00:56:22,560
Speaker 3: Lisa Blount and Dennis Dunn where they are walking across

1027
00:56:22,600 --> 00:56:26,919
Speaker 3: campus and they're talking. They're wrestling with the weird implications

1028
00:56:26,920 --> 00:56:30,400
Speaker 3: of the quantum mechanics they're studying. Specifically, they're talking about

1029
00:56:31,200 --> 00:56:35,440
Speaker 3: Shredinger's cat. Now, note that this is one of the

1030
00:56:35,800 --> 00:56:39,200
Speaker 3: mini pop invocations of quantum physics that just takes the

1031
00:56:39,239 --> 00:56:42,879
Speaker 3: Copenhagen interpretation as a given. It is not the only interpretation,

1032
00:56:43,040 --> 00:56:45,839
Speaker 3: so you don't have to go with that. But they're

1033
00:56:45,880 --> 00:56:48,200
Speaker 3: talking about, like, wait, why am I even studying this?

1034
00:56:48,320 --> 00:56:51,200
Speaker 3: And one of them makes the joke says, particle beam

1035
00:56:51,239 --> 00:56:55,640
Speaker 3: weapons research grants being a millionaire by the time I'm forty. Ah, yeah,

1036
00:56:55,680 --> 00:56:58,120
Speaker 3: that's what it is. And again I was like, is

1037
00:56:58,160 --> 00:57:01,000
Speaker 3: that a normal outlook for physics grad students?

1038
00:57:01,360 --> 00:57:03,759
Speaker 1: I don't know. That's how Walter sees it.

1039
00:57:04,080 --> 00:57:07,080
Speaker 3: Okay, that's right. I mean he's at least a maybe

1040
00:57:07,120 --> 00:57:10,719
Speaker 3: he's a he's joking, he's a jokester. But so they

1041
00:57:11,160 --> 00:57:14,120
Speaker 3: find that a group of they go to class to

1042
00:57:14,280 --> 00:57:17,280
Speaker 3: find like a posted note that indicates a number of

1043
00:57:17,320 --> 00:57:20,760
Speaker 3: physics grad students have been recruited by Professor Barack for

1044
00:57:20,840 --> 00:57:23,640
Speaker 3: a special project that's going to take their take up

1045
00:57:23,640 --> 00:57:26,720
Speaker 3: their weekend, So all their weekend plans are canceled now.

1046
00:57:27,960 --> 00:57:31,400
Speaker 3: And this leads to scenes where Catherine and Brian are

1047
00:57:31,440 --> 00:57:33,800
Speaker 3: getting to know one another better as well. So remember

1048
00:57:33,840 --> 00:57:35,880
Speaker 3: Brian is sort of the tom Atkins guy, he's the

1049
00:57:36,160 --> 00:57:40,520
Speaker 3: blonde mustache, and they're talking about the counterintuitiveness of quantum

1050
00:57:40,560 --> 00:57:44,440
Speaker 3: mechanics and Catherine says, I want the clockwork back, and

1051
00:57:44,480 --> 00:57:47,400
Speaker 3: then Brian goes on to make a sexist comment about

1052
00:57:47,440 --> 00:57:50,600
Speaker 3: how women as beautiful as her don't usually work in

1053
00:57:50,640 --> 00:57:53,960
Speaker 3: physics departments, and she reacts bluntly. She's like, that is

1054
00:57:54,000 --> 00:57:56,720
Speaker 3: a stupid and sexist thing to say, and then he

1055
00:57:56,760 --> 00:57:59,040
Speaker 3: goes for the classic Oh, I was just joking, don't

1056
00:57:59,080 --> 00:58:02,720
Speaker 3: get offended, and then she's the one who apologizes to him.

1057
00:58:02,800 --> 00:58:05,600
Speaker 3: I can't believe he got away with that one. Also,

1058
00:58:05,680 --> 00:58:08,160
Speaker 3: if it's the joke, what's the funny part. It didn't

1059
00:58:08,160 --> 00:58:09,280
Speaker 3: seem like a joke anyway.

1060
00:58:09,600 --> 00:58:11,960
Speaker 1: He's not the funny one. Walter's the funny one, though

1061
00:58:11,960 --> 00:58:14,480
Speaker 1: he makes some bad jokes too, but at least there's

1062
00:58:14,600 --> 00:58:15,560
Speaker 1: charm in the delivery.

1063
00:58:15,840 --> 00:58:19,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, but then he sort of at least euphemistically apologizes

1064
00:58:20,000 --> 00:58:22,480
Speaker 3: by saying something like, you know, this wasn't the way

1065
00:58:22,480 --> 00:58:25,640
Speaker 3: I'm in for our conversation to go, and all eventually

1066
00:58:25,680 --> 00:58:28,400
Speaker 3: gets smoothed over because it does seem that they like

1067
00:58:28,440 --> 00:58:30,760
Speaker 3: one another and they end up agreeing to go on

1068
00:58:30,800 --> 00:58:33,560
Speaker 3: a date later. But I think there is something kind

1069
00:58:33,560 --> 00:58:38,400
Speaker 3: of revealed about Catherine's character here in that, like, they

1070
00:58:38,400 --> 00:58:40,720
Speaker 3: have this little tense moment, and it seems to me

1071
00:58:40,880 --> 00:58:43,400
Speaker 3: she's in the right, like what he said was dumb,

1072
00:58:43,880 --> 00:58:46,760
Speaker 3: and then she's the one who ends up apologizing. So

1073
00:58:46,800 --> 00:58:49,280
Speaker 3: it seems like it's something about her character here that,

1074
00:58:49,280 --> 00:58:52,680
Speaker 3: at least at the beginning of the story, she's capitulating

1075
00:58:52,720 --> 00:58:53,720
Speaker 3: when she doesn't need to.

1076
00:58:54,600 --> 00:58:56,840
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, it is interesting to think about this scene

1077
00:58:56,920 --> 00:59:00,560
Speaker 1: in terms of the ultimate trajectory for both of these characters.

1078
00:59:00,800 --> 00:59:11,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, we do get a scene of like a briefing

1079
00:59:11,280 --> 00:59:14,160
Speaker 3: from Professor Barack in front of the grad students where

1080
00:59:14,640 --> 00:59:17,160
Speaker 3: we learn that okay, you've all been drafted to become

1081
00:59:17,280 --> 00:59:21,080
Speaker 3: live in researchers for a special project at this abandoned church.

1082
00:59:21,400 --> 00:59:23,280
Speaker 3: They're all going to go to Saint Goddard's and live

1083
00:59:23,360 --> 00:59:26,240
Speaker 3: there at least for the weekend to do research. They

1084
00:59:26,280 --> 00:59:28,920
Speaker 3: will receive class credit, and he can't tell them what

1085
00:59:28,960 --> 00:59:32,360
Speaker 3: they're going to be researching. So we go on to

1086
00:59:32,360 --> 00:59:36,160
Speaker 3: see Professor Barack arriving at the church to begin the project.

1087
00:59:36,200 --> 00:59:38,240
Speaker 3: And when he gets there, he he looks down the

1088
00:59:38,280 --> 00:59:41,440
Speaker 3: sidewalk and he sees a woman standing in the distance

1089
00:59:41,520 --> 00:59:43,680
Speaker 3: as if in a trance, looking up at the sun,

1090
00:59:44,120 --> 00:59:46,920
Speaker 3: and she has ants crawling on her face. And this

1091
00:59:47,000 --> 00:59:50,480
Speaker 3: will become the beginning of a theme where we see

1092
00:59:50,520 --> 00:59:52,880
Speaker 3: a lot of visions like this. I'll explain more as

1093
00:59:52,880 --> 00:59:56,560
Speaker 3: we go along. But we also get a conversation between

1094
00:59:56,640 --> 01:00:01,560
Speaker 3: Barack and the priest played by Donald Pleasants where they're

1095
01:00:01,560 --> 01:00:05,200
Speaker 3: talking about like what all of this means, and Donald

1096
01:00:05,200 --> 01:00:07,840
Speaker 3: Pleasant says that they must translate the book of the

1097
01:00:07,920 --> 01:00:11,880
Speaker 3: Brotherhood of Sleep and Barack must quote prove it scientifically,

1098
01:00:12,200 --> 01:00:15,320
Speaker 3: prove what they don't say yet. But as the weekend approaches,

1099
01:00:15,360 --> 01:00:19,040
Speaker 3: we get a few storylines further developing. So Brian and

1100
01:00:19,080 --> 01:00:21,880
Speaker 3: Catherine's romance deepens, they go on a date, they get

1101
01:00:21,880 --> 01:00:23,840
Speaker 3: to know each other better, and they appear to be

1102
01:00:23,880 --> 01:00:26,720
Speaker 3: falling in love. But at the same time as that

1103
01:00:26,880 --> 01:00:30,640
Speaker 3: sort of positive storyline is developing, there's a negative one too.

1104
01:00:31,040 --> 01:00:34,600
Speaker 3: We get more ominous signs from the atmosphere, something about

1105
01:00:34,600 --> 01:00:38,520
Speaker 3: the sunshine feels wrong and hostile. And then around Saint

1106
01:00:38,520 --> 01:00:42,439
Speaker 3: Goddard's people begin to gather. There is like a conclave

1107
01:00:42,600 --> 01:00:47,120
Speaker 3: of silent entrance to drifters, led by a disheveled Alice Cooper,

1108
01:00:47,680 --> 01:00:50,640
Speaker 3: and they wander slowly around the streets and the alleys

1109
01:00:50,680 --> 01:00:53,800
Speaker 3: around the church, sometimes staring up at the sun, sometimes

1110
01:00:53,840 --> 01:00:57,160
Speaker 3: staring down at the ground, maybe looking at insects, and

1111
01:00:57,560 --> 01:01:00,160
Speaker 3: one of them at one point approaches Donald Plum and

1112
01:01:00,240 --> 01:01:03,200
Speaker 3: says he's entering the building, and she says, it's so

1113
01:01:03,440 --> 01:01:07,600
Speaker 3: wonderful what you're doing, father, opening the church again. And

1114
01:01:07,640 --> 01:01:10,040
Speaker 3: then Donald Pleasance looks down and sees that she is

1115
01:01:10,080 --> 01:01:12,520
Speaker 3: holding like a coffee cup full of maggots.

1116
01:01:14,200 --> 01:01:16,960
Speaker 1: The bug wrangler really just did have. They had a

1117
01:01:17,000 --> 01:01:22,160
Speaker 1: lot to do on this picture. Maggots, beatles, earthworms, you

1118
01:01:22,240 --> 01:01:23,640
Speaker 1: name it, ants.

1119
01:01:24,040 --> 01:01:27,800
Speaker 3: Yes, So the students and professors arrive and begin their

1120
01:01:27,800 --> 01:01:31,280
Speaker 3: weekend of work. They unload their equipment and introduce themselves.

1121
01:01:31,320 --> 01:01:33,400
Speaker 3: So it's not only people from the physics department, but

1122
01:01:33,440 --> 01:01:38,440
Speaker 3: also biochemists to microbiologists, theologians, and classicists. To translate the book,

1123
01:01:38,560 --> 01:01:40,520
Speaker 3: there are a lot of characters. As we said earlier,

1124
01:01:40,760 --> 01:01:43,000
Speaker 3: we can't really spend time talking about all of them,

1125
01:01:43,400 --> 01:01:45,960
Speaker 3: but we'll mention a few individuals as we go along

1126
01:01:46,000 --> 01:01:49,120
Speaker 3: for certain scenes. One thing that often bugs me in

1127
01:01:49,200 --> 01:01:51,800
Speaker 3: storytelling does happen here. Doesn't bug me as much here

1128
01:01:51,840 --> 01:01:55,720
Speaker 3: as it often does, but it's that situation where, like,

1129
01:01:56,000 --> 01:01:59,880
Speaker 3: many specialists are assembled for a project or mission, but

1130
01:02:00,080 --> 01:02:02,200
Speaker 3: they are not told what it's about or what they're

1131
01:02:02,240 --> 01:02:05,520
Speaker 3: going to be doing until after they get there. So like,

1132
01:02:05,600 --> 01:02:08,120
Speaker 3: in this situation, it's like, why did they agree to

1133
01:02:08,120 --> 01:02:11,760
Speaker 3: do it in the first place. It often feels implausible.

1134
01:02:12,080 --> 01:02:14,240
Speaker 3: So we get those kind of scenes where the characters

1135
01:02:14,360 --> 01:02:16,000
Speaker 3: arrive here and they're like, what are we going to

1136
01:02:16,040 --> 01:02:17,920
Speaker 3: be studying? What are we doing? And they're like, I

1137
01:02:17,920 --> 01:02:19,800
Speaker 3: don't know, you know, I'll tell you when I know.

1138
01:02:21,000 --> 01:02:22,920
Speaker 3: I could be wrong, But I seem to recall a

1139
01:02:22,960 --> 01:02:26,840
Speaker 3: particularly egregious example of this in the movie Prometheus, because

1140
01:02:27,680 --> 01:02:29,520
Speaker 3: they do this, but they also they don't get the

1141
01:02:29,560 --> 01:02:32,440
Speaker 3: briefing until they're like literally light years away from Earth.

1142
01:02:33,880 --> 01:02:37,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, I guess I'd cut Promethea some slack personally, because

1143
01:02:38,120 --> 01:02:41,040
Speaker 1: the experts in that film were recruited to board a

1144
01:02:41,120 --> 01:02:44,200
Speaker 1: state of the art exploration space vessel funded by the

1145
01:02:44,200 --> 01:02:47,840
Speaker 1: world's pre eminent innovator and visionary. In Prince of Darkness,

1146
01:02:48,200 --> 01:02:51,240
Speaker 1: a local physics professor has just invited students to sleep

1147
01:02:51,360 --> 01:02:55,320
Speaker 1: in the basement of a condemned church. But I mean,

1148
01:02:55,920 --> 01:02:58,080
Speaker 1: all in all, you know, I guess you have to

1149
01:02:58,120 --> 01:03:00,400
Speaker 1: sort of think of it again from a story telling

1150
01:03:01,400 --> 01:03:04,960
Speaker 1: choice standpoint, and you know, I venture to guess. I

1151
01:03:04,960 --> 01:03:08,120
Speaker 1: don't know for certain on this, but I've ad ventured

1152
01:03:08,160 --> 01:03:10,400
Speaker 1: to guess that this is perhaps a storytelling trope with

1153
01:03:10,480 --> 01:03:14,000
Speaker 1: roots and military movies where the characters are gonna have

1154
01:03:14,400 --> 01:03:18,000
Speaker 1: more limited choice about showing up for that secret mission

1155
01:03:18,040 --> 01:03:21,120
Speaker 1: with that last minute debriefing. Carpenter has always been pretty

1156
01:03:21,120 --> 01:03:23,760
Speaker 1: open about his use of like classic Western structure his

1157
01:03:23,880 --> 01:03:26,880
Speaker 1: inspiration for his film, so I would not be surprised

1158
01:03:26,880 --> 01:03:29,919
Speaker 1: if he and other filmmakers are drawing on stuff like that.

1159
01:03:29,920 --> 01:03:32,280
Speaker 3: That's a good insight. That makes a lot of sense.

1160
01:03:32,480 --> 01:03:36,480
Speaker 3: This works in a military situation because the characters are

1161
01:03:36,480 --> 01:03:38,400
Speaker 3: just supposed to follow orders. They don't have to know

1162
01:03:38,400 --> 01:03:41,080
Speaker 3: what they're gonna do. You know, they're told when they're told.

1163
01:03:41,800 --> 01:03:45,320
Speaker 3: It makes less sense for like movies about scientists or

1164
01:03:45,360 --> 01:03:47,560
Speaker 3: something where normally you would like you would know what

1165
01:03:47,600 --> 01:03:50,040
Speaker 3: you're gonna do before you start doing it. But yeah,

1166
01:03:50,080 --> 01:03:51,840
Speaker 3: that makes a lot of sense to me. So it's

1167
01:03:51,920 --> 01:03:54,600
Speaker 3: just like the same kind of storytelling structure is pourted

1168
01:03:54,640 --> 01:03:57,000
Speaker 3: onto different types of characters and situations.

1169
01:03:57,280 --> 01:04:01,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then all that aside from the standpoint of

1170
01:04:02,040 --> 01:04:05,360
Speaker 1: giving the audience more about you know, providing some exposition,

1171
01:04:05,480 --> 01:04:08,760
Speaker 1: but also some little character moments. A debriefing scene like

1172
01:04:08,800 --> 01:04:11,880
Speaker 1: that can be very useful. You know. Obviously it can

1173
01:04:11,920 --> 01:04:13,840
Speaker 1: work well with characters being like, well, now, why are

1174
01:04:13,880 --> 01:04:17,160
Speaker 1: we here because I'm a doctor and you're a lawyer.

1175
01:04:17,200 --> 01:04:18,760
Speaker 1: What do we possibly have in common?

1176
01:04:19,080 --> 01:04:19,280
Speaker 3: One?

1177
01:04:19,360 --> 01:04:21,480
Speaker 1: Why are we in this church basement? That sort of thing.

1178
01:04:21,880 --> 01:04:24,200
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, totally. I mean it's absolutely clear, like why

1179
01:04:24,240 --> 01:04:27,000
Speaker 3: it happens from a storytelling and efficiency point of view,

1180
01:04:27,040 --> 01:04:29,440
Speaker 3: because it's like you can explain it to the audience

1181
01:04:29,440 --> 01:04:31,280
Speaker 3: at the same time that the characters find out. You

1182
01:04:31,320 --> 01:04:34,160
Speaker 3: can see them react all at once. You can string

1183
01:04:34,200 --> 01:04:37,200
Speaker 3: the mystery or the tension along before that moment of

1184
01:04:37,240 --> 01:04:39,680
Speaker 3: the reveal. What everybody's doing. Yeah, I mean it's clear

1185
01:04:39,720 --> 01:04:42,360
Speaker 3: why it works from from the storyteller's point of view.

1186
01:04:42,400 --> 01:04:44,440
Speaker 3: It's just one of those where like that clashes with

1187
01:04:44,480 --> 01:04:45,280
Speaker 3: the plausibility.

1188
01:04:46,840 --> 01:04:49,919
Speaker 1: All right, so we got the team is assembled, right,

1189
01:04:49,960 --> 01:04:51,960
Speaker 1: and now they're being told what's up.

1190
01:04:52,320 --> 01:04:55,720
Speaker 3: Right, So we're going to start making some discoveries. First

1191
01:04:55,760 --> 01:04:58,400
Speaker 3: of all, there's the character Lisa I mentioned earlier. This

1192
01:04:58,520 --> 01:05:01,920
Speaker 3: is the theology ste udent who studies ancient languages. She

1193
01:05:02,120 --> 01:05:04,800
Speaker 3: just like looks at the Brotherhood of Sleep book. She's like, Okay,

1194
01:05:04,800 --> 01:05:08,960
Speaker 3: I'm gonna start typing out the translation. So she's typing

1195
01:05:09,000 --> 01:05:11,080
Speaker 3: on the computer, and we keep cutting back to her

1196
01:05:11,160 --> 01:05:14,520
Speaker 3: at different times, like seeing the sentences as she types them.

1197
01:05:14,880 --> 01:05:18,280
Speaker 3: They're things like, I Jesus have sent mine angel to

1198
01:05:18,360 --> 01:05:21,920
Speaker 3: testify unto you this thing which shall be unleashed, and

1199
01:05:22,000 --> 01:05:25,360
Speaker 3: the Prince of Darkness was himself sealed that old life

1200
01:05:25,400 --> 01:05:28,440
Speaker 3: called the Devil and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world.

1201
01:05:29,160 --> 01:05:33,040
Speaker 3: So kind of biblical type stuff, except it's interesting. This

1202
01:05:33,320 --> 01:05:37,400
Speaker 3: text seems to have a quality that none of the

1203
01:05:37,760 --> 01:05:41,360
Speaker 3: canonical texts of the Bible have, which is it claims

1204
01:05:41,400 --> 01:05:45,120
Speaker 3: to be written by Jesus. You know in the Bible,

1205
01:05:45,160 --> 01:05:47,440
Speaker 3: we don't have that. We only hear about Jesus from others.

1206
01:05:47,800 --> 01:05:51,040
Speaker 3: That's kind of interesting, So this would be all read text. Yeah,

1207
01:05:51,080 --> 01:05:55,040
Speaker 3: I guess so. So the team all they gather in

1208
01:05:55,080 --> 01:05:58,160
Speaker 3: the basement and they're finally shown the cylinder of green goo.

1209
01:05:58,440 --> 01:06:01,440
Speaker 3: So it's like swirling around really good in the cylinder.

1210
01:06:01,480 --> 01:06:04,880
Speaker 3: They're watching it churn and Donald Pleasant says, I can

1211
01:06:04,920 --> 01:06:08,080
Speaker 3: feel it getting stronger. And some of the scientists are

1212
01:06:08,120 --> 01:06:11,240
Speaker 3: not amused. They're like, wait a minute, we're here for what,

1213
01:06:11,920 --> 01:06:14,320
Speaker 3: and they think it's a waste of their time. Others

1214
01:06:14,360 --> 01:06:17,680
Speaker 3: are more interested. But as the research begins, we get

1215
01:06:18,040 --> 01:06:21,480
Speaker 3: different scenes where like findings emerge. So I'm going to

1216
01:06:21,640 --> 01:06:25,560
Speaker 3: list off some of the things they discover. First of all,

1217
01:06:25,880 --> 01:06:29,280
Speaker 3: they discovered the ancient book describes a long series of

1218
01:06:29,480 --> 01:06:34,600
Speaker 3: differential equations mathematical instruments that had not been invented at

1219
01:06:34,600 --> 01:06:36,960
Speaker 3: the time the book was written, So huh, how is

1220
01:06:37,000 --> 01:06:40,600
Speaker 3: that possible. They also find that the lid on the

1221
01:06:40,640 --> 01:06:44,440
Speaker 3: cylinder is sealed shut with a strange locking mechanism so

1222
01:06:44,520 --> 01:06:47,680
Speaker 3: that it can only be opened from the inside, and

1223
01:06:47,760 --> 01:06:50,880
Speaker 3: the corrosion on the lid is carbon dated to seven

1224
01:06:50,960 --> 01:06:54,200
Speaker 3: million years ago. By the way, just pedantic note. Carbon

1225
01:06:54,240 --> 01:06:56,560
Speaker 3: dating is not useful for things that old. You would

1226
01:06:56,600 --> 01:07:00,360
Speaker 3: need to use a different radiometric method for that. Is

1227
01:07:00,480 --> 01:07:03,600
Speaker 3: inside the cylinder, what is it? What is the green goo? Well,

1228
01:07:03,680 --> 01:07:07,680
Speaker 3: they do some tests and Brian reports to Barak. He says, quote,

1229
01:07:08,080 --> 01:07:11,800
Speaker 3: a life form is growing out of prebiotic fluids. It's

1230
01:07:11,840 --> 01:07:17,720
Speaker 3: not winding down into disorder. It's self organizing. It's becoming something.

1231
01:07:18,280 --> 01:07:21,920
Speaker 3: What that This is one of those where I'm like, Okay,

1232
01:07:22,000 --> 01:07:24,840
Speaker 3: I don't know how what did they detect? What tests

1233
01:07:24,960 --> 01:07:26,240
Speaker 3: did they do to determine that?

1234
01:07:26,960 --> 01:07:31,720
Speaker 1: Well, you know, yeah, it's it's it's it's technobabble. But yeah,

1235
01:07:31,800 --> 01:07:33,880
Speaker 1: the important thing is we know there's something growing inside

1236
01:07:33,920 --> 01:07:36,240
Speaker 1: this cylinder that can only be open from the inside.

1237
01:07:36,360 --> 01:07:38,520
Speaker 3: But if they can't they can't get inside the cylinder.

1238
01:07:38,520 --> 01:07:43,520
Speaker 3: How did they test it? Hm, well, okay, I'm not complaining.

1239
01:07:43,600 --> 01:07:44,400
Speaker 3: I'm just saying, like.

1240
01:07:44,440 --> 01:07:47,400
Speaker 1: There are some containment issues going on as well. See.

1241
01:07:48,080 --> 01:07:50,040
Speaker 3: I think this is a great example of what I

1242
01:07:50,080 --> 01:07:52,840
Speaker 3: was saying earlier that I think the science stuff in

1243
01:07:52,880 --> 01:07:56,240
Speaker 3: this movie it works. I think it works great if

1244
01:07:56,280 --> 01:07:58,880
Speaker 3: you don't pay too close attention, If you just take

1245
01:07:58,920 --> 01:08:02,320
Speaker 3: it esthetically and you don't try to like analyze it substantively.

1246
01:08:02,760 --> 01:08:05,760
Speaker 3: If you just like let it happen as an aesthetic experience,

1247
01:08:05,800 --> 01:08:06,520
Speaker 3: it's beautiful.

1248
01:08:06,800 --> 01:08:10,520
Speaker 1: Yeah. Also, trust scientists, Joe, trust them, they're professionals.

1249
01:08:11,440 --> 01:08:13,479
Speaker 3: Somewhere in here we get the scene where one dude

1250
01:08:13,480 --> 01:08:16,880
Speaker 3: tries to leave the church at night. Oh, this is

1251
01:08:16,920 --> 01:08:19,120
Speaker 3: the guy who's going to get stabbed with a bicycle

1252
01:08:19,200 --> 01:08:22,880
Speaker 3: by Alice Cooper. And he finds a crucified pigeon in

1253
01:08:22,920 --> 01:08:25,280
Speaker 3: the alley when he's going out, So that's not a

1254
01:08:25,280 --> 01:08:28,360
Speaker 3: good sign. That's never good. And then he like runs

1255
01:08:28,400 --> 01:08:30,559
Speaker 3: into Alice Cooper in the alley and and all of

1256
01:08:30,600 --> 01:08:33,000
Speaker 3: his and all of his band you know, they're they're

1257
01:08:33,000 --> 01:08:35,000
Speaker 3: hanging out down there, and he gets he gets impaled

1258
01:08:35,000 --> 01:08:38,240
Speaker 3: with the bicycle. Uh, and nobody seems to notice this.

1259
01:08:38,240 --> 01:08:40,639
Speaker 3: This just like happens off to the side while nobody's looking.

1260
01:08:41,800 --> 01:08:46,120
Speaker 3: And then finally we get a scene where Lisa reveals

1261
01:08:46,280 --> 01:08:49,800
Speaker 3: the translation of the book and sort of summarizes its

1262
01:08:49,880 --> 01:08:50,720
Speaker 3: main teachings.

1263
01:08:51,479 --> 01:08:54,000
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, we got we got a real doozy come

1264
01:08:54,040 --> 01:08:54,720
Speaker 1: in here.

1265
01:08:54,680 --> 01:08:57,840
Speaker 3: Are you ready? Obviously we've had lots of spoilers so far,

1266
01:08:57,880 --> 01:08:59,800
Speaker 3: but like if you know, if you don't want to

1267
01:08:59,800 --> 01:09:02,320
Speaker 3: have everything spoiled, you could stop now and watch the

1268
01:09:02,360 --> 01:09:05,080
Speaker 3: movie yourself. But here we go. This is like the

1269
01:09:05,080 --> 01:09:08,040
Speaker 3: big reveal, she says, And this is a quote with

1270
01:09:08,080 --> 01:09:11,719
Speaker 3: some abridgments. The container was buried somewhere in the Middle

1271
01:09:11,720 --> 01:09:16,639
Speaker 3: East eons ago by the father of Satan, a god

1272
01:09:16,720 --> 01:09:20,200
Speaker 3: who once walked the earth before man, but was somehow

1273
01:09:20,280 --> 01:09:24,680
Speaker 3: banished to the dark side. Apparently the father buried his

1274
01:09:24,920 --> 01:09:29,280
Speaker 3: son inside the container. Now later on here Christ comes

1275
01:09:29,320 --> 01:09:33,960
Speaker 3: to warn us he was of extraterrestrial ancestry, but a

1276
01:09:34,040 --> 01:09:38,360
Speaker 3: human like race. Finally, they determine Christ as crazy, but

1277
01:09:38,439 --> 01:09:41,640
Speaker 3: he's gaining power, converting a lot of people to his beliefs,

1278
01:09:41,720 --> 01:09:45,040
Speaker 3: so they kill him. But his disciples keep the secret

1279
01:09:45,080 --> 01:09:48,760
Speaker 3: and hide it from civilization until man could develop a

1280
01:09:48,840 --> 01:09:53,679
Speaker 3: science sophisticated enough to prove what Christ was saying. And

1281
01:09:53,720 --> 01:09:56,479
Speaker 3: then Donald Pleasance goes on to surmise from that that

1282
01:09:56,520 --> 01:09:59,679
Speaker 3: the Church kept this a secret for the last two millennia,

1283
01:10:00,120 --> 01:10:03,680
Speaker 3: thinking it better to characterize evil as an abstract spiritual

1284
01:10:03,760 --> 01:10:07,800
Speaker 3: force rather than as a volume of liquid buried in

1285
01:10:07,840 --> 01:10:12,400
Speaker 3: a jar. But I, oh, my God, I love this reveal.

1286
01:10:12,479 --> 01:10:16,720
Speaker 3: So the idea is that all of Christian history is

1287
01:10:16,760 --> 01:10:20,200
Speaker 3: sort of a facade to cover up the reality, which

1288
01:10:20,280 --> 01:10:23,400
Speaker 3: is that Jesus was an alien who came to warn

1289
01:10:23,520 --> 01:10:26,719
Speaker 3: us that the father of the Devil buried his son

1290
01:10:26,840 --> 01:10:29,920
Speaker 3: the Devil, which is a jar of liquid in the

1291
01:10:29,920 --> 01:10:33,439
Speaker 3: desert somewhere and it's been hiding there and we have

1292
01:10:33,520 --> 01:10:34,519
Speaker 3: to watch out for it.

1293
01:10:35,120 --> 01:10:40,840
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, it's essentially Christianity, if not organized, religion as

1294
01:10:40,880 --> 01:10:44,519
Speaker 1: a whole is just a placeholder. It's a band aid

1295
01:10:44,920 --> 01:10:47,759
Speaker 1: until science can reach the point where we can actually

1296
01:10:47,800 --> 01:10:50,439
Speaker 1: tackle the problem. And you know, now that I say

1297
01:10:50,479 --> 01:10:52,719
Speaker 1: it out loud, there are a lot of interesting ways

1298
01:10:52,800 --> 01:10:57,240
Speaker 1: to take that apart and look at it. So yeah,

1299
01:10:58,360 --> 01:11:00,120
Speaker 1: I like the way it hits in this picture though.

1300
01:11:00,280 --> 01:11:05,080
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, oh another funny like report on findings scene.

1301
01:11:05,600 --> 01:11:07,320
Speaker 3: This is one of those like how did they figure

1302
01:11:07,360 --> 01:11:11,360
Speaker 3: that out? Moments Brian discovers that the green goo is

1303
01:11:11,439 --> 01:11:17,240
Speaker 3: one conscious and two capable of telekinesis a little fuzzy

1304
01:11:17,240 --> 01:11:20,519
Speaker 3: on how they detected that with the machines, but they

1305
01:11:20,560 --> 01:11:23,599
Speaker 3: put it together. So at some point we start getting

1306
01:11:23,760 --> 01:11:27,120
Speaker 3: the leaky cylinder and this is where everything really goes haywire.

1307
01:11:27,840 --> 01:11:32,520
Speaker 3: The volume of green goo starts leaking out of the container,

1308
01:11:33,400 --> 01:11:37,280
Speaker 3: and it drips upwards so against gravity and forms a

1309
01:11:37,360 --> 01:11:41,519
Speaker 3: pool on the ceiling of the room. And then Susan Cabot,

1310
01:11:41,760 --> 01:11:44,519
Speaker 3: one of the researchers, notices this. She's like down in

1311
01:11:44,520 --> 01:11:46,040
Speaker 3: the room with it. She sees the pool on the

1312
01:11:46,080 --> 01:11:50,040
Speaker 3: ceiling and then it sprays into her mouth, turning her

1313
01:11:50,080 --> 01:11:53,519
Speaker 3: into a servant of Satan. And this starts a chain

1314
01:11:53,600 --> 01:11:57,000
Speaker 3: reaction where from here Susan goes on to start killing

1315
01:11:57,120 --> 01:12:00,639
Speaker 3: and converting other people in the church. Sometimes she'll snap

1316
01:12:00,720 --> 01:12:04,400
Speaker 3: their necks. Sometimes she will infect them and turn them

1317
01:12:04,400 --> 01:12:07,680
Speaker 3: into new thralls of the Satan fluid, often by like

1318
01:12:08,360 --> 01:12:11,799
Speaker 3: vomiting a jet of fluid out of her mouth into

1319
01:12:11,840 --> 01:12:14,480
Speaker 3: somebody else's mouth and face orifices.

1320
01:12:14,920 --> 01:12:17,679
Speaker 1: And even if she does kill you, you'll still come back

1321
01:12:17,720 --> 01:12:19,439
Speaker 1: and be a servant. Later we see that with next

1322
01:12:19,479 --> 01:12:20,080
Speaker 1: Snap Dude.

1323
01:12:20,360 --> 01:12:23,439
Speaker 3: Yes. And then another type of threat begins, which is

1324
01:12:23,479 --> 01:12:26,280
Speaker 3: the same thing we saw earlier that people who try

1325
01:12:26,320 --> 01:12:29,599
Speaker 3: to leave the church get attacked by the Alice Cooper crew.

1326
01:12:30,560 --> 01:12:32,640
Speaker 3: So a lot of the middle of the movie is

1327
01:12:32,760 --> 01:12:35,840
Speaker 3: like scary scenes like this, people getting attacked by the

1328
01:12:35,960 --> 01:12:39,120
Speaker 3: Satan thralls or by the Alice Cooper crew outside in

1329
01:12:39,200 --> 01:12:41,799
Speaker 3: any particular scary scenes you want to talk about rob.

1330
01:12:41,960 --> 01:12:44,800
Speaker 1: Ooh, any particular scenes. Oh, I mean there's a lot

1331
01:12:44,840 --> 01:12:48,640
Speaker 1: going on here with characters just sort of like you

1332
01:12:49,240 --> 01:12:52,680
Speaker 1: wandering off maybe you know, going outside, even which is

1333
01:12:52,720 --> 01:12:55,960
Speaker 1: extra dangerous, and or taking little naps in which we

1334
01:12:56,040 --> 01:12:59,519
Speaker 1: get the you know, the reveal about the dreams, which

1335
01:12:59,560 --> 01:13:02,080
Speaker 1: we'll get to here. But I'm trying to remember if

1336
01:13:02,120 --> 01:13:04,320
Speaker 1: there was I pretty much any scene in which a

1337
01:13:04,400 --> 01:13:07,439
Speaker 1: character spits a stream of green liquid out of their

1338
01:13:07,439 --> 01:13:12,640
Speaker 1: mouth into another character a character's mouth, I'm generally on

1339
01:13:12,720 --> 01:13:15,639
Speaker 1: board for. Also, any of the sequences with the cylinder

1340
01:13:15,680 --> 01:13:19,200
Speaker 1: are all great, so you know everything's going according to plan.

1341
01:13:19,920 --> 01:13:21,680
Speaker 1: Oh wait, one scene does come to mind. This is

1342
01:13:21,720 --> 01:13:24,320
Speaker 1: not really a scary scene, but there's a scene where

1343
01:13:24,360 --> 01:13:29,880
Speaker 1: Peter Jason's character is moving through like the snack room,

1344
01:13:29,920 --> 01:13:32,479
Speaker 1: the break room, the kitchen or whatever. And I just

1345
01:13:32,760 --> 01:13:36,000
Speaker 1: both times I watched it, I was very captivated by

1346
01:13:36,000 --> 01:13:38,200
Speaker 1: all the things he was grabbing, because I think he

1347
01:13:38,400 --> 01:13:42,080
Speaker 1: had a coffee cup, who's smoking a cigarette, also grabbed

1348
01:13:42,080 --> 01:13:46,000
Speaker 1: two apples and an entire package of oreos, and I

1349
01:13:46,120 --> 01:13:48,519
Speaker 1: was like, this man is going to get down for

1350
01:13:48,600 --> 01:13:51,920
Speaker 1: what is his discipline. I guess he's the microbiologist, a

1351
01:13:52,040 --> 01:13:54,479
Speaker 1: chemist chemist. I think, yeah, this guy's about to do

1352
01:13:54,560 --> 01:13:55,400
Speaker 1: some serious.

1353
01:13:55,160 --> 01:13:59,200
Speaker 3: Chemistry, chemistry with all the package of doughnut, several apples

1354
01:13:59,200 --> 01:14:01,280
Speaker 3: that he's doing tricks with. He's like popping them up

1355
01:14:01,320 --> 01:14:03,519
Speaker 3: in the air and kind of juggling apples while he's

1356
01:14:03,560 --> 01:14:05,880
Speaker 3: smoking and doing kazoo songs with his mouth.

1357
01:14:06,280 --> 01:14:10,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I had noted that. Both times I watch it,

1358
01:14:10,160 --> 01:14:12,880
Speaker 1: I remember that over any actual scares that were happening

1359
01:14:12,960 --> 01:14:14,200
Speaker 1: during this portion of the picture.

1360
01:14:22,840 --> 01:14:26,479
Speaker 3: Oh, there's another great technobabble scene in here where Barak

1361
01:14:26,680 --> 01:14:30,719
Speaker 3: and the priest are talking and the thing, and Barack

1362
01:14:30,800 --> 01:14:35,800
Speaker 3: starts to hypothesize that, Okay, maybe if there is a

1363
01:14:35,960 --> 01:14:39,479
Speaker 3: universal mind, like a god, controlling every single thing in

1364
01:14:39,520 --> 01:14:43,599
Speaker 3: the universe, every the movement of every single subatomic particle.

1365
01:14:44,439 --> 01:14:48,760
Speaker 3: He says, well, every particle has an anti particle. It's

1366
01:14:48,880 --> 01:14:53,240
Speaker 3: mirror image, it's negative side. Maybe this universal mind resides

1367
01:14:53,280 --> 01:14:56,479
Speaker 3: in the mirror image instead of in our universe as

1368
01:14:56,520 --> 01:15:01,040
Speaker 3: we wanted to believe. Maybe he's anti god, bringing darkness

1369
01:15:01,160 --> 01:15:05,240
Speaker 3: instead of light. Once again, I don't know how well

1370
01:15:05,280 --> 01:15:07,639
Speaker 3: that works if you engage too closely with the idea

1371
01:15:07,680 --> 01:15:10,519
Speaker 3: of an anti particle, but as pure aesthetics, it's great.

1372
01:15:10,600 --> 01:15:14,120
Speaker 1: I love this and so that's ultimately the threat here,

1373
01:15:14,240 --> 01:15:16,200
Speaker 1: the threat of the coming of the anti God.

1374
01:15:16,520 --> 01:15:19,479
Speaker 3: Yes, so you mentioned the idea of the dream, and

1375
01:15:19,560 --> 01:15:22,280
Speaker 3: this is one of my favorite things in the whole movie.

1376
01:15:22,720 --> 01:15:26,599
Speaker 3: So what the characters start to discover is that every

1377
01:15:26,600 --> 01:15:29,720
Speaker 3: time someone goes to sleep in this church, they have

1378
01:15:29,800 --> 01:15:33,080
Speaker 3: the same dream. Not just the same dream they had

1379
01:15:33,160 --> 01:15:36,719
Speaker 3: last time. All of the different people have the same dream.

1380
01:15:36,760 --> 01:15:39,800
Speaker 3: They start comparing notes and realizing they're all dreaming the

1381
01:15:39,840 --> 01:15:43,599
Speaker 3: same thing. It's an image of the church seen from

1382
01:15:43,600 --> 01:15:47,800
Speaker 3: outside from outfront, with a figure in shadow emerging from

1383
01:15:47,880 --> 01:15:50,840
Speaker 3: the front doors of the chapel into the daylight, and

1384
01:15:50,880 --> 01:15:55,000
Speaker 3: what sounds like a looping recorded message that begins, this

1385
01:15:55,160 --> 01:15:58,759
Speaker 3: is not a dream, not a dream. We are using

1386
01:15:58,800 --> 01:16:03,200
Speaker 3: your brain's electrical system as a receiver. And ooh, I

1387
01:16:03,200 --> 01:16:06,200
Speaker 3: think of everything in the movie, this was the thing

1388
01:16:06,240 --> 01:16:08,360
Speaker 3: the first time I saw it that got me the hardest.

1389
01:16:08,479 --> 01:16:09,920
Speaker 3: I love this dream.

1390
01:16:10,400 --> 01:16:13,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is pretty great. I'm a sucker for any

1391
01:16:13,960 --> 01:16:19,479
Speaker 1: kind of like at this point, you know, vintage creepy

1392
01:16:20,280 --> 01:16:23,800
Speaker 1: technological transmission stuff like you know, be at the video

1393
01:16:23,880 --> 01:16:29,160
Speaker 1: drone transmission in the original video drone film or be

1394
01:16:29,280 --> 01:16:31,760
Speaker 1: at the Ring video. I'm on board for all of that,

1395
01:16:31,800 --> 01:16:34,320
Speaker 1: and I put this up there with any of those examples.

1396
01:16:34,520 --> 01:16:37,760
Speaker 3: Oh it's so good. So we get different snippets of

1397
01:16:37,800 --> 01:16:40,439
Speaker 3: the recorded message because characters are often woken up in

1398
01:16:40,479 --> 01:16:42,679
Speaker 3: the middle of the dream and they only remember part

1399
01:16:42,680 --> 01:16:45,800
Speaker 3: of the message. But like the beginning is what it says,

1400
01:16:45,880 --> 01:16:47,679
Speaker 3: this is not a dream. Not a dream. We're using

1401
01:16:47,880 --> 01:16:50,559
Speaker 3: your brain's electrical system. And then it says we are

1402
01:16:50,640 --> 01:16:54,439
Speaker 3: unable to transmit through conscious neural interference. You are receiving

1403
01:16:54,439 --> 01:16:57,519
Speaker 3: this broadcast as a dream. We are transmitting from the

1404
01:16:57,600 --> 01:17:02,400
Speaker 3: year one nine nine nine. And then like suddenly, you know,

1405
01:17:02,439 --> 01:17:05,840
Speaker 3: the character will snap awake. And so it turns out

1406
01:17:05,840 --> 01:17:09,920
Speaker 3: what we learn is that the Brotherhood of Sleep has

1407
01:17:09,960 --> 01:17:16,240
Speaker 3: recorded testimony that anyone in close proximity to the church

1408
01:17:16,479 --> 01:17:19,960
Speaker 3: has always had this dream, always has the same dream.

1409
01:17:20,880 --> 01:17:24,559
Speaker 3: And Brian suggests a theory, what if someone is trying

1410
01:17:24,560 --> 01:17:28,160
Speaker 3: to communicate with them, This could be a message beamed

1411
01:17:28,280 --> 01:17:32,760
Speaker 3: into their brains from the future by the emission of tachions,

1412
01:17:32,800 --> 01:17:36,960
Speaker 3: which are hypothetical particles we've never detected directly, but they

1413
01:17:36,960 --> 01:17:40,160
Speaker 3: are proposed to exist that sort of fit with existing

1414
01:17:40,240 --> 01:17:44,639
Speaker 3: models of physics hypothetical particles that always move faster than

1415
01:17:44,640 --> 01:17:48,479
Speaker 3: the speed of light and thus possibly backwards in time.

1416
01:17:49,200 --> 01:17:52,479
Speaker 3: And so the idea is is this is a warning

1417
01:17:52,720 --> 01:17:56,760
Speaker 3: scent from the future to our brains as receiver antennas

1418
01:17:56,800 --> 01:17:59,800
Speaker 3: in the past, and it's an invitation to change the

1419
01:17:59,800 --> 01:18:04,240
Speaker 3: course of history to avert some kind of catastrophic future event.

1420
01:18:05,240 --> 01:18:07,960
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, I love pretty much all the descriptions of

1421
01:18:08,000 --> 01:18:09,479
Speaker 1: this in the film that I think it's later where

1422
01:18:09,479 --> 01:18:12,559
Speaker 1: someone talks about how it's like it's like each time

1423
01:18:12,600 --> 01:18:15,000
Speaker 1: it's more intense in your mind, as if it's growing

1424
01:18:15,080 --> 01:18:18,800
Speaker 1: and pushing other things out of your sleeping mind to

1425
01:18:18,840 --> 01:18:20,080
Speaker 1: make room for itself.

1426
01:18:20,439 --> 01:18:24,000
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, I love that. And so while this is

1427
01:18:24,040 --> 01:18:26,240
Speaker 3: going on, the characters are like learning about the dream

1428
01:18:26,360 --> 01:18:29,759
Speaker 3: and comparing notes about that. We also get Susan running

1429
01:18:29,800 --> 01:18:34,200
Speaker 3: around recruiting minions. So she infects Lisa, who's the one

1430
01:18:34,240 --> 01:18:36,559
Speaker 3: doing the translation of the book of the Brotherhood of Sleep.

1431
01:18:36,600 --> 01:18:39,720
Speaker 3: She vomits satanic juice into her mouth, and then she

1432
01:18:39,760 --> 01:18:43,960
Speaker 3: also recruits Calder, the microbiologist, and so we get that

1433
01:18:44,040 --> 01:18:46,760
Speaker 3: really creepy scene that I love where Lisa is after

1434
01:18:46,880 --> 01:18:50,759
Speaker 3: she's infected. She's sitting at the computer typing, not looking

1435
01:18:50,760 --> 01:18:53,120
Speaker 3: at the screen, and like one of the professors tries to,

1436
01:18:53,439 --> 01:18:56,200
Speaker 3: you know, pop into the door and be like, hey, Lisa,

1437
01:18:56,240 --> 01:18:58,840
Speaker 3: what's going on, But she's just typing over and over.

1438
01:18:59,000 --> 01:19:02,040
Speaker 3: I Live, I Live, I Live. And then later you

1439
01:19:02,080 --> 01:19:04,720
Speaker 3: see her type on the screen. You will not be

1440
01:19:04,760 --> 01:19:07,439
Speaker 3: saved by the Holy Ghost. You will not be saved

1441
01:19:07,479 --> 01:19:11,840
Speaker 3: by the God Plutonium. In fact, you will not be saved.

1442
01:19:13,439 --> 01:19:19,479
Speaker 1: It is interesting that the the Devil, the son of

1443
01:19:19,680 --> 01:19:23,160
Speaker 1: the anti God here as it's communicating with people, its

1444
01:19:23,160 --> 01:19:26,800
Speaker 1: main communications increasingly are kind of taunting. They're kind of like,

1445
01:19:27,120 --> 01:19:28,960
Speaker 1: you got no chance. It's not like you need to

1446
01:19:28,960 --> 01:19:31,280
Speaker 1: fall in line or I can do great things for humanity.

1447
01:19:31,320 --> 01:19:34,360
Speaker 1: It's like it's just saying, hey, I'm bringing doom and

1448
01:19:34,360 --> 01:19:35,479
Speaker 1: there's nothing you can do about it.

1449
01:19:35,800 --> 01:19:38,080
Speaker 3: Yeah. One of the guys who went outside earlier and

1450
01:19:38,520 --> 01:19:41,720
Speaker 3: got killed, he starts calling everybody to the window and

1451
01:19:41,800 --> 01:19:44,519
Speaker 3: he's like standing there in zombie form in the parking

1452
01:19:44,520 --> 01:19:47,160
Speaker 3: lot below, and they're like, hey, what's going on and

1453
01:19:47,240 --> 01:19:50,320
Speaker 3: he just yells at them like pray for death.

1454
01:19:50,200 --> 01:19:53,679
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then collapses into Beetles. Great great scene.

1455
01:19:54,280 --> 01:19:58,000
Speaker 3: So the remaining researchers are increasingly overtly threatened by the

1456
01:19:58,040 --> 01:20:01,400
Speaker 3: servants of Satan, and they start finding themselves like they

1457
01:20:01,479 --> 01:20:04,799
Speaker 3: first they discovered they're barricaded inside the church. The Alice

1458
01:20:04,800 --> 01:20:07,160
Speaker 3: Cooper band has piled up trash and furniture on the

1459
01:20:07,160 --> 01:20:12,479
Speaker 3: doors outside. Calder, who has been possessed by the devil.

1460
01:20:12,600 --> 01:20:15,880
Speaker 3: He like stabs himself with a steak of wood in

1461
01:20:16,240 --> 01:20:19,839
Speaker 3: the throat in front of everyone in a horrifying scene.

1462
01:20:20,080 --> 01:20:23,439
Speaker 3: Susan and Lisa end up bringing the cylinder of goop

1463
01:20:23,560 --> 01:20:25,840
Speaker 3: up from the basement and they take it to a

1464
01:20:25,920 --> 01:20:29,280
Speaker 3: sleeping Kelly where it pools on the ceiling and then

1465
01:20:29,280 --> 01:20:32,439
Speaker 3: it drains down from the ceiling into Kelly's mouth and eyes.

1466
01:20:32,720 --> 01:20:35,719
Speaker 3: So oops. I think Kelly might be the chosen one.

1467
01:20:36,600 --> 01:20:38,599
Speaker 3: And we later learned about like she had a mark

1468
01:20:38,680 --> 01:20:40,599
Speaker 3: on her arm that was growing. She didn't know what

1469
01:20:40,640 --> 01:20:42,960
Speaker 3: it was, but it takes the form of I think

1470
01:20:42,960 --> 01:20:45,240
Speaker 3: they say they call it the magician staff. It's like

1471
01:20:45,280 --> 01:20:48,160
Speaker 3: a symbol that is not good news.

1472
01:20:48,560 --> 01:20:51,240
Speaker 1: I think that Carpenter said they got the symbol from

1473
01:20:51,240 --> 01:20:54,760
Speaker 1: a blue oyster cult alb I mean, and you know

1474
01:20:55,080 --> 01:20:58,720
Speaker 1: it likely has I'm sure it has a history pre

1475
01:20:58,840 --> 01:21:01,800
Speaker 1: dating Blue Oyster Cult, but there you have it.

1476
01:21:02,439 --> 01:21:05,400
Speaker 3: So in the final act we get less reveals about

1477
01:21:05,439 --> 01:21:07,559
Speaker 3: the mythos. You know, it's starting to all kind of

1478
01:21:07,560 --> 01:21:12,080
Speaker 3: come together, but instead it turns into more action and

1479
01:21:12,200 --> 01:21:15,719
Speaker 3: desperate horror. So the final act involves various demon sieges.

1480
01:21:15,760 --> 01:21:18,120
Speaker 3: You mentioned there are elements of the Siege movie to this,

1481
01:21:18,280 --> 01:21:21,240
Speaker 3: as there certainly are, Like the remaining humans get sort

1482
01:21:21,280 --> 01:21:25,160
Speaker 3: of herded into different rooms of the church or defensive positions,

1483
01:21:25,520 --> 01:21:28,280
Speaker 3: like there's one part where the character waltered and it's done.

1484
01:21:28,840 --> 01:21:30,960
Speaker 3: He gets stuck in a closet where he can like

1485
01:21:31,040 --> 01:21:34,120
Speaker 3: look through a sort of a confessional screen out at

1486
01:21:34,360 --> 01:21:37,280
Speaker 3: Kelly as she's being transformed into the host of Satan,

1487
01:21:38,040 --> 01:21:41,200
Speaker 3: and he's like freaked out and his friends are trying

1488
01:21:41,240 --> 01:21:44,200
Speaker 3: to like dig him out through a wall. We also

1489
01:21:44,280 --> 01:21:49,640
Speaker 3: get resurrected versions of the dead scientists. Calder especially is

1490
01:21:49,760 --> 01:21:52,280
Speaker 3: awesome in this form. He's the one who can't stop

1491
01:21:52,400 --> 01:21:56,799
Speaker 3: laughing and he's very creepy. And eventually Kelly gets turned

1492
01:21:56,880 --> 01:22:02,240
Speaker 3: into this absolutely horrifying anti god vessel who is like

1493
01:22:03,080 --> 01:22:06,640
Speaker 3: she's awake and she's got these wide wild eyes like

1494
01:22:06,680 --> 01:22:10,479
Speaker 3: she's thrilled to be in physical form again and just

1495
01:22:10,560 --> 01:22:14,599
Speaker 3: like testing her limits, except she's in Kelly's body. She

1496
01:22:14,680 --> 01:22:18,639
Speaker 3: has Kelly's original body, but with mangled, burned, bloody flesh.

1497
01:22:18,760 --> 01:22:20,280
Speaker 3: Is disgusting to look at.

1498
01:22:20,800 --> 01:22:23,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've always kind of thought about that. This is

1499
01:22:23,840 --> 01:22:25,679
Speaker 1: one of the things I've always noticed about this particular

1500
01:22:25,760 --> 01:22:28,559
Speaker 1: character is that she does the effects here are great,

1501
01:22:28,920 --> 01:22:33,519
Speaker 1: and she looks disgusting, and I feel like it does

1502
01:22:33,560 --> 01:22:35,920
Speaker 1: feel like an intentional choice, like they didn't try to

1503
01:22:36,000 --> 01:22:41,160
Speaker 1: make her like horror cool or horror sexy, you know,

1504
01:22:41,320 --> 01:22:46,080
Speaker 1: like she's supposed to be just this gross, zombified slab

1505
01:22:46,120 --> 01:22:48,960
Speaker 1: of rotting meat. Like the possession is just decaying or

1506
01:22:49,000 --> 01:22:54,519
Speaker 1: flash or something. So it's an interesting look, and especially

1507
01:22:54,560 --> 01:22:58,439
Speaker 1: with the hair remaining pristine. Likes the blonde hair has

1508
01:22:58,479 --> 01:23:02,400
Speaker 1: been untouched by the corruption, but the flesh is all decayed.

1509
01:23:02,400 --> 01:23:04,240
Speaker 1: And yeah, the big eyes steering out of.

1510
01:23:04,240 --> 01:23:09,200
Speaker 3: It, it's tremendously revolting. Yeah. Now, there are actually some

1511
01:23:09,200 --> 01:23:12,640
Speaker 3: more conversations that go on with the remaining human characters.

1512
01:23:14,240 --> 01:23:16,880
Speaker 3: There's one thing where they talk about how they believe.

1513
01:23:16,960 --> 01:23:18,600
Speaker 3: For some reason, I think there was something about this

1514
01:23:18,640 --> 01:23:21,360
Speaker 3: in the Brotherhood of Sleep book that the goal of

1515
01:23:21,400 --> 01:23:25,160
Speaker 3: Satan here is to bring back his father from the

1516
01:23:25,240 --> 01:23:29,160
Speaker 3: dark side. Somehow, his father, the anti god, was banished

1517
01:23:29,360 --> 01:23:33,040
Speaker 3: to the sort of inverse universe, and Satan wants to

1518
01:23:33,080 --> 01:23:37,080
Speaker 3: bring his father back. There's an interesting thing where at

1519
01:23:37,160 --> 01:23:41,200
Speaker 3: multiple times we notice Donald Pleasance reverts to prayers and

1520
01:23:41,240 --> 01:23:43,439
Speaker 3: the Bible, like he's reading from the Bible or saying

1521
01:23:43,520 --> 01:23:47,240
Speaker 3: Christian prayers, like he does this at a short funeral

1522
01:23:47,280 --> 01:23:52,000
Speaker 3: they hold for Calder and he's also praying and reading

1523
01:23:52,040 --> 01:23:54,680
Speaker 3: from some kind of book when he's in danger. And

1524
01:23:54,880 --> 01:23:56,840
Speaker 3: I thought this was interesting in that he's doing this

1525
01:23:56,920 --> 01:24:00,240
Speaker 3: even though he seems to have been convinced earlier that

1526
01:24:00,320 --> 01:24:03,200
Speaker 3: the official doctrine in mythology of the Church is purely

1527
01:24:03,240 --> 01:24:05,720
Speaker 3: a fiction to cover up the truth about Christ as

1528
01:24:05,720 --> 01:24:08,400
Speaker 3: an alien. But it's like he can't give it up.

1529
01:24:08,439 --> 01:24:09,200
Speaker 3: He still needs it.

1530
01:24:09,680 --> 01:24:13,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, when during a stressful situation, you know,

1531
01:24:13,000 --> 01:24:15,599
Speaker 1: what are you going to do? You're gonna fall back

1532
01:24:15,640 --> 01:24:19,160
Speaker 1: on your faith. There previous models of your faith and

1533
01:24:19,160 --> 01:24:19,639
Speaker 1: so forth.

1534
01:24:19,800 --> 01:24:22,519
Speaker 3: It's like he's fully convinced that the metaphysics of his

1535
01:24:22,640 --> 01:24:27,280
Speaker 3: religion are are untrue, but he still needs the act

1536
01:24:27,439 --> 01:24:29,960
Speaker 3: of his religion. He still needs to be able to pray,

1537
01:24:31,400 --> 01:24:34,040
Speaker 3: so there are Again there's the Siege movie aspects that

1538
01:24:34,080 --> 01:24:36,320
Speaker 3: are like fighting off demon attacks on the rooms. There's

1539
01:24:36,320 --> 01:24:38,720
Speaker 3: one part that's funny where the scientists are defending a

1540
01:24:38,800 --> 01:24:42,760
Speaker 3: room against a zombie attack and Professor barak U's is

1541
01:24:42,800 --> 01:24:44,559
Speaker 3: a shaken up soda can as a weapon.

1542
01:24:44,800 --> 01:24:47,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's an astrophysics man. You can't mess with him.

1543
01:24:47,360 --> 01:24:50,920
Speaker 3: I love that. And they're all like they're dodging streams

1544
01:24:50,960 --> 01:24:56,880
Speaker 3: of satan juice vomit while the Satan hosting Kelly oh Man.

1545
01:24:56,960 --> 01:24:59,760
Speaker 3: There's a creepy scene where she starts looking into me,

1546
01:25:00,360 --> 01:25:03,240
Speaker 3: like she finds a little makeup compact and looks into

1547
01:25:03,240 --> 01:25:08,080
Speaker 3: the mirror in it and says, father, it's so creepy.

1548
01:25:08,360 --> 01:25:11,280
Speaker 3: And I like that the mirror she's looking into appears

1549
01:25:11,280 --> 01:25:13,320
Speaker 3: to be showing static like an old TV.

1550
01:25:14,280 --> 01:25:17,160
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, I love the use of mirrors here. Obviously,

1551
01:25:17,200 --> 01:25:19,280
Speaker 1: you know, it's very Alice in Wonderland.

1552
01:25:19,479 --> 01:25:20,840
Speaker 3: Very bores as well.

1553
01:25:21,280 --> 01:25:24,360
Speaker 1: The idea that the mirror is a gateway to the

1554
01:25:24,479 --> 01:25:28,919
Speaker 1: unseen world, to the realm where this ancient being is imprisoned.

1555
01:25:29,000 --> 01:25:30,880
Speaker 1: And it's also kind of interesting to think about this

1556
01:25:30,920 --> 01:25:33,680
Speaker 1: in terms of Okay, you're you're the son of the

1557
01:25:33,720 --> 01:25:37,800
Speaker 1: anti God waking up during the mid nineteen eighties, and

1558
01:25:37,840 --> 01:25:41,439
Speaker 1: you have not been privy to any of human history

1559
01:25:41,520 --> 01:25:43,439
Speaker 1: really at this point, is that correct?

1560
01:25:44,640 --> 01:25:47,040
Speaker 3: So it was buried before, like eons ago?

1561
01:25:47,080 --> 01:25:51,080
Speaker 1: They say, yeah, so you've never seen a mirror, not

1562
01:25:51,240 --> 01:25:52,759
Speaker 1: like this, I mean, the best.

1563
01:25:52,560 --> 01:25:54,400
Speaker 3: You could ever see a human, I guess.

1564
01:25:54,280 --> 01:25:56,839
Speaker 1: Never seen a human. Yeah, never never seen a mirror.

1565
01:25:56,880 --> 01:25:58,720
Speaker 1: I guess the best you could hope for would have

1566
01:25:58,760 --> 01:26:04,479
Speaker 1: been reflection in water. That sort of thing. So very

1567
01:26:04,600 --> 01:26:09,360
Speaker 1: very exciting here for ancient evil entities of venturing into

1568
01:26:09,479 --> 01:26:12,759
Speaker 1: our reality. And you don't even know how big mirrors

1569
01:26:12,800 --> 01:26:15,360
Speaker 1: get become important.

1570
01:26:15,000 --> 01:26:17,960
Speaker 3: That's right. So the first attempt to contact the anti

1571
01:26:18,000 --> 01:26:20,920
Speaker 3: God through the mirror fails, but then Kelly goes to

1572
01:26:21,000 --> 01:26:23,280
Speaker 3: another room, goes to another room with a bigger mirror,

1573
01:26:23,320 --> 01:26:25,040
Speaker 3: and this is the room where Donald Pleasance is like

1574
01:26:25,120 --> 01:26:27,960
Speaker 3: hiding behind a piece of furniture. So she goes up

1575
01:26:28,000 --> 01:26:31,080
Speaker 3: to the mirror and then it starts saying like father,

1576
01:26:31,760 --> 01:26:34,400
Speaker 3: and the mirror fills with light and like, oh we

1577
01:26:34,479 --> 01:26:37,720
Speaker 3: are tuned in now, baby, It's something is happening. She

1578
01:26:37,840 --> 01:26:40,439
Speaker 3: starts reaching in through the mirror. And we see her

1579
01:26:40,520 --> 01:26:44,479
Speaker 3: hand emerging on the other side, and it's an underwater shot,

1580
01:26:44,479 --> 01:26:47,439
Speaker 3: like a hand reaching under the surface of a liquid.

1581
01:26:48,400 --> 01:26:51,400
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, some great effects here with the surface of

1582
01:26:51,439 --> 01:26:54,240
Speaker 1: the mirror that I believe they said the use mercury

1583
01:26:54,320 --> 01:26:57,200
Speaker 1: here to create this effect. So a bit dangerous but

1584
01:26:57,600 --> 01:26:57,960
Speaker 1: worth it.

1585
01:26:58,360 --> 01:27:01,360
Speaker 3: Yeah. So Donald pleas since tries to intervene, Like he

1586
01:27:01,520 --> 01:27:04,160
Speaker 3: chops off the demon Kelly's arm with an axe, but

1587
01:27:04,200 --> 01:27:06,960
Speaker 3: then she immediately grows a new one. Then he chops

1588
01:27:07,000 --> 01:27:09,040
Speaker 3: off her head, but she picks it up and puts

1589
01:27:09,040 --> 01:27:11,559
Speaker 3: it back on. It seems like there's nothing stopping her.

1590
01:27:12,000 --> 01:27:15,679
Speaker 3: But finally, just as she is about to pull her father,

1591
01:27:15,840 --> 01:27:19,440
Speaker 3: the anti god, through the mirror from the other side,

1592
01:27:19,640 --> 01:27:24,320
Speaker 3: Catherine intervenes. So Kelly is like reaching in grasping a

1593
01:27:24,400 --> 01:27:28,000
Speaker 3: shadowy hand on the other side. Catherine sees what's happening.

1594
01:27:28,120 --> 01:27:31,200
Speaker 3: In a moment of clarity, she realizes what's about to

1595
01:27:31,240 --> 01:27:35,120
Speaker 3: take place, and she runs and tackles the satan possessed

1596
01:27:35,200 --> 01:27:40,640
Speaker 3: Kelly tackles her into the mirror, so Catherine also disappears

1597
01:27:40,680 --> 01:27:44,240
Speaker 3: into the mirror, and then Donald pleasant smashes the mirror

1598
01:27:44,479 --> 01:27:45,440
Speaker 3: with his axe.

1599
01:27:45,800 --> 01:27:47,160
Speaker 1: Yeah. Incredible sequence.

1600
01:27:47,479 --> 01:27:49,920
Speaker 3: So this causes sort of it cuts the connection to

1601
01:27:49,920 --> 01:27:53,160
Speaker 3: the demonic power. The zombies all collapse, They fall down dead.

1602
01:27:53,520 --> 01:27:56,280
Speaker 3: Alice Cooper's crew are no longer possessed. They sort of

1603
01:27:56,320 --> 01:27:58,400
Speaker 3: go off mission and then just wander off on their

1604
01:27:58,439 --> 01:28:03,920
Speaker 3: own business. Kelly and Catherine have vanished, Brian, Walter, Barack,

1605
01:28:04,000 --> 01:28:07,479
Speaker 3: and Donald Pleasance have survived. And the next morning we

1606
01:28:07,520 --> 01:28:11,080
Speaker 3: see characters sort of being taken to the hospital or

1607
01:28:11,120 --> 01:28:14,439
Speaker 3: trying to figure out what this all means, and Donald

1608
01:28:14,439 --> 01:28:17,599
Speaker 3: Pleasant says, we stopped it. The future conjured up by

1609
01:28:17,640 --> 01:28:21,639
Speaker 3: that vile serpent. It will not happen now, and Barack says,

1610
01:28:21,680 --> 01:28:24,559
Speaker 3: we're safe, but he's waiting on the other side. She

1611
01:28:24,720 --> 01:28:27,519
Speaker 3: died for us, and so you think it's all over.

1612
01:28:27,680 --> 01:28:31,120
Speaker 3: But then somebody starts having the dream again. We go

1613
01:28:31,280 --> 01:28:34,960
Speaker 3: back to the dream and it turns out it's Brian

1614
01:28:35,080 --> 01:28:38,040
Speaker 3: having the dream, and the recorded message plays and the

1615
01:28:38,120 --> 01:28:40,000
Speaker 3: dark figure begins to come out of the church, and

1616
01:28:40,040 --> 01:28:42,200
Speaker 3: this time we see a part of the message we've

1617
01:28:42,240 --> 01:28:44,559
Speaker 3: never made it to before. We get later and later,

1618
01:28:44,920 --> 01:28:48,160
Speaker 3: and it's revealed that the dark figure coming out of

1619
01:28:48,280 --> 01:28:53,439
Speaker 3: the doors of the church is Catherine, and Brian suddenly

1620
01:28:53,439 --> 01:28:55,680
Speaker 3: wakes up. He wakes from a horrible nightmare. He like

1621
01:28:55,720 --> 01:28:58,880
Speaker 3: imagines that she's lying there, bloodied and mangled in the

1622
01:28:58,920 --> 01:29:01,120
Speaker 3: same way that that ke he was as the host

1623
01:29:01,120 --> 01:29:05,040
Speaker 3: of Satan. But he wakes up and he's alone in

1624
01:29:05,080 --> 01:29:07,639
Speaker 3: his room, in his bed, and then the pulsing music

1625
01:29:07,680 --> 01:29:11,640
Speaker 3: starts again. Something is wrong with the world still, and

1626
01:29:11,680 --> 01:29:14,520
Speaker 3: he looks in the mirror on his wall and slowly

1627
01:29:14,600 --> 01:29:17,840
Speaker 3: he reaches out to touch it, and then cut to credits.

1628
01:29:18,840 --> 01:29:21,599
Speaker 1: Yeah, right, as the music is building too, Like it's

1629
01:29:22,120 --> 01:29:23,879
Speaker 1: so perfect, perfect ending.

1630
01:29:24,080 --> 01:29:28,400
Speaker 3: Love the ending, powerful, so good. So yeah, I love

1631
01:29:28,479 --> 01:29:31,799
Speaker 3: Prince of Darkness. I think it is such a powerfully moody,

1632
01:29:32,000 --> 01:29:37,840
Speaker 3: ominous horror film, just a tremendous menace, and it establishes

1633
01:29:37,880 --> 01:29:41,040
Speaker 3: a tone almost like no other film I can think of.

1634
01:29:41,520 --> 01:29:44,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, and again, so ambitious too, not only in terms of,

1635
01:29:44,760 --> 01:29:47,960
Speaker 1: you know, these themes of quantum mechanics and theology, but

1636
01:29:48,040 --> 01:29:50,760
Speaker 1: also just you know, other choices that Carpenter made in

1637
01:29:50,800 --> 01:29:53,080
Speaker 1: attempting to make a film that stood out from what

1638
01:29:53,160 --> 01:29:55,839
Speaker 1: he perceived as some of the sameness that was present

1639
01:29:55,840 --> 01:29:58,559
Speaker 1: in the horror genre at the time, and honestly, as

1640
01:29:58,760 --> 01:30:03,160
Speaker 1: there's almost always some like swell of sameness in the

1641
01:30:03,200 --> 01:30:06,679
Speaker 1: horror genre at any given point. So kudos to anybody

1642
01:30:06,680 --> 01:30:09,040
Speaker 1: who tries to break through that, to push through that,

1643
01:30:09,920 --> 01:30:13,519
Speaker 1: almost as if like pushing through that mirror right and

1644
01:30:13,560 --> 01:30:15,160
Speaker 1: reaching something on the other side.

1645
01:30:15,840 --> 01:30:18,360
Speaker 3: Here's something I wonder about. I wonder what you think.

1646
01:30:19,080 --> 01:30:22,920
Speaker 3: This movie has strong themes of science and technology. Most

1647
01:30:22,920 --> 01:30:26,120
Speaker 3: of the major characters are scientists. They're doing scientific tests

1648
01:30:26,200 --> 01:30:28,640
Speaker 3: for most of the film. And yet I am not

1649
01:30:28,920 --> 01:30:32,599
Speaker 3: at all tempted to think of this as a science

1650
01:30:32,640 --> 01:30:37,040
Speaker 3: fiction movie. It is definitely horror. Why does my brain

1651
01:30:37,120 --> 01:30:40,240
Speaker 3: subconsciously just classify it that way without a second thought?

1652
01:30:41,080 --> 01:30:46,280
Speaker 1: Hmmm, Yeah, that's a good question. Is is it ultimately

1653
01:30:47,000 --> 01:30:50,240
Speaker 1: any less science fiction than the thing? And yet you know,

1654
01:30:50,479 --> 01:30:54,920
Speaker 1: I'm far far more likely to classify the thing, John Carpenter?

1655
01:30:55,000 --> 01:30:59,040
Speaker 1: Is the thing as sci fi horror? Yeah? I don't know.

1656
01:30:59,120 --> 01:31:01,840
Speaker 1: I don't know exactly what it is. Maybe the degree

1657
01:31:01,880 --> 01:31:07,800
Speaker 1: to which like direct technology is employed. Like nobody like

1658
01:31:07,840 --> 01:31:12,200
Speaker 1: builds a technology technology based trap. Nobody uses a ray

1659
01:31:12,200 --> 01:31:16,560
Speaker 1: gun or a symbol some sort of electroshock device. I

1660
01:31:16,600 --> 01:31:16,960
Speaker 1: don't know.

1661
01:31:17,600 --> 01:31:20,560
Speaker 3: You know, there are movies where there are mysterious or

1662
01:31:20,600 --> 01:31:24,560
Speaker 3: unexplainable phenomena that are first thought of to be supernatural,

1663
01:31:24,640 --> 01:31:27,240
Speaker 3: but then it is discovered that they are like physical

1664
01:31:27,280 --> 01:31:30,360
Speaker 3: in nature, they have a scientific explanation. And then there

1665
01:31:30,360 --> 01:31:33,840
Speaker 3: are movies where there are mysterious phenomena that are first

1666
01:31:33,920 --> 01:31:36,200
Speaker 3: thought of to be physical, but they're discovered to have

1667
01:31:36,240 --> 01:31:41,200
Speaker 3: a supernatural explanation. In this movie, I can't quite tell

1668
01:31:41,280 --> 01:31:44,800
Speaker 3: what they have discovered, Like we sort of get an explanation,

1669
01:31:44,920 --> 01:31:46,960
Speaker 3: but I don't know how to classify it is the

1670
01:31:47,040 --> 01:31:51,920
Speaker 3: ultimate explanation supernatural or physical? Does that make sense?

1671
01:31:52,160 --> 01:31:54,040
Speaker 1: Yeah? I mean I guess some of it kind of

1672
01:31:54,080 --> 01:31:57,000
Speaker 1: comes down to the idea that everything kind of collapses

1673
01:31:57,040 --> 01:32:00,600
Speaker 1: into and into what like missed and shadow smoking shadows.

1674
01:32:00,640 --> 01:32:04,360
Speaker 3: You know that it is you can't tell the difference

1675
01:32:04,400 --> 01:32:09,720
Speaker 3: between between the sufficiently powerful and understandable alien presence and

1676
01:32:09,960 --> 01:32:11,919
Speaker 3: like a ghost story spirit from beyond.

1677
01:32:12,280 --> 01:32:14,599
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like, this is a film where science has failed

1678
01:32:14,680 --> 01:32:17,720
Speaker 1: us to a certain extent, and so has religion, and

1679
01:32:18,000 --> 01:32:20,600
Speaker 1: these are the consequences of those failures.

1680
01:32:20,400 --> 01:32:24,360
Speaker 3: It's beyond science or religion. You can't even understand whether

1681
01:32:24,400 --> 01:32:28,520
Speaker 3: what you're dealing with is natural or supernatural. Yeah, yeah,

1682
01:32:28,600 --> 01:32:30,280
Speaker 3: that does seem more like horror, I guess.

1683
01:32:30,680 --> 01:32:33,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, I think it is far easier to say

1684
01:32:33,360 --> 01:32:38,840
Speaker 1: Friends of Darkness, solid horror film with science elements to it. Yeah,

1685
01:32:38,920 --> 01:32:41,559
Speaker 1: all right, well, there you have it. Happy Halloween, just

1686
01:32:41,640 --> 01:32:43,680
Speaker 1: reminded that stuff to blow your mind is primarily a

1687
01:32:43,720 --> 01:32:47,879
Speaker 1: science and culture podcast with core episodes on Tuesdays and Thursdays,

1688
01:32:47,880 --> 01:32:50,280
Speaker 1: but on Fridays we set aside most serious concerns to

1689
01:32:50,320 --> 01:32:53,240
Speaker 1: just talk about a weird film on weird House Cinema.

1690
01:32:53,640 --> 01:32:55,240
Speaker 1: You can find a full list of all the movies

1691
01:32:55,280 --> 01:32:57,960
Speaker 1: we've covered over the years at letterbox dot com. This

1692
01:32:58,160 --> 01:33:01,040
Speaker 1: L E T T E R bo x D dot com.

1693
01:33:01,120 --> 01:33:03,639
Speaker 1: Our user name there is weird House and that's where

1694
01:33:03,640 --> 01:33:06,639
Speaker 1: you'll find the list. Hey, go to our tea public

1695
01:33:06,640 --> 01:33:08,439
Speaker 1: store if you like. We have a couple of Halloween

1696
01:33:08,479 --> 01:33:11,240
Speaker 1: shirts up as well as they rub the fur shirt

1697
01:33:11,360 --> 01:33:14,240
Speaker 1: if you want to get in on that. You know,

1698
01:33:14,240 --> 01:33:16,080
Speaker 1: those are just for fun, but if you know, if

1699
01:33:16,080 --> 01:33:17,960
Speaker 1: you want to stick or a shirt, yeah, check it out.

1700
01:33:18,080 --> 01:33:20,080
Speaker 1: It's well, I guess it's a way to sort of

1701
01:33:20,080 --> 01:33:21,200
Speaker 1: spread the word about the show.

1702
01:33:21,680 --> 01:33:25,280
Speaker 3: Huge thanks as always to our excellent audio producer Jjposway.

1703
01:33:25,560 --> 01:33:27,120
Speaker 3: If you would like to get in touch with us

1704
01:33:27,120 --> 01:33:29,599
Speaker 3: with feedback on this episode or any other to suggest

1705
01:33:29,640 --> 01:33:31,840
Speaker 3: a topic for the future, or just to say hello.

1706
01:33:32,000 --> 01:33:34,559
Speaker 3: You can email us at contact at stuff to Blow

1707
01:33:34,560 --> 01:33:42,200
Speaker 3: your Mind dot com.

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Speaker 2: Stuff to Blow Your Mind is production of iHeartRadio. For

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Speaker 2: more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

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Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.