WEBVTT - Part One: I Do Not Like Elon Musk Very Much 0:00:02.200 --> 0:00:07.680 Cook. I'm Robert Evans, host Behind the Bastards, and my 0:00:07.880 --> 0:00:11.879 producer Sophie right before we started recording, called Elon Musk 0:00:12.039 --> 0:00:16.080 a cuck. So Elon, if you're listening, you have been 0:00:16.120 --> 0:00:20.599 accused of being a Yeah, what's cuking my my lib 0:00:20.680 --> 0:00:24.960 tards or whatever. I don't know. I just I hate 0:00:25.200 --> 0:00:28.400 cook is an insult um. But I also really enjoy 0:00:28.480 --> 0:00:30.840 saying cook, and I that's the thing I have to 0:00:30.920 --> 0:00:33.720 hide because people who say cook on the internet are 0:00:33.720 --> 0:00:36.760 all the worst people in Nate Silver, who is one 0:00:36.800 --> 0:00:39.160 of the worst people, and I choose not to put 0:00:39.200 --> 0:00:41.920 myself in that category. But it is fun to say cook. 0:00:42.240 --> 0:00:44.600 But you can reclaim it, you know what I'm saying. 0:00:44.720 --> 0:00:47.839 You can reclaim it. Yeah, But I don't want to 0:00:47.960 --> 0:00:51.480 claim it in the context of Elon Musk because he's no, 0:00:51.720 --> 0:00:54.680 I don't like him. I've been seeing Robert smile that 0:00:54.800 --> 0:00:58.959 big in a really long time. He likes it when 0:00:58.960 --> 0:01:01.240 I come on and make him lush and then and 0:01:01.320 --> 0:01:07.200 also talk about cooks. Yeah, He's like, we have Alexandra here, 0:01:07.240 --> 0:01:13.000 you live, Yeah, Sophia, Alexandra, how you doing, Sophia. I'm 0:01:13.000 --> 0:01:16.640 you know, surviving in a current hell Yeah, I'm lying. 0:01:16.880 --> 0:01:20.360 I'm spiraling. How about your Albert? I'm also spiraling. I'm 0:01:20.400 --> 0:01:22.760 having such a bad day, Sophia. It sounds like you 0:01:22.760 --> 0:01:27.120 are too. I'm so not happy to hear that. You 0:01:27.160 --> 0:01:31.360 know what will make this day better? Um? Are you 0:01:31.400 --> 0:01:34.400 gonna tell me about a bastard that I have been 0:01:34.480 --> 0:01:37.280 dying to hear about? Yeah? I think we're going to 0:01:37.360 --> 0:01:42.119 talk about Elon Musk for like two and a half hours. Yes, 0:01:42.800 --> 0:01:45.360 are you suing on board for this ship? Tessed with 0:01:45.440 --> 0:01:49.000 him and his inability to be a good father and 0:01:49.160 --> 0:01:52.440 just all of these other things, and his his relationship 0:01:52.480 --> 0:01:55.920 with Grimes. There aren't things that I won't read about 0:01:55.920 --> 0:02:00.240 Elon Musk because I find the whole thing fascinating. Also, Slee, 0:02:00.360 --> 0:02:03.800 he's terrible, Yeah, he is. And I don't know. There 0:02:03.800 --> 0:02:05.400 won't be as much about his kids in here, just 0:02:05.400 --> 0:02:07.760 because I don't like talking about people's kids and I 0:02:07.760 --> 0:02:11.480 haven't heard allegations of like abuse or anything like that. Um, 0:02:11.480 --> 0:02:14.560 So I just mean his attitude on fatherhood, Like he's like, no, 0:02:14.680 --> 0:02:17.839 I'll be gone forever, yes, yes, yes, yeah, we will 0:02:17.880 --> 0:02:20.640 be talking about that. We will be talking about We'll 0:02:20.639 --> 0:02:23.120 be talking about super much about Grimes just because that's 0:02:23.120 --> 0:02:25.040 all kind of new. But we'll be talking about his 0:02:25.120 --> 0:02:27.880 relationships with women. We will be talking about a lot 0:02:27.919 --> 0:02:29.840 of we will be talking too much. But I wrote 0:02:29.840 --> 0:02:32.200 fourteen thousand words about Elon musk We're going to be 0:02:32.240 --> 0:02:35.120 talking too much about him. He is the James Cameron 0:02:35.240 --> 0:02:39.520 of science. Okay, we're like, he that that should be 0:02:39.639 --> 0:02:45.919 James Cameron, right, And it's not sadly but uh yeah, 0:02:46.120 --> 0:02:49.560 just you know from the way that he commits to 0:02:49.680 --> 0:02:52.640 his movies and how little time he commits to his 0:02:52.720 --> 0:02:55.800 relationships compared to his movies, that he was like, for 0:02:55.960 --> 0:02:59.520 sure a terrible father, uh and husband. And that's why 0:02:59.520 --> 0:03:03.760 I like and fucking what's her face? Big Beelow When 0:03:03.880 --> 0:03:05.960 and had to make her locker, She's like, this is 0:03:06.040 --> 0:03:10.639 less traumatic than my marriage anyway, Sorry, the same to me. 0:03:10.760 --> 0:03:14.240 It's the same to me, speaking as a career obsessed 0:03:14.280 --> 0:03:18.160 man who has had a lot of relationship issues for 0:03:18.240 --> 0:03:20.720 years as a result of being a career obsessed man, 0:03:21.400 --> 0:03:27.520 we're bad people to be in relationships with. Dude, I'm 0:03:27.520 --> 0:03:31.240 here to workaholic. Yeah, I mean you do live in 0:03:31.280 --> 0:03:37.040 Los Angeles. Um, so does Elon Musk. Um, and he 0:03:37.080 --> 0:03:39.200 always will all that ship about moving to Texas his 0:03:39.240 --> 0:03:42.120 horse ship, and in fact, someone just released evidence that 0:03:42.480 --> 0:03:45.040 the day that he was like talking about maybe moving 0:03:45.080 --> 0:03:47.080 his plant to Texas, he applied for a bunch of 0:03:47.080 --> 0:03:50.480 expansions of the factory in California. Like he was always 0:03:50.480 --> 0:03:54.200 just full of ship and lying. Um, he's great. He 0:03:54.320 --> 0:03:57.320 loves lying, he does. And I'm gonna tell you right now, 0:03:57.560 --> 0:03:59.920 I don't know, maybe you'll feel differently the first ep 0:04:00.000 --> 0:04:02.720 aisode of this, you're gonna wind up kind of sympathetic 0:04:02.720 --> 0:04:05.440 about him because there are reasons to be sympathetic about him. 0:04:05.440 --> 0:04:07.880 And I do think, do you know me? Yeah, we'll see, 0:04:07.920 --> 0:04:13.360 we'll see, we'll see. He's he's an abuse victim. Um. 0:04:13.520 --> 0:04:18.320 So like that's lame. Um, Like it's not lame to 0:04:18.360 --> 0:04:21.280 be sure. Hitler had a tough for a while with 0:04:21.360 --> 0:04:23.960 his art. Like I don't know what are we doing here. 0:04:24.480 --> 0:04:27.640 I mean, it's Hitler's mom's cancer that really gets tugged 0:04:27.640 --> 0:04:29.920 you at the heart strings. But yeah, I mean, yes, 0:04:30.000 --> 0:04:33.000 that's what we're doing, just saying things that are normal 0:04:33.080 --> 0:04:35.960 that have happened to bad people, not normal, but bad 0:04:36.000 --> 0:04:38.599 things that have happened to bad people. What I want 0:04:38.880 --> 0:04:42.160 is for people to hate bad people for the right reasons. 0:04:42.200 --> 0:04:44.720 And I do think some of the reasons Elon Musk 0:04:44.920 --> 0:04:48.040 gets shipped um are the wrong reasons, and there are 0:04:48.160 --> 0:04:50.839 so many really good things to give him shit about 0:04:51.200 --> 0:04:53.760 that I want to make sure everyone is giving him 0:04:53.760 --> 0:04:57.440 ship for the proper reason. You want to direct the hate. 0:04:57.839 --> 0:05:00.600 I want to direct the hate towards things that that 0:05:00.880 --> 0:05:04.240 deserve your hate and in the within the same person, 0:05:04.279 --> 0:05:07.200 which maybe is being too picky, um, but this is 0:05:07.240 --> 0:05:12.479 what I do for some reason, for some reason, nobody 0:05:12.560 --> 0:05:14.680 asked asked me to do this, but I do it. 0:05:14.880 --> 0:05:16.640 I just want to tell you that I'm pretty sure 0:05:16.680 --> 0:05:19.320 I hate him for all of the quote un right reasons, 0:05:19.839 --> 0:05:22.520 but there's a lot of those so pretty fucking petty, 0:05:22.600 --> 0:05:25.159 So there's some ship in there that I do not 0:05:25.320 --> 0:05:27.880 need to hate him. Well, this will be good because 0:05:27.920 --> 0:05:31.000 I will try to be scrupulously fair as I outline 0:05:31.000 --> 0:05:33.320 why he's a piece of shit, and you will not 0:05:33.440 --> 0:05:35.599 give a funk about that and just and that will 0:05:35.720 --> 0:05:38.159 that will please both of the segments of people that 0:05:38.240 --> 0:05:41.839 listen to this podcast. UM. I love coming on because 0:05:41.880 --> 0:05:44.120 every time I connect with some of your listeners who 0:05:44.120 --> 0:05:46.599 I love and then other people on Reddit are like, 0:05:47.040 --> 0:05:51.800 I wish she would just kill herself, eat her heart. 0:05:54.760 --> 0:05:57.680 I would say Reddit's Reddit's part of the nine of 0:05:57.720 --> 0:05:59.640 the Internet or so that we never should have made. 0:05:59.800 --> 0:06:02.039 But speaking about things that never should have been made, 0:06:02.240 --> 0:06:08.080 let's let's talk about Elon musk Yeah. So I did 0:06:08.120 --> 0:06:10.880 not want to do an episode about Elon Musk um, 0:06:10.920 --> 0:06:13.680 and I still kind of don't, um, although I changed 0:06:13.680 --> 0:06:15.840 my mind on that over the course of the episode, 0:06:15.880 --> 0:06:18.800 and my attitude on him from most of the time 0:06:18.800 --> 0:06:21.200 I've known about him has been it's bad to be 0:06:21.240 --> 0:06:24.880 a billionaire. Uh. And I know that he did some 0:06:25.040 --> 0:06:27.520 messed up stuff to get where he has has gotten. 0:06:27.760 --> 0:06:30.880 But also his businesses are things that I broadly support, 0:06:30.960 --> 0:06:34.719 like electric cars are are good. Space travel I think 0:06:34.800 --> 0:06:38.839 is good and should be easier. Um and I do 0:06:38.920 --> 0:06:41.680 think actually people will disagree about this. We'll talk about 0:06:41.680 --> 0:06:43.680 this a little bit. And I think there are things 0:06:43.720 --> 0:06:46.720 that are positive about SpaceX um. So like it was 0:06:46.760 --> 0:06:47.960 one of those things that was like, of all the 0:06:47.960 --> 0:06:50.440 people in the world, like, yeah, I think he's shitty 0:06:50.440 --> 0:06:52.000 in Lane, but like, why am I going to go 0:06:52.080 --> 0:06:55.359 after him in particular? And having spent an entire week 0:06:55.440 --> 0:06:58.120 reading everything I can about Elon Musk, I now feel 0:06:58.240 --> 0:07:01.720 very comfortable talking about out him for three hours. I 0:07:01.760 --> 0:07:03.440 don't know, I just didn't want to do this for 0:07:03.480 --> 0:07:05.680 a long time, and I get what. What finally pushed 0:07:05.680 --> 0:07:09.400 me over the edge was his reaction to the coronavirus 0:07:10.080 --> 0:07:13.560 um And it was like after weeks. So I don't 0:07:13.560 --> 0:07:15.960 know if you've been following Elon on Twitter during this, 0:07:16.040 --> 0:07:19.800 but for weeks he called fears over the coronavirus dumb. Um. 0:07:19.840 --> 0:07:22.960 He initially when it first hit predicted that like the 0:07:23.000 --> 0:07:24.720 panic was stupid and it was going to be like 0:07:24.760 --> 0:07:27.080 a nothing burger. And then obviously it's shut down the 0:07:27.200 --> 0:07:29.640 entire world, so he was wrong on that prediction. Then 0:07:29.680 --> 0:07:31.960 he predicted that we would be at no new cases 0:07:32.040 --> 0:07:34.160 by the end of April. By the end of April, 0:07:34.320 --> 0:07:36.400 like a couple of thousand people a day, we're dying 0:07:36.400 --> 0:07:39.960 in the United States, so we're not not not He 0:07:40.040 --> 0:07:42.360 was not right on that either, um. And then he 0:07:42.400 --> 0:07:45.760 went like kind of straight up into maga on Twitter 0:07:45.880 --> 0:07:48.880 with like tweeting free America now in all caps and 0:07:48.960 --> 0:07:53.640 like very studiously reopening his Alameda County Tesla factory, which 0:07:53.640 --> 0:07:55.640 by the way, is considered one of the most dangerous 0:07:55.680 --> 0:07:58.720 factories in the United States. Um and a number of 0:07:58.760 --> 0:08:01.280 his workers protested and said, like he should be in 0:08:01.360 --> 0:08:05.440 prison for the safety standards here. Yeah. Uh, it's it's 0:08:05.480 --> 0:08:08.640 pretty great that you know, we've been talking about how 0:08:08.680 --> 0:08:12.640 we are spiraling, but like, honestly, compared to that, are 0:08:12.680 --> 0:08:16.600 we Robert, No, we're doing great. I've never been so 0:08:16.680 --> 0:08:19.800 freaked out by reality that I abandoned it in favor 0:08:19.880 --> 0:08:26.280 of something insane like MAGA. Yeah. It's like it's slogans 0:08:26.360 --> 0:08:30.200 like free America that you cannot relate to the complex 0:08:30.280 --> 0:08:34.520 realities of a virus or a pandemic. It's remarkable to 0:08:34.559 --> 0:08:36.800 me how weak a person you have to be to 0:08:36.960 --> 0:08:40.040 not be able to handle this as a billionaire, Like 0:08:40.800 --> 0:08:43.880 it's it's really just get on your yacht with like 0:08:43.960 --> 0:08:47.079 eight to Tony Robbins is on it. That can set 0:08:47.120 --> 0:08:50.360 you right, Like what's going on? Yeah, like it's this 0:08:50.400 --> 0:08:53.640 should be fine, Um, but no, it's not. For Elon 0:08:54.040 --> 0:08:56.760 the same month that he tweeted all of that stupid bullshit, 0:08:57.280 --> 0:08:59.640 he tweeted that Tesla stock price was too high, which 0:08:59.720 --> 0:09:02.599 instaly cut fourteen billion dollars from the company's value In 0:09:02.640 --> 0:09:05.200 a matter of minutes because the stock market totally makes sense. 0:09:05.840 --> 0:09:08.760 This really piste off a lot of his most loyal followers, 0:09:08.760 --> 0:09:11.200 who were all like his his his mentions for days 0:09:11.200 --> 0:09:13.680 where people being like, you just tanked the value of 0:09:13.720 --> 0:09:18.199 my portfolio with the Alley law. And there are suspicions. 0:09:18.280 --> 0:09:20.440 I don't think there's possible to confirm this, but people 0:09:20.480 --> 0:09:24.600 have suspected that he did this because essentially the way 0:09:24.640 --> 0:09:27.840 that like fucking stocks work, he was about to have 0:09:28.000 --> 0:09:31.800 like temporarily taking the value of Tesla reduced his tax burden. 0:09:31.880 --> 0:09:35.000 Basically like he did that to save some money on taxes, 0:09:35.360 --> 0:09:37.640 which is like illegal but also the kind of illegal 0:09:37.720 --> 0:09:40.240 that like nobody ever really gets in trouble for um, 0:09:40.320 --> 0:09:43.559 but also the kind of selfish that is so remarkable 0:09:43.720 --> 0:09:47.960 that you would rather hurt every single investor in your company. Yeah, 0:09:48.480 --> 0:09:51.760 then then to just fucking take it on the chin 0:09:51.840 --> 0:09:55.880 and pay taxes. When billionaires paying taxes is good for 0:09:55.920 --> 0:09:59.960 the world, It's it's cool. And again, those are suspe 0:10:00.000 --> 0:10:02.520 missions that people have voiced and not something that we 0:10:02.559 --> 0:10:05.559 can prove. Because Elon Musk has many lawyers, I want 0:10:05.600 --> 0:10:09.000 to be clear when we when we state other people's suspicions. 0:10:09.000 --> 0:10:11.920 We are not stating an objective fact um. No one 0:10:11.960 --> 0:10:14.320 knows why he tweeted that dumb thing that tanked the 0:10:14.400 --> 0:10:18.000 value of his stock. That is one suspicion um. He 0:10:18.120 --> 0:10:21.239 also tweeted quote, I am selling almost all physical possessions. 0:10:21.240 --> 0:10:23.840 Will own no house, and he quickly followed up by 0:10:23.920 --> 0:10:26.520 noting that his girlfriend Grimes was mad at him for this, 0:10:26.960 --> 0:10:29.800 and then he did list all of his mansions. So 0:10:31.880 --> 0:10:34.400 and it's like he talks about is that like a 0:10:34.440 --> 0:10:37.559 weird flex? What is that supposed to be? Yeah, it's 0:10:37.600 --> 0:10:41.079 a thing. I read this book about Elon Musk that 0:10:41.080 --> 0:10:42.559 we'll talk about a little bit more later, like a 0:10:42.559 --> 0:10:45.679 biography about him that was publish this and in it, 0:10:45.960 --> 0:10:49.080 like the biographer Ashley Vance, notes that like he travels 0:10:49.080 --> 0:10:50.839 around all the time, Like he'll spend like two days 0:10:50.840 --> 0:10:52.520 in l A, two days in San Francisco, and like 0:10:52.520 --> 0:10:54.360 when he goes to San Francisco, he usually will just 0:10:54.360 --> 0:10:56.880 crash at a friend's house on their couch. And like 0:10:57.000 --> 0:10:58.880 the way it's related is that like he's just this 0:10:59.000 --> 0:11:02.120 kind of obsessive accoholic who doesn't care about material things. 0:11:02.160 --> 0:11:04.520 But it's like, no, the friend that you're crashing at 0:11:04.679 --> 0:11:08.080 is like the founder of Google. Like like like like 0:11:08.200 --> 0:11:11.559 you're not like chilling in like your buddies, like studio apartment, 0:11:12.760 --> 0:11:17.680 Like the couch is your own guest mansion. Yeah yeah, 0:11:17.720 --> 0:11:19.760 like or if it is a couch, it is a 0:11:19.840 --> 0:11:22.760 seventy thousand dollar couch, Like it is a couch with 0:11:22.960 --> 0:11:28.800 that that is worth more than some cities like um. Anyway, 0:11:29.320 --> 0:11:31.920 several days after tweeting that he was selling all of 0:11:31.960 --> 0:11:36.080 his earthly possessions his I think still girlfriend, Grimes gave 0:11:36.120 --> 0:11:38.480 birth to the couple's first child together, and like Musk 0:11:38.600 --> 0:11:42.440 six or seventh kid, um, he went viral again when 0:11:42.480 --> 0:11:44.920 he announced that the boy's name would be x A 0:11:45.120 --> 0:11:47.240 E A twelve and that is not how he says 0:11:47.240 --> 0:11:49.719 it's supposed to be pronounced. I don't care. It's a 0:11:49.800 --> 0:11:52.720 dumb name for a baby. The state of California agrees 0:11:52.760 --> 0:11:54.400 it's a dumb name for a baby, and they have 0:11:54.840 --> 0:11:57.520 signaled that it is not an acceptable name under state 0:11:57.520 --> 0:12:00.800 health codes. Um, so that's cool. We'll see how that 0:12:00.840 --> 0:12:02.680 works out. I'm sure he'll find a way to get 0:12:02.760 --> 0:12:05.680 his his stupid way on this. Um. Although he says 0:12:05.679 --> 0:12:07.880 it was grimes decision, which maybe it was I don't 0:12:07.880 --> 0:12:11.840 think she makes great decisions either. I mean she is 0:12:12.160 --> 0:12:18.920 having his baby. Yeah, clearly not the best decision making process. Again, 0:12:18.960 --> 0:12:22.640 as I mentioned, already has like a billion kids he 0:12:22.679 --> 0:12:26.079 doesn't care about. Yeah, I don't know. So the thing 0:12:26.160 --> 0:12:28.280 that like really set me off, Like, all of this 0:12:28.400 --> 0:12:31.800 is very silly, and it's silly in general that a 0:12:31.800 --> 0:12:34.040 man with this much wealth spends any time at all 0:12:34.080 --> 0:12:38.080 on Twitter, because you shouldn't, like you just shouldn't, like 0:12:38.160 --> 0:12:40.400 none of us should, but you especially shouldn't if you 0:12:40.440 --> 0:12:44.840 can buy a yacht. Um. And before anybody who follows 0:12:44.920 --> 0:12:47.080 Musk had any chance to really digest all of this 0:12:47.120 --> 0:12:50.120 ship or stop laughing about it, uh, Musk dropped another 0:12:50.160 --> 0:12:53.240 bombshell when he tweeted take the red Pill alongside a 0:12:53.240 --> 0:12:57.079 red rose emoji. Now, at various points in time on Twitter, 0:12:57.160 --> 0:13:00.560 Musk has identified himself as a socialist without really explaining 0:13:00.559 --> 0:13:02.760 what he means by that. So this might have been 0:13:02.840 --> 0:13:06.800 him talking about democratic socialism, but it probably wasn't. Um. 0:13:06.960 --> 0:13:11.120 I think anyone listening knows like what red pill means 0:13:11.160 --> 0:13:13.840 on the far right. Uh. And Musk was immediately embraced 0:13:13.840 --> 0:13:16.200 by the worst people on the Internet, including Ivanka Trump, 0:13:16.200 --> 0:13:19.320 who quote tweeted him uh Lily Wachowski, one half of 0:13:19.320 --> 0:13:24.240 the duo responsible for coming up with the term red pill. Yeah, 0:13:24.480 --> 0:13:27.520 I told them both to go funk themselves. So all 0:13:27.600 --> 0:13:29.800 of this made me go, Okay, I gotta fucking right 0:13:29.840 --> 0:13:32.120 about Elon Musk, Like, we gotta, we gotta do this. 0:13:32.480 --> 0:13:34.400 I've been watching the while it out too, and I've 0:13:34.400 --> 0:13:39.080 been like, just it's reminding me of kind of the 0:13:39.160 --> 0:13:44.880 Kanye breakdown. Yeah, We're like the line between eccentricity and 0:13:44.960 --> 0:13:48.880 just like becoming a bad person has becoming a little 0:13:49.000 --> 0:13:52.520 like more blurred for them than it ever has been, 0:13:53.120 --> 0:13:57.880 and people are trying to there's very few stands were 0:13:57.880 --> 0:14:01.080 still around. We're like no, no, no, acent probably still 0:14:01.120 --> 0:14:05.600 means good in the background, but it's it's telling that 0:14:05.679 --> 0:14:09.000 when people like Ivanka Trump retweet you and support you 0:14:09.080 --> 0:14:11.440 and you don't say anything like and you don't say 0:14:11.480 --> 0:14:15.440 no fuck you, Like yeah, on you. You know, if 0:14:15.480 --> 0:14:19.880 people misinterpreted it, that's on you to set it, Yeah, 0:14:20.040 --> 0:14:22.400 to be like no, not these people. Um yeah, And 0:14:22.440 --> 0:14:24.840 I I can't say if Ellen's in the process of 0:14:24.920 --> 0:14:27.200 I don't know, embracing the alt right or like going 0:14:27.200 --> 0:14:29.400 full maga or if he's just ship posting because he 0:14:29.440 --> 0:14:33.440 does that all of the time. Um. Yeah. In a 0:14:33.480 --> 0:14:36.160 Business Insider interview that came out today, which is actually 0:14:36.160 --> 0:14:38.320 written by the woman who wrote the biography that will 0:14:38.400 --> 0:14:42.040 refer to regularly in this episode, he stated that he 0:14:42.320 --> 0:14:44.640 makes a lot of stupid tweets. He did, he did 0:14:44.720 --> 0:14:47.600 own that, but he didn't specify which tweets were stupid, 0:14:47.840 --> 0:14:50.240 which is kind of like the most cowardly way to 0:14:50.320 --> 0:14:53.080 acknowledge that you tweet a bunch of dumb shit. Um. 0:14:53.160 --> 0:14:55.040 He also stated that Twitter was a valuable way for 0:14:55.120 --> 0:14:57.520 him to engage with his fans without a filter, which 0:14:57.560 --> 0:15:00.440 is not true of anyone who has ever had fans. Um, 0:15:00.440 --> 0:15:03.760 there's no value in Twitter. Everyone should exactly what Trump 0:15:03.800 --> 0:15:09.960 says to to justify his Twitter presence. Yeah. Yeah. Now, 0:15:10.000 --> 0:15:12.280 when it comes to analyzing whether or not Elon Musk 0:15:12.360 --> 0:15:15.080 is a bastard, um, and that doesn't Like, obviously, I 0:15:15.120 --> 0:15:17.320 think it's unethical to be a billionaire, But I don't 0:15:17.320 --> 0:15:19.560 think like every billionaire doesn't deserve to have a behind 0:15:19.600 --> 0:15:21.840 the bastards because most of them, like I still don't 0:15:21.880 --> 0:15:23.480 even know if I'm gonna write one about bezos because 0:15:23.520 --> 0:15:25.040 it would just wind up being like a list of 0:15:25.080 --> 0:15:28.720 bad Amazon practices. But I think he's pretty boring. I 0:15:28.720 --> 0:15:31.760 don't know, Maybe I will one day. Um But like 0:15:31.840 --> 0:15:33.320 you have, there has to be like you have to 0:15:33.360 --> 0:15:36.920 be interestingly shitty to qualify for this show. UM and 0:15:37.160 --> 0:15:40.520 I do think Ellen qualifies now now that I understand 0:15:40.560 --> 0:15:43.680 him better. Now I should start by noting that most 0:15:43.680 --> 0:15:46.600 of our information on him comes from Elon himself or 0:15:46.600 --> 0:15:49.640 his close family members, most of whom have financial ties 0:15:49.680 --> 0:15:53.120 to Elon. So there is a dearth of objective information, 0:15:53.200 --> 0:15:57.360 particularly about his early life. UM. And the other chunk 0:15:57.400 --> 0:15:59.560 of information we have from his early adults On comes 0:15:59.600 --> 0:16:01.600 from people who dislike him for one reason or another. 0:16:01.600 --> 0:16:04.160 So it's hard to get objective sources about this guy. 0:16:04.760 --> 0:16:07.040 And as a result, there are two competing Elons that 0:16:07.080 --> 0:16:09.520 appear if you study his life story. And so the 0:16:09.520 --> 0:16:11.920 Elon that his fans tend to see is the awkward 0:16:11.960 --> 0:16:14.520 genius driven manically to save the world and so obsessed 0:16:14.520 --> 0:16:16.600 with this goal that he fails to understand the needs 0:16:16.880 --> 0:16:19.600 or cater to the feelings of normal people. UM. And 0:16:19.640 --> 0:16:21.760 it's usually sort of like, but it's okay because he's 0:16:21.760 --> 0:16:30.359 really try Yes, big bang theory. No one has benefited. 0:16:30.640 --> 0:16:33.480 I will say no human being has benefited more from 0:16:33.520 --> 0:16:39.160 our Hollywood induced misunderstanding of autism than Elon Musk. Um 0:16:39.600 --> 0:16:42.920 like he he has been the primary beneficiary of that. 0:16:45.200 --> 0:16:49.880 It's cool, Um, it's not. Uh yeah uh so just 0:16:50.280 --> 0:16:52.720 and so the other view of him is that he's 0:16:52.760 --> 0:16:55.400 just another sociopathic billionaire asshole who treats human beings that 0:16:55.400 --> 0:16:57.360 make his wealth possible like a fifteen year old boy 0:16:57.360 --> 0:17:03.040 treats kleenex. Um. That's what I think. Yeah. Yeah. The 0:17:03.080 --> 0:17:06.840 main source for this episode is a book titled Elon Musk, Tesla, SpaceX, 0:17:06.880 --> 0:17:09.600 and the Quest for a Fantastic Future by Ashley Vance. 0:17:10.080 --> 0:17:11.919 It was published in two US in fifteen, so this 0:17:12.000 --> 0:17:15.240 was before Musk's social media presence made him problematic to 0:17:15.280 --> 0:17:16.760 a lot of people who had either liked him or 0:17:16.800 --> 0:17:20.640 tolerated him quietly before. Uh. It is a broadly positive book, 0:17:20.680 --> 0:17:23.080 and it verges on fawning when it talks about Tesla 0:17:23.119 --> 0:17:26.879 and SpaceX technology. Um, but it's not entirely positive, and 0:17:26.880 --> 0:17:29.280 its evaluation of Elon himself and is very critical about 0:17:29.320 --> 0:17:31.640 him at a number of points. Um. When the book 0:17:31.680 --> 0:17:34.399 was published, Musk took to Twitter to complain about stories 0:17:34.440 --> 0:17:36.760 other people had told about him that he disagreed with. 0:17:37.359 --> 0:17:40.400 Um But he also continued to do interviews with Ashley Vance, 0:17:40.400 --> 0:17:43.680 So he's obviously not that angry. Um Elon did cooperate 0:17:43.840 --> 0:17:46.080 with the book, and the story behind how that came 0:17:46.080 --> 0:17:50.000 to be is deeply revealing about his personality. UM. So 0:17:50.080 --> 0:17:52.480 he learned that Vance was working on his biography early 0:17:52.480 --> 0:17:55.040 in the process, and UM, I'm just gonna quote Ashley 0:17:55.119 --> 0:17:58.560 now writing about how that inner introduction went. I had 0:17:58.600 --> 0:18:00.520 informed him of my plans to write a bo about him, 0:18:00.520 --> 0:18:02.679 and he did informed me if his plans not to cooperate. 0:18:02.800 --> 0:18:05.879 His rejections stung but thrust me into dogged reporter mode. 0:18:05.960 --> 0:18:07.439 If I had to do this book without him, so 0:18:07.520 --> 0:18:10.240 be it. Plenty of people had left Musk's companies, Tesla 0:18:10.280 --> 0:18:12.880 Motors and SpaceX and would talk, and I already knew 0:18:12.920 --> 0:18:15.520 a lot of his friends. The interviews followed, one after another, 0:18:15.640 --> 0:18:18.200 month after month, and two or so people into the process, 0:18:18.240 --> 0:18:20.399 I heard from Musk once again. He called me at 0:18:20.440 --> 0:18:22.480 home and declared that things could go one of two ways. 0:18:22.640 --> 0:18:24.520 He could make my life very difficult, or he could 0:18:24.640 --> 0:18:26.879 help with the project. After all, he'd be willing to 0:18:26.920 --> 0:18:28.719 cooperate if he could read the book before it went 0:18:28.760 --> 0:18:36.040 to publication and could add footnotes throughout it. Wow, yeah, yeah, 0:18:36.880 --> 0:18:39.399 only I five total approval of everything you say about me? 0:18:39.400 --> 0:18:42.119 Would that be cool with you? Artistically? Integrity wise, as 0:18:42.160 --> 0:18:44.360 a writer, as a journalist, what do you think? It's 0:18:44.400 --> 0:18:47.320 even more frustrating than that. Uh, he would not meddle 0:18:47.320 --> 0:18:49.080 with my text, but wanted the chance to set the 0:18:49.119 --> 0:18:51.480 record straight and spots he deemed f actually inaccurate, So 0:18:51.480 --> 0:18:53.320 he wanted He didn't want to just he didn't want 0:18:53.320 --> 0:18:55.320 to have to be able to approve her text. He 0:18:55.359 --> 0:18:57.880 wanted to be able to basically write his own biography 0:18:57.960 --> 0:19:03.920 alongside her biography that are argued with it such an 0:19:05.520 --> 0:19:10.240 I can't even He's like a reply guy to the 0:19:10.320 --> 0:19:14.880 million degree, Like it's one of those things. I entered 0:19:14.920 --> 0:19:16.560 this project being like I don't know if this guy's 0:19:16.560 --> 0:19:18.639 going to be really interesting enough to do an episode about. 0:19:18.640 --> 0:19:20.800 And once I read that part of the introduction, I 0:19:20.840 --> 0:19:23.000 was like, Okay, yeah, I'm doing the right thing, Like yeah, 0:19:24.200 --> 0:19:26.280 because that kind of says everything about him as a 0:19:26.359 --> 0:19:30.760 human being really, um so yeah, being a journalist, VANCE 0:19:30.800 --> 0:19:32.960 said no, and this is partly because she feared that 0:19:33.000 --> 0:19:35.120 he'd write dozens of pages of footnotes that would create 0:19:35.119 --> 0:19:37.560 out the actual biography itself, which is almost certainly true, 0:19:37.920 --> 0:19:40.439 and partly because, in her words quote, Musk has his 0:19:40.560 --> 0:19:42.360 version of the truth and it's not always the version 0:19:42.400 --> 0:19:45.720 of the truth that the rest of the world shares. Um. Now, 0:19:46.040 --> 0:19:48.760 to Ellen's credit, when Vance stood her ground and agreed 0:19:48.800 --> 0:19:51.480 to he agreed to cooperate with the book anyway. Ashley 0:19:51.800 --> 0:19:53.480 says that he's the kind of person who respects it 0:19:53.520 --> 0:19:55.680 and people around him set strong boundaries and hold firm 0:19:55.680 --> 0:19:58.679 in their convictions. Um. Of course, when the book came 0:19:58.680 --> 0:20:00.920 out and it included anecdotes about Elon that he did 0:20:00.960 --> 0:20:03.359 not like, he took to Twitter to provide his own footnotes. 0:20:03.359 --> 0:20:06.919 So he is absolutely the guy that um he you 0:20:06.960 --> 0:20:09.640 think he is. We're gonna get into Musk's early life 0:20:09.640 --> 0:20:11.560 in a second, but before we do, I want to 0:20:11.600 --> 0:20:14.920 read run more segment from Ashley's introduction. This moment comes 0:20:15.000 --> 0:20:17.560 during the first dinner she and Elon shared after he 0:20:17.600 --> 0:20:21.119 agreed to cooperate with her project. Quote. Two and a 0:20:21.160 --> 0:20:23.520 half hours after he started, must put his hands on 0:20:23.560 --> 0:20:25.960 the table, made a move to get up and then paused, 0:20:26.080 --> 0:20:28.719 locked eyes with me, and busted out that incredible question, 0:20:29.080 --> 0:20:31.960 do you think I'm insane? The oddity of the moment 0:20:32.080 --> 0:20:34.320 left me speechless for a beat, with my every synapse 0:20:34.359 --> 0:20:36.120 fired trying to figure out if this was some sort 0:20:36.119 --> 0:20:39.080 of riddle, and if so, how should it be answered artfully? 0:20:39.240 --> 0:20:40.919 It was only after I spent lots of time with 0:20:41.359 --> 0:20:46.080 that is just so terrifying. If I was interviewing a 0:20:46.119 --> 0:20:53.080 man he said that to me, I would be terrified, Sophie, terrifying, horrifying. 0:20:54.160 --> 0:20:56.760 You have a real responsibility just as like a dude, 0:20:57.119 --> 0:20:59.520 and also as a as a dude who has any 0:20:59.600 --> 0:21:01.399 kind of prominence. And I don't have the same kind 0:21:01.400 --> 0:21:05.320 of prominence that Musk does, but I I do regularly 0:21:05.359 --> 0:21:08.040 wind up in situations where like I'm well known by 0:21:08.080 --> 0:21:09.439