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Speaker 1: Lute force. If it doesn't work, you're just not using enough.

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Speaker 1: You're listening to Software Radio, Special Operations, Military Nails on

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Speaker 1: straight talk with the guys in the community.

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Speaker 2: Hey, what's going on? It is another wonderful episode of

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Speaker 2: soft Rep Radio and I am your host, Rad and

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Speaker 2: today I have a legend of a guest. But before

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Speaker 2: I introduce you to him, I want to tell you

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Speaker 2: about our merch store, the soft Rep dot Com Ford

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Speaker 2: slash Merch Go check out our merch We have shirts,

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Speaker 2: branded hats. There's lighters that you can carry. If you

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Speaker 2: have an DC or you need to light them up,

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Speaker 2: Come get a lighter. Go check out our merch store.

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Speaker 2: It helps keep the fireplace on. And the interview is

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Speaker 2: going with my next guest for sure. Second, we have

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Speaker 2: the book Club and it's soft Rep dot Com Forward

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Speaker 2: slash book hyphen Club. That's book Hyphened Club, all right.

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Speaker 2: And if you're new to the show, welcome for your

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Speaker 2: first time. And if you've been a fan and you've

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Speaker 2: been a listener and your name happens to be you

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Speaker 2: know Johnson, all right, and you're out there saying, Hey, Rad,

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Speaker 2: I want you to I want to hear you talk

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Speaker 2: about Colonel Keith Nightingale. And I have Colonel Keith Nightingale

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Speaker 2: here today on the show, Jim, And this is for you, bro. Okay,

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Speaker 2: I know Jim is a mutual friend of ours, Keith,

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Speaker 2: and welcome to the show.

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Speaker 3: Keith. Hey, my pleasure to be here far away.

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Speaker 2: All right. So I'm gonna introduce your resume here that

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Speaker 2: I have and I'm just gonna go over that and

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Speaker 2: you correct me if I'm wrong. I'm gonna introduce you

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Speaker 2: to my guests for those that don't know already, all right.

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Speaker 2: Colonel retired Keith Nightingale. Education United States Army War College

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Speaker 2: eighty seven, US Army Commander, General Staff School seventy six.

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Speaker 2: He's got a political science bachelors from Claremont in sixty five.

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Speaker 2: Military background US Army sixty five through ninety three included

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Speaker 2: the following assignments. His last assignment was the director of

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Speaker 2: the Department of Defense Counter Drug Task Force in Latin America.

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Speaker 2: Mister then Colonel Nightingale supervised a standalone joint staff organization

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Speaker 2: of sixty eight personnel, including military customs, the Central Intelligence Agency,

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Speaker 2: the DEA, and ins personnel. The organization was designed and

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Speaker 2: managed by Colonel retired Nightingale, and included state of the

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Speaker 2: art communication systems and all source intelligence capabilities. The task

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Speaker 2: force was responsible for developing and executing an and dean

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Speaker 2: Ridge regional interdiction attack on the drug industry, combining US

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Speaker 2: and host nation assets. His responsibilities included planning and executing

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Speaker 2: the DoD and customs aviation support to the counter drug effort,

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Speaker 2: as well as supervision of the Adean Ridge Security Assistance

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Speaker 2: Program and the Escobar Task Force. Colonel retired Nightingale was

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Speaker 2: the key coordinator for DoD in the pursuit of Pablo

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Speaker 2: Escobar and managed the direct support to the government of Columbia.

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Speaker 2: There's more. Colonel Nightingale served two tours in Vietnam. One

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Speaker 2: is the senior advisor to the fifty second Vietnamese Ranger

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Speaker 2: Battalion to include TET nineteen sixty eight. The second was

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Speaker 2: his rifle company commander in the Hunter first Airborne to

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Speaker 2: include Lambson seven one to nine er. Upon return from Vietnam,

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Speaker 2: Captain Nightingale became a founding member of the first of

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Speaker 2: the seventy fifth Ranger Battalion when it was created by

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Speaker 2: General Creighton Abrams in nineteen seventy four, later commanding both

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Speaker 2: that battalion and the Ranger Brigade. His first battalion command

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Speaker 2: was the five o ninth Airborne, an independent airborne battalion

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Speaker 2: in Italy with a broad Northern American Treaty Organization mission.

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Speaker 2: He later commanded the two five oh fifth Battalion Task

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Speaker 2: Force of the eighty second Airborne Division, the one to

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Speaker 2: seventy fifth Rangers, and the Ranger Training Brigade. His experiences

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Speaker 2: in these commands include the liberation of Grenada and Panama

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Speaker 2: and a variety of special operation missions. As the Ranger

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Speaker 2: Brigade Commander, mister Nightingale developed the present Army Ranger Training

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Speaker 2: Program and initiated the Snowcap Model training program for DEA

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Speaker 2: personnel assigned to operation missions in Latin America. As a

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Speaker 2: battalion commander in the eighty second Airborne, the lieutenant colonel

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Speaker 2: at the time conceptualized and executed the return of the

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Speaker 2: eighty second Airborne to Normandy for the fortieth anniversary. This

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Speaker 2: was the first time they had been to Saint Mary

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Speaker 2: Glise since sixth June nineteen forty four d Day. Subsequently,

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Speaker 2: Colonel retired, Nightingale has led annual battlefield to raidewalks in

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Speaker 2: the Normandy area, and as an honorary citizen of the

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Speaker 2: City of Saint Mary Eglise. Colonel Nightingale commanded at every

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Speaker 2: level in the two to five oh five, from second

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Speaker 2: platoon leader to battalion commander and acting commander of the

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Speaker 2: five oh five PR. Mister Nightingale's military staff assignments included

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Speaker 2: as an original member of the US Special Operations Command

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Speaker 2: and joined Secial Operations Command when they were created in

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Speaker 2: the aftermath of a failed Iran rescue. Prior to this,

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Speaker 2: he was the member of the Special Operations Director of

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Speaker 2: the Army Staff and participated as the Ground Operations Officer

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Speaker 2: within Task Force Eagle Claw the Iran rescue attempt. Key

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Speaker 2: programs included participating in the planning for the Iran rescue

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Speaker 2: Achille leuro incident, Dosier kidnapping, the TWA hij USCMIA issues extractions,

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Speaker 2: and various bay route hostage programs. Additional responsibilities in this

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Speaker 2: area included developing and executing a zero based special Operations

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Speaker 2: budget exceeding three hundred million US dollars. Mister Nightingale also

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Speaker 2: served as special assistance of the Commander in Chief US

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Speaker 2: Special Operations Command and US since South. I'm breathing, I'm breathing.

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Speaker 2: I'm breathing, I'm breathing. There's more. I'm almost there. During

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Speaker 2: a portion of the above, he was seconded to the

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Speaker 2: CIA within its Operations Directorate. Professional Affiliations, US Army Ranger,

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Speaker 2: Society of Vietnamese Rangers, Life Member in the five oh

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Speaker 2: five pir and the Ranger Regiment. Awards and Honors, Defense

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Speaker 2: Superior Service Medal, three Legs of Merit, five Defense Meritorious

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Speaker 2: Service Medals, Humanitarian Service Medal, Iran and four Bronze Stars

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Speaker 2: of Valor, the Vietnamese Medal of Honor Acroix du Guier.

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Speaker 2: I hope I didn't say that wrong with Gold Palm,

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Speaker 2: Member of the eighty second and Ranger Regiment, Halls of Fame,

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Speaker 2: Officer of the French Legion de honein bro. Can you

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Speaker 2: sign my baseball card please?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? How great val art. But I can tell you

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Speaker 3: that all those impressive looking titles, none of them came

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Speaker 3: by design. They were all by chance. You know, I'm

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Speaker 3: a big believer and that life is luck and timing,

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Speaker 3: And what I did basically was I just happened to

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Speaker 3: be at the right place at the right time, and

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Speaker 3: the particular jobs just kind of meshed with my personality.

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Speaker 3: So I was very fortunate in that regard. Was certainly

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Speaker 3: not something I ever planned for. It just happened.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it just came your way. You just stepped this

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Speaker 2: way and then stepped that way, and that's where it

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Speaker 2: led you. And you were the guy. It's just like, hey,

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Speaker 2: this is your life. I grew growing up with a

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Speaker 2: father in the Special Forces community. It was just like,

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Speaker 2: that's just how he was. It's just his life. He

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Speaker 2: went and rocked, he went and did these things. It's

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Speaker 2: just who he was and managed to do it every

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Speaker 2: single day, and other people did other things in their lives.

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Speaker 3: I just did what I did.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's so awesome that you've been through so much

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Speaker 2: of our history of battle, right, I mean, boy, okay,

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Speaker 2: so let me just rebring up my dad, former Green Brier.

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Speaker 3: Right.

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Speaker 2: He was in sixty eight sixty nine in the Navy

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Speaker 2: in Vietnam and then went up until about ninety one

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Speaker 2: ninety two as an SF guy. Same type of you know,

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Speaker 2: timeframe that you put in. I'm sure he'd be like

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Speaker 2: you're interviewing who today, Aaron.

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Speaker 3: He was probably in the swift boats down in three Corps,

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Speaker 3: three and four corps.

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Speaker 2: He was a radio operator and so he did Morse code,

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Speaker 2: and so he just talked, yeah, on a boat, some

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Speaker 2: kind of boat, some kind of boat, frigate maybe a frigate.

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Speaker 3: Well, frigate's off shore. Was he in the Brownwater Navy

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Speaker 3: or the Blue Water.

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Speaker 2: He said that they were being encroached, so their systems

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Speaker 2: all shut down down and their boat stopped in Chinese

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Speaker 2: waters perhaps, and they were just adrift and they were

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Speaker 2: being encroached upon by Chinese and so they were burning

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Speaker 2: everything inside of their boiler. So he or whatever, they're

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Speaker 2: just burning everything, burned all the paperwork. They thought they

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Speaker 2: would get boarded and attacked and et cetera. And then

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Speaker 2: he said there was a marine who was on standby

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Speaker 2: to put one in him if it was to come

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Speaker 2: to that. So, since he was the radio guy and

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Speaker 2: he handled every single thing for you know, the comms

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Speaker 2: spoke the language of Morse code, and back then, back then,

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Speaker 2: that's that's our cane now, yeah, exactly. It was essential then.

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Speaker 2: I mean, when I was in the Vietnamese Rangers, the

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Speaker 2: bulk of our communications was UHF by Morse code because

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Speaker 2: we were in the deep Green and the FM didn't work,

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Speaker 2: so we usually used a long wire antenna with one

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Speaker 2: of the old World War two bicycle generator systems. And

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Speaker 2: you had this Vietnamese guy with a Morse key on

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Speaker 2: his leg, happy now you know, help us, help us,

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Speaker 2: we're surrounded and overrun over. He probably had that down.

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Speaker 2: He probably reputation. Oh man, my dad had that same

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Speaker 2: system at home, and I would put it on and

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Speaker 2: I'd sit there and tap it on myself, just not

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Speaker 2: realizing what exactly as a young man, you know, ten

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Speaker 2: eleven years old, growing up around all that equipment. But

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Speaker 2: he told me as a joke, which wasn't a joke.

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Speaker 2: He's like, oh, I mean when I was in the

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Speaker 2: boy Scouts and Explorers, we did Morse code. Yes, you

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Speaker 2: know that was one of the merit badges because at

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Speaker 2: that time Morse was a primary means of transmission. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: it was, you know, send a message off to another

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Speaker 2: place and use Morse code. Come on, now, I've seen

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Speaker 2: three amigos. I only have fifteen dollars to send a

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Speaker 2: code just say we'll be there stop. Yeah really, And

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Speaker 2: so I know I'm laughing with you, and I love

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Speaker 2: that you were in the Boy Scouts. You know, I'm

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Speaker 2: a big proponent of the Boy Scouts, and I know

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Speaker 2: it's going to Scout in America, but I'm okay with

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Speaker 2: the fundamentals of learning to sustain yourself in a situation

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Speaker 2: or helping others in need.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, I lived out in the country, which I

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Speaker 3: still do, and the Boy Scouts and the Explorers in

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Speaker 3: my area were really focused on the local environment. You know,

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Speaker 3: we did a lot of hiking, fishing, learn how particular

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Speaker 3: outdoor survival skills if you would. So it was valuable

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Speaker 3: to me in my later life. I mean, I wasn't

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Speaker 3: scared or ranger school. You know, I'd been in the

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Speaker 3: Boonies shore, so you know, all I had helped in

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Speaker 3: terms of development. But at the time you don't think

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Speaker 3: about it. You know, you just do it because that's

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Speaker 3: what everybody else is doing. So after a while you

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Speaker 3: get comfortable with it, and you know that's that has

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Speaker 3: all certainly helped me in the earlier part of my career.

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Speaker 3: You know, Vietnam is the boony Yeah, so it didn't

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Speaker 3: bother me that I was out there.

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Speaker 2: Because you'd already spent some time out there fishing and

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Speaker 2: camping and setting up your tent and just you know,

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Speaker 2: being on your own hearing noises at night, you just

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Speaker 2: do exactly. You know, it's like, what's pacing around my

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Speaker 2: tent right now out there? But now we got thermals

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Speaker 2: thermal imaging for that. If you ever want to sit

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Speaker 2: around a campfire and wonder if someone's looking at you,

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Speaker 2: turn around with a thermal optic and see if you

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Speaker 2: can see what's in the dark shadows behind the Holy Cow.

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Speaker 3: When I was in Vietnam on both my tours, that

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Speaker 3: was way before we had any technology. We loggered up

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Speaker 3: during the night because you couldn't see anybody, you know,

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Speaker 3: in the bush. Now night is your primary operating time.

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Speaker 2: Yes, starlight night vision was just starting to float around.

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Speaker 3: Well, starlight needed moonlight, you know, if it was less

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Speaker 3: than thirty percent PMI, they didn't really work.

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Speaker 2: X It's got billows that opened up to suck in

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Speaker 2: the light, I believe, and so it has to have

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Speaker 2: that light.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, but it was limited. You know, the optics then

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Speaker 3: were limited so that it still needed light to gather

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Speaker 3: so you could focus on the actual target you're looking at.

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Speaker 3: Like I said, if you had less than thirty percent PMI.

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Speaker 3: They were maybe good for only about twenty five or

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Speaker 3: thirty meters any kind of moonlight. You could probably get

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Speaker 3: one hundred meters out of it in an open.

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Speaker 2: Ground a football field.

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Speaker 3: Huh.

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Speaker 2: Yeah that's now Today you've got like high tech nudge,

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Speaker 2: you know, modular I mean night vision, PBS phosphor.

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Speaker 3: The optic system does your killing. Yeah, thermally, you know,

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Speaker 3: it tells you when you're on target, and all you

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Speaker 3: got to do is follow the.

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Speaker 2: Really, I mean really really now you okay? In Vietnam

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Speaker 2: now again, we came together by a mutual friend, Jim Johnson,

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Speaker 2: his father, Jim Johnson Junior. I don't know if you're

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Speaker 2: it was always Colonel Johnes. Colonel Johnson. He was my brigade.

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Speaker 2: Was that during you know the time in Vietnam? When

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Speaker 2: was he your brigade commander?

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Speaker 3: This is when I came back to the eighty second

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Speaker 3: as a battalion commander, like nineteen eighty one through eighty four,

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Speaker 3: and he was my first brigade commander and a really

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Speaker 3: good guy. He allowed me to do things that perhaps

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Speaker 3: he wouldn't have allowed with others because he understood what

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Speaker 3: I was trying to do. Basically, I turned the two

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Speaker 3: five of five into a ranger battalion, so it required

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Speaker 3: a lot of work and some things that were kind

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Speaker 3: of unusual for the eighty second. And he was very supportive,

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Speaker 3: as was General Lindsay, the CG during that whole time.

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Speaker 2: That's really nice. And so he gave you kind of

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Speaker 2: like free reign to do your job and do it

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Speaker 2: and then you know, if he needs you.

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Speaker 3: He gave me very broad latitude and as long as

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Speaker 3: I told him what I was doing, he would support me.

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Speaker 3: You know. Occasionally when I would do something off the rails,

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Speaker 3: he'd call me in and say, why did you do that?

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Speaker 3: And I would say for the following reasons, whatever they were,

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Speaker 3: and he'd say, okay, but talk to me next time

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Speaker 3: before you do it. Let me know.

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Speaker 2: He was very taller, sure and understanding, but he knew

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Speaker 2: the type of person that you were in your persona,

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Speaker 2: and so he was able to work with you.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 2: I mean, he does have his son who has like

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Speaker 2: followed his legacy of being a stellar officer in the

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Speaker 2: military as well. Do you ever get those two confused?

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Speaker 3: Junior is certainly part of his head. You know, they

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Speaker 3: had the same basic characteristics you know, physically fit, understood soldiers,

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Speaker 3: which not a lot of people do, and knew how

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Speaker 3: to get the most out of people, which is another

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Speaker 3: skill set.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, and and I know he's going to

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Speaker 2: be listening to this, So just a shout out to you, Jim,

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Speaker 2: and thanks for bringing Keith into my life. And I

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Speaker 2: love it. So far, so good, right, so far, so good.

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Speaker 2: Now now, well, Jim, Jim Jr.

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Speaker 3: And I go back to Jordan. I spent a lot

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Speaker 3: of time there, both in the Special ops as well

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Speaker 3: as later as civilian on putting in a communications and

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Speaker 3: ops center for the Jordanians. So you know, we knew

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Speaker 3: his majesty and we knew the people around him, so

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Speaker 3: we were both welcome because I think the Jordanians recognized

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Speaker 3: us as being real soldiers, you know, not just you know,

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Speaker 3: paper mache dummies with a contract.

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Speaker 2: Like to see you for you a warrior? Yeah yeah, well.

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Speaker 3: Sure, I mean I Abdullah was a colonel and the

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Speaker 3: who ran the first the Special Operations brigade. He was

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Speaker 3: at that time, he wasn't expected to be the king

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Speaker 3: because the king's brother, Hussein uh you know, was the

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Speaker 3: nextant line. So Abdullah then was basically the brigade commander. Uh,

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Speaker 3: and we got on great. We jumped together at one

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Speaker 3: of their airfields and then he treated me to a

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Speaker 3: couple ebations out of the saddle bags of cool.

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Speaker 2: That's so cool. You know, he loves his camouflage. You know,

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Speaker 2: he has like so many different active patterns in his

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Speaker 2: Jordaanian military that are I just I look for them.

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Speaker 2: I love like I've got my tiger stripe on right now,

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Speaker 2: You've got your multi cam on right now, Like I

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Speaker 2: love all different camouflages. Big props to him believing in

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Speaker 2: his camouflage. I love that.

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Speaker 3: Well. He's very forward thinking and in an extremely difficult situation.

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Speaker 3: You know, he, like his dad, has to walk a

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Speaker 3: very small tightrope with their Palestinian population.

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Speaker 2: Uh.

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Speaker 3: You know, Abdullah is focused towards the West and Western

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Speaker 3: values and h the situation today as well as previously.

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Speaker 3: You know, he had to balance the desires of his

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Speaker 3: Palestinian citizenry at the same same time with his beliefs

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Speaker 3: and what needed to be done. Yeah, not an email task.

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Speaker 2: That region is definitely difficult to navigate in this day today.

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Speaker 2: You know, it's a he's doing it, but he is

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Speaker 2: a very Western valued kind of individual and or seems

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Speaker 2: to be with his own you know, heritage, right, I

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Speaker 2: get it.

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Speaker 3: Well, you know his education. He went to Deerfield Academy

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Speaker 3: in Massachusetts, and then he went to Camberly, you know,

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Speaker 3: the military the West point for the United Kingdom, and

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Speaker 3: you know that's where his value structure comes from, plus

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Speaker 3: his own you know hash in my legacy.

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Speaker 2: That's amazing. And you jumped with him, that's so cool.

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Speaker 2: Static line jump right.

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Speaker 3: Static line jump one thirty at one of the more

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Speaker 3: distant airfields. His dad was in the audience. So we

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Speaker 3: were going to jump, and I think the winds were

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Speaker 3: probably twenty plus off the drop zone. I still have

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Speaker 3: on my Tha fifty back there the scratch marks from

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Speaker 3: being dragged across the runway, you know, and the wind

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Speaker 3: trying to get us a parachute to drop. Bro.

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Speaker 2: That's a cool story right there. That's way I love

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Speaker 2: airborne stories.

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Speaker 3: Airborne, well, it was it was unusual. I mean my

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Speaker 3: dzso on the ground was giving me the wind readings

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Speaker 3: and they were all eighteen to twenty five. Oh, you

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Speaker 3: were just a normal no jumps in the US. But

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Speaker 3: he also said that Jordanians that's with him says, this

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Speaker 3: jump will happen, and even if you don't jump out,

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Speaker 3: they will. So you know, it was basically a done deal.

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Speaker 3: We just had to had to do it.

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Speaker 2: Not a segue, right like, because you got so much

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Speaker 2: I read a lot of you know, just things that

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Speaker 2: you want people to know about. Okay, So so Panama right.

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Speaker 2: I got a friend who jumped into grenade Panama mad

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Speaker 2: Max Mullen, Howard Mullan. He's a ranger Hall of Fame guy.

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Speaker 2: And uh, did you go in on that as well?

340
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Speaker 2: Were you a part of Uh?

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Speaker 3: No, I was not in on the initial assault. I

342
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Speaker 3: came in on the follow on, on the reconstitution. Uh.

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Speaker 3: We had we were still rooting out the a lot

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Speaker 3: of the call it the Gorilla resistance. Even though we

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Speaker 3: had gotten the pres out Pineapple Face, there was still.

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Speaker 2: A lot of.

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Speaker 3: No diego. There was still a lot of dissidents that

348
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Speaker 3: we're trying to create issues with the election process. Billy

349
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Speaker 3: Ford was the guy that was basically running for president

350
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Speaker 3: in a democratic election, and so we had to work

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Speaker 3: very closely with the newly installed Panamanian police plus our

352
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Speaker 3: own intelligence networks to pinpoint these guys and put them

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Speaker 3: in their box before the election began. The other part

354
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Speaker 3: of it was squelching all these rumors that the US

355
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Speaker 3: had killed thousands of Panamanians and had buried him in

356
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Speaker 3: the woods. My job, among others, was to get with

357
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Speaker 3: the most vehement anti US person who was claiming these

358
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Speaker 3: mass casualties, and General Jallen gave me a platoon of

359
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Speaker 3: engineers along with a couple of medics, and we went

360
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Speaker 3: to every place that she said there were buried bodies,

361
00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:03,440
Speaker 3: and we went out there with her on the side

362
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Speaker 3: in the jungle with the engineers and we said, okay,

363
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Speaker 3: where do you want us to dig, you know, and

364
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Speaker 3: there was nothing there because there wasn't nothing.

365
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Speaker 2: You're looking for the accountability you're like, we'll take that was.

366
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Speaker 3: Sort of what we had to do to eliminate all

367
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Speaker 3: the noise, uh in the election process. Well that's good.

368
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Speaker 2: At least you went and did that. I mean, you know,

369
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Speaker 2: you were like, show us, show us where this is at,

370
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Speaker 2: Like we'll go and uncover this in on earth this

371
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Speaker 2: and figure why this what happened was this? That's that's

372
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Speaker 2: a big atrocity to claim.

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Speaker 3: We also made a point of inviting the local press

374
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Speaker 3: so that they could see you know, they hear what

375
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Speaker 3: she says and then they see what they.

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Speaker 2: She's taking them there, and yeah, yeah, She's like, this

377
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Speaker 2: is where it's supposed to be. This is X, this

378
00:22:49,720 --> 00:22:52,040
Speaker 2: is X, this is what she's saying. They you like,

379
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Speaker 2: let's go bring your press boom right, just clear the air.

380
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Speaker 3: Yeah, And you know, eventually she could see what was

381
00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:03,920
Speaker 3: going on and she just basically bailed.

382
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Speaker 2: Are you anything to do with the Desert storm?

383
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Speaker 3: I was assisting on the intelligent side when I was Panama.

384
00:23:16,040 --> 00:23:21,680
Speaker 3: Oddly enough, through General Downing. General Downing and I knew

385
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Speaker 3: each other in the Ranger Battalion were the first creator.

386
00:23:24,760 --> 00:23:28,919
Speaker 3: He was the second S three. I was a headquarters

387
00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:33,399
Speaker 3: company commander slash plans officer, and we had been close

388
00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:36,159
Speaker 3: ever since and actually through the day that he died.

389
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Speaker 3: My particular job, because I had some unique intelligence ASSSS,

390
00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:45,560
Speaker 3: was to independently look at some of the intel packages

391
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Speaker 3: that he was given. He was a JASOK commander then,

392
00:23:50,200 --> 00:23:54,040
Speaker 3: and I would give him an independent analysis of what

393
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Speaker 3: I thought. It was very peripheral. You know, most of

394
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Speaker 3: my time, all my time, virtually, it was spent chasing

395
00:24:00,560 --> 00:24:04,200
Speaker 3: the druggies. You know. After we got Pablo, the thing

396
00:24:04,280 --> 00:24:10,280
Speaker 3: shifted to developing host nation drug interdiction programs. You know,

397
00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:15,160
Speaker 3: we worked with either their military or their federal police

398
00:24:15,840 --> 00:24:20,119
Speaker 3: to go after the precursor chemical labs down in the

399
00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:23,160
Speaker 3: south along the Pu Demle or up in the Andian

400
00:24:23,280 --> 00:24:28,000
Speaker 3: Ridge Bolivia, Peru, Ecuador, Venezuela, or wherever they would grow

401
00:24:28,040 --> 00:24:31,119
Speaker 3: on the dope. You know, we would develop local host

402
00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:35,320
Speaker 3: nation forces so they could chase after the drugies, and

403
00:24:35,760 --> 00:24:39,800
Speaker 3: we would provide secondary support in a way of intelligence

404
00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:43,600
Speaker 3: or oversight as to what they were doing. I had

405
00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:47,359
Speaker 3: an a wax from Customs all. You know, Customs is our.

406
00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:50,560
Speaker 2: Big that's an aircraft with a big circle satellite dish

407
00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:52,440
Speaker 2: that spins around on top of it.

408
00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:55,600
Speaker 3: And we would put the host nation people on board

409
00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:59,840
Speaker 3: when they would run anop and they were just wow,

410
00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:04,000
Speaker 3: you know, this is the cats mew. And because of that,

411
00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:07,440
Speaker 3: they became a lot more supportive. You know, they initially

412
00:25:07,520 --> 00:25:11,119
Speaker 3: were kind of suspicious, didn't want to do it, madeor

413
00:25:11,280 --> 00:25:14,280
Speaker 3: problem in country because the Tugies had a lot of power,

414
00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:17,280
Speaker 3: and you know, we would show them all with toys

415
00:25:18,080 --> 00:25:20,639
Speaker 3: and we did a lot of ground training through the

416
00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:25,280
Speaker 3: unit down there as well as I had CIA and

417
00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:29,760
Speaker 3: DEA and Customs, and you know, we would put it

418
00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:33,199
Speaker 3: all together and we'd target a drug lab and we

419
00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:36,840
Speaker 3: would have the host nation guys go in against it directly,

420
00:25:37,240 --> 00:25:39,879
Speaker 3: and we'd be overhead with the a wax with the

421
00:25:39,920 --> 00:25:43,520
Speaker 3: locals on board, and they were directing their people. So

422
00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:45,080
Speaker 3: it was very reinforcement.

423
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:47,159
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're just seeing that you could see things that

424
00:25:47,200 --> 00:25:49,960
Speaker 2: they had no idea it could be seen. And it

425
00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:52,280
Speaker 2: just kind of like said, hey, check out a wax, right,

426
00:25:52,359 --> 00:25:55,480
Speaker 2: this aircraft that has technology. And back then what yours was?

427
00:25:55,520 --> 00:25:56,920
Speaker 2: This is like the eighties nineties.

428
00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:02,040
Speaker 3: No, this was nineteen ninety through ninety.

429
00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:05,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, nineteen ninety ninety three, right, So I mean a wax, right,

430
00:26:06,640 --> 00:26:08,920
Speaker 2: I know what it does. You know what it does.

431
00:26:09,320 --> 00:26:10,800
Speaker 2: But if you don't know what it does.

432
00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:15,880
Speaker 3: Right exactly, well, it was a shiny news boy. I mean,

433
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:17,439
Speaker 3: it didn't cost him any moody.

434
00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:19,679
Speaker 2: It listens to everything and sees things that no one

435
00:26:19,720 --> 00:26:22,520
Speaker 2: else knows. And you're just like what they're watching TV

436
00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:24,600
Speaker 2: in their house and that's the show. You're like, wait

437
00:26:24,600 --> 00:26:25,440
Speaker 2: a second here.

438
00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:29,480
Speaker 3: Well, I you know example, I watched the takedown on

439
00:26:29,640 --> 00:26:33,720
Speaker 3: Pablo looking at the Fleer feed from the Customs bird

440
00:26:34,640 --> 00:26:37,160
Speaker 3: you know, I was actually in Panama on the op

441
00:26:37,280 --> 00:26:42,000
Speaker 3: Center during this particular takedown, and we had an a

442
00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:45,760
Speaker 3: wax overhead with locals on board from the search block,

443
00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:49,600
Speaker 3: and you know, I was just getting the feed from

444
00:26:49,640 --> 00:26:51,840
Speaker 3: the a wax. I could see him on the roof.

445
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:55,919
Speaker 3: I could see the vehicles pulling in and the guard

446
00:26:56,000 --> 00:27:00,480
Speaker 3: guys chasing up the stairs and there's Pablo chunkin across

447
00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:03,920
Speaker 3: the tile roof and he gets whacked and he's down,

448
00:27:04,200 --> 00:27:06,560
Speaker 3: you know, all two hundred and fifty pounds of him,

449
00:27:06,680 --> 00:27:07,800
Speaker 3: draped over the tile.

450
00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:10,280
Speaker 2: Wow.

451
00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:17,120
Speaker 3: Man, Wow, technology is wonderful, I.

452
00:27:17,040 --> 00:27:19,960
Speaker 2: Mean really right. And so that takes care of that

453
00:27:20,160 --> 00:27:26,560
Speaker 2: story right into story there. And so did his organization tricked?

454
00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:29,000
Speaker 2: Is it still trying to thrive? Did it just fizzle

455
00:27:29,040 --> 00:27:30,240
Speaker 2: down after he was taken?

456
00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:37,400
Speaker 3: What happened is basically, the Colombians eliminated Mediine when they

457
00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:43,920
Speaker 3: eliminated Pablo as a force there. The drug program then

458
00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:48,120
Speaker 3: was shifted over to Collie, way down south, and they

459
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:52,560
Speaker 3: were totally different organization, probably the most effective and efficient

460
00:27:53,240 --> 00:27:58,520
Speaker 3: international business organization on the planet. These were guys that

461
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:04,680
Speaker 3: were ranchered, wealthy ranchers in Collie and what they did

462
00:28:04,760 --> 00:28:08,199
Speaker 3: instead of shoot people, which was Pablo's approach. They just

463
00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:12,080
Speaker 3: bought them off, you know, this judge and that cop

464
00:28:12,160 --> 00:28:15,280
Speaker 3: and everything else. So it was very low key. That

465
00:28:15,720 --> 00:28:20,480
Speaker 3: plus the E l N and the UH, the FARC

466
00:28:21,040 --> 00:28:25,280
Speaker 3: created so many problems for Columbia that they just basically

467
00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:29,600
Speaker 3: kind of forgot about the drug war, right, they pulled

468
00:28:29,680 --> 00:28:33,120
Speaker 3: back and doing a whole lot. So I would say

469
00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:37,760
Speaker 3: the shift to Collie was actually to our disadvantage. You know,

470
00:28:37,840 --> 00:28:40,360
Speaker 3: if we had kept Pablo in place, we'd at least

471
00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:44,160
Speaker 3: been able to contain him. Collie was much more sophisticated.

472
00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:47,240
Speaker 3: I mean, their sons went to the Wharton School of Business.

473
00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:51,200
Speaker 3: I was just going to London School of Economics. Yeah,

474
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:53,360
Speaker 3: and you know, it was just amazing to sit there.

475
00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:55,959
Speaker 3: I was in the fence and office one day in

476
00:28:56,080 --> 00:29:00,600
Speaker 3: Louisiana watching a money transfer go down with them among

477
00:29:00,640 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 3: the bad guys, and that money in nano seconds went

478
00:29:04,800 --> 00:29:09,720
Speaker 3: across about thirty banks. It became completely untraceable, you know,

479
00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:13,560
Speaker 3: at a point and very quickly just boom. Yeah.

480
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:16,120
Speaker 2: See these guys go get trained up and you don't

481
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:19,280
Speaker 2: even know who they are. Sometimes they're just like working

482
00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:20,120
Speaker 2: next to everybody.

483
00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:23,120
Speaker 3: Well, you know, it's a bunch of teenagers in their garage,

484
00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:24,520
Speaker 3: you know, doing it.

485
00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:27,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, you know. So there's other things that

486
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:29,320
Speaker 2: go along with it, like the guys that get the

487
00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:32,240
Speaker 2: government contracts that can't fulfill it, but they apply for

488
00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:34,400
Speaker 2: a contract next thing. You know, they're important the wrong

489
00:29:34,440 --> 00:29:36,680
Speaker 2: AMMO and selling it to our troops. It's like they

490
00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:39,520
Speaker 2: just get their hands into these situations. Like you said,

491
00:29:39,520 --> 00:29:42,520
Speaker 2: sometimes it's luck. Sometimes you just stepped right into it,

492
00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:44,560
Speaker 2: like I didn't, you know, and.

493
00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:46,760
Speaker 3: You know I don't.

494
00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:50,760
Speaker 2: That's crazy, right, No, Really, you went after Pablo Bro

495
00:29:50,840 --> 00:29:54,080
Speaker 2: Pablo Escobar, and you've been involved in so many different

496
00:29:55,080 --> 00:29:58,080
Speaker 2: theaters of operations. Right, it wasn't just based on just

497
00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:00,080
Speaker 2: the Pacific you were. You did do a lot of

498
00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:07,600
Speaker 2: Latin America, right, Yes, that really was between my army

499
00:30:07,640 --> 00:30:13,000
Speaker 2: and my civilian life. I probably spent fifteen years more

500
00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:17,200
Speaker 2: or less throughout Latin America. Initially when we were in

501
00:30:17,280 --> 00:30:21,480
Speaker 2: Special Ops, when I was a major slash lieutenant colonel,

502
00:30:21,800 --> 00:30:24,800
Speaker 2: we spent most of our time focused on El Salvador

503
00:30:25,240 --> 00:30:29,560
Speaker 2: and Nicaragua and Honduras. I helped set up the camps

504
00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:34,360
Speaker 2: and the Honduras side for the our side, and Ali

505
00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:37,360
Speaker 2: North did the ones down south in Costa Rica. But

506
00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:41,560
Speaker 2: we had two totally different reporting chains. I went through

507
00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:46,280
Speaker 2: the agency guys and he had a separate program. But

508
00:30:46,600 --> 00:30:49,440
Speaker 2: I remember seeing him get interviewed by Congress over the

509
00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:52,160
Speaker 2: whole situation in his Marine Corps uniform, you know, and

510
00:30:52,200 --> 00:30:53,000
Speaker 2: I sit with my dad.

511
00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:56,280
Speaker 3: He just kind of like, that's why. My handler, if

512
00:30:56,320 --> 00:30:59,360
Speaker 3: you would, was very careful to make sure that we

513
00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:03,960
Speaker 3: had memo on everything that we did. Every dollar was

514
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:08,880
Speaker 3: accounted for. We had the ambassadors sign off, negar Ponte

515
00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:14,080
Speaker 3: on everything. So when they started looking at our side

516
00:31:14,120 --> 00:31:16,320
Speaker 3: of the house, we were completely clean.

517
00:31:16,520 --> 00:31:19,280
Speaker 2: Right, You're like, audit me. Here you go. You know,

518
00:31:19,880 --> 00:31:21,760
Speaker 2: you can live that line. You can live that life.

519
00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:23,600
Speaker 2: You can say, yeah, it looks funny, but go ahead

520
00:31:23,640 --> 00:31:25,440
Speaker 2: and audit it. And then they audit it and it's

521
00:31:25,520 --> 00:31:29,280
Speaker 2: not funny. You know, I'm just saying, but then that's funny.

522
00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:32,040
Speaker 2: It can be funny. And I know that during all

523
00:31:32,080 --> 00:31:35,720
Speaker 2: of that, President Reagan and his administration was really trying

524
00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:37,320
Speaker 2: to say, hey, you know, what's going on down the

525
00:31:37,320 --> 00:31:39,920
Speaker 2: Contras and everything like that. You know, the violence of

526
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:43,080
Speaker 2: the Contras and their tactics of the contrast were not

527
00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:46,440
Speaker 2: as hardcore as it was being propagated through the media

528
00:31:46,920 --> 00:31:49,240
Speaker 2: or being talked about, you know, and then you have

529
00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:52,880
Speaker 2: you're referred to them as Ali. But Colonel Oliver North,

530
00:31:52,880 --> 00:31:54,640
Speaker 2: which a Colonel Oliver North at the time, you know,

531
00:31:54,720 --> 00:31:58,720
Speaker 2: Marine Corps was around contrast, there was arms going to

532
00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:02,800
Speaker 2: the Contras after it was supposedly stopped, right, and that's

533
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:05,200
Speaker 2: where he kind of got involved. You weren't in dealing.

534
00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:08,840
Speaker 3: That was the It was a deal with Iran. Yeah, uh,

535
00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:11,440
Speaker 3: you know it was we had to figure out a

536
00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:15,239
Speaker 3: way to get guns and money to the Iranians. And

537
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:20,120
Speaker 3: on Ali's side, I don't know quite how it meant worked,

538
00:32:20,720 --> 00:32:24,800
Speaker 3: but they would they would get money from arm sales

539
00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:28,280
Speaker 3: and it would end up supporting the Iran program. Was

540
00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:31,120
Speaker 3: Iran contra. It was what the investigation was.

541
00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:34,480
Speaker 2: Right, right, And so I don't know, our guys.

542
00:32:34,200 --> 00:32:40,400
Speaker 3: Were pretty clean. In order for us to give them food, AMMO,

543
00:32:41,000 --> 00:32:44,440
Speaker 3: take care of their families, you know, we required them

544
00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:46,600
Speaker 3: to tell us what the op was going to be,

545
00:32:47,280 --> 00:32:50,320
Speaker 3: and in many cases we provided the intelligence for the

546
00:32:50,400 --> 00:32:54,360
Speaker 3: op and it was primarily resupply ops across the Gulf

547
00:32:54,440 --> 00:32:57,840
Speaker 3: of Onseeca that we were trying to interdict because that

548
00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:02,680
Speaker 3: there was the Nicaraguans say, and Denistas were shipping arms

549
00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:08,880
Speaker 3: to El Salvador, and that was really our focus was

550
00:33:08,960 --> 00:33:10,520
Speaker 3: preserving El Salvador.

551
00:33:10,800 --> 00:33:16,600
Speaker 2: Wow, that's you know that that whole era. The Contrast

552
00:33:17,320 --> 00:33:20,040
Speaker 2: created one of the biggest video games in the world

553
00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:25,000
Speaker 2: called Contra. I just want you to know. Nintendo just

554
00:33:25,120 --> 00:33:27,240
Speaker 2: picked it up. They put a character like Arnold and

555
00:33:27,280 --> 00:33:29,840
Speaker 2: Stallone as the two Bay guys that went running.

556
00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:32,240
Speaker 3: Through the game's the TV show Narco, I.

557
00:33:32,280 --> 00:33:38,880
Speaker 2: Know, I mean really, you know, yeah, I'm kind of

558
00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:43,160
Speaker 2: speechless right now because what you've done is awesome and

559
00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:46,560
Speaker 2: also not awesome but awesome. Does that make sense? Like

560
00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:47,160
Speaker 2: you were in.

561
00:33:49,640 --> 00:33:53,160
Speaker 3: It was fun? Yeah, you know it was I had

562
00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:56,960
Speaker 3: a lot of freedom, yes, and the general just said,

563
00:33:57,120 --> 00:34:01,080
Speaker 3: you know, go do this broad terms, yes, and we'd

564
00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:04,400
Speaker 3: pull all these people together play with new toys. You know.

565
00:34:04,600 --> 00:34:07,360
Speaker 3: It was great, you could It was kind of like

566
00:34:07,440 --> 00:34:10,759
Speaker 3: being in a giant toy box. You know. Suddenly I

567
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:14,520
Speaker 3: got agency NSA, you know, and a partridge and a

568
00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:18,200
Speaker 3: pair of te and you go off, we.

569
00:34:18,280 --> 00:34:21,879
Speaker 2: Do it, yes, and it's great and we get done. Yeah,

570
00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:24,239
Speaker 2: You're like this, let's get this done, and it would

571
00:34:24,239 --> 00:34:29,120
Speaker 2: get done it Oh wow, wow, Wow. So when we

572
00:34:29,160 --> 00:34:30,879
Speaker 2: talked on the phone the other day when we were

573
00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:33,799
Speaker 2: touching base, you said that you you still go you

574
00:34:33,840 --> 00:34:35,759
Speaker 2: go to the VA now? Or what's going on now

575
00:34:35,800 --> 00:34:37,680
Speaker 2: that you're out? Are you you go to the VA?

576
00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:41,479
Speaker 2: You're doing good? Everything's all up enough? Well answer yes

577
00:34:41,560 --> 00:34:47,040
Speaker 2: and no, I have. I'm in remission from cancer, okay.

578
00:34:47,239 --> 00:34:52,319
Speaker 2: And for that I went to UCLA Med, which has

579
00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:55,520
Speaker 2: a number of branches in Santa Barbara, which is convenient

580
00:34:55,600 --> 00:34:58,919
Speaker 2: for me. Plus all the rich old folks in Montecito

581
00:34:59,040 --> 00:35:01,760
Speaker 2: donate a lot to the hospital. Good, so the food

582
00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:02,959
Speaker 2: is actually pretty good.

583
00:35:05,080 --> 00:35:07,880
Speaker 3: So and that. Yeah, the big stuff I go to

584
00:35:08,280 --> 00:35:13,839
Speaker 3: UCLA Med. The smaller call it continuing stuff. I go

585
00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:18,720
Speaker 3: to the VA. They just opened up a new major

586
00:35:18,880 --> 00:35:21,480
Speaker 3: facility in Ventura, which is close to me.

587
00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:23,560
Speaker 2: What do you think about that, DoD I my.

588
00:35:23,719 --> 00:35:27,560
Speaker 3: DP is there. Ironically enough, the guy used to be

589
00:35:27,680 --> 00:35:31,719
Speaker 3: a med tech and the one sixtieth and you know

590
00:35:31,760 --> 00:35:35,000
Speaker 3: we talked about that, the creation of Task Force one

591
00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:38,480
Speaker 3: sixty and you know how it began, all things he

592
00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:43,239
Speaker 3: had no idea of, you know. But yeah, for a

593
00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:48,319
Speaker 3: lot of my meds because they're free, and I go

594
00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:51,680
Speaker 3: there for my call it my GP checkups, you know,

595
00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:53,120
Speaker 3: once every six months.

596
00:35:53,719 --> 00:35:55,879
Speaker 2: So the one sixtieth are you talking about the one

597
00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:56,719
Speaker 2: sixtieth sore?

598
00:35:56,880 --> 00:36:01,640
Speaker 3: Yes, PASK Force one sixty. We created it in nineteen

599
00:36:01,880 --> 00:36:02,719
Speaker 3: eighty one.

600
00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:05,840
Speaker 2: Is that what we call night stalkers today?

601
00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:11,040
Speaker 3: Yes, Nash Force went sixty, the SORE, the Special Operations

602
00:36:11,440 --> 00:36:12,920
Speaker 3: Aviation Regiment.

603
00:36:13,120 --> 00:36:15,320
Speaker 2: Oh right, Oh, we saw.

604
00:36:15,440 --> 00:36:20,759
Speaker 3: The National GUARDH sixes and built it up from there

605
00:36:20,840 --> 00:36:22,000
Speaker 3: to where it is today.

606
00:36:22,239 --> 00:36:26,240
Speaker 2: I love that. That is so neat. You are so cool.

607
00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:30,440
Speaker 2: That is so I don't know. I just found the money.

608
00:36:30,520 --> 00:36:32,160
Speaker 2: My job was to get the money.

609
00:36:32,239 --> 00:36:32,680
Speaker 3: Good job.

610
00:36:32,719 --> 00:36:34,520
Speaker 2: Well, the thing is that somebody came to you with

611
00:36:34,640 --> 00:36:37,040
Speaker 2: their situation. You're like, well, let me find that. And

612
00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:40,080
Speaker 2: you got it done because people listened to you, and

613
00:36:40,200 --> 00:36:43,359
Speaker 2: those people that had broad, you know, rules with you

614
00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:45,479
Speaker 2: like that allowed you do these things. They were like, hey,

615
00:36:45,880 --> 00:36:48,160
Speaker 2: you're the guy man, here's the stamp. Let me stamp

616
00:36:48,200 --> 00:36:49,759
Speaker 2: that for you, and you get it done.

617
00:36:49,960 --> 00:36:52,680
Speaker 3: I would say that, you know, this was not because

618
00:36:52,719 --> 00:36:56,319
Speaker 3: I was so wonderful. It was because General Meyer, then

619
00:36:56,360 --> 00:36:59,840
Speaker 3: the Chief Staff of the Army, mandated a lot of

620
00:36:59,840 --> 00:37:03,400
Speaker 3: the things that we did over much of the opposition

621
00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:07,839
Speaker 3: of his own general officers. And so people knew when

622
00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:12,840
Speaker 3: I showed up, I was basically showing up with his requirements.

623
00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:17,480
Speaker 3: So they didn't have They foddered as hard as they could,

624
00:37:17,520 --> 00:37:21,440
Speaker 3: but they realized they were going to lose. So eventually

625
00:37:21,480 --> 00:37:24,359
Speaker 3: they just quit fighting and you know, just did it.

626
00:37:25,080 --> 00:37:28,280
Speaker 3: But it was extremely difficult. You know, my book Phoenix

627
00:37:28,440 --> 00:37:33,400
Speaker 3: Rising I indicated in the second part how absolutely difficult

628
00:37:33,400 --> 00:37:38,440
Speaker 3: it was. With the bureaucracy, the military bureaucracy. They didn't

629
00:37:38,480 --> 00:37:41,719
Speaker 3: want to do it because it wasn't invented here. They

630
00:37:42,680 --> 00:37:47,759
Speaker 3: kept demanding their own primacy, and it was essential that

631
00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:52,759
Speaker 3: everything in they call it the Special Packages be unified.

632
00:37:53,239 --> 00:37:55,520
Speaker 3: You know, we had to have aviation, we had to

633
00:37:55,560 --> 00:37:59,600
Speaker 3: have maritime, we had to have the ground pounders. So

634
00:37:59,680 --> 00:38:03,200
Speaker 3: you know, they had all of these unique units and

635
00:38:03,320 --> 00:38:08,960
Speaker 3: they operated essentially in a stovepipe through the newly created

636
00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:15,480
Speaker 3: JSOCK and then before that through the JTF the Honey

637
00:38:15,480 --> 00:38:21,040
Speaker 3: Badger period. Immediately after the Iran rescue failed, Carter said,

638
00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:23,520
Speaker 3: you've got to be ready to go back in ten days.

639
00:38:24,239 --> 00:38:29,520
Speaker 3: So whatever you need, do it now. Allway, handcuffs are off.

640
00:38:29,880 --> 00:38:33,320
Speaker 3: Whatever you need, you're going to get. And so General

641
00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:37,560
Speaker 3: Meyer took that as a requirement and created out of

642
00:38:37,600 --> 00:38:41,400
Speaker 3: whole cloth. You know, the Secret Army of Northern Virginia

643
00:38:41,680 --> 00:38:46,440
Speaker 3: is a task Force one sixty the Rangers in a

644
00:38:46,480 --> 00:38:50,600
Speaker 3: special operations mode, which the Army hated. They wanted it

645
00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:58,680
Speaker 3: to stay conventional, and a much improved Delta force. All

646
00:38:58,719 --> 00:39:02,560
Speaker 3: of that came out because of the failure and the

647
00:39:02,600 --> 00:39:07,320
Speaker 3: honey Badger period lasted about eighteen months before Jaysok took

648
00:39:07,640 --> 00:39:12,279
Speaker 3: full of control of the forces and the assets. But

649
00:39:12,400 --> 00:39:16,280
Speaker 3: that building period was incredibly important to where we are today.

650
00:39:17,000 --> 00:39:21,799
Speaker 3: I am absolutely satisfied that the failure in Iran on

651
00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:26,920
Speaker 3: their rescue led to our ability to get Osama bin Waden.

652
00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:33,440
Speaker 3: Had we succeeded, the Service chiefs les Meyer would have

653
00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:38,040
Speaker 3: wiped their hands of it and disassembled everything, and they

654
00:39:38,120 --> 00:39:42,400
Speaker 3: tried to do that. When General Wickham replaced General Meyer,

655
00:39:42,880 --> 00:39:45,960
Speaker 3: he didn't like special ops, you know. He brought his

656
00:39:46,040 --> 00:39:50,600
Speaker 3: own brand of puritism, if you would, to the army

657
00:39:50,640 --> 00:39:53,280
Speaker 3: and he tried to kill it all of the organizations.

658
00:39:53,880 --> 00:40:04,080
Speaker 3: And he went to the sec Army John Marsh, who

659
00:40:04,160 --> 00:40:10,240
Speaker 3: was wearing his asd Solik, hat the DoD special operations

660
00:40:10,280 --> 00:40:15,440
Speaker 3: are at and he said Wickham and Thurmann said we

661
00:40:15,560 --> 00:40:18,480
Speaker 3: want to get rid of Task Force one sixty. We

662
00:40:18,520 --> 00:40:22,920
Speaker 3: wanted to disband ISA, and we want to return the

663
00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:29,040
Speaker 3: rangers to conventional infantry. And what Marsh did is he

664
00:40:30,320 --> 00:40:33,280
Speaker 3: gave him a time out and he started asking people

665
00:40:33,400 --> 00:40:38,319
Speaker 3: offline about the organizations and what they were doing and

666
00:40:38,360 --> 00:40:42,439
Speaker 3: how they were doing it, primarily through General Downing, who

667
00:40:42,480 --> 00:40:46,839
Speaker 3: did all of this clandestinely back door. Myself and a

668
00:40:46,840 --> 00:40:52,880
Speaker 3: couple other people went up to the hill to talk

669
00:40:52,960 --> 00:40:56,239
Speaker 3: with our favorite committees, the hask ASSASS, the HISSIC and

670
00:40:56,320 --> 00:41:00,560
Speaker 3: Assistic and get their take on it. All of this

671
00:41:00,719 --> 00:41:05,960
Speaker 3: was reported back to Marsh and so he told Wickham

672
00:41:05,960 --> 00:41:08,680
Speaker 3: and Thurman, ain't no way you're going to do this.

673
00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:12,040
Speaker 3: In fact, you're going to support them to the maximum

674
00:41:12,080 --> 00:41:15,799
Speaker 3: extent possible. And I want to weekly memo on my

675
00:41:16,000 --> 00:41:19,799
Speaker 3: desk what you're doing to support them and so that

676
00:41:19,920 --> 00:41:24,719
Speaker 3: preserve the force. Uh. And I'm absolutely convinced that if

677
00:41:24,760 --> 00:41:29,279
Speaker 3: Wickham had been allowed to have his way, that what

678
00:41:29,360 --> 00:41:32,680
Speaker 3: you see today would not have existed. Would not exist, Yeah,

679
00:41:32,680 --> 00:41:33,000
Speaker 3: would have.

680
00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:36,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, that it just makes sense to have you guys,

681
00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:39,879
Speaker 2: you know, my dad, you guys, the guys out there

682
00:41:39,920 --> 00:41:42,080
Speaker 2: doing these things, the gals that are out there well, you.

683
00:41:42,080 --> 00:41:46,600
Speaker 3: Know, you need kind of special units to do special things.

684
00:41:47,239 --> 00:41:49,799
Speaker 3: You know, if you have a hostage rescue thing, you

685
00:41:49,880 --> 00:41:51,439
Speaker 3: can't jump in the eighty second?

686
00:41:51,480 --> 00:41:53,640
Speaker 2: Did he not see the dirty doesn't ever?

687
00:41:54,640 --> 00:41:58,160
Speaker 3: You know, there's got to be a different alternative, and

688
00:41:58,200 --> 00:42:01,880
Speaker 3: you know that's why we were created, the Joint Task Force.

689
00:42:02,280 --> 00:42:05,440
Speaker 3: You know, the JCS met a day after the hostage

690
00:42:05,920 --> 00:42:09,719
Speaker 3: situation in the embassy and he said, what are our items? Well,

691
00:42:09,760 --> 00:42:13,800
Speaker 3: we can newcomb or we can send in eighteenth Airborne Corps.

692
00:42:13,880 --> 00:42:17,239
Speaker 3: You know, there was no middle ground anywhere, which is

693
00:42:17,280 --> 00:42:19,399
Speaker 3: why we were created. Wow.

694
00:42:19,680 --> 00:42:23,160
Speaker 2: Now I have another friend that you might know, Colonel

695
00:42:23,239 --> 00:42:29,480
Speaker 2: Danny McKnight arranger arranger right blackhawk down noted, and he

696
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:32,319
Speaker 2: does or did war games with me for a long time.

697
00:42:32,880 --> 00:42:36,319
Speaker 2: He was my I would hunt him okay, and he

698
00:42:36,400 --> 00:42:39,520
Speaker 2: was Alpha commander, and then Max Mullen was Bravo commander,

699
00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:42,520
Speaker 2: so I'd usually fight with Max, and then sometimes I

700
00:42:42,520 --> 00:42:46,399
Speaker 2: would go over and fight as lieutenant for Danny as

701
00:42:46,440 --> 00:42:48,200
Speaker 2: the colonel for the war games that we would do,

702
00:42:48,239 --> 00:42:50,920
Speaker 2: he would you know, run the whole Alpha team and

703
00:42:50,920 --> 00:42:53,200
Speaker 2: then I would be one of his lieutenants over a platoon, etc.

704
00:42:53,840 --> 00:42:55,959
Speaker 2: He's like rat Where are we going to go today?

705
00:42:56,000 --> 00:42:57,279
Speaker 2: What are we going to do today? Rad? What are

706
00:42:57,280 --> 00:42:59,560
Speaker 2: we gonna do? So, you know, did you have anything

707
00:42:59,600 --> 00:43:04,160
Speaker 2: to do with you know, Serpent and you know Somalia

708
00:43:04,200 --> 00:43:07,279
Speaker 2: in that whole situation that went down over there with market.

709
00:43:07,719 --> 00:43:14,320
Speaker 3: Well Tangentially, I had retired in July. The Olympic Hotel

710
00:43:14,760 --> 00:43:20,280
Speaker 3: went down. On three October. I was living in McLean.

711
00:43:21,400 --> 00:43:27,240
Speaker 3: General Downing asked me to meet and talk to the

712
00:43:27,280 --> 00:43:32,239
Speaker 3: eight casualties that were sent back to Walter Reid. So

713
00:43:32,360 --> 00:43:36,960
Speaker 3: I interviewed all of them, got their story about various things,

714
00:43:37,920 --> 00:43:41,799
Speaker 3: and reported that back to General Downing. Some was good

715
00:43:41,880 --> 00:43:45,920
Speaker 3: news and some was bad news. And General Downing was

716
00:43:45,960 --> 00:43:50,080
Speaker 3: not always appreciative of bad news, but he understood it

717
00:43:50,520 --> 00:43:52,799
Speaker 3: and that was the important part, you know. And that

718
00:43:52,960 --> 00:43:57,120
Speaker 3: had to do with shall we say, command control arrangements

719
00:43:57,560 --> 00:44:01,400
Speaker 3: as well as personal performances. Wow.

720
00:44:02,200 --> 00:44:05,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, So what are you doing today? I know that

721
00:44:05,800 --> 00:44:11,400
Speaker 2: you're an official member or citizen in France for the Normandy.

722
00:44:12,040 --> 00:44:14,040
Speaker 2: I understand that you still go back there is that

723
00:44:14,080 --> 00:44:18,520
Speaker 2: something that's happening. We're recording this in May. It's coming out.

724
00:44:17,360 --> 00:44:23,319
Speaker 2: I go back every year since I retired, and I

725
00:44:23,480 --> 00:44:27,040
Speaker 2: give the terrain walk staff rides to all the active

726
00:44:27,120 --> 00:44:33,320
Speaker 2: duty troops, and I do that based on my experience

727
00:44:33,480 --> 00:44:37,080
Speaker 2: with the originals. I took the eighty second back to

728
00:44:37,160 --> 00:44:40,680
Speaker 2: Normandy for the first time since World War Two on

729
00:44:40,719 --> 00:44:45,000
Speaker 2: the fortieth anniversary, and we landed there and it was

730
00:44:45,080 --> 00:44:50,839
Speaker 2: just incredible. And during this period of this particular experience,

731
00:44:50,920 --> 00:44:56,799
Speaker 2: on six June nineteen eighty four, General Gavin thence retired,

732
00:44:57,600 --> 00:45:02,360
Speaker 2: arranged for twelve bus loads of veterans of that period

733
00:45:02,480 --> 00:45:06,239
Speaker 2: to greet us and walk us around, and he gave

734
00:45:06,360 --> 00:45:10,560
Speaker 2: us the staff rights that I give today, and he

735
00:45:10,680 --> 00:45:14,759
Speaker 2: had all of the captains and corporals and PFCs that

736
00:45:14,840 --> 00:45:18,200
Speaker 2: were each one of these sites talked to us about

737
00:45:18,760 --> 00:45:23,200
Speaker 2: what they saw, what they did, how the thing unfolded.

738
00:45:23,800 --> 00:45:26,920
Speaker 2: And that was on top of my earlier discussions with

739
00:45:27,080 --> 00:45:30,800
Speaker 2: Vet's beginning in nineteen seventy seven when I visited Normandy

740
00:45:31,080 --> 00:45:35,279
Speaker 2: for the first time. All that together gave me a

741
00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:39,640
Speaker 2: tremendous sense of what actually occurred on a given site,

742
00:45:40,120 --> 00:45:44,840
Speaker 2: the human facts, you know, the facts behind the faces

743
00:45:44,840 --> 00:45:47,279
Speaker 2: behind the facts you know. And I wrote a book

744
00:45:47,320 --> 00:45:51,160
Speaker 2: about it, The Human Face of d Day, which you

745
00:45:51,160 --> 00:45:56,560
Speaker 2: can buy cases of on Amazon, and it kind of

746
00:45:56,640 --> 00:46:02,359
Speaker 2: lays out the whole Normandy invasion and from the viewpoint.

747
00:46:01,840 --> 00:46:04,719
Speaker 3: Of the people that actually participated, what they told you

748
00:46:06,400 --> 00:46:09,800
Speaker 3: from the very beginning of this why I was Normandy

749
00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:15,120
Speaker 3: selected all the way through the planning, the preparation, the execution,

750
00:46:15,320 --> 00:46:19,880
Speaker 3: and then the subsequent follow on. And I kind of

751
00:46:19,920 --> 00:46:23,799
Speaker 3: take it as a personal responsibility to pass on to

752
00:46:23,880 --> 00:46:29,080
Speaker 3: the actives what the originals told me. And my thought

753
00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:33,840
Speaker 3: is that if an active troop is in some deep

754
00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:37,480
Speaker 3: dark place and deep ship, he will think back and

755
00:46:37,520 --> 00:46:41,879
Speaker 3: he'll remember what happened at La fier Bridge and he'll say,

756
00:46:41,920 --> 00:46:44,360
Speaker 3: if they can do it, I can do it, and

757
00:46:44,440 --> 00:46:47,200
Speaker 3: it just gives them a little extra gas in the tank,

758
00:46:47,520 --> 00:46:51,560
Speaker 3: a boost affirmative. Yeah, that book. I do it every

759
00:46:51,600 --> 00:46:54,279
Speaker 3: year and I love to do it. It's my annual rejuvenation.

760
00:46:54,480 --> 00:46:57,319
Speaker 2: This Human Face of D Day. They got cases of

761
00:46:57,360 --> 00:46:59,640
Speaker 2: it on Amazon for you to buy. Go out there

762
00:47:00,239 --> 00:47:02,920
Speaker 2: get Yeah. I leave it a review, Please go buy

763
00:47:03,000 --> 00:47:05,400
Speaker 2: Human Face of D Day. We will have that posted

764
00:47:05,520 --> 00:47:08,319
Speaker 2: up in the Little Dissertation blog.

765
00:47:08,080 --> 00:47:11,480
Speaker 3: And five star reviews. The more reviews I get, the

766
00:47:11,480 --> 00:47:12,840
Speaker 3: more Amazon put.

767
00:47:12,600 --> 00:47:17,439
Speaker 2: The five stars for the for the kernel. No, that's great.

768
00:47:17,480 --> 00:47:22,800
Speaker 2: So you also have Phoenix Rising. Correct, Yes, Phoenix Rising

769
00:47:23,360 --> 00:47:27,680
Speaker 2: is about the Iran Rescue. I kept a sort of

770
00:47:27,719 --> 00:47:32,520
Speaker 2: a journal throughout the entire period from when I was

771
00:47:32,560 --> 00:47:37,800
Speaker 2: first called up to when we finished with Honey Badger.

772
00:47:38,440 --> 00:47:41,880
Speaker 2: That's kind of part one my own observations of people,

773
00:47:42,000 --> 00:47:46,799
Speaker 2: things and issues. And the second part is about the

774
00:47:46,880 --> 00:47:52,560
Speaker 2: Honey Badger period and how we created these forces against

775
00:47:52,640 --> 00:47:57,000
Speaker 2: all the opposition of the bureaucrats to kill it in place.

776
00:47:57,680 --> 00:48:00,279
Speaker 2: So you know, the first part's interesting to say, at

777
00:48:00,320 --> 00:48:04,200
Speaker 2: parts boring, but if you're into this stuff, it'll give

778
00:48:04,239 --> 00:48:06,920
Speaker 2: you a complete picture of how we got.

779
00:48:06,800 --> 00:48:09,880
Speaker 3: To where we are today. Oh yeah, and a little

780
00:48:09,880 --> 00:48:12,680
Speaker 3: bit of you know, slam dunk on some personalities, but

781
00:48:12,760 --> 00:48:13,200
Speaker 3: that just.

782
00:48:13,160 --> 00:48:16,759
Speaker 2: Makes you know. I see if my editor guy that

783
00:48:17,000 --> 00:48:19,320
Speaker 2: runs that part of our soft Rap, would be interesting

784
00:48:19,360 --> 00:48:23,320
Speaker 2: getting your books into our book club, you know, jure, Hey, please,

785
00:48:23,360 --> 00:48:25,279
Speaker 2: you know what I mean. I will. I'll link us

786
00:48:25,320 --> 00:48:27,160
Speaker 2: up in an email together, so I'll say, hey guy,

787
00:48:27,200 --> 00:48:28,600
Speaker 2: this is Keith et cetera.

788
00:48:28,719 --> 00:48:32,560
Speaker 3: And don't forget my first book, Just Another Day in Vietnam,

789
00:48:32,640 --> 00:48:35,960
Speaker 3: Just Another Day, where I talk about one battle when

790
00:48:36,000 --> 00:48:40,320
Speaker 3: I was a lieutenant in the Ranger Battalion Vietnamese ranger battalion.

791
00:48:41,239 --> 00:48:42,839
Speaker 2: Dude, So like you're alert.

792
00:48:43,080 --> 00:48:46,520
Speaker 3: All these wonderful options that are open, three books, five

793
00:48:46,640 --> 00:48:50,040
Speaker 3: star reviews cases, they're great stocking.

794
00:48:49,640 --> 00:48:52,840
Speaker 2: St Colonel never thought when he was writing triplicate papers

795
00:48:52,880 --> 00:48:55,080
Speaker 2: in his office with a typewriter that he'd be pushing

796
00:48:55,080 --> 00:48:57,600
Speaker 2: five star Google reviews in twenty twenty four.

797
00:48:58,920 --> 00:49:03,279
Speaker 3: Exactly, saint technology. I never could have written it if

798
00:49:03,320 --> 00:49:04,080
Speaker 3: I just had time.

799
00:49:04,120 --> 00:49:07,239
Speaker 2: I tell you what, at least I remember typewriters, right,

800
00:49:07,280 --> 00:49:09,319
Speaker 2: So I was born in seventy seven. To let you know,

801
00:49:09,600 --> 00:49:11,680
Speaker 2: just to let you know we're okay.

802
00:49:11,760 --> 00:49:16,280
Speaker 3: Well, I had a elite typewriter when I was in college,

803
00:49:16,440 --> 00:49:19,560
Speaker 3: a tiny little type, and I could put the story

804
00:49:19,600 --> 00:49:21,080
Speaker 3: of the world on one page.

805
00:49:21,520 --> 00:49:22,279
Speaker 2: Say, with my dad.

806
00:49:22,320 --> 00:49:22,920
Speaker 3: My dad was like.

807
00:49:24,920 --> 00:49:29,160
Speaker 2: Two fingers, go into town. Then he got really good

808
00:49:29,160 --> 00:49:31,879
Speaker 2: with his just regular fingers. But you know sometimes those

809
00:49:31,920 --> 00:49:34,359
Speaker 2: keys would get stuck and he's like pop it out.

810
00:49:34,400 --> 00:49:36,880
Speaker 2: You know, he's in flow, get stuck on him. And

811
00:49:37,280 --> 00:49:39,399
Speaker 2: I still have his typewriter. As a matter of fact,

812
00:49:39,719 --> 00:49:40,480
Speaker 2: Well I am.

813
00:49:40,760 --> 00:49:43,359
Speaker 3: I am still two things, two fingers, but I can

814
00:49:43,400 --> 00:49:46,000
Speaker 3: do sixty words a minute with two things. That's great.

815
00:49:46,080 --> 00:49:46,680
Speaker 2: I love that.

816
00:49:46,880 --> 00:49:47,440
Speaker 3: I love that.

817
00:49:47,800 --> 00:49:51,120
Speaker 2: Okay, So Look, we've had a great conversation. We've talked

818
00:49:51,120 --> 00:49:53,640
Speaker 2: about things that you've done. There's things that we're never

819
00:49:53,640 --> 00:49:55,480
Speaker 2: going to talk about that you've done. You get to

820
00:49:55,520 --> 00:49:58,200
Speaker 2: take those with you, all right, And uh, I want

821
00:49:58,200 --> 00:50:01,760
Speaker 2: to say thanks and welcome home from all your shitty

822
00:50:01,800 --> 00:50:05,160
Speaker 2: situations you've ever been in. And uh, welcome back home.

823
00:50:05,680 --> 00:50:09,080
Speaker 2: One in the sun and income to I love that

824
00:50:09,080 --> 00:50:11,280
Speaker 2: you're wearing your camouflage. And I got mine on today

825
00:50:11,280 --> 00:50:13,960
Speaker 2: that wasn't even talked about. So I'm right there with you.

826
00:50:14,520 --> 00:50:17,200
Speaker 3: Great jacket is perfect for my needs. You know, I'm

827
00:50:17,200 --> 00:50:19,520
Speaker 3: my old guy. You got to have a little something

828
00:50:19,560 --> 00:50:23,080
Speaker 3: on your rabs and all. And this is lightweight. I'll

829
00:50:23,120 --> 00:50:25,799
Speaker 3: have this and point to hawk when I'm there next.

830
00:50:25,840 --> 00:50:27,319
Speaker 2: Let me let me ask you, though, there's one thing

831
00:50:27,360 --> 00:50:29,440
Speaker 2: that's in yours on your shelf that I wanted to

832
00:50:29,480 --> 00:50:31,600
Speaker 2: ask you about. Right, you got so many little, uh

833
00:50:32,040 --> 00:50:36,520
Speaker 2: collectible things. Is that like a Scout cap? Bear cup?

834
00:50:36,560 --> 00:50:38,360
Speaker 2: Is that a cover over your shoulder?

835
00:50:38,960 --> 00:50:39,000
Speaker 1: No?

836
00:50:39,360 --> 00:50:44,640
Speaker 3: That is my father's campaign Yeah from nineteen thirty nine.

837
00:50:45,920 --> 00:50:48,279
Speaker 2: Wow, what was Tell me real quick about your father?

838
00:50:48,400 --> 00:50:50,640
Speaker 2: Looks like a boy scouts. Tell me about your father?

839
00:50:51,080 --> 00:50:52,600
Speaker 2: Give me a brief story about that.

840
00:50:54,160 --> 00:50:57,960
Speaker 3: Well, my dad went to Stanford. He was commissioned in

841
00:50:58,080 --> 00:51:03,920
Speaker 3: nineteen thirty nine in ROTC. Didn't was not activated, he

842
00:51:03,960 --> 00:51:07,080
Speaker 3: was just in the reserves. And then in nineteen forty

843
00:51:07,200 --> 00:51:11,600
Speaker 3: he was activated and he had his first exercise at

844
00:51:11,640 --> 00:51:15,719
Speaker 3: Camp San Louis Obisito. He was an artillery and that

845
00:51:15,920 --> 00:51:19,400
Speaker 3: was his hat. That was the standard uniform, you know,

846
00:51:19,520 --> 00:51:23,640
Speaker 3: the high wool things, you know, San Luis paths, you know,

847
00:51:24,520 --> 00:51:30,360
Speaker 3: in August, you can visualize it with my mom and

848
00:51:30,400 --> 00:51:35,279
Speaker 3: they lived in a taskadero and there were signs at

849
00:51:35,280 --> 00:51:39,319
Speaker 3: that time for rentals, you know, room for rent or

850
00:51:39,360 --> 00:51:42,400
Speaker 3: house for rent, and it would say no dogs or soldiers.

851
00:51:43,400 --> 00:51:46,920
Speaker 3: So you know, it was not a very supportive area

852
00:51:47,680 --> 00:51:51,200
Speaker 3: until of course Pearl Harbor then it became very supportant.

853
00:51:51,360 --> 00:51:53,520
Speaker 3: But anyway, that was his campaign hat.

854
00:51:53,800 --> 00:51:58,719
Speaker 4: And I've got underneath it my hat from the my

855
00:51:59,520 --> 00:52:04,360
Speaker 4: Cami my Cami head gear from two five oh five.

856
00:52:04,600 --> 00:52:05,560
Speaker 3: We were the mop top.

857
00:52:06,200 --> 00:52:06,799
Speaker 2: I love that.

858
00:52:07,080 --> 00:52:07,600
Speaker 3: I love it.

859
00:52:07,640 --> 00:52:08,880
Speaker 2: I love it because you don't want to be just

860
00:52:08,920 --> 00:52:09,600
Speaker 2: a roundhead.

861
00:52:09,880 --> 00:52:13,160
Speaker 3: You want to have well what it did? You know?

862
00:52:13,239 --> 00:52:15,799
Speaker 3: I said when I commanded two five oh five, I

863
00:52:15,880 --> 00:52:18,839
Speaker 3: turned them into a ranger batown, Yeah, which is sort

864
00:52:18,880 --> 00:52:21,920
Speaker 3: of what I did because based on my personal experience

865
00:52:22,520 --> 00:52:25,279
Speaker 3: and I wanted something to set them apart from the

866
00:52:25,320 --> 00:52:29,480
Speaker 3: rest of the day. So my S three at that

867
00:52:29,719 --> 00:52:34,680
Speaker 3: time was a brit Exchange officer and he said, well,

868
00:52:34,680 --> 00:52:40,640
Speaker 3: why don't we wear the British Airborne camouflage helmet. Oh,

869
00:52:40,680 --> 00:52:43,759
Speaker 3: that was a great idea. So we did that and

870
00:52:44,239 --> 00:52:47,840
Speaker 3: they were unique to the street. Nine battalions, one of

871
00:52:47,880 --> 00:52:50,719
Speaker 3: them were of the mop top and I did that

872
00:52:50,840 --> 00:52:54,360
Speaker 3: as a motivational tool to get them to work harder.

873
00:52:54,880 --> 00:52:57,560
Speaker 3: I said, hey, you guys are different, You're really good.

874
00:52:57,960 --> 00:53:01,799
Speaker 3: You've got to meet the standard, work harder. And I'd

875
00:53:01,800 --> 00:53:04,640
Speaker 3: give them high standards and they'd meet it because they

876
00:53:04,760 --> 00:53:07,160
Speaker 3: was so proud of being in the unit with the

877
00:53:07,280 --> 00:53:11,160
Speaker 3: mop top. It made a huge psychological difference to the

878
00:53:11,200 --> 00:53:14,880
Speaker 3: troops in terms of, you know, leadership and what you

879
00:53:14,920 --> 00:53:17,279
Speaker 3: could get out of them and their own sense of

880
00:53:17,400 --> 00:53:20,279
Speaker 3: self worth. That's a long an. I love it.

881
00:53:20,360 --> 00:53:22,719
Speaker 2: No, I'm going to grow from that. I'm growing as

882
00:53:22,719 --> 00:53:24,880
Speaker 2: a leader from you right now. I appreciate that, and

883
00:53:24,920 --> 00:53:28,680
Speaker 2: my listener is going to appreciate that. Strive for excellence.

884
00:53:28,880 --> 00:53:32,080
Speaker 2: I love that, So thank you for implementing that with

885
00:53:32,440 --> 00:53:33,240
Speaker 2: all of your.

886
00:53:34,800 --> 00:53:34,920
Speaker 3: Esse.

887
00:53:36,040 --> 00:53:40,720
Speaker 2: Is that okay, sure, whatever work I think that works.

888
00:53:40,760 --> 00:53:44,160
Speaker 2: I think that works, non applaud just say said money.

889
00:53:44,239 --> 00:53:47,680
Speaker 2: Go buy his books. Go check out Human Face of

890
00:53:47,760 --> 00:53:52,200
Speaker 2: d Day, Phoenix Rising, and Just Another Day in Vietnam

891
00:53:52,360 --> 00:53:57,120
Speaker 2: written by Keith Nightingale. Retire kernel of a lot of things,

892
00:53:57,400 --> 00:54:00,399
Speaker 2: in a lot of life, and I wish you much

893
00:54:00,400 --> 00:54:03,160
Speaker 2: more life. And I'm glad you're in remission. And I'm

894
00:54:03,200 --> 00:54:08,040
Speaker 2: glad we've now met and talked and again to Jim

895
00:54:08,360 --> 00:54:10,640
Speaker 2: who put us in connection, I'm just gonna shot him

896
00:54:10,640 --> 00:54:13,239
Speaker 2: out again. Thank you. I appreciate it. Hit me up

897
00:54:13,239 --> 00:54:16,000
Speaker 2: with any more referrals, just like Keith, you're the best.

898
00:54:16,000 --> 00:54:18,720
Speaker 2: Thank you for listening to soft Rep and on behalf,

899
00:54:19,560 --> 00:54:23,840
Speaker 2: on behalf of Keith Nightingale and myself and Brandon Webb

900
00:54:23,880 --> 00:54:26,840
Speaker 2: and my producers and everybody Martin and everybody on the

901
00:54:26,840 --> 00:54:29,640
Speaker 2: email chains. I thank you so much for being a

902
00:54:29,680 --> 00:54:32,160
Speaker 2: part of my life and letting me have this opportunity

903
00:54:32,280 --> 00:54:35,239
Speaker 2: to talk to people like Keith. I'm truly blessed with this.

904
00:54:35,480 --> 00:54:38,560
Speaker 2: So with that, I'm going to end the call and

905
00:54:38,719 --> 00:54:41,359
Speaker 2: say peace from all of us here. Soft Rep.

906
00:54:49,880 --> 00:54:52,359
Speaker 1: You've been listening to self reparadia