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Speaker 1: It's the Son of a Butcher podcast. I'm your host

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Speaker 1: Claude Harmon. This week the second major of the twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty five season, the PGA Championship, which will be held

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Speaker 1: at Quail Hollow, And this week on the podcast, Jason

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Speaker 1: Duffner the twenty thirteen PGA champion. He won that at

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Speaker 1: Oak Hill, lost in a playoff in twenty eleven. A

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Speaker 1: King in Bradley in Atlanta, got his high at six

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Speaker 1: in the world rankings back in twenty twelve, was on

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Speaker 1: the Ryder Cup team in twelve, President's Cup team in thirteen,

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Speaker 1: And Jason Duffner back in the day was an elite

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Speaker 1: ball striker. He had a beautiful golf swing. He's a

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Speaker 1: thinker about the game of golf. He's a student about

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Speaker 1: the game of golf. So really cool to have him

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Speaker 1: on to talk about what it takes to win and

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Speaker 1: his career. But before that, our friends at Cober Golf

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Speaker 1: have their four new drivers out, the DS Adapt Drivers,

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Speaker 1: four models to fit every golfer, paired with future Fit

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Speaker 1: thirty three which offers thirty three unique lie and lost

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Speaker 1: settings to find your ideal ballflight, minimize your man maximize

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Speaker 1: your distance and dial in your game. You can head

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Speaker 1: over to cobragolf dot com to check out their new

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Speaker 1: driver models. It went straight in my bag. Love it,

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Speaker 1: love the way it looks. Go check it out. But

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Speaker 1: it's a major week and getting an opportunity to talk

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Speaker 1: to a major champion like Jason Duffer really really cool

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Speaker 1: and like I said, he's a student of the game

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Speaker 1: and he talks a lot about kind of how he

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Speaker 1: thinks about golf. And this is a good one. So

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Speaker 1: sit back and enjoy listening to Jason Duffner. Doff, you

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Speaker 1: turned pro in twenty four twenty year career on the

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Speaker 1: PGA Tour. When you look back at when you started,

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Speaker 1: excluding all of the noise off the golf course, now

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Speaker 1: with professional golf and all the live stuff, what do

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Speaker 1: you think has changed about the game since you turn pro?

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Speaker 1: Back and oh, for the.

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Speaker 2: Most yeah, I think the thing that comes to the

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Speaker 2: front of my mind is the speed.

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Speaker 3: Right, It's crazy.

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Speaker 2: So speed to me was never a skill when I

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Speaker 2: first started.

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Speaker 1: So you had it or did Yeah?

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Speaker 2: I turned prone two thousand, so twenty four years. I

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Speaker 2: played nineteen years on the tour of fifteen or more events,

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Speaker 2: and speed wasn't a skill. Now guys had speed, but

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Speaker 2: nobody trained for it. Nobody thought about it.

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Speaker 1: You're either guys like DJ would come out Roy and

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Speaker 1: you just go, where is this coming?

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Speaker 3: Right?

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Speaker 2: And now speed has become a skill, and I would

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Speaker 2: say it's become probably the most dominant skill in the game.

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Speaker 3: And what I mean by that is you.

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Speaker 2: Can train for speed, you can gain it quickly. You know,

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Speaker 2: if you're in a certain age group, you can pick

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Speaker 2: up ten miles an hour club at speed pretty quick,

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Speaker 2: and that can propel you to being able to play

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Speaker 2: at a high level. As long as you know how

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Speaker 2: to play the game a little bit, you're competitive. But

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Speaker 2: I also think it's taken away from a little bit

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Speaker 2: of the game and the skill set in the game.

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Speaker 2: So I would say I see guys that have speed,

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Speaker 2: but as an all around player, maybe not as polished

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Speaker 2: as what maybe I needed when I first started. And

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Speaker 2: the other thing is is the skills that I needed

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Speaker 2: to play on tour and to play well on tour,

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Speaker 2: they took me a long time to acquire. I had

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Speaker 2: to do a lot of my own practice. I had

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Speaker 2: to do a lot of research, trial and error. Right,

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Speaker 2: That's another thing that's changed. When I first started playing golf,

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Speaker 2: and when I first got on tour, it was a

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Speaker 2: lot of trial and error. You didn't have track Man's

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Speaker 2: you didn't have the three D technology that we have now.

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Speaker 2: In teaching, nobody really explored strength and conditioning as it

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Speaker 2: related to.

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Speaker 3: Golf right or golf specific.

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Speaker 2: Tiger came along around the same time, and he was training,

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Speaker 2: but it wasn't golf it.

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Speaker 1: Right, so he just got jacked and big and I

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Speaker 1: would argue.

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Speaker 2: To a point and we could go back and forth

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Speaker 2: that the game's a little bit easier now than it was.

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Speaker 1: My dad says that. My dad always says. It's interesting.

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Speaker 1: He said when he played the tour, he said, every

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Speaker 1: poor five, my dad played with a weak rip and

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Speaker 1: need a fade. But he said, every single par five

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Speaker 1: he played when he played on the PG or he'd

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Speaker 1: strengthened his grip, try and hit a big sling hook.

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Speaker 1: I think one of the other things stuff that I've

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Speaker 1: noticed that's changed, Like you said, you can just kind

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Speaker 1: of have one shot now, and I think, really, to me,

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Speaker 1: it was Jordan's speed. When Jordan came out, everybody was like,

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Speaker 1: he's gonna have to change the grip, He's gonna have

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Speaker 1: to change a lot of the stuff, you know, the

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Speaker 1: finger off. When Jordan started to have the success he had,

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Speaker 1: I thought one of the main reasons he had that

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Speaker 1: success is he was one of these new breed of

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Speaker 1: players that said, no, no, this is what I do.

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Speaker 1: I did this in college, and I am just going

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Speaker 1: to keep doing what I do and not maybe make

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Speaker 1: a lot of the changes you mentioned launch monitor technology.

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Speaker 1: How much do you think the change from four when

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Speaker 1: you came on tour technology across the board threw everything

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Speaker 1: from club fitting launch moner technology. I think you you're

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Speaker 1: a student of the game, and I think you were

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Speaker 1: one of the first players that I was really around

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Speaker 1: that kind of got the track man numbers and it

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Speaker 1: worked in your head. When I was working with Ricky,

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Speaker 1: you'd come up and you guys would play and you'd say, hey,

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Speaker 1: can I just rather than go out and work on

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Speaker 1: your golf swing, you would say, hey, can I get

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Speaker 1: on a launch monitor? Because you were looking at the numbers?

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Speaker 1: And do you now have you in the past stuff

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Speaker 1: used the numbers is a guide for what you're trying

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Speaker 1: to feel.

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Speaker 2: I think I use the track Man more than anything

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Speaker 2: now for equipment fit. Right, So I look at a

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Speaker 2: lot of the ball data, the club data, I can

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Speaker 2: easily manipulate, and that doesn't mean I'm doing it the

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Speaker 2: right way.

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Speaker 3: Right.

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Speaker 2: As you know in the teaching industry, tour players have

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Speaker 2: this special ability to put the sweet spot on the

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Speaker 2: ball some way, somehow. That's their special talent. That's what

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Speaker 2: makes tour players two players. Right, So we see all

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Speaker 2: these different swings you mentioned Jordan Speeth. We could go

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Speaker 2: down the list, Like if you looked at the top

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Speaker 2: fifty guys in the world, not all of them have

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Speaker 2: like mechanically fununctional swings like that, you would say that's ideal.

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Speaker 2: But they can put the sweet spot on the golf ball, right.

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Speaker 2: So you know, I can change the numbers of the

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Speaker 2: club data, but I use the track man and the

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Speaker 2: information mainly for equipment fits and then to practice. So

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Speaker 2: set up practice routines, especially inside one hundred and fifty yards,

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Speaker 2: to understand how far I'm hitting the ball at what

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Speaker 2: speeds and then translate into that what that feels. That's

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Speaker 2: the other thing tour players are really good at is

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Speaker 2: understanding feels and speeds. What is seventy miles an hour

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Speaker 2: of a club had speed feel like?

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Speaker 3: Right?

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Speaker 2: And trying to ingrain those So that technology has really

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Speaker 2: helped accelerate the learning curve, and I think you can

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Speaker 2: get better faster by using the technology that's available. When

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Speaker 2: I was in college, we used to have this old

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Speaker 2: kind of shaggreen and we had a t box that

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Speaker 2: would go up to one hundred and forty yards and

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Speaker 2: you would walk off from a stick that you stuck

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Speaker 2: in the ground and you'd walk back to eighty yards

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Speaker 2: and I'm gonna work on eighty yards for these fifty balls.

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Speaker 2: Then you'd walk back ten yards and that's how we practice.

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Speaker 2: But now it's just instant, right.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I always look at when I started working

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Speaker 1: with tour players back in the early two thousands, I

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Speaker 1: was on the European tour. I had a Dell Daylight

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Speaker 1: readable laptop, which people thought they were seeing fire for

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Speaker 1: the first time because I could plug out all these

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Speaker 1: chords and I could plug it in. I could take

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Speaker 1: it on the range and you could see the laptop

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Speaker 1: had the V one system. I could see it outside,

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Speaker 1: put it side by side, put on a tripod. But technology, now,

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Speaker 1: do you think it is helping younger players more than

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Speaker 1: it's hurting younger players?

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Speaker 3: It's a good question.

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Speaker 2: I think sometimes with the technology, you're chasing perfect, and

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Speaker 2: the game isn't a game of perfect, right, It's more

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Speaker 2: of a game of missus. To be honest with you,

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Speaker 2: it is how good is your miss? Is your missing play?

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Speaker 2: Can we carry on to the next shot from our miss?

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Speaker 2: Or are we dropping? Or are we routine? And these things.

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Speaker 2: So I think I'm trying to manage that can be

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Speaker 2: complicated between students and teachers because you want to give

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Speaker 2: the students the best information possible to help them be

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Speaker 2: successful at what they do. So managing that, I think

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Speaker 2: is very important. I think it's probably way overboard for

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Speaker 2: your everyday golfer.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, like too much information.

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Speaker 2: Like there's a lot of things that you look at

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Speaker 2: tour players and you think you can do, but you

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Speaker 2: really never will have a chance. But we're definitely trying

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Speaker 2: to make the game easier to some point for those

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Speaker 2: people and trying to find ways for them to improve.

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Speaker 2: So I enjoy certain aspects of the tech, but I

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Speaker 2: also see the disadvantage at times because you're chasing perfect,

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Speaker 2: and I've been guilty of that at times in my career.

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Speaker 1: I gave a presentation a couple of weeks ago for

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Speaker 1: the Titleist Performance Institute at the World Golf Fitness Summit,

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Speaker 1: and I found a video on social It was the top.

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Speaker 1: It was all the swings with a driver, back to

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Speaker 1: back of everybody starting from thirty to one that made

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Speaker 1: it to the Tour Championship. You know, very different golf swings.

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Speaker 1: And I said in my presentation, if you watch this,

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Speaker 1: if you have as an instructor, if you have a

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Speaker 1: model in your head of the way you want everybody

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Speaker 1: to swing the golf club, you will lose. My dad

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Speaker 1: is famous, obviously for the work that he did with

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Speaker 1: Tiger Woods, and part of my presentation was I watched

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Speaker 1: Tiger Woods and when I went to the European Tourist

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Speaker 1: I helped my dad work with Adam Scott and then

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Speaker 1: I worked with Trevor Ullman. It was Tiger one oh one.

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Speaker 1: Right now, there are so many different styles of golf swings,

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Speaker 1: Whereas in the early two thousands, and I think a

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Speaker 1: lot of before that, it was a quest to be

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Speaker 1: perfect the work that Led did with with Nick Faldo,

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Speaker 1: you know, to try and create that kind of almost

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Speaker 1: robotic machine like golf swing. But now we see so

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Speaker 1: many different body styles, types of golf swings. Have you

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Speaker 1: seen in your career kind of it go from a

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Speaker 1: quest for perfect between now with technology. You know. I

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Speaker 1: talked to Greg Rose and Dave Phillips a TPI about

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Speaker 1: this all the time. They're like, listen, we get your

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Speaker 1: own three D. We don't really care what it looks like.

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Speaker 1: It's functional. We know what your body can do. Have

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Speaker 1: you seen kind of a shift in maybe golf swings

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Speaker 1: becoming less about aesthetics and has maybe the tech helped

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Speaker 1: it be more about function?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? I think so.

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Speaker 2: I think you're seeing more guys have their own swing

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Speaker 2: style and as a coach or even as a fan

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Speaker 2: of the game, understanding the differences in those things. For

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Speaker 2: an example, you worked with Dustin Johnson. You could never

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Speaker 2: teach how Dustin Johnson swings the golf club. But at

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Speaker 2: the same time, you would never want to take him

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Speaker 2: and change what he does.

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Speaker 3: Right. That's unique.

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Speaker 2: It's like a fingerprint, that's his DNA. But I'm sure

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Speaker 2: when you were working with him you understood his tendencies

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Speaker 2: of what worked and when things were going well and

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Speaker 2: where he got off. So you're always trying to drive

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Speaker 2: him back to those tendencies. That worked for him. So

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Speaker 2: I think that's what you're seeing more of now. And

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Speaker 2: with the three D technology and the capturing and all

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Speaker 2: these things that are happening, people can see the uniqueness

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Speaker 2: and these fingerprints of golf swings and understand like, these

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Speaker 2: are the parameters this player needs to work in, and

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Speaker 2: then when they're off, you can understand where you need

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Speaker 2: to go a lot sooner and a lot quicker.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I think everybody kind of has their

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Speaker 1: own signature in their own DNA. I've always thought of

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Speaker 1: you as kind of a student of the game and

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Speaker 1: a student of golf swings. When you look at golf swings,

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Speaker 1: give me golf swings that you Jason Duffer look at

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Speaker 1: and go, I like that golfing.

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Speaker 2: I mean obviously Tiger early two thousands, right, that's pretty good.

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Speaker 1: Like right now, who's golf swing on tour that you

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Speaker 1: look at in the last three or four years? I mean,

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Speaker 1: obviously Rory. Everybody looks at Roy. But are there any

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Speaker 1: others that you gotta go? And I really like that move.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I've liked fleet man.

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Speaker 1: In my head, I'm thinking Tommy Fleet because I love

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Speaker 1: his action, right.

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Speaker 2: I got great action, good, good playing good face control.

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Speaker 2: Who else Adam Scott I think has done a really

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Speaker 2: good I.

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Speaker 1: Just saw Scotty in last week and I was watching

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Speaker 1: him hit golf balls, and he's it was like growing

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Speaker 1: up watching Freddie Couples hit golf balls. You just went

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Speaker 1: it looks so good the way the tempo and the rhythm.

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Speaker 1: When you what do you like about Adam Scott's golfing.

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Speaker 2: Obviously, the tempo and the rhythm are good. I'm a

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Speaker 2: little envious of his draw capability because I've never been

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Speaker 2: a big right to left ball flight type of guy.

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Speaker 2: So I'm all the guys that I like swings all

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Speaker 2: sling hook it and they probably hate hitting sling hooks, right.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Scotty was like, it's a little off the toe.

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Speaker 1: I need to try and feel like it gets a

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Speaker 1: little bit more.

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Speaker 2: So I'm kind of favorable towards those guys. I think

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Speaker 2: Justin Thomas has done a great job with his golf swing.

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Speaker 1: And that's a very kind of an old school throwback

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Speaker 1: to where kind of that Davis love high everything kind

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Speaker 1: of in the last I think we haven't seen a

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Speaker 1: lot of that being taked.

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Speaker 2: Now you've got a lot of hands deeper yep, a

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Speaker 2: lot more stronger face. These guys are sitting back on

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Speaker 2: the right foot spinning side bending. My body doesn't side

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Speaker 2: bend anymore. Sidebind in rotation equals get a back surgeon

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Speaker 2: on speed dial.

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Speaker 3: At some point, you know, I.

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Speaker 1: Said this in the TPI conference. My uncle Billy came

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Speaker 1: into Vegas. He candies for Jay Haas on the PGA

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Speaker 1: tour for thirty years. He was a great instructor, I

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Speaker 1: think one of the best in the game. And it

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Speaker 1: was that year that Tiger and Duvall were hanging out

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Speaker 1: together and Tiger's number one in the world and Duvall's

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Speaker 1: number one in the world, and two side by side

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Speaker 1: golf swings couldn't be any more different, right, and both

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Speaker 1: unbelievable champions, majors and stuff like that. My uncle Billy said,

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Speaker 1: you know, the amazing thing is when you look at

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Speaker 1: Duval's swing, nobody is teaching that. He said, everybody, what

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Speaker 1: we do now is try to teach everybody to swing

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Speaker 1: the golf club like Tiger Adam Scott wide with minimize

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Speaker 1: the movement. And he said, you know, if you look

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Speaker 1: at two of the greatest ball strikers of all time, Hiller,

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Speaker 1: when shut take it inside, come over it fade Trevino

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Speaker 1: wide open, take it outside, drop it on, and he said,

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Speaker 1: we're not teaching anybody to try and do that. I've

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Speaker 1: heard that one of the things that drives Jack Nicholas

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Speaker 1: crazy is for everything that everybody asks Jack about, nobody

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Speaker 1: would ever try and putt like Jack. He's one of

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Speaker 1: the greatest, if not the greatest, pressure putter of all time,

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Speaker 1: with a very non conventional method. Everybody wants to putt

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Speaker 1: like Slick Rick and Tiger, right, but Jack was one

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Speaker 1: of the greatest with a method nobody would use. How

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Speaker 1: much do you think technique has played a role And

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Speaker 1: were those guys just able to execute? Because you talked

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Speaker 1: about the game maybe not being what it is now.

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Speaker 1: And if you look at I played tennis growing up,

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Speaker 1: tennis now is there's no serve in volley anymore. Nobody

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Speaker 1: serves in volleys anymore because why would you. You don't

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Speaker 1: have to, right, But if you look at the greatest

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Speaker 1: tennis players of all time, Novak, Rafa, Roger, they could

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Speaker 1: do it all. And the greatest golfers, the great great champions,

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Speaker 1: the icons, they can do it all as well. They

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Speaker 1: have everything, so that jump from professional golf to college golf.

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Speaker 1: I think everybody that's coming out of amateur golf and

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Speaker 1: college golf is trying so hard to have all of

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Speaker 1: the shots. But I do think that we live in

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Speaker 1: an era with technology. My dad always says, you guys

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Speaker 1: never had to get the ball in the air. You

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Speaker 1: never played with with a wooden golf club. In a competition,

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Speaker 1: the ball is always launched high. If anything. At the

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Speaker 1: elite tour level that you're at, you guys are trying

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Speaker 1: to bring the spin down, whereas back in the day,

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Speaker 1: the only way you could get it up was and

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Speaker 1: I think a lot of my dad believes that a

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Speaker 1: lot of the old golf swings that knee drive, that

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Speaker 1: kind of crenchaw drive with the knee hang back. He

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Speaker 1: thought that a lot of that was equipment dependent, based

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Speaker 1: off of the equipment they were playing the equipment. Now

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Speaker 1: the drivers don't curve as much right now.

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Speaker 3: The ball inherently used to be the hardest club to hit.

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Speaker 1: Now now he's one of the easiest. Would you like

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Speaker 1: to see that change? You think that technology?

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Speaker 3: I think the technology makes it too easy. I do.

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Speaker 3: I think learning to.

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Speaker 2: Hit shots is a lost art. I think the ball

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Speaker 2: doesn't spin enough. So spin is spin, Yeah, either back spin,

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Speaker 2: side spin, it's hard to spin it. So you know,

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Speaker 2: guys play this power game. They beat up the par

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Speaker 2: fives and they get comfortable doing that. And the guys

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Speaker 2: that are still in the top thirty, that are top

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Speaker 2: fifty are still great.

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Speaker 3: They still have a high skill level.

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Speaker 2: But outside of that, I think guys are very one

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Speaker 2: dimensional on how they play.

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Speaker 1: But the problem now, Duff, is you can you can

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Speaker 1: get one shot and if you if you look at

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Speaker 1: guys like Brooks and DJ, if you've got speed, now

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Speaker 1: you can basically say, okay, I just do what I

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Speaker 1: do now, I hit the golf ball. I've got a

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Speaker 1: ton of speed. And Brooks and DJ, I think are

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Speaker 1: the prototype guys to where they just go, I just

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Speaker 1: hit one shot pretty much all the time. Brooks can

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Speaker 1: draw it a little bit more than.

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Speaker 2: DK, and you can't argue with them because they play well,

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Speaker 2: they win tournaments, and they make a lot of money.

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Speaker 3: So who's to argue with that?

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Speaker 1: The jump from college golf to professional golf, what do

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Speaker 1: you think is the biggest part of that jump? And

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Speaker 1: what if you could go back and tell yourself when

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Speaker 1: you were coming out of Auburn, Hey, the tour really

360
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Speaker 1: you need this? What do you know now that you

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Speaker 1: didn't know when you came out about what it takes

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Speaker 1: to have a long term career as you've had on.

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Speaker 2: I think a lot of it doesn't have to do

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Speaker 2: with the physical aspects. A lot of the kids get

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Speaker 2: into the golf swing and the scoring and how do

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Speaker 2: I putt? And I think the biggest thing I think

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Speaker 2: for kids making that jump is getting involved and being

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Speaker 2: a professional golfer and seeing what else there is about that. Right, So,

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Speaker 2: there's a lot of travel, there's a lot of time

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Speaker 2: that you're accountable for now. Nobody is telling you to

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Speaker 2: get up and practice.

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Speaker 1: All the things you hated as a college golfer. I

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Speaker 1: hear this all the time. The coach tells you when

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Speaker 1: to practice, they tell you when to work out. You

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Speaker 1: have a place to practice, you have a place to play,

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Speaker 1: you have a travel schedule. When you turn pros, all

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Speaker 1: of that goes away.

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Speaker 2: So managing that, managing expectations, I think is a big

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Speaker 2: thing for the guys coming out now because they're with

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Speaker 2: the social media and all the things the tour has

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Speaker 2: done to promote these guys to get these guys on

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Speaker 2: tour quicker. They expect to have quick results. So so

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Speaker 2: how do you manage that if it doesn't happen, not

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Speaker 2: everybody's going to be right on tour? You know, how

385
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Speaker 2: do you deal with playing for a paycheck? Right, you know,

386
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Speaker 2: making cuts, making.

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Speaker 1: And you're going to make any.

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Speaker 2: Money providing, you know, for your livelihood. And then I

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Speaker 2: don't think college kids really understand how competitive professional golf

390
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Speaker 2: is because when they play a college event, there might

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Speaker 2: be say fifteen teams and that equals eighty or ninety guys,

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Speaker 2: and there might be only ten twelve guys that can

393
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Speaker 2: really play that are in that field. Well, when you

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Speaker 2: go to any corn Fairy event, DP World Tour event,

395
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Speaker 2: PGA Tour event, even like whatever's below corn Fairy Tour, like,

396
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Speaker 2: these dudes are the best of the best, and as

397
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Speaker 2: you're progressing, it's getting better and better. So trying to

398
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Speaker 2: be one of the best in the world at what

399
00:19:28,800 --> 00:19:34,280
Speaker 2: you do is extremely, extremely difficult, if that makes sense,

400
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Speaker 2: in the whole world. So it's not for everybody, That's

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00:19:39,080 --> 00:19:40,920
Speaker 2: what I tell them. And there's a lot of sacrifice.

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Speaker 2: I've made a lot of sacrifice in twenty four years

403
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Speaker 2: to do what I did, and at times I wish

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Speaker 2: that I would have had other things in my life,

405
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Speaker 2: but I'm also grateful for the opportunities that I had

406
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Speaker 2: in golf, and I know that I had to make

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Speaker 2: that sacrifice to live that dream for as long as

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Speaker 2: I did.

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Speaker 1: And I also think, you know, when you're a college golfer,

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Speaker 1: you don't know what you don't know, but because you

411
00:20:04,640 --> 00:20:06,439
Speaker 1: can play this, I think golf is one of these

412
00:20:06,440 --> 00:20:08,440
Speaker 1: sports where you can play the same. You can be

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Speaker 1: a college golfer and go play at the Medalist and

414
00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:14,840
Speaker 1: play with some of the guys down here, and he

415
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Speaker 1: can make a birdie on a bog in a hole,

416
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Speaker 1: and you can make a birdie and maybe you clip

417
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Speaker 1: them by one. And I don't think a lot of

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00:20:20,480 --> 00:20:23,080
Speaker 1: college golfers, but also a lot of the fans realize

419
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Speaker 1: that the guys that play on the PGA Tour Justin

420
00:20:27,280 --> 00:20:30,280
Speaker 1: Thomas is James Harden, right, John Raum is Kevin Durant.

421
00:20:30,280 --> 00:20:34,520
Speaker 1: They don't realize that the best players in competitive golf,

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Speaker 1: or the greatest athletes that they watch day in and

423
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Speaker 1: day out in other sports, they don't realize that Rory

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Speaker 1: McElroy is Patrick mahomes, but they think, oh yeah, I

425
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Speaker 1: can go and do that, and you get out there

426
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Speaker 1: and you're like, well, because once you get to the NFL,

427
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Speaker 1: or I use the NFL all the time. Once you

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Speaker 1: get to the NFL, everybody that is playing and starting

429
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Speaker 1: in the NFL was probably the best player in their

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Speaker 1: high school's history, their talent history, maybe the state. And

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Speaker 1: I think it sometimes gets skewed into thinking, oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean I played good in college and stuff. Junior golf.

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Speaker 1: I love working with juniors. What do you think is

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Speaker 1: important for junior golfers from a development standpoint? If you

435
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Speaker 1: could sit a bunch of juniors down that are trying

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Speaker 1: to play, you know, junior golf to that high school golf,

437
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Speaker 1: would you tell them to focus on things differently now

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Speaker 1: than you would have told them when you turn pro.

439
00:21:27,560 --> 00:21:31,520
Speaker 2: I think playing tournaments and being competitive for that age

440
00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:35,439
Speaker 2: is probably the most important thing because you learn so

441
00:21:35,600 --> 00:21:39,439
Speaker 2: much about the game playing tournaments, and you learn so

442
00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:42,440
Speaker 2: much about yourself. And they're in that kind of age

443
00:21:42,560 --> 00:21:49,080
Speaker 2: range where information and being able to cognitively develop and

444
00:21:49,119 --> 00:21:52,600
Speaker 2: do these things is so important. So being in tournaments

445
00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:58,080
Speaker 2: and understanding how to compete, how to shoot scores, how

446
00:21:58,119 --> 00:22:01,720
Speaker 2: to manage when things aren't going well, how to manage

447
00:22:01,800 --> 00:22:05,000
Speaker 2: when things are going well. So those are all things,

448
00:22:05,040 --> 00:22:07,439
Speaker 2: And this is one thing I tell a lot of people,

449
00:22:07,560 --> 00:22:12,640
Speaker 2: like playing junior golf, college golf, professional golf is uncomfortable.

450
00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:16,320
Speaker 2: There's a lot of uncomfortable things about that. And the

451
00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:20,280
Speaker 2: guys that are really good seem to be very comfortable

452
00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:24,919
Speaker 2: in uncomfortable environments. Right when things are on the line,

453
00:22:25,160 --> 00:22:29,000
Speaker 2: or the elements are at their worst, or the crowds

454
00:22:29,119 --> 00:22:31,280
Speaker 2: are at their highest level. You know, we're playing in

455
00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:34,200
Speaker 2: front of people, all these things that could be uncomfortable,

456
00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:37,800
Speaker 2: that's where they find to be the most comfortable. Right,

457
00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:41,199
Speaker 2: That's where I see the difference between guys, you know,

458
00:22:41,280 --> 00:22:43,720
Speaker 2: everyday tour players that maybe win here and there and

459
00:22:44,359 --> 00:22:48,679
Speaker 2: guys like Jordan Speeth and DJ and Dustin Brooks and

460
00:22:48,840 --> 00:22:53,840
Speaker 2: Justin Thomas. Right, being comfortable in uncomfortable environments, I think

461
00:22:54,080 --> 00:22:57,920
Speaker 2: is a real key to the development of golfers. Because

462
00:22:57,920 --> 00:23:00,280
Speaker 2: everybody can swing a golf club. You see junior years

463
00:23:00,280 --> 00:23:04,159
Speaker 2: that have amazing information is out there to do that.

464
00:23:06,200 --> 00:23:12,360
Speaker 2: So those are easy things for everybody. But it's these intangibles,

465
00:23:12,400 --> 00:23:15,159
Speaker 2: it's these cognitive skills that needed to be developed, and

466
00:23:15,200 --> 00:23:17,359
Speaker 2: I think you can develop those at that are early

467
00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:18,840
Speaker 2: age by playing tournaments.

468
00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:22,080
Speaker 1: And the most uncomfortable I think you're ever going to

469
00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:24,159
Speaker 1: feel is on the back nine on Sunday in a

470
00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:26,800
Speaker 1: major championship. You were lucky enough and got through that

471
00:23:26,840 --> 00:23:32,280
Speaker 1: in twenty thirteen it o'kill. What is major championship pressure?

472
00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:35,000
Speaker 1: Trying to win one of those? How is it different

473
00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:37,880
Speaker 1: than trying to win? The thing I love about your career,

474
00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:43,400
Speaker 1: Duff is you've won on really good, iconic, tough golf courses. Memorial,

475
00:23:44,280 --> 00:23:46,320
Speaker 1: you want to major ad o' kill, which is one

476
00:23:46,359 --> 00:23:50,520
Speaker 1: of the major major tournaments. But what's it like on

477
00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:52,240
Speaker 1: the back nine on Sunday trying to win a major?

478
00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:53,480
Speaker 1: How's that pressure different?

479
00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:58,399
Speaker 2: So for me, I don't want to say I didn't

480
00:23:58,400 --> 00:24:01,399
Speaker 2: feel pressure. I knew it was that take, But I

481
00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:04,200
Speaker 2: was always very comfortable when I was playing well because

482
00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:08,760
Speaker 2: I was playing well right, And I think another great

483
00:24:08,920 --> 00:24:14,480
Speaker 2: quality that I had I maybe wasn't as comfortable as

484
00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:17,000
Speaker 2: I thought I would like to be in uncomfortable situations.

485
00:24:17,040 --> 00:24:17,680
Speaker 3: But one.

486
00:24:19,040 --> 00:24:21,000
Speaker 2: Great quality that I felt like I had through my

487
00:24:21,080 --> 00:24:25,919
Speaker 2: career is that I was willing to take chances and

488
00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:29,800
Speaker 2: take risks to get what I wanted, accepting that failure

489
00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:31,840
Speaker 2: might be part of that, and that I was okay

490
00:24:32,800 --> 00:24:37,000
Speaker 2: to fail in situations if it meant giving me an

491
00:24:37,040 --> 00:24:39,000
Speaker 2: opportunity to get what I wanted, right.

492
00:24:38,920 --> 00:24:39,760
Speaker 3: To risk it all.

493
00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:42,040
Speaker 2: So a couple of years before that, I was in

494
00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:45,680
Speaker 2: contention in Atlanta and I was trying to win the

495
00:24:45,720 --> 00:24:47,640
Speaker 2: golf tournament and it didn't work.

496
00:24:47,680 --> 00:24:50,320
Speaker 3: But I was okay with it because I was.

497
00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:52,120
Speaker 2: Willing to do what I needed to do. I didn't

498
00:24:52,160 --> 00:24:54,840
Speaker 2: shy away from it. It just didn't happen for me then.

499
00:24:55,000 --> 00:24:59,320
Speaker 2: So just knowing, like when I'm playing good and I'm

500
00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:03,000
Speaker 2: not worried about that failure component, I always felt a

501
00:25:03,040 --> 00:25:05,680
Speaker 2: lot of comfort and peace when I was playing and

502
00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:09,600
Speaker 2: I was just okilled. Just kind of was the right

503
00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:11,639
Speaker 2: type of thing for me. It was a good golf

504
00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:12,359
Speaker 2: course for me.

505
00:25:12,480 --> 00:25:14,800
Speaker 1: It wasn't when you say it was a good golf

506
00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:17,640
Speaker 1: course for you. It's an incredibly hard golf course. It's

507
00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:20,119
Speaker 1: very much an old school golf course. So when you

508
00:25:20,119 --> 00:25:22,840
Speaker 1: say you liked the golf course and it you felt

509
00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:25,360
Speaker 1: like it set up well for you, what about it?

510
00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:27,080
Speaker 3: So no distance advantage?

511
00:25:27,119 --> 00:25:27,280
Speaker 1: Really?

512
00:25:27,359 --> 00:25:27,760
Speaker 3: It okay?

513
00:25:29,960 --> 00:25:32,000
Speaker 2: I haven't played it since they've changed it, but when

514
00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:34,840
Speaker 2: we played it, everybody was playing from the same spot.

515
00:25:35,520 --> 00:25:38,120
Speaker 2: Some guys might hit three woods where I was hitting

516
00:25:38,119 --> 00:25:39,960
Speaker 2: a lot of drivers that week, but we were still

517
00:25:40,040 --> 00:25:42,480
Speaker 2: playing from the same spot. So that got me into

518
00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:45,720
Speaker 2: an iron competition. I had played well the week before

519
00:25:45,760 --> 00:25:48,639
Speaker 2: at Firestone, which is another golf course. I've played very well,

520
00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:52,520
Speaker 2: long hard, so I'm comfortable and I'm confident with my game.

521
00:25:54,160 --> 00:25:57,040
Speaker 2: And you know, it wasn't a putting contest. It was

522
00:25:57,080 --> 00:25:59,600
Speaker 2: going to be somewhere in that eight to ten under range,

523
00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:01,119
Speaker 2: which I was very comfortable with.

524
00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:03,480
Speaker 1: You're not someone that likes thirty under.

525
00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:05,440
Speaker 2: No, but I did win in Palm Spring I could

526
00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:09,439
Speaker 2: like that. But you know, when tournaments were in that

527
00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:12,800
Speaker 2: like six to ten to twelve range, that's when I

528
00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:16,000
Speaker 2: felt comfortable. So that was that type of major. And

529
00:26:16,600 --> 00:26:18,560
Speaker 2: I shot sixty three in the second round. And I

530
00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:20,960
Speaker 2: tell people this all the time. Tour pros shoot really

531
00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:25,720
Speaker 2: low rounds frequently. Sometimes they're at home on Thursday with

532
00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:28,560
Speaker 2: your buddies. But that week I happened to have a

533
00:26:28,560 --> 00:26:30,280
Speaker 2: really good way. I see a lot of sixty threes

534
00:26:30,280 --> 00:26:32,879
Speaker 2: in majors where everything went right that day, right I

535
00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:35,280
Speaker 2: had just recently had a day two weeks ago at

536
00:26:35,280 --> 00:26:37,680
Speaker 2: home where everything rent right and I shot sixty two,

537
00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:39,120
Speaker 2: and I was like, that's great. I wish I would

538
00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:41,359
Speaker 2: have done them the Monday qualify next week, but it

539
00:26:41,440 --> 00:26:44,240
Speaker 2: didn't happen. So I had one of those days and

540
00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:46,000
Speaker 2: I shot a sixty three. So that gave me a

541
00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:49,919
Speaker 2: huge advantage for the week of the tournament. And I

542
00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:53,439
Speaker 2: was playing well, and I had a great pairing on Sunday,

543
00:26:53,480 --> 00:26:56,120
Speaker 2: which in Furich was very easy to play with. And

544
00:26:56,320 --> 00:26:58,960
Speaker 2: I wasn't leading. I kind of had slipped back to

545
00:26:59,080 --> 00:27:01,280
Speaker 2: one shot and I got off to a good start.

546
00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:05,080
Speaker 2: So all these things kind of manifested itself into that

547
00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:08,120
Speaker 2: week and then I, you know, I'm kind of head

548
00:27:08,200 --> 00:27:10,720
Speaker 2: down doing my thing, and when I get to the

549
00:27:10,760 --> 00:27:12,840
Speaker 2: tenth hole, I've got a four shot lead with nine

550
00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:15,639
Speaker 2: holes to play. So now it's about managing, you know,

551
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:19,080
Speaker 2: let's hit the fairways, let's one shot at the time,

552
00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:22,119
Speaker 2: manage the game, get it on the green, and you know,

553
00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:22,880
Speaker 2: make pars.

554
00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:25,879
Speaker 3: And so it just kind of worked out that way.

555
00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:30,480
Speaker 2: But it's hard to describe because you would think there's

556
00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:32,480
Speaker 2: a lot of internal pressure. This is something I've been

557
00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:36,000
Speaker 2: working for my whole life. But in that moment, the

558
00:27:36,080 --> 00:27:38,560
Speaker 2: really good players can kind of filter all that out

559
00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:40,880
Speaker 2: and really focus on what you're trying to do.

560
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:44,960
Speaker 1: Would it be safe to say that part of becoming

561
00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:48,280
Speaker 1: a great great player there's acceptance. You have to accept

562
00:27:48,280 --> 00:27:49,960
Speaker 1: that you're going to make bad swings, you have to

563
00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:52,080
Speaker 1: accept that you're going to get bad breaks, because I

564
00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:56,879
Speaker 1: think a lot of players don't expect there to be adversity.

565
00:27:56,920 --> 00:27:59,040
Speaker 1: And I think a lot of the great players that

566
00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:00,760
Speaker 1: I've been lucky enough to be around, you guys know

567
00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:02,920
Speaker 1: you're going to make bad swings. You know you might

568
00:28:02,960 --> 00:28:04,800
Speaker 1: not have it all the time. And I think everybody

569
00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:07,240
Speaker 1: that is trying to get to the level that that

570
00:28:07,680 --> 00:28:10,560
Speaker 1: you've gotten to in your game win a major beyond

571
00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:13,920
Speaker 1: President's Cop Wrider cops win multiple times. They think you've

572
00:28:13,920 --> 00:28:16,440
Speaker 1: always got it. There's you're never going to hit it bad.

573
00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:18,720
Speaker 1: But what I hear you saying is, listen, you have to.

574
00:28:18,680 --> 00:28:21,320
Speaker 2: Accept that failure is a big party. Failure is a

575
00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:22,800
Speaker 2: big part of it, huge part of the game. And

576
00:28:22,840 --> 00:28:25,120
Speaker 2: how do you manage that? How does that affect you?

577
00:28:25,600 --> 00:28:30,600
Speaker 2: Does that discourage you? Does that linger does it manifest

578
00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:34,080
Speaker 2: itself into other things? I had that later in my career.

579
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:37,880
Speaker 2: I really struggled with my putting and that manifested itself

580
00:28:37,920 --> 00:28:39,840
Speaker 2: into the yips for me for a period of time.

581
00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:43,520
Speaker 1: What's that like when you're on because I think everybody listening,

582
00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:48,200
Speaker 1: but everybody listening putting. I've talked to a lot of

583
00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:50,080
Speaker 1: good players about it. I mean, you know, one of

584
00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:52,880
Speaker 1: your good friends, Ricky Fowler, Slicksick's one of the best

585
00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:55,560
Speaker 1: pure putters on the planet, right and he just says, listen,

586
00:28:55,800 --> 00:28:58,719
Speaker 1: Seaball hit Ball, sea Line, hit Line, doesn't think about anything,

587
00:28:58,760 --> 00:29:01,640
Speaker 1: you know, pure natural, but when you do struggle, And

588
00:29:02,080 --> 00:29:05,000
Speaker 1: I think this is really powerful for everyone listening, for

589
00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:08,920
Speaker 1: people that are struggling with putting and struggling with the yips,

590
00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:11,360
Speaker 1: your struggle with that, what's it feel like on the

591
00:29:11,360 --> 00:29:12,520
Speaker 1: golf course, because.

592
00:29:12,280 --> 00:29:14,360
Speaker 3: I mean awful, It's it's uncontrolled.

593
00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:17,640
Speaker 1: We've all seen the videos of you and Ernie L's

594
00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:20,040
Speaker 1: when guys are struggling missing it from two feet. You're

595
00:29:20,040 --> 00:29:21,760
Speaker 1: not You're not trying to do that. You're trying.

596
00:29:22,600 --> 00:29:26,360
Speaker 2: It's it's uh, unless you've been through it, you don't

597
00:29:26,440 --> 00:29:32,560
Speaker 2: understand it. For one, and you know it's a subconscious thing.

598
00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:37,000
Speaker 2: It's it's I grew up on public golf courses in Cleveland,

599
00:29:37,080 --> 00:29:41,200
Speaker 2: Ohio that we're rolling about a seven on the stamp,

600
00:29:41,360 --> 00:29:43,920
Speaker 2: and I never saw a putt that broke more than

601
00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:47,280
Speaker 2: outside left or outside right for a long time. So

602
00:29:47,720 --> 00:29:51,480
Speaker 2: the art of putting I never really learned. If I

603
00:29:51,520 --> 00:29:53,880
Speaker 2: have one regret in my career, is that I didn't

604
00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:55,920
Speaker 2: do better understanding putting.

605
00:29:55,800 --> 00:29:57,880
Speaker 1: And how I like you've understood the golf right, and.

606
00:29:58,320 --> 00:30:01,680
Speaker 2: How I could have been a more consistent putter, because

607
00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:04,160
Speaker 2: as time went on and as I got older, the

608
00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:07,320
Speaker 2: putting got worse and worse, and the misses became more frequent,

609
00:30:08,160 --> 00:30:12,479
Speaker 2: and that manifested itself into the yips by a subconscious feeling. Right,

610
00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:17,320
Speaker 2: I'm feeling some type of emotional pain, mental anguish, anxiety

611
00:30:17,880 --> 00:30:22,120
Speaker 2: with these misses, right, that's embarrassing, that's X, Y or CD.

612
00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:26,240
Speaker 2: I'm labeling it, however, in my mind subconsciously. So what

613
00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:30,120
Speaker 2: happens is you get in that situation again and your

614
00:30:30,120 --> 00:30:33,560
Speaker 2: subconscious goes, hey, remember last time you had this thirty

615
00:30:33,560 --> 00:30:34,479
Speaker 2: incher and you missed it.

616
00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:35,080
Speaker 1: That hurt.

617
00:30:35,640 --> 00:30:39,160
Speaker 2: Don't do it again, right, And it becomes a fight

618
00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:44,280
Speaker 2: or flight situation, And I would go to flight, and

619
00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:47,400
Speaker 2: I had a hard time pulling the trigger. So there's

620
00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:49,160
Speaker 2: a lot of work that I've done in the last

621
00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:52,120
Speaker 2: two years to try to undo that because I'll be

622
00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:54,560
Speaker 2: forty eight next year and I want to play Champions

623
00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:56,600
Speaker 2: Tour and I know I need to putt well. So

624
00:30:56,640 --> 00:31:00,160
Speaker 2: there's things that happened. So it's a very natural thing

625
00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:04,440
Speaker 2: that happens. It's your subconscious warning you that this situation

626
00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:09,480
Speaker 2: is dangerous. It has caused distress and pain and anguish

627
00:31:09,560 --> 00:31:12,800
Speaker 2: in the past, and it's a natural response. And there's

628
00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:17,760
Speaker 2: certain people people that are very self aware and you know,

629
00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:20,520
Speaker 2: care about what other people think or say or do,

630
00:31:21,280 --> 00:31:23,320
Speaker 2: usually are the ones that get the yips that bother

631
00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:26,840
Speaker 2: him the most. So it's it's something that I battled

632
00:31:26,880 --> 00:31:30,360
Speaker 2: late in my career. I've been better lately and understanding it.

633
00:31:30,440 --> 00:31:36,480
Speaker 2: But it's definitely a subconscious, natural response to things, and

634
00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:40,920
Speaker 2: there's ways to manage it. Breathing is one thing understanding that, Hey,

635
00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:43,480
Speaker 2: thanks for warning me, but this isn't that dangerous of

636
00:31:43,520 --> 00:31:44,680
Speaker 2: a situation, right.

637
00:31:45,760 --> 00:31:48,480
Speaker 1: I remember my dad telling me after Greg Norman's had

638
00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:51,920
Speaker 1: the big collapse at Augusta in ninety six. But Greg

639
00:31:52,040 --> 00:31:55,680
Speaker 1: was always a huge visualizer, writing, visualized all the shot.

640
00:31:55,760 --> 00:31:58,920
Speaker 1: Greg wasn't by any means fast, and if you remember

641
00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:03,040
Speaker 1: the worst he played on Sunday, the slower he got.

642
00:32:03,480 --> 00:32:05,960
Speaker 1: And I remember my dad telling me that. My dad

643
00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:08,120
Speaker 1: asked him about it, and he said, my entire career,

644
00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:10,360
Speaker 1: I could visualize the shot, and I was in a

645
00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:13,200
Speaker 1: mental state to where I didn't see anything. So I

646
00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:18,200
Speaker 1: was standing behind it for so long trying to visualize

647
00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:22,520
Speaker 1: a shot, trying to see a shot. I also think

648
00:32:22,560 --> 00:32:24,800
Speaker 1: that part of it, like you said, going back to

649
00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:28,880
Speaker 1: acceptance is saying, Okay, I'm in a bad place right now.

650
00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:32,200
Speaker 1: And I think everyone listening can take that from it. Said, listen,

651
00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:34,680
Speaker 1: when you get into that spell on the golf course,

652
00:32:34,920 --> 00:32:37,160
Speaker 1: it's like a giant rainstorm has just come in and

653
00:32:37,200 --> 00:32:39,880
Speaker 1: it's just for like fifteen minutes. Like here in Florida

654
00:32:39,920 --> 00:32:42,720
Speaker 1: every summer, around three o'clock, a storm blows in, it

655
00:32:42,800 --> 00:32:45,240
Speaker 1: rains for like thirty minutes. It looks like the world's

656
00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:48,920
Speaker 1: gonna end, and then it's sunny. Breathing. You talked about breathing,

657
00:32:49,240 --> 00:32:51,120
Speaker 1: and so is that something that you've tried to.

658
00:32:51,360 --> 00:32:52,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, definitely.

659
00:32:52,320 --> 00:32:55,040
Speaker 2: There's a couple of different things I do to reset

660
00:32:56,080 --> 00:32:57,800
Speaker 2: to try to get out of that frame of mind

661
00:32:57,840 --> 00:33:00,640
Speaker 2: because we're just like all the other golf We get

662
00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:03,240
Speaker 2: in those those spaces. You just don't see them very

663
00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:06,520
Speaker 2: often because usually when we're doing that, we're not playing.

664
00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:07,360
Speaker 3: Well and we're on TV.

665
00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:12,959
Speaker 2: So we go through all these different emotions and different

666
00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:17,239
Speaker 2: techniques to try and reset and clear. And you know,

667
00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:21,840
Speaker 2: the thing is is golf is very score driven, like

668
00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:26,320
Speaker 2: outcome oriented, outcome orients everything. And you know, you have

669
00:33:26,360 --> 00:33:29,239
Speaker 2: a rough six holes, it can it can ruin your

670
00:33:29,280 --> 00:33:30,360
Speaker 2: whole tournament.

671
00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:31,280
Speaker 1: And you lose the process.

672
00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:31,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, and you.

673
00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:36,080
Speaker 2: Lose the process. And so just trying to manage those

674
00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:40,040
Speaker 2: types of situations I think is difficult. Golf is really

675
00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:45,000
Speaker 2: easy for pros when they're playing well, and it's really hard,

676
00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:47,760
Speaker 2: Like you feel like there might be a light at

677
00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:49,360
Speaker 2: the end of the tunnel, but I think it could

678
00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:51,200
Speaker 2: be a train that's about to hit me when it's

679
00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:51,800
Speaker 2: going bad.

680
00:33:52,040 --> 00:33:55,160
Speaker 1: Right. Well, I remember early in Tiger's career, my dad said, listen,

681
00:33:55,200 --> 00:33:58,280
Speaker 1: anybody can play good on tour when they're playing good.

682
00:33:58,320 --> 00:34:00,320
Speaker 1: He's like, that's why they call it playing good. He's like,

683
00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:03,800
Speaker 1: the great ones can manage their games where they don't

684
00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:06,520
Speaker 1: have their best stuff. They can still compete now. I

685
00:34:06,520 --> 00:34:10,600
Speaker 1: think Tiger took that, yeah, but he also took it

686
00:34:10,640 --> 00:34:13,160
Speaker 1: in the early on in his career. He's winning tournaments

687
00:34:13,200 --> 00:34:14,960
Speaker 1: by seven shots, and he's like, yeah, my B game,

688
00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:17,440
Speaker 1: and everybody's going, dude, come on, man, you just smoked

689
00:34:17,520 --> 00:34:19,239
Speaker 1: us by eight You're hitting one hundred passes, and you

690
00:34:19,239 --> 00:34:22,359
Speaker 1: tell us you get your D game right when you

691
00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:26,320
Speaker 1: have your A game? What's that feel like? For everyone listening,

692
00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:28,839
Speaker 1: it's just what's it feel like when you have your

693
00:34:28,880 --> 00:34:31,920
Speaker 1: A game? I mean, are you conscious of it? Are

694
00:34:31,920 --> 00:34:34,799
Speaker 1: you like, Yeah, I've got it today, I've got a

695
00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:36,759
Speaker 1: low scool, Like that's sixty three that you said you

696
00:34:36,760 --> 00:34:40,320
Speaker 1: shot in a major championship at Okill Iconic Old School

697
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:43,919
Speaker 1: golf course. It had to feel pretty good, pretty easy. Yeah,

698
00:34:43,960 --> 00:34:47,480
Speaker 1: But what is that? Is it you getting the right numbers?

699
00:34:47,560 --> 00:34:50,279
Speaker 1: Are you getting the right clubs? Does everything just kind

700
00:34:50,320 --> 00:34:53,520
Speaker 1: of snowball in a positive way? In the way it's

701
00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:55,680
Speaker 1: snowballs in a bad way when you're not playing good.

702
00:34:55,719 --> 00:34:58,279
Speaker 1: Then you have that one go out of bounce hit

703
00:34:58,280 --> 00:34:59,600
Speaker 1: the cart path goes out of bounds, right.

704
00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:03,120
Speaker 2: I think it's a couple of things. A lot of

705
00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:05,320
Speaker 2: it is you have really good control of your swing.

706
00:35:05,920 --> 00:35:08,359
Speaker 2: You've been around guys, you've worked with guys, and you know,

707
00:35:09,040 --> 00:35:13,440
Speaker 2: weeks when guys have control of their swing, their body

708
00:35:13,480 --> 00:35:17,719
Speaker 2: feels a certain way, they're able to, you know, be

709
00:35:17,840 --> 00:35:20,319
Speaker 2: on plane and control of the face however they might

710
00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:20,719
Speaker 2: do it.

711
00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:22,040
Speaker 3: And then some of.

712
00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:27,480
Speaker 2: It has to do with course fit, course conditions. A

713
00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:29,120
Speaker 2: lot of it has to do with getting the right

714
00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:32,359
Speaker 2: yardage in the right situation. People don't realize we're constantly

715
00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:36,040
Speaker 2: trying to fit clubs to numbers that don't always fit

716
00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:37,480
Speaker 2: to those numbers, right.

717
00:35:38,120 --> 00:35:41,680
Speaker 1: And I think days that you struggle, the caddies will also.

718
00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:44,040
Speaker 1: You know, I've had players like player will shoot seventy

719
00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:46,279
Speaker 1: five and not really play that good, and you know

720
00:35:46,320 --> 00:35:47,920
Speaker 1: they're talking about their golf swing, and then you talk

721
00:35:47,960 --> 00:35:50,880
Speaker 1: to the caddies like, we're in between clubs on every

722
00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:53,640
Speaker 1: single shot today, we didn't have one good number.

723
00:35:53,760 --> 00:35:54,759
Speaker 3: Yeah, you get that.

724
00:35:55,040 --> 00:35:58,160
Speaker 2: And you know, we're playing a sport that's on the

725
00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:01,480
Speaker 2: biggest field in all the sports, with the smallest target

726
00:36:01,680 --> 00:36:07,160
Speaker 2: in all of sports, with the smallest object that we're

727
00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:11,120
Speaker 2: trying to move wherever on the field in the elements.

728
00:36:11,680 --> 00:36:14,080
Speaker 3: So there's a lot of things that can go wrong.

729
00:36:15,080 --> 00:36:18,280
Speaker 2: But you know, when we're playing well, the game is easy.

730
00:36:18,400 --> 00:36:22,600
Speaker 2: It seems like our good shots are really good. We've

731
00:36:22,600 --> 00:36:25,320
Speaker 2: all hit great shots that haven't gone the right distance

732
00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:29,400
Speaker 2: or going a bunker or going a water hazard. You know,

733
00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:33,600
Speaker 2: that never happens when you're playing well. You know, if

734
00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:36,200
Speaker 2: you looked at the probability of what it takes to

735
00:36:36,280 --> 00:36:40,399
Speaker 2: make a forty footer that breaks four feet, like, it's

736
00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:44,160
Speaker 2: like zero to nine, zero to none, and you might

737
00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:46,719
Speaker 2: make two of those in one day. So those are

738
00:36:47,200 --> 00:36:51,719
Speaker 2: those are the types of things that happen, and I

739
00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:54,320
Speaker 2: guess that's what attracts people to the game.

740
00:36:55,320 --> 00:36:57,000
Speaker 3: They love that type of stuff.

741
00:36:57,520 --> 00:37:00,839
Speaker 2: And when things aren't going well, the opposite is happening, right.

742
00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:03,120
Speaker 2: I hit it in the bunker, then it plugged. It

743
00:37:03,160 --> 00:37:07,280
Speaker 2: was unplayable. I lifted out three putts from eight feet.

744
00:37:07,520 --> 00:37:09,799
Speaker 3: I you know, X, Y and Z, we all have

745
00:37:09,920 --> 00:37:10,400
Speaker 3: the list.

746
00:37:10,600 --> 00:37:14,760
Speaker 2: So but when you're playing well, things seem very easy.

747
00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:17,759
Speaker 2: Your mind is very uncluttered.

748
00:37:17,840 --> 00:37:18,960
Speaker 1: When it's clear, it's.

749
00:37:18,800 --> 00:37:23,319
Speaker 2: Clear, the pictures are clear, the feelings are clear. Some

750
00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:27,520
Speaker 2: guys run with that for a long period of time,

751
00:37:27,600 --> 00:37:31,480
Speaker 2: but I really believe that, you know, there's always exceptions

752
00:37:31,520 --> 00:37:33,640
Speaker 2: to the rule. But for most guys, you have a

753
00:37:33,719 --> 00:37:37,280
Speaker 2: really good ten years, and somewhere in that ten years

754
00:37:37,320 --> 00:37:40,720
Speaker 2: you have a two or three year peak of really

755
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:43,160
Speaker 2: exceptional play. And that's kind of what happened with me.

756
00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:47,200
Speaker 2: Starting in two thousand and nine, I played really really

757
00:37:47,200 --> 00:37:48,720
Speaker 2: good golf for about ten years.

758
00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:52,120
Speaker 1: It just seemed like you were on like a trajectory

759
00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:54,120
Speaker 1: where you were one of those guys stuff back in

760
00:37:54,160 --> 00:37:56,880
Speaker 1: the day to where every single week you were in

761
00:37:56,880 --> 00:37:58,560
Speaker 1: the hunt on back nine you were.

762
00:37:58,920 --> 00:38:00,560
Speaker 2: I could make a lot of cut and have a

763
00:38:00,560 --> 00:38:01,359
Speaker 2: lot of conn.

764
00:38:01,560 --> 00:38:03,919
Speaker 1: We're always one of the guys that shot that going

765
00:38:03,960 --> 00:38:05,560
Speaker 1: in the weekend were good, and then you'd make that

766
00:38:05,640 --> 00:38:07,440
Speaker 1: move on and then it just seemed like you had

767
00:38:07,440 --> 00:38:10,160
Speaker 1: a run for three, four or five years where you

768
00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:12,120
Speaker 1: were one of the guys that were on the leader

769
00:38:12,120 --> 00:38:13,120
Speaker 1: board every time.

770
00:38:12,920 --> 00:38:15,480
Speaker 2: You turned on twenty eleven, twelve, and thirteen.

771
00:38:16,719 --> 00:38:19,360
Speaker 1: I mean, think of how many times you had chances

772
00:38:19,400 --> 00:38:21,239
Speaker 1: to win tournaments in that.

773
00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:24,239
Speaker 2: Stretch A ton and one of the things that I

774
00:38:24,480 --> 00:38:26,080
Speaker 2: take a lot of pride in. There's a lot of

775
00:38:26,080 --> 00:38:28,319
Speaker 2: things to take brought in, but to me, like that

776
00:38:28,440 --> 00:38:31,040
Speaker 2: top thirty in the FedEx Cup is always kind of

777
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:33,719
Speaker 2: like benchmark a benchmark, and I was able to do

778
00:38:33,800 --> 00:38:36,760
Speaker 2: that seven times in eight years, starting in two thousand

779
00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:37,280
Speaker 2: and nine.

780
00:38:37,320 --> 00:38:38,880
Speaker 3: So that's something I was really proud of.

781
00:38:42,800 --> 00:38:46,040
Speaker 1: Like all professional athletes, you don't get there by yourself

782
00:38:46,360 --> 00:38:50,000
Speaker 1: who have been some of the big influences on your life,

783
00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:51,560
Speaker 1: but your career as well.

784
00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:55,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, so my grandfather and my father both played golf.

785
00:38:55,800 --> 00:38:58,239
Speaker 2: They introduced me to the game. I was a bit

786
00:38:58,280 --> 00:38:59,880
Speaker 2: of a late bloomer. I didn't play a lot, did

787
00:38:59,880 --> 00:39:04,400
Speaker 2: you your golf? I played some, but my grandfather was

788
00:39:04,440 --> 00:39:07,200
Speaker 2: a pitcher for the Chicago White Sox before the World

789
00:39:07,200 --> 00:39:10,080
Speaker 2: War Two, so baseball was always a big thing in

790
00:39:10,120 --> 00:39:12,279
Speaker 2: my family, and I played a lot of baseball growing up.

791
00:39:12,320 --> 00:39:14,799
Speaker 2: I was doing travel ball and all those you know,

792
00:39:14,920 --> 00:39:17,879
Speaker 2: summer league and as much baseball as I could do.

793
00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:20,640
Speaker 2: And then, uh, kind of around thirteen fourteen, I kind

794
00:39:20,640 --> 00:39:24,520
Speaker 2: of transitioned into golf. We moved to South Florida and

795
00:39:25,000 --> 00:39:27,400
Speaker 2: PGA Tour event hount A Classic was at.

796
00:39:27,160 --> 00:39:30,360
Speaker 3: Weston Hills, and I was familiar with golf.

797
00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:34,600
Speaker 2: Family members played golf, but moving there in high school

798
00:39:34,600 --> 00:39:37,080
Speaker 2: and not having friends, Golf's the game you can play

799
00:39:37,080 --> 00:39:39,640
Speaker 2: by yourself, and I kind of transitioned to golf, and

800
00:39:40,360 --> 00:39:42,480
Speaker 2: it's one of those sports that you don't really realize

801
00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:44,200
Speaker 2: why you fall in love with it, but you do

802
00:39:44,320 --> 00:39:46,799
Speaker 2: for some reason. So those were big influences to get

803
00:39:46,800 --> 00:39:50,520
Speaker 2: me started. You know, back when I played high school

804
00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:54,000
Speaker 2: and college, you didn't have coaches and instructors and people

805
00:39:54,040 --> 00:39:57,600
Speaker 2: you worked with, like I watched the guys on tour,

806
00:39:57,680 --> 00:39:59,799
Speaker 2: you know, I was fortunate to watch those guys play.

807
00:39:59,840 --> 00:40:02,840
Speaker 2: So like guys like VJ. Singh would come through and

808
00:40:02,880 --> 00:40:05,239
Speaker 2: I used to play with him tons and tons when

809
00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:07,600
Speaker 2: I was young, and Fred Couples, and I'd go watch

810
00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:08,480
Speaker 2: these guys play.

811
00:40:08,600 --> 00:40:10,799
Speaker 1: I learned from playing a lot with a guy like VJ.

812
00:40:10,880 --> 00:40:13,960
Speaker 1: Because he's just I don't think VJ gets nearly the

813
00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:17,120
Speaker 1: credit that he deserves. Obviously, there are a lot of

814
00:40:17,120 --> 00:40:19,640
Speaker 1: guys in that Tiger era, you know, when Tiger was

815
00:40:19,680 --> 00:40:23,759
Speaker 1: at his powers, but I don't think people remember just

816
00:40:23,960 --> 00:40:26,000
Speaker 1: how dominated a golfer.

817
00:40:26,920 --> 00:40:30,200
Speaker 2: Time he was a man, and I would watch a

818
00:40:30,239 --> 00:40:33,400
Speaker 2: lot of golf. I'd tape golf, that's how you know.

819
00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:36,719
Speaker 2: So so all these guys that are on tour were

820
00:40:37,280 --> 00:40:40,560
Speaker 2: big parts of my golf life. And then as I

821
00:40:40,600 --> 00:40:44,239
Speaker 2: started turning pro, you know, you start coming across people,

822
00:40:44,280 --> 00:40:46,520
Speaker 2: and I came across Chuck Cook, who really helped me,

823
00:40:47,600 --> 00:40:50,160
Speaker 2: I think, understand what it meant to be on tour

824
00:40:50,360 --> 00:40:53,600
Speaker 2: and how to practice and how to prepare and what

825
00:40:53,680 --> 00:40:56,760
Speaker 2: I needed to be a good tour player. He helped

826
00:40:56,800 --> 00:40:59,680
Speaker 2: me with the mechanics of the golf swing to an extent.

827
00:41:00,200 --> 00:41:03,280
Speaker 2: But I think what he provided me more than anything

828
00:41:03,400 --> 00:41:08,680
Speaker 2: was understanding and a blueprint of, you know, how to practice,

829
00:41:08,680 --> 00:41:10,920
Speaker 2: how to prepare, how to be a PGA tour player,

830
00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:13,319
Speaker 2: and what I needed to be successful.

831
00:41:13,640 --> 00:41:14,719
Speaker 3: So he helped me a lot.

832
00:41:14,760 --> 00:41:17,600
Speaker 1: And Chuck is such an old school guy, right, you know.

833
00:41:17,680 --> 00:41:20,680
Speaker 1: I look at guys like my dad, guys like Randy Smith,

834
00:41:21,239 --> 00:41:23,600
Speaker 1: guys like they're kind of throwbacks right there. They were

835
00:41:23,600 --> 00:41:25,920
Speaker 1: old school. They grew up in an era to where

836
00:41:26,080 --> 00:41:30,000
Speaker 1: you know, golf wasn't what it was and is now today.

837
00:41:32,160 --> 00:41:35,080
Speaker 1: You talk about the technical side, how much of the

838
00:41:35,120 --> 00:41:38,040
Speaker 1: influence on your career did Chuck have both, you know,

839
00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:43,799
Speaker 1: from a technique standpoint and then from a execution management standpoint.

840
00:41:44,000 --> 00:41:47,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think execution and management was big for me

841
00:41:47,520 --> 00:41:49,279
Speaker 2: and what I learned from him. He had worked with

842
00:41:49,320 --> 00:41:52,279
Speaker 2: Payne Stewart and he had worked with Tom Kite, so

843
00:41:52,360 --> 00:41:54,640
Speaker 2: he was familiar with pretty good players. Yeah, being with

844
00:41:54,719 --> 00:41:57,520
Speaker 2: those guys winning majors, playing at.

845
00:41:57,440 --> 00:41:58,160
Speaker 3: A high level.

846
00:41:58,280 --> 00:42:02,879
Speaker 2: So he probably shared with me how those guys did

847
00:42:02,880 --> 00:42:06,360
Speaker 2: it in whatever way without saying it's invaluable. Yeah, without

848
00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:09,160
Speaker 2: saying like Tom Kaite did it this way right, and this.

849
00:42:09,239 --> 00:42:11,240
Speaker 1: Was what good players do. Yeah.

850
00:42:11,360 --> 00:42:15,160
Speaker 2: So that helped me a lot, and the technique helped me.

851
00:42:15,320 --> 00:42:19,040
Speaker 2: I think for me, I had to be smart about

852
00:42:19,040 --> 00:42:21,319
Speaker 2: my golf, if that makes sense. I didn't feel like

853
00:42:21,440 --> 00:42:25,120
Speaker 2: I had a lot of I had physical skill and ability,

854
00:42:25,160 --> 00:42:27,919
Speaker 2: but maybe not to what some of these peers did.

855
00:42:28,520 --> 00:42:32,040
Speaker 2: So I had to be smart in how I knew

856
00:42:32,200 --> 00:42:35,200
Speaker 2: what worked for me, and I had to work hard,

857
00:42:35,600 --> 00:42:38,360
Speaker 2: Like I had to put in sixty seventy hour weeks.

858
00:42:38,360 --> 00:42:40,040
Speaker 2: That's what I had to do, and I did that

859
00:42:40,120 --> 00:42:44,160
Speaker 2: for a long time, which I don't do as much anymore.

860
00:42:44,640 --> 00:42:46,440
Speaker 1: Well, you know, the body as we get older doesn't

861
00:42:46,480 --> 00:42:49,279
Speaker 1: allow us. Yes, switching to the equipment side. You've been

862
00:42:49,320 --> 00:42:51,560
Speaker 1: with Cobra Golf for a while. They've got their new

863
00:42:51,680 --> 00:42:55,120
Speaker 1: ds adapt drivers coming out. The new driver, what do

864
00:42:55,160 --> 00:42:57,200
Speaker 1: you like about it? You know, when you get a

865
00:42:57,280 --> 00:43:00,239
Speaker 1: new driver, first thing I think for me, is the

866
00:43:00,239 --> 00:43:02,960
Speaker 1: way it looks? Are you? Are you more of a

867
00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:05,319
Speaker 1: look guy or more of a feel guy when it

868
00:43:05,360 --> 00:43:08,040
Speaker 1: comes to kind of the way a driver looks.

869
00:43:08,360 --> 00:43:11,279
Speaker 2: I can get by the looks if it feels and

870
00:43:11,360 --> 00:43:12,200
Speaker 2: performs right.

871
00:43:12,760 --> 00:43:14,560
Speaker 3: But it's not a non starter.

872
00:43:15,280 --> 00:43:18,680
Speaker 2: But I would say this one, they've taken some things

873
00:43:18,719 --> 00:43:22,160
Speaker 2: that we've talked to them about, like what tour players prefer.

874
00:43:22,360 --> 00:43:25,239
Speaker 2: So they've kind of taken the crown and there's a

875
00:43:25,320 --> 00:43:28,200
Speaker 2: separation between the crown and the face angle. Now they

876
00:43:28,239 --> 00:43:30,480
Speaker 2: put some scoring lines on the face angle, so we

877
00:43:30,520 --> 00:43:33,719
Speaker 2: can just distinguish where the face angle is.

878
00:43:34,200 --> 00:43:35,799
Speaker 1: Do you like to see when you look down at

879
00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:37,520
Speaker 1: the driver? Do you like to see it sit a

880
00:43:37,520 --> 00:43:39,800
Speaker 1: little bit kind of toe open? Do you want to

881
00:43:39,840 --> 00:43:41,799
Speaker 1: see a little bit less loft? What do you like

882
00:43:41,840 --> 00:43:42,279
Speaker 1: when you.

883
00:43:42,560 --> 00:43:43,600
Speaker 3: Like toe open?

884
00:43:43,680 --> 00:43:45,960
Speaker 2: And I like seeing off because I like to lean

885
00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:49,200
Speaker 2: the shaft than so often. Yeah, so I like offset

886
00:43:49,200 --> 00:43:51,360
Speaker 2: on irons. A lot of people don't like offset on it.

887
00:43:51,480 --> 00:43:54,239
Speaker 1: Really, I would have never thought, given kind of your

888
00:43:54,360 --> 00:43:57,000
Speaker 1: kind of old school kind of the way that you

889
00:43:57,080 --> 00:43:58,840
Speaker 1: kind of push, you would like offset.

890
00:43:58,960 --> 00:44:01,719
Speaker 2: Offset looks like loft, and it looks like hook, and

891
00:44:01,760 --> 00:44:04,319
Speaker 2: it looks like I can lean the shaft, So you.

892
00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:07,880
Speaker 1: Know, my grandfather used to say that at impact, you

893
00:44:07,920 --> 00:44:11,239
Speaker 1: want your wrist to be like Bethlehem steel, not a

894
00:44:11,360 --> 00:44:15,200
Speaker 1: Linguini with clam saucety. So he was very weak grip,

895
00:44:15,239 --> 00:44:16,640
Speaker 1: and believe it or not, I don't know if I've

896
00:44:16,640 --> 00:44:20,080
Speaker 1: told you that my grandfather interlocked with the left thumb

897
00:44:20,280 --> 00:44:22,880
Speaker 1: off because he hooked it as a kid. So he

898
00:44:22,880 --> 00:44:25,640
Speaker 1: would basically just try and fold that angle. If you've

899
00:44:25,640 --> 00:44:28,640
Speaker 1: never hit one like that, take take interlock and the

900
00:44:28,719 --> 00:44:31,520
Speaker 1: left thumb is over here, you can just basically hold

901
00:44:31,560 --> 00:44:36,959
Speaker 1: that champions. The other thing I think that's really cool

902
00:44:36,960 --> 00:44:41,000
Speaker 1: about the new drivers from Cobra is the adjustable hostle

903
00:44:41,080 --> 00:44:43,880
Speaker 1: to be able to adjust not only the lie and

904
00:44:44,000 --> 00:44:47,279
Speaker 1: I mean the loft, but the lie everybody working on

905
00:44:47,440 --> 00:44:50,640
Speaker 1: but now we can just a lot of different things.

906
00:44:50,680 --> 00:44:52,840
Speaker 1: How do you think that's going to help the average golf.

907
00:44:52,680 --> 00:44:53,479
Speaker 3: I think it can help.

908
00:44:53,800 --> 00:44:56,080
Speaker 2: I know it's going to help us on tour because

909
00:44:56,120 --> 00:44:59,360
Speaker 2: we've been wanting the flatter, flatter, flatter, right.

910
00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:02,080
Speaker 1: Why do you tour players want the driver flatter.

911
00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:04,800
Speaker 2: Because we swing it on plane because.

912
00:45:04,600 --> 00:45:06,480
Speaker 1: We're not coming over the top of that, I mean,

913
00:45:06,680 --> 00:45:08,279
Speaker 1: because we're not ten left in it.

914
00:45:08,440 --> 00:45:09,919
Speaker 3: Yeah, trick.

915
00:45:10,560 --> 00:45:14,719
Speaker 2: The trick that the equipment companies have is they're trying

916
00:45:14,719 --> 00:45:18,120
Speaker 2: to build stuff for consumers that buy, and generally speaking,

917
00:45:18,160 --> 00:45:20,840
Speaker 2: consumers aren't the best golfers.

918
00:45:20,840 --> 00:45:23,200
Speaker 1: And you want a Formula one race card, you don't

919
00:45:23,200 --> 00:45:23,799
Speaker 1: want to and.

920
00:45:23,760 --> 00:45:26,600
Speaker 2: They're usually over the top, and they usually slice, and

921
00:45:26,600 --> 00:45:28,680
Speaker 2: they usually have a ton of spin. They usually hit

922
00:45:28,760 --> 00:45:31,480
Speaker 2: down on it. So all these things they change is

923
00:45:31,520 --> 00:45:33,799
Speaker 2: great for them. But then you get to somebody that's

924
00:45:33,840 --> 00:45:36,279
Speaker 2: on plane doesn't work as much.

925
00:45:36,320 --> 00:45:37,200
Speaker 3: So that's the trick.

926
00:45:37,280 --> 00:45:40,480
Speaker 2: And I think, you know, having the adjustability now we'll

927
00:45:40,520 --> 00:45:44,319
Speaker 2: be able to really dial in the drivers and get

928
00:45:44,360 --> 00:45:47,399
Speaker 2: them to where we can play them just as well.

929
00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:50,920
Speaker 1: Hobbies off the golf course. And if you weren't a golfer, Duff,

930
00:45:51,040 --> 00:45:52,040
Speaker 1: what would you be doing.

931
00:45:53,080 --> 00:45:55,160
Speaker 3: I've never thought about what Rick says.

932
00:45:55,239 --> 00:45:57,800
Speaker 1: Your your your kitchen game is pretty good.

933
00:45:58,360 --> 00:46:02,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, so hobbies, I would say cooking. I enjoy cooking

934
00:46:02,920 --> 00:46:03,160
Speaker 2: a lot.

935
00:46:03,200 --> 00:46:06,480
Speaker 1: What do you like about it? The process?

936
00:46:06,520 --> 00:46:10,759
Speaker 2: Probably the process, like the I'm into the process and

937
00:46:11,640 --> 00:46:14,680
Speaker 2: just the that's just like my mind works that way,

938
00:46:14,800 --> 00:46:17,120
Speaker 2: Like you do this, then you do this so and

939
00:46:17,160 --> 00:46:18,880
Speaker 2: then you get this result.

940
00:46:18,960 --> 00:46:20,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, this result that's usually pretty good.

941
00:46:21,440 --> 00:46:24,799
Speaker 2: I like offshore fishing, which I've been doing some this

942
00:46:24,840 --> 00:46:28,600
Speaker 2: past year since I haven't been playing much. I've got

943
00:46:28,640 --> 00:46:32,280
Speaker 2: an eighteen month old, so he keeps me on my toes,

944
00:46:32,360 --> 00:46:35,480
Speaker 2: so to speak. And if I wasn't playing golf, I

945
00:46:35,560 --> 00:46:39,080
Speaker 2: really have no idea because I've never even thought about it.

946
00:46:39,840 --> 00:46:41,560
Speaker 1: Well, the good thing is you've never had to.

947
00:46:41,719 --> 00:46:45,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, I would not be a golf instructor like yourself.

948
00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:50,040
Speaker 1: With someone obviously, because everybody kind of sees you as

949
00:46:50,080 --> 00:46:54,319
Speaker 1: a student of the swing. Thank you for saying that.

950
00:46:54,360 --> 00:46:56,919
Speaker 1: You please tell everybody what you said when somebody else

951
00:46:57,000 --> 00:46:58,440
Speaker 1: if you wanted to be a golf instructor.

952
00:46:58,440 --> 00:46:59,719
Speaker 3: I don't want to deal with these guys.

953
00:47:00,080 --> 00:47:03,560
Speaker 1: You guys, you tour players are all absolutely lunatics.

954
00:47:03,640 --> 00:47:04,200
Speaker 3: Lunatics.

955
00:47:04,280 --> 00:47:05,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, why are you guys so close?

956
00:47:06,000 --> 00:47:08,839
Speaker 3: I don't I never tried to be that way, but.

957
00:47:10,440 --> 00:47:12,480
Speaker 2: You know, I don't want to get texts at nine

958
00:47:12,640 --> 00:47:15,480
Speaker 2: thirty at night about a golf swing and have forty

959
00:47:15,480 --> 00:47:18,640
Speaker 2: five minute conversation like hey, it's golf, Like hey.

960
00:47:18,640 --> 00:47:20,399
Speaker 1: My favorite is take a look at the swing on dude,

961
00:47:20,440 --> 00:47:20,959
Speaker 1: I'm not there.

962
00:47:21,120 --> 00:47:24,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, it doesn't matter, like it's in the camera angle.

963
00:47:24,160 --> 00:47:26,640
Speaker 3: Everybody's the camera. It's in two dimensions.

964
00:47:26,719 --> 00:47:29,120
Speaker 1: Like I get so many people say you do one

965
00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:31,239
Speaker 1: of the things I've never done that that I could

966
00:47:31,280 --> 00:47:34,319
Speaker 1: probably make a pretty decent, you know, amount of money

967
00:47:34,360 --> 00:47:38,160
Speaker 1: out the online golf instruction because for me, if I can't,

968
00:47:38,480 --> 00:47:40,400
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, I can look at golf swings and

969
00:47:40,400 --> 00:47:43,560
Speaker 1: stuff and with the players that I see all the time, right,

970
00:47:43,840 --> 00:47:46,719
Speaker 1: you know, I know the guys I work with golf swings.

971
00:47:46,760 --> 00:47:49,560
Speaker 1: You know they're in slow motion because I've seen so

972
00:47:49,680 --> 00:47:51,839
Speaker 1: many of them. But when people say, hey, I really

973
00:47:52,040 --> 00:47:53,799
Speaker 1: I'm living I live in Australia and I really love

974
00:47:53,800 --> 00:47:55,279
Speaker 1: to work with you, I'm like, dude, how's that going

975
00:47:55,360 --> 00:47:58,160
Speaker 1: to work. I'd happily take your money, but I couldn't

976
00:47:58,200 --> 00:48:00,680
Speaker 1: do it because for me, I need to be there to.

977
00:48:00,719 --> 00:48:02,200
Speaker 3: Kind of you need to see how the body man.

978
00:48:02,239 --> 00:48:05,200
Speaker 1: I need to see what you're doing in all of

979
00:48:05,239 --> 00:48:05,840
Speaker 1: those things.

980
00:48:06,080 --> 00:48:06,279
Speaker 3: Yeah.

981
00:48:06,760 --> 00:48:09,719
Speaker 1: Lastly, dolh forty eight years old, two years to the

982
00:48:09,800 --> 00:48:12,880
Speaker 1: Champs Tour, you said you wanted to play, So that

983
00:48:13,040 --> 00:48:16,000
Speaker 1: two year I don't want to say limbo, but it

984
00:48:16,120 --> 00:48:20,359
Speaker 1: is somewhat limbo because you're waiting to play on a tour,

985
00:48:20,400 --> 00:48:24,640
Speaker 1: which as a past major champion, you're gonna go out.

986
00:48:25,080 --> 00:48:27,120
Speaker 1: I can't imagine you're not gonna go out and play well.

987
00:48:27,719 --> 00:48:30,200
Speaker 1: So what's the next couple of years look like for you?

988
00:48:30,440 --> 00:48:30,720
Speaker 3: Yeah?

989
00:48:30,800 --> 00:48:35,200
Speaker 2: I think I'm fortunate that I don't really need to

990
00:48:35,200 --> 00:48:37,719
Speaker 2: play golf right now, and I'm able to take some

991
00:48:37,840 --> 00:48:41,160
Speaker 2: time away. I turned pro in two thousand and I

992
00:48:41,280 --> 00:48:43,359
Speaker 2: put a lot of time and effort for twenty three

993
00:48:43,400 --> 00:48:46,120
Speaker 2: years into that. So this year has been kind of

994
00:48:46,120 --> 00:48:48,799
Speaker 2: a rest and recovery year. Some people take rest and

995
00:48:48,880 --> 00:48:52,799
Speaker 2: recovery days or weeks, but I've been doing that for

996
00:48:52,840 --> 00:48:54,920
Speaker 2: a year. I've been doing some research.

997
00:48:54,560 --> 00:48:55,120
Speaker 3: On my game.

998
00:48:55,480 --> 00:48:57,040
Speaker 2: I've been working with a guy in New York, a

999
00:48:57,080 --> 00:48:59,640
Speaker 2: little bit called Mike Jacobs, who does a lot of

1000
00:48:59,640 --> 00:49:01,520
Speaker 2: three D stuff, connecting work.

1001
00:49:02,360 --> 00:49:05,000
Speaker 1: What have you seen in the three D that maybe

1002
00:49:05,000 --> 00:49:08,960
Speaker 1: you didn't know? More just a better understanding as to

1003
00:49:09,040 --> 00:49:10,240
Speaker 1: how your body works.

1004
00:49:10,400 --> 00:49:13,480
Speaker 2: It's more about how my body works, how I function.

1005
00:49:13,239 --> 00:49:15,200
Speaker 1: How your body works today, this is the way your

1006
00:49:15,239 --> 00:49:15,719
Speaker 1: body works.

1007
00:49:15,880 --> 00:49:18,000
Speaker 2: And understanding that I'm not going to swing like I

1008
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:21,279
Speaker 2: did ten years ago, but understanding where I'm at now

1009
00:49:21,320 --> 00:49:23,480
Speaker 2: and what I can do better. I think that gives

1010
00:49:23,480 --> 00:49:27,000
Speaker 2: you a good blueprint of where you're at.

1011
00:49:27,080 --> 00:49:28,719
Speaker 3: And what you could do and maybe what you could

1012
00:49:28,719 --> 00:49:29,520
Speaker 3: do a little bit better.

1013
00:49:29,560 --> 00:49:31,600
Speaker 2: I also have a lot of freedom right now because

1014
00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:34,840
Speaker 2: I'm not playing competitively, so I can play with stuff.

1015
00:49:34,880 --> 00:49:36,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, you can try stuff and say, hey, listen, let

1016
00:49:36,719 --> 00:49:40,000
Speaker 1: me really push the rabbit hole of changing this, because

1017
00:49:40,000 --> 00:49:42,319
Speaker 1: I don't have to worry about Okay, I can work

1018
00:49:42,360 --> 00:49:43,480
Speaker 1: on this for two weeks, but then I got to

1019
00:49:43,520 --> 00:49:45,640
Speaker 1: go to Memorial and try and make the cotton, try

1020
00:49:45,640 --> 00:49:46,040
Speaker 1: and get them.

1021
00:49:46,120 --> 00:49:48,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, So that's given me a lot of freedom in

1022
00:49:48,160 --> 00:49:51,400
Speaker 2: that aspect. I think this year, you know, and I

1023
00:49:51,520 --> 00:49:53,400
Speaker 2: keep my toe in the water. I played eight events.

1024
00:49:53,960 --> 00:49:55,960
Speaker 2: I think it's important to play some you got to

1025
00:49:56,000 --> 00:50:00,000
Speaker 2: keep I don't want to keep playing twenty five weeks

1026
00:50:00,239 --> 00:50:03,600
Speaker 2: year right now, but I practice some like I kind

1027
00:50:03,600 --> 00:50:05,560
Speaker 2: of do golf on my terms right now.

1028
00:50:05,640 --> 00:50:07,520
Speaker 1: This is what I call as supposed to because when

1029
00:50:07,520 --> 00:50:09,680
Speaker 1: you're when you're a professional golfer trying to play at

1030
00:50:09,680 --> 00:50:11,799
Speaker 1: the highest level, you're not playing golf on your time.

1031
00:50:11,880 --> 00:50:15,640
Speaker 1: You're playing golf in a very structured environment and if

1032
00:50:15,680 --> 00:50:18,359
Speaker 1: you are struggling, and I don't think people realize this.

1033
00:50:18,640 --> 00:50:20,839
Speaker 1: I think one of the negative effects of the only

1034
00:50:20,880 --> 00:50:23,680
Speaker 1: negative effect of tiger woods is he made it fashionable

1035
00:50:23,719 --> 00:50:26,440
Speaker 1: for everybody to try and change their golf swings. But

1036
00:50:26,960 --> 00:50:28,959
Speaker 1: when you're playing on tour, you don't have four months

1037
00:50:29,000 --> 00:50:30,440
Speaker 1: to go. Let me go down the rabbit hole of

1038
00:50:30,520 --> 00:50:32,840
Speaker 1: really trying to change.

1039
00:50:32,160 --> 00:50:33,160
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1040
00:50:34,000 --> 00:50:39,040
Speaker 2: So that's been nice, and I think as I get closer,

1041
00:50:39,239 --> 00:50:42,480
Speaker 2: I'll look at some opportunities. I may play that twenty

1042
00:50:42,560 --> 00:50:44,400
Speaker 2: six year on the corn Ferry Tour because I'll be

1043
00:50:44,400 --> 00:50:46,880
Speaker 2: able to have status. So I may look at playing

1044
00:50:46,960 --> 00:50:49,440
Speaker 2: like twelve fifteen events just to get back into that

1045
00:50:49,560 --> 00:50:54,040
Speaker 2: routine and hopefully, you know, I'll be ready to play.

1046
00:50:54,080 --> 00:50:57,200
Speaker 2: I think it's important to play and practice and stay

1047
00:50:57,200 --> 00:51:00,640
Speaker 2: with it to an extent. I think take three years

1048
00:51:00,640 --> 00:51:03,840
Speaker 2: away from golf and just being at home probably wouldn't

1049
00:51:03,840 --> 00:51:07,160
Speaker 2: be conducive to great play on the Champions Tour. So

1050
00:51:07,200 --> 00:51:09,720
Speaker 2: I'm kind of staying with it. And as I get closer,

1051
00:51:09,760 --> 00:51:12,080
Speaker 2: I can see myself ramping up. But right now I'm

1052
00:51:12,160 --> 00:51:15,760
Speaker 2: enjoying lots of other things in my life other than golf.

1053
00:51:15,880 --> 00:51:18,120
Speaker 1: Well, you deserve it enough. Can't thank you enough for

1054
00:51:18,160 --> 00:51:20,520
Speaker 1: talking to me. And the biggest compliment, Duff, that I

1055
00:51:20,520 --> 00:51:22,160
Speaker 1: can give you is you know you and I didn't

1056
00:51:22,160 --> 00:51:24,239
Speaker 1: really spend a lot of time together when you were

1057
00:51:24,239 --> 00:51:26,640
Speaker 1: on tour. But if you were hitting golf balls and

1058
00:51:26,680 --> 00:51:29,640
Speaker 1: I was waiting, I would go kind of stand back

1059
00:51:29,719 --> 00:51:32,359
Speaker 1: far enough away and I would just watch you hit

1060
00:51:32,400 --> 00:51:34,680
Speaker 1: golf balls, and I just marveled it the way you

1061
00:51:34,760 --> 00:51:37,120
Speaker 1: swung the golf club, the way that kind of your

1062
00:51:37,120 --> 00:51:39,760
Speaker 1: body moved through it, in the way that you really

1063
00:51:39,760 --> 00:51:42,680
Speaker 1: did simplify things. So I can't wait to see you

1064
00:51:42,680 --> 00:51:45,279
Speaker 1: playing on the Champs Tour. I have no doubt you

1065
00:51:45,360 --> 00:51:46,800
Speaker 1: will be a success.

1066
00:51:46,840 --> 00:51:48,000
Speaker 3: Thanks for selling. Yes, thank you.

1067
00:51:49,120 --> 00:51:51,200
Speaker 1: So that was Jason Dufner, And like I said, it's

1068
00:51:51,320 --> 00:51:54,400
Speaker 1: the second major of the week this week at Quail Hollow,

1069
00:51:54,440 --> 00:51:57,520
Speaker 1: the PGA Championship, and if the first major of the

1070
00:51:57,560 --> 00:52:02,200
Speaker 1: year with Roy McElroy dueling with Rose Bryson d Chambeau,

1071
00:52:02,400 --> 00:52:04,240
Speaker 1: I think we're in for a really good major season.

1072
00:52:04,280 --> 00:52:06,759
Speaker 1: I think we're going to have a season where the

1073
00:52:06,760 --> 00:52:08,640
Speaker 1: best players in the world are going to contend for

1074
00:52:08,719 --> 00:52:12,360
Speaker 1: major championships. There's always going to be surprises. But excited

1075
00:52:12,360 --> 00:52:14,800
Speaker 1: about Quail Hollow. It's a great golf course, it's a

1076
00:52:14,800 --> 00:52:18,680
Speaker 1: great venue, and the second major of the year is

1077
00:52:18,880 --> 00:52:21,439
Speaker 1: upon us sono it butch comes to you most every week,

1078
00:52:21,640 --> 00:52:24,759
Speaker 1: great review. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.