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Speaker 1: Welcome to Creature feature production of I Heart Radio. I'm

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Speaker 1: your ghostly host, katee eke Goolden. It's it's Katie Golden.

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Speaker 1: I'm doing a spooky Halloween name. I studied psychology and

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Speaker 1: evolutionary biology, and I like to dive into the brains

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Speaker 1: of humans and animals and get all gross and sticky.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to Creature features Spooky October spook Tacular A thing

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Speaker 1: I just made up today on the show Superstition Black cats, crows,

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Speaker 1: ravens and a mysterious demonic monster. Where do superstitions come from?

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Speaker 1: What are the facts behind the superstition? And our crows

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Speaker 1: really conspiring against us? Discover this and more as we

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Speaker 1: answer the angel question. Do Satanists like to kiss cat?

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Speaker 1: But so? Superstitions are a powerful force throughout human society.

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Speaker 1: About fifty of pold Americans report holding some superstitions. As

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Speaker 1: children were particularly adept at picking up superstitions, researchers found

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Speaker 1: that young children from three to five years old will

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Speaker 1: dutifully rub a pebble against their forehead when told it

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Speaker 1: can help them study. This seems cute and funny, but

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Speaker 1: as adults were not much better. A study found that

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Speaker 1: college students were more likely to keep lottery tickets that

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Speaker 1: had their quote lucky numbers on them than those with

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Speaker 1: random numbers. Whether we carry a lucky charm, avoid a

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Speaker 1: crack in the sidewalk, think we're on a lucky role

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Speaker 1: in the casino, or whatever weird little habits we try

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Speaker 1: to do and get a certain outcome. We're all, to

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Speaker 1: a certain extent superstitious. But being superstitious isn't a sign

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Speaker 1: of being stupid, it's quite the opposite. As intelligent creatures,

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Speaker 1: we form connections. This allows us to figure out tools, language, ideas, philosophy, technology, art,

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Speaker 1: and bad puns, basically everything that makes human special. Of course,

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Speaker 1: making connections can be a double edged sword. Sometimes they

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Speaker 1: make sense, like if I wear a sweater, I'm less

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Speaker 1: likely to be cold later. But sometimes they don't make sense,

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Speaker 1: like if I wear my lucky never washed underwear, maybe

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Speaker 1: this will be the day I'll win the lottery in

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Speaker 1: the heart of my crush despite smelling like kind ofwashed underwear.

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Speaker 1: Superstitions seem to reach a fever pitch when it comes

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Speaker 1: to animals. I think this has to do with our

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Speaker 1: natural curiosity about our fellow living creatures, and both our

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Speaker 1: tips to understand them, and our misunderstandings. As we have

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Speaker 1: throughout history tried to figure out the animal kingdom, we

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Speaker 1: have sometimes developed superstitions about those animals which we deemed

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Speaker 1: mysterious or sneaky. So today we'll be exploring some of

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Speaker 1: the animal superstitions, the scientific facts behind these animals, and

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Speaker 1: why our brains and even animal brains can be superstitious.

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Speaker 1: Joining me to go on a superstition expedition as comedian, writer, podcaster, filmmaker,

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Speaker 1: and Garfield lover Joey Cliff. Yeah, hey everybody, I okay,

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Speaker 1: So a couple of things. Um, I wish I thought

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Speaker 1: of like a Halloween name before this. I guess I

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Speaker 1: should be like joe Eke Cliff, but like the cliff

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Speaker 1: is where it first? Joe Eke Cliffhanger. Yeah, Oak Cliffhanger.

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Speaker 1: There we go. And just for the record, UM, I

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Speaker 1: definitely rubbed a pebble on my forehead and I'm wearing

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Speaker 1: mine clean underwear before going on this show. Not for

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Speaker 1: superstition reasons. I'm just weird. He just enjoys it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: It's just how I live my life. Thanks for having me.

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Speaker 1: I'm excited to talk to superstitions. Yeah, for sure, I

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Speaker 1: brought you on, especially because you're a fellow cat lover.

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Speaker 1: I want to talk about black cats today. Oh my

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Speaker 1: favorite I mean my favorite kind of cats, but also

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Speaker 1: every kind of cat is my favorite kind of cat.

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Speaker 1: So that does not know it right, you would? You

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Speaker 1: You just showed me like an orange cat that looks

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Speaker 1: like Garfield and you're like, this is my favorite cat,

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Speaker 1: and then you look at another cat and you're like,

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Speaker 1: that's my favorite cat. Yeah, it's It's just like any

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Speaker 1: cat that I'm looking at or thinking about at any

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Speaker 1: given moment is my favorite cat. It's a real object,

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Speaker 1: permanent stitution. So as you may know, uh, in especially

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Speaker 1: in Western Europe, there's superstitions about black cats and then

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Speaker 1: being unlucky, like you're not supposed to be if your

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Speaker 1: path is interrupted by a black cat, or a black

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Speaker 1: cat walks in front of you, it's bad luck, which

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Speaker 1: seems a little weird. So it's kind of curious where

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Speaker 1: this started, what this kind of superstition originated from. My

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Speaker 1: guess is that the just the dog lobby was very

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Speaker 1: powerful century Europe. It's just this like teetering man in

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Speaker 1: a trench coat with like oddly doglike features. It's like, yes,

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Speaker 1: cats are bad. It's like it's like it's a dog.

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Speaker 1: So he's like, gross, cots are bad. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: It's man mannershon and I am here a human fellow

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Speaker 1: telling you that cats are bad. As an unbiased human,

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Speaker 1: I mean like if like ten dogs learned to climb

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Speaker 1: into a trench coat and like right on each other's

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Speaker 1: shoulders and also speak English, I feel like I would

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Speaker 1: listen to him that they really want they really wanted

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Speaker 1: this right exactly. So in Western Europe during the Middle Ages,

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Speaker 1: black cats beca aim associated with the devil. People believe

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Speaker 1: that black cats were which familiars or even witches in disguise.

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Speaker 1: There's this old story about a black cat who had

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Speaker 1: rocks thrown at it, which come on, don't do that, um,

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Speaker 1: and then it limped away into a woman's house. That right,

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Speaker 1: and then a woman came out and was limping on

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Speaker 1: the same foot as the cat. Qwe dy ergo the

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Speaker 1: cat was which in disguise, perfect science, perfect science. So

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Speaker 1: the your origin of this idea of cats being satanic

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Speaker 1: maybe due to a papal bowl, which is a public

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Speaker 1: decree in I guess the church, the Catholic Church um

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Speaker 1: by Pope Gregory the ninth in the twelve thirties. So

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Speaker 1: the decree was called vox in rama. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I don't speak Latin, so I think it's like speech

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Speaker 1: in rama. Yeah, right, Um described a Satanic ritual. So quote,

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Speaker 1: a black cat descends backwards with tail erect first the novice,

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Speaker 1: then the master, than each one of the orders that

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Speaker 1: these are Satanists who are worthy in perfect kiss the

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Speaker 1: cat on its buttocks. Then each returns to his place,

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Speaker 1: and speaking certain responses, they incline their heads towards the cat.

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Speaker 1: Forgive us, says the master, and the next one to

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Speaker 1: him repeats this, a third responding, we know, Master. A

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Speaker 1: fourth says, and we must obey. So these are Satanists

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Speaker 1: kissing a cat on the anus and then asking it

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Speaker 1: to forgive them. Wow. So I think that today I've

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Speaker 1: learned that I'm a Satanist. Um. Yeah, that's weird. Uh yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean I wonder, like what is the root of that? Why?

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Speaker 1: Like was this based on some like Pegan ritual or whatever,

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Speaker 1: or was the pope just looking for an easy escapegoat

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Speaker 1: or escape cat as for just like, why did they

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Speaker 1: Why did they pick on cats? Why? I think the

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Speaker 1: latter basically propaganda. Cats are kind of mysterious looking there.

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Speaker 1: They aren't like a dog where they kind of obey you.

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Speaker 1: And so maybe this idea of this kind of mysterious

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Speaker 1: dark creature that you know, it's eyes glow in the

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Speaker 1: dark and there there's something you know, spooky about that.

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Speaker 1: But it's totally made up, Like this never happened as

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Speaker 1: far as I know. This has never been a Satanic ritual. Um.

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Speaker 1: But it's just propaganda to make it like, look, how

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Speaker 1: spooky and weird these satans Satanic ritual It's just something

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Speaker 1: that I mean a lot of my cat lover friends

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Speaker 1: do all the time. Yeah, I mean, you guys are

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Speaker 1: already probably riddled with ta gandhia eyes. So yeah, that's

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Speaker 1: like the amount of cats that I've kissed directly on

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Speaker 1: the mouth. It's like it's like I'm sure I have,

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Speaker 1: And that's just like one step removed from the butthole

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Speaker 1: because that mouth is on the butt hole almost right.

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Speaker 1: It's also just part of the dietary, says, It's part

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Speaker 1: of the digestives. Right. Cats are little poop donuts that's

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Speaker 1: spend most of their time with mouth on their butt hole,

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Speaker 1: like cleaning themselves, and half of the other time eating stuff.

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Speaker 1: So it's just you know, you're any time you interact

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Speaker 1: with a cat is just one butthole. I mean, you

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Speaker 1: said you're describing a cat as a poop butthole. I know,

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Speaker 1: I know that I should be grossed out by that,

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Speaker 1: but when you said that, it made me go like, oh,

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Speaker 1: they are because you because you're absolutely riddled with ganda

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Speaker 1: Toxoplasma gandhia, which is a little um micro organism. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's a parasite that is in cat feces and it

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Speaker 1: makes rats like when rats get infected with it, it it

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Speaker 1: makes them lose their fear of cats. And it's suspected

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Speaker 1: although that there's nothing scientific about this, suspicion that oh,

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Speaker 1: humans who are infected, maybe they become attracted to cats,

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Speaker 1: but I don't. I haven't never seen any evidence of it.

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Speaker 1: It's it's stuff like the specifically toxic plasmosis um. It's

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Speaker 1: they think that it makes like it makes people lazier

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Speaker 1: and a little bit sloppier, and it kind of like

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Speaker 1: they're a specific It doesn't necessarily make them like like

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Speaker 1: cats more or less, but it does do like kind

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Speaker 1: of weird psychological things, like I think it makes people

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Speaker 1: a little bit more depressed, so it can trigger mental illness,

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Speaker 1: like that is that is a I think that is

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Speaker 1: an actual finding where it can trigger people who are

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Speaker 1: already predisposed to schizophrenia and can trigger that. It's also

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Speaker 1: funny because like a lot of the things of like, oh,

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Speaker 1: maybe it makes people more sloppy, more lazy, but that's

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Speaker 1: also isn't that just part of cat ownership, like you

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Speaker 1: and your cat becoming one I've also described like every

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Speaker 1: comedy person, and like it makes them like sloppy and

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Speaker 1: a little bit lazy, and like they're not very they

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Speaker 1: don't clean their apartment very And I wonder, like with

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Speaker 1: the pope kind of like decree, I wonder how much

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Speaker 1: of that is. I mean, you assume people in the

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Speaker 1: Middle Ages probably felt the same affection toward cats that

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Speaker 1: like we do nowadays, right, They probably like kissed them

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Speaker 1: on their little heads and talked about their cute peats

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Speaker 1: and stuff like that. So I wonder how much of

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Speaker 1: that is the Church seeing that people are quote unquote

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Speaker 1: putting this thing above Jesus or whatever and um kind

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Speaker 1: of using that of like, oh, we gotta like get

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Speaker 1: people stop caring about this thing that they love. That's

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Speaker 1: not the church. That's certainly the truth when it comes

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Speaker 1: to um, we'll discuss a little later to like with

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Speaker 1: corvids like crows and ravens, anything that had a positive

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Speaker 1: association in paganism, Um, they're like, no, actually that thing

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Speaker 1: is bad to kind of try to tear people away

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Speaker 1: from their old pagan right. And I don't know if

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Speaker 1: cats really have that much of an association with paganism,

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Speaker 1: but it it could just be another like you said,

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Speaker 1: another scape cat, Like, oh you care about this cat, well,

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Speaker 1: actually the cat is evil or whatever. Yeah, that's what

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Speaker 1: if you cared that much about Jesus or Jesus being

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Speaker 1: jealous of a cat, that makes sense. Look if Jesus

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Speaker 1: had cute little pizza talk about Jesus way more. What's

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Speaker 1: that word you're saying, pizza p e t s. Look,

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Speaker 1: if you're really if you're really involved in the cat

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Speaker 1: side of the internet, you know what pizza does. The

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Speaker 1: little tobeans is uh, there's highly scientific terms. So some

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Speaker 1: historians believe that after this decree, it led to a

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Speaker 1: mass slaughter of cats, and some argue that this could

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Speaker 1: have made the Black plague more severe as there weren't

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Speaker 1: as many cats to kill the rat carriers of the plague.

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Speaker 1: I haven't really found any definitive evidence of either um

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Speaker 1: mass slaughter or that this led to a worse plague.

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Speaker 1: Just like I think it's just conjecture that this could

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Speaker 1: have happened. It's an alluring theory because it's such poetic

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Speaker 1: justice of like we kill the cats. Oh no, now

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Speaker 1: we get the plugue because the cats aren't there to

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Speaker 1: protect us. Yeah, what is the It's like I forget

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Speaker 1: exactly what it is, but it's like like it throws

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Speaker 1: off kind of like the order of things, and you

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Speaker 1: like remove one species from it. And then it's like,

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Speaker 1: I forget the exact scientific term for it, the logical

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Speaker 1: catastroph Yeah, exactly makes sense that it's like, oh, you

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Speaker 1: remove the cats the rats, like you know, kind of

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Speaker 1: exploding population size, and with the rats kind of fleas

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Speaker 1: exploding population size, and then the fleas have the plugue

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Speaker 1: or whatever, right, right, I mean, and it could have happened.

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Speaker 1: I'm just I just don't think there's it's hard to relate, right.

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Speaker 1: There may be some anecdotal evidence, but there hasn't been

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Speaker 1: any like solid proof of that happening. But still what

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Speaker 1: we know it happened is that people would torture cats

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Speaker 1: as a way to fend off the devil. Maybe I

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Speaker 1: shouldn't have had you on this. Yeah, I'm gonna say,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna say, oh no, whenever it gets a lot better,

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Speaker 1: don't worry. All over Europe, burning cats was a common

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Speaker 1: pastime because I was seen as fending off the devil.

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Speaker 1: And Epral Belgium, the festival Caton's thought involved setting cats

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Speaker 1: on fire and throwing them from the belfry of churches.

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Speaker 1: So cat Insto is still celebrated, but thankfully it's now

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Speaker 1: more of a celebration of cats than hurting them. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: so Jester tosses stuffed toy cats out to children who

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Speaker 1: wait below and catch them. A giant cat puppet is

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Speaker 1: paraded through the town square and it features people dressed

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Speaker 1: as cats, as mice and witches, and there's like a

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Speaker 1: catneym parade. They even have Hello Kitty and Garfield now

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Speaker 1: and I'm going to show you I'm excited about Are

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Speaker 1: they part of the parade or just to live in

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Speaker 1: the town Now? They are part of the parade. Let me, Um,

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Speaker 1: when is like, what time of year is this? It's

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Speaker 1: I think it's every second Sunday of May or something

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Speaker 1: I was. I visited a couple of years ago, and

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Speaker 1: it's like I did not know this existed, and now

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Speaker 1: I have to go back to celebrate cats with them.

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Speaker 1: It's a lovely city. If you haven't ven, you should go.

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Speaker 1: People dressed as cats, little kids dressed as a little

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Speaker 1: dancing mice. These are my people. Um here's a float

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Speaker 1: like with Egyptian cats on it. Oh, finally cats are

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Speaker 1: getting the respect they deserve. Um oh yeah, giant cat.

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Speaker 1: I'm not really sure what exactly is going on here,

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Speaker 1: but there's like a big demonic cat float with a

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Speaker 1: bunch of birds playing drums. All I know is my

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Speaker 1: toxoplasmos firing out. And then let's see a bunch of

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Speaker 1: which is more dancing, Let's see more wacky physical wacky

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Speaker 1: physical comedy. There's um a band and then hello kids,

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Speaker 1: and then the moment we're waiting for giant Garfield floats.

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Speaker 1: This is my kind of city. Uh. And then there's

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Speaker 1: this giant effigy of a cat. More cats uh. And

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Speaker 1: then just like these giant cat effigies that are paraded around.

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Speaker 1: There's a cat wearing a suit, cat wearing a dress

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Speaker 1: in a suit that are getting paraded around. Finally they're

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Speaker 1: getting the respect they deserve exactly. Uh. And then they

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Speaker 1: throw cats, the toy cats off the church now and

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Speaker 1: kids catch them and to keep them. So I guarantee

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Speaker 1: that if I went to that, I would be pushing

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Speaker 1: kids aside to those toy cats like mine. I'm a

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Speaker 1: crown man. I need this cat. I need this cat

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Speaker 1: more than your kid. So that's a positive change. And

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Speaker 1: I like that. I like that it's switched to being

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Speaker 1: you know, like a horrifying sacrifice of cats to like

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Speaker 1: just like we. It feels like the town of ep

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Speaker 1: is trying to make That warms my heart. Yes, going

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Speaker 1: back back in time a little bit now. In Celtic mythology,

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Speaker 1: the cat she I think it's called the catch. It

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Speaker 1: looks it's spelled like cat sith, which is really funny

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Speaker 1: to be like like a cat sith lord. But I

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Speaker 1: do believe it is pronounced catch um like banshee. I

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Speaker 1: just want to say, like Star Wars has been like

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Speaker 1: dipping in popularity a little bit lately, and if they

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Speaker 1: want to make Star Wars more popular. Yeah, make star Wars. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: cat star Wars a cat sit I mean I would

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Speaker 1: star Walker, Muke Skywalker, uh pon sess lame Yo Vader, Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: my Vader. All of this work. I think all of

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Speaker 1: my all of my Star Wars points are going to

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Speaker 1: just be mea with her name like Hanslo Jewi baka

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Speaker 1: because it's like chew cats chew stuff. I'm bad at ones.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, I mean I feel like cats sit lord.

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Speaker 1: Is it Princess lay around? Yeah, Princess lay around. It's goods.

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Speaker 1: So the cat She is a fairy creature resembling a

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Speaker 1: large black cat with a white spot on its chest. Adorable.

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Speaker 1: It's believed to be able to steal people's souls before burial. Adorable.

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Speaker 1: To prevent this, people watched over the body in late

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Speaker 1: wake before the body was interred. Apparently there were tricks

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Speaker 1: to prevent the cat She from stealing the soul of

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Speaker 1: the deceased. There was music, leaping around and wrestling to

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Speaker 1: entertain the cat. Riddles that were left on unanswered, so

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Speaker 1: the cat she would try to figure them out. Cats

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Speaker 1: classically bad at riddles. They even place cat up around

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Speaker 1: the house to distract the catchy, which is the cutest

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Speaker 1: like funeral rite I've ever heard. Just please don't steal

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Speaker 1: my dead grandma's soul. Here's some here's some catinet. Here's

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Speaker 1: some here's some catinet. We made you a mouse that

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Speaker 1: like this god smiley face on it is filled with

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Speaker 1: nep Behold a small figure of a mouse filled with

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Speaker 1: an interesting herb for you cat demon. Yeah, just like

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Speaker 1: like somebody some these jobs after your grandmother passes away.

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Speaker 1: It's just to have a laser pointer like they like,

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Speaker 1: kind of wing around. This will appease the cat demon.

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Speaker 1: This is this is an adorable demon on Swen or

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Speaker 1: all hallows eve. I think I pronounced this wrong on

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Speaker 1: the last episode. I think I called it sam Haine.

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Speaker 1: That's how it's spelled. But I think it's called Solwen

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Speaker 1: because the Celtic pronunciations of things are all all all weird.

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Speaker 1: The holiday, this is the holiday that Halloween is based on.

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Speaker 1: So saucers of milk were left out for the cat

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Speaker 1: she so that they would bless the house. But if

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Speaker 1: you didn't treat the catch they'd trick you by cursing

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Speaker 1: your cows. So their milk runs dry. So cats were

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Speaker 1: the original trick or treaters in a way. Before we

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Speaker 1: get into sort of the facts behind cats, there's just

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Speaker 1: this wonderful quote from grad show Marks that's a black

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Speaker 1: cat crossing your path signifies that the animal is going somewhere,

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Speaker 1: which I kind of love, especially in the framework of

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Speaker 1: evolutionary biology, because sometimes it's the most obvious thing is

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Speaker 1: actually the truth when it comes to animal facts. Here's

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Speaker 1: a modern day myth about black cats, which is that

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Speaker 1: they're killed more on Halloween, or that shelters won't adopt

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Speaker 1: them out because they're they're afraid they'll be used in

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Speaker 1: Satanic rituals. This seems to just be kind of a

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Speaker 1: rumor or an old old wives tales. I can't find

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Speaker 1: any evidence of this being true, and in fact, the

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Speaker 1: a s p c A says like, that's not true.

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Speaker 1: You can adopt black cats year around. They're not worried

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Speaker 1: about Satanists. I mean, if anything, it's like the Satanists

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Speaker 1: are just going to kiss the cats butt. So what's

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Speaker 1: what's the problem. Yeah, I mean I wonder if there's

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Speaker 1: a way too, because I I uh personal promo. I

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Speaker 1: run a Facebook group for Los Angeles comedians to share

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Speaker 1: pictures of their cats called the La Underground Cat Network.

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Speaker 1: That's ten thousand members, and uh, like that's something that like,

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Speaker 1: I mean around Halloween, a lot of people in group

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Speaker 1: are always very concerned about people that are like trying

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Speaker 1: to get cats adopted around Halloween. So if that, you know,

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Speaker 1: it is for exactly what you're talking about, like worries

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Speaker 1: of sacrifice and stuff like that. So like, if that

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Speaker 1: isn't the case, uh, somebody should publicize that more. This

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Speaker 1: is the thing that like cat lovers are worried about,

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Speaker 1: you know. Yeah, And I mean I think that there's

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Speaker 1: another thing I looked into to try to figure out

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Speaker 1: if it's true, and unfortunately, I don't think there's a

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Speaker 1: study that is conclusive yet. But the idea that black

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Speaker 1: cats aren't adopted out as much. Um. And I've seen

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Speaker 1: some shelters say like, no, that's not the case, and

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Speaker 1: then other shelters saying like yeah, annecnotally we've noticed that,

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Speaker 1: um and some claiming it just like well, black cats

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Speaker 1: are so common, you see them more in shelters, so uh,

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Speaker 1: it's not that they're adopted out at a lower rate.

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Speaker 1: There's just like more of them. So you see them

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Speaker 1: languishing in shelters more. But I can't really find anything definitive.

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Speaker 1: So I know, I read that someone was planning on

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Speaker 1: doing a study, so I'll be really interested to see

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Speaker 1: the results of that because I think, especially today, I

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Speaker 1: just don't think that superstition around black cats are as

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Speaker 1: powerful as they used to be. I mean, I think

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Speaker 1: it's still something that like, it's something that I think

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Speaker 1: is still still exists in the popular culture as a

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Speaker 1: thing that people are aware of because it's been a

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Speaker 1: thing for so long. It's like self fulfilling a little

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Speaker 1: bit in a way. But you know, yeah, I don't

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Speaker 1: necessarily think that people are worried at so much about

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Speaker 1: like bad luck and things like that. Yeah, So now

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Speaker 1: let's do just some facts about black cats because they're

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Speaker 1: actually quite interesting. So the reason they're black is there's

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Speaker 1: a recessive gene that turns off the tabby coloration, so

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Speaker 1: there are solid black cats. They're also black smoke cats

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Speaker 1: whose coats go from white to black or gray to black.

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Speaker 1: They can rust in the sun, so they're black. Fur

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Speaker 1: sometimes turns a lighter rust brown shade and the same Yeah,

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Speaker 1: because it's there's the u melanin pigment present in their fur,

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Speaker 1: which is actually kind of fragile, and so the sunlight

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Speaker 1: will actually break down that pigment and UH thus that

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Speaker 1: kind of reddish brown color that happens and there are

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Speaker 1: actual potential benefits to their black coat. UH searchers looked

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Speaker 1: at melanism in cats and identified a gene called a

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Speaker 1: goody which controls black fur in cats, and the researchers

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Speaker 1: believe that one purpose of the black coat could be

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Speaker 1: like just camouflage, like if it's dark, you can't see

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Speaker 1: a black cat as well. But there's another theory that

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Speaker 1: is not proven, although there's been a connection made, which

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Speaker 1: is that there's a possibility that melanism and that black

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Speaker 1: coat UH can offer resistance to viruses UM. The melanism

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Speaker 1: gene in South American jaguars and jagger undis, which is

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Speaker 1: a smaller wildcat UH, is also linked to the genes

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Speaker 1: that control resistance to HIV and infection, which is something

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00:21:41,760 --> 00:21:45,600
Speaker 1: that cats can get feline chick. This is kind of speculative.

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Speaker 1: They haven't really UH tested to see like if there's

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Speaker 1: if cats with black coats are actually more resistant to

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Speaker 1: HIV infection, But it's a really interesting kind of promising

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Speaker 1: avenue of research that I'm excited to see develop that

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Speaker 1: could I guess that that could point to, like why

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00:22:01,880 --> 00:22:04,119
Speaker 1: there are just more black cats. Where we're noticing more

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Speaker 1: black cats is maybe like because I mean, like feline HIV.

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Speaker 1: That is definitely something that comes up a lot and

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Speaker 1: cats are tested for. So like if black cats are

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Speaker 1: in some way resistant to that, that could be why

401
00:22:14,520 --> 00:22:15,680
Speaker 1: one of the reasons there was a little more like

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Speaker 1: um small dovetail. Fun fact, do you know how jaguars hunt?

403
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Speaker 1: I know, they drag stuff up trees. Yeah, they're They're intense.

404
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Speaker 1: They like basically what they do. They they hunt alligators

405
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Speaker 1: and crocodiles. And the way they do it is their

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Speaker 1: jaws are so strong that they can they don't just

407
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Speaker 1: strangle them. They can but with one bite pierce through

408
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Speaker 1: their skull, so like it's just like a straight like kill.

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Speaker 1: So jaguars are great. They have one of the strongest

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Speaker 1: psi JA strength cats. Yeah, yeah, they're great. They're just

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Speaker 1: extremely like if you I think also because they're not

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Speaker 1: super fluffy, their hair is quite short, you can see

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Speaker 1: how incredibly well muscled they are, so like when they're

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Speaker 1: carrying they'll be able to carry prey up to the

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Speaker 1: branches of a tree, which keeps their prey safe from

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Speaker 1: other predators or scavengers. And it's just it takes they

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Speaker 1: have a whole antelope that they're just shoving up a tree.

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Speaker 1: Incredible when you watch that and you're like, if another

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Speaker 1: antelope sees that, they're gonna be like, oh, I'm not

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Speaker 1: uh yeah, I mean just like really, there are so

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Speaker 1: many interesting cat species that have different like abilities and

422
00:23:23,960 --> 00:23:26,800
Speaker 1: things like that. Do you know what like a caracle is. Yeah, yeah,

423
00:23:26,840 --> 00:23:28,800
Speaker 1: they're they're kind of the cute ones with the really

424
00:23:28,880 --> 00:23:31,480
Speaker 1: tall ears of the little poofs. Yeah, they've got like

425
00:23:31,520 --> 00:23:34,040
Speaker 1: super cute ears. But the way they can jump so

426
00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:36,320
Speaker 1: high that one of the ways that they hunt is

427
00:23:36,359 --> 00:23:39,800
Speaker 1: that they literally will jump and intercept birds midflight out

428
00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:41,920
Speaker 1: of there. There's footage of it on the internet. It

429
00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:47,440
Speaker 1: is insane. That's incredible. Yeah, because they are quite leggy. Yeah. Yeah,

430
00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:49,760
Speaker 1: my my cat would do that, although she had a

431
00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:51,600
Speaker 1: little bit of a cheek because she would sit next

432
00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:54,080
Speaker 1: to the bird fountain and just wait for birds to

433
00:23:54,119 --> 00:23:56,800
Speaker 1: land there and then she would just spring up. Oh

434
00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:02,480
Speaker 1: that asnorable, destructive to the environment, but adorable. Your cat

435
00:24:02,600 --> 00:24:05,159
Speaker 1: is your cat? Chunky is your cat? Like, yeah, so

436
00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:07,719
Speaker 1: this was my childhood cat. So she's she's in that

437
00:24:07,760 --> 00:24:10,320
Speaker 1: big ball yard in the sky now. But she she

438
00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:12,439
Speaker 1: was a chunker. It was pretty cute because she was

439
00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:15,560
Speaker 1: like very she was quite um. She wasn't overweight. It

440
00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:18,199
Speaker 1: was more like she was just very fluffy and she

441
00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:21,760
Speaker 1: had that especially older like female cats will sometimes developed

442
00:24:21,800 --> 00:24:26,439
Speaker 1: that just sort of wattle like basically just flub and

443
00:24:26,480 --> 00:24:29,240
Speaker 1: so she she was like that. She was really cantankerous

444
00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:32,720
Speaker 1: and grouchy. But okay, so um, when she passed away,

445
00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:36,960
Speaker 1: did you, uh, did you use a laser pointer to distract?

446
00:24:38,119 --> 00:24:40,160
Speaker 1: It would be like a cat demon and a regular cat,

447
00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:41,919
Speaker 1: they'd be fine with each other. No. But you know,

448
00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:44,200
Speaker 1: when my other cat passed away, who was my other

449
00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:48,800
Speaker 1: childhood cat, Binky, my mom buried him in our backyard

450
00:24:48,920 --> 00:24:52,360
Speaker 1: and the next day a bobcat, a young bobcat, was

451
00:24:52,560 --> 00:24:56,000
Speaker 1: sitting next to the grave site, which my mom was like,

452
00:24:56,040 --> 00:24:59,960
Speaker 1: he's reincarnated into a bobcat and like that bobcat want

453
00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:03,440
Speaker 1: to eat as corpse. But you know it's still cute. Yeah,

454
00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:04,880
Speaker 1: that is one of those things where it's like, yeah,

455
00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:07,160
Speaker 1: you think about like the superstitious thing of it. It's like, oh,

456
00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:10,240
Speaker 1: it's like that bobcat saying goodbye, and it's like, no, scientifically,

457
00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:12,600
Speaker 1: that bobcats like waiting for you to turn around. So

458
00:25:14,200 --> 00:25:17,200
Speaker 1: I like the idea that that maybe maybe my cat

459
00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:20,320
Speaker 1: and the bobcat were friends and the bobcats like respecting

460
00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:24,400
Speaker 1: the cat, but but probably not. Yeah, Like, well, let's

461
00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:30,680
Speaker 1: just say real recognized to feel in that situation. As

462
00:25:30,720 --> 00:25:34,359
Speaker 1: someone with o c D, I'm intimately familiar with superstition,

463
00:25:34,640 --> 00:25:37,520
Speaker 1: and I find it interesting how the mindset of superstition

464
00:25:37,560 --> 00:25:40,800
Speaker 1: can be harmful or helpful. Some days, I'm really good

465
00:25:40,800 --> 00:25:45,040
Speaker 1: at problem solving as I make connections between seemingly unrelated ideas.

466
00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:48,040
Speaker 1: Other days I'm worried that if I chew unequal amounts

467
00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:50,000
Speaker 1: of food in the sides of my cheeks, everyone I

468
00:25:50,040 --> 00:25:53,199
Speaker 1: love will die. I wonder, though, if the problem solving

469
00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:56,720
Speaker 1: skills are more valuable than the random superstitions are harmful

470
00:25:57,240 --> 00:26:00,320
Speaker 1: while O c D maybe an extreme example, research shows

471
00:26:00,359 --> 00:26:04,639
Speaker 1: that superstition maybe an evolutionary benefit. Harvard and University of

472
00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:09,159
Speaker 1: Helsinki researchers Dr Kevin Foster and Dr Hannah Coco created

473
00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:12,320
Speaker 1: a mathematical model to see whether superstition could help with

474
00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:16,520
Speaker 1: evolutionary survival. They found that despite the high error rates

475
00:26:16,560 --> 00:26:20,480
Speaker 1: with superstitious behavior, this strategy can still lead to higher

476
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:25,000
Speaker 1: rates of survival, thus being favored by natural selection. So

477
00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:29,920
Speaker 1: is wearing your lucky underwear a deeply ingrained evolutionary skill. Maybe,

478
00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:32,520
Speaker 1: but I don't think it makes you special. When we return,

479
00:26:32,560 --> 00:26:45,400
Speaker 1: we'll discover that humans aren't the only superstitious ones. Birds

480
00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:49,639
Speaker 1: were more alike than we realize. In ninety B. F.

481
00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:53,760
Speaker 1: Skinner conducted a famous set of experiments involving a box

482
00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:57,679
Speaker 1: and food and birds. He placed hungry pigeons in a

483
00:26:57,760 --> 00:27:01,520
Speaker 1: box a cage really, and offered them brief access to

484
00:27:01,640 --> 00:27:06,040
Speaker 1: feeding trades at regular intervals. The pigeons began to engage

485
00:27:06,080 --> 00:27:10,240
Speaker 1: in interesting behaviors. They would start to spin around, thrust

486
00:27:10,280 --> 00:27:13,600
Speaker 1: their heads up, or rock from side to side, seeming

487
00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:17,040
Speaker 1: to connect these behaviors to the arrival of food. Once

488
00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:20,920
Speaker 1: they had formed a specific superstitious habit, it continued even

489
00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:24,679
Speaker 1: once Skinner started to increase the time between feedings. The

490
00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:28,600
Speaker 1: pigeons probably desperate for some control over their lives. We're

491
00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:32,760
Speaker 1: trying anything to see what would stick. Even turning counterclockwise

492
00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:36,880
Speaker 1: without fail, waiting for their food. Now, I don't think

493
00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:39,600
Speaker 1: these pigeons are dumb, and I don't think humans who

494
00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:43,200
Speaker 1: engage in superstition are stupid either. I think in a way,

495
00:27:43,320 --> 00:27:46,280
Speaker 1: superstition is a way to try and feel some semblance

496
00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:50,400
Speaker 1: of control over our dumpster fire lives. If we feel helpless,

497
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:53,800
Speaker 1: like a pigeon stuck in Skinner's evil little device, We're

498
00:27:53,840 --> 00:27:56,560
Speaker 1: going to try anything to feel that we're doing something

499
00:27:56,600 --> 00:27:59,720
Speaker 1: to help our situation, even if that means blaming all

500
00:27:59,720 --> 00:28:03,960
Speaker 1: our problems on well birds. So, now moving on from cats,

501
00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:10,480
Speaker 1: I want to talk about crows and ravens. Boo, I'm leaving. Um,

502
00:28:10,520 --> 00:28:15,000
Speaker 1: that's that's very interesting and I am. I definitely feel

503
00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:17,400
Speaker 1: that in my own life, and that like before you have,

504
00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:20,000
Speaker 1: like you know, a big job interview or a big meeting,

505
00:28:20,119 --> 00:28:22,159
Speaker 1: or like you know, anything that has any level of pressure.

506
00:28:22,560 --> 00:28:25,000
Speaker 1: I feel like a lot of us have just things

507
00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:28,240
Speaker 1: that we do that make us feel like, oh, because

508
00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:30,919
Speaker 1: I did this, I feel less nervous about this thing

509
00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:33,760
Speaker 1: that I'm about to do. Like I used to wear, Um,

510
00:28:33,800 --> 00:28:37,600
Speaker 1: this is uh pre finding out that he's a monster,

511
00:28:37,760 --> 00:28:40,280
Speaker 1: But I used to wear like a like a whole

512
00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:44,680
Speaker 1: cogan wrist a band to uh job interviews and stuff

513
00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:47,560
Speaker 1: like that when I was in college. And you know,

514
00:28:47,600 --> 00:28:49,880
Speaker 1: it's something that whenever I would not do that, I

515
00:28:49,880 --> 00:28:52,479
Speaker 1: would definitely feel more nervous about it. Never would do that,

516
00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:54,200
Speaker 1: I would feel a little bit more like, Yeah, a

517
00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:57,400
Speaker 1: whole comania has got my I used to have this

518
00:28:57,480 --> 00:29:01,000
Speaker 1: little Celtic not ring that I got at this fair,

519
00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:02,840
Speaker 1: and like, when I wore it, I had a really

520
00:29:02,840 --> 00:29:05,600
Speaker 1: good time at the fair, and so I started wearing

521
00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:07,680
Speaker 1: it again. And I was a kid, And of course

522
00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:09,680
Speaker 1: I think with my O C D. It makes those

523
00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:13,040
Speaker 1: superstitions even stronger. I see so clearly the cause and

524
00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:17,040
Speaker 1: effect of the superstitions, Like, Okay, one time I wore

525
00:29:17,080 --> 00:29:18,600
Speaker 1: this ring and I had a good time. So then

526
00:29:18,600 --> 00:29:20,720
Speaker 1: I started wearing it in order to have a good

527
00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:23,320
Speaker 1: time again, and then that transformed into if I don't

528
00:29:23,320 --> 00:29:26,520
Speaker 1: wear it, I'll have a bad time. And it's it's

529
00:29:26,560 --> 00:29:29,200
Speaker 1: just like those those pigeons where that it's really funny

530
00:29:29,240 --> 00:29:32,040
Speaker 1: because they would just try to do a behavior like

531
00:29:32,440 --> 00:29:34,760
Speaker 1: rocking back and forth, and if the food came after

532
00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:37,280
Speaker 1: that just by chance or like oh, rocking back and

533
00:29:37,320 --> 00:29:41,080
Speaker 1: forth equals food. I think it's just so interesting that

534
00:29:41,160 --> 00:29:45,560
Speaker 1: we seem to have this desire to make these connections,

535
00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:48,360
Speaker 1: almost like it's a little scary to feel like we

536
00:29:48,440 --> 00:29:51,360
Speaker 1: don't have control over environment. And then if we can

537
00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:54,160
Speaker 1: make these connections, maybe we can get a little more controlled,

538
00:29:54,920 --> 00:30:00,320
Speaker 1: especially with death, because like death is the ultimate uncontrollable force.

539
00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:03,960
Speaker 1: So if we can make superstitions surrounding death, like bad

540
00:30:04,040 --> 00:30:06,280
Speaker 1: omens and things, we feel like, Okay, maybe I know

541
00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:08,760
Speaker 1: when it's coming, maybe I can feel some reassurance that

542
00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:12,520
Speaker 1: I have some control over my own mortality. And that

543
00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:15,760
Speaker 1: kind of brings us to two crows and ravens because

544
00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:19,120
Speaker 1: they're they're the sort of ultimate like bad omen of death.

545
00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:21,680
Speaker 1: I wonder how much of that is not to not

546
00:30:21,720 --> 00:30:24,400
Speaker 1: to make it about cats again, but I'm gonna I

547
00:30:24,440 --> 00:30:27,840
Speaker 1: wonder how much of that is um, you know, like

548
00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:29,680
Speaker 1: if we talk about like the things like you know,

549
00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:31,880
Speaker 1: burning cats or sacrificing cats when like a loved one

550
00:30:31,920 --> 00:30:35,240
Speaker 1: dies or whatever, like, how much of that is, Oh,

551
00:30:35,320 --> 00:30:38,400
Speaker 1: your loved one died, you feel like you like, you

552
00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:40,760
Speaker 1: feel like guilt that you didn't talk to them enough

553
00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:42,680
Speaker 1: for that you weren't nice enough to them, or maybe

554
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:45,880
Speaker 1: like they sucked and you feel like conflicted about, like

555
00:30:46,120 --> 00:30:49,120
Speaker 1: mourning somebody who was who was lame or bad or whatever,

556
00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:52,200
Speaker 1: and you feel like by doing some kind of sacrifice

557
00:30:52,280 --> 00:30:54,840
Speaker 1: or some kind of ritual or whatever, you know, like

558
00:30:55,080 --> 00:30:57,840
Speaker 1: putting cat nip around your house discriminate that god that

559
00:30:57,920 --> 00:30:59,960
Speaker 1: you feel like you're kind of making right on your

560
00:31:00,160 --> 00:31:02,600
Speaker 1: like past things that you did or didn't do with

561
00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:08,040
Speaker 1: that person, right, like having some control over your relationship

562
00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:11,280
Speaker 1: with them, even once you no longer have that control

563
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:15,200
Speaker 1: because they're gone. I mean, I definitely like I will

564
00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:18,320
Speaker 1: talk to dead people in my life. It's like I

565
00:31:18,400 --> 00:31:20,440
Speaker 1: don't often talk to the dead people in my life

566
00:31:20,440 --> 00:31:23,560
Speaker 1: who I had a great relationship with usually just think

567
00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:25,920
Speaker 1: of them fondly when I had a bad relationship with

568
00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:29,080
Speaker 1: them all like lament out loud. Almost. This desire to

569
00:31:29,080 --> 00:31:32,360
Speaker 1: communicate with them is stronger when you had a fractured relationship,

570
00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:34,840
Speaker 1: which I think is interesting. Well, it's also like with

571
00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:39,160
Speaker 1: a fractured relationship, you there are more blanks that you

572
00:31:39,200 --> 00:31:41,160
Speaker 1: can kind of fill in with whatever you wanted to write,

573
00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:44,960
Speaker 1: like cat nipping cat gods. Yeah, yeah, cat gods all

574
00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:47,840
Speaker 1: great things. Um, yes, I mean that that makes a

575
00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:50,040
Speaker 1: lot of sense, Like a lot of it is like

576
00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:52,160
Speaker 1: you said, it's like season control over something you don't

577
00:31:52,160 --> 00:31:55,160
Speaker 1: really feel like you have control over. UM. Yeah, that's

578
00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:58,280
Speaker 1: super interesting. I saw this, UM, this story. I don't

579
00:31:58,280 --> 00:32:01,080
Speaker 1: know the veracity of it really, but it was on Facebook,

580
00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:03,720
Speaker 1: so it has to be true. UM. And it was

581
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:07,160
Speaker 1: this video of this woman where this cardinal lands on

582
00:32:07,200 --> 00:32:10,120
Speaker 1: her and she's like crying with tears of joy, and

583
00:32:10,240 --> 00:32:13,600
Speaker 1: like the backstory is that her I think either her

584
00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:16,360
Speaker 1: sister or her mother had passed away. And she said,

585
00:32:16,400 --> 00:32:19,120
Speaker 1: like if when I pass away, I'll give you a sign,

586
00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:21,320
Speaker 1: you know, after I'm gone, that I'm still there with you.

587
00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:24,080
Speaker 1: And so she took the bird landing on her as

588
00:32:24,160 --> 00:32:27,240
Speaker 1: the sign. And I think that's another That's another thing

589
00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:30,160
Speaker 1: that like that magical thinking gives us a connection to

590
00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:33,080
Speaker 1: things that maybe we otherwise are kind of out of

591
00:32:33,120 --> 00:32:37,280
Speaker 1: our out of our grasp. UM. Just a personal story.

592
00:32:37,600 --> 00:32:40,600
Speaker 1: I when I was in college, I took an entomology

593
00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:43,880
Speaker 1: class and UM, part of the entomology classes that we

594
00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:46,960
Speaker 1: had to raise caterpillars. So they gave us a caterpillar.

595
00:32:47,040 --> 00:32:48,760
Speaker 1: They give us a cup with caterpillies food in it,

596
00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:51,720
Speaker 1: with the thought process being that like you'll raise it

597
00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:55,120
Speaker 1: into you know moth or whatever. And um, it was

598
00:32:55,400 --> 00:32:59,440
Speaker 1: particularly cold, um in that winter, and I was really

599
00:32:59,440 --> 00:33:01,560
Speaker 1: excited about raising this caterpillar. And I raised it to

600
00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:04,240
Speaker 1: the point rosenick cocoon and then just like it was

601
00:33:04,400 --> 00:33:08,080
Speaker 1: very clear. Um after like a couple of days that

602
00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:13,120
Speaker 1: like I know probably wasn't gonna yeah, and um, I

603
00:33:13,800 --> 00:33:17,960
Speaker 1: before that gave it a name, bug Zilla, and I

604
00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 1: cut out a picture of Mathra and taped it to

605
00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:23,320
Speaker 1: the inside of like it's like home that I built

606
00:33:23,400 --> 00:33:25,080
Speaker 1: for it, just so it could have like a hero.

607
00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:29,160
Speaker 1: And UM. I went to Washington State University and at

608
00:33:29,200 --> 00:33:30,880
Speaker 1: the time, I'm not sure if it's still around anymore,

609
00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:34,040
Speaker 1: but there was a bar called Valhalla. And um, after

610
00:33:34,120 --> 00:33:37,160
Speaker 1: the um like caterpillar, you know, presumably passed away to

611
00:33:37,560 --> 00:33:39,880
Speaker 1: didn't become a mouth or whatever. Um, I got a

612
00:33:39,920 --> 00:33:42,280
Speaker 1: bunch of my friends together. We put on suits and

613
00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:46,000
Speaker 1: then we like took the dead caterpillar to Valhalla. And

614
00:33:46,040 --> 00:33:48,400
Speaker 1: then I like, uh, we all went to like one

615
00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:50,360
Speaker 1: of the toilet stalls and like put it in the

616
00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:52,360
Speaker 1: toilet and flushed the toilet with like her hands in

617
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:55,360
Speaker 1: her cheeks. So it's like I don't know, I was like, oh,

618
00:33:55,400 --> 00:33:58,200
Speaker 1: we just put it to Valhalla like a true and

619
00:33:58,240 --> 00:34:02,320
Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, ultimately that's madness if you track it right.

620
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:05,640
Speaker 1: But but it made us feel better. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, like,

621
00:34:05,760 --> 00:34:08,239
Speaker 1: I know, my when one of my fish died when

622
00:34:08,239 --> 00:34:09,800
Speaker 1: I was a kid, I was about to flush it.

623
00:34:09,920 --> 00:34:11,879
Speaker 1: My brother was like, you can't do that, We've got

624
00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:16,080
Speaker 1: to bury it. So we had a little funeral for

625
00:34:16,120 --> 00:34:20,319
Speaker 1: the fish. Yeah, and it's like afterwards you felt like, oh,

626
00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:23,640
Speaker 1: you know, ultimately, like so much of what happens in

627
00:34:23,719 --> 00:34:26,880
Speaker 1: life is just like random chaos crash together. Those little

628
00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:29,279
Speaker 1: things that you do make it feel more under your

629
00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:32,400
Speaker 1: control and more like makes more sense, Like random death

630
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:35,520
Speaker 1: makes more sense when you kind of ritualize it. Yeah, yeah,

631
00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:42,920
Speaker 1: totally speaking of random death the Greek and uh In

632
00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:47,520
Speaker 1: Greek mythology, which is often they seem to just try

633
00:34:47,560 --> 00:34:50,480
Speaker 1: to really make sense of the capriciousness of the universe,

634
00:34:51,040 --> 00:34:54,560
Speaker 1: ravens were seen as bad omens um and also God's

635
00:34:54,600 --> 00:34:58,360
Speaker 1: messengers to Earth. So the story goes that Apollo, the

636
00:34:58,560 --> 00:35:01,960
Speaker 1: sun god, had sent a white raven to spy on

637
00:35:02,040 --> 00:35:05,480
Speaker 1: his lover Coronas, but when the raven returned, it brought

638
00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:09,799
Speaker 1: news of Coronas's infidelity and Apollo was so angry he

639
00:35:09,880 --> 00:35:12,760
Speaker 1: set the raven on fire, which and then that turned

640
00:35:12,760 --> 00:35:15,120
Speaker 1: it black. But that seems really rude, like the ravens

641
00:35:15,160 --> 00:35:21,920
Speaker 1: just doing its job. Yeah, first off, drama? Uh? Second off, yeah,

642
00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:24,160
Speaker 1: what the f like? What did you did? You want

643
00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:28,000
Speaker 1: it to lie to you? Um? Yeah? Whoever did that?

644
00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:32,520
Speaker 1: Burning the messenger? Literally? Um. In the Jewish religious texts

645
00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:35,839
Speaker 1: the Talmud, the raven was considered to be one of

646
00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:39,120
Speaker 1: the only animals to have sex on the arc, so

647
00:35:39,200 --> 00:35:45,440
Speaker 1: God punished them only the pipe. In the Ark and

648
00:35:45,600 --> 00:35:50,560
Speaker 1: Celtic and Serbian literature, ravens are associated with warfare and battle.

649
00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:52,960
Speaker 1: And one of the reasons I think that crows and

650
00:35:53,040 --> 00:35:56,680
Speaker 1: ravens and other corvids are associated with death in battle

651
00:35:56,840 --> 00:35:59,920
Speaker 1: is that they often feed on carrion. This might be

652
00:36:00,040 --> 00:36:02,200
Speaker 1: you why so much folklore is about them being an

653
00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:04,719
Speaker 1: omen of death because they literally will show up when

654
00:36:04,760 --> 00:36:07,680
Speaker 1: something dies because they want to eat its eyeballs because

655
00:36:07,680 --> 00:36:11,120
Speaker 1: by balls are good. Yeah, they're it's like the original gusher,

656
00:36:11,160 --> 00:36:14,960
Speaker 1: you know, right exactly in terms of being bad omens. Corvids,

657
00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:18,600
Speaker 1: which includes ravens and crows, it's that family of birds. Um.

658
00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:23,040
Speaker 1: It's mostly in Western European culture, potentially or perhaps partially

659
00:36:23,080 --> 00:36:25,200
Speaker 1: due to the fact that they were associated with the

660
00:36:25,280 --> 00:36:29,440
Speaker 1: god Odin and Norse mythology and Christianity sought to slander

661
00:36:29,480 --> 00:36:33,080
Speaker 1: these pagan symbols, so people were less likely to follow them.

662
00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:37,160
Speaker 1: But in South Asia they are associated with sages and

663
00:36:37,280 --> 00:36:41,600
Speaker 1: as guardians in the Hindu religion. In Bhutan, the raven

664
00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:46,080
Speaker 1: is the national bird and it's associated with bravery and guardianship.

665
00:36:46,560 --> 00:36:50,840
Speaker 1: In mythologies of the indigenous peoples of the Pacific Northwest Coast,

666
00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:53,640
Speaker 1: he name the tribe I'm from, I'm indigenous, I'm I'm

667
00:36:53,719 --> 00:36:56,640
Speaker 1: en world cowl. It's yeah, it's a whole bunch of tribes.

668
00:36:56,719 --> 00:36:58,160
Speaker 1: Can I show you that? Yeah? Yeah, I let me

669
00:36:58,200 --> 00:36:59,879
Speaker 1: see if I grew up on any of these reservations,

670
00:37:00,160 --> 00:37:04,400
Speaker 1: um uh tillamok shinok. Yeah, these are all these are

671
00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:07,040
Speaker 1: all around where I grew up A yeah, do you

672
00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:09,520
Speaker 1: know about this then? Um, it's one of those things

673
00:37:09,520 --> 00:37:11,160
Speaker 1: where it's like I grew up in reservation and went

674
00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:14,720
Speaker 1: to tribal schools up until um, like seventh eighth grade.

675
00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:17,960
Speaker 1: So like I guarantee that there was an assembly that

676
00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:20,879
Speaker 1: we had where an elder told us these stories while

677
00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:24,600
Speaker 1: I was playing a game. So yeah, there's definitely a

678
00:37:24,600 --> 00:37:27,920
Speaker 1: lot of like things surrounding specifically like Pacific Northwest. The

679
00:37:28,040 --> 00:37:30,759
Speaker 1: term is like coastal sailor isious sort of what is

680
00:37:31,360 --> 00:37:33,759
Speaker 1: and um, there's a lot of stuff about crows and

681
00:37:33,840 --> 00:37:36,879
Speaker 1: ravens kind of in that mythology. Yeah, and I think

682
00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:40,000
Speaker 1: there's a more it's a more positive association because it's

683
00:37:40,040 --> 00:37:44,200
Speaker 1: involved in creation myths rather than like I think, I

684
00:37:44,239 --> 00:37:46,200
Speaker 1: think it's just really interesting to me that it's really

685
00:37:46,239 --> 00:37:49,719
Speaker 1: mostly at the Christian areas of Western Europe where it's

686
00:37:49,800 --> 00:37:52,600
Speaker 1: associated with these negative things and you can kind of

687
00:37:52,640 --> 00:37:56,600
Speaker 1: almost trace it back to this propaganda effort to make

688
00:37:56,640 --> 00:37:59,680
Speaker 1: them seem bad because they were associated with Norse or

689
00:37:59,719 --> 00:38:02,319
Speaker 1: paid in mythology. Yeah, it's I mean there's a lot

690
00:38:02,320 --> 00:38:03,799
Speaker 1: of that stuff, like a lot of there's so much.

691
00:38:04,680 --> 00:38:08,120
Speaker 1: It's really interesting to see where like superstitions and religious

692
00:38:08,120 --> 00:38:13,000
Speaker 1: beliefs kind of stem from um uh, Like people can

693
00:38:13,040 --> 00:38:15,160
Speaker 1: look at the same symbols and interpret them differently based

694
00:38:15,160 --> 00:38:17,520
Speaker 1: on how they interact with them. So like, um, I

695
00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:21,160
Speaker 1: want to say, in like Egyptian religions, um, the like

696
00:38:21,200 --> 00:38:24,640
Speaker 1: the Niles River is or the Nile and that's what's

697
00:38:24,640 --> 00:38:27,759
Speaker 1: called right now, Yeah, the Nile Um, the Nile is

698
00:38:27,800 --> 00:38:31,960
Speaker 1: seen as like a very um I guess kind god

699
00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:35,800
Speaker 1: or very kind thing within like ancient Egyptian religions, because

700
00:38:35,800 --> 00:38:38,600
Speaker 1: the Nile like floods very reliably. It's like it floods,

701
00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:40,840
Speaker 1: you know, every six months or whatever. They know exactly

702
00:38:40,840 --> 00:38:42,560
Speaker 1: when it's gonna do it, exactly how it's gonna take.

703
00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:45,160
Speaker 1: It's um like it fertilizes the land and does a

704
00:38:45,200 --> 00:38:47,560
Speaker 1: lot of really great stuff, whereas like the nearby tigers,

705
00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:51,440
Speaker 1: Tigris and Euphrates rivers are kind of complete chaos and

706
00:38:51,440 --> 00:38:53,919
Speaker 1: they flood just like whenever. So like because of that

707
00:38:54,320 --> 00:38:56,520
Speaker 1: um mess obtaining religions that were more near the tigers

708
00:38:56,560 --> 00:38:58,759
Speaker 1: and Rephrates looked at rivers as being kind of like

709
00:38:58,840 --> 00:39:01,560
Speaker 1: chaos gods essentially, so like even if you take something,

710
00:39:01,560 --> 00:39:03,919
Speaker 1: it's just like literally a river or like you said,

711
00:39:04,040 --> 00:39:07,560
Speaker 1: like you know, like Corvid's like just you know, uh,

712
00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:11,080
Speaker 1: it's entirely based on like are there a lot of

713
00:39:11,120 --> 00:39:13,440
Speaker 1: Corvids in that area? Is there like is there a

714
00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:15,640
Speaker 1: scary guy in your neighborhood that likes a Corvid? And

715
00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:17,600
Speaker 1: you're like, oh, I don't like that guy. So corvids

716
00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:20,000
Speaker 1: are bad, you know, like it is. It's interesting to

717
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:22,560
Speaker 1: see how that stuff kind of develops based on situations.

718
00:39:23,120 --> 00:39:26,239
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, And Swedish folklore, ravens are thought to be

719
00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:29,880
Speaker 1: the spirits of murdered men. It's still associated with death,

720
00:39:30,080 --> 00:39:32,359
Speaker 1: but in a different way where it's like, rather than

721
00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:35,160
Speaker 1: than being omens of death, they're like a result of

722
00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:37,919
Speaker 1: someone dying in a way. So it's like it's still

723
00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:40,759
Speaker 1: kind of that death association, but instead it's like a

724
00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:43,759
Speaker 1: risen spirit from someone who has died. You have a

725
00:39:43,800 --> 00:39:49,280
Speaker 1: slight similarity, but then it it's just the interpretation is different. So, Okay, crows,

726
00:39:49,320 --> 00:39:52,239
Speaker 1: maybe they're around carrion, maybe they're associated with death, but

727
00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:55,200
Speaker 1: instead of being a sign of death to come there like,

728
00:39:55,400 --> 00:39:57,680
Speaker 1: oh it's a spirit of someone who's died, well yeah,

729
00:39:57,719 --> 00:40:00,960
Speaker 1: it's more like a crow. A crow appeared at that

730
00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:04,000
Speaker 1: guy's funeral. He must have been a murderer. Like it is,

731
00:40:04,080 --> 00:40:06,400
Speaker 1: it's kind of looking at us like the residue of

732
00:40:06,440 --> 00:40:08,880
Speaker 1: something as opposed to something right, which I think is

733
00:40:08,920 --> 00:40:12,560
Speaker 1: interesting because it easily can go either way. Um, as

734
00:40:12,920 --> 00:40:15,759
Speaker 1: as the case with any mythology or superstition, where it's

735
00:40:15,800 --> 00:40:19,000
Speaker 1: like just like a slight difference and interpretation will come

736
00:40:19,040 --> 00:40:22,319
Speaker 1: into a different result. There's an ancient Greek saying that

737
00:40:22,640 --> 00:40:25,880
Speaker 1: the swans will sing when the jackdaws are silent, which

738
00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:29,840
Speaker 1: means that wise people will speak after fools stop talking,

739
00:40:29,920 --> 00:40:32,800
Speaker 1: which I gotta correct the Greeks the saying is actually

740
00:40:32,840 --> 00:40:36,919
Speaker 1: backwards because swans are rude. Oh, fish, jerks and jackdaws

741
00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:40,319
Speaker 1: and other corvids are actually very intelligent, right. Yeah. There

742
00:40:40,400 --> 00:40:42,160
Speaker 1: is also like I feel like there are a lot

743
00:40:42,160 --> 00:40:44,239
Speaker 1: of sayings like that, where like when you analyze them,

744
00:40:44,280 --> 00:40:45,839
Speaker 1: you're just like, oh, it's clear that the person who

745
00:40:45,840 --> 00:40:48,040
Speaker 1: came up without saying has never met a cat before, right,

746
00:40:48,200 --> 00:40:50,839
Speaker 1: or never met a swan. Yeah, It's like they only

747
00:40:50,840 --> 00:40:52,759
Speaker 1: know if swans in theory, they don't know that they're

748
00:40:52,760 --> 00:40:55,439
Speaker 1: big jerks, right exactly. They just look at a swan,

749
00:40:55,520 --> 00:40:57,840
Speaker 1: it's like, oh, it's pretty and elegant, but really no,

750
00:40:58,480 --> 00:41:02,200
Speaker 1: if you've ever been chased by a swan, you've been chased. Well,

751
00:41:02,239 --> 00:41:04,719
Speaker 1: my mom has. She she was in I think she

752
00:41:04,840 --> 00:41:08,719
Speaker 1: was in the UK and she got chased over a

753
00:41:08,760 --> 00:41:11,720
Speaker 1: long distance spice swan and it was just like really terrifying.

754
00:41:12,000 --> 00:41:14,080
Speaker 1: How long is the long was the swan like waiting

755
00:41:14,120 --> 00:41:16,840
Speaker 1: outside of her hotel room is a several days? Was

756
00:41:16,880 --> 00:41:19,800
Speaker 1: this a Revenant situation with swan like she got in

757
00:41:19,840 --> 00:41:25,440
Speaker 1: a taxi and the swan like in another tax i?

758
00:41:25,480 --> 00:41:28,120
Speaker 1: Mean that would be I want to see somebody make

759
00:41:28,200 --> 00:41:31,960
Speaker 1: the Revenant, but with a swan just this, like this

760
00:41:32,120 --> 00:41:35,120
Speaker 1: swan wing burst out of the ground and clods way up.

761
00:41:35,680 --> 00:41:38,239
Speaker 1: I think that's basically the Goose game though, isn't it. Yeah,

762
00:41:38,280 --> 00:41:42,120
Speaker 1: it's basically that was the pitch for untitled Goose games,

763
00:41:42,560 --> 00:41:44,239
Speaker 1: even like the Revenant, But what if it was a

764
00:41:45,880 --> 00:41:48,040
Speaker 1: have you have you played untitled Goose game? I haven't,

765
00:41:48,080 --> 00:41:50,920
Speaker 1: but I'm so excited to. Yeah, me too, I've I've

766
00:41:50,960 --> 00:41:53,800
Speaker 1: heard it's incredible. We're installing it in the office. I'm excited.

767
00:41:54,160 --> 00:41:56,839
Speaker 1: It's amazing. Yeah, I've just seen enough gifts of like

768
00:41:57,160 --> 00:42:00,799
Speaker 1: a goose stealing a kid's glasses and then dropping perfect game.

769
00:42:01,000 --> 00:42:05,960
Speaker 1: It's the perfect game. It's so let's get into some

770
00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:09,680
Speaker 1: crow and raven facts. They are Corvid's and I bet

771
00:42:09,800 --> 00:42:12,880
Speaker 1: everyone's wondering what's the difference between a raven and a crow.

772
00:42:13,680 --> 00:42:17,200
Speaker 1: Ravens are typically larger and they travel in pairs, whereas

773
00:42:17,280 --> 00:42:20,760
Speaker 1: crows are a bit smaller, and they travel in big groups,

774
00:42:20,800 --> 00:42:24,080
Speaker 1: so like you know, the titular murder of crows, right,

775
00:42:24,360 --> 00:42:27,200
Speaker 1: Although it's important to note like people who actually study

776
00:42:27,239 --> 00:42:30,280
Speaker 1: birds don't necessarily call like say like, oh, there's a murder,

777
00:42:30,719 --> 00:42:34,279
Speaker 1: just say a flock of of them. Crow's tails are

778
00:42:34,520 --> 00:42:37,480
Speaker 1: fan shaped, whereas ravens have a longer middle feather, so

779
00:42:37,520 --> 00:42:39,640
Speaker 1: it's like they're giving you a middle finger with their butts.

780
00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:45,000
Speaker 1: And ravens sound different from crows. So I'm gonna do

781
00:42:45,000 --> 00:42:47,680
Speaker 1: you want to play a little game try to the

782
00:42:47,719 --> 00:42:51,919
Speaker 1: difference between crows and ravens. Absolutely, So I'm gonna play

783
00:42:51,920 --> 00:42:53,920
Speaker 1: at this call. Can we play this game with cats

784
00:42:53,960 --> 00:43:00,200
Speaker 1: after this? Just imagine them as flying cats with beaks done?

785
00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:05,879
Speaker 1: Am I guessing crow a raven? Yeah? Um? I want

786
00:43:05,920 --> 00:43:11,880
Speaker 1: to say that is a I'm gonna say that's a raven.

787
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:16,640
Speaker 1: You're right, that is a raven. So by process elimination,

788
00:43:17,080 --> 00:43:23,839
Speaker 1: that's only two choices. These are crows. I'm gonna say

789
00:43:23,880 --> 00:43:29,640
Speaker 1: that's a raven. Boy, So you can see like the

790
00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:32,560
Speaker 1: raven call is sort of more of a what would

791
00:43:32,600 --> 00:43:35,799
Speaker 1: you call that? Like a the raven is like a

792
00:43:35,880 --> 00:43:38,239
Speaker 1: It's like a honk, yeah, like a honk and then

793
00:43:38,239 --> 00:43:44,520
Speaker 1: the crow call is like yeah, um. Ravens beaks are

794
00:43:44,680 --> 00:43:47,720
Speaker 1: slightly larger and more pronounced. They have like little shaggy

795
00:43:47,800 --> 00:43:51,200
Speaker 1: r nose bristles, so the little like mustache right above

796
00:43:51,239 --> 00:43:54,160
Speaker 1: their beaks is a little bit poofire. Both are very

797
00:43:54,200 --> 00:43:58,800
Speaker 1: intelligent animals, so according to a study at Loomed University, Sweden,

798
00:43:59,600 --> 00:44:03,640
Speaker 1: raven are able to make complex plans when presented with

799
00:44:03,760 --> 00:44:07,640
Speaker 1: food based situations, such as being able to exchange tokens

800
00:44:07,680 --> 00:44:11,120
Speaker 1: for food or to use tools to obtain food. Ravens

801
00:44:11,120 --> 00:44:13,840
Speaker 1: could plan out what they would need to accomplish the task,

802
00:44:13,960 --> 00:44:18,880
Speaker 1: and they would make preparations, which ravens making preparations should

803
00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:23,000
Speaker 1: just strike fear into. They would also decline an immediate

804
00:44:23,080 --> 00:44:25,680
Speaker 1: reward in favor of a functional item. So if they

805
00:44:25,719 --> 00:44:27,719
Speaker 1: can only pick one item and there's like a little

806
00:44:27,760 --> 00:44:30,040
Speaker 1: piece of meat or something, but then a tool they

807
00:44:30,080 --> 00:44:32,520
Speaker 1: know they can use to get even more meat, they'll

808
00:44:32,640 --> 00:44:36,840
Speaker 1: choose the tool so that they can do delayed gratification,

809
00:44:37,360 --> 00:44:40,080
Speaker 1: which is pretty incredible. You've seen video of this. I've

810
00:44:40,080 --> 00:44:44,359
Speaker 1: seen videos of them using tools to get things out

811
00:44:44,360 --> 00:44:46,560
Speaker 1: of things. This this study, I don't think there's a

812
00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:49,759
Speaker 1: video of Unfortunately, there are a couple of Um I

813
00:44:50,000 --> 00:44:51,880
Speaker 1: worked on like an Shan geographic show a couple of

814
00:44:51,960 --> 00:44:54,440
Speaker 1: years ago where we did a lot of section was

815
00:44:54,480 --> 00:44:56,799
Speaker 1: on the crows and ravens and stuff. And yeah, there's

816
00:44:56,800 --> 00:44:58,600
Speaker 1: a lot of really great footage of them, you know,

817
00:44:58,680 --> 00:45:00,440
Speaker 1: essentially like learning how to use tool tolls. And it's

818
00:45:00,480 --> 00:45:02,840
Speaker 1: very it's like very clear watching that they're like putting

819
00:45:02,880 --> 00:45:06,359
Speaker 1: that they're connecting pieces together. They cocked their little heads

820
00:45:06,400 --> 00:45:08,640
Speaker 1: and they're like huh yeah, and they're like bend they'll

821
00:45:08,719 --> 00:45:11,399
Speaker 1: bend a wire so they can use it as a hook. Yeah,

822
00:45:11,440 --> 00:45:13,239
Speaker 1: Like they don't just they don't just use tools. I

823
00:45:13,280 --> 00:45:15,320
Speaker 1: feel like there's stuff like there's a new study recently

824
00:45:15,360 --> 00:45:19,400
Speaker 1: where somebody found, um, there's footage that exists of a

825
00:45:19,400 --> 00:45:22,640
Speaker 1: pig using a tool in the wild, and um, this

826
00:45:22,719 --> 00:45:24,960
Speaker 1: is the first time that's ever been documented with like

827
00:45:25,080 --> 00:45:27,560
Speaker 1: pictures and video and stuff like that. And the tool

828
00:45:27,640 --> 00:45:29,279
Speaker 1: is like it basically just uses a piece of bark

829
00:45:29,320 --> 00:45:32,440
Speaker 1: to like help dig for you know whatever, Whereas like

830
00:45:32,600 --> 00:45:36,080
Speaker 1: a crow or raven if you go which a corvid um,

831
00:45:36,239 --> 00:45:39,319
Speaker 1: they'll like you literally watch them, yeah, like bend a

832
00:45:39,320 --> 00:45:41,520
Speaker 1: piece of wire. Like it's clear that they're not just

833
00:45:41,960 --> 00:45:45,840
Speaker 1: like using something to help there, like literally fashioning a

834
00:45:45,920 --> 00:45:48,840
Speaker 1: tool out of something. Yeah. New Caledonian crows are experts

835
00:45:48,840 --> 00:45:52,000
Speaker 1: set that, so they will they'll bend wire, They'll they'll

836
00:45:52,080 --> 00:45:54,680
Speaker 1: form tools into shape so that they can use them

837
00:45:54,719 --> 00:45:59,040
Speaker 1: specifically for tasks. Crows are also extremely good at identifying

838
00:45:59,160 --> 00:46:02,760
Speaker 1: human faces. Oh, I love this story. They will harass

839
00:46:02,840 --> 00:46:07,640
Speaker 1: experimenters that they remember if they did them dirty. Researchers

840
00:46:07,680 --> 00:46:09,759
Speaker 1: suspected this to be true when they felt they were

841
00:46:09,800 --> 00:46:13,239
Speaker 1: getting harassed by crows after they had captured them for

842
00:46:13,320 --> 00:46:17,120
Speaker 1: a study. To put this to the test, experimenters wore

843
00:46:17,200 --> 00:46:20,920
Speaker 1: masks and they held out taxiderman crows, and then this

844
00:46:21,120 --> 00:46:25,000
Speaker 1: distrusted the other crows. They're pretty offended by them, just

845
00:46:25,080 --> 00:46:29,040
Speaker 1: like holding these dead crows. So they issued alarm calls

846
00:46:29,040 --> 00:46:32,239
Speaker 1: and they started to harass the experiment ers. And then

847
00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:35,480
Speaker 1: weeks later they wore the masks again, and the crows

848
00:46:35,560 --> 00:46:39,000
Speaker 1: recognized the masks and started to harass and scold them

849
00:46:39,080 --> 00:46:42,520
Speaker 1: for their their horrible death cult that the crows probably

850
00:46:42,520 --> 00:46:44,360
Speaker 1: thought they were in. There's a there's a couple of

851
00:46:44,360 --> 00:46:46,200
Speaker 1: fun additions to the story. It was a University of

852
00:46:46,239 --> 00:46:48,439
Speaker 1: Washington study. I want to say in like the Middle

853
00:46:48,480 --> 00:46:51,279
Speaker 1: Light two thousand's or something, and uh, the mask that

854
00:46:51,280 --> 00:46:54,080
Speaker 1: they wore was literally a Dick Cheney mask. Really, that's

855
00:46:54,120 --> 00:46:56,920
Speaker 1: so funny. Yeah, they were they were a Dick Cheney

856
00:46:56,920 --> 00:47:00,440
Speaker 1: mask and harassed these crows, and the crows caught them.

857
00:47:00,480 --> 00:47:01,960
Speaker 1: And then yet two weeks later they're kind with the

858
00:47:01,960 --> 00:47:04,480
Speaker 1: same Dick Cheney mask and the crows would yell at

859
00:47:04,520 --> 00:47:07,279
Speaker 1: them more. Um, yeah, crows are super smart. This is

860
00:47:07,320 --> 00:47:09,879
Speaker 1: great though, So now crows, do you think like these

861
00:47:09,920 --> 00:47:12,480
Speaker 1: crows like if you somehow got Dick Cheney to come

862
00:47:12,480 --> 00:47:15,319
Speaker 1: onto the campus, like they would attack Dick Cheney. Yeah,

863
00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:17,840
Speaker 1: I wonder if that's like if that's like just a

864
00:47:18,000 --> 00:47:22,000
Speaker 1: political protest from the researchers and just like okay, so

865
00:47:22,000 --> 00:47:24,160
Speaker 1: like Dick Cheney's doing a speech here in a couple

866
00:47:24,200 --> 00:47:27,160
Speaker 1: of weeks, these crows. So what you're saying is we

867
00:47:27,200 --> 00:47:31,799
Speaker 1: can train crows to hate the people that I also hate. Interesting,

868
00:47:32,239 --> 00:47:34,319
Speaker 1: I guess that if you, like, I guess if you

869
00:47:34,400 --> 00:47:36,200
Speaker 1: yelled at the crow and then showed them a picture

870
00:47:36,200 --> 00:47:40,160
Speaker 1: of one of your enemies and said he did this. Uh,

871
00:47:40,200 --> 00:47:43,680
Speaker 1: you know, they probably crows are smart. They are, but yeah,

872
00:47:43,680 --> 00:47:45,799
Speaker 1: it is it is funny that like you can very

873
00:47:45,840 --> 00:47:50,680
Speaker 1: clearly see that they feel spite, right, Yeah. And also

874
00:47:51,040 --> 00:47:54,520
Speaker 1: they can use vending machines, which is pretty great. I mean,

875
00:47:54,640 --> 00:47:57,239
Speaker 1: like they're gonna they're gonna take over the world. We're done,

876
00:47:57,280 --> 00:48:00,160
Speaker 1: We're done. So researchers made a crow vending machine that

877
00:48:00,200 --> 00:48:03,480
Speaker 1: would dispense bits of meat in exchange for strips of paper,

878
00:48:03,600 --> 00:48:05,840
Speaker 1: and the crows would just like tear off little pieces

879
00:48:05,880 --> 00:48:09,560
Speaker 1: of paper, dispense them into a machine like the fresh

880
00:48:09,600 --> 00:48:11,799
Speaker 1: dollar bill into a soda machine, and then they'd get

881
00:48:11,840 --> 00:48:14,960
Speaker 1: there get their little bit of meat. Um. Actually I

882
00:48:15,160 --> 00:48:17,400
Speaker 1: had neveat that study. That's super interesting. I want to

883
00:48:17,400 --> 00:48:20,719
Speaker 1: see the crow where like they do this, but then

884
00:48:20,719 --> 00:48:26,080
Speaker 1: the meat gets stuck before falling out, or like rejects

885
00:48:26,080 --> 00:48:31,359
Speaker 1: the strip of paper, and they're like, comes on. They've

886
00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:35,320
Speaker 1: also been observed cracking nuts using crosswalks and passing cars.

887
00:48:35,320 --> 00:48:38,319
Speaker 1: That's a pretty famous one. What I think is really

888
00:48:38,320 --> 00:48:42,440
Speaker 1: interesting about the crow behavior is that this cause effect

889
00:48:42,520 --> 00:48:45,920
Speaker 1: intelligence is also the same kind of thing behind superstition.

890
00:48:46,600 --> 00:48:48,680
Speaker 1: So you know that's sort of like if I put

891
00:48:48,719 --> 00:48:50,799
Speaker 1: a piece of paper in this machine, I get a

892
00:48:50,840 --> 00:48:53,640
Speaker 1: piece of meat. You know, I just wanted I'm really

893
00:48:53,680 --> 00:48:56,719
Speaker 1: curious to see if there's any any studies that will

894
00:48:56,760 --> 00:49:00,040
Speaker 1: come out about like corvid superstition that the core of

895
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:02,680
Speaker 1: its themselves have because we know pigeons can do it,

896
00:49:02,960 --> 00:49:05,840
Speaker 1: and I imagine that these these kinds of crows, which

897
00:49:06,000 --> 00:49:10,080
Speaker 1: in ravens, which are so intelligent, probably would develop some

898
00:49:10,200 --> 00:49:14,160
Speaker 1: superstitious here because they can make that those causal connections.

899
00:49:14,200 --> 00:49:16,880
Speaker 1: So I mean, I feel like that's something that you

900
00:49:16,920 --> 00:49:21,319
Speaker 1: see in like house pets, right, I mean, like like

901
00:49:21,520 --> 00:49:24,040
Speaker 1: you know, like anybody's dog has like a favorite toy

902
00:49:24,200 --> 00:49:26,719
Speaker 1: or whatever. Um, Like, I'm not sure exactly what the

903
00:49:26,760 --> 00:49:29,040
Speaker 1: cause of this is, but it's like cats oftentimes before

904
00:49:29,080 --> 00:49:32,799
Speaker 1: they pounced, well like wiggle their butt. That's actually they're

905
00:49:32,800 --> 00:49:36,120
Speaker 1: aligning their feet under their body in the optimal way

906
00:49:36,440 --> 00:49:39,640
Speaker 1: so that they're spring loaded to pounds. Oh that makes sense.

907
00:49:39,640 --> 00:49:43,000
Speaker 1: That's uh, that's way better than theory, which is for luck.

908
00:49:44,080 --> 00:49:46,000
Speaker 1: But yeah, you know what, they may think it's lucky

909
00:49:46,040 --> 00:49:48,759
Speaker 1: though they've got a lucky but yeah, they got a

910
00:49:48,800 --> 00:49:52,680
Speaker 1: lucky but because so many Satanists keep keep kissing her

911
00:49:52,719 --> 00:49:57,719
Speaker 1: asses special in some way. Um yeah, but I mean,

912
00:49:57,760 --> 00:50:00,320
Speaker 1: like you know, like it's clear that it's clear that

913
00:50:00,560 --> 00:50:03,640
Speaker 1: that animals have emotional intelligence beyond what we give them

914
00:50:03,719 --> 00:50:06,440
Speaker 1: credit for us. So, like it is easy to make

915
00:50:06,480 --> 00:50:09,279
Speaker 1: the connection of like, yeah, does your does your cat

916
00:50:09,360 --> 00:50:11,319
Speaker 1: have like a lucky place that they sleep, But does

917
00:50:11,360 --> 00:50:13,440
Speaker 1: your dog have like a lucky Do they have like

918
00:50:13,480 --> 00:50:16,680
Speaker 1: a lucky toy that they really love snuggling with before

919
00:50:16,719 --> 00:50:19,080
Speaker 1: they eat or whatever? My dog, I think my dog

920
00:50:19,120 --> 00:50:21,919
Speaker 1: actually thinks she has a lucky ass because every time

921
00:50:22,040 --> 00:50:25,640
Speaker 1: she meets someone new, she will turn around and sniffer butt.

922
00:50:25,800 --> 00:50:28,680
Speaker 1: Like it's a compulsive behavior, like she will like or

923
00:50:28,719 --> 00:50:30,880
Speaker 1: if she's coming up to greet you, she'll like sniff

924
00:50:30,920 --> 00:50:33,720
Speaker 1: er butt first it's like her own but she sniffs

925
00:50:33,719 --> 00:50:36,319
Speaker 1: her own butt. I wonder if that's if that's the

926
00:50:36,360 --> 00:50:39,680
Speaker 1: equivalent of like checking your breath. Yeah, like checking your breath,

927
00:50:39,800 --> 00:50:41,560
Speaker 1: or just like like looking in the mirror and like

928
00:50:41,600 --> 00:50:43,920
Speaker 1: combing your hair. Yeah, maybe it could be like just

929
00:50:44,080 --> 00:50:46,200
Speaker 1: making sure my butt smells like but just like, okay,

930
00:50:46,280 --> 00:50:49,520
Speaker 1: it smells like a butt, good, stinky and ripe, exactly

931
00:50:49,560 --> 00:50:53,480
Speaker 1: how it's supposed to be. This to me is fascinating. Uh.

932
00:50:54,080 --> 00:50:57,920
Speaker 1: In case you guys don't know, ravens can talk. Yeah,

933
00:50:58,000 --> 00:51:01,279
Speaker 1: and so I've got a couple of um clips that

934
00:51:01,360 --> 00:51:04,200
Speaker 1: I want to play. This one's a pretty famous one

935
00:51:04,320 --> 00:51:08,239
Speaker 1: from the Clovis Zoo in New Mexico. His name is

936
00:51:08,360 --> 00:51:11,399
Speaker 1: Joe the Raven. Yeah. They can say like hello and stuff. Right,

937
00:51:13,280 --> 00:51:17,319
Speaker 1: so that's Joe the Raven. What did he say, Hang,

938
00:51:17,400 --> 00:51:22,040
Speaker 1: Moun's coming. Oh yeah. And then here's another This is

939
00:51:22,160 --> 00:51:29,239
Speaker 1: Mischief the Raven. Yeah. Birds actually have the styrinx, which

940
00:51:29,280 --> 00:51:32,440
Speaker 1: is the their kind of version of the larynx that

941
00:51:32,480 --> 00:51:36,400
Speaker 1: can mimic human voices. Oh that makes sense, Like parrots

942
00:51:36,400 --> 00:51:40,800
Speaker 1: have that too, right exactly, Um, parrots, starling's, minor birds,

943
00:51:41,440 --> 00:51:45,160
Speaker 1: liar birds. I'm sure I'm for getting a few more species.

944
00:51:45,200 --> 00:51:48,160
Speaker 1: So many more species than parrots can actually talk, because

945
00:51:48,200 --> 00:51:53,080
Speaker 1: they can mimic sounds and birds, um, even songbirds who

946
00:51:53,120 --> 00:51:57,399
Speaker 1: can't talk, like, they are very good at memorizing sound combinations.

947
00:51:57,480 --> 00:52:00,560
Speaker 1: And they go through this crystallization period where they will

948
00:52:00,640 --> 00:52:04,120
Speaker 1: learn these incredibly intricate songs. Yeah, I mean, I wonder,

949
00:52:04,160 --> 00:52:06,759
Speaker 1: at what point are you going to get like not

950
00:52:06,960 --> 00:52:10,360
Speaker 1: a crow like learning, somebody's learning, somebody's a TM coaches,

951
00:52:11,880 --> 00:52:14,759
Speaker 1: But like, you know, what is the what is the

952
00:52:14,800 --> 00:52:18,640
Speaker 1: ceiling for this? Well, the ceiling, as far as I

953
00:52:18,680 --> 00:52:21,960
Speaker 1: know is there was an African gray parrot name I

954
00:52:21,960 --> 00:52:25,480
Speaker 1: think his name is alex Uh. And he was able

955
00:52:25,560 --> 00:52:29,440
Speaker 1: to identify objects based on what they were made out of,

956
00:52:29,680 --> 00:52:32,080
Speaker 1: Like you could ask him what matters this, and then

957
00:52:32,120 --> 00:52:36,680
Speaker 1: he would say like metal or like wood or something,

958
00:52:36,719 --> 00:52:39,080
Speaker 1: and so he could use He seemed to be able

959
00:52:39,080 --> 00:52:42,920
Speaker 1: to have some simple communication skills with his language. He

960
00:52:42,920 --> 00:52:47,000
Speaker 1: would say goodbye or like good night or yeah, or

961
00:52:47,080 --> 00:52:49,440
Speaker 1: if he wanted something, I think he could say, like

962
00:52:49,600 --> 00:52:53,919
Speaker 1: you know, want to go cage or something. Wow, it's

963
00:52:54,120 --> 00:52:56,279
Speaker 1: very very simple. I wouldn't say that he knows how

964
00:52:56,320 --> 00:52:59,920
Speaker 1: to speak human language, but like how a dog knows

965
00:53:00,000 --> 00:53:02,759
Speaker 1: certain things will get the dog certain things, So like

966
00:53:02,800 --> 00:53:05,000
Speaker 1: if the dog winds, he'll get attention, or if the

967
00:53:05,040 --> 00:53:07,120
Speaker 1: dog rolls over on his tummy, like he'll get a

968
00:53:07,160 --> 00:53:10,440
Speaker 1: tummy rub um, or if he sits, if you tell

969
00:53:10,480 --> 00:53:13,239
Speaker 1: them to sitney sits, then he gets a treat, or

970
00:53:13,280 --> 00:53:15,719
Speaker 1: like like an o ring. Attainment of sign language right exactly.

971
00:53:16,239 --> 00:53:18,600
Speaker 1: Also with like sign language, it's really hard to tell

972
00:53:18,680 --> 00:53:21,279
Speaker 1: like how they're using the sign language because there's so

973
00:53:21,360 --> 00:53:24,680
Speaker 1: much interpretation air in terms of like you'll interpret something

974
00:53:24,800 --> 00:53:27,359
Speaker 1: is perhaps like a sign, whereas it may not be

975
00:53:27,480 --> 00:53:29,960
Speaker 1: the sign that you think it is. Um, So there's

976
00:53:29,960 --> 00:53:32,279
Speaker 1: a lot of human interpretation that can go wrong there.

977
00:53:32,560 --> 00:53:35,120
Speaker 1: But I do think that. I mean, just as dogs

978
00:53:35,200 --> 00:53:38,759
Speaker 1: can do simple communication nonverbally, I think that animals who

979
00:53:38,760 --> 00:53:43,160
Speaker 1: are capable of mimicking or language can then do a

980
00:53:43,239 --> 00:53:46,600
Speaker 1: verbal communication. Although it's hard to say whether they understand

981
00:53:46,719 --> 00:53:48,799
Speaker 1: what that means. Yeah, I mean, it could just be

982
00:53:48,800 --> 00:53:52,200
Speaker 1: like a simple cause effect thing where it's like they're, uh,

983
00:53:52,360 --> 00:53:54,279
Speaker 1: this crow is aware that when it says food, it

984
00:53:54,320 --> 00:53:56,719
Speaker 1: gets food, right exactly, So I guess what I mean.

985
00:53:56,840 --> 00:53:59,000
Speaker 1: That means that it knows what food is, but like right,

986
00:53:59,600 --> 00:54:02,400
Speaker 1: um uh. Side note, have you ever seen a picture

987
00:54:02,440 --> 00:54:06,160
Speaker 1: of the world's smartest dog? No, you should google it.

988
00:54:06,160 --> 00:54:09,319
Speaker 1: It's definitely clear that the dog is self aware. Is

989
00:54:09,360 --> 00:54:12,879
Speaker 1: his name? Chasers E the border Collie? Oh yeah, let's see,

990
00:54:12,880 --> 00:54:16,480
Speaker 1: there's a picture of this dog that's it looks like

991
00:54:16,560 --> 00:54:19,160
Speaker 1: he's looked into the universe. It definitely looks like this

992
00:54:19,320 --> 00:54:24,600
Speaker 1: dog as contemplated the state of things his eyes are.

993
00:54:24,840 --> 00:54:28,279
Speaker 1: He's like I've seen I've seen the universe. Although my

994
00:54:28,360 --> 00:54:30,800
Speaker 1: dog also gets that look, and it's usually right before

995
00:54:30,840 --> 00:54:35,120
Speaker 1: she farts. Who knows what that means? Yeah, that's fair. Yeah, anyway,

996
00:54:35,160 --> 00:54:41,480
Speaker 1: I take it back. Dogs are Superstitions about animals aren't

997
00:54:41,480 --> 00:54:46,800
Speaker 1: always negative. In Kombolcha, Ethiopia, hyenas are regarded positively in folklore.

998
00:54:47,080 --> 00:54:51,520
Speaker 1: They eat evil spirits and they're laughing hells bear supernatural meanings.

999
00:54:51,520 --> 00:54:54,919
Speaker 1: This superstition may be based in a very practical reality.

1000
00:54:55,200 --> 00:54:58,879
Speaker 1: The hyenas eat herbivores, which locals are grateful for as

1001
00:54:58,920 --> 00:55:02,280
Speaker 1: an excess of herb wars can eat crops and disturb homes,

1002
00:55:02,680 --> 00:55:04,720
Speaker 1: so the people of the region make sure to share

1003
00:55:04,719 --> 00:55:08,520
Speaker 1: their space and make conservation efforts for the hyena. The British,

1004
00:55:08,600 --> 00:55:11,359
Speaker 1: who throughout history have had a checkered past when it

1005
00:55:11,360 --> 00:55:14,680
Speaker 1: comes to animal conservation, came to the rescue of the

1006
00:55:14,760 --> 00:55:18,400
Speaker 1: Barbary macaque due to a superstition. The legend goes that

1007
00:55:18,480 --> 00:55:22,320
Speaker 1: once the maccaques disappear from Gibraltar, Britain would lose control

1008
00:55:22,400 --> 00:55:25,319
Speaker 1: of the territory, which they had captured from Spain in

1009
00:55:25,400 --> 00:55:29,520
Speaker 1: seventeen o four. In nineteen forty two, the population of

1010
00:55:29,640 --> 00:55:34,440
Speaker 1: macaques had crashed to only about seven individuals. Winston Churchill,

1011
00:55:34,520 --> 00:55:38,319
Speaker 1: either out of tradition or superstitious belief, arranged for the

1012
00:55:38,360 --> 00:55:43,560
Speaker 1: macaques to be repopulated. Unfortunately, not all superstitions look so

1013
00:55:43,680 --> 00:55:47,440
Speaker 1: kindly upon rare creatures. When we return, we'll explore the

1014
00:55:47,480 --> 00:55:59,080
Speaker 1: soft side of a demonic monster. So imagine that you're

1015
00:55:59,120 --> 00:56:03,000
Speaker 1: just chilling in your room, sitting on your bed, but

1016
00:56:03,160 --> 00:56:06,560
Speaker 1: you hear a tapping on the ceiling above you, tap

1017
00:56:06,680 --> 00:56:11,040
Speaker 1: tap tap, Then it's quiet again. Then you hear it

1018
00:56:11,560 --> 00:56:16,160
Speaker 1: tap tap tap. The taps then migrate from the ceiling

1019
00:56:16,440 --> 00:56:21,800
Speaker 1: down the wall, tap tap tap. The taps get closer,

1020
00:56:22,160 --> 00:56:25,839
Speaker 1: as if they're searching for you. You freeze, trying not

1021
00:56:25,920 --> 00:56:29,879
Speaker 1: to make a sound, but the taps get closer and closer.

1022
00:56:30,600 --> 00:56:34,400
Speaker 1: Suddenly you hear a loud, scraping noise right behind you

1023
00:56:34,480 --> 00:56:38,440
Speaker 1: in the flash of long yellow teeth. You scramble to

1024
00:56:38,520 --> 00:56:42,560
Speaker 1: hide under your bed. You think maybe you're safe. That's

1025
00:56:42,600 --> 00:56:46,279
Speaker 1: when a huge, bony finger scrapes under your bed and

1026
00:56:46,360 --> 00:56:50,359
Speaker 1: impales you on a sharp needle like claw. As you

1027
00:56:50,440 --> 00:56:53,560
Speaker 1: start to bleed out, you feel yourself being dragged up

1028
00:56:53,600 --> 00:56:56,640
Speaker 1: and forced through the hole in the wall into the

1029
00:56:56,760 --> 00:57:03,680
Speaker 1: jaws of the eye I. You seem very scared, Yeah,

1030
00:57:03,760 --> 00:57:10,240
Speaker 1: I definitely so. The I I is a lemur native

1031
00:57:10,280 --> 00:57:14,200
Speaker 1: to Madagascar. So, just just so people know, Lemurs are

1032
00:57:15,000 --> 00:57:18,760
Speaker 1: a type of primate that evolved independently from monkeys and apes.

1033
00:57:19,320 --> 00:57:23,440
Speaker 1: They're about five pounds, they're nocturnal, and they have huge

1034
00:57:23,520 --> 00:57:27,760
Speaker 1: yellow eyes. So here's a few pictures. They're these guys.

1035
00:57:28,120 --> 00:57:30,919
Speaker 1: They've got like long, weird fingers and basically scrape into

1036
00:57:30,960 --> 00:57:33,840
Speaker 1: like they get hants and stuff exactly. So. Uh. They

1037
00:57:33,880 --> 00:57:39,640
Speaker 1: have wiry gray and white wild hair, long squirrel like tail. Uh.

1038
00:57:39,720 --> 00:57:45,480
Speaker 1: Their nipples are near their grind. They have nictating membrane

1039
00:57:45,560 --> 00:57:48,560
Speaker 1: like in cats. So you should like them. It's the

1040
00:57:48,640 --> 00:57:53,120
Speaker 1: third eyelid that protects the eye. My favorite part. They

1041
00:57:53,120 --> 00:57:59,000
Speaker 1: have teeth that perpetually grow. They have huge floppy, dobby

1042
00:57:59,120 --> 00:58:03,520
Speaker 1: like ears. And it has a big middle finger. So

1043
00:58:04,000 --> 00:58:07,720
Speaker 1: it has already has these long, narrow, bony fingers, but

1044
00:58:07,840 --> 00:58:11,800
Speaker 1: they have this really really narrow and disproportionately long middle

1045
00:58:11,880 --> 00:58:15,640
Speaker 1: finger that just it's so it's really weird when you

1046
00:58:15,680 --> 00:58:18,440
Speaker 1: look at it. Um. I hope that I know that

1047
00:58:18,440 --> 00:58:20,200
Speaker 1: there's I know the scientific reason for the middle finger.

1048
00:58:20,240 --> 00:58:22,040
Speaker 1: I hope that the real reason is they don't give

1049
00:58:22,040 --> 00:58:27,120
Speaker 1: a It's an omni tool. Yeah, it allows them to

1050
00:58:28,040 --> 00:58:33,000
Speaker 1: tell authority how they think. So it uses this long

1051
00:58:33,040 --> 00:58:37,000
Speaker 1: spindly finger to tap on trees, and it listens or

1052
00:58:37,080 --> 00:58:41,400
Speaker 1: feels for the vibrations inside hollow channels in the trees.

1053
00:58:41,920 --> 00:58:45,200
Speaker 1: Then it listens for the movement of grubs inside these

1054
00:58:45,240 --> 00:58:49,200
Speaker 1: hollow channels. Um. Once it finds a grub, it uses

1055
00:58:49,240 --> 00:58:52,160
Speaker 1: its sharp beaver like teeth to rip open the bark,

1056
00:58:52,520 --> 00:58:55,440
Speaker 1: and then it shoves its long, bony fingers right in

1057
00:58:55,480 --> 00:58:58,680
Speaker 1: the hole and then hooks and impales the grub, drags

1058
00:58:58,720 --> 00:59:01,880
Speaker 1: it up, pulls it out into the mouth. Um. So

1059
00:59:01,920 --> 00:59:05,000
Speaker 1: this is called percussive foraging, which sounds like a great

1060
00:59:05,040 --> 00:59:08,400
Speaker 1: name for a metal band. Yeah, I mean, I feel

1061
00:59:08,400 --> 00:59:10,880
Speaker 1: like I feel like a metal A successful metal song

1062
00:59:10,920 --> 00:59:13,439
Speaker 1: could definitely be written about using your giant middle finger

1063
00:59:13,520 --> 00:59:19,240
Speaker 1: to impale you, impale amazed with my middle finger. Yeah,

1064
00:59:19,280 --> 00:59:21,560
Speaker 1: that's a good that's a good metal lyric. If you're

1065
00:59:21,600 --> 00:59:27,240
Speaker 1: listening to this, go for it. In superstition, the I

1066
00:59:27,520 --> 00:59:31,080
Speaker 1: I is a demonic entity. Folklore holds that if it

1067
00:59:31,160 --> 00:59:34,040
Speaker 1: points its long, narrow middle finger at you, it has

1068
00:59:34,080 --> 00:59:36,840
Speaker 1: marked you for death, or it's marked you as an

1069
00:59:36,840 --> 00:59:43,360
Speaker 1: asshole that cut it off in traffic. Thank you. Another

1070
00:59:43,480 --> 00:59:46,160
Speaker 1: legend is that they break into your house and murder

1071
00:59:46,240 --> 00:59:48,800
Speaker 1: you in your sleep by stabbing your aorta with their

1072
00:59:48,840 --> 00:59:52,640
Speaker 1: pointy middle finger. These things aren't that big now, they're

1073
00:59:52,680 --> 00:59:55,400
Speaker 1: like four pounds. Yeah, I feel like if it tried,

1074
00:59:55,520 --> 00:59:58,520
Speaker 1: you could probably you probably find it off pretty cheesy,

1075
00:59:58,680 --> 01:00:01,400
Speaker 1: unless you're a grub, which case you know you're kind

1076
01:00:01,400 --> 01:00:03,520
Speaker 1: of screwed. If you're grab your screwed. But I'm a

1077
01:00:03,520 --> 01:00:06,360
Speaker 1: big strong man, although I mean, I don't think I'll

1078
01:00:06,360 --> 01:00:09,320
Speaker 1: ever take a threat seriously again unless it's I'll stab

1079
01:00:09,360 --> 01:00:12,479
Speaker 1: you in the heart with my middle finger. Yeah, that's

1080
01:00:12,520 --> 01:00:14,440
Speaker 1: like the most metal way to do that is. And

1081
01:00:14,520 --> 01:00:16,840
Speaker 1: it's like that, that's when I know you're serious. If

1082
01:00:16,840 --> 01:00:19,840
Speaker 1: you're just like I'll kill you, it's like, okay, whatever,

1083
01:00:19,920 --> 01:00:21,800
Speaker 1: it's like, I will stab you in the heart with

1084
01:00:21,840 --> 01:00:24,880
Speaker 1: my middle favors like, oh, you don't like me, do you?

1085
01:00:25,560 --> 01:00:27,920
Speaker 1: And you also want to make a point of that, right,

1086
01:00:28,840 --> 01:00:32,400
Speaker 1: Despite the horror story I gave you about the I I,

1087
01:00:33,000 --> 01:00:35,360
Speaker 1: there are no threat to your me. In fact, they're

1088
01:00:35,400 --> 01:00:41,560
Speaker 1: an endangered species. No habitat destruction and hunting has put

1089
01:00:41,560 --> 01:00:45,160
Speaker 1: them at risk. Um. I think they're actually very cute. Um.

1090
01:00:45,200 --> 01:00:47,680
Speaker 1: They're these adorable little guys who live in balled up

1091
01:00:47,720 --> 01:00:51,080
Speaker 1: nests of leaves and branches. Their eyes are big and weird.

1092
01:00:52,600 --> 01:00:55,600
Speaker 1: They also don't exclusively eat insects. They will eat fruit,

1093
01:00:55,680 --> 01:00:58,640
Speaker 1: seeds and nectar. They just they just love eating eating

1094
01:00:58,640 --> 01:01:02,520
Speaker 1: grubs and stabbing them with they're weird fingers. The babies

1095
01:01:02,520 --> 01:01:04,600
Speaker 1: are really cute. Let me show you. I'm excited to

1096
01:01:04,600 --> 01:01:09,080
Speaker 1: see this. Here's a baby one. Ah. They are so

1097
01:01:09,240 --> 01:01:12,360
Speaker 1: cute and like every picture of them. Uh, if you're

1098
01:01:12,360 --> 01:01:14,520
Speaker 1: listening to this, I strongly recommend googling a picture an

1099
01:01:14,520 --> 01:01:19,000
Speaker 1: I I they look constantly surprised. Yeah, they definitely do.

1100
01:01:19,640 --> 01:01:22,840
Speaker 1: I'll include these in the show notes and pictures of these.

1101
01:01:22,880 --> 01:01:26,880
Speaker 1: But their eyes are big and yellow and they look shocked. Um.

1102
01:01:27,280 --> 01:01:29,680
Speaker 1: Some of them are uglier than others. Here's one that

1103
01:01:29,720 --> 01:01:34,160
Speaker 1: looks a little scrappy, but it's cute. They look like

1104
01:01:34,280 --> 01:01:38,560
Speaker 1: cute little demons. Like they constantly look like they they

1105
01:01:38,720 --> 01:01:41,480
Speaker 1: ordered a dinner at a nice restaurant and didn't pay

1106
01:01:41,480 --> 01:01:43,600
Speaker 1: attention to how much it cost and just looked at

1107
01:01:43,600 --> 01:01:51,400
Speaker 1: the bill. Yeah, and I don't know that. It's just

1108
01:01:51,480 --> 01:01:53,520
Speaker 1: like the whole thing, the whole look they've got going

1109
01:01:53,600 --> 01:01:56,720
Speaker 1: on with like the big the big years, the huge

1110
01:01:56,760 --> 01:02:01,720
Speaker 1: middle fingers, the wide eyes. It's like a little bus shimmy. Yeah,

1111
01:02:01,800 --> 01:02:04,720
Speaker 1: it's a little bit bu shimmy. It's a little Steve Sammy. Yeah,

1112
01:02:04,880 --> 01:02:09,080
Speaker 1: but you know in a good way. I like bushimmy. Yeah,

1113
01:02:09,320 --> 01:02:12,880
Speaker 1: yeah it is. Uh what is it's the like the

1114
01:02:12,880 --> 01:02:16,080
Speaker 1: the section of the uncanny Valley to something that is

1115
01:02:16,560 --> 01:02:18,920
Speaker 1: like a little bit scarier where it's still cute. So

1116
01:02:19,000 --> 01:02:21,280
Speaker 1: like a dog wearing a suit or something like that. Right,

1117
01:02:21,360 --> 01:02:23,920
Speaker 1: it's like in theory, if you describe it, it's scary,

1118
01:02:23,960 --> 01:02:25,720
Speaker 1: but if you look at it, it's like the cute

1119
01:02:25,840 --> 01:02:29,800
Speaker 1: version of scary, right, right, it's I mean they're sort

1120
01:02:29,840 --> 01:02:33,840
Speaker 1: of that like ugly cute thing. It's where it's sort

1121
01:02:33,880 --> 01:02:36,800
Speaker 1: of like sphinx cats where it's like they're horrible little

1122
01:02:36,840 --> 01:02:40,520
Speaker 1: butt monsters, but they're cute, horrible little but monsters. Yeah,

1123
01:02:40,600 --> 01:02:42,520
Speaker 1: Like I'd still I'd still kiss that, but I'd still

1124
01:02:42,600 --> 01:02:45,280
Speaker 1: I'd kiss look, I would kiss and eye eyes, but

1125
01:02:46,720 --> 01:02:51,120
Speaker 1: I'd be that satanist. I think everybody'd be like, oh, jeez,

1126
01:02:51,120 --> 01:02:57,040
Speaker 1: would get it. You did a study abroad you and

1127
01:02:57,120 --> 01:03:00,840
Speaker 1: that I I but get a room. So do you

1128
01:03:00,840 --> 01:03:02,760
Speaker 1: want to talk a little bit about some of the

1129
01:03:02,840 --> 01:03:06,040
Speaker 1: podcasts you're doing and uh, some some of the cat

1130
01:03:06,080 --> 01:03:09,320
Speaker 1: related things you're doing as well. Okay, so podcasts and

1131
01:03:09,360 --> 01:03:13,400
Speaker 1: cat realid things are doing. Um So, I run the

1132
01:03:13,520 --> 01:03:15,760
Speaker 1: l a Underground Cat Network, a Facebook group of people

1133
01:03:15,800 --> 01:03:17,960
Speaker 1: who love cats. You should definitely check it out. Um.

1134
01:03:18,640 --> 01:03:22,320
Speaker 1: I specifically cat related things. I um host a show

1135
01:03:22,400 --> 01:03:25,200
Speaker 1: called Chats on Cats with Joey Clift at the Right

1136
01:03:25,200 --> 01:03:28,080
Speaker 1: Citizen's Create Theater in Los Angeles, where I just celebrities

1137
01:03:28,120 --> 01:03:31,640
Speaker 1: about their cats. It's very cute. We uh don't have

1138
01:03:31,680 --> 01:03:33,480
Speaker 1: one in the books right now, but I don't know.

1139
01:03:33,520 --> 01:03:36,000
Speaker 1: I'm sure i'll come up soon. You can if you

1140
01:03:36,040 --> 01:03:38,960
Speaker 1: want to hear me talk about Native American stuff. I've

1141
01:03:39,000 --> 01:03:42,320
Speaker 1: got a podcast on Your Wolf and Your Wolf Presents

1142
01:03:42,360 --> 01:03:45,560
Speaker 1: show called Wow Your Native American Too, where I interview

1143
01:03:45,600 --> 01:03:48,800
Speaker 1: other natives about native stuff. Um. If you check out

1144
01:03:48,800 --> 01:03:51,080
Speaker 1: my Twitter account, got a link to it, it's great. Uh.

1145
01:03:51,080 --> 01:03:52,240
Speaker 1: This is a little bit of an old one, but

1146
01:03:52,280 --> 01:03:54,240
Speaker 1: I still think it's very funny. I've got a podcast

1147
01:03:54,240 --> 01:03:57,000
Speaker 1: called twenty five Minutes of Silence where the premises, the

1148
01:03:57,120 --> 01:04:00,760
Speaker 1: guests and I just sit in silence for twenty five minutes. Um.

1149
01:04:00,800 --> 01:04:02,919
Speaker 1: I work very hard to get good guests. I've gotten

1150
01:04:03,000 --> 01:04:06,920
Speaker 1: former Astronauts on the show Emmy Women, Emmy Winning Writers.

1151
01:04:06,960 --> 01:04:10,680
Speaker 1: I got ken Bone from the election to do. Uh yeah,

1152
01:04:10,760 --> 01:04:13,560
Speaker 1: it's very How do we know because if you're just

1153
01:04:13,560 --> 01:04:16,680
Speaker 1: sitting in silence, I mean always at the top of

1154
01:04:16,720 --> 01:04:19,360
Speaker 1: the show, I'm always like, look into silence and ms

1155
01:04:19,400 --> 01:04:22,520
Speaker 1: Joey Clift, I'm here with Katie Golden. Katie, I will

1156
01:04:22,560 --> 01:04:24,920
Speaker 1: say hi, and then Hi, let me with out of

1157
01:04:24,920 --> 01:04:27,280
Speaker 1: the way. He's silence, And at the end of it,

1158
01:04:27,320 --> 01:04:29,640
Speaker 1: we plug each other's social media accounts and then that's it.

1159
01:04:30,480 --> 01:04:33,280
Speaker 1: So like you know, you know, you know, it's one

1160
01:04:33,320 --> 01:04:36,280
Speaker 1: unbroken recording. Can you hear breathing though you can hear

1161
01:04:36,400 --> 01:04:39,600
Speaker 1: breathing and oftentimes like you can hear background noise. So

1162
01:04:39,640 --> 01:04:42,600
Speaker 1: it's like we don't like make eye contact and staring

1163
01:04:42,640 --> 01:04:44,360
Speaker 1: blanking the whole time. And the goal isn't for us

1164
01:04:44,440 --> 01:04:46,480
Speaker 1: to stay quiet. It's just for us to not talk.

1165
01:04:46,600 --> 01:04:49,720
Speaker 1: So when I had the astronaut on the show, uh,

1166
01:04:49,720 --> 01:04:51,480
Speaker 1: he used that time to clean out his rain gutter,

1167
01:04:51,480 --> 01:04:54,360
Speaker 1: and I used that time to do my laundry. See uh,

1168
01:04:54,680 --> 01:04:58,560
Speaker 1: so you know it's it's a real grab back. When

1169
01:04:58,640 --> 01:05:00,640
Speaker 1: Ken Bone did the show, he used to apply to

1170
01:05:00,720 --> 01:05:04,720
Speaker 1: fan mail, which he still gets really yeah, and his

1171
01:05:04,920 --> 01:05:07,800
Speaker 1: address is not publicly listed, so he does not know

1172
01:05:07,920 --> 01:05:10,000
Speaker 1: how people can send him fit mail, Like I mean,

1173
01:05:10,040 --> 01:05:12,800
Speaker 1: if it's to get at that that nice sweater, bod,

1174
01:05:12,840 --> 01:05:15,680
Speaker 1: I think that people will find a way. Yeah. Yeah, people.

1175
01:05:15,760 --> 01:05:19,640
Speaker 1: People are thirsting for Ken Bones Jones, and for Bones

1176
01:05:19,720 --> 01:05:23,840
Speaker 1: and Jones and for a bones in And can you

1177
01:05:23,880 --> 01:05:26,880
Speaker 1: explain for just like a minute or so your fascination

1178
01:05:26,920 --> 01:05:30,400
Speaker 1: with Garfield because I shared this as well. So okay,

1179
01:05:30,440 --> 01:05:33,200
Speaker 1: so um, I'm a really I'm a really big fan

1180
01:05:33,240 --> 01:05:35,960
Speaker 1: of Garfield in the same way that Katie is. Um.

1181
01:05:36,160 --> 01:05:38,920
Speaker 1: I don't know, He's just such a weird piece of

1182
01:05:38,920 --> 01:05:42,560
Speaker 1: Americana that is. Um, he's so stable than what he

1183
01:05:42,720 --> 01:05:45,080
Speaker 1: is that it is very easy to make comedy based

1184
01:05:45,080 --> 01:05:48,400
Speaker 1: on Garfield. So um. A couple of years ago, I

1185
01:05:48,920 --> 01:05:50,920
Speaker 1: thought it would be very funny to change my Twitter

1186
01:05:50,960 --> 01:05:54,160
Speaker 1: handle too, or my Twitter name to just Garfield official

1187
01:05:54,360 --> 01:05:57,680
Speaker 1: because I realized that the official Garfield Twitter account is

1188
01:05:57,720 --> 01:06:01,760
Speaker 1: not verify, and um, so I changed to Garfield Official

1189
01:06:01,800 --> 01:06:03,120
Speaker 1: and then just every couple of days, I would just

1190
01:06:03,160 --> 01:06:07,040
Speaker 1: post Garfield facts just like Garfield Fact number seven. He

1191
01:06:07,080 --> 01:06:09,080
Speaker 1: has a there's a dog named Odie and Garfield's strips

1192
01:06:09,160 --> 01:06:12,160
Speaker 1: or whatever, and um, while I was doing this, um,

1193
01:06:12,200 --> 01:06:16,760
Speaker 1: I noticed that there was, um the official Garfield account.

1194
01:06:16,800 --> 01:06:18,640
Speaker 1: The actual Garfiel account was doing a Q and A

1195
01:06:18,720 --> 01:06:22,480
Speaker 1: with Garfield if you did the hashtag ask Garfield. And

1196
01:06:22,560 --> 01:06:26,200
Speaker 1: I realized very quickly, like, okay, I could probably answer

1197
01:06:26,240 --> 01:06:30,200
Speaker 1: these questions faster than their social media team can. And

1198
01:06:30,360 --> 01:06:33,360
Speaker 1: because neither of our accounts are verified, people aren't gonverbable

1199
01:06:33,360 --> 01:06:35,480
Speaker 1: to tell the difference between which Garfield account because the

1200
01:06:35,640 --> 01:06:38,439
Speaker 1: real one are fake. You're like, it was really easy

1201
01:06:38,440 --> 01:06:40,479
Speaker 1: because people would just ask, like, what's your favorite food,

1202
01:06:40,480 --> 01:06:43,520
Speaker 1: and it's like lasagna is great, you know, and uh,

1203
01:06:43,600 --> 01:06:45,520
Speaker 1: it was super funny. It got like write ups from

1204
01:06:45,560 --> 01:06:48,160
Speaker 1: the A V Club and I also got blocked by

1205
01:06:48,320 --> 01:06:53,880
Speaker 1: the go Comics account that was facilitating it. Weirdly enough,

1206
01:06:54,640 --> 01:06:56,000
Speaker 1: one of the things I was tweeting about was like

1207
01:06:56,040 --> 01:06:58,160
Speaker 1: I treated out Alive Garden for some reason, and the

1208
01:06:58,200 --> 01:07:01,800
Speaker 1: official Olive Garden account thought that I was the official Guarden.

1209
01:07:02,160 --> 01:07:04,840
Speaker 1: They thought that I was the official Garfield account, so

1210
01:07:05,160 --> 01:07:08,600
Speaker 1: they offered to like send me like a catered Olive Gardens,

1211
01:07:09,040 --> 01:07:11,720
Speaker 1: and I jumped into their d M and I was like,

1212
01:07:11,760 --> 01:07:14,080
Speaker 1: I'm not eficial Garfield account. But I do love all

1213
01:07:14,120 --> 01:07:17,440
Speaker 1: of gardens, and then they sent me like an for

1214
01:07:17,440 --> 01:07:21,120
Speaker 1: pretending to be Garfield. The Garfield grift is real, lucrative.

1215
01:07:21,200 --> 01:07:23,920
Speaker 1: It was a real guard Field grift. I don't know.

1216
01:07:24,000 --> 01:07:26,040
Speaker 1: I just like doing bits around Garfield. So if you

1217
01:07:26,080 --> 01:07:29,240
Speaker 1: follow me on Twitter, I'll probably do some Garfield bits.

1218
01:07:29,280 --> 01:07:31,600
Speaker 1: Well that's just wonderful. Yeah, I have a I have

1219
01:07:31,640 --> 01:07:34,360
Speaker 1: a swoll gar Field that someone crocheted me based on

1220
01:07:34,400 --> 01:07:36,360
Speaker 1: a D and D character that I made, which is

1221
01:07:36,440 --> 01:07:40,520
Speaker 1: a swoll Field, which is an extremely buff and muscular Garfield.

1222
01:07:40,880 --> 01:07:42,280
Speaker 1: Do you have pictures of this because I have to

1223
01:07:42,280 --> 01:07:44,760
Speaker 1: see this. Yeah, let me get them for you. Here

1224
01:07:44,760 --> 01:07:48,600
Speaker 1: he is posing with Kalle. Okay, I'm looking at swull Field.

1225
01:07:49,920 --> 01:07:53,880
Speaker 1: That is delightful, home um, and that was knitted by

1226
01:07:54,040 --> 01:07:58,600
Speaker 1: Nico Manner forty two. Thank you for that. I cherish

1227
01:07:58,680 --> 01:08:03,080
Speaker 1: him every days and I kiss his butt hole every day. Yeah,

1228
01:08:03,120 --> 01:08:04,640
Speaker 1: that's how you know the love is real, as if

1229
01:08:04,640 --> 01:08:06,760
Speaker 1: you're willing to kiss a cat's block. As part of

1230
01:08:06,800 --> 01:08:10,240
Speaker 1: my my satanic ritual is kissing Garfield's butth hole. Look,

1231
01:08:10,400 --> 01:08:13,600
Speaker 1: I would do that in a art. Garfield was real

1232
01:08:13,880 --> 01:08:18,400
Speaker 1: and he had a blot hole. The Satanists of the

1233
01:08:18,520 --> 01:08:22,120
Speaker 1: Lasagna Order. I mean, look, if that's not already a call,

1234
01:08:22,200 --> 01:08:24,280
Speaker 1: we should start that call. Hold well we did it

1235
01:08:24,400 --> 01:08:28,040
Speaker 1: just now it's it's started. Yes, So you've got anything

1236
01:08:28,040 --> 01:08:31,120
Speaker 1: else to plug? Yeah, so I guess the main thing

1237
01:08:31,120 --> 01:08:34,160
Speaker 1: i'd plug is, um, just follow me on social media.

1238
01:08:34,680 --> 01:08:39,400
Speaker 1: My Twitter account is at Joey Tainment, My Instagram is

1239
01:08:39,880 --> 01:08:42,880
Speaker 1: at Joey Cliff. It's like five eyes. I was going

1240
01:08:42,920 --> 01:08:45,000
Speaker 1: to take Joey Cliff, which a twelve year old took it,

1241
01:08:45,120 --> 01:08:49,120
Speaker 1: so I really missed that. Um And then um, this

1242
01:08:49,200 --> 01:08:53,000
Speaker 1: is uh not out yet, but I have an animated

1243
01:08:53,000 --> 01:08:56,759
Speaker 1: short film that's currently going through the film festival circuit. Um.

1244
01:08:56,800 --> 01:09:00,640
Speaker 1: It's called Thames Very Long. It's called telling people your

1245
01:09:00,720 --> 01:09:02,840
Speaker 1: Native American when you're not Native. Is a lot like

1246
01:09:02,880 --> 01:09:04,960
Speaker 1: telling a barrier a bear when you're not a bear.

1247
01:09:05,320 --> 01:09:07,719
Speaker 1: It's about weird racial like aggressions that people make about natives.

1248
01:09:07,720 --> 01:09:10,400
Speaker 1: And the name is twenty four words long and that's

1249
01:09:10,400 --> 01:09:12,599
Speaker 1: going to be online real soon, probably in the next

1250
01:09:12,640 --> 01:09:15,920
Speaker 1: month or so. So yeah, follow me on socials. Look

1251
01:09:15,920 --> 01:09:20,040
Speaker 1: at for that's super great. If you have a cat

1252
01:09:20,280 --> 01:09:22,120
Speaker 1: or you know a cat, at that cat, I'm so

1253
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Speaker 1: I'm gonna put up cats. Thank you so much for

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Speaker 1: joining us. You can follow us on all of the

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Speaker 1: various internet things that go on. We're on Creature feature

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Speaker 1: Pod dot Com, Creature feature Pod on Instagram, Creature feed

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Speaker 1: Pod on Twitter. That's f e A T, not f

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Speaker 1: E T. That's something very different. Uh. And I am

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Speaker 1: at Katie Golden And of course, as always I am

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Speaker 1: at po bird Writes, where I make sure that birds

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Speaker 1: have the tools necessary or own distraction. Uh. Thank you

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Speaker 1: so much for joining us. Come back next Wednesday for

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Speaker 1: more Creature Feature. If you're liking the show, hit all

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Speaker 1: of the nice buttons below the episode, like all the

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Speaker 1: stars and the reviews and things. Thanks to the Space

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Speaker 1: Classics for their totally tubular tune Exo Alumina. Creature features

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Speaker 1: a production of I Heart Radios How Stuff Works. For

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Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your

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Speaker 1: favorite chows. See you next Wednesday. Boot Spooky Spooky Windus

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Speaker 1: joined the Garfield Cult