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Speaker 1: We just want people to you know, live their lives

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Speaker 1: and be happy and be able to enjoy it without

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Speaker 1: some you know, lunatic screaming in their face every three seconds.

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Speaker 2: We should be focusing on the issues that actually occupy

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Speaker 2: a lot of the mental space in Americans' minds, that

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Speaker 2: are filled with conspiracies, and we should fill it with

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Speaker 2: the truth and solutions.

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Speaker 3: As we built Midas Touched, that community aspect was almost

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Speaker 3: more important than us saying you know, here are our

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Speaker 3: political beliefs and here are these political stances, but more like, hey,

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Speaker 3: don't y'all want things to be normal?

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Speaker 4: Hi? Everyone, I'm Kittie Couric, and this is next question.

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Speaker 4: It's no secret that one of the things that propelled

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Speaker 4: Donald Trump to victory in the last election was right

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Speaker 4: wing media, a potent combination of conservative cable podcasts and

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Speaker 4: social media influencers. Now progressive voices are trying to make

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Speaker 4: sure that their footprint is as powerful and as big.

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Speaker 4: The Micellas brothers have created The Midas Touch, one of

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Speaker 4: the few digital networks. Yes, they considered themselves a network

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Speaker 4: to crack the code, gaining millions of followers and even

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Speaker 4: beating Joe Rogan for the number one spot on Apple

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Speaker 4: Podcasts a few months back, So I'm really excited to

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Speaker 4: talk to them about what they're doing and how they're

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Speaker 4: doing it. First of all, hello guys, welcome to next question.

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Speaker 4: Thank you so much. An exclusive, the first time the

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Speaker 4: three of you have done an in person interview together,

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Speaker 4: right first, that early first Wow, I'm very honored and

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Speaker 4: very flattered, and I wanted to ask a little bit

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Speaker 4: about your life story. You all grew up on Long Island,

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Speaker 4: you all had your own respective careers. Ben, What were

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Speaker 4: you doing before you decided to embark on this venture.

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Speaker 2: Well, I was a lawyer. I went to law school

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Speaker 2: at Georgetown Law was a civil rights lawyer, and I

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Speaker 2: was working civil rights cases out in the Bakersfield, Fresno area,

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Speaker 2: representing families who lost loved ones in police brutality cases.

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Speaker 4: Wow.

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Speaker 1: So it was through that work that I.

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Speaker 2: Ended up meeting Colin Kaepernick, and Colin Kaepernick took a

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Speaker 2: knee for police brutality to bring attention to it, and

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Speaker 2: then from there the pandemic happened and the Minus Touch

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Speaker 2: network kind of sprung out of it. But my background

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Speaker 2: was a lawyer. I think my parents were surprised when

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Speaker 2: I went into podcasting.

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Speaker 3: But I.

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Speaker 1: Think they're happy within them.

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Speaker 4: I'm sure they are. How about you, Brett, what were

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Speaker 4: you doing?

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Speaker 3: I was a film and TV so I moved out

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Speaker 3: to Los Angeles to go to USC and I was

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Speaker 3: in film school there and then I graduated freelance for

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Speaker 3: a bid, ended up working for the Ellen Degenero Show

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Speaker 3: as an editor there, ran the digital department, post production

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Speaker 3: team over there. I had a great experience. Ended up

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Speaker 3: working for as a creative executive in film and television

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Speaker 3: after that, and then the pandemic hit. Production quickly shut

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Speaker 3: down and we started this project and the rest is history.

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Speaker 4: Well, you guys were really early adapters for like digital content.

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Speaker 4: I remember doing such an incredible job, so you knew, gosh,

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Speaker 4: a lot of people aren't watching the show at home.

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Speaker 4: We are going to make sure that everyone sees it online.

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Speaker 3: And I got to give them a lot of credit.

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Speaker 3: On the producers, there are a lot of credit. They

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Speaker 3: saw that incredibly early on. And what ended up happening

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Speaker 3: was when I got there, there was a team of

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Speaker 3: like five people. I was the new guy. There was like,

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Speaker 3: you know, four or five other people. By the time

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Speaker 3: I left there, you know, we had a team of

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Speaker 3: I don't know if you include you know, kind of

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Speaker 3: other staff kind of associated with it, probably more like

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Speaker 3: eighty people there. And so I saw this entire division

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Speaker 3: of Digital blossom and I got to be there while

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Speaker 3: it happened. And I never thought that editing and helping

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Speaker 3: to create videos that maybe about human interest stories and

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Speaker 3: cat videos and whatever we were doing there would end

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Speaker 3: up apply to making political videos. But somehow I think

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Speaker 3: it ended up being a great education actually and doing that.

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Speaker 4: So I'm sure it did. Meanwhile, the baby, Geordy, tell

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Speaker 4: me what you were up before you got involved in this.

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Speaker 1: Marketing and advertising. Actually, right here in New York, heart

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Speaker 1: of Times Square, this agency called Translation Incredible Agency. I

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Speaker 1: like to say that they gave me my PhD in

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Speaker 1: New age marketing. It was really awesome. It was a

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Speaker 1: nimble operation over there. I think they had less than

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Speaker 1: maybe eighty to one hundred employees when I was there,

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Speaker 1: and so you got to wear a lot of different hats,

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Speaker 1: so from the creative department to strategy to account management,

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Speaker 1: just kind of seeing campaigns, taking them from the earliest

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Speaker 1: stages of development and seeing the whole execution all the

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Speaker 1: way through. It was really really cool and seeing how

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Speaker 1: they kind of used new age tech and social media

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Speaker 1: to really emphasize and reach their audience in different ways.

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Speaker 1: It was eye opening at the time.

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Speaker 4: So your skill sets really complement each other. You all

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Speaker 4: bring something different to the table. And so it's the pandemic.

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Speaker 4: You all are getting increasingly frustrated by what you're watching unfold,

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Speaker 4: to say the least. And Ben, what was your aha moment,

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Speaker 4: like we have to do more? And how did you

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Speaker 4: all come together and say let's launch this new venture.

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Speaker 2: Well, you heard our backgrounds. We're not political people missing

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Speaker 2: from those backgrounds with stories of working in politics. We're

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Speaker 2: just people who were scared during the pandemic. We were nervous,

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Speaker 2: we were worried about our families, we were worried about

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Speaker 2: our friends, and we were sending each other text messages

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Speaker 2: about what we were going through, and so we said,

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Speaker 2: how do we translate those messages into you know, we

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Speaker 2: almost felt selfish if we didn't bring what we were

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Speaker 2: talking about to the public. So we just started saying,

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Speaker 2: what if we wrote about this, What if we started

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Speaker 2: a blog, What if we use bread skills who could

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Speaker 2: do videos and editing? What if we use Geordie's marketing

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Speaker 2: skills and just start telling people, here's what we're feeling,

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Speaker 2: here's what we're experiencing. You're not alone, we're a family,

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Speaker 2: and here's what we're trying to do to help each other.

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Speaker 2: So we start releasing a article, a video that Brett

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Speaker 2: edits Geordie helps coming up with some of the framing

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Speaker 2: of it with his marketing skills, and it seemed to

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Speaker 2: resonate because nobody had really seen a focus on these

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Speaker 2: topics that really focused on the human experience as opposed

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Speaker 2: to just kind of an overtly political side to it.

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Speaker 2: So people had this kind of aha, like I feel

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Speaker 2: that way too, And once we started seeing that, the

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Speaker 2: shock to us was like, wait a minute, no one

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Speaker 2: else is really talking like that and connecting in that way.

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Speaker 2: And so we did it again and again and again,

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Speaker 2: and from there it just kind of kept on growing.

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Speaker 2: You know, a video did one hundred thousand views, then

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Speaker 2: a million views, then five million views, and from there

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Speaker 2: it kind of sprung up and a community started developing

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Speaker 2: around it, and the months progressed and we started seeing

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Speaker 2: that this was actually having a real impact.

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Speaker 4: And then you sort of broadened your aperture if you will,

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Speaker 4: and kind of started focusing on all kinds of things,

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Speaker 4: not just obviously the COVID and the or misinformation or

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Speaker 4: how you were feeling and what was upsetting you, but

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Speaker 4: the political spectrum in general, right, Brett.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, no, one hundred percent. You know, I think we

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Speaker 3: just you know, we were trying to share our lived

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Speaker 3: experience with everybody out there, and so when we saw

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Speaker 3: something was that we thought was crazy, we would just

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Speaker 3: be like, this, isn't this crazy? Everybody what we're watching together?

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Speaker 3: Like is it just us? And like I think for

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Speaker 3: a while we were all just looking at each other

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Speaker 3: like I don't understand, Like why is this being treated

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Speaker 3: like this is normal? Especially was during the time when

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Speaker 3: you know, Trump was saying this fifteen cases going down

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Speaker 3: to zero, It's never going to come to our short

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Speaker 3: it was just lie after lie after lie, and I

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Speaker 3: was like we were all like, you know, this is

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Speaker 3: going to be bad, right this is and then we

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Speaker 3: just kept seeing, you know, all the kind of political

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Speaker 3: ramifications stem from there. I think that was a very

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Speaker 3: kind of pivotal moment in shaping people's beliefs. And in

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Speaker 3: addition to just COVID, I think a lot of people

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Speaker 3: at that point were sort of being siloed into different

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Speaker 3: kind of groups at that point, and there was a

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Speaker 3: deep division that was kind of being put into our society,

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Speaker 3: and people were kind of falling.

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Speaker 4: Into force by their own self selection are algorithmically reinforve and.

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Speaker 3: The fact that everybody was home and everybody was not

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Speaker 3: speaking with each other. And so as we develop mad

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Speaker 3: to people were mad for all different reasons. I mean people,

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Speaker 3: some people were mad that they had to you know,

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Speaker 3: be home. Some people were mad that, you know, why

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Speaker 3: isn't this Why don't they just take the vaccine? Why

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Speaker 3: don't they respect my space? People were all mad at

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Speaker 3: each other for all different reasons, and so there were

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Speaker 3: these communities developing, and so community became an essential aspect

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Speaker 3: to us, more so than the politics of are you

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Speaker 3: able to kind of assemble a community that's based around

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Speaker 3: kind of positivity and wanting to do the right thing

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Speaker 3: rather than a lot of these sort of more malicious

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Speaker 3: online communities that exist out there that seek to kind

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Speaker 3: of sew division and hatred. And during that time there

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Speaker 3: was definitely, you know a lot of that, and so

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Speaker 3: as we built kind of might as touched the community

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Speaker 3: aspect was almost more important than us saying you know,

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Speaker 3: here are political beliefs, and here are these political stances,

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Speaker 3: but more like, hey, don't you all want things to

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Speaker 3: be normal? Like can't we see that this stuff is

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Speaker 3: freaking nuts? And like if we could all just rally

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Speaker 3: around that, like maybe we could actually put those political

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Speaker 3: differences aside in many ways. And so as we progressed,

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Speaker 3: one of the things that we saw was that, you know,

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Speaker 3: there were folks who may consider themselves, you know, as

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Speaker 3: liberal as could be, joining us. Then there were folks

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Speaker 3: who consider themselves Republicans or former Republicans who were joining

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Speaker 3: us independence. Like we saw, you know, people coming to

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Speaker 3: us for all sorts of reasons. But at the end

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Speaker 3: of the day, I think the core was people just

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Speaker 3: wanting things to be like normal again, right, understanding that

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Speaker 3: what we're seeing then, and by the way, what we're

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Speaker 3: still seeing now is not normal.

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Speaker 4: I was going to say, I mean, I wouldn't necessarily say,

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Speaker 4: and you can correct me if you disagree that your

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Speaker 4: content exudes positivity at this moment in time. And I

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Speaker 4: feel like you have gone through various iterations, Jeordi. During

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Speaker 4: the Biden administration, were you guys a little more dormant.

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Speaker 4: There were fewer things for people of a certain political persuasion,

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Speaker 4: I think, to be outraged about. So did your growth

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Speaker 4: really explode after the election of Donald Trump the second time?

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Speaker 1: No, I would say we saw our strongest growth period

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Speaker 1: when President Biden was president. During that era. I think

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Speaker 1: it's a slight misconception about what we do that you know,

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Speaker 1: maybe like like just angry you know, out the world

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Speaker 1: or or anything like that. We really just try and

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Speaker 1: bring folks facts and data, and it's sort of that

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Speaker 1: approach that has led the community to grow. When you

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Speaker 1: watch our videos, for example, you know Ben will say

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Speaker 1: a couple of sentences, We'll just say play the clip,

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Speaker 1: because playing the clip many times is way more effective

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Speaker 1: than Ben explaining every little slight detail and maybe even

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Speaker 1: giving his opinion in that second. If people are just

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Speaker 1: take away the receipts from the videos and we let

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Speaker 1: them form their own opinion, that's where we've genuinely seen

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Speaker 1: the most growth of the network and of the community,

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Speaker 1: because it's to really the values that we care about.

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Speaker 1: We just want things to be normal. We just want

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Speaker 1: people to you know, live their lives and be happy

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Speaker 1: and be able to enjoy it without some you know,

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Speaker 1: lunatic screaming in their face every three seconds. And so

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Speaker 1: I think we've seen tremendous growth during the Biden administration,

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Speaker 1: and we continue to see growth right now as well.

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Speaker 1: But again, I think people are always coming to us

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Speaker 1: for the facts and for the data, and that's what

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Speaker 1: it's allowed.

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Speaker 2: To grow, I think, cause we've been there now for

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Speaker 2: about five years. A lot of people shut off after

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Speaker 2: the last election, and they were looking for fighters, and

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Speaker 2: they were looking for people to stand up to them.

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Speaker 2: And I hope we've always been authentic to those same

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Speaker 2: values when we just started this out in twenty twenty

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Speaker 2: as what we're doing now, so as we were out

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Speaker 2: there still fighting, and I think people a group of

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Speaker 2: people lost a lot of hope after this election, so

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Speaker 2: they turned and they saw what we were doing, and

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Speaker 2: I think that also helped give them hope, which allowed

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Speaker 2: a lot more people to maybe notice what we were

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Speaker 2: doing now. And also we were doing things on the

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Speaker 2: digital realm that a lot of people are adopting now

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Speaker 2: right in our YouTube strategy, our focus on simulcasting videos

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Speaker 2: and audio was just a different way to even kind

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Speaker 2: of approach this space, which also I think has been

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Speaker 2: a bit kind of pioneering, and we could talk about

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Speaker 2: that later, but that's part of I think where we're

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Speaker 2: seeing and we're humble and grateful for it. But some

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Speaker 2: of the recognition is, oh, lots of people didn't even

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Speaker 2: know what we were talking about, and we were saying

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Speaker 2: simulcast right a year ago or more. And now that's

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Speaker 2: the you know, the new lingo.

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Speaker 4: You know, if a Martian landed on Earth and you

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Speaker 4: had to explain to him or her what the Midas

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Speaker 4: Touch Network is in you know, an elevator pitch, how

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Speaker 4: would you do it? Who wants to take that?

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Speaker 2: I mean, I mean, I think it's a podcast that's

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Speaker 2: fueled by a community, and the community.

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Speaker 4: It's not just a pot well podcast, I guess, as

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Speaker 4: we know are video and audio, but it's sort of

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Speaker 4: you're doing everything everywhere all at once. Right but sorry

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Speaker 4: the Martian interrupted, you go on.

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Speaker 2: You know it's it's it's the community is built on

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Speaker 2: you know, I think, core values and principles and that's

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Speaker 2: what's the success. And what we're trying to readjust everybody

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Speaker 2: to remember is that politicans, the Martians going to I

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Speaker 2: may have lost the Martian elevator speech, but I'll give

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Speaker 2: you my academic speech for the market. I'm assuming the

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Speaker 2: Martians mar well leg well educated mar mars exactly. But

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Speaker 2: but I think politics has been gamified into your this team,

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Speaker 2: you're that team. You're angry, you're angry, yell at each other,

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Speaker 2: and the viewers left a little bit confused, Wait, what's

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Speaker 2: what's even the issue? And they try to pick what

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Speaker 2: team do I like based on the style of the

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Speaker 2: fight and the style of the debate and who's winning

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Speaker 2: that fight. And that's the split screen cable news yell, yell, yale.

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Speaker 2: So we try to deconstruct that, and we come with

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Speaker 2: an opinion and a strong opinion, but we try to

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Speaker 2: root it in a trial lawyer approach. Here's the evidence,

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Speaker 2: here's the exhibit, here's why we feel this way. Agree

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Speaker 2: with us, don't agree with us, but here's here's what

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Speaker 2: we're grounded in. And so rather than have a four

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Speaker 2: minute segment of yelling with thirty seconds of the actual news,

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Speaker 2: we try to root it in eleven to thirteen minutes

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Speaker 2: of the facts with opinion.

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Speaker 1: But it's the facts that drive it.

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Speaker 4: What I would say to the Martian, I would say that,

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Speaker 4: but Also, one of the things I think you all

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Speaker 4: do so effectively is connect the dots in this crazy,

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Speaker 4: fragmented media landscape, you know, with so much happening, particularly

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Speaker 4: in the early days of the second Trump administration. I

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Speaker 4: think what you do so artfully is is you kind

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Speaker 4: of connect, you know, you thread all these things. If

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Speaker 4: an expert saying this, and then Caroline Levitt is saying that,

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Speaker 4: and you know, you're taking all these different things and

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Speaker 4: you're kind of helping people understand and aggregate what all

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Speaker 4: these these moments mean.

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Speaker 1: Is that that's why you're Katie Kirk no part of

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Speaker 1: your yes.

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Speaker 3: You know. It's funny because we were speaking about this.

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Speaker 3: I think, like just yesterday that there's so much noise

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Speaker 3: out there, and you I think we all thought, you know,

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Speaker 3: if we went back I don't know even ten years ago,

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Speaker 3: but probably more than that, probably thought, oh, with the Internet,

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Speaker 3: with digital media, with also there's going to be so

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Speaker 3: much information. People are going to be so well informed,

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Speaker 3: people are going to be smarter than ever, They're going

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Speaker 3: to be on top of everything. It's going to be

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Speaker 3: so clear to know what's true and what's fiction. It's

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Speaker 3: clearly like the opposite at this point of what we're seeing.

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Speaker 3: There's such a deluge of information coming at people every

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Speaker 3: single day. So I think one of the things that

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Speaker 3: we do try to do is what you just hit at,

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Speaker 3: which is how do we cut through that noise with

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Speaker 3: a message that's clear, that could resonate, that gets the

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Speaker 3: truth across in the midst of just all of this

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Speaker 3: chaos that's coming every single day. Certainly that's been ramped

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Speaker 3: up since Trump's second administration, where I think part of

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Speaker 3: their strategy is also to flood the zone. I mean,

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Speaker 3: you think back to what's yeah, you think back to

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Speaker 3: what Bannon said in twenty sixteen or whenever he made

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Speaker 3: that statement, flood the zone with shit. I don't know

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Speaker 3: if I'm lent.

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Speaker 2: To say that.

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Speaker 3: Weak here, and and that's definitely been their strategy this

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Speaker 3: time around as well. Just do so much that it's

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Speaker 3: almost impossible for you know, an average person to try

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Speaker 3: to keep up with it. But we that's one of

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Speaker 3: the things we try to do is really center the

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Speaker 3: conversation on you know, these are the distractions, these are

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Speaker 3: the important issues, These are the things that are actually

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Speaker 3: going to affect you know, you your family, you know,

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Speaker 3: your friends, your coworkers.

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Speaker 4: These are these things you really need to understand. Yeah,

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Speaker 4: for sure, and I think it You're right. I mean,

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Speaker 4: a combination of things is making it so difficult to

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Speaker 4: stay informed. And a story that happened four days ago,

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Speaker 4: the country has moved on and it's like, hey, whatever

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Speaker 4: happened to the Associated Press getting kicked out of the

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Speaker 4: White House press room? And you know what about all

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Speaker 4: these right wing media influencers who are now taking over

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Speaker 4: seats that once belong to legacy media? Would you describe

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Speaker 4: yourselves as journalists, curators, producers or do you think there

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Speaker 4: isn't really a category for what you do? Jordy, you're smiling,

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Speaker 4: Go ahead, you.

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Speaker 1: Know, I've never thought of it like that. I view

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Speaker 1: as as concerned citizens first and foremost, we just.

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Speaker 4: Want to they're building a media impure.

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Speaker 1: Well, the funny thing about that is a journy. I

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Speaker 1: don't mean to no go for it. When we do interview.

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Speaker 2: We don't do a lot of interviews about ourselves, so

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Speaker 2: we're actually not that and I mean this sincerely reflective

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Speaker 2: on like who we are because we center the network

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Speaker 2: around the community and around the message to the people,

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Speaker 2: so it is always you know, interesting sometimes, you know,

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Speaker 2: and lately we don't do a lot of interviews, but

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Speaker 2: sometimes when we're reflecting on like who we are and

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Speaker 2: what does it mean?

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Speaker 4: But maybe just think about instead of you guys like

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Speaker 4: as brothers, sort of who is the Midas Network, right,

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Speaker 4: you know, And I guess it's a lot of things, right,

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Speaker 4: and it's.

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Speaker 2: Most importantly it's been built on the community of people

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Speaker 2: in America and frankly people around the world who are

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Speaker 2: concerned about the human condition and experience. That's how I

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Speaker 2: would say it, very you know, very succinctly. But I

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Speaker 2: think we are a media network. We run a media

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Speaker 2: network filled with some of the best reporters out there.

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Speaker 2: We have a great editorial team that breaks stories. You know,

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Speaker 2: I consider what I do on a day to day basis.

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Speaker 2: I'm reporting on the news, we break exclusives, we report

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Speaker 2: on news that happens, and you know, we try to

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Speaker 2: contextualize everything.

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Speaker 1: Right as best we can. That's all.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 4: I'm wondering, could you do what you do without legacy media?

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Speaker 4: In other words, I know you use a lot of

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Speaker 4: clips from MSNBC or Fox or CNN, you use reporting,

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Speaker 4: and then I think you make it understandable. As I said,

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Speaker 4: you call from a lot of different sources and kind

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Speaker 4: of give people the big picture, at least in a

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Speaker 4: lot of the content I'm looking at, But the big

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Speaker 4: beef while legacy media gets trashed and everything is a

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Speaker 4: lot of these content creators and even digital media networks

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Speaker 4: could not do what they do without. You know, with

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Speaker 4: all due respect to the reporters you have, but with

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Speaker 4: this vast array of legacy media organizations that are covering

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Speaker 4: the world to are interviewing Scot Galloway on CNN or

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Speaker 4: doing something else with some other expert from you might

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Speaker 4: run a CLI. So I'm just curious how you feel

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Speaker 4: about that. If legacy media poof went away, I don't

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Speaker 4: think you could do what you're doing.

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Speaker 2: I don't know. I mean I think that I think

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Speaker 2: that a lot of the things that we find are

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Speaker 2: on social media.

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Speaker 4: It's what right our hearings on Capitol Hill. I was

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Speaker 4: thinking about that.

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Speaker 2: No, so I would say there's maybe five to seven

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Speaker 2: percent of what we do is maybe commenting on an

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Speaker 2: interview that's on a cable news legacy news network. But

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Speaker 2: I don't think that drives the network even a small fraction.

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Speaker 2: I mean, the majority of it is people are out

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Speaker 2: there saying things either on social media on their own tiktoks,

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Speaker 2: on their own instagrams, on their own x accounts, or whatever, or.

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Speaker 4: People are saying things on Capitol Hill like Marjorie Taylor

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Speaker 4: Green claiming that guy was flipping the bird. Did you

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Speaker 4: you guys, I'm sure did a story.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, oh yeah, we did that. The deceptive photo where

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Speaker 3: Represent Stansbury ended up showing the actual photo and then

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Speaker 3: who was holding it up It.

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Speaker 2: Was Marjorie Taylor Green had the big poster board of

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Speaker 2: the head of USA Fencing. Why they brought a USA

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Speaker 2: Fencing even though they received no federal funding is because

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Speaker 2: there was a Fox story saying that there was a

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Speaker 2: trendgender fencer. So the whole conspiracy is is that they

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Speaker 2: wanted to punch down on a marginalized community using the

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Speaker 2: fencing guy. So they showed a photo of the head

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Speaker 2: of USA Fencing in a doge committee and he had

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Speaker 2: a peace sign or he had two fingers up, and

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Speaker 2: they edited out to look like he was giving the

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Speaker 2: camera the middle finger, and they said, look, he's giving

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Speaker 2: you all the middle finger. And then Congresswoman Stansbury said, no,

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Speaker 2: let me show you what the photo is. You know,

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Speaker 2: it's a it's actually a peace sign.

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Speaker 4: That was so crazy, remember, and Marjorie Taylor Green just hitting.

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Speaker 2: In the cavel. See.

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Speaker 3: But that's the kind of thing like to me, I

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Speaker 3: don't care what your politics are, like, that's not okay,

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Speaker 3: you know, and we should all be able to acknowledge

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Speaker 3: that that's not okay at the end of the day,

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Speaker 3: to do that kind of deception and to try to

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Speaker 3: punch down at people like that. And so I think

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Speaker 3: that's at the heart of, you know, a lot of

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Speaker 3: what we're trying to get across here. But you know,

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Speaker 3: I think one of the other great examples too, And

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Speaker 3: you know, I think legacy media certainly plays, you know,

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Speaker 3: a tremendous role. And I think there's some you know,

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00:22:20,160 --> 00:22:22,639
Speaker 3: excellent reporters out there who do a really, you know,

436
00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:24,920
Speaker 3: terrific job, and I you know, I commend their work,

437
00:22:25,040 --> 00:22:27,240
Speaker 3: you know, especially the reporters who are out there in

438
00:22:27,359 --> 00:22:29,920
Speaker 3: these war zones and reporting on these international stories. You know,

439
00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:32,440
Speaker 3: I have so much respect for the stuff they do.

440
00:22:32,600 --> 00:22:35,159
Speaker 3: But I will say also, you know, the a lot

441
00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:37,479
Speaker 3: of the bread and butter of what we've done, especially

442
00:22:37,480 --> 00:22:39,560
Speaker 3: throughout the past few years also is looking to like

443
00:22:39,640 --> 00:22:42,800
Speaker 3: the first hand documentation ourselves. And so I think one

444
00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:44,760
Speaker 3: of the great examples and of one of the reasons

445
00:22:44,800 --> 00:22:46,600
Speaker 3: I think Ben is so good at what he does

446
00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:49,479
Speaker 3: is with his you know, background as an attorney. One

447
00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:51,280
Speaker 3: of the things that we do is we'll go through

448
00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:54,800
Speaker 3: court filings, for example, and so during all the various

449
00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:57,040
Speaker 3: court cases over the past few years, and even everything

450
00:22:57,080 --> 00:22:59,000
Speaker 3: that's happening in the courts right now, because you know,

451
00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:01,600
Speaker 3: there's a whole lot of legal stuff happening right now

452
00:23:01,680 --> 00:23:06,040
Speaker 3: in the various score Oh yeah, we started a whole

453
00:23:06,119 --> 00:23:08,960
Speaker 3: new well channel, the Legal af Channel, because we had

454
00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:11,280
Speaker 3: so many legal stories, right and so so we have

455
00:23:11,320 --> 00:23:14,080
Speaker 3: a whole channel now specifically dedicated to the legal But

456
00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:16,920
Speaker 3: on those the attorneys are going through these source documents,

457
00:23:17,040 --> 00:23:19,840
Speaker 3: the court filings. You know this judge said this, Their

458
00:23:19,960 --> 00:23:22,800
Speaker 3: argument is this, they're analyzing it. And so I think

459
00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:24,199
Speaker 3: that is at the heart of it. And I think

460
00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:26,200
Speaker 3: one of the things our format allows us to do

461
00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:30,000
Speaker 3: that may not be as conducive to a twenty four

462
00:23:30,000 --> 00:23:32,760
Speaker 3: hour news format or a kind of a TV news

463
00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:34,639
Speaker 3: format is we could go there and we could sit

464
00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:36,159
Speaker 3: there and we could say, pull up the filing, and

465
00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:38,680
Speaker 3: we could read an eight page filing and our audience

466
00:23:38,840 --> 00:23:42,080
Speaker 3: likes that. It probably doesn't make good TV, yeah, but

467
00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:44,360
Speaker 3: our audience likes us going through. Okay, now, let's look

468
00:23:44,359 --> 00:23:46,879
Speaker 3: at the footnote on page three, and let's go to

469
00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:50,720
Speaker 3: the paragraph on page and they likely turn the channel

470
00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:53,359
Speaker 3: at that point. But our audience, you know, likes that

471
00:23:53,440 --> 00:23:55,680
Speaker 3: because they like seeing what's actually being said. And I

472
00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:58,520
Speaker 3: think sometimes it's the most revealing rather than you know,

473
00:23:59,040 --> 00:24:01,479
Speaker 3: you hearing what I have to say about this topic.

474
00:24:01,800 --> 00:24:03,760
Speaker 3: Let me tell you what the judge actually said here,

475
00:24:03,880 --> 00:24:06,280
Speaker 3: let me tell you what there, what the Trump Administration's

476
00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:09,159
Speaker 3: argument actually is here, and then you be the judge

477
00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:21,919
Speaker 3: of what the truth is. Hi.

478
00:24:22,040 --> 00:24:24,800
Speaker 4: Everyone, it's Katie Curic. You know I'm always on the

479
00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:29,159
Speaker 4: go between running my media company, hosting my podcast, and

480
00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:32,040
Speaker 4: of course covering the news. And I know that to

481
00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:34,840
Speaker 4: keep doing what I love, I need to start caring

482
00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:38,480
Speaker 4: for what gets me there, my feet. That's why I

483
00:24:38,680 --> 00:24:43,000
Speaker 4: decided to try the Good Feet stores personalized arch support system.

484
00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:46,359
Speaker 4: I met with a Good Feet arch support specialist and

485
00:24:46,520 --> 00:24:49,480
Speaker 4: after a personalized fitting, I left the store with my

486
00:24:49,680 --> 00:24:53,880
Speaker 4: three step system designed to improve comfort, balance, and support

487
00:24:54,480 --> 00:24:58,400
Speaker 4: my feet. Knees and back are thanking me already. Visit

488
00:24:58,480 --> 00:25:02,200
Speaker 4: goodfeet dot com to learn find the nearest store, or

489
00:25:02,359 --> 00:25:15,000
Speaker 4: book your own free personalized fitting. So fair enough, you

490
00:25:15,080 --> 00:25:18,879
Speaker 4: guys do a ton of original reporting, and not just

491
00:25:19,200 --> 00:25:21,720
Speaker 4: on clips that you see on cable news. In fact,

492
00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:23,560
Speaker 4: I thought it was funny. I know that you hired

493
00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:27,040
Speaker 4: this guy and he is sort of like, how can

494
00:25:27,119 --> 00:25:29,920
Speaker 4: I explain him? He's sort of like the tru yes,

495
00:25:30,359 --> 00:25:33,800
Speaker 4: the truffle sniffy dog who can figure out, like what

496
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:35,720
Speaker 4: is going to be the big story and kind of

497
00:25:35,840 --> 00:25:38,480
Speaker 4: does clip. And I read one of you said something

498
00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:42,760
Speaker 4: like he's so undervalued as the best cable news producer's

499
00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:45,600
Speaker 4: business because in a way, you all are setting the

500
00:25:45,720 --> 00:25:50,000
Speaker 4: agenda for at least more progressive cable news networks, and

501
00:25:50,040 --> 00:25:53,920
Speaker 4: I would imagine even more conservative ones that are often

502
00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:57,359
Speaker 4: reacting to more progressive ones. Right.

503
00:25:57,520 --> 00:25:59,160
Speaker 3: Well, one of the things that we notice, and it's

504
00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:02,119
Speaker 3: a funny thing to see is that you know Ason,

505
00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:04,160
Speaker 3: who's one of the most brilliant people on the planet.

506
00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:05,200
Speaker 4: I might have to hire.

507
00:26:06,680 --> 00:26:08,639
Speaker 2: He truly is a savant when you see what he

508
00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:11,560
Speaker 2: does with like the eight screens and he sits there

509
00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:14,920
Speaker 2: for like eighteen hours a day like it's real.

510
00:26:15,080 --> 00:26:16,800
Speaker 3: And let me just say, he's ours. You can't have it.

511
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:20,600
Speaker 3: But he goes, he goes through, you know, the clips

512
00:26:20,720 --> 00:26:24,040
Speaker 3: all day long, and you know he's got an eye

513
00:26:24,119 --> 00:26:25,840
Speaker 3: for it, and I think it's something you do need

514
00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:28,640
Speaker 3: an eye for, right, what out of all the things

515
00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:32,000
Speaker 3: that are said during these congressional hearings, for example, or

516
00:26:32,080 --> 00:26:33,800
Speaker 3: on the floor of the house, whatever it is on

517
00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:37,199
Speaker 3: cable news, there's a lot of stuff that isn't newsworthy,

518
00:26:37,240 --> 00:26:41,200
Speaker 3: that isn't exciting, but for you to be able to capture, contextualize,

519
00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:43,800
Speaker 3: and ninety nine percent of the time he's literally just

520
00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:45,920
Speaker 3: putting the captions of what people are saying when he

521
00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:48,280
Speaker 3: puts out these clips. But to pick those moments that

522
00:26:48,359 --> 00:26:50,480
Speaker 3: are the moments that you know, he knows will be

523
00:26:50,520 --> 00:26:52,800
Speaker 3: important for people to see. I think that's a real

524
00:26:52,920 --> 00:26:55,199
Speaker 3: skill and a real talent. And one of the interesting

525
00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:56,920
Speaker 3: things that we see is he'll do that throughout the

526
00:26:57,040 --> 00:27:01,360
Speaker 3: day and then coincidentally, you know on the Shepherd.

527
00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:04,800
Speaker 4: Talking about yeah, you go another lawyer.

528
00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:08,760
Speaker 3: Right, whether it's MSNBC or Fox, you know, they're playing

529
00:27:08,840 --> 00:27:11,600
Speaker 3: those same clips. They have a different perspective on the clips.

530
00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:14,359
Speaker 3: But but they're playing those same clips that Asen pulled

531
00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:16,919
Speaker 3: earlier in the day. I don't think that's any accident.

532
00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:19,639
Speaker 3: I think, you know, that's just how people are consuming media,

533
00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:22,399
Speaker 3: right and it's not just us, but it's a cable

534
00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:25,439
Speaker 3: news producers as well are seeing what happens in Congress.

535
00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:28,600
Speaker 3: Not because you know, these hosts are sitting there watching

536
00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:31,040
Speaker 3: hear you know, the hearings all day, but because they

537
00:27:31,119 --> 00:27:34,600
Speaker 3: see what people are speaking about online, and oftentimes that originates.

538
00:27:34,119 --> 00:27:34,800
Speaker 1: With our team.

539
00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:37,399
Speaker 4: So interesting you talk about your values. You know, you

540
00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:40,800
Speaker 4: describe the trans community as a marginalized community. I couldn't

541
00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:44,160
Speaker 4: agree with you more. I think our values are probably aligned.

542
00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:49,080
Speaker 4: But clearly you guys are left of center. Is that fair?

543
00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:52,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, it's funny. I just I think that's

544
00:27:52,680 --> 00:27:55,639
Speaker 3: certainly fair, you know, in the kind of traditional political space.

545
00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:57,760
Speaker 4: I mean, if you're thinking about issues that you all

546
00:27:57,840 --> 00:28:01,560
Speaker 4: care about, believe in, maybe describe some of those issues

547
00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:02,720
Speaker 4: like and we all.

548
00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:04,280
Speaker 3: Grew up you know, not that we grew up, you know,

549
00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:07,280
Speaker 3: we didn't growup political, but we're all you know, Democrats,

550
00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:09,119
Speaker 3: and we all have you know, had, you know, beliefs

551
00:28:09,160 --> 00:28:11,000
Speaker 3: that go in that, but we don't we really don't

552
00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:14,920
Speaker 3: view everything like through necessarily a political end. Like in

553
00:28:15,080 --> 00:28:18,920
Speaker 3: that way, we don't necessarily view ourselves as like like

554
00:28:18,960 --> 00:28:20,800
Speaker 3: I don't care what the Democratic Party does, you know,

555
00:28:20,840 --> 00:28:22,959
Speaker 3: I don't care about their internal squabbling. I don't care,

556
00:28:23,160 --> 00:28:25,320
Speaker 3: you know. Like, to me, we're just doing our thing,

557
00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:28,320
Speaker 3: and if we have our values and if people want

558
00:28:28,359 --> 00:28:30,479
Speaker 3: to meet us at our values, that's kind of all

559
00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:31,240
Speaker 3: we care about.

560
00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:32,399
Speaker 4: So are your values?

561
00:28:32,520 --> 00:28:36,120
Speaker 2: Look, I think people should get for a hard day's

562
00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:38,920
Speaker 2: work or just working. They should get paid with dignity.

563
00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:41,720
Speaker 2: I think Americans should be able to be able to

564
00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:45,400
Speaker 2: afford homes. I don't believe Americans should be living paycheck

565
00:28:45,480 --> 00:28:47,920
Speaker 2: to paycheck if they're working. I think that's a form

566
00:28:47,960 --> 00:28:51,560
Speaker 2: of psychological torture. I believe that Americans should all have

567
00:28:51,720 --> 00:28:55,040
Speaker 2: access to healthcare. It should be very affordable or free

568
00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:58,160
Speaker 2: for Americans. I believe Americans should have access to education,

569
00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:01,360
Speaker 2: which should be affordable or free to Americans.

570
00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:03,160
Speaker 1: I believe in equality.

571
00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:06,880
Speaker 2: I don't believe that marginalized community should have to wake

572
00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:09,160
Speaker 2: up and be scared how they're going to be treated

573
00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:11,960
Speaker 2: in a given day. I don't believe that people should

574
00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:16,280
Speaker 2: be bullying marginalized communities. I believe diversity and equality is

575
00:29:16,400 --> 00:29:18,800
Speaker 2: a strength, and equity is a strength, and I don't

576
00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:22,000
Speaker 2: think that the lesson from this past election should be

577
00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:25,680
Speaker 2: running away from that. It should be standing up for

578
00:29:25,840 --> 00:29:28,120
Speaker 2: it and being strong and standing up for it and

579
00:29:28,200 --> 00:29:32,240
Speaker 2: showing actual convictions. I think a lot of marginalized communities

580
00:29:32,320 --> 00:29:35,160
Speaker 2: see fair weather supporters who are with them when it

581
00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:38,760
Speaker 2: seems cool and then abandon them when the seasons change,

582
00:29:39,240 --> 00:29:41,240
Speaker 2: and I think they see that a lot in how

583
00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:45,240
Speaker 2: the media portrays them, how corporations portray them. Oh, everyone's

584
00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:48,040
Speaker 2: with DEI now, and everyone's not with DEI now.

585
00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:48,960
Speaker 1: I think that's bullshit.

586
00:29:49,320 --> 00:29:51,040
Speaker 2: I think you've got to stand with people and be

587
00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:54,880
Speaker 2: who you are, and that's ultimately is the right thing

588
00:29:55,000 --> 00:29:58,520
Speaker 2: to do. But I think that's also what ultimately will

589
00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:02,600
Speaker 2: win elections too, because if your really care, if you're

590
00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:06,240
Speaker 2: really fighting for people, they'll recognize that. And I think

591
00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:08,240
Speaker 2: when they see that you're waivering, they don't even know

592
00:30:08,320 --> 00:30:10,200
Speaker 2: if you're a real ally or not an ally.

593
00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:14,280
Speaker 4: And I imagine working with and representing Colin Kaepernick was

594
00:30:14,760 --> 00:30:19,320
Speaker 4: very transformative. Maybe not transformative, maybe that's not the right word.

595
00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:20,280
Speaker 2: For sure, it was.

596
00:30:20,520 --> 00:30:23,400
Speaker 4: It was in terms of how you view things like

597
00:30:23,520 --> 00:30:27,480
Speaker 4: Black Lives Matter and some of the things that Colin did,

598
00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:31,680
Speaker 4: and as we were talking about racial equality and DEI

599
00:30:32,080 --> 00:30:37,320
Speaker 4: issues and gosh, we've seen so much of that progress reversed.

600
00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:39,720
Speaker 4: How do you feel about reproductive rights?

601
00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:43,240
Speaker 2: Well, it's the first Colin Oh yeah, yeah. On the

602
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:47,240
Speaker 2: Colin side, nobody wanted to work with us at first.

603
00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:50,479
Speaker 2: When I started representing Colin. Remember that Colin was one

604
00:30:50,520 --> 00:30:53,960
Speaker 2: of the first people, if not the first person Trump targeted.

605
00:30:54,320 --> 00:30:57,720
Speaker 2: Get that sob off the field. Colin lost his job.

606
00:30:57,880 --> 00:30:59,680
Speaker 2: No one would do deals with us, no one did

607
00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:01,840
Speaker 2: business with us, and Colin and I were working together.

608
00:31:01,920 --> 00:31:04,760
Speaker 2: Then then all of a sudden, everybody wanted to work

609
00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:10,000
Speaker 2: with us because Colin fought people perceived what everything was.

610
00:31:10,040 --> 00:31:12,880
Speaker 2: As Colin won, he stood up, everybody was with us.

611
00:31:13,640 --> 00:31:17,400
Speaker 2: And then people leave and then they're no longer. Oh

612
00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:21,880
Speaker 2: we can't do you know, all these corporations, all these groups, everybody.

613
00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:25,160
Speaker 4: Who wanted to invest in and get scared right, and

614
00:31:25,280 --> 00:31:26,240
Speaker 4: they they.

615
00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:29,480
Speaker 2: Were all talking about diversity Initiative, Chief, diversity off, you know,

616
00:31:29,600 --> 00:31:32,400
Speaker 2: all those things. Then they get rid of them. So

617
00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:34,560
Speaker 2: if you look at that, you think.

618
00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:37,280
Speaker 1: Who has my back?

619
00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:42,000
Speaker 2: And I think you need to as a leader, setting aside,

620
00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:44,040
Speaker 2: are you center left, are you left left or you

621
00:31:44,160 --> 00:31:47,720
Speaker 2: left left left? You just as a leader have to

622
00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:50,560
Speaker 2: say I have your back, and I've always had your back.

623
00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:53,720
Speaker 2: I'm the person who was marching with you in Bakersfield

624
00:31:54,160 --> 00:31:56,800
Speaker 2: on the streets, whether you were a Democrat or Republican,

625
00:31:56,840 --> 00:31:58,880
Speaker 2: if you lost a loved one, I was with you,

626
00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:02,560
Speaker 2: and I was fighting for you. And I'm the civil

627
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:04,680
Speaker 2: rights lawyer who was fighting for you. I was the

628
00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:07,880
Speaker 2: person there. We we have your back, and I think

629
00:32:08,040 --> 00:32:12,240
Speaker 2: that authenticity is what's most important beyond you know, how

630
00:32:12,320 --> 00:32:15,000
Speaker 2: do you describe yourself as it relates to reproductive rights.

631
00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:18,840
Speaker 2: We feel strongly that reproductive rights it's a woman's decision.

632
00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:21,520
Speaker 2: We as men get the hell out of it. It's

633
00:32:21,600 --> 00:32:25,400
Speaker 2: it's it's not for me to even think for a

634
00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:31,600
Speaker 2: moment that I should be in any way controlling, lecturing, talking,

635
00:32:31,960 --> 00:32:35,880
Speaker 2: having anything at all to intrude in the conversation you

636
00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:40,440
Speaker 2: know here, you know, And so for us women's reproductive rights,

637
00:32:40,800 --> 00:32:43,440
Speaker 2: that is sacro saying to the women men stay the

638
00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:43,800
Speaker 2: hell out.

639
00:32:44,160 --> 00:32:48,040
Speaker 4: So you, I think, are anesthetical to the current sort

640
00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:51,720
Speaker 4: of right wing media ecosystem. And I want to read

641
00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:54,680
Speaker 4: a quote from this guy named Michael Tamaski, who is

642
00:32:55,200 --> 00:32:57,640
Speaker 4: the editor of The New Republic. I interviewed him a

643
00:32:57,680 --> 00:33:02,040
Speaker 4: few days after the election and I asked him about

644
00:33:03,080 --> 00:33:06,880
Speaker 4: his essay about why Trump won and when exploring why

645
00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:10,680
Speaker 4: he did, Tamaski wrote, the answer is the right wing

646
00:33:10,840 --> 00:33:13,680
Speaker 4: media today. The right wing media Fox News and the

647
00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:17,840
Speaker 4: entire News Corp, Newsmax one American news network, the Sinclair

648
00:33:17,960 --> 00:33:22,040
Speaker 4: Network of radio and TV stations, and newspapers. iHeartMedia, not

649
00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:26,160
Speaker 4: all of iHeartMedia, normally Lyricy and the Bot Radio Network,

650
00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:30,080
Speaker 4: Christian Radio, Elon, musk X, the Huge podcast like Joe

651
00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:33,640
Speaker 4: Rogan's much More sets the news agenda in this country.

652
00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:37,120
Speaker 4: He repeated that in the next paragraph sets the news

653
00:33:37,280 --> 00:33:40,280
Speaker 4: agenda in this country, and they fed their audience as

654
00:33:40,360 --> 00:33:44,360
Speaker 4: a diet of slanted and distorted information that made it

655
00:33:44,520 --> 00:33:48,160
Speaker 4: possible for Trump to win. Before I ask you about

656
00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:51,840
Speaker 4: how this informed your decision to move forward with the

657
00:33:51,960 --> 00:33:54,840
Speaker 4: Midas Network, I'd love to hear your take on why

658
00:33:54,960 --> 00:33:58,000
Speaker 4: you think, and maybe Jordi, as a marketing person, you

659
00:33:58,120 --> 00:34:01,560
Speaker 4: have something interesting to say about this. Why has right

660
00:34:01,680 --> 00:34:06,240
Speaker 4: wing media been so incredibly effective?

661
00:34:06,560 --> 00:34:08,680
Speaker 1: Yep? I think when you go down that list, the

662
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:11,600
Speaker 1: Fox News is the Rogans, and you keep going down

663
00:34:11,640 --> 00:34:12,239
Speaker 1: and down to.

664
00:34:12,760 --> 00:34:15,160
Speaker 4: The so called manosphere and all those things.

665
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:18,160
Speaker 1: Right, there's one thing that that's really standing out to

666
00:34:18,239 --> 00:34:19,879
Speaker 1: me every time you go down through one of those

667
00:34:19,920 --> 00:34:23,560
Speaker 1: lists is who they're funded by. Billion like these billionaire

668
00:34:23,719 --> 00:34:27,680
Speaker 1: billionaire Elon Musk billionaire, Fox News, Murdoch billionaire. You go

669
00:34:27,760 --> 00:34:30,560
Speaker 1: into the Rogan sphere. I don't know his whatnot, but

670
00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:35,200
Speaker 1: but it's it's heavy funding, heavy funding and influence that

671
00:34:35,400 --> 00:34:38,680
Speaker 1: then just trickles down into that quote unquote manosphere. And

672
00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:42,000
Speaker 1: so once you get hit with you know, the Fox

673
00:34:42,080 --> 00:34:45,440
Speaker 1: News clips, it's an ecosystem that all feeds into itself

674
00:34:45,719 --> 00:34:47,960
Speaker 1: and then the algorithm takes it on your social network,

675
00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:52,040
Speaker 1: so you really can't escape it. Like it's it's consuming

676
00:34:52,160 --> 00:34:54,920
Speaker 1: in such a way that it's almost unavoidable.

677
00:34:55,640 --> 00:35:00,799
Speaker 2: People are suffering. People feel pained right now, and people

678
00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:06,400
Speaker 2: want answers about why they feel pain. They can't afford

679
00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:10,720
Speaker 2: a home, and they're seeing rich people with ten jets

680
00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:15,759
Speaker 2: and mansions and they can't afford a home. They don't

681
00:35:15,800 --> 00:35:18,279
Speaker 2: know if they're going to be able to We have

682
00:35:18,400 --> 00:35:22,439
Speaker 2: to listen to people and what they're saying democrats, People

683
00:35:22,960 --> 00:35:26,600
Speaker 2: listen to what people are actually saying to you. People

684
00:35:26,640 --> 00:35:30,680
Speaker 2: are suffering out there, and I think that they're getting

685
00:35:30,840 --> 00:35:35,400
Speaker 2: easy answers from right wing media about where they're suffering

686
00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:38,480
Speaker 2: is coming from. They're being told the immigrants are doing

687
00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:40,640
Speaker 2: it to you. They're eating your cats and your dogs,

688
00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:42,719
Speaker 2: and that sounds stupid to a lot of people. The

689
00:35:43,520 --> 00:35:46,759
Speaker 2: people want an easy answer about why they're feeling pain.

690
00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:50,879
Speaker 2: And when you can blame a marginalized community as they're

691
00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:54,360
Speaker 2: doing it, they're doing it. And then somebody comes in

692
00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:55,760
Speaker 2: and says, I'm going.

693
00:35:55,680 --> 00:35:56,719
Speaker 1: To make you rich.

694
00:35:57,560 --> 00:36:00,480
Speaker 2: I'm going to make you the richest person ever, just

695
00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:02,960
Speaker 2: like me. You're going to be so rich you're not

696
00:36:03,040 --> 00:36:04,719
Speaker 2: even going to know what to do with how rich

697
00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:10,360
Speaker 2: you are. That message resonates with people who are suffering.

698
00:36:10,760 --> 00:36:15,600
Speaker 2: It's built on fraud, but you combine the lies with

699
00:36:15,800 --> 00:36:20,120
Speaker 2: a right wing media network giving you a simple answer,

700
00:36:21,560 --> 00:36:25,279
Speaker 2: and that connects with people. Now, how do you combat it.

701
00:36:25,840 --> 00:36:28,960
Speaker 2: You have to combat it by pointing out that that's

702
00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:32,040
Speaker 2: a lie and that's a fraud. But you also have

703
00:36:32,200 --> 00:36:36,480
Speaker 2: to provide solutions, and you have to speak to people's

704
00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:41,439
Speaker 2: real human condition. You have to look somebody in the eye,

705
00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:44,239
Speaker 2: and you have to say to them, I hear you,

706
00:36:45,360 --> 00:36:48,640
Speaker 2: I listen to you, I understand what you're going through.

707
00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:52,839
Speaker 2: And that's what we could talk about the podcast Bros.

708
00:36:52,880 --> 00:36:57,840
Speaker 2: The media ecosystem, but ultimately whether this massive funding machine

709
00:36:58,360 --> 00:37:02,600
Speaker 2: they're pumping easy and by scapegoating the other and making

710
00:37:02,719 --> 00:37:05,480
Speaker 2: people understand, oh, that's why I'm going through this, and

711
00:37:05,560 --> 00:37:07,640
Speaker 2: that's not why they're going through this. They're going through

712
00:37:07,680 --> 00:37:11,200
Speaker 2: this because people like Trump and other people are the

713
00:37:11,280 --> 00:37:15,279
Speaker 2: ones doing it to them, inflicting that's what's causing it.

714
00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:19,880
Speaker 2: And they've managed to the people who are causing it,

715
00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:22,439
Speaker 2: has managed to convince the people they're inflicting the pain

716
00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:25,239
Speaker 2: on that they're helping them and they're not. And so

717
00:37:25,440 --> 00:37:30,040
Speaker 2: the antidote to that is also simple messages.

718
00:37:30,560 --> 00:37:33,160
Speaker 4: All saying messaging is so important. It hasn't it been,

719
00:37:33,239 --> 00:37:36,200
Speaker 4: because it seems to me there is sort of an

720
00:37:36,360 --> 00:37:41,640
Speaker 4: orchestrated effort to keep it simple but also to have

721
00:37:41,880 --> 00:37:47,560
Speaker 4: it kind of almost echoing throughout the whole ecosystem right

722
00:37:47,800 --> 00:37:51,000
Speaker 4: in a way that is just much more effective.

723
00:37:51,160 --> 00:37:51,320
Speaker 1: You know.

724
00:37:51,440 --> 00:37:54,920
Speaker 4: I think also people think that people are paying attention

725
00:37:55,040 --> 00:37:58,680
Speaker 4: to every little thing and they're just hearing sort of

726
00:37:59,680 --> 00:38:02,799
Speaker 4: this orchestrated effort. I'm not really making sense right now,

727
00:38:02,920 --> 00:38:06,759
Speaker 4: but I think like a lot most people aren't like us,

728
00:38:06,920 --> 00:38:10,759
Speaker 4: like reading everything, or like your guy who's watching.

729
00:38:10,480 --> 00:38:13,960
Speaker 3: The By the way, it is coordinated. And you know

730
00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:17,640
Speaker 3: those people you mentioned, they do work together, you know.

731
00:38:17,920 --> 00:38:21,239
Speaker 3: I'm sure and I've seen certain the evidence of it.

732
00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:23,200
Speaker 3: There's been stories about it as well that there are

733
00:38:23,640 --> 00:38:26,440
Speaker 3: signal chats and I message chats and various things.

734
00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:28,200
Speaker 4: This is what we're going to be, is what we're

735
00:38:28,200 --> 00:38:30,120
Speaker 4: going to talk about. The Rocket Ales used to do

736
00:38:30,239 --> 00:38:33,400
Speaker 4: that every morning off Fox News and they all distribute

737
00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:36,880
Speaker 4: a memo with talking points that every anchor had to

738
00:38:37,000 --> 00:38:37,400
Speaker 4: adhere to.

739
00:38:37,840 --> 00:38:39,759
Speaker 3: One of the things that we noticed early on, and

740
00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:41,840
Speaker 3: I feel like we were written off for it a

741
00:38:41,920 --> 00:38:45,760
Speaker 3: lot is that those conversations were starting on the Internet

742
00:38:46,280 --> 00:38:49,799
Speaker 3: and they would then permeate to legacy media. They would

743
00:38:49,800 --> 00:38:52,879
Speaker 3: then get to people's Facebook feeds. They would then get

744
00:38:52,920 --> 00:38:55,400
Speaker 3: into the conversations that people are having with one another.

745
00:38:55,719 --> 00:38:57,759
Speaker 3: But you wonder, where does this cats and dogs room,

746
00:38:57,840 --> 00:38:59,719
Speaker 3: or where does that even begin from? And you could

747
00:38:59,760 --> 00:39:02,359
Speaker 3: trace stuff like that back to an Internet post, back

748
00:39:02,440 --> 00:39:05,440
Speaker 3: to a tweet that went viral that people spoke about

749
00:39:05,680 --> 00:39:08,960
Speaker 3: and so oftentimes, because everything is so fragmented right now,

750
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:12,279
Speaker 3: you don't actually know where that information even started from,

751
00:39:12,440 --> 00:39:15,200
Speaker 3: what was the kind of match that ignited it. But

752
00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:19,120
Speaker 3: oftentimes these conversations are beginning in these spaces and then

753
00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:22,840
Speaker 3: they kind of become more mainstream and in many cases

754
00:39:22,880 --> 00:39:25,120
Speaker 3: now make their way to the President of the United States,

755
00:39:25,160 --> 00:39:27,879
Speaker 3: who lives in these spaces as well. But I think,

756
00:39:27,920 --> 00:39:30,960
Speaker 3: you know, I think it's a bit nefarious kind of

757
00:39:31,080 --> 00:39:34,200
Speaker 3: how it operates in a way, and I think folks

758
00:39:34,280 --> 00:39:36,799
Speaker 3: have learned, in my opinion, a lot of the wrong

759
00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:44,400
Speaker 3: lessons from the election. And by nefarious, I mean I

760
00:39:44,440 --> 00:39:47,279
Speaker 3: think people think like these people were created in a lab,

761
00:39:47,480 --> 00:39:50,279
Speaker 3: that you know, the MANI Sphere podcast, that these people

762
00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:55,120
Speaker 3: were created in a lab designed to spread propaganda and

763
00:39:55,360 --> 00:39:58,640
Speaker 3: spread certain lives. But to me, that's not what it is.

764
00:39:58,840 --> 00:40:01,399
Speaker 3: I think these a lot of these shows did begin

765
00:40:01,600 --> 00:40:05,160
Speaker 3: organically and they had audiences, and they connected with people

766
00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:08,279
Speaker 3: through typical you know, life things, or whether it's you know,

767
00:40:08,400 --> 00:40:14,759
Speaker 3: ultimate fighting or or weightlifting or you know, discussing a

768
00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:17,800
Speaker 3: pop culture trial or you know whatever. It may be

769
00:40:18,360 --> 00:40:21,000
Speaker 3: something that doesn't necessarily seem political, but once they have

770
00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:25,560
Speaker 3: you in they could then use that space to send

771
00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:28,160
Speaker 3: people down these other rabbit holes that I think could

772
00:40:28,200 --> 00:40:31,920
Speaker 3: be you know, kind of a bit more dangerous, I

773
00:40:32,320 --> 00:40:32,960
Speaker 3: think in that way.

774
00:40:33,120 --> 00:40:36,840
Speaker 4: So it's like a lifestyle podcast that sort of morphs

775
00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:38,239
Speaker 4: into people in it.

776
00:40:38,360 --> 00:40:41,120
Speaker 3: Then they say, Okay, now that I got you, have

777
00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:43,759
Speaker 3: you considered that the vaccine might be hurt in you?

778
00:40:43,840 --> 00:40:45,960
Speaker 3: You know, like once they get hurt of yeah, have

779
00:40:46,040 --> 00:40:47,960
Speaker 3: you heard of the and and then all of a

780
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:49,800
Speaker 3: sudden you start getting put down this path, you know.

781
00:40:49,840 --> 00:40:52,600
Speaker 3: I read an interesting article a few years ago at

782
00:40:52,640 --> 00:40:54,040
Speaker 3: this point, I think it was in the New York Times,

783
00:40:54,080 --> 00:40:56,560
Speaker 3: and it was about how the Epoch Times the Epic

784
00:40:56,640 --> 00:40:58,839
Speaker 3: Times is uh, they were.

785
00:40:59,239 --> 00:41:01,400
Speaker 4: I was shinned up that once, and I tried to

786
00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:04,759
Speaker 4: because I always like to hear what everybody's saying and

787
00:41:04,880 --> 00:41:08,480
Speaker 4: how stories are being framed. Isn't it called epochs epocket

788
00:41:08,520 --> 00:41:12,480
Speaker 4: the yacht But anyway, it's like it's like from China

789
00:41:12,560 --> 00:41:12,839
Speaker 4: or something.

790
00:41:12,880 --> 00:41:15,600
Speaker 3: Someone will correct me in the comments, and I was like,

791
00:41:16,120 --> 00:41:16,440
Speaker 3: oh my.

792
00:41:16,480 --> 00:41:20,239
Speaker 4: God, these people are insane. Stop stop stop, And they

793
00:41:20,360 --> 00:41:22,640
Speaker 4: kept sending me stuff. Finally they and so.

794
00:41:22,719 --> 00:41:25,840
Speaker 3: In this New York Times space, they analyzed how they

795
00:41:25,960 --> 00:41:29,120
Speaker 3: pulled people in with viral videos of cats and dogs,

796
00:41:29,800 --> 00:41:33,120
Speaker 3: and they would promote on Facebook videos of cute cat

797
00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:35,520
Speaker 3: videos and cute dog videos, and so they would get

798
00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:38,680
Speaker 3: people to engage with their content because they thought that

799
00:41:38,800 --> 00:41:40,920
Speaker 3: they were engaging. Oh, look at this cute cat who's

800
00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:43,440
Speaker 3: on a skateboard or you know whatever it is. Next

801
00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:46,439
Speaker 3: thing they know they're being pushed. You know, Fauci needs

802
00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:48,720
Speaker 3: to go to prison and on all this crazy stuff.

803
00:41:48,960 --> 00:41:51,160
Speaker 3: And it all started because they watched this video of

804
00:41:51,560 --> 00:41:54,000
Speaker 3: a dog on a rumba or something, you know. And

805
00:41:54,400 --> 00:41:56,480
Speaker 3: so that's what I mean by nefarius, that people could

806
00:41:56,480 --> 00:41:59,960
Speaker 3: get pulled in with things that seem benign or see

807
00:42:00,320 --> 00:42:02,680
Speaker 3: like they're you know, things that relate to their interests.

808
00:42:03,080 --> 00:42:06,040
Speaker 3: Next thing they know, they're taking down this algorithmic hell

809
00:42:06,120 --> 00:42:10,000
Speaker 3: hole and that they really can't escape from once they're in.

810
00:42:10,680 --> 00:42:12,480
Speaker 3: And so I think that's one of the kind of

811
00:42:12,600 --> 00:42:15,759
Speaker 3: dangerous spaces that we're in right now. Also, is you know,

812
00:42:15,880 --> 00:42:18,000
Speaker 3: social media is going to continue to push the at

813
00:42:18,120 --> 00:42:20,200
Speaker 3: you that you engage with and that it thinks you

814
00:42:20,320 --> 00:42:22,680
Speaker 3: want to see. And once you do a few clicks,

815
00:42:23,000 --> 00:42:26,759
Speaker 3: sometimes people get lost in these algorithms and it just

816
00:42:26,840 --> 00:42:29,360
Speaker 3: takes it consumes their life and they just kind of

817
00:42:29,520 --> 00:42:32,400
Speaker 3: lose a grip on, you know, a little bit of

818
00:42:32,520 --> 00:42:37,480
Speaker 3: normalcy and kind of even respect for other people humanity.

819
00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:39,800
Speaker 3: And I think that's kind of one of the dangerous.

820
00:42:39,480 --> 00:42:44,120
Speaker 4: Elspace programs, you to have this visceral reaction to anything

821
00:42:44,320 --> 00:42:48,239
Speaker 4: that is different than your point of view. Yeah, right.

822
00:42:48,600 --> 00:42:52,080
Speaker 4: And I know that you all say the talking point

823
00:42:52,200 --> 00:42:55,080
Speaker 4: or the conventional wisdom is like the left needs a

824
00:42:55,200 --> 00:42:57,640
Speaker 4: Joe Rogan, they need their Joe Rogan. And I know

825
00:42:57,800 --> 00:43:01,040
Speaker 4: you have all said that that's the wrong way to

826
00:43:01,160 --> 00:43:06,120
Speaker 4: look at it. But clearly, to deal with this ecosystem

827
00:43:06,200 --> 00:43:10,280
Speaker 4: that is so powerful, different points of view or even

828
00:43:11,320 --> 00:43:16,279
Speaker 4: truth right needs to have a more potent platform. So

829
00:43:17,400 --> 00:43:25,040
Speaker 4: how do you think different views or truth and everything

830
00:43:25,120 --> 00:43:30,200
Speaker 4: that's going on with the Trump administration gets out there

831
00:43:30,440 --> 00:43:32,440
Speaker 4: and explain to people? And do you worry that you're

832
00:43:32,520 --> 00:43:34,360
Speaker 4: kind of preaching to the choir? I know it just

833
00:43:34,400 --> 00:43:37,200
Speaker 4: asks like twelve questions in one, but how do you

834
00:43:37,320 --> 00:43:38,080
Speaker 4: do that well?

835
00:43:38,200 --> 00:43:41,080
Speaker 2: On the preaching to the choir? I always ask this

836
00:43:41,239 --> 00:43:45,160
Speaker 2: question when people, and I ask about Fox and I said,

837
00:43:45,200 --> 00:43:48,359
Speaker 2: do you think that Fox News is preaching to the choir?

838
00:43:48,440 --> 00:43:50,160
Speaker 2: I say, raise your hand, if you think Fox News

839
00:43:50,200 --> 00:43:54,080
Speaker 2: preaches to the choir, and usually in my group, everybody

840
00:43:54,800 --> 00:43:56,560
Speaker 2: raises their hand and says, of course, they're preaching to

841
00:43:56,600 --> 00:43:58,800
Speaker 2: a right wing choir. I go, do you think Fox

842
00:43:58,920 --> 00:44:03,760
Speaker 2: is one of the more powerful forces in politics in general? Okay,

843
00:44:03,800 --> 00:44:06,239
Speaker 2: so they're preaching to the choir. You don't view that

844
00:44:06,440 --> 00:44:09,640
Speaker 2: as a negative, right right? Okay, Well, what if your

845
00:44:09,760 --> 00:44:13,440
Speaker 2: choir just needs to sing louder than the other choir?

846
00:44:13,560 --> 00:44:15,640
Speaker 2: What if you just need a choir to begin with.

847
00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:18,759
Speaker 2: What if your choir doesn't believe you're a good conductor,

848
00:44:19,560 --> 00:44:22,320
Speaker 2: you should first be a good conductor of your own choir.

849
00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:24,800
Speaker 2: This is going back to what I said before, and

850
00:44:25,040 --> 00:44:28,440
Speaker 2: ensure that your choir knows that you're actually their conductor

851
00:44:29,160 --> 00:44:32,560
Speaker 2: and that you're fighting for your choir. So I think

852
00:44:32,680 --> 00:44:34,759
Speaker 2: that whether you want to say it is the Democrats

853
00:44:34,840 --> 00:44:38,759
Speaker 2: or whoever, I think that one of the problems has

854
00:44:38,840 --> 00:44:43,200
Speaker 2: been that the choir needed to be preached to a

855
00:44:43,239 --> 00:44:45,520
Speaker 2: little bit from an authentic position and saying we're here

856
00:44:45,560 --> 00:44:48,440
Speaker 2: with you, we're fighting for you, and then you can

857
00:44:48,520 --> 00:44:52,200
Speaker 2: start to build and grow because I think other people

858
00:44:52,320 --> 00:44:55,759
Speaker 2: start to see, wait a minute, that makes sense.

859
00:44:55,920 --> 00:44:57,680
Speaker 4: Your choir needed a church to go to.

860
00:44:59,160 --> 00:45:03,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, and to me when you're building, do

861
00:45:03,239 --> 00:45:07,319
Speaker 2: you want to model that on a choir built upon

862
00:45:07,520 --> 00:45:11,560
Speaker 2: values that you don't think are helpful? And this goes

863
00:45:11,600 --> 00:45:13,399
Speaker 2: to your Rogan question. I'm going to tie it all together,

864
00:45:13,400 --> 00:45:15,520
Speaker 2: you know, but you know, but do you want to

865
00:45:15,600 --> 00:45:18,239
Speaker 2: then say we should be like that? Well, you're going

866
00:45:18,280 --> 00:45:20,479
Speaker 2: to start losing people in your choir if you're saying

867
00:45:20,800 --> 00:45:23,640
Speaker 2: I want to start acting that way, because then they're

868
00:45:23,640 --> 00:45:26,839
Speaker 2: going to go, WHOA, what do you mean? I don't

869
00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:30,840
Speaker 2: like the way they're treating, marginalizing. I don't like the

870
00:45:30,880 --> 00:45:33,399
Speaker 2: way they're bullying. I don't like the way that they're

871
00:45:33,480 --> 00:45:34,719
Speaker 2: making a mockery of women.

872
00:45:34,800 --> 00:45:35,320
Speaker 1: I don't like that.

873
00:45:35,760 --> 00:45:37,839
Speaker 2: So why do you want to be like that? Huh?

874
00:45:38,520 --> 00:45:38,560
Speaker 3: No?

875
00:45:38,719 --> 00:45:41,520
Speaker 2: I think that they just want to see you say

876
00:45:41,640 --> 00:45:43,480
Speaker 2: this is what I believe in. I give you an example.

877
00:45:43,920 --> 00:45:46,040
Speaker 2: Andy Basheer, governor of Kentucky, got.

878
00:45:46,120 --> 00:45:50,440
Speaker 4: Reviewed him on Friday. Oh my god, he is I mean,

879
00:45:50,560 --> 00:45:53,440
Speaker 4: talk about wholesome at all Americas. It's like out of

880
00:45:53,520 --> 00:45:56,200
Speaker 4: central casts like Andy Basheer.

881
00:45:55,960 --> 00:46:01,359
Speaker 2: Rush Chairman, Democratic governor.

882
00:46:01,440 --> 00:46:04,280
Speaker 4: Sixty eight percent approvement right in sixty in Kentucky.

883
00:46:04,880 --> 00:46:08,879
Speaker 2: He doesn't say I'm not for LGBTQ, right, he says

884
00:46:08,920 --> 00:46:12,560
Speaker 2: the opposite. He vetoes any bill that comes his way

885
00:46:12,960 --> 00:46:16,040
Speaker 2: that's anti LGBTQ, and he's then he does a press

886
00:46:16,120 --> 00:46:18,680
Speaker 2: conference and he'll say, this is why I'm vetoing it.

887
00:46:18,920 --> 00:46:21,920
Speaker 2: We need to treat all human beings with respect. And

888
00:46:22,000 --> 00:46:26,120
Speaker 2: they respect him in Kentucky for doing that. So to me,

889
00:46:26,320 --> 00:46:29,200
Speaker 2: if he can do that in Kentucky, we should be

890
00:46:29,239 --> 00:46:32,120
Speaker 2: able to do that everywhere else. And to me, that's

891
00:46:32,160 --> 00:46:34,720
Speaker 2: a great example. I was so impressed in the interview

892
00:46:34,760 --> 00:46:36,880
Speaker 2: I did with him where he conveyed, you know, that

893
00:46:37,000 --> 00:46:40,400
Speaker 2: message to me. So there's that, and then there's what

894
00:46:40,560 --> 00:46:43,000
Speaker 2: Senator Bernie Sanders said to me, which is that the

895
00:46:43,160 --> 00:46:48,200
Speaker 2: most important issues are sometimes the least discussed. And that's true.

896
00:46:48,280 --> 00:46:51,040
Speaker 2: You know, people aren't talking about the issues that actually

897
00:46:51,520 --> 00:46:54,360
Speaker 2: impact us the most, whether that's housing, whether that's healthcare,

898
00:46:54,640 --> 00:46:58,800
Speaker 2: whether it's education, whether it's you know, living paycheck to paycheck,

899
00:46:58,840 --> 00:47:01,279
Speaker 2: and all of these issues are not being discussed, So

900
00:47:01,440 --> 00:47:04,360
Speaker 2: we should discuss them. So to me, in terms of

901
00:47:04,880 --> 00:47:08,880
Speaker 2: building what our version of what's going on on the

902
00:47:08,960 --> 00:47:11,480
Speaker 2: other side should be, I think it's obvious we should

903
00:47:12,000 --> 00:47:14,640
Speaker 2: make sure our choir sings louder, and we should be

904
00:47:14,719 --> 00:47:18,840
Speaker 2: focusing on the issues and actually occupy a lot of

905
00:47:18,920 --> 00:47:23,080
Speaker 2: the mental space in Americans' minds, but are filled with conspiracies,

906
00:47:23,480 --> 00:47:25,560
Speaker 2: and we should fill it with the truth and solutions.

907
00:47:25,800 --> 00:47:29,560
Speaker 4: And what is the reaction among say, people who are

908
00:47:29,640 --> 00:47:33,520
Speaker 4: more conservative, you know, because everyone's all over the place

909
00:47:33,560 --> 00:47:37,640
Speaker 4: and you see like working class folks who supported Donald Trump.

910
00:47:38,080 --> 00:47:40,480
Speaker 4: But if you're tackling the issues they care about, do

911
00:47:40,560 --> 00:47:43,920
Speaker 4: you find that they are gravitating towards your platform?

912
00:47:44,760 --> 00:47:46,000
Speaker 1: Yeah? I mean, look or not.

913
00:47:47,000 --> 00:47:51,480
Speaker 2: I think I'll say this, whether they're gravitating or not gravitating.

914
00:47:52,600 --> 00:47:57,040
Speaker 2: I'm confident that the views and values I stand behind them.

915
00:47:57,160 --> 00:47:59,320
Speaker 2: I stand on business and I stand behind them. And

916
00:47:59,400 --> 00:48:03,279
Speaker 2: I'm confident that that's the approach that will. You know,

917
00:48:04,080 --> 00:48:08,840
Speaker 2: I'm not trying to chase people and beg them to

918
00:48:09,480 --> 00:48:12,600
Speaker 2: be good people. I simply want to let them know

919
00:48:13,040 --> 00:48:16,960
Speaker 2: that here's a place where we feel very strongly about

920
00:48:17,000 --> 00:48:21,080
Speaker 2: these things. There's a massive community now with millions of

921
00:48:21,120 --> 00:48:23,960
Speaker 2: people who watch this. Join it if you want to

922
00:48:24,040 --> 00:48:26,200
Speaker 2: join it, don't join it if you don't want to

923
00:48:26,320 --> 00:48:29,279
Speaker 2: join it. But we are, we are here, and we're

924
00:48:29,320 --> 00:48:30,800
Speaker 2: standing the struggle what we believe.

925
00:48:30,600 --> 00:48:31,520
Speaker 1: And so I don't.

926
00:48:32,120 --> 00:48:35,320
Speaker 2: I don't it may sound I don't occupy myself so

927
00:48:35,440 --> 00:48:38,359
Speaker 2: much thinking about you know, I'm really hoping that I've

928
00:48:38,520 --> 00:48:42,640
Speaker 2: just changed, you know, mister Maga's mind and made him

929
00:48:42,680 --> 00:48:45,920
Speaker 2: into a mister Midas like I. If they want to

930
00:48:45,960 --> 00:48:50,279
Speaker 2: live in their rage algorithm, they want if they want

931
00:48:50,320 --> 00:48:52,839
Speaker 2: to live in there, Remitas mighty the best. Yeah, if

932
00:48:52,840 --> 00:48:54,839
Speaker 2: they want to live in their rage algorithm, then that's

933
00:48:54,840 --> 00:48:57,200
Speaker 2: where they could live, you know, but they should know

934
00:48:57,280 --> 00:48:59,919
Speaker 2: that there's other places where we're going to talk about

935
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:03,680
Speaker 2: the issues in an impactful, logical smart way, and then

936
00:49:03,760 --> 00:49:06,719
Speaker 2: we're going to layer that with some positivity to day.

937
00:49:06,920 --> 00:49:10,680
Speaker 4: Do you feel that this whole kind of opposite views

938
00:49:11,080 --> 00:49:14,680
Speaker 4: of you know, the Foxes of the world are in

939
00:49:14,880 --> 00:49:19,040
Speaker 4: aggregate gaining traction. You have, for example, pot Save America,

940
00:49:19,200 --> 00:49:22,760
Speaker 4: have Currenter Newsroom. You have a lot of these digital

941
00:49:23,760 --> 00:49:27,040
Speaker 4: companies networks. Honestly, I know you call yourself a network,

942
00:49:27,080 --> 00:49:31,799
Speaker 4: but their networks too kind of rising up and creating

943
00:49:32,080 --> 00:49:38,000
Speaker 4: a force field that is, you know, bumping up against

944
00:49:38,640 --> 00:49:41,200
Speaker 4: this other huge ecosystem.

945
00:49:41,719 --> 00:49:43,640
Speaker 2: I just give you the data quickly, you know, from

946
00:49:43,680 --> 00:49:47,480
Speaker 2: our network three hundred and fifty million or so YouTube

947
00:49:47,560 --> 00:49:48,680
Speaker 2: views every single month.

948
00:49:48,800 --> 00:49:49,760
Speaker 4: I'm very jealous.

949
00:49:49,800 --> 00:49:52,040
Speaker 1: So that's more more.

950
00:49:52,120 --> 00:49:53,840
Speaker 4: We're all like, what's going on?

951
00:49:54,560 --> 00:49:57,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, but that's more on a day to day basis

952
00:49:57,120 --> 00:49:59,799
Speaker 2: on digital and I think we all agree things are

953
00:50:00,080 --> 00:50:04,919
Speaker 2: moving digital. So the cable news wants to go more digital.

954
00:50:04,760 --> 00:50:07,560
Speaker 4: Right So there and there in our forever, I was like,

955
00:50:07,719 --> 00:50:09,120
Speaker 4: what is wrong with you people?

956
00:50:09,239 --> 00:50:12,239
Speaker 2: But anyway go so on that platform, the Mightas Touched

957
00:50:12,320 --> 00:50:14,560
Speaker 2: Network on a day to day basis, and some days

958
00:50:15,120 --> 00:50:17,040
Speaker 2: Fox beats us, but on a day to day basis,

959
00:50:17,080 --> 00:50:20,319
Speaker 2: we'll get more views than Fox on YouTube and then

960
00:50:20,440 --> 00:50:23,600
Speaker 2: seeing an MSNBC and all the rest, Mightas Touch Network

961
00:50:23,880 --> 00:50:26,960
Speaker 2: will beat those. We're the fastest growing substack right now

962
00:50:27,400 --> 00:50:28,759
Speaker 2: of all substacks.

963
00:50:28,280 --> 00:50:31,080
Speaker 4: Out there, substack after Memorial Day.

964
00:50:31,000 --> 00:50:34,480
Speaker 1: So we should do that would be fun and we love.

965
00:50:34,360 --> 00:50:36,080
Speaker 4: Subjects that we're all such good.

966
00:50:36,000 --> 00:50:41,560
Speaker 2: For exactly exactly and then you know, across and then

967
00:50:41,680 --> 00:50:45,680
Speaker 2: on the podcast downloads themselves. Uh, Jordy showed me the

968
00:50:45,800 --> 00:50:48,839
Speaker 2: data today. So in the last month, the Mightas Touch

969
00:50:48,960 --> 00:50:53,840
Speaker 2: Network beat Rogan Tucker, Carlson, Candae Owens, Charlie Kirk, and

970
00:50:53,920 --> 00:50:57,880
Speaker 2: Ben Shapiro all combined for the month of for the

971
00:50:57,960 --> 00:51:02,040
Speaker 2: last month, they do so in terms of in terms

972
00:51:02,120 --> 00:51:05,279
Speaker 2: of growth. You know, I think that that, you know,

973
00:51:05,400 --> 00:51:09,839
Speaker 2: that shows that there is an appetite for this out there,

974
00:51:10,320 --> 00:51:13,600
Speaker 2: and I think that, you know, we got to preach

975
00:51:13,640 --> 00:51:16,439
Speaker 2: to that choir, you know, and expand it. But let's

976
00:51:16,440 --> 00:51:18,680
Speaker 2: start also with fortifying the choir and let them know

977
00:51:18,760 --> 00:51:19,919
Speaker 2: we care about them. Yeah.

978
00:51:27,480 --> 00:51:29,879
Speaker 4: Hi, everyone, it's me Katie Couric. You know, if you've

979
00:51:29,880 --> 00:51:32,600
Speaker 4: been following me on social media, you know I love

980
00:51:32,719 --> 00:51:35,800
Speaker 4: to cook, or at least try, especially alongside some of

981
00:51:35,880 --> 00:51:39,600
Speaker 4: my favorite chefs and foodies like Benny Blanco, Jake Cohen,

982
00:51:39,719 --> 00:51:44,080
Speaker 4: Lighty Hoyke, Alison Roman, and Ininagarten. So I started a

983
00:51:44,160 --> 00:51:47,680
Speaker 4: free newsletter called good Taste to share recipes, tips and

984
00:51:47,840 --> 00:51:51,960
Speaker 4: kitchen mustaves. Just sign up at Katiecuric dot com slash

985
00:51:52,160 --> 00:51:55,080
Speaker 4: good Taste. That's k A T I E C O

986
00:51:55,320 --> 00:51:58,880
Speaker 4: U R I C dot com slash good Taste. I

987
00:51:59,080 --> 00:52:11,359
Speaker 4: promise your taste buds will be happy you did. I'm

988
00:52:11,480 --> 00:52:15,279
Speaker 4: curious because I've struggled with this as someone who you

989
00:52:15,400 --> 00:52:18,440
Speaker 4: grew up watching, I'm sure, and it started in very

990
00:52:18,560 --> 00:52:24,000
Speaker 4: traditional mainstream media now pointing out the facts and what

991
00:52:24,400 --> 00:52:29,400
Speaker 4: is really happening is automatically interpreted as being biased, right,

992
00:52:30,120 --> 00:52:34,600
Speaker 4: And of course I think there's no such thing as

993
00:52:34,680 --> 00:52:38,640
Speaker 4: true objectivity. But having said that, you know, I really

994
00:52:38,719 --> 00:52:42,400
Speaker 4: struggle with that, and many people say, listen, the rules

995
00:52:42,480 --> 00:52:46,600
Speaker 4: have changed. It's okay to say you support trans people.

996
00:52:46,840 --> 00:52:50,240
Speaker 4: It's okay that you say I am one hundred percent

997
00:52:50,360 --> 00:52:54,160
Speaker 4: for reproductive rights. You know, all these things that honestly,

998
00:52:54,280 --> 00:52:58,440
Speaker 4: as personally I hold dear, but professionally I've been trained

999
00:52:58,840 --> 00:53:01,279
Speaker 4: to not share that. I'm curious if you think sort

1000
00:53:01,320 --> 00:53:07,960
Speaker 4: of old fashioned, semi objective, knowing that pure objectivity is impossible,

1001
00:53:08,480 --> 00:53:12,440
Speaker 4: that kind of journalism still has a place in the culture,

1002
00:53:12,680 --> 00:53:15,560
Speaker 4: or is it simply you know, the seventy five and

1003
00:53:15,760 --> 00:53:19,040
Speaker 4: up people who are watching the network evening newscasts.

1004
00:53:19,920 --> 00:53:22,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I certainly think it's still as a place.

1005
00:53:22,440 --> 00:53:24,400
Speaker 3: But at the same time, I think everything is so

1006
00:53:24,640 --> 00:53:27,920
Speaker 3: fragmented now that I think such a large portion of

1007
00:53:28,040 --> 00:53:32,000
Speaker 3: the audience are going to places that share a point

1008
00:53:32,040 --> 00:53:35,520
Speaker 3: of view. And I think, you know, I think if

1009
00:53:35,600 --> 00:53:37,960
Speaker 3: we just did a report that is this happened, then

1010
00:53:37,960 --> 00:53:40,960
Speaker 3: this happened, then this happened, then this happened. I mean,

1011
00:53:41,080 --> 00:53:44,120
Speaker 3: there's there's plenty of places where people you know, could find.

1012
00:53:44,239 --> 00:53:47,360
Speaker 4: Not you know, really I mean fewer and fewer, right, right, Yeah, But.

1013
00:53:47,680 --> 00:53:49,719
Speaker 3: I think I think the key thing that we do

1014
00:53:50,000 --> 00:53:52,360
Speaker 3: is connect the dots on all those things. And I

1015
00:53:52,440 --> 00:53:54,640
Speaker 3: think when you're able to weave it into a story

1016
00:53:54,800 --> 00:53:56,879
Speaker 3: and actually connect the dots, I think that's what people

1017
00:53:57,040 --> 00:54:01,440
Speaker 3: want to be able to gain clarity on because I think,

1018
00:54:01,680 --> 00:54:03,520
Speaker 3: as as we've kind of been saying, there's so much

1019
00:54:03,640 --> 00:54:05,960
Speaker 3: information out there that in order to be able to

1020
00:54:06,280 --> 00:54:09,160
Speaker 3: digest it and has to be presented, you know, I

1021
00:54:09,280 --> 00:54:12,840
Speaker 3: think in many ways, you know, in certain ways just

1022
00:54:12,920 --> 00:54:16,680
Speaker 3: to make it clear from even just a storytelling perspective,

1023
00:54:16,760 --> 00:54:19,840
Speaker 3: so people get how how does a tariff affect you know,

1024
00:54:20,120 --> 00:54:23,000
Speaker 3: their you know, their business or the price they're going

1025
00:54:23,080 --> 00:54:24,960
Speaker 3: to pay for goods, you know, and how does this

1026
00:54:25,040 --> 00:54:27,400
Speaker 3: affect their medication and their family? Like I think, you

1027
00:54:27,520 --> 00:54:28,839
Speaker 3: just I think you need to be able to tie

1028
00:54:28,880 --> 00:54:31,040
Speaker 3: it all together in a way, and whether people think

1029
00:54:31,080 --> 00:54:33,800
Speaker 3: it's biased or not when you're speaking on those issues,

1030
00:54:34,320 --> 00:54:35,640
Speaker 3: to me, I think you just need to put that

1031
00:54:35,719 --> 00:54:37,879
Speaker 3: aside because now we live in a time when people

1032
00:54:37,920 --> 00:54:40,080
Speaker 3: are going to comment on on everything, right, Like I said,

1033
00:54:40,160 --> 00:54:42,480
Speaker 3: and people are going to comment I mispronounced something. We'll

1034
00:54:42,480 --> 00:54:44,560
Speaker 3: get a comment, right, it's it's there's going to be

1035
00:54:44,600 --> 00:54:47,480
Speaker 3: a comment about everything. You have to almost bake that

1036
00:54:47,680 --> 00:54:50,960
Speaker 3: into what you're doing, in my opinion, and just be you,

1037
00:54:50,960 --> 00:54:54,000
Speaker 3: you know, and and and and let the chips fall

1038
00:54:54,000 --> 00:54:55,840
Speaker 3: where they may. I think the biggest thing that you

1039
00:54:55,920 --> 00:54:58,280
Speaker 3: need to do, though, is be authentic, you know, to yourself.

1040
00:54:58,360 --> 00:55:01,240
Speaker 3: And I think people could smell bullshit from a mile away.

1041
00:55:02,000 --> 00:55:04,239
Speaker 3: And that's why I think when after the twenty twenty

1042
00:55:04,280 --> 00:55:06,320
Speaker 3: four election, when there were so many I feel like

1043
00:55:06,360 --> 00:55:10,960
Speaker 3: I saw so many democratic politicians and people in media

1044
00:55:11,160 --> 00:55:14,000
Speaker 3: and podcasts and you name it, to all the sudden,

1045
00:55:14,400 --> 00:55:16,920
Speaker 3: everything I thought they believed in and the communities that

1046
00:55:16,960 --> 00:55:18,799
Speaker 3: I thought they supported, all of a sudden they seem

1047
00:55:18,840 --> 00:55:21,359
Speaker 3: to be backtracking on that. Maybe we focused a little

1048
00:55:21,400 --> 00:55:23,719
Speaker 3: too much on inclusivity, Maybe we focused a little too

1049
00:55:23,800 --> 00:55:27,799
Speaker 3: much on reproductive rights. And when you try to kind

1050
00:55:27,840 --> 00:55:31,400
Speaker 3: of shape your opinions based around public poland.

1051
00:55:31,160 --> 00:55:33,960
Speaker 4: Right and kind of like were the wind driving is

1052
00:55:34,080 --> 00:55:37,680
Speaker 4: the DEI people who when it was cool, it was great,

1053
00:55:37,800 --> 00:55:39,680
Speaker 4: and now they're like, what what does that stand for?

1054
00:55:39,960 --> 00:55:43,040
Speaker 3: Yeah? And so how do I trust you with anything,

1055
00:55:43,320 --> 00:55:46,960
Speaker 3: and I don't. I's speaking of mister Maga, Missus Midas

1056
00:55:47,000 --> 00:55:48,879
Speaker 3: whatever we were talking about before. You know, I don't

1057
00:55:48,920 --> 00:55:51,320
Speaker 3: think you're gonna win. You know, the mister Maga is

1058
00:55:51,360 --> 00:55:53,760
Speaker 3: not going to vote for you because you have those beliefs.

1059
00:55:53,760 --> 00:55:55,960
Speaker 3: They're going to vote for the Maga guy. Okay, they're

1060
00:55:56,000 --> 00:55:58,360
Speaker 3: not going to come around. They may say they respect

1061
00:55:58,400 --> 00:56:00,279
Speaker 3: you more or something. You know, you're not get in

1062
00:56:00,280 --> 00:56:04,000
Speaker 3: their vote, I assure you. And you're just alienating your choir,

1063
00:56:04,120 --> 00:56:06,520
Speaker 3: as we were speaking about before, and you're angering the

1064
00:56:06,600 --> 00:56:10,480
Speaker 3: people who you've built trust with because you violated that trust.

1065
00:56:10,600 --> 00:56:13,239
Speaker 3: So I think right now, and I think whether you're

1066
00:56:13,920 --> 00:56:17,600
Speaker 3: Miightas Touched or whether you're Joe Rogan or you name it,

1067
00:56:18,160 --> 00:56:21,720
Speaker 3: I think the most important thing is that you're authentic

1068
00:56:21,920 --> 00:56:24,759
Speaker 3: to your audience and that people trust the things that

1069
00:56:24,840 --> 00:56:27,479
Speaker 3: you are saying and know where you are coming from,

1070
00:56:27,880 --> 00:56:30,160
Speaker 3: and know that tomorrow, if a poll comes out that

1071
00:56:30,280 --> 00:56:32,640
Speaker 3: says this big thing you've been pushing may not be

1072
00:56:32,760 --> 00:56:34,520
Speaker 3: super popular right now, that you're not all of a

1073
00:56:34,560 --> 00:56:37,800
Speaker 3: sudden going to just change your beliefs, you know, based

1074
00:56:37,880 --> 00:56:41,200
Speaker 3: on it. And I mean that's that's my thought on that.

1075
00:56:41,320 --> 00:56:42,920
Speaker 3: I think you know, one of the things I could

1076
00:56:42,920 --> 00:56:44,520
Speaker 3: say about Donald Trump. I'm not trying to say anything

1077
00:56:44,600 --> 00:56:46,480
Speaker 3: nice about the guy right now, but one of the

1078
00:56:46,520 --> 00:56:48,520
Speaker 3: things I could say is I think he's pushed forward

1079
00:56:48,560 --> 00:56:51,480
Speaker 3: a lot with things that are incredibly unpopular, and then

1080
00:56:51,520 --> 00:56:54,120
Speaker 3: he's taken his people kind of on that journey with

1081
00:56:54,200 --> 00:56:56,080
Speaker 3: him going way back. I mean, remember he was being

1082
00:56:56,200 --> 00:57:00,439
Speaker 3: laughed at at these debates and the White House dinner.

1083
00:57:00,560 --> 00:57:03,440
Speaker 3: I mean, everyone is making a mockery of him, but

1084
00:57:03,560 --> 00:57:05,960
Speaker 3: he pushed forward and he tried to make the case

1085
00:57:06,040 --> 00:57:07,600
Speaker 3: to bring people to his side.

1086
00:57:07,840 --> 00:57:10,239
Speaker 4: He is a marketing genius, don't you think Geordie in

1087
00:57:10,280 --> 00:57:10,760
Speaker 4: a way.

1088
00:57:14,640 --> 00:57:16,959
Speaker 2: I would say he's a Ponzi schemer and a fraud.

1089
00:57:17,200 --> 00:57:19,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, a good characters.

1090
00:57:20,040 --> 00:57:22,600
Speaker 4: I mean you can think dialectically he can be all

1091
00:57:22,680 --> 00:57:23,480
Speaker 4: those things, can't he.

1092
00:57:24,160 --> 00:57:25,960
Speaker 1: I mean, was Bernie made Off a good marketer?

1093
00:57:27,560 --> 00:57:29,800
Speaker 4: Well, I think he's very I think he was very

1094
00:57:30,240 --> 00:57:33,040
Speaker 4: I don't think he had a public persona that was

1095
00:57:33,240 --> 00:57:36,320
Speaker 4: charismatic and got people to buy what he was selling.

1096
00:57:36,440 --> 00:57:38,640
Speaker 4: I mean he did have a small group, right, but

1097
00:57:39,320 --> 00:57:40,880
Speaker 4: I don't know just on a well, we don't have

1098
00:57:40,960 --> 00:57:41,360
Speaker 4: to get.

1099
00:57:43,560 --> 00:57:45,880
Speaker 1: I think what Bro was saying though, too about audiences

1100
00:57:46,080 --> 00:57:49,560
Speaker 1: these days, and it's a marketing buzzword authenticity. I know

1101
00:57:49,600 --> 00:57:50,800
Speaker 1: I used to say it a lot back in my

1102
00:57:50,880 --> 00:57:54,480
Speaker 1: marketing days, but genuinely, I think people are viewing what

1103
00:57:54,560 --> 00:57:57,480
Speaker 1: we're doing here at the maas Touch Network as absolutely authentic.

1104
00:57:57,600 --> 00:57:59,440
Speaker 1: You know, with three brothers, we don't try and be

1105
00:57:59,480 --> 00:58:01,680
Speaker 1: anything that we're not right. We rely on Ben for

1106
00:58:01,880 --> 00:58:04,360
Speaker 1: the legal, Bred for the digital, and Me for the marketing,

1107
00:58:04,520 --> 00:58:07,160
Speaker 1: and then we bring in experts in specific spaces that

1108
00:58:07,240 --> 00:58:09,800
Speaker 1: could speak to issues that we're not experts in. Yeah,

1109
00:58:09,920 --> 00:58:12,360
Speaker 1: and we don't pretend that we're experts in, but we

1110
00:58:12,520 --> 00:58:15,439
Speaker 1: have a clear value set of you know, right or wrong.

1111
00:58:15,960 --> 00:58:18,440
Speaker 1: And if those lean more democratic, well, I think that

1112
00:58:18,560 --> 00:58:20,480
Speaker 1: tells you kind of where we are as a country,

1113
00:58:20,560 --> 00:58:23,760
Speaker 1: as a society, and we just stand behind it wholeheartedly,

1114
00:58:24,280 --> 00:58:26,000
Speaker 1: and I think people like that. I think that's what

1115
00:58:26,320 --> 00:58:27,200
Speaker 1: folks are gravitating.

1116
00:58:27,280 --> 00:58:29,160
Speaker 3: By the way, that's not to say that your ideas

1117
00:58:29,240 --> 00:58:31,840
Speaker 3: cannot evolve, that you cannot change your opinions. I think

1118
00:58:31,920 --> 00:58:34,760
Speaker 3: certainly you can. And I don't think your beliefs that

1119
00:58:34,880 --> 00:58:37,120
Speaker 3: you had at age eighteen have to be the beliefs

1120
00:58:37,160 --> 00:58:39,520
Speaker 3: that you have at age fifty. You know, I think

1121
00:58:39,600 --> 00:58:42,960
Speaker 3: that evolution is a part of life. Exploring new ideas,

1122
00:58:43,080 --> 00:58:45,760
Speaker 3: engaging with them, changing your mind is a part of life.

1123
00:58:45,800 --> 00:58:49,600
Speaker 3: But I think people to your point, know when you go, oh,

1124
00:58:50,160 --> 00:58:52,440
Speaker 3: this poll came out yesterday, and all of a sudden,

1125
00:58:52,560 --> 00:58:55,960
Speaker 3: I maybe I shouldn't support transgender people so much. Maybe

1126
00:58:56,000 --> 00:58:58,600
Speaker 3: I shouldn't support you know, diversity, Maybe I shouldn't support

1127
00:58:58,640 --> 00:59:02,040
Speaker 3: reproductive rights. People see right through that wrap, you know,

1128
00:59:02,240 --> 00:59:04,160
Speaker 3: and then they go, you know, they go, this person,

1129
00:59:04,160 --> 00:59:06,080
Speaker 3: you're okay, So you're just a fraud. How do I

1130
00:59:06,160 --> 00:59:08,480
Speaker 3: trust that anything else you're telling me right now? How

1131
00:59:08,520 --> 00:59:10,080
Speaker 3: do I know you're being honest about that? What if

1132
00:59:10,120 --> 00:59:12,720
Speaker 3: tomorrow you know some other politician one that was the

1133
00:59:12,760 --> 00:59:14,400
Speaker 3: opposite of that, and then all of a sudden you're

1134
00:59:14,880 --> 00:59:17,280
Speaker 3: switching your beliefs on that too, Like how do you

1135
00:59:17,440 --> 00:59:20,440
Speaker 3: trust somebody you know who's sort of a shape shifter

1136
00:59:20,720 --> 00:59:23,240
Speaker 3: like that? And I think it's important to not view,

1137
00:59:23,560 --> 00:59:26,680
Speaker 3: you know, as you go from election to election or

1138
00:59:27,120 --> 00:59:30,080
Speaker 3: you know, issue to issue, whatever it is, that you

1139
00:59:30,240 --> 00:59:33,280
Speaker 3: don't just change with the way the wind is blowing,

1140
00:59:33,360 --> 00:59:35,800
Speaker 3: but that you are staying true through those moments, and

1141
00:59:35,920 --> 00:59:38,320
Speaker 3: that you're sticking up for your beliefs cuse I think

1142
00:59:38,360 --> 00:59:41,320
Speaker 3: at least you know, at least people will respect.

1143
00:59:41,000 --> 00:59:45,000
Speaker 4: You right and giving them facts and data that actually

1144
00:59:45,160 --> 00:59:49,240
Speaker 4: reinforces your position. I think that's really critical. Just a

1145
00:59:49,320 --> 00:59:51,040
Speaker 4: few more questions. I could talk to you guys for

1146
00:59:51,240 --> 00:59:54,040
Speaker 4: hours a lot to do it over feer sometimes, please,

1147
00:59:54,240 --> 00:59:57,680
Speaker 4: but I'd love to know, just sort of logistically, selfishly

1148
00:59:57,880 --> 01:00:00,840
Speaker 4: a little about the secret sauce that has made you

1149
01:00:01,120 --> 01:00:04,800
Speaker 4: so successful. You guys have hired a bunch of different

1150
01:00:05,240 --> 01:00:08,400
Speaker 4: It's interesting. I didn't realize Michael Cohen was part of

1151
01:00:08,480 --> 01:00:11,120
Speaker 4: your network, you know, the former Trump Trump lawyer, But

1152
01:00:11,640 --> 01:00:14,840
Speaker 4: you have hired a lot of different people. You have correspondence,

1153
01:00:14,920 --> 01:00:17,800
Speaker 4: but you also have sort of what might traditionally be

1154
01:00:17,920 --> 01:00:21,440
Speaker 4: called pundits. Do you ever feel like you've got too

1155
01:00:21,560 --> 01:00:24,800
Speaker 4: much content that's coming out or how do you kind

1156
01:00:24,840 --> 01:00:26,400
Speaker 4: of organize what you're doing.

1157
01:00:26,920 --> 01:00:29,440
Speaker 2: So we've taken the twenty four hour cable news cycle

1158
01:00:29,480 --> 01:00:32,640
Speaker 2: and we've tried to deconstruct it. So whereas a twenty

1159
01:00:32,680 --> 01:00:36,600
Speaker 2: four hour cable news cycle, you'll have how many stories

1160
01:00:36,640 --> 01:00:38,880
Speaker 2: in a given day, five to seven that are on

1161
01:00:39,040 --> 01:00:42,160
Speaker 2: repeat every day. So we try to take those five

1162
01:00:42,280 --> 01:00:45,080
Speaker 2: to seven stories that and I don't watch what cable

1163
01:00:45,160 --> 01:00:47,520
Speaker 2: news is those five to seven We program it based

1164
01:00:47,560 --> 01:00:50,439
Speaker 2: on what we think are the most important, say seven

1165
01:00:50,480 --> 01:00:53,040
Speaker 2: to ten stories of the day, and then that becomes

1166
01:00:53,120 --> 01:00:57,680
Speaker 2: basically ten to twelve YouTube videos you know, every day

1167
01:00:57,840 --> 01:00:59,720
Speaker 2: from you know, and they're all.

1168
01:00:59,520 --> 01:01:02,800
Speaker 4: Your different contributors, right because you do some right and

1169
01:01:03,440 --> 01:01:07,000
Speaker 4: do do I'll do yes, I see you too, Jordan.

1170
01:01:07,400 --> 01:01:08,439
Speaker 4: Every now every now.

1171
01:01:08,600 --> 01:01:11,160
Speaker 1: More so social they do more of the long form stuff.

1172
01:01:11,360 --> 01:01:15,120
Speaker 2: So every day we probably have about one or two

1173
01:01:15,480 --> 01:01:19,280
Speaker 2: some days three live shows that last about an hour.

1174
01:01:19,880 --> 01:01:21,680
Speaker 2: And so that may be the show I do with

1175
01:01:21,880 --> 01:01:24,920
Speaker 2: bretton Jordy. That may be a show called Legal af

1176
01:01:25,040 --> 01:01:26,880
Speaker 2: that I do with a guy named Michael Popak and

1177
01:01:27,280 --> 01:01:30,320
Speaker 2: Karen Friedman Agnifolo and she was the number two DA

1178
01:01:30,400 --> 01:01:32,440
Speaker 2: in the minute. These are like top Lords.

1179
01:01:33,520 --> 01:01:34,040
Speaker 4: I'm kidding.

1180
01:01:34,120 --> 01:01:34,840
Speaker 2: No no, no, no no.

1181
01:01:35,320 --> 01:01:36,600
Speaker 1: It means analysis friends.

1182
01:01:37,000 --> 01:01:42,200
Speaker 2: By the way, legal analysis, analysis friends some people. It

1183
01:01:42,240 --> 01:01:44,840
Speaker 2: could be a play on somebody else, but it's analysis friends.

1184
01:01:45,080 --> 01:01:47,600
Speaker 3: Okay, get Clara out of the gutter.

1185
01:01:51,520 --> 01:01:54,880
Speaker 2: And so about ten videos to twelve videos a day

1186
01:01:55,680 --> 01:02:00,240
Speaker 2: that are about ten to fifteen minutes. And let whatever

1187
01:02:00,320 --> 01:02:02,560
Speaker 2: it takes to go through a court filing or to

1188
01:02:02,640 --> 01:02:05,640
Speaker 2: provide all of the data where we feel that we've

1189
01:02:05,840 --> 01:02:08,280
Speaker 2: covered the issue in a way that people really get.

1190
01:02:08,800 --> 01:02:10,640
Speaker 1: So we do that twelve times a day.

1191
01:02:10,720 --> 01:02:12,560
Speaker 2: Maybe there's a four am, although now that I'm on

1192
01:02:12,600 --> 01:02:14,600
Speaker 2: East Coast time, it's all screwed up, But on the

1193
01:02:14,640 --> 01:02:17,560
Speaker 2: West Coast it's a four or five thirty seven, you know,

1194
01:02:17,640 --> 01:02:20,280
Speaker 2: and you basically go ninety minutes out and you program

1195
01:02:20,400 --> 01:02:22,800
Speaker 2: it like that with two or three live shows a day,

1196
01:02:22,840 --> 01:02:25,160
Speaker 2: and some days maybe on the weekend it's one live show.

1197
01:02:26,760 --> 01:02:29,440
Speaker 2: And then we have our other social media built around it.

1198
01:02:29,520 --> 01:02:32,080
Speaker 2: So we've got the TikTok, we've got the Instagram, We've

1199
01:02:32,120 --> 01:02:34,360
Speaker 2: got all those of the Blue Sky, which our accounts

1200
01:02:34,400 --> 01:02:36,640
Speaker 2: do very well on as well. And then the audio

1201
01:02:36,800 --> 01:02:40,320
Speaker 2: podcast as well, has some the main brother podcast and

1202
01:02:40,400 --> 01:02:42,840
Speaker 2: maybe a few selective you know, gase.

1203
01:02:42,680 --> 01:02:45,320
Speaker 4: Ever Sleep Yeah. And how do you how do you

1204
01:02:45,400 --> 01:02:47,800
Speaker 4: make money off all this stuff? Because that has been,

1205
01:02:47,920 --> 01:02:52,520
Speaker 4: of course, the big dilemma for people who have transferred

1206
01:02:52,560 --> 01:02:55,960
Speaker 4: to kind of a pure digital platform. They used to

1207
01:02:56,120 --> 01:02:59,960
Speaker 4: talk about analog dollars and digital pennies, so that's changed.

1208
01:03:00,240 --> 01:03:02,400
Speaker 4: Just more than fifty percent of people are now getting

1209
01:03:02,440 --> 01:03:05,320
Speaker 4: their using information from social media. But what is your

1210
01:03:05,440 --> 01:03:06,360
Speaker 4: financial model.

1211
01:03:06,520 --> 01:03:09,800
Speaker 2: I think it's still analog dollars digital pennies, although the

1212
01:03:09,960 --> 01:03:13,040
Speaker 2: analog dollars right are getting a little bit less and

1213
01:03:13,120 --> 01:03:16,720
Speaker 2: the digital pennies are getting more, which is a good thing.

1214
01:03:17,160 --> 01:03:20,479
Speaker 2: I just spoke recently at a panel and I said,

1215
01:03:21,160 --> 01:03:24,240
Speaker 2: one of the most important things I think to monetizing

1216
01:03:24,320 --> 01:03:26,560
Speaker 2: it is you don't go in it to monetizing And

1217
01:03:26,600 --> 01:03:29,880
Speaker 2: I mean truly, we never went into this thinking how

1218
01:03:29,920 --> 01:03:34,439
Speaker 2: do we make the biggest business decisions That naturally grew

1219
01:03:34,760 --> 01:03:37,880
Speaker 2: out of building good content.

1220
01:03:37,640 --> 01:03:40,000
Speaker 4: And a good base and a big community.

1221
01:03:40,320 --> 01:03:43,680
Speaker 2: And then the community exactly, and the community was there

1222
01:03:43,720 --> 01:03:46,960
Speaker 2: and that's what we fought for always and stood by

1223
01:03:47,040 --> 01:03:49,560
Speaker 2: the community, built the community, and they built us. It's been,

1224
01:03:50,120 --> 01:03:52,880
Speaker 2: you know, very mutual. And then as you grow that,

1225
01:03:53,360 --> 01:03:56,200
Speaker 2: you know, then you start to get into your digital

1226
01:03:56,280 --> 01:03:59,440
Speaker 2: pennies analog dollars, and you start to look at you know,

1227
01:03:59,560 --> 01:04:02,880
Speaker 2: what's YouTube CPM which is a different name for it,

1228
01:04:03,040 --> 01:04:06,920
Speaker 2: but what's a podcast CPM? And then what's a host

1229
01:04:07,000 --> 01:04:11,360
Speaker 2: read CPM? And then you start getting into conversations that

1230
01:04:11,600 --> 01:04:14,920
Speaker 2: start to not fully are but start to look similar

1231
01:04:15,040 --> 01:04:17,440
Speaker 2: to the way traditional.

1232
01:04:17,000 --> 01:04:17,960
Speaker 1: TV viewed things.

1233
01:04:18,040 --> 01:04:22,200
Speaker 2: You know, what's a CPM and here's the here's where

1234
01:04:22,240 --> 01:04:25,960
Speaker 2: things are moving. I think right now, if you were

1235
01:04:26,120 --> 01:04:30,000
Speaker 2: to buy and add a thirty second or sixty second

1236
01:04:30,080 --> 01:04:33,920
Speaker 2: spot on a cable news network, your CPM would be

1237
01:04:34,160 --> 01:04:37,240
Speaker 2: super high for thirty seconds, and you may be paying

1238
01:04:37,400 --> 01:04:40,440
Speaker 2: an outrage. You know, they'll say it's a good you know,

1239
01:04:41,000 --> 01:04:42,840
Speaker 2: the networks will say it makes sense, but you'll be

1240
01:04:42,880 --> 01:04:45,840
Speaker 2: paying whatever X dollars for that thirty seconds. After the

1241
01:04:45,920 --> 01:04:48,320
Speaker 2: show airs, no one sees the ad again, and you're

1242
01:04:48,360 --> 01:04:51,040
Speaker 2: one of five ads that may be during that block

1243
01:04:51,160 --> 01:04:52,880
Speaker 2: or four ads during that block, and no one ever

1244
01:04:52,960 --> 01:04:55,520
Speaker 2: sees it again. And I don't know what the conversion

1245
01:04:55,640 --> 01:04:58,920
Speaker 2: rate even is for you know, because it's not even

1246
01:04:58,960 --> 01:05:01,360
Speaker 2: really track that way. How many people bought a car

1247
01:05:01,520 --> 01:05:01,920
Speaker 2: based on.

1248
01:05:02,440 --> 01:05:06,280
Speaker 4: Those those vitamins that tastes like vegetables, right.

1249
01:05:08,240 --> 01:05:08,520
Speaker 1: News?

1250
01:05:08,720 --> 01:05:12,560
Speaker 2: You know, So if we're getting a million views, if

1251
01:05:12,560 --> 01:05:15,080
Speaker 2: we're getting a million views, you know, on a video,

1252
01:05:15,680 --> 01:05:20,040
Speaker 2: and then there's a host read you know, read and

1253
01:05:20,200 --> 01:05:23,400
Speaker 2: Jordi you know, works with the with the advertisers to

1254
01:05:23,520 --> 01:05:26,840
Speaker 2: make sure we're getting advertisers that kind of meet our criterion.

1255
01:05:26,880 --> 01:05:29,480
Speaker 2: We're not bringing advertisers that we think are not the

1256
01:05:29,560 --> 01:05:33,400
Speaker 2: right fits for us. You know, you start thinking about, well,

1257
01:05:33,440 --> 01:05:36,120
Speaker 2: what does that CPM look like? And you know, I

1258
01:05:36,200 --> 01:05:39,840
Speaker 2: think it's a more valuable proposition ultimately to an advertiser

1259
01:05:40,080 --> 01:05:42,400
Speaker 2: down the road. And I think this is where this

1260
01:05:42,560 --> 01:05:45,040
Speaker 2: is where the industry is moving. And I think, I

1261
01:05:45,120 --> 01:05:48,040
Speaker 2: think this is why we see so many people looking

1262
01:05:48,160 --> 01:05:51,240
Speaker 2: at a model, you know that that I think we

1263
01:05:51,480 --> 01:05:53,280
Speaker 2: you know, and again there's been a lot of people

1264
01:05:53,320 --> 01:05:55,960
Speaker 2: involved in this, but I think that we've helped, you know,

1265
01:05:56,320 --> 01:06:00,200
Speaker 2: show that this is a viable path for one of

1266
01:06:00,240 --> 01:06:02,760
Speaker 2: the first and people are seeing it and saying, oh,

1267
01:06:02,880 --> 01:06:03,160
Speaker 2: got it.

1268
01:06:03,240 --> 01:06:04,320
Speaker 1: I see how Midas did it.

1269
01:06:04,440 --> 01:06:07,800
Speaker 2: Let me try to build a network, And that's kind

1270
01:06:07,840 --> 01:06:10,000
Speaker 2: of how we, you know, how we think about things there.

1271
01:06:10,400 --> 01:06:13,680
Speaker 3: It's interesting over the past few years since we've been

1272
01:06:13,800 --> 01:06:16,840
Speaker 3: doing this, we've seen a lot of companies kind of

1273
01:06:16,920 --> 01:06:19,520
Speaker 3: come and go try to enter the space. And I

1274
01:06:19,600 --> 01:06:21,800
Speaker 3: think the theme that I've seen and the ones that

1275
01:06:22,160 --> 01:06:25,240
Speaker 3: have kind of come and gone quickly are the ones

1276
01:06:25,360 --> 01:06:28,320
Speaker 3: that start with a top down approach rather than a

1277
01:06:28,400 --> 01:06:31,200
Speaker 3: bottom up approach. And by that, I mean, you know,

1278
01:06:31,280 --> 01:06:34,600
Speaker 3: you see this big splashy announcement so and so was

1279
01:06:35,200 --> 01:06:38,840
Speaker 3: you know, the editor in chief of such and such,

1280
01:06:39,240 --> 01:06:41,680
Speaker 3: You know newspaper, and now they're going to make the

1281
01:06:41,760 --> 01:06:44,960
Speaker 3: digital network for the future. And they got an eighty

1282
01:06:45,040 --> 01:06:49,480
Speaker 3: million dollar investment, and they're gonna open up twelve offices

1283
01:06:49,560 --> 01:06:51,840
Speaker 3: around the world, and they're going to hire one hundred

1284
01:06:51,880 --> 01:06:54,560
Speaker 3: and fifty staff and and anytime I see that, I'll

1285
01:06:54,600 --> 01:06:57,160
Speaker 3: be I give them a year. I mean, how the

1286
01:06:57,440 --> 01:07:00,440
Speaker 3: economics aren't gonna even work. I mean, the office is alone.

1287
01:07:00,440 --> 01:07:02,760
Speaker 3: I'm kind of sinking, like I don't even understand how

1288
01:07:02,800 --> 01:07:02,960
Speaker 3: you have.

1289
01:07:03,240 --> 01:07:04,040
Speaker 1: Still dollar penny.

1290
01:07:05,920 --> 01:07:07,200
Speaker 3: So like to me, I'm like, I don't even know

1291
01:07:07,320 --> 01:07:08,960
Speaker 3: how this is how you think this is.

1292
01:07:09,000 --> 01:07:09,440
Speaker 1: Going to work.

1293
01:07:09,600 --> 01:07:12,440
Speaker 4: But so how many people do you have all together

1294
01:07:12,720 --> 01:07:13,320
Speaker 4: on your team?

1295
01:07:13,480 --> 01:07:15,840
Speaker 3: So I think one of the one of the things

1296
01:07:15,920 --> 01:07:18,480
Speaker 3: that is most effective about what we've done here is

1297
01:07:18,520 --> 01:07:21,320
Speaker 3: the way we've decentralized it. So, you know, I think

1298
01:07:21,360 --> 01:07:24,720
Speaker 3: as far as like kind of full time staff is concerned,

1299
01:07:25,040 --> 01:07:26,520
Speaker 3: you know, at this point, are probably like ten to

1300
01:07:26,600 --> 01:07:29,920
Speaker 3: fifteen like full time full time, like you know. And

1301
01:07:30,000 --> 01:07:32,080
Speaker 3: then in addition to that, though, we have dozens and

1302
01:07:32,280 --> 01:07:35,840
Speaker 3: dozens and dozens of contributors who are also producing content

1303
01:07:35,960 --> 01:07:37,640
Speaker 3: and contractors and people like that.

1304
01:07:37,880 --> 01:07:40,200
Speaker 4: So so it's not it's their side hustle kind of

1305
01:07:40,520 --> 01:07:42,880
Speaker 4: or is it for sometributor.

1306
01:07:42,200 --> 01:07:44,360
Speaker 3: You know, it's one of those things where you get

1307
01:07:44,400 --> 01:07:46,480
Speaker 3: what you put into it. And so there are some

1308
01:07:46,680 --> 01:07:50,880
Speaker 3: folks who are you know, making videos every day, doing

1309
01:07:50,960 --> 01:07:53,600
Speaker 3: to a day you know, you know, are just really

1310
01:07:53,680 --> 01:07:55,919
Speaker 3: crushing it and this is like become their main thing

1311
01:07:56,480 --> 01:07:59,720
Speaker 3: and now their livelihood is making you know, videos for

1312
01:07:59,840 --> 01:08:01,960
Speaker 3: my Touch, which I think is amazing that we're able

1313
01:08:02,040 --> 01:08:05,040
Speaker 3: to to folks. And then we may have folks who

1314
01:08:05,160 --> 01:08:07,320
Speaker 3: do you know, a video a month or you know,

1315
01:08:07,360 --> 01:08:10,200
Speaker 3: a couple of videos a month, and you know this

1316
01:08:10,280 --> 01:08:12,840
Speaker 3: will be their side thing. And so I think, you know,

1317
01:08:12,960 --> 01:08:14,840
Speaker 3: I think we offer that flexibility to folks you know

1318
01:08:14,920 --> 01:08:16,479
Speaker 3: who work with us kind of how much do you

1319
01:08:16,520 --> 01:08:18,839
Speaker 3: want to put into it and what's kind of resonating

1320
01:08:18,920 --> 01:08:21,280
Speaker 3: with folks. But you know, I think it's cool that

1321
01:08:21,360 --> 01:08:23,559
Speaker 3: we've been able to build this platform from the ground

1322
01:08:23,640 --> 01:08:27,200
Speaker 3: up completely independently, without a penny of outside investment money,

1323
01:08:27,439 --> 01:08:29,080
Speaker 3: you know, getting us to where we are, you know

1324
01:08:29,280 --> 01:08:33,120
Speaker 3: right now. And so you know, and and obviously you know,

1325
01:08:34,120 --> 01:08:36,560
Speaker 3: we were certainly afforded, you know, privileges of you know,

1326
01:08:36,680 --> 01:08:39,639
Speaker 3: all having jobs and being able to take this leap

1327
01:08:39,720 --> 01:08:41,880
Speaker 3: that other folks aren't necessarily able to do. And I

1328
01:08:41,960 --> 01:08:45,240
Speaker 3: completely acknowledge that, but I think I think it's important

1329
01:08:45,280 --> 01:08:48,559
Speaker 3: that you know, you do have that kind of ground

1330
01:08:48,680 --> 01:08:51,400
Speaker 3: up approach when you approach it, because when you're dealing

1331
01:08:51,479 --> 01:08:53,639
Speaker 3: with when you're dealing with pennies, you can't be spending

1332
01:08:54,040 --> 01:08:56,600
Speaker 3: you know, you can't be spending dollars. You need to

1333
01:08:56,600 --> 01:08:58,880
Speaker 3: figure out a way to do this. And you know,

1334
01:08:59,160 --> 01:09:01,000
Speaker 3: I'll also go back to our roots here. I'll take

1335
01:09:01,040 --> 01:09:03,200
Speaker 3: it back to the beginning because during the pandemic, one

1336
01:09:03,200 --> 01:09:06,400
Speaker 3: of the things that we noticed was everyone was recording

1337
01:09:06,479 --> 01:09:09,160
Speaker 3: from their homes and so we would watch CNN, we

1338
01:09:09,200 --> 01:09:12,040
Speaker 3: would watch you know, NBC, we'd watch all the networks.

1339
01:09:12,040 --> 01:09:14,680
Speaker 3: Everyone's on Skype or Zoom or whatever, and so we

1340
01:09:14,800 --> 01:09:15,479
Speaker 3: were like, we could do that.

1341
01:09:16,360 --> 01:09:19,240
Speaker 4: Yeah, we've said. We said, well, I mean it's amazing.

1342
01:09:19,360 --> 01:09:21,200
Speaker 4: I mean, as somebody who you know, used to have

1343
01:09:21,320 --> 01:09:24,200
Speaker 4: hair and makeup every morning or night and be on

1344
01:09:24,320 --> 01:09:27,960
Speaker 4: a fancy, you know, desk with life and camera crews

1345
01:09:28,040 --> 01:09:31,920
Speaker 4: and everything, and I'm like, there's something great too about

1346
01:09:32,080 --> 01:09:35,160
Speaker 4: the immediacy, Like we'd have to call somebody and get

1347
01:09:35,200 --> 01:09:37,240
Speaker 4: them in a car and have them come to the studio,

1348
01:09:37,840 --> 01:09:40,439
Speaker 4: and there's something great about just being able to talk

1349
01:09:40,520 --> 01:09:42,880
Speaker 4: to someone right away. If it's by the way, there's

1350
01:09:42,880 --> 01:09:43,800
Speaker 4: a rawness to it.

1351
01:09:43,920 --> 01:09:46,080
Speaker 3: There's an authenticity to it also.

1352
01:09:46,120 --> 01:09:49,280
Speaker 4: You know scariness. There's people see me without make them.

1353
01:09:50,160 --> 01:09:53,519
Speaker 3: I totally do not think that, but but you know,

1354
01:09:53,600 --> 01:09:56,760
Speaker 3: I think though it, you know, it requires you to,

1355
01:09:57,240 --> 01:09:59,240
Speaker 3: you know, think a little differently, right, You don't necessarily

1356
01:09:59,720 --> 01:10:01,880
Speaker 3: you know, I know, and I think Ben knows he

1357
01:10:01,920 --> 01:10:04,880
Speaker 3: doesn't have necessarily you know, a studio, music, all this

1358
01:10:04,920 --> 01:10:07,000
Speaker 3: stuff lifting him up, and so he has to, you know,

1359
01:10:07,080 --> 01:10:09,080
Speaker 3: in many ways focus on the content.

1360
01:10:08,960 --> 01:10:12,280
Speaker 4: Right, and there it's a fakiness about like good evening, yeah,

1361
01:10:12,320 --> 01:10:12,880
Speaker 4: you know, and.

1362
01:10:13,720 --> 01:10:15,640
Speaker 3: I think people see, you know, see through a lot

1363
01:10:15,680 --> 01:10:19,200
Speaker 3: of that, and so you know, I in doing it

1364
01:10:19,320 --> 01:10:21,680
Speaker 3: in that way, you know, I think ultimately, like if

1365
01:10:21,680 --> 01:10:23,720
Speaker 3: anyone is like watching this and like, how do I

1366
01:10:23,840 --> 01:10:25,400
Speaker 3: start something like this? Like you want to make sure

1367
01:10:25,439 --> 01:10:27,160
Speaker 3: your sound is good, you want to make sure people

1368
01:10:27,160 --> 01:10:29,200
Speaker 3: could see, Okay, you want a good camera, good audio.

1369
01:10:29,520 --> 01:10:31,400
Speaker 3: Aside from that, people are going to be actually pretty

1370
01:10:31,400 --> 01:10:34,160
Speaker 3: forgiving with the rest of the stuff. And I think

1371
01:10:34,600 --> 01:10:36,280
Speaker 3: in the beginning also there were so many people who

1372
01:10:36,280 --> 01:10:38,519
Speaker 3: would come to us you know, I got this, I

1373
01:10:38,640 --> 01:10:41,000
Speaker 3: got this great video, I got this great painting. I

1374
01:10:41,120 --> 01:10:42,920
Speaker 3: just need to run it through a few weeks of

1375
01:10:43,000 --> 01:10:45,680
Speaker 3: testing and then we're going to make some changes. And

1376
01:10:45,760 --> 01:10:47,800
Speaker 3: then if I could just get an investor.

1377
01:10:47,560 --> 01:10:50,360
Speaker 4: You just do it restributor. And you know, that's the

1378
01:10:50,439 --> 01:10:52,320
Speaker 4: one question I also wanted to ask you. You know,

1379
01:10:52,960 --> 01:10:55,240
Speaker 4: you do it in real time, you experiment, you get

1380
01:10:55,439 --> 01:10:58,599
Speaker 4: kind of the reaction. I promise, I only have business

1381
01:11:00,400 --> 01:11:01,320
Speaker 4: talking to you. Guys.

1382
01:11:02,120 --> 01:11:04,479
Speaker 2: We've before you ask We've been very excited to do this.

1383
01:11:05,840 --> 01:11:08,040
Speaker 1: We're big Katie. We asked for a lot of interviews.

1384
01:11:08,080 --> 01:11:11,240
Speaker 1: We don't really do it. Oh, but we're very big fans.

1385
01:11:11,000 --> 01:11:13,600
Speaker 4: Of you, and thank you. I appreciate it. Thank you.

1386
01:11:13,960 --> 01:11:16,360
Speaker 4: That means a lot to me. But you talked about

1387
01:11:16,680 --> 01:11:20,479
Speaker 4: how responsive you guys are to your community, and I'm curious.

1388
01:11:20,600 --> 01:11:22,960
Speaker 4: You know, I love the interactivity. You know it's not

1389
01:11:23,040 --> 01:11:25,439
Speaker 4: always fun to read because when you read a mean

1390
01:11:25,520 --> 01:11:30,160
Speaker 4: comment or whatever, But tell me what that actually means

1391
01:11:30,720 --> 01:11:33,840
Speaker 4: being responsive to your community. Can you give me sort

1392
01:11:33,840 --> 01:11:34,840
Speaker 4: of an example of that.

1393
01:11:35,680 --> 01:11:39,560
Speaker 2: I'll give you an example of the message that resonated

1394
01:11:39,600 --> 01:11:41,799
Speaker 2: and how we do it. If you looked at Senator

1395
01:11:41,880 --> 01:11:45,439
Speaker 2: Bernie Sanders and AOC's rallies recently where there have been

1396
01:11:45,560 --> 01:11:48,479
Speaker 2: thirty thousand people in fifteen thousand. There's a part of

1397
01:11:48,560 --> 01:11:50,800
Speaker 2: it where they go into the audience and they say

1398
01:11:51,040 --> 01:11:53,320
Speaker 2: they ask the audience, how do you feel about this?

1399
01:11:53,600 --> 01:11:55,840
Speaker 2: And then they just listen and you hear what the

1400
01:11:55,920 --> 01:12:00,080
Speaker 2: people are saying. And we do something intuitively similar for

1401
01:12:00,160 --> 01:12:03,000
Speaker 2: the past five years where we want to know how

1402
01:12:03,040 --> 01:12:07,719
Speaker 2: they're feeling, what they're thinking about issues, and really listen

1403
01:12:07,960 --> 01:12:12,120
Speaker 2: and learn from their experiences. And that's where we understand,

1404
01:12:12,320 --> 01:12:14,040
Speaker 2: you know, Okay, this is what you're going through, this

1405
01:12:14,120 --> 01:12:16,520
Speaker 2: is what you're going through, this is what you're experiencing.

1406
01:12:16,680 --> 01:12:20,960
Speaker 2: And so we have that sense in our overall programming

1407
01:12:21,160 --> 01:12:21,600
Speaker 2: where they are.

1408
01:12:21,680 --> 01:12:22,559
Speaker 1: And another what.

1409
01:12:22,720 --> 01:12:25,400
Speaker 4: Is it reading like their comments or is it do

1410
01:12:25,520 --> 01:12:29,040
Speaker 4: you have a special site or email address where you

1411
01:12:29,160 --> 01:12:31,080
Speaker 4: actually hear from people? How do you do that?

1412
01:12:31,320 --> 01:12:33,559
Speaker 2: It's all of the above. I mean it's reading the comments.

1413
01:12:34,040 --> 01:12:38,000
Speaker 2: We hold sometimes one two times a month, we'll hold

1414
01:12:38,120 --> 01:12:42,360
Speaker 2: meetings with our supporters and with the mightas Mighty as

1415
01:12:42,400 --> 01:12:44,719
Speaker 2: we call them, and we'll do zoom chats and they'll

1416
01:12:44,720 --> 01:12:48,160
Speaker 2: tell us how they're feeling. They'll explain to us on

1417
01:12:48,280 --> 01:12:52,960
Speaker 2: our social media handles, they'll usually you know, at us

1418
01:12:53,200 --> 01:12:56,840
Speaker 2: and certain things, and so it's an aggregate of all

1419
01:12:56,960 --> 01:13:01,040
Speaker 2: of that and we're just constantly listening to them every day.

1420
01:13:01,080 --> 01:13:03,920
Speaker 2: It's not necessary we have those meetings, but it is

1421
01:13:04,040 --> 01:13:08,000
Speaker 2: kind of a constant back and forth since this started.

1422
01:13:08,360 --> 01:13:12,519
Speaker 2: Just another example is when we started covering Canadian politics,

1423
01:13:12,840 --> 01:13:17,360
Speaker 2: which was a big and our expansion internationally, but we

1424
01:13:17,800 --> 01:13:21,280
Speaker 2: listened and listened and listened, and a lot of American

1425
01:13:21,400 --> 01:13:27,559
Speaker 2: media networks supplant the Canadian experience with their American centric

1426
01:13:27,720 --> 01:13:31,560
Speaker 2: views of how Canada is versus really listening to what

1427
01:13:31,680 --> 01:13:34,880
Speaker 2: people in Canada are experiencing. And so before we started

1428
01:13:34,920 --> 01:13:38,280
Speaker 2: doing any reporting on Canada, we had to understand the

1429
01:13:38,400 --> 01:13:40,880
Speaker 2: dynamics of the Liberal Party and the Conservative Party and

1430
01:13:40,920 --> 01:13:43,639
Speaker 2: the NDP and the Green Party and how things work

1431
01:13:43,760 --> 01:13:46,200
Speaker 2: and what's going on with Carnie and what's going on

1432
01:13:46,320 --> 01:13:50,320
Speaker 2: with Pierre Poliev and understanding you know, all of those dynamics.

1433
01:13:51,240 --> 01:13:56,080
Speaker 2: And this was it was a relentless listening experience, and

1434
01:13:56,200 --> 01:13:58,840
Speaker 2: then we started talking about it and then it started

1435
01:13:58,880 --> 01:14:02,519
Speaker 2: connecting in Canada. So the Midas Touch Network podcast became

1436
01:14:02,560 --> 01:14:07,160
Speaker 2: the most listened to podcasts in Canada about Canadian politics

1437
01:14:08,360 --> 01:14:10,560
Speaker 2: and that, and what we heard from them is just

1438
01:14:10,640 --> 01:14:15,120
Speaker 2: such a compliment which told us that. But the feedback

1439
01:14:15,200 --> 01:14:18,400
Speaker 2: there was, it's because you're listening to us, and you

1440
01:14:18,600 --> 01:14:22,320
Speaker 2: understand that when Donald Trump is making these threats against us,

1441
01:14:22,520 --> 01:14:24,760
Speaker 2: it's not a joke. Nor do we view it as

1442
01:14:24,760 --> 01:14:27,639
Speaker 2: a trade war. We view it as a war war.

1443
01:14:28,240 --> 01:14:31,439
Speaker 2: We view that type of language the same way that

1444
01:14:31,760 --> 01:14:36,519
Speaker 2: Ukraine views putin talking about denocification. Is how when he

1445
01:14:36,720 --> 01:14:39,640
Speaker 2: uses language fifty first state, it's an attack on our

1446
01:14:39,760 --> 01:14:42,439
Speaker 2: very existence and our sovereignty. So we want you to

1447
01:14:42,560 --> 01:14:46,080
Speaker 2: understand why it is we're boycotting American products, and it's

1448
01:14:46,080 --> 01:14:48,599
Speaker 2: not that we don't like Americans. It's that the leader

1449
01:14:48,640 --> 01:14:51,120
Speaker 2: of your country right now is basically threatening an invasion

1450
01:14:51,200 --> 01:14:53,960
Speaker 2: against us. And so when you start speaking like that,

1451
01:14:54,080 --> 01:14:55,040
Speaker 2: they go, thank.

1452
01:14:54,960 --> 01:14:56,080
Speaker 1: You, you know, they go.

1453
01:14:56,200 --> 01:14:59,320
Speaker 2: Our local media doesn't even talk about it in those terms, and.

1454
01:14:59,320 --> 01:15:00,000
Speaker 1: That's how we felt.

1455
01:15:00,360 --> 01:15:03,480
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's obvious that you have an audience first mentality,

1456
01:15:03,560 --> 01:15:05,920
Speaker 4: and it is surprising to me, as somebody who's been

1457
01:15:05,960 --> 01:15:10,400
Speaker 4: doing this a long time, how all these interactive tools

1458
01:15:10,400 --> 01:15:15,719
Speaker 4: are at our fingertips and still most media organizations really

1459
01:15:15,800 --> 01:15:19,080
Speaker 4: don't utilize them, not to blow my own for a nanosecond,

1460
01:15:19,160 --> 01:15:21,679
Speaker 4: But when I was I wrote about this in my book.

1461
01:15:21,840 --> 01:15:24,000
Speaker 4: Sorry everybody who works with me, because they've heard the

1462
01:15:24,040 --> 01:15:26,559
Speaker 4: story a million times. But when I was at doing

1463
01:15:26,640 --> 01:15:29,559
Speaker 4: the CBS Evening News, I was covering the golf oil spill,

1464
01:15:30,160 --> 01:15:31,840
Speaker 4: and I said, what do you guys want to know

1465
01:15:32,280 --> 01:15:33,719
Speaker 4: about the golf oil spill?

1466
01:15:33,960 --> 01:15:34,600
Speaker 3: That you know?

1467
01:15:34,760 --> 01:15:37,680
Speaker 4: Because I think you get in a media cycle or

1468
01:15:37,840 --> 01:15:39,960
Speaker 4: a news cycle and you kind of repeat the same

1469
01:15:40,080 --> 01:15:42,679
Speaker 4: thing over and over again, or you advance the story

1470
01:15:42,760 --> 01:15:45,280
Speaker 4: in a small way, but you kind of miss the

1471
01:15:45,360 --> 01:15:48,880
Speaker 4: forest for the tree sometimes. So I asked on Twitter

1472
01:15:49,000 --> 01:15:51,880
Speaker 4: back then, you know, what are your questions about what's

1473
01:15:51,960 --> 01:15:54,959
Speaker 4: going on in the golf And the people at CBS

1474
01:15:55,360 --> 01:16:00,960
Speaker 4: were so unnerved by me trying to to understand what

1475
01:16:01,120 --> 01:16:03,760
Speaker 4: people cared about, what they wanted to know, and what

1476
01:16:03,920 --> 01:16:07,040
Speaker 4: they were thinking and what they were wondering about. But

1477
01:16:07,680 --> 01:16:11,519
Speaker 4: to me, if you're serving an audience, why wouldn't you

1478
01:16:12,360 --> 01:16:14,320
Speaker 4: listen to them? And I think Brett you were talking

1479
01:16:14,320 --> 01:16:17,640
Speaker 4: about the top down approach and kind of serve your

1480
01:16:17,800 --> 01:16:21,560
Speaker 4: audience where they are and what they want to know

1481
01:16:21,840 --> 01:16:23,960
Speaker 4: instead of what you think they should be told.

1482
01:16:24,200 --> 01:16:27,160
Speaker 3: Right, Hey, and what either whether you're a politician or

1483
01:16:27,200 --> 01:16:30,960
Speaker 3: a reporter, or you're selling tires or I don't care

1484
01:16:31,000 --> 01:16:33,320
Speaker 3: what it is that you're doing, if you don't understand

1485
01:16:33,400 --> 01:16:36,160
Speaker 3: what people want and what people are looking for from you,

1486
01:16:36,640 --> 01:16:38,200
Speaker 3: you know, I think you're I think you're going to

1487
01:16:38,240 --> 01:16:40,439
Speaker 3: miss it. And you're right. You know, now more than ever,

1488
01:16:41,280 --> 01:16:43,360
Speaker 3: people are gonna let you know what they think. You know,

1489
01:16:43,479 --> 01:16:46,920
Speaker 3: it's they're not shy about it. Better for better, they're

1490
01:16:46,960 --> 01:16:47,840
Speaker 3: not exactly shy.

1491
01:16:48,000 --> 01:16:50,599
Speaker 4: I used to say, the good thing about the internet

1492
01:16:50,760 --> 01:16:55,160
Speaker 4: is everyone now has a voice. The bad thing everyone

1493
01:16:55,600 --> 01:16:56,400
Speaker 4: now has a voice.

1494
01:16:56,560 --> 01:16:58,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, So I mean people aren't shy about it, and

1495
01:16:59,000 --> 01:17:01,519
Speaker 3: you know, and and people well may disagree with us

1496
01:17:01,600 --> 01:17:05,240
Speaker 3: too at times, you know, but at least we know,

1497
01:17:05,520 --> 01:17:06,880
Speaker 3: you know, what they're thinking, and at least they know

1498
01:17:06,920 --> 01:17:08,960
Speaker 3: that we're coming from a place of like, this is

1499
01:17:09,080 --> 01:17:11,599
Speaker 3: what we really believe in it, and we're not going

1500
01:17:11,680 --> 01:17:14,280
Speaker 3: to b su you know, on it. And I think

1501
01:17:14,320 --> 01:17:15,240
Speaker 3: that's kind of the most.

1502
01:17:15,080 --> 01:17:18,679
Speaker 1: Important corporate news took surgery. Yeah, I was. From my perspective,

1503
01:17:18,680 --> 01:17:20,680
Speaker 1: I don't think the minus touch network exists at this

1504
01:17:20,800 --> 01:17:23,280
Speaker 1: scale that it does now without our audience, without the

1505
01:17:23,360 --> 01:17:27,479
Speaker 1: midas Mighty, and without that relentless relationship of listening and

1506
01:17:27,560 --> 01:17:31,000
Speaker 1: feedback that we have every second of the day, we

1507
01:17:31,200 --> 01:17:33,160
Speaker 1: read everything, for better.

1508
01:17:33,040 --> 01:17:35,320
Speaker 4: Or for worse, We read time to do it every

1509
01:17:35,439 --> 01:17:36,280
Speaker 4: but I'm glad.

1510
01:17:36,080 --> 01:17:38,680
Speaker 1: You do because it's very important for us that we

1511
01:17:38,800 --> 01:17:42,080
Speaker 1: really understand how our audience is feeling. And they were

1512
01:17:42,160 --> 01:17:45,160
Speaker 1: with us five years ago when I moved back into

1513
01:17:45,200 --> 01:17:49,439
Speaker 1: my mom's basement during in the lockdown. Yeah, doing it

1514
01:17:49,520 --> 01:17:51,840
Speaker 1: from there to now I have a kid and I'm

1515
01:17:51,880 --> 01:17:54,599
Speaker 1: living with my wife in Pittsburgh, and so they've seen

1516
01:17:54,720 --> 01:17:57,080
Speaker 1: us mature in the network, mature every step of the way,

1517
01:17:57,120 --> 01:18:00,519
Speaker 1: and it's really been this familial relation ship that we've

1518
01:18:00,520 --> 01:18:01,080
Speaker 1: been able.

1519
01:18:00,920 --> 01:18:03,360
Speaker 4: To faster and the and the walls have been broken.

1520
01:18:09,880 --> 01:18:11,960
Speaker 4: If you want to get smarter every morning with a

1521
01:18:12,000 --> 01:18:15,280
Speaker 4: breakdown of the news and fascinating takes on health and

1522
01:18:15,360 --> 01:18:18,639
Speaker 4: wellness and pop culture, sign up for our daily newsletter,

1523
01:18:18,760 --> 01:18:31,000
Speaker 4: wake Up Call by going to Katiecuric dot com. I

1524
01:18:31,120 --> 01:18:35,439
Speaker 4: think there still is this sort of artifice about a

1525
01:18:35,560 --> 01:18:39,000
Speaker 4: lot of mainstream media and the way they communicate with people,

1526
01:18:39,160 --> 01:18:42,600
Speaker 4: and obviously you all have tapped into that the a

1527
01:18:42,800 --> 01:18:46,080
Speaker 4: word authenticity, which I think it's overused, but I think

1528
01:18:46,160 --> 01:18:47,439
Speaker 4: it actually still holds.

1529
01:18:47,680 --> 01:18:49,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's it's one of those cliche for a reason.

1530
01:18:50,520 --> 01:18:52,840
Speaker 4: Yeah yeah, I mean I think that's been one of

1531
01:18:52,920 --> 01:18:56,200
Speaker 4: the reasons I've been successful professionally, is I think people

1532
01:18:57,040 --> 01:18:59,680
Speaker 4: think that I'm the same on cameras i am off,

1533
01:18:59,760 --> 01:19:01,800
Speaker 4: which I am most of the time. You know, I'm

1534
01:19:01,840 --> 01:19:06,200
Speaker 4: not fully unfiltered when I do things, and maybe I

1535
01:19:06,240 --> 01:19:09,600
Speaker 4: should be a little less, you know, or more unfiltered.

1536
01:19:09,960 --> 01:19:12,479
Speaker 4: But before we go, I want to we've kind of

1537
01:19:12,960 --> 01:19:16,439
Speaker 4: mentioned the manosphere and young men in this country. How

1538
01:19:16,479 --> 01:19:18,320
Speaker 4: old are you been? Forty forty?

1539
01:19:18,560 --> 01:19:21,640
Speaker 3: Well, it's about to be forty a few days your

1540
01:19:22,120 --> 01:19:23,599
Speaker 3: or over over yes, overselling.

1541
01:19:23,600 --> 01:19:25,200
Speaker 1: I don't know when I know When's it going to air.

1542
01:19:27,640 --> 01:19:28,320
Speaker 4: On Thursday?

1543
01:19:28,439 --> 01:19:30,840
Speaker 2: So h a couple of days before?

1544
01:19:31,720 --> 01:19:31,840
Speaker 3: Right?

1545
01:19:32,240 --> 01:19:37,679
Speaker 4: Old thirty five? So forty thirty five, thirty two. Tell

1546
01:19:37,720 --> 01:19:42,160
Speaker 4: me about what you think is happening to younger men

1547
01:19:42,360 --> 01:19:46,280
Speaker 4: in this country, both really primarily gen Z and how

1548
01:19:46,360 --> 01:19:51,960
Speaker 4: they have gravitated so enthusiastically, and maybe this is not

1549
01:19:52,160 --> 01:19:55,960
Speaker 4: even factually correct. I have to really check the numbers.

1550
01:19:56,040 --> 01:20:02,599
Speaker 4: But to Republican, to maga politic and how well, first

1551
01:20:02,600 --> 01:20:04,040
Speaker 4: of all, I want to know why you think this

1552
01:20:04,160 --> 01:20:06,680
Speaker 4: has happened, And then I want to know what you

1553
01:20:06,800 --> 01:20:10,080
Speaker 4: think can be done to change those dynamics.

1554
01:20:10,439 --> 01:20:14,120
Speaker 2: I think the idea of alpha has been hijacked by

1555
01:20:14,200 --> 01:20:17,840
Speaker 2: the least alpha people in the world. Okay, like a

1556
01:20:18,000 --> 01:20:22,320
Speaker 2: JD Vance, we're saying all my masculinities under attack. Okay,

1557
01:20:22,400 --> 01:20:24,120
Speaker 2: that's not an alpha thing to say. Like, let's be

1558
01:20:24,320 --> 01:20:26,160
Speaker 2: very cliqu When when I hear stuff like that, I'm like,

1559
01:20:26,320 --> 01:20:28,599
Speaker 2: what are you your masculinity? This is what you think

1560
01:20:28,640 --> 01:20:30,640
Speaker 2: about that your masculinity is under attack? What the hell

1561
01:20:30,640 --> 01:20:32,640
Speaker 2: are you talking about? You know, all of this like

1562
01:20:32,880 --> 01:20:35,680
Speaker 2: you know, whining that I hear from these magma Oh

1563
01:20:35,760 --> 01:20:36,800
Speaker 2: my god, you're coming after me.

1564
01:20:37,000 --> 01:20:40,040
Speaker 4: Oh. My friend Joeanne Littman wrote a whole essay about that,

1565
01:20:40,200 --> 01:20:42,639
Speaker 4: you know, all doxed and attacked. It was awful. I'm

1566
01:20:42,640 --> 01:20:43,240
Speaker 4: going to send it to you.

1567
01:20:43,479 --> 01:20:45,040
Speaker 1: You know, you know all of that.

1568
01:20:45,400 --> 01:20:47,360
Speaker 2: When I grew up, I don't like the term alpha

1569
01:20:47,479 --> 01:20:50,280
Speaker 2: in general. You know, you're an alpha, you know, but

1570
01:20:50,560 --> 01:20:53,360
Speaker 2: to me, at least as I was raised, you know,

1571
01:20:53,600 --> 01:20:56,679
Speaker 2: being a good guy or good person, but you stand

1572
01:20:56,800 --> 01:20:59,720
Speaker 2: up for people to me, like the cool kid or

1573
01:20:59,800 --> 01:21:04,200
Speaker 2: the or the growing up when I was in high school.

1574
01:21:04,760 --> 01:21:07,519
Speaker 2: Now would be considered that you would stand up against

1575
01:21:07,560 --> 01:21:10,519
Speaker 2: the bully. The bully wasn't like the alpha person. The

1576
01:21:10,560 --> 01:21:13,120
Speaker 2: bully was like the loser, you know, like why are

1577
01:21:13,120 --> 01:21:15,920
Speaker 2: you bullying these people? Like you would want to stand

1578
01:21:16,000 --> 01:21:18,759
Speaker 2: up for people. And that's to me what was always

1579
01:21:18,840 --> 01:21:21,519
Speaker 2: viewed as like cool and how you know, at least

1580
01:21:21,560 --> 01:21:24,600
Speaker 2: how I was raised and being a good man to

1581
01:21:24,720 --> 01:21:27,320
Speaker 2: me is being a man of your word, being someone

1582
01:21:27,400 --> 01:21:32,559
Speaker 2: of honor, you know, you know, against standing up for people.

1583
01:21:33,240 --> 01:21:36,320
Speaker 2: And that's kind of been you know, inverted with this

1584
01:21:36,600 --> 01:21:40,400
Speaker 2: to me, this corrosive culture that has you know, basically

1585
01:21:40,520 --> 01:21:44,120
Speaker 2: said the opposite that the bullies and the people who

1586
01:21:44,240 --> 01:21:47,720
Speaker 2: punch down. That's been viewed right now as like what

1587
01:21:47,840 --> 01:21:48,920
Speaker 2: it is and it shouldn't be.

1588
01:21:49,080 --> 01:21:51,800
Speaker 4: Yes, just because of Trump, really, isn't it The way

1589
01:21:51,920 --> 01:21:54,360
Speaker 4: he speaks and the way he talks and the way

1590
01:21:54,439 --> 01:21:59,479
Speaker 4: he demeans people. Suddenly that has probably been interpret as.

1591
01:21:59,400 --> 01:22:02,320
Speaker 3: Good for it right in so many ways. You know,

1592
01:22:02,320 --> 01:22:04,160
Speaker 3: it's funny when when when you speak about that, I

1593
01:22:04,240 --> 01:22:06,280
Speaker 3: think about I think it's in twenty one Jump Street.

1594
01:22:07,040 --> 01:22:10,040
Speaker 3: There's a scene in the movie, uh, you know where

1595
01:22:10,160 --> 01:22:11,920
Speaker 3: Channing Tatum where they go to the high school and

1596
01:22:11,960 --> 01:22:13,680
Speaker 3: they try to be cool as they knew it, like

1597
01:22:13,760 --> 01:22:15,280
Speaker 3: in the eighties and tried to be like kind of

1598
01:22:15,320 --> 01:22:17,800
Speaker 3: the bullies and stuff, and they're looked down upon as like, nah,

1599
01:22:18,439 --> 01:22:20,320
Speaker 3: like we're not into that anymore. What are you doing

1600
01:22:20,439 --> 01:22:23,320
Speaker 3: like this weird this weird stuff? And uh And I

1601
01:22:23,479 --> 01:22:25,240
Speaker 3: feel like I, you know, I grew up the same way.

1602
01:22:25,320 --> 01:22:27,439
Speaker 3: But you know, I think that I think that too

1603
01:22:27,439 --> 01:22:30,560
Speaker 3: many people are looking at you know, Gen's Z or

1604
01:22:30,640 --> 01:22:33,960
Speaker 3: Jen Alpha right now as being molded and kind of

1605
01:22:34,080 --> 01:22:37,200
Speaker 3: set in certain ways, and that this election was, you know,

1606
01:22:37,280 --> 01:22:39,400
Speaker 3: a reflection on who they are now and who they're

1607
01:22:39,400 --> 01:22:40,040
Speaker 3: always going to be.

1608
01:22:40,920 --> 01:22:43,200
Speaker 4: But I do think they're being molded by some of

1609
01:22:43,240 --> 01:22:50,280
Speaker 4: these percent they're giving anti women's empowerment bros, I.

1610
01:22:50,280 --> 01:22:53,320
Speaker 3: Think one hundred percent. But I don't think that's something

1611
01:22:53,400 --> 01:22:57,120
Speaker 3: that is going to be like concrete in them necessarily.

1612
01:22:57,200 --> 01:22:59,680
Speaker 3: I think people have their lived experiences, and I think

1613
01:22:59,720 --> 01:23:01,640
Speaker 3: one of the interesting things that we've even seen in

1614
01:23:01,680 --> 01:23:04,560
Speaker 3: the past few months since Trump has taken office is

1615
01:23:04,600 --> 01:23:06,240
Speaker 3: when you look at a lot of those public opinion

1616
01:23:06,320 --> 01:23:09,400
Speaker 3: polls of gen Z, they've completely flipped on their head,

1617
01:23:09,840 --> 01:23:12,840
Speaker 3: and polls that showed gen Z you know, even or

1618
01:23:12,880 --> 01:23:16,960
Speaker 3: supporting Trump back in November December. Now it's something like

1619
01:23:17,360 --> 01:23:20,000
Speaker 3: sixty eight twenty something, you know, in the opposite direction.

1620
01:23:20,160 --> 01:23:22,760
Speaker 3: So you see how even you know, those shifts could happen.

1621
01:23:22,800 --> 01:23:24,360
Speaker 3: And I think when people even go out into the

1622
01:23:24,400 --> 01:23:27,479
Speaker 3: world and have experiences and have jobs and need to

1623
01:23:28,000 --> 01:23:31,599
Speaker 3: you know, afford medication and need to you know, help

1624
01:23:31,680 --> 01:23:34,559
Speaker 3: their mom who's on Social Security, and they see these

1625
01:23:34,640 --> 01:23:37,400
Speaker 3: real world things that you know, have been kind of

1626
01:23:37,439 --> 01:23:41,320
Speaker 3: gamified in this kind of manosphere world and that have

1627
01:23:41,479 --> 01:23:43,799
Speaker 3: kind of been stripped from them, I think the reality

1628
01:23:43,840 --> 01:23:45,559
Speaker 3: wakes them up, you know a little bit.

1629
01:23:45,600 --> 01:23:48,080
Speaker 4: I think because I feel like they're still watching the

1630
01:23:48,160 --> 01:23:52,679
Speaker 4: same people and still getting the same information. And unless

1631
01:23:52,880 --> 01:23:58,480
Speaker 4: those people are flipping or changing or abandoning this administration

1632
01:23:58,640 --> 01:24:01,920
Speaker 4: of what they're doing, they're going to be steadfast.

1633
01:24:02,960 --> 01:24:05,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, I just I don't think they're lockdown.

1634
01:24:05,280 --> 01:24:07,920
Speaker 3: I mean, maybe I have, you know, too much faith,

1635
01:24:08,320 --> 01:24:08,600
Speaker 3: but I.

1636
01:24:09,160 --> 01:24:10,760
Speaker 2: Think you have to look at the going back to

1637
01:24:10,800 --> 01:24:12,560
Speaker 2: where we almost started, right as I think you have

1638
01:24:12,640 --> 01:24:14,960
Speaker 2: to look at the root cause, which is how is

1639
01:24:15,040 --> 01:24:19,360
Speaker 2: this group able to be kind of preyed upon by

1640
01:24:19,479 --> 01:24:23,680
Speaker 2: in my opinion, these types of fraudsters and people who

1641
01:24:23,800 --> 01:24:26,320
Speaker 2: push this. And it's because, you know, I think a

1642
01:24:26,360 --> 01:24:29,800
Speaker 2: lot of young people and young men are scared that

1643
01:24:29,840 --> 01:24:31,880
Speaker 2: they're not going to have a future, right, And I

1644
01:24:31,920 --> 01:24:36,400
Speaker 2: think it stems from their weakness and that other people

1645
01:24:36,560 --> 01:24:39,040
Speaker 2: can pray on it because they're worried that am I

1646
01:24:39,120 --> 01:24:40,880
Speaker 2: going to Am I going to have a job? Am

1647
01:24:40,880 --> 01:24:42,800
Speaker 2: I going to be able to afford a home? Can

1648
01:24:42,880 --> 01:24:46,080
Speaker 2: I bring someone on a date and afford to even

1649
01:24:46,160 --> 01:24:47,640
Speaker 2: pay for it? What's my future going?

1650
01:24:47,760 --> 01:24:50,559
Speaker 4: But it's also more than that to me, Benett's sort

1651
01:24:50,560 --> 01:24:54,479
Speaker 4: of oh, women are making all these strides, right, they're

1652
01:24:54,560 --> 01:24:57,360
Speaker 4: more women in college and law school than there are men.

1653
01:24:58,040 --> 01:25:04,679
Speaker 4: Or gosh, programs are giving unfair advantages, or affirmative action

1654
01:25:04,960 --> 01:25:07,560
Speaker 4: or diversity programs in colleges or whatever you want to

1655
01:25:07,600 --> 01:25:09,840
Speaker 4: talk about. I mean, I've seen it play out in

1656
01:25:09,960 --> 01:25:13,240
Speaker 4: my own life among people I know, and they think

1657
01:25:13,680 --> 01:25:17,479
Speaker 4: when other people do well, they do less well. Right,

1658
01:25:17,800 --> 01:25:21,800
Speaker 4: And so there's just been this tremendous backlash and to

1659
01:25:21,920 --> 01:25:25,479
Speaker 4: your point, like a lot of whining like oh poor us,

1660
01:25:25,640 --> 01:25:29,599
Speaker 4: and playing the victim for a lot of young white men.

1661
01:25:30,320 --> 01:25:33,640
Speaker 4: And I think you're right, people are exploiting that. But

1662
01:25:33,800 --> 01:25:37,759
Speaker 4: how do you reverse it? How do you get people

1663
01:25:37,840 --> 01:25:41,680
Speaker 4: to think differently and to see that this is you know,

1664
01:25:41,760 --> 01:25:44,599
Speaker 4: because I do think they're having some real world effects.

1665
01:25:44,800 --> 01:25:49,720
Speaker 2: Well, I think you can't solve that by trying to

1666
01:25:50,280 --> 01:25:54,559
Speaker 2: imitate it. You just become a worse version of something

1667
01:25:54,640 --> 01:25:58,240
Speaker 2: that's not already good. Which is why the learning experience

1668
01:25:58,320 --> 01:26:01,040
Speaker 2: of oh, the left needs to find a is the

1669
01:26:01,160 --> 01:26:06,879
Speaker 2: wrong advice, because you want to become someone who's already

1670
01:26:06,960 --> 01:26:08,599
Speaker 2: kind of praying on these communities.

1671
01:26:08,600 --> 01:26:09,839
Speaker 4: So what mean exactly?

1672
01:26:10,000 --> 01:26:12,320
Speaker 2: So you have to again, you have to be a

1673
01:26:12,479 --> 01:26:15,040
Speaker 2: voice that is a fighter. I mean, you have to

1674
01:26:15,120 --> 01:26:17,920
Speaker 2: go back to you have to be a doer. You

1675
01:26:18,120 --> 01:26:21,439
Speaker 2: have to be someone who actually accomplishes things and says,

1676
01:26:21,720 --> 01:26:23,840
Speaker 2: here's what I stand for. I mean, here are the

1677
01:26:23,880 --> 01:26:27,160
Speaker 2: views and values. It's not a zero sum game you

1678
01:26:27,400 --> 01:26:31,000
Speaker 2: against other groups and marginalized communities taking your That's not it.

1679
01:26:31,520 --> 01:26:33,400
Speaker 2: That's a pathetic way. You know who deals with that?

1680
01:26:33,800 --> 01:26:37,880
Speaker 2: Whiners deal with that like not like people who are

1681
01:26:38,160 --> 01:26:40,639
Speaker 2: losers deal with that. You you want to be a winner,

1682
01:26:41,080 --> 01:26:45,440
Speaker 2: Let's work hard, you know, Let's let's focus on being entrepreneurial.

1683
01:26:45,600 --> 01:26:49,400
Speaker 2: Let's focus on actually building things versus destroying things. And

1684
01:26:49,520 --> 01:26:51,840
Speaker 2: ripping things apart. Do you want to be a step up?

1685
01:26:52,000 --> 01:26:55,519
Speaker 2: But yeah, yeah, step up, you know, step up, And yeah.

1686
01:26:55,600 --> 01:26:56,280
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna be.

1687
01:26:56,680 --> 01:27:00,719
Speaker 2: You know, when I talk to sometimes my I lecture

1688
01:27:00,800 --> 01:27:04,000
Speaker 2: an undergrad. I have a big class. The semester's wrapped up.

1689
01:27:04,360 --> 01:27:06,360
Speaker 2: But you know, at the end of the semester too,

1690
01:27:06,479 --> 01:27:10,240
Speaker 2: sometimes I like to, you know, reflect on the way

1691
01:27:10,400 --> 01:27:12,160
Speaker 2: that I don't know what the class is political views,

1692
01:27:12,160 --> 01:27:15,040
Speaker 2: and I don't inject my political views ever in the class,

1693
01:27:15,520 --> 01:27:19,800
Speaker 2: but I do talk about how I have white kids,

1694
01:27:19,880 --> 01:27:23,840
Speaker 2: black kids, Latina kids, Asian students in my class, men, women,

1695
01:27:23,960 --> 01:27:28,080
Speaker 2: trans in my class. No one in my class ever

1696
01:27:28,200 --> 01:27:33,599
Speaker 2: thinks it's acceptable during the class to say, oh, look

1697
01:27:33,640 --> 01:27:36,040
Speaker 2: at you, this race, look at you, this person, look

1698
01:27:36,080 --> 01:27:36,920
Speaker 2: at you, this person.

1699
01:27:37,120 --> 01:27:38,320
Speaker 1: I don't like you. I don't like you.

1700
01:27:38,520 --> 01:27:40,240
Speaker 2: I mean, could you imagine what would happen in a

1701
01:27:40,280 --> 01:27:43,840
Speaker 2: class if everybody was interacting and treating each other like No,

1702
01:27:44,080 --> 01:27:48,120
Speaker 2: we act professional. There's a professor. We go through the semester,

1703
01:27:48,600 --> 01:27:52,200
Speaker 2: we get along the diversity and the class, the different views,

1704
01:27:52,280 --> 01:27:55,600
Speaker 2: different gen that made the class a more powerful experience

1705
01:27:55,840 --> 01:27:56,519
Speaker 2: and we were all.

1706
01:27:56,479 --> 01:27:57,080
Speaker 1: Happy with it.

1707
01:27:57,479 --> 01:27:59,680
Speaker 2: So as I end the semester, I always go to them.

1708
01:28:00,280 --> 01:28:04,280
Speaker 2: So why when we leave this classroom and go into

1709
01:28:04,439 --> 01:28:08,200
Speaker 2: now what a political setting or a professional setting. Now

1710
01:28:08,240 --> 01:28:11,080
Speaker 2: we're supposed to all of a sudden take this and

1711
01:28:11,280 --> 01:28:13,400
Speaker 2: now fight each other, and now not like each other.

1712
01:28:13,720 --> 01:28:15,880
Speaker 2: We saw the strength of what made this class of

1713
01:28:15,920 --> 01:28:18,439
Speaker 2: one hundred and five people strong. It was the very

1714
01:28:18,560 --> 01:28:21,240
Speaker 2: diverse We all liked each other. So go out there

1715
01:28:21,280 --> 01:28:23,880
Speaker 2: and remember that this was a valuable experience for all

1716
01:28:23,960 --> 01:28:26,160
Speaker 2: of us, and that should be what the real world was,

1717
01:28:26,240 --> 01:28:28,600
Speaker 2: and that's what we should be fighting for. Not to

1718
01:28:28,720 --> 01:28:33,280
Speaker 2: see in the halls of Congress them not letting people

1719
01:28:33,320 --> 01:28:34,679
Speaker 2: in bath. They're like, what are they even doing?

1720
01:28:34,840 --> 01:28:35,000
Speaker 3: You know?

1721
01:28:35,120 --> 01:28:37,960
Speaker 1: I mean, it's lost her mind.

1722
01:28:38,880 --> 01:28:40,479
Speaker 3: She was somebody who a few years ago, you know,

1723
01:28:40,600 --> 01:28:42,880
Speaker 3: kind of pretended to be an ally and she's now

1724
01:28:42,960 --> 01:28:43,920
Speaker 3: the biggest voice, you.

1725
01:28:43,960 --> 01:28:45,920
Speaker 4: Know, against she does the selfies in bat.

1726
01:28:45,960 --> 01:28:48,120
Speaker 3: It's like weird, right, It's like like sixty times a day.

1727
01:28:48,160 --> 01:28:50,280
Speaker 2: It's like you're on vacation sixty times a day about

1728
01:28:50,360 --> 01:28:54,200
Speaker 2: any top at all, even like a hobby would be strange.

1729
01:28:54,280 --> 01:28:56,560
Speaker 2: I mean, yet alone, like this is what you you know,

1730
01:28:56,680 --> 01:28:58,720
Speaker 2: this is what you occupy your time with. And that's

1731
01:28:58,720 --> 01:29:00,479
Speaker 2: how I try to flip it on the you know them,

1732
01:29:00,880 --> 01:29:02,800
Speaker 2: you know more than I'm like, this is what you're

1733
01:29:02,840 --> 01:29:06,400
Speaker 2: focused on, Like you wake up thinking about bathrooms all day.

1734
01:29:07,120 --> 01:29:10,400
Speaker 2: This is your main view, you know, and and and

1735
01:29:10,600 --> 01:29:13,200
Speaker 2: that's to me how you address it versus living in

1736
01:29:13,360 --> 01:29:18,760
Speaker 2: their framework of all of their grievance and pettiness.

1737
01:29:18,280 --> 01:29:20,519
Speaker 3: And hate just flipping on them, you know. I think

1738
01:29:20,560 --> 01:29:22,600
Speaker 3: one of the things that people I think one of

1739
01:29:22,640 --> 01:29:25,160
Speaker 3: the reasons why people gravitate to the stuff we do

1740
01:29:25,479 --> 01:29:27,800
Speaker 3: as well, is because they leave with the information. And

1741
01:29:27,840 --> 01:29:30,519
Speaker 3: then I think they also leave empowered. And I think

1742
01:29:30,640 --> 01:29:33,800
Speaker 3: folks need to be empowered. They need to feel in

1743
01:29:33,960 --> 01:29:36,400
Speaker 3: control of their lives. And I think a lot of these,

1744
01:29:36,680 --> 01:29:38,920
Speaker 3: you know, young kids right now don't feel in control

1745
01:29:38,960 --> 01:29:41,559
Speaker 3: of their lives. And a lot of it's not their fault, right,

1746
01:29:41,600 --> 01:29:43,360
Speaker 3: I mean, this is the situation. This is the hands

1747
01:29:43,400 --> 01:29:45,599
Speaker 3: that they have been dealt, and it's you know, through

1748
01:29:45,760 --> 01:29:48,439
Speaker 3: decades and decades and decades, you know, whether it's poor

1749
01:29:48,560 --> 01:29:53,519
Speaker 3: policy or just shifts in global everything, like whatever it is.

1750
01:29:53,800 --> 01:29:56,400
Speaker 3: You know, they're looking now, they're looking at their parents,

1751
01:29:56,760 --> 01:29:58,559
Speaker 3: and they're going, well, they had it easy. They were

1752
01:29:58,600 --> 01:30:01,519
Speaker 3: able to get a you know, my you know, Dad

1753
01:30:01,640 --> 01:30:03,920
Speaker 3: was able to get one job and work you know,

1754
01:30:04,479 --> 01:30:07,080
Speaker 3: five days a week, you know, eight hour days, and

1755
01:30:07,640 --> 01:30:10,920
Speaker 3: come home or dinner, and we had two week vacations,

1756
01:30:11,040 --> 01:30:13,439
Speaker 3: you know, twice a year. You know, they look and

1757
01:30:13,520 --> 01:30:14,920
Speaker 3: they go, how the heck am I going to do that?

1758
01:30:15,200 --> 01:30:17,519
Speaker 3: You know, even if I had a job where I

1759
01:30:17,640 --> 01:30:19,320
Speaker 3: was making six figures, I'm not going to be able

1760
01:30:19,320 --> 01:30:20,639
Speaker 3: to afford a house. I'm not going to be able

1761
01:30:20,680 --> 01:30:22,120
Speaker 3: to have savings. I'm not going to be able to

1762
01:30:22,200 --> 01:30:24,680
Speaker 3: live in a neighborhood where I could walk around and

1763
01:30:25,120 --> 01:30:27,760
Speaker 3: get everything that I need to survive. And then in

1764
01:30:27,880 --> 01:30:30,479
Speaker 3: doing all that, how am I going to have kids?

1765
01:30:30,520 --> 01:30:32,280
Speaker 3: How am I going to be able to afford a family?

1766
01:30:32,320 --> 01:30:34,639
Speaker 3: I can't even afford to get a coffee for myself,

1767
01:30:34,680 --> 01:30:37,360
Speaker 3: you know. So these are real issues also, and so

1768
01:30:37,960 --> 01:30:40,240
Speaker 3: what I don't want to do is write off also

1769
01:30:40,320 --> 01:30:43,080
Speaker 3: a lot of this as mere whining and you know,

1770
01:30:43,640 --> 01:30:46,280
Speaker 3: you kind of woe is me, But understand that, you know,

1771
01:30:46,800 --> 01:30:48,639
Speaker 3: people are hurting, going back to what we were saying

1772
01:30:48,680 --> 01:30:51,760
Speaker 3: at the beginning, and that's including these younger generations, and

1773
01:30:51,960 --> 01:30:54,040
Speaker 3: so I think we need to empower them and.

1774
01:30:54,320 --> 01:31:00,519
Speaker 4: Also like acknowledge, acknowledge the anxiety and struggle. Know whoever,

1775
01:31:00,680 --> 01:31:02,880
Speaker 4: they may be right, and I think we.

1776
01:31:02,920 --> 01:31:06,360
Speaker 3: Need to you know, acknowledge it. And you know what

1777
01:31:06,520 --> 01:31:09,640
Speaker 3: we've seen in those communities that you've talked about, the manuspheral,

1778
01:31:09,640 --> 01:31:13,320
Speaker 3: all that stuff, they've acknowledged it, and then they've directed

1779
01:31:13,479 --> 01:31:17,200
Speaker 3: that anger at the other They've directed you are you

1780
01:31:17,320 --> 01:31:21,840
Speaker 3: can't afford a home because the Democrats are giving the

1781
01:31:21,960 --> 01:31:24,599
Speaker 3: money to illegal immigrants and that money should have went

1782
01:31:24,640 --> 01:31:26,880
Speaker 3: to you. And then, you know, the second there's a

1783
01:31:26,960 --> 01:31:29,120
Speaker 3: social program that may actually help people, they go, oh, no,

1784
01:31:29,160 --> 01:31:32,200
Speaker 3: we're not gonna pay for that. That's socialism, that's communism.

1785
01:31:32,200 --> 01:31:33,400
Speaker 3: We're not going to do that. It's like, okay, so

1786
01:31:33,840 --> 01:31:35,920
Speaker 3: you don't believe in any of this, right, but but

1787
01:31:36,080 --> 01:31:39,040
Speaker 3: too often that energy is taken and then it's pushed

1788
01:31:39,040 --> 01:31:42,320
Speaker 3: in a negative direction to blame other people for you know,

1789
01:31:42,479 --> 01:31:46,200
Speaker 3: for those woes, for those issues. I think we all

1790
01:31:46,320 --> 01:31:48,599
Speaker 3: need to figure out a way as a society in general,

1791
01:31:48,720 --> 01:31:50,640
Speaker 3: to how do we empower people, you know, in a

1792
01:31:50,760 --> 01:31:53,439
Speaker 3: in a productive, positive way. And some of that also

1793
01:31:53,680 --> 01:31:56,560
Speaker 3: is going to require structural change and in you know,

1794
01:31:56,680 --> 01:31:58,400
Speaker 3: how are we going to ensure that these kids are

1795
01:31:58,439 --> 01:31:59,880
Speaker 3: going to be able to grow up and have family

1796
01:32:00,320 --> 01:32:03,920
Speaker 3: and have you know, productive lives and have a job

1797
01:32:04,120 --> 01:32:07,120
Speaker 3: that they could support their families with and enjoy the

1798
01:32:07,160 --> 01:32:09,880
Speaker 3: American dream as they've been told. I mean, we were

1799
01:32:09,920 --> 01:32:12,679
Speaker 3: all promised growing up, right, you know, go to college,

1800
01:32:13,080 --> 01:32:15,000
Speaker 3: you get a good you know, you get a good job,

1801
01:32:15,160 --> 01:32:18,240
Speaker 3: you'll you'll be good. Everything is good. And now that's

1802
01:32:18,360 --> 01:32:20,720
Speaker 3: not simply not what's happening in so many cases. So

1803
01:32:20,760 --> 01:32:23,920
Speaker 3: I think there's a bitterness that develops, and that bitterness

1804
01:32:24,040 --> 01:32:28,120
Speaker 3: is then you know, taken and weaponized for bad and

1805
01:32:28,200 --> 01:32:29,760
Speaker 3: I think we need to kind of figure out how

1806
01:32:29,800 --> 01:32:32,240
Speaker 3: to you know, take that and put people back on

1807
01:32:32,280 --> 01:32:32,760
Speaker 3: the right course.

1808
01:32:32,920 --> 01:32:36,400
Speaker 4: That's a good segue to my final question, which is,

1809
01:32:37,320 --> 01:32:40,639
Speaker 4: you know, you talk about empowering people, and I get

1810
01:32:40,840 --> 01:32:45,720
Speaker 4: very discouraged about the state of the country and disappointed

1811
01:32:46,120 --> 01:32:49,840
Speaker 4: and frustrated, and I'm curious. I like the idea, even

1812
01:32:49,880 --> 01:32:53,040
Speaker 4: though you know some of your YouTube things are like

1813
01:32:53,160 --> 01:32:57,000
Speaker 4: these big bold letters like the video he doesn't want

1814
01:32:57,080 --> 01:33:01,880
Speaker 4: you to see, or pathetic meltdown, lock him up. You know,

1815
01:33:02,040 --> 01:33:05,160
Speaker 4: it's very kind of I like it. You're saying a

1816
01:33:05,360 --> 01:33:08,360
Speaker 4: slightly New York posty about it. To be honest with you,

1817
01:33:08,479 --> 01:33:13,080
Speaker 4: with the yellow almost like in your face graphics. But

1818
01:33:14,520 --> 01:33:20,560
Speaker 4: I'm curious if you're optimistic about the country, and what

1819
01:33:20,840 --> 01:33:23,560
Speaker 4: kind of words of encouragement can you give me and

1820
01:33:23,760 --> 01:33:28,080
Speaker 4: other people watching this or listening to this that we're

1821
01:33:28,240 --> 01:33:32,080
Speaker 4: going to be okay and democracy is not going to

1822
01:33:32,160 --> 01:33:32,599
Speaker 4: go away.

1823
01:33:33,960 --> 01:33:36,840
Speaker 2: I am hopeful. I am optimistic, and I think that

1824
01:33:37,040 --> 01:33:43,240
Speaker 2: the plan that Trump and Musk had was to pretty

1825
01:33:43,320 --> 01:33:46,920
Speaker 2: much control all levers of everything right now and really

1826
01:33:47,080 --> 01:33:50,760
Speaker 2: beat down any opposition and resistance. I think what we

1827
01:33:50,920 --> 01:33:58,519
Speaker 2: see right now in federal courts is judges appointed by Trump, Reagan,

1828
01:34:00,000 --> 01:34:04,559
Speaker 2: George W. Bush on the due process questions. They made

1829
01:34:04,600 --> 01:34:06,320
Speaker 2: a lot of bad rulings on a lot of things,

1830
01:34:06,840 --> 01:34:10,360
Speaker 2: but on the due process questions, all judges have said,

1831
01:34:10,360 --> 01:34:12,920
Speaker 2: at least as of now of this recording, there is

1832
01:34:13,000 --> 01:34:16,640
Speaker 2: something called due process. You have to go and follow it,

1833
01:34:17,439 --> 01:34:20,560
Speaker 2: and we do not live in an authoritarian country. And

1834
01:34:20,680 --> 01:34:24,559
Speaker 2: so federal judges on that question, by and large across

1835
01:34:24,640 --> 01:34:27,800
Speaker 2: the country are standing up to Donald Trump more significantly.

1836
01:34:27,960 --> 01:34:28,160
Speaker 1: Though.

1837
01:34:28,320 --> 01:34:32,080
Speaker 2: I think you see the protests, peaceful protests growing, I

1838
01:34:32,120 --> 01:34:34,599
Speaker 2: think that's a good sign. I think what we saw

1839
01:34:34,680 --> 01:34:37,880
Speaker 2: with the hands off protest No King's Day, I think

1840
01:34:37,960 --> 01:34:42,240
Speaker 2: that's going to continue to grow. And that gives me

1841
01:34:42,320 --> 01:34:44,920
Speaker 2: a lot of hope as well. And I think that

1842
01:34:45,479 --> 01:34:47,800
Speaker 2: I take a lot of hope that people are in

1843
01:34:47,920 --> 01:34:53,400
Speaker 2: the fight right now. I was worried that after the election,

1844
01:34:54,320 --> 01:34:57,519
Speaker 2: you saw a lot of people just for about too much, yeah,

1845
01:34:57,600 --> 01:35:01,439
Speaker 2: tune out and just didn't anything. I think that we

1846
01:35:01,640 --> 01:35:06,599
Speaker 2: now have a opposition and resistance that looks and feels

1847
01:35:06,920 --> 01:35:10,760
Speaker 2: even stronger than what we saw back in twenty seventeen,

1848
01:35:10,880 --> 01:35:15,920
Speaker 2: twenty eighteen. I think people have seen Trump's reckless on

1849
01:35:16,120 --> 01:35:19,439
Speaker 2: and off again tariffs and all of this rhetoric that

1850
01:35:20,040 --> 01:35:22,719
Speaker 2: you know, it's the same kind of pattern. He huffs

1851
01:35:22,800 --> 01:35:27,000
Speaker 2: and he puffs and does something that causes harm and

1852
01:35:27,120 --> 01:35:30,719
Speaker 2: then he withdraws from it and then declares that a victory.

1853
01:35:31,479 --> 01:35:35,320
Speaker 2: And there's still some news outlets that report these things

1854
01:35:35,360 --> 01:35:37,800
Speaker 2: as victories. It's like he just is the arsonist who

1855
01:35:37,920 --> 01:35:40,840
Speaker 2: slightly put out a fire that he created, and now

1856
01:35:40,920 --> 01:35:43,000
Speaker 2: things are worse, and now he wants to declare that

1857
01:35:43,320 --> 01:35:47,720
Speaker 2: a victory. But I think that the publics that by

1858
01:35:47,800 --> 01:35:49,439
Speaker 2: and large is seeing that.

1859
01:35:49,680 --> 01:35:52,680
Speaker 4: I mean, Americans are smart, right, I mean a lot

1860
01:35:52,760 --> 01:35:53,599
Speaker 4: of them are smart.

1861
01:35:53,720 --> 01:35:57,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think we see Trump's approval right now

1862
01:35:57,600 --> 01:36:01,880
Speaker 2: is basically the worst in presentidential history at this time,

1863
01:36:02,000 --> 01:36:05,679
Speaker 2: including his first term. As you look across the poles

1864
01:36:05,760 --> 01:36:09,599
Speaker 2: and so he still has that thirty five percent kind

1865
01:36:09,640 --> 01:36:14,679
Speaker 2: of MAGA floor plus are minus another five or six percent.

1866
01:36:14,880 --> 01:36:17,559
Speaker 2: So some poles at thirty nine, some at forty two.

1867
01:36:17,960 --> 01:36:21,000
Speaker 2: But by and large, I don't think people like hostile

1868
01:36:21,120 --> 01:36:24,000
Speaker 2: takeovers of the federal government. I think people want to

1869
01:36:24,040 --> 01:36:26,880
Speaker 2: feel safe going on airplanes and not have a transportation

1870
01:36:27,040 --> 01:36:32,080
Speaker 2: secretary kind of panic on TV about flights and staffing

1871
01:36:32,200 --> 01:36:35,120
Speaker 2: and try to blame other people. I think people see

1872
01:36:35,400 --> 01:36:39,360
Speaker 2: veterans getting fired and disrespected. I think people see education

1873
01:36:39,560 --> 01:36:43,040
Speaker 2: being gutted, and I think that people don't like that stuff.

1874
01:36:43,160 --> 01:36:45,800
Speaker 4: Women dying in parking lot, I think too absolutely.

1875
01:36:46,000 --> 01:36:49,240
Speaker 2: And I think that people saying, you know, you know, no,

1876
01:36:49,680 --> 01:36:52,400
Speaker 2: we're not okay with this, and that gives.

1877
01:36:52,240 --> 01:36:53,880
Speaker 1: Me, That gives me hope.

1878
01:36:54,040 --> 01:36:57,280
Speaker 4: Even slack divism, whati's so called, you know, sitting on

1879
01:36:57,360 --> 01:37:00,680
Speaker 4: your chairs and trying to do some thing which was

1880
01:37:00,800 --> 01:37:03,840
Speaker 4: derided for so long, I think is actually a pretty

1881
01:37:03,880 --> 01:37:07,720
Speaker 4: good barometer of how people are feeling. You know, what

1882
01:37:07,880 --> 01:37:11,800
Speaker 4: they're saying on social media, how they're commenting and what

1883
01:37:11,920 --> 01:37:14,800
Speaker 4: they're watching, like the Midus network, right, you.

1884
01:37:14,800 --> 01:37:16,720
Speaker 3: Know percent Yeah, And then that's why we always say,

1885
01:37:16,720 --> 01:37:19,360
Speaker 3: you know, do what you can, right. You don't have

1886
01:37:19,520 --> 01:37:22,560
Speaker 3: to go out there and build a media network, right, Like,

1887
01:37:22,840 --> 01:37:25,360
Speaker 3: that's not we're asking, right, But but if your thing

1888
01:37:25,520 --> 01:37:28,280
Speaker 3: is getting your messages out on social media by sending messages,

1889
01:37:28,360 --> 01:37:30,439
Speaker 3: do it like we're talking to a neighbor. I'm listening

1890
01:37:30,479 --> 01:37:33,640
Speaker 3: to a neighbor, right, do it. If you if you're

1891
01:37:33,800 --> 01:37:37,200
Speaker 3: a painter, paint right, like, whatever it is that you do,

1892
01:37:38,040 --> 01:37:40,519
Speaker 3: do it and use that to empower yourself. Also, I

1893
01:37:40,560 --> 01:37:43,200
Speaker 3: think one of the things that I also think about

1894
01:37:43,360 --> 01:37:45,439
Speaker 3: is just how much throughout history, and not even just

1895
01:37:45,479 --> 01:37:48,479
Speaker 3: American history, but in general, they are these big pendulum

1896
01:37:48,520 --> 01:37:53,080
Speaker 3: swings and they happen quickly, and you know, I think.

1897
01:37:53,000 --> 01:37:55,519
Speaker 4: I've never seen one happen quite this quick and clearly.

1898
01:37:55,520 --> 01:37:57,160
Speaker 3: That's what I was going to say. I've never seen

1899
01:37:57,200 --> 01:37:59,200
Speaker 3: it happen as quickly as we've seen it happen now,

1900
01:37:59,280 --> 01:38:02,479
Speaker 3: and even since Donald Trump took office to right now,

1901
01:38:02,600 --> 01:38:06,080
Speaker 3: I think we've also seen a tremendous pendulum swing kind

1902
01:38:06,080 --> 01:38:09,200
Speaker 3: of influx. As we are kind of all living in

1903
01:38:09,280 --> 01:38:12,280
Speaker 3: this moment, how this will end. When it will end,

1904
01:38:12,400 --> 01:38:14,320
Speaker 3: what it looks like when we're on the other side.

1905
01:38:14,920 --> 01:38:17,040
Speaker 3: You know, I don't know that history has not yet

1906
01:38:17,120 --> 01:38:20,639
Speaker 3: been written, but I know that the pendulum always does swing.

1907
01:38:20,800 --> 01:38:22,720
Speaker 3: It doesn't happen on its own, but you know, it

1908
01:38:22,800 --> 01:38:25,200
Speaker 3: happens by collective action. And you know a lot of

1909
01:38:25,280 --> 01:38:27,840
Speaker 3: people staying engaged and in the fight, but I know

1910
01:38:28,000 --> 01:38:29,760
Speaker 3: it will. And that's why when we speak about these

1911
01:38:29,840 --> 01:38:32,840
Speaker 3: fair weather you know, folks who change their opinion based

1912
01:38:32,920 --> 01:38:34,920
Speaker 3: on the way the wind is blowing, I think they

1913
01:38:34,960 --> 01:38:37,000
Speaker 3: may get caught on the wrong side of you know,

1914
01:38:37,120 --> 01:38:40,719
Speaker 3: that pendulum when things swing back to you know, people

1915
01:38:41,320 --> 01:38:45,960
Speaker 3: you know pushing forward on you know, inclusion, diversity, people

1916
01:38:46,479 --> 01:38:49,920
Speaker 3: championing you know, workers' rights, people championing you know, the

1917
01:38:50,000 --> 01:38:53,200
Speaker 3: ability for people to afford their you know, medication or

1918
01:38:53,240 --> 01:38:55,840
Speaker 3: get their social security or whatever it is. I think

1919
01:38:55,840 --> 01:38:59,280
Speaker 3: there's a breaking point that society reaches, and I think

1920
01:38:59,360 --> 01:39:02,360
Speaker 3: we've kind of did a a speed run, you know,

1921
01:39:02,479 --> 01:39:04,599
Speaker 3: to where we are right now, even a speed run

1922
01:39:04,640 --> 01:39:06,280
Speaker 3: to Trump and now a speed run kind of back

1923
01:39:06,360 --> 01:39:08,800
Speaker 3: as people are like, oh shit, maybe this wasn't the

1924
01:39:08,840 --> 01:39:09,880
Speaker 3: best idea on the planet.

1925
01:39:10,080 --> 01:39:10,360
Speaker 2: I did.

1926
01:39:10,479 --> 01:39:12,640
Speaker 4: I did feel like Andy Basheer, who I don't know

1927
01:39:12,680 --> 01:39:14,920
Speaker 4: if you all talked about this, Ben, but he did

1928
01:39:15,000 --> 01:39:18,320
Speaker 4: have a good point about, you know, the Democrats and

1929
01:39:19,160 --> 01:39:23,360
Speaker 4: some progressives I think became a little too precious about

1930
01:39:23,479 --> 01:39:29,840
Speaker 4: words and about you know, shaming or judging or you know,

1931
01:39:30,000 --> 01:39:34,040
Speaker 4: being self righteous about framing certain issues to the point

1932
01:39:34,080 --> 01:39:36,960
Speaker 4: where it was like a turnoff for a lot of people.

1933
01:39:37,360 --> 01:39:39,720
Speaker 4: Do you agree with that criticism, Well, I.

1934
01:39:39,800 --> 01:39:43,840
Speaker 3: Think ultimately, speak as people speak, you know, don't don't

1935
01:39:43,880 --> 01:39:46,840
Speaker 3: try to cook up phrases in a lab. Don't try

1936
01:39:46,920 --> 01:39:50,840
Speaker 3: to you know, come up with euphemisms for things, or

1937
01:39:51,240 --> 01:39:53,439
Speaker 3: you don't know, you know how many times people have also,

1938
01:39:53,520 --> 01:39:55,040
Speaker 3: you know, come to us you know what I think

1939
01:39:55,080 --> 01:39:58,200
Speaker 3: you should say, you know, like experts, maybe instead of

1940
01:39:58,240 --> 01:40:00,960
Speaker 3: saying the language this way, maybe should say it, you know,

1941
01:40:01,200 --> 01:40:03,439
Speaker 3: this other way. And I'm like, I've never heard somebody

1942
01:40:03,520 --> 01:40:05,840
Speaker 3: use that phrase in my life, though, Like I can't.

1943
01:40:05,880 --> 01:40:07,560
Speaker 3: I don't even know what you're talking about. Honestly, it

1944
01:40:07,600 --> 01:40:08,840
Speaker 3: sounds like mumbo jumbo, like.

1945
01:40:08,800 --> 01:40:10,439
Speaker 1: A breda tested point three percent.

1946
01:40:10,760 --> 01:40:13,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, this tested. I'm like, I don't even know what

1947
01:40:13,680 --> 01:40:16,160
Speaker 3: that means. So, yeah, I'm going to talk how I

1948
01:40:16,200 --> 01:40:17,880
Speaker 3: speak with my brothers and how I speak with my friends.

1949
01:40:18,000 --> 01:40:20,120
Speaker 4: Yeah, and I know you say what what you can

1950
01:40:20,280 --> 01:40:22,760
Speaker 4: have in a group chat right like, it's it's got

1951
01:40:22,880 --> 01:40:26,120
Speaker 4: to be sort of figured out that way, JORDI bring

1952
01:40:26,240 --> 01:40:28,439
Speaker 4: it home money I I I.

1953
01:40:28,720 --> 01:40:30,479
Speaker 1: Want to echo your point that you said just before.

1954
01:40:30,760 --> 01:40:34,840
Speaker 1: Americans are spart Americans are resilient, and it's not going

1955
01:40:34,920 --> 01:40:37,160
Speaker 1: to be easy these next couple of years here, but

1956
01:40:37,280 --> 01:40:40,960
Speaker 1: democracy will prevail. I genuinely have hope. I know from

1957
01:40:41,000 --> 01:40:42,720
Speaker 1: the folks my age, I know where they're sinning that

1958
01:40:43,000 --> 01:40:46,280
Speaker 1: right now, and I know from you know, folks around

1959
01:40:46,320 --> 01:40:48,680
Speaker 1: Ben and Brett's age and then older, you know where

1960
01:40:48,720 --> 01:40:52,519
Speaker 1: they're sinning that. People love this country. This country is

1961
01:40:52,560 --> 01:40:57,040
Speaker 1: the greatest country in the world. Americans want this country

1962
01:40:57,120 --> 01:40:59,800
Speaker 1: to succeed. The world wants this country to succeed. And

1963
01:41:00,000 --> 01:41:01,479
Speaker 1: we just have to put our heads down every single

1964
01:41:01,560 --> 01:41:03,280
Speaker 1: day and do the work and make sure that we

1965
01:41:03,439 --> 01:41:05,600
Speaker 1: leave this country better off, you know, not just for

1966
01:41:05,720 --> 01:41:08,559
Speaker 1: our kids, but for the next several generations of kids

1967
01:41:08,800 --> 01:41:11,840
Speaker 1: hundreds of years down the line, because that's how much

1968
01:41:11,880 --> 01:41:12,800
Speaker 1: this country means to us.

1969
01:41:12,960 --> 01:41:15,080
Speaker 4: And in the mouth of it, mauths of babes, right,

1970
01:41:16,280 --> 01:41:17,519
Speaker 4: you did he nail it?

1971
01:41:17,600 --> 01:41:17,800
Speaker 3: Or well?

1972
01:41:17,960 --> 01:41:20,840
Speaker 4: Yes, you nailed it. Nailed it. You guys ever fight

1973
01:41:21,000 --> 01:41:23,120
Speaker 4: by the way, do you ever get into the guards?

1974
01:41:23,720 --> 01:41:28,800
Speaker 3: Absolutely, but listen, it's not it's not like but they're

1975
01:41:28,800 --> 01:41:31,040
Speaker 3: not like you know, it's it's little things. Honestly, like

1976
01:41:31,120 --> 01:41:32,320
Speaker 3: we we don't all that much.

1977
01:41:32,439 --> 01:41:34,519
Speaker 4: But you know, if do you like working together, it's

1978
01:41:34,560 --> 01:41:34,880
Speaker 4: the best.

1979
01:41:34,960 --> 01:41:38,000
Speaker 3: It's honestly, it's a dream like and I think always

1980
01:41:38,000 --> 01:41:40,120
Speaker 3: growing up, like we always wanted to work together in

1981
01:41:40,200 --> 01:41:42,320
Speaker 3: some capacity, and like as kids, we would like make

1982
01:41:42,400 --> 01:41:44,439
Speaker 3: movies together, you know, we would make like little action

1983
01:41:44,600 --> 01:41:47,200
Speaker 3: movies or horror movies or mystery movies or whatever, and

1984
01:41:47,479 --> 01:41:49,400
Speaker 3: and that that would be like our way of working together.

1985
01:41:49,400 --> 01:41:51,200
Speaker 3: I would play sports like whatever it was. Again, we'd

1986
01:41:51,200 --> 01:41:53,960
Speaker 3: always love doing stuff together. Then there just became a time,

1987
01:41:53,960 --> 01:41:56,679
Speaker 3: it came in time in life where our age difference,

1988
01:41:56,960 --> 01:41:59,599
Speaker 3: you know, separate you, separates you naturally. You know, when

1989
01:42:00,040 --> 01:42:02,240
Speaker 3: when Ben's already in college and I'm just starting high

1990
01:42:02,240 --> 01:42:04,360
Speaker 3: school and Jordi's in middle school, you know whatever that is,

1991
01:42:04,520 --> 01:42:06,599
Speaker 3: or I'm a senior in high school, Jeordie's just starting,

1992
01:42:06,880 --> 01:42:09,559
Speaker 3: you know, as a freshman in high school. And luckily

1993
01:42:09,600 --> 01:42:13,640
Speaker 3: I set the stage to make sure everybody likes, you know,

1994
01:42:13,760 --> 01:42:14,920
Speaker 3: but there's always these kinds.

1995
01:42:14,760 --> 01:42:16,360
Speaker 4: Of and that you live up to Ben's.

1996
01:42:17,880 --> 01:42:20,679
Speaker 3: You know, school president and teachers.

1997
01:42:22,200 --> 01:42:23,479
Speaker 1: That's a ridiculous award.

1998
01:42:23,720 --> 01:42:24,920
Speaker 2: You wanted the real war.

1999
01:42:26,360 --> 01:42:28,720
Speaker 4: It was a teachers awards.

2000
01:42:30,960 --> 01:42:35,840
Speaker 1: Him. Yeah, it suck up him. Right here, let's focus

2001
01:42:35,960 --> 01:42:36,759
Speaker 1: on the student government.

2002
01:42:39,240 --> 01:42:41,679
Speaker 4: Well, I have to say this is especially the longest

2003
01:42:41,760 --> 01:42:45,200
Speaker 4: podcast I've ever done, but it felt like the shortest.

2004
01:42:45,479 --> 01:42:48,479
Speaker 4: Thank you guys so so much. This was such a

2005
01:42:48,560 --> 01:42:52,000
Speaker 4: fun conversation. I learned a lot and just really enjoyed

2006
01:42:52,040 --> 01:42:53,960
Speaker 4: getting to know all three of you. So thank you.

2007
01:42:54,560 --> 01:42:56,800
Speaker 1: It was great to be here. And you know, we

2008
01:42:56,880 --> 01:42:58,320
Speaker 1: did grow up watching you and.

2009
01:43:00,200 --> 01:43:03,719
Speaker 3: They are such massive myers of Yes, truly an honor.

2010
01:43:03,840 --> 01:43:06,360
Speaker 3: So for this to be, you know, the first show

2011
01:43:06,400 --> 01:43:08,920
Speaker 3: that we're actually in person on together. You know, it's

2012
01:43:09,040 --> 01:43:11,840
Speaker 3: it's not by accident and where we're really grateful, you know,

2013
01:43:12,000 --> 01:43:13,840
Speaker 3: for that, and we're just so thrilled to be here

2014
01:43:13,880 --> 01:43:14,040
Speaker 3: with you.

2015
01:43:14,320 --> 01:43:16,360
Speaker 1: Thank you, thank you. I'm not just saying that because

2016
01:43:16,360 --> 01:43:19,320
Speaker 1: I'm the teachers. I'm not trying to suck out you

2017
01:43:19,360 --> 01:43:22,360
Speaker 1: see how you want. I'm genuinely genuinely.

2018
01:43:30,520 --> 01:43:33,479
Speaker 4: Thanks for listening. Everyone. If you have a question for

2019
01:43:33,680 --> 01:43:36,360
Speaker 4: me a subject you want us to cover, or you

2020
01:43:36,439 --> 01:43:39,080
Speaker 4: want to share your thoughts about how you navigate this

2021
01:43:39,240 --> 01:43:42,920
Speaker 4: crazy world, reach out send me a DM on Instagram.

2022
01:43:43,240 --> 01:43:46,160
Speaker 4: I would love to hear from you. Next Question is

2023
01:43:46,200 --> 01:43:50,480
Speaker 4: a production of iHeartMedia and Katie Kuric Media. The executive

2024
01:43:50,520 --> 01:43:54,560
Speaker 4: producers are Me, Katie Kuric, and Courtney Ltz. Our supervising

2025
01:43:54,640 --> 01:43:58,960
Speaker 4: producer is Ryan Martz, and our producers are Adriana Fazzio

2026
01:43:59,360 --> 01:44:04,560
Speaker 4: and Meredith Barnes. Julian Weller composed art theme music. For

2027
01:44:04,720 --> 01:44:07,720
Speaker 4: more information about today's episode, or to sign up for

2028
01:44:07,800 --> 01:44:10,920
Speaker 4: my newsletter, wake Up Call, go to the description in

2029
01:44:10,960 --> 01:44:14,479
Speaker 4: the podcast app, or visit us at Katiecuric dot com.

2030
01:44:15,000 --> 01:44:17,400
Speaker 4: You can also find me on Instagram and all my

2031
01:44:17,560 --> 01:44:22,160
Speaker 4: social media channels. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the

2032
01:44:22,320 --> 01:44:26,439
Speaker 4: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your

2033
01:44:26,479 --> 01:44:31,840
Speaker 4: favorite shows. Hi everyone, it's Katie Couric. You know I'm

2034
01:44:31,920 --> 01:44:35,400
Speaker 4: always on the go between running my media company, hosting

2035
01:44:35,479 --> 01:44:38,960
Speaker 4: my podcast, and of course covering the news. And I

2036
01:44:39,160 --> 01:44:41,680
Speaker 4: know that to keep doing what I love, I need

2037
01:44:41,800 --> 01:44:44,920
Speaker 4: to start caring for what gets me there, my feet.

2038
01:44:45,600 --> 01:44:48,320
Speaker 4: That's why I decided to try the Good feet stores

2039
01:44:48,479 --> 01:44:52,200
Speaker 4: personalized arch support system. I met with a Good Feet

2040
01:44:52,360 --> 01:44:56,439
Speaker 4: arch support specialist and after a personalized fitting, I left

2041
01:44:56,479 --> 01:44:59,880
Speaker 4: the store with my three step system designed to improve comfort,

2042
01:45:00,320 --> 01:45:04,519
Speaker 4: balance and support. My feet, knees, and back are thanking

2043
01:45:04,640 --> 01:45:08,479
Speaker 4: me already. Visit goodfeat dot com to learn more, find

2044
01:45:08,520 --> 01:45:12,559
Speaker 4: the nearest store, or book your own free personalized fitting.