1 00:00:02,400 --> 00:00:06,200 Speaker 1: Happy Saturday. Since it is November five, also known as 2 00:00:06,240 --> 00:00:09,480 Speaker 1: Guy Fox Day or Guy Fox Night, we are replaying 3 00:00:09,720 --> 00:00:13,480 Speaker 1: prior hosts Sarah and Deblina's episode on the Gunpowder Plot 4 00:00:13,600 --> 00:00:18,080 Speaker 1: as today's Saturday classic. This originally came out as two 5 00:00:18,160 --> 00:00:21,000 Speaker 1: parts that were separated by an entire week that was 6 00:00:21,040 --> 00:00:24,880 Speaker 1: on November two and n Each of those parts is 7 00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:28,040 Speaker 1: shorter than today's episodes typically are, so we are running 8 00:00:28,040 --> 00:00:35,120 Speaker 1: both of them together today, so enjoy. Welcome to Stuff 9 00:00:35,159 --> 00:00:45,360 Speaker 1: You Missed in History Class, a production of I Heart Radio. Hello, 10 00:00:45,400 --> 00:00:47,760 Speaker 1: and welcome to the podcast. I'm Deblina Chocolate Boardy and 11 00:00:47,760 --> 00:00:50,320 Speaker 1: I'm Sara Dout And the topic we're about to discuss 12 00:00:50,440 --> 00:00:53,960 Speaker 1: isn't exactly obscure, and at least some of our listeners, 13 00:00:54,000 --> 00:00:57,240 Speaker 1: the British contingent that is, probably won't be able to 14 00:00:57,280 --> 00:01:00,160 Speaker 1: say that they missed in history class. It has to 15 00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:03,000 Speaker 1: do with a certain celebration that's coming up in England 16 00:01:03,000 --> 00:01:06,679 Speaker 1: on November five. Some call it Bonfire Day, others call 17 00:01:06,720 --> 00:01:09,640 Speaker 1: it Fireworks Night, and still others know it as Guy 18 00:01:09,760 --> 00:01:12,880 Speaker 1: Fox Day, referring to the man whose name is most 19 00:01:12,920 --> 00:01:17,360 Speaker 1: associated with the notorious Gunpowder Plot. Athwarted attempt to blow 20 00:01:17,440 --> 00:01:22,360 Speaker 1: up Parliament on November five. It's also called the Powder Treason. Yeah, 21 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:25,840 Speaker 1: and people celebrate or commemorate this day in different ways, 22 00:01:25,880 --> 00:01:27,760 Speaker 1: and it's changed a lot over the years, but the 23 00:01:27,800 --> 00:01:30,959 Speaker 1: alternate names for the event really give you a good 24 00:01:31,040 --> 00:01:34,640 Speaker 1: general idea of what goes on. People set off fireworks 25 00:01:34,680 --> 00:01:37,880 Speaker 1: and they light up their bonfires, and often a top 26 00:01:37,920 --> 00:01:42,320 Speaker 1: of those bonfires, they'll burn Guy Fox in effigy, so 27 00:01:42,400 --> 00:01:44,360 Speaker 1: that might throw some of you guys for a loop. 28 00:01:44,440 --> 00:01:48,360 Speaker 1: Children will often sell those effigies eventually they call them guys. 29 00:01:48,440 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 1: They'll go out and they'll sell them on the street 30 00:01:50,400 --> 00:01:53,480 Speaker 1: and they'll ask for a penny for the guy. And 31 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:57,360 Speaker 1: those same kids are probably also pretty familiar with a 32 00:01:57,440 --> 00:02:01,200 Speaker 1: famous rhyme. Do you want to read it off for Scenarstaplina? Sure, 33 00:02:01,440 --> 00:02:06,360 Speaker 1: it's remember remember the fifth of November, gunpowder treason and plot. 34 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:09,760 Speaker 1: I see no reason why gunpowder treason should ever be 35 00:02:09,919 --> 00:02:14,240 Speaker 1: forgot and thanks at least in part to pop culture references. 36 00:02:14,320 --> 00:02:16,160 Speaker 1: And we'll talk a little bit more about that later. 37 00:02:16,200 --> 00:02:19,160 Speaker 1: But many people outside of the UK have heard this 38 00:02:19,360 --> 00:02:22,680 Speaker 1: rhyme too, and perhaps they even know the name Guy Fox. 39 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:24,720 Speaker 1: I mean, if you've ever seen the two thousand six 40 00:02:24,800 --> 00:02:28,359 Speaker 1: movie V for Vendetta, for example, this will surely ring 41 00:02:28,400 --> 00:02:29,960 Speaker 1: a bell, or if you just work in the house 42 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:33,120 Speaker 1: Stuff Works office. One of our coworkers, Jonathan Strickland of 43 00:02:33,280 --> 00:02:36,680 Speaker 1: tech Stuff, is definitely a fan of of rattling off 44 00:02:36,680 --> 00:02:39,359 Speaker 1: this rhyme from time to time. It's always fun to hear. Yeah, 45 00:02:39,400 --> 00:02:41,360 Speaker 1: And he and I were actually talking about that in 46 00:02:41,600 --> 00:02:43,600 Speaker 1: reference to the fact that there are a lot of 47 00:02:43,639 --> 00:02:47,480 Speaker 1: misconceptions out there about who exactly Guy Fox was and 48 00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:51,720 Speaker 1: what November five is commemorating. Some simply think that Fox 49 00:02:51,840 --> 00:02:54,040 Speaker 1: was the hero of the day, and they might be 50 00:02:54,080 --> 00:02:56,280 Speaker 1: surprised to learn what we just told you that he's 51 00:02:56,320 --> 00:02:59,160 Speaker 1: burned in effigy, or they at least think that he 52 00:02:59,320 --> 00:03:01,920 Speaker 1: was the master mind of the Gunpowder plot, which wasn't 53 00:03:01,960 --> 00:03:04,240 Speaker 1: the case at all. He's actually kind of a minor character, 54 00:03:04,400 --> 00:03:07,520 Speaker 1: not a master criminal at all. Really, right, So we're 55 00:03:07,560 --> 00:03:09,560 Speaker 1: going to take a closer look at the Gunpowder plot, 56 00:03:09,680 --> 00:03:13,400 Speaker 1: the motives behind it, and the players involved, including who 57 00:03:13,520 --> 00:03:16,799 Speaker 1: really instigated the whole thing. And we're also going to 58 00:03:16,880 --> 00:03:19,760 Speaker 1: discuss some conflicting theories over the origins of the plot, 59 00:03:19,760 --> 00:03:21,560 Speaker 1: but we're going to get to that later. First, we're 60 00:03:21,600 --> 00:03:25,480 Speaker 1: gonna give you the generally accepted version of events, and 61 00:03:25,520 --> 00:03:27,200 Speaker 1: to do that we need to kind of set the 62 00:03:27,200 --> 00:03:29,880 Speaker 1: scene a bit. So there's an overarching conflict at the 63 00:03:29,919 --> 00:03:32,600 Speaker 1: time which ends up leading to the events will discuss, 64 00:03:32,680 --> 00:03:36,360 Speaker 1: and the conflict is between English Catholics and English Protestants. 65 00:03:36,440 --> 00:03:39,560 Speaker 1: And by the time the gunpowder plot was devised, Catholics 66 00:03:39,560 --> 00:03:42,520 Speaker 1: in England had had pretty rough go of it for 67 00:03:42,600 --> 00:03:45,360 Speaker 1: many years, being persecuted. During the reign of Queen Elizabeth 68 00:03:45,360 --> 00:03:48,600 Speaker 1: the First, who was a Protestant, they'd been subject to 69 00:03:48,680 --> 00:03:52,080 Speaker 1: religious legislation that required them to attend to parish church 70 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:54,600 Speaker 1: every Sunday. And it wasn't just that they had to 71 00:03:54,640 --> 00:03:56,680 Speaker 1: go to church every Sunday. If you didn't go, it 72 00:03:56,720 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 1: was known as recusancy. And according to an article by 73 00:04:00,040 --> 00:04:04,440 Speaker 1: i'm in Adams in History Today, the penalty for recusancy 74 00:04:04,600 --> 00:04:08,440 Speaker 1: was originally a one shilling fine, but that ended up 75 00:04:08,440 --> 00:04:11,920 Speaker 1: going up to twenty pounds a month by fight one, 76 00:04:11,960 --> 00:04:13,640 Speaker 1: which I mean that still sounds like a lot of 77 00:04:13,640 --> 00:04:17,039 Speaker 1: money today. Twenty pounds that's pretty stee forty dollars or 78 00:04:17,080 --> 00:04:21,000 Speaker 1: so about that. So Elizabeth had been excommunicated by the 79 00:04:21,040 --> 00:04:24,920 Speaker 1: pope and she saw Recusans as potential traders, thus the 80 00:04:25,680 --> 00:04:29,680 Speaker 1: really high fine and the strict rules about what Catholics 81 00:04:29,720 --> 00:04:32,359 Speaker 1: had to do right. And there were other parts to 82 00:04:32,440 --> 00:04:35,719 Speaker 1: these penal laws as they were called um one that 83 00:04:35,800 --> 00:04:39,200 Speaker 1: declared that it was treason basically to convert a subject 84 00:04:39,279 --> 00:04:42,479 Speaker 1: to Catholicism, and also treason for a Jesuit or a 85 00:04:42,520 --> 00:04:45,520 Speaker 1: priest to enter the country. People who broke these laws 86 00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:48,960 Speaker 1: were executed. But towards the end of the fifteen nineties 87 00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:52,280 Speaker 1: Catholics started to have a little bit of hope. Elizabeth 88 00:04:52,279 --> 00:04:54,800 Speaker 1: was getting older and she was childless and didn't have 89 00:04:54,839 --> 00:04:58,760 Speaker 1: an air so there was the thinking, hey, maybe the 90 00:04:58,800 --> 00:05:02,080 Speaker 1: next monarch would be a little bit more tolerant of Catholics. 91 00:05:02,440 --> 00:05:05,360 Speaker 1: And when James the sixth of Scotland took the throne 92 00:05:05,360 --> 00:05:08,960 Speaker 1: in six o three after Elizabeth died, making him King 93 00:05:09,040 --> 00:05:11,640 Speaker 1: James the First of England, he kind of seemed to 94 00:05:11,680 --> 00:05:14,560 Speaker 1: be that guy. His wife, for example, Anne of Denmark, 95 00:05:14,680 --> 00:05:18,040 Speaker 1: she was Catholic, and with Anne's help, James had sort 96 00:05:18,040 --> 00:05:21,919 Speaker 1: of campaigned for support from other Catholic powers in Europe 97 00:05:22,360 --> 00:05:25,640 Speaker 1: and from the Pope also before Elizabeth's death, to kind 98 00:05:25,640 --> 00:05:28,320 Speaker 1: of prepare himself to not have opposition when he took 99 00:05:28,360 --> 00:05:31,440 Speaker 1: the throne in England, so those things kind of gave 100 00:05:31,800 --> 00:05:33,640 Speaker 1: Catholics a little bit of hope. They're like, okay, he 101 00:05:33,680 --> 00:05:37,640 Speaker 1: seems friendly towards Catholics. And also, according to an article 102 00:05:37,680 --> 00:05:41,320 Speaker 1: in History Review by Pauline Croft, James was pretty open 103 00:05:41,360 --> 00:05:43,480 Speaker 1: minded at least seemed that way at first. He said 104 00:05:43,480 --> 00:05:45,800 Speaker 1: to have commented that he didn't really want there to 105 00:05:45,839 --> 00:05:48,480 Speaker 1: be more Catholics in England, so he didn't want there 106 00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:50,560 Speaker 1: to be more converts or for more people to come in. 107 00:05:50,760 --> 00:05:54,159 Speaker 1: But if they kept their Catholic nous kind of on 108 00:05:54,240 --> 00:05:57,280 Speaker 1: the down low and followed the law, he wouldn't bother them, 109 00:05:57,360 --> 00:05:59,560 Speaker 1: or at least there wouldn't be major violence, like a 110 00:05:59,640 --> 00:06:03,080 Speaker 1: live in, let live philosophy. Almost so Catholics caught wind 111 00:06:03,120 --> 00:06:06,360 Speaker 1: of this, and some people thought, well, maybe it means 112 00:06:06,400 --> 00:06:10,560 Speaker 1: the end of the recusancy laws period, and some Catholics 113 00:06:10,600 --> 00:06:13,520 Speaker 1: even went as far as to petition James before his 114 00:06:13,600 --> 00:06:17,960 Speaker 1: coronation for toleration, really hoping that something would come out 115 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:21,280 Speaker 1: of this new monarch. James wouldn't go that far, and 116 00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:24,719 Speaker 1: he said that he'd suspend the monthly recusancy finds for 117 00:06:24,800 --> 00:06:26,960 Speaker 1: as long as they continued to support him, so he 118 00:06:27,040 --> 00:06:30,800 Speaker 1: kind of offered a halfway bargain there, and he also 119 00:06:30,880 --> 00:06:34,719 Speaker 1: added a few people with Catholic sympathies to the Privy Council, 120 00:06:34,800 --> 00:06:37,839 Speaker 1: including the Earl of Northumberland. So yeah, I mean that 121 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:41,520 Speaker 1: seems like a bit of a win, especially coming after Elizabeth. 122 00:06:41,920 --> 00:06:45,000 Speaker 1: But for many Catholics, they were just disappointed that they 123 00:06:45,040 --> 00:06:47,560 Speaker 1: were disappointed that there weren't more changes than they saw 124 00:06:47,640 --> 00:06:51,320 Speaker 1: under James. And as evidence of how disgruntled some people 125 00:06:51,360 --> 00:06:54,200 Speaker 1: were with James already, two plots against the king were 126 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:58,440 Speaker 1: discovered as early as June and July three, just to 127 00:06:58,440 --> 00:07:00,760 Speaker 1: give you an idea of exactly how all soon. That is, 128 00:07:00,839 --> 00:07:03,960 Speaker 1: Elizabeth had died in March um, so really just a 129 00:07:03,960 --> 00:07:06,880 Speaker 1: couple of months. These plots were called the Bye and 130 00:07:06,920 --> 00:07:09,520 Speaker 1: the Main plots, and there were different people involved in each, 131 00:07:09,560 --> 00:07:11,680 Speaker 1: but just to give you a summary of these. In 132 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:14,640 Speaker 1: the by plot, the goal was to kidnap the King 133 00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:18,240 Speaker 1: and his eldest son, Prince Henry, and forced James to 134 00:07:18,280 --> 00:07:22,960 Speaker 1: replace his chief ministers and to declare Catholic toleration. And 135 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:25,720 Speaker 1: the main plot, on the other hand, conspirators hoped to 136 00:07:25,760 --> 00:07:28,680 Speaker 1: get rid of James entirely, and to put his English 137 00:07:28,680 --> 00:07:31,920 Speaker 1: born cousin, Lady Arabel Stewart, on the throne. According to 138 00:07:31,960 --> 00:07:34,920 Speaker 1: Crofts article, though both of these plots were pretty incompetent, 139 00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:37,920 Speaker 1: which I guess is probably why they didn't work out, 140 00:07:38,360 --> 00:07:40,600 Speaker 1: But the fact that they were found out didn't stop 141 00:07:40,600 --> 00:07:44,000 Speaker 1: others from cooking up their own conspiracies, which is where 142 00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:47,360 Speaker 1: the gunpowder plot begins. So we're gonna start talking about 143 00:07:47,360 --> 00:07:51,720 Speaker 1: this conspiracy by talking about the conspirator specifically. The plot 144 00:07:51,720 --> 00:07:55,880 Speaker 1: began with a man named Robert Catesby, and Catesby was 145 00:07:56,040 --> 00:07:59,600 Speaker 1: a devout Catholic and he had become very disillusioned with 146 00:07:59,640 --> 00:08:01,920 Speaker 1: the govern ment early on when he saw his father 147 00:08:02,040 --> 00:08:05,640 Speaker 1: being persecuted for not conforming to Church of England rules. 148 00:08:05,680 --> 00:08:09,160 Speaker 1: And Katsby himself had been imprisoned for a brief time 149 00:08:09,200 --> 00:08:13,080 Speaker 1: after fighting in an uprising led by Robert Devreaux, who 150 00:08:13,120 --> 00:08:15,880 Speaker 1: was the second Earl of Essex back in sixteen o one. 151 00:08:16,240 --> 00:08:19,960 Speaker 1: So Katsby really wasn't like the Catholics who were entering 152 00:08:20,080 --> 00:08:22,760 Speaker 1: James Rain with a lot of hope and thinking there 153 00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:25,840 Speaker 1: was a lot of promise. He didn't trust in those promises, 154 00:08:25,880 --> 00:08:29,440 Speaker 1: and he he wasn't counting on anything. Katsby was also 155 00:08:29,840 --> 00:08:31,840 Speaker 1: kind of a ringleader of a small group of men 156 00:08:31,880 --> 00:08:34,080 Speaker 1: who had taken part in the Essex Revolt with him, 157 00:08:34,320 --> 00:08:38,120 Speaker 1: including Jack and kit Wright and Francis Tresham. Other men 158 00:08:38,200 --> 00:08:41,439 Speaker 1: related to them were also sympathetic to their cause. Thomas Percy, 159 00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:44,360 Speaker 1: for example, who worked for and was related to the 160 00:08:44,400 --> 00:08:47,280 Speaker 1: Earl of Northumberland, was brother in law to the Rights 161 00:08:47,760 --> 00:08:50,880 Speaker 1: and then Robert and Thomas Wintour, who were known for 162 00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:54,800 Speaker 1: giving priest refuge in their homes, were related to Katesby. 163 00:08:54,840 --> 00:08:57,920 Speaker 1: So at first they hoped that maybe Spain would invade 164 00:08:57,960 --> 00:09:01,280 Speaker 1: England to help the Catholics, and they offered their support 165 00:09:01,320 --> 00:09:04,000 Speaker 1: to Spain in that regard. But Spain was actually hoping 166 00:09:04,040 --> 00:09:06,160 Speaker 1: to end hostility with England at the time, and was 167 00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:09,480 Speaker 1: in the process of starting to negotiate a peace treaty 168 00:09:09,480 --> 00:09:12,360 Speaker 1: to that effect, so Katsby and his buddy started to 169 00:09:12,400 --> 00:09:15,440 Speaker 1: give up on Spain as a solution. We're not sure 170 00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:18,640 Speaker 1: exactly when the idea for the plot started brewing, but 171 00:09:18,760 --> 00:09:21,720 Speaker 1: by the beginning of sixteen oh four, Katesby shared with 172 00:09:21,800 --> 00:09:24,120 Speaker 1: tom Win Tour that he thought of a way to 173 00:09:24,160 --> 00:09:27,880 Speaker 1: solve their problem al right, So in January, the King 174 00:09:27,960 --> 00:09:30,640 Speaker 1: had announced that he was going to call parliament soon, 175 00:09:31,080 --> 00:09:34,040 Speaker 1: and Katsby's idea was to blow up the House of 176 00:09:34,080 --> 00:09:37,520 Speaker 1: Parliament while they were in session, and apparently when Tour 177 00:09:37,679 --> 00:09:41,680 Speaker 1: was kind of hesitant about this, but Katsby was a 178 00:09:41,760 --> 00:09:46,240 Speaker 1: smooth talker and ultimately convinced the gang. So Kidsby held 179 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:48,880 Speaker 1: a meeting of people who were to be involved in 180 00:09:48,920 --> 00:09:52,559 Speaker 1: the plot on May four in London at the Duck 181 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:55,720 Speaker 1: and Drake lodging house in the Strand, and he had 182 00:09:55,760 --> 00:09:59,200 Speaker 1: three of his posse there, Tom Wintour, Thomas Percy and 183 00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:02,560 Speaker 1: Jack Right. But there was a fifth person to a 184 00:10:02,640 --> 00:10:07,559 Speaker 1: very important one, none other than Guy Fox himself. So 185 00:10:07,640 --> 00:10:10,720 Speaker 1: Fox is an interesting character in this whole discussion about 186 00:10:10,760 --> 00:10:14,040 Speaker 1: the tensions between the Protestants and the Catholics. He was 187 00:10:14,080 --> 00:10:17,520 Speaker 1: a militant Catholic convert from Yorkshire. He was born in 188 00:10:17,600 --> 00:10:21,000 Speaker 1: April thirteenth, fifteen seventy to a Protestant dad and a 189 00:10:21,040 --> 00:10:24,120 Speaker 1: Catholic mom. His dad died when he was young, though, 190 00:10:24,160 --> 00:10:26,480 Speaker 1: so his mom and her actions in the underground Catholic 191 00:10:26,520 --> 00:10:29,319 Speaker 1: community in England really ended up being a big influence 192 00:10:29,360 --> 00:10:32,600 Speaker 1: on him. Fox also went to St. Peter's School, in York, 193 00:10:32,760 --> 00:10:35,439 Speaker 1: which also had Catholic leaning, so that probably had a 194 00:10:35,440 --> 00:10:38,719 Speaker 1: big influence in how his views turned out grew up, 195 00:10:38,760 --> 00:10:41,000 Speaker 1: and that's also where he might have met the Wright brothers. 196 00:10:41,360 --> 00:10:44,000 Speaker 1: He ended up going into military service abroad, serving in 197 00:10:44,040 --> 00:10:46,680 Speaker 1: the Spanish Army in the Netherlands from fifteen ninety three 198 00:10:46,800 --> 00:10:50,360 Speaker 1: to about sixteen o four. In sixteen o three, though, 199 00:10:50,480 --> 00:10:53,240 Speaker 1: he was sent on a diplomatic mission to Spain to 200 00:10:53,320 --> 00:10:56,800 Speaker 1: try and convince them to invade England, much like Catesby 201 00:10:56,880 --> 00:11:00,280 Speaker 1: and friends did before. And that's also where he might 202 00:11:00,280 --> 00:11:03,600 Speaker 1: have come into contact with Katesby's crew through these interactions, 203 00:11:03,600 --> 00:11:05,920 Speaker 1: so just looking for areas where he might have met 204 00:11:06,000 --> 00:11:08,439 Speaker 1: up with them or where they may have heard of him. 205 00:11:08,480 --> 00:11:11,360 Speaker 1: At any rate, Katesby and his fellow plotters needed someone 206 00:11:11,400 --> 00:11:15,000 Speaker 1: like Fox in the mix. He was their muscle of sorts. 207 00:11:15,080 --> 00:11:17,800 Speaker 1: He knew something about guns and AMMO, and since he'd 208 00:11:17,840 --> 00:11:21,960 Speaker 1: been away from England for so long, his face was unknown, 209 00:11:22,040 --> 00:11:24,640 Speaker 1: and that's a key point to remember, very important because 210 00:11:24,679 --> 00:11:26,320 Speaker 1: he was going to have to do some sort of 211 00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:31,040 Speaker 1: reconnaissance type work. So those five conspirators had their meeting 212 00:11:31,120 --> 00:11:33,600 Speaker 1: in the Strand and they took an oath of secrecy, 213 00:11:33,720 --> 00:11:36,199 Speaker 1: and they said mass, and then they talked about the plan. 214 00:11:36,720 --> 00:11:39,920 Speaker 1: So by that time, Parliament had been in session since 215 00:11:40,000 --> 00:11:43,200 Speaker 1: March and was expected to last at least a couple 216 00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:46,200 Speaker 1: of months. More so, the plan was to lease a 217 00:11:46,200 --> 00:11:48,520 Speaker 1: house next to the House of Lord's Chamber in the 218 00:11:48,559 --> 00:11:52,520 Speaker 1: old Palace of Westminster. Then they would dig a tunnel 219 00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:56,040 Speaker 1: from the sellers of the least House to the foundations 220 00:11:56,120 --> 00:11:59,320 Speaker 1: of the Chamber and put some gunpowder in there. They'd 221 00:11:59,640 --> 00:12:03,400 Speaker 1: bring gunpowder in at night from Catesby's house across the towns. 222 00:12:03,480 --> 00:12:05,280 Speaker 1: So you can start to get the sense of why 223 00:12:05,360 --> 00:12:08,280 Speaker 1: it would be important to not be a guy everybody 224 00:12:08,320 --> 00:12:11,520 Speaker 1: recognized around town. Yeah, you wouldn't want to be recognized 225 00:12:11,559 --> 00:12:13,840 Speaker 1: because there was a lot of at stake. If this worked, 226 00:12:13,880 --> 00:12:15,560 Speaker 1: they were going to be blowing up Parliament. They were 227 00:12:15,559 --> 00:12:18,760 Speaker 1: going to be killing the king. Also his son, and 228 00:12:19,160 --> 00:12:22,360 Speaker 1: his other son was sickly. So the plan after this 229 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:27,800 Speaker 1: was to kidnap young Princess Elizabeth and basically make her 230 00:12:27,880 --> 00:12:30,720 Speaker 1: their puppet queen. But I mean, the details surrounding this 231 00:12:30,800 --> 00:12:32,400 Speaker 1: are still kind of sketchy, and we're going to talk 232 00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:34,840 Speaker 1: about that a little bit more later. But once they 233 00:12:34,840 --> 00:12:37,360 Speaker 1: settled on a general Plan, or part one of the plan, 234 00:12:37,440 --> 00:12:40,520 Speaker 1: at least they set to it. Percy leased the house 235 00:12:40,600 --> 00:12:43,360 Speaker 1: with the help of his connections to the Earl of Northumberland, 236 00:12:43,760 --> 00:12:47,880 Speaker 1: but then on July seven, Parliament was postponed and scheduled 237 00:12:47,920 --> 00:12:52,520 Speaker 1: to reconvene in February of six five. Before that meeting ended, though, 238 00:12:52,559 --> 00:12:55,520 Speaker 1: they did manage to reconfirm all of those penalties that 239 00:12:55,559 --> 00:12:59,240 Speaker 1: applied to Catholics and recusancy fines were reinstated, so adding 240 00:12:59,320 --> 00:13:04,280 Speaker 1: fuel to the potential explosive fire exactly. So, they agreed 241 00:13:04,320 --> 00:13:06,840 Speaker 1: to start working again in the fall keep moving towards 242 00:13:06,920 --> 00:13:10,680 Speaker 1: their plot, but Parliament was delayed again until October six 243 00:13:10,920 --> 00:13:14,319 Speaker 1: oh five, and eventually it was rescheduled again until November five, 244 00:13:14,720 --> 00:13:18,560 Speaker 1: so they agreed to start work again that February. That March, though, 245 00:13:18,600 --> 00:13:21,360 Speaker 1: they had a stroke of luck the lease for a 246 00:13:21,440 --> 00:13:25,200 Speaker 1: ground floor seller between their tunnel and the House of 247 00:13:25,240 --> 00:13:29,160 Speaker 1: Lords meeting space became available. According to the BBC, that 248 00:13:29,240 --> 00:13:32,120 Speaker 1: seller extended right underneath the House of Lords, so it 249 00:13:32,160 --> 00:13:36,120 Speaker 1: allowed the plotters to pack the gunpowder, thirty six barrels 250 00:13:36,160 --> 00:13:38,200 Speaker 1: of it, in fact, right where it would be the 251 00:13:38,240 --> 00:13:50,920 Speaker 1: most dangerous. So when we saw them last March, of 252 00:13:51,000 --> 00:13:54,440 Speaker 1: sixteen o five. Our conspirators had just lucked out, and 253 00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:57,520 Speaker 1: they had gotten the chance to Lisa Seller, which would 254 00:13:57,840 --> 00:13:59,840 Speaker 1: was used at the time for coal storage. I believe 255 00:14:00,200 --> 00:14:02,960 Speaker 1: that extended right underneath the House of Lords, so it 256 00:14:03,000 --> 00:14:06,199 Speaker 1: made the tunnel unnecessary. It's a really good break for them, exactly. 257 00:14:06,280 --> 00:14:09,640 Speaker 1: So the plotters started filling up the cellar with barrels 258 00:14:09,640 --> 00:14:12,920 Speaker 1: and barrels of gunpowder, sneaking in at night, and they 259 00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:16,320 Speaker 1: kept it pretty well concealed too. They covered it with 260 00:14:16,360 --> 00:14:19,520 Speaker 1: iron bars and lots of bundles of kindling, so you 261 00:14:19,520 --> 00:14:22,080 Speaker 1: couldn't just tell it was a cellar full of gunpowder. 262 00:14:22,440 --> 00:14:24,960 Speaker 1: So over the next few months they managed to get 263 00:14:25,000 --> 00:14:28,360 Speaker 1: about thirty six barrels of gunpowder in there, which was 264 00:14:28,520 --> 00:14:32,400 Speaker 1: definitely enough to demolish everything in the immediate area, including 265 00:14:32,400 --> 00:14:34,800 Speaker 1: of course the king and his heir and the members 266 00:14:34,800 --> 00:14:37,960 Speaker 1: of parliament. But that was only if the gunpowder was 267 00:14:38,120 --> 00:14:41,920 Speaker 1: fresh enough by the time they actually ignited it. And 268 00:14:42,240 --> 00:14:46,120 Speaker 1: some folks have suggested that the gunpowder might have decayed 269 00:14:46,680 --> 00:14:49,440 Speaker 1: um others say, well, maybe they were able to replace 270 00:14:49,480 --> 00:14:51,240 Speaker 1: some of it, but that turns out to be a 271 00:14:51,320 --> 00:14:53,760 Speaker 1: moot point, and it still would have done some damage 272 00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:56,960 Speaker 1: we can assume. But during this time Fox assumed the 273 00:14:57,080 --> 00:15:00,680 Speaker 1: role of the seller's caretaker, posing as a John Johnson, 274 00:15:01,080 --> 00:15:03,880 Speaker 1: a servant of Thomas Percy, who was the plotter who 275 00:15:03,880 --> 00:15:06,800 Speaker 1: would lease the space. And Fox was really well suited 276 00:15:06,800 --> 00:15:08,840 Speaker 1: to this role too, because, as we mentioned in the 277 00:15:08,840 --> 00:15:11,440 Speaker 1: previous podcast, he'd been out of the country for some time. 278 00:15:11,520 --> 00:15:15,680 Speaker 1: So his appearance, which Gunpowder plot historian Antonio Frasier has 279 00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:20,320 Speaker 1: described as quote tall, powerfully built, with thick reddish brown hair, 280 00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:23,240 Speaker 1: a flowing mustache in the tradition of the time, and 281 00:15:23,320 --> 00:15:26,680 Speaker 1: a bushy, reddish brown beard, was pretty much unknown in 282 00:15:26,760 --> 00:15:29,160 Speaker 1: London at that time, which is fortunate because he does 283 00:15:29,160 --> 00:15:31,600 Speaker 1: sound like a guy you probably would recognize if he 284 00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:34,960 Speaker 1: saw him. Twice. Yes, very distinctive. So the plot seemed 285 00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:39,680 Speaker 1: to be progressing steadily, but before fall even rolled around, 286 00:15:39,800 --> 00:15:43,200 Speaker 1: the conspirators did something you should probably never do if 287 00:15:43,240 --> 00:15:46,200 Speaker 1: you're really trying to keep a secret. They let more 288 00:15:46,280 --> 00:15:48,840 Speaker 1: people in on it. Kind of a lot, but we'll 289 00:15:48,840 --> 00:15:51,160 Speaker 1: just give you a refresher because there are a lot 290 00:15:51,200 --> 00:15:53,280 Speaker 1: of names here, and they worked to add many more 291 00:15:53,360 --> 00:15:58,120 Speaker 1: names to their party. But the original conspirators were catesby 292 00:15:58,160 --> 00:16:03,120 Speaker 1: Tom Wintour Thomas Percy, Jack Right, and Guy Fox. So 293 00:16:03,280 --> 00:16:07,680 Speaker 1: in the spring of sixteen o five, they included Robert Wintour, 294 00:16:07,760 --> 00:16:11,560 Speaker 1: who was Tom's brother, Kit Wright, who was Jack's brother, 295 00:16:12,080 --> 00:16:16,080 Speaker 1: and John Grant, who was Wintour's brother in law. Another guy, 296 00:16:16,200 --> 00:16:19,960 Speaker 1: Robert Keys, who was probably related to the Wintour brother 297 00:16:20,080 --> 00:16:23,440 Speaker 1: somehow or another, was also led into the group, as 298 00:16:23,720 --> 00:16:27,320 Speaker 1: was katesby servant Thomas Bates. So, I mean, I guess 299 00:16:27,320 --> 00:16:29,800 Speaker 1: you figure you can trust your your brother. So they're 300 00:16:29,840 --> 00:16:32,720 Speaker 1: telling a few people, but this is already starting to 301 00:16:32,760 --> 00:16:35,960 Speaker 1: swell to a pretty large group of men. Yeah, And 302 00:16:36,000 --> 00:16:38,280 Speaker 1: then it got even worse when the plotters took a 303 00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:41,080 Speaker 1: break from the preparations they were doing over the summer. 304 00:16:41,320 --> 00:16:46,800 Speaker 1: Katesby also brought Ambrose Rookwood, Sir Everard Digby, and Francis Tresham, 305 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:50,760 Speaker 1: Katesby's cousin by marriage, into the fold, mainly because of 306 00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:53,840 Speaker 1: their wealth. Katesby had been funding this whole thing by 307 00:16:53,880 --> 00:16:56,000 Speaker 1: himself so far, and he really needed some help to 308 00:16:56,040 --> 00:16:59,640 Speaker 1: see it to its completion. And Rookwood and Digby were 309 00:16:59,640 --> 00:17:01,600 Speaker 1: also so supposed to have a role in what will 310 00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:05,320 Speaker 1: refer to as Part two of this plan. They both 311 00:17:05,320 --> 00:17:06,960 Speaker 1: had a lot of horses that were going to be 312 00:17:07,080 --> 00:17:10,400 Speaker 1: useful in the uprising that Katesby was planning after the explosion, 313 00:17:10,480 --> 00:17:14,160 Speaker 1: but more specifically after the explosion, which would take place 314 00:17:14,240 --> 00:17:17,560 Speaker 1: after Fox lit a slow match in the cellar. As 315 00:17:17,560 --> 00:17:19,840 Speaker 1: soon as the King had come into the House of Lords. 316 00:17:20,280 --> 00:17:23,200 Speaker 1: Katesby would ride from London to the Midlands, where he'd 317 00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:26,520 Speaker 1: meete Digby, and Digby would have been waiting beforehand with 318 00:17:26,560 --> 00:17:29,760 Speaker 1: some servants that the Red Lion and dun Church disguised 319 00:17:29,760 --> 00:17:32,840 Speaker 1: as a hunting party. From there, they would supposedly go 320 00:17:32,920 --> 00:17:36,320 Speaker 1: to kidnap Princess Elizabeth, the King's daughter, from the home 321 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:39,320 Speaker 1: of her governor and proclaim her queen. And we mentioned 322 00:17:39,320 --> 00:17:42,120 Speaker 1: her in the previous podcast as well. And the reason 323 00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:44,280 Speaker 1: that they were going to proclaim her queen is because 324 00:17:44,280 --> 00:17:47,159 Speaker 1: Prince Henry would have died in the explosion. He was 325 00:17:47,160 --> 00:17:49,719 Speaker 1: the oldest son of the king and four year old 326 00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:52,399 Speaker 1: Prince Charles was too sickly. There were some there was 327 00:17:52,440 --> 00:17:54,040 Speaker 1: some question as to whether or not he was going 328 00:17:54,119 --> 00:17:56,359 Speaker 1: to survive, and they didn't want to place all their 329 00:17:56,400 --> 00:18:00,160 Speaker 1: hopes on him. So yeah, that was the general idea 330 00:18:00,240 --> 00:18:02,240 Speaker 1: of the plot. But what was going to happen next, 331 00:18:02,359 --> 00:18:05,760 Speaker 1: after they had kidnapped Princess Elizabeth is sort of unclear. 332 00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:09,520 Speaker 1: In an article for History Today, Simon Adams says, that's 333 00:18:09,600 --> 00:18:13,280 Speaker 1: quote one of the major mysteries of the plot. So 334 00:18:13,880 --> 00:18:16,879 Speaker 1: presumably they would just try to marry Elizabeth off to 335 00:18:17,200 --> 00:18:21,479 Speaker 1: some other Catholic European prince and solidify their Catholic regime 336 00:18:21,560 --> 00:18:25,720 Speaker 1: that way, and they would create their own puppet queen essentially. 337 00:18:26,200 --> 00:18:29,440 Speaker 1: According to an article by Pauline Croft in History Review, though, 338 00:18:29,800 --> 00:18:33,040 Speaker 1: Tresham was uneasy about the whole plot pretty much as 339 00:18:33,040 --> 00:18:35,800 Speaker 1: soon as he heard it. So giant red flag here. 340 00:18:36,000 --> 00:18:38,159 Speaker 1: He's not liking what he hears. You can't take it 341 00:18:38,200 --> 00:18:40,760 Speaker 1: back once you tell somebody all about your plot either. 342 00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:43,720 Speaker 1: But regardless of how everyone felt about it, I mean, 343 00:18:43,760 --> 00:18:46,600 Speaker 1: that's still more than ten people. That's just a lot 344 00:18:46,640 --> 00:18:48,679 Speaker 1: of people to be involved in what's supposed to be 345 00:18:48,680 --> 00:18:52,280 Speaker 1: a secret plot. So maybe what happened next really isn't 346 00:18:52,280 --> 00:18:57,680 Speaker 1: that surprising. On October five, just days before Parliament was 347 00:18:57,720 --> 00:19:00,360 Speaker 1: set to meet William Parker, who's better and own as 348 00:19:00,359 --> 00:19:04,560 Speaker 1: Lord Monteagle, received an anonymous letter warning him to quote, 349 00:19:04,560 --> 00:19:07,760 Speaker 1: devise some excuse to shift your attendance at this Parliament 350 00:19:08,040 --> 00:19:12,359 Speaker 1: to avoid quote a terrible blow. So basically, stay away 351 00:19:12,400 --> 00:19:15,480 Speaker 1: for your own good, don't go to parliament. So Lord 352 00:19:15,520 --> 00:19:19,480 Speaker 1: Monteagle was a former Catholic himself. He had also participated 353 00:19:19,520 --> 00:19:22,439 Speaker 1: in that Essex uprising with Katesby and friends that we 354 00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:26,200 Speaker 1: mentioned in the earlier podcast, and he had at least 355 00:19:26,200 --> 00:19:32,040 Speaker 1: publicly converted to the Protestant religion. Still he had Catholic connections, 356 00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:36,720 Speaker 1: especially through his marriage. Trasham was Montegal's brother in law, 357 00:19:36,800 --> 00:19:41,280 Speaker 1: so um, unfortunately for Kate's By, Tresham had a few 358 00:19:41,320 --> 00:19:44,960 Speaker 1: brothers in law to consider. But that's why the letter 359 00:19:45,119 --> 00:19:48,600 Speaker 1: is often attributed to Tresham because of that family connection. 360 00:19:48,880 --> 00:19:51,359 Speaker 1: But we really don't know for sure who sent it, 361 00:19:51,480 --> 00:19:55,320 Speaker 1: who warned Lord Monteagle. Yeah. Croft actually throws out some 362 00:19:55,400 --> 00:19:58,040 Speaker 1: other potential sources of the letter. She writes, for example, 363 00:19:58,119 --> 00:20:02,080 Speaker 1: that Tom Winter sometimes served as montegal secretary, so there's 364 00:20:02,080 --> 00:20:04,960 Speaker 1: a connection there. But there's another theory that's even more 365 00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:08,080 Speaker 1: interesting to me at least. Croft also suggests that it's 366 00:20:08,119 --> 00:20:12,240 Speaker 1: possible that Monteagle himself wrote the letter and just incorporated 367 00:20:12,320 --> 00:20:15,920 Speaker 1: information that he gleaned from some of his Catholic cohorts 368 00:20:16,040 --> 00:20:18,679 Speaker 1: to tip people off under under the guise of an 369 00:20:18,680 --> 00:20:21,320 Speaker 1: anonymous letter right but regardless of where it came from. 370 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:24,440 Speaker 1: Montegal shared this letter with Sir Robert Cecil, the Earl 371 00:20:24,480 --> 00:20:27,520 Speaker 1: of Salisbury, the head of the monarchy secret police, and 372 00:20:27,560 --> 00:20:30,680 Speaker 1: the King's Secretary of State. Salisbury, in turn, of course, 373 00:20:30,720 --> 00:20:32,959 Speaker 1: shares the letter with the King, and there aren't any 374 00:20:33,040 --> 00:20:35,639 Speaker 1: specifics in the letter, so they wait a couple of 375 00:20:35,680 --> 00:20:38,720 Speaker 1: days before they raise any sort of alarm. Katesby in 376 00:20:38,720 --> 00:20:41,400 Speaker 1: the meantime he hears about the letter too, and he's 377 00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:45,160 Speaker 1: obviously worried that the plot has been betrayed, so he 378 00:20:45,240 --> 00:20:48,560 Speaker 1: consults with his co conspirators and they actually decided just 379 00:20:48,640 --> 00:20:52,080 Speaker 1: to go ahead with the plan. They suspected I've read 380 00:20:52,119 --> 00:20:54,719 Speaker 1: that Tresham was at fault, but he swore to them 381 00:20:54,760 --> 00:20:57,520 Speaker 1: that he didn't do anything, so they just said, okay, 382 00:20:57,600 --> 00:21:00,680 Speaker 1: let's go. They weren't going to just complete rushed into 383 00:21:00,680 --> 00:21:04,280 Speaker 1: it blindly though, just sname case. On November four, Percy 384 00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:08,240 Speaker 1: visited with his boss and his relative, the Earl of Northumberland, 385 00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:12,000 Speaker 1: whose connections had of course helped Percy lease the house 386 00:21:12,000 --> 00:21:14,040 Speaker 1: in the cellar in the first place. He checked with 387 00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:17,560 Speaker 1: him to try to gauge whether or not the Earl 388 00:21:17,600 --> 00:21:22,240 Speaker 1: of Northumberland knew anything about the plan. Ironically, Percy did 389 00:21:22,280 --> 00:21:25,240 Speaker 1: not warn his relative to try to stay away from 390 00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:28,600 Speaker 1: Parliament himself that day. But Percy left the meeting feeling 391 00:21:28,600 --> 00:21:32,000 Speaker 1: pretty reassured that they were in the clear. Nobody knew 392 00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:34,879 Speaker 1: it was good, so it is all just full speed 393 00:21:34,880 --> 00:21:38,800 Speaker 1: ahead for the gunpowder plotters, or so they think, because 394 00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:41,440 Speaker 1: Saulisbury by this time has ordered the area all around 395 00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:44,880 Speaker 1: the Palace of Westminster, which houses Parliament, to be searched. 396 00:21:45,359 --> 00:21:48,400 Speaker 1: During the first search, though they didn't find anything, though 397 00:21:48,400 --> 00:21:51,240 Speaker 1: they did run into Fox there. He was, of course, 398 00:21:51,280 --> 00:21:54,960 Speaker 1: posing as John Johnson, and so they took him basically 399 00:21:54,960 --> 00:21:56,399 Speaker 1: for what he was posing to be. They took him 400 00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:59,679 Speaker 1: for a servant. The gunpowder, as we mentioned, was concealed, 401 00:22:00,000 --> 00:22:02,200 Speaker 1: so they didn't see that in the search either. They 402 00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:04,919 Speaker 1: did notice all of that kindling, though, the kindling that 403 00:22:04,960 --> 00:22:07,880 Speaker 1: we mentioned that was concealing the gunpowder, and they thought 404 00:22:07,920 --> 00:22:10,359 Speaker 1: it was a little weird that that was all there. 405 00:22:10,680 --> 00:22:13,359 Speaker 1: But when they realized that Thomas Percy, who was of 406 00:22:13,400 --> 00:22:17,919 Speaker 1: course a well respected gentleman pensioner, was leasing the space, 407 00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:21,600 Speaker 1: they figured, all right, it's probably okay. But then, according 408 00:22:21,640 --> 00:22:25,040 Speaker 1: to that Craft article, again Montego raised suspicient about the 409 00:22:25,080 --> 00:22:28,399 Speaker 1: fact that Percy was leasing the space even though he 410 00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:30,720 Speaker 1: had his own home in London, you know, like, why 411 00:22:30,800 --> 00:22:34,840 Speaker 1: does Percy need this place anyway? The King ordered another 412 00:22:34,920 --> 00:22:38,120 Speaker 1: search after that, and they found Fox at about midnight 413 00:22:38,200 --> 00:22:43,200 Speaker 1: on November four, along with the gunpowder, very incriminating slow 414 00:22:43,280 --> 00:22:47,119 Speaker 1: match and a watch that Percy had given him to 415 00:22:47,200 --> 00:22:50,600 Speaker 1: check the time with. So the plot was done caught 416 00:22:50,640 --> 00:23:01,880 Speaker 1: red handed. So for Box was arrested as John Johnson 417 00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:04,440 Speaker 1: and thrown into the Tower of London, where it said 418 00:23:04,480 --> 00:23:07,200 Speaker 1: that he was interrogated and tortured to reveal the names 419 00:23:07,200 --> 00:23:10,040 Speaker 1: of the other conspirators, even though torture was illegal in 420 00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:13,119 Speaker 1: England at the time. It took two days to break 421 00:23:13,160 --> 00:23:15,680 Speaker 1: Fox down for him to finally give up the names 422 00:23:15,680 --> 00:23:18,280 Speaker 1: of the others who were involved in the plot. Percy's name, 423 00:23:18,320 --> 00:23:20,800 Speaker 1: of course, had already been linked with the leases, so 424 00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:23,960 Speaker 1: there was already a warrant out for his arrest. Meanwhile, 425 00:23:24,000 --> 00:23:27,959 Speaker 1: though Kate Sby Rookwood, the right brothers, Percy and Bates 426 00:23:28,040 --> 00:23:29,960 Speaker 1: all roads in the Midlands where part two of the 427 00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:32,680 Speaker 1: plan was supposed to happen. But of course that wasn't 428 00:23:32,720 --> 00:23:35,159 Speaker 1: going to happen now. Instead, they met up with the 429 00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:38,919 Speaker 1: other co conspirators, raided Warwick Castle for fresh horses, and 430 00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:42,400 Speaker 1: then went looking for help and apparently got refused by 431 00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:45,200 Speaker 1: several Catholic safe houses. They just kept going from house 432 00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:47,440 Speaker 1: to house, but nobody would join them and nobody would 433 00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:49,879 Speaker 1: offer them help. I was interested in that point because, 434 00:23:49,880 --> 00:23:52,399 Speaker 1: I mean, it suggests me at least that word of 435 00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:55,120 Speaker 1: the plot must have spread really quickly, I mean all 436 00:23:55,160 --> 00:23:58,359 Speaker 1: the way up in the Midlands. Two houses to know 437 00:23:58,480 --> 00:24:01,320 Speaker 1: better than to actually accept the people into your home. Well, 438 00:24:01,359 --> 00:24:02,879 Speaker 1: a big deal was made out of it, which we're 439 00:24:02,880 --> 00:24:04,720 Speaker 1: going to touch on a little bit later, But at 440 00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:06,679 Speaker 1: that time, yeah, I guess people knew it wasn't a 441 00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:10,400 Speaker 1: good idea to to protect these people. So they eventually 442 00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:13,080 Speaker 1: stopped at Whole Beach House in Staffordshire, where they thought 443 00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:15,720 Speaker 1: they could at least put up a defense there. But 444 00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:18,040 Speaker 1: they messed up right in the beginning by putting their 445 00:24:18,119 --> 00:24:21,240 Speaker 1: damp gunpowder by the fire to dry, So of course 446 00:24:21,280 --> 00:24:24,320 Speaker 1: the gunpowder exploded and it burned a couple of them 447 00:24:24,320 --> 00:24:27,680 Speaker 1: in the process. It blinded one guy. It's all rather 448 00:24:27,760 --> 00:24:29,919 Speaker 1: ironic if you think about it long and hard. But 449 00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:32,879 Speaker 1: of course at this point the odds were even worse 450 00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:35,280 Speaker 1: for them. Not only are they on the run for 451 00:24:35,600 --> 00:24:39,160 Speaker 1: high treason, but they are injured, and according to Croff, 452 00:24:39,160 --> 00:24:41,760 Speaker 1: they considered just getting out of the whole thing, blowing 453 00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:45,840 Speaker 1: themselves up at this point. But by November eight men 454 00:24:46,119 --> 00:24:49,120 Speaker 1: led by the High Sheriff of wush sure did them. 455 00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:51,880 Speaker 1: In the rest of the way. They have this quick battle. 456 00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:55,960 Speaker 1: Katesby the rights and Percy ended up dying from their wounds. 457 00:24:56,520 --> 00:24:59,040 Speaker 1: It sounds like it was probably the best way to go. Thomas, 458 00:24:59,160 --> 00:25:02,800 Speaker 1: Wintour could and Grant were captured. Five of the guys 459 00:25:02,800 --> 00:25:05,480 Speaker 1: were still free, but not for very long. By the 460 00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:10,080 Speaker 1: new year, all of them were captured, and then Tresham, 461 00:25:10,119 --> 00:25:13,520 Speaker 1: when he was contained in the tower, fell ill and died. 462 00:25:13,600 --> 00:25:16,200 Speaker 1: And some people think that maybe he was poison. Maybe 463 00:25:16,280 --> 00:25:20,080 Speaker 1: even Monteagle took mercy on him because of that letter 464 00:25:20,119 --> 00:25:24,080 Speaker 1: of warning and slipped him some poison helped him escape 465 00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:27,600 Speaker 1: what would ultimately be a far worse punishment of drawing 466 00:25:27,680 --> 00:25:30,400 Speaker 1: and quartering, which is the fate the rest of them 467 00:25:30,440 --> 00:25:33,640 Speaker 1: were destined for. Yep, all the plotters who weren't dead 468 00:25:33,640 --> 00:25:37,600 Speaker 1: were put on trial January six, six and of course 469 00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:40,440 Speaker 1: they were all found guilty of high treason and executed 470 00:25:40,480 --> 00:25:42,600 Speaker 1: over the next couple of days. They were all hanged, 471 00:25:42,720 --> 00:25:47,280 Speaker 1: drawn and quartered. So the plot was ultimately unsuccessful, and 472 00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:49,960 Speaker 1: maybe because of that, it's been the subject of debate 473 00:25:50,040 --> 00:25:53,000 Speaker 1: for many years. Some have even suggested that there was 474 00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:55,520 Speaker 1: no plot, that the plotters were actually set up by 475 00:25:55,520 --> 00:25:59,159 Speaker 1: the government, specifically the Earl of Salisbury, who knew that 476 00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:02,520 Speaker 1: the backlash after the plot was exposed would just reinforce 477 00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:06,480 Speaker 1: Protestantism and strength and hatred towards Catholics in England. Yeah, 478 00:26:06,600 --> 00:26:10,520 Speaker 1: and in a nineteen interview with The New York Times, Fraser, 479 00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:13,400 Speaker 1: who we mentioned earlier, said that the reason the origins 480 00:26:13,440 --> 00:26:16,800 Speaker 1: of the plot are up for debate is that researchers 481 00:26:16,840 --> 00:26:20,479 Speaker 1: are trying to quote draw conclusions from imperfect records and 482 00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:23,760 Speaker 1: testimonies taken under torture. She says that you really have 483 00:26:23,920 --> 00:26:27,440 Speaker 1: to assess the evidence and make up your own mind. 484 00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:29,480 Speaker 1: And for her part, she does believe there was a plot. 485 00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:34,919 Speaker 1: According to Teaching History, most historians do generally accept this idea. 486 00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:38,200 Speaker 1: Now they do think there was something going on, but 487 00:26:38,280 --> 00:26:41,160 Speaker 1: the results of government conspiracy would have been aiming for 488 00:26:41,320 --> 00:26:44,480 Speaker 1: still came to pass. The Gunpowder plot just made anti 489 00:26:44,520 --> 00:26:48,040 Speaker 1: Catholic feelings in England more intense. There were new laws 490 00:26:48,080 --> 00:26:51,639 Speaker 1: preventing Catholics from practicing law, serving as officers in the 491 00:26:51,720 --> 00:26:54,200 Speaker 1: army or the navy, and they weren't allowed to vote. 492 00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:57,680 Speaker 1: On the evening of that Guy Fox was caught. November five, 493 00:26:57,800 --> 00:27:01,719 Speaker 1: sixteen o five, the first Guy Fox hype celebration took place. 494 00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:05,080 Speaker 1: The people of London rang bells and lit bonfires to 495 00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:08,200 Speaker 1: celebrate the fact that the King and his nobility were safe. 496 00:27:08,760 --> 00:27:11,440 Speaker 1: In sixteen o six, the English government passed an act 497 00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:14,440 Speaker 1: to make the celebration an annual event, which at first 498 00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:17,239 Speaker 1: was religious in nature, with sermons and everything, and then 499 00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:20,760 Speaker 1: later it became more of a raucous social event. In 500 00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:23,639 Speaker 1: the seventeenth century people started burning effigies of the pope 501 00:27:23,640 --> 00:27:26,320 Speaker 1: on the fires, and in the eighteenth century is when 502 00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:30,880 Speaker 1: the Little Guy effigy appeared. Yeah, And in eighteen fifty nine, 503 00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:35,040 Speaker 1: since there was an increased emphasis on religious toleration, the 504 00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:39,960 Speaker 1: sixteen o six Act was finally abolished and the Bonfire night. 505 00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:42,800 Speaker 1: At that point the celebrations really started to morph into 506 00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:46,840 Speaker 1: private bonfires and fireworks parties that children would go sell 507 00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:49,280 Speaker 1: the guys on the street to fund and over the 508 00:27:49,359 --> 00:27:52,040 Speaker 1: years it really became more of a family event in 509 00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:55,040 Speaker 1: a lot of places with fireworks displays, kind of how 510 00:27:55,359 --> 00:27:57,720 Speaker 1: we would celebrate Fourth of July here on sounds sort 511 00:27:57,760 --> 00:28:00,359 Speaker 1: of similar to that, although people can definitely actos so 512 00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:03,160 Speaker 1: if we're wrong about that, but certain similar elements. Right. 513 00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:07,120 Speaker 1: So now Bonfire Night celebrations still exist, but they compete 514 00:28:07,119 --> 00:28:10,360 Speaker 1: with other false celebrations like Halloween, and I'm really interested. 515 00:28:10,400 --> 00:28:13,720 Speaker 1: We asked during the last podcast for people to send 516 00:28:13,840 --> 00:28:16,320 Speaker 1: us um some examples of things that they do to 517 00:28:16,400 --> 00:28:19,560 Speaker 1: celebrate Bonfire Night, if they celebrated it at all, and 518 00:28:19,640 --> 00:28:21,600 Speaker 1: so hopefully we'll get to read some of those on 519 00:28:21,640 --> 00:28:25,240 Speaker 1: an upcoming podcast. Kind of awesome to have this always, 520 00:28:25,400 --> 00:28:28,160 Speaker 1: like I guess the week after Halloween to you can 521 00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:30,359 Speaker 1: bring out your costumes again. Maybe I don't know, if 522 00:28:30,359 --> 00:28:32,440 Speaker 1: you celebrate both and it's just like a two week 523 00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:37,080 Speaker 1: long celebration or something exactly. The gunpowder plot didn't leave 524 00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:40,440 Speaker 1: a mark, though, of a more serious mark than just 525 00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:44,120 Speaker 1: all these bonfire parties. The Houses of Parliament are still 526 00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:48,000 Speaker 1: searched just before the State Opening, which has been held 527 00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:53,840 Speaker 1: in November since nine even though Parliament's website says this 528 00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:57,560 Speaker 1: is retained as a picturesque custom rather than a serious 529 00:28:57,600 --> 00:29:01,200 Speaker 1: anti terrorist precaution, for which of core there are proper 530 00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:04,200 Speaker 1: mean I'm glad they qualified that for us. But Guy 531 00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:06,960 Speaker 1: Fox on the gunpowder plot have also been invoked quite 532 00:29:06,960 --> 00:29:09,360 Speaker 1: a bit in art and pop culture. One of the 533 00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:11,560 Speaker 1: most well known examples is the one that we mentioned 534 00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:13,800 Speaker 1: in part one of this podcast, which is the two 535 00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:16,800 Speaker 1: thousand six movie V for Vendetta, based on the comic 536 00:29:16,880 --> 00:29:19,560 Speaker 1: book series by Alan Moore, in which an anarchist known 537 00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:22,800 Speaker 1: as V tries to bring down the government. Basically, that's 538 00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:25,400 Speaker 1: the basic plot line of this and V wears a 539 00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:27,840 Speaker 1: Guy Fox mask. And if you haven't seen this movie, 540 00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:30,000 Speaker 1: I do highly recommend it, especially now that we've kind 541 00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:32,360 Speaker 1: of gone over the story. I did enjoy it, Sarah, 542 00:29:32,440 --> 00:29:34,360 Speaker 1: you haven't seen it, right, haven't seen it? And I 543 00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:37,120 Speaker 1: know now that I've admitted that. Whenever we admit there's 544 00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:39,160 Speaker 1: a certain movie we haven't seen, we usually hear from 545 00:29:39,200 --> 00:29:41,880 Speaker 1: people telling us I can't believe you haven't seen that. 546 00:29:41,920 --> 00:29:44,680 Speaker 1: You're still getting Harry Potter email. I'm still getting Harry 547 00:29:44,720 --> 00:29:47,520 Speaker 1: Potter emails. We're still getting ned Kelly emails, so you know, 548 00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:50,040 Speaker 1: I'm sure you'll get emails about this one too, but 549 00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:53,560 Speaker 1: maybe because of the movie and its association with popular 550 00:29:53,600 --> 00:29:57,760 Speaker 1: revolution and anti establishment ideals that mask. The Guy Fox 551 00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:02,080 Speaker 1: mask has shown up in other places to members of 552 00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:04,960 Speaker 1: the hacker group Anonymous have been known to wear it. 553 00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:07,560 Speaker 1: I was talking to Jonathan Strickland of tech Stuff about 554 00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:09,080 Speaker 1: that recently. He brought it up to me when he 555 00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:12,360 Speaker 1: found out we were doing this, and recently people involved 556 00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:15,480 Speaker 1: in the Occupy Wall Street movement have been wearing it too, 557 00:30:15,840 --> 00:30:18,240 Speaker 1: So it is interesting to see how this idea of 558 00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:21,200 Speaker 1: Guy Fox is still very political. It makes me wonder, though, 559 00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:24,200 Speaker 1: how many of the people wearing the masks today really 560 00:30:24,240 --> 00:30:27,160 Speaker 1: know the story of Guy Fox, or even if they 561 00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:30,520 Speaker 1: know who Guy Fox is and they know about the bonfires, 562 00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:37,960 Speaker 1: did they know the whole history of the plot. Thanks 563 00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:40,680 Speaker 1: so much for joining us on this Saturday. Since this 564 00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:42,800 Speaker 1: episode is out of the archive, if you heard an 565 00:30:42,800 --> 00:30:45,040 Speaker 1: email address or a Facebook U r L or something 566 00:30:45,080 --> 00:30:47,520 Speaker 1: similar over the course of the show that could be 567 00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:52,400 Speaker 1: obsolete now. Our current email address is History Podcast at 568 00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:55,920 Speaker 1: I heart radio dot com. Our old House Stuff works 569 00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:59,000 Speaker 1: email address no longer works, and you can find us 570 00:30:59,040 --> 00:31:02,080 Speaker 1: all over social media. It at Missed in History and 571 00:31:02,200 --> 00:31:06,000 Speaker 1: you can subscribe to our show on Apple podcasts, Google podcasts, 572 00:31:06,040 --> 00:31:08,640 Speaker 1: the I heart Radio app, and wherever else you listen 573 00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:14,440 Speaker 1: to podcasts. 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