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Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,

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Speaker 1: where we discussed the top political headlines with some of

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Speaker 1: today's best minds. And President Trump has frozen one hundred

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Speaker 1: and seventy five million dollars of the University of Pennsylvania's

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Speaker 1: funding over an excuse that he's using, which is trans women.

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Speaker 1: We have such a great show for you today, ye

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Speaker 1: Al Franken shows. Al Franken discusses changing leadership in the

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Speaker 1: Senate and what it would mean. Then we'll talk to

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Speaker 1: et Injermentum newsletter editor Josh Cohen about the future Democrats want.

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Speaker 2: But first the news, Mollie.

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Speaker 3: The thing that makes me be able to go to

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Speaker 3: sleep without taking a truckload of melatonin each night is

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Speaker 3: that Donald Trump keeps suffering multiple legal blows every single day.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, this is Trump one point zero being a lot

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Speaker 1: like Trump two point zero being a lot like Trump

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Speaker 1: one point zero, a lot of the stuff that Trump

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Speaker 1: wants to do. And again, I'm going to remind all

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Speaker 1: of you that in July, Jesse and I did this

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Speaker 1: YouTube series. It makes us look like we're psychics. We

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Speaker 1: just read this stupid website that the Heritage Foundation stupidly published.

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Speaker 3: Read a pdf that had command to f a lot

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Speaker 3: of times to see how many different ways they said

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Speaker 3: the same fucking thing over and over again.

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Speaker 2: Exactly.

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Speaker 1: It was not gone with the wind, it was not

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Speaker 1: check off, it was not the brothers caramotts off. It

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Speaker 1: was in fact the Heritage Foundations mandate for leadership.

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Speaker 3: But some would say there was some power broker going

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Speaker 3: on it.

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Speaker 1: There was some power broker in going and it was

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Speaker 1: a lot of repetition and a lot of chapters written

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Speaker 1: by members of Trump's first administration who, surprised, surprise, went

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Speaker 1: back into his second administration. Who could have seen this coming?

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Speaker 1: How about everyone who was paying attention. So one of

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Speaker 1: the things that we both I think, when we were

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Speaker 1: talking about this in July and so sbsequently in the

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Speaker 1: healthscape that is our lives, we noticed that a lot

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Speaker 1: of this stuff seemed really illegal, right, like you know,

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Speaker 1: dissolving agencies like you know, ending the Department of Education,

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Speaker 1: stuff like that. And so in fact it turns out

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Speaker 1: that all of the courts also think these illegal things

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Speaker 1: are illegal, which is now created an atmosphere where MAGA

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Speaker 1: now hates all the federal judges. And so the good

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Speaker 1: news is that Trump just keeps losing in court like

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Speaker 1: he did the first time. The bad news is that

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Speaker 1: these federal judges are basically like the rest of us

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Speaker 1: now being harassed by the Maga wing of the Mega Party,

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Speaker 1: which uses X as a sort of four Chan to

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Speaker 1: get together and organize, utilize, and harass the rest of us.

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Speaker 3: I do like this four Chan metaphor for what X

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Speaker 3: is for them. It's good.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, it's basically, you know, it's a it's

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Speaker 1: a message board for people who you know, use straight

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Speaker 1: armed salutes to invoke bad guys from the Second World

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Speaker 1: War who I have no idea.

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Speaker 3: So one of the worst things I've done in my

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Speaker 3: brain is I've listened to like episodes of Joe Rogan

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Speaker 3: and Steve Bennon's War Room, where I've heard these people

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Speaker 3: who love to think their immune systems are just so

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Speaker 3: awesome talking about how if we could just figure out

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Speaker 3: the antibodies from the people who don't catch things, that's

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Speaker 3: where we're really going to find the good stuff. And

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Speaker 3: it's like some bad movie plot that we're going to

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Speaker 3: solve bird flu with this, And that is exactly what

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Speaker 3: RFK Junior is telling our government to do.

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Speaker 2: Wait what Wait?

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Speaker 1: First, wait what, Oh, okay, RFK juniors unveils into drubbing

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Speaker 1: planned to combat bird flu. So let's just talk about

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Speaker 1: this for a minute. Trump is at war with the Cords. Meanwhile,

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Speaker 1: MAGA is at war with nature, basically nature and science.

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Speaker 2: This is like a larger theme.

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Speaker 1: We're seeing that the truth has gotten so stretched out

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Speaker 1: and sort of impaled that it is no longer the truth. Right,

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Speaker 1: It's a sort of mimiogram of the truth. And one

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Speaker 1: of the things we see here is like Trump has

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Speaker 1: these statements. I'm going to go back to the story

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Speaker 1: we were just talking about for a minute because they

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Speaker 1: think that it can shed light on the story we're

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Speaker 1: talking about right now. So Trump is on Truth's Social

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Speaker 1: complaining about these judges, and he says, if a president

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Speaker 1: doesn't have the right to throw murderers and other criminals

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Speaker 1: out of our country because a radical left lunatic judge

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Speaker 1: wants to assume the role of president, then our country

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Speaker 1: is in very big trouble and doesn't fail. Okay, So right,

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Speaker 1: this is this way of perverting the truth. Right. The

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Speaker 1: truth is this judge is just not a radical left lunatic,

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Speaker 1: and he's saying, you just have to do due process

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Speaker 1: before you kick people out of the country, and make

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Speaker 1: sure that you're kicking out the right people, sending them

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Speaker 1: to a country that perhaps they've been to before. This

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Speaker 1: is exactly the same kind of thing with the RFK stuff, Right,

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Speaker 1: It's this idea that you're not seeing the world in

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Speaker 1: a normal way, you're seeing the world in this kind

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Speaker 1: of paranoid way. And in fact, the thing that makes

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Speaker 1: me think of is the paranoid style, right, Richard Hofsteinter,

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Speaker 1: this idea the paranoid style of American politics. Right, This

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Speaker 1: is this idea that the sort of world of conservative

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Speaker 1: thinkers looks at things in a way that is sort

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Speaker 1: of the opposite of what's really happening.

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Speaker 2: And this is like the sort of legacy of Nixon

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Speaker 2: and Agnew. Yeah, I was thinking about pat Buchanon.

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Speaker 3: See, I only say that the way John McLaughlin used

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Speaker 3: to say it did and yell at going.

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Speaker 2: But you can, right.

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Speaker 1: So Pap Buchanan is another one, right, where there's sort

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Speaker 1: of there's a sense in which everything that's real is

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Speaker 1: not really real and things that are wrong or maybe right.

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Speaker 1: So here's the deal. RFK Junior has taken a step further.

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Speaker 1: He is doing these things when it comes to public health.

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Speaker 1: And I think, honestly, this is where we see the

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Speaker 1: post COVID paranoid style of post COVID politics in a

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Speaker 1: way that is the most destructive, right, because Trump's war

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Speaker 1: on the judiciary is destructive. But it's a little bit different, right,

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Speaker 1: We've sort of seen it before. We know what it is.

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Speaker 1: It's much more on the surface, ourf case war against

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Speaker 1: science and technology, and the sort of hearkening back to

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Speaker 1: the early earlier times in American life when we didn't

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Speaker 1: have vaccines is actually more insidious.

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Speaker 2: So here's what's happening.

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Speaker 1: He has decided that the bird flu should be allowed

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Speaker 1: to spread unchecked to identified birds that could be immune.

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Speaker 1: And I think this is important because what he is

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Speaker 1: saying here is that he's just not going to try

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Speaker 1: And this is what they did with COVID too, Right

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Speaker 1: with COVID, they said, Now, why this is going to

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Speaker 1: be bad is because we are going to all get

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Speaker 1: bird flu and die. Maybe we won't all get bird

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Speaker 1: flu and die, but a a lot of birds are

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Speaker 1: going to die.

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Speaker 2: B a lot of people are going to get.

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Speaker 3: Sick, and crucial to a lot of US Americans, a

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Speaker 3: lot of pets are going to die, right, A lot.

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Speaker 2: Of pets are going to die. It's just terrible.

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Speaker 1: Kennedy said in a reason Fox News interview that farmers

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Speaker 1: should consider maybe the possibility of letting it run through

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Speaker 1: their flock so they can identify the birds. They'll identify

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Speaker 1: them all right, because they'll be dead and preserve the

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Speaker 1: birds that are immune to it, an idea experts say

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Speaker 1: would be dangerous and hurt the poultry industry.

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Speaker 3: So, Mali, I know you sometimes tell people you're nepo

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Speaker 3: oldie online, but I got news for you that's getting

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Speaker 3: put into policy now. Because the DOJ is asserting Trump

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Speaker 3: hypothetically as the power to purge all female agency heads

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Speaker 3: or those over forty. That's two strikes there. Miss.

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Speaker 2: Here's the thing.

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Speaker 1: Just because a lot of conservative men don't like being

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Speaker 1: married to women over forty doesn't mean they don't have

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Speaker 1: a use on this planet. I'm sorry to tell you

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Speaker 1: that's not how any of this works. And look, you'll

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Speaker 1: remember that women over a college educated women did not

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Speaker 1: over Trump, right, because we read the Trump Department of

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Speaker 1: Justice asserted in court on Tuesday that under its theories,

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Speaker 1: could the president decide he was not going to a

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Speaker 1: point or allowed or remain in office any female heads

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Speaker 1: of agencies or heads over forty years old. Judge Karen Henderson,

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Speaker 1: a wild leftist Reagan appointee on the DC Circuit of Appeals,

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Speaker 1: asked the Deputy Assistant Attorney General, and you know what

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Speaker 1: he said?

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Speaker 2: He said, I.

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Speaker 1: Think that would be within the president's constitutional authority under

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Speaker 1: the removal of power, because honestly, who wants to be

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Speaker 1: married to someone over forty.

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Speaker 3: Not I My wife turns it in August and putting

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Speaker 3: her on notice.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right, baby, we are, by the way, kidding,

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Speaker 1: we're both mid to late forties.

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Speaker 3: Yes, Somali. Mister Trump told me and the American people

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Speaker 3: that day one he's going to putin in his place,

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Speaker 3: and the war in Ukraine, He's going to make peace

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Speaker 3: in the Middle East.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, good work.

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Speaker 3: Then there was these recent ceasefires, and I have news

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Speaker 3: for you. They're done. They're fucking done.

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Speaker 2: I am shocked. I am shocked to hear that.

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Speaker 1: I think from Trump one point zero, where he said

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Speaker 1: who knew healthcare could be so complicated? I feel like

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Speaker 1: we could put this on every thing that Trump falls into.

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Speaker 1: Who knew that any of this could be so complicated.

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Speaker 1: It's complicated and Donald Trump learning how to do government

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Speaker 1: one minute at a time.

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Speaker 2: Lucky us.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Al Franken is a former senator and the host of

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Speaker 1: the Al Frankin show.

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Speaker 3: Oh and Molly. He appears in the new Netflix TV

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Speaker 3: series The Residence, which is out now.

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Speaker 1: Welcome Back, Too Fast Politics, Al Franken.

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Speaker 4: Thank you, great to be back. Molly. How you doing now?

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Speaker 2: You're actor Alfred versus.

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Speaker 4: I'm actor Al Franklin again. I've done it before, but

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Speaker 4: there's been a hiatus from my acting career. But I'm

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Speaker 4: very excited about this show. I'm in The Residence all

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Speaker 4: right to pitch the show. It's a murder mystery. It

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Speaker 4: takes place basically. The biggest character in it is the

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Speaker 4: White House Residence, not the West wing, but the East wing,

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Speaker 4: and there's a murder. The chief usher is the murderer.

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Speaker 4: So this involves all the staff and all the people

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Speaker 4: who were at this big dinner for the Australian Prime Minister.

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Speaker 4: It's a great show. When I got the script, I

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Speaker 4: really loved it, but I didn't know how it's going

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Speaker 4: to be great it's going to be but it was

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Speaker 4: and it is so I was very excited when I

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Speaker 4: saw and they sent me the episodes and they're great,

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Speaker 4: great cast.

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Speaker 2: Who else is in it with you?

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Speaker 4: Well, Uzzo Aduba, who people would know from Orange is

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Speaker 4: the New Black. She's the only person I know that

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Speaker 4: is one an Emmy in acting for both a comedy

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Speaker 4: and a drama in the same show.

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Speaker 2: Oh wow.

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Speaker 4: Yeah. So each one year they submitted it as a comedy,

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Speaker 4: one year they submitted as a drama, and when it

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Speaker 4: got more dramatic, and she won in both categories two

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Speaker 4: different years. So she has that distinction. She plays the

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Speaker 4: detective who solves this thing after in the and you

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Speaker 4: solve it in the eighth episode she does.

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Speaker 2: That is very cool.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so I feel like we have our distractions from

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Speaker 1: watching Donald Trump dismantle the federal government. Mine is my

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Speaker 1: book is coming out in June. Yours is this very

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Speaker 1: cool show, which Jesse and are both going to watch.

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Speaker 1: I think of this, like, you have been a United

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Speaker 1: States senator, so you really do care about the federal

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Speaker 1: government and like what is happening right now. I would

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Speaker 1: love to just talk through a little bit about what

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Speaker 1: you think is happening right now to Republican senators because

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Speaker 1: there are still a bunch that are there that you've known,

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Speaker 1: and they have survived one Trump administration, right and now

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Speaker 1: they are into their next and I just am wondering

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Speaker 1: what you think it's like for like a John Soon.

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Speaker 2: I don't think they are having fun either.

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Speaker 4: Oh God, no, no, I don't think anybody's having fun

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Speaker 4: there right now, because the Republicans have all caved except

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Speaker 4: for Markowski and Collins and McConnell.

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Speaker 2: Bafflingly, Well, it's not baffling, but you know what I mean.

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Speaker 4: It's not baffling at all. McConnell, I don't know it was.

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Speaker 4: But how many did he vote?

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Speaker 2: Know on three four?

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Speaker 4: I think at least three. But I mean, he's not

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Speaker 4: running for reelection, so everybody else is just scared. You know.

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Speaker 4: We have Musk saying he's going to spend at least

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Speaker 4: one hundred million on the primary of these guys if

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Speaker 4: they defy him, and they all seem to be scared

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Speaker 4: of him. They all are scared of him, There's no

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Speaker 4: doubt about it. So that's why they're caving every day.

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Speaker 1: Elon has done a ton of stuff over the first

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Speaker 1: six weeks, and now we're starting to see the courts

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Speaker 1: are just basically like, no, you can't do any of that.

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Speaker 1: So you can't do usai D, you can't do this,

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Speaker 1: you can't fire. I mean, God bless the democratic ags.

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Speaker 1: Jesse and I interviewed one in July who was like,

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Speaker 1: basically said, we don't think she's going to win, and

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Speaker 1: we have spent the last six months sitting down and

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Speaker 1: figuring out all the lawsuits we're going to have to file.

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Speaker 4: That was in July, Yeah, July.

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Speaker 1: And we were both like, no, he doesn't know what

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Speaker 1: he's talking about.

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Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: After we end up recording, I go and she's going

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Speaker 2: to win and he was.

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Speaker 1: Like, no, she's not gonna win. He's like, but here

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Speaker 1: are the lawsuits we're going to file. But they filed

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Speaker 1: all these lawsuits.

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Speaker 4: Who do you blame that she didn't win? I know

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Speaker 4: who I blame.

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Speaker 1: So this age was Okay, go ahead, you know it's

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Speaker 1: not his fault. But I'm just saying, I just want

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Speaker 1: to I want to tell you what he told us

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Speaker 1: because I think.

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Speaker 4: No, it's not his fault at all. That's not what

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Speaker 4: I'm no.

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Speaker 1: I know, but I mean, I just want to tell

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Speaker 1: you what he told us because I think think it

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Speaker 1: is interesting, and it got me thinking about the election

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Speaker 1: in a certain way. He said, I am in He's

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Speaker 1: in a blue state, in a but very Latino state,

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Speaker 1: and he said, they're just not going to vote for her.

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Speaker 1: He said, the Latino men are not going to vote

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Speaker 1: for her. And it was like in his mind, he said,

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Speaker 1: it just doesn't matter. He said, it's just not happening.

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Speaker 1: I think Latino men, I think white, non college educated women.

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Speaker 2: I don't think she could have broken through there.

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Speaker 4: Well, I think it because it started so late and

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Speaker 4: Trump took the right tack and you know, and went

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Speaker 4: after both her and Biden. I was scared throughout, but

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Speaker 4: I thought it was going to be fifty to fifty

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Speaker 4: on election night, and it wasn't. It was fifty forty nine.

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Speaker 2: Who do you blame?

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Speaker 1: This is the most spiritual thing you can do is

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Speaker 1: re litigate the twenty twenty four cycle.

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Speaker 2: I can't stop so well.

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Speaker 4: I blame Biden for not dropping out much sooner, for

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Speaker 4: not honoring what he said going into the I thought

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Speaker 4: he had a great presidency in many ways, many pomplishments,

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Speaker 4: but he had to know that he wasn't up to snuff.

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Speaker 4: And of course that debate was a harrowing thing to watch. Yeah,

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Speaker 4: and then to not pull out then was ridiculous as well.

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Speaker 4: But that's relitigating stuff that everyone relitigates in their mind

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Speaker 4: every day as they go to sleep.

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Speaker 1: I don't think we should continue on but on this

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Speaker 1: depressing dijectory. But since we're just going to do it

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Speaker 1: one more minute, not it the cardinal sin as I

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Speaker 1: see it is running from populism whatever. That looks like

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Speaker 1: Democrats had a much more populist policy program, right, I mean,

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Speaker 1: tax cuts for rich people is not populism.

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Speaker 4: Well, how about these these medicaid cuts.

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Speaker 2: Eight hundred and eighty billion over ten years.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, and that wait, wait till people on medicaid see

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Speaker 4: that realize that's happening to them.

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Speaker 2: Let's talk about that.

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Speaker 1: Because there's sort of a pause between Trump doing crazy

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Speaker 1: stuff and like the average American feeling it.

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Speaker 2: How long do you think that is?

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Speaker 4: I don't know. I don't know when this kicks in,

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Speaker 4: but when it kicks in that you know. One of

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Speaker 4: the things is like Medicaid expansion, which was under the

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Speaker 4: Affordable Care Act, and one of the great things in

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Speaker 4: the Affordable Care Act. You look at how many red

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Speaker 4: states didn't sign up for that, but then through voters

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Speaker 4: insisting on it in all these different red states, it

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Speaker 4: was adopted in a you know, on by a ballot initiative,

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Speaker 4: and it's the best thing happens to rural hospitals. And

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Speaker 4: the states that haven't done it, those red states that

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Speaker 4: are in basically the Confederacy and Wisconsin, I guess those

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Speaker 4: states have lost rural hospitals. It's a disaster for them.

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Speaker 4: And so but now we're going to have people who

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Speaker 4: are on straight medicaid, not through Medicaid expansion, and they're

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Speaker 4: going to be really hurting. Yeah, they're going to notice that,

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Speaker 4: and hopefully that will work in the midterm, but that's

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Speaker 4: a long way away. And in the meantime, this horrible

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Speaker 4: stuff has happened.

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Speaker 1: It's like the accelerationist case for Trumpism, right, like that

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Speaker 1: you want people to notice it because last time Democrats

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Speaker 1: were in a way too effective at preventing some of

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Speaker 1: the effects of Trumpism, right, Like, he's not going to

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Speaker 1: cut stuff because he wasn't able to last time. Was

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Speaker 1: a refrain I heard all the time.

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Speaker 4: I guess, so, you know, I was there during part

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Speaker 4: of that, and that part of it. He had the whole.

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Speaker 4: He had the whole thing. First couple of years he

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Speaker 4: had the House, the Senate, and the White House. Now

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Speaker 4: he does and it's a whole different story here.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm curious because they passed the CR.

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Speaker 2: It is not great.

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Speaker 4: Either way was bad.

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Speaker 2: Now either way was bad. Now here's my question for you.

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Speaker 1: You and I both know, and I think a lot

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Speaker 1: of people that a lot of the conversations I've had,

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Speaker 1: like behind the scenes, have been with staffers or members

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Speaker 1: who have said things like, you know, it was impossible

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Speaker 1: situation right, Like I know for a fact they told

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Speaker 1: Schumer's office that RUSSA could not wait for a shutdown,

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Speaker 1: that he planned to make every single hr person in

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Speaker 1: all the federal agencies deemed essential workers and then just

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Speaker 1: keep going, right, just spend those weeks of no of

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Speaker 1: government shutdown just firing everyone he could without the purview

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Speaker 1: of the federal government.

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Speaker 4: That sounds about right, and that's why Schumer did what

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Speaker 4: he did. But the counter to that is that how

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Speaker 4: long would that have lasted? The air traffic controllers are necessary,

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Speaker 4: and I guess you end up having Trump say what's

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Speaker 4: necessary and what's not necessary. Right.

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Speaker 1: Besides that is the counter that is would Mitch McConnell

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Speaker 1: have been like, Oh, okay.

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Speaker 4: I guess he would have. I don't know, But so

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Speaker 4: what so the government shuts down, right, that gives Trump

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Speaker 4: all the power to decide what's essential and what's not essential.

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Speaker 4: And Mitch is just one of the three that I mentioned.

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Speaker 4: They all voted yes on it, all the Republicans, right,

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Speaker 4: I think it was every one of them, And so

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Speaker 4: I don't know what McConnell would have done, but I

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Speaker 4: don't think it would have done anything different.

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Speaker 2: Right if Mitch had been in leadership at the time.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, well, yeah, that's what I mean. If we're doing

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Speaker 4: a lot of what ifs today, the.

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Speaker 1: Question is could you have gotten anything out of Trump

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Speaker 1: world if you have no leverage?

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Speaker 2: I mean, I think that's the real question.

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Speaker 1: People are mad because they feel that Chuck Schumer did

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Speaker 1: not get enough from Trump World.

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Speaker 4: They got nothing. Right, They wrote that bill without any

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Speaker 4: any concessions at all. When he said let's vote you know,

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Speaker 4: yes on this. It was a terrible choice between the

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Speaker 4: worst of both worlds. I mean, it was terrible.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So do you think that?

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Speaker 1: So A lot of people are saying now that tchumor

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Speaker 1: should not be in leadership.

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Speaker 2: What do you think about that?

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Speaker 4: Well, I could see them trying to make a change.

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Speaker 4: It just be who would challenge and who would wants

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Speaker 4: that job?

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Speaker 2: Who do you think want that job?

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Speaker 3: I don't know.

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Speaker 4: I I see, you know, Chris Murphy being out there

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Speaker 4: very loudly, but I think that he probably thinking about

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Speaker 4: the White House as opposed to being leadership of the

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Speaker 4: you know, of a minority right now, and it's it's

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Speaker 4: a kind of a thankless job. So yeah, I don't know.

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Speaker 4: It's not going to be Durbin or them. They would

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Speaker 4: want someone young, right, I.

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Speaker 2: Mean, I think Durbin may not run again.

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Speaker 1: As from what I understand, I think we really have

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Speaker 1: a question of like what leadership should look like. For example,

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Speaker 1: Nancy Pelosi, people were mad at her because she was older,

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Speaker 1: but she never brought things up to the floor that didn't.

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Speaker 4: Pass right, right, right, she was brilliant.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 1: We saw how good she was at that when we

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Speaker 1: saw Mike Johnson get in there, because Mike jun then

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Speaker 1: it's actually quite a hard job.

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Speaker 2: So she is a really good leader.

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Speaker 1: Now does she reflect the entirety of the Democratic Party?

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Speaker 1: Absolutely not, But doesn't necessarily.

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Speaker 4: Matter, and no one does, right.

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Speaker 1: And it's a big tent. So the question I think is,

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Speaker 1: first of all, do you want a leader who who

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Speaker 1: is a spokesman? Can those things be different?

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Speaker 5: Right?

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Speaker 1: Because usually you kind of have a candidate, a presidential candidate,

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Speaker 1: and then you have a member of the party who

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Speaker 1: is in leadership, and those two things don't necessarily need

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Speaker 1: to be the same.

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Speaker 4: Oh, not at all. You know Harry Reid. I remember

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Speaker 4: always people saying why is Harry Reid the leader? And

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Speaker 4: I said, for a really good reason. But you know,

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Speaker 4: he wasn't a popular national figure, but he was a

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Speaker 4: great leader. Nancy Pelosi never Speaker of the House, doesn't

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Speaker 4: usually run for president. Sometimes you have, but senators do.

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Speaker 4: But I can't think of a majority leader or minority

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Speaker 4: leader except for Bob Dole who ran for president.

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Speaker 2: Can you no? And it did not go well for

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Speaker 2: Bob Dole, I think more importantly.

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Speaker 4: Well, he did lose, and he lost by quite a bit.

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Speaker 4: That was that Clinton midterm. And it's not a road

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Speaker 4: to the White House certainly, And I don't know who

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Speaker 4: would want this job right now. I haven't heard any

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Speaker 4: rumblings of that, have you.

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Speaker 1: So Punchbowld today had some thing about Brian Shots Punchball,

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Speaker 1: which I listen to and read, but is much much

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Speaker 1: better sourced.

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00:22:06,440 --> 00:22:08,480
Speaker 2: On the right than the left. When you read it,

442
00:22:08,560 --> 00:22:09,080
Speaker 2: you see that.

443
00:22:09,320 --> 00:22:11,560
Speaker 1: And that's not true for all of them, but they

444
00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:15,480
Speaker 1: had sort of Brian Shots his wants at Durbin's job,

445
00:22:15,600 --> 00:22:17,000
Speaker 1: but maybe he wants leadership.

446
00:22:17,160 --> 00:22:18,520
Speaker 4: Durban is the whip right.

447
00:22:19,119 --> 00:22:21,920
Speaker 1: Is the whip right, and he's also the chair of Judiciary.

448
00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:23,560
Speaker 1: I mean, he's super important.

449
00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:25,040
Speaker 4: Well, Shots doesn't want that.

450
00:22:25,520 --> 00:22:28,359
Speaker 1: And the other thing is that if you're leader in

451
00:22:28,440 --> 00:22:31,760
Speaker 1: the Senate, you need to know all of those people, right,

452
00:22:32,119 --> 00:22:33,920
Speaker 1: I mean, the job is to be able to talk

453
00:22:33,960 --> 00:22:37,520
Speaker 1: to everyone and to form consensus, whatever that looks like

454
00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:40,960
Speaker 1: in a Trump Senate. So I would think you don't

455
00:22:41,000 --> 00:22:44,840
Speaker 1: necessarily want the youngest person. You actually want people who

456
00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:46,800
Speaker 1: have you know, Chuck Shots.

457
00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:49,920
Speaker 4: Has been there a pretty long time now, I would say, yeah.

458
00:22:49,560 --> 00:22:50,200
Speaker 2: No, he has.

459
00:22:50,560 --> 00:22:52,440
Speaker 1: I mean I think he'd be good, though, Like, what

460
00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:56,200
Speaker 1: you need if you have someone taking on humor, I'm

461
00:22:56,200 --> 00:22:59,119
Speaker 1: not sure you have that is someone who is ensconsed

462
00:22:59,280 --> 00:23:03,480
Speaker 1: enough to be like a Shot, but brave enough to

463
00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:07,840
Speaker 1: go against one of your party's biggest leaders, right.

464
00:23:07,720 --> 00:23:09,879
Speaker 4: And I just don't see it happening. I mean, I

465
00:23:09,920 --> 00:23:12,320
Speaker 4: think of Sheldon white House or someone like that as

466
00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:15,119
Speaker 4: that kind of person, But I don't think Sheldon wants

467
00:23:15,119 --> 00:23:16,120
Speaker 4: that kind of job.

468
00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:18,680
Speaker 1: Right, And that I think is the thing that the

469
00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:22,000
Speaker 1: more vocal part of the party doesn't totally understand, is

470
00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:24,199
Speaker 1: that this is not happening in a vacuum. This is

471
00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:28,800
Speaker 1: happening in an institution where people do six year terms.

472
00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:31,400
Speaker 4: Yeah, and who are very comfortable in those terms. And

473
00:23:31,760 --> 00:23:34,200
Speaker 4: I just don't see someone challenging Schumer, that's all.

474
00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:37,919
Speaker 1: And Schumer is now has all these protesters, he had

475
00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:41,080
Speaker 1: to cancel his book tour, he had this, and that

476
00:23:41,280 --> 00:23:42,000
Speaker 1: I mean, you.

477
00:23:41,960 --> 00:23:46,720
Speaker 4: Know, not, it's a shame on the book tour. What's

478
00:23:46,760 --> 00:23:48,600
Speaker 4: it is about being Jewish?

479
00:23:48,720 --> 00:23:52,800
Speaker 1: It's a book about anti Semitism. So, okay, we're both Jewish.

480
00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:54,120
Speaker 1: You're Jewish, we're Jewish.

481
00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:57,600
Speaker 2: We're both too right, Yeah, right, congratulations to us.

482
00:23:58,040 --> 00:24:00,119
Speaker 4: Are you interested in the book by Chuck Schumer on

483
00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:01,040
Speaker 4: any Semitism?

484
00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:05,520
Speaker 2: You're so mean? Why do you ask me such? Hi?

485
00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:12,200
Speaker 2: Oh look, we're out of time. I'll Reagan. I hope

486
00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:13,000
Speaker 2: you'll come back.

487
00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:15,720
Speaker 4: Oh I will, I will if you'll have me.

488
00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:17,680
Speaker 2: Are you kidding me of course.

489
00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:19,760
Speaker 4: And watch The Residents on Netflix.

490
00:24:20,160 --> 00:24:21,800
Speaker 2: Netflix. I'll watch it.

491
00:24:21,800 --> 00:24:22,720
Speaker 4: It's great.

492
00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:28,240
Speaker 1: Josh Cohen is the editor of the newsletter at Injermentum.

493
00:24:29,080 --> 00:24:34,200
Speaker 1: Welcome back, but it's been a while too fast politics.

494
00:24:34,320 --> 00:24:37,040
Speaker 5: Josh, Hello, it's good to be honest. It's been like

495
00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:38,959
Speaker 5: I think last of Masani was during the election.

496
00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:43,639
Speaker 2: Oh that turned out great. Yeah, so let's talk.

497
00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:47,280
Speaker 1: We're in the wilderness here. You have this really good block.

498
00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:51,560
Speaker 1: You're such a good and interesting writer and thinker. And

499
00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:54,080
Speaker 1: one of the things you do is you've sort of

500
00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:58,480
Speaker 1: you've been running through the possibility is for twenty eight,

501
00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:01,840
Speaker 1: but also what do you sort of think talk to

502
00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:03,919
Speaker 1: me about who you feel like as leading the party

503
00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:04,480
Speaker 1: right now.

504
00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:08,520
Speaker 5: It's a really tricky situation because I did immediately after

505
00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:10,720
Speaker 5: the election, when they first started putting out the twenty

506
00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:13,720
Speaker 5: twenty eight polling, the consistent thing, if we're gonna like

507
00:25:13,760 --> 00:25:17,080
Speaker 5: look that far ahead, it has consistently shown Kamala Harris

508
00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:20,919
Speaker 5: with like a meaningful lead. She's been around thirty thirty

509
00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:24,840
Speaker 5: five forty percent of the vote, while everybody else, like

510
00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:28,840
Speaker 5: this whole list of mostly identical kind of white governors

511
00:25:28,880 --> 00:25:32,760
Speaker 5: in swing states and Pete Budachees on top of that,

512
00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:36,400
Speaker 5: they've been AOC has been pulling him like the mid

513
00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:40,440
Speaker 5: to low to high single digits. So in that sense,

514
00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:43,679
Speaker 5: like she is still kind of like the front runner

515
00:25:43,720 --> 00:25:46,000
Speaker 5: and the person that people like think of when they

516
00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:48,520
Speaker 5: think of the Democratic Party. But the thing is, and

517
00:25:48,600 --> 00:25:50,760
Speaker 5: I noted this like a couple like a week ago

518
00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:53,240
Speaker 5: and people got really mad about it, is that she's

519
00:25:53,280 --> 00:25:56,919
Speaker 5: been very very absent since the election. Like part of

520
00:25:56,920 --> 00:25:59,840
Speaker 5: that is like the tradition, but she's only really shown

521
00:25:59,880 --> 00:26:03,080
Speaker 5: up for like Broadway plays and award shows. It's like

522
00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:06,040
Speaker 5: the traditional kind of thing that an outgoing administration does,

523
00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:09,159
Speaker 5: where they like don't criticize a new party. But the

524
00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:11,640
Speaker 5: thing is is that this isn't really a traditional set

525
00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:14,960
Speaker 5: of circumstances, and they certainly didn't certain yeah, and they

526
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:18,760
Speaker 5: didn't campaign on Trump being a traditional opponent. So for

527
00:26:18,840 --> 00:26:21,000
Speaker 5: her to kind of abide in to go to like

528
00:26:21,040 --> 00:26:23,119
Speaker 5: the kind of default mode where they just kind of

529
00:26:23,320 --> 00:26:26,119
Speaker 5: sink into the background, I think that there's like a

530
00:26:26,200 --> 00:26:29,560
Speaker 5: contradiction there and their behavior and kind of how people

531
00:26:29,640 --> 00:26:31,840
Speaker 5: feel about the moment. And this is something that I

532
00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:34,200
Speaker 5: thought was very interesting. I read this in an AP

533
00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:38,040
Speaker 5: piece about the huge rallies that Bernie Sanders has been

534
00:26:38,040 --> 00:26:41,639
Speaker 5: doing his office. Actually, during the first couple of weeks

535
00:26:41,640 --> 00:26:45,320
Speaker 5: of Trump's administration, they deliberately just thought, like, Okay, we

536
00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:48,760
Speaker 5: could probably organize these things, but we'll just wait back

537
00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:51,959
Speaker 5: to see if, like anybody wants to take a public

538
00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:54,399
Speaker 5: role in like doing this kind of tour and like

539
00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:57,240
Speaker 5: trying to press an argument and framework for the next

540
00:26:57,320 --> 00:26:59,880
Speaker 5: four years. But nobody did it over the first month,

541
00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:02,439
Speaker 5: so they just thought, well, if nobody's doing it, we

542
00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:04,320
Speaker 5: should do it. And that they did it and it

543
00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:08,120
Speaker 5: got this massive response he's been getting like presidential campaign

544
00:27:08,320 --> 00:27:11,200
Speaker 5: rally sizes and like the February in March of an

545
00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:13,560
Speaker 5: off year. I think that things are very much up

546
00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:17,080
Speaker 5: for grabs. Anybody who's kind of treating this moment in

547
00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:19,399
Speaker 5: the way that they kind of described it over the

548
00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:22,600
Speaker 5: past number of years is somebody who I think people

549
00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:24,679
Speaker 5: will gravitate towards. Because there's a lot of people who

550
00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:27,159
Speaker 5: didn't necessarily like Bernie when he ran for president that

551
00:27:27,240 --> 00:27:29,879
Speaker 5: I've seen, like across social media, like saying that they

552
00:27:29,920 --> 00:27:32,760
Speaker 5: have a renewed appreciation for him just because he's going

553
00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:35,080
Speaker 5: out and giving speeches. It's not any like kind of

554
00:27:35,480 --> 00:27:37,960
Speaker 5: huge thing. But he's acting in the way that you

555
00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:40,560
Speaker 5: would expect someone to act in this moment. And I

556
00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:43,359
Speaker 5: think that anybody who fits that role as somebody who

557
00:27:43,480 --> 00:27:45,679
Speaker 5: could get a lot of goodwill very early.

558
00:27:46,200 --> 00:27:46,480
Speaker 2: Yeah.

559
00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:49,639
Speaker 1: I mean what Trump did that was smart and that

560
00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:53,920
Speaker 1: set him up. Trump right defies gravity. He's his own

561
00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:56,840
Speaker 1: I mean, you can't run on his playbook, because his

562
00:27:56,920 --> 00:27:59,720
Speaker 1: playbook is be famous for twenty years for being a

563
00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:05,000
Speaker 1: brother businessman, Like it's unreplicatable. But what he did, which

564
00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:07,320
Speaker 1: I think is smart, is in the first two years

565
00:28:07,359 --> 00:28:09,560
Speaker 1: of the Biden administration. I'd love you to like actually

566
00:28:09,640 --> 00:28:12,800
Speaker 1: tell me everything my theory is right or wrong, because

567
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:17,159
Speaker 1: I have this theory that what Biden did wrong was

568
00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:21,080
Speaker 1: that he spent two years wildly avoiding the press, shutting

569
00:28:21,160 --> 00:28:24,879
Speaker 1: them down at every moment, being aggressively boring, refusing to

570
00:28:24,920 --> 00:28:28,720
Speaker 1: participate in anything a start contrast to and again this

571
00:28:28,920 --> 00:28:32,280
Speaker 1: is no love for Trump here, but Trump does pool sprays,

572
00:28:32,359 --> 00:28:34,800
Speaker 1: He talks to the media on the airplane, he's in,

573
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:37,120
Speaker 1: he's out, He's talking to them all the time. Now

574
00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:40,880
Speaker 1: he only does interviews with friendly outlets like Fox or

575
00:28:41,000 --> 00:28:44,440
Speaker 1: Real America Voice or Mark Levin, but he's still doing

576
00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:48,160
Speaker 1: a ton of media and like Biden, in the first

577
00:28:48,200 --> 00:28:50,440
Speaker 1: two years, you know, you could count in one hand.

578
00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:53,960
Speaker 1: And then in the second two years they just started

579
00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:58,160
Speaker 1: panicking and trying desperately to get some coverage, but they

580
00:28:58,200 --> 00:28:59,920
Speaker 1: still didn't want to give their guy out.

581
00:29:00,160 --> 00:29:01,680
Speaker 2: So it ended up being.

582
00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:04,560
Speaker 1: Just like whereas Trump has been sort of running a

583
00:29:04,640 --> 00:29:07,920
Speaker 1: shadow government this whole time, which I think has served

584
00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:08,560
Speaker 1: him guy.

585
00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:10,560
Speaker 5: I totally agree with that. One of the things that

586
00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:12,800
Speaker 5: really struck me when he first got into office was

587
00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:15,560
Speaker 5: just the following politics and their buying for four years

588
00:29:15,560 --> 00:29:18,000
Speaker 5: and he was such like a managed kind of just

589
00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:20,360
Speaker 5: his total lack of a presence. And then Trump comes

590
00:29:20,360 --> 00:29:22,520
Speaker 5: in on day one. He has like these press pools

591
00:29:22,520 --> 00:29:25,160
Speaker 5: around the resolute desk in the Oval office where he's

592
00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:27,920
Speaker 5: just like talking with them about whatever for like an hour,

593
00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:31,320
Speaker 5: and that totally drives the news on the conversation. It

594
00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:33,840
Speaker 5: made me realize, like, oh, Biden really did leave a

595
00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:36,440
Speaker 5: lot on the table here, and a lot yeah, he

596
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:40,520
Speaker 5: had such to put nicely communication deficiencies that I don't

597
00:29:40,560 --> 00:29:42,560
Speaker 5: know if he did try to do a blitz throughout

598
00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:44,640
Speaker 5: his four years that it would have. But like even

599
00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:47,640
Speaker 5: like just basic stuff like press conferences. He only gave

600
00:29:47,720 --> 00:29:51,000
Speaker 5: like three Oval office addresses, even though his presidency was

601
00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:53,520
Speaker 5: very eventful and he had a lot of stuff he

602
00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:56,440
Speaker 5: needed to manage public opinion. It was just a very

603
00:29:56,480 --> 00:30:00,520
Speaker 5: reactive kind of strategy instead of a proactive one, and

604
00:30:00,520 --> 00:30:03,440
Speaker 5: they ended up kind of being swamped on the issues

605
00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:04,160
Speaker 5: by the end of.

606
00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:06,800
Speaker 1: It because they couldn't control the narrative at all. And

607
00:30:06,840 --> 00:30:10,840
Speaker 1: it's something I see in democratic electives at large, is

608
00:30:10,880 --> 00:30:14,120
Speaker 1: this idea. You know, you'll see like a good example

609
00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:18,160
Speaker 1: is congressional leadership. Right, they'll come out with a statement,

610
00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:20,800
Speaker 1: You'll get them on TV. You know, you get leader

611
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:24,600
Speaker 1: Jeffries on TV once, so we you know, maybe you'll

612
00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:25,400
Speaker 1: make a little video.

613
00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:25,680
Speaker 2: You know.

614
00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:29,400
Speaker 1: There's just not the same kind of effort at flooding

615
00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:30,320
Speaker 1: the zone.

616
00:30:30,600 --> 00:30:30,920
Speaker 4: Yeah.

617
00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:33,280
Speaker 5: I think that the stuff that Bernie has done is

618
00:30:33,440 --> 00:30:35,520
Speaker 5: because like as somebody who's more on the left, he

619
00:30:35,600 --> 00:30:38,280
Speaker 5: does stand out even like among our tendency, as somebody

620
00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:41,800
Speaker 5: who's been uniquely successful and like the remarkable thing and

621
00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:44,320
Speaker 5: like this is stuff people were saying like about him,

622
00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:46,560
Speaker 5: like early in the eighties before anybody knew who he

623
00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:50,680
Speaker 5: was nationally, is that he was an extremely effective messenger

624
00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:53,480
Speaker 5: in terms of discipline, just saying the same thing over

625
00:30:53,520 --> 00:30:55,880
Speaker 5: and over, like when he was mayor of Burlington. It

626
00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:58,080
Speaker 5: got to the point where he defined the terms of

627
00:30:58,080 --> 00:31:00,160
Speaker 5: the debate so much that by the end of his

628
00:31:00,240 --> 00:31:03,240
Speaker 5: tenure even his opponents were really speaking like kind of

629
00:31:03,280 --> 00:31:05,600
Speaker 5: the same language as him, just proposing different kinds of

630
00:31:05,640 --> 00:31:07,880
Speaker 5: ways of doing the problems that he made the center

631
00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:11,080
Speaker 5: of politics. That's art that Democrats have really lost, I

632
00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:13,920
Speaker 5: think in kind of the very consultant driven kind of

633
00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:17,440
Speaker 5: like structure that they have where it's always chasing polling

634
00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:20,200
Speaker 5: instead of driving it, which I think is possible.

635
00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:22,280
Speaker 2: Chasing polling is a really good point.

636
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:25,720
Speaker 1: So the people we've seen out on the stump, right,

637
00:31:26,080 --> 00:31:31,600
Speaker 1: Chris Murphy, endless right videos, movies on television and everything

638
00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:33,680
Speaker 1: everywhere tweeting up a storm.

639
00:31:33,840 --> 00:31:35,600
Speaker 2: I mean, Bernie was the first.

640
00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:37,520
Speaker 1: To do it, and he is doing the town halls

641
00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:40,920
Speaker 1: and they're getting huge response. And I actually was texting

642
00:31:40,920 --> 00:31:44,280
Speaker 1: with one of his people about like the huge response

643
00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:47,800
Speaker 1: and they're going to Republican districts. So okay, So we've

644
00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:51,600
Speaker 1: got him, We've got Murphy, and we've got Tim Walls.

645
00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:53,760
Speaker 1: I mean, can you think of anyone else who's sort

646
00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:55,640
Speaker 1: of out there in that same kind of way.

647
00:31:56,120 --> 00:31:57,960
Speaker 5: He did bring Sean Fain on his tour.

648
00:31:58,360 --> 00:31:59,680
Speaker 2: Oh yes, you're very smart.

649
00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:02,200
Speaker 5: And he also is bringing AOC to his tour in

650
00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:05,200
Speaker 5: the West. He's going to like Colorado, Nevada, and Arizona,

651
00:32:05,280 --> 00:32:07,600
Speaker 5: I think, and she's coming along with him, which is

652
00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:10,920
Speaker 5: like an interesting piece of kind of secession management.

653
00:32:10,800 --> 00:32:14,920
Speaker 1: Right because he's been criticized for not having a successor

654
00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:16,160
Speaker 1: because he is eighty three.

655
00:32:16,440 --> 00:32:18,200
Speaker 5: Yeah, he is eighty three. He'll be eighty seven and

656
00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:21,920
Speaker 5: twenty twenty eight, and that'll be a pretty valuable endorsement.

657
00:32:22,160 --> 00:32:24,240
Speaker 5: And you don't know if that he'll be around to

658
00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:27,280
Speaker 5: give that hopefully. I mean, he seems pretty spry right now.

659
00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:30,600
Speaker 2: But he's pretty spy and he's very sharp.

660
00:32:30,920 --> 00:32:31,120
Speaker 3: Yeah.

661
00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:36,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, the chief of staff of my guy Pritzker, you

662
00:32:36,040 --> 00:32:36,640
Speaker 1: know who she is.

663
00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:39,040
Speaker 2: Right, Anna had this very.

664
00:32:38,680 --> 00:32:43,040
Speaker 1: Smart thing which she tweeted, which was basically, this is

665
00:32:43,080 --> 00:32:47,040
Speaker 1: not about left or right right, the left side of

666
00:32:47,040 --> 00:32:50,000
Speaker 1: the party, the middle of the party, the more sort

667
00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:53,560
Speaker 1: of modern never trumpling of the party, which is basically

668
00:32:53,600 --> 00:32:56,400
Speaker 1: what it is at this point. It's actually about are

669
00:32:56,440 --> 00:32:58,520
Speaker 1: you going to fight or are you going to not fight?

670
00:32:59,000 --> 00:33:02,400
Speaker 5: Yeah, and I think that people really underestimate how like

671
00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:05,760
Speaker 5: there was the kind of like now infamous James Carville

672
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:10,000
Speaker 5: line in his New York Times off ever, he said, Oh,

673
00:33:10,040 --> 00:33:13,360
Speaker 5: Democrats need to play dead, and he's obviously just one person,

674
00:33:13,400 --> 00:33:16,200
Speaker 5: But that really is the kind of strategy that the leadership,

675
00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:18,680
Speaker 5: the kind of fighter versus not fighter thing, that's what

676
00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:21,480
Speaker 5: they're taking. They are trying to be as non confrontational

677
00:33:21,480 --> 00:33:24,800
Speaker 5: as possible. They're trying to just like let Republicans take

678
00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:28,000
Speaker 5: up all the attention so when things get bad then

679
00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:30,160
Speaker 5: people will blame them and they'll go to Democrats as

680
00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:30,760
Speaker 5: an alternative.

681
00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:32,560
Speaker 2: That's the wrong play, I think.

682
00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:35,760
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's not really what any opposition I think is

683
00:33:35,800 --> 00:33:36,960
Speaker 5: ever really done.

684
00:33:37,400 --> 00:33:37,480
Speaker 4: Right.

685
00:33:37,560 --> 00:33:38,400
Speaker 2: He doesn't work.

686
00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:40,840
Speaker 5: They didn't do that in twenty eighteen. There was like

687
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:43,680
Speaker 5: they were very active in opposing him, and there's I

688
00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:47,040
Speaker 5: think there's sort of like this weird kind of revisionist

689
00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:50,320
Speaker 5: history where everybody's trying to paint everything that involve the

690
00:33:50,360 --> 00:33:52,720
Speaker 5: eight years of resistance to Trump as this kind of

691
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:56,520
Speaker 5: retrospective failure because of what the end result was. But

692
00:33:56,560 --> 00:33:58,280
Speaker 5: if you look at what they did during his first

693
00:33:58,320 --> 00:34:00,880
Speaker 5: four years, like this kind of era that's now being

694
00:34:00,880 --> 00:34:04,120
Speaker 5: looked back on, is like this embarrassing too woe thing

695
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:07,120
Speaker 5: that created a backlash. It was very effective in and

696
00:34:07,160 --> 00:34:10,400
Speaker 5: of itself. Trump came in with the trifecta in twenty sixteen,

697
00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:12,600
Speaker 5: and he left in twenty twenty. His party had lost

698
00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:14,799
Speaker 5: the presidency of the House in the Senate, the last

699
00:34:14,800 --> 00:34:18,080
Speaker 5: time that had happened so quickly for I think a

700
00:34:18,160 --> 00:34:21,560
Speaker 5: president whose party was newly elected, I think was like

701
00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:25,400
Speaker 5: Grover Cleveland or something. It's not typical for a party

702
00:34:25,520 --> 00:34:28,080
Speaker 5: to come in like I know Herbert Hoover did, but

703
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:30,520
Speaker 5: he was like at the tail end of three administrations.

704
00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:33,359
Speaker 5: It's not typical for a party to lose that much

705
00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:36,160
Speaker 5: goodwill that fast. That was a real like. So a

706
00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:38,360
Speaker 5: lot of what Democrats did during the first four years

707
00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:40,120
Speaker 5: did work. Yeah, it did work.

708
00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:43,400
Speaker 1: Yeah. And you know what annoys me about that because

709
00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:46,080
Speaker 1: I agree. I think there's a lot of like shitting

710
00:34:46,120 --> 00:34:50,320
Speaker 1: on twenty sixteen because you know, saying it was cringe

711
00:34:50,520 --> 00:34:51,400
Speaker 1: or whatever.

712
00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:53,080
Speaker 5: Or twenty eighteen the resistance.

713
00:34:53,400 --> 00:34:53,600
Speaker 2: Right.

714
00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:56,080
Speaker 1: When you would talk to people about the twenty twenty

715
00:34:56,080 --> 00:34:58,360
Speaker 1: four election, you would say, well, you know, Donald Trump

716
00:34:58,400 --> 00:35:00,520
Speaker 1: wants to do this, this and this in voters would say,

717
00:35:00,600 --> 00:35:03,240
Speaker 1: but he didn't do it last time, so he won't

718
00:35:03,239 --> 00:35:06,080
Speaker 1: do it this time. And in some ways Democrats were

719
00:35:06,080 --> 00:35:09,360
Speaker 1: really a victim of their own success, right Like Trump

720
00:35:09,400 --> 00:35:13,799
Speaker 1: had wanted to repeal Obamacare had it not been for

721
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:18,080
Speaker 1: Meghan McCain's dad. You may remember him as a United.

722
00:35:17,840 --> 00:35:20,320
Speaker 5: States Senator, as obscure figure.

723
00:35:20,320 --> 00:35:23,120
Speaker 2: Right who me and Meghan made it all on her own.

724
00:35:23,160 --> 00:35:26,000
Speaker 2: Of course, had she not made it on her own,

725
00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:26,799
Speaker 2: she had this.

726
00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:30,200
Speaker 1: Father who actually was the vote that thumbs down that

727
00:35:30,360 --> 00:35:33,279
Speaker 1: saved healthcare for all of these millions of people. I

728
00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:37,520
Speaker 1: don't know why we're shitting on the sort of success

729
00:35:37,680 --> 00:35:39,960
Speaker 1: of that. And the other thing I want to ask you,

730
00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:42,640
Speaker 1: I heard a friend of mine say this on a podcast,

731
00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:44,520
Speaker 1: and I got really mad at him, and I actually

732
00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:46,360
Speaker 1: called him up and yelled at him because I was like,

733
00:35:46,600 --> 00:35:48,320
Speaker 1: my favorite thing to do is call people up and

734
00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:50,040
Speaker 1: yell at them about their opinions.

735
00:35:50,200 --> 00:35:51,640
Speaker 2: But he had said, we are in.

736
00:35:51,560 --> 00:35:55,600
Speaker 1: A cycle of back to back to back backlashes where

737
00:35:55,680 --> 00:35:58,560
Speaker 1: voters are so angry that they're going to backlash, you know.

738
00:35:58,640 --> 00:36:01,080
Speaker 1: And he said Hair's going to lose and Trump is

739
00:36:01,080 --> 00:36:03,640
Speaker 1: going to win, not because they want trumpsm but because

740
00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:07,200
Speaker 1: they're angry at the administration, they have right now talk

741
00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:08,200
Speaker 1: me through that idea.

742
00:36:08,400 --> 00:36:10,640
Speaker 5: There is something to say about that. And I think that, like,

743
00:36:10,680 --> 00:36:12,479
Speaker 5: if you look at it for a very broad view,

744
00:36:12,920 --> 00:36:15,319
Speaker 5: it's just this kind of long period where people don't

745
00:36:15,360 --> 00:36:18,239
Speaker 5: really feel like the central issues that they're angry about

746
00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:21,279
Speaker 5: are are being like really directly addressed. We are now

747
00:36:21,280 --> 00:36:24,000
Speaker 5: on like a third straight like this will be a

748
00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:27,120
Speaker 5: one term presidency. I'm like, it's our third straight one

749
00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:29,920
Speaker 5: term presidency. I can't like I think like during the

750
00:36:29,920 --> 00:36:33,480
Speaker 5: Cold War period, only like there were two total presidents

751
00:36:33,520 --> 00:36:37,799
Speaker 5: like Carter and hw Bush were one term presidents and

752
00:36:38,160 --> 00:36:40,960
Speaker 5: just lost reelection and it wasn't because they were killed.

753
00:36:41,239 --> 00:36:44,279
Speaker 5: This is a remarkable period of like swings back one

754
00:36:44,320 --> 00:36:46,560
Speaker 5: way and the other. And I do think that there

755
00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:49,640
Speaker 5: is a lot to be said about people voting for

756
00:36:49,840 --> 00:36:53,440
Speaker 5: Trump over Harris because like not necessarily as an endorsement of

757
00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:56,959
Speaker 5: his program, obviously it was a very narrow election. And also,

758
00:36:57,040 --> 00:36:59,520
Speaker 5: like what you were saying about Trump's first term, this

759
00:36:59,600 --> 00:37:02,080
Speaker 5: is something I wrote about, like is in this piece

760
00:37:02,320 --> 00:37:04,719
Speaker 5: or like a month or two ago, about the main

761
00:37:04,800 --> 00:37:10,400
Speaker 5: contradictions of like Trump's presidency, Trump's biggest advantage, like by

762
00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:13,000
Speaker 5: the end of the election, was that people, like a

763
00:37:13,040 --> 00:37:15,759
Speaker 5: majority of people looked back on his first administration or

764
00:37:15,760 --> 00:37:18,680
Speaker 5: they saw it as a retrospective success, which was not

765
00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:20,719
Speaker 5: the case at all. He never had positive approval during

766
00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:22,759
Speaker 5: his first term, but people look back in what he

767
00:37:22,800 --> 00:37:25,480
Speaker 5: did then when like they thought, like the international scene

768
00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:29,080
Speaker 5: was relatively peaceful and the economy wasn't undergoing like an

769
00:37:29,120 --> 00:37:33,560
Speaker 5: acostal living crisis, and just like relative stability compared to

770
00:37:33,600 --> 00:37:36,440
Speaker 5: the post COVID world, and they looked back on that positively.

771
00:37:36,680 --> 00:37:39,200
Speaker 5: But I think is fascinating is that that is that

772
00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:42,799
Speaker 5: that comes after four years where the right has broadly

773
00:37:42,840 --> 00:37:47,360
Speaker 5: written off Trump's first term as a miserable, compromised failure.

774
00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:51,000
Speaker 5: Like their entire way to explain the election to this

775
00:37:51,360 --> 00:37:53,800
Speaker 5: they like twenty twenty to the sent that they recognized

776
00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:56,200
Speaker 5: that they even lost it was that, oh, Trump had

777
00:37:56,239 --> 00:37:59,239
Speaker 5: too many globalists around him, he wasn't prepared enough, he

778
00:37:59,320 --> 00:38:03,160
Speaker 5: didn't have he wasn't truly socially conservative enough, he wasn't

779
00:38:03,360 --> 00:38:07,600
Speaker 5: dedicated enough to the cause. So they have undergone this

780
00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:12,280
Speaker 5: extensive effort to really like institutionalize this form of politics

781
00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:16,120
Speaker 5: that they're imagining is what people really wanted. And at

782
00:38:16,160 --> 00:38:18,319
Speaker 5: the tail end of that entire process, when they get JD.

783
00:38:18,440 --> 00:38:21,680
Speaker 5: Vance's VP and they have the America First Policy Institute

784
00:38:21,840 --> 00:38:25,040
Speaker 5: and Product twenty twenty five planning out all these radical changes,

785
00:38:25,600 --> 00:38:28,919
Speaker 5: what people vote him in on is over that first term,

786
00:38:29,080 --> 00:38:31,840
Speaker 5: they have gifts avowed more than anybody else. And I

787
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:34,560
Speaker 5: think that if that's what a lot of people expected,

788
00:38:34,600 --> 00:38:36,680
Speaker 5: they were going off with what they knew, and his

789
00:38:36,760 --> 00:38:39,920
Speaker 5: approval has like plummeted in the past couple of weeks,

790
00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:43,440
Speaker 5: like even more rapidly than a honeymoon bomb usually fades.

791
00:38:43,600 --> 00:38:46,160
Speaker 5: And I think that the people were generally by the

792
00:38:46,200 --> 00:38:48,200
Speaker 5: end of twenty twenty four, they were fine with the

793
00:38:48,239 --> 00:38:51,120
Speaker 5: idea of a good economy and mean tweets. They weren't

794
00:38:51,160 --> 00:38:54,160
Speaker 5: like so disgusted by Trump as a figure, Like it's

795
00:38:54,160 --> 00:38:57,319
Speaker 5: been a decade since he entered politics. They're basically just

796
00:38:57,800 --> 00:39:00,800
Speaker 5: CETI sized to whatever his shtick is. They were fine

797
00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:03,080
Speaker 5: with that. But instead of getting like what they got

798
00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:05,279
Speaker 5: during his first term, which is just him being this

799
00:39:05,440 --> 00:39:08,480
Speaker 5: character while things seem to go well, which is a

800
00:39:08,480 --> 00:39:11,720
Speaker 5: compromise people were willing to make, they're getting this huge

801
00:39:11,840 --> 00:39:16,120
Speaker 5: paleocon ideological project that was never really litigated during the

802
00:39:16,200 --> 00:39:19,759
Speaker 5: term itself, and I think like presenting like obviously, there's

803
00:39:19,800 --> 00:39:22,480
Speaker 5: the oligarchy thing, and like talking about how the rich

804
00:39:22,560 --> 00:39:25,239
Speaker 5: people control it and it's not real democracy. I think

805
00:39:25,239 --> 00:39:28,480
Speaker 5: that's a very effective framing that Republicans can't really respond to,

806
00:39:28,920 --> 00:39:31,920
Speaker 5: but also just kind of turning the narrative of elite

807
00:39:31,960 --> 00:39:35,279
Speaker 5: capture on its head and talking about how his administration

808
00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:39,120
Speaker 5: is being run by these kind of like super ideological creeps.

809
00:39:39,440 --> 00:39:41,920
Speaker 5: It's a message that the right has hit liberals with

810
00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:44,600
Speaker 5: for a long time. Like I think making the Heritage

811
00:39:44,600 --> 00:39:47,920
Speaker 5: Foundation a household name was one of the few real

812
00:39:47,960 --> 00:39:51,480
Speaker 5: impressive successes of twenty twenty four on the Democratic side,

813
00:39:51,880 --> 00:39:54,440
Speaker 5: and more of that I think will be helpful.

814
00:39:54,800 --> 00:40:00,200
Speaker 1: It definitely seems like we're in a very abnormal them

815
00:40:00,200 --> 00:40:05,120
Speaker 1: all time in American politics. So when we talk about

816
00:40:05,160 --> 00:40:09,240
Speaker 1: like Democrats winning back at the midterms, like it feels

817
00:40:09,280 --> 00:40:13,000
Speaker 1: like a fair amount of sunny optimism here, we are

818
00:40:13,080 --> 00:40:17,480
Speaker 1: definitely down rabbit hole. Certain things make me think like

819
00:40:17,640 --> 00:40:22,440
Speaker 1: will be okay. The incompetence of this administration, the feeling

820
00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:28,240
Speaker 1: that Trump you know, already running out of gas. The

821
00:40:28,280 --> 00:40:30,520
Speaker 1: things that make me think we're not going to be okay,

822
00:40:30,880 --> 00:40:34,480
Speaker 1: Elin and Trump basically whipped the House vote. You know,

823
00:40:34,680 --> 00:40:38,640
Speaker 1: that's clearly what happened here, Republicans in Congress of giving

824
00:40:38,640 --> 00:40:41,920
Speaker 1: away their power at an alarming clip. I mean, what

825
00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:45,440
Speaker 1: are you watching to sort of tell you whether or

826
00:40:45,440 --> 00:40:46,399
Speaker 1: not to sleep at night?

827
00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:49,719
Speaker 5: This is going to sound like kind of dire, but

828
00:40:49,840 --> 00:40:51,840
Speaker 5: I guess, like to the U Stent, they're actually listening

829
00:40:51,840 --> 00:40:55,400
Speaker 5: to court orders. I mean, no, no, it's not dire.

830
00:40:55,600 --> 00:40:56,480
Speaker 2: I mean that's right.

831
00:40:56,680 --> 00:41:00,360
Speaker 5: You've had jd Vance like LARPing about like oh like

832
00:41:00,400 --> 00:41:04,280
Speaker 5: and like whatever, like eighteen year old Nazi staffer posted

833
00:41:04,320 --> 00:41:08,160
Speaker 5: a Napoleon quote on his Twitter page, right, But at

834
00:41:08,200 --> 00:41:10,520
Speaker 5: the same you do see them kind of complying with

835
00:41:10,719 --> 00:41:13,759
Speaker 5: even like the stuff with the deportation flights. They like

836
00:41:13,840 --> 00:41:16,200
Speaker 5: there was obviously all the bragging on Twitter, but like

837
00:41:16,239 --> 00:41:19,839
Speaker 5: they're still litigating that and they're making this convoluted legal

838
00:41:19,920 --> 00:41:22,239
Speaker 5: argument as to why it was still legal, like to

839
00:41:22,280 --> 00:41:24,440
Speaker 5: the extent that. I mean, there's like all these really

840
00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:28,240
Speaker 5: the right wing like Third Amendment Project whatever they're called,

841
00:41:28,560 --> 00:41:30,520
Speaker 5: Like these right wing people on Twitter who are like

842
00:41:30,560 --> 00:41:33,480
Speaker 5: freaking out and like saying, oh, the judiciary better get

843
00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:36,000
Speaker 5: their act in line, because nothing says we have to

844
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:38,760
Speaker 5: listen to them. So the extent that like the constitutional

845
00:41:38,920 --> 00:41:42,840
Speaker 5: order is still in operation, I think that that is

846
00:41:43,280 --> 00:41:44,280
Speaker 5: a positive sign.

847
00:41:44,880 --> 00:41:48,600
Speaker 1: Yes, so sad that we're having this conversation, but.

848
00:41:48,640 --> 00:41:51,399
Speaker 5: Yes, go on the question of like elections, I think

849
00:41:51,480 --> 00:41:54,080
Speaker 5: is something people are worried about. That's less of like

850
00:41:54,239 --> 00:41:56,600
Speaker 5: in terms of the just the pure logistics of it.

851
00:41:56,760 --> 00:41:59,600
Speaker 5: That's less of an immediate concern because those are held

852
00:41:59,680 --> 00:42:02,160
Speaker 5: the state level. If there was like a problem with

853
00:42:02,239 --> 00:42:06,160
Speaker 5: Republicans like in red states, like stopping elections, they've had

854
00:42:06,160 --> 00:42:08,759
Speaker 5: that power for a while and they haven't like exercised

855
00:42:08,760 --> 00:42:11,879
Speaker 5: it yet, I guess. And even then, like I mean,

856
00:42:11,920 --> 00:42:13,600
Speaker 5: I don't know, there's just a lot of like the

857
00:42:13,640 --> 00:42:17,520
Speaker 5: basic kind of machinery that is still I guess intact

858
00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:19,880
Speaker 5: at this point. I guess that makes it so I

859
00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:22,319
Speaker 5: can kind of talk about stuff like twenty twenty eight

860
00:42:22,320 --> 00:42:24,239
Speaker 5: without feeling like it's pointless.

861
00:42:24,520 --> 00:42:28,200
Speaker 1: I'll take it. I'll take it. Yeah, Josh, will you

862
00:42:28,280 --> 00:42:29,440
Speaker 1: please come back soon?

863
00:42:29,960 --> 00:42:32,120
Speaker 5: Of course, of course, any time.

864
00:42:33,719 --> 00:42:40,880
Speaker 6: They're no more thickly Jesse Cannon Smelly, we are often

865
00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:44,680
Speaker 6: exhausted by the stupidity of GOP State House laws.

866
00:42:44,680 --> 00:42:47,920
Speaker 3: But Arkansas, I think they did the thorough pummeling of

867
00:42:47,960 --> 00:42:50,600
Speaker 3: my exhaustion this week where they brought up a bill

868
00:42:50,600 --> 00:42:53,920
Speaker 3: that could ban hairdressers from giving gender non conforming haircuts

869
00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:54,799
Speaker 3: to minors.

870
00:42:55,239 --> 00:42:55,560
Speaker 2: Yeah.

871
00:42:55,800 --> 00:42:58,880
Speaker 3: The Party of Freedom, MALLI, the Party of Freedom.

872
00:42:58,719 --> 00:43:01,600
Speaker 2: The Party of Freedom. So yeah.

873
00:43:01,680 --> 00:43:07,520
Speaker 1: Earlier this month, Arkansas State Rep. Mary Bentley, looking for

874
00:43:07,600 --> 00:43:12,640
Speaker 1: a place on the Supreme Court, introduced HB sixteen sixty

875
00:43:12,680 --> 00:43:15,880
Speaker 1: eight a law that would be more appropriate in sixteen

876
00:43:15,960 --> 00:43:20,640
Speaker 1: sixty eight, the Vulnerable Youth Protection Act. It's an anti

877
00:43:20,640 --> 00:43:25,799
Speaker 1: trans bill that does not actually criminalize anything, but it

878
00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:31,680
Speaker 1: weaponizes civil enforcement by permitting lawsuits against people who support

879
00:43:31,960 --> 00:43:36,040
Speaker 1: trans people by providing or helping to receive gender affirming

880
00:43:36,120 --> 00:43:39,040
Speaker 1: care or affirming young people in their transition.

881
00:43:39,719 --> 00:43:45,239
Speaker 2: So again, this is the same as Sbaight.

882
00:43:45,560 --> 00:43:45,719
Speaker 4: Right.

883
00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:49,080
Speaker 1: These are the idea right. Remember in Sbaight, it was

884
00:43:49,120 --> 00:43:53,439
Speaker 1: this abortion law in Texas made it so that men

885
00:43:53,600 --> 00:43:57,040
Speaker 1: whose wives or girlfriends had had abortions could sue the

886
00:43:57,120 --> 00:44:01,400
Speaker 1: people who helped them. This is this idea that you

887
00:44:01,640 --> 00:44:07,720
Speaker 1: can deputize other Americans to be your henchmen, and it

888
00:44:07,800 --> 00:44:11,880
Speaker 1: is meant to scare people, and it is meant to

889
00:44:12,480 --> 00:44:16,520
Speaker 1: make life harder for people, and it is meant to

890
00:44:16,640 --> 00:44:20,959
Speaker 1: put women, especially those in abusive relationships, in a place

891
00:44:20,960 --> 00:44:23,960
Speaker 1: where they have less power. So this is a page

892
00:44:24,120 --> 00:44:29,000
Speaker 1: out of the Matthew Cosmeric, the judge from Texas who

893
00:44:29,080 --> 00:44:31,920
Speaker 1: has been very involved in the Comstock Act. This is

894
00:44:31,960 --> 00:44:34,920
Speaker 1: a page out of these guys book. Right, this idea

895
00:44:35,440 --> 00:44:40,800
Speaker 1: that you can deputize people to go and harass women

896
00:44:41,000 --> 00:44:44,760
Speaker 1: who have had abortions, and here we have a way

897
00:44:44,800 --> 00:44:49,160
Speaker 1: to harass people who give haircuts to minors. This is

898
00:44:49,200 --> 00:44:52,120
Speaker 1: the kind of thing where it seems very stupid and trivial,

899
00:44:52,280 --> 00:44:57,480
Speaker 1: but it's actually sort of this step towards a police state, right,

900
00:44:57,560 --> 00:44:59,960
Speaker 1: It's a step towards less for.

901
00:45:00,280 --> 00:45:03,839
Speaker 3: America, the true or Wellian state where your neighbors are

902
00:45:03,880 --> 00:45:07,160
Speaker 3: telling on each other and your neighbor you've deputized everybody

903
00:45:07,239 --> 00:45:10,360
Speaker 3: as a law enforcement agent. Of this and exactly what

904
00:45:10,480 --> 00:45:13,200
Speaker 3: the warning was and orwell, yeah, that stuff.

905
00:45:13,960 --> 00:45:18,319
Speaker 1: That's it for this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in

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00:45:18,600 --> 00:45:24,080
Speaker 1: every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday and Saturday to hear the best

907
00:45:24,160 --> 00:45:28,440
Speaker 1: minds and politics make sense of all this chaos. If

908
00:45:28,480 --> 00:45:31,520
Speaker 1: you enjoy this podcast, please send it to a friend

909
00:45:31,960 --> 00:45:33,600
Speaker 1: and keep the conversation going.

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00:45:34,040 --> 00:45:35,200
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening,