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Speaker 1: It's time to get inside the Giants huts.

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Speaker 2: Let's go.

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Speaker 1: Let's go, Giants, Get the Giants mobul, give me some job.

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Speaker 1: Part of the Giants podcast Network. Let's Roll. Welcome to

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Speaker 1: another edition of the Giants Little Podcast, brought to you

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Speaker 1: by Citizens, the official bank of the Giants. I am

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Speaker 1: John Schmelk. Welcome back in front of the program. You'll

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Speaker 1: be seeing him on our programming over the course the

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Speaker 1: next couple of months. Getting ready for the NFL Draft.

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Speaker 1: Dave Seversen, who covers the draft for our Lads dot com, Dave,

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Speaker 1: how are you man?

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Speaker 2: Awesome? John, This is one of my favorite parts of

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Speaker 2: the process right now because we don't have a lot

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Speaker 2: of clarity on what the draft will look like in

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Speaker 2: April because of free agency and coaching hires. So right

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Speaker 2: now you have to look under every single stone, cross

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Speaker 2: every t dot, every eye. And that's the best way

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Speaker 2: to learn a bat a draft classes to dive headfirst.

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Speaker 2: And I know we still both have a little ways

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Speaker 2: to go, but really excited to get the ball rolling

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Speaker 2: because it we're just having to start.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and the only process is fun, right because we're

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Speaker 1: not worrying about team needs, We're not worrying about, you know,

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Speaker 1: things like that. We're just worried about the players. Who

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Speaker 1: are these players, what are they about, where they've been

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Speaker 1: in How does this draft class compared to other draft classes.

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Speaker 1: And that's kind of what we're gonna do today. We're

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Speaker 1: gonna set up primer for most football fans and NFL

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Speaker 1: fans and Giant fans that haven't paid much attention to

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Speaker 1: the draft over the past four or five months. Though

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Speaker 1: I recommend you go check out Tony Paul and I

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Speaker 1: on draft season you can catch up on all this stuff.

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Speaker 1: But this will kind of be a one stop, half

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Speaker 1: hour podcast. This is the draft class. This is what

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Speaker 1: the Giants are looking at a three. This is what

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Speaker 1: Giant fans have to worry about, all right, So let's

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Speaker 1: start here. Dave and we kind of we chatting before

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Speaker 1: we started. Not a great draft to be picking in

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Speaker 1: the top ten last year was the opposite. The Giants

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Speaker 1: are picking at six, and they got a player that

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Speaker 1: could have went top one or two or three in

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Speaker 1: most other drafts. This year not the case. Now, the

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Speaker 1: Giants could be fortunate at three where one of the

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Speaker 1: one or two what I would consider elite position players

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Speaker 1: are sitting there for them. But why don't you kind

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Speaker 1: of put the top ten of this draft class in context?

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Speaker 1: And maybe last year's class and other classes fans might

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Speaker 1: be familiar with what's.

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Speaker 2: Gonna be a standout trait to this draft class. And

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Speaker 2: you'll see as we c this is going to become

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Speaker 2: more and more clear that there is a growing trend

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Speaker 2: in media in the league about the value of positions,

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Speaker 2: premium positions, if you will, the tackles, the edge defenders,

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Speaker 2: the quarterbacks, the wide receivers, and in this class, the

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Speaker 2: best players don't play those positions. And some of the

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Speaker 2: weak points of this draft class. And I don't want

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Speaker 2: to say that there aren't good players. There are very

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Speaker 2: good players at every single position in this draft. But

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Speaker 2: when you're talking about the blue goose, the prime grades,

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Speaker 2: the guys that you project to be all pros, they

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Speaker 2: don't play those premium positions. So what I'm really interested

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Speaker 2: to see in this draft how much does that matter

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Speaker 2: in the top ten Because the best I would say,

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Speaker 2: two of the best seven players in this draft, one

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Speaker 2: is a tight end and one is a running back.

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Speaker 2: But those guys, it's looked down upon if you draft

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Speaker 2: them in the top ten.

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Speaker 1: And by the way, David, you can even argue another

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Speaker 1: top guy play safety.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, Malcos Starks. Absolutely. And then you talk about

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Speaker 2: the defensive tackles other than Abdul Carter, who I'm sure

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Speaker 2: we'll talk about the detackles in this group. I might

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Speaker 2: take them over most of the edge defenders. And I

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Speaker 2: do know the Dexter Lawrence contract and Aaron Donald changed

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Speaker 2: the game a little bit. But the edge defender is

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Speaker 2: still the premium position up front, but the players inside

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Speaker 2: are better. So I'm really curious to see how much

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Speaker 2: does that actually impact where a guy gets drafted.

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Speaker 1: No, you're right, and it was the opposite last year.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 1: You had wide receivers, you had offensive tackles, you had

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Speaker 1: all those types of positions that were super valuable as

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Speaker 1: your quarterback obviously, and that's really not the case this year.

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Speaker 1: So let's start with the non quarterbacks first, and no worry,

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Speaker 1: Giant fans, we will get to the quarterbacks. But you

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Speaker 1: mentioned who would you consider the elite position players in

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Speaker 1: this year's class that you would be pretty comfortable and

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Speaker 1: you can include position value in this if you want.

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Speaker 1: That you would feel comfortable in pretty much any draft class.

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Speaker 1: Drafting them in the top ten. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I mean Bill in the school thought that you can

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Speaker 2: take a running back, and I don't think the Giants

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Speaker 2: are going to go down this path. I would bet

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Speaker 2: against it, honestly, but ash Gent Ashton Genty is kind

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Speaker 2: of like my personal prototype running back. The guy has

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Speaker 2: led the country and broken tackles over the past few years.

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Speaker 2: By country mile, he's got a PhD and just breaking

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Speaker 2: through contact and contact bounds. He led the country in

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Speaker 2: seventy sixty and fifty yard runs and the next guy

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Speaker 2: was less than half the amount of what Genty did.

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Speaker 2: I mean, we were talking about a legitimate Saquon Barkley

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Speaker 2: caliber grade at that running back position. I think in

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Speaker 2: any draft he's a top ten caliber guy. We just

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Speaker 2: saw Bjon Robbinson go top ten. We've seen Detroit reach

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Speaker 2: as we put it back in the day for Jamior Gibbs,

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Speaker 2: and that's worked out pretty well. We're looking at the

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Speaker 2: biggest running back contracts that were giving the offseason. The

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Speaker 2: teams are still in the playoffs. I mean, that is

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Speaker 2: a thing that I think we're gonna see happen in

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Speaker 2: this draft, and it would happen in any draft. Ashon

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Speaker 2: genty goes top ten. Tyler Warren to me is a

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Speaker 2: TJ Hawk and saying a former top ten pick. He's

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Speaker 2: another Brock Bauers caliber player, a different kind of player.

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Speaker 2: He actually plays with his hand in the dirt and

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Speaker 2: can block in line. But that's another guy that I

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Speaker 2: would be comfortable taking in the top ten. But the

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Speaker 2: question that I would love to get your input on

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Speaker 2: if you've seen these guys so far at wide receiver,

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Speaker 2: you know, we just saw that top three last year,

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Speaker 2: Malik Neighbors, Marvin Harrison roma done say that was like

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Speaker 2: the cream of the crop. But then you see names

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Speaker 2: like Brian Thomas and Lad McConkie come in, and those

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Speaker 2: guys had made the R Lads L Rookie team which

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Speaker 2: comes out this week. I mean, do you really see

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Speaker 2: a top ten a guy in this draft worthy of

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Speaker 2: taking that high in the draft at that position? And

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Speaker 2: that's where I get a little shaky. Is that wide receiver?

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Speaker 1: I would think about Ted McMillan at the bottom half

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Speaker 1: of the top ten. That would be the one guy.

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Speaker 1: I'm not a Luther burning guy, I want to pick

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Speaker 1: him that high. I think the better question and now

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Speaker 1: we can we can hit on Travis Hunter here, right,

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Speaker 1: because he's kind of like the really unique player. If

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Speaker 1: he was just a wide receiver and not also a cornerback,

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Speaker 1: or if he was just a cornerback and not just

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Speaker 1: a wide receiver, would he be a top ten player.

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Speaker 1: My thought on that is if he was just a cornerback, yes,

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Speaker 1: If he was just a wide receiver, no, where do

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Speaker 1: you stand on that?

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Speaker 2: I see him as a wide receiver, body type, movement traits,

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Speaker 2: and ball skills as Garrett Wilson. You know, he's in

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Speaker 2: that scene like five eleven one and eighty pounds, slightly undersized,

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Speaker 2: but unbelievably fast. I don't know if we truly know

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Speaker 2: how fast this kid is. According to the GPS tracking,

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Speaker 2: he was the second fastest player in all of college

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Speaker 2: football last year out of sixty sixty nine hundred players.

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Speaker 2: I mean, think about that. That's including Savior Worthy. You know,

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Speaker 2: it's like, this is the kind of guy that might

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Speaker 2: run four two is and you put a number like

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Speaker 2: that on this kind of player. That's a top ten

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Speaker 2: pick to me all day. But I understod my hesitation

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Speaker 2: with drafting him high. I need full cohesion in the

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Speaker 2: room of what the plan is for him. Are you

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Speaker 2: actually going to try and play him both sides? It's

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Speaker 2: never been done at a level that what he did

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Speaker 2: in college. We've seen guys flash on both sides of

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Speaker 2: the ball, but nothing what Travis Hunter did in college.

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Speaker 2: Do we really think he can do that at the

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Speaker 2: next level. And this is where the organizations that are

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Speaker 2: constantly contecting the playoffs, there's cohesion from owner to front

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Speaker 2: office to coaching staff. And I would love to try

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Speaker 2: him on offense first. I think the upside of a

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Speaker 2: corner is a little limited, not a very big guy.

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Speaker 2: And I just think the way the league is right now,

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Speaker 2: give me points, put points on the board, and you

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Speaker 2: try to manufacture and good enough defense, especially for a

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Speaker 2: team like the Giants who have just been in the

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Speaker 2: cellar for so long and the offense has been the

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Speaker 2: main issue for that long.

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Speaker 1: Okay, I'm gonna give you the counterpoint to that, because

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Speaker 1: I think this is gonna be fun conversation that that's

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Speaker 1: that we're gonna have for the next three months. Now.

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Speaker 1: I think if you're going to try to do both,

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Speaker 1: it's easier to be a full time corner and a

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Speaker 1: part time wide receiver. You don't see many guys that

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Speaker 1: all right, you're playing for fifteen snaps at corner. You

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Speaker 1: have to know how to pass guys off. You don't

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Speaker 1: have to work with your safeties. It's much easier to

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Speaker 1: put together a twelve to fifteen play package on offense

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Speaker 1: than it is to put together a twelve to fifteen

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Speaker 1: play package on defense. And I do think just from

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Speaker 1: a playing the wide receiver, you know, just skill wise

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Speaker 1: and you know the ins and outs of it. I

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Speaker 1: think he's much more raw than Garrett Wilson was coming out,

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Speaker 1: for example, not as good as a rat runner of

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Speaker 1: things like that. Even though I'm with you, I think

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Speaker 1: the physical profile match is actually pretty pretty well. I

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Speaker 1: haven't heard that one before. I think it's really good.

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Speaker 1: That's my argument for why I'm thinking full time corner.

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Speaker 1: But you still try to get your dozen plays on

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Speaker 1: offense and you know two minute when it's a little simpler,

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Speaker 1: big third down plays, you know, specific packages for him.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't. I would never argue against being a

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Speaker 2: corner and a part time offensive player because again, like

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Speaker 2: I do think logistically it just makes more sense, and

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Speaker 2: it's it's like defense and playing corner. We can see

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Speaker 2: you Deante banks right now. You need a lot of

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Speaker 2: reps to develop. You know, you can't just be talented

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Speaker 2: to play corner. You need to get a lot of reps.

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Speaker 2: And if you are gonna limit him on that side

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Speaker 2: of the ball, the likelihood of him reaching the ceiling.

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Speaker 2: But what we're saying right now, these are the conversations

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Speaker 2: teams are going to have. You don't want to draft

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Speaker 2: him and say we'll figure it out later. All those

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Speaker 2: decisions need to be made prior to drafting him. And

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Speaker 2: if you don't feel there is cohesion in that room,

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Speaker 2: you will not reach the fantasy of what Travis Henner presents.

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Speaker 1: And by the way, real quick, what does he want

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Speaker 1: to do? Right? Like? Is he all in on playing corner?

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Speaker 1: Is he all in on playing wide receiver? I just

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Speaker 1: want to pick this guy this high and try to

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Speaker 1: force him into a spot. You know he might you know,

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm just some guys might be thinking, well,

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Speaker 1: just look at the average contract for a wide receiver

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Speaker 1: versus the average contract for a corner. Why would I

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Speaker 1: want to play cornerback? So I don't know what Hunter's thinking.

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Speaker 1: Team's got to figure that out.

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Speaker 2: Too, yep. I mean, if you rattle off. You go

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Speaker 2: into a sports bar and you give and you start

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Speaker 2: talking about the top ten wide receivers in football. Everybody

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Speaker 2: will know who you're talking about. Every time you bring

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Speaker 2: up a new name. You bring up the ten best

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Speaker 2: corners in football. Most of those guys will know the

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Speaker 2: top three or four, but they don't know the rest,

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Speaker 2: the marketing, the money opportunities, and is that what fuels him.

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Speaker 2: I don't know Travis Hunter well enough to say yes

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Speaker 2: or no, but I would say I would assume if

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Speaker 2: I'm him and he's my son, wide receiver is the

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Speaker 2: route to go, and you do have to. Those conversations

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Speaker 2: with him will be crucial to what where he ends

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Speaker 2: up going and how and what organization drafts him come April.

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Speaker 1: You know, David, I don't know if organizations think this way.

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Speaker 1: And this week my last thing on Hunter, and I

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Speaker 1: think if I'm picking the first position player, I think

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Speaker 1: he's probably the first guy I pick. And I think

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Speaker 1: the reason is simply this, I get two bites at

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Speaker 1: the apple. Right. We've seen, for example, corners that get

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Speaker 1: picked really high in this league flame out. It happens, right,

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Speaker 1: It's just the way that it's a tough position to play.

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Speaker 2: Well.

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Speaker 1: You know what if you get through a year with

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Speaker 1: Travis Hunter and you say, wait a second, I don't

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Speaker 1: think this is gonna work. Well, you can just slow

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Speaker 1: item hunt the offense, so you almost get two shots

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Speaker 1: at the player at two different spots, which makes the

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Speaker 1: chance of the pick failing even smaller. And to give

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Speaker 1: yourself that type of safety net if the first position

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Speaker 1: doesn't work out, I think that just gives you so

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Speaker 1: much value and backstop as a front office to reduce

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Speaker 1: the risk of your pick that if it doesn't work

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Speaker 1: at corner, all right, let's Lineman wide receiver and we've

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Speaker 1: already seen proof of concept at that spot in college.

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Speaker 2: You're you're exactly right. It's a hedge, and any big

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Speaker 2: decision making, especially when it's an investment like this short

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Speaker 2: term long term dividends, right, you, the proper way to

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Speaker 2: do it is hedge where you can, and that it's

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Speaker 2: a great hedge. The problem with the NFL if you're

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Speaker 2: going to change the plan for him next year, now,

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Speaker 2: it just becomes a really muddy situation. And that's why

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Speaker 2: I think that you go into it saying this is

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Speaker 2: what we're doing with him, and then if it doesn't

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Speaker 2: work out after three or four years, Sure, you can

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Speaker 2: kind of pivot to another side, But are you even

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Speaker 2: going to be here in three to four years if

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Speaker 2: it doesn't work out? So that's that's a really complex situation.

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Speaker 2: It's one of the most unique I've ever seen since

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Speaker 2: I started doing this.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it really is. It's gonna be fun to kind

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Speaker 1: of debate the other guy. And I'm with you. I

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Speaker 1: think Jenti's a top ten guy. I'm not trying. I

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Speaker 1: have not finished my warrant tape yet. I was gonna

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Speaker 1: wait for the season to and and then kind of

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Speaker 1: go through it all, and I'm gonna go try to

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Speaker 1: go through it this week. So I'll push him aside

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Speaker 1: just for me because I have not done my full

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Speaker 1: study of him yet. I'll do. Carter's the other position

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Speaker 1: guy that I'm very excited about. Oh yeah, and he's

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Speaker 1: only his one season as a full edge rusher. Last

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Speaker 1: year he was an off ball linebacker. He but he

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Speaker 1: has that ridiculous speed off the edge to challenge the

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Speaker 1: outside shoulder of the defensive tackle. He's learning a variety

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Speaker 1: of moves. That's the other guy. Given the position that

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Speaker 1: he plays in his athletic skill set Dave that I

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Speaker 1: would say, all right, top five, I feel okay about

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Speaker 1: picking this guy and his athletic upside and how he can,

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Speaker 1: you know, be that three to four defensive end outside

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Speaker 1: linebacker passing down's hand in the dirt rush the passer

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Speaker 1: and he is going to you know, be that potentially

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Speaker 1: that TJ. Watt type of outside guy that this is

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Speaker 1: going to be a terror trying to rush the passer.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean prior to the season, I had them

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Speaker 2: as my number four overall player in the class. And

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Speaker 2: it was a little bit of a reach at that

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Speaker 2: point because all we saw were flashes as a pass rusher.

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Speaker 2: But what I saw last year, there were a few

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Speaker 2: times I watched this tape last summer I had to

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Speaker 2: make sure it wasn't I didn't speed up the rate

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Speaker 2: of watching one and a half speed. I mean, he

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Speaker 2: literally looks like he's playing at a different speed than

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Speaker 2: everyone else on the field. And then you see there's

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Speaker 2: a physicality to him as well. You see the number eleven,

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Speaker 2: you see the Penn State uniform. I hate a helmet scout.

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Speaker 2: I try to avoid it, actually go out of my

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Speaker 2: way to avoid it. It is impossible to not think

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Speaker 2: about Micah Parsons when you're watching this kid play. I mean,

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Speaker 2: their college tape was so similar. The way they pursue

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Speaker 2: the ball across the field, what they can do from

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Speaker 2: the middle of the field, what they can do from

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Speaker 2: the out side. And the draw to an abdual Carter

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Speaker 2: is that you are not going to have to pigeonhole

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Speaker 2: him hole into one spot. You can truly move him around.

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Speaker 2: And you know, a team like the Giants, you say, oh,

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Speaker 2: we have Brian Burns, we have kvon Thibodeau. If he

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Speaker 2: gets that fifth year, I mean, he will be back

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Speaker 2: next year. And what they do with this fifth year

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Speaker 2: option will be interesting to watch in the coming months.

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Speaker 2: But even if they do both come back, you can

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Speaker 2: still use this guy. You can use all three. You

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Speaker 2: almost need all three. I mean, in my opinion, the Giants,

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Speaker 2: one thing they need to do is that not one,

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Speaker 2: but two more pass rushers to this front to give

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Speaker 2: themselves an identity up front. So abdual Carter is not

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Speaker 2: stockpiling too much talent at a position. It's adding another

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Speaker 2: weapon to a defense that is very thirsty for more.

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Speaker 2: We have weapons and explosive playmakers. My one question about

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Speaker 2: Carter that I did not have about Parsons coming out,

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Speaker 2: and this is a really important strait to the elite

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Speaker 2: pass rushers in the NFL, is how good is his

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Speaker 2: power game? Can he truly bull rush? Can he push

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Speaker 2: a tackle back the lap of a passer? I mean,

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Speaker 2: you look at all the top edge rushers in today's game,

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Speaker 2: all of them, they all have that button they can

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Speaker 2: push and say, you know what, I'm not going around you,

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Speaker 2: i am going through you. I mean, we just saw

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Speaker 2: Jared Verst, who will win the Defensive Rookie of the

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Speaker 2: Year that award. This there's a lot of sloppiness to

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Speaker 2: his game. He is one of the most powerful ed

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Speaker 2: rushers right away. That translates to the NFL. And that's

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Speaker 2: the one question I have about Abdull Carter.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, we never got the full season at

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Speaker 1: edge rusher for Parsons, right, That's the reasons he dropped

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Speaker 1: outside the top ten. We only saw like Parsons last

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Speaker 1: year at Penn State was like Carter's previous season right

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Speaker 1: where we saw flashes. He didn't know if he was

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Speaker 1: a pass rusher or not. So yeah, I'm with you

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Speaker 1: on that. So pass those two guys. You mentioned the

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Speaker 1: running back in the tight end, we mentioned the safety.

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Speaker 1: If you're picking and you have a blank slate team,

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Speaker 1: so position value matters, who is your next non quarterback

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Speaker 1: position player that you would have on the board after

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Speaker 1: Carter and Hunter.

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Speaker 2: I feel incredibly safe with Mason Graham. Yeah, and I

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Speaker 2: also feel that there's a ceiling to him that can

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Speaker 2: be one of the top defensive tackles in all the football.

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Speaker 2: Watching this Michigan defensive tackle group was very reminiscent of

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Speaker 2: what we saw at Clemson years ago when we had

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Speaker 2: Christian Wilkins and Dexter Lawrence playing next to each other.

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Speaker 2: Very different players, different draft projections. Christian Wilkins went Top ten,

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Speaker 2: Dexter Lawrence, as we know, was in the middle of

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Speaker 2: the first round. And now I would even say I

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Speaker 2: like Dexter Lawrence more than Wilkins. But when I'm watching

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Speaker 2: these two guys play, it's the same exact feel that

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Speaker 2: I get. Kenneth Grant has this really high ceiling, but

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Speaker 2: he's got a few things he's got to really develop

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Speaker 2: from an arsenal and technique perspective. Mason Graham, as much

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Speaker 2: as we want to be drawn in by the pressure

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Speaker 2: rate and what he can do against one on one

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Speaker 2: blocking as he rushes the passer. He is an elite

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Speaker 2: run defender. I mean this is in every down four

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Speaker 2: set is both quicker and more powerful. He's got the

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Speaker 2: wrestling background. He's going to test out as well as

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Speaker 2: anyone in the defensive tackle group. I feel very safe

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Speaker 2: with this guy. Floor end ceiling.

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Speaker 3: You're ready for a change. Pay Day comes early with Citizens,

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Speaker 3: so go to that retreat. Knew you moves to the country.

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Speaker 3: Now you're raising goats and launching a lifestyle brand. Are

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Speaker 3: you ready for all that life brings?

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Speaker 1: Johnson Podcast is brought to you by Citizens, the official

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Speaker 1: bank of the Giants. From game day celebrations to your

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Speaker 1: everyday financial needs, Big Blue fans can get the most

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Speaker 1: out of every moment with Citizens. Learn more at citizens

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Speaker 1: bank dot com slash Giants. All Right, you went Michigan,

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Speaker 1: sew me and Will Johnson. I've watched his tape for

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Speaker 1: two years and a lot of people still have him

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Speaker 1: in their top five. And look, I get the appeal.

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Speaker 1: He's long, he has these interceptions. I get all that

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Speaker 1: on tape. I just see way too many easy catches

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Speaker 1: in the front of him that are uncontested. I don't

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Speaker 1: see enough pressman, and I can't wrap my head around

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Speaker 1: selecting him as a top five pick. Tell me why

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Speaker 1: I'm right or wrong.

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Speaker 2: I think you're right. I think he's top fifteen. But

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Speaker 2: a top five corner to me is what we've seen

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Speaker 2: in Derek Stingley and Sauce Gardner. Guys that you know

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Speaker 2: right away are going to be your quarterback, your number

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Speaker 2: one corner, and they have the ceiling of being a

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Speaker 2: true shutdown guy, which I believe there's probably there's a

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Speaker 2: handful of them. So to really say you're a top

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Speaker 2: five corner at a position, just like wide receiver every

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Speaker 2: year there it's a very deep group. It's the way

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Speaker 2: the kids are playing football now, all the way from

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Speaker 2: youth to high school to college are there is so

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Speaker 2: much talent at the position that if I am going

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Speaker 2: to use a top five pick on this position, he

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Speaker 2: better be a special I better project him to be

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Speaker 2: an all Pro caliber guy. And Will Johnson, to me,

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Speaker 2: the measurables are there. The five star recruit, the highlight

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Speaker 2: reel is impressive. If that's all you've seen so far,

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Speaker 2: the pick six is the anticipation, But I don't know

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Speaker 2: if I trust him being on an island alone with

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Speaker 2: some of the best receivers in the game because he's

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Speaker 2: afraid of getting beat deep. Is there a speed issue?

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Speaker 2: I don't know, is there? I mean, we'll see his

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Speaker 2: tests out. He's very quick, He's got great jumps in

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Speaker 2: his history, but the long speed will be the question

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Speaker 2: with him. And he plays like that too. Another thing

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Speaker 2: I don't like about Will Johnson and I and one

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Speaker 2: of the few left that do care about this. He

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Speaker 2: is not a physical player. If you watch his tape

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Speaker 2: against the Run, He's the kind of guy that makes

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Speaker 2: a lot of business decisions and we're seeing. Part of

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Speaker 2: the issue that Giants fans have right now with Deontay

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Speaker 2: Banks is the effort. Is it always there? Does he

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Speaker 2: really want to put his hat in there. I've had

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Speaker 2: a scout told me that, hey, we pay the other

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Speaker 2: ten guys to tackle. We pay the other ten guys

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Speaker 2: to give me the corner that can cover. But unless

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Speaker 2: you have Deion Sanders caliber coverage ability, I need you

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Speaker 2: to at least contribute in that element of the game.

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Speaker 2: And physicality, to me goes deeper than just run defense.

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Speaker 2: It comes down to effort, pressing, guys at the line,

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00:19:53,040 --> 00:19:54,800
Speaker 2: so Will Johnson. To me, there are a lot of

433
00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:57,600
Speaker 2: good traits, there are not enough elite traits, and there

434
00:19:57,640 --> 00:19:59,480
Speaker 2: are a couple holes that would prevent me from taking

435
00:19:59,560 --> 00:19:59,960
Speaker 2: him in the time.

436
00:20:00,520 --> 00:20:01,960
Speaker 1: All right, two other spots I want to hit on

437
00:20:02,000 --> 00:20:03,879
Speaker 1: before we jumped to the quarterbacks here, David Yah. So

438
00:20:03,880 --> 00:20:06,920
Speaker 1: I'm sure everyone's waiting for that, all right, offensive tackle.

439
00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:10,800
Speaker 1: I don't see any of these guys's top ten picks.

440
00:20:10,960 --> 00:20:14,720
Speaker 1: I know, you watch Kelvin Banks. You know, you just

441
00:20:14,760 --> 00:20:16,399
Speaker 1: watch a guy and you say, that guy feels like

442
00:20:16,440 --> 00:20:19,480
Speaker 1: a really good offensive tackle to me. He moves like

443
00:20:19,520 --> 00:20:21,520
Speaker 1: a guard to me, and he looks like a guard

444
00:20:21,600 --> 00:20:25,080
Speaker 1: to me. You know, good player. I would be happy

445
00:20:25,080 --> 00:20:27,320
Speaker 1: picking him in the first round, in the top fifteen,

446
00:20:27,400 --> 00:20:30,120
Speaker 1: top twenty, I'd be good with that. You know, Will Campbell.

447
00:20:30,720 --> 00:20:32,560
Speaker 1: I know his arm length is a big question for

448
00:20:32,600 --> 00:20:33,879
Speaker 1: a lot of people, but I do think he is

449
00:20:33,920 --> 00:20:36,000
Speaker 1: tackle feet. I think he moves well, and I think

450
00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:38,480
Speaker 1: he's athletic enough out there. I think he's very solid

451
00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:42,480
Speaker 1: in how he plays. But unlike you know, last last

452
00:20:42,560 --> 00:20:44,600
Speaker 1: year when we had all those tackles early, I mean,

453
00:20:44,600 --> 00:20:48,000
Speaker 1: these guys would probably be you know, tackle four maybe

454
00:20:48,000 --> 00:20:49,760
Speaker 1: in last year's draft for me, like, they don't have

455
00:20:49,880 --> 00:20:52,160
Speaker 1: me as excited as last year's class for sure.

456
00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:55,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, John, last year we had nine offensive

457
00:20:55,720 --> 00:20:58,480
Speaker 2: linemen taken in the first round. We had six in

458
00:20:58,520 --> 00:21:01,240
Speaker 2: the second, we had ten in the third. I mean

459
00:21:01,240 --> 00:21:03,840
Speaker 2: that is twenty five total offensive lineman taking the first

460
00:21:03,840 --> 00:21:07,000
Speaker 2: three rounds. We have that fresh in our memory. That's

461
00:21:07,040 --> 00:21:09,840
Speaker 2: not normal. Last year's group was not a normal group.

462
00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:12,760
Speaker 2: To even put these guys in the same discussion would

463
00:21:12,760 --> 00:21:17,399
Speaker 2: be disrespectful to last year's group. Then I have written

464
00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:19,720
Speaker 2: on my notes right now the one position I'm most

465
00:21:19,760 --> 00:21:22,520
Speaker 2: worried about. If I'm a team looking to add a

466
00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:26,080
Speaker 2: player at it's this position. I'm worried about the tackles.

467
00:21:26,280 --> 00:21:29,920
Speaker 2: The top guys Will Campbell, Kelvin Banks, Emery Jones, Greys Abel.

468
00:21:29,920 --> 00:21:31,600
Speaker 2: I mean that's four of the top six guys in

469
00:21:31,640 --> 00:21:34,879
Speaker 2: this group. They might be better at guard at the

470
00:21:34,880 --> 00:21:37,960
Speaker 2: next level. Will Campbell to me, is Peter Skronski a

471
00:21:38,000 --> 00:21:41,280
Speaker 2: guy that can play tackle, but probably the length concerns

472
00:21:41,320 --> 00:21:44,040
Speaker 2: and just his sheer ability to anchor and play with power,

473
00:21:44,240 --> 00:21:45,560
Speaker 2: he probably should play inside.

474
00:21:45,560 --> 00:21:47,919
Speaker 1: But he question, do you think he is the power

475
00:21:47,920 --> 00:21:50,040
Speaker 1: in the run game? To move people because you watch

476
00:21:50,080 --> 00:21:52,680
Speaker 1: his run blocking a tackle and you know this isn't

477
00:21:52,720 --> 00:21:54,439
Speaker 1: the guy that's guy going to finish through the whistle

478
00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:57,320
Speaker 1: on a lot of these plays, you know, in certain schemes.

479
00:21:57,320 --> 00:22:00,000
Speaker 2: I think he'll be much better what Dominic Pooney had

480
00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:03,119
Speaker 2: done in San Francisco that wide zone, Like that's the

481
00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:05,040
Speaker 2: kind of guy that I think he could be at

482
00:22:05,040 --> 00:22:07,439
Speaker 2: the next level. But to answer your question, that's not

483
00:22:07,520 --> 00:22:07,960
Speaker 2: top ten.

484
00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:10,080
Speaker 1: And by the way, I was worried about Pooni's power

485
00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:11,679
Speaker 1: last year too, which is why I was kind of

486
00:22:11,680 --> 00:22:13,679
Speaker 1: on the fence with him. But that has worked out

487
00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:14,880
Speaker 1: for San Francisco.

488
00:22:14,640 --> 00:22:16,240
Speaker 2: And that could be scheme based, Like if he got

489
00:22:16,320 --> 00:22:18,399
Speaker 2: drafted by a different team. We're not talking about a

490
00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:20,000
Speaker 2: guy that made the r lads Al rookie team. We're

491
00:22:20,040 --> 00:22:21,840
Speaker 2: talking about someone that might not even been a factor

492
00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:25,240
Speaker 2: this year. The one guy that I like the most

493
00:22:25,320 --> 00:22:28,040
Speaker 2: is the one that tours ACL in October. Now, Josh

494
00:22:28,040 --> 00:22:32,200
Speaker 2: Simmons from Ohio State. His tape was starting to trend

495
00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:34,920
Speaker 2: towards the best left tackle tape we were watching all

496
00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:37,320
Speaker 2: year the ACL and jury. But he's out, He's in

497
00:22:37,359 --> 00:22:39,840
Speaker 2: the draft this year and he probably will be back.

498
00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:44,480
Speaker 2: Just based on historical data with tackles, not players tackles

499
00:22:44,480 --> 00:22:47,040
Speaker 2: tearing the ACL. He should be back for training camp.

500
00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:48,280
Speaker 2: I don't know if he'll be ready for the start

501
00:22:48,320 --> 00:22:50,400
Speaker 2: of the season, but that, to me is the guy

502
00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:52,960
Speaker 2: that I would want if I'm looking left tackle. That's

503
00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:55,040
Speaker 2: the guy I feel safe with. Another one that we're

504
00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:56,840
Speaker 2: gonna get to watch down in Mobile at the Senior

505
00:22:56,880 --> 00:23:00,960
Speaker 2: Bowl Josh Connelly from Oregon. He's a guy that he

506
00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:04,240
Speaker 2: has probably the best work in the drafts. He's very twitchy,

507
00:23:04,240 --> 00:23:06,200
Speaker 2: he's very bounced. That to me is a big deal

508
00:23:06,440 --> 00:23:09,480
Speaker 2: with offensive line evaluation at tackle. How balanced are you?

509
00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:12,280
Speaker 2: And he's got the best in the group. The last

510
00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:13,639
Speaker 2: name I want you to keep an eye on put

511
00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:16,400
Speaker 2: him on your list is Armin Membu from Missouri. He'll

512
00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:17,960
Speaker 2: also be at staable and.

513
00:23:18,320 --> 00:23:21,000
Speaker 1: I watched him last week. I love him. He is

514
00:23:21,080 --> 00:23:23,119
Speaker 1: the top of the second round guy for me, end

515
00:23:23,160 --> 00:23:26,040
Speaker 1: of the first He is very good at tackle. I

516
00:23:26,119 --> 00:23:27,679
Speaker 1: was impressed with him. You want to slide him out

517
00:23:27,720 --> 00:23:30,080
Speaker 1: of right tackle day one, I'd be very very happy

518
00:23:30,119 --> 00:23:30,600
Speaker 1: to do that.

519
00:23:31,000 --> 00:23:33,560
Speaker 2: And that's exactly what you just said. You said top

520
00:23:33,600 --> 00:23:36,239
Speaker 2: of round two, John. If I'm a team looking to

521
00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:40,359
Speaker 2: add offensive line talent. I'm not considering round one for

522
00:23:39,920 --> 00:23:43,439
Speaker 2: two reasons. The gap between the top three and the

523
00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:45,720
Speaker 2: next six might not even exist. They're all gonna be

524
00:23:45,840 --> 00:23:49,120
Speaker 2: very similar grades, and I'm gonna use that premium resource

525
00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:52,760
Speaker 2: elsewhere on the roster. But over the last four drafts,

526
00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:56,600
Speaker 2: over seventy percent of the guys drafted offensive lineman rounds

527
00:23:56,600 --> 00:23:59,000
Speaker 2: two and three have panned out to be at least

528
00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:02,040
Speaker 2: quality starter. I mean, if you go look at the

529
00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:04,959
Speaker 2: lists of names that get drafted Day two, round two,

530
00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:09,280
Speaker 2: and round three, that's the sweet spot for the offensive line.

531
00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:12,399
Speaker 2: And I do think come draft time last year as

532
00:24:12,400 --> 00:24:15,359
Speaker 2: an anomaly. All Right, those guys deserve to be top picks.

533
00:24:16,480 --> 00:24:18,959
Speaker 2: We can reach for offensive line because you're afraid that

534
00:24:18,960 --> 00:24:22,760
Speaker 2: there might not be anything left Day two this year.

535
00:24:23,560 --> 00:24:26,679
Speaker 2: Every year, there's plenty of talent left Day two. Be

536
00:24:26,880 --> 00:24:30,080
Speaker 2: patient on the offensive line this year, don't reach, You'll

537
00:24:30,119 --> 00:24:32,800
Speaker 2: still be You'll walk away with guys that you can work.

538
00:24:32,600 --> 00:24:34,720
Speaker 1: With, especially now looking for a Day one left tackle.

539
00:24:34,760 --> 00:24:36,520
Speaker 1: Those guys sometimes you have to think a little bit earlier.

540
00:24:36,520 --> 00:24:38,600
Speaker 1: But if you're okay guard, center or right tackle, I

541
00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:40,159
Speaker 1: think you're right. I'm with you. You can draft them

542
00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:40,920
Speaker 1: a little bit later.

543
00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:44,960
Speaker 3: You love turf, you're good at it, so you start

544
00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:49,040
Speaker 3: a turf Fizz business grows, your savings grow, become the

545
00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:53,119
Speaker 3: most celebrated name in turf. Are you ready for all

546
00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:53,919
Speaker 3: that life brings?

547
00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:58,159
Speaker 1: Johns Total Podcast is brought to you by Citizens, the

548
00:24:58,160 --> 00:25:00,560
Speaker 1: official Bank of the Giant. Citizens will donate seven hundred

549
00:25:00,560 --> 00:25:02,640
Speaker 1: and fifty dollars for the Giants Foundation for each score

550
00:25:02,640 --> 00:25:04,959
Speaker 1: and drive during the twenty twenty four season. Learn more

551
00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:07,320
Speaker 1: at citizensbank dot com slash Giants Real Quick Gands. Before

552
00:25:07,320 --> 00:25:10,400
Speaker 1: we get the quarterbacks, the two Georgia edges. I don't

553
00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:12,320
Speaker 1: know if I like any either of the ten picks.

554
00:25:12,359 --> 00:25:15,120
Speaker 1: I think I like Jalen Walker better than Mike Kyle

555
00:25:15,119 --> 00:25:17,920
Speaker 1: Williams in my opinion, But again, I think they're more

556
00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:22,400
Speaker 1: like top fifteen seventeen guys that necessarily feel super comfortable

557
00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:23,440
Speaker 1: with them in the top ten.

558
00:25:24,040 --> 00:25:26,840
Speaker 2: They're both projection based. I mean, Jalen Walker has not

559
00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:30,400
Speaker 2: made that. Abdul Carter moved to the outside full time.

560
00:25:30,480 --> 00:25:32,680
Speaker 2: He played a lot of off ball linebacker this year,

561
00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:34,840
Speaker 2: and his tape you can clearly tell that's just not

562
00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:37,919
Speaker 2: going to be his future at the NFL level. But

563
00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:42,040
Speaker 2: he does have a little bit more power. I talked

564
00:25:42,040 --> 00:25:45,320
Speaker 2: about the shortcoming of Abdul Carter's power, potentially holding him

565
00:25:45,359 --> 00:25:48,320
Speaker 2: back a little bit early on. Jalen Walker has that power.

566
00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:51,359
Speaker 2: He plays very low. He's got incredibly strong hands, but

567
00:25:51,840 --> 00:25:54,920
Speaker 2: a lot of his production came from secondary effort, which

568
00:25:54,960 --> 00:25:57,359
Speaker 2: is fine, you want that, but he did not beat

569
00:25:57,400 --> 00:26:01,200
Speaker 2: a lot of tackles right away with a wide arsenal

570
00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:04,720
Speaker 2: of moves, and that does concern me a little bit.

571
00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:07,280
Speaker 2: With there was not a lot of just natural quick wins.

572
00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:10,000
Speaker 2: I mean, NFL is all about getting quick pressure, not

573
00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:12,800
Speaker 2: just pressure quick pressure, because these guys get the ball

574
00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:16,040
Speaker 2: out so fast, and Javin Walker is explosive enough, but

575
00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:19,240
Speaker 2: he does get stalled out by quality tackles a little

576
00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:23,640
Speaker 2: too long too often. MIKEL Williams is a very ironically

577
00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:26,639
Speaker 2: similar situation to what Trevon Walker was a couple of

578
00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:30,800
Speaker 2: years ago. Someone that checks every single box you want physically,

579
00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:33,879
Speaker 2: but it has not turned into a lot of production yet.

580
00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:38,760
Speaker 2: And that's gonna be a defensive line coach saying, hey,

581
00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:41,280
Speaker 2: I can make that guy into a special player. The

582
00:26:41,320 --> 00:26:45,000
Speaker 2: scout perspective says, hey, I like the upside of him,

583
00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:47,600
Speaker 2: but he hasn't done it enough on a consistent basis

584
00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:49,960
Speaker 2: to really put a high label on him yet. So

585
00:26:50,080 --> 00:26:53,000
Speaker 2: you are right. I think top twenty, top fifteen for both,

586
00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:54,000
Speaker 2: but not top ten.

587
00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:56,440
Speaker 1: All right, let's go to the quarterbacks. Here will be

588
00:26:56,840 --> 00:27:00,159
Speaker 1: we Bury the lead if you took these top two

589
00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:02,760
Speaker 1: quarterbacks and maybe those aren't clearly your top two in

590
00:27:03,320 --> 00:27:06,199
Speaker 1: Ward and Sanders, we can have that conversation too. But

591
00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:08,160
Speaker 1: if you put this group and combined it with last

592
00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:11,280
Speaker 1: year's group, when would the first quarterback for you show up?

593
00:27:11,560 --> 00:27:14,360
Speaker 1: I have cam Ward probably around my JJ McCarthy range

594
00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:17,600
Speaker 1: from last year, and then I probably a little further back.

595
00:27:17,640 --> 00:27:19,200
Speaker 1: And again this is not based on what they've done

596
00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:20,800
Speaker 1: first year in the NFL. This is just based on

597
00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:23,639
Speaker 1: their pre draft analysis last year. I would probably have

598
00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:27,120
Speaker 1: shoudor somewhere in that kind of b nix penix type

599
00:27:27,119 --> 00:27:27,919
Speaker 1: of territory for me.

600
00:27:28,359 --> 00:27:30,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm with you. In terms of stacking those top

601
00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:34,440
Speaker 2: two guys, I had JJ McCarthy pretty high. I had

602
00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:37,960
Speaker 2: him as number three last year, slightlyhead of Drake May

603
00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:40,960
Speaker 2: So I have cam Ward more in that in the

604
00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:43,159
Speaker 2: tier under those guys, I had four guys last year

605
00:27:43,200 --> 00:27:45,080
Speaker 2: that I would really take at the top of any draft,

606
00:27:45,119 --> 00:27:48,960
Speaker 2: and that's Jayden Daniels, Kayleb Williams, JJ McCarthy, Drake may Kim.

607
00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:52,200
Speaker 2: Ward is right under those guys, and it's because he's

608
00:27:52,200 --> 00:27:54,840
Speaker 2: not as clean. His footwork is a disaster. He's made

609
00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:57,880
Speaker 2: a lot of bad decisions under pressure. But the armtown

610
00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:01,640
Speaker 2: is legit. I like the ethos he presents. He's a playmaker.

611
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:04,399
Speaker 2: Cam Ward is a guy that will make plays in

612
00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:07,320
Speaker 2: big moments. The comeback he had at California this year

613
00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:10,800
Speaker 2: was still to this day one of the most impressive

614
00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:13,000
Speaker 2: fourth quarter comebacks I've ever seen a quarterback ever do.

615
00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:15,480
Speaker 2: And it was all on his arm. He has that

616
00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:17,560
Speaker 2: kind of ability to take over a game and.

617
00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:19,760
Speaker 1: Then to your point, real fast. We watched jam Daniels

618
00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:24,720
Speaker 1: last night, right, So, calm pressure in big moments, Yeah,

619
00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:30,080
Speaker 1: cam Ward never looks flustered. He's always calm, relaxed and poised.

620
00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:33,000
Speaker 2: It's a it's a yeah. They call that the slow pulse,

621
00:28:33,080 --> 00:28:34,960
Speaker 2: like the heart rate never spikes up no matter what,

622
00:28:35,080 --> 00:28:37,040
Speaker 2: never too excited. Did you see his reaction after the

623
00:28:37,080 --> 00:28:38,760
Speaker 2: game when he feels go It's like he kind of

624
00:28:38,800 --> 00:28:40,280
Speaker 2: just was like all right, on to the next week.

625
00:28:40,360 --> 00:28:41,880
Speaker 2: Do you want that. You don't want a guy that's

626
00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:44,239
Speaker 2: too too excited about winning. You don't want a guy

627
00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:47,400
Speaker 2: that gets too upset about losing. But there are there's

628
00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:49,160
Speaker 2: a lack of polish to him. This is a zero

629
00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:51,640
Speaker 2: star recruit that played a wing t offense in high school.

630
00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:54,200
Speaker 2: He started off at incarnet word. I mean, we're not

631
00:28:54,200 --> 00:28:57,040
Speaker 2: talking about a guy that had a lot of professional

632
00:28:57,040 --> 00:29:00,000
Speaker 2: caliber development and coaching growing up. And you could look

633
00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:02,360
Speaker 2: at that from a perspective of saying, hey, we're not

634
00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:05,400
Speaker 2: even close to this kid's ceiling. Shouldar Sanders? On the

635
00:29:05,400 --> 00:29:08,880
Speaker 2: other hand, he is unbelievably polished. I love his release,

636
00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:12,120
Speaker 2: I love his footwork. But the guy's probably had, to

637
00:29:12,160 --> 00:29:14,800
Speaker 2: be honest with you, the best quarterback coaching anyone could

638
00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:18,080
Speaker 2: ever have from being a young kid being Dione Sun.

639
00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:19,959
Speaker 2: So is he already at his ceiling? Is there anything

640
00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:22,920
Speaker 2: better that can he get better at? Anything left? So?

641
00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:25,080
Speaker 2: Is there anything left to get better at? In his arsenal?

642
00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:29,080
Speaker 2: But there's a thing to Shuldar Sanders that I do

643
00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:32,560
Speaker 2: think owners, once they start getting involved in these decisions,

644
00:29:33,520 --> 00:29:37,200
Speaker 2: He's going to make a team relevant. You might like,

645
00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:39,800
Speaker 2: I think Giants fans, if you want to keep the

646
00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:42,240
Speaker 2: discussion in there. They want to win, all right, but

647
00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:44,360
Speaker 2: there are owners out there. They want to be relevant,

648
00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:48,320
Speaker 2: they want the primetime games, they want people looking at

649
00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:51,040
Speaker 2: them and talking about them. Shoulder Sanders, and that can

650
00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:53,160
Speaker 2: help some young players. I mean, I think a Shardar

651
00:29:53,240 --> 00:29:56,959
Speaker 2: Sanders Malik neighbors relationship has a lot of potential. They

652
00:29:56,960 --> 00:29:59,240
Speaker 2: could feed off each other, get the both the best

653
00:29:59,240 --> 00:30:02,000
Speaker 2: out of each other. So those two of the guys

654
00:30:02,040 --> 00:30:04,080
Speaker 2: are probably gonna be in the first round discussion. But

655
00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:07,680
Speaker 2: the one interesting component to this quarterback class, and as

656
00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:09,600
Speaker 2: you watch more guys, I think you're gonna start to

657
00:30:09,640 --> 00:30:14,680
Speaker 2: see this the gap between cam Ward and Shreder Sanders.

658
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:17,440
Speaker 2: And then you have your next group of guys, Jackson Dart,

659
00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:21,640
Speaker 2: Jalon Milroe, Will Howard, even Dylan Gabriel. It's not that big.

660
00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:25,360
Speaker 2: It's just not a big gap. Where last year we

661
00:30:25,480 --> 00:30:28,320
Speaker 2: saw a record amount of picks go between bo Nix

662
00:30:28,360 --> 00:30:31,240
Speaker 2: and Spencer Rattler in round five, there was an enormous

663
00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:34,800
Speaker 2: gap between the top guys and everybody else. I don't

664
00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:37,520
Speaker 2: see a big gap. I do think in certain scenarios

665
00:30:37,600 --> 00:30:40,840
Speaker 2: there are some advanced metrics that Jackson Dart is actually

666
00:30:40,840 --> 00:30:43,320
Speaker 2: the best quarterback under pressure in this group. And when

667
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:45,800
Speaker 2: I say pressure, I'm not talking about high pressure situations.

668
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:48,640
Speaker 2: I'll talk about the actual pass rush. And you know

669
00:30:48,720 --> 00:30:51,520
Speaker 2: because he did. Jackson Dart did kind of blow it

670
00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:54,560
Speaker 2: at Florida. It was a really rough last two minutes

671
00:30:54,560 --> 00:30:56,280
Speaker 2: of the game for him, and he did the same

672
00:30:56,280 --> 00:31:00,120
Speaker 2: thing at LSU. Did not respond well to high leverage situations.

673
00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:04,080
Speaker 2: But his talent, his arm talent, his ability to respond

674
00:31:04,120 --> 00:31:06,120
Speaker 2: to a pass rush, which is often a make or

675
00:31:06,160 --> 00:31:10,160
Speaker 2: break for a young quarterback, it's right there. So Jalen

676
00:31:10,240 --> 00:31:14,640
Speaker 2: Milroe has the most explosive electric talent, but he's light

677
00:31:14,720 --> 00:31:17,320
Speaker 2: years behind these guys as a passer. Will Howard is

678
00:31:17,360 --> 00:31:19,720
Speaker 2: now starting to show who we thought he was last summer.

679
00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:21,920
Speaker 2: I thought him at a top five quarterback, had a

680
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:24,320
Speaker 2: rough start, but he checks a lot of boxes when

681
00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:27,840
Speaker 2: you're looking for the old school prototype. So the question

682
00:31:27,920 --> 00:31:30,480
Speaker 2: to me is in this quarterback class, do these top

683
00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:33,840
Speaker 2: two guys really stand out enough? And it's a theme

684
00:31:33,880 --> 00:31:35,800
Speaker 2: of the class, and it comes back to this positional

685
00:31:35,880 --> 00:31:38,520
Speaker 2: value that we started off with. Are these guys really

686
00:31:38,520 --> 00:31:41,160
Speaker 2: worth taking that high in the draft simply because of

687
00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:45,160
Speaker 2: position or can you get an equal or a similar

688
00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:47,400
Speaker 2: graded player around later.

689
00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:50,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, or even top round three, right, I think, yeah,

690
00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:52,600
Speaker 1: I don't think there's any guarantee Jackson darts going top

691
00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:54,640
Speaker 1: round two. I don't know what teams think about him,

692
00:31:54,840 --> 00:31:56,560
Speaker 1: you know, Milroe. I think someone will fall in love

693
00:31:56,560 --> 00:31:59,000
Speaker 1: with his physical attributes and they'll pick him high. But yeah,

694
00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:02,239
Speaker 1: I'm with you, and you know, I think teams are

695
00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:04,120
Speaker 1: gonna have to be patient with this quarterback class. Right.

696
00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:05,760
Speaker 1: This is not gonna be where you have three or

697
00:32:05,760 --> 00:32:08,120
Speaker 1: four guys where you're gonna plug in a really five

698
00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:10,080
Speaker 1: for last year and they're gonna look good right away.

699
00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:12,200
Speaker 1: Like it's that that's just not gonna happen. I don't

700
00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:14,520
Speaker 1: think with this class. I think your best chance is

701
00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:17,280
Speaker 1: probably Shadoor that you can you know, he's been with

702
00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:19,560
Speaker 1: Pat Scharmer, an NFL offense, he's been to your point

703
00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:21,800
Speaker 1: coach up really well, that's the guy I think that

704
00:32:21,880 --> 00:32:23,680
Speaker 1: you can probably feel good about. Put him right in.

705
00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:26,480
Speaker 1: You're gonna get competent play. But again he is and

706
00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:28,280
Speaker 1: it's funny. People probably don't think about it this way,

707
00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:31,600
Speaker 1: but he's missing figure. Dion Sunny's gonna be like this hyperathlete.

708
00:32:31,720 --> 00:32:34,120
Speaker 1: He's not a hyperathlete, he's like a boring pocket passer,

709
00:32:34,200 --> 00:32:37,040
Speaker 1: like that's what and that's fine, that's okay. Yeah, But

710
00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:39,480
Speaker 1: like we saw with Jayden Daniels even on Sunday Night,

711
00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:45,960
Speaker 1: that being mobile for a young quarterback fixes so many

712
00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:48,000
Speaker 1: mistakes that you make as a passer and a and

713
00:32:48,040 --> 00:32:51,680
Speaker 1: a processor that I'm not sure Chador is gonna have

714
00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:53,480
Speaker 1: that in his bag right away, which I think is

715
00:32:53,520 --> 00:32:55,160
Speaker 1: the only thing that could hold him back a little

716
00:32:55,200 --> 00:32:57,520
Speaker 1: bit early. While Ward not a hyper athlete, I think

717
00:32:57,560 --> 00:33:00,320
Speaker 1: he's a little bit slipperier, right, and can make guys

718
00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:02,480
Speaker 1: missing the pocket maybe a little bit more. Yeah.

719
00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:05,120
Speaker 2: Absolutely, I mean, Kim Ward, that is the word. It's slippery.

720
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:07,560
Speaker 2: He is really good at evading pressure and he can

721
00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:10,400
Speaker 2: feel the pressure. That's one thing I don't like about

722
00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:13,360
Speaker 2: Standers game. Sanders game kind of reminds me of a

723
00:33:13,400 --> 00:33:15,880
Speaker 2: seven on seven quarterback where there are there are no

724
00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:18,320
Speaker 2: offensive line and there are no defensive linemen. You kind

725
00:33:18,320 --> 00:33:20,200
Speaker 2: of just sit back there and just kind of wait,

726
00:33:20,400 --> 00:33:23,160
Speaker 2: wait a little too long. And there is a lot

727
00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:25,960
Speaker 2: of talk about how poor his offensive line was, especially

728
00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:29,880
Speaker 2: last year, he was responsible for just as much of

729
00:33:29,920 --> 00:33:33,360
Speaker 2: the pressure that he took on himself because he doesn't

730
00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:35,560
Speaker 2: feel the pass rush. Kim Wore can feel it. And

731
00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:38,440
Speaker 2: it's hard to measure with the number, and you know

732
00:33:38,680 --> 00:33:41,400
Speaker 2: we're obsessed with analytics and numbers now, it's really hard

733
00:33:41,400 --> 00:33:43,360
Speaker 2: to measure this. But when you watch it, you can

734
00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:46,520
Speaker 2: see it. Kim Ward, Patrick Mahomes. These guys they know

735
00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:49,160
Speaker 2: where the pressure is almost before it even gets there.

736
00:33:49,480 --> 00:33:52,080
Speaker 2: I don't see that in Sanders game. And like you said,

737
00:33:52,360 --> 00:33:54,720
Speaker 2: he's not fast enough to evade the way he did

738
00:33:54,720 --> 00:33:57,320
Speaker 2: in college. He's just not He's not a big guy either, John,

739
00:33:57,360 --> 00:34:00,280
Speaker 2: He's right now. Measurement I have on him is is

740
00:34:00,480 --> 00:34:02,959
Speaker 2: just over six foot two five. I mean that is

741
00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:06,480
Speaker 2: really small for NFL standards unless you have a special

742
00:34:06,560 --> 00:34:09,840
Speaker 2: athletic ability, which he does not that that's a concern

743
00:34:09,960 --> 00:34:11,480
Speaker 2: for me. Is that seis metric.

744
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:14,080
Speaker 1: I'm with your final question. I got a heart out here.

745
00:34:14,680 --> 00:34:17,480
Speaker 1: You mentioned offensive tackle being maybe a weaker part of

746
00:34:17,480 --> 00:34:19,759
Speaker 1: this draft class. I had great defensive tackle being a

747
00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:22,680
Speaker 1: stronger part of this draft class. I agree. Any other

748
00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:24,880
Speaker 1: the positions stick out to you is either being particularly

749
00:34:24,920 --> 00:34:27,279
Speaker 1: strong or weak. As you get into day two and

750
00:34:27,320 --> 00:34:27,799
Speaker 1: day three of.

751
00:34:27,719 --> 00:34:30,200
Speaker 2: The class, this tight end group might be one of

752
00:34:30,200 --> 00:34:32,840
Speaker 2: the best we've ever seen. And we have that. We

753
00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:35,040
Speaker 2: have the superstar at the start at the top, and

754
00:34:35,120 --> 00:34:39,440
Speaker 2: Tyler Warren, but then we have breakout studs and Helm

755
00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:43,399
Speaker 2: from Texas bringing school from Clemson, Arroyo from Miami. He'll

756
00:34:43,640 --> 00:34:47,399
Speaker 2: be down the Senior Bowl, you know, the Michian yep.

757
00:34:47,560 --> 00:34:49,319
Speaker 2: And he had an off year. I mean, he came

758
00:34:49,320 --> 00:34:51,239
Speaker 2: into the year as the top guy. I think there's

759
00:34:51,320 --> 00:34:54,759
Speaker 2: gonna be I have nine grades right now that I

760
00:34:54,760 --> 00:34:56,759
Speaker 2: think are going to be Round one or two or three,

761
00:34:56,840 --> 00:35:00,640
Speaker 2: so starting caliber players. That number is rarely over six,

762
00:35:01,120 --> 00:35:04,000
Speaker 2: and it where I'm adding pretty fifty percent of that

763
00:35:04,040 --> 00:35:06,839
Speaker 2: to this group. So and all different kinds of tight ends,

764
00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:09,040
Speaker 2: to guys with size and can play in line, and

765
00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:11,600
Speaker 2: guys that can brock bowers it and be a wide

766
00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:14,239
Speaker 2: receiver type player. Harold Fannon is a guy that has

767
00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:16,440
Speaker 2: like a wild card future to him. We're gonna see

768
00:35:16,520 --> 00:35:18,880
Speaker 2: him down in Senior Bowl. Him and Tyler Warren combined

769
00:35:18,880 --> 00:35:20,799
Speaker 2: for twenty eight hundred parts this year. Dude, I mean

770
00:35:20,840 --> 00:35:23,200
Speaker 2: it was. It's an incredible group that I think has

771
00:35:23,239 --> 00:35:24,400
Speaker 2: a lot of upside.

772
00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:26,919
Speaker 1: And then any group that you think is particularly weak

773
00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:28,879
Speaker 1: besides offensive tackle, I.

774
00:35:28,840 --> 00:35:31,359
Speaker 2: Mean, I feel like I'm saying this year after year now.

775
00:35:31,360 --> 00:35:33,239
Speaker 2: But the linebackers, I just don't see more than a

776
00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:35,799
Speaker 2: handful of guys that really can project to be every

777
00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:38,920
Speaker 2: down players. Ie. I see a couple of specialty type players,

778
00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:41,279
Speaker 2: but the top of the linebacker group I'm just not

779
00:35:41,320 --> 00:35:42,880
Speaker 2: that excited about. And I don't see a lot of

780
00:35:42,920 --> 00:35:43,439
Speaker 2: depth either.

781
00:35:44,280 --> 00:35:45,920
Speaker 1: Dave, this is awesome. Tell the folks whether you can

782
00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:46,960
Speaker 1: find all your work of this year.

783
00:35:47,320 --> 00:35:50,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, our lads dot com. We also you could sign

784
00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:52,640
Speaker 2: up for a newsletter there that that's a three day

785
00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:54,800
Speaker 2: per week newsletter that we're sending out. We just started

786
00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:57,680
Speaker 2: this last week Monday, Wednesday Friday. I'm putting a lot

787
00:35:57,680 --> 00:36:00,960
Speaker 2: of effort into those and our Lads underscore on X.

788
00:36:01,000 --> 00:36:03,719
Speaker 2: I'm being very active there between now and then, and

789
00:36:03,800 --> 00:36:07,399
Speaker 2: give the YouTube channel, our Lads YouTube channel a look.

790
00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:10,000
Speaker 2: We have mock drafts coming up, a came Word Versitar

791
00:36:10,040 --> 00:36:12,040
Speaker 2: Sanders video coming up, and we're gonna be putting out

792
00:36:12,080 --> 00:36:14,080
Speaker 2: as much content as we can between now and then.

793
00:36:14,120 --> 00:36:15,960
Speaker 2: I'll also be at the Senior Bowl, so look for

794
00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:16,520
Speaker 2: me out there.

795
00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:19,000
Speaker 1: Nice we can hang out and look forward to We're

796
00:36:19,040 --> 00:36:20,960
Speaker 1: booking our flights next couple of days, I'll be a

797
00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:22,680
Speaker 1: trying to to check out your door, so that should

798
00:36:22,680 --> 00:36:24,960
Speaker 1: be a lot of fun. Save good stuff, enjoy the process,

799
00:36:24,960 --> 00:36:25,880
Speaker 1: and we'll catch up later on.

800
00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:27,560
Speaker 2: Okay, thanks Sean, we'll talk soon.

801
00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:30,239
Speaker 1: Dave Severton from our Lads dot Com, we thank you

802
00:36:30,239 --> 00:36:31,840
Speaker 1: for joining us on The Giants Total Podcast, brought to

803
00:36:31,840 --> 00:36:33,839
Speaker 1: you by Citizens Official Bank of the Giants. We'll see

804
00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:34,840
Speaker 1: you next time. Everybody,