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Speaker 1: Media. Welcome back to Behind the Bastards, a podcast that

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Speaker 1: is about bad people, and it turns out there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of those in the world, only more of them

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Speaker 1: every year. It feels like to commiserate with me about

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Speaker 1: that point. My guest today, Jack O'Brien, Doctor Jack O'Brien,

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Speaker 1: mister Colonel Jack O'Brien, President Jack O'Brien. All of the titles,

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Speaker 1: esquire what other titles are there? Do we have titles for?

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Speaker 2: Like I don't know, I like colonel the honorable colonel,

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Speaker 2: because that that's one that when they give it to you,

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Speaker 2: you can just start calling yourself that, Like you just

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Speaker 2: did an episode about this dream the colonel dream was

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Speaker 2: just like just like somebody called him that one time,

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Speaker 2: I think in like New Orleans and they were like,

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Speaker 2: we'll make you honorable colonel, and he was like started

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Speaker 2: trying his name on legal documents.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, what if I ever if I was ever

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Speaker 1: made a Kentucky colonel or whatever other kind of anytime.

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Speaker 1: The second I get made a colonel, I am never

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Speaker 1: introducing myself any other way, like I.

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Speaker 3: Like to think.

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Speaker 4: So when we went to the R and C and DNC,

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Speaker 4: they had this display of President's shoes. I like to

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Speaker 4: think if there was like a podcast version of it,

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Speaker 4: it would just be Jack's, Jordan's.

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Speaker 2: Jordan's Yeah, I have some behind me right there. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I think that's very nice with you, Sophie. I don't

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Speaker 2: think I can take credit for all podcasts.

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Speaker 1: You know what's not nice of me? Maybe I thought

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Speaker 1: they're telling you the telling you the life story of

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Speaker 1: Greg Bovino. No, I really like the Robert.

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Speaker 4: Can you share the working title that you did, because

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Speaker 4: it's it's a great working title.

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Speaker 1: I just I don't know, you see, I was I

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Speaker 1: went back and forth on it because I feel like

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Speaker 1: it's too obvious. I just called him America's Kirkland brand

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Speaker 1: Gestapo chief.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I love it. I like it.

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Speaker 1: I like that there's there's the thing because like there

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Speaker 1: are people. He gets angry that people compare Ice to

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Speaker 1: the Gesta and he's not with Ice, he's Border Patrol.

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Speaker 1: But you know they're all gestapo esque and people get

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Speaker 1: angry about them. And there's there's like three different kinds

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Speaker 1: of people here. There's like normal people who are like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it seems like some Gestapo kind of thing. There's like

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Speaker 1: closet Nazis and Trump administration being like, first off, it's

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Speaker 1: Gestapo and second.

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Speaker 2: Second, you're using the wrong font to make that accusation.

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Speaker 1: And then there's guys like me who tries to switch

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Speaker 1: between the two. Yeah, just because I've read too many

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Speaker 1: books and watch too many documentaries about the Gestapo. Wow,

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Speaker 1: we're doing Yes, I'm not being sus.

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Speaker 4: Shocked to hear that about you. Robert Evans, host of

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Speaker 4: Behind the Bastards.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so, Jack, what do you know about Greg Gregory?

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Speaker 1: That time we had a Greg commit like crimes against

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Speaker 1: humanity in this country? Now, yeah, it was about it

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Speaker 1: was not about time, but I feel like it hasn't

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Speaker 1: happened before.

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Speaker 2: I think, you know, diversity of first name is really important.

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Speaker 2: So I was also welcoming when Greg showed up on

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Speaker 2: the scene.

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Speaker 1: Finally, finally, some Greg representation in the crimes.

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Speaker 2: I host a daily news show called The Daily Zeh as.

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Speaker 1: A man, you were a man who needed no introduction.

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Speaker 1: But clearly that's irresponsible.

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Speaker 2: Well no, but I mean due to that show, do

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Speaker 2: have some experience covering the latest happenings. But we do

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Speaker 2: that show twice a day, and therefore I don't I

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Speaker 2: didn't have a lot of time to dig in to

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Speaker 2: his backstory to really, uh see what makes this guy tick?

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Speaker 2: You know, Yeah, I have a feeling. I I was

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Speaker 2: just like kind of uh using context clues and making

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Speaker 2: educated guesses about what makes him tick. Yeah, yeah, I don't.

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Speaker 2: I don't know that much other than that he his

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Speaker 2: rapid rise and precipitous dismissal.

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, and that's actually happened once before in his career.

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Speaker 1: We're not tad about a little bit. Yeah, not Greg

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Speaker 1: Greg again. You can't mean, like like you go back

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Speaker 1: to like the other crimes against humanity this country has committed.

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Speaker 1: You can't imagine like a greg having some significant role

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Speaker 1: in like the displacement of the Native Americans, right, or

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Speaker 1: like you can't imagine Greg like Greg's not an old

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Speaker 1: It's like, yeah, it's I have trouble imagine. I can

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Speaker 1: imagine a Gregory. I can imagine like a Gregory something

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Speaker 1: are there being involved in one of this nation's great crimes.

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Speaker 1: I can see that name signed on too, like the

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Speaker 1: order to in turn people. But not a Greg you know,

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Speaker 1: like there weren't Gregs until very recently. I feel like

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Speaker 1: it's certainly not in a position where they could do

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Speaker 1: crimes against humanity.

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Speaker 2: Like Gregg Gregg. It's like kind of got like a

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Speaker 2: gen X like quality to it, where it's, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 2: you can just call me Greg.

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Speaker 1: Would it be better worse if he was a Craig,

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Speaker 1: Like would we believe him more or less? Because I

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Speaker 1: feel like Greg, I do believe Greg doing more than Craig.

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Speaker 3: Greg is worse.

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Speaker 1: Craig is a is a trustworthy name, you know, Greg.

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Speaker 1: There's a little something sketchy about it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, when did Gregg's first start showing up just not

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Speaker 2: Gregory's but Greg.

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Speaker 1: Greg It had to have been like the seventies.

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Speaker 3: My cousin Greg succession.

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Speaker 1: There you go, that's the birth of Greg.

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Speaker 2: Greig is a young person's name.

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Speaker 4: Further point, but literally in that show, he decides he

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Speaker 4: wants to be taken seriously and he's like asks people

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Speaker 4: to call him Gregory, but he says it like, uh

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Speaker 4: gregor as.

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Speaker 2: On the wrong syllable, Yeah, the wrong syllable. Uh Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I recently met a seventy something year old man named Corey.

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Speaker 2: You're are you the first Corey? And I did? I

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Speaker 2: did ask him that, and he didn't think it was funny.

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Speaker 2: Cory is such a young person's name. Yeah, yeah, Greg.

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Speaker 3: Well, we've all tried to learn about this.

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Speaker 4: Joyd hearing more because it's gonna be upsetting.

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Speaker 1: I will be over on my end googling historical Greg's

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Speaker 1: first Greg History Comma uh so I said to have

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Speaker 1: to write this episode the week mister Bovino lost a

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Speaker 1: special job dressing like a Naziqual overseeing Border patrol operations

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Speaker 1: alongside ice in Minneapolis. He made the news several times

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Speaker 1: for statements in the wake of the murders of Rede

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Speaker 1: Good and Alex Pretty, and during the first year of

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Speaker 1: the Trump administration had generally turned himself into the physical

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Speaker 1: embodiment of the regime's violence towards Americans. It's too early

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Speaker 1: to say what the future holds for Greg, but given

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Speaker 1: that he just took a turn a sin eater for

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Speaker 1: the Trump administration, I think it's time we look into

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Speaker 1: who this guy is and where he came from. And

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Speaker 1: in short, he's not quite the guy I expected. There's

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Speaker 1: very little in Bovino's early life and even in most

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Speaker 1: of his career with the Border Patrol that would have

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Speaker 1: led one to predict he'd have turned into this I'm

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Speaker 1: not saying you'd have expected him to be like a

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Speaker 1: great guy, but that like the fact that he wound

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Speaker 1: up in at this moment in history doing this thing

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Speaker 1: is like a little surprising most of his former Yeah,

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Speaker 1: he's not. He doesn't seem like he was built for

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Speaker 1: this his whole life. And you don't get a lot

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Speaker 1: of quotes from his pre people who used to know

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Speaker 1: him being like, oh yeah, that makes sense for old Greg,

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Speaker 1: you know, yeah, most.

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Speaker 2: Of more just like they don't really remember him no

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Speaker 2: more of like, uh huh that guys doing that. Huh.

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Speaker 1: It's the general reaction. It's it's again like if this

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Speaker 1: guy in your school who wasn't super bad at anything,

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Speaker 1: but wasn't very good at anything and never really stood

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Speaker 1: out at anything winds up on the news dragging Americans

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Speaker 1: out of their home and tear gassing them in the

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Speaker 1: street for no reason. You're like, is he dressed like

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Speaker 1: a Nazi?

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Speaker 2: Whereas like Stephen Miller is like the James of Nazis,

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Speaker 2: Like where everybody in high school was like, this guy

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Speaker 2: is going to be Nazi the world?

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Speaker 3: Did you just say the le bron James of Nazis.

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Speaker 1: I think it's a good comparison, so.

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Speaker 2: That he was a standout Nazi from from the very

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Speaker 2: earliest ages. People you couldn't miss chosen.

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Speaker 1: He was the lebron or Stephen Miller in sixth grade.

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Speaker 1: You knew what they were growing up to do. This

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Speaker 1: guy is gonna be the best basketball player where ever,

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Speaker 1: and this guy's gonna be a fucking Nazi.

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Speaker 5: Yes, yeah, I think you're right money with that, Jack,

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Speaker 5: Not really.

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Speaker 1: No, there's maybe one piece of evidence, but it's not good.

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Speaker 1: So most of the evidence is that he's kind of

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Speaker 1: like not the guy you'd expect to have done this.

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Speaker 1: Now that said, we don't have a lot about Greg's

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Speaker 1: early life. The only journalists who have really dug into

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Speaker 1: Bovino's life in a credible way are Dan Mihelopolis and

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Speaker 1: Lauren Fitzpatrick of the Chicago Sun Times, and they did

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Speaker 1: great work. They did both a podcast and an article

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Speaker 1: looking into his backstory. Aside from them, there's just one

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Speaker 1: Daily Mail article that talks to his sister, and so

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Speaker 1: we have a lot from his sister, who I don't

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Speaker 1: consider the most credible witness about this guy. Right, So

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Speaker 1: there's just not a ton of detail. And then there's

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Speaker 1: some sketchier sources on the matter, so we got some

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Speaker 1: open questions still. That said Greg was born on March

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Speaker 1: twenty seventh, nineteen seventy in San Bernardino, California, which I

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Speaker 1: bet you didn't call San Berndino Baby.

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Speaker 2: You know that's good I didn't because I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I cannot differentiate any like any of those la.

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Speaker 1: He's the pieces. That's such a West La thing to say, too, Jack, It's.

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Speaker 2: A I'm bad at LA stuff too.

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Speaker 1: I'm just like I.

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Speaker 2: I grew up on the East Coast and I'm just

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Speaker 2: like San.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, Inland Empire, Jack Inland Empire.

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Speaker 1: In about San Berndino from the Frank Zappa song San Bernandino,

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Speaker 1: And hearing that Greg Bobino was born in San Berdino

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Speaker 1: makes me also think of the Frank Zappa song Baby Snakes,

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Speaker 1: because at this point he's a baby snake, you know. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and those are bad right they can well really but

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Speaker 1: yeah baby snakes. Sure, yeah, absolutely, It's not their fault.

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Speaker 1: They're just snakes. But yes, yes, he's born there. And

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Speaker 1: because he would embark on a career of at and

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Speaker 1: facilitating the brutalization of immigrants, a lot has been made

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Speaker 1: of the immigration history of his own family. And I

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Speaker 1: have some qualms with this because you're mostly bringing this

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Speaker 1: up to be like you're hurting these people, yet a

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Speaker 1: generation or two ago your family was in the same situation.

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Speaker 1: Can't you see why that's fucked up? And my answer

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Speaker 1: to that is no, they can't. They're bad people, right,

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Speaker 1: Like It's like, at a certain point, are you like

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Speaker 1: you could again people do this thing with Stephen Miller's

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Speaker 1: background or Trump's and it's like, yeah, I mean they're bad.

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Speaker 1: They don't care. They don't care, they're bad people.

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Speaker 2: They suck Like, oh, that didn't work pointing out the

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Speaker 2: hypoglypsy of the behavior their background.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I feel.

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Speaker 2: Like a three million time we do it, it's just

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Speaker 2: gonna like break through it and be like a damn

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Speaker 2: and they'll be like.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's the too many people believe their moms when

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Speaker 1: they were like that bully. You know, if that bully

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Speaker 1: knew he was hurting you, he'd feel bad, and it's like, right,

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Speaker 1: he's a dick. That's not how they work. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's it's also just like, yeah, basically every white person,

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Speaker 1: if you go back two generations, has like an immigration

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Speaker 1: story in this country because it's the United States. That's

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Speaker 1: kind of how it happened here for most people. But

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Speaker 1: as you might have guessed from the name, the Bavinos

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Speaker 1: were originally Italian. In nineteen oh nine, Michelle Bovino, who

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Speaker 1: is Greg's great grandfather, left the village of Alprigliano in

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Speaker 1: the mountains of southern Italy. His home was racked with

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Speaker 1: poverty and dominated by organized criminal cartels, much like certain countries.

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Speaker 1: Our administration doesn't think he should be sending us immigrants today,

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Speaker 1: so it is a pretty direct comparison.

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Speaker 2: Not a popular source.

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Speaker 1: Of people back then, right, No, no, they were not.

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Speaker 1: The United States not thrilled these people are coming over.

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Speaker 1: So Michel, who I'm sure was immediately called Michael as

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Speaker 1: soon as you can't be going by that here, left

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Speaker 1: his wife and kids behind. So they are staying back

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Speaker 1: in Italy, and I guess he's sending them back money

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Speaker 1: as he seeks to make a life for himself in

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Speaker 1: the United States. So he's doing that for years until

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Speaker 1: this takes a while, until in May of nineteen twenty four,

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Speaker 1: there's a panic over immigration in the halls of power

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Speaker 1: in the United States, and this was you know, the

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Speaker 1: result of kind of a long simmering pot. From the

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Speaker 1: early eighteen hundreds, most immigration into the US had been

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Speaker 1: Western and Northern Europeans, aka the whitest of the white people.

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Speaker 1: And we had some issues with some of them, right,

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Speaker 1: There's some like, oh, a welshman's here now, but like

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Speaker 1: you know, for the most part, it's like, well, they're

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Speaker 1: all pretty We're all pretty white, right, these people. You know,

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Speaker 1: not to say that nobody faced bigotry when they came here,

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Speaker 1: but they're all you know, this is like the founding

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Speaker 1: stock and the ideas of people by that point in time,

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Speaker 1: by the time you hit the eighteen hundreds, and by

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Speaker 1: the late eighteen hundreds and early nineteen hundred, shits starting

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Speaker 1: to shift. Immigrants are now coming more from Eastern and

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Speaker 1: Southern Europe, where the white people are not quite as white.

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Speaker 1: The first twenty or so years of the nineteen hundreds

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Speaker 1: also coincided with the largest search in immigration in US history.

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Speaker 1: Up to that point, eugenics was beginning to become a

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Speaker 1: popular topic of discussion, and among educated racists, it was

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Speaker 1: believe that many different European nations were also effectively different races.

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Speaker 1: Per an article in the Migration Policy Institute, The influential

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Speaker 1: eugenicist Charles Davenport considered Italians prone to crimes of personal violence,

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Speaker 1: while Jews were characterized by intense individualism and ideals of

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Speaker 1: gain at the cost of any interest. Since eugenicists believe

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Speaker 1: individual races possess different characteristics and abilities, Davenport argued, the

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Speaker 1: government should be careful not to adulterate our national germ

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Speaker 1: plasm with socially unfit traits.

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Speaker 2: And you know, and what this was in what small

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Speaker 2: corner of the internet. Oh wait, this was in academia.

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Speaker 1: This is this is in Congress at this point, I mean, this.

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Speaker 2: Is it was so popular, Like Americans don't understand how

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Speaker 2: popular that was in the early twentieth century. If you've

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Speaker 2: seen a picture with a man with like a stethoscope

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Speaker 2: or a fucking pince nez or whatever and doctor in

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Speaker 2: front of his name. In nineteen ten, he believed the

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Speaker 2: most racist things you can imagine because he read it

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Speaker 2: in the text book that was like the dvs Czech

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Speaker 2: has these characters like a D and D source book

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Speaker 2: where it's like, oh, they get plus two to strike,

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Speaker 2: you know, like that's literally how these people are like

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Speaker 2: learning this shit. It's in textbooks, and it's in the

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Speaker 2: textbooks that our congressmen are reading, and they're going to

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Speaker 2: yell at too about all of the Italians that are

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Speaker 2: coming into the country. Enter the Dillingham Commission, which was

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Speaker 2: set up by Congress to study the consequences of immigration.

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Speaker 2: It released report in nineteen oh nine, that's right after,

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Speaker 2: but two years after Michelle came to the United States

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Speaker 2: that argued northern and Western Europeans were just kind of

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Speaker 2: better people from the other parts of Europe, and it

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Speaker 2: suggested the Dillingham Report suggested a wide range of policies

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Speaker 2: to discourage immigration from unworthy places, including literacy tests and

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Speaker 2: racial quotas. Right, that's where a lot of this stuff,

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Speaker 2: you know, is when America really starts thinking about immigration

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Speaker 2: and the border in a very modern way. You know,

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Speaker 2: there'd been panics over it before, and you know, legislation,

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Speaker 2: but a lot of our modern apparatus of how we

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Speaker 2: think about immigration, of how we think about white genocide,

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Speaker 2: and that sort of all starts right in this period

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Speaker 2: of time. And to make a long story short, the

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Speaker 2: Dillingham Commission releases that reported nineteen eleven. You know, things

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Speaker 2: still move slowly in the halls of power, but this

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Speaker 2: eventually culminates in nineteen twenty four in the Immigration Act,

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Speaker 2: which restricted immigration in an attempt to ensure most deriving

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Speaker 2: immigrants were from the good places.

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Speaker 1: For the MPI, it closed the door in almost all

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Speaker 1: New Asian immigration and shut out most European Jews and

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Speaker 1: other refugees fleeing fascism and the horrors of the Holocaust

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Speaker 1: in Europe. One of the most restrictive immigration laws in

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Speaker 1: US history, it played a key role in any of

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Speaker 1: the previous era of largely unrestricted immigration. So this is

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Speaker 1: when immigration as like a modern concept really gets started.

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Speaker 1: And Greg Bevino's ancestor, this is just.

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Speaker 2: A relevant context for people who are like, this is

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Speaker 2: not what America is about.

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Speaker 1: Well, it's kind of been the way we have it

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Speaker 1: for a while in the last one hundred and something years.

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Speaker 1: And Greg Bavino's ancestor knew that this posts a threat

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Speaker 1: to his plan because he's making money and he's sending

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Speaker 1: it over to Italy. But his plan is I want

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Speaker 1: to bring my family with me right to the lane

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Speaker 1: of opportunity at some point, and he sees this Act

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Speaker 1: to get passed and He's like, shit, that's about to

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Speaker 1: get a lot harder. So within days of the Immigration

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Speaker 1: Act passing, he files paperwork to start the process of

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Speaker 1: becoming a citizen. Once this process was completed in nineteen

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Speaker 1: twenty seven, he brought his family over and they became

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Speaker 1: citizens through a process known as chain migration. Here's how

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Speaker 1: The Sun Times explains what happened after Michelle was naturalized

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Speaker 1: in nineteen twenty seven. He was reunited with his wife

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Speaker 1: and four children and at Pennsylvania Cold Company Town after

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Speaker 1: their arrival on the steamship the SS Giuseppe Verde Record Show.

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Speaker 1: Then the kids, including Vincenzo twelve, Gregory Bovino's future grandfather,

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Speaker 1: automatically benefited from a derivative citizenship law for minors. Luigia

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Speaker 1: would become a naturalized citizen. So all is it's, you know,

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Speaker 1: chain migration is kind of exactly the thing that they're

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Speaker 1: trying to stop now. It's to be part of why

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Speaker 1: they want to reverse some of the citizenships that have

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Speaker 1: been granted, because a lot of them are granted in

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Speaker 1: ways that are very related to this right, right, and

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Speaker 1: it's what they want to stop because they want to

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Speaker 1: stop families from coming over here and getting larger.

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Speaker 2: They've just they've benefited from this random crapshoot of laws

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Speaker 2: and everyone did.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: They don't want anybody else to get lucky like they did.

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Speaker 1: Right, And they don't want any other ethnic groups, as

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Speaker 1: they see it, or racial groups to come here and

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Speaker 1: start breeding, right, which is what Italians did. You know,

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Speaker 1: It's what everybody did. It's kind of the entire point

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Speaker 1: of the country, you know.

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Speaker 2: Kind of the whole deal. The melting pot is a

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Speaker 2: very chaste way of saying a lot of people came

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Speaker 2: here and started fucking each.

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Speaker 1: Other pot, right, and.

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Speaker 2: Everything kind of mixed together. I do love how rigorously

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Speaker 2: Italian everything. It's an incredible name of the boat that

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Speaker 2: they came over all.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, just Agenzo. Yeah, they were nearly out of pizza

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Speaker 1: by the time they hit the dops. Yes, I know.

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Speaker 1: The Trump administration has cited the nineteen twenty four immigration

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Speaker 1: law as an example of the kind of reforms they

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Speaker 1: seek to make. They've also repeatedly cited chain migration stories

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Speaker 1: like this as an example of things like why birthright

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Speaker 1: citizenship and Juwsoli need to be revisited. For his part,

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Speaker 1: Baveno does not seem interested in his family background, and

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Speaker 1: I don't know that it was much of a factor

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Speaker 1: in his raising. For him, the most influential thing that

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Speaker 1: happened in nineteen twenty four may not have even been

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Speaker 1: the Immigration Act because that is also the year the

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Speaker 1: Border Patrol was created, and that's going to be Greg

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Speaker 1: Bavino's whole life. So, like I said, he's born in

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Speaker 1: San Bordino because his father had just been drafted to

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Speaker 1: fight in Vietnam. So don't worry. Like my native Inland

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Speaker 1: Empire people, they don't stay very long. They're just stationed

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Speaker 1: on a military base nearby, and two years later, when

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Speaker 1: his father gets discharged, the family moves back east to

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Speaker 1: Blowing Rock, North Carolina, which is the real name of

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Speaker 1: a place. Don't make fun of it, you know.

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Speaker 2: Blowing Rock, North Carolina.

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Speaker 4: When you first mentioned San Bernardino, I was like confused

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Speaker 4: because he doesn't give big Inland Empire energy.

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Speaker 1: No, he's not an Inland Empire guy. No, he's there

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Speaker 1: two years.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, so this this makes more sense.

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Speaker 2: He does give Blowing Rock energy.

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Speaker 1: I do. I do kind of wonder is there any

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Speaker 1: and he doesn't say anything about this, so maybe I'm

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Speaker 1: reading into it. Maybe two years isn't enough time. But

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Speaker 1: I've lived in parts of uh, you know, the the

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Speaker 1: deep rural areas where oh, you didn't come here to

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Speaker 1: you were two. You're not really from here, boy, you know.

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Speaker 1: So I don't know if that was any part of

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Speaker 1: his background or not.

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Speaker 2: New family.

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Speaker 1: Coming up here. That was twenty years ago.

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Speaker 2: Mark called him Hollywood, here comes Hollywood.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I could see that, but they don't say anything

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Speaker 1: about that. That's purely a head cannon for fucking Greg Bavino.

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Speaker 1: And to be fair, probably not the case because his

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Speaker 1: dad's side of the family's just come here, but his

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Speaker 1: mom's side of the family goes back at least they say,

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Speaker 1: eight generations in the Blowing Rock area. The Bavenos had

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Speaker 1: two more children, Natalie and Nicholas, born in seventy four

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Speaker 1: and seventy nine, after moving back to their part of

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Speaker 1: the country, and one gets the feeling that young Greg

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Speaker 1: may have benefited a bit from only child syndrome, because

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Speaker 1: he's a good bit older than his siblings, right closer

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Speaker 1: to his sister than his brother, but he's got some

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Speaker 1: oldest sibling memories. At least his younger sister, Natalie is

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Speaker 1: one of our few semi detailed sources in Greg's childhood.

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Speaker 1: Although she seems to idolize her brother and I don't

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Speaker 1: credit her with a lot of skepticism or scrutiny about him.

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Speaker 1: She describes their early childhood as Rockwellian, which means reminiscent

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Speaker 1: of the paintings of Dorman Rockwell, right, and is also

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Speaker 1: based I think, often on some misunderstandings of them. But

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Speaker 1: like she's thinking of like those nice paintings of kids

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Speaker 1: hiking in the woods and you know, idyllic Christmases with

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Speaker 1: the family gathered around the fire and stuff, right, Like,

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Speaker 1: that's what she means. There were about a thing.

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Speaker 2: Norman Rockwell like fucked up.

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Speaker 1: I actually know he's pretty good politics. I mean he's

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Speaker 1: not perfect. There's some stuff you know, you find with

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Speaker 1: any illustrator of that period. They did some uncomfortable illustrations

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Speaker 1: if you look back far enough, right, But no, he

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Speaker 1: did a lot of He was like super pro integration,

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Speaker 1: super pro civil rights movement. Like he was just like the.

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Speaker 2: Carefully curated version of the paintings that make it happen

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Speaker 2: to be curated by white supremacists.

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Speaker 1: As is often the case, a bunch of white supremacists

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Speaker 1: have taken his paintings to be like, this was the

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Speaker 1: ideal America before everything got when Norman Rockwell was just

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Speaker 1: painting pretty things.

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Speaker 5: You know, Norman Rockwell, Yeah, he was also painting like

434
00:22:47,800 --> 00:22:50,800
Speaker 5: because he did some paintings of like civil rights movement,

435
00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:52,600
Speaker 5: like protests and stuff that were contemporaries.

436
00:22:52,600 --> 00:22:56,360
Speaker 1: It wasn't all but you know that. Yeah, they forgot.

437
00:22:57,320 --> 00:22:59,840
Speaker 2: So you're sure she was referring to Norman Rockwell when

438
00:22:59,840 --> 00:23:02,920
Speaker 2: she said Rockwellian and not the eighties artist who's saying

439
00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:04,040
Speaker 2: somebody's watching me.

440
00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:07,639
Speaker 1: Yes, I do not believe she's referring to the eighties

441
00:23:07,720 --> 00:23:10,159
Speaker 1: artists who sick somebody's watching me. Thank you though for

442
00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:10,800
Speaker 1: bringing that up.

443
00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:12,520
Speaker 3: Norman fucking rock Well.

444
00:23:12,680 --> 00:23:16,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, there were about a thousand people in their hometown,

445
00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:20,200
Speaker 1: which she describes as literally perfect. So again she has

446
00:23:20,200 --> 00:23:23,640
Speaker 1: these idyllic memories of their early childhood. The Bavino's benefited

447
00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:26,000
Speaker 1: from a tight family and an extensive one, right. They

448
00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:28,520
Speaker 1: have a lot of in laws and relatives, and they

449
00:23:28,520 --> 00:23:31,119
Speaker 1: had money too. They're doing very well for a while.

450
00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:34,879
Speaker 1: Their father had started a successful bar, the Library Club,

451
00:23:35,280 --> 00:23:37,239
Speaker 1: And the reason why it's such a big deal here

452
00:23:37,280 --> 00:23:39,600
Speaker 1: is that their town is like the lone wet county

453
00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:41,399
Speaker 1: in the middle of a bunch of dry counties. So

454
00:23:41,400 --> 00:23:43,680
Speaker 1: there's a bunch of bars in town. And it's kind

455
00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:46,000
Speaker 1: of like a vacation town. So it's both where people

456
00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:50,000
Speaker 1: come on vacation, but also if anyone nearby wants to drink,

457
00:23:50,119 --> 00:23:52,600
Speaker 1: they have to come to Blowing Rock, right, and the

458
00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:54,840
Speaker 1: library Club's like one of the biggest places they're going

459
00:23:54,920 --> 00:23:55,280
Speaker 1: to go to.

460
00:23:55,960 --> 00:23:59,960
Speaker 2: You can make a good living by having the brilliant innovation.

461
00:24:01,000 --> 00:24:03,640
Speaker 2: We are in a town where I can open a bar,

462
00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:06,720
Speaker 2: and no other towns around those over the bar. I

463
00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:08,000
Speaker 2: bet people will drink here.

464
00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:11,520
Speaker 1: I bet people will drink here. And they different did.

465
00:24:11,440 --> 00:24:13,960
Speaker 2: Because people talk about like being able to like how

466
00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:17,160
Speaker 2: you know, previous generations you could buy a house for

467
00:24:17,280 --> 00:24:19,639
Speaker 2: this and like everything was so much cheaper. It was

468
00:24:19,680 --> 00:24:22,680
Speaker 2: also so easy to like succeed.

469
00:24:22,359 --> 00:24:26,879
Speaker 1: Backless less ideas had been had, you know, Like I

470
00:24:26,920 --> 00:24:29,480
Speaker 1: don't know, I think people will use plastic in the

471
00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:31,679
Speaker 1: future room getting into plastics.

472
00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:33,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, you become a millionaire.

473
00:24:34,240 --> 00:24:37,879
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it was easier. It was easier most of

474
00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:40,120
Speaker 1: the sources I find out. I will say, though, Jack,

475
00:24:40,160 --> 00:24:42,280
Speaker 1: I don't know that we fully understand how the Library

476
00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:44,840
Speaker 1: Bar made its money. Most of the sources I find

477
00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:47,639
Speaker 1: just describe it as a bar, and weirdly enough, the

478
00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:49,520
Speaker 1: thing that made me think maybe something more was going

479
00:24:49,560 --> 00:24:51,879
Speaker 1: on here was that interview I found with Natalie and

480
00:24:51,920 --> 00:24:54,520
Speaker 1: the Daily Mail where I don't think she's trying to

481
00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:57,520
Speaker 1: let on that her dad was a criminal, but that's

482
00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:00,280
Speaker 1: kind of how it sounds, because here's a quote from her.

483
00:25:00,800 --> 00:25:03,040
Speaker 1: In those early years, the family was living the good life,

484
00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:05,240
Speaker 1: thanks largely to the success of the Library Club, and

485
00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:08,160
Speaker 1: here's Natalie. The bouncers would drop huge sacks of money

486
00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:11,560
Speaker 1: off stacks and stacks. He did incredibly well. The family

487
00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:13,400
Speaker 1: was able to buy their house into both they'd ride

488
00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:15,640
Speaker 1: on Wataga Lake and the membership in a country club

489
00:25:15,680 --> 00:25:17,679
Speaker 1: where they ran a side business, a drink stand on

490
00:25:17,720 --> 00:25:21,120
Speaker 1: the ninth hole. And that's not how.

491
00:25:21,720 --> 00:25:27,280
Speaker 5: We don't come to your own with sands of money.

492
00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:27,600
Speaker 2: Yeah.

493
00:25:28,680 --> 00:25:31,040
Speaker 1: I've known a few bar owners and none of them

494
00:25:31,040 --> 00:25:35,200
Speaker 1: have the bouncers drop sacks of money off at their houses.

495
00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:38,400
Speaker 1: That's your dad was moving something.

496
00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:39,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, he was moving.

497
00:25:43,320 --> 00:25:46,800
Speaker 3: On the ninth hole. Is such a fantastic detail.

498
00:25:47,520 --> 00:25:50,840
Speaker 2: Wow. Yeah, Well, we were basically millionaires for the time

499
00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:53,760
Speaker 2: because he had a drink stand on the ninth hole

500
00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:54,720
Speaker 2: of a golf course.

501
00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:58,320
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that makes sense. Yeah, that doesn't sound like

502
00:25:58,359 --> 00:26:00,000
Speaker 1: the way you bribe the judges about it.

503
00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:06,920
Speaker 2: They droven ice cream truck getting sallar.

504
00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:10,600
Speaker 1: You know, the bouncer's dropped sacks of money off at

505
00:26:10,640 --> 00:26:15,600
Speaker 1: the house as is normal. Maybe she's not remembering things right,

506
00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:18,000
Speaker 1: but that sounds sketchy as a fuck to me.

507
00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:21,200
Speaker 3: And speaking of stacks and stacks at stacks.

508
00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:27,200
Speaker 1: Speaking of sketchy as FUCKO, here's the sponsors of our show,

509
00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:39,480
Speaker 1: and we're back. So yeah, I don't know. Greg grows

510
00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:42,680
Speaker 1: up to be fair. Whatever the truth is about their dad,

511
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:45,680
Speaker 1: the kids didn't grow up aware of anything sketchy. Greg

512
00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:49,080
Speaker 1: spends his early childhood hunting fish and and exploring the woods.

513
00:26:49,560 --> 00:26:52,160
Speaker 1: His parents got him his first shotgun at age eight.

514
00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:56,520
Speaker 1: He reads hunting magazines voraciously, which is how he encountered

515
00:26:56,520 --> 00:27:00,359
Speaker 1: his first pieces of pro border patrol propaganda. And this

516
00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:02,760
Speaker 1: is interesting because I got a different answer. Every other

517
00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:05,720
Speaker 1: article I read was talked about a thing we'll discuss later.

518
00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:07,439
Speaker 1: There's a movie he watches and the like, and this

519
00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:09,760
Speaker 1: is the first time he encountered the border patrol and

520
00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:11,920
Speaker 1: it's actually talking to his sister that the Daily Mail

521
00:27:12,000 --> 00:27:13,919
Speaker 1: gets this piece of information that I think might be

522
00:27:14,040 --> 00:27:17,119
Speaker 1: more accurate, because it feels more accurate to me, at least.

523
00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:20,760
Speaker 1: The hunting publications featured columns written by old time border

524
00:27:20,800 --> 00:27:24,359
Speaker 1: patrol agents such as Skeeter Skelton and Charles Askins. The

525
00:27:24,400 --> 00:27:26,480
Speaker 1: young boy had found his calling. He thought it was

526
00:27:26,520 --> 00:27:29,600
Speaker 1: the wild West. Natalie Babino to The Daily Mail, it

527
00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:31,760
Speaker 1: was like a true frontier. It was those old timers

528
00:27:31,760 --> 00:27:34,800
Speaker 1: that inspired that in him. And that is more believable

529
00:27:34,800 --> 00:27:37,480
Speaker 1: to me than the other story, just because, like I

530
00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:40,600
Speaker 1: too was a young boy once, and I've read a

531
00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:43,480
Speaker 1: lot of similar articles and a lot of similar magazines.

532
00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:45,200
Speaker 1: I could see that happening to this kid.

533
00:27:45,359 --> 00:27:48,000
Speaker 2: You're familiar with the works of Skeeter Skelton.

534
00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:49,639
Speaker 1: You know what, Jack I am. That's what we're going

535
00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:53,760
Speaker 1: to talk about next. Because the second, as someone with

536
00:27:53,760 --> 00:27:56,760
Speaker 1: a comedy background, the second I read the name Skeeter Skeleton,

537
00:27:57,280 --> 00:28:01,600
Speaker 1: like we gotta deal with that, ask Skeeter, Peter.

538
00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:09,040
Speaker 2: Skeeter Skelton fucking rules, I'm sorry.

539
00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:12,640
Speaker 1: What is that short for? Like skeet Tropolis? Like, what

540
00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:13,119
Speaker 1: the fuck?

541
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:14,560
Speaker 3: Skeeter?

542
00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:19,119
Speaker 1: I've known a couple Skeeters, but I never thought it

543
00:28:19,200 --> 00:28:24,240
Speaker 1: was a given Christian name. I'm gonna be honest, is it. Yeah,

544
00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:27,239
Speaker 1: that's what it seems like. It's written on everything that

545
00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:29,760
Speaker 1: it's it's byeline. I don't know. I don't know the

546
00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:34,919
Speaker 1: man's birth certificate, Jack Skeeter Skelton. It's just weird hearing

547
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:37,600
Speaker 1: the name, seeing the name Skeeter written and a real

548
00:28:37,640 --> 00:28:40,840
Speaker 1: publication is supposed to hearing it across the bar, which

549
00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:41,760
Speaker 1: is how you're supposed to.

550
00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:44,800
Speaker 2: Those guys usually don't make it out of the library

551
00:28:44,840 --> 00:28:48,080
Speaker 2: club are usually there. They do not.

552
00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:52,160
Speaker 4: I just am thinking of that that Nickelodeon show called

553
00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:56,440
Speaker 4: Cousin Skeeter from like the nineties.

554
00:28:56,960 --> 00:29:00,240
Speaker 1: Oh geez, I don't even remember that one. Yeah, I

555
00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:02,000
Speaker 1: read the name Skeeter Skelton. I had to look into

556
00:29:02,080 --> 00:29:04,960
Speaker 1: it more. And he was a lawman from Hereford, Texas

557
00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:07,480
Speaker 1: who served in a bunch of different coproles. He did everything.

558
00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:09,920
Speaker 1: He was in everything from the Amarilla Police to Border Patrol,

559
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:13,680
Speaker 1: to DEA to customs. And he starts writing for Shooting Times,

560
00:29:13,680 --> 00:29:16,880
Speaker 1: which is a magazine that still exists in nineteen sixty six.

561
00:29:17,840 --> 00:29:19,719
Speaker 1: And again it's one of those like no one had

562
00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:22,520
Speaker 1: had the idea to have a magazine about shooting. So

563
00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:24,840
Speaker 1: they start having one in sixty six and he's like,

564
00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:27,000
Speaker 1: I'm gonna write about handguns. It's like, no one had

565
00:29:27,040 --> 00:29:29,680
Speaker 1: that idea before. So he goes from pitching them to

566
00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:32,760
Speaker 1: becoming the handgun editor in the next year because they're like,

567
00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:36,440
Speaker 1: what a great idea people in America writing about handguns.

568
00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:39,280
Speaker 1: You're a genius, Skeeter, And he had.

569
00:29:39,160 --> 00:29:43,000
Speaker 2: Guy whose nickname is just a slang term for mosquitoes,

570
00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:45,720
Speaker 2: as a genius.

571
00:29:46,160 --> 00:29:50,760
Speaker 1: Oh God, Skeeter Skelton. Yeah, he's the handgun editor of

572
00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:53,000
Speaker 1: Shooting Times until his death in nineteen ninety eight. If

573
00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:55,040
Speaker 1: you want to know his main claim to fame, he's

574
00:29:55,080 --> 00:29:58,960
Speaker 1: generally credited with reviving interest in the forty four special round,

575
00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:02,960
Speaker 1: which is the bullet Dirty Harry uses. So without Skeeter Skelton,

576
00:30:03,000 --> 00:30:05,480
Speaker 1: we may never have Dirty Harry.

577
00:30:05,280 --> 00:30:08,440
Speaker 2: He popularized it before Dirty Harry.

578
00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:10,400
Speaker 1: Oh he's not.

579
00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:16,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, he's got like Dirty Harry actually stole that

580
00:30:16,920 --> 00:30:21,440
Speaker 2: ship from me. I do know, I got it. So

581
00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:24,640
Speaker 2: we're doing a new version of TDZ where we dive

582
00:30:24,680 --> 00:30:28,360
Speaker 2: into icons. We just did a Marilyn Monroe episode and

583
00:30:30,320 --> 00:30:34,160
Speaker 2: we found this character named George Solitaire, who I can't

584
00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:37,240
Speaker 2: stop thinking about and talking about because he had a

585
00:30:37,320 --> 00:30:40,920
Speaker 2: claim to fame. Uh, he was just Joe Demaggio was

586
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:44,400
Speaker 2: like drinking buddy, and his claim to fame was that

587
00:30:44,480 --> 00:30:49,560
Speaker 2: he invented the phrase Splitsville and Dollsville. And he was

588
00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:52,080
Speaker 2: like he had a whole origin story about it that

589
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:56,080
Speaker 2: because he was born in Brownsville and moved to Bronxville.

590
00:30:56,600 --> 00:30:58,160
Speaker 1: That's just he thought about vil.

591
00:30:58,600 --> 00:31:02,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, like Bill in a Blood Yeah. But otherwise he

592
00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:04,880
Speaker 2: was just a guy who got drunk with Joe DiMaggio

593
00:31:05,200 --> 00:31:07,800
Speaker 2: and he's like all over the historical record, and he

594
00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:10,600
Speaker 2: was like love it. Scalper was just like like that,

595
00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:15,040
Speaker 2: having a claim to fame that is that specific and

596
00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:17,800
Speaker 2: stupid is just like my hat's off to like what

597
00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:18,880
Speaker 2: a weird world?

598
00:31:19,040 --> 00:31:19,080
Speaker 5: What.

599
00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:22,280
Speaker 1: It's one of those things the second someone tells you that,

600
00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:24,280
Speaker 1: they're like, you know, I kept up with that word Splitsville.

601
00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:30,160
Speaker 1: You're like you must have would claim to have done that, Yeah,

602
00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:31,920
Speaker 1: that's not a thing anyone would pretend.

603
00:31:32,440 --> 00:31:36,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, like to be like I popularized this one round,

604
00:31:36,720 --> 00:31:37,920
Speaker 2: that's kind of shit.

605
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:40,760
Speaker 1: It's kind of if an ancient man came up to

606
00:31:40,760 --> 00:31:42,920
Speaker 1: me and said I made the forty four. Popular'd be like,

607
00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:43,680
Speaker 1: you probably did.

608
00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:46,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, I guess, I don't know. I would like about

609
00:31:46,800 --> 00:31:50,920
Speaker 2: to lying and like get it to just find a lie.

610
00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:52,840
Speaker 1: So specially there you go.

611
00:31:52,880 --> 00:31:58,280
Speaker 2: People, nobody would ever be like, what, Okay, Yeah, I

612
00:31:58,320 --> 00:31:59,680
Speaker 2: guess so that that makes sense.

613
00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:04,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'll believe it. And so I haven't

614
00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:06,880
Speaker 1: had the time because he wrote articles for twenty something years,

615
00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:08,040
Speaker 1: I haven't had the time to go through all A.

616
00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:11,200
Speaker 1: Skeeter's old articles on shooting times. But I found you

617
00:32:11,360 --> 00:32:13,400
Speaker 1: one article and I read.

618
00:32:14,720 --> 00:32:16,080
Speaker 2: And I read the first.

619
00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:18,600
Speaker 1: Paragraph of it, Jack, And this kind of tells you

620
00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:21,000
Speaker 1: all you need to know about what young Gregory might

621
00:32:21,000 --> 00:32:23,000
Speaker 1: have picked up reading Skeeter's columns.

622
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:24,040
Speaker 2: Oh my god.

623
00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:26,680
Speaker 1: Almost all the objections to the three point fifty seven

624
00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:29,480
Speaker 1: magnum as a police weapon come from city police departments.

625
00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:31,880
Speaker 1: It is argued, with some justification, that an officer who

626
00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:34,360
Speaker 1: fires a magnum in a crowded city is more likely

627
00:32:34,360 --> 00:32:36,640
Speaker 1: to kill innocent, non combativets than he would be if

628
00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:39,160
Speaker 1: armed with a standard thirty eight special, Not much as

629
00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:41,240
Speaker 1: given to the fact that the same officer runs a

630
00:32:41,240 --> 00:32:43,240
Speaker 1: hell of a lot more risk of being killed himself

631
00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:45,640
Speaker 1: when his low powered thirty eight fails to put an

632
00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:47,000
Speaker 1: armed opponent out of action.

633
00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:49,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, so just.

634
00:32:49,040 --> 00:32:52,360
Speaker 1: Like, look, some city cops say, this bigger bullet gets

635
00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:56,040
Speaker 1: regular people killed because it goes through doors and stuff, right,

636
00:32:56,120 --> 00:32:58,240
Speaker 1: but have you thought about the danger of not killing

637
00:32:58,240 --> 00:32:58,600
Speaker 1: a guy?

638
00:32:59,000 --> 00:32:59,240
Speaker 2: Yeah?

639
00:32:59,240 --> 00:33:00,440
Speaker 3: Out action?

640
00:33:01,520 --> 00:33:04,080
Speaker 1: I love? And you see also because this was this

641
00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:05,960
Speaker 1: is actually like was published right after his death, but

642
00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:07,800
Speaker 1: he wrote it a little before, so this was published

643
00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:11,680
Speaker 1: like posthumously in eighty eight. But you can see the

644
00:33:11,720 --> 00:33:15,000
Speaker 1: early birth of a lot of the warrior ethos, like

645
00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:17,840
Speaker 1: warrior cop shit here the whole well, you know, you

646
00:33:17,840 --> 00:33:19,760
Speaker 1: could say, you know, an officer was more likely to

647
00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:22,560
Speaker 1: kill innocent non combatives as opposed to like innocent people,

648
00:33:23,080 --> 00:33:27,320
Speaker 1: innocent civilities. Nona could have done something right, right.

649
00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:32,880
Speaker 2: Everything of the assumption that someone's attacking you. That's how

650
00:33:32,920 --> 00:33:35,600
Speaker 2: you leave the door in the morning. Yeah, everyone is

651
00:33:36,640 --> 00:33:41,360
Speaker 2: entering on that situation right with It's it's worth the

652
00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:45,520
Speaker 2: risk to have a gun that shoots through four people

653
00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:49,160
Speaker 2: in a crowded urban environment exactly.

654
00:33:49,240 --> 00:33:51,880
Speaker 1: And so this is the kind of shit he's reading

655
00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:54,680
Speaker 1: as a kid, Like the early precursors to a lot

656
00:33:54,720 --> 00:33:58,080
Speaker 1: of that is what Greg Bavino is the fact that like,

657
00:33:58,400 --> 00:34:00,720
Speaker 1: as like a nine or ten or eleven year old,

658
00:34:00,720 --> 00:34:04,200
Speaker 1: he's reading yes, something like because he was born in seventy,

659
00:34:04,280 --> 00:34:05,600
Speaker 1: so he would have been born like a couple of

660
00:34:05,640 --> 00:34:08,160
Speaker 1: years after this guy started writing for Shooting Times. So

661
00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:10,800
Speaker 1: from the time he's a little kid, he's reading stuff

662
00:34:10,840 --> 00:34:13,600
Speaker 1: like this, like he's almost patient zero for this, like

663
00:34:13,640 --> 00:34:16,919
Speaker 1: warrior cop ethos bullshit, like he may have been. He's

664
00:34:17,000 --> 00:34:20,040
Speaker 1: among the very first kids who got hit with this

665
00:34:20,080 --> 00:34:24,319
Speaker 1: stuff as a child, you know, he's not an earlier generation. Yeah,

666
00:34:24,400 --> 00:34:27,160
Speaker 1: right into the bloodstream and it just takes over as

667
00:34:27,160 --> 00:34:30,799
Speaker 1: far as we can tell. So Natalie's interview is the

668
00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:34,400
Speaker 1: only place I found reference to Bavino reading these magazines,

669
00:34:34,440 --> 00:34:36,000
Speaker 1: and every other piece on him lists as I said,

670
00:34:36,000 --> 00:34:38,000
Speaker 1: a very different, inciting incident for his interest in the

671
00:34:38,040 --> 00:34:40,879
Speaker 1: Border Patrol as a career. Here's how the Chicago Sun

672
00:34:40,920 --> 00:34:44,440
Speaker 1: Times describes it. Bavino has said that he was inspired

673
00:34:44,520 --> 00:34:46,400
Speaker 1: to join the Border Patrol when he saw a movie

674
00:34:46,440 --> 00:34:48,560
Speaker 1: called The Border that came out when he was just eleven,

675
00:34:48,760 --> 00:34:50,719
Speaker 1: produced by a distant cousin of his mom. It just

676
00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:53,840
Speaker 1: starred Jack Nicholson and Harvey kai Tell as agents, but

677
00:34:53,880 --> 00:34:56,319
Speaker 1: the end, Bvino was crestfallen that the movie portrayed the

678
00:34:56,360 --> 00:34:58,319
Speaker 1: agents as bad guys and said that he was moved

679
00:34:58,320 --> 00:35:00,799
Speaker 1: to join the Border Patrol in nineteen six ninety six

680
00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:03,480
Speaker 1: to show that he was the opposite a good border cop.

681
00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:06,879
Speaker 1: Making the border secure is my personal responsibility, Bavino said

682
00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:11,400
Speaker 1: on a podcast in twenty twenty one. And I wonder

683
00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:13,600
Speaker 1: is it that maybe he saw the movie and then

684
00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:16,680
Speaker 1: started reading the magazines. But his sisters describes the magazines

685
00:35:16,719 --> 00:35:18,359
Speaker 1: as kind of the first thing. So is it that

686
00:35:18,400 --> 00:35:21,200
Speaker 1: Bovino doesn't want to admit that, like, well, I read

687
00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:24,319
Speaker 1: some magazines by some Border Patrol guys and thinks that

688
00:35:24,719 --> 00:35:28,239
Speaker 1: because this is a more convenient right wing, modern right

689
00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:30,560
Speaker 1: wing narrative, right that, Like well, I saw the liberal

690
00:35:30,560 --> 00:35:33,160
Speaker 1: Hollywood movie about the Border Patrol, and I wanted to

691
00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:35,680
Speaker 1: prove him wrong, you know, which is kind of what

692
00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:36,520
Speaker 1: I suspect.

693
00:35:36,960 --> 00:35:39,480
Speaker 2: And it's like, you're instead of having to rely on

694
00:35:39,600 --> 00:35:42,879
Speaker 2: people wanting to learn more about Skeeter Skelton, you can

695
00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:45,319
Speaker 2: just br like it had Harvey Kaye Tell and Jack

696
00:35:45,360 --> 00:35:47,920
Speaker 2: Nicholson like that, those are names you've heard before. This

697
00:35:47,960 --> 00:35:50,200
Speaker 2: will stick in your brain. I don't have to say,

698
00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:54,000
Speaker 2: Skeeter correct those guys, rather than being like, well, have

699
00:35:54,080 --> 00:36:00,200
Speaker 2: you read the works of skied Skill? No? Yeah, that's

700
00:36:00,200 --> 00:36:01,319
Speaker 2: a name you just made up?

701
00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:05,000
Speaker 1: Man, Yes, it's not a real guy. So the idyllic

702
00:36:05,080 --> 00:36:07,839
Speaker 1: perfect part of Greg's childhood also ends the same year

703
00:36:07,880 --> 00:36:11,320
Speaker 1: the Border comes out. When he's eleven, his father drives

704
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:13,479
Speaker 1: home drunk one night from work. I'm sure it wasn't

705
00:36:13,480 --> 00:36:16,919
Speaker 1: the first night, can't have been right, and he winds

706
00:36:17,000 --> 00:36:19,840
Speaker 1: up crashing his truck directly into a car, killing a

707
00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:22,720
Speaker 1: young woman and brutally injuring her husband. They were twenty

708
00:36:22,719 --> 00:36:25,719
Speaker 1: six and twenty nine years old, respectively. It was a

709
00:36:26,200 --> 00:36:29,680
Speaker 1: bad crash. There was no sign that Bevino tried to

710
00:36:29,719 --> 00:36:32,479
Speaker 1: break before hitting the other car, which the local paper

711
00:36:32,560 --> 00:36:35,880
Speaker 1: described as bold. Over by the impact, Mike was unharmed.

712
00:36:36,239 --> 00:36:38,879
Speaker 1: The victim's husband sued the Bovenos and sued Mike's bar

713
00:36:39,280 --> 00:36:42,279
Speaker 1: and uncle. Ultimately, Mike pled guilty to a misdemeanor charge

714
00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:44,680
Speaker 1: of death by motor vehicle, but the judge in his

715
00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:46,920
Speaker 1: case ordered he'd be sent to state prison a treatment

716
00:36:46,960 --> 00:36:49,120
Speaker 1: for his alcoholism, and he stays there for four months.

717
00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:53,400
Speaker 1: There's an article written about him While he's in jail,

718
00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:56,000
Speaker 1: he tells the Charlotte Observer that he'd long struggled with

719
00:36:56,040 --> 00:36:57,719
Speaker 1: his drinking and that he'd gotten drunk the night of

720
00:36:57,719 --> 00:36:59,960
Speaker 1: the crash because his wife had begged him to quit

721
00:37:00,160 --> 00:37:02,640
Speaker 1: sauce and that had made him angry. He promised not

722
00:37:02,719 --> 00:37:04,680
Speaker 1: to do so again after getting out of jail, saying

723
00:37:04,719 --> 00:37:06,879
Speaker 1: I've got a dead woman on my hands. Getting dead

724
00:37:06,960 --> 00:37:09,759
Speaker 1: drunk just isn't worth it. I don't know how else

725
00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:12,200
Speaker 1: you frame that, but that's not the best way. Maybe

726
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:15,040
Speaker 1: I don't know. The lawsuit destroys this.

727
00:37:15,360 --> 00:37:17,759
Speaker 2: Clever bit of word play.

728
00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:19,799
Speaker 1: We need you kill the woman. Why are we doing

729
00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:21,200
Speaker 1: word play here?

730
00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:27,080
Speaker 2: We could just skip the fucking Hallmark poster And yeah,

731
00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:30,840
Speaker 2: I stopped drinking a horrible thing as a result of

732
00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:31,520
Speaker 2: my drinking.

733
00:37:31,840 --> 00:37:38,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a weird way to describe it. Yeah, yeah,

734
00:37:38,160 --> 00:37:40,360
Speaker 1: just I killed a woman would have been enough to say.

735
00:37:41,520 --> 00:37:44,680
Speaker 1: The lawsuit destroyed his business, obviously forcing him to sell it.

736
00:37:44,880 --> 00:37:47,600
Speaker 1: Betty decided she'd had enough and divorced him after this,

737
00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:50,560
Speaker 1: gaining soul custody of their three children. Mike left the

738
00:37:50,560 --> 00:37:53,600
Speaker 1: family and settled in New Mexico. Greg was fourteen when

739
00:37:53,640 --> 00:37:55,319
Speaker 1: his dad left so this takes a while. You have

740
00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:58,120
Speaker 1: to imagine this is a bad three years. And he

741
00:37:58,320 --> 00:38:01,399
Speaker 1: enters high school right around the same time divorce was finalized.

742
00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:04,840
Speaker 1: He was not recalled by his peers as an overly

743
00:38:04,920 --> 00:38:08,400
Speaker 1: memorable student, right, He's not someone who really makes a mark.

744
00:38:08,800 --> 00:38:10,560
Speaker 1: When he started it would talk a high school. He

745
00:38:10,640 --> 00:38:13,080
Speaker 1: joined the wrestling team. And if you have seen photos

746
00:38:13,080 --> 00:38:18,400
Speaker 1: of Greg around other people, he's not a large man, right, No, man,

747
00:38:18,719 --> 00:38:22,080
Speaker 1: he's he's a smaller fella, right. And height isn't everything.

748
00:38:22,120 --> 00:38:24,640
Speaker 1: There's weight a classes and stuff. It's not everything. And

749
00:38:24,680 --> 00:38:25,440
Speaker 1: wrestling it's.

750
00:38:25,320 --> 00:38:26,800
Speaker 2: Great for wrestling to be small.

751
00:38:26,920 --> 00:38:30,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, it can, it can be handy. But he's also,

752
00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:33,400
Speaker 1: even in that world, kind of small, right, And he

753
00:38:33,440 --> 00:38:35,759
Speaker 1: doesn't seem to have developed in other ways to compensate

754
00:38:35,800 --> 00:38:37,600
Speaker 1: for that. And everyone who talks about his time in

755
00:38:37,600 --> 00:38:39,719
Speaker 1: wrestling is very polite about this, but he was not

756
00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:43,040
Speaker 1: good at it. Sometimes people actually talk to his old

757
00:38:43,120 --> 00:38:46,719
Speaker 1: high school coach, who it seems like a very nice

758
00:38:46,760 --> 00:38:48,880
Speaker 1: man because when they bring up was he good, he's like, well,

759
00:38:49,200 --> 00:38:51,000
Speaker 1: when he was, you know, he wasn't the biggest boy.

760
00:38:51,320 --> 00:38:54,360
Speaker 1: He wasn't the biggest guy. But at the end of

761
00:38:54,600 --> 00:38:57,640
Speaker 1: his senior year, he got the Most Improved award, which

762
00:38:57,680 --> 00:39:00,560
Speaker 1: is something even though the team had an unusually tear season,

763
00:39:01,120 --> 00:39:03,759
Speaker 1: which is a very sweet way to try to describe

764
00:39:03,800 --> 00:39:04,359
Speaker 1: this boy.

765
00:39:05,040 --> 00:39:08,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, our team got so shitty that he was actually

766
00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:10,520
Speaker 2: like kind of par for the course for our tea.

767
00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:12,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's kind of what he's saying.

768
00:39:14,120 --> 00:39:18,720
Speaker 2: How I am just curious, now that you've researched three

769
00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:23,720
Speaker 2: thousand of the worst people to ever live, how common

770
00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:28,719
Speaker 2: is the like not remembered versus like, oh yeah, I

771
00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:30,120
Speaker 2: remember that shit ahead.

772
00:39:30,160 --> 00:39:33,400
Speaker 1: Like mostly you know, generally, when we come across a

773
00:39:33,440 --> 00:39:36,000
Speaker 1: guy who there's not much about their childhood or background,

774
00:39:36,000 --> 00:39:38,000
Speaker 1: it's because they were like some weird con person the

775
00:39:38,040 --> 00:39:40,160
Speaker 1: eighteen hundreds, and it's like they just hopped onto the

776
00:39:40,239 --> 00:39:42,319
Speaker 1: historic record when they were thirty and we don't know

777
00:39:42,360 --> 00:39:45,839
Speaker 1: what the fuck was going on previously. Yeah, or it's

778
00:39:45,840 --> 00:39:48,879
Speaker 1: someone who's such a minor weirdo or creep that there's

779
00:39:48,960 --> 00:39:51,440
Speaker 1: just not a lot, you know, no one, no major

780
00:39:51,520 --> 00:39:54,120
Speaker 1: you know, they haven't been covered by a major newspaper,

781
00:39:54,239 --> 00:39:57,200
Speaker 1: no one's dug into them that much. With someone like Greg,

782
00:39:57,280 --> 00:40:00,080
Speaker 1: this is it's not common. They have this little We

783
00:40:00,520 --> 00:40:03,200
Speaker 1: actually talked to a bunch of their classmates in Peers.

784
00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:04,040
Speaker 1: That's the weird thing.

785
00:40:04,200 --> 00:40:06,640
Speaker 4: The one thing that we that we typically come across

786
00:40:06,680 --> 00:40:09,760
Speaker 4: that's like a common commonality is like somebody who has

787
00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:13,680
Speaker 4: crazy ambition, and that's what people remember. Yeah, I'm not

788
00:40:13,880 --> 00:40:16,000
Speaker 4: I'm not hearing that here for Greg at all.

789
00:40:16,120 --> 00:40:18,960
Speaker 1: Nobody says that about about because that's.

790
00:40:18,600 --> 00:40:21,880
Speaker 4: Like that that is a very common bastard tradi is

791
00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:25,319
Speaker 4: that they had way too much ambition at an early

792
00:40:25,360 --> 00:40:29,000
Speaker 4: age and then they, you know, become like Jeff Bezos

793
00:40:29,080 --> 00:40:29,799
Speaker 4: or whatever.

794
00:40:29,719 --> 00:40:33,160
Speaker 2: They were like, Yeah, yeah, he was voted person least

795
00:40:33,400 --> 00:40:36,640
Speaker 2: likely for you to be asking this question about them

796
00:40:37,160 --> 00:40:40,080
Speaker 2: because he thought he wasn't gonna do ship.

797
00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:42,719
Speaker 1: Because Greg, seriously, Greg.

798
00:40:42,600 --> 00:40:48,840
Speaker 2: Gregg, Well, first of all, Greg, Greg, Yeah, did.

799
00:40:48,719 --> 00:40:52,960
Speaker 1: You realize his named Greg? Sorry, the Greg's out there.

800
00:40:52,960 --> 00:40:54,760
Speaker 1: I just it's hard to It's not even an insult.

801
00:40:54,760 --> 00:40:56,759
Speaker 1: It's just hard to imagine a Greg being like the

802
00:40:57,280 --> 00:40:57,960
Speaker 1: mouthpiece of a.

803
00:40:58,000 --> 00:41:01,080
Speaker 4: Fashion I do literally have a cousin and he is delightful.

804
00:41:01,120 --> 00:41:02,920
Speaker 4: Cousin Greg, if you're listening to this, I love you,

805
00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:03,560
Speaker 4: cousin Greg.

806
00:41:03,600 --> 00:41:05,799
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'd have trouble imagining your cousin Greg is the

807
00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:07,320
Speaker 1: mouthpiece of a fascist regime.

808
00:41:07,400 --> 00:41:10,719
Speaker 2: You know, we literally all cousin Greg. They're all great,

809
00:41:10,840 --> 00:41:13,880
Speaker 2: My cousin Greg rocks except Greg. Bavino's cousin has a

810
00:41:13,920 --> 00:41:15,479
Speaker 2: cousin Greg. Not so great.

811
00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:16,240
Speaker 3: Not so great.

812
00:41:16,960 --> 00:41:20,239
Speaker 1: Yeah, So Greg's coach said this about him. Quote. Greg

813
00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:23,240
Speaker 1: was not bashful, He had no problems asking the coach questions,

814
00:41:23,520 --> 00:41:26,040
Speaker 1: and you know, he liked to tell stories, funny stories.

815
00:41:26,920 --> 00:41:30,399
Speaker 1: He also expressed when these reporters ask him a lot

816
00:41:30,400 --> 00:41:33,279
Speaker 1: of surprise that he went into law enforcement. And he

817
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:35,399
Speaker 1: says so in a way. I love this. The coach

818
00:41:35,440 --> 00:41:39,240
Speaker 1: says this in a way that makes me think, like, oh,

819
00:41:39,400 --> 00:41:42,200
Speaker 1: I think this coach might not like the police very much.

820
00:41:42,480 --> 00:41:42,920
Speaker 2: Quote.

821
00:41:43,120 --> 00:41:45,439
Speaker 1: That was a real surprise. I just didn't picture Greg

822
00:41:45,480 --> 00:41:47,719
Speaker 1: being in law enforcement. He was always very pleasant and

823
00:41:47,760 --> 00:41:49,839
Speaker 1: I didn't see him as that. That to me didn't

824
00:41:49,840 --> 00:41:57,239
Speaker 1: seem to fit his personality. It wasn't did beg him

825
00:41:57,239 --> 00:41:58,200
Speaker 1: for a huge asshole.

826
00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:01,279
Speaker 2: He turned into a piece.

827
00:42:01,840 --> 00:42:05,520
Speaker 1: He was that kind of pricks coach.

828
00:42:06,160 --> 00:42:10,960
Speaker 2: I love it, cool guy, when you go back like

829
00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:13,760
Speaker 2: it's it's also interesting when they don't have anything interesting

830
00:42:13,760 --> 00:42:15,759
Speaker 2: to say, because, like I do feel like most of

831
00:42:15,800 --> 00:42:19,520
Speaker 2: the time when you're asking a normal person about like

832
00:42:20,320 --> 00:42:23,960
Speaker 2: that they'll have made up a memory about them. Yeah,

833
00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:27,120
Speaker 2: you know, because just to be interesting at like dinner parties.

834
00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:29,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, I remember he never stopped reading that book about

835
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:33,640
Speaker 1: Ryan hard Heidrich. Just love the guy like something, you know. Yeah,

836
00:42:33,640 --> 00:42:36,080
Speaker 1: but no, there's very other other than his sister being

837
00:42:36,160 --> 00:42:39,040
Speaker 1: like he read Skeeter he read.

838
00:42:39,600 --> 00:42:41,600
Speaker 2: And his coach being like, I didn't think he was

839
00:42:41,680 --> 00:42:44,480
Speaker 2: a big enough asshole to be aoud be a copy.

840
00:42:44,560 --> 00:42:49,839
Speaker 1: Yeah. Jason Perry, his wrestling teammate, also expressed surprise at

841
00:42:49,880 --> 00:42:52,600
Speaker 1: what had become of Bovino. He described Gregan's school as

842
00:42:52,760 --> 00:42:54,840
Speaker 1: very polite and added, I don't think Greg would not

843
00:42:54,920 --> 00:42:57,160
Speaker 1: do his job, and like, if they're asking him to

844
00:42:57,160 --> 00:42:59,440
Speaker 1: do something that's not fair to minorities, I'm sure he's

845
00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:01,800
Speaker 1: hating it. This is kind of a Bible Belt community,

846
00:43:01,840 --> 00:43:03,839
Speaker 1: so I know Greg was exposed to compassion and love

847
00:43:03,880 --> 00:43:06,239
Speaker 1: for his fellow man, but it's dangerous to speculate what

848
00:43:06,320 --> 00:43:08,560
Speaker 1: a man is thinking. I hope whatever happens, I hope

849
00:43:08,560 --> 00:43:10,200
Speaker 1: it works out good for him and his family and

850
00:43:10,239 --> 00:43:14,160
Speaker 1: the people that are being mistreated. You know, is such

851
00:43:14,160 --> 00:43:16,400
Speaker 1: a middle of the road thing. I hope both the

852
00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:19,080
Speaker 1: guy hurting people and the hurt people are get better.

853
00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:23,200
Speaker 2: Okay, it's crazy because I know he's aware of compassion,

854
00:43:23,320 --> 00:43:24,319
Speaker 2: like he's heard of it.

855
00:43:24,560 --> 00:43:27,160
Speaker 1: Like, yeah, he's aware. He's not supposed to He must

856
00:43:27,200 --> 00:43:29,440
Speaker 1: not like what he's doing because he's not supposed to

857
00:43:29,440 --> 00:43:34,239
Speaker 1: act this way he has heard of Yeah, I know

858
00:43:34,280 --> 00:43:37,400
Speaker 1: he's not supposed to be doing this shit. Yeah yeah. Now,

859
00:43:37,600 --> 00:43:39,640
Speaker 1: if you spend any amount of time looking this guy

860
00:43:39,719 --> 00:43:41,839
Speaker 1: up on social media, you'll run into some claims made

861
00:43:41,840 --> 00:43:44,480
Speaker 1: by a purported former classmate of his on Reddit that

862
00:43:44,520 --> 00:43:47,160
Speaker 1: are much more negative than the recollections gathered by The

863
00:43:47,200 --> 00:43:50,960
Speaker 1: Sun Times. It opens with the opie head bar nine

864
00:43:51,040 --> 00:43:53,600
Speaker 1: three one six writing, I just found out I know

865
00:43:53,640 --> 00:43:55,879
Speaker 1: Greg Bovito personally. Here are some things you can tell

866
00:43:55,920 --> 00:43:58,640
Speaker 1: him when you next see him, And the poster claims

867
00:43:58,640 --> 00:44:00,960
Speaker 1: that he's a current Minneapolis president who used to live

868
00:44:01,000 --> 00:44:03,520
Speaker 1: in Boone, North Carolina, near where Bvino grew up, and

869
00:44:03,520 --> 00:44:05,439
Speaker 1: that they went to the same school, and he posted

870
00:44:05,440 --> 00:44:07,160
Speaker 1: a clip from a yearbook with a picture of Bevino

871
00:44:07,239 --> 00:44:09,879
Speaker 1: on the wrestling team as evidence that said a bunch

872
00:44:09,880 --> 00:44:13,880
Speaker 1: of these pictures are floating around, not guaranteed that that

873
00:44:14,040 --> 00:44:15,960
Speaker 1: means he actually went to school with this guy, and

874
00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:18,160
Speaker 1: then he provides a bunch of suggestions for things that

875
00:44:18,200 --> 00:44:22,000
Speaker 1: protesters should say to Bovino. Hey, Greg, you're the reason

876
00:44:22,040 --> 00:44:24,239
Speaker 1: your dad got drunk and killed that woman in Blowing Rock,

877
00:44:24,239 --> 00:44:27,279
Speaker 1: which led to your parents' divorce. And I don't think

878
00:44:27,320 --> 00:44:31,360
Speaker 1: that that's necessarily accurate. I think his dad killing someone

879
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:34,360
Speaker 1: and bankrupting the family is probably enough of a reason.

880
00:44:34,520 --> 00:44:36,000
Speaker 1: That might be a bit of a dick move, but

881
00:44:36,040 --> 00:44:37,799
Speaker 1: I think we're just being an asshole to this guy.

882
00:44:38,280 --> 00:44:41,719
Speaker 1: That doesn't really expand our knowledge about Greg though, Right,

883
00:44:42,000 --> 00:44:43,960
Speaker 1: so let's move on to the next one. Hey, Greg,

884
00:44:43,960 --> 00:44:45,880
Speaker 1: do you think it's weird that the Wataga High yearbook

885
00:44:45,880 --> 00:44:47,680
Speaker 1: has you listened as most likely to shit his pants

886
00:44:47,719 --> 00:44:52,400
Speaker 1: in public? Now they don't seen this yearbook. That's a

887
00:44:52,480 --> 00:44:56,000
Speaker 1: nice burn. But also yearbooks don't do that. That's not

888
00:44:56,080 --> 00:44:59,520
Speaker 1: a thing. Like no public school yearbooks not are you

889
00:44:59,600 --> 00:45:00,319
Speaker 1: someon go.

890
00:45:00,280 --> 00:45:02,240
Speaker 2: To jail in the South?

891
00:45:02,920 --> 00:45:05,400
Speaker 1: In public school, You're not allowed to do that for

892
00:45:05,440 --> 00:45:08,359
Speaker 1: a lot of reasons. It's abusive to the students. Again,

893
00:45:08,400 --> 00:45:12,840
Speaker 1: he would have been eighteen, Like, hey, Greg, your history

894
00:45:12,880 --> 00:45:15,239
Speaker 1: teacher thinks that you're a pathetic Nazi punk. No wonder

895
00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:17,560
Speaker 1: you failed all his classes. This doesn't seem to be

896
00:45:17,560 --> 00:45:19,879
Speaker 1: accurate based on again it's a burn, But I don't

897
00:45:19,920 --> 00:45:22,440
Speaker 1: think it's true because I think his grades were decent.

898
00:45:22,920 --> 00:45:24,960
Speaker 1: At least it sounds like that I could. I can

899
00:45:25,000 --> 00:45:27,319
Speaker 1: believe some of his teachers hate him now, but I

900
00:45:27,400 --> 00:45:29,360
Speaker 1: just I don't think he actually did fail all of

901
00:45:29,400 --> 00:45:31,799
Speaker 1: his classes. I haven't found the evidence of that. So

902
00:45:31,960 --> 00:45:34,719
Speaker 1: another extal allegation is that a local store banned him

903
00:45:34,719 --> 00:45:37,680
Speaker 1: for sniffing shoes after people tried them on. Don't have

904
00:45:37,680 --> 00:45:39,399
Speaker 1: anything about that, one way or the other.

905
00:45:39,800 --> 00:45:43,160
Speaker 2: Right, it's a good one. Now we're getting too like

906
00:45:43,400 --> 00:45:48,400
Speaker 2: pretty good lies to tell about someone. Yeah, kind of

907
00:45:48,440 --> 00:45:53,279
Speaker 2: weird and specific enough, like having invented Splitsville. It's like, no, yeah,

908
00:45:53,320 --> 00:45:55,640
Speaker 2: he had to be from pay less shoes.

909
00:45:58,120 --> 00:46:02,359
Speaker 1: The last one is really specific and again not when

910
00:46:02,400 --> 00:46:04,759
Speaker 1: we can back up in any way, Hey, Greg, do

911
00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:08,720
Speaker 1: you remember eating that the Wataga Pioneers wrestling team's soggy biscuit?

912
00:46:08,800 --> 00:46:11,200
Speaker 1: Is it still gay to eat stemen off of Bojangles biscuit?

913
00:46:11,280 --> 00:46:12,560
Speaker 1: Or was that just an eighties thing?

914
00:46:13,280 --> 00:46:13,560
Speaker 2: Now?

915
00:46:14,080 --> 00:46:17,000
Speaker 1: Again, first off, he was born in seventies, so he

916
00:46:17,040 --> 00:46:21,680
Speaker 1: wouldn't have been I mean, yeah, yeah, that could that

917
00:46:21,719 --> 00:46:24,960
Speaker 1: works out. I guess, yeah, yeah, that does work out.

918
00:46:25,000 --> 00:46:29,200
Speaker 1: The timing works out. The Bojangles biscuits make sense. That said,

919
00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:31,239
Speaker 1: I can't back up the rest of this, and there's

920
00:46:31,400 --> 00:46:34,120
Speaker 1: enough wrong with the previous parts of this that I

921
00:46:34,160 --> 00:46:35,839
Speaker 1: maybe this is someone who went to school with him

922
00:46:35,880 --> 00:46:38,200
Speaker 1: and is just like throw it out shit because they

923
00:46:38,239 --> 00:46:41,520
Speaker 1: didn't like him. You know, maybe he did sniff shoes

924
00:46:41,560 --> 00:46:44,640
Speaker 1: in a local shoe store. I can't prove it, but

925
00:46:44,680 --> 00:46:46,680
Speaker 1: there's no evidence. People are gonna bring this up because

926
00:46:46,680 --> 00:46:49,600
Speaker 1: it went crazy viral. I can't back any of this up,

927
00:46:49,719 --> 00:46:51,160
Speaker 1: and there's nothing here.

928
00:46:51,920 --> 00:46:53,759
Speaker 2: I feel like we can confirm both of those things

929
00:46:53,840 --> 00:46:58,720
Speaker 2: happened in that guy whoever in the post. Yeah, yeah,

930
00:46:58,760 --> 00:47:01,319
Speaker 2: and like he's just like spific because those are like

931
00:47:01,440 --> 00:47:05,279
Speaker 2: good and specific weird, Like, yeah, those are real. He's

932
00:47:05,320 --> 00:47:07,400
Speaker 2: probably just taking those and being like these having a

933
00:47:07,440 --> 00:47:08,479
Speaker 2: Greg Bovino And.

934
00:47:08,600 --> 00:47:10,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, I believe some guy did those things.

935
00:47:11,040 --> 00:47:12,000
Speaker 2: Yeah for sure.

936
00:47:12,760 --> 00:47:15,080
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, again, maybe, but I can't I can't

937
00:47:15,080 --> 00:47:17,160
Speaker 1: prove it, and I can't find any specific reason to

938
00:47:17,160 --> 00:47:19,920
Speaker 1: believe that this post that people are sharing around is real.

939
00:47:20,480 --> 00:47:23,000
Speaker 1: Uh boy, if anyone can prove that Greg Bovino got

940
00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:25,279
Speaker 1: banned from a store for sniff and shoes. Let's have it.

941
00:47:25,360 --> 00:47:28,640
Speaker 1: But nobody else seems to be sharing this yet great,

942
00:47:28,800 --> 00:47:32,120
Speaker 1: some cub reporter go down to boone figure this out

943
00:47:32,920 --> 00:47:34,720
Speaker 1: break the mystery.

944
00:47:35,160 --> 00:47:39,719
Speaker 2: So just looking through microfiche looking for sho.

945
00:47:39,760 --> 00:47:44,000
Speaker 1: Sniffing microfiche in the basement of the shoe store. It's

946
00:47:44,000 --> 00:47:46,879
Speaker 1: all just shoe store related articles, all right.

947
00:47:47,080 --> 00:47:51,160
Speaker 2: So I'm gonna come clean here and say, I like

948
00:47:51,280 --> 00:47:52,920
Speaker 2: the smell of new shoes.

949
00:47:54,760 --> 00:47:55,200
Speaker 1: What is it?

950
00:47:56,080 --> 00:47:59,320
Speaker 2: So if you're smelling, if you're at a shoe store,

951
00:48:00,239 --> 00:48:05,120
Speaker 2: wait to finish on shoes, right, So are you taking

952
00:48:05,239 --> 00:48:08,640
Speaker 2: their shoes while they're they're existing shoes while they're trying

953
00:48:08,640 --> 00:48:10,040
Speaker 2: them on? Because yeah, that's you.

954
00:48:09,960 --> 00:48:12,440
Speaker 1: Can see how you'd shoot this in a TV show,

955
00:48:12,640 --> 00:48:15,120
Speaker 1: right where like you have you have somebody putting on

956
00:48:15,200 --> 00:48:17,120
Speaker 1: take off the shoe, put it up, and then you

957
00:48:17,120 --> 00:48:20,000
Speaker 1: have like, oh, Greg sneak around the corner check see

958
00:48:20,040 --> 00:48:24,640
Speaker 1: that the coast is clear to the shoom.

959
00:48:25,200 --> 00:48:28,240
Speaker 2: I think new shoe, new tennis, ball, and new car

960
00:48:28,520 --> 00:48:33,719
Speaker 2: are underrated, like synthetic chemical smells that I enjoy, Like

961
00:48:33,880 --> 00:48:38,200
Speaker 2: I will I will pair of sneakers that I just

962
00:48:38,360 --> 00:48:40,919
Speaker 2: opened the box on and take a nice deep deep

963
00:48:40,960 --> 00:48:43,320
Speaker 2: huff and I, okay, should I be banned?

964
00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:44,640
Speaker 1: Yes, for.

965
00:48:47,680 --> 00:48:54,040
Speaker 2: Nobody's worn them yet, I don't know. Shoe sniffer, A

966
00:48:54,080 --> 00:48:56,440
Speaker 2: new shoe sniffer, brand new shoes.

967
00:48:56,640 --> 00:49:01,279
Speaker 1: Brand new. Come on now, all right, So that's that's

968
00:49:01,640 --> 00:49:03,440
Speaker 1: the myth about Greg Devino that I had.

969
00:49:03,760 --> 00:49:04,120
Speaker 2: I don't know.

970
00:49:04,239 --> 00:49:06,480
Speaker 1: It's not even busting, it's just pointing out I've seen

971
00:49:06,480 --> 00:49:10,080
Speaker 1: this going around. This doesn't directly comport with anything else

972
00:49:10,239 --> 00:49:12,600
Speaker 1: that's independent, and I have no specific reason to believe

973
00:49:12,640 --> 00:49:17,799
Speaker 1: this is all true. So anyway, His sister describes him

974
00:49:17,840 --> 00:49:19,640
Speaker 1: as a voracious reader in high school, and I've seen

975
00:49:19,680 --> 00:49:22,280
Speaker 1: a few other accounts that match this. He liked military

976
00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:25,440
Speaker 1: history and cowboy novels, particularly the work of Louis Lamore,

977
00:49:25,719 --> 00:49:28,760
Speaker 1: and his favorite book was probably Robert Heinland Starship Troopers.

978
00:49:28,880 --> 00:49:31,759
Speaker 1: Surprising no one. His sister told The Daily Mail that

979
00:49:31,800 --> 00:49:36,880
Speaker 1: he reads Starship Troopers once a year, which completely makes sense. Yeah,

980
00:49:37,040 --> 00:49:40,520
Speaker 1: oh man, yeah, and I get so did I back

981
00:49:40,560 --> 00:49:41,000
Speaker 1: in the day.

982
00:49:41,080 --> 00:49:45,080
Speaker 2: But no, wait, I know the movie is satirical. Is

983
00:49:45,120 --> 00:49:46,080
Speaker 2: the book also?

984
00:49:46,640 --> 00:49:49,799
Speaker 1: No, not at all. So Robert Robert Heinland was an

985
00:49:49,840 --> 00:49:54,040
Speaker 1: interesting guy, a very influential science fiction writer. One of

986
00:49:54,040 --> 00:49:56,600
Speaker 1: his books, The Moon's a Harsh Mistress, is often seen

987
00:49:56,680 --> 00:49:59,600
Speaker 1: as providing a lot of the ideological underpending for the

988
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:04,960
Speaker 1: libertarian movement. Right Like, it's a foundational text for American libertarianism. Yeah,

989
00:50:06,960 --> 00:50:10,239
Speaker 1: by the way, I said influential. I said influential. That's

990
00:50:10,320 --> 00:50:13,279
Speaker 1: that's not a value term. And he's a guy he

991
00:50:13,320 --> 00:50:15,120
Speaker 1: started out as a socialist and then he had his

992
00:50:15,239 --> 00:50:18,280
Speaker 1: like weird super reactionary right wing like John Bircher period,

993
00:50:18,280 --> 00:50:19,560
Speaker 1: and then he became kind of more of like a

994
00:50:19,880 --> 00:50:23,879
Speaker 1: normal libertarian sort of deal. But Starship Troopers was It's

995
00:50:24,120 --> 00:50:26,520
Speaker 1: it's often seen as a fascist novel, and that's certainly

996
00:50:26,520 --> 00:50:28,400
Speaker 1: a very valid reading of it. There's a lot of

997
00:50:28,400 --> 00:50:31,080
Speaker 1: it that reads very fasci It's also, if you understand

998
00:50:31,080 --> 00:50:33,319
Speaker 1: Heinland's life, there's a lot of it that's like, oh, yeah,

999
00:50:33,320 --> 00:50:36,279
Speaker 1: you were a guy who like joined up during World

1000
00:50:36,360 --> 00:50:39,320
Speaker 1: War Two and served in the military during that period

1001
00:50:39,320 --> 00:50:41,239
Speaker 1: of time. Of course you have a very positive view

1002
00:50:41,280 --> 00:50:43,360
Speaker 1: on what the state and the military could do together,

1003
00:50:43,800 --> 00:50:45,680
Speaker 1: right Like, there's also a bit of that in it

1004
00:50:45,719 --> 00:50:47,719
Speaker 1: where it's like, well, you just feel there's some like

1005
00:50:47,840 --> 00:50:51,120
Speaker 1: nostalgia towards that period of time too. In this but

1006
00:50:51,800 --> 00:50:54,600
Speaker 1: it is. It is a book about no Literally, the

1007
00:50:54,640 --> 00:50:57,640
Speaker 1: best type of government would be the military runs everything right.

1008
00:50:59,440 --> 00:51:02,000
Speaker 1: So I can see why Greg Bavino is attached to

1009
00:51:02,040 --> 00:51:04,560
Speaker 1: this book as a kid, especially without any of these

1010
00:51:04,600 --> 00:51:09,160
Speaker 1: slight mitigating factors in Island's own life. And Heinland pretty

1011
00:51:09,200 --> 00:51:11,680
Speaker 1: racist guy. I'm not that interested in mitigating it. I'm

1012
00:51:11,719 --> 00:51:13,279
Speaker 1: just saying there's a little bit more there than there

1013
00:51:13,280 --> 00:51:16,080
Speaker 1: would be with a guy like Baveno. So once he

1014
00:51:16,160 --> 00:51:19,239
Speaker 1: graduates high school in nineteen eighty eight, Baveno went to

1015
00:51:19,280 --> 00:51:23,439
Speaker 1: Western Carolina University, where he studied natural research conservation before

1016
00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:26,040
Speaker 1: becoming the first member of his family to graduate college.

1017
00:51:26,280 --> 00:51:28,919
Speaker 1: He then joined the Border Patrol in nineteen ninety six.

1018
00:51:29,360 --> 00:51:32,359
Speaker 1: He graduated as part of class three hundred and twenty five.

1019
00:51:32,760 --> 00:51:35,239
Speaker 1: One of his classmates, Jason Owens, would wind up his

1020
00:51:35,320 --> 00:51:38,279
Speaker 1: head of Border Patrol. The two have podcasted together per

1021
00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:40,400
Speaker 1: The Sun Times with Jack you know is the strongest

1022
00:51:40,400 --> 00:51:44,200
Speaker 1: bond that two people can share. During their their podcast together,

1023
00:51:44,239 --> 00:51:47,080
Speaker 1: Baveno claims Owens had better grades and graduated at the

1024
00:51:47,120 --> 00:51:48,960
Speaker 1: top of the class, but that he was better at

1025
00:51:49,000 --> 00:51:51,600
Speaker 1: pe and marksmanship, and he makes this claim a lot

1026
00:51:51,600 --> 00:51:53,920
Speaker 1: that he was the best shot in the border patrol. Basically,

1027
00:51:54,080 --> 00:51:56,640
Speaker 1: I haven't seen independent confirmation of this. Seems like he

1028
00:51:56,719 --> 00:51:58,799
Speaker 1: might be kind of just jazzing himself up a little bit.

1029
00:51:59,400 --> 00:52:03,560
Speaker 1: But pretty easy claim to make, Pretty easy for you

1030
00:52:03,600 --> 00:52:03,919
Speaker 1: to make.

1031
00:52:04,560 --> 00:52:07,160
Speaker 2: Rarely do people be like, all right, that's it, let's

1032
00:52:07,200 --> 00:52:08,919
Speaker 2: go to a range together, right now.

1033
00:52:09,000 --> 00:52:11,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, yeah, you got used. Usually like at

1034
00:52:11,160 --> 00:52:13,920
Speaker 1: least an hour long thing to set up, you know.

1035
00:52:15,200 --> 00:52:17,960
Speaker 1: He starts working at the famous El Centro sector, which

1036
00:52:18,000 --> 00:52:20,400
Speaker 1: is on the border of California, not far from what

1037
00:52:20,440 --> 00:52:22,600
Speaker 1: he where he'd been born, but across the country from

1038
00:52:22,600 --> 00:52:26,560
Speaker 1: his home. For the Sun Times quote, Bavino told Owens

1039
00:52:26,640 --> 00:52:28,600
Speaker 1: later that he was impressed when the sector chief showed

1040
00:52:28,680 --> 00:52:31,000
Speaker 1: up in the field alongside the agents. Bavino said it

1041
00:52:31,040 --> 00:52:33,560
Speaker 1: showed him the need to get into the fight. It's

1042
00:52:33,560 --> 00:52:37,560
Speaker 1: not a fight. It's a bunch of hungry people walking

1043
00:52:37,600 --> 00:52:42,239
Speaker 1: across the desert, not a fight. Not a battle. Seeing

1044
00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:43,760
Speaker 1: a couple of battles, they don't look.

1045
00:52:43,680 --> 00:52:45,680
Speaker 2: Like that enemy bugs out there.

1046
00:52:46,200 --> 00:52:49,200
Speaker 1: I mean, there are hungry people stumbling around battlefields, but

1047
00:52:49,239 --> 00:52:50,799
Speaker 1: you don't look at them and go, ah, the fight.

1048
00:52:51,080 --> 00:52:52,960
Speaker 1: You look at them and go that guy's starving. To

1049
00:52:53,040 --> 00:52:55,400
Speaker 1: death because he hasn't eaten in three weeks.

1050
00:52:56,480 --> 00:53:00,920
Speaker 2: Non combatants, we'll call them for bat is good to

1051
00:53:00,960 --> 00:53:03,120
Speaker 2: see though, if they got any weapons.

1052
00:53:02,719 --> 00:53:05,279
Speaker 1: They might get into the fight. Yeah, that's right. So

1053
00:53:06,280 --> 00:53:08,360
Speaker 1: he was promoted steadily over the years and wound up

1054
00:53:08,360 --> 00:53:10,759
Speaker 1: transferred to Washington, where he got a master's degree in

1055
00:53:10,880 --> 00:53:13,879
Speaker 1: national security at the National War College, and then New

1056
00:53:14,000 --> 00:53:17,000
Speaker 1: Orleans where he led a sector. In twenty twenty, he

1057
00:53:17,080 --> 00:53:19,600
Speaker 1: was sent back to El Centro as a commander. He

1058
00:53:19,640 --> 00:53:22,200
Speaker 1: also spent some time in tactical units. Per his sister,

1059
00:53:22,239 --> 00:53:25,479
Speaker 1: who makes this dubious claim, early in his career, Greg

1060
00:53:25,480 --> 00:53:27,360
Speaker 1: would run into cartels and be the first one in

1061
00:53:27,400 --> 00:53:29,320
Speaker 1: the door because he had the best marksmanship. There you

1062
00:53:29,360 --> 00:53:31,319
Speaker 1: see that claim again. A lot of times it was

1063
00:53:31,360 --> 00:53:33,959
Speaker 1: drug cartel base, which he said is now infiltrated every

1064
00:53:33,960 --> 00:53:36,520
Speaker 1: major city with the crime and corruption. And again, I

1065
00:53:36,560 --> 00:53:39,240
Speaker 1: don't think Natalie knows all that much about this stuff.

1066
00:53:39,560 --> 00:53:39,680
Speaker 2: Now.

1067
00:53:39,800 --> 00:53:41,640
Speaker 1: I think her big brother just told her this and

1068
00:53:41,719 --> 00:53:43,120
Speaker 1: she's like, that's the way it's got to be.

1069
00:53:43,800 --> 00:53:45,880
Speaker 2: By the way, if you talk to the sun or

1070
00:53:46,080 --> 00:53:51,160
Speaker 2: like sister, or you know, children of any law enforcement

1071
00:53:51,200 --> 00:53:55,959
Speaker 2: officer who are gullible enough, this is the same first

1072
00:53:55,960 --> 00:53:58,880
Speaker 2: person in You guys don't know how dangerous it is

1073
00:53:58,880 --> 00:54:04,680
Speaker 2: out Yeah the door. Their dad is actually secretly the

1074
00:54:04,840 --> 00:54:05,960
Speaker 2: sickest marksman.

1075
00:54:06,320 --> 00:54:07,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's the best for the gun.

1076
00:54:07,719 --> 00:54:13,200
Speaker 2: Like it's crazy. They thought, ye how yeah, yeah, that's amazing,

1077
00:54:13,400 --> 00:54:15,640
Speaker 2: but it's great. You you know, it's a certain type

1078
00:54:15,680 --> 00:54:19,880
Speaker 2: of person who lies about stuff to their sister, right.

1079
00:54:19,760 --> 00:54:22,600
Speaker 1: Because I haven't found this claim repeated elsewhere, clearly not

1080
00:54:22,640 --> 00:54:25,239
Speaker 1: anywhere credible, but we do have documentation of his career

1081
00:54:25,280 --> 00:54:28,320
Speaker 1: running El Centro, where he oversaw about eleven hundred employees.

1082
00:54:28,680 --> 00:54:31,880
Speaker 1: Critics say that under Boveno's leadership, BP employees were violent

1083
00:54:31,920 --> 00:54:34,400
Speaker 1: and cruel towards migrants. The acl you accused one of

1084
00:54:34,400 --> 00:54:37,399
Speaker 1: his agents of assaulting a Salvadoran migrant in twenty twenty two,

1085
00:54:37,719 --> 00:54:40,000
Speaker 1: separating her from their ten year old child for nearly

1086
00:54:40,040 --> 00:54:43,080
Speaker 1: a year after presumably she was beaten. The woman was

1087
00:54:43,200 --> 00:54:45,520
Speaker 1: charged with assaulting an agent in detention, and then the

1088
00:54:45,600 --> 00:54:49,360
Speaker 1: charges were dropped. The Suntimes quotes Monica Lungerica, a senior

1089
00:54:49,400 --> 00:54:52,040
Speaker 1: attorney for the Center for Immigration Law and Policy, as saying,

1090
00:54:52,239 --> 00:54:54,520
Speaker 1: I think it was a prosecution that sought to silence her,

1091
00:54:54,520 --> 00:54:57,080
Speaker 1: stop her from speaking out about the assault that she experienced.

1092
00:54:57,239 --> 00:54:59,000
Speaker 1: We've seen it here at the border for a very

1093
00:54:59,040 --> 00:55:01,840
Speaker 1: long time, and obviously, you know, Bavino has taken that

1094
00:55:01,880 --> 00:55:04,280
Speaker 1: show on the road. And I bring this up because

1095
00:55:04,280 --> 00:55:06,960
Speaker 1: you can see this exact pattern and the rest of

1096
00:55:07,000 --> 00:55:11,000
Speaker 1: it in his most recent chunk of his career, right, yeah, right, where.

1097
00:55:10,840 --> 00:55:15,000
Speaker 2: Someone is being assaulted by the people under his command

1098
00:55:15,480 --> 00:55:19,000
Speaker 2: and that is treated as an assault somehow.

1099
00:55:19,080 --> 00:55:24,359
Speaker 1: Yep. There, Yeah, it's interesting, yep. So for his part,

1100
00:55:24,360 --> 00:55:27,359
Speaker 1: Bavino has bragged that the consequences El Centro agents force

1101
00:55:27,440 --> 00:55:29,840
Speaker 1: upon migrants lead to fewer people trying to cross in

1102
00:55:29,880 --> 00:55:32,440
Speaker 1: the first place. Earlier in his career he seems to

1103
00:55:32,480 --> 00:55:34,359
Speaker 1: have had more of an interest in portraying himself as

1104
00:55:34,400 --> 00:55:36,759
Speaker 1: a good guy to members of the public. Not long

1105
00:55:36,800 --> 00:55:39,120
Speaker 1: after he got transferred back to lead El Centro, a

1106
00:55:39,200 --> 00:55:43,080
Speaker 1: local activist Edie Harmon eighty one complained about border patrol

1107
00:55:43,160 --> 00:55:47,840
Speaker 1: vehicles harming wildlife. Bavino fancies himself a conservationist. He's gotten

1108
00:55:47,840 --> 00:55:49,800
Speaker 1: a degree on the subject, and he once wrote a

1109
00:55:49,840 --> 00:55:52,760
Speaker 1: thesis about the danger of illegal immigrants post to animals

1110
00:55:52,760 --> 00:55:55,120
Speaker 1: in the Southwest. So he agreed to go hike with

1111
00:55:55,160 --> 00:55:57,080
Speaker 1: Harmon and he wrote her a thank you note, insisting

1112
00:55:57,080 --> 00:56:00,400
Speaker 1: Border Patrol cared about the environment too. For The Sun Times,

1113
00:56:00,640 --> 00:56:02,840
Speaker 1: she said Movino tried to win her over by offering

1114
00:56:02,920 --> 00:56:05,520
Speaker 1: to install a guzzler a watering tank for the sheep

1115
00:56:05,560 --> 00:56:07,600
Speaker 1: and to dedicate it in the name of her dead husband.

1116
00:56:07,800 --> 00:56:11,200
Speaker 1: She said she declined because no biologists recommended that. Before

1117
00:56:11,239 --> 00:56:13,480
Speaker 1: Mavino left their hike, He's asked to take a photo

1118
00:56:13,520 --> 00:56:16,000
Speaker 1: with Harmon each standing on opposite sides of a cactus.

1119
00:56:16,680 --> 00:56:17,920
Speaker 1: And that's just.

1120
00:56:18,000 --> 00:56:22,040
Speaker 3: So weird, man, so weird weird. That's weird guy behavior.

1121
00:56:22,320 --> 00:56:25,319
Speaker 1: What do you mean, what do you mean the Biden administration.

1122
00:56:25,400 --> 00:56:27,399
Speaker 1: I think he's trying. He's got to pretend he cares

1123
00:56:27,440 --> 00:56:29,680
Speaker 1: about the environment. And I think he also sees it

1124
00:56:29,719 --> 00:56:31,920
Speaker 1: as because he's got this background. This is a wedge

1125
00:56:31,920 --> 00:56:35,160
Speaker 1: you can drive between the liberal conservationists and the the

1126
00:56:35,239 --> 00:56:37,719
Speaker 1: quote unquote illegals, right, is if you're like, well, they're

1127
00:56:37,719 --> 00:56:40,120
Speaker 1: bad for the environment, you know, and.

1128
00:56:41,239 --> 00:56:44,239
Speaker 3: For the environment, Greg fuck off off.

1129
00:56:44,640 --> 00:56:46,799
Speaker 1: And and Harmond made the very good point that like

1130
00:56:47,080 --> 00:56:48,719
Speaker 1: he wanted to install a water tank for that the

1131
00:56:48,719 --> 00:56:50,720
Speaker 1: reason the sheep are in dangerous because the Border Patrol

1132
00:56:50,800 --> 00:56:54,399
Speaker 1: keeps putting concertina wire up across their grazing ground. It's

1133
00:56:54,440 --> 00:56:58,160
Speaker 1: the razor wire that's bad for the sheep. They need water.

1134
00:56:58,600 --> 00:57:01,120
Speaker 1: Them lying around.

1135
00:57:00,840 --> 00:57:05,440
Speaker 2: Now, they're gonna want some water. Robert, Yeah, that is true.

1136
00:57:06,080 --> 00:57:10,520
Speaker 2: As somebody who has done three thousand podcasts on Hitler,

1137
00:57:10,840 --> 00:57:16,600
Speaker 2: I'm wasn't Hitler also like very into animals and animal

1138
00:57:16,640 --> 00:57:22,560
Speaker 2: rights US not at all for those two things to overlap.

1139
00:57:23,040 --> 00:57:25,760
Speaker 1: No, And I think, you know, this may just this

1140
00:57:25,840 --> 00:57:28,400
Speaker 1: may be Vino. Maybe there's another version of Greg Levino

1141
00:57:28,400 --> 00:57:32,160
Speaker 1: who just went into conservation. But also maybe it's just

1142
00:57:32,440 --> 00:57:35,120
Speaker 1: it's there's a degree. I think certainly by the time

1143
00:57:35,160 --> 00:57:37,760
Speaker 1: he's back at Alcentro, there's this understanding that like, well,

1144
00:57:38,080 --> 00:57:39,720
Speaker 1: maybe this is a way we can drive a wedge

1145
00:57:39,840 --> 00:57:42,080
Speaker 1: between the people that I want to target and the

1146
00:57:42,080 --> 00:57:46,320
Speaker 1: majority of the voting population of this state. Right. Baveno

1147
00:57:46,600 --> 00:57:48,800
Speaker 1: is one of the guys who completely drank the Border

1148
00:57:48,840 --> 00:57:51,640
Speaker 1: Patrol kool aid. Right. He loves to use the nickname

1149
00:57:51,680 --> 00:57:54,240
Speaker 1: the Green Machine to refer to the Border Patrol, which

1150
00:57:54,280 --> 00:57:56,480
Speaker 1: is what they call themselves. I think they think it's

1151
00:57:56,520 --> 00:57:58,080
Speaker 1: cool good.

1152
00:57:58,240 --> 00:58:01,440
Speaker 3: That's like a naked juice. It's like what they that's

1153
00:58:01,480 --> 00:58:02,720
Speaker 3: like a naked Juice flavor.

1154
00:58:03,360 --> 00:58:08,240
Speaker 2: Yeah it is, yeah, after the green juice from Naked

1155
00:58:08,320 --> 00:58:12,520
Speaker 2: Juice that like some it's really like sometimes fine and

1156
00:58:12,560 --> 00:58:16,200
Speaker 2: sometimes it's so fucking bad. Had a bad green juice

1157
00:58:16,320 --> 00:58:19,600
Speaker 2: I have? I had one of those, Yeah, like seven

1158
00:58:19,600 --> 00:58:21,960
Speaker 2: eleven green juice can go can go off.

1159
00:58:22,680 --> 00:58:28,120
Speaker 4: Yeah yeah, speaking of random products, Robert, it's about that time.

1160
00:58:29,000 --> 00:58:31,520
Speaker 2: Don't want me to keep talking about how native juice

1161
00:58:31,520 --> 00:58:33,520
Speaker 2: green machine can sometimes go off.

1162
00:58:35,760 --> 00:58:38,160
Speaker 3: I've never seen you drinking naked juice. I sat next

1163
00:58:38,160 --> 00:58:38,920
Speaker 3: to you for years.

1164
00:58:39,160 --> 00:58:40,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's because I had a bad experience once.

1165
00:58:41,720 --> 00:58:43,200
Speaker 3: You're a round dew guy.

1166
00:58:43,880 --> 00:58:49,560
Speaker 2: That's right. Sophie's seen me at my finest.

1167
00:58:50,280 --> 00:58:51,280
Speaker 3: That's your green.

1168
00:58:51,120 --> 00:58:55,000
Speaker 2: Juice is about That's right. Why what were you talking about?

1169
00:58:57,160 --> 00:58:59,480
Speaker 2: I once did a money phone in front of Sophie

1170
00:58:59,480 --> 00:59:00,840
Speaker 2: with a six a mountain dew.

1171
00:59:01,920 --> 00:59:03,240
Speaker 3: You at that picture.

1172
00:59:06,560 --> 00:59:08,840
Speaker 4: If I do know that that picture is somewhere, I

1173
00:59:08,880 --> 00:59:11,960
Speaker 4: am gonna have them put that up on the nutfla.

1174
00:59:11,720 --> 00:59:12,560
Speaker 2: My finest work.

1175
00:59:15,920 --> 00:59:27,480
Speaker 1: All right, everybody, here's ads and we're back. Sou But Vino,

1176
00:59:27,560 --> 00:59:30,040
Speaker 1: as I said, really drinks the Border Patrol kool aid.

1177
00:59:30,880 --> 00:59:31,160
Speaker 2: He will.

1178
00:59:31,400 --> 00:59:34,440
Speaker 1: He loves reciting the agency slogan on her first with

1179
00:59:34,520 --> 00:59:38,320
Speaker 1: little provocation, which at least one Border Patrol whistleblower has

1180
00:59:38,360 --> 00:59:41,200
Speaker 1: said is often used by men in the Border Patrol

1181
00:59:41,560 --> 00:59:44,120
Speaker 1: to mean on her first because they like to sexually

1182
00:59:44,120 --> 00:59:47,360
Speaker 1: assault female agents and women in there. Credit cust today,

1183
00:59:48,440 --> 00:59:52,120
Speaker 1: good stuff the Border Patrol. Bavino described the Border Patrol

1184
00:59:52,160 --> 00:59:55,520
Speaker 1: as his life's work in Brandon el Centro, the premier sector.

1185
00:59:56,520 --> 00:59:58,600
Speaker 1: He's the one who considers it that. It is a

1186
00:59:58,680 --> 01:00:01,280
Speaker 1: very busy sector. It's a big it's a lot of

1187
01:00:01,320 --> 01:00:03,640
Speaker 1: people come through it. But he's like, no, this is

1188
01:00:03,680 --> 01:00:05,280
Speaker 1: the this is the state of the art. You know,

1189
01:00:05,360 --> 01:00:07,600
Speaker 1: this is this is the best one. You know, We're

1190
01:00:07,880 --> 01:00:10,320
Speaker 1: the standard from which all the other sectors are set.

1191
01:00:10,640 --> 01:00:13,919
Speaker 1: I appreciated with One journalist for calmatters dot org said

1192
01:00:13,920 --> 01:00:16,400
Speaker 1: about this, it's similar to the way states have mottos

1193
01:00:16,400 --> 01:00:19,200
Speaker 1: on license plates that aren't necessarily used by anybody else

1194
01:00:19,240 --> 01:00:20,280
Speaker 1: to describe that state.

1195
01:00:21,520 --> 01:00:23,720
Speaker 2: Right, there's some good ones of those.

1196
01:00:23,880 --> 01:00:28,439
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's some good ones of those. So state, Hey,

1197
01:00:28,520 --> 01:00:30,960
Speaker 1: now hey, now hey, now I gotta stand but actually

1198
01:00:31,000 --> 01:00:33,720
Speaker 1: that that's that is an insult to people from Missouri.

1199
01:00:34,120 --> 01:00:36,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, why do they do that? Why they do that?

1200
01:00:36,640 --> 01:00:39,200
Speaker 1: It dates back to again like the eighteen hundreds. But

1201
01:00:39,240 --> 01:00:40,840
Speaker 1: it means that, like people from Missouri were so dumb

1202
01:00:40,920 --> 01:00:43,080
Speaker 1: that like if if they wouldn't believe you unless you

1203
01:00:43,120 --> 01:00:46,080
Speaker 1: showed them something. Right, he just tells someone like, oh

1204
01:00:46,120 --> 01:00:48,000
Speaker 1: there's there's big boats, now you gotta they got to

1205
01:00:48,000 --> 01:00:49,480
Speaker 1: see the boat because they're dumb.

1206
01:00:50,120 --> 01:00:52,520
Speaker 2: Right, don't believe in dinosaurs, that sort.

1207
01:00:52,320 --> 01:00:53,640
Speaker 1: Of thing, right, right?

1208
01:00:53,880 --> 01:00:57,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, Calling something the premiere anything is a great like

1209
01:00:58,240 --> 01:01:01,320
Speaker 2: weasel where like that that's got to be one of

1210
01:01:01,360 --> 01:01:06,000
Speaker 2: the MVPs of like bad movies posters. Yeah, like we're

1211
01:01:06,040 --> 01:01:07,920
Speaker 2: like the premiere crime.

1212
01:01:08,000 --> 01:01:14,280
Speaker 1: It's like Miller calling itself the Champagne of beer. Yeah, okay, guys, no, no, no,

1213
01:01:14,080 --> 01:01:17,880
Speaker 1: it's gonna call it that unless we're joking the poetry

1214
01:01:17,920 --> 01:01:23,320
Speaker 1: of lying, you know. Yeah. During the Biden years, Bavino

1215
01:01:23,360 --> 01:01:25,960
Speaker 1: started running into trouble, first for tweeting. He made a

1216
01:01:26,080 --> 01:01:27,840
Speaker 1: He made a lot of tweets that got him in trouble.

1217
01:01:27,880 --> 01:01:29,560
Speaker 1: One of them was about a citizen who had been

1218
01:01:29,600 --> 01:01:32,440
Speaker 1: killed by a documented person driving drunk that his superiors

1219
01:01:32,440 --> 01:01:35,280
Speaker 1: made him delete because it was too political. He claimed

1220
01:01:35,280 --> 01:01:37,360
Speaker 1: to be a political and did not understand what was

1221
01:01:37,400 --> 01:01:39,560
Speaker 1: wrong with his post, but he would later prove to

1222
01:01:39,560 --> 01:01:41,760
Speaker 1: have something of an obsession with the subject. He has

1223
01:01:41,800 --> 01:01:44,400
Speaker 1: in the Trump years, the most recent year in Change

1224
01:01:44,440 --> 01:01:47,560
Speaker 1: at least repeatedly brought up the threat of undocumented immigrants

1225
01:01:47,640 --> 01:01:53,200
Speaker 1: driving drunk as a reason for aggressive immigration rest. Yes, yes, wow,

1226
01:01:53,280 --> 01:02:01,760
Speaker 1: nothing psychological there, Okay, Okay, that's okay, great, Like that's

1227
01:02:01,920 --> 01:02:07,400
Speaker 1: so fuck. Last year's Operation Midway Blitz in Chicago, which

1228
01:02:07,400 --> 01:02:10,160
Speaker 1: is where theveno and not where he first gained widespread

1229
01:02:10,240 --> 01:02:14,360
Speaker 1: national visibility, but it really, really massively increased his visibility

1230
01:02:14,760 --> 01:02:16,320
Speaker 1: was in honor of a twenty year old who'd been

1231
01:02:16,400 --> 01:02:18,960
Speaker 1: killed in a duy, right, Like this is a thing

1232
01:02:19,200 --> 01:02:23,680
Speaker 1: for Greg And it's like again, man, like, Okay, you

1233
01:02:23,760 --> 01:02:26,200
Speaker 1: didn't want to go to therapy, but he's taking your

1234
01:02:26,200 --> 01:02:29,280
Speaker 1: anger at your dad out on some random people, almost

1235
01:02:29,320 --> 01:02:31,720
Speaker 1: none of whom did anything wrong, Like almost none of

1236
01:02:31,720 --> 01:02:33,000
Speaker 1: whom have ever driven drunk.

1237
01:02:33,200 --> 01:02:35,800
Speaker 2: Right, this is up there with Tucker. I'm sure you

1238
01:02:35,880 --> 01:02:37,800
Speaker 2: guys have talked about it before on the show. But

1239
01:02:37,840 --> 01:02:40,800
Speaker 2: Tucker Carlson's we got to get our tucky of hippies

1240
01:02:41,040 --> 01:02:45,840
Speaker 2: and women and then his mom left his dad for

1241
01:02:45,960 --> 01:02:49,480
Speaker 2: like a French hippie and like his mom was a hippie.

1242
01:02:49,600 --> 01:02:54,040
Speaker 2: It's just like, damn man, it's almost like too obvious,

1243
01:02:54,160 --> 01:02:57,800
Speaker 2: Like how do you land where you are without being

1244
01:02:57,880 --> 01:03:04,200
Speaker 2: like this is like everybody's know what? This is so bad? Yeah?

1245
01:03:04,360 --> 01:03:07,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's often the case, and you know it. It's

1246
01:03:07,440 --> 01:03:09,880
Speaker 1: the case with old Greg right now. One thing that

1247
01:03:09,960 --> 01:03:13,080
Speaker 1: made Bevino's El Centro stand out is that he had

1248
01:03:13,160 --> 01:03:16,040
Speaker 1: five agents whose whole full time job was making videos,

1249
01:03:16,920 --> 01:03:20,600
Speaker 1: which is interesting and it shows again he understands he's

1250
01:03:20,600 --> 01:03:23,120
Speaker 1: at least someone who sees how good a shot Trump

1251
01:03:23,120 --> 01:03:25,680
Speaker 1: has it coming back in the Biden years and is like,

1252
01:03:26,240 --> 01:03:29,240
Speaker 1: I know what to do to get on this fucker's radar.

1253
01:03:29,400 --> 01:03:31,360
Speaker 1: Is I need to start making some shit that goes viral.

1254
01:03:31,400 --> 01:03:33,880
Speaker 1: I got to piss off some libs. Right. Here's how

1255
01:03:33,920 --> 01:03:37,640
Speaker 1: cal Matters describes a representative example. Two agents sitting their

1256
01:03:37,720 --> 01:03:39,960
Speaker 1: vehicle at night listening to a news broadcast about an

1257
01:03:40,000 --> 01:03:42,320
Speaker 1: undocumented migrant charged with the rape and murder of a

1258
01:03:42,360 --> 01:03:44,720
Speaker 1: sixty four year old woman in Santa Maria. The news

1259
01:03:44,760 --> 01:03:47,160
Speaker 1: clips from a real CBS report from ten years ago.

1260
01:03:47,200 --> 01:03:49,160
Speaker 1: An agent shakes his head and discussed and turns off

1261
01:03:49,160 --> 01:03:51,480
Speaker 1: the radio, saying, man, that's the second one in less

1262
01:03:51,480 --> 01:03:53,080
Speaker 1: than a week, things are getting out of hand.

1263
01:03:53,160 --> 01:03:53,480
Speaker 2: Oh wow.

1264
01:03:53,840 --> 01:03:55,920
Speaker 1: And if you're trying to make the case that, like, wow,

1265
01:03:55,960 --> 01:03:59,480
Speaker 1: every week, multiple people are getting raped by immigrants, and

1266
01:03:59,520 --> 01:04:02,160
Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, your one example was from a news

1267
01:04:02,160 --> 01:04:03,400
Speaker 1: clip from ten years ago.

1268
01:04:04,120 --> 01:04:07,480
Speaker 2: Their most powerful weapon maybe is selection bias, where they

1269
01:04:07,520 --> 01:04:10,760
Speaker 2: will find a will find and make it seem like

1270
01:04:10,840 --> 01:04:14,760
Speaker 2: it is constantly happening right next toward you. Yeh, yep.

1271
01:04:15,280 --> 01:04:17,760
Speaker 1: Now at that moment, dispatch comes over the radio and

1272
01:04:17,800 --> 01:04:20,720
Speaker 1: it tells the agents there's a nearby vehicle loaded with migrants.

1273
01:04:20,920 --> 01:04:22,880
Speaker 1: The agents catch three of them in, but one gets

1274
01:04:22,920 --> 01:04:26,080
Speaker 1: away and sneaks into any Town, USA, where he murders

1275
01:04:26,080 --> 01:04:29,479
Speaker 1: an American citizen, taking the man's cell phone and running off,

1276
01:04:29,840 --> 01:04:33,200
Speaker 1: and the screen goes dark, and the message every apprehension matters.

1277
01:04:33,240 --> 01:04:34,400
Speaker 1: Do you know who got away?

1278
01:04:35,600 --> 01:04:35,880
Speaker 2: Again?

1279
01:04:37,440 --> 01:04:40,920
Speaker 1: So much plot, it's so much plot for such a

1280
01:04:40,920 --> 01:04:42,040
Speaker 1: shitty ad.

1281
01:04:42,000 --> 01:04:44,840
Speaker 2: Like thirty minutes of a Chuck Norris movie.

1282
01:04:45,120 --> 01:04:49,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, that's the opening of a Check Norris movie.

1283
01:04:49,120 --> 01:04:51,440
Speaker 1: Only about one percent of the people the border patrol

1284
01:04:51,520 --> 01:04:54,200
Speaker 1: encounters have a criminal conviction, compared to eight percent of

1285
01:04:54,240 --> 01:04:56,800
Speaker 1: American citizens. But there's a little point in bringing reality

1286
01:04:56,960 --> 01:04:59,440
Speaker 1: into this. They don't care, right.

1287
01:04:59,360 --> 01:05:02,280
Speaker 2: They just to treat these people like complete shit, right,

1288
01:05:02,320 --> 01:05:06,080
Speaker 2: and so it's like a chance. Yeah, it's bully tactics

1289
01:05:06,120 --> 01:05:09,080
Speaker 2: where you just find the person who's the least protected

1290
01:05:09,320 --> 01:05:09,760
Speaker 2: and then.

1291
01:05:09,720 --> 01:05:11,080
Speaker 1: Yep, go after him.

1292
01:05:11,480 --> 01:05:12,240
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1293
01:05:12,320 --> 01:05:14,919
Speaker 1: So Bavino was called to testify before Congress in twenty

1294
01:05:14,960 --> 01:05:17,360
Speaker 1: twenty three. He discussed how crossings in his sector had

1295
01:05:17,360 --> 01:05:20,240
Speaker 1: increased significantly and basically made the border hot case that

1296
01:05:20,240 --> 01:05:23,640
Speaker 1: the Biden administration was failing to protect the border. Bavino's

1297
01:05:23,640 --> 01:05:25,880
Speaker 1: own history came up, including what turned out to be

1298
01:05:25,920 --> 01:05:29,480
Speaker 1: repeated issues with social media. One relevant quote was, I

1299
01:05:29,480 --> 01:05:32,280
Speaker 1: think there was one post with two Yameni's terrorists. I

1300
01:05:32,400 --> 01:05:35,520
Speaker 1: was ordered to take that down. Ravino was relieved of

1301
01:05:35,560 --> 01:05:38,760
Speaker 1: command after his testimony, which the Republican House members who

1302
01:05:38,840 --> 01:05:41,880
Speaker 1: convened the hearing saw his retribution, and it probably was

1303
01:05:42,040 --> 01:05:44,720
Speaker 1: right like retribution.

1304
01:05:44,440 --> 01:05:47,560
Speaker 2: For him, say, being a dick this stuff and being.

1305
01:05:48,120 --> 01:05:50,320
Speaker 1: Me at a fucked up asshole. But I guess that counts,

1306
01:05:52,120 --> 01:05:55,840
Speaker 1: and it's also those retribution. I was fired as retribution

1307
01:05:56,040 --> 01:05:59,760
Speaker 1: for being bad, as he's bad at his job in

1308
01:05:59,800 --> 01:06:02,040
Speaker 1: this right because he's his old claim is that like

1309
01:06:02,040 --> 01:06:04,160
Speaker 1: you got to be brutal to reduce crossings, and he

1310
01:06:04,200 --> 01:06:06,760
Speaker 1: admitted that crossings were at at all time high and

1311
01:06:06,840 --> 01:06:08,960
Speaker 1: he's in charge. I don't know, man, maybe you were

1312
01:06:09,000 --> 01:06:11,160
Speaker 1: just saying you sucked at your job. But he didn't

1313
01:06:11,160 --> 01:06:14,440
Speaker 1: suffer any consequences for his actions. Those House members complained

1314
01:06:14,440 --> 01:06:16,720
Speaker 1: about his demotion, and he was reinstated at El Centro.

1315
01:06:17,120 --> 01:06:19,720
Speaker 1: And you know what happened not long after Donald Trump

1316
01:06:19,800 --> 01:06:23,280
Speaker 1: won re election. On January seventh, twenty twenty five, the

1317
01:06:23,320 --> 01:06:26,200
Speaker 1: day after Congress certified as victory, Bavino led sixty five

1318
01:06:26,240 --> 01:06:30,120
Speaker 1: agents in operation returned to cinder per calmatters dot org.

1319
01:06:30,480 --> 01:06:32,640
Speaker 1: Most of the official information about the raid came from

1320
01:06:32,800 --> 01:06:35,840
Speaker 1: Vino's Facebook comments. He posted blurred photos of three Latino

1321
01:06:35,880 --> 01:06:38,360
Speaker 1: men alongside a photo of thirty three pounds of marijuana

1322
01:06:38,360 --> 01:06:40,240
Speaker 1: in the trunk of a car. He wrote, here, in

1323
01:06:40,280 --> 01:06:42,760
Speaker 1: the premier sector, we go the extra mile or five

1324
01:06:42,840 --> 01:06:45,200
Speaker 1: hundred of them to protect our nation and communities from

1325
01:06:45,240 --> 01:06:49,680
Speaker 1: bad people and bad things. So congratulations, Greg, you protected

1326
01:06:49,720 --> 01:06:55,520
Speaker 1: California from pot Like great man, keeping that welled out

1327
01:06:55,560 --> 01:06:59,360
Speaker 1: of a store smelled it here ever since that thirty

1328
01:06:59,360 --> 01:07:02,720
Speaker 1: three pounds really put a dint in the state. Wow,

1329
01:07:03,880 --> 01:07:07,200
Speaker 1: seventy eight people were arrested. The Border Patrol told local

1330
01:07:07,240 --> 01:07:10,080
Speaker 1: business owners that the raids were targeting criminal activity, but

1331
01:07:10,160 --> 01:07:13,880
Speaker 1: this was obviously untrue, and a cal Matters investigation partnered

1332
01:07:13,920 --> 01:07:16,280
Speaker 1: with Evident in Bellingcat, showed that the Border Patrol had

1333
01:07:16,320 --> 01:07:19,080
Speaker 1: no prior knowledge of criminal history of any kind. For

1334
01:07:19,160 --> 01:07:23,120
Speaker 1: seventy seven of seventy eight arrestees, this was very likely illegal.

1335
01:07:23,160 --> 01:07:25,400
Speaker 1: In the acl you has sued on behalf of the

1336
01:07:25,440 --> 01:07:28,760
Speaker 1: farm workers agents are accused of failing to id themselves

1337
01:07:28,840 --> 01:07:31,479
Speaker 1: or percent warrants, and of using brutal force. In one case,

1338
01:07:31,480 --> 01:07:33,360
Speaker 1: they slashed the tires of a US citizen and then

1339
01:07:33,400 --> 01:07:35,440
Speaker 1: arrested them for seemingly no reason. I say, very like,

1340
01:07:35,520 --> 01:07:38,520
Speaker 1: this was very illegal. You know, this is all very illas.

1341
01:07:39,160 --> 01:07:40,440
Speaker 2: Slashed the tires.

1342
01:07:40,680 --> 01:07:42,800
Speaker 1: They loved doing that, they loved doing it.

1343
01:07:44,600 --> 01:07:47,360
Speaker 2: What so on what grounds were they arresting them if

1344
01:07:47,360 --> 01:07:50,520
Speaker 2: it wasn't for them having like warrants or anything.

1345
01:07:50,320 --> 01:07:52,520
Speaker 1: Here legally here, illegally here, illegally.

1346
01:07:54,000 --> 01:07:54,160
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1347
01:07:54,200 --> 01:07:55,640
Speaker 1: I mean that's their argument, is that like they were doing,

1348
01:07:55,680 --> 01:07:57,080
Speaker 1: that's the illegal thing they were doing.

1349
01:07:57,240 --> 01:07:57,520
Speaker 2: You know.

1350
01:07:59,760 --> 01:08:06,920
Speaker 1: Son the papers, right, Yeah, that's who they all are. Minjucho,

1351
01:08:07,040 --> 01:08:09,280
Speaker 1: a senior lawyer for the ACLU called this operation a

1352
01:08:09,320 --> 01:08:11,880
Speaker 1: pilot project for the ones that Bavino would leader spearhead

1353
01:08:11,920 --> 01:08:14,160
Speaker 1: around the country. He earned the attention of the Trumpet

1354
01:08:14,400 --> 01:08:17,719
Speaker 1: administration for his combative presence on social media and willingness

1355
01:08:17,720 --> 01:08:20,560
Speaker 1: to use federal forces to brutalize people. On June of

1356
01:08:20,600 --> 01:08:23,080
Speaker 1: twenty twenty five, he was named tactical commander of a

1357
01:08:23,080 --> 01:08:26,280
Speaker 1: mass rate in Los Angeles, which sparked protests across the city.

1358
01:08:26,640 --> 01:08:29,080
Speaker 1: And you're all pretty familiar with what happened next. We're

1359
01:08:29,120 --> 01:08:31,120
Speaker 1: not going to go into crazy detail about everything Bavino

1360
01:08:31,160 --> 01:08:33,120
Speaker 1: did in the last year because you all lived through it, right,

1361
01:08:33,240 --> 01:08:36,000
Speaker 1: we don't need to do a ton of that. His

1362
01:08:36,080 --> 01:08:39,240
Speaker 1: agents helped ICE agents as they brutally detained random Angelino's.

1363
01:08:39,280 --> 01:08:41,240
Speaker 1: They blew up indoors to houses, They gas people in

1364
01:08:41,280 --> 01:08:45,000
Speaker 1: the street. Bavino had his video to Division craft ads

1365
01:08:45,040 --> 01:08:47,719
Speaker 1: depicting his men's violence to regular working people as action

1366
01:08:47,840 --> 01:08:50,559
Speaker 1: movie scenes. He led his agents in an armed patrol

1367
01:08:50,600 --> 01:08:53,240
Speaker 1: outside of a political rally held by Gavin Newsom, which

1368
01:08:53,280 --> 01:08:56,080
Speaker 1: some might suggest could be seen as actual treason. Bavino

1369
01:08:56,160 --> 01:08:58,360
Speaker 1: claimed not to have known that Newsom was in the building.

1370
01:08:58,439 --> 01:09:01,000
Speaker 1: Continue his habit of giving answers to questions that present

1371
01:09:01,160 --> 01:09:03,400
Speaker 1: only the The only other answer is like, well, so

1372
01:09:03,479 --> 01:09:05,640
Speaker 1: the end, you're incompetent, right if you didn't know he

1373
01:09:05,720 --> 01:09:07,719
Speaker 1: was in the build, like what the fuck was this about?

1374
01:09:07,760 --> 01:09:10,360
Speaker 2: Dipshit? We just like saw a crowd and we just

1375
01:09:10,400 --> 01:09:13,920
Speaker 2: yeah kind of we were like, oh shit that patrol does.

1376
01:09:14,680 --> 01:09:18,080
Speaker 2: Was that also when they did the military rage of

1377
01:09:18,960 --> 01:09:20,559
Speaker 2: uh MacArthur Park.

1378
01:09:20,760 --> 01:09:24,559
Speaker 1: And yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, which we should be

1379
01:09:24,600 --> 01:09:26,479
Speaker 1: talking and he was like, we're giving this back to

1380
01:09:26,560 --> 01:09:28,800
Speaker 1: Maul and Paul America. And it's like, man, the people

1381
01:09:28,800 --> 01:09:31,400
Speaker 1: who live there are the ones that you're fucking with.

1382
01:09:31,680 --> 01:09:34,320
Speaker 1: They're the ones who use the park dipshit. But again

1383
01:09:34,400 --> 01:09:36,760
Speaker 1: he knows this. I'm not going to give a blow

1384
01:09:36,760 --> 01:09:38,880
Speaker 1: by blow of every violent act as men perpetrated, but

1385
01:09:38,880 --> 01:09:41,040
Speaker 1: I should read this quote from an article by Gabrielle

1386
01:09:41,040 --> 01:09:44,280
Speaker 1: Cannon and The Guardian. Two undocumented people have died trying

1387
01:09:44,280 --> 01:09:47,280
Speaker 1: to flee Babino's agents. A Mexican farmworker fell from a greenhouse,

1388
01:09:47,280 --> 01:09:49,479
Speaker 1: and a Guatemalan day laborer was hit by a vehicle

1389
01:09:49,520 --> 01:09:52,560
Speaker 1: following a rate at home depot. In another episode, the

1390
01:09:52,560 --> 01:09:55,120
Speaker 1: paper reported they detained a disabled fifteen year old high

1391
01:09:55,160 --> 01:09:57,559
Speaker 1: school student in a case of mistaken identity, after drawing

1392
01:09:57,600 --> 01:10:00,280
Speaker 1: their guns and handcuffing him, leaving unfired bullet. It's on

1393
01:10:00,320 --> 01:10:04,439
Speaker 1: the ground, so cool people just like well trained, good

1394
01:10:04,479 --> 01:10:08,760
Speaker 1: at their jobs. Raveno's obviously sent to Chicago after LA,

1395
01:10:08,840 --> 01:10:11,639
Speaker 1: where he enacts similar violence. On one occasion, he throws

1396
01:10:11,640 --> 01:10:14,520
Speaker 1: tear gas on camera against a crowd of peaceful protesters.

1397
01:10:14,920 --> 01:10:17,200
Speaker 1: He and his agency had just been enjoined against using

1398
01:10:17,240 --> 01:10:20,040
Speaker 1: gas without justification, so Bavino claimed that he'd been hit

1399
01:10:20,080 --> 01:10:22,040
Speaker 1: in the head with a rock and had no choice.

1400
01:10:22,200 --> 01:10:24,759
Speaker 1: Bavino later admitted that he'd lied to the US District

1401
01:10:24,840 --> 01:10:26,320
Speaker 1: Judge Sarah Ellis about this.

1402
01:10:27,240 --> 01:10:35,040
Speaker 2: That seems fireable. Robert should spirable doing violent, a violent thing,

1403
01:10:35,800 --> 01:10:38,800
Speaker 2: and they hit me in the head with a.

1404
01:10:41,800 --> 01:10:45,280
Speaker 1: To do I'm a huge piece of shit, sorry, guys.

1405
01:10:46,200 --> 01:10:46,320
Speaker 2: Uh.

1406
01:10:46,560 --> 01:10:48,479
Speaker 1: In October of twenty twenty five, he had been declared

1407
01:10:48,520 --> 01:10:50,680
Speaker 1: Commander at Large of the Border Patrol, which is not

1408
01:10:50,840 --> 01:10:53,320
Speaker 1: a real job but basically removed him from the normal

1409
01:10:53,520 --> 01:10:56,439
Speaker 1: Border Patrol hierarchy without giving him formal control over the

1410
01:10:56,479 --> 01:10:58,920
Speaker 1: whole group. In other words, it's the job you give

1411
01:10:58,960 --> 01:11:01,439
Speaker 1: a guy who you want, you want out there in public,

1412
01:11:01,479 --> 01:11:02,920
Speaker 1: you want to let him do stuff for a while,

1413
01:11:02,920 --> 01:11:05,080
Speaker 1: because you know eventually you pissed people off too much

1414
01:11:05,080 --> 01:11:06,640
Speaker 1: and you want to be able to make him your

1415
01:11:06,680 --> 01:11:10,040
Speaker 1: sacrificial lamb. Right, it's make him a job that'll put

1416
01:11:10,080 --> 01:11:12,080
Speaker 1: him out in front of everybody, because this dipshit is

1417
01:11:12,120 --> 01:11:14,160
Speaker 1: not going to be able to help himself. He was

1418
01:11:14,200 --> 01:11:17,000
Speaker 1: the face man for Trump's brutal mass deportations, and his

1419
01:11:17,080 --> 01:11:18,960
Speaker 1: main job, again, I think, was to provide a focus

1420
01:11:18,960 --> 01:11:21,920
Speaker 1: for public outrage walking around in his Nazi coat looking

1421
01:11:21,960 --> 01:11:24,639
Speaker 1: like Doogie Howser at the end of Starship Troopers. Shit

1422
01:11:24,760 --> 01:11:27,639
Speaker 1: like this serves as a useful distraction, but Vino has

1423
01:11:27,680 --> 01:11:29,960
Speaker 1: gotten to defend his choice of outerwear several times. In

1424
01:11:29,960 --> 01:11:33,320
Speaker 1: interviews per globalsecurity dot org, he explained that he purchased

1425
01:11:33,360 --> 01:11:35,639
Speaker 1: it around nineteen ninety nine as a young Border patrol

1426
01:11:35,680 --> 01:11:37,360
Speaker 1: agent and had worn it for more than twenty five

1427
01:11:37,439 --> 01:11:40,520
Speaker 1: years in cold weather or formal settings without prior controversy.

1428
01:11:40,760 --> 01:11:42,880
Speaker 1: He pointed to a twenty twenty two Department of Homeland

1429
01:11:42,880 --> 01:11:45,320
Speaker 1: Security ceremony under the Biden administration where he wore it

1430
01:11:45,320 --> 01:11:48,559
Speaker 1: and received only compliments. Survivors argue that the design draws

1431
01:11:48,600 --> 01:11:51,040
Speaker 1: from long standing US military traditions such as the m

1432
01:11:51,120 --> 01:11:54,080
Speaker 1: nineteen thirty nine style overcoats or bridge coats used in

1433
01:11:54,160 --> 01:11:57,719
Speaker 1: law enforcement and formal uniforms rather than exclusively fascist imagery.

1434
01:11:58,120 --> 01:12:01,400
Speaker 1: But we know why you're doing it, Greg, and we

1435
01:12:01,520 --> 01:12:03,080
Speaker 1: know why you like it. You like it because it

1436
01:12:03,120 --> 01:12:04,680
Speaker 1: makes you look like Doogie Howser at the end of

1437
01:12:04,720 --> 01:12:05,639
Speaker 1: Starship Troopers.

1438
01:12:06,200 --> 01:12:09,040
Speaker 2: And also to be like it's not fascist, it's from

1439
01:12:09,080 --> 01:12:14,040
Speaker 2: the US military. He's like, well, okay, let's take a

1440
01:12:14,040 --> 01:12:17,880
Speaker 2: look at the US military history. Yeah, there was something

1441
01:12:18,280 --> 01:12:22,400
Speaker 2: we were talking on Zecho about how the like they're

1442
01:12:22,560 --> 01:12:27,000
Speaker 2: thinking about bringing ice to the Winter Olympics, and there

1443
01:12:27,120 --> 01:12:31,040
Speaker 2: there's just a quote from somebody in Italy talking about

1444
01:12:31,120 --> 01:12:35,400
Speaker 2: their prison camps over there, like they're deporting Albanians and

1445
01:12:35,439 --> 01:12:37,200
Speaker 2: taking them to like a black site. And they were like,

1446
01:12:37,439 --> 01:12:41,120
Speaker 2: it's like Italian Guantanamo. And I was like, oh, we

1447
01:12:41,320 --> 01:12:46,280
Speaker 2: use Nazis as like our touchstone. The other countries use

1448
01:12:46,439 --> 01:12:50,160
Speaker 2: US as they're They're like, yeah, it's it's almost like

1449
01:12:50,240 --> 01:12:54,800
Speaker 2: we're America as they're like fascism touchstone.

1450
01:12:55,360 --> 01:12:57,120
Speaker 3: M yes, yes.

1451
01:12:58,760 --> 01:13:01,360
Speaker 1: So anyway, I'm not sure how much there is to say.

1452
01:13:01,360 --> 01:13:03,000
Speaker 1: I mean, there's a lot more, but you've all lived

1453
01:13:03,000 --> 01:13:05,280
Speaker 1: through it. Right, you know, we know where he is

1454
01:13:05,400 --> 01:13:07,760
Speaker 1: right now. After two murders in Minneapolis, he was picked

1455
01:13:07,800 --> 01:13:11,240
Speaker 1: to be the face of the Trump administration's miscalculation. He

1456
01:13:11,400 --> 01:13:13,559
Speaker 1: was removed from his fake job and sent back to

1457
01:13:13,600 --> 01:13:16,320
Speaker 1: El Centro. I'm sure this is not the end of

1458
01:13:16,400 --> 01:13:18,960
Speaker 1: us hearing about Gregory Bavino. They're kind of keeping him

1459
01:13:18,960 --> 01:13:19,960
Speaker 1: in the cooler, right.

1460
01:13:20,320 --> 01:13:20,759
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1461
01:13:20,960 --> 01:13:23,360
Speaker 1: He had made a couple of claims previous, even previous

1462
01:13:23,400 --> 01:13:26,960
Speaker 1: to Minneapolis, about wanting to retire in the next two years,

1463
01:13:27,360 --> 01:13:29,240
Speaker 1: which I think was part of why the Trump administration

1464
01:13:29,320 --> 01:13:31,360
Speaker 1: this may have even been an open like, Look, we're

1465
01:13:31,360 --> 01:13:33,400
Speaker 1: gonna give you a special, fancy job. You're gonna be

1466
01:13:33,439 --> 01:13:35,280
Speaker 1: on camera. You're gonna get to be the face of

1467
01:13:35,320 --> 01:13:38,320
Speaker 1: the border patrol doing all this fascist bullshit you've always

1468
01:13:38,320 --> 01:13:41,080
Speaker 1: wanted to do. And then when stuff gets too hot

1469
01:13:41,120 --> 01:13:44,920
Speaker 1: for us, we're gonna cut bait, right, and then you'll

1470
01:13:44,960 --> 01:13:47,720
Speaker 1: just retire with full benefits. Doesn't that sound good to

1471
01:13:47,760 --> 01:13:50,080
Speaker 1: you? You can get a nice job on Fox News or something,

1472
01:13:50,080 --> 01:13:50,639
Speaker 1: and you're retired.

1473
01:13:50,680 --> 01:13:52,880
Speaker 2: You get to wear that jacket that you keep asking

1474
01:13:52,960 --> 01:13:55,400
Speaker 2: us to wear to every meeting. You get to wear

1475
01:13:55,439 --> 01:13:56,240
Speaker 2: that on the news.

1476
01:13:56,320 --> 01:13:59,120
Speaker 1: You can wear that every day, buddy, Greg, anytime you

1477
01:13:59,120 --> 01:14:01,840
Speaker 1: want to wear you dumbedge, please put it on. Put

1478
01:14:01,840 --> 01:14:06,120
Speaker 1: it on a la fuck it like anyway. That's that's

1479
01:14:06,160 --> 01:14:09,760
Speaker 1: my read of the Greg Bavino story. We will maybe

1480
01:14:09,840 --> 01:14:13,559
Speaker 1: do an update on the fucker if more becomes of him,

1481
01:14:13,560 --> 01:14:15,759
Speaker 1: but it may also just be a thing. We'll wait

1482
01:14:15,840 --> 01:14:18,880
Speaker 1: around a little while in elcenttro you know, probably get

1483
01:14:18,960 --> 01:14:21,240
Speaker 1: get his rocks off a few times, hurting people down there,

1484
01:14:21,280 --> 01:14:23,240
Speaker 1: and then retire, you know, like he'd plan.

1485
01:14:23,200 --> 01:14:26,040
Speaker 2: To, right. Did you see the video of the woman

1486
01:14:26,080 --> 01:14:29,360
Speaker 2: who was just like kind of dragging him outside of

1487
01:14:29,400 --> 01:14:33,920
Speaker 2: a seven eleven and his response was just he's like, oh,

1488
01:14:34,000 --> 01:14:37,360
Speaker 2: that's real nice. Oh you're being real nice. It was

1489
01:14:37,560 --> 01:14:40,800
Speaker 2: just like, I don't I don't know, man, that's I

1490
01:14:41,080 --> 01:14:43,599
Speaker 2: don't think your place is to tell people that they're

1491
01:14:43,640 --> 01:14:46,679
Speaker 2: being not nice. At this stage.

1492
01:14:47,040 --> 01:14:49,559
Speaker 4: He's a weird little guy that got too much power,

1493
01:14:49,800 --> 01:14:54,520
Speaker 4: and I hope to never see him again, but I think, unfortunately,

1494
01:14:55,000 --> 01:14:57,240
Speaker 4: the way this world's been working, we probably will.

1495
01:14:58,640 --> 01:15:01,200
Speaker 2: Yep. Yeah, there a lot of weird little guys. I

1496
01:15:01,240 --> 01:15:03,479
Speaker 2: feel like someone should make a show about that.

1497
01:15:03,800 --> 01:15:05,439
Speaker 1: Yeah, we should probably have a show about weird little

1498
01:15:05,479 --> 01:15:06,839
Speaker 1: guys on our podcast network.

1499
01:15:07,280 --> 01:15:11,560
Speaker 3: Oh great news. I have a great news.

1500
01:15:12,000 --> 01:15:15,120
Speaker 4: Molly Conger has a show called Little Guys.

1501
01:15:16,840 --> 01:15:18,880
Speaker 1: They figured out how to launch a second podcast.

1502
01:15:19,160 --> 01:15:22,200
Speaker 3: Wow, Jack, is there anything you like to plug here

1503
01:15:22,240 --> 01:15:22,720
Speaker 3: at the end?

1504
01:15:23,200 --> 01:15:27,000
Speaker 2: Oh my god, Sophie, thank you so much. First of all,

1505
01:15:27,120 --> 01:15:31,520
Speaker 2: such a pleasure to be with you, guys, Robert uh

1506
01:15:31,800 --> 01:15:36,000
Speaker 2: The my first intern at Cracked, our first intern discovered

1507
01:15:36,000 --> 01:15:40,800
Speaker 2: by the great Daniel O'Brien, and so so fun to

1508
01:15:41,280 --> 01:15:43,200
Speaker 2: have been working with you on the podcast base all

1509
01:15:43,240 --> 01:15:46,160
Speaker 2: these years. And Sophie Lichterman, one of the greats to

1510
01:15:46,280 --> 01:15:49,960
Speaker 2: ever do it. So thank you guys so much. I

1511
01:15:50,000 --> 01:15:54,680
Speaker 2: always enjoy being back Daily Zeitgeist is a show that

1512
01:15:54,760 --> 01:16:00,120
Speaker 2: I do twice a day with Wonderful day suffering cou

1513
01:16:00,240 --> 01:16:06,879
Speaker 2: Miles Gray. And we just published our two thousandth episodes.

1514
01:16:07,040 --> 01:16:11,679
Speaker 4: Oh congratulations, dude, two thousandth main episode Crazy, the second.

1515
01:16:11,680 --> 01:16:14,880
Speaker 2: We didn't even count the second one, but lord, we

1516
01:16:14,920 --> 01:16:17,960
Speaker 2: did it. We made it to two thousand. What it

1517
01:16:18,040 --> 01:16:20,160
Speaker 2: is We're not sure, but we did it.

1518
01:16:20,360 --> 01:16:20,679
Speaker 1: Wow.

1519
01:16:21,280 --> 01:16:23,599
Speaker 2: And then, like I mentioned, we have a new series

1520
01:16:24,400 --> 01:16:27,439
Speaker 2: that I think fans of the Cracked podcat the old

1521
01:16:27,479 --> 01:16:32,280
Speaker 2: Crack podcast will like, called the iconograph where each Monday,

1522
01:16:33,760 --> 01:16:36,360
Speaker 2: me and a researcher do a deep dive into a

1523
01:16:36,439 --> 01:16:42,680
Speaker 2: different icon. What's an icon, you ask? By our definition?

1524
01:16:42,960 --> 01:16:45,439
Speaker 2: So our first episode was about Einstein and our second

1525
01:16:45,600 --> 01:16:48,840
Speaker 2: was about Erkle. So it's just any of these like

1526
01:16:49,080 --> 01:16:53,320
Speaker 2: big pop culture wore cruxes that drive a lot of

1527
01:16:53,360 --> 01:16:56,320
Speaker 2: meaning in the zeitgeist, and it lets us do a

1528
01:16:56,400 --> 01:16:59,320
Speaker 2: show that isn't about the news, which is so nice.

1529
01:16:59,560 --> 01:17:03,280
Speaker 4: Fun Sophie lore for you. My first ever crush was

1530
01:17:03,320 --> 01:17:06,479
Speaker 4: Einstein's like great grandson.

1531
01:17:06,600 --> 01:17:09,000
Speaker 2: Are you serious? Damn?

1532
01:17:09,280 --> 01:17:09,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure.

1533
01:17:09,960 --> 01:17:11,880
Speaker 2: I should have had you on to this talk about that.

1534
01:17:12,920 --> 01:17:16,519
Speaker 4: If you're listening to this, Yes, I loved you. It

1535
01:17:16,560 --> 01:17:17,960
Speaker 4: was first grade. I loved you.

1536
01:17:18,479 --> 01:17:21,080
Speaker 2: Yes, Hi. You don't think he knew?

1537
01:17:21,640 --> 01:17:24,240
Speaker 4: Oh no, he I was not cool, you know me.

1538
01:17:24,439 --> 01:17:27,679
Speaker 4: I can't hide any anything. I've never changed. I've always

1539
01:17:27,720 --> 01:17:30,160
Speaker 4: been this way, Like.

1540
01:17:30,200 --> 01:17:32,320
Speaker 3: He for sure knew, He for sure knew.

1541
01:17:32,439 --> 01:17:33,800
Speaker 4: And the way I know he knew is I got

1542
01:17:33,800 --> 01:17:35,760
Speaker 4: teased about it by this other guy, so I kicked

1543
01:17:35,840 --> 01:17:38,040
Speaker 4: him in the shin and then I got in trouble, so.

1544
01:17:37,920 --> 01:17:41,200
Speaker 3: He knew he knew. I've been this way my entire life.

1545
01:17:41,240 --> 01:17:43,200
Speaker 2: And I picture you kicking him in the shin and

1546
01:17:43,240 --> 01:17:46,360
Speaker 2: his shin bone snapping backwards like Steven Segal.

1547
01:17:46,720 --> 01:17:51,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, no, he definitely knew but h and.

1548
01:17:51,400 --> 01:17:55,879
Speaker 2: His name was Greg Einstein, Gretin Simon Einstein.

1549
01:17:55,880 --> 01:17:58,320
Speaker 4: Shout out if you're listening to If you're listening to this,

1550
01:17:58,479 --> 01:17:59,160
Speaker 4: I loved you.

1551
01:17:59,360 --> 01:18:04,519
Speaker 2: I was in grade. But yeah, anyways, that's a fun one.

1552
01:18:04,560 --> 01:18:07,680
Speaker 2: Those come out every Monday morning. We're calling the iconograph.

1553
01:18:07,800 --> 01:18:10,800
Speaker 2: We just did Marilyn Monroe, which is a really fun episode.

1554
01:18:10,840 --> 01:18:15,000
Speaker 2: Dolly Parton, Tony Hawk's coming up and Robert would love

1555
01:18:15,040 --> 01:18:18,240
Speaker 2: to have you on one. So sure. We like to

1556
01:18:18,439 --> 01:18:21,760
Speaker 2: reach out to the guests and be like, Okay, here's

1557
01:18:21,800 --> 01:18:24,040
Speaker 2: our list. Who do you like or pitch us the

1558
01:18:24,280 --> 01:18:26,920
Speaker 2: icon that you want to go over. So maybe a

1559
01:18:27,000 --> 01:18:28,760
Speaker 2: chance for you guys to talk about people you don't

1560
01:18:29,280 --> 01:18:30,840
Speaker 2: who aren't the.

1561
01:18:30,840 --> 01:18:35,800
Speaker 1: Worst, Sure, people who aren't the worst? Yes, icons, icons, Yes,

1562
01:18:35,920 --> 01:18:39,280
Speaker 1: like the iconic Jack O'Brien, who thank you for being

1563
01:18:39,320 --> 01:18:39,920
Speaker 1: on our show.

1564
01:18:40,439 --> 01:18:43,479
Speaker 2: It's so wonderful being here. Also Jack underscore O'Brien on Twitter.

1565
01:18:43,560 --> 01:18:48,679
Speaker 4: And yeah, one last plug against the State by James Stout,

1566
01:18:48,760 --> 01:18:51,719
Speaker 4: our colleague. His book is available now, please buy it.

1567
01:18:51,720 --> 01:18:56,800
Speaker 4: It's fantastic. Love James, That'll do it right, Robert.

1568
01:18:57,360 --> 01:18:59,679
Speaker 1: Yep, That'll do it Holy shit?

1569
01:19:00,200 --> 01:19:03,080
Speaker 3: By bye.

1570
01:19:04,520 --> 01:19:07,080
Speaker 4: Behind the Bastards is a production of cool Zone Media.

1571
01:19:07,280 --> 01:19:10,440
Speaker 4: For more from cool Zone Media, visit our website Coolzonemedia

1572
01:19:10,520 --> 01:19:13,200
Speaker 4: dot com or check us out on the iHeartRadio app,

1573
01:19:13,200 --> 01:19:17,599
Speaker 4: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Full video episodes,

1574
01:19:17,640 --> 01:19:20,240
Speaker 4: but Behind the Bastards are now streaming on Netflix, dropping

1575
01:19:20,280 --> 01:19:23,120
Speaker 4: every Tuesday and Thursday. Hit Remind Me on Netflix you

1576
01:19:23,200 --> 01:19:26,679
Speaker 4: don't miss an episode. For clips in our older episode catalog,

1577
01:19:26,760 --> 01:19:30,000
Speaker 4: continue to subscribe to our YouTube channel YouTube dot com

1578
01:19:30,040 --> 01:19:34,000
Speaker 4: slash at Behind the Bastards. We love about forty percent

1579
01:19:34,040 --> 01:19:35,479
Speaker 4: of you, statistically speaking,