Speaker 1: Welcome back to the Fire Drill. Uh. I'm super tired.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna try to keep this energized. First of all,
Speaker 1: we talk live. We all give grades of live. And
Speaker 1: before you say we're gonna get all our anti live
Speaker 1: or not, it's not true. So listen to our grades
Speaker 1: of the first full year of live. Uh. We talked
Speaker 1: about what is now will always be referred to as
Speaker 1: the butter Ball Bermuda. Somebody on Twitter called it the
Speaker 1: butter ball instead of the butterfield, so we're calling it
Speaker 1: the butter ball and all the stories that come with that.
Speaker 1: We talk about Bannon Dunes and our trip there, and
Speaker 1: we rank all the courses. We talked about my swearing,
Speaker 1: we talk about I mean, it's insane. It's always a
Speaker 1: fire drill, It's crazy. We were super tired, Uh, but
Speaker 1: we we got it done. Before we get into the
Speaker 1: actual podcast, I want to thank We want to thank
Speaker 1: a couple of our sponsors, Dormy Workshop. This is when
Speaker 1: Alan Shipnik usually says artisanal. I don't even know what
Speaker 1: that is. They make club covers and putter covers. I
Speaker 1: don't know what artisanal neans, but supposedly there artisanal, so uh,
Speaker 1: Dormy Workshop is a great supporter of ours. So check
Speaker 1: them out and then uh part points the app. Uh
Speaker 1: it's a great way, a new way of scoring. It's
Speaker 1: awesome app use it go make par huge supporter of us.
Speaker 1: They sent us some bottles of wine while we're at
Speaker 1: Bandon Dunes. I'm not a wine drinker. I'm a Jack
Speaker 1: and coke drinker. But I did drink their wine. Uh
Speaker 1: so it was amazing wine. Uh power points. Dormy Workshop
Speaker 1: great supporters of the fire Pit. As you can see
Speaker 1: above my head, fire Pit, the fire Pit Collective. I'm
Speaker 1: in the office, flew down from Bandon. That's all I got.
Speaker 1: Jake's laughing at me, and here is us talking about
Speaker 1: the week in golf. I got can't you chan nothing thing? Well,
Speaker 1: what I'm thinking about? Can't get them? H think well
Speaker 1: I'm thinking about. Hello. This is Alan ship Knuck back
Speaker 1: for another fire Drill podcast. I am joined uh per
Speaker 1: usual by Michael Bamberger and Ryan Frent. We were doing
Speaker 1: these every Sunday, but because we were all three of
Speaker 1: us were in trans at home from Bandon. It's now
Speaker 1: Monday morning. But our dedication to you, the listener remains
Speaker 1: so um guys. We were. We were having a heck
Speaker 1: of a time in one of the greatest spots on Earth.
Speaker 1: But um, what was interesting to me was that, you know,
Speaker 1: a bandoned is the mecca for the recreational golfer in America,
Speaker 1: and you're you're surrounded by golf conversations at all times,
Speaker 1: and people are talking about their gear, and they're putting
Speaker 1: stroke and their favorite players and whether they're gonna go
Speaker 1: to the map Ssters next year and whatever. I mean,
Speaker 1: every conversation is infused with golf. Um. But I did
Speaker 1: not hear anyone talking about the Live finale in Miami,
Speaker 1: even though it was a pretty exciting event and had
Speaker 1: an interesting format. You had, uh, you had some some
Speaker 1: heavyweight matchups, you know, camp Smith taken down Phil Mickelson
Speaker 1: and in their in their singles, and you had you
Speaker 1: had a top finish, but it wasn't on the TV,
Speaker 1: in the grill room, it wasn't on the lips of
Speaker 1: the golfers. Um. I just thought it was an interesting dichotomy. Um,
Speaker 1: so what now that the first season is over and
Speaker 1: and it's all in the books, what do we think
Speaker 1: of where Live is and what do we think of
Speaker 1: what happened in Miami, and let's just talk about that
Speaker 1: for a little while. Somebody start, Michael is starting, Okay,
Speaker 1: I guess I'm starting. No, Michael, you start okay, he's
Speaker 1: shaking it off. Um season overall one bigger and more
Speaker 1: impact than I think any of us dreamed. I mean
Speaker 1: to think that Cam Smith and Dustin Johnson and Brooks
Speaker 1: Kepka and Bryson de Shambo would be playing anywhere else
Speaker 1: besides the PGA Tour is wild. Uh. And I don't
Speaker 1: think even the Live loyalists at the beginning of this
Speaker 1: thought in their first season they would have marquete names
Speaker 1: like that I should and I don't think any of
Speaker 1: us did. So the impact on the game is obvious. Uh.
Speaker 1: The PGA Tour change your whole structure. So for the
Speaker 1: people that are like, oh we negative live like they
Speaker 1: have made an impact, there's a hundred. There's no Anyone
Speaker 1: who says that you haven't is not being realistic. That
Speaker 1: being said, I don't know how they get anyone to care. Uh.
Speaker 1: And you said it perfectly that Sunday dinner or Saturday
Speaker 1: dinner is we have twenty four nerds. We are like
Speaker 1: when I say nerds, I mean, me and one of
Speaker 1: the players that was with us at Bandon are breaking
Speaker 1: down the Bermuda field, and the Bermuda field is deep
Speaker 1: in the weeds of of golf nersery. I mean, that
Speaker 1: leader board is like, I mean, you've got to be
Speaker 1: a serial, serious golf fan to to be locked in
Speaker 1: on that. And we hadn't talked about live and the
Speaker 1: only time we you brought it up and we talked
Speaker 1: about it was the fact that we hadn't talked about it.
Speaker 1: And I don't know how to overcome that because I
Speaker 1: mean that night I looked it up. I mean, Bryson
Speaker 1: and Louis Eustasen had a twenty three whole match, Like
Speaker 1: if that was in the World Golf Classic or in
Speaker 1: the match play tournament or whatever, people would have been
Speaker 1: locked in. And somehow, no, I didn't even know, no
Speaker 1: one cares for some reason in the United States, maybe
Speaker 1: some people overseas do. There's a more TV. I just
Speaker 1: don't know how they overcome it. I think the money
Speaker 1: aspect has turned more people off than it has turned
Speaker 1: people on. Like it just it's not the driving force
Speaker 1: of why people watch golf. I completely agree with that
Speaker 1: rhyme word for word, uh, And I would say, of
Speaker 1: course it has had an immense impact because we've seen
Speaker 1: the PGA Tour structure itself, and the PGA Tour has
Speaker 1: lost some of its marquee players. But it's the most significant.
Speaker 1: But at all professional golf exists for fans, This this
Speaker 1: first year seems almost inconsequential, not completely, but as you say,
Speaker 1: this was this was in theory a great event that
Speaker 1: nobody cared about in our circle anyway. I mean TV
Speaker 1: is obviously the key because if you had that Bryson
Speaker 1: match on TV, if you had Camp Smith against Um
Speaker 1: against Phil Nicholson even Sunday, you know I did, I
Speaker 1: did watch a lot of hlights and I did read
Speaker 1: everything that was written it, so I was I was
Speaker 1: paying attention. Um. You know, the Durral is of course
Speaker 1: that people know from so many, so many great championships
Speaker 1: there on the PGA Tour. It was set up as
Speaker 1: a real championship test. And you know Cam Smith shooting
Speaker 1: sixty five in the final round, three shots better than
Speaker 1: anybody else. I mean, it's just electric to watch that
Speaker 1: guy play golf. That was a reminder of it. So
Speaker 1: if it was on TV in the back drop people
Speaker 1: would have gotten into it, and it just seems like
Speaker 1: the biggest miss of all that Live could not find
Speaker 1: a way to get on any TV platform in the
Speaker 1: United States. And even this, uh excuse me, this Fox
Speaker 1: Sports deal that where they might buy the time would
Speaker 1: certainly be worthwhile investment because um again, if it's on
Speaker 1: the grill Room and bandon, people are going to tune
Speaker 1: into it because you know these players and you care
Speaker 1: about them and you have some emotional investment in them,
Speaker 1: and especially in a matchplace scenario, I think it would
Speaker 1: have been a great show. So that, to me is
Speaker 1: the biggest critique of all for a Live is that
Speaker 1: they just they never found a way to get themselves
Speaker 1: on TV throughout this whole season and obviously launching as
Speaker 1: as a beta test, and no one knew it to
Speaker 1: expect as soon as they signed Dustin um and and
Speaker 1: surprisingly good initial offering of players, and they kept adding
Speaker 1: players like it's really from from their perspective, I think
Speaker 1: that that was the difference maker, was not getting on TV,
Speaker 1: and that's still a riddle they're gonna have to solve
Speaker 1: for a year two. But because that's how you will
Speaker 1: get the casual fan even pay attention and or no
Speaker 1: you know that you you exist. So that was really
Speaker 1: driven home, um, because yeah, I mean we're having we're
Speaker 1: having lunch on Sunday waiting for the shuttle, and uh,
Speaker 1: you have college golf on TV, you have uh, you
Speaker 1: have European Tour, you have PGA Tour. Like in the
Speaker 1: ecosystem of golf, the one thing that's missing is live
Speaker 1: and that still bogs my mind. They couldn't get it done.
Speaker 1: There may be one significant thing that is missing in
Speaker 1: addition to uh a TV deal. Golf unique among you know,
Speaker 1: major professional sports has an element of charm to it,
Speaker 1: just like the tennis does when it's at Wimbledon in Paris.
Speaker 1: The Master certainly has a charm to it. The British Open,
Speaker 1: for sure, does you know? The weekly tour events, especially
Speaker 1: older established ones do and it is part of the
Speaker 1: appeal of the of the whole thing. And even as
Speaker 1: the golfers have become more athletic, physically, much bigger, there's
Speaker 1: still been the charm of the little ball, the little
Speaker 1: niceties to each other and I just you know, I know, golf,
Speaker 1: you know, is always derided for being this old timey
Speaker 1: thing that's aged out Uh, but maybe that whole thing
Speaker 1: really is a major part of everything about it, and
Speaker 1: and maybe Live is so off the mark there that
Speaker 1: it can't catch on because people don't want golf but
Speaker 1: louder the music or the shotguns starts and all and
Speaker 1: all the rest. Uh. I have no idea, but that
Speaker 1: would be I guess on my part that that's a
Speaker 1: good word for it. I mean Live offers many things,
Speaker 1: but charm is not one of them. I mean, the
Speaker 1: the product is so in your face, the personalities behind it,
Speaker 1: whether it's Greg Norman, or it's Sergio or Patrick Read
Speaker 1: or Pat Perez and his wife or you can go
Speaker 1: on down the list, like it's just a very aggressive
Speaker 1: set of personalities and um, you know, I'd say Rory
Speaker 1: has a certain charm about him, right, like there's um
Speaker 1: it's but Phil Nicholson does not. Like he's just so
Speaker 1: brash and and he's he's such a um, he's so
Speaker 1: polarizing and for whatever reason, Live just attracted those personalities,
Speaker 1: brooks Kepca, I mean Ian Poulter, Like you've gone down
Speaker 1: the list. I mean it's a very specific personality type.
Speaker 1: Um and so summed up by summed up by one
Speaker 1: quote I'll read from pet Perez, uh, who has struggled
Speaker 1: the entire Live season. So they asked him about it
Speaker 1: and he said, I get a lot of grief people
Speaker 1: saying I never sew up, so I did today. Uh,
Speaker 1: so everybody can just shut up. The guy plays one
Speaker 1: good round of golf and in state of being like, hey,
Speaker 1: you know, it was great to be in the team
Speaker 1: format or whatever thanks to my teammate. I mean, that's
Speaker 1: what he says. It's just so wild and there's so
Speaker 1: many heels, so many like I just they have leaned
Speaker 1: into it. And uh, at some point that just you know,
Speaker 1: I've always said, I like Bryson was very popular slash
Speaker 1: polarizing in the PGA Tour because there was a lot
Speaker 1: of you know, good guys around him. It's good to
Speaker 1: have a heel amongst a bunny good guys, but like
Speaker 1: just a bunch of heels is just not that just
Speaker 1: doesn't work. It's not working for some reason. You know,
Speaker 1: it's just not working. And uh, I just it's Cam
Speaker 1: is not totally outspoken, so he's I mean, he's definitely
Speaker 1: the quietest and and not the the you know, the
Speaker 1: heel type, but he just doesn't have the personality that
Speaker 1: already does, so he just doesn't offset those other guys
Speaker 1: to me. And just to follow up on what what
Speaker 1: Alan was saying about Phil raising Phil's name, Well, for
Speaker 1: thirty years, Phil actually was one of the more charming,
Speaker 1: if not really actually the most charming figure in golf
Speaker 1: because for that long run when he was so close
Speaker 1: and couldn't close it into major and then you know,
Speaker 1: and then when he started winning majors and contending to
Speaker 1: majors and not closing us opens and he had his
Speaker 1: parents there and his kids there and his wife there
Speaker 1: in an O Shuck's manner, and then badass Phil emerged,
Speaker 1: you know suddenly around at um, you know, with the
Speaker 1: leather coats and the whole thing, and it was a
Speaker 1: whole hair dial. Yeah, the hair tie and the everything
Speaker 1: was was different. And uh aviators and you captured this
Speaker 1: so well in your book that there's been you know,
Speaker 1: two films, uh and Uh. I was very drawn to
Speaker 1: old Phil. I have not you know, uh into new film.
Speaker 1: He's saw he saw a new fil so hard it's
Speaker 1: it makes you want to run the other way in
Speaker 1: my opinion. Um, but you know, Dustin Johnson, he had
Speaker 1: a certain charm of you know, c ball hit ball.
Speaker 1: There's a lots of different way. You know, charm is
Speaker 1: abroad really kind of a morphous kind of word. But
Speaker 1: you know, you think of VJ. Not a charming person,
Speaker 1: but there was a certain rugged charm to the fact
Speaker 1: that he would just stand on the range all day
Speaker 1: and hit balls and try to figure it out for himself.
Speaker 1: You know, that loner quality and uh, this lived to
Speaker 1: her is so much us against the world that actually
Speaker 1: the individualism, which is a huge part of the appeal
Speaker 1: for for me and I think for many is is
Speaker 1: so far lost. Interesting. Yeah, I mean Dustin is. It's
Speaker 1: funny because I feel like Dustin, among all the guys
Speaker 1: who went to live, he's taken the least amount of shrapnel,
Speaker 1: probably because people do like him, but mostly because he's
Speaker 1: just been very real about it, like it's great money,
Speaker 1: it's kind of fun. I'm wanna do something different. He's not.
Speaker 1: He's not talking any trash to the tour. He resigned
Speaker 1: his membership, he didn't sign on any lawsuits, and he's
Speaker 1: just kind of like, hey man, I'm just having I'm
Speaker 1: just having fun making birdies, making millions. What's a big deal,
Speaker 1: and people have accepted that from him because he has
Speaker 1: not been in your face about it and he's uh,
Speaker 1: he just kind of goes with the flow as always,
Speaker 1: so hey, speaking of people, is Charles Howell even on
Speaker 1: live like the man is disappeared, I mean truly disappeared,
Speaker 1: Like I mean we're talking about I think he's like
Speaker 1: fifteen or something ridiculous in the all time PGA twour
Speaker 1: winnings like this man was an a t M. I'm
Speaker 1: not sure he's alive. Is Charles Howell? Did Charles Howell
Speaker 1: play in any actual live events? Char You've got my number,
Speaker 1: give us the call. We want to know hashtag where's
Speaker 1: Chucky three sticks? I mean, where the hell is? Like
Speaker 1: that's a relatively big name, right, I mean Charles Howell
Speaker 1: is like a known name in golf. I haven't heard
Speaker 1: a damn. I'm not I'm swear I'm not sure he
Speaker 1: played in a live event. Well, I have proof of life.
Speaker 1: I saw him a few times. But yeah, okay, it's
Speaker 1: funny because he UM. I think early on when right
Speaker 1: when he signed UM, I said something on one of
Speaker 1: our podcasts about it's hard to be mad at Charles
Speaker 1: Howe and then when no one can really be that
Speaker 1: mad at Charles Howe. He just is. It was very benign,
Speaker 1: kind of throwaway line when he sent me on Instagram
Speaker 1: saying thank you so much for the support, and like
Speaker 1: that's how undersiege these guys are that if you if you, yeah,
Speaker 1: if you say anything nice about him, they're like even
Speaker 1: just sort of neutral, like so grateful. I thought that
Speaker 1: was really that. That was charming by Charles Howell. But yeah,
Speaker 1: Charles Howell and Cam tren Gali are two wild signings.
Speaker 1: I mean, Charles I get, Charles I get, but Cam
Speaker 1: tren Gali is a wild wild signing. Go ahead, Michael,
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, No, No, Judge Hendrick, I would say is
Speaker 1: a loss for the tour, you know, and lost Roger Cup.
Speaker 1: People are going to a great Roger Cup captain. And
Speaker 1: he would have been fun. He is a lot of fun.
Speaker 1: We've been so fun. And I mean I'm a big
Speaker 1: fan of Luke Donald too, but he doesn't have the
Speaker 1: personality of Henrik and in the presence, you know, it's
Speaker 1: just I thought you had to be European to be
Speaker 1: the European Cup captain. Well, I mean all these guys
Speaker 1: from Chicago, yeah, all these guys are pretty Americanized at
Speaker 1: this point. But um, that's what I'm saying about the
Speaker 1: heel part of it, Like we love Sergio, we'd love
Speaker 1: to hate Sergio and Ian because as they were amongst
Speaker 1: a bunch of nice European guys, and now they're just
Speaker 1: a bunch of like a couple of assholes amongst a
Speaker 1: bunch of assholes. So it's like, yeah, it's like, doesn't work.
Speaker 1: I will say, I mean echoing the earlier comments that
Speaker 1: I think on the whole, if you had to grade
Speaker 1: Lives debut, I still think it's got to be a
Speaker 1: B plus or something in that range where they had
Speaker 1: so many victories and as far as launching themselves and
Speaker 1: getting players and just the amount of buzz and discussion
Speaker 1: they've created, it far out strips it's you know, it's
Speaker 1: actual impact in the sports world. But um, you know,
Speaker 1: when I've sometimes I get asked to speak at at
Speaker 1: things or the book events, and there's always a Q
Speaker 1: and ATHEI end. So many questions are about live golf,
Speaker 1: And when I put up the ask Allen every week,
Speaker 1: so many questions about live golf. So people are tuned
Speaker 1: into it, but what they're tuned into is the controversy
Speaker 1: and the noise, and the macro developments and the sports
Speaker 1: washing and the and as a business story and as
Speaker 1: um as a Shakespearean you know, exercise and and and
Speaker 1: all these big themes, but they're not tuned into is
Speaker 1: the actual competition. So, I mean they've they've created an
Speaker 1: insane amount of buzz this year and credit to live.
Speaker 1: That's what they need to do. Get the name out there,
Speaker 1: make a mark in the larger sports world. Um, and
Speaker 1: they've done a spectacular job at that. But you can't
Speaker 1: you can't survive forever on that. At some point the
Speaker 1: competition has to become compelling and people have to be
Speaker 1: invested in the players, the teams and what's actually happening
Speaker 1: between the ropes. So for for year one, I think
Speaker 1: mission accomplished and they probably have to be delighted about
Speaker 1: where they are, But there are some very serious questions
Speaker 1: going forward if it's viable as a as a sporting
Speaker 1: entity and not just as a conversation piece. Yeah. I
Speaker 1: mean I put up a tweet yesterday about Pat perezdon
Speaker 1: is weekly his earnings. I mean it is insane. He
Speaker 1: played an eight live events basically broke part a couple
Speaker 1: of times um and made eight million over eight million dollars.
Speaker 1: And obviously there's some debate about whether the upfront money
Speaker 1: counts against that or a dozen or whatever. At minimum
Speaker 1: he made eight million dollars. If he has any upfront money,
Speaker 1: let's say it's five million. Just for conversation piece, he
Speaker 1: played eight events and made thirteen million dollars. In his
Speaker 1: twenty year PGA Tour career, he made twenty eight million.
Speaker 1: If I'm Pat Perez, I understand, like I like, there's
Speaker 1: no I mean, but to your point, Allan, it is
Speaker 1: like I put that tweet up and it is instantaneous interaction,
Speaker 1: like and it's relatively split down the mill And I
Speaker 1: wish I could have a poll underneath of it of
Speaker 1: like did any of you are that are saying good
Speaker 1: for Pat? Which I agree, good for Pat for going
Speaker 1: to make ten million dollars playing terrible golf, Like did
Speaker 1: they actually watch it? You know? And that's the conversation
Speaker 1: that you know, we continue to have is Yes, guys
Speaker 1: are making a lot of money. Yes, we understand why
Speaker 1: people are living. Yes, they have made a serious impact
Speaker 1: on the game of golf. Does anyone care outside of
Speaker 1: players leaving, does anyone care? And to Alan's A plus,
Speaker 1: I I would echo that I would give the exact
Speaker 1: same gray abuse. Uh. I mean when you think about
Speaker 1: where live golf was at the time of MOFO, what
Speaker 1: what was that February Allen? Yeah, okay, So then and
Speaker 1: then Nicholas did a forum at at the Honda tournament
Speaker 1: and and uh. Jimmy Roberts was the moderator, and he said, well,
Speaker 1: Phil's done this, and uh. And then Big Jack said, well,
Speaker 1: it looks like he'll be going alone in the house
Speaker 1: kind of applauded or left. And the idea it was
Speaker 1: it was over. You know, that's what people thought. And
Speaker 1: of course it's anything but over. They've got some of
Speaker 1: the biggest names in golf, they're playing big courses, they've
Speaker 1: got a capable telecast even though it's on YouTube. And
Speaker 1: I don't see how you can give it anything other
Speaker 1: than the A plus in terms of getting it up
Speaker 1: and running given where they were, and let's not forget
Speaker 1: about the pandemic that slowed them down for two years.
Speaker 1: So this, this whole thing shows the application, you know,
Speaker 1: the intelligent application of money, just like Augustin National does
Speaker 1: every year. Every year you'll go back to Augustin nationally
Speaker 1: done some new thing, and whether you like it or
Speaker 1: don't like it, it's always done well. And that's you know,
Speaker 1: the intelligent application of money to a problem. And that's
Speaker 1: not as easy as its ounds. So I agree, I
Speaker 1: would actually give it an a plus. But this let
Speaker 1: but the piece that we're speaking of, can you get
Speaker 1: people to care? You can't buy that, You really cannot
Speaker 1: buy that. Yeah, and I mean lived. They have some
Speaker 1: very very smart people behind the scenes. You know, they're
Speaker 1: unheard of for the sports fan. They don't speak publicly
Speaker 1: but when but they are very sharp, you know, some
Speaker 1: of them, Michael. I've talked to some of them, and um,
Speaker 1: some money plus brain power is powerful. Now. Obviously Greg
Speaker 1: Norman's made some gaffs and whatever, but um, the people
Speaker 1: behind the scenes are are pretty clever, and I think
Speaker 1: that that's part of how they've gotten this far. Norman
Speaker 1: has been very effective. You know. Norman has made the
Speaker 1: case of you know, he says short, simple things that
Speaker 1: may or may not be true, but they're landing. You know,
Speaker 1: this tour can be additive and people are like, yeah,
Speaker 1: what's wrong? Why not have more you know it was
Speaker 1: some competition. Good, So he's been effective. Can we talk
Speaker 1: about the Butterfield field. Let's talk about the Butterfield because
Speaker 1: that was super compelling. Uh, Ryan, these are your people
Speaker 1: that this this is You've You've built your life caring
Speaker 1: about things like the Butterfield Bermuda Open. So talk to viewers.
Speaker 1: People didn't care about the Butterfield. I was into it because,
Speaker 1: uh well, I'll just say this. I was at the
Speaker 1: North Bend Airport and James Power was contending and there's
Speaker 1: a couple of Irish guys on our trip and they
Speaker 1: were losing their minds because they know him personally and
Speaker 1: they know his spat answers, and they were hooting and
Speaker 1: hollering in like startling the other passengers. They were just
Speaker 1: watching my laptop because there's no TVs not airport, and
Speaker 1: it was that was a fun way to do it. So,
Speaker 1: so tell the listeners why why the Bermuda Open is
Speaker 1: your fifth major? I mean those kind of events, especially
Speaker 1: Bermuda because it's not an opposite field event, even though
Speaker 1: the field as very much an opposite field field. Wow,
Speaker 1: that's too many words, but it has none of the
Speaker 1: top players go there. Um, but Shamus is a great
Speaker 1: example of the guys I cover and with the thin
Speaker 1: line between making it and not making it. I mean
Speaker 1: I have told this story in a tweet many times.
Speaker 1: Saw Shamus literally, uh, sixteen months ago. Uh, whenever the
Speaker 1: Honda has played, maybe eighteen months ago on the on
Speaker 1: the range at the Honda Monday Qualifier, Mark and I
Speaker 1: were there, I was kidding. Saw Shamus walked up to him, said, hey, man,
Speaker 1: how's it going. Yeah, games, okay, I just need to
Speaker 1: get into some events. And I have a conversation and
Speaker 1: he said, I am I think I have thirteen events.
Speaker 1: He had like very low conditional status, and he said,
Speaker 1: I gotta get to fifteen events. Don't even care if
Speaker 1: I missed the cut. I gotta get to fifteen events
Speaker 1: for it to count as a year towards my pension.
Speaker 1: Like that's where he was in pro golf. I mean
Speaker 1: he was like, I'll take a start and missed the
Speaker 1: cut automatically just so I can get it. I mean
Speaker 1: that's where he was. Um. I think he was ranked
Speaker 1: five hundred in the world or around five hundred in
Speaker 1: the world. Uh. He won at the Barbersol Uh, and
Speaker 1: he won again this week and he is going to
Speaker 1: be in the top thirty in the world. He's gonna
Speaker 1: go to a second straight Masters. I mean, he couldn't
Speaker 1: crack an egg, you know, for a long time in
Speaker 1: his pro career, and something clicked. He changed caddies, he
Speaker 1: changed win coaches, whatever the reason was. Gained confidence mainly,
Speaker 1: and that's what I love about. And that's what the
Speaker 1: PGA Tour offers, uh to me is I've said it
Speaker 1: a million times. The guy who finished third, Ben Griffin,
Speaker 1: was working at desk job fourteen months ago. Those are
Speaker 1: the stories that I think the tour needs to do
Speaker 1: a much better job of telling. Uh. But also that's
Speaker 1: what you You can't create those, those are like actual
Speaker 1: stories that happened, and that is why I love the
Speaker 1: butter ball. Someone called it the butter ball on Twitter.
Speaker 1: So that's what's known as going forward. Well, and Dustin
Speaker 1: Johnson winning thirty five million dollars and eight events is
Speaker 1: pretty wild, but it's not gonna change his life. He
Speaker 1: already had the boats and the mansions and the cars,
Speaker 1: and his kids, kids, kids were were set for life.
Speaker 1: But what Ben Griffin just did is probably it's certainly
Speaker 1: career changing, possibly life changing, and you buried the lead
Speaker 1: Monday Q Info, you had Aaron Baddeley, a Monday qualifier
Speaker 1: who's in contention until the bitter end. Like that would
Speaker 1: have been epic if you could have done it, because,
Speaker 1: um tell tell the listeners a little bit about Aaron Baddeley,
Speaker 1: like you know, you know, if you remember where he
Speaker 1: won the Australian Open as as an amateur in the
Speaker 1: late nineties, he was gonna he was gonna be the
Speaker 1: next big thing. Um haw. He's had a decent two
Speaker 1: pretty good PGA tour career, but the last actumber years
Speaker 1: have been a real struggle. So what do they not
Speaker 1: know about the Aaron Baddley experience. You're talking about Aaron Badley.
Speaker 1: Aaron Badley one of the nicest people in the world. Ah. So,
Speaker 1: first of all, it's so wild the guy. I mean,
Speaker 1: I have the serious side of it is I have
Speaker 1: mad respect for a guy who has twenty two million
Speaker 1: dollars in career earnings, four PG twur wins at any Monday, Okay.
Speaker 1: I mean to the fact is he's going to get
Speaker 1: about ten starts a year no matter what. Uh as
Speaker 1: being a past champion, he can just wait for those
Speaker 1: and Aaron is at every Monday. In fact, he went
Speaker 1: to the Bermuda Monday, got in. It was played a
Speaker 1: week prior, not the traditional Monday of the week prior.
Speaker 1: By the time in the field all the withdraws, Aaron
Speaker 1: would have been into the field by sixteen people. He
Speaker 1: didn't even have to go to the Monday and most
Speaker 1: most players would have known that, knowing the history of
Speaker 1: the field. But for some reason, Aaron is there. Whenever
Speaker 1: Aaron is at a Monday, most of his family is there.
Speaker 1: I don't know why, but they don't believe in haircuts.
Speaker 1: None of them have had an haircut. There's their entire life.
Speaker 1: They have nine kids. They roll up in a bus,
Speaker 1: the battlies get off, they follow him during the playoff,
Speaker 1: there's baddles all over the place. I mean, this is
Speaker 1: a great example. At the Barracuda UH, the player can
Speaker 1: invite your caddy into the UH, into the dining area.
Speaker 1: So Marcus like, hey, man, just come in and eat
Speaker 1: with me. I go in. And this is not an exaggeration.
Speaker 1: The baddlies are having a foosball turn, like two of
Speaker 1: the kids versus other two of the kids. Grandma Amp
Speaker 1: are in there. The wife's in their errands there. It's Saturday.
Speaker 1: Aaron missed the cut by like ten points, and they
Speaker 1: still like just jamming away in there. So the battles
Speaker 1: are a why well, they're not a wild budget, but
Speaker 1: they are always everywhere. It's pretty wild. This is actually
Speaker 1: a great story. One of the three of us should
Speaker 1: get on the bus with the battles and go for
Speaker 1: like a cross country trip like that's gonna happen fire
Speaker 1: Pit Collective dot com at some point in two thousand
Speaker 1: twenty three. That sounds like an amazing story. Yes, I
Speaker 1: mean the whole clan, Grandma, grandpa, everybody. Yeah, into all
Speaker 1: the elves out there from other golf media outlets who
Speaker 1: monitor this podcast to Steeler ideas, you can't have that one.
Speaker 1: We're keeping that one. Yeah, that one's too good. Alex Myers, No,
Speaker 1: it's not happening. Yeah, don't touch it. Um, it's net
Speaker 1: need to think that Shamus Powers has played his way,
Speaker 1: you know, very likely to all four majors this year.
Speaker 1: Aaron Battle has had many years, whore has played all
Speaker 1: four majors who would like to be back or and uh,
Speaker 1: I think these events do help us keep our eye
Speaker 1: on the prize, which is if you want to be
Speaker 1: a professional golfer and really be the envy of your peers,
Speaker 1: the starting point is playing in all four majors. And uh,
Speaker 1: Charlie Howell's not going to do that. Henrik Sinson's not
Speaker 1: going to do that. Dustin Johnson will do it. But
Speaker 1: you know who knows for how much longer. Brooks Kepko
Speaker 1: you don't know for how much longer. Um, It's just
Speaker 1: it's just odd to think the champions Powers will have
Speaker 1: something that those guys won't well. And also, I mean
Speaker 1: Shamius Powers is very much in the conversation now for
Speaker 1: the Writer Cup or less than a year out from
Speaker 1: from Rome. Um. If you look at all of his stats,
Speaker 1: I mean, he's clearly one of the best twelve Europeans
Speaker 1: right now and you know, two victories in the space
Speaker 1: of what sixteen seventeen months. So if you can sustain
Speaker 1: this form, I mean, he's going to be important part
Speaker 1: of that team which is very much in transition and
Speaker 1: needs some of these young guys to assert themselves if
Speaker 1: they're going to be able to handle this very powerhouse
Speaker 1: US team. So UM, I guarantee you Luke Donald is
Speaker 1: very locked in on Jami's powers right now and and
Speaker 1: really um really excited to see his continued development and
Speaker 1: that that's a big deal. Alan how locked in or
Speaker 1: other Ryan and Allen how locked anything? Live is on
Speaker 1: Harrison Crow the uh the kid who won the Asian
Speaker 1: Pacific Amateur which gets you know, automatic spot into the
Speaker 1: into the Masters and and other elite events and had
Speaker 1: planned to term pro and now is not. Uh so
Speaker 1: is he auditioning for a live spot or is or
Speaker 1: what is he doing? You know, we don't know, but
Speaker 1: oh no they are because I I think I think
Speaker 1: I mentioned this previously. You know, I've talked to a
Speaker 1: couple of college coaches about this, and he says, there's
Speaker 1: as much, if not more conversation about Live then there's
Speaker 1: about the PGA tour among the college players because they
Speaker 1: know I'm live is keenly aware. A lot of the
Speaker 1: guys we've signed are old and getting older, and they
Speaker 1: need to make their own stars, if you will. They
Speaker 1: need young talent and um, and so these college kids
Speaker 1: know like, hey, if I have a great year, if
Speaker 1: I went in cuble A's are when the US Amateur
Speaker 1: or whatever it is, I'm going to get an offer
Speaker 1: from Live and as as Ryan has has documented so
Speaker 1: many times, just because you're a great college player means
Speaker 1: nothing on the long arduous tour or a trek to
Speaker 1: the PGA Tour. Whereas you know, if you can, if
Speaker 1: you can get in with Live in the Asian Tour,
Speaker 1: you're you're gonna make a nice living um. And so
Speaker 1: these young these young players know that. I thought a
Speaker 1: lot about that as I saw Tyler Strafacci miss by
Speaker 1: fourteen or something at first stage at you school, and
Speaker 1: James Piatt is that live at least who knows? You know,
Speaker 1: Rumors that I've heard is, you know, seven figure you're
Speaker 1: signing deal. Whether that was against his earnings or whatever,
Speaker 1: it doesn't matter. He's making millions of dollars and putting
Speaker 1: play relatively poor golf. And Tyler is playing poor golf
Speaker 1: and not making a time. And if you're the US
Speaker 1: Open champ, if you're the US Amateur champion, and you
Speaker 1: look at those two examples that are very very recent,
Speaker 1: those are the last prior to this year. I think
Speaker 1: those are the last two US Open champions. One is
Speaker 1: lost like lost in the he's playing a minor league
Speaker 1: tour event this week. I mean that is at the
Speaker 1: bottom of the professional golf barrel and one is flying
Speaker 1: in private jets and as a multimillionaire. And I get it.
Speaker 1: I say it all the time. I get it. And
Speaker 1: even in the best case scenario for the top players,
Speaker 1: unless they change the you know, PGA Tour, you you
Speaker 1: are going to go play on the corn Ferry Tour,
Speaker 1: and you have your choice of playing in Wichita, Kansas.
Speaker 1: I always say nothing against which Kansas for a million
Speaker 1: dollars or playing with Brooks Kapka and Brason de Shambo
Speaker 1: on their team and making a grand If you fire
Speaker 1: four eighties, I don't know if you're twenty two years old,
Speaker 1: if we all go back to the two year old
Speaker 1: we were, I don't know how that is a tough decision.
Speaker 1: I think Harrison Crows maybe twenty. I'm not sure, but
Speaker 1: imagine the pressure he's under right now at age twenty.
Speaker 1: It should be such a golden time in your life.
Speaker 1: But to play these events as an amateur professional and
Speaker 1: waiting with all this pressure on you, Uh, it's almost
Speaker 1: more than then then a person could take. And it
Speaker 1: actually makes you wonder whether whether it's gonna make golf
Speaker 1: enjoyable for him or not to have to have so
Speaker 1: much weight on him. Uh so early. I mean, if
Speaker 1: a kid comes out, if a kid's a great pitching prospect, whatever,
Speaker 1: coming out of high school. Uh, there's such a system
Speaker 1: of development and here it's like this or that really
Speaker 1: fast and really hard, and I think it'll I think
Speaker 1: it'll weigh on these kids in a very significant way.
Speaker 1: That's a great point. And even to extend the conversation further,
Speaker 1: I'm sure that's people saying, well, James Piatt is playing
Speaker 1: so bad he's not gonna be on Live next year.
Speaker 1: That first of all, every contract is different. He may
Speaker 1: have had a two or three year guarantee. We don't
Speaker 1: know that just yet. But even if he does get
Speaker 1: relegated to the Asian Tour slash in their national series,
Speaker 1: that's still much better money than you can make on
Speaker 1: the corn ferry, and it gives you a road back
Speaker 1: to live and so uh yeah, you're you're far from home.
Speaker 1: And that's also kind of cool because I would rather
Speaker 1: I would rather see the world than see you know.
Speaker 1: To use your example, Ryan, which dot Kansas like I'd
Speaker 1: played for three million dollars in qual lumpour or a
Speaker 1: million dollars, in which I like, to me, that's a
Speaker 1: great adventure when you're twenty two years old, and um,
Speaker 1: you know so. And I'll say this as again, is
Speaker 1: like I don't know James's family financial or Tyler's. It
Speaker 1: doesn't matter. Let's say they're both like just middle class
Speaker 1: people and both their careers flame out. I hope that
Speaker 1: doesn't happen, but let's just as a hypothetical, James is
Speaker 1: gonna go build a nice golf course on the or
Speaker 1: a nice house and the course he grew up with,
Speaker 1: and go be a club pro or speaker or whatever.
Speaker 1: And he has X million dollars, assuming he takes care
Speaker 1: of his money, he's basically set for life. And because
Speaker 1: he's gonna get three years out of this minimum, as
Speaker 1: you said, Alan, like, okay, he doesn't make live next year,
Speaker 1: he's gonna go play on the Asian Tour for a
Speaker 1: couple of years, even if he plays poorly, play okay whatever.
Speaker 1: Tyler is gonna play minor league tour events. And I
Speaker 1: just again, I get it, I get it, I and
Speaker 1: I the PGA Tour is gonna lose some top amateurs.
Speaker 1: There's just no way that some of those kids don't
Speaker 1: take it. I think to me, one of the biggest
Speaker 1: lessons from all of this, and one of the crucial
Speaker 1: mistakes that Jay Monahan made, is is overvaluing the PGA Tour.
Speaker 1: Like I think we're sent we're sentimental about the PGA Tour,
Speaker 1: especially me and Michael and you as well, Ryan. But
Speaker 1: you know, that's all we've known, that's all we've really covered.
Speaker 1: It was the big leagues. It was it was all
Speaker 1: that mattered in our thinking. Um. But I think for
Speaker 1: a lot of these golfers, you know, it's about making
Speaker 1: a living, it's about their future. And the difference between
Speaker 1: playing a live event in Miami versus a tour event
Speaker 1: uh in in different parts of Florida, it doesn't feel
Speaker 1: that much different. You know, there's the majors and there's
Speaker 1: everything else. And so I don't think that a lot,
Speaker 1: you know. I think these kids grew up dreaming about
Speaker 1: playing in the Masters, in the U S Open, and
Speaker 1: and that's it's still gonna be available to them if
Speaker 1: they play well on live. Um. I believe that. So, um,
Speaker 1: they didn't grow up dreaming about playing the Greater Heartford Open.
Speaker 1: So I think I think players are willing to give
Speaker 1: up the idea of the tour if the circumstances are
Speaker 1: right for them, and um, whereas that might have been
Speaker 1: unthinkable before, you know, because we have these we have
Speaker 1: the NFL versus the USFL analogy and some of these
Speaker 1: other ones where the other league's never caught on and
Speaker 1: they disappeared and and it was clearly always just the
Speaker 1: big time but the most the five most important events
Speaker 1: in golf for the majors, in the Wryder Cup are
Speaker 1: not controlled by the PGA Tour, And so um, if
Speaker 1: if the live players can still have access to those
Speaker 1: in some in some manner, um, at least even the
Speaker 1: thought they might, I think the tour becomes much less attractive.
Speaker 1: So um to some now there's you're gonna have your
Speaker 1: loyalists for sure. But um, I think that's been one
Speaker 1: of the that's been one of the lessons of this year,
Speaker 1: is that maybe we were kind of overrating the value
Speaker 1: of the PGA Tour to some of the players. Alan,
Speaker 1: what what would you like me to say to people
Speaker 1: when they asked me of you, is Alan pro or
Speaker 1: anti live? Um? The answers, yes, that's the answer. Um.
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm I'm trying I'm trying to both sides
Speaker 1: this whole thing to death, right like um, because there's
Speaker 1: people have kind of staked out these hardened positions, and
Speaker 1: I go back and forth. I'm critical Live and I'm
Speaker 1: also supportive of Live. I see, um, you know, I
Speaker 1: see what they've achieved, and I see the potential for
Speaker 1: the future, and I think it's quite interesting potentially they
Speaker 1: can if they can make the right moves, like I think,
Speaker 1: like like you, especially Michael, uncomfortable with the source of
Speaker 1: the money, and um, you know, there's a lot of
Speaker 1: polarizing figures that are part of Live that I'm not
Speaker 1: exactly rooting for. So um, I I try, much like
Speaker 1: my my three Woods off the tea, I just try
Speaker 1: and play it right down the middle. And you know,
Speaker 1: it's and I think people who have been confused about
Speaker 1: my feelings on Live, which I guess is good because
Speaker 1: I don't want to. I don't I don't want to
Speaker 1: before against and the same with the tour. I mean,
Speaker 1: I've been critical of monhand times and some of the
Speaker 1: tour moves, but I also I think I i've I
Speaker 1: can see the things that they've changed, and um, I
Speaker 1: want the tour to to succeed as well, because we
Speaker 1: need the tour like we don't. We don't want to
Speaker 1: badly diminish PG tour. That's not good for any of us.
Speaker 1: So uh, I'm I'm I'm pro and con PG tour
Speaker 1: and I'm pro and con live. I guess the alan
Speaker 1: as you get, as you get deeper into the reporting
Speaker 1: and the writing of your book, do you think at
Speaker 1: some point you will evolve to a place where you
Speaker 1: do have an opinion in the reader would actually know it,
Speaker 1: or do you think it maybe is incumbent upon you
Speaker 1: and behooves you to maintain this this sort of neutral
Speaker 1: position all through this writing process of the book. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think I guess I'm struggling with that a little
Speaker 1: bit because, Um, I think I think the easiest way
Speaker 1: to say is I'm critical both sides. That's my version
Speaker 1: of neutrality. Um. But um, and I can also see
Speaker 1: that you know, also give credit or credit to due
Speaker 1: and they've made the right moves. But um, yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean it's running for a political position we don't know about. Well.
Speaker 1: I think I think he's writing a really really sensitive,
Speaker 1: difficult book. Will Bardwell, I use his line all the
Speaker 1: time of tweet was will's a great follow if you
Speaker 1: don't follow on Twitter, he said, live versus the PGA
Speaker 1: Tour doesn't have to have a good guy. You know,
Speaker 1: every story doesn't have to have a good guy. It
Speaker 1: can have two bad guys. And yeah, in some ways
Speaker 1: that's more compelling that I guess. To answer your question, Michael,
Speaker 1: I just don't want I don't want to be obvious
Speaker 1: because if if if people say, oh, this is an
Speaker 1: anti Live book or I'm an anti Live reporter, then
Speaker 1: you close off, um, a lot of potential stories that
Speaker 1: I'd like to write. Same with the same if I'm
Speaker 1: if I'm if I'm pro live or you know what
Speaker 1: I mean. Like once you once you pick sides, then
Speaker 1: the other side tunes you out. And I don't mean institutionally,
Speaker 1: I mean the fans and the readers, um. Like, I
Speaker 1: think it's better if you know, if people don't really
Speaker 1: know your your true feelings, but it will probably come
Speaker 1: out in the book because at that point, um, you know,
Speaker 1: I've I'll be a little deeper into the process and
Speaker 1: I can, I can, I can let it go if
Speaker 1: you will. But part of the problem is I don't
Speaker 1: really know how I feel just yet, Like because I'm
Speaker 1: trying to you know, I've talked a lot of them
Speaker 1: live folks, and I see their point. Talk to a
Speaker 1: lot of the tour folks, I see their point. So, UM,
Speaker 1: I think being flexible in your opinion is a good
Speaker 1: thing in our jobs. When once you once you once
Speaker 1: you take a heartened stance, um, then you start tuning
Speaker 1: out the other information. I mean, that's that's a problem
Speaker 1: with the modern age, right is is everything is so polarizing,
Speaker 1: and then you just seek out the information that reinforces
Speaker 1: your point of view. And that's not my role here,
Speaker 1: So I'm I'm trying not to be in a bunker. Yeah.
Speaker 1: That that is very well said, quick techual. Cool question
Speaker 1: for Alan, very very well said. Do you think that, um,
Speaker 1: do you think that sixteen events and sixty players is
Speaker 1: where this thing is headed for year two? And then
Speaker 1: beyond year two do you think you could go Do
Speaker 1: you think both those numbers could go up as well?
Speaker 1: I think they're committed to fourteen for next year. I
Speaker 1: think there will be sixty players in that the same
Speaker 1: They're going to try and hold the field at forty eight.
Speaker 1: That's what they've committed to. But they're not gonna say
Speaker 1: forty guys at every tournament. I mean you saw that. Um,
Speaker 1: your players will get essentially traded and or demoted sixty
Speaker 1: on the live roster, but only forty playing per event exactly,
Speaker 1: so an event correct, still forty eight in the events.
Speaker 1: But the player movement's gonna be interesting and you're seeing
Speaker 1: it right now. Like, um, that was a subtext as
Speaker 1: week in Miami is teams are trying to get locked
Speaker 1: in for next year, but some of the players are
Speaker 1: working both sides the street. Like obviously Taylor Gooch had
Speaker 1: had a great success with the four Aces and they'd
Speaker 1: like to have him back. I mean he's he's clearly
Speaker 1: one of the best thirty or forty players in the world.
Speaker 1: Even his world ranking says that. But he's getting he's
Speaker 1: getting inquiries from other captains and they're trying to recruit him,
Speaker 1: and um, so yeah, there'll be something that could really
Speaker 1: be an implosion, that could be like super that could
Speaker 1: be very compelling. Like you could have some like like
Speaker 1: if you actually steal I mean not steel or trade
Speaker 1: for sign whatever, like one of the players. There could
Speaker 1: be some like true rivalries developed over time between like
Speaker 1: say I can't I can't say these stupid names out
Speaker 1: loud without laughing. But like the Nibblix steal somebody and
Speaker 1: the four Aces are playing. I mean, it's so ridiculous
Speaker 1: the names. But like you could you could create some true,
Speaker 1: true true like uh, you know, hard feelings if you
Speaker 1: take one or two of their players and then you
Speaker 1: play in a match, you know later that's been that's
Speaker 1: sort of part of their plan all along. Like it's
Speaker 1: all been kumbaya this year because it's live against the
Speaker 1: world and they all have each other's back, and I
Speaker 1: think that's genuine. But it's gonna become there's some business
Speaker 1: decisions are gonna start messing with that, and guys are
Speaker 1: gonna start looking out for themselves a little bit. And
Speaker 1: they want to be on the winning team. They want
Speaker 1: to be Pat Prez. They they'd love to be the
Speaker 1: worst player on the winning team. Right, that's a good
Speaker 1: place to be. Um. You know, some of these teams
Speaker 1: never even sniffed a podium, and you know they want
Speaker 1: to get struck. Begging them. I'm begging to live people
Speaker 1: to change their names, begging it's gonna happen. I can't
Speaker 1: say out loud niblicks one more time. I can't. I
Speaker 1: just it's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. This is
Speaker 1: this has all been such a beta test, and next
Speaker 1: year it's all gonna be baked out. They'll be new names,
Speaker 1: new new merch new logos, different players on different teams,
Speaker 1: and the players all have much more input, like they
Speaker 1: had to launch with something, you know, and then players
Speaker 1: kept coming online and players change teams, and so they
Speaker 1: never really they never they never really dialed in all
Speaker 1: the all the team names. I'm actually i'd never buy
Speaker 1: anything in any golf tourmer I haven't spent my own
Speaker 1: money on an item of apparel, probably since my first
Speaker 1: Masters was an intern. But I sort of have a
Speaker 1: little regret that I didn't scoop up some of the
Speaker 1: the live team merchandise because it's it's so funny and
Speaker 1: and like campy. I should have I should have a
Speaker 1: few of those hats to wear them around peoplen't even
Speaker 1: know what it is, but those if you know, you know,
Speaker 1: it would have been quite funny. But I never can.
Speaker 1: Someone remind me. Hope my wife listens to all of
Speaker 1: our podcast, but hopefully she doesn't listen this far in
Speaker 1: I'm supposed to buy a coffee cup at every place
Speaker 1: that I visit for her, and I forgot Benon Dude.
Speaker 1: So when we get off, please remind me to get
Speaker 1: online and buy a Bannon Dude's coffee mug and send
Speaker 1: it home and pretend like I bought it at the
Speaker 1: course and head it chipped, and then we'll just keep
Speaker 1: it between us and the ten people that listen to
Speaker 1: this podcast. Is four Crushers? Is that one of the teams.
Speaker 1: There are the Crushers, and there are the four races,
Speaker 1: but there are not four Crushers. I only say this
Speaker 1: because I'm looking on eBay right now. For seven dollars
Speaker 1: and cents, it says here you can buy a Crusher's
Speaker 1: team logo. Cool unique T shirt. Alright, next podcast, mixed podcast,
Speaker 1: We're going to buy We're buying live merch for each
Speaker 1: other and have to wear what we send each other. Okay,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna send you my favorite team merch and then
Speaker 1: you send me, and we're all going to have a
Speaker 1: team and we'll break down the niblicks and the and
Speaker 1: the Crushers and the whatever. The Crushers seem to be
Speaker 1: the only people available on eBay. I kind of regret
Speaker 1: not like just leaning into the bit and going to
Speaker 1: every press conference and just hammering the players like do
Speaker 1: you think that this course sets up well for the
Speaker 1: Nibletis And just just like question after question like it
Speaker 1: would have been it would have been a great bit.
Speaker 1: But Michael and Ryan, you just came back from Bannon
Speaker 1: Dunes for the first time without a coffee mug. But
Speaker 1: a lot of other thoughts. And um, let's talk about Bandon.
Speaker 1: I've been blessed to go there now probably ten or
Speaker 1: eleven times. And um, for two rookies, what did you
Speaker 1: think of abandoned dudes? I will go first. It was
Speaker 1: I mean, it's unreal, um, and golf to me for
Speaker 1: for me, and I appreciate that people want to play
Speaker 1: very difficult golf courses and you can play these courses
Speaker 1: very difficult, and we played it in very ideal weather conditions,
Speaker 1: so it made it easier. I love the playability of
Speaker 1: all the courses. I can take my buddies and we
Speaker 1: can play the right teas who is going to shoot
Speaker 1: a hundred and we don't have to look for golf
Speaker 1: balls all day and he's not gonna be miserable. The
Speaker 1: vibe is great, and I know we're gonna get to
Speaker 1: our rankings. But my favorite part, my favorite course was
Speaker 1: the part of three course. It's like a course I
Speaker 1: could have in my backyard and play every single day,
Speaker 1: Like I love it. I loved it. I could. You
Speaker 1: could go out and drink some beers, play six sms,
Speaker 1: play it difficult, play it easy. It's a great course.
Speaker 1: It requires all the shots. It's laid back. I mean,
Speaker 1: it was unreal. The place is unreal. I love the
Speaker 1: I love the whole experience applying those courses. Uh, I
Speaker 1: am so not interested in resort golf. When that guy
Speaker 1: with the knickers comes running up to you and grabbing
Speaker 1: the clubs from you because God forbid you should carry
Speaker 1: your own This place is so not like that. You
Speaker 1: have the feeling that's expensive and complicated. Actually, if you
Speaker 1: get online and start looking at prices, you know, if
Speaker 1: you're willing to play in you know, in cooler weather
Speaker 1: or chance your weather, it's not expensive. You can carry
Speaker 1: your own bag, you can stay at a motel down
Speaker 1: the street, you can get a cheat time. Um, it's
Speaker 1: loaded with charm, which you can't believe they could pull
Speaker 1: that off with all the many holes that they have
Speaker 1: their Uh. With the putting course and the part three
Speaker 1: and the I guess it's five eighteen whole courses. Um,
Speaker 1: the quality of the turf is outstanding to be that
Speaker 1: near the ocean. Um in the United States, it's it's
Speaker 1: it's incredible. I've been fortunate enough to play a lot
Speaker 1: of golf as you have, Allen. We played a lot
Speaker 1: of great golf together in Scotland and in the UK.
Speaker 1: It's very similar to that experience. And um, it's not pretentious.
Speaker 1: Uh I think it's brilliant. What what what Mike Kaiser
Speaker 1: and in our for me if people have done there
Speaker 1: and it's inspiring, and I would really urge people that
Speaker 1: there's a lot of great places to go in this game.
Speaker 1: But I know we have people who are really devoted,
Speaker 1: uh to the game. And just for my own example,
Speaker 1: I was resistant, and uh I am sales resistant by nature,
Speaker 1: and uh I was overwhelmed by just the joy of
Speaker 1: the golf experience there. Yeah, that's beautifully sad. You know
Speaker 1: how I always say it's hard to follow up people.
Speaker 1: Thank god I went first. You know, like, did you
Speaker 1: hear that? Fucking I've only said f ford one time?
Speaker 1: Did you hear that? Did you hear that. I mean,
Speaker 1: thank god I went first. Like this guy, I was
Speaker 1: just like, yeah, it's great. I was like, I like
Speaker 1: the part three because I can smoke pot on it,
Speaker 1: and he just went into this wonderful soliloquy of how
Speaker 1: wonderful it was. I mean, Jesus, thank god I went
Speaker 1: first in that scenario. Indeed, yeah, it is special. I mean,
Speaker 1: I'm sure both of you guys have people hit you up.
Speaker 1: And because I have been lucky to travel a lot
Speaker 1: of places and they ask where Buddy's trip, where should
Speaker 1: I go, It's like it's it's not even close. Obviously,
Speaker 1: I live in the Pebble Beach area, and uh, these
Speaker 1: courses are very dear to me. But it's a completely
Speaker 1: different experience. And if you don't have access to the
Speaker 1: private clubs here, you know, you have Pebble Beach Golf
Speaker 1: Links and you have Spyglass Hill, and then it's a
Speaker 1: pretty steep fall off for your third course. I guess
Speaker 1: possit Tampa if you want to drive an hour, but
Speaker 1: you know, pine Hurst has is loaded with charm and
Speaker 1: I love Tobacco Road if you willing to drive twenty minutes,
Speaker 1: But um, I mean the four courses at Bannon and
Speaker 1: Old Mac is is more polarizing. We don't even play
Speaker 1: it on this trips. You guys didn't see it, but
Speaker 1: the top four for most of us are just so
Speaker 1: incredibly good and the logistics are so easy. Like we had,
Speaker 1: you know, we had these Irish guys who were abandoned
Speaker 1: for the first time, which is a hell of a
Speaker 1: long trip. And credit to um to Marty Carr for
Speaker 1: making the trip killing no doubt had been there before,
Speaker 1: but as Marty's first time, and you know he runs
Speaker 1: a travel business car golf over over An Ireland in
Speaker 1: the UK, and so he's seen it all. And you know,
Speaker 1: Marty was just completely blown away, like like like especially
Speaker 1: you Michael and and and Ryan, and it was just, um,
Speaker 1: there's the ease of it all because we were saying, like, okay,
Speaker 1: we go to south If we go to Southwest Ireland
Speaker 1: to play a tournament like this, I mean, you know,
Speaker 1: from Waterville to tow the Hinges in Valley Bunny and
Speaker 1: it's it's two hours and you probably have to sleep
Speaker 1: somewhere else that night. And um, so you know, when
Speaker 1: you go on down the list of all the great
Speaker 1: destinations in the world, there's nothing like Bandon from the quality,
Speaker 1: the quantity, and the ease and and then every every
Speaker 1: detail you know, like the Saturday night where it sitting
Speaker 1: at the fire pit in these you know, these hundred
Speaker 1: foot tall trees and um, if you if someone's hungry,
Speaker 1: you order pizza, they bring a pizza, and you around
Speaker 1: a beer, they'll bring a beer. And it's just everything
Speaker 1: is um. It is just is so well thought out
Speaker 1: and so service oriented without as you say, Michael, being
Speaker 1: over the top. So it is. It is really special.
Speaker 1: And I would just add to to Ryan's point, and
Speaker 1: I know people won't do it. I'm suggesting I would
Speaker 1: actually really do it. Just play from the teas that
Speaker 1: are gonna They're going to make the course playable and
Speaker 1: fun for you, where you can find your golf ball
Speaker 1: and the hole is too tight for you to hit
Speaker 1: driver and in the goals to find your book for
Speaker 1: that one hole. Just move up at tea and others.
Speaker 1: Don't worry about all these U. SJ. Regulations or whatever else.
Speaker 1: I think Bandoned think one other time I went, I
Speaker 1: found I found that the Doe course too difficult, and
Speaker 1: I think it was poor weather and the rest this
Speaker 1: year we played it very short. It was it was
Speaker 1: very playable. Um. But golf is supposed to have pleasure
Speaker 1: to our lives and a big starting point for that
Speaker 1: is playing from the right tea for that hole, uh,
Speaker 1: in that wind condition. So go you know to agree
Speaker 1: that people now golf rs are rules followers, and I
Speaker 1: know it's hard for people to do what I'm suggesting,
Speaker 1: but I really do mean, well, we we play the
Speaker 1: green teas, so that that's you know, sixty two six
Speaker 1: yards um, maybe sixty four um my pack, but that
Speaker 1: that's a nice number. And we didn't have a lot
Speaker 1: of wind. You know, we used to we used to play.
Speaker 1: So we're all there for the Uncle Tony Invitational. Shout
Speaker 1: out to Imaginella, who's been doing it for close to
Speaker 1: a decade now and it runs so efficiently. He's got
Speaker 1: it really dialed in, and he's already planning the two thousand,
Speaker 1: twenty four Uncle Tony Invitational. Not Evenson has already planned
Speaker 1: like it. The amount of care he puts into it
Speaker 1: is remarkable and um. But yeah, so there's a lot
Speaker 1: of excellent golfers who are part of that crew, and
Speaker 1: we could play the blacks um and those courses would
Speaker 1: be a lot harder, but it wouldn't be as much fun.
Speaker 1: And you abandoned it gives it takes away. I mean
Speaker 1: you can make birdies out there for sure, especially you know,
Speaker 1: we used to play in in July when there's a
Speaker 1: lot windier and and the greens were plenty. You know,
Speaker 1: when you you're playing, you're playing the fifth hole at
Speaker 1: Bandon Dunes and the twin on our wind. I mean
Speaker 1: it's like driver three wood and you gotta thread it
Speaker 1: through those dunes. I mean, um, that's that's a big gask.
Speaker 1: And so you know you're right, Michael. Like part of
Speaker 1: its charm, is it they the courses don't beat you up. Um, now,
Speaker 1: you hit a bad shot, you can be severely punished,
Speaker 1: but that's also part of what the game's about. But
Speaker 1: you can score and um yeah, and that that's important
Speaker 1: because you don't want to. It's hard to get there.
Speaker 1: I mean it is, no matter where you're coming from.
Speaker 1: And you guys coming from Philly, coming from from you know,
Speaker 1: essentially Chicago Airport. I mean those are those are tough
Speaker 1: travel days. But uh so you don't want to get
Speaker 1: there and just get punched in the nose over and
Speaker 1: over like you want to you want to hit some
Speaker 1: shots and you want to feel like you can play
Speaker 1: the golf course. And I think from the green teas
Speaker 1: that that's always the case. Right, quick question, right what
Speaker 1: what part five? Was it when you hit driver for
Speaker 1: iron whole high at the at the first course? Was
Speaker 1: that nine? No? No, that was sixteen on Trails up Hill? Yeah,
Speaker 1: big power, big power. Yeah. I thought you were in
Speaker 1: a tiny little bunker shot. Oh that that bunker shot
Speaker 1: was Yeah, you gotta made what did you not hit
Speaker 1: that ball hole high? That foreign? Yeah, but in a
Speaker 1: bunker and then I had a little tight little thing.
Speaker 1: Let's talk about let's do a whole pot on that
Speaker 1: whole because that was pretty good. Yeah, it just drifted
Speaker 1: left on the wind. He was in the he was
Speaker 1: pin high, Michael, but that was it was like ten
Speaker 1: ft and then and then and then he got up
Speaker 1: and down out of the trap. Yeah for a four. Yeah,
Speaker 1: hited to it like a foot and a half. I remember,
Speaker 1: I remember it. Ryan, even Iran. Yeah, we played together
Speaker 1: the first D eight Trails and Ryan and his partner
Speaker 1: killing no doubt, who's uh, this it's just absolutely from
Speaker 1: du just wonderfully insane very successful in as a maker
Speaker 1: of medical devices. But you put on the golf course
Speaker 1: and he's just he's a little terrier, and he's just
Speaker 1: full of life and energy and really fun to play
Speaker 1: with and a very I'd like to publicly apologize for
Speaker 1: the for the letdown on the final day. I played
Speaker 1: some of the best golf I've played in my adult
Speaker 1: life the first three days, and probably one of the
Speaker 1: worst rounds of my adult life the last round on
Speaker 1: the last hole at two sixty out and a part
Speaker 1: five with a shot. All I had to do was
Speaker 1: make a regular part in a par five and we
Speaker 1: are in the playoff, and I fanned a three would
Speaker 1: so far right that my caddy, who was very, very good,
Speaker 1: was like, there's no trouble on this whole I found. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's how bad my three would was in the last Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's the eighteenth that abandoned dunes. And yeah, you just
Speaker 1: got played on the left side, right, And you'll know
Speaker 1: that in better next time. But what if all were
Speaker 1: those other guys on when we were coming up eighteen
Speaker 1: and they were yelling at each other, like the group
Speaker 1: on the green and the group they were they were
Speaker 1: at the preserve. Yeah, that was a funny moment. So
Speaker 1: we were we were playing eighteen. Michael is my partner
Speaker 1: and um and as you're as those have been abandoned, No,
Speaker 1: what separates you from the preserves about a hundred and
Speaker 1: fifty yard wide gulf, you know, of course essentially, and
Speaker 1: there was there was clearly a big buddy's trip playing
Speaker 1: the preserve and either I think there were six or
Speaker 1: eight sims in each group as we played, and they
Speaker 1: were on they were on consecutive holes, and they started
Speaker 1: shouting each other, um, and the guys played all the
Speaker 1: way back, you know, and they were so heated because
Speaker 1: I guess one of the groups wasn't playing the correct tease.
Speaker 1: But they were going back and forth and back with
Speaker 1: and it was like there was no like levity in
Speaker 1: their voices. They were serious, but it was so loud
Speaker 1: it was disturbing us. So finally I showered across the divide.
Speaker 1: I was like, guys, have fun, and one of the
Speaker 1: dude said thank you, like they just needed to hear it,
Speaker 1: like it just snapped him back into like that was
Speaker 1: the loudest argument on in golf course I've ever seen it.
Speaker 1: Think some really urban munis where guys will go at it,
Speaker 1: but later in the round I didn't. I couldn't hear,
Speaker 1: but I couldn't hear exactly what they were saying, but
Speaker 1: you could tell that they were heated. You guys were
Speaker 1: close enough that you could hear words, but later in
Speaker 1: the round they were like yelling, you know, drunk and fun.
Speaker 1: So whatever you said, Alan was like, I'm not taking
Speaker 1: all the credit. They just came to their senses. But
Speaker 1: it was really fun to watch you and Killing Ryan
Speaker 1: because we played that first day at Trails and you
Speaker 1: guys played your butts off and so yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: you came up one shot short, but it's just fun
Speaker 1: to be in the mix. And it really I've been there.
Speaker 1: I said this to my to Mark. I was like,
Speaker 1: I never thought like it was fun to feel disappointed,
Speaker 1: if that makes sense. Like I didn't think I cared,
Speaker 1: and I was like I was genuinely piste off for
Speaker 1: a minute and like you know, and it's like meaningless
Speaker 1: and then obviously it's meaningless, but like it was felt
Speaker 1: good to be disap pointed, if that made sense. I
Speaker 1: just want to say this because I talked to Killing
Speaker 1: about this, because I've had a couple of times where
Speaker 1: we were we had not Michael, another partner, we had
Speaker 1: a chance to win, to win the Uncle Tony. And
Speaker 1: we do welcome the U T I jokes, um, because
Speaker 1: those are the initials. And we came. You know, we
Speaker 1: lost the playoff. We we finished one shot out of
Speaker 1: a playoff another time. And like the nerves you feel
Speaker 1: on those closing holes, the adrenaline, it's almost impossible to
Speaker 1: replicate that in adult life. I means how I used
Speaker 1: to feel like playing high school basketball. But you know
Speaker 1: that just that incredible intensity and wanting it so much
Speaker 1: and having to control all the the flood of uh
Speaker 1: different substances are released by your body, the serotonin, the testosterone,
Speaker 1: the adrenaline and have to execute shots and not wanting
Speaker 1: to let your partner down. And I mean, yes, beyond
Speaker 1: our little group, nobody really cares. But the rest of
Speaker 1: us care so deeply. And that's why it's so great
Speaker 1: about golf, as you can actually have that feeling like
Speaker 1: and I can play pick up basketball at the y
Speaker 1: m c A. And you're not gonna have that adrenaline
Speaker 1: and um, you know, maybe if you if you're a
Speaker 1: stockbroker and you're betting your mortgage on something you you'll
Speaker 1: have that if you're a degenerate gambler who's got a
Speaker 1: hundred thousand dollars in the super Bowl. Maybe, but um,
Speaker 1: it's really hard to to buy that feeling as as
Speaker 1: an adult out of organized sports. And um, that's one
Speaker 1: of the things that makes golf so great is you
Speaker 1: can get so lost in it that it means the
Speaker 1: world to you for for and um, it's really one
Speaker 1: of the pleasures of that of that tournament. And in
Speaker 1: tournament you play with your friends. All right, can we
Speaker 1: do what you want to do? Just a top and
Speaker 1: a bottom? No? No, yeah, So just to reiterate for
Speaker 1: the purpose of this, you guys didn't didn't get to
Speaker 1: see old McDonald, So, um, do your top five, Just
Speaker 1: do your top four. We know you both love the
Speaker 1: Preserve the part three your course, like given, everyone loves
Speaker 1: the Preserve, but it's slightly different. So we're gonna say
Speaker 1: the Preserve is one of the greatest experiences in golf.
Speaker 1: But just give us one through four on the other
Speaker 1: could I just offer one thing the way I'm looking
Speaker 1: at this and if you guys, you guys, look at
Speaker 1: it anyway you wish. I'm saying, if you had one
Speaker 1: day to play one course all day and you could
Speaker 1: only choose one, which would it be. That's the definition, Sean.
Speaker 1: You've been going in. Okay, I'm taking Sheep's Ranch first,
Speaker 1: the Part three course, second, Bandon Dunes, the original course, third,
Speaker 1: Specific Dunes, fourth Bandon Trails. Five. It's crazy. It's called
Speaker 1: Bandon Trails five. That's the core crunch of course. It's
Speaker 1: one of the most beautiful courses in the world period.
Speaker 1: And I've had a great fortune played many, many, many
Speaker 1: great beautiful courses. But that's that's that's something in my five.
Speaker 1: I am going see Branch first, by a long shot,
Speaker 1: By a long shot. They're all great. I'm just saying, like,
Speaker 1: clearly for me, number one of the long courses, the preservist,
Speaker 1: the one I would say is one if I if
Speaker 1: I had to rank it in there, um Bandon, Bandon Trails,
Speaker 1: Bandon Do, and Pacific is last. For me. It was wonderful,
Speaker 1: it's great, there's no complaints about it's just not It's
Speaker 1: just my last. And she branched again. Because you could
Speaker 1: play with anyone, you could play. You could take will
Speaker 1: Crop out there, who shot sixty four, and you could
Speaker 1: play the back tis, he could play the back teas,
Speaker 1: you could play the forward tease. You could have some
Speaker 1: sort of match. You could take your guy who shoots
Speaker 1: a hundred out there and not be looking for balls
Speaker 1: all day. There's no bunkers. It still has some difficulty
Speaker 1: to it despite being wide open. It's not like, of course,
Speaker 1: you can just go out and fire seventy every time.
Speaker 1: You can make it hard. If there's elements, it's hard.
Speaker 1: I mean it's all of them that we played work great.
Speaker 1: That for me. She Branch was above as it can be.
Speaker 1: It's my clear number one. So so Ryan, if you could,
Speaker 1: you could go for a day. You'd rather play a
Speaker 1: sheep's ranch all day long than the Part three all
Speaker 1: day long. No, no, no, I'm alan put a asteri parte.
Speaker 1: That's fine. There's no rules to this, just as a
Speaker 1: side not I will not name names. But on the
Speaker 1: Part three course, we were playing eight sums and one
Speaker 1: of the players in the other foursome we're playing a
Speaker 1: four person scramble. One of the persons, one of the
Speaker 1: people in the other foursome offered some performance in Hampton
Speaker 1: Gummies that was anti performance and dancing, and I've never
Speaker 1: seen such good players such terrible shots when it was
Speaker 1: a scratch Goloffer who had three shanks dead shanks in
Speaker 1: a row. I mean, it's one of the challenges. One
Speaker 1: of the challenges of the t I is you have
Speaker 1: to it's gummy management. Um yeah, I mean, you gotta
Speaker 1: really know what you're doing. On the last day killing
Speaker 1: O dubbed My part was like, you know, do I
Speaker 1: have another drink? Do I have less drinks? Do I
Speaker 1: drink less? Do I not drink enough? You know, it's
Speaker 1: like it's a it's a dicey bell curve. I would
Speaker 1: say for me, Bannon Dunes is number one. I just
Speaker 1: think the flow of that golf course is so wonderful.
Speaker 1: There's not a hole in there. I really don't love,
Speaker 1: even though the ones that kick my butt. Number two,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna say Trails. I think it's the most wondrous
Speaker 1: routing on the planet. It just you start in the dunes,
Speaker 1: then you're in the meadows, then you're you're in the forest,
Speaker 1: and then you're on this giant sand hill, and then
Speaker 1: you're back in you're back in the forest, and then
Speaker 1: you're in the dunes. You know, there's like I don't
Speaker 1: like the first hole. I don't really like the fourteenth hole,
Speaker 1: but um, I think the whole experiences is pretty magical. Um,
Speaker 1: then I would do sheep, and then I would do pack,
Speaker 1: which is amazing because Specific Dunes is in a lot
Speaker 1: of the top twenty or thirties and and all the
Speaker 1: one top one hundred rankings. I mean, it is a
Speaker 1: phenomenal golf course and there's so many great holes, but it, um,
Speaker 1: it just doesn't move me the same way. And I
Speaker 1: feel like for those who have been lucky enough to
Speaker 1: play it and they know, like incredible, that's you're you're
Speaker 1: playing along the ocean and there's that giant dude on
Speaker 1: your right. Once you make a right turn, you leave
Speaker 1: that hole. I think the finishes is a little underwhelming
Speaker 1: and so um. And in the wind it's a total
Speaker 1: bit so um to the point where it can it
Speaker 1: can really beat you up more than the others. I
Speaker 1: think the others are more playable in the wind. So
Speaker 1: it's crazy. Think Pacific Dunes, which is one of the
Speaker 1: greatest golf course in the planet, somehow its number four
Speaker 1: in any ranking. But that's just that's just how I feel,
Speaker 1: And I mean that I love the Preserve as much
Speaker 1: as you guys do. But if I, if I had
Speaker 1: one day abandoned, I would want to play play the
Speaker 1: big courses. So reluctantly I'll put that fifth in this
Speaker 1: little ranking, but at the same time, I'd be happy
Speaker 1: to play that the rest of my life. And and
Speaker 1: so it's, um, it's quite And you know, next time, Michael,
Speaker 1: you need to play all Matt because you would appreciate it.
Speaker 1: It's kind of funky and I think you'd probably like
Speaker 1: it then most people do. And that finishes phenomenal. And
Speaker 1: the third hole you hitting over this dude with that
Speaker 1: famous tree, Like, well, if you put all Mac in
Speaker 1: any city in America, players would be they would be
Speaker 1: beside themselves with how great it is. So it's just
Speaker 1: it's tough company, man, it really is. But oh yeah,
Speaker 1: now Abandoned Dunes. What a place. And it's neat to
Speaker 1: that that camaraderie that we all felt and that that
Speaker 1: sense of adventure. I mean, it's like we we've talked
Speaker 1: about this many times as a podcast, but golf is
Speaker 1: just so special. You can't have that experience in any
Speaker 1: other sport. You just can't. And we're lucky that it's
Speaker 1: all part of our lives in such a big way. Agreed, Well,
Speaker 1: should we release should we release the listeners? I think
Speaker 1: it's probably that time. Um, but yeah, it's it's another
Speaker 1: another big week in golf and for the Fire Drill podcasts.
Speaker 1: Any parting thoughts where we go? I only said the
Speaker 1: F word one time today, so all you people, let's
Speaker 1: say I swear too much. F No, I'm just kidding.
Speaker 1: Uh So, Michael and I had this conversation and it
Speaker 1: was like, you know, everyone, you don't want to lose
Speaker 1: who you are, so I do swear. I'll try to
Speaker 1: limit it to twenty five efforts per podcast going forward.
Speaker 1: You gotta be you Ryan. But you know, at the
Speaker 1: same time, I think Michael, I heard from some of
Speaker 1: our our Twitter followers and our our listeners, like, um,
Speaker 1: it has to be judicious in its use. You know,
Speaker 1: it loses its punch if you use it too much.
Speaker 1: So I think I mean you hung out with me out.
Speaker 1: I use it repeatedly as a lack of my known
Speaker 1: vocabulary and fils in everything. You can use it as
Speaker 1: a verb. But now, ma, just just be yourself, right
Speaker 1: and that's all we go. No, I'm just kidding. On
Speaker 1: that note, we're gonna close this Fire Drill Podcast. Thank
Speaker 1: you for listening. We appreciate you out there and um
Speaker 1: wherever you may be, and we will be back at
Speaker 1: it on Sunday nights um per usual again next week,
Speaker 1: but special circumstances this time. So I'm alan ship knuck.
Speaker 1: That was Ryan French and Michael Bamberger. Uh until we
Speaker 1: do this again. Thanks for listening. A bed big played
Speaker 1: to win, made a fortune with my ship game. I
Speaker 1: run the table, never thought I could fall. Then the
Speaker 1: winter time hit me like a cannon ball, and now
Speaker 1: I can't shake this losing the street. Every road I
Speaker 1: take is a dead end stream. I got thoughts in
Speaker 1: my head, can't get trying not to think what I'm
Speaker 1: thinking about that got thoughts in my head, can't get
Speaker 1: him out, trying not to think what I'm thinking about
Speaker 1: a