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Speaker 1: This is Alec Baldwin and you're listening to Here's the

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Speaker 1: Thing from iHeart Radio. My guest today holds many titles.

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Speaker 1: A former lawyer, CEO of the nonprofit organization HARK, founder

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Speaker 1: and CEO of the Connecticut Paid Leave Authority, and the

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Speaker 1: current commissioner for the Department of Social Services in Hartford, Connecticut.

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Speaker 1: Andrea Barton Reeves has been recognized by the NAACP as

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Speaker 1: one of the quote one hundred most influential Blacks in

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Speaker 1: the state of Connecticut. She was also named one of

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Speaker 1: the one hundred Women of Color for her groundbreaking leadership

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Speaker 1: during the pandemic. Barton Reeves is a lawyer, business owner, entrepreneur,

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Speaker 1: and now a government official. But above all, Barton Reeves

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Speaker 1: is an advocate for others.

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Speaker 2: I've worked in government since twenty twenty. I came in

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Speaker 2: eleven days before the pandemic.

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Speaker 1: And before that it was all like NGO, would you say?

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Speaker 2: Or I came out of college and worked at a

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Speaker 2: large insurance company. I went to law school, I practiced

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Speaker 2: law for ten years. I ran a not for profit

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Speaker 2: for people with intellectual disabilities, and then I came to

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Speaker 2: the state in twenty twenty.

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Speaker 1: What I wanted to start with, is the work you

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Speaker 1: did as an ad litem council. You did a lot

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Speaker 1: of work in terms of representing children in the divorce

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Speaker 1: custody nexus.

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Speaker 2: Correct, Yes, I did.

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Speaker 1: What was it that drew you to that?

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Speaker 2: What drew me to that was my own personal experience.

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Speaker 2: I'm a childhood divorce.

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Speaker 1: Ah.

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Speaker 2: It was extremely contentious, and throughout all of that, I

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Speaker 2: felt that my voice and the voices of my two

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Speaker 2: younger brothers just weren't heard at all. And so when

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Speaker 2: I had an opportunity to do that kind of work

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Speaker 2: to help others children's, other children's voices be heard when

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Speaker 2: their parents were separating or divorcing, or just dismantling of

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Speaker 2: the family as the children, I just felt very called

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Speaker 2: to be a voice for them, which is why I

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Speaker 2: chose to become a guardian at lightem in a attorney

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Speaker 2: for the minor child, which is why I went to

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Speaker 2: law school, which is specifically to do that work.

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Speaker 1: I'm assuming from what I read that that took place.

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Speaker 1: You lived in New Jersey when you were much younger, Correct?

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Speaker 2: I did. I grew up in New Jersey.

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Speaker 1: And how old were you when your parents divorced?

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Speaker 2: I was just sixteen, so you.

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Speaker 1: Were a grown child. You were not a little kid,

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Speaker 1: you were grown.

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Speaker 2: No, but a sixteen year old girl is very impressionable

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Speaker 2: at that stage in their lives. It's a turning point

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Speaker 2: when your family dismantled at that stage.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well I had a divorce. My first marriage ended

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Speaker 1: in divorce. My daughter was five years old at the time,

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Speaker 1: and it was blisteringly contentious and unnecessarily so. And the

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Speaker 1: reason I mentioned to that to you is because you know,

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Speaker 1: they didn't have a progressive or overly competent ad lightem

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Speaker 1: program in New Jersey back then, they did not have that.

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Speaker 2: No, they didn't know, they didn't. Children just had to

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Speaker 2: suffer through whatever happened in the courts, and you would

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Speaker 2: find yourself, you know, it's really stuck in the middle

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Speaker 2: of your parents' discontent with one another, and there's a

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Speaker 2: lot of separation and abandonment and acrimony, an enormous amount

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Speaker 2: of actrimony which children don't really have the emotional intelligence

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Speaker 2: to make any sense of. Their lives are just about

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Speaker 2: pleasing their parents and wanting safety and security, and there's

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Speaker 2: really not a lot to be had in relationships that

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Speaker 2: fall apart in that way and where parents can't seem

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Speaker 2: to bring themselves back together. So a lot of my

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Speaker 2: work with children really was to be their voice and

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Speaker 2: then and to really be a voice of reason to

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Speaker 2: the parents, to say, I understand why you are not

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Speaker 2: together anymore. You've made that decision, but to really think

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Speaker 2: about the long term impact of what it means to

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Speaker 2: have children in the middle of all of that controversy,

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Speaker 2: because they live with it forever. They just do. It

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Speaker 2: forms the way they form relationship, It forms the way

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Speaker 2: they see the world. It just does. And I think

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Speaker 2: to minimize that is a difficult thing to do from

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Speaker 2: the perspective of children. And I had a lot of

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Speaker 2: parents that really got it when I explained that to them,

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Speaker 2: and could at least figure out a way to make

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Speaker 2: it work for the kids, even if not for one another.

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Speaker 1: I wrote a book about my divorce and it was

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Speaker 1: a screed against the California family law system, which was horrible.

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Speaker 1: It was just unspeakably bad in terms of the rights

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Speaker 1: of the father, whereas there's are other states that are

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Speaker 1: much more balanced. The divorce litigation, financial and custody was

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Speaker 1: for a man that was a gardener for a job

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Speaker 1: those divorces were over in twenty minutes in the courtroom

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Speaker 1: I sat in. Mine took a year and a half.

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Speaker 1: When they know you got the dough, they pump it

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Speaker 1: from you. Every there very versed in that. And we

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Speaker 1: did not have an ADLTEM council that I recall, but

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Speaker 1: a very close person in my life did and I

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Speaker 1: went to court with him, and I was stunned by

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Speaker 1: the fact that the ADLTEM council in and this one

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Speaker 1: session flipped the whole case on its ear by taking

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Speaker 1: the girls aside and understanding from them that their mother

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Speaker 1: was drinking while she was driving. And the moment the

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Speaker 1: child reported that to the ATLTEM, she walked in and

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Speaker 1: just lobbed a grenade into the whole thing. And this person,

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Speaker 1: the guy that I knew, he got full custody of

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Speaker 1: his kids, and the mother lost all her custody of

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Speaker 1: her kids. So the power of that position did you have.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to say what's the worst you saw,

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Speaker 1: but what's the most common thing you saw? As an

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Speaker 1: adel item counsel. The kids needed to be protected from what.

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Speaker 2: Kids needed to be protected from the enormous amount of

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Speaker 2: acrimony that occurred as a result of the conflict between

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Speaker 2: their parents. That's really what they needed to be protected from,

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Speaker 2: and they needed their own voice to be heard in

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Speaker 2: all of those circumstances and in some of the children.

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Speaker 2: With some of the children that I represented, the parents

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Speaker 2: definitely wanted the children to take sides, but children are

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Speaker 2: not emotionally mature enough to take sides. The only side

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Speaker 2: that they have is the side of being wanting to

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Speaker 2: be loved by both of their parents. That's the only

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Speaker 2: side that they can take. They're really not there to

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Speaker 2: be the arbiters of the conflict between their parents, and

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Speaker 2: that's often the position that they find themselves as, which

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Speaker 2: is why a guardian at lightened and an attorney for

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Speaker 2: the minor child is so incredibly important. And you do

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Speaker 2: have an enormous amount of power in those circumstances, and

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Speaker 2: to the example that you raise, it's most important to

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Speaker 2: use that extremely responsibly because when you do walk into

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Speaker 2: the courtroom and you hand in your report because you've

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Speaker 2: been to the home eight times, sometimes I would go

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Speaker 2: eight ten times to see children in different circumstances, different

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Speaker 2: times of the days. Sometimes I'd go to their school,

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Speaker 2: I talk to their parents separately, I've represented children whose

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Speaker 2: parents were incarcerated, and I would go up to the

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Speaker 2: prisons in Connecticut and visit their parents there and really

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Speaker 2: try to figure out what was going on and what

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Speaker 2: was really in the best instance of children. And that

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Speaker 2: means that you have to set aside your own ideas

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Speaker 2: of what you should think should happen, and you should

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Speaker 2: do what you think is you should make a recommendation

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Speaker 2: to the court that would help the children thrive. And

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Speaker 2: that might not necessarily what you would do in your

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Speaker 2: own personal circumstance, but it's about the kids that you're representing.

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Speaker 1: I went to a therapist once who was actually one

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Speaker 1: of the lights of this whole experience, a very wonderful

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Speaker 1: woman who said to me, you know, your daughter was

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Speaker 1: a hostage and she can't do anything to defy the

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Speaker 1: other party, and she just hopes you understand that she's

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Speaker 1: doing what she must do. She's been kept as a

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Speaker 1: hostage because we didn't. Every battle I made to augment

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Speaker 1: my custody was not successful. And a man, a friend

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Speaker 1: of mine, who'd said to me, stick with the boilerplate

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Speaker 1: orders of the court that you have and live with

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Speaker 1: it for a year. Don't keep coming back. You have

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Speaker 1: a month or two of positive interaction with the child,

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Speaker 1: and you want fifty to fifty right away. Don't do that,

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Speaker 1: he said, sit and let everything heal. Try to let

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Speaker 1: it heal. If it doesn't heal after a year, then

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Speaker 1: you know what you're dealing with. And she said, when

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Speaker 1: you're there's my daughter at this point like seven, And

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Speaker 1: she said, when your daughter's twenty five, she'll come around

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Speaker 1: to you and she'll understand. Thinking, Oh, okay, I just

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Speaker 1: hanging there eighteen years, Okay, yeah, there you go. Yeah years,

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Speaker 1: hang in there. Yeah, you stopped doing that? Did you know?

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Speaker 1: I would imagine for many people who work in something

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Speaker 1: that's involved so much pain and suffering like that, did

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Speaker 1: you get sick of it? Eventually?

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Speaker 2: The reason I stopped is because the last child that

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Speaker 2: I represented had her mother murdered by her father. And

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Speaker 2: I remember getting a call from the court that Sunday

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Speaker 2: that said there's a two year old that needs your representation.

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Speaker 2: Can you go and see them? And courts don't usually

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Speaker 2: call on Sunday, so I knew it was bad, and

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Speaker 2: I went down. I met my client and her family

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Speaker 2: and they were just taking the accused away at that

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Speaker 2: point the police are still outside. The mom was still inside,

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Speaker 2: and the police. There's a lot of police activity. So

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Speaker 2: I went with the child to another home of another

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Speaker 2: family member and had an opportunity to just and watch

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Speaker 2: her be loved and surrounded when protected.

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Speaker 1: By two years old.

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Speaker 2: She was two. She was too And I came home

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Speaker 2: and said to my husband, I've been doing this a

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Speaker 2: long time, but I don't think I can do this anymore.

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Speaker 1: What does your husband do?

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Speaker 2: He's a lawyer, like I mean, okay, he's a contracts lawyer.

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Speaker 2: He does not have the stomach for the things that

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Speaker 2: I would do. I am a very different calling all

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Speaker 2: my life. I do, and I recognize that, and he's

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Speaker 2: been extremely supportive of that.

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Speaker 1: Whatever happened to that two year old Guildiana, where did

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Speaker 1: she end up going with her?

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Speaker 2: She ended up going with her maternal grandparents, who eventually

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Speaker 2: got custody of her and then tried to work through

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Speaker 2: some kind of relationship with the dad's family. But you

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Speaker 2: can imagine that was probably very difficult, and I lost

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Speaker 2: track of her after that.

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Speaker 1: You transition, but you did all this work, and in

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Speaker 1: these other organizations, you're with some pretty big ticket law

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Speaker 1: firms there at ninety seven through two thousand and four.

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Speaker 1: How old were you when you entered law school?

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Speaker 2: Thirty?

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Speaker 1: So you would decide this is a decision you made,

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Speaker 1: and you were already cruising down the highway career wise,

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Speaker 1: you decided to get off the highway to go to

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Speaker 1: law school.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but I will tell you I knew I wanted

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Speaker 2: to be a lawyer when I was seven. I had

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Speaker 2: already made that decision. I know, my parents had no

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Speaker 2: idea how I knew, but I was precocious and a reader,

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Speaker 2: and I just knew that that's what I wanted to do.

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Speaker 2: So I probably waited longer than I would have normally,

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Speaker 2: but at that point in time, that was the right

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Speaker 2: time for me to go. So I did leave my

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Speaker 2: career at Chubb, which is where I was working, and

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Speaker 2: went to law school full time.

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Speaker 1: When you graduated, did you know what you wanted to do?

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Speaker 2: I did. I wanted to be a guardian atlightem and

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Speaker 2: represent children. I did. It's not what I ended up

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Speaker 2: doing directly out of law school, but it ended up

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Speaker 2: being the bulk of my career.

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Speaker 1: Now, you went to New York Law did they have Obviously,

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Speaker 1: in any law school, they have specialty programs for the

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Speaker 1: ad LTEM work.

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Speaker 2: They didn't they didn't know, they did not, but it

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Speaker 2: was the kind of school and still is. They gave

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Speaker 2: you a lot of practical experience, so I was able

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Speaker 2: to get summer internships and jobs during the school year.

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Speaker 2: It really taught me how to be a good lawyer,

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Speaker 2: because that's what you really need. You need compassion, need

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Speaker 2: really sharp legal skills, and you just really need to

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Speaker 2: understand that being a lawyer is not just about the law,

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Speaker 2: it's about the whole person as a client. And that's

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Speaker 2: what they taught me there, and that's what I learned

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Speaker 2: at the law firms where I worked, and that's what

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Speaker 2: allowed me to do the work that I did for

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Speaker 2: so long and hopefully.

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Speaker 1: Well then you start your own law firm.

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Speaker 2: It did.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, why did you want to do what needs weren't

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Speaker 1: met in another law firm.

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Speaker 2: Yes, the need was an eighteen month old who needed

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Speaker 2: his mom, that was in need.

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Speaker 1: That was flexible schedule.

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Speaker 2: A flexible schedule. My husband and I are adoptive parents,

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Speaker 2: and we had this beautiful he was eight months at

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Speaker 2: the time, the eight month old boy that needed a

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Speaker 2: home and through a lot of different circumstances, we are

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Speaker 2: his parents. We still are to this day, probably much

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Speaker 2: to his sugar in, but we still are.

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Speaker 1: Well. I'm sure he's very proud of you.

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Speaker 2: I think he is. He really needed me to be

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Speaker 2: home with him. So I started my own law practice

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Speaker 2: so I could do that, right.

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Speaker 1: And so when you leave or not leave your practice,

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Speaker 1: but were you still practicing privately. I'm assuming there's an

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Speaker 1: overlaper when you were the program director at Lawyers for

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Speaker 1: Children in America.

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Speaker 2: Yes, I did both.

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Speaker 1: You're doing both.

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Speaker 2: I did both. I had my private practice and I

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Speaker 2: taught other lawyers how to represent children whose families were

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Speaker 2: involved in the child protections.

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Speaker 1: So when you told your husband you want to have

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Speaker 1: a second child, he spit out his coffee in the

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Speaker 1: kitchen area said, no way, are we doing? No room

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Speaker 1: for any siblings?

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Speaker 2: I yes, Yeah, there was a lot. I would say.

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Speaker 2: We tried, We thought about adoption again. We thought about

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Speaker 2: trying again, but at the time just left us and

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Speaker 2: he was ten and figured well, we'll just raise him

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Speaker 2: the best.

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Speaker 1: You had a big career by then, you were working

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Speaker 1: all yeah. Describe what is HARK.

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Speaker 2: That used to be an acronym that stood for the

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Speaker 2: Hartford area Association for Retarded Citizens, and we don't use

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Speaker 2: that name anymore. It's not an acronym. It is an

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Speaker 2: organization that at Bauptestiz is probably seventy years old, that

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Speaker 2: supports people with intellectual disabilities in their families.

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Speaker 1: And how long are you there? One year? Was there

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Speaker 1: for ten years or ten years? What kind of work

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Speaker 1: did you do there?

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Speaker 2: I went in as their general counsel and they're a

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Speaker 2: head of HR and I left as the CEO.

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Speaker 1: And what work did they do? Specifically?

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Speaker 2: They supported about two hundred families and people that have

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Speaker 2: intellectual disability anything for being on the autism inspectrum to

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Speaker 2: severe intellectual disability in group homes, in day programs and

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Speaker 2: summer camps, and working in the community through something called

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Speaker 2: supported employment. So if you know someone who has an

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Speaker 2: intellectual disability, it's very likely that they're not working. They're

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Speaker 2: probably still living at home with their parents, and they're

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Speaker 2: not living a full life. And this program is designed

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Speaker 2: to make sure that people with disabilities, particularly intellectual disabilities

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Speaker 2: formally known as mental retortation, we do not use that

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Speaker 2: term anymore. We're able to live full and complete lives.

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Speaker 1: Now, when you're there, what is the there's two hundred

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Speaker 1: families that are under your umbrella.

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Speaker 2: There, that's right.

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Speaker 1: That seems like a So this is like a what

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Speaker 1: would you describe as an MNGO or you have to

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Speaker 1: raise the money privately, correct or you get grants?

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Speaker 2: Well both, right. So it was funded primarily by the

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Speaker 2: state of Connecticut through a lot of contracts to provide

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Speaker 2: services to these families. There was a lot of fundraising.

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Speaker 2: It is your typical not for profit, always sort of

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Speaker 2: struggling but making it work and really very mission focused

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Speaker 2: and mission driven. And I loved it. I loved it.

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Speaker 1: My family member of mine a woman, a young woman,

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Speaker 1: she had two daughters, and when she was pregnant for

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Speaker 1: her third child, they found that it was Down's syndrome,

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Speaker 1: and they went ahead and had the baby, and then

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Speaker 1: right after the baby was born, the husband left. They

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Speaker 1: took off.

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Speaker 2: Very common.

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Speaker 1: Is that very common? It is?

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Speaker 2: Yes, it's common that.

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Speaker 1: There are people that just can't deal with it.

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Speaker 2: That's right. It puts enormous strain on families because you

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Speaker 2: were always caring for that child for the rest of

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Speaker 2: their lives.

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Speaker 1: Wow. Yeah, I'm assuming that this might be one of

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Speaker 1: the areas that's the most underserved in our society. Is

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Speaker 1: that correct, that's right, working with intellectual disabilities.

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Speaker 2: Yes, so your friend's daughter, I always say this probably

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Speaker 2: encounters a lot of discrimination because of her disability, her

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Speaker 2: intellectual disability, And people make a lot of assumptions about

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Speaker 2: people that have intellectual disability. Many of them are just

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Speaker 2: not good, that the person is really limited in their capabilities,

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Speaker 2: and in many cases that is just simply not true.

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Speaker 2: They've just not ever had a chance to prove how

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Speaker 2: capable they really can be. And that's what HARC did

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Speaker 2: is really help people live their fullest lives.

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Speaker 1: When you left there after quite a while, you were

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Speaker 1: the CEO, and I'll help you. Didn't get this one wrong?

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Speaker 1: The Connecticut Paid Family and Medical Leave Insurance Authority correct.

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Speaker 2: Yes, yes, what did you do there? I started it.

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Speaker 2: It was a law that was passed that said people

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Speaker 2: should be able to get paid when they take family

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Speaker 2: and medical leave. And that was it. It was the

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Speaker 2: board of directors and a piece of paper, and my

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Speaker 2: job was to make it into a full fledged state agency.

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Speaker 2: And now it is probably have served more than one

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Speaker 2: hundred and fifty thousand people, probably is, I think the

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Speaker 2: last number I saw it had one point two billion

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Speaker 2: dollars in assets and benefits. It's made out to people,

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Speaker 2: so people won't have to do things like leave their

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Speaker 2: kids in the NICICQEU to go back to work because

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Speaker 2: they need a paycheck and they can't afford to take

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Speaker 2: time and be with their family. That was the whole point.

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Speaker 2: That really was the whole.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that Ted talk you did was very powerful, well done.

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Speaker 2: That was really good.

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Speaker 1: I learned a lot from that.

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Speaker 2: Thank you.

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Speaker 1: But then, of course you arrive where you are now

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Speaker 1: in twenty twenty three. I believe you're appointed commission of

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Speaker 1: the department. So is this a position you wanted? No,

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Speaker 1: you didn't.

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Speaker 2: I didn't seek it. Let me just put it that way.

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Speaker 2: And I was just talking to my husband about this,

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Speaker 2: and I remember getting the call from the governor's chief

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Speaker 2: of staff saying would you like this job? And I

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Speaker 2: had to stop for a moment and say, are you

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Speaker 2: sure the Medicaid Agency and they said, yeah, we want you.

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Speaker 2: And so within a matter of days, that was the

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Speaker 2: decision that I made that I would come and do

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Speaker 2: this work. It's critical.

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Speaker 1: So I'm assuming because I see at one point here

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Speaker 1: in my notes that there's a number that people are

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Speaker 1: worried you may lose. That's in the three hundred to

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Speaker 1: four hundred million dollar mark for the state.

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Speaker 2: Correct, That is the estimate all of the things together.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, this comes from the FEDS, that's right. Has the

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Speaker 1: federal funding of these programs, whether it was preceded you

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Speaker 1: or not, has the federal funding for these programs been

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Speaker 1: anemic all along? And was it bad and now it's

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Speaker 1: just going to get worse or was a period where

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Speaker 1: you were well funded?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? No, I don't think there was ever a period

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Speaker 2: we were well funded. I don't think any medicaid director

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Speaker 2: or anybody who has my job across the country will

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Speaker 2: tell you that it's always a struggle to try to

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Speaker 2: meet the needs of all the people and to try

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Speaker 2: to do that adequately because states have limited budgets. Those

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Speaker 2: the budgets that you get from the federal government is

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Speaker 2: really based on a lot of formulas. Some most of

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Speaker 2: its population and need and income based, So it's really

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Speaker 2: a hard thing to do. And then when you're starting

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Speaker 2: to look at the kinds of changes that HR one brings,

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Speaker 2: it puts even more financial pressure on states that already

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Speaker 2: have financial pressures in their medicaid programs. And their staff programs.

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Speaker 2: So it's a harder thing to do. And the third

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Speaker 2: of our state here in Connecticut, they're on Medicaid a

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Speaker 2: third a third.

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Speaker 1: The total population in Connecticut is what it's three million

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Speaker 1: less than Brooklyn, that's right. So when you're up there,

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Speaker 1: what's the tax situation up there? It's not that you

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Speaker 1: have no tax, but you have a rather low state

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Speaker 1: income tax.

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Speaker 2: Correct, we have, you know, I would say a pretty

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Speaker 2: adequate and robust state income tax, right, I don't remember

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Speaker 2: the rate is adequate. But we have pockets of enormous

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Speaker 2: wealth here and lots of pockets of poverty. So, you know,

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Speaker 2: the wealth has kind of concentrated closer to New York

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Speaker 2: City in the water, you know, Stanford right day, in

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Speaker 2: the places where people get to the city and make

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Speaker 2: their living, and then closer to where I am in

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Speaker 2: the middle of the state, that's a very different circumstance.

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Speaker 2: We have some pretty significant pockets of urban and rural

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Speaker 2: poverty that we struggle with.

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Speaker 1: Commissioner for the Department of Social Services in Connecticut, Andrea

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Speaker 1: Barton Williams. If you enjoy conversations about politics and current events,

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Speaker 1: check out my episode with Becca Heller founder of the

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Speaker 1: International Refugee Assistance Project. Heller organized a network of lawyers

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Speaker 1: working pro bono at airports across the United States during

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Speaker 1: the first Trump Administration's Muslim Man The.

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Speaker 3: Thing that was amazing about Airport Weekend is that, like,

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Speaker 3: we organize the lawyers, but nobody organized the protesters. Totally spontaneous.

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Speaker 3: Thousands of America went out and freezing shitty January weather

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Speaker 3: to just be like, this is not cool. The Executive

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Speaker 3: Order was rescinded before the lawsuit. The lawsuit we won

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Speaker 3: said that they can't hold people. But the one that

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Speaker 3: we won right away wasn't about sort of the legality

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Speaker 3: of the order on its face. It was the public

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Speaker 3: pressure that got the administration to rescind the executive Order

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Speaker 3: and the so called chaos at the airports, which I

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Speaker 3: will forever be proud of.

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Speaker 1: To hear more of my conversation with Becca Heller, go

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Speaker 1: to Here's Thething dot org. After the break, Barton Reeves

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Speaker 1: discusses the changes she anticipates in Connecticut and nationwide with

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Speaker 1: President Trump's new policies and how this will affect health

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Speaker 1: insurance in her state. I'm Alec Baldwin and you're listening

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Speaker 1: to here is the thing. Andrea Barton Reeves built a

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Speaker 1: legal career in both private practice and nonprofit organizations. Her

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Speaker 1: appointment as Commissioner for the Department of Social Services marks

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Speaker 1: her first foray into government work. I was curious about

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Speaker 1: her experience thus far if she found her colleagues in

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Speaker 1: the Connecticut State House as well intentioned and motivated as

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Speaker 1: the nonprofit world.

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Speaker 2: In the job that I have now, My committees of

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Speaker 2: cognizances you described in that way are the Human Services Committee,

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Speaker 2: the Children's Committee, aging, and they're all led by really

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Speaker 2: incredible people who do I think, very difficult work under

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Speaker 2: very difficult circumstances. We're a blue state, so in some

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Speaker 2: instances it's easier to do the work here. But we

443
00:21:49,119 --> 00:21:50,720
Speaker 2: have a lot of people that are aging quickly. We

444
00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:52,280
Speaker 2: have a lot of kids that are need you know,

445
00:21:52,440 --> 00:21:56,560
Speaker 2: we have a five percent unensured health rate in this state.

446
00:21:56,880 --> 00:21:58,640
Speaker 2: There's a lot of things that need to get done here,

447
00:21:58,680 --> 00:22:00,359
Speaker 2: so you need to have people that really candmitted to

448
00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:03,480
Speaker 2: getting that to happen. We have more bipartisanship here in

449
00:22:03,520 --> 00:22:06,119
Speaker 2: Connecticut than I hear that happens in other states, so

450
00:22:06,600 --> 00:22:08,720
Speaker 2: we don't really have sort of what I would call

451
00:22:08,800 --> 00:22:12,360
Speaker 2: sort of a Tammany Hall situation going on here at all. No,

452
00:22:12,680 --> 00:22:15,600
Speaker 2: but it's still political. It still takes a lot of

453
00:22:15,800 --> 00:22:18,680
Speaker 2: talking and walking around in the hallways and building relationships

454
00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:21,520
Speaker 2: to get things to work. That's anywhere you go. But

455
00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:23,160
Speaker 2: I think I'm lucky to be here.

456
00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:26,520
Speaker 1: So Trump comes in the first round, you are not

457
00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:29,720
Speaker 1: in that job in the first round, and then Trump's

458
00:22:29,720 --> 00:22:33,320
Speaker 1: in the second round. What are you seeing? What's the

459
00:22:33,359 --> 00:22:36,919
Speaker 1: situation now? You've expect the Trump budget and the Trump

460
00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:40,359
Speaker 1: policies to result in what for your program and.

461
00:22:40,359 --> 00:22:44,000
Speaker 2: Your state, and it's a nationwide I would say we

462
00:22:44,160 --> 00:22:47,800
Speaker 2: expect that a number of people will go without health

463
00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:51,320
Speaker 2: insurance because the rules for getting health insurance have changed

464
00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:56,000
Speaker 2: dramatically under this bill for a particular population, which is

465
00:22:56,040 --> 00:22:59,119
Speaker 2: known in the as expansion population. So those are people

466
00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:01,240
Speaker 2: that we were able to to add to the Medicaid

467
00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:04,560
Speaker 2: roles because of changes to the federal rules that allowed

468
00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:06,680
Speaker 2: us to add about in our state, about three hundred

469
00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:10,040
Speaker 2: and fifty thousand more people who normally wouldn't be qualified

470
00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:12,600
Speaker 2: for Medicaid because of their income. We were able to

471
00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:17,560
Speaker 2: add them. They are now specifically targeted under the passage

472
00:23:17,560 --> 00:23:21,320
Speaker 2: of HR one, so they now have work requirements that

473
00:23:21,359 --> 00:23:24,520
Speaker 2: they have to meet that they're very strict and rather

474
00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:27,359
Speaker 2: draconian and the description of the way that some people

475
00:23:27,600 --> 00:23:30,840
Speaker 2: would think about it. And if you don't meet those requirements,

476
00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:34,200
Speaker 2: then you are dropped away the way that it's defined

477
00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:37,240
Speaker 2: and designed now. And when you fall off of those roles,

478
00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:39,400
Speaker 2: you're then not able to go on to what's known

479
00:23:39,440 --> 00:23:42,600
Speaker 2: as commonly known as Obamacare, because if you can't qualify

480
00:23:42,720 --> 00:23:47,440
Speaker 2: for the Medicaid, then you're automatically disqualified for the Obamacare,

481
00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:50,399
Speaker 2: which means then you go without any coverage whatsoever for

482
00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:52,840
Speaker 2: a pretty significant period of time, and then the only

483
00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:57,040
Speaker 2: thing available to you after that would be emergency medical coverage,

484
00:23:57,080 --> 00:24:00,679
Speaker 2: which is costly. It's very expensive, and people usually go

485
00:24:00,720 --> 00:24:01,679
Speaker 2: there as a last resort.

486
00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:04,320
Speaker 1: So we're kind of we're kind of hurting ourselves by

487
00:24:04,359 --> 00:24:07,760
Speaker 1: not having these other more comprehensive programs, because when you

488
00:24:07,760 --> 00:24:10,280
Speaker 1: push people into a corner, their ultimate choice is a

489
00:24:10,359 --> 00:24:11,280
Speaker 1: very expensive one.

490
00:24:11,400 --> 00:24:14,320
Speaker 2: It really is, and it becomes expensive because people will

491
00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:16,680
Speaker 2: wait till the last minute and when they're very, very sick,

492
00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:18,560
Speaker 2: so they're going to end up getting the most expensive

493
00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:21,720
Speaker 2: medical interventions. So it's kind of counterintuitive to trying to

494
00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:24,040
Speaker 2: save money because eventually you have to pay for health

495
00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:26,240
Speaker 2: care in some way, shape or form. There's no way

496
00:24:26,280 --> 00:24:30,160
Speaker 2: to get around doing that. It does, so this means

497
00:24:30,160 --> 00:24:33,320
Speaker 2: that we'll have those that group of people really at risk.

498
00:24:33,480 --> 00:24:35,440
Speaker 2: Then the other side of it is a snap which

499
00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:38,080
Speaker 2: most people know is food stamps. Food stamps, but it's

500
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:43,000
Speaker 2: a supplemental nutrition assistance program that has it's always had

501
00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:45,800
Speaker 2: work requirements, but it's moved up from age fifty four

502
00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:47,480
Speaker 2: to sixty four. So now we're going to have people,

503
00:24:47,560 --> 00:24:49,879
Speaker 2: you know, fifty five up to sixty four. They're going

504
00:24:49,920 --> 00:24:51,440
Speaker 2: to have to find some kind of job in order

505
00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:54,040
Speaker 2: for them to be able to keep their food benefit.

506
00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:56,760
Speaker 2: I don't know how that's going to happen.

507
00:24:57,000 --> 00:24:59,040
Speaker 1: So they have to find a job at fifty five.

508
00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:01,440
Speaker 2: You have to find a job at fifty five that

509
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:03,959
Speaker 2: meets these new work requirements. And if you don't in

510
00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:07,239
Speaker 2: this economy, that's right, and we won't be able to

511
00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:11,440
Speaker 2: provide you with food anymore. And food insecurity around people

512
00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:14,520
Speaker 2: who are fifty five and older is an epidemic that

513
00:25:14,560 --> 00:25:17,640
Speaker 2: people don't talk about. It really is. And so now

514
00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:20,440
Speaker 2: I'm thinking, I don't know how this is going to happen.

515
00:25:21,000 --> 00:25:23,159
Speaker 2: And this is the same kind of thinking that my

516
00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:25,520
Speaker 2: colleagues have across the country, which is we are just

517
00:25:26,600 --> 00:25:29,080
Speaker 2: very afraid and almost you know, in a state of

518
00:25:29,119 --> 00:25:31,879
Speaker 2: panic and devastation around what's going to happen to people.

519
00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:34,760
Speaker 2: Our goal here, and I think it's it's the goal

520
00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:36,840
Speaker 2: around the country is to have a few people as

521
00:25:36,880 --> 00:25:40,000
Speaker 2: possible adversely impacted by what's happening. So we're doing a

522
00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:42,440
Speaker 2: lot of planning, a lot of you know, thoughtful work

523
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:45,120
Speaker 2: around how we can get people to comply with the law.

524
00:25:45,160 --> 00:25:47,040
Speaker 2: Because it is the law, there's not really much we

525
00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:50,119
Speaker 2: can do about that. And it only passed by four votes.

526
00:25:50,800 --> 00:25:53,159
Speaker 2: You know, there's four votes that have just changed the

527
00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:56,000
Speaker 2: trajectory of the way people get access to healthcare and

528
00:25:56,040 --> 00:26:01,120
Speaker 2: access to food. And when you think about that, it's

529
00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:03,879
Speaker 2: mind boggling and devastating when you think about it in

530
00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:06,240
Speaker 2: the larger context of what democracy is supposed to.

531
00:26:06,680 --> 00:26:08,440
Speaker 1: But it reminds me also of the housing thing I

532
00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:10,879
Speaker 1: heard about in New York, where they're saying, well, you know,

533
00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:13,120
Speaker 1: homeless advocates and so forth that I worked with off

534
00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:15,280
Speaker 1: and on over the year's Coalition for the homeless and

535
00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:17,840
Speaker 1: so forth. They were saying, how, you know, just give

536
00:26:17,840 --> 00:26:20,520
Speaker 1: them the cash for the rent to keep them in

537
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:22,680
Speaker 1: the building. Just give them the rent money so that

538
00:26:22,720 --> 00:26:24,399
Speaker 1: they can stay, because once they get kicked out of it,

539
00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:27,360
Speaker 1: that's when the problems really really multiply, and that's when

540
00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:29,439
Speaker 1: things made you, you know, give them the money to

541
00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:31,240
Speaker 1: have health insurance because you're only going to end up

542
00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:34,160
Speaker 1: paying more potentially. Give them the money for the rent

543
00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:36,760
Speaker 1: because you're only going to end up pay more potentially.

544
00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:39,080
Speaker 1: And I think that, I mean, I love that idea

545
00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:42,200
Speaker 1: that we're going to find housing for people, whether it's

546
00:26:42,240 --> 00:26:43,680
Speaker 1: in the city itself or not.

547
00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:47,639
Speaker 2: So that what you're describing is called the housing first model,

548
00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:50,680
Speaker 2: which is that you get people housed first, and it's

549
00:26:50,720 --> 00:26:54,240
Speaker 2: that foundation that allows people to get access to other benefits.

550
00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:56,719
Speaker 2: And we know that the housing first model works. We

551
00:26:56,800 --> 00:27:00,480
Speaker 2: have statistical proof that shows that it works. Happened though

552
00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:04,040
Speaker 2: with the last the most recent executive order that President

553
00:27:04,040 --> 00:27:07,440
Speaker 2: Trump just issued around housing. It meant that people who

554
00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:09,639
Speaker 2: are now currently on house could sort of be rounded

555
00:27:09,680 --> 00:27:12,520
Speaker 2: up and institutionalized, which is the antithesis of the housing

556
00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:16,720
Speaker 2: first model. It's because homelessness is not criminal homelessness really

557
00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:19,480
Speaker 2: is a societal issue that we need to embrace, and

558
00:27:19,520 --> 00:27:22,760
Speaker 2: so I think sticking with this idea of funding the

559
00:27:22,800 --> 00:27:25,760
Speaker 2: housing first model is how we get to do the

560
00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:27,879
Speaker 2: right thing for people so that they're not out on

561
00:27:27,920 --> 00:27:30,320
Speaker 2: the street, that we can get them to access healthcare.

562
00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:33,000
Speaker 2: They can then have stability and be able to work.

563
00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:36,359
Speaker 2: And there are solutions for this if we're willing to

564
00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:38,919
Speaker 2: do it as a country, and I think there just

565
00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:41,760
Speaker 2: needs to be more of a political will to make

566
00:27:41,800 --> 00:27:44,960
Speaker 2: that happen. But that most recent I would say edict

567
00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:48,919
Speaker 2: through this executive order doesn't send us in that direction

568
00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:49,440
Speaker 2: at all.

569
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:53,960
Speaker 1: Now, you are a spectacularly and powerfully educated woman and

570
00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:56,800
Speaker 1: accomplished woman, and I'm wondering if the work you do

571
00:27:57,160 --> 00:27:59,320
Speaker 1: is affected by you being a woman and you being

572
00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:02,119
Speaker 1: a black woman, Like, do you see we're in a

573
00:28:02,240 --> 00:28:05,840
Speaker 1: social services system that there are certain groups that are

574
00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:08,520
Speaker 1: more disadvantage than others. And here you are with a

575
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:10,560
Speaker 1: law degree from New York Law and everything, and you're

576
00:28:10,600 --> 00:28:12,840
Speaker 1: there to try to help these people. Are you affected

577
00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:14,840
Speaker 1: by that fact at all? Does that play into your

578
00:28:14,960 --> 00:28:16,480
Speaker 1: consciousness about it?

579
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:20,320
Speaker 2: It absolutely does. Yes, I am extremely fortunate to be

580
00:28:20,359 --> 00:28:23,159
Speaker 2: where I am right and I know that. But my

581
00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:26,320
Speaker 2: parents came from nothing. They were immigrants that came from

582
00:28:26,359 --> 00:28:30,879
Speaker 2: Guyana with absolutely nothing and came here to have my

583
00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:33,080
Speaker 2: brothers and I and to create a life for us,

584
00:28:33,119 --> 00:28:36,120
Speaker 2: and unfortunately they were able to do that. So I've

585
00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:39,280
Speaker 2: walked this journey and I understand it. And you know,

586
00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:41,320
Speaker 2: even though you know my dad ended up being a

587
00:28:41,400 --> 00:28:43,800
Speaker 2: doctor and my mother ended up being a psychiatric nurse,

588
00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:46,760
Speaker 2: we were raised while they were getting those educations, so

589
00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:48,960
Speaker 2: we didn't have anything. We didn't grow up the way

590
00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:52,680
Speaker 2: that doctors childrens grow up. We had a lot of poverty,

591
00:28:52,960 --> 00:28:55,680
Speaker 2: a lot of struggle, So we understand that. And then

592
00:28:55,720 --> 00:28:58,120
Speaker 2: when my parents divorced, it was just my mom and

593
00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:00,560
Speaker 2: my brothers and I and she didn't really have any money.

594
00:29:00,560 --> 00:29:03,240
Speaker 2: She got paid what nurses get paid, which wasn't very much.

595
00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:07,080
Speaker 2: So we had snap, we had food stamps, we had

596
00:29:07,160 --> 00:29:09,440
Speaker 2: government cheese, we had all of those things. We had

597
00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:11,480
Speaker 2: the lights turned off, we had the water turned off.

598
00:29:11,920 --> 00:29:16,320
Speaker 2: I've lived this journey. I've lived it. But she passed

599
00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:19,240
Speaker 2: away last September. But she was a person of extraordinary

600
00:29:19,280 --> 00:29:22,720
Speaker 2: strength that never made any excuses, and she would just

601
00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:25,400
Speaker 2: say we go on those are her words, it's tough.

602
00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:27,800
Speaker 2: We go on and I learned from her to be

603
00:29:27,880 --> 00:29:30,920
Speaker 2: the person that I am, and she taught us that

604
00:29:31,000 --> 00:29:34,000
Speaker 2: we have an obligation to do more and do better.

605
00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:36,640
Speaker 2: And she did not make all the sacrifices that she

606
00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:40,440
Speaker 2: made for me to feel like I'm privileged and don't

607
00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:42,720
Speaker 2: have an obligation to do for others. This is in

608
00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:45,680
Speaker 2: my blood, this is what I do. I am absolutely

609
00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:47,160
Speaker 2: built to be an advocate.

610
00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:52,400
Speaker 1: And it's amazing how people like yourself, who are mentored

611
00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:54,360
Speaker 1: by a mother like that or a parents like that,

612
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:57,080
Speaker 1: you see their success rate, and then you see the

613
00:29:57,120 --> 00:29:59,240
Speaker 1: success rate is less for those who don't have that.

614
00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:03,240
Speaker 1: They don't have a parent who can teach them where

615
00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:05,320
Speaker 1: they can go, what they can do, how they can

616
00:30:05,720 --> 00:30:08,440
Speaker 1: spread their wings and fly. I mean, I've got I'm

617
00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:10,760
Speaker 1: sixty seven years old, i have a two year old baby.

618
00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:12,920
Speaker 1: I got seven kids. And the number one thing is

619
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:16,840
Speaker 1: when they reach these transitional ages. When you see a

620
00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:20,040
Speaker 1: child move from two to three, three to four, and

621
00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:22,400
Speaker 1: then they get to be like seven, they cross the

622
00:30:22,480 --> 00:30:24,520
Speaker 1: line of maybe six is my recollection now with my

623
00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:26,920
Speaker 1: one child, and they start to be much more curious

624
00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:29,200
Speaker 1: about the world. How do you teach your kids to

625
00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:31,440
Speaker 1: face things. That's the challenge for me every day.

626
00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:34,280
Speaker 2: You know, gradually there's a lot of joy I see

627
00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:36,520
Speaker 2: that you have with your family, and that's a beautiful

628
00:30:36,560 --> 00:30:39,080
Speaker 2: thing and a gift. We have, as I mentioned, our

629
00:30:39,120 --> 00:30:41,720
Speaker 2: one son, and we've poured everything that we have into him.

630
00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:43,400
Speaker 2: But the one thing that we've taught him is that

631
00:30:43,440 --> 00:30:46,040
Speaker 2: he lives in an enormous amount of privilege because his

632
00:30:46,160 --> 00:30:47,920
Speaker 2: dad and I made a lot of sacrifices to make

633
00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:51,920
Speaker 2: that happen. Because my husband is also the same way,

634
00:30:51,960 --> 00:30:54,040
Speaker 2: grew up in Newark, New Jersey, food stamps, not a

635
00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:57,680
Speaker 2: lot of money, working class family. We understand that we

636
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:01,160
Speaker 2: have a lot of privilege, and we have taught our

637
00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:03,840
Speaker 2: son that it's about character, it's about the kind of

638
00:31:03,880 --> 00:31:07,239
Speaker 2: person that you are. It's using your privilege and your

639
00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:09,400
Speaker 2: access to do good and make a better life for

640
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:13,000
Speaker 2: other people. We do not indulge him, and we never have,

641
00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:16,280
Speaker 2: and we've said to him, you owe others because you

642
00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:18,800
Speaker 2: have had so much, and you've had a lot more

643
00:31:19,160 --> 00:31:22,280
Speaker 2: than we ever had. So we've done that through example

644
00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:27,080
Speaker 2: and through overt teaching, through raising him in religious communities,

645
00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:30,800
Speaker 2: sending him to mission trips, and making sure that he

646
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:33,160
Speaker 2: sees us volunteer and show up in the community. And

647
00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:34,880
Speaker 2: that's the example you want to be. You need to

648
00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:37,960
Speaker 2: be a global citizen, and you need to be a responsible

649
00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:39,720
Speaker 2: citizen with the gifts that you've been given.

650
00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:43,120
Speaker 1: So Trump comes in the second time, and I'm not

651
00:31:43,200 --> 00:31:46,680
Speaker 1: someone who I've lost my appetite for the Trump bashing thing,

652
00:31:47,000 --> 00:31:51,120
Speaker 1: but it is stark. It is heartbreaking for me to

653
00:31:51,160 --> 00:31:54,840
Speaker 1: see a society that has all this money and is

654
00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:57,720
Speaker 1: willing to give all these tax breaks to people and

655
00:31:57,800 --> 00:32:00,520
Speaker 1: to put us further in debt when we're Bavie was

656
00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:03,640
Speaker 1: a crisis level of debt federally as it is, and

657
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:07,080
Speaker 1: to cut all this money to just give people hand

658
00:32:07,280 --> 00:32:10,000
Speaker 1: up to be a part of this society we have.

659
00:32:10,640 --> 00:32:12,200
Speaker 1: We don't want to give them a ceiling and say

660
00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:13,800
Speaker 1: well you have to have this much, but they have

661
00:32:13,840 --> 00:32:19,320
Speaker 1: to have a floor. They have to have food, education, medicine,

662
00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:23,360
Speaker 1: housing and beyond. And I'm thinking, are you are people

663
00:32:23,400 --> 00:32:24,840
Speaker 1: in your office? Are they scared?

664
00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:29,080
Speaker 2: They are extraordinarily concerned. I think when we first started,

665
00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:32,560
Speaker 2: we were frightened about how dracone these changes would be

666
00:32:32,600 --> 00:32:36,880
Speaker 2: and how fundamentally different the programs that we administer would

667
00:32:36,920 --> 00:32:39,240
Speaker 2: become as a result of of whatever we thought the

668
00:32:39,280 --> 00:32:42,040
Speaker 2: final bill. There were many iterations of this bill and

669
00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:44,640
Speaker 2: we had a lot of sleepless nights following it, back

670
00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:46,440
Speaker 2: and forth from the House to the Senate, that different

671
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:49,080
Speaker 2: visions in the House, different versions in the Senate, and

672
00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:51,520
Speaker 2: what we ended up with, we think was pretty close

673
00:32:51,560 --> 00:32:53,600
Speaker 2: to what we anticipated we would end up with. So

674
00:32:53,640 --> 00:32:56,240
Speaker 2: we had anticipated some of the changes, but some of

675
00:32:56,280 --> 00:32:58,080
Speaker 2: them we did not, because you just didn't know what

676
00:32:58,120 --> 00:33:00,400
Speaker 2: was going to happen at the end. This is what's

677
00:33:00,400 --> 00:33:02,760
Speaker 2: happening right now. This is not new, and I think

678
00:33:02,760 --> 00:33:06,000
Speaker 2: this is what people really need to understand. This has

679
00:33:06,360 --> 00:33:10,040
Speaker 2: happened to us as a nation for decades. There's always

680
00:33:10,040 --> 00:33:13,360
Speaker 2: been this fundamental misapprehension about why poor people are poor,

681
00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:17,040
Speaker 2: and that is because there's an understanding that they are

682
00:33:17,160 --> 00:33:21,120
Speaker 2: lesser than others that are not that being poor is

683
00:33:21,320 --> 00:33:23,760
Speaker 2: in many ways perceived to be by other's a self

684
00:33:23,760 --> 00:33:26,840
Speaker 2: inflicted wound that if you were to just work harder

685
00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:29,920
Speaker 2: and if you were more industrious, that somehow you wouldn't

686
00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:33,160
Speaker 2: find yourself in these circumstances, and then somehow you would

687
00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:36,000
Speaker 2: have the same access to resources as everyone else. Does, Well,

688
00:33:36,040 --> 00:33:38,720
Speaker 2: we know that that thinking is very deeply flawed because

689
00:33:38,720 --> 00:33:43,320
Speaker 2: we have so many foundations of discrimination in this nation,

690
00:33:43,560 --> 00:33:46,320
Speaker 2: whether it's against women, people of color, people who are poor,

691
00:33:46,360 --> 00:33:49,400
Speaker 2: people who are immigrants, that there really was no way

692
00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:52,720
Speaker 2: there for anyone to be on an equal playing field

693
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:54,600
Speaker 2: with others, for us not to be where we are,

694
00:33:55,040 --> 00:33:58,320
Speaker 2: even during the New Deal, right with the Roosevelt administration

695
00:33:59,120 --> 00:34:03,480
Speaker 2: that came about because of the destitution that people were experiencing,

696
00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:06,080
Speaker 2: because it was happening during the Depression. But even in

697
00:34:06,160 --> 00:34:08,000
Speaker 2: his own thinking, if you were to read some of

698
00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:10,880
Speaker 2: the works that in some of the work around Roosevelt

699
00:34:11,200 --> 00:34:13,320
Speaker 2: and his thinking at the time, even he was reluctant

700
00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:15,160
Speaker 2: to be as expansive in the New Deal as he

701
00:34:15,320 --> 00:34:17,839
Speaker 2: was because he believed that people really needed to bring

702
00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:21,600
Speaker 2: themselves up by their bootstraps. But that assumes that there's

703
00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:24,239
Speaker 2: an equal footing that everyone can take hold of and

704
00:34:24,239 --> 00:34:27,040
Speaker 2: look forward, and in this nation that has never been

705
00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:29,720
Speaker 2: the case. It's never been true. You asked me earlier

706
00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:32,479
Speaker 2: about being a black person and being a woman, Well,

707
00:34:32,560 --> 00:34:36,480
Speaker 2: you know, that intersection of identity was one that just

708
00:34:36,520 --> 00:34:40,120
Speaker 2: didn't I would have had no rights even two hundred

709
00:34:40,200 --> 00:34:42,920
Speaker 2: years ago right that I would not I couldn't vote,

710
00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:45,040
Speaker 2: and I wasn't even a whole person, but I was

711
00:34:45,080 --> 00:34:48,880
Speaker 2: even considered a full human being in the foundational documents

712
00:34:48,880 --> 00:34:52,120
Speaker 2: of this nation. So under those circumstances, there is no

713
00:34:52,200 --> 00:34:54,440
Speaker 2: way for me to have equal footing with others, for

714
00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:57,120
Speaker 2: me to not be poor, to not have access to

715
00:34:57,200 --> 00:34:59,200
Speaker 2: the same kinds of things that people have. But if

716
00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:01,560
Speaker 2: you want to talk your self into believing that that's

717
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:04,200
Speaker 2: the narrative, then it gives you the license to make

718
00:35:04,239 --> 00:35:06,239
Speaker 2: the kinds of decisions that are that were being made.

719
00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:08,800
Speaker 2: But back in the Reagan administration, this is how decisions

720
00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:12,000
Speaker 2: were made to cut food programs, to cut back on foodstamps,

721
00:35:12,120 --> 00:35:15,080
Speaker 2: to create block brands for heating assistance. It was the

722
00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:17,560
Speaker 2: same kind of thinking. Poor people are poor because of

723
00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:19,920
Speaker 2: what they do and what they haven't done. This is

724
00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:22,760
Speaker 2: just a new iteration of that same kind of thinking

725
00:35:23,120 --> 00:35:26,640
Speaker 2: that we're more cognizant of because it's just so much

726
00:35:26,680 --> 00:35:29,799
Speaker 2: more dramatic and it's cut. But it's not a new

727
00:35:29,880 --> 00:35:31,839
Speaker 2: way of thinking for this country at all.

728
00:35:36,200 --> 00:35:40,279
Speaker 1: Andrea Barton reeves, if you're enjoying this conversation, tell a

729
00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:43,279
Speaker 1: friend and be sure to follow. Here's the thing on

730
00:35:43,360 --> 00:35:48,120
Speaker 1: the iHeartRadio app, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts

731
00:35:48,760 --> 00:35:51,279
Speaker 1: when we come back. Barton Reeves on whether she would

732
00:35:51,320 --> 00:36:06,920
Speaker 1: consider running for public office in Connecticut. I'm Alec Baldwin

733
00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:11,240
Speaker 1: and you're listening to hear the thing. Andrea Barton Reeves's

734
00:36:11,239 --> 00:36:15,279
Speaker 1: career has taken an unpredictable path from ad litem law

735
00:36:15,440 --> 00:36:19,839
Speaker 1: to CEO of HARK, which provides support to the intellectually

736
00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:24,280
Speaker 1: and developmentally disabled, to creating Connecticut's paid Family and Medical

737
00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:28,400
Speaker 1: Lead program, with her focus always on advocating for others.

738
00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:31,560
Speaker 1: I was curious whether or not she would consider running

739
00:36:31,560 --> 00:36:32,560
Speaker 1: for office. One day.

740
00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:36,800
Speaker 2: Oh my goodness, have you been talking to my friends?

741
00:36:37,320 --> 00:36:39,759
Speaker 1: Maybe I have. You'll never know.

742
00:36:41,120 --> 00:36:43,600
Speaker 2: I would never know. No, I have not considered that.

743
00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:47,479
Speaker 2: I think I would stay in state service. I would

744
00:36:47,560 --> 00:36:49,279
Speaker 2: love to be able to continue to do the work

745
00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:51,960
Speaker 2: that I'm doing, or something else that helps people who

746
00:36:52,000 --> 00:36:56,680
Speaker 2: are disadvantage, for low income disabled. This is what I

747
00:36:56,760 --> 00:36:58,960
Speaker 2: think I was born to do. I think it's why

748
00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:01,640
Speaker 2: I'm here, and I feel like I do this work

749
00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:05,120
Speaker 2: exceptionally well because it is in my DNA. It is

750
00:37:05,160 --> 00:37:06,399
Speaker 2: what I was destined to do.

751
00:37:07,239 --> 00:37:11,240
Speaker 1: Now, talk about this other Masters of Arts and Religion program.

752
00:37:11,320 --> 00:37:14,120
Speaker 1: What is a Master of Arts in Religion program? And

753
00:37:14,120 --> 00:37:16,560
Speaker 1: you're going where to Yale? I am going to Yale?

754
00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:18,640
Speaker 1: What is it? What are you going there for?

755
00:37:19,239 --> 00:37:22,120
Speaker 2: So I'm getting a Master of Arts and Religion and ethics.

756
00:37:22,640 --> 00:37:25,839
Speaker 2: So my goal once I leave is to be able

757
00:37:25,880 --> 00:37:28,000
Speaker 2: to help other leaders who work in the spaces that

758
00:37:28,040 --> 00:37:31,280
Speaker 2: I work in in advocacy and not for profit and government,

759
00:37:31,680 --> 00:37:34,240
Speaker 2: to really be able to have more of a stronger

760
00:37:34,280 --> 00:37:37,319
Speaker 2: intersection between their own personal beliefs. They don't have to

761
00:37:37,320 --> 00:37:39,600
Speaker 2: be religious beliefs, they just have to be, you know,

762
00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:41,839
Speaker 2: their own personal philosophy and the work that they're being

763
00:37:41,840 --> 00:37:45,520
Speaker 2: called to do, because often you're asked to separate those things.

764
00:37:45,600 --> 00:37:48,759
Speaker 2: You're either working in an environment where you sort of

765
00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:51,879
Speaker 2: set aside your morals and your values, or you're working

766
00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:54,200
Speaker 2: in environment that you're completely immersed in your morals and

767
00:37:54,200 --> 00:37:56,960
Speaker 2: your values, and it's really hard to make those things integrated.

768
00:37:57,000 --> 00:37:59,439
Speaker 2: You really have an opportunity to do that. My goal

769
00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:01,400
Speaker 2: is to really help leaders figure out how to do that,

770
00:38:01,480 --> 00:38:03,959
Speaker 2: because I feel fortunate that I've been able to figure

771
00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:05,719
Speaker 2: out how to do that, which is why I get

772
00:38:05,719 --> 00:38:07,560
Speaker 2: so much joy from the work that I do. Even

773
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:11,359
Speaker 2: under the circumstances and that we're talking about today, I

774
00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:13,879
Speaker 2: still feel like there's a chance for me to help

775
00:38:13,920 --> 00:38:16,960
Speaker 2: people live a better life. I can take the circumstances

776
00:38:17,000 --> 00:38:19,440
Speaker 2: that have been handed to us through this bill and

777
00:38:19,560 --> 00:38:23,279
Speaker 2: still try to find a way to make access to

778
00:38:23,400 --> 00:38:27,279
Speaker 2: healthcare and access to food possible for people by using

779
00:38:27,280 --> 00:38:31,080
Speaker 2: my imagination and my experience and my education. And I

780
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:33,640
Speaker 2: want other leaders to feel just as hopeful, even when

781
00:38:33,719 --> 00:38:38,280
Speaker 2: the circumstances are prevented with they're presented with may seem untenable.

782
00:38:38,400 --> 00:38:42,000
Speaker 1: So it's not about you either having people in the workspace,

783
00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:47,279
Speaker 1: regardless of what it is, embrace the moral components of

784
00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:49,719
Speaker 1: the work they do, or asking them to face the

785
00:38:49,719 --> 00:38:51,759
Speaker 1: moral components of the work that they do. It's not

786
00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:52,960
Speaker 1: about that, is it.

787
00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:54,680
Speaker 2: Kindly about that? Is?

788
00:38:55,280 --> 00:38:57,360
Speaker 1: It is not that compelling.

789
00:38:57,760 --> 00:39:01,360
Speaker 2: It's about being unafraid to face the moral decisions that

790
00:39:01,440 --> 00:39:04,040
Speaker 2: you need to make right. It's really it's taking in

791
00:39:04,400 --> 00:39:06,920
Speaker 2: the entire circumstance of what it means to make a

792
00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:09,839
Speaker 2: life changing decision. That's what I do every day, right

793
00:39:09,880 --> 00:39:12,520
Speaker 2: for a million people. When we have a budget of

794
00:39:12,600 --> 00:39:15,480
Speaker 2: nine billion dollars for our medicaid budget, every single one

795
00:39:15,520 --> 00:39:18,600
Speaker 2: of those dollars represents a decision about who gets what

796
00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:21,400
Speaker 2: and when and the quality of the care that they get.

797
00:39:21,760 --> 00:39:23,520
Speaker 2: So if I sat back and thought about it, I

798
00:39:23,560 --> 00:39:25,759
Speaker 2: would say, oh, you know, this is a huge responsibility.

799
00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:28,799
Speaker 2: You know who would voluntarily take it. But if you

800
00:39:28,880 --> 00:39:30,600
Speaker 2: have a chance to make that kind of change in

801
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:34,400
Speaker 2: a person's life, I believe that it's really your moral

802
00:39:34,440 --> 00:39:37,759
Speaker 2: obligation and your responsibility to embrace it, because who else

803
00:39:37,800 --> 00:39:41,040
Speaker 2: but you who's thinking about the intersection of what you

804
00:39:41,120 --> 00:39:43,840
Speaker 2: can do morally and what you can do in a

805
00:39:43,880 --> 00:39:46,359
Speaker 2: more expansive way for lots of people so they can

806
00:39:46,440 --> 00:39:48,880
Speaker 2: all be lifted and live a better life. We very

807
00:39:49,040 --> 00:39:51,040
Speaker 2: rarely get a chance to do that kind of work

808
00:39:51,040 --> 00:39:53,560
Speaker 2: in our lives, we really do. We can do it

809
00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:56,840
Speaker 2: in small places, we can do it, you know, intermittently,

810
00:39:57,000 --> 00:39:58,319
Speaker 2: But when you get a chance to do it on

811
00:39:58,360 --> 00:40:01,440
Speaker 2: a large scale. I did with paid family and medical

812
00:40:01,520 --> 00:40:04,040
Speaker 2: eve and I'm doing now. You have to embrace it.

813
00:40:04,040 --> 00:40:06,359
Speaker 2: But many people are afraid to embrace it because they're

814
00:40:06,360 --> 00:40:08,839
Speaker 2: afraid of all the moral hazards that come with it.

815
00:40:09,400 --> 00:40:11,680
Speaker 2: My role now is to say you need to embrace

816
00:40:11,719 --> 00:40:13,920
Speaker 2: those moral hazards, not be afraid of them, but equip

817
00:40:14,040 --> 00:40:16,399
Speaker 2: yourself to deal with them so that you can lead

818
00:40:16,480 --> 00:40:21,000
Speaker 2: exceptionally and really help people to live fully as they're

819
00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:23,879
Speaker 2: intended to. And you can do that, and I hope

820
00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:25,919
Speaker 2: I'm an example of that in some ways, and I'd

821
00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:27,359
Speaker 2: like to teach other people how to do that.

822
00:40:28,000 --> 00:40:29,520
Speaker 1: I want to ask you in the last couple of

823
00:40:29,520 --> 00:40:31,879
Speaker 1: minutes we have here, which is, what does someone who

824
00:40:31,960 --> 00:40:35,920
Speaker 1: is immersed in many of life's most difficult problems? What

825
00:40:35,920 --> 00:40:37,759
Speaker 1: do you do to escape and unwind? What do you

826
00:40:37,760 --> 00:40:39,319
Speaker 1: do and your husband do? Where do you go?

827
00:40:39,600 --> 00:40:43,799
Speaker 2: Well? We're big moviegoers, but okay, okay, we are.

828
00:40:44,600 --> 00:40:46,680
Speaker 1: The Hallmark channel might have something soothing.

829
00:40:46,760 --> 00:40:48,480
Speaker 2: Well, they have a little bit more to do that.

830
00:40:48,560 --> 00:40:51,839
Speaker 2: We're more sort of Maravel movie You are you are?

831
00:40:51,960 --> 00:40:55,799
Speaker 2: Reallys Yes, We're more along those lines because I think

832
00:40:55,840 --> 00:40:58,680
Speaker 2: you're right for him, it's less of an issue for me.

833
00:40:58,760 --> 00:41:01,520
Speaker 2: I do struggle with the moral of the normalization of

834
00:41:01,640 --> 00:41:05,239
Speaker 2: violence in media in general, not just movies, So I

835
00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:09,879
Speaker 2: personally struggle with that, and he respects that. We take

836
00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:12,000
Speaker 2: a lot of long walks, We spend a lot of good,

837
00:41:12,000 --> 00:41:14,280
Speaker 2: great quality time together. We're both voracious readers.

838
00:41:14,280 --> 00:41:15,560
Speaker 1: Do you like to get out of town. You like

839
00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:17,040
Speaker 1: to go away anywhere I do.

840
00:41:17,160 --> 00:41:19,879
Speaker 2: We just got back from Bermuda, which did nice love. Yeah,

841
00:41:19,920 --> 00:41:21,560
Speaker 2: we just love these long vacations.

842
00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:25,760
Speaker 1: It was beautiful and you get to decompress and unwind, Yes,

843
00:41:25,920 --> 00:41:28,959
Speaker 1: from your tough, tough, Quotitian chores there.

844
00:41:29,160 --> 00:41:32,080
Speaker 2: Yes that I love. As I say, I believe that

845
00:41:32,160 --> 00:41:34,719
Speaker 2: I am built for this and all to do this work.

846
00:41:34,800 --> 00:41:37,439
Speaker 2: So it's it's a for me. There's a strange joy

847
00:41:37,440 --> 00:41:39,920
Speaker 2: that comes to being able to share what I've learned

848
00:41:39,920 --> 00:41:42,240
Speaker 2: throughout my life to help make things better.

849
00:41:42,480 --> 00:41:44,960
Speaker 1: Well, the state of Connecticut is lucky to have you.

850
00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:47,640
Speaker 1: They're lucky to have you. You're a very substantial human being.

851
00:41:47,840 --> 00:41:50,640
Speaker 2: Thank you. It's my pleasure to speak with you. Appreciate it.

852
00:41:54,880 --> 00:41:59,800
Speaker 1: Connecticut Commissioner for the Department of Social Services, Andrea Barton Reeves.

853
00:42:00,600 --> 00:42:03,880
Speaker 1: This episode was recorded at c d M Studios in

854
00:42:03,960 --> 00:42:07,840
Speaker 1: New York City. Were produced by Kathleen Russo, Zach MacNeice,

855
00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:12,080
Speaker 1: and Victoria De Martin. Our engineer is Frank Imperial. Our

856
00:42:12,200 --> 00:42:16,240
Speaker 1: social media manager is Danielle Gingrich. I'm Alec Baldwin. Here's

857
00:42:16,280 --> 00:42:23,400
Speaker 1: the thing, as brought to you by iHeart Radio.