WEBVTT - Muriel's Wedding 0:00:00.960 --> 0:00:04.560 On the Bechdecast, The questions asked if movies have women 0:00:04.680 --> 0:00:07.960 and them, are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands 0:00:08.000 --> 0:00:12.400 or do they have individualism? The patriarchy Zeph and Beast 0:00:12.800 --> 0:00:15.800 start changing with the Bechdel Cast. 0:00:16.400 --> 0:00:21.439 Oh hello, Jamie, Hello, Hello, what's up? How are you? 0:00:21.560 --> 0:00:21.720 Oh? 0:00:21.760 --> 0:00:22.720 I'm doing pretty good. 0:00:23.079 --> 0:00:26.560 How are you? I'm doing all right. Yes, it's just 0:00:26.680 --> 0:00:31.440 nice to sit down and watch an Australian film. So true, 0:00:31.520 --> 0:00:35.280 Australian films are so slipped on, wouldn't you agree? I agree, 0:00:35.960 --> 0:00:40.200 absolutely slipt on that Tony collects a stuff. 0:00:40.720 --> 0:00:43.479 She really is and I always forget she's Australian because 0:00:43.680 --> 0:00:47.120 most of the roles I've seen her do she's doing 0:00:47.159 --> 0:00:50.160 an American accent. Yes, I feel like she is. 0:00:50.200 --> 0:00:52.840 She then, and we've talked about this on the show before, 0:00:52.960 --> 0:00:56.320 but I never I never tire of this line of discussion. 0:00:56.800 --> 0:01:00.840 But like she and Margot Robie, I feel like our 0:01:00.960 --> 0:01:05.400 our our strongest stealth Australians that I'm aware of, unless 0:01:05.440 --> 0:01:07.480 there's more and we we just don't know. 0:01:09.160 --> 0:01:13.960 Solely true, because there's Nicole Kidman's always kind of slipping 0:01:14.000 --> 0:01:14.399 into her. 0:01:14.480 --> 0:01:18.080 I would not, I would not she is. I would 0:01:18.160 --> 0:01:23.240 not say that. I'm like, really, Nicole Kidman's Australian, nothing 0:01:23.280 --> 0:01:27.760 but respect, but like she's constantly falling out of it. Yeah, 0:01:27.800 --> 0:01:30.039 in a way that I simply love. I find it 0:01:30.160 --> 0:01:34.800 very charming. Oh oh my gosh, no, wait, you're not 0:01:34.880 --> 0:01:38.840 a Succession head Sarah Snook. Sarah Snook, who plays the 0:01:39.400 --> 0:01:44.280 daughter Shive on Succession, is Australian and in all four 0:01:44.319 --> 0:01:48.840 seasons I have I'm sure Australian folks would catch smaller slips, 0:01:49.680 --> 0:01:52.520 but I like caught one slip and it was so 0:01:52.600 --> 0:01:54.840 funny because she just couldn't say range. I think we've 0:01:54.840 --> 0:01:57.240 talked about this of the Yeah, Raine drove she could. 0:01:57.480 --> 0:02:01.760 She couldn't say Range, Rover, She's a Range and you're like, yeah, 0:02:01.920 --> 0:02:08.320 New York girl boss. Anyways. Yeah, this movie is proof 0:02:08.400 --> 0:02:11.720 positive that Tony Kullett is indeed Australian and has been 0:02:11.760 --> 0:02:15.000 for some time, at least thirty one years. Yeah. 0:02:15.040 --> 0:02:16.120 I would say most of her life. 0:02:16.200 --> 0:02:18.720 Can't speak to before then, but this was like her big, 0:02:18.880 --> 0:02:22.160 her big Welcome to the Bechdel Cast. My name is 0:02:22.200 --> 0:02:23.080 Shamie Loftis. 0:02:23.440 --> 0:02:25.359 My name is Caitlyn Dante. This is our show where 0:02:25.360 --> 0:02:28.280 we examine movies through an intersexual feminous ones, using the 0:02:28.320 --> 0:02:30.400 Bechdel test as a jumping off point. We don't really 0:02:30.440 --> 0:02:32.720 have time for that. We got to talk about Muriel's wedding. 0:02:32.919 --> 0:02:35.160 This is our fake wedding. This is our fake wedding. 0:02:35.400 --> 0:02:38.240 This is yeah. We we sort of planned this episode 0:02:38.320 --> 0:02:41.120 last minute just because we were excited about it. It's 0:02:41.160 --> 0:02:44.119 a movie that we are I'm sure that we're making 0:02:44.160 --> 0:02:46.280 a few prospective guests for this because I think so 0:02:46.360 --> 0:02:48.800 many guests over like I would talk about Muriel's wedding like, 0:02:49.120 --> 0:02:52.560 people are frothing for this episode. Oh yeah, and we're 0:02:52.560 --> 0:02:55.440 happy to give it to you. And I am so 0:02:56.280 --> 0:02:58.960 excited to hear what people's experience with this movie was, 0:02:59.040 --> 0:03:02.959 because I just like, there's so much to talk about. 0:03:03.080 --> 0:03:05.200 What a film? I know, what a film I not? 0:03:06.160 --> 0:03:10.960 Wouldn't you say? So? This film came out in nineteen 0:03:11.040 --> 0:03:13.680 ninety four. Ever heard of it? 0:03:14.960 --> 0:03:15.560 It was a lie? 0:03:15.600 --> 0:03:18.960 It is I believe me too, And it's brave of 0:03:19.040 --> 0:03:23.480 us to say that. But this was directed by PJ. Hogan, 0:03:23.520 --> 0:03:25.680 who was like, who did so? He also did my 0:03:25.720 --> 0:03:29.400 best friend's wedding, which we covered not too long ago 0:03:29.600 --> 0:03:31.320 on this show, and by that, I mean I was 0:03:31.360 --> 0:03:33.639 living in my current apartment, so it couldn't have been 0:03:33.680 --> 0:03:34.360 too long ago. 0:03:34.960 --> 0:03:40.360 Very true. He also directed that Peter Pan movie that 0:03:40.440 --> 0:03:43.600 you have discussed with enjoying jerem me. 0:03:44.080 --> 0:03:46.840 I was like, wow, he's coming up all over the place. 0:03:46.880 --> 0:03:49.720 I also have been thinking a lot about Jason Isaacs, 0:03:49.760 --> 0:03:52.640 who I believe plays Captain Hook in that Peter Pan. Yeah, 0:03:52.680 --> 0:03:57.640 because Jason Isaacs is in the new season of White Lotus, 0:03:57.680 --> 0:03:59.800 so he's kind of having and I was like, who 0:03:59.880 --> 0:04:04.600 is that? And then it's like, oh right, Wig Luciu's 0:04:04.640 --> 0:04:08.320 Malfoy's dad. I was like, what's his name? What's his name? Wig? 0:04:08.640 --> 0:04:11.360 In my head, Jason Isaac's name. 0:04:11.240 --> 0:04:12.720 Is Wig long blond Wig. 0:04:12.880 --> 0:04:15.120 Yeah, I didn't know him before he was Wig. 0:04:16.680 --> 0:04:16.920 P J. 0:04:17.080 --> 0:04:20.839 Hogan also directed Confessions of a Schoppaholic, which I have 0:04:20.960 --> 0:04:21.799 also not seen. 0:04:22.200 --> 0:04:26.560 I haven't either. I know that people have and listeners 0:04:26.560 --> 0:04:29.600 correct me from wrong. People have a lot of love 0:04:29.640 --> 0:04:33.039 for that movie, but it seems more nostalgic than it 0:04:33.360 --> 0:04:37.240 being good, might imagine. I can't say I read the 0:04:37.360 --> 0:04:40.200 Confessions of the Chapoholic books when I was a kid, 0:04:40.839 --> 0:04:43.640 because they had like a lot of sex in them, 0:04:44.800 --> 0:04:47.160 and I think my mom let me take them out 0:04:47.160 --> 0:04:50.520 of the library because she thought they were princess Diary's 0:04:50.560 --> 0:04:55.560 books because the covers look similar, you know, both very 0:04:55.920 --> 0:04:58.919 feminine titles. And but like I learned how to I 0:04:59.040 --> 0:05:00.960 value those. But I don't remember a thing that happened, 0:05:01.160 --> 0:05:03.520 but it's how I remember. It's how I learned about 0:05:03.720 --> 0:05:08.120 fucking and credit card debt, two things I have since experienced. 0:05:08.720 --> 0:05:10.640 Congratulations, thank you. 0:05:10.720 --> 0:05:13.000 Thank you. And I couldn't have done it without my 0:05:13.120 --> 0:05:14.400 friend Chappaholic. 0:05:15.240 --> 0:05:18.560 I learned about fucking via Judy. 0:05:18.360 --> 0:05:23.480 Bloom books, like the adult ones. Yeah, because she wrote Forever, Yes, 0:05:23.640 --> 0:05:26.800 Forever was that's a very horny book, very horny. 0:05:26.880 --> 0:05:29.960 And then there's one called like Summer Sisters or something. 0:05:30.920 --> 0:05:35.400 Remember that heavily references Abba. Relevant to today's discussion. 0:05:35.600 --> 0:05:38.400 I do have a quite I mean, how on earth 0:05:39.040 --> 0:05:41.880 did because this was an independent film, how did they 0:05:42.000 --> 0:05:46.760 afford Abba? I don't It was made for nine million dollars, 0:05:46.960 --> 0:05:49.040 Like that's how much it costs to play three seconds 0:05:49.040 --> 0:05:50.560 of dancing Queen. Now I wonder. 0:05:51.600 --> 0:05:55.400 I mean, I don't know, Mammy are ruined it for everyone? 0:05:55.960 --> 0:05:59.080 I was gonna write Abba songs are that's too high. 0:05:59.160 --> 0:06:01.400 Now, that's it's very possible because I think this came 0:06:01.400 --> 0:06:05.240 out before the musical, so maybe that was just what 0:06:05.400 --> 0:06:07.239 let me. Yeah, because the musical came out in nineteen 0:06:07.320 --> 0:06:12.120 ninety nine, so maybe Abba Wright's We're pretty cheap. And 0:06:12.480 --> 0:06:14.640 I mean it's clear that no one in Australia in 0:06:14.680 --> 0:06:17.440 nineteen ninety four had a good thing to say about them. 0:06:18.000 --> 0:06:20.760 Well especially Mary friends. 0:06:20.839 --> 0:06:23.400 Yeah, yeah, I mean you can tell where PJ. Hogan 0:06:23.440 --> 0:06:28.279 stands because everyone who hates Abba is a bitch. What 0:06:28.400 --> 0:06:31.440 an interesting movie. So yes, nineteen ninety four PJ. Hogan, 0:06:31.520 --> 0:06:36.280 written and directed by I believe, his film debut, produced 0:06:36.400 --> 0:06:41.400 by two women Brave, one of whom is Pj's his wife, 0:06:41.839 --> 0:06:47.320 Jocelyn Moorehouse and a young actor who is pretty obscure 0:06:47.920 --> 0:06:52.560 becomes a big stat from this movie. And an's Tony Kollett. 0:06:52.920 --> 0:06:57.680 That's so true, Jimmie, what is your relationship with this movie? 0:06:58.440 --> 0:07:01.160 I hadn't seen it and I have no idea why, 0:07:01.320 --> 0:07:05.000 because it's like I think, maybe it's just like a 0:07:05.480 --> 0:07:08.279 little Yeah, I guess it's like for the same reason 0:07:08.360 --> 0:07:10.120 that I mean, I'm not comparing them, but they're like 0:07:10.600 --> 0:07:14.320 for one thing, I thought this movie was a romantic comedy, 0:07:14.440 --> 0:07:17.520 like I did not, And there I would say, it 0:07:17.600 --> 0:07:21.360 is like, while it is coded as it seems like 0:07:21.360 --> 0:07:23.720 it was marketed as a romantic comedy. I mean, I 0:07:24.000 --> 0:07:25.960 look at the cover of this movie and I'm like. 0:07:26.240 --> 0:07:29.520 Oh, that's a rom com probably exactly. 0:07:29.680 --> 0:07:31.880 Like it's a I was. I was honestly like, is 0:07:31.920 --> 0:07:36.760 this just like a boring highjinks thing? Like what is this? 0:07:36.760 --> 0:07:39.800 This movie, I would say is pretty thoroughly devoid of 0:07:40.680 --> 0:07:44.600 romantic love, but not devoid of love, but devoid of 0:07:44.680 --> 0:07:48.120 romantic love, yes, but it is funny at many points. 0:07:48.200 --> 0:07:50.600 I found it very sport but like, yeah, I just 0:07:50.680 --> 0:07:53.480 hadn't seen it for whatever reason, for the same reason 0:07:53.480 --> 0:07:55.559 that yeah, I think like Pretty Woman is a movie 0:07:55.600 --> 0:07:57.440 that you'd think I would have seen by now, but 0:07:57.480 --> 0:08:00.280 it was just like a little too old where I 0:08:00.280 --> 0:08:01.960 don't think I grew up with anyone was like, you 0:08:02.040 --> 0:08:06.560 gotta watch Muriel's wedding. But that's a damn shame, because 0:08:07.320 --> 0:08:10.840 this movie I really enjoyed it. I've I don't even 0:08:10.920 --> 0:08:14.560 like it's gonna be challenging to talk about because there's 0:08:14.640 --> 0:08:18.040 so much that happens in this movie. I will say 0:08:18.240 --> 0:08:20.720 and Okay, to be clear, I don't mean this as 0:08:20.720 --> 0:08:25.560 a negative, but a lot of tonal whiplash where you're like, 0:08:26.240 --> 0:08:29.559 it's this movie, No, it's this movie. It's a noora 0:08:29.720 --> 0:08:33.319 for a few minutes, and then it's like a family 0:08:33.400 --> 0:08:36.959 drama for the last ten minutes. It's like it's so 0:08:37.080 --> 0:08:41.440 many different movies. It's also kind of like, I mean, 0:08:41.520 --> 0:08:45.160 I would be shocked if people weren't, you know, sort 0:08:45.200 --> 0:08:48.480 of in the way that fans, do, you know, rooting 0:08:48.640 --> 0:08:51.920 for Muriel and Rohnda to realize they're in love with 0:08:51.960 --> 0:08:54.720 each other. I don't know what PJ thinks of that, 0:08:55.080 --> 0:09:00.559 but that's probably what should happen anyways. Yeah, I just 0:09:00.600 --> 0:09:03.199 thought it was wild. Yeah, and also that this came 0:09:03.200 --> 0:09:07.199 out during like a pretty cool moment for Australian independent 0:09:07.240 --> 0:09:10.760 film because it came out right after the Adventures of Priscilla, 0:09:10.840 --> 0:09:13.679 Queen of the Desert, So this was like a really 0:09:14.000 --> 0:09:19.720 interesting time for Straine film. So true, what's your history 0:09:19.840 --> 0:09:21.520 with this movie? Had you seen it? 0:09:22.120 --> 0:09:26.360 I had seen the first scene at the wedding at 0:09:26.360 --> 0:09:30.120 the very beginning. Interesting, and I don't know why I 0:09:30.120 --> 0:09:32.440 didn't keep watching. I think I like had to go 0:09:32.640 --> 0:09:36.200 to a comedy show or something. But I watched it, 0:09:36.559 --> 0:09:39.280 I think when I was still living in Boston with 0:09:39.400 --> 0:09:42.240 my best friend, who I'm pretty sure is a big 0:09:42.280 --> 0:09:44.800 fan of this movie, and he's like, I'm gonna put 0:09:44.800 --> 0:09:47.960 this on, and then I watched the first scene and 0:09:47.960 --> 0:09:50.680 then I like had to go. It's not that I 0:09:50.880 --> 0:09:52.440 wasn't interested in continuing watching. 0:09:52.520 --> 0:09:55.600 It's also such a weird for it's such a weird 0:09:56.000 --> 0:09:58.600 movie from the moment it begins, like I like, what 0:09:58.640 --> 0:10:00.920 would you even leave? Being like where is this going 0:10:00.960 --> 0:10:05.000 to go? Because it's like Urials getting arrested? Right. 0:10:05.840 --> 0:10:08.560 So I knew enough based on that first scene to 0:10:08.720 --> 0:10:13.320 know that it was a movie about a woman who 0:10:13.320 --> 0:10:15.480 we're supposed to kind of think is this you know, 0:10:15.600 --> 0:10:19.720 like sad sack person, but we also like love her 0:10:19.800 --> 0:10:24.280 and we're endeared to Muriel. But it's like it doesn't 0:10:24.320 --> 0:10:27.240 start the way like that first scene. I was like, 0:10:27.280 --> 0:10:30.800 oh this this probably isn't a standard rom calm based 0:10:30.800 --> 0:10:32.840 on just like how things are being set up or 0:10:32.840 --> 0:10:36.960 I couldn't really tell. But I never found out until 0:10:37.040 --> 0:10:41.080 you know, yesterday what it was about, because I for 0:10:41.160 --> 0:10:44.200 some reason didn't keep watching it at a later date. 0:10:44.320 --> 0:10:47.000 But now I know. I've seen it twice now in 0:10:47.040 --> 0:10:52.160 the past twenty four hours, and there's so much to discuss. 0:10:52.200 --> 0:10:53.920 There's so much that happens. This is one of the 0:10:53.960 --> 0:10:58.360 longest recaps I've ever written, just because so much happens 0:10:58.400 --> 0:11:01.319 and it's hard to like gloss over things. 0:11:01.440 --> 0:11:03.959 I really liked. One of the many things I liked 0:11:04.040 --> 0:11:07.679 about this movie is that even though there are like 0:11:08.280 --> 0:11:10.520 I don't know, I mean, and maybe the recap will 0:11:10.679 --> 0:11:14.559 prove me wrong because it is just such a vibes movie, 0:11:15.200 --> 0:11:17.959 but even when characters sort of drop in and out, 0:11:19.160 --> 0:11:21.520 they usually I thought that the script in the movie 0:11:21.679 --> 0:11:25.240 was like much better than most movies about making sure 0:11:25.320 --> 0:11:28.080 characters came back, making sure that people had a moment. 0:11:28.200 --> 0:11:32.400 Someone who is referenced early on we meet later and 0:11:32.440 --> 0:11:35.600 we get to see, even if it's like maybe very 0:11:35.720 --> 0:11:39.360 sort of quick, but like you get to see sort 0:11:39.360 --> 0:11:43.600 of like the humanity of a lot of stock rom 0:11:43.679 --> 0:11:46.880 com characters, because it feels like this is a whole 0:11:46.920 --> 0:11:51.960 movie about the like quote unquote loser best friend that 0:11:52.000 --> 0:11:55.720 we see in so many romantic comedies, but this movie 0:11:55.760 --> 0:11:59.920 is about her and about how everyone around her is 0:12:00.080 --> 0:12:04.240 an asshole, like including her, Like I just yeah. 0:12:04.080 --> 0:12:07.240 She's got problems, but that's what makes the movie so like, 0:12:07.400 --> 0:12:11.400 it's so good, authentic and endearing. H Yeah, it's like 0:12:11.600 --> 0:12:16.200 if a movie focused on like the Judy Greer best 0:12:16.200 --> 0:12:18.120 friend character of so many rom coms. 0:12:18.440 --> 0:12:22.200 Yeah, and then yeah, and if she had like huge 0:12:22.280 --> 0:12:27.040 issues with her family. We'll get to the fare. But yeah, 0:12:27.080 --> 0:12:29.360 I thought it was really good. I also kept writing 0:12:29.400 --> 0:12:32.760 down real teeth. I just love people. 0:12:32.800 --> 0:12:38.280 No, no, uh, what's the fucking guy's name, Jerry Bruckheimer here? 0:12:38.720 --> 0:12:41.840 No, no, Lauren Michael's teeth, none of it, none of 0:12:41.840 --> 0:12:47.480 it real real teeth. Also, Okay, the best example I 0:12:47.480 --> 0:12:50.480 can think of of a bit character that I had 0:12:50.520 --> 0:12:53.719 totally forgotten about and then she came back was that 0:12:53.840 --> 0:12:57.040 lady Diane who hates shoplifting. 0:12:57.960 --> 0:12:59.440 Oh yeah, she's just. 0:12:59.600 --> 0:13:03.600 The same, The same woman gets both Muriel and her 0:13:03.720 --> 0:13:06.920 mother arrested for a shoplifting. Yeah. 0:13:06.960 --> 0:13:12.040 She's like, I guess it's sort of like those secret shoppers, Yeah, 0:13:12.240 --> 0:13:15.600 who just like goes to stores and like spies and 0:13:15.840 --> 0:13:18.800 narcs on other customers for shoplifting. 0:13:19.080 --> 0:13:20.600 Yeah. I mean it's like, I get it that you've 0:13:20.600 --> 0:13:22.440 got to work, but the least you can do is 0:13:22.640 --> 0:13:26.000 be really bad at that job on purpose. Come on, absolutely? 0:13:26.360 --> 0:13:29.079 Yeah. Yeah, Well, in any case, shall we take a 0:13:29.160 --> 0:13:32.880 quick break and then get into the ages long recap 0:13:32.920 --> 0:13:33.679 that I've written. 0:13:34.200 --> 0:13:35.160 Let's do it. 0:13:35.440 --> 0:13:49.480 Okay, we'll be right back, and we're back. We'll place 0:13:49.520 --> 0:13:54.600 a content warning here for suicide as well as family 0:13:54.640 --> 0:14:00.480 abuse dynamics. Here's the recap of Muriel's wedding. I also like, 0:14:00.520 --> 0:14:03.520 I'm like, am I saying this name right? Muriel Muriel? 0:14:04.040 --> 0:14:06.280 And then later she calls herself Mariel. 0:14:05.920 --> 0:14:08.800 Like, it's Muriel Muriel. I think that that at least 0:14:08.800 --> 0:14:12.360 that's the American pronunciation of it, okay, because that was 0:14:12.400 --> 0:14:14.440 did you ever I know, I know the answer to this. 0:14:14.480 --> 0:14:17.360 Did you ever watch Courage the Cowardly Dog? 0:14:18.720 --> 0:14:19.880 Were not at all? 0:14:20.520 --> 0:14:24.200 Well, there's a character named Muriel on that show. It's 0:14:24.200 --> 0:14:27.520 spelled the same way, and she says it like that. Okay, 0:14:27.600 --> 0:14:29.600 it's kind of an old time It's just like an 0:14:29.600 --> 0:14:31.080 old fashioned name. Yeah. 0:14:31.120 --> 0:14:36.640 Well, my grandmother was named Miriam, so oh, okay, similar vibes. 0:14:36.880 --> 0:14:39.360 I knew. I knew a few mary El's. I definitely 0:14:39.360 --> 0:14:43.920 didn't know any Muriels. Her husband's name was Eustace. This 0:14:44.000 --> 0:14:47.000 cartoon I'm talking. Okay, so they they've just wear an 0:14:47.040 --> 0:14:48.600 elderly cartoon characters. 0:14:48.800 --> 0:14:50.520 Got it, got it all right? 0:14:50.600 --> 0:14:51.520 I guess we should start. 0:14:53.840 --> 0:14:58.400 So we are in a place called Porpoise Spit Australia. 0:14:58.560 --> 0:15:02.200 Ever heard of it? No, because it's a made up. 0:15:02.160 --> 0:15:04.520 Place, such a funny big name. 0:15:06.160 --> 0:15:10.800 We meet Muriel has Slop, played by Tony Kullette, at 0:15:10.800 --> 0:15:14.920 her friend's wedding, not her best friend's wedding, just her 0:15:15.080 --> 0:15:20.840 regular friend's wedding. She has caught the bouquet Mariel has 0:15:21.240 --> 0:15:25.920 and she's delighted because she loves weddings. She desperately wants 0:15:25.960 --> 0:15:29.720 to get married. The whole marriage and wedding thing is 0:15:29.760 --> 0:15:33.880 like very up her alley. Yeah, but all of her 0:15:34.040 --> 0:15:40.640 very mean friends such as Tanya, Cheryl, Nicole, there's another 0:15:40.680 --> 0:15:44.440 one whose name I didn't catch. They're like, eh, Muriel 0:15:44.840 --> 0:15:48.040 caught the bouquet. There's no way she'll be the next 0:15:48.080 --> 0:15:51.480 one to get married. She's never even had a boyfriend, Mariel, 0:15:51.560 --> 0:15:54.600 you should give the bouquet to someone else. They're also 0:15:54.680 --> 0:15:57.840 commenting on how she didn't even buy a new dress 0:15:57.840 --> 0:16:00.760 for this wedding, and she's like, yes, I did. 0:16:00.840 --> 0:16:05.040 And then it's like, well, yes and no, I love 0:16:05.200 --> 0:16:08.520 I love her. I just like she's impossible not to 0:16:08.600 --> 0:16:11.200 root for, even when she's being a real piece of shit. 0:16:11.360 --> 0:16:14.200 I just Tony Kalett is so good and the writing is, 0:16:14.520 --> 0:16:15.560 I thought, really good. 0:16:16.000 --> 0:16:16.320 Yeah. 0:16:16.360 --> 0:16:19.320 I just this movie weirdly made me like my best 0:16:19.320 --> 0:16:23.280 friend's wedding more just because I knew it was the same. 0:16:23.680 --> 0:16:25.440 It's not that I really want to watch it again, 0:16:25.640 --> 0:16:27.440 but I know that that our whole discussion around that 0:16:27.480 --> 0:16:29.800 movie was sort of like they were trying to go 0:16:29.880 --> 0:16:32.880 for something but it didn't quite happen, right, And I 0:16:32.880 --> 0:16:36.120 feel like they're trying to go something for something different, 0:16:36.120 --> 0:16:38.160 but they're trying to go for something here that is 0:16:38.160 --> 0:16:41.800 also weirdly wedding related, right, But the difference is it 0:16:41.840 --> 0:16:44.240 works in this movie really well. Right. 0:16:44.280 --> 0:16:48.240 It seems like PJ. Hogan has a vested interest in 0:16:49.200 --> 0:16:57.240 subverting traditional wedding oriented narratives, and what he ends up 0:16:57.280 --> 0:17:01.280 doing with My best Friend's wedding I appreciate to some extent, but. 0:17:01.280 --> 0:17:03.720 It also just feels like it's so Hollywood, and it 0:17:03.800 --> 0:17:08.880 seems like this movie is presumably completely within his control 0:17:08.920 --> 0:17:12.640 because it's fairly low budget. It's I don't know. Yeah, 0:17:12.640 --> 0:17:14.440 I wasn't able to fight a lot of information of 0:17:14.520 --> 0:17:18.160 like was he But I'm assuming because it's like a 0:17:18.240 --> 0:17:21.560 husband wife, you know, producing to it, like creatively, there 0:17:21.640 --> 0:17:24.840 was a lot more freedom to make some like weird 0:17:24.960 --> 0:17:28.200 choices because this movie makes so many weird choices. 0:17:27.880 --> 0:17:30.680 It really does. Yeah, And then there's a quick moment 0:17:30.720 --> 0:17:35.920 where Muriel goes inside and sees the groom whose name 0:17:36.000 --> 0:17:36.520 is Chuck. 0:17:37.240 --> 0:17:40.360 You're like and maybe maybe that's the name. Maybe we're 0:17:40.440 --> 0:17:40.960 not sure. 0:17:42.119 --> 0:17:45.560 And he's having sex with not the bride but one 0:17:45.560 --> 0:17:49.840 of the bride's friends, Nicole, and like Muriel sees them 0:17:49.880 --> 0:17:53.680 like secretly having sex in the laundry room. Then there's 0:17:53.720 --> 0:17:57.200 this whole thing where that woman, I guess her name 0:17:57.240 --> 0:18:00.400 is what is it Diane. She's like the secret shopper 0:18:00.800 --> 0:18:05.680 like store detective lady who accuses Maryel of stealing the 0:18:05.800 --> 0:18:06.760 dress that she's wearing. 0:18:07.320 --> 0:18:11.280 I am just like my enemy, my enemy Diane. 0:18:12.640 --> 0:18:17.600 The cops get involved, but Muriel's dad, Bill Heslop played 0:18:17.600 --> 0:18:22.159 by Bill Hunter, who was also in Priscilla, Queen of 0:18:22.200 --> 0:18:24.600 the Desert, and he's in another movie that we watched 0:18:24.640 --> 0:18:27.080 recently together. We haven't covered it on the podcast yet, 0:18:27.119 --> 0:18:28.280 but strictly ballroom. 0:18:28.880 --> 0:18:31.320 I mean he is Australia. 0:18:31.960 --> 0:18:38.160 Yeah, he is like a city council member or something. 0:18:38.800 --> 0:18:39.600 He works in government. 0:18:39.760 --> 0:18:42.880 It seems like he's a city council member who aspires 0:18:42.920 --> 0:18:46.360 to a bigger political career. Yes. Yeah, he's a climber 0:18:46.920 --> 0:18:48.040 and he's a piece of shit. 0:18:48.240 --> 0:18:52.040 He's the worst person. He kind of like butters up 0:18:52.119 --> 0:18:56.440 the cops to get Muriel out of trouble after stealing 0:18:56.480 --> 0:18:59.760 this dress. Then we cut to Muriel having dinner with 0:19:00.119 --> 0:19:05.120 her family. Her dad and her mom, Betty played by 0:19:05.200 --> 0:19:09.720 Genie Drynen, are there, along with Muriel's like three or 0:19:09.720 --> 0:19:14.840 four siblings. Her dad is carrying on about his various 0:19:14.960 --> 0:19:18.960 business dealings. He seems to be like a real estate 0:19:19.160 --> 0:19:23.679 developer or he like grants permits to people who build 0:19:23.680 --> 0:19:25.160 these like resorts and stuff like that. 0:19:25.240 --> 0:19:27.720 I was not exactly sure, yeah, because I was like, 0:19:27.760 --> 0:19:30.720 whatever he was doing, it's shady as fuck. Yeah, he 0:19:30.800 --> 0:19:33.879 was doing illegally. But like he I mean, and this 0:19:34.040 --> 0:19:36.439 is like a through line to the movie as it 0:19:36.480 --> 0:19:39.199 turns out, but like he's such a liar that I 0:19:39.440 --> 0:19:42.080 was not even sure what he was supposed to. 0:19:42.080 --> 0:19:45.520 Have been doing, right, Yeah, I don't really, I don't understand. 0:19:45.840 --> 0:19:48.960 He's like, I don't take bribes, I mean agreements, And 0:19:49.040 --> 0:19:52.639 I was like, for what, like it just was I 0:19:52.640 --> 0:19:55.040 don't know, I don't have that in me. I'm just like, 0:19:55.119 --> 0:19:58.560 it's too confusing. You're calling things other can't do it. 0:19:58.760 --> 0:19:59.880 We just know he's sleazy. 0:20:00.160 --> 0:20:03.600 Yeah, and he's hearing on oh that day draft, like 0:20:03.640 --> 0:20:07.320 whenever he screams across any room day draft. Yeah. The 0:20:07.359 --> 0:20:09.880 woman he's gonna leave her for. Yeah, yeah. 0:20:09.960 --> 0:20:13.120 Yeah, So there's that. There's he talks about how he 0:20:13.200 --> 0:20:16.680 like ran for state government once but lost. That'll kind 0:20:16.680 --> 0:20:20.280 of come back later. We also learn that Muriel dropped 0:20:20.280 --> 0:20:23.560 out of high school. She's currently unemployed and has been 0:20:23.600 --> 0:20:27.840 for a couple of years. Her dad calls Muriel and 0:20:27.880 --> 0:20:32.240 her siblings useless and dead weight. And then this is 0:20:32.280 --> 0:20:34.919 when a friend of Bill's comes over to the table. 0:20:35.480 --> 0:20:39.520 This is a beauty consultant named Deirdre who. 0:20:39.359 --> 0:20:42.399 Is basically running an MLM. It sounds like like a 0:20:42.520 --> 0:20:43.920 ninety era mL. 0:20:44.200 --> 0:20:47.840 It's not Avon, it's not Mary Kay, but it's something 0:20:47.960 --> 0:20:48.240 like it. 0:20:48.240 --> 0:20:53.200 It's the Australian fictional variant of this right, but. 0:20:53.200 --> 0:20:57.320 Deirdre offers Muriel a job. The next night, Muriel goes 0:20:57.359 --> 0:21:01.680 out to drinks with her friends, her mean girl friends, 0:21:01.920 --> 0:21:06.040 including the bride from the wedding, Tanya, who's crying because 0:21:06.080 --> 0:21:08.840 her husband is already having an affair, but not. 0:21:08.760 --> 0:21:11.760 With the person that Muriel knows with. It's a different affair, 0:21:11.960 --> 0:21:16.639 which just unfortunately, like pretty funny when you see, like 0:21:17.000 --> 0:21:19.680 when you see I think it's Nicole, react to like, wait, 0:21:20.119 --> 0:21:23.560 he's cheating on me to yet another person. 0:21:24.359 --> 0:21:28.479 Yeah, And her friends tell Tanya to forget about her 0:21:28.560 --> 0:21:33.200 husband and go on holiday with them to Hibiscus Island. 0:21:33.520 --> 0:21:36.560 This is the lot to Sex and the City the movie. 0:21:36.880 --> 0:21:39.480 Oh my gosh, you're right. Yeah, I didn't even think 0:21:39.520 --> 0:21:40.000 about that. 0:21:40.280 --> 0:21:42.440 Yeah, it's like if they had a friend that they 0:21:42.560 --> 0:21:48.040 verbally abused almost to death. Fortunately, among their crimes, that's 0:21:48.080 --> 0:21:50.480 not one of them. There's not a random fift but 0:21:50.480 --> 0:21:52.159 it really did feel like the cast of Sex and 0:21:52.200 --> 0:21:55.280 the City plus Tony Collette, and everyone's screaming at Tony 0:21:55.280 --> 0:21:56.439 Collett to shut up. 0:21:56.960 --> 0:21:59.960 Right, because what has happened is that Maryel's friends had 0:22:00.200 --> 0:22:04.280 planned a vacation without inviting Mauriel, and then they tell 0:22:04.320 --> 0:22:06.960 her that they don't want Muriel hanging around with them 0:22:07.000 --> 0:22:10.080 anymore because she doesn't fit in with the image that 0:22:10.119 --> 0:22:13.440 they've cultivated. She doesn't wear the right clothes or hairstyles. 0:22:13.720 --> 0:22:17.159 They fat shame her, and they also just simply don't 0:22:17.359 --> 0:22:21.640 like who she is as a person. Mauriel naturally starts 0:22:21.800 --> 0:22:23.880 crying and she says. 0:22:23.720 --> 0:22:29.800 I'm not nothing. It's so we're like, oh, Mariel, yeah, 0:22:29.840 --> 0:22:32.640 like this this movie is very depressing. Do yeah. However, 0:22:33.720 --> 0:22:36.960 I think it's so like bravely. I think Tony Kallett 0:22:37.040 --> 0:22:40.800 is very talented, but it is wild how they managed 0:22:40.840 --> 0:22:42.920 to balance the tone in the scene that like, your 0:22:42.960 --> 0:22:45.760 heart is breaking for her, and the scene is still 0:22:45.800 --> 0:22:48.080 a little bit funny because they're in this like loud 0:22:48.119 --> 0:22:52.159 tiki bar, and the friends are so tone deaf that 0:22:52.200 --> 0:22:54.960 when they're like, oh, yeah, I'm Muriel. We didn't invite 0:22:55.000 --> 0:22:57.920 you on vacation because we hate you and we hate 0:22:57.960 --> 0:23:01.720 everything about you. And then I think Tanya turns the 0:23:01.720 --> 0:23:06.320 subject back to herself and Muriel's still crying, and then 0:23:06.320 --> 0:23:09.160 she's like, could you stop making it about yourself? Muriel? 0:23:09.240 --> 0:23:12.199 Like It's like it still manages to be funny in 0:23:12.200 --> 0:23:15.719 this very depressed but in a way that isn't taking 0:23:15.800 --> 0:23:19.199 swings at our love of Muriel, which is I feel like, 0:23:19.240 --> 0:23:24.080 really hard to do. And yeah, I mean we'll we'll 0:23:24.080 --> 0:23:27.680 talk about the the you know that group of gals. 0:23:27.760 --> 0:23:30.679 But I just it made me because, especially as the 0:23:30.680 --> 0:23:34.080 movie goes on, it just feels like when you start 0:23:34.119 --> 0:23:37.560 to realize the sort of unending depths of self hatred 0:23:37.720 --> 0:23:40.680 that Muriel has for herself, that it's like she's saying, 0:23:40.720 --> 0:23:43.720 I'm not nothing like almost more to herself than to 0:23:43.800 --> 0:23:49.400 these women, and it's totally it's really sad. I no, oh, 0:23:49.520 --> 0:23:52.280 it breaks your heart. And then don't worry. It's gonna 0:23:52.280 --> 0:23:55.040 work out for her everyone. It's gonna also watch the movie. 0:23:55.080 --> 0:23:57.360 It's streaming on Paramount Plus. But it's gonna work out 0:23:57.359 --> 0:23:58.320 for her everybody. 0:23:58.640 --> 0:24:02.840 Yeah, but a few really the horrible things will happen first, I. 0:24:02.800 --> 0:24:06.760 Mean, isn't if that's not life best case scenario. 0:24:08.280 --> 0:24:11.280 Okay, So her friends have dumped her. The next day, 0:24:11.520 --> 0:24:16.159 Muriel's mom, Betty, gives Muriel a blank check so that 0:24:16.200 --> 0:24:20.080 she can buy makeup kids from Deirdre to resell because 0:24:20.119 --> 0:24:25.240 it is this like MLM scheme. Muriel tells her mom 0:24:25.640 --> 0:24:28.560 that she's gonna get married and be successful so that 0:24:28.680 --> 0:24:30.399 her parents can be proud of her. 0:24:30.920 --> 0:24:34.040 And there's a line that and there's also I again 0:24:34.119 --> 0:24:36.280 just like a character that I'm used to seeing in 0:24:36.400 --> 0:24:40.679 passing in rom comms, the like, for lack of a 0:24:40.680 --> 0:24:44.800 better description, depressed mother, and we end up getting I mean, 0:24:44.800 --> 0:24:47.000 it doesn't get much happier, but there is a lot 0:24:47.040 --> 0:24:50.760 of depth that we get with her mother that I 0:24:50.840 --> 0:24:54.120 wasn't expecting, and I was like pretty pleasantly surprised by 0:24:54.520 --> 0:24:56.879 just the amount that the plot is considering her. But 0:24:56.920 --> 0:24:58.920 there's a line she says in that scene that again 0:24:59.040 --> 0:25:02.960 just broke my heart because it becomes I feel like 0:25:03.119 --> 0:25:06.199 it's clear at the beginning, but it becomes clearer and 0:25:06.240 --> 0:25:10.480 clearer as the movie goes on that Muriel's mother's coping 0:25:10.560 --> 0:25:16.679 technique is denial and like shutting herself off to the 0:25:16.720 --> 0:25:19.720 parts of reality that are upsetting, even when that hurts 0:25:19.720 --> 0:25:22.280 through children. Basically, there's a line that she says that 0:25:22.400 --> 0:25:24.159 just brought my heart where she's like, your dad just 0:25:24.240 --> 0:25:27.000 wants to be proud of you, and you're just her 0:25:27.080 --> 0:25:30.359 phrasing it that way, you're just like, ah, I would 0:25:30.400 --> 0:25:35.000 steal all your money too, totally, which is what Muriel does. 0:25:35.480 --> 0:25:40.560 Yes, because we cut to Hibiscus Island, which is a 0:25:40.760 --> 0:25:46.440 very small island off the north west coast of Australia. 0:25:47.440 --> 0:25:50.679 This is where Muriel's friends are or former friends I 0:25:50.680 --> 0:25:56.480 should say, are on vacation. They look over and see Muriel, 0:25:56.560 --> 0:25:59.440 who has clearly used that blank check that her mom 0:25:59.480 --> 0:26:04.080 gave her to treat herself to a holiday, and the 0:26:04.160 --> 0:26:08.840 other women are furious that Mauriel is there. That night, 0:26:09.080 --> 0:26:11.960 she runs into someone she went to high school with, 0:26:12.640 --> 0:26:17.840 Ronda played by Rachel Griffiths. Maryel makes up a lie 0:26:18.040 --> 0:26:22.120 and tells Ronda that she's engaged to someone named Tim Simms. 0:26:23.480 --> 0:26:27.800 They I and you will be shocked how long Tim 0:26:27.840 --> 0:26:30.639 Simms is canonically real in this friendship. 0:26:30.880 --> 0:26:35.879 It seems like a month and months. She's like, what 0:26:35.920 --> 0:26:38.720 do you mean you would get a married Tim Simms? 0:26:38.800 --> 0:26:41.800 It's somehow even funnier in the accent, like. 0:26:43.359 --> 0:26:47.800 It's just I love it. It's it's her. I don't know 0:26:47.800 --> 0:26:50.840 why I'm feeling so referencing today, but her, what is it? 0:26:50.920 --> 0:26:55.000 Astronaut Mike Dexter, like just a made up boyfriend from 0:26:55.040 --> 0:26:58.560 thirty Rock. Yes, that's Muriel's Tim Simms. 0:26:58.800 --> 0:27:02.520 I'm also reminded of I forget which Brady Bunch movie, 0:27:02.800 --> 0:27:06.560 but it's like the ones that Christine Taylor is in them. 0:27:07.000 --> 0:27:11.800 They were like big staples of my youth. And Marcia 0:27:11.880 --> 0:27:15.119 at one point makes up a boyfriend named George Glass. 0:27:16.680 --> 0:27:18.320 So I love a lot like that. 0:27:19.040 --> 0:27:22.800 I mean, because it's also and I appreciate that it's 0:27:23.160 --> 0:27:28.040 made clearer in Muriel's wedding. Then I think it's been 0:27:28.080 --> 0:27:31.320 in most because I mean, god knows how many movies 0:27:31.359 --> 0:27:35.120 we've covered that have been like a relationship predicated on 0:27:35.160 --> 0:27:38.640 a lie. But I am giving this movie a pass 0:27:38.680 --> 0:27:42.119 because it's a friendship. No, But also it is, like 0:27:42.840 --> 0:27:47.320 is made so clear to us why Muriel's doing what 0:27:47.400 --> 0:27:51.040 she's doing. It doesn't excuse her from being dishonest with 0:27:51.800 --> 0:27:55.200 people who especially people like Ronda, who actually care about her, 0:27:55.960 --> 0:27:58.800 but it's very clear that this lie is coming from 0:27:58.840 --> 0:28:03.639 a place of insecurity, which is like most of the 0:28:03.680 --> 0:28:06.880 times in you know, my life where that lie has 0:28:06.920 --> 0:28:09.960 been made to me, or like when I was in 0:28:10.040 --> 0:28:14.959 high school from me is because you're insecure and like 0:28:15.000 --> 0:28:18.320 you want to seem cool and yeah, I don't know. 0:28:18.359 --> 0:28:21.280 We just covered Ryleyan on the show, and there's a 0:28:21.320 --> 0:28:24.200 similar thing there where it's just like, oh, I'm only 0:28:24.200 --> 0:28:26.080 going to see this person for one night. Let me 0:28:26.160 --> 0:28:29.320 just let them believe in the best version of myself 0:28:29.320 --> 0:28:32.359 that doesn't exist yet totally, and then you always end 0:28:32.440 --> 0:28:36.000 up entering a domestic partnership with this person. But what 0:28:36.119 --> 0:28:38.320 can you do? Right? It is? 0:28:38.720 --> 0:28:42.920 It is very different from the standard like rom com. 0:28:43.120 --> 0:28:46.600 Oh it's a it's a bet, or it's some kind 0:28:46.600 --> 0:28:50.000 of goofy lie to trick someone into thinking I'm not 0:28:50.160 --> 0:28:53.840 writing an article about them or whatever it is. Right, 0:28:53.880 --> 0:28:56.600 the context here is totally different, and it's rooted in 0:28:56.680 --> 0:29:03.440 something far more real, zembling real life, because I've met 0:29:03.560 --> 0:29:06.640 so many people like Muriel who I like, of course, 0:29:06.760 --> 0:29:09.280 either don't know they're lying or I can tell they're 0:29:09.320 --> 0:29:12.640 lying about something, but I understand why they're doing it, 0:29:12.840 --> 0:29:17.920 because yeah, they're they're insecure, They're they're doing the like 0:29:18.280 --> 0:29:20.640 fake it till you make it thing, and you know. 0:29:20.600 --> 0:29:23.640 It's the classic like I have a boyfriend who lives 0:29:23.680 --> 0:29:28.479 in Canada, like yeah, and some people carry that energy 0:29:28.600 --> 0:29:32.360 far into their adulthood and Muriel is I mean she's not, 0:29:32.560 --> 0:29:35.440 I mean not far into her adulthood. Tony Kollette I 0:29:35.440 --> 0:29:38.000 think is like twenty two in this movie. Yeah, but 0:29:38.640 --> 0:29:42.400 you know she and also as as it becomes more 0:29:42.440 --> 0:29:45.480 obvious and like, I don't know if it hit for 0:29:45.520 --> 0:29:47.720 you right away and I'm just have a brain full 0:29:47.720 --> 0:29:52.520 of rocks. But it's also like Muriel has seen her 0:29:52.600 --> 0:29:56.880 parents use lying in denial as coping strategies her whole life, 0:29:57.480 --> 0:29:59.840 and so it makes a lot of sense that that 0:30:00.040 --> 0:30:01.760 would be her go to for sure. 0:30:02.080 --> 0:30:06.240 Yeah. Yeah, So this is the lie that maryel tells 0:30:06.560 --> 0:30:12.840 Ronda about her fiance Tim Sims. Sims and the two 0:30:12.840 --> 0:30:17.440 of them get to talking about Tanya and Tanya's friends 0:30:17.760 --> 0:30:20.400 and how they were so cruel to Ronda in high school, 0:30:20.800 --> 0:30:24.640 and Mariel is like, well, surprise, they're right over there. 0:30:25.200 --> 0:30:28.760 So Ronda approaches them and Tanya is like, oh, why 0:30:28.760 --> 0:30:31.400 don't you have a drink with us? And Ronda is 0:30:31.440 --> 0:30:35.040 basically like no, thanks, you killy had beach. 0:30:35.680 --> 0:30:41.760 By the way, love, Like this speed with which Ronda 0:30:41.800 --> 0:30:45.760 wins you over is like unreal, It's so great. 0:30:46.120 --> 0:30:50.360 Yeah, and she's like, by the way, your friend Nicole 0:30:50.640 --> 0:30:54.440 is fucking your husband. And also I'm gonna go hang 0:30:54.480 --> 0:30:57.920 out with my new friend Maryel By like mic drop. 0:30:57.960 --> 0:31:01.480 Cut to and also, if you haven't seen the movie, 0:31:02.160 --> 0:31:05.840 important that you know that Muriel's obsessed with Abba. Cut 0:31:05.880 --> 0:31:10.880 to them doing an amazing karaoke scene in Waterloo, and 0:31:10.880 --> 0:31:15.200 then you're like, oh, this movie is weird, weird like this, 0:31:15.520 --> 0:31:19.040 it's it's great. Also, my best friend's wedding features an 0:31:19.040 --> 0:31:22.560 extended karaoke scene. Another PJ. 0:31:22.680 --> 0:31:25.360 Hogan, Wait, is it the one where they're at the 0:31:25.400 --> 0:31:28.400 like rehearsal dinner or some like wedding. 0:31:28.080 --> 0:31:32.760 Over Julia am I thinking they're wrong movie Ulis can't 0:31:32.800 --> 0:31:34.360 sing and then they follow. 0:31:34.200 --> 0:31:38.160 No, Cameron Diaz can't sing. Oh yes, yes, at karaoke. 0:31:38.280 --> 0:31:40.240 But then there's another scene where like a whole group 0:31:40.280 --> 0:31:42.920 of people are singing at some dinner. Yeah, we're talking 0:31:42.920 --> 0:31:45.560 about twoffer different scenes. But now I remember the karaoke scene. 0:31:45.640 --> 0:31:45.880 P J. 0:31:46.000 --> 0:31:50.719 Hogan loves a weird karaoke slash bar fight scene. 0:31:51.160 --> 0:31:54.240 Yeah, because what happens is like Rhnda and Muriel are 0:31:54.280 --> 0:31:59.160 like bringing down the house with their Waterloo performance. 0:31:58.840 --> 0:32:01.680 The outfits. It's just awesome. Yeah. 0:32:01.960 --> 0:32:04.880 Meanwhile, Tanya and her friends are there and they're having 0:32:04.920 --> 0:32:09.240 a horrible time, and then Tanya and Nicole start beating 0:32:09.280 --> 0:32:14.000 each other up. Cut to Maryel's family. They're reading a 0:32:14.000 --> 0:32:17.800 postcard from Muriel saying that she's funding this expensive vacation 0:32:18.280 --> 0:32:22.680 with all the cosmetics she's selling. Diadra hears about this 0:32:22.920 --> 0:32:27.640 and knows that Muriel's lying. Also, there's speculation that Muriel's 0:32:27.880 --> 0:32:31.280 dad and Deirdre are having an affair. I can't remember 0:32:31.280 --> 0:32:32.720 if I've made that clear yet or not. 0:32:32.920 --> 0:32:37.160 Yes, yeah, And it becomes increasingly obvious as time goes on, 0:32:37.280 --> 0:32:40.040 for sure, because she just always happens to be in 0:32:40.080 --> 0:32:43.680 the same restaurant. I love that that's there. It seems 0:32:43.720 --> 0:32:46.640 like truly their system is I will go to the 0:32:46.760 --> 0:32:50.840 nearest Chinese restaurant, and then you also go there, because 0:32:50.880 --> 0:32:54.840 we see that happen in multiple cities, Like that's clearly 0:32:55.040 --> 0:32:56.520 just their thing that they. 0:32:56.400 --> 0:32:59.960 Do something and he's always like, oh, what a cool 0:33:01.200 --> 0:33:05.560 and she's like hi, yeah yeah. So back to Muriel. 0:33:05.680 --> 0:33:10.240 She's still on vacation, hanging out with Ronda, who reassures 0:33:10.400 --> 0:33:14.960 Marriel that she is somebody. She's successful in Timstons wants 0:33:15.000 --> 0:33:20.760 to marry her. Shortly after this, Muriel returns home very 0:33:20.800 --> 0:33:24.000 briefly because it seems like her family is missing. Twelve 0:33:24.080 --> 0:33:27.720 thousand dollars and they rightfully suspect Muriel of stealing it. 0:33:27.960 --> 0:33:31.360 So she turns right back around and heads to Sydney, 0:33:31.480 --> 0:33:34.280 where Ronda lives. She moves in with her. 0:33:34.520 --> 0:33:37.480 It's a very sad scene, but it's also very funny 0:33:37.520 --> 0:33:42.280 that Muriel walks in the house with these like pretty 0:33:42.320 --> 0:33:45.360 gnarly tan lines too. She has like the outline of 0:33:45.440 --> 0:33:48.040 sunglasses on her face, which I thought was a funny touch. 0:33:48.520 --> 0:33:52.160 And then her poor mother is like always wanting to 0:33:52.160 --> 0:33:54.400 give her the benefit of the doubt, and it's like, 0:33:54.600 --> 0:33:58.240 you didn't do it right. You wouldn't do that. You're awesome, 0:33:58.440 --> 0:34:03.840 and Muriel's like, yeah, gotta go and running back. I mean, 0:34:04.560 --> 0:34:06.680 I mean, yeah, I was laughing. 0:34:06.920 --> 0:34:07.720 It's funny. 0:34:07.920 --> 0:34:10.400 You sun block. Oh my god. People in the nineties 0:34:10.440 --> 0:34:13.600 were so stressful. Please use sunblock for the love of god. 0:34:14.920 --> 0:34:20.880 Yeah, okay. So Muriel moves to Sydney. She's still lying 0:34:20.960 --> 0:34:25.000 to Ronda about having been engaged, although now she's saying 0:34:25.080 --> 0:34:29.840 that her ex fiance, Tim Sims is a cop, and 0:34:29.920 --> 0:34:33.200 so she's changing her name to Mariel with an A 0:34:34.000 --> 0:34:35.399 to hide from him. 0:34:35.600 --> 0:34:38.720 And I like that. I mean, it's definitely like naive 0:34:38.800 --> 0:34:42.600 of Ronda, But I also just like appreciate how game 0:34:42.719 --> 0:34:46.799 she is for like whatever Muriel's up to where she 0:34:46.880 --> 0:34:50.400 says and she means it. She's like, oh, you know 0:34:50.440 --> 0:34:52.239 when she meets him, she's like, oh, are you are 0:34:52.280 --> 0:34:54.680 you trying to like have one last fling before you 0:34:54.719 --> 0:34:57.759 get married to Tim Simms. I won't tell anybody. Yeah, 0:34:57.800 --> 0:35:00.960 And then and then she's like, oh, are you changing 0:35:01.000 --> 0:35:04.359 your name? Because Tim Sims is a homicidal X cop. 0:35:04.600 --> 0:35:09.120 I won't tell anybody. And it's like she is. She's 0:35:09.160 --> 0:35:10.320 a true friend. 0:35:10.680 --> 0:35:11.360 She's loyal. 0:35:11.680 --> 0:35:15.359 She's loyal even when it's like, come on, read back 0:35:15.400 --> 0:35:18.160 what you just said. But they're young. 0:35:18.200 --> 0:35:22.920 They're young, yeah, early twenties. Yeah, yeah, Okay. So Maryel 0:35:23.040 --> 0:35:26.799 now works at a video rental store and one night 0:35:26.960 --> 0:35:30.000 she goes out to a dance club with a customer 0:35:30.120 --> 0:35:33.439 named Bryce, who had like come into the video store 0:35:33.480 --> 0:35:37.040 and asked her out on a date. She brings him 0:35:37.080 --> 0:35:41.600 back home, where Ronda is having allowed threesome in the 0:35:41.680 --> 0:35:47.080 other room. Maryel and Bryce start making out. She's shrieking 0:35:47.160 --> 0:35:50.280 with laughter, and then there's all this okay high jinks. 0:35:50.480 --> 0:35:53.200 Well, okay, we have to slow this scene down because 0:35:53.239 --> 0:35:55.480 this scene I was like, I had to watch it 0:35:55.520 --> 0:35:59.239 like three times. It so much happens. Some of it 0:35:59.320 --> 0:36:02.560 is very high, some of it is very serious. The 0:36:02.600 --> 0:36:05.080 giggly stuff I was really confused about because I was 0:36:05.120 --> 0:36:07.719 sort of wondering because what happens right before they start 0:36:07.800 --> 0:36:11.080 making out and like we'll get into this where you know, 0:36:11.160 --> 0:36:15.400 it is very nineties and ascribing to like no consent discussions, 0:36:15.480 --> 0:36:20.120 nothing like that. Right like they're vibing, but he comes 0:36:20.120 --> 0:36:23.600 on pretty strong. I thought, sure, And she's laughing and 0:36:23.640 --> 0:36:25.840 it's unclear. I sort of was like, is it nervous 0:36:26.000 --> 0:36:29.399 or excited laughter? Because what happens right before they start 0:36:29.440 --> 0:36:33.239 making out is she sees her dad on tv ye 0:36:33.360 --> 0:36:36.880 say like Muriel, come home. We don't care about the money, 0:36:36.960 --> 0:36:39.560 And so I was like, is she having a panic attack? 0:36:39.800 --> 0:36:42.520 Like or is this but and it's like it's genuinely 0:36:43.200 --> 0:36:44.920 and it's you know whatever. It doesn't need to be 0:36:44.920 --> 0:36:47.080 directly clear to me, but I was like, I just 0:36:47.120 --> 0:36:49.040 felt to me, I was like reading that as like 0:36:49.320 --> 0:36:52.440 she was just like so overwhelmed by so many things 0:36:52.520 --> 0:36:54.359 happening at once, where I was like, this is an 0:36:55.320 --> 0:36:58.960 either her first or one of her first sexual experiences 0:36:59.520 --> 0:37:02.520 and she's like excited about it but also nervous, and 0:37:02.600 --> 0:37:05.400 also her dad is on TV looking for her, and 0:37:05.440 --> 0:37:07.840 also there's a three way going on five feet away, 0:37:08.239 --> 0:37:10.680 and it's just like it seems like she just like 0:37:10.760 --> 0:37:13.040 sort of her brain breaks a little bit and she's 0:37:13.080 --> 0:37:17.759 like yeah, right, and then hijinks and then cancer and 0:37:17.800 --> 0:37:18.200 you're like. 0:37:18.200 --> 0:37:21.719 All it's a spin of like two minutes. It's so 0:37:21.840 --> 0:37:24.280 much jam packed into one small moment. 0:37:24.440 --> 0:37:25.279 While Yeah, I was. 0:37:25.200 --> 0:37:27.880 Thinking about, like, the context we learned earlier in the 0:37:27.880 --> 0:37:30.560 beginning of the movie is that Maryel's never had a boyfriend. 0:37:30.760 --> 0:37:33.560 That doesn't mean she's never had any sexual experiences, but 0:37:33.640 --> 0:37:36.040 it also might mean that she hasn't. 0:37:36.200 --> 0:37:36.759 We don't know. 0:37:37.080 --> 0:37:38.120 We don't know for sure. 0:37:38.480 --> 0:37:40.719 We're not sure. It does seem like Muriel has a 0:37:40.800 --> 0:37:45.920 hyperfixation on monogamy that would suggest that maybe she hasn't 0:37:45.920 --> 0:37:47.440 had it, but we again, we just don't know. 0:37:47.480 --> 0:37:52.839 Canonically hard to say yeah. But then yeah, there's this 0:37:53.000 --> 0:37:58.320 like high jinxy kind of slapstick moment where Bryce, intending 0:37:58.360 --> 0:38:02.640 to like unzip her pants, he accidentally unzips the bean 0:38:02.719 --> 0:38:06.879 bag chair and all of the beans spill out. Then 0:38:06.920 --> 0:38:10.680 the two dudes who Ronda is fucking come out naked 0:38:10.800 --> 0:38:13.839 with their dicks out, and every time, like and why 0:38:14.120 --> 0:38:16.960 Maryel sees them, she shrieks some more. But like in 0:38:17.000 --> 0:38:21.080 a again, we're just like how. 0:38:20.440 --> 0:38:24.920 It just seems like she it's like she she's very 0:38:24.920 --> 0:38:27.600 hard to read this scene. I was like, how are 0:38:27.680 --> 0:38:31.319 you feeling? I don't know. Yeah, And also I'm like 0:38:32.000 --> 0:38:36.560 it happened so suddenly that I'm like, why did they attack? 0:38:37.719 --> 0:38:42.200 I'm guessing they heard her shrieking shrieking, and then they're like, 0:38:42.320 --> 0:38:44.600 what are you doing to her? So the two other 0:38:44.719 --> 0:38:49.960 guys like pin Bryce down, thinking that maybe he was 0:38:50.040 --> 0:38:55.320 assaulting Muriel, and then Ronda comes out and then suddenly 0:38:55.440 --> 0:38:58.440 Ronda's like, I can't feel my legs. 0:38:59.320 --> 0:39:02.600 Cut to so the er, that scene is exactly as 0:39:02.680 --> 0:39:06.279 chaotic as you just described, Like it is an experience 0:39:06.360 --> 0:39:07.240 watching that scene. 0:39:07.680 --> 0:39:10.680 Yeah, it's a lot. And then in the er in 0:39:10.719 --> 0:39:14.960 the hospital, it turns out that Ronda has a cancerous 0:39:15.080 --> 0:39:17.680 tumor that is pressing on her spine. That's why she 0:39:17.680 --> 0:39:20.840 couldn't feel her legs and she needs to have surgery 0:39:21.000 --> 0:39:23.400 immediately to have the tumor removed. 0:39:24.320 --> 0:39:27.400 Not to over cancer this discussion so much, but I 0:39:27.440 --> 0:39:30.080 did it did make me. I was curious, like how 0:39:30.120 --> 0:39:35.520 intentionally this was done. And apologies if you're an oncologist 0:39:35.640 --> 0:39:40.799 or a lover of oncologists, But the scene where she 0:39:40.920 --> 0:39:44.640 finds out that she has cancer and the oncologist sort 0:39:44.680 --> 0:39:47.919 of just drops that word into the conversation and she's like, wait, 0:39:48.640 --> 0:39:52.560 I have cancer and he's like, yeah, yeah, duh. Like 0:39:53.000 --> 0:39:56.680 that has been my experience with most oncologists, like when 0:39:56.719 --> 0:39:58.880 I was taking care of my dad over a course 0:39:58.920 --> 0:40:02.879 of years, where there's sometimes this and I get it, 0:40:03.320 --> 0:40:07.400 we're dumb, but like you have to say, like, okay, 0:40:07.520 --> 0:40:10.960 first things first, you have cancer, not just like okay, 0:40:11.000 --> 0:40:12.200 so here's what we have to do. We have to 0:40:12.200 --> 0:40:16.640 do on this timeline. Uh yeah, idiot, it's obviously cancer. 0:40:16.719 --> 0:40:21.600 I'm like, it's not best side manner. Where where is it? Anyways? 0:40:21.640 --> 0:40:25.480 I just felt weirdly validated by that experience and the 0:40:25.520 --> 0:40:28.680 doctor be like, oh, well, yeah, it's obviously cancer. Like 0:40:28.760 --> 0:40:30.560 you know, you have to say that, you have to 0:40:30.600 --> 0:40:31.160 say that. 0:40:31.200 --> 0:40:34.640 You have to use your words. I mean, I've talked 0:40:34.680 --> 0:40:39.759 at length on various podcasts and episodes of this show 0:40:39.840 --> 0:40:43.680 about my kind of distrust of the American healthcare system. 0:40:43.719 --> 0:40:46.399 But yeah, I found that a lot of doctors are 0:40:46.400 --> 0:40:49.160 not very good at communication, so no, and then there 0:40:49.440 --> 0:40:50.279 they should work on that. 0:40:50.800 --> 0:40:56.000 Yeah, anyways, there it is a very uh again, just 0:40:56.000 --> 0:41:00.400 like one of the many kind of abrupt like pace 0:41:00.600 --> 0:41:05.479 changes in the movie where it goes from like, oh, 0:41:05.840 --> 0:41:08.839 like Muriel's about to have a fun hookup with her 0:41:08.920 --> 0:41:15.680 crush to her best friend has cancer. And I just 0:41:15.719 --> 0:41:19.759 again was like so impressed that even though the like 0:41:20.360 --> 0:41:23.000 whatever gradient of things that happen is so all over 0:41:23.040 --> 0:41:26.960 the place, it never stops being a comedy. Right, but 0:41:27.560 --> 0:41:30.360 I'm sort of confused as to how that was even possible. 0:41:30.520 --> 0:41:33.640 But yeah, it's like, I mean, Rohnda has to have 0:41:33.680 --> 0:41:38.080 this surgery and and it seems that, you know, Muriel 0:41:38.160 --> 0:41:41.320 is her main source of support. 0:41:41.480 --> 0:41:45.920 Mm hmm. Yeah, this will become clear in a few 0:41:46.120 --> 0:41:50.440 moments before that, Muriel calls home and finds out that 0:41:50.760 --> 0:41:54.200 her dad has left her mom and is currently in 0:41:54.320 --> 0:42:00.440 Sydney as well, facing an inquiry for accepting bra vibes 0:42:00.600 --> 0:42:04.840 after Muriel stole their money. But you also get the 0:42:04.880 --> 0:42:08.399 impression that he's been accepting bribes his entire career, so 0:42:08.560 --> 0:42:09.840 it's like not a new. 0:42:09.680 --> 0:42:12.040 Thing, and that right, and that it's just like this, 0:42:12.200 --> 0:42:14.880 it happens to be the thing that people caught up on. 0:42:15.280 --> 0:42:17.840 And also, I mean, it becomes clearer as the movie 0:42:17.840 --> 0:42:21.719 goes on that her dad is always doing things that 0:42:21.960 --> 0:42:27.680 seem altruistic but are without fail to improve his own position, 0:42:28.000 --> 0:42:30.360 which you know, because at first I was kind of 0:42:30.400 --> 0:42:32.600 surprised when he goes on TV and he's like, Muriel, 0:42:32.640 --> 0:42:35.000 we love you, we're you know, we don't care about 0:42:35.040 --> 0:42:37.760 the money. But then it's like, oh, he was doing 0:42:37.800 --> 0:42:40.919 that to make him more sympathetic in this big court 0:42:40.960 --> 0:42:43.239 case he was about to go through. He's like, he 0:42:43.280 --> 0:42:45.839 doesn't mean a word that he says, which we learn 0:42:45.880 --> 0:42:48.720 in even more kind of gruesome detail as the movie 0:42:48.760 --> 0:42:49.160 goes on. 0:42:49.640 --> 0:42:54.240 For sure. So then, and this is maybe to help 0:42:54.440 --> 0:42:59.680 Muriel cope with this news of her friend being diagnosed 0:42:59.680 --> 0:43:03.280 with CAM. But she goes into a wedding dress shop 0:43:03.600 --> 0:43:08.239 to try on a gown. She tells the shopkeepers that 0:43:08.360 --> 0:43:13.000 she's marrying her fiance Bill in September. 0:43:12.520 --> 0:43:16.560 Which is also like, ugh, that's her dad's name, Muriel, 0:43:16.640 --> 0:43:17.440 don't say. 0:43:17.239 --> 0:43:21.480 That, yeah, stick with Tim Sims. She also said her 0:43:21.600 --> 0:43:25.760 story straight lady. She also says that her mom can't 0:43:25.760 --> 0:43:29.000 come because she's in the hospital with a tumor on 0:43:29.080 --> 0:43:32.799 her spine aka what's going on with Rohnda. And by 0:43:32.840 --> 0:43:37.919 now we realize that Muriel is a serial liar. I mean, yeah, 0:43:38.040 --> 0:43:41.279 that was pretty clear from the jump, but it's like 0:43:41.520 --> 0:43:45.480 now happened several times. 0:43:44.880 --> 0:43:47.000 But I feel like that's the first example where it's 0:43:47.080 --> 0:43:51.359 clear that like lying is her coping mechanism because it's 0:43:51.360 --> 0:43:54.160 like she can't talk about she finds it really difficult 0:43:54.200 --> 0:43:56.719 to talk about what is actually bothering her, so she 0:43:56.800 --> 0:44:00.640 makes up weird lies that reference what is bothering right. 0:44:00.719 --> 0:44:04.719 Yeah, she's pulling from source material aka other people in 0:44:04.719 --> 0:44:09.040 her life and then making up stories to make herself 0:44:09.239 --> 0:44:13.120 seem sympathetic. And it works. Yeah, because the shopkeeper out 0:44:13.120 --> 0:44:17.400 of section, they take photos of her in the dress, 0:44:17.560 --> 0:44:22.799 which Mariel puts in a wedding photo album, which we'll 0:44:22.800 --> 0:44:27.520 come back in a moment. Meanwhile, Ronda is in physical therapy. 0:44:27.640 --> 0:44:31.520 She's learning how to walk again. She's incredibly frustrated because 0:44:31.800 --> 0:44:36.120 she's unable to do much for herself. Mariel has to 0:44:36.120 --> 0:44:39.440 take care of her. But Mariiel's like, I don't mind, 0:44:40.160 --> 0:44:42.760 this is the best my life has ever been. It's 0:44:42.800 --> 0:44:44.960 as good as an Abba song. 0:44:45.280 --> 0:44:49.080 That made me tear up. That was really beautiful. 0:44:49.440 --> 0:44:54.120 Yeah. But then and then Ronda makes Muriel promise that 0:44:54.160 --> 0:44:57.480 they'll never go back to their hometown of Porpoise Spit 0:44:58.800 --> 0:44:59.359 and she's like. 0:44:59.440 --> 0:45:03.560 Yeah, which I will say is for even though Ronda 0:45:03.800 --> 0:45:08.000 is the best character in the movie, I think, and 0:45:08.040 --> 0:45:11.319 she's the realist. I wonder if it's like if it's 0:45:11.360 --> 0:45:14.560 a youth thing or but like, I don't know that 0:45:14.640 --> 0:45:18.400 she necessarily realized what a big ask that is, and 0:45:18.440 --> 0:45:20.799 that it was sort of like said and not to 0:45:20.840 --> 0:45:23.719 say that Muriel wouldn't have done it or I mean, 0:45:23.760 --> 0:45:27.440 because it's like caretaking and like assisting is like one 0:45:27.480 --> 0:45:29.960 of the most important jobs that exists. But it was 0:45:30.040 --> 0:45:32.880 just I felt a little bit for Muriel in that 0:45:32.920 --> 0:45:35.480 moment where it's like, well, what do you say in 0:45:35.520 --> 0:45:38.200 that situation? Even if you have reservations, you don't want 0:45:38.200 --> 0:45:41.720 to seem like you're turning your back on your friend, right, 0:45:41.760 --> 0:45:44.759 So it was I felt for both of them in 0:45:44.760 --> 0:45:48.160 that situation, because of course it's like Ronda needs a 0:45:48.200 --> 0:45:52.480 lifeline badly because she was They literally bonded over hating 0:45:52.480 --> 0:45:56.600 where they came from right, But then in the same way, 0:45:56.600 --> 0:45:59.000 it's like, that's a lot of pressure, particularly on a 0:45:59.040 --> 0:46:02.560 new friendship, and so I just really felt for both 0:46:02.560 --> 0:46:02.839 of them. 0:46:03.000 --> 0:46:06.640 Yeah, they've only known each other for a few months. 0:46:06.800 --> 0:46:09.640 Yeah, maybe, like and so it's like that is a 0:46:09.680 --> 0:46:15.160 really steep escalation, you know, but that's I mean, god, 0:46:15.320 --> 0:46:20.080 I again, it's just like obviously very specific circumstances, but like, oh, 0:46:21.160 --> 0:46:25.920 two friends in their early twenties and a weirdly codependent friendship. 0:46:27.640 --> 0:46:31.080 Many such cases, many such cases, indeed. 0:46:31.160 --> 0:46:38.400 Yes, So one day Ronda sees this wedding photo album 0:46:38.800 --> 0:46:42.800 that Maryel has been compiling, and apparently she's been filling 0:46:42.800 --> 0:46:46.000 it with dozens of photos of her in different wedding 0:46:46.040 --> 0:46:51.520 dresses at various bridal shops across Sydney. And then Ronda 0:46:51.800 --> 0:46:55.320 catches her red handed, like in the middle of trying 0:46:55.400 --> 0:46:58.919 on a dress and assumes that Maryel has gotten back 0:46:58.960 --> 0:47:02.560 together with Tim's Sims. And this is the moment where 0:47:02.719 --> 0:47:07.120 Maryel finally admits that there is no Tim Simms. She 0:47:07.560 --> 0:47:12.160 made him up, and she's doing that because she just 0:47:12.320 --> 0:47:15.520 desperately wants to get married, because if she gets married, 0:47:15.920 --> 0:47:20.719 she'll be someone else. Because Maryel hates herself. 0:47:20.640 --> 0:47:22.799 And that is the moment in the movie. Room'm like, oh, 0:47:22.840 --> 0:47:29.160 this movie is so good. It's like directly confronting how 0:47:29.200 --> 0:47:33.239 we're conditioned to see marriage to some extent where a 0:47:33.280 --> 0:47:37.200 lot of people are conditioned to see marriage is as 0:47:37.239 --> 0:47:40.200 like if you can do this, everything will be okay. 0:47:40.520 --> 0:47:45.200 When look at literally any marriage, it's so demonstrably untrue 0:47:45.280 --> 0:47:47.960 and like and the fact that like Ronda is so 0:47:48.600 --> 0:47:50.719 awesome in that scene, and we'll talk about like the 0:47:50.760 --> 0:47:54.239 conversations around ableism in this movie too, but like the 0:47:54.840 --> 0:47:58.120 fact that she, you know, is like get out of 0:47:58.120 --> 0:48:02.080 it because she's so afraid for Muriel and thinks that 0:48:02.200 --> 0:48:05.400 Muriel's re entering this abusive relationship right, And it's just 0:48:05.400 --> 0:48:08.960 like it's so emotionally charged and there's too much going 0:48:09.000 --> 0:48:11.080 on in their respective lives for them to be able 0:48:11.120 --> 0:48:12.600 to show up for each other in the way that 0:48:12.640 --> 0:48:16.160 they need to. And it's just like a ough it was. 0:48:16.280 --> 0:48:20.320 That scene is so heartbreaking and then also still somehow 0:48:20.360 --> 0:48:26.239 funny at the end because Ronda storms out and it's 0:48:26.320 --> 0:48:29.480 just like the two employees at the Bridle shop and 0:48:29.560 --> 0:48:33.600 a sobbing Tony Kollett and they're like hmmm, so what 0:48:33.640 --> 0:48:34.000 do we do? 0:48:34.360 --> 0:48:36.080 So we need that dress back now? 0:48:36.719 --> 0:48:40.160 Right, It's still like always there manages to be a 0:48:40.160 --> 0:48:43.520 comedic button on these like devastating scenes. 0:48:43.560 --> 0:48:50.560 It's wilds yeah for sure. Okay, So sometime later, Muriel 0:48:50.680 --> 0:48:54.359 meets up with her dad in Sydney. He berates her 0:48:54.400 --> 0:48:58.479 for stealing his money. Deirdre just happens to come into 0:48:58.560 --> 0:49:02.960 the restaurant, Oh my God, and she and Bill confirm 0:49:03.080 --> 0:49:07.160 that they're in love and that Bill has effectively left 0:49:07.280 --> 0:49:12.360 Muriel's mom Betty for Deirdre. Bill also tells Muriel that 0:49:12.400 --> 0:49:15.120 she has to move back in with her mom and 0:49:15.160 --> 0:49:17.440 she has like a few weeks to do it to 0:49:17.560 --> 0:49:22.040 avoid having to move back to Porpoise spit. Muriel goes 0:49:22.120 --> 0:49:27.720 through personal ads looking for men who are looking for 0:49:27.880 --> 0:49:29.080 a his wife. 0:49:29.680 --> 0:49:32.799 And this is like the maybe third or fourth time 0:49:32.920 --> 0:49:33.279 that the. 0:49:33.200 --> 0:49:38.560 Movie just likes a big name, totally different movie where 0:49:38.560 --> 0:49:41.680 it's like that this is the beginning of a this 0:49:41.760 --> 0:49:43.279 is the first act of a different movie. 0:49:43.560 --> 0:49:47.120 If we're like well into the second act of this movie. 0:49:47.239 --> 0:49:47.479 Now. 0:49:48.200 --> 0:49:50.440 I just thought it was like it was pretty pretty 0:49:50.480 --> 0:49:54.719 awesome because that premise feels weirdly like old school rom 0:49:54.800 --> 0:50:00.040 comie of like I need to do this and so 0:50:00.120 --> 0:50:02.799 I guess I have to get married. Like that's the 0:50:02.840 --> 0:50:04.680 oldest rom com trope in the book. 0:50:05.080 --> 0:50:10.120 So I thought when I was watching this yesterday, yeah, 0:50:10.120 --> 0:50:12.480 for the first time, aside from that first scene I 0:50:12.480 --> 0:50:15.600 had already watched years and years and years ago. I 0:50:15.719 --> 0:50:17.799 thought that the premise of the movie was going to 0:50:17.880 --> 0:50:21.600 be that after she catches the bouquet at this wedding 0:50:21.680 --> 0:50:24.680 and all her friends are like, you'll never be the 0:50:24.719 --> 0:50:27.680 next one to get married, that Maryel will like go 0:50:27.840 --> 0:50:32.080 on a journey like just be hell bent on getting 0:50:32.280 --> 0:50:35.000 married to prove those friends wrong. And that is kind 0:50:35.080 --> 0:50:39.680 of what happens. But that's not even necessarily her specific goal, 0:50:40.239 --> 0:50:42.279 like other a lot of other things happen to like 0:50:42.400 --> 0:50:46.200 get her on this path of this marriage that she 0:50:46.280 --> 0:50:48.520 eventually has, which we're about to get to. 0:50:48.600 --> 0:50:50.640 But like, well, it's like because it's like the real 0:50:50.760 --> 0:50:55.200 inciting incident of this movie is meeting Ronda, Like that's 0:50:55.239 --> 0:50:58.160 what really changes things. It feels like I don't know, 0:50:58.320 --> 0:51:00.080 I feel like it's clear by the end that it's like, 0:51:00.600 --> 0:51:03.840 you know, platonic or not, Like Ronda is the great 0:51:03.920 --> 0:51:08.840 love of Muriel's life. And vice versa, even though you 0:51:08.880 --> 0:51:13.320 know they both make their mistakes, Muriel more than Ronda. 0:51:14.360 --> 0:51:19.000 But yeah, yeah, that scene, it's so I don't even 0:51:19.080 --> 0:51:20.560 know what I thought this movie. I thought it was 0:51:20.680 --> 0:51:26.120 literally just like my wedding is next week, aha, because 0:51:26.120 --> 0:51:29.439 that's so many movies like they're like, I guess it's 0:51:29.480 --> 0:51:35.440 one of those. But it's just so twisty turney this 0:51:35.560 --> 0:51:38.120 is to me when it turns into it accidentally turns 0:51:38.160 --> 0:51:41.160 into like sort of an aura for like ten minutes 0:51:42.280 --> 0:51:47.560 where it's like, there's this rich guy from a foreign 0:51:47.640 --> 0:51:51.560 country that you know nothing about. You're gonna marry him, 0:51:53.000 --> 0:51:55.680 but it's not serious, and you're like, I know this. 0:51:55.600 --> 0:51:59.840 One right, because here's what happens. So she finds a 0:52:00.160 --> 0:52:05.080 personal ad that seems promising, so she goes to respond 0:52:05.080 --> 0:52:08.080 to it. Meanwhile, Ronda reveals that her cancer has come 0:52:08.120 --> 0:52:11.799 back and that she'll never walk again, and Ronda's mom 0:52:11.880 --> 0:52:15.680 is insisting that she does move back home to Porpoise Spit. 0:52:16.719 --> 0:52:21.240 Muriel's too wrapped up in this other thing to really 0:52:21.280 --> 0:52:25.160 bother with what Ronda's dealing with. That's because Muriel. 0:52:24.880 --> 0:52:27.879 My read of that was like it almost felt like 0:52:28.160 --> 0:52:31.200 Muriel was like mirroring her mom a little bit in 0:52:31.200 --> 0:52:35.279 that sequence where the situation going on around her was 0:52:35.320 --> 0:52:39.239 too overwhelming and so she kind of like detaches from 0:52:39.280 --> 0:52:42.880 it and does something else because originally, I guess I 0:52:43.000 --> 0:52:45.520 misinterpreted it the first time I watched this sequence where 0:52:45.920 --> 0:52:47.920 I thought that like Muriel had all of it, like 0:52:48.400 --> 0:52:51.279 she wants to, say, in Sydney because she doesn't want 0:52:51.280 --> 0:52:55.000 to be in this toxic family dynamic, but she also 0:52:55.040 --> 0:52:58.279 wants to be in Sydney because she loves Rhonda and 0:52:58.280 --> 0:53:01.239 wants to be there to support her, And so I 0:53:01.320 --> 0:53:03.960 sort of thought part of the reason she was seeking 0:53:03.960 --> 0:53:06.680 out this marriage arrangement was so that she could continue 0:53:06.680 --> 0:53:09.880 to be around Ronda. But then Ronda is you know, 0:53:09.920 --> 0:53:12.640 when Ronda's mom sort of puts her foot down and 0:53:12.920 --> 0:53:16.400 is like, no, you're coming home, it seems like Muriel 0:53:17.120 --> 0:53:21.160 just freaks out and kind of detaches instead of fighting 0:53:21.239 --> 0:53:24.840 for Ronda in that moment, which is like very relatable 0:53:24.920 --> 0:53:27.719 for someone in their early twenties and over their head, 0:53:27.719 --> 0:53:31.320 but it's so heartbreaking where it's like Ronda needed someone 0:53:31.360 --> 0:53:32.799 so badly to show up for her. 0:53:33.800 --> 0:53:38.240 Yeah, and Muriel is at this juncture in her life 0:53:38.760 --> 0:53:40.480 not the person to be able to do it. 0:53:41.040 --> 0:53:44.279 No, she like can't manage her own shit. 0:53:44.440 --> 0:53:48.200 No, not at all. But she does manage to meet 0:53:48.440 --> 0:53:52.960 this man who is looking for his wife. His name 0:53:53.040 --> 0:53:56.760 is David van Arkle and he's a swimmer who's trying 0:53:56.800 --> 0:54:00.920 to compete in the Olympics for Australia because he's from 0:54:01.239 --> 0:54:04.759 South Africa and there's a long history of South Africa 0:54:04.760 --> 0:54:08.480 being banned from the Olympics for being an apartheid state. Like, 0:54:08.960 --> 0:54:11.600 so he needs to marry an Australian woman to get 0:54:11.680 --> 0:54:14.480 like a green card or whatever the equivalent is, so 0:54:14.520 --> 0:54:18.480 that he can swim for Australia, and his family is 0:54:18.520 --> 0:54:23.080 willing to pay Muriel ten thousand dollars to marry this guy. 0:54:23.200 --> 0:54:27.600 Which is just like a totally different movie. It's like 0:54:27.760 --> 0:54:33.920 it's just so wild how what it intends, Like tonal 0:54:33.960 --> 0:54:35.480 Shift that is again. 0:54:37.320 --> 0:54:40.760 And so she meets this guy David, and Muriel's swooning 0:54:40.800 --> 0:54:43.840 over him because he's hot, handsome, and he's got a 0:54:43.840 --> 0:54:44.920 good physique and stuff. 0:54:44.960 --> 0:54:47.080 But to the point where it's like he doesn't she doesn't, 0:54:47.239 --> 0:54:49.879 or maybe she's so accustomed to being negged in front 0:54:49.920 --> 0:54:52.759 of her very eyes, because that's how her father, acts. 0:54:52.719 --> 0:54:55.239 And her friend, her former friends and her friends. 0:54:55.320 --> 0:54:58.239 Just like she's just so used to being negged to 0:54:58.320 --> 0:55:03.040 her face that David is like yucky, I don't like 0:55:03.120 --> 0:55:07.359 her to his like weird coach, and Muriel's like. 0:55:07.320 --> 0:55:12.560 Whatever, I'm like no, right. She seems thrilled at the 0:55:12.600 --> 0:55:16.319 idea of marrying him. He seems repulsed by her, but 0:55:16.400 --> 0:55:20.120 she breezes past that and. 0:55:19.280 --> 0:55:22.160 He'll give her, you know, ten thousand dollars that will 0:55:22.200 --> 0:55:25.279 allow her to extract herself from this financial obligation to 0:55:25.320 --> 0:55:25.840 her family. 0:55:25.960 --> 0:55:29.880 So yeah, so whin when so a wedding gets arranged 0:55:29.960 --> 0:55:33.360 between Muriel and David and there's a lot of media 0:55:33.400 --> 0:55:37.400 attention around it since David is this like star athlete, 0:55:38.040 --> 0:55:41.520 so she like gets in the tabloids and stuff like that. 0:55:42.160 --> 0:55:48.640 Cut to the wedding, Ronda is reluctantly there with her mother, Tanya, 0:55:48.760 --> 0:55:53.440 Cheryl and those women are there is Muriel's bridesmaids because 0:55:53.440 --> 0:55:54.960 they kind of came crawling back. 0:55:55.200 --> 0:55:57.600 That made my blood boil. I was so mad at 0:55:57.680 --> 0:56:00.799 Muriel in that moment for because you're like, oh, she 0:56:01.520 --> 0:56:05.360 grow up, she needs to grow up like she does. Yeah, 0:56:05.400 --> 0:56:08.200 she does. Honestly, I was like nice of Ronda to 0:56:08.280 --> 0:56:09.760 even show up. 0:56:10.320 --> 0:56:11.920 She's there quite reluctantly. 0:56:12.760 --> 0:56:15.399 It also feels like Ronda's doing something that like I've 0:56:15.400 --> 0:56:17.279 never done this at a wedding, but I've definitely done 0:56:17.280 --> 0:56:20.920 it at various events, just like showing up to be 0:56:21.040 --> 0:56:23.520 like here I am and how bad does it feel 0:56:23.520 --> 0:56:27.160 to see me right now? Yeah, it feels like Ronda's 0:56:27.160 --> 0:56:29.960 pulling one of those and I respect that totally. 0:56:30.920 --> 0:56:34.840 So they're there. Bryce is there for some reason. 0:56:35.920 --> 0:56:39.000 Again, just like another character that we really only encounter 0:56:39.120 --> 0:56:42.080 once or twice, who is given. I thought like sort 0:56:42.120 --> 0:56:45.319 of this deeper lore by showing up later where it 0:56:45.320 --> 0:56:47.520 seems like he first of all, he's dressed like he's 0:56:47.520 --> 0:56:50.240 going to a funeral, which felt intentional. He's wearing all black, 0:56:51.000 --> 0:56:53.600 and I think it's implied that like he's upset things 0:56:53.640 --> 0:56:56.120 didn't work out between him and Muriel, and like he 0:56:56.200 --> 0:57:03.319 seems really sad that she's getting married to someone else. Yeah, 0:57:03.400 --> 0:57:05.640 which is just a lot of lare. Even though he 0:57:05.680 --> 0:57:07.400 never speaks again, I don't think, No. 0:57:07.440 --> 0:57:09.040 He doesn't. We don't see him on screen. I don't 0:57:09.040 --> 0:57:12.400 think after this either, sometimes I was like, maybe I 0:57:12.440 --> 0:57:15.560 don't really get Australian humor. Is this supposed to be 0:57:16.080 --> 0:57:16.600 a joke? 0:57:16.840 --> 0:57:19.280 I think so. I mean I feel like the whole 0:57:19.520 --> 0:57:23.240 the whole wedding is like a combination of being a joke, 0:57:23.280 --> 0:57:26.919 but it's also like it's I found it genuinely unsettling 0:57:27.240 --> 0:57:30.840 to watch, Like though it is kind of like a 0:57:30.840 --> 0:57:32.960 horror movie in the way it plays out. 0:57:33.440 --> 0:57:36.880 It's yeah, it does kind of remind you of Carrie 0:57:37.480 --> 0:57:39.960 in like the prompt scene where she's like so excited 0:57:40.000 --> 0:57:45.120 to have one prom queen. Meanwhile, maryel is like grinning 0:57:45.200 --> 0:57:49.080 ear to ear. This is like her what she has 0:57:49.120 --> 0:57:51.400 been conditioned to think is supposed to be like, you know, 0:57:51.440 --> 0:57:54.640 the happiest day of her life. And she's so ecstatic 0:57:55.200 --> 0:57:57.560 she's getting married, which is what she's always wanted. And 0:57:57.600 --> 0:58:00.360 it doesn't matter that it's a sham marriage to a 0:58:00.520 --> 0:58:03.440 man who is disgusted by her. She's still like. 0:58:03.640 --> 0:58:07.400 It's it's devastating. And the way, and again it is 0:58:07.440 --> 0:58:10.600 like the way Tony Kleett like manages to straddle how 0:58:11.680 --> 0:58:15.680 tragic that is with how funny she is. We're like 0:58:15.760 --> 0:58:20.919 the huge spile and the like yeah, la like contrasted 0:58:20.960 --> 0:58:23.640 with people looking like they're at a funeral, like it's 0:58:23.760 --> 0:58:27.640 really unsettling and a little bit funny, and it's yeah, 0:58:27.680 --> 0:58:29.720 it is like I feel like the Carrie. That's a 0:58:29.760 --> 0:58:32.240 really good comparison and like somehow even worse than that, 0:58:32.360 --> 0:58:38.760 because we know that Muriel views marriage as a path 0:58:38.920 --> 0:58:44.520 to feeling seen and feeling validated and as a potential 0:58:44.560 --> 0:58:47.800 way to love herself. It's not like she doesn't fully 0:58:47.960 --> 0:58:51.320 understand that the marriage is fake, Like she knows that 0:58:51.520 --> 0:58:54.120 that's not something that she's going to be confronted by later. 0:58:54.280 --> 0:58:56.840 That was like in the text. So it's like she's 0:58:56.840 --> 0:59:03.400 smiling because she's and thinks that she's about to be 0:59:03.480 --> 0:59:06.000 able to love herself for the first time. It has 0:59:06.040 --> 0:59:08.640 like which isn't you know whatever. I mean, they're doing 0:59:08.680 --> 0:59:12.000 a business transaction. I don't really care about David's apartheid 0:59:12.080 --> 0:59:16.080 ass feelings so like, but but it's like she knows 0:59:16.160 --> 0:59:20.280 what's happening and is still so thrilled because of how 0:59:20.320 --> 0:59:23.880 she's been conditioned to view marriage. And it's so like, 0:59:23.920 --> 0:59:26.280 I feel like the moment you see her happiest is 0:59:26.360 --> 0:59:30.720 like I think it's Tanya. They all have very similar 0:59:31.080 --> 0:59:34.400 hair colors. Who looks at Muriel in her wedding dress 0:59:34.440 --> 0:59:38.640 and says like kind of in horror, like Muriel, you're beautiful, 0:59:38.920 --> 0:59:43.000 and she's like glowing at like hearing that from these 0:59:43.000 --> 0:59:47.760 women who have bullied her her entire life. And yeah, 0:59:47.880 --> 0:59:51.240 it's just like she's looking I mean, that's like Muriel's again, 0:59:51.280 --> 0:59:53.880 and it's like, how can you falter for that? I 0:59:53.920 --> 0:59:55.760 think all of us have done this to some extent, 0:59:56.160 --> 0:59:58.800 and everyone has had someone in their life that has 0:59:58.840 --> 1:00:01.760 been a more extreme exam it of like looking for 1:00:01.920 --> 1:00:06.360 validation from the people who are cruelest to them instead 1:00:06.360 --> 1:00:09.720 of focusing on themselves. And then you're just like you 1:00:09.800 --> 1:00:12.400 just want to shake her and be like Ronda's right 1:00:12.480 --> 1:00:15.800 over there, like when you stop talking to these people 1:00:15.840 --> 1:00:19.160 that But that's just I don't know. I just this 1:00:19.240 --> 1:00:20.840 movie is so good because you're like this is just 1:00:20.920 --> 1:00:24.400 like an abusive cycle that Muriel is caught up in, no, 1:00:24.640 --> 1:00:28.640 and like she's seeking out validation and love from people 1:00:28.680 --> 1:00:30.280 who just are not capable of it. 1:00:30.480 --> 1:00:33.800 Yeah, it reminded me of eighth grade because that's the 1:00:34.240 --> 1:00:37.920 journey that the Kayla character goes on throughout the whole movie. 1:00:38.640 --> 1:00:42.120 I was also so devastated because in this wedding scene, 1:00:42.680 --> 1:00:45.920 the one other character besides Ronda, who seems like she 1:00:46.040 --> 1:00:51.040 truly cares for Muriel and her well being. Is Muriel's mom, 1:00:51.560 --> 1:00:54.200 And she shows up at the wedding and she's late, 1:00:54.280 --> 1:00:56.240 but she's there like she had to take a cat 1:00:56.360 --> 1:00:58.920 like all that. Like her father was there to like 1:00:59.000 --> 1:01:01.000 give her away, and he'll so very cruelly. He's like, 1:01:01.160 --> 1:01:03.360 she's yours now, sir, Like. 1:01:03.600 --> 1:01:06.560 Well, and it's also like her her father is there 1:01:06.640 --> 1:01:09.360 because it makes him look good to be there again. 1:01:09.400 --> 1:01:11.640 It's like everything with him is selfish. 1:01:11.720 --> 1:01:16.760 It's about image, yeah, yeah, elevating his image. Her mom comes, 1:01:16.920 --> 1:01:20.840 she's alone, she's brought this gift that she's clearly intending 1:01:20.880 --> 1:01:24.560 to give to Mariel. Mariel completely like breezes past her 1:01:24.800 --> 1:01:26.600 and ignores her own mother, and. 1:01:26.720 --> 1:01:29.520 She starts crying and she starts crying, Oh my god. 1:01:29.920 --> 1:01:32.800 And then things just only get sadder from there with 1:01:32.920 --> 1:01:37.000 her mother. But I was just like, oh, like, Mariel, 1:01:37.080 --> 1:01:40.439 the people who love you, they are there for you, 1:01:40.520 --> 1:01:45.280 and you're like blowing them off, and it's so so sad. 1:01:45.320 --> 1:01:46.160 She needs to grow up. 1:01:46.320 --> 1:01:48.520 It's really sad. Yeah, And I'm also like she's like 1:01:48.680 --> 1:01:52.680 twenty two, like it's but but it. Yeah, the stuff 1:01:52.680 --> 1:01:56.520 with her mom again, it's I it's so it felt 1:01:56.720 --> 1:01:59.640 very I'm trying to think of a less corny way 1:01:59.800 --> 1:02:05.000 to say subversive, but let's just say it. But the 1:02:05.040 --> 1:02:08.520 way that the family is introduced at the beginning, at least, 1:02:08.520 --> 1:02:13.160 like I was not expecting to get so much depth 1:02:13.640 --> 1:02:16.920 in those characters, Like I'm so used to seeing like 1:02:17.400 --> 1:02:19.880 this is the family that she wants to get away from, 1:02:20.040 --> 1:02:25.240 and wouldn't you they suck, you know, And as time 1:02:25.400 --> 1:02:28.240 goes on, it's like, I mean, at least the way 1:02:28.280 --> 1:02:31.080 that Bill sucks is relentless, but it is so much 1:02:31.120 --> 1:02:35.280 more complicated and specific than you're you know, led to believe. 1:02:35.680 --> 1:02:41.200 And and the ways that her mother is just like ignored, 1:02:41.520 --> 1:02:45.680 the dynamic among the siblings, like it's not you know, 1:02:45.920 --> 1:02:49.560 like Dostoyevsky, but but there's a lot of depth to 1:02:50.160 --> 1:02:54.720 the way that this family processes having to know each other. 1:02:55.440 --> 1:02:56.000 I agree. 1:02:56.200 --> 1:03:02.120 Yeah, it's so many movies of a similar ilk or 1:03:02.160 --> 1:03:04.440 that would be sort of like maybe lumped in with 1:03:04.520 --> 1:03:08.640 this movie because wedding is in the title, have such 1:03:09.080 --> 1:03:15.240 tropy stock characters as far as like I mean, the 1:03:15.320 --> 1:03:19.520 leads also, but especially the like, you know, the family, 1:03:19.600 --> 1:03:22.280 you know, the mom and the dad, or the siblings 1:03:22.440 --> 1:03:26.440 or the best friends. And this movie takes time to 1:03:26.840 --> 1:03:31.240 show you how all of these characters are. They feel 1:03:31.240 --> 1:03:37.280 like real people. They aren't these tropy stock characters. They 1:03:37.360 --> 1:03:40.360 have layers, there's layers to them. 1:03:41.480 --> 1:03:47.280 It's shreky in it. Sure it's stree, but they're But 1:03:47.280 --> 1:03:50.160 but it's also because I mean, and I know the 1:03:50.160 --> 1:03:53.440 movie so it's over. But the like, I have complicated 1:03:53.440 --> 1:03:56.880 feelings towards the way that the Cruel Friends are portrayed, 1:03:57.760 --> 1:04:00.680 because they are sort of made out to be, you know, 1:04:00.800 --> 1:04:05.080 like sort of the brain dead bimbo stereotype. Right. But 1:04:05.800 --> 1:04:08.680 the reason I'm inclined to give this at least some 1:04:08.720 --> 1:04:13.440 of a pass is because of the like stock characters 1:04:13.440 --> 1:04:16.680 we're talking about, where, you know, the Cruel Friends are 1:04:17.120 --> 1:04:22.480 usually the protagonists in these movies, and Muriel is a 1:04:22.520 --> 1:04:27.920 side character. Someone with a disability is fully a side 1:04:27.960 --> 1:04:30.680 character that you don't get any insight into their inner life. 1:04:31.480 --> 1:04:35.760 Muriel's family they're like, you wouldn't know a thing about them. 1:04:35.840 --> 1:04:37.960 So it's weirdly like the people that you're used to 1:04:38.080 --> 1:04:42.760 seeing as protagonists, even like Bryce kind of disappearing when 1:04:42.760 --> 1:04:45.680 he seemed to be introduced as like, here's the love interest, 1:04:46.280 --> 1:04:50.680 just kidding, like he'll show up onths later. It just 1:04:50.720 --> 1:04:52.960 feels like, yeah, you're meeting these stock characters and then 1:04:53.000 --> 1:04:56.760 seeing them either deepened or written off in a way 1:04:56.800 --> 1:05:00.760 that they usually wouldn't be, and it's hard to be 1:05:01.040 --> 1:05:01.760 mad at it. 1:05:01.760 --> 1:05:06.840 It's interesting. Yeah, so uh, let's see what happens next. 1:05:07.200 --> 1:05:13.560 The wedding happens afterward, Ronda confronts Muriel for being a phony, 1:05:14.520 --> 1:05:19.040 because Muriel's like, my girlfriends who dumped me, they came 1:05:19.120 --> 1:05:21.520 crawling back because I'm famous. 1:05:21.680 --> 1:05:24.480 My bullies are literally obsessed with me. I was like, 1:05:25.280 --> 1:05:25.720 come on. 1:05:27.120 --> 1:05:32.480 Right, And Ronda's like, okay, well that is not impressive 1:05:32.600 --> 1:05:35.480 number one number two, I have to move back to 1:05:35.560 --> 1:05:40.600 Porpoise spit because you abandoned me. And she says, ooh, 1:05:40.600 --> 1:05:44.320 this is my favorite line. She says, maryel van Arkle 1:05:44.520 --> 1:05:48.000 is not half the person that Muriel heslop was. 1:05:48.920 --> 1:05:55.080 So true, so true. I just yeah, it's it's great. 1:05:55.400 --> 1:05:58.560 And then the fact that Ronda is then doomed to 1:05:58.720 --> 1:06:03.080 also hang out this bummer group of girls. I'm just like, 1:06:03.200 --> 1:06:05.520 oh my god, I was using why she goes along 1:06:05.560 --> 1:06:08.120 with that I would sooner be alone. I'm assuming that 1:06:08.200 --> 1:06:11.760 it's like it seems like when we see them together later, 1:06:11.840 --> 1:06:14.840 it seems like Ronda's mom invited them over. I think 1:06:14.880 --> 1:06:18.000 they're at Ronda's place. Yeah, because her so I think Ronda, 1:06:18.320 --> 1:06:21.960 like Ronda's mom was trying to like force Ronda to 1:06:22.040 --> 1:06:24.880 socialize with people she didn't like. 1:06:25.280 --> 1:06:29.680 Right because earlier, earlier in the movie, Ronda says, I'd 1:06:29.760 --> 1:06:32.200 rather swallow rite of blades than have drinks with the 1:06:32.240 --> 1:06:32.960 lux of you. 1:06:33.480 --> 1:06:37.200 And you're like, and the way the things end with them, 1:06:37.640 --> 1:06:39.040 well we have let's just get to the end of 1:06:39.080 --> 1:06:39.440 the movie. 1:06:39.560 --> 1:06:43.720 Yeah, okay, So Ronda calls Muriel out back in Porpoise 1:06:43.760 --> 1:06:49.120 spit Betty, Mariel's mom accidentally takes some shoes from a 1:06:49.240 --> 1:06:52.320 store without paying for them, and the same woman. 1:06:52.280 --> 1:06:56.560 Because her feet, her feet her mm hmm. 1:06:56.560 --> 1:06:58.960 And she paid for everything else. It just seems like 1:06:59.000 --> 1:07:01.480 she forgot to pay for and she has so much 1:07:01.520 --> 1:07:04.520 on her mind. Her family hates her and they're cruel 1:07:04.560 --> 1:07:04.840 to her. 1:07:05.000 --> 1:07:07.240 And it was also like and now that she's been 1:07:07.240 --> 1:07:11.960 abandoned by her husband, like she's never been more alone 1:07:12.040 --> 1:07:14.760 in taking care of the family, because she was like 1:07:15.200 --> 1:07:20.720 asking for basic help from her adult children and husband 1:07:21.560 --> 1:07:25.320 when things were quote unquote normal and everyone was saying no. 1:07:25.480 --> 1:07:28.560 So now it's like her work has been compounded even 1:07:28.600 --> 1:07:32.680 worse and everyone is still ignoring her. Who wouldn't shoplift 1:07:32.760 --> 1:07:34.360 under these circumstances. 1:07:34.640 --> 1:07:38.680 True, but she gets in trouble because the same woman 1:07:38.800 --> 1:07:43.080 who got Muriel arrested for stealing the dress. She narks 1:07:43.120 --> 1:07:44.000 on Betty. 1:07:44.040 --> 1:07:47.600 What a callback wild who thought we would see Diane again? 1:07:48.120 --> 1:07:51.720 Wasn't expecting her to make a return. But this is 1:07:51.760 --> 1:07:55.439 when Bill tells Betty that he wants a divorce. He's 1:07:55.440 --> 1:07:56.760 like leaving her once and for all. 1:07:57.120 --> 1:07:59.200 After he does the thing that he does, the fucking 1:07:59.280 --> 1:08:03.280 everybody and basically sweet talks Betty out of like having 1:08:03.320 --> 1:08:06.840 to serve any time because he's like, oh, I you know, 1:08:07.600 --> 1:08:11.080 all cops are my friends, which is like a red flag, right, 1:08:11.120 --> 1:08:17.160 But he's super nice to protect ostensibly to protect Betty, 1:08:17.280 --> 1:08:21.000 but it's just to protect his reputation absolutely, because he 1:08:21.160 --> 1:08:25.759 immediately becomes extremely cruel to her this and it's also, oh, 1:08:25.840 --> 1:08:28.920 it just made me so I hate him so much. 1:08:29.040 --> 1:08:32.360 Like the when they're on the way back and she 1:08:32.400 --> 1:08:35.000 was like, I meant to pay for it and like, 1:08:35.200 --> 1:08:38.360 I'm so tired, I really just need some help. And 1:08:38.360 --> 1:08:41.360 then he just turns the radio on and starts ignoring her, 1:08:41.880 --> 1:08:46.400 and I'm just like, why won't your head explode? 1:08:46.960 --> 1:08:50.679 Like it's tell me about it, nightmare. And then he 1:08:50.800 --> 1:08:53.800 tells her he's like divorcing her, and then he says 1:08:53.960 --> 1:08:56.920 the reason he wasn't elected to state government when he 1:08:57.040 --> 1:09:00.960 ran previously was because his family was such an embarrassment. 1:09:01.439 --> 1:09:03.280 I really thought for a second, because at this point, 1:09:03.280 --> 1:09:06.400 I'm like, this anything could happen in this movie. I 1:09:06.479 --> 1:09:09.400 was sort of hoping that she was gonna like shoot him, 1:09:09.520 --> 1:09:12.240 kill him. I sort of thought for a second, I 1:09:12.280 --> 1:09:15.840 was like, I wouldn't be mad if she simply shot him. 1:09:15.880 --> 1:09:18.679 I would wove for her to do that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 1:09:18.720 --> 1:09:23.760 But instead she's devastated. She lashes out at her son 1:09:24.000 --> 1:09:27.840 for not mowing the lawn. I think, or yeah, he's 1:09:27.920 --> 1:09:30.040 right there, and like this is the first moment we 1:09:30.080 --> 1:09:36.280 see her kind of breakdown, and then Betty dies A 1:09:36.320 --> 1:09:40.479 short time later. Maryel is told that it was a 1:09:40.560 --> 1:09:45.240 heart attack, but we find out that Betty died by suicide. 1:09:45.200 --> 1:09:48.920 And that this and this again just like such a 1:09:49.080 --> 1:09:51.720 fucking twist of the knife because we find this out 1:09:51.800 --> 1:09:57.200 from a character who Joni, Muriel's sister, who were introduced 1:09:57.240 --> 1:10:02.000 to in this very like one liner jokey way, because 1:10:02.080 --> 1:10:06.280 every time we heard from Joni, she's like your terrible Mariel, 1:10:07.240 --> 1:10:12.240 like that's her like catch phrase, and she's like the 1:10:12.439 --> 1:10:16.320 younger sister I think, who always is like, haha, you're 1:10:16.320 --> 1:10:18.840 in trouble. And that's kind of the only thing we've 1:10:18.880 --> 1:10:22.800 known about her other than she rips SIGs hanging out 1:10:22.840 --> 1:10:24.639 on the couch. That's what we know about this character. 1:10:25.080 --> 1:10:28.559 But then you get like this moment of incredible depth 1:10:28.840 --> 1:10:30.519 into this character in a way that you just like 1:10:30.560 --> 1:10:35.960 aren't expecting. Where Joni found her mother's body, Yeah, was 1:10:36.040 --> 1:10:39.200 able to glean that it had been a fatal pill 1:10:39.200 --> 1:10:44.559 overdose and that the doctor had covered this up at 1:10:44.560 --> 1:10:48.679 the father's request because quote unquote he's been through enough, 1:10:49.280 --> 1:10:52.920 and so the fact that it was still like this 1:10:53.000 --> 1:10:56.519 poor woman's like final cry for help was not going 1:10:56.520 --> 1:11:00.599 to be heard because of the person who is abusive 1:11:00.600 --> 1:11:03.559 and horrible to her, like it's just uh, and then 1:11:03.600 --> 1:11:05.880 the way he acts at the funeral, it's just like 1:11:05.960 --> 1:11:10.400 But anyways, that that moment with Joanie is like really perfect. 1:11:10.439 --> 1:11:12.839 I mean, she's like the it seems like the brothers 1:11:12.840 --> 1:11:16.559 are kind of in shock. Weirdly, the youngest daughter seems 1:11:16.600 --> 1:11:19.160 like she's inviting her crushes to the funeral question of Mark. 1:11:19.280 --> 1:11:19.960 That was weird. 1:11:20.160 --> 1:11:23.760 I couldn't I forgot she was one of the siblings 1:11:23.760 --> 1:11:26.080 half the time, because I think we don't see her 1:11:26.120 --> 1:11:28.240 in some of like the dinner scenes or something, or 1:11:28.360 --> 1:11:29.559 she's like focus. 1:11:30.000 --> 1:11:33.920 Everyone processes death differently whatever, But like, but just seeing 1:11:34.000 --> 1:11:35.720 Jonie in that moment, be like what am I going 1:11:35.760 --> 1:11:39.000 to do without her? And realize like, oh, yeah, they 1:11:39.000 --> 1:11:42.800 were extremely close and like almost every time you see Joni, 1:11:42.920 --> 1:11:47.120 she's with her mom, and and that before the movie's over. 1:11:47.840 --> 1:11:50.880 In a way that it is also kind of made 1:11:50.960 --> 1:11:55.360 me feel sad, was that you could already see sort 1:11:55.400 --> 1:11:58.880 of the beginning stages of Jonie beginning to fill the 1:11:58.960 --> 1:12:01.519 role that her mother filled in her in her dad's 1:12:01.560 --> 1:12:05.280 life of like, you know, then she like hollers down 1:12:05.320 --> 1:12:08.400 to him from the balcony and is like, games on, 1:12:08.479 --> 1:12:10.160 want me to get you a beer? And it's like 1:12:10.200 --> 1:12:12.680 the daughter sort of filling this servile role that the 1:12:12.760 --> 1:12:16.519 mom filled and to someone who just like couldn't deserve 1:12:17.520 --> 1:12:19.480 love less. 1:12:21.360 --> 1:12:23.080 It's just got I know this. 1:12:22.800 --> 1:12:26.639 This movie is about breaking out of the cycle of abuse. 1:12:27.360 --> 1:12:33.280 I know. And then you mentioned so. The funeral is 1:12:33.320 --> 1:12:37.160 the next scene, and we see that Bill piece of 1:12:37.160 --> 1:12:40.519 shit that he is, is more concerned about how the 1:12:40.600 --> 1:12:41.840 press perceive him. 1:12:42.080 --> 1:12:44.559 It's clear he like called the press to be like, 1:12:44.760 --> 1:12:48.040 you're gonna want to come to my what my wife's funeral? 1:12:48.040 --> 1:12:53.160 Wife's funeral? And he doesn't seem to be grieving at all, 1:12:53.520 --> 1:12:58.720 or it's just he's so horrible. And this is the 1:12:58.800 --> 1:13:02.400 moment that Mauriel realizes not only what a prick her 1:13:02.479 --> 1:13:06.240 dad is, but that she is similar to him in 1:13:06.280 --> 1:13:08.639 the sense that she cares too much about what other 1:13:08.640 --> 1:13:12.080 people think of her. She has lied to people and 1:13:12.160 --> 1:13:16.559 sabotaged meaningful relationships along the way, and she doesn't want 1:13:16.560 --> 1:13:20.360 to be like that anymore. She breaks down her husband, 1:13:20.600 --> 1:13:22.280 David Van Arkle. 1:13:22.120 --> 1:13:24.800 Who again like this is a a It seems like 1:13:24.840 --> 1:13:27.240 another movie is about to start, and then it does 1:13:27.280 --> 1:13:31.200 it and you're like, yay, but I was like, oh, 1:13:31.280 --> 1:13:34.240 he came what he came to the funeral? 1:13:34.560 --> 1:13:37.599 He consults her, this is the first time he's been 1:13:37.720 --> 1:13:41.960 any manner of like tender toward her, which feels kind of. 1:13:41.960 --> 1:13:44.720 Like a payoff of one of the few interactions we've 1:13:44.760 --> 1:13:50.479 seen with them before, another very depressing movie, very depressing 1:13:50.520 --> 1:13:52.680 scene in a movie that's full of them. But when 1:13:52.720 --> 1:13:56.000 they get back to his like fancy apartment after their 1:13:56.040 --> 1:14:00.920 wedding and you know, all the pretenses are dropped and 1:14:00.960 --> 1:14:04.400 he's like, all right, there's your room. I'm gonna go swim, 1:14:04.800 --> 1:14:08.960 and like can kind of feel how meaningful the wedding 1:14:09.080 --> 1:14:12.160 was to Muriel and asks her like who the hell 1:14:12.200 --> 1:14:15.240 marries someone? Like why would you marry someone who's a stranger? 1:14:15.320 --> 1:14:18.920 And she's like, well, you dude just said that and 1:14:18.960 --> 1:14:20.680 he's like, well, it's because I want to win, and 1:14:20.720 --> 1:14:23.280 she's like so do I, and like they're talking about 1:14:23.280 --> 1:14:27.879 totally different things, but you see that that like affects 1:14:27.960 --> 1:14:29.960 him in some way. But you're like, I don't know 1:14:30.000 --> 1:14:32.240 if that's but it clearly it does come back because 1:14:33.160 --> 1:14:37.719 whatever thought this you know, fucking goof is capable of having, 1:14:38.120 --> 1:14:41.680 at least it was like, oh, I was viewing this 1:14:41.760 --> 1:14:45.680 person as a warm body and it turns out that 1:14:45.680 --> 1:14:50.800 they're a fucking person, which is a very low bar 1:14:50.880 --> 1:14:52.120 to clear, but many. 1:14:51.920 --> 1:14:56.320 Do not clear it this is true, but yeah, he 1:14:56.840 --> 1:15:01.880 consoles her as she's crying. They kiss, and I think 1:15:01.880 --> 1:15:05.200 it is implied that they have sex. Yeah, but the 1:15:05.200 --> 1:15:09.919 next morning she's like, I'm leaving. We have to break up, goodbye, 1:15:10.640 --> 1:15:14.400 And then her dad is like, Muriel, I need you 1:15:14.479 --> 1:15:18.599 to stay and help me raise the kids. Even though 1:15:18.800 --> 1:15:21.000 like how old are these kids? It seems like there's 1:15:21.120 --> 1:15:22.639 maybe one under eighteen? 1:15:23.200 --> 1:15:24.519 Yeah, I thought so too. 1:15:24.640 --> 1:15:29.080 They're like the youngest daughter is she's like a teenager, 1:15:29.200 --> 1:15:31.719 a teenager, but yeah, the rest of them seem pretty 1:15:31.760 --> 1:15:35.160 close to, if not in fully adulthood. 1:15:35.439 --> 1:15:39.800 Yes, we also learn that in the sort of towards 1:15:39.880 --> 1:15:44.800 the end of Muriel's mother's life that she burned the 1:15:44.920 --> 1:15:48.040 lawn because she was so frustrated that she wasn't able 1:15:48.120 --> 1:15:51.280 to get help with it. It just seemed like there was 1:15:51.320 --> 1:15:58.200 a lot of struggling that Muriel at very least didn't see, 1:15:59.439 --> 1:16:01.400 and I think to some extent with the kids without 1:16:01.760 --> 1:16:03.840 putting the blak because it is like pretty squarely on 1:16:03.880 --> 1:16:10.360 the father, but like a struggle that they weren't comfortable seeing, right. 1:16:10.400 --> 1:16:14.240 I think it's probably a combination of her mom was 1:16:14.360 --> 1:16:22.280 like good at hiding her various problems, and also that 1:16:22.600 --> 1:16:27.840 Muriel and her siblings were wilfully ignoring any signs that 1:16:27.880 --> 1:16:30.640 their mother was struggling because they didn't want to be 1:16:30.680 --> 1:16:34.000 bothered with it, or they were too focused on themselves 1:16:34.200 --> 1:16:37.080 or whatever else along those lines. 1:16:37.600 --> 1:16:39.800 And I think that there is this I want to 1:16:39.960 --> 1:16:42.160 be very careful with the way that I phrase this, 1:16:42.360 --> 1:16:45.880 but it's a dynamic that is familiar to me, not 1:16:45.920 --> 1:16:50.880 in like my specific family dynamic, but whatever I've seen 1:16:50.920 --> 1:16:59.720 it of kids perceiving specifically mothers, usually as weak and 1:17:00.479 --> 1:17:06.200 as targets of mockery in a lot of cases, and like, 1:17:06.320 --> 1:17:08.519 I don't want to be like her kind of thing 1:17:08.600 --> 1:17:14.479 without you know, considering how she got there, And yeah, 1:17:14.520 --> 1:17:17.519 like that, it just feels like a very specific dynamic 1:17:17.560 --> 1:17:21.960 that I haven't really seen a lot in movies. And 1:17:22.120 --> 1:17:26.040 also that like to some extent that Betty was didn't 1:17:26.080 --> 1:17:30.040 want her kids see her struggle because she doesn't want 1:17:30.080 --> 1:17:32.640 to worry her kids, and like we see that in 1:17:32.800 --> 1:17:37.200 scenes where you know, she's again very willfully ignoring the 1:17:37.200 --> 1:17:40.800 fact that Muriel has obviously stolen this money, and it's like, 1:17:41.080 --> 1:17:43.200 maybe it was a mistake, maybe it was my fault. 1:17:43.400 --> 1:17:46.559 I don't know anything's possible. And Muriel's honest, and she 1:17:46.560 --> 1:17:49.200 still doesn't want to quite want to hear it. She 1:17:49.439 --> 1:17:52.200 doesn't want to quite tell her kids why, like but 1:17:52.320 --> 1:17:55.280 only that's another reason where when you get that information 1:17:55.360 --> 1:17:59.760 later that Jonie was the one to find that she 1:18:00.360 --> 1:18:03.200 died by suicide, and that Jonie seems to be the 1:18:03.240 --> 1:18:07.160 only sibling who knows why their dad is gone, it's like, oh, 1:18:07.240 --> 1:18:10.680 these two characters had it, Like Jonie was her confidant, 1:18:11.479 --> 1:18:14.439 because Janie is the one that calls Muriel and it's like, yeah, 1:18:14.560 --> 1:18:18.599 Dad like left her. But then when confronted about it, 1:18:18.600 --> 1:18:21.960 Betty is like, oh no, don't worry about it. Oh 1:18:22.200 --> 1:18:26.439 I've got to go. We're getting raided by the government. Yeah, 1:18:26.520 --> 1:18:31.479 you're just like cut o. God, Like, I just hope 1:18:31.479 --> 1:18:34.840 in her next life, this this fictional character caught a 1:18:34.880 --> 1:18:39.360 fucking break, Like it just is so But yeah, I 1:18:39.400 --> 1:18:42.840 don't know, like it it's so tragic what happens to her. 1:18:42.960 --> 1:18:45.120 But I don't know. I mean, I thought that the 1:18:45.200 --> 1:18:49.080 movie showed a lot of care and thought towards her 1:18:49.160 --> 1:18:51.639 in a way that I wasn't used to in this genre. 1:18:52.600 --> 1:18:58.400 Totally I agree, and I was I mean the moments 1:18:58.439 --> 1:19:00.760 that were the most gut right and chinked to me. 1:19:01.320 --> 1:19:08.000 We're surrounding the Betty character because she's just so abused 1:19:08.120 --> 1:19:13.720 and neglected by her husband, by her children. She's just 1:19:14.200 --> 1:19:16.840 seems to be kind of waiting on people hand and foot, 1:19:17.240 --> 1:19:20.559 and no one is grateful, and no one checks in 1:19:20.600 --> 1:19:23.160 with her, and no one cares about how she feels 1:19:23.360 --> 1:19:26.720 and life it seems like except for Jonie right right. 1:19:27.200 --> 1:19:31.760 And Muriel is again too busy wrapped up in her 1:19:31.960 --> 1:19:36.840 own image and getting married to whoever will marry her 1:19:37.280 --> 1:19:39.599 to notice all the things that's going on with her mother, 1:19:39.680 --> 1:19:42.400 and it's just, oh, it's devastating. 1:19:42.760 --> 1:19:43.080 Yeah. 1:19:43.120 --> 1:19:47.040 But so there's this moment where her dad, Bill is like, 1:19:47.600 --> 1:19:49.280 you have to stay and help me raise the kids, 1:19:49.360 --> 1:19:52.840 and Muriel's like, no, I don't, that's actually your job 1:19:52.880 --> 1:19:56.599 as a parent. So goodbye, and she leaves. She goes 1:19:56.640 --> 1:20:00.599 to Ronda's house, who, like we mentioned before, is hanging 1:20:00.600 --> 1:20:02.160 out with Tanya. 1:20:02.280 --> 1:20:05.559 She's basically been kidnapped like her I think her mom 1:20:05.640 --> 1:20:08.040 is like forcing her to hang out with these assholes. 1:20:08.600 --> 1:20:13.040 Yes, And Mariel comes in and she asks Ronda to 1:20:13.200 --> 1:20:17.320 move back to Sydney with her, and Ronda, who is 1:20:17.520 --> 1:20:23.920 still upset with Muriel, is like whoelm okay, I forgive you. 1:20:24.080 --> 1:20:27.479 Let's go, and they get in a cab and the 1:20:27.520 --> 1:20:30.400 movie ends with the two of them yelling out the 1:20:30.439 --> 1:20:34.040 car windows saying like goodbye to the streets and the 1:20:34.080 --> 1:20:42.040 malls and the beaches of Porpoise. Spit and so let's 1:20:42.040 --> 1:20:56.839 take another quick break and we'll come back to discuss further, and. 1:20:56.840 --> 1:21:01.559 We're back will I've already talked about a lot of 1:21:01.600 --> 1:21:05.720 elements of the movie in the abstract that was By 1:21:05.760 --> 1:21:08.920 the way, kudos on the recap. That was not an 1:21:08.960 --> 1:21:10.080 easy recap. 1:21:10.000 --> 1:21:12.880 No, it wasn't. I tried to make it as like 1:21:13.200 --> 1:21:16.439 concise as possible, but again, just so much happens. There's 1:21:16.479 --> 1:21:20.599 so many tonal and narrative shifts throughout this movie that 1:21:22.000 --> 1:21:24.760 it was difficult. But I did my best. You did 1:21:24.760 --> 1:21:26.760 a wonderful jop, Oh, thank you saving much. 1:21:26.840 --> 1:21:30.479 There is one thing I just wanted to add to 1:21:30.520 --> 1:21:33.280 the tale end. I guess that could get a conversation 1:21:33.360 --> 1:21:39.559 started or not whatever. But with her dad towards the 1:21:39.760 --> 1:21:41.360 end of the movie, I think the last scene he 1:21:41.400 --> 1:21:45.400 appears in where like you said, like he's like Muriel, 1:21:46.720 --> 1:21:49.120 You're gonna have to raise your adult siblings for me, 1:21:49.320 --> 1:21:52.280 And she's like, no, I don't think so, pretty sure 1:21:52.280 --> 1:21:54.639 that you should have been doing that for twenty something 1:21:54.720 --> 1:21:58.040 years at this point. Yeah, but that her dad. I 1:21:58.040 --> 1:21:59.760 don't even know how to feel about it, because he 1:21:59.840 --> 1:22:02.680 is like, it seems like he has a moment of 1:22:02.720 --> 1:22:06.280 self awareness that I didn't think he was capable of having. 1:22:06.400 --> 1:22:09.200 So I was a little bumped by it. It sort 1:22:09.240 --> 1:22:11.040 of felt like it was like trying to knit a 1:22:11.080 --> 1:22:14.040 bow on it where he it seems like the person 1:22:14.080 --> 1:22:16.720 that we've spent time with this whole time would be like, well, 1:22:16.720 --> 1:22:22.559 go fuck yourself, goodbye forever, like be cruel. But the Yeah, 1:22:22.640 --> 1:22:24.960 so this was a little schmalzy for me, But I 1:22:25.000 --> 1:22:28.760 did think it was an interesting choice that he kind 1:22:28.800 --> 1:22:34.720 of has this moment of lucidity and is like, you 1:22:34.800 --> 1:22:38.599 reap what you sew. It is basically admitting like everyone 1:22:38.720 --> 1:22:42.560 is leaving me because I have been nothing but selfish 1:22:42.840 --> 1:22:46.599 and which again just like really packs a gut punch 1:22:46.840 --> 1:22:50.840 for when Jonie calls down to him a character who 1:22:50.880 --> 1:22:54.200 he is also abused and lambasted as much as he 1:22:54.280 --> 1:22:57.720 has to anyone else in the family and she's like, 1:22:57.840 --> 1:22:59.680 what can I get for you? And you know, it 1:22:59.800 --> 1:23:04.040 just seems like she's mimicking the behavior that she saw 1:23:04.040 --> 1:23:06.840 in her mom of you know, like taking care of 1:23:07.080 --> 1:23:10.280 people even when they're horrible to you. And I don't know, 1:23:10.360 --> 1:23:13.640 I mean again, it's it's a very sad note to 1:23:13.760 --> 1:23:16.599 leave things on but his I don't know, she can 1:23:16.600 --> 1:23:20.280 we can we talk a little bit more about her mom? Yeah, 1:23:20.720 --> 1:23:22.519 just because I mean so much of the movie, the 1:23:22.640 --> 1:23:26.639 end of it becomes about her mom. Where we were 1:23:26.640 --> 1:23:29.760 getting at this in the recap where it's such a 1:23:29.760 --> 1:23:33.040 complicated thing because it's it's very clear that like Betty 1:23:33.320 --> 1:23:37.479 is so struggling with depression and it seems like she 1:23:37.840 --> 1:23:41.400 uses denial as a tool to get through the day basically, 1:23:42.080 --> 1:23:44.080 and then the reference that she had been taking sleeping 1:23:44.120 --> 1:23:46.559 pills for a while, which is also like possibly a 1:23:46.560 --> 1:23:50.920 self medication technique, Like you know, that her life was 1:23:50.960 --> 1:23:53.920 not easy and she'd been conditioned to believe that no 1:23:53.960 --> 1:23:57.160 one was ever going to care about it. But that also, 1:23:57.200 --> 1:23:59.400 I mean that it's a tricky and I guess I'll 1:23:59.439 --> 1:24:01.840 just like leave it this because I don't know how 1:24:01.880 --> 1:24:06.519 to properly have this conversation really but how her being 1:24:06.560 --> 1:24:10.880 put in this horrible position by her abusive husband also 1:24:11.000 --> 1:24:14.600 means that her self medicating and you know, sort of 1:24:14.640 --> 1:24:18.880 willfully passively allowing him to continue his reign of terror 1:24:19.320 --> 1:24:24.360 has negative effect on her kids. And it's tricky because 1:24:24.360 --> 1:24:28.120 I don't want to victim blame her, But in parental 1:24:28.160 --> 1:24:32.280 situations like that, especially, it's so hard to talk about 1:24:32.320 --> 1:24:36.760 because there's like a wounded part of me that's like, well, 1:24:36.800 --> 1:24:39.719 isn't she kind of enabling this abuse towards her children 1:24:39.840 --> 1:24:42.960 by never calling it out when it's happening right in 1:24:42.960 --> 1:24:46.800 front of her, which of course is an offshoot of 1:24:47.160 --> 1:24:51.600 her being abused and probably fear of retaliation from her 1:24:51.680 --> 1:24:54.400 husband and all of these horrible things. But in the 1:24:54.439 --> 1:24:57.439 same way, it's I mean, it's just a very sad 1:24:57.560 --> 1:25:01.479 situation to see because it's like he, you know, the father, 1:25:01.600 --> 1:25:05.640 is laying into any of his kids at any given opportunity, 1:25:05.640 --> 1:25:09.360 and she's very often right there and kind of pretends 1:25:09.360 --> 1:25:15.559 it doesn't isn't happening, or will say something behind his back, 1:25:15.640 --> 1:25:18.320 but not to It's just it's just really sad to 1:25:18.360 --> 1:25:22.240 take a family that's like so thoroughly abused, especially by 1:25:22.280 --> 1:25:26.320 someone as narcissistic as Bill, who will turn on the 1:25:26.400 --> 1:25:30.920 charm anytime someone who isn't his family is in the room. 1:25:31.960 --> 1:25:36.519 And I think, I mean, it's effective because it's so 1:25:37.479 --> 1:25:42.679 emblematic of real dynamics. I think, like we're so used 1:25:42.720 --> 1:25:49.559 to watching Hollywood movies that often like sugarcoat these things 1:25:49.840 --> 1:25:54.200 or ignore them, or if there is an abusive family dynamic, 1:25:54.360 --> 1:25:59.880 it's portrayed in this trophy way or like jokey or 1:26:00.080 --> 1:26:05.559 cartoonish way or something. And this being like an indie 1:26:05.600 --> 1:26:11.840 Australian movie, we were like, oh, this actually resembles authentic 1:26:12.320 --> 1:26:15.800 human dynamics. Obviously not all of them, but like, this 1:26:15.920 --> 1:26:20.519 is this is a familiar dynamic that I've observed in 1:26:21.320 --> 1:26:25.160 other people. I mean, there are It's not a one 1:26:25.160 --> 1:26:28.040 for one, but I've I kind of saw a little 1:26:28.040 --> 1:26:30.520 bit of my family in. 1:26:30.040 --> 1:26:32.720 Sure Likewise, likewise. 1:26:32.360 --> 1:26:36.240 Where like my dad is a narcissist, he was not 1:26:36.520 --> 1:26:42.160 outwardly cruel to my siblings and I, but he was 1:26:42.200 --> 1:26:47.840 certainly like emotionally negligent. And then like my mom would 1:26:47.880 --> 1:26:50.439 try to challenge it sometimes, but usually it was easier 1:26:50.439 --> 1:26:54.439 for her to just kind of like power through and 1:26:55.120 --> 1:26:57.280 do the best buy her kids as she could. And 1:26:58.360 --> 1:27:00.280 I feel like we weren't always as great well as 1:27:00.320 --> 1:27:02.719 we should have been for our mom's attempts at keeping 1:27:02.760 --> 1:27:06.000 things stable in the household, and we didn't do a 1:27:06.040 --> 1:27:09.519 great job of considering how she might be feeling and 1:27:09.600 --> 1:27:12.720 stuff like that. Yeah, so I was like, oh, this, 1:27:12.920 --> 1:27:17.360 there's some familiar stuff. I've experienced variations of this in 1:27:17.400 --> 1:27:17.960 my own life. 1:27:18.439 --> 1:27:22.360 Yeah. Yeah, it reminds me a lot of an aunt 1:27:22.400 --> 1:27:24.439 and uncle that like, yeah, I spent a lot of 1:27:24.439 --> 1:27:28.800 time where it's just and how it is portrayed as like, 1:27:30.280 --> 1:27:32.160 you know, on a long enough timeline, this is just 1:27:32.760 --> 1:27:35.920 normal for them, Like, oh, yeah, this is just how, 1:27:35.960 --> 1:27:38.760 And I think it is. The movie doesn't bash you 1:27:38.800 --> 1:27:41.680 over the head with it, but that Muriel is just 1:27:42.120 --> 1:27:45.960 any time she's nearer her father until the very end 1:27:46.000 --> 1:27:48.720 when he realizes that, you know, he has no more 1:27:48.760 --> 1:27:51.680 power to exert over her. She's not going to go 1:27:51.800 --> 1:27:54.040 back because she's concerned about her mom. Because her mom 1:27:54.120 --> 1:27:58.840 isn't there, she is no longer financially obligated, Like she's 1:27:59.240 --> 1:28:02.040 extracted herself from this cycle of abuse that her family's 1:28:02.080 --> 1:28:04.840 caught in. I think it's sad and realistic that the 1:28:04.880 --> 1:28:07.920 whole family is not liberated from it, at least not 1:28:08.000 --> 1:28:12.080 right away. But anyways, towards the beginning where he calls 1:28:12.120 --> 1:28:14.800 her lazy, he points out, like I spent all this 1:28:14.960 --> 1:28:17.400 money on her and she can't even type, and she's like, yes, 1:28:17.439 --> 1:28:21.360 I can, and he's like, no, you can't. He body 1:28:21.400 --> 1:28:24.640 shames her, like, and it seems like her response to 1:28:24.720 --> 1:28:28.160 that is just like she's tremendously depressed the second she 1:28:28.400 --> 1:28:32.439 leaves her life. I mean, it's a mess because she's 1:28:32.439 --> 1:28:35.760 like twenty one or whatever, but like, but she immediately 1:28:35.800 --> 1:28:39.439 gets a job, Like she immediately is able to do all, 1:28:39.479 --> 1:28:41.880 like live independently in the way that her dad would 1:28:41.920 --> 1:28:44.720 tell her every day she couldn't possibly do. And it's 1:28:44.720 --> 1:28:48.880 like right, because being away from that energy and that 1:28:49.000 --> 1:28:52.479 horribleness is what would allow you to just be a person. 1:28:52.600 --> 1:28:54.760 And it's just I feel like the storytelling does that 1:28:54.800 --> 1:28:57.880 so effortlessly, where it literally is like cut to her 1:28:58.560 --> 1:29:03.559 having a job that she likes, because you could do 1:29:03.600 --> 1:29:07.760 that in the nineties, I think. But I just thought 1:29:07.760 --> 1:29:10.960 it was like, really, yeah, the dad is the source 1:29:11.000 --> 1:29:12.400 of terror is just. 1:29:12.360 --> 1:29:18.280 Like so clear, right, And it also informs probably why 1:29:18.320 --> 1:29:22.240 she puts up with the abuse from Tanya and all 1:29:22.280 --> 1:29:25.120 of those women who are so cruel to her, because 1:29:25.720 --> 1:29:32.240 when you've become accustomed to abuse, then you going back 1:29:32.280 --> 1:29:35.559 to my family, like my mom was raised by a 1:29:35.680 --> 1:29:40.320 very abusive mother, and she has said to me many 1:29:40.360 --> 1:29:43.679 many times, like that's why I married your dad, who 1:29:43.760 --> 1:29:47.000 was like not good to me. But that's what I knew, 1:29:47.200 --> 1:29:52.080 Like that I tolerated it because that's really all I understood. 1:29:52.160 --> 1:29:56.439 So you have the sense that Maryel hangs out with 1:29:56.479 --> 1:30:00.519 these women who are outwardly cruel to her be because 1:30:01.240 --> 1:30:05.320 she has just become accustomed to this abuse from her father, 1:30:06.280 --> 1:30:10.080 and then she starts to I mean, it takes her 1:30:10.080 --> 1:30:12.880 a little while to liberate herself from it. But this 1:30:12.960 --> 1:30:16.560 friendship with Rhonda is, like you said, like the catalyst 1:30:16.720 --> 1:30:22.280 that gets her on a path of liberation. And that's 1:30:22.400 --> 1:30:25.880 like the core, what like the core of the movie 1:30:25.960 --> 1:30:29.679 as far as like I read it, it is like, yeah, 1:30:29.760 --> 1:30:32.519 you know, as far as like Muriel's arc, I wanted 1:30:32.560 --> 1:30:36.160 to get into that a little bit because yeah, again, 1:30:36.560 --> 1:30:42.280 Muriel starts out as this person who's lying to people, 1:30:42.800 --> 1:30:47.040 she's stealing dresses, she's trying to fit in with this 1:30:47.080 --> 1:30:51.200 crowd who doesn't want her. She ends up marrying a 1:30:51.240 --> 1:30:54.760 guy who seems repulsed by her, just so she can 1:30:54.800 --> 1:30:58.920 say she's gotten married. She's like basically living a false life. Meanwhile, 1:30:59.000 --> 1:31:03.559 throughout this she has made one actual friend in Ronda. 1:31:04.320 --> 1:31:08.639 She's the one person in Mariel's life aside from her mom, 1:31:08.960 --> 1:31:13.000 who accepts Mariel for who she is. Ronda doesn't tolerate 1:31:13.120 --> 1:31:15.920 Maryel being like dishonest and phony, and we see her 1:31:16.479 --> 1:31:21.320 call Maryel out for that, But when she's being an honest, 1:31:21.600 --> 1:31:25.920 genuine person, Ronda loves Mariel for who she is. But 1:31:26.120 --> 1:31:30.120 when you know Ronda needs her the most, Mariel abandons 1:31:30.200 --> 1:31:33.479 her in favor of this wedding and all the attention 1:31:33.720 --> 1:31:37.439 she's getting, Yeah, because she's finally living out this fantasy. 1:31:38.240 --> 1:31:43.639 And then Mariel's arc culminates partly because she sees how 1:31:43.680 --> 1:31:47.680 horrible her father is being at her mother's funeral. She 1:31:47.800 --> 1:31:51.880 realizes that she's living this sham life that she's been, 1:31:52.840 --> 1:31:57.479 you know, as disingenuous as her shitty father. And then 1:31:57.560 --> 1:32:00.680 she leaves it all behind to reunite with which is 1:32:00.960 --> 1:32:04.280 like a very interesting story and not one that you 1:32:04.400 --> 1:32:09.160 generally see because one it shows a woman who's a 1:32:09.240 --> 1:32:13.519 mess in a way that again just feels authentic to 1:32:14.000 --> 1:32:14.759 real life. 1:32:14.880 --> 1:32:17.759 Yeah, it's not misogynists. It's just like you are given 1:32:17.840 --> 1:32:23.960 all the information that you need to understand, however misguided 1:32:24.040 --> 1:32:28.280 and occasionally very selfish. What Muriel is doing is you 1:32:28.360 --> 1:32:31.240 understand where it's coming from, and like you're rooting for 1:32:31.280 --> 1:32:33.640 her to do better, and I get It's like, I 1:32:34.439 --> 1:32:36.880 kind of love how the movie teases you with a 1:32:36.880 --> 1:32:39.599 potentially really shitty ending right at the end where like 1:32:40.000 --> 1:32:44.280 she opens the church door and her fake husband's there 1:32:44.520 --> 1:32:48.679 and he maybe likes her now, but and I think again, 1:32:48.840 --> 1:32:52.200 like a lesser movie would be like, oh, they're gonna 1:32:52.240 --> 1:32:55.519 fall in love. But then she but it's like the 1:32:55.600 --> 1:32:58.759 strongest she ever is that she's like I don't love 1:32:58.880 --> 1:33:03.400 you like I Yeah, it's and you're just like woo. 1:33:03.479 --> 1:33:07.200 And he's like I don't love you either, but you 1:33:07.240 --> 1:33:09.200 could live with me, and she's like no. 1:33:09.640 --> 1:33:10.840 And serves more than that. 1:33:11.600 --> 1:33:16.599 I really love that moment. Yeah, that like she's able 1:33:16.640 --> 1:33:21.360 to see I don't know. I mean, God, may everyone 1:33:21.439 --> 1:33:23.840 be so lucky to realize in their early twenties that 1:33:23.880 --> 1:33:28.120 they're repeating the mistakes of their parents, and I was like, yeah, 1:33:28.200 --> 1:33:32.639 that's in some ways it is a fantasy film, but I'm. 1:33:32.479 --> 1:33:34.840 Sure some people have managed to do it. 1:33:35.200 --> 1:33:37.760 Yeah, but I mean, yeah, her friendship with Ronda is 1:33:37.840 --> 1:33:42.040 so life changing and so like life affirming and yeah. 1:33:41.920 --> 1:33:46.200 Yeah right, because like we see Maryel being a mess 1:33:46.520 --> 1:33:50.200 for the bulk of the movie, but it's very different 1:33:50.240 --> 1:33:54.760 from that like rom com version, like Hollywood rom conversion 1:33:54.920 --> 1:33:58.760 of a woman who's a mess quote unquote, because that 1:33:58.800 --> 1:34:01.920 always feels very cart tony and trophy, and it's like 1:34:01.960 --> 1:34:07.800 she's a mess because she's single and she works too 1:34:07.920 --> 1:34:11.320 much at her magazine job and that's why she's single, 1:34:11.360 --> 1:34:14.520 and she just needs a boyfriend to cure her messiness. 1:34:14.920 --> 1:34:18.200 And we don't get any of that with the Murial character. 1:34:18.360 --> 1:34:20.679 And that's another thing that's so interesting about this movie 1:34:21.120 --> 1:34:23.920 because so many movies from this era that central woman 1:34:24.000 --> 1:34:28.599 as a protagonist are about her finding hetero love and 1:34:28.640 --> 1:34:31.920 that being the thing that fulfills her. But this movie 1:34:32.520 --> 1:34:37.160 is about her personal growth and her solid friendship or 1:34:37.240 --> 1:34:41.639 like perhaps because of a solid friendship with another woman 1:34:42.120 --> 1:34:44.120 who supports her and cares for her. 1:34:44.760 --> 1:34:46.120 And I love that. 1:34:46.320 --> 1:34:47.000 It's a great. 1:34:46.840 --> 1:34:50.200 Movie exactly exactly I mean, and also that I mean 1:34:50.840 --> 1:34:53.080 all of us fakes. Like the title, the title is 1:34:53.120 --> 1:34:57.599 basically a joke where you know, she becomes I mean, 1:34:57.640 --> 1:35:00.160 she becomes disabused of all of these things because is 1:35:00.200 --> 1:35:03.320 basically a coming of age movie of everything that she's 1:35:03.360 --> 1:35:06.240 told is going to like make her the right kind 1:35:06.240 --> 1:35:08.519 of person, which at the beginning of the movie she 1:35:08.680 --> 1:35:11.280 so badly wants to be, to the point that she's 1:35:11.320 --> 1:35:13.960 being very or she's been conditioned. I don't want to 1:35:14.080 --> 1:35:16.000 put it all on her, but like she's being very 1:35:16.000 --> 1:35:20.960 self destructive in pursuit of being anybody but herself, and 1:35:21.400 --> 1:35:25.719 marriage is the ultimate way to become a different person 1:35:26.439 --> 1:35:28.920 in the way that she's been socially conditioned, which still 1:35:29.000 --> 1:35:32.960 happens right, And it's like she's at her saddest when 1:35:32.960 --> 1:35:37.920 she's trying on wedding dresses, she's at her least authentic 1:35:38.400 --> 1:35:42.520 when she's getting married, and at her kind of cruelest 1:35:43.080 --> 1:35:45.639 to the people in her life. She blows off her mom, 1:35:45.800 --> 1:35:49.240 she ignores Rhonda like and then does this sort of 1:35:49.240 --> 1:35:52.000 really condescending like, oh no, I don't want you to 1:35:52.040 --> 1:35:54.200 hang out with us, I got you a plane ticket, 1:35:54.360 --> 1:35:57.240 and then she's like fuck you Like, so she's at 1:35:57.320 --> 1:36:00.120 her the sort of like she's at her worst and 1:36:00.160 --> 1:36:03.720 she's living out her fantasy. Yeah, and I you know, 1:36:03.840 --> 1:36:06.000 it's it's a little broad, but it also it just 1:36:06.040 --> 1:36:08.800 like it works so well in the story of like, 1:36:09.200 --> 1:36:12.080 you know, maybe Muriel will get married someday, but not 1:36:12.240 --> 1:36:15.559 for the reasons that she did the first time, because 1:36:15.600 --> 1:36:17.760 it seems like she, you know, like really is at 1:36:17.800 --> 1:36:20.400 least well on her way to understanding that that is. 1:36:21.320 --> 1:36:24.880 And I think unfortunately, through a lot of tragedy and 1:36:24.960 --> 1:36:29.240 seeing how tremendously depressed her mother was until the end 1:36:29.240 --> 1:36:33.280 of her life and just knowing that, like she had 1:36:33.280 --> 1:36:36.919 to move forward another way to do right by herself 1:36:36.960 --> 1:36:40.600 and honestly, I think, to some extent do right by 1:36:40.640 --> 1:36:44.040 her mom's memory too. I think that it is like 1:36:45.320 --> 1:36:49.120 I feel like where they attribute to her mom to 1:36:49.720 --> 1:36:53.240 you know, liberate herself from this dynamic that her mom 1:36:53.439 --> 1:36:59.479 was trapped in. And then Rhonda, I just love this 1:36:59.600 --> 1:37:03.479 broad She's so great. But let let's talk let's talk 1:37:03.479 --> 1:37:07.120 about rod. I mean she I don't know, it is 1:37:07.200 --> 1:37:10.559 really I love seeing friends become friends really fast in 1:37:10.600 --> 1:37:13.439 a convincing way. I love just all of it. And 1:37:13.479 --> 1:37:15.479 they're like, Yep, we're gonna move in together. We're best 1:37:15.479 --> 1:37:19.439 friends now, blah blah blah. She's really horny. She's having 1:37:19.560 --> 1:37:25.960 three ways with sailor American sailors. Whatever. But let's talk 1:37:26.000 --> 1:37:30.240 about Yeah, this is a character who is able bodies 1:37:30.439 --> 1:37:34.320 at the beginning of the movie and is disabled at 1:37:34.439 --> 1:37:39.240 the end of the movie. She's using a wheelchair permanently, which, yeah, 1:37:39.320 --> 1:37:41.160 let's let's talk about it. 1:37:42.200 --> 1:37:45.360 I mean, this one's a little trickier than our than 1:37:45.360 --> 1:37:49.800 most of our conversations surrounding disability, because it's often a 1:37:50.040 --> 1:37:54.879 character who from the moment we see them on screen 1:37:55.160 --> 1:37:59.880 till the end of the movie, they are disabled the 1:38:00.360 --> 1:38:00.960 entire span. 1:38:01.920 --> 1:38:04.160 Mccaulluff Time, macaulay Culkin. 1:38:03.960 --> 1:38:08.559 And Saved right is my go to example. Yeah, right, 1:38:08.760 --> 1:38:13.439 played by an able bodied actor, which is often the case, 1:38:13.560 --> 1:38:17.160 which is what warrants the criticism. In this case, it's 1:38:17.160 --> 1:38:23.400 a little trickier because she is able bodied for i'd say, 1:38:23.439 --> 1:38:26.479 like the first half of the time we see her 1:38:26.479 --> 1:38:34.320 on screen, so it makes the casting trickier. I'm inclined 1:38:34.400 --> 1:38:36.680 to give this a little bit of a pass, or 1:38:36.720 --> 1:38:41.160 at least some leeway because of the circumstances of her 1:38:41.479 --> 1:38:45.000 being an able bodied character for part of it. But 1:38:45.479 --> 1:38:46.839 it's tricky. 1:38:47.160 --> 1:38:49.840 It's tricky. I am inclined to agree with you. I 1:38:49.840 --> 1:38:53.519 would also like, I would love to hear what our 1:38:53.640 --> 1:38:57.760 disabled listeners feel about this character, because obviously weird like 1:38:58.880 --> 1:39:01.759 not the be all and opinion of this. Of course, 1:39:02.000 --> 1:39:04.160 I don't feel qualified to make the call, but I 1:39:04.160 --> 1:39:07.200 think as as far as how Ronda is written, I 1:39:07.400 --> 1:39:11.639 was like, particularly for nineteen ninety four, pretty impressed with Again, 1:39:11.680 --> 1:39:16.280 it seems to push back on some popular tropes around disability, 1:39:17.040 --> 1:39:21.200 where you know, at the beginning, when I mean just 1:39:21.280 --> 1:39:26.000 the medical frustration that we've both experienced versions of of, 1:39:26.600 --> 1:39:29.080 you know, being talked to either like you're a baby 1:39:29.320 --> 1:39:33.599 or a scientist by a doctor and nothing in between. 1:39:33.960 --> 1:39:37.280 And you know, and and Ronda again, because she's just 1:39:37.360 --> 1:39:40.479 a very blunt person. You know, Muriel's like, what is 1:39:40.520 --> 1:39:43.240 he saying? She's like, he's saying, I'm like fucked but 1:39:43.360 --> 1:39:47.600 he can't say that, you know, and seeing her frustrations, 1:39:47.760 --> 1:39:50.400 and you know, Muriel's saying something that is coming from 1:39:50.400 --> 1:39:51.920 a good place, but it's something we hear a lot 1:39:51.960 --> 1:39:55.439 around disability of like no, Ronda you're going to walk, 1:39:55.600 --> 1:39:58.920 You're going to walk again, which is her encouraging Ronda 1:39:58.960 --> 1:40:02.000 and doesn't want her to lose hope, which is totally fair, 1:40:02.560 --> 1:40:06.200 but I think also buys into this idea that an 1:40:06.240 --> 1:40:11.360 able bodied life is the only one worth having or 1:40:11.400 --> 1:40:14.840 the only one to strive towards, even though it's not 1:40:15.080 --> 1:40:19.840 you know addressed explicitly you Know Ronda as time when 1:40:19.840 --> 1:40:24.040 we flash forward, like, Ronda is understandably tremendously frustrated and 1:40:24.120 --> 1:40:28.720 sad when she loses the use of her legs and 1:40:28.920 --> 1:40:32.280 struggles with it, but it seems like she's ultimately more 1:40:32.320 --> 1:40:35.280 frustrated that she has to move home than anything else. 1:40:35.360 --> 1:40:41.240 And by the time we see Ronda at Maryelle's wedding, 1:40:41.560 --> 1:40:45.120 she seems like comfortable in her wheel. It's just how 1:40:45.160 --> 1:40:48.000 other people talk to her and treat her that's the problem. 1:40:48.760 --> 1:40:51.080 Where it seems like, when she gets past the initial 1:40:51.560 --> 1:40:56.320 shock and adjustment of living with a disability, that it's 1:40:57.080 --> 1:40:59.439 mainly other people who are the problem. We see it 1:40:59.560 --> 1:41:04.320 in a so much casual ableism that is explicit in 1:41:04.360 --> 1:41:07.160 the movie. It's like played for laughs to make the 1:41:07.200 --> 1:41:11.680 person doing it look bad because it's the ladies in 1:41:12.040 --> 1:41:15.040 the dress shop where oh my god, what was the 1:41:15.280 --> 1:41:18.040 and like Ronda's like, get the fuck out of my way, 1:41:19.040 --> 1:41:20.680 where she said you just can't come in here and 1:41:20.720 --> 1:41:23.720 threaten brides, I don't care how unfortunate you are, and 1:41:23.800 --> 1:41:27.760 Ronda says fuck you, which is the only response to 1:41:27.800 --> 1:41:32.920 that sentence. There's a moment with Ronda's mother where Ronda's like, 1:41:32.960 --> 1:41:34.080 I don't want to sit in the front of the 1:41:34.120 --> 1:41:37.479 wedding because she doesn't really want to be there is 1:41:37.560 --> 1:41:41.519 the reason. But you know, Ronda's mom is very casually like, well, good, 1:41:41.560 --> 1:41:44.439 you won't be in anyone's way. And then I think 1:41:44.479 --> 1:41:48.640 the most over the top example is the evil Friends 1:41:49.160 --> 1:41:52.600 talking to her like she has died and her being like, 1:41:53.320 --> 1:41:54.679 I'm not ditch Cheryl. 1:41:55.120 --> 1:41:57.120 You're like right, because one of them says something like 1:41:57.200 --> 1:41:59.280 you were so full of life and it's like I 1:41:59.520 --> 1:42:01.360 still what am here? 1:42:01.439 --> 1:42:01.559 Right? 1:42:01.680 --> 1:42:03.960 Just because I'm disabled now doesn't change that. 1:42:05.240 --> 1:42:08.120 Yeah, And she's also just she's also telling them that 1:42:08.240 --> 1:42:13.000 she's beat cancer, which is like amazing, Like but yeah. 1:42:13.040 --> 1:42:17.519 We see her encounter a lot of like quiet and 1:42:17.600 --> 1:42:22.679 loud ableism throughout the movie, and it's always pushed back 1:42:22.720 --> 1:42:27.439 on and again it's just like, I'm sure that it 1:42:27.520 --> 1:42:31.639 is not a perfect depiction by any means, but I 1:42:31.680 --> 1:42:35.080 appreciated that it was even acknowledged, because I feel like 1:42:35.200 --> 1:42:39.760 so many movies just perpetuate ableism and don't acknowledge that, 1:42:39.920 --> 1:42:44.559 like this is a problem that able bodied people don't 1:42:44.640 --> 1:42:48.760 know how to talk to anybody who isn't like them. 1:42:48.479 --> 1:42:53.439 Like totally. Yeah, I think for like a movie from 1:42:53.479 --> 1:42:58.200 the mid nineties, it does surprisingly well in that regard. 1:42:59.280 --> 1:43:02.880 This is a topic which we can, you know, move 1:43:02.920 --> 1:43:05.160 on to or address later. But I was kind of 1:43:05.200 --> 1:43:08.960 reminded the same way that you know, characters are hurling 1:43:09.880 --> 1:43:16.680 ablest macro or micro aggressions at Rhonda. There are examples 1:43:16.680 --> 1:43:23.519 of white characters committing racist aggressions in a way that 1:43:23.600 --> 1:43:27.640 the movie tends to seem to present it as like, 1:43:27.800 --> 1:43:31.479 look at this foolish person saying this foolish thing. But 1:43:31.640 --> 1:43:34.240 at the same time, the movie has a cast of 1:43:35.160 --> 1:43:39.840 almost exclusively white people and certainly only gives interiority to 1:43:39.880 --> 1:43:45.519 the white characters, right, so it kind of undermines the 1:43:45.560 --> 1:43:49.320 spotlight on oh, look how foolish this racist person is. 1:43:50.360 --> 1:43:52.400 But yeah, there's like there's yeah, I don't want to 1:43:52.400 --> 1:43:55.240 get too specific, because some of them are really gross, but. 1:43:55.360 --> 1:43:59.280 It's mostly anti Asian racism. Yeah, I was noticing a 1:43:59.280 --> 1:44:03.320 lot of anti a racism and also anti Indigenous racism. 1:44:03.600 --> 1:44:06.080 Yeah right, because there's there's a reference to Bill doing 1:44:06.160 --> 1:44:11.040 a real estate development project on land that Aboriginal people 1:44:11.520 --> 1:44:15.440 had been living on and those Indigenous people were displaced 1:44:15.520 --> 1:44:18.400 so that a resort or something could be built, and 1:44:18.439 --> 1:44:21.400 then Bill is talking about this and like carrying on 1:44:21.520 --> 1:44:25.519 as though I deserve recognition for the great work I 1:44:25.600 --> 1:44:29.960 did to build this you know, development, and it's just 1:44:30.120 --> 1:44:33.960 like completely dismissing the you know, the violence and displacement 1:44:34.040 --> 1:44:37.439 toward the Aboriginal people who we don't see on screen 1:44:37.600 --> 1:44:41.000 or never meet any Aboriginal people in this movie. So 1:44:42.360 --> 1:44:43.479 it's we do. 1:44:43.520 --> 1:44:46.559 Meet Aboriginal people in the other movie that stars that 1:44:46.680 --> 1:44:48.160 actor that came out that year. 1:44:49.680 --> 1:44:52.439 But yes, which we discussed and you can go back, and. 1:44:53.160 --> 1:44:56.720 Also has its own problems. Yeah, but yeah, no, I 1:44:56.840 --> 1:45:01.120 felt like, you know, the reason for me, and again 1:45:01.800 --> 1:45:04.240 it's not for me to make this call, but part 1:45:04.280 --> 1:45:07.000 of the reason that I didn't find the movie to 1:45:07.000 --> 1:45:11.000 be tremendously ablest is because we have a disabled character 1:45:11.840 --> 1:45:18.560 who we love and who pushes back against the ableism 1:45:18.720 --> 1:45:22.160 and like loves and accepts herself. It's the circumstance she's 1:45:22.200 --> 1:45:25.840 frustrated with right, but with the it seems like they're 1:45:25.880 --> 1:45:28.920 trying to go for a similar thing. But it's like, 1:45:28.920 --> 1:45:34.160 if your cast is all white excepting very passing, you know, interactions, 1:45:34.360 --> 1:45:39.320 then those jokes are not gonna land, at least for us, 1:45:39.360 --> 1:45:43.320 not particularly well, because there's no one there to push 1:45:43.400 --> 1:45:46.919 back on it. So it's just like, haha, they are racist, 1:45:47.400 --> 1:45:50.479 which is not a particularly effective joke. 1:45:50.880 --> 1:45:51.719 Yeah, I agree. 1:45:52.040 --> 1:45:55.040 It's like yeah, it's like, you know, you can say, well, 1:45:55.080 --> 1:45:57.920 we hate those characters and this is just another reason 1:45:57.960 --> 1:46:00.240 to hate them, but it's like, well, we already hated them. Again. 1:46:00.280 --> 1:46:02.679 It's like, if you want to go there, if that's 1:46:02.720 --> 1:46:05.800 the route you want to go, don't only cast white 1:46:05.840 --> 1:46:09.120 people because it's like it's the racism in the room 1:46:09.120 --> 1:46:10.320 with us kind of vibe. 1:46:10.439 --> 1:46:11.519 Yeah for sure, not. 1:46:11.439 --> 1:46:14.639 To say that. I mean, you know, I'm not accusing 1:46:14.680 --> 1:46:18.000 the director of being racist. I'm just like, you need 1:46:18.080 --> 1:46:24.760 representation of more than white people obviously, but also like 1:46:24.840 --> 1:46:27.320 those jokes aren't going to land in an all white cast, 1:46:28.040 --> 1:46:30.400 and it's like silly to expect them. 1:46:30.240 --> 1:46:33.840 To, right to the point where you're not even sure 1:46:34.080 --> 1:46:37.320 what the intent was with those jokes. It's like, is 1:46:37.360 --> 1:46:39.839 it to call out the white people for being racist? 1:46:40.000 --> 1:46:43.280 Or are we supposed to be laughing along with the joke? 1:46:43.600 --> 1:46:46.160 Because the movie doesn't make that super super clear. 1:46:46.320 --> 1:46:49.320 In nineteen ninety four, I don't know what the answer is. 1:46:49.360 --> 1:46:53.840 Anyone's guessed, right, So yeah, no, I totally agree with you, 1:46:53.920 --> 1:46:58.240 And it's that's unfortunate because I think that, like by 1:46:58.320 --> 1:47:04.120 writing Rhonda's Care so thoughtfully, that this movie is able 1:47:04.160 --> 1:47:07.800 to push back on a lot of ablest tropes, So 1:47:07.840 --> 1:47:11.160 it's unfortunate that it sort of just plays into lazier 1:47:11.200 --> 1:47:13.160 tropes around racism. 1:47:15.680 --> 1:47:19.719 Also wanted to talk about the body shaming and fat 1:47:19.760 --> 1:47:28.280 shaming that particularly Muriel's character is subjected to different family 1:47:28.320 --> 1:47:33.559 members and friends of hers or former friends fat shame her. 1:47:34.080 --> 1:47:37.960 But then you also learn that Tony collect gained weight 1:47:38.080 --> 1:47:41.360 for the role, and not that I don't want Tony 1:47:41.600 --> 1:47:45.599 Collette to get roles, especially starmaking roles like this, but 1:47:46.400 --> 1:47:51.000 productions throughout history have had a bad habit of not 1:47:51.479 --> 1:47:56.240 casting fat actors or just actors of varying body sizes. 1:47:57.240 --> 1:48:03.200 And instead either casting an actor and then requiring that 1:48:03.320 --> 1:48:06.320 they gain weight or putting them in a fat suit. 1:48:06.720 --> 1:48:11.080 Which also feels I mean what I mean, We unfortunately 1:48:11.240 --> 1:48:14.000 don't need to go back very far in movie history 1:48:14.040 --> 1:48:17.400 because this still very much happens. It was a lot 1:48:17.400 --> 1:48:21.000 of the discourse surrounding the Whale, which one Brendan Fraser 1:48:21.040 --> 1:48:24.320 a fucking oscar. It's I don't know, I mean, like 1:48:24.360 --> 1:48:26.439 we've had this conversation on the show before, but I 1:48:26.600 --> 1:48:31.160 was disappointed to learn that. Not shocked given the nineteen 1:48:31.280 --> 1:48:35.719 ninety four of it, all right, but certainly disappointed because 1:48:35.720 --> 1:48:40.080 it's just like Tony Klette is tremendously talented, so are 1:48:40.880 --> 1:48:46.080 actors that aren't rail Thinn. You know, like, if this 1:48:46.200 --> 1:48:50.960 is canon to this character who we love, cast accordingly, 1:48:51.360 --> 1:48:52.360 you know, it's. 1:48:52.600 --> 1:48:58.000 Right, there are available actors of all sizes, and if 1:48:58.040 --> 1:49:02.559 the role requires an actor to be a certain size, 1:49:02.840 --> 1:49:07.400 there's already an actor who's that exact size that could 1:49:07.400 --> 1:49:10.919 have been cast without requiring that they make any changes 1:49:11.479 --> 1:49:12.280 to their body. 1:49:12.560 --> 1:49:17.400 Absolutely, And it's it's so wild because it's just like, 1:49:17.560 --> 1:49:20.840 but although I guess you couldn't make a movie in 1:49:20.920 --> 1:49:24.479 nineteen ninety four in Australia without this guy Bill, so 1:49:25.200 --> 1:49:28.720 Bill to be there's only like sometimes when you see 1:49:28.720 --> 1:49:31.640 Australian movies, I'm like, are there ten working actors in 1:49:31.680 --> 1:49:34.680 this country? Like what is going on? Bill is in 1:49:35.280 --> 1:49:37.400 all of them? That's so wild? 1:49:38.080 --> 1:49:41.040 Yeah it's it's I mean, and good good. 1:49:40.840 --> 1:49:44.479 For him, but yeah no. But I'm glad that you 1:49:44.640 --> 1:49:47.519 pointed that out because I was also like, I need 1:49:47.560 --> 1:49:49.720 to do more research, and then the research made me 1:49:50.040 --> 1:49:59.280 sad many such cases. Let me see. That's like, I 1:49:59.280 --> 1:50:00.479 think most. 1:50:00.320 --> 1:50:01.880 Of what I had I didn't have much else. We 1:50:01.920 --> 1:50:03.840 covered a lot of stuff during the recap. I think 1:50:03.840 --> 1:50:06.320 the last thing that I wanted to just include was 1:50:06.479 --> 1:50:11.320 a quote from a piece from The Guardian by an 1:50:11.360 --> 1:50:17.479 Australian writer named Karen Pickering, who wrote kind of like 1:50:17.520 --> 1:50:22.439 a retrospective review in twenty seventeen about this movie entitled 1:50:22.800 --> 1:50:27.519 Mauriel's Wedding is a feminist masterpiece and more relevant than ever. 1:50:28.760 --> 1:50:33.000 She doesn't go quite as like intersectional as our discussion 1:50:33.240 --> 1:50:35.240 has been, but she does point out a lot of 1:50:35.240 --> 1:50:38.040 the positives which I tended to agree with. So I'll 1:50:38.080 --> 1:50:43.240 just share a few quick paragraphs from this quote. Lots 1:50:43.240 --> 1:50:46.040 of little moments resonate with me as a feminist observer. 1:50:46.560 --> 1:50:51.080 Rhnda is totally and unapologetically sex positive, and when her 1:50:51.160 --> 1:50:54.320 casual sex partners think a guy is taking advantage of Maryel, 1:50:54.400 --> 1:50:59.280 they intervene on her. Behalf. Bryce is an example of gentle, respectful, 1:50:59.479 --> 1:51:03.840 and war masculinity, which you could maybe because of how 1:51:03.880 --> 1:51:05.840 strong he comes on you could maybe disagree with that, 1:51:05.920 --> 1:51:09.840 but anyway, Yeah, well, David is positively influenced in this 1:51:09.960 --> 1:51:15.200 direction by Mauriel. Also maybe up for debate. Undoubtedly, patriarchy 1:51:15.479 --> 1:51:19.720 is the decisive factor in creating Muriel's reprehensible dad, in 1:51:19.840 --> 1:51:23.400 the behavior of her hapless siblings, in the power differential 1:51:23.439 --> 1:51:26.400 between her mother and father, and even in the despicable 1:51:26.520 --> 1:51:30.799 deirdrech Chambers just a sad woman in a bad man's world. 1:51:31.000 --> 1:51:33.040 I guess that we didn't really talk about Deirdre, but 1:51:33.200 --> 1:51:35.840 I don't have that much to say other than it 1:51:35.960 --> 1:51:39.639 seems like she is coded as like, here's a woman 1:51:39.680 --> 1:51:45.679 who will step on anyone to achieve some notoriety or comfort, 1:51:46.040 --> 1:51:50.920 such as you know, participating in MLMs. And I mean also, 1:51:51.160 --> 1:51:52.960 oh oh, I wanted to bring this up in the 1:51:52.960 --> 1:51:58.080 conversation about Muriel's mother about Betty what Deirdre says about 1:51:58.120 --> 1:52:01.720 her towards the end of the movie where you know, 1:52:01.800 --> 1:52:05.799 Deirdre says again, just because Betty, even from beyond the grave, 1:52:05.920 --> 1:52:08.719 is being punished by her piece of shit ex husband 1:52:09.240 --> 1:52:13.880 says like, oh, you know, this is gonna make Bill 1:52:13.880 --> 1:52:16.519 look a lot more sympathetic in the press, so at 1:52:16.600 --> 1:52:18.760 least her life had a purpose. And I was like, 1:52:19.800 --> 1:52:25.400 you fucking it, Like I just oh, I like my 1:52:25.720 --> 1:52:29.679 blood was. I don't know how someone said that about 1:52:29.720 --> 1:52:32.880 my mom and our relationships up and down, but like 1:52:33.120 --> 1:52:37.120 I would hit somewhat. That's like, oh my god, how 1:52:37.120 --> 1:52:40.320 did Deirdre not take one to the fucking nose on that? 1:52:40.320 --> 1:52:43.599 That was like, uh, I don't but. 1:52:45.479 --> 1:52:47.680 I respect what the what the writer's saying, and it's 1:52:47.680 --> 1:52:49.920 true and it is I'm sure it's like canonically true, 1:52:49.920 --> 1:52:52.080 but I'm like, I know, I hate that bitch. I 1:52:52.120 --> 1:52:52.960 hate that bitch. 1:52:53.120 --> 1:52:56.200 Yeah, no, she's awful. Just to finish out this quote, 1:52:56.280 --> 1:52:59.400 the writer goes on to say Bill has exemplifies a 1:52:59.600 --> 1:53:05.360 particularly Australian strain of toxic masculinity. He's matro corrupt, racist, 1:53:05.520 --> 1:53:08.879 cruel to his children, and wholly abusive to his poor wife. 1:53:09.360 --> 1:53:12.320 The most likable he ever gets is when he's grudgingly 1:53:12.360 --> 1:53:17.839 impressed by Muriel giving him the what for before she leaves. 1:53:18.120 --> 1:53:20.040 I don't know if that's an Australian expression, but I 1:53:20.040 --> 1:53:21.200 don't know what the what for? 1:53:21.960 --> 1:53:24.240 The what for? I think it's just like standing up 1:53:24.240 --> 1:53:24.920 to him kind of. 1:53:25.160 --> 1:53:30.120 That makes sense finally, And how can we understand her beautiful, 1:53:30.160 --> 1:53:34.080 tragic mom without factoring in the misogyny and sexism that's 1:53:34.160 --> 1:53:36.840 kept her in this home full of people who treat 1:53:36.880 --> 1:53:40.000 her so badly. Yeah, but in Mariel's case, it's also 1:53:40.200 --> 1:53:44.280 a patriarchal fantasy that keeps her alive, the dream that 1:53:44.360 --> 1:53:47.599 one day she'll be a success because someone will want 1:53:47.640 --> 1:53:51.000 to marry her unquote. And yeah, I think that's the 1:53:51.080 --> 1:53:53.160 last thing I wanted to just touch a little bit 1:53:53.200 --> 1:53:58.800 more on as far as this idea of And Mauriel's 1:53:58.840 --> 1:54:02.280 not alone in this. I've met people throughout my life 1:54:02.680 --> 1:54:09.320 were who cared more about getting married than who they married, 1:54:09.800 --> 1:54:14.080 or like everything was focused on the wedding. The wedding's 1:54:14.080 --> 1:54:16.479 the happiest day of your life, and it's like, will 1:54:16.600 --> 1:54:19.120 what about the relationship after that? 1:54:19.680 --> 1:54:22.880 Or like, but what I really appreciate about this movie 1:54:23.160 --> 1:54:26.760 is that I think that a lot of even like 1:54:27.240 --> 1:54:31.160 movies that are ostensibly feminist, and not to say that 1:54:31.200 --> 1:54:34.480 this doesn't happen, because sure it does. Some people are 1:54:34.880 --> 1:54:40.440 simply vapid, right, Like it happens across the gender spectrum. 1:54:40.680 --> 1:54:45.800 But I think that sometimes when particularly a woman is 1:54:46.440 --> 1:54:50.400 perceiving marriage this way, movies that sort of taut themselves 1:54:50.440 --> 1:54:52.640 and pat themselves on the back for their own feminism 1:54:52.720 --> 1:54:56.360 are like, look at this fucking loser who's not like 1:54:56.560 --> 1:55:00.640 cool and feminist, like the main character who has never 1:55:00.840 --> 1:55:04.800 made a mistake in response to patriarchy. Like it's like, 1:55:04.880 --> 1:55:09.000 what makes me really appreciate Muriel even more is that, 1:55:09.160 --> 1:55:12.880 like she's drank the kool aid, and a lot of 1:55:12.920 --> 1:55:15.600 people drink the kool aid, and some people even get 1:55:15.800 --> 1:55:19.320 drink the kool aid and get married and then realize fuck. 1:55:19.440 --> 1:55:23.560 I mean, it's it's really hard to you know, against 1:55:23.640 --> 1:55:29.200 a culture that is still this adamant about merit for sure, 1:55:29.800 --> 1:55:32.040 and then also I mean whatever, there's We've talked about 1:55:32.080 --> 1:55:34.600 marriage plenty on the show. But I just really appreciated 1:55:34.640 --> 1:55:37.720 and it felt rare that, you know, I think when 1:55:37.760 --> 1:55:42.320 we see movies that surround women and weddings. Very often 1:55:42.360 --> 1:55:44.240 it's just like she's getting married. It's like done with 1:55:44.280 --> 1:55:46.160 the assumption. That's like, and of course we know this 1:55:46.240 --> 1:55:48.160 is the most important day of her life, and blah blah, 1:55:48.160 --> 1:55:50.600 blah blah. It's just like assuming that you have drank 1:55:50.640 --> 1:55:53.680 the kool aid. And then there's movies that I think 1:55:53.800 --> 1:55:58.200 are like corny bad twenty tens feminism, that are like 1:55:58.640 --> 1:56:02.080 any woman who wants to get married is an agent 1:56:02.160 --> 1:56:05.960 of the patriarchy, where it's like the truth is always 1:56:06.000 --> 1:56:07.960 going to be somewhere in the middle there. And with Muriel, 1:56:08.040 --> 1:56:13.200 it's like she's being disabused of this really patriarchal structure 1:56:13.400 --> 1:56:16.080 that is all she knows. And it's not until she 1:56:16.760 --> 1:56:21.240 escapes and lives a little bit and connects with someone 1:56:21.840 --> 1:56:25.640 on a deeper level through Ronda, that she's able to realize, 1:56:25.680 --> 1:56:28.480 like and you know, until she literally gets what she wants. 1:56:28.560 --> 1:56:32.600 And it's horrible that she's like, well, I'm gonna get 1:56:32.640 --> 1:56:35.520 out while i can, and you know, and maybe she 1:56:35.600 --> 1:56:38.640 will find love down the line, we'll get married, maybe 1:56:38.680 --> 1:56:40.840 she won't. But it's just like it's cool to see 1:56:40.840 --> 1:56:43.720 someone be disabused of that and still have the movie 1:56:43.760 --> 1:56:47.440 be like wholy on their side, because it's a journey 1:56:47.440 --> 1:56:48.280 a lot of people have. 1:56:48.240 --> 1:56:50.400 To go on, definitely, And yeah, I don't I don't 1:56:50.440 --> 1:56:57.960 blame people for having been conditioned to like disproportionately value 1:56:58.640 --> 1:57:02.080 getting married or just like the idea of getting married 1:57:02.320 --> 1:57:06.240 or the idea of having a wedding, because there's an entire, 1:57:06.680 --> 1:57:10.960 you know, bazillion dollar industry built around that, there's and 1:57:11.000 --> 1:57:14.680 not for nothing, we love going to weddings and as 1:57:14.720 --> 1:57:17.760 to your wedding, but yeah, I mean so much of 1:57:17.840 --> 1:57:24.200 patriarchy does condition people, and especially women to strongly value 1:57:24.640 --> 1:57:30.200 the idea of getting married and not even like not 1:57:30.400 --> 1:57:33.839 like having a marriage and having a meaningful relationship with 1:57:33.840 --> 1:57:38.760 with a companion. It's just like you gotta get married. 1:57:39.200 --> 1:57:43.280 The subtext, according to the patriarchy is like become. 1:57:42.960 --> 1:57:47.240 A man's property, right, But it's like and then and 1:57:47.280 --> 1:57:52.120 then the whole you know lie the eresults in these 1:57:52.160 --> 1:57:56.440 like compet structure is that as a woman, you will 1:57:57.000 --> 1:58:00.879 become a more the most complete version of yourself exactly 1:58:00.880 --> 1:58:03.240 when you get married to a man. And so I 1:58:03.280 --> 1:58:09.440 think with every with every feminist movement, that the conception 1:58:09.560 --> 1:58:13.839 of marriage has been sort of adjusted or like altered 1:58:13.880 --> 1:58:18.240 by the right to make this very conservative notion Syne. 1:58:18.440 --> 1:58:21.400 And I mean, I'm fucking getting married next year, Like 1:58:21.400 --> 1:58:23.840 you have a fiance. I have a fiance, but it's 1:58:23.880 --> 1:58:27.480 because I simply really want to marry, like I'm excited 1:58:27.520 --> 1:58:31.400 about it, which is like, then do it. But yeah, 1:58:31.440 --> 1:58:35.600 I feel like people the way that people sell, particularly 1:58:35.640 --> 1:58:38.720 young women on marriage by praying on their self esteem 1:58:38.960 --> 1:58:43.320 is and during like second wave feminism of like, no, 1:58:43.520 --> 1:58:47.520 actually being married is a way to be self actualized. 1:58:47.560 --> 1:58:51.640 You're like, shut the fuck up, dude, Like there, you know, 1:58:52.440 --> 1:58:55.800 it's just interesting watching the news scams that people come 1:58:55.880 --> 1:58:59.680 up with. But you know, Muriel sees through the matrix 1:58:59.760 --> 1:59:02.880 at the end of the movie and realizes that friendship 1:59:03.920 --> 1:59:06.240 is the true wedding or something. 1:59:07.560 --> 1:59:11.280 No, if that's exactly it, And that's why I really 1:59:11.360 --> 1:59:15.800 appreciate this movie again, Like, yes, she she has more 1:59:15.920 --> 1:59:21.040 maturing to do. She you know, needs to learn how 1:59:21.040 --> 1:59:27.120 to be a more honest person. But it's this caring, 1:59:27.160 --> 1:59:31.920 supportive friendship with her friend Rhonda. I keep wanting to 1:59:31.960 --> 1:59:34.560 call her Rodna. I don't even think that's a name. 1:59:35.360 --> 1:59:40.280 That's a cool name, Rodna, It's Ronda I'm just having 1:59:40.560 --> 1:59:47.920 a bit of a brain thing today. But Ronda is, Yeah, 1:59:48.160 --> 1:59:52.360 the thing that she that Muriel needed to see the light. 1:59:53.040 --> 1:59:53.640 I love it. 1:59:54.120 --> 1:59:57.560 Yeah, and just seeing especially with I guess the last 1:59:57.560 --> 2:00:02.640 thing I'll say about Rhonda and Uriel is that, you know, Ronda, 2:00:03.120 --> 2:00:05.320 part of what draws them to each other is they 2:00:05.360 --> 2:00:09.360 really admire each other and you know, and that even 2:00:09.480 --> 2:00:14.320 after Muriel kind of exposes herself as like I've been 2:00:14.400 --> 2:00:18.520 lying to you, Ronda's upset about it, she's hurt, but 2:00:18.640 --> 2:00:24.320 it doesn't make her think Muriel isn't awesome. Yeah, and 2:00:24.360 --> 2:00:27.240 that is like a true friend of like you know, 2:00:27.680 --> 2:00:30.160 and and not everyone would would do that, and maybe 2:00:30.160 --> 2:00:32.760 they would be right to write like that's a pretty 2:00:32.800 --> 2:00:36.280 big lie. But she's like, okay, fine, so Tim Sims 2:00:36.320 --> 2:00:38.400 wasn't real, You're still cool, like. 2:00:38.920 --> 2:00:43.760 Because in that moment, Maryel explains why she made Tim 2:00:43.760 --> 2:00:47.040 Simms up. She's like, exactly, I hate myself and if 2:00:47.040 --> 2:00:50.120 I was marrying someone, I could be a different person 2:00:50.360 --> 2:00:52.800 and I would love a different person, which like might 2:00:53.120 --> 2:00:54.560 and probably wouldn't even be true. 2:00:54.680 --> 2:00:56.960 Like no, I mean, well we learned that's not true 2:00:57.360 --> 2:00:59.919 because she marries some guy and this miserable. 2:01:00.320 --> 2:01:05.560 Right, so the way that she actually will love herself 2:01:05.800 --> 2:01:08.280 has nothing to do with marriage or being with a 2:01:08.320 --> 2:01:10.880 man or anything like that. She lays all this out 2:01:11.320 --> 2:01:16.080 and Ronda she hears that. She sees that, and she's like, 2:01:16.120 --> 2:01:18.560 this is still a person worthy of my friendship and 2:01:19.640 --> 2:01:23.840 like probably needs my help. They need each other, They 2:01:23.920 --> 2:01:24.880 need each other for sure. 2:01:26.160 --> 2:01:29.520 I love them. I love them. This movie passes the 2:01:29.560 --> 2:01:31.520 Bechdel test obviously a lot. 2:01:31.680 --> 2:01:34.960 Yes, lots of different combinations of characters talking about all 2:01:35.040 --> 2:01:37.800 kinds of stuff. There are discussions about men. Some of 2:01:37.800 --> 2:01:40.280 them are made up. Oh does it pass the test 2:01:40.320 --> 2:01:43.240 if you're talking about Tim Simms, who's not a real. 2:01:43.120 --> 2:01:48.240 Person feminist icon timsons. We don't know how Tim Simms identifies. 2:01:48.520 --> 2:01:51.440 We don't because Tim Sims is made up. 2:01:51.800 --> 2:01:54.120 Well, Tim Sims is a cop, so he's. 2:01:54.080 --> 2:02:03.800 See him, Tim Simms. I hate to hear it anyways, Okay, Yeah, 2:02:03.840 --> 2:02:06.760 it passes a lot, And honestly, most of the interactions 2:02:06.760 --> 2:02:12.000 about men are pretty anti men. It's yeah, I don't 2:02:12.000 --> 2:02:14.120 think this movie has a very high opinion of men. 2:02:14.280 --> 2:02:16.720 And that's why I and that's why I trust it. 2:02:17.720 --> 2:02:19.440 Wow, Titanic, I don't. 2:02:19.320 --> 2:02:21.720 Think if we've ever thrown that line in before, so 2:02:22.200 --> 2:02:25.040 for your consideration, it doesn't make any sense. That's why 2:02:25.040 --> 2:02:25.600 I trusted. 2:02:27.200 --> 2:02:29.360 Did you catch my Summer Heights High reference from like 2:02:29.560 --> 2:02:30.400 two hours ago? 2:02:30.640 --> 2:02:33.080 Oh my god, the. 2:02:33.040 --> 2:02:38.440 Curly haired beach yeah, may yeah, oh yeah, that's probably No, 2:02:38.480 --> 2:02:40.760 that's a jama and that's not Summer High High briber raids. 2:02:41.840 --> 2:02:45.000 I mix it up. Yeah, Jame meant a lot to me. 2:02:45.960 --> 2:02:50.000 Well, I mean, same spelling, different pronunciation. 2:02:49.640 --> 2:02:52.600 I think, so, just like there's an accent mark, I think. 2:02:54.280 --> 2:02:58.920 But yeah, yeah, so it passes the vectels test handily. Yeah, 2:02:58.960 --> 2:03:02.600 so but what about the one perfect metric, the nipple scale? 2:03:02.680 --> 2:03:05.960 Oh, you mean our scale where we rate the movie 2:03:06.640 --> 2:03:09.400 on a scale of zero to five nipples based on 2:03:10.640 --> 2:03:14.120 looking at the movie through an intersectional feminist lens. 2:03:14.320 --> 2:03:14.960 Why, yes, I do. 2:03:15.400 --> 2:03:22.360 Well in that case, I'll give this. I'm like between 2:03:22.880 --> 2:03:25.000 I want to see like a three and a half, 2:03:25.760 --> 2:03:31.560 maybe edging toward a four. There's a lot that I 2:03:31.560 --> 2:03:34.640 think this movie handles well. There's a few things that 2:03:34.680 --> 2:03:39.840 I'm a little dicey on that I think are very 2:03:40.800 --> 2:03:44.080 you know, criticism about how the movie handles like the 2:03:44.160 --> 2:03:50.000 racist microaggressions that different characters hurl head people, and the 2:03:50.040 --> 2:03:56.480 discussion around ableism and the discussion around body and body size, 2:03:57.560 --> 2:04:02.040 those are a little iffier. But because this movie at 2:04:02.080 --> 2:04:06.640 its core is about two women forming a friendship that 2:04:07.160 --> 2:04:11.840 is just like sweet, and it's not the healthiest friendship 2:04:11.880 --> 2:04:15.160 on account of Maurial lying a lot, but she learns 2:04:15.200 --> 2:04:18.360 not to do that, but she's working on and that's 2:04:18.400 --> 2:04:21.040 the thing too, Like there's so few movies about a 2:04:21.080 --> 2:04:24.640 messy woman who's messy in a way that actually feels 2:04:24.680 --> 2:04:30.880 like real life and that needs to learn and not 2:04:31.160 --> 2:04:34.440 be dishonest, not be lying to people, et cetera, because 2:04:34.600 --> 2:04:40.919 movies and society ever heard of it, well, except expect 2:04:41.040 --> 2:04:43.320 women to be these perfect little angels who are not 2:04:43.360 --> 2:04:46.920 allowed to misbehave in any way and who have to 2:04:46.960 --> 2:04:50.080 just be born perfect. And we have very little tolerance 2:04:50.600 --> 2:04:53.960 for messy women. And I love to see a movie 2:04:54.000 --> 2:04:56.920 about a messy woman, But I also love to see 2:04:56.920 --> 2:04:59.880 a movie about a messy woman growing, because messy people should, 2:05:00.440 --> 2:05:03.440 you know, grow and learn, right, And that's what this 2:05:03.480 --> 2:05:05.840 movie is all about. So I really appreciate it. And 2:05:06.680 --> 2:05:09.720 I'll land on like three point seventy five nipples and 2:05:09.760 --> 2:05:16.480 I'll distribute them between Tony Collette, the actor who plays Ronda, 2:05:16.880 --> 2:05:25.960 Rachel Griffiths, and Tim Sims imaginary imaginary King. 2:05:26.760 --> 2:05:28.640 Yeah, I'm gonna go three point seven five as well. 2:05:28.680 --> 2:05:34.280 I agree, particularly with regards to the racism and asking 2:05:34.320 --> 2:05:36.640 a I mean not Tony Kollett was not famous at 2:05:36.680 --> 2:05:39.520 this time, but having an actor gain weight instead of simply. 2:05:39.240 --> 2:05:42.000 Just casting an actor who's already the size of the character. 2:05:42.240 --> 2:05:45.720 Yeah, basically everything else about this movie I was really 2:05:46.560 --> 2:05:49.480 pleasantly surprised by. Like I was really blown away. It's like, 2:05:49.560 --> 2:05:54.880 it's a really funny, memorable movie about the cycle of 2:05:55.960 --> 2:06:00.880 trauma in families. And I still laughed so much and 2:06:01.680 --> 2:06:03.960 you could never predict what's going to happen next in 2:06:04.040 --> 2:06:08.440 this movie. I love Love Love just a story about yeah, 2:06:08.480 --> 2:06:12.960 like being liberated through friendship but still being a messy 2:06:13.040 --> 2:06:15.600 twenty one, twenty two year old, Like it just yeah, 2:06:15.640 --> 2:06:21.280 she feels so real and the performances are amazing, and 2:06:21.320 --> 2:06:24.240 I just feel like it's like this weird, awesome commentary 2:06:24.240 --> 2:06:27.240 on it's the exact opposite of what the poster leads 2:06:27.280 --> 2:06:30.640 you to believe, right, it's going to be And I 2:06:30.720 --> 2:06:34.840 really love that I got gotten big time. This movie 2:06:34.920 --> 2:06:38.800 got our asses because even the like, I mean, I'm 2:06:38.800 --> 2:06:41.080 sort of wondering if they were trying to market it 2:06:41.120 --> 2:06:43.680 as like, because this is kind of a hard sell 2:06:44.040 --> 2:06:46.200 to your average rom com goer, to be like, it's 2:06:46.360 --> 2:06:49.600 the most depressing thing you'll ever see. Prepare to not 2:06:49.720 --> 2:06:54.320 feel escape from reality at all, because the poster says, 2:06:54.600 --> 2:06:57.040 a comedy about a small town girl who didn't fit in, 2:06:57.320 --> 2:07:00.840 but it's about to learn how to stand out. Uriel's wedding, 2:07:01.120 --> 2:07:04.320 she's not just getting married, she's getting even I'm like, 2:07:04.520 --> 2:07:06.920 that doesn't feel like the movie. I feel like they 2:07:06.920 --> 2:07:09.000 were just trying to be like, it's a movie about 2:07:09.000 --> 2:07:12.400 a wedding, go see it, just trick people into going 2:07:12.560 --> 2:07:15.560 because it is a tricky sell. But I think it's awesome. Yes, 2:07:15.600 --> 2:07:17.960 I'm gonna do three point seventy five nipples. I'm gonna 2:07:17.960 --> 2:07:21.080 give them to Toni Collette. I'm gonna give one to 2:07:21.200 --> 2:07:24.760 Jocelyn Moore and Linda House, who were Yeah, the two 2:07:24.840 --> 2:07:26.760 producers of this movie were women. I'm gonna give one 2:07:26.800 --> 2:07:32.680 to editor Jill Billcock, who also who's just an Australian legend, 2:07:32.720 --> 2:07:36.840 also edited Strictly Ballroom Romeo Plus Juliet and Mulin Rouge 2:07:37.520 --> 2:07:41.320 and Oh my God, Kate Blanchette, another Australian legend. She 2:07:41.640 --> 2:07:47.680 also edited the Cate Blanchette Queen Elizabeth's movie Oh from 2:07:47.720 --> 2:07:49.880 the nineties. So I'll give one to her and then 2:07:49.920 --> 2:07:52.760 i'll give by last point five. Yeah, you know what, 2:07:52.800 --> 2:07:55.040 I'm gonna give it to Tim Simms as well, because 2:07:55.680 --> 2:07:57.760 he had me in the first act. Then it turns 2:07:57.760 --> 2:07:59.120 out he was a vengeful cop. 2:07:59.720 --> 2:08:02.880 Oh okay, wait, I take back my Tim Sims nipple 2:08:03.240 --> 2:08:06.560 and I'm gonna yeah, sorry, I forgot that he's a cop. 2:08:06.680 --> 2:08:08.400 Well I won't. 2:08:08.680 --> 2:08:10.000 I'm gonna give he's not real. 2:08:11.960 --> 2:08:13.520 But I do, like, I don't want Tim Sims to 2:08:13.520 --> 2:08:14.640 get any bright ideas. 2:08:14.720 --> 2:08:18.520 I do want to distribute some of my nipples to 2:08:19.520 --> 2:08:22.000 Muriel's mom and her sister Jonie. 2:08:22.640 --> 2:08:27.600 I yes, Betty and Jonie, I really And meanwhile, I'm 2:08:27.600 --> 2:08:30.760 the person that just screamed they're not real. I am 2:08:30.840 --> 2:08:35.160 so like. I just hope that Muriel calls Joni regularly. 2:08:35.240 --> 2:08:37.080 I was worried for Joanie at the end. I don't 2:08:37.120 --> 2:08:39.600 want Joni to get stuck in that pattern of abuse 2:08:40.160 --> 2:08:42.800 with her dad because it's not like he's going to 2:08:42.840 --> 2:08:47.760 ever improve. I'm like, Jony, I'm assuming you're an adult. Like, 2:08:49.200 --> 2:08:51.440 it's hard to tell how old people were in the 2:08:51.520 --> 2:08:55.960 nineties because they weren't using SPS sunblock and they were 2:08:56.040 --> 2:08:59.880 ripping STIGs. But like, my heart really went out to Joni. 2:09:00.160 --> 2:09:01.040 Yeah, I hope she moves on. 2:09:01.280 --> 2:09:04.560 I'm still keeping my nipples with timsim. That is fine. 2:09:04.800 --> 2:09:05.520 I allow it. 2:09:06.000 --> 2:09:10.960 And with that, listeners, thank you so much for those 2:09:10.960 --> 2:09:14.120 of you who have been frothing at the mouth for 2:09:14.200 --> 2:09:17.280 this Mariel's wedding episode. I know it's it's some of 2:09:17.320 --> 2:09:19.960 you at least. I hope you enjoyed it. 2:09:20.400 --> 2:09:22.520 We really enjoyed putting it together. Yeah, we hope it 2:09:22.560 --> 2:09:25.040 was worth the way because this was a blast. 2:09:25.360 --> 2:09:30.760 Yeah, it was a prospect on our wedding Webuary month 2:09:31.200 --> 2:09:34.160 last year. Yup, and it didn't quite make the cut. 2:09:34.200 --> 2:09:36.960 But here it is on the main feed, So yeah, 2:09:37.000 --> 2:09:37.600 what now? 2:09:37.680 --> 2:09:38.680 What now? 2:09:38.720 --> 2:09:44.240 But speaking of the main feed versus our Matreon, it's 2:09:44.280 --> 2:09:46.879 something you should subscribe to. You can go to patreon 2:09:46.920 --> 2:09:49.800 dot com slash spectal Cast. It's five dollars a month. 2:09:50.160 --> 2:09:54.320 You get two bonus episodes on amazing themes such as 2:09:54.520 --> 2:10:00.680 wedding Webruary. What a bargain and plus you get access 2:10:00.720 --> 2:10:04.640 to the entire back catalog. So check that out. Check 2:10:04.640 --> 2:10:07.880 out our link tree, our letterbox. You know, give us 2:10:08.280 --> 2:10:13.560 five nipples on your listening platform, all that good stuff, follow. 2:10:13.360 --> 2:10:17.040 Us on Instagram, and most of all, follow your heart. 2:10:17.800 --> 2:10:22.600 And with that, listeners, let's get in the car and always. 2:10:22.280 --> 2:10:26.960 Say it we Bye bye Street, Bye shopping Mall, I Cry, 2:10:26.960 --> 2:10:34.960 Bye surfer Boys, Bye Los Angeles, Goodbye Porpoise Spit. What 2:10:35.120 --> 2:10:40.960 a just I'd live there, No, I wouldn't, No horrible play. 2:10:41.040 --> 2:10:47.680 Goodbye Porpoise Spit, Bye Bye. The Bechdel Cast is a 2:10:47.680 --> 2:10:51.840 production of iHeartMedia, hosted by Caitlin Derante and Jamie Loftus, 2:10:51.920 --> 2:10:55.760 produced by Sophie Lichterman, edited by Mola Board. Our theme 2:10:55.800 --> 2:10:59.920 song was composed by Mike Kaplan with vocals by Catherine Voskresenski. 2:11:00.520 --> 2:11:03.840 Our logo in merch is designed by Jamie Loftus and 2:11:03.920 --> 2:11:07.760 a special thanks to Aristotle Acevedo. For more information about 2:11:07.800 --> 2:11:10.800 the podcast, please visit linktree, slash Bechdelcast