1 00:00:06,920 --> 00:00:16,319 Speaker 1: Diversion podcasts. Hey, this is Stephen Talty, the host of 2 00:00:16,320 --> 00:00:21,280 Speaker 1: this podcast, Good Assassin's Hunting the Butcher. This podcast project 3 00:00:21,480 --> 00:00:23,880 Speaker 1: came out of my work on a related book called 4 00:00:24,000 --> 00:00:27,040 Speaker 1: The Good Assassin. If you want to explore other parts 5 00:00:27,080 --> 00:00:29,840 Speaker 1: of this story, check it out. It's not just a 6 00:00:29,880 --> 00:00:33,000 Speaker 1: book version of the podcast. I spend time on different 7 00:00:33,040 --> 00:00:35,920 Speaker 1: aspects of the mission. There are chapters diving into World 8 00:00:35,960 --> 00:00:38,760 Speaker 1: War two history that we didn't cover in the podcast, 9 00:00:39,200 --> 00:00:41,320 Speaker 1: and the book works as a kind of a companion 10 00:00:41,479 --> 00:00:45,080 Speaker 1: to the listening experience. You can purchase a copy of 11 00:00:45,120 --> 00:00:49,680 Speaker 1: The Good Assassin on Amazon, Apple Books, and on bookshop 12 00:00:50,040 --> 00:00:57,480 Speaker 1: dot Org. Thanks a note, this episode contains descriptions of 13 00:00:57,520 --> 00:01:10,800 Speaker 1: graphic violence listeners describe and is advised. Mio was happy 14 00:01:10,880 --> 00:01:14,880 Speaker 1: to be back in Paris. His children had missed him. 15 00:01:14,880 --> 00:01:17,440 Speaker 1: His young son, in fact, had asked so many times 16 00:01:17,440 --> 00:01:20,160 Speaker 1: when his father was coming home that MEA's wife arranged 17 00:01:20,200 --> 00:01:22,760 Speaker 1: for a friend to call and pretend to be her husband. 18 00:01:23,440 --> 00:01:25,400 Speaker 1: But when the boy got on the line, he knew 19 00:01:25,440 --> 00:01:28,280 Speaker 1: the voice on the other end wasn't Meos and he'd 20 00:01:28,280 --> 00:01:32,600 Speaker 1: been crushed. So he was overjoyed that his father was 21 00:01:32,680 --> 00:01:39,679 Speaker 1: finally home. But me his mission wasn't completed. The final 22 00:01:39,720 --> 00:01:45,000 Speaker 1: act was still to take place in Uruguay and in 23 00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:48,639 Speaker 1: your's apartment in the heart of Paris. The team started 24 00:01:48,680 --> 00:02:04,840 Speaker 1: putting the pieces together. I'm Stephen Talty and this as 25 00:02:04,880 --> 00:02:14,000 Speaker 1: good assassin's hunting the butcher. The first pile was to 26 00:02:14,520 --> 00:02:18,040 Speaker 1: find and not bendling forward file. The second clock was 27 00:02:18,320 --> 00:02:24,160 Speaker 1: mine a Nazi and hearing we must thwart this shameful 28 00:02:24,280 --> 00:02:26,960 Speaker 1: pass the end of a trail of blood and horror, 29 00:02:27,320 --> 00:02:29,440 Speaker 1: the end of a man whose name will be written 30 00:02:29,480 --> 00:02:52,880 Speaker 1: in the end Episode eight, the ticking clock. There was 31 00:02:52,919 --> 00:02:57,320 Speaker 1: a lot of work to do. We've had collected all 32 00:02:57,320 --> 00:03:00,680 Speaker 1: the letters and telegrams that Meo had said from the field. 33 00:03:01,600 --> 00:03:04,760 Speaker 1: Neo had brought back maps of Montevideo and sal Polo, 34 00:03:05,440 --> 00:03:09,079 Speaker 1: lots of information on hotels and unning cars and the 35 00:03:09,160 --> 00:03:13,280 Speaker 1: vacation home market. He'd written down exactly what he needed 36 00:03:13,280 --> 00:03:15,960 Speaker 1: to go through passport control and what problems the other 37 00:03:15,960 --> 00:03:19,920 Speaker 1: team members might find. Nothing could be left to chance. 38 00:03:21,160 --> 00:03:23,200 Speaker 1: There was a file on Zookers, what he was like, 39 00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:26,240 Speaker 1: what he didn't like, what his habits were. But they 40 00:03:26,240 --> 00:03:29,400 Speaker 1: still didn't have a place with the assassination could be 41 00:03:29,400 --> 00:03:32,360 Speaker 1: carried out. They didn't even know how it was going 42 00:03:32,400 --> 00:03:36,560 Speaker 1: to be carried out. On the trip back to France, 43 00:03:36,840 --> 00:03:39,520 Speaker 1: knew I had given some thought to that. He was 44 00:03:39,640 --> 00:03:43,680 Speaker 1: very straightforward about it, he later wrote in his memoir. 45 00:03:45,440 --> 00:03:48,560 Speaker 1: I pointed out that the distant sniper shot was not, 46 00:03:49,200 --> 00:03:53,880 Speaker 1: in my opinion, at least a shootable option, most because 47 00:03:54,040 --> 00:03:57,120 Speaker 1: of the noise and because it would not allow us 48 00:03:57,120 --> 00:04:01,440 Speaker 1: to give him the clue. Degrass I also rejected the 49 00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:05,920 Speaker 1: use of poison. I gave detailed the count of the 50 00:04:06,080 --> 00:04:10,520 Speaker 1: so called drinking night I had set up the Japanese nightclub. 51 00:04:11,720 --> 00:04:14,840 Speaker 1: I mentioned his strange habit of sipping his drink in 52 00:04:14,920 --> 00:04:21,239 Speaker 1: an ever so slow, almost nerve wracking fashion. The sniper 53 00:04:21,240 --> 00:04:24,119 Speaker 1: shot would have been a possibility if they've been carrying 54 00:04:24,120 --> 00:04:27,360 Speaker 1: out the assassination on their home soil, but the team 55 00:04:27,400 --> 00:04:30,240 Speaker 1: had a factor in their need to escape. It was 56 00:04:30,279 --> 00:04:33,719 Speaker 1: always a temptation to devote more time to figuring out 57 00:04:33,960 --> 00:04:36,960 Speaker 1: how to eliminate a target than to figuring out how 58 00:04:36,960 --> 00:04:39,920 Speaker 1: to get away once you've done it. They couldn't fall 59 00:04:39,920 --> 00:04:44,320 Speaker 1: into that trap. Bessad wanted everyone to suspect that Israel 60 00:04:44,520 --> 00:04:47,320 Speaker 1: had carried out the killing, but it didn't want any 61 00:04:47,320 --> 00:04:50,880 Speaker 1: of its agents to actually get caught. That could lead 62 00:04:50,880 --> 00:04:57,960 Speaker 1: to interrogations and other things. What they were doing wasn't legal. 63 00:04:58,279 --> 00:05:00,320 Speaker 1: Secris wasn't going to get a trial or have a 64 00:05:00,400 --> 00:05:05,520 Speaker 1: lawyer like Adafikman had got after Massad kidnapped him. They 65 00:05:05,520 --> 00:05:09,719 Speaker 1: didn't want Massad to be the story. They wanted Suckers 66 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:13,200 Speaker 1: to be the story. So the team members had to 67 00:05:13,240 --> 00:05:16,240 Speaker 1: carry out the killing, gather their belongings, and head to 68 00:05:16,279 --> 00:05:19,159 Speaker 1: the airport. They had to get on the plane and 69 00:05:19,200 --> 00:05:23,240 Speaker 1: get safely back to Europe before Sucker's body was discovered. 70 00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:27,240 Speaker 1: That influenced how the assassination would be carried out. It 71 00:05:27,320 --> 00:05:30,679 Speaker 1: couldn't be public, it couldn't be loud, and the body 72 00:05:30,680 --> 00:05:33,240 Speaker 1: had to be left out of sight so that someone 73 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:36,080 Speaker 1: didn't stumble on it and raise the alarm before the 74 00:05:36,120 --> 00:05:39,520 Speaker 1: agents had time to leave the country. A hotel room, 75 00:05:39,520 --> 00:05:42,760 Speaker 1: for example, was out the maid would find the body 76 00:05:43,200 --> 00:05:47,839 Speaker 1: too quickly. Neo gave the finale a lot of thought. 77 00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:52,040 Speaker 1: It was his call. He had met Sukers. He had 78 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:54,280 Speaker 1: a better sense of what would work than you, even 79 00:05:54,279 --> 00:05:58,279 Speaker 1: the others who've been busy training. But by the time 80 00:05:58,279 --> 00:06:02,039 Speaker 1: he met with the team, me had an idea. I 81 00:06:02,160 --> 00:06:07,279 Speaker 1: believe that's the best way is to lure him into 82 00:06:07,320 --> 00:06:11,920 Speaker 1: a house where an elimination unit will be waiting for him. 83 00:06:12,040 --> 00:06:15,680 Speaker 1: From my intense and intimate acquaintance with the late one, 84 00:06:16,400 --> 00:06:19,880 Speaker 1: and from the numerous hours we have spent together, which 85 00:06:19,960 --> 00:06:24,560 Speaker 1: have included many visits to various rental sights, I'm convinced 86 00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:28,840 Speaker 1: he will enter any house I do. He trusts me, 87 00:06:29,880 --> 00:06:33,719 Speaker 1: but get him. Ron, the former messodge and military historian, 88 00:06:34,160 --> 00:06:36,760 Speaker 1: learned later what Mia wasn't aware of at the time. 89 00:06:37,160 --> 00:06:40,920 Speaker 1: Suchers did not trust Anton Kunzla as much as he believed. 90 00:06:42,560 --> 00:06:46,200 Speaker 1: Still the last moment, was not fully sure that the 91 00:06:46,240 --> 00:06:50,440 Speaker 1: meal is kosher. He took a picture of meal, gave 92 00:06:50,520 --> 00:06:54,240 Speaker 1: it to his wife and told her, if something happens 93 00:06:54,279 --> 00:06:58,800 Speaker 1: to me, if I don't come back, this is the killer. 94 00:06:58,920 --> 00:07:02,559 Speaker 1: He killed me. It was a plan, but it wasn't 95 00:07:02,600 --> 00:07:06,520 Speaker 1: fool proof. Zukers had already shown that he was suspicious. 96 00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:10,160 Speaker 1: He seemed to trust MEO and some little thing would 97 00:07:10,160 --> 00:07:12,559 Speaker 1: send him off and they were almost back to zero again. 98 00:07:13,400 --> 00:07:18,080 Speaker 1: That was the first risk. The second was Zuker's physical strength. 99 00:07:19,000 --> 00:07:21,480 Speaker 1: Mio knew that you're reeve and the team members getting 100 00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:23,960 Speaker 1: tired of his warnings about how tough the butcher was, 101 00:07:24,520 --> 00:07:27,240 Speaker 1: but he didn't care. He was a lead agent. This 102 00:07:27,360 --> 00:07:31,160 Speaker 1: was his mission. You had to see the guy to understand. 103 00:07:31,800 --> 00:07:35,880 Speaker 1: He looked like a competitive weightlifter, so Mio kept at it. 104 00:07:36,400 --> 00:07:39,160 Speaker 1: He told your Reeve again about how Zukers was a 105 00:07:39,280 --> 00:07:43,560 Speaker 1: highly mistrustful man, acutely vigilant, armed with a gun, and 106 00:07:43,640 --> 00:07:47,600 Speaker 1: of great physical strength. You're reeve nodded, but he was 107 00:07:47,600 --> 00:07:51,560 Speaker 1: probably thinking Meo was getting a little paranoid himself. Massad 108 00:07:51,600 --> 00:07:55,200 Speaker 1: agents were war veterans. They killed before the butcher was 109 00:07:55,280 --> 00:07:58,680 Speaker 1: sixty four years old. They would take care of him 110 00:07:58,760 --> 00:08:02,120 Speaker 1: without any problem. You Reef told me, oh, he'd done 111 00:08:02,120 --> 00:08:04,720 Speaker 1: a good job. But for the killed team getting the 112 00:08:04,760 --> 00:08:08,160 Speaker 1: butcher inside the house, that was the tricky part. They 113 00:08:08,160 --> 00:08:11,960 Speaker 1: would take care of the rest. If four strong Israelis 114 00:08:12,200 --> 00:08:16,760 Speaker 1: couldn't handle a senior citizen, well, then Massad was in trouble. 115 00:08:22,200 --> 00:08:24,960 Speaker 1: You Reef went over MEO's plan and quickly approved it, 116 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:29,120 Speaker 1: and he confirmed one important detail before the sentence was 117 00:08:29,160 --> 00:08:31,680 Speaker 1: carried out. The team would read out a verdict in 118 00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:34,040 Speaker 1: the name of the thirty thousand men, women and children 119 00:08:34,400 --> 00:08:38,080 Speaker 1: that Sukers had helped kill. Would be like a judge's 120 00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:41,800 Speaker 1: sentence would show the world the Israelis had given serious 121 00:08:41,840 --> 00:08:45,040 Speaker 1: thought to why Sukers had to die. In no way 122 00:08:45,080 --> 00:08:48,480 Speaker 1: could the execution be equated with the death of his victims. 123 00:08:49,320 --> 00:08:53,000 Speaker 1: They had to show that they had carefully considered his crimes. 124 00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:59,760 Speaker 1: This was justice, not vengeance. This raised an intriguing possibility. 125 00:09:00,360 --> 00:09:01,880 Speaker 1: If they were going to take the time to read 126 00:09:01,880 --> 00:09:07,120 Speaker 1: the charges, maybe Sucres would respond. Maybe he'd even defend himself. 127 00:09:07,920 --> 00:09:11,280 Speaker 1: Maybe I thought he'd tell the Israelis why he'd done 128 00:09:11,360 --> 00:09:14,680 Speaker 1: what he'd done. In my quest to know the motives 129 00:09:14,679 --> 00:09:17,920 Speaker 1: behind his actions, this would be a perfect time for 130 00:09:18,000 --> 00:09:22,640 Speaker 1: Suckers himself to tell his story. Or if he was 131 00:09:22,679 --> 00:09:26,840 Speaker 1: truly an anti Semite at heart, maybe facing five Jewish 132 00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:31,120 Speaker 1: assassins would reveal that. Maybe he'd shout some abuse at 133 00:09:31,160 --> 00:09:34,680 Speaker 1: the team. They would at least be a clue. But 134 00:09:34,800 --> 00:09:37,880 Speaker 1: one thing was for sure. With this plan, there would 135 00:09:37,880 --> 00:09:41,080 Speaker 1: be a chance for Zukers to finally tell the truth. 136 00:09:43,480 --> 00:09:46,600 Speaker 1: Mia was satisfied all the work he'd put in had 137 00:09:46,600 --> 00:09:50,440 Speaker 1: been vindicated. They were going ahead with his plan. The 138 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:53,400 Speaker 1: debate in the German Parliament was coming up in a 139 00:09:53,440 --> 00:09:58,240 Speaker 1: few months. They all hoped a successful mission would influence 140 00:09:58,320 --> 00:10:05,040 Speaker 1: it On the ninth of November, a letter arrived the 141 00:10:05,120 --> 00:10:08,520 Speaker 1: Rotterdam po box that MEO had set up months earlier. 142 00:10:08,960 --> 00:10:15,480 Speaker 1: It was from Zuker's. Following your request, I hereby enclosed 143 00:10:15,480 --> 00:10:19,080 Speaker 1: my flight ticket from sal Follow to Monte Video went back, 144 00:10:19,960 --> 00:10:24,760 Speaker 1: as well as a few other receipts for personal expenses. 145 00:10:25,679 --> 00:10:29,600 Speaker 1: I hope you arrival in Rotterdam and said to all 146 00:10:29,640 --> 00:10:35,559 Speaker 1: these films this you hoping to see you soon. This friendship. 147 00:10:36,679 --> 00:10:41,920 Speaker 1: Heppert so cares. The team was pleased. The butcher was 148 00:10:41,960 --> 00:10:44,679 Speaker 1: taking the bait, but me A waited over a month, 149 00:10:44,760 --> 00:10:47,960 Speaker 1: said a reply. He wanted it to seem like he 150 00:10:48,040 --> 00:10:51,360 Speaker 1: was a busy man putting deals together. He couldn't appear 151 00:10:51,440 --> 00:10:57,280 Speaker 1: to be too eager. Dear Abert, I thank you for 152 00:10:57,320 --> 00:11:01,280 Speaker 1: your letter and forms of receipts you sent. Everything here 153 00:11:01,360 --> 00:11:03,920 Speaker 1: is running as it should, and as far as business 154 00:11:04,040 --> 00:11:08,280 Speaker 1: is concerned, I have nothing to complain about. My associates 155 00:11:08,320 --> 00:11:10,600 Speaker 1: are very pleased with the outcome of the trip to 156 00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:15,520 Speaker 1: South America to Grasil and Uruguay. I intend to return 157 00:11:15,559 --> 00:11:18,200 Speaker 1: to South America in the coming weeks in order to 158 00:11:18,280 --> 00:11:23,200 Speaker 1: realize and implement various investment plans. I should therefore be 159 00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:26,720 Speaker 1: grateful to you if you could manage soon after receiving 160 00:11:26,760 --> 00:11:31,320 Speaker 1: this letter to make the necessary arrangements to Chile and Uruguay. 161 00:11:31,920 --> 00:11:34,840 Speaker 1: I'm enclosing a banker's check for one hundred dollars to 162 00:11:34,920 --> 00:11:39,240 Speaker 1: cover your expenses. Please inform me by telegram when all 163 00:11:39,240 --> 00:11:42,199 Speaker 1: the necessary papers are in your hands and you are 164 00:11:42,200 --> 00:11:45,160 Speaker 1: ready for the trip. A happy New Year to you 165 00:11:45,240 --> 00:11:48,560 Speaker 1: and your family. Hope to see you soon. Your friend 166 00:11:49,120 --> 00:12:00,960 Speaker 1: and Tom Kumslay your rearranged with MASSAD headquarters to provide 167 00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:05,320 Speaker 1: new identities for the other team members, fake names, passports 168 00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:08,000 Speaker 1: and backstories that would give them a reason for being 169 00:12:08,000 --> 00:12:12,920 Speaker 1: in Uruguay. The men spent hours memorizing the details. They 170 00:12:13,000 --> 00:12:16,320 Speaker 1: learned a few key phrases in Spanish and Portuguese in 171 00:12:16,360 --> 00:12:18,360 Speaker 1: case they were stopped by the police or had some 172 00:12:18,400 --> 00:12:21,840 Speaker 1: other problem. The four team members were almost done with 173 00:12:21,880 --> 00:12:26,760 Speaker 1: their training, and Crabmagaw, the Israeli fighting system Emmi Lichtenfeld 174 00:12:26,880 --> 00:12:29,800 Speaker 1: was working them hard. Neil wasn't part of the training. 175 00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:33,400 Speaker 1: His job was to get the butcher into the room. 176 00:12:33,480 --> 00:12:37,880 Speaker 1: That was it. They practiced the same maneuvers over and 177 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:41,920 Speaker 1: over again. Watching the sessions, Neil later wrote he thought 178 00:12:41,920 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 1: the instructor had the graceful movements with dancer Lichtenfeld's feet 179 00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:50,600 Speaker 1: slid across the floor soundlessly as he avoided knight thrust 180 00:12:50,920 --> 00:12:54,720 Speaker 1: and club swinging at his head. But according to Emi 181 00:12:54,800 --> 00:12:59,240 Speaker 1: Lichtenfeld student a yl Yanilov, his graceful nature would never 182 00:12:59,320 --> 00:13:04,280 Speaker 1: have been mistake in for weakness. So Emi was differently 183 00:13:05,080 --> 00:13:09,080 Speaker 1: with very high level of refined movements. So like Muhammad 184 00:13:09,080 --> 00:13:13,000 Speaker 1: Ali said, he say that's like about the fly sing, 185 00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:17,960 Speaker 1: Then the Krapma God teacher could look a little scary. 186 00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:20,959 Speaker 1: In his white karate tunic, he had a glass of 187 00:13:21,040 --> 00:13:24,000 Speaker 1: eye and half his face was frozen from an injury 188 00:13:24,040 --> 00:13:27,280 Speaker 1: he had sustained on his journey to Palestine. He's spoke 189 00:13:27,320 --> 00:13:30,400 Speaker 1: in a deep, bare tone with a slight lisp caused 190 00:13:30,400 --> 00:13:32,319 Speaker 1: by an injury to the left side of his mouth. 191 00:13:33,200 --> 00:13:36,800 Speaker 1: Krama God did require slight adjustments for the mission, having 192 00:13:36,800 --> 00:13:40,320 Speaker 1: been invented to save Jewish lives, was defensive in nature. 193 00:13:41,000 --> 00:13:44,320 Speaker 1: It's core philosophy was do whatever is needed to cause 194 00:13:44,320 --> 00:13:47,120 Speaker 1: as much damage as possible to your attacker and get 195 00:13:47,120 --> 00:13:52,079 Speaker 1: away safely. But in Uruguay the massadman would be the aggressors. 196 00:13:53,400 --> 00:13:56,920 Speaker 1: All knows how Emi would have instructed the team to 197 00:13:57,080 --> 00:14:01,640 Speaker 1: locate the target's weak spot. He will tell them the 198 00:14:01,840 --> 00:14:05,280 Speaker 1: slight to the most sensitive points to be very efficient 199 00:14:05,360 --> 00:14:09,199 Speaker 1: in their striking with open hand or with closed fist. 200 00:14:10,360 --> 00:14:13,200 Speaker 1: So he's very strongly to the knee, to the sole, 201 00:14:13,280 --> 00:14:16,360 Speaker 1: reflexes to the floating griegs, liver and sleep. Go up 202 00:14:16,400 --> 00:14:19,800 Speaker 1: at this line of the neck. Front of the neck. 203 00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:23,040 Speaker 1: Back of the neck is extremely efficient. Go to the 204 00:14:23,040 --> 00:14:25,320 Speaker 1: line of the drop to coast one cushion. Go to 205 00:14:25,480 --> 00:14:28,200 Speaker 1: the line of the eyes, especially the temples. So these 206 00:14:28,200 --> 00:14:31,160 Speaker 1: are strikes that will coastal cushion and we make the 207 00:14:31,240 --> 00:14:36,120 Speaker 1: person who groogi full down. They practiced disarming a target 208 00:14:36,160 --> 00:14:38,840 Speaker 1: as Mill had told them. Sekers carried a gun everywhere, 209 00:14:39,480 --> 00:14:42,240 Speaker 1: and Cromaga, if there was a gun involved in a fight, 210 00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:46,040 Speaker 1: who always assumed it would be fired. But the massad 211 00:14:46,080 --> 00:14:50,080 Speaker 1: agents wanted to immobilize Seekers before he could drive, so 212 00:14:50,120 --> 00:14:53,040 Speaker 1: they practiced a blow from the back they hoped would 213 00:14:53,040 --> 00:14:56,880 Speaker 1: bring the butcher down. A l can imagine what the 214 00:14:56,920 --> 00:15:00,840 Speaker 1: team was going through. He vividly remembers how hard Amy 215 00:15:01,320 --> 00:15:04,840 Speaker 1: pushed him in his own training. He said, do again, 216 00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:08,280 Speaker 1: not good, do do again, not go, do again twenty times, 217 00:15:08,360 --> 00:15:11,080 Speaker 1: No good. Do again. I didn't even know what you 218 00:15:11,120 --> 00:15:13,320 Speaker 1: wanted from me. What should I do? In that sense? 219 00:15:13,360 --> 00:15:17,640 Speaker 1: I think I just too eventually, So when you think 220 00:15:17,680 --> 00:15:22,960 Speaker 1: about it, it's just the agile. You have to do 221 00:15:23,120 --> 00:15:27,800 Speaker 1: something you know doing, go did do better? That's it. 222 00:15:30,080 --> 00:15:34,080 Speaker 1: You read could fear a meat and Sudie practice. Kick 223 00:15:34,120 --> 00:15:37,440 Speaker 1: after kick they paired off and rain blows down on 224 00:15:37,520 --> 00:15:41,960 Speaker 1: the head of their opponents. Lintenbell believed the knuckles were 225 00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:44,520 Speaker 1: too delicate for a good smash to the face. He 226 00:15:44,600 --> 00:15:48,000 Speaker 1: preferred the meaty base of the hand, or even better, 227 00:15:48,480 --> 00:15:54,200 Speaker 1: the elbow balance was key. Kick returned to position, Kick 228 00:15:54,480 --> 00:16:00,520 Speaker 1: returned to position. Kick, They drilled and drilled. We made 229 00:16:00,560 --> 00:16:03,400 Speaker 1: the experience that much more exhausting for the men was 230 00:16:03,440 --> 00:16:06,000 Speaker 1: that Mio wasn't even doing theneath for us, and the 231 00:16:06,040 --> 00:16:08,800 Speaker 1: rest of it kept reminding them they were about to 232 00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:13,680 Speaker 1: face a raging animal. Remember the late one is a 233 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:17,680 Speaker 1: strong man, and he's always armed. Even your Reeve grew 234 00:16:17,720 --> 00:16:23,280 Speaker 1: impatient with him. Meo exaggerates a bit will overcome, so 235 00:16:23,480 --> 00:16:30,320 Speaker 1: cooes without any problem. It was MEO's turn to be annoyed. 236 00:16:31,200 --> 00:16:34,680 Speaker 1: These Raeli Is always believed they could solve any problem. 237 00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:38,960 Speaker 1: Typical saber bullshit. He was worried they were going to 238 00:16:39,040 --> 00:16:47,400 Speaker 1: mess up his operation. Are you curious about something you've 239 00:16:47,400 --> 00:16:49,800 Speaker 1: heard on Hunting the Butcher and want to know more? 240 00:16:50,600 --> 00:16:53,200 Speaker 1: Is there something I haven't covered that you wish I would? 241 00:16:53,880 --> 00:16:56,400 Speaker 1: I want to hear from you. We've set up an 242 00:16:56,400 --> 00:16:59,880 Speaker 1: email address for listeners to send us questions about the show. 243 00:17:00,600 --> 00:17:04,520 Speaker 1: We've received some amazing, thoughtful questions so far, and we'd 244 00:17:04,520 --> 00:17:08,600 Speaker 1: love to hear more. Record yourself asking your question, include 245 00:17:08,600 --> 00:17:11,280 Speaker 1: your name and where you're from, and we'll try to 246 00:17:11,320 --> 00:17:15,240 Speaker 1: answer your question on a future episode. The email address 247 00:17:15,480 --> 00:17:20,920 Speaker 1: is Hunting the Butcher at Diversion Podcasts dot com. Record 248 00:17:20,920 --> 00:17:24,200 Speaker 1: yourself asking a question and email it to me. The 249 00:17:24,320 --> 00:17:29,119 Speaker 1: voice memos app on iPhone works well for recording yourself again. 250 00:17:29,560 --> 00:17:33,640 Speaker 1: The email address is Hunting the Butcher at Diversion Podcasts 251 00:17:34,000 --> 00:17:38,680 Speaker 1: dot com. That's podcasts plural. I'm looking forward to hearing 252 00:17:38,720 --> 00:18:04,359 Speaker 1: your questions. Thanks, you're even The others took all of 253 00:18:04,440 --> 00:18:07,800 Speaker 1: MEO's notes, the telegrams and letters, his thoughts on the 254 00:18:07,880 --> 00:18:11,879 Speaker 1: kill method and honed them into a working paper. It 255 00:18:11,920 --> 00:18:16,800 Speaker 1: included maps, even timetables to and from different landmarks in Montevideo. 256 00:18:18,160 --> 00:18:20,560 Speaker 1: They looked at the maps searching for the right neighborhood 257 00:18:20,600 --> 00:18:23,520 Speaker 1: to rent a house. They bought summer clothes that would 258 00:18:23,520 --> 00:18:26,240 Speaker 1: be right for Uruguay, and they went to various banks 259 00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:31,920 Speaker 1: and changed money for Uruguay and pesos. Then they began 260 00:18:31,960 --> 00:18:35,480 Speaker 1: to look for a staging ground for the operation, a 261 00:18:35,520 --> 00:18:38,760 Speaker 1: place where they could fly into, getting organized and prepare 262 00:18:38,880 --> 00:18:41,320 Speaker 1: for D Day. They didn't want to be hanging around 263 00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:48,400 Speaker 1: Uruguay for weeks attracting attention. They chose Buenos Aires. Meo 264 00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:51,359 Speaker 1: never revealed the reason why they chose it, but my 265 00:18:51,520 --> 00:18:55,040 Speaker 1: theory is that it was a big city, cosmopolitan. He 266 00:18:55,160 --> 00:18:58,320 Speaker 1: got visitors from all over the world. They wouldn't stick 267 00:18:58,320 --> 00:19:00,880 Speaker 1: out there, so it was a good place to lay low. 268 00:19:02,760 --> 00:19:06,159 Speaker 1: All of this work and planning took about two months. 269 00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:10,199 Speaker 1: The world took no notice of their mission. The Beatles 270 00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:14,080 Speaker 1: released a new album, Beatles for Sale, and college students 271 00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:18,760 Speaker 1: in America were staging protests against the Vietnam War. As 272 00:19:18,760 --> 00:19:23,120 Speaker 1: for France, he was preparing for Winter Olympics. No one 273 00:19:23,359 --> 00:19:26,520 Speaker 1: paid any mind to the men entering and leaving the 274 00:19:26,600 --> 00:19:36,320 Speaker 1: little apartment on the avenue they were side jan Another 275 00:19:36,440 --> 00:19:42,600 Speaker 1: letter arrived in the Rotterdam po box her col I 276 00:19:42,760 --> 00:19:47,560 Speaker 1: completed all the arrangements as you asked, I have to passport, 277 00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:52,520 Speaker 1: including the visas for Uruguaya and Chile, waiting for your 278 00:19:52,680 --> 00:19:57,160 Speaker 1: arrival and for for the details concerning our joint business trip. 279 00:19:58,600 --> 00:20:04,080 Speaker 1: This friendship ever took us. In the note, Zuker seemed 280 00:20:04,080 --> 00:20:07,000 Speaker 1: a little more nervous than in the previous one. Did 281 00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:09,919 Speaker 1: the line about waiting for further details mean that he 282 00:20:09,960 --> 00:20:13,760 Speaker 1: was having doubts? If the details weren't what he expected, 283 00:20:14,280 --> 00:20:28,439 Speaker 1: would he refuse to leave Brazil? Nobody knew. The agents 284 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:31,800 Speaker 1: booked their airline tickets. Each member would be traveling separately. 285 00:20:32,200 --> 00:20:35,879 Speaker 1: They didn't want to look like a team. Before their departures, 286 00:20:36,160 --> 00:20:38,600 Speaker 1: the five men met for a final time in the 287 00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:42,720 Speaker 1: Paris apartment. They went over the plan. They double checked 288 00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:45,840 Speaker 1: and triple checked everything. There was nothing left to do 289 00:20:45,920 --> 00:20:50,120 Speaker 1: in Paris. It was a solemn moment. We were all 290 00:20:50,160 --> 00:20:53,159 Speaker 1: aware that we were going to take the life of 291 00:20:53,160 --> 00:20:58,000 Speaker 1: a man, but none of us had any doubt this 292 00:20:58,320 --> 00:21:05,280 Speaker 1: was the just punishment for his statistic criminal Mio sat 293 00:21:05,320 --> 00:21:08,920 Speaker 1: down and wrote out a telegram for Suckers, including all 294 00:21:08,920 --> 00:21:13,560 Speaker 1: his travel plants. Then the members poured some drinks and 295 00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:17,520 Speaker 1: made a toast best of luck. Your reef told them 296 00:21:17,560 --> 00:21:20,560 Speaker 1: he wasn't much of a speech giver. The men kept 297 00:21:20,560 --> 00:21:25,359 Speaker 1: their private thoughts to themselves. They were eager to get going. 298 00:21:33,840 --> 00:21:36,600 Speaker 1: Three days later, Mio boarded his flight to sal Paolo. 299 00:21:37,359 --> 00:21:40,320 Speaker 1: He was going to Brazil first to reconnect with Suckers. 300 00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:44,159 Speaker 1: The other members would fly out later. Neo planned on 301 00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:47,760 Speaker 1: meeting Suckers in the airport transit lounge before flying on 302 00:21:47,960 --> 00:21:52,200 Speaker 1: to Buonos areas. He had to make sure the butcher 303 00:21:52,400 --> 00:21:55,280 Speaker 1: was all in. After twelve hours in the air, the 304 00:21:55,280 --> 00:21:59,240 Speaker 1: plane landed. Maa waited until after the other passengers got out, 305 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:02,520 Speaker 1: then walked toward the airplane door. At the top of 306 00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:05,560 Speaker 1: the jetway. He was heading down the stairs, lost in 307 00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:10,719 Speaker 1: his own thoughts. I heard Ruko's familiar voice. Hello, he Anton, 308 00:22:10,880 --> 00:22:14,159 Speaker 1: I am here. I looked down to the bottom of 309 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:18,760 Speaker 1: the stairs, and what did I see? Herbert Chukos wearing 310 00:22:18,760 --> 00:22:23,159 Speaker 1: a colorful tie, holding something black in one hand and 311 00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:26,960 Speaker 1: waving happily with the other. That black thing in the 312 00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:31,399 Speaker 1: butcher's hand, that was a camera. He was filming me. 313 00:22:31,520 --> 00:22:35,800 Speaker 1: Oh as he arrived, How on earth did he manage 314 00:22:35,840 --> 00:22:39,760 Speaker 1: to get in here? I wondered? This was a restricted area, 315 00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:42,520 Speaker 1: and we were supposed to meet in the transit lounge. 316 00:22:43,480 --> 00:22:46,760 Speaker 1: When Meo realized what the black object was, he was shocked. 317 00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:52,800 Speaker 1: This meant that Drukos was actually filming me, immortalizing my 318 00:22:52,960 --> 00:22:57,080 Speaker 1: image on film. Instinctively, I raised my hand as if 319 00:22:57,080 --> 00:23:00,919 Speaker 1: in greeting, but the motion was actually tended to hide 320 00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:04,480 Speaker 1: from the camera lens some of my mold distinguishing features. 321 00:23:07,359 --> 00:23:11,880 Speaker 1: It was a disaster. Suckers had sprung a trap. When 322 00:23:11,880 --> 00:23:14,720 Speaker 1: you're undercover, you want there to be no record of 323 00:23:14,760 --> 00:23:18,280 Speaker 1: your actual self in the mission. The documents all have 324 00:23:18,359 --> 00:23:21,720 Speaker 1: your cover name, not your real one. If you're photographed, 325 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:26,080 Speaker 1: who want to be wearing your disguise. This was a 326 00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:30,840 Speaker 1: time before the widespread use of surveillance cameras. Neo thought 327 00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:34,399 Speaker 1: he was safe, but now the butcher he had him 328 00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:38,640 Speaker 1: down on film. It was bad. That was only half 329 00:23:38,680 --> 00:23:41,879 Speaker 1: of it. The other half was why was Zuker's filming 330 00:23:41,960 --> 00:23:44,760 Speaker 1: him in the first place. As the two men had 331 00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:47,400 Speaker 1: been old friends. Meal might have passed it off as 332 00:23:47,440 --> 00:23:50,399 Speaker 1: his body wanting a memento of their trip, but that 333 00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:54,600 Speaker 1: wasn't it. This was Zukers being paranoid again. He wanted 334 00:23:54,600 --> 00:23:58,919 Speaker 1: to film as evidence, just in case, Kunzla was up 335 00:23:58,920 --> 00:24:02,240 Speaker 1: to no good. Sucker said he was ready to become partners, 336 00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:06,199 Speaker 1: but clearly he still had his doubts. He'll never be 337 00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:10,840 Speaker 1: rid of his suspicions. I thought this concern. I was 338 00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:14,520 Speaker 1: fully convinced that this was yet another one of UCO's 339 00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:19,640 Speaker 1: security exercises. One false move the team might interpret as 340 00:24:19,720 --> 00:24:23,480 Speaker 1: my attempt to hide from the camera, and all my 341 00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:27,560 Speaker 1: months long efforts to win his trusts would come to nothing. 342 00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:32,440 Speaker 1: And in fact me it was right. The butcher didn't 343 00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:37,560 Speaker 1: trust him fully. Later, his wife nodded all police what happened. 344 00:24:37,640 --> 00:24:41,639 Speaker 1: When Sucers returned home, my husband told me that he 345 00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:46,480 Speaker 1: had filmed Kunzla coming off the plane. He emphasized that 346 00:24:46,560 --> 00:24:49,199 Speaker 1: if anything bad were to happen to him in the 347 00:24:49,240 --> 00:24:53,000 Speaker 1: near future, then it was this man seen on the 348 00:24:53,040 --> 00:24:57,960 Speaker 1: film waving at Harvard who would bear directed soul responsibility 349 00:24:58,080 --> 00:25:02,399 Speaker 1: for it. The film and the stills taken from it 350 00:25:02,520 --> 00:25:06,680 Speaker 1: would haunt the massad agent for years. When I discussed 351 00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:10,680 Speaker 1: this with Gad Shimron, he mentioned how significant this became. 352 00:25:11,280 --> 00:25:14,800 Speaker 1: This photo. For many years, uh Nio told me that 353 00:25:14,840 --> 00:25:17,400 Speaker 1: every time he crossed the border, somewhere on the road 354 00:25:17,480 --> 00:25:22,200 Speaker 1: there was a big interval coaster wanted for murder with 355 00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:27,120 Speaker 1: his picture as complet taken by a suspicious to much 356 00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:31,240 Speaker 1: so Mea was coming down the steps of the jetway 357 00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:34,600 Speaker 1: at the airport in Sal Paulo. He's holding up his 358 00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:37,879 Speaker 1: hands like he's waving it at Sukers a friendly greeting, 359 00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:40,680 Speaker 1: but in reality he's trying to block the view of 360 00:25:40,720 --> 00:25:44,160 Speaker 1: his face from the camera. He's trying to look smooth, natural, 361 00:25:44,640 --> 00:25:48,640 Speaker 1: but it isn't working. He looks awkward and nervous. He's 362 00:25:48,680 --> 00:25:53,720 Speaker 1: realized that Suckers has outsmarted him. Neo finally made it 363 00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:56,040 Speaker 1: down to the bottom of the chet way and Suckers 364 00:25:56,119 --> 00:25:59,280 Speaker 1: dropped the camera to his side. He greeted the agent. 365 00:25:59,720 --> 00:26:03,280 Speaker 1: It went into the transit lounge to talk Neis flight 366 00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:06,199 Speaker 1: to Buenos Aires was leaving soon, so they only had 367 00:26:06,240 --> 00:26:10,040 Speaker 1: a few minutes. They ordered drinks and Mio tried to 368 00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:12,800 Speaker 1: get back on track. He told Suckers he has some 369 00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:16,879 Speaker 1: good news. His partners had decided to invest heavily in 370 00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:21,159 Speaker 1: South America, hundreds of thousands of dollars at the very least, 371 00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:24,920 Speaker 1: and they'd agreed to bring Suekers on board. If he 372 00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:27,919 Speaker 1: played his cards right, he would soon be a rich man. 373 00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:33,280 Speaker 1: Zukers didn't react the way Meo had hoped. He said 374 00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:35,879 Speaker 1: he had a problem. It turned out that he hadn't 375 00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:38,560 Speaker 1: been telling the truth in his telegram, his visa and 376 00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:43,280 Speaker 1: other documents, they weren't ready yet. He couldn't fly to Uruguay. 377 00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:46,720 Speaker 1: It was getting worse. And worse was Zuker's backing out. 378 00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:49,960 Speaker 1: Had he realized he was being trapped or was he 379 00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:53,880 Speaker 1: just being lazy? Meo had no idea what was going on, 380 00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:56,920 Speaker 1: but he stayed in character, the character of the hard 381 00:26:57,000 --> 00:27:02,000 Speaker 1: charging businessman. He got angry and loud. How could you 382 00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:04,920 Speaker 1: do this? Did you say you want to be a businessman. 383 00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:08,600 Speaker 1: I am a businessman and I stick to my vote. 384 00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:12,760 Speaker 1: You want me said all your papers weren't older. I 385 00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:16,240 Speaker 1: want you to know that I am very, very disappointed. 386 00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:21,600 Speaker 1: He really was furious. If Sukers couldn't get out of Brazil, 387 00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:24,640 Speaker 1: the mission was off. There might not be a chance 388 00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:27,399 Speaker 1: to organize a second operation before the vote in the 389 00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:32,560 Speaker 1: German Parliament. The butcher had messed up everything. Zukers hung 390 00:27:32,600 --> 00:27:35,879 Speaker 1: his head. He was embarrassed, or he appeared to be embarrassed. 391 00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:39,840 Speaker 1: I promised it would never happen again to Mio. He 392 00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:43,840 Speaker 1: appeared to be sincere. After a few tense moments, Neo 393 00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:48,199 Speaker 1: calmed down. He told Seekers that Brazil was out. The 394 00:27:48,280 --> 00:27:51,440 Speaker 1: partners wanted to do their business in Uruguay and Chile, 395 00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:54,600 Speaker 1: so he wanted Seekers with him when he traveled to 396 00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:57,720 Speaker 1: the two countries. Neo took a lot of cash out 397 00:27:57,720 --> 00:28:01,439 Speaker 1: of his pocket handed it to the butcher traveling expenses. 398 00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:04,720 Speaker 1: He told the butcher to get his papers straightened down. 399 00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:07,240 Speaker 1: Once that was done, he would pay for his flight 400 00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:11,440 Speaker 1: to Uruguay, but he had to get moving. Suckers cheered up. 401 00:28:12,080 --> 00:28:14,439 Speaker 1: He agreed to get the visa a sap. He was 402 00:28:14,520 --> 00:28:17,480 Speaker 1: even a little cheeky. He asked if Meo had the 403 00:28:17,480 --> 00:28:20,520 Speaker 1: addresses of the hotels they'd be staying at in Montefdello. 404 00:28:21,280 --> 00:28:26,879 Speaker 1: Neo thought to himself, the best, that is forever cautious, 405 00:28:27,920 --> 00:28:30,840 Speaker 1: but he memorized the names of the hotel's just in case. 406 00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:34,520 Speaker 1: He recited them to Suckers, who wrote them down. It 407 00:28:34,680 --> 00:28:38,120 Speaker 1: was another test. At least Mio had passed this one. 408 00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:42,200 Speaker 1: A boarding announcement was made from MEO's flight to Buenos Aires. 409 00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:46,200 Speaker 1: The two men parted. Neo slapped Suckers on the shoulder, 410 00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:50,320 Speaker 1: told him not to let him down again. Then he 411 00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:57,480 Speaker 1: headed towards his departure. Game Neo landed in Buenos Aires, 412 00:28:57,720 --> 00:29:00,400 Speaker 1: took a taxi to his hotel. The most of the 413 00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:03,240 Speaker 1: team was still back in Paris. He needed to get 414 00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:05,720 Speaker 1: in touch with them to tell them the mission was 415 00:29:05,760 --> 00:29:10,120 Speaker 1: a go. But things started to go wrong. It turned 416 00:29:10,120 --> 00:29:12,760 Speaker 1: out that the telephone and post office workers had gone 417 00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:15,360 Speaker 1: on strike. It was one of those things you just 418 00:29:15,400 --> 00:29:19,800 Speaker 1: couldn't predict. But it didn't matter. Mio was screwed. He 419 00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:22,920 Speaker 1: couldn't communicate with your read. The team was waiting for 420 00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:26,280 Speaker 1: word from him that Seekers was still in play, but 421 00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:30,280 Speaker 1: Mio couldn't make a call or send a telegram. He 422 00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:34,440 Speaker 1: was stranded. Even worse, if the butcher was trying to 423 00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:37,640 Speaker 1: contact him, he had no way of knowing it. Maybe 424 00:29:37,640 --> 00:29:40,920 Speaker 1: Seekers was having trouble getting the right papers, Maybe he 425 00:29:40,920 --> 00:29:46,360 Speaker 1: had questions he needed answers to Mea was annoyed and worried. 426 00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:49,240 Speaker 1: Day after day, he checked with the front desk and 427 00:29:49,320 --> 00:29:52,920 Speaker 1: asked if any telegrams had come through. The answer was 428 00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:57,600 Speaker 1: always known. The city was in the communications lockdown. Nothing 429 00:29:57,680 --> 00:30:02,160 Speaker 1: was getting in or out, so Mia was going stir crazy. 430 00:30:02,640 --> 00:30:05,840 Speaker 1: He had nothing to do. And he hated that. To 431 00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:08,440 Speaker 1: get his mind off sukers, he took a trip to 432 00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:11,840 Speaker 1: a holiday resort called my adult Plata, but it was 433 00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:16,160 Speaker 1: off season. The place was half empty. Kind of depressing. Actually, 434 00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:19,320 Speaker 1: Lea went back to Bueness Areas, tried to pass the 435 00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:23,640 Speaker 1: time by taking long walks through the city. There were 436 00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:27,640 Speaker 1: no letters. When he got back to the hotel. He 437 00:30:27,720 --> 00:30:32,840 Speaker 1: was losing precious time. The clock was ticking and Germany's 438 00:30:32,920 --> 00:30:37,040 Speaker 1: vote on the amnesty statute was approaching fast. If the 439 00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:52,120 Speaker 1: mission didn't move forward soon, all would be lost. Hi, 440 00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:56,360 Speaker 1: this is Stephen Talty, host of Good Assassins Hunting the Butcher. 441 00:30:57,160 --> 00:30:59,600 Speaker 1: The folks that helped me bring you this show, Diversion 442 00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:03,200 Speaker 1: podcast Us have just launched another podcast that I think 443 00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:07,880 Speaker 1: you'll like. It's called Backstaged The Devil in Metal, a 444 00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:10,880 Speaker 1: deep dive into the history of metal music, filled with 445 00:31:11,040 --> 00:31:14,160 Speaker 1: never before heard interviews and stories from some of the 446 00:31:14,200 --> 00:31:19,200 Speaker 1: biggest names of music, including Black Sabbath, Judas, Priest Van Helen, 447 00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:24,400 Speaker 1: and many others. It's outrageous, raw and surprising at times. 448 00:31:25,120 --> 00:31:28,920 Speaker 1: Backstage The Devil in Metal is out now. Follow the 449 00:31:28,920 --> 00:31:32,720 Speaker 1: show on Apple Podcasts, I Hired Radio app or wherever 450 00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:47,200 Speaker 1: you listen to your podcasts. Finally, on February five, the 451 00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:51,360 Speaker 1: strike ended and the telegram arrived. It was from Zookers 452 00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:58,560 Speaker 1: Glato informula that all the preparations are complete. I have 453 00:31:58,680 --> 00:32:02,640 Speaker 1: the documents, I Theresa. They thing to hear from you 454 00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:07,840 Speaker 1: as to there, and then I joined you. Mea was overjoyed. 455 00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:10,760 Speaker 1: He wrote out a telegram to the Massad team in Paris. 456 00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:16,680 Speaker 1: Negotiations have finished and the transaction is about to take place. 457 00:32:17,360 --> 00:32:20,840 Speaker 1: Request you sent urgently the team of experts in order 458 00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:26,320 Speaker 1: to complete the transactions successfully Anton, it was time for 459 00:32:26,360 --> 00:32:35,120 Speaker 1: the team to come to Argentina. The Paris team started 460 00:32:35,200 --> 00:32:38,160 Speaker 1: arriving in Buenos Aires one by one and taking the 461 00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:41,880 Speaker 1: rooms in hotels downtown. Once they all made it in, 462 00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:44,520 Speaker 1: your reefs sent out the word that they should meet 463 00:32:44,840 --> 00:32:47,520 Speaker 1: one of the many cafes in the city. It would 464 00:32:47,520 --> 00:32:50,960 Speaker 1: get the latest details from Meo and prepare for Uruguay. 465 00:32:51,800 --> 00:32:54,840 Speaker 1: The men arrived at the cafe and shook hands. Then 466 00:32:54,840 --> 00:32:57,960 Speaker 1: they sat down and Mio gave them an update, recounting 467 00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:01,040 Speaker 1: the story of the movie Camera and Super Continuing fear 468 00:33:01,160 --> 00:33:05,200 Speaker 1: of being trapped, he warned them for the obtain time 469 00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:11,440 Speaker 1: about the butcher He's like a violent animal. The minute 470 00:33:11,440 --> 00:33:16,440 Speaker 1: the census that he has trapped, he muster all his strength. This, 471 00:33:16,800 --> 00:33:20,600 Speaker 1: it turned out, was actually true. Zucris was preparing for 472 00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:23,640 Speaker 1: his own flight to Uruguay, but before he left, he 473 00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:29,080 Speaker 1: told his family, if someone comes after me, I have 474 00:33:29,240 --> 00:33:34,760 Speaker 1: a fight until the death. Meo didn't know this. He 475 00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:36,880 Speaker 1: didn't know that Sucris had passed the film of Kunsla 476 00:33:37,000 --> 00:33:41,160 Speaker 1: arriving in Brazil to his wife. He knew Zucris was paranoid, 477 00:33:41,560 --> 00:33:46,880 Speaker 1: but he didn't know how deep it went. On February ten, 478 00:33:47,280 --> 00:33:50,400 Speaker 1: Meo flew into Manto. The Dao Uruguay and the others 479 00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:54,080 Speaker 1: soon followed. The debate over the statute of Limitations was 480 00:33:54,120 --> 00:33:56,760 Speaker 1: only a month away now in March, and then the 481 00:33:56,880 --> 00:34:01,680 Speaker 1: vote would follow in May. The clock continued to tick, 482 00:34:02,680 --> 00:34:05,080 Speaker 1: and the team still didn't have a house to carry 483 00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:08,960 Speaker 1: out the execution. That was the first subjective as they 484 00:34:08,960 --> 00:34:14,040 Speaker 1: did their final preparations, But once they settled into their hotels, 485 00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:17,840 Speaker 1: the team realized there was a problem. The city didn't 486 00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:22,040 Speaker 1: have that many houses for rent. Montefideo was a small place, 487 00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:24,799 Speaker 1: not a lot of tourists, and the houses that were 488 00:34:24,800 --> 00:34:29,680 Speaker 1: available were often run down. Laser Sudet, the agent who 489 00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:32,719 Speaker 1: tried to kill the German chancellor ten years before, was 490 00:34:32,760 --> 00:34:36,560 Speaker 1: given the job of finding a place. He had three requirements. 491 00:34:37,040 --> 00:34:38,960 Speaker 1: It had to look like it could be the headquarters 492 00:34:39,160 --> 00:34:42,080 Speaker 1: for a rich European company. It had to have some 493 00:34:42,120 --> 00:34:46,000 Speaker 1: sort of privacy so the noise of the assassination wasn't overheard. 494 00:34:47,080 --> 00:34:49,320 Speaker 1: And it had to be close to a major highway 495 00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:52,120 Speaker 1: so that the team could escape without getting lost in 496 00:34:52,200 --> 00:34:56,200 Speaker 1: a tangle of side streets. So Det contacted some real 497 00:34:56,280 --> 00:34:59,160 Speaker 1: estate agents. Every day he went looking at the houses 498 00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:02,560 Speaker 1: with them, and he slowly realized there was nothing that 499 00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:06,960 Speaker 1: fit his three requirements. Either the houses looked terrible, or 500 00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:09,400 Speaker 1: they had no privacy, or they weren't a part of 501 00:35:09,400 --> 00:35:12,040 Speaker 1: the city that was hard to get out of. The 502 00:35:12,080 --> 00:35:15,279 Speaker 1: team thought they'd planned for everything, but it was Murphy's law. 503 00:35:15,719 --> 00:35:20,960 Speaker 1: If something could go wrong, it would days passed. Finally, 504 00:35:21,000 --> 00:35:23,560 Speaker 1: a real estate agent called Sude. He was in a 505 00:35:23,560 --> 00:35:27,040 Speaker 1: good mood. He told Sude he found the perfect place. 506 00:35:27,680 --> 00:35:30,160 Speaker 1: The two of them drove out to see it. When 507 00:35:30,160 --> 00:35:33,440 Speaker 1: they pulled up to the house, Sude was happy. From 508 00:35:33,480 --> 00:35:36,800 Speaker 1: the street, the place looked good, It had a garden, 509 00:35:37,080 --> 00:35:39,480 Speaker 1: and it was in good shape. They walked up to 510 00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:42,839 Speaker 1: the front door and the agent rang the bell. As 511 00:35:42,880 --> 00:35:46,600 Speaker 1: soon as the door opened, Sedet's heart dropped. The guy 512 00:35:46,640 --> 00:35:49,919 Speaker 1: standing in the doorway had side curls, he was wearing 513 00:35:49,920 --> 00:35:54,840 Speaker 1: a yamaka. Sadet realized he was an Orthodox Jew. Sade 514 00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:59,000 Speaker 1: cursed under his breath. The homeowner smiled and invited the 515 00:35:59,040 --> 00:36:02,520 Speaker 1: two men in, but sud He just turned, walked down 516 00:36:02,560 --> 00:36:06,280 Speaker 1: the path and got into the car. If they rented 517 00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:09,160 Speaker 1: the house from this guy and Zucris was killed inside, 518 00:36:09,560 --> 00:36:12,640 Speaker 1: who knew what would happen. Some neo Nazis might fire 519 00:36:12,640 --> 00:36:15,799 Speaker 1: bomb the place, or the homeowner and his family could 520 00:36:15,800 --> 00:36:19,920 Speaker 1: become targets for nut jobs in the city. So it 521 00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:23,760 Speaker 1: was a no. Sudi couldn't risk. It was the right house, 522 00:36:24,160 --> 00:36:27,439 Speaker 1: but the wrong owner. The real estate agent got back 523 00:36:27,440 --> 00:36:32,560 Speaker 1: into the car. He was mortified, probably angry too. He 524 00:36:32,640 --> 00:36:38,320 Speaker 1: asked sud what was wrong. Sudet said, I don't like Jews. 525 00:36:39,120 --> 00:36:41,480 Speaker 1: His son told me the story when I visited him 526 00:36:41,480 --> 00:36:45,200 Speaker 1: in Israel. He says it reflects his father's very dark 527 00:36:45,239 --> 00:36:48,359 Speaker 1: sense of humor. He was always doing things like that. 528 00:36:48,960 --> 00:36:53,200 Speaker 1: It was just part of his personality. But despite Sudet's joke, 529 00:36:53,760 --> 00:36:56,080 Speaker 1: it was a bad day. The team still had no 530 00:36:56,160 --> 00:36:59,600 Speaker 1: place to carry out the final act and they were 531 00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:10,520 Speaker 1: running out of time. They were hitting a wall. They 532 00:37:10,560 --> 00:37:14,040 Speaker 1: looked all over Carrasco, a desirable part of monte Video 533 00:37:14,440 --> 00:37:17,919 Speaker 1: with nice vacation homes near the ocean that would look good, 534 00:37:18,560 --> 00:37:20,560 Speaker 1: but it was the middle of summer and there was 535 00:37:20,600 --> 00:37:26,640 Speaker 1: nothing available. Things were getting desperate. Then finally a stroke 536 00:37:26,719 --> 00:37:30,799 Speaker 1: of luck, the realtor found a place. In all the 537 00:37:30,840 --> 00:37:34,440 Speaker 1: massade reports I've seen, it has always been described as 538 00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:38,719 Speaker 1: a house in Carrasco in Montevideo, but the Uruguayan writer 539 00:37:38,840 --> 00:37:43,800 Speaker 1: Fernando Gudizoni told me that massade reports aren't exactly correct. 540 00:37:44,520 --> 00:37:48,360 Speaker 1: The house they ended up with was actually located somewhere else, 541 00:37:48,719 --> 00:37:52,120 Speaker 1: in another nearby town called Shangri La, which was not 542 00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:58,640 Speaker 1: the original plan. They have not They wishes to rent 543 00:37:58,840 --> 00:38:04,759 Speaker 1: a house in the city, but they can't. And Carrasco 544 00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:10,440 Speaker 1: was and Ea is now high level neighborhood. Sanglia was 545 00:38:10,480 --> 00:38:15,520 Speaker 1: a poor town and Shanglia is outside the city. Outside 546 00:38:16,280 --> 00:38:19,600 Speaker 1: it's not in Montevideo, and Carrasco is a part of 547 00:38:19,719 --> 00:38:26,280 Speaker 1: monte Video. There are two different realities, and you cross 548 00:38:26,800 --> 00:38:32,520 Speaker 1: pine forests two or three miles and after that you 549 00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:37,880 Speaker 1: go to Shanglia is also in a in a isolated 550 00:38:38,080 --> 00:38:42,040 Speaker 1: area in in a blog you have two or three 551 00:38:42,080 --> 00:38:49,280 Speaker 1: houses in summer. In winter is absolutely empty. The house 552 00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:57,120 Speaker 1: was small and humble, a little house, not a luxury house. 553 00:38:58,120 --> 00:39:03,600 Speaker 1: This was the only house have I about, so he 554 00:39:03,680 --> 00:39:06,920 Speaker 1: thought it had potential. The house wasn't in the best shape, 555 00:39:07,200 --> 00:39:10,160 Speaker 1: but it might work. One thing that bothered him, though, 556 00:39:10,560 --> 00:39:13,239 Speaker 1: was that there was some construction workers fixing the house 557 00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:16,040 Speaker 1: next door. If they heard a disturbance on the day 558 00:39:16,080 --> 00:39:19,000 Speaker 1: of the assassination, they might come looking for the cause, 559 00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:23,320 Speaker 1: or they might call the police. But said he was 560 00:39:23,400 --> 00:39:26,640 Speaker 1: running out of options. He brought me about to get 561 00:39:26,719 --> 00:39:29,239 Speaker 1: his opinion, and after a few minutes of looking the 562 00:39:29,239 --> 00:39:33,640 Speaker 1: place over, ne agreed there was nothing better. It would 563 00:39:33,680 --> 00:39:38,600 Speaker 1: have to do. There's another curious detail that I only 564 00:39:38,680 --> 00:39:43,560 Speaker 1: uncovered in my most recent research. In Massade reports, they 565 00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:47,480 Speaker 1: always referred to the house as Casa Kubertini. But when 566 00:39:47,480 --> 00:39:50,160 Speaker 1: I spoke to Buddhisoni, who knows the country like the 567 00:39:50,160 --> 00:39:52,920 Speaker 1: back of his hand and actually grew up in Shangri La, 568 00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:55,799 Speaker 1: he told me there's no record of the house ever 569 00:39:55,880 --> 00:40:01,960 Speaker 1: being called at in Uruguay. They Gotini that is named 570 00:40:02,360 --> 00:40:08,279 Speaker 1: the statement of Massad do not exist, never exists, that 571 00:40:08,440 --> 00:40:11,759 Speaker 1: name never existed. When I asked but his zone to 572 00:40:11,800 --> 00:40:15,120 Speaker 1: speculate about where Massad got the name from, he was 573 00:40:15,160 --> 00:40:18,759 Speaker 1: at a loss. I don't know, maybe a confusion. I 574 00:40:19,080 --> 00:40:25,040 Speaker 1: don't know. My microchurch was very intensive and difficult, and 575 00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:33,080 Speaker 1: a looking in archives and in libraries, coart don't existed. 576 00:40:33,320 --> 00:40:37,880 Speaker 1: You're white. So it remains a bit of a mystery. 577 00:40:38,280 --> 00:40:40,919 Speaker 1: But for whatever reason, maybe it was a code name. 578 00:40:41,400 --> 00:40:44,080 Speaker 1: The killed team called the final location. They decided on 579 00:40:44,600 --> 00:40:57,080 Speaker 1: Casa Kubertine, and then the team was suddenly very busy. 580 00:40:58,160 --> 00:41:00,920 Speaker 1: Now that they had a location, they had to prepare. 581 00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:03,640 Speaker 1: The five men drove from one end of the city 582 00:41:03,719 --> 00:41:07,440 Speaker 1: to the other, memorizing its layout. They drove the streets 583 00:41:07,480 --> 00:41:11,280 Speaker 1: around Casta Kubertini, finding the best ways in and out. 584 00:41:12,080 --> 00:41:16,760 Speaker 1: They studied how polite and patient Uruguayans were when they drove, 585 00:41:17,520 --> 00:41:20,480 Speaker 1: and anyone who spent time in Israel knows how foreign 586 00:41:20,560 --> 00:41:23,960 Speaker 1: the style of driving would be to an Israeli. Former 587 00:41:24,040 --> 00:41:28,520 Speaker 1: Massad agent Abner Abraham put it like this, Well, it's real. 588 00:41:28,600 --> 00:41:31,560 Speaker 1: You know. People are very nervous, they are very nervous 589 00:41:31,719 --> 00:41:35,399 Speaker 1: and they don't want to wait. Well, it's like, who'll 590 00:41:35,440 --> 00:41:38,040 Speaker 1: teach you to drive like this? You don't know how 591 00:41:38,080 --> 00:41:42,440 Speaker 1: to drive? Okay, you need to learn again. But you know, 592 00:41:42,520 --> 00:41:46,920 Speaker 1: sometimes it's not only to say something against the other drivers. 593 00:41:47,040 --> 00:41:50,560 Speaker 1: Sometimes you stand near his car and you open your 594 00:41:50,560 --> 00:41:53,880 Speaker 1: window and you need to educate him why you don't this, 595 00:41:54,120 --> 00:41:55,680 Speaker 1: and why do you don't this? And you have to 596 00:41:55,960 --> 00:41:58,440 Speaker 1: keep the right and why you keep the left? And okay, 597 00:41:58,719 --> 00:42:03,800 Speaker 1: you need to edit the team. And it might seem small, 598 00:42:04,360 --> 00:42:07,400 Speaker 1: but the team needed to learn to keep their Israeli 599 00:42:07,480 --> 00:42:12,800 Speaker 1: habits in check. This meant no aggressive driving, no road rage. 600 00:42:13,320 --> 00:42:16,480 Speaker 1: They didn't want to stand out. Your reef had warned 601 00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:20,600 Speaker 1: them that they had to avoid police attention at all costs, 602 00:42:21,280 --> 00:42:25,480 Speaker 1: so they always kept the speed limit. You're even brought 603 00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:28,439 Speaker 1: in someone from the Foreign Service already stationed in South 604 00:42:28,440 --> 00:42:32,360 Speaker 1: America to serve as an advisor. He wasn't trained with 605 00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:35,160 Speaker 1: the team, but he knew the language and could also 606 00:42:35,200 --> 00:42:43,879 Speaker 1: function as a lookout. On the big day, Mio sent 607 00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:50,160 Speaker 1: a telegram to Zukers, Dear Herbert, business running well, your 608 00:42:50,200 --> 00:42:53,080 Speaker 1: help needed. I would be glad if you could join 609 00:42:53,160 --> 00:43:00,600 Speaker 1: me in Monte Video. On the morning of February. That 610 00:43:00,719 --> 00:43:04,520 Speaker 1: was the date that Yerev had chosen. Three was his birthday, 611 00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:07,919 Speaker 1: and he considered it his lucky number. He didn't want 612 00:43:08,040 --> 00:43:11,879 Speaker 1: any more bad luck. Maybe this would help. The next 613 00:43:11,960 --> 00:43:17,920 Speaker 1: day there was a reply from Zuker's dear Anton, arriving 614 00:43:17,960 --> 00:43:24,400 Speaker 1: by Varic flight on a few hours later, another telegram arrived, 615 00:43:24,800 --> 00:43:28,600 Speaker 1: changing the airline from verig to Air France. But the 616 00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:33,879 Speaker 1: butcher was coming. The men made their final plans. Meo 617 00:43:33,960 --> 00:43:37,239 Speaker 1: rented Zukers a room at his hotel, even though if 618 00:43:37,280 --> 00:43:40,040 Speaker 1: all one according to plan, he would never sleep in it. 619 00:43:40,640 --> 00:43:43,680 Speaker 1: He read the newspapers each and every morning, looking for 620 00:43:43,719 --> 00:43:46,760 Speaker 1: anything that would interfere with the mission, a road closing, 621 00:43:46,840 --> 00:43:50,800 Speaker 1: a parade, anything, And after a few days he found 622 00:43:50,800 --> 00:43:53,120 Speaker 1: one one of the streets they were going to use 623 00:43:53,160 --> 00:43:56,640 Speaker 1: for the escape would be closed for repairs. The men 624 00:43:56,719 --> 00:44:00,520 Speaker 1: jumped in their cars and found an alternate route. Sod 625 00:44:00,920 --> 00:44:05,160 Speaker 1: went shopping. He visited the local luggage stores looking for 626 00:44:05,280 --> 00:44:08,680 Speaker 1: something to put Seeker's body. They didn't want to leave 627 00:44:08,719 --> 00:44:10,920 Speaker 1: the corpse just lying on the floor of the Cossa 628 00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:14,160 Speaker 1: Kober teeny, but the butcher was so big. Nothing that 629 00:44:14,239 --> 00:44:18,440 Speaker 1: Sudied saw would fit. Finally, he found his store selling 630 00:44:18,480 --> 00:44:21,279 Speaker 1: those huge traveling trunks that people back in the day 631 00:44:21,440 --> 00:44:23,880 Speaker 1: used when they sailed to the other side of the world. 632 00:44:24,719 --> 00:44:27,200 Speaker 1: He pulled a tape measure out of his pocket, got 633 00:44:27,239 --> 00:44:31,880 Speaker 1: the dimensions, yes, if there was anything bigger, salesman said no, 634 00:44:32,960 --> 00:44:37,720 Speaker 1: so the Sudeep bought it. According to former intelligence officer 635 00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:42,400 Speaker 1: Chris Costa, lining up every detail of the escape is 636 00:44:42,520 --> 00:44:47,280 Speaker 1: just as important as executing the mission itself. It's easy 637 00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:52,600 Speaker 1: to plan, and everybody likes tactics. Everybody likes talking about tradecraft. 638 00:44:52,840 --> 00:44:55,920 Speaker 1: The harder partners to talk about what comes after. So 639 00:44:56,200 --> 00:44:59,800 Speaker 1: you have to think about the end state of what 640 00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:04,600 Speaker 1: you want and then work it backwards. That's part of 641 00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:09,759 Speaker 1: planning an operation. Meal paid the hotel and rental car 642 00:45:09,880 --> 00:45:13,520 Speaker 1: bills in advance. He didn't want any last minute complications there. 643 00:45:14,280 --> 00:45:16,799 Speaker 1: Even bought two tickets for a flight to Chili, which 644 00:45:16,880 --> 00:45:20,840 Speaker 1: he and Sukers would never take. It was like method acting. 645 00:45:21,680 --> 00:45:24,279 Speaker 1: Everything had to appear to be real, so we did 646 00:45:24,320 --> 00:45:35,520 Speaker 1: everything as if it was real. For their final meeting 647 00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:39,040 Speaker 1: before the butcher arrived, the men chose a restaurant that 648 00:45:39,160 --> 00:45:41,600 Speaker 1: me had been to before on one of his trips 649 00:45:41,680 --> 00:45:45,120 Speaker 1: with Zukers. They sat at the table and began talking 650 00:45:45,160 --> 00:45:49,480 Speaker 1: in low voices. They didn't want to attract attention. It 651 00:45:49,520 --> 00:45:52,760 Speaker 1: didn't look like a band of assassins. If you spotted 652 00:45:52,800 --> 00:45:56,160 Speaker 1: them having their drinks and chatting, you might think they 653 00:45:56,160 --> 00:46:00,880 Speaker 1: were middle managers or insurance agents. As they were talking, 654 00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:05,400 Speaker 1: the waiter walked up. Shloum, he said in Hebrew. He 655 00:46:05,520 --> 00:46:07,480 Speaker 1: told the five men that he was originally from Hungary 656 00:46:07,800 --> 00:46:11,200 Speaker 1: but had served in the Israeli Defense Forces. He heard 657 00:46:11,239 --> 00:46:13,800 Speaker 1: them speaking Hebrew and he'd come over to greet his 658 00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:17,719 Speaker 1: fellow Jews. The men looked at each other and broke 659 00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:21,839 Speaker 1: out laughing. They thought they were being discreet, but here 660 00:46:22,160 --> 00:46:25,239 Speaker 1: they've been outed by a Hungarian waiter. They lowered their 661 00:46:25,280 --> 00:46:33,719 Speaker 1: voices even further and talked about On the night of 662 00:46:33,800 --> 00:46:37,879 Speaker 1: the Neo went to bed early. He said he wanted 663 00:46:37,920 --> 00:46:42,960 Speaker 1: to recharge his batteries for what was coming, the crucial 664 00:46:43,200 --> 00:46:58,120 Speaker 1: day judgment Today, Ye good assassins. Hunting the Butcher is 665 00:46:58,160 --> 00:47:02,000 Speaker 1: a production of Diversion Podcast in association with I Heart Radio. 666 00:47:02,920 --> 00:47:06,640 Speaker 1: This season is written and hosted by Stephen Tlalti, produced 667 00:47:06,680 --> 00:47:10,800 Speaker 1: and directed by Scott Waxman and Jacob Bronstein. Executive producers 668 00:47:10,920 --> 00:47:15,160 Speaker 1: Scott Waxman and Mark frances Story editing by Jacob Bronstein 669 00:47:15,640 --> 00:47:20,560 Speaker 1: with editorial direction from Scott Waxman and mangesh At Ticket editing, 670 00:47:20,640 --> 00:47:24,080 Speaker 1: mixing and sound designed by Mark Francis, with the voices 671 00:47:24,200 --> 00:47:30,160 Speaker 1: of Nick Afka, Thomas Amrie, Angele, Andrew Polk, Mindy Escobar Leants, 672 00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:35,640 Speaker 1: Steve Routman and Stefan Brudnitsky. Theme music by Tyler Cash. 673 00:47:36,360 --> 00:47:40,839 Speaker 1: Archival research by Adam Shapiro, thanks to Oran Rosenbaum at 674 00:47:40,960 --> 00:48:22,920 Speaker 1: ut A Diversion Podcasts