1 00:00:10,600 --> 00:00:13,680 Speaker 1: You're listening to the third and final part of Unexplained, 2 00:00:14,160 --> 00:00:25,120 Speaker 1: Season seven, episode six, look Me in the Eye. By 3 00:00:25,160 --> 00:00:28,920 Speaker 1: early nineteen seventy six, an Alisa Mchel and her family 4 00:00:29,360 --> 00:00:31,920 Speaker 1: remain convinced she is in the grip of a horrifying 5 00:00:31,960 --> 00:00:36,320 Speaker 1: demonic possession. She has her good and bad days, or, 6 00:00:36,360 --> 00:00:39,680 Speaker 1: as she sees it, the days when Lucifer leaves her 7 00:00:39,720 --> 00:00:44,360 Speaker 1: alone and the days when he doesn't. In spite of that, 8 00:00:45,080 --> 00:00:48,960 Speaker 1: Anna Lisa somehow manages to continue her studies at the 9 00:00:49,080 --> 00:00:52,680 Speaker 1: University of Wurtzburg, but she is terrified at the thought 10 00:00:52,720 --> 00:00:56,040 Speaker 1: of anyone there other than Peter and her best friend 11 00:00:56,080 --> 00:00:59,240 Speaker 1: Anna finding out the truth about what has been going 12 00:00:59,280 --> 00:01:02,880 Speaker 1: on with her. And though she continues to visit physicians 13 00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:06,040 Speaker 1: on the order of Father Alt, she never once mentions 14 00:01:06,080 --> 00:01:09,280 Speaker 1: the voices that speak to her or the hideous faces 15 00:01:09,319 --> 00:01:13,600 Speaker 1: that reveal themselves at night, and she never wants mentions 16 00:01:13,640 --> 00:01:17,440 Speaker 1: the exorcisms. What scares her most is the thought that 17 00:01:17,480 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 1: the doctors will simply judge her to be clinically insane, 18 00:01:21,280 --> 00:01:24,039 Speaker 1: that they will cart her away and strip her of 19 00:01:24,080 --> 00:01:26,880 Speaker 1: any right to speak for herself, that she will be 20 00:01:27,000 --> 00:01:31,119 Speaker 1: poked and prodded by clueless medics intent on denying her 21 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:35,560 Speaker 1: the only thing that will bring her salvation her faith. 22 00:01:37,200 --> 00:01:40,080 Speaker 1: And perhaps there is something else that haunts an Elisa, 23 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:44,440 Speaker 1: something lingering in the psyche of a nation still struggling 24 00:01:44,480 --> 00:01:47,880 Speaker 1: to come to terms with its past, that her fears 25 00:01:47,920 --> 00:01:53,840 Speaker 1: derived from. In September nineteen thirty nine, Adolf Hitler signed 26 00:01:53,920 --> 00:01:58,680 Speaker 1: the National Euthanasia Decree, effectively ordering the death of any 27 00:01:58,720 --> 00:02:03,080 Speaker 1: German citizen not deemed able enough. It was members of 28 00:02:03,120 --> 00:02:07,360 Speaker 1: the Church, such as Catholic Bishop August von Galen, although 29 00:02:07,440 --> 00:02:10,560 Speaker 1: less concerned when it came to the persecution of Jews, 30 00:02:10,800 --> 00:02:14,880 Speaker 1: it should be said, who most vehemently opposed it, while 31 00:02:14,960 --> 00:02:19,880 Speaker 1: notable medical professionals like Verner Hyde, professor of psychiatry and 32 00:02:19,960 --> 00:02:24,680 Speaker 1: neurology at Analisa's own University of Wurzburg, were some of 33 00:02:24,720 --> 00:02:29,800 Speaker 1: its most ardent supporters. Between nineteen thirty nine and nineteen 34 00:02:29,840 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 1: forty five, in an operation dubbed Action T four, as 35 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:38,480 Speaker 1: many as one hundred thousand German citizens considered physically or 36 00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:42,840 Speaker 1: psychiatrically deficient, many of whom had already been sterilized by 37 00:02:42,880 --> 00:02:46,720 Speaker 1: the state in a mass eugenics program, were murdered by 38 00:02:46,760 --> 00:02:52,000 Speaker 1: their own government Much of the technology and techniques developed 39 00:02:52,000 --> 00:02:55,600 Speaker 1: in the implementation of Action T four would later become 40 00:02:55,639 --> 00:03:07,000 Speaker 1: instrumental in the perpetration of the Holocaust. In March, while 41 00:03:07,000 --> 00:03:11,600 Speaker 1: at university, Annalisa attempts to board a train home when 42 00:03:11,600 --> 00:03:15,520 Speaker 1: her body becomes oddly stiff and she is unable to move. 43 00:03:16,440 --> 00:03:19,320 Speaker 1: She eventually makes a way to the local church and 44 00:03:19,440 --> 00:03:23,239 Speaker 1: prays for an end to her suffering. But as she speaks, 45 00:03:23,760 --> 00:03:27,880 Speaker 1: she is apparently gripped by an invisible force, and as 46 00:03:27,919 --> 00:03:32,760 Speaker 1: horrified churchgoers look on, is seemingly thrown repeatedly onto her 47 00:03:32,840 --> 00:03:38,360 Speaker 1: knees in an act of strange supplication. On hearing about 48 00:03:38,440 --> 00:03:43,960 Speaker 1: this latest event, Annalisa's sister Roswea travels to Wurtzberg to 49 00:03:44,000 --> 00:03:48,400 Speaker 1: look after her. When she arrives, she finds that Analisa 50 00:03:48,840 --> 00:03:54,120 Speaker 1: is now refusing to eat. One morning, her doormate Ursula 51 00:03:54,560 --> 00:03:58,560 Speaker 1: walks into Analisa's room and gasps in horror at the 52 00:03:58,600 --> 00:04:03,640 Speaker 1: sight of the stricken young woman. Rosswether quickly ushes her out, 53 00:04:04,080 --> 00:04:07,120 Speaker 1: but her sla can't shake the image from her mind 54 00:04:07,560 --> 00:04:13,040 Speaker 1: of Annelisa staring blankly into space with skeletal arms contorted 55 00:04:13,080 --> 00:04:18,360 Speaker 1: in front of her in a strange inhuman pose. As 56 00:04:18,400 --> 00:04:21,719 Speaker 1: news of her shocking condition spreads quickly among her friends, 57 00:04:22,040 --> 00:04:26,360 Speaker 1: they beg Anealisa to see a doctor, but Rosswether reassures 58 00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:30,839 Speaker 1: them that everything is under control. After a brief stay 59 00:04:30,920 --> 00:04:35,159 Speaker 1: with Father Ault that fails to rectify the situation, a 60 00:04:35,240 --> 00:04:39,279 Speaker 1: weak and terribly emaciated Anna Lisa is collected from his 61 00:04:39,400 --> 00:04:43,520 Speaker 1: residence by her parents and her boyfriend Peter, who carries 62 00:04:43,560 --> 00:04:47,839 Speaker 1: her out to his car and drives her home. Once there, 63 00:04:48,240 --> 00:04:53,320 Speaker 1: Annalisa's behavior only becomes more erratic as the apparent voices 64 00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:58,200 Speaker 1: in her head continue their unremitting torment. Some days she 65 00:04:58,240 --> 00:05:01,760 Speaker 1: has found furiously rubbing her fa or banging her head 66 00:05:01,800 --> 00:05:06,000 Speaker 1: against the wall until it bleeds. She asks her family 67 00:05:06,040 --> 00:05:09,320 Speaker 1: to tie her up at night and sometimes even during 68 00:05:09,320 --> 00:05:12,240 Speaker 1: the day, for fear of what the demons might make 69 00:05:12,279 --> 00:05:17,400 Speaker 1: her do. Despite the deterioration in her condition, and Elisa 70 00:05:17,560 --> 00:05:21,279 Speaker 1: attempts to reassure them are that everything will be fine 71 00:05:21,839 --> 00:05:24,680 Speaker 1: because the Mother of God has also spoken to her, 72 00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:28,479 Speaker 1: telling her that it will all finally be over in July. 73 00:05:30,160 --> 00:05:35,120 Speaker 1: In the meantime, Father Arnold Rents continues the exorcisms, but 74 00:05:35,240 --> 00:05:39,520 Speaker 1: struggles to make contact with any apparent entities. And the 75 00:05:39,600 --> 00:05:43,640 Speaker 1: sessions only seem to send ann Elisa into violent fits 76 00:05:43,640 --> 00:05:47,520 Speaker 1: of rage. While Peter and her father Joseph do their 77 00:05:47,560 --> 00:05:53,160 Speaker 1: best to restrain her. During one particularly brutal session, just 78 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:57,400 Speaker 1: like in the church weeks before, and Elisa falls to 79 00:05:57,480 --> 00:06:01,559 Speaker 1: her knees, stands there, and throws herself to the floor 80 00:06:01,600 --> 00:06:07,800 Speaker 1: again until the skin splits and her knees bleed. She 81 00:06:07,839 --> 00:06:12,440 Speaker 1: will repeat this six hundred times before collapsing from exhaustion 82 00:06:14,120 --> 00:06:17,840 Speaker 1: at each fall. Her mother Anna tries tearfully to comfort 83 00:06:17,880 --> 00:06:22,080 Speaker 1: her daughter by throwing pillows and blankets under her bloodied legs, 84 00:06:22,600 --> 00:06:26,040 Speaker 1: but she seems to miss them deliberately every time she 85 00:06:26,120 --> 00:06:37,239 Speaker 1: hits the floor. After hearing about this troubling session, Father 86 00:06:37,279 --> 00:06:40,919 Speaker 1: Olt is haunted by the descriptions of Anna Lisa's vicious 87 00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:46,240 Speaker 1: genuflections and her continued refusal to eat. Knowing the family's 88 00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:50,240 Speaker 1: reluctance to involve the medical profession, he secretly invites a 89 00:06:50,320 --> 00:06:56,520 Speaker 1: physician friend, doctor Richard Roth, to her next exorcism. One night, 90 00:06:57,000 --> 00:07:01,200 Speaker 1: with the session already underway, Doctor Roth and father Alt 91 00:07:01,520 --> 00:07:04,880 Speaker 1: arrive at the Michael family home as the sound of 92 00:07:05,040 --> 00:07:10,240 Speaker 1: inhuman shrieking can be heard coming from inside a single 93 00:07:10,320 --> 00:07:14,360 Speaker 1: lamp illuminates the hall as Alt leads Roth to the 94 00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:18,240 Speaker 1: second floor, where he is then shown into Analisa's room. 95 00:07:19,120 --> 00:07:23,920 Speaker 1: He is horrified by what he sees. Annalissa's face is 96 00:07:23,960 --> 00:07:29,040 Speaker 1: swollen and beaten, and her eyes are sunken into discolored flesh. 97 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:34,520 Speaker 1: He watches as Father Rents stands, holding his crucifix out 98 00:07:34,560 --> 00:07:39,800 Speaker 1: toward her as he recites the rich uale Romanum. Moments later, 99 00:07:40,560 --> 00:07:44,400 Speaker 1: a shaking Doctor Roth bolts from the room and rushes 100 00:07:44,480 --> 00:07:48,560 Speaker 1: down to the kitchen. When Father Alt asks him if 101 00:07:48,600 --> 00:07:52,440 Speaker 1: he will help them, a trembling doctor Roth replies simply, 102 00:07:53,080 --> 00:07:57,240 Speaker 1: there are no injections against the devil, before gathering his 103 00:07:57,360 --> 00:08:02,440 Speaker 1: things and hurrying out of the house. When Father Alt 104 00:08:02,560 --> 00:08:06,800 Speaker 1: returns a few days later, Annalisa tells him, with fading 105 00:08:06,880 --> 00:08:09,800 Speaker 1: light in her eyes, that she fears it is still 106 00:08:09,840 --> 00:08:13,720 Speaker 1: to get worse before it will get better. She reminds 107 00:08:13,800 --> 00:08:16,680 Speaker 1: him that he mustn't be afraid, though all will be 108 00:08:16,720 --> 00:08:19,640 Speaker 1: well in July, just as the Mother of God has 109 00:08:19,680 --> 00:08:25,120 Speaker 1: deemed it so. Father Olt notices that one of Annalisa's 110 00:08:25,200 --> 00:08:29,000 Speaker 1: teeth has been chipped. When he leaves the house later 111 00:08:29,080 --> 00:08:33,120 Speaker 1: that night, he sees a peculiar mouth shaped dent in 112 00:08:33,200 --> 00:08:37,560 Speaker 1: the wall, and a glass panel appears to be missing 113 00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:41,680 Speaker 1: from one of the doors. It was Anna Lisa. Joseph 114 00:08:41,760 --> 00:08:48,560 Speaker 1: tells him she had run through it head first. Another 115 00:08:48,679 --> 00:08:53,360 Speaker 1: five exorcisms take place before thirtieth of June, when in 116 00:08:53,400 --> 00:08:57,160 Speaker 1: a thick summer heat, Father Rents arrives at the Michael 117 00:08:57,280 --> 00:09:01,559 Speaker 1: household for what will be the sixty seventh exorcism since 118 00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:05,840 Speaker 1: they started. As she has done in all sixty six 119 00:09:05,960 --> 00:09:10,679 Speaker 1: so far, ann Elisa waits patiently and eagerly for her deliverance, 120 00:09:11,080 --> 00:09:15,800 Speaker 1: surrounded by her family, her parents Anna and Joseph, sisters 121 00:09:15,920 --> 00:09:20,960 Speaker 1: Barbara and Rosweether, and Peter, and there is reason to 122 00:09:21,000 --> 00:09:26,280 Speaker 1: be cheerful, despite her temperature running at thirty nine degrees celsius. 123 00:09:26,679 --> 00:09:31,560 Speaker 1: Tomorrow is the first of July, the moment, as Annelisa claims, 124 00:09:31,600 --> 00:09:34,800 Speaker 1: has been foretold by the Mother of God that she 125 00:09:34,840 --> 00:09:48,520 Speaker 1: will finally be released. An Elisa is placed on the 126 00:09:48,600 --> 00:09:51,920 Speaker 1: sofa with barely the strength to lift her own body, 127 00:09:52,200 --> 00:09:57,559 Speaker 1: and once again Father Rents begins the ritual. Within seconds, 128 00:09:57,720 --> 00:10:01,679 Speaker 1: as the sacred words fall from his mouth, Analisa begins 129 00:10:01,720 --> 00:10:06,040 Speaker 1: to slither and moan, her teeth and withered gums, gnashing 130 00:10:06,120 --> 00:10:12,640 Speaker 1: at the sound of the prayers. On the bridge of 131 00:10:12,679 --> 00:10:17,079 Speaker 1: her nose, a large open sore weeps from a wound 132 00:10:17,480 --> 00:10:24,440 Speaker 1: sustained the previous week. As rerns continues, a voice cries out, 133 00:10:25,320 --> 00:10:28,200 Speaker 1: but it is not the growl of a demon or 134 00:10:28,240 --> 00:10:32,360 Speaker 1: a hiss of rage, but rather the gentle, sweet, and 135 00:10:32,480 --> 00:10:40,160 Speaker 1: exhausted voice of a young woman. Absolution, says Analisa. Father 136 00:10:40,240 --> 00:10:46,920 Speaker 1: Rents stops and asks is she sure? Yes, she replies, 137 00:10:48,400 --> 00:10:51,720 Speaker 1: it seems the last of the demons have finally left 138 00:10:51,760 --> 00:10:55,800 Speaker 1: her body. But Rence knows all too well it could 139 00:10:55,800 --> 00:10:59,320 Speaker 1: be a trap. After all, how do they know it 140 00:10:59,360 --> 00:11:04,120 Speaker 1: is Annalisa who is speaking. Rents gives a nod to Peter, 141 00:11:04,559 --> 00:11:07,679 Speaker 1: who then stares long and hard into Anna Lisa's eyes, 142 00:11:08,720 --> 00:11:10,679 Speaker 1: just as she had asked him to do, so that 143 00:11:10,720 --> 00:11:13,320 Speaker 1: he'll know if it is really her in her mind 144 00:11:13,440 --> 00:11:18,040 Speaker 1: or not. Peter turns to Rents and confirms it really 145 00:11:18,120 --> 00:11:22,920 Speaker 1: is Anna Lisa who is speaking. Rents turns back to 146 00:11:23,000 --> 00:11:27,760 Speaker 1: the young woman. Finding a momentary reserve of strength, she 147 00:11:27,880 --> 00:11:31,880 Speaker 1: drops from the couch and kneels on the floor. Father 148 00:11:32,000 --> 00:11:35,160 Speaker 1: Rents makes the sign of the Cross and places his 149 00:11:35,320 --> 00:11:40,120 Speaker 1: hand on her head. God, the father of mercies. Through 150 00:11:40,160 --> 00:11:43,360 Speaker 1: the death and resurrection of his son, has reconciled the 151 00:11:43,400 --> 00:11:46,199 Speaker 1: world to himself and sent the Holy Spirit the name 152 00:11:46,240 --> 00:11:48,800 Speaker 1: of the Father and of the Son and of the 153 00:11:48,840 --> 00:11:53,880 Speaker 1: Holy Spirit. When it's finished, An Elisa is taken to 154 00:11:53,920 --> 00:11:59,320 Speaker 1: her bed and left asleep. Her hopeful mother, Anna follows 155 00:11:59,400 --> 00:12:04,160 Speaker 1: Father Rent to the door. What happens now, she asks. 156 00:12:05,120 --> 00:12:17,080 Speaker 1: Father Rents pats her arm and smiles. We pray. Later 157 00:12:17,160 --> 00:12:20,360 Speaker 1: that night, as Anna makes her way to bed, a 158 00:12:20,480 --> 00:12:26,880 Speaker 1: quiet voice comes out from Anna Lisa's room. Mama, I'm afraid, 159 00:12:27,320 --> 00:12:33,760 Speaker 1: says Anne Alissa. An image flashes through Anna's mind. It's 160 00:12:33,800 --> 00:12:37,680 Speaker 1: Anna Lisa, not as a young woman, but a young 161 00:12:37,800 --> 00:12:42,000 Speaker 1: child who wanted nothing but to make her mother happy. 162 00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:47,000 Speaker 1: Anna goes to her daughter and sits with her until 163 00:12:47,120 --> 00:12:53,800 Speaker 1: she falls asleep. Sometime later, a scream coming from Annalissa's 164 00:12:53,880 --> 00:12:58,360 Speaker 1: room rips the silence of the night. Joseph rushes in 165 00:12:58,600 --> 00:13:02,280 Speaker 1: to find Anna Lisa being seemingly thrown about her bed 166 00:13:02,600 --> 00:13:06,360 Speaker 1: by an invisible force. He commands the demons to leave 167 00:13:06,400 --> 00:13:11,560 Speaker 1: his daughter alone, and the violence eventually subsides, but it 168 00:13:11,559 --> 00:13:14,880 Speaker 1: will be well into the following morning of July first, 169 00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:19,520 Speaker 1: before Anna Lisa is finally calmed enough to fall asleep 170 00:13:19,679 --> 00:13:27,440 Speaker 1: once more. A few hours later outside Venus, the morning star, 171 00:13:27,960 --> 00:13:31,640 Speaker 1: having hung so bright and prominent in the sky, slowly 172 00:13:31,679 --> 00:13:36,320 Speaker 1: fades before vanishing altogether into the warm light of the 173 00:13:36,440 --> 00:13:42,560 Speaker 1: rising sun. At seven am. Before heading off to work, 174 00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:46,240 Speaker 1: Joseph makes sure to check in on his daughter and 175 00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:51,680 Speaker 1: finds her sleeping peacefully. An hour later, he receives a 176 00:13:51,720 --> 00:13:55,240 Speaker 1: phone call from Anna to inform him that Anna Lisa 177 00:13:56,280 --> 00:14:02,679 Speaker 1: is dead. An autopsy on her body finds all her 178 00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:07,280 Speaker 1: inner organs are healthy, including the brain, with no damage 179 00:14:07,320 --> 00:14:12,200 Speaker 1: noted that might have caused any epileptic seizures. Her death 180 00:14:12,600 --> 00:14:16,920 Speaker 1: is recorded as having been caused by starvation and possibly 181 00:14:17,120 --> 00:14:22,280 Speaker 1: over exertion. The report also notes that her pupils were 182 00:14:22,360 --> 00:14:25,720 Speaker 1: unusually dilated and that she had none of the bed 183 00:14:25,840 --> 00:14:31,280 Speaker 1: saws or ulcerations of the skin associated with starvation, despite 184 00:14:31,320 --> 00:14:34,880 Speaker 1: weighing only sixty eight pounds at the time of her death. 185 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:40,200 Speaker 1: She is buried a few days later on the fringes 186 00:14:40,280 --> 00:14:47,280 Speaker 1: of Klingenberg Cemetery, next to her sister Martha. In the 187 00:14:47,320 --> 00:14:51,600 Speaker 1: aftermath of Anne Elsa's death, the West German state charged 188 00:14:51,640 --> 00:14:56,640 Speaker 1: her parents, Joseph and Anna, along with Fathers, Arnold Rents, 189 00:14:56,680 --> 00:15:01,800 Speaker 1: and Ernest Alt with negligent homicide. Two years later, in 190 00:15:01,800 --> 00:15:06,320 Speaker 1: a heavily publicized case, all four defendants were found guilty 191 00:15:06,320 --> 00:15:10,080 Speaker 1: of manslaughter due to negligence and sentenced to a term 192 00:15:10,160 --> 00:15:15,080 Speaker 1: of six months in prison later suspended and three years probation. 193 00:15:16,480 --> 00:15:20,840 Speaker 1: All four defendants maintained to the end that Analiza had 194 00:15:20,880 --> 00:15:27,200 Speaker 1: been the victim of a demonic possession. Much later, when 195 00:15:27,280 --> 00:15:32,080 Speaker 1: Father Rentz's taped recordings of Analis's exorcisms are made public, 196 00:15:32,760 --> 00:15:37,600 Speaker 1: an analysis of her pained and anguished responses apparently revealed 197 00:15:37,680 --> 00:15:40,680 Speaker 1: some of them to be hitting two registers at the 198 00:15:40,760 --> 00:15:59,880 Speaker 1: same time, as if two people had been speaking simultaneously. 199 00:15:48,080 --> 00:16:06,760 Speaker 1: Then whatever way we look at the terrifying and tragic 200 00:16:06,880 --> 00:16:10,520 Speaker 1: case of Ana Lisa Michel, it is impossible to escape 201 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:13,720 Speaker 1: the horror of it. If you believe in the existence 202 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:17,480 Speaker 1: of demonic spirits that can possess your mind intent on 203 00:16:17,560 --> 00:16:21,880 Speaker 1: condemning your soul to an eternity of damnation, then such 204 00:16:21,920 --> 00:16:26,040 Speaker 1: a horror is self explanatory. If you don't, we can 205 00:16:26,080 --> 00:16:31,080 Speaker 1: still find a number of equally unsettling ideas lurking during 206 00:16:31,080 --> 00:16:35,480 Speaker 1: the exorcisms. When Analisa yelled and fought with father rents. 207 00:16:36,040 --> 00:16:39,240 Speaker 1: She claimed it was as if somebody had taken over 208 00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:43,800 Speaker 1: her mind, leaving herself stranded on the edges of her 209 00:16:43,840 --> 00:16:49,440 Speaker 1: psyche while someone else pulled her strings. If, like me, 210 00:16:49,960 --> 00:16:53,960 Speaker 1: you find this notion terrifying, then perhaps it's best not 211 00:16:54,040 --> 00:16:58,240 Speaker 1: to think too deeply on just what that self is exactly. 212 00:16:59,560 --> 00:17:03,120 Speaker 1: We often talk of how our actions define us, that 213 00:17:03,200 --> 00:17:06,760 Speaker 1: the choices we make from our moral standpoints, to the 214 00:17:06,760 --> 00:17:10,800 Speaker 1: clothes we wear, to even the partners we supposedly choose 215 00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:16,399 Speaker 1: all combine to form an impression of who we are. Yet, 216 00:17:16,640 --> 00:17:20,280 Speaker 1: if we live in a deterministic universe, as many leading 217 00:17:20,359 --> 00:17:25,640 Speaker 1: scientists and philosophers think, which if any of our decisions, 218 00:17:25,960 --> 00:17:29,600 Speaker 1: could we reasonably declare to have been made entirely of 219 00:17:29,640 --> 00:17:34,520 Speaker 1: our own volition? To paraphrase Arthur Schopenhauer, you may have 220 00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:37,879 Speaker 1: a thought and then act on that thought, But what 221 00:17:38,480 --> 00:17:43,000 Speaker 1: thought to have that thought in the first place? Free will, 222 00:17:43,160 --> 00:17:46,720 Speaker 1: in the purest sense, a will that is completely free 223 00:17:46,760 --> 00:17:52,760 Speaker 1: from any influence, does not exist through a combination of 224 00:17:52,880 --> 00:17:56,920 Speaker 1: nature and nurture. Even before we are born, we are 225 00:17:56,960 --> 00:18:02,240 Speaker 1: in a sense programmed to behave in this at a 226 00:18:02,320 --> 00:18:06,320 Speaker 1: very basic level, our behavior is controlled by the biological 227 00:18:06,400 --> 00:18:11,119 Speaker 1: demands of our bodies. We eat because we're hungry, drink 228 00:18:11,160 --> 00:18:16,200 Speaker 1: because we're thirsty, rest because we are tired. We could 229 00:18:16,240 --> 00:18:19,239 Speaker 1: choose not to eat, drink, or rest, but for the 230 00:18:19,240 --> 00:18:23,200 Speaker 1: most part, the consequences of doing so prevent us from 231 00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:28,159 Speaker 1: making such decisions. The neural networks in our brains that 232 00:18:28,280 --> 00:18:32,160 Speaker 1: influence our behavior how quick we might be to get angry, 233 00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:36,359 Speaker 1: or why we prefer oranges to apples, for example, are 234 00:18:36,400 --> 00:18:40,399 Speaker 1: partly determined by genetic events, many of which take place 235 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:47,159 Speaker 1: before we are born, that constantly affect our behavior. Epigenetic imprinting, 236 00:18:47,640 --> 00:18:51,840 Speaker 1: the way our biology processes how exactly our genes will 237 00:18:51,840 --> 00:18:55,960 Speaker 1: influence our behavior, also takes place before we are born 238 00:18:56,760 --> 00:19:10,160 Speaker 1: and can even continue during our lifetime, all without our control. Often, 239 00:19:10,440 --> 00:19:13,919 Speaker 1: when we feel we are being freely assertive, our actions 240 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:19,199 Speaker 1: are in fact simply reactions to stimuli. Some believe the 241 00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:22,800 Speaker 1: process known as priming is a profound case in point, 242 00:19:23,160 --> 00:19:26,680 Speaker 1: demonstrating the way in which our behavior can be manipulated 243 00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:32,560 Speaker 1: by something as simple as word association. One striking example 244 00:19:33,000 --> 00:19:36,040 Speaker 1: was revealed in a two thousand and six study conducted 245 00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:42,320 Speaker 1: by a psychologist, Professor Kathlyn votes of the University of Minnesota. 246 00:19:42,680 --> 00:19:46,480 Speaker 1: The study demonstrated that people who carry out tasks while 247 00:19:46,520 --> 00:19:50,640 Speaker 1: being exposed to reminders of money, either through images placed 248 00:19:50,720 --> 00:19:53,840 Speaker 1: near them on screens or the use of fake money 249 00:19:53,920 --> 00:19:57,160 Speaker 1: left out in plain sight, were likely to be more 250 00:19:57,200 --> 00:20:00,919 Speaker 1: self sufficient. They were also less will to help others 251 00:20:01,080 --> 00:20:04,280 Speaker 1: in a series of later tasks they were asked to perform. 252 00:20:04,960 --> 00:20:08,560 Speaker 1: And all this before we even take into consideration how 253 00:20:08,600 --> 00:20:12,280 Speaker 1: our general outlook on life or our moral and religious 254 00:20:12,280 --> 00:20:15,600 Speaker 1: beliefs are shaped by the environment we're brought up in 255 00:20:16,119 --> 00:20:20,560 Speaker 1: and the social groups we predominantly interact with. We could 256 00:20:20,680 --> 00:20:24,600 Speaker 1: argue that through education and raised awareness, we learn to 257 00:20:24,680 --> 00:20:28,400 Speaker 1: recognize the ways in which our choices are being influenced 258 00:20:28,480 --> 00:20:32,399 Speaker 1: by things we can't control, and in turn learn to 259 00:20:32,440 --> 00:20:37,359 Speaker 1: make better, more thoughtful choices. And as thinkers such as 260 00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:43,840 Speaker 1: Daniel Dennett have proposed, maybe that's enough. As Dennett argues, 261 00:20:44,240 --> 00:20:47,080 Speaker 1: even if we reject the purest's idea of free will, 262 00:20:47,640 --> 00:20:51,320 Speaker 1: there are parameters within which we can retain a satisfactory 263 00:20:51,400 --> 00:20:54,760 Speaker 1: degree of freedom that at least leaves us with, as 264 00:20:54,760 --> 00:20:59,760 Speaker 1: he says, the varieties of free will worth wanting. In 265 00:20:59,760 --> 00:21:03,320 Speaker 1: this sense, free will is possible if we understand it 266 00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:08,320 Speaker 1: essentially as nothing but a useful fiction. In other words, 267 00:21:08,600 --> 00:21:12,320 Speaker 1: although we should accept that we can't have full authority 268 00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:17,560 Speaker 1: over our decisions, be it the biological impulses we can't control, 269 00:21:17,600 --> 00:21:20,120 Speaker 1: like who we fall in love with, or the myriad 270 00:21:20,200 --> 00:21:24,280 Speaker 1: ways in which our environments influence us, we might find 271 00:21:24,320 --> 00:21:29,240 Speaker 1: we have enough choices to meaningfully affect outcomes, thereby providing 272 00:21:29,320 --> 00:21:33,879 Speaker 1: a gratifying feeling of autonomy. But if we say that 273 00:21:34,000 --> 00:21:37,639 Speaker 1: free will amounts to the number of options available to 274 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:41,720 Speaker 1: us within any given situation, how should we account for 275 00:21:41,800 --> 00:21:44,359 Speaker 1: the way in which, for each of us, due to 276 00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:49,439 Speaker 1: the influence of our individualistic, predetermined genetic makeup and the 277 00:21:49,560 --> 00:21:54,000 Speaker 1: varied subjective experiences of our lives, those choices at our 278 00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:59,480 Speaker 1: disposal will be different. Is it fair that one person 279 00:21:59,560 --> 00:22:03,080 Speaker 1: can be penalized for a criminal act, for example, and 280 00:22:03,160 --> 00:22:06,679 Speaker 1: be stigmatized for it when so many of the things 281 00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:09,800 Speaker 1: that lead them to commit the act are completely out 282 00:22:09,800 --> 00:22:14,399 Speaker 1: of their control. The simple answer is that we can't. 283 00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:19,200 Speaker 1: The best we can do is agree collectively on what 284 00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:23,000 Speaker 1: we deem to be acceptable behavior. Then we can negotiate 285 00:22:23,080 --> 00:22:28,119 Speaker 1: the parameters of acceptability, either explicitly through the enforcement of 286 00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:34,919 Speaker 1: laws or implicitly through tacitly agreed social moraids. But what 287 00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:49,760 Speaker 1: happens then when those parameters shift? The terror of becoming 288 00:22:49,800 --> 00:22:53,920 Speaker 1: the victim of demonic possession is about much more than control. 289 00:22:54,760 --> 00:22:59,359 Speaker 1: For the devout, the ultimate fear is that something fundamentally 290 00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:03,960 Speaker 1: evil has taken over their soul, threatening to commit evil 291 00:23:04,000 --> 00:23:08,320 Speaker 1: acts in their name, or the sin of suicide, condemning 292 00:23:08,359 --> 00:23:12,040 Speaker 1: them to hell in the process. Yet, if we are 293 00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:15,640 Speaker 1: never truly in control of our actions, what might any 294 00:23:15,680 --> 00:23:20,160 Speaker 1: of us be capable of given the right set of circumstances. 295 00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:24,520 Speaker 1: In July nineteen sixty one, twenty three year old Bill 296 00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:28,200 Speaker 1: Menolt came across an advert in the New Haven Register, 297 00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:33,359 Speaker 1: a Connecticut based local paper, requesting persons needed for a 298 00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:36,760 Speaker 1: study of memory, with the offer of four dollars for 299 00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:41,200 Speaker 1: just one hour of your time. Having just recently left 300 00:23:41,240 --> 00:23:44,439 Speaker 1: the Army, Bill figured he could use the money, and, 301 00:23:44,560 --> 00:23:47,280 Speaker 1: since he would be in New Haven that day anyway, 302 00:23:47,720 --> 00:23:52,199 Speaker 1: decided to put himself forward. A few days later, he 303 00:23:52,359 --> 00:23:56,919 Speaker 1: arrived at Yale University's Interaction Laboratory, where he was introduced 304 00:23:57,000 --> 00:24:02,959 Speaker 1: to another volunteer, an accountant named Missus Wallace, and the experimenter, 305 00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:06,960 Speaker 1: an officious sounding man dressed in a gray lab coat 306 00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:11,520 Speaker 1: who would be supervising the experiment. It was explained to 307 00:24:11,600 --> 00:24:14,280 Speaker 1: Bill and mister Wallace that they were taking part in 308 00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:18,440 Speaker 1: a study to examine the effects of punishment on learning ability. 309 00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:22,880 Speaker 1: Then they drew straws to determine which roles they would take. 310 00:24:24,000 --> 00:24:27,600 Speaker 1: Mister Wallace was assigned the position of learner and taken 311 00:24:27,640 --> 00:24:31,800 Speaker 1: into a room where, watched by Bill, he was strapped 312 00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:36,080 Speaker 1: into an electric chair. Now in the role of teacher, 313 00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:40,240 Speaker 1: Bill was taken to an adjacent room containing an electric 314 00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:43,639 Speaker 1: shock generator that he was led to believe was hooked 315 00:24:43,720 --> 00:24:48,399 Speaker 1: up to the electric chair under the watchful eye of 316 00:24:48,440 --> 00:24:52,959 Speaker 1: the experimenter. Bill and mister Wallace, who were no longer 317 00:24:53,080 --> 00:24:56,359 Speaker 1: able to see each other, proceeded to carry out a 318 00:24:56,480 --> 00:25:01,320 Speaker 1: series of simple word based memory tests. All Bill then 319 00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:05,320 Speaker 1: had to do was administer an electric shock whenever the 320 00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:12,000 Speaker 1: learner mister Wallace, got the answer wrong, with one additional instruction. 321 00:25:13,119 --> 00:25:17,320 Speaker 1: Each time this occurred, he was to increase the strength 322 00:25:17,560 --> 00:25:28,000 Speaker 1: of the electric shocks in his room. On the electric 323 00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:32,040 Speaker 1: shock generator that Bill was controlling, there were thirty switches 324 00:25:32,240 --> 00:25:36,600 Speaker 1: clearly marked with different levels of power, ranging from fifteen 325 00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:41,240 Speaker 1: vaults described as slight shock to four hundred and fifty 326 00:25:41,320 --> 00:25:48,000 Speaker 1: vaults described as danger severe shock. With the experiment under way, 327 00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:53,000 Speaker 1: Bill dutifully increased the shocks by fifteen vaults with each 328 00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:57,359 Speaker 1: wrong answer, even when mister Wallace could be heard screaming 329 00:25:57,400 --> 00:26:00,560 Speaker 1: in agony and demanding to be let out from the 330 00:26:00,600 --> 00:26:04,520 Speaker 1: other side of the wall. At every scream, Bill would 331 00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:08,359 Speaker 1: turn to the experimenter for guidance, each time being told 332 00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:14,200 Speaker 1: calmly but forcefully to please continue. Two hundred and ten vaults, 333 00:26:14,760 --> 00:26:18,920 Speaker 1: two hundred and fifty five vaults, three hundred and thirty volts. 334 00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:23,120 Speaker 1: Up it went until something occurred that Bill had not 335 00:26:23,160 --> 00:26:29,840 Speaker 1: been prepared for. Mister Wallace stopped responding. The young former 336 00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:34,200 Speaker 1: soldier had been instructed earlier to treat a non response 337 00:26:34,440 --> 00:26:39,080 Speaker 1: as an incorrect answer, but was understandably concerned that something 338 00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:43,919 Speaker 1: terrible had happened. He looked to the experimenter, who again 339 00:26:44,200 --> 00:26:49,880 Speaker 1: asked him calmly to continue. Bill flicked the next switch 340 00:26:50,359 --> 00:26:55,040 Speaker 1: four hundred and thirty five vaults. There was no response. 341 00:26:56,400 --> 00:27:01,119 Speaker 1: Now utterly convinced that he'd killed mister Wallace, a horrified 342 00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:05,879 Speaker 1: Bill looked again to the experimenter. The experiment requires we continue, 343 00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:11,280 Speaker 1: he commanded flatly, against all his better judgment, Bill flicked 344 00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:15,400 Speaker 1: the highest and final switch on the generator four hundred 345 00:27:15,440 --> 00:27:20,800 Speaker 1: and fifty vaults. Thankfully, for Bill, none of it was real. 346 00:27:21,880 --> 00:27:25,640 Speaker 1: There were no electric shocks transmitted to mister Wallace, who, 347 00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:28,919 Speaker 1: it turned out, wasn't an accountant at all, but a 348 00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:32,879 Speaker 1: stooge who was part of the experiment named Bob mac donnough. 349 00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:38,959 Speaker 1: Bill had unwittingly taken part in a hugely controversial experiment 350 00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:44,280 Speaker 1: designed by psychologist Stanley Milgram to test our obedience to 351 00:27:44,359 --> 00:27:55,080 Speaker 1: authority figures. When the truth of the Holocaust was exposed 352 00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:58,680 Speaker 1: in the aftermath of the Second World War, Stanley Milgram, 353 00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:02,560 Speaker 1: like many others, was left completely stunned as to how 354 00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:08,320 Speaker 1: so many ordinary people could be convinced to perpetrate such acts. 355 00:28:08,960 --> 00:28:12,080 Speaker 1: The Milgram Experiment, as it came to be known, was 356 00:28:12,119 --> 00:28:16,280 Speaker 1: conducted in the wake of the trial of Adolph Eichmann, who, 357 00:28:16,400 --> 00:28:20,119 Speaker 1: as a member of the National Socialist German Workers Party, 358 00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:24,160 Speaker 1: played a leading role in the organization of the Holocaust. 359 00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:29,280 Speaker 1: Aikman famously stated he should not be considered culpable for 360 00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:34,600 Speaker 1: his actions, since he had merely been following orders Aikman's 361 00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:40,760 Speaker 1: defense uncomfortably inferred that anyone in his situation could very 362 00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:45,240 Speaker 1: well have made the same choices. Milgram set out to 363 00:28:45,320 --> 00:28:49,680 Speaker 1: discover if there was any truth to this. Bill was 364 00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:54,120 Speaker 1: one of forty male subjects with varying occupations and levels 365 00:28:54,120 --> 00:28:59,440 Speaker 1: of education, who were tested. Prior to the study. Milgram 366 00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:03,440 Speaker 1: asked for teen psychology majors to predict how many test 367 00:29:03,480 --> 00:29:07,480 Speaker 1: subjects could be coerced into administering the highest level of shock, 368 00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:10,800 Speaker 1: to which they gave the mean answer of one point 369 00:29:10,840 --> 00:29:16,440 Speaker 1: two percent. The eventual answer was, in fact sixty five percent, 370 00:29:17,240 --> 00:29:22,360 Speaker 1: more than half of all participants. And for me, it 371 00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:26,520 Speaker 1: is here that we find the true horror. Often the 372 00:29:26,560 --> 00:29:30,800 Speaker 1: only thing standing between us and the perpetrating of what 373 00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:34,800 Speaker 1: we might consider evil acts is the tenacity of our 374 00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:39,520 Speaker 1: fictitious social conventions, and whether we are lucky enough, either 375 00:29:39,560 --> 00:29:44,440 Speaker 1: through a genetic predisposition or through developing the requisite attitude 376 00:29:45,120 --> 00:29:49,720 Speaker 1: to wilfully adhere to them, which in turn leaves us 377 00:29:49,760 --> 00:29:53,320 Speaker 1: with the even more uncomfortable truth that, far from so 378 00:29:53,480 --> 00:29:58,520 Speaker 1: called evil acts being an aberration of human behavior, they 379 00:29:58,520 --> 00:30:03,760 Speaker 1: are in fact, in d entirely normative. The search for 380 00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:07,640 Speaker 1: the truth of things has invigorated thinkers throughout the history 381 00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:11,640 Speaker 1: of humankind, and has become an especially fraught issue in 382 00:30:11,680 --> 00:30:16,480 Speaker 1: our era of uncertainty, characterized by fears over the impact 383 00:30:16,520 --> 00:30:21,360 Speaker 1: of fake news and the increasing reliance on dispassionate algorithms 384 00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:26,480 Speaker 1: to aggregate information. What rarely gets acknowledged is that the 385 00:30:26,600 --> 00:30:31,360 Speaker 1: truth is not necessarily important to the function of humanity. 386 00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:35,800 Speaker 1: In fact, we could reasonably say that in terms of 387 00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:40,000 Speaker 1: how we model societies and come together to collectively operate, 388 00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:45,880 Speaker 1: it might be irrelevant and in some ways even detrimental. 389 00:30:53,280 --> 00:30:57,600 Speaker 1: In two thousand and eight, professor Kathleen Vows, this time 390 00:30:57,680 --> 00:31:03,040 Speaker 1: in collaboration with psychologist Jonathan Schoola of the University of California, 391 00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:07,520 Speaker 1: carried out a fascinating study to test how belief in 392 00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:14,160 Speaker 1: free will effects moral responsibility. Vose and Schooler gave two 393 00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:17,880 Speaker 1: sets of participants a different passage to read from the 394 00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:22,680 Speaker 1: Astonishing Hypothesis, a nineteen ninety four book about the study 395 00:31:22,720 --> 00:31:27,840 Speaker 1: of consciousness written by Nobel laureate and co discoverer of DNA, 396 00:31:28,320 --> 00:31:33,760 Speaker 1: Francis Crick. One passage asserted that although we appear to 397 00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:37,880 Speaker 1: have free will, in fact our choices have already been 398 00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:42,680 Speaker 1: predetermined for us. While the other passage gave no mention 399 00:31:42,840 --> 00:31:47,280 Speaker 1: of the concept. After completing a quick survey about their 400 00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:51,200 Speaker 1: respective thoughts on the idea of free will, participants were 401 00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:54,760 Speaker 1: then asked to take a quick maths test with one caveat. 402 00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:58,400 Speaker 1: Whenever a question appeared, they were asked to press the 403 00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:01,920 Speaker 1: space bar to prevent the answer appearing on the screen 404 00:32:02,040 --> 00:32:07,440 Speaker 1: shortly after. Incredibly, those who read the passage dismissing free 405 00:32:07,440 --> 00:32:11,520 Speaker 1: will cheated more often, with the level of cheating being 406 00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:17,920 Speaker 1: higher the more skeptical the participant was about having it. Perhaps, then, 407 00:32:18,000 --> 00:32:21,200 Speaker 1: with this in mind, provided you think cheating is an 408 00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:25,160 Speaker 1: undesirable behavior, there is reason to maintain the idea of 409 00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:30,560 Speaker 1: free will, regardless of whether it is true or not. Ultimately, 410 00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:33,440 Speaker 1: we may find that the extent to which we cling 411 00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:36,160 Speaker 1: to the notions of free will and ownership of the 412 00:32:36,200 --> 00:32:39,000 Speaker 1: self has far more to do with what we consider 413 00:32:39,240 --> 00:32:42,400 Speaker 1: the purpose of life to be, rather than any real 414 00:32:42,520 --> 00:32:46,400 Speaker 1: truth as to who or what we are, something that 415 00:32:46,560 --> 00:32:52,440 Speaker 1: is itself driven by pre programmed genetic data and unconscious responses. 416 00:32:53,120 --> 00:32:57,240 Speaker 1: Should we choose to see ourselves as all valid occupiers 417 00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:01,640 Speaker 1: of a minutely small shared space in a vast universe, 418 00:33:02,240 --> 00:33:05,280 Speaker 1: that should do what we can to ensure as many 419 00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:08,560 Speaker 1: of us as possible can experience a life that is 420 00:33:08,600 --> 00:33:12,680 Speaker 1: worth living. Or should we choose to act selfishly to 421 00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:17,360 Speaker 1: survive and thrive at any cost, Or are we merely, 422 00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:22,120 Speaker 1: in the words of true detectives rusty call, just things 423 00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:26,280 Speaker 1: that labor under the illusion of having a self, an 424 00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:31,480 Speaker 1: accretion of sensory experience and feelings programmed with total assurance 425 00:33:31,840 --> 00:33:43,600 Speaker 1: that we are each somebody, when in fact everybody is nobody. 426 00:33:44,240 --> 00:33:49,240 Speaker 1: This episode was written by Richard McLean Smith Unexplained. The 427 00:33:49,240 --> 00:33:52,960 Speaker 1: book and audiobook, with stories never before featured on the show, 428 00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:57,480 Speaker 1: is now available to buy worldwide. You can purchase from Amazon, 429 00:33:57,760 --> 00:34:02,800 Speaker 1: Barnes and Noble, Waterstones, and bookstores. Please subscribe to and 430 00:34:02,920 --> 00:34:06,160 Speaker 1: rate the show wherever you get your podcasts, and feel 431 00:34:06,200 --> 00:34:08,840 Speaker 1: free to get in touch with any thoughts or ideas 432 00:34:09,160 --> 00:34:12,160 Speaker 1: regarding the stories you've heard on the show. Perhaps you 433 00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:14,560 Speaker 1: have an explanation of your own you'd like to share. 434 00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:18,680 Speaker 1: You can find out more at Unexplained podcast dot com 435 00:34:18,719 --> 00:34:22,440 Speaker 1: and reach us online through Twitter at Unexplained Pod and 436 00:34:22,600 --> 00:34:27,319 Speaker 1: Facebook at Facebook dot com. Forward Slash Unexplained Podcast