1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:03,520 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Tutor Dixon Podcast. On this Good Friday. 2 00:00:03,640 --> 00:00:06,920 Speaker 1: We have such a special guest here with us today 3 00:00:07,000 --> 00:00:10,200 Speaker 1: on this Holy weekend. And I say that because we 4 00:00:10,240 --> 00:00:14,480 Speaker 1: get to travel through a tragedy, really a life tragedy 5 00:00:14,520 --> 00:00:17,120 Speaker 1: that one of the pastors that my church went through. 6 00:00:17,200 --> 00:00:19,759 Speaker 1: And one of the great things I think about my 7 00:00:19,920 --> 00:00:22,880 Speaker 1: church is that every so often we have a video 8 00:00:23,000 --> 00:00:25,360 Speaker 1: about one of the families at church and something that 9 00:00:25,400 --> 00:00:29,000 Speaker 1: they've lived through, something that God has taken them through 10 00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:33,320 Speaker 1: and brought them out stronger and kept them strong throughout 11 00:00:33,440 --> 00:00:36,480 Speaker 1: something really difficult. And I think that's a wonderful thing 12 00:00:36,600 --> 00:00:40,960 Speaker 1: to experience in church because really that's what church is 13 00:00:41,000 --> 00:00:44,080 Speaker 1: all about. It's not a place for the healthy people. 14 00:00:44,120 --> 00:00:47,199 Speaker 1: It's not a place for people who are perfect on 15 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:49,479 Speaker 1: their own, because we're not. It's a place for people 16 00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:53,920 Speaker 1: to come together and realize that we need God above 17 00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:57,400 Speaker 1: all other things, that God is there for us and 18 00:00:57,480 --> 00:01:00,800 Speaker 1: will take us through the most difficult time. And I 19 00:01:00,800 --> 00:01:05,039 Speaker 1: think this story my guest today, his name is Brad Grossman. 20 00:01:05,120 --> 00:01:08,360 Speaker 1: He's one of the campus pastors at my church. His 21 00:01:08,440 --> 00:01:11,880 Speaker 1: story is so powerful in this Holy week because for me, 22 00:01:12,000 --> 00:01:14,200 Speaker 1: I always feel like as we go through this week, 23 00:01:14,520 --> 00:01:19,479 Speaker 1: there's this heaviness. We understand the seriousness of our sin, 24 00:01:19,800 --> 00:01:22,759 Speaker 1: of our pain, of all the hard things that we do, 25 00:01:22,800 --> 00:01:25,200 Speaker 1: and then at the end we have this celebration that 26 00:01:25,319 --> 00:01:30,120 Speaker 1: we have a savior, that Jesus rises, and he rises again, 27 00:01:30,160 --> 00:01:33,679 Speaker 1: and he saves our lives and we have eternity because 28 00:01:33,720 --> 00:01:36,640 Speaker 1: of him and because of our belief in him. But 29 00:01:36,880 --> 00:01:40,080 Speaker 1: this week at church, our pastor was talking about Holy 30 00:01:40,120 --> 00:01:44,240 Speaker 1: Week and he was talking about that day that Jesus 31 00:01:44,360 --> 00:01:49,400 Speaker 1: was betrayed and that he says to the disciples when 32 00:01:49,440 --> 00:01:52,320 Speaker 1: he returns, I have to leave you because I have 33 00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:54,640 Speaker 1: to be able to send the Spirit to be with you. 34 00:01:55,400 --> 00:01:57,280 Speaker 1: The Spirit can go with you all, and you have 35 00:01:57,360 --> 00:02:01,080 Speaker 1: to all go around and share my message, and I 36 00:02:01,160 --> 00:02:03,520 Speaker 1: can't be with all of you as you travel. I 37 00:02:03,600 --> 00:02:07,200 Speaker 1: need to send the Spirit to travel with you. And boy, 38 00:02:07,280 --> 00:02:10,600 Speaker 1: that is Brad Grossman's story who I have with me today. 39 00:02:11,160 --> 00:02:13,799 Speaker 1: That is his story because he has done such great 40 00:02:13,840 --> 00:02:19,079 Speaker 1: things with a really hard family situation that he dealt with, 41 00:02:19,600 --> 00:02:22,640 Speaker 1: and it's a situation that many of us go through. 42 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:24,919 Speaker 1: In fact, people in my family have dealt with this 43 00:02:25,080 --> 00:02:28,760 Speaker 1: as well. And that is addiction. And for Brad it 44 00:02:29,000 --> 00:02:33,400 Speaker 1: was his son who, like so many stories we hear, 45 00:02:34,280 --> 00:02:38,320 Speaker 1: he went through all kinds of medical issues, had to 46 00:02:38,400 --> 00:02:43,240 Speaker 1: have surgeries, and ultimately, after many surgeries, his son, Grant, 47 00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:47,239 Speaker 1: ended up addicted to pain medication. And that's where I 48 00:02:47,280 --> 00:02:49,480 Speaker 1: want to bring Brad in. Brad, thank you so much 49 00:02:49,600 --> 00:02:52,040 Speaker 1: for sharing your story today. It means so much to 50 00:02:52,120 --> 00:02:52,839 Speaker 1: so many of us. 51 00:02:53,280 --> 00:02:55,600 Speaker 2: Well, thank you, tutor. It's great to be here and 52 00:02:55,639 --> 00:02:57,960 Speaker 2: to be able to share what God has shown me 53 00:02:58,000 --> 00:03:00,000 Speaker 2: in that with others. Thank you. 54 00:03:00,440 --> 00:03:03,600 Speaker 1: I would encourage people, we'll try to connect a link 55 00:03:03,639 --> 00:03:07,080 Speaker 1: to your story because listening to you and Beth, your wife, 56 00:03:07,120 --> 00:03:10,320 Speaker 1: tell the story on the video was so powerful and 57 00:03:10,680 --> 00:03:13,040 Speaker 1: for me it was so powerful because you have to understand, 58 00:03:13,840 --> 00:03:16,160 Speaker 1: Brad is someone that I see every week, and you 59 00:03:16,240 --> 00:03:19,040 Speaker 1: come out and you're so you are just you can 60 00:03:19,120 --> 00:03:22,160 Speaker 1: see the joy. You are a joyful person and that 61 00:03:22,360 --> 00:03:26,400 Speaker 1: is clearly the Lord that is shining through. And I 62 00:03:26,440 --> 00:03:29,360 Speaker 1: had no idea. I had no idea that this was 63 00:03:29,440 --> 00:03:33,520 Speaker 1: your story. And then you share the story about Grants. 64 00:03:33,560 --> 00:03:35,880 Speaker 1: So if you can tell us a little bit about 65 00:03:36,000 --> 00:03:37,400 Speaker 1: what happened with your son. 66 00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:40,960 Speaker 2: Sure it was. It was two thousand and eight. My 67 00:03:41,000 --> 00:03:43,640 Speaker 2: son was a senior in high school, playing basketball, and 68 00:03:44,280 --> 00:03:47,360 Speaker 2: it was just everything was going great. His senior year, 69 00:03:47,400 --> 00:03:49,240 Speaker 2: he was finally getting to play on the team. And 70 00:03:50,240 --> 00:03:52,960 Speaker 2: it was about six weeks after my father passed actually, 71 00:03:53,000 --> 00:03:57,960 Speaker 2: and we started experiencing Grants started experiencing some health issues 72 00:03:58,000 --> 00:04:01,200 Speaker 2: where we took him to the hospital. That turned into weeks, 73 00:04:01,360 --> 00:04:03,720 Speaker 2: and then all of a sudden, we learned that he 74 00:04:03,760 --> 00:04:08,680 Speaker 2: had alterative colliitis, which is an autoimmune deficiency. So that 75 00:04:08,760 --> 00:04:13,520 Speaker 2: led to weeks and months in the hospital with surgery. 76 00:04:14,200 --> 00:04:18,560 Speaker 2: I remember that December of eight, which then led to 77 00:04:18,760 --> 00:04:22,400 Speaker 2: more surgeries, and I would say it was probably up 78 00:04:22,440 --> 00:04:27,120 Speaker 2: to about seven surgeries in that first first five or 79 00:04:27,160 --> 00:04:29,960 Speaker 2: six years, just to try to get it right. So, 80 00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:32,160 Speaker 2: but one of the things we tried to focus on 81 00:04:32,200 --> 00:04:36,560 Speaker 2: Tutor was as a family, we committed to Lord, please 82 00:04:36,600 --> 00:04:39,400 Speaker 2: help us to honor you in this. As we were 83 00:04:39,400 --> 00:04:41,920 Speaker 2: going through each step of the way, we just said, Lord, 84 00:04:42,000 --> 00:04:44,400 Speaker 2: help us to keep our eyes on you. And as 85 00:04:44,400 --> 00:04:47,040 Speaker 2: a family, everyone agreed. We knew this isn't about us. 86 00:04:47,080 --> 00:04:50,000 Speaker 2: This is about trying to communicate what it looks like 87 00:04:50,120 --> 00:04:53,440 Speaker 2: to go through a trial with God at our side. 88 00:04:53,480 --> 00:04:57,280 Speaker 2: But I've got to be honest, it was easier at 89 00:04:57,320 --> 00:04:59,800 Speaker 2: first because we thought this was going to have an 90 00:04:59,880 --> 00:05:03,320 Speaker 2: end it. We knew we felt like this health issue, 91 00:05:03,320 --> 00:05:04,840 Speaker 2: that they were going to get it right. There were 92 00:05:04,880 --> 00:05:07,640 Speaker 2: so many medications, We had the best doctors in Chicago 93 00:05:08,080 --> 00:05:10,880 Speaker 2: looking at our son. And then I would say it 94 00:05:10,920 --> 00:05:14,320 Speaker 2: was probably in twenty twelve when we thought we had 95 00:05:14,360 --> 00:05:18,279 Speaker 2: really turned a corner. We were so grateful he was healthy, 96 00:05:18,560 --> 00:05:22,600 Speaker 2: he was engaged to a wonderful Christian girl. They were 97 00:05:22,640 --> 00:05:26,120 Speaker 2: going to do missions together. It was a great time 98 00:05:26,120 --> 00:05:29,920 Speaker 2: in our lives. And got married in twenty thirteen and 99 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:32,040 Speaker 2: really couldn't have been any better. He was serving as 100 00:05:32,040 --> 00:05:34,680 Speaker 2: a pastor, which I'd always told him, Son, you could 101 00:05:34,680 --> 00:05:37,720 Speaker 2: be an engineer, a doctor, but nothing makes me more 102 00:05:37,760 --> 00:05:40,440 Speaker 2: proud than you being a pastor and serving the Lord. 103 00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:43,520 Speaker 2: So it was beautiful. I think it was a time 104 00:05:43,600 --> 00:05:45,880 Speaker 2: my wife and I look back on that and it 105 00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:49,679 Speaker 2: was just a glorious time celebrating his marriage, his new job, 106 00:05:49,800 --> 00:05:53,080 Speaker 2: new career. And then after he had moved out and 107 00:05:53,120 --> 00:05:57,200 Speaker 2: gotten married, was not many months after that that we 108 00:05:57,360 --> 00:06:01,200 Speaker 2: started seeing patterns of behavior that really concern me, and 109 00:06:01,279 --> 00:06:04,799 Speaker 2: as a retired police officer, concerned me all the more 110 00:06:05,279 --> 00:06:09,120 Speaker 2: to where that was something I had to make some 111 00:06:09,160 --> 00:06:13,240 Speaker 2: hard decisions with my son and confront him on things, 112 00:06:13,279 --> 00:06:18,480 Speaker 2: and that's when, unfortunately, things really started unraveling. I can't 113 00:06:18,600 --> 00:06:21,279 Speaker 2: it would take hours and hours to share all the 114 00:06:21,440 --> 00:06:24,919 Speaker 2: various stories, but anyone that's been involved in addiction understands 115 00:06:24,920 --> 00:06:31,400 Speaker 2: that painkiller addiction is so strong physiologically mentally there's that 116 00:06:31,440 --> 00:06:37,440 Speaker 2: mental obsession. I knew of drugs and investigating drug dealers 117 00:06:37,480 --> 00:06:40,039 Speaker 2: and so forth from a law enforcement standpoint, but I 118 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:44,080 Speaker 2: had no idea upfront. And I think anybody that truly 119 00:06:44,200 --> 00:06:48,800 Speaker 2: understands the addictive lifestyle, you really don't truly understand it 120 00:06:48,880 --> 00:06:52,400 Speaker 2: unless you know somebody or have experienced that firsthand. And 121 00:06:52,440 --> 00:06:54,599 Speaker 2: that's what we were starting to experience some of the 122 00:06:54,680 --> 00:06:58,960 Speaker 2: behavioral patterns. And that was probably the hardest thing, going 123 00:06:58,960 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 2: to make some tough decision where Grant then ended up 124 00:07:02,120 --> 00:07:05,520 Speaker 2: losing his position at the church, which was devastating because 125 00:07:05,520 --> 00:07:08,440 Speaker 2: I was I had to bring him forward on some 126 00:07:08,600 --> 00:07:11,760 Speaker 2: of that, which was hard. It was almost I felt 127 00:07:11,760 --> 00:07:15,160 Speaker 2: like it was almost Abraham and Isaac story where Abraham 128 00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:16,880 Speaker 2: was offering up his son. I knew it was the 129 00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:19,480 Speaker 2: right thing to do to let the church know. He 130 00:07:19,560 --> 00:07:22,360 Speaker 2: then lost his marriage in that time, and then that 131 00:07:22,480 --> 00:07:27,280 Speaker 2: started several more years of rehab centers trying to get 132 00:07:27,360 --> 00:07:29,760 Speaker 2: him the best that we could, all the way from 133 00:07:29,840 --> 00:07:33,480 Speaker 2: Laguna Hills, California, which we were ignorant at the time, 134 00:07:33,640 --> 00:07:36,440 Speaker 2: not knowing what does rehab look like on this so 135 00:07:36,480 --> 00:07:38,440 Speaker 2: we just we knew we wanted the best for our son. 136 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:42,160 Speaker 2: And I remember that very after that very first program, 137 00:07:42,240 --> 00:07:46,000 Speaker 2: It was just a month, and that was in twenty fourteen, 138 00:07:46,800 --> 00:07:49,840 Speaker 2: and remember we did the Prodigal Sun story. We had 139 00:07:50,000 --> 00:07:53,120 Speaker 2: his best man over to our house. I went and 140 00:07:53,120 --> 00:07:56,160 Speaker 2: picked up Grant from the airport. We were going to 141 00:07:56,200 --> 00:07:58,960 Speaker 2: celebrate that our son had turned the corner. It was 142 00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:01,320 Speaker 2: a great day. We thought, now this is going to 143 00:08:01,320 --> 00:08:04,640 Speaker 2: be it. He's passed the health issues. We send him 144 00:08:04,640 --> 00:08:08,320 Speaker 2: to rehab and that'll be it. And unfortunately, that was 145 00:08:08,440 --> 00:08:12,920 Speaker 2: just the start of over twenty different rehab stints over 146 00:08:13,000 --> 00:08:17,160 Speaker 2: the next several years. But during that time, I can 147 00:08:17,200 --> 00:08:17,600 Speaker 2: tell you. 148 00:08:17,480 --> 00:08:19,360 Speaker 1: Too, how did you say you were kind of naive 149 00:08:19,440 --> 00:08:20,360 Speaker 1: to the rehab. 150 00:08:21,320 --> 00:08:23,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, I would. I would say when you're a police officer, 151 00:08:24,040 --> 00:08:26,960 Speaker 2: you know people go to rehab and you hear about 152 00:08:26,960 --> 00:08:30,080 Speaker 2: AA and NA and so forth. But I had no 153 00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:36,640 Speaker 2: idea the depth of what this addiction involved. I didn't 154 00:08:36,720 --> 00:08:40,720 Speaker 2: understand the total physiological response, the mental obsession you have 155 00:08:41,480 --> 00:08:45,080 Speaker 2: when they were literally and his surgeries would pump him 156 00:08:45,080 --> 00:08:48,240 Speaker 2: with narcotics, and looking back on it, they be and 157 00:08:48,320 --> 00:08:51,160 Speaker 2: the doctors were striving to keep him comfortable. That's what 158 00:08:51,200 --> 00:08:53,040 Speaker 2: they would say. And I remember there were times where 159 00:08:53,040 --> 00:08:55,839 Speaker 2: I saw certain behaviors that really concern me and I 160 00:08:55,840 --> 00:08:58,240 Speaker 2: would mention something. They say, mister Grossman, you just have 161 00:08:58,320 --> 00:09:01,040 Speaker 2: to trust us. Just trust us. We know how to 162 00:09:01,080 --> 00:09:03,240 Speaker 2: take care of your son. We need to make him comfortable. 163 00:09:03,280 --> 00:09:06,400 Speaker 2: But looking back, seeing him, you know, do the pump 164 00:09:06,800 --> 00:09:10,640 Speaker 2: to get more and more opioids, really makes me kind 165 00:09:10,640 --> 00:09:12,800 Speaker 2: of sick to my stomach now thinking about it. But 166 00:09:13,280 --> 00:09:16,000 Speaker 2: that was just the ignorance at the time, not truly 167 00:09:16,080 --> 00:09:19,400 Speaker 2: understanding what that was doing to my son. At the time, 168 00:09:19,880 --> 00:09:21,880 Speaker 2: we just wanted him to get better and thinking that 169 00:09:21,960 --> 00:09:25,360 Speaker 2: after the surgeries and after the narcotics wore off, he'd 170 00:09:25,400 --> 00:09:27,600 Speaker 2: be okay, and that was far from the truth. 171 00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:32,440 Speaker 1: It's interesting because when I had I had surgery in 172 00:09:32,480 --> 00:09:36,440 Speaker 1: twenty fifteen, and when I left the hospital, they sent 173 00:09:36,480 --> 00:09:41,320 Speaker 1: me home with massive amounts of narcotics. It was shocking. 174 00:09:41,400 --> 00:09:44,480 Speaker 1: I mean, I couldn't use them up to this day, 175 00:09:44,559 --> 00:09:48,720 Speaker 1: you know. And that was in twenty fifteen, and I was, 176 00:09:49,360 --> 00:09:52,000 Speaker 1: you know, I didn't think anything of it, but I 177 00:09:52,040 --> 00:09:56,080 Speaker 1: didn't use them. I had a terrible reaction where if 178 00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:58,280 Speaker 1: I took one pill, I couldn't wake up. I just 179 00:09:58,320 --> 00:10:01,439 Speaker 1: couldn't function at all. And I know that that has 180 00:10:01,480 --> 00:10:04,120 Speaker 1: a different effect on different people. But then I had 181 00:10:04,120 --> 00:10:06,959 Speaker 1: another surgery in twenty nineteen and they sent me home 182 00:10:07,000 --> 00:10:09,960 Speaker 1: with advil, and I thought, that's so interesting. And I 183 00:10:10,040 --> 00:10:14,800 Speaker 1: spoke to some people who had been in government at 184 00:10:14,800 --> 00:10:18,880 Speaker 1: the time between that twenty fifteen and twenty nineteen surgery, 185 00:10:18,920 --> 00:10:22,000 Speaker 1: and they said that they've changed this quite a bit, 186 00:10:22,040 --> 00:10:25,800 Speaker 1: that hospitals aren't allowed to prescribe that kind of narcotic. 187 00:10:25,880 --> 00:10:26,000 Speaker 3: Now. 188 00:10:26,040 --> 00:10:27,840 Speaker 1: I don't know if that would be the case with 189 00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:32,120 Speaker 1: the pump and during surgery, but it seems, I mean, 190 00:10:32,120 --> 00:10:34,560 Speaker 1: you're not alone. This happened to a lot of people. 191 00:10:35,400 --> 00:10:39,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, And we saw that quite a bit because what 192 00:10:40,240 --> 00:10:42,960 Speaker 2: Grant learned really quickly is he could go to doctors 193 00:10:43,000 --> 00:10:44,920 Speaker 2: and just say he had still had pain because he 194 00:10:44,960 --> 00:10:48,400 Speaker 2: still had his disease that was causing some severe physical pain. 195 00:10:48,480 --> 00:10:51,640 Speaker 2: So he had an easy out for the doctor to 196 00:10:51,640 --> 00:10:54,120 Speaker 2: write a script for him to give him more pain meds. 197 00:10:54,200 --> 00:10:58,080 Speaker 2: We learned later on Grant would become sober and come 198 00:10:58,120 --> 00:11:01,600 Speaker 2: out of a rehab and by's grace, we continue to 199 00:11:01,600 --> 00:11:06,920 Speaker 2: have a very close relationship even with with this dark 200 00:11:07,000 --> 00:11:09,640 Speaker 2: side that was going on, and he would share very 201 00:11:09,640 --> 00:11:11,840 Speaker 2: honestly with me because I would ask him, I'd say, son, 202 00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:14,400 Speaker 2: can you can you fill me on on what's going 203 00:11:14,440 --> 00:11:15,960 Speaker 2: on so that I can not only help you, but 204 00:11:16,080 --> 00:11:19,560 Speaker 2: help others, And uh yeah, he would. He would be 205 00:11:19,760 --> 00:11:22,360 Speaker 2: very frank about how easy it was to get pain 206 00:11:22,480 --> 00:11:25,720 Speaker 2: meds from the doctors and so forth, just by simply 207 00:11:25,760 --> 00:11:28,600 Speaker 2: saying he had pain. So that was that was more 208 00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:32,040 Speaker 2: than frustrating. And again going back to the only way 209 00:11:32,080 --> 00:11:34,359 Speaker 2: we could deal with that at the time was continuing 210 00:11:34,440 --> 00:11:37,920 Speaker 2: to offer our son up in prayer because when we 211 00:11:37,960 --> 00:11:41,320 Speaker 2: couldn't see him, when he was gone and homeless or 212 00:11:42,440 --> 00:11:46,160 Speaker 2: in a rehab center. That's what God definitely showed us 213 00:11:46,200 --> 00:11:48,280 Speaker 2: in those times because there were so many things we 214 00:11:48,360 --> 00:11:51,040 Speaker 2: wanted to do. We we had the best rehab programs, 215 00:11:51,080 --> 00:11:54,920 Speaker 2: we had the best counseling, we had the best psychiatrist. 216 00:11:54,960 --> 00:11:58,440 Speaker 2: At times, just trying everything, and I'm convinced the Lord 217 00:11:58,600 --> 00:12:02,080 Speaker 2: just wanted to show us that I'm the one that's 218 00:12:02,120 --> 00:12:04,920 Speaker 2: in control. I'm the one that can only help and 219 00:12:04,960 --> 00:12:08,000 Speaker 2: deliver your son overall. And that's what gave us the 220 00:12:08,040 --> 00:12:12,320 Speaker 2: strength in each of these relapses or overdoses over those 221 00:12:12,760 --> 00:12:13,440 Speaker 2: ten years. 222 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:16,480 Speaker 3: Let's take a quick commercial break. We'll continue next on 223 00:12:16,520 --> 00:12:18,560 Speaker 3: the Tutor Dixon Podcast. 224 00:12:21,200 --> 00:12:24,520 Speaker 1: What is that hope in God like through a tragedy 225 00:12:24,600 --> 00:12:28,480 Speaker 1: like this, Because I mean I obviously experienced that when 226 00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:30,520 Speaker 1: I had cancer and I was going through that. I 227 00:12:30,559 --> 00:12:36,280 Speaker 1: remember this overwhelming feeling of no matter what happens, it's 228 00:12:36,720 --> 00:12:39,520 Speaker 1: kind of a selfish feeling for me, this is a 229 00:12:39,559 --> 00:12:42,800 Speaker 1: win win. I either go to be with the Lord 230 00:12:43,000 --> 00:12:46,000 Speaker 1: or I stay here with my kids. But you have 231 00:12:46,080 --> 00:12:49,160 Speaker 1: this tremendous guilt like I'm sick and I'm letting them down. 232 00:12:49,480 --> 00:12:53,440 Speaker 1: And I imagine probably from your son's perspective, there was 233 00:12:53,760 --> 00:12:57,280 Speaker 1: a lot of guilt there as well, and he probably 234 00:12:57,280 --> 00:13:00,360 Speaker 1: couldn't even tell you how much guilt there was. But 235 00:13:00,520 --> 00:13:05,880 Speaker 1: for you going through this, there is this like I 236 00:13:06,040 --> 00:13:08,160 Speaker 1: just I can't. You can put it into words better 237 00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:11,880 Speaker 1: than I can. The way that faith gets you, through 238 00:13:11,960 --> 00:13:15,360 Speaker 1: the way that God carries you in these moments is 239 00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:19,640 Speaker 1: so it's shocking because you think I can't do this, 240 00:13:19,800 --> 00:13:20,720 Speaker 1: and yet he's there. 241 00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:24,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, I would say it's I usually explain it to people. 242 00:13:24,679 --> 00:13:27,800 Speaker 2: It's like working out. I enjoy physical fitness and so 243 00:13:28,400 --> 00:13:31,920 Speaker 2: spiritual fitness. You need to exercise your faith muscles, is 244 00:13:31,960 --> 00:13:34,720 Speaker 2: the best way I can explain it. And I believe 245 00:13:34,800 --> 00:13:38,280 Speaker 2: if you don't, your muscles become atrophied. And so during 246 00:13:38,320 --> 00:13:42,200 Speaker 2: those times, and looking back on those fifteen years of 247 00:13:42,280 --> 00:13:44,800 Speaker 2: going through this, from the illness, through all the surgeries 248 00:13:44,840 --> 00:13:47,439 Speaker 2: to grant to death, it was so obvious Tutor that 249 00:13:47,920 --> 00:13:50,800 Speaker 2: God just wanted to continue to give us little tests, 250 00:13:50,840 --> 00:13:52,480 Speaker 2: not to be mean to us, but because of his 251 00:13:52,640 --> 00:13:55,400 Speaker 2: love for my wife and I and my daughter going 252 00:13:55,440 --> 00:13:58,760 Speaker 2: through this, that he wanted us to test our faith. 253 00:13:58,800 --> 00:14:00,760 Speaker 2: And one of the first ones it pops into my 254 00:14:00,840 --> 00:14:04,160 Speaker 2: mind was in twenty sixteen. It was after his seventh surgery, 255 00:14:04,760 --> 00:14:08,920 Speaker 2: and I remember he was at home with us, and 256 00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:11,880 Speaker 2: I had gone to a fundraiser for a prison ministry. 257 00:14:12,200 --> 00:14:14,440 Speaker 2: Beth was home with him. All of a sudden, I 258 00:14:14,520 --> 00:14:16,839 Speaker 2: was in the middle of that and my wife calls 259 00:14:16,840 --> 00:14:20,160 Speaker 2: me and says, Brad, you got to come home right away. 260 00:14:20,160 --> 00:14:22,880 Speaker 2: I said, what's going on, she goes Grant's gone. He 261 00:14:22,960 --> 00:14:26,640 Speaker 2: had just gotten out of surgery, his seventh one, maybe 262 00:14:26,680 --> 00:14:30,440 Speaker 2: two days prior to that, in his bed, and that 263 00:14:31,080 --> 00:14:34,160 Speaker 2: draw for the painkillers was so great, because we were 264 00:14:34,400 --> 00:14:37,000 Speaker 2: always encouraging him to not use them, just because we 265 00:14:37,040 --> 00:14:41,040 Speaker 2: could see things. And anyway, he ended up walking several 266 00:14:41,120 --> 00:14:44,640 Speaker 2: miles to an er just to get the pain meds. 267 00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:47,720 Speaker 2: I felt like I knew where he was going, so 268 00:14:47,800 --> 00:14:50,120 Speaker 2: I went there and got there just in time to 269 00:14:50,160 --> 00:14:52,280 Speaker 2: pull back the curtain in the er to see the 270 00:14:52,320 --> 00:14:57,640 Speaker 2: doctor about ready to give him a shot of his 271 00:14:57,680 --> 00:15:01,520 Speaker 2: pain meds delauded at the time. He wasn't very happy 272 00:15:01,520 --> 00:15:05,200 Speaker 2: about that. But I went to take him home, walking 273 00:15:05,240 --> 00:15:08,440 Speaker 2: out to the car, and he ended up keep walking. 274 00:15:08,920 --> 00:15:10,960 Speaker 2: It was so strong in him that he just kept walking. 275 00:15:10,960 --> 00:15:13,480 Speaker 2: I said, son, please get in the car. Please, Son, 276 00:15:13,520 --> 00:15:17,320 Speaker 2: get in the car, and he starts walking down the road. 277 00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:19,040 Speaker 2: And I felt like it was at that when it 278 00:15:19,080 --> 00:15:20,760 Speaker 2: was one of the most critical times that the Lord 279 00:15:20,840 --> 00:15:22,640 Speaker 2: was just saying, Brad, this is time you got to 280 00:15:22,720 --> 00:15:25,200 Speaker 2: let your son go. I will take care of him. 281 00:15:25,360 --> 00:15:27,720 Speaker 2: I will watch over him. And I'm sitting there thinking 282 00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:30,920 Speaker 2: he's barely he's walking like an old man. He had 283 00:15:30,960 --> 00:15:33,200 Speaker 2: lost so much weight. He just got done with surgery, 284 00:15:33,280 --> 00:15:36,560 Speaker 2: had all the bandages and so forth, and I just 285 00:15:36,560 --> 00:15:38,600 Speaker 2: felt like that's what I needed to do. So I 286 00:15:38,680 --> 00:15:42,360 Speaker 2: went home, leaving my son at eleven pm on a road, 287 00:15:42,600 --> 00:15:44,920 Speaker 2: not knowing where he was going, and went home and 288 00:15:44,960 --> 00:15:49,560 Speaker 2: my wife was like, where's Grant? I said, sweetheart, he 289 00:15:49,680 --> 00:15:52,160 Speaker 2: just kept on walking. He wouldn't come with me, and 290 00:15:52,200 --> 00:15:53,840 Speaker 2: we just need to pray. So we got down on 291 00:15:53,840 --> 00:15:56,400 Speaker 2: our knees next to our bed and just asked the 292 00:15:56,440 --> 00:15:59,640 Speaker 2: Lord to please watch over our son, committing him to 293 00:15:59,680 --> 00:16:02,720 Speaker 2: the low, and by God's grace, we were able to 294 00:16:02,760 --> 00:16:04,520 Speaker 2: go to sleep. Because I remember church was the next 295 00:16:04,520 --> 00:16:07,080 Speaker 2: morning we were both serving. Obviously it was on our 296 00:16:07,120 --> 00:16:10,160 Speaker 2: mind the whole time as I'm sitting in service. But 297 00:16:11,320 --> 00:16:13,280 Speaker 2: it was later that afternoon that we get a call 298 00:16:13,320 --> 00:16:16,160 Speaker 2: from Grant. He's like, Dad, it's Grant, It said, son, 299 00:16:16,200 --> 00:16:18,920 Speaker 2: where are you? He's like, I walked to such and 300 00:16:18,960 --> 00:16:22,520 Speaker 2: such hospital, which was easily about seven miles away, and 301 00:16:22,560 --> 00:16:25,320 Speaker 2: he goes, I can't do this anymore, dead, Daddy, will 302 00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:29,280 Speaker 2: you come and get me? And I remember driving over 303 00:16:29,320 --> 00:16:32,360 Speaker 2: there to get him. And that was just one of 304 00:16:32,440 --> 00:16:36,360 Speaker 2: several opportunities that I believe God by his grace alone, 305 00:16:36,400 --> 00:16:39,720 Speaker 2: not because I was strong, but gave me the grace 306 00:16:39,800 --> 00:16:42,160 Speaker 2: to want to always focus in on letting my son 307 00:16:42,360 --> 00:16:45,640 Speaker 2: see Jesus Christ through his earthly Father, which is exactly 308 00:16:45,680 --> 00:16:48,160 Speaker 2: what we want during Easter right. We want people to 309 00:16:48,200 --> 00:16:53,080 Speaker 2: be able to truly understand that morning comes before rejoicing, 310 00:16:53,200 --> 00:16:55,440 Speaker 2: but also that we want people to be able to 311 00:16:55,480 --> 00:16:58,040 Speaker 2: see Jesus and the way he sees his best is 312 00:16:58,080 --> 00:17:02,040 Speaker 2: through love loving one another. And there were some of 313 00:17:02,080 --> 00:17:05,160 Speaker 2: the greatest times, as hard as there were ment there 314 00:17:05,200 --> 00:17:07,800 Speaker 2: as many as there were hard times, there were also 315 00:17:07,840 --> 00:17:10,080 Speaker 2: those precious moments where I felt like the Lord gave 316 00:17:10,119 --> 00:17:13,240 Speaker 2: me chances where my son would say, Dad, thank you 317 00:17:13,280 --> 00:17:15,960 Speaker 2: for helping me to see God through you, thank you 318 00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:19,320 Speaker 2: for forgiving me like God does, because it made me 319 00:17:19,400 --> 00:17:22,919 Speaker 2: feel it strengthened me so much to know that that 320 00:17:23,080 --> 00:17:24,840 Speaker 2: was my main mission. I just wanted to honor the 321 00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:28,159 Speaker 2: Lord when I focused on the circumstances or myself and 322 00:17:28,200 --> 00:17:31,000 Speaker 2: what was maybe happening to my son. How could God, 323 00:17:31,040 --> 00:17:34,119 Speaker 2: how could you take a young man who was serving 324 00:17:34,119 --> 00:17:36,679 Speaker 2: you as a pastor, who was married to a godly woman, 325 00:17:37,359 --> 00:17:39,679 Speaker 2: where things were going so well? How could you allow this, 326 00:17:39,800 --> 00:17:42,960 Speaker 2: which I think is such a common one. How can 327 00:17:43,000 --> 00:17:47,679 Speaker 2: God allow suffering in situations like this with good people? 328 00:17:48,080 --> 00:17:50,159 Speaker 2: And I feel like he really showed my wife and 329 00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:52,680 Speaker 2: I both that that it wasn't about us, It was 330 00:17:52,760 --> 00:17:57,360 Speaker 2: about this is a broken world. It's a broken world 331 00:17:57,400 --> 00:17:59,439 Speaker 2: where there's going to be a lot of suffering, and 332 00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:02,439 Speaker 2: when we can keep our eyes fixed on Jesus, just 333 00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:05,800 Speaker 2: like Hebrews twelve two says so beautifully, and it says, 334 00:18:05,880 --> 00:18:08,320 Speaker 2: let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the Author and 335 00:18:08,359 --> 00:18:11,200 Speaker 2: perfector of our faith, who for the joy set before him, 336 00:18:11,600 --> 00:18:14,439 Speaker 2: endured the cross, scorning at shame and sat down at 337 00:18:14,440 --> 00:18:17,439 Speaker 2: the right hand of the throne of God. So Jesus Christ, 338 00:18:17,520 --> 00:18:21,560 Speaker 2: before he was crucified, was able to experience joy and 339 00:18:21,560 --> 00:18:24,800 Speaker 2: strengthen power from his heavenly Father by keeping his eyes 340 00:18:25,119 --> 00:18:28,280 Speaker 2: fixed on his heavenly Father. So, by God's grace, I 341 00:18:28,280 --> 00:18:31,879 Speaker 2: had such a wonderful wife who Beth was strong and 342 00:18:31,960 --> 00:18:35,920 Speaker 2: believed the same way, and together we would just encourage 343 00:18:35,920 --> 00:18:40,400 Speaker 2: each other in that back and forth through multiple relapses. 344 00:18:41,280 --> 00:18:45,320 Speaker 2: And it's such an up and down roller coaster. You said, 345 00:18:45,359 --> 00:18:48,560 Speaker 2: you've experienced that a little bit. Anybody that's dealt with 346 00:18:48,600 --> 00:18:53,360 Speaker 2: addiction knows a It's a cruel roller coaster. Is It's 347 00:18:53,400 --> 00:18:55,880 Speaker 2: actually very cruel because there were times I would say, God, 348 00:18:55,880 --> 00:18:59,040 Speaker 2: I don't understand why this is going on, but I'm 349 00:18:59,040 --> 00:19:01,960 Speaker 2: going to trust you because I believe in who you are. 350 00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:04,280 Speaker 2: I believe in your word. And that gave me so 351 00:19:04,400 --> 00:19:07,880 Speaker 2: much strength as reminding myself and then reminding my bride, 352 00:19:07,920 --> 00:19:12,080 Speaker 2: and she would remind me who is God. He's sovereign overall, 353 00:19:12,160 --> 00:19:16,920 Speaker 2: he's all powerful, He's infinite in love. The hardest obstacle 354 00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:20,440 Speaker 2: or the hardest hurdle tutor was, He's good all the time. 355 00:19:21,440 --> 00:19:25,080 Speaker 2: God's good all the time. He's good. When my son 356 00:19:25,200 --> 00:19:29,080 Speaker 2: was just graduated for another rehab program, he just got 357 00:19:29,080 --> 00:19:34,040 Speaker 2: another job, he was working on restoring his marriage, and 358 00:19:34,080 --> 00:19:37,920 Speaker 2: then a relapse or an overdose, that's good. And yet 359 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:40,919 Speaker 2: it comes back to like King David did. All throughout 360 00:19:40,960 --> 00:19:44,320 Speaker 2: the Psalms, God wants us to cry out to him, 361 00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:46,920 Speaker 2: but he also wants us to come back to the truth. 362 00:19:46,960 --> 00:19:49,040 Speaker 2: And the truth is that we must trust him in 363 00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:53,359 Speaker 2: the end. And I would say Psalm thirty four seventeen 364 00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:55,680 Speaker 2: and eighteen comes back to me right now, which is 365 00:19:55,720 --> 00:19:58,960 Speaker 2: some of my favorites it says, the righteous cry out, 366 00:19:59,160 --> 00:20:01,520 Speaker 2: and the Lord hears them and delivers them from all 367 00:20:01,520 --> 00:20:04,439 Speaker 2: their troubles. The Lord is close to the broken hearted 368 00:20:04,440 --> 00:20:07,480 Speaker 2: and saves those who are crushed in spirit. The righteous 369 00:20:07,520 --> 00:20:10,000 Speaker 2: man may have many troubles, but the Lord delivers him 370 00:20:10,000 --> 00:20:12,560 Speaker 2: from them all. I can remember a time kneeling next 371 00:20:12,560 --> 00:20:15,240 Speaker 2: to my bed with my wife and my arms as 372 00:20:15,440 --> 00:20:19,240 Speaker 2: she's weeping after another overdose, and we're just crying that 373 00:20:19,320 --> 00:20:22,080 Speaker 2: out and praying that to God, and the peace of 374 00:20:22,160 --> 00:20:25,960 Speaker 2: God that really does transcend all understanding. Was incredible in 375 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:28,560 Speaker 2: those moments. You can't make that up. It wasn't because 376 00:20:28,560 --> 00:20:32,240 Speaker 2: I was strong. It was definitely because of God's strength 377 00:20:32,240 --> 00:20:32,800 Speaker 2: in that moment. 378 00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:36,919 Speaker 1: And look at how many lives have been saved because 379 00:20:36,960 --> 00:20:41,120 Speaker 1: of your story. At Grant's experience and Grant's life has 380 00:20:41,200 --> 00:20:45,320 Speaker 1: led you to minister to twenties, to minister to young 381 00:20:45,359 --> 00:20:49,000 Speaker 1: people and bring them to the Lord and save their lives. 382 00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:51,800 Speaker 1: And I think that you have to look at these 383 00:20:51,840 --> 00:20:55,400 Speaker 1: stories and say, how is God using this? And how 384 00:20:55,520 --> 00:20:58,160 Speaker 1: is God using you? And really, when I heard your 385 00:20:58,160 --> 00:21:00,520 Speaker 1: story the first time and my kids were said next 386 00:21:00,520 --> 00:21:03,320 Speaker 1: to me, one of my daughters says to me, is 387 00:21:03,320 --> 00:21:05,840 Speaker 1: there a time when you could get so mad at 388 00:21:05,880 --> 00:21:08,840 Speaker 1: me that you would not love me anymore. And I 389 00:21:08,920 --> 00:21:12,879 Speaker 1: always tell her, it's just like God, that doesn't happen. 390 00:21:12,920 --> 00:21:15,439 Speaker 1: It's not possible. It's not possible for me to stop 391 00:21:15,480 --> 00:21:19,720 Speaker 1: loving you. And your story was that depiction, so colorful 392 00:21:20,280 --> 00:21:25,120 Speaker 1: to see how no matter what you were like, when 393 00:21:25,160 --> 00:21:29,359 Speaker 1: he calls, I'll be there. But there was also also 394 00:21:29,440 --> 00:21:31,960 Speaker 1: that story that we hear in the Bible of but 395 00:21:32,040 --> 00:21:35,280 Speaker 1: I have to let him make his mistakes too. I can't. 396 00:21:35,400 --> 00:21:39,080 Speaker 1: I can't save him. You had to let him walk 397 00:21:39,119 --> 00:21:42,400 Speaker 1: away that day, and that to me was incredibly powerful 398 00:21:42,440 --> 00:21:46,840 Speaker 1: because God allows us to make mistakes. But no matter what, 399 00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:50,400 Speaker 1: God is always there. God will all when we come back. 400 00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:53,120 Speaker 1: He is always waiting, He's always looking for us, He's 401 00:21:53,119 --> 00:21:56,600 Speaker 1: always searching for us. And that was your story. That 402 00:21:56,800 --> 00:21:59,280 Speaker 1: was what hit me about your story. I like your 403 00:21:59,359 --> 00:22:02,920 Speaker 1: story is really all of our stories. It's how powerful 404 00:22:03,080 --> 00:22:05,879 Speaker 1: the love of a father is, and the ultimate father 405 00:22:06,080 --> 00:22:07,879 Speaker 1: is His love is so much greater than that. 406 00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:11,520 Speaker 2: Amen. Yeah. And I remember one time picking up Grant 407 00:22:11,640 --> 00:22:15,200 Speaker 2: from it was one of the rehab centers that he 408 00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:17,119 Speaker 2: had to leave, and so I was taking him to 409 00:22:17,200 --> 00:22:20,360 Speaker 2: another one and as we were driving there. I took 410 00:22:20,400 --> 00:22:22,400 Speaker 2: his hand and just told him how much I love him, 411 00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:25,600 Speaker 2: and I made it a point each time after each relapse. 412 00:22:26,560 --> 00:22:30,040 Speaker 2: After unfortunately, my wife and daughter and I all three 413 00:22:30,040 --> 00:22:32,840 Speaker 2: of us, had an opportunity where he overdosed near us, 414 00:22:33,480 --> 00:22:37,200 Speaker 2: and I can still remember after that just telling him, son, 415 00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:38,879 Speaker 2: I want you to know that no matter what you 416 00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:41,880 Speaker 2: ever do, my love for you will never change. That's 417 00:22:41,920 --> 00:22:45,359 Speaker 2: from Roman's eight God's love. Well, we will never be 418 00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:47,680 Speaker 2: separated from God's love. So I just wanted my son 419 00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:50,520 Speaker 2: to know that, and especially the time that he was 420 00:22:50,680 --> 00:22:53,520 Speaker 2: went missing. That was probably the scariest moment. He was 421 00:22:53,560 --> 00:22:56,600 Speaker 2: gone for eighteen days. He had left a rehab center. 422 00:22:57,200 --> 00:22:59,200 Speaker 2: I had called just to check up and they said, yeah, 423 00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:00,880 Speaker 2: we haven't seen him. I said, what do you mean, 424 00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:03,760 Speaker 2: you haven't seen him. It was in Chicago, where there's 425 00:23:04,160 --> 00:23:06,399 Speaker 2: in this rehab center. God blessed them, but it was 426 00:23:06,440 --> 00:23:09,920 Speaker 2: right in the middle of where there was heroin drug 427 00:23:10,040 --> 00:23:14,040 Speaker 2: use rampant. He left without his phone, without his luggage, 428 00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:16,320 Speaker 2: and I knew that wasn't good. And that was a 429 00:23:16,359 --> 00:23:20,639 Speaker 2: moment where I ended up contacting the morgue. I contacted 430 00:23:20,640 --> 00:23:23,520 Speaker 2: the hospitals. I went down there with a friend of 431 00:23:23,520 --> 00:23:26,680 Speaker 2: mine just to look for him. Went visiting different homeless shelters, 432 00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:29,880 Speaker 2: had a picture of him showing showing them to him, 433 00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:33,400 Speaker 2: and probably spent several hours because I'd gotten a message 434 00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:36,600 Speaker 2: from somebody through Facebook they thought they saw Grant. So 435 00:23:36,680 --> 00:23:39,440 Speaker 2: that was what I did for several hours. I came 436 00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:41,359 Speaker 2: back home and it was so clear that the Lord 437 00:23:41,480 --> 00:23:44,119 Speaker 2: was saying, you need to just trust me in this again. 438 00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:46,800 Speaker 2: So I got down on my knees and prayed, and 439 00:23:47,240 --> 00:23:49,600 Speaker 2: Beth and I prayed together and just said, God, we 440 00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:53,040 Speaker 2: know you're the ultimate protector. We don't know where he's at. 441 00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:55,600 Speaker 2: And the reason I know I went down there is 442 00:23:55,600 --> 00:23:59,600 Speaker 2: because I didn't want I didn't want to have somebody 443 00:23:59,640 --> 00:24:01,920 Speaker 2: else fin him. I didn't want him to die in 444 00:24:01,960 --> 00:24:04,720 Speaker 2: some alley or some other place. It was just such 445 00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:07,040 Speaker 2: a strong poll and Beth was supportive. But when I 446 00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:09,320 Speaker 2: got home, I know the Lord was saying, you now 447 00:24:09,359 --> 00:24:11,720 Speaker 2: need to trust me. You did your part, but let 448 00:24:11,760 --> 00:24:15,680 Speaker 2: me watch over your son. And it wasn't more than 449 00:24:15,720 --> 00:24:19,440 Speaker 2: twenty minutes that Beth comes downstairs, said Brad, I just 450 00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:22,080 Speaker 2: got a call from Grant from some hotel that he 451 00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:24,760 Speaker 2: had walked from the city to a town that was 452 00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:28,000 Speaker 2: only about seven miles from us, and so we immediately 453 00:24:28,480 --> 00:24:31,480 Speaker 2: jumped in the car drove there to see him, all weathered, 454 00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:35,080 Speaker 2: his hands were swollen because he had had to beat 455 00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:38,000 Speaker 2: off some attackers when he was living in this homeless 456 00:24:38,119 --> 00:24:42,680 Speaker 2: camp underneath a bridge. It was, and in that moment too, 457 00:24:42,840 --> 00:24:46,320 Speaker 2: just giving him a hug. I think back now, toutor 458 00:24:46,359 --> 00:24:50,880 Speaker 2: your opinion of homelessness, your opinion of those dealing with addiction. 459 00:24:51,600 --> 00:24:55,720 Speaker 2: God was preparing us for ministry opportunities, even though seeing 460 00:24:55,760 --> 00:25:03,919 Speaker 2: our son in desolate places, in such low positions, gives me, 461 00:25:04,119 --> 00:25:07,800 Speaker 2: and has given me such a much more compassionate heart, 462 00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:09,880 Speaker 2: not because of my own strength, because of my own 463 00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:15,440 Speaker 2: selfishness and maybe self righteousness at times. Being able to 464 00:25:15,480 --> 00:25:19,440 Speaker 2: look at people through God's eyes, I believe is one 465 00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:21,560 Speaker 2: of the reasons why He took us through so many 466 00:25:21,560 --> 00:25:24,200 Speaker 2: of those Because I didn't understand homelessness before. I didn't 467 00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:26,760 Speaker 2: understand the life of addiction. I didn't know what it 468 00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:30,280 Speaker 2: was like to experience an overdose, or have to forgive 469 00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:34,240 Speaker 2: someone time and time and time again, to feel betrayed 470 00:25:34,960 --> 00:25:38,720 Speaker 2: numerous times. Yet it was only through the power of 471 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:42,199 Speaker 2: God's love that I could forgive my son Grant, that 472 00:25:42,240 --> 00:25:45,040 Speaker 2: I could continue to look at him with eyes of love, 473 00:25:45,080 --> 00:25:48,680 Speaker 2: because it wasn't. I wasn't. I didn't have the capacity 474 00:25:48,760 --> 00:25:50,920 Speaker 2: to do that in my own strength. And my wife 475 00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:53,840 Speaker 2: did the same thing. And we look back on that thinking, 476 00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:56,359 Speaker 2: how good of God to allow us to still have 477 00:25:56,440 --> 00:25:59,680 Speaker 2: an intimate relationship with our son for all those years, 478 00:26:00,119 --> 00:26:05,160 Speaker 2: been through all the incredibly hard and tragic times. Only 479 00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:06,040 Speaker 2: God could do that. 480 00:26:06,240 --> 00:26:08,959 Speaker 3: Let's take a quick commercial break. We'll continue next on 481 00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:15,160 Speaker 3: the Tutor Dixon Podcast. Your story is so powerful for 482 00:26:15,200 --> 00:26:17,960 Speaker 3: families going through this because I think so many people 483 00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:21,879 Speaker 3: feel shame about this, and your story is very clear 484 00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:24,760 Speaker 3: that this is not a certain group, that there is 485 00:26:24,800 --> 00:26:27,000 Speaker 3: no discrimination when it comes to addiction. 486 00:26:27,160 --> 00:26:30,720 Speaker 1: It can attack anyone, it can come after anyone, and 487 00:26:30,960 --> 00:26:36,000 Speaker 1: there's one way to power through that, and that is 488 00:26:36,359 --> 00:26:36,840 Speaker 1: with God. 489 00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:41,480 Speaker 2: Amen. Amen. And I had gone into all the rehab 490 00:26:41,520 --> 00:26:44,119 Speaker 2: centers when I would drop Grant off, and one I 491 00:26:44,119 --> 00:26:46,119 Speaker 2: remember had about one hundred and eighty men in this 492 00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:48,840 Speaker 2: rehab center. It was down in Missouri, and I remember 493 00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:52,680 Speaker 2: going in there, and you're exactly right. There were men, older, younger, 494 00:26:52,920 --> 00:26:57,200 Speaker 2: different races, different social backgrounds. So it touches everybody, which 495 00:26:57,240 --> 00:26:59,919 Speaker 2: I think is healthy for us as believers to understand. 496 00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:02,800 Speaker 2: And when we see a homeless person, I guarantee if 497 00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:05,359 Speaker 2: you ride with me, if anybody was to ride with 498 00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:08,640 Speaker 2: me in a car, and people have before, I can't 499 00:27:08,720 --> 00:27:11,160 Speaker 2: drive by a homeless person because I see my son. 500 00:27:11,760 --> 00:27:14,480 Speaker 2: I see my son in those moments. Just a couple 501 00:27:14,440 --> 00:27:17,120 Speaker 2: of weeks ago in Arizona, I saw a young man. 502 00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:22,000 Speaker 2: He reminded me of my son. Excuse me, and I 503 00:27:22,160 --> 00:27:25,480 Speaker 2: turned around because I wanted this young man. He was 504 00:27:25,520 --> 00:27:28,320 Speaker 2: holding up a sign like I heard somebody say they 505 00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:30,560 Speaker 2: saw my son, and so I just wanted to go 506 00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:33,280 Speaker 2: over him, telling him that God loves him and give 507 00:27:33,359 --> 00:27:35,920 Speaker 2: him some money. And people say, why would you give 508 00:27:35,960 --> 00:27:37,920 Speaker 2: me money, He's probably going to use it for drugs. 509 00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:40,720 Speaker 2: Well that's where you trust the Lord. God is sovereign. 510 00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:43,439 Speaker 2: I don't know, but I just wanted this person more 511 00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:45,640 Speaker 2: than anything to know in that moment that God loved 512 00:27:45,640 --> 00:27:48,720 Speaker 2: that young man and allowed me to pray with him. 513 00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:53,399 Speaker 2: And that's just something that God has done. And I 514 00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:56,200 Speaker 2: couldn't be more grateful looking back on what the Lord 515 00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:58,960 Speaker 2: has taught my wife and I threw all this to 516 00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:01,480 Speaker 2: be able to bring us to a place where we 517 00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:06,960 Speaker 2: now have such incredible ministry opportunities on a daily basis, 518 00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:09,600 Speaker 2: I can say, and each night when I get home 519 00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:12,439 Speaker 2: from church and Beth and I get together and have dinner, 520 00:28:13,119 --> 00:28:16,040 Speaker 2: one of our favorite times is debriefing, just talking about 521 00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:18,480 Speaker 2: the day, like we've done in almost forty two years 522 00:28:18,520 --> 00:28:21,680 Speaker 2: of marriage, but then just going on a walk and 523 00:28:21,840 --> 00:28:25,320 Speaker 2: just praying. Debriefing, but then just praying and praying for 524 00:28:25,400 --> 00:28:29,320 Speaker 2: others and praying for our twenties as you mentioned, which 525 00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:33,680 Speaker 2: they have just been an incredible gift from God, because 526 00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:35,960 Speaker 2: I can tell you there are so many times when 527 00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:40,040 Speaker 2: we are missing our son, which is on a daily basis, 528 00:28:40,200 --> 00:28:42,960 Speaker 2: where God doesn't bring one of these young men or 529 00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:46,040 Speaker 2: one of these young twenties into our lives to give 530 00:28:46,080 --> 00:28:49,640 Speaker 2: me a hug or to just be part of our 531 00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:53,840 Speaker 2: day and remind me just to fill that void. It's 532 00:28:53,840 --> 00:28:56,440 Speaker 2: so clear that God is doing that just out of 533 00:28:56,560 --> 00:29:00,600 Speaker 2: his grace and his love for my wife. And it's 534 00:29:00,600 --> 00:29:02,360 Speaker 2: such a blessing from the Lord. 535 00:29:03,600 --> 00:29:07,640 Speaker 1: And he's never missing, he's never gone, he's never not 536 00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:10,920 Speaker 1: beside you. That's the thing that I think is most beautiful. 537 00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:14,440 Speaker 1: Even the story that you tell of Grant's funeral when 538 00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:18,800 Speaker 1: you went to his to memorialize him, to celebrate his life, 539 00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:23,320 Speaker 1: and you didn't expect. I don't think you expected all 540 00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:27,000 Speaker 1: of the twenties to carpool out there and for the 541 00:29:27,040 --> 00:29:29,720 Speaker 1: pastors from Harvest to go out to be with you 542 00:29:30,520 --> 00:29:33,480 Speaker 1: and just that love that God brings together. But you 543 00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:36,200 Speaker 1: told a story about someone who had met him, a 544 00:29:36,200 --> 00:29:38,360 Speaker 1: story you didn't know, and I want you to share 545 00:29:38,400 --> 00:29:38,800 Speaker 1: that now. 546 00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:41,720 Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I would love to just start with that. 547 00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:44,080 Speaker 2: I just touch on that point with the twenties because 548 00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:48,000 Speaker 2: we were at the wake and I definitely didn't have 549 00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:51,800 Speaker 2: any idea that people would be coming from the church 550 00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:54,680 Speaker 2: because we'd only been there for about a year. I'd 551 00:29:54,680 --> 00:29:57,200 Speaker 2: only been on staff at the church for a few months. 552 00:29:57,960 --> 00:30:00,920 Speaker 2: And at the wake, looking over and seeing about seven 553 00:30:01,040 --> 00:30:04,360 Speaker 2: or eight of the pastors, seeing several of our small 554 00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:08,920 Speaker 2: group members, adult small group members, and then to see 555 00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:11,959 Speaker 2: about a dozen of our twenties at the memorial service 556 00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:14,280 Speaker 2: was something I won't ever forget. That was one of 557 00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:20,080 Speaker 2: the most powerful moments to see God's love from the 558 00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:23,080 Speaker 2: church family. That's exactly what God calls us to, especially 559 00:30:23,120 --> 00:30:25,880 Speaker 2: around Easter when he says go therefore and make disciples 560 00:30:25,880 --> 00:30:28,120 Speaker 2: of all nations. He's saying all of us to go 561 00:30:28,160 --> 00:30:32,320 Speaker 2: out there. Love one another's his greatest commandment, and for 562 00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:34,760 Speaker 2: them to do that, that definitely sent a message that 563 00:30:35,400 --> 00:30:37,200 Speaker 2: Beth and I were in the right place because that 564 00:30:37,320 --> 00:30:40,240 Speaker 2: was so powerful. But the story you're talking about is 565 00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:43,680 Speaker 2: one I won't forget either. And it was after the 566 00:30:43,720 --> 00:30:46,240 Speaker 2: memorial service. It was probably a day or so after 567 00:30:46,280 --> 00:30:49,080 Speaker 2: that when I got a message from my daughter through 568 00:30:49,120 --> 00:30:52,600 Speaker 2: Facebook saying, Daddy, this guy wanted to share a message 569 00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:55,280 Speaker 2: with you. And here's what it was. He said that 570 00:30:55,360 --> 00:30:59,360 Speaker 2: he was became an alcoholic. He was in his twenties. 571 00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:02,560 Speaker 2: He was an alcoholic, been through rehab, and he was 572 00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:04,880 Speaker 2: about ready to go to another rehab center. His parents 573 00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:07,640 Speaker 2: had kicked him out of the house, had packed his 574 00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:10,880 Speaker 2: stuff up, put it in a trash bag, give it 575 00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:13,400 Speaker 2: to him, dropped him off at this rehab center. He said, 576 00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:15,560 Speaker 2: he went in there he was going through withdrawls. He 577 00:31:15,640 --> 00:31:18,560 Speaker 2: was scared, he was alone. His parents, he felt like, 578 00:31:18,600 --> 00:31:21,520 Speaker 2: had disowned him. He walks into the rehab center to 579 00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:24,160 Speaker 2: get checked in and he looks up in the first 580 00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:26,840 Speaker 2: guy he sees is a young man, and he said 581 00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:29,960 Speaker 2: he walked over to me and gave me a handshake 582 00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:32,600 Speaker 2: and a smile and said, Hi, I'm Grant Grossman. Let 583 00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:34,960 Speaker 2: me show you around. And he said for the next 584 00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:37,640 Speaker 2: six weeks, he said, he saw my son do that 585 00:31:37,720 --> 00:31:40,320 Speaker 2: with each and every person would come in there, which 586 00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:44,000 Speaker 2: makes me think of another guy at the memorial service 587 00:31:44,360 --> 00:31:46,360 Speaker 2: that came up to me. He was a man in 588 00:31:46,400 --> 00:31:49,320 Speaker 2: his fifties. I said. He was a custodian at the 589 00:31:49,440 --> 00:31:52,200 Speaker 2: last rehab center that my son was at, and he said, 590 00:31:52,200 --> 00:31:53,960 Speaker 2: I just wanted to tell you I met your son there. 591 00:31:54,920 --> 00:31:57,800 Speaker 2: Nobody ever talks to me there. I just do the cleaning, 592 00:31:58,280 --> 00:32:00,280 Speaker 2: but each time your son would come up to me 593 00:32:00,360 --> 00:32:02,840 Speaker 2: and talk with me and showed me that he really 594 00:32:02,880 --> 00:32:06,720 Speaker 2: cared about me, and that just impacted me so much. 595 00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:09,200 Speaker 2: But this young man, going back to that, he said 596 00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:12,960 Speaker 2: he saw my son greet people there each week, that 597 00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:16,280 Speaker 2: he was there every day, greeting people as they came in. 598 00:32:16,400 --> 00:32:19,200 Speaker 2: And he said, mister Grossman, there's no doubt in my 599 00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:22,040 Speaker 2: mind that your son now is in heaven and he's 600 00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:25,160 Speaker 2: the one that's at the pearly gates greeting people as 601 00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:28,520 Speaker 2: they walk in to Heaven, saying Hi, I'm Grant Grossman. 602 00:32:28,920 --> 00:32:37,000 Speaker 2: Welcome to heaven. And oh boy, that was a beautiful 603 00:32:37,040 --> 00:32:39,720 Speaker 2: message to get. My wife and I and my daughter 604 00:32:39,920 --> 00:32:45,400 Speaker 2: Whitney really embrace that that memory because we can really 605 00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:47,200 Speaker 2: picture that. As a matter of fact, we've got chimes 606 00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:50,080 Speaker 2: in our condo here that we go over and just 607 00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:54,160 Speaker 2: like to hit him a little bit and say hello, Grant, 608 00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:59,080 Speaker 2: hope you're having a great day son. Sob, I think. 609 00:32:59,040 --> 00:33:03,880 Speaker 1: That story to me so powerful because even going through that, 610 00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:10,000 Speaker 1: even when he was struggling so much, he was being Jesus. 611 00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:13,040 Speaker 1: I mean, that's the beauty of a foundation in faith, 612 00:33:13,360 --> 00:33:18,640 Speaker 1: is that even though he was struggling with demons, there 613 00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:23,200 Speaker 1: was so Jesus was so much stronger, so much stronger 614 00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:25,760 Speaker 1: in his life that that still played out no matter 615 00:33:25,800 --> 00:33:29,480 Speaker 1: where he was. And you must be so impressed with 616 00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:33,640 Speaker 1: how God worked through him, even in those in dark places, 617 00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:35,240 Speaker 1: God was working through him. 618 00:33:35,600 --> 00:33:38,240 Speaker 2: Amen, tutor, And you just made me think of another 619 00:33:38,920 --> 00:33:41,600 Speaker 2: It was a I'll say, it's another spiritual epiphany where 620 00:33:41,600 --> 00:33:44,160 Speaker 2: the Lord taught me because I'm always wanting to learn, Lord, 621 00:33:44,200 --> 00:33:45,960 Speaker 2: show me, show me what you want me to learn. 622 00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:48,200 Speaker 2: This life isn't about me. I want to learn more 623 00:33:48,240 --> 00:33:50,840 Speaker 2: from you so that I can love others like you do. 624 00:33:51,520 --> 00:33:54,720 Speaker 2: And it came to me at a point in time 625 00:33:54,760 --> 00:33:57,440 Speaker 2: where I was my goal or my hopes for my 626 00:33:57,560 --> 00:33:59,400 Speaker 2: son was to be a pastor. I mean, I thought 627 00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:01,800 Speaker 2: that was awesome for my son to be a pastor 628 00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:04,240 Speaker 2: in a church that I was now getting the experience. 629 00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:07,720 Speaker 2: And it was so clear that God said, Brad, I 630 00:34:07,800 --> 00:34:10,200 Speaker 2: needed to be there. I needed your son to be 631 00:34:10,239 --> 00:34:12,960 Speaker 2: in all these rehab centers, all these twenty different rehab 632 00:34:13,080 --> 00:34:18,440 Speaker 2: centers across the Midwest in California to be able to 633 00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:21,719 Speaker 2: invite others to accept Jesus Christ. And when I think 634 00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:24,200 Speaker 2: about it, I heard so many stories when I would 635 00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:27,040 Speaker 2: visit the rehab centers of my son leading other men 636 00:34:27,120 --> 00:34:30,480 Speaker 2: to Christ. And it made me think, what we think 637 00:34:32,160 --> 00:34:35,120 Speaker 2: is our plans for our children or for our loved ones. 638 00:34:35,480 --> 00:34:40,000 Speaker 2: God has a much better plan. What Satan meant for evil, 639 00:34:40,040 --> 00:34:42,279 Speaker 2: God meant for good, and he'd used it for good. 640 00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:45,880 Speaker 2: So in that moment, again, just my advice to anybody 641 00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:48,360 Speaker 2: that's going through this with a loved one is to 642 00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:51,000 Speaker 2: keep going back to Romans eight twenty eight that says 643 00:34:51,080 --> 00:34:53,640 Speaker 2: and we know that in all things, all things, hundred 644 00:34:53,640 --> 00:34:56,640 Speaker 2: percent word, all things, God works for the good. Of 645 00:34:56,680 --> 00:35:00,359 Speaker 2: those who love Him, who've been called according to his purpose. Good, 646 00:35:00,640 --> 00:35:03,120 Speaker 2: God's good. It may not feel good to us, but 647 00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:06,840 Speaker 2: it's God's good and carrying into what I get to 648 00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:10,480 Speaker 2: do now, Tutor, I wouldn't trade that for anything, And 649 00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:15,120 Speaker 2: I don't mean that to sound extra religious. I'm thinking 650 00:35:15,160 --> 00:35:17,719 Speaker 2: of It was Saturday when we buried our sons, so 651 00:35:17,760 --> 00:35:20,839 Speaker 2: it would have been yeah, it was a Saturday. He 652 00:35:20,920 --> 00:35:23,600 Speaker 2: died on a Tuesday. We buried him on a Saturday, 653 00:35:24,080 --> 00:35:25,840 Speaker 2: and it was three days later that I was to 654 00:35:25,880 --> 00:35:28,960 Speaker 2: be back at church and Pastor cow and the church 655 00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:31,160 Speaker 2: staff was so great, said you take as much time 656 00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:34,360 Speaker 2: off as you as you need to. And I talked 657 00:35:34,360 --> 00:35:36,640 Speaker 2: with Beth. We prayed about it, and I said, sweetheart, 658 00:35:36,680 --> 00:35:40,560 Speaker 2: she goes, Honey, I know what you're thinking. You go 659 00:35:40,640 --> 00:35:42,239 Speaker 2: what you feel like you need to do. I just 660 00:35:42,239 --> 00:35:45,040 Speaker 2: felt like I needed to be at the church because 661 00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:48,200 Speaker 2: my responsibilities were calling and meeting with people to pray with. 662 00:35:48,920 --> 00:35:52,040 Speaker 2: And so that next Tuesday I went back. And that 663 00:35:52,160 --> 00:35:55,080 Speaker 2: week I'll never forget because I had three different families, 664 00:35:55,080 --> 00:35:57,560 Speaker 2: two on the phone and one that came and met 665 00:35:57,600 --> 00:35:59,880 Speaker 2: me in my office that week that we're all dealing 666 00:35:59,880 --> 00:36:03,440 Speaker 2: with with sons that were addicted to drugs. And it 667 00:36:03,520 --> 00:36:05,480 Speaker 2: was at one point when I got off the phone 668 00:36:05,480 --> 00:36:08,480 Speaker 2: with one family, praying with them and just sharing what 669 00:36:08,520 --> 00:36:11,080 Speaker 2: God had taught me. Not that I was anything better, 670 00:36:11,120 --> 00:36:13,719 Speaker 2: It was always pointing them back to the hope that 671 00:36:13,760 --> 00:36:17,360 Speaker 2: you can have in God because his strength, his power, 672 00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:20,279 Speaker 2: He gives you strength in your weakness. He will give 673 00:36:20,320 --> 00:36:23,120 Speaker 2: you hope when you're hopeless. He will comfort you when 674 00:36:23,120 --> 00:36:25,640 Speaker 2: your trouble. But I was sitting there, and after I 675 00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:28,479 Speaker 2: got off the phone praying with them, the Lord brought 676 00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:31,479 Speaker 2: back to mine tewod Corinthians one three and four and says, 677 00:36:31,520 --> 00:36:33,479 Speaker 2: Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord 678 00:36:33,520 --> 00:36:36,920 Speaker 2: and Savior, Jesus Christ, the Father of compassion and the 679 00:36:36,920 --> 00:36:39,960 Speaker 2: God of all comfort, who comforts us in all our troubles, 680 00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:43,200 Speaker 2: so that we can comfort those in any trouble with 681 00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:46,719 Speaker 2: the comfort we ourselves have received from God. And I 682 00:36:46,800 --> 00:36:49,200 Speaker 2: just broke down crying. I was in my office all 683 00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:51,759 Speaker 2: by myself, and I was crying because God allowed me 684 00:36:51,880 --> 00:36:54,440 Speaker 2: to be able to experience His word in such a 685 00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:57,920 Speaker 2: real way that all those moments that God was comforting 686 00:36:57,960 --> 00:37:00,600 Speaker 2: me through all those years with my son, he was 687 00:37:00,640 --> 00:37:04,080 Speaker 2: now allowing me to help comfort other people who are 688 00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:07,040 Speaker 2: going through similar circumstances. I'm never going to say they're 689 00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:10,959 Speaker 2: the same, but what a beautiful picture of God's word 690 00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:14,719 Speaker 2: coming to life. And I get to experience that on 691 00:37:14,760 --> 00:37:18,360 Speaker 2: a daily basis. That's why it's that's why I appreciate 692 00:37:18,440 --> 00:37:22,040 Speaker 2: you saying you see that joy. It's definitely not human joy. 693 00:37:22,239 --> 00:37:24,719 Speaker 2: It's the joy of the Lord, which cal and our 694 00:37:24,840 --> 00:37:28,920 Speaker 2: church teaches. It's supernatural delight. I don't have to make 695 00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:32,440 Speaker 2: it up. God has given me his joy, his strength 696 00:37:32,840 --> 00:37:35,960 Speaker 2: that you can't you can't manufacture yourself. I don't have 697 00:37:36,040 --> 00:37:39,080 Speaker 2: the capacity to love like he does. But the more 698 00:37:39,120 --> 00:37:41,480 Speaker 2: I see Jesus for who he is, the more I 699 00:37:41,560 --> 00:37:44,279 Speaker 2: grow in my love for him. The more clearly I 700 00:37:44,360 --> 00:37:47,160 Speaker 2: see others through his eyes, the more I see my 701 00:37:47,280 --> 00:37:50,800 Speaker 2: wife like a husband should, the more I see homeless 702 00:37:50,840 --> 00:37:54,399 Speaker 2: people through God's eyes, the more I see I've met 703 00:37:54,400 --> 00:37:56,800 Speaker 2: with so many people that are addicted to drugs or 704 00:37:56,800 --> 00:38:00,759 Speaker 2: addicted to other things, and it's so easy to sit 705 00:38:00,800 --> 00:38:03,640 Speaker 2: across from them, whether I'm mentoring them at a restaurant, 706 00:38:03,680 --> 00:38:07,040 Speaker 2: whether I've been in the jails at Ottawa County Jail 707 00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:09,000 Speaker 2: and sit across from men and be able to tell 708 00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:16,600 Speaker 2: them with with sincerity, God loves you. God loves you, 709 00:38:16,840 --> 00:38:19,400 Speaker 2: and so do I. I can say that with sincerity 710 00:38:19,480 --> 00:38:21,840 Speaker 2: that it's because of God first loving me that I 711 00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:24,640 Speaker 2: can say I love these people and reminding them that 712 00:38:25,040 --> 00:38:28,000 Speaker 2: God hasn't forgotten them. They are not alone. His love 713 00:38:28,080 --> 00:38:31,120 Speaker 2: hasn't changed for them. And to see these men, whether 714 00:38:31,360 --> 00:38:35,240 Speaker 2: they've been in a rehab center or in a jail 715 00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:38,920 Speaker 2: or a prison where I've been, it's so beautiful to 716 00:38:38,960 --> 00:38:42,880 Speaker 2: see what that statement says to people who feel hopeless. 717 00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:46,680 Speaker 2: Because in a jail, we're in a hospital, we're in 718 00:38:46,719 --> 00:38:50,200 Speaker 2: a rehab center. Many of these men always felt hopeless. 719 00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:52,680 Speaker 2: But to be able to come in there and share 720 00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:56,200 Speaker 2: the one God of hope like Easter right, there's only 721 00:38:56,719 --> 00:39:01,279 Speaker 2: one person that is the living hope, and that's the 722 00:39:01,320 --> 00:39:03,919 Speaker 2: Lord Jesus Christ. And what a privilege to be able 723 00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:07,560 Speaker 2: to share that with other people and have some credibility 724 00:39:07,640 --> 00:39:11,160 Speaker 2: because he has brought us through things. But I always 725 00:39:11,200 --> 00:39:13,960 Speaker 2: remind him, this isn't me and my own strength. You 726 00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:16,480 Speaker 2: can have that same strength. You can have that same 727 00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:20,000 Speaker 2: hope by trusting in the Lord Jesus Christ and who 728 00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:23,200 Speaker 2: he is, his character. He will never ever fail you. 729 00:39:24,320 --> 00:39:26,440 Speaker 1: It's so beautiful because as I listen to you, I 730 00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:28,520 Speaker 1: hear you talk about, you know, my son was meant 731 00:39:28,520 --> 00:39:30,239 Speaker 1: to be a pastor and he got to do that 732 00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:32,480 Speaker 1: and he got to go out there and be that. 733 00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:37,239 Speaker 1: But that wasn't what you were anticipating for yourself. And 734 00:39:37,280 --> 00:39:39,800 Speaker 1: I just think it's beautiful to see God's hand writing 735 00:39:39,840 --> 00:39:43,120 Speaker 1: in your story, because not only was God saying there's 736 00:39:43,280 --> 00:39:46,080 Speaker 1: a pastor in your family, he was saying, there's actually 737 00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:48,839 Speaker 1: two pastors. You're going to be ready for this too. 738 00:39:49,040 --> 00:39:53,279 Speaker 1: I am preparing you for something wonderful. And I am 739 00:39:53,400 --> 00:39:55,640 Speaker 1: so impressed with what you do every week. And I'm 740 00:39:55,640 --> 00:39:59,120 Speaker 1: so impressed with both you and your wife everything you've 741 00:39:59,120 --> 00:40:03,000 Speaker 1: been through. But your dedication to God and your dedication 742 00:40:03,200 --> 00:40:08,240 Speaker 1: to bringing the Gospel to people is so incredible. Before 743 00:40:08,239 --> 00:40:11,960 Speaker 1: we go, just is there an Easter message over and 744 00:40:11,960 --> 00:40:14,080 Speaker 1: above what we've already talked about that you want people 745 00:40:14,120 --> 00:40:15,080 Speaker 1: to be left with today? 746 00:40:15,440 --> 00:40:18,640 Speaker 2: The Easter message that I would want to give would 747 00:40:18,680 --> 00:40:21,239 Speaker 2: be directed to two different groups of people. First, it 748 00:40:21,239 --> 00:40:24,480 Speaker 2: would be those that are struggling with addiction. I would 749 00:40:24,520 --> 00:40:26,960 Speaker 2: want to say to them and remind them that Jesus 750 00:40:27,280 --> 00:40:31,120 Speaker 2: loves them, that Jesus is alive, that no matter what 751 00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:34,040 Speaker 2: they've done, no matter where they are, no matter what 752 00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:36,759 Speaker 2: they're even doing right now, that Jesus's love for them 753 00:40:36,800 --> 00:40:38,600 Speaker 2: will never change. So that's what I would want to 754 00:40:38,640 --> 00:40:43,080 Speaker 2: tell that individual, and that he came to not only 755 00:40:43,120 --> 00:40:46,080 Speaker 2: die for their sins and wash them away, but also 756 00:40:46,160 --> 00:40:50,719 Speaker 2: he was raised from the dead so that with his 757 00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:53,719 Speaker 2: power you can overcome the sin and the struggles that 758 00:40:53,760 --> 00:40:58,239 Speaker 2: you're facing right now. That's the message for those individuals. 759 00:40:58,239 --> 00:41:01,200 Speaker 2: And then secondly it would be for the family members 760 00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:04,719 Speaker 2: or parents of an addicted loved one. I would say 761 00:41:04,760 --> 00:41:09,040 Speaker 2: to them, you're not alone. Jesus sees you very clearly 762 00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:12,360 Speaker 2: what you're dealing with, what you're struggling with, and that 763 00:41:12,440 --> 00:41:15,200 Speaker 2: by trusting him, trusting in who he is, that he 764 00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:17,720 Speaker 2: is sovereign, that he is all powerful, that he loves 765 00:41:17,760 --> 00:41:20,880 Speaker 2: your child, your family member far more than you ever will, 766 00:41:21,280 --> 00:41:24,239 Speaker 2: and that by trusting him you will have that kind 767 00:41:24,280 --> 00:41:28,359 Speaker 2: of peace. From Isaiah twenty six three and four. It's 768 00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:30,719 Speaker 2: one of my favorites, and it says you will keep 769 00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:34,359 Speaker 2: in perfect peace those whose minds are steadfast because they 770 00:41:34,360 --> 00:41:37,280 Speaker 2: trust in you. Trust in the Lord forever, For the Lord, 771 00:41:37,320 --> 00:41:41,880 Speaker 2: the Lord himself is the rock eternal. And then finally, pray. 772 00:41:42,880 --> 00:41:45,840 Speaker 2: Trusting God. You know you can go to His throne 773 00:41:45,880 --> 00:41:49,759 Speaker 2: of grace with confidence and find grace and help in 774 00:41:49,840 --> 00:41:52,759 Speaker 2: those times of need. And so I would encourage you 775 00:41:52,800 --> 00:41:55,360 Speaker 2: when you're feeling like you can't go on anymore, Pray, 776 00:41:55,920 --> 00:41:59,879 Speaker 2: when you're fearful, Pray when you're feeling anxious about where 777 00:41:59,880 --> 00:42:02,680 Speaker 2: your child is or what they're doing, or if they're okay. 778 00:42:03,200 --> 00:42:06,920 Speaker 2: Pray and the peace of God really will surpass all 779 00:42:07,000 --> 00:42:10,240 Speaker 2: understanding and guard your heart and your mind in Christ Jesus. 780 00:42:10,920 --> 00:42:14,440 Speaker 2: So for each each group of people, I would just 781 00:42:14,560 --> 00:42:18,480 Speaker 2: encourage you keep your eyes on Jesus. You can trust him. 782 00:42:18,680 --> 00:42:22,919 Speaker 2: He's already covered your sin, He's already been risen from 783 00:42:22,960 --> 00:42:26,480 Speaker 2: the grave. And for the purpose of restoring your relationship 784 00:42:26,520 --> 00:42:29,879 Speaker 2: with Him and caring for you during this time, that's 785 00:42:29,880 --> 00:42:31,560 Speaker 2: what I would share with him. 786 00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:35,680 Speaker 1: Amen. Thank you, Pastor Brad Grossman. You are amazing. Thank 787 00:42:35,719 --> 00:42:38,040 Speaker 1: you for sharing the story. I appreciate it. Thanks for 788 00:42:38,080 --> 00:42:38,960 Speaker 1: being on the podcast. 789 00:42:39,280 --> 00:42:40,320 Speaker 2: Thank you so much. Tutor. 790 00:42:40,360 --> 00:42:43,080 Speaker 1: God bless you, God bless you, and God bless all 791 00:42:43,160 --> 00:42:45,560 Speaker 1: of you. Thank you for listening today. Go out and 792 00:42:45,600 --> 00:42:49,360 Speaker 1: have a wonderful Easter, Go to church, get with your family, 793 00:42:49,760 --> 00:42:53,600 Speaker 1: and just celebrate our risen Lord. Thank you for listening.