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Speaker 1: I'm Debbie Peers and I was key hairstylist on the Office.

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Speaker 1: I'm Kim Ferry and I was the department head for

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Speaker 1: the office. Hello everybody, You're gonna love this one. Uh.

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Speaker 1: First off, welcome to another installment of the Office Deep Dive.

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Speaker 1: I am your host, Brian Baumgartner. The studio is crowded today, people,

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Speaker 1: I am bringing you my conversation with the other half

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Speaker 1: of our hair and makeup crew, the hair department of

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Speaker 1: the Office. Now, if you haven't already, go listen to

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Speaker 1: my interview with the office is head makeup artist Laverne Karacuzzi,

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Speaker 1: because we make a few references to that conversation here.

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Speaker 1: But then be sure to come right back to hear

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Speaker 1: more fascinating behind the scenes stories from my very good

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Speaker 1: friends Debbie Pierce and Kim Ferry. Now, having Debbie and

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Speaker 1: Kim in the studio, it was like it was like

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Speaker 1: getting a warm hug. I mean, when you think about it,

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Speaker 1: I spent an entire decade of my life working with

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Speaker 1: the two of them, and they really are extraordinary people

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Speaker 1: to work with. They brought a brand new perspective to

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Speaker 1: the beauty of the office conversation, Like you won't believe

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Speaker 1: how long it took to make sure Meredith's bald cap

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Speaker 1: looked well bald, and and the thought that went into

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Speaker 1: Pam's hair evolution. I truly had no idea the care

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Speaker 1: and concern that these women gave not only to the show,

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Speaker 1: the plot, the crew, but but also to each other

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Speaker 1: in really difficult times of their lives. It's nothing short

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Speaker 1: of astounding. We were lucky to have them on set then,

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Speaker 1: and well we're so lucky to have them on the

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Speaker 1: podcast now. Now. Maybe that's enough tuting of their horns

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Speaker 1: for now. I think our conversation really speaks for itself.

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Speaker 1: So get ready to be blown away, like like the

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Speaker 1: hair dryer blown away anyway. The wonderful geniuses that made

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Speaker 1: up the hair department of the Office, Debbie Pierce and

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Speaker 1: Kim Ferry, Bubble and Squeak. I love it, Bubble and

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Speaker 1: Squeak on Bubble and Squeaker, cooking at every moment, lift

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Speaker 1: over from the nut before. What is? Oh my god,

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Speaker 1: it's so good to see. Oh my god, are you

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Speaker 1: I'm good. I'm good. Oh my gosh. Thank you guys

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Speaker 1: so much than it's fun to get together, man, look

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Speaker 1: at you. I love the shirt. Well done, very well done.

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Speaker 1: Um you today, this has been so great? Are you

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Speaker 1: kidding me? I saw Laverne yesterday, Yes, yes, Um. I

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Speaker 1: mean so many writers that are all now running their

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Speaker 1: own worlds. Mike Sure and Brent Forrester, Claire Scanlon and

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Speaker 1: Jenna Angela and Rain We've done so it's just so

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Speaker 1: fun to see everybody. I know. But it's it's amazing. Um.

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Speaker 1: I was out and I had my jacket on the

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Speaker 1: we got season five or six or something, and all

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Speaker 1: of a sudden, I was in a restaurant and this

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Speaker 1: girl said, oh, I love your jacket. I said, do

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Speaker 1: you watch the show? Oh? Yes, we love the Office.

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Speaker 1: It was a whole new generation, right, I mean anywhere

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Speaker 1: from thirteen to thirty five. I mean, it's it's a

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Speaker 1: whole new group of people. Why do you think that is?

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I think they just identified with the characters,

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Speaker 1: and uh, that is on Netflix now and it's reruns

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Speaker 1: and the series. So I just think they get a

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Speaker 1: character that they really like and and they identify with

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Speaker 1: them and it just has snowballed. It's it's amazing. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I mean we have been talking about and part of

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Speaker 1: what I'm going back and looking at is. You know,

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Speaker 1: we were the top scripted show on NBC for a

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Speaker 1: long time, but the show now is bigger than it

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Speaker 1: was that through Netflix. I'm just like, what, I don't know,

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Speaker 1: what do you think? Just people identifying with the characters? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I just you know season too, it hit its prime. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's when it really did. It did, and they just

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Speaker 1: wanted to see what was Steve gonna do next time?

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Speaker 1: And the whole cast of characters. Really, the whole cast

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Speaker 1: of characters, you never know what they're gonna do or

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Speaker 1: say no. Because we were just laughing before you came

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Speaker 1: in talking about Kim. When she called me about the show.

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Speaker 1: She said, Debbie, UM, you know I'm gonna do this

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Speaker 1: little show called The Office. You know, it's just about

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Speaker 1: five um actors, you know, a couple of girls and

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Speaker 1: uh so simple, you know, you know, can what you think?

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Speaker 1: Come and join me and let's do this. I said, okay, okay,

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Speaker 1: I'll call you tomorrow. So I didn't. I said, yeah, Kim,

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Speaker 1: I'd like to do that. I'd like to do that

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Speaker 1: with you. And then this little show blew up into

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Speaker 1: this mega It was that hit. Yeah, so you said

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Speaker 1: the show hit its prime in season two? Is that

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Speaker 1: because that's when you guys came on it is it

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Speaker 1: your responsible right? Exactly right? And you know we didn't

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Speaker 1: have any budget either. We were so do you remember

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Speaker 1: we were literally throwing like a can of hair sprayed

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Speaker 1: to each other across like over the actors. Do you

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Speaker 1: remember that we had no budget. We supplies and stuff

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Speaker 1: on my own, right, and then Kim would go to

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Speaker 1: set and I would be in the trailer, so I

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Speaker 1: had to do all the guest actors and everything body

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Speaker 1: that came back. So all of a sudden, we looked

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Speaker 1: at each other set, Uh, this is getting to be

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Speaker 1: bigger then we thought. So, you know, then after you know,

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Speaker 1: see what the season three or four that we were

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Speaker 1: able to get it really got another additional partition because

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Speaker 1: it was kind of our one. But remember we would

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Speaker 1: take breaks to we would sat down and we didn't

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Speaker 1: know if the show was going to come back and

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Speaker 1: see and they'd be like, okay, hey, we got another six,

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Speaker 1: let's just do these six right, great, Okay, we'll be

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Speaker 1: back great, and then it would sat down again, and

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Speaker 1: it was really confusing those first steps two season two. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but it made it through. That must have been hard

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Speaker 1: from a crew perspective to to you know, like we

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Speaker 1: did that first six of season two, and then we

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Speaker 1: went away and we had no idea if we were

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Speaker 1: coming back or you know, and then and and that's

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Speaker 1: real tricky because people need to know where their money

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Speaker 1: is going to come from, of course, and so you

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Speaker 1: get scared that you lose your crew because you know,

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Speaker 1: you don't want people go to other the shows, you

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Speaker 1: know and stuff. But we were blessed. We were blessed.

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Speaker 1: We kept our crew pretty much together. I mean, there

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Speaker 1: were a few people that had to leave and stuff,

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Speaker 1: but we were blessed all the way to the end. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: what do you think was so we were going for

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Speaker 1: a very realistic look, moving away from what television was

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Speaker 1: at that time, if you think about friends and stuff

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Speaker 1: was did that present challenges or did that make it easier? Yeah? Yeah, no,

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Speaker 1: presented challenges, especially for me. Well you know, both of

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Speaker 1: us want to oh yeah, yeah, so we both worked.

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Speaker 1: It worked in salons, you know, prior to getting into

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Speaker 1: film television. But um, you know, when you see a

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Speaker 1: person and something looks array, you know, out of out

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Speaker 1: of whack and stuff, you immediately want to go over

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Speaker 1: there and do something. And also with the makeup. I'm

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Speaker 1: sure the verrant probably told you you want to at

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Speaker 1: least haven't had a little colitude a person and everything.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, it presents a challenge. And so it was

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Speaker 1: funny because remember we didn't the second season though you

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Speaker 1: were all having your own makeup and your own stuff.

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Speaker 1: They we weren't touching them. You're forgetting that because they

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Speaker 1: were getting their own touch ups at their own station

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Speaker 1: and they had there and we would be sitting waiting.

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Speaker 1: We would not go in that second season because that's

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Speaker 1: that was per Pulfi, per Greg Daniel. But that was

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Speaker 1: hard that, yeah, that you don't It was you guys

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Speaker 1: that were touching yourself up and we would see you

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Speaker 1: at the season three okay, season three we were able

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Speaker 1: to then actually go in and start doing touch ups

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Speaker 1: on you. But season two it was very I remember

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Speaker 1: going in different probably wasn't supposed to, but I did

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Speaker 1: not did not in season two it did, okay, I remember,

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Speaker 1: oh my gosh, yeah, and I um I remember Ken

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Speaker 1: Koppas was talking to me about he said that there

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Speaker 1: was and this was before you, but on the on

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Speaker 1: the pilot and moving forward as they were sort of

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Speaker 1: establishing the look, and Ken went to all of the

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Speaker 1: heads of department and said, anything that you would get

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Speaker 1: fired on on some other show are the things that

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Speaker 1: we want. So like, if a hair is out of place,

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Speaker 1: and if a lighting isn't quite right, if we don't

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Speaker 1: have a perfect frame shot on an actor, that's all good.

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Speaker 1: We want those little mistakes to make it, you know,

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Speaker 1: feel more real. Yeah, and that's kind of what you

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Speaker 1: were told to write, like the hair did not have

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Speaker 1: to match. Yeah. I mean originally I was offered the

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Speaker 1: first six episodes, but I was still working on another show,

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Speaker 1: so I couldn't do it. But I wish, I wish, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I just I couldn't because when we came in second season,

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Speaker 1: everything changed. The whole look of the cast, yeah changed. Well,

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Speaker 1: Steve had he was the first severe on that first season,

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Speaker 1: and Kim softened him up. It looked great. Yeah, So

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Speaker 1: what was the direction. We've talked a lot about that about,

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Speaker 1: you know, feeling like if we were a show that's

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Speaker 1: going to go on for longer than a season or two. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that Michael, we needed to find some redeeming values. And

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Speaker 1: then they started writing in short ways and his look changed. Well.

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Speaker 1: He also he had gone through you know, the Virgin

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Speaker 1: so he basically had lost a lot of weight too,

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Speaker 1: and looked a bit different than we did it first.

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Speaker 1: But I remember coming in and having a meeting with

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Speaker 1: him and in the trailer actually and just discussing with him.

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Speaker 1: You know, I watched the first six episodes when I

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Speaker 1: knew I was going to get the second season, and

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Speaker 1: I told him, I really you know, they wanted him

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Speaker 1: to look like Gordon Gecko. That was like his look. Technically,

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Speaker 1: that's what they designed it for. Its gray slick, but

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Speaker 1: it was too for me. It was too greasy and

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Speaker 1: too slick and and not flattering and severe. Right, So

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Speaker 1: I told him, like, I really want to make a

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Speaker 1: big change, and I want to discuss it with you.

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Speaker 1: And I did that pretty much with a lot of

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Speaker 1: the actors, just kind of asking them, you know, how

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Speaker 1: do you feel and what do you want and then

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Speaker 1: let's incorporate this and then I can pitch it to

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Speaker 1: Greg because he did have the final say over looks

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Speaker 1: and things, and he was really great though. I mean,

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Speaker 1: he would always listen to us and if we really

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Speaker 1: wanted to push one kind of look or one certain thing,

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Speaker 1: it was okay, and he would always come around, so

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Speaker 1: that was great. I really appreciated his thought. Yeah, so

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Speaker 1: doing that, trying to create that very sort of realistic look,

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Speaker 1: ultimately it is more difficult than sort of that high fashion.

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't know. It was easy, it

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Speaker 1: was casual. It was also looked like real people, so

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Speaker 1: they can be a little dishovel. I mean, it's almost

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Speaker 1: easier because you're not doing the high end glam stuff.

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Speaker 1: We're not putting on these you know, when I was

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Speaker 1: doing Pretty liars, like they have all this hair, you

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Speaker 1: have this makeup, you have this wardrobe. We didn't really

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Speaker 1: have that, so it wasn't except when we do special shows. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: when we did the Halloween episodes. Halloween episodes were always tricky,

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Speaker 1: but yeah, I loved it though. I did every single

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Speaker 1: week on that show entire time. Yeah, and I remember

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Speaker 1: even the Halloween episodes. If you think of other shows

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Speaker 1: that have Halloween episodes, the makeup, the hair, like, everything

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Speaker 1: should look perfect, right. But Greg, I remember there was

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Speaker 1: a discussion about him saying, well, but these are real

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Speaker 1: people who are dressing for their office, so it's not

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Speaker 1: gonna look perfect. He was very adamant about that these

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Speaker 1: aren't people that are going to spend huge amounts of money.

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Speaker 1: They just want to throw like a cheap He's like,

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Speaker 1: make sure it's a cheap, simple wig that someone would

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Speaker 1: buy office, you know, a basic store. It's not like

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Speaker 1: a whole thing. Although we got a little more into

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Speaker 1: that when you know, Rain and Creed and they started.

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Speaker 1: We started with the wigs, and it got a little

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Speaker 1: better as we went further. But in the beginning, yeah, definitely,

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Speaker 1: and I wanted to show and tells for him. I

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Speaker 1: would walk upstairs, I would present the whigs because he

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Speaker 1: would give me an idea of you know, I want,

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Speaker 1: you know, Mindy to have this, I want you know,

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Speaker 1: Rain to have this um and he would kind of

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Speaker 1: give me some ideas to go with and then I

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Speaker 1: would present it to him. So I would carry it

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Speaker 1: up and go to the writers. I try to make

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Speaker 1: sure not many writers were in there, so that it

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Speaker 1: was just kind of him and I wouldn't get too

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Speaker 1: many beings because it gets lost. But it was great

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Speaker 1: that the collaboration was fun and they were always open

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Speaker 1: to it, and it was fun to be in there

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Speaker 1: and watch them like laugh at this stuff and be like, Oh,

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Speaker 1: that's gonna be so great or it's gonna be so

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Speaker 1: good on them. It was fun. Do you feel there

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Speaker 1: was more collaboration on the office than other shows. Yes? Absolutely.

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Speaker 1: I think what I love about Greg is that he

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Speaker 1: even if he wanted to discuss it, like he would

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Speaker 1: listen and he would hear your side of it. It

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Speaker 1: wasn't in other shows where they're just like, no, we

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Speaker 1: want it like this. So, you know, he's such a

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Speaker 1: kind person. And he would kind of stroll into our

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Speaker 1: trailers sometimes and just wander around, which I love. And

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Speaker 1: we were doing right and I'd be like anything He's

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Speaker 1: like no, and he just like walked through, like need

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Speaker 1: a haircut or anything. Sure, great, he's aidelic Sometimes he

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Speaker 1: just you know, randomly come in. But yes, he's such

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Speaker 1: a good person. But he trusts the people that he hired,

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Speaker 1: and that's what I respect and that's what I really

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Speaker 1: appreciated about him. Yeah. He it's what do they say,

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Speaker 1: what's the He's smart enough to know what he doesn't know,

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Speaker 1: you know, like he you know, like and get the

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Speaker 1: people that do. Yes. Have you said that quote about

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Speaker 1: Steve even a way too? What was it? Okay? This

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Speaker 1: is a great speed of the leader is the speed

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Speaker 1: of the game. That my girlfriend gave me that quote, um,

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Speaker 1: meaning that the person that is upfront is who has

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Speaker 1: the you know, the authority and the wherewithal umbility responsibilities,

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Speaker 1: our leader. They're they're the leaders, and then the gang follows.

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Speaker 1: So whoever is upfront, they're going to look at that person.

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Speaker 1: That's what keeps us together, the leader. Yeah. Do you

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Speaker 1: think Steve was a good leader? Yeah, I do. Great leader,

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Speaker 1: a great leader. So, Debbie, when Steve left, I was

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Speaker 1: reminded a lot of people went around from different departments

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Speaker 1: and told stories about Steve. And three different people have

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Speaker 1: told me one story, which was the story that you told, Um,

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Speaker 1: it was about him. You were in a van. Yes, Uh,

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Speaker 1: Steve was quite a gentleman and Um at that time,

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Speaker 1: nobody really knew. But I was going through a situation

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Speaker 1: with my hip. I was in a lot of pain

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Speaker 1: and getting up and down on the van was very

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Speaker 1: hard for me, and so UM, Kim and all the games,

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Speaker 1: you know, they kind of knew, and so they would

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Speaker 1: let me sit in the front when we would go

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Speaker 1: on on location and stuff. So this one day, UM,

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Speaker 1: we were all gathering into the van, um Steve and

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Speaker 1: some of the actors, and I went to proceed to

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Speaker 1: go in the back and he looked at me. He goes, Debbie,

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Speaker 1: where are you going? I said, well, I'm letting you stay.

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Speaker 1: He said, you go and take that seat, and I just, um,

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Speaker 1: I just thought that was such a kind thing, because

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Speaker 1: here is he's the star of the show, and he

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Speaker 1: always did. He would stand there at that van. He

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Speaker 1: would hold the door and help us in the van.

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Speaker 1: You know, I said, some mama's raised a nice young man.

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Speaker 1: But that's how he was, right. Yeah, but he did

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Speaker 1: that with everybody, even you know what I mean, even

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Speaker 1: just like he would wait and some other people would

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Speaker 1: just go to their trailers, but he always stood there,

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Speaker 1: every single woman down, every single man. And yes, so

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Speaker 1: that meant so much to me. And it was funny

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Speaker 1: because we came back, I think it was towards the

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Speaker 1: end and um, he said, how are you doing, Debby?

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Speaker 1: I said, I'm doing fine. Since I've seen you got

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Speaker 1: a new hips bionic now and since then I've got

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Speaker 1: another new Hi. I am the bion. I was talking

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Speaker 1: into Laverne about what people don't realize is the hair

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Speaker 1: and makeup trailer is what is what is it is

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Speaker 1: the trick. It is the place where everybody comes. Um,

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Speaker 1: you can make a break a show in the makeup

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Speaker 1: and hair trail. I'm serious. You can make or break

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Speaker 1: a show well because the way the environment is created.

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Speaker 1: The way the environment is created because when actors come

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Speaker 1: in in the morning, that early in the morning, it

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Speaker 1: has to be calm and a safe place that they

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Speaker 1: know they can come in. They can you know, study

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Speaker 1: their lines, they can just relax and you as you work,

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Speaker 1: you get to know your actors. You get to know

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Speaker 1: when they're feeling okay and when they're not. You get

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Speaker 1: to know when you can talk to them and laugh

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Speaker 1: and joke, and you get to know when you need

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Speaker 1: to shut up and don't say nothing exactly walk way

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Speaker 1: and you need to walk away I mean, or you know,

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Speaker 1: just give them their space, right. Yeah. So I told

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Speaker 1: the producer that one time on another show. I said, Um,

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Speaker 1: you know you gotta know that it starts right in here.

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Speaker 1: We create an atmosphere and give them a place of

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Speaker 1: safe safety, a safe player and the kind place we

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Speaker 1: might play music that's soothing so that they can get

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Speaker 1: into character and give them the performance that you need.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's very interesting. I haven't really thought about

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Speaker 1: this before, but just hearing you talk, just go with

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Speaker 1: me for a second. Maybe this is bad, but when

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Speaker 1: you hear some of what you're saying, the thing that

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Speaker 1: is occurring to me is that you don't realize that

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Speaker 1: as an actor, you're being poked and prodded kind of

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Speaker 1: for twelve hours a day. Yeah, Like there's no in

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Speaker 1: in no other sort of business. Are there people up

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Speaker 1: in your business business? Right hours, it's like unzip your pants,

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Speaker 1: take off your pants, let's run this wire up your leg,

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Speaker 1: onto your chest, onto your skin. You know, someone's touching

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Speaker 1: your face and touching your hand, right, And there are

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Speaker 1: times where like you're trying to work on a scene,

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Speaker 1: you're trying to do something and it's just like poke poke,

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Speaker 1: poke poke, and so yeah, like the necessity to have

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Speaker 1: an environment, especially first time that we're just getting ready

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Speaker 1: like like sort of like stay away jackals. Let's you know,

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Speaker 1: let's at least start the day we have to do

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Speaker 1: these things, but let's try to create an environment that

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Speaker 1: doesn't create sort of high stress and high anxiety from

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Speaker 1: the very beginning. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, Well will you

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Speaker 1: try to feel your actors, and when you go you

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Speaker 1: might look up a Brian, do you need anything, and

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Speaker 1: you'll say no, and I'll say, okay, back off and

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Speaker 1: go to the next person, you know. So we try

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Speaker 1: to respect that because we know that that is a

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Speaker 1: thing where somebody's I'm gonna at you all the time.

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Speaker 1: Sometimes it's like okay, I need a break here, right. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: And especially I would say for continuity photos too. I

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Speaker 1: know we had that thing up there, you'd have to

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Speaker 1: stand there with all four sides, something that we have

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Speaker 1: to do. And I know it's got to be annoying

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Speaker 1: when you're we do, but we have to do our

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Speaker 1: job too, because this is the stuff we have to submit.

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Speaker 1: This is we have to turn in. This is going

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Speaker 1: to be a record, because sometimes it is the question

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Speaker 1: was that curl this way? Or was it that? And

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Speaker 1: then But basically, you guys were really really good. I

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Speaker 1: mean you were very patient. And I went to another

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Speaker 1: show and uh no, no, no, no, no no no.

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Speaker 1: Somebody told me Phillis was on another show, and um

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Speaker 1: she went in and the guy said, I need to

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Speaker 1: take your picture. Phillis got up there, she said, turn around.

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Speaker 1: The guy said, Dabby, she did all four sides was

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Speaker 1: trained well, real crazer. We foller today. It was hilarious.

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Speaker 1: Phillis just turned around. She didn't she didn't squawk about anything.

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Speaker 1: That's because we had to do that. Yeah. Well we

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00:22:15,760 --> 00:22:19,119
Speaker 1: had such a large cast, a large and it just

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00:22:19,160 --> 00:22:21,320
Speaker 1: get up bigger and bigger. This season, it just kept

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00:22:21,400 --> 00:22:23,880
Speaker 1: up getting bigger and bigger and bigger. So so many

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Speaker 1: people to track and have to take care of. Yes, indeed,

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Speaker 1: we had to keep a book. Yeah, Laverne talked about

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Speaker 1: the battle plan. Yeah, that was important every day. That

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Speaker 1: is something that the eighties would make for us. And

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Speaker 1: we'd have basically a chart and it would have like

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Speaker 1: at the top of it it would be you know,

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Speaker 1: Kim and then who I do, and then Debbie and

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00:22:45,560 --> 00:22:48,320
Speaker 1: who she does down the line, and then then there

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00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:50,200
Speaker 1: was a makeup side as well, so we could really

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Speaker 1: know and understand who was going where at what time

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Speaker 1: because it was so many people getting through the work first,

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Speaker 1: and then when it was like everybody had to be

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Speaker 1: out on set, well that was you know, we had

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Speaker 1: everybody through, but we got him through. We did all

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Speaker 1: the time. All the time. We did. Who were the

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00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:20,639
Speaker 1: actors that you principally took care of. Um. I did Steve, John, Jenna, Angela,

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00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:27,480
Speaker 1: b J Mindy and make sure yeah he was yeah yeah.

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00:23:27,560 --> 00:23:31,119
Speaker 1: And then you and I did Phyllis, I did you,

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00:23:31,760 --> 00:23:38,440
Speaker 1: I did um Kate, Oscar and Leslie and then guest

390
00:23:38,440 --> 00:23:42,960
Speaker 1: started to split them up. I loved I bet you did.

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Speaker 1: Everybody loved address you're Everyone was like Debbie, you know

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00:23:48,320 --> 00:23:51,080
Speaker 1: he was British, Debbie, his hair is fine. Why are

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00:23:51,160 --> 00:23:56,359
Speaker 1: you still messing with his hair? Funny little more, Debbie,

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00:23:57,280 --> 00:24:04,000
Speaker 1: get your hands, get your hair off. Indes hairby it's professional.

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00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:09,399
Speaker 1: He's he was a nice guy. He was really a

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00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:14,160
Speaker 1: nice guy. Um, but you took care of you both

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00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:18,440
Speaker 1: worked on it. But kind of the biggest I think

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00:24:18,720 --> 00:24:23,719
Speaker 1: I can't think of really anything bigger hair additions throughout

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Speaker 1: the series became Kevin's tupay. I almost brought that today. Yeah,

400
00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:32,200
Speaker 1: I thought about it because it's in my storage. You know,

401
00:24:33,240 --> 00:24:36,040
Speaker 1: I'm literally driving here I go. Yes, I should have gone,

402
00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:37,840
Speaker 1: and I would have like presented it to you so

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00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:40,960
Speaker 1: you could pet it one more time. I'll bring it

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00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:44,760
Speaker 1: back for you. Yes, monumental. Yeah, I have a oh.

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00:24:44,840 --> 00:24:47,680
Speaker 1: I just posted a picture on my Instagram. Hold on.

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00:24:48,119 --> 00:24:49,960
Speaker 1: But it's like the picture of you when I was

407
00:24:50,040 --> 00:24:52,840
Speaker 1: first trying it on, you remember, and Jenna and Oscar

408
00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:55,960
Speaker 1: came up and they're just like they were making fun

409
00:24:56,000 --> 00:24:57,800
Speaker 1: of you, and we were like they were heckling him,

410
00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:05,240
Speaker 1: but he was standing strong. He was strong that this

411
00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:08,879
Speaker 1: whole thing. Yes, I think it was supposed to be

412
00:25:09,359 --> 00:25:12,200
Speaker 1: just a gag for the wedding. Yes, it was a gig,

413
00:25:12,520 --> 00:25:19,320
Speaker 1: and then it came back. It came back. Um, so

414
00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:26,119
Speaker 1: you guys come in season two, we're struggling. We're struggling.

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00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:29,920
Speaker 1: Then at the end of that season we get picked

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00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:34,480
Speaker 1: up fairly early for a full third season and The

417
00:25:34,600 --> 00:25:38,320
Speaker 1: Office wins the Emmy for Best Comedy. Do you remember

418
00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:42,280
Speaker 1: those feelings or did you feel like, well, we've got

419
00:25:42,400 --> 00:25:45,040
Speaker 1: job security now, or you know, what was the what

420
00:25:45,240 --> 00:25:47,639
Speaker 1: was the feeling around there as we shifted from a

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00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:53,800
Speaker 1: little engine that maybe do you remember? Um, I remember

422
00:25:53,880 --> 00:25:56,320
Speaker 1: this because this was when for the Emmy's all the

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00:25:56,400 --> 00:25:59,520
Speaker 1: girls came in that day to the trailer and they

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00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:02,040
Speaker 1: had cheese and crackers and we had champagne and it

425
00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:04,800
Speaker 1: was us doing them in our trailer where you know,

426
00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:07,680
Speaker 1: everyone else is going too high end, you know, salons

427
00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:09,960
Speaker 1: and they're probably getting everything done, but all the girls

428
00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:12,359
Speaker 1: wanted to be together and it was so sweet. It

429
00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:14,159
Speaker 1: was such a fun morning and it was just us

430
00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:16,560
Speaker 1: doing their hair and everyone was excited and they were

431
00:26:16,600 --> 00:26:19,920
Speaker 1: happy and it was getting and it was amazing. It

432
00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:21,840
Speaker 1: was amazing, and they were like eating and drinking. We

433
00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:23,720
Speaker 1: were doing champagne and we're like, wow, what if you

434
00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:26,440
Speaker 1: guys like you're gonna win, We're gonna win. It's gonna happen.

435
00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:29,359
Speaker 1: And then it did. And then that we saw the

436
00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:31,440
Speaker 1: pictures and it was just what a great moment. It

437
00:26:31,520 --> 00:26:33,840
Speaker 1: was like a victory for our little show that could

438
00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:39,159
Speaker 1: really Yeah, I totally forgot about that. All the ladies

439
00:26:39,359 --> 00:26:45,040
Speaker 1: came and the like literally in the trailer. In the trailer, Yeah,

440
00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:50,520
Speaker 1: yeah they did. That's really good. And then things went

441
00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:56,399
Speaker 1: well for a while, and then there was the strike. Yes,

442
00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:00,480
Speaker 1: what are your memories of that time? Well, it was

443
00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:04,359
Speaker 1: you know, everybody was like up in the air about

444
00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:07,719
Speaker 1: whether we're going to have jobs or not. And uh,

445
00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:12,560
Speaker 1: we we went down for what like well, yeah it did, um.

446
00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:16,560
Speaker 1: But the first remember the first day we didn't want

447
00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:19,840
Speaker 1: to cross because the writers were there literally the whole

448
00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:22,760
Speaker 1: cast um as we were standing and I remember b J.

449
00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:25,240
Speaker 1: You know, you had the fence right that we had,

450
00:27:25,320 --> 00:27:26,840
Speaker 1: and he was on the other side of it, and

451
00:27:26,920 --> 00:27:29,400
Speaker 1: I was like, I don't want to cross either. I'm

452
00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:32,960
Speaker 1: union where He's like it's okay. I'm like, it's not okay.

453
00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:34,879
Speaker 1: And I remember getting choked up, like I don't want

454
00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:36,639
Speaker 1: to do this to you. You guys are my family,

455
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:38,560
Speaker 1: Like I don't want to pass. And he said no,

456
00:27:38,720 --> 00:27:41,720
Speaker 1: look they're telling you to cross. And so we sat

457
00:27:41,840 --> 00:27:44,760
Speaker 1: on the stage and just waited. We just waited because

458
00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:47,040
Speaker 1: there was nothing else we could do. I think about

459
00:27:47,040 --> 00:27:49,680
Speaker 1: six seven hours later, they said you can go home.

460
00:27:49,960 --> 00:27:53,840
Speaker 1: I remember we went. I think that I never got

461
00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:56,359
Speaker 1: in hair and makeup. I guess there were a couple

462
00:27:56,440 --> 00:27:58,520
Speaker 1: of talking heads that were shot that could be shot,

463
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:02,000
Speaker 1: but it wasn't when there wasn't much no And I

464
00:28:02,560 --> 00:28:05,920
Speaker 1: remember being there as well because at a certain point

465
00:28:05,960 --> 00:28:10,879
Speaker 1: we weren't sure what was happening. Awkward, yeah, but you know,

466
00:28:11,200 --> 00:28:13,560
Speaker 1: as a mom of two young kids and I was

467
00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:17,960
Speaker 1: the person supporting my household, um, it was terrifying. But

468
00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:23,080
Speaker 1: I will never forget Greg Daniels and his wife writing

469
00:28:23,160 --> 00:28:27,080
Speaker 1: a check, remember that for a thousand dollars every thousand,

470
00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:34,320
Speaker 1: every family, every family. I was floor because that made

471
00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:38,280
Speaker 1: such a difference to my household. I went to the

472
00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:41,800
Speaker 1: mail that day, and uh, you know, people were sending

473
00:28:41,920 --> 00:28:44,280
Speaker 1: Christmas cards and stuff, and so I looked at the

474
00:28:44,400 --> 00:28:46,880
Speaker 1: cards and then I saw this card from Craig Daniels.

475
00:28:47,320 --> 00:28:52,400
Speaker 1: I'm going, oh, isn't that nice? And so I opened

476
00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:54,800
Speaker 1: up the card and I'm reading and then I see

477
00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:59,160
Speaker 1: this check And I didn't. I didn't really look at

478
00:28:59,200 --> 00:29:02,320
Speaker 1: it really key nearly at first, you know, and I said, oh,

479
00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:06,120
Speaker 1: how sweet. I thought it was a hundred dollars. I

480
00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:09,800
Speaker 1: looked and then I started Catholic zeros and I said,

481
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:12,920
Speaker 1: oh my god, I'm telling you. I almost literally beat

482
00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:18,200
Speaker 1: on myself. I was like, I was like, oh my god,

483
00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:21,200
Speaker 1: I could not believe it. But I told that story

484
00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:23,880
Speaker 1: to quite a few of my friends who worked on

485
00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:26,440
Speaker 1: other shows, and they were like, are you kidding me?

486
00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:31,800
Speaker 1: I said no, they I said, the producer and the actors,

487
00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:35,680
Speaker 1: because you guys came after the strike was over, when

488
00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:39,560
Speaker 1: we came back, and you gave us like two thousand

489
00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:44,120
Speaker 1: dollars a piece to the whole crew. That was nunheard of.

490
00:29:45,080 --> 00:29:48,360
Speaker 1: That was simply unheard of. It was such a blessing

491
00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:52,240
Speaker 1: to all of us because many people had families like him,

492
00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:55,120
Speaker 1: and they needed to know they had some sucks sort

493
00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:57,480
Speaker 1: of security and what what they were gonna do. I mean,

494
00:29:57,560 --> 00:30:00,720
Speaker 1: because other shows were down also, so this was such

495
00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:05,800
Speaker 1: a blessing and because we were family. Yeah, at that point,

496
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:11,120
Speaker 1: we absolutely true. That's absolutely true. Yeah, you felt it.

497
00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:17,880
Speaker 1: I mean, Greg, you know the caterers and what show

498
00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:22,760
Speaker 1: has the same caterers for nine years? Eventually someone's like,

499
00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:29,720
Speaker 1: we did, guys, we love it burn in a good way, right,

500
00:30:30,160 --> 00:30:33,280
Speaker 1: But I mean he he didn't ever want to change

501
00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:36,360
Speaker 1: it up. He had loyalty to everyone who was there.

502
00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:40,240
Speaker 1: Yeah he did, Yeah, he did. Those guys were so good.

503
00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:44,120
Speaker 1: We ate well. They us. They would even remember they

504
00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:46,240
Speaker 1: would put up on our like if you they knew

505
00:30:46,280 --> 00:30:48,120
Speaker 1: that you liked a certain things they made like a

506
00:30:48,240 --> 00:30:53,320
Speaker 1: name of my breed or something. True. That's true, that's true.

507
00:30:53,360 --> 00:30:56,440
Speaker 1: I still have pictures of those menus. That's true. That's right.

508
00:30:56,840 --> 00:30:59,600
Speaker 1: And and we had the best craft service at Peter

509
00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:23,040
Speaker 1: Peter got blessed, bless Yeah, you started talking about this

510
00:31:23,120 --> 00:31:28,520
Speaker 1: a little before, but just how hair changed over over

511
00:31:28,600 --> 00:31:31,280
Speaker 1: the course of the show, like specifically with Pam or

512
00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:35,400
Speaker 1: with Kelly. What were the decisions that were made. Were

513
00:31:35,480 --> 00:31:39,520
Speaker 1: you softening Pam or what happened? It depended on what

514
00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:43,120
Speaker 1: episode we were doing. Again, originally, in the beginning, they

515
00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:46,480
Speaker 1: were supposed to be very simple, very plain, you know,

516
00:31:46,920 --> 00:31:51,680
Speaker 1: regular day people. But as some people became producers of

517
00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:55,160
Speaker 1: the show, then they had an actual say more in

518
00:31:55,360 --> 00:31:59,000
Speaker 1: what I could do for them. So, um, you'll see

519
00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:01,840
Speaker 1: the evolution of Pam's hair for instance, where she was

520
00:32:01,960 --> 00:32:03,880
Speaker 1: very kind of messy and it was a scrunchy thing

521
00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:06,600
Speaker 1: and kind of pulled back right and she had that

522
00:32:06,680 --> 00:32:09,520
Speaker 1: clip in all the time, and then and then literally

523
00:32:09,560 --> 00:32:12,360
Speaker 1: in season two and I remember her talking about this

524
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:15,680
Speaker 1: because I listened to her podcast, but she said, you know,

525
00:32:15,960 --> 00:32:18,120
Speaker 1: Kim was so happy for the first time ever she

526
00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:20,120
Speaker 1: was able to have all of her hair down, which

527
00:32:20,200 --> 00:32:22,520
Speaker 1: was true because we had had it, you know, in

528
00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:25,880
Speaker 1: a clip with the scrunchy and it was just and

529
00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:28,680
Speaker 1: she has this natural curl and we got to kind

530
00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:30,640
Speaker 1: of smooth it out and make it a little more

531
00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:34,680
Speaker 1: fun and a little more designed. And the same thing

532
00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:38,920
Speaker 1: with Angela. You know, originally her character was she's supposed

533
00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:41,840
Speaker 1: to be very severe, She's very uptight. She doesn't really

534
00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:44,800
Speaker 1: care as much. She just wants you know, she's all business.

535
00:32:45,320 --> 00:32:48,240
Speaker 1: So that was true in the first few but then

536
00:32:48,400 --> 00:32:51,280
Speaker 1: as that evolved as well, then she had her hair

537
00:32:51,360 --> 00:32:53,440
Speaker 1: in a ponytail and then sometimes she'd have it down

538
00:32:53,520 --> 00:32:55,360
Speaker 1: and I did the Angela braid on her, which was

539
00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:58,240
Speaker 1: really fun, and that little headband braid, and and so

540
00:32:58,400 --> 00:33:00,719
Speaker 1: she got to be a little softer, but also her

541
00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:03,240
Speaker 1: character was softening. So I think it kind of played

542
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:07,239
Speaker 1: with how they you know, what their direction was, as

543
00:33:07,320 --> 00:33:09,440
Speaker 1: they're falling in love with different people, or their meeting

544
00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:12,200
Speaker 1: new people, or kind of that course of it just

545
00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:15,560
Speaker 1: going forward. But um, and the same thing with Steve

546
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:17,160
Speaker 1: when I first met him and we changed his hair

547
00:33:17,360 --> 00:33:20,160
Speaker 1: immediately and he was really on board too, so that

548
00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:22,160
Speaker 1: kind of stayed and he kind of kept that same

549
00:33:22,240 --> 00:33:25,520
Speaker 1: look for him the whole time. But again there were

550
00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:27,520
Speaker 1: a lot of hair gags. There was gum and his hair.

551
00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:29,600
Speaker 1: I remember that day I had to peanut butter on

552
00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:33,200
Speaker 1: my hands for twelve hours and it was just insane. So,

553
00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:36,240
Speaker 1: you know, every gag had its thing, And even the

554
00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:39,200
Speaker 1: big thing with with Kate and having her head shaved,

555
00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:43,240
Speaker 1: that was four weeks of prep for me because I

556
00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:46,600
Speaker 1: had to plan you know, she needed to be bald,

557
00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:49,080
Speaker 1: so we needed a specialist and then he ended up,

558
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:50,640
Speaker 1: you know, doing the ball cap for her. But I

559
00:33:50,720 --> 00:33:52,400
Speaker 1: had to build hair pieces for her, and we had

560
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:54,160
Speaker 1: to do tests, and we had to do another test

561
00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:56,720
Speaker 1: and then a third test and then remember you guys

562
00:33:56,760 --> 00:33:59,800
Speaker 1: were like grabbing the hair, and you know, I had

563
00:33:59,840 --> 00:34:02,479
Speaker 1: to teacher, and I had to shave um. I had

564
00:34:02,560 --> 00:34:04,360
Speaker 1: to get a certain clipper, and then I had to

565
00:34:04,640 --> 00:34:06,880
Speaker 1: modify the clipper just so it wouldn't tear if she

566
00:34:07,000 --> 00:34:08,960
Speaker 1: was pushing it back because it was so thin. You

567
00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:10,600
Speaker 1: have to make sure it's not going to tear. Like

568
00:34:11,200 --> 00:34:13,879
Speaker 1: there was so many variables to that. It was four

569
00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:17,000
Speaker 1: weeks of prep just for that gag. But everybody thought

570
00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:19,120
Speaker 1: she actually shaved her head, which it was pretty great,

571
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:22,800
Speaker 1: pretty great, and and and Kate, it's really healthy and

572
00:34:23,440 --> 00:34:26,839
Speaker 1: so much, so much to make that flat. It took

573
00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:29,360
Speaker 1: me forty five minutes to do the actual rap to

574
00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:32,640
Speaker 1: get her head underneath. And then yeah, it was a lot,

575
00:34:32,960 --> 00:34:36,000
Speaker 1: which was fun. Though I loved that stuff. I love

576
00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:39,640
Speaker 1: that Greg would challenge me and he was happy each time,

577
00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:43,080
Speaker 1: which was great. So, right, was there ever any discussion

578
00:34:43,160 --> 00:34:48,360
Speaker 1: about Pam's hair changing based on where she was with

579
00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:53,879
Speaker 1: her relationship with Jim. Yes, yes, absolutely about that, as

580
00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:56,360
Speaker 1: she was kind of they were kind of falling for

581
00:34:56,480 --> 00:35:00,239
Speaker 1: each other. She got a lot more saw after, so

582
00:35:00,320 --> 00:35:02,479
Speaker 1: we did. We got rid of all her natural curl

583
00:35:02,560 --> 00:35:04,520
Speaker 1: and we started doing like blow drives, and then we

584
00:35:04,560 --> 00:35:08,120
Speaker 1: started doing curls and waves and something very soft because

585
00:35:08,160 --> 00:35:09,840
Speaker 1: she was kind of falling in love with this person

586
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:13,000
Speaker 1: and same thing for him, so it definitely changed for

587
00:35:13,040 --> 00:35:18,759
Speaker 1: her at that point. Right, Um, so did you leave

588
00:35:18,920 --> 00:35:25,120
Speaker 1: before the end? I sadly did a few days. Um,

589
00:35:25,719 --> 00:35:30,760
Speaker 1: because as the show was ending, right, Greg kept adding

590
00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:33,240
Speaker 1: and then he added another week, and then he added

591
00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:36,680
Speaker 1: another week. And what I had set up was that

592
00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:39,120
Speaker 1: I was going to be going to show Pretty Little

593
00:35:39,120 --> 00:35:42,279
Speaker 1: Liars actually, and I had gotten that job, but it

594
00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:44,520
Speaker 1: was literally like a month and a half away. So

595
00:35:44,640 --> 00:35:47,120
Speaker 1: I thought, well, fine, I'll take a little time off,

596
00:35:47,360 --> 00:35:49,239
Speaker 1: you know, and then I'll just top on this other show.

597
00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:52,080
Speaker 1: And then he like booked another week and I'm like, well,

598
00:35:52,400 --> 00:35:55,320
Speaker 1: and I even told production too, I you know, this

599
00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:58,040
Speaker 1: is getting nervous, because then it pushed again and I

600
00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:01,080
Speaker 1: was like, wow, this is really getting close, and I'm

601
00:36:01,120 --> 00:36:02,839
Speaker 1: a little nervous, but they're like, no, no, no, it's

602
00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:04,960
Speaker 1: never going to go over that. And then I remember

603
00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:08,920
Speaker 1: literally the Sunday night that we were wrapping or I wrapped,

604
00:36:09,320 --> 00:36:11,359
Speaker 1: we still had a couple more days. It's like three

605
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:13,280
Speaker 1: more days or something. I think you did. I don't remember,

606
00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:17,480
Speaker 1: but um, I was devastated because I really wanted to

607
00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:20,239
Speaker 1: be there. That was my show. I lived that show

608
00:36:20,320 --> 00:36:22,440
Speaker 1: for ten years basically, you know, on and off, with

609
00:36:22,480 --> 00:36:25,120
Speaker 1: the seasons that we would go down a little bit. Yeah,

610
00:36:25,280 --> 00:36:27,399
Speaker 1: it was really hard for me to not be there

611
00:36:27,440 --> 00:36:29,160
Speaker 1: those last few days, and I know that it was

612
00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:31,680
Speaker 1: a whole thing with everyone there and everyone came back,

613
00:36:31,760 --> 00:36:33,920
Speaker 1: and I felt really left out. I'm not gonna lie.

614
00:36:33,960 --> 00:36:37,640
Speaker 1: It was sad. Oh yeah, yeah, because that was I mean,

615
00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:40,759
Speaker 1: I lived that show for so long and it was

616
00:36:40,800 --> 00:36:42,120
Speaker 1: all of my friends, and I wish I could have

617
00:36:42,160 --> 00:36:44,320
Speaker 1: been there. I know, Debbie took over and she ran it,

618
00:36:44,480 --> 00:36:46,120
Speaker 1: you know, those last few days, and I knew she

619
00:36:46,160 --> 00:36:49,319
Speaker 1: would do a great job. But it was really hard

620
00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:53,200
Speaker 1: because I then, you know, started Sunday night, I rapped,

621
00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:55,719
Speaker 1: I think it was like twelve thirty at night, and

622
00:36:55,840 --> 00:36:59,440
Speaker 1: then Monday morning, I went in at seven am to

623
00:36:59,560 --> 00:37:02,920
Speaker 1: load into the next trailer and worked you know that

624
00:37:03,040 --> 00:37:04,879
Speaker 1: week as a prep week, and then went right into

625
00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:07,840
Speaker 1: that show. So I didn't get a break. But I

626
00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:11,480
Speaker 1: really hate that I missed those last few days. But

627
00:37:11,520 --> 00:37:16,279
Speaker 1: they would sendny pictures and they were communicating, Yeah, it awesomething.

628
00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:19,520
Speaker 1: I mean to see a show that you've been with

629
00:37:19,680 --> 00:37:23,520
Speaker 1: all that many years and your baby, it was your baby. Yeah,

630
00:37:23,880 --> 00:37:26,680
Speaker 1: I mean we were there from the beginning and uh,

631
00:37:27,000 --> 00:37:30,359
Speaker 1: you know, people came, people went, but we were still

632
00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:33,160
Speaker 1: there and to see it all come to an end

633
00:37:33,200 --> 00:37:37,080
Speaker 1: that it was just kind of heart wrenching. It. Yeah,

634
00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:39,520
Speaker 1: my kids would come and visit and I had that

635
00:37:39,600 --> 00:37:41,360
Speaker 1: picnic table in the back, if you remember, because I

636
00:37:41,360 --> 00:37:43,279
Speaker 1: would just want to sit with them privately, and every

637
00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:44,960
Speaker 1: time all the actors and more, I'm like, no, no, no, no,

638
00:37:45,080 --> 00:37:47,600
Speaker 1: you don't you know, like they would come up, they

639
00:37:47,640 --> 00:37:49,160
Speaker 1: would pick up the kids, they would take them to

640
00:37:49,200 --> 00:37:51,440
Speaker 1: craft service and it was so sweet, Like it was

641
00:37:51,520 --> 00:37:54,160
Speaker 1: such a great I don't know if you'll ever have

642
00:37:54,200 --> 00:37:57,040
Speaker 1: another show like that. I really I don't know, do you.

643
00:37:57,239 --> 00:37:59,920
Speaker 1: I mean, it was such a different show than any

644
00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:03,480
Speaker 1: thing I've ever been on. Right, and I still am

645
00:38:03,480 --> 00:38:05,880
Speaker 1: in touch with Angelot. You know, I'm hopefully going to

646
00:38:05,960 --> 00:38:08,080
Speaker 1: go to their podcast and hang with them for a minute.

647
00:38:08,120 --> 00:38:10,279
Speaker 1: But you know, it was so nice to see Creed

648
00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:12,480
Speaker 1: in Vegas. And then I've I've seen Kate doing some

649
00:38:12,600 --> 00:38:15,879
Speaker 1: shows and I was still in touch and still there.

650
00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:23,920
Speaker 1: You know, Um, I did this crazy show for Hulu Housewives,

651
00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:32,000
Speaker 1: yeah and the kidding, and I went and uh, they

652
00:38:32,080 --> 00:38:33,680
Speaker 1: were telling me who was going to be on it,

653
00:38:33,800 --> 00:38:36,360
Speaker 1: and I saw Angela and so I said, well, you know,

654
00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:39,239
Speaker 1: we're not going to tell it until we had to

655
00:38:39,320 --> 00:38:42,800
Speaker 1: meet with the actors. And so when I walked in

656
00:38:44,800 --> 00:38:49,200
Speaker 1: her face just lit day and we hugged each other,

657
00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:51,800
Speaker 1: it was just wonderful. She said, I didn't know you

658
00:38:51,880 --> 00:38:55,000
Speaker 1: were going to be here. It was a good surprise,

659
00:38:55,080 --> 00:38:57,520
Speaker 1: and so we were able to you know, work everything out.

660
00:38:57,719 --> 00:39:00,640
Speaker 1: It was just you know, like a home week. It's great.

661
00:39:17,840 --> 00:39:21,840
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. I um, yeah, it's just to me,

662
00:39:22,200 --> 00:39:26,000
Speaker 1: it's crazy like these I mean, ordinary is a nice

663
00:39:26,040 --> 00:39:28,520
Speaker 1: way to say it, but a lot of ordinary looking

664
00:39:28,640 --> 00:39:33,399
Speaker 1: people on this show, middle aged office workers. Even though

665
00:39:33,440 --> 00:39:36,920
Speaker 1: the characters are universal. The fact that so many kids

666
00:39:37,080 --> 00:39:40,719
Speaker 1: are into it now, my kids are into this show, now,

667
00:39:41,040 --> 00:39:43,399
Speaker 1: you know how weird. That is for me. They love

668
00:39:44,760 --> 00:39:47,359
Speaker 1: Effort has a Dunder Mifflin shirt, he has Dunder mid

669
00:39:47,440 --> 00:39:50,000
Speaker 1: Flynn pants, like he says, Oh my god, all my

670
00:39:50,160 --> 00:39:53,520
Speaker 1: friends and they love that show. Like you know, it

671
00:39:53,640 --> 00:39:56,839
Speaker 1: makes me kind of cool. Yes, you are how old?

672
00:39:58,040 --> 00:40:03,400
Speaker 1: He's fifteen and he's that's were now Connor just passed me.

673
00:40:04,800 --> 00:40:08,440
Speaker 1: It's not baby. They were yeah, they were tiny. Do

674
00:40:08,560 --> 00:40:15,000
Speaker 1: they remember anything about being there? They remember craft service? Okay, right,

675
00:40:15,080 --> 00:40:17,560
Speaker 1: well that makes sense. Yeah, that's where they can get

676
00:40:18,239 --> 00:40:22,560
Speaker 1: All my friends. Teenagers and young adults are into it,

677
00:40:23,080 --> 00:40:25,959
Speaker 1: all of them. Yeah. Yeah, And you're like you said,

678
00:40:26,200 --> 00:40:28,600
Speaker 1: if you wear anything that has like my jacket or

679
00:40:28,640 --> 00:40:31,120
Speaker 1: I have my chat onto something, people walk out there

680
00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:34,360
Speaker 1: like right on. You know, yeah, they stopped you and stuff.

681
00:40:34,719 --> 00:40:37,440
Speaker 1: I remember we did the thing out and uh we

682
00:40:37,520 --> 00:40:40,800
Speaker 1: were at the country club somewhere West l As. It

683
00:40:40,880 --> 00:40:44,880
Speaker 1: was a golf thing, okay, yes, remember remember yes, yes,

684
00:40:45,000 --> 00:40:48,200
Speaker 1: And so we were going back and forth and they

685
00:40:48,320 --> 00:40:53,680
Speaker 1: were huge crowds of young people, teenagers that were like

686
00:40:54,080 --> 00:40:59,200
Speaker 1: so excited about the show. Yeah yeah, even then young

687
00:40:59,400 --> 00:41:04,719
Speaker 1: It appeals to ye the parents though, and yeah, I

688
00:41:04,760 --> 00:41:07,279
Speaker 1: think it appears that it appeals I'm telling you from

689
00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:10,120
Speaker 1: thirteen on up? Is your thirteen year old into it

690
00:41:10,320 --> 00:41:13,719
Speaker 1: or more than sixteen? Um, he was watching it for

691
00:41:13,760 --> 00:41:16,320
Speaker 1: a while, but then he's kind of switched into his

692
00:41:16,360 --> 00:41:18,600
Speaker 1: mother stuff, so he goes back to it. But yeah,

693
00:41:18,680 --> 00:41:21,680
Speaker 1: EVERT was excited that he um, yeah, that he has

694
00:41:21,719 --> 00:41:25,799
Speaker 1: stuff from the show, and yeah, it's kind of cool. Yeah. Six. Four,

695
00:41:26,400 --> 00:41:29,920
Speaker 1: I know. Four. Let me let me ask you one

696
00:41:29,920 --> 00:41:35,920
Speaker 1: more question. What five? Why would you choose to work

697
00:41:36,239 --> 00:41:40,800
Speaker 1: in film and television as opposed to like a salon? Okay,

698
00:41:40,800 --> 00:41:44,239
Speaker 1: I can tell you what it is for me. Um,

699
00:41:44,520 --> 00:41:48,520
Speaker 1: As a little girl, I used to watch television and

700
00:41:48,920 --> 00:41:54,400
Speaker 1: old movies. I loved old movies, you know, Clark Gable,

701
00:41:55,200 --> 00:42:02,719
Speaker 1: Myrna Lloyd, whoever, Gary Cooper, Sydney Port Geane, Kelly, Freda Stair, Oh,

702
00:42:02,800 --> 00:42:08,800
Speaker 1: my god, Rosny Russell. So it was just a dream

703
00:42:09,000 --> 00:42:11,960
Speaker 1: of mine, and I guess I as I grew up,

704
00:42:12,000 --> 00:42:15,319
Speaker 1: and I just started realizing what God gave me as

705
00:42:15,360 --> 00:42:17,880
Speaker 1: a gift, which was was doing here. I did. My

706
00:42:17,960 --> 00:42:20,719
Speaker 1: mother would give me dollars every year and m by

707
00:42:20,760 --> 00:42:23,200
Speaker 1: the time they ended, she get up Christmas, by the

708
00:42:23,239 --> 00:42:26,280
Speaker 1: time June came, they were balled here because I curled

709
00:42:26,360 --> 00:42:34,080
Speaker 1: him and twisted them. And so I guess when I

710
00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:37,360
Speaker 1: came out here, it was a goal of mine to

711
00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:40,080
Speaker 1: get into film and television. That wasn't an easy thing,

712
00:42:40,760 --> 00:42:44,640
Speaker 1: but um, I just kept pursuing and um, but it

713
00:42:44,760 --> 00:42:47,759
Speaker 1: wasn't my timing, it was God's timing. And uh, one

714
00:42:47,880 --> 00:42:51,040
Speaker 1: day he opened up a door for me and I

715
00:42:51,200 --> 00:42:54,920
Speaker 1: went through and oh my god, it's just been wonderful.

716
00:42:55,239 --> 00:42:58,640
Speaker 1: But I wanted to work, and so and I worked

717
00:42:58,680 --> 00:43:01,360
Speaker 1: in the salon. I had a very sccessful career in

718
00:43:01,440 --> 00:43:04,120
Speaker 1: the salon. When I got ready to leave, my clients

719
00:43:04,160 --> 00:43:07,680
Speaker 1: were like, what you leave in me? You know? I

720
00:43:07,760 --> 00:43:10,879
Speaker 1: knew a platform artists to write a platform artists. Yeah,

721
00:43:11,000 --> 00:43:15,560
Speaker 1: I work for Revalon for many years and so I

722
00:43:15,719 --> 00:43:20,680
Speaker 1: had different phases of the beauty industry. But this was

723
00:43:21,000 --> 00:43:26,240
Speaker 1: and is my favorite. Yeah. I I've been um blessed

724
00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:29,120
Speaker 1: to work on some really great shows, meet some really

725
00:43:29,160 --> 00:43:32,879
Speaker 1: good people. This one here, now, I just gotta say

726
00:43:33,400 --> 00:43:36,759
Speaker 1: how much I love and care about her. Um. Oh,

727
00:43:36,840 --> 00:43:40,120
Speaker 1: I know what you're gonna say when we started this show,

728
00:43:41,440 --> 00:43:47,080
Speaker 1: and you're gonna excuse me we started the show. Um,

729
00:43:47,640 --> 00:43:53,760
Speaker 1: I was diagnosed with breast cancer and I told Kimmy

730
00:43:53,960 --> 00:43:58,560
Speaker 1: I said, Kim, I know that you know you you

731
00:43:58,719 --> 00:44:00,960
Speaker 1: need to have some money that's going to be around

732
00:44:01,360 --> 00:44:04,320
Speaker 1: and help you and do and all. And um, you

733
00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:06,040
Speaker 1: know I'm gonna have to go and take care of this.

734
00:44:06,680 --> 00:44:09,799
Speaker 1: And I appreciate you let me work with you so far,

735
00:44:10,000 --> 00:44:12,359
Speaker 1: but I know you're gonna need to get somebody else.

736
00:44:12,920 --> 00:44:17,360
Speaker 1: And she said to me, Debbie Pierce, I will not

737
00:44:17,600 --> 00:44:20,880
Speaker 1: let you go. That's because you're gonna need those hours

738
00:44:21,360 --> 00:44:23,160
Speaker 1: and you're going to need that to get through this.

739
00:44:24,080 --> 00:44:26,759
Speaker 1: So I will cover your shift every night, and you

740
00:44:26,840 --> 00:44:28,960
Speaker 1: will go to therapy and you will take care of

741
00:44:29,080 --> 00:44:31,720
Speaker 1: yourself so you survive this. And I will do anything

742
00:44:32,080 --> 00:44:34,880
Speaker 1: you need. And she did. She brought in some people

743
00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:40,520
Speaker 1: temporarily to help. And then I, um, I went all

744
00:44:40,640 --> 00:44:44,759
Speaker 1: you guys, all guys, she wouldn't let me quit. Um.

745
00:44:44,840 --> 00:44:48,680
Speaker 1: I went UH through treatment for two and a half months.

746
00:44:49,120 --> 00:44:54,040
Speaker 1: I left every day after after touch ups at two

747
00:44:54,120 --> 00:44:56,759
Speaker 1: and I went to UH Daniel Freeman which is no

748
00:44:56,880 --> 00:45:00,600
Speaker 1: more at in l A meeting Inglewood, and I took

749
00:45:00,680 --> 00:45:03,720
Speaker 1: my treatment. I had my surgery and took my treatment

750
00:45:04,200 --> 00:45:06,680
Speaker 1: and I came back to work. And you guys, you

751
00:45:06,800 --> 00:45:10,160
Speaker 1: know we're so kind and loving to me, and I

752
00:45:11,200 --> 00:45:16,279
Speaker 1: appreciate that so much to this day. I I just

753
00:45:16,440 --> 00:45:22,440
Speaker 1: love this one. Yeah, and you're still here kicking at girls.

754
00:45:23,440 --> 00:45:26,759
Speaker 1: Yeah we did the right thing. Yeah we did well.

755
00:45:26,800 --> 00:45:31,600
Speaker 1: How does it feel knowing you were a little girl

756
00:45:31,920 --> 00:45:38,919
Speaker 1: watching Clark Gable and fred As Stare and you grew

757
00:45:39,080 --> 00:45:48,000
Speaker 1: up and became an important part of television history yourself? Brian,

758
00:45:48,080 --> 00:45:52,279
Speaker 1: I can't tell you, um, what a feeling that is. Um.

759
00:45:53,800 --> 00:45:58,880
Speaker 1: The last two years eighteen and nineteen, I worked on

760
00:45:58,960 --> 00:46:03,000
Speaker 1: a couple of projects that were nominated for Emmies, and

761
00:46:03,120 --> 00:46:08,880
Speaker 1: I got nominated um along with those projects, and I

762
00:46:10,560 --> 00:46:14,200
Speaker 1: I was just floored because here's this little black girl

763
00:46:14,360 --> 00:46:19,279
Speaker 1: from Younger's New York who watched all those people on

764
00:46:20,200 --> 00:46:25,320
Speaker 1: the movies and television and everything, and now I have

765
00:46:25,480 --> 00:46:30,600
Speaker 1: an opportunity two be in that arena and do the work.

766
00:46:31,960 --> 00:46:36,120
Speaker 1: I was honored. I was thrilled. I was humbled. I

767
00:46:36,280 --> 00:46:40,120
Speaker 1: was thanking my God that I was able to I

768
00:46:40,200 --> 00:46:43,560
Speaker 1: have this opportunity to do what I love to do.

769
00:46:44,520 --> 00:46:48,719
Speaker 1: It was amazing. It was amazing. So I I'm and

770
00:46:48,800 --> 00:46:52,360
Speaker 1: I'm still in awe. You know. I worked on a

771
00:46:53,160 --> 00:46:56,080
Speaker 1: thing that a couple of weeks ago they were doing

772
00:46:56,120 --> 00:46:59,200
Speaker 1: a thing called Perry Amazing. Oh yeah, they're doing a

773
00:46:59,239 --> 00:47:02,680
Speaker 1: Pary Amazing, which is a period they're doing it when

774
00:47:02,760 --> 00:47:06,399
Speaker 1: he was a young lawyer. Yeah, it was very cool

775
00:47:06,520 --> 00:47:09,239
Speaker 1: they did it. We did the thirties and all. So

776
00:47:09,440 --> 00:47:12,080
Speaker 1: that was wonderful for me. And that was the great

777
00:47:12,160 --> 00:47:15,520
Speaker 1: thing about um, you know, having opportunities to go back

778
00:47:16,160 --> 00:47:20,800
Speaker 1: and do periods that you grew up seeing. It's just

779
00:47:20,920 --> 00:47:23,440
Speaker 1: fun here to do, you know. And even when we

780
00:47:23,520 --> 00:47:27,480
Speaker 1: did stuff on the show, doing different wigs and stuff

781
00:47:27,560 --> 00:47:32,160
Speaker 1: to uh, you know whatever characters, and we did Farrell, Um,

782
00:47:33,080 --> 00:47:36,560
Speaker 1: Will Farrell, we had we did Will Ferrell and uh

783
00:47:37,200 --> 00:47:42,520
Speaker 1: you remember Fredis Stair but not Will Ferrell. Sorry, Will

784
00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:48,879
Speaker 1: no lovely man. It's such a lovely man. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

785
00:47:49,000 --> 00:47:51,800
Speaker 1: we did. We did uh we did some fun things

786
00:47:52,560 --> 00:47:57,239
Speaker 1: Phyllis's wedding. Yeah, what are you What are you most

787
00:47:57,320 --> 00:48:02,879
Speaker 1: proud of? Honestly, I would say the Office, I really would.

788
00:48:03,120 --> 00:48:06,120
Speaker 1: It was such a great show. It was It seemed

789
00:48:06,160 --> 00:48:09,719
Speaker 1: in the beginning we had so many challenges and it

790
00:48:09,880 --> 00:48:12,320
Speaker 1: just wasn't going to go, but we stuck with it

791
00:48:12,520 --> 00:48:14,960
Speaker 1: and then it just like slowly got this falling And

792
00:48:15,280 --> 00:48:19,640
Speaker 1: actually I remember, um and I've said this to other people.

793
00:48:19,640 --> 00:48:23,400
Speaker 1: Remember when you guys had my Space where before Facebook,

794
00:48:24,040 --> 00:48:26,760
Speaker 1: they all went out and I remember, like Jenna and Johnny,

795
00:48:26,920 --> 00:48:29,520
Speaker 1: like all of you, We're going and saying, you know,

796
00:48:29,600 --> 00:48:31,040
Speaker 1: we want to be on Carson and we want to

797
00:48:31,080 --> 00:48:32,799
Speaker 1: go on these shows. And you put yourself out there.

798
00:48:32,840 --> 00:48:35,279
Speaker 1: And I feel sincerely that that's what saved the show

799
00:48:35,920 --> 00:48:37,959
Speaker 1: because you were, you know, in a in a time

800
00:48:38,040 --> 00:48:40,200
Speaker 1: where we didn't have I mean, social media how it

801
00:48:40,320 --> 00:48:44,280
Speaker 1: is today is crazy, but back then you were physically

802
00:48:44,320 --> 00:48:46,200
Speaker 1: going to shows, you were going on my Space. You

803
00:48:46,360 --> 00:48:49,439
Speaker 1: understood that we could reach more people, and I think

804
00:48:49,560 --> 00:48:52,600
Speaker 1: that helped float it and then it turned it. Yeah,

805
00:48:52,600 --> 00:48:56,440
Speaker 1: I mean we were definitely so we were struggling so

806
00:48:56,880 --> 00:48:59,359
Speaker 1: much and we all felt like it could end at

807
00:48:59,360 --> 00:49:04,600
Speaker 1: any moment. Yeah, there was a very active campaign by

808
00:49:04,960 --> 00:49:07,279
Speaker 1: the actors to say, like, let's see if we can

809
00:49:07,400 --> 00:49:10,160
Speaker 1: keep this going a little bit longer, just because we

810
00:49:10,239 --> 00:49:12,640
Speaker 1: felt like it was. It was, it was a good

811
00:49:12,680 --> 00:49:15,120
Speaker 1: show and it was worth it. You put in the work,

812
00:49:15,520 --> 00:49:18,520
Speaker 1: You actually put in the work, and that's what turned

813
00:49:18,560 --> 00:49:22,359
Speaker 1: everything around. Yeah, it did, it really did. And I think, yes,

814
00:49:22,600 --> 00:49:24,880
Speaker 1: like I said, season two, I think it found it

815
00:49:25,360 --> 00:49:27,880
Speaker 1: the footing of it and it kind of excelled, and

816
00:49:27,960 --> 00:49:30,040
Speaker 1: it just it took on a life of its own,

817
00:49:30,080 --> 00:49:31,960
Speaker 1: and I think that's really what held it together. And

818
00:49:32,160 --> 00:49:35,279
Speaker 1: I knew they within a few weeks were like, yeah,

819
00:49:36,000 --> 00:49:39,840
Speaker 1: I really did. And it just went forever, which was awesome.

820
00:49:40,000 --> 00:49:41,960
Speaker 1: So it was nice to have that long of a

821
00:49:42,040 --> 00:49:44,359
Speaker 1: run and through the whole process to what was cool

822
00:49:44,520 --> 00:49:47,560
Speaker 1: is that people are getting married, people are buying cars

823
00:49:47,680 --> 00:49:50,840
Speaker 1: for the first time, people are buying house and you know,

824
00:49:51,040 --> 00:49:53,120
Speaker 1: so it kind of it was such a cool thing

825
00:49:53,239 --> 00:49:56,160
Speaker 1: to see everybody, you know, moving into different stages of

826
00:49:56,520 --> 00:50:02,400
Speaker 1: what of life. Yeah yeah, I mean whole thirties was

827
00:50:02,520 --> 00:50:07,320
Speaker 1: spent there. Oh wow, yes, I mean that's that's a decade.

828
00:50:08,360 --> 00:50:11,360
Speaker 1: It was a decade of our lives. Yeah, yeah, it was.

829
00:50:11,560 --> 00:50:14,040
Speaker 1: That's why it's so sentimental and it's so it meant

830
00:50:14,080 --> 00:50:18,839
Speaker 1: so much, such a great show. Yeah. Well, um, thank

831
00:50:18,880 --> 00:50:20,880
Speaker 1: you guys so much for coming to talk to me

832
00:50:23,640 --> 00:50:26,719
Speaker 1: so much. It's so good to see. It's so good

833
00:50:26,760 --> 00:50:29,080
Speaker 1: to see you. I will get your hairpiece to you

834
00:50:29,200 --> 00:50:32,759
Speaker 1: and we'll just try it on someday. You know. I

835
00:50:32,960 --> 00:50:35,879
Speaker 1: just wore a really really bad one for the first

836
00:50:35,920 --> 00:50:38,680
Speaker 1: time since then, like a really bad yes, I mean

837
00:50:38,719 --> 00:50:41,520
Speaker 1: it was sort of intentionally it was. It was a

838
00:50:41,680 --> 00:50:47,359
Speaker 1: movie that took place in the eighties, and it had

839
00:50:47,600 --> 00:50:53,080
Speaker 1: kind of a what is it Jimmy swagger, like jim

840
00:50:53,239 --> 00:50:57,200
Speaker 1: Baker Baker kind of. They showed me a picture of

841
00:50:57,440 --> 00:51:01,520
Speaker 1: the idea which was like kind us Sam Donaldson with

842
00:51:01,680 --> 00:51:08,239
Speaker 1: that like strong, strong with the hair. Yeah, so it

843
00:51:08,400 --> 00:51:13,120
Speaker 1: wasn't necessarily supposed to look good. I don't know. I

844
00:51:13,239 --> 00:51:15,760
Speaker 1: haven't seen the dailies. We'll see if it if that works,

845
00:51:16,280 --> 00:51:20,200
Speaker 1: if it works like somewhat believably because there's yeah, but yeah,

846
00:51:20,200 --> 00:51:26,040
Speaker 1: it comes off later in the movie. Yeah. Um, thanks

847
00:51:26,080 --> 00:51:32,719
Speaker 1: you guys. Oh my god, the three of us, can

848
00:51:32,800 --> 00:51:36,360
Speaker 1: we get a photo of me? And Oh my gosh,

849
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Speaker 1: good to see you. Oh how much fun did I have?

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Speaker 1: Debbie and Kim. Thank you so much for joining me.

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Speaker 1: I really enjoyed talking to you. And let me just say,

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Speaker 1: I am so glad that you decided to join the

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Speaker 1: TV biz and leave your beauty salons. I don't know

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Speaker 1: what we would have done without you and listeners. I

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Speaker 1: don't know what we would do without you, so thank

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00:52:16,640 --> 00:52:19,520
Speaker 1: you so much for listening. You know, if a tree

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Speaker 1: falls in the woods and no one listens. Did we

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Speaker 1: make this podcast? I don't know, but I hope you

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Speaker 1: have a magnificent week and I am going to see

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Speaker 1: you next time for another episode of the Office Deep Dive.

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Speaker 1: The Office Deep Dive is hosted and executive produced by

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Speaker 1: me Brian baum Gartner, alongside our executive producer Langley. Our

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Speaker 1: senior producer is Tessa Kramer. Our producers are Diego Tapia

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00:52:55,440 --> 00:52:58,200
Speaker 1: and Liz Hayes. My main man in the booth is

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Speaker 1: Alec Moore. Our theme song Bubble and Squeak, performed by

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Speaker 1: my great friend Creed Bratton, and the episode was mixed

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Speaker 1: by Seth Olandsky.