1 00:00:01,040 --> 00:00:06,360 Speaker 1: Conversations on life, style, beauty, and relationships. It's The Velvet's 2 00:00:06,400 --> 00:00:09,800 Speaker 1: Edge Podcast with Kelly Henderson. David Moscow is here. I 3 00:00:09,840 --> 00:00:12,639 Speaker 1: have to tell you I am a huge fan. Back 4 00:00:12,680 --> 00:00:16,480 Speaker 1: in the day you were in the movie Newsies and Big. 5 00:00:16,520 --> 00:00:19,600 Speaker 1: I mean, these are like very big movies for people 6 00:00:19,680 --> 00:00:22,759 Speaker 1: like me, So I'm so happy to have you here. 7 00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:25,720 Speaker 1: But you've completely transitioned. I mean, you're this huge actor. 8 00:00:25,760 --> 00:00:29,400 Speaker 1: You've had so many different projects, You've done production, you produce, 9 00:00:29,920 --> 00:00:32,760 Speaker 1: and now you're in this whole different role I would 10 00:00:32,800 --> 00:00:36,760 Speaker 1: imagine for you, and you've kind of gotten into some activism. Um, 11 00:00:36,800 --> 00:00:39,479 Speaker 1: but I really want to talk about that transition for 12 00:00:39,560 --> 00:00:43,159 Speaker 1: you and what that was like, just transitioning from acting 13 00:00:43,760 --> 00:00:47,840 Speaker 1: to now producing and really really getting behind the cause 14 00:00:47,920 --> 00:00:53,800 Speaker 1: that you're working on. Wow, Yeah, it was. It was 15 00:00:53,840 --> 00:00:57,000 Speaker 1: sort of I don't know, gradual until it wasn't. You know. 16 00:00:57,200 --> 00:01:00,000 Speaker 1: I had been in the as an actor. I've been 17 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:02,800 Speaker 1: in the business for a long time. Big. I was 18 00:01:02,880 --> 00:01:05,880 Speaker 1: eleven years old when I had that audition, the second 19 00:01:05,920 --> 00:01:09,840 Speaker 1: audition that I'd ever done, and originally it was Robert 20 00:01:09,880 --> 00:01:12,040 Speaker 1: de Niro, not Tom Hanks. So I was actually auditioning 21 00:01:12,080 --> 00:01:15,560 Speaker 1: for the best friend and so I was eleven and 22 00:01:15,560 --> 00:01:18,800 Speaker 1: and then you know, you get to be you know, 23 00:01:18,959 --> 00:01:24,480 Speaker 1: thirty five ish, and you don't have to In order 24 00:01:24,560 --> 00:01:27,160 Speaker 1: to be a successful actor, you have to have an 25 00:01:27,160 --> 00:01:30,840 Speaker 1: insane drive. You have to want it because lots of 26 00:01:30,840 --> 00:01:34,200 Speaker 1: people out here want it, right. Everybody wants to be 27 00:01:34,959 --> 00:01:37,760 Speaker 1: Brad Pitt. It's like wishing you were the King of England, right, 28 00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:40,680 Speaker 1: So you've got to really really have it. And I 29 00:01:40,680 --> 00:01:44,360 Speaker 1: would meet young people, young creatives. I would you know, 30 00:01:44,480 --> 00:01:46,160 Speaker 1: be talking in them and be like, oh wow, yeah, 31 00:01:46,240 --> 00:01:50,680 Speaker 1: you have that burning I remember that. Um. Because when 32 00:01:50,680 --> 00:01:52,720 Speaker 1: you're auditioning and you're putting yourself out there, you really 33 00:01:52,720 --> 00:01:57,760 Speaker 1: have to prepare more than anybody else. Um. And and 34 00:01:57,880 --> 00:02:00,320 Speaker 1: love what you're doing, love the ups and downs. I 35 00:02:00,440 --> 00:02:06,080 Speaker 1: started to get more excited with kind of facilitating behind 36 00:02:06,120 --> 00:02:08,800 Speaker 1: the scenes, like how do you build a movie? People 37 00:02:08,840 --> 00:02:11,640 Speaker 1: would call me up and be like, you know, because 38 00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:13,160 Speaker 1: I had been in the business so long, they were 39 00:02:13,560 --> 00:02:15,079 Speaker 1: how would I get a movie off the ground? And 40 00:02:15,080 --> 00:02:17,680 Speaker 1: I'd be like, call this person and call that person 41 00:02:17,760 --> 00:02:22,280 Speaker 1: and they'll help you. And then um, and somehow you 42 00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:25,120 Speaker 1: would get roped into producing things because they call you 43 00:02:25,200 --> 00:02:26,880 Speaker 1: to be like that didn't work so what do I 44 00:02:26,919 --> 00:02:30,120 Speaker 1: do next? And You'll be like, okay, let me call. 45 00:02:31,080 --> 00:02:33,920 Speaker 1: And then I was running a theater company with some 46 00:02:33,960 --> 00:02:36,720 Speaker 1: friends in New York. I was I had just done 47 00:02:37,360 --> 00:02:42,320 Speaker 1: an HBO a pilot for an HBO TV series, Last 48 00:02:42,320 --> 00:02:45,760 Speaker 1: of the Ninth um it was David Milch, who had 49 00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:50,440 Speaker 1: done Deadwood and NYPD Blue like legendary showrunner, and um, 50 00:02:50,480 --> 00:02:52,120 Speaker 1: I was the heavy I was the bad guy. It 51 00:02:52,240 --> 00:02:54,200 Speaker 1: was like in the seventies, was a cop drama in 52 00:02:54,240 --> 00:02:57,120 Speaker 1: New York. And at the same time I had this 53 00:02:57,200 --> 00:03:00,560 Speaker 1: theater company. And my dad called me up and said 54 00:03:01,000 --> 00:03:05,080 Speaker 1: that a friend of his son had written twenty pages 55 00:03:05,080 --> 00:03:07,000 Speaker 1: of music for a play. And when I listened to 56 00:03:07,000 --> 00:03:08,799 Speaker 1: it at the theater company and I was like, oh no, 57 00:03:08,840 --> 00:03:12,320 Speaker 1: this is a terrible thing. There's nothing worse than being 58 00:03:12,320 --> 00:03:14,840 Speaker 1: stuck in bad theater. And then it was a family 59 00:03:14,880 --> 00:03:19,200 Speaker 1: friend as well, but I said okay, And so Luise's 60 00:03:19,200 --> 00:03:22,760 Speaker 1: son came down with his college friends and they put 61 00:03:22,800 --> 00:03:24,920 Speaker 1: on a performance, and five minutes in I was like, 62 00:03:24,960 --> 00:03:29,399 Speaker 1: lock the Doors is amazing. And his name was Lin 63 00:03:29,440 --> 00:03:33,000 Speaker 1: Manuel Miranda and and it was in the Heights, which 64 00:03:33,080 --> 00:03:34,800 Speaker 1: ended up winning the Tony. And then Lynn went on 65 00:03:34,840 --> 00:03:37,760 Speaker 1: to do Hamilton's after that, but I became the original 66 00:03:37,800 --> 00:03:41,400 Speaker 1: producer of In the Heights and so I'm doing this 67 00:03:41,960 --> 00:03:45,440 Speaker 1: HBO show, which if you would talk to me a 68 00:03:45,520 --> 00:03:47,560 Speaker 1: year or two even before that, I would have been like, 69 00:03:47,600 --> 00:03:50,480 Speaker 1: that's the dream to have a show. Right. This was 70 00:03:50,520 --> 00:03:53,800 Speaker 1: at the height of like the Sopranos, and so I 71 00:03:53,840 --> 00:03:57,600 Speaker 1: was like, everybody wanted this. And what I realized is 72 00:03:57,640 --> 00:04:02,920 Speaker 1: I was more interested in putting together the play. You know, 73 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:05,960 Speaker 1: I found all the investors. I brought in the casting 74 00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:09,120 Speaker 1: director Bernie Telsey, who had done rent. Um. I was 75 00:04:09,320 --> 00:04:12,040 Speaker 1: putting actors in the roles. So I was calling up, 76 00:04:12,240 --> 00:04:14,040 Speaker 1: you know, friends of mine who were successful to see 77 00:04:14,040 --> 00:04:17,560 Speaker 1: if they would come in and do a workshop. Um. 78 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:22,200 Speaker 1: And so I was I found myself, you know, responding 79 00:04:22,240 --> 00:04:25,640 Speaker 1: to my agents. They would be like, you have an 80 00:04:25,640 --> 00:04:29,040 Speaker 1: audition tomorrow, and I'm like, I'm sorry, I can't do it. 81 00:04:29,160 --> 00:04:31,080 Speaker 1: So it kind of it kind of was like it 82 00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:34,560 Speaker 1: built up until the moment when I realized that I 83 00:04:34,640 --> 00:04:40,000 Speaker 1: was more interested in facilitating for other creative people. UM. 84 00:04:40,040 --> 00:04:47,480 Speaker 1: Because also I started to become more um controlling what 85 00:04:47,720 --> 00:04:55,440 Speaker 1: you've been controlling, Well, I kind of would look at, um, 86 00:04:56,320 --> 00:05:00,400 Speaker 1: you look at things being mishandled people doing them in directly. 87 00:05:00,720 --> 00:05:03,520 Speaker 1: There's something that occurs a lot of times in independent 88 00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:07,680 Speaker 1: film work where people will work really hard to get 89 00:05:07,760 --> 00:05:11,000 Speaker 1: their movie made, and once their movie is made, they 90 00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:13,840 Speaker 1: have no plan. Their plan is that they're gonna get 91 00:05:13,839 --> 00:05:16,680 Speaker 1: into Sundays. That's their plan. That's it. And then you know, 92 00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:19,400 Speaker 1: the movies don't get into Sundays, and then they're like, 93 00:05:19,480 --> 00:05:23,200 Speaker 1: now what right? So I would watch these mistakes happen, 94 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:28,720 Speaker 1: and then UM I ended up partnering with a this 95 00:05:28,839 --> 00:05:32,080 Speaker 1: guy out of Wall Street who had a neat idea 96 00:05:32,279 --> 00:05:37,720 Speaker 1: around jumping on board films that were almost finished and 97 00:05:37,800 --> 00:05:42,760 Speaker 1: helping them get across the finish line, get theatrical release, 98 00:05:43,279 --> 00:05:47,320 Speaker 1: and and and international sales and really building the long 99 00:05:47,400 --> 00:05:50,200 Speaker 1: tail of a movie so that they could make another 100 00:05:50,240 --> 00:05:53,479 Speaker 1: movie that the filmmakers could do this again. And and 101 00:05:53,520 --> 00:05:57,640 Speaker 1: so I did that. After the In the Heights, I 102 00:05:57,760 --> 00:06:02,440 Speaker 1: ended up having this partnership and we produced, financed, raised 103 00:06:02,480 --> 00:06:05,680 Speaker 1: money for about twenty seven movies. UM. We had a 104 00:06:05,680 --> 00:06:08,400 Speaker 1: film in competition that Can We won Tribeca a couple 105 00:06:08,440 --> 00:06:13,080 Speaker 1: of times, Sundance a number of times, and and along 106 00:06:13,120 --> 00:06:16,680 Speaker 1: the way my investors, I would always be pitching projects 107 00:06:16,720 --> 00:06:19,240 Speaker 1: like is this stuff that you guys would be interested in? 108 00:06:19,520 --> 00:06:23,200 Speaker 1: And this one that kept coming up was doing a 109 00:06:23,279 --> 00:06:29,080 Speaker 1: documentary about food producers and how particularly a taco and 110 00:06:29,080 --> 00:06:33,480 Speaker 1: a margharita were made because Central Americans, particularly Mexicans, were 111 00:06:33,520 --> 00:06:35,920 Speaker 1: under a lot of attack. And I thought it was 112 00:06:36,040 --> 00:06:39,800 Speaker 1: ridiculous as we sat here sipping our margharita's and you know, 113 00:06:40,720 --> 00:06:43,479 Speaker 1: the most consumed cocktail the United States. Tacos are the 114 00:06:43,560 --> 00:06:46,320 Speaker 1: third most consumed food item, and here we are, like 115 00:06:46,600 --> 00:06:48,760 Speaker 1: trying to get these migrant workers out of our country. 116 00:06:48,800 --> 00:06:54,480 Speaker 1: It just seemed crazy. So I said, let's go from scratch, 117 00:06:55,360 --> 00:06:59,760 Speaker 1: harvest Massa with subsistence farmers in Ohaka, go to the 118 00:06:59,800 --> 00:07:03,719 Speaker 1: heat the doors in Jalisco make tequila, and let's just 119 00:07:03,760 --> 00:07:07,960 Speaker 1: show the hard work you know that, and and the 120 00:07:07,960 --> 00:07:11,360 Speaker 1: the expertise that's needed to make the food that we 121 00:07:12,400 --> 00:07:16,960 Speaker 1: you know, getting our paper bag at the drive through. Um, 122 00:07:17,040 --> 00:07:20,040 Speaker 1: and then UM, my investment, my investments will like that. 123 00:07:20,120 --> 00:07:24,720 Speaker 1: We like that. Let's try that, And like most things 124 00:07:24,720 --> 00:07:27,560 Speaker 1: in this business, it doesn't quite work out how you planned. 125 00:07:28,120 --> 00:07:31,320 Speaker 1: So it turned into a TV series. My my agent 126 00:07:31,600 --> 00:07:37,520 Speaker 1: at the time, repped Bourdain and his company ZPZ and 127 00:07:37,560 --> 00:07:39,640 Speaker 1: so they were like, well, why don't you do this 128 00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:43,280 Speaker 1: not just a one off, but every week you look 129 00:07:43,320 --> 00:07:46,200 Speaker 1: at a different food culture and the food producers there. 130 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:48,600 Speaker 1: And I was coming in as like a layman who 131 00:07:48,640 --> 00:07:51,040 Speaker 1: didn't know anything, and so it really would be leaning 132 00:07:51,040 --> 00:07:52,600 Speaker 1: on the experts and they would try and teach me 133 00:07:52,600 --> 00:07:55,840 Speaker 1: how to do things. Here we are two seasons and 134 00:07:55,920 --> 00:07:59,200 Speaker 1: a book later. So well, so the series and the 135 00:07:59,200 --> 00:08:02,560 Speaker 1: book that you're talking about are named, um from scratch. 136 00:08:02,680 --> 00:08:04,680 Speaker 1: If you guys have heard of them, or if you're 137 00:08:05,080 --> 00:08:08,800 Speaker 1: interested in things like that, I find it fascinating and UM, 138 00:08:08,840 --> 00:08:12,080 Speaker 1: I'm so happy that you're having these conversations and putting 139 00:08:12,080 --> 00:08:14,360 Speaker 1: them out there on such like the big scale that 140 00:08:14,400 --> 00:08:18,240 Speaker 1: you are, because you know, it just doesn't get talked 141 00:08:18,240 --> 00:08:20,920 Speaker 1: about and it's such a part of our daily lives 142 00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:23,400 Speaker 1: that I think, especially in America, I feel like we 143 00:08:23,480 --> 00:08:27,000 Speaker 1: don't really even consider. And so as I was researching 144 00:08:27,040 --> 00:08:29,200 Speaker 1: for this, it was so fascinating to me to just 145 00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:32,600 Speaker 1: look at some of the conversations you're just starting and 146 00:08:32,640 --> 00:08:36,880 Speaker 1: how how much that gets missed. And um, also, like 147 00:08:36,880 --> 00:08:38,560 Speaker 1: when your rep first reached out to me, we have 148 00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:40,840 Speaker 1: a topic every month, and this is obviously the month 149 00:08:40,880 --> 00:08:43,760 Speaker 1: of Thanksgiving, So gratitude is a big piece of that. 150 00:08:44,160 --> 00:08:47,760 Speaker 1: But I love the focus on like where our food 151 00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:50,959 Speaker 1: comes from, and like the way that our universe and 152 00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:53,720 Speaker 1: our world works, and how we just missed that too. 153 00:08:53,880 --> 00:08:56,560 Speaker 1: You know, you've mentioned like going to the store and 154 00:08:56,600 --> 00:08:59,079 Speaker 1: you just are not connected to the meat you're buying 155 00:08:59,120 --> 00:09:02,160 Speaker 1: in this plastic wrapper, wrapped in plastic. You don't even 156 00:09:02,200 --> 00:09:03,440 Speaker 1: know this because you don't think of this as an 157 00:09:03,480 --> 00:09:09,080 Speaker 1: animal at that point. Exactly. M yeah, exactly. So it's 158 00:09:09,120 --> 00:09:11,960 Speaker 1: how the listeners a little bit breakdown the way I 159 00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:14,520 Speaker 1: love hearing about how the shows started, but breakdown just 160 00:09:14,559 --> 00:09:17,200 Speaker 1: the premise and like what it is you're out there 161 00:09:17,320 --> 00:09:21,679 Speaker 1: looking for and now how that's turned into a book. So, uh, 162 00:09:21,720 --> 00:09:25,280 Speaker 1: I meet with a chef somewhere in the world, sometimes 163 00:09:25,360 --> 00:09:28,760 Speaker 1: very fancy restaurants, sometimes a home cook or a food truck. 164 00:09:29,080 --> 00:09:32,280 Speaker 1: They make me a meal. I sit down, we discuss 165 00:09:32,600 --> 00:09:35,240 Speaker 1: the ingredients that are in it. So we'll be like, Okay, 166 00:09:35,280 --> 00:09:37,280 Speaker 1: this is you know our quota very day. That's a 167 00:09:37,400 --> 00:09:39,480 Speaker 1: that's a pepper I need to get. This is corn, 168 00:09:39,559 --> 00:09:42,560 Speaker 1: this is rice, this is um, And then I have 169 00:09:42,760 --> 00:09:48,920 Speaker 1: weak to go out and harvest, hunt fish, forage every ingredient, 170 00:09:49,200 --> 00:09:51,720 Speaker 1: come back and try and recreate it with the help 171 00:09:51,760 --> 00:09:54,600 Speaker 1: of the chef. Um. So the first part is sort 172 00:09:54,640 --> 00:09:58,760 Speaker 1: of like Chef's Table, right, it's really interviewing the chef 173 00:09:58,920 --> 00:10:01,760 Speaker 1: and their meal that they produced. And then the next 174 00:10:02,320 --> 00:10:06,200 Speaker 1: fifty minutes is like the six months before the food 175 00:10:06,320 --> 00:10:10,960 Speaker 1: comes to the table in chef's table. Um And uh So, 176 00:10:12,559 --> 00:10:18,480 Speaker 1: I'm you you land, I don't like to know kind 177 00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:21,240 Speaker 1: of what we're gonna be harvesting. I want to learn 178 00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:24,280 Speaker 1: it at the table as I'm eating the food. And 179 00:10:24,320 --> 00:10:27,239 Speaker 1: then I'm off. I'm whether if it's in the Philippines, 180 00:10:27,280 --> 00:10:30,760 Speaker 1: I'm in rice patties, you know, worried about Cobra's and 181 00:10:30,920 --> 00:10:33,600 Speaker 1: uh and if it's in uh, if it's in Naples. 182 00:10:33,920 --> 00:10:35,880 Speaker 1: You know, we went to the best pizza place in 183 00:10:35,880 --> 00:10:40,440 Speaker 1: the world, and I then went and milked water buffalo 184 00:10:40,520 --> 00:10:44,600 Speaker 1: to make mazzarella. I harvested wheat and ground it like 185 00:10:44,800 --> 00:10:46,880 Speaker 1: this little town does. They've have been doing it the 186 00:10:46,880 --> 00:10:49,600 Speaker 1: same way for five years. So like an old simple 187 00:10:49,960 --> 00:10:53,920 Speaker 1: and an old stone mill. Um, I went and got anchovies, 188 00:10:54,440 --> 00:10:57,920 Speaker 1: picked tomatoes and then ended up back at the pizza 189 00:10:57,960 --> 00:11:01,720 Speaker 1: place after a week and made you know, what was 190 00:11:01,760 --> 00:11:07,920 Speaker 1: not a great pizza for me. I met the ship 191 00:11:08,120 --> 00:11:12,720 Speaker 1: made it amazing pizzas to me, and mine was like 192 00:11:12,760 --> 00:11:15,160 Speaker 1: I did the old you know, we take the pizza 193 00:11:15,200 --> 00:11:17,800 Speaker 1: and you slide it into pizza of him, and I 194 00:11:17,880 --> 00:11:20,680 Speaker 1: pulled it so the hole opened up, so then I 195 00:11:20,720 --> 00:11:23,800 Speaker 1: had to push it together, and he was like in Italian, 196 00:11:23,840 --> 00:11:25,440 Speaker 1: he was yelling me, start over, start over, and I 197 00:11:25,440 --> 00:11:26,920 Speaker 1: was like, no, no, this is my this is my 198 00:11:27,000 --> 00:11:32,200 Speaker 1: pie um. But while his was definitely, you know, a 199 00:11:32,280 --> 00:11:39,960 Speaker 1: great pie um, mine tasted unbelievable because I had I 200 00:11:40,080 --> 00:11:42,760 Speaker 1: knew where everything had come from, and I had been 201 00:11:42,760 --> 00:11:45,920 Speaker 1: waiting for this meal for a week. Like the minute 202 00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:49,600 Speaker 1: I was harvesting wheat and grinding it, I was like, oh, 203 00:11:49,679 --> 00:11:53,240 Speaker 1: this is gonna be good, right, this pie amazing. And 204 00:11:53,440 --> 00:11:56,640 Speaker 1: one of the other things I learned was, you know, 205 00:11:56,760 --> 00:12:00,160 Speaker 1: it takes sixty people to make a pizza slice. So 206 00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:03,080 Speaker 1: Americans we walk around thinking, oh, I'm on an island. 207 00:12:03,120 --> 00:12:06,120 Speaker 1: I did this by myself. But if you're eating food, 208 00:12:06,440 --> 00:12:11,080 Speaker 1: then no, you are connected to everybody. And one of 209 00:12:11,080 --> 00:12:14,360 Speaker 1: the things that that food production always brings you back 210 00:12:14,360 --> 00:12:19,880 Speaker 1: to is the community um and and it's good. It's 211 00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:22,200 Speaker 1: good that way. The closer you are you know, the 212 00:12:22,280 --> 00:12:26,000 Speaker 1: further you are from unconscious consumption, right where you're just 213 00:12:26,520 --> 00:12:28,959 Speaker 1: putting things in your body and not really thinking about it. 214 00:12:29,960 --> 00:12:32,280 Speaker 1: When you start to realize, when you start to learn 215 00:12:32,320 --> 00:12:35,560 Speaker 1: about the people who are who are feeding you, you 216 00:12:35,679 --> 00:12:38,840 Speaker 1: care more about them. You care more about the people 217 00:12:38,840 --> 00:12:43,360 Speaker 1: around you. It binds the community together. UM. And you 218 00:12:43,440 --> 00:12:47,800 Speaker 1: also start to think about the larger environment because you 219 00:12:47,960 --> 00:12:53,600 Speaker 1: constantly when you're out there fishing. You know, particularly, you 220 00:12:53,640 --> 00:12:58,000 Speaker 1: are running up against um over fishing, You're running up 221 00:12:58,000 --> 00:13:01,199 Speaker 1: against global climate change, You're running up against you know. 222 00:13:01,240 --> 00:13:05,240 Speaker 1: We were in South Africa harvesting sorghum and the farmer 223 00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:08,400 Speaker 1: had been through seven years of drought followed by seven 224 00:13:08,480 --> 00:13:11,640 Speaker 1: years of flooding and he was all the farms around 225 00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:14,280 Speaker 1: and were collapsing and falling apart, and he was struggling 226 00:13:14,960 --> 00:13:17,120 Speaker 1: to survive. And we well, I was like, oh my goodness, 227 00:13:17,120 --> 00:13:21,600 Speaker 1: what happens when the bread basket of South Africa collapses 228 00:13:21,800 --> 00:13:26,760 Speaker 1: because they can't you know, there's no water left. Um, 229 00:13:26,800 --> 00:13:31,760 Speaker 1: so food production you really looking are looking at uh 230 00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:35,760 Speaker 1: if you pull the thread, um, you know, the end 231 00:13:35,760 --> 00:13:40,360 Speaker 1: of humanity. It's it gets kind of scary sometimes and 232 00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:42,240 Speaker 1: then and at the same time, you're looking at people 233 00:13:42,240 --> 00:13:45,440 Speaker 1: who are doing things correctly. So like you go to Finland, 234 00:13:45,480 --> 00:13:47,920 Speaker 1: you go to Costa Rica, you go to Iceland, and 235 00:13:47,960 --> 00:13:51,880 Speaker 1: you're like, Okay, if we can be humble enough to 236 00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:55,240 Speaker 1: learn from what they're doing, then we have a chance. 237 00:13:56,679 --> 00:14:00,120 Speaker 1: And yeah, because Finland, uh for Iceland, had complete the 238 00:14:00,600 --> 00:14:03,880 Speaker 1: um collapse their fish stocks first haddock, then they were 239 00:14:03,880 --> 00:14:06,040 Speaker 1: trying to wipe out all their cod next and but 240 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:08,280 Speaker 1: they figured it. They were like, oh my goodness, we're 241 00:14:08,280 --> 00:14:11,240 Speaker 1: not gonna have any fish. So they then put they 242 00:14:11,280 --> 00:14:16,080 Speaker 1: instituted hermits for every man, woman, child, and company on 243 00:14:16,120 --> 00:14:20,720 Speaker 1: the island, and now the stocks are back. Um. It 244 00:14:20,800 --> 00:14:26,480 Speaker 1: wasn't a perfect solution because they actually they turned the 245 00:14:26,520 --> 00:14:29,320 Speaker 1: fish stock. They turned these fish permits into more like 246 00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:32,000 Speaker 1: stocks so you could buy and sell them, you get 247 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:34,440 Speaker 1: mortgages on your house with them, whatever, and they started 248 00:14:34,440 --> 00:14:39,440 Speaker 1: to collect in like now basically eight families own all 249 00:14:39,560 --> 00:14:43,680 Speaker 1: the fish stocks in all of Iceland, and and it's 250 00:14:43,720 --> 00:14:47,520 Speaker 1: destroyed sort of the fishing villages because there's no local 251 00:14:47,560 --> 00:14:51,440 Speaker 1: fishing anymore because it's just these major families. And about 252 00:14:52,360 --> 00:14:55,920 Speaker 1: I think eight years ago. Whenever that last economic collapses, 253 00:14:56,120 --> 00:14:59,120 Speaker 1: it always feels like we're constantly in an economic right now. 254 00:15:00,600 --> 00:15:05,440 Speaker 1: But whenever that last one was, Iceland realized, you know, 255 00:15:05,480 --> 00:15:07,960 Speaker 1: their banking industry and falling apart, and they needed to 256 00:15:07,960 --> 00:15:11,800 Speaker 1: do a new um constitution because stuff was and they 257 00:15:11,840 --> 00:15:15,120 Speaker 1: decided that everyone voted the fish stocks were gonna be 258 00:15:15,200 --> 00:15:17,600 Speaker 1: turned We're gonna be nationalized again, We're gonna be taken 259 00:15:17,640 --> 00:15:22,400 Speaker 1: back from these families, and they voted the constitution into effect, 260 00:15:23,640 --> 00:15:27,000 Speaker 1: and yet it has been limbo for these eight years 261 00:15:27,120 --> 00:15:31,120 Speaker 1: as these families fight to maintain control of the fish stocks. 262 00:15:31,360 --> 00:15:35,640 Speaker 1: Now the ice Icelanders believe that the constitution will be 263 00:15:35,720 --> 00:15:37,640 Speaker 1: ratified and put into an effect. But it's kind of 264 00:15:37,680 --> 00:15:42,000 Speaker 1: wild how you're seeing, you know, the economics behind this 265 00:15:42,080 --> 00:15:45,560 Speaker 1: as well. Yeah, I love the idea. I mean, there's 266 00:15:45,600 --> 00:15:47,000 Speaker 1: so many things I want to touch on that you 267 00:15:47,080 --> 00:15:48,920 Speaker 1: just mentioned, But the first thing that popped in my 268 00:15:48,960 --> 00:15:52,120 Speaker 1: head to just that last statement was what you're learning 269 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:55,760 Speaker 1: by witnessing what Iceland did and like the pluses and 270 00:15:55,800 --> 00:15:58,520 Speaker 1: the minuses, you know, And I think in your experience 271 00:15:58,560 --> 00:16:01,400 Speaker 1: of traveling the world and just some of the conversations 272 00:16:01,440 --> 00:16:05,400 Speaker 1: I've heard you have, um, you're you're seeing that everywhere, 273 00:16:05,440 --> 00:16:08,320 Speaker 1: like some places are really nailing it, and they're doing 274 00:16:08,360 --> 00:16:10,200 Speaker 1: things that are going to be beneficial in the long 275 00:16:10,280 --> 00:16:14,320 Speaker 1: run and continue to have good production and things like 276 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:18,040 Speaker 1: that and not over consumption. Um. But it really brings 277 00:16:18,120 --> 00:16:21,320 Speaker 1: up something that I think is really hitting ahead just 278 00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:24,280 Speaker 1: culturally in general, which is that we do all really 279 00:16:24,320 --> 00:16:27,080 Speaker 1: need each other and we can all kind of like 280 00:16:27,400 --> 00:16:31,160 Speaker 1: the connecting piece even through our food. It's just wild 281 00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:33,560 Speaker 1: that we try to act like we're just these individuals 282 00:16:33,600 --> 00:16:37,560 Speaker 1: walking around and this separateness, you know, and in reality, 283 00:16:37,640 --> 00:16:40,400 Speaker 1: we can all learn so much from each other all 284 00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:45,240 Speaker 1: the time. Yeah, there's a there's a neat book called 285 00:16:45,520 --> 00:16:48,280 Speaker 1: shop Class as soul Craft and it was written by 286 00:16:48,280 --> 00:16:54,040 Speaker 1: a Yale philosophy professor who also is the local motorcycle 287 00:16:54,040 --> 00:16:59,200 Speaker 1: mechanic in New Haven, and he talks about how um 288 00:16:59,360 --> 00:17:03,080 Speaker 1: people who can do things with their hands are you know, 289 00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:08,600 Speaker 1: are sometimes looked down upon, and he reasons because they 290 00:17:08,600 --> 00:17:13,400 Speaker 1: are so important to us. The plumber, the air conditioning 291 00:17:13,400 --> 00:17:17,080 Speaker 1: repair person, the farmer. You know, they are so important 292 00:17:17,119 --> 00:17:21,760 Speaker 1: to us that we cannot stand that dependency and so 293 00:17:21,840 --> 00:17:25,040 Speaker 1: instead we have to look down on them because we 294 00:17:25,119 --> 00:17:28,359 Speaker 1: need so much. We can't fix our sink, we can't 295 00:17:28,359 --> 00:17:31,080 Speaker 1: fix our refrigerator, and thus we have to make fun 296 00:17:31,119 --> 00:17:34,439 Speaker 1: of the person who can, right. And it leads to 297 00:17:34,800 --> 00:17:37,399 Speaker 1: this other thing where um and we talked about in 298 00:17:37,400 --> 00:17:43,320 Speaker 1: the book that working with your hands um is is 299 00:17:43,359 --> 00:17:49,080 Speaker 1: a is a human need and it stops depression. That 300 00:17:49,119 --> 00:17:53,720 Speaker 1: there's been all these studies that making food from scratch 301 00:17:54,320 --> 00:17:56,800 Speaker 1: that we've been doing for hundreds of thousands of years 302 00:17:58,000 --> 00:18:00,480 Speaker 1: is part of us so much so when you take 303 00:18:00,520 --> 00:18:05,800 Speaker 1: it away, depression rates will go crazy. And if if 304 00:18:05,880 --> 00:18:10,040 Speaker 1: we allow ourselves to get dirty again, you know, I 305 00:18:10,080 --> 00:18:12,760 Speaker 1: think a lot of our lives are spent. You know 306 00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:14,800 Speaker 1: a lot of effort is put in by humanity to 307 00:18:14,800 --> 00:18:18,560 Speaker 1: make things easier for ourselves. Drive around in a car, 308 00:18:19,080 --> 00:18:21,880 Speaker 1: it's kind of like that the movie Wally, where everyone's 309 00:18:21,920 --> 00:18:24,720 Speaker 1: like floating on those you know, getting fat and just 310 00:18:24,960 --> 00:18:28,040 Speaker 1: with a straw in their mouth. And and it's actually 311 00:18:28,560 --> 00:18:32,119 Speaker 1: that's hurting us. And if we get back into the 312 00:18:32,160 --> 00:18:38,040 Speaker 1: dirt and grow our food or confront where our food 313 00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:41,560 Speaker 1: comes from, whether that is hunting or were raising an 314 00:18:41,600 --> 00:18:46,640 Speaker 1: animal and butchering it, um that that's important for us. 315 00:18:47,040 --> 00:18:50,040 Speaker 1: That give us sort of a solidity um that we 316 00:18:50,560 --> 00:18:52,439 Speaker 1: you know, we wander around in this modern world not 317 00:18:52,520 --> 00:19:00,280 Speaker 1: really understanding what we're doing some kind of I that's 318 00:19:00,320 --> 00:19:02,360 Speaker 1: so interesting. I didn't know that that was an actual 319 00:19:02,440 --> 00:19:05,239 Speaker 1: proven fact because I've always said when I'm cooking, like 320 00:19:05,280 --> 00:19:07,560 Speaker 1: the chopping part, like people always be like, oh, do 321 00:19:07,600 --> 00:19:09,040 Speaker 1: you need help with that? And I'm like, no, this 322 00:19:09,119 --> 00:19:12,040 Speaker 1: is my therapy. I love that, you know, Yeah, it's 323 00:19:12,160 --> 00:19:16,040 Speaker 1: very meditative. Um did you find when you were on 324 00:19:16,080 --> 00:19:19,160 Speaker 1: these journeys with these chefs, like you know how people 325 00:19:19,200 --> 00:19:22,000 Speaker 1: make the joke about um, well this is made with 326 00:19:22,119 --> 00:19:24,760 Speaker 1: love and there's like an ingredient of that. But I 327 00:19:24,840 --> 00:19:26,600 Speaker 1: do a lot of energy work, and I really have 328 00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:32,360 Speaker 1: found that people, especially chefs um that make things they 329 00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:34,760 Speaker 1: source that they do all the things, they make things 330 00:19:34,840 --> 00:19:39,360 Speaker 1: from their hearts. Apparently like we're digesting that energy. I mean, 331 00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:41,040 Speaker 1: I guess that can get a little woo woo if 332 00:19:41,080 --> 00:19:44,480 Speaker 1: people don't believe in that. But but anyway, like, did 333 00:19:44,520 --> 00:19:47,280 Speaker 1: you find that in your process that going through the 334 00:19:47,320 --> 00:19:51,399 Speaker 1: whole process from start to finish like really produced a 335 00:19:51,440 --> 00:19:53,560 Speaker 1: different kind of energy than if you would just go 336 00:19:53,720 --> 00:19:56,760 Speaker 1: buy the stuff at a store and throw it together. Yeah, 337 00:19:57,119 --> 00:19:59,920 Speaker 1: there's a there was a nice landing chef Gunner gissss 338 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:02,720 Speaker 1: and who's got the like the one Michelin Star and 339 00:20:02,880 --> 00:20:07,680 Speaker 1: you know, and he says, uh, he says nothing against um, 340 00:20:08,280 --> 00:20:10,400 Speaker 1: the guys who bring the boxes, but if I get 341 00:20:10,400 --> 00:20:14,879 Speaker 1: an ingredient, it's a much better story to tell because 342 00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:17,840 Speaker 1: he thinks of himself as an artist too. Um. But 343 00:20:17,920 --> 00:20:20,119 Speaker 1: to go back to what you're saying about, sort of 344 00:20:20,119 --> 00:20:23,040 Speaker 1: the energy that they're passing along, I feel it. I'm 345 00:20:23,040 --> 00:20:26,479 Speaker 1: not gonna get woo like you, but I think I 346 00:20:26,520 --> 00:20:29,320 Speaker 1: think that whenever we showed up someplace, like I went 347 00:20:29,359 --> 00:20:33,479 Speaker 1: to the Andes and we were harvesting keenwa with these 348 00:20:33,960 --> 00:20:36,080 Speaker 1: farmers at the top of the the mountains. I mean, 349 00:20:36,119 --> 00:20:39,400 Speaker 1: it was crazy. And we showed up and they had 350 00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:47,760 Speaker 1: basically harvested and slaughtered um. So guinea pigs are kind 351 00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:51,600 Speaker 1: of like the chickens in the Andes. Like, so they 352 00:20:51,600 --> 00:20:55,840 Speaker 1: had slaughtered all their guinea pigs and had harvested keenwau 353 00:20:56,000 --> 00:20:58,840 Speaker 1: to make a huge feast for us while we were 354 00:20:58,880 --> 00:21:01,119 Speaker 1: visiting them. And they didn't have much at all, Like 355 00:21:01,200 --> 00:21:05,680 Speaker 1: this was like a huge deal, and it was them 356 00:21:05,680 --> 00:21:10,840 Speaker 1: putting their love and and pride onto the plate to 357 00:21:10,960 --> 00:21:13,480 Speaker 1: show us right. And you could feel that, you could 358 00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:18,320 Speaker 1: feel that meal right, like everybody. We were so you know, 359 00:21:18,320 --> 00:21:20,280 Speaker 1: we gave hugs to everybody at the end. I mean, 360 00:21:21,240 --> 00:21:23,760 Speaker 1: and I think that that's something that happens a lot, right. 361 00:21:23,840 --> 00:21:28,080 Speaker 1: Food just used to show love, to give up. My 362 00:21:28,119 --> 00:21:32,679 Speaker 1: mom still cooks way too much food to show how 363 00:21:32,760 --> 00:21:35,159 Speaker 1: much she loves me. And I know she loves me, like, 364 00:21:37,119 --> 00:21:42,000 Speaker 1: please stop, no more rights at me. But but that's yeah, 365 00:21:42,080 --> 00:21:44,399 Speaker 1: I mean, and people say that, people say, you know, 366 00:21:44,480 --> 00:21:49,680 Speaker 1: food is love, it's how people show it. Yeah, And 367 00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:53,760 Speaker 1: and there is an energy that's transferred when someone makes 368 00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:56,919 Speaker 1: you a great meal or puts the time and effort 369 00:21:56,960 --> 00:21:59,840 Speaker 1: in to feed you, you know, the most important of us. 370 00:22:00,000 --> 00:22:06,360 Speaker 1: And it's and yeah, we saw it everywhere. Yeah, I'm 371 00:22:06,359 --> 00:22:08,119 Speaker 1: trying to think there. We had a we had a 372 00:22:08,200 --> 00:22:13,680 Speaker 1: very grumpy chef in um in Finland grumpy. See maybe 373 00:22:13,680 --> 00:22:18,760 Speaker 1: you did that. No, So for the Finns, it's it's 374 00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:22,119 Speaker 1: it's pretty neat, like Finland is a wonderful, incredible country. 375 00:22:22,119 --> 00:22:25,560 Speaker 1: It's the most forested country in Europe. They really, you know, 376 00:22:25,680 --> 00:22:30,600 Speaker 1: environmentally are like everyone goes out into the woods, everyone mushrooms, 377 00:22:30,640 --> 00:22:34,320 Speaker 1: everyone fishes like a pretty neat existence. They actually have 378 00:22:34,359 --> 00:22:39,080 Speaker 1: a rule it's called the Everyman Law. And there's no 379 00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:44,679 Speaker 1: trespassing in Finland. If you have land, people are allowed 380 00:22:44,720 --> 00:22:48,960 Speaker 1: to use your land up until within side of your house. 381 00:22:49,000 --> 00:22:51,600 Speaker 1: They're not allowed to come on your front lawn, but 382 00:22:51,960 --> 00:22:54,200 Speaker 1: they can camp, they can fish, they can do whatever 383 00:22:54,200 --> 00:22:56,240 Speaker 1: you want on your land. And I sat there and 384 00:22:56,240 --> 00:23:00,240 Speaker 1: I was like, this is amazing. Like in America, Erica, 385 00:23:00,280 --> 00:23:03,439 Speaker 1: we're so far from that idea. Right, my god, you'd 386 00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:09,280 Speaker 1: get shot you. Um, that's how far we are. But 387 00:23:09,359 --> 00:23:12,560 Speaker 1: it's incredible that that they do it. But also what 388 00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:15,360 Speaker 1: I was saying about the grumpiness is that the Finns 389 00:23:16,040 --> 00:23:20,840 Speaker 1: uh particularly finished men um, they don't like small talk. 390 00:23:21,160 --> 00:23:24,439 Speaker 1: In general, I'm generalizing here, but they don't like small 391 00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:27,960 Speaker 1: talk and they like to leave space between when you 392 00:23:28,119 --> 00:23:31,680 Speaker 1: finished talking and when they start talking because they don't 393 00:23:31,680 --> 00:23:33,840 Speaker 1: want to over they don't want to cut you off, right, 394 00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:36,960 Speaker 1: So there's a lot of very awkward silences where you're 395 00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:41,600 Speaker 1: talking and then you wait and then he talks, and 396 00:23:41,640 --> 00:23:44,119 Speaker 1: as an American, I try to fill the silence. Yea. 397 00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:46,560 Speaker 1: So it was very like I was like, this guy 398 00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:51,080 Speaker 1: hates me, what is happening here? But really he's processing 399 00:23:51,080 --> 00:23:57,760 Speaker 1: what you said. He's being very respectful, very thoughtful. Yeah. Interesting. Um, well, 400 00:23:57,840 --> 00:24:00,399 Speaker 1: let's talk a little bit about because I'm know, like 401 00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:03,359 Speaker 1: in our culture, I just immediately think of fast food, 402 00:24:03,560 --> 00:24:05,800 Speaker 1: you know, I'm like McDonald's, and that's how so many 403 00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:09,000 Speaker 1: of us have survived. And um, I think it's like 404 00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:11,280 Speaker 1: what you said about, we're just moving so fast all 405 00:24:11,280 --> 00:24:13,080 Speaker 1: the time. And so when I hear you talking about 406 00:24:13,080 --> 00:24:16,479 Speaker 1: this whole process, you're talking about six weeks out and 407 00:24:16,680 --> 00:24:20,639 Speaker 1: like watching it from start to finish and growing whatever 408 00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:24,040 Speaker 1: it is or killing the animal, and that's a slow process. 409 00:24:24,240 --> 00:24:27,920 Speaker 1: And so what do you think, like you personally, would 410 00:24:27,920 --> 00:24:32,000 Speaker 1: you say, what's the detriment to our society with the 411 00:24:32,040 --> 00:24:39,080 Speaker 1: fast food culture? Wow? Well, I mean the big question. Look, 412 00:24:39,119 --> 00:24:43,480 Speaker 1: I think that there are multiple layers here, the harm 413 00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:50,480 Speaker 1: that we do ourselves healthwise by by over consuming um, 414 00:24:50,520 --> 00:24:53,160 Speaker 1: because we can have food whenever we want, and we're 415 00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:56,960 Speaker 1: also being told to eat in a way to keep 416 00:24:57,000 --> 00:24:59,639 Speaker 1: the economy like moving. I saw a commercial the other 417 00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:02,280 Speaker 1: day and they were like talking about second breakfast and 418 00:25:02,320 --> 00:25:06,000 Speaker 1: I was like, oh my gosh, how how how much 419 00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:07,720 Speaker 1: food do I need to eat in order to you you 420 00:25:08,359 --> 00:25:10,680 Speaker 1: need to like continue to move in the right and 421 00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:12,879 Speaker 1: and it's hurting us right so that's number one. I 422 00:25:12,920 --> 00:25:17,120 Speaker 1: think that all these diseases that we get now are 423 00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:22,760 Speaker 1: because we, you know, have over nutrition. Um and uh. 424 00:25:23,560 --> 00:25:25,600 Speaker 1: And then two, I think that you know, we we 425 00:25:25,680 --> 00:25:29,600 Speaker 1: really are harming the animals. Um. I think that we 426 00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:33,960 Speaker 1: are raising livestock in a horrific way. Um. One of 427 00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:37,040 Speaker 1: the things that throughout the journey, you know, I'm a 428 00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:41,080 Speaker 1: meat eater. The community that I my family eats me, 429 00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:45,320 Speaker 1: my wife's family eats me. Um. You know, I think 430 00:25:45,359 --> 00:25:48,760 Speaker 1: that vegans are extremely brave, and I have a lot 431 00:25:48,840 --> 00:25:51,320 Speaker 1: of respect for them, because you really are. When you 432 00:25:51,320 --> 00:25:54,280 Speaker 1: make that decision, you're taking yourself out of a community. 433 00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:56,640 Speaker 1: You're the person who's gonna be like mom and dad, sorry, 434 00:25:56,640 --> 00:25:58,920 Speaker 1: I'm not gonna eat that anymore. Or you have to 435 00:25:58,960 --> 00:26:00,800 Speaker 1: call up to the house at the parties at and 436 00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:03,160 Speaker 1: be like, listen, you gotta cook me a separate meal. 437 00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:07,359 Speaker 1: That's a big thing, you know. Um. So, but I 438 00:26:07,960 --> 00:26:10,480 Speaker 1: haven't gotten there yet. Where I've gotten is, you know, 439 00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:14,720 Speaker 1: I've come face to face with slaughtering animals. So that 440 00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:16,239 Speaker 1: was one of the things I wanted to do. If 441 00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:18,119 Speaker 1: I was going to eat meat, I would have to 442 00:26:19,400 --> 00:26:23,480 Speaker 1: kill the animals that I'm eating. Um. To see if 443 00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:27,200 Speaker 1: that was something that I still wanted to do. Um, 444 00:26:27,280 --> 00:26:32,880 Speaker 1: and it made me reduce my meat consumption considerably. Yeah, 445 00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:35,879 Speaker 1: we did. Like a thumbnail sketch of like if I 446 00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:38,840 Speaker 1: ate two meals a day of meat, which is not 447 00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:42,199 Speaker 1: a lot, considering that there's beef and products and a 448 00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:46,040 Speaker 1: lot of stuff, but that's basically like breakfast and dinner, right, 449 00:26:46,040 --> 00:26:48,600 Speaker 1: I have a macon in the morning and whatever that 450 00:26:48,680 --> 00:26:51,720 Speaker 1: I would have eaten thirty five thousand animals in my lifetime. 451 00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:55,040 Speaker 1: And that's insane. I've killed thirty five thousand animals without 452 00:26:55,119 --> 00:27:00,200 Speaker 1: thinking about it at all. Um. And so I now 453 00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:04,880 Speaker 1: have these rules where I want to buy meat that 454 00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:08,920 Speaker 1: has been raised too mainly um, so it didn't live 455 00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:12,720 Speaker 1: this horrible life in a box. And and then I 456 00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:16,480 Speaker 1: also want to buy meat from a place that treats 457 00:27:16,480 --> 00:27:20,520 Speaker 1: its workers fairly and pays them a living wage. And 458 00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:22,800 Speaker 1: so I eat a lot less meat because it hits 459 00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:27,440 Speaker 1: it hits my wallet right like now expensive, so it 460 00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:32,919 Speaker 1: gets moved to the appetizer or or it becomes you know, 461 00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:35,840 Speaker 1: a big deal, like I eat it once a week 462 00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:40,080 Speaker 1: or twice a week. Um, Like it's more celebratory and 463 00:27:40,119 --> 00:27:43,760 Speaker 1: like a conscious decision. Okay, Like my mom grew up 464 00:27:43,800 --> 00:27:47,080 Speaker 1: in Montana and and only a generation ago, that's how 465 00:27:47,119 --> 00:27:50,399 Speaker 1: meat was in her house. Right. They had chicken once 466 00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:54,320 Speaker 1: a week, they had beef once a month, and my 467 00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:56,160 Speaker 1: grandpa had to go out and get a deer if 468 00:27:56,200 --> 00:28:00,000 Speaker 1: they wanted more like um, and that was normal for them. 469 00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:02,600 Speaker 1: And here, you know, I can get whatever I want 470 00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:08,960 Speaker 1: any time. Um. So I think putting this boundary on yourself, um, 471 00:28:09,200 --> 00:28:14,320 Speaker 1: to to have conscious consumption. Think about what you're putting 472 00:28:14,320 --> 00:28:17,720 Speaker 1: in your body and how it's affecting your community, the 473 00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:22,760 Speaker 1: larger world. Um. And then so I think we need 474 00:28:22,800 --> 00:28:25,560 Speaker 1: to treat the animals better. And lastly, when you pay 475 00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:30,719 Speaker 1: good money for produce and meat um, as opposed to 476 00:28:32,040 --> 00:28:34,719 Speaker 1: pulling up to uh, you know a take out, you 477 00:28:34,720 --> 00:28:38,479 Speaker 1: know fast food, getting in a paper bag and just 478 00:28:38,520 --> 00:28:41,960 Speaker 1: eating it in a car. When you when you put 479 00:28:42,000 --> 00:28:45,200 Speaker 1: that effort in, you know that you are treating your 480 00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:51,800 Speaker 1: other humans well. Um. And I've seen your body to 481 00:28:53,440 --> 00:28:55,960 Speaker 1: health wise, yes, right, Like I can go on rants 482 00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:58,600 Speaker 1: about that's where the meat thing. Really I'm trying to 483 00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:02,480 Speaker 1: actually start adjusting to the mentality that you're talking about 484 00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:05,360 Speaker 1: the bigger picture, because for me, the focus has been 485 00:29:05,760 --> 00:29:08,040 Speaker 1: I don't want to eat meat that's been pumped full 486 00:29:08,120 --> 00:29:11,080 Speaker 1: of all these hormones and all these other things to 487 00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:14,160 Speaker 1: produce a lot of it like that, to me, I've 488 00:29:14,200 --> 00:29:17,280 Speaker 1: known about that part of it. But then looking at 489 00:29:17,400 --> 00:29:20,440 Speaker 1: the bigger scale and how that's affecting our world and 490 00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:23,040 Speaker 1: our environment and all of those things and the animals, 491 00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:26,080 Speaker 1: um is a whole another conversation of it. Like there's 492 00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:29,160 Speaker 1: the two sides of it, you know. Yeah, well, the 493 00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:34,800 Speaker 1: fact that you know, factory farms are poisoning the planet, 494 00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:38,640 Speaker 1: but it is so important right for people to have 495 00:29:38,760 --> 00:29:41,880 Speaker 1: meat or even big agg right, all of all of 496 00:29:41,920 --> 00:29:46,080 Speaker 1: those chemicals that are causing cancer and going you look 497 00:29:46,080 --> 00:29:49,400 Speaker 1: at how the Gulf of Mexico is becoming a dead 498 00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:54,720 Speaker 1: zone because everything coming down the Mississippi and River is 499 00:29:54,720 --> 00:29:58,280 Speaker 1: is polluting and killing all of that agriculture runoff is 500 00:29:58,400 --> 00:30:02,880 Speaker 1: killing our ocean. And yet the need to sell corn 501 00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:09,320 Speaker 1: or for us to consume meat is so huge that 502 00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:12,960 Speaker 1: we can't adjust, and we need to turn that ship 503 00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:17,640 Speaker 1: around or we're gonna have a choice. Yeah, we went 504 00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:21,200 Speaker 1: to the Philippines and I was out there making patisse, 505 00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:23,880 Speaker 1: which is like a fish sauce. It's a it's a 506 00:30:23,920 --> 00:30:27,320 Speaker 1: fundamental ingredient in Philippine cuisine, is kind of like it's 507 00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:30,720 Speaker 1: on everybody's table, like catch up, right, And we were 508 00:30:30,760 --> 00:30:35,240 Speaker 1: making this thing called kilo win, which is uh Philippine cevich. 509 00:30:35,720 --> 00:30:38,560 Speaker 1: And they used the sauce as a marinate. So I 510 00:30:38,600 --> 00:30:41,080 Speaker 1: needed to go out and get this round scab, which 511 00:30:41,120 --> 00:30:43,960 Speaker 1: is a you know here, it's a bait fish there. 512 00:30:44,120 --> 00:30:47,360 Speaker 1: They use it to make um to make the patiss 513 00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:50,800 Speaker 1: And we went out on a on a banca which 514 00:30:50,840 --> 00:30:56,640 Speaker 1: is like this really rickety ass boat. And so fisherman 515 00:30:56,960 --> 00:31:00,920 Speaker 1: it's the most dangerous profession in the world. Thousand fishermen 516 00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:06,120 Speaker 1: die every year and God and these boats in the 517 00:31:06,160 --> 00:31:09,640 Speaker 1: South China Sea, you know, when they were smaller, these 518 00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:12,080 Speaker 1: were the they look like those outriggers right there. They're 519 00:31:12,080 --> 00:31:14,240 Speaker 1: a thin canoe with these two arms that go down 520 00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:17,760 Speaker 1: on the bast and when they're smaller, that was the 521 00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:20,600 Speaker 1: Those were the boats that the Austronesians came down from 522 00:31:21,040 --> 00:31:25,120 Speaker 1: from Taiwan and like and and went all over Australia 523 00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:29,440 Speaker 1: and Indonesia. But but now they expanded them. They just 524 00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:31,960 Speaker 1: basically took that same design and blew it up. When 525 00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:35,320 Speaker 1: it's small, it's very secure and a safe boat when 526 00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:38,240 Speaker 1: it's big, and the fishing boat it's these things flip. 527 00:31:38,560 --> 00:31:42,520 Speaker 1: It's terrible. So We're out there in a storm on 528 00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:46,600 Speaker 1: this banka and I'm like, oh, we're gonna die and 529 00:31:46,840 --> 00:31:50,640 Speaker 1: we're not catching any fish. So I asked the fisherman. 530 00:31:50,640 --> 00:31:53,760 Speaker 1: I'm like, we were out all night and didn't catch anything. 531 00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:57,760 Speaker 1: And I'm like, is this normal. He's like, yeah, Um, 532 00:31:57,800 --> 00:32:00,840 Speaker 1: his father used to get, you know, one ton of fish. 533 00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:03,680 Speaker 1: His grandfather used to get ten tons of fish. And 534 00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:06,960 Speaker 1: now he has to go out further and stay out longer. 535 00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:12,440 Speaker 1: And you know, we we couldn't talk about it much 536 00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:15,640 Speaker 1: on the show because you know, cable TV is not 537 00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:20,960 Speaker 1: really But what we started researching for the book was 538 00:32:21,600 --> 00:32:24,640 Speaker 1: that the South China Sea has lost seventy of its 539 00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:27,880 Speaker 1: fish in the last twenty years, and they've lost their 540 00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:31,920 Speaker 1: fish in the last fifty years, and basically there's all 541 00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:36,120 Speaker 1: this territorial dispute going on. China is actually building islands 542 00:32:36,120 --> 00:32:38,760 Speaker 1: close to the Philippines so that they can call this 543 00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:45,120 Speaker 1: area Chinese territory right the ocean just for fish. That's 544 00:32:45,120 --> 00:32:47,840 Speaker 1: why they're doing it. They don't want ocean territory, they 545 00:32:47,840 --> 00:32:50,240 Speaker 1: want the fish. That's in that ocean, and meanwhile there's 546 00:32:50,280 --> 00:32:54,200 Speaker 1: eight countries that are all hammering that. See, the South 547 00:32:54,280 --> 00:32:56,240 Speaker 1: China Sea has one third of the fishing boats in 548 00:32:56,280 --> 00:33:02,960 Speaker 1: the world and they're gonna run out of fish, and nobody, 549 00:33:03,120 --> 00:33:06,280 Speaker 1: none of the countries are able to reach across the 550 00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:10,120 Speaker 1: territorial dispute and say, hey, we're all fighting over this 551 00:33:10,200 --> 00:33:14,600 Speaker 1: thing that's gonna disappear unless you're out how to stop it. 552 00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:17,840 Speaker 1: So whether this is your land, your ocean, or my ocean, 553 00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:20,920 Speaker 1: we need to figure this out. And they're not. So 554 00:33:21,240 --> 00:33:24,000 Speaker 1: people talk about, you know, World War three could be 555 00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:27,360 Speaker 1: Russia in the Ukraine, or Israel and Palestine or Indian Pakistan, 556 00:33:27,720 --> 00:33:30,719 Speaker 1: the South China Sea. The fight for fish there is 557 00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:33,880 Speaker 1: because there's there's not gonna be fish. And how many 558 00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:38,840 Speaker 1: billion people are are sitting right on that ocean without fish? Um? 559 00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:43,400 Speaker 1: So yeah, that was that was some wild stuff. When 560 00:33:43,440 --> 00:33:45,880 Speaker 1: you start to unpeel the onion and you're getting down 561 00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:50,120 Speaker 1: into it, like what is happening here? And there's a 562 00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:53,400 Speaker 1: positive thing that's going on there as well. So this 563 00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:56,320 Speaker 1: goes back to sort of our wallets being able to 564 00:33:56,640 --> 00:34:00,280 Speaker 1: make a change. So the Philippines, a lot of the 565 00:34:00,280 --> 00:34:02,040 Speaker 1: country we were in the Philippines, so I can talk 566 00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:05,080 Speaker 1: about that mostly, but the other countries they're are kind 567 00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:07,360 Speaker 1: of doing the same thing. The Philippines would like to 568 00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:12,440 Speaker 1: sell fish to the EU, and the EU the citizens 569 00:34:12,440 --> 00:34:15,680 Speaker 1: there just passed a law that they will only import 570 00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:21,680 Speaker 1: sustainably caught fish. So now the Philippines has to look into, Okay, 571 00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:24,759 Speaker 1: how do we sell sustainable fish. So they started developing 572 00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:27,960 Speaker 1: these marine protected areas, which are areas in the ocean 573 00:34:28,000 --> 00:34:30,080 Speaker 1: that you are not allowed to fish, and the fish 574 00:34:30,080 --> 00:34:33,920 Speaker 1: stocks repair there and then they kind of overflow the 575 00:34:33,920 --> 00:34:35,920 Speaker 1: the m p A and then you can fish around 576 00:34:36,000 --> 00:34:38,520 Speaker 1: the m p A and it's a really really great 577 00:34:38,560 --> 00:34:43,080 Speaker 1: way to maintain fish in the ocean. Um. So the 578 00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:48,160 Speaker 1: Philippines has now one of their territory is now m 579 00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:52,440 Speaker 1: p A, which is a great move. The thing is 580 00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:55,880 Speaker 1: they got to get tot for it to be viable. Um. 581 00:34:55,920 --> 00:34:58,840 Speaker 1: But look, this is something that the people in the 582 00:34:58,880 --> 00:35:02,439 Speaker 1: European Union have a affecting fish in the South China Sea, 583 00:35:02,719 --> 00:35:05,719 Speaker 1: and Americans can do the same thing. Um if we 584 00:35:05,719 --> 00:35:09,520 Speaker 1: start looking at you know, where we're getting our fish from. Um. 585 00:35:09,719 --> 00:35:17,840 Speaker 1: And uh, I was just gonna no, I get I 586 00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:19,600 Speaker 1: got to totally get it because I do the same thing. 587 00:35:19,840 --> 00:35:23,279 Speaker 1: I was just thinking as you were talking, just like 588 00:35:23,960 --> 00:35:27,560 Speaker 1: the food industry in general, it's just so indicative of 589 00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:31,520 Speaker 1: all these bigger problems that we have are like just 590 00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:36,000 Speaker 1: the climate of everything right now? Are you seeing like 591 00:35:36,040 --> 00:35:38,920 Speaker 1: when you're traveling to these places you're going and you're like, 592 00:35:39,000 --> 00:35:40,960 Speaker 1: let me figure out how to source and make food. 593 00:35:41,200 --> 00:35:44,480 Speaker 1: But like you're you just explained this bigger picture story 594 00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:47,520 Speaker 1: that's like this could be a war. I mean, is 595 00:35:47,600 --> 00:35:50,480 Speaker 1: that like is that consistent just around the world and 596 00:35:50,520 --> 00:35:57,520 Speaker 1: your experience? Yeah, food consulting, you know, food is we 597 00:35:57,600 --> 00:36:00,840 Speaker 1: want land for materials, right, Humanity want to land for 598 00:36:00,920 --> 00:36:05,560 Speaker 1: materials and mostly for food. And so when you're bumping 599 00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:09,880 Speaker 1: up against um, you're getting into the heart of the matter. 600 00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:14,000 Speaker 1: We were in Malta, and Malta doesn't have any water. 601 00:36:15,160 --> 00:36:17,640 Speaker 1: It's never really had a long time ago it had 602 00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:20,120 Speaker 1: rivers and streams, but it doesn't have any rivers and 603 00:36:20,160 --> 00:36:23,000 Speaker 1: streams or lakes now, and it's got a water table 604 00:36:23,080 --> 00:36:29,239 Speaker 1: underneath the ground. And UM, so they they they're having 605 00:36:29,239 --> 00:36:33,520 Speaker 1: a population explosion there and so they built a desalination 606 00:36:33,560 --> 00:36:38,600 Speaker 1: plant in the eighties and that's allowed them to you know, uh, 607 00:36:38,640 --> 00:36:43,920 Speaker 1: they're now the second most dense area in Europe. Um. 608 00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:50,000 Speaker 1: But Malta has this history. Every thousand years, people people 609 00:36:50,040 --> 00:36:52,880 Speaker 1: go to Malta, they build up, they build up, they 610 00:36:52,880 --> 00:36:57,120 Speaker 1: build up, and then they overshoot like Icarus in the sun. 611 00:36:57,440 --> 00:37:01,200 Speaker 1: And then Malta disappeared like basically become I'm inhabited, and 612 00:37:01,200 --> 00:37:03,799 Speaker 1: then about three hundred more years passed and a new 613 00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:06,800 Speaker 1: group arrives and they build and build and build and build, 614 00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:11,239 Speaker 1: and you know, is can humanity get out of its 615 00:37:11,280 --> 00:37:14,720 Speaker 1: own way? Right? We've seen this over thousands of years 616 00:37:14,920 --> 00:37:19,040 Speaker 1: and here we are right at that next precipice and 617 00:37:19,320 --> 00:37:26,120 Speaker 1: Malta overcome. It's history, right, Yeah, you run all kinds 618 00:37:26,120 --> 00:37:28,480 Speaker 1: of things every place we go, right, every place we go. 619 00:37:28,680 --> 00:37:33,240 Speaker 1: You know, we're in the Mediterranean, we're going fishing. They've 620 00:37:33,239 --> 00:37:36,840 Speaker 1: lost a lot of their shellfish. The Mediterranean isn't a 621 00:37:36,880 --> 00:37:40,960 Speaker 1: really fertile sea in general. It doesn't have major rivers 622 00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:44,000 Speaker 1: that flow into it. It's also been hammered by about 623 00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:47,439 Speaker 1: twenty eight countries for ten thousand years, and so it's 624 00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:52,840 Speaker 1: kind of empty. And you know, anytime one country makes 625 00:37:53,040 --> 00:37:56,440 Speaker 1: a positive change, like Italy realized over over fishing, so 626 00:37:56,480 --> 00:37:59,480 Speaker 1: they did some rules and then Croatia, which is right there, 627 00:37:59,600 --> 00:38:02,239 Speaker 1: was like Italy is not fishing anymore, we can fish. 628 00:38:02,600 --> 00:38:04,640 Speaker 1: So then they came in and hit it hard. So 629 00:38:05,239 --> 00:38:09,760 Speaker 1: the sort of the tragedy of the commons um is uh. 630 00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:11,960 Speaker 1: But also I want to go back and say, there 631 00:38:11,960 --> 00:38:14,879 Speaker 1: are places that are doing wonderful things and if we can, 632 00:38:15,080 --> 00:38:17,840 Speaker 1: if we can be humble enough to listen and learn. 633 00:38:18,400 --> 00:38:22,840 Speaker 1: You know, Costa Rica isn't amazing. We we harvested there. Um. 634 00:38:22,960 --> 00:38:26,120 Speaker 1: They like much of the world, we're cutting down a 635 00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:29,319 Speaker 1: lot of their rainforests. And then they stopped and they said, 636 00:38:29,320 --> 00:38:32,680 Speaker 1: wait a minute, what makes Costa Rica amazing? You know, 637 00:38:32,760 --> 00:38:37,759 Speaker 1: our bio diversity, our rainforests. Let's fix this. Um. And 638 00:38:37,840 --> 00:38:45,799 Speaker 1: so they've really turned it around. Um. Like I said, Iceland, Finland, Um, 639 00:38:45,840 --> 00:38:49,040 Speaker 1: there are there are a lot of people everywhere who 640 00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:51,400 Speaker 1: are who who are doing good things whether or not 641 00:38:51,680 --> 00:38:55,080 Speaker 1: you know, Uh, they've been able to turn the tide. 642 00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:58,560 Speaker 1: You know. Um. We were in South Africa and we 643 00:38:58,600 --> 00:39:00,960 Speaker 1: worked a lot of community groups, you know, in a 644 00:39:01,000 --> 00:39:04,279 Speaker 1: country that's having a lot of trouble, um, and we 645 00:39:04,360 --> 00:39:08,000 Speaker 1: really found that these local people on the ground are 646 00:39:08,040 --> 00:39:12,920 Speaker 1: going to be the sort of if if South Africa 647 00:39:13,000 --> 00:39:16,240 Speaker 1: is gonna make it, it's gonna be these collective groups 648 00:39:16,440 --> 00:39:19,719 Speaker 1: that are going to hold it together. Um, whether it's 649 00:39:19,719 --> 00:39:25,640 Speaker 1: community gardens or local dairies that um, you know all 650 00:39:25,680 --> 00:39:29,239 Speaker 1: of the people who work at their farm are handicapped. 651 00:39:30,719 --> 00:39:34,360 Speaker 1: We we found these two really cool companies this Orange 652 00:39:34,600 --> 00:39:38,319 Speaker 1: um good Hope is the name of it. Orange Company 653 00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:41,600 Speaker 1: and another one Carmen Tee. And they give a percentage 654 00:39:42,120 --> 00:39:48,040 Speaker 1: of ownership to their workers. Um and uh, it's not 655 00:39:48,120 --> 00:39:50,520 Speaker 1: mandated by the by the government. They just do it 656 00:39:50,560 --> 00:39:55,000 Speaker 1: because they feel like it helps the community and you know, 657 00:39:55,239 --> 00:39:59,640 Speaker 1: want to support the company more so little things. Yeah, 658 00:39:59,680 --> 00:40:01,799 Speaker 1: I was a to say, what would be I love 659 00:40:01,880 --> 00:40:05,920 Speaker 1: to give the listeners, like a tangible and so as individuals, 660 00:40:06,400 --> 00:40:10,920 Speaker 1: especially living in a country like ours, where like I 661 00:40:10,920 --> 00:40:12,840 Speaker 1: would I don't have a garden, you know, like do 662 00:40:12,920 --> 00:40:14,840 Speaker 1: I need to have a garden? Like what I'm starting 663 00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:17,520 Speaker 1: to think, like what can I do? What's a tangible 664 00:40:17,560 --> 00:40:21,480 Speaker 1: takeaway for each of us individually that we could just 665 00:40:21,719 --> 00:40:23,960 Speaker 1: one small thing even you know that we could start 666 00:40:23,960 --> 00:40:30,879 Speaker 1: participating in. Okay, Well, there's so many things. I mean, 667 00:40:30,920 --> 00:40:34,120 Speaker 1: first of all for you personally, Yeah, I don't go 668 00:40:34,160 --> 00:40:38,399 Speaker 1: Apple picking, Go out and harvest pumpkins, go fishing, get 669 00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:45,920 Speaker 1: out there, esky, go camping. Are about this lamping? Does 670 00:40:45,960 --> 00:40:52,799 Speaker 1: that count? Yeah? You and my wife have had. Yeah, 671 00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:54,640 Speaker 1: you're gonna have to You're gonna have to leave behind 672 00:40:54,640 --> 00:41:00,120 Speaker 1: the hair dryer and the Okay, don't just personally for 673 00:41:00,160 --> 00:41:05,000 Speaker 1: your own sanity, go do it and and put yourself 674 00:41:05,040 --> 00:41:09,480 Speaker 1: out there, you know, on that edge of of being uncomfortable, right, 675 00:41:10,280 --> 00:41:12,680 Speaker 1: because that being uncomfortable is actually what is going to 676 00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:19,120 Speaker 1: make you stronger. Yeah, So that's one too. There every 677 00:41:19,200 --> 00:41:22,719 Speaker 1: every uh, there are all these community farms that you 678 00:41:22,719 --> 00:41:24,480 Speaker 1: can a lot of them if you just go on 679 00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:26,719 Speaker 1: and google in your area, they will drop off a 680 00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:31,440 Speaker 1: box in front of your house. Yeah, and you can 681 00:41:31,480 --> 00:41:35,359 Speaker 1: actually go visit those farms as well. Uh. And and 682 00:41:35,760 --> 00:41:40,319 Speaker 1: that's a good way to support local agriculture. And you know, 683 00:41:41,600 --> 00:41:44,239 Speaker 1: make sure that the farm that you're gonna work with, 684 00:41:44,760 --> 00:41:48,800 Speaker 1: you know, treats their workers right, treats their animals right. Um. 685 00:41:48,840 --> 00:41:50,799 Speaker 1: And that's the way that you're going to take out 686 00:41:50,800 --> 00:41:53,839 Speaker 1: the middle men between your money and and it's going 687 00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:57,360 Speaker 1: to the right the right people. Um. And your food 688 00:41:57,400 --> 00:42:00,480 Speaker 1: may look uglier, it may come with dirt, it and 689 00:42:00,560 --> 00:42:04,680 Speaker 1: it may you know, it's not shiny and plastic bags. 690 00:42:04,680 --> 00:42:07,000 Speaker 1: It's in a box dropped off on your front door. 691 00:42:07,120 --> 00:42:09,120 Speaker 1: But I think there's something cool in that. Like I 692 00:42:09,120 --> 00:42:13,440 Speaker 1: think that you're bigot. Then, um, it's gonna give you. 693 00:42:14,480 --> 00:42:17,800 Speaker 1: It's gonna give you something back. Um. And then in 694 00:42:18,320 --> 00:42:21,279 Speaker 1: the larger sense, you know, um, there are a lot 695 00:42:21,360 --> 00:42:26,440 Speaker 1: of organizations out there fighting the good fight or healthier 696 00:42:26,480 --> 00:42:34,040 Speaker 1: food um for farm workers. UM, and support them. UM. 697 00:42:34,080 --> 00:42:40,520 Speaker 1: You know, donate money, Uh, go to the voting booth. Um. 698 00:42:40,560 --> 00:42:44,399 Speaker 1: We are Well, there's two things. You know, we're we're 699 00:42:44,440 --> 00:42:46,400 Speaker 1: getting close to the time where it's going to be 700 00:42:46,440 --> 00:42:52,000 Speaker 1: too late. It's important. That's one. And two, there are 701 00:42:52,080 --> 00:42:56,080 Speaker 1: lots of people doing lots of great things. I mean, 702 00:42:56,120 --> 00:42:59,040 Speaker 1: one of the reasons why on my show, I'm not 703 00:42:59,120 --> 00:43:01,960 Speaker 1: the expert. I go out to talk with experts who 704 00:43:01,960 --> 00:43:05,759 Speaker 1: know what they're talking about, because in this world there's 705 00:43:05,760 --> 00:43:07,480 Speaker 1: a lot of people who think that they're experts, particularly 706 00:43:07,520 --> 00:43:09,560 Speaker 1: on the Internet. And then when you go out and 707 00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:11,719 Speaker 1: you really meet people who know what they're doing, it's 708 00:43:11,800 --> 00:43:14,840 Speaker 1: so mind blowing and humbling, and you're just like, holy smoked, 709 00:43:15,080 --> 00:43:18,120 Speaker 1: I wish I could do what you do. UM. And 710 00:43:18,200 --> 00:43:23,239 Speaker 1: so it's kind of like, Uh, I like what Guy 711 00:43:23,280 --> 00:43:25,960 Speaker 1: Fieri does where he goes and he meets with people 712 00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:30,600 Speaker 1: doing great things locally, and I'm I feel like I'm 713 00:43:30,600 --> 00:43:32,440 Speaker 1: doing that. I hope to do that. I hope to 714 00:43:32,480 --> 00:43:34,600 Speaker 1: do it as well as he does, where I'm going 715 00:43:34,600 --> 00:43:39,120 Speaker 1: to food producers and showing, you know, what expertise looks like, 716 00:43:39,160 --> 00:43:45,680 Speaker 1: what hard work looks like. Um and uh yeah, I 717 00:43:45,760 --> 00:43:48,520 Speaker 1: was gonna say I think that that is my biggest 718 00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:50,719 Speaker 1: takeaway from one of the things you just said was 719 00:43:50,920 --> 00:43:54,080 Speaker 1: pay attention, because I think it is getting late, like 720 00:43:54,120 --> 00:43:56,880 Speaker 1: we're really starting to see something and you know, a 721 00:43:56,920 --> 00:43:58,359 Speaker 1: lot of us want to live in this place where 722 00:43:58,360 --> 00:43:59,840 Speaker 1: we're like, don't look at that, like it's not how 723 00:44:00,000 --> 00:44:01,440 Speaker 1: and I'm not going to pay attention, but like the 724 00:44:01,480 --> 00:44:03,719 Speaker 1: denial is not getting us anywhere if we not learned 725 00:44:03,719 --> 00:44:06,560 Speaker 1: anything in the last couple of years. So I think 726 00:44:06,600 --> 00:44:08,759 Speaker 1: it's just pay attention. And all of those are really 727 00:44:08,760 --> 00:44:10,720 Speaker 1: good tangibles. I'll put all of that in the description 728 00:44:10,760 --> 00:44:13,560 Speaker 1: of this podcast too. We've mentioned the show a lot, 729 00:44:13,600 --> 00:44:15,080 Speaker 1: but I want to talk a little bit about the 730 00:44:15,120 --> 00:44:18,799 Speaker 1: book because you did this show and then now you 731 00:44:18,840 --> 00:44:20,719 Speaker 1: have this book that you wrote with your Dad, Can 732 00:44:20,760 --> 00:44:22,680 Speaker 1: you tell us a little bit about the difference between 733 00:44:22,719 --> 00:44:24,799 Speaker 1: the show and the book. Well, most of what I've 734 00:44:24,800 --> 00:44:27,799 Speaker 1: been actually talking about here is from the book. So 735 00:44:27,960 --> 00:44:32,600 Speaker 1: it's very adventurous, Like it's fun. It's like trying to 736 00:44:32,600 --> 00:44:35,799 Speaker 1: get honey and I get stung. I'm trying to get 737 00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:39,160 Speaker 1: an octopus almost drowned Sardinia, like and and so. But 738 00:44:39,160 --> 00:44:41,719 Speaker 1: but all the deeper stuff that we've been discussing, all 739 00:44:41,760 --> 00:44:44,680 Speaker 1: the research or the history of you know, that all 740 00:44:44,719 --> 00:44:48,920 Speaker 1: comes from you know, these these um we'd be having 741 00:44:48,960 --> 00:44:52,600 Speaker 1: a conversation with somebody and then something would stick, you know, 742 00:44:52,840 --> 00:44:55,080 Speaker 1: Like I was in Malta and the chef and I 743 00:44:55,080 --> 00:44:58,319 Speaker 1: are talking and he goes, oh, it's been hard on 744 00:44:58,360 --> 00:45:00,840 Speaker 1: the farm farmers this year. It hasn't man did ninety days, 745 00:45:00,920 --> 00:45:04,520 Speaker 1: And I'm like, I wonder, I wonder what that means. 746 00:45:04,640 --> 00:45:07,879 Speaker 1: Like for the show, we just go off and make 747 00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:11,279 Speaker 1: the meal and it's an adventure. But that stuck with me, 748 00:45:11,360 --> 00:45:14,520 Speaker 1: and then I wanted to like, Okay, well what happens 749 00:45:14,560 --> 00:45:18,799 Speaker 1: in Malta where there is no right or in Iceland. 750 00:45:19,360 --> 00:45:22,480 Speaker 1: You know. We were talking with our driver, who's this 751 00:45:22,719 --> 00:45:26,160 Speaker 1: X cop and now he like it drives chursts around 752 00:45:26,640 --> 00:45:29,759 Speaker 1: and uh I was talking about how needed was that 753 00:45:29,840 --> 00:45:33,799 Speaker 1: the permits, you know, that everybody was now permitted, and 754 00:45:33,880 --> 00:45:36,920 Speaker 1: he said something like, yeah, but they've destroyed all the 755 00:45:36,960 --> 00:45:39,600 Speaker 1: fishing villages. And I was like, in my mind, my 756 00:45:39,600 --> 00:45:41,680 Speaker 1: first instinct was like, Oh, this guy's just pissed that 757 00:45:41,719 --> 00:45:44,840 Speaker 1: there's a limit on the catch, right, catch limit. And 758 00:45:45,120 --> 00:45:47,560 Speaker 1: I thought that that was what he meant, that that's 759 00:45:47,600 --> 00:45:52,160 Speaker 1: why the these towns were being destroyed. And then I 760 00:45:52,960 --> 00:45:55,600 Speaker 1: we did research on it, and it was really about 761 00:45:55,640 --> 00:45:59,000 Speaker 1: this sort of this economic thing where the permits were 762 00:45:59,000 --> 00:46:02,400 Speaker 1: being funneled up to these families and and the fishing 763 00:46:02,440 --> 00:46:04,480 Speaker 1: villages were really dying and everybody was moving back into 764 00:46:04,560 --> 00:46:09,920 Speaker 1: rakavic Um. So I got to kind of like unspooled 765 00:46:10,120 --> 00:46:14,000 Speaker 1: the thread, um that we're sitting there. Um. We were 766 00:46:14,040 --> 00:46:18,520 Speaker 1: in Kenya and we were with the Massi, the Um 767 00:46:20,239 --> 00:46:23,640 Speaker 1: who you know have been in Kenya for five hundred years. 768 00:46:23,640 --> 00:46:29,320 Speaker 1: Their pastoralists. Um, they raised cattle and goats and they 769 00:46:29,400 --> 00:46:32,000 Speaker 1: live in these bomas which are like these um they 770 00:46:32,040 --> 00:46:35,520 Speaker 1: take acacia trees and surround their village that lions and 771 00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:38,239 Speaker 1: leopards can't get in, and it's you know, it's it's 772 00:46:38,280 --> 00:46:43,800 Speaker 1: really neat UH culture. But the modern world is hitting 773 00:46:43,920 --> 00:46:48,000 Speaker 1: Kenya like in the last ten years, like bam explosion 774 00:46:48,040 --> 00:46:52,400 Speaker 1: of you know, they have UH satellite, everyone's got cell phones. 775 00:46:52,440 --> 00:46:57,440 Speaker 1: Now everyone has motorbikes, and those two things alone have 776 00:46:57,640 --> 00:47:01,400 Speaker 1: transformed the company the country. Their cell phones they actually 777 00:47:01,400 --> 00:47:04,319 Speaker 1: had the first in Kenya. They had the first sort 778 00:47:04,320 --> 00:47:08,680 Speaker 1: of like PayPal uh app on their phones because nobody 779 00:47:08,680 --> 00:47:12,920 Speaker 1: had nobody had a bank, very rural, but they could 780 00:47:13,440 --> 00:47:16,640 Speaker 1: um put money onto their phones, and so that cell 781 00:47:16,680 --> 00:47:21,680 Speaker 1: phone became this transformational device that really you know, UH. 782 00:47:21,719 --> 00:47:24,200 Speaker 1: They're now the I think the fastest growing economy in Kenya. 783 00:47:24,600 --> 00:47:28,840 Speaker 1: But what that means to the mass I is people 784 00:47:29,239 --> 00:47:32,960 Speaker 1: want to settle down. They don't necessarily want to go 785 00:47:33,000 --> 00:47:36,799 Speaker 1: out for weeks with the cows because with the cows 786 00:47:36,840 --> 00:47:38,879 Speaker 1: you have to keep them moving so that animals don't 787 00:47:38,880 --> 00:47:42,000 Speaker 1: eat them. And and they want to be by this 788 00:47:42,200 --> 00:47:45,120 Speaker 1: by school right for their kids because they don't necessarily 789 00:47:45,120 --> 00:47:49,160 Speaker 1: want their kids to do this and so UM. And 790 00:47:49,160 --> 00:47:51,880 Speaker 1: they're also building farms. So when they settled down, they 791 00:47:51,880 --> 00:47:54,560 Speaker 1: build farms and they build fences, which means the animals 792 00:47:54,600 --> 00:47:58,280 Speaker 1: the migration can't come through. So you're seeing like massive 793 00:47:58,320 --> 00:48:02,360 Speaker 1: die off of elephants and build the beast and zebra 794 00:48:03,160 --> 00:48:07,640 Speaker 1: and and so there's this. It's a it's a really 795 00:48:07,680 --> 00:48:12,320 Speaker 1: interesting scary time, you know, just in terms of change, 796 00:48:13,080 --> 00:48:16,399 Speaker 1: and you can't ask people to live in this sort 797 00:48:16,440 --> 00:48:20,640 Speaker 1: of like Disneyland of five years ago, right like, yes, 798 00:48:20,719 --> 00:48:22,239 Speaker 1: we don't want you. You have to stay in the 799 00:48:22,239 --> 00:48:25,320 Speaker 1: boma and you have to keep watching the cows um. 800 00:48:25,360 --> 00:48:28,600 Speaker 1: But at the same time sort of there there is 801 00:48:30,360 --> 00:48:34,120 Speaker 1: the mass I have always um in essence protected the 802 00:48:34,200 --> 00:48:39,160 Speaker 1: native the animals, right um. And they've lived in concert 803 00:48:39,280 --> 00:48:41,680 Speaker 1: with the elephants in the world of beasts and the 804 00:48:41,760 --> 00:48:46,160 Speaker 1: and the zebra and the lions and stuff. So there 805 00:48:46,280 --> 00:48:52,160 Speaker 1: is a m what's going on there is is they 806 00:48:52,160 --> 00:48:55,279 Speaker 1: are going to um. The government is going to give 807 00:48:55,320 --> 00:48:58,440 Speaker 1: the land to the mass I and they are going 808 00:48:58,520 --> 00:49:03,279 Speaker 1: to um. They lea sit out to safari companies who 809 00:49:03,280 --> 00:49:06,239 Speaker 1: now will pay them um so that they don't have 810 00:49:06,280 --> 00:49:11,360 Speaker 1: to necessarily become farmers UM. But this was a tangent 811 00:49:12,400 --> 00:49:16,360 Speaker 1: We're going down this rabbit hole of like Kenyan anyway, 812 00:49:16,760 --> 00:49:19,799 Speaker 1: you know, the book opens up a lot of stuff. Yeah, 813 00:49:20,440 --> 00:49:22,720 Speaker 1: and whether you want to learn about pizza in making 814 00:49:22,760 --> 00:49:26,120 Speaker 1: pizza in Italy or sort of the future of the Mara, 815 00:49:26,560 --> 00:49:30,680 Speaker 1: the mass A Mara in Future of Elephants. Um, there's 816 00:49:30,680 --> 00:49:32,359 Speaker 1: a lot of cool stuff to go unpack in it. 817 00:49:33,239 --> 00:49:35,719 Speaker 1: I just think it's important for all of us, Like 818 00:49:35,760 --> 00:49:37,960 Speaker 1: we said, to pay attention, but it's it's definitely even 819 00:49:38,040 --> 00:49:41,400 Speaker 1: learning about the different cultures and how we are. I 820 00:49:41,440 --> 00:49:44,560 Speaker 1: had someone say to me, like, we have been destroying 821 00:49:45,239 --> 00:49:48,480 Speaker 1: our world and our universe with all of this overconsumption 822 00:49:48,560 --> 00:49:51,120 Speaker 1: and all the stuff, and it's going to start fighting 823 00:49:51,120 --> 00:49:53,120 Speaker 1: back at some point. And so we're and we are. 824 00:49:53,160 --> 00:49:56,160 Speaker 1: We're seeing all these like natural disasters happen and amp up, 825 00:49:56,200 --> 00:49:58,880 Speaker 1: and it's just like, okay, like when are we going 826 00:49:58,920 --> 00:50:00,880 Speaker 1: to be like, oh, hey, may maybe we need to 827 00:50:00,880 --> 00:50:03,080 Speaker 1: do something different here. So I think it's really cool 828 00:50:03,120 --> 00:50:06,000 Speaker 1: to learn from all these different cultures and see what's 829 00:50:06,040 --> 00:50:10,040 Speaker 1: working and what's not working and how we're all connected. Well, 830 00:50:10,080 --> 00:50:12,160 Speaker 1: you just said, you said we have to pay attention, 831 00:50:12,320 --> 00:50:17,440 Speaker 1: and that's it. We have to be uh conscious about 832 00:50:17,480 --> 00:50:21,799 Speaker 1: all this stuff. Um, I've got a I've got a 833 00:50:21,800 --> 00:50:26,240 Speaker 1: four year old and uh and I worry. I worry 834 00:50:26,239 --> 00:50:30,120 Speaker 1: about him, you know, Yeah, I'm hopefully raising him correctly. 835 00:50:30,160 --> 00:50:32,919 Speaker 1: It's been very interesting. He's decided he's vegan. So it's 836 00:50:32,920 --> 00:50:38,279 Speaker 1: been he doesn't want to eat, he doesn't want to 837 00:50:38,280 --> 00:50:42,000 Speaker 1: eat Piglet and babe, and you know he's connected. I 838 00:50:42,040 --> 00:50:47,600 Speaker 1: like this, but he goes out with me and and 839 00:50:47,640 --> 00:50:51,920 Speaker 1: does some of this stuff, and so you know, I 840 00:50:51,960 --> 00:50:54,600 Speaker 1: feel like I don't know how long am I going 841 00:50:54,680 --> 00:50:57,160 Speaker 1: to be able to protect him for? Right? Right? Start 842 00:50:57,200 --> 00:51:02,040 Speaker 1: putting in motion, um, because what's what's sixty years gonna 843 00:51:02,040 --> 00:51:07,840 Speaker 1: look like? From that? Exactly? Like exactly? Yeah, well I 844 00:51:07,880 --> 00:51:09,920 Speaker 1: love that. Where can people find you if they want 845 00:51:09,960 --> 00:51:12,640 Speaker 1: to keep up with everything you're doing and the show 846 00:51:12,719 --> 00:51:14,759 Speaker 1: and the book and all the things. So we have 847 00:51:15,520 --> 00:51:19,320 Speaker 1: discover from scratch dot com. The book is in anywhere 848 00:51:19,360 --> 00:51:23,480 Speaker 1: you get books, Amazon and Bars and Nobles, your local bookstore. Um. 849 00:51:23,520 --> 00:51:29,080 Speaker 1: The show will be on streamers starting in January. We're 850 00:51:29,120 --> 00:51:33,600 Speaker 1: moving from from A and E Networks. And then, uh, 851 00:51:33,760 --> 00:51:37,960 Speaker 1: there's a really neat I guess I'll announce you here 852 00:51:38,080 --> 00:51:43,799 Speaker 1: there's a really neat spinoff um from Scratch Home. And 853 00:51:43,840 --> 00:51:48,360 Speaker 1: basically what we do is I'm going to build a 854 00:51:48,400 --> 00:51:51,640 Speaker 1: house from the ground up and if I need to 855 00:51:52,000 --> 00:51:55,520 Speaker 1: like make a faucet, I will mind iron smelt steal