Speaker 1: You always look different because you're the first woman of
Speaker 1: the first brown person, the first Asian, the first Indian,
Speaker 1: the first person of color to global luxury brand. You're
Speaker 1: always the first. You're always underestimated. People don't know exactly
Speaker 1: what to expect.
Speaker 2: Lena Nair is in charge of one of the most
Speaker 2: exclusive luxury brands in the world, Chanel, the French fashion
Speaker 2: house known for its iconic designs and fragrances, made the
Speaker 2: avant garde move to appoint her in the top job.
Speaker 2: Previously a human resources veteran, she spent three decades at
Speaker 2: Unilever before switching from the world of fast moving consumer
Speaker 2: goods to oude couture and beauty. The firm's history is
Speaker 2: a legendary, from its founder Gabrielle or Cucko to its fans,
Speaker 2: including Marilyn Monroe. For Lena Naire, it's a chance to
Speaker 2: make history.
Speaker 1: Now. Want to change the world, but look good while
Speaker 1: doing it.
Speaker 2: On this episode of leaders with Laqua, I speak to
Speaker 2: Lena Nair about her professional and personal job, how it
Speaker 2: defines her leadership style, and her unique approach at the
Speaker 2: top of luxury. Ina Area, thank you so much for
Speaker 2: joining us here. On Bloomberg delighted to be here. What's
Speaker 2: it like being a Chanel chief executive? It is the
Speaker 2: best job in the world. It's creative, it's energetic. It's
Speaker 2: why Brunt the sector is doing well. It's a great
Speaker 2: place to be in. So what kind of difference do
Speaker 2: you want to make a Chanel? Is it on the business?
Speaker 2: Is it longevity? Is it what it stands for? Is
Speaker 2: it sustainability?
Speaker 1: You know, I want to lead Chanel into the future
Speaker 1: along with my team, and lead Chanell into the future
Speaker 1: by protecting what's core to us, by protecting our differentiation,
Speaker 1: protecting what's unique about us, and by evolving as a scaled,
Speaker 1: iconic business and brand. You know, it's always important to
Speaker 1: understand the context we operate in. The context we have
Speaker 1: externally is very very dynamic to political uncertainties, macroeconomic challenges, inflation,
Speaker 1: complete fragmentation, media channels, ecosystems. I mean, winning hearts and
Speaker 1: minds of people is so difficult in today's day and age.
Speaker 1: So we see all of that externally AI. I mean
Speaker 1: there's not a week you don't hear about AI. So
Speaker 1: all of this is happening externally and internally. It's been
Speaker 1: a phase of rapid growth. In the last ten years,
Speaker 1: we have more than doubled our revenue. We've more than
Speaker 1: double the number of people who work for us, We've
Speaker 1: more than doubled a distribution presence, We've more than doubled
Speaker 1: the number of countries we have presencing. So that's a
Speaker 1: lot of growth. So my role, along with my leadership team,
Speaker 1: is to ensure that we make coherent these changes, that
Speaker 1: we make sense of these changes, and we are constantly
Speaker 1: shaping what's next.
Speaker 2: As far as I can remember, Chanelle was this beautiful,
Speaker 2: high end luxury everybody wanted the products, but it was
Speaker 2: always quite secretive. And then there's been an opening in
Speaker 2: the last couple of years through culture events podcasts. Why
Speaker 2: is that?
Speaker 1: Like?
Speaker 2: Is there? You know, can a high end luxury company
Speaker 2: no longer be secretive in twenty twenty four?
Speaker 1: You know, for me, never having been in the world
Speaker 1: of luxury or sophistication or refinement, didn't know what to
Speaker 1: expect when I came to Chanel two and a half
Speaker 1: years ago. But it's a very humble company. People are
Speaker 1: truly humble, and you've met many of my teammates and
Speaker 1: it comes from a sense of we don't say things
Speaker 1: unless we've really done them so high integrity, so we'd
Speaker 1: rather do things before we speak about them. So some
Speaker 1: of the shyness has been to do with that, And
Speaker 1: I think the part of the opening up is also
Speaker 1: as we've grown larger, and I explained some of the
Speaker 1: internal context. We've been through rapid growth, being in so
Speaker 1: many markets, having so many people work for us, it
Speaker 1: becomes important to be clearer and more open about who
Speaker 1: we are, what we stand for. It's one hundred year
Speaker 1: role company. It's important to say what we do to
Speaker 1: have been a bagon of inspiration all this year is
Speaker 1: and continue to be a bagon of inspiration for the
Speaker 1: next hundred years.
Speaker 2: Is that because we're buying a luxury differently so that
Speaker 2: clients and customers now want more of a story than
Speaker 2: they maybe did ten fifteen years ago.
Speaker 1: You know, I think there's no typical client and there's
Speaker 1: no one reason to engage in luxury. Truly, we see
Speaker 1: all kinds of clients. People who are longtime fans of Chanel,
Speaker 1: people who are dedicated buyers of Qutuo, people who are
Speaker 1: first time buyers. In fact, first time buyers are thirty
Speaker 1: percent of our clients, which is a lot. We see
Speaker 1: a lot of gen Z and Alpha. Thirty five percent
Speaker 1: of luxury consumers by twenty thirty are going to be
Speaker 1: gen Z and Alpha. It's a hard number to believe,
Speaker 1: but it's the vibrance. See, the vitality is huge because
Speaker 1: each of those clients has a different set of reasons
Speaker 1: for why they engage with us. So for gen Z
Speaker 1: and Alpha, they buy because they want to buy less
Speaker 1: and buy better. They want to buy because they see
Speaker 1: it's a financially wise investment, but everybody buys for a
Speaker 1: different reason. For me, it's part of continuing to build
Speaker 1: our brand, our reputation, come company and telling our story
Speaker 1: in engaging ways to all sorts of clients.
Speaker 2: But do you have to speak differently to the younger generation, No.
Speaker 1: Not really. Our story of so Affare, our story of craftsmanship,
Speaker 1: our story of how how many hours goes into making
Speaker 1: this jacket, like a hundred hours, all handmade, is still
Speaker 1: the core of our story, our craftsmanship, our so Affare.
Speaker 1: It is still how people engage with luxury, the quality
Speaker 1: of it, the beauty of it, a thing of beauty
Speaker 1: gives us all joy. So that is still a very
Speaker 1: very big reason how people look at luxury, the quality
Speaker 1: the sub wire being part of that, and the story
Speaker 1: of Gabriel Chanel and the story of her DNA and
Speaker 1: what she means for us, a spirit of constantly inno
Speaker 1: waiting and radical ways. Because when she designed clothes, it
Speaker 1: was about the freedom of movement. It was about anticipate
Speaker 1: the needs of the modern woman. It was about creating trousers,
Speaker 1: crossbody bags so that women could ride bikes, ride horses.
Speaker 1: So it was about supporting women to be and become
Speaker 1: whoever they wanted to be and become. It was about
Speaker 1: being on this journey of self discovery with women, and
Speaker 1: that core part of our story doesn't change. It is
Speaker 1: the story of being supporting women to be and become
Speaker 1: the best versions of themselves, to discover themselves. And that
Speaker 1: story still engages no matter what age you are, And
Speaker 1: the core of our story really doesn't change. How we
Speaker 1: say it might change. They're more channels than you and
Speaker 1: I can count today. There's all sorts of things, Instagram, tiktop,
Speaker 1: everything that's coming. So the media channels might change through
Speaker 1: the ecosystem, and how we engage might change, but the
Speaker 1: core of our story is still very much who we
Speaker 1: are as you know.
Speaker 2: Get my action was like a pioneer, and I feel
Speaker 2: like when you talk about her, it's also maybe telling
Speaker 2: a little bit about your story. I mean, you have
Speaker 2: a unique story. You grow up in a town in
Speaker 2: India where not many females were educated to a higher level.
Speaker 2: So what was what was that journey like?
Speaker 1: It was a long journey, it was. I grew up
Speaker 1: in a small town in the southwest of India, col Kolhapur,
Speaker 1: and the world of luxury, refinement, sophistication was very far
Speaker 1: away from where I grew up. It was a small
Speaker 1: town like any other. Most of my memories of me
Speaker 1: running barefoot in the town or having my little bike
Speaker 1: and running around women. Being ambitious was not the norm.
Speaker 1: In fact, I remember my mother constantly telling me, who'll
Speaker 1: marry you? You're so ambitious and do you really know
Speaker 1: what you're going to do with your life? And so
Speaker 1: very limited access to role models, to opportunities. I did
Speaker 1: engineering after sort of convincing everybody in my family that
Speaker 1: engineering was good for girls, which was great. It was
Speaker 1: electronics and telecommunications, and I quite enjoyed again being in
Speaker 1: the minority, but learning a lot more about the world
Speaker 1: of technology, which we're all in now part of. Then
Speaker 1: did my management studies. Worked all over the country as
Speaker 1: part of Kindestani and Aliva. I worked. I had an
Speaker 1: all round experience, a hands on experience. Worked in the
Speaker 1: shop floor, worked in frontline sales, rode the trucks in
Speaker 1: the morning, going to the trade selling tea. So it
Speaker 1: was a fun experience, it was an adventure. It meant
Speaker 1: being constantly underestimated. It meant that you always looked different
Speaker 1: because you were the first woman of the first brown person,
Speaker 1: the first Asian, the first Indian, the first person of
Speaker 1: color to leader global luxury brand. You're always the first.
Speaker 1: You're always underestimated. People don't know exactly what to expect,
Speaker 1: they're suspicions of what your agenda might be. And along
Speaker 1: with it comes the responsibility of making it easier for
Speaker 1: those who come after you. So I feel a tremendous privilege,
Speaker 1: tremendous sense of responsibility to make it easier, which means
Speaker 1: questioning norms, being a role model, mentoring as many people
Speaker 1: as I can, trying to make it easier for others,
Speaker 1: constantly championing a more equal bird.
Speaker 2: You like a challenge. Is there ever challenge that you
Speaker 2: actually shine away from.
Speaker 1: You know, every single thing I've done, it's almost as
Speaker 1: if somebody had said it can't be done. I mean,
Speaker 1: I remember I was in a fashion factory and I said,
Speaker 1: I want to go in the night shift, and they said, no,
Speaker 1: we don't put women in the night shift. I said,
Speaker 1: how will I be a successful production manager or personal
Speaker 1: manager of a factory if I never went into a
Speaker 1: night shift and knew how a third of my people worked.
Speaker 1: So in some ways it has fueled some of my determination.
Speaker 1: It's fueled some of my Okay, I'm going to show
Speaker 1: this is possible, a sense of I'm going to go
Speaker 1: get on and do it. It also gives me courage
Speaker 1: because I feel sometimes I'm not just doing it for me,
Speaker 1: I'm doing it for everyone else who comes after me.
Speaker 1: So it gives me courage too. So it fuels my determination,
Speaker 1: fuels my courage. But it is I don't shy me
Speaker 1: from challenges. And I always tell women who ask me
Speaker 1: for advice, saying, put your hand up for the most
Speaker 1: difficult job, put your hand up for things that are challenging,
Speaker 1: you know, go in there and lean into things that
Speaker 1: are difficult, that are challenging, because that's what gives you
Speaker 1: the greatest credibility, respect reputation as you built your career.
Speaker 2: Coming up, Chanelle's lenonaire on the long term outlook for
Speaker 2: luxury and the changing role of what it means to
Speaker 2: be a chief executive. Chanelle is behind some of the
Speaker 2: most recognizable designs and fragrances in modern fashion. The French
Speaker 2: luxury house is still privately held by the billionaire family Vartheimer,
Speaker 2: involved with the company over the past century. I continue
Speaker 2: my rare interview with the firm's chief executive Lemannair. Do
Speaker 2: you see that again, you know, the high end luxury?
Speaker 2: Does that even go higher end luxury that actually there's
Speaker 2: a lot of players in the fashion world right now,
Speaker 2: in luxury world, and it's really the ones that are
Speaker 2: very high that will do well. And does that also
Speaker 2: justify some of the price increases that we've seen at Channel.
Speaker 1: Our prices are related to our cost prices. We use
Speaker 1: exquisite raw materials and our production, as you know, is
Speaker 1: very rigorous, laborious, handmade, so we raise our prices according
Speaker 1: to the inflation that we see, so they're really linked
Speaker 1: to the cost price. We've also made a commitment to
Speaker 1: price harmonization across the world, which means our client should
Speaker 1: not experience excessive price, different shills, price different shills, no
Speaker 1: matter where they buy.
Speaker 2: And secondhand the market is also something that we're saying
Speaker 2: more and more in the last like four to five years.
Speaker 2: What does that mean for a company like shanew.
Speaker 1: You know, we've famously not been on e commerce. We've
Speaker 1: always said we want our clients to buy from our
Speaker 1: beautiful stores because we believe that clients must enjoy the
Speaker 1: immersive experience, immersive physical experience where they build a relationship
Speaker 1: with the fashion advice or the beauty advice or the
Speaker 1: boutique assistant, which is so magical and so core to
Speaker 1: the Chanell story.
Speaker 2: And how do you see the China market right now
Speaker 2: compared to the US market, because it's not that volatile. Actually,
Speaker 2: you kind of have like a base set stage for
Speaker 2: quite some time.
Speaker 1: China is a very central market for the luxury ecosystem
Speaker 1: because of the fast adoption of luxury, because of the
Speaker 1: appreciation of refinement and sophistication. So it's a very important
Speaker 1: central market for US. I came back recently from China
Speaker 1: and I was really happy to see the energy and
Speaker 1: vibrancy in the market, so we continue to run our
Speaker 1: business for the long term and continue to invest in
Speaker 1: China for the long term. Similarly, US, I see US
Speaker 1: as a long term market for luxury. It always has been,
Speaker 1: and all markets see a bit of ebbs and flows,
Speaker 1: but if you keep a long term perspective, we continue
Speaker 1: to invest. I mean, we just opened our beautiful Watches
Speaker 1: and Fine to Restore on the fifth Avenue. It is
Speaker 1: absolutely breathtaking, designed by Peter Marino, with everything that you'd
Speaker 1: expect a nationally boutique, great personalization, intimacy, beauty, things that
Speaker 1: uplift you. So we we believe in both these markets
Speaker 1: and they important to us.
Speaker 2: So it's probably tough for being a chief executive in
Speaker 2: twenty twenty four than it was for the last twenty
Speaker 2: years because of the constant change, and we don't really
Speaker 2: know what AI brings either.
Speaker 1: Yes, it is. It is definitely more challenging, and one
Speaker 1: of my principles as a leader is about tapping into
Speaker 1: collective intelligence because I truly believe the days of the
Speaker 1: superhero leader are well and truly behind us. World is
Speaker 1: so complex. There are crisis on multiple levels that you
Speaker 1: imagine one individual, no matter how bright they are, how
Speaker 1: experience they are, can have answers to all the questions.
Speaker 1: No chance. That's why I believe in collective intelligence, diverse perspectives.
Speaker 1: Go around the room, listen to every voice. It's very
Speaker 1: important to me that I'm not just listening to the
Speaker 1: dominant voices in my room, in my meeting room, but
Speaker 1: listening to all voices around the table.
Speaker 2: So is that what you also lead by empathy? I
Speaker 2: mean I'm always you always say you know you lead
Speaker 2: and lived, which is not always easy.
Speaker 1: I remember in my early days in my career and unilvel,
Speaker 1: when I was going to a place in a factory
Speaker 1: and I felt if it was not safe for women,
Speaker 1: I would go back and fight the battle to make
Speaker 1: sure it was made safe for women who came after me.
Speaker 1: It was always questioning the norms, challenging what was happening
Speaker 1: so I could make it easier for others who come
Speaker 1: after me. It's beautiful in chanel Vius, seventy six percent women,
Speaker 1: sixty percent of my management team are women, so it's
Speaker 1: it's easier to set into place everything to support the
Speaker 1: development and career of all these standard women and create
Speaker 1: a more equal world.
Speaker 2: Would you ever go into menswear with Chanelle?
Speaker 1: If we're going to menswear, it's a rare time in
Speaker 1: our history where we have a female founder, a female CEO,
Speaker 1: female creative director of fashion. So it's a rare time.
Speaker 1: And I think we support women everyone such a beautiful
Speaker 1: you know, we do make things for men. Blur is
Speaker 1: one of the largest selling perfume for men, and I
Speaker 1: hope it stays that way. We really buy women for women,
Speaker 1: support women and were here to empower and support women
Speaker 1: on the journey of becoming.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you're right the perfume. I forgot the perfumes. Yeah,
Speaker 2: talk to me a little bit. I mean there's things
Speaker 2: that people don't understand about Chanel or we talked about
Speaker 2: the foundation because actually for so long it was all
Speaker 2: kept you know, in house. But you also have other brands,
Speaker 2: like how do you see all of these companies working together?
Speaker 1: Yes, you know, we are the world leader in many categories.
Speaker 1: There is all a fashion which is well known. We
Speaker 1: are in fragrances and beauty and skincare. And one of
Speaker 1: the things is we as with my leadership team, which
Speaker 1: we started working on what we call a beacon of
Speaker 1: inspiration for the next hundred years, or we call the
Speaker 1: one hundred year of plan, you know, constantly thinking ahead.
Speaker 1: We started putting some building blocks of fit, which is
Speaker 1: having a positive impact in the world. And there was
Speaker 1: sustainability in my middle, social sustainability and the whole area
Speaker 1: of women's empowerment and girls. So we are one of
Speaker 1: the largest philanthropic organization dedicated to women empowerment and girls.
Speaker 2: It's amazing because not many people know that.
Speaker 1: One hundred and twenty five million this year, so one
Speaker 1: hundred million as soon as they came in and now
Speaker 1: we've increased that two hundred and twenty five million, so
Speaker 1: we are truly one of the largest organizations in the world.
Speaker 1: We work with two hundred and thirty seven partners in
Speaker 1: fifty fifty cluss countries on beautiful programs that support women
Speaker 1: to be free to shape their destiny.
Speaker 2: Coming up, Lena Nair on how Chanel is trying to
Speaker 2: change luxury and how her background in HR is helping
Speaker 2: to shape her mindset. As a chief executive, Lena Naire
Speaker 2: is used to breaking convention and changing norms in the workplace.
Speaker 2: Her transition for Unilever and Human Resources to becoming the
Speaker 2: chief executive of one of the most prestigious names in luxury.
Speaker 2: She tells me how Chanelle is positioning for the future
Speaker 2: of fashion and what it means for her legacy at
Speaker 2: the iconic firm. How difficult is it for a big
Speaker 2: luxury company to be sustainable? I mean, you have very
Speaker 2: ambitious goals.
Speaker 1: I'd like us to set the bar for luxury. I
Speaker 1: would like other luxury players to be inspired by what
Speaker 1: Chanelle does every day. We are one of the few
Speaker 1: luxury players that has now publicly set a goal of
Speaker 1: net zero twenty forty. So we want to really reduce
Speaker 1: our corbon emissions. So, for example, we are in cobon emissions.
Speaker 1: We are reducing our logistics, transport and corbon footprint to
Speaker 1: do with digital Chanelle dot Com saw an increase in
Speaker 1: traffic of thirty percent but a sixteen percent reduction in
Speaker 1: carbon footprint.
Speaker 2: How much of this comes from I guess the heart,
Speaker 2: you know, try to to do good. And how much
Speaker 2: does this also play with consumers because in five ten
Speaker 2: years will be even more focused on this.
Speaker 1: Yes, you know for insane. I think clients believe luxury
Speaker 1: is sustainable because they know we make few things and
Speaker 1: we make them beautifully, and we make them with hand,
Speaker 1: and that genuine desire by clients to see us continue
Speaker 1: to sustainable is only going to go up. And I
Speaker 1: mentioned about more gen Z and Alpha buying, and they
Speaker 1: buy because they want to buy less and buy better,
Speaker 1: which is the right mindset to engage with luxury. So
Speaker 1: it is going to be increasingly important in sustainability.
Speaker 2: You need to be a risk taker, like the idea
Speaker 2: that as a chief executive, I guess you need to
Speaker 2: be careful, But do you need to Is there anything
Speaker 2: coming where you, you know, will challenge I guess you're.
Speaker 1: Risk taking, you know. I think for all of us
Speaker 1: it's the world today is so complex and moving fast
Speaker 1: that you're constantly adjusting being a child taking. For me,
Speaker 1: we are a courageous brand because we walk in the
Speaker 1: footsteps of a courageous woman. Gabriel Chanel lived the life
Speaker 1: she wanted courageously passionately, made the choices she wanted courageously passionately.
Speaker 1: And one of our values is audacity. So for me,
Speaker 1: audacity so important. Lean do you call it restaking, I
Speaker 1: call it audacity.
Speaker 2: I like, I actually prefer audacity. It has a certain
Speaker 2: cachet that I'm sure Gabrielle Chanell would have loved. What
Speaker 2: have you learned about yourself? As chief executive? So you
Speaker 2: were in charge of HR for Uniliver, and this is
Speaker 2: a massive company, it's one hundred thousands of employees. I mean,
Speaker 2: is it different actually being in charge of a company
Speaker 2: than being in charge of of HR.
Speaker 1: When when I was moving to Chanel, a mentor told
Speaker 1: me you're doing a quadruple jump. So what do I mean?
Speaker 1: So it's changed on so many dimensions. It's public to private.
Speaker 1: It's FMCG to LUG. It is from Anglo Dutch to
Speaker 1: French heritage. I have weekly French classes. It's HR to CEO.
Speaker 1: So it's been changed on all dimensions. It's not just
Speaker 1: one dimension, It's been all dimensions. And luxury is very
Speaker 1: different from fmcs. You know, the preciousness, the rarity, it's
Speaker 1: not available everywhere every time. It's the balance between timeless
Speaker 1: quest for new it's all of that. It's different to me.
Speaker 1: The principles of business and the principles of leadership are
Speaker 1: transferable across sectors. How to run a business across multiple countries,
Speaker 1: multiple product categories, multiple geographies, multiple cultures. How to galvanize
Speaker 1: and inspire teams across again, multiple cultures, multiple kinds. There
Speaker 1: are principles that hold you in good step because people
Speaker 1: are people. At the end of the day, they have motivations, dreams, aspirations.
Speaker 1: They won't to engage in a particular way. I must
Speaker 1: say being in Chanel has taught me to be more patient,
Speaker 1: more long term. The treadmill of quarterly results, etc. Is
Speaker 1: a different world. So it's taught me to be more patient.
Speaker 1: It's taught me to appreciate a lot more. And you know,
Speaker 1: I want to change the world but look good while
Speaker 1: doing it.
Speaker 2: I love that. Do you think about your legacy?
Speaker 1: Yes? I do. For me, I hope people say that
Speaker 1: I'm a purpose led visionary leader, which means you spend
Speaker 1: a lot of time thinking about what are you doing,
Speaker 1: what are you giving back? What will be the difference
Speaker 1: you make? I think for me, the biggest thing is
Speaker 1: if a hundred years from now people look back and
Speaker 1: say that we at Channel did stuff today that inspires them,
Speaker 1: that helped them question norms about what they're doing, Audacious
Speaker 1: things that have redefined the norms, supported women everywhere to
Speaker 1: feel like they can be the best version of themselves.
Speaker 1: I think that would be something that I would feel
Speaker 1: good about it. If I've made a few women in
Speaker 1: the world dream a little bit more about what they
Speaker 1: could achieve in their lives, I would feel very fulfilled
Speaker 1: in my life and career.
Speaker 2: Do you think you're ipoceanal Oh no.
Speaker 1: And IPA is not on the table. We love the
Speaker 1: privilege of being an independent company, being able to make
Speaker 1: long term decisions. Twenty thirty hundred years old.
Speaker 2: I being a best piece of advice and worst piece
Speaker 2: of advice you've ever been given.
Speaker 1: Best piece of advice I'm actually going to do too.
Speaker 1: One is fall in love with the life a job
Speaker 1: you have. Don't wait for the perfect job. Fall in
Speaker 1: love with the job you have and make it the
Speaker 1: most perfect job in the world. And the other is
Speaker 1: which my husband also tells me a lot, enjoy the
Speaker 1: journey as much as you enjoy the destination. We're always
Speaker 1: in a hurry to get somewhere, and you get promoted,
Speaker 1: you and given the next promotion. No, no, no, just
Speaker 1: enjoy breathe a bit and enjoy the journey as much
Speaker 1: as the destination. Worst piece of advice. I think most
Speaker 1: often when you get a worst piece of advice you
Speaker 1: just ignore it and forget about it. But you know,
Speaker 1: I've received advice like you know, when I was in
Speaker 1: many rooms the only woman in the room, the only
Speaker 1: woman in the room. So many times in my career,
Speaker 1: I've received advice like you know, stay quiet for as
Speaker 1: long as you can, and try and blend in, and
Speaker 1: you know you're already standing out because you looked at
Speaker 1: from from the rest. And I think that's terrible advice.
Speaker 1: I think it's really important you feel safe to be
Speaker 1: who you are, and it takes courage to be who
Speaker 1: you are, and you're changed by being who you are.
Speaker 2: I mean, no, no, thank you so much for joining yesterday.