1 00:00:07,680 --> 00:00:09,840 Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Saber Protection of I Heeart Radio. 2 00:00:09,920 --> 00:00:12,600 Speaker 1: I'm Annie Reese and I'm Lauren vocal Baum, and today 3 00:00:12,640 --> 00:00:15,400 Speaker 1: we have an episode for you about the semi fictional 4 00:00:15,440 --> 00:00:20,760 Speaker 1: foods of Pan's Labyrinth. Yes, and if you've seen that 5 00:00:20,800 --> 00:00:25,560 Speaker 1: film then you know there's some intense subject matter to 6 00:00:25,680 --> 00:00:34,000 Speaker 1: be discussed. Yes, absolutely, uh absolutely, I was I suggested 7 00:00:34,040 --> 00:00:39,720 Speaker 1: this topic because you know, it's October, even more people 8 00:00:39,760 --> 00:00:43,280 Speaker 1: than usual are filling their brains with with horror films. 9 00:00:43,320 --> 00:00:44,760 Speaker 1: And I was like, oh man, what if we did 10 00:00:44,760 --> 00:00:49,159 Speaker 1: a fictional foods with some kind of horror property. Um? 11 00:00:49,200 --> 00:00:55,480 Speaker 1: And my first thought, My first thought was this shining 12 00:00:56,600 --> 00:01:00,480 Speaker 1: And Annie was like, so you're just going to talk 13 00:01:00,520 --> 00:01:10,160 Speaker 1: about alcoholism, yeah, and a little sad frozen cabinet and 14 00:01:10,160 --> 00:01:16,000 Speaker 1: and the sad frozen pantry. Yeah. I was like, I 15 00:01:16,040 --> 00:01:21,960 Speaker 1: was like, okay, I see you. Um. And I don't 16 00:01:21,959 --> 00:01:23,959 Speaker 1: know where I got Pants Labyrinth from, honestly, Like, I 17 00:01:24,000 --> 00:01:26,600 Speaker 1: was just kind of going through because because I almost wouldn't. 18 00:01:26,840 --> 00:01:29,480 Speaker 1: I mean, it's a it's a film with many strong 19 00:01:30,000 --> 00:01:34,440 Speaker 1: horror elements, but it's not usually categorized strictly as a 20 00:01:34,480 --> 00:01:39,840 Speaker 1: horror film. Um. Right, it's kind of a dark fairy 21 00:01:39,840 --> 00:01:45,039 Speaker 1: tale with historical elements that are sad. Yeah, which to me, 22 00:01:45,280 --> 00:01:48,120 Speaker 1: I just I don't know, like like to me, Gamaldo 23 00:01:48,160 --> 00:01:50,960 Speaker 1: Toro is pretty much always a horror director, no matter 24 00:01:51,240 --> 00:01:55,360 Speaker 1: what precisely he's doing, he's really leaning in that direction. 25 00:01:55,640 --> 00:01:57,480 Speaker 1: And I think that part of why it's not categorized 26 00:01:57,480 --> 00:02:02,240 Speaker 1: as a horror film is a reluctance among some academics 27 00:02:02,320 --> 00:02:08,880 Speaker 1: and film critics to um recognize genre fiction as like good. Ever, 28 00:02:09,600 --> 00:02:11,040 Speaker 1: so they're like, oh, well, I liked this, so I 29 00:02:11,120 --> 00:02:14,000 Speaker 1: can't possibly be a horror film. It's a dark fairy Yes. 30 00:02:14,400 --> 00:02:17,320 Speaker 1: We just did an episode about this on stuff I 31 00:02:17,440 --> 00:02:20,680 Speaker 1: never told you. We were talking about elevated horror and 32 00:02:20,680 --> 00:02:23,120 Speaker 1: what does it mean and why is it a thing? 33 00:02:23,520 --> 00:02:25,040 Speaker 1: And a lot of it is people just don't want 34 00:02:25,040 --> 00:02:30,760 Speaker 1: to say they like horror, right, yes, so a lots 35 00:02:30,880 --> 00:02:33,880 Speaker 1: I'm back there. Um, I hadn't seen I saw Pants 36 00:02:33,960 --> 00:02:38,320 Speaker 1: Labyrinth when it came out because it was very critically acclaimed. Um, 37 00:02:38,480 --> 00:02:42,240 Speaker 1: it got a lot of buzz, as they say, So 38 00:02:42,280 --> 00:02:44,200 Speaker 1: I saw it when it came out. I think it 39 00:02:44,360 --> 00:02:50,919 Speaker 1: was pretty young, younger youngish at the time, who knows, Um, 40 00:02:51,080 --> 00:02:56,000 Speaker 1: But it disturbed me and I never I hadn't seen 41 00:02:56,000 --> 00:03:00,280 Speaker 1: it again until this. I rewatched it for this episode. Yeah, 42 00:03:00,280 --> 00:03:03,360 Speaker 1: I think I must have seen it at least one 43 00:03:03,520 --> 00:03:06,480 Speaker 1: other time. Yeah, because I remember seeing it in theaters 44 00:03:06,600 --> 00:03:11,000 Speaker 1: and being yeah, like very kind of racked about it, um, 45 00:03:11,040 --> 00:03:14,080 Speaker 1: and then and really liking it and wanting to watch 46 00:03:14,120 --> 00:03:16,400 Speaker 1: it again, but never quite coming around to like a 47 00:03:16,440 --> 00:03:19,720 Speaker 1: really good time to do it. And so it's certainly 48 00:03:19,760 --> 00:03:22,520 Speaker 1: been like ten years or something like that since I've 49 00:03:22,520 --> 00:03:26,160 Speaker 1: watched it. And uh, and it was really really interesting 50 00:03:26,400 --> 00:03:29,760 Speaker 1: getting to revisit it and um see all of the 51 00:03:29,800 --> 00:03:32,760 Speaker 1: effects that they were using, and um, all of the 52 00:03:32,760 --> 00:03:36,640 Speaker 1: themes that I've gotten to watch del Toro, um using 53 00:03:36,760 --> 00:03:42,080 Speaker 1: some of his later works. Yeah, and that that's that's 54 00:03:42,120 --> 00:03:45,320 Speaker 1: interesting to me that the food stood out enough to 55 00:03:45,520 --> 00:03:47,760 Speaker 1: you that even though you hadn't seen it in a while, 56 00:03:48,720 --> 00:03:52,360 Speaker 1: it was a suggestion. Oh yeah, let's talk about this 57 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:55,800 Speaker 1: so well that I mean, if if you've seen it, 58 00:03:55,880 --> 00:03:57,200 Speaker 1: then I'm sure that you know, like one of the 59 00:03:57,200 --> 00:03:59,240 Speaker 1: main things we're gonna be talking about is that heck 60 00:03:59,240 --> 00:04:02,880 Speaker 1: and Dinner with the Paleman. It's just very it's very 61 00:04:02,920 --> 00:04:06,280 Speaker 1: striking and the actual scene, actual depiction of the food 62 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:09,040 Speaker 1: in the scene is so short, but it's quite memorable. 63 00:04:09,880 --> 00:04:14,120 Speaker 1: It is all right, So I guess that brings us 64 00:04:14,120 --> 00:04:17,919 Speaker 1: two hawk questions. Oh, i've it certainly does yep, Okay, 65 00:04:17,960 --> 00:04:26,680 Speaker 1: here we go. Pans Labyrinth, what is it? Well? Pan's 66 00:04:26,760 --> 00:04:30,320 Speaker 1: Labyrinth is the English language name of a Spanish Mexican 67 00:04:30,360 --> 00:04:34,440 Speaker 1: film original title A LaRenzo del Funnel. It premiered in 68 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:37,040 Speaker 1: two thousand and six and was written and directed right 69 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:43,880 Speaker 1: by Yamoo. And we've talked a lot about fairy tales 70 00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:47,440 Speaker 1: on this show. We've done readings of a few of them. Um, 71 00:04:47,480 --> 00:04:53,000 Speaker 1: and the story is both a fairy tale and depicts 72 00:04:53,560 --> 00:04:58,240 Speaker 1: very real historical events if if a fictionalized stylized version 73 00:04:58,600 --> 00:05:02,040 Speaker 1: of them. Yeah. So there are two threads to the plot. 74 00:05:02,200 --> 00:05:05,760 Speaker 1: Um one follows an eleven year old girl named Ophelia 75 00:05:05,839 --> 00:05:08,839 Speaker 1: and her pregnant mother as they arrived in a countryside 76 00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:14,120 Speaker 1: military camp in post Civil War Spain. Ophelia's father had 77 00:05:14,160 --> 00:05:17,560 Speaker 1: died during the war, and they're settling in with her 78 00:05:17,600 --> 00:05:21,560 Speaker 1: stepfather for his baby's birth. Um. He's a captain in 79 00:05:21,560 --> 00:05:24,920 Speaker 1: the military and stationed there to root out a guerrilla 80 00:05:25,040 --> 00:05:31,839 Speaker 1: activity in the woods. He's a cruel, stern man with 81 00:05:32,080 --> 00:05:35,880 Speaker 1: little regard for Ophelia or her mother. His unborn son 82 00:05:36,360 --> 00:05:38,560 Speaker 1: is all he seems to care about, not that he's 83 00:05:38,600 --> 00:05:43,120 Speaker 1: even sure of the sex outside of his own, you know. Arrogance. Uh. 84 00:05:43,320 --> 00:05:47,680 Speaker 1: Times are lean and the military UM and government are 85 00:05:47,800 --> 00:05:51,160 Speaker 1: hoarding what little food and medicine are in the area, 86 00:05:51,520 --> 00:05:54,479 Speaker 1: and the rebels are trying to help the locals. And 87 00:05:54,520 --> 00:05:58,000 Speaker 1: one of the rebels, a woman named Mercedes, works sort 88 00:05:58,000 --> 00:06:00,640 Speaker 1: of undercover, is the head of house at the camp, 89 00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:07,159 Speaker 1: like the head servant. Things go poorly in this thread. UM. 90 00:06:09,839 --> 00:06:13,680 Speaker 1: The other thread is a fairy tale that may be 91 00:06:13,960 --> 00:06:17,960 Speaker 1: real or that Ophelia may have concocted UM, that she's 92 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:22,000 Speaker 1: really the lost princess of a magical kingdom, and that 93 00:06:22,160 --> 00:06:25,440 Speaker 1: a fawn has come to give her three trials to 94 00:06:25,440 --> 00:06:30,159 Speaker 1: see whether she's worthy of rejoining her immortal family. UM. 95 00:06:30,200 --> 00:06:33,760 Speaker 1: So she must face fearsome monsters and protect the innocent 96 00:06:33,880 --> 00:06:38,159 Speaker 1: and save her baby brother. Things also kind of go poorly. 97 00:06:41,960 --> 00:06:45,840 Speaker 1: Theme of the film, UM, which we were talking about 98 00:06:45,920 --> 00:06:49,680 Speaker 1: when I was trying to think of like Spanish Mexican 99 00:06:49,720 --> 00:06:52,520 Speaker 1: horror movies and everyone I was like, but that's pretty 100 00:06:52,560 --> 00:07:00,520 Speaker 1: grim and said, oh that's pretty grim and sad. Yeah, yep, UM, 101 00:07:00,600 --> 00:07:03,039 Speaker 1: UM gonna get into a little bit of why that 102 00:07:03,160 --> 00:07:05,680 Speaker 1: isn't just a second UM. First to note on del 103 00:07:05,760 --> 00:07:08,440 Speaker 1: Toro Um he was born in Mexico in nineteen sixty 104 00:07:08,520 --> 00:07:14,120 Speaker 1: four into a deeply Catholic family, although he is lapsed Catholic. 105 00:07:14,480 --> 00:07:17,280 Speaker 1: He frequently works in genre fiction UM, some of which 106 00:07:17,520 --> 00:07:23,640 Speaker 1: does indeed explore similar historical themes of authoritarianism. But we 107 00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:29,120 Speaker 1: are ostensibly a food show. Almost every episode we have 108 00:07:29,200 --> 00:07:35,240 Speaker 1: to remind ourselves uh foo. Food and various difficulties with 109 00:07:35,280 --> 00:07:38,920 Speaker 1: it are a really key part of this film. Characters 110 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:42,880 Speaker 1: are constantly eating or drinking or struggling to do so. 111 00:07:43,320 --> 00:07:45,960 Speaker 1: In the real world, there's daily cooking to be done, 112 00:07:46,240 --> 00:07:51,280 Speaker 1: rations to distribute feasts to impress, with nausea to cope with, 113 00:07:51,520 --> 00:07:55,480 Speaker 1: and alcohol as a pleasure and as a painkiller. UM. 114 00:07:55,520 --> 00:07:58,440 Speaker 1: In the fairytale world, there's tricks to be played and 115 00:07:58,640 --> 00:08:03,560 Speaker 1: entrapments to avoid surrounding food and eating, and and always 116 00:08:03,560 --> 00:08:08,160 Speaker 1: the fear of being eaten by the monsters. More specifics 117 00:08:08,160 --> 00:08:12,160 Speaker 1: on all of that in a little bit, but there's 118 00:08:12,440 --> 00:08:15,320 Speaker 1: a lot of metaphor that can be drawn between the 119 00:08:15,360 --> 00:08:18,360 Speaker 1: food and the anxieties surrounding it in the real and 120 00:08:18,400 --> 00:08:23,920 Speaker 1: the fairytale worlds and okay, the Spanish Civil War and 121 00:08:24,000 --> 00:08:30,400 Speaker 1: the fascist dictatorship of Francisco Franco afterwards were really terrible 122 00:08:30,400 --> 00:08:34,240 Speaker 1: times in history for a lot of people. The war 123 00:08:34,400 --> 00:08:38,240 Speaker 1: only lasted from nineteen thirty six nine thirty nine, but 124 00:08:38,400 --> 00:08:44,040 Speaker 1: Franco ruled from then until ninety five, and hundreds of 125 00:08:44,040 --> 00:08:48,480 Speaker 1: thousands of people were killed, partially in mass exterminations by 126 00:08:48,640 --> 00:08:53,240 Speaker 1: the nationalists under Franco. Um exterminations of people deemed socially 127 00:08:53,280 --> 00:08:56,679 Speaker 1: undesirable for one reason or another, including people of religions 128 00:08:56,679 --> 00:09:01,440 Speaker 1: other than Catholic, gay people, leftists, a very walks. It's 129 00:09:01,480 --> 00:09:05,800 Speaker 1: called the White Terror, and the extent of this is 130 00:09:05,840 --> 00:09:09,480 Speaker 1: still uncertain today, but like it's it's thought that like 131 00:09:09,600 --> 00:09:13,800 Speaker 1: tens of thousands of people still lie unknown in in 132 00:09:13,920 --> 00:09:19,959 Speaker 1: unmarked graves. Just this year, virtual Museum opened and new 133 00:09:20,040 --> 00:09:23,800 Speaker 1: laws were passed in Spain to help untangle the history there. 134 00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:28,680 Speaker 1: And especially in the decade or so immediately following the war, 135 00:09:29,160 --> 00:09:32,080 Speaker 1: there was a lot of famine. H there was this 136 00:09:32,200 --> 00:09:34,680 Speaker 1: three year drought that did not help a lot of 137 00:09:34,679 --> 00:09:37,199 Speaker 1: the farms and the people who worked them were destroyed 138 00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:42,240 Speaker 1: or displaced. It's sometimes called Spain's Years of hunger. Ah. 139 00:09:42,800 --> 00:09:46,000 Speaker 1: There was a ration system in place from the late 140 00:09:46,080 --> 00:09:50,160 Speaker 1: thirties until the early fifties, but it was insufficient and 141 00:09:50,400 --> 00:09:55,520 Speaker 1: rife with corruption. A research into people's diets indicated that 142 00:09:55,559 --> 00:09:58,280 Speaker 1: no one was getting enough to eat. Literally, no one 143 00:09:58,360 --> 00:10:02,600 Speaker 1: day studied was getting an appropriate daily chloric intake um, 144 00:10:02,640 --> 00:10:05,360 Speaker 1: and what they were getting was like over fifty calories 145 00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:10,240 Speaker 1: from bread. Ah. It was a huge source of anxiety 146 00:10:10,400 --> 00:10:16,960 Speaker 1: for many people, and malnutrition was very rampant. Yeah. And 147 00:10:17,000 --> 00:10:20,800 Speaker 1: I know we've talked about this in a couple of episodes, 148 00:10:20,840 --> 00:10:24,800 Speaker 1: and I think that war and conflict every episode we've 149 00:10:24,840 --> 00:10:30,559 Speaker 1: done has some instance of war conflict. Here was the 150 00:10:30,600 --> 00:10:34,240 Speaker 1: people who were suffering and didn't have enough food and 151 00:10:34,280 --> 00:10:37,600 Speaker 1: what came out of that. Um. So yeah, it would 152 00:10:38,120 --> 00:10:42,120 Speaker 1: have a huge impact on the culture. The films that 153 00:10:42,120 --> 00:10:45,920 Speaker 1: are getting made around these ideas, oh yeah, yeah, and 154 00:10:45,920 --> 00:10:47,600 Speaker 1: the stories that you tell and how you deal with 155 00:10:47,600 --> 00:10:49,840 Speaker 1: those anxieties. And one of the things that I do 156 00:10:49,960 --> 00:10:53,280 Speaker 1: love about genre fiction and perhaps specifically horror, is that 157 00:10:53,360 --> 00:10:59,520 Speaker 1: it's such a wonderful place to explore anxieties like that. Yeah. Yeah, 158 00:10:59,600 --> 00:11:03,319 Speaker 1: especially you like, if you're trying to deal with something 159 00:11:03,480 --> 00:11:08,160 Speaker 1: that is so tragic and terrible as this, and you 160 00:11:08,200 --> 00:11:10,280 Speaker 1: don't want people to turn away because it's not a 161 00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:17,600 Speaker 1: fun topic. Explore it and it's still not a fun topic, 162 00:11:18,679 --> 00:11:22,360 Speaker 1: but at least like you're having that conversation, I think 163 00:11:22,480 --> 00:11:25,760 Speaker 1: more people are more willing to engage in it in 164 00:11:25,800 --> 00:11:30,800 Speaker 1: that way. But that's my opinion. Well, what about the 165 00:11:30,880 --> 00:11:44,240 Speaker 1: nutrition oh, um, don't don't eat uh? Genre depictions of 166 00:11:45,640 --> 00:11:50,800 Speaker 1: uh Francoist fascism. Yeah, I think I can get on 167 00:11:50,840 --> 00:11:54,040 Speaker 1: board with that one. No silly follow ups from me. 168 00:11:57,800 --> 00:12:01,280 Speaker 1: We do have some numbers for you, so we do. Um. 169 00:12:01,320 --> 00:12:05,000 Speaker 1: The film got a relatively limited release but was very 170 00:12:05,000 --> 00:12:10,640 Speaker 1: well accepted. It's certified fresh at on Rotten Tomatoes. Very good. Um. 171 00:12:10,720 --> 00:12:12,559 Speaker 1: And the year that came out, it was on the 172 00:12:12,600 --> 00:12:15,240 Speaker 1: top ten lists, um like top ten movies of the 173 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:20,880 Speaker 1: year of at least thirty five major publications. Um as 174 00:12:22,120 --> 00:12:26,200 Speaker 1: it was still the fifth highest grossing foreign film in 175 00:12:26,360 --> 00:12:29,760 Speaker 1: US history. UM. So that was eleven years after it 176 00:12:29,800 --> 00:12:33,520 Speaker 1: had come out, and it was nominated for a glut 177 00:12:33,559 --> 00:12:36,679 Speaker 1: of awards pun intended after the fact, but you know, 178 00:12:36,760 --> 00:12:41,040 Speaker 1: let's roll with it. Um. At the seventy nine Academy Awards, 179 00:12:41,360 --> 00:12:46,360 Speaker 1: it won three for Art Direction, cinematography and makeup, but 180 00:12:47,160 --> 00:12:51,720 Speaker 1: it won across all categories with various organizations over the 181 00:12:51,760 --> 00:12:55,120 Speaker 1: next year or so. Yeah, it's very, very visually arresting. 182 00:12:55,160 --> 00:13:01,600 Speaker 1: It's it's still. When I was watching, I was like, still, yep, Yeah, okay, yep, yep. 183 00:13:01,720 --> 00:13:09,200 Speaker 1: That's beautiful and very upsetting. Exactly. Well, we're going to 184 00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:15,439 Speaker 1: get into more of that, but first we have a 185 00:13:15,520 --> 00:13:27,640 Speaker 1: quick break for word from our sponsor. We're back. Thank 186 00:13:27,679 --> 00:13:31,480 Speaker 1: you sponsored, Yes, thank you. One of the thoughts that 187 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:35,000 Speaker 1: I had while I was watching this time around is like, goodness, 188 00:13:35,000 --> 00:13:40,520 Speaker 1: my gracious, this film is not light handed. It's it's pretty. 189 00:13:41,240 --> 00:13:43,880 Speaker 1: It's pretty straightforward, like as much as it's you know, 190 00:13:43,960 --> 00:13:48,839 Speaker 1: couching things in metaphor, it's very direct and um one 191 00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:51,800 Speaker 1: of those one of those things I realized, like the 192 00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:57,040 Speaker 1: very setting of the main events of this film is evocative. 193 00:13:57,160 --> 00:14:00,880 Speaker 1: Because the military camp is set up in this old mill. 194 00:14:01,920 --> 00:14:06,000 Speaker 1: It is literally replacing a means of making food with 195 00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:11,839 Speaker 1: the means of making war. Yeah. Yeah, and it feels 196 00:14:11,920 --> 00:14:14,800 Speaker 1: kind of it's trivial the right word. I don't know. 197 00:14:14,840 --> 00:14:16,560 Speaker 1: I kept thinking of the Hunger Games. A lot of 198 00:14:16,559 --> 00:14:18,960 Speaker 1: the conversations we have when we did the Hunger Games 199 00:14:19,400 --> 00:14:23,800 Speaker 1: are very relevant to this as well. And obviously the 200 00:14:23,880 --> 00:14:29,120 Speaker 1: Hunger Games is totally fictional, still has like real world foods, 201 00:14:29,160 --> 00:14:33,560 Speaker 1: but like a future dystopia. Sure, although I can't help like, 202 00:14:33,560 --> 00:14:36,520 Speaker 1: like the reading that I was doing about the famine 203 00:14:36,560 --> 00:14:40,800 Speaker 1: in the country and immediately following the war UM was 204 00:14:40,880 --> 00:14:44,800 Speaker 1: so reminiscent, Like I have to think that Suzanne Collins 205 00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:49,840 Speaker 1: did research into stuff like post Civil War Spain when 206 00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:54,720 Speaker 1: she was especially writing the prequel. It was just very 207 00:14:55,000 --> 00:14:59,200 Speaker 1: very very similar and very upsetting. Yeah. Yeah, And as 208 00:14:59,240 --> 00:15:02,880 Speaker 1: we talked about in that Hunger Games episode. In Pan's Labyrinth, 209 00:15:02,920 --> 00:15:06,520 Speaker 1: food is often depicted as a source of power UM. 210 00:15:06,760 --> 00:15:12,200 Speaker 1: Several scenes show those who were in power feasting UM. 211 00:15:12,240 --> 00:15:14,920 Speaker 1: And these feasts are often made by the lower class. 212 00:15:14,920 --> 00:15:18,120 Speaker 1: They're supplied by the lower class. Uh. And that is 213 00:15:18,160 --> 00:15:21,920 Speaker 1: why while the lower classes like struggling and starving, they're 214 00:15:21,960 --> 00:15:26,680 Speaker 1: feasting off of what they have done but they have 215 00:15:26,800 --> 00:15:32,440 Speaker 1: taken from them. In In just one example, at one 216 00:15:32,480 --> 00:15:34,960 Speaker 1: point early in the film UM, two locals are captured 217 00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:38,320 Speaker 1: by the Captain's men and questioned for being potential rebels. 218 00:15:38,760 --> 00:15:41,520 Speaker 1: It turns out they're really probably just farmers who were 219 00:15:41,560 --> 00:15:46,120 Speaker 1: hungry and out hunting rabbits, but they're murdered for having 220 00:15:46,160 --> 00:15:50,840 Speaker 1: guns and being out at night, right, and then there 221 00:15:50,840 --> 00:15:54,920 Speaker 1: are also more fantastical elements illustrating the power of food. 222 00:15:54,960 --> 00:15:58,520 Speaker 1: For instance, Apphilia, there's a scene where she's able to 223 00:15:58,560 --> 00:16:05,080 Speaker 1: defeat this big toad, obnoxious toad's living under a fig 224 00:16:05,120 --> 00:16:09,400 Speaker 1: tree and poisoning it slowly. Yes, she's able to defeat 225 00:16:09,440 --> 00:16:14,480 Speaker 1: it by giving it by feeding its stones, which acts 226 00:16:14,480 --> 00:16:18,760 Speaker 1: as like a purgitive. It rids the toxin from the 227 00:16:18,800 --> 00:16:22,240 Speaker 1: tree um so that it once again can produce fruit. 228 00:16:22,960 --> 00:16:25,000 Speaker 1: And this is all after she asked of it. Aren't 229 00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:27,520 Speaker 1: you ashamed of staying down here eating bugs while the 230 00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:32,480 Speaker 1: tree dies? Um? And much of this food and its 231 00:16:32,480 --> 00:16:34,960 Speaker 1: power serves as a symbol of, yeah, what was going 232 00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:39,560 Speaker 1: on during the Spanish Civil War and fascism. When Vadal, 233 00:16:39,720 --> 00:16:42,200 Speaker 1: acting as a symbol of the fascist government, hands out 234 00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:47,040 Speaker 1: the captain yes, um sorry sorry yeah. When he hands 235 00:16:47,040 --> 00:16:50,440 Speaker 1: out ration cards, he's controlling the source of food and 236 00:16:50,480 --> 00:16:52,960 Speaker 1: therefore is in the place of power. And it's telling 237 00:16:52,960 --> 00:16:56,200 Speaker 1: you that you're very lucky that they're so kind to 238 00:16:56,360 --> 00:17:01,120 Speaker 1: give these rations. You're welcome, We don't have to do this. 239 00:17:03,320 --> 00:17:05,639 Speaker 1: H M. Hmm. And then there are a lot of 240 00:17:05,720 --> 00:17:10,879 Speaker 1: scenes around So Mercedes works in the kitchen, works with 241 00:17:10,920 --> 00:17:13,800 Speaker 1: a lot of other cooks, and there are a lot 242 00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:17,720 Speaker 1: of scenes around that that I found interesting and especially 243 00:17:17,720 --> 00:17:21,680 Speaker 1: like them being sort of the mercy of the higher ups, 244 00:17:21,720 --> 00:17:26,440 Speaker 1: like getting blamed for the burnt coffee, um, getting blamed 245 00:17:26,480 --> 00:17:29,560 Speaker 1: for the rabbits that are too young to be cooked. Uh, 246 00:17:29,600 --> 00:17:34,280 Speaker 1: these demands for this lavish food that isn't available. Uh. 247 00:17:34,320 --> 00:17:36,840 Speaker 1: And then kind of the like gossip that's going on 248 00:17:36,920 --> 00:17:40,080 Speaker 1: in the kitchen about like oh they eat like pigs 249 00:17:40,160 --> 00:17:43,480 Speaker 1: and just this it being a space of kind of 250 00:17:43,520 --> 00:17:48,200 Speaker 1: this smaller rebellion of talking about like look what they're doing, 251 00:17:48,720 --> 00:17:53,719 Speaker 1: We see what's happening here. M h uh. An early 252 00:17:53,800 --> 00:17:57,399 Speaker 1: scene shows the captain talking about rations like olives in 253 00:17:57,440 --> 00:18:00,719 Speaker 1: a very smug manner. Um. And then yeah, they have 254 00:18:00,840 --> 00:18:05,520 Speaker 1: the like well off circle and a circle dividing them. Um. 255 00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:08,440 Speaker 1: And when they do we end out the rations, they 256 00:18:08,480 --> 00:18:12,360 Speaker 1: call it like the daily bread and Franco Spain. Uh, 257 00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:17,960 Speaker 1: and yeah, are very like thrilled by it. Yeah, it's 258 00:18:18,040 --> 00:18:23,240 Speaker 1: it's very oof oof. It's it's very like like military 259 00:18:23,320 --> 00:18:27,600 Speaker 1: dudes yelling at you, basically implying that you should be 260 00:18:27,680 --> 00:18:31,320 Speaker 1: so grateful about this pittance of food that they have 261 00:18:31,640 --> 00:18:38,399 Speaker 1: spoken with amongst themselves as knowing is insufficient. Yeah. In 262 00:18:38,440 --> 00:18:42,439 Speaker 1: another small act of rebellion, um, Mercedes does bring some 263 00:18:42,520 --> 00:18:45,440 Speaker 1: food and rations out to the rebels. Um. A little 264 00:18:45,440 --> 00:18:49,000 Speaker 1: bit of disobedience in there. Yeah, some cheese, some brandies 265 00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:53,440 Speaker 1: and tobacco. And there are several scenes that I personally 266 00:18:53,440 --> 00:18:56,960 Speaker 1: thought was like, oh, this is uh something where it 267 00:18:57,160 --> 00:18:59,399 Speaker 1: felt to me where I was picking up on, like 268 00:18:59,440 --> 00:19:02,080 Speaker 1: the dangers of cooking, Like especially with Mercedes. She has 269 00:19:02,119 --> 00:19:03,879 Speaker 1: this knife and she keeps like wiping it off in 270 00:19:03,880 --> 00:19:06,720 Speaker 1: her apron. I was like, Oh, that's gonna that's gonna 271 00:19:06,800 --> 00:19:15,000 Speaker 1: come back. It's a Chekhov's pairing knife for share still um. Yeah. 272 00:19:15,080 --> 00:19:17,840 Speaker 1: And then like there's a lot of stuff that felt 273 00:19:17,920 --> 00:19:22,439 Speaker 1: evocative to me around like the death around cooking when 274 00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:25,159 Speaker 1: it comes to cooking meat or preparing meat, or the 275 00:19:25,600 --> 00:19:28,080 Speaker 1: flip side of kind of the life giving you know, 276 00:19:28,160 --> 00:19:32,439 Speaker 1: you killed this animal, but it's feeding people. Um. And 277 00:19:32,440 --> 00:19:34,800 Speaker 1: the same with milk, Like there's a pretty particular scene 278 00:19:34,800 --> 00:19:38,600 Speaker 1: where Mercedes is milking a cow and I was like, 279 00:19:39,280 --> 00:19:42,160 Speaker 1: there's a reason this was put in here. Yeah. Yeah, 280 00:19:42,320 --> 00:19:45,600 Speaker 1: and giving the milk directly to Ophelia and and it 281 00:19:45,760 --> 00:19:49,439 Speaker 1: being a very um kind of warm and comfortable and 282 00:19:49,560 --> 00:19:57,640 Speaker 1: earthy moment. M yeah. Um. The meanwhile, the fun himself 283 00:19:57,720 --> 00:20:00,600 Speaker 1: and and the some of the fairies are shown eating 284 00:20:00,920 --> 00:20:04,960 Speaker 1: as well. Uh, they eat this little scrap of jerky 285 00:20:05,520 --> 00:20:09,679 Speaker 1: that looks real gross and real suspect to me. I'm like, 286 00:20:09,840 --> 00:20:15,280 Speaker 1: is that made of people? Like? What kind of tearing 287 00:20:15,280 --> 00:20:19,439 Speaker 1: at it? Pretty savagely? I'm like, M And I did 288 00:20:19,640 --> 00:20:22,119 Speaker 1: enjoy that aspect of this movie, of the kind of 289 00:20:23,119 --> 00:20:26,560 Speaker 1: because so many fairy tales we grow up with are 290 00:20:26,640 --> 00:20:28,800 Speaker 1: the disneyfied version, and when you go back to the original, 291 00:20:28,920 --> 00:20:31,520 Speaker 1: you're like, oh um, and I feel like this was 292 00:20:31,560 --> 00:20:34,200 Speaker 1: kind of going back to like, oh yeah, fairies maybe 293 00:20:34,200 --> 00:20:38,080 Speaker 1: they eat people. I don't know, yeh, scary, watch out. 294 00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:40,920 Speaker 1: They might be lying to you. You're not sure, Yes, 295 00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:46,119 Speaker 1: something could be going on. We're speaking of one of 296 00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:48,840 Speaker 1: the key pieces of food or not. It's not really food, 297 00:20:48,840 --> 00:20:51,840 Speaker 1: but something that requires food in this is the man 298 00:20:51,920 --> 00:20:56,879 Speaker 1: Jake root Um that Fawn gives Ophelia in order to 299 00:20:56,960 --> 00:21:00,600 Speaker 1: heal her pregnant mother, and so Apphilia puts the under 300 00:21:00,600 --> 00:21:04,200 Speaker 1: her mother's bed and she feeds it like drops the 301 00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:10,439 Speaker 1: blood and milk. However, when her stepfather discovers it, he 302 00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:14,119 Speaker 1: is disgusted. Um. He goes to destroy it, but before 303 00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:17,159 Speaker 1: he can, Affiliate's mother convinces him like, give us a 304 00:21:17,160 --> 00:21:21,280 Speaker 1: moment alone, and she tells Aphilia essentially the real world 305 00:21:21,400 --> 00:21:26,560 Speaker 1: isn't fair and magic isn't real. And then she throws 306 00:21:26,600 --> 00:21:29,840 Speaker 1: the magic root into the fire and collapses in pain 307 00:21:29,880 --> 00:21:34,120 Speaker 1: as it burns, as if she's somehow connected to it. Uh. 308 00:21:34,119 --> 00:21:37,560 Speaker 1: And that kind of struck me, as this conversation we've 309 00:21:37,600 --> 00:21:40,600 Speaker 1: had before of like looking down on these on traditional, 310 00:21:41,800 --> 00:21:45,080 Speaker 1: long trusted remedies where they just are me like, oh, 311 00:21:45,119 --> 00:21:49,000 Speaker 1: this is gross, this is wrong. Um, yeah, this isn't modern. 312 00:21:49,160 --> 00:21:54,840 Speaker 1: It must be incorrect and silly. Yeah. And it was 313 00:21:54,920 --> 00:21:58,439 Speaker 1: just heartbreaking to have this where Philia is trying to 314 00:21:58,440 --> 00:22:04,560 Speaker 1: help her mom and be told like the real world sucks, 315 00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:10,000 Speaker 1: magic isn't real. Yeah, suck it up, Yeah you need 316 00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:12,240 Speaker 1: you need to grow up because this is never going 317 00:22:12,280 --> 00:22:17,520 Speaker 1: to help. Um and then kind of immediately eating her words. Um. 318 00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:20,480 Speaker 1: And that second that she destroys that thing, she starts 319 00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:24,639 Speaker 1: having a much worse time. Yes, And notably, the man 320 00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:27,040 Speaker 1: Drake does kind of look like a child, and she 321 00:22:27,440 --> 00:22:31,280 Speaker 1: a baby, and the mother is pregnant. So it's I 322 00:22:31,359 --> 00:22:39,199 Speaker 1: felt pretty symbolic on the nose, But I think this 323 00:22:39,320 --> 00:22:47,320 Speaker 1: brings us to the centerpiece. Oh yeah, the pale man's male. Um. 324 00:22:47,400 --> 00:22:50,320 Speaker 1: Yeah it is. This is a very very striking scene. 325 00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:55,560 Speaker 1: So it's like this long table in an empty room. 326 00:22:55,760 --> 00:22:59,119 Speaker 1: Other than the paleman and Affilia and her fairies in 327 00:22:59,160 --> 00:23:03,760 Speaker 1: her little hand bag and on the table are just 328 00:23:03,880 --> 00:23:07,680 Speaker 1: like all these fruits, um, all these drinks, and most 329 00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:11,399 Speaker 1: of them are in shades of red um. A lot 330 00:23:11,440 --> 00:23:17,160 Speaker 1: of them are kind of like speaking red liquid. There's 331 00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:20,200 Speaker 1: ham and bright red caviar and jello, like just all 332 00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:22,760 Speaker 1: of these like shades of pink and red. Other things 333 00:23:22,800 --> 00:23:27,320 Speaker 1: in there too, but mostly like black and rust and 334 00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:33,359 Speaker 1: red and pink as strawberries and and slices of oranges, 335 00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:38,719 Speaker 1: blackberries and raspberries, black and red currants, pomegranates and cherries, wine, 336 00:23:38,760 --> 00:23:41,480 Speaker 1: all of this stuff. Yeah. Yeah, it's like a very 337 00:23:41,680 --> 00:23:46,320 Speaker 1: saturated yeah yeah. And and and at the head of 338 00:23:46,359 --> 00:23:51,240 Speaker 1: this table is this monstrous pale man um who doesn't 339 00:23:51,280 --> 00:23:55,640 Speaker 1: seem to have any eyes, and who who is unmoving 340 00:23:56,040 --> 00:23:58,359 Speaker 1: for a large portion of the scene. And Ophelia has 341 00:23:58,400 --> 00:24:02,600 Speaker 1: been warned to not eat anything on the table, right, 342 00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:05,960 Speaker 1: And if you haven't seen this movie, you've probably seen 343 00:24:06,960 --> 00:24:11,040 Speaker 1: that's the image you've seen is the Paleman. Um. So 344 00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:17,000 Speaker 1: above this table are these frescoes that depick the Paleman 345 00:24:17,280 --> 00:24:23,440 Speaker 1: eating children. Yeah, just gobbling them right up. And so 346 00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:26,840 Speaker 1: it's it feels very clear that the meal represents temptation. 347 00:24:27,720 --> 00:24:32,639 Speaker 1: Um was specifically designed to lure in children, and especially 348 00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:34,879 Speaker 1: children who are hungry, which is something that comes up 349 00:24:34,880 --> 00:24:37,040 Speaker 1: in fairy tales all the time, of like this hunger 350 00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:41,040 Speaker 1: of children. Um. We talked about it in our Handsl 351 00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:44,400 Speaker 1: and Gretel episode, yeah, and in our Goblin Market episode. 352 00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:48,800 Speaker 1: That's right, um. But yeah, so affiliate was told like, 353 00:24:48,880 --> 00:24:50,760 Speaker 1: don't take any part of the food. It was one 354 00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:54,960 Speaker 1: of her trials. Um. But she gives in and she 355 00:24:55,040 --> 00:24:59,399 Speaker 1: eats two grapes, and I think, and a lot of 356 00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:01,840 Speaker 1: things I read it supposed to be like the Paleman's eyes. 357 00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:04,399 Speaker 1: So she eats these two grapes and then he's able 358 00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:08,080 Speaker 1: to put his eyes in his hands. I'm making a 359 00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:11,679 Speaker 1: hand gesture. You can't see, but you're Paleman. It's the 360 00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:15,479 Speaker 1: Paleman hand. I just here. He yes, he puts yeah 361 00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:18,840 Speaker 1: when when she comes in, his eyeballs are sitting on 362 00:25:18,920 --> 00:25:22,399 Speaker 1: a plate in front of him, and then he just 363 00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:24,040 Speaker 1: pops him right in the palms of his hands and 364 00:25:24,080 --> 00:25:28,040 Speaker 1: he's like, oh, I can see now. Great. Yeah. It's 365 00:25:28,040 --> 00:25:31,119 Speaker 1: almost like, you know, by giving in, by partaking in 366 00:25:31,160 --> 00:25:36,240 Speaker 1: this food which she needed and wanted, she's giving him 367 00:25:36,280 --> 00:25:38,760 Speaker 1: that power that we were talking about, that the kind 368 00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:42,080 Speaker 1: of power that food has, um and it does. This 369 00:25:42,119 --> 00:25:46,400 Speaker 1: scene does echo another scene in the real world where 370 00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:50,359 Speaker 1: the captain and his cohorts have this luxurious mean um. 371 00:25:50,400 --> 00:25:54,320 Speaker 1: They're toasting to each other um and over the whole 372 00:25:54,400 --> 00:25:58,560 Speaker 1: meal is hanging hanging over it is this suffering and 373 00:25:58,680 --> 00:26:04,200 Speaker 1: lack of food available for others as they're just like yeah, yeah, 374 00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:07,600 Speaker 1: because at that dinner, at that feast, they're discussing cutting 375 00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:10,760 Speaker 1: rations for the locals, um and like the food on 376 00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:14,680 Speaker 1: their table doesn't appear fancy, certainly not fancy the way 377 00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:18,879 Speaker 1: that the Paleman's dinner does, but um, but is very plentiful. 378 00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:22,280 Speaker 1: You know, potatoes and beans and roast chicken and red 379 00:26:22,359 --> 00:26:29,560 Speaker 1: wine and those two rabbits roasted yep. That really that 380 00:26:29,680 --> 00:26:36,280 Speaker 1: burns yeah, um. And there is a history of using 381 00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:41,560 Speaker 1: scenes of feasting often over the top lavish beast. I 382 00:26:41,560 --> 00:26:43,880 Speaker 1: mean even like in our real world history we've talked 383 00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:47,560 Speaker 1: about that plenty, but in our fiction, like, there's so 384 00:26:47,600 --> 00:26:49,360 Speaker 1: many examples I could think of. But you have those 385 00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:52,080 Speaker 1: like gross mouth sounds. You have like the snapping of 386 00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:56,080 Speaker 1: the bones, the inhaling, the sucking sounds of like dribbling 387 00:26:56,119 --> 00:27:00,800 Speaker 1: of juices, often the juices are red. Um. And that 388 00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:05,760 Speaker 1: is juxtaposed with poverty and death um. And then also 389 00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:09,359 Speaker 1: just like depicting such a gluttonous feast as an evil temptation, 390 00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:14,760 Speaker 1: like oh this is so bad. Um. It did remind 391 00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:19,440 Speaker 1: me of the scene from Return of the King when oh, yeah, 392 00:27:19,640 --> 00:27:25,320 Speaker 1: Dennis or is like going to town feasting alone the 393 00:27:25,600 --> 00:27:31,000 Speaker 1: sounds and the juices, and it's like cut against his 394 00:27:31,119 --> 00:27:36,280 Speaker 1: soldiers going out to die. Well he's just eating, consuming 395 00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:42,560 Speaker 1: yeah mm hmm. And then I I thought a lot 396 00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:45,920 Speaker 1: of really in depth essays about those that fascinated me. 397 00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:50,600 Speaker 1: But kind of the whole idea of like in this 398 00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:55,119 Speaker 1: movie of losing affilia, losing her innocence and this fairy 399 00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:58,120 Speaker 1: tale kind of being, you know, her childhood innocence, trying 400 00:27:58,119 --> 00:28:01,359 Speaker 1: to hang onto that and then it getting destroyed and 401 00:28:01,440 --> 00:28:05,320 Speaker 1: when the Paleman, after she eats two of the grapes 402 00:28:05,359 --> 00:28:09,680 Speaker 1: at this feast, he takes two of the fairies um 403 00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:14,600 Speaker 1: that she has with her and eats them really girly. Yeah. Yeah, 404 00:28:14,680 --> 00:28:17,320 Speaker 1: And it just felt like that was a key moment 405 00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:23,160 Speaker 1: of Oh, you made this mistake and and you're going 406 00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:29,000 Speaker 1: to lose this piece like childhood innocence maybe. Um. Yeah, 407 00:28:29,040 --> 00:28:33,120 Speaker 1: Like the evils are real, you are not safe. This 408 00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:39,360 Speaker 1: is what reality is like, um. And the I would 409 00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:43,920 Speaker 1: say that the Paleman himself is a really terrifying depiction 410 00:28:44,120 --> 00:28:48,960 Speaker 1: of hunger. Um. You know, he either can't or won't 411 00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:52,000 Speaker 1: eat this feast that's in front of him, but instead 412 00:28:52,520 --> 00:28:56,640 Speaker 1: waits for children or for fairies to to devour um. 413 00:28:56,920 --> 00:29:00,320 Speaker 1: And and and like physically he's got this fatty skin 414 00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:03,480 Speaker 1: that's hanging in loose folds all over his body, but 415 00:29:03,520 --> 00:29:05,960 Speaker 1: the rest of his body is so thin, so like 416 00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:14,280 Speaker 1: impossibly emaciated, with this swollen belly. And oh, it's it's 417 00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:18,920 Speaker 1: really upsetting. Good show, good show, everyone involved, Good show. 418 00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:24,880 Speaker 1: Doug Jones, terrifying, sir, Yes, yes, I am scared. You 419 00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:28,440 Speaker 1: have done an excellent job. Yeah, that's the actor who 420 00:29:28,520 --> 00:29:31,640 Speaker 1: was portraying the fawn and also or the movements of 421 00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:36,440 Speaker 1: the fawn and the paleman. Yeah, and then I guess 422 00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:40,760 Speaker 1: we need to talk about grapes. Yeah, yeah, because because 423 00:29:40,760 --> 00:29:44,080 Speaker 1: why because why grapes? Right? Like, you know, there's this 424 00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:49,880 Speaker 1: table is just bursting with like towering pies and and 425 00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:55,000 Speaker 1: roasted squash and rested crabs, that ham that studded with 426 00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:58,320 Speaker 1: the pineapples and the cherries. Um, but it's these grapes. 427 00:29:58,360 --> 00:30:01,640 Speaker 1: There's this platter of this red fruit with right the 428 00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:05,040 Speaker 1: cut up and pomegranates and and these grapes and they're 429 00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:08,640 Speaker 1: they're huge, and they're cold. You can tell because there's 430 00:30:08,720 --> 00:30:13,479 Speaker 1: they're the kind of sweating and she just can't resist them. Yeah. 431 00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:18,160 Speaker 1: And I feel like the use of grapes just brings 432 00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:22,080 Speaker 1: up so much for me. Um. But you know, like 433 00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:25,719 Speaker 1: the temptation of the forbidden fruit um back and all. 434 00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:27,000 Speaker 1: I feel like a lot of times when I think 435 00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:31,560 Speaker 1: of grapes, I see those kind of Greek paintings where 436 00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:34,600 Speaker 1: gods or angels or whatever what have you are eating 437 00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:39,880 Speaker 1: grapes and it's painted as like so luxurious, so luxurious, 438 00:30:40,440 --> 00:30:44,200 Speaker 1: someone will feed them to you, like just the height 439 00:30:45,080 --> 00:30:50,000 Speaker 1: of of luxury. Um. And then I do think fruit 440 00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:53,720 Speaker 1: is often used in fairy tales, like you have the 441 00:30:53,720 --> 00:30:58,120 Speaker 1: poisoned apples of snow white, just for one example. Um. 442 00:30:58,200 --> 00:30:59,800 Speaker 1: And then again a lot of people have written about 443 00:30:59,800 --> 00:31:02,600 Speaker 1: how this also represents a loss of innocence. And I 444 00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:07,160 Speaker 1: found a specific paper that was about menstruation. So I 445 00:31:07,240 --> 00:31:09,480 Speaker 1: was like, well, I guess I'll come back later for 446 00:31:09,720 --> 00:31:11,720 Speaker 1: stuff I never told you. I don't think this is 447 00:31:11,720 --> 00:31:18,320 Speaker 1: a savor rabbit hole, but I'll come back. Um. But yeah, yeah, 448 00:31:18,560 --> 00:31:22,080 Speaker 1: it was interesting. And the way it was shot, Aphilia 449 00:31:22,280 --> 00:31:24,680 Speaker 1: was looking she wasn't looking at the paleman. The fairies 450 00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:27,400 Speaker 1: are telling her like don't, don't do it, don't do it, 451 00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:31,600 Speaker 1: and she's eating them, and just like she's a child 452 00:31:31,960 --> 00:31:35,080 Speaker 1: and she yeah, she is a kid, and she probably 453 00:31:35,120 --> 00:31:38,040 Speaker 1: hasn't had something I mean, like fresh fruit in that 454 00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:42,720 Speaker 1: kind of situation is luxurious. It is a special treat. 455 00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:46,080 Speaker 1: And and especially you know, like like like thinking about 456 00:31:46,400 --> 00:31:50,600 Speaker 1: refrigeration and how how rare that was in those days 457 00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:53,440 Speaker 1: and especially in in lean times when you know, you 458 00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:56,320 Speaker 1: don't always have power everywhere and stuff like that, and 459 00:31:56,360 --> 00:31:59,240 Speaker 1: so like she probably hadn't had something that sounds as 460 00:31:59,280 --> 00:32:04,400 Speaker 1: simple as we're rigerated grape in years maybe in her 461 00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:07,800 Speaker 1: whole life, because she's eleven years old, it's only five 462 00:32:07,880 --> 00:32:11,200 Speaker 1: years after the war ended. You know, like like she 463 00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:13,880 Speaker 1: probably doesn't remember a time before war. She probably doesn't 464 00:32:13,920 --> 00:32:18,800 Speaker 1: remember a time when she had as much fruit as 465 00:32:18,840 --> 00:32:22,440 Speaker 1: she wanted to eat. Yeah. Yeah, And I always said 466 00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:26,600 Speaker 1: this earlier, but that to me goes back to that 467 00:32:26,680 --> 00:32:29,680 Speaker 1: point of like, if you're controlling the food, then you 468 00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:34,240 Speaker 1: have the power. Because when she ate the grapes, she 469 00:32:34,400 --> 00:32:38,200 Speaker 1: was hungry, she was a child, but in doing so, 470 00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:43,000 Speaker 1: she did give or power was taken from her and 471 00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:45,840 Speaker 1: it made the pale man like wake up, he's able 472 00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:49,800 Speaker 1: to see um. So I just think like that whole 473 00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:56,400 Speaker 1: idea of if you are the one controlling like who 474 00:32:56,440 --> 00:33:01,880 Speaker 1: gets food, how much food, then it's like we can't 475 00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:06,480 Speaker 1: blame her for not being able to resist, right But yeah, yeah, 476 00:33:06,920 --> 00:33:09,520 Speaker 1: even you know, even though we've seen her do um 477 00:33:09,600 --> 00:33:15,480 Speaker 1: incredibly brave, selfless things for for the rest of the film, 478 00:33:15,520 --> 00:33:18,280 Speaker 1: you know, in that in that moment, she was just 479 00:33:18,320 --> 00:33:23,080 Speaker 1: a hungry kid, and you know, and it's not it's 480 00:33:23,120 --> 00:33:30,840 Speaker 1: not evil, It was just used against her. Yeah yeah, yeah, 481 00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:36,120 Speaker 1: the whole film really is about you know, innocence, um 482 00:33:36,200 --> 00:33:41,200 Speaker 1: and and and evil and about bravery. Yeah, the bravery 483 00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:44,800 Speaker 1: to do the right thing, even when that's going to 484 00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:48,160 Speaker 1: cause some trouble for you, even when you have direct 485 00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:53,080 Speaker 1: orders to do the wrong thing. Um. And and that's 486 00:33:53,120 --> 00:33:56,000 Speaker 1: just a really clear example of that of that type 487 00:33:56,040 --> 00:34:02,360 Speaker 1: of metaphorical visual It's also a story about stories, about 488 00:34:02,400 --> 00:34:07,880 Speaker 1: the power of stories, and how the same way that 489 00:34:07,880 --> 00:34:11,880 Speaker 1: an authoritarian will try to control you through hunger, they'll 490 00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:16,600 Speaker 1: try to control the narrative and who gets to narrate um. 491 00:34:16,640 --> 00:34:19,280 Speaker 1: And you see that again and again through this film 492 00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:23,160 Speaker 1: about you know, Aphelia's mother fretting that she's wasting too 493 00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:26,320 Speaker 1: much time reading books and thinking about fairy tales and 494 00:34:26,360 --> 00:34:28,640 Speaker 1: that it's not realistic and that she needs to grow 495 00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:31,640 Speaker 1: up and um. At that at that feast in the 496 00:34:31,640 --> 00:34:36,520 Speaker 1: real world, you see the captain speaking down to Aphelia's mother. 497 00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:39,439 Speaker 1: She she tries to tell this kind of romantic story 498 00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:42,880 Speaker 1: about how they got together and uh, and he mocks her. 499 00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:45,680 Speaker 1: He goes, he turns to the ladies who are there, 500 00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:49,120 Speaker 1: and he's like, man, she's isn't she so quaint? Like 501 00:34:49,200 --> 00:34:51,760 Speaker 1: she really thinks that this kind of thing is amusing? 502 00:34:52,160 --> 00:34:56,000 Speaker 1: Isn't that adorable? Um? And then when someone else at 503 00:34:56,000 --> 00:34:59,240 Speaker 1: the dinner proceeds to tell kind of a story about 504 00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:03,200 Speaker 1: the captain's father about how he died, the captain denies it, 505 00:35:03,880 --> 00:35:09,160 Speaker 1: even though he clearly this is clearly exactly what happened. Um, 506 00:35:09,200 --> 00:35:12,040 Speaker 1: that that his father died at a certain time and 507 00:35:12,080 --> 00:35:15,440 Speaker 1: broke his watch, and you know, had instructions for the 508 00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:17,359 Speaker 1: watch to be given to his sons, that he would 509 00:35:17,360 --> 00:35:20,240 Speaker 1: always know what time his father died. And he carries 510 00:35:20,280 --> 00:35:22,040 Speaker 1: around this heck and watch the whole movie and is 511 00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:26,600 Speaker 1: obsessed with it, and um, and the last thing that 512 00:35:26,640 --> 00:35:29,600 Speaker 1: he does, because good good does win in the end, 513 00:35:29,680 --> 00:35:33,239 Speaker 1: really and in both the fairy tale and the in 514 00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:36,600 Speaker 1: the real world in this film, the last thing that 515 00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:41,919 Speaker 1: the captain does is asked that the rebels give his son, 516 00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:45,759 Speaker 1: the baby boy, I Philey's little brother, this watch and 517 00:35:45,800 --> 00:35:48,920 Speaker 1: tell him who his father was and what time he died. 518 00:35:49,360 --> 00:35:52,200 Speaker 1: And the rebels cut him off and they're just like, yeah, 519 00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:55,759 Speaker 1: he ain't even going to know your name, and that's it. 520 00:35:56,520 --> 00:35:59,040 Speaker 1: And that and I love I love that. I love 521 00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:04,400 Speaker 1: that they have, you know, reseased the means of narration. 522 00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:08,680 Speaker 1: They've reseized the means of production of food, of of 523 00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:14,440 Speaker 1: welfare m Yeah, it's it's really really good. And we 524 00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:17,720 Speaker 1: didn't even talk about um because I was also struck 525 00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:21,200 Speaker 1: by the captain gets the slash on his face and 526 00:36:21,239 --> 00:36:26,880 Speaker 1: he keeps trying to drink oh um, and it clearly 527 00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:32,239 Speaker 1: hurts him. Uh, and he keeps trying to keeps drinking alcohol. Yeah, 528 00:36:33,080 --> 00:36:36,839 Speaker 1: whiskey or brandy or something like that. And oh, it's 529 00:36:36,880 --> 00:36:43,360 Speaker 1: so it's so annarly it really is. Um. That was 530 00:36:43,400 --> 00:36:46,520 Speaker 1: the thing that very much struck me that this this 531 00:36:46,680 --> 00:36:50,960 Speaker 1: go through is how how gory things get in the 532 00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:55,640 Speaker 1: real world, and how even though things are scary and 533 00:36:56,760 --> 00:37:01,319 Speaker 1: the in the fairytale world there, they're never I don't know, 534 00:37:01,400 --> 00:37:04,960 Speaker 1: just just that that that um, that juxtaposition between the 535 00:37:05,000 --> 00:37:08,239 Speaker 1: horror of fairy tales and the horror of getting your 536 00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:10,359 Speaker 1: face slashed open and trying to sew it back up 537 00:37:10,400 --> 00:37:14,640 Speaker 1: yourself like that so wild. Oh I don't think I've 538 00:37:14,680 --> 00:37:22,920 Speaker 1: ever seen anything like that on the film before. Heck. Um, yeah, 539 00:37:23,040 --> 00:37:25,719 Speaker 1: it's it's it's really if you if you haven't seen it, 540 00:37:25,760 --> 00:37:28,360 Speaker 1: we've just spoiled like the whole movie for you. So sorry. 541 00:37:28,400 --> 00:37:33,440 Speaker 1: But but maybe if you have seen it and uh, 542 00:37:33,680 --> 00:37:36,480 Speaker 1: you know, want to be kind of upset but also dazzled. 543 00:37:37,880 --> 00:37:45,960 Speaker 1: You know, give it a revisit. I love it, great review? Yes, yes, yes, 544 00:37:46,360 --> 00:37:49,600 Speaker 1: Uh do you recommend it? I feel like we've gave 545 00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:53,360 Speaker 1: it enough of a warning that it's kind of a downer. 546 00:37:53,560 --> 00:37:57,480 Speaker 1: That sounds tright, but essentially it does. I don't know, 547 00:37:57,760 --> 00:38:00,359 Speaker 1: it's I think it's I think it's hopeful in the end. 548 00:38:00,400 --> 00:38:02,439 Speaker 1: I think it's hopeful that there are good people who 549 00:38:02,440 --> 00:38:06,000 Speaker 1: are willing to do good things and help each other out. Yes, 550 00:38:06,080 --> 00:38:10,480 Speaker 1: and that I think also that your small actions can 551 00:38:10,520 --> 00:38:14,280 Speaker 1: mean so much more than you thought that they did. Yeah, definitely, 552 00:38:15,680 --> 00:38:18,120 Speaker 1: before we go, um or, I mean, we have some 553 00:38:18,200 --> 00:38:20,480 Speaker 1: listener mail for you, but before we before we get 554 00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:22,640 Speaker 1: into that, Annie, I want to ask you, do you 555 00:38:23,280 --> 00:38:28,560 Speaker 1: think that the fairy tale world in this film is real? 556 00:38:29,600 --> 00:38:35,600 Speaker 1: Or do you think Ophelia was making it up? I okay, 557 00:38:36,000 --> 00:38:38,720 Speaker 1: my knees, my knees, jerk. Answer is, I've always assumed 558 00:38:38,760 --> 00:38:41,960 Speaker 1: it was real. Um, and I think that's the way 559 00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:46,120 Speaker 1: that it was shot and the way that was done. Um. 560 00:38:46,280 --> 00:38:50,600 Speaker 1: I'd never had considered before that maybe she was making 561 00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:52,080 Speaker 1: it up. I don't want to say just making it, 562 00:38:52,200 --> 00:38:56,040 Speaker 1: but you know, like sure, this escape, I always thought 563 00:38:56,040 --> 00:38:59,799 Speaker 1: it was real. I thought it was real too, and 564 00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:03,360 Speaker 1: and I guess I guess rewatching it, there are just 565 00:39:03,440 --> 00:39:05,960 Speaker 1: a couple of little hints where um where like um, 566 00:39:06,000 --> 00:39:10,960 Speaker 1: like the captain can't see the fawn or where You're 567 00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:14,040 Speaker 1: not sure, And Ophelia had this this magic chalk from 568 00:39:14,040 --> 00:39:16,160 Speaker 1: the fond that could let her open a door to 569 00:39:16,239 --> 00:39:20,360 Speaker 1: wherever she wanted to go. And uh, and Mercedes sees 570 00:39:20,640 --> 00:39:23,239 Speaker 1: one of these chalk outlines, but it's just a chalk 571 00:39:23,239 --> 00:39:27,000 Speaker 1: outline that's there's no door there. But then there are 572 00:39:27,040 --> 00:39:31,120 Speaker 1: other hints yeah where um, you know, I don't know, 573 00:39:31,320 --> 00:39:36,799 Speaker 1: like like where did she get that man Drake Root? Uh? Uh? 574 00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:41,319 Speaker 1: You know she it seems very big for such a 575 00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:44,359 Speaker 1: small child to have come up with. Um, And I did. 576 00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:47,840 Speaker 1: I did read an interview with del Toro where he's 577 00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:50,759 Speaker 1: talking about how that that is his intent that it was, 578 00:39:51,280 --> 00:39:55,560 Speaker 1: that it was real, and so I don't know. I 579 00:39:55,600 --> 00:39:58,640 Speaker 1: was just I'm just curious. I I think watching it, 580 00:39:58,719 --> 00:40:01,640 Speaker 1: I really hoped that it was real and was really 581 00:40:01,680 --> 00:40:08,000 Speaker 1: afraid that it wasn't. Yeah. Yeah, again, like I think 582 00:40:08,040 --> 00:40:10,560 Speaker 1: the way that the the narrative was set up, the 583 00:40:10,600 --> 00:40:12,759 Speaker 1: way it was shot, you were at least for me, 584 00:40:12,800 --> 00:40:15,640 Speaker 1: I was primed to be like, yeah, that's what's happening. 585 00:40:18,320 --> 00:40:28,040 Speaker 1: I believe her over this guy certainly. Well, I think 586 00:40:28,040 --> 00:40:31,759 Speaker 1: that's what we have to say about Pan's labyrinth for now. 587 00:40:32,560 --> 00:40:36,720 Speaker 1: I think it is. We do have some, as Afford mentioned, 588 00:40:36,760 --> 00:40:39,359 Speaker 1: listener mail for you, but first we've got one more 589 00:40:39,440 --> 00:40:52,319 Speaker 1: quick break for a word from our sponsors, and we're back. 590 00:40:52,360 --> 00:40:55,759 Speaker 1: Thank you sponsoring, Yes, thank you, and we're back with 591 00:40:56,280 --> 00:41:07,200 Speaker 1: the snow like a mace. Ah. That was That was 592 00:41:07,239 --> 00:41:10,839 Speaker 1: when we should have recorded. Well, one day you'll get 593 00:41:10,840 --> 00:41:14,000 Speaker 1: the video of what's going on behind news, whether you 594 00:41:14,040 --> 00:41:20,800 Speaker 1: want it or not. Oh goodness, um, Andrew wrote a 595 00:41:20,880 --> 00:41:23,600 Speaker 1: long time, long time. Thanks again for always bringing a 596 00:41:23,600 --> 00:41:26,759 Speaker 1: little sunshine into my day. Lately my podcast have been 597 00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:30,680 Speaker 1: the audio equivalent of doomscrolling. So I very much appreciate 598 00:41:30,719 --> 00:41:33,600 Speaker 1: your show. Wow this episode, I don't know, but thank you, 599 00:41:36,280 --> 00:41:39,320 Speaker 1: Andrew continues. I'm a few weeks behind and just listened 600 00:41:39,320 --> 00:41:42,480 Speaker 1: to your Dill episode and had two thoughts. Lauren made 601 00:41:42,520 --> 00:41:44,160 Speaker 1: mention of Ukraine at the top of the show, and 602 00:41:44,200 --> 00:41:47,240 Speaker 1: I was immediately reminded of a nearby brewery that recently 603 00:41:47,239 --> 00:41:49,600 Speaker 1: released a beer in support of Ukraine. It was on 604 00:41:49,640 --> 00:41:52,680 Speaker 1: the lighter side and was brewed with sea salt, sunflower seeds, 605 00:41:52,760 --> 00:41:57,359 Speaker 1: and dill weird on paper, but definitely translated well into 606 00:41:57,400 --> 00:42:01,400 Speaker 1: an enjoyable beverage. Herved beers can sometimes be overwhelming, but 607 00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:05,360 Speaker 1: this one was very well balanced. However, it caused quite 608 00:42:05,480 --> 00:42:12,080 Speaker 1: the halotoxes to Peanut butter and pickle sandwiches came up 609 00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:14,640 Speaker 1: during the listener male portion of the episode. To my 610 00:42:14,760 --> 00:42:18,320 Speaker 1: abject horror, my wife actually makes peanut butter and pickles 611 00:42:18,320 --> 00:42:22,200 Speaker 1: sandwiches occasionally for her lunch or for an aftrinude snack, 612 00:42:22,239 --> 00:42:25,279 Speaker 1: and claims to enjoy them. She will smear on the 613 00:42:25,280 --> 00:42:27,879 Speaker 1: peanut butter, put a dill pickle spear on the side 614 00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:30,440 Speaker 1: of the bread, and fold it in half. She claims 615 00:42:30,480 --> 00:42:34,000 Speaker 1: the texture of the pickle adds some level of sophistication. 616 00:42:34,239 --> 00:42:37,520 Speaker 1: But I will never be touching one of those things, 617 00:42:38,560 --> 00:42:46,359 Speaker 1: all caps. Never. Oh that's that's wonderful. Yeah, I mean, 618 00:42:47,600 --> 00:42:49,359 Speaker 1: I hope this doesn't get me on your bad side, 619 00:42:49,400 --> 00:42:52,759 Speaker 1: but I feel like I could enjoy that. I mean, 620 00:42:52,880 --> 00:42:56,160 Speaker 1: I I think that you would enjoy peanut butter in 621 00:42:56,200 --> 00:42:59,920 Speaker 1: no matter. I don't think, like not even Mayo really 622 00:43:00,080 --> 00:43:07,000 Speaker 1: dissuaded you. From enjoying peanut butter. It's true. Oh oh no, 623 00:43:07,000 --> 00:43:10,680 Speaker 1: now I have a craving Oh my gosh. Okay, Luckily 624 00:43:10,680 --> 00:43:13,080 Speaker 1: I have a ton of peanut butter, not so many pickles. 625 00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:17,680 Speaker 1: But I can fix. Can you can? And this beer 626 00:43:17,719 --> 00:43:20,480 Speaker 1: sounds delightful. I think it does. It does. I don't 627 00:43:20,480 --> 00:43:23,799 Speaker 1: think I've ever had dil in a beer, but I'm 628 00:43:23,800 --> 00:43:29,200 Speaker 1: so into that. M Chad and Lauren wrote, we are 629 00:43:29,200 --> 00:43:31,160 Speaker 1: reaching out to say hi and to share some fun 630 00:43:31,200 --> 00:43:34,960 Speaker 1: tidbits from this past year's adventures and fun coincidences between 631 00:43:34,960 --> 00:43:38,719 Speaker 1: episodes and where we happened to be visiting. Uh are 632 00:43:38,719 --> 00:43:40,320 Speaker 1: reaching out has been on my to do list for 633 00:43:40,360 --> 00:43:43,480 Speaker 1: a while, but moving, starting new jobs, traveling, and celebrating 634 00:43:43,480 --> 00:43:47,080 Speaker 1: our daughter Grace's college graduation, amongst other life events, has 635 00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:49,600 Speaker 1: kept us on our toes all year. I'm on my 636 00:43:49,640 --> 00:43:52,279 Speaker 1: first work trip since and as I sit in the 637 00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:55,439 Speaker 1: hotel room awaiting my six thirty am alarm, I thought 638 00:43:55,520 --> 00:43:58,000 Speaker 1: now would be an ideal time to reach out again. 639 00:43:58,560 --> 00:44:02,160 Speaker 1: Here we go. We visited Palm Springs back in March, 640 00:44:02,239 --> 00:44:04,759 Speaker 1: and lo and behold, I listened to your episode on 641 00:44:04,840 --> 00:44:07,799 Speaker 1: date Shakes on the flight. Little did I know that 642 00:44:07,840 --> 00:44:10,799 Speaker 1: two days later would be driving through Date Valley on 643 00:44:10,840 --> 00:44:13,440 Speaker 1: our way up to um Ottle Wild and to the 644 00:44:13,480 --> 00:44:17,400 Speaker 1: pines and snow so crazy. I know the shakes are good, 645 00:44:17,440 --> 00:44:22,000 Speaker 1: but the views from the mountains were better. Uh. This summer, 646 00:44:22,120 --> 00:44:24,400 Speaker 1: we took our parents out to Sonoma and shared with 647 00:44:24,440 --> 00:44:27,840 Speaker 1: them our love for wine tasting. After surviving four days 648 00:44:27,880 --> 00:44:30,839 Speaker 1: with both sets of parents plenty of wine tasting and 649 00:44:30,960 --> 00:44:34,000 Speaker 1: catching up, we dropped them off at San Francisco Airport 650 00:44:34,120 --> 00:44:36,640 Speaker 1: and did another week of road tripping and seeing friends 651 00:44:36,640 --> 00:44:40,359 Speaker 1: from Sacramento to Los Angeles. During one of those long, 652 00:44:40,400 --> 00:44:42,960 Speaker 1: crazy drives in the Central Valley, we listened to your 653 00:44:43,000 --> 00:44:47,120 Speaker 1: episode about Pismo clans and the Monterey Clan industry. Two 654 00:44:47,200 --> 00:44:49,799 Speaker 1: days later we were in Monterey Bay. We had a 655 00:44:49,880 --> 00:44:52,239 Speaker 1: marvelous lunch on the pier at sand Bar and Grill, 656 00:44:52,560 --> 00:44:55,360 Speaker 1: saw some sea lions, found my new favorite hot sauce, 657 00:44:55,680 --> 00:44:58,839 Speaker 1: the pepper plant. The stuff is amazing, go buy some. 658 00:44:59,360 --> 00:45:01,759 Speaker 1: I cannot eve recall when we were listening to your 659 00:45:01,800 --> 00:45:04,560 Speaker 1: episode on jerk Chicken, but regardless, it brought back a 660 00:45:04,640 --> 00:45:07,359 Speaker 1: rush of memories of finding the best jerk chicken cart 661 00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:10,000 Speaker 1: in New York City, Oh, which I did. It's on 662 00:45:10,160 --> 00:45:13,320 Speaker 1: fifty six and third Avenue and the chicken with oxtail, 663 00:45:13,360 --> 00:45:16,440 Speaker 1: gravy and rice is the best cart food I've ever had. 664 00:45:17,080 --> 00:45:19,160 Speaker 1: Now that I remind myself it's been five years since 665 00:45:19,200 --> 00:45:21,400 Speaker 1: I last ate some I need to make time to 666 00:45:21,440 --> 00:45:24,280 Speaker 1: get back there and see if they're still there. Also, 667 00:45:24,360 --> 00:45:27,440 Speaker 1: Happy one Day Early, Happy Jerk Chicken Day. It's now 668 00:45:27,440 --> 00:45:30,160 Speaker 1: on my calendar because of YouTube, and no, I did 669 00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:35,440 Speaker 1: not plan on this timing. Another episode that spurned of 670 00:45:35,600 --> 00:45:39,240 Speaker 1: food experience is when Annie waxed poetic about butter beans 671 00:45:39,600 --> 00:45:42,080 Speaker 1: and I was like, wait, we eat those pretty regularly 672 00:45:42,160 --> 00:45:44,640 Speaker 1: thanks to Rancho Gordo. And I just happened to listen 673 00:45:44,680 --> 00:45:46,400 Speaker 1: when I was in the mood to make some hummus 674 00:45:46,680 --> 00:45:50,480 Speaker 1: lo and behold, butter bean hummus was now in our bellies. 675 00:45:50,880 --> 00:45:53,919 Speaker 1: Those lagoons make even better hummus than dare I say, 676 00:45:54,000 --> 00:45:58,440 Speaker 1: garbonzo beans And well, you don't have an episode on 677 00:45:58,440 --> 00:46:00,520 Speaker 1: it yet, but if you are in search of a 678 00:46:00,600 --> 00:46:03,560 Speaker 1: road trip and want to research bourbonism, you need to 679 00:46:03,640 --> 00:46:06,600 Speaker 1: head to Louisville. I hope it's on your radar, and 680 00:46:06,640 --> 00:46:09,160 Speaker 1: if not, I'm happy to write another diet tribe worth 681 00:46:09,200 --> 00:46:13,040 Speaker 1: of info about the city. The food and of course bourbon. 682 00:46:13,560 --> 00:46:16,120 Speaker 1: Thanks for sticking with me making great shows, and I 683 00:46:16,160 --> 00:46:19,400 Speaker 1: do apologize for the long winded email. Plus we are 684 00:46:19,440 --> 00:46:22,080 Speaker 1: back in Atlanta later in November to see friends and 685 00:46:22,120 --> 00:46:24,880 Speaker 1: eat our way through more of the amazing restaurants on 686 00:46:24,920 --> 00:46:29,279 Speaker 1: Annie's map. Thanks again for sharing ya. I'm glad that 687 00:46:29,400 --> 00:46:36,560 Speaker 1: map is getting oh always yeah, yeah, goodness, that's a 688 00:46:36,600 --> 00:46:40,920 Speaker 1: great map. Um oh heck okay, Uh, congratulations on your 689 00:46:40,960 --> 00:46:46,360 Speaker 1: daughter's college graduations. Heck yeah um oh. Palm Springs is 690 00:46:46,400 --> 00:46:54,279 Speaker 1: such a weird city. Yeah, I love that entire area. Um, 691 00:46:54,320 --> 00:46:58,200 Speaker 1: I have not been out to like northern California and 692 00:46:58,320 --> 00:47:01,800 Speaker 1: way too long. Yeah, we need to fix that. Yeah, 693 00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:05,040 Speaker 1: that's high on the list. High on the list, it is. 694 00:47:05,080 --> 00:47:06,560 Speaker 1: We also had a funny moment where we're like, have 695 00:47:06,640 --> 00:47:09,480 Speaker 1: we done an episode on clams? We haven't done one, 696 00:47:09,560 --> 00:47:14,400 Speaker 1: but we have talked about them in another episode. But 697 00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:17,000 Speaker 1: this is a classic battle Or and I have. We're 698 00:47:17,040 --> 00:47:21,360 Speaker 1: always like, did we do that episode already? Yeah? Or 699 00:47:21,600 --> 00:47:24,880 Speaker 1: We'll be twenty minutes into doing reading for an episode 700 00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:26,960 Speaker 1: that both of us are convinced we've never done, and 701 00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:29,279 Speaker 1: then we suddenly realized that we have done it because 702 00:47:29,320 --> 00:47:30,840 Speaker 1: we're coming up with all of these links that we 703 00:47:30,880 --> 00:47:33,279 Speaker 1: already have book marked, Like, there's no way I would 704 00:47:33,320 --> 00:47:40,319 Speaker 1: have read this earlier. Right, maybe if anyone knows about 705 00:47:40,360 --> 00:47:45,319 Speaker 1: this jerk chicken cart right in, we could confirm her network. Yes, 706 00:47:46,080 --> 00:47:50,000 Speaker 1: give us an updates. Always so good, always so easy. 707 00:47:50,120 --> 00:47:53,640 Speaker 1: I always forget. I know, I've had a homeless craving lately. 708 00:47:55,320 --> 00:47:59,520 Speaker 1: Also we haven't been so I always get in trouble 709 00:47:59,560 --> 00:48:01,880 Speaker 1: for this. I can't remember its Louisville. I don't know 710 00:48:01,920 --> 00:48:04,560 Speaker 1: how to say it. But anyway, but we didn't go 711 00:48:04,719 --> 00:48:11,759 Speaker 1: to Kentucky and drink some whiskey. Yes, we went and 712 00:48:11,840 --> 00:48:16,880 Speaker 1: we got to talk with Eddie Russell and um a 713 00:48:17,160 --> 00:48:21,200 Speaker 1: he was delightful. Uh and be Yeah, we we did. 714 00:48:21,280 --> 00:48:24,359 Speaker 1: Um we did like a like a roundup of some 715 00:48:24,440 --> 00:48:26,919 Speaker 1: of the food that we enjoyed while we were there, 716 00:48:27,360 --> 00:48:31,359 Speaker 1: including hot brown Am I saying the right thing? I think? 717 00:48:31,440 --> 00:48:34,320 Speaker 1: So there was a lot. It was very good, but 718 00:48:34,400 --> 00:48:37,719 Speaker 1: it was a lot of food. Yeah, so much food 719 00:48:37,760 --> 00:48:44,000 Speaker 1: all the time. They're it was wonderful. Um so yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 720 00:48:43,800 --> 00:48:45,640 Speaker 1: That was that was in the early days. That was 721 00:48:46,440 --> 00:48:49,080 Speaker 1: way back, way back. That was when I was still 722 00:48:49,160 --> 00:48:54,560 Speaker 1: driving around everywhere. Oh my goodness, times of change, listeners, 723 00:48:55,360 --> 00:49:01,360 Speaker 1: times have changed, Frenny, Yes, Um, thank you, thank you. 724 00:49:01,400 --> 00:49:03,960 Speaker 1: Thank you to both of these listeners for writing in. 725 00:49:04,440 --> 00:49:06,200 Speaker 1: If you would like to write to us that you 726 00:49:06,239 --> 00:49:09,279 Speaker 1: can our email us hello at savor pod dot com. 727 00:49:09,440 --> 00:49:12,680 Speaker 1: We're also on social media. You can find us on Twitter, Facebook, 728 00:49:12,680 --> 00:49:15,239 Speaker 1: and Instagram at savor pod and we do hope to 729 00:49:15,280 --> 00:49:18,000 Speaker 1: hear from you. Savor is a production of I Heart Radio. 730 00:49:18,160 --> 00:49:20,359 Speaker 1: For more podcasts from my heart Radio, you can visit 731 00:49:20,400 --> 00:49:23,040 Speaker 1: the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you 732 00:49:23,120 --> 00:49:25,560 Speaker 1: listen to your favorite shows. Thanks as always to our 733 00:49:25,560 --> 00:49:28,480 Speaker 1: super producers Dylan Fagin and Andrew Howard. Thanks to you 734 00:49:28,560 --> 00:49:30,399 Speaker 1: for listening, and we hope that lots more good things 735 00:49:30,480 --> 00:49:31,279 Speaker 1: are coming your way