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Speaker 1: Welcome to How the Money. I'm Joel and I am Matt.

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Speaker 1: Today we're talking how to tackle your student loans with

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Speaker 1: Lauren Williams. Today on the show, we're talking with gold

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Speaker 1: medal winning Certified Financial Planner Lauren Williams. Uh, and I'm

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Speaker 1: being serious. She is an Olympic athlete and is the

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Speaker 1: first American woman to medal in both the Summer and

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Speaker 1: Winter Olympic Games. And that's super cool and we're excited

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Speaker 1: to have Lauren's share about that here in a bit. So, Lauren,

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Speaker 1: she's a CFP, she's won gold as an Olympic athlete.

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Speaker 1: And Lauren is also a Certified Student Loan Professional a

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Speaker 1: c s LP, so she has a high level of

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Speaker 1: expertise in all things student loans, especially when it comes

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Speaker 1: to forbearing student loan forgiveness, the different income based repayment plans.

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Speaker 1: So we're looking forward to talking about that with you today. Lauren,

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Speaker 1: let's go ahead and dive right in. Thank you for

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Speaker 1: joining us today on the podcast. I am so excited

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Speaker 1: to chat with you all. I think we are going

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Speaker 1: to have a blast. Oh yeah, it's gonna be a

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Speaker 1: lot of fun. We're really looking forward to have this

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Speaker 1: conversation and Lauren the first question we ask everybody who

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Speaker 1: comes on the show. Matt and I we like craft beer.

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Speaker 1: We spend us what some would say a little too

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Speaker 1: much on our craft beer. Um, but we disagree because

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Speaker 1: we think it's important to spend a lot on a

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Speaker 1: few things, on the things that you really value in

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Speaker 1: life while you're saving and investing well for the future.

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Speaker 1: So we want to know from you, what is your

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Speaker 1: craft beer equivalent? What do you sport on? Oh, that

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Speaker 1: is definitely food, um, and experiences to be exact. So

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Speaker 1: you know, there's Airbnb experiences where you're allowed to like

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Speaker 1: kind of go do walking tours or food. There's underground restaurants. Um.

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Speaker 1: So I'm not just talking like I like to eat.

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Speaker 1: There's a lot of people that you know, say their

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Speaker 1: food eas etcetera. But I am definitely willing to spend

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Speaker 1: like three bucks on a meal, not blinked, not cringe

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Speaker 1: at all, and be so excited at the end of it. See,

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Speaker 1: I could never do that. I would be cringing the

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Speaker 1: whole time. Yeah, I don't think I've ever remember one

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Speaker 1: time I took my wife out. We went to this

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Speaker 1: one place and it was like eighty dollars for the

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Speaker 1: both of us to eat, and that's the most I've

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Speaker 1: ever spent on a meal. And I still think about that.

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Speaker 1: I'm like, how did we do that? So you know

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Speaker 1: a little bit, well, lord, what's like the coolest I

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Speaker 1: mean you said experience, and so does that mean like

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Speaker 1: the chef's table kind of where you're sitting there and

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Speaker 1: you know they're they're bringing you, you know what it

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Speaker 1: is they choose to bring you, Like, what's the coolest

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Speaker 1: experience that you have experienced? That is exactly the kind

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Speaker 1: of thing that I would love to do have done,

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Speaker 1: And yeah, are looking for those sorts of experiences. Another

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Speaker 1: one is, like I said, the underground restaurant. So you

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Speaker 1: basically have to find out about them via word of mouth,

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Speaker 1: get on a list, then you wait on this list,

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Speaker 1: and then you're chosen in a lottery. They give you

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Speaker 1: the location only like twenty four hours in advance, and

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Speaker 1: then you show up and you dine with others who

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Speaker 1: have been chosen, um with like some of the greatest

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Speaker 1: chefs that are around. Well, that's kind of make it

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Speaker 1: even more fun, kind of to do it with other

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Speaker 1: people who are super into it, like who have gone

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Speaker 1: through the same grueling process that you went through to

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Speaker 1: just be at that table. It's like a gorilla restaurant tour,

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Speaker 1: like basically, So I think you and my wife would

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Speaker 1: get along real well. She keeps up with a lot

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Speaker 1: of different chefs and they do like the pop ups

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Speaker 1: that's been the latest thing. Uh, and she's like, Okay, hey,

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Speaker 1: we gotta go eat here this day because they're only

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Speaker 1: gonna be there that one week, or hey, over here,

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Speaker 1: we can like order some food to go bring it home,

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Speaker 1: that kind of thing. But that's super cool. Glad to

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Speaker 1: hear that is something you're into. Lauren. We want to

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Speaker 1: talk about your story, I guess before we actually talk

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Speaker 1: about student loans and so let's kind of wind back

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Speaker 1: the clock a little bit. You were majoring in finance

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Speaker 1: at the University of Miami, but then something happened while

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Speaker 1: you were there that propelled you into a different line

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Speaker 1: of work. Essentially, can you share that experience? Yeah, you

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Speaker 1: never know where life is going to send you on

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Speaker 1: a hard left turn. Literally, that's what you do in

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Speaker 1: the track is just keep turning left. So I was

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Speaker 1: a junior in college and I ran the second fastest

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Speaker 1: time in the world at the College national Championships. It

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Speaker 1: was two thousand and four. It was the Olympic year, UM,

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Speaker 1: and so immediately I had to turn my focus from

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Speaker 1: being a junior in college to representing team USA, being

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Speaker 1: the favorite to represent team USA, UM going off to

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Speaker 1: the Olympic trials where I got third. So it took

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Speaker 1: a little bit of the pressure off but not very much,

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Speaker 1: and made my first Olympic team at twenty years old. Wow?

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Speaker 1: What mean? What was that like? That had to be?

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Speaker 1: Was it shocking? Were you expecting that? Uh? Like, were

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Speaker 1: you just expecting to kind of have a normal senior

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Speaker 1: year at college? I was. It was actually my junior year,

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Speaker 1: but I was definitely expecting to have a normal year.

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Speaker 1: All I wanted to do was be better than I

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Speaker 1: was the previous two years at the n c A Championship.

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Speaker 1: So I was fortunate enough to have made it to

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Speaker 1: the college nationals my freshman and my sophomore year. But

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Speaker 1: I felt like my sophomore year i'd beat some of

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Speaker 1: the girls UM at different races, and then I kind

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Speaker 1: of flopped at the Nationals and I was like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I don't want to experience that anymore. I'm gonna be

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Speaker 1: great when it's important to be great, which is at

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Speaker 1: that championship race. Well, Laurden, I mean, the Olympics have

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Speaker 1: actually been over for a week now, but you actually

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Speaker 1: competed in four different Olympics. You meddled in. Yeah, like

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Speaker 1: I said that, you know, both of the Summer and

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Speaker 1: Winter Olympics. Can you explain how that how that actually happened? Well,

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Speaker 1: funny stories. The three Olympics kind of were a normal trajectory,

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Speaker 1: I guess once I took the left turn and became

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Speaker 1: an Olympian for the first time. But that last one

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Speaker 1: chance meeting in the airport led me to learn about

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Speaker 1: Bob Slid, decide to give it a try, and six

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Speaker 1: months later find myself at the Olympic Game. So don't

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Speaker 1: underestimate what can happen in an airport when you're talking

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Speaker 1: to people. I mean, that's incredible. So what was it like,

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Speaker 1: I mean, training for once more and then having to

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Speaker 1: figure out how to I mean, I don't know, compete

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Speaker 1: on the international stage in a completely different sport under

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Speaker 1: like completely different conditions. What was that like for you? Um,

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Speaker 1: it was the most rewarding and the toughest six months

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Speaker 1: of my life to date because I was challenged in

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Speaker 1: ways I had never thought that you could be challenged.

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Speaker 1: I learned things I never you know, had planned to learn, um.

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Speaker 1: And it was just like such a quick, you know,

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Speaker 1: a steep learning curve that you had to figure out

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Speaker 1: so many different things. And I say, the main thing

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Speaker 1: being you know, how to work well together with others,

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Speaker 1: how to really put the team before yourself while being

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Speaker 1: on the team. When it comes to like training for

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Speaker 1: both track and then for bob sledding, like, what are

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Speaker 1: your days like in that? And does it ever get monotonous? Um?

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Speaker 1: I'm just kind of interested in, like what the day

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Speaker 1: to day it truly does sound like all left turns right? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it doesn't get boring or is it just is it

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Speaker 1: just constantly intense? I mean you know, what's what are

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Speaker 1: the day to days like for an olympian? Well, there,

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Speaker 1: it's not monotonous at all. You do a different workout

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Speaker 1: every day and then you're building on those workouts. So

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Speaker 1: that's one thing. And then there's also you know, physical therapy,

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Speaker 1: be there's you know, proper nutrition, uh, massage therapist. So

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Speaker 1: you know, there's a lot of different things that go

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Speaker 1: into it. But it is kind of like working out

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Speaker 1: all day every day definitely is a full time job.

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Speaker 1: It's like my nightmare like it. I think that's why

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Speaker 1: it sales monotonous to you, Joel, because like I mean,

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Speaker 1: you will exercise when you can ride your bike and

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Speaker 1: you can get somewhere, whereas like last night, I went

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Speaker 1: for a run, I was thinking about Lauren's interview, and

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Speaker 1: I was like, you know what, it's been a couple

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Speaker 1: of weeks. An extra mile just serve for this. I

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Speaker 1: put in the nice little five K. I got my

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Speaker 1: three three that's correct, right, Lauren, three point one Right,

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Speaker 1: that's further than I will ever run. So yeah, those

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Speaker 1: short births, right, Uh well, okay, let' let's kind of

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Speaker 1: transition a little bit to money, Lauren. There's this recent

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Speaker 1: study that found that six of Olympic athletes they actually

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Speaker 1: don't consider themselves financially stable. Some make millions, but that

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Speaker 1: actually isn't the norm. So yeah, I'm curious of your

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Speaker 1: experience with that. Can you shed some lights on the

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Speaker 1: personal finance sitch wation of most of the different Olympians

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Speaker 1: out there. Yeah, it's one of the things that a

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Speaker 1: lot of people don't know, but most Olympians, like you said,

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Speaker 1: are not funded. Um, they work full time. Some of

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Speaker 1: them are working two or three jobs in addition to

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Speaker 1: trying to uh excel on an elite level at their sport.

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Speaker 1: Uh So it's really really tough for someone to have

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Speaker 1: to work three jobs. Actually, I'll tell a story of

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Speaker 1: two thousand and four when I made my first Olympic team.

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Speaker 1: Like I said, I was fortunate enough to get a

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Speaker 1: contract from Nike, and they said, all this happened really

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Speaker 1: fast for me. But I remember very clearly being in

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Speaker 1: the airport headed home. UM, and the gentleman who won

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Speaker 1: the silver medal in the high jump, his name is

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Speaker 1: Matt Hemingway, was so excited that he was going to

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Speaker 1: be cutting back his hours at work. And he's like,

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Speaker 1: I think I'm just gonna work a forty hour work week.

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Speaker 1: And I was like, wait a minute, isn't that what

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Speaker 1: most people do is like eight times five and that's

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Speaker 1: forty You know, I'm I'm fresh out of school, but

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Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure forty hours like the norm. And yeah,

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Speaker 1: Matt had been working eighty hour work weeks and training

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Speaker 1: and one a silver medal at the Olympics that puts

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Speaker 1: it all in first spective for you, um, as it

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Speaker 1: pertains to how some athletes are having to you know,

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Speaker 1: work to maintain their lifestyle or work to just kind

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Speaker 1: of get by forget about maintaining a lifestyle. Um. In

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Speaker 1: addition to like said, mixing that with participating in sport,

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Speaker 1: that joke on the way not set a very high

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Speaker 1: bar for everyone else out there. It's an impressive feat.

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Speaker 1: Sorry about that. Yeah, well and and so yeah, I

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Speaker 1: guess it's some of the more high profile athletes and

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Speaker 1: some of the more high profile sports that get some

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Speaker 1: of the bigger sponsorships and are able to dedicate themselves

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Speaker 1: fully to training for the sport that are you know,

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Speaker 1: trying to compete in. But then I guess that leaves

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Speaker 1: a lot of athletes though on the sidelines having to work,

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Speaker 1: um and at the same time do the training right

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Speaker 1: even just in order to compete. Yeah. And I think

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Speaker 1: one of the things that's like a big misnomers Like

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Speaker 1: you said, you see the people on TV and we

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Speaker 1: equate fame with fortune. Fame and fortune are not in

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Speaker 1: fact the same thing. So um, you see you know,

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Speaker 1: Smone Biles, and you know the big names or the

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Speaker 1: people that are chosen to be kind of the forefront

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Speaker 1: of the Olympic Games, and then you say, okay, well

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Speaker 1: they did really well. Someone else who got an Olympic medal,

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Speaker 1: even if they didn't achieve the TV status, they must

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Speaker 1: have done really well financially, and they actually don't do

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Speaker 1: very well. So I know plenty of gold medalists who

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Speaker 1: have not even reached the six figure mark as it

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Speaker 1: pertains to earnings. Gotcha, yeah, well yeah, we're speaking of finances.

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Speaker 1: So kind of going back to your original major. Uh

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Speaker 1: And then now your career, Lauren, how do you feel

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Speaker 1: like the skills that you developed while training for the Olympics,

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Speaker 1: how do you feel that that translated into the world

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Speaker 1: of finance that you that you work in now? There

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Speaker 1: was quite a bit of carryover from sport to life

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Speaker 1: after sports. So I would say the biggest thing would

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Speaker 1: be perseverance. What I mean by that is in track

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Speaker 1: and field, you know, you show up a practice, some

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Speaker 1: days your sore um, some days your tires. Some days

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Speaker 1: practice doesn't go very well, and you're just like, oh

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Speaker 1: my goodness, am I still fast? You know? Do I

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Speaker 1: still have it? But you continue to show up. So

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Speaker 1: for me, perseverance is that ideas, Like you said, You

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Speaker 1: show up when your sore, You show up after you've

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Speaker 1: gotten your butt kicked. You show up, you know, even

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Speaker 1: after your coach yelled at you, and day after day

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Speaker 1: you continue to show up because you're building a foundation. Um,

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Speaker 1: even when you get to the competition kind of realm.

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Speaker 1: You know, you don't win every race. I don't know

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Speaker 1: very many people who you know, get get it all

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Speaker 1: right all the time, but you still continue to show

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Speaker 1: up because bad races in addition to good races are

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Speaker 1: what lead to you know, winning the championship. And so

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Speaker 1: you get over to the finance world and you know

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Speaker 1: you're not gonna get every client. Um, you're not gonna

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Speaker 1: make every client perfectly happy, despite you know, whatever kind

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Speaker 1: of vision or values you have within your firm um.

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Speaker 1: And sometimes you're just gonna get it like flat out wrong,

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Speaker 1: but you show up anyway. It took me quite a

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Speaker 1: while to become profitable as a financial planner, so um,

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Speaker 1: I kept showing up. Yeah, I feel like that that

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Speaker 1: the same that that also applies to the world of

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Speaker 1: personal finance, right for everybody in there with their when

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Speaker 1: it comes to their individual relationship with money. Oftentimes, you

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Speaker 1: know people who have gotten themselves into credit card debt

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Speaker 1: over seven, eight, ten years. They want to find out

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Speaker 1: how to get out of that credit card debt in

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Speaker 1: the next six months. Um. And it takes the same thing.

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Speaker 1: It takes perseverance. Like it took you a long time

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Speaker 1: to get into that, it's going to take a little

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Speaker 1: while to get out of that. But but it's going

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Speaker 1: to take that dedication, right that, um, that ability to

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Speaker 1: be disciplined in order to achieve the outcome that you want.

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Speaker 1: And I think sometimes we we want what we want

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Speaker 1: and we want it now, but that's just not the

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Speaker 1: way it works when it comes to building wealth or

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Speaker 1: paying off debt either, right exactly. Um, nothing happens overnight,

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Speaker 1: he said. Champions are not made overnight. Um. If you've

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Speaker 1: gained a lot of weight, you don't get skinny overnight.

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Speaker 1: I'm I'm actually in the midst of experiencing that in

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Speaker 1: the middle time right now. It's very retired body. Uh.

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Speaker 1: It takes time, and like you said, it takes it

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Speaker 1: takes perseverance in the sense that you're not going to

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Speaker 1: get at all, right, but you need to continue forward

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Speaker 1: even when you don't. So if you eat a bucket

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Speaker 1: of ice cream, UM, that doesn't mean you don't get

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Speaker 1: back on the horse the next day. You don't eat

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Speaker 1: five more buckets of ice cream and go down back

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Speaker 1: through it. Yeah, those splurges, and you know you're trying

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Speaker 1: to get out of credit card debt, then you have

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Speaker 1: a splurge or something that was unplanned for. You know,

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Speaker 1: it's okay to feel what you feel, but also continue

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Speaker 1: on the journey of getting debt free. I love it.

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Speaker 1: I love it, Lauren. Love the energy that you're bringing.

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Speaker 1: And we're going to continue to talk more with you here. Specifically,

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Speaker 1: we're gonna dive into student loans and we'll get to

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Speaker 1: that's right after this break. All right, we're back from

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Speaker 1: the break. We're talking with Lauren Williams about tackling student

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Speaker 1: loan debt. We're going to get into a bunch of

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Speaker 1: different student loan questions with Lauren, who is a certified

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Speaker 1: student loan professional, which means sheet knows a whole lot

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Speaker 1: of stuff about this. In just a second, Uh, Lauren,

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Speaker 1: Before we get to that, I wanted to ask you too.

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Speaker 1: You said that part of what led you to working

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Speaker 1: as a financial advisor was the fact that you were

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Speaker 1: actually let down by other advisors UM, and you felt

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Speaker 1: like you had to figure things out for yourself. So

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Speaker 1: I'm curious what was that process like of trying to

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Speaker 1: interview financial advisors and then realizing that there wasn't anybody

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Speaker 1: out there that necessarily fit the bill you're looking for. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it was pretty tough because I think one of the

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Speaker 1: things that UM I had going against me was that

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Speaker 1: I didn't have a lot of experience. I was young,

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Speaker 1: like said, junior in college. I had like thousand bucks

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Speaker 1: a month or something like that coming in UM, so

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Speaker 1: I didn't have a whole lot to manage, and then

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Speaker 1: I had, you know, a significant amount to manage. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And I didn't have any real frame of reference for

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Speaker 1: what questions I should be asking. So I didn't know

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Speaker 1: what fee only meant. I didn't know what a certified

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Speaker 1: financial planner was. I didn't know that there were commissions

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Speaker 1: or you know that some people only focus on investments.

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Speaker 1: There's so many different things about the financial professionals. And

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Speaker 1: like I said, I didn't have financial literacy how to

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Speaker 1: make a budget, you know, can I move out from

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Speaker 1: living with my college roommate. Lots of people were in

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Speaker 1: my ear telling me buy a house, you know, that's

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Speaker 1: the best thing you can do right now. And I'm like, well,

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Speaker 1: how much house can I have for and there was

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Speaker 1: like three times the amount of whatever you make and

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Speaker 1: I'm like, wow, that sounds like a lot um, you know.

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Speaker 1: And they weren't financial professionals. I had enough knowledge to know, like,

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Speaker 1: I don't know if I should listen to you, but

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Speaker 1: I didn't know who I should be going to seek

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Speaker 1: out to listen to or you know, who would have

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Speaker 1: expertise in that area. And so the letdown for me

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Speaker 1: was like, I'm not an athlete who was stolen from

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Speaker 1: or mismanaging a way that you know, caused me to

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Speaker 1: go broke. But I definitely did not get the service

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Speaker 1: that I need it, or the the understanding or um

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Speaker 1: really any value out of participating in financial planning other

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Speaker 1: than to put money in investments. Right. Well, I mean,

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Speaker 1: we're glad that you didn't go to this, you know,

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Speaker 1: through the school of hard knocks when it came to

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Speaker 1: you and your money. But for our listeners, Lauren, like,

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Speaker 1: I mean, how would you recommend that they find an

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Speaker 1: advisor who is actually helpful that they aren't wasting their time? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: So my big three are fee only CFP and fiduciary.

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Speaker 1: Those are the three things that I would say you

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Speaker 1: should be looking for in a financial professional UM. Fee

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Speaker 1: only being that they're going to charge you a fee.

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Speaker 1: Related that you're going to understand is like, this is

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Speaker 1: how much I pay my financial professional UM CFP being

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Speaker 1: that they are a certified financial planner, they've gone through

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Speaker 1: UM a certain amount of education, they've taken an exam,

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Speaker 1: they have to have three years of experience before they

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Speaker 1: can even call themselves a CFP, and then they're held

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Speaker 1: to a code of ethics. So there's a lot of

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Speaker 1: different things that are going to help them give you

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Speaker 1: a more holistic look at your fine finances UM. But

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Speaker 1: then't really I mean the fiduciary aspect of it is

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Speaker 1: that they need to do what's in your best interests,

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Speaker 1: which is crazy to me that there are people out

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Speaker 1: there that don't need to do what's in your best

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Speaker 1: interests as it pretends to finances right. Well, there was

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Speaker 1: an attempt to make legislation that required UH financial planners

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Speaker 1: to be fiduciaries, and then that kind of went away

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Speaker 1: after a little bit of a frighten and we were

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Speaker 1: bummed to see that because I do think that's a

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Speaker 1: standard that all financial financial planners should be held to you.

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Speaker 1: But until they are, like, people need to do their

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Speaker 1: own due diligence and look out for themselves and make

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Speaker 1: sure they're asking those questions of anybody that they might

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Speaker 1: potentially be working with. Definitely, And I think the last

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Speaker 1: thing is to really understand what it is you want.

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Speaker 1: So if you want help with your student loans, you know,

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Speaker 1: make sure you ask questions about that. Do you have

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Speaker 1: any expertise in this area. If you want to be

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Speaker 1: you know, by your first home, or you're trying to

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Speaker 1: figure out how to merge your finances with your spouse,

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Speaker 1: you need help making a budget, ask for those specific

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Speaker 1: things that are important to you as it relates to

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Speaker 1: your finances. So so often we just think, you know,

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Speaker 1: let the person talk to us, tell us what they

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Speaker 1: can offer. Oh, that stuff sounds good, But there's this

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Speaker 1: whole other list of things that are you know, on

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Speaker 1: your mind that you didn't know that they would or

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Speaker 1: would not help you with. So be really customizing and

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Speaker 1: asking the questions that are relatable for yourself. Yeah, there's

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Speaker 1: there's probably a list of tasks that you're wanting to

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Speaker 1: have accomplished by hiring an advisor. I think that's really smart,

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Speaker 1: basically kind of working backwards. This is the problem I

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Speaker 1: want to have solved. Let's make sure that you can

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Speaker 1: do that. And Lauren, you know you you kind of

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Speaker 1: touched on student loans there. Let's go ahead and shift

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Speaker 1: gears talk about that. What specifically got you interested, uh

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Speaker 1: in student loans? Like what drew you to specialize in

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Speaker 1: helping folks with their student loan problems? Yeah, this is

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Speaker 1: unfortunate story in that regard. But my very first client

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Speaker 1: at my firm, Worth Winning was a young lady who

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Speaker 1: made about a hundred and thirty four thousand dollars and

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Speaker 1: had three hundred and sixty four thousand dollars of student

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Speaker 1: loan debt. And so all I was thinking was like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: my first like organic client from you know, it's not

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Speaker 1: like my mom or my mom's friends. And I'm like,

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Speaker 1: oh my goodness, I don't know what to do. Like she,

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Speaker 1: you know, six figures is something I think it is

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Speaker 1: a milestone for a lot of people, especially I've experienced

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Speaker 1: in communities of color. That's like something that people are

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Speaker 1: trying to achieve. And so she's like, I've made it

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Speaker 1: past that mark. You know, I have this education, UM,

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Speaker 1: I'm living a small cost of living city. She was

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Speaker 1: in Michigan, and I just can't meet my monthly expenses

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Speaker 1: and the student loan is weighing me down. And I

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Speaker 1: didn't have good answers for her initially, and so I

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Speaker 1: had to start doing some research because you know, it

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Speaker 1: was unfortunate that the CFP didn't teach me that. So

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Speaker 1: it's like, I've got all this ledge, but this one

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Speaker 1: area I'm still lacking in because student loans are so

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Speaker 1: nuanced and there's something that you know, are new and

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Speaker 1: people are still trying to wrap their head around. So

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Speaker 1: I dived into Google and found Heather Jarvis, who is

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Speaker 1: a lawyer who has done quite a bit of the

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Speaker 1: legislation around getting those income driven plans that a lot

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Speaker 1: of people are on past UM linked up with her,

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Speaker 1: took some of her classes. Was like this is not enough.

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna be your apprentice, and she's like, but I

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Speaker 1: don't need an apprentice, and I'm like, yes, yes you do.

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Speaker 1: I haven't learn more about this UM. So, yeah, that

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Speaker 1: unfortunate situation of you know, seeing that lady not be

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Speaker 1: able to pay her student loans or not have any

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Speaker 1: real clear, plausible plan or how to fix it, you know,

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Speaker 1: like you know, we just say, like pay your debt,

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Speaker 1: and it's just like she's never gonna be done with this,

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Speaker 1: and how is she ever gonna you know, purchase anything

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Speaker 1: else like a home or you know, she didn't have

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Speaker 1: a car at that time. It was just the student

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Speaker 1: loan debt. Uh. And it got me really passionate about

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Speaker 1: being able to you know, find solutions for people. So, yeah,

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Speaker 1: who can benefit the most from hiring an advisor who's

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Speaker 1: also has that CSLP designation And like, um, if if

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Speaker 1: you have a bunch of student loan that would you

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Speaker 1: would you like recommend that people find somebody that has

428
00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:11,720
Speaker 1: that designation that can specially especially provide some helping guidance

429
00:20:12,040 --> 00:20:14,920
Speaker 1: for their particular situation. Definitely. And I would say also

430
00:20:15,000 --> 00:20:17,959
Speaker 1: be weary of people who are reaching out to you.

431
00:20:18,080 --> 00:20:19,680
Speaker 1: So you know, the phone calls that you get the

432
00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:22,320
Speaker 1: same way that the I R. S doesn't call you. Um,

433
00:20:22,840 --> 00:20:24,760
Speaker 1: the federal government is not going to call you about

434
00:20:24,800 --> 00:20:27,080
Speaker 1: your student loan. So they're calling you and they're telling

435
00:20:27,080 --> 00:20:30,280
Speaker 1: you to fix your life, and you know, just do

436
00:20:30,400 --> 00:20:33,399
Speaker 1: this process and just pay us a month for the

437
00:20:33,520 --> 00:20:35,160
Speaker 1: you know, the next three years, and we'll take care

438
00:20:35,160 --> 00:20:37,840
Speaker 1: of everything. You can handle your student loan, you know,

439
00:20:37,920 --> 00:20:40,439
Speaker 1: paperwork and things like that on your own. UM. And

440
00:20:40,480 --> 00:20:43,720
Speaker 1: a lot of those companies are scamed, so be very leary,

441
00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:46,160
Speaker 1: do your research and reach out to people like you said,

442
00:20:46,200 --> 00:20:49,800
Speaker 1: that are certified professionals. UM. There's a great company student

443
00:20:49,880 --> 00:20:52,280
Speaker 1: loan planner. I think you guys they said, have checked

444
00:20:52,320 --> 00:20:56,320
Speaker 1: it out before, where the information is credible. UM. There's

445
00:20:56,359 --> 00:20:59,080
Speaker 1: lots of free resources for you to go ahead and

446
00:20:59,200 --> 00:21:02,440
Speaker 1: learn more about your student loan situation. There's a podcast

447
00:21:02,560 --> 00:21:04,840
Speaker 1: as well. There's there's just so much information that you

448
00:21:04,880 --> 00:21:08,400
Speaker 1: can get for free. But then there's also I can, um,

449
00:21:08,440 --> 00:21:10,960
Speaker 1: you know, hire a professional that I know knows this

450
00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:15,080
Speaker 1: stuff inside out and can customize a plan for me. UM.

451
00:21:15,160 --> 00:21:18,000
Speaker 1: So I would also recommend that. Yeah. I think that's

452
00:21:18,040 --> 00:21:20,320
Speaker 1: that coaching aspect of it, right. I mean as an athlete,

453
00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:22,560
Speaker 1: you know, having it's one thing to have all the knowledge,

454
00:21:22,600 --> 00:21:24,320
Speaker 1: but it's something else to have somebody like you said,

455
00:21:24,320 --> 00:21:27,320
Speaker 1: maybe yelling at you occasionally, but helping you to actually

456
00:21:27,320 --> 00:21:32,080
Speaker 1: telling words of encouragement, helping to actually do the hard work. UH.

457
00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:34,399
Speaker 1: And that's I think certainly when a professional like that

458
00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:38,320
Speaker 1: can be beneficial. Lauren, let's kind of get get current

459
00:21:38,359 --> 00:21:40,800
Speaker 1: with it right. Federal student loans, they've been in forbearance

460
00:21:40,920 --> 00:21:44,960
Speaker 1: for borrowers since March of last year. That's been great,

461
00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:46,480
Speaker 1: I think for for many folks to be able to

462
00:21:46,520 --> 00:21:49,920
Speaker 1: prioritize just whatever their different goals have been, right, whether

463
00:21:49,920 --> 00:21:52,640
Speaker 1: that's building up their savings, paying off other types of debt.

464
00:21:53,119 --> 00:21:55,879
Speaker 1: And now those payments aren't set to resume until February

465
00:21:56,000 --> 00:22:00,000
Speaker 1: of next year of two, How should people be thinking

466
00:22:00,000 --> 00:22:03,280
Speaker 1: about their student loans right now with the most recent

467
00:22:03,359 --> 00:22:06,840
Speaker 1: deferment pushback. Yeah, So the first thing I want to

468
00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:09,240
Speaker 1: say is that if you have been making payments and

469
00:22:09,280 --> 00:22:12,479
Speaker 1: you should not have been making payments, you can get

470
00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:16,320
Speaker 1: every dollar that you have paid since March of back.

471
00:22:16,960 --> 00:22:19,000
Speaker 1: So what does that mean? You have to first figure

472
00:22:19,040 --> 00:22:22,159
Speaker 1: out should you have been making payments? Uh, if you

473
00:22:22,280 --> 00:22:26,200
Speaker 1: owe more than one point to five times what you earn,

474
00:22:26,840 --> 00:22:29,479
Speaker 1: then there's a high likelihood that you should be trying

475
00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:33,639
Speaker 1: for what we call taxable forgiveness. Taxable forgiveness as you

476
00:22:33,760 --> 00:22:36,159
Speaker 1: being on one of those income driven or payment plans

477
00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:38,959
Speaker 1: which many people are on, but they may be on them,

478
00:22:38,960 --> 00:22:41,680
Speaker 1: and they'll be paying a little bit extra. They're on them,

479
00:22:41,680 --> 00:22:44,639
Speaker 1: and they're not really sure how they work exactly. After

480
00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:47,040
Speaker 1: twenty or twenty five years, whatever is left over of

481
00:22:47,080 --> 00:22:50,080
Speaker 1: your loan amount is going to be forgiven. However, you

482
00:22:50,119 --> 00:22:52,040
Speaker 1: will have to pay taxes on what is forgiven, So

483
00:22:52,080 --> 00:22:55,320
Speaker 1: you should be setting aside a little bit for taxes. UM,

484
00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:57,959
Speaker 1: paying your student loan payment, but not paying a dollar

485
00:22:58,160 --> 00:23:01,280
Speaker 1: extra towards your loans, which means since March of last

486
00:23:01,320 --> 00:23:03,840
Speaker 1: year when they told you to pay zero, you know,

487
00:23:03,920 --> 00:23:05,639
Speaker 1: you might have felt your heart tug a little bit

488
00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:07,280
Speaker 1: and you're like, oh, man, but it doesn't feel good

489
00:23:07,359 --> 00:23:09,359
Speaker 1: to pay nothing. I'm not one of the people who

490
00:23:09,440 --> 00:23:12,199
Speaker 1: was in a situation where I lost my income and

491
00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:14,600
Speaker 1: I just I just want to keep paying. UM. You

492
00:23:14,640 --> 00:23:17,160
Speaker 1: are literally throwing money into a black hole, the trash,

493
00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:21,000
Speaker 1: the toilet, however you want to call it, right, But

494
00:23:21,119 --> 00:23:23,720
Speaker 1: the good news is that you can get it all back.

495
00:23:23,840 --> 00:23:26,720
Speaker 1: So find out which boat you're in, UM, which I

496
00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:29,000
Speaker 1: should probably mention what that other boat is, and that

497
00:23:29,160 --> 00:23:33,040
Speaker 1: is refinancing, paying the loans back aggressively. And that's basically

498
00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:35,800
Speaker 1: like you said, you earn more than you owe UM

499
00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:37,680
Speaker 1: and then in that case, you should probably be looking

500
00:23:37,720 --> 00:23:42,040
Speaker 1: at refinancing, but not until uh that COVID forbearance is over,

501
00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:44,119
Speaker 1: because zero percent interest is going to be better than

502
00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:46,840
Speaker 1: any interest rate you can get um with the private

503
00:23:46,880 --> 00:23:49,480
Speaker 1: company right now? Yeah? Oh yeah, Well, so how is

504
00:23:49,480 --> 00:23:51,000
Speaker 1: it that folks are able to get that money back

505
00:23:51,040 --> 00:23:54,560
Speaker 1: that they've been paying? You simply call your servicer and say, hey,

506
00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:56,520
Speaker 1: I'd like to get all of my money back, and

507
00:23:57,040 --> 00:23:59,080
Speaker 1: they know that they have to give every dollar back

508
00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:03,480
Speaker 1: um from thirty that you paid up to this point.

509
00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:05,720
Speaker 1: So and it's usually like seven to ten business days

510
00:24:05,720 --> 00:24:08,199
Speaker 1: before it drops back into your account. Okay, but I

511
00:24:08,200 --> 00:24:09,840
Speaker 1: think when when you look at the numbers, there aren't

512
00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:11,879
Speaker 1: many people who have been paying, right, Like, it's a

513
00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:14,800
Speaker 1: very small fraction of the borrowers who have actually continued

514
00:24:14,840 --> 00:24:16,720
Speaker 1: to pay even though they haven't had to be living

515
00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:20,800
Speaker 1: under a rock, right. Yeah, But let's talk about the

516
00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:23,280
Speaker 1: income based repayment plans that you mentioned. There are a

517
00:24:23,320 --> 00:24:26,640
Speaker 1: few different flavors of those plans. What are the biggest

518
00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:30,400
Speaker 1: mistakes that you see in the area of like IBr plans?

519
00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:32,960
Speaker 1: And yeah, do do you ever see folks that are

520
00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:34,520
Speaker 1: on the wrong plan that need to change plan that

521
00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:38,160
Speaker 1: need to like update their information, like in order to

522
00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:41,119
Speaker 1: have their payment reduced. Like what should people that are

523
00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:43,359
Speaker 1: on those plans right now be thinking? Yeah, So the

524
00:24:43,359 --> 00:24:45,760
Speaker 1: biggest thing that I see is not knowing the difference

525
00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:49,560
Speaker 1: because the acronyms are very confusing. So I d R

526
00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:52,600
Speaker 1: is the name of the program, income Driven Repayment, And

527
00:24:52,640 --> 00:24:55,119
Speaker 1: so sometimes I ask clients, you know what payment planning

528
00:24:55,119 --> 00:24:57,400
Speaker 1: you're on there on, like, I'm on ib R and

529
00:24:57,440 --> 00:24:59,439
Speaker 1: I be our income based that's the word that we

530
00:24:59,520 --> 00:25:02,119
Speaker 1: use kind of as common terms, but it's actually not

531
00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:05,120
Speaker 1: income based. The program is income driven, and income base

532
00:25:05,280 --> 00:25:08,960
Speaker 1: is one of four other options under the income driven umbrella.

533
00:25:09,320 --> 00:25:11,840
Speaker 1: So one big mistake I see people making is not

534
00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:15,600
Speaker 1: understanding that, you know, there are four different repayment options

535
00:25:15,680 --> 00:25:18,399
Speaker 1: under income driven, and they all choose ib R just

536
00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:20,600
Speaker 1: because that's the term that they've heard before, so income

537
00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:23,040
Speaker 1: based and they get on that one. There are three

538
00:25:23,080 --> 00:25:26,840
Speaker 1: other ones. Um, I see, our income contingent repayment is

539
00:25:26,880 --> 00:25:29,520
Speaker 1: the worst of the four. Um, So you should not

540
00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:32,080
Speaker 1: be on that one unless you have parent plus loans

541
00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:35,360
Speaker 1: that have already been consolidated. That is the only situation

542
00:25:35,359 --> 00:25:38,600
Speaker 1: where I've ever seen it be appropriate for someone to

543
00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:40,720
Speaker 1: be on I c R because it is based on

544
00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:44,960
Speaker 1: of your discretionary income. I b R is the next

545
00:25:45,080 --> 00:25:47,800
Speaker 1: least likely one that you should be on UM. There

546
00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:50,159
Speaker 1: are some situations where it is more appropriate, and I

547
00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:52,480
Speaker 1: said far more than there is I I c R,

548
00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:54,760
Speaker 1: and that one is going to be based on of

549
00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:59,119
Speaker 1: your discretionary income. Now there's two other plans R E

550
00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:02,200
Speaker 1: P A y E, so repay UH, and that one's

551
00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:04,200
Speaker 1: gonna be ten percent of your income. And then there's

552
00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:06,760
Speaker 1: P A y E. So you know, there's there's pay

553
00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:11,000
Speaker 1: and there's repay and those two. You know, like, why

554
00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:15,280
Speaker 1: would I people? You know so simple? So, but why

555
00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:17,600
Speaker 1: would I pay of my income every month when I

556
00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:19,760
Speaker 1: could pay ten percent? The answer is you would not

557
00:26:19,920 --> 00:26:22,600
Speaker 1: unless you absolutely have to. So if you want to

558
00:26:22,600 --> 00:26:24,520
Speaker 1: first see if you're eligible for that pay or that

559
00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:28,360
Speaker 1: repay plan UM, if you're going for that taxable forgiveness,

560
00:26:28,600 --> 00:26:31,520
Speaker 1: and don't just default to I b R because it's

561
00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:33,880
Speaker 1: income base. That is a plan that everybody can get

562
00:26:33,920 --> 00:26:36,280
Speaker 1: on UM. Now, the problem is that, like you said,

563
00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:39,639
Speaker 1: everyone cannot get on pay as you earn or repay.

564
00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:42,439
Speaker 1: So with repay, the requirement is that you have direct

565
00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:46,160
Speaker 1: loans with pay it's that you have direct loans and

566
00:26:46,480 --> 00:26:49,080
Speaker 1: that you did not borrow before October one of two

567
00:26:49,119 --> 00:26:52,320
Speaker 1: thousand and seven. So now people are listening, they're like,

568
00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:54,400
Speaker 1: oh my goodness, Like, oh, I didn't borrow before that day,

569
00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:57,080
Speaker 1: and I'm on IBr. This is your opportunity to switch

570
00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:01,000
Speaker 1: um and especially like you said, we're in in COVID forbearance.

571
00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:03,879
Speaker 1: What can you be doing making those switches now so

572
00:27:03,920 --> 00:27:06,879
Speaker 1: that when you get back to repayment your payment is

573
00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:09,280
Speaker 1: now less. Well, yeah, so that's definitely great to know,

574
00:27:09,320 --> 00:27:11,000
Speaker 1: because you want to make sure that you are on

575
00:27:11,160 --> 00:27:13,520
Speaker 1: the proper plan, to make sure that, I mean, you

576
00:27:13,520 --> 00:27:16,239
Speaker 1: don't want to go through a program and then not

577
00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:19,080
Speaker 1: actually have it count towards the proper program. It's all

578
00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:21,240
Speaker 1: about making sure that you're within the correct program. Is

579
00:27:21,240 --> 00:27:24,400
Speaker 1: that right? That is right? But also there's a caveat

580
00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:28,960
Speaker 1: so so when you switch from one income driven plan

581
00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:31,919
Speaker 1: to another, they do continue to count your credit. So

582
00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:33,840
Speaker 1: if you're going for twenty or twenty five years, so

583
00:27:33,880 --> 00:27:36,080
Speaker 1: let's say you're on IBr, that one is one that

584
00:27:36,119 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 1: takes place over twenty five years, you switch to the

585
00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:40,520
Speaker 1: Page you Earned plan, which is a twenty year plan.

586
00:27:40,760 --> 00:27:43,520
Speaker 1: You don't lose the credit that you've already had. However,

587
00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:46,400
Speaker 1: there are lots of other plans, which, like you said,

588
00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:49,320
Speaker 1: why is why it's so important to speak to someone

589
00:27:49,359 --> 00:27:53,240
Speaker 1: and get a customized plan for yourself because it's like, oh, well,

590
00:27:53,280 --> 00:27:55,920
Speaker 1: what if I choose something that's not income driven at all?

591
00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:58,280
Speaker 1: And then you're exactly right. You've now been on the

592
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:01,280
Speaker 1: wrong plan for ten years paying on your loans. You've

593
00:28:01,320 --> 00:28:03,720
Speaker 1: wasted quite a bit of money, and now you're switching

594
00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:06,919
Speaker 1: to maybe an income driven repayment plan and starting the

595
00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:09,359
Speaker 1: clock and got twenty or twenty five more years to go.

596
00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:13,320
Speaker 1: That's not an ideal situation to be in, right, right, Okay,

597
00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:15,960
Speaker 1: So just like over just like big picture here, so

598
00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:18,359
Speaker 1: like having less debt in your life. We want everyone

599
00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:20,359
Speaker 1: to hear this, right, Like that's a good thing. But

600
00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:22,399
Speaker 1: what you're saying is there's two different boats that you

601
00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:24,960
Speaker 1: can be, and you can if you're earning less, then

602
00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:27,440
Speaker 1: you can be you know, within an I d R

603
00:28:27,680 --> 00:28:30,440
Speaker 1: income driven repayment plan. But if you are earning more

604
00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:32,960
Speaker 1: and you don't qualify, I mean, would you recommend for

605
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:35,360
Speaker 1: those folks to just really get after that student loan

606
00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:36,919
Speaker 1: debt and to really pay it off as quickly as

607
00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:39,480
Speaker 1: they can. Exactly. You want to get that off your

608
00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:41,240
Speaker 1: plate as soon as possible so that you can pay

609
00:28:41,240 --> 00:28:43,680
Speaker 1: as little interest as possible. UM. And one of the

610
00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:45,800
Speaker 1: big things with the federal system, the reason that people

611
00:28:45,840 --> 00:28:48,960
Speaker 1: are using, you know, private lenders is because private lenders

612
00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:51,440
Speaker 1: give better interest rates and there's no way to negotiate

613
00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:54,000
Speaker 1: with the federal system. So that's another misnomer that I

614
00:28:54,040 --> 00:28:56,120
Speaker 1: see all the time is people say, oh, well, I

615
00:28:56,160 --> 00:28:59,920
Speaker 1: consolidate it. And the word consolidate and refinancing are you

616
00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:03,640
Speaker 1: used interchangeably um in other parts of the financial world,

617
00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:05,400
Speaker 1: but they're not the same thing as it pertains to

618
00:29:05,440 --> 00:29:08,920
Speaker 1: student loans. So consolidating is something that happens within the

619
00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:11,080
Speaker 1: federal system. So if you look at your you know,

620
00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:13,640
Speaker 1: big file at student a dot gov, you'll see twenty

621
00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:17,000
Speaker 1: or thirty loans or however many you borrowed. Consolidating is

622
00:29:17,000 --> 00:29:19,120
Speaker 1: taking them and squishing them all down into one or

623
00:29:19,160 --> 00:29:22,680
Speaker 1: two loans, but they're still federal loans. So there's various

624
00:29:22,680 --> 00:29:25,360
Speaker 1: reasons that people do that. Maybe they're trying to get

625
00:29:26,120 --> 00:29:28,840
Speaker 1: access to a different payment plan, uh, they want to

626
00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:31,520
Speaker 1: start paying earlier. There's all sorts of different thing. They're

627
00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:33,600
Speaker 1: trying to get out of default or something some sort

628
00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:38,240
Speaker 1: of bad situation. But consolidating is your loan staying federal. However,

629
00:29:38,400 --> 00:29:41,760
Speaker 1: refinancing is taking those federal loans out of the federal

630
00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:44,320
Speaker 1: system and putting them with the private lender. Once you've

631
00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:46,920
Speaker 1: done that, there is no going back. So you want

632
00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:50,040
Speaker 1: to be sure, very very sure before you do that,

633
00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:53,240
Speaker 1: because you're getting rid of things like public service loan forgiveness,

634
00:29:53,280 --> 00:29:55,240
Speaker 1: getting rid of these income driven plans that we just

635
00:29:55,280 --> 00:29:58,040
Speaker 1: talked about, getting rid of the COVID forbearance. Everybody who

636
00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:01,040
Speaker 1: has private loans right now is still paying. Anybody who

637
00:30:01,040 --> 00:30:04,120
Speaker 1: did that refinance in like let's say January was probably

638
00:30:04,440 --> 00:30:07,280
Speaker 1: dang it. That was a wrong move. But for people,

639
00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:09,280
Speaker 1: as we come out of this forbearance, it's been kind

640
00:30:09,280 --> 00:30:12,920
Speaker 1: of telegraph that this is going to be the last one, uh,

641
00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:14,880
Speaker 1: you know, in in the spring of next year. It

642
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:18,120
Speaker 1: might make sense for some people, especially people who are

643
00:30:18,120 --> 00:30:20,760
Speaker 1: in good financial standing and want to get their student

644
00:30:20,800 --> 00:30:24,080
Speaker 1: loans off their plate as quickly as possible. Refinancing might

645
00:30:24,120 --> 00:30:26,440
Speaker 1: make sense into a private loan for some of those people.

646
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:28,480
Speaker 1: I want to talk about the elephant in the Room

647
00:30:28,680 --> 00:30:32,160
Speaker 1: to Lauren student loan cancelation. Uh. There's been like a

648
00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:34,320
Speaker 1: lot of headlines, some of them a little click baity,

649
00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:37,959
Speaker 1: suggesting that student loans are going to exist pretty soon, right,

650
00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:41,120
Speaker 1: that thanks to the largest of the federal government, your

651
00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:45,000
Speaker 1: student loans will no longer burden you. Um. But yeah,

652
00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:49,360
Speaker 1: I think that possibility does exist. But how should people

653
00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:52,080
Speaker 1: think about paying off their loans when they see those articles?

654
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:54,520
Speaker 1: Like should they delay paying off some of that debt

655
00:30:54,560 --> 00:30:58,280
Speaker 1: in hopes that it's just kind of kind of magically disappear. Um.

656
00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:01,720
Speaker 1: I don't think that you should delay the hope that

657
00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:03,840
Speaker 1: there's someone going to swoop in with the magical wand

658
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:07,240
Speaker 1: or cape and make those loans go away. Uh. And

659
00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:09,880
Speaker 1: the reason is we need to think beyond ourselves. So

660
00:31:10,080 --> 00:31:12,240
Speaker 1: there's you know, roughly I think forty four millions do

661
00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:15,760
Speaker 1: loan borrowers the last time I checked. And imagine if

662
00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:20,200
Speaker 1: all the debt went away, what would happen to our economy? Um? Now,

663
00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:25,959
Speaker 1: you know is education area that needs a gross revamping. Absolutely,

664
00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:29,240
Speaker 1: But there are professors that you know, need to earn

665
00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:31,640
Speaker 1: a living. There are you know, buildings that need to

666
00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:34,360
Speaker 1: be taken care of. On college campuses and you know,

667
00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:38,200
Speaker 1: teachers and janitors, you name it. Um. You know there

668
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:41,880
Speaker 1: are other people attached to the education system, and so

669
00:31:41,920 --> 00:31:44,280
Speaker 1: to wipe everything out and to say that you did

670
00:31:44,360 --> 00:31:47,000
Speaker 1: not need to pay anything ever for the education that

671
00:31:47,040 --> 00:31:50,160
Speaker 1: you received, I think it's gonna, you know, definitely be

672
00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:53,320
Speaker 1: very bad for our economy. Um. But overall it's not

673
00:31:53,360 --> 00:31:55,480
Speaker 1: gonna be fair, like you said, across the board, because

674
00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:57,440
Speaker 1: what about the people who paid off their loans. So

675
00:31:57,880 --> 00:31:59,880
Speaker 1: I don't I don't think that it's coming the man

676
00:32:00,040 --> 00:32:02,920
Speaker 1: to Okay. I think that some forgiveness um is something

677
00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:05,080
Speaker 1: that could happen, um. And I think it could offer

678
00:32:05,120 --> 00:32:06,720
Speaker 1: a lot of relief to people who are in really

679
00:32:06,720 --> 00:32:09,160
Speaker 1: tough situation. So you know, as an example, that ten

680
00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:13,280
Speaker 1: dollar forgiveness and it tied it being tied to some

681
00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:16,360
Speaker 1: some level of income. That would wipe out people who

682
00:32:16,360 --> 00:32:20,120
Speaker 1: have gone to you know, cosmetology school or barber school

683
00:32:20,200 --> 00:32:22,560
Speaker 1: or something, and you know their school shut down. Some

684
00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:25,760
Speaker 1: of these you know technical schools that you know our

685
00:32:25,840 --> 00:32:28,320
Speaker 1: click baity or could be a television and you show

686
00:32:28,360 --> 00:32:30,760
Speaker 1: up and then they're shut down a few years later. Um.

687
00:32:30,800 --> 00:32:33,479
Speaker 1: You know, they're in a low earning situation now they

688
00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:35,280
Speaker 1: have dead on top of it, and they can't really

689
00:32:35,280 --> 00:32:38,040
Speaker 1: even get themselves going because they don't have they can't

690
00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:40,280
Speaker 1: clear up their credit. Um that can help a lot

691
00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:42,560
Speaker 1: of people. So I think some forgiveness is coming. I

692
00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:45,280
Speaker 1: don't think blanket forgiveness is coming, and I don't think

693
00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:48,400
Speaker 1: everyone should be upset that blankets forgiveness is not If

694
00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:52,360
Speaker 1: it does not come, they said it could still happen, um,

695
00:32:52,400 --> 00:32:54,640
Speaker 1: but we need to consider like you said, uh, this

696
00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:56,720
Speaker 1: is bigger than us. This is our you know, this

697
00:32:56,800 --> 00:32:59,360
Speaker 1: is our economy, this is our government, this is this

698
00:32:59,400 --> 00:33:00,880
Speaker 1: is our world that we got to live in after

699
00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:03,320
Speaker 1: student loans are canceled. Yeah, it would have massive effects

700
00:33:03,320 --> 00:33:05,160
Speaker 1: like I mean you you said capes. So it made

701
00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:07,240
Speaker 1: me think of like the Marvel movies, makes me think

702
00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:09,680
Speaker 1: of Thanos, you know, like if so if Biden just

703
00:33:09,760 --> 00:33:11,760
Speaker 1: like snapped his fingers that you know, all student loans

704
00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:13,360
Speaker 1: were wiped out, I mean, like you said, that would

705
00:33:13,360 --> 00:33:17,520
Speaker 1: have devastating impacts on our economy. So yeah, we're totally

706
00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:19,920
Speaker 1: with you. We think that, Yeah, it's a possibility, but

707
00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:22,720
Speaker 1: don't count on it. Yeah, or we got more questions

708
00:33:22,720 --> 00:33:24,640
Speaker 1: to get to with you, Lauren, including we want to

709
00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:27,560
Speaker 1: talk about income share agreements. They're kind of a popular

710
00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:30,160
Speaker 1: alternative to student loans. So yeah, we'll get the questions

711
00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:42,680
Speaker 1: about that and more with you right after this break. Alright,

712
00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:45,120
Speaker 1: we are back and we were talking with Lauren Williams

713
00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:48,920
Speaker 1: about student loans specifically, and Lauren, a couple of student

714
00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:52,560
Speaker 1: loan services are actually dropping their contracts with the federal government.

715
00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:55,160
Speaker 1: On the surface, that kind of seems like a boring headline,

716
00:33:55,200 --> 00:33:58,360
Speaker 1: but how will this have an impact on some borrowers

717
00:33:58,360 --> 00:34:01,320
Speaker 1: out there? It is not a boring headline. And the

718
00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:04,680
Speaker 1: reason that it's not because the big one that's doing

719
00:34:04,720 --> 00:34:07,760
Speaker 1: it is FED Loan, who is the official service or

720
00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:10,719
Speaker 1: of public service loan forgiveness. So if you work at

721
00:34:10,760 --> 00:34:13,600
Speaker 1: a government agency or a nonprofit organization and you've signed

722
00:34:13,640 --> 00:34:15,239
Speaker 1: up for this program, or you maybe you don't even

723
00:34:15,239 --> 00:34:17,719
Speaker 1: know that it existed, Hopefully we're turning people onto the

724
00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:20,520
Speaker 1: fact that the program exists. Um. The program is not

725
00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:23,839
Speaker 1: going away, so never fear. You can still sign up,

726
00:34:24,120 --> 00:34:25,400
Speaker 1: um and if you're in it, you're not going to

727
00:34:25,480 --> 00:34:29,000
Speaker 1: be booted from it. But FED Loans, the actual servicer, UH,

728
00:34:29,239 --> 00:34:32,200
Speaker 1: is going away. And so the big wonder and the

729
00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:35,440
Speaker 1: reason I actually think the extension was created was because

730
00:34:35,560 --> 00:34:39,920
Speaker 1: who's going to take over UM managing public service loan forgiveness.

731
00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:41,959
Speaker 1: My guess is that it's going to be Mohela because

732
00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:45,480
Speaker 1: they have a very similar internal system UM that is

733
00:34:45,560 --> 00:34:48,360
Speaker 1: going to you know, make it make the transition pretty easy.

734
00:34:48,560 --> 00:34:51,399
Speaker 1: We don't know yet, but that's going to create just

735
00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:54,920
Speaker 1: a little bit of a ripple for some people administratively.

736
00:34:55,880 --> 00:34:58,680
Speaker 1: So is there anything that a borrower in the PSLF

737
00:34:58,760 --> 00:35:02,480
Speaker 1: program needs to do, you know, while these changes are

738
00:35:02,520 --> 00:35:05,360
Speaker 1: up in the air. Yeah, So we're recommending that everyone

739
00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:08,279
Speaker 1: who is qualified for Public Service Loan forgiveness to fill

740
00:35:08,320 --> 00:35:11,759
Speaker 1: out their employers Certification form before the end of the

741
00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:14,640
Speaker 1: year so that they make sure that they have that

742
00:35:14,719 --> 00:35:16,600
Speaker 1: form filled out, they have their most recent set of

743
00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:19,560
Speaker 1: payments count it with the old program, and then also

744
00:35:19,600 --> 00:35:22,120
Speaker 1: to download your payment history. So those are two things

745
00:35:22,120 --> 00:35:23,920
Speaker 1: that you can do. And even if you're not in

746
00:35:23,960 --> 00:35:26,520
Speaker 1: Public service Loan forgiveness, there are people who are serviced

747
00:35:26,600 --> 00:35:29,520
Speaker 1: by FED loans who's who are not going for public

748
00:35:29,560 --> 00:35:32,160
Speaker 1: service loan forgiveness, you should do the same thing to

749
00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:34,560
Speaker 1: be prepared. That way, you have some sort of written

750
00:35:34,600 --> 00:35:39,560
Speaker 1: record of where you were before this change. Happened so smart. Yeah, well,

751
00:35:39,760 --> 00:35:41,360
Speaker 1: I want to ask you, Lauren, what's your take on

752
00:35:41,400 --> 00:35:44,000
Speaker 1: income share agreements because they seem to be coming more

753
00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:47,359
Speaker 1: common um, and it seems like some students have had

754
00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:49,800
Speaker 1: you know, uh, they haven't been taking an advantage of

755
00:35:49,840 --> 00:35:52,080
Speaker 1: in there that it's it's worked well, but other folks

756
00:35:52,280 --> 00:35:54,319
Speaker 1: have been taking advantage of when it comes to those

757
00:35:54,360 --> 00:35:57,800
Speaker 1: income share agreements. So yeah, what are your thoughts on those?

758
00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:01,800
Speaker 1: And let's say, uh, students, someone who's going to school

759
00:36:01,880 --> 00:36:04,160
Speaker 1: is looking at that as an alternative to student loans,

760
00:36:04,640 --> 00:36:07,640
Speaker 1: is that worth going in that direction instead? I think

761
00:36:07,640 --> 00:36:09,960
Speaker 1: that they there's still some some kings to be worked out.

762
00:36:09,960 --> 00:36:12,439
Speaker 1: As it pertains the income jare agreements. Like he said,

763
00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:16,759
Speaker 1: you've already brought those up, but I definitely think that

764
00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:18,840
Speaker 1: it's something worth looking into. What I think is probably

765
00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:21,920
Speaker 1: more productive is you know, spending more time looking for

766
00:36:22,120 --> 00:36:25,720
Speaker 1: the scholarships that exists, because there are many that go um,

767
00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:29,720
Speaker 1: you know, unsigned up for UM unrewarded over the course

768
00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:32,880
Speaker 1: of every year, so that would be one thing to

769
00:36:32,920 --> 00:36:35,480
Speaker 1: think about, and then also of course grants and things

770
00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:38,200
Speaker 1: like that. But as it pertains to the income share agreement,

771
00:36:38,239 --> 00:36:41,240
Speaker 1: I think that UM it can be a good program

772
00:36:41,239 --> 00:36:42,960
Speaker 1: and that you know, they said, once they get past

773
00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:44,399
Speaker 1: the kinks, that this is going to be something that's

774
00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:45,840
Speaker 1: going to grow and that people are going to be

775
00:36:45,880 --> 00:36:49,719
Speaker 1: more interested in participating in. Yeah, I personally kind of

776
00:36:49,719 --> 00:36:52,480
Speaker 1: like the idea of it, like the principle behind everybody

777
00:36:52,520 --> 00:36:54,480
Speaker 1: having a little bit of skin in the game. But yeah,

778
00:36:54,520 --> 00:36:56,240
Speaker 1: like you said, I mean there are a lot of

779
00:36:56,120 --> 00:36:58,319
Speaker 1: some of those specific agreements have not been great. Ye,

780
00:36:59,280 --> 00:37:01,960
Speaker 1: taking advantage of the ability for them to change the agreements,

781
00:37:02,040 --> 00:37:03,640
Speaker 1: right Like, I mean that's what they say, Oh, now

782
00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:05,520
Speaker 1: you've gotta sign a second one, and it's like, oh,

783
00:37:05,560 --> 00:37:09,800
Speaker 1: that didn't quite cover your full undergrad or whatever degree

784
00:37:09,840 --> 00:37:11,960
Speaker 1: it is that you're seeking after. Now you have to

785
00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:14,360
Speaker 1: sign up for another income share agreement. Before you know what,

786
00:37:14,360 --> 00:37:17,879
Speaker 1: they're taking large percentages of your future income, right. Yeah.

787
00:37:19,719 --> 00:37:22,560
Speaker 1: The let's talk about grad school loans for a second.

788
00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:26,600
Speaker 1: The Wall Street Journal they had this article recently detailing how,

789
00:37:26,719 --> 00:37:29,880
Speaker 1: like even law school students, they're getting crushed by student

790
00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:32,960
Speaker 1: loan debt and they're unable to earn a decent living

791
00:37:33,360 --> 00:37:37,120
Speaker 1: after graduating. So with that in mind, what considerations should

792
00:37:37,120 --> 00:37:42,360
Speaker 1: be made before borrowing for an advanced degree. The biggest

793
00:37:42,360 --> 00:37:44,080
Speaker 1: thing I think that people need to be thinking about

794
00:37:44,239 --> 00:37:47,600
Speaker 1: as they get prepared for graduate degrees is what do

795
00:37:47,640 --> 00:37:51,880
Speaker 1: I actually need in order to um pursue this degree?

796
00:37:51,920 --> 00:37:53,759
Speaker 1: Because what's happening right now is that there's there's no

797
00:37:53,800 --> 00:37:56,440
Speaker 1: limit on what you can borrow. So you know, people

798
00:37:56,480 --> 00:37:59,240
Speaker 1: are borrowing their education. They're making sure that their housing

799
00:37:59,280 --> 00:38:02,440
Speaker 1: costs are covered there, you know, their Friday night drinks

800
00:38:02,440 --> 00:38:09,000
Speaker 1: and beer covered exactly. They're buying their car with their

801
00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:11,799
Speaker 1: student payments. So these are the things that you know,

802
00:38:11,840 --> 00:38:14,359
Speaker 1: like they said, lack of financial literacy and just trying

803
00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:16,359
Speaker 1: to get by. You don't realize like, oh, I'm going

804
00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:18,399
Speaker 1: to have to pay this back at some point, um,

805
00:38:18,400 --> 00:38:20,480
Speaker 1: and this is gonna set me back as it pertains

806
00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:22,960
Speaker 1: to what I want to accomplish in my financial future.

807
00:38:23,000 --> 00:38:26,920
Speaker 1: So more education would be great, but uh, if you

808
00:38:26,960 --> 00:38:29,640
Speaker 1: are heading to graduate school before you take on that

809
00:38:29,719 --> 00:38:31,840
Speaker 1: six figure that because it's generally six figure that for

810
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:34,719
Speaker 1: just about everybody at this point, some more than others.

811
00:38:34,719 --> 00:38:37,080
Speaker 1: Like you said, lawyers were at around two hundred thousands,

812
00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:42,360
Speaker 1: of veterinarians were around four hundred thousand. Physicians dentists also

813
00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:45,440
Speaker 1: four hundred thousand and up. We've seen a million dollars

814
00:38:45,440 --> 00:38:48,080
Speaker 1: of student loan debt. That is a real thing, and

815
00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:51,400
Speaker 1: that is a very roman I could not imagine that.

816
00:38:51,400 --> 00:38:55,480
Speaker 1: I can't either yeah, and then do some comparison and

817
00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:58,280
Speaker 1: analysis for what you're going to earn, because, like you said, lawyers,

818
00:38:58,280 --> 00:39:00,200
Speaker 1: I think are the ones that are um, you know,

819
00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:02,279
Speaker 1: you get the fancy title, you're trying to live up

820
00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:04,080
Speaker 1: to the hype. You're kind of create a lifestyle that

821
00:39:04,120 --> 00:39:06,759
Speaker 1: says like hey hey mom, mom an attorney, but you're

822
00:39:06,800 --> 00:39:10,319
Speaker 1: also earning like forty five dollars a year. Uh, and

823
00:39:10,360 --> 00:39:12,600
Speaker 1: so the title and the income are not matching up

824
00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:15,160
Speaker 1: with the two student loan debt that you got. You

825
00:39:15,320 --> 00:39:16,840
Speaker 1: do you have a rule of thumb that you suggest

826
00:39:16,840 --> 00:39:19,080
Speaker 1: to people then to in order to like how do

827
00:39:19,120 --> 00:39:21,040
Speaker 1: you know how much you should borrow? Like how do

828
00:39:21,080 --> 00:39:24,279
Speaker 1: you know? Like Okay, actually, I definitely like this is

829
00:39:24,280 --> 00:39:26,000
Speaker 1: a bad decision for me to go to the school

830
00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:28,279
Speaker 1: and take on this debt load in order to get

831
00:39:28,280 --> 00:39:30,600
Speaker 1: this degree. Like what rule of thumb do you have

832
00:39:30,680 --> 00:39:33,080
Speaker 1: for people who are trying to figure out the cost

833
00:39:33,080 --> 00:39:36,680
Speaker 1: benefit analysis of getting an advanced degree? I would say

834
00:39:36,880 --> 00:39:38,880
Speaker 1: to spend a little bit time of like understanding like

835
00:39:38,920 --> 00:39:42,120
Speaker 1: what the lowest paying job in the profession you intend

836
00:39:42,160 --> 00:39:46,759
Speaker 1: to go into post graduate um is versus what the

837
00:39:46,880 --> 00:39:49,439
Speaker 1: you know, averages or the medium and the mean because

838
00:39:49,480 --> 00:39:52,400
Speaker 1: a lot of those numbers are like you said, averages

839
00:39:52,440 --> 00:39:55,239
Speaker 1: that are have the outliers put into it, so it's

840
00:39:55,239 --> 00:39:57,520
Speaker 1: not the actual I think it's a median is the

841
00:39:57,520 --> 00:40:00,120
Speaker 1: proper term where you get like how many of and

842
00:40:00,200 --> 00:40:03,319
Speaker 1: the middle of the road as opposed to the outliers

843
00:40:03,360 --> 00:40:07,000
Speaker 1: that are making bank exactly. And yeah, like I said,

844
00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:10,080
Speaker 1: we always see average numbers, not median numbers. So to

845
00:40:10,200 --> 00:40:12,160
Speaker 1: really get an understanding of like what the low end

846
00:40:12,200 --> 00:40:14,520
Speaker 1: of the earnings are and then build your build yourself

847
00:40:14,520 --> 00:40:17,360
Speaker 1: a budget based on that, that would be a good exercise.

848
00:40:17,400 --> 00:40:19,719
Speaker 1: Like if poop hits the fan and I don't get

849
00:40:19,760 --> 00:40:21,920
Speaker 1: what I want, uh, and I have to take a

850
00:40:22,000 --> 00:40:24,960
Speaker 1: job in this industry that is, you know, far less

851
00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:28,120
Speaker 1: than I thought, how would I live? Um, and then

852
00:40:28,280 --> 00:40:30,600
Speaker 1: use that as a guiding principle for whether or not

853
00:40:30,719 --> 00:40:32,680
Speaker 1: I want to take the risk on of taking on

854
00:40:32,800 --> 00:40:34,920
Speaker 1: this additional debt. I love it. Yeah, I love that,

855
00:40:34,960 --> 00:40:37,840
Speaker 1: And I think that's the kind of the due diligence

856
00:40:37,880 --> 00:40:40,799
Speaker 1: that people don't take Sometimes before getting a degree, it's

857
00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:44,360
Speaker 1: just assumed that, well, of course, getting this degree is

858
00:40:44,360 --> 00:40:47,040
Speaker 1: going to lead to a higher income, and so I'm

859
00:40:47,040 --> 00:40:49,520
Speaker 1: just gonna keep on pilot on that debt and then

860
00:40:49,520 --> 00:40:52,120
Speaker 1: it leads to a heartache in the end and just um,

861
00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:56,280
Speaker 1: sometimes a decade plus of just really tough financial situation.

862
00:40:56,640 --> 00:40:58,319
Speaker 1: I want to know your advice, though, Lauren, to like

863
00:40:58,440 --> 00:41:01,359
Speaker 1: real quick, what's your advice to young folks or our

864
00:41:01,400 --> 00:41:03,720
Speaker 1: parents of high school or is about taking on student

865
00:41:03,760 --> 00:41:06,200
Speaker 1: loan debt even just for an undergraduate degree. I mean

866
00:41:06,280 --> 00:41:08,879
Speaker 1: some of our listeners, they might have middle school age

867
00:41:08,920 --> 00:41:10,799
Speaker 1: kids or they're getting in high school, and they're trying

868
00:41:10,800 --> 00:41:13,319
Speaker 1: to figure out, like, how do I guide how do

869
00:41:13,360 --> 00:41:16,680
Speaker 1: I shirp up my child through this you know new

870
00:41:16,760 --> 00:41:19,840
Speaker 1: world of just record amounts of student loan debt that

871
00:41:19,920 --> 00:41:22,200
Speaker 1: kids are graduating with. How do I ensure that my

872
00:41:22,280 --> 00:41:26,080
Speaker 1: kid isn't one of those awful, you know situations that

873
00:41:26,200 --> 00:41:29,000
Speaker 1: gets detailed in some future Wall Street Journal article, like

874
00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:31,680
Speaker 1: how do I make sure that my kid graduates and

875
00:41:31,880 --> 00:41:35,319
Speaker 1: isn't like, you know, behind the eight ball? To start with, yeah,

876
00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:37,440
Speaker 1: I would say to the parents out there, this is

877
00:41:37,480 --> 00:41:40,160
Speaker 1: where starting to parent, and you know that from that

878
00:41:40,200 --> 00:41:43,319
Speaker 1: tough love standpoint is so important. So you know, so

879
00:41:43,400 --> 00:41:46,080
Speaker 1: often we want to protect our children, make sure that

880
00:41:46,080 --> 00:41:48,680
Speaker 1: they're you know, well cared for, and we we just

881
00:41:48,719 --> 00:41:50,440
Speaker 1: push things off because we want them to kind of

882
00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:52,600
Speaker 1: live in a bubble. Well, at some point they are

883
00:41:52,640 --> 00:41:55,080
Speaker 1: going to become adults, and you don't want them to

884
00:41:55,080 --> 00:41:57,759
Speaker 1: be ill prepared for adult ing. Part of parenting is

885
00:41:57,800 --> 00:42:00,400
Speaker 1: making sure that you know you're looking into their future

886
00:42:00,440 --> 00:42:03,000
Speaker 1: for them, and so the conversation needs to start in

887
00:42:03,040 --> 00:42:06,040
Speaker 1: middle school about that there is a cost related to

888
00:42:06,120 --> 00:42:09,399
Speaker 1: going to college and when they're in high school, Um,

889
00:42:09,480 --> 00:42:12,080
Speaker 1: you know these are the costs. You know, like the

890
00:42:12,120 --> 00:42:13,959
Speaker 1: cost is the thing that you need to be thinking

891
00:42:13,960 --> 00:42:16,799
Speaker 1: about and discussing with them, not trying to take them

892
00:42:16,880 --> 00:42:19,239
Speaker 1: or shield them from so they have a really good

893
00:42:19,320 --> 00:42:22,120
Speaker 1: understanding of what's realistic and and having them think about

894
00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:24,520
Speaker 1: what happens in the future. So we go to fancy

895
00:42:24,560 --> 00:42:27,120
Speaker 1: school X y Z. That costs you know, fifty tho

896
00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:30,640
Speaker 1: dollars a year. Um, and you know I made enough

897
00:42:30,680 --> 00:42:34,399
Speaker 1: money that I am you don't qualify for any financial aid. Uh,

898
00:42:34,480 --> 00:42:36,359
Speaker 1: you're gonna be taking out thirty thousand dollars a year

899
00:42:36,400 --> 00:42:38,000
Speaker 1: of student loan debt, which is gonna be a hundred

900
00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:41,200
Speaker 1: and twenty thousand, and you know, as an undergraduate, that's

901
00:42:41,200 --> 00:42:43,319
Speaker 1: a thing to be thinking about. Um. And so that

902
00:42:43,480 --> 00:42:45,520
Speaker 1: is a good point to for parents that are higher

903
00:42:45,520 --> 00:42:47,839
Speaker 1: earners that may not be in a position to say

904
00:42:47,880 --> 00:42:51,080
Speaker 1: for their children's education. Uh. Like I said that, that

905
00:42:51,160 --> 00:42:53,800
Speaker 1: conversation is going to be that much more important because

906
00:42:53,840 --> 00:42:56,120
Speaker 1: I've seen a lot of social pressure. You know, maybe

907
00:42:56,120 --> 00:42:58,960
Speaker 1: you've been paying for private school up to this point, um,

908
00:42:59,160 --> 00:43:01,440
Speaker 1: and everybody, like I said, it's going off to fancy

909
00:43:01,440 --> 00:43:03,080
Speaker 1: school x y Z. So you're like, oh, if my

910
00:43:03,160 --> 00:43:05,000
Speaker 1: child gets into that school, I have to make sure

911
00:43:05,040 --> 00:43:07,120
Speaker 1: they go there. Um, it's okay to send your kid

912
00:43:07,120 --> 00:43:09,160
Speaker 1: to community college because it's gonna better for their overall

913
00:43:09,200 --> 00:43:12,080
Speaker 1: financial future. How cool is it if they get to

914
00:43:12,080 --> 00:43:13,719
Speaker 1: go to fancy school X y Z and then they

915
00:43:13,719 --> 00:43:16,120
Speaker 1: get out of school and they're making thirty dollars you know,

916
00:43:16,160 --> 00:43:19,200
Speaker 1: with the d and twenty dollars of private student loan

917
00:43:19,239 --> 00:43:22,320
Speaker 1: debt at that point. Well, and even if community college

918
00:43:22,320 --> 00:43:26,120
Speaker 1: isn't necessarily cool, it's way cooler than graduating with like

919
00:43:26,120 --> 00:43:28,520
Speaker 1: bolo do debt that you can't afford. To pay exactly.

920
00:43:28,560 --> 00:43:30,320
Speaker 1: And so this is where you start to think ahead.

921
00:43:30,320 --> 00:43:33,080
Speaker 1: If you've made financial decisions that you're not proud of,

922
00:43:33,280 --> 00:43:36,320
Speaker 1: how can you change the trajectory for your children's future

923
00:43:36,640 --> 00:43:38,480
Speaker 1: and not put them in a situation where they're going

924
00:43:38,520 --> 00:43:40,760
Speaker 1: to make financial decisions that they're going to be digging

925
00:43:40,800 --> 00:43:44,400
Speaker 1: themselves a hole before they even get started. And that

926
00:43:44,560 --> 00:43:46,319
Speaker 1: is not the position you want your kids to be.

927
00:43:46,400 --> 00:43:48,600
Speaker 1: And I mean, Joel and I are oldest. We both

928
00:43:48,680 --> 00:43:51,200
Speaker 1: have eight year olds, and these are conversations we have

929
00:43:51,239 --> 00:43:54,000
Speaker 1: already started with them, talking about college, the cost stuff,

930
00:43:54,040 --> 00:43:56,640
Speaker 1: college saving four that and obviously the my eight year

931
00:43:56,640 --> 00:43:59,320
Speaker 1: old you can't go but it's just not happening. Sorry,

932
00:44:00,000 --> 00:44:02,640
Speaker 1: the first gut entrepreneurship at the age of eighteen. Hey,

933
00:44:02,680 --> 00:44:06,000
Speaker 1: there's nothing actually wrong with entrepreneurship. Yeah, Lauren, this has

934
00:44:06,040 --> 00:44:09,400
Speaker 1: been a really insightful, fun conversation. We really appreciate you

935
00:44:09,400 --> 00:44:11,719
Speaker 1: coming on. Working folks, go to learn more about you

936
00:44:11,840 --> 00:44:15,480
Speaker 1: and to specifically learn more about student loans student loan

937
00:44:15,520 --> 00:44:18,400
Speaker 1: repayments as well. Definitely, if you're looking for me, you

938
00:44:18,440 --> 00:44:21,120
Speaker 1: can find me on pretty much every social media platform

939
00:44:21,200 --> 00:44:23,920
Speaker 1: and you can find my website so worth dash winning

940
00:44:24,000 --> 00:44:27,080
Speaker 1: dot com or Lauren dash Williams dot com depending on

941
00:44:27,080 --> 00:44:29,400
Speaker 1: whether you're looking for the Olympian or the financial planner.

942
00:44:30,640 --> 00:44:32,319
Speaker 1: And if you want help with your student loans, I

943
00:44:32,360 --> 00:44:35,279
Speaker 1: recommend going to Student Loan Planner dot com. Like I said,

944
00:44:35,280 --> 00:44:40,279
Speaker 1: tons of free resources, uh, tons of of certified professionals,

945
00:44:40,280 --> 00:44:44,319
Speaker 1: so we are all student Loan Certified Student Loan Professionals

946
00:44:44,320 --> 00:44:47,640
Speaker 1: CFPS or c f A s uh and very well

947
00:44:47,719 --> 00:44:50,480
Speaker 1: versed in student loans. In addition to you know, general

948
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:54,359
Speaker 1: personal finance. So those are the three places I would look. Awesome, Lauren,

949
00:44:54,400 --> 00:44:56,560
Speaker 1: it's been great chatting with you. Thanks for all the

950
00:44:56,560 --> 00:44:58,200
Speaker 1: information and just for hanging out with us. We really

951
00:44:58,239 --> 00:45:00,560
Speaker 1: appreciate it. It was so fun hanging out with you

952
00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:03,080
Speaker 1: all today. All right, man, that was a great convo

953
00:45:03,400 --> 00:45:06,920
Speaker 1: with Lauren Williams. And yeah, just a lot of helpful insight,

954
00:45:07,040 --> 00:45:10,799
Speaker 1: especially in the tumultuous world of student loans. There's um

955
00:45:10,840 --> 00:45:12,600
Speaker 1: just a lot of things for people to think about,

956
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:15,960
Speaker 1: especially right now with the extended for parents. Right there's

957
00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:17,799
Speaker 1: a lot of stuff moving, a lot kind of what

958
00:45:17,880 --> 00:45:20,120
Speaker 1: feels like that's up in the air. But I think

959
00:45:20,200 --> 00:45:23,480
Speaker 1: Lauren gave us a great framework for those out there

960
00:45:23,480 --> 00:45:26,360
Speaker 1: who have student loans and how to approach their student loans.

961
00:45:26,440 --> 00:45:28,120
Speaker 1: But yeah, I'll go ahead and get to my big

962
00:45:28,160 --> 00:45:31,080
Speaker 1: takeaway for this episode. I want you to go first.

963
00:45:32,080 --> 00:45:36,759
Speaker 1: So she specifically addressed graduate student loans. Uh, And basically

964
00:45:37,040 --> 00:45:39,920
Speaker 1: I just liked what she said regarding knowing what you

965
00:45:39,960 --> 00:45:42,319
Speaker 1: need and only get the amount of money that you

966
00:45:42,360 --> 00:45:45,600
Speaker 1: need for that degree. Don't look at your other living

967
00:45:45,640 --> 00:45:48,200
Speaker 1: expenses because hopefully you're working at that point in time

968
00:45:48,200 --> 00:45:50,200
Speaker 1: and you're able to cover those expenses. You're able to

969
00:45:50,239 --> 00:45:53,120
Speaker 1: sustain yourself with that job or that part time job.

970
00:45:53,400 --> 00:45:56,960
Speaker 1: Don't be tempted just because you can uh into taking

971
00:45:56,960 --> 00:46:00,279
Speaker 1: out a bunch in student loans that you end up like,

972
00:46:00,280 --> 00:46:03,600
Speaker 1: like she said, putting that towards going out with some

973
00:46:03,640 --> 00:46:06,880
Speaker 1: friends for drinks or a vacation or a car. It

974
00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:09,920
Speaker 1: can be so easy to be attempted down that path

975
00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:12,560
Speaker 1: when it's just right there hanging before you. So I

976
00:46:12,560 --> 00:46:15,000
Speaker 1: think that was some great advice from Lauren. Yeah. I

977
00:46:15,040 --> 00:46:17,320
Speaker 1: think that there's like nothing else in life too where

978
00:46:17,800 --> 00:46:19,920
Speaker 1: we don't look at the price tag before we buy it,

979
00:46:19,960 --> 00:46:22,520
Speaker 1: except for maybe health health care. Health care, and that's

980
00:46:22,560 --> 00:46:24,399
Speaker 1: like the old one other place. But I think people

981
00:46:24,440 --> 00:46:26,400
Speaker 1: so often do that when it comes to higher education,

982
00:46:26,600 --> 00:46:29,239
Speaker 1: is they fail to really look at the cost and

983
00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:31,280
Speaker 1: then the benefit they're going to receive from it. It's

984
00:46:31,320 --> 00:46:33,919
Speaker 1: just kind of an assumption that getting this degree, getting

985
00:46:33,920 --> 00:46:36,480
Speaker 1: a higher education is going to lead to, you know,

986
00:46:36,719 --> 00:46:39,279
Speaker 1: increased earnings and it's gonna be worth it. Of course

987
00:46:39,320 --> 00:46:42,360
Speaker 1: it's gonna be worth it, but in in in many

988
00:46:42,400 --> 00:46:45,080
Speaker 1: cases it is. But then, uh, there are a lot

989
00:46:45,080 --> 00:46:47,520
Speaker 1: of cases where people don't run the numbers, where they're

990
00:46:47,560 --> 00:46:49,399
Speaker 1: not going into it with eyes wide open, and then

991
00:46:49,400 --> 00:46:52,399
Speaker 1: they end up with student loan debt that's backbreaking and

992
00:46:53,239 --> 00:46:56,799
Speaker 1: income post graduation that isn't as robust as they would

993
00:46:56,800 --> 00:46:59,080
Speaker 1: have hoped. Yeah. Yeah, Well, in her advice to specifically

994
00:46:59,120 --> 00:47:02,760
Speaker 1: about recent when you're researching typical salaries for whatever degree

995
00:47:02,760 --> 00:47:05,400
Speaker 1: you're getting, don't necessarily look at the average, uh, and

996
00:47:05,440 --> 00:47:08,600
Speaker 1: don't go best case scenario, like be realistic, look at

997
00:47:08,800 --> 00:47:11,560
Speaker 1: you know what maybe the median salary is or maybe

998
00:47:11,560 --> 00:47:13,399
Speaker 1: even you know what's on the lower end of that.

999
00:47:13,520 --> 00:47:15,520
Speaker 1: It would be like basing your budget off like the

1000
00:47:15,560 --> 00:47:19,719
Speaker 1: best month. Don't go off of averages. Like when she

1001
00:47:19,800 --> 00:47:21,080
Speaker 1: was talking about that made me think of like the

1002
00:47:21,160 --> 00:47:23,920
Speaker 1: joke about Bill Gates walking into a bar, like if

1003
00:47:23,960 --> 00:47:25,919
Speaker 1: he walks into a bar, like the average net worth

1004
00:47:25,960 --> 00:47:29,480
Speaker 1: of everyone shoots up dramatically. That's not because they all,

1005
00:47:29,760 --> 00:47:31,319
Speaker 1: you know, all of a sudden became worth more. It's

1006
00:47:31,360 --> 00:47:33,640
Speaker 1: because he makes so much, and so they don't get

1007
00:47:33,680 --> 00:47:36,760
Speaker 1: pulled into that trap of thinking that you're definitely gonna

1008
00:47:36,800 --> 00:47:39,319
Speaker 1: be making average or above average. Yeah. I think my

1009
00:47:39,360 --> 00:47:42,560
Speaker 1: big takeaway was perseverance. And Lauren is one of those

1010
00:47:42,640 --> 00:47:46,400
Speaker 1: people who has persevered in multiple different arenas and multiple

1011
00:47:46,400 --> 00:47:49,920
Speaker 1: different facets of her life. And that's why I admire

1012
00:47:50,080 --> 00:47:54,520
Speaker 1: She's incredibly just accomplished and just also cooling down to earth.

1013
00:47:54,560 --> 00:47:58,600
Speaker 1: But her perseverance and kind of her admonition for us

1014
00:47:58,680 --> 00:48:01,439
Speaker 1: all to persevere a little bit more or was I think.

1015
00:48:01,719 --> 00:48:03,920
Speaker 1: I don't know. I appreciate that because I feel like

1016
00:48:03,960 --> 00:48:07,200
Speaker 1: it takes a lot of discipline to achieve financial freedom.

1017
00:48:07,239 --> 00:48:10,759
Speaker 1: It's not one of those things that comes along by happenstance, right.

1018
00:48:10,800 --> 00:48:12,920
Speaker 1: It takes a lot of intentionality and putting in the

1019
00:48:13,000 --> 00:48:16,520
Speaker 1: hard work. And I think, especially in modern society, we

1020
00:48:16,600 --> 00:48:20,040
Speaker 1: want to put money in a cryptocurrency, we want to

1021
00:48:20,040 --> 00:48:21,200
Speaker 1: see it go to the moon like we wanted to

1022
00:48:21,200 --> 00:48:24,880
Speaker 1: happen overnight. We want our financial troubles to go away quickly,

1023
00:48:25,239 --> 00:48:28,359
Speaker 1: but that is unrealistic, Like we get rich slowly, and

1024
00:48:28,480 --> 00:48:30,840
Speaker 1: the good things in life come to those who persevere.

1025
00:48:30,920 --> 00:48:33,840
Speaker 1: So yeah, I think that was probably my big takeaway

1026
00:48:34,040 --> 00:48:35,839
Speaker 1: from this combo. But let's get back to the beer, Matt.

1027
00:48:35,920 --> 00:48:38,279
Speaker 1: This one was called The Donkey in the Thistle is

1028
00:48:38,320 --> 00:48:41,120
Speaker 1: by Mad Fritz Brewing Company. This was donated by your

1029
00:48:41,160 --> 00:48:43,399
Speaker 1: old college roommate, cal So, Yeah, what were your thoughts

1030
00:48:43,480 --> 00:48:46,600
Speaker 1: on this pale lagger? Yeah, thanks to my old buddy

1031
00:48:46,640 --> 00:48:49,000
Speaker 1: for donating this one to the show. Uh. First of all,

1032
00:48:49,040 --> 00:48:50,719
Speaker 1: I want to mention that it came in one of

1033
00:48:50,719 --> 00:48:54,719
Speaker 1: these fancy uh stopper bottles, right, so, like it looks

1034
00:48:54,719 --> 00:48:56,200
Speaker 1: like a wine bottle, but it's kind of got like

1035
00:48:56,239 --> 00:48:58,719
Speaker 1: the metal what's it called. It's got like the metal

1036
00:48:58,719 --> 00:49:00,719
Speaker 1: stopper built into what we can kind flip it down. Yeah,

1037
00:49:00,719 --> 00:49:02,239
Speaker 1: I don't know what it's called, but I like, you know, yeah,

1038
00:49:02,719 --> 00:49:05,520
Speaker 1: it's super fancy. Uh. And this brewery is out of

1039
00:49:05,640 --> 00:49:07,759
Speaker 1: Napa Valley, so they've got a lot of ties. I

1040
00:49:07,760 --> 00:49:10,560
Speaker 1: think there was some of the different vineyards, uh, some

1041
00:49:10,640 --> 00:49:14,080
Speaker 1: of the different wine producing regions over there. But uh

1042
00:49:14,120 --> 00:49:17,719
Speaker 1: so this is a pale lagger man, And the first

1043
00:49:17,719 --> 00:49:19,520
Speaker 1: thing that came to my mind when I took my

1044
00:49:19,520 --> 00:49:22,560
Speaker 1: first sip was that is super pillowy. Uh it had

1045
00:49:22,560 --> 00:49:26,520
Speaker 1: a very European lagger like profile in my opinion, and

1046
00:49:26,560 --> 00:49:28,040
Speaker 1: then on the back end, I feel like it kind

1047
00:49:28,040 --> 00:49:30,320
Speaker 1: of dried out and it almost had like some belgiany

1048
00:49:30,600 --> 00:49:34,120
Speaker 1: like bretty notes as well. But it was really enjoyable,

1049
00:49:34,200 --> 00:49:37,400
Speaker 1: very drinkable, something I enjoyed sharing with you today. What

1050
00:49:37,440 --> 00:49:39,000
Speaker 1: were your thoughts on it? Yeah? Man, I thought this

1051
00:49:39,080 --> 00:49:41,120
Speaker 1: was really interesting. It was dry, it was a little

1052
00:49:41,160 --> 00:49:44,600
Speaker 1: bit funky. I feel like this beer was producing rustic

1053
00:49:44,680 --> 00:49:46,960
Speaker 1: vibes for me. Uh yeah. Part of it was the

1054
00:49:47,040 --> 00:49:49,880
Speaker 1: label of basic like a donkey a beast of burden

1055
00:49:50,200 --> 00:49:52,480
Speaker 1: on the front. But then also gistle is also in

1056
00:49:52,520 --> 00:49:54,960
Speaker 1: the name. Yeah. Yeah, it feels like, you know, tumble

1057
00:49:55,000 --> 00:49:56,560
Speaker 1: weeds gonna blow by, and this is this is like

1058
00:49:56,640 --> 00:50:00,960
Speaker 1: John Steinbeck beer. Yeah. I love John's vibes. Yeah, totally.

1059
00:50:00,960 --> 00:50:03,439
Speaker 1: This is the beer I would drink while reading East

1060
00:50:03,440 --> 00:50:05,759
Speaker 1: of Eaten. My favorite all time. But uh so, yeah,

1061
00:50:05,760 --> 00:50:08,400
Speaker 1: I thought it had not just that rustic vibe on

1062
00:50:08,400 --> 00:50:11,760
Speaker 1: the artwork, but also in the flavor profile. Really really interesting.

1063
00:50:11,840 --> 00:50:15,080
Speaker 1: It's very unique and I'm all about these beers that

1064
00:50:15,120 --> 00:50:18,640
Speaker 1: are funky and relaxed and mellow and yeah, so big

1065
00:50:18,640 --> 00:50:20,400
Speaker 1: thanks to Cal for giving us a spear to have

1066
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Speaker 1: on the show. It was it was delicious. Yeah, and

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Speaker 1: we will actually we'll put a picture. We'll make sure

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Speaker 1: there's a picture of the label of this beer up

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Speaker 1: on our website along with some of the different links

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Speaker 1: and resources that Lauren mentioned today on this episode. We

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Speaker 1: actually didn't even talk about this, but she has a

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Speaker 1: book out about being an Olympian and training called The

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Speaker 1: Oval Office. If you're interested in her story there, we'll

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Speaker 1: make sure to link to that book as well. But Joel,

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Speaker 1: that's gonna be it for this episode, Buddy. Until next time,

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Speaker 1: Best Friends Out, Best Friends Out.