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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bloomberg Markets Podcast. I'm Paul Sweeney, alongside

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Speaker 1: my co host Matt Miller.

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Speaker 2: Every business day we bring you interviews from CEOs, market pros,

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Speaker 2: and Bloomberg experts, along with essential market moving news.

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Speaker 1: Find the Bloomberg Markets Podcast on Apple Podcasts or wherever

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Speaker 1: you listen to podcasts, and at Bloomberg dot com Slash

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Speaker 1: podcast To switch skiers and go to the big banks.

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Speaker 1: Allison Williams Bloomberg Intelligence. She's been founding these big banks

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Speaker 1: for a long time. She's got an informed opinion. So, Allison,

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Speaker 1: we've heard from some of the big ones here, what's

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Speaker 1: kind of the takeaway? I mean, I know business trends

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Speaker 1: are tough there from investment banking and so on and

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Speaker 1: so forth, but is trading enough and is wealth management

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Speaker 1: enough to get these big firms through to better capital

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Speaker 1: markets days?

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Speaker 3: So it was a software quarter for the investment bank,

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Speaker 3: but fick with a highlight. It actually came in about

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Speaker 3: stable with a year ago equities trading down about twelve

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Speaker 3: percent across the US banks, and then these coming in

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Speaker 3: down twenty to twenty five percent, which actually was a

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Speaker 3: little bit better than feared and certainly better than you know,

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Speaker 3: the almost fifty percent decline that we saw last year.

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Speaker 3: I would say going forward, you know, the pipelines are

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Speaker 3: still healthy. We've been hearing that for several quarters now,

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Speaker 3: and more and more of the banks are talking about

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Speaker 3: a hope for the second half and twenty twenty four. Certainly,

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Speaker 3: you know, clarity is what's needed to execute these deals.

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Speaker 3: That the curve is pricing in some FED cuts towards

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Speaker 3: the end of the year, and I think that has

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Speaker 3: been something that the banks are looking for as a

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Speaker 3: catalyst for that activity. For banks, you know that the

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Speaker 3: outperforming banks in terms of returns and revenue growth were

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Speaker 3: really those more focused on lending, so Wells Fargo, Japon, Morgan,

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Speaker 3: Bank America, and City. I would say that these four

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Speaker 3: banks plus all of the regional banks, you know, the

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Speaker 3: one thing we heard the universally deposits they're down, and

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Speaker 3: the net interest income outlook is worsening because the costs

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Speaker 3: of those deposits are rising. We did see some some

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Speaker 3: terms of do you.

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Speaker 2: Think a little too ironic? Yeah, I really do think

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Speaker 2: it's for years I was interviewing bank CEO's Allison, who

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Speaker 2: were like, we can't make any money in this low

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Speaker 2: interest rate environment, there's no way for us to make

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Speaker 2: net interest margin with zero rates. And now that the

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Speaker 2: head and other central banks have been like, okay, you know,

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Speaker 2: here's five hundred bases points have increased rates, They're like,

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Speaker 2: we can't make any money in these high interest rate environments.

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Speaker 2: I reget that they just move too quickly for them,

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Speaker 2: But how does it look, you know, going out two

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Speaker 2: or three quarters? Are they gonna are they gonna be

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Speaker 2: raking in the net interest margin by Q four?

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Speaker 3: I mean, so keep in mind that it's all about

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Speaker 3: sort of you know, the expectations and where we are. Right.

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Speaker 3: So net interest income was up, I mean it's almost

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Speaker 3: up fifty percent of JP Moore. Again, it was up

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Speaker 3: to you know, forty five percent almost at Wells Fargo,

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Speaker 3: twenty three to twenty five percent of our city group.

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Speaker 3: So the net interest income growth is really strong, and

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Speaker 3: so it is contributing turnings growth. It's just that, you know,

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Speaker 3: investors are looking for the peak, and so I we

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Speaker 3: it was four Q perhaps for some banks, it might

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Speaker 3: be one que for others. And so it's not that

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Speaker 3: they're not making money, it's just that that the lift, right,

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Speaker 3: So they got the lift on the on the on

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Speaker 3: the prices of their loans, but now the prices of

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Speaker 3: the deposits, so they're you know, cost of goods sold,

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Speaker 3: if you will, is finally starting to catch up. And

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Speaker 3: so that's that's and that's coming in a little bit

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Speaker 3: faster than people had anticipated. So you know, it's all

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Speaker 3: about the expectations. So they are still making snipping an

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Speaker 3: amount of money. Again, commercial real estate, that's the big

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Speaker 3: thing we're focusing on. Everyone's focusing on credit. Credit is

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Speaker 3: still really solid. It's weakening at the margin. Commercial real estate,

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Speaker 3: you know, is very early innings, but in general, you know,

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Speaker 3: the returns this quarter were still pretty good.

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Speaker 1: Head Count, Allison, I mean, when you talk about some

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Speaker 1: some weakness in these businesses, that seems to be the

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Speaker 1: first place where these big banks can go to can

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Speaker 1: reduce expenses. What are they saying about headcount going forward?

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Speaker 3: So starting to hear definitely on the investment banking side

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Speaker 3: of things, you know, pockets of cuts. As I said

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Speaker 3: that the pipelines have been there for a while, and

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Speaker 3: there really weren't reductions last year because the banks keep

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Speaker 3: holding out hope that that revenue is coming back. But

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Speaker 3: we are starting to see some some reductions. We're also hearing,

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Speaker 3: you know, more broadly so Goldman had had made some

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Speaker 3: pretty sizable cuts, as we know at the very beginning

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Speaker 3: of the year. They're making cuts in their consumer bank.

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Speaker 3: You know, Bank of America is actually talking about hiring

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Speaker 3: people this year, but then things you know, topping out

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Speaker 3: after that, and to some extent it is you know,

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Speaker 3: sort of the attrition is also slowing because it's just

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Speaker 3: not the same job market that it was a year ago.

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Speaker 1: Yep, absolutely, all right, Alison, thanks so much for jumping

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Speaker 1: on with us. We appreciate it. And it's busy time

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Speaker 1: of the quarterview with the banks reporting here, they tend

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Speaker 1: to be one of the first groups out of the gate.

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Speaker 1: Allison Williams, she's a senior bank's analyst for Bloomberg Intelligence.

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Speaker 1: She's based in our Princeton University office. And again, I

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Speaker 1: think what we've heard from a lot of the banks,

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Speaker 1: the big banks as well as the regional banks is

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Speaker 1: the business is okay at the moment, and they are

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Speaker 1: cautiously optimistic. But you know, I think i'd probably double

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Speaker 1: underscore cautiously at this point when we hear from those

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Speaker 1: bank management teams S and p. Five hundred. I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: say it for Lisa Bromwins. It is unched on the day.

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Speaker 1: Literally nothing going on out there in the SMP. But

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Speaker 1: that's okay. It's a Friday yet, Yeah, because we've got

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Speaker 1: options expiring at one pm Wall Street time.

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Speaker 4: You're listening to the team Ken's are Live program Bloomberg

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Speaker 4: Markets at ten am Eastern on Bloomberg dot Com, the

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Speaker 4: iHeartRadio app and the Bloomberg Business app, or listen on

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Speaker 4: demand wherever you get your podcasts.

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Speaker 1: Our next guest has perspective, let me put it that way.

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Speaker 1: Very very expansive, resume, very impressive, and we need perspective

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Speaker 1: in a big way here. Nancy Tangler joins us. She's

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Speaker 1: a CIO of Laffer Tangler Investments.

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Speaker 5: Gets this.

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Speaker 1: She splits her time map between Lake Tahoe and Scottsdale. We,

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Speaker 1: I mean, figured it out completely. Nancy, thanks so much

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Speaker 1: for joining us here. We appreciate it coming to New

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Speaker 1: York City to.

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Speaker 2: The Loma Point Loma University. Yeah, I know where Point

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Speaker 2: Loma is.

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Speaker 1: How good is that?

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Speaker 2: That's another great time. Geographically, You've done very.

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Speaker 1: Fun, very well, and we're stuck here in midtown East

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Speaker 1: I don't know how that works, all right, Nancy, You've

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Speaker 1: seen these markets over cycles, over long periods of time. Here,

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Speaker 1: we've just come out of a pandemic. We had some

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Speaker 1: crazy fiscal stimulus. Now to stry to pull that stimulus away.

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Speaker 1: The FED has raised rates at an unprecedented level over

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Speaker 1: the past four quarters. How you guys kind of positioned

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Speaker 1: yourself for this environment right here.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, So I've been pretty critical of Washington and the FED.

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Speaker 6: You know, I wrote a piece in July of twenty

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Speaker 6: twenty one that was entitled mister Magoo's Washington, and that

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Speaker 6: is what they remind me of. They kind of walk

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Speaker 6: along and there's destruction all around them, and somehow they

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Speaker 6: come out of it clean. But I think if the

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Speaker 6: last well, first of all, I wish the FED Reserve

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Speaker 6: Board governors would stop talking.

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Speaker 2: And yeah, they talk way too much all the time,

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Speaker 2: so many of them. I almost wonder they get paid

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Speaker 2: for each speaking engagement because why.

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Speaker 6: I don't know, but I think a little mystique would

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Speaker 6: go a long way. And the last press conference was

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Speaker 6: very disappointing because the FED chair was asked, do you

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Speaker 6: think monetary fiscal policy is too much? Should we could

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Speaker 6: can you say something and he refuses to even correlation

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Speaker 6: between the spending.

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Speaker 2: And you'd missed Alan Greenspan, right.

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Speaker 6: I know, I miss his briefcase.

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Speaker 2: I miss his I miss his testimony because he would

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Speaker 2: freely comment on fiscal policy. And why wouldn't you, I mean,

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Speaker 2: it's such an important component, right, and Vulker.

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Speaker 6: Did, Yeah, you weren't born yet, so you wouldn't know.

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Speaker 2: Oh that's so kind of you, so kind.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 6: So what we've been doing is, first of all, we

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Speaker 6: moved our clients out of bonds in the summer of

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Speaker 6: twenty twenty when the ten year hit fifty bases point yield,

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Speaker 6: and then we've been moving them back in recently and

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Speaker 6: began adding risk back into our equity portfolios, though it

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Speaker 6: sounds counterintuitive last fall. So that was Technology and consumer discretionary,

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Speaker 6: and those are names that we still like, but we've

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Speaker 6: been trimming them because they've they've appreciated so much, and

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Speaker 6: we're looking for companies that are Our investing theme is

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Speaker 6: old economy companies that are embracing the digital revolution think McDonald's, Chipotle,

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Speaker 6: Public Storage, and then the suppliers of the digital solutions.

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Speaker 1: So what are some of the names that. You know, again,

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Speaker 1: we have a FED that's kind of at or close

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Speaker 1: to peaking on rates, you know, so maybe some of

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Speaker 1: that headwind for some of the tech and consumer names

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Speaker 1: is kind of abating a little bit.

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Speaker 2: Let's go public storage because McDonald's and Chipotle, Paul and

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Speaker 2: I are intimately familiar with public storage. We don't know so, well,

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Speaker 2: why do you like them? What's that company about?

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Speaker 6: So they're engaging over fifty percent of their new clients digitally,

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Speaker 6: so they never meet with an individual, They access their

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Speaker 6: storage locker digitally, and so they've really levered up on

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Speaker 6: productivity at the company and they've they paid a special

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Speaker 6: dividend last year of thirteen dollars a share, and they

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Speaker 6: raised the dividends. So we dislike it for a steady,

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Speaker 6: stable earner in the portfolio to complement some of the

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Speaker 6: riskier names that we have in there.

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Speaker 2: And you have you have Microsoft as well? Or do

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Speaker 2: you like Microsoft? Because lately every company that has a

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Speaker 2: difficult earnings report just has to mention AI to try

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Speaker 2: and get back in. But Microsoft's been at this game

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Speaker 2: for longer than you know.

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Speaker 6: Tsmc Well, we trimmed it, I mean because we bought

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Speaker 6: more last fall, and it was one of our largest

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Speaker 6: holdings across all of our strategies. But it went well

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Speaker 6: above our guidelines. So we've pulled back on weakness. We'd

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Speaker 6: be adding to it.

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Speaker 2: That's all those big giant megatech companies, Amazon, Microsoft, Oracle

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Speaker 2: you held right, So are those companies that you've taken profits.

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Speaker 6: We've only taken profits so far in Salesforce and in

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Speaker 6: Microsoft this round. But historically, you know, we've been at

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Speaker 6: this for a long time. We were buyers of Apple

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Speaker 6: in twenty thirteen, and so we've been a net seller

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Speaker 6: of that stock for a long time, and we have

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Speaker 6: it represents about three percent of our portfolio. The others

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Speaker 6: are much larger portion of it. But yeah, I think

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Speaker 6: now is a really interesting time to look at Amazon.

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Speaker 6: I thought Andy Jasse's shareholder letter was excellent. I think

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Speaker 6: he's being Tim Cooked, which was you know, everyone doubted

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Speaker 6: Tim Cook at Apple, and that's when you got it

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Speaker 6: once in a lifetime opportunity to buy it at nine

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Speaker 6: times earnings.

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Speaker 1: You know you mentioned one of your names buying on

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Speaker 1: weakness is a name that's been in the news a lot,

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Speaker 1: and that's Tesla. Yeah, I guess you had the stomach

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Speaker 1: to you know, deal with Elon Musk. What's your tesla

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Speaker 1: call here?

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Speaker 6: So we're going to be adding to it. I think,

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Speaker 6: you know, the margin decline is meaningful, but he still

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Speaker 6: has margins that are twice GM and three or four

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Speaker 6: times FORD. What I think is important about Elon Musk

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Speaker 6: is that he seems to be always going where the

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Speaker 6: puck is going, not where it's been. And so the

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Speaker 6: price kept cutting, and then today he announced price increases.

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Speaker 6: That's going to drive people to the ecosystem, and I think,

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Speaker 6: much like Apple, that's a really smart strategy. So he

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Speaker 6: doesn't mind being underestimated. I think I owned it once

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Speaker 6: and sold it because that was when he was on

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Speaker 6: the Joe Rogan podcast smoking.

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Speaker 2: Smoking weed, Yeah yesterday. It was four twenty so a

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Speaker 2: lot of people were smoking yeah.

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Speaker 6: And I sold it because you know, he had his

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Speaker 6: top management team turned over a number of times. He

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Speaker 6: had that sec problem. And it went up four or

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Speaker 6: five fold from there. So when we got an opportunity

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Speaker 6: in January to buy it back on a relative price

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Speaker 6: to sales ratio it's still attractive, we stepped in.

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Speaker 2: And it's also interesting that he's doing I mean, essentially

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Speaker 2: you see GM and Ford and all the other legacy

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Speaker 2: automakers raising prices on their you know, very expensive products, right,

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Speaker 2: high margin products, and then doing everything they can to

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Speaker 2: cut prices on their lower end products. And that's certainly

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Speaker 2: what Musk is doing as well. But since it's all electric,

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Speaker 2: people don't differentiate this much. Right, He's raising prices on

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Speaker 2: the one hundred and thirty thousand dollars SUV while he's

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Speaker 2: cutting prices on the forty five thousand dollars you know Sedan.

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Speaker 2: So it just makes this.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, it's kind of the LVMH of the auto industry, and.

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Speaker 2: It gets that kind of valuation. And I mean it did, right.

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Speaker 2: It was at four hundred, now it's at one sixty. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: so I guess this is the right time.

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Speaker 6: We've picked it off in at like one oh four,

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Speaker 6: but we didn't buy enough. That's that's the perpetual dissatisfaction

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Speaker 6: of being a portfolio manager.

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Speaker 1: All right, Nancy, next time, anytime you're in New York,

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Speaker 1: you need to stop buy because but you're gonna be

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Speaker 1: in Tahoe in Scottsdale. I'll put You're not in New

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Speaker 1: York very often.

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Speaker 2: I am.

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Speaker 6: I'm here every month Okay, well come.

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Speaker 1: Back, let us know when you're coming back on week

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Speaker 1: you here, we'll talk some more stocks and more names.

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Speaker 1: I want to talk you about being a senior woman

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Speaker 1: in a financial services industry. I know you're the author

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Speaker 1: of the book The Woman's Guide to Successful Investing in

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Speaker 1: your working on a second edition. Now we want to

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Speaker 1: get you to talk to you a little bit about

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Speaker 1: that because, as you know, you are somewhat unique in

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Speaker 1: the financial services industry, and we appreciate.

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Speaker 4: That you're listening to the tape. Cat's are live program

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Speaker 4: Bloomberg Markets weekdays at ten am Eastern on Bloomberg Radio,

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Speaker 4: the tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg

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Speaker 4: Business App. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa

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Speaker 4: from our flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play

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Speaker 4: Bloomberg eleven thirty.

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Speaker 1: Deb Bacon, she covers the detailers for Bloomberg Intelligence, is

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Speaker 1: based in London. So we're going to talk to her

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Speaker 1: about Procter and Gamble because she covers Procter and Gamble.

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Speaker 1: But then I'm moving on very quickly to luxury because

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Speaker 1: Deb is my go to voice, as she is for

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Speaker 1: many institutional investors on the luxury business. But deb let's

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Speaker 1: pay the bills here. Let's start with Procter and Gamble.

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Speaker 1: The stocks up three point eight percent. It doesn't sound

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Speaker 1: like a lot, but that's like the the stock never

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Speaker 1: moves that much. So they had some good numbers. Tell

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Speaker 1: us what happened, right?

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Speaker 7: I think you know, I looked at these numbers and

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Speaker 7: the market was already expecting decent sales growth, so there

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Speaker 7: was a little beat on sales. But the big thing

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Speaker 7: here is the amount of growth margin that they're accumulating.

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Speaker 7: And when we think that we're going to see costs

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Speaker 7: start to fall away and also for X headwinds start

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Speaker 7: to transition over the coming quarters, that votes really well

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Speaker 7: for the level of productivity that's there. They're volumes are

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Speaker 7: down three percent, but that's kind of in line with

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Speaker 7: the market. So they're holding market share by value and volume.

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Speaker 7: They're investing heavily in marketing spend, and it really bodes

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Speaker 7: well for where their position going into next fiscal year.

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Speaker 2: What are the four X headwind transitions you're expecting? What

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Speaker 2: are we looking for?

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Speaker 7: So the company expects five percent by year end for

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Speaker 7: fiscal twenty twenty three, and this quarter we're already starting

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Speaker 7: to see that come off. So it was one half

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Speaker 7: way to this is their fiscal Q three pardon.

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Speaker 2: Me, five percent of five percent of.

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Speaker 7: What sorry, so on five percent of sales. So at

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Speaker 7: the top line for fiscal twenty twenty three, you're going

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Speaker 7: to see all in net sales, not one percent, because

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Speaker 7: there's going to be about a five percent for X

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Speaker 7: headwind fiscal twenty twenty three. But as as we've seen

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Speaker 7: through the coming quarters, we see four percent for X

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Speaker 7: headwind in the last Q three and that should go

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Speaker 7: down some more in Q four, So bit by bit

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Speaker 7: into next year, we'll see that headwind turn into tailwind.

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Speaker 7: And at the same time we've seen peak. Of course,

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Speaker 7: we'll start to see some of those coming off, and

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Speaker 7: that just really puts them in good positions for next year.

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Speaker 1: All right, deb, Matt Miller is more of a you know,

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Speaker 1: practer and gamble guy. I'm more of a luxury goods guy.

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Speaker 1: So talk to us about what's going on in the

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Speaker 1: luxury good business. I know you follow all of those names.

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Speaker 1: I want to get it from the angle of China

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Speaker 1: reopening because you know everything I know about the luxury

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Speaker 1: good business I learned by reading your research. But China's reopening,

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Speaker 1: that's going to be a really big tailwind. When will

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Speaker 1: some of the luxury good companies start to see that?

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Speaker 7: I mean in terms of share price, we're seeing that

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Speaker 7: already right, some of the big So it was announced

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Speaker 7: eight to January that that China would do a big reopening,

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Speaker 7: a very big surprise, and already we start to see

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Speaker 7: share price momentum on the back of that. So we've

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Speaker 7: seen the likes of Air Mayres or Brunelo, Kushinelli up

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Speaker 7: over thirty percent year today. So these companies are already

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Speaker 7: swung quite well through second half of twenty twenty two,

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Speaker 7: and then for the sector overall, it's becoming an outperformer.

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Speaker 7: And what we saw was January was still very difficult

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Speaker 7: because people were hesitant to get back in in the marketplace,

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Speaker 7: product not in the right place. By February, these companies

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Speaker 7: are saying that we're seeing traveling, we're seeing spending in stores,

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Speaker 7: a return into the market, but still a drag for

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Speaker 7: China overall in the Asia through the Q one into

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Speaker 7: Q two, though we would expect if there are no

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Speaker 7: big adversaries, that we see double digit growth starting to

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Speaker 7: pick up through Q two year on year and through

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Speaker 7: the rest of twenty twenty three.

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Speaker 1: Talk to us about just the supply chain for some

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Speaker 1: of these luxury retailers. I mean, where do they source

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Speaker 1: their product? Has it been a problem, is it getting better?

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Speaker 1: So on the on the supply chain side, right.

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Speaker 7: So if we think about the heritage companies like ms

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Speaker 7: like LVMH, the Italian traditional luxury makers, everything's produced locally

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Speaker 7: so as in so I need to rephrase that everything

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Speaker 7: is produced out of Europe, so France, Italy and others.

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Speaker 7: So their supply chain is particularly robust, and in fact

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Speaker 7: they're having to probably raise fourty five percent capacity per

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Speaker 7: year just to manage that double digit growth because they

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Speaker 7: have had such an explosion that some of these companies

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Speaker 7: have doubled their sales versus twenty eighteen, So they're fully

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Speaker 7: compensated twenty nineteen, twenty twenty and through the lockdown and

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Speaker 7: they're out at the other end, and they're bigger and

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Speaker 7: stronger than ever. So they're having to build production and

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Speaker 7: build supply chain around that. The big move also has

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Speaker 7: been that pre COVID we saw only around forty five

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Speaker 7: percent of sales online and now that's very much more

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Speaker 7: than doubled, and in the teams many makers, and they're

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Speaker 7: working with big you know, some of the best in

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Speaker 7: class in terms of of partners out there like Farfex,

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Speaker 7: Alibaba Luxury Portals to really do things also online. So

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Speaker 7: they're marketing to more clients baskets of bigger size, and

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Speaker 7: also they're getting a younger generation on board more quickly.

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Speaker 1: So DEBI, I look at you know, the shares of

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Speaker 1: hermez or ames up thirty eight percent this year fifty

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Speaker 1: two week high, up sixty percent on a trailing twelve

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Speaker 1: month basis. Have I missed that luxury trade?

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Speaker 7: You're going to be buying it for forty eight times

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Speaker 7: next year's pe. But I've had so much interest in

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Speaker 7: this stock over the week because the idea here is

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Speaker 7: that you know, there are only three hundred stores worldwide.

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Speaker 7: The company will opened two new production sites for leather

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Speaker 7: goods this shure. They have another production site coming on

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Speaker 7: board every year to twenty twenty seven, and so that's

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Speaker 7: how they're fulfilling their growth. They have waiting lists longer

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Speaker 7: than some of the watch companies, and yet they're also

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Speaker 7: using their one single individual brands to transition into very

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Speaker 7: sizable and weighty sectors. They're doing very well and ready

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Speaker 7: to wear of course into others, into jewelry, into homeware,

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Speaker 7: homewhere is that right?

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Speaker 1: There's plenty of stuff, plenty of stuff for me to

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Speaker 1: spend on Debacon. She's a senior anas covering luxury goods

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Speaker 1: for Bloomberg Intelligence out of London, talking about the practer

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Speaker 1: and gamble numbers very strong, talking about luxury, which means

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Speaker 1: very strong. These stacks have been on an absolute terror

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Speaker 1: in part due to a China reopening.

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Speaker 4: You're listening to the Team Cancer Live program Bloomberg Markets

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Speaker 4: weekdays at ten am Eastern on Bloomberg dot Com, the

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Speaker 4: iHeartRadio app Berg Business Happen or listen on demand wherever

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Speaker 4: you get your podcasts.

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Speaker 1: John Tucker, thank you so much. We appreciate that. Now

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Speaker 1: I kind of forgot about this deal. But it's a

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Speaker 1: big one. Kroger Albertson's the supermarket chained twenty five billion

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Speaker 1: dollar merger. It is winding its way through the regulatory process.

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Speaker 1: We're going to get an update on that, and in

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Speaker 1: order to do that, we have our expert in the

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Interactive Broker Studio. That's Jennifer Lee. She's a senior

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Speaker 1: litigation analy She covers antitrust for Bloomberg. Intelligence absolutely indispensable.

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Speaker 1: When you get these big M and A trades that

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Speaker 1: you know are just going to be looked at by

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Speaker 1: the various regulatory authorities, it's good to get an expert

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Speaker 1: opinion on that. So Jen, just give us the latest

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Speaker 1: here Again, it's a big deal, supermarket business, twenty five

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Speaker 1: billion dollars. Where are we in the review process? Is

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Speaker 1: this deal going to get done?

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Speaker 8: Right?

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Speaker 3: Sure?

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Speaker 9: Well, you know they've been in the investigation phase. So

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Speaker 9: the FTC started their in depth investigation early December, and

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Speaker 9: it usually takes the companies four to five, maybe even

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Speaker 9: six months to finish that up, and the news is

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Speaker 9: quiet during that time. I mean, I think that's why

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Speaker 9: this has been sort of falling off the radar. But

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Speaker 9: I'm thinking it's probably about time soon for the companies

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Speaker 9: to finish that up, and that's when things sort of

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Speaker 9: get into earnest in terms of talking about whether there's

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Speaker 9: a remedy that might be sufficient for the Federal Trade

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Speaker 9: Commission to agree to clear the deal.

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Speaker 2: What does the Federal Trade Commission want?

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Speaker 9: Well, they're going to want divestitures of stores and I

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Speaker 9: think what this is going to come down to is

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Speaker 9: how many stores will have to be sold and who

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Speaker 9: the buyer will be, and whether or not that buyer's adequate.

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Speaker 9: And I believe these companies face a really skeptical Federal

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Speaker 9: Trade Commission on both of those, and I have a

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Speaker 9: funny feeling they're probably not going to be able to

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Speaker 9: come to terms on this, and if they can't, it

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Speaker 9: means they're going to get a lawsuit to block the deal.

435
00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:47,760
Speaker 1: I mean, well, where is Kroger I mean, Alberts' is

436
00:22:47,760 --> 00:22:49,080
Speaker 1: a West Coast chain.

437
00:22:48,920 --> 00:22:50,200
Speaker 2: Right, Kroger's in Columbus.

438
00:22:50,280 --> 00:22:52,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, Kroger's in Columbus in the South. I mean, they're

439
00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:54,360
Speaker 1: not around here. So I don't even think about them.

440
00:22:54,359 --> 00:22:57,400
Speaker 1: But it seems like it's an easy fix, Paul.

441
00:22:57,440 --> 00:22:59,840
Speaker 2: If you want the best of everything, including the price

442
00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:02,680
Speaker 2: club program, okay, very good.

443
00:23:02,840 --> 00:23:05,199
Speaker 1: I would think you just have a big map, and

444
00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:06,879
Speaker 1: where they overlap, you say you got to sell one

445
00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:08,400
Speaker 1: of them, end of story. What's the big deal?

446
00:23:08,600 --> 00:23:08,760
Speaker 2: Right?

447
00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:11,040
Speaker 9: And that's the way it's always gone, Okay, And so

448
00:23:11,320 --> 00:23:13,680
Speaker 9: here's sort of the fundamental problem that the Federal Trade

449
00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:16,320
Speaker 9: Commission is facing and thinking about today. That is the

450
00:23:16,320 --> 00:23:18,480
Speaker 9: way these deals have always gone. You have a map,

451
00:23:18,560 --> 00:23:21,040
Speaker 9: you look at local regions one mile to ten miles.

452
00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:24,160
Speaker 9: If they overlap and it's concentrated, you divest. You're good

453
00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:27,480
Speaker 9: to go. But what that has resulted in in many

454
00:23:27,480 --> 00:23:30,360
Speaker 9: different industries, according to this Federal Trade Commission, is too

455
00:23:30,440 --> 00:23:34,760
Speaker 9: much consolidation and overly concentrated industries. So they don't like

456
00:23:34,800 --> 00:23:38,320
Speaker 9: that approach very much anymore. They've taken it in agriculture,

457
00:23:38,359 --> 00:23:40,680
Speaker 9: you know, They've taken it in many different industries that

458
00:23:40,720 --> 00:23:43,080
Speaker 9: are local in nature. So in this one, I think

459
00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:44,879
Speaker 9: they're going to go beyond that. They're not just going

460
00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:47,399
Speaker 9: to look at these local overlaps. I think they'll also

461
00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:51,160
Speaker 9: define fairly narrow markets, which then increases concentration in those

462
00:23:51,160 --> 00:23:54,760
Speaker 9: local regions. But they may also look in regionally or

463
00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:58,800
Speaker 9: nationally to see the impact of this combination on suppliers.

464
00:23:58,840 --> 00:24:02,000
Speaker 9: They might go the other direction. Okay, right, so a

465
00:24:02,040 --> 00:24:02,720
Speaker 9: package good.

466
00:24:02,600 --> 00:24:05,119
Speaker 1: Store, if I'm in an industry that has Walmart, I'm like,

467
00:24:05,520 --> 00:24:08,800
Speaker 1: I got no problem. I mean, you're jumping on me

468
00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:11,639
Speaker 1: because I'm hooking up with another regional supermarket chain when

469
00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:12,720
Speaker 1: I compete against Walmart.

470
00:24:13,359 --> 00:24:15,240
Speaker 9: Right, And you know, part of the argument is that

471
00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:17,840
Speaker 9: these companies need to combine to better compete with the

472
00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:20,960
Speaker 9: Walmarts and the costcos of Coural. But you know what

473
00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:23,199
Speaker 9: happens when they say, well, we need the scale, we

474
00:24:23,280 --> 00:24:25,240
Speaker 9: need to combine because we need the scale to better

475
00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:27,600
Speaker 9: compete against Walmart and Costco. Oh, but we think we

476
00:24:27,640 --> 00:24:30,240
Speaker 9: can divest a handful of stores and they can succeed

477
00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:33,640
Speaker 9: on their own without that scale. You know, it's difficult

478
00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:35,639
Speaker 9: to make that argument. And that's really what they're going

479
00:24:35,680 --> 00:24:37,800
Speaker 9: to do here. You know, they're talking about three hundred

480
00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:41,639
Speaker 9: stores or so, while in their divestiture agreement, Kroger has

481
00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:43,480
Speaker 9: agreed to go all the way up to six hundred

482
00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:45,760
Speaker 9: and fifty before it has the right to walk away

483
00:24:45,760 --> 00:24:48,040
Speaker 9: from the deal. So I think the FTC is going

484
00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:50,040
Speaker 9: to be looking for that six hundred and fifty number

485
00:24:50,119 --> 00:24:50,440
Speaker 9: or more.

486
00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:53,960
Speaker 2: How long is this going to take? I mean they've

487
00:24:54,240 --> 00:24:58,520
Speaker 2: just they're likely done responding to the FTC's inquiries now, right,

488
00:24:58,560 --> 00:25:02,440
Speaker 2: And then you say, expect maybe a lawsuit at the

489
00:25:02,520 --> 00:25:04,160
Speaker 2: end of the year next year.

490
00:25:04,280 --> 00:25:06,880
Speaker 9: When is it gonna No, I think it'll happen before then.

491
00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:09,240
Speaker 9: So as of April fifth, they had not yet finished

492
00:25:09,320 --> 00:25:12,400
Speaker 9: these what they call second requests. That's the investigation. They

493
00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:15,359
Speaker 9: may be done now. Now technically as soon as they finish.

494
00:25:15,720 --> 00:25:18,760
Speaker 9: The FTC only has thirty days, but it's pretty commonplace

495
00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:21,320
Speaker 9: to enter into a timing agreement with the agency that

496
00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:24,320
Speaker 9: gives it at least another sixty sometimes ninety more days

497
00:25:24,320 --> 00:25:26,880
Speaker 9: beyond that. So let's say they do that, they could

498
00:25:26,880 --> 00:25:29,119
Speaker 9: get and they get the lawsuit, that would be around

499
00:25:29,119 --> 00:25:33,840
Speaker 9: August timeframe. These kinds of lawsuits are for preliminary injunction,

500
00:25:33,960 --> 00:25:37,480
Speaker 9: so they move quickly. The average timing, based on my calculations,

501
00:25:37,520 --> 00:25:40,360
Speaker 9: is about five months from the filing of the complaint

502
00:25:40,400 --> 00:25:43,320
Speaker 9: to a decision, So theoretically there could be a decision

503
00:25:43,359 --> 00:25:45,280
Speaker 9: by the end of this year or even early. In

504
00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:46,160
Speaker 9: one queue, all.

505
00:25:46,119 --> 00:25:47,680
Speaker 1: Right, this is what I always do when I'm talking

506
00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:49,439
Speaker 1: at M and A. I go, M A go, I

507
00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:51,959
Speaker 1: click on the deal and I click on the advisors.

508
00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:55,560
Speaker 1: So the seller here has Credit Swiss and Goldman Sachs

509
00:25:55,600 --> 00:25:59,800
Speaker 1: as their financial advisors. They have seven legal advisors. And

510
00:25:59,840 --> 00:26:02,760
Speaker 1: I'm I'm not talking Mickey Mouse firms here, I'm talking Krevath,

511
00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:05,960
Speaker 1: I'm talking White in case Walktel Lipton. I mean, the

512
00:26:06,040 --> 00:26:09,960
Speaker 1: lawyers are getting paid here big time. It's just crazy

513
00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:12,680
Speaker 1: how that plays out. But I guess the question is,

514
00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:15,359
Speaker 1: is this just the function This tough view of this

515
00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:19,120
Speaker 1: deal is at a function of the democratic administration that if

516
00:26:19,119 --> 00:26:22,159
Speaker 1: this were Republican administration, the FTC might be more inclined

517
00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:23,879
Speaker 1: to let this deal go through, you know.

518
00:26:24,119 --> 00:26:27,040
Speaker 9: Possibly. I think there was sort of a change that

519
00:26:27,119 --> 00:26:30,440
Speaker 9: began in anti trust actually during the Trump administration. It's

520
00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:34,080
Speaker 9: not just this this administration. This one is certainly aggressive

521
00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:38,199
Speaker 9: and activist, but there has been this movement generally and

522
00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:41,960
Speaker 9: somewhat bipartisan, to strengthen up our M and A, the

523
00:26:42,000 --> 00:26:43,600
Speaker 9: way we view M and A and the way we

524
00:26:43,640 --> 00:26:48,159
Speaker 9: scrutinize these deals because of anti trust exactly. Yeah, you know,

525
00:26:48,200 --> 00:26:50,399
Speaker 9: And we also have this example, you know, from in

526
00:26:50,440 --> 00:26:53,280
Speaker 9: twenty fourteen, Safeway and Albertson's merged, and it was a

527
00:26:53,280 --> 00:26:56,880
Speaker 9: big failure. They cleared it, they divested stores, the company

528
00:26:56,880 --> 00:26:59,400
Speaker 9: that bought the divested stores went bankrupt before a year,

529
00:26:59,560 --> 00:27:02,000
Speaker 9: and then I'llson's brought back a bunch of those stores.

530
00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:03,040
Speaker 9: I mean, that is a colossaliz.

531
00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:05,560
Speaker 2: Was it a failure in terms of because I think

532
00:27:05,640 --> 00:27:09,240
Speaker 2: this administration right now has to think not only about antitrust,

533
00:27:09,320 --> 00:27:13,000
Speaker 2: but also about inflation. So the question is with scale,

534
00:27:13,119 --> 00:27:16,640
Speaker 2: are you able to keep prices down or with scale

535
00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:20,520
Speaker 2: are you able to push higher prices onto consumers? Right,

536
00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:23,280
Speaker 2: That's that's the crux of the argument that Biden has

537
00:27:23,320 --> 00:27:24,199
Speaker 2: to worry about right now.

538
00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:28,440
Speaker 9: It's not Biden viously, but his regulators. But and that's

539
00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:31,280
Speaker 9: exactly the issue. I mean, the companies say, with scale,

540
00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:33,560
Speaker 9: this will trickle down to better prices.

541
00:27:33,560 --> 00:27:37,240
Speaker 2: And the companies say, we'll defend it to the regulators

542
00:27:37,520 --> 00:27:39,760
Speaker 2: and to the customers, but to the shareholders they're like, hey,

543
00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:41,280
Speaker 2: if we can get this scale, we're going to push

544
00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:42,440
Speaker 2: through price increasing.

545
00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:45,240
Speaker 9: Exact customers exactly. And once upon a time an argument

546
00:27:45,240 --> 00:27:48,120
Speaker 9: about efficiencies was really helpful in the anti trust context

547
00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:50,960
Speaker 9: because the thought was if a company can gain efficiencies,

548
00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:53,479
Speaker 9: that'll pass down to consumers too in better prices. But

549
00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:56,640
Speaker 9: over time the regulators said, no, this isn't really happening.

550
00:27:56,640 --> 00:27:59,000
Speaker 9: It's just better margins for the companies. It's really not

551
00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:01,600
Speaker 9: trickling down to the consumers. We're not going to give

552
00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:04,439
Speaker 9: as much credence to these efficiencies claims or these claims

553
00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:07,280
Speaker 9: that this scale will allow us to provide better prices.

554
00:28:07,640 --> 00:28:10,000
Speaker 1: All right, so we got this big supermarket deal out there.

555
00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:12,520
Speaker 1: What else are you looking at? What else is you

556
00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:14,840
Speaker 1: know in the lens of kind of this, you know,

557
00:28:15,240 --> 00:28:17,399
Speaker 1: M and a litigation anti trust issues.

558
00:28:17,640 --> 00:28:20,040
Speaker 9: Well, I'm just waiting because I expect the Department of

559
00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:22,280
Speaker 9: Justice is likely to sue to try to block the

560
00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:25,120
Speaker 9: Adobe Figma transaction which has been floating out there.

561
00:28:25,119 --> 00:28:26,639
Speaker 1: Really, that's that's another big one right now.

562
00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:29,240
Speaker 9: Now, that's another big one, and I think twenty billion

563
00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:32,080
Speaker 9: dollars I believe, and I suspect that's going to happen,

564
00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:33,800
Speaker 9: and I think that could happen at any time.

565
00:28:34,119 --> 00:28:34,320
Speaker 10: Now.

566
00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:36,600
Speaker 9: You know, the Apartment of Justice has already sued to

567
00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:39,600
Speaker 9: try to block Jet Blue in Spirit. So I'm watching

568
00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:41,640
Speaker 9: that that's going to go into trial and we'll see

569
00:28:41,680 --> 00:28:44,560
Speaker 9: what happens there. I think they have a pretty good argument,

570
00:28:44,680 --> 00:28:47,560
Speaker 9: to be honest, in that case. I suspect the DOJ

571
00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:52,320
Speaker 9: can be successful. Really, yes, because I think it's.

572
00:28:51,800 --> 00:28:54,120
Speaker 1: Jef bluent Spirit, I mean Spirit, who cares about Spirit?

573
00:28:54,160 --> 00:28:54,960
Speaker 2: Really? Do we?

574
00:28:54,960 --> 00:28:55,160
Speaker 7: Well?

575
00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:57,760
Speaker 9: The people who like an ultra low cost carrier option

576
00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:00,320
Speaker 9: very much care about Spirit, and they're going to lose

577
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:03,200
Speaker 9: that option if Jet Blue takes over all of those routes.

578
00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:04,600
Speaker 9: And I think that's the crux of the matter.

579
00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:07,040
Speaker 2: I will tell you, having lived in Europe for a

580
00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:11,400
Speaker 2: long time, it's it was so awesome to be able

581
00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:15,480
Speaker 2: to fly anywhere on the continent for like fifty bucks.

582
00:29:15,560 --> 00:29:18,000
Speaker 2: Ye at any time that I've lived there, that I

583
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:20,040
Speaker 2: lived there over the last like seven years. Right then

584
00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:23,400
Speaker 2: I come back here and I want to fly to Austin,

585
00:29:23,680 --> 00:29:26,680
Speaker 2: and it's like, I gotta fly economy, you know, Oh

586
00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:31,440
Speaker 2: my god, that's just terrible. But but the flying economy

587
00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:37,320
Speaker 2: on United to Austin still costs like ten times more

588
00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:41,680
Speaker 2: than flying business on Ryanair to Valencia, you know, so.

589
00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:45,720
Speaker 1: Sort economy is not good for you.

590
00:29:45,920 --> 00:29:48,480
Speaker 2: Now. It's just painful for my knees, you know, especially

591
00:29:48,520 --> 00:29:49,800
Speaker 2: at my age.

592
00:29:49,680 --> 00:29:51,560
Speaker 1: So that I guess they don't factor that into the

593
00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:53,640
Speaker 1: spirit Jet Blue thing.

594
00:29:53,680 --> 00:29:56,520
Speaker 2: I want to hear something funny about Paul Until very

595
00:29:56,560 --> 00:30:00,960
Speaker 2: recently he thought the picture of the guy on Alaska

596
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:06,120
Speaker 2: Airlines tail was Jerry Garcia. That's not a joke.

597
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:09,280
Speaker 9: I really thought that I did, and I had.

598
00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:10,480
Speaker 2: A pilot Joy Garcia.

599
00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:11,880
Speaker 4: It may have been an Eskimo.

600
00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:15,240
Speaker 2: I don't know. Can we say Eskimo in a way

601
00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:16,160
Speaker 2: be canceled?

602
00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:16,520
Speaker 4: Sorry?

603
00:30:16,600 --> 00:30:18,200
Speaker 1: I don't know. But next time you're at an airport

604
00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:20,960
Speaker 1: and you see Alaska Airlines, tell me what you think.

605
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:22,000
Speaker 1: It's not so far off.

606
00:30:22,360 --> 00:30:23,920
Speaker 9: I'm gonna have to take a look, all right.

607
00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:26,920
Speaker 1: Jenry, thanks so much for joining us senior litigation analyst.

608
00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:29,200
Speaker 1: She covers all the antitrust stuff for all the big

609
00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:31,840
Speaker 1: M and A out there. Nobody else on the street

610
00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:34,120
Speaker 1: has that kind of research we do at Bloomberg Intelligence

611
00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:36,960
Speaker 1: and ssures closely with the industry in stock analys so

612
00:30:37,040 --> 00:30:40,800
Speaker 1: that we get the best analysis out there to our clients. Jenry,

613
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:42,160
Speaker 1: thanks so much. We appreciate it.

614
00:30:42,320 --> 00:30:45,960
Speaker 4: You're listening to the tape Canser live program Bloomberg Markets

615
00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:49,400
Speaker 4: weekdays at ten am Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the tune

616
00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:52,400
Speaker 4: in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business App.

617
00:30:52,440 --> 00:30:55,239
Speaker 4: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our

618
00:30:55,280 --> 00:31:00,880
Speaker 4: flagship New York station just Say Alexa playing Bloomberg eleven thirty.

619
00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:03,640
Speaker 1: I think over the last several years there's been a

620
00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:07,680
Speaker 1: big pusher or moved towards kind of reshoring a lot

621
00:31:07,760 --> 00:31:12,160
Speaker 1: of operations and businesses on US soil, you know, by

622
00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:14,719
Speaker 1: American that kind of thing. It's kind of gain momentum.

623
00:31:14,760 --> 00:31:17,600
Speaker 1: It certainly exacerbated by the pandemic, but there are those

624
00:31:17,640 --> 00:31:20,360
Speaker 1: that say, hey, let's not go so fast here. Maybe

625
00:31:20,360 --> 00:31:24,440
Speaker 1: this global supply chain thing is still a thing. Dave Stalin,

626
00:31:24,760 --> 00:31:27,760
Speaker 1: So those people from Taiwan, I don't know. We'll find out.

627
00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:30,240
Speaker 1: Dave Stalin chill out a little bit exactly. He's the

628
00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:34,520
Speaker 1: CEO of the Telecommunications Industry Association. He's also a graduate

629
00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:37,760
Speaker 1: of the US Naval Academy and a former infantry officer

630
00:31:38,320 --> 00:31:40,400
Speaker 1: with the US Marine Corps. So we thank him for

631
00:31:40,440 --> 00:31:43,880
Speaker 1: his service. Dave, thanks so much for joining us here. Again.

632
00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:46,400
Speaker 1: You think about over the last three four years pandemic,

633
00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:49,880
Speaker 1: been a lot of talk about on shoring, and it

634
00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:53,000
Speaker 1: kind of goes it's taken another level maybe with some

635
00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:55,840
Speaker 1: of the technology, maybe a cold war brewing between the

636
00:31:55,920 --> 00:31:59,520
Speaker 1: US and China on things on the telecommunications and technology space.

637
00:32:00,040 --> 00:32:01,960
Speaker 1: What's your view of how things have kind of evolved.

638
00:32:03,040 --> 00:32:05,880
Speaker 8: Well, thanks for having me. Yeah, it's an interesting time.

639
00:32:06,200 --> 00:32:10,640
Speaker 8: I think through the pandemic, we've recognized how important connectivity is.

640
00:32:12,080 --> 00:32:15,280
Speaker 8: It's almost like the air we breathe, but we don't

641
00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:18,400
Speaker 8: want it to be polluted air, right, So it's important

642
00:32:18,440 --> 00:32:22,800
Speaker 8: that we're buying products and building networks from trusted suppliers.

643
00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:26,440
Speaker 2: But I mean, we are buying a lot of products

644
00:32:26,480 --> 00:32:32,080
Speaker 2: and building networks with products out of China, certainly out

645
00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:35,520
Speaker 2: of Taiwan, but also out of China. Should we be

646
00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:36,360
Speaker 2: concerned about that?

647
00:32:37,720 --> 00:32:41,200
Speaker 8: Yeah, I definitely think there's a legitimate concern, and the

648
00:32:41,280 --> 00:32:46,640
Speaker 8: administration has significant concerns about the concentration of ICT or

649
00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:51,640
Speaker 8: technology manufacturing in China. But what's not clear is should

650
00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:57,920
Speaker 8: government review outbound investment in a way that really forces

651
00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:03,959
Speaker 8: companies to determine at a high level with heavy government review,

652
00:33:04,360 --> 00:33:08,320
Speaker 8: where they buy their products from. We're strong supporters of

653
00:33:08,560 --> 00:33:12,440
Speaker 8: building product in America and we are definitely as an

654
00:33:12,640 --> 00:33:16,160
Speaker 8: ICT industry trending in that direction more and more so.

655
00:33:16,640 --> 00:33:19,959
Speaker 8: But it's probably hard to get everything built in America

656
00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:21,360
Speaker 8: at a reasonable price.

657
00:33:21,920 --> 00:33:24,240
Speaker 2: Well what about a free market? You know, what about

658
00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:29,360
Speaker 2: businesses being able to do whatever they want with their dollars?

659
00:33:29,360 --> 00:33:31,360
Speaker 2: How much should the government be involved in this?

660
00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:34,760
Speaker 8: Yeah? So I'll go back to the point that everything

661
00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:38,280
Speaker 8: is connected these days, from an IoT device in your

662
00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:41,840
Speaker 8: home to a critical network to a broadband network, and

663
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:44,960
Speaker 8: we have to be careful with that level of connectivity

664
00:33:45,320 --> 00:33:50,080
Speaker 8: to ensure we're buying products and services from trusted partners,

665
00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:52,840
Speaker 8: and I think that's one of the roots of the issue.

666
00:33:52,920 --> 00:33:59,280
Speaker 8: The other, of course, is the overall competitiveness around the globe.

667
00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:04,040
Speaker 8: We first need to make sure that we're buying trusted products.

668
00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:07,880
Speaker 8: And TIA, as you mentioned, is an industry association that's

669
00:34:07,880 --> 00:34:10,160
Speaker 8: been around for eighty years. We've obviously seen a ton

670
00:34:10,160 --> 00:34:13,880
Speaker 8: of change and we create standards for the industry and

671
00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:17,640
Speaker 8: we advocate with the government for the industry large companies,

672
00:34:17,640 --> 00:34:22,880
Speaker 8: small companies, and we're very focused on ensuring that the

673
00:34:22,920 --> 00:34:25,480
Speaker 8: networks that are getting built are going to become more

674
00:34:25,480 --> 00:34:28,680
Speaker 8: and more trusted over time. But you have to verify trust,

675
00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:31,440
Speaker 8: you can't just assume it. And that's where the standard

676
00:34:31,640 --> 00:34:34,960
Speaker 8: side of TIA comes into play, as we've developed the

677
00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:38,960
Speaker 8: first cyber and supply chain security standard that's measurable for

678
00:34:39,120 --> 00:34:39,760
Speaker 8: the industry.

679
00:34:40,480 --> 00:34:42,919
Speaker 1: So kind of going down that route, Dave, I mean

680
00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:45,160
Speaker 1: the companies that you are, many of the companies that

681
00:34:45,200 --> 00:34:48,440
Speaker 1: you represent have been, have done, and continue to do

682
00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:51,319
Speaker 1: business in China. They just have to. That's just kind

683
00:34:51,320 --> 00:34:56,960
Speaker 1: of where the supply chain takes You can't disengage from China.

684
00:34:57,040 --> 00:34:59,360
Speaker 1: So what are some of the companies that you represent,

685
00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:03,080
Speaker 1: what are they How have they changed their behaviors or

686
00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:05,080
Speaker 1: their business models over the last several years.

687
00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:09,680
Speaker 8: Sure, it's a couple aspects. One is definitely companies are

688
00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:14,200
Speaker 8: moving manufacturing out of China to other places in the world,

689
00:35:14,239 --> 00:35:16,920
Speaker 8: some cases of the US, but to other places in

690
00:35:16,960 --> 00:35:21,680
Speaker 8: the world. There are many trusted US trading partners out

691
00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:26,200
Speaker 8: there Mexico, India and others that they're moving. They're manufacturing too.

692
00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:31,000
Speaker 8: Number two, one of the big challenges we have is

693
00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:35,560
Speaker 8: on the ICT space is anything that's electronics. We can

694
00:35:35,600 --> 00:35:38,000
Speaker 8: make fiber cable here, and we do with companies such

695
00:35:38,040 --> 00:35:41,080
Speaker 8: as Corning and Comscope. That's not a problem. We can

696
00:35:41,120 --> 00:35:44,480
Speaker 8: make cell towers here, we can make all the attachments. Obviously,

697
00:35:45,719 --> 00:35:49,640
Speaker 8: the labor to build and to project manage these networks

698
00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:53,279
Speaker 8: can be done here. But moving chips over is a

699
00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:56,440
Speaker 8: good first step, but it's not the only step. So

700
00:35:56,560 --> 00:36:00,000
Speaker 8: the US government has recently about a year ago, introduce

701
00:36:00,040 --> 00:36:04,239
Speaker 8: US as part of the IIJA, the Infrastructure Investment and

702
00:36:04,320 --> 00:36:08,480
Speaker 8: Jobs Act, a really large, forty five billion dollar program

703
00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:12,760
Speaker 8: to bring broadband to the unserved and underserved around the country.

704
00:36:13,280 --> 00:36:16,200
Speaker 8: One of the requirements is by America so there are

705
00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:20,160
Speaker 8: by America laws in place that say, when you use

706
00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:24,719
Speaker 8: US grant money, for example, the BAD program, the Broadband

707
00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:29,200
Speaker 8: Equity Access Deployment Program, part of IJA, a lot of acronyms,

708
00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:35,120
Speaker 8: you must follow the by America laws. Now, what we've

709
00:36:35,160 --> 00:36:40,920
Speaker 8: asked for is a limited and a targeted waiver for

710
00:36:41,000 --> 00:36:43,920
Speaker 8: certain parts of that and in essence, anything that has

711
00:36:43,920 --> 00:36:46,920
Speaker 8: a chip in it is not effectively made in the

712
00:36:47,040 --> 00:36:50,720
Speaker 8: US current So the labors no problem, the fiber cables

713
00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:53,399
Speaker 8: no problem, the towers, no problem. But anything that has

714
00:36:54,440 --> 00:36:58,480
Speaker 8: a chip, in other words, electronics, anything with intelligence that

715
00:36:58,560 --> 00:37:01,879
Speaker 8: has a chip in it is currently for the most part,

716
00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:06,000
Speaker 8: not made in the US. Therefore, we need that waiver

717
00:37:06,560 --> 00:37:07,920
Speaker 8: for this BEAD program.

718
00:37:08,600 --> 00:37:10,319
Speaker 2: By the way, as Paul is saying, you have a

719
00:37:10,400 --> 00:37:16,080
Speaker 2: tremendous resume and obviously have served this country in the

720
00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:20,360
Speaker 2: US military and in many different ways. After the Naval Academy,

721
00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:24,600
Speaker 2: US Army Ranger School Distinguished Honor graduate, there were in

722
00:37:24,640 --> 00:37:29,319
Speaker 2: the first, second, third, and fourth Marine divisions. I don't

723
00:37:29,320 --> 00:37:33,719
Speaker 2: know if this is this question is pertaining to the

724
00:37:33,760 --> 00:37:36,960
Speaker 2: Telecommunications Industry Association at all, but do you worry that

725
00:37:37,040 --> 00:37:40,239
Speaker 2: even some of our military equipment has chips out of.

726
00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:45,200
Speaker 8: China, absolutely, and the US military, the DoD is very

727
00:37:45,200 --> 00:37:49,239
Speaker 8: concerned about that as well, and they're putting tighter restrictions.

728
00:37:49,719 --> 00:37:53,399
Speaker 8: We all know that the Biden administration also just set

729
00:37:53,440 --> 00:37:56,919
Speaker 8: aside something like sixty five billion dollars to bring chip

730
00:37:56,960 --> 00:38:01,640
Speaker 8: manufacturing back to the US standard that I alluded to,

731
00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:05,000
Speaker 8: what we call SES nine thousand and one is the

732
00:38:05,040 --> 00:38:09,720
Speaker 8: only measurable and certifiable cyber and supply chain security standard

733
00:38:09,719 --> 00:38:13,600
Speaker 8: out there. We look at the processes that somebody uses

734
00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:17,360
Speaker 8: when they're developing a product to ensure that it's trusted.

735
00:38:17,640 --> 00:38:19,759
Speaker 8: The software and the hardware. You have to go back

736
00:38:19,760 --> 00:38:23,200
Speaker 8: to the route to ensure that you're developing a product

737
00:38:23,239 --> 00:38:27,280
Speaker 8: that is secure. So you have to have third party

738
00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:31,680
Speaker 8: verification that the software and hardware. There's so much open

739
00:38:31,719 --> 00:38:34,640
Speaker 8: source software being used these days. You have to verify

740
00:38:34,719 --> 00:38:35,960
Speaker 8: that those things are secure.

741
00:38:36,400 --> 00:38:36,600
Speaker 3: You know.

742
00:38:36,640 --> 00:38:40,120
Speaker 8: That's why I'm in this job. Many of my peers

743
00:38:40,160 --> 00:38:44,120
Speaker 8: are sailing on a boat or digging in their garden

744
00:38:44,120 --> 00:38:47,960
Speaker 8: in the backyard and long retired. But I am really

745
00:38:48,040 --> 00:38:51,840
Speaker 8: passionate about this industry and passionate about the security of

746
00:38:51,880 --> 00:38:52,440
Speaker 8: our country.

747
00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:55,400
Speaker 1: Well, we appreciate it. Dave I appreciate all your services

748
00:38:55,960 --> 00:38:58,759
Speaker 1: in support of this country. Dave Stalen, CEO of the

749
00:38:58,920 --> 00:39:03,400
Speaker 1: Telecommunications Industry Association, looking at the kind of the global

750
00:39:03,440 --> 00:39:07,000
Speaker 1: technology trade, the global telecommunications trade, a lot of work

751
00:39:07,040 --> 00:39:10,200
Speaker 1: to be done there to ensure these systems out there.

752
00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:13,520
Speaker 4: You're listening to the tape Can's our live program Bloomberg

753
00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:17,239
Speaker 4: Markets weekdays at ten am Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the

754
00:39:17,280 --> 00:39:20,520
Speaker 4: tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business App.

755
00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:23,359
Speaker 4: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our

756
00:39:23,400 --> 00:39:27,800
Speaker 4: flagship New York station, Just say Alexa, play Bloomberg eleven thirty.

757
00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:33,640
Speaker 1: Formula one. This is a big business globally. It's starting

758
00:39:33,680 --> 00:39:35,400
Speaker 1: to get bigger here in the US, I think, and

759
00:39:36,200 --> 00:39:37,800
Speaker 1: I know a little bit about this because the liberty

760
00:39:37,840 --> 00:39:40,840
Speaker 1: media folks own it and they have big, big plans

761
00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:44,200
Speaker 1: for growing Formula one. And we got a big, big

762
00:39:44,360 --> 00:39:47,719
Speaker 1: race coming to Miami, Formula one Miami Grand Prix coming.

763
00:39:47,760 --> 00:39:50,040
Speaker 1: That's a big news for I guess any city that

764
00:39:50,280 --> 00:39:52,120
Speaker 1: hosts it. But let's get the latest with Hannah Elliott.

765
00:39:52,120 --> 00:39:54,319
Speaker 1: She's got a great story out on the Bloomberg Hannah

766
00:39:54,360 --> 00:39:57,920
Speaker 1: covers the auto industry for US how to talk to

767
00:39:58,040 --> 00:40:01,160
Speaker 1: us about Miami. It sounds like a fun event. It

768
00:40:01,239 --> 00:40:05,160
Speaker 1: sounds like a must to event, must must see event

769
00:40:05,239 --> 00:40:06,600
Speaker 1: and be seen event.

770
00:40:06,760 --> 00:40:09,680
Speaker 10: About mind, must see it? Yeah, totally must see and

771
00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:13,160
Speaker 10: be seen is exactly right. There's there's a reason they

772
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:16,839
Speaker 10: call it the Magic City. That certainly applies to how

773
00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:22,080
Speaker 10: Miami does Formula one. It is a spectacle unlike any other.

774
00:40:22,960 --> 00:40:26,640
Speaker 10: Last year we saw that it f one brought three

775
00:40:26,719 --> 00:40:31,799
Speaker 10: hundred and fifty million dollars into Miami, with people, you know,

776
00:40:31,880 --> 00:40:37,239
Speaker 10: spending money on hotels, decadent nights out, uh, drinking, partying,

777
00:40:38,320 --> 00:40:42,680
Speaker 10: eating culture, all of that, plus of course race tickets.

778
00:40:42,640 --> 00:40:44,359
Speaker 2: And not a little bit of money. Hannah, I mean

779
00:40:44,400 --> 00:40:46,319
Speaker 2: I saw on You're sure lots of money. I mean

780
00:40:46,360 --> 00:40:49,080
Speaker 2: some people are spending. Did you say there was like

781
00:40:49,160 --> 00:40:51,400
Speaker 2: thirty or fifty thousand dollars bottle service?

782
00:40:52,239 --> 00:40:56,760
Speaker 10: Yeah. So you know, for instance, at the Club eleven,

783
00:40:56,840 --> 00:41:00,279
Speaker 10: which maybe you've heard of before, it's a big Miami club,

784
00:41:00,360 --> 00:41:04,600
Speaker 10: we've had this table. Tables start at five thousand dollars

785
00:41:04,640 --> 00:41:07,000
Speaker 10: and they go up to two hundred thousand dollars. If

786
00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:09,680
Speaker 10: you want a table with bottle service on the dance floor,

787
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:11,400
Speaker 10: that'll accommodate.

788
00:41:10,880 --> 00:41:11,680
Speaker 2: One hundred people.

789
00:41:12,760 --> 00:41:15,799
Speaker 10: But yeah, I mean, of course we've got h you've

790
00:41:15,800 --> 00:41:19,800
Speaker 10: heard of Carbone, of course, the great Italian restaurant chain,

791
00:41:20,239 --> 00:41:23,239
Speaker 10: Carbone is doing a pop up called Carbone Beach. They

792
00:41:23,239 --> 00:41:24,759
Speaker 10: did it last year, they're going to do it again

793
00:41:24,800 --> 00:41:28,040
Speaker 10: this year. Tickets cost three thousand dollars. Tables start at

794
00:41:28,040 --> 00:41:32,160
Speaker 10: twenty four thousand dollars. That's for a dinner or a meal.

795
00:41:32,400 --> 00:41:35,239
Speaker 2: So this is yeah, this is just for going going

796
00:41:35,280 --> 00:41:37,440
Speaker 2: out right now. I just came back from the Moto

797
00:41:37,480 --> 00:41:40,319
Speaker 2: GP in Austin, which is motorcycles, of course, and it

798
00:41:40,400 --> 00:41:44,440
Speaker 2: was far less crowded than Formula One was in Austin.

799
00:41:44,520 --> 00:41:48,320
Speaker 2: But what everybody you want at the race is access,

800
00:41:48,520 --> 00:41:50,719
Speaker 2: right You want to be in the paddock, you want

801
00:41:50,719 --> 00:41:52,799
Speaker 2: to be able to walk up and down pit lane,

802
00:41:52,840 --> 00:41:55,200
Speaker 2: you want to be able to peer into the garages.

803
00:41:55,520 --> 00:41:57,880
Speaker 2: How much is that kind of access going to cost?

804
00:41:58,200 --> 00:42:00,480
Speaker 2: If I can even get it at F one Miami.

805
00:42:01,200 --> 00:42:04,520
Speaker 10: So Padda Club tickets right now are costing over fourteen

806
00:42:04,560 --> 00:42:09,960
Speaker 10: thousand dollars. I have seen prices as low as ten thousand,

807
00:42:10,160 --> 00:42:14,040
Speaker 10: but according to my last check, I was emailing a

808
00:42:14,160 --> 00:42:17,080
Speaker 10: couple people this week to confirm the final price. They're

809
00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:19,880
Speaker 10: at fourteen thousand dollars right now. That gets you, of

810
00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:23,520
Speaker 10: course access to these luxury suites with food and alcohol,

811
00:42:23,719 --> 00:42:26,960
Speaker 10: and we'll get you pit access to in some cases.

812
00:42:27,080 --> 00:42:28,360
Speaker 10: Then you have a lot of pride.

813
00:42:28,440 --> 00:42:30,359
Speaker 2: By the way, that was a tenth the price at

814
00:42:30,360 --> 00:42:33,040
Speaker 2: the Moto GP in Austin, they were fourteen hundred.

815
00:42:33,760 --> 00:42:36,920
Speaker 10: You know Austin is I love Austin. Of course, Austin

816
00:42:36,960 --> 00:42:39,040
Speaker 10: had the first formula and raised in a long time

817
00:42:39,040 --> 00:42:41,960
Speaker 10: in the US. We love Austin. But Miami, you know,

818
00:42:42,040 --> 00:42:44,960
Speaker 10: has quite a reputation for partying and they really have

819
00:42:45,040 --> 00:42:47,920
Speaker 10: to live up to it, and the prices are reflecting.

820
00:42:47,440 --> 00:42:49,759
Speaker 1: That kind of talked to us about just Formula one

821
00:42:49,800 --> 00:42:51,640
Speaker 1: in the US. I know, you know, the likes of

822
00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:54,400
Speaker 1: you know, Matt Miller all into it. I'm sure you

823
00:42:54,440 --> 00:42:57,080
Speaker 1: are as well. Where where is it just in terms

824
00:42:57,120 --> 00:42:59,880
Speaker 1: of popularity and the growth of it?

825
00:43:00,040 --> 00:43:01,920
Speaker 2: How has it grown since the first race in Austin.

826
00:43:02,760 --> 00:43:07,160
Speaker 10: So it's been really interesting, you know, my Formula one

827
00:43:07,480 --> 00:43:11,080
Speaker 10: has had some history in the US, starting in the

828
00:43:11,160 --> 00:43:15,359
Speaker 10: late nineteen fifties. There have been random races everywhere from

829
00:43:15,400 --> 00:43:19,120
Speaker 10: Michigan to California to New York, but it's never really

830
00:43:19,200 --> 00:43:23,520
Speaker 10: got a foothold. Of course, the Austin Race started about

831
00:43:23,600 --> 00:43:26,400
Speaker 10: twelve years ago. That was really the first one and

832
00:43:26,480 --> 00:43:29,920
Speaker 10: since then. This is the second year for Miami. Also

833
00:43:29,960 --> 00:43:32,200
Speaker 10: this year we've got a race in Las Vegas coming,

834
00:43:32,200 --> 00:43:35,759
Speaker 10: which is going to be potentially even bigger and more

835
00:43:35,800 --> 00:43:39,040
Speaker 10: expensive than Miami, So we're getting a bit of a foothold.

836
00:43:39,640 --> 00:43:42,040
Speaker 10: A big part of that is the fact that Liberty

837
00:43:42,160 --> 00:43:47,200
Speaker 10: Media is now the owner and really prioritizes television. Of course,

838
00:43:47,640 --> 00:43:50,080
Speaker 10: TV audiences are very important in America if you want

839
00:43:50,080 --> 00:43:55,399
Speaker 10: a big fan base exactly. I was just gonna say,

840
00:43:55,520 --> 00:44:00,279
Speaker 10: you cannot underestimate the influence of Netflix's documentary series Drive

841
00:44:00,320 --> 00:44:02,960
Speaker 10: to Survive. They've had I think they're in their fifth

842
00:44:02,960 --> 00:44:08,080
Speaker 10: season now, and that is really humanized and drama dramaticized

843
00:44:08,560 --> 00:44:11,480
Speaker 10: the drivers and the race and actually it's kind of

844
00:44:11,480 --> 00:44:15,200
Speaker 10: been called the Kardashians on four wheels. It is kind

845
00:44:15,200 --> 00:44:17,680
Speaker 10: of It's really interesting and it really has broad and

846
00:44:17,760 --> 00:44:21,560
Speaker 10: so it's very fair to say that television. Of course,

847
00:44:21,560 --> 00:44:25,400
Speaker 10: television audiences are up every year by double digit percentages.

848
00:44:25,600 --> 00:44:27,480
Speaker 10: We do have a lot of momentum, and Miami is

849
00:44:27,520 --> 00:44:28,200
Speaker 10: a big part.

850
00:44:28,000 --> 00:44:28,560
Speaker 7: Of that all right.

851
00:44:28,560 --> 00:44:30,120
Speaker 2: Listen, Hannah, while we have you here, I want to

852
00:44:30,120 --> 00:44:32,360
Speaker 2: get your take on some of the other issues in

853
00:44:32,400 --> 00:44:36,359
Speaker 2: the car industry. More broadly, we've been talking so much

854
00:44:36,360 --> 00:44:39,799
Speaker 2: about Tesla cutting prices six times in a row now

855
00:44:39,840 --> 00:44:42,760
Speaker 2: for the cheaper models. Last night we heard their raising

856
00:44:42,760 --> 00:44:45,719
Speaker 2: prices for the more expensive Model X and Model S.

857
00:44:46,200 --> 00:44:49,440
Speaker 2: What's your take on Tesla right now? They've seen incredible

858
00:44:49,480 --> 00:44:52,239
Speaker 2: top line growth, not as much as Elan as projected,

859
00:44:52,560 --> 00:44:55,200
Speaker 2: but they have a lot of competition coming into the market.

860
00:44:56,040 --> 00:44:59,359
Speaker 10: Absolutely, I think the biggest problem that Tesla has right

861
00:44:59,400 --> 00:45:02,680
Speaker 10: now is the connection to its owner, Elon Musk. I

862
00:45:02,760 --> 00:45:05,440
Speaker 10: live in La. I can't tell you how many people say,

863
00:45:05,880 --> 00:45:09,520
Speaker 10: I'm a little cringey when I drive my Tesla. I'm

864
00:45:09,560 --> 00:45:13,919
Speaker 10: a little embarrassed about it. Because of some of the

865
00:45:14,120 --> 00:45:19,279
Speaker 10: antics of the company owner. We can't disassociate Elon from

866
00:45:19,320 --> 00:45:21,480
Speaker 10: Tesla right now, and I do think that's hurting the

867
00:45:21,520 --> 00:45:25,680
Speaker 10: brand perception. Secondly, to your point, there are so many

868
00:45:26,080 --> 00:45:31,000
Speaker 10: worthy competitors now to Tesla. Tesla one hundred percent beat

869
00:45:31,080 --> 00:45:33,919
Speaker 10: everyone to the punch, but that was ten years ago

870
00:45:34,040 --> 00:45:38,640
Speaker 10: and now we have amazing electric vehicles from outing BMW, Mercedes,

871
00:45:38,719 --> 00:45:43,000
Speaker 10: Pull Star, you know, Volvo. The list goes on Porsche,

872
00:45:44,280 --> 00:45:46,480
Speaker 10: every every automaker, now Kie.

873
00:45:46,960 --> 00:45:50,680
Speaker 2: Ev Kia makes some kick can I say, I don't

874
00:45:50,680 --> 00:45:54,920
Speaker 2: think kick butt EV's Hey? Listen one more on. Paul

875
00:45:55,560 --> 00:45:59,720
Speaker 2: has like a two thousand and six fourteen twenty fourteen

876
00:45:59,840 --> 00:46:02,520
Speaker 2: V it's a stick and he doesn't want to give

877
00:46:02,520 --> 00:46:04,439
Speaker 2: it up, but he needs to buy a new car,

878
00:46:04,680 --> 00:46:06,520
Speaker 2: and he said he can't find anything with a stick

879
00:46:06,560 --> 00:46:11,080
Speaker 2: out there. What would you recommend to a sporty, successful

880
00:46:11,239 --> 00:46:14,680
Speaker 2: former Wall Street gentleman like Paul Sweeney? What should he

881
00:46:14,719 --> 00:46:16,080
Speaker 2: get with a stick? What's out there?

882
00:46:16,800 --> 00:46:18,360
Speaker 10: You can get a nine to eleven with the stick,

883
00:46:19,880 --> 00:46:22,480
Speaker 10: you go, let's just call it how it is. You

884
00:46:22,520 --> 00:46:24,480
Speaker 10: can still buy a nine to eleven with a manual

885
00:46:24,520 --> 00:46:27,080
Speaker 10: transmission and you will love it.

886
00:46:27,360 --> 00:46:28,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, that sounds good.

887
00:46:28,360 --> 00:46:31,000
Speaker 2: I've been telling you for a while, but you know what,

888
00:46:31,080 --> 00:46:34,000
Speaker 2: Why put it off when eventually.

889
00:46:33,160 --> 00:46:33,839
Speaker 10: A matter of time?

890
00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:36,040
Speaker 1: It's only a matter of time. You guys have got

891
00:46:36,040 --> 00:46:39,520
Speaker 1: me red. Well, so, Hannah, what's the next thing on

892
00:46:39,600 --> 00:46:42,319
Speaker 1: the what's the next car you really want to test

893
00:46:42,360 --> 00:46:42,960
Speaker 1: drive out there?

894
00:46:43,320 --> 00:46:44,960
Speaker 10: I'll tell you what I'm gonna drive in a week

895
00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:47,280
Speaker 10: and a half. And I'm actually very excited about it. It's

896
00:46:47,239 --> 00:46:51,680
Speaker 10: the Lamborghini Hurricane Strato, which is their off quote unquote

897
00:46:51,880 --> 00:46:56,000
Speaker 10: off road Lamborghini. I'm going to go out to Joshua Tree.

898
00:46:56,120 --> 00:46:57,440
Speaker 10: We're gonna drive it in the desert.

899
00:46:57,520 --> 00:46:58,640
Speaker 2: We're gonna video it.

900
00:46:59,080 --> 00:47:02,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, they say off road. Instead of it being like

901
00:47:02,440 --> 00:47:04,399
Speaker 1: an inch off the ground, it's like three inches off

902
00:47:04,400 --> 00:47:04,680
Speaker 1: the ground.

903
00:47:04,760 --> 00:47:08,560
Speaker 10: Yeah, exactly, So you're not going down a dirt trail

904
00:47:09,000 --> 00:47:09,560
Speaker 10: very slowly.

905
00:47:09,640 --> 00:47:11,080
Speaker 1: I'm still not sure you want to take that on

906
00:47:11,120 --> 00:47:12,680
Speaker 1: in Manhattan Street with all the potholes.

907
00:47:12,920 --> 00:47:15,680
Speaker 2: I know, is Hannah's job. By the way, She's gonna

908
00:47:15,719 --> 00:47:19,040
Speaker 2: go to Joshua Tree, probably with some rock star in

909
00:47:19,080 --> 00:47:21,959
Speaker 2: a Lamborghini. They're gonna do shrooms, camp out. It's gonna

910
00:47:21,960 --> 00:47:23,160
Speaker 2: be awesome, and she gets paid.

911
00:47:24,440 --> 00:47:26,560
Speaker 10: I will report that. You're welcome to join. You know,

912
00:47:26,680 --> 00:47:27,879
Speaker 10: let's make a party of it.

913
00:47:28,400 --> 00:47:30,000
Speaker 2: That is that is very cool, And a lot of

914
00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:32,239
Speaker 2: these car makers are coming out with, you know, off

915
00:47:32,320 --> 00:47:34,480
Speaker 2: right road versions. You mentioned the nine to eleven. They

916
00:47:34,520 --> 00:47:36,600
Speaker 2: have their what's it called the Decar and it's like

917
00:47:36,680 --> 00:47:39,879
Speaker 2: two hundred and fifty grand. Is it really like an

918
00:47:39,880 --> 00:47:41,200
Speaker 2: off road worthy vehicle?

919
00:47:41,719 --> 00:47:44,400
Speaker 10: I think so. I think so. Let's not forget. Lamborghini

920
00:47:44,480 --> 00:47:47,920
Speaker 10: really does have sorry sorry, Porsche really does have a

921
00:47:48,080 --> 00:47:51,200
Speaker 10: history of off road racing, of Raleigh racing. Of course,

922
00:47:51,239 --> 00:47:55,759
Speaker 10: they're Rothman's cars, you know, decades ago were really successful

923
00:47:55,800 --> 00:47:58,120
Speaker 10: and popular. So yeah, I believe it when Porscha says

924
00:47:58,120 --> 00:48:00,520
Speaker 10: we've got an off road We've got a Safari style

925
00:48:00,640 --> 00:48:03,280
Speaker 10: nine to eleven. I believe that.

926
00:48:02,640 --> 00:48:06,200
Speaker 2: You can even get that Rothman's livery painted on your

927
00:48:06,480 --> 00:48:07,840
Speaker 2: nine to eleven to car. I think it's like a

928
00:48:07,880 --> 00:48:09,600
Speaker 2: twenty three thousand dollars option.

929
00:48:09,920 --> 00:48:12,279
Speaker 10: The only thing about that is they changed the word

930
00:48:12,320 --> 00:48:16,080
Speaker 10: to say rough roads instead of Rothman, even though delivery

931
00:48:16,440 --> 00:48:19,760
Speaker 10: looks the same. Oh, which is yeah.

932
00:48:19,600 --> 00:48:20,080
Speaker 2: A little week.

933
00:48:20,160 --> 00:48:22,440
Speaker 1: Are there car makers, like luxury car makers that just

934
00:48:22,480 --> 00:48:25,480
Speaker 1: say we're not gonna go ev Has anybody ever said

935
00:48:25,480 --> 00:48:25,919
Speaker 1: that now?

936
00:48:26,560 --> 00:48:29,719
Speaker 10: Well, yeah, Ferrari has said that. Lamborghini said that. There

937
00:48:29,760 --> 00:48:33,040
Speaker 10: have been a lot who say that, Okay, who swear

938
00:48:33,200 --> 00:48:35,200
Speaker 10: up and down we will never go electric. I think

939
00:48:35,200 --> 00:48:38,680
Speaker 10: at one time Rules Royce said that, you know, they

940
00:48:38,800 --> 00:48:41,720
Speaker 10: a lot say it. A lot also said we will

941
00:48:41,760 --> 00:48:45,160
Speaker 10: never make an suv. So whenever someone says never, I

942
00:48:45,239 --> 00:48:46,560
Speaker 10: do take it with a grain of salt.

943
00:48:46,640 --> 00:48:48,399
Speaker 1: Yeah, we'll let you go. But the story I thought

944
00:48:48,440 --> 00:48:51,000
Speaker 1: this week was hilarious or just really telling was Ford

945
00:48:51,160 --> 00:48:55,200
Speaker 1: f one point fifty. They're bringing their electric truck to Norway,

946
00:48:55,680 --> 00:48:56,040
Speaker 1: I mean.

947
00:48:56,000 --> 00:48:58,040
Speaker 2: Which is double funny if you remember those Will Ferrell

948
00:48:58,040 --> 00:48:59,200
Speaker 2: commercials in Super.

949
00:48:59,040 --> 00:49:00,520
Speaker 1: Bowl exactly, So I'm like, I don't know where you're

950
00:49:00,520 --> 00:49:03,520
Speaker 1: going to park that thing in EUROPEA Yeah, Henda Elliott,

951
00:49:03,520 --> 00:49:05,239
Speaker 1: thanks so much for joining us. Really great stuff. We

952
00:49:05,280 --> 00:49:07,840
Speaker 1: look forward to your reporting from Joshua Tree in a

953
00:49:07,840 --> 00:49:10,680
Speaker 1: few weeks. Honda La she covers automotive stuff, and she

954
00:49:10,719 --> 00:49:12,760
Speaker 1: actually gets to ride and test drive all these.

955
00:49:12,640 --> 00:49:15,759
Speaker 2: Cars, and she's gotten on the highest of high high

956
00:49:15,880 --> 00:49:19,319
Speaker 2: end yes vehicles expecting She writes for Bloomberg Pursuits. Check

957
00:49:19,320 --> 00:49:20,040
Speaker 2: it out on the web.

958
00:49:20,800 --> 00:49:23,880
Speaker 4: You're listening to the tape Cat's are live program Bloomberg

959
00:49:24,000 --> 00:49:27,600
Speaker 4: Markets weekdays at ten am Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the

960
00:49:27,640 --> 00:49:30,879
Speaker 4: tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business App.

961
00:49:30,920 --> 00:49:33,719
Speaker 4: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our

962
00:49:33,760 --> 00:49:38,800
Speaker 4: flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty.

963
00:49:39,560 --> 00:49:40,920
Speaker 1: One of the things that Matt and I like to

964
00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:43,560
Speaker 1: do on this show is try to bring some perspective

965
00:49:44,080 --> 00:49:47,280
Speaker 1: to these markets. Try to tap into some veterans who've

966
00:49:47,360 --> 00:49:49,760
Speaker 1: been through a cycle or two in our Exicus certainly

967
00:49:49,800 --> 00:49:53,480
Speaker 1: qualifies Chris Allman, He's the CIO of Colsters. What is Colsters?

968
00:49:53,880 --> 00:49:58,359
Speaker 1: Is California State Teachers Retirement System? Is it big? Well?

969
00:49:58,440 --> 00:50:00,759
Speaker 1: I think they got a portfolio valued three hundred and

970
00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:04,200
Speaker 1: six billion as of every twenty eight, twenty three, So

971
00:50:04,360 --> 00:50:09,040
Speaker 1: the answers yes, and of course based in Sacramento, California. Chris,

972
00:50:09,120 --> 00:50:10,680
Speaker 1: I mean, and it's also.

973
00:50:10,520 --> 00:50:14,560
Speaker 2: I think it's important to mention it's important, right, This

974
00:50:14,640 --> 00:50:19,480
Speaker 2: is the retirement of teachers, the most underpaid people in

975
00:50:19,520 --> 00:50:26,000
Speaker 2: our society, the most undervalued, and people like Chris helped

976
00:50:26,040 --> 00:50:28,520
Speaker 2: to make sure that they can live well after they're

977
00:50:28,560 --> 00:50:31,040
Speaker 2: done doing the service that they do for our for

978
00:50:31,120 --> 00:50:31,640
Speaker 2: our society.

979
00:50:31,680 --> 00:50:34,680
Speaker 1: Absolutely, it's a big responsibility. So Chris, given that kind

980
00:50:34,719 --> 00:50:37,200
Speaker 1: of build up, I mean, twenty twenty two year to

981
00:50:37,239 --> 00:50:40,080
Speaker 1: forget for most investors a little bit better starting off

982
00:50:40,200 --> 00:50:42,879
Speaker 1: this year, we where do we go from here?

983
00:50:43,719 --> 00:50:46,440
Speaker 5: Well, first off, thank you, gentlemen, thank you for that introduction,

984
00:50:46,800 --> 00:50:50,600
Speaker 5: and you said term gentlemen loosely. Yes, Matt and Paul,

985
00:50:50,719 --> 00:50:52,839
Speaker 5: it's been a long time. It is great to see you.

986
00:50:53,040 --> 00:50:54,959
Speaker 5: I had to travel all the way to Berlin once

987
00:50:55,120 --> 00:50:56,480
Speaker 5: just to see Matt on TV.

988
00:50:56,800 --> 00:50:57,000
Speaker 3: Though.

989
00:50:57,800 --> 00:51:01,359
Speaker 5: Hey, listen, guys, you know surprise saying my fiscal year

990
00:51:01,440 --> 00:51:05,680
Speaker 5: is June thirty, so it is a positive year. We're

991
00:51:05,760 --> 00:51:09,680
Speaker 5: up single digits, you know, high threes. That isn't a

992
00:51:09,719 --> 00:51:12,560
Speaker 5: great year for us. We need to earn seven. But

993
00:51:12,719 --> 00:51:17,000
Speaker 5: like you've been saying all day, everybody feels worried. Everybody

994
00:51:17,080 --> 00:51:20,040
Speaker 5: is slightly negative. But the numbers aren't telling you that

995
00:51:20,080 --> 00:51:26,240
Speaker 5: the stock market is up. Look at non US developed

996
00:51:26,280 --> 00:51:30,480
Speaker 5: markets are up thirteen percent so far. They're up nine

997
00:51:30,560 --> 00:51:36,040
Speaker 5: percent just in twenty twenty three. So maybe, just maybe

998
00:51:36,080 --> 00:51:38,360
Speaker 5: they're going to pull off a smooth landing.

999
00:51:39,440 --> 00:51:42,240
Speaker 2: We just talked with Phil Orlando over at Federated Hermes.

1000
00:51:42,280 --> 00:51:44,560
Speaker 2: He expects S and P earnings to total like one

1001
00:51:44,640 --> 00:51:48,920
Speaker 2: hundred ninety dollars, down from two nineteen last year. So

1002
00:51:48,960 --> 00:51:51,640
Speaker 2: there are some bears out there. What do you make

1003
00:51:51,680 --> 00:51:54,520
Speaker 2: of the sentiment in these markets, Chris.

1004
00:51:55,320 --> 00:51:57,960
Speaker 5: You know, Matt, I am looking out and I gotta

1005
00:51:57,960 --> 00:52:00,239
Speaker 5: tell you, I'm worried. I had talked to a lot

1006
00:52:00,280 --> 00:52:05,240
Speaker 5: of global CIOs and we are all on I feel

1007
00:52:05,280 --> 00:52:08,319
Speaker 5: like we're on thin ice. Liquidity is very tight. You

1008
00:52:08,320 --> 00:52:11,080
Speaker 5: don't go from zero to five hundred well in case

1009
00:52:11,120 --> 00:52:13,520
Speaker 5: of the Miami Grand Prix, you don't go from zero

1010
00:52:13,560 --> 00:52:17,040
Speaker 5: to five hundred basis points in nine months without seeing

1011
00:52:17,120 --> 00:52:20,560
Speaker 5: some pain. Not just Silicon Valley Bank or Signature Bank.

1012
00:52:20,640 --> 00:52:22,800
Speaker 5: But you know, the next shoe to drop is obviously

1013
00:52:23,360 --> 00:52:26,520
Speaker 5: probably going to be in commercial real estate office debt.

1014
00:52:27,200 --> 00:52:30,560
Speaker 5: People are seeing some of that debt roll and rates

1015
00:52:30,560 --> 00:52:33,320
Speaker 5: are higher and the buildings have to come down in value.

1016
00:52:33,320 --> 00:52:37,200
Speaker 5: We haven't seen any transactions, but just the cap rates

1017
00:52:37,200 --> 00:52:39,520
Speaker 5: have changed, so it's a tough market.

1018
00:52:39,280 --> 00:52:43,120
Speaker 2: And people got to refinance. There's a wall of maturity

1019
00:52:43,200 --> 00:52:45,839
Speaker 2: coming do that we're all scared of. I find it

1020
00:52:45,880 --> 00:52:49,480
Speaker 2: fitting that the that the phrase the next shoot to

1021
00:52:49,560 --> 00:52:52,480
Speaker 2: drop comes from real estate. Yes, and it's from New

1022
00:52:52,560 --> 00:52:56,880
Speaker 2: York tenements basically back in the day the walls and

1023
00:52:56,920 --> 00:52:59,600
Speaker 2: the I guess ceilings and Florida threat then that you

1024
00:52:59,600 --> 00:53:02,480
Speaker 2: could hear someone taking off his shoes when he got

1025
00:53:02,520 --> 00:53:04,319
Speaker 2: into bed, and you just waited after the first one

1026
00:53:04,360 --> 00:53:05,400
Speaker 2: for the next shoe to drop.

1027
00:53:05,560 --> 00:53:06,000
Speaker 4: That's good.

1028
00:53:06,080 --> 00:53:09,719
Speaker 5: You guys are amazing. What history buffs shoes news.

1029
00:53:09,760 --> 00:53:12,640
Speaker 2: You can use hue drops so so in terms of

1030
00:53:12,680 --> 00:53:15,759
Speaker 2: the Fed, how does Jerome How did Jerome Powell and co?

1031
00:53:15,920 --> 00:53:17,800
Speaker 2: Deal with this? We I guess I'll expect them to

1032
00:53:17,880 --> 00:53:20,759
Speaker 2: raise rates at least one more time. The debate is

1033
00:53:21,120 --> 00:53:23,640
Speaker 2: as to whether they cut rates when things start getting

1034
00:53:23,680 --> 00:53:26,719
Speaker 2: really painful, if we have big problems in commercial real

1035
00:53:26,840 --> 00:53:30,799
Speaker 2: estate for the financial stability picture, if we have a

1036
00:53:30,880 --> 00:53:33,880
Speaker 2: jumping unemployment, if another one or two million people lose

1037
00:53:34,480 --> 00:53:36,160
Speaker 2: or if one or two million people lose their jobs

1038
00:53:36,160 --> 00:53:37,600
Speaker 2: when we get to like four and a half percent,

1039
00:53:37,640 --> 00:53:41,440
Speaker 2: which relatively is relatively low, but still that would that

1040
00:53:41,480 --> 00:53:44,719
Speaker 2: would hurt for especially those losing the jobs. Does the

1041
00:53:44,760 --> 00:53:48,759
Speaker 2: FED have the resolve to keep fighting inflation or will

1042
00:53:48,800 --> 00:53:51,400
Speaker 2: they you know, blink and cut rates early?

1043
00:53:52,360 --> 00:53:55,239
Speaker 5: Well, I can't read his mind. And you know, you

1044
00:53:55,280 --> 00:53:58,080
Speaker 5: got to believe Jay Powell. He's he's been consistent all

1045
00:53:58,120 --> 00:54:01,040
Speaker 5: the way back since last last year. I was going

1046
00:54:01,080 --> 00:54:03,520
Speaker 5: to say last summer he is willing to hurt the

1047
00:54:03,560 --> 00:54:07,839
Speaker 5: economy to reduce inflation. But so far inflation has come down.

1048
00:54:08,239 --> 00:54:11,879
Speaker 5: Oil prices and commodity prices have softened. You guys are

1049
00:54:11,920 --> 00:54:15,839
Speaker 5: just talking about doctor Copper about thirty minutes ago. And

1050
00:54:15,960 --> 00:54:21,239
Speaker 5: so I got to think that amazingly they are orchestrating,

1051
00:54:21,719 --> 00:54:24,600
Speaker 5: even though it's hard to believe a soft landing. They

1052
00:54:24,640 --> 00:54:27,239
Speaker 5: are though going to raise rates obviously again at least

1053
00:54:27,320 --> 00:54:29,920
Speaker 5: once more. And as your last guest said, we're all

1054
00:54:29,920 --> 00:54:31,960
Speaker 5: going to be looking for the P word, the pauseword,

1055
00:54:33,239 --> 00:54:35,400
Speaker 5: and maybe they will. I don't think they're going to

1056
00:54:35,440 --> 00:54:38,200
Speaker 5: pivot this year. I think the market, the bomb market's

1057
00:54:38,239 --> 00:54:43,160
Speaker 5: overly optimistic about that. But I am amazed at how

1058
00:54:43,280 --> 00:54:48,920
Speaker 5: uncomfortable investors feel. Yet the planes are full, people are shopping,

1059
00:54:49,000 --> 00:54:51,520
Speaker 5: they're going to the Grand Prix, they're buying bottle service.

1060
00:54:53,080 --> 00:54:56,720
Speaker 5: This economy is strong, not just here. But Matt explained

1061
00:54:56,719 --> 00:54:58,920
Speaker 5: to me Europe. That is amazing to me.

1062
00:54:59,120 --> 00:55:02,080
Speaker 2: It is actually I mean, for months, Paul and I

1063
00:55:02,120 --> 00:55:06,120
Speaker 2: were terrified for Europeans on their behalf. We thought, oh

1064
00:55:06,120 --> 00:55:08,520
Speaker 2: my goodness, what are they looking forward to. It's going

1065
00:55:08,560 --> 00:55:10,960
Speaker 2: to be an awful winter. And it turned out, you know,

1066
00:55:11,000 --> 00:55:15,600
Speaker 2: the weather is what blessed them, I guess, and they

1067
00:55:15,760 --> 00:55:18,680
Speaker 2: seem to have avoided a recession. Also, you got the

1068
00:55:18,760 --> 00:55:23,400
Speaker 2: Chinese reopening, which was a surprise. With those things happening,

1069
00:55:23,440 --> 00:55:27,200
Speaker 2: I kind of expected a lift to commodities prices, right,

1070
00:55:27,280 --> 00:55:30,000
Speaker 2: and we still see oil now at seventy seven dollars

1071
00:55:30,000 --> 00:55:33,000
Speaker 2: of aarrol, even after the surprise cut. Why don't we

1072
00:55:33,120 --> 00:55:36,480
Speaker 2: see you know, iron Ore was tanking this morning when

1073
00:55:36,480 --> 00:55:38,320
Speaker 2: I came in. Why don't we see a lift of

1074
00:55:38,360 --> 00:55:41,600
Speaker 2: these commodity prices. Why isn't the global economy expected to

1075
00:55:41,680 --> 00:55:46,760
Speaker 2: grow with all of with all these blessings from beyond?

1076
00:55:47,840 --> 00:55:50,120
Speaker 5: You know, I'll tell you guys a secret. That's why

1077
00:55:50,160 --> 00:55:52,160
Speaker 5: I listened to your show every day when I drive in.

1078
00:55:52,239 --> 00:55:55,319
Speaker 5: You go, you know in California. You know, we're the

1079
00:55:55,320 --> 00:55:57,840
Speaker 5: graveyard shift of the financial markets. So we're coming in

1080
00:55:57,840 --> 00:56:00,520
Speaker 5: when the market's already open. But I listen to you

1081
00:56:00,520 --> 00:56:03,160
Speaker 5: guys because I'm baffled by this. You're right, I have

1082
00:56:03,239 --> 00:56:05,360
Speaker 5: been in Paul mentioned, I've been in this business a

1083
00:56:05,360 --> 00:56:09,000
Speaker 5: heck of a long time. And this market is really

1084
00:56:09,040 --> 00:56:14,160
Speaker 5: a conundrum because so many people feel like there's some

1085
00:56:14,400 --> 00:56:17,319
Speaker 5: kind of a pothole, not an O eight, but a

1086
00:56:17,320 --> 00:56:22,240
Speaker 5: pothole coming a recession. It's the most anticipated recession in history,

1087
00:56:22,719 --> 00:56:25,160
Speaker 5: and I can't believe I'm saying this. But therefore it

1088
00:56:25,200 --> 00:56:28,439
Speaker 5: may not happen. We may just muddle our way back

1089
00:56:28,520 --> 00:56:31,319
Speaker 5: out of this. I find that hard to believe I've

1090
00:56:31,320 --> 00:56:35,120
Speaker 5: been nervous. We have been defensive all year, and that's

1091
00:56:35,200 --> 00:56:38,040
Speaker 5: hurt us, not tremendously, but you know, every time there's

1092
00:56:38,080 --> 00:56:40,200
Speaker 5: a rally, we sell into it, and I see that

1093
00:56:40,280 --> 00:56:42,920
Speaker 5: in a lot of investors. The one thing I'm very

1094
00:56:42,960 --> 00:56:50,000
Speaker 5: concerned about is ill liquidity amongst major institutional investors, endowments.

1095
00:56:50,880 --> 00:56:55,279
Speaker 5: Certainly in there's no liquidation in private equity or in

1096
00:56:55,320 --> 00:56:59,000
Speaker 5: real estate, and those are two huge illiquid asset classes.

1097
00:56:59,040 --> 00:57:02,279
Speaker 5: We all count on some activity and cash flow and

1098
00:57:02,320 --> 00:57:05,680
Speaker 5: nobody's seeing anything. So if you're a mature plan like

1099
00:57:05,719 --> 00:57:08,600
Speaker 5: we are, where people have negative cash flows, you know

1100
00:57:08,680 --> 00:57:11,320
Speaker 5: your cash is dear in this market and you're holding

1101
00:57:11,360 --> 00:57:11,799
Speaker 5: on to it.

1102
00:57:12,200 --> 00:57:14,400
Speaker 1: All right, Chris, really appreciate getting a couple of minutes

1103
00:57:14,440 --> 00:57:16,280
Speaker 1: of your time. As always, next time you're in New York,

1104
00:57:16,280 --> 00:57:18,200
Speaker 1: please let us know. We'll get you in the studio here,

1105
00:57:18,640 --> 00:57:20,080
Speaker 1: have a proper discussion studio.

1106
00:57:20,120 --> 00:57:23,040
Speaker 2: We'll take you out to launch Man exactly right. Yeah,

1107
00:57:23,040 --> 00:57:25,000
Speaker 2: this is the big town. We stayed into hotail hours,

1108
00:57:25,120 --> 00:57:29,120
Speaker 2: sure le service. Absolutely. Chris Alman. He's the CIO of Colsters.

1109
00:57:29,360 --> 00:57:32,360
Speaker 1: They manage the money for the California State Teachers Retirement

1110
00:57:32,440 --> 00:57:35,920
Speaker 1: System been a longtime investor, really stage, we love getting

1111
00:57:35,920 --> 00:57:36,560
Speaker 1: his in the thoughts.

1112
00:57:36,600 --> 00:57:39,680
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to the Bloomberg Markets podcast. You can

1113
00:57:39,720 --> 00:57:43,520
Speaker 2: subscribe and listen to interviews at Apple Podcasts or whatever

1114
00:57:43,600 --> 00:57:47,320
Speaker 2: podcast platform you prefer. I'm Matt Miller. I'm on Twitter

1115
00:57:47,520 --> 00:57:49,439
Speaker 2: at Matt Miller nineteen seventy three.

1116
00:57:49,880 --> 00:57:52,240
Speaker 1: And I'm Fall Sweeney. I'm on Twitter at pt Sweeney.

1117
00:57:52,400 --> 00:57:55,080
Speaker 1: Before the podcast, you can always catch us worldwide at

1118
00:57:55,080 --> 00:57:56,800
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Radio