1 00:00:16,897 --> 00:00:27,577 Speaker 1: Pushkin Before we get started, let's talk about Pushkin Plus. 2 00:00:28,097 --> 00:00:32,697 Speaker 1: Pushkin Plus is a subscription podcast program available on Apple Podcasts. 3 00:00:33,257 --> 00:00:36,697 Speaker 1: Members will get access to exclusive bonus content like my 4 00:00:36,777 --> 00:00:39,417 Speaker 1: weekly bookmarks, where I talk about how I got a 5 00:00:39,457 --> 00:00:41,857 Speaker 1: book agent and what I'm watching on TV that week. 6 00:00:42,457 --> 00:00:46,217 Speaker 1: You'll get uninterrupted listening to many of your favorite podcasts 7 00:00:46,537 --> 00:00:51,457 Speaker 1: like Revisionous History, Cautionary Tales, and The Happiness Lab. Sign 8 00:00:51,497 --> 00:00:53,817 Speaker 1: up for Pushkin Plus on the show page in Apple 9 00:00:53,897 --> 00:01:03,457 Speaker 1: podcast or at pushkin dot Fm. I just want to 10 00:01:03,657 --> 00:01:08,657 Speaker 1: move through the world completely honest. I think when you 11 00:01:09,457 --> 00:01:13,937 Speaker 1: cling to the fake versions of yourself, you deny not 12 00:01:14,017 --> 00:01:17,417 Speaker 1: only you, you deny other people of getting to know 13 00:01:17,417 --> 00:01:20,817 Speaker 1: the real you and loving you for all the amazing 14 00:01:20,857 --> 00:01:26,457 Speaker 1: things that you actually are. Gabrielle Union is amazing. She 15 00:01:26,657 --> 00:01:29,657 Speaker 1: is a businesswoman and a best selling author who has 16 00:01:29,737 --> 00:01:33,537 Speaker 1: made her living in the public eye. She's an icon. 17 00:01:34,777 --> 00:01:37,577 Speaker 1: Gabrielle became a household name, which she starred in the 18 00:01:37,617 --> 00:01:41,137 Speaker 1: TV show Being Mary Jane, which is one of my favorites, 19 00:01:41,977 --> 00:01:44,737 Speaker 1: and with her star turn roles in cult films like 20 00:01:44,857 --> 00:01:50,177 Speaker 1: Bringing On and She's All That, she is unforgettable. But 21 00:01:50,297 --> 00:01:53,737 Speaker 1: as an author, she shows us a much more vulnerable 22 00:01:53,817 --> 00:01:57,577 Speaker 1: side than her on screen characters. Reading her work is 23 00:01:57,577 --> 00:02:13,617 Speaker 1: like having a conversation with a loving sister. Welcome to 24 00:02:13,697 --> 00:02:17,177 Speaker 1: well read Black Girl, the literary kickback you didn't even 25 00:02:17,257 --> 00:02:23,657 Speaker 1: know you needed. I'm your host Glory Adam. Today I'm 26 00:02:23,737 --> 00:02:27,857 Speaker 1: joined by Gabrielle Union. We chat about her lifelong love 27 00:02:27,857 --> 00:02:31,057 Speaker 1: of reading and how some of her most iconic roles 28 00:02:31,097 --> 00:02:36,217 Speaker 1: still bring her joy. In her latest memoir, You Got 29 00:02:36,257 --> 00:02:39,897 Speaker 1: Anything Stronger, we see how she embraced living in open 30 00:02:40,017 --> 00:02:43,057 Speaker 1: and honest life and how she's used her writing to 31 00:02:43,097 --> 00:02:46,017 Speaker 1: get closer to the person she has always wanted to be. 32 00:03:01,737 --> 00:03:04,817 Speaker 1: Thank you again for coming through coming on the podcast. 33 00:03:05,257 --> 00:03:08,377 Speaker 1: I'm so so happy to see you, and I really 34 00:03:08,417 --> 00:03:10,897 Speaker 1: want to talk to you about the joy of your 35 00:03:10,897 --> 00:03:13,577 Speaker 1: life and what you found brought you joy when you 36 00:03:13,577 --> 00:03:18,377 Speaker 1: were writing both of your books, the process of writing itself. 37 00:03:18,777 --> 00:03:23,097 Speaker 1: I find so much joy in a lot of joy 38 00:03:23,177 --> 00:03:25,617 Speaker 1: and a lot of peace. I'm finding that the older 39 00:03:25,617 --> 00:03:28,897 Speaker 1: I get, the things that softened my heart that don't 40 00:03:28,937 --> 00:03:32,017 Speaker 1: cause those jumps, you know, that roller coaster of emotion 41 00:03:32,057 --> 00:03:36,777 Speaker 1: that I used to think was fun and entertaining and 42 00:03:37,017 --> 00:03:40,937 Speaker 1: necessary in order to feel alive. I don't really require 43 00:03:41,057 --> 00:03:45,217 Speaker 1: that anymore. The parts of me that I don't post 44 00:03:45,297 --> 00:03:48,577 Speaker 1: on social media probably are the things that bring me 45 00:03:49,177 --> 00:03:52,297 Speaker 1: the kind of joy that people probably aren't aware of. 46 00:03:52,817 --> 00:03:55,097 Speaker 1: I know, you're always reading, you're always writing, you have 47 00:03:55,177 --> 00:03:58,137 Speaker 1: children's books, you have both of your memoirs. How are 48 00:03:58,177 --> 00:04:00,537 Speaker 1: you seeing present? Like? Well, books kind of still bring 49 00:04:00,577 --> 00:04:05,537 Speaker 1: you joy in peace. Well, the one I just finished 50 00:04:06,617 --> 00:04:10,497 Speaker 1: was called The Prophets. Yes, such a good book. We 51 00:04:10,657 --> 00:04:12,857 Speaker 1: got to get into the projects because over the years, 52 00:04:13,097 --> 00:04:15,417 Speaker 1: as I've been doing my own research for different projects, 53 00:04:15,617 --> 00:04:19,457 Speaker 1: I'm like, well, where where do the lgbtq I A 54 00:04:19,497 --> 00:04:24,337 Speaker 1: community magically disappear? To you know, during the Civil rights movement, 55 00:04:24,617 --> 00:04:29,257 Speaker 1: during slavery, during every major part of black history, where 56 00:04:29,257 --> 00:04:33,497 Speaker 1: does the lgbt QIA community go? We didn't disappear. So 57 00:04:33,737 --> 00:04:36,697 Speaker 1: to hear about the book, I was like, I gotta 58 00:04:36,737 --> 00:04:38,337 Speaker 1: get it, I gotta get it, I gotta get it. 59 00:04:38,617 --> 00:04:41,777 Speaker 1: And when it finally arrived, it was it was the 60 00:04:41,817 --> 00:04:45,537 Speaker 1: best gift I've I've ever been given. And it took 61 00:04:45,537 --> 00:04:47,577 Speaker 1: me six months to read it because I didn't want 62 00:04:47,617 --> 00:04:49,697 Speaker 1: it to end and confirmed what we all knew. Well, 63 00:04:49,697 --> 00:04:51,977 Speaker 1: that's the power of narrative too, because it's like it 64 00:04:51,977 --> 00:04:54,377 Speaker 1: corrects the record, right, It's like, this is why we're 65 00:04:54,417 --> 00:04:56,977 Speaker 1: so enthralled with the sixteen nineteen project and so many 66 00:04:56,977 --> 00:04:59,497 Speaker 1: other stories, because it's like, we need these stories to 67 00:04:59,537 --> 00:05:02,177 Speaker 1: correct the record and show that we had so many 68 00:05:02,217 --> 00:05:05,297 Speaker 1: more experiences that have been left out of history. So, yes, 69 00:05:05,377 --> 00:05:07,977 Speaker 1: it's fiction, but that was a reality for us that 70 00:05:08,137 --> 00:05:10,937 Speaker 1: wasn't covered, that wasn't appreciated, and now we had the 71 00:05:10,977 --> 00:05:14,137 Speaker 1: space to read about it and have dialogue and not 72 00:05:14,257 --> 00:05:17,937 Speaker 1: leave people out of the conversation. Now I'm yeah, one 73 00:05:17,977 --> 00:05:21,057 Speaker 1: thing that I'm really curious to hear about is your childhood. 74 00:05:21,217 --> 00:05:23,497 Speaker 1: What books kind of showed up or what stories did 75 00:05:23,497 --> 00:05:27,057 Speaker 1: you read that you still remember. My older sister had 76 00:05:27,217 --> 00:05:32,057 Speaker 1: an obscene collection of Nancy Drew mysteries, and they weren't 77 00:05:32,177 --> 00:05:35,017 Speaker 1: really my thing, but because I wanted to connect my 78 00:05:35,057 --> 00:05:39,537 Speaker 1: sister so badly, she was she was it for me. 79 00:05:39,577 --> 00:05:42,417 Speaker 1: I wanted to be her, so anything that she was into, 80 00:05:42,497 --> 00:05:48,577 Speaker 1: I was into. Perry Mason. Yes, me too, your sisters. 81 00:05:49,257 --> 00:05:51,617 Speaker 1: I mean, I mean as a child, it's a little odd, 82 00:05:51,657 --> 00:05:55,337 Speaker 1: but but yeah, and Nancy Drew. So I read all 83 00:05:55,377 --> 00:05:58,457 Speaker 1: of the Nancy Drew books. I read all anything Judy 84 00:05:58,497 --> 00:06:01,537 Speaker 1: Bloom has ever written in life. I have read My God, 85 00:06:01,577 --> 00:06:04,097 Speaker 1: I Love Judy. Yeah, those are the pages of my life, 86 00:06:04,097 --> 00:06:08,497 Speaker 1: of my childhood. That's where I felt most seen for 87 00:06:08,537 --> 00:06:11,657 Speaker 1: certain chunks of my childhood. I don't share this often, 88 00:06:11,737 --> 00:06:13,697 Speaker 1: and my mom is like rolling her eyes. I'm sure 89 00:06:14,817 --> 00:06:17,737 Speaker 1: they wanted me to skip third grade and my mom 90 00:06:17,817 --> 00:06:20,337 Speaker 1: was like, no, no, you know, we just moved from 91 00:06:20,337 --> 00:06:24,617 Speaker 1: Omaha to Northern California and we moved into the top, 92 00:06:24,977 --> 00:06:27,297 Speaker 1: you know, school district with the highest test scores, and 93 00:06:27,537 --> 00:06:29,497 Speaker 1: I'm sure they thought they were going to, you know, 94 00:06:29,897 --> 00:06:33,297 Speaker 1: send this new little black child into the slower track. 95 00:06:33,897 --> 00:06:36,257 Speaker 1: And I came in and they were like, she's at 96 00:06:36,257 --> 00:06:39,057 Speaker 1: a reading level that's kind of beyond. And my mom 97 00:06:39,137 --> 00:06:41,537 Speaker 1: was like, no, I think emotionally, she's probably not ready. 98 00:06:41,777 --> 00:06:44,337 Speaker 1: And then they asked again if I was able to 99 00:06:44,377 --> 00:06:46,937 Speaker 1: skip the fourth grade, and my mom was like, still no. 100 00:06:47,617 --> 00:06:51,097 Speaker 1: So I was just always kind of ahead and certainly 101 00:06:51,097 --> 00:06:53,897 Speaker 1: with like reading and reading comprehension and all of these things. 102 00:06:54,417 --> 00:06:57,417 Speaker 1: So my mom was like, maybe she's ready for, you know, 103 00:06:57,497 --> 00:07:00,937 Speaker 1: some more advanced subject. And it wasn't that she didn't 104 00:07:00,937 --> 00:07:02,897 Speaker 1: think I would understand it. I think her fear was 105 00:07:02,937 --> 00:07:08,257 Speaker 1: that I would and I would understand how are our 106 00:07:08,297 --> 00:07:11,937 Speaker 1: country treats black people and black children? And I think 107 00:07:12,017 --> 00:07:14,337 Speaker 1: she was worried about what does an eight nine year 108 00:07:14,337 --> 00:07:18,377 Speaker 1: old do with that? And then my mom took me 109 00:07:18,457 --> 00:07:21,577 Speaker 1: to a reading that Nikki Giovanni was reading poetry at 110 00:07:21,617 --> 00:07:25,777 Speaker 1: the Oakland Children's Museum, and she took me and I 111 00:07:25,897 --> 00:07:31,137 Speaker 1: was transfixed and transported, and then it sort of opened 112 00:07:31,217 --> 00:07:34,857 Speaker 1: up the world of black authors and people that look 113 00:07:34,937 --> 00:07:40,017 Speaker 1: like me. Who you know, who are writers? What I mean? 114 00:07:40,017 --> 00:07:41,857 Speaker 1: She was the first one I saw in, you know, 115 00:07:41,937 --> 00:07:46,177 Speaker 1: in the flesh. She made it it all feel possible 116 00:07:46,297 --> 00:07:49,657 Speaker 1: and real. And when you grow up in predominantly white spaces, 117 00:07:49,697 --> 00:07:52,417 Speaker 1: you think that some of the things that bring you 118 00:07:52,457 --> 00:07:55,337 Speaker 1: the most joy are really reserved for white people and 119 00:07:55,417 --> 00:07:58,097 Speaker 1: white kids, and you're like an interloper, you know, like 120 00:07:58,137 --> 00:08:01,937 Speaker 1: a voyeur, if you will. And so seeing Nikki Giovanni 121 00:08:01,977 --> 00:08:05,137 Speaker 1: and listening to her and listening to her cadence and 122 00:08:05,497 --> 00:08:09,297 Speaker 1: how she would turn a phrase, her syntax, I was like, yeah, 123 00:08:09,577 --> 00:08:13,617 Speaker 1: I found white people, and even just looking around and 124 00:08:13,657 --> 00:08:16,337 Speaker 1: seeing other kids in the audience that looked like me. 125 00:08:16,897 --> 00:08:19,777 Speaker 1: So it was these trips to Oakland and San Francisco 126 00:08:20,457 --> 00:08:24,097 Speaker 1: where I was able to just see other black people 127 00:08:24,177 --> 00:08:27,097 Speaker 1: and other black children who liked, you know, reading and 128 00:08:27,217 --> 00:08:30,497 Speaker 1: poetry and writing, and that kind of opened the door. 129 00:08:30,617 --> 00:08:34,097 Speaker 1: And then Anne Moody was the first author that blew 130 00:08:34,097 --> 00:08:36,937 Speaker 1: my world open, and Coming of Age in Mississippi was 131 00:08:36,977 --> 00:08:40,257 Speaker 1: the first kind of older kid book that I read 132 00:08:40,417 --> 00:08:42,657 Speaker 1: at I think I was in the fourth grade. It's 133 00:08:42,657 --> 00:08:44,777 Speaker 1: so wild because I'm a new mom and I'm trying 134 00:08:44,777 --> 00:08:46,617 Speaker 1: to figure out what to teach my son. But I 135 00:08:46,617 --> 00:08:49,817 Speaker 1: always remember I went to a conference or some kind 136 00:08:49,857 --> 00:08:51,177 Speaker 1: I can't even remember. I think it was a reading, 137 00:08:51,177 --> 00:08:54,297 Speaker 1: but Alice Walker was there, and Alice Walker said that 138 00:08:54,537 --> 00:08:57,897 Speaker 1: you need to treat young children like humans, like treat 139 00:08:57,937 --> 00:09:02,217 Speaker 1: them with enough consideration that they can understand complex things. 140 00:09:02,577 --> 00:09:04,337 Speaker 1: Did you ever write as a child too? Did you 141 00:09:04,377 --> 00:09:06,417 Speaker 1: like see Nikki Giovanni and tried to attempt to do 142 00:09:06,457 --> 00:09:10,257 Speaker 1: your own poems? Yes, the ones I remember are from 143 00:09:10,297 --> 00:09:12,737 Speaker 1: high school, and I found them not too long ago. 144 00:09:13,337 --> 00:09:16,537 Speaker 1: I wrote a lot of bad poetry. After Jason Kidd 145 00:09:16,857 --> 00:09:20,697 Speaker 1: NBA legend. He was one of my high school boyfriends, 146 00:09:20,737 --> 00:09:22,937 Speaker 1: and after he broke up with me three weeks before 147 00:09:23,017 --> 00:09:25,977 Speaker 1: junior prom in front of my dad and a gymnasium, 148 00:09:25,977 --> 00:09:32,097 Speaker 1: full of people. Um, it's okay, I'm a right not u. 149 00:09:33,097 --> 00:09:35,337 Speaker 1: But there was this poem and it was called like 150 00:09:35,457 --> 00:09:38,697 Speaker 1: You're my Crystal Sextant, and it was like you're my 151 00:09:38,777 --> 00:09:41,737 Speaker 1: Crystal sextant leading me to my fate. And then there 152 00:09:41,777 --> 00:09:44,977 Speaker 1: was one called little Boys. Little boys like to play 153 00:09:45,137 --> 00:09:48,017 Speaker 1: childish games from night to day. They think they're old, 154 00:09:48,057 --> 00:09:51,017 Speaker 1: but to their dismay their years from where her maturity 155 00:09:51,017 --> 00:09:57,537 Speaker 1: and manhood lay. What the bitterness is just dripping? Wait, 156 00:09:57,857 --> 00:10:03,337 Speaker 1: how old were you? He was the sixteen or seventeen? Yeah, 157 00:10:03,337 --> 00:10:07,297 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, yeah, oh the artist and you started early. 158 00:10:07,737 --> 00:10:10,537 Speaker 1: I love that. I love that so much. Yeah, it 159 00:10:10,737 --> 00:10:12,857 Speaker 1: is a book of them. I mean I was clearly 160 00:10:12,897 --> 00:10:16,217 Speaker 1: just cranking about in my misery. The fact that you 161 00:10:16,257 --> 00:10:19,777 Speaker 1: remember it though, it left an impression, you know, it 162 00:10:19,937 --> 00:10:23,017 Speaker 1: left something on your heart, and I feel bad producing kids. 163 00:10:23,057 --> 00:10:25,377 Speaker 1: He should not have done that. Yeah, you've said in 164 00:10:25,457 --> 00:10:28,097 Speaker 1: your first book, We're going to need more wine, which 165 00:10:28,137 --> 00:10:30,337 Speaker 1: I loved. There were a lot of chapters that you 166 00:10:30,377 --> 00:10:32,697 Speaker 1: wrote that you weren't ready to share. Can you talk 167 00:10:32,737 --> 00:10:35,177 Speaker 1: about why it's important for you to tell the entire 168 00:10:35,257 --> 00:10:38,257 Speaker 1: story and why it's so important for folks to hear 169 00:10:38,297 --> 00:10:41,377 Speaker 1: the truth, whether your experience in Hollywood or your experience 170 00:10:41,417 --> 00:10:44,137 Speaker 1: with motherhood. Why is that significant for you to be 171 00:10:44,177 --> 00:10:46,217 Speaker 1: able to tell the whole story and not just pieces 172 00:10:46,257 --> 00:10:49,097 Speaker 1: of it. Yeah. I think as I evolve, and as 173 00:10:49,137 --> 00:10:52,817 Speaker 1: I get older, and as I triple down on therapy 174 00:10:53,337 --> 00:10:56,577 Speaker 1: some weeks, I just find it important for me to 175 00:10:56,817 --> 00:11:00,577 Speaker 1: be as honest as possible. If I am going to 176 00:11:00,577 --> 00:11:04,617 Speaker 1: be occupying a public space, I don't want to occupy 177 00:11:04,697 --> 00:11:07,337 Speaker 1: that space as a fraction of me. I don't like 178 00:11:07,417 --> 00:11:09,897 Speaker 1: to have to remember what lies I've told like, I 179 00:11:09,937 --> 00:11:15,057 Speaker 1: just want to move through the world completely honest. My 180 00:11:15,137 --> 00:11:19,337 Speaker 1: whole last self has always served me well. And I 181 00:11:19,377 --> 00:11:23,657 Speaker 1: think when you cling to the fake versions that you 182 00:11:24,097 --> 00:11:27,777 Speaker 1: have sent out of yourself, you deny not only you 183 00:11:28,057 --> 00:11:32,777 Speaker 1: of your own truth and peace that comes with living 184 00:11:32,817 --> 00:11:36,257 Speaker 1: your life out loud and transparently. You deny other people 185 00:11:36,377 --> 00:11:38,737 Speaker 1: of getting to know the real you and loving you 186 00:11:39,497 --> 00:11:42,057 Speaker 1: for all the amazing things that you actually are. In 187 00:11:42,097 --> 00:11:44,417 Speaker 1: both your books, you talk about like your childhood and 188 00:11:44,497 --> 00:11:47,937 Speaker 1: your experiences coming to this level of being so open. 189 00:11:48,377 --> 00:11:51,617 Speaker 1: How did their acting career influence your writing, Because when 190 00:11:51,617 --> 00:11:54,097 Speaker 1: you read your books, it really does feel like we 191 00:11:54,177 --> 00:11:57,057 Speaker 1: know you right was that learned somewhere or was that 192 00:11:57,137 --> 00:11:59,817 Speaker 1: something like that showed up Just because when you're acting 193 00:11:59,857 --> 00:12:02,377 Speaker 1: that has to come out on the screen didn't make 194 00:12:02,417 --> 00:12:05,177 Speaker 1: it easier to write the book. What made the book 195 00:12:05,897 --> 00:12:10,617 Speaker 1: easier to write was therapy. Unfortunately, for the good chunk 196 00:12:10,697 --> 00:12:14,057 Speaker 1: of my acting career, I didn't know how to access truth, 197 00:12:14,257 --> 00:12:17,857 Speaker 1: and truth didn't feel safe, and I think it reflected 198 00:12:18,017 --> 00:12:23,057 Speaker 1: in my work. And then as I embraced radical transparency, 199 00:12:23,137 --> 00:12:26,857 Speaker 1: I just got more comfortable what living out loud and 200 00:12:27,017 --> 00:12:30,897 Speaker 1: in truth feels like for me personally. So I'm like, okay, 201 00:12:30,897 --> 00:12:34,297 Speaker 1: if I can do it as me Gab, I can 202 00:12:34,857 --> 00:12:37,337 Speaker 1: find the truth with my character and not be afraid. 203 00:12:38,097 --> 00:12:41,097 Speaker 1: As artists, as individuals, you want people to like you. 204 00:12:41,697 --> 00:12:44,297 Speaker 1: You want your character to be likable. You have to 205 00:12:44,337 --> 00:12:48,217 Speaker 1: represent a whole race of people. You want your character 206 00:12:48,257 --> 00:12:53,417 Speaker 1: to be beyond reproach. But that kind of snatches the 207 00:12:53,457 --> 00:12:56,497 Speaker 1: truth of the character when you have to pander to 208 00:12:56,697 --> 00:12:59,897 Speaker 1: respectability politics. So if I couldn't find it in my 209 00:12:59,937 --> 00:13:03,577 Speaker 1: real life to feel safe enough to exist, I am 210 00:13:03,617 --> 00:13:07,617 Speaker 1: so firmly committed to assimilating to the white gaze and 211 00:13:07,657 --> 00:13:10,937 Speaker 1: white fears that I have completely lost myself. You know, 212 00:13:11,017 --> 00:13:13,657 Speaker 1: your humanity is stripped when you commit to assimilation. And 213 00:13:13,697 --> 00:13:15,657 Speaker 1: if I have lost myself, how the hell am I 214 00:13:15,697 --> 00:13:18,937 Speaker 1: going to find it? For a character? Right? So, the 215 00:13:19,057 --> 00:13:23,257 Speaker 1: more I have worked to free myself and unlearn, and 216 00:13:23,377 --> 00:13:26,617 Speaker 1: to stop centering white fear in all things that I 217 00:13:26,697 --> 00:13:31,497 Speaker 1: do and certainly my art, I can now truly become 218 00:13:31,537 --> 00:13:49,937 Speaker 1: an artist. As a lover of memoirs and biographies, I 219 00:13:49,977 --> 00:13:53,737 Speaker 1: have benefited from authors revealing themselves so that as readers, 220 00:13:54,257 --> 00:13:58,617 Speaker 1: we can see ourselves. The truth's collected in those pages, 221 00:13:59,297 --> 00:14:02,617 Speaker 1: typed out letter by letter as they were lived moment 222 00:14:02,697 --> 00:14:06,977 Speaker 1: to moment, build a community of kindred strangers. I owe 223 00:14:06,977 --> 00:14:10,617 Speaker 1: these writers a debt, and while I can never repay them, 224 00:14:10,657 --> 00:14:13,537 Speaker 1: and I can at least honor them by sharing my 225 00:14:13,617 --> 00:14:17,577 Speaker 1: own truths here with you, readers gather the courage to 226 00:14:17,617 --> 00:14:21,657 Speaker 1: become storytellers, and the lifeline is past person to person, 227 00:14:22,017 --> 00:14:34,817 Speaker 1: book by book. The message remains keep going. Hi, this 228 00:14:34,897 --> 00:14:38,617 Speaker 1: is Gabrielle Union. You are listening to well read Black Girl. 229 00:14:41,817 --> 00:14:45,057 Speaker 1: I'm Glory Adam and you're listening to well read black Girl. 230 00:14:45,617 --> 00:14:49,097 Speaker 1: That was Gabrielle Union reading from her recent memoir You 231 00:14:49,177 --> 00:14:56,297 Speaker 1: Got Anything Stronger. I'm joined by Gabrielle today. I'm really 232 00:14:56,297 --> 00:14:58,897 Speaker 1: curious to hear how your love of writing and just 233 00:14:59,017 --> 00:15:02,097 Speaker 1: like art pivoted over into acting. Like when did you 234 00:15:02,137 --> 00:15:04,137 Speaker 1: know what you wanted to become an actress and really 235 00:15:04,137 --> 00:15:08,137 Speaker 1: pursue that. I'm still waiting for that moment. It's just 236 00:15:08,257 --> 00:15:11,417 Speaker 1: it's because I didn't. I wasn't in drama club. It 237 00:15:11,497 --> 00:15:14,137 Speaker 1: was never a thing for me. So I got this 238 00:15:14,177 --> 00:15:17,697 Speaker 1: internship at a modeling agency, and eventually the man I 239 00:15:17,737 --> 00:15:19,977 Speaker 1: had been interning for he was like, well, let's just 240 00:15:20,017 --> 00:15:22,697 Speaker 1: make up a fake resume and send you in and 241 00:15:22,777 --> 00:15:25,177 Speaker 1: see how you do. So I was like, how hard 242 00:15:25,217 --> 00:15:27,857 Speaker 1: could this be? And I booked my first audition, but 243 00:15:27,937 --> 00:15:30,377 Speaker 1: it was still nothing that I thought I wanted to do. 244 00:15:30,417 --> 00:15:32,457 Speaker 1: I didn't want to give up my good job, you 245 00:15:32,497 --> 00:15:34,777 Speaker 1: know how we are, And my good job was making 246 00:15:34,937 --> 00:15:37,177 Speaker 1: six dollars and sixteen cents an hour as the book 247 00:15:37,177 --> 00:15:40,497 Speaker 1: buyback supervisor at UCLA bookstore. I thought that was going 248 00:15:40,537 --> 00:15:44,017 Speaker 1: to be the pathway to my career, whatever that was 249 00:15:44,057 --> 00:15:46,177 Speaker 1: going to be. But then the money the first year 250 00:15:46,217 --> 00:15:48,377 Speaker 1: I made more than my parents and they were like, listen, 251 00:15:48,537 --> 00:15:50,377 Speaker 1: I think this acting thing is going to work out. 252 00:15:51,617 --> 00:15:55,057 Speaker 1: I also need a new roof. So for a long time, 253 00:15:55,097 --> 00:15:57,217 Speaker 1: it was just something I did that was fun. I 254 00:15:57,257 --> 00:15:59,537 Speaker 1: got to work with cool people, but I didn't know 255 00:15:59,577 --> 00:16:01,617 Speaker 1: what I was doing. I mean for years and years 256 00:16:01,897 --> 00:16:05,737 Speaker 1: until I started taking acting glasses with a private acting coach, 257 00:16:05,777 --> 00:16:08,857 Speaker 1: and I felt like I started to understand the material 258 00:16:08,937 --> 00:16:12,817 Speaker 1: in a different kind of way. I challenged myself and 259 00:16:12,897 --> 00:16:16,697 Speaker 1: that's when when my love affair with acting really took hold. 260 00:16:17,257 --> 00:16:20,737 Speaker 1: You know, everyone knows your role and Bringing On? Did 261 00:16:20,777 --> 00:16:22,217 Speaker 1: you know it was going to be such this like 262 00:16:22,297 --> 00:16:25,217 Speaker 1: cultural moment where everyone would be like dressing up as 263 00:16:25,257 --> 00:16:28,777 Speaker 1: you've Ralloween and like copying your ponytail. So by the 264 00:16:28,857 --> 00:16:32,937 Speaker 1: time Bringing On came around, I had already done ten 265 00:16:32,977 --> 00:16:35,337 Speaker 1: things I had about you. She's all that love on basketball, 266 00:16:35,897 --> 00:16:38,417 Speaker 1: So they were just like, oh, she's the black of 267 00:16:38,497 --> 00:16:40,857 Speaker 1: the moment. But by that time, the movie was called 268 00:16:40,977 --> 00:16:43,777 Speaker 1: cheer Fever, and it was already set up at Universal 269 00:16:43,817 --> 00:16:46,377 Speaker 1: and they had arranged a table read. But from all 270 00:16:46,417 --> 00:16:49,937 Speaker 1: of those actors, the only person that ended up in 271 00:16:49,977 --> 00:16:54,337 Speaker 1: the movie was me. Cheer Fever wasn't actually the movie 272 00:16:54,617 --> 00:16:58,297 Speaker 1: I wanted. I wanted Sugar and Spice, the cheerleading robbery 273 00:16:58,537 --> 00:17:02,497 Speaker 1: movie that was positioned as the cheerleading movie to have, 274 00:17:03,177 --> 00:17:05,777 Speaker 1: and I think they were like twelve leads or something, 275 00:17:06,257 --> 00:17:09,137 Speaker 1: and turns out none of them could be black. So 276 00:17:09,217 --> 00:17:14,457 Speaker 1: I begrudgingly took cheer Fever. I'm like, oh, oh my gosh, Okay, 277 00:17:14,457 --> 00:17:16,217 Speaker 1: well at least it's a check. The check will clear 278 00:17:16,337 --> 00:17:20,577 Speaker 1: like whatever. So yeah, no, none of us took Bring 279 00:17:20,617 --> 00:17:23,937 Speaker 1: It On or cheer Fever because it was like, you know, 280 00:17:24,097 --> 00:17:26,577 Speaker 1: the movie that we all wanted and we could foresee 281 00:17:26,617 --> 00:17:29,937 Speaker 1: this legacy. And no, not at all. It was like 282 00:17:29,937 --> 00:17:31,577 Speaker 1: the movie we took because we didn't get the movies 283 00:17:31,577 --> 00:17:35,177 Speaker 1: we wanted. But then it was a big deal because 284 00:17:35,417 --> 00:17:37,257 Speaker 1: black folks came out because it looked like it was, 285 00:17:37,297 --> 00:17:40,457 Speaker 1: you know, us versus the Toros. And then people saw 286 00:17:40,497 --> 00:17:42,937 Speaker 1: it and it was like they're like in a third maybe, 287 00:17:43,377 --> 00:17:46,777 Speaker 1: and so it was a conversation and articles and whatnot, 288 00:17:46,857 --> 00:17:48,697 Speaker 1: and you know at the time, but then you know, 289 00:17:48,737 --> 00:17:51,577 Speaker 1: it's been twenty years. So when somebody tagged me with 290 00:17:51,657 --> 00:17:54,457 Speaker 1: it and was like, where were these scenes in the movie, 291 00:17:54,497 --> 00:17:58,017 Speaker 1: and I was like, ah, time for another story time 292 00:17:58,177 --> 00:18:02,857 Speaker 1: on TikTok, where I explained why after we finished the 293 00:18:02,897 --> 00:18:06,057 Speaker 1: movie they had cut it. They'd shown the footage to 294 00:18:06,177 --> 00:18:09,457 Speaker 1: test audiences, and the test audiences wanted more of the Clovers, 295 00:18:09,977 --> 00:18:12,937 Speaker 1: so they didn't want to, you know, do reshoots and 296 00:18:13,017 --> 00:18:16,177 Speaker 1: have to really truly change major plot points. But they 297 00:18:16,177 --> 00:18:20,297 Speaker 1: were like, well, we can shoot additional footage that only 298 00:18:20,337 --> 00:18:24,097 Speaker 1: lives in the trailer in the hopes that audiences would 299 00:18:24,097 --> 00:18:27,497 Speaker 1: think that the movie was more equal between the Clovers 300 00:18:27,577 --> 00:18:31,697 Speaker 1: and the Toros. But I think what the main takeaway 301 00:18:31,777 --> 00:18:34,417 Speaker 1: is and that you could see it easily in all 302 00:18:34,457 --> 00:18:38,297 Speaker 1: of the sequels that followed were the Hood teams were 303 00:18:38,337 --> 00:18:42,137 Speaker 1: always centered in the sequels, whereas we weren't centered in 304 00:18:42,377 --> 00:18:45,897 Speaker 1: the original because we wanted more Clovers. Hello, but clearly 305 00:18:45,937 --> 00:18:50,097 Speaker 1: everybody did. And you know it's holding to this day. 306 00:18:50,297 --> 00:18:54,057 Speaker 1: I mean from day one it was magic. Like I'm 307 00:18:54,097 --> 00:18:58,657 Speaker 1: still close to everyone associated with the movie. It's a 308 00:18:58,737 --> 00:19:01,657 Speaker 1: gift that keeps on giving, right right. I also love 309 00:19:01,737 --> 00:19:04,177 Speaker 1: just like the friendships you have. You've have homegirls that 310 00:19:04,217 --> 00:19:06,337 Speaker 1: you've known it's like the third grade and you know, 311 00:19:06,337 --> 00:19:08,617 Speaker 1: you guys have grown up together. Can you just talk 312 00:19:08,657 --> 00:19:11,817 Speaker 1: about the places where you found community and what those 313 00:19:11,817 --> 00:19:14,777 Speaker 1: spaces mean to you. Yeah. I've always been very lucky 314 00:19:14,897 --> 00:19:18,377 Speaker 1: from the beginning of my career that the black and 315 00:19:18,377 --> 00:19:21,657 Speaker 1: brown folks around me, whether they were in front of 316 00:19:21,657 --> 00:19:24,417 Speaker 1: the camera or behind the camera, We're like, oh girl, okay, 317 00:19:24,457 --> 00:19:27,577 Speaker 1: come here, come here, Okay, what you want to do 318 00:19:27,617 --> 00:19:29,937 Speaker 1: on this next take? And they just weren't interested in 319 00:19:29,977 --> 00:19:34,537 Speaker 1: watching me fail? And nowadays it seems crazy because so 320 00:19:34,577 --> 00:19:38,097 Speaker 1: many people are very interested in watching people fail. If 321 00:19:38,137 --> 00:19:40,737 Speaker 1: you fail, that's a space for me. If the light 322 00:19:40,777 --> 00:19:43,057 Speaker 1: goes out on you, that means it's shining brighter on me. 323 00:19:43,497 --> 00:19:47,057 Speaker 1: And that's just not what I faced. You know, Tisha 324 00:19:47,257 --> 00:19:51,457 Speaker 1: Campbell to Sheina Arnold, they have always pulled my coattails, 325 00:19:51,537 --> 00:19:55,337 Speaker 1: always put me on game. Regina King been day one, 326 00:19:55,417 --> 00:19:59,257 Speaker 1: og never been interested in watching me fail. But that's 327 00:19:59,297 --> 00:20:01,937 Speaker 1: what that is who my community has been. Oh I 328 00:20:02,017 --> 00:20:13,817 Speaker 1: love that. It's time for everyone's favorite segment, rapid Fire. 329 00:20:14,977 --> 00:20:18,097 Speaker 1: So rapid Fire is we just say the first thing 330 00:20:18,097 --> 00:20:20,217 Speaker 1: that comes to your mind. You should say it. Okay, 331 00:20:21,017 --> 00:20:24,097 Speaker 1: So the first one is a favorite children's book you'd 332 00:20:24,097 --> 00:20:29,337 Speaker 1: like to read with COFFEA Shady Baby of course, natural 333 00:20:29,497 --> 00:20:34,617 Speaker 1: um pilates or yoga pilates, Maya Moore or Cannie Parker. 334 00:20:35,377 --> 00:20:38,217 Speaker 1: Come on, I mean that's I gotta go with Cannas. 335 00:20:38,257 --> 00:20:41,737 Speaker 1: That's my girl, do you prefer red or white wine? 336 00:20:41,857 --> 00:20:45,577 Speaker 1: And why I prefer white Shannon Blanc It's my favorite. 337 00:20:45,937 --> 00:20:50,737 Speaker 1: D Wade Sellers has an amazing Shannon Blanc available. It's 338 00:20:50,817 --> 00:20:53,577 Speaker 1: legit actually now available everywhere. But um, yeah, I love 339 00:20:53,777 --> 00:20:57,217 Speaker 1: Shannon Blanc. Is my favorite favorite versus battle so far. 340 00:20:58,777 --> 00:21:01,737 Speaker 1: I'm gonna go with Miss Patty and miss um Miss Gladys. 341 00:21:02,177 --> 00:21:05,737 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that was a good one. Um. Even though 342 00:21:05,777 --> 00:21:07,337 Speaker 1: I felt like it wasn't a bad a battle, I 343 00:21:07,337 --> 00:21:09,137 Speaker 1: just thought they were just like it's a kid. Yeah, 344 00:21:09,177 --> 00:21:13,617 Speaker 1: that was a love supiciite? Okay, So either best friend 345 00:21:14,377 --> 00:21:18,897 Speaker 1: or back to the streets. Oh yeah, my best friend. Yes, 346 00:21:19,497 --> 00:21:22,297 Speaker 1: of course, best friend. And that's our rapid fire. Boom 347 00:21:22,377 --> 00:21:30,857 Speaker 1: boom bah. Thank you, thank you, thank you, And I'm 348 00:21:30,897 --> 00:21:33,457 Speaker 1: glad that they gave me extra time because I could 349 00:21:33,497 --> 00:21:35,537 Speaker 1: literally talk about books all day long and I don't 350 00:21:35,577 --> 00:21:38,897 Speaker 1: get the opportunity to talk about books that often, So 351 00:21:39,257 --> 00:21:41,297 Speaker 1: thank you for allowing me to talk about books and 352 00:21:41,297 --> 00:21:45,617 Speaker 1: writing and reading. Gabriel Union has continued to have strong 353 00:21:45,697 --> 00:21:49,017 Speaker 1: friendships and fostered a community of fans that support her 354 00:21:49,057 --> 00:21:53,457 Speaker 1: whole self. Thinking back on Gabrielle's love of reading growing up, 355 00:21:53,937 --> 00:21:56,537 Speaker 1: I'm happy to see her work join the ranks of 356 00:21:56,577 --> 00:22:01,697 Speaker 1: her heroes, giving that same comfort to her readers. I'm 357 00:22:01,737 --> 00:22:05,057 Speaker 1: hoping that this is only the beginning of more stories 358 00:22:05,097 --> 00:22:10,297 Speaker 1: for Gabrielle to share. After the break, we'll get some 359 00:22:10,337 --> 00:22:14,177 Speaker 1: book recommendations from one of my favorite bookstores in Los Angeles. 360 00:22:28,017 --> 00:22:30,457 Speaker 1: Every few episodes, I'll check in with one of my 361 00:22:30,537 --> 00:22:33,697 Speaker 1: favorite bookstores to see what they're reading and what their 362 00:22:33,737 --> 00:22:37,817 Speaker 1: staff recommendations are. With Gabrielle Union on the West Coast, 363 00:22:37,937 --> 00:22:39,737 Speaker 1: I thought it'd be great for you to hear from 364 00:22:39,777 --> 00:22:45,417 Speaker 1: the LA based shop Reparations Club. My name is Jazzie 365 00:22:45,457 --> 00:22:49,137 Speaker 1: mcgilbert and I'm the founder and owner of Reparations Club 366 00:22:49,337 --> 00:22:52,937 Speaker 1: in Los Angeles. My mom worked a lot. She was 367 00:22:52,977 --> 00:22:55,777 Speaker 1: always at work, and she worked on the Third Street 368 00:22:55,817 --> 00:22:58,937 Speaker 1: promenade in Santa Monica, which had a big Barnes and Noble, 369 00:22:58,977 --> 00:23:01,257 Speaker 1: and so I would go there and while she finished 370 00:23:01,257 --> 00:23:03,217 Speaker 1: the work day after she'd picked me up from school, 371 00:23:03,617 --> 00:23:06,377 Speaker 1: the library bookstores. That's where we hung out. But we 372 00:23:06,617 --> 00:23:09,937 Speaker 1: never talked about opening a bookstore. I don't think I 373 00:23:10,057 --> 00:23:13,337 Speaker 1: had any moles of even business ownership in my life, 374 00:23:13,777 --> 00:23:17,697 Speaker 1: so not something I thought was an option for me. 375 00:23:17,817 --> 00:23:20,457 Speaker 1: In life, but she'd actually didn't know that I was 376 00:23:20,537 --> 00:23:23,977 Speaker 1: doing that or even had that idea at all. Sitting 377 00:23:23,977 --> 00:23:27,057 Speaker 1: on my bed right now is didn't we almost have 378 00:23:27,097 --> 00:23:30,817 Speaker 1: it all? Which I have been devouring. I am a 379 00:23:30,857 --> 00:23:35,257 Speaker 1: Whitney Houston stand and this is a biography written by 380 00:23:35,297 --> 00:23:40,177 Speaker 1: Garrett Kennedy about Whitney Houston's life and legacy. And it's 381 00:23:40,217 --> 00:23:43,097 Speaker 1: also in some ways a memoir of Garret's life too, 382 00:23:43,137 --> 00:23:45,297 Speaker 1: which I think is a really cool way to tell 383 00:23:45,337 --> 00:23:47,777 Speaker 1: that story. But how Whitney has impacted us all and 384 00:23:47,857 --> 00:23:51,537 Speaker 1: so I'm really obsessed with it. Hi, my name is Kayla. 385 00:23:51,657 --> 00:23:54,057 Speaker 1: In a new book i'd like to recommend is Dear 386 00:23:54,137 --> 00:23:57,577 Speaker 1: Sendern by a Quake a Messy because it is, hands down, 387 00:23:57,657 --> 00:24:01,257 Speaker 1: in my opinion, the most captivating and creative approach to 388 00:24:01,337 --> 00:24:06,177 Speaker 1: a memoir. I definitely urge everyone to read this memoir 389 00:24:06,217 --> 00:24:10,457 Speaker 1: if you're anything like me and I guess constantly exploring 390 00:24:10,777 --> 00:24:17,137 Speaker 1: the more heavier, darker narratives. Hi, my name is Temika 391 00:24:17,217 --> 00:24:19,657 Speaker 1: and the book I'd like to recommend is called Wild 392 00:24:19,777 --> 00:24:23,737 Speaker 1: Rain by Beverly Jenkins. It's a historical romance. It's so 393 00:24:23,977 --> 00:24:27,337 Speaker 1: historically accurate and write smack in the middle of it 394 00:24:27,377 --> 00:24:30,937 Speaker 1: is a beautiful love story and I am obsessed. So 395 00:24:31,577 --> 00:24:34,657 Speaker 1: she's a master. You heard it here first. Listen to 396 00:24:34,777 --> 00:24:39,417 Speaker 1: more of these conversations now on our bookmark series exclusively 397 00:24:39,497 --> 00:24:47,577 Speaker 1: on Pushkin Plus. We can all learn something from Gabrielle's journey. 398 00:24:47,697 --> 00:24:51,137 Speaker 1: I mean, Gabrielle Union moves through the world with such honesty. 399 00:24:51,537 --> 00:24:55,137 Speaker 1: She encourages her readers to take risks, make mistakes, and 400 00:24:55,297 --> 00:24:59,537 Speaker 1: most importantly, support each other. Be sure to get a 401 00:24:59,537 --> 00:25:02,497 Speaker 1: copy of You Got Anything Stronger if you haven't yet. 402 00:25:04,377 --> 00:25:07,457 Speaker 1: In the next episode, I'll be speaking with Brooklyn based 403 00:25:07,497 --> 00:25:22,977 Speaker 1: author and culture critic Zeeba Play Well Read. Black Girl 404 00:25:23,137 --> 00:25:26,737 Speaker 1: is a production of Pushkin Industries. It is written and 405 00:25:26,777 --> 00:25:31,137 Speaker 1: hosted by me Glory Dam and produced by Cher Vincent 406 00:25:31,257 --> 00:25:36,417 Speaker 1: and Brittany Brown. Our associate editor is Keishall Williams. Our 407 00:25:36,457 --> 00:25:41,297 Speaker 1: engineer is Amanda ka Wang, and our showrunner is Sasha Matthias. 408 00:25:41,817 --> 00:25:46,137 Speaker 1: Our executive producers are Miya Loebell and Leet Hall Molad. 409 00:25:46,777 --> 00:25:51,617 Speaker 1: At Pushkin thanks to Heather Fane, Carly Migliori, Jason Gambrel, 410 00:25:52,137 --> 00:25:58,897 Speaker 1: Julia Barton, Jen Goerra, John Schnars, and Jacob Wiseberg. You 411 00:25:58,937 --> 00:26:01,577 Speaker 1: can find me on Twitter and Instagram at Well read 412 00:26:01,617 --> 00:26:04,537 Speaker 1: black Girl. You can find pushkin and all social media 413 00:26:04,577 --> 00:26:07,657 Speaker 1: platforms at pushkin Pods, and you can sign up for 414 00:26:07,697 --> 00:26:11,617 Speaker 1: our newsletter at pushkin dot Fm. If you love this 415 00:26:11,657 --> 00:26:16,137 Speaker 1: show and others from Pushkin industry, consider subscribing to Pushkin Plus. 416 00:26:16,617 --> 00:26:20,377 Speaker 1: Pushkin Plus is a podcast subscription that offers bonus content 417 00:26:20,457 --> 00:26:24,537 Speaker 1: and uninterrupted listening for four ninety nine a month. Look 418 00:26:24,537 --> 00:26:28,297 Speaker 1: for Pushkin Plus on Apple podcast subscriptions, and if you're 419 00:26:28,297 --> 00:26:31,537 Speaker 1: already a subscriber, make sure to check out my exclusive 420 00:26:31,617 --> 00:26:36,177 Speaker 1: Bookmark series on Pushkin Plus. Starting on February eighteenth. You'll 421 00:26:36,217 --> 00:26:40,417 Speaker 1: hear extended interviews with book club members, bookstore owners, and more. 422 00:26:41,297 --> 00:26:43,217 Speaker 1: And do you get to hear What's on my mind, 423 00:26:43,497 --> 00:26:46,777 Speaker 1: What's on my radar, and of course what's on my 424 00:26:46,897 --> 00:26:51,457 Speaker 1: reading list? Each week. To find more Pushkin podcasts, listen 425 00:26:51,537 --> 00:26:56,137 Speaker 1: on iHeartRadio, app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you like to listen.