1 00:00:03,440 --> 00:00:07,200 Speaker 1: One of my favorite stories is a single parent raising 2 00:00:07,520 --> 00:00:08,880 Speaker 1: his two kids, got. 3 00:00:08,720 --> 00:00:09,399 Speaker 2: In some trouble. 4 00:00:09,480 --> 00:00:13,760 Speaker 1: They're homeless, looking for housing. I'm trying to not get emotional. 5 00:00:13,840 --> 00:00:15,360 Speaker 1: That's why I'm looking away right now. 6 00:00:15,440 --> 00:00:16,520 Speaker 2: Look at people. I started crying. 7 00:00:16,640 --> 00:00:18,840 Speaker 1: I'm a crier. So I'm trying to tell because I 8 00:00:18,840 --> 00:00:22,720 Speaker 1: get the emotion. See this person who's trying to change 9 00:00:22,720 --> 00:00:26,159 Speaker 1: his life. I mean, he wanted to change. He's like, 10 00:00:26,239 --> 00:00:29,639 Speaker 1: I'm through with drugs. I'm sick of him. For him 11 00:00:29,720 --> 00:00:33,840 Speaker 1: to I feel like a tears coming. I just. 12 00:00:35,280 --> 00:00:36,800 Speaker 2: I see his face. 13 00:00:38,800 --> 00:00:44,479 Speaker 1: But to give him keys and that was that was 14 00:00:45,640 --> 00:00:48,199 Speaker 1: that was a great, great great And so he's a 15 00:00:48,280 --> 00:00:53,920 Speaker 1: single father, get fighting drugs, gone through transitions, homeless, to 16 00:00:53,920 --> 00:00:57,200 Speaker 1: give him a key to a three bedroom one bad. 17 00:00:57,400 --> 00:00:58,920 Speaker 1: Do you think we eventually on that home? 18 00:00:59,080 --> 00:01:02,000 Speaker 2: Yes? Ah, yeah, that's the beauty. I got pictures. I 19 00:01:02,040 --> 00:01:07,640 Speaker 2: show it to you. He will in that house one day. 20 00:01:08,680 --> 00:01:11,520 Speaker 3: Welcome to an army of normal folks. I'm Bill Courtney. 21 00:01:11,920 --> 00:01:14,480 Speaker 3: I'm a normal guy. I'm a husband, I'm a father, 22 00:01:14,680 --> 00:01:18,080 Speaker 3: I'm an entrepreneur, and I'm a football coach in inner 23 00:01:18,160 --> 00:01:22,000 Speaker 3: city Memphis. And that last part, somehow it led to 24 00:01:22,040 --> 00:01:23,840 Speaker 3: an oscar for the film. 25 00:01:23,600 --> 00:01:26,800 Speaker 2: About one of my teams. That movie is called Undefeated. 26 00:01:27,840 --> 00:01:31,160 Speaker 3: Guys, I believe our country's problems will never be solved 27 00:01:31,680 --> 00:01:34,520 Speaker 3: by a bunch of fancy people in nice suits using 28 00:01:34,600 --> 00:01:37,720 Speaker 3: big words that nobody ever uses on CNN and Fox, 29 00:01:37,760 --> 00:01:42,360 Speaker 3: but rather by an army of normal folks. That's us, 30 00:01:42,720 --> 00:01:44,880 Speaker 3: just you and me deciding, Hey, you know what, maybe 31 00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:49,400 Speaker 3: I can help. That's what Reverend Kevis Harding, the voice 32 00:01:49,400 --> 00:01:52,200 Speaker 3: you just heard, has done. Kevis grew up in one 33 00:01:52,240 --> 00:01:56,760 Speaker 3: of Wichita's most challenging neighborhoods, played college football in Texas, 34 00:01:57,240 --> 00:02:00,960 Speaker 3: and could have more easily pursued the American dream somewhere else, 35 00:02:01,280 --> 00:02:06,080 Speaker 3: but instead Kevis came home. He served that same neighborhood 36 00:02:06,120 --> 00:02:10,320 Speaker 3: as a police officer, then as a pastor there, and 37 00:02:10,480 --> 00:02:14,000 Speaker 3: even has gotten a double life as a real estate developer. 38 00:02:14,800 --> 00:02:18,960 Speaker 3: Or maybe it's really all the same calling bringing hope 39 00:02:19,000 --> 00:02:23,560 Speaker 3: to its residents with the Bible and affordable housing. And 40 00:02:23,639 --> 00:02:26,200 Speaker 3: by the end of the year, this reverend will have 41 00:02:26,560 --> 00:02:30,919 Speaker 3: fifty affordable homes that they work to help folks own 42 00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:34,799 Speaker 3: and flourish right there in their neighborhood. If you've ever 43 00:02:34,880 --> 00:02:37,840 Speaker 3: wondered what it looks like to stop talking about change 44 00:02:37,880 --> 00:02:41,520 Speaker 3: and actually build it brick by brick, block by block. 45 00:02:42,120 --> 00:02:44,400 Speaker 3: I cannot wait for you to meet Kevis right after 46 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:57,000 Speaker 3: these brief messages from our general sponsors. 47 00:03:04,560 --> 00:03:09,160 Speaker 2: Reverend Heavis Harding, how are you? You know, well, happy 48 00:03:09,200 --> 00:03:09,440 Speaker 2: to be. 49 00:03:09,400 --> 00:03:14,320 Speaker 3: Here, Welcome to Memphis fluid this morning. Huh yes, everybody Keavis? 50 00:03:15,160 --> 00:03:18,280 Speaker 3: I think is it Kevis or doctor Harding or pastor Arding? 51 00:03:18,680 --> 00:03:18,920 Speaker 1: Well? 52 00:03:19,080 --> 00:03:20,720 Speaker 2: How am I to address you, sir? 53 00:03:20,919 --> 00:03:23,120 Speaker 1: Well, you get address me as Kevist, but I say 54 00:03:23,160 --> 00:03:26,360 Speaker 1: my professional name is Reverend doctor Kevis Jay Harding. 55 00:03:26,480 --> 00:03:27,359 Speaker 2: Got it. 56 00:03:27,120 --> 00:03:29,200 Speaker 1: But like you said, I knew I was in trouble, 57 00:03:29,240 --> 00:03:32,200 Speaker 1: like when you bill really money. It's really a French 58 00:03:32,280 --> 00:03:35,400 Speaker 1: name is Kvas, which is a Kavas is a h 59 00:03:35,600 --> 00:03:38,800 Speaker 1: I love the name. Uh Cavas is in French, is 60 00:03:38,840 --> 00:03:42,720 Speaker 1: in the French Alps. It's a place of protection. Really, 61 00:03:42,760 --> 00:03:45,000 Speaker 1: so they would say get into Kavas if an avalanche 62 00:03:45,080 --> 00:03:47,840 Speaker 1: or something came. Ah, you got it. But then we 63 00:03:47,840 --> 00:03:49,720 Speaker 1: take that same name bringing to America. You know, we 64 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:52,200 Speaker 1: call it the same place, but we call it the Crevis, 65 00:03:52,800 --> 00:03:54,040 Speaker 1: which is a crack of the rock. 66 00:03:54,320 --> 00:03:58,200 Speaker 2: I got it. So you're a safe safe yeah, got it? 67 00:03:58,360 --> 00:04:02,800 Speaker 3: So so everybody the doctor Reverend Kevis Harding, who we're 68 00:04:02,840 --> 00:04:05,640 Speaker 3: going to call Kevis from this point to Fine. It's 69 00:04:05,640 --> 00:04:09,000 Speaker 3: the pastor and executive director is a pastor. He's the 70 00:04:09,040 --> 00:04:15,240 Speaker 3: executive director of the Hope Community Development Corporation in Witchdal, Kansas. 71 00:04:15,440 --> 00:04:17,440 Speaker 3: Was kind of enough to fly into Memphis this morning 72 00:04:17,480 --> 00:04:23,080 Speaker 3: to join us and tell story. Had a fascinating trip 73 00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:25,960 Speaker 3: you've had. We had a guest. 74 00:04:26,480 --> 00:04:27,240 Speaker 2: I don't know what. 75 00:04:28,279 --> 00:04:30,440 Speaker 3: One of the funniest guys I've ever met in my life, 76 00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:32,479 Speaker 3: a guy named Bob Muzakowski. 77 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:34,120 Speaker 2: Is that Am I pronouncing that right? Yeah? 78 00:04:34,160 --> 00:04:38,560 Speaker 1: It's a Muzakhowski or a butcher myself, just h But anyway, 79 00:04:38,600 --> 00:04:44,240 Speaker 1: he's a Chicago guy, okay, and he has really invested 80 00:04:44,480 --> 00:04:47,679 Speaker 1: in the inner city of Chicago, I think the West Side. 81 00:04:47,800 --> 00:04:49,919 Speaker 1: And he's this like. 82 00:04:51,440 --> 00:04:57,359 Speaker 3: Old school Irish Chicago and gruff guy that played football 83 00:04:57,440 --> 00:04:59,960 Speaker 3: and got into bar fights and had a drinking problem 84 00:05:00,080 --> 00:05:03,480 Speaker 3: one time his life. It has this massive heart and 85 00:05:03,520 --> 00:05:07,280 Speaker 3: he is as plain spoken as it comes. And if anybody 86 00:05:07,320 --> 00:05:09,400 Speaker 3: hadn't listened to his episode, you have to look it up. 87 00:05:09,600 --> 00:05:13,320 Speaker 3: But the reason I'm talking about Bob and you're Wichitaw 88 00:05:13,400 --> 00:05:20,200 Speaker 3: in Chicago is he said something that's really interesting. And 89 00:05:20,240 --> 00:05:24,080 Speaker 3: he said, we always tell folks to do better and 90 00:05:24,200 --> 00:05:27,560 Speaker 3: get out of the hood, and he said the problem 91 00:05:27,720 --> 00:05:31,000 Speaker 3: is when people get successful and they get out of 92 00:05:31,000 --> 00:05:33,880 Speaker 3: the hood, that it only gets worse because all of 93 00:05:33,920 --> 00:05:36,760 Speaker 3: the people who have success that leave the hood continued 94 00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:39,359 Speaker 3: to make it a talent desert. 95 00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:43,480 Speaker 2: Yes, I agree with that. Well, you haven't done that. 96 00:05:43,839 --> 00:05:49,560 Speaker 3: You're you're the antithesis of what Bob calls out and everybody. 97 00:05:50,040 --> 00:05:53,920 Speaker 3: Kevis grew up in Wichitaal's North Side, which is now 98 00:05:53,960 --> 00:05:55,080 Speaker 3: called the near north Side. 99 00:05:55,120 --> 00:06:00,279 Speaker 2: I think as it's grown in northeast, northeast what I 100 00:06:00,279 --> 00:06:02,240 Speaker 2: say north side. Yeah, there was. 101 00:06:02,240 --> 00:06:04,280 Speaker 1: A north side that we called the north End though, 102 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:08,200 Speaker 1: or I now say, particularly where my brown, brown brothers 103 00:06:08,240 --> 00:06:08,880 Speaker 1: and sisters live. 104 00:06:08,960 --> 00:06:11,159 Speaker 2: We got to black and brown, I got it. 105 00:06:11,160 --> 00:06:15,800 Speaker 1: And uh, but same zip code six, four, six, seven, eight, 106 00:06:15,839 --> 00:06:16,719 Speaker 1: all those zip codes. 107 00:06:16,760 --> 00:06:17,960 Speaker 2: Yes, so you grew up there. 108 00:06:18,640 --> 00:06:21,039 Speaker 3: You played college football out of state, which we're going 109 00:06:21,120 --> 00:06:23,200 Speaker 3: to explore a little bit just because that sounds fun. 110 00:06:23,240 --> 00:06:28,839 Speaker 3: You became a police officer, and then yeah, the same neighborhood. 111 00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:30,120 Speaker 2: Everything is in the same neighborhood. 112 00:06:30,160 --> 00:06:34,960 Speaker 3: And he became a pastor, and now you're a community activist, 113 00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:38,640 Speaker 3: all in the same neighborhood, which is I think phenomenal. 114 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:44,800 Speaker 3: So tell us about just a little bit about how 115 00:06:44,839 --> 00:06:50,279 Speaker 3: you're raised in wich Dall's North Side and you know 116 00:06:50,360 --> 00:06:53,000 Speaker 3: what that neighborhood looks like, because I think that gives 117 00:06:53,080 --> 00:06:56,800 Speaker 3: us perspective. And then the football thing and the journey 118 00:06:56,800 --> 00:06:58,720 Speaker 3: to being a copy well. 119 00:06:58,680 --> 00:07:01,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, like you said, morning raised in which you too, 120 00:07:02,640 --> 00:07:05,960 Speaker 1: I still know my address. Now the home's been sold, 121 00:07:06,040 --> 00:07:07,960 Speaker 1: but I wish I could have balled it, but it's 122 00:07:08,360 --> 00:07:10,200 Speaker 1: I grew I grew up at fifteen thirty. Well, I 123 00:07:10,240 --> 00:07:14,360 Speaker 1: grew up with a single parent mom, where we moved 124 00:07:14,400 --> 00:07:18,000 Speaker 1: a lot in that neighborhood. But my base was my 125 00:07:18,160 --> 00:07:23,320 Speaker 1: mom's parents, which were my grandparents. And my grandfather really 126 00:07:23,360 --> 00:07:27,480 Speaker 1: been the role model in my life, and so I 127 00:07:27,520 --> 00:07:30,720 Speaker 1: grew up with him. He's you know, in construction, so 128 00:07:30,800 --> 00:07:33,000 Speaker 1: I lived with him in summertimes. I even lived with 129 00:07:33,080 --> 00:07:35,440 Speaker 1: him for a middle part of my middle school years. 130 00:07:36,080 --> 00:07:39,840 Speaker 1: And that was home to me because it was what 131 00:07:39,880 --> 00:07:44,000 Speaker 1: we called base. It was like fifteen thirty three North 132 00:07:44,040 --> 00:07:46,440 Speaker 1: piet which you tell Kansas six seven two one four 133 00:07:46,520 --> 00:07:47,720 Speaker 1: two six three two four. 134 00:07:47,680 --> 00:07:50,360 Speaker 2: Nine to two. I still know all of that. Ever 135 00:07:50,440 --> 00:07:51,040 Speaker 2: got lost. 136 00:07:51,080 --> 00:07:53,000 Speaker 1: I knew I could say I live in fifteen thirty 137 00:07:53,000 --> 00:07:56,520 Speaker 1: three North piet which you tell Kansas, the phone everything. 138 00:07:56,720 --> 00:08:00,600 Speaker 1: My my grandparents are Curtis and Shaquita Wilson, those but 139 00:08:00,720 --> 00:08:03,840 Speaker 1: so I grew up there, went to school the local 140 00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:07,680 Speaker 1: schools there from from elementary to high school. But I 141 00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:10,720 Speaker 1: went to a lot of different middle schools and high 142 00:08:10,800 --> 00:08:14,960 Speaker 1: school just because my mother had me when she was eighteen, 143 00:08:15,040 --> 00:08:18,080 Speaker 1: well turning nineteen, and then she I had a brother 144 00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:18,559 Speaker 1: and sister. 145 00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:21,360 Speaker 2: After that my sister and then my brother. My brother's 146 00:08:21,440 --> 00:08:22,160 Speaker 2: deceased now. 147 00:08:23,000 --> 00:08:28,800 Speaker 1: But as a hard working woman at eighteen with no degree, 148 00:08:29,360 --> 00:08:32,360 Speaker 1: always worked took care of us. I'm you know, people 149 00:08:32,360 --> 00:08:35,080 Speaker 1: say you're poor like p O R Like we were 150 00:08:35,160 --> 00:08:39,920 Speaker 1: p O No, I mean cause we were. I mean 151 00:08:40,400 --> 00:08:42,959 Speaker 1: for me, we always had something to eat. We was 152 00:08:43,040 --> 00:08:46,240 Speaker 1: always clothed. But the older you get, you look back 153 00:08:46,280 --> 00:08:48,560 Speaker 1: and go, man, how my mom did that. But she 154 00:08:48,600 --> 00:08:51,040 Speaker 1: did it all through her twenties. But we always had 155 00:08:51,080 --> 00:08:55,559 Speaker 1: to move because of this affordability of homeownership. She never 156 00:08:55,679 --> 00:08:59,959 Speaker 1: was a homeowner. She became a homeowner late in life 157 00:09:00,280 --> 00:09:02,440 Speaker 1: through marriage with her husband, who has a home. She 158 00:09:02,520 --> 00:09:08,079 Speaker 1: now lives in Winston Salem, North Carolina. But but growing 159 00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:08,960 Speaker 1: up and went it's tall. 160 00:09:10,800 --> 00:09:12,880 Speaker 2: That was that was a that was home. 161 00:09:14,000 --> 00:09:16,160 Speaker 1: I could I remember, you know, you know this bigion. 162 00:09:16,679 --> 00:09:20,280 Speaker 1: I could get on my bicycle and ride north and 163 00:09:20,360 --> 00:09:23,800 Speaker 1: south and that whole neighborhood of that two zip codes 164 00:09:23,840 --> 00:09:26,160 Speaker 1: six seven two eight and six seven two and four 165 00:09:26,320 --> 00:09:31,000 Speaker 1: and you knew. I mean back in those days, the seventies, 166 00:09:31,480 --> 00:09:33,600 Speaker 1: if I got in trouble down the street, it got 167 00:09:33,640 --> 00:09:36,360 Speaker 1: home before I did, right, Those are you know, those 168 00:09:36,480 --> 00:09:39,719 Speaker 1: kind of challenges, And I call them challenges because you 169 00:09:39,720 --> 00:09:42,439 Speaker 1: didn't want to get in trouble. But that's that was 170 00:09:42,480 --> 00:09:46,760 Speaker 1: that kind of feel, and that was my childhood growing 171 00:09:46,840 --> 00:09:51,720 Speaker 1: up in that neighborhood. Friends in that neighborhood play sports. 172 00:09:52,040 --> 00:09:56,120 Speaker 1: That was my outlet. Uh in all kids dreams back 173 00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:58,040 Speaker 1: then was I'm going to go to the NFL. That 174 00:09:58,440 --> 00:10:01,360 Speaker 1: that didn't happen. But you did play college ball, Yeah, 175 00:10:01,400 --> 00:10:06,199 Speaker 1: play college ball, and I had a tempt college should 176 00:10:06,320 --> 00:10:07,640 Speaker 1: well free agent. 177 00:10:09,120 --> 00:10:10,559 Speaker 2: I can't walk on for the NFL. 178 00:10:10,600 --> 00:10:12,880 Speaker 1: I went to the Chiefs and basically got cut, you know, 179 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:14,160 Speaker 1: things for coming up. 180 00:10:14,640 --> 00:10:18,200 Speaker 2: So you went to Hutchison Community. I went to Hutchison Community. 181 00:10:18,360 --> 00:10:21,520 Speaker 1: Well out of high school, went to Hutchison Community College, 182 00:10:21,559 --> 00:10:23,760 Speaker 1: which is forty five minutes outside. Would you tell the 183 00:10:24,320 --> 00:10:28,200 Speaker 1: great school got my degree in criminal justice? 184 00:10:29,040 --> 00:10:29,240 Speaker 2: Uh? 185 00:10:29,280 --> 00:10:33,640 Speaker 1: And then UTEP came and recruited me in Texas, Texall yeah, 186 00:10:33,679 --> 00:10:41,720 Speaker 1: I said, University University of Texas ut EPTA in my 187 00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:47,240 Speaker 1: back in my wagering days, they were always good enough 188 00:10:47,280 --> 00:10:51,680 Speaker 1: to cover and they always played teams that were UTUB 189 00:10:52,160 --> 00:10:54,760 Speaker 1: back in the day. Would always they'd take on Texas. 190 00:10:54,800 --> 00:10:56,280 Speaker 1: They'd play anybody we played. 191 00:10:56,800 --> 00:11:00,560 Speaker 3: I played Texas, I played not Surprising, not Surprise, and 192 00:11:00,920 --> 00:11:06,920 Speaker 3: UTAP ut e P we would. We had a fun 193 00:11:06,960 --> 00:11:10,120 Speaker 3: acronym for them, which was because they were always competitive 194 00:11:10,120 --> 00:11:12,640 Speaker 3: with the bigger teams, was you take them points? 195 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:15,199 Speaker 2: Okay I didn't know that. Yeah. 196 00:11:15,240 --> 00:11:17,959 Speaker 1: So if like UTEP was a twenty point underdog that 197 00:11:18,080 --> 00:11:21,240 Speaker 1: Texas bet on UTUP because they may not win, but 198 00:11:21,280 --> 00:11:24,240 Speaker 1: they were going to cover, that's you. You take them points, 199 00:11:24,320 --> 00:11:28,240 Speaker 1: U tap and uh. Eighty eight we we you're gonna 200 00:11:28,240 --> 00:11:31,040 Speaker 1: love this on ad. You like this cause it's close, 201 00:11:31,120 --> 00:11:33,600 Speaker 1: it's in Mississippi. But eighty eight we went to end 202 00:11:33,640 --> 00:11:37,960 Speaker 1: Up Business Bowl in Shreetport, and which I apply. We're 203 00:11:38,640 --> 00:11:41,560 Speaker 1: we're praying for preparing for the game and I'm dB, 204 00:11:41,920 --> 00:11:44,160 Speaker 1: and our coach kept say, hey, guys, we gotta really 205 00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:46,600 Speaker 1: watch this guy from something miss. His name is Favor, 206 00:11:46,800 --> 00:11:50,760 Speaker 1: no Favor, We call him Favor. So the whole time 207 00:11:50,800 --> 00:11:52,640 Speaker 1: we're like, man, we gotta watch this Favor. And then 208 00:11:52,640 --> 00:11:54,559 Speaker 1: when you get out to the game, we're in drills 209 00:11:54,600 --> 00:11:57,960 Speaker 1: and a couple of completions, as Brent farr I said, 210 00:11:57,960 --> 00:12:04,080 Speaker 1: his name's not Favorite, and that's you got. And he 211 00:12:04,200 --> 00:12:06,800 Speaker 1: was a fun guy. We because you know bowl games, 212 00:12:06,840 --> 00:12:11,040 Speaker 1: you actually you hit the out, you eat together, you 213 00:12:11,080 --> 00:12:15,319 Speaker 1: do stuff together, and so with like and uh, looking back, 214 00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:17,360 Speaker 1: you're going, man, and did not know I was hanging 215 00:12:17,360 --> 00:12:21,840 Speaker 1: out with a future Hall of Famer. Yes, and they 216 00:12:21,920 --> 00:12:25,080 Speaker 1: beat us too though. So you get your degree in 217 00:12:25,160 --> 00:12:27,599 Speaker 1: criminal justice. You played football, You wanted to be in 218 00:12:27,640 --> 00:12:29,680 Speaker 1: the NFL. You tried to walk on, I think to 219 00:12:29,760 --> 00:12:32,160 Speaker 1: the Cowboys and the Chiefs, the Cheeves, not that you 220 00:12:32,240 --> 00:12:34,679 Speaker 1: know what. The Cowboys gave me a letter, but the Raiders, 221 00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:37,520 Speaker 1: cow you know all the let me tell you something stuff. 222 00:12:37,559 --> 00:12:40,719 Speaker 3: You play four years of college football and you make 223 00:12:40,760 --> 00:12:44,440 Speaker 3: it the bowl games and you even get trying to 224 00:12:44,480 --> 00:12:45,360 Speaker 3: be a free agent. 225 00:12:45,840 --> 00:12:46,760 Speaker 2: You play little. 226 00:12:46,559 --> 00:12:51,440 Speaker 1: Ball if you were bad, Oh no, yeah, but just 227 00:12:51,760 --> 00:12:55,800 Speaker 1: well what I discovered, and that's my tell kids say, no, 228 00:12:55,920 --> 00:12:58,240 Speaker 1: are you gonna make You're not every you know that 229 00:12:58,360 --> 00:13:00,480 Speaker 1: you're not going to get there. But when you get 230 00:13:00,520 --> 00:13:02,079 Speaker 1: to that level what I call a cream and the 231 00:13:02,160 --> 00:13:04,520 Speaker 1: cream and when you know the coaches up in that 232 00:13:04,600 --> 00:13:06,600 Speaker 1: are Thigga says, oh, hey, you're great, but we just 233 00:13:06,640 --> 00:13:08,520 Speaker 1: want this. Butch say, you'd like to fall the kind 234 00:13:08,520 --> 00:13:11,480 Speaker 1: of screen. Oh I know, and it's time. 235 00:13:11,520 --> 00:13:14,320 Speaker 3: I mean, I have a friend that that has a 236 00:13:14,760 --> 00:13:18,800 Speaker 3: super Bowl ring, got a really good player and his 237 00:13:19,120 --> 00:13:21,320 Speaker 3: old school coach she used to say, more people making 238 00:13:21,440 --> 00:13:22,920 Speaker 3: to heaven than making the NFL. 239 00:13:23,760 --> 00:13:25,160 Speaker 2: You better protect this spot. 240 00:13:25,360 --> 00:13:32,040 Speaker 3: Yes, and now a few messages from our general sponsors. 241 00:13:32,080 --> 00:13:35,800 Speaker 3: But first, if you live in the Atlanta or Ozaki 242 00:13:35,920 --> 00:13:39,760 Speaker 3: county areas, we've still got the launch meetings for your 243 00:13:39,800 --> 00:13:43,719 Speaker 3: local service clubs coming up Sunday, March eighth. Check them 244 00:13:43,760 --> 00:13:49,120 Speaker 3: out in rs VP at a n F Atlanta dot 245 00:13:49,200 --> 00:13:54,480 Speaker 3: org and a n F Ozaki dot org. 246 00:13:54,640 --> 00:13:59,680 Speaker 2: That's o z a u k Ee dot org. We'll 247 00:13:59,679 --> 00:14:12,199 Speaker 2: be right back, all. 248 00:14:12,200 --> 00:14:14,640 Speaker 3: Right, So the NFL is off the table for you 249 00:14:15,679 --> 00:14:18,079 Speaker 3: got my degree, Dome, but you got your degree in 250 00:14:18,080 --> 00:14:23,400 Speaker 3: criminal justice and and even though you're at you taking points. Also, 251 00:14:24,720 --> 00:14:29,080 Speaker 3: this witch tall thing is is home and I read 252 00:14:29,120 --> 00:14:32,000 Speaker 3: I think you wanted to be an FBI that didn't 253 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:34,360 Speaker 3: work out because you didn't speak another language or something, 254 00:14:34,560 --> 00:14:36,520 Speaker 3: and you said, you know what, I'm going back home 255 00:14:36,560 --> 00:14:37,400 Speaker 3: and I'm going to be a cop. 256 00:14:37,600 --> 00:14:37,800 Speaker 2: Yep. 257 00:14:38,320 --> 00:14:41,920 Speaker 1: Well, well, actually the FBI when I cause I actually applied, 258 00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:44,280 Speaker 1: I was ready to go to Qualito, and they said, well, 259 00:14:44,320 --> 00:14:45,560 Speaker 1: do you speak Another. 260 00:14:45,440 --> 00:14:47,640 Speaker 2: Reason why they were they were recruiting in l Passa. 261 00:14:47,720 --> 00:14:49,560 Speaker 1: They thought most of the students who were in the 262 00:14:49,720 --> 00:14:54,040 Speaker 1: pastor spoke sp Hispanics. Yeah, and I'm always taken as 263 00:14:54,080 --> 00:14:56,960 Speaker 1: a Dominican Republican or you know. 264 00:14:57,000 --> 00:14:59,320 Speaker 2: People say like, so you got to speak Spanish. I'm like, no, 265 00:14:59,400 --> 00:15:00,000 Speaker 2: I don't speak. 266 00:15:00,560 --> 00:15:03,200 Speaker 1: And I can kick myself because I was immersed in 267 00:15:03,320 --> 00:15:04,800 Speaker 1: El Paso, Texas. 268 00:15:05,240 --> 00:15:09,640 Speaker 2: How I learned was the cuss words cut you out 269 00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:13,640 Speaker 2: pretty good in Spanish. No reference, let's let's let's be 270 00:15:13,760 --> 00:15:14,440 Speaker 2: careful here. 271 00:15:15,440 --> 00:15:19,240 Speaker 1: I never knew God that I knew I had a 272 00:15:19,280 --> 00:15:22,520 Speaker 1: heart for service, but I never knew it was the 273 00:15:22,600 --> 00:15:27,960 Speaker 1: ministry to being a pastor. It was like youth involvement, 274 00:15:28,480 --> 00:15:34,040 Speaker 1: helping kids off the streets, erasing teardrop gain signs. That 275 00:15:34,200 --> 00:15:38,240 Speaker 1: was my I was street ministry and so when they 276 00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:40,920 Speaker 1: said the FBI said, hey, we want you, but can 277 00:15:41,000 --> 00:15:43,320 Speaker 1: you go back. Either stay in l pass so and 278 00:15:43,360 --> 00:15:46,360 Speaker 1: do three years as a police officer, or come back home. 279 00:15:46,360 --> 00:15:49,320 Speaker 2: I'm going back home. I know the streets. I know that, 280 00:15:49,720 --> 00:15:49,960 Speaker 2: I know. 281 00:15:50,440 --> 00:15:52,720 Speaker 3: So the FAI said, if you'll go get some practical 282 00:15:52,760 --> 00:15:54,760 Speaker 3: experiences of college. Also you don't have the language, you 283 00:15:55,040 --> 00:15:58,440 Speaker 3: can come back and maybe we can apply. You got 284 00:15:58,560 --> 00:16:00,200 Speaker 3: to make pass all the time. So you go home 285 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:02,480 Speaker 3: and your cop. And I loved it. 286 00:16:02,680 --> 00:16:04,880 Speaker 1: I was a you know, I was the first community 287 00:16:04,880 --> 00:16:07,320 Speaker 1: police officer when it was when it was a big 288 00:16:07,320 --> 00:16:10,920 Speaker 1: thing in the nineties. You know, you got the because 289 00:16:10,920 --> 00:16:14,360 Speaker 1: it was more proactive. It was it was not reacting policing. 290 00:16:14,440 --> 00:16:17,880 Speaker 1: For those on notes, the police work is very reactive. 291 00:16:17,960 --> 00:16:18,960 Speaker 2: You drive around your. 292 00:16:18,840 --> 00:16:21,320 Speaker 1: Car and you wait for him to call you two 293 00:16:21,360 --> 00:16:24,800 Speaker 1: forty two, we have so and so at so and 294 00:16:24,840 --> 00:16:27,840 Speaker 1: so place in ten four and you go and you're 295 00:16:28,880 --> 00:16:31,320 Speaker 1: But when community policing came, I was like, oh, I 296 00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:35,120 Speaker 1: really love this because they let me go from listening 297 00:16:35,120 --> 00:16:37,760 Speaker 1: to the radio and being reactive, but I can go 298 00:16:37,920 --> 00:16:42,720 Speaker 1: and create, like taking a street called ghetto and any 299 00:16:42,880 --> 00:16:44,800 Speaker 1: radicated and I said, why are you putting a street 300 00:16:44,840 --> 00:16:46,840 Speaker 1: called ghetto in the ghetto, which I didn't call it 301 00:16:46,880 --> 00:16:49,280 Speaker 1: a ghetto, I called it the hood because I was 302 00:16:49,320 --> 00:16:51,720 Speaker 1: trying to explain what youita. There is really no ghetto. 303 00:16:51,720 --> 00:16:54,400 Speaker 1: It's a black neighborhood. But let me go show you 304 00:16:54,400 --> 00:16:57,840 Speaker 1: what the ghetto is. And from what I've seen in 305 00:16:57,880 --> 00:17:01,960 Speaker 1: the seventies back east, like this is just a poor 306 00:17:01,960 --> 00:17:05,399 Speaker 1: black neighborhood. So as a community police officer, I was 307 00:17:05,400 --> 00:17:09,439 Speaker 1: able to bring the city manager out and remove this 308 00:17:09,720 --> 00:17:12,280 Speaker 1: true street name called ghetto. Now is a walkway with 309 00:17:12,359 --> 00:17:17,159 Speaker 1: binges from a church into the neighborhood. So that was 310 00:17:17,200 --> 00:17:21,280 Speaker 1: my our neighborhood cleanups going in communities or this is 311 00:17:21,320 --> 00:17:24,000 Speaker 1: where the housing park came in. It's working with seniors 312 00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:26,719 Speaker 1: and finding out they live in their house but they 313 00:17:26,760 --> 00:17:29,440 Speaker 1: can't fix it, the roofs leaking, don't have the money 314 00:17:29,440 --> 00:17:29,959 Speaker 1: to fix it. 315 00:17:30,040 --> 00:17:32,159 Speaker 2: And you saw this as a police officer. As a 316 00:17:32,160 --> 00:17:33,919 Speaker 2: police officer, there's a. 317 00:17:33,920 --> 00:17:37,840 Speaker 3: Police officer that we're aware of and he's speaking the 318 00:17:37,880 --> 00:17:41,440 Speaker 3: community policing. But this is what his goal was, right, 319 00:17:41,720 --> 00:17:46,480 Speaker 3: His goal was to get invited into the areas he 320 00:17:46,560 --> 00:17:49,960 Speaker 3: patrolled the neighbors he patrolled. First step was get invited 321 00:17:49,960 --> 00:17:52,640 Speaker 3: in somebody's front yard of a conversation with them. Yeah, 322 00:17:52,920 --> 00:17:55,399 Speaker 3: second step was to get invited on the porch, and 323 00:17:55,440 --> 00:17:57,240 Speaker 3: the third step was to get invited in their home. 324 00:17:57,760 --> 00:18:00,480 Speaker 3: And once you, as a police officer, had an trust 325 00:18:00,480 --> 00:18:02,639 Speaker 3: to the community to get in the front yard, on 326 00:18:02,680 --> 00:18:05,959 Speaker 3: the porch and in the home, that then you were 327 00:18:06,040 --> 00:18:09,040 Speaker 3: truly fighting crime because you were you were hopping it 328 00:18:09,080 --> 00:18:10,520 Speaker 3: from happening in the first place. 329 00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:12,800 Speaker 1: I love Do you tell that officer, I like the 330 00:18:12,840 --> 00:18:16,760 Speaker 1: medium that was me that I mean, I literally and 331 00:18:16,920 --> 00:18:19,119 Speaker 1: well it's not I'll put one more step to that. 332 00:18:19,160 --> 00:18:20,840 Speaker 1: And I bet he could add this on here not 333 00:18:20,920 --> 00:18:22,600 Speaker 1: only get invited to the home, but didn't. 334 00:18:22,400 --> 00:18:24,520 Speaker 3: Sit at their table with him, Like that's actually what 335 00:18:24,600 --> 00:18:26,880 Speaker 3: he said was sit in their home and eat. 336 00:18:27,160 --> 00:18:31,600 Speaker 2: Eat when you break bread with a family, your your family. 337 00:18:31,840 --> 00:18:33,439 Speaker 2: So were you doing that? Yes? 338 00:18:33,800 --> 00:18:36,679 Speaker 1: So what happened is and and my police officer, and 339 00:18:36,680 --> 00:18:38,800 Speaker 1: I love my I love police working on it. But 340 00:18:38,880 --> 00:18:42,520 Speaker 1: what I what happened was as I did that build 341 00:18:42,520 --> 00:18:45,240 Speaker 1: that kind of relationship because it's about relationship. 342 00:18:46,040 --> 00:18:46,440 Speaker 2: Is that. 343 00:18:47,800 --> 00:18:52,000 Speaker 1: Uh, even when something went down, I could be ten 344 00:18:52,080 --> 00:18:56,159 Speaker 1: miles away and I would get a call, uh harding, 345 00:18:56,240 --> 00:18:57,879 Speaker 1: can you go to F one? We call on F 346 00:18:57,920 --> 00:19:00,439 Speaker 1: one like private channels. Then you go, hey, can you 347 00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:02,240 Speaker 1: come over here? They won't talk to me unless you're here. 348 00:19:03,520 --> 00:19:05,359 Speaker 1: Now get there. We saw a whole crime. 349 00:19:05,600 --> 00:19:09,639 Speaker 3: But see that's the deal when you as when people 350 00:19:09,680 --> 00:19:12,639 Speaker 3: see behind the badge and see the human being and 351 00:19:12,680 --> 00:19:14,800 Speaker 3: they don't see the uniform first. They see the human 352 00:19:14,840 --> 00:19:17,840 Speaker 3: being first because you have alop relationship with them. Yes, 353 00:19:18,000 --> 00:19:20,119 Speaker 3: now you can. Now you can do that work. So 354 00:19:20,680 --> 00:19:22,520 Speaker 3: how long were you a police officer? 355 00:19:22,600 --> 00:19:26,159 Speaker 1: I was from nine, I graduated ninety one and I 356 00:19:26,200 --> 00:19:27,440 Speaker 1: was on til ninety five. 357 00:19:27,720 --> 00:19:28,919 Speaker 2: In four years. 358 00:19:29,200 --> 00:19:33,080 Speaker 1: Yes, and I didn't It wasn't that I was I 359 00:19:33,160 --> 00:19:36,240 Speaker 1: didn't love police work. It was because I was getting 360 00:19:36,280 --> 00:19:40,359 Speaker 1: prepared to go to seminary to be United Methodist pastor. 361 00:19:40,440 --> 00:19:42,840 Speaker 3: Well, see that's what that's what's weird. How common is 362 00:19:42,880 --> 00:19:45,680 Speaker 3: it for a cop to become a pastor? And what 363 00:19:45,840 --> 00:19:46,639 Speaker 3: is that all about? 364 00:19:46,680 --> 00:19:48,879 Speaker 2: Why? Because you went to be a cop to go 365 00:19:48,920 --> 00:19:51,159 Speaker 2: to the FI but somewhere. 366 00:19:50,760 --> 00:19:52,520 Speaker 3: In there you transition, so you don't want to be 367 00:19:52,560 --> 00:19:53,000 Speaker 3: a pastor? 368 00:19:53,040 --> 00:19:54,560 Speaker 2: So what was that about? 369 00:19:54,640 --> 00:19:54,760 Speaker 1: So? 370 00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:57,080 Speaker 2: Bill? My goal was three years I was going to. 371 00:19:57,960 --> 00:20:00,000 Speaker 1: I even told the police department, Hey, I'm doing it 372 00:20:00,119 --> 00:20:02,440 Speaker 1: for three years so I can go be an FBI agents. 373 00:20:02,480 --> 00:20:06,240 Speaker 1: What I thought my goal was if I since I 374 00:20:06,240 --> 00:20:09,640 Speaker 1: didn't make the NFL, I had a degree in criminal 375 00:20:09,760 --> 00:20:15,040 Speaker 1: justice with abnormal psychology and political science. And in that 376 00:20:15,160 --> 00:20:18,640 Speaker 1: process at my local church, which was at the time 377 00:20:18,720 --> 00:20:22,880 Speaker 1: Saint Mark United Methodist Church and which you ta, and 378 00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:25,359 Speaker 1: I remember the pastor saying, hey, you're pretty good with 379 00:20:25,400 --> 00:20:27,200 Speaker 1: the kids, God, particularly young man. 380 00:20:28,280 --> 00:20:29,520 Speaker 2: Do you want to be a part of our youth 381 00:20:29,600 --> 00:20:30,440 Speaker 2: pastor ministry? 382 00:20:30,440 --> 00:20:32,760 Speaker 1: So I was part of this, the ministry as a 383 00:20:32,800 --> 00:20:36,399 Speaker 1: lay person, a lay person and while I'm still a 384 00:20:36,400 --> 00:20:38,159 Speaker 1: police officer, and I would come and do that and 385 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:40,160 Speaker 1: then and then I was like, by the way, since 386 00:20:40,160 --> 00:20:41,840 Speaker 1: you're doing such a good job, can you be our 387 00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:45,119 Speaker 1: youth pastor. So I'm still a cop and I'm part 388 00:20:45,160 --> 00:20:47,920 Speaker 1: time youth pastor. I mean when I say part time, 389 00:20:48,119 --> 00:20:50,800 Speaker 1: it wasn't about funding. I didn't care about the money. 390 00:20:50,800 --> 00:20:52,560 Speaker 1: It was this, I get to hang out with these 391 00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:56,680 Speaker 1: kids and that ministry just next thing I know, I'm 392 00:20:57,240 --> 00:20:59,959 Speaker 1: I'm sitting there with my wife and rolling for seminary 393 00:21:00,160 --> 00:21:04,200 Speaker 1: to be a full time elder in the United Methodist Church. Uh, 394 00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:07,600 Speaker 1: and some of my friends in college go Kevis. 395 00:21:08,040 --> 00:21:11,480 Speaker 2: You know it was Mayhem. My nickname was Mayam. Uh. 396 00:21:12,840 --> 00:21:17,600 Speaker 1: Your nickname was Mayhem like the commercial day but to 397 00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:22,280 Speaker 1: this day, I'm still as a progressive insurance and the 398 00:21:22,320 --> 00:21:23,280 Speaker 1: guys out here that. 399 00:21:23,320 --> 00:21:28,120 Speaker 2: Was me on the football. You know, you know you football? 400 00:21:28,359 --> 00:21:30,679 Speaker 1: You know, remember right Dell and bike back then was 401 00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:33,919 Speaker 1: bike Rember putting bike all over your shirt. 402 00:21:34,800 --> 00:21:36,080 Speaker 2: You're gonna know you hit. 403 00:21:36,440 --> 00:21:40,840 Speaker 1: I'm a tattooed these screws on you Listen. 404 00:21:40,880 --> 00:21:44,720 Speaker 2: I know I'm old when you could hit people and 405 00:21:44,720 --> 00:21:46,320 Speaker 2: that wouldn't flank football. Oh. 406 00:21:46,359 --> 00:21:48,880 Speaker 1: I still feel like I could hit somebody one time, 407 00:21:51,119 --> 00:21:52,520 Speaker 1: everything on me fall apart. 408 00:21:52,880 --> 00:21:54,200 Speaker 2: But that was that's. 409 00:21:53,960 --> 00:22:00,439 Speaker 1: So so in that in that process of trends, listening 410 00:22:00,520 --> 00:22:04,359 Speaker 1: from and again you got to hear this Bill. I 411 00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:08,359 Speaker 1: love what I did as a police officer, particularly the 412 00:22:08,359 --> 00:22:12,040 Speaker 1: community policing work, because it allowed me to literally do 413 00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:14,440 Speaker 1: the stuff I grew up doing with my grandfather, which 414 00:22:14,520 --> 00:22:18,800 Speaker 1: was construction. Uh, particularly with seniors. That's where my heart 415 00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:21,840 Speaker 1: was was how do I help these seniors keep their 416 00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:23,919 Speaker 1: homes because a lot of them were losing homes because they, 417 00:22:24,320 --> 00:22:27,240 Speaker 1: like you said earlier, we grew up in the neighborhoods, 418 00:22:27,240 --> 00:22:28,440 Speaker 1: and we become successful. 419 00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:29,800 Speaker 2: When we grow we move away. 420 00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:32,800 Speaker 1: So you got these parents who still live there, like 421 00:22:32,880 --> 00:22:36,520 Speaker 1: my grandparents, all of my uncles and aunts and including 422 00:22:36,560 --> 00:22:38,680 Speaker 1: my mom, they all moved out. None of them lived there, 423 00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:42,359 Speaker 1: some of them La Denver, and I mean there's not 424 00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:45,960 Speaker 1: I don't have an uncle and aunt from my grandparents' 425 00:22:46,040 --> 00:22:50,880 Speaker 1: side that actually lives in Wichita. 426 00:22:50,560 --> 00:22:51,440 Speaker 2: Are in that neighborhood. 427 00:22:51,480 --> 00:22:56,520 Speaker 1: They're all somewhere from Los Angeles to Oregon that you know. 428 00:22:57,320 --> 00:22:59,320 Speaker 2: Exactly what Bob was talking about. 429 00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:02,680 Speaker 3: A little money, you have a little success, and you leave, Yes, 430 00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:07,560 Speaker 3: but over generations of that, think of what's what what 431 00:23:07,760 --> 00:23:11,760 Speaker 3: ends up developing? Once everybody with talent lea yes, and 432 00:23:11,800 --> 00:23:12,520 Speaker 3: well and. 433 00:23:12,440 --> 00:23:13,120 Speaker 2: For what you tell. 434 00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:18,440 Speaker 1: Part of what I'm trying to hopefully let people understand 435 00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:21,920 Speaker 1: is you don't have to leave to be successful. So 436 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:24,720 Speaker 1: that's why I look when I got into the affordable housing. 437 00:23:24,760 --> 00:23:27,200 Speaker 1: Part of that was because we're trying to we're trying 438 00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:31,960 Speaker 1: to overcome decades of systemic sin, which we call redlining. 439 00:23:32,080 --> 00:23:33,959 Speaker 3: We're going to get to that in a minute, but 440 00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:38,240 Speaker 3: take us through transition from a cop to a pastor 441 00:23:38,320 --> 00:23:38,840 Speaker 3: full time. 442 00:23:39,240 --> 00:23:43,040 Speaker 1: Oh scary for one, because I was like, if yous 443 00:23:43,160 --> 00:23:44,080 Speaker 1: about your drug problem? 444 00:23:44,119 --> 00:23:44,359 Speaker 2: First? 445 00:23:44,640 --> 00:23:46,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, I always tell people I had a drug problem. 446 00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:49,000 Speaker 1: Not the common drug pot, but I got drugged at 447 00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:50,000 Speaker 1: church every Sunday. 448 00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:50,960 Speaker 2: Right. 449 00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:56,280 Speaker 1: So my mone, my mom, she was, she's to this day. 450 00:23:56,600 --> 00:23:59,120 Speaker 1: I mean, if I pulled my phone out, probably she's 451 00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:01,880 Speaker 1: got something about God. She's telling me I'm the pastor, 452 00:24:02,119 --> 00:24:04,560 Speaker 1: and she she's still she's still. 453 00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:07,280 Speaker 2: Telling me maybe the pastor. 454 00:24:09,880 --> 00:24:16,119 Speaker 1: Yes, but she she she was so faithful and growing 455 00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:17,199 Speaker 1: us up, and so we had to go. 456 00:24:17,320 --> 00:24:17,399 Speaker 2: Cha. 457 00:24:17,520 --> 00:24:19,760 Speaker 1: It was not which I tell people all the time, 458 00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:24,040 Speaker 1: until you get grown, and particularly in my house, Uh, 459 00:24:24,280 --> 00:24:24,840 Speaker 1: you didn't. 460 00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:27,000 Speaker 2: Have an option about going to church. You you went. 461 00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:29,639 Speaker 2: It wasn't. She didn't come to your bedroom and go 462 00:24:29,720 --> 00:24:31,800 Speaker 2: do you want to go to church? You know? And 463 00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:33,320 Speaker 2: to this day, I still get. 464 00:24:33,160 --> 00:24:37,119 Speaker 1: Your in there, go to church and nothing. And she 465 00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:41,160 Speaker 1: would turn her gospel channel on. It was like radio channel. 466 00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:44,520 Speaker 1: He would turn on, uh on the Lord side. It 467 00:24:44,520 --> 00:24:46,000 Speaker 1: was a song I'm on the Lord side. 468 00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:48,040 Speaker 2: I had the same drug problem. So you had the 469 00:24:48,040 --> 00:24:49,800 Speaker 2: same trug and you. 470 00:24:49,440 --> 00:24:51,159 Speaker 1: Well, so I be sleeping and she would turn that 471 00:24:51,280 --> 00:24:53,479 Speaker 1: music and I'd be like, it's time to go. 472 00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:55,480 Speaker 2: It was so man, know, it was so bad. 473 00:24:56,119 --> 00:24:59,600 Speaker 1: Church was late, but I would get mad because you 474 00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:02,080 Speaker 1: had to be school on through the weekday by eight 475 00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:04,760 Speaker 1: eight thirty and here this church wasn't till eleven o'clock 476 00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:06,600 Speaker 1: and I'm mad because I got to get up to 477 00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:09,919 Speaker 1: go somewhere and this. So anyway, that's that's how I 478 00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:13,480 Speaker 1: went from, you know, growing up in church, so I 479 00:25:13,560 --> 00:25:14,040 Speaker 1: knew God. 480 00:25:15,480 --> 00:25:18,160 Speaker 2: But I fell in love with Jesus. 481 00:25:17,880 --> 00:25:22,240 Speaker 1: In college and a Christian fellowship association with the guys 482 00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:27,159 Speaker 1: with the FCA, and I said, Christian Fellowship of Christian 483 00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:31,960 Speaker 1: athletes and where we would didn't have to be a 484 00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:34,200 Speaker 1: you know, you know, because you know your nicknames mayem 485 00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:36,359 Speaker 1: you're you know, you're at the bars after the game 486 00:25:36,880 --> 00:25:39,959 Speaker 1: and then someone invites you to this uh And to 487 00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:42,399 Speaker 1: this day, I still share that story about this. How 488 00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:44,560 Speaker 1: I fell in love with Jesus was a I was 489 00:25:44,560 --> 00:25:47,360 Speaker 1: at this preacher he was I couldn't even tell you 490 00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:51,400 Speaker 1: his name. It was a very large church, and he 491 00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:57,400 Speaker 1: did a story about Jesus following him and he's Jesus. 492 00:25:57,600 --> 00:26:00,720 Speaker 1: He promised Jesus that wherever he went, he said, Jesus, 493 00:26:00,760 --> 00:26:04,240 Speaker 1: wherever I go I'm gonna take you with me, and 494 00:26:04,280 --> 00:26:07,440 Speaker 1: so Jesus and he uses this man as this illustration 495 00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:10,080 Speaker 1: of Jesus is following him. So why I'm sitting there 496 00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:14,000 Speaker 1: at this nineteen year old kid and him illustrating the 497 00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:18,560 Speaker 1: story and this guy who's Jesus following him and he's 498 00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:21,679 Speaker 1: following him all around. He loves it. And then his 499 00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:24,640 Speaker 1: phone rings is you know, Mega Church. The phone rings 500 00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:26,400 Speaker 1: and he picks up and says, hey, man, we're having 501 00:26:26,440 --> 00:26:28,320 Speaker 1: a party. You want to go hang out? He says sure, 502 00:26:29,080 --> 00:26:32,600 Speaker 1: and so Jesus follows and he's he says, no, Jesus, 503 00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:34,960 Speaker 1: you have to stay. I'm going to go, you know, 504 00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:37,760 Speaker 1: hang out. My god, I need some space. But Jesus, 505 00:26:37,760 --> 00:26:40,000 Speaker 1: but you just told me wherever you go, I go, 506 00:26:40,560 --> 00:26:43,879 Speaker 1: and wherever you know, vice versa. And then the most 507 00:26:43,920 --> 00:26:47,800 Speaker 1: powerful thing he did was is when he was really 508 00:26:47,840 --> 00:26:49,959 Speaker 1: ready to go, and he did about three times. He 509 00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:53,040 Speaker 1: finally took Jesus and stood them still, and he hung 510 00:26:53,119 --> 00:26:56,240 Speaker 1: him on the cross and he told him you stay 511 00:26:56,359 --> 00:26:58,520 Speaker 1: right here, Jesus until I get back. And then he 512 00:26:58,560 --> 00:27:00,320 Speaker 1: turned around and looked It's like he's looking and right 513 00:27:00,359 --> 00:27:01,919 Speaker 1: at me, but he's probably looking at all of us, 514 00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:04,760 Speaker 1: and he was like, how do of us tell Jesus 515 00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:07,600 Speaker 1: that how much we love them, but soon's being ready 516 00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:10,440 Speaker 1: to go do some dirt. We put them up, we 517 00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:16,240 Speaker 1: domesticate them, we hide them away. I was like, Lord, 518 00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:19,440 Speaker 1: I don't ever want to do that. And I didn't 519 00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:23,160 Speaker 1: know it, but my life changed right there. So I'll 520 00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:25,199 Speaker 1: still made him on the football field, but on the 521 00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:28,679 Speaker 1: on the streets, I wanted to be Christ, which was 522 00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:32,800 Speaker 1: a carbonser son, hands and feet of Christ in a community. 523 00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:34,159 Speaker 2: Uh. 524 00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:40,600 Speaker 1: Doing what Christ did was building community. So so I'm sorry, no, 525 00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:42,800 Speaker 1: it's beautiful. 526 00:27:43,119 --> 00:27:46,000 Speaker 3: But I was just gonna say so the transition from 527 00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:49,040 Speaker 3: a police officer to a reverend seems like the groundwork 528 00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:50,560 Speaker 3: was laid many years before that, and. 529 00:27:50,600 --> 00:27:52,400 Speaker 2: I didn't know it. I just thought it was service. 530 00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:54,480 Speaker 1: I just thought, okay, so when I went So, when 531 00:27:54,480 --> 00:27:57,160 Speaker 1: I got into community, you know, policing, God was my focus. 532 00:27:57,320 --> 00:28:00,280 Speaker 1: Was this community. Policing would let me do that minute tree, 533 00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:02,600 Speaker 1: but it took me further. 534 00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:06,680 Speaker 2: We'll be right back. 535 00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:26,160 Speaker 3: So you began the ordained ministry in the United Methodist 536 00:28:26,240 --> 00:28:29,840 Speaker 3: Church in ninety five, became a deacon in ninety eight, 537 00:28:31,760 --> 00:28:36,120 Speaker 3: and then you were appointed senior pastor at del Delrose 538 00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:39,520 Speaker 3: United Methodist Church in which dal Kansas. Actually, when I 539 00:28:39,560 --> 00:28:42,960 Speaker 3: read that, I kind of giggled because you hear Delrose 540 00:28:43,080 --> 00:28:46,960 Speaker 3: United Methodist Church in which dal Kansas. I picture this 541 00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:50,440 Speaker 3: small community, a cool little church. Oh no, it turns 542 00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:56,120 Speaker 3: out you've been there for over twenty five years and 543 00:28:58,280 --> 00:29:01,880 Speaker 3: when you showed up there about twenty five members and 544 00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:03,280 Speaker 3: now there's eight hundred. 545 00:29:04,080 --> 00:29:06,920 Speaker 1: Well I always say eight hundred on paper. I get 546 00:29:06,960 --> 00:29:11,000 Speaker 1: two fifty on a Sunday. Okay, but still yeah, we 547 00:29:11,320 --> 00:29:13,320 Speaker 1: So I was sent, I was appointed. 548 00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:13,720 Speaker 2: I sent. 549 00:29:13,840 --> 00:29:17,520 Speaker 1: I can't United methods. You're appointed and you're considered a tenery. 550 00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:19,400 Speaker 1: That's a blessing for me is that I'm in an 551 00:29:19,480 --> 00:29:22,240 Speaker 1: urban setting and doing such a good job. I was 552 00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:26,080 Speaker 1: appointed by the bishop to a church to do a transition, 553 00:29:26,160 --> 00:29:30,160 Speaker 1: which was my first book, Can These Bones Live, which 554 00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:33,560 Speaker 1: was when God takes Ezekiel and he sits them down 555 00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:36,800 Speaker 1: in the valley of these dry bones six see six 556 00:29:36,880 --> 00:29:39,560 Speaker 1: seven two one four six seven two one eight in 557 00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:44,160 Speaker 1: the hood, and he says, can these bones live in Ezekiel? 558 00:29:44,200 --> 00:29:46,760 Speaker 1: Which I said to God was yes, give me a 559 00:29:46,800 --> 00:29:50,840 Speaker 1: shot with me having an entrepreneur spirit, not knowing what 560 00:29:50,880 --> 00:29:53,600 Speaker 1: the entrepreneur meant growing up doing it all my life 561 00:29:53,600 --> 00:29:56,960 Speaker 1: with my grandfather who was my example. And so we 562 00:29:57,040 --> 00:30:00,640 Speaker 1: took this church that they you had two years to 563 00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:02,640 Speaker 1: turn it around, from ninety eight to two thousand. All 564 00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:04,720 Speaker 1: we're going to do, like a lot of churches, is 565 00:30:04,760 --> 00:30:08,640 Speaker 1: closed because it's a very large church. It was a 566 00:30:08,720 --> 00:30:13,240 Speaker 1: large facility, very large, and it was an all white 567 00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:16,320 Speaker 1: congregation in all white neighborhood when what we call transitional 568 00:30:16,920 --> 00:30:18,200 Speaker 1: was the neighborhood transition. 569 00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:19,080 Speaker 2: So the neighborhood. 570 00:30:19,080 --> 00:30:21,960 Speaker 1: That's why I said near northeast because it keeps moving 571 00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:25,920 Speaker 1: out so where I grew up, where I'm at now 572 00:30:26,240 --> 00:30:28,840 Speaker 1: that I called the invisible line. Police officers we call 573 00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:30,960 Speaker 1: it the invisible line. Most people can still. 574 00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:31,520 Speaker 2: Call it that now. 575 00:30:31,560 --> 00:30:33,840 Speaker 1: It's like you knew when you cross a certain street, 576 00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:39,240 Speaker 1: I'm in the hood. That line kept moving to where 577 00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:42,440 Speaker 1: Dale Roch was inside that circle. 578 00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:45,280 Speaker 3: Now, so it transitioned from a large, all white church 579 00:30:45,360 --> 00:30:48,320 Speaker 3: to an urban church, very urban. And when you showed up, 580 00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:49,720 Speaker 3: there's twenty five members. 581 00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:53,200 Speaker 2: Everybody left. My question is. 582 00:30:56,400 --> 00:30:59,320 Speaker 3: Anybody who pays attention to anything, whether you're a Christian 583 00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:06,920 Speaker 3: or faithful or not. Church membership, church attendance, all of 584 00:31:06,960 --> 00:31:09,320 Speaker 3: those numbers in the United States. 585 00:31:08,920 --> 00:31:13,440 Speaker 2: Have been on a decline. Oh major, Yes, and you're almost. 586 00:31:13,080 --> 00:31:15,720 Speaker 3: Following the decline that happened in Europe in the early 587 00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:16,760 Speaker 3: nineteen hundreds. 588 00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:19,960 Speaker 2: It's very similar, very it's very very similar. 589 00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:24,960 Speaker 3: It's still still so how with that data and those 590 00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:31,760 Speaker 3: pressures against you, when church membership and church attendance is declining, 591 00:31:32,560 --> 00:31:35,080 Speaker 3: how have you grown from twenty five members to two 592 00:31:35,120 --> 00:31:38,960 Speaker 3: fifty regular attenders? And however many quote membership on the rolls, 593 00:31:38,960 --> 00:31:39,800 Speaker 3: how's that happened? 594 00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:43,240 Speaker 1: Well, I go back to the former police office officerp 595 00:31:43,320 --> 00:31:47,600 Speaker 1: You're talking about going to the neighborhood and all the 596 00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:51,000 Speaker 1: way back to the table. Still do that, staying connected, 597 00:31:51,160 --> 00:31:53,560 Speaker 1: building relationships with men in the community. 598 00:31:54,560 --> 00:31:57,920 Speaker 3: So you went from community policing to community pastoring. Yes, 599 00:31:58,520 --> 00:32:00,400 Speaker 3: the same set of arresting people and. 600 00:32:00,360 --> 00:32:03,640 Speaker 2: Dragging them to jail. You're dragging them to a congregation, 601 00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:06,200 Speaker 2: to an AA meeting and get them off drugs. 602 00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:08,640 Speaker 1: I'm dragging them to all men's meeting where I sit 603 00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:10,360 Speaker 1: there and we call it chopping up. I'm part of 604 00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:13,760 Speaker 1: It's called the smokers and jokers. It's a cigar lounge. 605 00:32:14,280 --> 00:32:15,800 Speaker 1: I go in there and hang out all these guys, 606 00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:16,520 Speaker 1: and I'm just I. 607 00:32:16,520 --> 00:32:16,880 Speaker 2: Want to go. 608 00:32:17,000 --> 00:32:21,040 Speaker 4: We should have recorded. And I love Bill and I 609 00:32:21,080 --> 00:32:22,400 Speaker 4: are both huge cigar fans. 610 00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:26,080 Speaker 2: He actually has a part time job, that's all. 611 00:32:26,760 --> 00:32:29,120 Speaker 4: I work on the army all at a cigar shop 612 00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:33,280 Speaker 4: at night. We gotta going on there, but I'm hoping 613 00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:34,880 Speaker 4: it Bill comes in Wichita one day we can. 614 00:32:35,360 --> 00:32:38,840 Speaker 1: We literally literally have a week. We bought our own 615 00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:41,120 Speaker 1: store front and I'll have to show it to you. 616 00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:44,560 Speaker 1: It's it's our it's our cigar. When you were, you 617 00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:47,040 Speaker 1: own it, yes, part of it. You think any other 618 00:32:47,040 --> 00:32:49,680 Speaker 1: pastor on the cigar what's a group of us. 619 00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:51,680 Speaker 2: It's a cold. It's a cold. 620 00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:58,520 Speaker 3: I'm Presbyterian, so everything's okay. And moderation of everything, everything everything. 621 00:32:58,720 --> 00:33:02,680 Speaker 1: So yes, I've I've smoked cigars and pastors Drake wild 622 00:33:02,720 --> 00:33:04,880 Speaker 1: with my pastors, you know all of that. 623 00:33:04,920 --> 00:33:06,920 Speaker 4: I don't know how many of them own a cigar shop. 624 00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:09,120 Speaker 2: That's no, I don't own it. 625 00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:12,640 Speaker 1: Well, we own it because it's it's it's yeah, and 626 00:33:12,680 --> 00:33:15,040 Speaker 1: we all pay one hundred dollars a month, dudes. 627 00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:15,479 Speaker 2: Which tastes care. 628 00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:19,520 Speaker 1: Electricity, the water, the trash, it and that's what we do. 629 00:33:19,720 --> 00:33:23,440 Speaker 1: Study and I don't do like oh, break out the Bible. 630 00:33:23,560 --> 00:33:24,720 Speaker 1: And but I just. 631 00:33:25,080 --> 00:33:26,800 Speaker 2: Like you have cigar burns on your Bible. 632 00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:34,000 Speaker 1: No I haven't, because you know what's so crazy? This 633 00:33:34,080 --> 00:33:37,760 Speaker 1: has become the I mean, we use this everybody, that's right, 634 00:33:37,920 --> 00:33:40,600 Speaker 1: So why going in with those guys and we'll just 635 00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:42,480 Speaker 1: chop it up with how are you doing with your kids? 636 00:33:43,560 --> 00:33:44,040 Speaker 2: Fothering? 637 00:33:44,680 --> 00:33:49,120 Speaker 3: So you grew your church. What I find interesting is 638 00:33:49,240 --> 00:33:54,600 Speaker 3: you grew this church. Let's be honest. I'm not putting 639 00:33:54,600 --> 00:33:56,240 Speaker 3: words in your mouth, but it sounds like this is 640 00:33:56,240 --> 00:33:58,920 Speaker 3: an area where it suffered extreme white flight. 641 00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:00,560 Speaker 2: Yes, yep. 642 00:34:00,920 --> 00:34:05,520 Speaker 3: And when that happens, and like you and like you say, 643 00:34:05,960 --> 00:34:11,400 Speaker 3: the hood expands and the white flight happens, it creates 644 00:34:11,440 --> 00:34:15,759 Speaker 3: these abysses. And you could see that maybe in the 645 00:34:15,800 --> 00:34:18,319 Speaker 3: sixties and seventies and eighties, this church grew and grew 646 00:34:18,360 --> 00:34:21,560 Speaker 3: and grew it was and then as the hood expanded, 647 00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:25,560 Speaker 3: the congregation left in the neighborhood changed and it has 648 00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:28,280 Speaker 3: to be repopulated or shut down exactly. 649 00:34:28,680 --> 00:34:30,520 Speaker 2: And you repopulated it. 650 00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:33,239 Speaker 3: And the same thing as a pastor that you did 651 00:34:33,360 --> 00:34:37,760 Speaker 3: as a police officer, which is community communitistoring, yes, which 652 00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:39,200 Speaker 3: I'm making that up. 653 00:34:39,080 --> 00:34:42,839 Speaker 2: But that's what I like no. 654 00:34:43,000 --> 00:34:44,840 Speaker 1: I think if it's not a real phrase, it should 655 00:34:44,840 --> 00:34:47,480 Speaker 1: be because I think every pastor should be in the 656 00:34:47,520 --> 00:34:50,240 Speaker 1: community beyond the four walls of the church. 657 00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:51,600 Speaker 2: Church. 658 00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:54,360 Speaker 1: Churches were not meant for us to build them. You know, 659 00:34:54,600 --> 00:34:57,040 Speaker 1: I love the movie, you know, Building Nato come to 660 00:34:57,160 --> 00:34:59,880 Speaker 1: fill the dreams and they will no, no, no church. 661 00:35:00,160 --> 00:35:02,440 Speaker 1: We did the same thing buildings, the big mega churches. 662 00:35:03,080 --> 00:35:06,200 Speaker 1: Nothing against megachurches, but that's the thing that I call 663 00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:09,920 Speaker 1: the nineties. In two thousands, you have a pocket of those, 664 00:35:10,880 --> 00:35:14,800 Speaker 1: but your neighborhood and we're considered a neighborhood church, local church. 665 00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:17,919 Speaker 1: So you're looking at two zip codes that I work 666 00:35:17,960 --> 00:35:20,239 Speaker 1: with in particularly six the two one four six them 667 00:35:20,440 --> 00:35:24,279 Speaker 1: two oh eight. Is that be the hands and feet 668 00:35:24,280 --> 00:35:26,000 Speaker 1: of Christ in that in that community? 669 00:35:26,680 --> 00:35:26,799 Speaker 2: Uh? 670 00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:32,040 Speaker 1: So we went, you know, providing community development through home 671 00:35:32,080 --> 00:35:36,719 Speaker 1: ownership programs, financial literacy, class men, ministry, women's men, use me. 672 00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:40,239 Speaker 1: But it doesn't have to be in the church in 673 00:35:40,239 --> 00:35:42,360 Speaker 1: that building, although we have a lot of stuff there, 674 00:35:43,239 --> 00:35:48,000 Speaker 1: but it's constantly outward looking, very missional driven. How do 675 00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:50,439 Speaker 1: we make a difference? How do we when we from 676 00:35:50,440 --> 00:35:53,680 Speaker 1: the simple little thing is a blessing box that can't 677 00:35:53,719 --> 00:35:57,400 Speaker 1: stay full because we feel it, and it's empty because 678 00:35:57,640 --> 00:36:00,920 Speaker 1: the homeless population. And how do you take those people 679 00:36:00,920 --> 00:36:04,880 Speaker 1: and get them into transitional housing? You no literally sleeping 680 00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:08,960 Speaker 1: around the church. My uh my mom always said, don't 681 00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:11,400 Speaker 1: confuse that building with a steeple. 682 00:36:11,800 --> 00:36:14,399 Speaker 3: Oh, I said, what do you mean. She said, that's 683 00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:17,480 Speaker 3: not a church. So that's a church building. It's a building. 684 00:36:17,560 --> 00:36:19,280 Speaker 3: She said, you can have a church on the field 685 00:36:19,360 --> 00:36:22,960 Speaker 3: somewhere people are in it. Yes, church, we are the church. 686 00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:26,040 Speaker 3: And that's what you're saying, ya is for the church 687 00:36:26,120 --> 00:36:28,120 Speaker 3: to be active, it has to get out of its 688 00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:29,520 Speaker 3: building and get into the community. 689 00:36:29,600 --> 00:36:31,399 Speaker 2: Yeah, beyond the four walls of the church. 690 00:36:31,560 --> 00:36:33,520 Speaker 4: There's actually two lines I love that relates to this. 691 00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:36,960 Speaker 4: So I think it's MLK said church is not a 692 00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:39,240 Speaker 4: place you go to, but a place you go from. 693 00:36:40,280 --> 00:36:41,800 Speaker 4: And then one of our guests, I feel like it 694 00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:44,720 Speaker 4: was Rona Pulson with Isaiah seventeen house. But she said, 695 00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:47,440 Speaker 4: like so many of these church programs, like they'll have 696 00:36:47,480 --> 00:36:50,640 Speaker 4: their little ice cream social and like think about people 697 00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:52,759 Speaker 4: who are like having trouble in their lives right now. 698 00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:54,640 Speaker 4: You think they want to like come with all these 699 00:36:54,680 --> 00:36:56,960 Speaker 4: pretty white people who got all their together and like 700 00:36:57,280 --> 00:36:59,799 Speaker 4: it's really nice clothes. Like that's the last place they 701 00:36:59,840 --> 00:37:01,960 Speaker 4: want to be. They want to be like, actually, where 702 00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:04,120 Speaker 4: you can help them in their need. That's the greatest 703 00:37:04,160 --> 00:37:05,000 Speaker 4: way to grow the church. 704 00:37:05,120 --> 00:37:09,480 Speaker 1: And I preached like this or without this jacket. I 705 00:37:09,520 --> 00:37:12,239 Speaker 1: haven't had a robe bone in forever because folks in 706 00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:15,040 Speaker 1: that neighborhood needs to know that I'm not coming out 707 00:37:15,040 --> 00:37:16,080 Speaker 1: there with this big. 708 00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:19,239 Speaker 2: Religious you know, thus as the Lord. But hey, this 709 00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:20,440 Speaker 2: is what I'm talking down to him. 710 00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:23,279 Speaker 1: I'm telling, I'm telling, I'm telling on me half the time. 711 00:37:23,280 --> 00:37:25,520 Speaker 1: My wife hates it. He got to tell all your. 712 00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:27,800 Speaker 2: Business, don't all your business? 713 00:37:28,920 --> 00:37:32,279 Speaker 1: Yeah, but but that lets people know you're relating to them. 714 00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:35,520 Speaker 1: And like, I like what you said. It's uh, the 715 00:37:35,760 --> 00:37:40,160 Speaker 1: you know, not the place you go to. Well, okay, Bill, 716 00:37:40,239 --> 00:37:44,680 Speaker 1: you like this Sunday particular? You Sunday to me, it's 717 00:37:44,760 --> 00:37:51,480 Speaker 1: halftime hmm, you know, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Wednesday's because Bible 718 00:37:51,520 --> 00:37:54,040 Speaker 1: study is kind of like that, you know, we're practicing. 719 00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:58,600 Speaker 1: And and now like you said that, so Sunday I'm 720 00:37:58,600 --> 00:38:01,040 Speaker 1: bringing everybody into the into the locker room. 721 00:38:01,480 --> 00:38:04,120 Speaker 2: That was a good week. Last week. Some of us 722 00:38:04,120 --> 00:38:04,719 Speaker 2: got beat up. 723 00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:07,080 Speaker 1: You fell over here over here, let me we're gonna 724 00:38:07,440 --> 00:38:09,640 Speaker 1: and then we'll practice this to next week through the 725 00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:12,799 Speaker 1: class and then after I get through it Sunday, like 726 00:38:12,880 --> 00:38:14,719 Speaker 1: you said, now, let let us go back out. 727 00:38:15,880 --> 00:38:17,120 Speaker 2: That's what the whole lights mean. 728 00:38:17,200 --> 00:38:19,520 Speaker 1: And when so when you see, as they say, the 729 00:38:19,600 --> 00:38:22,320 Speaker 1: Methodist Church are even Catholic when they bring the kids, 730 00:38:22,320 --> 00:38:25,359 Speaker 1: bring the lights. So the light is representative of Christ 731 00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:28,160 Speaker 1: that you bring it. You're bringing the light from out 732 00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:30,400 Speaker 1: of the world into a place of worship where you 733 00:38:30,440 --> 00:38:33,880 Speaker 1: can worship and as simble together to empower and to 734 00:38:33,960 --> 00:38:37,600 Speaker 1: encourage halftime. Hey, don't forget it. That's what we got 735 00:38:37,640 --> 00:38:39,840 Speaker 1: to go do when we go back out there. And 736 00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:41,840 Speaker 1: so when we and then when we finish worship, you 737 00:38:41,920 --> 00:38:43,799 Speaker 1: take that same light. If you remember that, you take 738 00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:46,000 Speaker 1: that same light and you take it out. So I 739 00:38:46,040 --> 00:38:48,839 Speaker 1: tell people the light is a representation of we come 740 00:38:48,880 --> 00:38:49,440 Speaker 1: to worship. 741 00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:52,920 Speaker 2: That's why I hate it people call church service. No, 742 00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:54,280 Speaker 2: that's not church's. 743 00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:57,840 Speaker 1: Worship, particularly Sundays is about worship where you come to 744 00:38:57,840 --> 00:39:00,600 Speaker 1: give God praise that got you through the week. Then 745 00:39:00,640 --> 00:39:04,080 Speaker 1: once you finish worship, halftime, Now, let's go back out 746 00:39:04,440 --> 00:39:07,120 Speaker 1: and be the light of Jesus Christ in this dark 747 00:39:07,200 --> 00:39:11,360 Speaker 1: world and you see them back out, and then I 748 00:39:11,520 --> 00:39:14,280 Speaker 1: try to say, instead of me just preaching from this pulpit, 749 00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:15,920 Speaker 1: now I'm gonna show you because I'm gonna go do 750 00:39:15,960 --> 00:39:16,279 Speaker 1: it too. 751 00:39:20,080 --> 00:39:23,920 Speaker 3: And that concludes Part one of our conversation with Kevis Harding, 752 00:39:24,040 --> 00:39:25,439 Speaker 3: and you don't want to miss part two. 753 00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:28,240 Speaker 2: It's now available to listen to. Together. 754 00:39:28,280 --> 00:39:31,600 Speaker 3: Guys, we can change this country, but it starts with you. 755 00:39:32,120 --> 00:39:33,120 Speaker 3: I'll see in part two