1 00:00:11,039 --> 00:00:14,720 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Therapy for Black Girls Podcast, a weekly 2 00:00:14,760 --> 00:00:19,520 Speaker 1: conversation about mental health, personal development, and all the small 3 00:00:19,560 --> 00:00:22,720 Speaker 1: decisions we can make to become the best possible versions 4 00:00:22,720 --> 00:00:26,840 Speaker 1: of ourselves. I'm your host, doctor Joy Hard and Bradford, 5 00:00:27,200 --> 00:00:32,280 Speaker 1: a licensed psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia. For more information or 6 00:00:32,400 --> 00:00:35,800 Speaker 1: to find a therapist in your area, visit our website 7 00:00:35,920 --> 00:00:39,640 Speaker 1: at Therapy for Blackgirls dot com. While I hope you 8 00:00:39,680 --> 00:00:43,680 Speaker 1: love listening to and learning from the podcast, it is 9 00:00:43,720 --> 00:00:46,640 Speaker 1: not meant to be a substitute for a relationship with 10 00:00:46,680 --> 00:00:57,880 Speaker 1: a licensed mental health professional. Hey, y'all, thanks so much 11 00:00:57,960 --> 00:00:59,840 Speaker 1: for joining me for session four or five of the 12 00:01:00,040 --> 00:01:03,120 Speaker 1: Therapy for Black Girls Podcast. We'll get right into our 13 00:01:03,160 --> 00:01:10,039 Speaker 1: conversation afterword from our sponsors. Have you heard the news 14 00:01:10,440 --> 00:01:13,680 Speaker 1: Therapy for Black Girls is launching our community on Patreon. 15 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:17,840 Speaker 1: It's your space to be seen, heard, and understood in 16 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:21,039 Speaker 1: an even more connected way. We're excited to bring you 17 00:01:21,080 --> 00:01:24,640 Speaker 1: new segments like so my Therapist Said, where we break 18 00:01:24,640 --> 00:01:28,039 Speaker 1: down viral therapy hot takes with real mental health professionals, 19 00:01:28,560 --> 00:01:32,440 Speaker 1: TBG community chats, where we unpack trending pop culture topics 20 00:01:32,480 --> 00:01:35,679 Speaker 1: that have us all in our feelings and opportunities to 21 00:01:35,720 --> 00:01:37,399 Speaker 1: connect with other sisters. 22 00:01:37,000 --> 00:01:38,040 Speaker 2: All over the world. 23 00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:41,640 Speaker 1: Sign up now at Therapy for Blackgirls dot com, slash 24 00:01:41,720 --> 00:01:45,160 Speaker 1: join Patreon for all the details about what we're planning 25 00:01:45,240 --> 00:01:47,080 Speaker 1: and to be the first to know when the doors 26 00:01:47,120 --> 00:01:54,640 Speaker 1: are open. We can't wait to see you inside. In 27 00:01:54,720 --> 00:01:57,240 Speaker 1: the wake of the Me Too movement, it became clear 28 00:01:57,320 --> 00:02:01,320 Speaker 1: that film and television sets needed stronger regulation around intimate scenes. 29 00:02:02,120 --> 00:02:05,920 Speaker 1: Since then, intimacy coordinators have been on the rise, ensuring 30 00:02:05,960 --> 00:02:09,840 Speaker 1: that actors feel safe and respected while bringing vulnerable moments 31 00:02:09,880 --> 00:02:13,160 Speaker 1: to life on screen. Thanks to their work, we can 32 00:02:13,280 --> 00:02:16,840 Speaker 1: enjoy our favorite shows and movies without questioning whether boundaries 33 00:02:16,880 --> 00:02:20,200 Speaker 1: were crossed behind the scenes. Today, I'm thrilled to be 34 00:02:20,280 --> 00:02:23,360 Speaker 1: joined by doctor Tiff Henry, an expert in sex and 35 00:02:23,400 --> 00:02:27,200 Speaker 1: mental health and a leading intimacy coordinator with a master's 36 00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:30,880 Speaker 1: in psychology and a doctorate in Human sexuality. She brings 37 00:02:30,880 --> 00:02:34,239 Speaker 1: a deep understanding of human connection to her work. Since 38 00:02:34,280 --> 00:02:38,880 Speaker 1: earning her certification with the Intimacy Professionals Association, Doctor Chiff 39 00:02:38,880 --> 00:02:41,480 Speaker 1: has become a go to intimacy coordinator for TV and 40 00:02:41,520 --> 00:02:45,360 Speaker 1: film productions across Metro Atlanta. You may have seen her 41 00:02:45,360 --> 00:02:48,840 Speaker 1: expertise in action in productions like Tille and Tell Me 42 00:02:48,960 --> 00:02:52,720 Speaker 1: Lies are caught her insights on Good Morning America and Cinian. 43 00:02:53,600 --> 00:02:58,480 Speaker 1: Through her careful choreography of intimate scenes, Doctor Chiff creates 44 00:02:58,600 --> 00:03:03,120 Speaker 1: environments where both passion and safety can coexist beyond the screen. 45 00:03:03,560 --> 00:03:08,080 Speaker 1: She dives even deeper into conversations about self discovery, relationships, 46 00:03:08,120 --> 00:03:12,080 Speaker 1: and intimacy on her podcast Intimate Details with Doctor Tiff. 47 00:03:13,080 --> 00:03:16,519 Speaker 1: If something resonates with you while enjoying our conversation, please 48 00:03:16,560 --> 00:03:19,959 Speaker 1: share with us on social media using the hashtag TBG 49 00:03:20,200 --> 00:03:26,840 Speaker 1: in session. Here's our conversation. Thank you so much for 50 00:03:26,960 --> 00:03:28,360 Speaker 1: joining me today, doctor Tiff. 51 00:03:29,120 --> 00:03:31,640 Speaker 2: Thank you so much for having me. It is truly 52 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:33,880 Speaker 2: an honor and a pleasure to be here, to be 53 00:03:33,919 --> 00:03:36,760 Speaker 2: in your presence, and just to be able to talk 54 00:03:37,360 --> 00:03:40,880 Speaker 2: about all of the things, just mental health in general 55 00:03:41,000 --> 00:03:45,119 Speaker 2: amongst our folk, and to be able to really sit 56 00:03:45,200 --> 00:03:49,560 Speaker 2: down with you is honestly a pleasure of blessing everything. 57 00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:52,720 Speaker 2: So I'm here for the duration. Whatever you need, whatever 58 00:03:52,760 --> 00:03:55,560 Speaker 2: I have, it is yours, it is your audiences. Just 59 00:03:55,840 --> 00:03:57,280 Speaker 2: thank you so much for having me. 60 00:03:57,640 --> 00:04:00,320 Speaker 1: No, thank you for joining me. So I always loves 61 00:04:00,320 --> 00:04:02,800 Speaker 1: to hear like the backstory of like how you got here. 62 00:04:03,400 --> 00:04:06,480 Speaker 1: This is a huge question, right but specifically as it 63 00:04:06,520 --> 00:04:09,880 Speaker 1: relates to like psychology, like how did you find yourself 64 00:04:10,280 --> 00:04:13,840 Speaker 1: in psychology and also exploring your doctorate in human sexuality? 65 00:04:14,400 --> 00:04:18,080 Speaker 2: Man, First of all, research you've done it. I spent 66 00:04:18,160 --> 00:04:20,840 Speaker 2: the morning writing okay today and I'm going to get 67 00:04:20,839 --> 00:04:22,680 Speaker 2: to the backstory. But I did spend the morning writing 68 00:04:22,800 --> 00:04:27,479 Speaker 2: something for my podcast about purpose and about how we 69 00:04:27,680 --> 00:04:31,599 Speaker 2: sometimes are waiting on purpose and trying to find purpose 70 00:04:31,880 --> 00:04:33,680 Speaker 2: and trying to figure it out. And a lot of 71 00:04:33,680 --> 00:04:36,880 Speaker 2: it has to do with us searching for what we 72 00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:42,440 Speaker 2: want as opposed to asking God about what he wants 73 00:04:42,440 --> 00:04:46,000 Speaker 2: for us. So that'll come later, but in that I 74 00:04:46,040 --> 00:04:50,479 Speaker 2: think I got started looking for what I wanted. So 75 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:52,560 Speaker 2: when I went to college, I went to undergrad it 76 00:04:52,680 --> 00:04:55,600 Speaker 2: University of North Carolina and Charlotte, and I did not 77 00:04:55,880 --> 00:04:58,800 Speaker 2: know what I wanted to major in. I would totally 78 00:04:58,800 --> 00:05:01,440 Speaker 2: do it differently, just being honest, I would totally do 79 00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:03,400 Speaker 2: it differently if I had to do it all over again, 80 00:05:03,440 --> 00:05:05,680 Speaker 2: but did not know what I wanted to do. Talk 81 00:05:05,760 --> 00:05:07,440 Speaker 2: to my dad about it, and he was like, well, 82 00:05:07,480 --> 00:05:09,920 Speaker 2: you know, I think you should do psychology, Like you're 83 00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:12,520 Speaker 2: really good and listening to people and helping people figure 84 00:05:12,520 --> 00:05:14,840 Speaker 2: things out and blah blah blah. So I'm like, okay, 85 00:05:15,040 --> 00:05:17,320 Speaker 2: i'll do it. I'll try it. Got like a D 86 00:05:17,520 --> 00:05:20,400 Speaker 2: or an F in my first class, so I was like, 87 00:05:20,440 --> 00:05:25,719 Speaker 2: you know what I'm supposed to be doing. But turns 88 00:05:25,760 --> 00:05:29,880 Speaker 2: out I believe that like any general class, and anybody 89 00:05:29,880 --> 00:05:32,479 Speaker 2: that's gone into an undergraduate program kind of knows, those 90 00:05:32,520 --> 00:05:36,400 Speaker 2: general classes they throw everything at you, right, So you're 91 00:05:36,440 --> 00:05:42,080 Speaker 2: talking abnormal, you're talking general disorders, and you're thinking about 92 00:05:42,160 --> 00:05:45,000 Speaker 2: all of these broad concepts and all of the key 93 00:05:45,080 --> 00:05:50,359 Speaker 2: players in the history of that field. And it was 94 00:05:50,400 --> 00:05:53,560 Speaker 2: just very overwhelming for me. So he's like, take another class, 95 00:05:53,600 --> 00:05:55,560 Speaker 2: see you know in my stick. And then I started 96 00:05:55,560 --> 00:05:57,680 Speaker 2: getting a's and b's, a's and b's, a's and b's, 97 00:05:57,839 --> 00:06:00,960 Speaker 2: and so I was like, oh okay. Eventually, just so 98 00:06:01,120 --> 00:06:03,200 Speaker 2: that everybody knows, I did go back and take the 99 00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:06,719 Speaker 2: class again and got an A after the fact. But 100 00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:10,200 Speaker 2: that's how I got into psychology. This was also at 101 00:06:10,240 --> 00:06:12,720 Speaker 2: a time now I'm going to date myself. I graduated 102 00:06:12,720 --> 00:06:18,120 Speaker 2: from college in ninety eight. In ninety eight, so this 103 00:06:18,320 --> 00:06:22,480 Speaker 2: was the time of doctor Drew having love lines. This 104 00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:25,800 Speaker 2: was a time doctor Ruth was in her bag. Doctor 105 00:06:25,839 --> 00:06:30,120 Speaker 2: Sujo Hansen was on the old Oxygen Network and she 106 00:06:30,279 --> 00:06:32,839 Speaker 2: was doing her thing, and I'm like, Wow, this seems 107 00:06:32,920 --> 00:06:36,200 Speaker 2: like an area of expertise that I would really want 108 00:06:36,240 --> 00:06:38,599 Speaker 2: to do. I really want to do sex therapy. But 109 00:06:38,800 --> 00:06:42,200 Speaker 2: also at the time, sex therapy seemed a little bit kookie. 110 00:06:42,240 --> 00:06:45,040 Speaker 2: There was we weren't. I didn't know anyone that looked 111 00:06:45,040 --> 00:06:48,160 Speaker 2: like us that was doing it, and I didn't know 112 00:06:48,200 --> 00:06:50,960 Speaker 2: if it was gonna stick. I did know that no 113 00:06:51,040 --> 00:06:53,760 Speaker 2: matter what psychology was going to I was going to 114 00:06:53,839 --> 00:06:57,800 Speaker 2: have a job. Okay, my mom worked in community mental health, 115 00:06:58,320 --> 00:07:02,000 Speaker 2: Like I knew that above all, psychology would be there 116 00:07:02,000 --> 00:07:04,440 Speaker 2: for me. So I was like, I'll specialize in this, 117 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:07,560 Speaker 2: but I'll always have psychology to fall back on, which 118 00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:09,680 Speaker 2: is a weird way of thinking about it. So I 119 00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:14,080 Speaker 2: minored in women's studies and then once I, you know, 120 00:07:14,200 --> 00:07:19,520 Speaker 2: did that, I really found that my niche was human 121 00:07:19,560 --> 00:07:24,320 Speaker 2: sexuality and women's sexuality. It was very easy for me 122 00:07:24,400 --> 00:07:27,040 Speaker 2: to talk about It was very easy for me to 123 00:07:27,200 --> 00:07:30,720 Speaker 2: understand and explain to people, to make people feel comfortable 124 00:07:30,760 --> 00:07:33,520 Speaker 2: talking to me about those things. So that was how 125 00:07:33,560 --> 00:07:35,680 Speaker 2: I got into it. I got the Masters in psychology 126 00:07:35,760 --> 00:07:38,000 Speaker 2: and then I went on for my doctorate in human 127 00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:43,600 Speaker 2: sexuality education from Widner University and that's how I got 128 00:07:44,280 --> 00:07:45,640 Speaker 2: to be a sex therapist. 129 00:07:45,880 --> 00:07:48,080 Speaker 1: So I feel like we are kindred spirits in that, 130 00:07:48,160 --> 00:07:53,480 Speaker 1: like the Loveland I mean the love line Sujohansen Oxygen like, 131 00:07:53,480 --> 00:07:54,920 Speaker 1: I feel like that is where a lot of us 132 00:07:54,960 --> 00:07:58,120 Speaker 1: first saw therapists show up on TV and like in 133 00:07:58,240 --> 00:08:02,560 Speaker 1: pop culture. So doctor kil Wyatt on the Oprah Show 134 00:08:02,680 --> 00:08:04,720 Speaker 1: was the first time I had seen like a black 135 00:08:04,760 --> 00:08:07,960 Speaker 1: woman mental health professional show up. Who was that for you? 136 00:08:08,120 --> 00:08:09,520 Speaker 1: Was it doctor Wyatt or someone else? 137 00:08:09,800 --> 00:08:13,280 Speaker 2: Oh? Who was it for me? You know what I think? 138 00:08:13,440 --> 00:08:16,880 Speaker 2: For me? It was It's it was different. It was 139 00:08:17,040 --> 00:08:20,600 Speaker 2: a therapist. Wow, it was a therapist that taught me. 140 00:08:20,720 --> 00:08:24,520 Speaker 2: She taught me abnormal psych Her name is doctor Joyce 141 00:08:24,600 --> 00:08:29,400 Speaker 2: Morley Ball. She's here in Atlanta, and she's a black, 142 00:08:29,680 --> 00:08:34,079 Speaker 2: ball headed woman who just owned whatever space she entered into. 143 00:08:34,360 --> 00:08:37,400 Speaker 2: I think doctor Ball does do some television, but I don't. 144 00:08:37,440 --> 00:08:40,000 Speaker 2: I that's not where I got her. She was when 145 00:08:40,040 --> 00:08:42,560 Speaker 2: I saw her and saw how she held the space 146 00:08:43,320 --> 00:08:46,720 Speaker 2: especially for black women. And I don't know that she 147 00:08:46,760 --> 00:08:50,320 Speaker 2: was intentional about that, but I gravitated towards her. It 148 00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:53,640 Speaker 2: was the hardest class in my master's program, probably the 149 00:08:53,679 --> 00:08:55,720 Speaker 2: only class that I got like a B in, But 150 00:08:55,880 --> 00:08:58,440 Speaker 2: I was thankful for that B because she worked me 151 00:08:58,880 --> 00:09:01,160 Speaker 2: over and I learned so much from her. She really 152 00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:05,880 Speaker 2: commanded that we understand the material, that we strive for excellence, 153 00:09:05,920 --> 00:09:08,640 Speaker 2: and that we really get down and dirty with our clients. 154 00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:11,720 Speaker 2: I think from her I learned a lot about, or 155 00:09:11,960 --> 00:09:15,720 Speaker 2: more about not being afraid to ask the tough questions 156 00:09:15,960 --> 00:09:21,319 Speaker 2: and to really look underneath things, to really be curious, 157 00:09:21,400 --> 00:09:24,040 Speaker 2: and that people are just layered. And one thing that 158 00:09:24,120 --> 00:09:26,319 Speaker 2: I did learn from her, I remember her saying very 159 00:09:26,360 --> 00:09:29,480 Speaker 2: vividly that like you were, not your diagnosis. And that 160 00:09:29,520 --> 00:09:32,559 Speaker 2: has always stuck with me because I remember, like I said, 161 00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:35,400 Speaker 2: my mom worked in she was an admin assistant in 162 00:09:35,440 --> 00:09:40,199 Speaker 2: community mental health when I was younger, and I remember 163 00:09:40,679 --> 00:09:45,920 Speaker 2: people calling people schizophrenic, like he's a schizophrenic, or she's bipolar, 164 00:09:46,160 --> 00:09:50,199 Speaker 2: she's whatever. And I remember doctor Ball one day said 165 00:09:50,280 --> 00:09:54,800 Speaker 2: this is a person with schizophrenia, this is a person 166 00:09:55,480 --> 00:09:58,320 Speaker 2: with bipolar disorder. And that was so important to me 167 00:09:58,360 --> 00:10:01,200 Speaker 2: and really profound, and I spread that message to people 168 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:03,320 Speaker 2: that I talk to, people that I work with that 169 00:10:03,440 --> 00:10:06,640 Speaker 2: we are not our diagnosis. And it's so hard when 170 00:10:06,679 --> 00:10:09,520 Speaker 2: you assume that or if other people put that on you. 171 00:10:10,000 --> 00:10:12,920 Speaker 2: But no, you're a person who has symptoms that are 172 00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:17,440 Speaker 2: characteristic of a diagnosis. You are still a person. And 173 00:10:17,480 --> 00:10:19,480 Speaker 2: so my hope is that in all the work that 174 00:10:19,520 --> 00:10:22,679 Speaker 2: I do, that I am people first, that I let 175 00:10:22,760 --> 00:10:27,000 Speaker 2: people know that they are people first, and we can 176 00:10:27,120 --> 00:10:31,800 Speaker 2: deal with and work through the elements that come with 177 00:10:32,040 --> 00:10:35,319 Speaker 2: you as a person and whatever diagnosis you may have. 178 00:10:36,800 --> 00:10:39,120 Speaker 1: So one of the many incredible things that you do 179 00:10:39,400 --> 00:10:42,520 Speaker 1: is working as an intimacy coordinator. So I wonder if 180 00:10:42,559 --> 00:10:44,800 Speaker 1: you can define what that is and like what your 181 00:10:44,840 --> 00:10:47,440 Speaker 1: work is there, and talk about the history of that 182 00:10:47,559 --> 00:10:51,120 Speaker 1: field and like how long intimacy coordinators have actually been 183 00:10:51,120 --> 00:10:52,160 Speaker 1: a part of productions. 184 00:10:52,480 --> 00:10:54,720 Speaker 2: As an intimacy coordinator, when someone asked me what it 185 00:10:54,760 --> 00:10:57,200 Speaker 2: is that I do or what that means, I just 186 00:10:57,240 --> 00:10:59,439 Speaker 2: had to say this. In Costco the other day, someone 187 00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:02,920 Speaker 2: asks me what this was, what it was. The way 188 00:11:02,920 --> 00:11:07,480 Speaker 2: that I explain it is I help actors and productions 189 00:11:08,080 --> 00:11:13,440 Speaker 2: when they have scenes that have nudity or simulated sex. 190 00:11:13,800 --> 00:11:17,160 Speaker 2: I come in and I help make that set safe. 191 00:11:17,240 --> 00:11:20,160 Speaker 2: I make the actors feel safe and I assist the 192 00:11:20,240 --> 00:11:23,839 Speaker 2: production in making sure that we ensure that the set 193 00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:27,880 Speaker 2: is safe. And what that looks like is going through 194 00:11:27,920 --> 00:11:31,080 Speaker 2: all the scripting. I go through with a fine tooth 195 00:11:31,160 --> 00:11:34,920 Speaker 2: comb and weed out any scenes that I think will 196 00:11:34,960 --> 00:11:39,200 Speaker 2: have some sort of intimacy, some level of intimacy. Now, 197 00:11:39,600 --> 00:11:42,680 Speaker 2: sometimes it requires that I'm there for just a kiss, 198 00:11:42,760 --> 00:11:47,560 Speaker 2: most times not, but I'm looking for, okay, beyond just 199 00:11:47,600 --> 00:11:52,359 Speaker 2: a kiss, right body touches, any kind of sexual stimulation 200 00:11:52,520 --> 00:11:58,320 Speaker 2: or simulated sexual stimulation, and of course nudity, and so 201 00:11:58,720 --> 00:12:01,080 Speaker 2: I'm looking for those things. I meet with the director 202 00:12:01,280 --> 00:12:03,480 Speaker 2: to make sure I understand their vision. Then I meet 203 00:12:03,480 --> 00:12:06,360 Speaker 2: with the actors and I go over that vision, but 204 00:12:06,400 --> 00:12:10,600 Speaker 2: I also get their consents or their concerns and see 205 00:12:10,600 --> 00:12:14,000 Speaker 2: what they're comfortable with. Just because a director may have 206 00:12:14,240 --> 00:12:16,600 Speaker 2: a vision for what they want to see, it doesn't 207 00:12:16,640 --> 00:12:20,720 Speaker 2: necessarily mean that the actor themselves is comfortable with portraying 208 00:12:20,760 --> 00:12:24,720 Speaker 2: it in that way, and so it becomes not necessarily 209 00:12:24,800 --> 00:12:27,800 Speaker 2: a negotiation. But we figure out what the actor is 210 00:12:27,800 --> 00:12:30,640 Speaker 2: comfortable with. We put that in a legal form called 211 00:12:30,640 --> 00:12:33,800 Speaker 2: a writer, which is what is expected of them and 212 00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:36,680 Speaker 2: what they say that they will do on the day 213 00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:41,320 Speaker 2: that we film. But ultimately people have agency and autonomy, 214 00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:44,360 Speaker 2: which is what I like, and they are able to 215 00:12:44,480 --> 00:12:47,680 Speaker 2: change their minds. So if on the day, let's say 216 00:12:47,720 --> 00:12:49,920 Speaker 2: I met with an actor two weeks ago, and on 217 00:12:49,960 --> 00:12:52,079 Speaker 2: the day that we are filming, they are no longer 218 00:12:52,120 --> 00:12:55,520 Speaker 2: comfortable with being touched in a certain way or exposing 219 00:12:55,559 --> 00:12:58,880 Speaker 2: a certain body part, they can amend that writer or 220 00:12:58,960 --> 00:13:01,920 Speaker 2: change that writer. They can less than what's on the writer. 221 00:13:02,120 --> 00:13:03,719 Speaker 2: We have to get a new writer if they want 222 00:13:03,760 --> 00:13:05,800 Speaker 2: to do more. And then just making sure that the 223 00:13:05,840 --> 00:13:09,360 Speaker 2: set is safe, that no more people are on set 224 00:13:09,360 --> 00:13:11,640 Speaker 2: that day that need to be on the set, that 225 00:13:12,040 --> 00:13:14,800 Speaker 2: you just don't have curious people there just to look 226 00:13:14,840 --> 00:13:17,920 Speaker 2: and gok at someone when they're in their most vulnerable state, 227 00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:21,640 Speaker 2: and making sure that they just continue to feel safe 228 00:13:21,640 --> 00:13:24,679 Speaker 2: throughout that process. So that's what I do as an 229 00:13:24,679 --> 00:13:29,400 Speaker 2: intimacy coordinator. I started doing intimacy coordination right around COVID, 230 00:13:29,400 --> 00:13:33,000 Speaker 2: which was an awful time to start doing it, but 231 00:13:33,200 --> 00:13:36,120 Speaker 2: it was very necessary for me. A little bit of 232 00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:43,120 Speaker 2: backstory on just how I navigated this. I've been doing therapy. 233 00:13:43,360 --> 00:13:46,600 Speaker 2: I've been in private practice since I graduated from my 234 00:13:46,640 --> 00:13:49,280 Speaker 2: master's program in two thousand and so Right after that, 235 00:13:49,360 --> 00:13:51,600 Speaker 2: I'd been doing work in hospitals and things like that. 236 00:13:51,880 --> 00:13:56,000 Speaker 2: I officially started private practice in six I'm old. I 237 00:13:56,040 --> 00:14:00,960 Speaker 2: officially started private practice in six and also then started 238 00:14:01,000 --> 00:14:04,200 Speaker 2: doing television show. I would get invited to do reality shows. 239 00:14:04,320 --> 00:14:07,600 Speaker 2: I hosted a daytime talk show for ABC and done 240 00:14:07,600 --> 00:14:11,240 Speaker 2: a nighttimes talk show for TLC, and had done a 241 00:14:11,240 --> 00:14:13,160 Speaker 2: lot of stuff in front of the camera, which I 242 00:14:13,240 --> 00:14:18,480 Speaker 2: really love, but at the same time felt as though 243 00:14:19,720 --> 00:14:22,280 Speaker 2: I didn't have as much control over the work that 244 00:14:22,360 --> 00:14:25,640 Speaker 2: I was being asked to do. I was beholding to 245 00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:28,520 Speaker 2: someone calling me and saying, Hey, we have this article 246 00:14:28,560 --> 00:14:30,280 Speaker 2: that just came out, would you like to comment on it, 247 00:14:30,400 --> 00:14:35,200 Speaker 2: Or we have this celebrity that needs counseling on television, 248 00:14:35,320 --> 00:14:37,400 Speaker 2: so can you come in and do it. I'm waiting 249 00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:40,840 Speaker 2: on a call. And I really wanted to create some 250 00:14:40,960 --> 00:14:43,960 Speaker 2: of my own stuff, and so I had worked with 251 00:14:44,360 --> 00:14:47,040 Speaker 2: a major network. I've had a couple of development deals 252 00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:49,880 Speaker 2: with networks, but this one in particular, it tied me 253 00:14:50,040 --> 00:14:54,240 Speaker 2: up for about two and a half three years where 254 00:14:54,280 --> 00:14:57,480 Speaker 2: we were developing a talk show. We were developing and development, 255 00:14:57,560 --> 00:14:59,600 Speaker 2: we shot pilots, We had done all these things, and 256 00:14:59,640 --> 00:15:02,120 Speaker 2: then people would leave networks, and so then you have 257 00:15:02,200 --> 00:15:04,680 Speaker 2: to repitch your idea to the new people to come in, 258 00:15:04,760 --> 00:15:07,200 Speaker 2: and then money changes. It was big thing and so 259 00:15:07,960 --> 00:15:11,600 Speaker 2: but also during that time while you're on hold, if 260 00:15:11,600 --> 00:15:14,200 Speaker 2: you have a good agent, they will make sure that 261 00:15:14,240 --> 00:15:18,240 Speaker 2: you are fairly compensated for taking that time. Because I 262 00:15:18,240 --> 00:15:20,880 Speaker 2: couldn't work on any other projects while I was in 263 00:15:20,920 --> 00:15:24,840 Speaker 2: development with this particular network, So I took that money, 264 00:15:25,800 --> 00:15:28,680 Speaker 2: saved a lot of it, but I use that to 265 00:15:28,920 --> 00:15:34,280 Speaker 2: fund my certification to become an intimacy coordinator. So I 266 00:15:34,360 --> 00:15:36,120 Speaker 2: use the money that I was waiting on to do 267 00:15:36,160 --> 00:15:38,200 Speaker 2: this next thing because it was going to allow me 268 00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:41,840 Speaker 2: to be behind the camera and learn more about this 269 00:15:41,960 --> 00:15:45,280 Speaker 2: industry that I wanted to be in and also do 270 00:15:45,360 --> 00:15:48,280 Speaker 2: the thing that I'd been doing already. Intimacy coordination is 271 00:15:48,320 --> 00:15:52,560 Speaker 2: such a compilation, a good compilation of my work as 272 00:15:52,560 --> 00:15:59,520 Speaker 2: a therapist, my education in sexuality. It just made so 273 00:15:59,640 --> 00:16:04,240 Speaker 2: much since it checked off all the boxes. So that's 274 00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:07,120 Speaker 2: how I got in it. And then this field has 275 00:16:07,160 --> 00:16:10,360 Speaker 2: been around for a while. I think some of the 276 00:16:10,440 --> 00:16:16,320 Speaker 2: earlier shows to use intimacy coordinators would be like Euphoria 277 00:16:16,760 --> 00:16:20,600 Speaker 2: in Khana Hbo. Hbo was one of the first, I think, 278 00:16:20,680 --> 00:16:23,720 Speaker 2: to make it a thing that with all of our 279 00:16:23,760 --> 00:16:26,600 Speaker 2: productions that have intimacy, we're going to have an intimacy coordinator. 280 00:16:27,320 --> 00:16:31,160 Speaker 2: I think what made it stick though, was the me 281 00:16:31,240 --> 00:16:34,640 Speaker 2: too movement, as you remember, and this was all with 282 00:16:34,800 --> 00:16:38,520 Speaker 2: like the Harvey Weinstein stuff. There were several allegations of 283 00:16:38,840 --> 00:16:43,600 Speaker 2: people insisting that people do things that they hadn't agreed on, 284 00:16:43,920 --> 00:16:46,600 Speaker 2: in actors feeling as though if they didn't they would 285 00:16:46,640 --> 00:16:49,360 Speaker 2: lose their job or they would lose their their ability 286 00:16:49,400 --> 00:16:52,280 Speaker 2: to work. Like the casting couch didn't become just this 287 00:16:52,400 --> 00:16:55,040 Speaker 2: mythical thing that we had always heard about. It was real. 288 00:16:55,520 --> 00:16:58,760 Speaker 2: People were showing up day of and being like, yeah, 289 00:16:58,800 --> 00:17:01,080 Speaker 2: you know, I knew that you agreed to do this 290 00:17:01,160 --> 00:17:03,320 Speaker 2: with the bra on, but let's just see how it 291 00:17:03,400 --> 00:17:07,479 Speaker 2: is with your bra off. That cannot happen today. And 292 00:17:07,520 --> 00:17:10,840 Speaker 2: that's why intimacy coordinators are there. I think before people 293 00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:13,240 Speaker 2: would even do that in audition. So they would bring 294 00:17:13,280 --> 00:17:16,680 Speaker 2: them there for an audition and have them act out 295 00:17:16,920 --> 00:17:19,520 Speaker 2: an intimate scene with someone that they don't even know. 296 00:17:19,560 --> 00:17:22,159 Speaker 2: And that's just not the way that actors should be treated, 297 00:17:22,240 --> 00:17:24,919 Speaker 2: that we should be handling this type of work because 298 00:17:25,000 --> 00:17:28,680 Speaker 2: it is really challenging, and people need to have autonomy 299 00:17:28,720 --> 00:17:31,680 Speaker 2: and agency over the things that they agree to do 300 00:17:31,760 --> 00:17:34,119 Speaker 2: and know that when they walk on set that no 301 00:17:34,160 --> 00:17:36,199 Speaker 2: one's going to be asking them to do something that 302 00:17:36,240 --> 00:17:40,600 Speaker 2: they aren't prepared to do and aren't willing to do. So, yeah, 303 00:17:40,720 --> 00:17:42,359 Speaker 2: that's kind of how that all came about. 304 00:17:42,640 --> 00:17:45,000 Speaker 1: So you mentioned certification, so you use some of your 305 00:17:45,080 --> 00:17:47,440 Speaker 1: money to get certified. So it talk to me about 306 00:17:47,480 --> 00:17:50,640 Speaker 1: the certification process to become an intimacy coordinator. 307 00:17:51,160 --> 00:17:56,760 Speaker 2: So I did mine with IPA, which is Intimacy Professionals Association. 308 00:17:57,320 --> 00:18:00,720 Speaker 2: I have to think about the acronym and out there 309 00:18:00,800 --> 00:18:04,880 Speaker 2: IDC is another. There are several. Each program is very different. 310 00:18:05,400 --> 00:18:09,040 Speaker 2: There's a set curriculum of things that you really do 311 00:18:09,119 --> 00:18:13,320 Speaker 2: need to know in order to become an intimacy coordinator. 312 00:18:13,440 --> 00:18:15,000 Speaker 2: Is not a mandate that you need to be a 313 00:18:15,080 --> 00:18:18,240 Speaker 2: therapist or a sex therapist or anything like that. Many 314 00:18:18,280 --> 00:18:21,840 Speaker 2: intimacy coordinators maybe come from different fields. We have a 315 00:18:21,840 --> 00:18:25,240 Speaker 2: lot of intimacy coordinators that are also stump performers and 316 00:18:25,359 --> 00:18:28,720 Speaker 2: actors or have acted in the past and had a 317 00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:31,840 Speaker 2: great intimacy coordinator or a need for one and decided, hey, 318 00:18:31,880 --> 00:18:34,840 Speaker 2: I already know what one half of being on set is, 319 00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:37,280 Speaker 2: Like I'd love to learn this. We've had a lot 320 00:18:37,280 --> 00:18:41,400 Speaker 2: of people who are costumers or pas who become intimacy coordinators. 321 00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:47,320 Speaker 2: You have to have a love for love of detail, 322 00:18:47,480 --> 00:18:52,159 Speaker 2: for sure, but of really wanting to make people feel 323 00:18:52,160 --> 00:18:55,399 Speaker 2: comfortable and safe and to advocate for them. And I 324 00:18:55,400 --> 00:18:58,160 Speaker 2: think we as therapists, I feel like we're perfectly positioned 325 00:18:58,160 --> 00:18:59,919 Speaker 2: in that area and that we are used to do 326 00:19:00,080 --> 00:19:02,280 Speaker 2: and that we're used to talking to people about difficult things. 327 00:19:02,800 --> 00:19:06,679 Speaker 2: We're used to listening very well and parenting back what 328 00:19:06,800 --> 00:19:08,560 Speaker 2: they've said to you to make sure that we're clear. 329 00:19:08,960 --> 00:19:12,040 Speaker 2: We're good at communicating those things to other people, and 330 00:19:12,080 --> 00:19:14,400 Speaker 2: then just standing in the gap and making sure that 331 00:19:14,520 --> 00:19:17,760 Speaker 2: what they need we can advocate for them. The process 332 00:19:18,160 --> 00:19:20,760 Speaker 2: was for me the way that I did it because, 333 00:19:20,760 --> 00:19:22,840 Speaker 2: like I said, I did it right at the beginning 334 00:19:23,040 --> 00:19:25,879 Speaker 2: of COVID. I might have started right before COVID, but 335 00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:28,040 Speaker 2: I know I'm pretty sure that COVID was part of it. 336 00:19:28,560 --> 00:19:31,760 Speaker 2: So we did a lot of it virtual where we 337 00:19:32,160 --> 00:19:36,240 Speaker 2: talked about all levels of the film industry, like everywhere 338 00:19:36,240 --> 00:19:38,800 Speaker 2: that we could possibly work, whether that is on stage 339 00:19:38,920 --> 00:19:43,119 Speaker 2: for like plays, short films, television. All of that we 340 00:19:43,240 --> 00:19:45,040 Speaker 2: talked a lot about and did a lot of education 341 00:19:45,119 --> 00:19:48,600 Speaker 2: on boundaries. Consent was a big part of it, how 342 00:19:48,640 --> 00:19:51,160 Speaker 2: things are shot. I remember one of the most helpful 343 00:19:51,200 --> 00:19:53,840 Speaker 2: parts was just like and I'd been on sets before, 344 00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:55,280 Speaker 2: but like I said, I was doing a lot of 345 00:19:55,400 --> 00:19:57,000 Speaker 2: in front of the camera work. I wasn't doing a 346 00:19:57,040 --> 00:19:59,919 Speaker 2: lot of behind the scenes work. So learning about screen 347 00:20:00,119 --> 00:20:03,119 Speaker 2: terminology and the things that would be said, like what 348 00:20:03,160 --> 00:20:06,399 Speaker 2: it means, like how to read a call sheet, how 349 00:20:06,440 --> 00:20:09,359 Speaker 2: to like who to go to when you need certain 350 00:20:09,400 --> 00:20:12,480 Speaker 2: things done on set, who to email, how to email like, 351 00:20:12,560 --> 00:20:17,280 Speaker 2: how to build a resume specific for this type of work. 352 00:20:17,359 --> 00:20:19,639 Speaker 2: So we went through kind of everything, and then some 353 00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:22,960 Speaker 2: of it was very practical. How to stage things so 354 00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:26,840 Speaker 2: that it looks very real on camera even though those 355 00:20:26,880 --> 00:20:30,960 Speaker 2: things aren't really happening. When I say simulated sex, sometimes 356 00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:35,719 Speaker 2: when we look at intimate scenes on TV, they look 357 00:20:36,720 --> 00:20:41,040 Speaker 2: very real, and these are some really good actors doing 358 00:20:41,119 --> 00:20:45,400 Speaker 2: some really intimate things, but it is simulated unless you're 359 00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:48,760 Speaker 2: watching something like porn. I would say, more often than not, 360 00:20:49,080 --> 00:20:51,879 Speaker 2: these things are not happening in real life, but we 361 00:20:51,960 --> 00:20:53,879 Speaker 2: make it look that way. And so a lot of 362 00:20:53,880 --> 00:20:57,359 Speaker 2: the training is about how to get certain angles and 363 00:20:57,400 --> 00:20:59,600 Speaker 2: knowing if it's a wide shot what we can get 364 00:20:59,680 --> 00:21:02,560 Speaker 2: versus if it's close up or a cowboy, and like 365 00:21:02,960 --> 00:21:07,160 Speaker 2: how to block using maybe someone's arm. I had a 366 00:21:07,160 --> 00:21:10,320 Speaker 2: actor the other day She's okay with her breast being shown, 367 00:21:10,400 --> 00:21:13,040 Speaker 2: but not her nipple, And so how do you show 368 00:21:13,080 --> 00:21:17,199 Speaker 2: a breast without showing a nipple and without showing the 369 00:21:17,280 --> 00:21:19,199 Speaker 2: nipple cover that's going to be on it. And so 370 00:21:19,320 --> 00:21:23,160 Speaker 2: you have to know how to block that with different 371 00:21:23,280 --> 00:21:26,639 Speaker 2: areas of the body or with another person or with 372 00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:30,840 Speaker 2: a prop or something like that. How to make sex 373 00:21:31,040 --> 00:21:35,840 Speaker 2: look real when penetration is absolutely not happening, when barriers 374 00:21:35,880 --> 00:21:38,560 Speaker 2: are in place so that that isn't happening. And then 375 00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:42,119 Speaker 2: also we know, as human beings, our body responds in 376 00:21:42,200 --> 00:21:45,600 Speaker 2: ways that maybe we don't want it to at certain times. 377 00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:49,800 Speaker 2: So there definitely are times when there's a scene going 378 00:21:49,880 --> 00:21:53,359 Speaker 2: on and two actors are doing their best to be 379 00:21:53,400 --> 00:21:57,560 Speaker 2: as professional as possible, and that doesn't mean that someone's 380 00:21:58,119 --> 00:22:00,920 Speaker 2: penis might not do something that they don't want it 381 00:22:00,960 --> 00:22:03,600 Speaker 2: to do, might get hard in a way, and so 382 00:22:03,680 --> 00:22:05,639 Speaker 2: we have to pull back. I have to be able 383 00:22:05,680 --> 00:22:08,399 Speaker 2: to give that person time and give them space, make 384 00:22:08,440 --> 00:22:11,560 Speaker 2: sure barriers are in place. I use things like these 385 00:22:11,640 --> 00:22:14,760 Speaker 2: yoga balls that I don't fully inflate, but it'll give 386 00:22:14,880 --> 00:22:17,920 Speaker 2: like this much of a padding in between them so 387 00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:19,840 Speaker 2: they can be on top of each other. The ball 388 00:22:19,880 --> 00:22:23,200 Speaker 2: is squished, you'll never see it, but it allows them 389 00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:25,800 Speaker 2: to move in a way that makes it look as 390 00:22:25,800 --> 00:22:29,240 Speaker 2: though they're having sex, but also provides a lot more 391 00:22:29,280 --> 00:22:33,119 Speaker 2: padding there and they're never touching each other. So little 392 00:22:33,119 --> 00:22:35,560 Speaker 2: things like that that you don't necessarily know or think about. 393 00:22:35,880 --> 00:22:38,040 Speaker 2: Thus the type of training that you get and you 394 00:22:38,200 --> 00:22:40,720 Speaker 2: just have this. I have this massive bag over here 395 00:22:40,800 --> 00:22:45,399 Speaker 2: that is just like a toolkit for all of the 396 00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:47,439 Speaker 2: things that could possibly come up on said that we 397 00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:48,359 Speaker 2: just don't think. 398 00:22:48,200 --> 00:23:01,920 Speaker 1: About more from our conversation after the break. So where 399 00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:05,040 Speaker 1: are you actually standing on set? Like are you like 400 00:23:05,200 --> 00:23:07,359 Speaker 1: to the side of the director, Like, where are you 401 00:23:07,400 --> 00:23:08,800 Speaker 1: so that you can see what's happening? 402 00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:12,200 Speaker 2: It depends. Most often, I'm in at what we call 403 00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:14,480 Speaker 2: video village, and that is kind of a tent or 404 00:23:14,520 --> 00:23:17,920 Speaker 2: an area where there are screens that show me exactly 405 00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:20,679 Speaker 2: what the camera is filming. So I mentioned before that 406 00:23:20,720 --> 00:23:23,680 Speaker 2: there are writers that we have in place for each actor, 407 00:23:24,400 --> 00:23:26,800 Speaker 2: that really state like what they're agreeing to do or 408 00:23:26,840 --> 00:23:28,800 Speaker 2: what they're saying they will not do or don't want 409 00:23:28,840 --> 00:23:31,399 Speaker 2: to show. So I need to be in front of 410 00:23:31,440 --> 00:23:34,720 Speaker 2: a monitor because obviously the camera isn't getting the full 411 00:23:34,880 --> 00:23:37,040 Speaker 2: picture of what's going on in the room. They're getting 412 00:23:37,840 --> 00:23:39,960 Speaker 2: what they're zeroed in on, and so I need to 413 00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:44,679 Speaker 2: make sure that what they're filming is what we've indicated 414 00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:48,480 Speaker 2: that can film, so that we're not wasting footage on 415 00:23:48,600 --> 00:23:50,680 Speaker 2: something that we'll never be able to use because of 416 00:23:50,720 --> 00:23:52,680 Speaker 2: a writer. So I always like to be in front 417 00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:56,080 Speaker 2: of a camera monitor. Sometimes that monitor. Most often that 418 00:23:56,119 --> 00:23:59,040 Speaker 2: monitor is going to be outside of wherever it is 419 00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:02,760 Speaker 2: the set that they're filming on. Sometimes they will set 420 00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:06,240 Speaker 2: a monitor for me in the actual room where they're filming. 421 00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:08,480 Speaker 2: There have been times where I've been like, if we're 422 00:24:08,480 --> 00:24:12,720 Speaker 2: shooting in like a makeshift bedroom and there's like a 423 00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:15,400 Speaker 2: bathroom off to the side, a lot of times I'm 424 00:24:15,440 --> 00:24:19,120 Speaker 2: tucked in behind the door looking at a monitor where 425 00:24:19,160 --> 00:24:21,480 Speaker 2: you can't see me, but I can see everything that's 426 00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:25,760 Speaker 2: going on. I've even had instances where a couple they're 427 00:24:26,080 --> 00:24:28,399 Speaker 2: let's say they're supposed to be making love in bed 428 00:24:28,760 --> 00:24:31,000 Speaker 2: and all we have is like a sheet to kind 429 00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:33,960 Speaker 2: of shield areas that don't need to be seen. And 430 00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:35,560 Speaker 2: so a lot of times I'm just off to the 431 00:24:35,600 --> 00:24:37,840 Speaker 2: side so that I can tuck that sheet here, do this, 432 00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:40,800 Speaker 2: or pull this in this way so that those things 433 00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:44,359 Speaker 2: won't be seen. I'm very close by. I'm usually not 434 00:24:44,520 --> 00:24:47,080 Speaker 2: very far away, but sometimes I'm right in the room 435 00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:50,159 Speaker 2: and right next to them, and sometimes I'm outside of 436 00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:52,000 Speaker 2: the set but on at a monitor. 437 00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:55,040 Speaker 1: So you already mentioned doctor Tiff that part of your 438 00:24:55,119 --> 00:24:57,760 Speaker 1: job is going through the script with a fine toothed comb, like, okay, 439 00:24:57,840 --> 00:24:59,960 Speaker 1: all of the things that look like they could be intimate, 440 00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:03,320 Speaker 1: see anything. And so I wonder what is your definition 441 00:25:03,400 --> 00:25:05,800 Speaker 1: of intimacy, because I would imagine that could sometimes be 442 00:25:05,840 --> 00:25:08,719 Speaker 1: different than maybe with the director or the writer. It's thinking, 443 00:25:08,800 --> 00:25:10,440 Speaker 1: so what definition are you using. 444 00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:14,920 Speaker 2: My therapeutic definition of intimacy is emotional closeness and physical closeness. 445 00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:16,920 Speaker 2: I believe you need to have both of those things, 446 00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:20,720 Speaker 2: emotional closeness and physical closeness for true intimacy. So when 447 00:25:20,760 --> 00:25:23,600 Speaker 2: I work with people in private practice, that's what I'm 448 00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:26,000 Speaker 2: talking to them about. A lot of times they'll come 449 00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:27,840 Speaker 2: because of the physical stuff but we got to work 450 00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:31,960 Speaker 2: on the emotional stuff too. On set though, what they 451 00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:36,160 Speaker 2: are looking for help with and safety around is more 452 00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:42,800 Speaker 2: of the physical stuff. But my recommendation and coaching and 453 00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:48,560 Speaker 2: choreography usually tries to I usually try to add some 454 00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:51,040 Speaker 2: of those emotional elements because I know that's how we 455 00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:54,480 Speaker 2: tell the best story. I'll say. So I'll tell you 456 00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:58,399 Speaker 2: if I have someone that's let's say I have a 457 00:25:58,440 --> 00:26:01,920 Speaker 2: couple that we're trying to convey that the love making 458 00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:04,439 Speaker 2: that they're doing or the scene needs to be just 459 00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:09,080 Speaker 2: really passionate and it's a big reconciliation that they're really 460 00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:12,560 Speaker 2: hungry for each other. We'll choreograph that to be ferocious 461 00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:15,879 Speaker 2: or whatever. But I want to see intimacy in different ways. 462 00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:18,119 Speaker 2: Like I may want to see like a face caress, 463 00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:20,880 Speaker 2: So that's my note to like, let's put the hand 464 00:26:20,920 --> 00:26:23,359 Speaker 2: on the face, or let's get a shot of the 465 00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:26,080 Speaker 2: hand going down the small of her back, or when 466 00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:28,840 Speaker 2: you grab his arm instead of just moving it across, 467 00:26:28,920 --> 00:26:30,919 Speaker 2: let's make sure that we get a close up on 468 00:26:30,960 --> 00:26:33,760 Speaker 2: the hand and that they're grabbing. So there are other 469 00:26:33,920 --> 00:26:38,160 Speaker 2: things that we can do to show intimacy aside from 470 00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:43,280 Speaker 2: just the simulation of sex. There's touch, there is caressing, 471 00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:47,840 Speaker 2: there's kisses, gentle kisses, there's stroking in a different type 472 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,080 Speaker 2: of way. There's ways that you may be out coach 473 00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:53,520 Speaker 2: to arch your back in a certain way so that 474 00:26:53,640 --> 00:26:56,720 Speaker 2: I know that a feeling is happening. I've had several 475 00:26:56,720 --> 00:26:59,960 Speaker 2: scenes where I'm going to think of the most appropriate 476 00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:04,960 Speaker 2: way to say this manual stimulation was happening for someone, 477 00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:10,359 Speaker 2: but it obviously wasn't really happening right. And my note was, 478 00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:13,399 Speaker 2: even though this isn't really happening right, you see the 479 00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:16,760 Speaker 2: person's hand go down out of frame, there has to 480 00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:19,879 Speaker 2: be a point where the person that is receiving the 481 00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:24,240 Speaker 2: manual stimulation, I need to know that happened. And so 482 00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:26,400 Speaker 2: it's working with the actor to make sure, Okay, at 483 00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:29,560 Speaker 2: this point, let's make sure your upper body shows me 484 00:27:29,760 --> 00:27:33,359 Speaker 2: that something is happening below the frame and that like 485 00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:36,439 Speaker 2: you're enjoying it and what that is, what's happening for you. 486 00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:39,560 Speaker 2: So just making sure that people are into not just 487 00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:43,240 Speaker 2: with the act, but you know what that act brings 488 00:27:43,280 --> 00:27:47,320 Speaker 2: about in their bodies totally, and then that they're conveying 489 00:27:47,400 --> 00:27:50,359 Speaker 2: the emotional intimacy along with it. 490 00:27:51,320 --> 00:27:54,119 Speaker 1: So is there any conversation with the actors in a 491 00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:56,639 Speaker 1: scene kind of beforehand, like where you were almost like 492 00:27:56,680 --> 00:27:59,520 Speaker 1: doing maybe like a not a session, but like a okay, 493 00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:01,600 Speaker 1: let's get I know each other a little better, or like, 494 00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:04,000 Speaker 1: you know, how are you setting up? Are they just 495 00:28:04,040 --> 00:28:07,160 Speaker 1: going into this room cold with this stranger doing these 496 00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:08,240 Speaker 1: very intimate things. 497 00:28:08,640 --> 00:28:13,080 Speaker 2: Usually not for me. I will meet with them well 498 00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:17,840 Speaker 2: before the scene actually happens the first time. If it's 499 00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:21,000 Speaker 2: for a show. If you think about most shows having eight, ten, 500 00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:25,680 Speaker 2: twelve episodes, right, I'm meeting with them before the first episode. Hey, 501 00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:28,479 Speaker 2: it's me. I'm gonna be talking to you about all 502 00:28:28,520 --> 00:28:31,640 Speaker 2: of these things for introducing myself, getting into it with 503 00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:35,000 Speaker 2: with what the director wants for those first batch of episodes, 504 00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:38,160 Speaker 2: and then really getting to know them as a person, 505 00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:39,920 Speaker 2: what they like, what they don't. In one of my 506 00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:43,520 Speaker 2: more recent shows, I had an actress who is just like, 507 00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:46,640 Speaker 2: I don't care what's coming down. I'm never gonna want 508 00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:49,000 Speaker 2: to do tongue. That's just not gonna happen for me. 509 00:28:49,080 --> 00:28:50,280 Speaker 2: I know there are a lot of kissing scenes. I 510 00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:51,720 Speaker 2: on mind kissing, but I think we can do it 511 00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:54,640 Speaker 2: without tongue. I'm not trying to catch it, and I said, Okay, 512 00:28:54,800 --> 00:28:58,000 Speaker 2: that's fine. Doesn't stop me from asking her every time 513 00:28:58,080 --> 00:29:01,120 Speaker 2: because I have to, But I do know, like from 514 00:29:01,160 --> 00:29:04,240 Speaker 2: the jump, because we know each other, we have this understanding. Okay, 515 00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:07,400 Speaker 2: this is non negotiable for her. She's not gonna want 516 00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:09,920 Speaker 2: to do that. So I can talk to then my 517 00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:12,840 Speaker 2: director about like, look, based on our previous work, I 518 00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:15,120 Speaker 2: know that this actor will want to do this, won't 519 00:29:15,160 --> 00:29:18,600 Speaker 2: want to do that. We'll still have the conversation. But 520 00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:23,120 Speaker 2: I think it does take I think an episode or 521 00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:25,640 Speaker 2: two or a conversation or two to get to that 522 00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:28,760 Speaker 2: level of comfort, to where you just know your actors. 523 00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:32,080 Speaker 2: I say all that to say again, it doesn't mean 524 00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:37,280 Speaker 2: that you don't continue to ask the same question that 525 00:29:37,360 --> 00:29:43,800 Speaker 2: you've always asked. I will repeatedly ask about any kind 526 00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:48,160 Speaker 2: of touch boundaries or kiss boundaries that because as you 527 00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:51,520 Speaker 2: know as a therapist, people hold things in their bodies, 528 00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:54,720 Speaker 2: they hold trauma in many areas, and they hold just 529 00:29:54,840 --> 00:29:57,600 Speaker 2: memories of things that have happened to them, good and bad. 530 00:29:58,160 --> 00:30:00,480 Speaker 2: And we want to make sure that in each and 531 00:30:00,520 --> 00:30:04,000 Speaker 2: every scene and with each and every scene partner, things 532 00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:07,000 Speaker 2: can change over time. And just because I felt comfortable 533 00:30:07,040 --> 00:30:09,160 Speaker 2: kissing this person and the last scene doesn't mean I'm 534 00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:11,080 Speaker 2: going to be comfortable kissing them in the next scene. 535 00:30:11,600 --> 00:30:14,320 Speaker 2: Just because I allowed this actor to touch me in 536 00:30:14,360 --> 00:30:16,640 Speaker 2: this way doesn't mean I want that actor to touch 537 00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:20,320 Speaker 2: me in this way. And so we have to as 538 00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:22,480 Speaker 2: intimacy coordinators, get to a point where we can just 539 00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:26,920 Speaker 2: ask those questions and make sure that our actors understand. 540 00:30:27,040 --> 00:30:28,960 Speaker 2: I know, I just ask you this, but I got 541 00:30:28,960 --> 00:30:30,800 Speaker 2: to ask you again because we're talking about a whole 542 00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:34,440 Speaker 2: different scene and a whole different scenario. Is this still okay? 543 00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:37,160 Speaker 2: And I think that helps, Like that helps with everything. 544 00:30:37,200 --> 00:30:40,880 Speaker 2: I feel like our actors feel like, okay. Yes, it's 545 00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:43,440 Speaker 2: in saying that you're asking me the same question again, 546 00:30:43,520 --> 00:30:47,240 Speaker 2: but I'm glad because you're not just taking into account 547 00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:51,160 Speaker 2: or assuming that I'm okay with it every time, because 548 00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:53,160 Speaker 2: I'm on the off chance that I'm not. I want 549 00:30:53,160 --> 00:30:55,760 Speaker 2: to be able to say that right right, So. 550 00:30:55,800 --> 00:30:59,160 Speaker 1: Dutch Tiff, what does aftercare look like? Especially in scenes 551 00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:02,720 Speaker 1: where there may have in like them, sexual violence, aftercare 552 00:31:03,320 --> 00:31:04,200 Speaker 1: is going to be different. 553 00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:07,560 Speaker 2: Unfortunately, I will say this, after care is very different 554 00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:11,120 Speaker 2: based on in my perspective, based on the set and 555 00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:15,000 Speaker 2: the production there are some productions they are more open 556 00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:17,880 Speaker 2: to it than others. I've been very lucky to have 557 00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:21,640 Speaker 2: been on a few sets where it was prioritized and 558 00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:26,440 Speaker 2: thought about prior to filming. A lot of times, after 559 00:31:26,520 --> 00:31:29,560 Speaker 2: care is one of those things that is thought about 560 00:31:29,600 --> 00:31:32,719 Speaker 2: after the fact. There is one set that I worked 561 00:31:32,760 --> 00:31:37,000 Speaker 2: on and I was actually not hired as the intimacy coordinator. 562 00:31:37,040 --> 00:31:40,320 Speaker 2: I was hired as what they called a sensitivity coordinator 563 00:31:40,840 --> 00:31:46,040 Speaker 2: because they knew going into production that the material would 564 00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:49,640 Speaker 2: be highly sensitive, not just for cast but for crew 565 00:31:49,720 --> 00:31:52,640 Speaker 2: as well, and so they brought me in just to 566 00:31:52,800 --> 00:31:56,920 Speaker 2: work on just making sure everybody felt okay when we 567 00:31:56,920 --> 00:32:01,720 Speaker 2: were doing some really tough, mentally challenge and draining scenes, 568 00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:06,000 Speaker 2: and I thought it was a brilliant move on that production. 569 00:32:06,160 --> 00:32:09,880 Speaker 2: I've also worked on other productions where I've suggested the 570 00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:13,120 Speaker 2: need for that and it was just like, we don't 571 00:32:13,160 --> 00:32:15,120 Speaker 2: have it. It's not in the budget. We don't think 572 00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:17,240 Speaker 2: it should be fine. If they have a problem, they 573 00:32:17,280 --> 00:32:21,920 Speaker 2: can talk to their supervisor. It's best if it's proactive. 574 00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:24,520 Speaker 2: And I don't necessarily know that every show needs it. 575 00:32:25,120 --> 00:32:27,000 Speaker 2: I do know that we need to have access to 576 00:32:27,040 --> 00:32:30,200 Speaker 2: address whatever issues may come up for us, because we're 577 00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:32,880 Speaker 2: all carrying around or going through something and who knows 578 00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:37,520 Speaker 2: what might trigger any kind of emotion or feeling or anything. 579 00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:41,600 Speaker 2: Aftercare is not a standard, and intimacy coordination is still 580 00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:44,960 Speaker 2: relatively new. I wish and I hope and I pray 581 00:32:45,040 --> 00:32:48,320 Speaker 2: that the future of our sets and the safety on 582 00:32:48,360 --> 00:32:53,600 Speaker 2: sets includes more mental health access and availability, because I 583 00:32:53,640 --> 00:32:56,440 Speaker 2: think as we start doing all of the things and 584 00:32:56,520 --> 00:33:02,320 Speaker 2: telling the stories, it becomes very heavy, and it becomes 585 00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:06,120 Speaker 2: I think for so many and again not just our cast, 586 00:33:06,280 --> 00:33:09,880 Speaker 2: but crew two are exposed to so much and you 587 00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:12,760 Speaker 2: don't know what is traumatizing for folks. You don't know 588 00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:16,440 Speaker 2: what they're what everybody's lived experience is. And not only that, 589 00:33:16,680 --> 00:33:20,040 Speaker 2: we're talking about individuals that are working twelve hour days 590 00:33:20,280 --> 00:33:23,680 Speaker 2: or more, that aren't getting to see their families as 591 00:33:23,720 --> 00:33:26,680 Speaker 2: much as they should, that probably aren't exercising like they should, 592 00:33:26,720 --> 00:33:30,200 Speaker 2: aren't eating as they should, that just need the support 593 00:33:30,320 --> 00:33:33,520 Speaker 2: and so to have that would be a humongous blessing 594 00:33:33,560 --> 00:33:35,760 Speaker 2: and an absolute game changer in this industry. 595 00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:38,480 Speaker 1: So you mentioned there are actors and actresses that you've 596 00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:41,440 Speaker 1: worked with, like maybe in different projects. How do you 597 00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:43,760 Speaker 1: actually end up a part of a project like would 598 00:33:43,760 --> 00:33:46,040 Speaker 1: it be that an actor would say, hey, I'm not 599 00:33:46,120 --> 00:33:48,160 Speaker 1: doing anything if Doctor Tippet's not here like she yes 600 00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:50,400 Speaker 1: the year if I'm doing any of this, is it 601 00:33:50,440 --> 00:33:53,400 Speaker 1: typically from the production company that they will say, okay, 602 00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:55,520 Speaker 1: we need to have a coordinator here. 603 00:33:55,560 --> 00:33:58,880 Speaker 2: How do you get involved. I've had very positive relationships 604 00:33:58,920 --> 00:34:02,720 Speaker 2: with many of my actors, but I usually get hired 605 00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:05,400 Speaker 2: a couple of ways. One, I have an agent, so 606 00:34:05,520 --> 00:34:09,320 Speaker 2: some stuff comes through my agent, some stuff comes through 607 00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:14,680 Speaker 2: my previous work. So a lot of times a production 608 00:34:15,040 --> 00:34:19,000 Speaker 2: coordinator or production supervisor. The film community is a very 609 00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:24,879 Speaker 2: is big, but it's small, and the upms or line producers, 610 00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:26,839 Speaker 2: they'll do this show and then they have their next 611 00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:28,759 Speaker 2: show lined up, and their next show lined up, and 612 00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:31,400 Speaker 2: their next show lined up, and so what tends to 613 00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:34,520 Speaker 2: happen is if you do a good job, a lot 614 00:34:34,520 --> 00:34:37,000 Speaker 2: of times they want to bring the same crew to 615 00:34:37,040 --> 00:34:40,880 Speaker 2: the next production. And so that a lot of times 616 00:34:40,920 --> 00:34:43,400 Speaker 2: is what happens for me is out you know, was 617 00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:47,840 Speaker 2: on one show and the first ad from that show 618 00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:51,600 Speaker 2: went to this show and they needed an intimacy coordinator. 619 00:34:51,640 --> 00:34:53,680 Speaker 2: And it's always well, who did you work with last time? 620 00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:56,080 Speaker 2: Or have you worked with anybody that you're really like, Oh, yeah, 621 00:34:56,120 --> 00:34:58,600 Speaker 2: I work with doctor Tiff. Let's see if she's available, 622 00:34:58,600 --> 00:35:00,680 Speaker 2: and then I get the call and then that's it. 623 00:35:00,800 --> 00:35:05,440 Speaker 2: Sometimes I've been reached out to specifically because I'm black, 624 00:35:06,040 --> 00:35:10,360 Speaker 2: Like the production might be a all black cast and 625 00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:14,439 Speaker 2: they're seeking out a black intimacy coordinator and I check 626 00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:17,920 Speaker 2: that box and so I get the call for that. 627 00:35:18,120 --> 00:35:20,920 Speaker 2: But I would say ninety percent of my referrals are 628 00:35:21,040 --> 00:35:25,560 Speaker 2: like word of mouth. Probably ten percent is from my agent. 629 00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:28,600 Speaker 2: I think with any profession that you're in, I don't 630 00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:33,040 Speaker 2: rely on social media at all for those jobs really 631 00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:38,640 Speaker 2: because I'm lazy and I have an Instagram account for 632 00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:41,960 Speaker 2: my icy work, but I don't update it. I don't 633 00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:45,480 Speaker 2: have time. So yeah, that's pretty much how it all happens. 634 00:35:45,760 --> 00:35:47,240 Speaker 2: Got it, Okay? 635 00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:49,680 Speaker 1: I mean it sounds like you're booked and busy without it, 636 00:35:49,800 --> 00:35:51,520 Speaker 1: so you don't really mean enough. 637 00:35:51,719 --> 00:35:54,920 Speaker 2: I'm booked enough. I'm booked enough. Right now. I'm managing 638 00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:57,920 Speaker 2: three shows and it's more than enough. One is ending 639 00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:00,400 Speaker 2: in a couple of weeks, which will be right, and 640 00:36:00,400 --> 00:36:02,280 Speaker 2: then I'm going to do the two throughout the summer. 641 00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:04,400 Speaker 2: Someone will have to be really phenomenal for me to 642 00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:07,360 Speaker 2: take on another project, but I also liked to vacation. 643 00:36:07,560 --> 00:36:10,440 Speaker 2: I like the beach, so this is getting into my 644 00:36:10,560 --> 00:36:12,760 Speaker 2: beach time and this is not that fancy. 645 00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:16,839 Speaker 1: Protect I am like, how did I. 646 00:36:16,840 --> 00:36:20,919 Speaker 2: End up working throughout this? I'm rethinking it, But it'll 647 00:36:20,960 --> 00:36:22,760 Speaker 2: be nice to have some beach money though. 648 00:36:22,719 --> 00:36:23,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, you need that. 649 00:36:24,120 --> 00:36:24,560 Speaker 2: You need that. 650 00:36:25,560 --> 00:36:27,400 Speaker 1: So you mentioned that you know some of the times 651 00:36:27,400 --> 00:36:29,839 Speaker 1: you get cast it because people are looking specifically for 652 00:36:29,920 --> 00:36:32,799 Speaker 1: a black intimacy coordinator. And I really feel like, you know, 653 00:36:32,800 --> 00:36:34,839 Speaker 1: even in the beginning, when you start talking about like 654 00:36:34,960 --> 00:36:38,600 Speaker 1: having your experiences in grad school and seeing Sujo Hansen 655 00:36:38,640 --> 00:36:40,600 Speaker 1: and thinking like, oh, this is something that I want 656 00:36:40,640 --> 00:36:42,400 Speaker 1: to do, I feel like you were really on the 657 00:36:42,480 --> 00:36:44,719 Speaker 1: cutting edge right Like now it feels like we see 658 00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:47,759 Speaker 1: a lot of mental health professionals talking about sexuality and 659 00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:49,640 Speaker 1: like that is more of a conversation, but I feel 660 00:36:49,680 --> 00:36:51,760 Speaker 1: like you were one of the people doing it before 661 00:36:52,200 --> 00:36:54,719 Speaker 1: like social media started really popping in, like we saw 662 00:36:54,760 --> 00:36:55,960 Speaker 1: people talking about it. 663 00:36:56,239 --> 00:36:57,600 Speaker 2: How do you feel like like. 664 00:36:57,560 --> 00:36:59,960 Speaker 1: That impacts the work that you do, and like, how 665 00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:02,600 Speaker 1: how are you bringing your black woman this onto the 666 00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:04,839 Speaker 1: set to help you approach the work? You do as 667 00:37:04,840 --> 00:37:06,560 Speaker 1: an intimacy coordinator. 668 00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:09,680 Speaker 2: Man, I can't leave her behind. I show up and 669 00:37:10,040 --> 00:37:13,759 Speaker 2: I am black, Lackay Black. I have to come in 670 00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:17,600 Speaker 2: as unapologetically who I am because that's who's going to 671 00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:21,839 Speaker 2: show up regardless. I could try, but I just have 672 00:37:21,920 --> 00:37:24,440 Speaker 2: to be me. And I find that the more me 673 00:37:24,600 --> 00:37:27,640 Speaker 2: that I am, the more people appreciate the me that 674 00:37:27,719 --> 00:37:30,160 Speaker 2: I am, and they appreciate me showing up and just 675 00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:34,040 Speaker 2: being who I am. I will say for and I'm looking. 676 00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:36,319 Speaker 2: I'm just trying to think right before we went on, like, 677 00:37:36,400 --> 00:37:38,879 Speaker 2: how many shows have I been on where it has 678 00:37:39,000 --> 00:37:41,319 Speaker 2: been like a predominantly black cast, And it hasn't been 679 00:37:41,440 --> 00:37:44,760 Speaker 2: very many. And the referrals that I've gotten, like from 680 00:37:44,880 --> 00:37:49,439 Speaker 2: those line producers or supervising producers or production coordinators, they 681 00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:54,480 Speaker 2: haven't been black production coordinators or supervisors or line producers. 682 00:37:55,120 --> 00:37:58,759 Speaker 2: But they recognize my talent, they recognize my ability, they 683 00:37:58,880 --> 00:38:02,640 Speaker 2: recognize the way that I communicate with not just my actors, 684 00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:05,520 Speaker 2: but with production as well. What that says to me 685 00:38:05,760 --> 00:38:08,840 Speaker 2: is show up as authentically as you can be exactly 686 00:38:08,880 --> 00:38:12,200 Speaker 2: who you are, because that's the thing that it's gonna 687 00:38:12,200 --> 00:38:14,560 Speaker 2: eventually come out and you don't want to have to 688 00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:18,600 Speaker 2: worry about keeping that part up. Understand that you're coming 689 00:38:18,640 --> 00:38:20,600 Speaker 2: in to do a job, do it the best that 690 00:38:20,680 --> 00:38:25,239 Speaker 2: you possibly can, and the right situations will find you. 691 00:38:25,239 --> 00:38:29,560 Speaker 2: You won't have to do much to continue on that trajectory. 692 00:38:30,360 --> 00:38:34,480 Speaker 2: I can't imagine not leading with it. I can't imagine 693 00:38:34,520 --> 00:38:36,520 Speaker 2: not leading with it. And I know it's hard, you know. 694 00:38:36,600 --> 00:38:38,720 Speaker 2: I know it's hard for us, especially in these spaces 695 00:38:38,719 --> 00:38:42,600 Speaker 2: where we don't see ourselves. But I think it's super 696 00:38:42,640 --> 00:38:45,640 Speaker 2: important that we understand that we wouldn't be in those 697 00:38:45,680 --> 00:38:48,000 Speaker 2: spaces if we weren't meant to be in those spaces. 698 00:38:48,360 --> 00:38:50,719 Speaker 2: So even if you don't see yourself, perhaps you're the 699 00:38:50,719 --> 00:38:53,600 Speaker 2: first one that other people need to see in order 700 00:38:53,600 --> 00:38:56,640 Speaker 2: to recognize that they can do it. When I started 701 00:38:56,680 --> 00:38:59,720 Speaker 2: doing sex therapy, I didn't see like someone of color 702 00:38:59,880 --> 00:39:04,640 Speaker 2: like me, And what I ended up realizing was that 703 00:39:04,760 --> 00:39:09,600 Speaker 2: I became the first black certified sex therapist in the 704 00:39:09,640 --> 00:39:12,239 Speaker 2: state of Georgia. That wasn't a goal that I set out, 705 00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:16,200 Speaker 2: but it wasn't until after that happened that I realized, 706 00:39:16,280 --> 00:39:19,520 Speaker 2: oh shit, right, look at your girl. And then I 707 00:39:19,600 --> 00:39:23,040 Speaker 2: had mentees and people, you know. When I taught Master students, 708 00:39:23,120 --> 00:39:25,800 Speaker 2: master's clinicians that were looking to get into this field. 709 00:39:26,760 --> 00:39:30,360 Speaker 2: They did that because of me, because of the example 710 00:39:30,360 --> 00:39:32,359 Speaker 2: that I did. I say all that to say, like, 711 00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:35,920 Speaker 2: even if you don't see the person of color, if 712 00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:39,960 Speaker 2: you see a person, know that if they did it, 713 00:39:39,960 --> 00:39:42,960 Speaker 2: it doesn't matter that you don't look like them, or 714 00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:45,359 Speaker 2: don't have the same aesthetics as them, or don't have 715 00:39:45,400 --> 00:39:49,200 Speaker 2: the same background as them. If it's been done, you 716 00:39:49,280 --> 00:39:52,360 Speaker 2: can do it and be the first. Don't be afraid 717 00:39:52,400 --> 00:39:56,239 Speaker 2: of being the first. Just do it. Do it, step out, 718 00:39:56,680 --> 00:39:58,600 Speaker 2: step out and own it. If God put the dream 719 00:39:58,640 --> 00:40:02,400 Speaker 2: in your heart, it is yours to have and to hold. 720 00:40:02,440 --> 00:40:05,919 Speaker 2: He will make a way for you to claim it. 721 00:40:06,480 --> 00:40:12,719 Speaker 1: More from our conversation after the break. Have you heard 722 00:40:12,760 --> 00:40:16,160 Speaker 1: the news? Therapy for Black Girls is launching our community 723 00:40:16,200 --> 00:40:20,120 Speaker 1: on Patreon. It's your space to be seen, heard, and 724 00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:23,960 Speaker 1: understood in an even more connected way. We're excited to 725 00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:27,480 Speaker 1: bring you new segments like so my therapist said, where 726 00:40:27,480 --> 00:40:30,359 Speaker 1: we break down viral therapy hot takes with real mental 727 00:40:30,400 --> 00:40:34,879 Speaker 1: health professionals. TBG community chats, where we unpack trending pop 728 00:40:34,920 --> 00:40:38,000 Speaker 1: culture topics that have us all in our feelings and 729 00:40:38,120 --> 00:40:40,680 Speaker 1: opportunities to connect with other sisters. 730 00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:41,320 Speaker 2: All over the world. 731 00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:44,880 Speaker 1: Sign up now at Therapy for Blackgirls dot com, slash 732 00:40:45,000 --> 00:40:48,440 Speaker 1: join Patreon for all the details about what we're planning 733 00:40:48,520 --> 00:40:50,359 Speaker 1: and to be the first to know when the doors 734 00:40:50,400 --> 00:40:58,040 Speaker 1: are open. We can't wait to see you inside. So 735 00:40:58,160 --> 00:41:01,160 Speaker 1: thinking more about like all black cas So, did you 736 00:41:01,200 --> 00:41:02,040 Speaker 1: watch Insecure? 737 00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:03,200 Speaker 2: I did? 738 00:41:03,239 --> 00:41:05,600 Speaker 1: So you probably remember a condom gait right when there 739 00:41:05,600 --> 00:41:07,880 Speaker 1: were lots of conversations about like, oh, we see a 740 00:41:07,880 --> 00:41:10,040 Speaker 1: lot of sex on Insecure, but we never see like 741 00:41:10,160 --> 00:41:13,359 Speaker 1: condom rappers. So ask somebody who might have been like 742 00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:15,200 Speaker 1: on the set or like helping, you know, to kind 743 00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:16,839 Speaker 1: of think through some of those things. What were your 744 00:41:16,840 --> 00:41:19,760 Speaker 1: thoughts or when things like that happen in pop culture? 745 00:41:19,840 --> 00:41:21,680 Speaker 1: How do you look at that as an intimacy equal? 746 00:41:21,760 --> 00:41:25,000 Speaker 2: You know, I don't even know if I remember that 747 00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:29,080 Speaker 2: much conversation about it. I do know that just from 748 00:41:29,160 --> 00:41:33,759 Speaker 2: my perspective and having worked on shows where you know, 749 00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:36,640 Speaker 2: young people are having sex or we want to show 750 00:41:36,719 --> 00:41:39,239 Speaker 2: these things, but these people maybe they're not married, or 751 00:41:39,239 --> 00:41:42,080 Speaker 2: maybe they're having sex with multiple partners or whatever. That's 752 00:41:42,120 --> 00:41:44,440 Speaker 2: always a conversation that I like to initiate. It it's 753 00:41:44,440 --> 00:41:46,840 Speaker 2: a couple of them. Are we saying as a production 754 00:41:47,320 --> 00:41:50,400 Speaker 2: or as like that these people like they're in college, 755 00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:52,239 Speaker 2: they're having lots of sex with lots of partners. Are 756 00:41:52,239 --> 00:41:54,520 Speaker 2: we saying that they're not using condoms? Are we ever 757 00:41:54,600 --> 00:41:57,000 Speaker 2: gonna show that condoms are a thing, Because like you 758 00:41:57,080 --> 00:41:59,560 Speaker 2: have to think about the implications just beyond like these 759 00:41:59,600 --> 00:42:02,560 Speaker 2: particular characters, Like what is the production saying, what is 760 00:42:02,560 --> 00:42:04,919 Speaker 2: the network saying? Like if this is on free form, 761 00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:09,080 Speaker 2: for example, is the message that we're not using condoms 762 00:42:09,120 --> 00:42:12,920 Speaker 2: what we want to say versus like HBO or you know, 763 00:42:13,000 --> 00:42:15,359 Speaker 2: you kind of have to think about that. That is 764 00:42:15,400 --> 00:42:18,160 Speaker 2: something that I think about as an ICEE. I also 765 00:42:18,200 --> 00:42:20,080 Speaker 2: think about this is a good one, and I think 766 00:42:20,120 --> 00:42:23,239 Speaker 2: it's annoying to me more than anything when people are 767 00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:27,160 Speaker 2: having simulated sex. I think it is important. I think 768 00:42:27,200 --> 00:42:31,960 Speaker 2: it's critical if it's a male identified and female identified partner, 769 00:42:32,680 --> 00:42:37,120 Speaker 2: that we see somebody's hand go down to make sure 770 00:42:37,160 --> 00:42:39,600 Speaker 2: the penis makes its way into the vagina. I don't 771 00:42:39,600 --> 00:42:42,799 Speaker 2: think penises magically find their way into vaginas, but when 772 00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:45,040 Speaker 2: we see sex scenes, a lot of times they just 773 00:42:45,080 --> 00:42:49,600 Speaker 2: start making love, and I think we know that somebody 774 00:42:49,640 --> 00:42:52,759 Speaker 2: got to put something somewhere in order for it to 775 00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:55,520 Speaker 2: go where it's supposed to go. It doesn't magically find 776 00:42:55,560 --> 00:42:59,640 Speaker 2: its way into all And so little details like that, 777 00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:03,240 Speaker 2: I think we have to make sure happen because it's 778 00:43:03,440 --> 00:43:07,080 Speaker 2: there's an adjustment period, there's a movement, there's we gotta 779 00:43:07,120 --> 00:43:09,480 Speaker 2: find a way. So little things like that are like 780 00:43:10,080 --> 00:43:11,879 Speaker 2: I don't know, like pet pains for me, I want 781 00:43:11,920 --> 00:43:13,880 Speaker 2: to see it. I want to make sure that happens. 782 00:43:14,160 --> 00:43:17,480 Speaker 2: And when we do like things like condom use, I'm 783 00:43:17,520 --> 00:43:21,120 Speaker 2: a stickler for like please don't tear that wrapper, Please 784 00:43:21,160 --> 00:43:23,359 Speaker 2: don't do that, Please don't do that. It's just it's 785 00:43:23,360 --> 00:43:26,200 Speaker 2: a sex education thing. Like there are so many different 786 00:43:26,200 --> 00:43:29,360 Speaker 2: things that just should happen, and they don't always. But 787 00:43:29,480 --> 00:43:31,680 Speaker 2: if I'm on set, I'm gonna at least say something 788 00:43:31,719 --> 00:43:33,600 Speaker 2: about it. And if they choose not to go in 789 00:43:33,600 --> 00:43:34,680 Speaker 2: that direction, that's fine. 790 00:43:35,520 --> 00:43:38,000 Speaker 1: So you mentioned that you've been on other sets as 791 00:43:38,040 --> 00:43:40,799 Speaker 1: like sensitivity coordinators, and to me, it feels like that's 792 00:43:40,840 --> 00:43:45,279 Speaker 1: an extension of like intimacy coordinators, right, Like especially I've 793 00:43:45,320 --> 00:43:49,440 Speaker 1: seen articles and things written about stories that especially like 794 00:43:49,480 --> 00:43:51,719 Speaker 1: if slavery is portrayed, or there's a lot of like 795 00:43:51,760 --> 00:43:55,920 Speaker 1: heavy racial trauma. They want somebody like a sensitivity coordinator 796 00:43:55,960 --> 00:43:58,440 Speaker 1: on set. What are your thoughts about, like how the 797 00:43:58,480 --> 00:44:02,879 Speaker 1: field of intimacy coordinator and sensitivity coordinators will expand maybe 798 00:44:02,880 --> 00:44:04,080 Speaker 1: in the next couple of years. 799 00:44:04,600 --> 00:44:07,560 Speaker 2: I definitely think intimacy coordinator like they're going to be there. 800 00:44:08,440 --> 00:44:12,440 Speaker 2: We're in the process of becoming in full partnership with 801 00:44:12,560 --> 00:44:15,000 Speaker 2: SAG after I've been a member of SAG since about 802 00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:18,960 Speaker 2: twenty eleven, but in the field of broadcasting, so I've 803 00:44:19,000 --> 00:44:23,040 Speaker 2: backdoored my way in. But now it is being recognized 804 00:44:23,160 --> 00:44:27,000 Speaker 2: and that will become evident in like all of our 805 00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:30,360 Speaker 2: contracts and making sure that we're paid a certain base 806 00:44:30,520 --> 00:44:32,720 Speaker 2: rate and all of those things. So I feel really 807 00:44:32,719 --> 00:44:37,399 Speaker 2: confident about where intimacy coordination is going, especially as we 808 00:44:37,520 --> 00:44:42,040 Speaker 2: join the union as intimacy coordinators in sensitivity and mental health. 809 00:44:42,120 --> 00:44:46,680 Speaker 2: They tend to be brought in as consultants, and I 810 00:44:46,680 --> 00:44:51,480 Speaker 2: think intimacy coordinators were initially as well. Because television and 811 00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:56,319 Speaker 2: film is so different, there's not always a need, you 812 00:44:56,360 --> 00:44:58,040 Speaker 2: know what, check me in a couple of years because 813 00:44:58,040 --> 00:45:00,160 Speaker 2: I may think through this and think about it very different. 814 00:45:00,280 --> 00:45:02,960 Speaker 2: I don't know that there's always a need for a 815 00:45:03,040 --> 00:45:06,000 Speaker 2: mental health professional to be on set. I do think 816 00:45:06,040 --> 00:45:09,920 Speaker 2: there needs to be availability of mental health professionals all 817 00:45:09,920 --> 00:45:13,279 Speaker 2: the time in every line of work. I do think 818 00:45:13,320 --> 00:45:15,600 Speaker 2: that we're going to start to see more of it though. 819 00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:18,520 Speaker 2: The first place that I saw actually I worked on Till, 820 00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:22,200 Speaker 2: the movie Till, and they brought me in for a 821 00:45:22,320 --> 00:45:24,680 Speaker 2: scene where there were some body touches. But I was 822 00:45:24,719 --> 00:45:28,720 Speaker 2: brought in because I was referred by the mental health 823 00:45:28,760 --> 00:45:31,319 Speaker 2: person on set. They had a mental health person on 824 00:45:31,400 --> 00:45:33,840 Speaker 2: set there who's a dear friend of mine, and she 825 00:45:33,880 --> 00:45:36,960 Speaker 2: brought me in to do that work. And then after that, 826 00:45:37,120 --> 00:45:41,760 Speaker 2: I worked with Natgo on Genius season four, which was MLKX, 827 00:45:41,800 --> 00:45:45,320 Speaker 2: and they brought me in specifically to do the sensitivity stuff. 828 00:45:45,760 --> 00:45:48,239 Speaker 2: And then I ended up signing a separate contract to 829 00:45:48,239 --> 00:45:50,360 Speaker 2: do some intimacy work because they had some scenes that 830 00:45:50,400 --> 00:45:53,080 Speaker 2: they needed somebody for but they weren't sure that they 831 00:45:53,080 --> 00:45:54,920 Speaker 2: were going to and it was like, yeah, you do, 832 00:45:55,440 --> 00:45:57,799 Speaker 2: so I was able to do that. Right now, I'm 833 00:45:57,840 --> 00:46:01,359 Speaker 2: working on a project I can't talk about the name, 834 00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:03,640 Speaker 2: but I can tell you that was one of the 835 00:46:03,640 --> 00:46:06,759 Speaker 2: things that I recommended when I came in just to interview. 836 00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:09,520 Speaker 2: Is that just based on what I'm seeing. I think 837 00:46:09,680 --> 00:46:12,080 Speaker 2: that we have a real need and a real opportunity 838 00:46:12,800 --> 00:46:16,200 Speaker 2: for a mental health component and someone to be here 839 00:46:16,400 --> 00:46:20,120 Speaker 2: dedicated for this show. And thankfully they took that and 840 00:46:20,200 --> 00:46:23,319 Speaker 2: ran and we have somebody on set. We also have 841 00:46:23,480 --> 00:46:26,279 Speaker 2: a team where our cast and crew can meet with 842 00:46:26,400 --> 00:46:29,799 Speaker 2: them whenever they need to. So I think that we're 843 00:46:29,880 --> 00:46:32,399 Speaker 2: going in that direction. I don't know if it will 844 00:46:32,400 --> 00:46:35,640 Speaker 2: happen with every set in every production, but I think 845 00:46:35,640 --> 00:46:38,400 Speaker 2: we're going there. There's certainly some overlap, there are certainly 846 00:46:38,440 --> 00:46:41,080 Speaker 2: things that I could handle. I'm a licensed clinician, right, 847 00:46:41,200 --> 00:46:44,560 Speaker 2: I could handle it because as a black women, we 848 00:46:44,680 --> 00:46:47,600 Speaker 2: can do a lot of different things. And just because 849 00:46:47,640 --> 00:46:49,239 Speaker 2: I can do it doesn't mean that I need to 850 00:46:49,239 --> 00:46:50,920 Speaker 2: do it, or should do it, or should have to 851 00:46:50,960 --> 00:46:53,680 Speaker 2: do it. And so I'm very proud of myself for 852 00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:57,080 Speaker 2: recognizing that and bringing that up in my interview and 853 00:46:57,120 --> 00:47:00,160 Speaker 2: really pushing back and saying it can't be meet and 854 00:47:00,200 --> 00:47:02,359 Speaker 2: not be me because I've read every script and I 855 00:47:02,520 --> 00:47:05,319 Speaker 2: know what's coming down the pipe, and I have an 856 00:47:05,360 --> 00:47:10,040 Speaker 2: idea that if I were to take that on, what 857 00:47:10,080 --> 00:47:12,840 Speaker 2: do they say, get blood out of a turn on? Yeah? 858 00:47:13,040 --> 00:47:15,479 Speaker 1: Right? Because they would be compensated, right, Like they would 859 00:47:15,719 --> 00:47:17,520 Speaker 1: compensate you for the one role, but then have you 860 00:47:17,640 --> 00:47:18,840 Speaker 1: doing all these different things? 861 00:47:19,239 --> 00:47:23,080 Speaker 2: Yes? Absolutely, But also I think they would have paid 862 00:47:23,120 --> 00:47:24,920 Speaker 2: me to do both. They would have had to pay 863 00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:26,400 Speaker 2: me to both. I wasn't gonna do both and then 864 00:47:26,440 --> 00:47:29,759 Speaker 2: not pay me. But I don't want to. I don't 865 00:47:29,760 --> 00:47:31,960 Speaker 2: want to be work like that. I would be there 866 00:47:32,000 --> 00:47:33,719 Speaker 2: every day. I wouldn't be able to get none done 867 00:47:33,719 --> 00:47:36,560 Speaker 2: for myself. I'm trying to get some beach time. I'm 868 00:47:36,600 --> 00:47:39,319 Speaker 2: trying to see my husband. I'd like intimate time with 869 00:47:39,400 --> 00:47:44,160 Speaker 2: my husband, okay, or to go see my daughter play, 870 00:47:44,400 --> 00:47:45,960 Speaker 2: to swim, or to do whatever. 871 00:47:46,040 --> 00:47:46,160 Speaker 1: Like. 872 00:47:46,239 --> 00:47:48,760 Speaker 2: I have to understand, and I think that's the growth 873 00:47:48,800 --> 00:47:52,480 Speaker 2: of being someone in a helping profession. I have to 874 00:47:52,560 --> 00:47:55,759 Speaker 2: understand what my needs are to aavigate for those and 875 00:47:55,880 --> 00:47:59,040 Speaker 2: see where I'm starting to get sucked in in places 876 00:47:59,640 --> 00:48:01,840 Speaker 2: where you know what, that ain't none of my business. 877 00:48:01,960 --> 00:48:05,080 Speaker 2: I could do it, but you know what, right now, 878 00:48:05,080 --> 00:48:07,480 Speaker 2: I'm choosing not to. I'm choosing to do what I 879 00:48:07,520 --> 00:48:10,399 Speaker 2: can do. I don't have the capacity for it, yeah, 880 00:48:10,480 --> 00:48:13,319 Speaker 2: to do all of that, And so even though I can, 881 00:48:13,520 --> 00:48:16,600 Speaker 2: and I'm very much trained to do it, don't want to. 882 00:48:17,280 --> 00:48:20,160 Speaker 1: So I would imagine there's it probably some people enjoying 883 00:48:20,160 --> 00:48:22,920 Speaker 1: our conversation, particularly therapists who are thinking. 884 00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:24,440 Speaker 2: Like, oh, this would be so cool to get into. 885 00:48:25,040 --> 00:48:27,080 Speaker 1: What would you suggest for people in terms of like 886 00:48:27,120 --> 00:48:30,480 Speaker 1: maybe doing more research or how would somebody get started 887 00:48:30,719 --> 00:48:32,560 Speaker 1: in becoming an intimacy coordinator? 888 00:48:33,239 --> 00:48:36,319 Speaker 2: Well, I would say, because not every therapist wants to 889 00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:40,600 Speaker 2: talk about sex and intimacy. That's not their niche. So 890 00:48:40,640 --> 00:48:43,760 Speaker 2: make sure if this is the road that you feel 891 00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:47,360 Speaker 2: most comfortable with and you can make other people feel 892 00:48:47,360 --> 00:48:50,959 Speaker 2: comfortable with. And so once you know that, I would say, 893 00:48:51,080 --> 00:48:54,520 Speaker 2: just put in a search for training or certification to 894 00:48:54,600 --> 00:48:59,000 Speaker 2: be an intimacy coordinator. There are different programs that come up. 895 00:48:59,160 --> 00:49:02,680 Speaker 2: IPA is one of them, I DC and others. I'm 896 00:49:02,719 --> 00:49:04,520 Speaker 2: not going to try and remember them all, but there 897 00:49:04,520 --> 00:49:07,200 Speaker 2: are others, and then just do that research, figure out 898 00:49:07,320 --> 00:49:09,239 Speaker 2: like Okay, this one sounds a little bit more like 899 00:49:09,280 --> 00:49:11,640 Speaker 2: something that I want to do, or this one is 900 00:49:11,680 --> 00:49:15,480 Speaker 2: in my area, or this one has more like online components. 901 00:49:15,560 --> 00:49:18,600 Speaker 2: Because I don't have time to be traveling, You'll figure 902 00:49:18,640 --> 00:49:21,560 Speaker 2: that part out, and then I would just have some conversations, 903 00:49:21,600 --> 00:49:24,640 Speaker 2: meet up with and talk to reach out to people 904 00:49:24,640 --> 00:49:27,799 Speaker 2: that are already doing the work. What is sad? And 905 00:49:27,840 --> 00:49:29,720 Speaker 2: this was sad for me and it still is sad. 906 00:49:29,880 --> 00:49:32,239 Speaker 2: Now we weren't really able to do a lot of 907 00:49:32,320 --> 00:49:35,520 Speaker 2: shadowing because of COVID like when I started. Before then, 908 00:49:35,760 --> 00:49:40,200 Speaker 2: I think that ICs had a lot more access to 909 00:49:40,719 --> 00:49:45,360 Speaker 2: being able to go on set, but after COVID not 910 00:49:45,440 --> 00:49:47,480 Speaker 2: so much, or during COVID and not so much. Like 911 00:49:47,560 --> 00:49:49,480 Speaker 2: they really did limit the number of people that could 912 00:49:49,480 --> 00:49:52,360 Speaker 2: be on set to the people that absolutely needed to 913 00:49:52,360 --> 00:49:54,600 Speaker 2: be there, and they were doing so much testing that 914 00:49:54,680 --> 00:49:57,120 Speaker 2: you just really couldn't have anybody that wasn't in a queue. 915 00:49:57,560 --> 00:49:59,920 Speaker 2: I think they're starting to allow people to have assistance 916 00:50:00,120 --> 00:50:03,040 Speaker 2: or to bring in somebody if you can find that 917 00:50:03,040 --> 00:50:04,799 Speaker 2: that would be great. But I would say do as 918 00:50:04,880 --> 00:50:08,360 Speaker 2: much research as you can. Make phone calls, ask people 919 00:50:09,480 --> 00:50:12,719 Speaker 2: offer to take an Icyl to coffee, prompt she'll go, 920 00:50:13,920 --> 00:50:16,000 Speaker 2: and you can pick their brain or just ask them 921 00:50:16,080 --> 00:50:19,279 Speaker 2: questions about their work how they got in. Because my 922 00:50:19,360 --> 00:50:21,680 Speaker 2: story is unique to me, there are other people that 923 00:50:21,719 --> 00:50:23,400 Speaker 2: have gotten in a different way. Like I said, I 924 00:50:23,440 --> 00:50:26,360 Speaker 2: have a couple of friends who are stunt performers, and 925 00:50:26,440 --> 00:50:31,240 Speaker 2: because they're stunt performing and icy work is very similar, 926 00:50:31,640 --> 00:50:37,400 Speaker 2: and that they were coordinating these physical activities between people, 927 00:50:37,560 --> 00:50:40,160 Speaker 2: and so it was an easier way in for them 928 00:50:40,239 --> 00:50:43,080 Speaker 2: because they were already doing some of that work. And 929 00:50:43,120 --> 00:50:45,719 Speaker 2: so if you're interested in one area and don't be 930 00:50:45,760 --> 00:50:48,160 Speaker 2: afraid to just get on set. I think one of 931 00:50:48,160 --> 00:50:51,200 Speaker 2: the benefits that I had is I had been on 932 00:50:51,280 --> 00:50:54,800 Speaker 2: sets before, so a lot of things I knew about 933 00:50:55,000 --> 00:50:59,440 Speaker 2: set culture. But there is a great benefit to knowing 934 00:50:59,560 --> 00:51:02,560 Speaker 2: what it is like to be on set in any capacity. 935 00:51:02,719 --> 00:51:05,760 Speaker 2: So if you have the availability to be a PA, 936 00:51:05,880 --> 00:51:07,600 Speaker 2: I'm not saying you have to start as a PA, 937 00:51:08,040 --> 00:51:10,600 Speaker 2: but if you want to just get acclimated to being 938 00:51:10,640 --> 00:51:12,600 Speaker 2: on set, a PA is a great way to go. 939 00:51:12,920 --> 00:51:14,759 Speaker 2: Or if you want to use your talent gift but 940 00:51:15,120 --> 00:51:17,240 Speaker 2: maybe in a different area. Let's say you're a great 941 00:51:17,800 --> 00:51:19,719 Speaker 2: Maybe you work as a graphic designer, and this is 942 00:51:19,760 --> 00:51:21,520 Speaker 2: the area that you feel like you want, like figure 943 00:51:21,520 --> 00:51:24,799 Speaker 2: out a way to get yourself in the industry as 944 00:51:24,840 --> 00:51:27,200 Speaker 2: a designer of some swort, maybe in the art department 945 00:51:27,520 --> 00:51:30,160 Speaker 2: or whatever, and then figure out I think the more 946 00:51:30,200 --> 00:51:33,880 Speaker 2: that you're on set, you'll start to see like so 947 00:51:34,120 --> 00:51:37,239 Speaker 2: many windows of opportunity and things that you didn't even 948 00:51:37,280 --> 00:51:39,560 Speaker 2: know existed that you are interested in. So it may 949 00:51:39,600 --> 00:51:42,759 Speaker 2: be intimacy, coordination, and maybe something else, but just don't 950 00:51:42,800 --> 00:51:45,959 Speaker 2: be afraid to look outside of the box for sure. 951 00:51:47,120 --> 00:51:49,120 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for that, Doctor Tiffin, for all 952 00:51:49,120 --> 00:51:50,719 Speaker 1: of the things you shared today. I feel like I've 953 00:51:50,760 --> 00:51:53,120 Speaker 1: learned so much and really appreciate you sharing. 954 00:51:52,880 --> 00:51:53,640 Speaker 2: All that with us. 955 00:51:54,440 --> 00:51:56,600 Speaker 1: Where can people stay connected with you? So you said 956 00:51:56,680 --> 00:51:58,360 Speaker 1: you're on social but not really. 957 00:51:58,920 --> 00:51:59,919 Speaker 2: No, I just don't post. 958 00:52:00,080 --> 00:52:00,920 Speaker 1: Oh you just don't put. 959 00:52:00,880 --> 00:52:05,120 Speaker 2: Intimacy stuff on the page that I'm supposed to because 960 00:52:05,200 --> 00:52:09,320 Speaker 2: I can't manage another page, Doctor j It's too much, 961 00:52:09,800 --> 00:52:12,520 Speaker 2: too much. So I would say, here's how you get 962 00:52:12,520 --> 00:52:14,560 Speaker 2: in touch with me if you will follow me at 963 00:52:14,680 --> 00:52:18,359 Speaker 2: doctor Tiffany TV on Instagram, d R T I F 964 00:52:18,360 --> 00:52:21,719 Speaker 2: F A and I E TV on Instagram. I think 965 00:52:21,760 --> 00:52:26,280 Speaker 2: that's a great place to start because I post there 966 00:52:26,719 --> 00:52:31,000 Speaker 2: the most. I also have a podcast, Intimate Details with 967 00:52:31,080 --> 00:52:35,359 Speaker 2: Doctor tiff and we're getting ready to go into a 968 00:52:35,440 --> 00:52:38,000 Speaker 2: new season. We just finished up kind of season three. 969 00:52:38,040 --> 00:52:40,600 Speaker 2: We're getting ready to go into season four, and that 970 00:52:40,760 --> 00:52:43,440 Speaker 2: season I'm ninety nine percent sure it's going to be 971 00:52:43,520 --> 00:52:46,760 Speaker 2: all about purpose, and so it's a great place to start, 972 00:52:47,000 --> 00:52:49,080 Speaker 2: especially if you're a woman, if you're a black woman, 973 00:52:49,160 --> 00:52:51,520 Speaker 2: if you're somebody who's just like trying to figure it 974 00:52:51,560 --> 00:52:54,399 Speaker 2: out as we all are in twenty twenty five, that's 975 00:52:54,440 --> 00:52:56,640 Speaker 2: a really good place to start. And so some things 976 00:52:56,680 --> 00:52:59,800 Speaker 2: of that nature are coming up probably within the coming weeks. 977 00:53:00,280 --> 00:53:02,040 Speaker 2: If you go to my Instagram, you'll be able to 978 00:53:02,080 --> 00:53:05,520 Speaker 2: sign up and subscribe to my newsletter. I am coming 979 00:53:05,560 --> 00:53:10,120 Speaker 2: out with a program for women. My primary work is 980 00:53:10,160 --> 00:53:14,120 Speaker 2: in helping women learn how to effortlessly attract the love 981 00:53:14,160 --> 00:53:17,920 Speaker 2: that they want to call in, primarily by focusing on 982 00:53:17,960 --> 00:53:22,680 Speaker 2: their own growth and transformation. And I'm so excited about 983 00:53:22,719 --> 00:53:25,520 Speaker 2: the programs that we have coming up for that. I'm 984 00:53:25,560 --> 00:53:28,400 Speaker 2: doing a year long program I believe. I thought it 985 00:53:28,440 --> 00:53:30,400 Speaker 2: was going to be twelve weeks, but it's going to 986 00:53:30,440 --> 00:53:33,720 Speaker 2: be a year. So that's something that's coming up as well. 987 00:53:33,760 --> 00:53:36,000 Speaker 2: But you'll find out all of that on Instagram because 988 00:53:36,040 --> 00:53:38,160 Speaker 2: that's usually where I, I mean, I have the capacity 989 00:53:38,200 --> 00:53:41,000 Speaker 2: for that. There's also a YouTube channel, Doctor Tiffany TV, 990 00:53:41,239 --> 00:53:44,120 Speaker 2: like put it in my name, you'll find me fine 991 00:53:44,920 --> 00:53:47,480 Speaker 2: and I'm there, so all right, beautiful. 992 00:53:47,680 --> 00:53:49,480 Speaker 1: We should include all of that in the show notes 993 00:53:49,520 --> 00:53:51,600 Speaker 1: so that the people can follow you because I have 994 00:53:51,680 --> 00:53:53,680 Speaker 1: a feeling that they're going to be very interested in 995 00:53:53,680 --> 00:53:55,880 Speaker 1: the work, and especially in this class. It sounds like 996 00:53:56,000 --> 00:53:56,640 Speaker 1: very interesting. 997 00:53:56,880 --> 00:53:59,240 Speaker 2: It's going to be amazing. It'd be amazing. 998 00:53:59,239 --> 00:54:02,440 Speaker 1: I'm super excited, very excited to hear thank you so 999 00:54:02,520 --> 00:54:04,080 Speaker 1: much for joining me today, doctor Tiffany. 1000 00:54:04,120 --> 00:54:08,200 Speaker 2: I appreciate it, Thank you, thank you for having me anytime. 1001 00:54:11,680 --> 00:54:13,680 Speaker 1: I'm so glad doctor tiff was able to join me 1002 00:54:13,719 --> 00:54:16,400 Speaker 1: for today's episode. To learn more about her and the 1003 00:54:16,440 --> 00:54:18,879 Speaker 1: work she's doing. Be sure to visit the show notes 1004 00:54:18,880 --> 00:54:22,000 Speaker 1: at Therapy for Blackgirls dot com slash session four five, 1005 00:54:22,719 --> 00:54:24,719 Speaker 1: and don't forget to text this episode to two of 1006 00:54:24,760 --> 00:54:26,319 Speaker 1: your girls right now and tell them to. 1007 00:54:26,360 --> 00:54:28,319 Speaker 2: Check it out. Did you know? 1008 00:54:28,360 --> 00:54:30,319 Speaker 1: You can leave us a voicemail with your questions for 1009 00:54:30,360 --> 00:54:33,320 Speaker 1: the podcast. If you want to suggest a movie or 1010 00:54:33,360 --> 00:54:35,919 Speaker 1: a book for us to review, or share thoughts about 1011 00:54:35,960 --> 00:54:39,040 Speaker 1: other topics we should discuss on the podcast, drop us 1012 00:54:39,080 --> 00:54:41,839 Speaker 1: a message at Memo dot fm slash Therapy for Black 1013 00:54:41,880 --> 00:54:44,400 Speaker 1: Girls and let us know what's on your mind. We 1014 00:54:44,600 --> 00:54:47,719 Speaker 1: just might feature it on the podcast. If you're looking 1015 00:54:47,719 --> 00:54:51,000 Speaker 1: for a therapist in your area, visit our therapist directory 1016 00:54:51,080 --> 00:54:55,520 Speaker 1: at Therapy for blackgirls dot Com slash directory. This episode 1017 00:54:55,640 --> 00:54:59,640 Speaker 1: was produced by Elise Ellis, Indy Chubu, and Tyree Rush. 1018 00:55:00,080 --> 00:55:03,080 Speaker 1: Editing was done by Dennis and Bradford. Thank y'all so 1019 00:55:03,160 --> 00:55:05,800 Speaker 1: much for joining me again this week. I look forward 1020 00:55:05,800 --> 00:55:08,399 Speaker 1: to continuing this conversation with you all real soon. 1021 00:55:09,160 --> 00:55:09,879 Speaker 2: Take good care.