1 00:00:00,680 --> 00:00:03,280 Speaker 1: Hey, look amores, we have a quick announcement about our 2 00:00:03,320 --> 00:00:06,000 Speaker 1: I Fund Women campaign. As you may have heard, we're 3 00:00:06,080 --> 00:00:09,600 Speaker 1: raising one hundred thousand dollars to cover the startup costs 4 00:00:09,600 --> 00:00:12,440 Speaker 1: of look at A Productions and pay our team. We 5 00:00:12,480 --> 00:00:14,520 Speaker 1: are well on our way to reaching our goal, but 6 00:00:14,600 --> 00:00:17,000 Speaker 1: we still need your help to get there. If all 7 00:00:17,040 --> 00:00:20,319 Speaker 1: of our listeners and one friend donated five dollars, we 8 00:00:20,320 --> 00:00:24,000 Speaker 1: would meet our goal well before ninety days. Consider becoming 9 00:00:24,000 --> 00:00:27,080 Speaker 1: a funder of look at Our Productions and contribute on 10 00:00:27,160 --> 00:00:31,000 Speaker 1: I Fund Women dot com forward Slash Project forward Slash 11 00:00:31,080 --> 00:00:48,680 Speaker 1: look Dash Productions. Radio radio radio Commies a myth and Bullshit, 12 00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:56,960 Speaker 1: a radio phonic novella. Look Radio hosted by Malamo the Locomotives. 13 00:00:57,080 --> 00:01:00,160 Speaker 1: Welcome back to season five of a look at Rado 14 00:01:00,360 --> 00:01:05,600 Speaker 1: por Rosas Listen at your own risk. Look at thought 15 00:01:05,600 --> 00:01:08,440 Speaker 1: our Radio is a radio phonic novella, which is just 16 00:01:08,480 --> 00:01:13,759 Speaker 1: a very extra way of saying a podcast, I'm Fiosa 17 00:01:14,440 --> 00:01:19,520 Speaker 1: and I'm mala. Today we have a jam packed episode 18 00:01:19,680 --> 00:01:22,760 Speaker 1: with a full length interview. We also have some world 19 00:01:22,840 --> 00:01:25,000 Speaker 1: updates that we want to share. It's kind of a 20 00:01:25,000 --> 00:01:28,600 Speaker 1: heavy episode, so just f y I now take some 21 00:01:28,920 --> 00:01:31,280 Speaker 1: time if you need to take care of yourself, come 22 00:01:31,280 --> 00:01:33,800 Speaker 1: back to it if you need to. UM and as 23 00:01:33,840 --> 00:01:38,240 Speaker 1: always practiced some good old self care. We are going 24 00:01:38,319 --> 00:01:44,000 Speaker 1: to be addressing, uh, the recent and ongoing wave of 25 00:01:44,160 --> 00:01:48,320 Speaker 1: anti Asian hate. We're going to be in discussion with 26 00:01:48,480 --> 00:01:51,120 Speaker 1: Grace Chang and we're gonna talk a little bit about 27 00:01:51,160 --> 00:01:55,080 Speaker 1: the Gabriella l a i G takeover that we hosted 28 00:01:55,120 --> 00:01:59,080 Speaker 1: on our Instagram. But before we do that, some updates 29 00:01:59,160 --> 00:02:02,760 Speaker 1: per you a little housekeeping. Make sure you're following Look 30 00:02:02,760 --> 00:02:08,240 Speaker 1: at the Radio across social media platforms. Um, We're everywhere Instagram, Twitter, TikTok, 31 00:02:08,440 --> 00:02:13,200 Speaker 1: even clubhouse, where at local underscore radio? And remember that 32 00:02:13,240 --> 00:02:17,040 Speaker 1: we are running a campaign ninety days to one k 33 00:02:17,280 --> 00:02:20,880 Speaker 1: to launch Look at the Productions. You can fund our 34 00:02:21,160 --> 00:02:25,240 Speaker 1: iPhone Women campaign. Head over to the link in our 35 00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:29,040 Speaker 1: show notes to donate directly. If the campaign isn't necessarily 36 00:02:29,080 --> 00:02:32,519 Speaker 1: your thing, you can always donate to our venmo at 37 00:02:32,600 --> 00:02:36,520 Speaker 1: look at a dash radio. Escort yourself to our venmo 38 00:02:36,680 --> 00:02:41,400 Speaker 1: if you aspire to be our human wallet. Yes, yes, yes, 39 00:02:41,480 --> 00:02:44,160 Speaker 1: as you know, we're launching our own production company Look 40 00:02:44,160 --> 00:02:47,720 Speaker 1: at the Productions. There are some really cool incentives if 41 00:02:47,760 --> 00:02:51,440 Speaker 1: you contribute so think about it. Think about it, and 42 00:02:51,680 --> 00:02:55,040 Speaker 1: you will hear your name given a shout out on 43 00:02:55,320 --> 00:02:57,720 Speaker 1: a future episode of Look at the Radio if you 44 00:02:57,760 --> 00:03:01,240 Speaker 1: do contribute to our campaign. We also want to plug 45 00:03:01,720 --> 00:03:06,280 Speaker 1: our faith Latina owned makeup brand Viva Cosmetics. You can 46 00:03:06,360 --> 00:03:10,040 Speaker 1: actually get fifteen percent off of your next purchase from 47 00:03:10,240 --> 00:03:15,280 Speaker 1: Viva Cosmetics with our affiliate code look at our Radio fifteen. 48 00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:19,800 Speaker 1: That's look at thought our Radio fifteen forcent off your 49 00:03:19,840 --> 00:03:24,680 Speaker 1: next purchase from Viva Cosmetics. Also, just going back to 50 00:03:24,680 --> 00:03:28,079 Speaker 1: the campaign, I want to thank our unders thank you 51 00:03:28,520 --> 00:03:31,560 Speaker 1: so much for getting us closer to our goal. We 52 00:03:31,600 --> 00:03:33,959 Speaker 1: could not do this without you. And just to give 53 00:03:33,960 --> 00:03:38,680 Speaker 1: you some perspective, we have twenty four thousand followers on 54 00:03:38,760 --> 00:03:42,760 Speaker 1: the Instagram. If each person donated five dollars, we would 55 00:03:42,840 --> 00:03:47,120 Speaker 1: meet our goal immediately basically and then some. So no 56 00:03:47,200 --> 00:03:50,280 Speaker 1: amount is too small. You know, if you can't meet 57 00:03:50,440 --> 00:03:55,000 Speaker 1: the minimal donation of I think seventy five, no worries. 58 00:03:55,080 --> 00:03:59,520 Speaker 1: Your contribution no matter the amount always helps. Really, so 59 00:03:59,600 --> 00:04:04,240 Speaker 1: you can to I fund women dot Com, Forward Slash Projects, 60 00:04:04,440 --> 00:04:09,080 Speaker 1: Forward Slash Local Dash productions. You can also check out 61 00:04:09,120 --> 00:04:12,080 Speaker 1: the link in our Instagram bio and that will take 62 00:04:12,120 --> 00:04:15,000 Speaker 1: you right to the campaign. I also want to give 63 00:04:15,040 --> 00:04:21,680 Speaker 1: a quick shout out to gas and we were in 64 00:04:21,720 --> 00:04:26,960 Speaker 1: conversation with them this past Thursday. The Chicano Studies Institute 65 00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:31,600 Speaker 1: of UC Santa Barbara invited us to host another conversation 66 00:04:31,640 --> 00:04:35,120 Speaker 1: with and she is someone that we admire, that we 67 00:04:35,320 --> 00:04:37,479 Speaker 1: learn from. And also, in case you didn't know, she 68 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:42,320 Speaker 1: coined the term Selenida and she is you know response 69 00:04:42,440 --> 00:04:48,360 Speaker 1: she is the Selena scholar right responsible for archiving interviews, 70 00:04:49,400 --> 00:04:54,120 Speaker 1: UM a ton of data from when Selena died and 71 00:04:54,160 --> 00:04:57,800 Speaker 1: also her memory and everything that has persevered afterwards. So 72 00:04:58,040 --> 00:05:01,200 Speaker 1: check out her book Selenida. And there's also a recording 73 00:05:01,279 --> 00:05:04,080 Speaker 1: floating around of the conversation. So once we have that, 74 00:05:04,160 --> 00:05:09,359 Speaker 1: we will link it somewhere, probably on our website. Yes, yes, 75 00:05:09,560 --> 00:05:14,240 Speaker 1: we've been really busy over here in local Landia and uh, 76 00:05:14,520 --> 00:05:19,800 Speaker 1: we wanted to take a minute to acknowledge some events 77 00:05:20,040 --> 00:05:22,600 Speaker 1: in the world. I mean living in the United States, 78 00:05:22,600 --> 00:05:25,279 Speaker 1: to be quite honest, the police state in which we 79 00:05:25,680 --> 00:05:28,719 Speaker 1: really and truly find ourselves. It seems that there is 80 00:05:28,760 --> 00:05:34,960 Speaker 1: a never ending cycle of violence and police brutality. And 81 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:41,479 Speaker 1: as people with platforms, as podcasters, as media makers, we 82 00:05:41,560 --> 00:05:44,360 Speaker 1: do feel that it is important for us, as part 83 00:05:44,400 --> 00:05:49,200 Speaker 1: of our radiophonic novella and our podcasting journey, to include 84 00:05:49,520 --> 00:05:52,880 Speaker 1: right um these events in the world and to say 85 00:05:52,880 --> 00:05:57,320 Speaker 1: the names of victims of police violence as part of 86 00:05:57,400 --> 00:06:00,200 Speaker 1: this archive that we're creating. Right So, we're not going 87 00:06:00,279 --> 00:06:03,640 Speaker 1: to do a deep dive into each of these recent cases. 88 00:06:04,120 --> 00:06:08,200 Speaker 1: It would be honestly impossible to give every victim of 89 00:06:08,240 --> 00:06:12,760 Speaker 1: police violence they're they're due um on a podcast like this, 90 00:06:13,120 --> 00:06:15,159 Speaker 1: but we do want to acknowledge their teen year old 91 00:06:15,200 --> 00:06:18,520 Speaker 1: Adam Tooleto, who was killed by police in Chicago. UM. 92 00:06:18,560 --> 00:06:22,760 Speaker 1: We want to also acknowledge Dante right Um, who was 93 00:06:22,839 --> 00:06:26,560 Speaker 1: murdered by police in Minnesota. We do have a really 94 00:06:26,760 --> 00:06:32,080 Speaker 1: important interview with Grace Chang. We've been discussing um anti 95 00:06:32,120 --> 00:06:35,240 Speaker 1: Asian hate on local Toora a little bit, and we 96 00:06:35,440 --> 00:06:39,400 Speaker 1: provided a platform to Gabriella Los Angeles and the ASI. 97 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:41,160 Speaker 1: Do you want to talk a little bit about Gabriella 98 00:06:41,200 --> 00:06:44,080 Speaker 1: Los Angeles and the i G takeover that they did 99 00:06:44,120 --> 00:06:48,479 Speaker 1: with us. Yeah, absolutely so. I was connected with some 100 00:06:48,560 --> 00:06:51,960 Speaker 1: members of Gabe La Los Angeles UM and they are 101 00:06:52,320 --> 00:06:57,760 Speaker 1: a Filipina lead organization based in l A. There are 102 00:06:57,800 --> 00:07:03,239 Speaker 1: grassroots organization and they are just working on dismantling imperialism, 103 00:07:03,320 --> 00:07:07,479 Speaker 1: and so they did an incredible takeover on look at 104 00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:12,720 Speaker 1: our radio. I was so impressed by the media assets 105 00:07:12,760 --> 00:07:17,720 Speaker 1: that they created. They were super educational, informative. I was 106 00:07:17,800 --> 00:07:21,960 Speaker 1: super impressed and like really amazed by the amount of 107 00:07:21,960 --> 00:07:25,480 Speaker 1: work that they put into teaching us about what they're 108 00:07:25,520 --> 00:07:29,200 Speaker 1: working on, to teaching us about the history of imperialism 109 00:07:29,240 --> 00:07:35,520 Speaker 1: in the Philippines and also contextualizing the recent waves of 110 00:07:36,200 --> 00:07:39,600 Speaker 1: hate crimes against the Asian community as something that is 111 00:07:39,920 --> 00:07:42,720 Speaker 1: not recent, right. It may be in the in the 112 00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:46,320 Speaker 1: sphere right now, in the new sphere, but there's actual 113 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:52,960 Speaker 1: historical um events that have transpired for decades, right that 114 00:07:53,040 --> 00:07:55,360 Speaker 1: have led us to this moment. And so it's not 115 00:07:55,640 --> 00:07:59,120 Speaker 1: has not just been the pandemic, but a ton of 116 00:07:59,160 --> 00:08:02,600 Speaker 1: other things that have historical events that have happened in 117 00:08:02,640 --> 00:08:06,040 Speaker 1: the past. So if you missed it, do not worry. 118 00:08:06,080 --> 00:08:09,480 Speaker 1: You can head over to our i G Stories. They're 119 00:08:09,520 --> 00:08:12,880 Speaker 1: saved out a highlight under Gabriela. And if there is 120 00:08:12,920 --> 00:08:17,320 Speaker 1: an organization that you think should have an Instagram takeover, 121 00:08:17,480 --> 00:08:20,200 Speaker 1: like let us know. If you're a part of the organization, 122 00:08:20,400 --> 00:08:23,560 Speaker 1: send us an email, We would love to offer the platform. 123 00:08:23,640 --> 00:08:27,480 Speaker 1: As the podcast continues to grow, we cannot always offer 124 00:08:27,520 --> 00:08:30,840 Speaker 1: an interview, and so we're trying to get creative and 125 00:08:30,840 --> 00:08:34,839 Speaker 1: and um really lean on the different platforms that we have, 126 00:08:34,920 --> 00:08:37,520 Speaker 1: whether that be the Patreon, So definitely you'll be seeing 127 00:08:37,520 --> 00:08:41,000 Speaker 1: more interviews on the Patreon or if it's an Instagram takeover, 128 00:08:41,400 --> 00:08:43,600 Speaker 1: a newsletter, shout out all of that. So we're really 129 00:08:43,600 --> 00:08:46,240 Speaker 1: trying to get creative with the way that we uplift 130 00:08:46,360 --> 00:08:48,840 Speaker 1: different voices on look at that our radio, and so 131 00:08:48,880 --> 00:08:51,120 Speaker 1: it might not always be on the podcast, but definitely 132 00:08:51,120 --> 00:08:53,880 Speaker 1: know we are trying to create space in some way 133 00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:58,800 Speaker 1: in loc Labia. Yes, yes we are. It's a process 134 00:08:58,880 --> 00:09:01,240 Speaker 1: and we thank you all for being here on this 135 00:09:01,320 --> 00:09:04,160 Speaker 1: journey and for rocking with us and writing with us 136 00:09:04,200 --> 00:09:08,280 Speaker 1: and for tuning in. So we also want to plug 137 00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:12,280 Speaker 1: that being said, a really cool Patreon interview that we 138 00:09:12,360 --> 00:09:19,040 Speaker 1: did recently with one Julie Bigneto, who is a really 139 00:09:19,160 --> 00:09:27,400 Speaker 1: um interesting person, stand up comedian, writer, podcast producer, and 140 00:09:27,840 --> 00:09:35,640 Speaker 1: uh Latina who is currently uh performing a mixed media 141 00:09:35,720 --> 00:09:40,520 Speaker 1: show called The Lass that comes from a really sad, 142 00:09:40,600 --> 00:09:43,160 Speaker 1: really tragic place. THEO said, do you want to share 143 00:09:43,160 --> 00:09:47,680 Speaker 1: a little bit about Julie's story and her partner who 144 00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:52,480 Speaker 1: figures so prominently in this show and that she talks 145 00:09:52,520 --> 00:09:57,600 Speaker 1: about in our interview. Okay, So Julie Pagnietto wrote this 146 00:09:58,160 --> 00:10:03,880 Speaker 1: really incredibly moving, incredibly vulnerable show that she's hosting over Zoom. 147 00:10:03,920 --> 00:10:07,959 Speaker 1: She's performing over Zoom. There're still tickets available and it's 148 00:10:08,000 --> 00:10:11,240 Speaker 1: also free, by the way, And it comes from a 149 00:10:11,240 --> 00:10:15,640 Speaker 1: tragic place like Mala mentioned where her partner was brutally 150 00:10:15,720 --> 00:10:20,120 Speaker 1: murdered at the end of twenty couple months later, we'd 151 00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:22,680 Speaker 1: go into a pandemic, right, And so while she's dealing 152 00:10:22,760 --> 00:10:26,520 Speaker 1: with her grief, she creates this show. Her partner was 153 00:10:26,600 --> 00:10:31,480 Speaker 1: a VR creator. She takes his background in VR and 154 00:10:31,840 --> 00:10:35,720 Speaker 1: uses that as a way to preserve his legacy, preserve 155 00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:39,600 Speaker 1: his work, and also re imagine what the relationship could 156 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:41,959 Speaker 1: have looked like. And it's incredibly moving. And I think 157 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:45,160 Speaker 1: that we've all been experiencing grief in one way or 158 00:10:45,200 --> 00:10:47,839 Speaker 1: another this past year, and that was also what moved 159 00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:52,800 Speaker 1: her to create the j Yes Um You may have 160 00:10:52,960 --> 00:10:58,440 Speaker 1: heard of the murder of Julie's partner. So his name 161 00:10:58,520 --> 00:11:04,240 Speaker 1: was Um Say Samprano and he was only twenty six 162 00:11:04,320 --> 00:11:07,880 Speaker 1: years old. He was working in like the s I said, VR, 163 00:11:08,360 --> 00:11:11,600 Speaker 1: and he was a video game developer and entrepreneur who 164 00:11:11,640 --> 00:11:14,360 Speaker 1: was making a name for himself. UM So, if you 165 00:11:14,360 --> 00:11:17,280 Speaker 1: don't know about the case, you can read more about it. 166 00:11:17,679 --> 00:11:21,439 Speaker 1: Head over to our Patreon, become a subscriber to listen 167 00:11:21,480 --> 00:11:25,560 Speaker 1: to Julie's full interview, and you can also get a 168 00:11:25,600 --> 00:11:28,720 Speaker 1: ticket to her show and support. It's going to be 169 00:11:28,800 --> 00:11:32,520 Speaker 1: running through basically the end of this month, so head 170 00:11:32,520 --> 00:11:35,920 Speaker 1: over to Patreon to learn more and to tune into that. 171 00:11:36,240 --> 00:11:41,480 Speaker 1: Um really moving interview with Julie Pigneto. Okay, so now 172 00:11:41,920 --> 00:11:45,840 Speaker 1: you have the immense honor and privilege to chat with 173 00:11:45,920 --> 00:11:49,240 Speaker 1: my former professor, Grace Chang. She is a professor at 174 00:11:49,280 --> 00:11:54,320 Speaker 1: UC Santa Barbara, an overall amazing badass individual. She's a writer, 175 00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:59,080 Speaker 1: she's an author, she is an activist. Uh, she's just 176 00:11:59,160 --> 00:12:02,760 Speaker 1: an overall, you know, amazing phenomenal person that I've had 177 00:12:02,800 --> 00:12:06,160 Speaker 1: the immense honor to learn from and we're all going 178 00:12:06,200 --> 00:12:12,720 Speaker 1: to be learning from her today. She has an amazing background, expertise, knowledge, 179 00:12:12,880 --> 00:12:15,320 Speaker 1: all of that. So, without further ado, here is our 180 00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:19,840 Speaker 1: interview with Grace check. Welcome Grace, Thank you so much. 181 00:12:19,920 --> 00:12:24,520 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for inviting me to speak about 182 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:27,440 Speaker 1: this really important or to have this conversation about this 183 00:12:27,640 --> 00:12:32,400 Speaker 1: incredibly important UM set of issues, and it's so nice 184 00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:35,560 Speaker 1: to be back in touch. Absolutely thank you. You know, 185 00:12:35,640 --> 00:12:39,120 Speaker 1: before we dive into the conversation, I would love to 186 00:12:39,440 --> 00:12:43,040 Speaker 1: give you the time and space right now to introduce 187 00:12:43,080 --> 00:12:45,280 Speaker 1: yourself and you know, in your own words, and talk 188 00:12:45,320 --> 00:12:48,560 Speaker 1: about your work and and anything you want to share 189 00:12:48,600 --> 00:12:51,800 Speaker 1: with us well. UM. I guess the way that we 190 00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:55,800 Speaker 1: have connected it is as you mentioned, I've been a 191 00:12:55,800 --> 00:12:59,839 Speaker 1: professor at UC Santa Barbara now for almost twenty years, 192 00:13:00,040 --> 00:13:04,280 Speaker 1: and I primarily teach about social justice movements. So I 193 00:13:04,320 --> 00:13:08,760 Speaker 1: teach about social justice movements, particularly from an intersexual framework, 194 00:13:08,840 --> 00:13:13,120 Speaker 1: and I try to look at how people's experiences of 195 00:13:14,640 --> 00:13:18,400 Speaker 1: living and working at the intersections of of so many 196 00:13:18,400 --> 00:13:24,040 Speaker 1: different actas of oppression and how that influences both their 197 00:13:24,080 --> 00:13:29,720 Speaker 1: experiences as UM people who are our survivors of oppression, 198 00:13:29,800 --> 00:13:33,240 Speaker 1: and also how they fight back UM and the ways 199 00:13:33,320 --> 00:13:39,079 Speaker 1: that that can influence as well the success or UM 200 00:13:39,280 --> 00:13:44,040 Speaker 1: or demise in some cases of UM coalitional work, UM 201 00:13:44,080 --> 00:13:49,720 Speaker 1: solidarity work, the different ways that movements can be divided 202 00:13:49,760 --> 00:13:53,600 Speaker 1: from each other, and people can be pitted against each other, 203 00:13:54,520 --> 00:13:58,400 Speaker 1: um in movement work, and I think that that's sometimes 204 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:01,200 Speaker 1: those are sometimes things that people don't want to look 205 00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:03,200 Speaker 1: at per se or they want to they don't want 206 00:14:03,200 --> 00:14:06,240 Speaker 1: to highlight them necessarily. It's it's not necessarily good pr 207 00:14:06,720 --> 00:14:10,600 Speaker 1: but it's incredibly important to look at how sometimes movements 208 00:14:10,840 --> 00:14:14,120 Speaker 1: can be at odds with each other. And it's because 209 00:14:14,120 --> 00:14:19,160 Speaker 1: we are being pitted against each other, both as individuals 210 00:14:20,080 --> 00:14:25,240 Speaker 1: with our experiences and in movements and in organizations. So 211 00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:28,960 Speaker 1: that's kind of the framework that I am right and 212 00:14:29,040 --> 00:14:34,200 Speaker 1: teach within, and um, I think that it plays out 213 00:14:34,360 --> 00:14:37,360 Speaker 1: so much in the work that I'm doing right now, 214 00:14:37,800 --> 00:14:41,080 Speaker 1: the research that I've been doing now for about two 215 00:14:41,160 --> 00:14:47,240 Speaker 1: decades on human trafficking and the ways that organizations that 216 00:14:47,360 --> 00:14:52,720 Speaker 1: are supposedly or allegedly carrying on the mission of anti 217 00:14:52,720 --> 00:14:58,520 Speaker 1: trafficking can often actually be very destructive and damaging towards 218 00:14:59,080 --> 00:15:03,640 Speaker 1: people who are are are being exploited on the level 219 00:15:03,680 --> 00:15:08,200 Speaker 1: of trafficking, yet they're not being identified as so called 220 00:15:08,320 --> 00:15:10,800 Speaker 1: victims of trafficking, and they use the term victims because 221 00:15:10,800 --> 00:15:14,320 Speaker 1: it's the legal term that people use. In order two, 222 00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:18,960 Speaker 1: it's unfortunately the legal term that UM and identification that 223 00:15:19,040 --> 00:15:24,120 Speaker 1: makes people eligible for different forms of support and resources 224 00:15:24,160 --> 00:15:26,840 Speaker 1: as victims of trafficking UM. I don't use it in 225 00:15:26,880 --> 00:15:29,840 Speaker 1: the in the sense of poor helpless victim who can't 226 00:15:29,840 --> 00:15:34,520 Speaker 1: do anything for themselves. Right, And you know you probably 227 00:15:34,560 --> 00:15:39,600 Speaker 1: remember me ranting about how people who are often identified 228 00:15:39,760 --> 00:15:45,400 Speaker 1: as as victims are in fact that the most able 229 00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:50,920 Speaker 1: and the most UM competent in in being able to 230 00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:55,080 Speaker 1: fight for themselves and to fight against the exploitation and 231 00:15:55,280 --> 00:16:00,320 Speaker 1: victimization that they might have experienced. So rather than someone 232 00:16:00,680 --> 00:16:04,280 Speaker 1: coming from on high or coming from a very paternalistic 233 00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:12,000 Speaker 1: or maternalistic position UM or colonial perspective quote saving victims 234 00:16:12,200 --> 00:16:17,920 Speaker 1: UM really like to look at how people say themselves. 235 00:16:17,920 --> 00:16:23,520 Speaker 1: People fight for themselves. They fight intergenerationally and across lots 236 00:16:23,520 --> 00:16:27,800 Speaker 1: of different boundaries to try to to do solidarity work 237 00:16:27,840 --> 00:16:33,080 Speaker 1: and to try to to expose where we are being 238 00:16:33,440 --> 00:16:39,040 Speaker 1: exploited across different lines or oppressed UM in these UM 239 00:16:39,440 --> 00:16:44,520 Speaker 1: intersectional ways and oppressors are sort of quite expert at 240 00:16:44,560 --> 00:16:47,760 Speaker 1: doing that, and so we have up our game and 241 00:16:48,360 --> 00:16:52,840 Speaker 1: be experts in resisting along those lines as well. Yeah, 242 00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:54,280 Speaker 1: you know, I love that you set all of that. 243 00:16:54,360 --> 00:16:58,320 Speaker 1: There's so much there I mean first about coalition building, right, 244 00:16:58,400 --> 00:17:01,200 Speaker 1: And I think that we're in a moment, we're having 245 00:17:01,400 --> 00:17:03,680 Speaker 1: what we've been having moments, right, But I think that 246 00:17:04,440 --> 00:17:09,760 Speaker 1: now we're there's this opportunity for these different groups of 247 00:17:09,800 --> 00:17:13,800 Speaker 1: people to really coalesced and to really build solidarity with 248 00:17:13,840 --> 00:17:17,960 Speaker 1: each other. Um. And like you said, there has there 249 00:17:18,000 --> 00:17:22,520 Speaker 1: have been many times where these groups have been purposely dismantled, 250 00:17:22,600 --> 00:17:25,000 Speaker 1: you know. I'm like thinking about the Black Panthers and 251 00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:29,479 Speaker 1: the Yellow Peril coalition building that was happening, and you know, 252 00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:32,480 Speaker 1: not that work wasn't happened, Not that work hasn't been 253 00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:35,440 Speaker 1: happening since then, or any movement building has been happening 254 00:17:35,480 --> 00:17:38,760 Speaker 1: since then, but I think there's been a way that 255 00:17:38,800 --> 00:17:42,399 Speaker 1: people have had to kind of go under reps, you know, um, 256 00:17:42,440 --> 00:17:45,280 Speaker 1: and to be creative in the type of coalition building 257 00:17:45,359 --> 00:17:48,080 Speaker 1: that they have to do, because if not, they're targeted 258 00:17:48,080 --> 00:17:50,399 Speaker 1: by the state. Right. And so I'm really glad that 259 00:17:50,440 --> 00:17:53,240 Speaker 1: you mentioned that because there's such an for lack of 260 00:17:53,280 --> 00:17:56,560 Speaker 1: a better word, opportunity right now to build with each other. 261 00:17:57,119 --> 00:18:01,919 Speaker 1: Absolutely absolutely, And was just looking at an article by 262 00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:06,679 Speaker 1: Victoria Law who wrote in Street Out and UM, a 263 00:18:06,760 --> 00:18:11,960 Speaker 1: really um important I think response to the tragedy in Atlanta, 264 00:18:13,720 --> 00:18:16,679 Speaker 1: the historical context and all of it. And one of 265 00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:20,760 Speaker 1: the articles called activist counter anti Asian Racism through community 266 00:18:20,840 --> 00:18:25,720 Speaker 1: safe safety Initiatives. And one of the best parts UM 267 00:18:25,760 --> 00:18:28,719 Speaker 1: that I think that she talks about is UM so so, 268 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:32,000 Speaker 1: first of all, she she talks about the UM Red 269 00:18:32,040 --> 00:18:36,679 Speaker 1: Canary Song collective of Asian sex workers UM, massage workers 270 00:18:36,680 --> 00:18:40,560 Speaker 1: and allies in New York, New York City, and so 271 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:45,119 Speaker 1: she kind of trasses the very tragic history UM or 272 00:18:45,280 --> 00:18:49,199 Speaker 1: the sort of initiation of the of the collective, and 273 00:18:49,280 --> 00:18:52,919 Speaker 1: that was that it was created in response to this 274 00:18:53,200 --> 00:18:59,320 Speaker 1: terrible death of Um Young Song, who was a thirty 275 00:18:59,320 --> 00:19:05,080 Speaker 1: eight year old massage worker who fell from her fourth 276 00:19:05,240 --> 00:19:10,280 Speaker 1: floor apartment to her death, and she was being chased. UM. 277 00:19:10,280 --> 00:19:13,160 Speaker 1: It's understood that she was being chased by police who 278 00:19:13,320 --> 00:19:17,320 Speaker 1: were attempting to arrest her allegedly for engaging in sex work. 279 00:19:17,560 --> 00:19:21,879 Speaker 1: And UM she had also been sexually assaulted by a 280 00:19:21,920 --> 00:19:24,920 Speaker 1: person who had claimed to be a police officer. UM 281 00:19:25,000 --> 00:19:29,359 Speaker 1: she had been arrested on sex work charges UM months 282 00:19:29,400 --> 00:19:34,560 Speaker 1: before that. And I think this was very awful, tragic 283 00:19:34,800 --> 00:19:39,760 Speaker 1: beginning of a collective that is very much alive and 284 00:19:39,800 --> 00:19:44,360 Speaker 1: well now and working in UM Flushing in Queens, New York, 285 00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:49,000 Speaker 1: and working with a whole network of organizations who are 286 00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:52,960 Speaker 1: demanding the decratalization of sex work in New York. It's 287 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:56,240 Speaker 1: called decrim New York. And one of the things that 288 00:19:56,320 --> 00:20:00,440 Speaker 1: Victoria Law talks about is that from the beginning there 289 00:20:00,560 --> 00:20:05,640 Speaker 1: were there was this history of the UM tragic death 290 00:20:05,640 --> 00:20:08,760 Speaker 1: of Young Song, but there was also what she says 291 00:20:08,800 --> 00:20:11,960 Speaker 1: is that there there were years since that was in 292 00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:16,840 Speaker 1: two thousand seventeen UM, there were years where this organization's 293 00:20:16,880 --> 00:20:22,600 Speaker 1: work could really build and grow and be understood within 294 00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:27,240 Speaker 1: the community as trustworthy and reliable and UM they were. 295 00:20:27,520 --> 00:20:30,280 Speaker 1: They did for knocking, and they did all types of 296 00:20:30,720 --> 00:20:37,240 Speaker 1: advocacy and assistance including mutual aid and giving people support 297 00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:42,280 Speaker 1: of whether it was groceries or cash, assistance and information 298 00:20:42,520 --> 00:20:45,359 Speaker 1: and and know your rights and all of the things 299 00:20:45,400 --> 00:20:49,960 Speaker 1: that that enabled people to survive and particularly enabled people 300 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:56,480 Speaker 1: survived through this pandemic. Not that always write saying saying 301 00:20:56,480 --> 00:21:03,280 Speaker 1: things as if it's in the past, and yeah, but 302 00:21:03,280 --> 00:21:07,359 Speaker 1: but you know, in reading the recent history of the 303 00:21:08,280 --> 00:21:12,280 Speaker 1: Red Canary Song Collective, I feel like it's it is 304 00:21:12,400 --> 00:21:18,359 Speaker 1: very parallel with UM. What people don't necessarily always think 305 00:21:18,440 --> 00:21:23,480 Speaker 1: of the Black Panther movement UM being pivotal in which 306 00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:26,600 Speaker 1: is also providing mutual aid, but but not just providing it, 307 00:21:27,359 --> 00:21:31,800 Speaker 1: establishing the principle of it. Right, And the principle was 308 00:21:32,400 --> 00:21:35,560 Speaker 1: that we do this and we provide basic needs for 309 00:21:35,600 --> 00:21:40,080 Speaker 1: people to survive until the revolution, right, and then when 310 00:21:40,119 --> 00:21:43,639 Speaker 1: the revolution comes that we're prepared and people are solid 311 00:21:43,760 --> 00:21:46,720 Speaker 1: and people are cared for and have their basic needs 312 00:21:46,760 --> 00:21:50,520 Speaker 1: taken care of, you know, by each other, right and um, 313 00:21:50,600 --> 00:21:53,480 Speaker 1: and that is an alternative to capitalism, and that is 314 00:21:53,480 --> 00:21:56,399 Speaker 1: an alternative to all of the violent, exploitative systems that 315 00:21:56,440 --> 00:22:01,840 Speaker 1: we experience. So UM, I feel like any any collective 316 00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:06,639 Speaker 1: that is like Reacknurson that is really following that model 317 00:22:06,680 --> 00:22:12,840 Speaker 1: and following that historical precedent is just so so critically needed, 318 00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:17,760 Speaker 1: so revolutionary in that that principle can't get lost. We 319 00:22:17,880 --> 00:22:22,400 Speaker 1: cannot lose that principle along the way, or we will, um, 320 00:22:23,080 --> 00:22:25,760 Speaker 1: or we will ultimately fail. Right. Yeah, thank you so 321 00:22:25,840 --> 00:22:29,200 Speaker 1: much for providing information about Red Canary Song. I've been 322 00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:31,600 Speaker 1: following them for a while now and I like love 323 00:22:31,640 --> 00:22:33,520 Speaker 1: seeing the work that they're doing, and I think it's 324 00:22:33,520 --> 00:22:38,840 Speaker 1: a really tangible way to get involved with what they're doing, 325 00:22:39,040 --> 00:22:44,760 Speaker 1: or perhaps find your own local grassroots organization that's also 326 00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:49,080 Speaker 1: providing mutual aid and decriminalizing sex work or their goal 327 00:22:49,119 --> 00:22:52,159 Speaker 1: is to decriminalize sex work up because that's definitely a 328 00:22:52,240 --> 00:22:57,440 Speaker 1: nationwide movement that's happening. Um so, I definitely encourage folks 329 00:22:57,520 --> 00:23:03,440 Speaker 1: to check them out. So when talking about the shooting 330 00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:07,359 Speaker 1: in Atlanta, right there were I noticed that there was 331 00:23:07,400 --> 00:23:10,240 Speaker 1: a lot of media attention in the very beginning right 332 00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:15,440 Speaker 1: and then as soon as it was revealed that perhaps 333 00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:17,800 Speaker 1: some of the women working there were sex workers, I 334 00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:21,800 Speaker 1: felt that I there was less coverage, like significantly less coverage. 335 00:23:21,920 --> 00:23:26,280 Speaker 1: And I also saw that other Asian journalists were pointing 336 00:23:26,320 --> 00:23:28,160 Speaker 1: this out as well. So I wanted to hear your 337 00:23:28,200 --> 00:23:30,680 Speaker 1: perspective on that. And I think it's safe to say 338 00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:33,400 Speaker 1: we know why, right, but let's talk about the why. 339 00:23:33,680 --> 00:23:37,040 Speaker 1: So I I I often see both sides of the 340 00:23:37,480 --> 00:23:41,520 Speaker 1: two cents, which is either the media just drops it 341 00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:45,359 Speaker 1: and is not interested or does just um you know, 342 00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:51,840 Speaker 1: unfortunately often very racialized and terrible accounts um or, or 343 00:23:51,920 --> 00:23:55,119 Speaker 1: there's a particular spin, And in this case, the particular 344 00:23:55,160 --> 00:24:00,960 Speaker 1: spin was to really focus on Um, it's workers, and 345 00:24:00,960 --> 00:24:05,720 Speaker 1: and how can we and this basically asked backwards idea 346 00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:08,280 Speaker 1: that oh, well, how can we avoid this tragedy again? 347 00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:11,880 Speaker 1: We can avoid it by um, let's raid these massage 348 00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:16,720 Speaker 1: workers and massage right, you know places more often. Right. 349 00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:21,919 Speaker 1: And so I feel like there have there has been 350 00:24:22,720 --> 00:24:26,280 Speaker 1: to me, at least in the alternative presses that I follow, 351 00:24:26,840 --> 00:24:32,320 Speaker 1: there's been some really good responses to that and understandings 352 00:24:32,880 --> 00:24:36,800 Speaker 1: and trying to bring back understandings of of how this 353 00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:39,439 Speaker 1: is not the way to go. This is that is 354 00:24:39,480 --> 00:24:42,600 Speaker 1: not going to serve people. UM. And I wanna do 355 00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:47,000 Speaker 1: a shout out to a report that was done by 356 00:24:47,040 --> 00:24:49,879 Speaker 1: the Urban Justice Center, the Sex Workers Project of the 357 00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:54,080 Speaker 1: Urban Justice Center in two thou nine. And Um, as 358 00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:57,919 Speaker 1: you and I were speaking about, you know, these studies 359 00:24:57,960 --> 00:25:01,280 Speaker 1: get done over and over again, and if if people 360 00:25:01,280 --> 00:25:06,280 Speaker 1: could just pay attention to the really important findings of 361 00:25:06,320 --> 00:25:09,040 Speaker 1: these studies, it would be that would be really helpful. Right. 362 00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:13,840 Speaker 1: And the bottom line of this UM study and the 363 00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:16,399 Speaker 1: report that came out that was called Kicking down the 364 00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:19,720 Speaker 1: Door at the Effects of anti Trafficking Raids, it essentially 365 00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:22,399 Speaker 1: said that Melissa did More was the author was a 366 00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:26,320 Speaker 1: primary author and basically found that most people who had 367 00:25:26,320 --> 00:25:31,840 Speaker 1: self identified as having been trafficked actually helped themselves they 368 00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:36,520 Speaker 1: quote rescued or saved themselves. Right. That it was very 369 00:25:36,520 --> 00:25:40,600 Speaker 1: clear that service providers did not actually find those cases 370 00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:45,720 Speaker 1: through raids UM. And that people who have experienced trafficking 371 00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:50,000 Speaker 1: are actually the ones who can best identify other trafficking victims. 372 00:25:50,680 --> 00:25:55,679 Speaker 1: They know what to look for. Um. And and on 373 00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:59,200 Speaker 1: the flip side, traffic sex workers who had been arrested 374 00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:02,600 Speaker 1: multiple time times actually didn't get identified by the police 375 00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:07,720 Speaker 1: or by other law enforcement as having been trafficking victims. 376 00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:12,520 Speaker 1: So there you go. I mean, right, they're virtually these 377 00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:16,040 Speaker 1: raids are not only virtually worthless in terms of what 378 00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:19,960 Speaker 1: they're supposedly trying to do, um, which I have questions about, 379 00:26:20,760 --> 00:26:26,320 Speaker 1: but um, they're also incredibly traumatizing, you know, incredibly impactful 380 00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:30,960 Speaker 1: to people who are hauled off, you know, have their 381 00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:34,480 Speaker 1: lives disrupted, sometimes get out it in different ways that 382 00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:37,320 Speaker 1: they don't want, you know, to be there. And they're 383 00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:41,960 Speaker 1: not actually provided with resources or support services or anything 384 00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:45,919 Speaker 1: that could actually make their lives better. And so what's 385 00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:48,479 Speaker 1: the actual point of the raid if it's not, in 386 00:26:48,560 --> 00:26:52,760 Speaker 1: fact just to criminalize people and to terrorize people essentially, 387 00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:57,520 Speaker 1: right and um, yeah, so these calls for oh, let's 388 00:26:57,640 --> 00:27:02,520 Speaker 1: let's crack down on massage parlors or let's um increase 389 00:27:02,560 --> 00:27:06,840 Speaker 1: the raids, um and really step that up. That who 390 00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:08,719 Speaker 1: is that going to serve? That's going to serve the police? 391 00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:12,840 Speaker 1: Of course? Of course sensationalist media and that's about it. 392 00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:18,000 Speaker 1: And do anything for these victims or potential victims, right, 393 00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:21,040 Speaker 1: and by victims and the victims of the shootings, not 394 00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:25,399 Speaker 1: that not on victims in in um this you know, 395 00:27:25,520 --> 00:27:29,840 Speaker 1: sort of saviors terms, right right, right, Yeah, I mean 396 00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:33,280 Speaker 1: there's so much there. I mean, yeah, there's just so 397 00:27:33,359 --> 00:27:38,000 Speaker 1: much there. Like what you're saying is that the quote 398 00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:41,400 Speaker 1: victims right of sex trafficking really are just saving themselves 399 00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:46,200 Speaker 1: and it really just complicates complicates that that perfect victim narrative, 400 00:27:46,520 --> 00:27:50,600 Speaker 1: right that I think very much sensationalizes what these raids 401 00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:54,000 Speaker 1: are meant to do, right, quote protect and quote safe, 402 00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:57,960 Speaker 1: but in reality they're actually just helping the police, as 403 00:27:57,960 --> 00:28:02,199 Speaker 1: you said, absolutely so, Grace. You mentioned that there is 404 00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:05,040 Speaker 1: a lot of lip service being done when it comes 405 00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:09,480 Speaker 1: to sex work and sex workers rights. Can you elaborate 406 00:28:09,640 --> 00:28:12,720 Speaker 1: on what you mean by that, what does this slip 407 00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:15,320 Speaker 1: service look like or what is it? What it tell 408 00:28:15,359 --> 00:28:19,080 Speaker 1: me more about that? Yeah, absolutely, so I'm gonna go 409 00:28:19,119 --> 00:28:23,320 Speaker 1: straight to the top, Yes, Kamala Harris for for for 410 00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:28,639 Speaker 1: a minute again and there Yeah, so, UM, there were 411 00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:32,639 Speaker 1: these historic raids UM and it was called Operation Gilded Cage. 412 00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:36,040 Speaker 1: They always come up with these fabulous names for these raids. 413 00:28:36,359 --> 00:28:40,920 Speaker 1: I remember one was like Operation Orchid or something. Um. 414 00:28:40,960 --> 00:28:44,560 Speaker 1: But but the one that I'm talking about, Operation Guilded 415 00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:48,280 Speaker 1: Cage in two thousand and five was supposedly at that 416 00:28:48,320 --> 00:28:52,520 Speaker 1: time the largest sex trafficking bust ever. Right and and 417 00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:59,680 Speaker 1: Kamala Harris's response was quite interesting. She and she and 418 00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:03,920 Speaker 1: E Lee, who's a long time sex worker rights organizer, 419 00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:07,840 Speaker 1: is generally credited with UM with creating the term sex 420 00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:11,200 Speaker 1: worker and sex worker. Um, they sort of did these 421 00:29:11,320 --> 00:29:17,120 Speaker 1: dueling Uh, they sort of didn't op ed battle um 422 00:29:17,120 --> 00:29:19,400 Speaker 1: and I can't remember whose came out first, but Carol 423 00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:21,760 Speaker 1: Lee was basically trying to lay out the spectrum the 424 00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:28,360 Speaker 1: whole how people in people can be in sex work voluntarily, 425 00:29:28,760 --> 00:29:33,480 Speaker 1: they can be not trafficked or forced to engage in 426 00:29:33,520 --> 00:29:35,920 Speaker 1: sex work, but they can still face other abuses. They 427 00:29:35,920 --> 00:29:37,800 Speaker 1: can be cheated out of their wages, they can be 428 00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:43,800 Speaker 1: abused by you know everyone in law enforcement, right, police, cut, UM, FBI, 429 00:29:43,960 --> 00:29:48,880 Speaker 1: you name it. And then also after in the aftermath 430 00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:54,040 Speaker 1: of that raid, the government was withholding people's trafficking visas 431 00:29:54,840 --> 00:29:59,920 Speaker 1: in essence unless they were willing to testify UM sometimes 432 00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:05,080 Speaker 1: not necessarily truthfully right about being trafficked. So if they 433 00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:09,640 Speaker 1: weren't trafficking victims, UM, they were, they were basically facing 434 00:30:09,640 --> 00:30:13,080 Speaker 1: deportation or they were sort of given being giving this 435 00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:17,920 Speaker 1: quote choice that they could testify against these alleged traffickers 436 00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:21,200 Speaker 1: UM and get the goods, right, get the trafficking visas, 437 00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:25,360 Speaker 1: get get the TVSS, and get the resources and services 438 00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:28,240 Speaker 1: that were attached to at so as she said, that 439 00:30:28,320 --> 00:30:32,800 Speaker 1: sounds like an offer you can't refuse, right, yeah, right, 440 00:30:33,440 --> 00:30:36,320 Speaker 1: So you know she's she's quite humorous. UM. And then 441 00:30:36,440 --> 00:30:42,520 Speaker 1: Kamala Harris came with her her response to UM, Operation 442 00:30:42,560 --> 00:30:45,120 Speaker 1: Builded Cage. And so she came, of course from a 443 00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:50,480 Speaker 1: very prosecutorial position UM. And that's always been her her 444 00:30:50,520 --> 00:30:54,840 Speaker 1: approach when she was the San Francisco tier and her 445 00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:58,960 Speaker 1: narrative was really clear. Her narrative was all about, oh 446 00:30:59,040 --> 00:31:04,960 Speaker 1: we saved these stones, um and UM. She was also 447 00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:08,400 Speaker 1: very clear to say, no adults can consent to their 448 00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:11,280 Speaker 1: own abuse. So this is of course the kind of 449 00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:15,840 Speaker 1: classic refrain of the anti sex work camp, right right. 450 00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:21,280 Speaker 1: They they really do a disservice to people's autonomy and 451 00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:25,720 Speaker 1: their ability to speak for themselves by literally saying, well, 452 00:31:26,240 --> 00:31:30,000 Speaker 1: you can't say that you're not abused because we're telling 453 00:31:30,040 --> 00:31:33,760 Speaker 1: you you can't. You can't consent your own abuse. So 454 00:31:33,960 --> 00:31:37,840 Speaker 1: you can't say that you're consenting sex worker, because we're 455 00:31:37,840 --> 00:31:42,000 Speaker 1: going to tell you otherwise, um and UM. So it's 456 00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:44,920 Speaker 1: this ideology that there's that there's no such thing as 457 00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:48,560 Speaker 1: consensual sex work, that all people will commit in commercial 458 00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:51,760 Speaker 1: sex are are victims by definition, right, And that's the 459 00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:56,080 Speaker 1: ideology that I think Kamala Harris was very much promoting, 460 00:31:56,360 --> 00:32:00,800 Speaker 1: very much um alining herself with for or most of 461 00:32:00,840 --> 00:32:05,400 Speaker 1: her years in office. And it was quite convenient that 462 00:32:05,520 --> 00:32:09,520 Speaker 1: when she hit the campaign trail um for for running 463 00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:14,600 Speaker 1: with Biden, Um, she really changed her tune and she 464 00:32:14,720 --> 00:32:19,719 Speaker 1: started coming out in more in the decrim camp, the 465 00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:23,280 Speaker 1: decridinalization of sex work camp, which was a really interesting 466 00:32:23,320 --> 00:32:26,920 Speaker 1: and rapid shift. UM. And I always say, hey, if 467 00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:29,680 Speaker 1: she sticks to it, great, You know that I'm not 468 00:32:29,720 --> 00:32:33,120 Speaker 1: gonna write I'm not going to fall well, I can't 469 00:32:33,120 --> 00:32:35,680 Speaker 1: say I'm not going to follow her. But if she 470 00:32:35,720 --> 00:32:39,560 Speaker 1: sticks to it, great, Right, Like you need someone in yeah, 471 00:32:40,520 --> 00:32:45,320 Speaker 1: absolutely figureship and too to be able to really shift 472 00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:49,720 Speaker 1: that narrative. And who better to do it than her hopefully, 473 00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:52,600 Speaker 1: um so when push comes to shove, I really hope 474 00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:56,680 Speaker 1: that she will stick to that, you know. Yeah, you know, 475 00:32:56,800 --> 00:33:00,440 Speaker 1: and there's a lot of like quote feminists that anti 476 00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:04,040 Speaker 1: sex work right and don't believe sex work can be consensual, 477 00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:07,200 Speaker 1: so that there's a lot there, I mean within our 478 00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:12,200 Speaker 1: own you know, different groups of community and circles and 479 00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:15,640 Speaker 1: movements where you know, we're we're talking to our own 480 00:33:15,640 --> 00:33:18,400 Speaker 1: people that sex work is work right, it is a 481 00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:21,360 Speaker 1: type of labor um I mean, and that's just you know, 482 00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:25,000 Speaker 1: one oh one. But then to talk about decriminalizing it, 483 00:33:25,080 --> 00:33:28,120 Speaker 1: you know, it just seems like there's there's a lot, 484 00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:31,000 Speaker 1: there's a there's a lot, there's a lot of convincing, 485 00:33:31,040 --> 00:33:33,080 Speaker 1: it seems. So when it comes to like the feminist 486 00:33:33,520 --> 00:33:38,120 Speaker 1: groups and circles, it's it's so confusing and really enraging 487 00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:40,800 Speaker 1: to me, Right, you know, there's a lot of work 488 00:33:40,840 --> 00:33:44,600 Speaker 1: to be done, and and one of my, um my 489 00:33:44,680 --> 00:33:49,360 Speaker 1: biggest concerns is that because there's so much focus on 490 00:33:49,600 --> 00:33:53,160 Speaker 1: alleged sex trafficking right right right, yeah, that oh, no 491 00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:57,120 Speaker 1: one can choose that, and everyone is by definition exploited 492 00:33:57,200 --> 00:34:05,200 Speaker 1: and in commercial sex because of that incredible disproportionate, completely 493 00:34:05,240 --> 00:34:11,360 Speaker 1: exaggerated UM on that industry within the realm of talking 494 00:34:11,440 --> 00:34:15,200 Speaker 1: about human trafficking. All these are forms of trafficking in 495 00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:20,680 Speaker 1: other industries that are much more prevalent, that go unnoticed 496 00:34:20,680 --> 00:34:24,680 Speaker 1: and unintended to, and people don't um aren't interesting in 497 00:34:24,760 --> 00:34:28,880 Speaker 1: rallying behind the domestic workers who are also facing trafficking, 498 00:34:29,200 --> 00:34:34,239 Speaker 1: or people in manufacturing, or people absolutely you know, all 499 00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:37,319 Speaker 1: kinds of care work. I mean, yeah, I mean capitalism 500 00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:41,440 Speaker 1: in its existence is exploitative. Any type of labor, you 501 00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:45,040 Speaker 1: have the potential to be exploited by your employer, by 502 00:34:45,120 --> 00:34:50,680 Speaker 1: even a coworker or colleague, exactly, right, exactly, And unfortunately 503 00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:55,120 Speaker 1: people often want to pick the easy and the glamorous 504 00:34:55,160 --> 00:34:58,680 Speaker 1: and the sensational stuff and look at um and they 505 00:34:58,680 --> 00:35:02,560 Speaker 1: want to focus the lens on on sex trafficking, even 506 00:35:02,680 --> 00:35:07,359 Speaker 1: when they don't even necessarily understand what that what that 507 00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:13,000 Speaker 1: term implies, right, and um, they are not so quick 508 00:35:13,600 --> 00:35:18,760 Speaker 1: to come to the defense or align with supporting domestic 509 00:35:18,760 --> 00:35:22,440 Speaker 1: workers who are working, or home care workers who are 510 00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:27,400 Speaker 1: working twenty four hour shifts, or domestic workers who are 511 00:35:27,840 --> 00:35:31,920 Speaker 1: being exploited by their employers and then being dumped during 512 00:35:31,960 --> 00:35:36,880 Speaker 1: the during the COVID during the pandemic. And there was 513 00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:41,600 Speaker 1: one piece of domestic worker or slash manny who was 514 00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:45,840 Speaker 1: let go, you know, who was fired basically, Um, that 515 00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:48,920 Speaker 1: goes as a nice euphemism, right, but who was was 516 00:35:49,640 --> 00:35:53,360 Speaker 1: essentially out of a job. And then her employers asked 517 00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:56,440 Speaker 1: if she wouldn't mind to face time with the children 518 00:35:56,480 --> 00:36:01,719 Speaker 1: and the family because they missed her. Wow. Yea, that 519 00:36:01,920 --> 00:36:07,560 Speaker 1: is emotional terrorism. That is really horrible, It really is. 520 00:36:07,640 --> 00:36:11,000 Speaker 1: But it's so representative. I think of the way that 521 00:36:11,120 --> 00:36:15,640 Speaker 1: people think of domestic workers and nannies and care workers 522 00:36:15,680 --> 00:36:22,600 Speaker 1: of all sorts as as just ultimately super exploitable, endlessly 523 00:36:22,920 --> 00:36:29,319 Speaker 1: exploitable and um and ultimately disposable, right and um, that 524 00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:33,000 Speaker 1: is the Unfortunately I see that as the face of 525 00:36:33,280 --> 00:36:43,520 Speaker 1: the American public. Yeah, it's an ugly face. M m 526 00:36:45,360 --> 00:36:54,440 Speaker 1: m m m m m m m m m m 527 00:36:55,040 --> 00:37:26,759 Speaker 1: m m M of it and little Ship Planet Parenthood 528 00:37:26,760 --> 00:37:29,319 Speaker 1: asked me to show someone how I see them, like 529 00:37:29,719 --> 00:37:33,319 Speaker 1: really see them, So this ad is dedicated to none 530 00:37:33,360 --> 00:37:37,239 Speaker 1: other than you, the OSSA. I see you going out 531 00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:41,960 Speaker 1: on runs every day, trying to reach personal goals and 532 00:37:42,040 --> 00:37:45,080 Speaker 1: personal best because you're training for a half marathon. I 533 00:37:45,120 --> 00:37:48,040 Speaker 1: see the way that you go go all out. You 534 00:37:48,080 --> 00:37:50,520 Speaker 1: are putting your endurance to the test your training, and 535 00:37:50,560 --> 00:37:53,480 Speaker 1: I see you as someone willing to try new things 536 00:37:53,719 --> 00:37:56,279 Speaker 1: and to work tirelessly to meet your goals. And I 537 00:37:56,280 --> 00:37:59,080 Speaker 1: feel very lucky to get to see you in that journey. 538 00:37:59,800 --> 00:38:02,720 Speaker 1: The inks girl, Yeah, it's definitely a new goal of mine. 539 00:38:02,880 --> 00:38:06,439 Speaker 1: You know I'm challenging myself and you know I'm trying 540 00:38:06,440 --> 00:38:11,120 Speaker 1: to inspire others as well. Similarly to planned Parenthood, thank 541 00:38:11,160 --> 00:38:15,319 Speaker 1: you for seeing me. Planned parenthood sees you, truly sees you, 542 00:38:15,560 --> 00:38:19,200 Speaker 1: not as patients, but as people deserving of understanding and 543 00:38:19,280 --> 00:38:23,600 Speaker 1: compassionate quality healthcare and education. Not only that, but they 544 00:38:23,680 --> 00:38:27,359 Speaker 1: understand the importance of having access to that care so 545 00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:32,080 Speaker 1: you can define exactly where you're going. Visit www dot 546 00:38:32,120 --> 00:38:34,960 Speaker 1: b CNE dot org to learn more about how Planned 547 00:38:34,960 --> 00:38:37,480 Speaker 1: Parenthood is here to see you become who you will be. 548 00:38:37,880 --> 00:38:43,120 Speaker 1: That's www dot b CNE dot org. I feel like 549 00:38:43,280 --> 00:38:48,480 Speaker 1: after the Allanted shootings, um, so many people came out 550 00:38:48,520 --> 00:38:52,359 Speaker 1: like either just in social media with personal stories like 551 00:38:52,719 --> 00:38:55,799 Speaker 1: you know, in my friend network or in out in 552 00:38:55,840 --> 00:39:00,319 Speaker 1: the media about you know, different things that we've dirt 553 00:39:00,400 --> 00:39:03,760 Speaker 1: along the way. Like I can't tell you personally myself 554 00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:08,480 Speaker 1: how many times I've been approached by people who want 555 00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:14,960 Speaker 1: to tell me about their Asian wife, their Asian girlfriend. Um, 556 00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:18,360 Speaker 1: who they have, Um, you know, who they sucked in 557 00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:22,560 Speaker 1: the in in whatever part of their lives, right, who 558 00:39:22,600 --> 00:39:26,319 Speaker 1: happened to be Asian or an Asian woman? Um? Who 559 00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:30,479 Speaker 1: they yeah, I mean, who they encountered in in their 560 00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:34,200 Speaker 1: exploits during um, during their time in the service, in 561 00:39:34,280 --> 00:39:38,400 Speaker 1: the military service. Right. So um. I even sort of 562 00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:43,640 Speaker 1: dredged up. I remembered in the aftermath of the shootings 563 00:39:43,680 --> 00:39:46,520 Speaker 1: something that I had sort of like, I think suppressed 564 00:39:46,560 --> 00:39:50,080 Speaker 1: for quite a while. I was a I think I 565 00:39:50,160 --> 00:39:54,480 Speaker 1: was a high school student sitting on a school bus 566 00:39:54,520 --> 00:39:58,520 Speaker 1: waiting for the bus to take off. Right, we're just 567 00:39:58,640 --> 00:40:00,960 Speaker 1: all lined up there that there were just a few 568 00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:04,200 Speaker 1: more moments for people to like pile on the bus 569 00:40:04,239 --> 00:40:08,440 Speaker 1: and somebody who was the brother of a friend of 570 00:40:08,480 --> 00:40:14,560 Speaker 1: my sister, so I like vaguely knew him. He walked 571 00:40:14,640 --> 00:40:17,280 Speaker 1: up to the right outside the window of the bus 572 00:40:17,320 --> 00:40:20,359 Speaker 1: and he made a gesture like he was shooting me, 573 00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:28,720 Speaker 1: and he like a gesture shooting me several times. Um, 574 00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:32,759 Speaker 1: And and then he shouted something about google blah blah blah. Right, 575 00:40:33,000 --> 00:40:35,760 Speaker 1: And I didn't even really I didn't even know that 576 00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:38,120 Speaker 1: that term goog. Right, I knew the term chink. I 577 00:40:38,160 --> 00:40:40,479 Speaker 1: had heard chink, I heard job. I had not heard 578 00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:46,279 Speaker 1: that particular racial epithet before. Right, So you know, yeah, 579 00:40:46,360 --> 00:40:48,840 Speaker 1: these are the things that that so many as of 580 00:40:48,920 --> 00:40:55,040 Speaker 1: us have experienced. And when this type of incident um, 581 00:40:55,040 --> 00:40:58,239 Speaker 1: which sounds so minimizing even to call it an incident, right, 582 00:40:58,800 --> 00:41:03,800 Speaker 1: And when a tragedy like this happens, yeah, triggers us all. Um. 583 00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:06,560 Speaker 1: The night of the shooting, actually, one of my friends 584 00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:11,640 Speaker 1: who's a Philipino woman, she she texted a few of us, um, 585 00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:15,719 Speaker 1: these two other women who are two other friends of 586 00:41:15,719 --> 00:41:18,160 Speaker 1: mine who are are also Philippino women, and myself, and 587 00:41:18,239 --> 00:41:23,239 Speaker 1: she said, don't look at the news. It's triggering. Trust me, 588 00:41:23,800 --> 00:41:27,160 Speaker 1: you'll thank me. Um. And of course, like that was 589 00:41:27,239 --> 00:41:29,520 Speaker 1: very hard to do, right, So so I don't think 590 00:41:29,520 --> 00:41:32,359 Speaker 1: that I that I actually did that fully, but it's 591 00:41:32,400 --> 00:41:38,200 Speaker 1: interesting what my where my mind went Immediately. I first thought, okay, 592 00:41:38,239 --> 00:41:40,600 Speaker 1: well what could it be? And I came up with 593 00:41:40,640 --> 00:41:43,879 Speaker 1: all these series. Right. My first thought was, oh, they've 594 00:41:43,920 --> 00:41:48,560 Speaker 1: done something horrific to the young people trying to cross 595 00:41:48,560 --> 00:41:50,640 Speaker 1: the border, right now, that was my first name. My 596 00:41:50,719 --> 00:41:55,480 Speaker 1: second theory was, oh, some cop just got off right 597 00:41:55,600 --> 00:42:00,799 Speaker 1: from some some killer cop just got off and um again, right, 598 00:42:01,800 --> 00:42:04,719 Speaker 1: And that sort of actually brought me to when I 599 00:42:04,800 --> 00:42:07,920 Speaker 1: was talking about that in class the other day, that 600 00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:11,600 Speaker 1: brought me to the double meaning of that, you know 601 00:42:11,840 --> 00:42:15,560 Speaker 1: those words some cops just got off because in my 602 00:42:15,640 --> 00:42:20,480 Speaker 1: research um around these issues, it's become really really clear 603 00:42:20,600 --> 00:42:24,200 Speaker 1: that that one of the primary abusers of sex workers 604 00:42:24,760 --> 00:42:29,520 Speaker 1: are cops. Right. Cops and law enforcement are constantly harassing 605 00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:34,960 Speaker 1: and abusing, attacking, raping sex workers right for a price, 606 00:42:35,080 --> 00:42:38,440 Speaker 1: right for the price of of of so called protection, 607 00:42:38,600 --> 00:42:42,080 Speaker 1: for the price of not um not turning people in. 608 00:42:42,440 --> 00:42:46,120 Speaker 1: And there are just too many instances to mention of 609 00:42:46,160 --> 00:42:52,080 Speaker 1: the NYPD, the Seattle PD, the San Francisco p D, um, 610 00:42:52,239 --> 00:42:55,399 Speaker 1: you name it. Of one scandal or another where it's 611 00:42:55,480 --> 00:42:59,960 Speaker 1: found out that cops are extracting either money or sex 612 00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:04,399 Speaker 1: sets for in order to UM not arrest or not 613 00:43:05,040 --> 00:43:10,040 Speaker 1: turn in UM sex workers in in various contexts. Right, 614 00:43:11,000 --> 00:43:16,560 Speaker 1: And that's a really really important piece of the picture 615 00:43:16,760 --> 00:43:21,359 Speaker 1: I think doesn't get focused on. And instead we have 616 00:43:22,520 --> 00:43:26,480 Speaker 1: you know, people clamoring about, oh, well, we should really 617 00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:31,920 Speaker 1: like do more raids on these massage parlors to UM, 618 00:43:31,960 --> 00:43:34,040 Speaker 1: you know, to try to prevent this kind of tragedy 619 00:43:34,080 --> 00:43:36,799 Speaker 1: from happening. And I don't know about you, but that 620 00:43:36,920 --> 00:43:40,640 Speaker 1: just does not compute from any angle. So it doesn't 621 00:43:40,640 --> 00:43:44,080 Speaker 1: like to protect and serve. Who is what we're constantly 622 00:43:44,320 --> 00:43:46,960 Speaker 1: we've been asking, right for many years now is who 623 00:43:47,920 --> 00:43:50,960 Speaker 1: is law enforcement actually protecting and serving well themselves and 624 00:43:51,160 --> 00:43:54,919 Speaker 1: actual property right and whiteness and white supremacy. Yeah, thank 625 00:43:54,920 --> 00:43:57,160 Speaker 1: you so much for bringing that up. But I wanted 626 00:43:57,200 --> 00:44:01,120 Speaker 1: to ask you as a final question. You mentioned, you know, 627 00:44:01,360 --> 00:44:08,839 Speaker 1: just simple protection for either sex workers, care workers, immigrant workers, 628 00:44:09,000 --> 00:44:13,200 Speaker 1: and that there's a pretty simple answer for mate ensuring 629 00:44:13,280 --> 00:44:18,120 Speaker 1: that this these communities aren't as vulnerable right to whatever 630 00:44:18,200 --> 00:44:23,399 Speaker 1: forms of attack or violence. Can you expand on that? Yeah? Absolutely, 631 00:44:23,520 --> 00:44:28,359 Speaker 1: so the very simple answer, UM it's a one word 632 00:44:28,440 --> 00:44:31,920 Speaker 1: answer that that we could definitely extand on. Among us 633 00:44:32,400 --> 00:44:40,760 Speaker 1: is decriminalization. Right. So undocumented UH, migrant workers are are criminalized, right. UM, 634 00:44:40,800 --> 00:44:47,759 Speaker 1: sex workers are criminalized. UM. Care workers are not criminalized 635 00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:52,319 Speaker 1: exactly the same way, but they are often excluded and 636 00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:57,880 Speaker 1: left out of basically protections right care workers at alls, UM. 637 00:44:58,760 --> 00:45:02,400 Speaker 1: And so all of those things point to the same things. 638 00:45:02,680 --> 00:45:05,359 Speaker 1: If you truly want to protect people, the best way 639 00:45:05,400 --> 00:45:07,840 Speaker 1: to protect people is to ensure that they have some 640 00:45:07,960 --> 00:45:13,160 Speaker 1: basic rights that other others, others at least presumably theoretically do, right. 641 00:45:13,760 --> 00:45:18,279 Speaker 1: So to start from that basis of Okay, what are 642 00:45:18,320 --> 00:45:22,680 Speaker 1: the what are the ways that people are especially vulnerable 643 00:45:22,719 --> 00:45:27,280 Speaker 1: to exploitation and violence? Um? And almost always the answer 644 00:45:27,280 --> 00:45:31,480 Speaker 1: to that is that they are being criminalized, they're being dehumanized, 645 00:45:31,560 --> 00:45:36,520 Speaker 1: and they are being excluded from basic protections. UM. That 646 00:45:36,560 --> 00:45:39,000 Speaker 1: seems really simple to me, But it doesn't seem to 647 00:45:39,000 --> 00:45:43,520 Speaker 1: be something that is moving really quickly UM in the 648 00:45:43,560 --> 00:45:47,319 Speaker 1: public arena, or at least anything. And I have some 649 00:45:47,400 --> 00:45:52,520 Speaker 1: really good examples in fact, of some other campaigns that 650 00:45:52,560 --> 00:45:55,520 Speaker 1: are that are happening now that I think be really 651 00:45:55,880 --> 00:45:58,120 Speaker 1: wonderful to people to sort of like do a shout 652 00:45:58,120 --> 00:46:03,520 Speaker 1: out or call yeah, absolutely please great. So UM. One 653 00:46:03,560 --> 00:46:07,520 Speaker 1: of the first ones is, um, there are home care 654 00:46:07,600 --> 00:46:11,839 Speaker 1: workers who are personal tenants. Um. You know, many of 655 00:46:11,840 --> 00:46:17,719 Speaker 1: them are elder Asian women, elder Chinese women. And I 656 00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:20,240 Speaker 1: want to point out too, because I think that this, 657 00:46:20,239 --> 00:46:23,120 Speaker 1: this doesn't always get the attention of people, but so 658 00:46:23,239 --> 00:46:26,600 Speaker 1: many of the women who were the workers who were 659 00:46:27,760 --> 00:46:31,120 Speaker 1: victimized in the land in the land to shooting, many 660 00:46:31,160 --> 00:46:33,399 Speaker 1: of them were over fifty. In fact, most of them, 661 00:46:33,440 --> 00:46:36,200 Speaker 1: I think we're over fifty, right, they were, they were 662 00:46:36,200 --> 00:46:38,839 Speaker 1: older women in this case. In the campaign that I'm 663 00:46:38,880 --> 00:46:42,520 Speaker 1: mentioned in New York. UM, it's called the anti anti 664 00:46:42,600 --> 00:46:46,680 Speaker 1: woman campaign after such er trees of court. Right, So 665 00:46:47,840 --> 00:46:51,359 Speaker 1: they are they're basically fighting for the right to not 666 00:46:51,480 --> 00:46:55,120 Speaker 1: have to work twenty four hour shifts. And when I 667 00:46:55,160 --> 00:46:58,480 Speaker 1: mentioned that to two people off hands, sometimes people are like, 668 00:46:59,600 --> 00:47:03,640 Speaker 1: what right, They can't even believe that we're talking about 669 00:47:03,640 --> 00:47:08,600 Speaker 1: a twenty four shift, especially in something as intensive as 670 00:47:09,000 --> 00:47:13,239 Speaker 1: home care, home health care. That's it, right, It's it's 671 00:47:13,360 --> 00:47:17,759 Speaker 1: lifting people, it's helping people to um, to toilet, right, 672 00:47:17,920 --> 00:47:22,640 Speaker 1: it's helping people to turn in bed sometimes to turn 673 00:47:22,719 --> 00:47:26,600 Speaker 1: people you know, within a certain number of hours back 674 00:47:26,640 --> 00:47:29,160 Speaker 1: and forth so that they're not getting bed sores. It's 675 00:47:29,160 --> 00:47:31,759 Speaker 1: helping people to eat, it's helping people to to do 676 00:47:31,800 --> 00:47:35,520 Speaker 1: any number of things that that they are needing assistance 677 00:47:35,560 --> 00:47:40,920 Speaker 1: for and very intimate work, right, very intimate assistance, UM. 678 00:47:41,000 --> 00:47:43,839 Speaker 1: And so in that respect, I feel like that care 679 00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:47,440 Speaker 1: work is just as intimate as sex work, right, and 680 00:47:47,600 --> 00:47:51,640 Speaker 1: people don't I think that because it's not as glamorous 681 00:47:52,640 --> 00:47:56,520 Speaker 1: and literally as sexy as as as people like to 682 00:47:56,560 --> 00:47:59,879 Speaker 1: think of, um, you know in the sex industry, right, 683 00:48:00,800 --> 00:48:03,560 Speaker 1: people don't want to pay attention to it. And this 684 00:48:03,680 --> 00:48:08,160 Speaker 1: campaign was is a long standing campaign. These workers who 685 00:48:08,640 --> 00:48:12,560 Speaker 1: have been fighting for themselves, advocating for themselves. First they 686 00:48:12,560 --> 00:48:16,960 Speaker 1: were fighting for mostly to get back wages back and 687 00:48:17,000 --> 00:48:23,200 Speaker 1: then it has somewhat expanded now to try to recapture 688 00:48:23,280 --> 00:48:26,279 Speaker 1: some some rights that they had managed to get in 689 00:48:26,360 --> 00:48:30,960 Speaker 1: these lawsuits that they had filed. So they had filed lawsuits, UM, 690 00:48:31,080 --> 00:48:37,000 Speaker 1: and they had been successful in um not being you know, 691 00:48:37,280 --> 00:48:40,160 Speaker 1: getting some back wages and also not being held to 692 00:48:40,200 --> 00:48:45,240 Speaker 1: the twenty four hour work shift. And then loanhol Andrew 693 00:48:45,280 --> 00:48:50,120 Speaker 1: Cuomo said, well, in the context of COVID, you know, 694 00:48:50,200 --> 00:48:54,200 Speaker 1: during the pandemic we need emergency measures, so let's go 695 00:48:54,239 --> 00:48:57,000 Speaker 1: back to the status quo. So so they were back 696 00:48:57,000 --> 00:49:00,200 Speaker 1: to square one. So all they're really asking for it's 697 00:49:00,280 --> 00:49:04,120 Speaker 1: a it seems to be a very tall order, even 698 00:49:04,160 --> 00:49:08,720 Speaker 1: though it shouldn't be asking for a separate, separate twelve 699 00:49:08,760 --> 00:49:11,840 Speaker 1: hour shifts. UM. What has been happening, and that the 700 00:49:12,360 --> 00:49:15,600 Speaker 1: status quo that Andrew Cuomo seems to be so happy 701 00:49:15,640 --> 00:49:19,040 Speaker 1: to sell um these workers down the river for is 702 00:49:19,800 --> 00:49:22,440 Speaker 1: UM as well as their union UM s c i U, 703 00:49:23,920 --> 00:49:27,520 Speaker 1: has has not actually, I'll just put it bluntly, has 704 00:49:27,560 --> 00:49:29,959 Speaker 1: not served them well, has not represented their interest. Well, 705 00:49:30,360 --> 00:49:33,000 Speaker 1: you know, the status quo has been that they've been 706 00:49:34,239 --> 00:49:38,040 Speaker 1: working twenty four hour shifts but then being told by 707 00:49:38,080 --> 00:49:43,600 Speaker 1: their home care agencies to only report I believe it's 708 00:49:43,800 --> 00:49:47,560 Speaker 1: thirteen hours, so that they get they only get paid 709 00:49:47,600 --> 00:49:51,920 Speaker 1: for that, because if they report longer hours than that, 710 00:49:52,120 --> 00:49:57,440 Speaker 1: or or they confess right admit to being UM working 711 00:49:57,480 --> 00:50:00,879 Speaker 1: around the clock, then they will often stand the chance 712 00:50:00,920 --> 00:50:04,000 Speaker 1: of losing those jobs, right UM, which they can't afford 713 00:50:04,120 --> 00:50:08,040 Speaker 1: that either. So it's a the choice, the so called choice, 714 00:50:08,200 --> 00:50:11,839 Speaker 1: and it's a false choice obviously, is to either work 715 00:50:11,880 --> 00:50:15,520 Speaker 1: around the clock and be completely exploited and exhausted and 716 00:50:15,680 --> 00:50:20,120 Speaker 1: suffer lots of health issues themselves and never see their 717 00:50:20,120 --> 00:50:23,800 Speaker 1: families or to lose those jobs, right, to lose those 718 00:50:23,960 --> 00:50:27,719 Speaker 1: sources of income that are sometimes the only source of 719 00:50:27,760 --> 00:50:30,160 Speaker 1: support for their families. And I just wanted to add 720 00:50:30,200 --> 00:50:33,480 Speaker 1: that these are women who they work garment workers, many 721 00:50:33,480 --> 00:50:38,360 Speaker 1: of them um form of garment workers and have transitioned 722 00:50:38,400 --> 00:50:42,480 Speaker 1: to this work. And it's just really incredibly ironic and 723 00:50:42,560 --> 00:50:45,880 Speaker 1: telling that they are going from one form of exploited 724 00:50:45,960 --> 00:50:51,400 Speaker 1: labor to another. Right. And um, there are there immigrants, 725 00:50:51,440 --> 00:50:56,080 Speaker 1: they're elder there Asian women and women of color and 726 00:50:56,239 --> 00:51:00,879 Speaker 1: some men of color. Um, and uh, why are they 727 00:51:00,880 --> 00:51:05,839 Speaker 1: not being protected where they're not being offered basic rights? 728 00:51:06,040 --> 00:51:09,160 Speaker 1: I think it's it's really easy to see why. Right. 729 00:51:10,320 --> 00:51:14,000 Speaker 1: Thank you so much Grace Chang for coming on the 730 00:51:14,080 --> 00:51:18,840 Speaker 1: podcast and sharing your your work and all these amazing 731 00:51:19,000 --> 00:51:23,799 Speaker 1: resources and this history and analysis for our audience. For 732 00:51:24,040 --> 00:51:27,960 Speaker 1: those listeners who are interested in reading more of your 733 00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:32,919 Speaker 1: work or following you and learning further from you. How 734 00:51:32,960 --> 00:51:38,760 Speaker 1: can they do that? Um? So I'm working on a book. Um, 735 00:51:38,880 --> 00:51:41,879 Speaker 1: I'm working in a book on human trafficking, and it's 736 00:51:41,960 --> 00:51:46,080 Speaker 1: going to be published by the New Press in New York. UM. 737 00:51:46,160 --> 00:51:49,080 Speaker 1: That is I want to say imminently coming out. But 738 00:51:50,040 --> 00:51:53,160 Speaker 1: I think that's a little too optimistic. In fact, I 739 00:51:53,200 --> 00:51:56,319 Speaker 1: think that the some of the recent things that have 740 00:51:56,440 --> 00:52:01,640 Speaker 1: happened in the context of the pandemic, including UM, this tragedy, 741 00:52:01,960 --> 00:52:07,759 Speaker 1: have have compelled me. I really feel UM, you know, 742 00:52:07,840 --> 00:52:13,080 Speaker 1: I feel compelled to make sure that I incorporate these UM, 743 00:52:13,200 --> 00:52:17,000 Speaker 1: these accounts into the into the story, because it's just 744 00:52:17,080 --> 00:52:21,160 Speaker 1: really important to address them, and I think they are unfortunately, 745 00:52:22,880 --> 00:52:26,600 Speaker 1: really good examples of how UM this is playing out 746 00:52:26,719 --> 00:52:31,920 Speaker 1: in the national discourse. So I'm going to be including 747 00:52:31,960 --> 00:52:35,400 Speaker 1: those stories in in the book. UM. I also have 748 00:52:35,480 --> 00:52:40,640 Speaker 1: a previous book called Disposal Domestics, UM, and that's by 749 00:52:40,719 --> 00:52:45,480 Speaker 1: UM that's published by Haymarket Press. UM, and shout out 750 00:52:45,520 --> 00:52:49,040 Speaker 1: to Haymarket, shout out to New the New Press as well. UM. 751 00:52:49,200 --> 00:52:53,640 Speaker 1: Both of those presses have been doing some really great UM. 752 00:52:53,680 --> 00:52:57,880 Speaker 1: I think you know, they've been doing some really great programming. Amazing. 753 00:52:58,160 --> 00:53:03,160 Speaker 1: We will link the the Haymarket pressing the show notes 754 00:53:03,200 --> 00:53:06,799 Speaker 1: so that folks can buy your book, support both you 755 00:53:06,960 --> 00:53:11,839 Speaker 1: and also the publication because we love supporting all of that. 756 00:53:12,000 --> 00:53:15,040 Speaker 1: So thank you so much. Grace for joining us today 757 00:53:15,080 --> 00:53:18,879 Speaker 1: and sharing your knowledge, your expertise with us. It's been 758 00:53:19,120 --> 00:53:22,120 Speaker 1: truly wonderful to speak with you and learn from you 759 00:53:22,200 --> 00:53:25,640 Speaker 1: once again. Absolutely, it was very, very nice to be 760 00:53:25,680 --> 00:53:28,239 Speaker 1: in a a conversation with you again, and I appreciate you 761 00:53:28,280 --> 00:53:32,319 Speaker 1: both for addressing this issue in a in a real 762 00:53:32,400 --> 00:53:36,120 Speaker 1: concerned way instead of just sort of like flashing the plan, 763 00:53:36,280 --> 00:53:42,400 Speaker 1: you know, right right right, Thank you, Thank you so much. 764 00:53:45,640 --> 00:53:59,839 Speaker 1: Radio radio radio music Myth and Bullshit a radio fun 765 00:54:00,080 --> 00:54:04,680 Speaker 1: novella local to the radio, hosted by Malamuno and Theosefe