Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Business Week. I'm Carol Masser and I'm
Speaker 1: Jason Kelly. We're right here every day bringing you the
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Speaker 1: all harnessing the power of Business Week reporters and editors,
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Speaker 1: twenty seven hundred journalists and analysts more than a hundred
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Speaker 1: Week on iTunes, SoundCloud, bl Bloomberg dot com. You can
Speaker 1: also listen to our radio show at two pm Eastern
Speaker 1: on Bloomberg Radio every weekday, or watch us on YouTube
Speaker 1: by searching Bloomberg Global News. This is the guy I've
Speaker 1: been wanting to talk to to try and make sense
Speaker 1: of everything that's going on a little south of est
Speaker 1: down in the nation's capital. He is our Washington Bureau
Speaker 1: chief and executive editor there in the Nation's capital. Craig
Speaker 1: Gordon from Bloomberg Joinius on the phone from Maryland. First, Craig,
Speaker 1: how are you. Oh, I'm doing fine. I'm out here
Speaker 1: in besides of Maryland and the leafy suburbs, so I'm
Speaker 1: plenty of plenty of removed from the action downtown, which
Speaker 1: would be at three or four blocks from where our offices,
Speaker 1: but of us have been there in about ten weeks,
Speaker 1: so we're feeling, we're feeling okay out here. And tell
Speaker 1: me what is going on. I mean, you've got a
Speaker 1: team reporting on this all the time. I mean I
Speaker 1: saw some pretty arresting images from uh Jen Epstein, who
Speaker 1: I know, you know, works very closely with you on
Speaker 1: our White House beat, and others who have been documenting this.
Speaker 1: I mean, what do we need to know maybe that
Speaker 1: we haven't seen and the important context of what's going
Speaker 1: on with the president and the response right now in Washington. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's a good question. I mean, I think the thing
Speaker 1: that is important to remember right now is that Trump
Speaker 1: actually does have a lot of authority to do the
Speaker 1: thing that he said that he wants to do, which
Speaker 1: is potentially send US troops into US cities to try
Speaker 1: to sort of quality unrest. Um. You know, there's laws
Speaker 1: that day back to eighteen o seven that allow him
Speaker 1: to do this. Usually they're only invoked when the local officials,
Speaker 1: the governor, the mayor, um, you know, sort of calls
Speaker 1: the White House and said some you know, kind of
Speaker 1: sending the troops. Um. It happened during the Rodney King
Speaker 1: riots in Los Angeles when Georgie W. Bush did it.
Speaker 1: There's some other instances scattered through history, but in most
Speaker 1: cases it's local officials making their request. The law this,
Speaker 1: you know, does allow Trump to do it if he
Speaker 1: sees there's a need to do it or fields there's
Speaker 1: a need to do it and essentially overrule the local um,
Speaker 1: the local officials. So it's something we're watching very closely now.
Speaker 1: Pentagon officials today held a briefing and told us, you know,
Speaker 1: they don't think that they will need to invoke this,
Speaker 1: you know, literally active military response. The National Guard and
Speaker 1: some of these states and cities can probably handle, um,
Speaker 1: whatever the protesters can throw at him. But it's very
Speaker 1: much alive question. And I think based on the reaction
Speaker 1: Trump's reaction last night, he's kind of itching to do it.
Speaker 1: So we're we're on pretty high alert for any kind
Speaker 1: of mobilization like that. So, Craig, wouldn't you make of
Speaker 1: what happened last night? So the President makes some comments
Speaker 1: and then he does this walk from what I understand
Speaker 1: an unannounced walk right across the street from White House
Speaker 1: through Lafayette Square, UM to visit St. John's Episcopal Church,
Speaker 1: and then he holds up a Bible. So, I don't know,
Speaker 1: what have you heard about that? And what was the
Speaker 1: president thinking? Well, what our reporter Jennifer Jacobs was actually
Speaker 1: on the scene was in the press, you know, the
Speaker 1: press pool essentially when um Trump made that walk, was
Speaker 1: that you know, people may remember the New York Times,
Speaker 1: Bloomberg and others reported that they had moved Trump into
Speaker 1: the sort of underground safety bunker at the White House
Speaker 1: on Friday night. UM, George W. Bush went there on
Speaker 1: nine eleven. You know, it does get to Cheney if
Speaker 1: you anyone saw that movie, kind of hustled there pretty
Speaker 1: forcefully on nine eleven. So you know, it's used to
Speaker 1: keep the leaders of the nation safe. Um. I don't
Speaker 1: think that was really an image that Donald Trump wanted
Speaker 1: kind of hanging out there. That he was, as his
Speaker 1: own son put it in a tweet, you know, sort
Speaker 1: of cowering in the basement while the protests were raging outside. Um,
Speaker 1: outside of the White House, they seemed Trump themselves seemed
Speaker 1: kind of eager to erase that image. And what Jennifer
Speaker 1: reported was that In a meeting with the military leaders
Speaker 1: who are at the White House to discussed some of
Speaker 1: the response, he raised the possibility of of walking over
Speaker 1: to St. John's Biscopal Church. And again, anyone who's visited
Speaker 1: the White House knows there's sort of a park right
Speaker 1: across the street, um Lafayette Square, and then across from
Speaker 1: that is this church. I've been there many times on
Speaker 1: pool duty covering presidents of the years. It's it's a
Speaker 1: frequent Sunday stop um for presidents, not so much Trump,
Speaker 1: but it is. It's sort of right there, it's in
Speaker 1: walking distance to the White House. He sort of made
Speaker 1: the decision he wanted to give it a try, and
Speaker 1: when the President says that, the team sort of scrambles
Speaker 1: to try to to try to make it happen. We're
Speaker 1: trying to sort out today exactly who gave the order
Speaker 1: or how it came down that the protesters were sort
Speaker 1: of cleared out from the front of the White House too,
Speaker 1: so that the President could make that walk, which is
Speaker 1: sort of essentially across Pennsylvania Avenue, across this rather small
Speaker 1: park and then right to the following corner. Um. There's
Speaker 1: some reporting right now that are training General Bill Barr,
Speaker 1: who people may have seen on TV went over to
Speaker 1: the kind of view the side. Um, before we knew
Speaker 1: Trump was going to make the walk, was the one
Speaker 1: who actually gave the order to kind of clear the park.
Speaker 1: That's a little bit in dispute right now. We're trying
Speaker 1: to get to the bottom of it, um in talking
Speaker 1: to Justice Department officials. But clearly an order was given
Speaker 1: because again anyone who saw the video and Jennifer Jacobs
Speaker 1: was there for us, you know those um, those military
Speaker 1: police cleared that spot out pretty pretty aggressively. UM, some
Speaker 1: tear gas and riot shields, um, et cetera on what
Speaker 1: at that point up till then, had been a fairly
Speaker 1: peaceful protest. So look the imagery. If you're a fan
Speaker 1: of Donald Trump, the imagery was probably pretty dramatic. Um,
Speaker 1: He's sort of striding through this kind of um, you know,
Speaker 1: troubled area where this protest had just happened, goes to
Speaker 1: the church, holds up a Bible. Um. Obviously he's taking
Speaker 1: kind of withering fire on this from Democrats who say, um,
Speaker 1: you know, he essentially cleared out a protest simply for
Speaker 1: a photo op. The leaders religious leaders, the Catholic archbishop
Speaker 1: in Washington, the Episcopalian bishop who kind of essentially oversees
Speaker 1: that church, you know, said it was sort of horrific
Speaker 1: that you would stage a photo opertive religious site with
Speaker 1: the with the Bible itself. So obviously very split opinions
Speaker 1: on that. I think Donald Trump honestly thinks he had
Speaker 1: a pretty good day yesterday. Right all right, So Greig,
Speaker 1: we're going to get our conversation in a minute, but
Speaker 1: before we go, just thirty seconds or so, what does
Speaker 1: the president do today? What's his state of mind today?
Speaker 1: From what you can tell, well, I mean, I think
Speaker 1: I think you can say he kind of leaned into
Speaker 1: it a little bit. He did two things, you know,
Speaker 1: that you might say would be designed to appeal to
Speaker 1: religious voters. He voted there's a shrine to Pope John
Speaker 1: Paul the Second, now Satan John Paul the Second out
Speaker 1: of northeast Washington. He visited there. He signed an executive
Speaker 1: order on international religious freedom. So if anyone missed the
Speaker 1: subtlety of his of his actions last night, he reinforced
Speaker 1: it today with a pretty um direct appeal to religious
Speaker 1: voters who were a big part of his twenty sixteen coalition.
Speaker 1: Now we've been talking about what's going on, of course
Speaker 1: across the country and President Trump and his team's wonts
Speaker 1: to it. Vice President Joe Biden, of course also out
Speaker 1: there giving some remarks on the civil unrest facing communities
Speaker 1: across the country. He also wait in on the president.
Speaker 1: Listen up, President, United States must be part of the solution,
Speaker 1: not the problem. But this president today is part of
Speaker 1: the problem and accelerates it. Let's bring back Craig Gordon,
Speaker 1: Washington Bureau chief of Bloomberg News, Craig, Joe Biden, Uh,
Speaker 1: you know, obviously campaigning in a very different way because
Speaker 1: of the virus. Um, I'm curious about how he addresses
Speaker 1: the president and his reaction. You know, what it might
Speaker 1: do for him, what it might do for the country. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean Biden has been, as people know, kind of
Speaker 1: in as a home and Willmington, Delaware, Uh, you know,
Speaker 1: kind of laying love because of the coronavirus. Made his
Speaker 1: first adventure out yesterday, and now the speech today, I mean,
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, Joe Biden has to give a
Speaker 1: speech like this. It's kind of the tone you might
Speaker 1: expect critical of Trump, kind of more you know, sadness
Speaker 1: than anger, you might say, um, and and kind of
Speaker 1: calling people to their to the sort of better angels. Obviously,
Speaker 1: you know, Joe Biden is a very familiar figure to
Speaker 1: a lot of Americans. Certainly people know he was vice
Speaker 1: president of Barack Obama twice. But you know, I think
Speaker 1: Joe Biden um prospers in this campaign just by looking
Speaker 1: like a kind of a steady, sensible alternative to Donald Trump.
Speaker 1: But ultimately voters are going to decide on Donald Trump.
Speaker 1: It's really this all elections referendum on Donald Trump. It
Speaker 1: was we thought it going to be a referenument as
Speaker 1: coronavirus handling. I think the marks on that are well in.
Speaker 1: There's a new mode. Let's pull out today showing people
Speaker 1: in the USA the country is on the wrong track.
Speaker 1: That is that is a dangerous number for Donald Trump.
Speaker 1: Posters always look at right track, wrong track. It's just
Speaker 1: a very simple way for people to kind of express
Speaker 1: frustration or fear about the direction of the country's going
Speaker 1: at With three courters of the country saying wrong track,
Speaker 1: that's extremely bad news for Trump approval rating, which is
Speaker 1: very very low. So Biden kind of can you know
Speaker 1: he can do well by just sort of showing up
Speaker 1: looking steady, looking sensible. People know, well, um, he's ser
Speaker 1: Barack Obama. No, well, he has ties into the black community,
Speaker 1: a lot of support him on African American voters. That's
Speaker 1: why he became the nominee. So I think he just like,
Speaker 1: don't make any mistakes while Trump is over here, Um,
Speaker 1: you know, starting throwing gasoline on the fire. And I
Speaker 1: think that that is all very helpful to Biden. The
Speaker 1: the bigger, the bigger, you know, way Biden can win
Speaker 1: this thing is by Trump's overreach and people thinking he's
Speaker 1: gone into a kind of a dangerous place and taking
Speaker 1: the country, as we say, down the wrong track. That's
Speaker 1: all good news for Joe Bidens some presidential hopes, right,
Speaker 1: and the whole notion as we all know historically, you know,
Speaker 1: are you better off four years ago? Are you better
Speaker 1: off today than you were four years ago? I do
Speaker 1: want to ask you, Craig, before we let you go.
Speaker 1: You know that this relationship that the president and the
Speaker 1: administration is developing with the nation's governors and mayors, who
Speaker 1: certainly were at the four of the coronavirus respond an
Speaker 1: hour at the four of the response to this We
Speaker 1: talked at the top of the conversation about, you know,
Speaker 1: the president's willingness more than willingness maybe to to send
Speaker 1: in the National Guard. But what does it tell us
Speaker 1: about sort of the more national political scene as we
Speaker 1: do see governors and mayors and I'm thinking about Mayor
Speaker 1: Bottoms in Atlanta and other sort of governors and mayors
Speaker 1: coming to the four how does that change the political calculus,
Speaker 1: maybe even when it comes to the veepstakes as they say,
Speaker 1: excuse me, yeah, I mean the mayor Bottoms down there
Speaker 1: in Atlanta certainly making a case for herself, UM to
Speaker 1: be to get our look from Joe Biden, who we
Speaker 1: know UM has said he will choose a woman for
Speaker 1: his vice president for running mate. Um He's been encouraged
Speaker 1: by some of his prominent African American sports to pick
Speaker 1: an African American woman. He's certally got several to choose
Speaker 1: from in Kamala Harris, Um C. C Abraham's also from Georgia,
Speaker 1: a few people like that. I think what's interesting is
Speaker 1: what we're gonna learn here is how far can push
Speaker 1: the Republican governors. While we have been on this phone call,
Speaker 1: the Texas governor Abbott just came out and said, you know,
Speaker 1: we don't need the U. S. Military down here. As
Speaker 1: he put it, Texans can take care of Texans. So
Speaker 1: while Abbott was a person who was very eager to
Speaker 1: kind of push the reopening on the virus front and
Speaker 1: really kind of walking lock step with Trump on the
Speaker 1: idea that we need to get the economy back open,
Speaker 1: you know, and balance economic needs versus the danger from
Speaker 1: the virus on this question, he's destroying a hard line
Speaker 1: and saying no, I'm not gonna go there. I'm not
Speaker 1: gonna let US troops marked to the streets of Austin
Speaker 1: and Houston and all the places Dallice in Texas. So
Speaker 1: I think I think where Trump is right now is
Speaker 1: that you know, there has been very little reaction from Republicans.
Speaker 1: You know, almost none have criticized his actions last night.
Speaker 1: Ben Sas from Nebraska is kind of a frequent Trump critic,
Speaker 1: no surprise there. But when you start to have the
Speaker 1: governors were again right on the front front line of
Speaker 1: both the virus and the protests starting to push back again,
Speaker 1: that that suggests um even they think Trump might be
Speaker 1: over reaching a little bit here. And and that's pretty
Speaker 1: hardcore Republicans. Now one of those voters in the middle
Speaker 1: think they might be thinking the same thing. All right,
Speaker 1: Craig Gordon, always a treat to catch up with you.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much. Just love your context in your perspective.
Speaker 1: Craig Gordon is our executive editor and Washington bureau chief
Speaker 1: for Bloomberg. Joining us on the phone from Maryland. You
Speaker 1: are listening to Bloomberg Business Week. Well, we can't lose
Speaker 1: sight of one of the other really big stories going
Speaker 1: on in the world, and that is another form of
Speaker 1: protest and another confrontation that's happening, and that is in
Speaker 1: Hong Kong and with Beijing and everything that's going on
Speaker 1: and the repercussions that it's having across the world. It's
Speaker 1: the subject of a story in Bloomberg Business Week this week.
Speaker 1: Joel Weber, the editor of the magazine, joins us from Brooklyn.
Speaker 1: Mark Champions wrote the story. Joel, help us understand the
Speaker 1: backdrop here. So, uh, last week, pretty significant event happened,
Speaker 1: which was, um, it really kind of looks like China
Speaker 1: moved on Hong Kong in a way which has been
Speaker 1: obviously brewing for a while, um for years. In fact,
Speaker 1: um but it has really come to a head and
Speaker 1: accelerated during the pandemic with this law that that that
Speaker 1: China has passed um and the a lot of China
Speaker 1: watchers and Hong Kong watchers are really fearing for the worst.
Speaker 1: You know. It's really fascinating, you know, reading through this story, Joel,
Speaker 1: because you know, the more I read about it, I'm like, wow,
Speaker 1: the similarities. And of course it's not apples to apples,
Speaker 1: but this whole idea of just you know, moving more
Speaker 1: aggressively into an area. Now you know, mind you Hong
Speaker 1: Kong is under you know, the sovereignty if you will,
Speaker 1: of China to begin with. But it is interesting how
Speaker 1: China and President g in particular, are you know, seemingly
Speaker 1: disinterested in what the rest of the world has to
Speaker 1: has to say about They're increasing the aggressive moves. That's right.
Speaker 1: And and what Mark actually writes in this story is that, um,
Speaker 1: there's a similarity to what's happening with Hong Kong and jeez,
Speaker 1: you know, sudden aggression, aggression there or really just aggression there. Um.
Speaker 1: And and what actually we saw from Putin in teen
Speaker 1: Um regarding CRIMEA, which also was sort of this this
Speaker 1: chess move at Um somewhat of an opportune moment for
Speaker 1: for him. And you know, the takeaways for both of
Speaker 1: these is just that you know, while the world is
Speaker 1: dealing with other things and looking away, there are moves
Speaker 1: that are made that you cannot unwind. And that's sort
Speaker 1: of what we're seeing here in Hong Kong, which you know,
Speaker 1: you guys mentioned you know, there's this de facto system
Speaker 1: of government there where it's sort of two systems one country,
Speaker 1: and that's supposed to last until and what we're seeing
Speaker 1: is that it might not last through the end of
Speaker 1: the year. Really, um so, Mark, I just wanted to
Speaker 1: bring you in, you know, you you I think we're
Speaker 1: the one who sort of said, you know, this is
Speaker 1: starting to look like a cremoment and and how how
Speaker 1: has that sort of manifested itself from your perspective? Yes,
Speaker 1: I mean that the key thing is, I think if
Speaker 1: you think of this in terms of, you know, why
Speaker 1: did the Chinese do what they did, um, and what
Speaker 1: does it say about how they now view their foreign
Speaker 1: policy choices and the West? And then you know, alternatively,
Speaker 1: if you also think about, well, what does it say
Speaker 1: about you know, how the West can respond and what
Speaker 1: you know, what what can actually be done? Um. And
Speaker 1: so if you think of it in those two ways, UM,
Speaker 1: there is a lot to be found in common. Uh.
Speaker 1: So you know, for the from the first point of
Speaker 1: view from the Chinese and you're what they are doing. Um.
Speaker 1: This is a moment a little like you know, putting
Speaker 1: in two thousand and fourteen where he took this decision
Speaker 1: knowing that it would for the foreseeable future destroyers relationship
Speaker 1: with the U for the West, but he had come
Speaker 1: to a point where he decided there was you know,
Speaker 1: that was what he wanted to do. It was actually
Speaker 1: valuable to him to work on anti Americanism, and he
Speaker 1: had also given up on trying to work with the US. UM.
Speaker 1: And really we're at that sort of point, was she
Speaker 1: now you know, after a couple of years of trade
Speaker 1: war um. And you know, now you've you've had the
Speaker 1: stuff with the coronavirus and Trump describing it as a
Speaker 1: as a Chinese virus and so on, and the Chinese
Speaker 1: are really just decided there's not not not much to
Speaker 1: lose by doing stuff that the US and and the
Speaker 1: rest of the West will really uh be very upset about. Um.
Speaker 1: And then secondarily they also understand, as did cut In,
Speaker 1: that there isn't much that the US or Europe can
Speaker 1: can do to actually stop what you know, the policy
Speaker 1: goals that they have, and these are quite historic goals,
Speaker 1: taking CRIMEA for Russia. I mean in the Hong Kong case,
Speaker 1: of course, Hong Kong already belongs to China. Everybody acknowledges that.
Speaker 1: But but to actually you know, impose control on an
Speaker 1: area that was becoming quite embarrassing for she He wasn't
Speaker 1: able to impose an authority order and so on, and
Speaker 1: so you know, in those two ways I think they
Speaker 1: are it is a sort of very useful in Ana
Speaker 1: and Mark, how does this how do you how do
Speaker 1: you think this will play out for Hong Kong specifically,
Speaker 1: and then also for those other places in sort of
Speaker 1: Chinese um gaze, like you know, thinking of Taiwan for instance. Yes, well,
Speaker 1: I mean the answer for Hong Kong is is frankly
Speaker 1: not terribly well. So if if you are a Hong
Speaker 1: Kong pro democracy protester, um you've been parted this movement
Speaker 1: which has been quite uh you know, formidable over the
Speaker 1: last year, um, then you it's the implications of all
Speaker 1: this a that China no longer cares to hesitate because
Speaker 1: it doesn't worry so much about what it's gonna what
Speaker 1: the rest of the world is going to think, or
Speaker 1: what it may lose economically. And secondly that the US
Speaker 1: UH and and in particular and the rest of the
Speaker 1: West in general, UM will be unable to do anything
Speaker 1: really for you. That these two things UM don't spell
Speaker 1: anything very good for you if you're in Hong Kong, UM,
Speaker 1: and you have to really you know, deal directly in
Speaker 1: the end with she and the party in UH in
Speaker 1: Beijing UH, and you know, find a new way, try
Speaker 1: and persuade them. I suppose that you know that this
Speaker 1: new law won't be so swinging, that it will destroy
Speaker 1: the the independent judiciary and so on, that Hong Kong's
Speaker 1: financial center and prosperity is based UM. So for for
Speaker 1: Hong Kong, you know, there's it's a complicated future UM
Speaker 1: and not not a very uh you know promising one UH.
Speaker 1: And then for Taiwan it a little different. I mean,
Speaker 1: what the effect of the destruction really of the idea
Speaker 1: of a two U two systems country in one country
Speaker 1: two systems UM, that the effect of what everything that
Speaker 1: has been watched over the last year from Taiwan. They
Speaker 1: watched it closely what was happening in Hong Kong. It's
Speaker 1: already been to really change the politics in Taiwan. You
Speaker 1: had a pro independence president who was really trailing in
Speaker 1: the polls quite badly last year before these protests really
Speaker 1: got going and the police response got going. Um and
Speaker 1: then in January she she won re election, and it's
Speaker 1: really changed the way that the taiwan Is think about
Speaker 1: the possibility of, you know, becoming part of that policy
Speaker 1: of one country, two systems. I have to say, it's
Speaker 1: it's it's very provocative and it does make me Mark wonder,
Speaker 1: you know, ultimately what's next in terms of this relationship
Speaker 1: between China and the United States. I mean, there's a
Speaker 1: line in there about China now being basically, you know,
Speaker 1: America's arch enemy, which is not essentially where I think
Speaker 1: if you go back a few years where we all
Speaker 1: thought it was ultimately going. It's a must read. Mark Champion,
Speaker 1: thank you so much, Bloomberg News senior reporter for international Affairs,
Speaker 1: joining us on the phone in London along with our
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Business Week editor Joel Webber, on the phone in Brooklyn.
Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and Jason
Speaker 1: Kelly on Bloomberg Radio. It's time again for our Bloomberg
Speaker 1: Business Week Small Business Survival Guide check in. For that,
Speaker 1: we have Demetri Cassini's editor of Bloomberg, on the phone
Speaker 1: from New Jersey. And so Demitra set this up for
Speaker 1: us because you have very kindly delivered us, uh, someone
Speaker 1: to talk about exactly what's going on in this very
Speaker 1: uncertain time already an uncertain time for small businesses, and
Speaker 1: it's only getting harder. Help us understand what's going on. Yeah, Jason,
Speaker 1: thank you. I mean it is really um, you know,
Speaker 1: gearing up for reopening. But the past week has been
Speaker 1: a very very very tough week, one of the toughest
Speaker 1: weeks in the United States, UM, following the killing of
Speaker 1: George Floyd. Protests, peaceful protests and interrupted by people coming
Speaker 1: in uh you know and looting and really creating much
Speaker 1: more mayhem. And so this affects small businesses, um really
Speaker 1: at their core businesses and communities that are really integral
Speaker 1: to those communities. And so we have been spanning out
Speaker 1: talking to business owners across the country And one of
Speaker 1: the first people that my colleague Nick liber who was
Speaker 1: a contributor to Business Week, spoke to is Rashad West,
Speaker 1: who owns a restaurant in Minneapolis. UM. He runs a
Speaker 1: restaurant across the street from the spot where George Floyd
Speaker 1: was killed. UM, and we talked to Rashade about what
Speaker 1: it means to be running. You know, how do you
Speaker 1: move forward from this right now? And UM, how do
Speaker 1: you navigate this point in time? So we're shot. Come
Speaker 1: on in, um, and welcome to Bloomberg Radio. You do
Speaker 1: join us on the phone in Minneapolis, and UM, you know,
Speaker 1: first of all, you know, we're so sorry for what
Speaker 1: your neighborhood is going through at this point. UM, tell
Speaker 1: us a little bit about what you're seeing and what
Speaker 1: it's meant for you and your community. UM, well thanks
Speaker 1: for having me. UM. Right now, we have very peaceful
Speaker 1: protests and memorial is actually on the intersection right across
Speaker 1: from where my restaurant is. So you know, this area
Speaker 1: is really protected on the neighborhoods making sure nothing violent,
Speaker 1: dangerous happening. UM. So every day you know we're coming in,
Speaker 1: people are are grilling, passing food, flashing food and water out,
Speaker 1: people are bringing their kids, uh, and it's like really
Speaker 1: a healing space. So um, right now the community is
Speaker 1: just coming together and showing showing um solidarity for the
Speaker 1: black community especially and so we're how wouldn't you sort
Speaker 1: of put all of this together? You know obviously that
Speaker 1: the comeback was in part owing to a shutdown of
Speaker 1: the entire economy. How do these things, these you know,
Speaker 1: two very traumatic events in different ways, how do they
Speaker 1: affect your your ability to really continue your business going forward? Um?
Speaker 1: I just think as a as a business owner, a
Speaker 1: small business owner, you're always trying to figure out a
Speaker 1: way to uh to navigate day by day. So right
Speaker 1: now it's just really pushing us to to figure out
Speaker 1: how one wee can support our community first, um, because
Speaker 1: you know that's that's where we are and they're the
Speaker 1: ones that allowed us in the neighborhood to to open
Speaker 1: a business. So figure out how to support our community.
Speaker 1: And then um, you know, just after this, after we
Speaker 1: started buying some balance, um, how we can provide again
Speaker 1: and continue to do business. So continuously adjusting as as
Speaker 1: as we all do, and and making making sure that
Speaker 1: people know we're here for them. That's that's really number
Speaker 1: one right now. We haven't really thought about much else
Speaker 1: to meet your come on back in, UM, because you've
Speaker 1: been you know, you know, managing the Small Business Survival
Speaker 1: Guide and the coverage, and it certainly has gone from
Speaker 1: you know, so much focused on the virus to obviously
Speaker 1: it's so much more than that now. Yeah. I mean,
Speaker 1: I think um Rashad shared with me earlier and others
Speaker 1: that we're talking to that in a way, UM, you
Speaker 1: know that that now the virus very important. It's important.
Speaker 1: Of course, it's still be wary of that, but that
Speaker 1: has become a secondary concern in some ways because this
Speaker 1: is fundamentally so much more challenging. But UM, I think,
Speaker 1: as he also said, it's it's for for many take
Speaker 1: it a day at a time, UM, take the step
Speaker 1: to camp first, to ensure that your community is okay.
Speaker 1: Because without your community being okay, you know what, what's
Speaker 1: the point if your business is going to be okay
Speaker 1: in the midst of a community, that is the part
Speaker 1: that is you know, really sort of mourning, UM or
Speaker 1: just trying to rebuild. So it is especially challenging right now.
Speaker 1: We've talked about so many things over the last few
Speaker 1: weeks having to do with funding and money and loan
Speaker 1: and and this doesn't even come close to that level.
Speaker 1: But I think if there's a strong community to build on,
Speaker 1: as there are resources, your chambers of commerce and all,
Speaker 1: you know you'll find the support you need. And especially
Speaker 1: leaders like business leaders like Rishad who see themselves as
Speaker 1: community leaders to not just a business owner. Risha just
Speaker 1: got about fifty seconds left. Here are you getting the
Speaker 1: support that you need? Financial and other? Um? Absolutely, community
Speaker 1: has UM has rallied around UM everybody that lives in
Speaker 1: the area. UM financially you know where we uh will
Speaker 1: be okay UM. And then they did set up a
Speaker 1: go fund me just just because you know, operations have
Speaker 1: completely stop so UM it was nice for them to
Speaker 1: do that, a friend to do that for our business.
Speaker 1: And you know we're gonna make through UM, but we
Speaker 1: make sure everybody is healed, you know, right well, our
Speaker 1: hard to with you good luck with everything, UH, and
Speaker 1: we know it's an incredibly difficult time. But we also
Speaker 1: know that you know, and we know this from Demetri's
Speaker 1: work and our own, that small businesses really are the
Speaker 1: backbone of community, is the backbone of this country in
Speaker 1: many ways, from an employment perspective, but also as gathering
Speaker 1: places at at times of great need where we all
Speaker 1: sort of need to lean on each other. Richad west
Speaker 1: Uh He is the owner of Dragon Walk. It is
Speaker 1: in the Bryant neighborhood of Minneapolis. Are thanks to him
Speaker 1: as well as to Demetri Cassa needs looking after the
Speaker 1: Small Business Survival Guide Critical Critical project at Bloomberg Business Week. Carol, Yeah,
Speaker 1: and truly in the thick of it, uh, in terms
Speaker 1: of what we've been dealing with the virus over the
Speaker 1: last few months, and then of course with the death
Speaker 1: of George Floyd a journal Now, but you at me drive?
Speaker 1: Oh no, no, no no, no, home honey please, I'll do
Speaker 1: the riding velvet me. I want to drive, Just drive, baby,
Speaker 1: the questions trying. This is the drive to the Globe community. Thanks,
Speaker 1: we'll drying us down on Bloomberg Radio. It is time
Speaker 1: for the drive to the close. Back with us as
Speaker 1: Kevin Barry, He's chief investment officer at the independent registered
Speaker 1: advisor investment advisor cap Trust. He joins us on the
Speaker 1: phone from Raleigh, North Carolina. So, Kevin, nice to have
Speaker 1: you back with us. Um tell us about life and Raleigh. Um,
Speaker 1: how are you guys doing well? You know, it came
Speaker 1: from New York City, in which case I would have
Speaker 1: been in an apartment for the last ninety days. I'm
Speaker 1: going a much better moved down here, and I know
Speaker 1: Jason's from Atlanta. What interesting things about here and Raleigh is, um,
Speaker 1: it's actually affordable. You can actually be a hipster by
Speaker 1: a warehouse and convert into a bar or something, so
Speaker 1: you know, you can afford more than the hat, right,
Speaker 1: A lot of folks are so expensive, but here you can.
Speaker 1: Actually there's so much happening. So many young people going
Speaker 1: to school here, stay in the area working at biotech companies.
Speaker 1: It's a very vibrant area. And I'm delighted to be here. Yeah.
Speaker 1: It's a great town, you know, and you've got the
Speaker 1: whole you know, research Triangle Park thing going on. You've got,
Speaker 1: as you say, some great universities, and people love living there.
Speaker 1: One of my closest friends moved from New York back
Speaker 1: home there. She's a Wake Forest grad and uh has
Speaker 1: a great house in Raleigh and just raves about life
Speaker 1: down there. I do wonder, you know, being a step
Speaker 1: removed from from New York City and you know, some
Speaker 1: of the especially the virus hotspots, and we can talk
Speaker 1: about some of the other things that are clearly going
Speaker 1: on in the world. You know, I do wonder if
Speaker 1: your lens is a little bit different for how you
Speaker 1: think about not just investing, but but the economy. We yeah,
Speaker 1: we do see. Obviously we're not as you know, people
Speaker 1: are much more socially distant naturally here right because they're
Speaker 1: they're not taking some ways to work, etcetera. So on
Speaker 1: the other hand, my niece, for example, is at Duke University.
Speaker 1: She's working on a COVID store right now, so being
Speaker 1: posted close to the biotechniques that we're kind of very
Speaker 1: close to what's happening in that standpoint. So, you know,
Speaker 1: the economy, it's interesting to see kind of outside of
Speaker 1: the city during this whole period of time, even when
Speaker 1: the quarantines are on, you can see construction work going
Speaker 1: on here, repaving, you know, sort of outdoor work was
Speaker 1: still happening here. So that has been pretty interesting. Um. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, Kevin, one of the things that we've been
Speaker 1: talking to we're gonna talk a little bit later on
Speaker 1: is with everything that's going on in the world, how
Speaker 1: e s G. I feel like all of a sudden,
Speaker 1: everybody's coming out and saying, you know, check out our
Speaker 1: E S G platform. You know, if you want companies
Speaker 1: at stress, equality, diversity, fairness, UM and the like, you know,
Speaker 1: then you know you're going to want to invest with
Speaker 1: us kind of kind of thinking. And I do think
Speaker 1: it is important that companies increasingly move forward on these
Speaker 1: types of initiatives because that can certainly money money money
Speaker 1: talks right and brings about changes in society. And I
Speaker 1: do wonder how, if at all that is some of
Speaker 1: what's you're hearing from some of your investors at cap Trust.
Speaker 1: That's a great question. We've actually been running that kind
Speaker 1: of money for over twenty five years, you know, and
Speaker 1: a long time ago was mostly what you're not going
Speaker 1: to buy. I don't like this, we don't like that,
Speaker 1: And now we're incorporating um many more positive aspects into it.
Speaker 1: But you know what's really interesting now, more than half
Speaker 1: of our employees are millennials. And for a firm to grow,
Speaker 1: we've been a rapidly growing firm. For firms grow, you
Speaker 1: have to attract talent, and you're getting grilled by the
Speaker 1: talent on your internally f g policies even before you
Speaker 1: design products for clients. I think that's really interesting. So
Speaker 1: when you look around the world and you sort of
Speaker 1: rank the worries, Kevin, you know, we we've obviously talked
Speaker 1: a lot about the civil unrest over the past couple
Speaker 1: of days. We've been talking for weeks and now months
Speaker 1: about the virus. But you know, you think about what's
Speaker 1: going on between Beijing and Hong Kong and the US
Speaker 1: China trade tensions and political and economic tensions. How do
Speaker 1: you sort of rate those in terms of what could
Speaker 1: be the most disruptive for an investor. Sure, so I
Speaker 1: think the China is very interesting right now, and you've
Speaker 1: put guys are probably done stories or there's a dollar
Speaker 1: shorage in Hong Kong. You know, people who are living
Speaker 1: there trying to switch to Hong Kong dollar for US dollar,
Speaker 1: and that's a sign. We see that in gold, right,
Speaker 1: and we see it into continued strength of the dollar overall.
Speaker 1: I think it's in what we've had the last three
Speaker 1: months as an extraordinary event. I've seen a lot of
Speaker 1: recessions and a lot of down dress, nothing like this. Actually,
Speaker 1: the shock does remind me of Not eleven a little
Speaker 1: bit and back to the seventy three seventy four shock.
Speaker 1: But um, it's it. This is an extraordinary time. And
Speaker 1: I think it's also so meaningful that it's occurred during
Speaker 1: an election year, coming up to an election year, because
Speaker 1: we have, uh see, bipartisan support for tremendous spending on
Speaker 1: the fiscal side and tremendous support on the monetary policy side.
Speaker 1: I'm not sure we would have gotten that much some
Speaker 1: more support, um if if it wasn't an election year,
Speaker 1: right that, Yes, yeah, I think absolutely. I mean, who
Speaker 1: wants to go to the ballot box and saying I'm
Speaker 1: voting against loans to small business, I'm voting against our
Speaker 1: unemployment benefits. So you have both parties. There doesn't seem
Speaker 1: to be any anyone advocating much in the way of
Speaker 1: fiscal discipline right now, right, And I think part of
Speaker 1: that is it's definitely it's election season, so how could
Speaker 1: you do? How could you though? I mean above me
Speaker 1: on it being an election year, right, Yes, I agree,
Speaker 1: I agree. But there are some some folks who are
Speaker 1: very focused on deficit, you know, bringing down the depth
Speaker 1: of fit, reducing deficits to either through reduced spending or
Speaker 1: increased taxes, and right now people are saying just what
Speaker 1: you're saying, Carol, like, you know what, let's just take
Speaker 1: care of people. Let's pass the bill and let's take
Speaker 1: care of people. And that's what's happening. And so I
Speaker 1: think I'm grateful that it's happening, but I but I'm
Speaker 1: also wondering if it would have been as generous if
Speaker 1: it wasn't an election year. That's just sad. Sorry, Oh,
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Okay, that's my opinion. Everyone. It's you know.
Speaker 1: The good thing is we got it right, We've gotten
Speaker 1: this aid and we'll probably get more eight it's our
Speaker 1: expectation that will be another program probably late later this
Speaker 1: month with additionally um which we need. And I'm happy
Speaker 1: that we're getting it. And so, you know, you mentioned
Speaker 1: nine eleven Kevin, And obviously something that folks look at
Speaker 1: after that for obvious reasons was the travel industry, the
Speaker 1: airline industry. What do you see in this case, because
Speaker 1: you know, we're looking at you know, volumes that are
Speaker 1: down US percent. Is their short term hope for that
Speaker 1: or is this something that's a longer term play? How
Speaker 1: do you look at that sector? Sure, So you know,
Speaker 1: I was in Manhattan and nine eleven, and you know,
Speaker 1: I remember a lot of you know that too well.
Speaker 1: There are a lot of people who said, I'm never
Speaker 1: going to fly again, just not going to do it.
Speaker 1: And airline traffic dropped precipitously over the next several months,
Speaker 1: but a year later we were back to of the
Speaker 1: airline traffic we had we had before. So it's interesting.
Speaker 1: The other thing that's interesting today, and I actually had
Speaker 1: to read it. It was on Bloomberg and I had
Speaker 1: to read like five times, was um the Carnival. Some
Speaker 1: of the carnival crews somewhat of major sort of travel
Speaker 1: agency saying that when day this Carnival announced that they
Speaker 1: were going to start sailing again, bookings were up I
Speaker 1: think SI over the same period last year. And I
Speaker 1: thought to myself, I would have I would have thought
Speaker 1: that would be the last, very last thing to come back,
Speaker 1: the very last thing thing like that. And yet there
Speaker 1: are people who want to continue to sort of go
Speaker 1: back to quote normal. It is. It's an amazing world,
Speaker 1: all right, Kevin Barry, good to check out with you.
Speaker 1: Thanks so much for giving us the opinion and the insights.
Speaker 1: Down in Raleigh, North Carolina, chief investment Officer for Cap
Speaker 1: Trust Carroll Resiliency. Right, yeah, it comes back. It's interesting.
Speaker 1: Thanks so much for listening to Bloomberg Business Week. Download
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