WEBVTT - Tom Morello 0:00:01.760 --> 0:00:04.840 Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of Inside the 0:00:04.880 --> 0:00:07.920 Studio on iHeart Radio. My name is Jordan runt Hog, 0:00:08.000 --> 0:00:10.960 but enough about me. In addition to being one of 0:00:10.960 --> 0:00:14.280 the most innovative guitarists of his generation, my guest today 0:00:14.320 --> 0:00:17.759 has earned a place as one of rock's loudest social consciousness. 0:00:18.400 --> 0:00:20.959 Beginning with Rage Against the Machine and later on with 0:00:21.079 --> 0:00:24.439 Audio Slave, Prophets of Rage and his solo project A 0:00:24.560 --> 0:00:28.640 Night Watchman, his politically charged anthems have changed people's heads, 0:00:29.040 --> 0:00:32.080 often while the head bang. Like many of us, he 0:00:32.200 --> 0:00:35.120 struggled with the isolation of lockdown, so he turned to 0:00:35.159 --> 0:00:38.199 his music. It's the force he's used for decades to 0:00:38.200 --> 0:00:41.559 help bring a positive change to the world. This time around, 0:00:41.760 --> 0:00:45.440 it helped bring a positive change to himself. After crafting 0:00:45.440 --> 0:00:48.159 guitar parts in his home studio, he sent them off 0:00:48.159 --> 0:00:52.160 to an astonishing assortment of friends and collaborators. The first 0:00:52.159 --> 0:00:54.680 fruits of the project released the mid October as The 0:00:54.720 --> 0:00:58.480 Atlas Underground Fire, and now he's back with another record 0:00:58.520 --> 0:01:02.720 from his self described Saw Conspiracy. Earlier this week, he 0:01:02.760 --> 0:01:06.760 announced The Atlas Underground Flood, a sister record featuring the 0:01:06.800 --> 0:01:10.479 likes of Ben Harper ex Ambassadors and Jim James due 0:01:10.480 --> 0:01:15.080 out December three. We talked about is creatively productive, quarantine, 0:01:15.400 --> 0:01:18.399 is legendary guitar playing, and what it's been like teaching 0:01:18.440 --> 0:01:22.320 his son to shred. He's a proud papa. Indeed, I'm 0:01:22.319 --> 0:01:25.360 so happy to welcome Mr Tomrollo. I hope you enjoy 0:01:25.440 --> 0:01:32.280 our conversation. But you are extremely busy, as everybody knows, 0:01:32.280 --> 0:01:35.960 so I I am extremely grateful for your time. I'm 0:01:36.000 --> 0:01:39.960 speaking to you shortly after the release of your latest 0:01:40.319 --> 0:01:44.280 sonic conspiracy, The Atlas Underground Fire, and by the time 0:01:44.280 --> 0:01:46.240 this comes out, listeners will be very well aware that 0:01:46.280 --> 0:01:48.680 there is a sister album on the way, The Atlas 0:01:48.760 --> 0:01:52.320 Underground Flood. I wanted to start by asking about the 0:01:52.320 --> 0:01:55.680 relationship between those two albums. Is Flood a continuation of 0:01:55.760 --> 0:01:58.680 Fire or is it an altogether different perspective? Yeah, no, 0:01:58.840 --> 0:02:01.400 these are record These are my Plague albums, their records 0:02:01.400 --> 0:02:04.480 that were both made, you know, during the height of lockdown, 0:02:04.680 --> 0:02:07.240 and uh, there's they are sister records in a way. 0:02:07.280 --> 0:02:10.480 It's sort of my stab at take the clashes London calling, 0:02:10.760 --> 0:02:13.120 making a making a record of sort of a double 0:02:13.200 --> 0:02:18.360 album that is united in purpose. Uh, united in intent, 0:02:18.919 --> 0:02:23.400 united in sort of authenticity and ferocity, but is sonically 0:02:23.639 --> 0:02:27.799 very very diverse, with no olds part. Absolutely. I mean, 0:02:28.160 --> 0:02:29.760 one of the things that I think that's so unique 0:02:29.760 --> 0:02:32.240 about these two albums is that I feel like for 0:02:32.360 --> 0:02:34.560 every other album you've made, it seems to come from 0:02:34.639 --> 0:02:37.360 place of wanting to help people other people, and it 0:02:37.360 --> 0:02:40.080 sounds like for these pairs of albums it was almost 0:02:40.080 --> 0:02:42.160 really the inverse. It was sort of designed. It came 0:02:42.160 --> 0:02:44.600 out of a need of wanting to help yourself and 0:02:44.639 --> 0:02:47.160 to help you remain being a musician at a time 0:02:47.160 --> 0:02:50.280 when that was looking harder and harder to do. Absolutely, absolutely, 0:02:50.280 --> 0:02:52.840 I mean, I recorded those albums here in my studio. 0:02:53.200 --> 0:02:54.919 I have a studio here, but I don't know how 0:02:54.919 --> 0:02:57.760 to run it. Um there's normally an engineer who sits here, 0:02:57.760 --> 0:03:00.359 but during lockdown, there was no engineer coming uh. And 0:03:00.440 --> 0:03:02.720 inspiration came from a very surprising place. I read an 0:03:02.760 --> 0:03:06.920 interview where UM Kanye West was bragging about recording the 0:03:07.000 --> 0:03:09.679 vocals to a couple of his albums onto the UH 0:03:09.880 --> 0:03:12.280 voice memo of his phone. So I just started recording 0:03:12.280 --> 0:03:16.600 guitar into my my my phone on a folding chair 0:03:16.639 --> 0:03:18.680 in front of my amp. Over there just playing some 0:03:18.720 --> 0:03:22.440 guitar riffs and then sending those riffs to producers, engineers 0:03:22.440 --> 0:03:25.720 and artists around the world, and that became the building 0:03:25.720 --> 0:03:27.880 blocks for these records. But first and foremost, it was 0:03:27.880 --> 0:03:30.000 a way to sort of assert that, in this crazy 0:03:30.040 --> 0:03:32.079 time of kind of fear and anxiety, that I could 0:03:32.120 --> 0:03:35.760 still be a musician of the guitars on this record. 0:03:35.960 --> 0:03:38.800 On these two records were recorded into the voice memo 0:03:38.800 --> 0:03:42.120 of my phone, which is something I hadn't anticipated and 0:03:42.160 --> 0:03:44.800 may lead to me throwing out all those expensive microphones. 0:03:45.840 --> 0:03:48.440 I mean, that is crazy. Has that new approach changed 0:03:48.480 --> 0:03:51.720 your approach to composing in the long hall? I mean, 0:03:51.920 --> 0:03:54.200 did it open any doors for you creatively? I imagine 0:03:54.240 --> 0:03:57.480 that sort of not having all of the accruterments of 0:03:57.640 --> 0:04:01.000 you know, the studio, maybe my can play a little freer. 0:04:01.040 --> 0:04:02.640 I don't know. Yeah, it was, it was. I mean 0:04:02.760 --> 0:04:05.720 it was. When I set out recording those guitar rists, 0:04:05.720 --> 0:04:07.720 it really was not with the intent I'm going to 0:04:07.800 --> 0:04:10.120 make a double album. It was like I need to 0:04:10.160 --> 0:04:13.800 try to survive Thursday, you know, you know, and and 0:04:14.040 --> 0:04:16.120 this is one way it's too like I love this, 0:04:16.360 --> 0:04:19.000 I love playing guitar, but there's no way to connect. Now, 0:04:19.080 --> 0:04:21.279 there was a way to connect, you know, on these records, 0:04:21.320 --> 0:04:23.360 I mean from they span from you know, bring Me 0:04:23.400 --> 0:04:26.400 the Horizon in Brazil, two Idols in the UK to 0:04:26.560 --> 0:04:29.840 Sam Abdulhadi and Palestine to Bruce Bringsteen in New Jersey, 0:04:30.000 --> 0:04:32.160 Refused in Sweden. I was just kind of like these 0:04:32.279 --> 0:04:34.839 rock and roll pen pals, you know, there's kind of 0:04:34.880 --> 0:04:38.560 global connectiveness during a time where there was no human connection. 0:04:39.640 --> 0:04:42.200 I mean, giving Kanye is indirect involvement on the album, 0:04:42.240 --> 0:04:45.120 I'm almost surprised that he didn't make a guest appearance. No, 0:04:45.360 --> 0:04:46.960 I didn't know. I didn't I didn't think to reach 0:04:46.960 --> 0:04:49.880 out for Evnick. Can you talk to me more about 0:04:49.880 --> 0:04:52.839 the collaborative process. Was it a case of finishing a 0:04:52.960 --> 0:04:55.560 sketch or riff and thinking, oh my god, I think 0:04:55.600 --> 0:04:58.240 I know exactly who that would be for. Or did 0:04:58.240 --> 0:04:59.800 you reach out to art a bunch of artists that 0:04:59.839 --> 0:05:01.680 you wanted to work with and kind of say here's 0:05:01.720 --> 0:05:05.960 ten things. Yeah, it was each of those ways was 0:05:06.000 --> 0:05:08.440 implemented in some ways that it was the where every 0:05:08.480 --> 0:05:10.359 day felt like it was kind of exactly the same. 0:05:10.440 --> 0:05:13.919 There was almost this roulette wheel adventure to these songs. 0:05:13.960 --> 0:05:15.840 You know, I come up here on Tuesday, I'd record 0:05:16.000 --> 0:05:19.400 four riffs. I'd send them to I don't know, pick Um, 0:05:19.440 --> 0:05:22.559 you know, uh, Jim James, my morning Jack, Like, which 0:05:22.800 --> 0:05:25.479 are you feeling any of these? Number three? Okay, great, 0:05:25.520 --> 0:05:27.280 let's have that be a starting point. Another time it 0:05:27.360 --> 0:05:29.240 might be like a track that is kind of more 0:05:29.279 --> 0:05:32.120 put together, bring me the horizon is responding to these risks. 0:05:32.120 --> 0:05:35.000 Other times, whether it was phantogram or some Abdulhati, they 0:05:35.080 --> 0:05:37.479 might send me something as a as a starting point. 0:05:37.560 --> 0:05:40.320 There were really no rules to it, and the the 0:05:40.440 --> 0:05:45.120 unexpectedness of that daily sort of creative process was really 0:05:45.480 --> 0:05:48.920 like an elixir of health and hope during that kind 0:05:48.920 --> 0:05:50.960 of crazy time. That was what I was gonna say. 0:05:50.960 --> 0:05:52.839 It must have been so exciting for you to send 0:05:52.880 --> 0:05:54.919 these out into the world, and really a lot always 0:05:54.920 --> 0:05:57.040 have no idea what they might send back. I mean, 0:05:57.200 --> 0:05:59.360 were there any what were some of the biggest surprises 0:05:59.400 --> 0:06:01.560 for you? Well, I'll say, I mean there's there's there 0:06:01.600 --> 0:06:04.039 were there were quite a few big surprises. But um, 0:06:04.080 --> 0:06:07.080 like some Albdo Hottie for example, she's a young Palestinian DJ, 0:06:07.160 --> 0:06:09.480 just fantastic young artist, and you know, I sent her 0:06:09.560 --> 0:06:12.039 some of my usual kind of Black Sabbath led Zeppelin 0:06:12.120 --> 0:06:14.840 riffs that the normal, the normal stuff, and she's like, 0:06:15.440 --> 0:06:18.240 I like these, but I don't know what to do 0:06:18.320 --> 0:06:20.359 with these. I was like, thank you for your candor. 0:06:20.440 --> 0:06:23.760 I appreciate that. Why don't you start the process. So 0:06:23.800 --> 0:06:25.640 she sent me this kind of like eight minute long 0:06:25.720 --> 0:06:30.080 kind of Arabic trance track that was entirely out of 0:06:30.839 --> 0:06:33.920 sort of my wheelhouse and experience. But I was like fantastic, 0:06:33.960 --> 0:06:35.920 Like I put on my headphones, put on my kind 0:06:35.920 --> 0:06:39.320 of like coal trane ears and just let go and 0:06:39.440 --> 0:06:42.680 just jammed over it. A few times, sent those those 0:06:43.160 --> 0:06:45.280 sort of wild tracks back to her to apply her 0:06:45.320 --> 0:06:48.240 production genius. So that was like that was the process. 0:06:48.320 --> 0:06:51.560 Like every day it was some new eddie, some new streams, 0:06:51.600 --> 0:06:55.040 some new routes, some new bridge, some new way to create, 0:06:55.640 --> 0:06:58.960 and eventually I amassed this body of material. Now it's 0:06:58.960 --> 0:07:01.920 two records, because in this day and age, putting out 0:07:01.920 --> 0:07:04.040 a double album doesn't make sense. But there there always 0:07:04.160 --> 0:07:06.640 was the intent that Fire and Flood would would be 0:07:06.720 --> 0:07:09.160 would be sisters, and they that they would be together. 0:07:09.560 --> 0:07:13.239 Um and you know, I I look at this project 0:07:13.320 --> 0:07:15.240 is it's is both a solo album and very much 0:07:15.240 --> 0:07:19.320 a collaborative effort. Um is a solo album, and that 0:07:19.400 --> 0:07:24.720 there is a kind of purity of overall vision and curation, 0:07:25.320 --> 0:07:28.240 and and my guitar is the common voice and all 0:07:28.240 --> 0:07:31.320 these songs, but none of these songs I couldn't I 0:07:31.360 --> 0:07:33.040 couldn't have made any of them on my own. They're 0:07:33.080 --> 0:07:36.280 all a product of the individual chemistry of the great 0:07:36.440 --> 0:07:39.520 and diverse artists I had the honor of working that 0:07:39.560 --> 0:07:41.400 sounds are so diverse, And as you said, you know, 0:07:41.440 --> 0:07:43.600 I mean, you think about making a you know, in quotes, 0:07:43.600 --> 0:07:46.440 a quarantine album, and it seems like this really isolating, 0:07:46.440 --> 0:07:50.200 claustrophobic thing. But this is truly a global record, and 0:07:50.240 --> 0:07:52.480 you think of all these artists that are not only 0:07:52.520 --> 0:07:55.120 located in different places, but are bringing their own experiences 0:07:55.160 --> 0:07:57.480 into it. I mean, I'm hard pressed to name an 0:07:57.480 --> 0:08:00.480 album where one of the vocals is for coorded by 0:08:00.480 --> 0:08:04.320 somebody who's basically scaling everest, you know, I mean, you know, 0:08:04.400 --> 0:08:06.320 I mean this is as was the case with Mike 0:08:06.360 --> 0:08:09.120 Poshner during that Yeah, I mean, that's that's crazy to me. 0:08:09.160 --> 0:08:11.320 How they you know, their experiences are now sort of 0:08:11.400 --> 0:08:13.480 part of the DNA of this record, I mean, and 0:08:13.600 --> 0:08:16.160 DJ Sama to me, wasn't she recording in the midst 0:08:16.200 --> 0:08:19.640 of the Israeli Yeah, yeah, exactly, yeah, she would sort 0:08:19.640 --> 0:08:21.480 of during the mixing of the song, she disappeared for 0:08:21.520 --> 0:08:23.240 a couple of days. I'm like, are you okay? And 0:08:23.640 --> 0:08:25.640 fortunately she was. But yeah, you know, and then there's 0:08:25.760 --> 0:08:28.120 you know, Springsteen in New Jersey Sinking Highway to Hell 0:08:28.520 --> 0:08:33.000 all will I'm completely alone, you know, every day here 0:08:33.000 --> 0:08:35.480 in the studio, like you know, doing but whatever, the 0:08:35.520 --> 0:08:40.880 normal sort of plumbing. And you've mentioned, of course the 0:08:40.960 --> 0:08:44.120 unifying feature of these records, of course, your electric guitar. 0:08:44.440 --> 0:08:47.199 You've been very vocal in uh, I mean, throughout your career, 0:08:47.240 --> 0:08:49.640 but in recent interviews, especially about how you feel the 0:08:49.640 --> 0:08:52.439 electric guitar is. I'm gonna make sure I'm getting the 0:08:52.520 --> 0:08:56.040 quote exactly right. The greatest instrument that humankind has ever devised. 0:08:56.120 --> 0:08:59.160 And you will get no argument for me whatsoever. But 0:08:59.200 --> 0:09:02.040 I wanted to ask Askew, why what is it about 0:09:02.040 --> 0:09:06.240 the electric guitar that makes it such an effective tool? Friend? 0:09:06.440 --> 0:09:09.880 Conduit paint? But yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly yeah. 0:09:10.040 --> 0:09:14.160 Co conspirator, um, yeah, I I mean, there's one I'm 0:09:14.240 --> 0:09:17.280 maybe somewhat prejudiced on this on this topic, but but 0:09:17.400 --> 0:09:20.400 there's no instruments, you know, before or after the creation 0:09:20.400 --> 0:09:23.640 of electric guitar that has both the the the can 0:09:23.720 --> 0:09:27.160 have the subtle nuance that the electric guitar has as 0:09:27.200 --> 0:09:31.080 well as the stadium destroying rock power. There's nothing else 0:09:31.120 --> 0:09:33.560 there's because it's also and there are certainly, you know, 0:09:33.559 --> 0:09:35.319 there are crowds that go wild to E d M 0:09:35.400 --> 0:09:37.520 music and this, this, that and the other, and hip hop, 0:09:37.559 --> 0:09:39.640 which is all fantastic, and I go wild too, don't 0:09:39.640 --> 0:09:41.720 get don't get me wrong, but there's something about the 0:09:41.800 --> 0:09:46.199 visceral hands on you know, man made or human made 0:09:46.280 --> 0:09:49.760 quality of like touching those strings and feeling the force 0:09:49.840 --> 0:09:52.520 of that or being able to be sort of introspective 0:09:52.520 --> 0:09:55.720 with a nuance. And but the second part of the 0:09:55.720 --> 0:09:57.720 thesis is not that the just that the electric guitar 0:09:57.760 --> 0:09:59.600 is the greatest instrument on the planet, that it's an 0:09:59.600 --> 0:10:03.000 instrument the future and not just a past, because there's 0:10:03.040 --> 0:10:05.920 a lot of guitar players that are traditionalists, and you know, 0:10:05.960 --> 0:10:07.760 all the good guitar playing has been done, so we 0:10:07.840 --> 0:10:09.839 just play something that's just like that, and that's what 0:10:10.360 --> 0:10:12.079 those are the those are the goal posts. I do 0:10:12.160 --> 0:10:14.679 not subscribe to that. I believe these records are in 0:10:14.960 --> 0:10:16.920 the first Atlas Underground record in two thousand eighteen, and 0:10:16.920 --> 0:10:19.960 these two records are an assertion the electric guitar has 0:10:20.000 --> 0:10:22.360 a bright future. But I think that that future is 0:10:22.360 --> 0:10:26.040 found in sometimes unconventional ways. I never want to let 0:10:26.080 --> 0:10:29.000 go of the big riffs, of the crazy guitar solos, 0:10:29.000 --> 0:10:31.240 of the expressiveness of the instrument, but I want to 0:10:31.280 --> 0:10:34.240 find a context for those riffs, for those solos, and 0:10:34.280 --> 0:10:37.760 for that that expressiveness in unexpected places to push the 0:10:37.800 --> 0:10:40.280 guitar into the future. That's why there is punk rock 0:10:40.360 --> 0:10:43.040 on this record. That's why there is there is uh 0:10:43.200 --> 0:10:45.240 A d M bass drops on this record. That's why 0:10:45.240 --> 0:10:47.480 there's heavy metal on this record. That's why that's there's 0:10:47.520 --> 0:11:00.400 folk songs on this Who to ask? There was a 0:11:00.440 --> 0:11:02.800 quote you gave recently, and I'm paraphrasing, but something where 0:11:02.840 --> 0:11:04.920 you said, for the first ten years of my musical 0:11:04.960 --> 0:11:07.520 career was practicing scales. In the second ten years, I 0:11:07.559 --> 0:11:12.760 was practicing animal sounds on guitar. Uh what point, I mean, 0:11:13.880 --> 0:11:17.800 at what point did the guitar become not strictly an 0:11:17.840 --> 0:11:21.120 instrument to be mastered, but something to be used to 0:11:21.200 --> 0:11:24.880 express yourself in ways that you know are unconventional and 0:11:24.960 --> 0:11:29.160 aren't necessarily traditional. Yeah, when we pick up an instrument, Uh, 0:11:29.200 --> 0:11:32.520 there are two categories in which people may find themselves. 0:11:32.559 --> 0:11:35.040 There are musicians and there are artists. Um. And for 0:11:35.080 --> 0:11:37.360 the first tenure, first first ten years of playing guitar, 0:11:37.760 --> 0:11:40.280 I had worked very, very hard at and put in 0:11:40.320 --> 0:11:44.760 my ten twenty hours to become a technically skilled musician. 0:11:45.360 --> 0:11:47.280 I couldn't write songs that I like. I mean, I 0:11:47.280 --> 0:11:50.600 could shred my ass off like Steve I or Baby 0:11:50.640 --> 0:11:53.480 van Halen. I couldn't write songs that I liked, and 0:11:53.520 --> 0:11:56.440 I didn't have my own voice on the instrument. It 0:11:56.520 --> 0:11:58.640 was around the beginnings of Rage against the Machine where 0:11:58.640 --> 0:12:01.520 I began self identifying as the DJ and the band right. 0:12:01.520 --> 0:12:03.520 I started to look at the instrument in an entirely 0:12:03.559 --> 0:12:06.880 different way, recognizing and realizing the electric guitar is a 0:12:06.880 --> 0:12:09.160 relatively new instrument on the planet. It's just a piece 0:12:09.200 --> 0:12:11.439 of wood with six wires and a few electronics that 0:12:11.480 --> 0:12:14.480 could be manipulated in a wide variety of of ways. 0:12:14.840 --> 0:12:17.680 And I remember the me being inured as a young 0:12:17.920 --> 0:12:22.080 guitar magazine reader and all my favorite guitars. Almost like 0:12:22.240 --> 0:12:25.679 to a to a person would say, well, it's all 0:12:25.720 --> 0:12:27.760 been done on the guitar, and I was like, how 0:12:27.760 --> 0:12:30.280 do we know? Are we sure? Have we? I mean, 0:12:30.320 --> 0:12:33.160 this is a short time. Is there a study? Is 0:12:33.200 --> 0:12:35.439 there a study that proved so? I? And but then 0:12:35.520 --> 0:12:37.760 once I got outside of that box and did start 0:12:37.760 --> 0:12:40.280 practicing animal noises and R two D two noises and 0:12:40.360 --> 0:12:43.880 helicopter noises, and you know, my inspirations went well beyond 0:12:44.360 --> 0:12:48.520 Chuck Barry, Betty Van Halen and Metallica. UM. It really 0:12:48.520 --> 0:12:50.520 like the blinders came off and all of a sudden 0:12:50.559 --> 0:12:52.520 I was I felt like, well, this is who I 0:12:52.600 --> 0:12:54.320 am on the instrument. And that's when I took the 0:12:54.520 --> 0:12:58.760 tentative first steps from becoming a musician into becoming an artist. 0:12:59.400 --> 0:13:01.200 And the thing that really boggles my mind is that 0:13:01.240 --> 0:13:04.679 you were came to guitar relatively late in life as 0:13:04.679 --> 0:13:06.840 far as you since go, I think, like late teens. 0:13:06.880 --> 0:13:08.319 I mean, one of the only people I can think 0:13:08.320 --> 0:13:11.040 of it picked up guitar that late was Robert Johnson, 0:13:11.080 --> 0:13:13.840 and he he had the devil to help, that's correct, 0:13:14.360 --> 0:13:15.920 which I imagine you did not. I mean, how did 0:13:15.960 --> 0:13:18.280 how did you first find your way to the guitar. Yeah, 0:13:18.520 --> 0:13:20.480 I mean, given my Catholic upbringing, that was not an option. 0:13:20.480 --> 0:13:23.079 But yeah, you're at He's the only guit Robert Johnson 0:13:23.080 --> 0:13:25.360 started playing at eighteen, and he's the only other guitar 0:13:25.360 --> 0:13:28.000 player I've ever heard of and began making the big 0:13:28.040 --> 0:13:30.560 game sort of notable as the guitars began making records 0:13:30.600 --> 0:13:32.839 that late. Um. I had a guitar when I was 0:13:32.880 --> 0:13:35.480 thirteen years old. I took two lessons that were so 0:13:35.640 --> 0:13:37.920 off putting. It sat in a closet for the next 0:13:37.920 --> 0:13:40.480 four years, UM, gathering dust. And for me it was 0:13:40.520 --> 0:13:44.959 punk rock music. I I admired the big rock stars 0:13:45.000 --> 0:13:46.839 of the day, the led Zeppelins is that now, But 0:13:46.880 --> 0:13:49.160 it really felt like it was unattainable. And you had 0:13:49.200 --> 0:13:51.680 to have a ten thousand dollar Les Paul and a 0:13:51.720 --> 0:13:54.400 wall of marshals and a and a castle on a 0:13:54.440 --> 0:13:58.720 Scottish lock and some sort of gorgeous cheek bones and 0:13:58.800 --> 0:14:01.000 hair and groupies and like to even they like get 0:14:01.040 --> 0:14:05.760 a ticket into the party, you know exactly I had, 0:14:05.800 --> 0:14:08.640 you know, I had a dance basement in Illinois. Uh, 0:14:08.720 --> 0:14:10.200 and so when I heard that, you know, the sex 0:14:10.200 --> 0:14:12.480 Pistols in the clash. Those were records. It felt like 0:14:12.480 --> 0:14:15.000 they were made in damp basements wherever those people were. 0:14:15.280 --> 0:14:18.720 They were singing about topics that were neither you know, dungeons, 0:14:18.760 --> 0:14:22.760 nor dragons nor groupies, and I could relate personally, relate to, 0:14:22.880 --> 0:14:26.000 like the real life stories they were telling about, you know, 0:14:26.640 --> 0:14:29.720 injustice and struggle and what how it sucks to be 0:14:30.080 --> 0:14:32.240 seventeen whatever, whatever it was sort of entailed in those 0:14:32.240 --> 0:14:36.160 songs felt like relatable, and more importantly, it felt like 0:14:36.200 --> 0:14:39.800 you could play those songs this afternoon. No, you could 0:14:39.840 --> 0:14:42.440 write a song like that this afternoon. And so the 0:14:42.520 --> 0:14:47.160 day I began, the day I began as a guitarist 0:14:47.440 --> 0:14:50.200 was within twenty four hours of getting the Sex Pistols cassette. 0:14:50.440 --> 0:14:52.320 I didn't know how to play a chord on the instrument. 0:14:52.440 --> 0:14:54.200 I didn't know how to play a note on the instrument. 0:14:54.320 --> 0:14:56.760 I went into the drama club of my school and 0:14:56.800 --> 0:14:59.480 announced the punk band was forming. I'm the guitar player. 0:15:00.000 --> 0:15:01.440 If you want to be in the band, raise your hand, 0:15:01.480 --> 0:15:05.760 no experience required. That makes me wonder if the Sex 0:15:05.760 --> 0:15:09.840 Pistols started roughly the same way too. Yeah, yeah, yeahs possible. 0:15:10.440 --> 0:15:12.520 I mean yeah, you uh, spent some of the time 0:15:12.560 --> 0:15:14.520 in the last year, and I have teaching your your son, 0:15:14.640 --> 0:15:17.960 your I think ten year old son how to play guitar. Uh. 0:15:18.400 --> 0:15:21.560 Has that changed your relationship to the guitar in anyway 0:15:21.640 --> 0:15:24.040 as now as a as a teacher to to a 0:15:24.120 --> 0:15:26.240 student in front of you, Yeah, very much. So. Well, 0:15:26.320 --> 0:15:28.480 first of all, I reflect in beginning to teach him, 0:15:28.480 --> 0:15:31.840 which was during lockdown. Um, I reflected on those two 0:15:31.880 --> 0:15:35.720 awful guitar lessons I had convinced me to not play 0:15:35.800 --> 0:15:37.600 for four years. So I did not repeat that pattern, 0:15:38.680 --> 0:15:40.640 and I made the experience one which was all about 0:15:40.720 --> 0:15:44.160 fun and immediate success and you know, like run before 0:15:44.160 --> 0:15:45.640 you walk and let's have a good time. But yes, 0:15:45.680 --> 0:15:48.160 it has changed my guitar playing considerly because now I'm 0:15:48.360 --> 0:15:50.880 kind of the second best guitar soloist in the family, 0:15:51.080 --> 0:15:52.640 and so I spent most of my time as a 0:15:52.720 --> 0:15:55.600 rhythm guitarist, you know, strumming the chords for Pink Floyd 0:15:55.640 --> 0:15:58.400 songs or whatever, while he just shreds his little butt off. 0:15:59.600 --> 0:16:02.680 I mean, I love and seeing his collaborations and your 0:16:02.680 --> 0:16:05.840 collaborations with Nandy Bush Well, I mean, for anyone who 0:16:05.960 --> 0:16:08.320 has the misfortune of having not seen her. She's this 0:16:08.440 --> 0:16:10.920 incredible I think she's eleven years old, this musician from 0:16:10.960 --> 0:16:14.880 England who will just melt your face on any instrument 0:16:15.040 --> 0:16:17.120 that you want. I mean, that has to make you 0:16:17.200 --> 0:16:21.320 feel good. I mean, the saga continues in a absolutely absolutely. 0:16:21.480 --> 0:16:23.840 I had become kind of Instagram friends, but she does 0:16:23.880 --> 0:16:26.600 these amazing covers of songs, including some audio slave and 0:16:26.680 --> 0:16:28.920 Rage against Machine songs. So I sent her one of 0:16:28.920 --> 0:16:31.480 my signature Ender Soul Power guitars, so we sort of 0:16:31.480 --> 0:16:33.560 became friendly, and then she reached out. It was like, 0:16:33.600 --> 0:16:35.360 do you want to, you know, write a song? He 0:16:35.560 --> 0:16:37.480 is that I would love to write a song with you, 0:16:37.640 --> 0:16:40.080 But I got a nine year old kid over here 0:16:40.160 --> 0:16:42.880 who's kind of ahead of me right now. Maybe you 0:16:42.920 --> 0:16:44.800 guys write a song together. And they did. They wrote 0:16:44.800 --> 0:16:46.680 a great song called The Children Will Rise Up. We 0:16:46.760 --> 0:16:48.720 got Jack Black in the video and it really you know, 0:16:48.720 --> 0:16:50.560 it says when the song was recorded, they were nine 0:16:50.560 --> 0:16:52.480 and ten years old. They're the ones they wrote it, 0:16:52.560 --> 0:16:54.440 they played, they play the inst I produced it. But 0:16:54.480 --> 0:16:56.760 it just it's pretty awesome, you know. And then I 0:16:56.760 --> 0:16:59.440 cannot I'm not gonna lie that when my kids solo 0:16:59.560 --> 0:17:02.440 comes up, in that one. You know, it's like it's 0:17:02.480 --> 0:17:05.800 just sixteen bars of just pure like fatherly pride. As 0:17:05.840 --> 0:17:08.119 he's sure, I mean, he's he's he's either got it 0:17:08.200 --> 0:17:11.240 or you don't. That has got to be the best 0:17:11.280 --> 0:17:14.000 feeling in the world that I mean, congratulate, you've done good. 0:17:14.040 --> 0:17:17.760 You've done good. It is, it's awesome. I'm speaking of 0:17:17.760 --> 0:17:20.440 of you know, a different note, but speaking of young 0:17:20.440 --> 0:17:22.919 women with guitars. You you've been working to get a 0:17:22.920 --> 0:17:27.840 group of young young musicians out of Taliban occupied Afghanistan. 0:17:27.840 --> 0:17:30.240 I was wondering what the latest was with them, and 0:17:30.280 --> 0:17:32.720 for there's any ways that that we can continue to 0:17:32.720 --> 0:17:35.280 to try to help. Yeah, the good news is that 0:17:35.320 --> 0:17:38.239 they are safe in regular contact with people who are 0:17:38.280 --> 0:17:40.760 in contact with them, and um, but they you know, 0:17:40.880 --> 0:17:44.880 I have been Uh. This is a great musician, Lannie Cordova. 0:17:44.920 --> 0:17:47.080 He was in like a metal band in the eighties 0:17:47.080 --> 0:17:48.760 and you know, he kind of got the religion of 0:17:48.800 --> 0:17:52.760 love and he moved moved to Afghanistan to help street children, 0:17:53.080 --> 0:17:56.840 people who have who had would endure trauma, especially on 0:17:56.880 --> 0:17:58.879 girls would endure trauma and because of the war and 0:17:58.920 --> 0:18:00.760 had lost their parents or for and whatnot. And he 0:18:00.800 --> 0:18:02.160 made a school for them and they had a lot 0:18:02.200 --> 0:18:06.639 of the The creative part of the school was they 0:18:06.680 --> 0:18:08.480 all learned to play guitar and they would sing songs 0:18:08.480 --> 0:18:11.600 and we did some collaborations and videos together. Was wonderful, 0:18:11.640 --> 0:18:14.479 wonderful girls, you know. And then after the Taliban takeover, 0:18:14.520 --> 0:18:17.359 they were you know, on a they were marked for death, 0:18:17.680 --> 0:18:20.040 you know, because they know we're playing Western music and 0:18:20.320 --> 0:18:22.760 had an American teacher and whatnot. And so they've been 0:18:22.760 --> 0:18:25.680 in hiding since then, and we've been working very very 0:18:25.880 --> 0:18:29.480 very diligently trying to get them um first to Pakistan 0:18:29.520 --> 0:18:31.919 and then you know, and then somewhere else. But but 0:18:31.920 --> 0:18:35.800 they're okay, they're okay, and uh, I hear from them periodically, 0:18:35.800 --> 0:18:39.800 and we're still doing all every means, both above and 0:18:40.200 --> 0:18:42.439 above board and blowboard to try to, you know, get 0:18:42.480 --> 0:18:46.399 them to safety. This was wonderfully here. I mean, I 0:18:46.480 --> 0:18:49.520 was thinking, this is probably the last eighteen months. I 0:18:49.560 --> 0:18:51.639 would imagine the first time in quite a while that 0:18:51.680 --> 0:18:54.760 you weren't literally on the front lines of marches. I'm 0:18:54.760 --> 0:18:58.200 thinking specifically of the protest for the murder of George Floyd. Uh. 0:18:58.280 --> 0:19:01.360 I've heard numerous clips and I've also heard anecdotally from 0:19:01.359 --> 0:19:04.320 friends that your music was being sung and chanted at 0:19:04.320 --> 0:19:07.199 these protests. What is it? I wanted to ask you, 0:19:07.240 --> 0:19:09.920 What is it about music that makes it such an 0:19:09.920 --> 0:19:15.399 effective method to transmit emotion and enact change. Yeah, well, 0:19:15.400 --> 0:19:17.800 I mean there's certainly a lot of evidence to support 0:19:17.840 --> 0:19:20.720 that thesis. You know, there's never been a successful social 0:19:20.760 --> 0:19:25.600 movement in this country without a soundtrack, really, you know, 0:19:25.720 --> 0:19:29.160 and with and um, you know, from the Union struggles 0:19:29.160 --> 0:19:31.720 to the civil rights movement to the anti war movements, 0:19:31.880 --> 0:19:36.959 from Vietnam to Iraq um that music. Music is a 0:19:37.080 --> 0:19:40.280 unique art form, and the music and pre dates you know, 0:19:40.400 --> 0:19:43.640 written language and so like, there's something about a tribal 0:19:43.760 --> 0:19:46.960 gathering with rhythm and rhyme that feels like the truth 0:19:47.119 --> 0:19:49.680 in a like something that's like deeply hardwired into our 0:19:49.720 --> 0:19:52.760