1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:17,959 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. 2 00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:29,760 Speaker 2: Welcome to the show, fellow Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as 3 00:00:29,800 --> 00:00:33,640 Speaker 2: always so much for tuning in. We didn't start the fire, 4 00:00:34,320 --> 00:00:36,479 Speaker 2: but we're happy to talk about it. 5 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:37,440 Speaker 3: It was always burning. 6 00:00:37,720 --> 00:00:43,320 Speaker 2: It was always yes, yes, And shout out to everybody 7 00:00:43,720 --> 00:00:46,640 Speaker 2: who is going to listen to that song right after this, 8 00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:49,720 Speaker 2: and shout out to anyone who can do all of 9 00:00:49,760 --> 00:00:51,560 Speaker 2: the lyrics without pause or a slip. 10 00:00:51,720 --> 00:00:54,240 Speaker 3: So topical, it's also kind of it's very at the 11 00:00:54,320 --> 00:00:56,320 Speaker 3: end of the world as we know it, cadence wise, 12 00:00:56,360 --> 00:01:01,080 Speaker 3: you know. And what's that band? A Little fallout does 13 00:01:01,320 --> 00:01:05,720 Speaker 3: a modernized version of that song with like updated lyrics. 14 00:01:05,720 --> 00:01:07,640 Speaker 3: That done not you know, the hugest Fallout Boy fan, 15 00:01:07,720 --> 00:01:09,160 Speaker 3: but I thought it was clever and. 16 00:01:09,200 --> 00:01:12,080 Speaker 2: It plays a big role in an episode of Always 17 00:01:12,120 --> 00:01:15,920 Speaker 2: Sunny in Philadelphia's latest season where they tried to do 18 00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:18,960 Speaker 2: a modern version we didn't start the Fire, and then 19 00:01:19,000 --> 00:01:22,840 Speaker 2: they learned that Fallout Boy already did it, and they 20 00:01:22,920 --> 00:01:28,319 Speaker 2: allude to apparently decades long beef they've had with Fallout Boy, 21 00:01:28,360 --> 00:01:30,319 Speaker 2: but it's the first time they mentioned it in the show. 22 00:01:30,560 --> 00:01:35,479 Speaker 2: Speaking shows, this is our super producer, mister Max Williams. 23 00:01:36,920 --> 00:01:39,440 Speaker 3: Whoa whoa whoa who. 24 00:01:40,400 --> 00:01:43,639 Speaker 2: That is none other than the one and only mister 25 00:01:43,880 --> 00:01:47,360 Speaker 2: Noel Brown. I am Ben Bullen. I don't know why 26 00:01:47,400 --> 00:01:51,000 Speaker 2: I paused there for a second, and I gotta tell you, guys, 27 00:01:51,480 --> 00:01:54,200 Speaker 2: at the risk of sounding like an arsonist. 28 00:01:54,080 --> 00:01:59,000 Speaker 3: Oh year, fire is pretty cool, I know what. Unequivocally, 29 00:01:59,040 --> 00:02:02,160 Speaker 3: it's pretty cool. Fromethean even right. It's a big deal. 30 00:02:02,560 --> 00:02:05,360 Speaker 3: It is the great Creator and the great destroyer. It's 31 00:02:05,600 --> 00:02:07,600 Speaker 3: pretty cool and pretty terrifying. 32 00:02:07,880 --> 00:02:12,280 Speaker 2: And this is a bit of a This is a 33 00:02:12,520 --> 00:02:15,760 Speaker 2: nice episode of ridiculous history for anybody who's a fan 34 00:02:15,919 --> 00:02:19,000 Speaker 2: of our sister podcast stuff they don't want you to know. 35 00:02:19,320 --> 00:02:22,600 Speaker 2: If you, like us, grew up reading time life books 36 00:02:22,680 --> 00:02:25,480 Speaker 2: like The Mysteries of the Universe and so on, you 37 00:02:25,600 --> 00:02:30,240 Speaker 2: probably at some point learned of the controversial concept of 38 00:02:30,400 --> 00:02:38,840 Speaker 2: spontaneous human combustion or SHC. It's the idea that, due 39 00:02:38,840 --> 00:02:43,960 Speaker 2: to some unknown factors or variables, at any point, a 40 00:02:44,120 --> 00:02:49,480 Speaker 2: human being can catch on fire internally, just for. 41 00:02:49,400 --> 00:02:59,160 Speaker 3: No good reason, sort of self destruct. This is definitely 42 00:02:59,320 --> 00:03:03,400 Speaker 3: a bit of red meat for paranormal enthusiasts. As you mentioned, 43 00:03:03,440 --> 00:03:04,880 Speaker 3: the kind of stuff we talk about and stuff they 44 00:03:04,880 --> 00:03:08,120 Speaker 3: don't want you to know. Surely, Ben, there, I've been 45 00:03:08,160 --> 00:03:11,120 Speaker 3: rewatching The X Files lately. It's got to be a 46 00:03:11,160 --> 00:03:13,880 Speaker 3: spontaneous human combustion episode of the X Files. 47 00:03:14,200 --> 00:03:17,440 Speaker 2: Oh or there are things related to SHC the X 48 00:03:17,440 --> 00:03:19,720 Speaker 2: Files for sure. Yeah you yelled it. 49 00:03:19,880 --> 00:03:21,320 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, it was an episode called fire. 50 00:03:21,760 --> 00:03:25,880 Speaker 2: There is, and I think there's an episode about maybe 51 00:03:25,919 --> 00:03:28,959 Speaker 2: more than one about someone who can start fires, like 52 00:03:29,040 --> 00:03:30,240 Speaker 2: another one called soft Light. 53 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:33,320 Speaker 3: I think there are more than one spontaneous team. There's 54 00:03:33,320 --> 00:03:36,760 Speaker 3: a whole section of on spontaneous human combustion on the 55 00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:39,680 Speaker 3: X Files fandom wiki. So there you go. Nice. 56 00:03:39,800 --> 00:03:42,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know, shout out to Chris Carter. When 57 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:45,880 Speaker 2: you've got to put out an episode every week, sometimes 58 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:47,560 Speaker 2: you return to similar wells. 59 00:03:47,720 --> 00:03:50,400 Speaker 3: Brother. Let me tell you, I think I've been watching 60 00:03:50,680 --> 00:03:53,680 Speaker 3: season seven because I've been enjoying Pluribus so much that 61 00:03:53,880 --> 00:03:56,360 Speaker 3: I wanted to go back and watch some of Vince 62 00:03:56,360 --> 00:03:59,280 Speaker 3: Gilligan's X Files episodes. And I think he started writing 63 00:03:59,280 --> 00:04:01,680 Speaker 3: a little later in the series. But yeah, and while 64 00:04:01,680 --> 00:04:04,280 Speaker 3: some of those episodes that he wrote are great, there 65 00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:08,080 Speaker 3: are some real stinkers later in the XI. There's one 66 00:04:08,120 --> 00:04:10,800 Speaker 3: where Molder speaking of stuff that I want you to know, 67 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:14,400 Speaker 3: gets trapped in the Devil's Triangle and transported back in 68 00:04:14,520 --> 00:04:17,640 Speaker 3: time on like the Queen Anne. And it is some 69 00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:21,720 Speaker 3: scenery chewing bad British accents in that episode, I'll tell 70 00:04:21,760 --> 00:04:21,920 Speaker 3: you what. 71 00:04:22,520 --> 00:04:26,039 Speaker 2: And then yeah, I put that with the the humorous 72 00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:29,560 Speaker 2: episodes some of the there's a Christmas episode I'm thinking 73 00:04:29,600 --> 00:04:33,120 Speaker 2: of as well, or with the a lot of the 74 00:04:33,200 --> 00:04:36,560 Speaker 2: technology episodes did in age super duper well? 75 00:04:36,680 --> 00:04:39,039 Speaker 3: No, And to your point, make that many episodes in 76 00:04:39,080 --> 00:04:40,839 Speaker 3: the season back in the day when a season was 77 00:04:40,880 --> 00:04:44,280 Speaker 3: like thirty something episodes, You're gonna reuse some topics and 78 00:04:44,400 --> 00:04:45,760 Speaker 3: there's gonna be some misses. 79 00:04:46,200 --> 00:04:49,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, you know what I mean. Even Stephen King asked 80 00:04:49,880 --> 00:04:52,440 Speaker 2: to write about similar things at some point. Guy has 81 00:04:52,520 --> 00:04:58,480 Speaker 2: several novels about a haunted bicycle. So here we go. 82 00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:03,560 Speaker 2: What is a with spontaneous human combustion? Is there any 83 00:05:03,720 --> 00:05:09,200 Speaker 2: proof or confirmation of cases of SHC? And what does 84 00:05:09,320 --> 00:05:10,880 Speaker 2: science have to say? 85 00:05:11,120 --> 00:05:14,160 Speaker 3: Science does have something to say about it. The National 86 00:05:14,240 --> 00:05:18,239 Speaker 3: Library of Medicine rights on their website from the journal 87 00:05:18,320 --> 00:05:21,679 Speaker 3: article Spontaneous human Combustion in the light of the twenty 88 00:05:21,720 --> 00:05:24,760 Speaker 3: first century, the term spontaneous human combustion refers to a 89 00:05:24,800 --> 00:05:28,000 Speaker 3: situation when a human body is found with significant portions 90 00:05:28,360 --> 00:05:31,320 Speaker 3: of the middle part of the body reduced to ash, 91 00:05:31,800 --> 00:05:35,279 Speaker 3: much less damage to the head and extremities, and minimal 92 00:05:35,400 --> 00:05:38,919 Speaker 3: damage to the direct surroundings of the body. Typically, no 93 00:05:39,080 --> 00:05:42,359 Speaker 3: observable source of ignition is found in the vicinity of 94 00:05:42,400 --> 00:05:46,760 Speaker 3: the victim, and a bad smelling oily substance is noted. 95 00:05:47,400 --> 00:05:50,599 Speaker 2: Yeah, and this will be familiar to all of our 96 00:05:50,680 --> 00:05:55,600 Speaker 2: fellow nerds in the crowd. The idea has been around 97 00:05:55,800 --> 00:05:59,799 Speaker 2: for quite some time and it's still controversial. I compare 98 00:05:59,839 --> 00:06:03,200 Speaker 2: it almost to the idea of the mellified man, which 99 00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:06,960 Speaker 2: is an episode for another day. But it's into means 100 00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:12,480 Speaker 2: someone with honey basically. So it came and went throughout history, 101 00:06:12,800 --> 00:06:16,200 Speaker 2: but it really had its big pop culture moment thanks 102 00:06:16,240 --> 00:06:19,440 Speaker 2: to Charles Dickens, the guy who wrote a Christmas Carol 103 00:06:19,600 --> 00:06:22,120 Speaker 2: and Bleak House and a bunch of other stuff. He 104 00:06:22,240 --> 00:06:25,960 Speaker 2: mentioned spontaneous human combustion in his eighteen fifty three novel 105 00:06:26,400 --> 00:06:31,680 Speaker 2: Bleak House. There's a case of human combustion in the story. 106 00:06:32,160 --> 00:06:38,600 Speaker 2: That really gripped his audience and in the public's perception, 107 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:43,080 Speaker 2: this was amazing writing. They were like this guy spits 108 00:06:43,080 --> 00:06:45,279 Speaker 2: hot fire about fire. 109 00:06:45,480 --> 00:06:50,279 Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure, there's quite a reaction, you know, from 110 00:06:50,279 --> 00:06:52,560 Speaker 3: the public, from his readers. Like you said, it was 111 00:06:52,600 --> 00:06:56,440 Speaker 3: just such an outlandish idea. So considering that just ten 112 00:06:56,560 --> 00:07:00,080 Speaker 3: years before that he was writing about Ebenezer Scrooge being 113 00:07:00,160 --> 00:07:05,160 Speaker 3: visited by ghosts bleak house, you know, created an even 114 00:07:05,240 --> 00:07:09,200 Speaker 3: more extreme response. One of the characters described is an old, 115 00:07:09,279 --> 00:07:13,760 Speaker 3: sleazy alcoholic and his name is mister Crook, and he 116 00:07:13,880 --> 00:07:17,960 Speaker 3: ultimately meets his end as a pile of ash on 117 00:07:18,080 --> 00:07:22,280 Speaker 3: the floor and noted in the text, a dark greasy 118 00:07:22,400 --> 00:07:25,160 Speaker 3: coating on the walls and ceilings could be found. 119 00:07:25,720 --> 00:07:30,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, so let's put on our investigative hats here 120 00:07:30,720 --> 00:07:35,440 Speaker 2: because Deerstalker's right. Yeah, let's surelock it. So we know 121 00:07:35,600 --> 00:07:40,679 Speaker 2: that heavy consumption of alcohol appears to be a common 122 00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:44,960 Speaker 2: trend in a lot of human combustion stories. And also 123 00:07:45,120 --> 00:07:48,600 Speaker 2: the note about a dark greasy coating or an oily 124 00:07:48,720 --> 00:07:52,480 Speaker 2: substance in the vicinity, that's something that we see reported 125 00:07:52,560 --> 00:07:57,000 Speaker 2: in other cases. Now, is that dark greasy coating thing? 126 00:07:57,200 --> 00:07:59,960 Speaker 2: Is it something that Dickens made up and then laid 127 00:08:00,360 --> 00:08:04,200 Speaker 2: informed a bunch of other people's stories and tall tales 128 00:08:06,160 --> 00:08:08,880 Speaker 2: it's tough to parts that game of telephone. But we 129 00:08:09,000 --> 00:08:14,560 Speaker 2: know the public said, Okay, this is amazing, but that 130 00:08:14,840 --> 00:08:18,560 Speaker 2: can't happen in real life. Charlie, you've got a bridge 131 00:08:18,560 --> 00:08:21,640 Speaker 2: too far. You've crossed a rubicad of realism. 132 00:08:21,840 --> 00:08:23,840 Speaker 3: But he defends it pretty aggressively, doesn't He. 133 00:08:24,440 --> 00:08:28,080 Speaker 2: Very much does? He doesn't say, well, everyone's a critic. 134 00:08:28,280 --> 00:08:31,840 Speaker 2: He says, Hey, you guys don't know how much work 135 00:08:31,880 --> 00:08:35,320 Speaker 2: I do making my little novels. All right, I did 136 00:08:35,360 --> 00:08:39,320 Speaker 2: a lot of research. Here are dozens upon dozens of 137 00:08:39,440 --> 00:08:46,640 Speaker 2: famous cases of spontaneous human combustion, and I have receipts. 138 00:08:46,640 --> 00:08:50,760 Speaker 2: I have doctors from those times who said this stuff 139 00:08:50,800 --> 00:08:51,400 Speaker 2: was real. 140 00:08:51,400 --> 00:08:54,160 Speaker 3: You know, speaking of the X Files. If I'm not mistaken, 141 00:08:54,200 --> 00:08:58,720 Speaker 3: there is a television mini series adaptation, I believe from 142 00:08:58,720 --> 00:09:04,079 Speaker 3: the BBC of Bleak How, starring Jillian Anderson, Agent Scully herself. 143 00:09:04,880 --> 00:09:09,040 Speaker 3: It is a little unusual, though, right, to include something 144 00:09:09,360 --> 00:09:13,160 Speaker 3: like this as just like a basic plot point, right, 145 00:09:13,240 --> 00:09:15,480 Speaker 3: It just seems like there were other you know, it's 146 00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:17,719 Speaker 3: an interest. It must have been a pet subject for him. 147 00:09:17,760 --> 00:09:20,080 Speaker 3: He just must have found it fascinating and thought it 148 00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:22,440 Speaker 3: was worth including. Because I don't know the plot of 149 00:09:22,559 --> 00:09:25,200 Speaker 3: bleak House right off the top, is it like a mystery, 150 00:09:25,280 --> 00:09:26,840 Speaker 3: like no one could figure out what happened to the 151 00:09:26,880 --> 00:09:28,760 Speaker 3: old Kook or Krook, mister. 152 00:09:28,600 --> 00:09:33,600 Speaker 2: Crook right, Crookick A bit on the nose there, Charlie. Well, 153 00:09:34,240 --> 00:09:38,880 Speaker 2: here's why I think the X Files mentions that we 154 00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:41,720 Speaker 2: brought in here, Here's why I think they're so apropos 155 00:09:42,080 --> 00:09:47,400 Speaker 2: because bleak House, while it's considered a novel now, it 156 00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:52,360 Speaker 2: was a lot more like X Files or Lost when 157 00:09:52,480 --> 00:09:56,080 Speaker 2: Charles Dickens was first writing it. It was published as 158 00:09:56,120 --> 00:10:00,640 Speaker 2: a twenty episode serial from eighteen fifty two to eighteen 159 00:10:00,679 --> 00:10:05,120 Speaker 2: fifty three. So our guy is writing in segments and 160 00:10:05,200 --> 00:10:09,640 Speaker 2: publishing those segments. So, like Chris Carter or Vince Gilligan, 161 00:10:09,800 --> 00:10:12,680 Speaker 2: he's got to put out an episode every you know, 162 00:10:12,720 --> 00:10:17,040 Speaker 2: at a certain cadence. And so maybe he just starts 163 00:10:17,120 --> 00:10:20,480 Speaker 2: thinking out of the box due to necessity. Right, Maybe 164 00:10:20,520 --> 00:10:23,800 Speaker 2: he's like he's getting to the death scene for Crook 165 00:10:23,840 --> 00:10:25,720 Speaker 2: and he's like, all right, I've done this, I did this, 166 00:10:26,120 --> 00:10:29,640 Speaker 2: I gotta do I gotta do something. Oh what about 167 00:10:29,720 --> 00:10:33,720 Speaker 2: spontaneous human combustion? Or maybe and this happens to us 168 00:10:33,760 --> 00:10:37,280 Speaker 2: all the time. Maybe he just got super obsessed with 169 00:10:37,360 --> 00:10:41,400 Speaker 2: the subject and was trying to shoehorn it into his job. 170 00:10:41,679 --> 00:10:44,319 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's my theory too, ben I do want to 171 00:10:44,360 --> 00:10:47,160 Speaker 3: read a little bit of his introduction to the character 172 00:10:47,200 --> 00:10:49,920 Speaker 3: of mister Crook, where he kind of plants the seed 173 00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:55,560 Speaker 3: of his untimely demise. He describes him as being old, short, cadaverous, 174 00:10:55,600 --> 00:11:00,640 Speaker 3: and withered, and his breath as issuing invisible smoke from 175 00:11:00,640 --> 00:11:03,600 Speaker 3: his mouth as if he were on fire within. 176 00:11:04,280 --> 00:11:08,000 Speaker 2: Okay, okay, so he had this in mind. Here's what 177 00:11:08,080 --> 00:11:10,199 Speaker 2: he said to his critics. By the way, when people 178 00:11:10,240 --> 00:11:13,800 Speaker 2: were questioning the veracity of the Death Seat, he said, 179 00:11:13,840 --> 00:11:17,000 Speaker 2: I shall not abandon the facts until there shall have 180 00:11:17,080 --> 00:11:21,880 Speaker 2: been a considerable spontaneous combustion of the testimony on which 181 00:11:21,960 --> 00:11:26,080 Speaker 2: human occurrences are usually received. Now that sounds a little 182 00:11:26,080 --> 00:11:29,960 Speaker 2: bit complicated, a little bit round about in circuitous for 183 00:11:30,160 --> 00:11:34,800 Speaker 2: us in the modern day, but he is essentially saying, 184 00:11:36,040 --> 00:11:40,240 Speaker 2: you guys are wrong. This happens. I know about this, 185 00:11:40,360 --> 00:11:42,959 Speaker 2: and get this, folks. He is not the only author 186 00:11:43,440 --> 00:11:47,920 Speaker 2: to use spontaneous human combustion as a plot device. 187 00:11:54,760 --> 00:11:58,079 Speaker 3: Yeah, we've got Herman Melville as well as Nicholas Gogul 188 00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:01,439 Speaker 3: both who use SHC to end the lives of some 189 00:12:01,600 --> 00:12:06,800 Speaker 3: characters in their books, respectively, Redburn and Dead Souls. We've 190 00:12:06,800 --> 00:12:11,359 Speaker 3: got more modern pop culture examples, of course, and characters 191 00:12:11,400 --> 00:12:15,720 Speaker 3: like Johnny Storm aka the Human Torch from The Fantastic Four, 192 00:12:15,840 --> 00:12:19,600 Speaker 3: Flame On and all of that, as well as Stephen 193 00:12:19,679 --> 00:12:23,959 Speaker 3: King's son Joe Hill, who mimics the horrifying supernatural fate 194 00:12:24,000 --> 00:12:26,040 Speaker 3: of SHC in his novel The Fireman. 195 00:12:27,120 --> 00:12:30,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, The Fireman's a great book. In this book, without 196 00:12:30,640 --> 00:12:35,319 Speaker 2: spoiling too much, there's a horrific plague. It's a virus 197 00:12:35,360 --> 00:12:39,319 Speaker 2: called dragon scale, and if you get too stressed out 198 00:12:39,760 --> 00:12:43,600 Speaker 2: and you have this virus, you erupt in flames and 199 00:12:43,640 --> 00:12:45,880 Speaker 2: you die. We don't want to give you too much 200 00:12:45,880 --> 00:12:48,400 Speaker 2: more of the plot. It's definitely worth the read. It's 201 00:12:48,440 --> 00:12:50,800 Speaker 2: a page turner for sure. Also, I want to shout 202 00:12:50,840 --> 00:12:54,600 Speaker 2: out Joe Hill's most recent novel, an absolute epic called 203 00:12:55,080 --> 00:12:58,160 Speaker 2: King Sorrow. I was able to get it before it 204 00:12:58,240 --> 00:13:02,640 Speaker 2: officially released and just devoured the thing. It's like it's 205 00:13:02,960 --> 00:13:04,640 Speaker 2: nine hundred something pages long. 206 00:13:04,720 --> 00:13:05,760 Speaker 3: Oh wow. Yeah. 207 00:13:05,760 --> 00:13:11,520 Speaker 2: But I think people who enjoy create creative horror stories 208 00:13:11,520 --> 00:13:14,319 Speaker 2: like this, I think you'll you'll really dig it. It's 209 00:13:14,320 --> 00:13:15,360 Speaker 2: a page turner. 210 00:13:15,040 --> 00:13:15,920 Speaker 3: As well, is it? 211 00:13:15,920 --> 00:13:16,000 Speaker 1: It? 212 00:13:16,280 --> 00:13:18,880 Speaker 3: Like for some reason, I'm picturing King Sorrow as being 213 00:13:19,000 --> 00:13:21,480 Speaker 3: some sort of big, bad, supernatural figure. 214 00:13:21,800 --> 00:13:26,720 Speaker 2: Oh dude, yeah, it's similar to it. Stephen King's novel 215 00:13:28,120 --> 00:13:31,280 Speaker 2: The main bad guy and this is also not a spoiler, 216 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:34,360 Speaker 2: is an extra dimensional dragon. 217 00:13:34,920 --> 00:13:38,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, like like Pennywise was an extra dimensional spider. I'm 218 00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:40,840 Speaker 3: not trying to poop poopy Joe Hill cribbing from his 219 00:13:40,920 --> 00:13:42,920 Speaker 3: dad a little bit. If you're gonna steal, steal from 220 00:13:42,960 --> 00:13:44,480 Speaker 3: the best, and if that happens to be your dad, 221 00:13:44,559 --> 00:13:46,720 Speaker 3: so be it. I think Joe Hill's very is good, 222 00:13:46,760 --> 00:13:48,520 Speaker 3: and he's getting good in his own right for sure, 223 00:13:48,559 --> 00:13:50,600 Speaker 3: as I think you would agree. Oh yeah, and if 224 00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:53,839 Speaker 3: you like graphic novels, get into Lock and Key. Well 225 00:13:53,840 --> 00:13:55,599 Speaker 3: that's the one that's what got me into him. I 226 00:13:55,600 --> 00:13:58,960 Speaker 3: think that came out maybe before he was as known 227 00:13:59,040 --> 00:13:59,800 Speaker 3: as a novelist. 228 00:14:00,679 --> 00:14:04,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and then he was publishing short stories in novellas. 229 00:14:04,600 --> 00:14:07,839 Speaker 2: But yeah, I remember back in one of our older offices, 230 00:14:08,360 --> 00:14:12,559 Speaker 2: you and I were actually trading editions of Lock and 231 00:14:12,640 --> 00:14:13,480 Speaker 2: Key back and forth. 232 00:14:13,480 --> 00:14:15,120 Speaker 3: It's just gosh, I think I may still have some 233 00:14:15,160 --> 00:14:16,920 Speaker 3: of yours. Ben I need to do a cleaning of 234 00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:19,680 Speaker 3: my graphic novel piles and I'll report back. 235 00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:23,960 Speaker 2: Okay, we'll stay tuned. Now, we know that everything we 236 00:14:24,040 --> 00:14:27,360 Speaker 2: mentioned so far these are works of fiction, and Charles 237 00:14:27,400 --> 00:14:32,880 Speaker 2: Dickens is popping back at people and claiming that the 238 00:14:32,920 --> 00:14:36,160 Speaker 2: fiction is informed by the facts. But when we get 239 00:14:36,200 --> 00:14:41,160 Speaker 2: to the facts of what we call SHC, or spontaneous 240 00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:48,360 Speaker 2: human combustion, we see over two hundred alleged cases in 241 00:14:48,400 --> 00:14:51,200 Speaker 2: the past three centuries. So it would be a very 242 00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:55,400 Speaker 2: rare thing to occur, but it seems like a lot 243 00:14:55,440 --> 00:14:58,880 Speaker 2: of people have been convinced it is indeed a real 244 00:14:58,960 --> 00:14:59,840 Speaker 2: thing that could happen. 245 00:15:00,280 --> 00:15:02,360 Speaker 3: Right, So, over the past three hundred years there have 246 00:15:02,440 --> 00:15:06,880 Speaker 3: been more than two hundred reported cases of alleged SHC. 247 00:15:07,320 --> 00:15:09,440 Speaker 3: If you want to look back even further, back to 248 00:15:09,520 --> 00:15:13,120 Speaker 3: medieval times, you know, the historical period, not the theme restaurant. 249 00:15:13,120 --> 00:15:17,080 Speaker 3: We find that allegedly the first account of SHC was 250 00:15:17,120 --> 00:15:23,080 Speaker 3: reported by Polonas Vorstius, and from that point on, each 251 00:15:23,160 --> 00:15:26,440 Speaker 3: case of SHC has shared some of the following characteristics, 252 00:15:26,480 --> 00:15:29,320 Speaker 3: some of which we've already described. Originally described in the 253 00:15:29,360 --> 00:15:33,760 Speaker 3: medical book Medical Jurisprudence from eighteen twenty three. That was 254 00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:38,400 Speaker 3: revisited when cited by la Perry in nineteen thirty eight 255 00:15:38,440 --> 00:15:41,920 Speaker 3: in a British Medical Journal article This is how that goes. 256 00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:45,520 Speaker 3: Victims were chronic alcoholics, which tracks for our character in 257 00:15:45,600 --> 00:15:50,320 Speaker 3: Dickens's novel, usually elderly females. Body had burned spontaneously, hands 258 00:15:50,320 --> 00:15:53,400 Speaker 3: and feet usually fell off. Fire caused little damage to 259 00:15:53,400 --> 00:15:56,800 Speaker 3: surrounding areas. The combustion of the body left a residue 260 00:15:56,960 --> 00:16:01,280 Speaker 3: of greasy and fetid ash, as well as a horrid odor. 261 00:16:01,760 --> 00:16:06,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, and doubtlessly Charles Dickens read this in an informed 262 00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:08,840 Speaker 2: bleak house, or it's one of the things that informed it. 263 00:16:09,520 --> 00:16:13,880 Speaker 2: We also know that, just as a as a note 264 00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:18,400 Speaker 2: in the interest of objectivity, we know that forensic science 265 00:16:18,440 --> 00:16:22,440 Speaker 2: and medicine was nowhere near where it is today. So 266 00:16:22,840 --> 00:16:27,880 Speaker 2: it's quite possible that there were cases that appeared to 267 00:16:27,920 --> 00:16:31,600 Speaker 2: be shc that just got confused because we didn't have 268 00:16:31,640 --> 00:16:35,320 Speaker 2: the technology or know how to really investigate them. But 269 00:16:35,720 --> 00:16:39,200 Speaker 2: it looks like a lot of very smart people were saying, hey, 270 00:16:39,640 --> 00:16:44,640 Speaker 2: something is happening. Let's go to some of the popular cases, 271 00:16:44,720 --> 00:16:47,120 Speaker 2: the ones that will stand out to anybody familiar with 272 00:16:47,160 --> 00:16:49,360 Speaker 2: this and We're also going to give a special shout 273 00:16:49,400 --> 00:16:53,720 Speaker 2: out to a hometown case for our research associate Dylan 274 00:16:54,160 --> 00:16:54,560 Speaker 2: for sure. 275 00:16:54,560 --> 00:16:59,720 Speaker 3: Starting off with the aforementioned Polonus Vorstius, we'll call this 276 00:17:00,040 --> 00:17:03,720 Speaker 3: patient zero right from fourteen seventy. His case is popularly 277 00:17:03,760 --> 00:17:08,240 Speaker 3: known for its sixteen forty one mentioned in Danish physician 278 00:17:08,480 --> 00:17:20,200 Speaker 3: Thomas Bartholin's book Historarium Historiarium Anato mcarum Rariorum Again I'm 279 00:17:20,240 --> 00:17:24,480 Speaker 3: potter coated right now, a collection of strange medical phenomenon 280 00:17:24,680 --> 00:17:28,000 Speaker 3: and Vorstias was an Italian knight who lived in Milan, 281 00:17:28,440 --> 00:17:30,080 Speaker 3: Italy in fourteen seventy. 282 00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:34,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, and despite not fitting the profile of being an 283 00:17:34,920 --> 00:17:40,800 Speaker 2: elderly female, he did drink a lot of wine. Reportedly, Okay, 284 00:17:40,800 --> 00:17:45,119 Speaker 2: he has a wild night cracking the veno and as 285 00:17:45,160 --> 00:17:48,399 Speaker 2: he is still consuming wine like this is a party 286 00:17:48,440 --> 00:17:53,639 Speaker 2: till Dodd's situation. Apparently, he gets a strong, fiery paid 287 00:17:53,840 --> 00:17:56,720 Speaker 2: in his chest that he starts coffee just really like 288 00:17:56,840 --> 00:18:02,119 Speaker 2: hacking it up. As his coffee escalates, he starts vomiting flames. 289 00:18:02,440 --> 00:18:05,000 Speaker 2: His whole body burst into fire. 290 00:18:05,200 --> 00:18:07,720 Speaker 3: Wow, I was about to say sick. Now, It's that's scary, 291 00:18:07,880 --> 00:18:13,600 Speaker 3: but it's pretty cool it's pretty metal breathing fire. Yeah, man, 292 00:18:13,640 --> 00:18:16,160 Speaker 3: I think we maybe are saying the quiet part out loud. 293 00:18:16,200 --> 00:18:19,080 Speaker 3: Here is the implication that these people are just like 294 00:18:19,160 --> 00:18:22,359 Speaker 3: so booze soaked, that like a single spark might just 295 00:18:22,440 --> 00:18:24,400 Speaker 3: set their entire bodies ablaze. 296 00:18:24,800 --> 00:18:27,400 Speaker 2: It seems to be, you know, based on the information 297 00:18:27,480 --> 00:18:30,919 Speaker 2: we have now, it seems to that there is at 298 00:18:31,040 --> 00:18:37,920 Speaker 2: least some kind of alleged relation flammability. Yeah, alcohol consumption 299 00:18:38,040 --> 00:18:40,159 Speaker 2: and flammability. I mean, we see it again if we 300 00:18:40,200 --> 00:18:44,040 Speaker 2: go a little bit forward in time to Nicole Millet 301 00:18:44,040 --> 00:18:49,119 Speaker 2: from seventeen twenty five. This was reported by a French author, 302 00:18:49,520 --> 00:18:53,440 Speaker 2: Jonas DuPont in his book from seventeen sixty three, did 303 00:18:53,520 --> 00:18:59,440 Speaker 2: Incindius boris umani Spontaneous? A collection of cases and studies 304 00:18:59,480 --> 00:19:02,040 Speaker 2: about the whole book is about spontaneous human combustion. 305 00:19:02,359 --> 00:19:05,600 Speaker 3: Yes, I expect to patrona. I'm sorry, I'm still so 306 00:19:06,040 --> 00:19:09,240 Speaker 3: potter brained. Her case is told through the eyes of 307 00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:14,240 Speaker 3: her husband, who's a Parisian innkeeper who was startled from 308 00:19:14,240 --> 00:19:17,800 Speaker 3: his slumber by the smell of smoke, at which time 309 00:19:17,840 --> 00:19:20,200 Speaker 3: he rushed to the source, only to find his wife 310 00:19:20,240 --> 00:19:22,840 Speaker 3: a blaze. Well not even a blaze. I think she'd already. 311 00:19:23,320 --> 00:19:26,479 Speaker 3: You know, it's like what happens in Skyrim when you 312 00:19:26,480 --> 00:19:28,439 Speaker 3: get blasted by a wizard and you just end up 313 00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:29,920 Speaker 3: like a little pile of ash. 314 00:19:29,960 --> 00:19:32,399 Speaker 2: And again we see another factor that's common to a 315 00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:36,920 Speaker 2: lot of these ledged cases. She's on a straw palette, 316 00:19:37,160 --> 00:19:41,640 Speaker 2: straw floor bed. But it has not caught on fire. 317 00:19:41,680 --> 00:19:44,840 Speaker 2: It's not even singed. It's unscathed the fact, despite the 318 00:19:44,880 --> 00:19:49,000 Speaker 2: fact that straw is incredibly flammable when it's dry. All 319 00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:52,199 Speaker 2: that was left of her body was her skull, along 320 00:19:52,280 --> 00:19:55,880 Speaker 2: with a scattering of bones from her back and lower legs. 321 00:19:56,640 --> 00:20:02,320 Speaker 2: And again, according to DuPont, the this victim was also 322 00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:06,959 Speaker 2: a heavy drinker. At first, the authorities go to her 323 00:20:07,080 --> 00:20:11,880 Speaker 2: husband and say, okay, man, you murdered your wife. 324 00:20:11,880 --> 00:20:16,719 Speaker 3: Clearly. He was initially put on trial and found guilty 325 00:20:16,760 --> 00:20:20,679 Speaker 3: of murder, but later was acquitted when he appealed using 326 00:20:20,760 --> 00:20:24,520 Speaker 3: the SAHC argument, and was backed up by the testimony 327 00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:29,360 Speaker 3: of one doctor Claude Nicholas Lecat This is amazing name, 328 00:20:29,400 --> 00:20:32,639 Speaker 3: who was a surgeon who had been staying at the 329 00:20:32,800 --> 00:20:36,480 Speaker 3: end that very night and was able to corroborate some 330 00:20:36,520 --> 00:20:40,280 Speaker 3: of the more unusual features of the case. 331 00:20:40,880 --> 00:20:43,879 Speaker 2: Yeah, and also able to speak from his own area 332 00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:46,760 Speaker 2: of expertise. You know, I am a man of medicine. 333 00:20:46,880 --> 00:20:51,840 Speaker 2: This can happen. So we know that there are hundreds 334 00:20:51,840 --> 00:20:55,119 Speaker 2: and hundreds of alleged cases of this, so we can't 335 00:20:55,119 --> 00:20:56,760 Speaker 2: do all of them, but we're going to give you 336 00:20:56,840 --> 00:21:02,399 Speaker 2: one more that is crucial to hour Pal Research Associate Dylan. 337 00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:07,160 Speaker 2: It is the case of doctor Irving Bentley that occurred 338 00:21:07,280 --> 00:21:12,880 Speaker 2: in counter Sport, Pennsylvania in nineteen sixty six, So we're 339 00:21:12,920 --> 00:21:14,520 Speaker 2: moving way forward to time. 340 00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:23,920 Speaker 3: That's right. Doctor Bentley was a family doctor, a family 341 00:21:24,320 --> 00:21:29,960 Speaker 3: gugp serving the counter Sport area that's cou d Ersprt 342 00:21:30,200 --> 00:21:34,280 Speaker 3: from nineteen twenty five to nineteen fifty three. After he retired, 343 00:21:34,359 --> 00:21:36,560 Speaker 3: he just kind of lived to chill, a little small town, 344 00:21:36,680 --> 00:21:41,280 Speaker 3: quaint existence in his two story ranch Rambler. That's not true, 345 00:21:41,280 --> 00:21:43,160 Speaker 3: that's sank Hill's house, but it was a two story 346 00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:47,159 Speaker 3: home in North Main Street area of town. He had 347 00:21:47,240 --> 00:21:50,520 Speaker 3: kind of a verbal agreement with the North penn Gas 348 00:21:50,520 --> 00:21:54,960 Speaker 3: Company that allowed them to enter his property and check 349 00:21:55,400 --> 00:21:58,920 Speaker 3: on his gas meter, which was located in the basement. 350 00:21:58,800 --> 00:22:01,159 Speaker 2: Because it was inside, so they can just walk up 351 00:22:01,160 --> 00:22:05,040 Speaker 2: to the sands, and so this is where we see 352 00:22:05,119 --> 00:22:09,000 Speaker 2: employee of the North Pen Gas Company, guy named Don Gosnell. 353 00:22:09,240 --> 00:22:14,720 Speaker 2: It's December fifth, nineteen sixty six, and Don Gosnell, who's 354 00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:17,840 Speaker 2: done this many times before. He lets himself into the 355 00:22:17,840 --> 00:22:20,720 Speaker 2: Good Doctor's home and it's nine am, and he's just 356 00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:23,880 Speaker 2: gonna go straight down to the basement and check the meter. 357 00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:28,480 Speaker 2: But as he gets closer to the basement, he is 358 00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:32,680 Speaker 2: overwhelmed by a stench. He describes it as a sickly 359 00:22:32,800 --> 00:22:37,920 Speaker 2: sweetish smell. So he follows his nose and he sees 360 00:22:37,960 --> 00:22:42,280 Speaker 2: his Skyrim style pile of ashes, and above the pile 361 00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:45,680 Speaker 2: there's a large hole in the sea weed and it's 362 00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:49,480 Speaker 2: literally still smoking. They are glowing numbers rimming it. 363 00:22:49,840 --> 00:22:52,639 Speaker 3: I'm not trying to make light of this dude's untimely demise, 364 00:22:52,680 --> 00:22:54,320 Speaker 3: but it is a little funny to picture just the 365 00:22:54,359 --> 00:22:58,639 Speaker 3: smoking pile of ash and like dude's charred walker and 366 00:22:58,800 --> 00:23:03,960 Speaker 3: like a leg joint and a foot still slippered right 367 00:23:04,200 --> 00:23:08,680 Speaker 3: exactly and he had apparently I guess, burned through the 368 00:23:09,800 --> 00:23:11,760 Speaker 3: floor of the master bathroom. 369 00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:15,480 Speaker 2: And so he calls out for doctor Bentley and he's 370 00:23:15,520 --> 00:23:18,320 Speaker 2: trying to say, hey, is everything okay, he got a 371 00:23:18,359 --> 00:23:23,639 Speaker 2: weird basement situation, and that's when he discovers Bentley in 372 00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:27,920 Speaker 2: his master bathroom over the basement with just a few 373 00:23:27,960 --> 00:23:31,119 Speaker 2: remains as we described there. I believe there was also 374 00:23:31,160 --> 00:23:35,440 Speaker 2: a bit of burned bathrobe. Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah. Everybody 375 00:23:35,680 --> 00:23:38,439 Speaker 2: involved with this case, because of course don gets to 376 00:23:38,440 --> 00:23:42,560 Speaker 2: the authorities too sweet. Everybody involved with this case is thinking, 377 00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:47,359 Speaker 2: how can a fire get hot enough to burn Doctor 378 00:23:47,400 --> 00:23:52,879 Speaker 2: Bentley but not scathe his walker. We do know that 379 00:23:53,000 --> 00:23:56,120 Speaker 2: he was, like so many people back then, a fan 380 00:23:56,240 --> 00:23:58,600 Speaker 2: of tobacco, a bit of a tobacconist. He was a 381 00:23:58,640 --> 00:24:03,679 Speaker 2: frequent smoker. We don't know too too much about his 382 00:24:03,880 --> 00:24:07,800 Speaker 2: alcohol consumption. We know the county deputy coroner got there. 383 00:24:07,880 --> 00:24:11,760 Speaker 2: We know the local fire department was on the scene. 384 00:24:11,760 --> 00:24:19,320 Speaker 2: The mortician was summoned, and eventually the deputy coroner had 385 00:24:19,359 --> 00:24:22,920 Speaker 2: to make some official statement, that is Deputy Corner John Deck, 386 00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:25,040 Speaker 2: and we've got a direct quote from him. 387 00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:30,080 Speaker 3: We do indeed looks like Doc Bentley was smoking his pipe. 388 00:24:30,440 --> 00:24:33,560 Speaker 3: The pipe toppled over and spilled over the tobacco, and 389 00:24:33,600 --> 00:24:36,320 Speaker 3: in the meantime he fell asleep. When he woke up, 390 00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:39,360 Speaker 3: he was on fire. Because some of the flannel night 391 00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:41,040 Speaker 3: shirt pieces show on the floor as he went to 392 00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:44,440 Speaker 3: the bathroom. I don't know about that. That sounds that's 393 00:24:44,440 --> 00:24:48,440 Speaker 3: a little jumping. I mean, it's not particularly thorough sounding. 394 00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:53,520 Speaker 2: It just seems, Yeah, accidental death is the ultimate verdict 395 00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:57,119 Speaker 2: or the ultimate conclusion of the authorities. But it's also 396 00:24:57,160 --> 00:25:00,960 Speaker 2: a very vague conclusion, and it doesn't really explain that 397 00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:04,280 Speaker 2: the pattern of burning. 398 00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:07,600 Speaker 3: I just think a moulder would say tisk disc to this. 399 00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:11,479 Speaker 2: Okay, right, ever heard of the knife ghost. That's one 400 00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:12,560 Speaker 2: of my favorite molder likes. 401 00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:15,360 Speaker 3: Oh man, No, that's good, Ben. We're about to talk 402 00:25:15,359 --> 00:25:17,919 Speaker 3: about something called the Wick effect. But I was just thinking, 403 00:25:17,960 --> 00:25:22,119 Speaker 3: surely there must speaking of our deerstalker hats and literature 404 00:25:22,920 --> 00:25:26,640 Speaker 3: be a mention as a plot point in Sherlock Holmes 405 00:25:26,720 --> 00:25:30,680 Speaker 3: of Spontaneous human combustion, And there absolutely is. In a 406 00:25:31,840 --> 00:25:36,199 Speaker 3: story called the Singular Problem of the Extinguished Wicks, a 407 00:25:36,280 --> 00:25:38,720 Speaker 3: spinster has found dead in her apartment, strangely burned, with 408 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:41,199 Speaker 3: nothing else affected. But what seems a simple case has 409 00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:43,400 Speaker 3: made more complex when her younger sister has later found 410 00:25:43,400 --> 00:25:45,919 Speaker 3: dead in the apartment, also burned. So two cases of 411 00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:47,880 Speaker 3: shc or something. 412 00:25:47,480 --> 00:25:53,080 Speaker 2: Else Yeah, and we again like, this is clearly an 413 00:25:53,119 --> 00:25:57,560 Speaker 2: obsession and a lot of fiction, especially in years past, 414 00:25:58,280 --> 00:26:01,000 Speaker 2: But we have to ask what science to say about it. 415 00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:04,879 Speaker 2: If you go to the scientific community at large and 416 00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:07,720 Speaker 2: you ask them, hey, how do we explain something as 417 00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:12,200 Speaker 2: out there and as frankly scary as spontaneous human combustion, 418 00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:15,560 Speaker 2: You're most likely going to hear about something called the 419 00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:19,000 Speaker 2: Wick effect. The best way to think about it through 420 00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:23,600 Speaker 2: grulish analogy is that your body is like a candle, 421 00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:28,280 Speaker 2: and your body has fat in it. The fat acts 422 00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:32,520 Speaker 2: as a flammable substance, and the oils from your body 423 00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:35,720 Speaker 2: can be absorbed into your clothing, and it can be 424 00:26:35,720 --> 00:26:39,560 Speaker 2: found in your hair, and maybe, if the conditions are right, 425 00:26:40,080 --> 00:26:45,040 Speaker 2: a source as small as the lit cherry of a 426 00:26:45,080 --> 00:26:50,600 Speaker 2: cigarette could set the candle on fire. And then they say, well, 427 00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:53,520 Speaker 2: think about it this way, if we continue our grulish 428 00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:58,159 Speaker 2: candle comparison, maybe this theory explains why fire of this 429 00:26:58,280 --> 00:27:01,760 Speaker 2: sort can seem so contained, restricted just to the individual's 430 00:27:01,840 --> 00:27:05,280 Speaker 2: body and the stuff they're wearing, without really damaging the 431 00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:05,960 Speaker 2: rest of the room. 432 00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:08,359 Speaker 3: Yeah. A guy named Brian J. Ford, who is a 433 00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:13,119 Speaker 3: biologist and author, had this to say, in support of 434 00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:15,600 Speaker 3: the argument, when a person is ill, they sometimes naturally 435 00:27:15,680 --> 00:27:18,679 Speaker 3: produce traces of acetone in the body, and acetone is 436 00:27:18,720 --> 00:27:22,160 Speaker 3: highly flammable. I experimented with scale model humans using pig 437 00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:26,080 Speaker 3: flesh that had been marinated in acetone. They burn like 438 00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:31,480 Speaker 3: incendiary bombs. Alcoholism can cause people to produce acetone, so 439 00:27:31,560 --> 00:27:34,600 Speaker 3: can many diseases. My conclusion is that an unwell individual 440 00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:38,359 Speaker 3: produces high levels of acetone which accumulate in the fatty 441 00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:41,359 Speaker 3: tissues and can be ignited, perhaps by a static spark 442 00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:42,480 Speaker 3: or a cigarette. 443 00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:46,400 Speaker 2: I mean, it sounds good. I think we can all agree. However, 444 00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:50,800 Speaker 2: there are some additional follow up questions, right like when 445 00:27:50,840 --> 00:27:56,000 Speaker 2: somebody is smoking a cigarette, how does that hit the 446 00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:59,920 Speaker 2: flammable stuff? Like, how does that trigger the issue? Because 447 00:28:00,119 --> 00:28:04,640 Speaker 2: usually the city I'm assuming theme from within, Yeah, it'll 448 00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:07,560 Speaker 2: be outside of the body. So are these people just 449 00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:12,359 Speaker 2: super hardcore gangsters and just putting the cigarette out on 450 00:28:12,400 --> 00:28:15,159 Speaker 2: their tongue. 451 00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:18,280 Speaker 3: Like a like they swallow it, but the saliva, you know, 452 00:28:18,280 --> 00:28:20,159 Speaker 3: it seems like would put it out before it, you know, 453 00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:22,600 Speaker 3: got any more meaningful? M hmm. Yeah. 454 00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:27,520 Speaker 2: And this these are natural, valid questions, asking good faith, 455 00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:30,159 Speaker 2: and with these in mind, it shouldn't surprise any of 456 00:28:30,240 --> 00:28:33,479 Speaker 2: us that there are other schools of thought. There are 457 00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:37,440 Speaker 2: scientists who oppose the Wick effect theory, and uh, they 458 00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:41,959 Speaker 2: point out something that is pretty obvious to medical authorities. 459 00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:45,520 Speaker 2: The human body has to get to a very high 460 00:28:45,560 --> 00:28:48,960 Speaker 2: temperature to be reduced to just ash. 461 00:28:49,240 --> 00:28:53,360 Speaker 3: That's the kicker, right, We're talking three thousand degrees fahrenheights. 462 00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:57,880 Speaker 3: To put that into perspective, you know, the process of 463 00:28:57,960 --> 00:29:02,240 Speaker 3: cremating a human body happen when the temperatures reach between 464 00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:07,000 Speaker 3: fourteen hundred and eighteen hundred degrees. That is like vaporizing. 465 00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:09,520 Speaker 3: You know, the kinds of temperatures that will you know, 466 00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:13,840 Speaker 3: reduce bone to ash. So this notion of the Wick 467 00:29:13,920 --> 00:29:17,760 Speaker 3: effect doesn't really take that into account. And also the 468 00:29:17,800 --> 00:29:22,360 Speaker 3: whole secondary kicker of how does that fire stay contained within? 469 00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:29,320 Speaker 2: Right? Yeah, because there are many unfortunate and tragic cases 470 00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:34,440 Speaker 2: of total loss structural damage to homes and buildings that 471 00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:38,920 Speaker 2: start from fires that are pretty small but still spread 472 00:29:39,040 --> 00:29:43,320 Speaker 2: to consume the entire domicile. So at this point we 473 00:29:43,360 --> 00:29:46,040 Speaker 2: don't have the answer. We want to know what you think. 474 00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:48,880 Speaker 2: Hop on over to our show page on Facebook Ridiculous 475 00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:53,480 Speaker 2: Historians and tell us your take on spontaneous human combustion. 476 00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:58,440 Speaker 2: Is this phenomenon alleged though it may be, Is it 477 00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:04,520 Speaker 2: something that really happenpons or is it possible that somehow 478 00:30:04,680 --> 00:30:09,640 Speaker 2: civilization got too excited about the concept and got everything 479 00:30:09,720 --> 00:30:13,120 Speaker 2: wrong in all of these cases? That seems kind of unlikely. 480 00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:16,600 Speaker 3: It does, It does seem pretty unlikely, and the fact 481 00:30:16,640 --> 00:30:19,200 Speaker 3: that medical science still doesn't quite have a consensus on 482 00:30:19,280 --> 00:30:22,040 Speaker 3: this so many years later, I don't know, it does 483 00:30:22,040 --> 00:30:24,600 Speaker 3: seem relatively improbable. 484 00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:30,320 Speaker 2: It also seems endlessly fascinating. Folks. Thank you so much 485 00:30:30,360 --> 00:30:33,000 Speaker 2: for joining us. We can't wait to hear your thoughts 486 00:30:33,040 --> 00:30:37,520 Speaker 2: over on Ridiculous Histories. Thanks for super producer mister Max Williams, 487 00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:40,800 Speaker 2: our research associate Dylan and who else. 488 00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:42,640 Speaker 3: Are oh man, Well, plenty of people, But I just 489 00:30:42,680 --> 00:30:45,200 Speaker 3: wanted to say, you're feeling spontaneous, why don't you head 490 00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:47,520 Speaker 3: on over to Apple Podcasts or your podcast platform of 491 00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:51,000 Speaker 3: choice and write something nice. It makes us feel good 492 00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:55,480 Speaker 3: and helps people discover the show. Huge thanks to Alex Williams, 493 00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:59,960 Speaker 3: who composed our theme. Max Williams, superproducer extraordinaire Jonathan Strickle, 494 00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:03,360 Speaker 3: the quiztor. You know what you did? A. J. Mohamas 495 00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:04,760 Speaker 3: Jacobs the Puzzler, and. 496 00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:07,760 Speaker 2: Of course I'm not thinking the quiztor, but I am thinking. 497 00:31:08,160 --> 00:31:11,600 Speaker 2: We're both thinking doctor Rachel Big Spinach Lance, as well 498 00:31:11,640 --> 00:31:14,480 Speaker 2: as our pals, the rude dudes over a ridiculous crime. 499 00:31:14,520 --> 00:31:17,720 Speaker 2: If you dig us, you'll dig them like a grieve. 500 00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:21,400 Speaker 2: I'm kidding. It's ninety nine percent murder free tack line 501 00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:24,920 Speaker 2: that we're very happy with, very indeed. 502 00:31:25,480 --> 00:31:28,800 Speaker 3: Oh jeez, Happy holidays, I guess right, No is it Thanksgiving? 503 00:31:28,880 --> 00:31:29,360 Speaker 3: Ish times? 504 00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:30,320 Speaker 2: Like holiday season? 505 00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:32,800 Speaker 3: Holiday season? You'll have a fun time with your fam 506 00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:35,600 Speaker 3: or you know, with your friends. Friends. Givings are great. 507 00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:45,560 Speaker 3: We'll see you next time, folks. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, 508 00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:48,880 Speaker 3: visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen 509 00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:49,959 Speaker 3: to your favorite shows.