1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:03,600 Speaker 1: An illegal alien from Guatemala charged with raping a child 2 00:00:03,680 --> 00:00:07,480 Speaker 1: in Massachusetts. An MS thirteen gang member from Al Salvador 3 00:00:07,720 --> 00:00:11,840 Speaker 1: accused of murdering a Texas man of Venezuelan charged with 4 00:00:11,920 --> 00:00:15,840 Speaker 1: filming and selling child pornography in Michigan. These are just 5 00:00:15,920 --> 00:00:19,680 Speaker 1: some of the heinous migrant criminals caught because of President 6 00:00:19,720 --> 00:00:23,320 Speaker 1: Donald J. Trump's leadership. I'm Christy nom the United States 7 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:28,120 Speaker 1: Secretary of Homeland Security. Under President Trump, attempted illegal border 8 00:00:28,160 --> 00:00:31,680 Speaker 1: crossings are at the lowest levels ever recorded, and over 9 00:00:31,760 --> 00:00:34,960 Speaker 1: one hundred thousand illegal aliens have been arrested. If you 10 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:38,920 Speaker 1: are here illegally, your next you will be fined nearly 11 00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:43,000 Speaker 1: one thousand dollars a day, imprisoned, and deported. You will 12 00:00:43,040 --> 00:00:46,680 Speaker 1: never return. But if you register using our CBP home 13 00:00:46,720 --> 00:00:50,120 Speaker 1: app and leave now, you could be allowed to return legally. 14 00:00:50,479 --> 00:00:55,240 Speaker 1: Do what's right. Leave now. Under President Trump, America's laws, 15 00:00:55,400 --> 00:00:57,840 Speaker 1: border and families will be protected. 16 00:00:57,920 --> 00:01:00,800 Speaker 2: Sponsored by the United States Department of Homeland Security, started 17 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:04,640 Speaker 2: working as a consultant for real estate developers, raising them 18 00:01:04,680 --> 00:01:07,800 Speaker 2: capital one transaction where I'd raise all the debt and 19 00:01:07,959 --> 00:01:10,520 Speaker 2: equity capital. I'm looking at the closing statement and there 20 00:01:10,520 --> 00:01:11,959 Speaker 2: it was just me, and I was a little fee 21 00:01:11,959 --> 00:01:13,240 Speaker 2: and I said, wait a minute. If I'm bringing all 22 00:01:13,280 --> 00:01:14,840 Speaker 2: the money, I'm a smart guy. I want to be 23 00:01:14,880 --> 00:01:16,800 Speaker 2: on that side of the table. That deal closed. And 24 00:01:16,840 --> 00:01:19,119 Speaker 2: I stuck with that developer for a couple of years 25 00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:22,320 Speaker 2: for free, just to learn, because I understood that I 26 00:01:22,360 --> 00:01:24,959 Speaker 2: could acquire a skill set that could make me a 27 00:01:25,000 --> 00:01:27,360 Speaker 2: tremendous amount of wealth. When I see people today who 28 00:01:27,360 --> 00:01:29,120 Speaker 2: approach you say, hey, man, I'm going to learn real 29 00:01:29,200 --> 00:01:31,840 Speaker 2: estate development. Give me a job. That's not the right way, right. 30 00:01:31,880 --> 00:01:34,600 Speaker 2: You want to acquire that skill set, and if you 31 00:01:34,600 --> 00:01:38,280 Speaker 2: can offer something, bring something to the table and indoctrinate 32 00:01:38,319 --> 00:01:40,360 Speaker 2: yourself into the real estate world. You want to do 33 00:01:40,360 --> 00:01:42,639 Speaker 2: that because with that knowledge you acquires yours forever. 34 00:01:44,680 --> 00:01:49,920 Speaker 3: My graduates from my school being forced bad drop b drop, 35 00:01:50,560 --> 00:01:52,960 Speaker 3: Mike drop bad drop drop. 36 00:02:03,440 --> 00:02:07,160 Speaker 4: All right, guys, welcome back, E y L. Today is 37 00:02:07,200 --> 00:02:10,920 Speaker 4: going to be a very special episode. We got Craig Livingstone. 38 00:02:10,960 --> 00:02:15,200 Speaker 4: So if you were at invest Fest Legendary Investment, legendary performance, 39 00:02:15,840 --> 00:02:18,839 Speaker 4: you saw him on stage with Don Peebles, yes and 40 00:02:19,120 --> 00:02:21,840 Speaker 4: moderated by a guy MG, the mortgage guy, And that 41 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:25,480 Speaker 4: was something that was a really dope highlight of investmentest 42 00:02:25,639 --> 00:02:29,440 Speaker 4: very educational and he works with Don. We'll talk about 43 00:02:29,480 --> 00:02:31,600 Speaker 4: that later on, but that's the reason why they were 44 00:02:31,600 --> 00:02:33,600 Speaker 4: on stage. They were talking about the Affirmation Tower, they 45 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:35,520 Speaker 4: were talk about real estate development, they were talking about 46 00:02:35,520 --> 00:02:39,760 Speaker 4: real estate investing a variety of different things. So this 47 00:02:39,800 --> 00:02:42,799 Speaker 4: is something that's extremely important because we talk about real 48 00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:47,680 Speaker 4: estate investing a lot, but it's always good to talk 49 00:02:47,680 --> 00:02:51,920 Speaker 4: about real estate development and on a larger scale because 50 00:02:51,960 --> 00:02:55,760 Speaker 4: it's important not only to be motivated, but also to 51 00:02:55,800 --> 00:02:57,480 Speaker 4: have the education to do with well. 52 00:02:57,520 --> 00:02:59,880 Speaker 5: I think we only we've had like a handful of 53 00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:01,800 Speaker 5: developers on Brandon Rul was one. 54 00:03:01,840 --> 00:03:02,760 Speaker 2: Obviously we had Don. 55 00:03:03,400 --> 00:03:05,760 Speaker 5: But we always say that thing right or despot to 56 00:03:05,840 --> 00:03:07,920 Speaker 5: be something, you have to see it. And so having 57 00:03:07,960 --> 00:03:10,720 Speaker 5: these conversations, especially at this level like this is like, 58 00:03:11,200 --> 00:03:12,840 Speaker 5: we don't go higher than this, you know what I mean. 59 00:03:12,880 --> 00:03:14,680 Speaker 5: So it's going to be I feel like it's going 60 00:03:14,720 --> 00:03:15,920 Speaker 5: to be a master class in a sense. 61 00:03:16,040 --> 00:03:16,280 Speaker 2: Yeah. 62 00:03:16,480 --> 00:03:21,200 Speaker 4: Managing partner for Exact Capital and has executed over one 63 00:03:21,200 --> 00:03:24,960 Speaker 4: point five billion of financing for numerous transactions ranging from 64 00:03:25,040 --> 00:03:31,680 Speaker 4: market rate to luxuries, building a condominium in Harlem, properties 65 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:34,920 Speaker 4: throughout the United States, working with don people who's on 66 00:03:34,960 --> 00:03:39,960 Speaker 4: the Affirmation Tower, I believe, right right, leave out the 67 00:03:40,000 --> 00:03:40,840 Speaker 4: Queen if. 68 00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:42,320 Speaker 2: You're not familiar with the Affirmation Tower. 69 00:03:42,840 --> 00:03:46,560 Speaker 4: That is a project that, once it's built, will be 70 00:03:46,760 --> 00:03:51,200 Speaker 4: the tallest building in New York City correct wes Western Hemisphere, 71 00:03:51,760 --> 00:03:56,800 Speaker 4: and the only skyscraper with a majority black team. That's right, right, 72 00:03:56,880 --> 00:04:02,720 Speaker 4: and that's intentional. So that's a historic landmark. And I 73 00:04:02,720 --> 00:04:04,800 Speaker 4: know you guys have had some issues. We'll talk about that, 74 00:04:05,360 --> 00:04:08,040 Speaker 4: but that's a historic landmark. Very important that we get 75 00:04:08,040 --> 00:04:10,400 Speaker 4: that pushed through. So this is going to be a 76 00:04:10,480 --> 00:04:12,400 Speaker 4: very high level conversation to say the least. But first 77 00:04:12,440 --> 00:04:14,120 Speaker 4: and foremost, thank you for joining us. Appreciate it, my 78 00:04:14,160 --> 00:04:16,120 Speaker 4: pleasure to be here again. Man, great to see you guys. 79 00:04:16,520 --> 00:04:18,320 Speaker 4: You guys have been really busy since we saw each 80 00:04:18,320 --> 00:04:21,640 Speaker 4: other in Atlanta. Yes, yes, I'm extremely proud of everything 81 00:04:21,640 --> 00:04:24,320 Speaker 4: you guys are doing. Likewise likewise, thank you. So we're 82 00:04:24,320 --> 00:04:26,320 Speaker 4: going to get into it, but first let's get some background. 83 00:04:26,560 --> 00:04:29,120 Speaker 4: How did you get your start in real estate, commercial 84 00:04:29,120 --> 00:04:31,360 Speaker 4: real estate and in real estate developed development. 85 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:34,720 Speaker 2: So let me give my background, just do a little 86 00:04:34,720 --> 00:04:38,240 Speaker 2: comprehensive review. So I am the managing partner at Exact 87 00:04:38,279 --> 00:04:41,799 Speaker 2: Capitol Group. We are a vertically integrated real estate concern. 88 00:04:42,360 --> 00:04:45,719 Speaker 2: We own, develop and build for our own account. So 89 00:04:46,720 --> 00:04:50,160 Speaker 2: I got into this because the last career that I 90 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:54,560 Speaker 2: had was actually an investment banking and to be a 91 00:04:54,600 --> 00:04:58,440 Speaker 2: good real estate developer you need to have great financial acumen, 92 00:04:59,279 --> 00:05:04,039 Speaker 2: a great communityation skills, and good presentation skills and project 93 00:05:04,040 --> 00:05:10,839 Speaker 2: management skills. So it was a natural progression out of 94 00:05:10,880 --> 00:05:15,520 Speaker 2: my last job at Goldman Sachs into becoming an entrepreneur. 95 00:05:15,760 --> 00:05:20,200 Speaker 2: When I was in business school, everyone that when all 96 00:05:20,240 --> 00:05:23,080 Speaker 2: the brothers who were my contemporaries read a book called 97 00:05:23,120 --> 00:05:27,359 Speaker 2: Why Should White Guys Have Autobiography Reginald Lewis, and that 98 00:05:27,600 --> 00:05:30,840 Speaker 2: was really a roadmap on how to be an entrepreneur 99 00:05:30,880 --> 00:05:33,480 Speaker 2: successfully at the highest level. And for those who don't know, 100 00:05:33,520 --> 00:05:36,200 Speaker 2: Regend Lewis topped the book. It's a really good book. 101 00:05:36,279 --> 00:05:38,960 Speaker 2: But you know, he was to leverage buyouts in the 102 00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:41,719 Speaker 2: eighties like in the Michael Milken era, and there was 103 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:45,119 Speaker 2: practically no other black people doing it. So it stood 104 00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:48,320 Speaker 2: out to me definitely made an imprint on me, and 105 00:05:48,720 --> 00:05:51,440 Speaker 2: like you said, seeing it right, I was able to 106 00:05:51,480 --> 00:05:54,719 Speaker 2: see somebody else doing it encouraged me to take on 107 00:05:54,800 --> 00:05:58,080 Speaker 2: business in entrepreneurship at the highest level. So when I 108 00:05:58,160 --> 00:06:03,039 Speaker 2: chose to leave investment banking, I wanted to get into 109 00:06:03,400 --> 00:06:07,880 Speaker 2: something that was transactional, deal motivated, and it just happened 110 00:06:07,880 --> 00:06:11,800 Speaker 2: to be real estate. And you know, when I was 111 00:06:12,080 --> 00:06:16,760 Speaker 2: still working, I bought a property and I used it. 112 00:06:16,800 --> 00:06:18,360 Speaker 2: I was telling them Matt when I spoke with him 113 00:06:18,839 --> 00:06:22,320 Speaker 2: through an FAHA loan, and so I put down my 114 00:06:22,520 --> 00:06:26,279 Speaker 2: five percent I remember, sixty five hundred dollars and we 115 00:06:26,760 --> 00:06:29,560 Speaker 2: so we owned that property. I bought it just like 116 00:06:29,680 --> 00:06:31,520 Speaker 2: I said, I used the FAH loan, spend sixty five 117 00:06:31,600 --> 00:06:35,720 Speaker 2: hundred dollars and it was a three family and every 118 00:06:35,800 --> 00:06:38,840 Speaker 2: month that I owned the property and made between eight 119 00:06:38,920 --> 00:06:42,960 Speaker 2: hundred and thousand dollars of income. And so after six 120 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:45,839 Speaker 2: seven months, I had my investment back. In eighteen months, 121 00:06:45,839 --> 00:06:49,240 Speaker 2: the realtor called me and said, there's an offer on 122 00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:52,960 Speaker 2: your property. And the offer was for one hundred thousand 123 00:06:53,000 --> 00:06:55,800 Speaker 2: dollars more than when I bought the property for. And 124 00:06:55,800 --> 00:06:57,479 Speaker 2: that was like when the first light bulb went off 125 00:06:57,520 --> 00:06:59,640 Speaker 2: and I got really into real estate because I said, 126 00:06:59,640 --> 00:07:01,080 Speaker 2: if I could do that, why the hell am I 127 00:07:01,120 --> 00:07:05,000 Speaker 2: coming here every day? So fast forward, I ended up 128 00:07:05,040 --> 00:07:10,560 Speaker 2: buying three more multi family properties and cycle them outsold them. 129 00:07:10,560 --> 00:07:16,000 Speaker 2: But when I left banking, I thought, well, how can 130 00:07:16,040 --> 00:07:20,920 Speaker 2: I do this business at scale? And started working as 131 00:07:20,960 --> 00:07:24,800 Speaker 2: a consultant for real estate developers, raising them capital. And 132 00:07:25,200 --> 00:07:28,400 Speaker 2: I was in one transaction where I'd raised all the 133 00:07:28,680 --> 00:07:33,000 Speaker 2: debt and equity capital and I'm looking at the closing 134 00:07:33,000 --> 00:07:34,720 Speaker 2: statement and there it was just me and I was 135 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:36,120 Speaker 2: a little fee and I said, wait a minute, if 136 00:07:36,120 --> 00:07:38,160 Speaker 2: I'm bringing all the money, I'm a smart guy. I 137 00:07:38,200 --> 00:07:39,920 Speaker 2: want to be on that side of the table. So 138 00:07:40,720 --> 00:07:43,200 Speaker 2: that deal closed and I stuck with that developer for 139 00:07:43,200 --> 00:07:45,800 Speaker 2: a couple of years for free, just to learn, because 140 00:07:45,840 --> 00:07:49,160 Speaker 2: I understood that I could acquire a skill set that 141 00:07:49,200 --> 00:07:51,880 Speaker 2: could make me a tremendous amount of wealth. Right, So 142 00:07:52,240 --> 00:07:54,240 Speaker 2: when I see people today who approach you say, hey, man, 143 00:07:54,440 --> 00:07:56,400 Speaker 2: I'm going to learn real estate development, give me a job. 144 00:07:56,520 --> 00:07:59,280 Speaker 2: That's not the right way, right. You want to acquire 145 00:07:59,320 --> 00:08:01,640 Speaker 2: that skill set, and if you can offer something, bring 146 00:08:01,680 --> 00:08:05,160 Speaker 2: something to the table, and indoctrinate yourself into the real 147 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:07,520 Speaker 2: estate world. You want to do that because with that knowledge, 148 00:08:07,520 --> 00:08:09,960 Speaker 2: you acquires yours forever, and you can monetize that for 149 00:08:10,000 --> 00:08:18,120 Speaker 2: your entire life. So after I closed that transaction, I 150 00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:19,520 Speaker 2: was talking about and I wanted to be on the 151 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:21,560 Speaker 2: other side of the table. About a year later, I 152 00:08:21,600 --> 00:08:23,920 Speaker 2: locked up my first deal and it was a church deal, 153 00:08:24,000 --> 00:08:28,560 Speaker 2: a condo development in Harlem where a church owned property. 154 00:08:28,600 --> 00:08:31,760 Speaker 2: And this is a common scenario in our communities. We 155 00:08:31,800 --> 00:08:34,480 Speaker 2: have churches that have been in the urban environment for 156 00:08:34,520 --> 00:08:39,560 Speaker 2: a long time and they've weathered some bad times and 157 00:08:39,600 --> 00:08:41,960 Speaker 2: now that all this gentrification is happening and the lands 158 00:08:41,960 --> 00:08:45,800 Speaker 2: that becoming valuable, they want to monetize that land, but 159 00:08:46,440 --> 00:08:50,160 Speaker 2: they also want to continue to exist there. So what 160 00:08:50,280 --> 00:08:52,040 Speaker 2: a lot of churches do is they'll do deals with 161 00:08:52,080 --> 00:08:54,920 Speaker 2: developers and well like the church will say, hey, you know, 162 00:08:54,960 --> 00:08:58,160 Speaker 2: we need a new church facility, we need some cash, 163 00:08:58,200 --> 00:08:59,760 Speaker 2: and you know, the developer, you do what you want 164 00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:02,160 Speaker 2: with the rights. And it was that type of deal. 165 00:09:02,559 --> 00:09:07,199 Speaker 2: And we brought that project to market in December of 166 00:09:07,240 --> 00:09:10,960 Speaker 2: two thousand and nine, right during the middle of the 167 00:09:11,000 --> 00:09:14,520 Speaker 2: financial downturn. So for about a week I thought that 168 00:09:14,760 --> 00:09:17,679 Speaker 2: the project was going to be a rental. It turns 169 00:09:17,679 --> 00:09:20,200 Speaker 2: out we hit the curve pretty well. We had a 170 00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:24,080 Speaker 2: fantastic sellout, about sixty million dollars in sixteen months. 171 00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:24,720 Speaker 6: And. 172 00:09:27,040 --> 00:09:30,280 Speaker 2: You know, we were very happy to repay our loan. 173 00:09:30,360 --> 00:09:33,680 Speaker 2: We made some money and that project went on to 174 00:09:33,800 --> 00:09:37,320 Speaker 2: be very successful. All the people who bought, you know, 175 00:09:37,480 --> 00:09:40,640 Speaker 2: units there by twenty fourteen, all their units had doubled 176 00:09:41,400 --> 00:09:43,560 Speaker 2: in value, so they were very happy with the investment. 177 00:09:43,600 --> 00:09:45,880 Speaker 2: That's that was my first project, which was a market 178 00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:51,439 Speaker 2: rate development project. And the other piece of intellectual capital 179 00:09:51,440 --> 00:09:55,280 Speaker 2: that I garnered through that was having weathered the financial 180 00:09:55,320 --> 00:09:58,560 Speaker 2: downturn and all that economic turbulence, I thought, well, how 181 00:09:58,559 --> 00:10:02,040 Speaker 2: could we do real estate development and inoculate ourselves from 182 00:10:02,080 --> 00:10:05,640 Speaker 2: the economic cycle, right? And the entry to that was 183 00:10:05,720 --> 00:10:11,600 Speaker 2: affordable housing, and which are public private partnerships where we 184 00:10:11,760 --> 00:10:17,920 Speaker 2: are building housing for tenants rental housing for tenants who 185 00:10:18,000 --> 00:10:21,959 Speaker 2: are you know, you take your average school teacher married 186 00:10:21,960 --> 00:10:24,920 Speaker 2: to ups driver who doesn't have four or five thousand 187 00:10:24,960 --> 00:10:26,920 Speaker 2: dollars a months to pay for rent out here, and 188 00:10:26,960 --> 00:10:29,040 Speaker 2: that's our market. That's what we like to build for. 189 00:10:29,640 --> 00:10:33,720 Speaker 2: And those types of projects require the involvement and participation 190 00:10:33,800 --> 00:10:38,960 Speaker 2: of governments will provide certain non conventional instruments like tax credits, 191 00:10:39,080 --> 00:10:42,720 Speaker 2: taxes and bonds, subsidies, etc. That made the capital stack 192 00:10:42,840 --> 00:10:46,200 Speaker 2: work so you can produce the housing. The dirty little 193 00:10:46,200 --> 00:10:50,080 Speaker 2: secret about affordable housing is the income you generate from 194 00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:55,080 Speaker 2: the rents don't pay enough income to subsidize building it. 195 00:10:55,080 --> 00:10:59,520 Speaker 2: It's because government subsidizes it that it works. 196 00:10:59,559 --> 00:11:01,800 Speaker 5: There's a there's a lot to unpack, but I want 197 00:11:01,800 --> 00:11:03,240 Speaker 5: to go back just to begin for it set because 198 00:11:03,240 --> 00:11:05,880 Speaker 5: you made a very wise decision that most Americans don't make, 199 00:11:06,120 --> 00:11:10,120 Speaker 5: and you bought multi family right away, because you know, 200 00:11:10,200 --> 00:11:12,640 Speaker 5: most times, you know, in our communities, it's like we 201 00:11:12,720 --> 00:11:15,280 Speaker 5: save enough money to buy the home that we can afford, 202 00:11:15,720 --> 00:11:17,640 Speaker 5: or the dream home that we think we can afford, 203 00:11:17,640 --> 00:11:20,000 Speaker 5: and re realize later that we can't. But you started 204 00:11:20,440 --> 00:11:24,120 Speaker 5: with multi family right away. Was that the strategy all along, 205 00:11:24,200 --> 00:11:26,199 Speaker 5: like you had been seeing people do that and as 206 00:11:26,280 --> 00:11:28,160 Speaker 5: that as a way of having passive income. 207 00:11:28,720 --> 00:11:32,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, that was definitely my objective in that we wanted 208 00:11:32,080 --> 00:11:35,280 Speaker 2: to you know, when you think about it, right the 209 00:11:35,280 --> 00:11:39,679 Speaker 2: fundamental equation is this, most people buy into that American 210 00:11:39,760 --> 00:11:42,199 Speaker 2: dream right where you know, if you take a person, 211 00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:44,400 Speaker 2: they go out and buy home, they save all their money, 212 00:11:44,559 --> 00:11:47,520 Speaker 2: they buy single family home, they move into it for 213 00:11:47,520 --> 00:11:50,520 Speaker 2: the next thirty years. Mostly the disposable income is going 214 00:11:50,559 --> 00:11:53,120 Speaker 2: to pay that mortgage that's it. But if they just 215 00:11:53,160 --> 00:11:55,959 Speaker 2: did something a little bit differently, buy a couple of 216 00:11:56,200 --> 00:11:59,560 Speaker 2: income generating assets first, right in the case I was 217 00:11:59,559 --> 00:12:02,480 Speaker 2: talking about out when I bought my first multi family 218 00:12:02,520 --> 00:12:04,199 Speaker 2: I mean that was making me between eight hundred and 219 00:12:04,320 --> 00:12:06,040 Speaker 2: thousand dollars a month, so they'll call it one thousand 220 00:12:06,080 --> 00:12:09,760 Speaker 2: dollars a month. If you're making sixty grand and you 221 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:12,320 Speaker 2: buy a multifamily house and you can make yourself an 222 00:12:12,320 --> 00:12:14,959 Speaker 2: extra thousand dollars a month, you've given yourself a twenty 223 00:12:14,960 --> 00:12:18,160 Speaker 2: percent raise, right, And you can do that repeatedly. And 224 00:12:18,200 --> 00:12:21,200 Speaker 2: the more assets you have that are generating income for you, 225 00:12:21,520 --> 00:12:23,320 Speaker 2: the easier it is to buy your next one and 226 00:12:23,360 --> 00:12:25,960 Speaker 2: your next one. Right, It's like getting off of that 227 00:12:26,000 --> 00:12:29,880 Speaker 2: point of inertia. But if you choose to buy a 228 00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:33,080 Speaker 2: single family home and move into it, I think you know, 229 00:12:33,120 --> 00:12:36,280 Speaker 2: it's not as lucrative and it's not the wealth generating 230 00:12:37,640 --> 00:12:39,760 Speaker 2: instrument that investment properties are. 231 00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:44,679 Speaker 4: So let's let's get into this realestate development conversation with 232 00:12:44,800 --> 00:12:47,719 Speaker 4: somebody that's looking to become a real estate developer right now? Right, 233 00:12:48,240 --> 00:12:51,280 Speaker 4: what advice would you would you give them in order 234 00:12:51,360 --> 00:12:54,480 Speaker 4: to because I understand that it's not necessarily easy to 235 00:12:54,480 --> 00:12:57,600 Speaker 4: get into the game, and it's all about relationships a 236 00:12:57,600 --> 00:12:59,760 Speaker 4: lot of times. So what advice would you get to 237 00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:02,040 Speaker 4: some it as looking to become a real estate developer. 238 00:13:02,360 --> 00:13:05,040 Speaker 2: So the first thing is just learn the equation, right, 239 00:13:05,559 --> 00:13:09,160 Speaker 2: because you could do the equation on a multi family 240 00:13:09,880 --> 00:13:13,200 Speaker 2: three family, which most people can have a level of 241 00:13:13,240 --> 00:13:16,560 Speaker 2: access to. But it's that same equation that's saying the 242 00:13:16,600 --> 00:13:19,760 Speaker 2: same mechanics that going through in a development deal. Granted, 243 00:13:19,800 --> 00:13:22,360 Speaker 2: the variables change a little bit because if you get 244 00:13:22,360 --> 00:13:24,880 Speaker 2: into development, you have to take on some different risks, 245 00:13:25,800 --> 00:13:29,440 Speaker 2: but you're basically buying an asset, you're investing money in it. 246 00:13:29,840 --> 00:13:35,480 Speaker 2: You're starting with a multi family, like a three family, 247 00:13:35,520 --> 00:13:38,800 Speaker 2: You're going to learn things like how to do maintenance 248 00:13:38,880 --> 00:13:41,000 Speaker 2: right when that toilet gets backed up. You're going to 249 00:13:41,080 --> 00:13:44,360 Speaker 2: learn something about plumbing, you learn something about electrical and 250 00:13:44,520 --> 00:13:46,800 Speaker 2: folks should not be scared to, you know, take on 251 00:13:46,880 --> 00:13:50,480 Speaker 2: the challenge because everything you learn increases your knowledge base. 252 00:13:51,280 --> 00:13:53,200 Speaker 2: The more knowledge you have, the more you're able to 253 00:13:53,200 --> 00:13:58,040 Speaker 2: monetize your situation. So you know, I would encourage folks 254 00:13:58,040 --> 00:14:03,440 Speaker 2: to start small. So start with a an operating property first, right, 255 00:14:03,559 --> 00:14:07,280 Speaker 2: a multifamily, learn the mechanics. Down the road, you may 256 00:14:07,320 --> 00:14:08,800 Speaker 2: want to say, you know, I'm going to buy a 257 00:14:08,840 --> 00:14:11,960 Speaker 2: Brownstone or some other home that you can actually renovate 258 00:14:12,040 --> 00:14:16,720 Speaker 2: and reposition. I mean everyone watches HGTV and those kind 259 00:14:16,760 --> 00:14:19,320 Speaker 2: of things. You see people doing flips. That's another aspect 260 00:14:19,440 --> 00:14:22,440 Speaker 2: of you know, uh in real estate investing, in real 261 00:14:22,480 --> 00:14:26,400 Speaker 2: estate development that is achievable and accessible for most people. 262 00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:30,160 Speaker 2: But if you do that, you learn how to you know, 263 00:14:30,240 --> 00:14:33,440 Speaker 2: contract with an electrician, how to get the plumbing redone 264 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:35,760 Speaker 2: in the house, how to you know, put get a 265 00:14:35,800 --> 00:14:38,160 Speaker 2: new roof, put on all the things that you basically 266 00:14:38,200 --> 00:14:40,160 Speaker 2: do when you develop, but you're learning it in a 267 00:14:40,160 --> 00:14:44,280 Speaker 2: little bit of a safer scenario. And once you you know, 268 00:14:44,320 --> 00:14:48,920 Speaker 2: you go from crawling to walking, you can run, so 269 00:14:48,960 --> 00:14:50,200 Speaker 2: that that crawling process. 270 00:14:50,560 --> 00:14:53,480 Speaker 5: I imagine now as your internet, well Internet for free. 271 00:14:53,520 --> 00:14:56,360 Speaker 5: Right You're you're saying, can I help this firm take 272 00:14:56,400 --> 00:14:57,720 Speaker 5: us through that process. 273 00:14:57,280 --> 00:14:58,200 Speaker 2: Of what you're learning? 274 00:14:58,320 --> 00:15:00,280 Speaker 5: What are you seeing the negatives and positives of this 275 00:15:00,400 --> 00:15:02,480 Speaker 5: space that you're now in, and to that moment where 276 00:15:02,520 --> 00:15:04,160 Speaker 5: you now see your name at the bottom of the 277 00:15:04,320 --> 00:15:06,840 Speaker 5: of the bet and you're like, wait, my name needs 278 00:15:06,840 --> 00:15:08,440 Speaker 5: to be next to be, needs to be next to 279 00:15:08,520 --> 00:15:10,880 Speaker 5: the bigger figures on this what's that process like for you? 280 00:15:10,640 --> 00:15:13,240 Speaker 2: You mean going from just like starting to learn, Well, 281 00:15:13,280 --> 00:15:16,440 Speaker 2: it's really just desire man, like, you know, really wanting 282 00:15:16,480 --> 00:15:20,360 Speaker 2: to learn it. You think about what this opportunity represented 283 00:15:20,400 --> 00:15:23,600 Speaker 2: for me was, you know, to actualize a dream and 284 00:15:23,760 --> 00:15:28,480 Speaker 2: being an entrepreneur. And so I was intent on learning everything. So, uh, 285 00:15:28,840 --> 00:15:31,600 Speaker 2: you know why I stayed with that developer for free 286 00:15:31,920 --> 00:15:33,800 Speaker 2: for two years because I wanted to learn and I 287 00:15:33,840 --> 00:15:37,480 Speaker 2: wanted to soak up everything like a sponge. So my 288 00:15:37,600 --> 00:15:40,840 Speaker 2: background is in finance. I have two degrees in finance, 289 00:15:41,640 --> 00:15:44,080 Speaker 2: Bachelors and the Masters, and I worked as an investment banker, 290 00:15:44,120 --> 00:15:47,160 Speaker 2: so I came to the table with really strong financial acumen. 291 00:15:47,520 --> 00:15:51,080 Speaker 2: So the you know, the math in real estate is 292 00:15:51,120 --> 00:15:53,480 Speaker 2: simple math and you don't have to be an investment 293 00:15:53,480 --> 00:15:55,040 Speaker 2: banker and you don't have to have an MBA to 294 00:15:55,080 --> 00:15:58,560 Speaker 2: do it. It's simple math because the income is generated 295 00:15:58,600 --> 00:16:01,400 Speaker 2: from people paying rent of operating expenses and you have 296 00:16:01,480 --> 00:16:07,280 Speaker 2: cash flow. It's really a simple equation. Development goes a 297 00:16:07,320 --> 00:16:10,600 Speaker 2: little bit deeper because you have to take something that's 298 00:16:10,600 --> 00:16:13,920 Speaker 2: not generating any income and put it through a process 299 00:16:13,960 --> 00:16:17,680 Speaker 2: where you're going to borrow some capital, both debt and equity. 300 00:16:17,960 --> 00:16:21,240 Speaker 2: You're going to hire an architect, maybe through some entitlement 301 00:16:21,240 --> 00:16:23,600 Speaker 2: work so that you can have the right zoning or 302 00:16:23,600 --> 00:16:25,600 Speaker 2: whatever you need to build. Then you're going to go 303 00:16:25,720 --> 00:16:29,360 Speaker 2: through the process of actually constructing something a little bit 304 00:16:29,400 --> 00:16:32,040 Speaker 2: more risky, but once you get your wheels under you, 305 00:16:32,040 --> 00:16:34,440 Speaker 2: you can do this. And so learning all of those 306 00:16:34,480 --> 00:16:39,520 Speaker 2: different aspects, you know, the financing component, being very focused 307 00:16:39,520 --> 00:16:44,840 Speaker 2: on project management, so making sure the our plans were 308 00:16:44,840 --> 00:16:47,520 Speaker 2: getting done on time, and you know, the legal documents 309 00:16:47,560 --> 00:16:51,040 Speaker 2: that we needed around developments were also moving along and 310 00:16:51,080 --> 00:16:55,160 Speaker 2: are structured properly. There's a lot of engagement in what 311 00:16:55,240 --> 00:16:59,280 Speaker 2: I do now with municipalities because when we're developing affordable housing, 312 00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:02,840 Speaker 2: it can't be done without the participation and the support 313 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:06,760 Speaker 2: of government. And so there's a lot of what I 314 00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:10,199 Speaker 2: think is undue bureaucracy in some markets that you have 315 00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:12,639 Speaker 2: to contend with. But then there are other markets that 316 00:17:12,720 --> 00:17:15,760 Speaker 2: are easy to function, and that is why as a company, 317 00:17:15,760 --> 00:17:18,399 Speaker 2: we chose to expand out of New York City into 318 00:17:18,720 --> 00:17:22,960 Speaker 2: several other markets where there really is tremendous demand for housing, 319 00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:26,439 Speaker 2: both you know market rate, moderate income and you know 320 00:17:26,920 --> 00:17:28,080 Speaker 2: affordable housing as well. 321 00:17:28,400 --> 00:17:31,760 Speaker 4: So can you walk us through the development of a building. 322 00:17:32,160 --> 00:17:33,680 Speaker 4: It could be in New York or out of New York. 323 00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:36,320 Speaker 4: I know this is RFPs right, And then you have 324 00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:38,520 Speaker 4: to get the financing right, and like you said, you 325 00:17:38,600 --> 00:17:40,680 Speaker 4: have to get the architect, and you got to go 326 00:17:40,720 --> 00:17:42,040 Speaker 4: through the permit process. 327 00:17:43,000 --> 00:17:44,800 Speaker 2: So yeah, can you kind of walk us through stuff? 328 00:17:44,920 --> 00:17:48,200 Speaker 2: So let's start with a blank piece of dirt. Okay, 329 00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:51,240 Speaker 2: So you have a piece of dirt. Let's call it 330 00:17:51,240 --> 00:17:54,720 Speaker 2: in Brooklyn, okay, And it's a new neighborhood that's turning 331 00:17:54,800 --> 00:17:58,679 Speaker 2: over and is improving. And as an investor, believe you 332 00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:01,520 Speaker 2: know what, I can put a building on that piece 333 00:18:01,520 --> 00:18:06,280 Speaker 2: of dirt, call it fifty units and make money. Right, 334 00:18:06,359 --> 00:18:08,680 Speaker 2: So the processes. First of all, I see that piece 335 00:18:08,720 --> 00:18:10,800 Speaker 2: of dirt. The first thing I want to do is 336 00:18:10,840 --> 00:18:14,560 Speaker 2: what's called a zoning analysis. I want to understand what's 337 00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:16,159 Speaker 2: the size of a building I could put on there? 338 00:18:16,200 --> 00:18:18,679 Speaker 2: Can I actually put fifty units? Is it fifty five units? 339 00:18:18,840 --> 00:18:21,480 Speaker 2: Is it sixties and forty five? I don't know. So 340 00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:25,640 Speaker 2: an architect would be engaged. They'd conduct a zoning analysis. 341 00:18:26,040 --> 00:18:28,359 Speaker 2: And what it does is reads the zoning code and 342 00:18:28,359 --> 00:18:31,280 Speaker 2: every municipality in the country has a zoning code, and 343 00:18:31,320 --> 00:18:33,719 Speaker 2: it interprets the zoning code and it gives you, right 344 00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:36,840 Speaker 2: there in a two three four page report, exactly what 345 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:39,040 Speaker 2: could be built, how high it could be, where the 346 00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:44,120 Speaker 2: setbacks have to be. You know, how many dwelling units 347 00:18:44,720 --> 00:18:46,920 Speaker 2: can be in that building, the size of every dwelling unit. 348 00:18:46,960 --> 00:18:51,400 Speaker 2: So all these very technical features are codified in a document. 349 00:18:51,760 --> 00:18:54,520 Speaker 2: So you can take that zoning analysis now and now 350 00:18:54,560 --> 00:18:57,160 Speaker 2: go build a financial model, right and that financial model 351 00:18:57,200 --> 00:18:59,320 Speaker 2: is going to say, look, I have these fifty units 352 00:18:59,320 --> 00:19:02,159 Speaker 2: summer studio. Some are one bedrooms, some or two bedrooms, 353 00:19:02,400 --> 00:19:08,000 Speaker 2: and they generate x amount of income. Right that the 354 00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:13,280 Speaker 2: amount of income they generate has to also be further 355 00:19:13,359 --> 00:19:17,080 Speaker 2: reduced by the operating expense. So the superintendent has to 356 00:19:17,119 --> 00:19:20,480 Speaker 2: clean the building or you know, service the residents. The 357 00:19:20,600 --> 00:19:23,240 Speaker 2: porters have to take the garbage out and shovel the 358 00:19:23,320 --> 00:19:25,919 Speaker 2: snow off the off the front steps. You have to 359 00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:28,399 Speaker 2: pay for electricity in the common areas, you have to 360 00:19:28,400 --> 00:19:30,359 Speaker 2: pay your real estate taxes or whatever it is. So 361 00:19:30,400 --> 00:19:32,840 Speaker 2: you do a financial model and you see, you know, 362 00:19:33,320 --> 00:19:36,920 Speaker 2: the revenue can generate the expenses associated against that project, 363 00:19:37,240 --> 00:19:38,760 Speaker 2: and then what kicks out of that is what we 364 00:19:38,840 --> 00:19:43,760 Speaker 2: called net operating income. That net operating income is what 365 00:19:44,400 --> 00:19:47,920 Speaker 2: is used to service the debt the mortgage on the building. Right, 366 00:19:48,400 --> 00:19:52,400 Speaker 2: so you can see just from a pro forma what 367 00:19:53,720 --> 00:19:56,680 Speaker 2: NY the building produces, and that NI will tell you 368 00:19:56,720 --> 00:20:01,000 Speaker 2: how much debt you can raise. So and you also 369 00:20:01,119 --> 00:20:04,359 Speaker 2: want to have a project that of course can support 370 00:20:04,400 --> 00:20:06,200 Speaker 2: the debt, so you know how much debt it can support. 371 00:20:06,400 --> 00:20:07,760 Speaker 2: Now you look at, well, how much debt do I 372 00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:10,159 Speaker 2: need to build it? And you're going to say, you know, 373 00:20:10,160 --> 00:20:13,840 Speaker 2: at fifty unit building. When you become a little bit 374 00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:18,160 Speaker 2: more seasoned, you kind of know what construction costs are. 375 00:20:18,440 --> 00:20:20,800 Speaker 2: But for folks who aren't, you can literally take your plans, 376 00:20:21,160 --> 00:20:23,439 Speaker 2: talk to a builder, say, hey, I'm building this building. 377 00:20:23,480 --> 00:20:26,040 Speaker 2: It's going to be block and plank, or it's going 378 00:20:26,119 --> 00:20:30,040 Speaker 2: to be port in place, concrete, steel frame, whatever construction 379 00:20:30,119 --> 00:20:34,439 Speaker 2: methodology your structural engineer recommends, and you get a cost, right, 380 00:20:34,520 --> 00:20:37,800 Speaker 2: a cost projection for building the building. So that building, 381 00:20:38,080 --> 00:20:42,440 Speaker 2: we'll just use some numbers, right that let's say to 382 00:20:42,440 --> 00:20:46,560 Speaker 2: acquire the land and to build everything's in be ten 383 00:20:46,560 --> 00:20:49,520 Speaker 2: million dollars and let's say at ten million dollars is 384 00:20:50,240 --> 00:20:53,200 Speaker 2: at six percent interest rate, so you know, every month, 385 00:20:53,400 --> 00:20:56,199 Speaker 2: that's how much your mortgage payment has to be on 386 00:20:56,240 --> 00:20:59,040 Speaker 2: that asset, So that NI has to be an excess 387 00:20:59,160 --> 00:21:02,879 Speaker 2: of that debt coverage that that debt number. We call 388 00:21:02,920 --> 00:21:07,639 Speaker 2: that a debt service coverage ratio, So that DSCR probably 389 00:21:07,720 --> 00:21:10,879 Speaker 2: needs to be minimum about one point twenty five, so 390 00:21:11,080 --> 00:21:13,640 Speaker 2: meaning you want to have one hundred and twenty five 391 00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:17,159 Speaker 2: percent of that mortgage number in your NI so you 392 00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:20,199 Speaker 2: can comfortably cover the debt service and then when you 393 00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:22,280 Speaker 2: pay the debt service, the rest of it in yours 394 00:21:22,280 --> 00:21:22,880 Speaker 2: to cash flow. 395 00:21:23,440 --> 00:21:26,600 Speaker 5: So when you're looking for let's say that plot of dirt, 396 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:29,280 Speaker 5: what's are you doing a market analysis to see like, 397 00:21:29,280 --> 00:21:31,760 Speaker 5: all right, we're actually looking for a place to invest 398 00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:34,320 Speaker 5: in this borough or in this city prior to it, 399 00:21:34,840 --> 00:21:37,680 Speaker 5: or are we you know, looking at past investments that 400 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:39,520 Speaker 5: are going up in the neighborhood to say, all right, 401 00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:41,880 Speaker 5: this is an opportunity for us and now create. 402 00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:43,400 Speaker 2: Now that's asked you a great question. So what you're 403 00:21:43,400 --> 00:21:45,600 Speaker 2: really doing is you you know, when you're looking at 404 00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:49,080 Speaker 2: that particular opportunity, you're doing it. So you're looking at 405 00:21:49,119 --> 00:21:51,959 Speaker 2: it because there's probably something else ready going on in 406 00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:55,400 Speaker 2: that neighborhood, right, And what we do is what's called 407 00:21:55,400 --> 00:21:58,800 Speaker 2: a comp study. So I can call a real estate 408 00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:01,359 Speaker 2: broker and say, give me a comm study for this 409 00:22:01,520 --> 00:22:03,680 Speaker 2: zip code. So they're going to say, Craig, I'll email 410 00:22:03,720 --> 00:22:07,960 Speaker 2: you this report and it'll have you five buildings, ten 411 00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:10,520 Speaker 2: buildings that are rending up in and around the neighborhood, 412 00:22:10,640 --> 00:22:12,959 Speaker 2: and it'll show me what the rents are in those buildings, 413 00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:15,760 Speaker 2: so I can have a reasonable expectation as to what 414 00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:21,200 Speaker 2: types of income are generated off off that asset. Now, 415 00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:25,320 Speaker 2: in some markets that we call transitional markets, you know 416 00:22:25,520 --> 00:22:28,880 Speaker 2: it's not so clear, but you're taking a bet because 417 00:22:29,040 --> 00:22:32,200 Speaker 2: let's say something fantastic is going on in that market, 418 00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:36,080 Speaker 2: like they're bringing in a new trains train station, or uh, 419 00:22:36,119 --> 00:22:38,359 Speaker 2: they're building a new stadium, and there's a reason why 420 00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:40,840 Speaker 2: I believe there's going to be a lot of demand 421 00:22:41,119 --> 00:22:44,359 Speaker 2: for real estate in that area. So we will, you know, 422 00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:47,800 Speaker 2: make an analysis and do an investment based on that. 423 00:22:48,240 --> 00:22:51,840 Speaker 2: But in my business, since we do affordable housing, here's 424 00:22:51,880 --> 00:22:59,640 Speaker 2: the thing. Affordable housing is real estate. It's actually it's 425 00:22:59,640 --> 00:23:02,800 Speaker 2: real but it's really a hybrid. It's really structured finance, right, 426 00:23:03,160 --> 00:23:08,440 Speaker 2: because we are offering units to rent at below market rate. 427 00:23:08,520 --> 00:23:11,360 Speaker 2: So it almost doesn't matter what the market is, because 428 00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:15,520 Speaker 2: the two bedrooms, say three thousand, in that market, I 429 00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:18,280 Speaker 2: could bring it to I could bring it to market 430 00:23:18,320 --> 00:23:21,920 Speaker 2: for like, say, sixteen hundred eighteen hundred, tremendous discount to 431 00:23:21,960 --> 00:23:25,760 Speaker 2: make it much more affordable. And the demand for affordable 432 00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:29,280 Speaker 2: housing is insatiable. We cannot build enough of it. I 433 00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:33,400 Speaker 2: have to tell y'all right now, in twenty twenty two, 434 00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:36,920 Speaker 2: almost twenty twenty three, we have a seven million unit 435 00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:40,640 Speaker 2: housing deficit in this country. Seven million units. That means 436 00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:43,040 Speaker 2: we could build for the next ten years. We'd have 437 00:23:43,119 --> 00:23:45,640 Speaker 2: to build for the next ten years across the country 438 00:23:45,960 --> 00:23:48,760 Speaker 2: just to satisfy that demand. And guess what, in ten 439 00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:51,080 Speaker 2: years we're going to find out there's even more demand 440 00:23:51,080 --> 00:23:57,840 Speaker 2: that occurred. And just to quantify that, seven million units 441 00:23:57,840 --> 00:24:00,200 Speaker 2: of housing is about two and a half three trillion 442 00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:04,000 Speaker 2: dollars of an economic opportunity. That's why our community has 443 00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:06,560 Speaker 2: got to get on real estate, because you know, you 444 00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:08,719 Speaker 2: can get your feed in. Not all of it's going 445 00:24:08,800 --> 00:24:12,920 Speaker 2: to be you know, thousand unit portfolios that are built 446 00:24:12,920 --> 00:24:14,879 Speaker 2: in public private partnerships. A lot of it will be 447 00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:18,520 Speaker 2: people who choose to you know, buy a plot of 448 00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:20,679 Speaker 2: land in the city or take a vacant land that 449 00:24:21,160 --> 00:24:23,960 Speaker 2: the city is rfpeing and you know, build a three 450 00:24:24,000 --> 00:24:26,120 Speaker 2: family or four family home on it. There's a lot 451 00:24:26,160 --> 00:24:29,919 Speaker 2: of opportunity there. So all right, let's talk about this. 452 00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:38,040 Speaker 4: There is a housing shortage in America, right, So what 453 00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:41,960 Speaker 4: does that mean for the average person and how does 454 00:24:42,040 --> 00:24:45,800 Speaker 4: that affect the real estate market over the next five years. 455 00:24:46,280 --> 00:24:48,240 Speaker 2: Well, that means that, you know, it's like anything else, 456 00:24:48,359 --> 00:24:51,640 Speaker 2: supply and demand. The supply is low, the demand is high. 457 00:24:51,960 --> 00:24:53,600 Speaker 2: So that's why rents go up. So so why is 458 00:24:53,640 --> 00:24:57,480 Speaker 2: there a housing shortage? Though? Man, there's been so much 459 00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:02,720 Speaker 2: politicization of housing and real estate and it's difficult to build. 460 00:25:02,760 --> 00:25:04,240 Speaker 2: Like you look at some of the markets. Where's the 461 00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:08,760 Speaker 2: most pronounced New York, California. There's this thing called Nimby. 462 00:25:08,920 --> 00:25:12,400 Speaker 2: You have heard of Nimby? Not in my backyard. People say, yeah, 463 00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:14,639 Speaker 2: we need affordable housma, don't build them, don't build them 464 00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:19,000 Speaker 2: on my street. Right, And so what that does is 465 00:25:19,560 --> 00:25:23,560 Speaker 2: it disturbs the real estate market for that particular city 466 00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:27,080 Speaker 2: and we just buy and large have not built enough 467 00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:31,760 Speaker 2: moderate and middle income or affordable housing so you know, 468 00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:34,320 Speaker 2: millionaires don't have any problem. They could buy whatever they 469 00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:36,480 Speaker 2: want to buy right or live wherever they want to live. 470 00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:42,159 Speaker 2: We're talking about the rank and file public workers, you know, teachers, 471 00:25:42,720 --> 00:25:47,720 Speaker 2: ambulance drivers, sanitation workers, the rank and file public who 472 00:25:47,720 --> 00:25:51,280 Speaker 2: have good jobs. They work hard. But there's been such 473 00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:54,040 Speaker 2: an escalation in the cost of rents because of the 474 00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:58,879 Speaker 2: supplying demand disruption that these rents are off the table. 475 00:25:59,119 --> 00:26:02,639 Speaker 2: I mean, if if four million units of housing hit 476 00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:05,359 Speaker 2: the market tomorrow, all rents would drop, but it takes 477 00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:08,560 Speaker 2: years and years to build it. That's why you know, 478 00:26:09,280 --> 00:26:12,480 Speaker 2: we have this condition because it's hard to just increase 479 00:26:12,520 --> 00:26:17,119 Speaker 2: the supply quickly. You have to have an alignment of politics, 480 00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:22,760 Speaker 2: of market forces like real estate excuse me, like interest rates. 481 00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:24,760 Speaker 2: You know, interest rates are out of control right now, 482 00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:27,240 Speaker 2: so it makes it very hard to build. Sometimes you 483 00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:31,360 Speaker 2: have construction costs going off the rails, like everyone heard about, 484 00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:35,160 Speaker 2: you know, what was going on with supply chain disruptions, 485 00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:36,960 Speaker 2: you know last year. So you have all these things 486 00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:39,760 Speaker 2: that can throw that equation off and make it hard 487 00:26:39,800 --> 00:26:43,000 Speaker 2: to produce housing. So you know, right now it's come 488 00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:46,480 Speaker 2: to a critical point. And you know, particularly elected officials 489 00:26:46,800 --> 00:26:50,359 Speaker 2: have to get off of the rubric where they want to, 490 00:26:51,440 --> 00:26:55,960 Speaker 2: you know, almost politicize housing, make all real estate developers evil, 491 00:26:56,000 --> 00:26:58,359 Speaker 2: all real estate is bad. We have a lot of 492 00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:02,360 Speaker 2: that narrative coming out to certain communities in certain cities, 493 00:27:02,640 --> 00:27:06,000 Speaker 2: but it doesn't help to do anything because people still 494 00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:08,560 Speaker 2: cannot find good housing, and the only way to get 495 00:27:08,640 --> 00:27:10,800 Speaker 2: it is to build it. Right, we have to ubzone. 496 00:27:10,960 --> 00:27:13,760 Speaker 2: A lot of communities don't want to go through rezonings 497 00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:16,320 Speaker 2: and up zone. They say all that, we don't want 498 00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:20,159 Speaker 2: that high building here. Well, okay, that's your opinion, but 499 00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:22,520 Speaker 2: we have people sleeping in shelters, right, we have people 500 00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:27,680 Speaker 2: who really need housing. And I firmly believe that housing 501 00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:31,200 Speaker 2: security from most families is financial security, because if people 502 00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:33,520 Speaker 2: have a roof over the head, there's more money they 503 00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:37,760 Speaker 2: have to dedicate to healthcare, the education, to other well 504 00:27:37,800 --> 00:27:40,359 Speaker 2: being of the family, taking care of the elderly, everything 505 00:27:40,359 --> 00:27:42,560 Speaker 2: else the families have to deal with. But if sixty 506 00:27:42,640 --> 00:27:45,160 Speaker 2: seventy percent of your income is used to pay rent, 507 00:27:45,680 --> 00:27:47,840 Speaker 2: cuts out a lot of options what you could do otherwise. 508 00:27:48,680 --> 00:27:51,320 Speaker 5: When you talk about up zone, and I was immediately 509 00:27:51,359 --> 00:27:53,200 Speaker 5: thinking a city I used to work in, the NEWI 510 00:27:53,240 --> 00:27:55,120 Speaker 5: sholl We're seeing a lot of towers go up there, 511 00:27:55,680 --> 00:27:58,000 Speaker 5: and I'm wondering, when when you're building units and you're 512 00:27:58,000 --> 00:28:01,240 Speaker 5: adding that to the portfolio, what's the allocation that has 513 00:28:01,280 --> 00:28:05,240 Speaker 5: to be affordable housing? And obviously your expertise in the field, 514 00:28:05,240 --> 00:28:08,280 Speaker 5: are you seeing people just meaning the minimum or people 515 00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:10,720 Speaker 5: exceeding the amount if there is a certain allocation you 516 00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:10,959 Speaker 5: have to have. 517 00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:12,840 Speaker 2: Well, first of all, let me say this, the mayor 518 00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:16,040 Speaker 2: of New Rochelle in that administration has done it absolutely correctly. 519 00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:21,399 Speaker 2: They have embraced real estate development, and they've used market 520 00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:25,280 Speaker 2: forces and capitalist forces and real estate developers to help 521 00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:28,200 Speaker 2: bring that city into the modern era. And the wave 522 00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:34,400 Speaker 2: of development that there is impressive, right. But in other 523 00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:36,680 Speaker 2: areas it's not so easy because you have a lot 524 00:28:36,720 --> 00:28:39,040 Speaker 2: of different opinions, a lot of you know, just fights 525 00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:41,520 Speaker 2: over what should be built, could be built. We don't 526 00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:48,520 Speaker 2: want that tower here, I think. To answer your second question, generally, 527 00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:52,000 Speaker 2: depending different municipalities have different requirements about how much affordable 528 00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:55,560 Speaker 2: housing should be built, and usually what happens is it's 529 00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:58,000 Speaker 2: tied to some type of tax abatement or some type 530 00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:01,120 Speaker 2: of government funding that will be provided to the project 531 00:29:01,160 --> 00:29:04,640 Speaker 2: to build it. We had a scenario recently in Harlem. Right, 532 00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:07,880 Speaker 2: we're very active, we do a lot, and a city 533 00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:11,480 Speaker 2: council person turned down a developer on one hundred and 534 00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:15,760 Speaker 2: forty fifth Street who bought land and only was required 535 00:29:15,800 --> 00:29:18,000 Speaker 2: to do twenty percent affordable housing, but he wanted to 536 00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:23,320 Speaker 2: ubzone the project and do nine hundred units. He went 537 00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:27,520 Speaker 2: as far as fifty percent of affordable housing. She still voted 538 00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:33,200 Speaker 2: it down. Well, wow, politics, So you think about that's 539 00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:35,200 Speaker 2: the wrong move, right, I mean that's four hundred and 540 00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:40,280 Speaker 2: fifty families. We're not going to have clean, decent, energy 541 00:29:40,320 --> 00:29:44,320 Speaker 2: efficient affordable housing for themselves, right, It's an absolute loss. 542 00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:46,400 Speaker 2: But we see too much of that these days. So 543 00:29:46,560 --> 00:29:48,840 Speaker 2: let me ask you this, well, two questions. How did 544 00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:55,400 Speaker 2: real estate developers get paid? Last answer, well, so what 545 00:29:55,440 --> 00:29:57,720 Speaker 2: I mean by that? Paid? Like twice? Though? Right? Well, 546 00:29:57,800 --> 00:29:59,560 Speaker 2: no real estate developers take all the risks, So what 547 00:29:59,640 --> 00:30:01,360 Speaker 2: we do? What do you mean twice? So you get all? 548 00:30:01,400 --> 00:30:03,120 Speaker 4: Right, Well you can explain it better than me, obviously, 549 00:30:03,160 --> 00:30:05,120 Speaker 4: but from my understanding. 550 00:30:05,080 --> 00:30:08,720 Speaker 2: You you get a. 551 00:30:07,920 --> 00:30:12,760 Speaker 4: Part of the development fee, yes, right, and then you 552 00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:15,280 Speaker 4: have if you have equity in it, then you can 553 00:30:15,360 --> 00:30:18,640 Speaker 4: get that as some level of conversation as well. 554 00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:20,640 Speaker 2: Right, So the equity, the equity that you invest would 555 00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:22,600 Speaker 2: just be returned to you. Right. The equity is so 556 00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:25,120 Speaker 2: when you do a project. Let's say, you know, when 557 00:30:25,120 --> 00:30:27,200 Speaker 2: you buy a house, right, you know, you go to 558 00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:31,440 Speaker 2: the bank and the bank says, okay, uh, you know 559 00:30:31,720 --> 00:30:33,960 Speaker 2: I want to buy this house. I'll say, okay, mister Livingston, 560 00:30:34,080 --> 00:30:36,120 Speaker 2: you know you have to put down twenty percent. That's 561 00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:38,800 Speaker 2: your equity. Same thing when you do a development deal. 562 00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:40,560 Speaker 2: The bank is going to give you one hundred percent 563 00:30:40,560 --> 00:30:42,880 Speaker 2: of the deal. You have to bring some equity. Usually, 564 00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:46,400 Speaker 2: depending on how large the project is, you get into 565 00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:51,000 Speaker 2: a scenario where the equity is coming from a third 566 00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:55,560 Speaker 2: party investor, a limited partner, which is usually a real 567 00:30:55,640 --> 00:30:59,440 Speaker 2: estate private equity fund. It could be an insurance company 568 00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:01,600 Speaker 2: or I'm just an investor that has a lot of 569 00:31:01,640 --> 00:31:04,160 Speaker 2: capital and they have to invest it because they need 570 00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:08,640 Speaker 2: to generate returns on their capital to pay pensioneires or 571 00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:12,280 Speaker 2: to pay out insurance claims or whatever it is. So 572 00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:15,680 Speaker 2: the equity gets returned. But to answer your question specifically, 573 00:31:16,040 --> 00:31:18,640 Speaker 2: a real estate developer will get fees, right, So you 574 00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:23,239 Speaker 2: get a developer fee. You could get distributions based off 575 00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:26,680 Speaker 2: of refinancing the project. Because let's say you know, like 576 00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:31,240 Speaker 2: you have a project, you do it after ten years 577 00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:34,440 Speaker 2: or whatever, rents go up, you have one level of debt, 578 00:31:34,440 --> 00:31:36,719 Speaker 2: you've been paying down that mortgage. You could refinance, put 579 00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:41,400 Speaker 2: a new mortgage on, take some capital out. But more regularly, 580 00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:43,640 Speaker 2: what happens is once you put the building into service, 581 00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:47,120 Speaker 2: every month is cash flow. Right remember NY, you have 582 00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:49,840 Speaker 2: your NY, you pay your debt, and what remains is 583 00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:51,880 Speaker 2: cash flow that can be distributed to partners. 584 00:31:52,240 --> 00:31:57,239 Speaker 4: So okay, now let me ask you this. When in 585 00:31:57,280 --> 00:32:00,720 Speaker 4: New York City rent prices have gone up one hundred 586 00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:05,720 Speaker 4: percent and since COVID, I think it's the most expensive 587 00:32:05,760 --> 00:32:11,880 Speaker 4: rent right now in the country. How is this sustainable? 588 00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:16,479 Speaker 4: And what is the solution or is there any solution 589 00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:17,800 Speaker 4: or will it's just continued just to go. 590 00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:20,960 Speaker 2: Well, no, that's that's not sustainable. And what you saw happened. 591 00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:25,440 Speaker 2: There was a situation where there are a couple of 592 00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:27,600 Speaker 2: things happened. There have been a lot of pressures on 593 00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:31,040 Speaker 2: operating expenses for years. If you look at the curve 594 00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:38,640 Speaker 2: of inflation, I mean, and how insurance, how oil, how labor, 595 00:32:39,080 --> 00:32:41,880 Speaker 2: all the inputs to operate a building have gone up tremendously. 596 00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:44,960 Speaker 2: So think about this, right, you heard of the fight 597 00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:48,880 Speaker 2: for fifteen. Okay, so we wanted to pay workers more. 598 00:32:48,920 --> 00:32:52,240 Speaker 2: So this bill came out of the state legislature to say, 599 00:32:52,280 --> 00:32:55,040 Speaker 2: you know, we're going to pay everybody fifteen dollars an hour. 600 00:32:55,200 --> 00:32:56,680 Speaker 2: And I believe it was a needed bill and we 601 00:32:56,680 --> 00:32:58,240 Speaker 2: should have done it. It was the right thing to do. 602 00:32:58,680 --> 00:33:02,320 Speaker 2: But we pay people fifteen dollars an hour. We took 603 00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:05,920 Speaker 2: the labor the minimum wage from seven or dollars or 604 00:33:05,960 --> 00:33:08,960 Speaker 2: whatever was seven, fifteen, eight dollars whatever to fifteen. In 605 00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:13,440 Speaker 2: two years. You doubled the cost of labor everywhere. Then 606 00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:18,800 Speaker 2: insurance goes up thirty percent a year. You have, you know, 607 00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:25,160 Speaker 2: all your supplies, water, gas, everything goes up so much. 608 00:33:25,200 --> 00:33:29,080 Speaker 2: So what happened with those big rent increases is there 609 00:33:29,120 --> 00:33:33,200 Speaker 2: was an opportunity again very short, tight supply, and folks 610 00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:35,040 Speaker 2: were out of the city for a while. Everyone came 611 00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:37,640 Speaker 2: flooding back at one point in time, and just the 612 00:33:37,640 --> 00:33:42,240 Speaker 2: market demands caused, you know, just the economic equation to 613 00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:46,040 Speaker 2: ensue supply and demand. You know, demand was strong, supply 614 00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:49,200 Speaker 2: was low. Rents went up. That's not sustainable. You'll never 615 00:33:49,240 --> 00:33:52,560 Speaker 2: see one hundred percent year over year or thirty percent 616 00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:56,680 Speaker 2: year over year rent increases. What compounded it more in 617 00:33:56,720 --> 00:34:02,400 Speaker 2: my world is that when you own affordable housing assets 618 00:34:02,400 --> 00:34:05,760 Speaker 2: like I do, particularly in New York City, those rents 619 00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:09,239 Speaker 2: are governed by the RGB, the Rent Guidelines Board, so 620 00:34:09,280 --> 00:34:12,960 Speaker 2: they set the rent increases on rent stabilized units every year. 621 00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:17,400 Speaker 2: And again the politicization of real estate, those RGB increases 622 00:34:17,520 --> 00:34:21,719 Speaker 2: had been artificially low for like throughout almost like the 623 00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:27,480 Speaker 2: whole Deblasio administration, and they were lagging the increase in 624 00:34:27,760 --> 00:34:30,960 Speaker 2: costs of operating buildings. So you know, there was an 625 00:34:31,080 --> 00:34:34,680 Speaker 2: RGB increased this past year, I think of earlier this year, 626 00:34:34,680 --> 00:34:37,280 Speaker 2: like four or six percent, and people were up in arms, 627 00:34:37,280 --> 00:34:41,680 Speaker 2: but it still didn't even really catch up with what 628 00:34:41,920 --> 00:34:46,160 Speaker 2: you know, inflation and operating costs had had, you know, 629 00:34:46,239 --> 00:34:49,640 Speaker 2: demonstrated over the past few years. So you're going to 630 00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:51,759 Speaker 2: see you know, So what I'm doing is making a 631 00:34:51,800 --> 00:34:56,760 Speaker 2: differentiation between what happens in the regulated world, like regulated 632 00:34:56,800 --> 00:34:59,920 Speaker 2: real estate and unregulated real estate. Unregulated real estate is 633 00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:03,400 Speaker 2: you had those huge dramatic increases. Regulated real estate is 634 00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:04,960 Speaker 2: not going to You're not going to see those types 635 00:35:05,000 --> 00:35:07,239 Speaker 2: of rent increases your over year. Yeah. 636 00:35:07,600 --> 00:35:09,960 Speaker 5: One of the things around real estate is the education 637 00:35:10,080 --> 00:35:12,560 Speaker 5: around it, and so most people think they can be 638 00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:15,240 Speaker 5: an agent, or they can be a realtor or obviously 639 00:35:15,320 --> 00:35:18,120 Speaker 5: in your case, a developer, But just doing the researcher 640 00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:20,239 Speaker 5: on it, you realize there's so many other things that 641 00:35:20,239 --> 00:35:23,319 Speaker 5: could be involved. And obviously what you're doing now, I 642 00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:25,040 Speaker 5: mean I wrote down a list of things and you 643 00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:27,239 Speaker 5: can enlighten me. I wonder what you see it on 644 00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:34,600 Speaker 5: the landscape looking forward for the space. Architects, accountants, attorneys, plumbers, electricians, masons, painters, competors, 645 00:35:34,640 --> 00:35:39,480 Speaker 5: all these opportunities we're missing the opportunity to be involved 646 00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:41,680 Speaker 5: in the process. What do you think we need to 647 00:35:41,719 --> 00:35:44,000 Speaker 5: do to enlighten the education around it. 648 00:35:44,280 --> 00:35:46,560 Speaker 2: No, I mean that's a great point as you're bringing up, 649 00:35:46,600 --> 00:35:51,880 Speaker 2: because like I just talked about, you know, building seven 650 00:35:51,920 --> 00:35:54,120 Speaker 2: million units, it's two and a half to three trillion 651 00:35:54,160 --> 00:35:58,359 Speaker 2: dollar opportunity. And that's not all going to developers, right. 652 00:35:58,680 --> 00:36:01,560 Speaker 2: You have architects and engineer and masons and plumbers and 653 00:36:01,600 --> 00:36:05,520 Speaker 2: accountants and attorneys and so many people involved in and 654 00:36:05,560 --> 00:36:08,239 Speaker 2: around real estate, and so there are a lot of 655 00:36:08,280 --> 00:36:11,400 Speaker 2: different career paths that are available. We talk about like 656 00:36:11,520 --> 00:36:14,879 Speaker 2: when we do Affirmation Tower and other projects that we do. 657 00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:17,680 Speaker 2: You know, this power in ownership. So as a developer, 658 00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:20,680 Speaker 2: what we do is we are intentional about making sure 659 00:36:20,680 --> 00:36:24,680 Speaker 2: we're spending money with minority and women own companies. Our 660 00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:28,680 Speaker 2: Harlem project, the Victoria Tower that is operational now on 661 00:36:28,680 --> 00:36:31,040 Speaker 2: one twenty fifth Street next to the Apollo, I mean, 662 00:36:31,080 --> 00:36:33,640 Speaker 2: and that project alone, we spend thirty five million dollars 663 00:36:34,239 --> 00:36:39,360 Speaker 2: contracts with minority and women owned companies. And in Affirmation Tower, 664 00:36:39,400 --> 00:36:41,839 Speaker 2: which is going to be a two and a half 665 00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:44,880 Speaker 2: billion dollar project, we're going to spend over a billion 666 00:36:44,920 --> 00:36:49,160 Speaker 2: dollars with minority and women owned companies. But again it's 667 00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:52,560 Speaker 2: because you have ownership that looks like me making damn 668 00:36:52,600 --> 00:36:54,880 Speaker 2: sure that we're doing it. We're not looking to you know, 669 00:36:54,920 --> 00:36:57,600 Speaker 2: figure out how to gain the system and not do it, 670 00:36:57,600 --> 00:37:00,480 Speaker 2: get the credit, give to somebody's wife. We started a 671 00:37:00,480 --> 00:37:02,840 Speaker 2: company that none of that nonsense. We were very intentional 672 00:37:03,120 --> 00:37:07,840 Speaker 2: about making sure that the economic multiplier exists in our community. 673 00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:12,520 Speaker 4: So let's talk about this Harlem hotel. It's going to 674 00:37:12,560 --> 00:37:16,920 Speaker 4: be the first luxury hotel in Harlem. 675 00:37:17,000 --> 00:37:20,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, we're really proud of it. Man. So it'll be 676 00:37:20,120 --> 00:37:24,200 Speaker 2: opening up in February and it'll be a renaissance by Marriott. 677 00:37:24,480 --> 00:37:28,400 Speaker 2: So this is the first full service hotel in Harlem 678 00:37:28,400 --> 00:37:30,680 Speaker 2: in eighty years. What is it going to be right 679 00:37:30,680 --> 00:37:34,040 Speaker 2: on one twenty fifth Street, right the Victorian, The Victorian, Yeah, 680 00:37:34,040 --> 00:37:38,239 Speaker 2: the Victoria Tower. So what it is is back in 681 00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:42,640 Speaker 2: the day you had Harlem's Opera Row and there were 682 00:37:43,040 --> 00:37:46,880 Speaker 2: four performance halls. You had the Apollo, the Victoria, the 683 00:37:46,920 --> 00:37:50,719 Speaker 2: Alhambra and the Harlem Opera House. Only the Apollo is 684 00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:55,399 Speaker 2: really functional right now as was originally built. But we 685 00:37:55,880 --> 00:37:59,560 Speaker 2: got involved in this project years ago and it was 686 00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:02,880 Speaker 2: an active reuse, so we've kept some of the original 687 00:38:03,680 --> 00:38:07,359 Speaker 2: historical features like the facade, the Marquee, the Blade. When 688 00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:09,439 Speaker 2: you go into the development, you know when you walk 689 00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:11,920 Speaker 2: in off one hundred and twenty fIF Street, you're walking 690 00:38:12,080 --> 00:38:17,880 Speaker 2: into the original nineteen seventeen lobby. We hired historical preservation 691 00:38:18,040 --> 00:38:21,879 Speaker 2: architects and we restored it to the te perfectly and 692 00:38:22,719 --> 00:38:26,480 Speaker 2: then the rest of it is all brand new. So 693 00:38:26,560 --> 00:38:29,799 Speaker 2: we have two twenty seven story towers. The tower on 694 00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:34,080 Speaker 2: one twenty sixth Street is a residential rental building that 695 00:38:34,160 --> 00:38:37,360 Speaker 2: was done in a fifty to thirty twenty configuration. So 696 00:38:37,400 --> 00:38:41,280 Speaker 2: this fifty percent market rate, thirty percent low income, twenty 697 00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:43,839 Speaker 2: percent middle income. And we did that intentionally to make 698 00:38:43,880 --> 00:38:47,120 Speaker 2: sure we could create opportunity for people from all over 699 00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:49,480 Speaker 2: the income spectrum to live there, right, And so it 700 00:38:49,520 --> 00:38:51,480 Speaker 2: wasn't just going to be a bunch of you know, 701 00:38:52,200 --> 00:38:55,320 Speaker 2: folks paying four five thousand dollars six thousand dollars a 702 00:38:55,360 --> 00:38:57,840 Speaker 2: month for rent, but we have affordable housing tenants paying 703 00:38:58,320 --> 00:39:00,839 Speaker 2: fraction of that living there and enjoying the same amenities 704 00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:05,120 Speaker 2: everyone else is enjoying. Then within the hotel there is 705 00:39:05,280 --> 00:39:12,520 Speaker 2: a two hundred and ten rooms. We have a fantastic lounge, bar, lobby. 706 00:39:12,560 --> 00:39:15,040 Speaker 2: It's amazing. Definitely, you guys might want to film this. 707 00:39:16,400 --> 00:39:18,719 Speaker 2: Uh easy, that's too easy. Yeah, we have. We have 708 00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:22,000 Speaker 2: a ballroom because we want to create an opportunity for 709 00:39:22,080 --> 00:39:25,120 Speaker 2: you know, institutions from our community to Harlem to be 710 00:39:25,120 --> 00:39:28,960 Speaker 2: able to have events there. So you know, world class 711 00:39:29,000 --> 00:39:33,799 Speaker 2: ballroom and then on the persons, well, before I get there, 712 00:39:34,160 --> 00:39:36,800 Speaker 2: we also created a cultural arts facility with two black 713 00:39:36,840 --> 00:39:39,680 Speaker 2: box theaters, so there's a ninety nine seat theater and 714 00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:42,399 Speaker 2: a one hundred and ninety nine seat theater that will 715 00:39:42,480 --> 00:39:45,880 Speaker 2: be occupied and operated by the Apollo Theater. Well, so 716 00:39:45,920 --> 00:39:52,439 Speaker 2: they'll be doing programming and creating arts programming from other 717 00:39:52,520 --> 00:39:55,960 Speaker 2: local groups in the community who can't you know, afford 718 00:39:56,000 --> 00:39:58,440 Speaker 2: to do it on Broadway because it gets prohibitively expensive. 719 00:39:58,600 --> 00:40:00,239 Speaker 2: But they could do it here and then and we 720 00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:02,080 Speaker 2: have you know, a couple of retailers. But you know, 721 00:40:02,200 --> 00:40:05,640 Speaker 2: it's a long time coming. We're happy to be, you know, 722 00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:07,960 Speaker 2: at the end and putting it into production. So we 723 00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:10,680 Speaker 2: got the hotel in Harlem. But there's also affordable housing 724 00:40:10,719 --> 00:40:13,240 Speaker 2: that's going on in Harlem. I know one hundred and fortieth, 725 00:40:13,440 --> 00:40:15,279 Speaker 2: there's a project in one hundred and fifteen. Let's talk 726 00:40:15,280 --> 00:40:19,440 Speaker 2: about the importance of I got almost restoring that that 727 00:40:19,440 --> 00:40:21,120 Speaker 2: that feeling from the Harlem Renaissance. 728 00:40:21,120 --> 00:40:23,520 Speaker 5: You talked about the four pillars that were there. But 729 00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:26,399 Speaker 5: there's like a researchers that it's happening obviously with you guys. 730 00:40:26,440 --> 00:40:28,239 Speaker 2: I mean there's a lot so limit. So here's the 731 00:40:28,239 --> 00:40:31,200 Speaker 2: dirt little secret. Harlem is no longer majority black, right, 732 00:40:31,360 --> 00:40:34,279 Speaker 2: So what is it? It's not majority black? I mean 733 00:40:34,280 --> 00:40:38,640 Speaker 2: you have some big big Asian population, big Latino population, 734 00:40:39,200 --> 00:40:42,480 Speaker 2: big white population, but you know the numbers are I 735 00:40:42,560 --> 00:40:45,080 Speaker 2: don't but we can get them to you. But but 736 00:40:45,160 --> 00:40:49,279 Speaker 2: you look at what we should be doing is preserving 737 00:40:49,480 --> 00:40:53,560 Speaker 2: our cultural institutions, and Harlem is a cultural institution. And 738 00:40:53,719 --> 00:40:55,400 Speaker 2: one of the things we've done you've mentioned on hundred 739 00:40:55,400 --> 00:40:57,200 Speaker 2: and fortieth Street. So we owned some property on one 740 00:40:57,280 --> 00:41:00,000 Speaker 2: hundred and fortieth Street and one hundred and fiftieth Street, 741 00:41:00,360 --> 00:41:04,800 Speaker 2: so we're rebuilding on those two vacant lots. We're putting 742 00:41:04,880 --> 00:41:10,680 Speaker 2: up two affordable condominiums. So it's home ownership where we 743 00:41:10,719 --> 00:41:13,120 Speaker 2: want folks from the community to be able to buy 744 00:41:13,960 --> 00:41:17,719 Speaker 2: units in the community at affordable prices. So you're talking 745 00:41:17,719 --> 00:41:21,440 Speaker 2: about like a three bedroom condo and Harlem for like 746 00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:24,919 Speaker 2: three hundred thousand dollars, right, unheard of. But we could 747 00:41:24,920 --> 00:41:27,960 Speaker 2: do that because of the participation and the support of 748 00:41:28,280 --> 00:41:30,920 Speaker 2: you know, the Department of Housing, Preservation, Development, you know, 749 00:41:31,000 --> 00:41:34,920 Speaker 2: New York City's Housing Agency, and some other funding that 750 00:41:34,960 --> 00:41:37,239 Speaker 2: came from the state. But we need a lot more 751 00:41:37,280 --> 00:41:40,000 Speaker 2: of that that. We need to have home ownership opportunities 752 00:41:40,040 --> 00:41:44,520 Speaker 2: in Brooklyn, you know, in the Bronx, and Harlem a 753 00:41:44,560 --> 00:41:47,440 Speaker 2: lot more of it. And so I think this city 754 00:41:47,480 --> 00:41:50,960 Speaker 2: Council and this legislature in the Assembly and the Senate 755 00:41:50,960 --> 00:41:54,280 Speaker 2: has woken up to that and it has created financial 756 00:41:54,320 --> 00:41:57,560 Speaker 2: resources to go into funding that type of development because 757 00:41:57,600 --> 00:41:59,440 Speaker 2: we you know, we were asleep for a long time, 758 00:42:00,239 --> 00:42:02,960 Speaker 2: was changing over. So let me ask you this because 759 00:42:03,239 --> 00:42:04,239 Speaker 2: but you're still a BIS. 760 00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:07,759 Speaker 6: This episode is brought to you by P and C Bank. 761 00:42:08,160 --> 00:42:10,920 Speaker 6: A lot of people think podcasts about work are boring, 762 00:42:11,120 --> 00:42:15,000 Speaker 6: and sure they definitely can be, but understanding of professionals 763 00:42:15,040 --> 00:42:18,320 Speaker 6: routine shows us how they achieve their success little by little, 764 00:42:18,680 --> 00:42:22,319 Speaker 6: day after day. It's like banking with P and C Bank. 765 00:42:22,800 --> 00:42:25,600 Speaker 6: It might seem boring to save, plan and make calculated 766 00:42:25,640 --> 00:42:28,719 Speaker 6: decisions with your bank, but keeping your money boring is 767 00:42:28,760 --> 00:42:32,080 Speaker 6: what helps you live or more happily fulfilled life. 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We 777 00:43:03,120 --> 00:43:05,640 Speaker 6: love supporting businesses that run on Square because it just 778 00:43:05,680 --> 00:43:08,879 Speaker 6: feels seamless. Whether it's a local coffee shop, a vendor 779 00:43:08,960 --> 00:43:11,239 Speaker 6: at a pop up market, or even one of our 780 00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:14,960 Speaker 6: merch partners, Square makes it easy for them to take payments, 781 00:43:15,160 --> 00:43:18,839 Speaker 6: manage inventory, and run their business with confidence, all from 782 00:43:18,960 --> 00:43:22,400 Speaker 6: one simple system. If you're a business owner or even 783 00:43:22,480 --> 00:43:26,000 Speaker 6: just thinking about launching something soon, Square is hands down 784 00:43:26,040 --> 00:43:28,400 Speaker 6: one of the best tools out there to help you start, 785 00:43:28,760 --> 00:43:32,320 Speaker 6: run and grow. It's not just about payments, it's about 786 00:43:32,360 --> 00:43:34,759 Speaker 6: giving you time back so you can focus on what 787 00:43:34,960 --> 00:43:38,600 Speaker 6: matters most Ready. To see how Square can transform your business, 788 00:43:38,880 --> 00:43:43,520 Speaker 6: visit Square dot com backslash, go backslash eyl to learn 789 00:43:43,560 --> 00:43:48,759 Speaker 6: more that Square dot com backslash, go backslash eyl. Don't wait, 790 00:43:49,040 --> 00:43:51,880 Speaker 6: don't hesitate. Let's Square handle the back end so you 791 00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:53,520 Speaker 6: can keep pushing your vision forward. 792 00:43:55,760 --> 00:43:59,359 Speaker 1: An illegal alien from Guatemala charged with raping a child 793 00:43:59,440 --> 00:44:02,480 Speaker 1: in master t U. 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Under President Trump, attempted 799 00:44:23,120 --> 00:44:26,800 Speaker 1: illegal border crossings are at the lowest levels ever recorded, 800 00:44:27,120 --> 00:44:30,200 Speaker 1: and over one hundred thousand illegal aliens have been arrested. 801 00:44:30,440 --> 00:44:34,000 Speaker 1: If you are here illegally, your next you will be 802 00:44:34,040 --> 00:44:37,920 Speaker 1: fined nearly one thousand dollars a day, imprisoned, and deported. 803 00:44:38,400 --> 00:44:41,640 Speaker 1: You will never return. But if you register using our 804 00:44:41,680 --> 00:44:44,880 Speaker 1: CBP home app and leave now, you could be allowed 805 00:44:44,880 --> 00:44:49,880 Speaker 1: to return legally. Do what's right. Leave now. Under President Trump, 806 00:44:50,000 --> 00:44:53,600 Speaker 1: America's laws, border and families will be protected. 807 00:44:53,719 --> 00:44:55,840 Speaker 2: Sponsored by the United States Department of Homeland Security. 808 00:44:55,880 --> 00:44:58,560 Speaker 4: Business man, and you handed to make money, right, So 809 00:44:58,640 --> 00:45:03,600 Speaker 4: when you're doing these projects, fifty of the housing is 810 00:45:03,680 --> 00:45:06,919 Speaker 4: going to low or middle income or you just talked 811 00:45:06,920 --> 00:45:09,560 Speaker 4: about where you can buy and it is based off 812 00:45:09,600 --> 00:45:10,200 Speaker 4: of your income. 813 00:45:11,040 --> 00:45:12,520 Speaker 2: So how are you making money off of this? 814 00:45:12,640 --> 00:45:18,239 Speaker 4: The city gives you subsidies to subsidize the price of 815 00:45:18,360 --> 00:45:20,879 Speaker 4: Like if somebody should be paying four thousand but they're 816 00:45:20,920 --> 00:45:24,720 Speaker 4: only paying one thousand, is the city subsidized three thousand dollars? 817 00:45:24,719 --> 00:45:27,200 Speaker 2: Absolutely? So what will happened is there's two types of 818 00:45:27,200 --> 00:45:31,640 Speaker 2: substis capital subsidy, and there's rental subsidy. So so capital 819 00:45:31,680 --> 00:45:34,279 Speaker 2: subsidy works like this, like, you know, we're doing the 820 00:45:34,360 --> 00:45:39,120 Speaker 2: development and it costs ten million to do the development, right, 821 00:45:40,040 --> 00:45:45,000 Speaker 2: but that development can only support six million of debt 822 00:45:45,080 --> 00:45:47,760 Speaker 2: or six million of capital because of the depressed costs. 823 00:45:47,920 --> 00:45:49,960 Speaker 2: The city's going to put in the additional subsidy. It's 824 00:45:49,960 --> 00:45:51,520 Speaker 2: a very simplistic way to look at it, but that's 825 00:45:51,600 --> 00:45:53,480 Speaker 2: kind of how it works, and how we get paid 826 00:45:53,800 --> 00:45:57,319 Speaker 2: is when you create that budget, our fee is part 827 00:45:57,360 --> 00:45:59,520 Speaker 2: of the budget. So it's like it's right, it's baked 828 00:45:59,560 --> 00:45:59,840 Speaker 2: right in. 829 00:46:00,080 --> 00:46:03,080 Speaker 4: So it's like a building costs ten million, you have 830 00:46:03,320 --> 00:46:05,720 Speaker 4: six million, the city will put the other four million 831 00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:08,520 Speaker 4: in for you. But for them pointing four million in 832 00:46:08,560 --> 00:46:10,719 Speaker 4: for you, they're gonna say we need thirty percent of 833 00:46:10,840 --> 00:46:13,399 Speaker 4: the market rate. So then the math it works out. 834 00:46:13,480 --> 00:46:15,200 Speaker 4: It's kind of like an even exchange all lost. That's 835 00:46:15,280 --> 00:46:20,440 Speaker 4: right right, right right. They subsidized. The city has to subsidize. 836 00:46:20,160 --> 00:46:24,440 Speaker 2: The building and the operations of affordable housing because otherwise 837 00:46:24,440 --> 00:46:26,759 Speaker 2: it wouldn't work. What's the what how much do you 838 00:46:26,800 --> 00:46:30,720 Speaker 2: need to have an affordable housing building? Like a percentage 839 00:46:30,800 --> 00:46:32,160 Speaker 2: I mean, we do some. We have a building that 840 00:46:32,200 --> 00:46:34,319 Speaker 2: we're bringing to market right now in the Bronx up 841 00:46:34,320 --> 00:46:37,440 Speaker 2: on Union Avenue to ninety five unit building. It's one 842 00:46:37,520 --> 00:46:41,680 Speaker 2: hundred percent affordable. But that was done from the genesis 843 00:46:41,680 --> 00:46:44,400 Speaker 2: with the city with the intention of doing an affordable 844 00:46:44,440 --> 00:46:47,319 Speaker 2: housing building. And by the way, that's also a joint 845 00:46:47,360 --> 00:46:49,320 Speaker 2: venture with the church, where we did a deal with 846 00:46:49,360 --> 00:46:52,480 Speaker 2: the church. They owned the land and they had aspirations. 847 00:46:52,560 --> 00:46:54,839 Speaker 2: I mean, it's a really good, really nice church. They 848 00:46:54,840 --> 00:46:59,719 Speaker 2: had aspirations to stay there. They wanted a new church facility, 849 00:47:00,320 --> 00:47:03,960 Speaker 2: and you know a lot of their members have passed 850 00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:08,920 Speaker 2: away or retired, moved away, and the congregation dwindled. So 851 00:47:09,680 --> 00:47:11,600 Speaker 2: when we were introduced to them, we had an idea, listen, 852 00:47:11,680 --> 00:47:13,920 Speaker 2: let's work out an affordable housing deal. We brought them 853 00:47:13,920 --> 00:47:16,719 Speaker 2: into the partnership where they are thirty percent owner as well, 854 00:47:17,440 --> 00:47:20,080 Speaker 2: and they get a new church facility. But all that 855 00:47:20,280 --> 00:47:24,200 Speaker 2: was done under one budget, and that includes a developer fee, 856 00:47:24,360 --> 00:47:26,439 Speaker 2: so we're able to do, you know, do good help 857 00:47:26,480 --> 00:47:28,839 Speaker 2: this church create affordable housing, but we made money by 858 00:47:28,840 --> 00:47:30,799 Speaker 2: doing it too. That literally is what's happened to my 859 00:47:30,920 --> 00:47:32,040 Speaker 2: church in the Michelle. 860 00:47:32,400 --> 00:47:34,759 Speaker 5: We're going to be on the bottom floor, there'll be 861 00:47:34,840 --> 00:47:37,040 Speaker 5: retail space, but they you know, there's going to be 862 00:47:37,080 --> 00:47:40,600 Speaker 5: a tower above it. You said something about, yeah, we 863 00:47:40,640 --> 00:47:42,239 Speaker 5: will sleep for a while, but now we need to 864 00:47:42,280 --> 00:47:44,000 Speaker 5: be woken. Part of it is seeing people like you, 865 00:47:44,040 --> 00:47:45,799 Speaker 5: but we need to see more people like you. And 866 00:47:45,840 --> 00:47:49,160 Speaker 5: I know you're on the board for the New York 867 00:47:49,200 --> 00:47:53,799 Speaker 5: Real Estate direct So can you talk about your role 868 00:47:53,840 --> 00:47:57,800 Speaker 5: and the importance that that organization plays in that process 869 00:47:57,800 --> 00:48:00,000 Speaker 5: of developing more developers that look like us? 870 00:48:00,080 --> 00:48:02,719 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean so, NYREK is the New York Real 871 00:48:02,760 --> 00:48:06,759 Speaker 2: Estate Chamber. It is the leading advocacy group for all 872 00:48:06,800 --> 00:48:09,960 Speaker 2: the diverse developers in New York State. So if you're 873 00:48:10,040 --> 00:48:12,640 Speaker 2: you know, anyone doing any project of scale, and note 874 00:48:13,160 --> 00:48:16,200 Speaker 2: that's a black or brown developer, female developers is a 875 00:48:16,200 --> 00:48:20,640 Speaker 2: member of this organization. And you know, thirty years ago 876 00:48:21,920 --> 00:48:24,359 Speaker 2: you wouldn't see anybody like us doing real estate, right. 877 00:48:24,920 --> 00:48:29,360 Speaker 2: It has just been a very undiverse industry, no diversity. 878 00:48:29,960 --> 00:48:32,560 Speaker 2: And so I'm on the board. I'm actually chairman of 879 00:48:32,600 --> 00:48:35,239 Speaker 2: the board. Cheryl McKissick is a board member with me. 880 00:48:35,360 --> 00:48:37,200 Speaker 2: Don Peeples is a board member with me. But we 881 00:48:37,320 --> 00:48:41,000 Speaker 2: have a bunch of other board members and developers that 882 00:48:41,480 --> 00:48:43,799 Speaker 2: are for profit and not for profits, but we all 883 00:48:43,880 --> 00:48:47,640 Speaker 2: work towards the same thing, to increase access to economic 884 00:48:47,680 --> 00:48:52,360 Speaker 2: opportunity and capital for diverse developers. And we've been making 885 00:48:52,400 --> 00:48:54,799 Speaker 2: a lot of noise, we've been I think, achieving a 886 00:48:54,800 --> 00:48:58,040 Speaker 2: lot of success. We are looking to recruit and bring 887 00:48:58,080 --> 00:49:01,400 Speaker 2: as many folks who are interested in real estate development 888 00:49:01,440 --> 00:49:03,920 Speaker 2: into the fold as possible because of the knowledge that 889 00:49:03,960 --> 00:49:05,919 Speaker 2: we have has to be shared. It's the only way 890 00:49:06,120 --> 00:49:09,360 Speaker 2: we're going to grow our ranks right and I like 891 00:49:09,400 --> 00:49:12,920 Speaker 2: to borrow, you know, rubric from our Jewish brothers and sisters. 892 00:49:12,960 --> 00:49:16,360 Speaker 2: I see so much collaboration in synagogues. You go to 893 00:49:16,360 --> 00:49:18,719 Speaker 2: any synegaue unit to see five or ten businessmen who 894 00:49:18,719 --> 00:49:21,319 Speaker 2: work together. And we try and do the same thing. 895 00:49:21,400 --> 00:49:24,360 Speaker 2: Don Peebles always says, you know, when he sees another 896 00:49:24,400 --> 00:49:27,560 Speaker 2: black developer, he doesn't see a competitor, he sees a 897 00:49:27,600 --> 00:49:29,960 Speaker 2: potential partner. And that's how you know, we look at it. 898 00:49:29,960 --> 00:49:33,080 Speaker 2: In Iraq, we are doing a lot of deals that 899 00:49:33,160 --> 00:49:36,840 Speaker 2: are larger because we collaborate with each other, like Affirmation Tower, 900 00:49:37,600 --> 00:49:44,839 Speaker 2: you know, the People's Organization, my company, the Bolstero in 901 00:49:44,880 --> 00:49:48,040 Speaker 2: Atlanta and Third and Urban One, an RFP last month 902 00:49:48,400 --> 00:49:54,439 Speaker 2: to develop a huge site next to Microsoft's ninety acre campus. Right, 903 00:49:54,800 --> 00:49:56,359 Speaker 2: it's just going to be you know, one point two 904 00:49:56,400 --> 00:49:59,120 Speaker 2: million square feet that will develop, which will consist of 905 00:49:59,120 --> 00:50:03,480 Speaker 2: four hundred and ninety FI units of housing, an office building, 906 00:50:04,080 --> 00:50:07,279 Speaker 2: and a hotel. That's going to be done right at 907 00:50:07,320 --> 00:50:09,560 Speaker 2: the bank Head train station. We're going to build a 908 00:50:09,560 --> 00:50:12,520 Speaker 2: platform over trail in Atlanta and go vertical. And we're 909 00:50:12,520 --> 00:50:15,200 Speaker 2: getting busy in Atlanta anyway. We love that market. We 910 00:50:15,280 --> 00:50:17,960 Speaker 2: want to do as much as possible so growing markets flourishing. 911 00:50:18,320 --> 00:50:21,680 Speaker 2: The government is super supportive of these types of public 912 00:50:21,719 --> 00:50:27,640 Speaker 2: private partnerships. They're aware of developing assets in an economically 913 00:50:27,640 --> 00:50:30,160 Speaker 2: diverse way, so that we could create some affordable housing 914 00:50:30,760 --> 00:50:34,839 Speaker 2: in combination with commercial and market rate development just makes 915 00:50:34,880 --> 00:50:38,560 Speaker 2: a lot of sense. So collaborating together allowed us to 916 00:50:38,600 --> 00:50:40,440 Speaker 2: win that. And there's we have a lot of instances 917 00:50:40,520 --> 00:50:44,680 Speaker 2: even amongst other direct members where you know other members 918 00:50:44,719 --> 00:50:47,440 Speaker 2: have collaborated or winning. There's a there's a you know, 919 00:50:47,440 --> 00:50:50,960 Speaker 2: a group one a great project up in Boston associated 920 00:50:50,960 --> 00:50:53,560 Speaker 2: with a train station not not too long ago. They're 921 00:50:53,600 --> 00:50:56,720 Speaker 2: winning deals with NISCHE, the New York City Housing Authority, 922 00:50:56,760 --> 00:50:59,959 Speaker 2: where we have our members taken down, you know, five six, seven, 923 00:51:00,040 --> 00:51:03,520 Speaker 2: eight hundred units that they're going to renovate and put 924 00:51:03,600 --> 00:51:08,960 Speaker 2: back into service and help improve the overall physical condition 925 00:51:09,040 --> 00:51:11,839 Speaker 2: of those those buildings that they've been so dilapidated for 926 00:51:11,880 --> 00:51:14,640 Speaker 2: so long. But again, this is all being done through collaboration. 927 00:51:14,800 --> 00:51:18,560 Speaker 2: So we want to work with as many folks who 928 00:51:18,600 --> 00:51:21,359 Speaker 2: are interested in real estate development, and we welcome people 929 00:51:21,360 --> 00:51:23,880 Speaker 2: into the fold, and we want to grow our ranks. 930 00:51:24,200 --> 00:51:27,239 Speaker 5: It sounds like you have almost right if you're talking 931 00:51:27,239 --> 00:51:30,000 Speaker 5: about Iraq that's obviously here in New York, but working 932 00:51:30,000 --> 00:51:33,120 Speaker 5: in Boston, having development in Atlanta, you're working with other 933 00:51:33,200 --> 00:51:36,920 Speaker 5: municipalities domestically. Is there one or is there thoughts of 934 00:51:36,960 --> 00:51:39,760 Speaker 5: this creating one that can create on a national level? 935 00:51:40,040 --> 00:51:41,880 Speaker 2: We'd love to, man. I mean, I think when you 936 00:51:41,880 --> 00:51:46,680 Speaker 2: look at what's happening again, that seven million unit housing opportunity, right, 937 00:51:46,719 --> 00:51:49,840 Speaker 2: I would like to see a lot of minorities and 938 00:51:49,960 --> 00:51:53,759 Speaker 2: women take advantage of it, right nationally, So I look 939 00:51:53,800 --> 00:51:56,920 Speaker 2: at direct as being a model what can happen through collaboration. 940 00:51:57,360 --> 00:52:01,839 Speaker 2: There's also a lot of advocacy that we do with 941 00:52:02,040 --> 00:52:04,040 Speaker 2: elected officials, right. We have to spend a lot of 942 00:52:04,040 --> 00:52:07,640 Speaker 2: time with not only elected officials, but government agencies on 943 00:52:07,680 --> 00:52:11,560 Speaker 2: the state, federal, sometimes in city level, trying to make 944 00:52:11,600 --> 00:52:15,920 Speaker 2: sure economic opportunity is awarded fairly because for a long time, 945 00:52:16,480 --> 00:52:19,720 Speaker 2: you know, we were persona non grata, there was nothing 946 00:52:19,760 --> 00:52:22,200 Speaker 2: coming to us. And it's a shame because you have 947 00:52:22,320 --> 00:52:26,920 Speaker 2: in most urban environments, in most cities around the country, 948 00:52:27,280 --> 00:52:31,120 Speaker 2: no mayor gets elected without the black vote. So we're 949 00:52:31,120 --> 00:52:33,239 Speaker 2: going to put people in office we to make sure 950 00:52:33,280 --> 00:52:35,480 Speaker 2: we get in a piece of economic pie. So we'd 951 00:52:35,520 --> 00:52:39,200 Speaker 2: love to take Iraq or an organization like Iraq nationally 952 00:52:39,719 --> 00:52:43,759 Speaker 2: and have the same type of contract and the same 953 00:52:43,800 --> 00:52:47,680 Speaker 2: type of mechanisms we use here replicated around the country. 954 00:52:47,920 --> 00:52:49,840 Speaker 2: So what's the deal with the Affirmation. 955 00:52:49,920 --> 00:52:52,880 Speaker 4: Tell last time we spoke to Don, I know it 956 00:52:53,040 --> 00:52:55,120 Speaker 4: was some issues, but I think there's been even more 957 00:52:55,200 --> 00:52:59,840 Speaker 4: issues right since then. So what's the latest update, Affirmation 958 00:53:00,239 --> 00:53:02,560 Speaker 4: and explain it to affirmationself anybody that might not be so. 959 00:53:02,560 --> 00:53:07,520 Speaker 2: Affirmation Tower is a project that was conceived by Don Peebles, 960 00:53:08,360 --> 00:53:10,719 Speaker 2: probably you know, a year and a half ago, maybe 961 00:53:10,719 --> 00:53:14,240 Speaker 2: a little bit longer, in response to an RFP issued 962 00:53:14,239 --> 00:53:18,840 Speaker 2: by New York State's economic development agency called ESD Empire 963 00:53:18,840 --> 00:53:23,520 Speaker 2: State Development and it leverages site K explain what an 964 00:53:23,560 --> 00:53:26,680 Speaker 2: RFP is, and RFP is a request for proposals. So 965 00:53:26,719 --> 00:53:30,640 Speaker 2: when a government wants to do something, they have to 966 00:53:30,680 --> 00:53:32,960 Speaker 2: spend some money on a project, or they want to 967 00:53:33,000 --> 00:53:34,960 Speaker 2: develop a site, they will put it out to the 968 00:53:35,000 --> 00:53:38,880 Speaker 2: public and ask for requests for proposals of like how 969 00:53:38,920 --> 00:53:42,680 Speaker 2: would you develop it? And so Don came up with 970 00:53:42,920 --> 00:53:45,960 Speaker 2: an idea leveraging a concept that he thought of a 971 00:53:45,960 --> 00:53:52,360 Speaker 2: while ago called affirmative development, which is proactively doing development 972 00:53:52,400 --> 00:53:55,960 Speaker 2: in an inclusive way and affirming that folks like me 973 00:53:56,080 --> 00:53:59,440 Speaker 2: and him and Cheryl and others can participate in real 974 00:53:59,520 --> 00:54:02,280 Speaker 2: estate developm at the highest levels. So we put together 975 00:54:02,960 --> 00:54:05,400 Speaker 2: an RFP to build, you know, one of the tallest 976 00:54:05,400 --> 00:54:07,640 Speaker 2: buildings in the world, definitely the tallest in the Western 977 00:54:07,680 --> 00:54:12,399 Speaker 2: Hemisphere by floor height. But our spire is below the 978 00:54:12,400 --> 00:54:17,360 Speaker 2: spire of the World of will Trade, the Freedom Tower, 979 00:54:17,400 --> 00:54:21,160 Speaker 2: because you know what it represents. But the idea is, 980 00:54:21,200 --> 00:54:24,120 Speaker 2: you know, in twenty twenty two, we should not be 981 00:54:24,120 --> 00:54:28,000 Speaker 2: talking about this as a first right, There's been no 982 00:54:28,080 --> 00:54:32,320 Speaker 2: skyscraper in New York City built by black folks or 983 00:54:32,400 --> 00:54:34,719 Speaker 2: owned by black people. We've probably toiled on it and 984 00:54:34,719 --> 00:54:38,160 Speaker 2: spent a lot of time working, laboring, but not owning 985 00:54:38,200 --> 00:54:40,200 Speaker 2: and not doing it as a developer. So it's time, 986 00:54:40,719 --> 00:54:45,359 Speaker 2: you know, to have that barrier broken. And what we're 987 00:54:45,360 --> 00:54:47,520 Speaker 2: looking to do there is to build, like I said, 988 00:54:47,560 --> 00:54:50,680 Speaker 2: the tallest tower in the Western hemisphere. We're going to 989 00:54:50,760 --> 00:54:55,240 Speaker 2: put the offices of the NAACP in there. A civil 990 00:54:55,320 --> 00:54:59,120 Speaker 2: rights museum as well. There would be all kinds of 991 00:54:59,120 --> 00:55:01,720 Speaker 2: great features of rink on the on the roof, there'd 992 00:55:01,760 --> 00:55:05,479 Speaker 2: be a public atriums. And you know, we want young 993 00:55:06,239 --> 00:55:07,960 Speaker 2: black and brown children to be able to come to 994 00:55:08,000 --> 00:55:09,480 Speaker 2: New York City and point to that and say, hey, 995 00:55:09,520 --> 00:55:11,760 Speaker 2: you know, somebody looks like me and my father built 996 00:55:11,760 --> 00:55:15,319 Speaker 2: that project, right, Because like I started by talking about 997 00:55:15,320 --> 00:55:18,120 Speaker 2: Reginald Lewis, right and what that inspired in my life. 998 00:55:18,200 --> 00:55:20,839 Speaker 2: We need to inspire the life of these next generations 999 00:55:21,000 --> 00:55:22,600 Speaker 2: and need to understand that they could do it too. 1000 00:55:23,160 --> 00:55:24,799 Speaker 2: So what what's the issues right now? But it was 1001 00:55:25,760 --> 00:55:30,120 Speaker 2: political issues? Yeah, political, I mean the governor Hochal rescinded 1002 00:55:30,120 --> 00:55:35,000 Speaker 2: the RFP when I'm not really clear. I think it 1003 00:55:35,040 --> 00:55:37,480 Speaker 2: was a bad move. I don't think it was wise 1004 00:55:37,520 --> 00:55:40,759 Speaker 2: at all, because you know, what's what the reason she 1005 00:55:40,840 --> 00:55:46,200 Speaker 2: said was they wanted to rescind the RFP to uh 1006 00:55:47,160 --> 00:55:49,520 Speaker 2: RE examine it so that it could align closer to 1007 00:55:49,520 --> 00:55:52,279 Speaker 2: her priorities, whatever that means. It was previously approved by 1008 00:55:52,400 --> 00:55:55,000 Speaker 2: Governor Cuomo, was it wasn't approved, it was issued by 1009 00:55:55,040 --> 00:55:58,399 Speaker 2: Governor Cuomo, and we were doing fantastically well. I think 1010 00:55:58,400 --> 00:56:03,040 Speaker 2: the public response to the project was amazing. And you know, 1011 00:56:03,120 --> 00:56:10,440 Speaker 2: I think a lot of times in democratic strategists underestimate 1012 00:56:10,520 --> 00:56:14,880 Speaker 2: how important economic development and economic empowerment and wealth generation 1013 00:56:15,000 --> 00:56:17,960 Speaker 2: is to our community. Right. They tend to want to 1014 00:56:18,160 --> 00:56:20,960 Speaker 2: dangle the same old poverty politics in front of us 1015 00:56:21,280 --> 00:56:24,719 Speaker 2: that we've experienced for the past fifty years that haven't 1016 00:56:24,719 --> 00:56:29,080 Speaker 2: gotten us anywhere, right. I mean, you government programs, government programs, 1017 00:56:29,120 --> 00:56:32,799 Speaker 2: you know, social programs. You look at you know there's 1018 00:56:32,840 --> 00:56:35,520 Speaker 2: been there's tons, and there's billions and billions of dollars 1019 00:56:35,600 --> 00:56:38,480 Speaker 2: spent just in this city, in this state, every single 1020 00:56:38,560 --> 00:56:41,720 Speaker 2: year on social programs, and we're not moving the needle. 1021 00:56:42,120 --> 00:56:45,520 Speaker 2: But if we spend half of that in economic development 1022 00:56:46,400 --> 00:56:50,000 Speaker 2: and investing in black companies, I guarantee the needle will move. 1023 00:56:51,719 --> 00:56:52,960 Speaker 2: Let's talk about the collaboration. 1024 00:56:53,120 --> 00:56:57,239 Speaker 5: Obviously, we spoke about Don working with Cheryl mckisney on 1025 00:56:57,320 --> 00:56:58,200 Speaker 5: this project together. 1026 00:56:58,280 --> 00:57:00,479 Speaker 2: I feel like this is the Avengers of real estate 1027 00:57:00,480 --> 00:57:02,880 Speaker 2: for our community for sure. What's that been like? 1028 00:57:02,960 --> 00:57:05,279 Speaker 5: How did you all come together to say, all right, 1029 00:57:05,280 --> 00:57:07,280 Speaker 5: this is what I'm bringing, this is what your team's bringing. 1030 00:57:07,600 --> 00:57:09,800 Speaker 5: Here is what we're going to bring. Let's combine efforts 1031 00:57:09,800 --> 00:57:11,799 Speaker 5: and build something that's going to be legendary in the start. 1032 00:57:12,040 --> 00:57:14,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, again, I have to compliment Don for his vision 1033 00:57:14,760 --> 00:57:17,880 Speaker 2: of being inclusive and collaborative and setting a standard of 1034 00:57:17,920 --> 00:57:21,280 Speaker 2: how we should be doing business together. Right. And you know, 1035 00:57:21,360 --> 00:57:23,840 Speaker 2: Don and Cheryl had known each other for a long time, 1036 00:57:23,960 --> 00:57:26,919 Speaker 2: going back to her days I think at Howard when 1037 00:57:27,200 --> 00:57:29,960 Speaker 2: they used to hang out and party and everything. And 1038 00:57:30,080 --> 00:57:32,360 Speaker 2: you know, we knew each other from our work together 1039 00:57:32,400 --> 00:57:36,440 Speaker 2: at IREK and you know I joined the board and 1040 00:57:36,480 --> 00:57:39,360 Speaker 2: we got along very well, and we have our own 1041 00:57:39,720 --> 00:57:42,000 Speaker 2: momentum and what we do. We're you know, very very 1042 00:57:42,040 --> 00:57:45,160 Speaker 2: active and very efficient in the capital markets, and so 1043 00:57:45,240 --> 00:57:47,600 Speaker 2: we're able to bring that acumen too the project in 1044 00:57:47,720 --> 00:57:51,000 Speaker 2: terms of raising capital and project management and the like. 1045 00:57:51,480 --> 00:57:58,400 Speaker 2: But the the the opportunity to collaborate with them. I mean, 1046 00:57:58,440 --> 00:58:01,280 Speaker 2: Don is the most successful America real estate developer in 1047 00:58:01,320 --> 00:58:04,480 Speaker 2: the country, right, so he brings a whole different level 1048 00:58:05,080 --> 00:58:09,400 Speaker 2: of this business and a whole different level of development 1049 00:58:09,400 --> 00:58:11,360 Speaker 2: to us because we would not have been trying to 1050 00:58:11,360 --> 00:58:14,480 Speaker 2: build a skyscrape or absent being invited into this project. 1051 00:58:14,840 --> 00:58:18,760 Speaker 2: And Cheryl is you know, she is the owner of 1052 00:58:18,920 --> 00:58:23,560 Speaker 2: the oldest black construction company in the country, started by 1053 00:58:23,560 --> 00:58:27,080 Speaker 2: her fifth generation grandfathers who were slaves. I mean, you 1054 00:58:27,080 --> 00:58:29,200 Speaker 2: can't have a better story than that. So you have 1055 00:58:29,280 --> 00:58:33,520 Speaker 2: this team to come together and to put together what 1056 00:58:33,760 --> 00:58:39,160 Speaker 2: should be a barrier breaking project, and for us to 1057 00:58:39,240 --> 00:58:41,760 Speaker 2: change the skyline of New York City and to say 1058 00:58:41,760 --> 00:58:45,080 Speaker 2: it was done by a black team is an amazing opportunity. 1059 00:58:45,120 --> 00:58:48,439 Speaker 2: So we remain vigilant. And you know, we talk about 1060 00:58:48,440 --> 00:58:50,760 Speaker 2: Affirmation Tower all the time. I think Don just got 1061 00:58:50,760 --> 00:58:53,040 Speaker 2: a Grill award a couple of days ago, which is, 1062 00:58:53,080 --> 00:58:57,520 Speaker 2: you know, big shout out to Don. And you know, 1063 00:58:57,560 --> 00:59:01,080 Speaker 2: we were looking for the r to be reissued. Now 1064 00:59:01,120 --> 00:59:04,440 Speaker 2: that governor Local has been re elected, that should be 1065 00:59:04,480 --> 00:59:06,800 Speaker 2: happening soon. And when it is reissued, we'll be all 1066 00:59:06,840 --> 00:59:09,160 Speaker 2: over it. You know, We're we are determined to win it. 1067 00:59:09,840 --> 00:59:13,960 Speaker 2: So that's the city owns the land, the state, the 1068 00:59:14,080 --> 00:59:17,800 Speaker 2: state owns the land. Yeah, okay, And it's right, and 1069 00:59:18,000 --> 00:59:22,920 Speaker 2: it's right in you know, Hudson Yards, right, So Javitt 1070 00:59:23,080 --> 00:59:25,880 Speaker 2: the site k is right across the street from Hudson Yards. 1071 00:59:25,880 --> 00:59:28,600 Speaker 2: So you think about it. Right, they gave a tremendous 1072 00:59:28,640 --> 00:59:32,840 Speaker 2: amount of land to relate it and then gave them 1073 00:59:32,880 --> 00:59:36,600 Speaker 2: billions of dollars in subsidy. Now they're talking about, you know, 1074 00:59:36,680 --> 00:59:41,680 Speaker 2: giving eighteen million square feet of land around Penn Station 1075 00:59:42,240 --> 00:59:46,240 Speaker 2: to Fernado. Right, we just want the opportunity to buy 1076 00:59:47,040 --> 00:59:51,320 Speaker 2: site case so we could do Affirmation Tower and we're 1077 00:59:51,320 --> 00:59:52,600 Speaker 2: not even looking for public subsidy. 1078 00:59:52,640 --> 00:59:55,120 Speaker 4: So the since the city owns the land, well they 1079 00:59:55,360 --> 00:59:57,240 Speaker 4: have ownership or the land or will you buy the 1080 00:59:57,320 --> 00:59:58,000 Speaker 4: land from this city? 1081 00:59:58,000 --> 01:00:00,280 Speaker 2: We'll do like a like a one hundred year ground lease, 1082 01:00:00,320 --> 01:00:02,760 Speaker 2: which is basically the same as buying it. What does 1083 01:00:02,840 --> 01:00:05,760 Speaker 2: that mean? Ground lease? So ground lease is like you know, 1084 01:00:06,600 --> 01:00:09,760 Speaker 2: we have the we pay a ground lease rent on 1085 01:00:09,840 --> 01:00:14,400 Speaker 2: an annual basis, but we get to own and operate 1086 01:00:14,520 --> 01:00:17,720 Speaker 2: the improvements on the land for that hundred years, so 1087 01:00:17,760 --> 01:00:18,680 Speaker 2: we'll build you know. 1088 01:00:19,360 --> 01:00:21,520 Speaker 4: Uh, so you're leasing the land for one hundred years. Yeah, 1089 01:00:21,640 --> 01:00:24,160 Speaker 4: So so the city still owns it, right, the state, 1090 01:00:24,360 --> 01:00:26,360 Speaker 4: the state would own you have control. We have control over. 1091 01:00:26,520 --> 01:00:28,000 Speaker 4: Just pay the rent. So the thing about this, So 1092 01:00:28,160 --> 01:00:31,080 Speaker 4: you guys have spent time down on Wall Street, right, 1093 01:00:31,320 --> 01:00:34,080 Speaker 4: So there's a little church down there on Broadway, Trinity Church. 1094 01:00:34,440 --> 01:00:37,360 Speaker 4: Trinity Church owns a ton of the land that those 1095 01:00:37,360 --> 01:00:39,760 Speaker 4: skyscrapers are built on. They've owned it for hundreds of years. 1096 01:00:39,880 --> 01:00:44,080 Speaker 4: They just lease it to different developers and financial institutions 1097 01:00:44,080 --> 01:00:47,080 Speaker 4: who build what they build, and they're just collecting ground 1098 01:00:47,120 --> 01:00:48,720 Speaker 4: lease rent. It's really good business model. 1099 01:00:48,800 --> 01:00:50,800 Speaker 2: So who owns most of the land in New York 1100 01:00:50,840 --> 01:00:53,080 Speaker 2: City like the land? No, not, not a lot of 1101 01:00:53,160 --> 01:00:55,600 Speaker 2: land is ground leased. Most land is owned fees, simple, 1102 01:00:55,640 --> 01:00:58,400 Speaker 2: but sometimes folks who choose to structured ground leases for 1103 01:00:58,440 --> 01:01:01,400 Speaker 2: whatever reason. If you're in a really you know, high 1104 01:01:01,760 --> 01:01:04,760 Speaker 2: demand area that's super valuable, why sell it. You could 1105 01:01:04,760 --> 01:01:07,040 Speaker 2: ground lease it and one hundred years from now your 1106 01:01:07,160 --> 01:01:11,959 Speaker 2: errors could still be collecting ground lease rent. Yeah. 1107 01:01:11,960 --> 01:01:16,880 Speaker 4: That So most skyscrapers that are being built, the developers 1108 01:01:16,880 --> 01:01:17,400 Speaker 4: don't own that. 1109 01:01:17,600 --> 01:01:19,400 Speaker 2: No, not most, but there's just that. That's just been 1110 01:01:19,440 --> 01:01:21,640 Speaker 2: the model that said Trinity Church there, some some do. 1111 01:01:21,840 --> 01:01:22,880 Speaker 2: Some they just buy it. 1112 01:01:22,960 --> 01:01:25,720 Speaker 4: Whoever owned it previously, they would sell them the land 1113 01:01:26,400 --> 01:01:30,320 Speaker 4: as part of the deal, right, or like if somebody's 1114 01:01:30,320 --> 01:01:34,880 Speaker 4: building a skyscraper. Yeah, they're buying the land most of 1115 01:01:34,920 --> 01:01:35,240 Speaker 4: the time. 1116 01:01:35,600 --> 01:01:38,480 Speaker 2: Most of the time, the more common execution is people 1117 01:01:38,560 --> 01:01:41,040 Speaker 2: just buy the dirt right from whoever owns it. From 1118 01:01:41,040 --> 01:01:45,600 Speaker 2: whoever owns it in some some instances maybe a family, 1119 01:01:46,040 --> 01:01:47,800 Speaker 2: a trust, whatever, they don't want to sell it, so 1120 01:01:47,840 --> 01:01:49,720 Speaker 2: let's say we'll lease it just collect income. 1121 01:01:50,640 --> 01:01:52,840 Speaker 4: So that church, Trinity Church you said, owns a lot 1122 01:01:52,840 --> 01:01:54,160 Speaker 4: of land in Wall Street area. 1123 01:01:54,240 --> 01:01:57,440 Speaker 2: Yeah, and how long have they had that land since? 1124 01:01:57,480 --> 01:01:59,360 Speaker 2: I mean like when there was no buildings there. Yeah, 1125 01:01:59,560 --> 01:02:00,600 Speaker 2: when it was arm was dirt. 1126 01:02:00,600 --> 01:02:04,440 Speaker 4: When they just took it from Americans pretty good, basically 1127 01:02:04,560 --> 01:02:05,440 Speaker 4: back to New Amsterdam. 1128 01:02:07,920 --> 01:02:08,800 Speaker 2: This is what I don't know. 1129 01:02:08,840 --> 01:02:10,400 Speaker 4: I don't know the source of how they acquired it. 1130 01:02:10,400 --> 01:02:12,920 Speaker 4: I mean, not like the church took it. They might have, 1131 01:02:13,400 --> 01:02:17,560 Speaker 4: but I'm just saying eventually that's what happened, right Like, 1132 01:02:17,680 --> 01:02:20,960 Speaker 4: it was here the guy control and they got control 1133 01:02:21,000 --> 01:02:23,240 Speaker 4: over and then they just kind of ciphered it off 1134 01:02:23,280 --> 01:02:26,960 Speaker 4: to whoever the new landowner was. Didn't They didn't own 1135 01:02:27,000 --> 01:02:28,160 Speaker 4: it originally. 1136 01:02:27,840 --> 01:02:30,360 Speaker 2: No, somebody because back in the you know, when the 1137 01:02:30,360 --> 01:02:32,760 Speaker 2: Indians your head, they didn't believe in ownership of land 1138 01:02:33,000 --> 01:02:34,040 Speaker 2: is everybody's land. 1139 01:02:34,080 --> 01:02:38,360 Speaker 4: Exactly, but now it's worth more money than anything else 1140 01:02:38,400 --> 01:02:38,760 Speaker 4: in the world. 1141 01:02:38,800 --> 01:02:40,800 Speaker 2: It's worth a lot, a whole lot, a whole lot, 1142 01:02:40,920 --> 01:02:41,280 Speaker 2: very part. 1143 01:02:41,360 --> 01:02:44,680 Speaker 5: Yeah, I wonder now, like going through this process, obviously 1144 01:02:44,720 --> 01:02:49,560 Speaker 5: seeing the politics of of the space, does it discourage 1145 01:02:49,560 --> 01:02:51,920 Speaker 5: you or are we looking? Are you now looking as 1146 01:02:51,960 --> 01:02:55,439 Speaker 5: a firm right? Where else are we going to make 1147 01:02:55,480 --> 01:02:56,000 Speaker 5: a statement? 1148 01:02:56,080 --> 01:02:56,240 Speaker 2: Right? 1149 01:02:56,240 --> 01:02:58,480 Speaker 5: Like New York City is prime because of what it 1150 01:02:58,560 --> 01:03:01,400 Speaker 5: means to the country's financial the world, But are there 1151 01:03:01,440 --> 01:03:04,120 Speaker 5: other places where we're looking to make just as much 1152 01:03:04,160 --> 01:03:06,440 Speaker 5: of an impact with some of the developments that you 1153 01:03:06,440 --> 01:03:06,880 Speaker 5: haven't money? 1154 01:03:06,960 --> 01:03:09,080 Speaker 2: So you know, there's only one New York City, right, 1155 01:03:09,120 --> 01:03:12,680 Speaker 2: And I've lived through two world coming to an end 1156 01:03:12,680 --> 01:03:16,600 Speaker 2: scenario nine to eleven, the financial collapse, Well now three COVID, 1157 01:03:17,080 --> 01:03:20,040 Speaker 2: and I'll tell you I think we're still bouncing back 1158 01:03:20,080 --> 01:03:22,640 Speaker 2: from COVID. There's been some other issues that are creating 1159 01:03:22,680 --> 01:03:25,520 Speaker 2: headwinds for us, like the crime and some other stuff. 1160 01:03:25,520 --> 01:03:30,000 Speaker 2: But with nine to eleven and the financial collapse, I mean, 1161 01:03:30,000 --> 01:03:33,280 Speaker 2: New York City bounce back. It's super resilient. There's one 1162 01:03:33,360 --> 01:03:37,960 Speaker 2: New York City. It's a global city. And I wouldn't 1163 01:03:38,000 --> 01:03:41,280 Speaker 2: bet against New York. Ever. However, what we're doing is 1164 01:03:41,280 --> 01:03:45,720 Speaker 2: we're diversifying as a company, and we love some markets 1165 01:03:45,760 --> 01:03:48,120 Speaker 2: in the southeast and out west and the Midwest. So 1166 01:03:49,000 --> 01:03:52,440 Speaker 2: we're really heavy in Atlanta. I mean, Georgia is amazing 1167 01:03:52,480 --> 01:03:55,240 Speaker 2: what's going on there. We just know we want to 1168 01:03:55,240 --> 01:04:00,840 Speaker 2: continue to invest and help that city transitioning grow. We're 1169 01:04:00,840 --> 01:04:06,320 Speaker 2: doing stuff in Columbia, South Carolina. We're in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma. 1170 01:04:07,800 --> 01:04:12,520 Speaker 2: We did deals in Indianapolis, Indiana. There's a lot of 1171 01:04:13,280 --> 01:04:18,520 Speaker 2: opportunity everywhere. And by the way, not every type of 1172 01:04:18,520 --> 01:04:20,400 Speaker 2: deals right for every type of market. You have to 1173 01:04:20,400 --> 01:04:23,160 Speaker 2: do the right deal in that market, right. So you know, 1174 01:04:23,160 --> 01:04:27,000 Speaker 2: we wouldn't build Affirmation Tower in Indianapolis, Indiana. It's not 1175 01:04:27,040 --> 01:04:31,640 Speaker 2: the right market, but it's it's the right project for 1176 01:04:31,760 --> 01:04:34,880 Speaker 2: New York City. So we're doing a lot of things. 1177 01:04:34,920 --> 01:04:38,440 Speaker 2: And you know, our number one market right now for 1178 01:04:38,520 --> 01:04:42,280 Speaker 2: investment going forward is Atlanta. Why are you so bullje 1179 01:04:42,360 --> 01:04:45,800 Speaker 2: on Atlanta? It has all the right demographics, so you know, 1180 01:04:46,240 --> 01:04:50,000 Speaker 2: population growth, a lot of companies are moving there. When 1181 01:04:50,000 --> 01:04:56,200 Speaker 2: you look at the the amount of new job creation, 1182 01:04:57,040 --> 01:04:59,080 Speaker 2: a lot of companies want to relocate out of the 1183 01:04:59,120 --> 01:05:02,920 Speaker 2: northeast out of foreign of these heavy tax states, Uh, 1184 01:05:03,000 --> 01:05:07,680 Speaker 2: these heavy bureaucratic states, it's so much easier to function 1185 01:05:07,800 --> 01:05:09,840 Speaker 2: some of these other markets. Like you know, there's a 1186 01:05:09,880 --> 01:05:12,800 Speaker 2: reason why Elon Musk moved Tesla to Texas. Right, there's 1187 01:05:12,800 --> 01:05:16,200 Speaker 2: a reason why you know, ge left Connecticut went to Boston. 1188 01:05:16,560 --> 01:05:19,640 Speaker 2: You know, companies have options they can choose, but the 1189 01:05:19,680 --> 01:05:24,480 Speaker 2: Southeast is really just a great markets created the right 1190 01:05:24,520 --> 01:05:28,680 Speaker 2: type of atmosphere. You have good educational institutions, you have 1191 01:05:28,720 --> 01:05:32,880 Speaker 2: great infrastructure, a government that's supportive of development and understands 1192 01:05:32,880 --> 01:05:34,800 Speaker 2: the importance of doing it the right way and is 1193 01:05:34,840 --> 01:05:37,680 Speaker 2: working collaboratively with the business community. The for is the 1194 01:05:37,760 --> 01:05:40,480 Speaker 2: right type of development. I think, you know, everything that 1195 01:05:41,880 --> 01:05:45,040 Speaker 2: Mary Dickens is doing in Atlanta is one percent spot on. 1196 01:05:45,360 --> 01:05:46,240 Speaker 2: He's doing the right thing. 1197 01:05:46,600 --> 01:05:50,360 Speaker 4: So that information, tew. What's the financing for that? How 1198 01:05:50,440 --> 01:05:51,000 Speaker 4: does that look? 1199 01:05:51,640 --> 01:05:55,440 Speaker 2: Oh man, that's about Uh I've looked at it in 1200 01:05:55,520 --> 01:05:57,600 Speaker 2: a minute. Well, you know, we've I'm sure we have 1201 01:05:57,600 --> 01:06:00,120 Speaker 2: to reprice everything at this point because the escalation and 1202 01:06:00,120 --> 01:06:03,600 Speaker 2: in construction costs. But that was a project that's going 1203 01:06:03,680 --> 01:06:09,040 Speaker 2: to be uh one point six billion dollars. 1204 01:06:08,840 --> 01:06:12,240 Speaker 4: So one point six million dollars and who are you 1205 01:06:12,280 --> 01:06:14,080 Speaker 4: getting the money from? Private equity firm? 1206 01:06:14,240 --> 01:06:17,560 Speaker 2: Right, so we'd have to raise limited partner LP equity 1207 01:06:18,160 --> 01:06:23,880 Speaker 2: from investment funds or you know, UH, insurance companies, you 1208 01:06:23,960 --> 01:06:26,640 Speaker 2: name it. But this that's an institutional asset where you're 1209 01:06:26,640 --> 01:06:29,080 Speaker 2: going to generate you know that. I mean that equity 1210 01:06:29,160 --> 01:06:31,200 Speaker 2: check is six hundred million dollars. How much money do 1211 01:06:31,240 --> 01:06:33,720 Speaker 2: you need to raise? So we'd have to raise I mean, 1212 01:06:34,440 --> 01:06:35,760 Speaker 2: none of us were rolling a wild with one point 1213 01:06:36,000 --> 01:06:38,400 Speaker 2: bill in the pocket. So we're gonna raise all of it. 1214 01:06:38,440 --> 01:06:40,560 Speaker 2: So you need to raise all of it. We're gonna 1215 01:06:40,600 --> 01:06:41,919 Speaker 2: raise all of it. So I mean there's a there's 1216 01:06:41,920 --> 01:06:43,680 Speaker 2: an amount of GP capital that has to go into 1217 01:06:43,800 --> 01:06:45,640 Speaker 2: So like Fidelia writes you a check for five hundred 1218 01:06:45,640 --> 01:06:50,800 Speaker 2: million dollars. Yeah, you know somebody Fidelity. I'm just saying hypothetical. Yeah, hypothetically, right, 1219 01:06:50,840 --> 01:06:53,000 Speaker 2: that's how So so we'd have so you have the 1220 01:06:53,040 --> 01:06:55,000 Speaker 2: capital stack will be like a billion in debt and 1221 01:06:55,040 --> 01:06:56,720 Speaker 2: that could come from and we've had I don't want 1222 01:06:56,720 --> 01:06:59,240 Speaker 2: to say it here, but we've had interest from some 1223 01:06:59,280 --> 01:07:02,480 Speaker 2: of the largest lenders in the world and some of 1224 01:07:02,520 --> 01:07:05,520 Speaker 2: the largest investors in the world. 1225 01:07:05,520 --> 01:07:08,080 Speaker 4: Too, and then for them, obviously like a bank, they 1226 01:07:08,120 --> 01:07:09,720 Speaker 4: get a return on their investment. 1227 01:07:09,400 --> 01:07:12,280 Speaker 2: Right to check. So the debt is, you know, you 1228 01:07:12,360 --> 01:07:14,280 Speaker 2: just pay interest on the debt, right, So we get 1229 01:07:14,280 --> 01:07:18,400 Speaker 2: a billion dollars in debt. You you're paying your six 1230 01:07:18,440 --> 01:07:22,800 Speaker 2: percent interest rate on that, okay, until it's repaid. And 1231 01:07:22,840 --> 01:07:25,000 Speaker 2: it gets repaid. The construction loan gets taken out with 1232 01:07:25,080 --> 01:07:27,760 Speaker 2: PERM financing when the when the project is done. But 1233 01:07:29,560 --> 01:07:31,640 Speaker 2: so you have construction financings, which is where we used 1234 01:07:31,640 --> 01:07:34,000 Speaker 2: to build it. Right, it's just a construction loan. So 1235 01:07:34,040 --> 01:07:37,160 Speaker 2: it's here's you know, a billion dollars six percent, So 1236 01:07:37,160 --> 01:07:40,120 Speaker 2: we're paying them sixty million dollars a year on the capitol. 1237 01:07:40,720 --> 01:07:45,160 Speaker 2: When you get the project finished, we put permanent financing 1238 01:07:45,160 --> 01:07:47,720 Speaker 2: on it. So like a ten year PERM loan, that 1239 01:07:47,840 --> 01:07:52,000 Speaker 2: amortis has some amortization features and we're just you know, 1240 01:07:52,040 --> 01:07:56,080 Speaker 2: we're still making monthly payments, but those payments really coming 1241 01:07:56,120 --> 01:08:00,560 Speaker 2: out of the operations of the building versus being finance 1242 01:08:00,640 --> 01:08:02,200 Speaker 2: is part of the construction loan. 1243 01:08:02,520 --> 01:08:05,760 Speaker 5: So even from the construction standpoint, I'm looking at at 1244 01:08:05,840 --> 01:08:09,400 Speaker 5: the trio of you guys, obviously you Cheryl and Don. 1245 01:08:10,480 --> 01:08:13,040 Speaker 5: The construction pieces is that where you lean on her 1246 01:08:13,080 --> 01:08:15,680 Speaker 5: for the expertise. Absolutely, all right, yeah, because I'm like 1247 01:08:15,680 --> 01:08:18,479 Speaker 5: we're combined the forces. That's her expertise. So mckisnick will 1248 01:08:18,520 --> 01:08:20,160 Speaker 5: be in charge of the construction. As far as all 1249 01:08:20,200 --> 01:08:23,280 Speaker 5: those loans, they'll be knocking that out. But as far 1250 01:08:23,320 --> 01:08:25,800 Speaker 5: as all the other opportunities inside there where we talked 1251 01:08:25,800 --> 01:08:29,080 Speaker 5: about are we looking to hire people that look like 1252 01:08:29,240 --> 01:08:31,439 Speaker 5: us to fulfill those roles. 1253 01:08:31,640 --> 01:08:35,479 Speaker 2: So our commitment is to spend a billion dollars with 1254 01:08:35,840 --> 01:08:44,720 Speaker 2: minority and women own companies. So okay, now this is 1255 01:08:44,720 --> 01:08:48,000 Speaker 2: going to be office space. It will be office and 1256 01:08:48,240 --> 01:08:52,080 Speaker 2: hotel a hotel. So office like we probably have a 1257 01:08:52,120 --> 01:08:57,000 Speaker 2: life science chooser which is a big growing area, and 1258 01:08:57,040 --> 01:09:00,760 Speaker 2: some two hotels actually well hotels, we have chosen them yet, 1259 01:09:00,800 --> 01:09:03,639 Speaker 2: but we have you know, so we have a idea 1260 01:09:03,680 --> 01:09:05,559 Speaker 2: of the type of hotels. So we do like a 1261 01:09:05,600 --> 01:09:11,840 Speaker 2: full service hotel and then maybe by h a what 1262 01:09:11,920 --> 01:09:14,080 Speaker 2: we call like a value hotel. What is a full 1263 01:09:14,120 --> 01:09:17,400 Speaker 2: service hotel? Something like you know the four seasons or 1264 01:09:18,000 --> 01:09:20,760 Speaker 2: you know where you have all of the you know, 1265 01:09:20,800 --> 01:09:25,800 Speaker 2: you have all the amenities, you have a certain level 1266 01:09:25,840 --> 01:09:30,280 Speaker 2: of operation and just you know, standard in terms of 1267 01:09:31,720 --> 01:09:35,360 Speaker 2: you know, concierge and spas and other. 1268 01:09:35,200 --> 01:09:37,639 Speaker 5: Things that are available. Who would fit in the category 1269 01:09:37,640 --> 01:09:40,720 Speaker 5: of value hotels. 1270 01:09:39,439 --> 01:09:42,360 Speaker 2: Something like a like a I'm not saying we're going 1271 01:09:42,439 --> 01:09:43,680 Speaker 2: to do this suld be at the hotel we do, 1272 01:09:43,880 --> 01:09:46,599 Speaker 2: but something like a like a pod hotel or something 1273 01:09:46,640 --> 01:09:51,160 Speaker 2: like the smaller hotels have some smaller rooms like boutique hotels. Well, 1274 01:09:51,320 --> 01:09:54,679 Speaker 2: smaller rooms, but just not as many amenity amenities. Okay, 1275 01:09:56,000 --> 01:09:58,920 Speaker 2: smaller rooms, less amenities, but also lower cost. 1276 01:09:59,000 --> 01:10:01,639 Speaker 4: So like no restaurant. You don't have a restaurant right right, 1277 01:10:01,760 --> 01:10:04,320 Speaker 4: there's no like twenty file room service, right. 1278 01:10:04,320 --> 01:10:06,840 Speaker 2: So that's what we call full service hotel. You have restaurants, 1279 01:10:06,960 --> 01:10:10,480 Speaker 2: room service, concierge, service spots those times. 1280 01:10:11,920 --> 01:10:16,519 Speaker 4: So for office space, are you concerned that the office 1281 01:10:16,520 --> 01:10:19,320 Speaker 4: space might be an issue going forward into the future 1282 01:10:19,320 --> 01:10:21,080 Speaker 4: when people might not be working from offices. 1283 01:10:21,439 --> 01:10:24,920 Speaker 2: No, because so I think you know what happens is 1284 01:10:25,000 --> 01:10:31,559 Speaker 2: there's always a new user one two. When you look 1285 01:10:31,600 --> 01:10:33,800 Speaker 2: at offices, they're not all the same. It's like, you know, 1286 01:10:34,720 --> 01:10:37,880 Speaker 2: they're not monolithic. You have buildings like one Vanderbilt that's 1287 01:10:37,960 --> 01:10:41,760 Speaker 2: leasing up at an incredible record setting numbers. But there's 1288 01:10:41,760 --> 01:10:44,439 Speaker 2: buildings you know, twenty blocks away. They can't get leased 1289 01:10:44,439 --> 01:10:47,200 Speaker 2: stuff that have vacant and if you're building, you know, 1290 01:10:47,400 --> 01:10:51,240 Speaker 2: the whole movement with ESG right now is that companies 1291 01:10:51,280 --> 01:10:53,439 Speaker 2: really want to be in buildings that are green, that 1292 01:10:53,560 --> 01:10:56,400 Speaker 2: have the right type of environmental footprint, that have been 1293 01:10:56,439 --> 01:10:59,960 Speaker 2: built a certain way, and are responsive to what share 1294 01:11:00,040 --> 01:11:03,480 Speaker 2: holders and their customers are demanding. That they'd be responsible 1295 01:11:03,479 --> 01:11:06,799 Speaker 2: corporate citizens. So to be able to offer you fortune 1296 01:11:06,840 --> 01:11:10,960 Speaker 2: five hundred companies the opportunity to you know, take space 1297 01:11:11,120 --> 01:11:15,840 Speaker 2: and a remarkable new tower like Affirmation Tower that has 1298 01:11:15,880 --> 01:11:19,720 Speaker 2: those types of features. You know, we've seen it work repeatedly. 1299 01:11:19,800 --> 01:11:23,120 Speaker 2: But it's because you're building the right type of building, 1300 01:11:23,200 --> 01:11:26,800 Speaker 2: not just you know, the old, you know, stale type 1301 01:11:26,800 --> 01:11:29,680 Speaker 2: of skyscrapers that have been built or office buildings that 1302 01:11:29,680 --> 01:11:32,960 Speaker 2: have been sitting there that you know just aren't interesting 1303 01:11:33,040 --> 01:11:35,599 Speaker 2: to you know, the architecture choices. 1304 01:11:35,680 --> 01:11:38,439 Speaker 5: The architecture looks incredible, and you said that, you know, 1305 01:11:38,479 --> 01:11:41,880 Speaker 5: you have to reassess obviously with supply chain issues and 1306 01:11:41,920 --> 01:11:45,640 Speaker 5: construction costs changing. Imagine now, like what would be the 1307 01:11:45,720 --> 01:11:48,400 Speaker 5: timeline to complete a project by estimate? 1308 01:11:48,439 --> 01:11:50,120 Speaker 2: What do you what do you think we would spend 1309 01:11:50,520 --> 01:11:54,240 Speaker 2: once awarded. We're going to spend about a year maybe 1310 01:11:54,280 --> 01:11:56,519 Speaker 2: fifteen eighteen months in pre development, and then we're going 1311 01:11:56,520 --> 01:12:01,679 Speaker 2: to take you know, three years to build it with Yeah, are. 1312 01:12:01,600 --> 01:12:03,800 Speaker 5: You finding a new affinity for the skyscrapers? Obviously you're 1313 01:12:03,800 --> 01:12:05,960 Speaker 5: doing for affordable housing. This is obviously something that you 1314 01:12:05,960 --> 01:12:08,160 Speaker 5: said don had a vision for. Is that something now 1315 01:12:08,160 --> 01:12:09,960 Speaker 5: that you're looking like, you know, I could do more 1316 01:12:09,960 --> 01:12:10,080 Speaker 5: of this? 1317 01:12:10,320 --> 01:12:12,759 Speaker 2: Well, you know what our firm is really multi strategy. 1318 01:12:12,840 --> 01:12:17,280 Speaker 2: So we have our business models where we do probably 1319 01:12:17,280 --> 01:12:19,320 Speaker 2: seventy percent of what we do is affordable housing, but 1320 01:12:19,360 --> 01:12:25,080 Speaker 2: we do other things. We do hotels, we do market 1321 01:12:25,160 --> 01:12:29,639 Speaker 2: rate projects, we do condos. Right, So how our business 1322 01:12:29,840 --> 01:12:32,960 Speaker 2: model is morphed is we're doing a lot more placemaking now, 1323 01:12:33,320 --> 01:12:36,600 Speaker 2: so less individual buildings. We still have a pipeline of 1324 01:12:36,600 --> 01:12:39,360 Speaker 2: buildings that we're completing, but we're doing less of that 1325 01:12:39,479 --> 01:12:42,599 Speaker 2: and more place making like what you see in Marta 1326 01:12:42,800 --> 01:12:46,720 Speaker 2: in Atlanta, where you know, there's a whole opportunity to 1327 01:12:46,760 --> 01:12:50,000 Speaker 2: develop a large tract of land, but to do it 1328 01:12:50,040 --> 01:12:54,920 Speaker 2: where there's office, there's hospitality, there's housing, mixed income housing, 1329 01:12:55,280 --> 01:12:59,439 Speaker 2: and it's also adjacent to public transportation, so it's like 1330 01:12:59,479 --> 01:13:03,840 Speaker 2: a destined and it's like a live work, play type community. 1331 01:13:04,240 --> 01:13:09,040 Speaker 2: We really like that model a lot more. And ahead 1332 01:13:09,080 --> 01:13:12,040 Speaker 2: of us, you know, we're going to be doing deals 1333 01:13:12,080 --> 01:13:14,080 Speaker 2: that look like that, which are much larger in size. 1334 01:13:14,560 --> 01:13:16,960 Speaker 2: I have the luxury were doing fewer of them and 1335 01:13:17,000 --> 01:13:19,360 Speaker 2: still putting a lot of capital to work. 1336 01:13:20,640 --> 01:13:25,200 Speaker 4: So just came back from Dubai and Abu Dhabi and 1337 01:13:25,760 --> 01:13:29,920 Speaker 4: the architecture out there is amazing, all modern buildings, but 1338 01:13:30,360 --> 01:13:35,160 Speaker 4: they're very it's like art as well. Right in New York, 1339 01:13:35,240 --> 01:13:37,479 Speaker 4: I don't really see that level of inspiration. It's not 1340 01:13:37,720 --> 01:13:42,639 Speaker 4: as inspirational with the architectural design of the landscape where 1341 01:13:42,720 --> 01:13:45,160 Speaker 4: they have like the sailboat building, even the berge of Khalifa, 1342 01:13:45,240 --> 01:13:47,519 Speaker 4: like how it's designed, the colors on it is. So 1343 01:13:47,560 --> 01:13:50,040 Speaker 4: I say, I have to say, just like when I 1344 01:13:50,040 --> 01:13:53,000 Speaker 4: look at the architecture, it's art as well, right, what 1345 01:13:53,000 --> 01:13:55,120 Speaker 4: that would make sense because the architecture some level of 1346 01:13:55,240 --> 01:13:58,840 Speaker 4: art in there, but I don't see that here. So 1347 01:13:59,080 --> 01:14:02,719 Speaker 4: when you're developing your buildings, do you have that level 1348 01:14:02,760 --> 01:14:05,040 Speaker 4: of art or is that something that you can't do 1349 01:14:05,120 --> 01:14:07,880 Speaker 4: because of the city puts limitations on it. Why don't 1350 01:14:07,880 --> 01:14:10,439 Speaker 4: we see that same level of creativity here one weird 1351 01:14:10,479 --> 01:14:12,439 Speaker 4: building and we and what we see over there. 1352 01:14:12,720 --> 01:14:17,320 Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, you know, historically architecture has been very artistic. 1353 01:14:17,360 --> 01:14:19,760 Speaker 2: If you look at some of those older buildings, like 1354 01:14:19,840 --> 01:14:23,280 Speaker 2: the Baroque style or Renaissance revival or some of the 1355 01:14:23,400 --> 01:14:26,360 Speaker 2: you know, French colonials, you have all this, you know, 1356 01:14:26,720 --> 01:14:30,479 Speaker 2: ornate features that are in buildings. You know a lot 1357 01:14:30,520 --> 01:14:33,280 Speaker 2: of sculpting, Gorgyle's all those kinds of things. It used 1358 01:14:33,280 --> 01:14:36,200 Speaker 2: to be very artistic. I just think from a design 1359 01:14:36,240 --> 01:14:39,679 Speaker 2: aesthetic we've gone away from it unfortunately just as a culture. 1360 01:14:39,880 --> 01:14:42,280 Speaker 2: As a culture. Yeah, And and the other thing about 1361 01:14:42,320 --> 01:14:43,840 Speaker 2: when you're talking about the Middle East and some of 1362 01:14:43,880 --> 01:14:47,840 Speaker 2: those other areas, I mean they can you have those times. 1363 01:14:47,840 --> 01:14:49,639 Speaker 2: I mean like Dubai, right, that's a city that came 1364 01:14:49,680 --> 01:14:52,360 Speaker 2: about of the sand because they had a vision and 1365 01:14:52,400 --> 01:14:54,360 Speaker 2: they were like, listen, we have a blank canvas. We 1366 01:14:54,400 --> 01:14:59,040 Speaker 2: want to be world renowned and they intentionally aims really high. 1367 01:14:59,439 --> 01:15:01,600 Speaker 2: Here it's a little bit more difficult because if I 1368 01:15:01,640 --> 01:15:03,840 Speaker 2: want to build, you know, a building the size of 1369 01:15:03,840 --> 01:15:06,439 Speaker 2: the birds Kalifa, there's going to be protests, There's gonna 1370 01:15:06,439 --> 01:15:09,400 Speaker 2: be politicians, there's gonna be a lot of opposition to it. 1371 01:15:09,520 --> 01:15:12,760 Speaker 2: We just have a freer society where people have the 1372 01:15:12,840 --> 01:15:16,479 Speaker 2: opportunity to you know, have their voices heard, and you know, 1373 01:15:16,520 --> 01:15:19,120 Speaker 2: whether they have a dollar in it or not, they 1374 01:15:19,120 --> 01:15:21,800 Speaker 2: still have the opportunity to you know, opine on it. 1375 01:15:21,840 --> 01:15:26,040 Speaker 2: And sometimes consensus or opposition is built around a project 1376 01:15:26,080 --> 01:15:27,960 Speaker 2: and just creates a lot more difficulty. So are you 1377 01:15:28,000 --> 01:15:31,800 Speaker 2: looking to develop anything overseas? Yes, we are. That was 1378 01:15:31,840 --> 01:15:33,760 Speaker 2: going to be my next point, right, Like you're bringing 1379 01:15:33,760 --> 01:15:37,800 Speaker 2: that up, like we're actually, uh, we're actually I can't 1380 01:15:37,800 --> 01:15:40,680 Speaker 2: get too much into it, but we're actually negotiating with 1381 01:15:40,760 --> 01:15:44,360 Speaker 2: the government to start building some transformative real estate in 1382 01:15:44,439 --> 01:15:49,760 Speaker 2: a Caribbean country. Ah makes sense, Yeah, a lot of sense. 1383 01:15:49,880 --> 01:15:53,080 Speaker 5: So we got over three thousand units of housing in 1384 01:15:53,120 --> 01:15:55,640 Speaker 5: New York City. I wonder if there's a goal or 1385 01:15:55,640 --> 01:15:59,160 Speaker 5: if there's a number of housing opportunities that you want 1386 01:15:59,160 --> 01:16:01,400 Speaker 5: to create a firm you know. 1387 01:16:01,439 --> 01:16:04,320 Speaker 2: See that's the thing, right, the beautiful thing about See, 1388 01:16:04,320 --> 01:16:09,120 Speaker 2: I'm I love sports and I love competition, right, and 1389 01:16:09,160 --> 01:16:11,000 Speaker 2: what goes with that is a scoreboard. For me, the 1390 01:16:11,000 --> 01:16:14,160 Speaker 2: scoreboard is how many units we own. So we'd like 1391 01:16:14,240 --> 01:16:20,040 Speaker 2: to have fifty thousand, but little over five, right, So 1392 01:16:20,080 --> 01:16:21,640 Speaker 2: we have some in other areas of the country, but 1393 01:16:21,720 --> 01:16:24,120 Speaker 2: you know, we want to have fifty thousand units and 1394 01:16:24,160 --> 01:16:25,479 Speaker 2: so a lot of work to do. 1395 01:16:25,920 --> 01:16:28,000 Speaker 5: So when you watch the scoreboard, is obviously somebody else 1396 01:16:28,600 --> 01:16:29,599 Speaker 5: that's off there on the board. 1397 01:16:29,640 --> 01:16:30,880 Speaker 2: That's just you, That's right. 1398 01:16:30,960 --> 01:16:33,360 Speaker 5: So who the people that you're looking at, not as competitors, 1399 01:16:33,439 --> 01:16:35,840 Speaker 5: but as inspiration to say we can just further to go. 1400 01:16:36,160 --> 01:16:38,479 Speaker 2: I mean, like the company that we When I formed 1401 01:16:38,479 --> 01:16:43,599 Speaker 2: this company, I always thought about Related right, Related as 1402 01:16:43,640 --> 01:16:47,960 Speaker 2: a company owned by Steven Ross who owns the Miami Dolphins, right, 1403 01:16:48,760 --> 01:16:52,280 Speaker 2: but they were primarily an affordable housing developer for decades, 1404 01:16:52,920 --> 01:16:56,439 Speaker 2: and the AOL Time Warnings Center is kind of like 1405 01:16:57,280 --> 01:16:59,000 Speaker 2: you know, they when they did that, they flipped the 1406 01:16:59,000 --> 01:17:03,240 Speaker 2: switch and start doing these you know, mega huge projects 1407 01:17:03,240 --> 01:17:06,320 Speaker 2: that are more like that place making idea I talked about. 1408 01:17:06,600 --> 01:17:08,679 Speaker 2: You you know, they have Hudson Yards, have other projects 1409 01:17:08,720 --> 01:17:11,680 Speaker 2: around you know, other areas of the country, but they 1410 01:17:11,720 --> 01:17:14,120 Speaker 2: still do affordable housing too, right, So you can have 1411 01:17:14,240 --> 01:17:17,880 Speaker 2: a model where you can do projects like you know, 1412 01:17:18,760 --> 01:17:22,200 Speaker 2: Time Warner Center or Hudson Yards, but still do affordable housing. 1413 01:17:22,240 --> 01:17:23,920 Speaker 2: That's what we're going to continue to do. But we're 1414 01:17:23,920 --> 01:17:26,839 Speaker 2: going to try to do it in more scalable projects 1415 01:17:26,880 --> 01:17:30,200 Speaker 2: where we could deploy more capital and create larger assets 1416 01:17:30,400 --> 01:17:31,560 Speaker 2: with the same effort. 1417 01:17:32,840 --> 01:17:37,519 Speaker 4: Well, Craig, it's been an honor very educational episode. Anything 1418 01:17:37,560 --> 01:17:39,240 Speaker 4: that you want to leave the people or let them 1419 01:17:39,320 --> 01:17:40,360 Speaker 4: know before we were out. 1420 01:17:40,439 --> 01:17:42,600 Speaker 2: I mean, what I'd say is, listen, get involved in 1421 01:17:42,600 --> 01:17:46,240 Speaker 2: real estate. There's a three trillion dollar economic opportunity for 1422 01:17:46,360 --> 01:17:51,360 Speaker 2: young people, for for minorities and women owned companies. Whether 1423 01:17:51,400 --> 01:17:56,800 Speaker 2: you're developing, doing property management, you're an electrician and carpenter, 1424 01:17:56,880 --> 01:18:00,519 Speaker 2: an accountant, an architect, you name it. It's a great 1425 01:18:00,520 --> 01:18:04,120 Speaker 2: industry and once you're involved, it leads to more and 1426 01:18:04,160 --> 01:18:06,479 Speaker 2: more opportunities. So let's not miss out on this, this 1427 01:18:06,640 --> 01:18:09,360 Speaker 2: three trillion dollar win fall. It's about to happen. 1428 01:18:11,160 --> 01:18:13,560 Speaker 4: Yeah, that's something that people said an MSG where he 1429 01:18:13,600 --> 01:18:17,040 Speaker 4: said that you know, there's a lot of opportunity for 1430 01:18:17,800 --> 01:18:21,800 Speaker 4: investment into black business like real estate development stuff like that, 1431 01:18:21,840 --> 01:18:27,040 Speaker 4: because I get like less than one point three percent 1432 01:18:27,240 --> 01:18:32,080 Speaker 4: of funding and that's like all minorities and women combined. 1433 01:18:32,439 --> 01:18:37,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's crazy. It's so imbalanced in balanced that it 1434 01:18:37,160 --> 01:18:41,439 Speaker 2: needs to be addressed. Yeah, well that's the luck for you. 1435 01:18:41,560 --> 01:18:44,840 Speaker 4: If you guys need anything from us, you need us 1436 01:18:44,840 --> 01:18:47,920 Speaker 4: to put EYO headquarters in the affirmation, just. 1437 01:18:47,920 --> 01:18:50,479 Speaker 5: Let us knows, let us know. That's easy. You know, 1438 01:18:50,560 --> 01:18:53,080 Speaker 5: we can feel the theater's up at home if you 1439 01:18:53,160 --> 01:18:54,439 Speaker 5: need whatever. 1440 01:18:54,439 --> 01:18:56,360 Speaker 2: Whatever. Listen when we open up and want you guys 1441 01:18:56,360 --> 01:18:57,960 Speaker 2: to come up there and see the place, and you know, 1442 01:18:58,240 --> 01:19:01,120 Speaker 2: for sure all the access you want to it for sure, 1443 01:19:01,240 --> 01:19:04,720 Speaker 2: for sure we'll see you in Atlanta again too. That's 1444 01:19:04,720 --> 01:19:05,439 Speaker 2: like our second home. 1445 01:19:05,479 --> 01:19:06,920 Speaker 5: So that's what I said when you were saying you're 1446 01:19:06,920 --> 01:19:09,320 Speaker 5: pretty big in Atlanta. We know we're pretty big out 1447 01:19:09,320 --> 01:19:11,439 Speaker 5: there too. Yeah, yeah, so we know exactly what you're 1448 01:19:11,439 --> 01:19:15,160 Speaker 5: talking about. The Microsoft Center that's right by ote, right 1449 01:19:15,200 --> 01:19:17,400 Speaker 5: where we actually sat down to enview it. So a 1450 01:19:17,400 --> 01:19:19,559 Speaker 5: lot of development is happening out there, so that's encouraging. 1451 01:19:19,600 --> 01:19:21,880 Speaker 5: I'm sure people that are there hearing this are like, 1452 01:19:21,880 --> 01:19:24,000 Speaker 5: all right, we need to stay here and make sure 1453 01:19:24,000 --> 01:19:25,439 Speaker 5: that we planning our cz now. 1454 01:19:25,479 --> 01:19:30,760 Speaker 4: Absolutely, is Atlanta a place where you think black people 1455 01:19:30,800 --> 01:19:32,800 Speaker 4: should focus all of the energy on. Not like every 1456 01:19:32,840 --> 01:19:34,559 Speaker 4: single person should come to Lanta, but it's like, all right, 1457 01:19:34,920 --> 01:19:38,639 Speaker 4: it's beneficial to have a central hub, and Atlanta obviously 1458 01:19:38,760 --> 01:19:43,920 Speaker 4: has stood out as the mecca for Black culture in 1459 01:19:44,040 --> 01:19:47,880 Speaker 4: business and music and a variety of different things for 1460 01:19:47,920 --> 01:19:52,160 Speaker 4: the last twenty years. So, like when we're doing vest 1461 01:19:52,200 --> 01:19:55,160 Speaker 4: Fest is in Atlanta. You guys are building in Atlanta. 1462 01:19:55,280 --> 01:19:57,519 Speaker 4: Do you think that there's something where it's like, all right, 1463 01:19:59,000 --> 01:20:00,439 Speaker 4: we should really focus on Atlanta. 1464 01:20:02,160 --> 01:20:04,840 Speaker 2: Yes, But Atlanta's not the only market, right, So, I 1465 01:20:04,880 --> 01:20:09,720 Speaker 2: mean DC is a great market. The fundamental principle for 1466 01:20:09,760 --> 01:20:13,040 Speaker 2: real estate is by low sell high. Atlanta is like 1467 01:20:13,439 --> 01:20:16,200 Speaker 2: in motion, bro. I mean, it's like it's ascending quickly. 1468 01:20:16,400 --> 01:20:22,720 Speaker 2: But there's other markets where Charlotte, Yes, absolutely, Charlotte. You know, 1469 01:20:23,280 --> 01:20:25,600 Speaker 2: uh stuff in the in the Midwest. I mean, like 1470 01:20:25,640 --> 01:20:28,600 Speaker 2: look at areas in and around Phoenix, and you just 1471 01:20:28,640 --> 01:20:34,360 Speaker 2: have the equation works in almost every municipality you shut. 1472 01:20:34,439 --> 01:20:36,080 Speaker 2: Let me ask you a question, right, Here's how I 1473 01:20:36,120 --> 01:20:39,600 Speaker 2: answer that question. If you could buy real estate and 1474 01:20:39,720 --> 01:20:43,519 Speaker 2: anywhere in the country at what it costs fifteen years ago, 1475 01:20:44,000 --> 01:20:46,000 Speaker 2: you could do that today, would you do it? Yeah? 1476 01:20:46,120 --> 01:20:48,000 Speaker 2: Then why wouldn't you do it now? So fifteen years 1477 01:20:48,000 --> 01:20:49,280 Speaker 2: from now you can say, look what I did? 1478 01:20:49,360 --> 01:20:51,120 Speaker 4: Well, Yeah, the real estate I'm just saying because you 1479 01:20:51,120 --> 01:20:53,760 Speaker 4: always hear about Black Wall Street, right, but blackwashe was 1480 01:20:53,760 --> 01:20:56,519 Speaker 4: more than just Tosa, Oklahoma's a right different places. So 1481 01:20:56,640 --> 01:20:58,320 Speaker 4: when I look at Atlanta, I look at it from 1482 01:20:58,400 --> 01:21:02,599 Speaker 4: a from an opportunity of investing, but then entrepreneurship as well. 1483 01:21:02,720 --> 01:21:05,559 Speaker 4: It's the only place in America that I've ever seen 1484 01:21:06,200 --> 01:21:09,560 Speaker 4: where when we most of the businesses that we patronize, 1485 01:21:09,640 --> 01:21:11,320 Speaker 4: or at least half of them are owned by black people. 1486 01:21:12,160 --> 01:21:13,599 Speaker 4: I've never seen that any whales. 1487 01:21:14,160 --> 01:21:18,120 Speaker 2: Well you have, I mean right for Maryland, maybe some 1488 01:21:18,200 --> 01:21:25,280 Speaker 2: areas in Maryland, but there's been a historical lack of 1489 01:21:25,320 --> 01:21:28,280 Speaker 2: access to capital and economic opportunity for us for sure, 1490 01:21:28,320 --> 01:21:31,240 Speaker 2: our community, and that's why that happens. But the entrepreneurial 1491 01:21:31,240 --> 01:21:35,040 Speaker 2: spirit is strong. And look, you know, it's not like 1492 01:21:35,560 --> 01:21:38,400 Speaker 2: what we do in our culture is invaluable because everybody's 1493 01:21:38,439 --> 01:21:41,320 Speaker 2: monetizing it, right. So, but if we have access to 1494 01:21:41,320 --> 01:21:43,800 Speaker 2: the capital, we can monetize it for ourselves. I mean, 1495 01:21:43,840 --> 01:21:46,360 Speaker 2: like hip hop is a perfect example. We have a 1496 01:21:46,360 --> 01:21:48,519 Speaker 2: lot of artists and a lot of black folks doing well. 1497 01:21:48,720 --> 01:21:50,720 Speaker 2: There's a lot of people who aren't black who did 1498 01:21:50,840 --> 01:21:53,840 Speaker 2: really well in hip hop because they had capital to 1499 01:21:53,880 --> 01:21:54,320 Speaker 2: begin with. 1500 01:21:54,439 --> 01:21:57,200 Speaker 4: So you're saying, just build other Atlantas, Yeah, don't just 1501 01:21:57,240 --> 01:21:59,719 Speaker 4: depend on one city make other cities. 1502 01:22:00,000 --> 01:22:03,040 Speaker 2: The equation works, and it works, you know, like there's 1503 01:22:03,080 --> 01:22:06,759 Speaker 2: a thing about it place like over Town in Miami, Miami. 1504 01:22:07,080 --> 01:22:08,880 Speaker 2: I mean like look at that. I mean like it's 1505 01:22:08,920 --> 01:22:11,800 Speaker 2: that's that's fire. Ten years from now, you got y'all 1506 01:22:11,800 --> 01:22:15,000 Speaker 2: be our basil, right, so you know, just ten years 1507 01:22:15,000 --> 01:22:17,920 Speaker 2: from now, look over times will look completely different. Troy 1508 01:22:17,920 --> 01:22:20,200 Speaker 2: has some of those characteristics to Detroit to another same 1509 01:22:20,200 --> 01:22:24,680 Speaker 2: thing exactly. But you know it comes. You know, we 1510 01:22:24,800 --> 01:22:28,920 Speaker 2: focus on it, and you know, we are in the 1511 01:22:29,040 --> 01:22:31,800 Speaker 2: urban environment, like we we kind of shape the urban 1512 01:22:31,880 --> 01:22:35,680 Speaker 2: environment our culture, right, and there's a reason why, folks. 1513 01:22:35,840 --> 01:22:39,200 Speaker 2: You know, you know when I was growing up, there 1514 01:22:39,320 --> 01:22:44,080 Speaker 2: was music that people listen to is all different. There 1515 01:22:44,120 --> 01:22:47,320 Speaker 2: was a C d C. There was you know, Guns 1516 01:22:47,320 --> 01:22:51,360 Speaker 2: and Roses, there was run DMC. But now everybody is 1517 01:22:51,400 --> 01:22:53,840 Speaker 2: on that urban hip hop stuff. Dress of the same, 1518 01:22:54,120 --> 01:22:58,040 Speaker 2: the same language, it's the same music. We can continue 1519 01:22:58,080 --> 01:23:01,880 Speaker 2: to evolve this culture, but put ourselves in a position 1520 01:23:01,920 --> 01:23:04,440 Speaker 2: where we have access to capital so we can monetize 1521 01:23:05,040 --> 01:23:07,559 Speaker 2: what's being involved. That's the rule, brick Man, That's what 1522 01:23:07,600 --> 01:23:10,320 Speaker 2: we want to do, not only with and particularly when 1523 01:23:10,360 --> 01:23:13,200 Speaker 2: you're talking about developing new hot spots in the real 1524 01:23:13,280 --> 01:23:19,720 Speaker 2: state that functions around that m eighties. You congrat Yeah, okay, 1525 01:23:19,720 --> 01:23:22,200 Speaker 2: I don't know if you watch that game the other night, Yo, 1526 01:23:22,280 --> 01:23:24,439 Speaker 2: they play we handled live with State, Like. 1527 01:23:24,479 --> 01:23:28,080 Speaker 5: Yeah, you know, but their top ten now back in 1528 01:23:28,560 --> 01:23:29,920 Speaker 5: the country and it fell off for a while. 1529 01:23:30,000 --> 01:23:32,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, I feel I feel a national championship coming right now. 1530 01:23:32,320 --> 01:23:36,559 Speaker 4: You No, they had a rough period for yeah. 1531 01:23:36,400 --> 01:23:39,760 Speaker 2: I mean so, I mean we didn't win. Were like 1532 01:23:39,760 --> 01:23:42,000 Speaker 2: the last championship was in twenty thirteen, you know, Yeah, 1533 01:23:42,000 --> 01:23:44,000 Speaker 2: but that's a that's pretty good. Yeah, twenty thirteen. 1534 01:23:44,160 --> 01:23:47,120 Speaker 4: I'm just saying you com was always you know, top 1535 01:23:47,439 --> 01:23:50,080 Speaker 4: fifteen at least. Yeah, Kevin Ali he won i think 1536 01:23:50,080 --> 01:23:53,200 Speaker 4: his first year and then they he won his his 1537 01:23:53,240 --> 01:23:53,720 Speaker 4: first year. 1538 01:23:54,240 --> 01:23:56,120 Speaker 2: He was first year. He won his first year. Yeah, yeah, 1539 01:23:56,240 --> 01:23:57,320 Speaker 2: that was what beat. 1540 01:23:57,920 --> 01:24:00,240 Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean even like if you look at these 1541 01:24:00,280 --> 01:24:03,240 Speaker 5: obviously at that time, Yukon wasn't. 1542 01:24:02,600 --> 01:24:04,679 Speaker 2: Like Yukon was amazing. Man. It was a great, great 1543 01:24:04,960 --> 01:24:08,839 Speaker 2: when gen Hole got there. Prior to that, well, Calhoun 1544 01:24:08,960 --> 01:24:11,320 Speaker 2: took the program to heights and then you know, they 1545 01:24:11,400 --> 01:24:14,240 Speaker 2: just were phenomenal for a long time. They rip rip 1546 01:24:14,320 --> 01:24:18,000 Speaker 2: on the national championship. Who's the who's the greatest player 1547 01:24:18,080 --> 01:24:21,240 Speaker 2: from Yukon history, Ray Allen. That's easy. It's not easy 1548 01:24:21,680 --> 01:24:24,720 Speaker 2: Ray Allen. It's Ray Allen because he played. We played 1549 01:24:24,720 --> 01:24:27,320 Speaker 2: four years, right, three three years, but lookally did in 1550 01:24:27,360 --> 01:24:28,759 Speaker 2: the n b A. I mean, well, I'm talking about 1551 01:24:28,760 --> 01:24:33,120 Speaker 2: just you're talking about Ukon playing. Kim Milwalk is the greatest. Oh, okay, 1552 01:24:33,200 --> 01:24:33,559 Speaker 2: he's the. 1553 01:24:33,560 --> 01:24:38,439 Speaker 4: Greatest player because he had the greatest performance. Ben Gordon 1554 01:24:38,479 --> 01:24:40,160 Speaker 4: was nasty too. 1555 01:24:40,840 --> 01:24:43,240 Speaker 5: I would if we're going to talk about basketball player, 1556 01:24:44,160 --> 01:24:46,800 Speaker 5: is Diana Tarassi not the best player from you come? 1557 01:24:47,680 --> 01:24:52,559 Speaker 2: Okay? Point all right? Men's men's point okay, men's player. 1558 01:24:52,920 --> 01:24:57,640 Speaker 4: He's had his run, that run in the n C 1559 01:24:57,720 --> 01:25:00,759 Speaker 4: Double A tournament that was the greatest, the year best. 1560 01:25:01,479 --> 01:25:04,000 Speaker 2: That backcourt was phenomenoush If you. 1561 01:25:03,960 --> 01:25:07,320 Speaker 5: Take Kimber's freshman year, sophomore year, you might not say 1562 01:25:07,320 --> 01:25:09,160 Speaker 5: the same. But if you take that third that junior 1563 01:25:09,200 --> 01:25:11,400 Speaker 5: year when he won a chip. Yeah, but Ray Allen 1564 01:25:11,439 --> 01:25:16,439 Speaker 5: consistently even even rip like his career was ridiculous and 1565 01:25:16,479 --> 01:25:18,160 Speaker 5: he wanted what he ended it with a chip. 1566 01:25:18,280 --> 01:25:20,599 Speaker 2: That's right. Yeah, y'all got four chips like most schools 1567 01:25:20,640 --> 01:25:24,839 Speaker 2: don't have four chips. I'm very, very proudly proud Columbia 1568 01:25:24,840 --> 01:25:26,960 Speaker 2: grad as well. That's right, but you know I bleed 1569 01:25:27,000 --> 01:25:29,679 Speaker 2: blue either. Well. 1570 01:25:29,720 --> 01:25:32,000 Speaker 4: It was a pleasure to having you, gentlemen. Thank you 1571 01:25:32,040 --> 01:25:34,400 Speaker 4: for joining us, and I look forward to connecting more 1572 01:25:34,400 --> 01:25:34,840 Speaker 4: in the future. 1573 01:25:34,880 --> 01:25:36,960 Speaker 2: All right, love it. Thank you so much. Thank you 1574 01:25:37,000 --> 01:25:39,160 Speaker 2: guys for rocking with us. We see you next week. Peace. Peace. 1575 01:25:41,160 --> 01:25:46,360 Speaker 3: My graduates from my school being forced back drop b Drop, 1576 01:25:47,000 --> 01:25:49,400 Speaker 3: Mike drop drop. 1577 01:26:00,000 --> 01:26:03,559 Speaker 1: An illegal alien from Guatemala charged with raping a child 1578 01:26:03,600 --> 01:26:07,360 Speaker 1: in Massachusetts. An MS thirteen gang member from Al Salvador 1579 01:26:07,600 --> 01:26:11,760 Speaker 1: accused of murdering a Texas man of Venezuelan charged with 1580 01:26:11,840 --> 01:26:15,720 Speaker 1: filming and selling child pornography in Michigan. These are just 1581 01:26:15,800 --> 01:26:19,559 Speaker 1: some of the heinous migrant criminals caught because of President 1582 01:26:19,600 --> 01:26:23,200 Speaker 1: Donald J. Trump's leadership. I'm Christy nom the United States 1583 01:26:23,200 --> 01:26:28,000 Speaker 1: Secretary of Homeland Security. Under President Trump, attempted illegal border 1584 01:26:28,040 --> 01:26:31,599 Speaker 1: crossings are at the lowest levels ever recorded, and over 1585 01:26:31,640 --> 01:26:34,880 Speaker 1: one hundred thousand illegal aliens have been arrested. If you 1586 01:26:34,960 --> 01:26:38,799 Speaker 1: are here illegally, your next you will be fine nearly 1587 01:26:38,880 --> 01:26:42,880 Speaker 1: one thousand dollars a day. Imprisoned and deported, you will 1588 01:26:42,920 --> 01:26:46,599 Speaker 1: never return. But if you register using our CBP home, 1589 01:26:46,640 --> 01:26:50,000 Speaker 1: app and leave now. You could be allowed to return legally. 1590 01:26:50,360 --> 01:26:55,120 Speaker 1: Do what's right. Leave now. Under President Trump America's laws, 1591 01:26:55,280 --> 01:26:57,719 Speaker 1: border and families will be protected. 1592 01:26:57,840 --> 01:26:59,920 Speaker 2: Sponsored by the United States Department of Homeland Security,