WEBVTT - The Alien Abduction Phenomenon of the Mid-20th Century 0:00:01.480 --> 0:00:09.240 Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a production of iHeartRadio. 0:00:11.200 --> 0:00:13.680 Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh, and there's 0:00:13.800 --> 0:00:17.319 Chuck and Ben's here again too. It's pretty much the 0:00:17.400 --> 0:00:19.959 new status quo, which I have to say I like 0:00:20.000 --> 0:00:23.160 a lot, and that makes the stuff you should Know. 0:00:24.079 --> 0:00:25.920 Oh. I was about to say Jerry might get her 0:00:25.920 --> 0:00:27.800 feelings hurt, but you know she won't even hear that. 0:00:28.160 --> 0:00:29.480 No, not a chance. 0:00:29.880 --> 0:00:33.519 If she's not, you know, overseeing that episode. It's not 0:00:33.560 --> 0:00:34.880 like she goes, oh, I should listen in. 0:00:35.440 --> 0:00:37.160 Yeah, I got to keep up with these guys. They're 0:00:37.200 --> 0:00:39.640 so hilarious. That's not a Jerry thing to think. 0:00:39.960 --> 0:00:42.560 Yeah, especially when it's more alien stuff. 0:00:43.520 --> 0:00:46.920 Yeah, we've done a lot of alien stuff and by god, 0:00:47.080 --> 0:00:50.159 every second of it's been amazing. And I don't think 0:00:50.159 --> 0:00:51.320 this is going to be any different. 0:00:51.760 --> 0:00:54.320 No, it's been a while, though we haven't. I feel 0:00:54.360 --> 0:00:56.640 like we kind of had a little grouping of those, 0:00:57.840 --> 0:00:59.400 you know, ten years ago or something. 0:01:00.280 --> 0:01:02.120 I think it was like last year, but we did. 0:01:02.240 --> 0:01:02.560 Was it really? 0:01:02.760 --> 0:01:04.640 No, it was probably like within the last two years. 0:01:04.640 --> 0:01:06.800 We did that two parter on Project blue Book. 0:01:07.440 --> 0:01:10.320 Oh sure, I just remember years ago at Comic Con. 0:01:10.360 --> 0:01:11.560 Did we do an alien thing there. 0:01:11.800 --> 0:01:15.000 We did one on UFOs. Yeah, yeah, for sure, that's. 0:01:15.680 --> 0:01:17.920 That's a brave thing for us to do at Comic 0:01:17.920 --> 0:01:18.680 Con for sure. 0:01:19.959 --> 0:01:23.680 A lot of experts there. Yeah, yeah, So yeah, today 0:01:23.720 --> 0:01:26.240 we're talking about something that definitely has a lot to 0:01:26.280 --> 0:01:28.240 do with aliens, a lot to do with UFOs, but 0:01:28.800 --> 0:01:32.880 also really has a lot to do with social psychology, 0:01:33.160 --> 0:01:38.240 in sociology and history as a strange moment in time 0:01:38.959 --> 0:01:42.440 where there was a you can almost call it a trend, 0:01:43.000 --> 0:01:46.240 And I want to say right from the outset, we 0:01:46.280 --> 0:01:49.080 are in no way, shape or for mocking anyone who 0:01:49.120 --> 0:01:53.160 believes that they were abducted. After researching this, I fully 0:01:53.240 --> 0:01:56.880 understand that people who who believe they were abducted by 0:01:56.960 --> 0:02:02.800 aliens are traumatized by that experienceience and show all the 0:02:02.840 --> 0:02:05.800 symptoms of a traumatic experience, and then on top of 0:02:05.840 --> 0:02:09.800 that had the indignity of not being believed by anybody 0:02:10.120 --> 0:02:12.960 and probably talk down to fairly frequently. So we're going 0:02:13.000 --> 0:02:16.960 to try not to talk down. So I'm not in 0:02:17.040 --> 0:02:19.240 calling it a trend. I'm not trying to diminish the 0:02:19.280 --> 0:02:22.919 experience of anybody who's ever who believes they were abducted, 0:02:22.960 --> 0:02:25.320 and that it had an impact on their lives. But 0:02:25.400 --> 0:02:27.880 there was a period in time from about the nineteen 0:02:28.400 --> 0:02:33.040 sixties and seventies through to the nineties where there were 0:02:33.080 --> 0:02:37.720 a lot of people running around claiming to have been abducted. 0:02:38.560 --> 0:02:42.840 Yeah, it's interesting. It's fascinating because it dawned to me 0:02:42.880 --> 0:02:45.880 when I was researching this, like, I just I haven't 0:02:45.919 --> 0:02:47.000 heard one of these in a long time. 0:02:47.560 --> 0:02:50.280 No, And I looked up and saw a bunch of 0:02:50.280 --> 0:02:53.360 different places that people attribute that to the advent of 0:02:53.560 --> 0:02:55.160 ubiquitous camera phones. 0:02:56.240 --> 0:02:59.160 Uh, that's inconvenient. 0:02:58.680 --> 0:03:01.400 Yeah, exactly. You can be like, nope, this is what 0:03:01.440 --> 0:03:04.240 you saw. So it dried up at almost the exact 0:03:04.280 --> 0:03:04.880 same time. 0:03:05.560 --> 0:03:07.800 Okay, all right, that makes a lot of sense. 0:03:08.120 --> 0:03:12.519 But before that there was like people have been seeing 0:03:12.560 --> 0:03:14.800 weird stuff in the sky and being like UFO for 0:03:14.840 --> 0:03:17.560 a while. But in our Project blue Book episode we 0:03:18.680 --> 0:03:21.400 found like the moment it really kicked off, and that 0:03:21.440 --> 0:03:24.400 was June twenty fourth, nineteen forty seven, and we talked 0:03:24.400 --> 0:03:26.240 it up to a guy named Kenneth Arnold who was 0:03:26.280 --> 0:03:30.519 a I think an amateur pilot or like a hobbyist 0:03:30.800 --> 0:03:34.680 who saw what came to be considered the first flying saucer. 0:03:35.400 --> 0:03:39.160 Yeah. And the alarming thing about this was he clocked 0:03:39.600 --> 0:03:43.600 the speed at about sixteen hundred miles an hour, which 0:03:43.640 --> 0:03:47.400 is at the time, you know, easily three times faster 0:03:47.520 --> 0:03:50.560 than anything else could fly. And this is where the 0:03:50.640 --> 0:03:53.120 term saucer came from. He said, they flew like a 0:03:53.160 --> 0:03:57.120 saucer would if you skipped it across the water. And 0:03:57.160 --> 0:03:59.200 so that's kind of where that term came from. And 0:03:59.240 --> 0:04:01.400 this is you know, this is just after World War 0:04:01.440 --> 0:04:03.560 Two and it's not like any no one had ever 0:04:05.080 --> 0:04:09.120 claimed to have witnessed anything before this, but basically pre 0:04:09.320 --> 0:04:12.920 this date it was one hundred percent well maybe not 0:04:13.000 --> 0:04:15.960 hundred percent, who knows, but most people were saying like, oh, 0:04:16.040 --> 0:04:19.320 that's just you know, some enemy technology or something that 0:04:19.360 --> 0:04:20.039 we don't know about. 0:04:20.240 --> 0:04:24.400 Yeah. So Kenneth Arnold kicked off what you characterize as 0:04:24.400 --> 0:04:28.080 like the modern UFO movement, I guess right. 0:04:28.600 --> 0:04:32.320 Yeah, as in, there's an alien driving not a Russian. 0:04:32.120 --> 0:04:33.279 Yes, yeah, good point. 0:04:33.320 --> 0:04:33.640 Yeah. 0:04:33.680 --> 0:04:36.239 And also the thing that really bolstered it within days 0:04:36.279 --> 0:04:42.160 of that, within two weeks, the Roswell Crash happened, which 0:04:42.240 --> 0:04:45.440 a lot of people say that's the advent of the 0:04:45.480 --> 0:04:47.880 idea that aliens are actually visiting us and that the 0:04:47.880 --> 0:04:51.760 government is covering it up right, So those two things. 0:04:51.760 --> 0:04:54.360 It was a one two punch in nineteen forty seven, 0:04:54.120 --> 0:04:57.720 in the summer of nineteen forty seven that really kind 0:04:57.760 --> 0:05:01.440 of just debuted aliens to the world. And one of 0:05:01.480 --> 0:05:07.919 the things is we'll see with abduction narratives or stories 0:05:08.320 --> 0:05:13.640 or claims, they usually have a very dark, bad thread 0:05:13.680 --> 0:05:17.479 to them. They're not a positive experience, and aliens have 0:05:17.560 --> 0:05:20.520 kind of gotten in large part like that kind of 0:05:20.680 --> 0:05:23.200 view by the public. If there are aliens out there, 0:05:23.400 --> 0:05:26.239 it's not entirely clear that they are benevolent or kind. 0:05:26.520 --> 0:05:29.160 But that's not how it was at the outset, was it. 0:05:29.360 --> 0:05:31.279 Yeah, we can chalk that up to a dude named 0:05:31.440 --> 0:05:37.720 George Adomski. I guess Adamski, Yeah, he was. He immigrated 0:05:37.720 --> 0:05:41.440 from Poland and he founded a group called the Royal 0:05:41.560 --> 0:05:44.800 Order of Tibet in southern California in the thirties. He 0:05:44.880 --> 0:05:47.800 was a teacher of philosophy. He was, you know, he 0:05:48.680 --> 0:05:50.920 was kind of out there a little bit, and in 0:05:51.000 --> 0:05:55.240 nineteen fifty two he claimed that he met an alien 0:05:55.279 --> 0:05:59.479 named Orthan, which is I mean, it's got to be 0:05:59.480 --> 0:06:01.679 the inspiration from orson from work from work. 0:06:01.600 --> 0:06:05.719 Right, probably because these were really popular books at the time. 0:06:06.080 --> 0:06:08.320 Yeah, I mean it just sounds like you're saying morek 0:06:08.360 --> 0:06:11.960 calling Orthon with a lisp, yeah, or how I say 0:06:11.960 --> 0:06:12.720 it now with my tooth. 0:06:12.760 --> 0:06:14.119 It's like Tyson calling Orthan. 0:06:15.200 --> 0:06:18.440 But his narrative was a bit different. He was like, Hey, 0:06:19.000 --> 0:06:22.400 this alien Orthan was a beautiful man. He had a 0:06:22.440 --> 0:06:25.640 high forehead, he had hair which is, as you'll see, 0:06:25.640 --> 0:06:29.720 pretty unusual from the grays that follow, and a uniform 0:06:29.760 --> 0:06:35.039 on a brown uniform, and you know, was telepathic, could 0:06:35.080 --> 0:06:39.599 like speak to him basically through his brain and brought 0:06:39.600 --> 0:06:42.800 a message of peace, saying, hey, I'm from Venus and 0:06:42.839 --> 0:06:44.960 you guys should stop with the nuclear weapons. 0:06:45.400 --> 0:06:50.120 Right. So this was like how people kind of viewed 0:06:51.120 --> 0:06:53.320 aliens visiting us at the time, Like this guy was 0:06:53.320 --> 0:06:55.520 writing these books like they were nonfiction and people were 0:06:55.560 --> 0:06:56.240 eating them up. 0:06:56.560 --> 0:06:57.320 Yeah. 0:06:57.560 --> 0:07:01.440 So there was this idea that aliens are kind of cool, 0:07:01.480 --> 0:07:03.360 they're more advanced than us, and they have our best 0:07:03.400 --> 0:07:06.040 interests in mind. And then that took a serious, like 0:07:06.520 --> 0:07:10.800 left turn just a few years later in the late fifties, 0:07:11.240 --> 0:07:15.480 when a farmer in Brazil named Antonio vs. Boas claimed 0:07:15.480 --> 0:07:19.640 that he had been taken aboard a spaceship and a 0:07:19.720 --> 0:07:22.160 damski later claimed that he had been on a spaceship too, 0:07:22.200 --> 0:07:25.560 But this was pretty new stuff that he had basically 0:07:25.600 --> 0:07:28.960 been abducted and forced to have sex with what he 0:07:29.000 --> 0:07:32.480 admitted was an attractive alien, but was a bit turned 0:07:32.520 --> 0:07:35.520 off by the fact that she barked during sex and 0:07:36.800 --> 0:07:40.640 then returned to his farm. And this was a this 0:07:40.720 --> 0:07:43.840 is a brand new this is new ground essentially that 0:07:43.880 --> 0:07:47.080 Boaz had started to trod. 0:07:47.840 --> 0:07:51.400 Yeah, for sure, I mean, this is I couldn't find 0:07:51.440 --> 0:07:54.720 an earlier one that mentioned any kind of you know, 0:07:54.920 --> 0:07:58.400 sexual assault going on, right, was this the first one 0:07:58.600 --> 0:08:01.000 from what I could tell? Yes, all right, so he 0:08:01.160 --> 0:08:05.840 was of course, went to a doctor, They examined him. 0:08:06.000 --> 0:08:08.720 They said, he's probably making this whole thing up. But 0:08:09.520 --> 0:08:13.160 there was a group a UFO, an early ufology group, 0:08:13.560 --> 0:08:17.960 that published this experience anyway, and in nineteen sixty five 0:08:18.040 --> 0:08:21.360 it ran in an international journal called Flying Salcer Review, 0:08:22.680 --> 0:08:25.520 which I get to copy of one of those, and 0:08:26.200 --> 0:08:28.000 all of a sudden, you know, people all over the 0:08:28.000 --> 0:08:31.400 world are hearing this story and this sort of you 0:08:31.400 --> 0:08:34.800 know was happening in you know, it was international, but 0:08:34.880 --> 0:08:39.560 it wasn't It didn't hit The American public quite liked 0:08:39.600 --> 0:08:43.000 this story of Betty and Barney Hill, which really really 0:08:43.080 --> 0:08:44.400 kicked things off here in the States. 0:08:44.640 --> 0:08:47.160 Yeah, because his thing came out in the Journal in 0:08:47.240 --> 0:08:49.640 nineteen sixty five and the Hill the Hills had an 0:08:49.679 --> 0:08:54.840 experience in nineteen sixty one. They are widely seen as 0:08:54.880 --> 0:09:00.640 the first credible abductees. If you believe that kind of stuff, 0:09:00.679 --> 0:09:03.880 you probably are focused on Betty and Barney Hill. They 0:09:03.880 --> 0:09:07.880 were an interracial couple in nineteen sixty one in New Hampshire. 0:09:08.360 --> 0:09:11.240 Betty was a social worker and Barney was a postal officer, 0:09:11.600 --> 0:09:16.440 and they had taken a delayed honeymoon to Montreal and 0:09:16.480 --> 0:09:18.560 were on their way back when they noticed that they 0:09:18.600 --> 0:09:21.120 were basically being chased by a light in the sky. 0:09:22.040 --> 0:09:24.280 And when they grabbed their binoculars and stopped and got 0:09:24.320 --> 0:09:26.560 out of the car, they could actually see that it 0:09:26.600 --> 0:09:29.480 was essentially a flying saucer and that aliens were looking 0:09:29.480 --> 0:09:32.560 at them through the windows. And the next thing they know, 0:09:33.559 --> 0:09:37.680 it's five am. They're pulling into their house about three 0:09:37.720 --> 0:09:42.040 hours later than they had expected to, and Barney's shoes 0:09:42.080 --> 0:09:44.840 were scuffed and Betty's dress was torn and they didn't 0:09:44.880 --> 0:09:48.360 know what had happened, but they were genuinely bothered by 0:09:48.440 --> 0:09:49.160 the experience. 0:09:49.720 --> 0:09:52.360 Yeah, and you know, we'll dive in a little bit 0:09:52.360 --> 0:09:54.920 more with them. But the reason that you mentioned that 0:09:54.920 --> 0:09:57.160 they were an interracial couple is because they were doing 0:09:57.960 --> 0:10:00.760 a lot of work for civil rights and stuff like that. 0:10:00.880 --> 0:10:04.319 So they all that to say, they had no reason to, 0:10:05.160 --> 0:10:07.600 in fact, every reason not to kind of come forward 0:10:08.280 --> 0:10:12.200 with this crazy story given their positions of doing like this, 0:10:12.320 --> 0:10:14.920 you know, great civil rights work, because you know, it 0:10:14.920 --> 0:10:16.480 would just all of a sudden people would call them 0:10:16.559 --> 0:10:20.280 kooks and probably cast doubt on, you know, the genuine 0:10:20.320 --> 0:10:22.880 good work they were doing. So they had no reason 0:10:22.960 --> 0:10:24.400 to make something like this up. 0:10:24.480 --> 0:10:26.000 And everything to lose too. 0:10:26.280 --> 0:10:29.480 Yeah, everything to lose. So they're trying to figure out 0:10:29.520 --> 0:10:32.200 and make sense of what had happened to them, because again, 0:10:32.240 --> 0:10:34.640 as you'll see with all these stories, whether or not 0:10:34.720 --> 0:10:39.319 this happened or not almost does it matter in some cases, 0:10:39.360 --> 0:10:43.280 because the trauma that's visited upon them afterward is very 0:10:43.360 --> 0:10:46.800 much real, just like any kind of potential false memory. 0:10:47.400 --> 0:10:51.280 So Betty starts researching, goes to the library and starts 0:10:52.320 --> 0:10:55.960 looking at books from the ni CAP which we've talked 0:10:56.000 --> 0:11:00.880 about before. Yeah, NIGHTCAP the National Investing Aations Committee on 0:11:00.960 --> 0:11:04.760 Aerial Phenomenon and that's you know, that was some retired 0:11:04.800 --> 0:11:08.680 military officers and you know UFO enthusiasts who had gotten 0:11:08.679 --> 0:11:13.880 together this you know, pretty early research group. And afterward 0:11:14.200 --> 0:11:17.559 they were, you know, they were suffering from PTSD, especially 0:11:18.840 --> 0:11:21.440 the husband he was he had pretty severe anxiety from this. 0:11:22.040 --> 0:11:24.960 Yeah he did. Betty had trouble sleeping, Barney had a 0:11:24.960 --> 0:11:27.280 bunch of anxiety. They just they were affected by this 0:11:27.360 --> 0:11:29.679 experience and they had this missing time that they knew 0:11:29.760 --> 0:11:32.240 they couldn't account for, and they wanted to know what happened. 0:11:32.559 --> 0:11:35.760 So they were they were earnestly trying to look for 0:11:35.800 --> 0:11:38.120 somebody to help explain what had happened to them and 0:11:38.160 --> 0:11:41.240 why their lives were affected. First, they went to the 0:11:41.240 --> 0:11:44.760 military and followed official channels because this is when Project 0:11:44.760 --> 0:11:47.240 Blue Book was an actual thing, and like you were 0:11:47.360 --> 0:11:52.160 encouraged to report any UFO citing to the military because 0:11:52.160 --> 0:11:55.360 they were investigating it. And the military was like, you know, 0:11:55.480 --> 0:11:58.320 this is not an important story, sorry, guys, we can't 0:11:58.320 --> 0:12:00.840 help you. So they turned to their and apparently their 0:12:00.920 --> 0:12:03.360 church was like this is way out of our league. Yeah, 0:12:03.600 --> 0:12:05.559 maybe you saw God. And they're like, Noah, wasn't God. 0:12:05.559 --> 0:12:07.920 They're like, yes, sorry, we can't help you either. So 0:12:07.960 --> 0:12:11.560 they turned to psychiatry, and a psychiatrist named Benjamin Simon 0:12:12.120 --> 0:12:14.600 agreed to help them. And this is a time where 0:12:15.320 --> 0:12:17.400 you were there was a good chance you were going 0:12:17.480 --> 0:12:20.079 to be hypnotized if you were on a psychiatrist's couch. 0:12:20.160 --> 0:12:23.640 This is the early to mid nineteen sixties. And so 0:12:23.880 --> 0:12:29.480 they were hypnotized over a series of sessions, and all 0:12:29.480 --> 0:12:33.199 of a sudden, these these memories have been repressed, that 0:12:34.280 --> 0:12:36.840 covered that chunk of time where that they couldn't account 0:12:36.920 --> 0:12:38.640 for started to come forward. 0:12:39.240 --> 0:12:43.360 That's right, which was abduction. Yeah, little great creatures. You know, 0:12:43.440 --> 0:12:46.839 this is the sort of the beginning of the stereotypical 0:12:47.160 --> 0:12:50.960 gray as we know them, gray, little skinny bodies, the 0:12:51.000 --> 0:12:54.839 big heads, the big oval eyes. They brought them on 0:12:54.920 --> 0:12:58.079 board the spaceship and did the you know, the usual 0:12:58.200 --> 0:13:00.880 kind of stuff, which is, let me probe you, let 0:13:00.920 --> 0:13:04.800 me sample you. Apparently they put a needle into Betty's stomach, 0:13:05.480 --> 0:13:07.960 which is what they assumed was like a pregnancy test. 0:13:08.920 --> 0:13:13.920 They were very entranced by Barney's dentures, and then they 0:13:14.000 --> 0:13:17.320 wiped their memories out. I guess men in black style, 0:13:18.080 --> 0:13:21.000 and that's where the lost time comes from. And these 0:13:21.000 --> 0:13:27.520 were like, these were real deal, super emotional hypnosis sessions 0:13:27.520 --> 0:13:31.079 with a very qualified psychiatrist. But even after all that, 0:13:31.800 --> 0:13:34.600 the psychiatrists Sigmon was like, I don't know, I think 0:13:34.640 --> 0:13:37.800 they have a shared delusion going on exactly. 0:13:37.960 --> 0:13:40.559 Yeah, So he was like, you guys weren't abductive, but 0:13:40.640 --> 0:13:42.760 you both believe you were abducted and it's having an 0:13:42.760 --> 0:13:45.280 effect on you. He actually drilled down a little further 0:13:45.360 --> 0:13:49.080 and suggested that it was actually latent racial tensions that 0:13:49.240 --> 0:13:52.920 existed in their marriage that they were equipped to deal 0:13:52.960 --> 0:13:58.600 with and were purposely kind of subverting into these weird 0:13:59.080 --> 0:14:01.480 you know, alien face fans. But that really that's what 0:14:01.559 --> 0:14:04.280 it was. And they were like, no, dude, you're wrong, 0:14:04.520 --> 0:14:07.480 we were abducted. All of these memories are real. And 0:14:07.520 --> 0:14:09.319 he's like, have you heard of false memories? And the 0:14:09.400 --> 0:14:11.040 Hills were like, no, we haven't, and they just kept 0:14:11.040 --> 0:14:14.120 moving on. So the psychiatry couldn't help them either. And 0:14:14.160 --> 0:14:16.520 as they went further and further along trying to get answers, 0:14:16.679 --> 0:14:19.560 they kind of were pushed further and further out of 0:14:19.600 --> 0:14:22.360 the mainstream and toward the fringes, where they were welcomed 0:14:22.400 --> 0:14:23.360 with open arms. 0:14:23.880 --> 0:14:27.640 Oh, of course, the story got published. In nineteen sixty five, 0:14:28.120 --> 0:14:32.000 a guy named John Lutriel from The Boston Traveler reported 0:14:32.080 --> 0:14:35.160 on this UPI picks it up, and then a guy 0:14:35.240 --> 0:14:38.400 named John G. Fuller made it into a book in 0:14:38.480 --> 0:14:43.240 nineteen sixty six called The Interrupted Journey Colan Two Lost 0:14:43.280 --> 0:14:46.880 Hours Aboard a Flying Saucer, which eventually became a TV 0:14:46.960 --> 0:14:50.120 movie in nineteen seventy five called The UFO Incident, which 0:14:50.120 --> 0:14:52.160 you can watch on YouTube if you want to see 0:14:52.160 --> 0:14:58.360 a relatively young and you know, pretty in great shape 0:14:58.480 --> 0:15:02.600 James Earl Jones movie. Did you watch it? I'd kind 0:15:02.600 --> 0:15:04.360 of scrub through it looking for the good stuff. 0:15:04.720 --> 0:15:06.960 I didn't watch it this time. I watched it when 0:15:06.960 --> 0:15:08.240 I was younger, for sure. 0:15:08.680 --> 0:15:11.720 Yeah, it like most of the movie, like eighty five 0:15:11.720 --> 0:15:14.480 percent of it, looks like it takes place in the 0:15:14.560 --> 0:15:18.480 psychiatrist's office, for sure. And I didn't see just scrubbing 0:15:18.480 --> 0:15:20.760 through any good alien stuff till kind of toward the end. 0:15:20.760 --> 0:15:23.680 I guess they were just wanted to wait to for 0:15:23.760 --> 0:15:29.160 the big reveal or whatever. But Stelle Parsons's plays the 0:15:29.200 --> 0:15:32.960 Wife and Barnard Hughes from Doc Hollywood. He was the 0:15:32.960 --> 0:15:37.120 old doctor in Doc Hollywood played Simon. And it was 0:15:37.160 --> 0:15:41.480 a big deal movie. And it was like, you know, 0:15:41.520 --> 0:15:43.520 it's a t moo movie at a time when TV 0:15:43.640 --> 0:15:46.200 movies were big. It's if you're around these days and 0:15:46.280 --> 0:15:50.240 you're not familiar with how things were back then, a 0:15:50.280 --> 0:15:52.760 big TV movie like this could be a sort of 0:15:52.760 --> 0:15:53.840 a national phenomenon. 0:15:53.960 --> 0:15:56.640 Yeah, Because I mean, you had a very limited amount 0:15:56.720 --> 0:15:59.360 of choices of what to watch on any given night. 0:15:59.480 --> 0:16:01.880 So if there's a big TV movie, they promoted the 0:16:01.920 --> 0:16:04.320 heck out of it, and all the the whole country 0:16:04.320 --> 0:16:06.360 could be talking about it for the next couple of weeks. 0:16:06.400 --> 0:16:08.240 You'd be reading about it in the newspaper. It would 0:16:08.240 --> 0:16:10.680 be a big deal, right, So yeah, and this was 0:16:10.720 --> 0:16:13.280 a big deal too. You mentioned that there wasn't much 0:16:13.320 --> 0:16:15.600 alien stuff in there, and apparently Betty Hill was very 0:16:15.640 --> 0:16:20.120 disappointed that James Earl Jones and the producers had kind 0:16:20.160 --> 0:16:22.640 of taken this story that to her was a legitimate 0:16:22.680 --> 0:16:26.040 alien abduction story and used it to explore the themes 0:16:26.040 --> 0:16:29.840 of like interracial marriage, civil rights, being black in a 0:16:29.880 --> 0:16:33.800 largely white state Barney's general experience as being a black 0:16:33.840 --> 0:16:37.080 man in the in the sixties, and she was like, yeah, 0:16:37.160 --> 0:16:39.000 that probably has something to do with it, but really 0:16:39.360 --> 0:16:43.240 we need more aliens, right. It had a huge hard 0:16:43.280 --> 0:16:45.760 to argue with that exactly. And it had a huge 0:16:45.760 --> 0:16:51.760 effect too because it kicked off so everything we know 0:16:51.960 --> 0:16:57.040 about alien abductions, the whole narrative, the whole thread, all 0:16:57.240 --> 0:17:01.720 the claims that followed are based largely on Betty and 0:17:01.760 --> 0:17:03.080 Barney Hill's experience. 0:17:03.800 --> 0:17:07.000 Yeah, and it should come as no surprise that after 0:17:07.080 --> 0:17:10.280 that movie airs, a lot more of these stories start 0:17:10.280 --> 0:17:13.480 to pop up. Very famous one just a couple of 0:17:13.520 --> 0:17:16.639 weeks later after the movie aired nineteen seventy five, is 0:17:17.119 --> 0:17:21.880 when the logger Travis Walton in Arizona was you know, 0:17:22.359 --> 0:17:25.359 beamed up into that spaceship became a movie Fire in 0:17:25.400 --> 0:17:29.119 the Sky in nineteen ninety three. He was gone for 0:17:29.160 --> 0:17:32.600 about a week, came back said that he was examined 0:17:32.600 --> 0:17:34.680 by what we would now call the Grays, a little 0:17:34.720 --> 0:17:38.520 short baldies. Yeah, and it just, you know, things really 0:17:38.520 --> 0:17:43.840 start to ramp up, almost in lockstep with stories ramping up, 0:17:43.840 --> 0:17:45.880 if that makes sense, Like we're kind of feeding each other. 0:17:46.119 --> 0:17:49.479 Yeah. By the way, Travis Walton was roundly exposed as 0:17:49.480 --> 0:17:52.359 a hoaxter and so was everybody in his group. And 0:17:52.400 --> 0:17:57.000 they saw it attributed to his boss, the head of 0:17:57.040 --> 0:18:01.040 this logging company, wanting to get out of an unlucrative 0:18:01.119 --> 0:18:05.400 contract with the federal government, so they concocted this story. 0:18:05.800 --> 0:18:06.800 It's a good way to do that. 0:18:06.920 --> 0:18:09.359 Yeah, that is so seventies. You know that, that's how 0:18:09.400 --> 0:18:10.760 you would get out of a movie contract. 0:18:12.240 --> 0:18:13.800 Uh, not a bad movie, though, Fire in the Guy 0:18:13.840 --> 0:18:14.360 was pretty good. 0:18:14.400 --> 0:18:14.960 I never saw it. 0:18:15.480 --> 0:18:16.440 Yeah, it's that bad. D B. 0:18:16.560 --> 0:18:19.960 Sweeney, Yeah, was he on Saturday Night Live? Why do 0:18:20.040 --> 0:18:20.479 I think that? 0:18:21.600 --> 0:18:24.639 Uh? You're thinking there was another swinge Julius Sweeney. 0:18:24.720 --> 0:18:27.359 I know, but I thought dB sweet Sweeney was too. 0:18:28.080 --> 0:18:33.879 Maybe I'm conflating Julius Julius Sweeney and G. E. Smith 0:18:33.920 --> 0:18:36.760 and Saturday Night Live Band and coming up with dB. 0:18:36.680 --> 0:18:40.080 SWEENEYH Maybe so G Smith was great? 0:18:40.400 --> 0:18:42.840 Yeah? I saw G. Smith and the Sara Night Live 0:18:42.920 --> 0:18:45.639 Band backing up halland Oates at the first ever concert 0:18:45.640 --> 0:18:46.160 I ever saw. 0:18:47.200 --> 0:18:49.480 Now, my friend I knew you went and saw Hall 0:18:49.520 --> 0:18:51.520 of Oates. I did not know that G. Smith was 0:18:51.560 --> 0:18:53.040 in the SNL band? Was the band? 0:18:53.200 --> 0:18:55.520 Yes? And the I think it was the sect player 0:18:55.560 --> 0:18:57.879 who wore like the floor length mink coats, like the 0:18:57.920 --> 0:19:00.600 whole shebang. It was like the tick of Ala abandoned. 0:19:00.600 --> 0:19:01.919 That's who was touring with Hall. 0:19:01.800 --> 0:19:04.760 And Oates, and Oates was like, can you tone it down? 0:19:04.600 --> 0:19:05.600 Can get rid of that coat? 0:19:06.160 --> 0:19:08.080 It's competing with my hair and mustache. 0:19:10.080 --> 0:19:13.000 All right, I think we should probably take a break. Yeah, yeah, 0:19:13.640 --> 0:19:15.560 all right, and we'll be right back and talk about 0:19:15.640 --> 0:19:50.040 more grays right after this. All right. So that was 0:19:50.160 --> 0:19:54.080 in the sixties and seventies, but basically from the fifties 0:19:54.920 --> 0:19:58.119 on through the seventies, there were all kinds of encounters 0:19:58.240 --> 0:20:02.080 and there were a lot of different kinds of aliens 0:20:02.440 --> 0:20:07.399 that people were reporting, ranging from a headless wing bat 0:20:08.000 --> 0:20:12.320 kind of thing in England to a pointy eared, glowing 0:20:12.359 --> 0:20:16.439 eyed creature in North Carolina. And this is when UFO 0:20:16.600 --> 0:20:20.800 research groups, who very much want people to believe that 0:20:21.000 --> 0:20:24.680 UFOs and aliens are real, I get the feeling behind 0:20:24.720 --> 0:20:27.960 the scenes are like, guys, we got to consolidate around 0:20:27.960 --> 0:20:31.760 to look here because all these weird aliens that people 0:20:31.760 --> 0:20:36.040 are reporting are not doing ourselves are any favors. Basically, 0:20:36.480 --> 0:20:39.520 so can we settle on the Grays and they did. 0:20:39.640 --> 0:20:43.960 Yeah, and that somehow or another, that is exactly how 0:20:44.000 --> 0:20:47.520 it happened, and it ended up in mainstream pop culture 0:20:47.560 --> 0:20:51.119 being adopted like that, where Like, as the Grays became 0:20:51.160 --> 0:20:54.200 more and more widespread, it was like a positive feedback 0:20:54.240 --> 0:20:57.880 where more people portrayed aliens as the Grays because that's 0:20:57.880 --> 0:21:00.240 what aliens looked like, and it just kept spreading from 0:21:00.240 --> 0:21:05.080 there until the general streamlined understanding of what aliens looked 0:21:05.080 --> 0:21:08.720 like was the Grays over time. And I just want 0:21:08.760 --> 0:21:12.240 to point out that probably the greatest X Files episode 0:21:12.240 --> 0:21:16.040 of all time, Jose Chunks from Outer Space, turns this 0:21:16.160 --> 0:21:19.520 process on its head, where there are two gray aliens 0:21:19.560 --> 0:21:23.320 that turn out to be human actors in costumes who 0:21:23.359 --> 0:21:27.440 themselves have an actual legitimate alien encounter with an alien 0:21:27.480 --> 0:21:29.920 that looks like one of the just bizarre kind from 0:21:29.920 --> 0:21:32.679 the fifties. It's like has fur, it's a cyclops with 0:21:32.720 --> 0:21:37.080 a horn, and it has like a chicken legs, and 0:21:37.119 --> 0:21:40.000 that's like the actual alien. And I just think that's 0:21:40.119 --> 0:21:42.960 just as sharp as can be, that they took that 0:21:43.080 --> 0:21:44.800 thread and just twisted it around. 0:21:45.640 --> 0:21:47.760 I don't remember that episode. I was not an X 0:21:47.760 --> 0:21:51.239 Files watcher at the time when it aired. Huh. I 0:21:51.280 --> 0:21:56.840 got into it in the uh. Although when did it stop, 0:21:56.960 --> 0:22:01.800 you know, like the early two thousands. Okay, well what 0:22:01.840 --> 0:22:04.320 I did it was syndicated while it was still going then, 0:22:04.359 --> 0:22:08.520 I guess because I started watching reruns and syndication in 0:22:08.600 --> 0:22:12.879 like ninety seven, and don't I don't even know if 0:22:12.920 --> 0:22:14.560 I kind of started at the beginning and watched it 0:22:14.560 --> 0:22:16.480 all the way through. But when I was living in 0:22:16.520 --> 0:22:19.280 New Jersey, I ended up watching a lot of X Files, 0:22:19.359 --> 0:22:21.080 so then enjoyed it quite a bit. 0:22:21.320 --> 0:22:23.520 This is a standalone episode. You don't have to know 0:22:23.600 --> 0:22:25.840 anything that's going on to and joy. Yeah. Yeah, if 0:22:25.840 --> 0:22:28.160 you do know what's going on, it's even more enjoyable. 0:22:28.160 --> 0:22:32.280 But jose Chung is this science fiction author who has 0:22:32.320 --> 0:22:35.160 a book or something called from Outer Space, and he's 0:22:35.160 --> 0:22:38.600 played by Charles Nelson Riley. There's stories of the Men 0:22:38.680 --> 0:22:40.480 in Black showing up, and the Men in Black are 0:22:40.520 --> 0:22:44.960 played by Alex Trebek and Jesse the Body Ventura as themselves, 0:22:45.000 --> 0:22:49.840 but they're Men in Black. Oh yeah, it's an amazing episode. 0:22:49.920 --> 0:22:51.240 It's so great, So. 0:22:51.600 --> 0:22:52.840 I definitely don't remember that one. 0:22:52.880 --> 0:22:54.840 You need to go see it. It's really worth all right, 0:22:54.880 --> 0:22:57.560 it's worth your forty four minutes of your time. 0:22:58.880 --> 0:23:01.600 Were you into X files from the beginning, like Live 0:23:01.680 --> 0:23:02.280 Run or whatever? 0:23:02.680 --> 0:23:03.359 Pretty much? 0:23:03.520 --> 0:23:03.720 Yeah? 0:23:03.760 --> 0:23:05.600 Yeah when I watch it now, though I used to 0:23:05.840 --> 0:23:08.959 when originally I was like, God, get this stupid monster 0:23:09.000 --> 0:23:11.800 stuff out of let's get back to the alien right. 0:23:12.000 --> 0:23:12.240 Yeah. 0:23:12.359 --> 0:23:15.000 Now as a grown up, I'm like, that alien conspiracy 0:23:15.000 --> 0:23:17.280 thing is so played out. I really enjoy the Monster 0:23:17.400 --> 0:23:18.800 of the Week episode. Yeah more. 0:23:19.359 --> 0:23:21.840 Yeah, I think the mix of the two was kind 0:23:21.840 --> 0:23:22.760 of what made it so great. 0:23:22.880 --> 0:23:25.000 Yeah, it was very smart, all right. 0:23:25.080 --> 0:23:27.360 So the other thing we should mention about the Grays 0:23:27.760 --> 0:23:31.479 is that when Betty at one point they had her 0:23:31.640 --> 0:23:36.600 recreate a star map that the aliens who captured her 0:23:36.640 --> 0:23:40.840 had shown her, and when she described what she had seen, 0:23:41.640 --> 0:23:43.320 a lot of people said, it sounds a lot like 0:23:43.440 --> 0:23:47.680 Zeta Reticuli, which is a star system about thirty nine 0:23:47.760 --> 0:23:50.720 light years from Earth. And so you might hear them 0:23:50.720 --> 0:23:54.040 called Grays, but if you ever hear any anyone in 0:23:53.840 --> 0:23:57.160 the in the BIZ, I guess refer to the aliens 0:23:57.160 --> 0:23:59.359 as Zeta reticulans. That comes from that. 0:23:59.600 --> 0:24:03.080 Yeah, Like we said, a lot of the just the 0:24:03.119 --> 0:24:07.679 basics of alien abduction stories were founded by the Hills, 0:24:08.680 --> 0:24:15.440 unaccounted for missing time, being abducted, being probed just yeah, 0:24:15.520 --> 0:24:19.280 exactly all that stuff originally with the Hills, but it 0:24:19.359 --> 0:24:21.920 formed the basis or foundation that other people that come 0:24:22.040 --> 0:24:26.040 just kind of slowly built on. And there was one 0:24:26.080 --> 0:24:28.600 person who contributed quite a bit, an artist from New 0:24:28.680 --> 0:24:32.920 York named Bud Hopkins, who said that he had a 0:24:32.960 --> 0:24:35.320 close encounter. I guess it would be the second kind 0:24:35.760 --> 0:24:38.680 where they just saw like a flying saucer over Cape 0:24:38.720 --> 0:24:41.439 cod But it was enough, it was enough of an 0:24:41.520 --> 0:24:44.800 experience that he kind of became, I don't know if 0:24:44.840 --> 0:24:47.280 obsessed as the right were, but deeply interested in the 0:24:47.359 --> 0:24:50.679 idea of UFOs and aliens. So he started kind of 0:24:50.720 --> 0:24:53.480 researching the whole thing and ended up writing a book 0:24:53.480 --> 0:24:55.879 in nineteen eighty one called I Got to Take a 0:24:55.880 --> 0:25:00.560 Deep Breath Missing Time. Colon documented stories of people kidnapp 0:25:00.560 --> 0:25:02.880 by UFOs and then returned with their memories or race. 0:25:05.080 --> 0:25:07.040 Yeah, he didn't want to leave anything to chance as 0:25:07.040 --> 0:25:09.639 far as people misunderstanding what his book was about. 0:25:09.720 --> 0:25:11.919 Yeah, Colan, does that make sense. 0:25:11.880 --> 0:25:18.439 Right, Colan, I'm talking about aliens, baby. So that was 0:25:19.080 --> 0:25:22.280 a pretty big book and it established that pattern that 0:25:22.280 --> 0:25:25.560 we've been talking about of these abduction stories where you 0:25:25.600 --> 0:25:29.399 see the UFO and sometimes you don't remember anything and 0:25:29.400 --> 0:25:31.960 you just wake up in bed or whatever. Not accounting 0:25:31.960 --> 0:25:36.040 for the time there was a young woman in the book. 0:25:36.200 --> 0:25:39.080 It was the first time that anyone had claimed to 0:25:39.119 --> 0:25:43.159 have been abducted twice, a young woman named Virginia Horton 0:25:44.280 --> 0:25:45.879 when she was six, so I guess she was a 0:25:45.880 --> 0:25:49.560 little girl then and then at sixteen years old. And 0:25:49.840 --> 0:25:53.040 this also follows a pattern in the second one, she 0:25:53.200 --> 0:25:56.919 followed a deer into the woods and then woke up 0:25:56.960 --> 0:26:00.240 at home with a bloody nose and following an annial 0:26:00.280 --> 0:26:02.520 into the woods. As a story that pops up kind 0:26:02.520 --> 0:26:05.879 of quite a bit. You're talking about alien abduction. 0:26:05.640 --> 0:26:07.920 Yes, exactly. So one of the other things that Bud 0:26:07.920 --> 0:26:14.520 Hopkins contributed was the idea that people were being repeatedly abducted. 0:26:14.600 --> 0:26:17.800 Some people were, and that he's like, probably what's going 0:26:17.840 --> 0:26:21.399 on is they're being impregnated and then you know, they 0:26:22.400 --> 0:26:26.960 give birth and then this hybrid alien human baby is born, 0:26:27.160 --> 0:26:28.680 and that's really what's going on. 0:26:28.680 --> 0:26:30.600 Here, and that they take that baby daily. 0:26:30.760 --> 0:26:34.280 Yeah, but I think he also suggested that this was 0:26:34.400 --> 0:26:36.959 for the benefit of the human race that this was 0:26:37.040 --> 0:26:43.320 that they were actually benevolent as brutal or I guess 0:26:43.480 --> 0:26:45.719 uncomfortable as their tactics may have seemed. 0:26:46.160 --> 0:26:49.880 Yeah, for sure. So things are really cooking at this point. 0:26:50.720 --> 0:26:54.600 Finally we get to a very very popular book. Those 0:26:54.600 --> 0:26:59.280 guy named Whitley's Streber, who was a writer already in 0:26:59.359 --> 0:27:01.480 this really helped, you know, the fact that he was 0:27:01.520 --> 0:27:04.240 already a writer and had like the backing of publishers 0:27:04.760 --> 0:27:06.600 get this book out there. But he was a horror 0:27:06.600 --> 0:27:09.800 and science fiction writer and an eighty seven published the 0:27:09.800 --> 0:27:13.160 book Communion, which had if you look up the cover 0:27:13.240 --> 0:27:16.240 of Communion, the illustration that was done by Ted Jacobs 0:27:17.080 --> 0:27:19.560 along with you know, Striber, because he was like, this 0:27:19.680 --> 0:27:21.800 is what I saw. You got to draw this that 0:27:22.119 --> 0:27:27.320 that is as stereotypical alien head as you could imagine 0:27:27.320 --> 0:27:29.040 on the cover of this very popular book. 0:27:29.160 --> 0:27:32.080 Yeah, like if the Grays had kind of been percolating 0:27:32.119 --> 0:27:34.760 throughout pop culture, this is like where all that all 0:27:34.800 --> 0:27:38.760 those different threads got pulled into one alien image and 0:27:38.800 --> 0:27:41.200 then from that moment on, that's essentially what the Grays 0:27:41.200 --> 0:27:44.720 looked like that cover illustration. Because it was just such 0:27:44.760 --> 0:27:52.120 a widely read book and Streiber says and always has said, 0:27:52.200 --> 0:27:54.680 from what I can tell, he's never broken character. If 0:27:54.680 --> 0:27:57.679 this was a hoax, He's never ever even intimated that 0:27:57.800 --> 0:28:03.000 it was. He's He said that until he started realizing 0:28:03.080 --> 0:28:07.600 that he had been abducted, he had never really been 0:28:07.680 --> 0:28:10.760 much into aliens, had never done much research, so he 0:28:10.840 --> 0:28:14.879 was giving the impression that all of his accounts were fresh. 0:28:14.960 --> 0:28:17.399 He went into him fresh, like George Costanzo right, he 0:28:17.400 --> 0:28:19.840 didn't know what he was talking about when he was 0:28:19.840 --> 0:28:23.880 writing about this. This was a legitimate memory. And as 0:28:23.920 --> 0:28:27.520 he remembered more and more and more, he realized that 0:28:27.560 --> 0:28:30.639 this had been going on since childhood, and the entire 0:28:30.760 --> 0:28:34.720 chunks of his life were fabricated memories that had been 0:28:34.720 --> 0:28:37.920 implanted by the aliens that abducted him to cover up 0:28:38.240 --> 0:28:41.360 the memories of his actual abductions and what they were 0:28:41.400 --> 0:28:44.280 doing to him on their ships. And so in addition 0:28:44.360 --> 0:28:47.240 to that cover alien of the image of the Grays. 0:28:47.640 --> 0:28:50.640 One of the big things that Whitley Striver contributed to 0:28:50.720 --> 0:28:55.200 the whole I guess phenomenon is the idea of screen 0:28:55.280 --> 0:28:58.760 memories that now no longer was it just missing time. 0:28:59.040 --> 0:29:01.080 You might not be missing time, You might not even 0:29:01.120 --> 0:29:05.640 remember having been abducted, but you just knew you'd been abducted, 0:29:05.680 --> 0:29:07.520 and if you thought about it enough, or if you 0:29:07.560 --> 0:29:09.400 went and tried to get to the bottom of your 0:29:09.480 --> 0:29:13.080 repressed memories, those screen memories would fall away and the 0:29:13.160 --> 0:29:16.120 true memories of your abduction would bubble up to the surface. 0:29:16.760 --> 0:29:19.120 Yeah, and it was a very, very big book. It 0:29:19.160 --> 0:29:24.120 became a movie in nineteen eighty nine, a Christopher Walkin movie. 0:29:24.240 --> 0:29:26.680 I'm pretty sure I saw it back then. I don't 0:29:26.680 --> 0:29:27.880 know if I saw it in the theater or not. 0:29:27.960 --> 0:29:30.760 It feels like a VHS movie to me, Yeah, for sure. 0:29:31.760 --> 0:29:34.480 But Walkin played him. If you look up the trailer 0:29:34.560 --> 0:29:40.120 on YouTube, it's a terrifying trailer. It's really unsettling. You 0:29:40.120 --> 0:29:43.920 should watch it. With the music and everything. They portray 0:29:43.960 --> 0:29:47.080 it as like a horror movie basically. But he is 0:29:47.120 --> 0:29:51.680 one that also Stryverer, that is, who never also claimed 0:29:52.560 --> 0:29:56.760 like officially that they were space alien. He was just like, hey, 0:29:57.080 --> 0:30:01.640 this happened to me. I'm not saying there's space aliens necessarily. 0:30:02.400 --> 0:30:05.320 He actually said they could come from another dimension, or 0:30:05.360 --> 0:30:08.040 maybe it could be something else. I know. In one 0:30:08.040 --> 0:30:11.720 of our UFO episodes, I talked about the fact that 0:30:11.760 --> 0:30:16.880 there are some people who think that the Grays are 0:30:16.920 --> 0:30:20.040 just humans from the future. Yeah, and that's what we 0:30:20.120 --> 0:30:22.600 eventually evolved to look like because our brains get bigger 0:30:22.640 --> 0:30:26.600 and bigger, so our heads bigger, and the actual outer 0:30:26.720 --> 0:30:30.360 ear is superfluous to the real hearing mechanism, So that's 0:30:30.360 --> 0:30:32.960 why they don't appear to have ears or noses. They 0:30:33.000 --> 0:30:35.480 just have ear holes and nose holes. And you know, 0:30:36.280 --> 0:30:39.040 as we go on, the eyes are supposedly getting bigger 0:30:39.520 --> 0:30:42.400 as we evolve, So that's you know, that's one theory. 0:30:42.520 --> 0:30:45.600 Right or another one is that they're from another dimension, 0:30:45.880 --> 0:30:49.480 not necessarily from space. One of the other things that 0:30:49.520 --> 0:30:54.600 Striver contributed was the idea that you would be probed 0:30:54.720 --> 0:30:57.920 anally or sexually in some way, shape or form. Remember 0:30:58.800 --> 0:31:02.280 Boas the Brazilian farmer, was the one who contributed being 0:31:02.680 --> 0:31:10.920 sexually assaulted aboard a spaceship the UFO exactly, But apparently 0:31:11.040 --> 0:31:15.360 most scholars trace the anal probe trope to Whitley Striber. 0:31:15.480 --> 0:31:17.760 He said that there was a large object with a 0:31:17.800 --> 0:31:20.760 network of wires on the end that was inserted into 0:31:20.760 --> 0:31:24.760 his rectum. And what's interesting is that bears a strange 0:31:25.720 --> 0:31:29.960 resemblance to what Barney Hill claimed too. He said that 0:31:30.040 --> 0:31:33.400 he had been anally probed and that there was a 0:31:33.480 --> 0:31:36.680 needle with a network of wires or something along that line. 0:31:36.680 --> 0:31:39.320 He didn't use that exact phrase, but that it had 0:31:39.360 --> 0:31:41.520 been left out of the book by John G. Fuller, 0:31:41.800 --> 0:31:45.280 that detail had it was only it was only it 0:31:45.320 --> 0:31:48.080 only showed up in a nineteen sixty five Nightcap report, 0:31:48.520 --> 0:31:51.280 So it wasn't well known at the time. Although it's 0:31:51.400 --> 0:31:55.320 entirely possible that if Whitley Striver was a hoaxer, you 0:31:55.360 --> 0:31:57.320 can imagine as a writer, he would have done enough 0:31:57.360 --> 0:31:59.479 research to go back and read a nineteen sixty five 0:31:59.560 --> 0:32:03.200 report about the quintessential abduction experience. 0:32:03.920 --> 0:32:06.880 Yeah, And as far as the anal probe goes, I've 0:32:06.880 --> 0:32:09.160 given this a lot of thought over the years, uh huh, 0:32:09.280 --> 0:32:13.200 and so like why that's always a thing, And the 0:32:13.240 --> 0:32:15.320 only thing I could come up with is that, you know, 0:32:15.400 --> 0:32:17.240 there are only so many holes. There are only so 0:32:17.280 --> 0:32:21.680 many areas of entry in your body, you know. Yeah, 0:32:21.720 --> 0:32:24.040 And there are reports of you know, nose probes and 0:32:24.080 --> 0:32:29.080 bleeding noses and stuff like that, And I think the 0:32:28.880 --> 0:32:33.440 the hidden quality, the hidden nature of the butthole might 0:32:33.600 --> 0:32:36.280 entice aliens to be like you know, there they see 0:32:36.280 --> 0:32:37.920 the nose, they see the ears, they see how the 0:32:37.960 --> 0:32:40.840 obvious ones, and then there's like ooh, there's a hidden one, right, 0:32:41.200 --> 0:32:42.520 like what treasure awaits us? 0:32:42.640 --> 0:32:46.040 Yeah, that's universal, not just among humans but around the universe, 0:32:46.120 --> 0:32:50.440 Like what is in that butthole? Yeah, that's a great 0:32:50.480 --> 0:32:55.000 good stuff. I like that. Uh so, yeah, that's that's 0:32:55.040 --> 0:32:57.120 just kind of like a little like a lot of 0:32:57.120 --> 0:32:59.040 people chuck that up to Whitley Striber, which may or 0:32:59.120 --> 0:33:02.680 may not be Yeah, correct, but that is interesting. That 0:33:02.840 --> 0:33:05.320 was nineteen eighty nine that the movie community came out, 0:33:05.360 --> 0:33:07.840 what'd you say, nineteen eighty seven for the book that 0:33:07.880 --> 0:33:09.960 had a huge effect. The X Files, like we said, 0:33:10.040 --> 0:33:12.600 came along and took all this stuff. Like if you 0:33:12.640 --> 0:33:15.440 watch the X Files back then or now or whenever, 0:33:16.400 --> 0:33:19.160 all of this is just so familiar. Like Chris Carter 0:33:19.680 --> 0:33:25.480 apparently read up on the abduction phenomenon and just turned 0:33:25.520 --> 0:33:28.480 it into different plot lines, right, so yeah, pure goal. Yeah, 0:33:28.560 --> 0:33:31.760 and so that just spread it out into the pop 0:33:31.800 --> 0:33:34.320 culture even further. And then there was a guy named 0:33:34.400 --> 0:33:37.520 John Mack who was the head of Harvard's psychiatry department, 0:33:37.960 --> 0:33:42.960 who was far and away the most credentialed person to 0:33:43.040 --> 0:33:46.160 come out and say I'm pretty sure these people are 0:33:46.200 --> 0:33:48.240 telling the truth in some way, shape or form. 0:33:48.960 --> 0:33:51.920 Yeah, And everyone was like, sure, you want to come 0:33:51.960 --> 0:33:52.360 out with us? 0:33:52.920 --> 0:33:55.640 Yeah, and he did very bravely. He was one of 0:33:55.680 --> 0:33:58.920 those people who railed against science just kind of having 0:33:58.920 --> 0:34:01.360 its own dogma, keeping its head in the sand about 0:34:01.360 --> 0:34:03.760 things that couldn't explain. He didn't like that very much, 0:34:03.800 --> 0:34:06.400 so that kind of fit with his vibe from what 0:34:06.440 --> 0:34:09.000 I can tell, But he kind of lent a little 0:34:09.000 --> 0:34:12.440 bit of legitimacy, especially if you were on the fringes. 0:34:12.719 --> 0:34:15.000 The fact that he was saying the stuff just gave 0:34:15.040 --> 0:34:16.520 you so much support. Right then. 0:34:17.280 --> 0:34:20.080 Yeah, he had a book in ninety four about thirteen 0:34:20.120 --> 0:34:27.680 different abduction cases called Abduction colon Human Encounters with Alien Parentheses. Btw, 0:34:28.160 --> 0:34:29.680 I teach at Harvard. 0:34:29.920 --> 0:34:33.719 Right, did I mention? Yeah? So I say we take 0:34:33.760 --> 0:34:36.920 another break and come back and talk about what scholars 0:34:36.960 --> 0:34:40.200 who don't buy the fact that these are actual alien 0:34:40.239 --> 0:34:41.440 abductions make of all this. 0:34:42.160 --> 0:34:43.719 Yeah, it gets pretty interesting after this. 0:34:43.800 --> 0:35:17.520 I think, Okay, Chuck, there's a couple of nuts and 0:35:17.520 --> 0:35:21.759 bolts things you should know about UFO subculture and it's 0:35:21.760 --> 0:35:24.000 so extensive, and it's been around for so long, and 0:35:24.040 --> 0:35:25.799 the people who are into it are so into it 0:35:26.200 --> 0:35:29.319 that just by glossing over it, we're probably gonna get 0:35:29.360 --> 0:35:31.680 stuff wrong, or we're just going to walk past some stuff. 0:35:31.840 --> 0:35:34.040 We're not experts, We've never claimed to be experts, and 0:35:34.080 --> 0:35:37.239 we're not experts of UFO subculture, So just want to 0:35:37.280 --> 0:35:40.000 caveat that. Probably should have said that at the outset 0:35:40.040 --> 0:35:44.360 of this episode. But in UFO subculture, from the research 0:35:44.360 --> 0:35:47.400 I've seen, there's a you can kind of divide people 0:35:49.200 --> 0:35:54.120 into two groups. One are contactees people who have met aliens, 0:35:55.000 --> 0:35:59.080 and the other is abductees, and those are people who 0:35:59.120 --> 0:36:01.840 have been taken by it millions. And if you'll remember 0:36:01.840 --> 0:36:04.279 back to our Project blue Book episode, there was an 0:36:04.320 --> 0:36:07.480 astronomer named Jay Allen Heinek who was a debunker of 0:36:07.600 --> 0:36:11.560 UFOs until he just became a true believer. He's the 0:36:11.600 --> 0:36:15.680 guy who came up with the close encounters classifications. Yeah, 0:36:15.719 --> 0:36:19.960 he left off with close encounters of the third kind contact. 0:36:20.719 --> 0:36:23.759 What abductees brought to that was close encounters of the 0:36:23.760 --> 0:36:26.520 fourth kind, where you were taken against your will into 0:36:26.560 --> 0:36:29.520 a spaceship. And among those two different groups there's two 0:36:29.719 --> 0:36:34.040 very different views of aliens between contact e's and abductees. 0:36:34.840 --> 0:36:37.359 Yeah, for sure, if you're a contactee, you're much more 0:36:37.520 --> 0:36:43.600 likely to relate a positive experience. Basically, I think a 0:36:43.640 --> 0:36:46.880 lot of the contactees I've read that they feel like 0:36:46.920 --> 0:36:50.480 they're like a feeling of being chosen, like in a 0:36:50.480 --> 0:36:54.320 good way. Abductees, it's kind of the other way around. 0:36:54.480 --> 0:36:59.200 There's all kinds of stories of probing, non consensual encounters, 0:37:00.080 --> 0:37:03.680 medical procedures going on. You know, all the stuff that 0:37:04.040 --> 0:37:06.359 you hear about shoving things in different holes of your 0:37:06.360 --> 0:37:11.680 body are not positive experiences for most abductees. And it's 0:37:11.719 --> 0:37:16.000 really interesting. I think that the contact ease can feel 0:37:16.480 --> 0:37:20.320 like chosen or touched. Where's the abductees feel violated? 0:37:20.360 --> 0:37:24.120 It is super interesting. There's also kind of a subgroup 0:37:24.160 --> 0:37:27.880 of abductees. Those are the people who have no memory 0:37:27.960 --> 0:37:31.040 of being abducted, but they're sure that they were abducted. 0:37:31.160 --> 0:37:35.279 They probably have unaccounted time in their life that they 0:37:35.440 --> 0:37:37.719 can look back on and think like what happened there? 0:37:38.000 --> 0:37:40.840 They just get the sense that they're abducted too. 0:37:40.719 --> 0:37:42.960 Right, So yeah, which is interesting. 0:37:43.080 --> 0:37:47.480 It is super interesting. The thing is this is really 0:37:47.480 --> 0:37:50.360 really important. I saw this in a lot of different 0:37:50.360 --> 0:37:54.840 places with people who research UFO abductees. They say that 0:37:55.080 --> 0:37:58.520 there are definitely people who are hoaxters. Yeah, there are 0:37:58.560 --> 0:38:02.000 definitely people who have like serious mental illness and are 0:38:02.040 --> 0:38:06.560 actually delusional, but that by and large, on the whole, 0:38:07.280 --> 0:38:13.720 UFO abductees are sane, sincere, genuine people who truly believe 0:38:13.800 --> 0:38:16.400 that they were abducted by aliens and whose lives have 0:38:16.520 --> 0:38:20.120 been in a lot of cases wrecked by it because 0:38:20.160 --> 0:38:23.880 they display the symptoms of trauma. They have post traumatic 0:38:23.880 --> 0:38:28.560 stress disorder symptoms from being abducted. And so if you're like, well, 0:38:28.880 --> 0:38:32.239 you know, I don't really buy any of this as 0:38:32.320 --> 0:38:36.680 being alien in nature, Like how would you explain it? 0:38:36.760 --> 0:38:39.480 And so sociology and psychology have said about trying to 0:38:39.480 --> 0:38:43.120 explain it, neither ones really kind of rung the bell fully. 0:38:43.200 --> 0:38:48.120 Yet, Yeah, for sure, there is there as plenty of 0:38:48.120 --> 0:38:51.640 research that's been done, even though they haven't you know, 0:38:52.200 --> 0:38:53.600 like you said, they haven't come to it like a 0:38:53.640 --> 0:39:00.720 great conclusion about it. But abductees their memories. The idea 0:39:00.920 --> 0:39:03.480 is like, if you're an abductee or you claim to 0:39:03.480 --> 0:39:07.000 be an abductee, then you're probably more prone to false memory, 0:39:07.440 --> 0:39:09.480 and there are some different tests they can do. One 0:39:09.560 --> 0:39:16.439 is called the Deese Rodiger McDermott task DRM, and that's 0:39:16.440 --> 0:39:18.640 where they give you a bunch of words that are 0:39:18.719 --> 0:39:22.080 sort of linked together, but there's a one word. They 0:39:22.080 --> 0:39:26.040 call it a lure word that's missing. So lyvia put 0:39:26.040 --> 0:39:31.840 together an example of snooze, blanket, snore or dream pillow bed. 0:39:32.640 --> 0:39:35.239 They don't use the word sleep in there, very key, 0:39:35.320 --> 0:39:39.480 but obviously that's the one word that's missing. And the 0:39:39.560 --> 0:39:43.840 people that are asked to sort of recount this and 0:39:44.000 --> 0:39:48.120 if they insert the missing word that there was never mentioned, 0:39:48.160 --> 0:39:50.960 like if they say sleep, then they're saying, all right, well, 0:39:51.000 --> 0:39:53.759 you're more susceptible to a false memory because we never 0:39:53.840 --> 0:39:54.440 said sleep. 0:39:54.600 --> 0:39:57.480 So there, Yeah, that's exactly how they present it to 0:39:58.239 --> 0:40:01.120 yeh at the end of the study. It's very humiliating, 0:40:01.840 --> 0:40:03.960 but yeah, that's kind of one of the general premises 0:40:04.000 --> 0:40:07.320 that people who believe that they were abducted by UFOs 0:40:07.320 --> 0:40:10.440 and whose lives are really affected by it negatively just 0:40:10.600 --> 0:40:14.880 are more susceptible to generating false memories, and some research 0:40:14.920 --> 0:40:18.160 backs that up. There have been studies that show that 0:40:18.200 --> 0:40:22.160 they do report more critical lower words than other people. 0:40:22.239 --> 0:40:26.200 Who don't believe they were abducted. Other studies say, we 0:40:26.400 --> 0:40:29.680 tried the same thing and found no difference whatsoever between 0:40:29.719 --> 0:40:33.640 the two, but we did find differences in other psychological 0:40:33.680 --> 0:40:41.799 traits like disassociativity, like having like reality seems unreal to you, absorption, 0:40:42.000 --> 0:40:46.040 which is a predisposition to get deeply immersed in sensory 0:40:46.360 --> 0:40:53.680 or mystical experiences, the likelier to have paranormal beliefs, likelier 0:40:53.719 --> 0:40:57.840 to believe that they have psychic abilities, fantasy proneness, difficulty 0:40:57.880 --> 0:41:01.520 differentiating between fantasy and reality, and a tendency to hallucinate. 0:41:02.080 --> 0:41:04.520 And that so these people are like, no, it's not 0:41:04.719 --> 0:41:08.560 a proneeness to developing false memories. It's all these other 0:41:08.680 --> 0:41:11.960 traits that are basically they're luring these people into this 0:41:12.080 --> 0:41:15.560 kind of fantasy world that they're not distinguishing from reality, 0:41:16.520 --> 0:41:19.040 and that that essentially has become part of their life 0:41:19.080 --> 0:41:21.720 to them, they've adopted that as part of their life. 0:41:21.960 --> 0:41:26.000 Those seem to be the two dominant rival psychological explanations 0:41:26.000 --> 0:41:26.279 for this. 0:41:27.120 --> 0:41:30.160 Yeah, and there's another sort of not sort of it 0:41:30.160 --> 0:41:34.960 sounds incredibly cruel. Test that was done, or a study 0:41:35.040 --> 0:41:39.360 rather when they got kids together either seven or eight 0:41:39.440 --> 0:41:42.200 year olds or eleven and twelve year olds, and they said, 0:41:42.880 --> 0:41:45.000 you were abducted by an alien when you were four 0:41:45.080 --> 0:41:49.640 years old. In fact, here's your mom and she's gonna 0:41:49.719 --> 0:41:53.239 reinforce this by telling you this happened. And here's a 0:41:53.280 --> 0:41:55.719 fake newspaper. Well they don't say fake, but here's a 0:41:55.760 --> 0:41:59.440 newspaper report that talks about these abductions being you know, 0:41:59.480 --> 0:42:02.680 pretty calm, and it's totally made up, of course. And 0:42:02.719 --> 0:42:06.879 then if these children go on to describe a lot 0:42:06.920 --> 0:42:11.160 more detail about the memory of being abducted when they 0:42:11.160 --> 0:42:14.360 were four years old, then their classified as having false memories. 0:42:14.760 --> 0:42:16.399 And I just I can't believe that they were allowed 0:42:16.400 --> 0:42:17.279 to get away with doing it. 0:42:17.400 --> 0:42:21.279 Yeah, from what this one, I think a British Psychological 0:42:21.560 --> 0:42:25.000 Association or society article found that they could find two 0:42:25.080 --> 0:42:30.920 studies that tried to implant false subduction memories into kids. 0:42:31.360 --> 0:42:35.120 One was from nineteen eighty four and they actually ascribed 0:42:35.120 --> 0:42:40.200 abductions to basically suppressed or repressed memories of being born. 0:42:40.800 --> 0:42:42.440 And then this one from two thousand and nine with 0:42:42.520 --> 0:42:48.520 Oatgar and friends, right, and like, yeah, it's deeply unethical, 0:42:48.520 --> 0:42:50.560 and they debriefed the kids. They said, no, this is 0:42:50.600 --> 0:42:53.600 all just a study or whatever, so you don't walk 0:42:53.640 --> 0:42:56.160 around thinking like this actually really happened to you, but 0:42:56.440 --> 0:42:59.759 who knows if that really worked. But it raised a 0:42:59.800 --> 0:43:03.480 really important point, really as unethical as it was, showed 0:43:03.960 --> 0:43:07.319 how easy it is for false memories to be implanted, 0:43:07.920 --> 0:43:12.360 especially if you are being told that by someone in 0:43:12.400 --> 0:43:15.240 a position and of authority like your psychologists or therapists 0:43:15.280 --> 0:43:19.120 or psychiatrist. Right. Yeah, And there's a really big rift 0:43:19.640 --> 0:43:25.080 in the field of psychology and psychiatry between whether you 0:43:25.120 --> 0:43:30.239 whether traumatic memories can be repressed, and if so, that 0:43:30.280 --> 0:43:33.279 means they can probably be recovered through good therapy, or 0:43:33.600 --> 0:43:36.920 if you don't actually repress traumatic experiences, and that if 0:43:37.000 --> 0:43:39.560 you do try to recover memories, what you remember is 0:43:39.560 --> 0:43:43.040 going to be false memories that are accidentally implanted. So 0:43:43.120 --> 0:43:46.799 that whole premise that you have missing time, and that 0:43:46.880 --> 0:43:49.720 if you go see a therapist who's sympathetic and understands 0:43:49.760 --> 0:43:52.800 what you're going through, they will help you recover those memories. 0:43:53.200 --> 0:43:56.200 It strongly suggests that all those are our false memories, 0:43:56.280 --> 0:44:00.120 even though again they're causing real legitimate pain in these 0:44:00.160 --> 0:44:01.239 people's lives. 0:44:01.719 --> 0:44:04.560 Yeah, for sure. And I know we talked about this 0:44:05.040 --> 0:44:08.919 and maybe Project Bluebrik Book, but some others as far 0:44:09.000 --> 0:44:12.200 as what else this could be why you're having these 0:44:12.239 --> 0:44:15.839 false memories, and sleep paralysis always seems to come up. 0:44:16.400 --> 0:44:19.400 We did an episode on this. About fifteen percent of 0:44:19.440 --> 0:44:23.759 the population experiences it. It's when you wake up in 0:44:23.800 --> 0:44:26.000 the middle of the night. You can't move, You might 0:44:26.080 --> 0:44:29.319 hear some buzzing sounds, you might see flashing lights. You 0:44:29.440 --> 0:44:34.360 almost always, it seems like, see pretty frightening shadowy figures 0:44:34.520 --> 0:44:37.120 in your room, maybe hovering above you or at the 0:44:37.120 --> 0:44:40.719 foot of your bed. So sleep paralysis could explain some 0:44:40.760 --> 0:44:43.839 of this, or theoretically it could. And then another one 0:44:43.840 --> 0:44:47.239 which is interesting as far as the hypothesis goes, is 0:44:47.760 --> 0:44:54.520 magnetic disturbances by plate tectonics that are causing hallucinations. And 0:44:56.120 --> 0:44:59.360 this is what's really interesting to me, distorted recollections of 0:44:59.760 --> 0:45:05.160 meta procedures while you're under anesthesia, like as you're going out. 0:45:05.320 --> 0:45:08.200 I think anyone who's ever done the twilight sleep thing 0:45:08.400 --> 0:45:12.160 for some you know or major you know surgery, When 0:45:12.160 --> 0:45:15.040 you're fully under that six or seven seconds where you're 0:45:15.080 --> 0:45:18.280 laying there with the bright light above you and people 0:45:18.360 --> 0:45:23.800 hovering over you, it gets weirder and weirder, and people 0:45:23.840 --> 0:45:26.279 think that this could be associated with that because a 0:45:26.320 --> 0:45:31.600 lot of the people who had reported abductions had undergone 0:45:31.680 --> 0:45:32.560 surgery recently. 0:45:32.719 --> 0:45:36.560 Yeah, that's pretty pretty interesting as far as coincidences go. 0:45:36.880 --> 0:45:39.719 That's anesthesia awareness, and I think I think we did 0:45:39.760 --> 0:45:42.600 a whole episode on it. The idea that you can 0:45:42.719 --> 0:45:45.879 have memories if you're not under quite enough, and that 0:45:46.040 --> 0:45:48.440 if it's a medical procedure, yeah, you could remember that 0:45:48.520 --> 0:45:51.440 as aliens, you know, probing you or whatever. 0:45:52.160 --> 0:45:54.319 Sure, Yeah, that's what it feels like. 0:45:54.760 --> 0:45:58.960 Yeah, well guess so for sure, I just remember being like, man, 0:45:59.000 --> 0:46:03.480 I'm so wasted, reminding myself like, oh yeah, I'm allowed 0:46:03.520 --> 0:46:08.400 to be These people got me wasted, right. Sociology, for 0:46:08.480 --> 0:46:11.359 their part, has done some study too, and just kind 0:46:11.360 --> 0:46:13.759 of quickly what they've come up with is that if 0:46:13.800 --> 0:46:17.480 you are very religious, you're probably less likely to believe 0:46:17.480 --> 0:46:19.960 in aliens and even less likely to believe you were 0:46:20.000 --> 0:46:25.960 abducted by aliens. But if you are untrusting of the government, 0:46:26.360 --> 0:46:30.480 you're far likelier to no surprise, yeah, to believe that 0:46:30.520 --> 0:46:32.240 you were abducted by aliens. 0:46:32.719 --> 0:46:34.880 Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And also the 0:46:34.920 --> 0:46:39.560 fact that who is it Joseph O. Baker's a sociologist 0:46:39.640 --> 0:46:42.960 who studies this stuff a lot, and he's like, post Watergate, 0:46:43.040 --> 0:46:45.160 you saw a lot of this stuff happening, and that's 0:46:45.239 --> 0:46:46.960 you know, when a lot of people have had big 0:46:47.000 --> 0:46:49.200 distrust of the government. So it sort of there's a 0:46:49.200 --> 0:46:50.640 correlation there at least for sure. 0:46:51.080 --> 0:46:53.920 And then I say we wrap it up on that 0:46:54.120 --> 0:46:58.680 study by Bud Hopkins, the artists who've gotten real deep into. 0:46:58.680 --> 0:47:01.040 Abduction lore, Yeah, let's do. 0:47:01.000 --> 0:47:04.319 It, Okay. So in the nineties Bud Hopkins worked with 0:47:04.360 --> 0:47:07.880 some academics and came up with like a legitimate random 0:47:07.960 --> 0:47:12.880 survey that sought to see how many of the population, 0:47:13.239 --> 0:47:16.759 like what percentage of the population believes they were abducted, 0:47:17.080 --> 0:47:19.680 And they came up with a like five like a 0:47:19.760 --> 0:47:22.400 questionnaire that got to the bottom of whether somebody felt 0:47:22.400 --> 0:47:25.799 like they had experienced five different aspects of abduction, right 0:47:26.120 --> 0:47:28.880 waking up paralyzed, with a sense of strange presence in 0:47:28.920 --> 0:47:31.279 the room, losing an hour or more of time that 0:47:31.400 --> 0:47:34.799 lost an accounted for a time. Feeling of flying could 0:47:34.840 --> 0:47:38.479 also correlate with witchcraft. Seeing strange lights in a room 0:47:38.880 --> 0:47:41.560 and then finding odd scars on your body and being 0:47:41.640 --> 0:47:44.080 like I have no idea where the scar came from. 0:47:44.560 --> 0:47:48.120 Yeah, So they did that this in the early nineteen nineties. 0:47:48.200 --> 0:47:52.879 They did some they know, controlled the data or did 0:47:52.880 --> 0:47:56.279 some controlling for the data, and they found that two 0:47:56.360 --> 0:47:59.600 percent of the sample had four of those five related 0:47:59.640 --> 0:48:02.760 experien variance has happen to them, which is about three 0:48:02.800 --> 0:48:08.400 point seven million Americans. That number, I think at UFO 0:48:08.440 --> 0:48:11.160 ologists and you know, people who study this stuff say, now, 0:48:11.239 --> 0:48:14.320 you know that number is really really high. It's probably 0:48:14.360 --> 0:48:19.280 more like thousands, but three point seven million people experience 0:48:19.280 --> 0:48:20.600 at least for of those five things. 0:48:20.840 --> 0:48:22.800 Yeah, a lot of people. So a lot of people 0:48:22.880 --> 0:48:26.279 use that in like articles and stuff on that, like, 0:48:26.320 --> 0:48:28.879 three point seven million is a big number. But yeah, 0:48:28.920 --> 0:48:30.920 I just want to point out they they had a 0:48:30.960 --> 0:48:34.640 really ingenious way of separating out the fibers from the outset. 0:48:35.400 --> 0:48:38.080 One of the questions was, you know, does the word 0:48:38.160 --> 0:48:42.959 trondant mean have special meaning for you? And about one 0:48:43.080 --> 0:48:46.680 percent of respondents said, yep, that really does you know 0:48:46.719 --> 0:48:49.279 what I'm talking about? And Trondon is a made up 0:48:49.320 --> 0:48:52.080 word that they used to catch fibers. And I think 0:48:52.160 --> 0:48:55.240 Trondon is like a really great band name too, especially 0:48:55.280 --> 0:48:56.719 because of the background it. 0:48:56.840 --> 0:48:59.839 Has Yeah, Space Rocket, good one. 0:49:00.719 --> 0:49:03.719 You got anything else? Yeah, Yeah, I mean, the whole 0:49:03.719 --> 0:49:05.680 thing's still ongoing. There's plenty of people out there who 0:49:05.680 --> 0:49:09.480 believe they were abducted, and psychology is still struggling to 0:49:09.920 --> 0:49:12.480 get to the bottom of it fully, So hopefully it will, 0:49:12.520 --> 0:49:14.279 so it can help all those people whose lives are 0:49:14.280 --> 0:49:15.560 affected by it negatively. 0:49:16.280 --> 0:49:18.280 Yeah, And at the very least we've gotten some fun 0:49:18.560 --> 0:49:19.480 movie and TVs out of. 0:49:19.480 --> 0:49:21.799 There for sure. If you want to know more about 0:49:21.840 --> 0:49:24.360 alien abductions, there's a lot to read out there, and 0:49:24.400 --> 0:49:26.160 you can do that. And in the meantime, we're just 0:49:26.239 --> 0:49:27.959 going to go ahead and have a listener mail. 0:49:31.760 --> 0:49:35.759 Hey, guys, been listening since twenty thirteen. Since then, you've 0:49:35.800 --> 0:49:39.440 been with me through college graduation, brain surgery, a wedding, 0:49:39.480 --> 0:49:41.920 COVID at, my teaching career, IVYF and. 0:49:41.880 --> 0:49:44.680 Our new baby Wowee. 0:49:44.280 --> 0:49:46.279 Since Amber was born in last July, and catching up 0:49:46.320 --> 0:49:50.759 on missed episodes. In August twenty twenty three, I think 0:49:50.760 --> 0:49:54.160 you had a couple of EPs about language acquisition. This 0:49:54.239 --> 0:49:55.960 is so in my wheelhouse because I'm a middle high 0:49:55.960 --> 0:49:58.480 school Spanish teacher and it maybe think of this anecdote 0:49:58.560 --> 0:50:02.600 relating to language act posician frequently pepper Spanish into my 0:50:02.640 --> 0:50:07.400 daily vocabulary. And I also hate squirrels. This is right 0:50:07.440 --> 0:50:11.280 up your alley, Josh. I frequently refer to them in Spanish. 0:50:11.280 --> 0:50:13.480 One day last summer, I asked my husband, who is 0:50:13.520 --> 0:50:17.279 a gringo, what he thought the Spanish word for squirrel was. 0:50:17.840 --> 0:50:22.600 He hesitated and then guessed, bendejo. I'll let you look 0:50:22.680 --> 0:50:25.280 up at that word actually means, but it's definitely not squirrel. 0:50:26.000 --> 0:50:29.160 After listening to the Para Social Relationship episode, I got 0:50:29.200 --> 0:50:32.600 too embarrassed to tell you this anecdote anecdote right away 0:50:32.640 --> 0:50:35.440 after the language episodes, but I decided to send it 0:50:35.480 --> 0:50:38.600 anyway now. Currently listening to the twenty twenty three Halloween 0:50:38.640 --> 0:50:41.600 special and hope to be caught up by June. And 0:50:41.600 --> 0:50:42.839 that is from Becky Hill. 0:50:43.680 --> 0:50:46.319 Thanks a lot, Becky, and congratulations to you and your 0:50:46.400 --> 0:50:49.359 husband on the birth of Amber. And from what I 0:50:49.360 --> 0:50:52.680 know about bendejo, like that's a pretty accurate. 0:50:52.440 --> 0:50:53.640 Term for squirrel. 0:50:54.160 --> 0:50:57.160 Yeah. Okay, if you want to be like Becky and 0:50:57.200 --> 0:50:59.000 get in touch with us and just share some great 0:50:59.040 --> 0:51:01.680 stuff about your life, we love to hear that. You 0:51:01.719 --> 0:51:04.120 can send it off in an email to Stuff Podcast 0:51:04.200 --> 0:51:09.840 at iHeartRadio dot com. Stuff you Should Know is a 0:51:09.840 --> 0:51:13.800 production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts myheart Radio, visit the 0:51:13.840 --> 0:51:17.160 iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your 0:51:17.160 --> 0:51:17.920 favorite shows.