Speaker 1: Welcome to Strictly Business Varieties weekly podcast featuring conversations with
Speaker 1: industry leaders about the business of media and entertainment. I'm
Speaker 1: Cynthia Littleton, business editor for Variety Today. My guest is
Speaker 1: Rob Mills, ABC's head of Alternative Series, Specials and Late Night.
Speaker 1: We recorded this via the New Information super Highway, a
Speaker 1: zoom call, with Rob speaking from his home in Los
Speaker 1: Angeles and me from my place in Sunnyside, Queens. In
Speaker 1: a lively conversation, Rob offers insights into how ABC found
Speaker 1: the way to salvage American idols live shows. He also
Speaker 1: talks about the business of game shows and why he
Speaker 1: wants to get a new season of The Bachelor in production.
Speaker 1: A s a p. Rob Mills, Senior vice president of
Speaker 1: Alternative Series, Specials and Late Night for ABC Entertainment, Thank
Speaker 1: you so much for joining us today through the magic
Speaker 1: of zoom technology flying through the airwaves. Yes, this is amazing.
Speaker 1: It's as if we were doing this in person. Cyn't
Speaker 1: thea thrilled to be here. I'm disappointed because this in
Speaker 1: fact was set up initially to be done in person,
Speaker 1: but that was not meant to be, so we are
Speaker 1: being resilient and and finding new ways to communicate, which
Speaker 1: is basically the job of the entire media and entertainment
Speaker 1: complex right now, tell us give us a little color
Speaker 1: about how you and your team have been have been
Speaker 1: continuing to program and develop and you know, make the
Speaker 1: plans that you need to keep the robust alternative series
Speaker 1: flowing to the ABC Television Network. Well, I mean, fortunately
Speaker 1: have to say, I don't think anyone has ever been busier. Uh,
Speaker 1: it's sort of been a kind of two pronged approach.
Speaker 1: One is, there's a lot of stuff we already have
Speaker 1: that's in various stages of pre pre pre production, production,
Speaker 1: and post production, so you're getting everything kind of righty
Speaker 1: and keeping those trains running. And then, as we've seen
Speaker 1: a lot of certainly on the special side, there's a
Speaker 1: lot of these specials that are being put together kind
Speaker 1: of quickly and nimbly that we're working on. We're doing
Speaker 1: the the Together at Home thing with the w h
Speaker 1: O that's gonna air on the eight Team. We're working
Speaker 1: on doing something kind of with the Disney the Disney Songbook.
Speaker 1: We're going to special there with celebrities that we're really
Speaker 1: excited about. So uh, there's there's still a lot of
Speaker 1: stuff going on. Also, you know American Idol, which has
Speaker 1: it's just getting to its live component, keeping that going
Speaker 1: and how we're going to do that, getting Jimmy Kimmel
Speaker 1: back on the air. So we've actually been coping by
Speaker 1: just keeping incredibly busy. And I'm so proud of my team.
Speaker 1: Everyone's been just fantastic and really kind of working their
Speaker 1: butt off. And has it really been like you know,
Speaker 1: everybody you know, mostly if not exclusively at home, everybody
Speaker 1: at home. Yeah, I have to say, it's amazing. I
Speaker 1: didn't even know what zoom was, how to work it's
Speaker 1: what it meant, And now I feel like I don't
Speaker 1: even remember when we did when we worked without it?
Speaker 1: You um have you have you guys had the like
Speaker 1: you know, everybody's had the story of like the really
Speaker 1: important meeting where the glitches just you know became like
Speaker 1: became part of became part of an agenda item, Like
Speaker 1: how we're working through those? Oh, yeah, we've dealt with that,
Speaker 1: but we we've powered through and found a way and
Speaker 1: and things are still still going up. How are you
Speaker 1: how do you work with producers who also are you
Speaker 1: must there must be a certain level of producer that
Speaker 1: has to be in a building somewhere with cameras and
Speaker 1: a and a control board. Or is it literally everybody's
Speaker 1: contributing their part from home. No, it really is everybody
Speaker 1: from home. I mean I think that as we keep
Speaker 1: doing these things with each specific show, like with Jimmy
Speaker 1: Kimmel that was the first one, and that was really
Speaker 1: figuring out, Okay, how can everybody do this remotely? And
Speaker 1: somebody going to Jimmy's house setting it up as safely
Speaker 1: as possible, giving giving them the stuff, the sanitized cameras
Speaker 1: and everything, and doing it there. And then somebody else
Speaker 1: remotely is there in post produssion editing the show, getting
Speaker 1: it ready. And that's how all these that's how idols
Speaker 1: gonna work. They're all. It is amazing now how equipped
Speaker 1: certainly from a technology standpoint, Um, we are sort of
Speaker 1: able to to do these jobs even with everything that's
Speaker 1: going on. It. I mean, it's just people saying, but
Speaker 1: it is. It is utterly amazing. Um, are there any
Speaker 1: are you finding any you know, benefits at all in
Speaker 1: this work process? Is are you able to be more
Speaker 1: thorough in some ways or any any unexpected benefits to
Speaker 1: this process. I think certainly it's led the way to
Speaker 1: innovation and certainly things differently and things you just wouldn't
Speaker 1: look at and having to look at it in it
Speaker 1: through a different lens. I mean, like I said, I'm
Speaker 1: fascinated to see how American Idol looks and feels when
Speaker 1: people are doing these these performances remotely and what is
Speaker 1: it like. And this is a very different way of
Speaker 1: finding a winner on that show than we normally would.
Speaker 1: So I think that it certainly is interesting and it
Speaker 1: makes you curious how it's going to be. I mean, also,
Speaker 1: just right before this started, and I know we'll talk
Speaker 1: about it more with Billionaire, that was sort of the
Speaker 1: first one we got that in under the wire and
Speaker 1: we took the audience out, and doing it without the
Speaker 1: audience made it different. And you know, in some ways, look,
Speaker 1: you you you need that audience. The host feeds off it.
Speaker 1: But it also was interesting to watch it and how
Speaker 1: you had to kind of innovate and really letting the
Speaker 1: crew kind of getting their reactions on audio and having
Speaker 1: Jimmy play more off of the contestant and the friend
Speaker 1: that they had brought to help them out. So I
Speaker 1: think that it's led to some really sort of interesting
Speaker 1: creative things that wouldn't have happened before that. And I think,
Speaker 1: no matter what, when this thing is all over, you
Speaker 1: have to be vigilant about learning. You know, what did
Speaker 1: we learn and how can we use those things in
Speaker 1: our everyday production once we get back to full speed.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think that a lot. You know, it's
Speaker 1: some of this the most sort of low tech, fuzzy
Speaker 1: shaky video has been some of the most compelling television
Speaker 1: that that we've all seen. I think that's that's exactly right,
Speaker 1: and it's just yeah, it's it's amazing, and it is
Speaker 1: a testament to you know, ow our world is really
Speaker 1: from that standpoints able to not only survive but thrive.
Speaker 1: Let's talk more specifically about Idle, which you you know,
Speaker 1: this is such your bit, such a big set piece
Speaker 1: for you for so much a prime time for the
Speaker 1: second half of the year here, so you had pretty
Speaker 1: much kind of just gotten off the ground and then
Speaker 1: like you know, not not a weekend, all of a
Speaker 1: sudden that you know, the sort of the growing awareness
Speaker 1: of of what this was gonna mean. Talk about how
Speaker 1: can you talk specifically about how you transition that from
Speaker 1: being up on its feet with a crew of I'm
Speaker 1: guessing hundreds to how you're doing it now. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean it was. It's so funny because everything really was
Speaker 1: trending in idolist direction. We we started, we were pacing
Speaker 1: ahead of last year. I think that the judges now
Speaker 1: three seasons in, are sort of better than ever. Their
Speaker 1: chemistry and and they're judging, They've really really gotten it.
Speaker 1: I think there arguably some of the best we've seen
Speaker 1: in those chairs. The talent was great. It really felt
Speaker 1: like this was this was a great season. Katie had
Speaker 1: announced she's pregnant, so that was really exciting every week
Speaker 1: with a bundle of joy on the way. Yeah, it was.
Speaker 1: It was all really great. We were so excited and
Speaker 1: then all of this happened and like everything and which
Speaker 1: I think is still the case, there's so much uncertainty.
Speaker 1: It was sort of like, Okay, we're gonna stop down
Speaker 1: for two weeks. It's not really going to affect us,
Speaker 1: but you know, we'll move. The goal line sort of
Speaker 1: kept moving, and then finally, I think a couple of
Speaker 1: weeks we had a couple of weeks ago we had
Speaker 1: to really say okay, we need to think about what
Speaker 1: is this show. First it was Okay, it's going to
Speaker 1: be on a sound stage within an audience, and then
Speaker 1: it was now, this thing might go longer than we're expecting,
Speaker 1: so how do we make this show? I mean, there
Speaker 1: was all sorts of things we told about do we
Speaker 1: just stop down and start back up again when this
Speaker 1: is over? But who knows how long that's going to be,
Speaker 1: and you want to keep keep it going. The audience
Speaker 1: is invested in these people now, and you don't want
Speaker 1: to have to then say, yeah, I remember six months
Speaker 1: ago these people that you really really liked, Well, they're
Speaker 1: back and they're gonna compete for American Idol. So I
Speaker 1: think that that was when we said, okay, how do
Speaker 1: we do the best version of the show at home?
Speaker 1: And to the producers credit, and they're really sort of
Speaker 1: the first ones out you know that that have to
Speaker 1: do this. We're going to be the first one doing
Speaker 1: this type of show. Uh, And they have just worked
Speaker 1: night and day to do something that's going to, you know,
Speaker 1: feel both relevant to our times but also hopefully at
Speaker 1: the end of the day, do the the main goal,
Speaker 1: which is entertained and get you invested and make you
Speaker 1: want to vote for somebody and and coron an American Idol.
Speaker 1: How um do you feel at all at the network.
Speaker 1: I'm I'm kind of guessing the sense of, like, you know,
Speaker 1: people are people need that normalcy. People want, you know,
Speaker 1: the idea that everything being shut down just adds to
Speaker 1: our dystopian feeling. And it's kind of this is your job.
Speaker 1: The show must go on. That's right, that's that's act.
Speaker 1: And that's the exact phrase we used, was the show
Speaker 1: must go on, keep it going people. Really, you're right,
Speaker 1: people want to feel that that the world is not
Speaker 1: shut down. And I know that in the grand scheme
Speaker 1: of things, this is you know, it's a singing competition,
Speaker 1: but we need to know that these things aren't. That
Speaker 1: life is not happening here. You know, we need to
Speaker 1: be present and and see everything that is going on
Speaker 1: and do everything we can to stay safe. But we
Speaker 1: also we need this more than ever. Especially we've seen
Speaker 1: how music too, especially has been really kind of you know,
Speaker 1: a cure all for for a lot of these things
Speaker 1: to avoid, keep your sanity and just lift your spirits.
Speaker 1: So hopefully we're going to do both those things, right,
Speaker 1: Can I ask you about and let me ask you
Speaker 1: about the business implications for that. I mean, I would imagine,
Speaker 1: and this is you know, with all sensitivity to the situation,
Speaker 1: I would imagine that that there is some savings, some
Speaker 1: cost savings in not having the extensive crew and all
Speaker 1: the production elements and the hair and the makeup and
Speaker 1: the costuming that you would otherwise have. You know, it's interesting.
Speaker 1: I guess we'll look and see. I'm not sure how
Speaker 1: that's all going to net out at the end. We'll
Speaker 1: look at everything and see. But but yeah, I have
Speaker 1: no idea if this is going to be cost savings
Speaker 1: because you're right, it's a little bom low tech, or
Speaker 1: is it going to cost more? Is it all going
Speaker 1: to come out in the wash? I mean, I know
Speaker 1: that the said is loaded on CBS. I mean, we
Speaker 1: could go if if things, if this thing all of
Speaker 1: a sudden was gone tomorrow, we could go right into
Speaker 1: CBS and go and do big live shows. But we've
Speaker 1: got the stage ready to go, so I'm not sure
Speaker 1: where the dollars and cents of it all is gonna
Speaker 1: pan out. Now that that'll be interesting And of course,
Speaker 1: in some cases, obviously through no fault to their own
Speaker 1: there are crew members that are still on the payroll
Speaker 1: even if they're not able to fly their trade. So yeah,
Speaker 1: that's right absolutely. How in the it's sort of in
Speaker 1: the bigger picture you mentioned some of it with the
Speaker 1: with the question for you is how is Idle change
Speaker 1: for you for ABC as a business now that you've
Speaker 1: had it a couple of years and you can you know,
Speaker 1: it's it's it's so clearly there's so much you know,
Speaker 1: integration with other parts of Disney. Now, can you talk
Speaker 1: about how it's changed as a business from year one
Speaker 1: now that you're in year three? Yeah, I think that.
Speaker 1: You know, year one was a year unlike anything I'd
Speaker 1: ever experienced professionally, because it was literally every corner of
Speaker 1: the Walt Disney Company sort of got behind it. They
Speaker 1: knew how great this could be. It could enhance everything.
Speaker 1: We've shot episodes at the Alani, We've had Disney Nights,
Speaker 1: so it's really been one of those things that's just
Speaker 1: been a great sort of brand enhancement. And I think
Speaker 1: now the big question was is there still room for idol?
Speaker 1: We're people sick of it, and I think we saw
Speaker 1: that there is. You know, it's not what it was
Speaker 1: fifteen years ago. But I don't know that anything is
Speaker 1: could be. But what we have seen is that there
Speaker 1: is this is an audience that has incredibly loyal following
Speaker 1: and a four quadrant following that, this is a show
Speaker 1: that people watch together. The fact that we had this
Speaker 1: room on Sunday night to which just feels like that
Speaker 1: was always the family night. This show just sort of
Speaker 1: fits like a glove on our Sunday night schedule. And
Speaker 1: we look at what we had before and what we
Speaker 1: have now with IDOL, and it's just great. So we
Speaker 1: just consider ourselves really lucky to have it, and it's
Speaker 1: one of those things that's just helped strengthen everything that
Speaker 1: the network things around it. I think it's paired really
Speaker 1: well with the rookie this year UM, so it's good.
Speaker 1: And everyone's credited here too. They really, from a marketing
Speaker 1: standpoint scheduling everything, they have not taken their foot off
Speaker 1: the gas. I mean, they still treat it like an
Speaker 1: important asset UM and I think that's been really helpful.
Speaker 1: And you're taking UM, as you mentioned earlier, you are
Speaker 1: taking another you know, very high watted brand name for
Speaker 1: ABC who wants to be a millionaire and bringing it
Speaker 1: back with with Jimmy Kimmel. Jimmy, you've got Jimmy Kimmel. Uh.
Speaker 1: His productivity has definitely stepped up under your tenure heading
Speaker 1: the department between Millionaire and the Live from his Studio,
Speaker 1: Live with the Studio audience, Uh specials. I butchered that name,
Speaker 1: but yeah, I mean I've always I started in light
Speaker 1: when I started ABC started late night, So I go
Speaker 1: back with Jimmy almost to the beginning of the show,
Speaker 1: and it's been really lucky. I mean, and before all that,
Speaker 1: I remember I used to listen to as Jimmy the
Speaker 1: sports guy at KA Rock and watched all this Comedy
Speaker 1: Central stuff. So I feel like I really go back
Speaker 1: with Jimmy, and um, it has been great to sort
Speaker 1: of watch him become. I mean, I always think he's
Speaker 1: been sort of the face of the net work. But
Speaker 1: now to your point from a produce oreal standpoint, from
Speaker 1: now he's hosting in prime time, Uh, watching a late
Speaker 1: night show really become I think, you know, for my money,
Speaker 1: he's the best monologue, the best interviewers. So it's been
Speaker 1: sort of great to do this. But this has been
Speaker 1: really exciting. I mean, Millionaire, Michael Davies, who produced the original,
Speaker 1: who also goes way back with Jimmy. He's a predecessor
Speaker 1: of yours. In Your Job as Alternative really sort of
Speaker 1: started started the Department Um and cast one Jimmy Kimmel
Speaker 1: as the what question reader in wind Benstein's Money. That's
Speaker 1: exactly right. So it's all sort of come full circle.
Speaker 1: But it's exciting. I mean, Michael came in and pitched
Speaker 1: it and he said, it drives me crazy. That sort
Speaker 1: of the beginning of this reality boom was Millionaire, and
Speaker 1: I think we all remember in this thing became this
Speaker 1: just a phenomenon, and then you had Survivor, and then
Speaker 1: you had Idol and The Bachelor and Dancing with Stars
Speaker 1: and Big Brother, Big Brother, and every one of those
Speaker 1: shows that we're telling you about are still on the air.
Speaker 1: It's a Millionaire and it drives them crazy. And he said,
Speaker 1: you know the goal of this show was always to
Speaker 1: be a an event, a limited event that comes back
Speaker 1: every now and then, and that's sort of how we started.
Speaker 1: And then it became a regular show and it burned
Speaker 1: out and this this should be back on and I
Speaker 1: totally agreed with him, and he sort of developed a
Speaker 1: really special. We knew the twenty anniversary was coming up,
Speaker 1: and he developed a way to make it feel like
Speaker 1: an event like it did before, and a lot of
Speaker 1: this stuff you knew and loved Pa Millionaire, but he
Speaker 1: also really innovated, and I think it helped to having Jimmy.
Speaker 1: And we aired a special where Jimmy said with Regis
Speaker 1: and I think regious even you know, Reis gave his blessed.
Speaker 1: I think he's thrilled said if anyone's going to do it,
Speaker 1: it's Jimmy, and I think that means a lot. So
Speaker 1: it feels like it's really true too, everything that made
Speaker 1: it great, but it also feels really relevant. And like
Speaker 1: I said, we did without an audience, so it really
Speaker 1: feels relevant now. Rob on your watch, the the the
Speaker 1: caliber and the number of game shows has really has
Speaker 1: really climbed on ABC. Can you talk about the business
Speaker 1: of game shows and why they're so attractive to the network? Well,
Speaker 1: they're they're they're great. Obviously, they're inexpensive. Um, I don't
Speaker 1: necessary for whatever reason, we have not done We've not
Speaker 1: had one, and I don't think we've had one that
Speaker 1: had the caliber of success that Millionaire did back in
Speaker 1: the day, so we haven't run the sprockets off them.
Speaker 1: And it really sort of honestly, it started when I
Speaker 1: first got this job. The first thing I knew would work.
Speaker 1: I've been watching Steve Harvey on Family Feud forever and
Speaker 1: I knew that a primetime version would work. Whatever. It
Speaker 1: ended up being Celebrity just because we wanted to differentiate
Speaker 1: it from the syndicated version. But it's sort of snowballed
Speaker 1: from there. There was no you know, preconceived idea of okay,
Speaker 1: once you know, after Celebrity Family Feud, we're going to
Speaker 1: do eight more game shows. It just sort of worked
Speaker 1: out that way. Uh, that worked, and then Michael Strand
Speaker 1: came to us and said, I'm dying to do Pyramids,
Speaker 1: so that was a no brainer. And then we started thinking, okay,
Speaker 1: how do we make a night out of this? And
Speaker 1: then it was okay, Match Game was great, and that
Speaker 1: that could be a great ten o'clock show, and the
Speaker 1: fact that Alec Baldwin wanted to do it was great.
Speaker 1: And then these things just kept working. So it's snowballed.
Speaker 1: And the great thing about game shows is they're all different.
Speaker 1: I mean, they're so Jeopardy is different from Weave of Fortune,
Speaker 1: which is different from Family Feud, which is different match game,
Speaker 1: which is different from Millionaire. So it just was, okay,
Speaker 1: let's just if they're good, and the fact you have
Speaker 1: so much different and great talent that want to host
Speaker 1: these things, Um, they really can become great, great propositions.
Speaker 1: It's fair to say that these are you know, these
Speaker 1: are very efficient hours of program for ABC, and that
Speaker 1: does help make them attractive. Yes, absolutely, I think that
Speaker 1: definitely helps. Um. I think you still don't want to
Speaker 1: do too many of them or run them forever, but
Speaker 1: even in the short runs they've been, they've been very
Speaker 1: good to us. Is there something about the summer months,
Speaker 1: like people people it's a little more casual, people are
Speaker 1: more inclined to kind of slip into a game show.
Speaker 1: I think that's a there's a little bit of that,
Speaker 1: But also for us, it just was always that's when
Speaker 1: alternative programming really kind of premiered and where we had
Speaker 1: the time slot, So it was it was a little
Speaker 1: bit of both. I still think absolutely you could have
Speaker 1: game work in season. I think Ellen's Game of Games
Speaker 1: works great. Um. I think if there were slots and
Speaker 1: there was something that we really felt we could do
Speaker 1: we could do more of in season. Absolutely, I would definitely,
Speaker 1: you know, I wouldn't be against it, but I agree
Speaker 1: there is something that the summer you just sort of
Speaker 1: want to relax, and I mean no, the equivalent of
Speaker 1: beach reads. You know, you just sit back and enjoy yourself.
Speaker 1: You guys also took a great shot this past season
Speaker 1: with Tiffany Hattish, putting her in a kind of a
Speaker 1: different in a different role that is. You know, I
Speaker 1: gave you a lot of credit for seeing her in that.
Speaker 1: And as soon as you see her as the host
Speaker 1: of kids say the darnest thing, it's like, oh my god,
Speaker 1: of course, but to see her, to see her initially
Speaker 1: as a good candidate, I UM give you guys a
Speaker 1: lot of credit for that. Um, the show I thought.
Speaker 1: I just I found the show charming. Thought they did
Speaker 1: a really nice job of kind of adding some new elements. Um,
Speaker 1: how was it for you guys? Oh it was great.
Speaker 1: I mean you believe me. I wish I could say
Speaker 1: we were complete visionaries and saw Tiffany, But honestly, everybody
Speaker 1: under the sun wanted to be a business with Tiffany Aish.
Speaker 1: I mean, she is the minute. You saw her in
Speaker 1: Girls Trip and you've seen her done um Jimmy kimme
Speaker 1: alive telling she told this story about group on if
Speaker 1: you've ever seen it, that was sort of I mean
Speaker 1: just you knew this woman was star. So we had
Speaker 1: really wanted to figure out something with her and then
Speaker 1: we were Look, we were fortunate. That's I think it's
Speaker 1: literally just about a year ago. Last April, she came
Speaker 1: in with this package and Eric Shots, who produces kids,
Speaker 1: say that darnis things We had always talked about it
Speaker 1: because that's another one too. Like you said, Cynthia, that
Speaker 1: you just you grew up. You know you you you
Speaker 1: loved it, you watched it. There's certain things that are
Speaker 1: just timeless. This is one of them. And we always said, God,
Speaker 1: if we can find the right host, it would be
Speaker 1: great to bring it back, and he to his credits
Speaker 1: attached Tiffany, and for us, yeah, it was like a
Speaker 1: no brainer. We always think about gosh a f V,
Speaker 1: which I know you're a huge fan of as well.
Speaker 1: It is such a great it's been such an anchor
Speaker 1: for us for over thirty years, and what is how
Speaker 1: you keep that audience there? And this just was sort
Speaker 1: of like, Wow, this is the perfect show to go
Speaker 1: with it. So it was. It was really a privilege,
Speaker 1: honestly to do it. Kids, cameras and unpredictability. What could
Speaker 1: go wrong? Nothing? Absolutely? Actually a little more serious now,
Speaker 1: let me ask you about, of course, another one of
Speaker 1: your the great franchises that I know you are continue
Speaker 1: to groom is The Bachelor, which utterly defies the gravity
Speaker 1: of both ratings and just pop culture buzz. It is,
Speaker 1: you know, my like a lot of my Twitter feed
Speaker 1: is given over I think two people talking about The
Speaker 1: Bachelor when the show is on in this environment, given
Speaker 1: the public health situation, does that make it hard to
Speaker 1: do that, to do a new version of that show
Speaker 1: or a new a new season of that show right now?
Speaker 1: Does that have to be paused to to your point,
Speaker 1: it has sort of defined gravity and it's lasted now
Speaker 1: it'll be it's just about twenty years old. I think
Speaker 1: it's it'll be twenty years And I think the reason
Speaker 1: for that is the show has not existed in a vacuum,
Speaker 1: and it's always evolved and it's been different, and the
Speaker 1: the venture you watch now is very different from season
Speaker 1: one and two thous two. When I think that everything
Speaker 1: about it has has changed and trying to update, and
Speaker 1: so I think that'll be the case here. I think
Speaker 1: everyone is looking at thinking, Okay, how do we do
Speaker 1: the show now, how do we reflect the times we're
Speaker 1: living in, how do we be nimble and how do
Speaker 1: we get back into production as quickly as possible? So
Speaker 1: I think that it might be different, But like I said,
Speaker 1: it's different now than it was ten years ago too,
Speaker 1: So it's still going to be everything you know and
Speaker 1: I love about the franchise, and it is one that
Speaker 1: literally we have meetings every day about it. Nobody takes
Speaker 1: it for granted. Um, So I think that's it's still
Speaker 1: there's absolutely a way we can do it, and hopefully
Speaker 1: that way is going to be sooner rather than later.
Speaker 1: When when if everything was it was, you know, as
Speaker 1: as normal let's call it. When when would you be
Speaker 1: going into production on a new ver, on a new
Speaker 1: season of the show, Well, I think you would, you know, again,
Speaker 1: everything keeps my first. That was another one too. We
Speaker 1: stopped down for two weeks and then it was okay,
Speaker 1: maybe it's two more weeks. Um, we still don't know
Speaker 1: when normal is, but we're looking at as many different
Speaker 1: variations of it as possible, whether it means not traveling
Speaker 1: or not traveling as much, or not going by planes,
Speaker 1: or just finding one place that we do the entire
Speaker 1: thing in and making sure everyone is tested. And so
Speaker 1: it's almost like you know, bachem and quarantine basically, um,
Speaker 1: we'll look at all those things because I think at
Speaker 1: the end of the day, this is to your point
Speaker 1: about idol too. We just need that normal sy. We
Speaker 1: need to know that these things uh need to be
Speaker 1: done safely, but they can still be done. Let me
Speaker 1: ask you. And not being entirely versed in the minutia
Speaker 1: of Bachelor's the show, the show does it seems to
Speaker 1: be an engine of kind of of its own you know,
Speaker 1: sort of scandals within the contestants or within some aspect
Speaker 1: of the production. Is that you know, this might be
Speaker 1: a hard question for you to answer, but is that
Speaker 1: is that in and of itself, the fact that there's
Speaker 1: a scandal about this person or that person, or something
Speaker 1: is revealed about that person's deep in the past. Is
Speaker 1: that all a crew to you know, keeping the show
Speaker 1: high in the Twitter rankings and keeping the you know,
Speaker 1: keeping the ratings very strong. Does all that noise around
Speaker 1: the show really help in the end. Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, I found that. I
Speaker 1: mean I've sort of I've seen it when people don't
Speaker 1: care as much and when they do and every then,
Speaker 1: and I think that at the end of the day,
Speaker 1: the enemy of this show is ampathy. When people don't care,
Speaker 1: that's when. So I think that absolutely. I mean, you
Speaker 1: never like the word scandal to be used with any show,
Speaker 1: so sometime hopefully if they are, they're minor. But they're
Speaker 1: all stuff that is relatable, you know. I mean, whether
Speaker 1: it's getting your heartbroken or somebody leaving you for somebody else,
Speaker 1: or wanting to be loved and not finding love, or
Speaker 1: everybody being in love. I think that all those scandals
Speaker 1: are scandals that we've all sort of had in our
Speaker 1: life at one point or another. And that's what makes
Speaker 1: the better so universal and relatable. Is everybody wants love.
Speaker 1: It is. Those are the stories of drama going back,
Speaker 1: you know, thousands and thousands of years. That's that's exactly.
Speaker 1: It's a tale as all this time. Let me ask you,
Speaker 1: when I talked to a lot of um nonfiction producers
Speaker 1: these days, there there's a lot of is I don't
Speaker 1: have to tell you it's a you know, the nonfiction
Speaker 1: producing world is a group of largely small operations. Many
Speaker 1: there's been a lot of acquisitions in the last ten years,
Speaker 1: and there's been some roll ups into larger firms. But
Speaker 1: if you talk to kind of the classic producer that
Speaker 1: runs you know, that that runs his or her own
Speaker 1: shop and you know, can be prosperous with a couple
Speaker 1: of shows, it's it's it's hard times for these companies
Speaker 1: that really have been the bedrock of of this community.
Speaker 1: What is your sense from talking to people, and again,
Speaker 1: I guess i'd say, you know, setting inside of this
Speaker 1: this shock that we're in, but just generally, do you
Speaker 1: feel like there's concern in that community for people that
Speaker 1: have been very important providers of programming for ABC and
Speaker 1: many others. Do you do you sense that people are hurting.
Speaker 1: I haven't sensed it yet. I mean, I think that
Speaker 1: they've been very good about being nimble and finding stuff
Speaker 1: that either can be produced right now, whether it's remotely,
Speaker 1: or things that can get back up on their feet quickly.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think that you'll see, depending on how
Speaker 1: long this goes, if scripted really gets you know, bogged
Speaker 1: down to where it's the equivalent of a writer strike. Um,
Speaker 1: they might be busier than ever. Um So I think
Speaker 1: that they're busy right now. I think they don't really
Speaker 1: have as much time to think about the hard times,
Speaker 1: but they're busy thinking, Okay, what can I do? How
Speaker 1: can I be be doing? Is? How can I use
Speaker 1: this to my advantage? Do you feel like, um uh?
Speaker 1: There's also been a lot of talk about, you know,
Speaker 1: kind of a dearth of of certainly new formats, new ideas.
Speaker 1: Do you feel like you have a steady stream of
Speaker 1: of options walking through your door? Do you feel any
Speaker 1: diminishment in you know, options or formats or pitches that
Speaker 1: come in again prior to the prior to the current situation. No.
Speaker 1: I mean I think that what we've learned is there
Speaker 1: might be only a certain number of stories that could
Speaker 1: be told, But it's how do you what is the
Speaker 1: difference spin on that? And I think that obviously the
Speaker 1: sort of prime example that was the mess Singer, which
Speaker 1: is not that different from something like Dancing with the
Speaker 1: Stars or or Idle, but it really took this this
Speaker 1: twist on it and made it feel completely different. And
Speaker 1: I think you're seeing that now with producers who realize
Speaker 1: that you don't have to reinvent the wheel or do
Speaker 1: something crazy that doesn't make sense, but it feels completely different.
Speaker 1: But just the flourishes you put on and the things
Speaker 1: that you make it feel different really are kind of
Speaker 1: what what separated, and we're getting a lot of great
Speaker 1: innovative pitches that way. I think that a show we
Speaker 1: did last summer that's coming up this summer, Holy Moly,
Speaker 1: which was you know, a mini golf tournament and was
Speaker 1: kind of crazy, but the way they produced it made
Speaker 1: it feel fresh and different, and we're really proud of
Speaker 1: that one that there's a layer of humor there that
Speaker 1: was that was fun and could really could really work
Speaker 1: right now exactly. That's that's right. I think people will
Speaker 1: be very happy when it comes back. Rob. Anybody that
Speaker 1: follows you on Twitter knows that you are a true
Speaker 1: student of television and a big fan. What is your Twitter?
Speaker 1: What is your Twitter handle? It's you know, it's very
Speaker 1: complicated because I sort of signed on knowing what Twitter
Speaker 1: was all these years ago. I probably would have ate
Speaker 1: it simple, but it's it's nil z M I L
Speaker 1: L S Y one one three step four So all right,
Speaker 1: well my birthday January thirteenth. N Well, now we'll remember
Speaker 1: to send you a present. But any you know TV fans,
Speaker 1: fans of kind of interesting arcane TV should follow that
Speaker 1: because Rob is a good poster. Um, tell me so again.
Speaker 1: Knowing that from your Twitter feed, what was it that
Speaker 1: got you into the business? How did what? What made
Speaker 1: you want to become a become an executive? It sort
Speaker 1: of suited me perfectly because you get to develop things
Speaker 1: and be creative. But I do like the business aspect.
Speaker 1: I love getting the ratings every morning and seeing what's
Speaker 1: worked and what didn't. And that's something I always liked
Speaker 1: growing up too. So I'm incredibly lucky. What opened the
Speaker 1: door to you? Like? What what started you on on
Speaker 1: the path that you're on, uh, in terms of just
Speaker 1: this job getting here, this job, or just your career
Speaker 1: in your career in TV in general. Well, knowing you know,
Speaker 1: I don't think I necessary. I love film, I love TV,
Speaker 1: So even that was sort of happenstance. I just knew
Speaker 1: I wanted to do something, so I came out to
Speaker 1: I came out here in nineties six after I graduated college,
Speaker 1: and just knew I didn't know what to do, just
Speaker 1: knew I wanted to get in, and somebody was fortunate
Speaker 1: to say, go work at a talent agency because you'll
Speaker 1: make context there. And again, I could have been put anywhere.
Speaker 1: I happened to be in TV. And at that point
Speaker 1: it was the head of uh what, they didn't even
Speaker 1: know what to call the group. I think they got
Speaker 1: an off network because they didn't know what alternative TV was.
Speaker 1: This was three months before Survivor and you watched the
Speaker 1: whole thing explode and Andrea Wong kind of there was
Speaker 1: an opening there as an assistant to the head of
Speaker 1: Late Night under Andrea Wong, and so she hired me
Speaker 1: and I've been here ever since. But it was all
Speaker 1: very kind of happenstance, just knowing that I'd be happy
Speaker 1: kind of doing anything whatever was in this business, because
Speaker 1: I did. I did. I absolutely loved it. Well again,
Speaker 1: now you're now you're are an executive in charge of
Speaker 1: a whole lot of shows that we just spoke about.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much, Rob for taking the time out.
Speaker 1: I hope you and your family are well and stay
Speaker 1: well in all this and look forward to a sequel
Speaker 1: that we can do in person. You two Cynthia, I'm
Speaker 1: excited for that. Take care. Thanks Rob, thanks for listening.
Speaker 1: Be sure to tune in next week for another episode
Speaker 1: of Strictly Business.