1 00:00:02,480 --> 00:00:08,879 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news. 2 00:00:10,000 --> 00:00:13,280 Speaker 2: Healthcare and Nigeria is under the spotlight after the death 3 00:00:13,360 --> 00:00:16,599 Speaker 2: of author Chimamanda Adj's twenty one month old son. 4 00:00:17,000 --> 00:00:22,080 Speaker 3: This kind of tragedy is a symptom of a systemic failure. 5 00:00:22,480 --> 00:00:27,760 Speaker 3: It demonstrates that there are either lapses or absence of 6 00:00:27,960 --> 00:00:32,800 Speaker 3: patient safety systems in place. There are lapses in accountability, 7 00:00:33,920 --> 00:00:38,080 Speaker 3: transparency and credibility. 8 00:00:38,560 --> 00:00:41,519 Speaker 2: Nigerians are asking if this is the latest example of 9 00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:46,360 Speaker 2: an inadequate health system with many wealthy citizens seeking care abroad. 10 00:00:46,680 --> 00:00:48,440 Speaker 3: This one is really seen in the latter DA because 11 00:00:48,479 --> 00:00:51,440 Speaker 3: it happened to somebody that has a voice. How about 12 00:00:51,560 --> 00:00:55,840 Speaker 3: those thousands and millions of people that are voiceless. 13 00:00:56,000 --> 00:00:59,120 Speaker 2: On today's episode, we'll look at what this tragedy says 14 00:00:59,200 --> 00:01:02,520 Speaker 2: about the state of Nigerian healthcare and how it compares 15 00:01:02,600 --> 00:01:09,440 Speaker 2: to other countries on the continent. I'm Jennifer's Abasaja and 16 00:01:09,560 --> 00:01:12,920 Speaker 2: this is the Next Africa Podcast, bringing you one story 17 00:01:13,040 --> 00:01:16,120 Speaker 2: each week from the continent driving the future of global 18 00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:21,360 Speaker 2: growth with the context only Bloomberg can provide. In a moment, 19 00:01:21,440 --> 00:01:24,680 Speaker 2: we'll speak with Bloomberg Senior reporter Yinka Ibukun and our 20 00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:27,840 Speaker 2: healthcare reporter jenis Q. But first a little more on 21 00:01:27,880 --> 00:01:31,520 Speaker 2: the tragic incident itself. The governor of Lego State has 22 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:35,520 Speaker 2: launched an investigation into the death of Chimamanda Adj's twenty 23 00:01:35,560 --> 00:01:39,080 Speaker 2: one month old son. He said the investigation will examine 24 00:01:39,080 --> 00:01:45,119 Speaker 2: the allegations raised, including compliance with established clinical protocols, professional conduct, 25 00:01:45,440 --> 00:01:49,720 Speaker 2: patient safety standards, and the roles and responsibilities of all 26 00:01:49,760 --> 00:01:53,840 Speaker 2: parties involved. He added that any individual or institution found 27 00:01:53,840 --> 00:01:59,240 Speaker 2: culpable of negligence, professional misconduct or regulatory violations will face 28 00:01:59,320 --> 00:02:01,680 Speaker 2: the full of the law. I want to bring in 29 00:02:01,680 --> 00:02:06,480 Speaker 2: a conversation with Anthea sege Nawandhu Shei, Mamanda Adich's sister 30 00:02:06,560 --> 00:02:09,760 Speaker 2: in law, herself a practicing doctor, I asked her to 31 00:02:09,800 --> 00:02:12,360 Speaker 2: explain what exactly happened to her nephew. 32 00:02:13,880 --> 00:02:20,400 Speaker 3: The negligence happened following out or during administration of IV 33 00:02:20,560 --> 00:02:26,639 Speaker 3: sedation with propofom he received per medical director, too much 34 00:02:26,639 --> 00:02:32,520 Speaker 3: sedation and on my interview with the Ani sociologist, he 35 00:02:32,720 --> 00:02:37,200 Speaker 3: was transferred without any form of monitoring. Was also transferred 36 00:02:37,200 --> 00:02:42,280 Speaker 3: without oxygen which he required not only during the procedure 37 00:02:42,280 --> 00:02:48,160 Speaker 3: but also during transportation. The neglects to monitor him happened 38 00:02:48,400 --> 00:02:52,000 Speaker 3: during transportation, and that most likely led to his cardiopulmonary 39 00:02:52,040 --> 00:02:55,760 Speaker 3: arrests at a time, we're not sure because we don't 40 00:02:55,880 --> 00:02:57,760 Speaker 3: have any records at this moment. 41 00:02:58,639 --> 00:03:01,440 Speaker 2: And you actually said you don't want to see your 42 00:03:01,480 --> 00:03:06,960 Speaker 2: nephew's death to happen in vain. Yes, what does that 43 00:03:07,040 --> 00:03:09,480 Speaker 2: look like for you and for your family? 44 00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:15,680 Speaker 3: So, first of all, that looks like accountability in any 45 00:03:16,240 --> 00:03:22,000 Speaker 3: healthcare system that has patient safety systems designed and in 46 00:03:22,040 --> 00:03:28,919 Speaker 3: place to prevent harm, negligence, address outcomes like this unfortunate 47 00:03:28,960 --> 00:03:36,720 Speaker 3: one are accounted for, and accountability means transparency, investigation, learning, 48 00:03:37,760 --> 00:03:40,840 Speaker 3: having systems in place to prevent harm, and if harm 49 00:03:40,880 --> 00:03:44,920 Speaker 3: does happen, to detect it early and escalate care rapidly. 50 00:03:45,600 --> 00:03:48,480 Speaker 3: So it starts at the hospital, but it's at multiple 51 00:03:48,560 --> 00:03:54,800 Speaker 3: levels where we want to see systemic reforms instituted and 52 00:03:55,000 --> 00:03:58,360 Speaker 3: enforced in the healthcare system at multiple levels. 53 00:03:59,080 --> 00:04:02,520 Speaker 2: And just find doctor NUWANDU. I wonder if there's any 54 00:04:02,720 --> 00:04:06,800 Speaker 2: other message that you want the public to know about 55 00:04:06,840 --> 00:04:08,880 Speaker 2: your nephew and about your family. 56 00:04:10,280 --> 00:04:16,040 Speaker 3: Yes, my nephew's death is, as we all know, a 57 00:04:16,080 --> 00:04:22,200 Speaker 3: personal and horrific tragedy, but it's an unacceptable cost patient 58 00:04:22,279 --> 00:04:26,960 Speaker 3: safety science is well established. What Nigeria requires now is 59 00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:32,599 Speaker 3: the political will of the government, regulatory courage to stand 60 00:04:32,680 --> 00:04:39,279 Speaker 3: up and speak and publicly declare what they find public 61 00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:46,000 Speaker 3: demand for accountability, and when those key issues align, meaningful 62 00:04:46,040 --> 00:04:51,080 Speaker 3: reform is absolutely achievable in Nigeria. So I'm looking forward 63 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:53,560 Speaker 3: to reform, and I'm looking forward to transparency, and I'm 64 00:04:53,600 --> 00:04:58,080 Speaker 3: looking forward to the political will that will supercharge these activities. 65 00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:02,039 Speaker 2: So Yinka, perhaps we start with you. We just heard 66 00:05:02,040 --> 00:05:05,360 Speaker 2: from doctor inn Wanda speaking as a grieving aunt, as 67 00:05:05,600 --> 00:05:09,600 Speaker 2: a public health leader and also a patient safety advocate. 68 00:05:09,640 --> 00:05:13,560 Speaker 2: When we think about what the hospital has said in 69 00:05:13,640 --> 00:05:17,479 Speaker 2: response to the specific incident, what have you found based 70 00:05:17,520 --> 00:05:18,240 Speaker 2: on your reporting? 71 00:05:18,920 --> 00:05:22,480 Speaker 4: Thanks Jen, So, first of all, my condolences to the 72 00:05:22,640 --> 00:05:26,680 Speaker 4: Sage Didchi family. We did try to reach out to 73 00:05:26,760 --> 00:05:30,480 Speaker 4: your care multiple times for common They did not respond 74 00:05:30,520 --> 00:05:35,080 Speaker 4: to Bloomberg's request, but in a statement quote in local media, 75 00:05:35,320 --> 00:05:39,080 Speaker 4: they expressed sympathy over the family's loss. I noted that 76 00:05:39,160 --> 00:05:43,240 Speaker 4: the child had arrived at its facility in critical condition. 77 00:05:43,800 --> 00:05:48,120 Speaker 4: They also said that they were investigating internally, and Lagos 78 00:05:48,160 --> 00:05:51,279 Speaker 4: State has also launched a crow into the cause of 79 00:05:51,440 --> 00:05:56,720 Speaker 4: death of mcano Are there reports that the doctor accused 80 00:05:56,760 --> 00:05:59,840 Speaker 4: of wrongdoing has also been suspended. 81 00:05:59,480 --> 00:06:02,880 Speaker 2: And I didn't wonder was just speaking there about accountability 82 00:06:03,040 --> 00:06:08,000 Speaker 2: and transparency, which speaks to the investigative manner in which 83 00:06:08,360 --> 00:06:11,160 Speaker 2: we're seeing this play out right now. But Yinka, this 84 00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:15,320 Speaker 2: is obviously a tragic individual case. But when we zoom 85 00:06:15,400 --> 00:06:20,000 Speaker 2: out and look more broadly about the healthcare industry in Nigeria, 86 00:06:20,360 --> 00:06:25,080 Speaker 2: are you noticing more of the population calling for some 87 00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:28,640 Speaker 2: of these changes that we just heard from the doctor there. 88 00:06:28,720 --> 00:06:32,560 Speaker 4: Stories of medical neglitions have actually exploded social media since 89 00:06:32,560 --> 00:06:36,560 Speaker 4: the incident, and these stories are sadly very common. They 90 00:06:36,680 --> 00:06:40,839 Speaker 4: impacted my own family as well, and usually such incidents 91 00:06:40,880 --> 00:06:47,400 Speaker 4: boiled down to infrastructure gaps, unreliable electricity for equipment, or 92 00:06:47,480 --> 00:06:51,320 Speaker 4: hospitals running out of oxygen or blood or not enough 93 00:06:51,360 --> 00:06:57,440 Speaker 4: healthcare workers. The facility that we're talking about here wouldn't 94 00:06:57,480 --> 00:07:00,159 Speaker 4: have been expected to have any of these problems that 95 00:07:00,200 --> 00:07:05,200 Speaker 4: the systemic problems based in Nigerian healthcare. And in addition 96 00:07:05,240 --> 00:07:08,760 Speaker 4: to that part from the healthcare perspective, it's been worsened 97 00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:11,160 Speaker 4: by the brain train. A lot of Nigerian doctors and 98 00:07:11,240 --> 00:07:15,560 Speaker 4: health professionals go abroad to seek better conditions, and then 99 00:07:15,560 --> 00:07:20,560 Speaker 4: on top of that, accountability is low, so when incidents happen, 100 00:07:21,160 --> 00:07:24,200 Speaker 4: few people have the resources or even the faith to 101 00:07:24,400 --> 00:07:29,840 Speaker 4: seecreatures or pursue legal action. And what people are asking 102 00:07:29,960 --> 00:07:35,040 Speaker 4: for is harder because at a systemic level, again, there 103 00:07:35,240 --> 00:07:38,520 Speaker 4: so much that means changing. But if I can boil 104 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:41,040 Speaker 4: it down to two things, I would say first is 105 00:07:41,120 --> 00:07:44,720 Speaker 4: that there should be more stringent and enforced standards around 106 00:07:44,840 --> 00:07:48,720 Speaker 4: patient safety. A doctor told me that policies that would 107 00:07:48,800 --> 00:07:53,200 Speaker 4: keep patients safe exist, but often their art mandatory. And 108 00:07:53,280 --> 00:07:57,160 Speaker 4: the second thing would be really accountability when harm happens 109 00:07:57,240 --> 00:08:00,440 Speaker 4: or when a life is lost in developed trees, in 110 00:08:00,480 --> 00:08:05,240 Speaker 4: certain incidents like this would have triggered automatic investigations. Our 111 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:08,400 Speaker 4: patient's records would be locked and examined. Here the family 112 00:08:08,440 --> 00:08:13,280 Speaker 4: had to serve the hospital to ensure the documentation was preserved. 113 00:08:14,600 --> 00:08:17,400 Speaker 4: So for all these reasons, there's a lot of systemic 114 00:08:17,520 --> 00:08:21,160 Speaker 4: change that needs to happen, and many Nigerians are watching, 115 00:08:21,800 --> 00:08:25,160 Speaker 4: hopefully it will be joining and ensuring that that does happen. 116 00:08:25,280 --> 00:08:29,240 Speaker 4: Because if a tragedy like this in such a high 117 00:08:29,320 --> 00:08:33,760 Speaker 4: profile situation doesn't trigger change, the worryans what will? 118 00:08:34,160 --> 00:08:37,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, And I wonder, Yinka, why you think this has 119 00:08:37,520 --> 00:08:41,040 Speaker 2: triggered such a shock And as you mentioned, you know 120 00:08:41,280 --> 00:08:44,560 Speaker 2: messages flooding on social media. Have you seen something like 121 00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:48,400 Speaker 2: this before? Does it seem potentially like this could be 122 00:08:48,800 --> 00:08:50,120 Speaker 2: a transformative moment. 123 00:08:50,800 --> 00:08:56,560 Speaker 4: So unfortunately, these strategies happen often, but this is particularly 124 00:08:56,760 --> 00:09:00,800 Speaker 4: resonant for a few reasons. First, who it happened to 125 00:09:00,920 --> 00:09:04,760 Speaker 4: my mother? And teachings of global style. Her writing has 126 00:09:04,800 --> 00:09:09,880 Speaker 4: given language to experiences as Africans, as women, as mothers. 127 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:13,720 Speaker 4: She's even written about greeting as her daughter her father's 128 00:09:13,760 --> 00:09:18,880 Speaker 4: death and her husband, doctor Ivara Sigi, is a medical 129 00:09:18,920 --> 00:09:23,000 Speaker 4: doctor himself, so they could access the best care and 130 00:09:23,240 --> 00:09:25,640 Speaker 4: this can happen to them, they dreams and thinking it 131 00:09:25,679 --> 00:09:28,880 Speaker 4: can happen to anybody, But it's also where it happens. 132 00:09:29,320 --> 00:09:33,679 Speaker 4: We know very well the feelings of the Nigeria healthcare system, 133 00:09:33,840 --> 00:09:36,400 Speaker 4: but when we think of that, we're not including places 134 00:09:36,440 --> 00:09:40,600 Speaker 4: like EUICA that's the top tier private hospital. However bad 135 00:09:40,640 --> 00:09:44,600 Speaker 4: the situation in Nigeria is many people would have brought 136 00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:48,719 Speaker 4: at the hospital like that would somehow have been insunated 137 00:09:48,760 --> 00:09:51,719 Speaker 4: from it. And then finally, you know, just try to 138 00:09:51,760 --> 00:09:55,280 Speaker 4: support because we're talking about the loss of a young child. 139 00:09:55,720 --> 00:09:58,400 Speaker 4: As heartbreaking as this is, there are way too many 140 00:09:58,440 --> 00:10:01,920 Speaker 4: parents in Nigeria as one of the highest child mortality 141 00:10:02,040 --> 00:10:06,640 Speaker 4: meets in the world, who live for that pain. Approximately 142 00:10:06,800 --> 00:10:10,000 Speaker 4: one in nine children die before the age of six, 143 00:10:10,880 --> 00:10:14,000 Speaker 4: and these tests disproportionately affect before. 144 00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:18,959 Speaker 2: It's completely heartbreaking. As you mentioned, stick with us, Ninka 145 00:10:19,160 --> 00:10:22,160 Speaker 2: and Janis you're also here. We're going to continue the 146 00:10:22,200 --> 00:10:25,320 Speaker 2: conversation after the break and talk about more of what's 147 00:10:25,360 --> 00:10:29,280 Speaker 2: happening within Nigerian healthcare and potentially what outlook there could 148 00:10:29,360 --> 00:10:36,920 Speaker 2: be for any improvement. We'll be right back. Welcome back 149 00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:39,640 Speaker 2: today on the podcast, we're discussing the state of healthcare 150 00:10:39,679 --> 00:10:44,480 Speaker 2: in Nigeria. Yinka Ibukun and Jenis Q are still with me. Jennie, 151 00:10:44,600 --> 00:10:48,000 Speaker 2: let's bring you into the conversation. What do we know 152 00:10:48,360 --> 00:10:52,640 Speaker 2: about the healthcare system in Nigeria. You cover this extensively 153 00:10:52,720 --> 00:10:55,640 Speaker 2: and have been. Yinka was just giving us some insight 154 00:10:56,120 --> 00:11:01,480 Speaker 2: into her own viewpoint and reporting on the industry, but 155 00:11:01,800 --> 00:11:04,680 Speaker 2: talk about how it is compared to some of the 156 00:11:04,679 --> 00:11:07,000 Speaker 2: other healthcare systems within the continent. 157 00:11:07,440 --> 00:11:09,520 Speaker 1: And Yank, if I can just say, I'm very sorry 158 00:11:09,600 --> 00:11:13,560 Speaker 1: to hear about your personal losses and tragedies related to 159 00:11:13,559 --> 00:11:16,640 Speaker 1: the healthcare systems. Healthcare investment in Nigeria is low by 160 00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:20,480 Speaker 1: global standards, with high individual out of pocket costs restricting 161 00:11:20,920 --> 00:11:24,480 Speaker 1: access to care. For regional context, West Africa is home 162 00:11:24,520 --> 00:11:28,120 Speaker 1: to sixteen countries with a combined population of more than 163 00:11:28,160 --> 00:11:31,120 Speaker 1: four hundred and thirty million people. More than half of 164 00:11:31,120 --> 00:11:34,199 Speaker 1: those are living in Nigeria. But even within the region, 165 00:11:34,520 --> 00:11:38,360 Speaker 1: Nigeria's healthcare system lags behind many of its West African neighbors. 166 00:11:38,880 --> 00:11:43,040 Speaker 1: Primary health care remains very underdeveloped in Nigeria, as Yanka said, 167 00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:47,440 Speaker 1: there are health worker shortages. Late last year, Nigeria said 168 00:11:47,520 --> 00:11:52,280 Speaker 1: about sixty seven percent of locally trained doctors currently work abroad, 169 00:11:52,440 --> 00:11:56,079 Speaker 1: primarily in the UK. That's driven by better working conditions 170 00:11:56,080 --> 00:12:00,240 Speaker 1: and economic opportunities abroad, but that obviously further restricts access 171 00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:03,720 Speaker 1: to care and reduces the quality of care for large 172 00:12:03,760 --> 00:12:06,320 Speaker 1: parts of the population. In a study that was published 173 00:12:06,360 --> 00:12:10,000 Speaker 1: by Lancet in twenty twenty two, it showed that Nigeria's 174 00:12:10,000 --> 00:12:13,679 Speaker 1: health spend increased from eighteen point six US dollars per 175 00:12:13,720 --> 00:12:16,640 Speaker 1: person in the heard of two thousand and one, which 176 00:12:16,679 --> 00:12:20,200 Speaker 1: made it the eleventh in West Africa despite its size 177 00:12:20,320 --> 00:12:23,480 Speaker 1: to about eighty four US dollars per person in twenty eighteen. 178 00:12:23,679 --> 00:12:26,520 Speaker 1: That raised its ranking to the third highest in the region. 179 00:12:27,200 --> 00:12:31,440 Speaker 1: But despite that increase in spend, relative outcomes remained really poor. 180 00:12:32,080 --> 00:12:35,360 Speaker 1: Nigeria is still ranked sixth in West Africa for age 181 00:12:35,400 --> 00:12:40,240 Speaker 1: standardized mortality and seventh for healthy life expectancy. 182 00:12:40,200 --> 00:12:45,040 Speaker 2: Which is so surprising, especially if you think of the 183 00:12:45,120 --> 00:12:49,000 Speaker 2: expertise that comes out of a lot of the medical 184 00:12:49,000 --> 00:12:52,360 Speaker 2: schools and the medical students that are Nigerian. But if 185 00:12:52,360 --> 00:12:57,040 Speaker 2: we just focus in on medical tourism, that is something Yinko, 186 00:12:57,120 --> 00:12:59,840 Speaker 2: you brought this up that we have continued to see 187 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:04,760 Speaker 2: all across the continent, but especially too with Leaders Janice, 188 00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:07,120 Speaker 2: maybe you start with us expand a little bit more 189 00:13:07,200 --> 00:13:09,679 Speaker 2: on how big of a trend that is. 190 00:13:10,600 --> 00:13:13,800 Speaker 1: The trend of Africans seeking healthcare broad is significant. Some 191 00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:17,520 Speaker 1: estimates put it at about three hundred thousand Africans that 192 00:13:17,640 --> 00:13:21,520 Speaker 1: travel to India annually for medical services, spending more than 193 00:13:21,559 --> 00:13:26,960 Speaker 1: two billion dollars each year. You mentioned Leaders, We've seen 194 00:13:27,000 --> 00:13:31,040 Speaker 1: several African presidents travel abroad for health services. That reflects 195 00:13:31,040 --> 00:13:34,080 Speaker 1: the ongoing challenges in their local health care systems. Just 196 00:13:34,120 --> 00:13:37,400 Speaker 1: to name a few. We had President Bohari from Nigeria. 197 00:13:37,520 --> 00:13:42,040 Speaker 1: We've had President Lungu from Zambia, President Mugabi from Zimbabwe 198 00:13:42,280 --> 00:13:46,079 Speaker 1: who died in Singapore in twenty seventeen while seeking medical treatment. 199 00:13:46,200 --> 00:13:49,720 Speaker 1: We've had President Bongo from Gabon who suffered a stroke 200 00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:52,880 Speaker 1: and was treated in Saudi Arabia after that stroke. And 201 00:13:53,240 --> 00:13:57,520 Speaker 1: we've had Presidents Talan from Benin who traveled to France 202 00:13:57,520 --> 00:13:59,040 Speaker 1: for treatments in twenty seventeen. 203 00:14:00,320 --> 00:14:03,320 Speaker 2: Maybe let's speak to some of the other problems that 204 00:14:03,320 --> 00:14:07,040 Speaker 2: we are seeing within the healthcare industry in other pockets 205 00:14:07,440 --> 00:14:10,360 Speaker 2: of the continent. What sticks out to you when you're 206 00:14:10,400 --> 00:14:13,040 Speaker 2: looking at this from your vantage point On. 207 00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:16,360 Speaker 1: A continent like Africa, As you can imagine, healthcare varies widely. 208 00:14:16,720 --> 00:14:20,400 Speaker 1: Certain regions face high endemic infectious disease risk and the 209 00:14:20,440 --> 00:14:25,080 Speaker 1: related burden to that, but we do see certain pockets 210 00:14:25,520 --> 00:14:28,800 Speaker 1: faring better than others. So in Kenya and South Africa, 211 00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:32,280 Speaker 1: the healthcare systems which are also a mixed like in Nigeria, 212 00:14:32,280 --> 00:14:35,480 Speaker 1: of public and private sectors. They both spend a lot 213 00:14:35,600 --> 00:14:40,160 Speaker 1: more of their GDP on healthcare than Nigeria does. Nigeria 214 00:14:40,240 --> 00:14:42,760 Speaker 1: allocates less than five percent of its national budget to 215 00:14:42,800 --> 00:14:46,120 Speaker 1: health care, and that is significantly below the fifteen percent 216 00:14:46,160 --> 00:14:49,160 Speaker 1: target recommended by the African Union. In Kenya, there is 217 00:14:49,240 --> 00:14:52,320 Speaker 1: mandatory health insurance. That's something South Africa is working hard 218 00:14:52,760 --> 00:14:56,000 Speaker 1: to also introduce. Just to be clear, Nigeria also has 219 00:14:56,040 --> 00:15:00,280 Speaker 1: compulsory health insurance, but previous efforts at universal coverage have 220 00:15:00,320 --> 00:15:04,320 Speaker 1: failed to achieve significant population coverage. The health insurance system 221 00:15:04,680 --> 00:15:08,320 Speaker 1: remains very fragmented there and some estimates peg the percent 222 00:15:08,400 --> 00:15:11,320 Speaker 1: of Nigerians that are still not covered by any form 223 00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:14,920 Speaker 1: of health insurance at ninety percent. That means ten percent 224 00:15:15,000 --> 00:15:17,960 Speaker 1: of Nigerians are estimated to have health insurance. That compares 225 00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:21,200 Speaker 1: to about sixteen percent in South Africa, although in South 226 00:15:21,200 --> 00:15:24,840 Speaker 1: Africa that's changing as lower price packages are offered health 227 00:15:24,840 --> 00:15:28,280 Speaker 1: insurance packages. And in Kenya about fifty three percent of 228 00:15:28,320 --> 00:15:30,960 Speaker 1: the population of health insurance. So that puts it in 229 00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:34,200 Speaker 1: perspective not only from a GDP spend, but also in 230 00:15:34,320 --> 00:15:35,880 Speaker 1: terms of universal coverage. 231 00:15:36,160 --> 00:15:39,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, and we're seeing some laws changing, at least in 232 00:15:39,600 --> 00:15:42,440 Speaker 2: South Africa or at least being debated as it pertains 233 00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:46,160 Speaker 2: to health coverage. Yinka, maybe we just finished with you 234 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:48,880 Speaker 2: one point that stuck out to me, from what doctor 235 00:15:48,960 --> 00:15:52,080 Speaker 2: Nuwanda was saying was the question is whether or not 236 00:15:52,320 --> 00:15:56,080 Speaker 2: Nigeria has the political will. Have we had any indications 237 00:15:56,080 --> 00:16:00,320 Speaker 2: from this administration that potentially we will see some reform 238 00:16:00,120 --> 00:16:04,760 Speaker 2: or to the healthcare industry moving forward when we. 239 00:16:04,720 --> 00:16:07,400 Speaker 4: Look at patient safety, I think it's going to take 240 00:16:07,480 --> 00:16:11,440 Speaker 4: some time before we see real and talk about reforms. 241 00:16:11,840 --> 00:16:18,560 Speaker 4: But Nigeria does have a minister, doctor Muhammad Party who 242 00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:22,160 Speaker 4: has been trying to drive reforms, specifically at the primary 243 00:16:22,200 --> 00:16:26,320 Speaker 4: care level, and the hopes is that the discussion on 244 00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:30,200 Speaker 4: patient safety standards will reach those reforms, even if it 245 00:16:30,320 --> 00:16:33,600 Speaker 4: only starts with primary care. So that's the hope out 246 00:16:33,640 --> 00:16:37,520 Speaker 4: of this. But it's also important to load them, as 247 00:16:37,560 --> 00:16:43,320 Speaker 4: doctor Lander said, that taking up this bite amid unimaginable laws, 248 00:16:43,840 --> 00:16:47,880 Speaker 4: and so it's really important that you know, we do 249 00:16:47,960 --> 00:16:51,520 Speaker 4: see something happen in terms of reforms that impact the 250 00:16:51,640 --> 00:16:55,440 Speaker 4: wider population of Nigeria, which is why it's so important 251 00:16:55,520 --> 00:16:57,320 Speaker 4: that policy makers commune to this. 252 00:16:58,600 --> 00:17:02,080 Speaker 2: Jennie Anninca, thanks again so much for joining us this week, 253 00:17:03,000 --> 00:17:06,640 Speaker 2: and you can read our reporting of healthcare across Africa 254 00:17:06,880 --> 00:17:11,800 Speaker 2: on Bloomberg platforms. Now here's some of the other stories 255 00:17:11,840 --> 00:17:15,639 Speaker 2: we've been following across the region. This week, Mozambiique will 256 00:17:15,640 --> 00:17:19,000 Speaker 2: only start talks with creditors to renegotiate its debt after 257 00:17:19,080 --> 00:17:22,200 Speaker 2: reaching an agreement on a new program with the International 258 00:17:22,240 --> 00:17:26,280 Speaker 2: Monetary Fund. President Daniel Chappo told Bloomberg in an interview, 259 00:17:26,840 --> 00:17:30,000 Speaker 2: the gas rich Southeastern African country is in talks with 260 00:17:30,080 --> 00:17:33,400 Speaker 2: the IMF on a new facility to stabilize the economy, 261 00:17:33,680 --> 00:17:38,200 Speaker 2: curb its reliance on natural resources and restore investor confidence. 262 00:17:38,880 --> 00:17:42,760 Speaker 2: And South Africa's government welcomed the approval of a US 263 00:17:42,840 --> 00:17:45,639 Speaker 2: preferential trade deal before a key vote in the Senate, 264 00:17:45,880 --> 00:17:49,679 Speaker 2: where Pretoria has faced opposition to its continued inclusion in 265 00:17:49,720 --> 00:17:52,760 Speaker 2: the pact. The House of Representatives approved the three year 266 00:17:52,800 --> 00:17:56,520 Speaker 2: extension of the African Growth and Opportunity Act, also known 267 00:17:56,560 --> 00:17:59,960 Speaker 2: as a GOA, which expired in September. And you can 268 00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:03,400 Speaker 2: follow these stories across Bloomberg platforms now, including the Next 269 00:18:03,400 --> 00:18:05,720 Speaker 2: African Newsletter. Will put a link to that in the 270 00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:11,960 Speaker 2: show notes. This program was produced by Adrian Bradley and 271 00:18:12,000 --> 00:18:15,200 Speaker 2: tiwa Adebayo. Don't forget to follow and review the show 272 00:18:15,240 --> 00:18:19,440 Speaker 2: wherever you usually get your podcasts. I'm Jennifer's Abasaja, thanks 273 00:18:19,480 --> 00:18:20,560 Speaker 2: as always for listening.