1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:02,920 Speaker 1: Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray. 2 00:00:03,160 --> 00:00:08,880 Speaker 1: It's ready. Are you get in touch with technology? With 3 00:00:08,960 --> 00:00:17,239 Speaker 1: tech Stuff from how stuff works dot com. Well, hello 4 00:00:17,280 --> 00:00:19,640 Speaker 1: again everyone, and welcome to tech stuff. My name is 5 00:00:19,680 --> 00:00:21,720 Speaker 1: Chris Polette, and I am an editor at how stuff 6 00:00:21,760 --> 00:00:24,840 Speaker 1: works dot com. Sitting across from me, as he typically 7 00:00:24,840 --> 00:00:28,520 Speaker 1: does when we record podcasts, is senior writer Jonathan Strickland. 8 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:32,160 Speaker 1: You enter a dark room that smells of mold. One 9 00:00:32,200 --> 00:00:35,839 Speaker 1: sputtering torch is the only light source. A rough hewn 10 00:00:35,840 --> 00:00:39,360 Speaker 1: oak table sits at the center of the floor, surrounded 11 00:00:39,360 --> 00:00:43,640 Speaker 1: by overturned chairs. On the table is a spoiled banquet 12 00:00:43,720 --> 00:00:46,760 Speaker 1: left untouched for at least several days. As you glance around, 13 00:00:46,760 --> 00:00:49,080 Speaker 1: you hear a quiet click, the sound of a trap 14 00:00:49,120 --> 00:00:55,280 Speaker 1: going off. Quick roll, you're saving brow'd do you're you're 15 00:00:55,480 --> 00:00:57,680 Speaker 1: you haven't. You took an arrow to the knee, so 16 00:00:57,840 --> 00:01:00,520 Speaker 1: you will now be a guards So I can no 17 00:01:00,560 --> 00:01:04,000 Speaker 1: longer be an adventurer, not like me. So we are 18 00:01:04,040 --> 00:01:08,240 Speaker 1: today going to talk about the history of massively multiplayer 19 00:01:08,400 --> 00:01:12,440 Speaker 1: online role playing games, and it all actually stems back 20 00:01:12,959 --> 00:01:15,440 Speaker 1: to what I was just alluding to, and all of 21 00:01:15,800 --> 00:01:18,520 Speaker 1: you guys out there who are big D n D 22 00:01:18,760 --> 00:01:21,880 Speaker 1: fans picked up on it. I'm sure immediately we're talking 23 00:01:21,920 --> 00:01:24,640 Speaker 1: about dudgeons and dragons, and it's important to talk about 24 00:01:24,680 --> 00:01:28,080 Speaker 1: dungeons and dragons first to understand why m m O 25 00:01:28,280 --> 00:01:33,240 Speaker 1: RPGs exist at all. Yeah, now, there were some computer 26 00:01:33,560 --> 00:01:36,680 Speaker 1: role playing games, but they weren't like what we think 27 00:01:36,720 --> 00:01:40,000 Speaker 1: of today and then and really they came around right 28 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:42,399 Speaker 1: about the same time as D and D took off. 29 00:01:42,840 --> 00:01:45,120 Speaker 1: So let's let's start with um, let's start with D 30 00:01:45,200 --> 00:01:47,520 Speaker 1: n D first of all to kind of explain what's 31 00:01:47,560 --> 00:01:49,440 Speaker 1: going on. So we're not we're not even talking about 32 00:01:49,960 --> 00:01:53,360 Speaker 1: D n D online. We're actually talking about specifically about 33 00:01:54,120 --> 00:01:58,080 Speaker 1: the pencil and paper and dice and all that jazz 34 00:01:58,800 --> 00:02:03,760 Speaker 1: game screens, etcetera. So back in nineteen uh, there were 35 00:02:03,840 --> 00:02:07,520 Speaker 1: some some some guys who had created a war game, 36 00:02:07,640 --> 00:02:11,360 Speaker 1: a miniature's war game called chain Mail. All right, now, 37 00:02:11,720 --> 00:02:15,040 Speaker 1: war games are they've been around for a while, right, Yeah. 38 00:02:15,080 --> 00:02:19,320 Speaker 1: It's where you essentially have figures that represent military units, 39 00:02:19,560 --> 00:02:22,280 Speaker 1: or you might even have what they used to call chits, 40 00:02:22,360 --> 00:02:24,959 Speaker 1: those little pieces of cardboard that had the little number. 41 00:02:25,080 --> 00:02:27,200 Speaker 1: It kind of looked like, Um, if you haven't seen 42 00:02:27,280 --> 00:02:31,040 Speaker 1: these old style things. They actually sort of look like 43 00:02:31,080 --> 00:02:33,280 Speaker 1: the periodic table. They have the picture of your unit 44 00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:35,720 Speaker 1: and how many hit points it has and all that stuff. Right, 45 00:02:35,760 --> 00:02:38,399 Speaker 1: So the ideas that you would try and uh out 46 00:02:38,480 --> 00:02:42,840 Speaker 1: strategicize your opponent playing on a map, and the map 47 00:02:42,919 --> 00:02:47,040 Speaker 1: might have even topographical elements that would indicate how you 48 00:02:47,120 --> 00:02:49,720 Speaker 1: might have an advantage or disadvantage in a given situation, 49 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:53,079 Speaker 1: depending upon your unit and where your enemy is located. 50 00:02:53,720 --> 00:02:56,640 Speaker 1: And anyway, the whole game was this idea of you know, 51 00:02:57,200 --> 00:03:00,440 Speaker 1: matching wits against an opponent. Well, chain mailind of brought 52 00:03:00,440 --> 00:03:02,320 Speaker 1: that down a little bit. Chain Mail was an idea 53 00:03:02,360 --> 00:03:07,040 Speaker 1: of using smaller units in very specific circumstances, like say 54 00:03:07,200 --> 00:03:12,040 Speaker 1: in castle or a dungeon. But then the game creators, 55 00:03:12,080 --> 00:03:15,640 Speaker 1: among them a certain Gary Gygax, I feel like I've 56 00:03:15,639 --> 00:03:19,480 Speaker 1: heard that name before, UH, decided that what if we 57 00:03:19,480 --> 00:03:22,480 Speaker 1: were to to to change this. So instead of playing, 58 00:03:22,840 --> 00:03:27,320 Speaker 1: you know, controlling units, you control a specific character, someone 59 00:03:27,360 --> 00:03:33,119 Speaker 1: who has a personality of background, UH, goals, motivations. UH. 60 00:03:33,160 --> 00:03:37,640 Speaker 1: They have their own abilities and their own disadvantages, and 61 00:03:37,720 --> 00:03:41,600 Speaker 1: you were to take on this role within an adventure. 62 00:03:41,960 --> 00:03:44,080 Speaker 1: And that was that where the whole role playing game 63 00:03:44,120 --> 00:03:46,320 Speaker 1: idea kind of spawned out of You would have someone 64 00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:49,720 Speaker 1: who is in charge of explaining all the environments and 65 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:52,040 Speaker 1: taking care of all the game mechanics on the back end. 66 00:03:52,080 --> 00:03:55,320 Speaker 1: That would be the dungeon master or game master. And 67 00:03:55,360 --> 00:03:59,280 Speaker 1: then the players would each control a character and would 68 00:03:59,360 --> 00:04:03,920 Speaker 1: try and pursue certain goals dependent upon the game itself 69 00:04:04,000 --> 00:04:08,320 Speaker 1: and that character's personality. And this was kind of a 70 00:04:08,400 --> 00:04:11,160 Speaker 1: radical idea at the time, back in nineteen seventy four, 71 00:04:11,720 --> 00:04:13,680 Speaker 1: and uh it called I could I guess you could 72 00:04:13,720 --> 00:04:18,919 Speaker 1: say it was a popular idea, particularly among high school 73 00:04:18,920 --> 00:04:23,320 Speaker 1: and college students. Now, your characters when when you first 74 00:04:23,320 --> 00:04:27,479 Speaker 1: started there, there are some elements of chance involved here. Um. 75 00:04:27,520 --> 00:04:30,960 Speaker 1: When you first create your character, uh, you roll the 76 00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:36,920 Speaker 1: dice to to determine what the character's characteristics are. Their attributes. Yeah, like, um, 77 00:04:37,120 --> 00:04:39,880 Speaker 1: for example, of strength, how strong that person is, or 78 00:04:40,120 --> 00:04:42,960 Speaker 1: or how much dexterity that person has the ability to 79 00:04:42,960 --> 00:04:44,680 Speaker 1: get out of the way when somebody's swinging an axe 80 00:04:44,680 --> 00:04:47,400 Speaker 1: at their head. Um. Now, I haven't played D and 81 00:04:47,480 --> 00:04:49,359 Speaker 1: D for about twenty years, but I remember that it 82 00:04:49,440 --> 00:04:52,600 Speaker 1: used to range between three and eighteen for normal characters. Yes, 83 00:04:52,640 --> 00:04:59,440 Speaker 1: because you roll, Um, the thing is um with the uh. 84 00:04:59,480 --> 00:05:01,880 Speaker 1: You know that that's one aspect of it too. But 85 00:05:01,960 --> 00:05:04,800 Speaker 1: the dungeon master or game master would use a screen 86 00:05:05,200 --> 00:05:08,080 Speaker 1: to hide the dungeon or whatever it is that you 87 00:05:08,120 --> 00:05:10,480 Speaker 1: were going and venturing in, so you didn't really know. 88 00:05:10,600 --> 00:05:12,560 Speaker 1: Unlike those other games where you could see there were 89 00:05:12,560 --> 00:05:14,760 Speaker 1: mountains ahead of your characters, you could go around the 90 00:05:14,760 --> 00:05:19,760 Speaker 1: mountains when you came, Um, you'll be riding six white horses. 91 00:05:19,960 --> 00:05:24,080 Speaker 1: But meanwhile, um, in a dungeon and in D and D, 92 00:05:24,120 --> 00:05:26,719 Speaker 1: you didn't necessarily know. And this is the difference in 93 00:05:26,720 --> 00:05:28,720 Speaker 1: a role playing game and those other games. You are 94 00:05:28,720 --> 00:05:33,240 Speaker 1: actually pretending to be, you know, this character. So uh. 95 00:05:33,600 --> 00:05:35,200 Speaker 1: One of the first things I had to learn and 96 00:05:35,240 --> 00:05:36,800 Speaker 1: I when I started playing dn D, I was I 97 00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:39,240 Speaker 1: think eight years old or nine years old. Um, you 98 00:05:39,279 --> 00:05:41,320 Speaker 1: had to learn that you can't see what's going on, 99 00:05:41,360 --> 00:05:43,920 Speaker 1: so you have to remember to ask what do I see? 100 00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:46,800 Speaker 1: What do I hear? You know, and the dungeon master 101 00:05:46,880 --> 00:05:49,520 Speaker 1: might not necessarily tell you you hear the click of 102 00:05:49,560 --> 00:05:52,320 Speaker 1: a trap unless you ask, like, well, you just heard 103 00:05:52,320 --> 00:05:57,160 Speaker 1: a clicking noise? Oh right, that clicking noises and D 104 00:05:57,240 --> 00:06:00,680 Speaker 1: n D were never a good thing. But you also 105 00:06:01,200 --> 00:06:03,839 Speaker 1: you also had different play styles. Right. You had people 106 00:06:03,839 --> 00:06:08,200 Speaker 1: who would play very achievement oriented, Right. They wanted to 107 00:06:08,400 --> 00:06:10,880 Speaker 1: they wanted to get whatever the goal was, and it 108 00:06:11,000 --> 00:06:14,480 Speaker 1: was less about the experience of being a character. Uh. 109 00:06:14,520 --> 00:06:17,520 Speaker 1: And then you had people who really kind of embraced 110 00:06:17,560 --> 00:06:21,720 Speaker 1: the idea of role playing being someone else and to 111 00:06:21,920 --> 00:06:26,160 Speaker 1: really kind of try and drive that aspect more than 112 00:06:26,240 --> 00:06:29,200 Speaker 1: the rules necessarily. So you you kind of had these 113 00:06:29,240 --> 00:06:35,400 Speaker 1: two types subcategories of players rule rule players that were 114 00:06:35,480 --> 00:06:39,239 Speaker 1: all about the statistics and and getting the good roles 115 00:06:39,240 --> 00:06:41,200 Speaker 1: and getting the best equipment for their character because it 116 00:06:41,240 --> 00:06:43,680 Speaker 1: would guarantee their success that kind of thing, and role 117 00:06:43,760 --> 00:06:46,360 Speaker 1: players who are more interested in the personality aspects. Most 118 00:06:46,360 --> 00:06:49,800 Speaker 1: most players fall somewhere within that spectrum. Between those two. 119 00:06:50,640 --> 00:06:52,520 Speaker 1: The same thing holds true by the way of m 120 00:06:52,640 --> 00:06:55,840 Speaker 1: m O RPGs. So the only reason I even mentioned 121 00:06:55,839 --> 00:06:58,240 Speaker 1: all of that is so that we have the foundation 122 00:06:58,360 --> 00:07:01,360 Speaker 1: to build upon, so that we understand once we get 123 00:07:01,400 --> 00:07:04,599 Speaker 1: into m m O RPGs why they're a big deal. Well, 124 00:07:04,640 --> 00:07:07,280 Speaker 1: computer role playing games have been around, like I said, 125 00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:11,280 Speaker 1: about as long as uh Dungeons and Dragons have, because 126 00:07:11,320 --> 00:07:13,880 Speaker 1: that was they sort of went around at um. The 127 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:17,360 Speaker 1: rise of personal computers on the desktop. Uh right, right 128 00:07:17,400 --> 00:07:20,040 Speaker 1: about the same time that the mid to late seventies, 129 00:07:20,160 --> 00:07:23,560 Speaker 1: and they got popular in high schools and colleges, which 130 00:07:23,600 --> 00:07:26,560 Speaker 1: were breeding grounds not just for role playing games, but 131 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:30,800 Speaker 1: for computer sciences. Yes, yes, that's true. Uh. The thing is, 132 00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:34,320 Speaker 1: one of the reasons that that Dungeons and Dragons and 133 00:07:34,320 --> 00:07:36,840 Speaker 1: other role playing games took off was because it gave 134 00:07:36,840 --> 00:07:39,160 Speaker 1: you an opportunity to play a game with your friends. 135 00:07:39,680 --> 00:07:44,160 Speaker 1: You weren't sitting at home on one machine interacting with 136 00:07:44,720 --> 00:07:46,720 Speaker 1: the game on the machine. I mean that was fun too. 137 00:07:46,800 --> 00:07:50,720 Speaker 1: I like playing uh those games by myself. Also, we 138 00:07:50,800 --> 00:07:54,200 Speaker 1: usually call those c RPGs computer role playing games. They 139 00:07:54,240 --> 00:07:58,800 Speaker 1: don't necessarily have a multiplayer element to them, right, but 140 00:07:58,800 --> 00:08:04,240 Speaker 1: but the multiplayer games, both on paper and and computers, 141 00:08:04,240 --> 00:08:07,000 Speaker 1: give you an opportunity to uh go through the experience 142 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:09,600 Speaker 1: with other people and uh, which which can be fun 143 00:08:09,640 --> 00:08:12,760 Speaker 1: because you never know what those other people are are 144 00:08:12,880 --> 00:08:14,720 Speaker 1: going to do. And it also gives you this feeling 145 00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:18,880 Speaker 1: of camaraderie es pre decor if you will, and and 146 00:08:18,960 --> 00:08:22,240 Speaker 1: depending upon the game, it may allow certain players to 147 00:08:22,320 --> 00:08:25,880 Speaker 1: band together and oppose other players. So you can even 148 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:29,480 Speaker 1: have elements within the game where you've got a struggle 149 00:08:29,720 --> 00:08:32,400 Speaker 1: between two groups of players, and if the game is 150 00:08:32,440 --> 00:08:36,480 Speaker 1: designed properly, meaning that it's you know, a dynamic element 151 00:08:36,679 --> 00:08:39,240 Speaker 1: to it, you might even be able to have players 152 00:08:39,559 --> 00:08:44,599 Speaker 1: actually influence the course of the game's world, which is 153 00:08:44,640 --> 00:08:47,240 Speaker 1: pretty tricky because you know, that's a very delicate balance 154 00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:49,720 Speaker 1: to to create when you are a developer. You don't 155 00:08:49,760 --> 00:08:52,199 Speaker 1: want to make it so easy to affect the game's 156 00:08:52,240 --> 00:08:56,800 Speaker 1: world that it is UH that that one group of 157 00:08:56,800 --> 00:09:00,480 Speaker 1: players essentially dominates and makes all the determine nations of 158 00:09:00,480 --> 00:09:02,720 Speaker 1: where the game's world is going. At the same time, 159 00:09:02,760 --> 00:09:04,800 Speaker 1: you don't want it to be so static that it 160 00:09:04,840 --> 00:09:07,920 Speaker 1: feels like no matter what you do, you don't influence 161 00:09:07,960 --> 00:09:12,080 Speaker 1: the outcome. It's a really tricky balance. Well, I would UH. 162 00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:14,400 Speaker 1: I would argue that one of the things that makes 163 00:09:14,920 --> 00:09:19,800 Speaker 1: UH online role playing games so much fun UH is 164 00:09:19,840 --> 00:09:24,880 Speaker 1: not necessarily the high graphics elements. I think the the 165 00:09:24,880 --> 00:09:28,120 Speaker 1: the element of play is most important. That's one of 166 00:09:28,120 --> 00:09:30,360 Speaker 1: the things. I mean, you don't see these things, these 167 00:09:30,440 --> 00:09:35,200 Speaker 1: fantastic UH animations of spells and and UH sword play 168 00:09:35,240 --> 00:09:37,720 Speaker 1: and whatever else that you might happen to be engaged 169 00:09:37,760 --> 00:09:41,200 Speaker 1: in when you're playing a tabletop role playing game because 170 00:09:41,240 --> 00:09:45,080 Speaker 1: imagine what imagine it. It's this thing that we used 171 00:09:45,080 --> 00:09:47,480 Speaker 1: to do before there was the internet. Well, I I 172 00:09:47,600 --> 00:09:51,080 Speaker 1: do love looking at the amazing graphics work of some 173 00:09:51,160 --> 00:09:54,079 Speaker 1: of these game studios now, but um, you know, the 174 00:09:54,200 --> 00:09:58,480 Speaker 1: very first online role playing games were text based. Yeah, 175 00:09:58,520 --> 00:10:01,120 Speaker 1: in fact, we can talk a little about them. First 176 00:10:01,160 --> 00:10:04,440 Speaker 1: of all, I wanna define a couple of terms for 177 00:10:04,480 --> 00:10:07,960 Speaker 1: the very earliest games. Some of them were built on 178 00:10:08,120 --> 00:10:12,720 Speaker 1: something called PLATO, which is an acronym for Programmed Logic 179 00:10:12,800 --> 00:10:17,480 Speaker 1: for Automated Teaching Operations. Here's the funny thing, this sucker 180 00:10:17,559 --> 00:10:20,320 Speaker 1: pre dates pretty much all of this stuff that we're talking. 181 00:10:20,360 --> 00:10:24,360 Speaker 1: PLATO actually came out before D and D the tabletop 182 00:10:24,360 --> 00:10:27,440 Speaker 1: game came out early sixties actually. But but PLATO was 183 00:10:27,640 --> 00:10:30,760 Speaker 1: all about. It was supposed to be an educational platform, 184 00:10:31,360 --> 00:10:33,560 Speaker 1: which of course meant that students immediately figured out ways 185 00:10:33,559 --> 00:10:37,199 Speaker 1: to play games on it, and uh like almost immediately. 186 00:10:37,720 --> 00:10:41,040 Speaker 1: This is for education. I want to kill stuff. So, um, 187 00:10:41,320 --> 00:10:46,000 Speaker 1: the University of Illinois built programmed Logic for automated teaching operations. 188 00:10:46,000 --> 00:10:49,480 Speaker 1: So it's a platform that could run on network to computers. Now, 189 00:10:49,480 --> 00:10:51,960 Speaker 1: these computers are networked to one another, they are not 190 00:10:52,160 --> 00:10:56,560 Speaker 1: networked into a larger network. Think land Party, not the Internet, right, 191 00:10:57,040 --> 00:11:00,839 Speaker 1: and uh, immediately you had students start to figure out 192 00:11:00,880 --> 00:11:03,240 Speaker 1: ways to create games because it meant that they could 193 00:11:03,280 --> 00:11:06,960 Speaker 1: link it to other students and have a social experience 194 00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:10,600 Speaker 1: on a computer, which just shows you that, you know, 195 00:11:10,840 --> 00:11:13,280 Speaker 1: we are very social creatures. The you know, the first 196 00:11:13,280 --> 00:11:15,480 Speaker 1: thing we start looking at is how can we use 197 00:11:15,520 --> 00:11:18,400 Speaker 1: this machine to connect to other people? So that's one 198 00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:21,520 Speaker 1: acronym you need to know. Another one is MUD, which 199 00:11:21,520 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 1: stands for multi user dungeons, not not what happens when 200 00:11:27,400 --> 00:11:32,120 Speaker 1: you add water to earth um, which just makes me 201 00:11:32,160 --> 00:11:34,200 Speaker 1: almost go off on a brack tangent. But I'm not 202 00:11:34,240 --> 00:11:40,240 Speaker 1: going to what happened to the water. Uh So Also 203 00:11:40,280 --> 00:11:43,920 Speaker 1: with mud come a couple of other um uh topics 204 00:11:44,120 --> 00:11:46,840 Speaker 1: or a couple other acronyms, MoU and mush. Have you 205 00:11:46,840 --> 00:11:50,520 Speaker 1: heard about those? So a move is a move is 206 00:11:50,559 --> 00:11:53,439 Speaker 1: an acronym that has an acronym in it because move 207 00:11:53,559 --> 00:12:00,440 Speaker 1: stands for mud object oriented, MUSH stands for mud users. 208 00:12:00,480 --> 00:12:06,120 Speaker 1: Shared hallucination or shared hack or shared habitat or shared holiday. 209 00:12:06,240 --> 00:12:08,760 Speaker 1: It really depends on who you ask. They're all pretty similar. 210 00:12:09,120 --> 00:12:13,440 Speaker 1: But but these are basically the frameworks within which people 211 00:12:13,520 --> 00:12:18,040 Speaker 1: built games. Now back in there was a game that 212 00:12:18,080 --> 00:12:22,760 Speaker 1: came out called Colossal Cave Adventure sometimes just called Adventure 213 00:12:22,960 --> 00:12:26,319 Speaker 1: by William Crowther and it was a single player text 214 00:12:26,320 --> 00:12:31,400 Speaker 1: based game, but it was what created the foundation for 215 00:12:31,559 --> 00:12:34,200 Speaker 1: some of the multi user games that came after it. 216 00:12:34,800 --> 00:12:39,520 Speaker 1: UH In ninety seven and published in seventy eight, a 217 00:12:39,559 --> 00:12:43,040 Speaker 1: game called Maria came out, and now Maria was built 218 00:12:43,080 --> 00:12:46,080 Speaker 1: on top of Plato. There were other games that came 219 00:12:46,120 --> 00:12:48,160 Speaker 1: out before Maria, but Maria is one of the more 220 00:12:48,240 --> 00:12:51,680 Speaker 1: famous ones, and it allowed up to ten players to 221 00:12:51,760 --> 00:12:54,760 Speaker 1: get together in a party and go on a dungeon 222 00:12:54,880 --> 00:12:59,080 Speaker 1: crawling adventure UH. And it was created with these these 223 00:12:59,520 --> 00:13:04,120 Speaker 1: very simple vector graphics like a UM. You know, you 224 00:13:04,160 --> 00:13:06,840 Speaker 1: see like the green wall with a green door outline 225 00:13:06,880 --> 00:13:08,440 Speaker 1: on it, and you would push a command that would 226 00:13:08,520 --> 00:13:10,559 Speaker 1: knock the door open and then you might have an 227 00:13:10,679 --> 00:13:13,520 Speaker 1: encounter afterward, you might find treasure, that kind of stuff. 228 00:13:13,679 --> 00:13:15,920 Speaker 1: The interesting thing about it was not only did it 229 00:13:15,960 --> 00:13:18,560 Speaker 1: allow up to tend people to play that that itself 230 00:13:18,640 --> 00:13:23,440 Speaker 1: was interesting, but it also created the dungeons um every 231 00:13:23,440 --> 00:13:27,000 Speaker 1: time you played, so the dungeons were not pre generated, 232 00:13:27,280 --> 00:13:30,400 Speaker 1: they generated dynamically when you would play the game, so 233 00:13:30,520 --> 00:13:33,840 Speaker 1: you would never necessarily have the same experience twice because 234 00:13:34,040 --> 00:13:38,839 Speaker 1: the dungeon would be randomly created when you started. UM 235 00:13:38,880 --> 00:13:41,720 Speaker 1: and UH. So that that was sort of an early 236 00:13:41,800 --> 00:13:44,520 Speaker 1: example of how people were trying to kind of port 237 00:13:44,600 --> 00:13:48,800 Speaker 1: the experience of playing Dungeons and Dragons or a game 238 00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:52,480 Speaker 1: like D and D to a computer environment and not 239 00:13:52,679 --> 00:13:56,400 Speaker 1: have it be a single player playing with computer generated characters, 240 00:13:56,440 --> 00:13:58,920 Speaker 1: although there are plenty of examples of that as well. 241 00:14:00,120 --> 00:14:03,920 Speaker 1: UM and then in nineteen seventy eight, a fellow named 242 00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:08,320 Speaker 1: Roy Trubshaw created the very first multi user dungeon and 243 00:14:08,360 --> 00:14:12,280 Speaker 1: it was called Mud. That's why we call the MUDs 244 00:14:12,320 --> 00:14:15,840 Speaker 1: because he made it. It was he was in Essex University, 245 00:14:16,040 --> 00:14:18,839 Speaker 1: and so Mud became the generic term for games that 246 00:14:18,880 --> 00:14:22,680 Speaker 1: were built in this way. UM and it became very 247 00:14:22,760 --> 00:14:26,760 Speaker 1: very popular. And then eventually again these were on network computers. 248 00:14:26,880 --> 00:14:30,960 Speaker 1: There was no Internet yet, but Trubshaw connected his game 249 00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:34,920 Speaker 1: to the ARPA net in nineteen eighty, so suddenly you 250 00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:42,560 Speaker 1: had essentially the ancestor too massively multiplayer online role playing games. 251 00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:45,440 Speaker 1: Because it made it gave access to people beyond just 252 00:14:45,640 --> 00:14:51,479 Speaker 1: folks who had uh the access to those specific computers 253 00:14:51,480 --> 00:14:55,320 Speaker 1: within Essex University to play. Yeah, my my notes have 254 00:14:55,440 --> 00:14:58,040 Speaker 1: the game down as being called Dungeon d U N 255 00:14:58,120 --> 00:15:01,480 Speaker 1: G E N. Yeah, I have it as it was 256 00:15:01,520 --> 00:15:07,520 Speaker 1: called multi User Dungeon. So yeah, yeah, but by the 257 00:15:07,560 --> 00:15:10,040 Speaker 1: same same thing. I mean, that's that is where mud 258 00:15:10,080 --> 00:15:12,200 Speaker 1: came from. They probably, I'm sure it was called dungeon, 259 00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:16,600 Speaker 1: just as uh for shorthand the next one I have 260 00:15:17,040 --> 00:15:20,080 Speaker 1: doesn't pop up til do you have anything you wanted 261 00:15:20,120 --> 00:15:23,200 Speaker 1: to mention before I go to that? Okay. So in 262 00:15:23,240 --> 00:15:26,600 Speaker 1: the University of Virginia there were a couple of classmates, 263 00:15:26,720 --> 00:15:30,280 Speaker 1: John Taylor and Kelton Flynn, and they created a game 264 00:15:30,320 --> 00:15:34,480 Speaker 1: called The Dungeons of Kezm, which was a six player game, 265 00:15:34,920 --> 00:15:37,160 Speaker 1: and it was also inspired by duchess and dragons, and 266 00:15:37,200 --> 00:15:43,880 Speaker 1: it used as key graphics to represent elements of the game. Yeah. Yeah, 267 00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:45,720 Speaker 1: it's making me think of some of the old games 268 00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:48,200 Speaker 1: I used to play. And they also founded a company 269 00:15:48,240 --> 00:15:51,640 Speaker 1: in eight two called the Kezmi Company. A few years later, 270 00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:53,840 Speaker 1: they I'll mention it when it happens, but they would 271 00:15:53,880 --> 00:15:57,040 Speaker 1: come up with another game that would be uh kind 272 00:15:57,040 --> 00:16:01,080 Speaker 1: of a big influence on online role playing games in 273 00:16:01,080 --> 00:16:04,840 Speaker 1: the future. UH. In any four, you had a fellow 274 00:16:04,920 --> 00:16:08,800 Speaker 1: named Mark Peterson who wrote The Realm of ang Mar 275 00:16:09,400 --> 00:16:13,760 Speaker 1: and Uh. It was originally a kind of an offshoot 276 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:17,440 Speaker 1: of another game called The Scepter of Goth and Uh. 277 00:16:17,520 --> 00:16:21,600 Speaker 1: In ninety four Peterson rewrote it and adapted it for 278 00:16:21,840 --> 00:16:25,000 Speaker 1: MS DOSS, which I don't know how many of you 279 00:16:25,040 --> 00:16:28,840 Speaker 1: guys remember MS DOSS. That's pre windows UM, but that 280 00:16:28,960 --> 00:16:32,520 Speaker 1: was the that formed the basis of a game that 281 00:16:32,640 --> 00:16:36,680 Speaker 1: ended up being found on a lot of bulletin board systems. So, 282 00:16:36,720 --> 00:16:40,400 Speaker 1: if you guys heard our episode about bbs IS, you 283 00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:43,000 Speaker 1: know that there used to be these communities. Still aren't 284 00:16:43,040 --> 00:16:45,160 Speaker 1: in many cases, but there were these communities that were 285 00:16:45,160 --> 00:16:50,600 Speaker 1: housed on individual, private individuals computers, although you could also 286 00:16:50,640 --> 00:16:53,120 Speaker 1: have companies that do this too, but you could have 287 00:16:53,160 --> 00:16:56,840 Speaker 1: a private individual who would open up their computer to 288 00:16:56,920 --> 00:17:00,640 Speaker 1: allow other people to dial into their computer to access 289 00:17:00,680 --> 00:17:03,680 Speaker 1: files and play games. This is one of the games 290 00:17:03,680 --> 00:17:05,840 Speaker 1: that was found on a lot of bbs is. And 291 00:17:05,880 --> 00:17:08,280 Speaker 1: if the BBS would allow multiple people to call in 292 00:17:08,320 --> 00:17:11,080 Speaker 1: at once, if they had multiple lines that would allow 293 00:17:11,160 --> 00:17:17,200 Speaker 1: for that, then you can have people play this game simultaneously. UM. 294 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:21,000 Speaker 1: And in eight five you had the introduction of Mirror World, 295 00:17:21,080 --> 00:17:23,000 Speaker 1: which was a multi user dungeon that could be run 296 00:17:23,040 --> 00:17:26,240 Speaker 1: on a home computer as opposed to some you know, 297 00:17:26,600 --> 00:17:32,200 Speaker 1: research institution or university's computer. Yeah, I remember the modem 298 00:17:32,280 --> 00:17:37,360 Speaker 1: speeds back then. That was. Yeah. Yeah, I've got an 299 00:17:37,359 --> 00:17:41,600 Speaker 1: interesting thing to mentioned in one about that. Five was 300 00:17:41,640 --> 00:17:44,119 Speaker 1: also the year that the Kezmi Corporation came out with 301 00:17:44,320 --> 00:17:48,680 Speaker 1: Island of Kezmi, which again Kelton Flynn and John Taylor, 302 00:17:49,119 --> 00:17:52,639 Speaker 1: and this ran on compu Serve. Yeah, I've heard of them. Yeah. 303 00:17:52,840 --> 00:17:57,320 Speaker 1: So it was the first commercial multiplayer online role playing game. 304 00:17:57,359 --> 00:18:00,160 Speaker 1: I don't think you could call it massive. Big has 305 00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:03,000 Speaker 1: had a limit to how many players could play one, 306 00:18:04,720 --> 00:18:07,440 Speaker 1: no more than one. Compared compared to the earlier games, 307 00:18:07,440 --> 00:18:09,880 Speaker 1: that's pretty massive. Yeah, compared to you know, the old 308 00:18:10,040 --> 00:18:12,240 Speaker 1: the Older Kids My game where six people could play, 309 00:18:12,320 --> 00:18:18,000 Speaker 1: or even the the the ten player Maria game, it's 310 00:18:18,040 --> 00:18:21,440 Speaker 1: you know, it's I think it's almost ten times that. Wow. 311 00:18:22,000 --> 00:18:28,040 Speaker 1: So I'm not that stupid people, almost but not quite. 312 00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:31,760 Speaker 1: An interesting game comes out interesting for a couple of 313 00:18:31,800 --> 00:18:34,240 Speaker 1: reasons because, for one thing, you can confuse it with 314 00:18:34,280 --> 00:18:38,000 Speaker 1: another game by the same name. Never Winter Nights by 315 00:18:38,119 --> 00:18:41,840 Speaker 1: Don Daglo and Catherine Mattega comes out has no connection 316 00:18:41,880 --> 00:18:43,639 Speaker 1: at all to the Never Winter Nights game that came 317 00:18:43,640 --> 00:18:48,080 Speaker 1: out by BioWare. But this game ran on A O L. 318 00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:51,920 Speaker 1: And I've heard of it. I used that joke already. 319 00:18:52,040 --> 00:18:57,080 Speaker 1: They and A O L used an interesting pricing mechanism. 320 00:18:57,200 --> 00:18:59,080 Speaker 1: So this is a commercial game. You had to pay 321 00:18:59,119 --> 00:19:01,359 Speaker 1: to play. And the way it worked was that you 322 00:19:01,400 --> 00:19:05,160 Speaker 1: would pay six dollars an hour to play this game 323 00:19:05,200 --> 00:19:09,960 Speaker 1: at three hundred bawd. And when we were talking hours, 324 00:19:10,520 --> 00:19:12,600 Speaker 1: that's about how long it would take to load to 325 00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:15,600 Speaker 1: make a move. Uh. For twelve dollars an hour, you 326 00:19:15,600 --> 00:19:21,280 Speaker 1: could play at Hey, that's just screaming fast, right, It's 327 00:19:21,400 --> 00:19:23,600 Speaker 1: it's screaming all right. I don't know if it's screaming fast. 328 00:19:23,640 --> 00:19:29,640 Speaker 1: And this was the first graphics based M M O RPG. Uh, Now, 329 00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:31,919 Speaker 1: do you have any you want to mention at all 330 00:19:31,960 --> 00:19:35,639 Speaker 1: before we get to ninety, because then I've got the biggie. Well. 331 00:19:36,200 --> 00:19:38,639 Speaker 1: I figured that we were going to talk about the 332 00:19:38,640 --> 00:19:41,719 Speaker 1: the Ultimate series of games because they were important for 333 00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:46,640 Speaker 1: the role playing game world, but they weren't massively multiplayer, right, 334 00:19:46,680 --> 00:19:49,480 Speaker 1: and that yes, that will definitely lead into a very 335 00:19:49,520 --> 00:19:53,760 Speaker 1: important discussion so Ultima. While while we've got this development 336 00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:56,720 Speaker 1: over here with the multi user games, there's still quite 337 00:19:56,760 --> 00:19:59,560 Speaker 1: a bit of work being done in single player computer 338 00:19:59,680 --> 00:20:02,360 Speaker 1: role play games. Oh absolutely, they were huge and one 339 00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:06,399 Speaker 1: of the one of the people who was really spearheading 340 00:20:06,400 --> 00:20:09,399 Speaker 1: this movement. We've actually we did an entire episode on him, 341 00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:14,399 Speaker 1: Richard Garriott, the Lord British of the Ultimate series. He 342 00:20:14,840 --> 00:20:18,639 Speaker 1: founded the Ultimate series. First game was Al Kalabeth, which 343 00:20:19,080 --> 00:20:22,399 Speaker 1: then eventually of which he was in college at the time. Yeah. Yeah, 344 00:20:22,480 --> 00:20:25,679 Speaker 1: and uh, he actually chopped out of college because his 345 00:20:25,920 --> 00:20:30,080 Speaker 1: computer game business took off so well. His dad, by 346 00:20:30,080 --> 00:20:34,520 Speaker 1: the way, astronaut. Yes, dad's an astronaut. He jumps out 347 00:20:34,520 --> 00:20:38,000 Speaker 1: of college, makes millions of dollars. But yeah, they were 348 00:20:38,000 --> 00:20:40,640 Speaker 1: he was working with. Don't take that as a lesson, kids, 349 00:20:40,720 --> 00:20:43,719 Speaker 1: I'm not saying drop out of college. Your mileage may 350 00:20:43,800 --> 00:20:49,160 Speaker 1: very yes. Um. Yeah, he was talking in one about 351 00:20:49,200 --> 00:20:53,560 Speaker 1: the possibility of an online version of Ultima. Yeah. Now, 352 00:20:53,600 --> 00:20:56,679 Speaker 1: Ultima was a series that he created after his first 353 00:20:57,080 --> 00:21:00,800 Speaker 1: success in computer role playing games and then Ultimate. Uh. 354 00:21:00,840 --> 00:21:03,560 Speaker 1: The original Ultimate games were kind of your standard hack 355 00:21:03,600 --> 00:21:06,639 Speaker 1: and slash RPG type games where you took on the 356 00:21:06,760 --> 00:21:11,480 Speaker 1: role of a character and tried to defeat some sort 357 00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:16,840 Speaker 1: of massively evil villain. But after Ultimate three UH, Richard 358 00:21:16,840 --> 00:21:20,479 Speaker 1: Garriott took an interesting turn. He really began to do 359 00:21:20,560 --> 00:21:24,199 Speaker 1: something new with computer role playing games. He created the 360 00:21:24,240 --> 00:21:27,600 Speaker 1: concept of UH. Well, it didn't create the concept, but 361 00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:31,600 Speaker 1: he incorporated the concept of morality and how your choices 362 00:21:31,600 --> 00:21:37,000 Speaker 1: can affect gameplay and UH. In Ultima four, you took 363 00:21:37,040 --> 00:21:39,119 Speaker 1: on the role of a character called the Avatar, who 364 00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:43,439 Speaker 1: was supposed to be the exemplification of all the best 365 00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:47,920 Speaker 1: traits in the world. He was supposed to be the 366 00:21:47,920 --> 00:21:51,119 Speaker 1: the paragon of virtue. And if you, um, if you 367 00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:54,800 Speaker 1: played like a nasty person and you stole stuff and 368 00:21:54,840 --> 00:21:57,960 Speaker 1: you killed innocence, you could not win the game. It 369 00:21:58,040 --> 00:21:59,720 Speaker 1: was impossible to win the game because in order to 370 00:21:59,720 --> 00:22:02,080 Speaker 1: win the and you had to make lots of sacrifices 371 00:22:02,200 --> 00:22:07,760 Speaker 1: and and be virtuous. And then this sort of gave 372 00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:10,080 Speaker 1: a real shot in the arm to his series. I mean, 373 00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:14,600 Speaker 1: it was already popular, but then it became crazy popular, 374 00:22:15,160 --> 00:22:20,080 Speaker 1: and so he continued to develop the games, and as 375 00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:27,720 Speaker 1: the multi user craze continued, with fairly primitive games compared 376 00:22:27,760 --> 00:22:32,440 Speaker 1: to some of the standalone games on computers, he began 377 00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:35,920 Speaker 1: to turn his eye towards developing an online version of 378 00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:40,120 Speaker 1: this Ultima world now in the meantime, just before he this, 379 00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:43,760 Speaker 1: while while this this whole plan for an online version 380 00:22:43,760 --> 00:22:48,080 Speaker 1: of Ultima was in the earliest development phases, another game 381 00:22:48,160 --> 00:22:51,960 Speaker 1: in ninety six came out called Meridian fifty nine, and 382 00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:54,159 Speaker 1: that was developed by a company called three d O 383 00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:58,160 Speaker 1: which no longer exists. Um they were, They were something 384 00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:00,840 Speaker 1: of an innovator for their time. Yes, um but if 385 00:23:00,840 --> 00:23:03,320 Speaker 1: you've never heard of them, and it's because they've been 386 00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:05,760 Speaker 1: closed for for quite a while. It's one of the 387 00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:10,199 Speaker 1: first massively multiplayer online role playing games ever released by 388 00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:13,200 Speaker 1: a major publisher, and and a lot of the things 389 00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:17,080 Speaker 1: that we associate with m m O RPGs began with 390 00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:20,119 Speaker 1: this game. For one, it had a monthly subscription for 391 00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:22,960 Speaker 1: a flat rate, so you would pay us a flat 392 00:23:23,040 --> 00:23:25,359 Speaker 1: rate each month to play. It had a three D 393 00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:28,280 Speaker 1: first person view of the world in a fantasy setting, 394 00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:32,159 Speaker 1: and uh not all. In fact, a lot of m 395 00:23:32,280 --> 00:23:34,720 Speaker 1: m O RPGs do not take the first person views. 396 00:23:34,920 --> 00:23:36,920 Speaker 1: Several of them take a third person view, where you're 397 00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:42,240 Speaker 1: either behind or or over the character you're playing. Um 398 00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:45,840 Speaker 1: but U three d O ran this game, but then 399 00:23:45,840 --> 00:23:48,680 Speaker 1: it shut down. The three d O shutdown in two 400 00:23:48,680 --> 00:23:52,359 Speaker 1: thousand three, it ceased to be Actually, they closed the 401 00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:56,200 Speaker 1: game on August thirty one, two from what I have, yeah, 402 00:23:56,240 --> 00:23:59,440 Speaker 1: well the game itself still continued because what happened was 403 00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:04,320 Speaker 1: in February Meridian fifty nine was turned over to the 404 00:24:04,320 --> 00:24:08,800 Speaker 1: original technical developers, which were a couple of brothers who 405 00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:12,080 Speaker 1: have opened the game to the public for no charge 406 00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:16,760 Speaker 1: to the player. So there it's running on two servers 407 00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:19,639 Speaker 1: in the United States. But yeah, I love the name 408 00:24:19,680 --> 00:24:24,480 Speaker 1: of the company though, Near Death Studios. Yeah, it's it's 409 00:24:24,520 --> 00:24:30,160 Speaker 1: just the game is when it's running on two servers. Yeah, 410 00:24:30,200 --> 00:24:32,920 Speaker 1: but it's but it's interesting that it's still you know, 411 00:24:33,480 --> 00:24:35,919 Speaker 1: this shows that the people who adopt these games can 412 00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:39,480 Speaker 1: be very passionate, and even when a studio itself is 413 00:24:39,520 --> 00:24:43,400 Speaker 1: in financial trouble, people want those games to continue, which 414 00:24:43,440 --> 00:24:47,680 Speaker 1: is somewhat problematic because how do you keep this going 415 00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:51,119 Speaker 1: when the in order to run the game, you actually 416 00:24:51,160 --> 00:24:53,680 Speaker 1: do have to spend real money. I mean, because you're 417 00:24:53,680 --> 00:24:57,560 Speaker 1: talking about electricity costs, you're talking about server costs, you're 418 00:24:57,560 --> 00:24:59,680 Speaker 1: talking about you know, you might have to have space 419 00:24:59,760 --> 00:25:04,720 Speaker 1: for that machine. It's Uh, it's tough. And um, that's 420 00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:07,160 Speaker 1: not the only time that has happened by a long shot. 421 00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:11,720 Speaker 1: But so at that same time, Richard Garriott and the 422 00:25:11,760 --> 00:25:15,560 Speaker 1: folks over at Origin and later Electronic Cards were working 423 00:25:15,680 --> 00:25:20,320 Speaker 1: on Ultimate Online. Yeah. Ultimate Online was apparently originally supposed 424 00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:23,400 Speaker 1: to go on now, keeping in mind the time frame 425 00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:25,480 Speaker 1: we were originally talking about for that when I met. 426 00:25:25,520 --> 00:25:27,919 Speaker 1: When I brought it up, we were very much in 427 00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:31,880 Speaker 1: the online service provider world and Sierra had its own 428 00:25:31,880 --> 00:25:34,719 Speaker 1: network it was working on, but they ended up shutting 429 00:25:34,720 --> 00:25:39,800 Speaker 1: it down. Um, and Ultimate Online became a an Internet 430 00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:45,280 Speaker 1: m m O RPG, which was probably better for h 431 00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:48,800 Speaker 1: for everyone involved because it gave you a much wider audience. 432 00:25:49,200 --> 00:25:52,840 Speaker 1: I got to actually see this game and action when 433 00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:55,680 Speaker 1: it was in its alpha build, before it even opened 434 00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:59,240 Speaker 1: up to the beta world. Uh and uh, because um, 435 00:25:59,440 --> 00:26:01,800 Speaker 1: Richard Garrett came down to a science fiction convention that 436 00:26:01,840 --> 00:26:04,680 Speaker 1: I go to a lot, dragon Con in Atlanta. So 437 00:26:05,359 --> 00:26:07,760 Speaker 1: Richard Garrett used to be a very frequent guest at 438 00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:10,000 Speaker 1: dragon Con, and in fact, he and I kind of 439 00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:11,600 Speaker 1: struck up a bit of a friendship and we would 440 00:26:11,680 --> 00:26:13,480 Speaker 1: chat about the games and stuff, and he would show 441 00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:16,720 Speaker 1: me the games that were in development, including Ultima Online, 442 00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:19,560 Speaker 1: and it was really a neat thing. It was. It 443 00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:21,880 Speaker 1: was a kind of a new idea. It was building 444 00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:25,320 Speaker 1: on that work that other people have done in previous 445 00:26:25,400 --> 00:26:29,160 Speaker 1: generations of multi user dungeons, but on a huge scale, 446 00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:32,959 Speaker 1: and also created a much more dynamic world. So Ultimate 447 00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:37,280 Speaker 1: Online had a world where, in theory anyway, you had 448 00:26:37,960 --> 00:26:41,439 Speaker 1: ecosystems that could actually be affected by player behavior. So, 449 00:26:41,520 --> 00:26:44,280 Speaker 1: for example, let's say that you are in a forest 450 00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:47,640 Speaker 1: and you decide one day that you are the bunny slayer, 451 00:26:48,160 --> 00:26:51,360 Speaker 1: and you go on a bunny slaying rampage and you 452 00:26:51,480 --> 00:26:53,760 Speaker 1: hack can slash every bunny you can find. Well, there's 453 00:26:53,760 --> 00:26:57,480 Speaker 1: a limited number of bunnies for a given amount of time, 454 00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:02,600 Speaker 1: and as you start slaying these bunnies, there are other consequences. 455 00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:05,439 Speaker 1: For example, there are also wolves in the forest, and 456 00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:07,960 Speaker 1: now all the bunnies are gone, which means that the 457 00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:11,040 Speaker 1: food source for the wolves are gone. You know, they 458 00:27:11,119 --> 00:27:13,640 Speaker 1: no longer have their normal food source, so they might 459 00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:17,119 Speaker 1: actually venture out of the forest and start to attack villagers. 460 00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:21,400 Speaker 1: So you could actually, inadvertently, while slaying bunnies, as any 461 00:27:21,520 --> 00:27:25,760 Speaker 1: good hero would want to do, bring terror and and 462 00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:28,600 Speaker 1: and hardship upon a village because these wolves are now 463 00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:33,640 Speaker 1: attacking people. Uh. On the flip side, if you were 464 00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:36,760 Speaker 1: you know, Wolf's Bane, and you were going out into 465 00:27:36,760 --> 00:27:39,359 Speaker 1: the woods to slay every single wolf you saw, the 466 00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:46,119 Speaker 1: bunny population might explode, and bunnies are everywhere almost like triples. Yeah, 467 00:27:46,160 --> 00:27:50,680 Speaker 1: that's just a small example of what was dynamically supposed 468 00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:54,160 Speaker 1: to happen in the world. Uh. And and to some 469 00:27:54,240 --> 00:27:57,080 Speaker 1: degree it did work like that, although there were definitely 470 00:27:57,160 --> 00:28:00,840 Speaker 1: some issues as well. It didn't always work exactly the 471 00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:06,080 Speaker 1: way people had planned. And also player behavior really really 472 00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:10,320 Speaker 1: changed that world quite a bit. If you, uh, if 473 00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:15,040 Speaker 1: you've played recent mmorpg more recent MMO RPGs and been 474 00:28:15,280 --> 00:28:17,760 Speaker 1: annoyed at the fact that there are people who are 475 00:28:18,280 --> 00:28:22,080 Speaker 1: playing the game just apparently to make other people miserable, 476 00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:26,080 Speaker 1: called griefers. Yeah, uh, that started pretty much with the 477 00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:28,960 Speaker 1: dawn of mmrpgs. Yeah. Now there were people who would 478 00:28:29,359 --> 00:28:34,920 Speaker 1: lurk just outside of starting areas and waylay characters, and uh, 479 00:28:35,000 --> 00:28:36,919 Speaker 1: sometimes they would just do it just to do it. 480 00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:39,760 Speaker 1: You know. It wasn't they knew you probably were not 481 00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:43,080 Speaker 1: carrying anything of value on you. There was no reason 482 00:28:43,120 --> 00:28:45,320 Speaker 1: to really attack you. There was no real benefit, and 483 00:28:45,400 --> 00:28:49,600 Speaker 1: yet they would do it because they're jerks. Um it. Meanwhile, 484 00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:51,479 Speaker 1: and there were a lot of other problems. There were 485 00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:54,440 Speaker 1: people who were finding ways to cheat the system. In fact, 486 00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:58,920 Speaker 1: there was a monumental event. So the game launches in Yeah, 487 00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:02,720 Speaker 1: well August of nine seven. The game has its first 488 00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:08,760 Speaker 1: monumental event. August. What happened? Oh was it ninth? I've 489 00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:11,520 Speaker 1: got eighth. But but you know what I'm talking about, right, Well, 490 00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:16,080 Speaker 1: there was an assassination, yes, of Lord British himself. Now 491 00:29:16,400 --> 00:29:20,320 Speaker 1: here's the thing. Lord British is uh. Normally in the 492 00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:25,600 Speaker 1: game was invulnerable to attack. But um uh, there was 493 00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:28,360 Speaker 1: an in game appearance of Lord British that happened during 494 00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:31,480 Speaker 1: the beta testing of Ultimate Online. So the game had 495 00:29:31,480 --> 00:29:33,440 Speaker 1: not gone gold yet. It was still but it was 496 00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:36,800 Speaker 1: open to players who were in the beta program. And 497 00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:41,800 Speaker 1: uh so Lord British was showing up during an event 498 00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:45,479 Speaker 1: in order to kind of stress test the servers. The 499 00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:47,920 Speaker 1: idea was that if Lord British is there, then most 500 00:29:47,920 --> 00:29:49,680 Speaker 1: of the beta players are going to be logged on 501 00:29:49,720 --> 00:29:54,920 Speaker 1: and this will help the origin and determine how well 502 00:29:55,000 --> 00:29:57,080 Speaker 1: their servers can hold up to the strain of a 503 00:29:57,080 --> 00:30:00,880 Speaker 1: lot of people playing at one time, yes, uh. And 504 00:30:00,920 --> 00:30:06,360 Speaker 1: then depending upon whom you ask, uh, something went terribly wrong. 505 00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:10,400 Speaker 1: Either it was a computer issue or a human issue. 506 00:30:10,760 --> 00:30:14,160 Speaker 1: And it's kind of kind of hard to, uh to 507 00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:16,680 Speaker 1: say what, although I think I know what it really happened. 508 00:30:16,840 --> 00:30:21,920 Speaker 1: What happened is that the server crashed, server reboots. Richard 509 00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:25,680 Speaker 1: Garriott is there as Lord British, server reboots and resets 510 00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:30,200 Speaker 1: Lord British, turning off his invulnerability flag. Richard Garriott does 511 00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:32,960 Speaker 1: not think he needs, does not realize this, and does 512 00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:36,440 Speaker 1: not turn the invulnerability flag back on. And then there 513 00:30:36,520 --> 00:30:42,240 Speaker 1: was a character called Reins who testing out this theory, 514 00:30:42,760 --> 00:30:47,960 Speaker 1: attacked Lord British and killed him. And he was also 515 00:30:48,120 --> 00:30:51,680 Speaker 1: he was not the player behind Rains was already kind 516 00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:54,680 Speaker 1: of a notorious on the servers because he was known 517 00:30:54,720 --> 00:30:59,640 Speaker 1: for exploiting bugs as opposed to reporting bugs, a software 518 00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:04,600 Speaker 1: consul from what I understand, so um uh it was 519 00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:10,640 Speaker 1: also supposedly one of the earliest griefers in the beta program, 520 00:31:10,680 --> 00:31:12,520 Speaker 1: So he was one of these people I was talking 521 00:31:12,520 --> 00:31:16,200 Speaker 1: about in a way, so uh, yeah, they were. He 522 00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:18,960 Speaker 1: was already kind of on thin ice, so that it 523 00:31:19,080 --> 00:31:23,080 Speaker 1: was an amusing situation and it was an irritating situation, 524 00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:27,720 Speaker 1: and uh they you know, the game also even had 525 00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:33,200 Speaker 1: little humorous responses and references to this when it went gold. 526 00:31:33,600 --> 00:31:37,960 Speaker 1: But yeah, that was one of those memorable moments in 527 00:31:38,160 --> 00:31:43,160 Speaker 1: m m O RPG history. So Ultimate Online ends up 528 00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:46,480 Speaker 1: being the very first mm O RPG to hit one 529 00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:50,600 Speaker 1: thousand subscribers. It's really successful early on in in the 530 00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:53,760 Speaker 1: in these early early days of the mm O RPG. Yeah. 531 00:31:53,760 --> 00:31:56,480 Speaker 1: But the next one that I have is it's going 532 00:31:56,560 --> 00:31:58,840 Speaker 1: to put it to shame even are you talking about 533 00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:04,880 Speaker 1: the one from Variant Interactive Later Sony Online Entertainment premiered 534 00:32:04,880 --> 00:32:10,480 Speaker 1: in ever Crack also known as ever Quest or Rest 535 00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:13,320 Speaker 1: or never Rest. Yeah, lots of different names for this. Yeah, 536 00:32:13,360 --> 00:32:16,200 Speaker 1: this was again. And what's also interesting is so far 537 00:32:16,320 --> 00:32:20,000 Speaker 1: Maridy in fifty nine Ultima Online request all three fantasy 538 00:32:20,040 --> 00:32:24,640 Speaker 1: based role playing games. Yes, EverQuest launches and it is 539 00:32:24,920 --> 00:32:28,160 Speaker 1: a massive success. Uh. It was in development at the 540 00:32:28,200 --> 00:32:30,880 Speaker 1: same time as Ultimate Online. Had a very different look 541 00:32:30,880 --> 00:32:33,680 Speaker 1: from Ultima Online, although similar setting in the sense of 542 00:32:33,720 --> 00:32:37,320 Speaker 1: it's the sword and sorcery realm. And uh, yeah, it 543 00:32:37,400 --> 00:32:40,160 Speaker 1: was one of those games where eventually, if you were 544 00:32:40,160 --> 00:32:42,560 Speaker 1: talking about an m m O RPG, you were talking 545 00:32:42,720 --> 00:32:47,160 Speaker 1: either about Ultimate Online or ever Request, and EverQuest popularity 546 00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:52,920 Speaker 1: skyrocketed that that might be a and and understatement in 547 00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:55,600 Speaker 1: some ways, and as people would play it for hours 548 00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:58,120 Speaker 1: and hours and and and lose track of time, and 549 00:32:58,560 --> 00:33:02,720 Speaker 1: there were divorces and well and also it was you know, 550 00:33:02,760 --> 00:33:05,480 Speaker 1: they had the benefit of seeing what was not working 551 00:33:05,560 --> 00:33:09,880 Speaker 1: on Ultimate Online and building out their world so that 552 00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:13,080 Speaker 1: it could limit these problems as much as possible. Some 553 00:33:13,160 --> 00:33:16,600 Speaker 1: problems are hard to get around because they are human generated, 554 00:33:16,920 --> 00:33:20,560 Speaker 1: and it's hard to create systems that prevent human behavior 555 00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:23,840 Speaker 1: from happening. Humans are very good at figuring out ways 556 00:33:23,880 --> 00:33:27,200 Speaker 1: to get around systems so that they can be jerks. Uh, 557 00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:30,720 Speaker 1: it's just true. We're you know, we're like, hey, I 558 00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:33,640 Speaker 1: really wanted to to to do this one thing. The 559 00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:35,440 Speaker 1: game's not letting me. But I bet if I try 560 00:33:35,440 --> 00:33:39,240 Speaker 1: it this way, it'll work. So yeah, Quest launches. But 561 00:33:39,280 --> 00:33:42,480 Speaker 1: another game also fairly popular, not nearly as popular as 562 00:33:42,520 --> 00:33:46,960 Speaker 1: ever Quest launches, called Asheran's Call. That one was from 563 00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:52,040 Speaker 1: Turbine Entertainment later on taken over by Microsoft and Ashuran's Call. 564 00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:58,480 Speaker 1: Uh another fantasy game. Yeah, yeah, it had it had 565 00:33:58,560 --> 00:34:01,360 Speaker 1: sort of a different system though UH to it. It 566 00:34:01,400 --> 00:34:06,160 Speaker 1: was sort of a loyalty system where you would basically, um, 567 00:34:06,200 --> 00:34:08,279 Speaker 1: there were It was sort of like a lord and 568 00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:12,520 Speaker 1: vassals kind of situation where um, the lord was expected 569 00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:16,719 Speaker 1: to be good to his I assume there were ladies too, 570 00:34:17,160 --> 00:34:19,080 Speaker 1: But basically in in this role, the person at the 571 00:34:19,120 --> 00:34:21,040 Speaker 1: top of the pyramid is supposed to expected to be 572 00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:24,640 Speaker 1: good to their people, um, for which they would be 573 00:34:24,680 --> 00:34:30,040 Speaker 1: rewarded and the people would be able to support their uh, 574 00:34:30,200 --> 00:34:32,040 Speaker 1: the person at the top of the pyramid. So it 575 00:34:32,080 --> 00:34:34,319 Speaker 1: was supposed to kind of feudalism. Yeah, it was really 576 00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:36,440 Speaker 1: supposed to work out in the game, and apparently it 577 00:34:36,480 --> 00:34:38,760 Speaker 1: was sort of a limited success, but it was a different, 578 00:34:38,760 --> 00:34:41,120 Speaker 1: a very different kind of system than than anyone else 579 00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:43,080 Speaker 1: had had. There. There are a couple of games that 580 00:34:43,160 --> 00:34:45,799 Speaker 1: really tried to break the mold UM and that was 581 00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:49,239 Speaker 1: one of them, and and they they've all met with 582 00:34:49,400 --> 00:34:53,960 Speaker 1: varying degrees of success. Um. Two thousand wasn't interesting year 583 00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:57,440 Speaker 1: because that's when Lucas Arts announced UH that it was 584 00:34:57,480 --> 00:35:02,040 Speaker 1: developing a game that initially I was very very eager 585 00:35:02,080 --> 00:35:06,719 Speaker 1: to get my hands on, called Star Wars Galaxies. So 586 00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:09,919 Speaker 1: it's announced in two thousand and the original launch date 587 00:35:10,000 --> 00:35:12,200 Speaker 1: was going to be in two thousand one, but it 588 00:35:12,239 --> 00:35:18,279 Speaker 1: was delayed until two thousand three. Uh. The game. The 589 00:35:18,280 --> 00:35:20,200 Speaker 1: setting of the game, first of all set in the 590 00:35:20,239 --> 00:35:23,080 Speaker 1: Star Wars universe, obviously, but the actual setting of the 591 00:35:23,080 --> 00:35:27,120 Speaker 1: game was set after the events of Episode four, often 592 00:35:27,200 --> 00:35:31,520 Speaker 1: just called Star Wars, also known as a New Hope. 593 00:35:31,760 --> 00:35:34,920 Speaker 1: So and you hope justin It's O Death Stars blown up. 594 00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:36,960 Speaker 1: That's when the game is set. And you could actually 595 00:35:37,040 --> 00:35:42,520 Speaker 1: encounter characters from the films as you played the game. Um, 596 00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:44,840 Speaker 1: but there were a lot of issues people had with 597 00:35:44,880 --> 00:35:47,480 Speaker 1: this game. There were some gameplay issues, there were some 598 00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:50,360 Speaker 1: story issues. There were people who were very upset that 599 00:35:50,400 --> 00:35:53,640 Speaker 1: the Jedi system was kind of weird in Star Wars 600 00:35:53,640 --> 00:35:56,120 Speaker 1: Galaxies in order to be a Jedi, you know, keep 601 00:35:56,120 --> 00:35:58,759 Speaker 1: in mind set during the original trilogy, not a lot 602 00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:02,239 Speaker 1: of Jedi in that original trilogy. You essentially had Luke, 603 00:36:02,719 --> 00:36:04,320 Speaker 1: and then you had you know, Darth Vader of the 604 00:36:04,400 --> 00:36:07,239 Speaker 1: Dark Lord of the Sith, and you had Yoda and 605 00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:09,759 Speaker 1: then as far as you knew that was that was 606 00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:12,640 Speaker 1: it Obi Wan in the first film, but then he 607 00:36:12,680 --> 00:36:16,120 Speaker 1: dies spoiler alert, and so, um, you didn't have that 608 00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:18,160 Speaker 1: any Jedi running around. I mean, the idea was that 609 00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:20,799 Speaker 1: Darth Vader had gone and and pretty much killed all 610 00:36:20,840 --> 00:36:25,200 Speaker 1: the rest of them. So, because you know, they wanted 611 00:36:25,239 --> 00:36:27,680 Speaker 1: the game to be true to the lore of Star 612 00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:30,319 Speaker 1: Wars as much as possible, they did not want it 613 00:36:30,360 --> 00:36:32,280 Speaker 1: to be easy to go out and create a Jedi, 614 00:36:33,000 --> 00:36:34,640 Speaker 1: as if it were, then everyone would go out and 615 00:36:34,640 --> 00:36:36,239 Speaker 1: create a Jedi, and then you'd suddenly have a Star 616 00:36:36,239 --> 00:36:39,239 Speaker 1: Wars universe where a hundred thousand Jedi are running around. 617 00:36:39,239 --> 00:36:42,080 Speaker 1: It wouldn't feel like Star Wars. So what they did 618 00:36:42,160 --> 00:36:45,920 Speaker 1: was they created a system that was difficult to discover 619 00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:50,200 Speaker 1: how to unlock the Jedi. It was almost ah, it 620 00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:53,160 Speaker 1: seemed almost random, like there was this list of criteria 621 00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:56,280 Speaker 1: you had to complete, and the list was never made public. 622 00:36:57,200 --> 00:37:00,920 Speaker 1: But uh so the game longed. In two thousand three, 623 00:37:01,000 --> 00:37:04,200 Speaker 1: the first the first person to unlock the Jedi slot 624 00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:08,200 Speaker 1: character did it within I think four months after the 625 00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:13,520 Speaker 1: game launched. Uh They later on changed the requirements for 626 00:37:13,600 --> 00:37:16,319 Speaker 1: becoming a Jedi and made it a quest that you 627 00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:19,240 Speaker 1: could take, so that you would have a very specific 628 00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:20,879 Speaker 1: pathway you could take in order to become a Jedi. 629 00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:24,160 Speaker 1: Because people were saying Star Wars The coolest people in 630 00:37:24,200 --> 00:37:26,279 Speaker 1: Star Wars are the Jedi. They have They're the ones 631 00:37:26,280 --> 00:37:27,800 Speaker 1: who have all the really cool powers. They have the 632 00:37:27,880 --> 00:37:30,160 Speaker 1: light sabers. These guys are awesome, and you're making it 633 00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:31,920 Speaker 1: impossible for me to find out how to play one. 634 00:37:32,640 --> 00:37:36,000 Speaker 1: So it's a very frustrating experience for people. Well, these 635 00:37:36,040 --> 00:37:40,279 Speaker 1: problems continued, among other issues, including things like reefers and 636 00:37:40,360 --> 00:37:43,400 Speaker 1: cheaters that sort of stuff, and the game was ultimately 637 00:37:43,520 --> 00:37:47,839 Speaker 1: shut down in twven, partially because there was another Star 638 00:37:47,840 --> 00:37:50,040 Speaker 1: Wars game on the horizon, but we'll get to that 639 00:37:50,120 --> 00:37:51,920 Speaker 1: in a little bit. Yeah, I was a little surprised 640 00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:54,239 Speaker 1: that you didn't mention Dark Age of Camelot in two 641 00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:58,520 Speaker 1: thousand one. Well that's just because the Star Wars Galaxies 642 00:37:58,520 --> 00:38:02,319 Speaker 1: was originally and now. But yeah, in two thousand one, 643 00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:05,080 Speaker 1: Dark Age of Camelot came out and that was that 644 00:38:05,160 --> 00:38:07,879 Speaker 1: was an interesting game too, because that focused a lot 645 00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:11,600 Speaker 1: on player versus player gameplay and it was specifically set 646 00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:16,279 Speaker 1: within the the world of King Arthur and legend. Yeah 647 00:38:16,280 --> 00:38:21,279 Speaker 1: another fantasy, but um but yeah, very specific fantasy though, 648 00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:24,080 Speaker 1: that's true. The the interesting thing about this is that 649 00:38:24,880 --> 00:38:27,960 Speaker 1: you had games where player versus player combat was possible 650 00:38:28,640 --> 00:38:31,880 Speaker 1: because a lot of people wanted to have the ability 651 00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:34,560 Speaker 1: to test their characters against other people's characters and play 652 00:38:34,600 --> 00:38:39,040 Speaker 1: against them. There were other games that really stressed UH 653 00:38:39,239 --> 00:38:42,919 Speaker 1: player cooperation, and some did not even allow player versus 654 00:38:42,960 --> 00:38:47,960 Speaker 1: player interaction. You had to you could not attack another player. UH. 655 00:38:48,040 --> 00:38:51,160 Speaker 1: Some games tried to split the difference where within certain 656 00:38:51,200 --> 00:38:53,640 Speaker 1: regions there was no way you could attack another player. 657 00:38:53,960 --> 00:38:57,520 Speaker 1: If you ventured outside of those regions, outside those safe zones, 658 00:38:57,880 --> 00:39:00,440 Speaker 1: then you could attack or be attacked by other players 659 00:39:00,920 --> 00:39:03,319 Speaker 1: and UH. Then there was another way of doing this 660 00:39:03,360 --> 00:39:07,279 Speaker 1: where games would create specific servers where if you would 661 00:39:07,320 --> 00:39:10,160 Speaker 1: log on to certain servers, they'd be player friendly in 662 00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:12,080 Speaker 1: the sense that you are not going to be attacked 663 00:39:12,080 --> 00:39:14,879 Speaker 1: by any other player because that's the kind of server 664 00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:17,520 Speaker 1: it is. And other servers or player versus player servers 665 00:39:17,520 --> 00:39:22,520 Speaker 1: where it's anything goes and lots of different experimentation during 666 00:39:22,520 --> 00:39:24,800 Speaker 1: this time to find out what what's the right way 667 00:39:24,800 --> 00:39:27,520 Speaker 1: of going about it, and to this day companies are 668 00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:31,920 Speaker 1: still experimenting with that. It also had the the people 669 00:39:31,960 --> 00:39:34,480 Speaker 1: in the game, the characters in the game UH as 670 00:39:34,560 --> 00:39:40,040 Speaker 1: part of a basically specific tribes UM basically the the UH, 671 00:39:40,480 --> 00:39:44,200 Speaker 1: the English, the Norse and the Celtic groups when and 672 00:39:44,239 --> 00:39:48,240 Speaker 1: each of them had specific attributes at which they excelled UM. 673 00:39:48,440 --> 00:39:52,760 Speaker 1: For example, the the Celts were particularly good at magic um, 674 00:39:53,160 --> 00:39:57,520 Speaker 1: and UM. The Norse were better at melee combat UM. 675 00:39:57,560 --> 00:39:59,920 Speaker 1: And that's something again. These systems, if you'll notice, the 676 00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:02,920 Speaker 1: systems are the kinds of things that are pretty common 677 00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:06,200 Speaker 1: across all of the the current m m O RPGs. 678 00:40:06,280 --> 00:40:09,040 Speaker 1: But it's sort of like they're being rolled out game 679 00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:12,920 Speaker 1: by game and people are um, they're sort of picking 680 00:40:13,000 --> 00:40:15,200 Speaker 1: up to the point where it's they take a, B, C, 681 00:40:15,480 --> 00:40:18,640 Speaker 1: D and E, where before they were just sort of a, well, 682 00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:20,920 Speaker 1: this is an okay game, but look at this one thing. 683 00:40:21,360 --> 00:40:25,439 Speaker 1: It's so cool. Yeah. Um. Two thousand one was also 684 00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:30,480 Speaker 1: an anarchy online launched as a science fiction based game, 685 00:40:30,600 --> 00:40:32,799 Speaker 1: so breaking the mold. I mean, Star Wars Galaxies had 686 00:40:32,840 --> 00:40:34,520 Speaker 1: not come out yet. It had been announced, but it 687 00:40:34,520 --> 00:40:36,560 Speaker 1: hadn't come out. And you could also argue that Star 688 00:40:36,600 --> 00:40:39,239 Speaker 1: Wars is in fact a fantasy not science fiction. I 689 00:40:39,239 --> 00:40:42,880 Speaker 1: would not argue against that. I think it's both. I 690 00:40:42,920 --> 00:40:46,000 Speaker 1: think that when most of the explanations for the technology 691 00:40:46,040 --> 00:40:48,480 Speaker 1: within Star Wars really boiled down to magic, it pretty 692 00:40:48,560 --> 00:40:51,279 Speaker 1: much just suggest fantasy. Well well yeah, but the thing 693 00:40:51,360 --> 00:40:55,120 Speaker 1: yet well anyway, a lightsabers, a magic sword, it really is. 694 00:40:55,680 --> 00:41:00,360 Speaker 1: But uh, blasters and and land speeders are techno apology, 695 00:41:00,920 --> 00:41:04,279 Speaker 1: which is yeah, yeah, okay, all right, it's got the 696 00:41:04,320 --> 00:41:07,280 Speaker 1: trappings of science fiction. It's a fantasy. So Anarchy Online 697 00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:10,000 Speaker 1: was science fiction based. Uh. It had some pretty major 698 00:41:10,040 --> 00:41:13,560 Speaker 1: technical issues when it launched, and had particular problems handling 699 00:41:14,120 --> 00:41:16,520 Speaker 1: large loads of players. So if a lot of people 700 00:41:16,840 --> 00:41:19,120 Speaker 1: tried to play on one server, there were a lot 701 00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:23,040 Speaker 1: of issues with lag and and and server stability. So 702 00:41:23,120 --> 00:41:25,920 Speaker 1: it had some issues when it launched. There's still a 703 00:41:25,920 --> 00:41:27,680 Speaker 1: lot of people who really loved that game, but there 704 00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:29,880 Speaker 1: were a lot of problems with it. It did have 705 00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:33,120 Speaker 1: several expansions though, yes, and this is when this is 706 00:41:33,120 --> 00:41:34,719 Speaker 1: the period in which you started to see a lot 707 00:41:34,719 --> 00:41:38,600 Speaker 1: of that. Ever, Quest was infamous for the expansions that 708 00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:42,719 Speaker 1: I think sixteen different expansions came out forever request, so 709 00:41:42,760 --> 00:41:46,120 Speaker 1: that's you know, and these were ways to increase the 710 00:41:46,200 --> 00:41:48,799 Speaker 1: appeal of the game to the longtime players who had 711 00:41:48,800 --> 00:41:52,880 Speaker 1: pretty much achieved everything they could do within the base game. Now, 712 00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:55,359 Speaker 1: why why would they keep playing? And remember, these games 713 00:41:55,360 --> 00:41:57,279 Speaker 1: are based on not just a purchase price, but a 714 00:41:57,320 --> 00:42:01,719 Speaker 1: monthly subscription. And so you want to try and keep 715 00:42:01,719 --> 00:42:04,120 Speaker 1: those players around as long as possible. Well, one way 716 00:42:04,120 --> 00:42:07,680 Speaker 1: to do that is to release expansions that continue to 717 00:42:07,719 --> 00:42:11,239 Speaker 1: engage players even after they have completed, you know, the 718 00:42:12,120 --> 00:42:15,799 Speaker 1: massive percentage of the base game. Well. Uh, in two 719 00:42:15,800 --> 00:42:21,719 Speaker 1: thousand two, we saw the launch of Final Fantasy eleven online. Uh. Yeah, 720 00:42:21,760 --> 00:42:25,280 Speaker 1: so it launched in in Japan on the PlayStation two 721 00:42:25,400 --> 00:42:28,800 Speaker 1: and at that time, so it was available on multiple platforms. 722 00:42:28,880 --> 00:42:30,440 Speaker 1: In fact, that was a big deal. It was a 723 00:42:30,800 --> 00:42:36,719 Speaker 1: massively multiplayer online game that was supporting platforms across various 724 00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:40,040 Speaker 1: kinds of machines. So it wasn't you know, you didn't 725 00:42:40,040 --> 00:42:42,440 Speaker 1: have to just play the game on one particular computer. 726 00:42:42,480 --> 00:42:44,600 Speaker 1: In fact, the same servers were supporting the game for 727 00:42:44,719 --> 00:42:47,400 Speaker 1: multiple platforms. And you might say, well, you know, so 728 00:42:47,440 --> 00:42:50,560 Speaker 1: what's the big deal about consoles. Well, keep in mind 729 00:42:50,600 --> 00:42:54,600 Speaker 1: that consoles, for the most part, don't necessarily have keyboards. 730 00:42:55,000 --> 00:42:57,040 Speaker 1: And so if you want to talk, this is part 731 00:42:57,040 --> 00:43:01,359 Speaker 1: of the online multiplayers variods. You want to communicate with 732 00:43:01,400 --> 00:43:04,680 Speaker 1: your your teammates to achieve whatever goals to slay the 733 00:43:04,760 --> 00:43:07,360 Speaker 1: dragon or to break into the fortress or whatever that 734 00:43:07,400 --> 00:43:11,640 Speaker 1: you're trying to accomplish, you need them or to irritate people, uh, 735 00:43:12,160 --> 00:43:14,799 Speaker 1: taunt people. You need to be able to communicate with 736 00:43:14,840 --> 00:43:17,359 Speaker 1: one another. And so now they're starting to figure out 737 00:43:17,360 --> 00:43:20,280 Speaker 1: ways convenient ways to do that to make that happen. 738 00:43:21,160 --> 00:43:24,040 Speaker 1: In two thousand three, h and by the way, there 739 00:43:24,080 --> 00:43:26,919 Speaker 1: are a lot of games that can come out over 740 00:43:26,960 --> 00:43:29,600 Speaker 1: in Asia that fall into this category that I'm not 741 00:43:29,600 --> 00:43:31,360 Speaker 1: really going to talk about. I'm telling mostly about the 742 00:43:31,360 --> 00:43:34,200 Speaker 1: ones that were played in the Western hemisphere, um because 743 00:43:34,200 --> 00:43:37,160 Speaker 1: that's where the majority of our listeners are from. But 744 00:43:37,239 --> 00:43:40,600 Speaker 1: in two thousand three, Ubisoft launches a game called Shadow 745 00:43:40,680 --> 00:43:44,279 Speaker 1: Bain and Shadow Bain. The interesting thing to me about 746 00:43:44,320 --> 00:43:46,719 Speaker 1: Shadow Bain was that the idea behind it was that 747 00:43:46,840 --> 00:43:51,680 Speaker 1: the game's events would not be pregenerated quests. Because for 748 00:43:51,719 --> 00:43:54,160 Speaker 1: a lot of these m m O RPGs, you create 749 00:43:54,160 --> 00:43:57,560 Speaker 1: a character, there are certain quests within the world that 750 00:43:57,600 --> 00:44:01,040 Speaker 1: exist and have existed for everyone that you can go 751 00:44:01,080 --> 00:44:03,839 Speaker 1: and complete. So your buddy can go and they get 752 00:44:03,840 --> 00:44:07,160 Speaker 1: a quest from this person, Hey, this in is full 753 00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:09,200 Speaker 1: of rats. I need you to clean it out. And 754 00:44:09,239 --> 00:44:10,919 Speaker 1: your buddy goes in and cleans out all the rats, 755 00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:13,400 Speaker 1: and then you go to that same person. That person says, hey, 756 00:44:13,400 --> 00:44:14,880 Speaker 1: this in is full of rats. I need you to 757 00:44:14,880 --> 00:44:16,359 Speaker 1: clean them out. Then you can go and clean out 758 00:44:16,400 --> 00:44:20,040 Speaker 1: all the rats. Uh Shadow Bain was different. It depended 759 00:44:20,080 --> 00:44:23,759 Speaker 1: upon the players to generate the content and the events 760 00:44:23,800 --> 00:44:28,160 Speaker 1: within the game that would affect everyone, which is pretty cool. 761 00:44:28,960 --> 00:44:31,640 Speaker 1: It's also putting a lot of responsibility on the backs 762 00:44:31,640 --> 00:44:36,000 Speaker 1: of the players. So I can't tell you exactly how 763 00:44:36,040 --> 00:44:38,040 Speaker 1: well it works because I never played Shadow Bain. I 764 00:44:38,080 --> 00:44:40,080 Speaker 1: just thought it was interesting to try and go about 765 00:44:40,200 --> 00:44:42,640 Speaker 1: making a game in that way. I have played in 766 00:44:42,719 --> 00:44:46,360 Speaker 1: games where the game content was supposed to be player generated, 767 00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:50,520 Speaker 1: and I gotta tell you, for every cool event that happens, 768 00:44:50,880 --> 00:44:56,040 Speaker 1: there's about twenty hours of nothing happening. Um one one 769 00:44:56,160 --> 00:44:59,439 Speaker 1: phenomenon we didn't mention. I just it's really not core 770 00:44:59,520 --> 00:45:02,360 Speaker 1: to what we're talking about, but just to show the 771 00:45:02,360 --> 00:45:06,040 Speaker 1: popularity of of uh M m O RPGs in the 772 00:45:06,080 --> 00:45:09,560 Speaker 1: early two thousand's is also when we start talking about 773 00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:14,800 Speaker 1: people trading real money for stuff in games and spawning 774 00:45:14,840 --> 00:45:17,760 Speaker 1: its own economy. Of course that that became a problem 775 00:45:17,840 --> 00:45:20,319 Speaker 1: for a lot of people. You know, gold farming as 776 00:45:20,360 --> 00:45:23,320 Speaker 1: they call it. Yeah, so you had it's kind of 777 00:45:23,360 --> 00:45:26,279 Speaker 1: crazy comment. Across many platforms, in many games, you had 778 00:45:26,280 --> 00:45:29,680 Speaker 1: people willing to pay real money to get in game 779 00:45:30,400 --> 00:45:34,319 Speaker 1: resources to make their players stronger within the game, which 780 00:45:34,360 --> 00:45:37,120 Speaker 1: is kind of interesting because you think you could be 781 00:45:37,200 --> 00:45:39,880 Speaker 1: using that real money to get you real resources to 782 00:45:40,000 --> 00:45:43,200 Speaker 1: make you happier in real life. But people were deriving 783 00:45:43,200 --> 00:45:45,800 Speaker 1: so much pleasure from the games themselves that they wanted 784 00:45:46,440 --> 00:45:49,360 Speaker 1: to uh to to deck out their characters with the 785 00:45:49,400 --> 00:45:51,600 Speaker 1: best stuff that they could possibly get. And in some 786 00:45:51,640 --> 00:45:54,200 Speaker 1: cases it wasn't like some cases it was so that 787 00:45:54,239 --> 00:45:56,440 Speaker 1: they could show off. Some cases, it was so that 788 00:45:56,480 --> 00:45:59,160 Speaker 1: they could take advantage of other players more effectively. Some 789 00:45:59,200 --> 00:46:02,239 Speaker 1: people just wanted, you know, they really like playing the game, 790 00:46:02,239 --> 00:46:04,759 Speaker 1: and they just wanted to have the coolest stuff that 791 00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:06,879 Speaker 1: they could get for their character, and they really didn't 792 00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:09,760 Speaker 1: have the time or the inclination to go get it themselves. 793 00:46:09,880 --> 00:46:14,640 Speaker 1: Because sometimes you're talking about items that would drop only 794 00:46:14,760 --> 00:46:19,000 Speaker 1: if you killed a certain monster and not always. You know, 795 00:46:19,080 --> 00:46:21,600 Speaker 1: it wouldn't always drop, so in other words, you might 796 00:46:21,640 --> 00:46:24,880 Speaker 1: have to face off against this particularly powerful creature and 797 00:46:25,000 --> 00:46:27,520 Speaker 1: use a lot of your resources like health potions or whatever, 798 00:46:27,840 --> 00:46:30,200 Speaker 1: in order to take the creature down, and then the 799 00:46:30,239 --> 00:46:33,640 Speaker 1: creature drops items, and it may even be that, you know, 800 00:46:33,719 --> 00:46:35,880 Speaker 1: it's only a certain percentage of the time will it 801 00:46:35,960 --> 00:46:38,520 Speaker 1: drop the item you're specifically looking for. To make it 802 00:46:38,560 --> 00:46:41,800 Speaker 1: more complicated, you would have games where other players could 803 00:46:42,080 --> 00:46:44,799 Speaker 1: pick up an item when it dropped, and so it 804 00:46:44,920 --> 00:46:48,560 Speaker 1: may only drop that one item. But then there's fifty 805 00:46:48,560 --> 00:46:50,399 Speaker 1: people all trying to grab it at the same time, 806 00:46:50,440 --> 00:46:53,439 Speaker 1: and there's only one instance of that item. Well, then 807 00:46:53,880 --> 00:46:56,719 Speaker 1: you know that would cause problems too, because you have 808 00:46:57,080 --> 00:47:00,200 Speaker 1: people who would camp out waiting for a mom start 809 00:47:00,239 --> 00:47:02,520 Speaker 1: to regenerate in order for them to go in and 810 00:47:02,560 --> 00:47:06,480 Speaker 1: try and farm out this particular item. And it for 811 00:47:06,520 --> 00:47:09,080 Speaker 1: some people it was worthwhile. For others, they just said, 812 00:47:09,160 --> 00:47:13,000 Speaker 1: this doesn't make the game fun if I'm just you know, 813 00:47:13,160 --> 00:47:15,160 Speaker 1: competing against all these people to wait for this one 814 00:47:15,200 --> 00:47:18,320 Speaker 1: monster to loads so I can get this one item. 815 00:47:19,120 --> 00:47:21,560 Speaker 1: You know, this feels more like work than a game, 816 00:47:21,640 --> 00:47:24,080 Speaker 1: and that became a problem for some people. It's still 817 00:47:24,120 --> 00:47:27,000 Speaker 1: a problem today, depending upon how the game handles items. 818 00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:28,600 Speaker 1: There are a lot of games now that will drop 819 00:47:28,640 --> 00:47:32,680 Speaker 1: items that are specific only to that one character, so 820 00:47:32,680 --> 00:47:35,480 Speaker 1: that each character that is participating and say a raid 821 00:47:36,000 --> 00:47:41,000 Speaker 1: all has access to the same general stuff, but if 822 00:47:41,040 --> 00:47:43,440 Speaker 1: they take it, it does not get removed from the 823 00:47:43,440 --> 00:47:46,880 Speaker 1: other person's game. So if if we are banding together 824 00:47:46,880 --> 00:47:49,920 Speaker 1: and we take down a monster and that monster drops 825 00:47:49,920 --> 00:47:52,120 Speaker 1: twenty gold, you get to pick up twenty gold. I 826 00:47:52,160 --> 00:47:54,879 Speaker 1: get to pick up twenty gold, and it's not like 827 00:47:55,000 --> 00:47:57,960 Speaker 1: the twenty gold only exists for the two of us. 828 00:47:58,040 --> 00:48:01,360 Speaker 1: So anyway, moving onto two thousand and four, which is 829 00:48:01,360 --> 00:48:03,920 Speaker 1: a big year and m m O RPGs again, I'm 830 00:48:03,960 --> 00:48:07,400 Speaker 1: surprised you didn't mention evonline, which also debuted into Yeah, 831 00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:09,759 Speaker 1: I thought about that and then I didn't. Do you 832 00:48:09,800 --> 00:48:14,400 Speaker 1: want to say anything about ev evonline is still very popular, Um, 833 00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:18,600 Speaker 1: it's uh it's made by a European company, um named 834 00:48:18,680 --> 00:48:24,400 Speaker 1: CCP Games, and very predominantly male too from what I understand, Um, 835 00:48:24,440 --> 00:48:27,919 Speaker 1: but yeah, it's a it's a big still very very 836 00:48:27,960 --> 00:48:33,200 Speaker 1: popular with space exploration and basically space combat. Um. Whereas 837 00:48:33,239 --> 00:48:35,719 Speaker 1: in the Star Wars games you might actually be a 838 00:48:35,880 --> 00:48:39,279 Speaker 1: character and you know, on your feet, most of what 839 00:48:39,320 --> 00:48:42,439 Speaker 1: I've seen of EV online is uh, space based, so 840 00:48:42,680 --> 00:48:45,359 Speaker 1: you know, you have your ship and you're doing stuff, um, 841 00:48:45,440 --> 00:48:49,120 Speaker 1: and there's there's interstellar commerce and that kind of thing. Um. 842 00:48:49,360 --> 00:48:51,520 Speaker 1: Obviously I've never played, but it's I do know some 843 00:48:51,560 --> 00:48:54,400 Speaker 1: people who do, and they really love it so and 844 00:48:54,440 --> 00:48:56,399 Speaker 1: it's it's got a big following, which is why I thought, 845 00:48:56,440 --> 00:48:59,320 Speaker 1: you know, you should mention it. Always one of us 846 00:48:59,400 --> 00:49:02,120 Speaker 1: nice to see a game that does not necessarily just 847 00:49:02,160 --> 00:49:07,319 Speaker 1: fall into the sword and sorcery realm. So next we 848 00:49:07,400 --> 00:49:10,720 Speaker 1: have in two thousand four three games that three among 849 00:49:10,840 --> 00:49:13,440 Speaker 1: the many games that came out, three big ones, ever 850 00:49:13,440 --> 00:49:16,759 Speaker 1: Request To, which you know, because ever Quest, even with 851 00:49:16,840 --> 00:49:19,480 Speaker 1: the expansion packs, was starting to show its age, and 852 00:49:19,560 --> 00:49:23,399 Speaker 1: ever Quest two was an opportunity for Well to sell 853 00:49:23,440 --> 00:49:25,440 Speaker 1: more copies of games for one thing, but also to 854 00:49:25,600 --> 00:49:29,719 Speaker 1: update the graphics and game engine beyond what an expansion 855 00:49:29,719 --> 00:49:33,360 Speaker 1: pack could do. And so ever Quest To launches, City 856 00:49:33,400 --> 00:49:37,879 Speaker 1: of Heroes launches, and now you've got the superhero supervillain 857 00:49:38,000 --> 00:49:42,759 Speaker 1: kind of games launching, which was a neat um, a 858 00:49:43,040 --> 00:49:48,640 Speaker 1: neat expansion on m m O RPGs. And then the 859 00:49:48,719 --> 00:49:53,399 Speaker 1: big game that is on the tip of everyone's tongue 860 00:49:53,400 --> 00:49:57,319 Speaker 1: when they talk about m m O RPGs, World of Warcraft, 861 00:49:58,360 --> 00:50:04,080 Speaker 1: which I think you cannot describe anything other than phenomenal success. 862 00:50:04,719 --> 00:50:07,560 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I mean it was. It was a true phenomenon. 863 00:50:07,719 --> 00:50:10,400 Speaker 1: There are over ten million people playing the game. I 864 00:50:10,520 --> 00:50:13,359 Speaker 1: remember when Ultimate Online launched, it was a big deal 865 00:50:13,360 --> 00:50:16,280 Speaker 1: when they hit a hundred thousand subscribers. Now we're talking 866 00:50:16,280 --> 00:50:19,720 Speaker 1: about ten million people playing this game, and it even 867 00:50:19,719 --> 00:50:22,720 Speaker 1: it even. I know that the largest number I've seen 868 00:50:22,960 --> 00:50:24,960 Speaker 1: attributed to it was a couple from a couple of 869 00:50:25,040 --> 00:50:28,480 Speaker 1: years ago. Now we're recording this in twelve where they 870 00:50:28,480 --> 00:50:31,360 Speaker 1: had hit twelve million at one point, maybe even thirteen. 871 00:50:31,719 --> 00:50:35,000 Speaker 1: So it is declined in the past year or two, 872 00:50:35,120 --> 00:50:39,760 Speaker 1: but not it's still going. Yeah, there there are plenty 873 00:50:39,760 --> 00:50:43,120 Speaker 1: of people who still play. And uh, and the expansion 874 00:50:43,120 --> 00:50:48,120 Speaker 1: packs have really continued the development of that world so 875 00:50:48,239 --> 00:50:52,120 Speaker 1: much so that they destroyed it at one point, Cataclysm completely. 876 00:50:52,239 --> 00:50:55,640 Speaker 1: Uh turned the world upside down and UH. It upsets 877 00:50:55,640 --> 00:50:59,120 Speaker 1: some players because things changed so dramatically. But the whole 878 00:50:59,160 --> 00:51:02,000 Speaker 1: point of it was that the player base for for 879 00:51:02,080 --> 00:51:05,640 Speaker 1: Wow was made up a lot a lot of the 880 00:51:05,640 --> 00:51:08,840 Speaker 1: player base we're old time players who have been playing forever, 881 00:51:08,960 --> 00:51:12,240 Speaker 1: and you know, you have to keep making things interesting 882 00:51:12,360 --> 00:51:15,720 Speaker 1: and adding a new realm every now and then, and 883 00:51:15,920 --> 00:51:19,239 Speaker 1: upping the level cap by five only goes so far. 884 00:51:19,880 --> 00:51:23,240 Speaker 1: And so there have been some calculated risks of really 885 00:51:23,280 --> 00:51:26,839 Speaker 1: shaking the game up in order to keep long time 886 00:51:26,880 --> 00:51:30,520 Speaker 1: players around and interested, because now they've got you know, 887 00:51:30,680 --> 00:51:35,480 Speaker 1: even places that seemed familiar are now new to them. Uh. 888 00:51:35,560 --> 00:51:39,040 Speaker 1: For new players, it was a little confusing, so you'd ask, 889 00:51:39,120 --> 00:51:42,040 Speaker 1: like a level seventy eight character, Hey, how do I 890 00:51:42,080 --> 00:51:44,600 Speaker 1: get to such and such? Like, Uh, well, I can 891 00:51:44,640 --> 00:51:46,640 Speaker 1: tell you how you used to be able to get there, 892 00:51:48,440 --> 00:51:52,040 Speaker 1: I don't know how you get there now. Um, left 893 00:51:52,040 --> 00:51:54,799 Speaker 1: at the barrel should have taken on the left. And Albuquerque. 894 00:51:55,320 --> 00:51:57,759 Speaker 1: Uh so, yeah, that those games, all three of those 895 00:51:57,800 --> 00:52:00,560 Speaker 1: games were made a big impact. And you know, it 896 00:52:00,640 --> 00:52:02,399 Speaker 1: was at this point that you really started to see 897 00:52:02,400 --> 00:52:06,200 Speaker 1: some real competition between games, because there are only so 898 00:52:06,239 --> 00:52:08,640 Speaker 1: many gamers out there who want to play online role 899 00:52:08,719 --> 00:52:13,839 Speaker 1: playing games. And yeah, and subscriptions can start to rack up. 900 00:52:14,400 --> 00:52:17,240 Speaker 1: I mean, these are not necessarily cheap and maybe somewhere 901 00:52:17,320 --> 00:52:21,600 Speaker 1: in the realm of you know, twenty a month a 902 00:52:21,640 --> 00:52:24,879 Speaker 1: month to play, and you know, you start playing multiple games, 903 00:52:24,920 --> 00:52:26,919 Speaker 1: you only have so much time to dedicate to each game. 904 00:52:27,040 --> 00:52:31,279 Speaker 1: So the competition was pretty fierce. World of Warcraft ran 905 00:52:31,400 --> 00:52:36,000 Speaker 1: with this and did really well. Two thousand eight there 906 00:52:36,040 --> 00:52:38,080 Speaker 1: was a game that launched that you know in other 907 00:52:38,080 --> 00:52:42,080 Speaker 1: games again launched between two thousand four, and Guild Wars 908 00:52:42,120 --> 00:52:44,280 Speaker 1: is a good one. That's actually a really good example 909 00:52:45,440 --> 00:52:49,200 Speaker 1: dn D Online, which changed from and it's not the 910 00:52:49,239 --> 00:52:50,799 Speaker 1: only one. In fact, the one I'm about to mention 911 00:52:50,840 --> 00:52:53,759 Speaker 1: also did this. D n D Online and Age of 912 00:52:53,800 --> 00:52:57,440 Speaker 1: Conan which launched. Both of those were games that you 913 00:52:57,440 --> 00:53:00,520 Speaker 1: would pay for originally and you did a monthly subscription. 914 00:53:00,600 --> 00:53:03,080 Speaker 1: Both of those games also came out with free to 915 00:53:03,160 --> 00:53:05,880 Speaker 1: play models, where you could play the game for free, 916 00:53:06,520 --> 00:53:09,520 Speaker 1: but you would not have access to all the content, 917 00:53:10,520 --> 00:53:13,600 Speaker 1: and depending upon the way the game model was, like 918 00:53:13,640 --> 00:53:16,000 Speaker 1: an Age of Conan, you could switch from a free 919 00:53:17,280 --> 00:53:19,480 Speaker 1: account to a paid account and then you would get 920 00:53:19,520 --> 00:53:22,360 Speaker 1: access to all the premium content. D and D Online 921 00:53:22,360 --> 00:53:26,160 Speaker 1: had a system where you could pay money for in 922 00:53:26,320 --> 00:53:29,000 Speaker 1: game credits and use those in game credits to unlock 923 00:53:29,280 --> 00:53:32,880 Speaker 1: areas of the game. Uh So, yeah, it was It 924 00:53:32,960 --> 00:53:38,000 Speaker 1: was a experimenting with different ways to get players engaged 925 00:53:38,000 --> 00:53:40,760 Speaker 1: with the game and enough so that they'd be willing 926 00:53:40,800 --> 00:53:44,239 Speaker 1: to pay to play the whole thing. And I don't 927 00:53:44,280 --> 00:53:46,600 Speaker 1: know how successful that was, honestly, I mean, it's it's 928 00:53:46,640 --> 00:53:48,399 Speaker 1: not the only time we've seen that too. We've also 929 00:53:48,440 --> 00:53:51,080 Speaker 1: seen online role playing games where if you pay real 930 00:53:51,120 --> 00:53:54,759 Speaker 1: money you get access to in game resources. UM. This 931 00:53:54,880 --> 00:53:57,520 Speaker 1: is also carried over into casual games. We've seen that. 932 00:53:57,560 --> 00:53:59,600 Speaker 1: When we had our episode about casual games, we talked 933 00:53:59,600 --> 00:54:02,799 Speaker 1: about games where you can pay cash to get an 934 00:54:02,840 --> 00:54:07,719 Speaker 1: advantage in the game freemium freemium. And it's also a 935 00:54:07,760 --> 00:54:12,040 Speaker 1: fairly controversial approach because you've got gamers who are saying 936 00:54:12,680 --> 00:54:14,799 Speaker 1: this takes skill out of it. If I just have 937 00:54:14,880 --> 00:54:17,320 Speaker 1: deep enough pockets, I can get an advantage over everyone 938 00:54:17,360 --> 00:54:19,759 Speaker 1: else in the game and it has no bearing on 939 00:54:19,800 --> 00:54:22,520 Speaker 1: whether I play the game well or not. And you 940 00:54:22,560 --> 00:54:25,160 Speaker 1: know there's something to that. But guess what, that's what 941 00:54:25,280 --> 00:54:27,719 Speaker 1: real life is about too. I hate to tell you 942 00:54:28,600 --> 00:54:31,280 Speaker 1: a real life if you have a lot of money, 943 00:54:31,560 --> 00:54:34,640 Speaker 1: you can make up for a basic lack of skills. 944 00:54:36,040 --> 00:54:38,200 Speaker 1: As it turns out, you can hire people who have 945 00:54:38,280 --> 00:54:41,719 Speaker 1: skills for you. Uh. And then I wanted to end 946 00:54:42,160 --> 00:54:47,320 Speaker 1: my discussion anyway on a game that launched in UM 947 00:54:48,640 --> 00:54:52,640 Speaker 1: sort of like tail in twenty eleven into into it's 948 00:54:52,680 --> 00:54:56,040 Speaker 1: a little game called Star Wars the Old Republic. Yes, 949 00:54:57,239 --> 00:55:00,480 Speaker 1: we have finally reached the one m m oh rpg 950 00:55:00,920 --> 00:55:04,560 Speaker 1: I actually play, alright, I have not played any other 951 00:55:04,680 --> 00:55:07,400 Speaker 1: m m O rpg. I've seen them developed, I've you know, 952 00:55:07,440 --> 00:55:09,719 Speaker 1: I've played on someone else's account just to get a 953 00:55:09,719 --> 00:55:12,400 Speaker 1: feel for it, but I've never actually got an account myself. 954 00:55:12,440 --> 00:55:14,200 Speaker 1: I mean, I did play a little bit of dn 955 00:55:14,280 --> 00:55:17,120 Speaker 1: D online for about a couple of months. But well, 956 00:55:17,200 --> 00:55:19,520 Speaker 1: you you wrote an article for the site. Yes, and 957 00:55:19,840 --> 00:55:22,719 Speaker 1: as that, I created an account so I could play it, 958 00:55:22,800 --> 00:55:24,960 Speaker 1: so I could get a better understanding of how it worked. 959 00:55:25,360 --> 00:55:28,160 Speaker 1: So Star Wars the Old Republic the reason there are 960 00:55:28,160 --> 00:55:29,600 Speaker 1: a couple of reasons why I wanted to play it. 961 00:55:29,680 --> 00:55:31,640 Speaker 1: One is that my hatred for Star Wars has not 962 00:55:31,719 --> 00:55:35,560 Speaker 1: gotten that out of hand yet. The prequels really did 963 00:55:35,560 --> 00:55:38,000 Speaker 1: a number on me. People still don't get me started, 964 00:55:38,040 --> 00:55:41,520 Speaker 1: please don't. But but I still despite all that, I 965 00:55:41,560 --> 00:55:45,120 Speaker 1: still loved the Star Wars universe, and I really loved 966 00:55:45,120 --> 00:55:47,040 Speaker 1: the Knights of the Old Republic games, which are set 967 00:55:47,160 --> 00:55:51,560 Speaker 1: up almost four thousand years before the original trilogy. Uh. 968 00:55:51,600 --> 00:55:54,319 Speaker 1: Star Wars the Old Republic has set about thirty years 969 00:55:54,360 --> 00:55:58,040 Speaker 1: before the original trilogy, so there are no characters from 970 00:55:58,040 --> 00:56:01,120 Speaker 1: the original trilogy or any of the the Star Wars 971 00:56:01,120 --> 00:56:05,640 Speaker 1: movies that are in the games. The games, You're You're in, 972 00:56:05,680 --> 00:56:11,879 Speaker 1: You're You're encountering, you know, ancestors several generations removed from 973 00:56:11,920 --> 00:56:15,479 Speaker 1: anyone in the the film series. The nice thing about 974 00:56:15,520 --> 00:56:18,319 Speaker 1: that is that you don't have to worry about impacting 975 00:56:18,360 --> 00:56:20,960 Speaker 1: the world so much that the movies could not have 976 00:56:21,080 --> 00:56:24,880 Speaker 1: happened right, because that was one of the problems, is 977 00:56:24,920 --> 00:56:28,360 Speaker 1: that you want this rich world that Lucas created that 978 00:56:28,440 --> 00:56:32,080 Speaker 1: people find so interesting and compelling, but they didn't want 979 00:56:32,120 --> 00:56:34,680 Speaker 1: to create it in such a way that if you 980 00:56:34,719 --> 00:56:38,840 Speaker 1: did one set of actions, you you invalidate what happens 981 00:56:38,840 --> 00:56:41,000 Speaker 1: in the movies, because then you've just invalidated the reason 982 00:56:41,000 --> 00:56:44,200 Speaker 1: why everyone loves it in the first place. So that's 983 00:56:44,200 --> 00:56:48,000 Speaker 1: a tricky balance. Well, by setting it years before the 984 00:56:48,040 --> 00:56:52,040 Speaker 1: events of the films, it kind of take that causation away. 985 00:56:52,719 --> 00:56:55,600 Speaker 1: And Uh, the Nights of the Old Republic games were 986 00:56:56,480 --> 00:56:58,400 Speaker 1: a lot of fun for me, So I wanted to 987 00:56:58,400 --> 00:57:01,000 Speaker 1: play this and I ended up getting account and I 988 00:57:01,000 --> 00:57:04,600 Speaker 1: do play. Uh. The my main character in case you're 989 00:57:04,600 --> 00:57:08,920 Speaker 1: all wondering, is an imperial agent. You can play either 990 00:57:09,160 --> 00:57:11,960 Speaker 1: as the imperial side or the rebel side. It's not 991 00:57:12,040 --> 00:57:16,480 Speaker 1: the same as the movies and on. Depending on which 992 00:57:16,520 --> 00:57:18,600 Speaker 1: side you're you're on, you can play light side or 993 00:57:18,680 --> 00:57:21,800 Speaker 1: dark side, so you could be a light side Imperial 994 00:57:21,840 --> 00:57:26,240 Speaker 1: agent if you wanted to be. I'm not. I played 995 00:57:26,240 --> 00:57:29,240 Speaker 1: the dark side. Yeah. Every time I can't I can, 996 00:57:29,400 --> 00:57:33,240 Speaker 1: I play it, I choose the dark side option. Um. 997 00:57:33,280 --> 00:57:36,200 Speaker 1: And so anyway, it's a really fun game set in 998 00:57:36,200 --> 00:57:39,720 Speaker 1: the Star Wars universe, and I've been having a blast 999 00:57:39,760 --> 00:57:42,000 Speaker 1: with it, and it makes me think that if I 1000 00:57:42,040 --> 00:57:45,120 Speaker 1: had had a broadband connection earlier, I probably would have 1001 00:57:45,120 --> 00:57:48,080 Speaker 1: gotten into M m O RPGs earlier. Now the way 1002 00:57:48,120 --> 00:57:50,000 Speaker 1: I play it, I play it more as a single 1003 00:57:50,000 --> 00:57:52,880 Speaker 1: player kind of experience, and I only occasionally team up 1004 00:57:52,920 --> 00:57:55,240 Speaker 1: with people because I just haven't made that many friends 1005 00:57:55,280 --> 00:57:58,120 Speaker 1: on on Star Wars the Old Republic yet. But who knows, 1006 00:57:58,120 --> 00:58:01,000 Speaker 1: maybe after this podcast goes live, folks will track me 1007 00:58:01,080 --> 00:58:03,320 Speaker 1: down and be like, hey, man, I'll help you out. 1008 00:58:03,960 --> 00:58:07,120 Speaker 1: You're having trouble taking that Mandalorian down, And I will say, yes, 1009 00:58:07,480 --> 00:58:10,400 Speaker 1: yes I am. That guy is tough and he's really 1010 00:58:10,440 --> 00:58:15,360 Speaker 1: irritating me. So yeah, they're They're scads of other games 1011 00:58:15,360 --> 00:58:19,520 Speaker 1: that we haven't mentioned, some very high profile games dozen 1012 00:58:19,800 --> 00:58:24,080 Speaker 1: like Halo games, and yeah, and there are other games 1013 00:58:24,080 --> 00:58:26,320 Speaker 1: that are There are other games that are massively multiplayer. 1014 00:58:26,360 --> 00:58:28,000 Speaker 1: In fact, I'd argue that the Halo games fit in 1015 00:58:28,040 --> 00:58:30,840 Speaker 1: this where there's not role playing involved, but it is 1016 00:58:30,840 --> 00:58:34,040 Speaker 1: a massively multiplayer online game, so you can have a 1017 00:58:34,080 --> 00:58:36,000 Speaker 1: lot of people playing at once even though they're not 1018 00:58:36,040 --> 00:58:39,280 Speaker 1: necessarily role playing. Yeah, it's it's funny because I think 1019 00:58:39,280 --> 00:58:42,880 Speaker 1: in a way, some of them, some of it's fuzzy. 1020 00:58:42,920 --> 00:58:46,000 Speaker 1: To be honest, Um, there are different degrees of the 1021 00:58:46,120 --> 00:58:50,280 Speaker 1: role playing involved. When you're playing you, is that really 1022 00:58:50,280 --> 00:58:54,360 Speaker 1: playing a role Yeah, so so, and again there are 1023 00:58:54,360 --> 00:58:56,200 Speaker 1: people who get into the role playing, and there are 1024 00:58:56,240 --> 00:58:59,920 Speaker 1: people who despise the role playing. And sometimes you'll have 1025 00:59:00,000 --> 00:59:03,280 Speaker 1: of companies create servers just for role players so that 1026 00:59:03,320 --> 00:59:06,600 Speaker 1: the role players can be all, you know. The hardcore 1027 00:59:06,640 --> 00:59:09,520 Speaker 1: gamers might say that's all hippie dippy, So the role 1028 00:59:09,560 --> 00:59:11,800 Speaker 1: players gonna be all hippie dipping on their own servers, 1029 00:59:12,080 --> 00:59:14,040 Speaker 1: and everyone who's just you know, who just wants to 1030 00:59:14,040 --> 00:59:16,720 Speaker 1: play the game can be on their servers. I like 1031 00:59:16,760 --> 00:59:19,040 Speaker 1: a balance between the two. So I'm somewhere in the middle. 1032 00:59:19,320 --> 00:59:22,080 Speaker 1: I don't I don't really identify myself with either group. 1033 00:59:23,280 --> 00:59:26,440 Speaker 1: So anyway, that's kind of a bird's eye view of 1034 00:59:26,480 --> 00:59:28,680 Speaker 1: the history of m m O RPGs. We really have 1035 00:59:29,320 --> 00:59:31,840 Speaker 1: Dungeons and Dragons to thank for it. I'm sure that 1036 00:59:31,920 --> 00:59:34,520 Speaker 1: the games would have would have developed on their own 1037 00:59:34,560 --> 00:59:37,400 Speaker 1: without it, but that was truly an inspiration. And D 1038 00:59:37,480 --> 00:59:40,960 Speaker 1: and D and yeah, and role playing games in general 1039 00:59:41,080 --> 00:59:43,800 Speaker 1: go well beyond just D n D. You can find 1040 00:59:44,640 --> 00:59:46,400 Speaker 1: tons and tons of them. Some of them are out 1041 00:59:46,400 --> 00:59:50,800 Speaker 1: of print now, but there have been games ranging across 1042 00:59:50,840 --> 00:59:55,680 Speaker 1: all genres, from horror to science fiction, mystery, just about 1043 00:59:55,720 --> 00:59:57,959 Speaker 1: everything you could think about there is a role playing 1044 00:59:57,960 --> 01:00:00,960 Speaker 1: game out there that fits it. So guys, if you 1045 01:00:01,040 --> 01:00:03,600 Speaker 1: have any suggestions for topics that we should tackle in 1046 01:00:03,720 --> 01:00:06,560 Speaker 1: future episodes, please let us know. You can say as 1047 01:00:06,560 --> 01:00:09,920 Speaker 1: an email all right, just as tech stuff at Discovery 1048 01:00:10,040 --> 01:00:12,760 Speaker 1: dot com or let us know on Facebook or Twitter 1049 01:00:13,000 --> 01:00:16,520 Speaker 1: are handled, there is tech stuff hs W and Chris 1050 01:00:16,560 --> 01:00:20,520 Speaker 1: and I will game with you again really soon. For 1051 01:00:20,680 --> 01:00:23,200 Speaker 1: more on this and thousands of other topics, visit how 1052 01:00:23,240 --> 01:00:29,840 Speaker 1: staff works dot Com, brought to you by the reinvented 1053 01:00:29,880 --> 01:00:32,600 Speaker 1: two thousand twelve camera. It's ready, are you