Speaker 1: Of the Law and Order franchises, SVU is considered especially watchable.
Speaker 2: We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the
Speaker 2: vicious felonies. These episodes are based on. These are our stories.
Speaker 2: Done done, yay. Hello, Welcome to That's Messed Up And
Speaker 2: As for you podcast. I am Kara Klink and I'm
Speaker 2: Lisa Traeger and every week we talk about an episode
Speaker 2: of SVU, the true crime it's based on, and we
Speaker 2: have an amazing guest from the episode. So that's our show.
Speaker 2: And in the beginning we each a chat. So welcome, Cara.
Speaker 2: What's up? Not much?
Speaker 1: I mean, Lisa, last night you did my show in
Speaker 1: Los Angeles and it was magical. I like, I was
Speaker 1: literally like fangirling over Lisa. I was like, I know,
Speaker 1: I've obviously seen you do stand up a million times,
Speaker 1: but I haven't in a while because of pandemic. And
Speaker 1: I was just like, you were you barely breathe in
Speaker 1: between jokes and people are just laughing, laughing, laughing.
Speaker 2: It was so fucking good. I know, it's not really
Speaker 2: a great quality of mine. I think it's great. I's honest,
Speaker 2: I'm just from the school. It's like, you know, you
Speaker 2: learn the patterns from the people you first look up to,
Speaker 2: and for me, it was like a tell in Nikki
Speaker 2: and so it's like they don't shut up. You just
Speaker 2: keep talking like you never shut up. Yeah, no breaks.
Speaker 2: I don't give them a chance to think if they
Speaker 2: like me or not. I just keep it moving. Wait
Speaker 2: a telling who else? Nicki Glazer? Yeah, she's pretty quick too.
Speaker 2: And then I looked up to Hannibal Burres but obviously
Speaker 2: not his cadence just as we're right, and Tom Sigora
Speaker 2: on how to treat people. But yeah, those are my
Speaker 2: four people that I feel like I learned the most
Speaker 2: lessons from as a young comedian. Interesting, I didn't know
Speaker 2: that about you and Nikki. Yeah, we did a show
Speaker 2: in a Mexican rest staurant in Springfield, Missouri, and I
Speaker 2: Megan was. I just thought she was the coolest person
Speaker 2: in the whole fucking world. And she came and hang out,
Speaker 2: hung out with us and gave us all the tidbits.
Speaker 2: And then I opened for her on New Year's and
Speaker 2: I thought she was a queen and she just like
Speaker 2: was really. She got me a gig to open for
Speaker 2: Amy Schumer in a big theater once like she was
Speaker 2: very nice to me as a young comedian.
Speaker 1: That's so funny because I just met Nikki like in
Speaker 1: New York and always just like felt like first I know,
Speaker 1: she was way like ahead of me when I met her,
Speaker 1: but I've always just felt like we were peers, even
Speaker 1: though she is much more successful than I am.
Speaker 2: Well when you're all. But then when we visited New York,
Speaker 2: she was at the same open mic as us. I mean,
Speaker 2: that's the greatest thing about comedy.
Speaker 1: Yeh.
Speaker 2: Like I remember I was a few months in and
Speaker 2: I went to see Hannibal at Zany's, paid to see him,
Speaker 2: and then I went to an open mic and he
Speaker 2: was there. Yeah. That's when I was like, okay, so
Speaker 2: this is okay. You perform at paid headlining gigs and
Speaker 2: then you have to keep like I learned very young,
Speaker 2: like okay, five spots a night. Okay, great, You're not
Speaker 2: good for any room. Like Hannibal had that lure like
Speaker 2: Thanksgiving he performed in someone's laundry room, but knows how
Speaker 2: to have fun.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: I was at a jay Z Kanye concert and I
Speaker 2: ran into him and he had a great seat, So
Speaker 2: it's like.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you gotta do that. No, that's really funny that
Speaker 1: you say that, because a guy literally came out to
Speaker 1: me after the show last night and I was, you know,
Speaker 1: a couple of wines in and he was like he
Speaker 1: was like this long haired he looked. He reminded me
Speaker 1: of like Spacoli from Fast Times at Ridgemont High.
Speaker 2: He was like, so like, how do I do this?
Speaker 1: And I was like, do what, like get on the
Speaker 1: show and he was like, I was like, just send
Speaker 1: me a clip. He's like no, but I mean like
Speaker 1: before that, like how do I get the clip? And
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, you want to know how to
Speaker 1: do stand up comedy?
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: I was like, here's what you do. You just got
Speaker 1: to start hitting open mics. I told him about Comedy Bureau.
Speaker 1: I was like, here's how you start. But like you're
Speaker 1: not going to be on the show for a few years,
Speaker 1: but I know you can do it.
Speaker 2: Just start like doing this, you know.
Speaker 1: But it's just it is funny how you kind of learned, like,
Speaker 1: oh wait, this one is like I know so many
Speaker 1: people that were like yeah, I did my cone and
Speaker 1: set and the next day I was serving salsa. Like
Speaker 1: you don't just like blow up from being on TV.
Speaker 1: One time, like, and that's not even like the main
Speaker 1: you know, no.
Speaker 2: And even that's why Hacks was so good when she's like,
Speaker 2: even if you're fucking great, that's not enough. Even if
Speaker 2: you're the best, you keep have to fucking clawing and
Speaker 2: clawing and coming up with new hours and new material.
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, never ends. But the greatest person I
Speaker 2: met last night was you in high school. Another friend
Speaker 2: of yours from high school was there and you two
Speaker 2: were what is it salutations? What is the thing? I know?
Speaker 1: Are superlatives from high school? Superlatives? We were biggest gossip.
Speaker 2: I met the two biggest gossips from fucking Connecticut high school.
Speaker 2: I don't know the name of my high school. High
Speaker 2: school to me, the biggest well because he stood there
Speaker 2: for a while and I was like, I don't know
Speaker 2: who you are, I'm ignoring you. And then once I
Speaker 2: found out, I was like, walk me to my car,
Speaker 2: like I couldn't get enough.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Jed is the best and he listens to the pod,
Speaker 1: so I'm really happy you guys got to meet.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, he was awesome and he loved That's why,
Speaker 2: like these intros are becoming hard for me. I'm just
Speaker 2: rewatching drag Race over and over and ready for conn
Speaker 2: Oh Today's thirsty. Yes, okay, sorry, I got that a
Speaker 2: new drag race. But yeah, he was really a fun time.
Speaker 2: The show was packed. I mean it was like one
Speaker 2: hundred and fifty people in an alley. I saw an
Speaker 2: overweight pug. That was a blessing.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, Candy Lawrence has the pug of the century.
Speaker 2: Also a very funny comedian.
Speaker 1: If you guys are interested in, uh yes, checking her out.
Speaker 2: She's really great. But I love her and I love
Speaker 2: her pug. His name's Buster Well, because it's also weird
Speaker 2: when you see someone on the internet for years, like
Speaker 2: you've been just I've been looking at this dog for months, right,
Speaker 2: months and months. Suddenly he's there and he's like meeting
Speaker 2: a celebrity. Yeah, he's like a ho ho. His body
Speaker 2: shape is a ho ho. And we have bigger you know.
Speaker 2: The show is obviously a huge success and it was
Speaker 2: a great time and I can't wait to keep going back.
Speaker 2: And your producer she brought snacks a cooler of Oh
Speaker 2: my god, thank god.
Speaker 1: I had no dinner and I eat all I drank
Speaker 1: all this wine and I was like, I need to
Speaker 1: eat something, and she had all these fucking snacks because
Speaker 1: she works on TV sets and she just craft serviced
Speaker 1: it up for us.
Speaker 2: I mean watching her put away the chair and the lights,
Speaker 2: I was like, what she why are you doing this?
Speaker 1: She's like an incredible workhorse, and she just like loves
Speaker 1: comedy and like loves doing the show and she's like
Speaker 1: the best producer I could have ever had a comedy show.
Speaker 2: Yes, that is she is incredible. I'm glad you guys
Speaker 2: have each other.
Speaker 1: Shout out to Shannon Cloud if anyone knows her.
Speaker 2: But outside of the show, we got a DM that yes,
Speaker 2: it's huge.
Speaker 1: A couple of weeks ago, I don't know if you
Speaker 1: guys saw on our stories, we shared a story of
Speaker 1: a listener was like, this is my good friend's dad.
Speaker 2: He went hiking on this mountain.
Speaker 1: I think it was in Utah and Nevad, I don't
Speaker 1: actually remember, and he's gone missing, like they can't find him,
Speaker 1: And they did find him.
Speaker 2: She ended up writing me.
Speaker 1: Back and said we shared it on our stories and
Speaker 1: then she wrote me and said we found him, and
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh my god, I'm so happy.
Speaker 2: And then today he messaged us and said thank you.
Speaker 1: So much for sharing. That means so much. If you
Speaker 1: ever need anything for me, just ask. It was so sweet.
Speaker 1: I feel like I'm part of a beautiful humanitarian story
Speaker 1: and all I did was share a story on our Instagram.
Speaker 2: I'm glad he was found. Yeah, no one wants to
Speaker 2: get lost hiking. Well, I feel like.
Speaker 1: Those stories usually don't end up great. You know, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I feel like there's usually a cravass involved.
Speaker 2: What's a crevass? You know, it's like a crevis. There
Speaker 2: was a.
Speaker 1: SNL sketch called Unfrozen cave Man Lawyer and he always
Speaker 1: says I fell into a crevass. Sorry, it's like, oh
Speaker 1: this guy anyway, Like, I feel like there's always some
Speaker 1: like there's always like you fell into some small spot
Speaker 1: where no one could find you and then you die.
Speaker 1: But let's get started because we have a super great
Speaker 1: episode today and it's jam packed and we should just
Speaker 1: jump right in.
Speaker 2: Okay, So let's get into the episode. Intimidation Game, Season sixteen,
Speaker 2: episode fourteen. It opens up on Benson with her therapist.
Speaker 2: I guess Kara was telling me there's some mixed emotions
Speaker 2: about this guy. I could care less.
Speaker 1: People have asked us what our feelings are we don't
Speaker 1: really have any.
Speaker 2: I don't I could. He could die in a fire
Speaker 2: or live forever and become syndicated. I don't care. I
Speaker 2: just he's just.
Speaker 1: An off show with the Therapist. You're not watching it,
Speaker 1: I mean maybe.
Speaker 2: I mean, if I'm not watching organized crime, I don't
Speaker 2: think the therapist show is going to get me. I would
Speaker 2: watch that Uzu Adubo in treatment, I would maybe watch that.
Speaker 2: So she's wearing a collared professor, sexy chic look with
Speaker 2: a tons of layers. We've learned the costume department just
Speaker 2: really loves layers. And then Benson's basically like, oh my god,
Speaker 2: lack of sleep and worrying about Noah and juggling my
Speaker 2: own schedule, and then it's like dun, dunt done, It's
Speaker 2: been amazing. So she loves it. She loves not sleeping
Speaker 2: and being stressed out. But she's scared that, like you know,
Speaker 2: the DNA with Noah's dad, Like could it affect Noah
Speaker 2: because he's breaking tea pots and breaking shit and roughhousing
Speaker 2: and you know what if he grows up being a
Speaker 2: rapist as well? But it's like, you're not a rapist,
Speaker 2: like I don't. Why would you be scared when your
Speaker 2: dad's a rapist? Yeah, yeah, I understand the fear. Whatever,
Speaker 2: but like it's also like you're an example of it
Speaker 2: not affecting your character in a negative way, so whatever.
Speaker 2: But yeah, you're not a criminal. Your kid's not a criminal.
Speaker 2: He's just an annoying kid. Get over it. So show,
Speaker 2: and then it cuts to the detectives on a day off.
Speaker 2: They're hanging out casual I SE's in a hoodie, he's
Speaker 2: playing video games, Rollin's and Creasy's there and it's a
Speaker 2: giant like video game convention, and I was thinking this,
Speaker 2: this is like a giant budget, Like that's hundreds of extras, TVs,
Speaker 2: video Like, was this at Javits Center? What the fuck?
Speaker 1: Like, yeah, unless it was a New York comic con
Speaker 1: and they just shot there, which also sounds like it
Speaker 1: would be a nightmare. Then I think that, yeah, you're right,
Speaker 1: it is like an extravagant and set up for the.
Speaker 2: Show, very expensive. And then Careese is like, this is awesome.
Speaker 2: This is better than comicn So okay. But Finn uses
Speaker 2: a lot of video game lingos, so we learn that
Speaker 2: he loves video games, and we know that he loves
Speaker 2: them in real life as well, and Rollins is like
Speaker 2: just a girl and she's like, I don't get it,
Speaker 2: which is rare because she loves MMA and football and gamble.
Speaker 2: You'd think that she'd.
Speaker 1: Be like, oh, yeah, I have a high score in
Speaker 1: fucking Halo or something.
Speaker 2: I was wondering which game you would mention. I was like,
Speaker 2: I wonder what Kara's gonna say. My brain was working overtime,
Speaker 2: I felt it. So they panned to young women talking
Speaker 2: with lanyards around their necks. They have credentials, and they're
Speaker 2: in a booth and then these like trash scumboys come
Speaker 2: in and lean into the booth and they're like, go home.
Speaker 2: Girls don't belong in gaming, get out of here. And
Speaker 2: the girls like super sassy and she looks cool and
Speaker 2: fun and she has a lot of comebacks. And they
Speaker 2: say that her boss, Raina Punjabi, was only able to
Speaker 2: make her feminazi game because she's a slut. And for me,
Speaker 2: this might not be everyone's perspective obviously, but like, if
Speaker 2: you fuck your way to the top, I still respect you.
Speaker 2: Like it's not easy, right, I mean, however you want.
Speaker 1: People are faking it till they make it in a
Speaker 1: lot of different ways out there, you know, Yeah, like
Speaker 1: sex should be any different. I think if you're in
Speaker 1: a power position, you cannot demand sex for business things.
Speaker 2: But if you're just if you're a slut on the go,
Speaker 2: I think you can fuck your way to the top.
Speaker 2: I'm okay with that. No, And I like this girl.
Speaker 1: I think this actress is like funny, like like I
Speaker 1: don't know, I don't think that the like the people
Speaker 1: that do sort of guest stars on the show are
Speaker 1: always like super fun Like I don't know, she's really
Speaker 1: funny when.
Speaker 2: She's like, oh, do you want to kiss me? Oh?
Speaker 2: Is that it? Like? I just think she's got a
Speaker 2: good top comic timing. Oh yeah, she is great the
Speaker 2: whole gam or gay everything. I mean, you're gonna lead
Speaker 2: us into this, so I'm grateful, but it makes no
Speaker 2: sense to me. I can't imagine in a million years,
Speaker 2: like not being like, Okay, I'll play my game when
Speaker 2: you play your game. I just can't imagine being so
Speaker 2: upset that something's not for you, like when there's hundreds
Speaker 2: of other games to choose from. But you know, we
Speaker 2: all have hill to die on. Some people are like
Speaker 2: for religious freedoms or like abortions for all. Then some
Speaker 2: people are like, women shouldn't play video games, and that's
Speaker 2: the biggest moment in their lives. It is a wild
Speaker 2: hill to climb to the top of and then die of. Well,
Speaker 2: it's also proof that your life's pretty chill if the
Speaker 2: worst thing that happens to you is like a female Ghostbusters,
Speaker 2: you know, or anything like. This is just so confusing
Speaker 2: to me. But yeah, so they have a little scuffle,
Speaker 2: the boys go away because she rebally slay them. And
Speaker 2: so then we see a friend, Leslie from Glasgow man.
Speaker 2: He's the babysitter guy who dresses the graphic novelists. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and so he's wearing a bow tie and a dumb hat,
Speaker 2: but not a douchhat, like it's a nerd hat. It's
Speaker 2: wild how they are able to balance what the hats
Speaker 2: portray when they are so annoying. I hate all these
Speaker 2: hats in public if I see them. But I can't
Speaker 2: believe he's back, And I'm curious, like, did they love
Speaker 2: him so they wrote him in? But this is the
Speaker 2: same season, I think, So it's like, was this already
Speaker 2: this was this pre planned reoccurring or were they like,
Speaker 2: we got to get Leslie back here, but I love him,
Speaker 2: and so basically he says the trail created a lot
Speaker 2: of buzz. So they have a new video game that
Speaker 2: is based on Glasgow Man, and he said that the
Speaker 2: developers are going to make it either way, so might
Speaker 2: as well make some cash. But the cops are kind
Speaker 2: of like but hurt about it, and Rollin's in a
Speaker 2: perfect messy Bun is skeptical about virtual reality. She's just
Speaker 2: confused by everything. She's like, why am I here? So
Speaker 2: then they are like panning to a public restroom and
Speaker 2: I get the sense that something not good's about to happen,
Speaker 2: but nobody can hear anything because it's so noisy on
Speaker 2: the convention floor. And so the young woman from that
Speaker 2: works for Reina Punjabi that was like in that scuffle,
Speaker 2: she's getting attacked. So she's attacked by the two dudes
Speaker 2: that said women shouldn't play games, and she's yelling stops up, stop,
Speaker 2: and they're violently attacking her and she's fighting so hard,
Speaker 2: but everyone's just going wild watching video games on a
Speaker 2: big screen, so no one is helping her. And then
Speaker 2: Leslie runs to them and goes something bad is happening
Speaker 2: to in the bathroom, and Finn and Creasy don't care
Speaker 2: which is it? You are police like it is so wild.
Speaker 2: So then Amanda is like, Okay, I guess I'll go. Well.
Speaker 1: I feel like they maybe it's like playing Devil's Advocate
Speaker 1: for them right now. I feel like it's like someone's
Speaker 1: like there's a girl in trouble in the bathroom, like, oh,
Speaker 1: she needs a tampon? Is that what these guys think
Speaker 1: is happening? Like that he came running up to you
Speaker 1: to tell you about a period emergency.
Speaker 2: But yeah, but Leslie would never do that. Leslie can
Speaker 2: talk to someone else about Leslie. Leslie wouldn't have or
Speaker 2: do that. I one time was eating fuh in Cleveland,
Speaker 2: but I had just gone off a plane bleeding through
Speaker 2: my tampon, and I asked the server, I go, can
Speaker 2: you see if there's any women you work with that
Speaker 2: have a tampon for me? He couldn't handle it. He
Speaker 2: got so shy, he was so uncomfortable. And then the
Speaker 2: woman like she came over and gave me tampons in
Speaker 2: a little makeup bag and like snuck it around and
Speaker 2: it just like really, uh threw a loop for these
Speaker 2: in these young people's minds, like they couldn't. I'm like, listen,
Speaker 2: I'm bleeding and I need this. Yeah, they got so uncomfortable.
Speaker 1: Love it, Lisa Trigger just fucking removing the stigmatization of
Speaker 1: menstrual issues, one fuz server.
Speaker 2: At a time. Yeah. I might have even said this
Speaker 2: before in another show, but yeah, that is a passion
Speaker 2: of mine. I like to talk about bleeding through things
Speaker 2: as often as possible, and if you see me do comedy,
Speaker 2: it's a theme that runs through myset. It is wild
Speaker 2: that we're supposed to like not talk about bleeding from
Speaker 2: our pussy's constantly.
Speaker 1: No, and we're supposed to like palm our tampon so
Speaker 1: nobody sees them, and like everything has to be so
Speaker 1: quiet about having a period.
Speaker 2: And it's like, yeah, Wolf had a funny joke about it.
Speaker 2: She's like, the only technology with tampon's is they make
Speaker 2: them smaller, because you know, we've just been so like
Speaker 2: loud with taking our trombones to the bathroom with us,
Speaker 2: and she does this like trombone act out whatever. I
Speaker 2: think I just butchered her joke, but I haven't seen
Speaker 2: her in years. Okay, so Rollin's you know, she gets it,
Speaker 2: so she's you know, going over there, and so she's
Speaker 2: helping our girl and then ra the girl says, yeah,
Speaker 2: they leveled up. So she's doing video game lingo to
Speaker 2: describe this attack and she's bleeding and it's not good.
Speaker 2: And it's the credits. Okay, they make us sad, and
Speaker 2: then they go to the song. And so then we
Speaker 2: come back to a busy Benson office. Everyone's getting the scoop,
Speaker 2: Gevin the scoop. We find out our favorite girl's name
Speaker 2: is Sarah Keller. She is twenty two and she works
Speaker 2: for Rena, who's a game developer. And then Rollins calls
Speaker 2: the convention march madness for gaming. So I'm glad.
Speaker 1: It's like that's like a metaphor that only that doesn't
Speaker 1: help anybody that doesn't know sports or male things.
Speaker 2: No, because I think video game dorks might not know
Speaker 2: about sports, and I don't know if sports know about
Speaker 2: video But she's explaining it to Benson.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, Like I guess Benson probably knows what march
Speaker 1: madness is, of course, but like it's just funny.
Speaker 2: I think to be like, what did you want her
Speaker 2: to say? Saie?
Speaker 1: At Barney's we know Benson loves a brand. That's a
Speaker 1: good one, thank you.
Speaker 2: So she explains to Benson, who is confused, as she
Speaker 2: rightfully should be, that men are mad that women are
Speaker 2: in gaming, and Finn says that guys think that game
Speaker 2: developers are gods and they're not ready for women to
Speaker 2: be god. Okay, So Benson and Finn go in to
Speaker 2: talk to Sarah and she describes them her attackers as
Speaker 2: fi al and Finn explains it means failures at life,
Speaker 2: which I kind of love. And then she describes them
Speaker 2: as young, white, pale and skinny, and Finn is like,
Speaker 2: that's eighty percent of the crowd, girl, And we get
Speaker 2: the scoop here. They touched her breasts, they pushed her down,
Speaker 2: and then she fought them off. So I think she
Speaker 2: got like it was violent and she got attacked, but
Speaker 2: I don't think there was like a you know, a
Speaker 2: full full attack. I don't know how to describe this.
Speaker 2: And so we learn about this thing called cobs Kobs,
Speaker 2: which is killer be slaughtered, and they're a type of
Speaker 2: video game person and they don't like that her boss
Speaker 2: is making a game that's not the game that they like.
Speaker 2: It's just like I don't know. If you don't want
Speaker 2: a big Mac, you can get the quarter pounder. I
Speaker 2: don't understand this. Go to Del Taco.
Speaker 1: If you don't even like burgers, go to a totally
Speaker 1: different restaurant.
Speaker 2: It is wild. So yeah, so Cobbs is like first
Speaker 2: person shooter games and they hate games that are non violent,
Speaker 2: and then she goes and they're stupid. I don't know whatever.
Speaker 2: I hate how dismissed if I am of all this,
Speaker 2: but I am so the game long. I do love.
Speaker 2: I do love Mario. I love Super Mario three. I
Speaker 2: love that definitely not a Cobs. I mean that's not
Speaker 2: a Mario is not murdering anyone except for Chupa Choops
Speaker 2: or whatever. What are they called Koopa Troopers whatever. I
Speaker 2: don't know, but this is my thing. I love the
Speaker 2: little ghosts and I would get a ghost tattoo, but
Speaker 2: I don't want people like this coming up to me
Speaker 2: and being like, how well do you know Mario? And
Speaker 2: it's like I don't. I just like trademarked items on
Speaker 2: my arm, but I really want the Mario ghost tat
Speaker 2: But like I said, I'm just scared of people being like,
Speaker 2: are you Mario enough I also love when Mario wore
Speaker 2: a little raccoon suit in World seven. Oh yeah, when
Speaker 2: he flies the raccoon tail. I love that. That's Mario three.
Speaker 2: I think no, in World set that's like that tale
Speaker 2: with the feather. But then in World seven there's another
Speaker 2: outfit that he wears that's a full on, like brown,
Speaker 2: little raccoon outfit that is at the feather.
Speaker 1: That's more than I know, Liza, I like, I fell
Speaker 1: off after I fell off around Yoshi or something.
Speaker 2: Okay, So we find out that this game launches Tuesday,
Speaker 2: and so the people are getting crazy online and Rollins
Speaker 2: is having a hard time going over the footage because
Speaker 2: it looks she makes a joke that is so bad
Speaker 2: and she said it's like George Costanza. She says, it's
Speaker 2: like looking for a geek in a geek stack. And
Speaker 2: I wonder if this is a Seinfeld callback about the
Speaker 2: Jerk Store or not, but that's what it sounded like.
Speaker 2: So Finn says there's more to this story. That all
Speaker 2: of these nerds are all so mad because they think
Speaker 2: Raina slept her way into the business and she's engaged
Speaker 2: to a venture capitalist named Stephen Kaplan, so they don't
Speaker 2: like that. She like, is with a guy for money
Speaker 2: and he backed this game, and Rollins with a statement
Speaker 2: I enjoy says just because her fiance has money, that
Speaker 2: means she doesn't have talent, and Finn's like, I didn't
Speaker 2: say that. I you know, I'm on her side. So
Speaker 2: Benson asked the question if this is about Raina, like
Speaker 2: why are we attacking Sarah Dundum? So they head off
Speaker 2: to the Amazonian studios to talk to Raina. And that's
Speaker 2: what the game is called. And Raina is walking, she's talking,
Speaker 2: she's with Finn and Rollins, and she's wearing a Steve
Speaker 2: Jobs style black turtleneck vibes but like fun hoops. So
Speaker 2: she's business but loves successories. And she's just like, I
Speaker 2: don't get why they're mad at the game. It's choose
Speaker 2: your own adventure. You can choose war or piece, matriarchy
Speaker 2: or patriarchy, environmental or industrial like chill like you could
Speaker 2: even in the game. They hate you can be violent,
Speaker 2: like it is so annoying. They don't even like that
Speaker 2: there's an option where you can just like plant corn
Speaker 2: and chill out. So they ask if she's had any
Speaker 2: threatening or fucked up messages or comments online, which is
Speaker 2: the dumbest question I've ever seen on this show. She's
Speaker 2: a woman that's trying to do anything, so yes, there
Speaker 2: are mean things said to her on the internet for
Speaker 2: no reason. She's like, I'm too busy to be pressed,
Speaker 2: you know, and like in the words of RuPaul, She's
Speaker 2: just like, what other people think about me is none
Speaker 2: of my business. So they launch in two days. Have
Speaker 2: said this before, and they're going to say this eight
Speaker 2: hundred more times. This launch on Tuesday is like, this
Speaker 2: is if you want to play a drinking game and
Speaker 2: you haven't watched the episode yet. Every time they mentioned
Speaker 2: that the game launches Tuesday, take a shot. You will
Speaker 2: be passed out pretty quickly. So Steven, the fiance, walks
Speaker 2: up and he explains that they gave Sarah the week off,
Speaker 2: but she wanted to come to work because it's such
Speaker 2: an important time, and Steven tells him that he will
Speaker 2: give them all the security tech info wel Raina works
Speaker 2: on her career changing launch. So he's a great supportive guy,
Speaker 2: and I think they really do like each other and
Speaker 2: she's not using him for money, but hey, so then
Speaker 2: Benson still does not understand video games, and Careese is like,
Speaker 2: don't tell Finn that. Why would finncare I just don't
Speaker 2: get why fincares of Benson likes video games or not.
Speaker 2: But anyways, so then he says, we Leslie has scoop
Speaker 2: for us, and that's the bow tie babysitter guy. So
Speaker 2: Caries has a weird, geled back look. It's like really
Speaker 2: grease ball and I don't like it. So Leslie comes
Speaker 2: down to help, and basically his scoop is he's on
Speaker 2: the message boards. He's on all these video game things
Speaker 2: and he he caught some people talking about the attack,
Speaker 2: and these guys are like bragging on this reddit forum
Speaker 2: about attacking her, and so they're like, Leslie, go trick
Speaker 2: them and say you want more information, and he's like
Speaker 2: no way, and then they threaten him. He's like, okay,
Speaker 2: I'll do it. So he starts typing to them and
Speaker 2: really like being like, yeah, that girl was such a bitch,
Speaker 2: I dox this other girl. Like give me more scoop.
Speaker 2: Let's meet up. So then Careese undercover in a trucker
Speaker 2: hat and Converse is acting like a programmer and is
Speaker 2: with Leslie and they're meeting the attackers outside to get
Speaker 2: the details of the crime and like her tits and
Speaker 2: this is my who is going out of their way
Speaker 2: to gossip. It's like the I mean, I like to gossip,
Speaker 2: but this is so let's meet up in person to
Speaker 2: talk shit is so weird. It makes no sense because
Speaker 2: it's also not a long composed so basically, like you know,
Speaker 2: the guys, they chat, they give details, but the conversation
Speaker 2: is less than thirty seconds, and then the guys are like, Okay,
Speaker 2: we good, Like, yeah, just wanted to hear about how
Speaker 2: you touch that girls tits? We good? Is that why
Speaker 2: I just said? It's like you took a train or
Speaker 2: an uber, you walked miles in New York and like,
Speaker 2: I don't understand this. But then Careesi, of course, has
Speaker 2: a fun little reveal. He's like, hey, I'm the police.
Speaker 2: One tries to run away, but we know Finn is
Speaker 2: there to grab him and say something sassy, and so
Speaker 2: he says wrong move player, nice try no reset button
Speaker 2: in the real world. And I feel like Finn has
Speaker 2: the most scenes like this where he's just around the
Speaker 2: corner ready to snap someone, Like he's always there to
Speaker 2: punch someone. I just feel like he's always the backup
Speaker 2: that's there d to like hit somebody, Okay, So then
Speaker 2: they go back to the precinct and it's the quickest
Speaker 2: lineup ever in the franchise history. I would say, like
Speaker 2: Sarah's just like that guy. That guy got him fuck that,
Speaker 2: Like she just knows who they are, and she calls
Speaker 2: one of them that slope Brow, son of a bitch
Speaker 2: number two. So that was fun as well. But I
Speaker 2: think slope Brow is like rude, but they attacked her,
Speaker 2: so she could be as rude as she wants to be.
Speaker 2: I think it's like I'm playing somebody.
Speaker 1: Somebody has like kind of near underthal features, right, yes, yeah, rude, Yeah,
Speaker 1: Oh for sure.
Speaker 2: It's a read. It is a read. So then she
Speaker 2: says she wants to keep things quiet and not make
Speaker 2: a huge deal about it. Dunt dunt on. Obviously there's
Speaker 2: memes already, so the restco public, the memes are out
Speaker 2: and the guys are being treated like heroes, so everyone
Speaker 2: is just like, you know, this isn't fair. And then
Speaker 2: this masked man makes a video that says, do not
Speaker 2: go where you're not wanted, bitches. Those guys are sacrificial lambs,
Speaker 2: and there's gonna be payback. Sarah, You're a slut. Everyone's
Speaker 2: a slut. Everyone's a slut. Okay, we get it. But
Speaker 2: the squad can't do anything with these threats because it's
Speaker 2: just a video on the internet. And then my favorite,
Speaker 2: I love when they eat. I love when there's a
Speaker 2: lunch break Rollins has an egg roll in her hand,
Speaker 2: and of course she doesn't understand video games. Again, it's like,
Speaker 2: I don't know you gamble. He plays video games. At
Speaker 2: least he has his problems under control, bitch. Okay, So
Speaker 2: she just doesn't understand how he goes from work to
Speaker 2: like shooting guns on a screen. And he explains, well,
Speaker 2: there's no rules, there's no one pp, there's no barber,
Speaker 2: there's no one telling him what to do, there's no
Speaker 2: gray area. I get to just shoot people. And so
Speaker 2: I like that he's not you know that he's doing
Speaker 2: that and not just shooting people in his job. Finn
Speaker 2: is like on a live stream on his phone and
Speaker 2: it's a video of Raina doing an interview and a
Speaker 2: white girl boss outfit, not like a white girl boss,
Speaker 2: but like a white outfit that is a girl boss outfit,
Speaker 2: not a white power suit, a white power suit.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and I actually really related to the scene and
Speaker 4: the guy is like baiting her and she says, hey, like,
Speaker 4: I'm here to promote my game and you keep roping
Speaker 4: me into a feminist debate.
Speaker 2: And I feel like this happens to me when I do podcasts.
Speaker 2: We're like, guys will just try to argue with me
Speaker 2: about something, and I'm like, this isn't fair. I'm obviously
Speaker 2: going to argue. I'm passionate about these issues, but everyone
Speaker 2: else gets to come on and just shoot the shit
Speaker 2: and be funny with you, and I have to like
Speaker 2: debate my like humanity and it really sucks. I go
Speaker 2: on so many guy comedy podcasts and I always they
Speaker 2: always try to like loop me into something and then
Speaker 2: I speak my mind and then I get death threats
Speaker 2: for like weeks and I so I really relate it
Speaker 2: to this where it's like, just because I have these
Speaker 2: points of view doesn't mean you have to bring it
Speaker 2: up all the time. When we're on a fucking funny
Speaker 2: show and now I have to explain to you what
Speaker 2: rape is. It's like so annoying. Yeah. So, mid stream
Speaker 2: of Raina's interview, though, the place gets raided by police.
Speaker 2: They throw her to the ground, point guns at her,
Speaker 2: and then the cops see the stream and they're like
Speaker 2: what And then I think this is where they would
Speaker 2: cut to commercial. Kara, you watched this with your Hulu
Speaker 2: with ads, so you can maybe confirm or deny that, yeah,
Speaker 2: I think that, yeah, there's her getting swatted.
Speaker 1: Is that's when you go out on commercial brand, That's
Speaker 1: when I have to watch forty five minutes of bad ads.
Speaker 2: So we're at the scene of the crime. And if
Speaker 2: you watch this live, this must have been so stressful
Speaker 2: to be like, what happened? What happened? But Finn explains
Speaker 2: that three separate numbers called nine to one one to
Speaker 2: report a hostage situation and this is like a hoax,
Speaker 2: and the cops played into the hoax, and he's mad
Speaker 2: at the cops. But I don't I mean, if everyone
Speaker 2: I don't know, I don't know, I don't know who's
Speaker 2: saw it. I'm on. But Rollins is in a trench
Speaker 2: coat that looks so fucking expensive, like it looks so
Speaker 2: fucking good on her, and Raina is of course disheveled
Speaker 2: and pissed because she was attacked in her own home
Speaker 2: with swat teams and guns. Okay. She says, they're trying
Speaker 2: to humiliate me, and it worked. They just swatted me
Speaker 2: in the middle of an interview. She's like, it's over,
Speaker 2: and Stephen goes, it's not over, Like they keep sending
Speaker 2: you threatening messages and they want to see you on
Speaker 2: your knees. She goes, I was on my knees, Like
Speaker 2: what do you want. He's like, the Reddit sub brand,
Speaker 2: sub red red Chance, the red Chance. I don't know.
Speaker 2: Everyone is like, they're like, it's not just online harassment.
Speaker 2: She's like, I'm used to it. I'm used to it.
Speaker 2: I don't care, And so Raina says, it's not a
Speaker 2: big deal. I don't understand. It's like, of course it's
Speaker 2: a big deal. They knew your address and they swatted you. Like,
Speaker 2: I don't know how she's so relaxed about this. She's like,
Speaker 2: I'll change my passwords and move to a new apartment.
Speaker 2: What's the big deal.
Speaker 1: I think she's trying to like play, I don't know, tough,
Speaker 1: tough guy. You know, I did watch this episode with
Speaker 1: my mother and had to explain dosing and swatting to her.
Speaker 1: That was tedious and not as fun as it sounds.
Speaker 2: Well, I've this whole episode. I feel like Benson Rawlins
Speaker 2: and your mom are right on the same page. Fully
Speaker 2: so Steven, the loving fiance he is, is just trying
Speaker 2: to plead with her, like please, can you not die?
Speaker 2: And she goes, I only care about the launch. So
Speaker 2: the nerds do say if the launch goes tomorrow, that
Speaker 2: her raped and mutilated body will be on the front
Speaker 2: page of every feminist blog. And it's like, just.
Speaker 1: What, Jezebel is not going to put a picture of
Speaker 1: a raped and mutilated body on any article, let alone
Speaker 1: the front page.
Speaker 2: Oh they would, They run on clicks the photo. Yes,
Speaker 2: it's all about the clicks, Kara, I don't think people
Speaker 2: have morals anymore. Okay, So then the masked guy that
Speaker 2: keeps showing up and he says the game is derivative.
Speaker 2: Who cares it's bad? Who cares she used sex to
Speaker 2: get where she is? Who cares? They must leave gaming
Speaker 2: or we will make them. It's just I do not
Speaker 2: understand the psyche of these people on any level at all.
Speaker 2: They're the same people that like write into advertisers to
Speaker 2: cancel shows that say like you know, or the people
Speaker 2: that are like women aren't funny, you know?
Speaker 1: Like women shouldn't be in comedy, you know, like it's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: feel free to not attend a female comedy show.
Speaker 2: Feel free. They're also not as violent. I don't I
Speaker 2: don't know about any comedy thing that's as crazy as
Speaker 2: gamer games. Oh no, no, no, they're definitely not as violent.
Speaker 1: I think that that's just because most of this happens
Speaker 1: behind screens. So the violence you can just get away
Speaker 1: with saying whatever the fuck you want.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So they're all begging her to reconsider and like
Speaker 2: just postpone the event, and she goes, no, it's happening,
Speaker 2: and they're like, can we maybe do it, like tape
Speaker 2: it and stream it later. She goes no, that means
Speaker 2: they'll win. It needs to be live. I'd rather be
Speaker 2: a bitch than a coward. And then he's just like okay,
Speaker 2: but can you just maybe get She goes, no, no cops,
Speaker 2: no dogs. I don't want any police presence. And it's
Speaker 2: like you are making it really hard to be on
Speaker 2: your side, Like I don't understand, Like won't you won't
Speaker 2: tape it, you won't have cops there, you won't take
Speaker 2: any precautions at all. I do know a comic we
Speaker 2: both know her, but she got so many bomb threat
Speaker 2: that she had to pay for her own security at
Speaker 2: every single show she did, and have her own bomb
Speaker 2: sniffing dogs and they came out of her paycheck because
Speaker 2: Republicans have problems. Again, it's like, it's just not about you.
Speaker 2: So after this like back and forth, back and forth,
Speaker 2: she says, listen, I appreciate you have a job to do.
Speaker 2: I came down. I'm cooperating. You've officially warned me, and
Speaker 2: I accept all liability, but I do not want a
Speaker 2: visible police presence. And that's that. And so okay, and
Speaker 2: so Benson and I have the same point of view
Speaker 2: where we're like, well, okay, it's not fully about you.
Speaker 2: There's people at this launch, Like we have to protect
Speaker 2: all these other people that are coming. Like if you
Speaker 2: if you want to take a responsibility for yourself, that's fine,
Speaker 2: but we need to help. And also everyone likes dogs,
Speaker 2: Like what's bad about having a bomb sniffing dog. No
Speaker 2: one has seen a dog and been upset. Carreese straight
Speaker 2: up offers to pull favors to get the event shut
Speaker 2: down for violations. And it's like your jail hair is showing,
Speaker 2: you know, Like we don't need you playing little games.
Speaker 2: Please follow the laws. You are a police officer. And
Speaker 2: then Rollins is on the side of Rayna and says,
Speaker 2: but then the cyber bullies win, so no, we have
Speaker 2: to like let her do it. Benson says, Okay, let's
Speaker 2: just have a chill police presence, like we'll go, we
Speaker 2: have enough money to cover this, we'll wear chill out
Speaker 2: clothes and like just make sure shit's okay. So they're
Speaker 2: at this event, it's like popping. Lots of people are there.
Speaker 2: Everyone's really excited for this game launch, and there's like
Speaker 2: a plan where they're like, oh, shall we see all
Speaker 2: the credit cards for tickets? And Finn says a great
Speaker 2: quote where he goes, anybody up to no good is
Speaker 2: not using a credit card. Yes, that put that on
Speaker 2: a shirt I feel. I think about Teresa from Housewives
Speaker 2: of New Jersey here paying with her furniture and cash,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 1: What I mean, for all her marble and onyx with
Speaker 1: a stack of hundreds.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, nothing good happens with cash, baby, except tattoos.
Speaker 2: I like to you know, but my shop now takes
Speaker 2: credit cards, which is like revolutionary. It's so nice not
Speaker 2: having to take hundreds of dollars out. Yeah. Oh, am,
Speaker 2: I in a new wait list for a new tattoo.
Speaker 2: I am okay, So I can't stop Krees. He's with
Speaker 2: the security team and he's insulting the quality of film,
Speaker 2: and the security guy's like, all right, motherfucker, we're not
Speaker 2: Steven Spielberg. We've had two hundred events a year here
Speaker 2: and there's no problems. We're good at our job. Stop
Speaker 2: the motherfucking shadea. Okay. The presentation starts and it's about
Speaker 2: like the game is about farming and building homes and
Speaker 2: like to have people this upset about it is so funny. Okay.
Speaker 2: So she comes out, well, won't be funny soon, Okay.
Speaker 2: So she comes out and like on brand, simple business,
Speaker 2: casual shakeout fit. Very Bethany Frankele and I don't think
Speaker 2: we agree on this, but to me, I think Bethany
Speaker 2: Frankel is the best dressed housewife. But I mean she's
Speaker 2: the top for me. Yeah, okay, good. Yeah. I have
Speaker 2: friends that try to argue and I'm like, no, we
Speaker 2: don't have to like her in her slight. I think
Speaker 2: most of them dress badly, but she's tours the top
Speaker 2: for me. For sure. Yeah, not her home decor. I
Speaker 2: would say I don't want red walls. But in terms
Speaker 2: of outfits, Raina and Bethany are similar. So while she's presenting,
Speaker 2: there's red laser pointers popping up on her body and face,
Speaker 2: not faces at all, Like, okay, there might you might
Speaker 2: get shot in the head. Can you maybe sweat? It's
Speaker 2: so confusing, but the cops are all really stressed out,
Speaker 2: so they're looking what the lasers are and basically it's
Speaker 2: just like a prank with like a bunch of the
Speaker 2: people just brought lasers and it's not violent lasers. And
Speaker 2: she makes a joke about like, ah my mom's cat
Speaker 2: likes laser pointers. But now you think it's okay, it's
Speaker 2: not okay. Blackout lights, turn out, everything is lighting. It's
Speaker 2: just like really fucked up. And then like there's an
Speaker 2: audio and it's like no social justice and gaming. So
Speaker 2: someone hacked onto this live board thing. People are rushing out.
Speaker 2: They've lost Raina. In the pandemonium. Kriese's on the security footage.
Speaker 2: He sees her with a security guard in the back
Speaker 2: hallway being dragged out the back exit. The squad runs.
Speaker 2: They're trying to get her Carisy has a little stumble
Speaker 2: running in dress shoes, but then you know, gets the
Speaker 2: guard and then on a giant screen outside is live
Speaker 2: footage of Raina being tied up in the back of
Speaker 2: a van and the masked man is saying game on.
Speaker 2: And then the fake security guard says, this was all
Speaker 2: done by this group called Acid Rain and he thought
Speaker 2: it was just going to be a chill prank. He
Speaker 2: didn't realize it was a full on kidnapping. And they're like,
Speaker 2: you're gonna go to jail by bitch and that's it.
Speaker 2: You guys know, Naomi k Pergin, I'm saying bye bitch
Speaker 2: with her essence inside of me.
Speaker 1: Please look up her Bye Bitch song and buy it
Speaker 1: as a tone. It's amazing, Yes, And then I says.
Speaker 2: See something, say something, which is a We talk about
Speaker 2: that a lot, and then they threaten him with murder chargers.
Speaker 2: So he starts talking and he says he did see
Speaker 2: the van, and the news are like, the cops are
Speaker 2: inside and this still happened. That's embarrassing. So the white
Speaker 2: van they find out was stolen from a garage yesterday,
Speaker 2: but the security cameras went out so no one saw anything,
Speaker 2: and no one has seen this van on any bridges
Speaker 2: or tunnel, so that means they're still in Manhattan, which
Speaker 2: I think is a good sign. And Careesy has a
Speaker 2: hit and they're off to like go on location. So
Speaker 2: they find the van and it's outside of like a wood,
Speaker 2: sandy bricks, boulder type place. I don't know what this is.
Speaker 2: I don't know, but there's a lot of different materials,
Speaker 2: so many boulders in Manhattan. It could be anywhere. Yeah,
Speaker 2: the van is empty, but there's a tiny dark hallway
Speaker 2: and Finn and Rollins go in there with their team
Speaker 2: and it's an abandoned building and there's a calling car
Speaker 2: there and a mattress which does not make me happy,
Speaker 2: and there's a blouse and a chair with ropes tied
Speaker 2: to it. And they left a video behind on a
Speaker 2: phone and the video is her begging and pleading and
Speaker 2: crying and they're slapping her and taking her shirt off,
Speaker 2: and then it says level completed. So then we're in
Speaker 2: this like messy bedroom. There's messy bookshelves, and Reina is
Speaker 2: there and she's bloody and she's in a bra and
Speaker 2: she's with Logan Paul, one of the brothers who's you know,
Speaker 2: likes to pull pranks in Japanese suicide forests and beat
Speaker 2: up NBA players for money. I don't know what the like.
Speaker 2: Usually when we speak to the young actors from SVU,
Speaker 2: we're like so inspired by them and we're like, the
Speaker 2: future will be good. And then when you find it
Speaker 2: out about these Internet brothers, you're like, maybe gen Z
Speaker 2: has some problems, so these are like problematic YouTube boys.
Speaker 2: It was shocking to see his face in this. I
Speaker 2: don't did he audition, did they want him? I'm so
Speaker 2: many questions, but he tells her to shut up, and
Speaker 2: it's bad. And then there's a man with a coat
Speaker 2: on and it's like a furry lined hood, which like
Speaker 2: for video game rapists, it's just like funny to have
Speaker 2: a fur lined hood. But you know, maybe it was
Speaker 2: on sale at Costco and his mom got it for him.
Speaker 2: So they put masks on to make another video. And
Speaker 2: I know this This is like one of the Kelly
Speaker 2: Who moments where you're like, this is bad and I
Speaker 2: know it's tragic, but your body is banging. I'm like,
Speaker 2: oh my god, I know you're being attacked, but you
Speaker 2: look great. Yeah, your abs are looking good. They're looking great,
Speaker 2: and the boyfriend's at the squad and he's like, we
Speaker 2: tried to tell her, We tried to tell her, and
Speaker 2: he's fucking pissed, and I'm with him, like I would
Speaker 2: be annoyed. I know you're more worried, but it's just tough.
Speaker 2: It's tough. You don't want to play a told you
Speaker 2: so game when someone's being attacked. But right, of course, no,
Speaker 2: nothing she did not. Yeah, so Carreese steal Benson in
Speaker 2: front of Steven, and Steven's like, wait, what's going on?
Speaker 2: And then they like shut the blinds so aggressively, and
Speaker 2: it's like he's already worried, why are you shutting the blinds?
Speaker 2: Like you're really ruining this man's brain. Correese shows Benson
Speaker 2: the video of a mass man and he's dragging her
Speaker 2: around and throwing her and she's crying and this is
Speaker 2: so sad. And the man start taking off her clothes
Speaker 2: and you know, nothing good's about to happen, and they're
Speaker 2: like surrounding her and this is very upsetting, very great acting,
Speaker 2: and a really graphic episode for SVO And we've seen
Speaker 2: a lot and this one is like hard to watch.
Speaker 2: So the next video is Rayna and she's bloody with
Speaker 2: messed up hair and in a T shirt with their
Speaker 2: calling card on it, like it's it's like a grenade
Speaker 2: with letters, and they make her do a forced statement
Speaker 2: and she says something like I realize now that gaming
Speaker 2: is no place for females, So all you bitches should
Speaker 2: get out now. You are not wanted and you are
Speaker 2: not safe. And I have a message for Stephen Kaplan.
Speaker 2: I never left you, and I only slept with you
Speaker 2: to back my game. I am a slut and I
Speaker 2: am a liar. And then like I understand, they're making
Speaker 2: her say and she has to say it, but like
Speaker 2: people know, she doesn't really mean it, so like I
Speaker 2: don't get what the point of this all is. And
Speaker 2: then the tape is geotagged, so Rollin sees this, and
Speaker 2: that's like pretty weird, like why would they be like secret,
Speaker 2: secret secret, And then all of a sudden, like let
Speaker 2: us know where they are, so they think it's a trap,
Speaker 2: and then they the house that is geotag belongs to
Speaker 2: a public art teacher and it's in Staten Island, and
Speaker 2: so the squad heads out to Staten Island and it
Speaker 2: ends up being the mother of one of the gamer criminals,
Speaker 2: and her son's name is Anthony. He plays video games,
Speaker 2: and they go to his room and it is the
Speaker 2: set of the rape. So it's in this basement room.
Speaker 2: The camera is still there and the guns safe is
Speaker 2: fully empty, and the mom is doing the classic he's
Speaker 2: a good boy, shy, you're making a mistake. No, no,
Speaker 2: no sexual ascent. He would never, And they're like, your
Speaker 2: basement is full of it evidence and it is him
Speaker 2: and he's harassed her for weeks and this is the
Speaker 2: account and she's like, no, he would never, he would never.
Speaker 2: My little baby, Uh yeah, don't do this with Oscar. Well,
Speaker 2: hopefully Oscar will behave but it's always it is always
Speaker 2: crazy that mom's Even Derek Chauvin's mom just like did
Speaker 2: a statement where she's like, he's a really good guy.
Speaker 2: It's like we watched a video of him murder a
Speaker 2: person slowly. So I know you're blinded by motherhood, like
Speaker 2: Jennifer Lopez says in Hustlers and motherhood is a mental disease,
Speaker 2: but you gotta know your son's suck. Listen.
Speaker 1: When I was growing up, like if the school called,
Speaker 1: my parents were like, what did you do. They were
Speaker 1: never like you've got the wrong kid, like they were
Speaker 1: constantly like that was.
Speaker 2: How I grew up.
Speaker 1: So I'm I'm usually like Rosie, what have you done?
Speaker 1: You know, like I'm not like I'm not like she's
Speaker 1: an angel, Like I don't think it's gonna be a
Speaker 1: problem for me to blame my child.
Speaker 2: So CARIESI is trying to like convince the mother to
Speaker 2: help them find them because they're violent criminals, even though
Speaker 2: she's like delusional. Sochrisey's connecting with her like I'm a
Speaker 2: stann Island boy. I grew up right around you. And
Speaker 2: we find out that like her husband died and like
Speaker 2: after his dad died, you know, like whatever, he's been
Speaker 2: fucked in the head. So now she's like even if
Speaker 2: he wrote the messages, he wouldn't rape, Like this isn't
Speaker 2: what he is and and it's like, okay, but he
Speaker 2: did stand and watch a live stream of a rape
Speaker 2: happen and helped the technology, like he got the bluetooth
Speaker 2: going to make this happen. So so then something made
Speaker 2: me want to look up this mother, and I'm glad
Speaker 2: I did. Her name is Juliet Printer. That's a funny
Speaker 2: last name. But she yeah, she doesn't have a photo
Speaker 2: for our IMDb, so if her representatives are listening to this,
Speaker 2: get a fucking photo up for your client. But she
Speaker 2: has fourteen credits, and she has been in some episodes
Speaker 2: of SBUs. She was in Perfect Tortured and Vulnerable. Wow. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and she's in two episodes of Veep. And then obviously
Speaker 2: then I looked up our favorite girl from up top
Speaker 2: that worked in the booth, that works for Reina that
Speaker 2: you really enjoyed her acting, and I looked her up
Speaker 2: and she's now filming Life and Beth right now, and
Speaker 2: she's a regular. So that's like the new Amy Schumer show.
Speaker 2: So maybe she's gonna blow up and be a huge
Speaker 2: going to know about that? Cool? Yeah, filling you in.
Speaker 2: So we really like her. She's had credit, she's been working,
Speaker 2: but hopefully she blows up after this new show. Hopefully
Speaker 2: it's a good time. Also, it's weird saying I hope
Speaker 2: someone blows up while we're listening to this episode in
Speaker 2: particular of just like all of this chaos and violence.
Speaker 2: So then he basically is as blunt as he can
Speaker 2: be with this mother and says, we need to end
Speaker 2: this peacefully, lady, And that's I think a threat of
Speaker 2: just like if you don't help us, like we will
Speaker 2: shoot your child, right, And so she spills the tea
Speaker 2: on like the guns and what's happening and where everyone is.
Speaker 2: So Benson's like, what's next, what's next? What's next? Finn
Speaker 2: has the scoop and he says, well, next in this
Speaker 2: game is killer be slaughtered. So shit's about to go bad.
Speaker 2: And then Raina calls them and they so basically Raina says,
Speaker 2: they have me in a garage. I think they're going
Speaker 2: to kill me. Please help me, Please help me, And
Speaker 2: there's a gun pointed to her head and someone's holding
Speaker 2: the phone to her face, so it means that her
Speaker 2: arms are tied up and busy if she can't even
Speaker 2: hold her own phone. So Finn does warn the Squat.
Speaker 2: He goes, this could be a cop ambush and a
Speaker 2: trap and like, we have to be careful, but we
Speaker 2: got to get our girls, so let's go. So they
Speaker 2: go to a factory warehouse building and the swats starts
Speaker 2: screaming she's got a gun, and they go in and
Speaker 2: she is taped up to like a sauce style contraption
Speaker 2: like a hell thing where her hands are tied to
Speaker 2: the gun and so she can't do anything. But like
Speaker 2: to the untrained swat eye, it looks like she's holding
Speaker 2: this gun but she's crying and she can't do anything
Speaker 2: about it. And there's a speaker that plays noises of gunfire,
Speaker 2: which I think would have made them like, I'll shoot
Speaker 2: her dead, but thank Goddess, View is there saying hold fire,
Speaker 2: hold fire, hold fire. So it is so fucked up.
Speaker 2: But they were gonna get her killed while she like
Speaker 2: had the gun tape for her. It's like really scary
Speaker 2: to think about. So then they feel like everyone is
Speaker 2: still in there. I don't even know I don't even
Speaker 2: remember how, but Christian Rollins are on the roof doing
Speaker 2: choreography and then some gamers on the roof shoot at them,
Speaker 2: and the fur coat lined guy is like, I never
Speaker 2: wanted this to get this far, and Rollins is like,
Speaker 2: shut your fucking mouth, and he goes, no, I geotagged
Speaker 2: for my mom's house so you can find me, like
Speaker 2: h and she doesn't care. It's too little, too late,
Speaker 2: my friend, too little too late. Yeah, he's acting like
Speaker 2: he just got roped in to like.
Speaker 1: Do the tech, but like he didn't think that these
Speaker 1: guys were going to go through on any of that shit.
Speaker 2: But yeah, this is a giant operation. Like you shut
Speaker 2: down a huge launch at an event center. Yeah, multiple
Speaker 2: stolen vans, multiple locations, like you're going to jail.
Speaker 1: Yeah, planted a security guard, like you were able to
Speaker 1: like hack into the mainframe and live stream your own kidnapping.
Speaker 2: Like it's a lot. Sochriesy has like a showdown with
Speaker 2: one of the other gamers and shoots him, not dead,
Speaker 2: but shoots him and is like, see, this is real life.
Speaker 2: This isn't like a video game. And then the Logan
Speaker 2: boy comes out, not Oscar Paul Paul or what is it, Jake, Jake.
Speaker 1: Logan Paul like Logan, his brother Jake is equally bad,
Speaker 1: but this is Logan.
Speaker 2: He there's like he hags out with some porn stars
Speaker 2: that I'm a fan of, and I'm like, yeah, I
Speaker 2: don't like this, okay, But for his birth this is
Speaker 2: kind of cool. For his friend's birthday, he got his
Speaker 2: favorite porn star to come meet him, and now they've
Speaker 2: been dating for like over a year. Oh cute. Yeah,
Speaker 2: So I don't know, I don't know if this is
Speaker 2: good or bad. But they're all young and not and
Speaker 2: so this logo, so Paul, God, what's this? So logan
Speaker 2: Paul comes out with the gun and says, actually, video
Speaker 2: games are the same as life. Okay, okay, buddy. So
Speaker 2: Carisy starts talking. I mean, I did spend over five
Speaker 2: hundred dollars on Simpson's tapped out and then I had
Speaker 2: to like close my account, and so I understand how
Speaker 2: the lines can blur. I don't want to be fully judgmental,
Speaker 2: but I did build a whole city that looks beautiful. Yeah,
Speaker 2: but then did you.
Speaker 1: Like kidnap Matt Groening and say, like make the game
Speaker 1: do what I want?
Speaker 2: I mean, like very psychotic when he's going on, but
Speaker 2: we should we should start writing that script. So Carries
Speaker 2: starts talking and he's like, don't talk and prepare to
Speaker 2: be slaughtered. But he sees Rollins and is like, drop
Speaker 2: the gun to Rollins. So Rowlins has to drop the gun.
Speaker 2: Caresy doesn't have a gun, and the the guy with
Speaker 2: the gun goes on a long speech you know, rain
Speaker 2: as a skink and a whore, and the guy on
Speaker 2: the ground, who's already been shot, calls Rollin's a bitch,
Speaker 2: and it's like aren't you bleeding? Like how are you
Speaker 2: still having time to call women bitches? So Finn comes
Speaker 2: up from behind and says like drop the gun, and
Speaker 2: then you know, Logan also has moments. There's a back
Speaker 2: and forth like Finn's like it's not a game, yes
Speaker 2: it is, blah blah blah. So then the guy tries
Speaker 2: to do a spin move to kill Finn, but Finn
Speaker 2: shot the shit out of him and is like, fuck
Speaker 2: you, You're dead, so dead to them all Wendy Williams' style.
Speaker 2: Finn explains he knows the difference between video games and reality,
Speaker 2: and those guys didn't thank you, Finn. So Benson now
Speaker 2: says that he has to be an administrative duty for
Speaker 2: a few days. But keep your gun, dude, it was
Speaker 2: a clean ass shot. You're good, Like, enjoy a couple
Speaker 2: days off. You're fine. She pats him on the shoulder
Speaker 2: and tells him to go home. Rollins is now with
Speaker 2: Raina and Steven at the house at their apartment and
Speaker 2: one of the video gamers just took a plea deal.
Speaker 2: The other one's going to trial, so now she has
Speaker 2: to testify, but Rollin says, she has like a lot
Speaker 2: of time, don't worry. But it's like so traumatizing to like,
Speaker 2: since we saw everything she went through in such graphic detail,
Speaker 2: it is like hard to imagine her having to go
Speaker 2: on trial. And she's so sad and traumatized. She's like
Speaker 2: such a good actress. And she says, women and gaming,
Speaker 2: what did I expect? And she starts to cry and
Speaker 2: she says whatever, I'm out and Rollin says, no, no,
Speaker 2: if you give up, they'd win, and she goes, no,
Speaker 2: they already did. And it's like Rollin's this isn't the
Speaker 2: time to push her into making video games. I'm sorry.
Speaker 2: She was just like gang raped and beaten the shit
Speaker 2: out of So can you not like give her a
Speaker 2: pep talk to get back to work? And yeah, and
Speaker 2: then that's Dick Wolf. And honestly, this was a graphic
Speaker 2: Wild Chase episode, and I really am curious to know
Speaker 2: about the real information.
Speaker 1: Kara Well, I was going to say, I feel like
Speaker 1: this is really graphic episode and very scary, and I
Speaker 1: remember that from when I watched it originally.
Speaker 2: But I do think that it kind of conveys the sentiment.
Speaker 1: That is online towards women, and we'll get into that
Speaker 1: with this next part.
Speaker 2: And I'm very passionate about this because I lost a
Speaker 2: friend to Gamergate. Like I had a friend who was
Speaker 2: so into Gamergate, causing chaos everywhere he went, like started
Speaker 2: posting videos where we're like, what's going on with him?
Speaker 2: But you want to see the best in your friend,
Speaker 2: and so I kept kind of forgiving and seeing and
Speaker 2: then he became a full on racist who legit was like,
Speaker 2: I don't get what's wrong with the white supremacist, Like,
Speaker 2: we cut him out. We uninvited him from Thanksgiving like
Speaker 2: years ago, wow, like twenty sixteen. We cut him out
Speaker 2: of our lives because he became a full blown, like racist.
Speaker 1: Well that's kind of when a lot of things happened
Speaker 1: for people. I didn't know that about your friend. That's nuts.
Speaker 1: Tell me more as I get into the real stuff
Speaker 1: when we come back. Okay, let's get into hashtag gamer gate.
Speaker 1: Gamergate was basically a clusterfuck even within itself, like it
Speaker 1: was supposed to be this big movement, but then there
Speaker 1: was never any official mission, statement or leadership of any kind,
Speaker 1: Like they never had a manifesto, they never there was
Speaker 1: just nothing that ever defined it specifically, and so it
Speaker 1: just evolved into like a culture war on the Internet,
Speaker 1: and it's basically like a microcosm of the whole like
Speaker 1: alt right versus like leftysjws shit that blew up in
Speaker 1: twenty sixteen around the time that your friend revealed himself
Speaker 1: to be of one side, and like, I think that
Speaker 1: argument is still happening, raging on message boards and shit
Speaker 1: right now.
Speaker 2: That this was kind of like I think around when
Speaker 2: it started.
Speaker 1: But essentially the part of gamergate that people might think
Speaker 1: was like legitimate is that guys, which I don't think,
Speaker 1: but I'm just saying, like this was like the nicer
Speaker 1: version of gamer gate, which is that they suspected unethical
Speaker 1: collusion between the press and feminists and progressives and social critics.
Speaker 1: Like so they were like thinking that women gamers and
Speaker 1: developers were like sleeping with press or like figuring out
Speaker 1: ways to collude to get like more favorable treatment. So
Speaker 1: it started out as an ethics in gaming thing that
Speaker 1: was like the crux of it, but it just never
Speaker 1: was that really because all these guys glombed onto it
Speaker 1: and it became like all these shittheads who just wanted
Speaker 1: to like launch smear campaigns and online harassment of women
Speaker 1: in gaming because they just didn't like the idea of
Speaker 1: any progressive ideals living in the gaming space at all,
Speaker 1: Like because there were no leaders and there was no
Speaker 1: real like succinct messaging. The whole thing was like the
Speaker 1: movement was like a clusterfuck from the beginning, just like
Speaker 1: all over the place, and ended up being becoming defined
Speaker 1: by the harassment of women. So all these guys gathered
Speaker 1: and communicated on like four chan, in at relay chat rooms, Twitter,
Speaker 1: and Reddit. Eventually four chan bands talking about about gamer gate,
Speaker 1: and that's when eight chan develops, which eight chan is
Speaker 1: now called eight kun or kun eight kuhn and is
Speaker 1: just like a full neo Nazi racist like Wonderland on
Speaker 1: the Internet. The gamer gate term comes from this actor
Speaker 1: Adam Baldwin.
Speaker 2: I don't really know who he is.
Speaker 1: He's been in a bunch of stuff, Like he was
Speaker 1: in Firefly, he was in a show called Chuck. I'm
Speaker 1: sure you're all gonna DM me and go. He was
Speaker 1: so and So's father in this movie. I don't know
Speaker 1: who he is. I don't really think I've seen him
Speaker 1: in anything, but I think he was in like Full
Speaker 1: Metal jacket like old movies, and then he's been like
Speaker 1: in some newer stuff, and he thought about it as
Speaker 1: like corruption in gaming. You know that journalists were you know,
Speaker 1: taking like bribes or person having personal relationships and stuff
Speaker 1: that influence what they covered in the gaming industry. So
Speaker 1: he is the one that coined the term gamer gate.
Speaker 1: But he also endorsed Ted Cruz in twenty six So
Speaker 1: that tells us everything we need to know. I think.
Speaker 1: Let me get to like how it really went down.
Speaker 1: So it started in twenty thirteen when Zoe Quinn, who
Speaker 1: was an indie game developer, released Depression Quest, which is
Speaker 1: a text focused game designed to convey the experience of
Speaker 1: depression through all these fictional scenarios and it was based
Speaker 1: on their own experience with the illness. So it was
Speaker 1: really well reviewed by gaming media. But these fucking loser
Speaker 1: in cells in the gaming world didn't like that it
Speaker 1: wasn't a violent skill based game exactly like what happens
Speaker 1: in this episode. They just don't like that it's not
Speaker 1: a shoot him up game, and they think it's bringing
Speaker 1: politics into gaming and they don't like that. So Zoe
Speaker 1: was already getting a lot of shit in twenty thirteen
Speaker 1: just for developing this game. And then in twenty fourteen
Speaker 1: we get to the Zoe Post, which is a post
Speaker 1: on a blog written by Zoe's ex boyfriend, Aaron Joni Jony.
Speaker 2: It's one of those GJ situations.
Speaker 1: I don't really know how you say it, but in
Speaker 1: twenty fourteen, he wrote this long, detailed post about Zoe
Speaker 1: and his relationship with them and their breakup and like
Speaker 1: he put in personal text emails chats, I think possibly no,
Speaker 1: not nudes.
Speaker 2: But all bad.
Speaker 1: All this like personal shit he included in this post,
Speaker 1: and the post falsely accused Zoe of having a sexual
Speaker 1: relationship with this journalist named Nathan Grayson from Kataku, which
Speaker 1: is a you know how Gawker has like Jezebel, They've
Speaker 1: got Jalopi, They've got like all these different lifestyle based
Speaker 1: websites blogs. Kataku is their gaming one. Yes, exactly Dead's been.
Speaker 1: Kataku is their gaming one. So he accused his ex
Speaker 1: Zoe of having a sexual relationship with this journalist at
Speaker 1: Kataku so that he would review their game favorably. This
Speaker 1: is what a lot of people think gamergate is about.
Speaker 1: These two people colluding for good game reviews and it's
Speaker 1: wild because this guy, Aaron who posted the blog later
Speaker 1: said that this was a typo and that he actually
Speaker 1: had no proof of their relationship at all. And then
Speaker 1: number two, he never reviewed their game, like he never
Speaker 1: reviewed Depression Quests. So the entire backbone of Gamergate to
Speaker 1: me that if you're claiming it's about ethics and journalism
Speaker 1: there is completely dispelled. So Zoe gets docked their Tumblr,
Speaker 1: Skype and Dropbox gets hacked, their nudes get leaked, and
Speaker 1: of course there's like rape and death threats up the wazoo,
Speaker 1: and they ended up fleeing their home for their safety.
Speaker 2: So not a great situation for Zoe.
Speaker 1: And I just want to clarify that currently Zoe identifies
Speaker 1: as non binary, but at the time of Gamergate, Zoe
Speaker 1: identified as female, so that's why I am using the
Speaker 1: correct pronouns now. But Zoe was targeted as a woman
Speaker 1: back in the day. Then another target who I believe
Speaker 1: that Raina Punjabi's character is based on Zoe. And this
Speaker 1: next person a little bit because this is a feminist
Speaker 1: media critic named Anita Sarkisian, and she was kind of
Speaker 1: the biggest face of Gamergate, like because she just was
Speaker 1: very vocal and received a lot of hate, but is
Speaker 1: not actually a game developer herself.
Speaker 2: So I think that's like it's an amalgamation of the two.
Speaker 1: So Anita had previously been the target of online harassment
Speaker 1: because she has this YouTube series called Tropes Versus Women,
Speaker 1: and she did this one called Tropes Versus Women in
Speaker 1: video Games that analyze sexist portrayals of women. She does
Speaker 1: it all about pop culture, but then she did one
Speaker 1: about video games. She also started a nonprofit called Feminist
Speaker 1: Frequency that makes a lot of content like videos, and
Speaker 1: they aim to quote analyze modern media's relationship to gender, race,
Speaker 1: and sexuality, and they advocate just treatment of all people
Speaker 1: offline and online. I'm sure even that description would make
Speaker 1: all these gamer losers go fucking nuts.
Speaker 2: Like I'm just sitting here thinking and maybe arcade is
Speaker 2: different than video games, but it's like do they hate
Speaker 2: Miss pac Man, like you know, you just have to
Speaker 2: shoot people? Or you like, why aren't they mad at Madden?
Speaker 2: That's about football? Like you know what I mean. It's
Speaker 2: just like even there, it's obviously hatred towards women, but
Speaker 2: it's like their fake cover story isn't real because they're
Speaker 2: not mad at any sports games or the boxing or jaws.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 1: Well, I think like what I in what I was reading,
Speaker 1: like what some people are saying is like these are
Speaker 1: people that feel marginalized, and they feel like gaming is
Speaker 1: a place where they're accepted and they.
Speaker 2: Get that little like they get that.
Speaker 1: Little dose of acceptance that they're looking for, and they
Speaker 1: feel like when like women and like people of color
Speaker 1: and like other people come in, they're taking something away
Speaker 1: from them in their space.
Speaker 2: But they keech bullshit. Well it's just silly because it's like, well,
Speaker 2: don't you feel that they these other people also find
Speaker 2: a home in video games, Like it just seems exactly
Speaker 2: so strange to thank you, a white man in a
Speaker 2: country built for and by white men, feels out of place,
Speaker 2: But like this black woman who likes video games would
Speaker 2: not feel out of place and want refuge in a thing.
Speaker 1: Well, right, I mean you're describing white privilege. It's like
Speaker 1: fully on display here. Yeah, Like it's it's terrible. These
Speaker 1: guys are not right. So, like, while the original goal
Speaker 1: I think was to sort of critique the representation of
Speaker 1: women in pop culture, it ended up being about ending
Speaker 1: abuse in the games industry. That's like what the focus
Speaker 1: is now of feminist frequency, and a lot of her
Speaker 1: videos have been viewed a million times.
Speaker 2: It's pretty successful.
Speaker 1: So she did an episode of her show about the
Speaker 1: whole Zoe Quinn thing, and she received rape and death
Speaker 1: threats and private information about her was released, including her
Speaker 1: home address, and she also fled her home.
Speaker 2: And that's the thing because all these people, like maybe
Speaker 2: I'm combining them and they shouldn't be, but I'm assuming
Speaker 2: they're just like right wing lunatics that want freedom and
Speaker 2: it's all about your freedom, and yet with these actions
Speaker 2: they try to like fuck up other people's freedom, you
Speaker 2: know what I mean, Because like the point of this
Speaker 2: is to make sure these women never speak again or
Speaker 2: never want to go public or never do anything because
Speaker 2: they're put in danger and like all their private shits
Speaker 2: put out. So it's like they are constantly going against
Speaker 2: their ideals too, where like this feminist frequency is her
Speaker 2: safe space, and now you're mad at what she says,
Speaker 2: and now you're trying to her up for like being
Speaker 2: her own self. It's like enraging. I'll shut up.
Speaker 1: No, no, no, you're you're exactly right, And it's like
Speaker 1: that's basically what people started to realize that Gamergate became
Speaker 1: Gamergate became shutting down any opposition or any critique of
Speaker 1: the gaming industry in vis a vi women, you know,
Speaker 1: or minorities, or.
Speaker 2: Like anything political, but mostly women.
Speaker 1: Actually, someone created a computer game called beat Up Anita
Speaker 1: Sarkisian where you could just virtually beat up Anita with
Speaker 1: your mouse, like so pretty fucked up. Anita had said,
Speaker 1: kind of like what we say all the time on
Speaker 1: this podcast, but she said, one of the most radical
Speaker 1: things you can do is to actually believe women when
Speaker 1: they talk about their experiences. The perpetrators do not see
Speaker 1: themselves as perpetrators at all. They see themselves as noble warriors.
Speaker 1: So that's like these guys, I think put themselves like,
Speaker 1: you know, they are video game characters in their own minds.
Speaker 1: Like one time, Anita was set to speak at Utah
Speaker 1: State University in October of twenty fourteen, like a few
Speaker 1: months after Gamergate had really had started, and she had
Speaker 1: to cancel the whole thing because they were calling in
Speaker 1: bomb threats, death threats, saying there was going to be
Speaker 1: a mass murder, like comparing it to this mass murder
Speaker 1: that happened in Montreal saying like, this is what we're
Speaker 1: going to do at this place, and they couldn't do
Speaker 1: extra security at this venue because Utah's opened carry laws,
Speaker 1: so they just canceled the event. And this got a
Speaker 1: lot of media attention, and then the FBI started an investigation,
Speaker 1: which ultimately went nowhere because all these people are anonymous
Speaker 1: and it's like very hard to track people down. Another
Speaker 1: victim of gamer Gate was Brianna Wu, an independent game
Speaker 1: developer and co founder of a video games studio called
Speaker 1: Giant Space Cat. She was doxed on eight Chan as
Speaker 1: a retaliation for just a mocking gamer Gate.
Speaker 2: She wasn't even like because she was making games. I
Speaker 2: don't but I had something to do with that.
Speaker 1: But she mocked Gamergate and got fully docksed, rape and
Speaker 1: death threats as she contacted police fled her home, but
Speaker 1: also said that she would not allow threats to intimidate
Speaker 1: her into silence, so she did offer a reward for
Speaker 1: information leading to conviction of people who were harassing her,
Speaker 1: and she set up a legal fund to help other
Speaker 1: game developers who had been harassed online. So very cool person,
Speaker 1: Brianna Wu, And like, I don't even know, I think
Speaker 1: one time I tried to go on four Chan, like
Speaker 1: I'm talking ten years ago, just to see what was up,
Speaker 1: and like I slowly backed out of the room. There's
Speaker 1: also Felicia Day, who is an actress and gamer that
Speaker 1: my husband kind of knows and some of my friends know,
Speaker 1: but I've I've heard of her more than anyone else
Speaker 1: in this story. She wrote a blog about her concerns
Speaker 1: over gamer Gate and her fear of retaliation if she
Speaker 1: spoke up against it, and almost immediately her home address,
Speaker 1: her phone number was posted online. She got harassing letters,
Speaker 1: phone calls. But then then like the actor Will Wheedon
Speaker 1: and an NFL player named Chris Klue also posted criticisms
Speaker 1: of gamer Gate and surprise, surprise, their phone numbers addresses
Speaker 1: are no to be found. And Stephen Colbert talked about
Speaker 1: why are men not being threatened by gamer Gate?
Speaker 2: It's like completely targeting women.
Speaker 1: So if it really is about ethics and journalism and
Speaker 1: it's about all this other shit you claim, it's about
Speaker 1: why are when people critique it that are men, why
Speaker 1: are you not going after them? So it's insane and
Speaker 1: it's it was never about ethics. It's about shutting women up.
Speaker 1: Which we've said, and it's anyone who criticized the patriarchal,
Speaker 1: male dominated culture of gaming gets, you know, their lives ruined.
Speaker 1: One article I read, and I just want to mention
Speaker 1: this said, these threats the women were receiving were quote,
Speaker 1: not just run of the mill internet nastiness. In many cases,
Speaker 1: these women received highly graphic, disturbing threats, the stuff of
Speaker 1: SVU episodes. So I like that somebody agreed with us,
Speaker 1: and then SVW was like, hell, yeah, we're gonna make
Speaker 1: an episode about it.
Speaker 2: And this is again just an assumption on my part,
Speaker 2: but I bet these are the same men that say
Speaker 2: I'm a good guy. Why am I getting friend Zone?
Speaker 2: What the fuck? I'm such a good guy? And girls
Speaker 2: who want to damy like, these are the guys. These
Speaker 2: are the guys. I think they're nice people. Yeah, these
Speaker 2: dumb bitches don't want to be my girlfriend. Fuck? Okay.
Speaker 1: So, according to the Entertainment Software Association, forty eight and
Speaker 1: this is this is actually this data is from about
Speaker 1: five or six years ago, from when gameror Gate was happening.
Speaker 1: But they say forty eight percent of game players in
Speaker 1: the United States are women. Game developers are mostly male,
Speaker 1: I mean, apparently there was a survey of game developers
Speaker 1: in twenty fourteen that found only twenty one percent of
Speaker 1: the respondents identified as female, So almost half of gamers
Speaker 1: are women, you know, And it's just so insane to
Speaker 1: say no women in gaming. It's the same thing to
Speaker 1: me as when people go women aren't funny, and I'm like,
Speaker 1: but fifty percent of audiences are women, like going to
Speaker 1: see comedy. Fifty percent of the world is women. So yeah, Eventually,
Speaker 1: like they there wasn't, you know, an FBI investigation, and
Speaker 1: I'm sure local authorities tried to jump in at some points,
Speaker 1: but it's very hard to prosecute these offenders that were
Speaker 1: all operating under pseudonyms on the internet. And then, yeah,
Speaker 1: like I said, eight chan became this gamer gate hub
Speaker 1: eventually after four chan band discussion, and eight chan is
Speaker 1: where QAnon lives no surprise here, it is where conspiracy
Speaker 1: nutbags go to hang out and party. The whole gamer
Speaker 1: Gate debate obviously brought Nazis, Men's right activists and other
Speaker 1: losers out of the woodwork, and mainstream gaming critics and
Speaker 1: gamer gate supporters kind of like this actor at Adam Baldwin.
Speaker 1: They insist that the trolls are just a small vocal minority,
Speaker 1: that it's actually a very small group of people, but
Speaker 1: they're all very tech savvy, so they create these sock
Speaker 1: puppet accounts to appear like a larger group. It's kind
Speaker 1: of like how I think during twenty sixteen election, when
Speaker 1: you would look under Trump and you would see all
Speaker 1: the peppet, you'd see all these bots and stuff, you
Speaker 1: thought that there were a lot more people supporting Trump
Speaker 1: than I think actually do.
Speaker 2: So.
Speaker 1: Anita Sarkisian talks a lot about how women and men
Speaker 1: are attacked very different online in a lot of the
Speaker 1: ways that these websites, like even Twitter or Readit, whatever,
Speaker 1: the way that they're set up to deal with reporting,
Speaker 1: Like when you report someone's harassment, it's very focused towards
Speaker 1: the male experience.
Speaker 2: It's not focused towards the female experience.
Speaker 1: Like she says, men are usually embarrassed, it's an insult,
Speaker 1: it's a one time thing. When women are attacked, it's
Speaker 1: violent threats, it's sexual harassments, and it's sustained over time.
Speaker 1: So we can see that reporting on social media is
Speaker 1: created for the way men are harassed because users can
Speaker 1: send abusive comments to women and then get reported and
Speaker 1: get taken down and they just set up new accounts
Speaker 1: and it's up to the person receiving the vitriol to
Speaker 1: keep blocking them, you know, like it's up to the women.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and they're you know when you do get fucked
Speaker 2: up shit written, Like the people that are in charge
Speaker 2: of deciding what is abusive and what is not are
Speaker 2: white tech boy nerds that were probably a part of
Speaker 2: gamer gate. But Marshabelski has a whole thing. There's like
Speaker 2: a pod documentary about Facebook and everything. But like Steph
Speaker 2: Tolov just posted it like it never ends where you
Speaker 2: can just like repost something horrific a man wrote to you,
Speaker 2: and wright men are trash and you will get in
Speaker 2: trouble and taken off a site for a month, and
Speaker 2: that is deemed abusive. Like if you repost something a
Speaker 2: man sends you that you will get in trouble. But
Speaker 2: so often when you write to people like race, like
Speaker 2: we have multiple friends who have been a part of
Speaker 2: this where they get like I'm gonna rape you. You
Speaker 2: beat beat beat beep, and yeah the sits right back,
Speaker 2: so I'm going sorry, We've we've decided this isn't abusive,
Speaker 2: and so anything towards white men you will get in trouble.
Speaker 2: Any thing that's like I will rape you. It's like, sorry,
Speaker 2: this doesn't work. But if you retweet the posts of
Speaker 2: someone threatening rape, you will then get banned. So it's like,
Speaker 2: not only are they building the sites for dudes, but
Speaker 2: like the people in charge of deciding what's abusive or
Speaker 2: not are also dudes who are probably abusive. Yeah. So oh.
Speaker 1: Anita also said women are still afraid to go to
Speaker 1: the police with stories of rape and abuse, and now
Speaker 1: we're afraid to go to the police saying I got
Speaker 1: this death threat from email or Twitter because police will
Speaker 1: look at you and say what's Twitter? She said, I've
Speaker 1: had a cop say to me, why don't you just
Speaker 1: quit your job? Why don't you just stop doing what
Speaker 1: you're doing? Like, which is you know, not surprising that
Speaker 1: cops are not either with it or smart about their suggestions.
Speaker 2: Yeah, she should have been like, cool, give me your pension. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I'll take your pension. I'm gonna need some time, I'm
Speaker 2: gonna need some money to get me started. Okay.
Speaker 1: So basically what Anita says is that game studios, developers
Speaker 1: and major publishers need to kind of speak out against
Speaker 1: this harassment of women and say that this behavior is unacceptable.
Speaker 1: And some brands have, like I believe EA Games and
Speaker 1: Stuff has said something, but like Blizzard, other game companies
Speaker 1: like haven't. And that was at the time of gamer Gate.
Speaker 1: It's possible now they have, but a lot of places
Speaker 1: like that. That is kind of where it starts, is
Speaker 1: like just in the whole gaming culture being like, Okay,
Speaker 1: this isn't it, Like this thing against women is not it?
Speaker 1: Like why don't you have problems with like this character
Speaker 1: can't run fast enough, he doesn't have enough fireballs to shoot?
Speaker 2: Like these are gaming problems? Like stop? Who? Why do
Speaker 2: you care? Who plays?
Speaker 1: What? It's really I mean, what we've been saying the
Speaker 1: whole time. So that's basically the story of Gamergate. One
Speaker 1: good thing that came out of it was in twenty nineteen,
Speaker 1: Anita founded the Game and Online Harassment Hotline, which is
Speaker 1: a free, nonprofit service for people that are being harassed
Speaker 1: in gaming or online. So that's Gameshotline dot org. And
Speaker 1: I'm going to talk a little bit more about what
Speaker 1: Anita does in our what was Sister peg jew segment,
Speaker 1: but that is Gamergate in a nutshell for now, Kara,
Speaker 1: I have.
Speaker 2: A reveal for you. You say you don't know who Adam
Speaker 2: Baldwin is.
Speaker 3: Oh god, he's CNSFU, lost reputation, Gonzel Delia Craigan gets
Speaker 3: in trouble for US allegedly killing a sex worker. Right, yes,
Speaker 3: And while he's being investigated, in comes Captain Stephen Harris
Speaker 3: for three episodes played by your man Adam Baldwin.
Speaker 2: Oh and he's like a dick, right is the next sucks?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's like an asshole that's like on yes, Oh
Speaker 2: my god. Okay, that makes sense.
Speaker 1: Okay, well, so they who started so as a button
Speaker 1: on this episode, the guy who started Gamergate played a
Speaker 1: total dick in SVU, of course, and he's like a
Speaker 1: full libertarian, right wing kind of guy.
Speaker 2: Let's get him on the pod. Listen. I don't want
Speaker 2: to talk to this bootleg Baldwin, but can't wait for
Speaker 2: everyone to listen to the interview we do have coming
Speaker 2: up next.
Speaker 1: Baby, Okay, let's get to our interview. We're so excited
Speaker 1: we got to talk to this person. She has been
Speaker 1: a regular cast member on ABC's The Fix, n NBC's
Speaker 1: Champions You might have seen her on Vampire Diaries Bones
Speaker 1: American Horror Story.
Speaker 2: I mean, she stays working.
Speaker 1: You might recognize her from SVU as Dara mclaonnie in
Speaker 1: more recent episodes, but in this today's episode, you know
Speaker 1: her as Raina Punjabi.
Speaker 2: Check out our interview with Mausam Macar. It's exciting that
Speaker 2: you did amazing in your episode and then you were
Speaker 2: asked back for many episodes and you were a fan
Speaker 2: of the show. So since you were a fan, how
Speaker 2: did it feel when you first got booked or like
Speaker 2: the audition or any of that. I was very.
Speaker 5: Excited, obviously, and I think, I know, I.
Speaker 6: Know, this was the first show that I booked that
Speaker 6: I was a fan of, that a show that I
Speaker 6: actively watched everything else I had done. There were a
Speaker 6: lot of new shows, so they hadn't been on air
Speaker 6: for that long. So when I got to set, I mean,
Speaker 6: first off, I was I just had the biggest shit
Speaker 6: eating grid when I saw Mershkah, Like at that point,
Speaker 6: we hadn't been introduced because I was coming in, you know,
Speaker 6: I think she was finishing up a previous episode, so
Speaker 6: we just passed each other in the hallway. So she
Speaker 6: didn't know who I was, or maybe she did, but
Speaker 6: she probably didn't, you know, put two and two together.
Speaker 6: I think she was just walking to set and I
Speaker 6: just had the biggest smile because I couldn't I couldn't
Speaker 6: believe I was there.
Speaker 5: And then.
Speaker 6: On my first day of filming, I had a scene
Speaker 6: with everybody, like the entire cast, and I just.
Speaker 2: The time.
Speaker 5: I was like, oh my gosh, I used to watch
Speaker 5: this from my like dorm room in college.
Speaker 6: And I'm here and and I don't I and Murushka
Speaker 6: tried to talk to me, and I really.
Speaker 5: Made the stupidest and like I could not think straight.
Speaker 5: And that was the first time I realized.
Speaker 6: I'm like, because I'm usually a person that's usually not
Speaker 6: nervous on set or anything, I'm like, oh, this, this.
Speaker 2: Is this is what it feels to be nervous.
Speaker 6: Because she would ask me very simple questions that had
Speaker 6: very simple answers, but I would just overthink it.
Speaker 5: I think.
Speaker 6: I think at one point we had filmed something and
Speaker 6: you know, and she and there was myself and another
Speaker 6: guest actor on my very first episode that I did,
Speaker 6: and he was from New York. Fantastic actor that I've
Speaker 6: worked with him again since and she looked towards two
Speaker 6: of us and asked, oh, where are you guys from?
Speaker 6: And I'd been flown in from LA and I was
Speaker 6: about to see Oh no. She asked me, are you
Speaker 6: guys from LA? And I was about to say yes,
Speaker 6: but then I was like, oh, maybe maybe she maybe
Speaker 6: she she means from LA, but I'm not from LA.
Speaker 6: I only moved to LA a few years ago. But
Speaker 6: then as I was answering, I said, oh, no, no,
Speaker 6: she probably doesn't need to know all that. She probably
Speaker 6: just wants to know if I came from LA. So
Speaker 6: it came out of my mouth was.
Speaker 5: Yeah, no, no, yeah, yeah. It was literally the response
Speaker 5: I came out of my mouth.
Speaker 6: The first things I said to Mershcaggerty as myself, not
Speaker 6: in character, and of course my guest. I was like, yes,
Speaker 6: I'm originally from New York, but you know, and he
Speaker 6: just had such so much more composed answer.
Speaker 2: I just looked at him.
Speaker 6: I was like, wow, I sound like an idiot. I
Speaker 6: sound like a truly crazy person. And then she had
Speaker 6: an yeah. And then she had another question at some
Speaker 6: point where she has, oh, I don't get to watch
Speaker 6: a lot of TV. Have you guys done a lot
Speaker 6: of TV, and I just I didn't want to come
Speaker 6: across as an experience. But I also didn't want to
Speaker 6: pretend that I'd been doing this forever. At that point,
Speaker 6: had done several guest stars, you know, but nothing, nothing
Speaker 6: too much.
Speaker 2: And I just blurted out, oh.
Speaker 6: The usual amount, which I don't know what that means.
Speaker 5: I have no idea what that means.
Speaker 2: Well, we checked out your IMDb and you are booked,
Speaker 2: you are you are working. It seems like you are busy.
Speaker 2: Yes no, thank you.
Speaker 6: I've since then, I've I've gotten a yes, no thank you.
Speaker 6: I appreciate it, but at the moment I could not
Speaker 6: make a one.
Speaker 2: Full sentence in front of Murshia.
Speaker 1: It is kind of like, I mean, I like I was.
Speaker 1: I was a Paige at Conan and I would meet
Speaker 1: famous people every day.
Speaker 2: But it wasn't until I met Tina Fey that.
Speaker 1: I was like and I had met like all these
Speaker 1: Jennifer Andison, all these big stars.
Speaker 2: But like when it's somebody.
Speaker 1: Who's work you really like admire you've been watching for
Speaker 1: so long, it's such a different kind of tongue tied experience. Really,
Speaker 1: I like to you just ran through a full conversation
Speaker 1: with mercer Harget in your mind that wasn't happening, and
Speaker 1: you were giving the answers out loud as you went.
Speaker 2: And then how did it feel to be asked back
Speaker 2: after your first episode?
Speaker 5: That was? That was fantastic.
Speaker 6: I had such a great time on my first episode.
Speaker 6: And you know, because I've been a fan of the show,
Speaker 6: I knew it's like, oh, people come back as different,
Speaker 6: you know, different characters.
Speaker 5: Sometimes that would be so great.
Speaker 6: But my first episode was such a wonderful experience and
Speaker 6: I had so much fun doing so many different things
Speaker 6: for just for that one episode. I felt truly fulfilled
Speaker 6: from that experience, so everything else just felt like a
Speaker 6: cherry on top. So yeah, when they asked me back,
Speaker 6: I was like, sure, but I was only add a
Speaker 6: couple of years ago. They're cool with that, and I'm like, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 6: they're cool with it. I'm like, great that, I'm cool
Speaker 6: with it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it is pretty cool. Close.
Speaker 1: You guys did not give the audience much time to
Speaker 1: forget about rain Now before you re emerged as a
Speaker 1: new person.
Speaker 2: Right exactly.
Speaker 1: But and who's to say, I mean, you could always
Speaker 1: come back again, right this character could be back many
Speaker 1: many times.
Speaker 6: I shot my final episode a month before COVID, and
Speaker 6: at the time the talk was, oh, we're planning to
Speaker 6: bring you back, et cetera, et cetera. So there was
Speaker 6: definitely talk of that. Of course, COVID hit and then
Speaker 6: it didn't make sense to fly in people from town
Speaker 6: with quarantine rules. So hopefully I would love to come back.
Speaker 6: It was the new character is also so fiery and
Speaker 6: feisty and you know, spunky, so it would be really
Speaker 6: fun to do.
Speaker 2: Wow. So Raina was a badass. But while she kept
Speaker 2: being like, don't give me security, I'm doing what I want.
Speaker 2: I'm not canceling the launch where you like, shut up,
Speaker 2: rain Like, were you frustrated with your character that she
Speaker 2: wasn't listening to the pros?
Speaker 6: Absolutely, for me, i'd be like, yes, give me all
Speaker 6: the precissions.
Speaker 5: I don't trust anybody out there. I've seen too many
Speaker 5: SVU episodes. I know what's going on. Yeah, but I understood.
Speaker 6: I understood her her desire to be with the people
Speaker 6: and everything. I definitely worked that in my my character
Speaker 6: homework and everything. But absolutely, when I was like, when
Speaker 6: I make a list of things, I make a list
Speaker 6: of characteristics whenever I get to play a character of
Speaker 6: you know, uh, these are the ways the characters very
Speaker 6: like me, and these are the ways that the characters
Speaker 6: are very unlike me. One of the things I definitely
Speaker 6: noted was maus of maccarr would have definitely asked for
Speaker 6: all the security possible, right up. Ajabi doesn't, you know,
Speaker 6: doesn't feel the need for this, So that was definitely
Speaker 6: one of the differing points.
Speaker 2: Wait, so did you know anything about gamer Gate before
Speaker 2: you film this? Yeah?
Speaker 6: So, I from from looking at the sides, it looked
Speaker 6: like it was inspired by that, And then as soon
Speaker 6: as I got the full script, I figured that that
Speaker 6: was going to be the inspired by true events piece
Speaker 6: of it.
Speaker 5: So I definitely looked into it a lot.
Speaker 6: And I also figured out from some of the costuming
Speaker 6: choices that they were trying to go for maybe, you know,
Speaker 6: inspired by a certain I can't remember the name of
Speaker 6: the woman, but the depth, the hoop ear rings and
Speaker 6: everything with a tied back hair.
Speaker 2: I forget.
Speaker 5: I forget the woman that it was kind of inspired by.
Speaker 1: Oh wait, I know exactly who she is, Anita Sarkisian. Yes, exactly,
Speaker 1: that's exactly it.
Speaker 6: So when we were trying out outfit looks, you know,
Speaker 6: and they're looking at earrings and outfits, I'm like, oh.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I know. Yeah.
Speaker 1: They were also definitely giving you, I feel like a
Speaker 1: young female Steve Jobs vibe some of it.
Speaker 5: Like yeah, absolutely absolutely so yeah.
Speaker 6: So going into filming, I had read up as much
Speaker 6: as I could about what the real situation was, just
Speaker 6: to figure out what doxing was and things like that,
Speaker 6: because at the time it was sort of like fresh
Speaker 6: as to what was kind of happening that was kind
Speaker 6: of happening.
Speaker 5: All across the country to people.
Speaker 6: So I remember looking up all these things at the time,
Speaker 6: So I definitely knew what was inspired by.
Speaker 2: Are you a video game person? I'm not.
Speaker 6: My husband is, so I you know, he would fill
Speaker 6: me in on some of this stuff, but even he
Speaker 6: is not like super into it. Right, I do not
Speaker 6: play any video games.
Speaker 2: He's not threatening and harassing women.
Speaker 6: I know, maybe he doesn't when I'm asleep, but from
Speaker 6: what I know, he goes to me the same time
Speaker 6: I do, and so I don't.
Speaker 2: Think he's doing that. I loved your wardrobe. I loved
Speaker 2: the white outfit so much, and like business ye, and
Speaker 2: then at the end when you decide you're going to
Speaker 2: step out of gaming. It was like a loose sweater
Speaker 2: and I didn't know if that was on purpose, like
Speaker 2: professional to lounge wear, but I liked that. Absolutely.
Speaker 6: The costume designer on it is the same woman that
Speaker 6: I've worked with throughout all my episodes, and absolutely she's fantastic.
Speaker 6: And when she brought out that first set of right outfits,
Speaker 6: I'm like, oh, Raina's going to be cool, Like yeah,
Speaker 6: it was really great. And even the hair that they did,
Speaker 6: like some when I'm doing the speech with the black
Speaker 6: jacket or vest, like I don't remember exactly what it was,
Speaker 6: but I had this awesome break down my side.
Speaker 2: It was Yeah.
Speaker 6: They were really really made her very much cutting edge
Speaker 6: cool for sure.
Speaker 2: Yeah was it hard? I mean it's one of the
Speaker 2: more graphic episodes. I would say, even it's scary, it's intense.
Speaker 2: How was it shooting such intense stuff? Prepping for it
Speaker 2: and then watching it? Was that hard? Yeah?
Speaker 6: I think it was very hard for my parents to watch.
Speaker 6: I think they were very proud of my work, but
Speaker 6: they were.
Speaker 5: I actually got a lot of like actual phone calls
Speaker 5: for my friends afterwards because I think they.
Speaker 6: Were all just very disturbed by seeing me like attacked. So,
Speaker 6: like you said, I think it was a little bit
Speaker 6: more graphic than other episodes, and I think I had
Speaker 6: a lot of friends who were like, I just needed
Speaker 6: to hear your voice and just make sure you're actually okay.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I.
Speaker 6: Know this is a show, but that that I just
Speaker 6: needed to hear your voice voice and just just make
Speaker 6: sure you were cool.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 6: I mean at the time, it was again, you know,
Speaker 6: there were everybody was great on set and everything, but yeah,
Speaker 6: it was it was definitely long days of you know,
Speaker 6: and having to get into a mental space of like.
Speaker 5: Okay, now I've been great, now I've been kidnapped. You know,
Speaker 5: It's just it's just a lot.
Speaker 2: And I would I.
Speaker 6: Remember coming home every night from filming, I would always
Speaker 6: just get some room service of ice cream and just
Speaker 6: wash HGTV.
Speaker 5: Because I was like, I just have to like physically.
Speaker 6: Shut my head down and everything down and just watch
Speaker 6: remodeling shows just so I just could just kind of
Speaker 6: wash away the day.
Speaker 5: So yeah, it was definitely.
Speaker 6: Intense, and I even remember at one point, you know,
Speaker 6: at some point it does become technical, because I remember
Speaker 6: one point I was in the I was in the
Speaker 6: hair and makeup and we were trying to figure out
Speaker 6: how how much injuries I needed because we were kind
Speaker 6: of going back and forth and I and I make
Speaker 6: a list of everything, and they were like, wait, so
Speaker 6: have you only been kidnapped or have you already been
Speaker 6: raped yet. I'm like, no, I haven't been raped yet,
Speaker 6: but I haven't I have been beaten up, so it
Speaker 6: shouldn't be as much as have been raped like we
Speaker 6: did yesterday, but it should be a little less.
Speaker 5: Like we're just going kind of going through all the
Speaker 5: timeline of it.
Speaker 6: So I just remember kind of having those conversations with
Speaker 6: the hair and makeup team trying to figure out the
Speaker 6: extent of the injuries as we go back and forth
Speaker 6: because we don't film, you know, chronologically, so those moments
Speaker 6: are kind of funny. But then you know, when you're
Speaker 6: in the space and it's like dark, and you know,
Speaker 6: and and and you're working with a sun team of like, okay,
Speaker 6: they're going to push you, and I'm like, oh right, yeah, okay, yes, yeah,
Speaker 6: let's get into this. So it just yeah, it takes
Speaker 6: a lot of like mental energy, but this I feel
Speaker 6: like this was the I don't think I've ever ever had.
Speaker 5: The chance to do so much in one episode.
Speaker 6: So that was also kind of very gratifying to be
Speaker 6: able to like really stretched myself as an actor of
Speaker 6: just like being able to present in front of a
Speaker 6: crowd like that was an amazing experience. It's like, Okay,
Speaker 6: here's a room, here's like a filled out auditorium, and
Speaker 6: you get to make a speech and all these people
Speaker 6: are cheering for you for this character.
Speaker 2: But it's like, oh my.
Speaker 6: Gosh, I bet there are actual people who have fans
Speaker 6: like this.
Speaker 2: Like it was just like, ay.
Speaker 6: There are several moments that were like I can't imagine
Speaker 6: walking into an auditorium and having like thousands of screaming
Speaker 6: fans and I'm like, and you know, my character has that,
Speaker 6: so just kind of the rush and the power and
Speaker 6: like trying to it was just like as an actor,
Speaker 6: it felt like a very full experience of like playing
Speaker 6: a powerful woman who didn't want to seem intimidated, a
Speaker 6: woman who was able to enjoy that power but then unfortunately,
Speaker 6: you know, the world getting in the way and.
Speaker 5: You know, having that power taken away.
Speaker 6: And it just it felt like a true journey for
Speaker 6: a character so that was very gratifying.
Speaker 2: What a journey, and then like the when your hands
Speaker 2: are like taped to the gun, and then that final speech,
Speaker 2: it's just like it's so power, don't I don't know
Speaker 2: powerful zword's scared. Yeah, it's very good.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean my mom had a hard time watching you,
Speaker 1: So I can't imagine how your mom felt, like, yeah
Speaker 1: all that.
Speaker 6: No, my mom was like, oh, I mean she just
Speaker 6: felt like she was like, you did such good work,
Speaker 6: but oh, I don't. I don't want to see you
Speaker 6: like that, get honey, And I'm like, I understand, I don't.
Speaker 2: I don't need to do that.
Speaker 5: In every episode of every TV show I do.
Speaker 2: Now, the important stuff was careesy hot in person. He
Speaker 2: was charming.
Speaker 5: He's super charming.
Speaker 6: He's so so such a sweetheart, a lovely, lovely guy
Speaker 6: to work with, so great, you know we yeah, we
Speaker 6: totally got along.
Speaker 2: He was lovely.
Speaker 1: Did you eventually warm up with Mushika and we're able
Speaker 1: to have some like normal conversations, Yes.
Speaker 6: Thankfully, thank you for asking that I did because the
Speaker 6: second the second time I came back, So the first
Speaker 6: time as a new character, all my scenes were with
Speaker 6: were in the courtroom, so I didn't have any scenes
Speaker 6: with her. But then the third time I came back,
Speaker 6: the episode was directed by Mrshka Oh yes, and it
Speaker 6: was really yes exactly, and I was so grateful for
Speaker 6: that because I really feel like I needed to redeem
Speaker 6: myself in front of her. And I was like, man,
Speaker 6: I'm true, I'm really not that, I'm really not that
Speaker 6: big of an idiot, and I'm really not like that,
Speaker 6: you know, unable to speak in front of celebrities, because
Speaker 6: up until that time, I was totally.
Speaker 5: Fine, and since then I've been fine.
Speaker 6: And so I was so glad I was able to
Speaker 6: come back for an episode that she directed, because she
Speaker 6: loves directing and you could really see the joy and
Speaker 6: excitement in her eyes when she's directing, like she it
Speaker 6: just feels like a it feels like a new adventure
Speaker 6: for her, I think. So for one, it was great
Speaker 6: to be directed by her, great to see how excited
Speaker 6: she was doing that. And then she's you know, because
Speaker 6: because she's an actress, she's such a kind and giving director.
Speaker 6: Like just the way she directs actors and everything is
Speaker 6: just very encouraging, very just very warm and loving. And
Speaker 6: so I finally did get to have good conversations with
Speaker 6: her and got to take selfies with her and everything,
Speaker 6: and so yeah, and so it was a much I
Speaker 6: was far more normal that time around.
Speaker 1: And we obviously looked you up online and saw that
Speaker 1: you had a career transition. So you used to work
Speaker 1: in finance before you started acting, And I'm just curious
Speaker 1: as to how that whole transition happened, And is finance
Speaker 1: as terrible as it seems to us people who do
Speaker 1: not work in finance.
Speaker 6: Sure, So I had done acting all through high school,
Speaker 6: so it wasn't like a completely new thing. But when
Speaker 6: I got to college, it was very much like, Okay,
Speaker 6: that was nice, I'm going to set that aside now
Speaker 6: and now I'm going to do something reasonable. And it wasn't,
Speaker 6: you know, the typical stereotypical all my parents told me
Speaker 6: I couldn't do acting.
Speaker 5: I was just a very logical kid who was like, you.
Speaker 6: Know, that's a hobby, and now I'm going to go
Speaker 6: into something that will make me money or you know,
Speaker 6: or just have like a stable life. A finance So
Speaker 6: I did investment banking, which is very long hours. I
Speaker 6: worked eighty to one hundred hours a week, barely saw family,
Speaker 6: and friends.
Speaker 5: I did like the job, and I liked.
Speaker 2: The people I worked with.
Speaker 6: I did it in Chicago, so I'm sure my experience
Speaker 6: would have been different in a different place.
Speaker 2: But I worked.
Speaker 6: A lot of folks I worked with in Chicago still
Speaker 6: had that like Midwestern nicety to them, so it was
Speaker 6: actually and maybe.
Speaker 5: That's the stereotype. Two.
Speaker 2: I've heard of other.
Speaker 6: Investment banks in Chicago that didn't have as good of
Speaker 6: experience as mine. I worked at a boutique bank, so
Speaker 6: my experience with them was good. It was just a
Speaker 6: tough life to keep continuing, and I realized that I
Speaker 6: couldn't imagine myself like when I thought about my life.
Speaker 2: Twenty years in the future.
Speaker 6: I just didn't see myself doing finance investment banking. And
Speaker 6: I lined up a private equity job right after. But
Speaker 6: I took a few months off to kind of find
Speaker 6: myself because there was just a lot of pressures in
Speaker 6: my life at that point, and I was like, I
Speaker 6: need to get away from every single human being I
Speaker 6: know so I can think for myself for a minute.
Speaker 2: So I took.
Speaker 5: Off for a trip to Africa and I hiked Malcolm.
Speaker 6: Njaro and did a camping Safari through the SERENGETI wo,
Speaker 6: So I had.
Speaker 2: Wait, what are you already an out doorsy person? Like
Speaker 2: they just want to know I just went.
Speaker 5: I just I was like, fuck it, I just need
Speaker 5: I truly.
Speaker 6: Was looking away to get away from everybody, from from
Speaker 6: my parents, from my coworkers, and for my boyfriend at
Speaker 6: the time.
Speaker 5: Who is now my husband. So it's fine, but there
Speaker 5: was just you know, my my.
Speaker 6: Family was pretty traditional and they wanted me to get
Speaker 6: an arranged marriage. I had a boyfriend who was not
Speaker 6: my culture or religion or anything, who was like, when
Speaker 6: what's happening with us? And then my coworker's like, oh,
Speaker 6: you should be you should be going to these business schools.
Speaker 6: And so there was just like, ah, I'm just going crazy.
Speaker 6: And I was like, where can I go where no
Speaker 6: one can reach me by email or cell phone? And
Speaker 6: I was like, if I go, if I go in
Speaker 6: the middle of the Serengetti and I'm camping, there's no
Speaker 6: internet access. But it was during this trip that I
Speaker 6: finally got a chance to just sit back and think.
Speaker 6: And there were just a couple of people I met
Speaker 6: during this trip that kind of asked like made me
Speaker 6: think about certain things for the first time and just
Speaker 6: finally made me take a step back and be like, man,
Speaker 6: when when was I just feeling truly creative and fulfilled
Speaker 6: and et cetera, et cetera. And I thought about all
Speaker 6: the times I was doing acting in high school. You know,
Speaker 6: I did like summer acting programs, And so when I
Speaker 6: came back to Chicago and started my new job, I
Speaker 6: kind of started actively figuring out how to bring that
Speaker 6: back into my life.
Speaker 5: And it started with taking Second City.
Speaker 6: Classes and doing every student film that was out there.
Speaker 6: Like literally, I was doing one every weekend because I
Speaker 6: was like, I just need to learn, gain enough experience,
Speaker 6: figure out this is what I want to do. And
Speaker 6: I got to a decision point in my life where
Speaker 6: it was I either apply and go to business school
Speaker 6: and kind of go down the finance path, or I quit.
Speaker 5: And just try acting and see what happens.
Speaker 6: And I figured if if it was awful and I
Speaker 6: just crashed and burned, it would be an interesting business
Speaker 6: school essay and I could just kind of divert back.
Speaker 1: Wow, And it paid off, and now you're you have
Speaker 1: the tools to invest your money as an actor and
Speaker 1: make it. Yeah, like you know how to turn those
Speaker 1: residuals into something to write home about.
Speaker 2: That's awesome exactly.
Speaker 6: No, yeah, that that is one of the things that
Speaker 6: I've I've noticed just from you know, because they from
Speaker 6: what a lot of a lot of my friends who've
Speaker 6: gone through acting, you know, like a college acting program.
Speaker 6: And I think it's changing now, but just like sort
Speaker 6: of like the financial tools and like how to handle
Speaker 6: your life isn't really taught two actors, you know, and
Speaker 6: hopefully that's changing now. But yeah, absolutely I didn't know
Speaker 6: what to do and I kind of had all those
Speaker 6: tools everything in place.
Speaker 2: And yeah, save some money for taxes exactly, and then
Speaker 2: you know, and I make sure your business manager is
Speaker 2: not stealing all your money. You know. Yes, it's awful.
Speaker 5: Do you hear stories like that?
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, no, I yeah.
Speaker 6: And it also gave me, you know, I had savings,
Speaker 6: so I was able to like get coaching for things.
Speaker 6: Because I was so raw and new, I didn't have
Speaker 6: a formal training program, so I got I worked with
Speaker 6: acting coaches and then finally did a conservatory. So yeah,
Speaker 6: it gave me, gave me the ability to just learn
Speaker 6: and everything while I was still working. And so yes,
Speaker 6: I'm very grateful that I And it also gave the
Speaker 6: work style of investment bankers just so intense. So I
Speaker 6: pretty much just tried to apply that into my acting world.
Speaker 2: What was the first job you booked that you were like, Yeah,
Speaker 2: I'm this is it. I'm killing it. I'm going to
Speaker 2: be able to like work.
Speaker 6: Oh sure, Well the first TV that I booked, which
Speaker 6: actually is funny. So my episode, my first episode of
Speaker 6: SVU was directed by the same director that directed me
Speaker 6: for the very first time in television. They're both Dick Wolf.
Speaker 6: I did Chicago Fire. Oh so Chicago.
Speaker 2: Fire was my very very.
Speaker 5: First episode of TV.
Speaker 6: And so it all felt very full circle because SVU
Speaker 6: was such a big get for me because at that
Speaker 6: time that was the biggest guest star i'd done.
Speaker 5: I'd done a bunch of smaller guest.
Speaker 6: Stars, but that was sort of like the biggest main
Speaker 6: you know, guest star. So and to have it be
Speaker 6: directed by the very first director that I ever worked
Speaker 6: with on TV was was really lovely.
Speaker 2: And then since you are an SVU fan, I would
Speaker 2: like to ask, like, what are your favorite episodes or
Speaker 2: das or like what yeah, stuff like that, Like, what
Speaker 2: are your favorite SVU characters and episodes.
Speaker 6: Right, Well, I I don't watch it as regularly as
Speaker 6: I used to. I think when I was in college
Speaker 6: and stuff.
Speaker 2: I used to.
Speaker 6: I mean, whenever there was an SVU marathon on, I
Speaker 6: would watch it. I'd get I didn't have cable in
Speaker 6: my home. So when we go to a hotel room,
Speaker 6: if there was an SVU marathon on, I'd be like,
Speaker 6: I need to set aside a few hours.
Speaker 2: Just for this.
Speaker 5: I know we're on vacation, but I'm gonna need to
Speaker 5: watch a few hours of SVU.
Speaker 2: But oh, what is it?
Speaker 5: Novak? I love Novak?
Speaker 6: Oh yeah, I love I mean, I loved all the
Speaker 6: female das I loved. I'm trying to remember. I think
Speaker 6: Novak was probably my favorite one. I love the new
Speaker 6: crew that they have now too, and also because that's
Speaker 6: why I worked with, so it feels a little bit
Speaker 6: more like, oh, I know them, They're so great, They're lovely,
Speaker 6: you know. All the others are just more like, oh,
Speaker 6: I just you know, I just admire them.
Speaker 1: From Afar, do you have any episodes that like stick
Speaker 1: out to you as like we like to say haunting,
Speaker 1: because I feel like your episode is like it's like
Speaker 1: very fucked up. So I'm like, what's your version of
Speaker 1: like watching this episode?
Speaker 2: Sure?
Speaker 6: Sure, I think there was an episode where Novac played
Speaker 6: I can't remember the actress's name now, Yes, did she
Speaker 6: initially come as as like an attacker?
Speaker 2: Yes? Oh yeah she could killed a stripper.
Speaker 6: Yes, that episode because like where like the tables are turned,
Speaker 6: that always like sticks out in my mind. It was like,
Speaker 6: oh wow, it can it can happen, It can happen
Speaker 6: to anybody type of thing. And I remember that episode
Speaker 6: also because of Novak and I was like, oh, she
Speaker 6: came on the show before she was da so and
Speaker 6: she was so great in that role, Like it was
Speaker 6: just it was just nice to see that, like, oh
Speaker 6: she's kind of rotten in this one and not. And
Speaker 6: so that episode is always the one I think.
Speaker 1: Yeah, she actually she actually rapes a stripper and kills
Speaker 1: one of her friends.
Speaker 5: Yes, yes, yes, yes.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, No, I just you know, I mean the
Speaker 1: fans will tell. So, yeah, but what are you working
Speaker 1: on right now? We saw you're doing a project with
Speaker 1: Ava du Verney, which is it sounds cool called Naomi.
Speaker 6: Yes, yes, what we got So it's a brand new show.
Speaker 6: It's a CW show in the DC World comic books.
Speaker 6: It's it's based on a brand new comic called Naomi
Speaker 6: that came out in twenty nineteen, I believe, So it's
Speaker 6: a whole new world, but it is in the world
Speaker 6: of Superman.
Speaker 2: So it's in that world.
Speaker 3: Now.
Speaker 6: I don't know if it I don't know if it's
Speaker 6: in like the Aero Verse world of the CW, but
Speaker 6: it is in the world of Superman. And so we
Speaker 6: shot the pilot in March, and we got the series
Speaker 6: pickup order last month or yes, last month, No, this,
Speaker 6: I don't.
Speaker 2: Remember one of these months.
Speaker 6: And we're going to start shooting the first season, hopefully
Speaker 6: in August, so that will be the thing that I'm doing.
Speaker 5: It's a great, great story.
Speaker 6: It's about a black girl who starts to discover that
Speaker 6: she has power. So she's she would be one of
Speaker 6: the youngest superheroes out there. She's a sixteen year old
Speaker 6: girl going about her life in this ideal like little, tiny,
Speaker 6: sort of like army based town and then things start
Speaker 6: happening to her, and it's the story is kind of
Speaker 6: about her journey of discovering who she is and how
Speaker 6: she fits into the world of Superman and you know,
Speaker 6: just that whole coming of.
Speaker 5: Age story, but with superheroes.
Speaker 2: Wait and what's so what's your role?
Speaker 5: So I play Naomi's adoptive mom.
Speaker 2: Oh okay, whoa huge Yeah?
Speaker 6: So yeah, so it's pretty it's pretty exciting. So myself
Speaker 6: and Barry Watson from uh Seventh Heaven, baby seventh Heaven exactly,
Speaker 6: So he and I yeah, we're her parents.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. That's fun. You guys are like a hot couple.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I appreciate it. I can see it.
Speaker 6: So yeah, it's going to be a spring show on cw'
Speaker 6: so it'll air early twenty twenty two.
Speaker 2: Mouson was awesome. I mean, the fact that she has
Speaker 2: anyone with a Chicago story or two always catches my Yes,
Speaker 2: I know that.
Speaker 1: That's a heartwarmer for you, a great way in for
Speaker 1: the Lisa troupe anyone wants to know Liza Trup.
Speaker 2: But also just you know, anything about following your dreams,
Speaker 2: hiking a mountain, ending up like serendipitous moments of like
Speaker 2: working with someone and remembering them and having moments like
Speaker 2: I liked the thoughtfulness and all of her stories.
Speaker 1: Yeah, she seems like just so genuinely nice person and
Speaker 1: that's seems to be paying all for most of the
Speaker 1: people that we interview. Sorry, bad news, assholes. But let's
Speaker 1: get into today's post mortem. What did we learn from
Speaker 1: intimidation game? Lisa, I'm just not going to go anywhere
Speaker 1: near video games because I'm not interested in them, but
Speaker 1: not because I'm a woman.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll I guess I learned that people that like
Speaker 2: shooter games can't have any other games or they s
Speaker 2: been out of control. Like I guess that's what I learned,
Speaker 2: That everyone's out of their fucking minds. It's just it's
Speaker 2: interesting because the idea of.
Speaker 1: Corruption in journalism is like, there's so much corruption in
Speaker 1: journalism and to focus it on video games is so
Speaker 1: bonkers to me, like ethics and gaming, Like there are
Speaker 1: ethical breaches happening all over the fucking world, Like there
Speaker 1: are people abusing institutions, abusing their power. Like it's just
Speaker 1: crazy where people are taking their stand. But that we
Speaker 1: learned today that they are very serious about it and
Speaker 1: they have a lot of tech savvy to make your
Speaker 1: life a living hell if you enter their world.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Also, if the police offer extra protections for a
Speaker 2: giant event that's gotten death threats, say yes, yeah, take yeah,
Speaker 2: take it. Take some playing clothes officers and a couple
Speaker 2: of German shepherds, you know, for the safety of everybody,
Speaker 2: some free security, and turn it down. No. I wouldn't
Speaker 2: never turn that down ever, ever, ever. Also I don't
Speaker 2: know Logan Paul, get out of here. Also, your kids
Speaker 2: are creeps. You don't know everything about your kid. Your
Speaker 2: kid doesn't tell you everything. Yes, your kid is a rapist.
Speaker 2: He's going to jail. Stop protecting him. My son would
Speaker 2: never Well, guess what we have proof? I don't know.
Speaker 2: That's a screen name, that's a screen game. Raise your
Speaker 2: fucking kids better. Yeah, oh my gosh. And also, don't
Speaker 2: ever try to play games with any of the detectives
Speaker 2: because guess what, Ice teas around the corner and he's
Speaker 2: about to shoot your ass. He's about to add light
Speaker 2: your ass up. People forget they ad all cocky. Guess
Speaker 2: what Iced Tea's waiting, he's behind the corner.
Speaker 1: His t should do that, he should do like play
Speaker 1: fucking whatever Skyrim with iced Tea for charity, like or something.
Speaker 2: I bet that would make a lot of money. People
Speaker 2: would love to game with iced Tea.
Speaker 1: I think he's a shit talker and a half in
Speaker 1: those little headsets, those little Madonna headsets gamers use, and yes, gamers,
Speaker 1: I'm calling the Madonna headsets. That's my frame of that's
Speaker 1: my point of reference for a front microphone.
Speaker 2: But it is wild because video games everyone plays. It's
Speaker 2: so is this outdated? I wonder or is this still
Speaker 2: a real thing? Because you know, Tricksy Mattel, she's she's
Speaker 2: twitching all the time I'm playing games, and I guess
Speaker 2: she is a guy. But and then like this porn star.
Speaker 2: I love Adriana chechick. She's always she's always twitching. She
Speaker 2: did a twenty four hour twitch stream of a video game.
Speaker 2: And when sometimes she'll beat a game and she'll cry
Speaker 2: and be like, I can't believe it. That took me
Speaker 2: sixteen hours. So and but I don't know if it's
Speaker 2: just perverts watching her play or game addicts, Like, I
Speaker 2: don't know, Probably a mix of both. Probably a mix
Speaker 2: of both. Yeah, yeah, her house looks great, Adriana, if
Speaker 2: you're listening, let me swim in your pool. Let me
Speaker 2: swim in your pool. I'm ready. Do you think if
Speaker 2: I DM her she'll let me swim in her pool?
Speaker 2: It's a great question, like can I dog sit for you?
Speaker 2: I want to be in your backyard.
Speaker 1: Yeah, to have like a verified on Instagram dog sitter
Speaker 1: sounds like, you know.
Speaker 2: What could go wrong? We follow each other? Oh yeah, I.
Speaker 1: Think you can slide into those dms with your dog
Speaker 1: pool requests.
Speaker 2: Be like, remember me, I waited in line to meet
Speaker 2: you at a pornhub pop up in New York. We've
Speaker 2: done some professional work together, but that is not porn. No,
Speaker 2: that makes it sound like you've done porn with her.
Speaker 1: Oh no, I did a Brasser's roast. Yes, I remember that.
Speaker 1: That looked really really fun.
Speaker 2: I did work at the Avens and it was like
Speaker 2: I was in a room getting makeup done with all
Speaker 2: these like naked porn stars. But she was like, what
Speaker 2: do you want for your makeup? And I was like,
Speaker 2: I don't want other people to think that I think
Speaker 2: that I'm a porn star. I was very carry Bradshaw
Speaker 2: in the real episode where I'm like, I don't want
Speaker 2: people to think that I'm a porn It's like can you?
Speaker 2: And then they made my makeup like I was a
Speaker 2: porn and I'm like, I just don't want people to
Speaker 2: think i'm deluged, like I just I don't know what
Speaker 2: you want for me, Like like I'm here to get
Speaker 2: can I just look like a comic? But and what
Speaker 2: was crazy? I mean, this has nothing to do with
Speaker 2: gamer Gate. I very apologize to anyone that wants a
Speaker 2: full on post mortem. But the funny a funny tale
Speaker 2: was all these girls that was getting my makeup done with.
Speaker 2: They were talking shit about this one porn star and
Speaker 2: they're like, she's so fucking ugly and annoying. And I
Speaker 2: had masturbated to her that morning, but I didn't want
Speaker 2: to say anything because I was like, I guess you
Speaker 2: guys fucking hate her, but I don't think she's ugly.
Speaker 2: But I just like sat listening to them talk about her.
Speaker 1: Wow, Lisa, you just stood idly by while someone who
Speaker 1: had just given you pleasure moments earlier is getting raked
Speaker 1: across the calls by her coworkers.
Speaker 2: Well because I'm in their space, you know, so I'm like,
Speaker 2: of course, shll I joke. I wouldn't expect that. I
Speaker 2: should have been like, you know what, I like her,
Speaker 2: and you guys are all bitches, Like I don't know,
Speaker 2: see you on the red carpet. I hope you talked
Speaker 2: to me like that would have been crazy? What else? Oh,
Speaker 2: the first thing ever is getting your hands taped to
Speaker 2: a gun? Oh god? Yeah, So if you're a book
Speaker 2: an officer, maybe look out for that. I don't know.
Speaker 1: Anyway, let's move on to what would Sister Peg do? Segment,
Speaker 1: which we are going to highlight this week, which every week,
Speaker 1: you know, what would Sister Peg do? We highlight an organization,
Speaker 1: give you a piece of reading, an article or a
Speaker 1: book or something that can give you more info on
Speaker 1: the episode that we talked about today, And today we're
Speaker 1: going to focus in on Anita Sarkisian's organization, which is
Speaker 1: called Feminist Frequency. It's Feminist Frequency dot com and their
Speaker 1: goal is to end abuse in the games industry and
Speaker 1: they also establish, i think, as we mentioned, the gaming
Speaker 1: industry's first games and Online Harassment hotline, which is a
Speaker 1: tech based support resource for people who struggle from abuse online.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the website has a weekly podcast, tons.
Speaker 1: Of resources, so go check that out if you are
Speaker 1: interested in any more info.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for that, Kara, And next week
Speaker 2: we will be doing at Charisma for all you sick
Speaker 2: fucks out there. Season six, Episode seven, check it out
Speaker 2: on Hulu, Peacock, or wherever you steal some SVU thank
Speaker 2: you so much for always tuning in and being such
Speaker 2: great listeners, and we'll see you next week. Bye. That's
Speaker 2: Messed Up as an Exactly Right production.
Speaker 1: If you have compliments you'd like to give us or
Speaker 1: episodes you'd like us to cover, shoot us an email
Speaker 1: at That's Messed uppod at gmail dot com.
Speaker 2: Follow the podcast on Instagram at That's Messed Up Pod
Speaker 2: and on Twitter at Messed Up Pod, and follow us
Speaker 2: personally at Kara Clank and at Glittercheese.
Speaker 1: As always, please see our show notes for sources and
Speaker 1: more information.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much to SVU super fan and our
Speaker 2: incredible producer, Hannah Kyle Kraton.
Speaker 1: And to our sound engineer and personal hero Onali Snilson,
Speaker 1: and to Henry Kaperski for our theme song, to Carly
Speaker 1: Jean Andrews for our artwork. Thanks to our executive producers
Speaker 1: Georgia Hardstar, Karen Kilgarriff, Daniel Kramer, and everybody at Exactly
Speaker 1: Right Media.
Speaker 2: Listen, subscribe, leave us a review on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher,
Speaker 2: or wherever you get your podcasts. If you're an advertiser
Speaker 2: interested in advertising on our show, go to midroll dot com.
Speaker 2: Slash ads done done,