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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. Bloomberg Tech is alive

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Speaker 1: from coast to coast with Caroline Hide in New York

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Speaker 1: and ever though in San Francisco.

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Speaker 2: This is Bloomberg Tech coming up. Google's thinking about the

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Speaker 2: next phase of its TPU program and that moves markets

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Speaker 2: will have the latest.

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Speaker 3: Plus ast space mobile shares plunge after the Blue Origin

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Speaker 3: space launch miss over the weekend. We also spoke the

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Speaker 3: Blue Origin CEO.

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Speaker 2: And IPOs are so back, Sarah brass IPO is back

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Speaker 2: on the table months after we're drawing a previous attempt.

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Speaker 3: So first we check in on these markets, which are

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Speaker 3: dictated by geopolitics once more. And look on the day

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Speaker 3: we are down on the Nasdaq one hundred to the

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Speaker 3: tune of seven teens percent. We're actually heading session loans.

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Speaker 3: Why the latest headlines coming from President Trump that the

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Speaker 3: ceasefire that currently is holding the truth that they had

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Speaker 3: put in place for two weeks is unlikely to not

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Speaker 3: be extended. It's unlikely to be pushed forward, even as

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Speaker 3: though we anticipate some talks to kick start once again

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Speaker 3: over in Pakistan on Wednesday. Now, there's also concerns really

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Speaker 3: about the Horll moves, the straight of horm moves likely

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Speaker 3: to remain blocked ed. What this means is that the

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Speaker 3: streak of tech stock wins is likely to be coming

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Speaker 3: to an end. We're up a eleven point six percent

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Speaker 3: of the thirteen days. If it had held for a

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Speaker 3: fourteenth day of gains, that would have been the longest

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Speaker 3: winning street since before you were born nineteen eighty five,

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Speaker 3: according to our own Dan Curtis, and that's the Nasdaq

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Speaker 3: and A's at one hundred. What looks like it's not

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Speaker 3: going to be a fourteenth day.

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Speaker 2: En it would be before I was born. There's a

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Speaker 2: big focus right now on Google's TPU program. There's a

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Speaker 2: report from the Information that there are talks between Google

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Speaker 2: and Marvel about an inferenced specific TPU somewhere in the future.

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Speaker 2: By the way, that's a report and story that Google

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Speaker 2: is declining to common and full stop, but it's moving

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Speaker 2: markets in the sense that Marvell is getting a big

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Speaker 2: boost from it. Separate to that, Bloomberg's reporting that Google

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Speaker 2: plans to announce its new generation of TPUs at an

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Speaker 2: event in Las Vegas this week. Let's get the details

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Speaker 2: on that with Bloomberg's AI Infrastructure reporter Dina Bass. So

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Speaker 2: much focus on the TPU program, right, Google's own use

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Speaker 2: of it and then the expansion of it to third

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Speaker 2: party customers andthropics. One that you and I have reported on, right,

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Speaker 2: What are they going to tell us in Las Vegas

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Speaker 2: this week? What is the future of the TPU program.

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Speaker 4: So what we're reporting is they're probably going to announce

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Speaker 4: an inference chip, you know, for running AI models after

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Speaker 4: they've been trained. Thus far, they've been doing training and

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Speaker 4: inference in one chip. You know, we are expecting and

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Speaker 4: reporting that they're probably going to announce something separate just

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Speaker 4: for inference. At Google chief scientist Jeff Dean told me

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Speaker 4: in an interview, Look, you know the way inference demand

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Speaker 4: is growing called it now becomes sensible to specialized chips,

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Speaker 4: more for training and more for inference workloads, and that

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Speaker 4: they're looking at a bunch of things. Their chip chief,

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Speaker 4: i mean VIDAT declined to tell me specifically whether they're

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Speaker 4: going to announce that this week, but you know said

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Speaker 4: we'd be hearing more soon. And this continues sort of

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Speaker 4: a trend. You know, in Nvidia announced a fast inference

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Speaker 4: chip from what they'd acquired from GROC you mentioned before

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Speaker 4: the Cerebrase IPO that's also at this point really a

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Speaker 4: lowly in seafast inference play.

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Speaker 3: Meanwhile, the play has been extraordinary with TPUs and the

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Speaker 3: adoption by many would call even rivals Meta likely wanting

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Speaker 3: in on the Google made chips. So how are they

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Speaker 3: broadening and where do you think they're going to be

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Speaker 3: getting supply from? More broadly, there's a lot of reporting

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Speaker 3: in the market, for example, that maybe they turned to

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Speaker 3: Marvel versus Broadcom.

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Speaker 5: I know you can't coment on that.

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Speaker 3: Directly, but how are they thinking about their own supply chain?

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Speaker 4: Look, I think for them, supply, excuse me, supply is

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Speaker 4: a problem. I was talking to Google Deep my n CEO,

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Speaker 4: Demesis Savias.

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Speaker 6: He mentioned that as well.

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Speaker 4: Look, you have Meta, which signed they told us, a

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Speaker 4: multi billion, multi year deal to use TPUs. They're just

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Speaker 4: getting their first big tranche of them. They're trying to

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Speaker 4: figure out what they're going to do with them. Anthropic

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Speaker 4: has a huge deal, Citadel is going to talk about

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Speaker 4: how they're using TPUs at the Google Next conference this week.

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Speaker 4: And what Demis was telling me was that, uh, you know,

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Speaker 4: contrary to what Jensen Wank said last week on the

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Speaker 4: Dark Hush Fatal podcast that you know, it's really just

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Speaker 4: anthropic that wants them. They actually you know, have a

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Speaker 4: lot of people that are interested. They don't have enough supply.

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Speaker 4: Uh he was Demis was saying to me, Look, you know,

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Speaker 4: what they end up doing is prioritizing the you know,

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Speaker 4: top of the line frontier lab customers, because those are

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Speaker 4: the customers who are most capable of taking advantage of

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Speaker 4: what TPU has to offer.

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Speaker 7: You know.

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Speaker 4: More broadly, I think the TPU play, and this is

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Speaker 4: why it appeals to these big frontier labs, is that

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Speaker 4: Google is the only, you know, maker of a large,

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Speaker 4: top of the line frontier model, one of the top

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Speaker 4: you know models that also makes uh you know, AI

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Speaker 4: accelerator chips in a large volume, has said they will

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Speaker 4: as well.

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Speaker 2: I think that's why it's worth lingering for a minute

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Speaker 2: on why the TPU is useful. So you explained really

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Speaker 2: well that to this point, the TPU tensor processing unit

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Speaker 2: has basically been a general purpose accelerator training or inference.

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Speaker 2: But when you put it side by side, as many

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Speaker 2: people try to do against Nvidia's latest GPU or other

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Speaker 2: inference specific chips, you know what is it about Google

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Speaker 2: owning the architecture, about designing it for specifically the inference

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Speaker 2: use case that makes it better. Is it money, is

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Speaker 2: it power? What do we need to know?

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Speaker 4: Well, Google's argument is that it is the fact that

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Speaker 4: they know what you need for training and running a

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Speaker 4: top of the line model. There are you know, two

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Speaker 4: things in the last couple of months that have really

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Speaker 4: increased the interest in Google TPU. One is the Anthropic deal,

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Speaker 4: which was a validation of the technology. The other was

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Speaker 4: sort of the release of the latest version of Gemini,

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Speaker 4: which was trained and is running its inference on Google TPU,

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Speaker 4: and the you know, strong reviews that it's gotten. Google

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Speaker 4: uses data and requests and information from their own AI

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Speaker 4: model teams to figure out what they need to prioritize

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Speaker 4: and frankly, what they need to.

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Speaker 6: Fix in the chip business.

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Speaker 4: They you know, they work together to figure out that,

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Speaker 4: for example, Google TPU wasn't doing you know, utilization was

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Speaker 4: too low on those chips when you were using it

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Speaker 4: for reinforcement learning. Demis was telling me they're using it

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Speaker 4: to figure out, you know, how precise the chips have

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Speaker 4: to be as opposed to where they can save money.

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Speaker 4: And that's sort of a set of data that flows

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Speaker 4: into the Google TPU design team that other you know,

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Speaker 4: other chip makers don't necessarily have. And Vidia does have

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Speaker 4: a very you know, solid model team. But you know,

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Speaker 4: among the big three anthropic open AI, Google, you know,

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Speaker 4: for frontier models, Google is the only one making AI

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Speaker 4: accelerator chips at volume right now.

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Speaker 5: Databas is a great story.

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Speaker 3: Can't wait to see what comes out at the Vegas event.

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Speaker 5: We appreciate you joining today. Now let's just dwell a

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Speaker 5: little bit more on tech stocks.

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Speaker 3: They are taking a pause like the rest of the

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Speaker 3: market today from their recent winning streak, and that's as

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Speaker 3: investors navigate concerns so peace talks between the US and Iran.

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Speaker 3: But let's discuss the tech outlook in particular with Anna Rathman,

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Speaker 3: CEO of Grenadilla Advisory, and once again geopolitics comes to

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Speaker 3: the forefront. But the fundamentals of tech are they vindicating

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Speaker 3: the valuations because boy, if we had a run up of.

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Speaker 7: Late yes, I mean, I think it's difficult to value

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Speaker 7: tech at this point, especially with AI, just because just

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Speaker 7: a few weeks ago, pre war, we were worried about

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Speaker 7: the six hundred and fifty billion dollar AI infrastructure spent

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Speaker 7: by the hyperscalers, and today we're not really talking about that.

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Speaker 7: In fact, we're wondering if we have enough capacity. And

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Speaker 7: you know, frankly, the previous reporting about Google's TPUs, I mean,

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Speaker 7: we can have all of these deals right looking forward

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Speaker 7: to twenty twenty seven, twenty twenty eight.

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Speaker 2: At the end of the.

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Speaker 7: Day, it really is about shortages, right, And this is

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Speaker 7: where the geopolitics really comes in as well well, as

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Speaker 7: you know, we're hearing it from the manufacturers and the

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Speaker 7: ism manufacturing in disease. So I think that the valuation

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Speaker 7: is really difficult for tech because computing computing needs are real,

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Speaker 7: but you need to you need real assets in order

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Speaker 7: to build real assets, which are the picks and shovels

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Speaker 7: of the AI story. So I mean, I think we're

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Speaker 7: kind of in a quandary here.

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Speaker 3: So does that mean on don't do anything s done

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Speaker 3: pat until we get clarity at least on the geopolitical

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Speaker 3: side of the equation, which in and of itself affects

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Speaker 3: the supply chain of chip manufacturing. For example, helium that

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Speaker 3: can't get through will mose right now.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, I think AI is one of those stories when

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Speaker 7: it takes off. It takes off, and it's going to

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Speaker 7: be difficult to catch. So in terms of investing, I

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Speaker 7: think you stay invested. If you are invested in hyperscalers,

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Speaker 7: you're already exposed to a lot of data centers. Perhaps

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Speaker 7: think of some of the adjacent industries of manufacturing and industrials.

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Speaker 7: As far as the war is concerned, it's difficult to

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Speaker 7: price that in as well. I mean that the story

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Speaker 7: is very different today from last week, but I do

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Speaker 7: think that the markets have sort of priced in not

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Speaker 7: a binary outcome of will we have a deal versus

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Speaker 7: will we not have a deal. I think what the

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Speaker 7: market is pricing in is this very wobbly, very messy

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Speaker 7: ceasefire that might continue.

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Speaker 4: For a while.

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Speaker 2: So I find this really interesting. We've spent a lot

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Speaker 2: of time emphasizing that then as that one hundred had

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Speaker 2: this amazing thirteen days streak, and people seem to forget

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Speaker 2: that before that thirteen day period there was a big

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Speaker 2: sell off in technology shares, and if you look at

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Speaker 2: like some of the Goldman Prime brokerage data, you know,

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Speaker 2: hedge funds were dumping out of US tech stocks software

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Speaker 2: in particular. Why is it do you think that the

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Speaker 2: investors sort of then felt that the calm to start

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Speaker 2: buying almost immediately as the war was taking place.

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Speaker 7: Well, you know, I don't think the investors were waiting

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Speaker 7: for the calm. I think the investors were waiting for

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Speaker 7: some bottom where it felt cheap enough to come in,

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Speaker 7: because again, the AI story is a long term story.

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Speaker 6: Even software.

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Speaker 7: I think it was more of a sledgehammer tool that

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Speaker 7: we were using to knock out all of the software indiscriminately.

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Speaker 7: And now software is still going to be pressured in

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Speaker 7: my opinion because of AI AI native AI stories, but

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Speaker 7: I think at this point we may be applying more

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Speaker 7: of a scalpel rather than a sledgehammer.

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Speaker 6: So from that.

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Speaker 7: Perspective, everything was oversald. So I think investors just look

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Speaker 7: for a cheaper point to enter the market.

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Speaker 2: Technology earnings start big time in Earnest this week in

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Speaker 2: some sense. What do you think will happen? What do

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Speaker 2: you think what kind of bar do you think is

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Speaker 2: set for investors for this tech earning season.

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Speaker 7: Well, you know, if we look at some of the

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Speaker 7: international tech stocks that we've heard from, such as TSMC

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Speaker 7: and ASML, I mean that demanded story.

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Speaker 6: Is here and real, and you know in the future

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Speaker 6: as well.

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Speaker 7: So I do expect a demand story to continue. Whether

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Speaker 7: or not the companies are actually poised to capture that

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Speaker 7: is another story. That's a corporate story, that's a management story.

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Speaker 7: So one in particular that I might be a little

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Speaker 7: bit nervous about would be Intel just because of the

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Speaker 7: recent history, just because of some of the issues with

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Speaker 7: the foundries. Other than that, I'm still pretty constructive on

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Speaker 7: Tech and we'll see what they actually report this week.

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Speaker 2: Anna Rathbun and Grenadilla Advisory, thank you very much. Now

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Speaker 2: coming up, Blue Origins New Glens successfully reuses a booster

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Speaker 2: for the first time, but the mission also delivers a

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Speaker 2: major setback for the payload that was on board. We're

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Speaker 2: going to hear from Blue Origin CEO Dave Limb Next,

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Speaker 2: this is Blueberg Tech.

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Speaker 4: It was a.

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Speaker 2: Story of both success and failure for Blue Origin Space

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Speaker 2: launch over the weekend. For the first time, the Jeff

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Speaker 2: Bezos company reused a booster for its New Glen rocket

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Speaker 2: and landed it successfully, but the satellite it was carrying

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Speaker 2: for ast Space Mobile wasn't placed in the correct orbit

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Speaker 2: and is quote too low to sustain operations, and.

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Speaker 3: It was painful if you own the shares of AST

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Speaker 3: Space Mobile. Therefore, look rocketing back down to Earth down

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Speaker 3: nine percent for AST's Space Mobile.

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Speaker 5: At one point it.

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Speaker 3: Was off by fourteen percent. And this off nominal orbit

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Speaker 3: means a lot for a company that needs to get

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Speaker 3: about fourteen up in this year.

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Speaker 2: Yes, you know he is a paying customer of Blue Origin.

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Speaker 2: And if you go on social media and you look

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Speaker 2: at Jeff Bezos or Dave Limp, the CEO, they were

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Speaker 2: celebrating the Blue Origin part that they landed the booster.

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Speaker 2: They reused the boosters only the third time New Glens flown.

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Speaker 2: But basically the satellite that they were sending into orbit

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Speaker 2: was in the wrong place and it doesn't have the

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Speaker 2: means in terms of frousters to move itself, so they

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Speaker 2: deorbit it and the insurance company actually comes in and

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Speaker 2: pays for it.

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Speaker 3: And that's what's word about AST Space Mobile sort of

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Speaker 3: being the one that bears the brunt here because they

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Speaker 3: get the money back from the insurance, but it needs

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Speaker 3: to get its satellites back up there to be able

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Speaker 3: in a swift succession to allow you and I to

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Speaker 3: make the calls that we want to do. Look Scotiabank

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Speaker 3: analyst Dress Concelo was sort of saying, look, even though

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Speaker 3: the reusable Blustellan is successfully, the mission was a failure,

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Speaker 3: and the Bluebirds seven failure highlights the need for well

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Speaker 3: more redundancy backup plans right for these failing units.

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Speaker 2: For it's a black eye for Blue Origin because they

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Speaker 2: part of their business plan is to put satellites into

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Speaker 2: orbit for customers. But again, they really needed the rocket

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Speaker 2: itself to work, and it did. I spoke to Blue

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Speaker 2: Origin CEO Dave Limb, but that was ahead of the launch.

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Speaker 2: We talked big picture about the company's future, and this

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Speaker 2: is what he had to say about the new GM program.

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Speaker 8: I think it'd be a really good year if we

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Speaker 8: could do you know, eight to twelve flights this year,

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Speaker 8: up from two last year, that would be that, you know,

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Speaker 8: that'd be a good cadence for us. I can see

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Speaker 8: a path that we have plenty of hardware to do that.

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Speaker 8: It really is what we learn from the flights.

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Speaker 6: I would tell you that there's there's never been.

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Speaker 8: A time where launch is in such demand, and by

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Speaker 8: the way, I think the demand's going up with all

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Speaker 8: these directed device announcements Amazon made one obviously, other AST

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Speaker 8: is doing directed device and these mega constellations. We have

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Speaker 8: our own constellation. We announced with Taro Wave that laun

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Speaker 8: if I if I could fly a rocket every week

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Speaker 8: right now, I would be sold out for the indefinite future.

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Speaker 8: And so our job is to get out there, get

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Speaker 8: as fast a cadence as we can, as quickly as possible.

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Speaker 8: And the foundation of that, again is just to build

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Speaker 8: a world class manufacturing business. And you know, that's something

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Speaker 8: I've done for a long time, and the team's done

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Speaker 8: for a long time, and I think we're on the

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Speaker 8: right path. We still have ways to go, but I'm

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Speaker 8: I'm excited about the progress.

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Speaker 2: The world became familiar with Blue Origin through New Shepherd,

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Speaker 2: the smaller form factor launch system, and the first focus

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Speaker 2: of that was kind of space tourism, you know, going

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Speaker 2: to a pretty low altitude relatively speaking, for a few

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Speaker 2: minutes of weightlessness. And you know, of course I was

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Speaker 2: in Van Horn, Texas when Jeff Bezos himself went up.

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Speaker 2: But you took the decision to halt that program in

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Speaker 2: large part to focus on Blues participation in getting America

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Speaker 2: back to the Moon. And so you know, in the

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Speaker 2: first instance, Dave, what has the result of that decision been.

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Speaker 2: Have you been able to accelerate that other program, the

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Speaker 2: lunar program? How have you moved and reassigned resource and

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Speaker 2: people to fulfill that ambition?

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Speaker 8: Yeah, you know, we were able to fly ninety eight

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Speaker 8: people above the Carmen line. I've never seen so many

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Speaker 8: smiles on every astronaut we were able to do that

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Speaker 8: for And I think if you had to make the

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Speaker 8: decision to put New Shepherd on pause, we put on

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Speaker 8: pause for at least two years. With your heart, it

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Speaker 8: would have been a very hard decision because you see that,

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Speaker 8: you saw it when you saw Jeff fly. Every customer

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Speaker 8: is the happiest customer you've ever seen. But when you

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Speaker 8: make it, when you make that decision with your head,

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Speaker 8: it was probably one of the simpler business decisions that

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Speaker 8: I and Jeff have ever made, because you know, I

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Speaker 8: am so passionate about.

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Speaker 6: Getting the US back to the Moon, as is Jeff.

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Speaker 8: It's you know, I don't think the country wants another

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Speaker 8: spot Nik moment. We have been saying it blue for

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Speaker 8: twenty plus years that the Moon is this incredible gift

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Speaker 8: given to us. You know, it's three days away, It's

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Speaker 8: got all the resources that we'll ever need right there

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Speaker 8: at least for the foreseeable millennium ahead of us, and.

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Speaker 6: We know how to get there.

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Speaker 3: Through Origin CEO Dave Lim there speaking with it over

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Speaker 3: the course of the weekend. And coming up we are

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Speaker 3: talking Apple's revab criy.

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Speaker 5: It may have been revealed more on that. Next there's

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Speaker 5: a broombag tech.

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Speaker 3: Time now for talking tech and first up, China's IG

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Speaker 3: says it expects AI to produce the bulk of its

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Speaker 3: film and TV content within five years. Now, the Netflix

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Speaker 3: style streaming platform plans to transform its app and website

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Speaker 3: into a social media destination centered on AI generated programming. Now,

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Speaker 3: as part of that shift, the company unveiled a new

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Speaker 3: AI talkit it says can handle nearly every stage of

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Speaker 3: the filmmaking process. US regulators across Asia are taking a

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Speaker 3: closer look at cybersecurity risks in their financial systems as

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Speaker 3: concerns grow over the spread of appropics mythos model. Now

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Speaker 3: in Singapore, the financial regulator is urging banks to tighten

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Speaker 3: up vulnerabilities, while in South Korea, government agencies have been

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Speaker 3: meeting to plan their response, and Huawei has unveiled its

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Speaker 3: latest folded phone, the Pure xmax.

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Speaker 5: Now the device.

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Speaker 3: Unfolds horizontally to rough it the size of a small tablet.

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Speaker 3: There's priced around oney six hundred and ten dollars now.

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Speaker 5: The launch comes as.

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Speaker 3: Competition with Apple heats up, but Apple expected to roll

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Speaker 3: out it's own affordable later this year.

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Speaker 2: ED Let's stick with Apple, whose upcoming WWDC event is

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Speaker 2: set to reveal the future of Siri. But ahead of

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Speaker 2: the forum, Apple's teaser may have revealed a glimpse of

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Speaker 2: the revamped interface. Let's get to Bloomber's Mark German, who

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Speaker 2: covers all things Apple and consumer tech, and this was

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Speaker 2: the subject of this weekend's power On. I don't Mark,

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Speaker 2: I don't know. Every weekend I repower on. It's usually

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Speaker 2: based on who you're talking to, your reporting. This time,

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Speaker 2: you're getting your your your microscope out, you're looking at

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Speaker 2: the imagery. What are you trying to learn here?

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Speaker 9: Well, you know, every time Apple announces an event toor

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Speaker 9: they announce in your conference, they put out this teaser,

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Speaker 9: graphic or invitation, and from time to time it gives

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Speaker 9: you a pretty good indicator of what's to come. But

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Speaker 9: usually you only realize what that actually was in hindsight.

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Speaker 9: But now I can tell you, you know, several weeks

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Speaker 9: ahead of the conference that this WWDC font, this logo,

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Speaker 9: this glow, this design they have there actually is representative we're.

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Speaker 6: Looking at it now interface.

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Speaker 9: Yeah, it's a representative of the new Siri interface. Basically,

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Speaker 9: they're moving Siri to a new design. If you're familiar

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Speaker 9: with the iPhone Dynamic Island, when you trigger Siri, it'll

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Speaker 9: peer up in that little camera area and then it

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Speaker 9: has that new font like you have a WWDC logo

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Speaker 9: and it has a glowing cursor similar to the glow

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Speaker 9: you see around the twenty six and that logo you

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Speaker 9: were showing.

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Speaker 3: So fold that into what we experience, how that will

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Speaker 3: seem what in fact Siri will seem like when we

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Speaker 3: finally get it into our hands or our ears or

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Speaker 3: our voice, the way we're going to interact with it.

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Speaker 9: You know, Siri has looked cool for for for many years,

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Speaker 9: but it hasn't worked so cool for for many years.

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Speaker 6: Right.

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Speaker 9: It's it's in many ways, it's just pushing people to

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Speaker 9: the design in order to distract from the functionality. That's

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Speaker 9: what we saw from Apple Intelligence. But this time around,

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Speaker 9: they think that they have nailed it. They think they're

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Speaker 9: going to get Siri to work with the features they

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Speaker 9: previously announced, some of the new enhancements that are coming

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Speaker 9: that they haven't announced yet, or a Siri app so

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Speaker 9: a standalone app, a chat bot like interface for the

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Speaker 9: first time to better compete with Gemini and CHACKGPT, and

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Speaker 9: then a new feature that they call internally World's Knowledge Answers,

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Speaker 9: which is basically a perplexity competitor, so you can search

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Speaker 9: the web and get summaries of information without it actually

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Speaker 9: pointing you to Google. It'll happen within the Siri interface itself.

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Speaker 9: So if this all works, I think they have a

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Speaker 9: pretty compelling story to tell for their voice assistant in AI.

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Speaker 2: Come jack Mark real quick. It's better to follow this

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Speaker 2: story and aggregate over a number of years, Like I

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Speaker 2: think back to two or three wwdc's ago and you

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Speaker 2: reporting like Siri and Apple Intelligence isn't going to be

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Speaker 2: the focus, then looks like it will be the focus.

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Speaker 2: Now summarize where Apple was actually landed with Siri, that

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Speaker 2: is AI improved.

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Speaker 9: Now In terms of the underpinnings of Siri, they're using

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Speaker 9: technology from a Gemini model, merging it with their own

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Speaker 9: model technology in order to get it work more properly,

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Speaker 9: it'll be able to analyze data on your phone to

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Speaker 9: help you take action on it. But big picture, this

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Speaker 9: year's conference is really all about Siri and AI. They

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Speaker 9: basically hit pause on all non AI or serre related features.

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Speaker 9: Lots of bug fixes and performance enhancements, but the focus

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Speaker 9: is on this voice assistant this year.

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Speaker 5: Mark German is always giving us the hints. We so

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Speaker 5: appreciate it.

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Speaker 3: Let's talk about now humanoid robots for a minute, because

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Speaker 3: one has just won a half marathon race for robots

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Speaker 3: in Beijing.

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Speaker 5: But get this, it ran faster than the human world record.

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Speaker 3: The race was held in Beijing over the weekend, showcasing

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Speaker 3: China's really rapid advances in robotics and artificial and intelligen

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Speaker 3: and the robots strode across the finish line in fifteen

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Speaker 3: minutes and twenty six seconds to the state run China Daily.

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Speaker 3: That's according to them, and that beat the human world

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Speaker 3: record holder Jacob kip Plumo of Uganda, who finished the

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Speaker 3: half month and in fifty seven minutes and twenty seconds

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Speaker 3: last month in Lisbon. What a stunt, I mean Last

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Speaker 3: year it took more than two hours.

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Speaker 5: For the robots to win.

438
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Speaker 2: That's the video of robots running in a race. I

439
00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:26,600
Speaker 2: mean that can we let's just literally what is one

440
00:22:26,680 --> 00:22:30,199
Speaker 2: hundred teams? Three hundred robots? The director won't show it,

441
00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:33,560
Speaker 2: but I'm just grinning and laughing because that's a video

442
00:22:33,640 --> 00:22:34,960
Speaker 2: of robots running in a race.

443
00:22:35,119 --> 00:22:36,160
Speaker 5: Karen, what was important?

444
00:22:36,320 --> 00:22:38,919
Speaker 3: Liquid cooling that's going to go on in that Maybe

445
00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:41,000
Speaker 3: that helps us in other parts of window.

446
00:22:41,160 --> 00:22:42,560
Speaker 2: So many DPUs on fire?

447
00:22:42,680 --> 00:22:55,000
Speaker 3: Okay, bloomg Or, welcome back to Bloomberg Tech.

448
00:22:55,119 --> 00:22:56,800
Speaker 5: We talk about geopolitics. Now.

449
00:22:56,800 --> 00:23:00,640
Speaker 3: President Trump says it's quote highly unlikely and a ceasefire

450
00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:02,000
Speaker 3: whether RON will be extended.

451
00:23:02,200 --> 00:23:03,080
Speaker 5: This is VPJD.

452
00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:06,240
Speaker 3: Vans is set to head to Pakistan for deal discussions. Now,

453
00:23:06,280 --> 00:23:09,199
Speaker 3: Bloomberg's Jeff Mason has just spoken with the president. But

454
00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:12,080
Speaker 3: a few moments ago, you join us now, Jeff, and

455
00:23:12,119 --> 00:23:14,240
Speaker 3: this tone seems negative.

456
00:23:16,240 --> 00:23:18,600
Speaker 10: You know, I'm not going to say negative or positive.

457
00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:21,760
Speaker 10: Just what he said, which was a couple of different things.

458
00:23:21,760 --> 00:23:24,000
Speaker 10: He said that he thought talks could work out well

459
00:23:23,720 --> 00:23:27,120
Speaker 10: for all parties. But he also said, as you rightly quoted,

460
00:23:27,240 --> 00:23:30,080
Speaker 10: that he was not intending or it was at least

461
00:23:30,160 --> 00:23:33,240
Speaker 10: highly unlikely that he would extend a ceasefire. He also

462
00:23:33,359 --> 00:23:36,959
Speaker 10: said that the ceasefire ends on Wednesday, which is a

463
00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:40,639
Speaker 10: little bit of news because the two week period that

464
00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:44,760
Speaker 10: most people were assuming goes through tomorrow Tuesday, so that

465
00:23:44,880 --> 00:23:47,920
Speaker 10: was interesting. The President also made a point in our

466
00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:50,280
Speaker 10: phone conversation of saying that he was not in a

467
00:23:50,359 --> 00:23:52,440
Speaker 10: rush to get a deal, and he talked about the

468
00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:55,080
Speaker 10: length of the Iran War. The excuse me, he talked

469
00:23:55,080 --> 00:23:57,600
Speaker 10: about the length of the Vietnam War, the Afghanistan War,

470
00:23:57,680 --> 00:24:02,080
Speaker 10: the Korean War. So he was watching this timeline or

471
00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:04,760
Speaker 10: his own timeline, in the fact that many other wars

472
00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:06,840
Speaker 10: have gone for a long time, and he just said

473
00:24:06,840 --> 00:24:07,960
Speaker 10: he was not in a rush.

474
00:24:08,359 --> 00:24:10,680
Speaker 2: I'm just going over the headlines that were generated from

475
00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:14,640
Speaker 2: the interview, Jeff. There are several of them. I guess operationally,

476
00:24:15,000 --> 00:24:18,080
Speaker 2: what happens next? What did the president tell you about

477
00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:20,679
Speaker 2: what he and his cabinet will do in the coming days.

478
00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:24,000
Speaker 2: We mentioned jd Vance, the Vice president, and what he

479
00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:26,840
Speaker 2: does now plan to do with regards to talks.

480
00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:29,600
Speaker 10: Well, he gave a little bit of detail about when

481
00:24:29,600 --> 00:24:31,479
Speaker 10: the talks are expected to happen. He said that they

482
00:24:31,520 --> 00:24:34,080
Speaker 10: were likely to be on Tuesday night and Wednesday morning,

483
00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:38,040
Speaker 10: and he said that Jade Vance was expected to leave

484
00:24:38,119 --> 00:24:42,119
Speaker 10: later on in the day today Monday, which contradicted what

485
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:45,000
Speaker 10: he said to another reporter at another news outlet earlier,

486
00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:48,280
Speaker 10: where he suggested that the Vice president was already en route.

487
00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:50,119
Speaker 6: So the next step are these talks.

488
00:24:50,680 --> 00:24:54,280
Speaker 10: I asked him when we spoke about the ceasefire if

489
00:24:54,280 --> 00:24:57,399
Speaker 10: he expected that fighting would resume right after the ceasefire

490
00:24:57,480 --> 00:24:59,560
Speaker 10: concluded if there wasn't a deal, and he said he

491
00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:03,880
Speaker 10: expected so. So to your broad question, it's kind of a

492
00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:07,679
Speaker 10: dual track here. He's expecting talks to take place, and

493
00:25:07,720 --> 00:25:10,800
Speaker 10: he showed some optimism about those talks, but he's also

494
00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:15,320
Speaker 10: clearly holding over the threat of additional attacks to start

495
00:25:15,359 --> 00:25:18,280
Speaker 10: as soon as this week if a deal is not concluded.

496
00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:20,240
Speaker 6: And just for a reality check.

497
00:25:20,160 --> 00:25:23,480
Speaker 10: For our listeners and viewers, remember that the last time

498
00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:27,200
Speaker 10: there was a major piece deal with Iran happened during

499
00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:29,800
Speaker 10: the President Barack Obama's administration.

500
00:25:30,160 --> 00:25:33,040
Speaker 6: That deal took a year and a half to hammer out.

501
00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:38,560
Speaker 10: So timing here is it would be unusual if they're

502
00:25:38,600 --> 00:25:41,320
Speaker 10: able to get a deal as fast as Wednesday evening,

503
00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:44,960
Speaker 10: which is what the President said was the deadline for

504
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:46,640
Speaker 10: the end of the Seaspire.

505
00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:48,640
Speaker 2: Bloomberg Jeff Mason, who's just off the phone with US

506
00:25:48,680 --> 00:25:51,200
Speaker 2: President Donald Trump, Thank you very much. There's a lot

507
00:25:51,240 --> 00:25:53,800
Speaker 2: going on in markets, much of it relates to the

508
00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:55,520
Speaker 2: headlines about the war in the rom but actually in

509
00:25:55,560 --> 00:25:58,840
Speaker 2: bitcoin's case, so we're around seventy five, six hundred US

510
00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:03,119
Speaker 2: dollars partoken Carrot. I saw the headline that Strategy Michael

511
00:26:03,160 --> 00:26:05,399
Speaker 2: Sailor et cetera brought two point five billion dollars in

512
00:26:05,440 --> 00:26:08,800
Speaker 2: bitcoin in the trailing seven days, and I think that

513
00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:11,720
Speaker 2: that's their biggest buy since the end of twenty twenty

514
00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:14,480
Speaker 2: four something like that. Maybe that's a factor in the market.

515
00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:17,160
Speaker 2: Maybe it's just a risk asset behaving like everything else.

516
00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:19,679
Speaker 3: Who knew that Michael Sailor actually still wants to continue

517
00:26:19,720 --> 00:26:22,080
Speaker 3: to buy bitcoin. I mean, many wouldn't not be surprised

518
00:26:22,080 --> 00:26:24,960
Speaker 3: by that. It's interesting that in the defile space more broadly,

519
00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:27,520
Speaker 3: that's been that we can hack training what was three

520
00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:28,280
Speaker 3: hundred million.

521
00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:31,119
Speaker 2: Dollars, which has helped those consequences. Right, It really.

522
00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:33,840
Speaker 3: Does just negative sentiment around DeFi. But people can separate

523
00:26:33,840 --> 00:26:36,520
Speaker 3: the two. Your bitcoin is not DeFi. DeFi is not Bitcoin.

524
00:26:36,680 --> 00:26:39,440
Speaker 2: Really quick in the technology space on single names, Adobe

525
00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:42,480
Speaker 2: is higher by about one percent. It announced basically a

526
00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:46,159
Speaker 2: broader agentic ecosystem with basically everyone in the world of

527
00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:49,280
Speaker 2: tech aws and thropic, Google Cloud, IBM, Microsoft and video

528
00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:52,000
Speaker 2: and open Ai, and an earlier report on that had

529
00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:53,919
Speaker 2: boosted shares. And then there's the kind of big thing

530
00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:57,000
Speaker 2: that's happening in aggregate. The Nasdaq one hundred is softer

531
00:26:57,840 --> 00:27:00,080
Speaker 2: and actually push to session lows after some of the

532
00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:02,399
Speaker 2: headlines from the President. But the main thing is it

533
00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:05,440
Speaker 2: snapped a thirteen day winning streak, right, Karen, That is

534
00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:08,080
Speaker 2: what we've been talking about in that thirteen day period,

535
00:27:08,160 --> 00:27:11,000
Speaker 2: sort of how tech is unstoppable in the face of

536
00:27:11,040 --> 00:27:13,480
Speaker 2: what is sort of a tense situation in the Gulf

537
00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:15,879
Speaker 2: that speaks of Benberg equities for water Carmen Rhini Key,

538
00:27:16,119 --> 00:27:18,400
Speaker 2: I mean, that's kind of the story, right, Tech has

539
00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:21,520
Speaker 2: cloud on irrespective of those geopolitical overhangs.

540
00:27:21,720 --> 00:27:24,680
Speaker 11: Yeah, we've seen just an incredible rush back into risk

541
00:27:24,800 --> 00:27:27,439
Speaker 11: assets from investors. I mean even today, you know, we

542
00:27:27,520 --> 00:27:30,680
Speaker 11: had this really significant geopolitical news, at least at first

543
00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:33,320
Speaker 11: you said Drum wasn't quite as significant as I might

544
00:27:33,359 --> 00:27:35,199
Speaker 11: have expected. And there are parts of tech that are

545
00:27:35,200 --> 00:27:37,680
Speaker 11: actually still holding up today. So I was writing about

546
00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:40,560
Speaker 11: the IGV the software ETF last week it had its

547
00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:44,080
Speaker 11: best week since two thousand and one, really significant gains there.

548
00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:47,000
Speaker 12: Today it's actually holding up a little bit. It's doing a.

549
00:27:46,960 --> 00:27:49,280
Speaker 11: Little bit better than the hardware sector than the socks.

550
00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:51,359
Speaker 11: At least last that I checked on my terminal, it

551
00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:55,080
Speaker 11: was up a little bit today. Hadn't completely erased doated

552
00:27:55,240 --> 00:27:58,560
Speaker 11: games exactly exactly, and so we are seeing still some

553
00:27:58,840 --> 00:28:02,840
Speaker 11: bright spots here. And I think the names that drove

554
00:28:03,119 --> 00:28:05,960
Speaker 11: the nasdaqs thirteen day streak are really interesting. So we

555
00:28:06,040 --> 00:28:09,480
Speaker 11: definitely had talked about Intel had such an incredible rally that.

556
00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:11,160
Speaker 12: Was the top of the charts there.

557
00:28:11,200 --> 00:28:13,600
Speaker 11: It was the number one performer over those thirteen days,

558
00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:16,840
Speaker 11: and then the memory names were right after it. So Marvel,

559
00:28:17,359 --> 00:28:18,959
Speaker 11: sand Disk, Western Digital.

560
00:28:19,040 --> 00:28:21,080
Speaker 3: Can we go into Marvel a little bit more because

561
00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:23,240
Speaker 3: the hardware story is basically.

562
00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:24,240
Speaker 5: What's been unstoppable.

563
00:28:24,520 --> 00:28:26,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, and Marvel that seems to be reporting out there

564
00:28:26,880 --> 00:28:29,560
Speaker 3: that maybe they're going to be working alongside Google, Google

565
00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:32,919
Speaker 3: broadening out from its TPU broadcom relationship to some of

566
00:28:32,920 --> 00:28:33,400
Speaker 3: the players.

567
00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:33,720
Speaker 5: Yeah.

568
00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:35,359
Speaker 11: Well, and this is one that actually the stock is

569
00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:37,600
Speaker 11: sort of bucking the trend today, at least in the

570
00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:40,560
Speaker 11: inter day, was on track to close at a record high.

571
00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:42,800
Speaker 12: So another record high. Marvel's still looking really strong.

572
00:28:42,840 --> 00:28:45,200
Speaker 11: And yes, so the news today is that there are

573
00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:49,280
Speaker 11: reports that it's in discussions to develop two chips with Google.

574
00:28:49,320 --> 00:28:52,200
Speaker 11: So one is immense memory processing chip and the other

575
00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:53,680
Speaker 11: is a TPU.

576
00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:54,880
Speaker 12: And those are both really significant.

577
00:28:54,920 --> 00:29:01,120
Speaker 11: It's also potentially intox aimed at designing semiconductors exclusively for Google.

578
00:29:01,320 --> 00:29:03,800
Speaker 11: So that's a huge deal for a company like Marvel.

579
00:29:03,880 --> 00:29:07,080
Speaker 11: And again, you know, it's had a really incredible rise.

580
00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:09,840
Speaker 11: So through Friday's close it was up more than sixty

581
00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:12,360
Speaker 11: percent this year. It's just extending those days.

582
00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:14,840
Speaker 2: That game all calms down in the session as well. Right,

583
00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:16,959
Speaker 2: you both got to point out it had an astonishing

584
00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:19,800
Speaker 2: start to April, like every other member of that basket.

585
00:29:19,960 --> 00:29:21,240
Speaker 2: So interesting move.

586
00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:22,719
Speaker 3: Yeah, we've got to keep an eye on the hardware

587
00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:23,800
Speaker 3: and we can dig in a little bit more.

588
00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:24,880
Speaker 5: But common Hinikey.

589
00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:27,360
Speaker 3: Sets it up perfectly, always got her eye on the

590
00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:29,360
Speaker 3: broader moves. Let's dig in a little bit more on

591
00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:32,640
Speaker 3: this Marvel's story. But in my intelligence, senior analyst Con Savanni,

592
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:36,760
Speaker 3: who has been watching the stock positioning itself for maybe

593
00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:39,040
Speaker 3: taking advantage of custom chip demand. And here we have it,

594
00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:42,040
Speaker 3: maybe some reporting showing that they can be really relied

595
00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:46,040
Speaker 3: upon by the likes of Alphabet's Google chip design. What

596
00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:48,480
Speaker 3: do you make of the reporting coming out of the

597
00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:50,480
Speaker 3: information in this particular instance.

598
00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:53,560
Speaker 13: Yeah, this reporting really validates what we have been talking

599
00:29:53,600 --> 00:29:55,959
Speaker 13: about for the past two quarters that you know, the

600
00:29:56,000 --> 00:29:59,120
Speaker 13: noise prior to six months in Marvel was all about

601
00:29:59,200 --> 00:30:02,960
Speaker 13: Amazon Tradium three. But we think they're really expanding beyond

602
00:30:03,080 --> 00:30:05,680
Speaker 13: just the number one, number two hyperscalers. And what's more

603
00:30:05,720 --> 00:30:09,000
Speaker 13: importantly is here is that MPU which just falls in

604
00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:12,440
Speaker 13: the x few attached portfolio. This is the areas where

605
00:30:12,440 --> 00:30:17,600
Speaker 13: sophisticated hyperscalers like Google, Amazon, Microsoft are now optimizing customs

606
00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:21,720
Speaker 13: chips beyond just the core powerful TPUs or accelerator. So

607
00:30:21,760 --> 00:30:24,640
Speaker 13: this is where we think Marvel can gain significant shell

608
00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:26,640
Speaker 13: and this comes at higher growth margins.

609
00:30:26,640 --> 00:30:29,480
Speaker 2: By the way, Yeah, in inference memory is more of

610
00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:32,400
Speaker 2: a bottleneck, right, and so the MPU just moves data,

611
00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:35,160
Speaker 2: you know, that's its purpose. I think the thing that

612
00:30:35,160 --> 00:30:37,959
Speaker 2: we try and reiterate is that Google owns the design

613
00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:41,440
Speaker 2: and architecture of TPU either way. So in that case,

614
00:30:41,520 --> 00:30:43,880
Speaker 2: what is it that broad Com to this point and

615
00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:48,360
Speaker 2: potentially Marvel actually do conjem. What's the value add of

616
00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:49,720
Speaker 2: partnering with someone like that.

617
00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:53,240
Speaker 13: So when you think about beyond that core digital logic,

618
00:30:53,440 --> 00:30:56,000
Speaker 13: it's the IDP sets surrounding. How do you connect to

619
00:30:56,040 --> 00:30:58,160
Speaker 13: the memory, how do you do your packaging, how do

620
00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:01,280
Speaker 13: you have your intercorrect iOS. This is where these companies

621
00:31:01,320 --> 00:31:04,360
Speaker 13: come in with their own IP portfolio and add value.

622
00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:07,080
Speaker 13: One more thing to add here is the influence hardware

623
00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:10,920
Speaker 13: streck is changing. It's not just one hardware stack fits

624
00:31:10,960 --> 00:31:13,640
Speaker 13: all sides, so we are going to see multiple players.

625
00:31:13,640 --> 00:31:16,840
Speaker 13: There's also talks about media tech also participating in one

626
00:31:16,840 --> 00:31:18,960
Speaker 13: of the Google's sort of keep you versions, So we

627
00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:21,160
Speaker 13: are going to see this diversification when it comes to

628
00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:21,760
Speaker 13: ASIK now.

629
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:24,320
Speaker 2: And by the way, on the Marvel side of this,

630
00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:27,480
Speaker 2: Google declines to comment to Bloomberg on any of the reporting.

631
00:31:27,960 --> 00:31:31,880
Speaker 2: But it's not Google, it's Broadcom or Marvel that phones

632
00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:36,120
Speaker 2: TSMC and gets those things. Fat Congensabannie from Bloomberg Intelligence

633
00:31:36,120 --> 00:31:38,720
Speaker 2: with the research. Really appreciate it. Now coming up the

634
00:31:38,760 --> 00:31:43,160
Speaker 2: conversation with Greg Martin of Rainmaker Securities, as Markets get

635
00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:48,760
Speaker 2: set for some mega IPOs. This is Blomberg Tech. AI

636
00:31:48,800 --> 00:31:52,280
Speaker 2: shipmaker Cerebra Systems is back in the IPO spotlight. The

637
00:31:52,320 --> 00:31:56,160
Speaker 2: company filed publicly for a US IPO on Friday, just

638
00:31:56,280 --> 00:31:59,680
Speaker 2: six months after pulling its previous attempt, so to say.

639
00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:03,000
Speaker 2: The deal could raise around two billion dollars, testing investor

640
00:32:03,040 --> 00:32:06,600
Speaker 2: appetite for large scale listings. The company's filing shows gross

641
00:32:06,600 --> 00:32:09,760
Speaker 2: margins slipped to thirty nine percent twenty twenty five from

642
00:32:09,840 --> 00:32:13,280
Speaker 2: forty two percent a year earlier, highlighting some of the pressures.

643
00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:16,920
Speaker 2: Even high profile AI named a facing character at LISTA.

644
00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:20,280
Speaker 5: It's not loss making this year for versus last year.

645
00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:22,520
Speaker 5: Let's well, revenue certainly doubled.

646
00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:24,600
Speaker 3: Let's talk a little bit more about the IPO landscape

647
00:32:24,640 --> 00:32:28,200
Speaker 3: and joined with Greg Martin, Managing Partner and Maker Securities,

648
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:31,400
Speaker 3: and Greg, what is the appetite likely to be?

649
00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:33,400
Speaker 5: Say we go into Cerebraus and.

650
00:32:33,320 --> 00:32:36,880
Speaker 3: We think about how, yes, they've suddenly galvanized revenue growth,

651
00:32:36,920 --> 00:32:38,160
Speaker 3: but the margin has been hit.

652
00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:40,720
Speaker 5: As Ed articulates, are people just going to be.

653
00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:43,840
Speaker 3: Betting still on this desire for AI? Compute the rampant

654
00:32:43,840 --> 00:32:46,200
Speaker 3: bottlenecks that we see in terms of just access for

655
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:49,640
Speaker 3: AI iterations and innovations.

656
00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:52,520
Speaker 14: Well, it's a great question, and clearly this is going

657
00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:54,320
Speaker 14: to lead off, you know, what could be a big

658
00:32:54,360 --> 00:32:58,520
Speaker 14: AI infrastructure year. There's already some public companies like core

659
00:32:58,640 --> 00:33:02,080
Speaker 14: Weave and Nebius who had nice run ups recently, so

660
00:33:02,080 --> 00:33:06,320
Speaker 14: there's clearly demand for AI infrastructure and Cerebrius numbers. They've

661
00:33:06,360 --> 00:33:09,240
Speaker 14: they've grown revenues. I think the biggest question mark with

662
00:33:09,240 --> 00:33:13,320
Speaker 14: Cerebris was customer concentration. Now they've added open Ai, but

663
00:33:13,360 --> 00:33:17,760
Speaker 14: they still have customer concentration, and so it's also a

664
00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:21,000
Speaker 14: very high valuation. The company did five hundred ten million

665
00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:23,800
Speaker 14: of revenue last year. Their last round was at twenty

666
00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:27,160
Speaker 14: three billion, which was just done in February, and so

667
00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:32,040
Speaker 14: it's meantime, the secondary market for Cerebris is actually traded

668
00:33:32,160 --> 00:33:35,000
Speaker 14: down to about ten billion recently, and so there's a

669
00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:38,400
Speaker 14: big question mark of whether they can hit a big

670
00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:41,040
Speaker 14: enough number in the IPO pricing such that their last

671
00:33:41,120 --> 00:33:43,720
Speaker 14: round investors won't have a down round. So I think

672
00:33:43,960 --> 00:33:47,240
Speaker 14: the market we're watching Cerebris closely. It's not the marquee

673
00:33:47,400 --> 00:33:50,600
Speaker 14: name like SpaceX and propic or open Ai, but it'll

674
00:33:50,640 --> 00:33:52,920
Speaker 14: be interesting to see if the market really is open

675
00:33:53,280 --> 00:33:56,960
Speaker 14: again for a company like Cerebris with such customer concentration.

676
00:33:57,200 --> 00:33:59,160
Speaker 3: And this is why we go to greg because we

677
00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:01,480
Speaker 3: think about the quick that you can see, you can

678
00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:04,160
Speaker 3: tell our audience about in the secondary market, just how

679
00:34:04,200 --> 00:34:07,040
Speaker 3: hot is it for the really exciting names like we

680
00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:10,760
Speaker 3: were just reporting Edge and Team about how Anthropic basically

681
00:34:10,920 --> 00:34:13,600
Speaker 3: is turning away more money in terms of a capital

682
00:34:13,719 --> 00:34:16,960
Speaker 3: raise that could drive its valuation up to eight hundred billion.

683
00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:20,000
Speaker 14: Also, yeah, and Thropics one of the hottest companies we've

684
00:34:20,040 --> 00:34:25,520
Speaker 14: ever seen. Unbelievable demand on our platform or Rainmaker. Obviously,

685
00:34:25,560 --> 00:34:29,080
Speaker 14: the company added ten billion of ARR in one month.

686
00:34:29,880 --> 00:34:33,200
Speaker 14: They're now up to about thirty billion of arrs reported publicly.

687
00:34:33,680 --> 00:34:36,719
Speaker 14: So it's just it's people are starting to value Anthropic

688
00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:40,719
Speaker 14: as a share of the economy, not in sort of

689
00:34:40,760 --> 00:34:43,000
Speaker 14: traditional metrics that you might see. And of course their

690
00:34:43,040 --> 00:34:46,399
Speaker 14: growth actually does start to rationalize the valuation that they

691
00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:48,640
Speaker 14: that they've had. We're starting to see them, you know,

692
00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:51,799
Speaker 14: enter into just about every software category. So Anthropic is

693
00:34:51,800 --> 00:34:55,359
Speaker 14: about as hot as companies we've seen. They raise money

694
00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:58,160
Speaker 14: at three hundred and fifty billion just in February. We're

695
00:34:58,160 --> 00:35:02,360
Speaker 14: now seeing potential eight hundred and we're seeing unlimited demand

696
00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:05,880
Speaker 14: on our on our platform. So clearly Anthropic is the

697
00:35:05,920 --> 00:35:07,640
Speaker 14: hottest company we've seen in a long time.

698
00:35:08,080 --> 00:35:11,920
Speaker 2: You know, with those names SpaceX, Open AI, Andthropic, people

699
00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:14,480
Speaker 2: always ask when we report something, you know, how do I,

700
00:35:14,520 --> 00:35:17,279
Speaker 2: as an everyday person invest into those companies? And the

701
00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:19,000
Speaker 2: first thing I say is, we don't do that. I

702
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:22,080
Speaker 2: don't do financial advice. Just read my reporting. But the

703
00:35:22,120 --> 00:35:24,440
Speaker 2: second thing is I say, oh, but we have reported

704
00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:28,040
Speaker 2: that SpaceX, Open AI, and Anthropic are all likely to

705
00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:32,000
Speaker 2: go public in twenty twenty six. And with that flood

706
00:35:32,239 --> 00:35:35,839
Speaker 2: into the market of three names at that scale, how

707
00:35:35,920 --> 00:35:38,759
Speaker 2: does that translate to activity on the secondary market? Do

708
00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:43,160
Speaker 2: people try and position themselves in anticipation of a big

709
00:35:43,239 --> 00:35:45,359
Speaker 2: listing or public debut moment like that?

710
00:35:46,120 --> 00:35:46,319
Speaker 11: Yeah?

711
00:35:46,360 --> 00:35:50,560
Speaker 14: Absolutely, you know, these three companies in particular, there's they're

712
00:35:50,600 --> 00:35:54,399
Speaker 14: obviously you know, enormous market caps eight hundred billion, two

713
00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:58,719
Speaker 14: trillion potentially for SpaceX. So we're seeing a ton of

714
00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:02,440
Speaker 14: demand pre IPO because people do think that there's going

715
00:36:02,480 --> 00:36:04,440
Speaker 14: to be a run up in the markets. All of

716
00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:08,040
Speaker 14: these companies are oversubscribed in the secondary markets, and as

717
00:36:08,120 --> 00:36:11,560
Speaker 14: companies get closer to IPO, there's a feeling that hey,

718
00:36:11,600 --> 00:36:13,719
Speaker 14: now I'm going to have liquidity, Now I'm going to

719
00:36:13,719 --> 00:36:16,440
Speaker 14: have access to more information. But we've seen in the

720
00:36:16,440 --> 00:36:19,560
Speaker 14: past IPO allocations get cut back substantially, and so if

721
00:36:19,600 --> 00:36:22,000
Speaker 14: you want to get into these companies with any kind

722
00:36:22,040 --> 00:36:23,880
Speaker 14: of scale, you may have to come into the private

723
00:36:23,920 --> 00:36:26,480
Speaker 14: markets and buy it via secondary or primary. So we're

724
00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:29,440
Speaker 14: seeing rabid demand for all three of these companies in

725
00:36:29,480 --> 00:36:30,360
Speaker 14: the secondary market.

726
00:36:30,520 --> 00:36:33,239
Speaker 2: Greg really quick. We had lots of little IPOs last week,

727
00:36:33,320 --> 00:36:35,360
Speaker 2: many of them came on this show. What did that

728
00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:36,000
Speaker 2: signal to you?

729
00:36:37,640 --> 00:36:40,640
Speaker 14: Not a lot, you know, I'm much more focused on

730
00:36:40,719 --> 00:36:44,840
Speaker 14: the bigger IPOs. There's clearly a massive backlog and so companies,

731
00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:47,160
Speaker 14: there are companies that just need to go public. I

732
00:36:47,200 --> 00:36:49,280
Speaker 14: don't think there's a lot to be you know, learned

733
00:36:49,320 --> 00:36:52,279
Speaker 14: from what we saw last week. Listen, we have the

734
00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:54,920
Speaker 14: potential for one of the biggest IPO years in history.

735
00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:58,000
Speaker 14: The three companies you mentioned are going to potentially raise

736
00:36:58,160 --> 00:37:00,680
Speaker 14: up up close to two hundred billion in between them,

737
00:37:01,360 --> 00:37:04,160
Speaker 14: which could suck the entire oxygen out of the market

738
00:37:04,200 --> 00:37:07,360
Speaker 14: for a while. So I think what's really going to

739
00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:10,720
Speaker 14: be interesting is how those three companies, SpaceX and profit

740
00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:13,840
Speaker 14: and open AI perform, And of course it's a function

741
00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:16,440
Speaker 14: of whether the ip OF market's truly opened, because I

742
00:37:16,440 --> 00:37:18,880
Speaker 14: don't think the market's open until the streets and corms

743
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:19,279
Speaker 14: are open.

744
00:37:20,320 --> 00:37:22,440
Speaker 2: God, if that's what you're banking and waiting on, we'll

745
00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:26,040
Speaker 2: be here a while. Greg Martin of Rainmaker Securities secondary

746
00:37:26,080 --> 00:37:29,800
Speaker 2: market broker who sees what's happening in terms of liquidity

747
00:37:29,840 --> 00:37:33,680
Speaker 2: interests ahead of IPO now coming up. Nick Stronsky, co

748
00:37:33,760 --> 00:37:37,640
Speaker 2: founder and CEO of Revolute, discusses the digital banks future

749
00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:45,080
Speaker 2: plans on this week's David Rubinstein Show. Nick Ronsky built

750
00:37:45,120 --> 00:37:48,160
Speaker 2: Revolute into one of the world's most valuable fintech companies,

751
00:37:48,239 --> 00:37:51,040
Speaker 2: now worth around seventy five billion dollars. The co founder

752
00:37:51,040 --> 00:37:54,440
Speaker 2: and CEO speaks to David Rubinstein about the company's future.

753
00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:57,480
Speaker 15: I think it's obviously much easier for us and giving

754
00:37:57,560 --> 00:38:02,160
Speaker 15: on your administration. Plus we have so many other Manking licenses.

755
00:38:02,200 --> 00:38:04,200
Speaker 15: Plus we have a Manky license you can now, So

756
00:38:04,239 --> 00:38:06,919
Speaker 15: for us it became much easier compared to two years ago.

757
00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:09,680
Speaker 16: So in the United States, what do you hope to

758
00:38:09,719 --> 00:38:12,279
Speaker 16: be able to do with your banking license if.

759
00:38:12,160 --> 00:38:12,600
Speaker 2: You get it?

760
00:38:13,200 --> 00:38:16,399
Speaker 16: What is the market gap that you think you can

761
00:38:16,480 --> 00:38:18,200
Speaker 16: feel that maybe others aren't doing.

762
00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:21,279
Speaker 15: So basically I mentioned a radioh retail business. So it's

763
00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:24,880
Speaker 15: one simple up where you can do everything what you

764
00:38:24,880 --> 00:38:27,600
Speaker 15: need for your financial life. And then second direction, we'll

765
00:38:27,600 --> 00:38:30,920
Speaker 15: also provide the regular business accounts for businesses. And again

766
00:38:30,960 --> 00:38:33,120
Speaker 15: it's end to end services that you need to run

767
00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:37,640
Speaker 15: your business. So payments, banking, credit will come as well,

768
00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:41,799
Speaker 15: wealth management or treasury we call it treasury, and then

769
00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:44,040
Speaker 15: acquiring as well. So for example, right now, if I'm

770
00:38:44,080 --> 00:38:47,960
Speaker 15: an American company, I'll need to stop say Strip for acquiring,

771
00:38:48,080 --> 00:38:52,080
Speaker 15: then Gip Morgan for my business banking. Then you know,

772
00:38:52,160 --> 00:38:55,920
Speaker 15: something else for payouts, something else for payroll. So we

773
00:38:56,000 --> 00:38:58,400
Speaker 15: provide all these services in one product.

774
00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:01,040
Speaker 16: Well, if you conquer the US the way you've conquered

775
00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:04,960
Speaker 16: the UK and Europe, is China next, or you're not

776
00:39:05,000 --> 00:39:05,959
Speaker 16: going to focus on that.

777
00:39:05,960 --> 00:39:08,160
Speaker 15: Easy way that if you're focusing so spending a lot

778
00:39:08,160 --> 00:39:11,160
Speaker 15: of time or studying Asia and then as a search,

779
00:39:11,280 --> 00:39:13,440
Speaker 15: so we apply it for multiple banking licenses in Asia

780
00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:14,879
Speaker 15: as well, and then some of them but we got

781
00:39:14,920 --> 00:39:17,839
Speaker 15: already and then China is on the list as well.

782
00:39:17,880 --> 00:39:20,360
Speaker 15: You know, one day I hope we can set up

783
00:39:20,400 --> 00:39:21,000
Speaker 15: a business there.

784
00:39:21,040 --> 00:39:25,959
Speaker 16: Now some people have written that your bank Revolute is

785
00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:29,000
Speaker 16: worth seventy five billion dollars. Have you ever thought of

786
00:39:29,040 --> 00:39:30,400
Speaker 16: taking your organization public?

787
00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:33,520
Speaker 15: But the way I think about it, will be ready

788
00:39:33,520 --> 00:39:38,400
Speaker 15: to probably into year's time. But then again depends on

789
00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:39,480
Speaker 15: how good the market is.

790
00:39:39,840 --> 00:39:42,160
Speaker 16: Bench you don't have an IPO, how do people who

791
00:39:42,200 --> 00:39:45,040
Speaker 16: work for you make some money? You make a market

792
00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:47,600
Speaker 16: for people to sell their shares internally.

793
00:39:47,239 --> 00:39:50,240
Speaker 15: Yes, so we do secondaries every one in two years

794
00:39:50,560 --> 00:39:54,400
Speaker 15: when people can sell certain portion of their stocks to

795
00:39:54,640 --> 00:39:55,480
Speaker 15: accel investors.

796
00:39:55,680 --> 00:39:59,320
Speaker 16: So you've done secondary sales for your employees, so employees

797
00:39:59,360 --> 00:40:02,560
Speaker 16: can then some liquidity. Do you expect before you go

798
00:40:02,640 --> 00:40:04,400
Speaker 16: public you'll do any more of those? Or you're just

799
00:40:04,440 --> 00:40:06,560
Speaker 16: going to wait till you go public before you liquify

800
00:40:06,640 --> 00:40:07,840
Speaker 16: any more our stock.

801
00:40:08,000 --> 00:40:09,960
Speaker 15: We all think, so we might do second risk as

802
00:40:09,960 --> 00:40:12,799
Speaker 15: well before we do ip your because we do it

803
00:40:12,800 --> 00:40:14,840
Speaker 15: every one or two years, so we might do a

804
00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:15,480
Speaker 15: second result.

805
00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:18,000
Speaker 16: All right, Well, if anybody wants to sell their shares

806
00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:20,760
Speaker 16: to me, let me know. And have any investment bankers

807
00:40:20,800 --> 00:40:22,680
Speaker 16: told you why they're the best to do the IPO

808
00:40:22,800 --> 00:40:23,200
Speaker 16: for you?

809
00:40:23,280 --> 00:40:24,959
Speaker 15: Yeah, obviously every single one is the best.

810
00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:27,000
Speaker 16: Everyone is the best. You're not in a rush to

811
00:40:27,000 --> 00:40:27,160
Speaker 16: do it.

812
00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:29,280
Speaker 2: You don't need the money, so we're bank.

813
00:40:30,120 --> 00:40:33,360
Speaker 15: And then for the bank, it's super important to have trust.

814
00:40:34,280 --> 00:40:36,640
Speaker 15: And then public companies are trusted and more compared to

815
00:40:36,719 --> 00:40:37,520
Speaker 15: private companies.

816
00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:40,000
Speaker 3: Go see the full interview with the Revolute co founder

817
00:40:40,080 --> 00:40:43,319
Speaker 3: or CEO, Nick Sterronsky. Watch the David Rubinstein Show to

818
00:40:43,320 --> 00:40:46,040
Speaker 3: peer Conversations on Wednesday, April twenty second at nine pm

819
00:40:46,160 --> 00:40:48,440
Speaker 3: in New York and you O'm been about television Now

820
00:40:48,480 --> 00:40:52,040
Speaker 3: more on digital banking JP Morgan City Group. I've taken

821
00:40:52,080 --> 00:40:55,399
Speaker 3: their rivalry onto the blockchain, competing to define the next

822
00:40:55,440 --> 00:40:57,600
Speaker 3: roun tier of global payments. Just take a listen to

823
00:40:57,640 --> 00:40:59,400
Speaker 3: what they told us in a recent joint interview.

824
00:41:00,120 --> 00:41:02,840
Speaker 17: The real client problem that we were looking to solve

825
00:41:03,280 --> 00:41:06,719
Speaker 17: is the ability for large multinationals, big banks and broker

826
00:41:06,760 --> 00:41:09,560
Speaker 17: dealers and FinTechs to be able to move their money

827
00:41:09,600 --> 00:41:12,040
Speaker 17: around make payments seamlessly around the world.

828
00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:12,719
Speaker 2: Twenty four cent.

829
00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:15,160
Speaker 6: We want to keep building on the public chain stuff.

830
00:41:15,400 --> 00:41:18,760
Speaker 18: We have now tokenized money market funds with our asset

831
00:41:18,760 --> 00:41:22,120
Speaker 18: management business through Conneccess. We have tokenized deposit tokens, we

832
00:41:22,160 --> 00:41:25,440
Speaker 18: have a full tokenization engine we have core infrastructure, so

833
00:41:25,480 --> 00:41:28,400
Speaker 18: we basically want to want to battle hard net.

834
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:31,440
Speaker 3: Rivals on screen, and the two banks of building competing

835
00:41:31,480 --> 00:41:34,480
Speaker 3: systems but takingly different paths. Blue Megs as wellly is

836
00:41:34,520 --> 00:41:36,080
Speaker 3: here with one of the most red stories on the

837
00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:37,040
Speaker 3: terminal today as well.

838
00:41:37,440 --> 00:41:38,400
Speaker 5: How are they doing it differently?

839
00:41:38,440 --> 00:41:40,960
Speaker 3: One like stable coins, one doesn't so much exactly.

840
00:41:41,000 --> 00:41:43,399
Speaker 19: So it's interesting to see Wall Street raised into this space,

841
00:41:43,440 --> 00:41:45,520
Speaker 19: and it's even more interesting to see their approach. So

842
00:41:45,600 --> 00:41:48,279
Speaker 19: for a city, they've signaled an openness to stable coins.

843
00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:51,280
Speaker 19: They've partnered with coinbase to really push into this digital

844
00:41:51,280 --> 00:41:54,880
Speaker 19: asset space and they want tokenized securities. Around five hundred

845
00:41:54,880 --> 00:41:57,360
Speaker 19: clients have been enabled in that platform and they process

846
00:41:57,440 --> 00:41:59,560
Speaker 19: around one billion dollars already.

847
00:42:00,040 --> 00:42:01,640
Speaker 5: The JP Morgan day, isn't it?

848
00:42:01,719 --> 00:42:02,000
Speaker 6: Yes?

849
00:42:02,320 --> 00:42:05,040
Speaker 19: JP Morgan has been a little bit more reticent when

850
00:42:05,080 --> 00:42:07,440
Speaker 19: it comes to stable coins because for them, the KYC

851
00:42:07,680 --> 00:42:10,160
Speaker 19: is a little bit less. What they prefer is to

852
00:42:10,160 --> 00:42:13,439
Speaker 19: build their in house infrastructure. Their in house blockchain called

853
00:42:13,520 --> 00:42:17,040
Speaker 19: kinnexis and Cannexus is really already processing over three trillion

854
00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:20,759
Speaker 19: dollars in volume, with each average daily block being five

855
00:42:20,800 --> 00:42:24,360
Speaker 19: billion dollars. So to be sure, this isn't really grand.

856
00:42:24,440 --> 00:42:27,040
Speaker 19: Yet in the larger scheme of things, they process trillions

857
00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:30,640
Speaker 19: and trillions in their traditional payment system, but it's growing.

858
00:42:30,360 --> 00:42:34,160
Speaker 2: So they're preparing for a world in which everything is tokenized. Right,

859
00:42:34,239 --> 00:42:36,880
Speaker 2: So we're playing up the kind of frenemy I suppose,

860
00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:39,120
Speaker 2: angle of it. But what they are doing is laying

861
00:42:39,160 --> 00:42:42,320
Speaker 2: groundwork for the state of the financial system that doesn't

862
00:42:42,400 --> 00:42:43,320
Speaker 2: quite exist yet.

863
00:42:43,719 --> 00:42:44,920
Speaker 5: That doesn't quite exist yet.

864
00:42:44,920 --> 00:42:47,080
Speaker 19: We have the IMF, I think two weeks ago, warning

865
00:42:47,120 --> 00:42:49,360
Speaker 19: that if we build too much into this space, we

866
00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:52,680
Speaker 19: might see actually a great crash because in theory everything

867
00:42:52,719 --> 00:42:55,800
Speaker 19: works send a token from two AM and Maldives to

868
00:42:55,840 --> 00:42:58,400
Speaker 19: your friend in New York. But in practice it's still

869
00:42:58,560 --> 00:43:00,560
Speaker 19: a little tough, and especially if a lot of these

870
00:43:00,719 --> 00:43:02,480
Speaker 19: from the Nasdaq to the New York Stock Is Chain,

871
00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:05,480
Speaker 19: to JP Morgan to City build their own worlds, it's

872
00:43:05,520 --> 00:43:08,280
Speaker 19: going to be even more fragmented than what we see today.

873
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:11,160
Speaker 19: So lots two still parse out in this space, but

874
00:43:11,200 --> 00:43:14,520
Speaker 19: it's exciting to see this big big banks really push

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Speaker 19: into token is NAFE token ie real world's assets, real

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Speaker 19: world Yes.

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Speaker 2: Bloombergs Isabelle Lee with the story that JP Morgan and

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Speaker 2: City squaring off on the Next Payments Frontier. So that

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Speaker 2: does it for this edition of Bloomberg Tech.

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Speaker 12: Yeah, don't forget to check out our podcast.

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Speaker 5: Why not.

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Speaker 3: You can find it on the terminal, if you're on

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Speaker 3: a line on Apple and Spotify, on iHeart ed.

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Speaker 5: Is here in New York Nantah week Right, Well, lucky.

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Speaker 2: Lady, a fifty six minutes into the show, if you've

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Speaker 2: just worked that out, congratulations, it.

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Speaker 5: Might be a holograss. It's a push into.

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Speaker 2: That recap on the pod, and it's nice to be

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Speaker 2: here with you in New York City. This is Bloomberg Tech.