1 00:00:08,840 --> 00:00:12,440 Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Saber Projection for iHeartRadio. I'm Annie Reese. 2 00:00:12,240 --> 00:00:15,000 Speaker 2: And I'm Lauren Vogelbaum, and today we have an episode 3 00:00:15,080 --> 00:00:16,840 Speaker 2: for you about hibiscus tea. 4 00:00:17,560 --> 00:00:20,960 Speaker 1: Yes, was there any particular reason this was on your mind? Lauren? 5 00:00:21,600 --> 00:00:25,079 Speaker 2: Uh, it has been on my list for a very 6 00:00:25,120 --> 00:00:29,200 Speaker 2: long time, and I really wanted to talk about it, 7 00:00:30,040 --> 00:00:35,159 Speaker 2: especially given that we are kind of entering the summer season. 8 00:00:35,280 --> 00:00:39,839 Speaker 2: What a nice time for a nice refreshing drink if 9 00:00:39,920 --> 00:00:43,880 Speaker 2: you choose an iced version of a hibiscus tea. And furthermore, 10 00:00:44,440 --> 00:00:48,120 Speaker 2: we are rolling up on Juneteenth, and so yeah, I 11 00:00:48,120 --> 00:00:50,600 Speaker 2: thought this was a great, great opportunity. 12 00:00:51,320 --> 00:00:56,000 Speaker 1: Yes, yes it is. I don't think I've ever had 13 00:00:56,080 --> 00:00:58,160 Speaker 1: hibiscus tea, to be honest with you. 14 00:00:58,240 --> 00:01:01,760 Speaker 2: No, Oh my goodness, I've definitely had it as an 15 00:01:01,800 --> 00:01:06,520 Speaker 2: agua fresca. And also some of my favorite hot teas 16 00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:08,360 Speaker 2: do have hibiscus in them. 17 00:01:08,600 --> 00:01:14,480 Speaker 1: So yeah, they sound nice. They sound oh really lovely. 18 00:01:14,760 --> 00:01:19,240 Speaker 2: So bright and zingy, so red. 19 00:01:22,959 --> 00:01:25,200 Speaker 1: Color can be important to food. 20 00:01:25,400 --> 00:01:29,479 Speaker 2: And oh absolutely yeah you eat with your eyes first. 21 00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:36,440 Speaker 1: Yes, well, I suppose this brings us to our question, sure, 22 00:01:37,000 --> 00:01:41,080 Speaker 1: hibiscus tea, what is it? 23 00:01:42,040 --> 00:01:46,880 Speaker 2: Well, Hibiscus tea is a beverage made by steeping parts 24 00:01:46,880 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 2: of the flowers of a specific type of Hibiscus makes 25 00:01:50,360 --> 00:01:54,640 Speaker 2: sense in boiling water usually and then often chilling and 26 00:01:54,680 --> 00:01:59,640 Speaker 2: sweetening that infusion to produce this like vibrant, deep pink 27 00:01:59,680 --> 00:02:03,880 Speaker 2: to parl buish red drink that is tart and fruity 28 00:02:04,160 --> 00:02:09,000 Speaker 2: and a little floral. It's often seasoned with similar or 29 00:02:09,040 --> 00:02:15,920 Speaker 2: contrasting flavors like ginger, citrus, rose, orange blossom, cinnamon, allspice, vanilla, 30 00:02:16,120 --> 00:02:21,040 Speaker 2: or mint. At heavy concentrations, and when it's sweetened, Hibiscus 31 00:02:21,040 --> 00:02:25,160 Speaker 2: tea really tastes more like a juice than a tea 32 00:02:25,520 --> 00:02:29,160 Speaker 2: or a tisane technically because it doesn't contain the tea plant, 33 00:02:29,760 --> 00:02:32,960 Speaker 2: but yeah, Hibiscus tea is sometimes called a juice. You 34 00:02:33,000 --> 00:02:35,520 Speaker 2: can mix it with fruit juices, or with soda, water, 35 00:02:35,760 --> 00:02:39,880 Speaker 2: or with liquor. The flowers can be used to make 36 00:02:40,120 --> 00:02:44,040 Speaker 2: all kinds of other things, preserves, wines, use them as 37 00:02:44,040 --> 00:02:47,480 Speaker 2: an ingredient in savory or sweet dishes. But today we're 38 00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:51,760 Speaker 2: focusing on the drinks. A lot of different cultures do 39 00:02:51,880 --> 00:02:56,080 Speaker 2: have their own virgins and customs. But like, the color 40 00:02:56,320 --> 00:02:59,760 Speaker 2: is just so fun and the flavor is so refreshing 41 00:03:00,240 --> 00:03:04,000 Speaker 2: that it is often like a small treat or a 42 00:03:04,040 --> 00:03:10,720 Speaker 2: celebratory drink for like holidays and gatherings. Hibiscus tea is 43 00:03:10,960 --> 00:03:15,320 Speaker 2: like if you could juice a jewel. It's like it's 44 00:03:15,360 --> 00:03:17,040 Speaker 2: like drinking gemstones. 45 00:03:19,040 --> 00:03:23,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a good description based on the pictures I've seen. 46 00:03:24,280 --> 00:03:27,359 Speaker 2: Yep, yep, and a tip of the hat to see 47 00:03:27,440 --> 00:03:30,480 Speaker 2: us Lewis for that one, because somewhere in the Silver 48 00:03:30,639 --> 00:03:35,320 Speaker 2: Chair they talk about juicing gemstones, and that's a line 49 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:36,640 Speaker 2: that's really stuck with me. 50 00:03:38,400 --> 00:03:38,840 Speaker 1: Love it. 51 00:03:41,600 --> 00:03:46,240 Speaker 2: Anyway, Okay, these flowers go buy a lot of names. 52 00:03:46,840 --> 00:03:51,480 Speaker 2: Roselle hibiscus is a common one in Mexican Spanish, it's 53 00:03:51,480 --> 00:03:54,880 Speaker 2: a Florida hamiica and the drink is an agua fresca 54 00:03:55,040 --> 00:03:59,840 Speaker 2: called agua de hamiica. In Jamaica, it's often called so 55 00:04:00,880 --> 00:04:03,760 Speaker 2: not to be confused with other tart tasting plants that 56 00:04:03,800 --> 00:04:06,240 Speaker 2: go by the same name, and those are kind of 57 00:04:06,240 --> 00:04:08,120 Speaker 2: the ones that are likely that you're likely to run 58 00:04:08,120 --> 00:04:11,080 Speaker 2: across in the United States. There are dozens of other 59 00:04:11,320 --> 00:04:14,520 Speaker 2: local names for this plant wherever it has grown across, 60 00:04:14,600 --> 00:04:20,120 Speaker 2: like Asia and Africa and South America. Whatever you call it, colloquially, 61 00:04:20,400 --> 00:04:24,960 Speaker 2: the botanical name for the plant is Hibiscus sabdarifa sebdarifa 62 00:04:25,360 --> 00:04:26,080 Speaker 2: I don't remember. 63 00:04:26,560 --> 00:04:26,760 Speaker 1: Yeah. 64 00:04:26,800 --> 00:04:29,680 Speaker 2: It's in the mallow family though, and is thus related 65 00:04:29,680 --> 00:04:31,880 Speaker 2: to all kinds of things that we've talked about before, 66 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:36,479 Speaker 2: from like okra to cacao to durian to yes the 67 00:04:36,480 --> 00:04:39,520 Speaker 2: plant that was originally in marshmallows before marshmallows were made 68 00:04:39,520 --> 00:04:42,279 Speaker 2: of gelatin and stuff. This plant is a woody shrub 69 00:04:42,480 --> 00:04:46,720 Speaker 2: or kind of like shrublet with often burgundy stems, and 70 00:04:46,880 --> 00:04:50,000 Speaker 2: it grows these long green leaves that are ribbed with red. 71 00:04:50,480 --> 00:04:52,680 Speaker 2: The leaves are also edible. I've read that they're like 72 00:04:52,680 --> 00:04:56,240 Speaker 2: a spicy spinach. Never tried them. Right in you can 73 00:04:56,279 --> 00:04:58,800 Speaker 2: extract strong fibers from the stems that can be used 74 00:04:58,839 --> 00:05:01,960 Speaker 2: to weave like rope and rough fabrics, though the varieties 75 00:05:01,960 --> 00:05:04,039 Speaker 2: that are used for fiber are different than the ones 76 00:05:04,160 --> 00:05:07,400 Speaker 2: used for food. Typically, the ones used for food will 77 00:05:07,440 --> 00:05:11,960 Speaker 2: bud and then bloom with this really fleshy calyx, and 78 00:05:12,000 --> 00:05:15,520 Speaker 2: the calyx is the support structure that sort of cups 79 00:05:15,520 --> 00:05:18,080 Speaker 2: the flour from the bottom of the bloom, made up 80 00:05:18,080 --> 00:05:22,680 Speaker 2: of a ring of variably fleshy sepals. Yeah, and the 81 00:05:22,760 --> 00:05:26,040 Speaker 2: calyx on this type of hibiscus will usually be a 82 00:05:26,080 --> 00:05:30,440 Speaker 2: deep blood red in color and almost a vegetable in texture. 83 00:05:30,880 --> 00:05:34,880 Speaker 2: The actual blossoms are a papery like white yellow to 84 00:05:35,000 --> 00:05:37,880 Speaker 2: pink with a red center, and then the bloom will 85 00:05:37,920 --> 00:05:41,520 Speaker 2: die back and the plant's fruit a seed pod will 86 00:05:41,560 --> 00:05:45,640 Speaker 2: develop inside the calyx, which will remain and grow with 87 00:05:45,680 --> 00:05:49,600 Speaker 2: it once that fruit is mature but not ripe, at 88 00:05:49,600 --> 00:05:51,960 Speaker 2: which point the fruit will dry out and crack open. 89 00:05:52,520 --> 00:05:56,080 Speaker 2: Once it's mature, you can harvest the whole head and 90 00:05:56,120 --> 00:05:58,839 Speaker 2: then peel and probably discard the fruit unless you're saving 91 00:05:58,839 --> 00:06:02,920 Speaker 2: it for seeds, and save the red calyx to use 92 00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:06,760 Speaker 2: fresh or freeze or dry. You can also preserve them 93 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:09,480 Speaker 2: by pickling or canning and syrup, but that's not usually 94 00:06:09,560 --> 00:06:12,240 Speaker 2: what you're going for in drinks unless you want like 95 00:06:12,279 --> 00:06:14,880 Speaker 2: a really awesome garnish for a drink maybe, And that 96 00:06:14,920 --> 00:06:17,599 Speaker 2: would be pretty because when they are fresh they are 97 00:06:17,680 --> 00:06:24,440 Speaker 2: really stunning, just like a slightly translucent ruby crimson colors, 98 00:06:24,760 --> 00:06:29,920 Speaker 2: sort of like alien looking pods, like like a cartoon 99 00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:32,400 Speaker 2: flower bud or like a weird puppet. 100 00:06:33,000 --> 00:06:35,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, there's a lot of great hand gestures happening. 101 00:06:36,000 --> 00:06:40,000 Speaker 2: By the way, listeners, if you sort of make the 102 00:06:40,040 --> 00:06:43,560 Speaker 2: gesture you would make to operate a hand puppet, that's 103 00:06:43,680 --> 00:06:47,960 Speaker 2: kind of what they look like. Anyway. They will dry 104 00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:51,120 Speaker 2: down to a deep burgundy. And there are varieties that 105 00:06:51,200 --> 00:06:55,920 Speaker 2: have green calusies, but they're less popular for making drinks 106 00:06:55,920 --> 00:06:59,880 Speaker 2: with because they're not as pretty. Drinks made with this 107 00:07:00,240 --> 00:07:05,680 Speaker 2: a flower bit are popular around lots of the tropical 108 00:07:05,720 --> 00:07:09,440 Speaker 2: to subtropical world where the plants thrive. You know, yeah, 109 00:07:09,480 --> 00:07:12,320 Speaker 2: like the color is pretty, the flavor is tart, sort 110 00:07:12,320 --> 00:07:15,560 Speaker 2: of like cranberry. It is a wonderful hot weather drink 111 00:07:16,200 --> 00:07:19,400 Speaker 2: around the Caribbean. Punches made with hibiscus are also traditionally 112 00:07:19,520 --> 00:07:23,800 Speaker 2: enjoyed around Christmas. Teas made with hibiscus can be served 113 00:07:23,800 --> 00:07:26,120 Speaker 2: hot as well. If you have ever had one of 114 00:07:26,160 --> 00:07:31,400 Speaker 2: the Celestial Seasonings zinger flavors, the zinger in question is hibiscus. 115 00:07:32,000 --> 00:07:32,680 Speaker 1: That's what that is. 116 00:07:35,840 --> 00:07:40,640 Speaker 2: Oh okay, yeah, yeah, super good. I feel like Celestial 117 00:07:40,640 --> 00:07:43,560 Speaker 2: Seasonings is a weird company. There's a little ping in 118 00:07:43,600 --> 00:07:46,040 Speaker 2: my brain going like are they strange? And I'm not 119 00:07:46,080 --> 00:07:47,440 Speaker 2: sure off the top of my head. So here we 120 00:07:47,480 --> 00:07:51,320 Speaker 2: are not a sponsor. We can say not a sponsor, hey, 121 00:07:54,320 --> 00:07:58,080 Speaker 2: but at any rate. Also, also, hibiscus tea is like 122 00:07:58,120 --> 00:08:03,520 Speaker 2: a cultural precursor to a bunch of other vibrantly red 123 00:08:03,560 --> 00:08:08,560 Speaker 2: colored drinks in Black American cultures. Red drink is a 124 00:08:08,760 --> 00:08:12,440 Speaker 2: catch all term for bright red drinks that can feature 125 00:08:12,520 --> 00:08:16,160 Speaker 2: any number of ingredients and flavors. You know, maybe hibiscus, 126 00:08:16,200 --> 00:08:20,840 Speaker 2: but maybe strawberry, cherry, raspberry, sumac, cranberry, maybe a red 127 00:08:20,920 --> 00:08:23,760 Speaker 2: kool aid or big red soda, or a lemonade that's 128 00:08:23,800 --> 00:08:26,240 Speaker 2: been taken straight past pink and all the way to 129 00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:31,080 Speaker 2: very red. You know. Different regions or neighborhoods or households 130 00:08:31,240 --> 00:08:35,680 Speaker 2: may have preferences or traditions, and these are popular, especially 131 00:08:35,720 --> 00:08:41,480 Speaker 2: around Juneteenth. I will say that if you're looking to 132 00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:44,199 Speaker 2: work with hibiscus for the first time at home, look 133 00:08:44,240 --> 00:08:46,520 Speaker 2: up a few recipes. I mean usually probably do that 134 00:08:46,559 --> 00:08:49,200 Speaker 2: with any new ingredient. But yeah, it's often suggested to 135 00:08:49,240 --> 00:08:52,160 Speaker 2: do like a prolonged simmer instead of like a brief 136 00:08:52,240 --> 00:08:54,360 Speaker 2: steep to get the most out of your flowers. 137 00:08:55,440 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 1: Yes, yes, and again, listeners please write. 138 00:08:59,840 --> 00:09:01,840 Speaker 2: In oh my goodness, yes. 139 00:09:02,480 --> 00:09:06,520 Speaker 1: Yes, Well what about the nutrition. 140 00:09:07,679 --> 00:09:11,720 Speaker 2: Really depends on how you make your hibiscus tea. Perhaps obviously, 141 00:09:11,800 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 2: the more sugar you use, the more of a treat 142 00:09:14,559 --> 00:09:18,040 Speaker 2: that will probably count as but treats are nice. High 143 00:09:18,040 --> 00:09:20,839 Speaker 2: biscus flowers do contain a lot of compounds that are 144 00:09:20,840 --> 00:09:25,880 Speaker 2: like potentially useful in our bodies, and these teas and 145 00:09:26,080 --> 00:09:30,440 Speaker 2: extracts thereof are being investigated for positive effects, including like 146 00:09:30,480 --> 00:09:35,000 Speaker 2: lowering blood pressure. But yeah, savor motto. Bodies are complicated. 147 00:09:35,080 --> 00:09:39,440 Speaker 2: Nutrition is complicated. Before ingesting a medicinal dose of anything, 148 00:09:39,559 --> 00:09:42,280 Speaker 2: you should check with a healthcare provider. And we're not that. 149 00:09:43,480 --> 00:09:48,439 Speaker 1: No, nope, who were not, No birds. I do appreciate 150 00:09:48,480 --> 00:09:53,199 Speaker 1: how that sounds like the very the quick message they 151 00:09:53,240 --> 00:09:57,760 Speaker 1: read at the end of medicine ads. Though medicinal ads 152 00:09:57,760 --> 00:10:03,480 Speaker 1: in the US the fine say yeah, yeah, yes, yes, 153 00:10:03,559 --> 00:10:05,559 Speaker 1: that's sabers version of that. 154 00:10:06,200 --> 00:10:11,520 Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, with less vomiting and diarrhea involved, usually hopefully 155 00:10:11,600 --> 00:10:13,800 Speaker 2: so hopefully hopefully so. 156 00:10:15,240 --> 00:10:16,880 Speaker 1: We do have some numbers for you. 157 00:10:17,679 --> 00:10:22,480 Speaker 2: A couple all right. So in Mexico, the state of 158 00:10:22,559 --> 00:10:26,480 Speaker 2: Guerrero grows the most of this type of hibiscus, with 159 00:10:26,600 --> 00:10:30,640 Speaker 2: some six thousand farmers raising some eleven million pounds of 160 00:10:30,640 --> 00:10:34,640 Speaker 2: it every year as of twenty nineteen. Back around the 161 00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:37,800 Speaker 2: turn of the twenty first century, the FAO, the Food 162 00:10:37,800 --> 00:10:44,079 Speaker 2: and Agriculture Organization of the UN, noted that some fifteen 163 00:10:44,200 --> 00:10:50,680 Speaker 2: million metric tons were traded internationally every year, with China 164 00:10:50,720 --> 00:10:54,480 Speaker 2: and Thailand producing the most and the US and Germany 165 00:10:54,800 --> 00:10:58,959 Speaker 2: importing the most. They also noted in the same report 166 00:10:59,080 --> 00:11:06,400 Speaker 2: that Sudan produces the best. Really, yeah, they were like 167 00:11:06,440 --> 00:11:07,880 Speaker 2: this one. 168 00:11:08,480 --> 00:11:10,559 Speaker 1: I don't know that I've seen that before. 169 00:11:10,760 --> 00:11:12,520 Speaker 2: All right, I'm like, all right. 170 00:11:13,600 --> 00:11:18,920 Speaker 1: Okay, oh my goodness. All right, well, we do have 171 00:11:19,040 --> 00:11:20,120 Speaker 1: quite a history for you. 172 00:11:20,720 --> 00:11:23,480 Speaker 2: We do, and we are going to get into that. 173 00:11:23,600 --> 00:11:25,480 Speaker 2: But first we are going to get into a quick 174 00:11:25,480 --> 00:11:37,280 Speaker 2: break for a word from our sponsors, and we're back. 175 00:11:37,280 --> 00:11:44,000 Speaker 1: Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you, okay. So, Hibiscus originated 176 00:11:44,040 --> 00:11:48,679 Speaker 1: in West Africa, where it was also domesticated. Another species 177 00:11:48,720 --> 00:11:52,720 Speaker 1: may have originated in Asia. There are some differing theories 178 00:11:52,960 --> 00:11:57,400 Speaker 1: about whether the Asian variety evolved from the African variety 179 00:11:57,960 --> 00:12:01,800 Speaker 1: or vice versa, or if it was a simultaneous event. 180 00:12:02,880 --> 00:12:06,440 Speaker 1: Research suggest that some of the earliest high biscus teas 181 00:12:06,679 --> 00:12:10,319 Speaker 1: go back hundreds of years out of West Africa. These 182 00:12:10,440 --> 00:12:14,360 Speaker 1: teas were believed to be medicinal and sometimes incorporated in 183 00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:18,080 Speaker 1: ceremonies and may have been an offering for people coming 184 00:12:18,080 --> 00:12:19,880 Speaker 1: to visit your home. So if somebody was visiting you, 185 00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:22,640 Speaker 1: you'd be like, have some high biscus to you, very 186 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:28,080 Speaker 1: hospital Yeah. Other sources put it back to ancient Egypt 187 00:12:28,200 --> 00:12:33,400 Speaker 1: and Asia, where it was also it was used primarily medicinally. 188 00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:38,400 Speaker 1: Historians believe that the African genus of hibiscus was introduced 189 00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:42,400 Speaker 1: to the Caribbean with European colonization beginning in the early 190 00:12:42,480 --> 00:12:48,000 Speaker 1: fifteen hundreds. Enslaved West Africans forcibly relocated to the Caribbean 191 00:12:48,280 --> 00:12:53,520 Speaker 1: brought the plant and traditions around it with them. Growing 192 00:12:53,520 --> 00:12:57,320 Speaker 1: food stuffs from Africa and small subsistence gardens was a 193 00:12:57,360 --> 00:13:00,360 Speaker 1: way to hold on to pieces of their homelands and 194 00:13:00,360 --> 00:13:04,120 Speaker 1: and the knowledge around these plants, and a form of 195 00:13:04,200 --> 00:13:08,600 Speaker 1: resistance and hope. Hibiscus, which took off in the Caribbean 196 00:13:08,760 --> 00:13:11,560 Speaker 1: and in parts of the Americas, was a staple in 197 00:13:11,600 --> 00:13:16,000 Speaker 1: many of these gardens. Most often it was used medicinally 198 00:13:16,240 --> 00:13:19,480 Speaker 1: or consumed as a type of drink, just as it 199 00:13:19,559 --> 00:13:23,240 Speaker 1: had been in Africa, with the addition of ingredients available 200 00:13:23,360 --> 00:13:26,360 Speaker 1: in the Caribbean, like certain spices would go in there 201 00:13:27,840 --> 00:13:33,280 Speaker 1: many variations with many names spread across the Americas where 202 00:13:33,400 --> 00:13:38,160 Speaker 1: hibiscus was available, it served as a reminder of the 203 00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:41,960 Speaker 1: survivor of their ancestors. For the people who were making 204 00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:48,120 Speaker 1: it under these violent conditions of colonialism, it was symbolic 205 00:13:48,160 --> 00:13:53,000 Speaker 1: of bloodshed, but it was also symbolic of strength. We've survived. 206 00:13:53,440 --> 00:13:59,600 Speaker 1: We should celebrate this. Yeah. Meanwhile, the Asian genus of 207 00:13:59,679 --> 00:14:03,440 Speaker 1: hyperscus likely arrived to the Caribbean in the eighteen thirties 208 00:14:03,480 --> 00:14:07,400 Speaker 1: with the first waves of indentured laborers from Asia, an 209 00:14:07,480 --> 00:14:11,320 Speaker 1: exploitative system put in place after the abolition of the 210 00:14:11,320 --> 00:14:15,680 Speaker 1: Atlantic slave trade. So kind of another terrible system that 211 00:14:15,720 --> 00:14:20,680 Speaker 1: got put in place. Yep, yep. In some places like India, 212 00:14:20,720 --> 00:14:24,960 Speaker 1: the high biscus flower had spiritual and symbolic connotations that 213 00:14:25,040 --> 00:14:30,560 Speaker 1: were in some cases adopted or adapted to Caribbean beliefs, 214 00:14:30,880 --> 00:14:37,080 Speaker 1: so it also had that kind of symbolicism or religious aspect. 215 00:14:37,400 --> 00:14:40,400 Speaker 2: Stepping back a bit, Hibiscus may have hit Mexico from 216 00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:43,680 Speaker 2: the west coast, as it was simultaneously arriving in the 217 00:14:43,720 --> 00:14:48,280 Speaker 2: Caribbean to the east. By the fifteen sixties, the Spanish 218 00:14:48,360 --> 00:14:51,800 Speaker 2: were building a trade route from the Philippines to Mexico 219 00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:55,280 Speaker 2: and then overland to the east coast, and then from 220 00:14:55,320 --> 00:14:59,960 Speaker 2: Mexico to Spain. So from the Pacific, the Spanish landed 221 00:15:00,120 --> 00:15:03,800 Speaker 2: in the port city of Acapulco in what's now Correro, 222 00:15:04,960 --> 00:15:08,040 Speaker 2: which is the leading producer of hibiscus today. 223 00:15:09,800 --> 00:15:16,640 Speaker 1: Yes. Carlinaeus gave hibiscus its scientific name in seventeen fifty three, 224 00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:23,360 Speaker 1: and food historian Adrian Miller believes that hibiscus tea combined 225 00:15:23,400 --> 00:15:27,080 Speaker 1: with Cola nut tea because coalon nuts were another crop 226 00:15:27,160 --> 00:15:31,640 Speaker 1: that were often grown alongside hibiscus by the enslaved, led 227 00:15:31,680 --> 00:15:34,680 Speaker 1: to the creation of red drink, which yes is a 228 00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:38,200 Speaker 1: category of drinks that grew to include kool aid and 229 00:15:38,280 --> 00:15:43,160 Speaker 1: carbonated red drinks. Records indicate that there were early red 230 00:15:43,240 --> 00:15:47,080 Speaker 1: drinks on plantations in the American South during enslavement in 231 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:52,320 Speaker 1: after emancipation, and they were a combination of water, molasses, 232 00:15:52,320 --> 00:15:57,600 Speaker 1: and sometimes other herbs and spices. At the time, molasses 233 00:15:58,000 --> 00:16:01,080 Speaker 1: varied in hue and could have a red tone, so 234 00:16:01,120 --> 00:16:05,000 Speaker 1: that could have added to the color. This drink later 235 00:16:05,080 --> 00:16:10,360 Speaker 1: became associated with June teenth. If hibiscus wasn't available, cherries 236 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:12,880 Speaker 1: or some type of berry to get that red hue 237 00:16:12,920 --> 00:16:19,920 Speaker 1: was used. It was and is typically a very celebratory drink. Yes, 238 00:16:20,520 --> 00:16:23,080 Speaker 1: The first known reference to red drink goes back to 239 00:16:23,480 --> 00:16:27,840 Speaker 1: the practice amongst Black Americans of putting strawberries, cherries, sumac, 240 00:16:28,000 --> 00:16:31,800 Speaker 1: or raspberries in their lemonade to add that red coloring. 241 00:16:32,000 --> 00:16:36,280 Speaker 1: In the eighteen seventies, this beverage was often served at 242 00:16:36,320 --> 00:16:42,320 Speaker 1: emancipation ceremonies or anniversaries. It was also popularly associated with circuses, 243 00:16:42,440 --> 00:16:46,560 Speaker 1: to the point it was sometimes called circus lemonade. Over 244 00:16:46,600 --> 00:16:51,000 Speaker 1: the ensuing decades, a handful of articles referenced emancipation celebrations 245 00:16:51,040 --> 00:16:56,400 Speaker 1: that featured something like red pop or red lemonade. Powdered 246 00:16:56,480 --> 00:17:00,000 Speaker 1: kool aid was invented in the nineteen twenties. The red 247 00:17:00,080 --> 00:17:03,640 Speaker 1: soda Big Red was invented in Texas in nineteen thirty seven. 248 00:17:04,119 --> 00:17:08,879 Speaker 1: Both are pieces of the story of red drink. Caribbean 249 00:17:08,960 --> 00:17:13,080 Speaker 1: immigrants to America in the late twentieth century helped popularize 250 00:17:13,280 --> 00:17:18,199 Speaker 1: hibiscus tea in the United States. But this brings us 251 00:17:18,280 --> 00:17:23,520 Speaker 1: two a point I feel we'd come across all too often, 252 00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:28,760 Speaker 1: when hibiscus tea was commercialized on a large scale, it 253 00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:32,840 Speaker 1: often was reduced to spa water, which is like, you know, 254 00:17:33,080 --> 00:17:38,040 Speaker 1: when you walk into I'm picturing an all white, bright office, 255 00:17:39,080 --> 00:17:42,679 Speaker 1: all white coloring wise, but also probably but you know, 256 00:17:43,320 --> 00:17:51,000 Speaker 1: yeah yeah, yeah, very very clean, sterile sort of looking. Yeah, yeah, yeah, 257 00:17:51,119 --> 00:17:54,320 Speaker 1: where there would be this water jug that would have 258 00:17:54,400 --> 00:17:57,360 Speaker 1: cucumbers in it. That's what when I think of spa water, 259 00:17:57,440 --> 00:17:59,800 Speaker 1: that's what I typically q. 260 00:18:00,520 --> 00:18:05,200 Speaker 2: Or lemon or yeah, maybe hibiscus flowers. 261 00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:08,920 Speaker 1: Yes, And this was a pretty trendy thing in the 262 00:18:08,960 --> 00:18:14,560 Speaker 1: twenty tens, this spa water thing, But that completely erases 263 00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:18,160 Speaker 1: the history of high biscus tea and what it means 264 00:18:18,520 --> 00:18:21,199 Speaker 1: to so many And this led to a lot of 265 00:18:21,320 --> 00:18:27,600 Speaker 1: conversations around cultural appropriation as well. It should as well 266 00:18:28,040 --> 00:18:31,200 Speaker 1: it should because that's really reducing it. 267 00:18:34,080 --> 00:18:39,239 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's really flattening it out of right, out of 268 00:18:39,320 --> 00:18:42,919 Speaker 2: any meaning. And yes, the flowers are pretty like, yes, 269 00:18:43,440 --> 00:18:48,679 Speaker 2: it's it's lovely, but gosh, you could do that in 270 00:18:48,720 --> 00:18:53,520 Speaker 2: a slightly more contextual way, which is interesting, which is 271 00:18:53,560 --> 00:18:57,000 Speaker 2: like the fun part about food, right right, or I 272 00:18:57,000 --> 00:18:58,600 Speaker 2: mean like, of course we agree with that, we run 273 00:18:58,600 --> 00:18:59,680 Speaker 2: a food podcast, but. 274 00:19:01,080 --> 00:19:04,520 Speaker 1: No exactly because there was like a specific example that 275 00:19:04,600 --> 00:19:06,720 Speaker 1: was given in one of the things one of the 276 00:19:06,880 --> 00:19:11,720 Speaker 1: articles I was reading, and it wasn't necessarily hibiscus tea, 277 00:19:11,800 --> 00:19:15,159 Speaker 1: but it was related, and it just felt so like 278 00:19:17,440 --> 00:19:21,520 Speaker 1: this person doesn't know she like she feels like she 279 00:19:21,600 --> 00:19:23,840 Speaker 1: created this thing for the first time when there's this 280 00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:29,560 Speaker 1: huge history of resistance and what it means and all 281 00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:34,320 Speaker 1: of the complexities of it, and you're like, here's this spat. 282 00:19:34,040 --> 00:19:35,560 Speaker 2: Water here you go. 283 00:19:36,280 --> 00:19:40,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, okay, yeah, always good to know where you're 284 00:19:40,960 --> 00:19:43,080 Speaker 1: getting your information from. 285 00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:46,640 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I mean it's also I mean, look like 286 00:19:46,640 --> 00:19:49,960 Speaker 2: like being willfully ignorant isn't cool, but like we're all 287 00:19:50,000 --> 00:19:53,119 Speaker 2: ignorant about stuff, like you know, like there's you know, 288 00:19:53,960 --> 00:19:56,320 Speaker 2: I learned new things every day as part of this job. 289 00:19:56,600 --> 00:20:03,199 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, and being willing to acknowledge that if you 290 00:20:03,320 --> 00:20:04,720 Speaker 1: were in. 291 00:20:04,760 --> 00:20:09,879 Speaker 2: The row, yeah, trying to think about it before you really. 292 00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:18,280 Speaker 1: First, but if you did get it wrong, yeah yeah yeah. 293 00:20:18,359 --> 00:20:22,240 Speaker 1: I did want to add here, though, a smaller, often 294 00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:26,840 Speaker 1: family owned businesses operated by folks from places with hibiscus 295 00:20:26,880 --> 00:20:30,919 Speaker 1: tea traditions offer products while still honoring the history, so 296 00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:38,119 Speaker 1: you can get not all commercialized. Hibiscus tea is something 297 00:20:38,160 --> 00:20:43,919 Speaker 1: that is disconnected from the history or not even at 298 00:20:43,960 --> 00:20:48,159 Speaker 1: all what it is in some cases advertising is like 299 00:20:48,200 --> 00:20:49,800 Speaker 1: this is a business tea and that's not what it 300 00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:53,959 Speaker 1: is at all. But there are there are people who 301 00:20:54,040 --> 00:20:59,080 Speaker 1: are offering products who do know the history and are 302 00:20:59,160 --> 00:21:01,640 Speaker 1: offering what the thing is. 303 00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:05,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, Like, if you've got a Caribbean market somewhere around 304 00:21:05,640 --> 00:21:11,480 Speaker 2: your neighborhood, their chances are that they sell either in 305 00:21:11,600 --> 00:21:14,800 Speaker 2: like a tetra pack or perhaps fresh a like Sorrel, 306 00:21:15,320 --> 00:21:20,680 Speaker 2: maybe like Sorrel with ginger drink in a cold case somewhere, 307 00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:24,040 Speaker 2: which is probably delightful. And that's one of the things 308 00:21:24,040 --> 00:21:25,439 Speaker 2: that I always pick up when I go to that 309 00:21:25,520 --> 00:21:30,560 Speaker 2: kind of spot. Most of the Mexican markets around Atlanta 310 00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:36,000 Speaker 2: certainly have some like floor de Hamica hanging out in 311 00:21:36,040 --> 00:21:40,240 Speaker 2: like little dried pouches somewhere in the store. Yeah, I 312 00:21:40,240 --> 00:21:43,800 Speaker 2: don't know. It's I feel like we are so lucky 313 00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:48,920 Speaker 2: to have so many people bringing their food culture in 314 00:21:50,160 --> 00:21:53,840 Speaker 2: and sharing it, and I you know, this is this 315 00:21:53,880 --> 00:21:59,440 Speaker 2: is one of those cases where it's like gotten easier 316 00:21:59,760 --> 00:22:04,320 Speaker 2: and to them suddenly harder to find that kind of thing. 317 00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:11,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, absolutely, And this is an episode I would 318 00:22:11,600 --> 00:22:22,720 Speaker 1: recommend a sign further reading, just because this drink did 319 00:22:23,520 --> 00:22:27,960 Speaker 1: branch off and mean so much and so many things 320 00:22:28,040 --> 00:22:34,360 Speaker 1: to different cultures. Yeah that we couldn't go into all 321 00:22:34,400 --> 00:22:41,760 Speaker 1: of it, but it really is amazing and important history 322 00:22:43,720 --> 00:22:46,399 Speaker 1: and why this why it matters that we should know 323 00:22:47,920 --> 00:22:51,879 Speaker 1: the history of it when we were partaking. 324 00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:55,679 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and and reading personal accounts about it is 325 00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:57,240 Speaker 2: really beautiful. 326 00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:04,440 Speaker 1: It's really cool and you can do that, you can, thankfully, 327 00:23:04,600 --> 00:23:06,920 Speaker 1: another thing we can be grateful for people have written 328 00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:11,480 Speaker 1: about it and they've done research into it, So recommend 329 00:23:12,119 --> 00:23:15,680 Speaker 1: that you look that up. But I think that's what 330 00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:18,200 Speaker 1: we have to say about High Biscus Tea for now. 331 00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:22,320 Speaker 2: I believe it is. We would also love to hear 332 00:23:22,359 --> 00:23:25,639 Speaker 2: from you if you already have personal experiences that you 333 00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:28,679 Speaker 2: would like to share. We do already have some listener 334 00:23:28,720 --> 00:23:30,160 Speaker 2: mail for you, though, and we are going to get 335 00:23:30,160 --> 00:23:31,800 Speaker 2: into that as soon as we get back from one 336 00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:44,520 Speaker 2: more quick break for a word from our sponsors, and 337 00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:44,920 Speaker 2: we're back. 338 00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:48,200 Speaker 1: Thank you, sponsor, Yes, thank you, And we're back with 339 00:23:48,600 --> 00:24:00,480 Speaker 1: oh this listener. Huh do you ever have a day 340 00:24:00,520 --> 00:24:04,440 Speaker 1: dream of destroying someone in karaoke? 341 00:24:09,400 --> 00:24:09,720 Speaker 2: Wow? 342 00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:12,000 Speaker 1: That's just very specific? 343 00:24:13,520 --> 00:24:13,840 Speaker 2: You know what? 344 00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:17,240 Speaker 1: No, I don't, I I'm. 345 00:24:17,200 --> 00:24:21,680 Speaker 2: You are you are like, I'm solidly seventy percent more 346 00:24:21,680 --> 00:24:26,719 Speaker 2: competitive than I am. I'm I'm a little like timid. 347 00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:28,520 Speaker 2: I'm like, what if we play a game where we 348 00:24:28,560 --> 00:24:29,560 Speaker 2: all win at the end. 349 00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:37,320 Speaker 1: I'm talking about revenge though. Oh no, I'm better than you. 350 00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:41,520 Speaker 1: But like, here's this song and I'm going to absolutely 351 00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:42,159 Speaker 1: ruin you. 352 00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:45,240 Speaker 2: I've done that. 353 00:24:46,520 --> 00:24:47,240 Speaker 1: I have to. 354 00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:52,760 Speaker 2: Not positive that the message got across or not, but 355 00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:54,080 Speaker 2: I've definitely done that. 356 00:24:54,200 --> 00:24:59,200 Speaker 1: So okay, okay, Well, let's just say I've been having 357 00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:03,639 Speaker 1: this day dream lately and I that's kind of what 358 00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:07,360 Speaker 1: was coming through, not related to the topic our listeners. 359 00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:13,960 Speaker 1: Sometimes it's just whatever I'm sharing. Yeah, but yeah, we'll 360 00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:25,560 Speaker 1: see look out cool. Yeah yeah, and now you'll know 361 00:25:25,680 --> 00:25:29,040 Speaker 1: because we do karaoke together, so you'll be like, oh, 362 00:25:30,560 --> 00:25:31,160 Speaker 1: here it is. 363 00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:33,119 Speaker 2: I know at least one that you do in a 364 00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:36,080 Speaker 2: revenge type manner. But go ahead, Yes. 365 00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:42,440 Speaker 1: I have a couple songs. Indeed. Well, I'm sure that's 366 00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:49,399 Speaker 1: totally normal. Healthy. Okay. So Michael Rip took a bartending 367 00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:53,719 Speaker 1: class back in two thousand and four. Yikes, the mnemonic 368 00:25:54,040 --> 00:25:59,760 Speaker 1: for an Alabama slammer was slow slow gin southern southern 369 00:25:59,760 --> 00:26:06,840 Speaker 1: comet awl emaretto. Uh huh, Somewhere around that time, my 370 00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:10,439 Speaker 1: girlfriend discovered Red Devils, which are pretty good too. Is 371 00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:16,359 Speaker 1: basically an Alabama slammer mixed with a kamakazi, so slow 372 00:26:16,520 --> 00:26:26,080 Speaker 1: Southern apl with very vodka, little lime, time triple sack. Okay, 373 00:26:26,840 --> 00:26:29,800 Speaker 1: all right, if I was naming that, I'd probably call 374 00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:34,240 Speaker 1: it a Birmingham since a Cosmopolitan is basically a red 375 00:26:34,640 --> 00:26:39,439 Speaker 1: cranberry Kamakazi, and Birmingham is the capital of Alabama. But 376 00:26:39,760 --> 00:26:43,800 Speaker 1: I digress. You mentioned TGI Fridays in that episode, and 377 00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:47,800 Speaker 1: it's sad what it's become. We might have actually discovered 378 00:26:47,840 --> 00:26:51,439 Speaker 1: Red Devils there around that time. We were all in 379 00:26:51,480 --> 00:26:56,040 Speaker 1: our early twenties, and this was before Friday's descended into streamlined, 380 00:26:56,160 --> 00:27:01,520 Speaker 1: corporate bland nonsense. They had a legit cocktail book on 381 00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:04,119 Speaker 1: every table and it was a solid place to go 382 00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:07,520 Speaker 1: as a group of young people in the evening. Food apps, 383 00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:11,080 Speaker 1: good drinks, The bartenders were good and trained, and we 384 00:27:11,160 --> 00:27:16,240 Speaker 1: spent many a night there. I thank you for sending 385 00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:23,120 Speaker 1: this in. Yes, I feel like I've only experienced TGI 386 00:27:23,280 --> 00:27:26,879 Speaker 1: Fridays as it is now. I don't think I experienced before, 387 00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:29,800 Speaker 1: experienced it before it changed. 388 00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:33,120 Speaker 2: Oh wow, Yeah, I think I've mentioned on the show 389 00:27:33,160 --> 00:27:37,920 Speaker 2: before perhaps this is what you're referencing. I don't remember 390 00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:41,720 Speaker 2: what I've said that. Right when I was a teenager 391 00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:47,560 Speaker 2: in my little strip mall of a hometown in South Florida, 392 00:27:48,200 --> 00:27:51,600 Speaker 2: one of the places that was like open, relatively late, 393 00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:56,040 Speaker 2: and tolerant of teenagers was a TGI Fridays, And we 394 00:27:56,200 --> 00:28:01,560 Speaker 2: partially liked it because even as teenagers, they had they 395 00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:03,320 Speaker 2: they had like a hole, they had a whole lot 396 00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:08,280 Speaker 2: of mocktails, and so we felt very adult ordering our 397 00:28:08,440 --> 00:28:14,000 Speaker 2: like silly layered juice blends or whatever it was. And 398 00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:20,560 Speaker 2: uh yeah, yeah, no, they they were. They were really 399 00:28:20,600 --> 00:28:25,840 Speaker 2: on the forefront of something. And I earnestly like I 400 00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:28,800 Speaker 2: say this partially because, like I've said before that my 401 00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:32,200 Speaker 2: dad was a chef or restaurant industry at any rate, 402 00:28:32,280 --> 00:28:36,920 Speaker 2: and and he knew a guy who worked high up 403 00:28:37,080 --> 00:28:40,920 Speaker 2: in like concept stuff at TGA Fridays right around when 404 00:28:40,960 --> 00:28:47,600 Speaker 2: they became this giant cocktail book type of place. And 405 00:28:49,240 --> 00:28:51,800 Speaker 2: that was a really fascinating time to have a little 406 00:28:51,840 --> 00:28:55,320 Speaker 2: bit of an eye into the restaurant industry because it's 407 00:28:55,360 --> 00:28:59,960 Speaker 2: sort of when a lot of the kitchen shortcuts were 408 00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:03,480 Speaker 2: were being implemented when places started being able to have 409 00:29:03,520 --> 00:29:07,240 Speaker 2: these giant menus because of stuff happening behind the scenes 410 00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:12,520 Speaker 2: like factories and and other companies. And I don't know, 411 00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:15,680 Speaker 2: I don't know. It's always so interesting the way that 412 00:29:15,720 --> 00:29:17,120 Speaker 2: all of that stuff works. 413 00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:21,720 Speaker 1: It is, it is. And in my equivalent, I had 414 00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:25,800 Speaker 1: an apple Pie's, so you yeah, I had an Applebee's, 415 00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:29,760 Speaker 1: So I understand what you're so similar vibe really like, yeah, 416 00:29:29,800 --> 00:29:33,320 Speaker 1: and it was the place you would go when you were, 417 00:29:33,520 --> 00:29:38,280 Speaker 1: you know, a teenager looking for kind of an adult vibe. 418 00:29:38,320 --> 00:29:44,360 Speaker 1: I don't know, Yeah, get your mock tails. But yeah, no, Now, 419 00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:46,120 Speaker 1: I had a great time at a TGI Friday, So 420 00:29:46,160 --> 00:29:49,680 Speaker 1: I know I told that story, But I I did 421 00:29:49,720 --> 00:29:52,440 Speaker 1: the thing where at at an airport where they're like, 422 00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:55,479 Speaker 1: we'll pay you eight hundred dollars and pay for your 423 00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:58,920 Speaker 1: time if you'll go the next day. Yeah, And I 424 00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:01,520 Speaker 1: did it, and I they gave me a lot of 425 00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:05,280 Speaker 1: money to go to teach. And I kind of had 426 00:30:05,280 --> 00:30:07,600 Speaker 1: a great time honestly because I was in the airport, 427 00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:13,360 Speaker 1: so I was looking around and just enjoying what TGI 428 00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:17,600 Speaker 1: Fridays has to offer. Not a sponsor, not a sponsor. 429 00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:27,760 Speaker 2: Oh no, But also thank you for this little bartending 430 00:30:27,840 --> 00:30:33,560 Speaker 2: guide up here. Yes, that's very funny and only slightly terrifying. 431 00:30:35,520 --> 00:30:38,720 Speaker 1: Yeah, I very much enjoy this. This is one of 432 00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:41,160 Speaker 1: those like glimpses into a world that I don't know 433 00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:45,479 Speaker 1: much about and that I'm intrigued so much by. So 434 00:30:45,640 --> 00:30:51,120 Speaker 1: thank you. Oh oh goodness. 435 00:30:51,920 --> 00:30:57,480 Speaker 2: Noah wrote about the Silver Palette cookbook. So you asked 436 00:30:57,480 --> 00:31:00,000 Speaker 2: if any of us had a specific relationship with these 437 00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:03,600 Speaker 2: Silver Palletate cookbook and I got to say, from my childhood, 438 00:31:03,880 --> 00:31:05,840 Speaker 2: I cannot sing its praise is enough. 439 00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:07,400 Speaker 1: Picture this. 440 00:31:07,760 --> 00:31:10,600 Speaker 2: It's the early nineteen nineties and you're a seven to 441 00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:13,800 Speaker 2: thirteen year old kid who is very interested in cooking 442 00:31:13,880 --> 00:31:17,280 Speaker 2: and food. You've mastered the basics and the family standards, 443 00:31:17,440 --> 00:31:21,520 Speaker 2: but what's wild and interesting? The stretch goals something accessible 444 00:31:21,560 --> 00:31:25,680 Speaker 2: but fancy and fine. It is pre Internet and there 445 00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:28,320 Speaker 2: are a smattering of cookbooks on the shelf. There's a 446 00:31:28,360 --> 00:31:31,720 Speaker 2: Better Homes and Gardens book from nineteen fifty seven, interesting 447 00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:36,240 Speaker 2: in concept, but you're a tween latchkey kid. Oven hamburgers, 448 00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:41,040 Speaker 2: pork roast, some basic sandwiches, lasagna, etc. Doesn't interest you 449 00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:43,800 Speaker 2: at all. This is the best old hat and more 450 00:31:43,800 --> 00:31:47,080 Speaker 2: of a reference. Then the kid's cookbooks. Great for some 451 00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:49,360 Speaker 2: snacks or staples. I don't really want to make peanut 452 00:31:49,400 --> 00:31:51,760 Speaker 2: butter cookies. Pancakes for the morning is kind of blab. 453 00:31:52,040 --> 00:31:55,800 Speaker 2: Chocolate cover bananas are neat I guess than the others. 454 00:31:56,360 --> 00:31:58,880 Speaker 2: Moose wood is stuff for hippies. No twelve year old 455 00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:02,720 Speaker 2: wants to make a kale based soup. Then A Shining 456 00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:07,320 Speaker 2: Light in the darkness the Silver Palette cookbook. These women 457 00:32:07,400 --> 00:32:11,880 Speaker 2: are serious about food, but really the joy, focus, blurbs 458 00:32:12,080 --> 00:32:16,080 Speaker 2: and expanded notation really sent me. It was earth shattering. 459 00:32:17,520 --> 00:32:18,000 Speaker 1: Not just a. 460 00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:21,040 Speaker 2: Cookbook, but a book about food. They'll take a few 461 00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:24,040 Speaker 2: pages just to talk about pasta shapes. There's talk about 462 00:32:24,080 --> 00:32:26,400 Speaker 2: not just meals planned for a family or how to 463 00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:29,840 Speaker 2: make breakfast, but ideas for picnics or Fourth of July celebrations, 464 00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:33,720 Speaker 2: foods people enjoy in winter, little anecdotes from their business. 465 00:32:34,640 --> 00:32:37,560 Speaker 2: Plus the stuff was both incredible and laid out in 466 00:32:37,600 --> 00:32:40,280 Speaker 2: such a way that you could just do it. Yes, 467 00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:43,600 Speaker 2: perhaps the amateur Gormond's goal is to cook restaurant quality food, 468 00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:47,160 Speaker 2: and wow, these are steps from people who have done 469 00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:50,040 Speaker 2: it one hundred times. There are more tricks than just 470 00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:53,120 Speaker 2: salt and butter, or covering a chicken in herbs to 471 00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:56,280 Speaker 2: roast it. There is a pasta sauce with sausage, onions, 472 00:32:56,360 --> 00:32:58,960 Speaker 2: and peppers. I had a basic knowledge of red sauces. 473 00:32:59,000 --> 00:33:01,040 Speaker 2: You know, you do a basic bit with garlic and onions, 474 00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:03,000 Speaker 2: add a can of crushed tomatoes, and then you maybe 475 00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:06,600 Speaker 2: move on to marinera or catch tory or whatever. I 476 00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:09,960 Speaker 2: think this one hooked me. You're starting out by pricking 477 00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:12,920 Speaker 2: a pound of sausage with a fork, simmering it in 478 00:33:13,000 --> 00:33:15,520 Speaker 2: half an inch of water until it boils dry. Then 479 00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:18,640 Speaker 2: brown them and pull them and fry up the onions garlic, 480 00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:21,120 Speaker 2: then pull that out and fry up the bell peppers. 481 00:33:21,720 --> 00:33:26,480 Speaker 2: Eventually it's a perfect sublime sauce where everything is perfectly 482 00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:30,600 Speaker 2: cooked through but nothing is overdone, perfect big chunks of 483 00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:34,760 Speaker 2: texture with your forfella or whatever. You taste every bit individually, 484 00:33:35,480 --> 00:33:40,080 Speaker 2: like there's so much reason in these. Even the halla 485 00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:42,800 Speaker 2: not much of a baker, but boiling milk and sugar 486 00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:46,280 Speaker 2: before letting it cool and then making a dough does 487 00:33:46,320 --> 00:33:49,280 Speaker 2: work out to make a sweet, fine grained bread that 488 00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:51,920 Speaker 2: you braided yourself. I did have to figure out the 489 00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:57,520 Speaker 2: flour content on that one. But it was still sublime anyhow. Yeah, 490 00:33:57,640 --> 00:34:01,040 Speaker 2: it's very vinegarrette and herb heavy, but at that time 491 00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:02,720 Speaker 2: in my life, it was the kind of book that 492 00:34:02,840 --> 00:34:05,720 Speaker 2: really made me want to explore food and empowered me 493 00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:09,320 Speaker 2: to do cool things. That kid who was putting chicken 494 00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:12,040 Speaker 2: livers or a butterfly leg of lamb on the shopping 495 00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:15,600 Speaker 2: list grew up to be someone who's making dandylion capers 496 00:34:15,800 --> 00:34:18,879 Speaker 2: or a fridge gravlax, or throwing ganash on peanut butter 497 00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:22,440 Speaker 2: Christmas cookies, or trying several of the mentioned variants in 498 00:34:22,680 --> 00:34:26,399 Speaker 2: Raw Dog, or listening to your wonderful podcast. I think 499 00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:29,840 Speaker 2: I can trace back the big jump to this one cookbook. 500 00:34:31,719 --> 00:34:39,000 Speaker 1: Oh that's lovely. That is ough, that is so I 501 00:34:39,040 --> 00:34:44,279 Speaker 1: adore this so much. Right, you were so I love that. 502 00:34:44,320 --> 00:34:47,839 Speaker 1: You were a twelve year old. Yeah, he was. 503 00:34:47,880 --> 00:34:51,400 Speaker 2: Like being like, okay, leg a lamb. Mom like yes, 504 00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:52,880 Speaker 2: get this party started. 505 00:34:53,680 --> 00:34:58,520 Speaker 1: Yes, you wanted to try new things, and you this 506 00:34:58,680 --> 00:35:04,120 Speaker 1: book was the launching point. I love it. That's so fantastic. 507 00:35:04,440 --> 00:35:07,480 Speaker 2: It like empowered and encouraged you to do it. Oh 508 00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:08,880 Speaker 2: my goodness, that's wonderful. 509 00:35:09,400 --> 00:35:13,840 Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, and that you continued, you took that and 510 00:35:14,600 --> 00:35:18,319 Speaker 1: kept it and continued with it in your in your life, 511 00:35:18,400 --> 00:35:21,799 Speaker 1: and so you're still experimenting and like trying new things 512 00:35:22,560 --> 00:35:24,560 Speaker 1: and learning. Yeah. 513 00:35:25,640 --> 00:35:28,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, like the joy that it teaches is really real. 514 00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:35,840 Speaker 2: And moosewood is stuff for hippies. No. Twelve girl wants 515 00:35:35,920 --> 00:35:37,640 Speaker 2: to make a kale based soup. 516 00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:45,799 Speaker 1: It's true. A lot of truths were dropped in this message. Yes, 517 00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:52,919 Speaker 1: so thank you, yes, oh yes, thank you so much. Man. 518 00:35:53,080 --> 00:35:55,160 Speaker 2: I love that you remember, like a line by line 519 00:35:55,239 --> 00:35:57,520 Speaker 2: that that uh pasta sauce recipe. 520 00:35:57,560 --> 00:36:02,480 Speaker 1: That's so good. Yeah. Hey, some recipes change your life, 521 00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:07,839 Speaker 1: they do, they do, my goodness. Well, thank you so 522 00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:10,759 Speaker 1: much to both of these listeners for writing in. If 523 00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:12,440 Speaker 1: you would like to write to us, you can or 524 00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:14,920 Speaker 1: email us hello at savorpod dot com. 525 00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:17,399 Speaker 2: Oh, we're also on social media. You can find us 526 00:36:17,480 --> 00:36:21,200 Speaker 2: on Blue Sky or Instagram at saverpod and we do 527 00:36:21,280 --> 00:36:24,440 Speaker 2: hope to hear from you. Saveor is a production of iHeartRadio. 528 00:36:24,640 --> 00:36:27,040 Speaker 2: For more podcasts from heart Radio, you can visit the 529 00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:30,359 Speaker 2: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your 530 00:36:30,360 --> 00:36:33,840 Speaker 2: favorite shows. Thanks as always to our superproducers Dylan Fagan 531 00:36:33,880 --> 00:36:36,279 Speaker 2: and Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening, and we 532 00:36:36,320 --> 00:36:47,120 Speaker 2: hope that lots more good things are coming your way.