1
00:00:07,120 --> 00:00:09,640
Speaker 1: Hey, what, I'm welcome in Doug Gottlieb here, and you

2
00:00:09,680 --> 00:00:13,720
Speaker 1: have downloaded All Ball, the All Basketball podcast, and um,

3
00:00:13,760 --> 00:00:17,920
Speaker 1: I'll give you a couple of quick thoughts on the scheme. Um. Actually,

4
00:00:18,000 --> 00:00:20,040
Speaker 1: they're gonna be really quick thoughts. Look, if you're a

5
00:00:20,040 --> 00:00:24,279
Speaker 1: basketball guy, you know there's been these runners, hangers, honors,

6
00:00:24,320 --> 00:00:27,800
Speaker 1: guys looking to make some cash off some kids for

7
00:00:27,840 --> 00:00:31,360
Speaker 1: a long time. It's always been gross to me. Just

8
00:00:31,560 --> 00:00:34,040
Speaker 1: is it's always been gross to me, Like we can

9
00:00:34,080 --> 00:00:37,360
Speaker 1: have a legit conversation about paying guys not paying guys.

10
00:00:38,040 --> 00:00:40,879
Speaker 1: You know, I'm I'm not for it. I don't think

11
00:00:40,920 --> 00:00:43,519
Speaker 1: that's what it's all about. I think the gift is

12
00:00:43,640 --> 00:00:46,440
Speaker 1: the payment is the education and kind of like the

13
00:00:46,560 --> 00:00:49,360
Speaker 1: keys to the kingdom of future wealth, which is a

14
00:00:49,400 --> 00:00:51,919
Speaker 1: college degree and the people you're around. But I think

15
00:00:51,920 --> 00:00:55,320
Speaker 1: we can all whether or not you think that universities

16
00:00:55,720 --> 00:01:00,639
Speaker 1: UM exponentially benefit from the talents of student and athletes.

17
00:01:01,000 --> 00:01:03,200
Speaker 1: We can have that to debate. What I think is

18
00:01:03,280 --> 00:01:06,600
Speaker 1: not debatable is these guys are gross, Like this is

19
00:01:06,640 --> 00:01:10,479
Speaker 1: a fucking clown to me. He just is sorry, Like

20
00:01:11,520 --> 00:01:13,800
Speaker 1: I note too, I was reading like comments on Twitter

21
00:01:13,840 --> 00:01:16,360
Speaker 1: like how it's like some hero for f the n

22
00:01:16,400 --> 00:01:19,160
Speaker 1: c A, Like alright, dude, well, the n c A

23
00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:24,280
Speaker 1: actually is the schools. It's not some legislative body that rules,

24
00:01:24,280 --> 00:01:28,360
Speaker 1: and we had to figure it out that way. Um.

25
00:01:28,360 --> 00:01:31,920
Speaker 1: But you know, you just because if you don't like

26
00:01:31,959 --> 00:01:34,640
Speaker 1: a rule or that, that's fine. You don't have to

27
00:01:34,640 --> 00:01:36,240
Speaker 1: like the rule. Like get together and get a group

28
00:01:36,280 --> 00:01:38,800
Speaker 1: of people and try and change the rule and change

29
00:01:38,800 --> 00:01:41,240
Speaker 1: things for the better. But just you know, it's I

30
00:01:41,319 --> 00:01:45,280
Speaker 1: just I think it's gross, not just in giving players money.

31
00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:48,200
Speaker 1: But to me, what's super gross is like all these

32
00:01:48,200 --> 00:01:50,320
Speaker 1: guys take money off the top like it's such as

33
00:01:50,480 --> 00:01:53,280
Speaker 1: it really is a scheme and it's slimy. If the

34
00:01:53,440 --> 00:01:56,080
Speaker 1: if the players are really worth whatever payments that you're arranging,

35
00:01:56,120 --> 00:01:58,360
Speaker 1: then they should get every penny of it, not their parents,

36
00:01:58,360 --> 00:02:02,280
Speaker 1: not their friends and death only, not you. But you

37
00:02:02,280 --> 00:02:03,640
Speaker 1: know that's what guys do you know, I got a

38
00:02:03,640 --> 00:02:06,360
Speaker 1: guy for you, hook me up here. This is not

39
00:02:07,080 --> 00:02:09,720
Speaker 1: I don't think that's the blueprint for every basketball player.

40
00:02:10,200 --> 00:02:13,240
Speaker 1: I don't like the idea everybody's cheating because I've been

41
00:02:13,280 --> 00:02:15,799
Speaker 1: around it, and I do we do some of that.

42
00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:18,239
Speaker 1: Some of this exists, sure is the majority. I don't

43
00:02:18,240 --> 00:02:21,400
Speaker 1: believe so more than anything these hanger on or runner

44
00:02:21,480 --> 00:02:24,320
Speaker 1: dudes that cling to a kid. The kid has all

45
00:02:24,360 --> 00:02:27,000
Speaker 1: the talent, You're gonna guide them and you're gonna get

46
00:02:27,000 --> 00:02:28,520
Speaker 1: paid along the way. That's just I don't know, it's

47
00:02:28,520 --> 00:02:31,079
Speaker 1: just gross to me. I go get your own ship.

48
00:02:31,280 --> 00:02:33,680
Speaker 1: If you can play, go fucking play. If you can

49
00:02:33,720 --> 00:02:36,520
Speaker 1: become an agent, go get it, get a lot degree,

50
00:02:36,560 --> 00:02:39,680
Speaker 1: get certified as an agent. But being some go between,

51
00:02:39,840 --> 00:02:42,000
Speaker 1: I'm gonna call guys and hook a guy up, and

52
00:02:42,520 --> 00:02:44,079
Speaker 1: I'll get you this guy if you give me a

53
00:02:44,120 --> 00:02:46,200
Speaker 1: little bit off the top, Like, that's just gross to me.

54
00:02:46,840 --> 00:02:50,560
Speaker 1: Just is so. I watched it and I it just it.

55
00:02:50,560 --> 00:02:55,640
Speaker 1: It's popularizing and mainstreaming something that that's existed in the

56
00:02:55,680 --> 00:02:57,959
Speaker 1: basketball world, and I've just always kind of found to

57
00:02:58,000 --> 00:03:02,760
Speaker 1: be gross. And I don't think, like, let's not associate

58
00:03:02,840 --> 00:03:06,160
Speaker 1: every guy who's ever brought a player with them. I

59
00:03:06,200 --> 00:03:08,320
Speaker 1: don't think that bringing a player with you in order

60
00:03:08,360 --> 00:03:10,079
Speaker 1: to get a college job, or to move from high

61
00:03:10,080 --> 00:03:12,799
Speaker 1: school to junior college or whatever. I don't I don't

62
00:03:12,840 --> 00:03:15,240
Speaker 1: look whatever it takes, you know, legally for you to

63
00:03:15,280 --> 00:03:17,880
Speaker 1: get that opportunity, because that's all you can ask for

64
00:03:17,919 --> 00:03:19,880
Speaker 1: in life is an opportunity to show you can do something.

65
00:03:20,639 --> 00:03:23,760
Speaker 1: I'm talking about these these guys that they've made a

66
00:03:23,840 --> 00:03:26,520
Speaker 1: living out of being a runner, out of being a

67
00:03:26,600 --> 00:03:29,680
Speaker 1: hanger on, of being a guy who you know, peels

68
00:03:29,720 --> 00:03:33,000
Speaker 1: off a couple hundred bucks to a kid meanwhile, is

69
00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:36,280
Speaker 1: getting you know, paid from a several different ends. Uh,

70
00:03:36,320 --> 00:03:38,640
Speaker 1: in order to control where that kid goes. Where a

71
00:03:38,640 --> 00:03:40,760
Speaker 1: player should go to school should be based upon what's

72
00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:44,080
Speaker 1: best for that kid for the now, you know, for

73
00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:48,360
Speaker 1: his personality, for his game, for his future. That's what

74
00:03:48,440 --> 00:03:50,920
Speaker 1: should be important. And we do, we lose track of it.

75
00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:56,040
Speaker 1: We just do. This is a weird hiring season, super

76
00:03:56,080 --> 00:03:59,760
Speaker 1: super weird in that there just haven't been a lot

77
00:03:59,760 --> 00:04:02,280
Speaker 1: of jobs. And I said this on a radio show.

78
00:04:02,280 --> 00:04:03,640
Speaker 1: By the way, you can hear the radio show three

79
00:04:03,680 --> 00:04:06,840
Speaker 1: to sixty Eastern twelve or three Pacific every day on

80
00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:08,840
Speaker 1: Fox Sports trade of the I Heart Radio app. You

81
00:04:08,880 --> 00:04:11,240
Speaker 1: can also download the podcast there. That way you can

82
00:04:11,240 --> 00:04:13,520
Speaker 1: get the best stuff best stuff and work a little

83
00:04:13,520 --> 00:04:16,279
Speaker 1: bit more condensed. But I've said this before is that

84
00:04:17,000 --> 00:04:20,760
Speaker 1: one of the things that we haven't really dug into

85
00:04:21,200 --> 00:04:24,440
Speaker 1: is how this is gonna affect college athletics specifically, college basketball,

86
00:04:24,440 --> 00:04:27,000
Speaker 1: which doesn't make a ton of money for the university,

87
00:04:28,560 --> 00:04:32,040
Speaker 1: and honestly, thankful for, thankfully for, these athletic departments are

88
00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:33,800
Speaker 1: not going to have the winter sport kids around for

89
00:04:33,839 --> 00:04:37,120
Speaker 1: another year. Not that they didn't want the kids to play,

90
00:04:37,160 --> 00:04:40,520
Speaker 1: but more scholarships is more cost and more cost any

91
00:04:40,600 --> 00:04:43,000
Speaker 1: year which everybody's gonna everybody's books are gonna be off.

92
00:04:44,279 --> 00:04:45,880
Speaker 1: And when when the n c A is used to

93
00:04:45,880 --> 00:04:48,400
Speaker 1: paying out over you know, six hundred million dollars and

94
00:04:48,400 --> 00:04:53,240
Speaker 1: they're getting two seventy five from insurance, like everybody's gonna

95
00:04:53,279 --> 00:04:55,719
Speaker 1: take a hit. No conference tournaments. You're talking about your

96
00:04:56,160 --> 00:04:59,960
Speaker 1: athletic department, you know, being off by ten to fifty

97
00:05:00,000 --> 00:05:02,920
Speaker 1: into twenty million dollars and they're gonna get less, if

98
00:05:02,920 --> 00:05:05,000
Speaker 1: not any, no money from the state, from the school

99
00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:08,760
Speaker 1: because everybody's gonna tighten their belt here. So I think

100
00:05:08,800 --> 00:05:10,840
Speaker 1: that had to happen where you had to rule those

101
00:05:10,880 --> 00:05:13,160
Speaker 1: kids couldn't come back if nothing else for the dollars

102
00:05:13,160 --> 00:05:15,760
Speaker 1: and cents of it didn't make sense. Do you wish

103
00:05:15,760 --> 00:05:17,760
Speaker 1: guys got a chance to play the n s A tournament? Sure?

104
00:05:18,200 --> 00:05:21,159
Speaker 1: Does it re iterate my point that the n c

105
00:05:21,200 --> 00:05:23,320
Speaker 1: A Tournament is as are more valuable to the players

106
00:05:23,560 --> 00:05:25,800
Speaker 1: than it is to the schools because they need that

107
00:05:25,839 --> 00:05:29,320
Speaker 1: promotion to make a name for themselves. Absolutely, it's still

108
00:05:29,360 --> 00:05:32,400
Speaker 1: a bummer. It's not cool. And you know now we're

109
00:05:32,400 --> 00:05:35,279
Speaker 1: missing a final four. At those final four's, you would

110
00:05:35,279 --> 00:05:38,800
Speaker 1: see guys with resumes, there'll be interviews taking place. You know,

111
00:05:39,440 --> 00:05:42,839
Speaker 1: in the neighborhood of seventy to a hundred jobs. Head

112
00:05:42,839 --> 00:05:44,800
Speaker 1: coaching jobs seem to be open on a yearly basis,

113
00:05:44,800 --> 00:05:48,360
Speaker 1: maybe not that many, probably in the variety. Next year

114
00:05:48,360 --> 00:05:50,200
Speaker 1: will be a year which you'll see probably a spike.

115
00:05:50,279 --> 00:05:52,640
Speaker 1: This year you will not not a ton of jobs open.

116
00:05:53,480 --> 00:05:56,240
Speaker 1: But we had Jeff Linder last week he got the

117
00:05:56,279 --> 00:05:59,760
Speaker 1: Wyoming job, came up from Northern Colorado. This week we

118
00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:02,200
Speaker 1: we have Stan Johnson who is going to join us. Stan,

119
00:06:02,279 --> 00:06:04,240
Speaker 1: of course, is a longtime assistant coach, never been a

120
00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:07,640
Speaker 1: head coach, played at Southern Utah and at a Midgee

121
00:06:07,680 --> 00:06:11,960
Speaker 1: State and we've been friendly over the past decade or so.

122
00:06:12,200 --> 00:06:13,919
Speaker 1: I can only tell you that the guy can hoop,

123
00:06:14,680 --> 00:06:16,600
Speaker 1: and he's got a young family. He's gonna move from

124
00:06:16,640 --> 00:06:20,120
Speaker 1: Marquette from Milwaukee out to Los Angeles, PLA Del Rays

125
00:06:20,160 --> 00:06:23,080
Speaker 1: where l m U is located now. Louis La Mery

126
00:06:23,080 --> 00:06:25,080
Speaker 1: Mount used to be the home of the NBA Summer

127
00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:27,320
Speaker 1: League and they were one of the first to take

128
00:06:27,360 --> 00:06:33,560
Speaker 1: advantage of of of transfers. What what what people forget

129
00:06:33,720 --> 00:06:38,720
Speaker 1: about louis La Mery Mount is they remember Hank and Bow.

130
00:06:40,360 --> 00:06:45,360
Speaker 1: What they forget is uh that Hank and Bow were

131
00:06:45,839 --> 00:06:50,400
Speaker 1: together at USC and I believe when they're at USC

132
00:06:51,240 --> 00:06:55,160
Speaker 1: they actually won the pack ten before they went on probation.

133
00:06:56,600 --> 00:07:00,560
Speaker 1: But both Kimball Hank Gathers. We're not the first big

134
00:07:00,600 --> 00:07:05,520
Speaker 1: transfers to land at Loyala Merymount, not even close. It

135
00:07:05,640 --> 00:07:11,960
Speaker 1: was actually UM a group before a year before that

136
00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:14,360
Speaker 1: team took off for a couple of years. For they

137
00:07:14,400 --> 00:07:18,880
Speaker 1: had they had Corey Gains UM. Corey Gains transferred over

138
00:07:18,920 --> 00:07:22,280
Speaker 1: from u C l A and the first the first

139
00:07:22,360 --> 00:07:27,119
Speaker 1: year that Hank and Bow played they at l m U.

140
00:07:27,200 --> 00:07:31,600
Speaker 1: They dominated the w c C. That team had Corey

141
00:07:31,640 --> 00:07:35,200
Speaker 1: Gains as their point guard. Corey average seventeen and nine.

142
00:07:35,280 --> 00:07:37,880
Speaker 1: Granted those stats were skewed because of the pace of play.

143
00:07:38,120 --> 00:07:40,520
Speaker 1: Jeff Fryar was a sophomore that year. He's from Coronel

144
00:07:40,560 --> 00:07:43,960
Speaker 1: Mar High School. Still works for kids. Great shooter. Mike

145
00:07:44,080 --> 00:07:46,640
Speaker 1: Yost was one of the old heads from the previous regime,

146
00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:49,520
Speaker 1: and they had Bow, Kimball and Hank Coash. Imagine a

147
00:07:49,600 --> 00:07:54,120
Speaker 1: team in which Jeff Friar, Corey Gains, Mike Yost, Bo Kimball,

148
00:07:54,480 --> 00:07:56,600
Speaker 1: and Hank Gathers. Bow and Hank both average twenty two

149
00:07:56,600 --> 00:07:59,160
Speaker 1: a game, Yost and Gains average seventeen a game, and

150
00:07:59,200 --> 00:08:01,520
Speaker 1: Friar average twelve a game, all on one team. And

151
00:08:01,560 --> 00:08:04,840
Speaker 1: they had Enox Simmons coming out the bench. Enoch Simmons. Uh.

152
00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:08,400
Speaker 1: The year after Corey Gains finished up end up averaging

153
00:08:08,400 --> 00:08:11,000
Speaker 1: I think nineteen a game. So they had so many

154
00:08:11,120 --> 00:08:15,520
Speaker 1: dudes who can get buckets, it was it was really

155
00:08:15,560 --> 00:08:17,440
Speaker 1: kind of crazy. They had a guy named Mark Armstrong

156
00:08:17,480 --> 00:08:19,560
Speaker 1: as well. It came up the bench average about eight

157
00:08:19,600 --> 00:08:21,880
Speaker 1: and eight. So they took Corey games from u C

158
00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:24,480
Speaker 1: l A. They took Bow and and Hank from USC

159
00:08:25,320 --> 00:08:28,440
Speaker 1: and uh, let's roll, Let's let's go play some who right,

160
00:08:29,240 --> 00:08:32,640
Speaker 1: And so the the idea of transfers in the w

161
00:08:32,760 --> 00:08:34,800
Speaker 1: into the w c C from the Pack twelve or

162
00:08:34,840 --> 00:08:37,120
Speaker 1: Pac ten back then. This is not a new idea,

163
00:08:37,880 --> 00:08:40,880
Speaker 1: only now everybody's doing it, right, now there's all kinds

164
00:08:40,880 --> 00:08:43,120
Speaker 1: of movement in college basketball. It's one of the challenges

165
00:08:43,120 --> 00:08:45,760
Speaker 1: to high major, low major, mid major basketball, getting guys

166
00:08:45,800 --> 00:08:48,280
Speaker 1: to move up, getting guys to move down in terms

167
00:08:48,280 --> 00:08:51,319
Speaker 1: of levels. Do you get grad transfers? Do you get

168
00:08:51,320 --> 00:08:53,400
Speaker 1: four year transfers. You're not gonna get a lot of

169
00:08:53,440 --> 00:08:55,839
Speaker 1: jucos at l m U. Do you red shirt guys?

170
00:08:55,840 --> 00:08:58,080
Speaker 1: Do you play the long game? Do you do the

171
00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:01,839
Speaker 1: international thing? So there's all different sorts of ways to

172
00:09:01,880 --> 00:09:03,960
Speaker 1: build a program and where you are when you're in

173
00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:06,560
Speaker 1: Los Angeles, generally you should recruit all of just recruit

174
00:09:06,559 --> 00:09:07,959
Speaker 1: all of l A. You can always be out on

175
00:09:08,000 --> 00:09:09,760
Speaker 1: the road without being on the road, still sleep in

176
00:09:09,760 --> 00:09:12,040
Speaker 1: your own bed. But you have to know who to pick,

177
00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:14,960
Speaker 1: who to recruit from. You gotta recruit all these guys

178
00:09:15,000 --> 00:09:16,840
Speaker 1: and then get get some on bounce back. But you

179
00:09:16,840 --> 00:09:19,520
Speaker 1: gotta make sure you take the right guys. Kind of interesting.

180
00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:22,400
Speaker 1: Let's catch up with Stan Johnson. He's got all of

181
00:09:22,440 --> 00:09:24,560
Speaker 1: these challenges. Who to take, how to build, how to

182
00:09:24,559 --> 00:09:27,000
Speaker 1: get loyal mere amount back to where they were Because

183
00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:30,079
Speaker 1: now you're in the WCC where Gonzaga is a high major,

184
00:09:30,960 --> 00:09:33,760
Speaker 1: b y U is is rolling and I think they're

185
00:09:33,760 --> 00:09:35,760
Speaker 1: going there. You consider them a high major. They have

186
00:09:36,480 --> 00:09:39,400
Speaker 1: though they can't recruit the whole country, the group, they

187
00:09:39,400 --> 00:09:41,880
Speaker 1: can recruit as a fervent fan base and there's plenty

188
00:09:41,880 --> 00:09:45,640
Speaker 1: of players. I think Mark Pope's brilliant coach. He's gonna

189
00:09:45,679 --> 00:09:49,680
Speaker 1: be excellent there. Sat Mary's has been dominant. Um. You know,

190
00:09:49,679 --> 00:09:52,920
Speaker 1: they're gonna have to remake themselves yet again going forward

191
00:09:52,920 --> 00:09:55,160
Speaker 1: to next year and now you have quality coaches and

192
00:09:55,200 --> 00:09:57,560
Speaker 1: investment in Pacific with Damon Steinmeyer has got a lot

193
00:09:57,600 --> 00:10:02,800
Speaker 1: of his team back next year. San Francis sco Um

194
00:10:02,800 --> 00:10:04,800
Speaker 1: you know is a program which is I think on

195
00:10:04,840 --> 00:10:09,680
Speaker 1: the rise in Santa Clara, so little LMU was trying

196
00:10:09,720 --> 00:10:11,720
Speaker 1: to kind of crack that code to get back among

197
00:10:11,880 --> 00:10:14,319
Speaker 1: at least the middle and maybe challenge the elite. The

198
00:10:14,440 --> 00:10:16,720
Speaker 1: hired Stan Johnson, who has never been a head coach before.

199
00:10:16,960 --> 00:10:20,160
Speaker 1: Here's my conversation with stand. Be sure to catch the

200
00:10:20,200 --> 00:10:23,360
Speaker 1: live edition of The Doug Gottlieb Show weekdays at three

201
00:10:23,400 --> 00:10:26,920
Speaker 1: pm Easter Noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the

202
00:10:27,040 --> 00:10:30,560
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio WAP. He's the new head coach at

203
00:10:30,600 --> 00:10:34,599
Speaker 1: Loyal Merrormounts first head coaching gig. He's Stan Johnson, he

204
00:10:34,679 --> 00:10:38,800
Speaker 1: joins us down the All Ball podcast. Um, let's let's

205
00:10:38,960 --> 00:10:42,240
Speaker 1: let's go back. Okay, let's go back when you were

206
00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:45,800
Speaker 1: at Southern Utah. Wasn't Monica your best Monica was the

207
00:10:45,800 --> 00:10:47,640
Speaker 1: best player before you? You got to be a scene like,

208
00:10:48,080 --> 00:10:52,959
Speaker 1: how did your career with with Southern Utahgo? Yeah, I

209
00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:57,440
Speaker 1: plought a lot of balls and Jeff Monica, Uh, you know,

210
00:10:57,520 --> 00:10:59,120
Speaker 1: he was a great player. I mean, I don't know

211
00:10:59,120 --> 00:11:01,960
Speaker 1: if you remember. We had a team one year. I

212
00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:04,559
Speaker 1: think we were We won twenty five games, we lost

213
00:11:04,559 --> 00:11:07,559
Speaker 1: Detroy Bill in New York pretty much at the buzzer

214
00:11:07,840 --> 00:11:10,840
Speaker 1: against Boston College. And we have two guys that were

215
00:11:10,880 --> 00:11:15,080
Speaker 1: just incredible, Jeff Monico and Cred House. Uh, who were

216
00:11:15,640 --> 00:11:18,040
Speaker 1: you know, great great players, probably could have played anywhere

217
00:11:18,040 --> 00:11:21,199
Speaker 1: in the country. Uh, you know by the time they

218
00:11:21,200 --> 00:11:23,679
Speaker 1: were seniors, and you know, I was, you know, the

219
00:11:23,760 --> 00:11:27,280
Speaker 1: defensive specialists, the glue guy, the old guy, kind of

220
00:11:27,320 --> 00:11:29,880
Speaker 1: a leader on the team. And my job is to

221
00:11:29,880 --> 00:11:31,680
Speaker 1: make sure those guys got enough shots in the game.

222
00:11:32,920 --> 00:11:35,560
Speaker 1: Monico his freshman year, I got him dunked on by

223
00:11:35,559 --> 00:11:38,320
Speaker 1: a desimation pretty pretty nasty. He was chasing me down

224
00:11:39,040 --> 00:11:41,079
Speaker 1: at the Old Gallagher I and he was just a freshman.

225
00:11:41,120 --> 00:11:43,400
Speaker 1: He's like chasing me down like six ft probably one

226
00:11:43,440 --> 00:11:45,600
Speaker 1: sixty at the time. He's gonna be, you know, Johnny

227
00:11:45,640 --> 00:11:47,120
Speaker 1: on the spot. I just threw that stuck out the

228
00:11:47,120 --> 00:11:48,960
Speaker 1: back wood. He turned around, he got a mouthful and

229
00:11:49,240 --> 00:11:51,880
Speaker 1: dozen Mason nuts. It was it was pretty. But from

230
00:11:51,920 --> 00:11:54,880
Speaker 1: from that point, obviously his career career took off. How

231
00:11:54,920 --> 00:11:56,440
Speaker 1: did you end up at How did you end up there?

232
00:11:56,480 --> 00:11:59,080
Speaker 1: How did you up at Southern Etah? That's a crazy

233
00:11:59,080 --> 00:12:02,600
Speaker 1: story that he know. I was actually born like very

234
00:12:02,679 --> 00:12:06,079
Speaker 1: West Africa. So my mom is an American citizen. A

235
00:12:06,200 --> 00:12:09,800
Speaker 1: war broke out, thank god, we had dual citizenship. H

236
00:12:10,280 --> 00:12:13,080
Speaker 1: lost everything, packed up our bags, came to the States

237
00:12:13,080 --> 00:12:15,640
Speaker 1: with three bags, and we moved to Salt Lake. And

238
00:12:15,800 --> 00:12:19,000
Speaker 1: as I was growing up, you know, we my my

239
00:12:19,160 --> 00:12:22,280
Speaker 1: family would take trips from Salt Lake to like St.

240
00:12:22,280 --> 00:12:26,240
Speaker 1: George and and on I fifteen South you would always

241
00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:29,440
Speaker 1: pass Sedither City and something Utah would be on your left.

242
00:12:30,120 --> 00:12:33,560
Speaker 1: I remember going, there is no way in hell I

243
00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:35,560
Speaker 1: could ever go to school here and live in this town.

244
00:12:36,360 --> 00:12:38,760
Speaker 1: And you know what, you gotta be careful what you

245
00:12:38,800 --> 00:12:42,200
Speaker 1: say because as my college of my high school career

246
00:12:42,240 --> 00:12:45,240
Speaker 1: developed that end up being you know, a great option

247
00:12:45,280 --> 00:12:47,920
Speaker 1: for me in the place I felt the most comfortable.

248
00:12:48,280 --> 00:12:51,560
Speaker 1: Um and you know staff that really recruited to be

249
00:12:51,640 --> 00:12:54,680
Speaker 1: the hardest, so I end up picking something Utah, Okay,

250
00:12:54,720 --> 00:12:58,000
Speaker 1: So why did you when you moved? How over you

251
00:12:58,000 --> 00:13:03,280
Speaker 1: when you moved? I ten when the war broke out?

252
00:13:03,960 --> 00:13:06,520
Speaker 1: What are your what do you remember what you result like?

253
00:13:07,280 --> 00:13:10,560
Speaker 1: What are your memories of Liberia? I remember it. I

254
00:13:10,600 --> 00:13:12,480
Speaker 1: remember it like it was yesterday. I mean remember everything.

255
00:13:12,520 --> 00:13:14,760
Speaker 1: You know, we we lived in My dad was a

256
00:13:14,760 --> 00:13:18,560
Speaker 1: mining engineer, so uh, you know, in in in those

257
00:13:18,640 --> 00:13:21,640
Speaker 1: countries and third world countries, you either have or you

258
00:13:21,679 --> 00:13:24,720
Speaker 1: don't have. There's no middle class. We were fortunate to

259
00:13:24,760 --> 00:13:27,520
Speaker 1: have and we lived in a almost a German community

260
00:13:27,640 --> 00:13:33,280
Speaker 1: because there was a huge mining company that everybody worked at. So,

261
00:13:33,480 --> 00:13:35,800
Speaker 1: you know, I can't remember everything. I remember being in

262
00:13:35,840 --> 00:13:38,040
Speaker 1: a place that was so safe you could literally, at

263
00:13:38,040 --> 00:13:41,680
Speaker 1: the age of eight, walk from your school to to

264
00:13:41,840 --> 00:13:45,440
Speaker 1: your house, regardless of our part was. You know, I

265
00:13:45,480 --> 00:13:48,280
Speaker 1: remember the day that the rebels came in to overtake

266
00:13:48,840 --> 00:13:51,560
Speaker 1: the country and they had all of us at gunpoint,

267
00:13:51,600 --> 00:13:54,600
Speaker 1: our entire school really and again by the grace of God,

268
00:13:54,640 --> 00:13:58,439
Speaker 1: we would let go. And I remember uh the American

269
00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:04,040
Speaker 1: uh govern that landing a military war plane that could

270
00:14:04,120 --> 00:14:07,360
Speaker 1: fit tanks in on a mining script that they had

271
00:14:07,400 --> 00:14:10,320
Speaker 1: to create because the airport had been blown up. I

272
00:14:10,360 --> 00:14:14,280
Speaker 1: remember getting into that plane and uh, you know, flying

273
00:14:14,320 --> 00:14:16,520
Speaker 1: to necessarily owned and then from there to the States.

274
00:14:16,559 --> 00:14:18,800
Speaker 1: So I mean, you couldn't make it up. It was

275
00:14:18,800 --> 00:14:21,200
Speaker 1: straight out of a movie. Well, and then you you

276
00:14:21,320 --> 00:14:23,720
Speaker 1: end up in Salt Lake, of all places, which I

277
00:14:23,760 --> 00:14:25,920
Speaker 1: know you when you're around a German community, there's plenty

278
00:14:25,960 --> 00:14:28,200
Speaker 1: of white faces. But to be in Salt Lake where

279
00:14:28,240 --> 00:14:31,400
Speaker 1: they're all white faces, what was what was that transition?

280
00:14:31,560 --> 00:14:35,320
Speaker 1: Remember about the transition in your early teenagers? Yeah, I

281
00:14:35,320 --> 00:14:37,840
Speaker 1: mean I mean completely different, you know, even being in

282
00:14:37,880 --> 00:14:40,640
Speaker 1: the German community. I mean there's there's more black people

283
00:14:40,640 --> 00:14:44,040
Speaker 1: in African Americans than there are you know, Germans. But

284
00:14:44,720 --> 00:14:47,520
Speaker 1: you know, you moved to Salt Lake. I remember my

285
00:14:47,600 --> 00:14:52,720
Speaker 1: first recess, man first recess. Uh, they're playing basketball and

286
00:14:52,920 --> 00:14:55,400
Speaker 1: again I'm probably at that time. You know, Salt Lakes

287
00:14:55,520 --> 00:14:58,360
Speaker 1: has grown a lot since then. Thus I'm the only

288
00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:02,120
Speaker 1: brother Lee in the school, you know, me and my

289
00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:04,160
Speaker 1: little brother probably, So what do you think they think

290
00:15:04,240 --> 00:15:07,600
Speaker 1: this guy can play. I'm the first pick. I didn't

291
00:15:07,600 --> 00:15:09,560
Speaker 1: know if you were supposed to dribble the ball or

292
00:15:09,640 --> 00:15:14,160
Speaker 1: kick the ball. And that was the last time I

293
00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:18,720
Speaker 1: was picked, uh first for the entire year. I mean

294
00:15:18,760 --> 00:15:20,280
Speaker 1: I was the last pick. And when they got to

295
00:15:20,360 --> 00:15:22,640
Speaker 1: the team that had to pick me, was piste off

296
00:15:22,640 --> 00:15:24,640
Speaker 1: that they had me. So, you know, I made a

297
00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:27,320
Speaker 1: commitment that summer, like I'm gonna learn this game and

298
00:15:27,320 --> 00:15:29,480
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get pretty good at it. But the thing

299
00:15:29,560 --> 00:15:31,800
Speaker 1: that they taught me was, man, what power that ball

300
00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:34,960
Speaker 1: has that a kid from West Africa could connect with

301
00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:38,240
Speaker 1: the Caucasian kid from Murray, Utah and built a great bond.

302
00:15:38,520 --> 00:15:40,760
Speaker 1: And since then then I just fell in love with

303
00:15:40,800 --> 00:15:44,120
Speaker 1: the game. But it was because of those moments. So

304
00:15:44,160 --> 00:15:46,880
Speaker 1: who is your guy that recruited you at Southern what assistant?

305
00:15:48,080 --> 00:15:52,720
Speaker 1: His name was Bob Law And Bobby Law was a

306
00:15:52,800 --> 00:15:55,280
Speaker 1: Southern Utah for a long time. He's at Stins at

307
00:15:55,280 --> 00:15:58,040
Speaker 1: cal Paul, he saying, as they stayed, he's now out

308
00:15:58,040 --> 00:16:00,600
Speaker 1: of the business, but you know, just a great guy,

309
00:16:00,760 --> 00:16:03,360
Speaker 1: you know, someone who made me see it, like, you know,

310
00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:06,560
Speaker 1: I was one of his own kids. And uh, he's

311
00:16:06,600 --> 00:16:10,080
Speaker 1: actually had a tremendous impact, you know, on my career.

312
00:16:10,200 --> 00:16:12,920
Speaker 1: And you know how I see the game in what way?

313
00:16:12,960 --> 00:16:19,320
Speaker 1: What about him? Do you is similar? Because he had

314
00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:22,840
Speaker 1: he had a knack. Uh you know, do you played,

315
00:16:22,840 --> 00:16:24,440
Speaker 1: You've been in a lot of locker rooms. Man, he

316
00:16:24,960 --> 00:16:27,480
Speaker 1: had to knock a knack when he when he was

317
00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:32,280
Speaker 1: his scout and he was presenting before you went out there.

318
00:16:33,160 --> 00:16:36,040
Speaker 1: He had a way to raise your level, you know,

319
00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:38,440
Speaker 1: from wherever you were at, he could raise your level,

320
00:16:39,240 --> 00:16:41,680
Speaker 1: you know, in a sincere way. He could get you

321
00:16:41,760 --> 00:16:46,360
Speaker 1: juiced and pumped up and really really motivated to uh

322
00:16:46,400 --> 00:16:50,200
Speaker 1: to go out and play. And that's something that I've

323
00:16:50,280 --> 00:16:52,560
Speaker 1: you know, I've I've really taken, you know, the importance

324
00:16:52,600 --> 00:16:54,800
Speaker 1: of those moments. You know, you're not gonna win the

325
00:16:54,840 --> 00:16:59,720
Speaker 1: game just off share adrenaline at some point. He's got

326
00:16:59,800 --> 00:17:02,680
Speaker 1: to be one than that. But I learned the importance

327
00:17:02,720 --> 00:17:04,840
Speaker 1: of that, you know, in terms of a guy's psyche

328
00:17:04,920 --> 00:17:07,840
Speaker 1: before a game, how important that is getting people off

329
00:17:07,840 --> 00:17:11,160
Speaker 1: to a good start. Uh. So that's something I've I've

330
00:17:11,240 --> 00:17:14,239
Speaker 1: really taken from him, and I've tried to build on,

331
00:17:14,680 --> 00:17:17,360
Speaker 1: you know, my eighteen years of doing this. It's interesting,

332
00:17:17,480 --> 00:17:19,800
Speaker 1: I there's a lot of coaches who will say, like you,

333
00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:23,600
Speaker 1: you can't coach effort, I completely disagree. I think that's

334
00:17:23,640 --> 00:17:27,320
Speaker 1: a huge portion of what you of which you I mean, like, look,

335
00:17:27,400 --> 00:17:30,600
Speaker 1: you you know you you coach with Steve Wojahowski, like,

336
00:17:31,160 --> 00:17:33,639
Speaker 1: and I understand that the guys are either wired to

337
00:17:33,760 --> 00:17:36,199
Speaker 1: play like Woe Joe or not. But it feels to

338
00:17:36,240 --> 00:17:38,760
Speaker 1: me like effort is they getting guys to play hard,

339
00:17:38,840 --> 00:17:40,840
Speaker 1: whether or not you set out that way or not.

340
00:17:41,320 --> 00:17:42,959
Speaker 1: Like that was our thing at Oklahoma State, was like, Hey,

341
00:17:42,960 --> 00:17:45,040
Speaker 1: we're just gonna We're gonna it might not be pretty,

342
00:17:45,040 --> 00:17:47,560
Speaker 1: we're gonna outplay everybody. You know, We're gonna We're just

343
00:17:47,600 --> 00:17:50,800
Speaker 1: gonna play hard. But why do coaches, why do coaches

344
00:17:50,800 --> 00:17:52,080
Speaker 1: do this thing where they go like, well, you can't

345
00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:55,639
Speaker 1: coach effort, like you absolutely can. Well, I think it's different.

346
00:17:55,720 --> 00:17:57,560
Speaker 1: You know, I think you know, if a guy is lazy,

347
00:17:57,800 --> 00:18:00,880
Speaker 1: you know in our business, uh, when you should recruit him?

348
00:18:00,920 --> 00:18:04,720
Speaker 1: You know, that's different. But if even the guy who

349
00:18:04,720 --> 00:18:07,720
Speaker 1: works hard and the guy who has it, there's still

350
00:18:07,800 --> 00:18:10,359
Speaker 1: days where you don't feel like it, and on the

351
00:18:10,440 --> 00:18:12,960
Speaker 1: days your team doesn't feel like it, on certain games

352
00:18:12,960 --> 00:18:16,639
Speaker 1: where they're not given all they're capable of. Absolutely, you

353
00:18:16,640 --> 00:18:20,320
Speaker 1: can demand and get that problem, you know. But uh

354
00:18:20,520 --> 00:18:23,119
Speaker 1: so I agree with you. You have to coach effort.

355
00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:25,200
Speaker 1: You have to get him out of it, because sometimes

356
00:18:25,600 --> 00:18:28,680
Speaker 1: what a guy thinks he's giving, he's got more to give.

357
00:18:29,280 --> 00:18:31,520
Speaker 1: But like I said, if if a kid is lazy

358
00:18:31,640 --> 00:18:34,159
Speaker 1: and he doesn't understand how to work and he doesn't

359
00:18:34,160 --> 00:18:37,920
Speaker 1: have that in him, then that's obviously a lot harder

360
00:18:37,960 --> 00:18:39,480
Speaker 1: to coach and get out of him than a guy

361
00:18:39,520 --> 00:18:42,199
Speaker 1: who understands how to work. But you just have to

362
00:18:42,240 --> 00:18:45,480
Speaker 1: hold him to that every single day. I got to uh,

363
00:18:45,560 --> 00:18:49,320
Speaker 1: I got to know uh Bill Evans a little bit

364
00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:52,840
Speaker 1: at Idaho State right before you got fired. A couple

365
00:18:52,800 --> 00:18:54,680
Speaker 1: of years ago. We were in I was in Cancoon

366
00:18:54,720 --> 00:18:56,560
Speaker 1: doing a tournament and he was doing like the JV

367
00:18:56,680 --> 00:19:00,600
Speaker 1: tournament at Idaho State. And I watched this and practice

368
00:19:00,640 --> 00:19:02,840
Speaker 1: and play, and he was super kind to me. Tell

369
00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:04,440
Speaker 1: me what you think of my team? Whatever? He coach

370
00:19:04,520 --> 00:19:06,720
Speaker 1: you in Southern Utah, you guys had really good success.

371
00:19:07,080 --> 00:19:11,879
Speaker 1: What was he like? Coach Evans was a gentleman. You know.

372
00:19:11,960 --> 00:19:16,800
Speaker 1: Coach Evans made no excuses. You know at Southern Utah. Uh,

373
00:19:16,840 --> 00:19:19,760
Speaker 1: you know, we had a pretty nice arena, especially for

374
00:19:19,840 --> 00:19:22,520
Speaker 1: a school of that that that size and where it's at.

375
00:19:23,160 --> 00:19:26,720
Speaker 1: But he was a guy who could get a lot

376
00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:31,200
Speaker 1: done with so much less. I mean, think about it, Doug.

377
00:19:31,760 --> 00:19:34,280
Speaker 1: We went to the tournament, um, I want to say

378
00:19:34,320 --> 00:19:38,720
Speaker 1: two thousand and one. The school has never been there

379
00:19:39,200 --> 00:19:42,520
Speaker 1: and since then they haven't been back. I mean, that's

380
00:19:42,560 --> 00:19:45,439
Speaker 1: the kind of impact he had. He could whenever you

381
00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:47,919
Speaker 1: gave him, he could make the best of it. And

382
00:19:47,960 --> 00:19:51,440
Speaker 1: that's you know, that's that's part of being a really

383
00:19:51,440 --> 00:19:54,120
Speaker 1: good coach. I mean he was at Ottawa State. Those

384
00:19:54,160 --> 00:19:57,239
Speaker 1: were really really really really hard jobs for a lot

385
00:19:57,320 --> 00:20:00,480
Speaker 1: of different reasons, and he was able to. I didn't

386
00:20:00,480 --> 00:20:03,520
Speaker 1: get the best out of out of both those places,

387
00:20:03,560 --> 00:20:07,399
Speaker 1: and eventually sometimes the place just gets you. But he

388
00:20:07,480 --> 00:20:10,960
Speaker 1: never made an excuse. He was always consistent, the same

389
00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:15,600
Speaker 1: guy every day, and he treated people, uh the right way.

390
00:20:15,880 --> 00:20:17,880
Speaker 1: I mean, it didn't matter if you were the janitor

391
00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:20,560
Speaker 1: or the president. There was a consistency in terms of

392
00:20:20,560 --> 00:20:22,919
Speaker 1: who he was as a human being. You know, just

393
00:20:23,080 --> 00:20:27,000
Speaker 1: really really impressive. All right, So you get done playing

394
00:20:27,119 --> 00:20:29,720
Speaker 1: and then what was your plan? So you know, I

395
00:20:29,760 --> 00:20:33,359
Speaker 1: got done playing and I probably could have you know,

396
00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:37,800
Speaker 1: gone over somewhere and made a couple of dollars and

397
00:20:37,840 --> 00:20:41,760
Speaker 1: called myself a probe. But I was realistic. I knew

398
00:20:42,160 --> 00:20:44,240
Speaker 1: how hard this business is, how hard it is to

399
00:20:44,280 --> 00:20:47,040
Speaker 1: get in, and I just knew I wanted to coach,

400
00:20:47,240 --> 00:20:50,400
Speaker 1: and I was fortunate enough. Uh, there was a guy

401
00:20:50,400 --> 00:20:52,399
Speaker 1: who was an assistant coach for US or Southern Utah

402
00:20:52,440 --> 00:20:54,960
Speaker 1: for a year that ended up getting a job at

403
00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:58,600
Speaker 1: the Miidji State. So I played three years of stuthn

404
00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:03,920
Speaker 1: Utah and read sort of the year so I graduated,

405
00:21:03,960 --> 00:21:08,160
Speaker 1: I had tendonitis, bad needs, and uh, you know, he said, today,

406
00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:10,040
Speaker 1: let's you can come up here and you know, if

407
00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:12,840
Speaker 1: you want to finish your career and just play here,

408
00:21:12,840 --> 00:21:15,159
Speaker 1: and you know, maybe you can get into coaching with me.

409
00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:16,560
Speaker 1: So I went up there and played one year at

410
00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:19,879
Speaker 1: the Middy State. And it's the most northern university in

411
00:21:19,880 --> 00:21:23,320
Speaker 1: the United States. Literally, if you can live in the Minsion, Minnesota,

412
00:21:23,400 --> 00:21:25,919
Speaker 1: there's nowhere on earth you can't live. You know, forty

413
00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:30,400
Speaker 1: below winners, I mean, the lake freezers, over all that stuff.

414
00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:33,280
Speaker 1: So I played for him for one year. He offered

415
00:21:33,320 --> 00:21:36,800
Speaker 1: me a job. I mean, I remember being in Minnesota

416
00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:39,520
Speaker 1: at four and a half scholarships. He's playing me, you know,

417
00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:43,920
Speaker 1: ten thousand dollars a year and I'm living in his basement. Um,

418
00:21:43,960 --> 00:21:46,920
Speaker 1: and that's how my career got started. And it's been

419
00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:50,240
Speaker 1: such a rewarding thing, you know, the god from living

420
00:21:50,280 --> 00:21:52,840
Speaker 1: a guy's basement. Remember my dad saying you've got a

421
00:21:52,880 --> 00:21:55,760
Speaker 1: college degree, dude, what are you doing? What are you doing?

422
00:21:56,920 --> 00:22:01,240
Speaker 1: But that that that beginning to go into a place

423
00:22:01,320 --> 00:22:05,600
Speaker 1: like Marquette and then having a chance to get this job. Uh,

424
00:22:05,640 --> 00:22:07,920
Speaker 1: there's so much I've taken from that, so much. I've

425
00:22:07,960 --> 00:22:11,760
Speaker 1: learned so much. It just makes me so appreciative of

426
00:22:12,080 --> 00:22:14,879
Speaker 1: all the opportunities you get. So, Jeff, how do you

427
00:22:14,920 --> 00:22:18,199
Speaker 1: say his last name? The coach at MIGI g u

428
00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:21,800
Speaker 1: i OT played to Kansas with Larry Brown. Okay, so,

429
00:22:21,800 --> 00:22:24,639
Speaker 1: so Jeff, um, what was what was he like as

430
00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:28,199
Speaker 1: a coach? Because because I always think and you can

431
00:22:28,200 --> 00:22:29,879
Speaker 1: tell me if I'm wrong, it's interesting you said that,

432
00:22:29,920 --> 00:22:33,480
Speaker 1: you know, the assistant coach recruited you at at Southern

433
00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:35,720
Speaker 1: Utah kind of shaped you in terms of always getting

434
00:22:35,720 --> 00:22:40,400
Speaker 1: guys energy. Um, I played for my my first obviously

435
00:22:40,440 --> 00:22:43,000
Speaker 1: for my dad, and then my my fresh, my vasty coach,

436
00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:45,399
Speaker 1: my fresh years got named Tom McCluskey. He played at

437
00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:47,959
Speaker 1: Penn State on Dick Harder. He was. He had some

438
00:22:48,040 --> 00:22:51,679
Speaker 1: unbelievable drills. You know, Dick Harter obviously a fanatic. Some

439
00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:53,159
Speaker 1: of the stuff I take from him. Then then my

440
00:22:53,200 --> 00:22:56,040
Speaker 1: high school, my the JV coach became the high school coach,

441
00:22:56,200 --> 00:22:58,080
Speaker 1: and now he's a junior college coach. Any ground and

442
00:22:58,119 --> 00:23:01,840
Speaker 1: any ground was great at I don't underneath out of

443
00:23:01,840 --> 00:23:04,800
Speaker 1: bounds and some special plays even in a high school,

444
00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:08,359
Speaker 1: like we ran really good simple stuff that that all worked.

445
00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:12,960
Speaker 1: But it began it kind of um fostered a passion

446
00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:18,320
Speaker 1: in me in offensive basketball and in screening and angles

447
00:23:18,359 --> 00:23:21,840
Speaker 1: and how and why things work in spacing or whatever. Uh,

448
00:23:22,080 --> 00:23:24,360
Speaker 1: what's your take away from guy out in terms of

449
00:23:24,840 --> 00:23:27,960
Speaker 1: coaching That that you like, that you that that you remember.

450
00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:31,320
Speaker 1: That's awesome, great questions. You know. The thing I got

451
00:23:31,400 --> 00:23:36,560
Speaker 1: from him, Doug was, before you can demand from your guys,

452
00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:39,160
Speaker 1: they have to know that you love who they are,

453
00:23:40,520 --> 00:23:43,800
Speaker 1: not just the jersey, not just because on a given

454
00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:46,120
Speaker 1: night they had twenty points. So I like you this night.

455
00:23:46,359 --> 00:23:48,920
Speaker 1: You have to pour into him. And if you pour

456
00:23:48,960 --> 00:23:53,480
Speaker 1: into them and those kids believe that you sincerely love them.

457
00:23:53,600 --> 00:23:56,280
Speaker 1: You're gonna build a trust that regards to what you

458
00:23:56,320 --> 00:24:00,520
Speaker 1: do offensively or defensively, there's gonna be greater buying. And

459
00:24:00,600 --> 00:24:02,480
Speaker 1: that's the thing I got from him, Like you have

460
00:24:02,600 --> 00:24:05,000
Speaker 1: to pour into people. You got a point in their life,

461
00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:06,920
Speaker 1: you got a point of their soul. It's got It

462
00:24:07,520 --> 00:24:10,520
Speaker 1: can't just be transactional. You know. As a coach, you're

463
00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:13,359
Speaker 1: here to transform. And sometimes you're gonna tell them stuff

464
00:24:13,359 --> 00:24:15,679
Speaker 1: that they don't want to hear. Sometimes you're gonna be

465
00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:17,720
Speaker 1: you're gonna have to be very difficult on them, but

466
00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:19,520
Speaker 1: sometimes you're gonna have to put your arm around them

467
00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:22,520
Speaker 1: and love them. And that may sound Mickey mouse or whatever,

468
00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:27,480
Speaker 1: but that really is the staple now of who I

469
00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:32,520
Speaker 1: am and what I believe and what I believe. It takes,

470
00:24:32,680 --> 00:24:35,119
Speaker 1: especially in this day and age, to connect with a

471
00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:38,120
Speaker 1: kid and to create buy in. So all those things

472
00:24:38,119 --> 00:24:41,600
Speaker 1: that we're talking about in terms of basketball, undergrown, underneath,

473
00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:45,880
Speaker 1: you know, defense, offensive philosophy, those things work better when

474
00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:48,720
Speaker 1: kids knows you care. And that's really what I took

475
00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:51,479
Speaker 1: from him. That's a great one. You know, it's one

476
00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:53,200
Speaker 1: of things you Eddie setting used to do, or he'd

477
00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:56,160
Speaker 1: you every day you come in and you you make

478
00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:58,280
Speaker 1: I contact with because we had a we had a

479
00:24:58,320 --> 00:25:01,080
Speaker 1: signing sheet. You had to go in make eye contact

480
00:25:01,119 --> 00:25:04,560
Speaker 1: with a coach. And we used to think the expression

481
00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:06,399
Speaker 1: we used was man, if you fart on campus, they

482
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:10,880
Speaker 1: smell in the office. But they knew who your girlfriend was, right,

483
00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:14,080
Speaker 1: they knew your parents, all your situations never and it

484
00:25:14,200 --> 00:25:17,320
Speaker 1: was their way of being invested, you know, invested in

485
00:25:17,359 --> 00:25:20,080
Speaker 1: your career. All right, From there, you go to Southwest Baptist,

486
00:25:20,160 --> 00:25:24,159
Speaker 1: which is in what Bolivar, Missouri? Yeah, that and I

487
00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:27,359
Speaker 1: went with the same coach. Okay, so he goes so

488
00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:29,600
Speaker 1: he goes what to get closer to home? But is that?

489
00:25:30,480 --> 00:25:32,520
Speaker 1: But MIDGI was was D was it D two at

490
00:25:32,520 --> 00:25:35,200
Speaker 1: the time? D two? So we went D two the

491
00:25:35,320 --> 00:25:37,480
Speaker 1: D two? Why do we go because of the MIDGI state?

492
00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:40,280
Speaker 1: We played the league with ten scholarships. We had four

493
00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:43,080
Speaker 1: and a half scholarships in that league. We win the

494
00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:47,960
Speaker 1: league and Southwest Baptist comes calling for him. It's a

495
00:25:48,080 --> 00:25:50,360
Speaker 1: it's a little better job, it's closer to his home.

496
00:25:50,440 --> 00:25:53,000
Speaker 1: He's from Kansas, and we go there to take over

497
00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:55,680
Speaker 1: that program. So that's why we went there. All right?

498
00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:57,919
Speaker 1: What what is what is it like to now, you know,

499
00:25:58,000 --> 00:26:01,400
Speaker 1: you gotta start up a program in Missouri. That's that's

500
00:26:01,480 --> 00:26:04,720
Speaker 1: D two that you have no connections with. Right at

501
00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:07,359
Speaker 1: least she had played there a little bit Warmer, What

502
00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:12,320
Speaker 1: was that like? Unbelievable? I mean, we go there and

503
00:26:12,359 --> 00:26:14,680
Speaker 1: we take over a program, They're gonna build this new arena,

504
00:26:14,760 --> 00:26:16,880
Speaker 1: and you know, they've got all these things kind of going.

505
00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:19,880
Speaker 1: We finally have Kim scholarships. But now you're in the

506
00:26:19,960 --> 00:26:24,160
Speaker 1: best league in Division two basketball. I mean, it's unbelievable.

507
00:26:24,920 --> 00:26:26,960
Speaker 1: It's you know, the guys that are in that league

508
00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:30,119
Speaker 1: could play in a lot of places throughout the country.

509
00:26:30,160 --> 00:26:33,160
Speaker 1: Most of them are there because they don't have the grades. Well,

510
00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:35,040
Speaker 1: we signed a kid, I don't even know if you

511
00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:38,680
Speaker 1: will remember this name. There's a uh kid by the

512
00:26:38,760 --> 00:26:42,200
Speaker 1: name of Shelton Pace. He played with Kurt Snyder and

513
00:26:42,359 --> 00:26:47,399
Speaker 1: Upland High School and and back then, um, you know,

514
00:26:48,200 --> 00:26:50,840
Speaker 1: Sheldon was actually the best player on the team. He

515
00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:53,080
Speaker 1: didn't have grades how to go, Juco didn't even have

516
00:26:53,119 --> 00:26:56,960
Speaker 1: grades in JUCO. We had to help get ineligible just

517
00:26:57,040 --> 00:26:59,840
Speaker 1: to be a D two player. So we signed this

518
00:27:00,040 --> 00:27:03,320
Speaker 1: hid Shelton Pace, who I'm telling you had he been

519
00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:07,639
Speaker 1: in Marquette or Royal and Mermouth, he probably has a

520
00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:11,440
Speaker 1: chance to be a legitimate NBA player. His last year

521
00:27:11,600 --> 00:27:15,840
Speaker 1: with US, he where we finished. So we took the

522
00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:19,120
Speaker 1: job in the second year with Shelton. In his second year,

523
00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:22,880
Speaker 1: we finished fifth in the country. He finished his second

524
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:26,320
Speaker 1: to Dee Brown in Illinois for the Bob Couzie Award.

525
00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:32,120
Speaker 1: You know, from Southwest Baptist. Again, it was a constant.

526
00:27:32,119 --> 00:27:34,080
Speaker 1: It was a remind for me again like you know what,

527
00:27:34,560 --> 00:27:40,120
Speaker 1: there's great players everywhere and if you're good, great things

528
00:27:40,119 --> 00:27:43,320
Speaker 1: that happened for you. So that experience and going us

529
00:27:43,320 --> 00:27:45,520
Speaker 1: out of his practice in two years but in that program,

530
00:27:45,640 --> 00:27:49,320
Speaker 1: from from being nowhere to being the fifth rated, fifth

531
00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:52,560
Speaker 1: land team in the country, you know that that that

532
00:27:52,640 --> 00:27:56,199
Speaker 1: was one of my best moments and experiences you know

533
00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:59,800
Speaker 1: in basketball so far. How did you get the north

534
00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:06,280
Speaker 1: from there? So after my first year at Southwest Baptist,

535
00:28:06,280 --> 00:28:09,800
Speaker 1: I'm on the road and I can't I think it

536
00:28:09,840 --> 00:28:13,080
Speaker 1: was in Indianapolis, and I run into Bobby Braswell and

537
00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:16,159
Speaker 1: we're talking. I didn't know him, we didn't know me,

538
00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:18,040
Speaker 1: but we kind of bumped each other and we're talking,

539
00:28:18,119 --> 00:28:21,560
Speaker 1: and uh, we get off the road and right before

540
00:28:21,680 --> 00:28:23,800
Speaker 1: school starts, he calls and he has an opening on

541
00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:26,560
Speaker 1: his staff. I think, right now, it's almost close to

542
00:28:26,600 --> 00:28:29,600
Speaker 1: our August early August, and he called me and he

543
00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:33,119
Speaker 1: said to stand, you know I sat with you. Um,

544
00:28:33,320 --> 00:28:35,880
Speaker 1: we really don't know each other. I haven't open. I'd

545
00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:38,479
Speaker 1: love for you to come to birth Roods. And I'm like,

546
00:28:38,600 --> 00:28:40,520
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, you know it's a dream. I I

547
00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:42,320
Speaker 1: want to go Division one. I mean, I've been the

548
00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:44,960
Speaker 1: D two coach. I've only been coaching for four years.

549
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:46,600
Speaker 1: I can go to North Rids. And then something says

550
00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:49,240
Speaker 1: to me, you can't leave here. You can't leave. You

551
00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:52,520
Speaker 1: just got here. It's late. It's so late in the year.

552
00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:56,200
Speaker 1: This guy's giving you a job. If this was earlier,

553
00:28:56,240 --> 00:28:58,680
Speaker 1: you can leave. So I tell Brasles a breast, I

554
00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:02,400
Speaker 1: love to come, but I can't this year. I wouldn't

555
00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:04,320
Speaker 1: do this to use schools getting ready to start here.

556
00:29:04,360 --> 00:29:07,400
Speaker 1: I can't leave him hind and dry. So fast forward

557
00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:12,160
Speaker 1: a year. He calls me back and says, listen, I

558
00:29:12,240 --> 00:29:15,480
Speaker 1: love how you handle that. I have another opening. I'd

559
00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:17,880
Speaker 1: love for you to come. And at that point the

560
00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:20,840
Speaker 1: time was right, and I went to Mortorage. Yeah, you

561
00:29:20,880 --> 00:29:22,520
Speaker 1: guys had a great year. You're when year there, right,

562
00:29:23,680 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 1: so we yeah, I get the job. It's um early May,

563
00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:35,080
Speaker 1: and we have to sign seven guys from that period

564
00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:40,520
Speaker 1: too when school starts seven players. We signed seven guys

565
00:29:40,840 --> 00:29:43,600
Speaker 1: and we went on to UH when the big rest

566
00:29:43,680 --> 00:29:45,160
Speaker 1: first time in the history of the school. And then

567
00:29:45,160 --> 00:29:50,280
Speaker 1: the next year I actually went to Utah on that team. Um.

568
00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:52,360
Speaker 1: You know they played Memphis really close in the first

569
00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:56,720
Speaker 1: round nt A tournament. Um okay, and what what's what

570
00:29:56,800 --> 00:30:00,440
Speaker 1: was Bobby Braswell like as a coach, tremendous, So like

571
00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:03,040
Speaker 1: you're asking me where I got from each guy? Bobby

572
00:30:03,080 --> 00:30:07,200
Speaker 1: Braswell was the most organized human being I've ever seen

573
00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:09,760
Speaker 1: in my life. Literally, I always tell him, even into

574
00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:12,440
Speaker 1: this day, I've never met a guy who majors in

575
00:30:12,440 --> 00:30:15,520
Speaker 1: the miners. More to the point, like I would come

576
00:30:15,560 --> 00:30:18,720
Speaker 1: into his office and you know, bras was very particulous.

577
00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:21,040
Speaker 1: He was on top of everything. Doug, you bring the

578
00:30:21,080 --> 00:30:24,320
Speaker 1: Scott report, it's neatly done, and you know he would

579
00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:27,280
Speaker 1: look over it and he would, you know, serve like

580
00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:31,680
Speaker 1: Doug Gottlie uh twenty six points a game, five rebounds,

581
00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:36,600
Speaker 1: eight assists, he'll he'll he'll pass by that goaes Hey Johnson, Johnson,

582
00:30:37,000 --> 00:30:39,480
Speaker 1: you missed the comma. I'm like, miss the comma? Did

583
00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:42,440
Speaker 1: you see the Doug eight? You know you're worried about

584
00:30:42,440 --> 00:30:46,240
Speaker 1: the comma. But he was so into the two little things.

585
00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:50,000
Speaker 1: You know, uh, when pregame meal comes out the exact

586
00:30:50,040 --> 00:30:53,080
Speaker 1: minute where the bus is parked. His whole deal was

587
00:30:53,600 --> 00:30:56,360
Speaker 1: we can win forty to fifty percent of our games

588
00:30:56,400 --> 00:31:00,840
Speaker 1: just on being organized. And Matt has stuck with me.

589
00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:05,480
Speaker 1: You know how organized you have to be in order

590
00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:09,000
Speaker 1: to get the best out of your team, your program,

591
00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:12,360
Speaker 1: your organization. And I'm so thankful when I stopped, because

592
00:31:13,160 --> 00:31:15,840
Speaker 1: that's why brows are so good at Northridge. You know Northwridge,

593
00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:19,200
Speaker 1: you don't have a whole lot, but here's the organization.

594
00:31:20,120 --> 00:31:22,560
Speaker 1: It was why he was able to be I mean

595
00:31:22,640 --> 00:31:25,600
Speaker 1: for the longest time, the longest turnument after American coach

596
00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:29,520
Speaker 1: in America that the organizational pieces is what I stole

597
00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:33,800
Speaker 1: from brass Um. Okay. So then you go with Jim

598
00:31:33,840 --> 00:31:38,959
Speaker 1: Boiling at Utah, now boiling obviously, Okay, how first, how

599
00:31:38,960 --> 00:31:42,760
Speaker 1: did you get the job? I've got jobs just you

600
00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:45,640
Speaker 1: know again, it's funny, man, when you it's amazing sometimes

601
00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:47,280
Speaker 1: when you just work and you put your head down,

602
00:31:47,400 --> 00:31:50,840
Speaker 1: good things can happen. That's kind of always been my philosophy.

603
00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:52,440
Speaker 1: But I've learned that you have to you have to

604
00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:54,200
Speaker 1: network a little more, and I've learned that a little

605
00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:56,680
Speaker 1: later in my career. But so I'm at cash State,

606
00:31:57,520 --> 00:32:00,960
Speaker 1: the Meetest Hills, and you remember they used to have

607
00:32:01,000 --> 00:32:06,800
Speaker 1: all those big I'm working at North Rids that summer. Um.

608
00:32:06,840 --> 00:32:09,360
Speaker 1: I'm walking in the door as Jim's coming in. Jim

609
00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:11,800
Speaker 1: just got the job, so I've got our North Ride

610
00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:14,040
Speaker 1: stuff on and I and I shake his hand. We're

611
00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:15,920
Speaker 1: coming in at the same time, and I say, hey, man,

612
00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:19,320
Speaker 1: I'm from Salt Lake. Congratulations, you're gonna love that place.

613
00:32:19,320 --> 00:32:22,760
Speaker 1: You've got a great program, you're inheriting. The people are awesome.

614
00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:26,160
Speaker 1: They love basketball. Really, that's the gist of our conversation.

615
00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:30,880
Speaker 1: I go down and sit and we don't talk again. Well,

616
00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:34,000
Speaker 1: fast forward a year. My phone rings and it's boiling

617
00:32:34,800 --> 00:32:36,800
Speaker 1: and he's already done some background check on me, and

618
00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:38,320
Speaker 1: he sits. Then you know, I have a you know,

619
00:32:38,360 --> 00:32:41,080
Speaker 1: Marty Wilson has left, He's gone a Pepperdine. I'd like

620
00:32:41,160 --> 00:32:43,560
Speaker 1: to talk to you about this job. And I want

621
00:32:43,600 --> 00:32:46,200
Speaker 1: you to know, like a year ago, I can tell

622
00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:50,720
Speaker 1: you exactly what you were wearing and what you were doing.

623
00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:53,040
Speaker 1: He said, you had tackie pants on, you had a

624
00:32:53,040 --> 00:32:57,400
Speaker 1: white shirt tucked in. I watched you sit during that

625
00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:01,560
Speaker 1: entire event by yourself, took notes. You weren't really talking

626
00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:04,320
Speaker 1: to anybody. I was evaluating you and I didn't even

627
00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:07,480
Speaker 1: know you. And that really stuck with me. And I've

628
00:33:07,520 --> 00:33:09,600
Speaker 1: done some research on you now and this is where

629
00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:11,680
Speaker 1: we're at. So let me just think about that. And

630
00:33:11,720 --> 00:33:13,880
Speaker 1: I told our guys all the time. Now, you know,

631
00:33:14,080 --> 00:33:18,000
Speaker 1: wherever I've been, you never you were always being evaluated.

632
00:33:19,280 --> 00:33:22,520
Speaker 1: You know, you don't know who's watching, who's looking. And

633
00:33:22,840 --> 00:33:25,160
Speaker 1: I've lived that. I mean, for a guy to for

634
00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:27,000
Speaker 1: a year later to tell me the color slacks and

635
00:33:27,040 --> 00:33:28,680
Speaker 1: the type of shoes I had on in the polo,

636
00:33:29,240 --> 00:33:31,120
Speaker 1: and to tell me what I was doing at this event,

637
00:33:31,600 --> 00:33:34,200
Speaker 1: that really stuck with me. And I mean, that's that's

638
00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:38,720
Speaker 1: how I got that job. What was boiling? Uh? Like

639
00:33:38,800 --> 00:33:41,720
Speaker 1: there there, there's there's a lot to boiling. I liked Jim,

640
00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:45,000
Speaker 1: I interacted some, I did some of the games. I mean,

641
00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:48,160
Speaker 1: I do know that that that he I was told

642
00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:50,320
Speaker 1: he wore some dudes out with the like who had

643
00:33:50,360 --> 00:33:52,080
Speaker 1: to collect the cell phones on the road. He was

644
00:33:52,280 --> 00:33:53,800
Speaker 1: he was one of the first to collect the cell

645
00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:57,880
Speaker 1: phones on the roney. Yeah, yeah, one of us did.

646
00:33:57,920 --> 00:34:01,640
Speaker 1: I can't remember who did. But you know, Jim is

647
00:34:01,680 --> 00:34:04,000
Speaker 1: one of my best friends in the business. I mean,

648
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:06,720
Speaker 1: we are type. You know, there's been so many times,

649
00:34:06,720 --> 00:34:09,120
Speaker 1: even the very coach of the Bulls, he's he'll come

650
00:34:09,160 --> 00:34:11,960
Speaker 1: down here before the season and you know, we'll stay

651
00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:14,120
Speaker 1: with our staff and talk defense. And I mean he's

652
00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:16,120
Speaker 1: a giver that way. I taught people all the time,

653
00:34:16,120 --> 00:34:18,040
Speaker 1: like you see him on the sideline, especially in college,

654
00:34:18,040 --> 00:34:22,120
Speaker 1: and he he's the most caring human being I've ever

655
00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:25,840
Speaker 1: been around. The guy would literally take off his shirt

656
00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:28,320
Speaker 1: for you. But you don't really get to you wouldn't

657
00:34:28,360 --> 00:34:31,120
Speaker 1: know that unless you get to really know him. But

658
00:34:31,320 --> 00:34:35,200
Speaker 1: really really intense. And it's intense that he comes from

659
00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:37,600
Speaker 1: his love of the game and his love for his players.

660
00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:41,840
Speaker 1: I mean, but he's he was an intense guy. And uh,

661
00:34:41,920 --> 00:34:43,880
Speaker 1: the thing I love most about Jim, you know, he

662
00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:46,719
Speaker 1: taught me about game prep. You know, he has a

663
00:34:46,760 --> 00:34:49,200
Speaker 1: football mindset. How you prep for a game. You know

664
00:34:49,239 --> 00:34:52,480
Speaker 1: your offensive package, how you implant, how you implement a

665
00:34:52,520 --> 00:34:55,239
Speaker 1: defensive system. I mean it was next level. I mean

666
00:34:55,239 --> 00:34:58,719
Speaker 1: our defense. You know when I was there, was was

667
00:34:58,760 --> 00:35:02,920
Speaker 1: off the charts. Uh. His terminology, you know, everybody's speaking

668
00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:08,000
Speaker 1: the same language. You know, his his basketball I Q um,

669
00:35:08,160 --> 00:35:11,160
Speaker 1: it's as good as anybody I've I've been around. Um

670
00:35:11,360 --> 00:35:14,319
Speaker 1: And uh yeah, you know Jim, I mean you had

671
00:35:14,360 --> 00:35:16,600
Speaker 1: to be tough to play there, and you have to

672
00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:19,919
Speaker 1: be tough to play for him, because that's that's really

673
00:35:19,960 --> 00:35:24,120
Speaker 1: who he is. You know, it's interesting I did uh

674
00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:27,719
Speaker 1: that year, his his third year, I think you're still there.

675
00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:30,520
Speaker 1: His third year, you guys were very good, played out

676
00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:36,279
Speaker 1: in Hawaii and um, yeah, he struggled. And but your

677
00:35:36,280 --> 00:35:38,920
Speaker 1: first game was against Butler. Now this is Butler. The

678
00:35:39,000 --> 00:35:41,839
Speaker 1: year after they went to the National champions and they

679
00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:43,759
Speaker 1: went again. They went again, They lost to Yukon. They

680
00:35:43,760 --> 00:35:46,600
Speaker 1: couldn't couldn't score. And he was like one of the

681
00:35:46,640 --> 00:35:48,640
Speaker 1: first ones that says, like, what do you think of Butler?

682
00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:54,239
Speaker 1: And I was like, Jim, I think they're like crazy physical.

683
00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:58,600
Speaker 1: He's like, listen to me, that's the most physical fucking

684
00:35:58,600 --> 00:36:01,120
Speaker 1: team on earth. He goes, they look like look like

685
00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:04,520
Speaker 1: choir boys and they hit you like sailors. He's like,

686
00:36:04,600 --> 00:36:06,640
Speaker 1: you don't let don't let the don't let the clean cut.

687
00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:09,040
Speaker 1: Like you wait, they're gonna kick our ass tomorrow. I

688
00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:11,360
Speaker 1: remember he's telling me, you have those quick practices and

689
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:13,640
Speaker 1: meetings whatever. They're gonna kick our Our kids are not

690
00:36:13,719 --> 00:36:16,359
Speaker 1: ready for Butler or whatever. And sure enough, and then

691
00:36:16,719 --> 00:36:18,279
Speaker 1: I think you guys got your ass kicked by him.

692
00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:20,200
Speaker 1: He walks by the table, was like told you. He

693
00:36:20,239 --> 00:36:22,600
Speaker 1: goes that, that's one of the toughest teams I've you know,

694
00:36:22,680 --> 00:36:26,640
Speaker 1: most physically tough teams I've ever seen. And he goes, you,

695
00:36:26,640 --> 00:36:28,920
Speaker 1: you watch, I bet they I bet they go to

696
00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:31,360
Speaker 1: He said something flippant, like at the hotel, Like, I

697
00:36:31,440 --> 00:36:34,160
Speaker 1: bet they go another final four. They got the championship game.

698
00:36:34,600 --> 00:36:41,760
Speaker 1: Good championship game. Um, yeah, he's he's an interesting he's

699
00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:44,520
Speaker 1: if there was one thing that could have helped him,

700
00:36:44,680 --> 00:36:46,680
Speaker 1: could have could have saved him, you go, like, we

701
00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:49,000
Speaker 1: would have done this, It would have ended up better

702
00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:51,080
Speaker 1: because it started out hot as can be right. He

703
00:36:51,160 --> 00:36:56,359
Speaker 1: replaces Jack o Letty and he's doing great rolling. Um,

704
00:36:56,400 --> 00:36:58,839
Speaker 1: if you could have, if you could could have, if

705
00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:00,759
Speaker 1: is there a butterfly? If at moment where if we

706
00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:02,400
Speaker 1: would have done this, this, this, and this might not

707
00:37:02,480 --> 00:37:04,600
Speaker 1: have happened. What would have been Yeah, you know what

708
00:37:04,760 --> 00:37:08,000
Speaker 1: I think, you know the thing I've learned from that

709
00:37:08,080 --> 00:37:10,359
Speaker 1: experience to be answer you, I mean, there's so many

710
00:37:10,360 --> 00:37:12,839
Speaker 1: things you can do better. And much as much as

711
00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:16,479
Speaker 1: that sucked, especially it sucked for me because that's home, man,

712
00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:20,920
Speaker 1: Like that's home. There there's nothing worse than getting fired

713
00:37:20,960 --> 00:37:25,080
Speaker 1: in your hometown. And and that really scarred me for

714
00:37:25,120 --> 00:37:28,480
Speaker 1: a long time. It scarred Jim. You know, we we

715
00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:31,120
Speaker 1: poured a lot into that place. You know, we could

716
00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:33,640
Speaker 1: have done a lot of things better. But but but

717
00:37:33,680 --> 00:37:36,800
Speaker 1: the one thing that I would say that we should

718
00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:39,000
Speaker 1: have and could have if we could hit rewind, is

719
00:37:39,320 --> 00:37:42,880
Speaker 1: we should have found a way to stay old, you know,

720
00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:45,520
Speaker 1: like we were rolling the year we won the league,

721
00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:49,520
Speaker 1: I think it was. But from that time, that seed

722
00:37:49,560 --> 00:37:51,799
Speaker 1: that was the highest seed in the history of the

723
00:37:51,800 --> 00:37:54,719
Speaker 1: Mountain West Conference, right, that was back we had I

724
00:37:54,760 --> 00:37:57,759
Speaker 1: had I had my brother on a couple of weeks ago,

725
00:37:57,800 --> 00:37:59,320
Speaker 1: maybe radio, I'm not sure it was. I think it

726
00:37:59,360 --> 00:38:00,880
Speaker 1: was known as pot and he was telling me about

727
00:38:00,920 --> 00:38:04,640
Speaker 1: like people forget you go back to two thousand and nine,

728
00:38:04,680 --> 00:38:10,440
Speaker 1: two Mountain West never got good Monster League, I mean

729
00:38:10,480 --> 00:38:14,279
Speaker 1: Pros after Pros, great coaching. But what we did is

730
00:38:14,520 --> 00:38:17,520
Speaker 1: we try. I mean we lost our top seven guys

731
00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:23,920
Speaker 1: off that team, right, and we went young. You know,

732
00:38:24,040 --> 00:38:26,359
Speaker 1: we went really young, and we were going to try

733
00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:28,680
Speaker 1: to build back up. So like when you saw us,

734
00:38:28,719 --> 00:38:31,080
Speaker 1: we were a young team. You know, if I could

735
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:33,000
Speaker 1: have gone back, we would have found ways to stay

736
00:38:33,080 --> 00:38:37,360
Speaker 1: old and had some older guys waiting that could step

737
00:38:37,400 --> 00:38:40,360
Speaker 1: in and play. And we didn't really have that. I

738
00:38:40,480 --> 00:38:44,879
Speaker 1: do think had we survived, you know, one more year,

739
00:38:45,719 --> 00:38:47,359
Speaker 1: the year they let him go up, we had one

740
00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:50,520
Speaker 1: more year, we had a good team coming back and

741
00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:52,120
Speaker 1: we were going to have a chance to do it.

742
00:38:52,200 --> 00:38:55,080
Speaker 1: But in this day and age, man, you you have

743
00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:57,680
Speaker 1: to find ways, especially when at a place like that

744
00:38:57,680 --> 00:39:00,839
Speaker 1: where the expectations are so high, You've got to find

745
00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:04,200
Speaker 1: ways that to stay old. And uh, we we could

746
00:39:04,239 --> 00:39:07,120
Speaker 1: have done that. Uh, I had a lot better. And

747
00:39:07,160 --> 00:39:09,200
Speaker 1: you know I think that personal, you know, as an

748
00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:13,319
Speaker 1: assistant coach and for him, because Jive is fantastic and

749
00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:17,680
Speaker 1: uh he's a terrific basketball coach. Uh. You know, again,

750
00:39:17,719 --> 00:39:21,120
Speaker 1: if anybody who's worth the assault and worked their way,

751
00:39:21,280 --> 00:39:22,719
Speaker 1: I think you look in word and said, you know

752
00:39:22,760 --> 00:39:25,160
Speaker 1: what could have done better? And that's your advice. I

753
00:39:25,200 --> 00:39:27,279
Speaker 1: would have given him, not certain something I would have done.

754
00:39:27,400 --> 00:39:31,120
Speaker 1: We know, I know, and you think I think, I

755
00:39:31,120 --> 00:39:32,799
Speaker 1: think what coaches thinking. You tell me from on, But

756
00:39:32,800 --> 00:39:35,799
Speaker 1: coaches think that if they tell the world, hey, we're

757
00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:38,239
Speaker 1: super young, that everybody will understand you can't win with

758
00:39:38,280 --> 00:39:41,040
Speaker 1: young players. But they just don't. They they're like, well

759
00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:43,399
Speaker 1: he's every young, but they but you know, it's like

760
00:39:43,800 --> 00:39:47,120
Speaker 1: and in that league, especially any league now, but really

761
00:39:47,200 --> 00:39:49,680
Speaker 1: in that league especially because I would say the Mountain

762
00:39:49,719 --> 00:39:53,520
Speaker 1: West back then it was transfer central, right, I mean,

763
00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:55,360
Speaker 1: like even j J O'Brien, who you guys had, it

764
00:39:55,400 --> 00:39:57,319
Speaker 1: was a freshman transfers he goes to Santa Us State.

765
00:39:57,760 --> 00:40:00,520
Speaker 1: It was, it became it was a transfers haven. So

766
00:40:00,680 --> 00:40:04,400
Speaker 1: if you're playing with true freshman, true sophomores, other teams

767
00:40:04,440 --> 00:40:07,200
Speaker 1: have fourth fifth sometimes you know, six year dudes. You know,

768
00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:10,680
Speaker 1: you're playing against legit men. They're just better. They're older,

769
00:40:10,680 --> 00:40:13,160
Speaker 1: they're bigger, they're better, they're more experienced, and it's really

770
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:16,360
Speaker 1: really hard. Yeah. Part then, yeah, thinking about j j

771
00:40:16,440 --> 00:40:19,279
Speaker 1: Olbrian jj Olbriant was a monster that's what I'm saying.

772
00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:21,279
Speaker 1: Like that we had in one more year, so we

773
00:40:21,360 --> 00:40:23,640
Speaker 1: had Will Kleiberg. I don't know if you on that team.

774
00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:26,239
Speaker 1: Williberg left and he went to Iowa State. He was

775
00:40:26,280 --> 00:40:31,359
Speaker 1: the best player, like junior college, I think college American. Right. Yeah,

776
00:40:31,440 --> 00:40:34,279
Speaker 1: we were just we were just we were we were

777
00:40:34,320 --> 00:40:37,960
Speaker 1: young and playing against men and we didn't have time.

778
00:40:38,280 --> 00:40:43,160
Speaker 1: And okay, that's on us and on that um. We

779
00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:45,359
Speaker 1: could have done a better job for him that way.

780
00:40:45,480 --> 00:40:50,160
Speaker 1: So you get fired, you're in your hometown. Uh what happens?

781
00:40:51,800 --> 00:40:54,680
Speaker 1: We get fired? And I'm just you know, I just

782
00:40:54,760 --> 00:40:57,840
Speaker 1: explained to you how my career was going, right. I

783
00:40:57,880 --> 00:41:00,960
Speaker 1: mean it's like you win, you go here and win,

784
00:41:01,040 --> 00:41:02,800
Speaker 1: you go here and win, and you get this false

785
00:41:03,160 --> 00:41:06,400
Speaker 1: it's like a false cress. You know, you think you're

786
00:41:06,440 --> 00:41:10,200
Speaker 1: at the peak, you know what, And I started getting

787
00:41:10,239 --> 00:41:11,880
Speaker 1: this single. Oh man, you know what. Look, I mean,

788
00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:13,960
Speaker 1: good things just happened. I'm never gonna get fired. I

789
00:41:14,000 --> 00:41:16,560
Speaker 1: mean we're good. We just went wherever I go. We win.

790
00:41:16,640 --> 00:41:20,000
Speaker 1: It's like, get ready to humble yourself. Bro. Not only

791
00:41:20,040 --> 00:41:22,160
Speaker 1: you're gonna get fired, You're gonna get fired in your hometown.

792
00:41:23,040 --> 00:41:26,520
Speaker 1: And then you you realize. It was my first wake

793
00:41:26,640 --> 00:41:30,120
Speaker 1: up call to the business. Like the minute you get fired,

794
00:41:30,320 --> 00:41:35,640
Speaker 1: it's like you have some sort of disease that people

795
00:41:35,640 --> 00:41:38,799
Speaker 1: will catch if they talk to you, will come next

796
00:41:38,840 --> 00:41:44,160
Speaker 1: to you, and you realize very quickly who's with you?

797
00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:47,879
Speaker 1: And I'm amazed during that experience, guys, I've never even

798
00:41:47,920 --> 00:41:50,440
Speaker 1: really talked to you know. At that point, I think

799
00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:53,239
Speaker 1: that's when the relationship with with your brother and I

800
00:41:53,280 --> 00:41:56,600
Speaker 1: started to grow. Like I knew him but didn't like

801
00:41:56,840 --> 00:41:59,520
Speaker 1: you start all of a sudden, guys start reaching out

802
00:41:59,600 --> 00:42:02,719
Speaker 1: and looking out for you, and so that was interesting.

803
00:42:02,760 --> 00:42:05,560
Speaker 1: But I I interviewed for like five or six jobs,

804
00:42:05,560 --> 00:42:08,839
Speaker 1: I'm not kidding you, and uh I missed out on

805
00:42:08,920 --> 00:42:11,840
Speaker 1: four of them, literally to the head coach's best friend,

806
00:42:12,080 --> 00:42:14,480
Speaker 1: or at least that's what I was told every time

807
00:42:14,520 --> 00:42:17,160
Speaker 1: I got the call saying no. So I get I

808
00:42:17,160 --> 00:42:20,680
Speaker 1: don't know how many knows and I'm on my last leg. Man,

809
00:42:21,239 --> 00:42:25,840
Speaker 1: I've got a young kid. Um I think we had

810
00:42:26,080 --> 00:42:28,600
Speaker 1: actually had we had two kids at that time. One

811
00:42:28,680 --> 00:42:31,360
Speaker 1: was a little baby. They're both babies. Insurance is getting

812
00:42:31,360 --> 00:42:34,120
Speaker 1: to run out. I hear that Drake has an opening,

813
00:42:34,239 --> 00:42:37,000
Speaker 1: and somebody gets me kind of lined up with Mark Phelps.

814
00:42:37,560 --> 00:42:40,759
Speaker 1: So I called Phelps and we're talking and Phelps said, Hey, Stan, listen, man,

815
00:42:41,520 --> 00:42:44,520
Speaker 1: I'd like to bring you in, but um, I don't

816
00:42:44,520 --> 00:42:47,120
Speaker 1: know if I can. I have another guy i'm bringing

817
00:42:47,160 --> 00:42:48,839
Speaker 1: in for an interview. I think I'm set with him.

818
00:42:48,840 --> 00:42:51,040
Speaker 1: I'm only going to bring in one. And I'm getting

819
00:42:51,040 --> 00:42:52,680
Speaker 1: ready to put down on my phone and something said,

820
00:42:52,680 --> 00:42:55,000
Speaker 1: do not let this dude off the phone. This is

821
00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:59,759
Speaker 1: it for you, and I just said to him, I said, Mark, listen, man,

822
00:43:00,320 --> 00:43:02,800
Speaker 1: if you bring me in, it will be the best

823
00:43:02,880 --> 00:43:05,960
Speaker 1: thing you've done in your entire life. I'm just asking

824
00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:11,600
Speaker 1: you for a chance. It was literally that, and he said, uh,

825
00:43:12,719 --> 00:43:16,000
Speaker 1: I don't know, man, Maybe i'll call you back. Like

826
00:43:16,080 --> 00:43:17,920
Speaker 1: two hours lady called me back and said that really

827
00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:19,239
Speaker 1: hit me. I want to bring you in. I went

828
00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:21,600
Speaker 1: and interviewed with him and got the job. But I

829
00:43:21,640 --> 00:43:24,680
Speaker 1: don't know where I would have been had that not happened.

830
00:43:25,080 --> 00:43:28,440
Speaker 1: You know, you can get out of his business really quick. Um.

831
00:43:28,480 --> 00:43:32,520
Speaker 1: So that was my next step from from Utah to joke.

832
00:43:33,120 --> 00:43:35,560
Speaker 1: It's interesting. I had just had a I just texted

833
00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:40,160
Speaker 1: a buddy of mine who is on staff with a

834
00:43:40,680 --> 00:43:43,720
Speaker 1: major a big school, and they just lost lost a coach,

835
00:43:44,560 --> 00:43:45,840
Speaker 1: and I said, who is he bringing in? He's like,

836
00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:47,799
Speaker 1: I don't know. I said, is he gonna move you up?

837
00:43:47,800 --> 00:43:50,640
Speaker 1: He's like, I don't know. We've asked now, we haven't

838
00:43:50,640 --> 00:43:52,360
Speaker 1: really talked about that. And I was like, can I

839
00:43:52,400 --> 00:43:55,200
Speaker 1: give you some advice? It's like, sure, My advice is

840
00:43:55,239 --> 00:43:57,239
Speaker 1: walking to his up sucking office and tell him, Hey, man,

841
00:43:57,480 --> 00:43:59,080
Speaker 1: I want the job. I know how do you work?

842
00:43:59,120 --> 00:44:01,200
Speaker 1: I know what you want. I can do it. Just

843
00:44:01,280 --> 00:44:03,040
Speaker 1: do it. I don't know if he's gonna do it,

844
00:44:03,080 --> 00:44:05,239
Speaker 1: but it's like, you know, it's one of those things. Look,

845
00:44:05,280 --> 00:44:07,800
Speaker 1: I've gotten myself. There was one of the three places

846
00:44:07,840 --> 00:44:11,480
Speaker 1: I worked where they didn't dig that. But generally, you know,

847
00:44:11,640 --> 00:44:14,359
Speaker 1: like sometimes you don't only have to walk to take

848
00:44:14,400 --> 00:44:16,479
Speaker 1: the horse to water to make them drink. You actually

849
00:44:16,520 --> 00:44:18,600
Speaker 1: have to open their mouth, pour the water and close

850
00:44:18,640 --> 00:44:20,960
Speaker 1: their mouth and make them swallow sometimes and they go,

851
00:44:21,520 --> 00:44:24,319
Speaker 1: wow that water is this is pretty good? Okay? So

852
00:44:24,400 --> 00:44:28,400
Speaker 1: you go and you're you're at Drake the Bulldogs Des Moines, Iowa.

853
00:44:28,560 --> 00:44:33,680
Speaker 1: Mark Phelps is the coach. What was he like? Mark

854
00:44:33,800 --> 00:44:36,799
Speaker 1: was great? You know, Mark was was great? Mark? Uh,

855
00:44:37,000 --> 00:44:40,160
Speaker 1: you know I got there. I think Mark had already

856
00:44:40,200 --> 00:44:42,920
Speaker 1: been there three or four years, if I'm not mistaken,

857
00:44:43,000 --> 00:44:44,680
Speaker 1: So you've already had a lot of time. And that

858
00:44:44,840 --> 00:44:47,400
Speaker 1: that's the other thing. Sometimes, you know, when you're at

859
00:44:47,400 --> 00:44:49,560
Speaker 1: a place like you talk and you lose a job,

860
00:44:49,680 --> 00:44:51,880
Speaker 1: especially when you're a young guy and you're start, you

861
00:44:51,920 --> 00:44:54,520
Speaker 1: don't always go up, so sometimes you're gonna go lateral.

862
00:44:54,680 --> 00:44:57,160
Speaker 1: Maybe I can take a step back, or you get

863
00:44:57,200 --> 00:45:01,200
Speaker 1: back into a situation where it's not may be the greatest.

864
00:45:01,440 --> 00:45:03,759
Speaker 1: And so I'm going to Drake. Mark has already been there.

865
00:45:04,719 --> 00:45:07,239
Speaker 1: Mark has done a good job there, And my first

866
00:45:07,280 --> 00:45:09,400
Speaker 1: year there, I think outside of that team that went

867
00:45:09,440 --> 00:45:11,359
Speaker 1: to the tournament, we set the wind bark. I mean,

868
00:45:11,719 --> 00:45:14,520
Speaker 1: I think he was like he won the most games

869
00:45:14,520 --> 00:45:17,600
Speaker 1: of any coach at Drake. So we did some great things.

870
00:45:17,640 --> 00:45:20,960
Speaker 1: I was there two years, and you know, for for Drake,

871
00:45:21,080 --> 00:45:23,480
Speaker 1: we did some great things. But at the end of that,

872
00:45:23,920 --> 00:45:25,560
Speaker 1: you know, two years, all of a sudden, now he's

873
00:45:25,560 --> 00:45:28,000
Speaker 1: there five or six years, and you know how that goes,

874
00:45:28,800 --> 00:45:33,160
Speaker 1: and the a d wants to make a change. Uh

875
00:45:33,280 --> 00:45:37,600
Speaker 1: So she she made a change there and I actually

876
00:45:37,680 --> 00:45:40,000
Speaker 1: interviewed with her for the job, which was weird enough,

877
00:45:40,440 --> 00:45:44,160
Speaker 1: and they ended up hiring Ray Jackaletti and she and

878
00:45:45,840 --> 00:45:48,360
Speaker 1: straight enough you were part of the staff to replaced

879
00:45:48,400 --> 00:45:50,959
Speaker 1: him at Utah, right, like it's all now we've gotten

880
00:45:50,960 --> 00:45:56,759
Speaker 1: then diagram with the circles. By the way, I think

881
00:45:56,800 --> 00:45:59,480
Speaker 1: it was your last year you guys played Greg was

882
00:45:59,520 --> 00:46:02,080
Speaker 1: at cal I had just moved back out to the

883
00:46:02,080 --> 00:46:04,600
Speaker 1: West coast. You played him in the Anaheim Convention Center.

884
00:46:05,640 --> 00:46:08,600
Speaker 1: And and and Brett Nelson was on that staff too,

885
00:46:08,680 --> 00:46:12,759
Speaker 1: wasn't he? And right it was with us, Yeah, and

886
00:46:12,800 --> 00:46:15,719
Speaker 1: we had a we had a nice team, uh really

887
00:46:15,800 --> 00:46:18,000
Speaker 1: nice team and a great team coming back and again

888
00:46:18,080 --> 00:46:21,320
Speaker 1: they so they made the switch, and you know it's funny.

889
00:46:21,320 --> 00:46:23,200
Speaker 1: And so Ray get there and Ray's like, hey, stare

890
00:46:23,239 --> 00:46:24,880
Speaker 1: And you know, the one thing I always appreciated about

891
00:46:24,880 --> 00:46:28,680
Speaker 1: you was you were so gracious with me after you

892
00:46:28,719 --> 00:46:31,239
Speaker 1: guys replaced us. You know, I would tell Ray all

893
00:46:31,239 --> 00:46:34,000
Speaker 1: the time, Ray, you left us in great guys. You know,

894
00:46:34,040 --> 00:46:36,960
Speaker 1: this thing is on solid ground. And we had a

895
00:46:37,040 --> 00:46:40,520
Speaker 1: great starting We had two great starting blocks. But isn't

896
00:46:40,560 --> 00:46:42,960
Speaker 1: that amazing? So fast forward how many years now he's

897
00:46:43,000 --> 00:46:47,719
Speaker 1: the coach and maybe because of those conversations, he's, hey,

898
00:46:47,800 --> 00:46:49,839
Speaker 1: will you stay with me? You know, so I told

899
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:52,400
Speaker 1: Ray I would, but you know, if something came along,

900
00:46:53,280 --> 00:46:55,680
Speaker 1: you know, I would have to entertain that. And certainly,

901
00:46:55,800 --> 00:46:58,799
Speaker 1: like a week later, you know, her called me and

902
00:46:58,920 --> 00:47:01,240
Speaker 1: asked me to go to Arizona. Right, you guys, get

903
00:47:01,440 --> 00:47:03,920
Speaker 1: get fired at Drake right here you are. You're the

904
00:47:03,960 --> 00:47:08,800
Speaker 1: kiss of death right two straight jobs to strap kidding? Uh?

905
00:47:08,960 --> 00:47:14,800
Speaker 1: How did you? How did you end up at Arizona State? Um? So, actually,

906
00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:16,960
Speaker 1: you know, like I said, so I knew Ray Ray

907
00:47:16,960 --> 00:47:20,080
Speaker 1: and I Ady wants me to stay at Drake. So

908
00:47:20,160 --> 00:47:23,120
Speaker 1: I agree to stay. I'm probably whip him for a

909
00:47:23,160 --> 00:47:26,320
Speaker 1: week or so and my phone rings, I'll never get it.

910
00:47:26,400 --> 00:47:31,160
Speaker 1: A Saturday and I'm in the our facility there Drake

911
00:47:31,200 --> 00:47:33,520
Speaker 1: and a tope Syndeck on the other line and he

912
00:47:33,680 --> 00:47:39,600
Speaker 1: just has lost Dric to Fullerton and he's like, hey, Stan,

913
00:47:39,719 --> 00:47:42,319
Speaker 1: I you know I've got this opening. I would love

914
00:47:42,360 --> 00:47:45,560
Speaker 1: for you to come out here and uh, you know,

915
00:47:45,680 --> 00:47:47,680
Speaker 1: just visit with me. You know, I'd love for you

916
00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:50,320
Speaker 1: to be a part of my staff. And I'm my coach.

917
00:47:50,360 --> 00:47:53,319
Speaker 1: I just told these guys are going to stay. And

918
00:47:53,400 --> 00:47:54,920
Speaker 1: you know, so the more I thought about him, like

919
00:47:54,960 --> 00:47:57,160
Speaker 1: you know what you owe yourself this opportunity. So I

920
00:47:57,480 --> 00:47:59,359
Speaker 1: went to Phoenix, of which I knew was a trap

921
00:47:59,400 --> 00:48:03,360
Speaker 1: because if I went, it was over. I went and

922
00:48:03,440 --> 00:48:06,400
Speaker 1: sat with him and one on the tour of the place,

923
00:48:06,520 --> 00:48:09,640
Speaker 1: and and you know, I end up taking a job.

924
00:48:10,640 --> 00:48:16,479
Speaker 1: So I'm with Herb at Arizona State. Okay, Now Herb

925
00:48:16,560 --> 00:48:20,800
Speaker 1: syndic is it's it's weird, Like he's such a brilliant

926
00:48:20,800 --> 00:48:24,520
Speaker 1: guy and brilliant coach. Um, and in spite of his

927
00:48:24,640 --> 00:48:29,359
Speaker 1: success at NC State, he was never kind of their guy, right, Um,

928
00:48:29,400 --> 00:48:32,480
Speaker 1: he had success in my Ohio before that. He's obviously

929
00:48:32,480 --> 00:48:34,480
Speaker 1: now building something. But at Santa Clara you'll have to

930
00:48:34,480 --> 00:48:40,080
Speaker 1: compete against him. Um, he's you know Carnegie Mellen, you know,

931
00:48:40,400 --> 00:48:44,960
Speaker 1: like super bright, super genius dude. And I believe, like

932
00:48:45,840 --> 00:48:49,600
Speaker 1: Rick Pettino almost like idolizes him. Like Rick Pettino who

933
00:48:49,680 --> 00:48:52,000
Speaker 1: used to be on his staff, thinks he's just a

934
00:48:52,040 --> 00:48:54,640
Speaker 1: brilliant but their styles are so very different. What was

935
00:48:55,080 --> 00:49:00,319
Speaker 1: what's syndic? Like he's outstanding, Doug. I mean, for of all,

936
00:49:00,400 --> 00:49:03,880
Speaker 1: he is a complete gentleman, you know, I mean I've

937
00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:07,920
Speaker 1: not been around um a better person. You know when

938
00:49:07,920 --> 00:49:12,560
Speaker 1: you talk about somebody with a pure heart, Uh, somebody

939
00:49:12,600 --> 00:49:16,400
Speaker 1: who's in it for all the right reasons. UM, that's HERB.

940
00:49:16,840 --> 00:49:21,879
Speaker 1: And you met that with just ultra intelligence, I mean

941
00:49:22,320 --> 00:49:26,080
Speaker 1: crazy intelligence, you know, freaky to the point. You know.

942
00:49:26,160 --> 00:49:29,600
Speaker 1: Doug Collins and I got really close, and Doug would

943
00:49:29,600 --> 00:49:31,080
Speaker 1: come over all the time because he has a home

944
00:49:31,120 --> 00:49:33,840
Speaker 1: in Phoenix, and Doug would come my office. And if

945
00:49:33,880 --> 00:49:38,719
Speaker 1: you like stand, you've got to get HERB to simplify.

946
00:49:38,920 --> 00:49:42,200
Speaker 1: So I would go in there. We're going there like, okay, coach,

947
00:49:42,920 --> 00:49:46,239
Speaker 1: you gotta you know the zone offense. I know you

948
00:49:46,320 --> 00:49:48,919
Speaker 1: think like that, but let's let's really stify that. He's like, okay,

949
00:49:48,960 --> 00:49:51,880
Speaker 1: I can he come back? And it'd be the most

950
00:49:51,880 --> 00:49:54,520
Speaker 1: complex thing you've ever seen. And in his mind it

951
00:49:54,640 --> 00:49:59,960
Speaker 1: was so simple. But he's just so bright, so intellig

952
00:50:00,080 --> 00:50:03,759
Speaker 1: j But he taught me really what it was like

953
00:50:03,880 --> 00:50:07,279
Speaker 1: to be a CEO, how you run a program, how

954
00:50:07,640 --> 00:50:10,759
Speaker 1: to be efficient with your time. Um, you know, how

955
00:50:10,800 --> 00:50:14,440
Speaker 1: to not only coach basketball, but all the other parts

956
00:50:15,640 --> 00:50:19,800
Speaker 1: of the program UH that or needed to be addressed

957
00:50:19,800 --> 00:50:23,880
Speaker 1: in order UH to achieve great success, whether that's you know,

958
00:50:23,920 --> 00:50:28,080
Speaker 1: in the community, organizing the plans or that uh with

959
00:50:28,239 --> 00:50:30,640
Speaker 1: your games and your boosters, organizing the plan or that

960
00:50:30,719 --> 00:50:34,200
Speaker 1: how you how do you control your messaging? Uh? He

961
00:50:34,280 --> 00:50:37,720
Speaker 1: was he was just the next level with that stuff.

962
00:50:37,760 --> 00:50:40,160
Speaker 1: But Herb did in the way where you always felt

963
00:50:40,200 --> 00:50:46,320
Speaker 1: like you were working with him and not for him. Um,

964
00:50:46,320 --> 00:50:48,759
Speaker 1: who is your who is your? Who is the get

965
00:50:48,840 --> 00:50:54,920
Speaker 1: that you're most prideful in recruiting in Arizona State? That

966
00:50:55,040 --> 00:50:59,160
Speaker 1: I'm most prideful in recruiting. Yeah, like I saw like

967
00:50:59,160 --> 00:51:01,160
Speaker 1: like you know when you talked to coaches, coaches, it's

968
00:51:01,160 --> 00:51:03,279
Speaker 1: not necessarily the best player, it's just a guy that

969
00:51:03,360 --> 00:51:06,439
Speaker 1: you saw that you believed in that You're like, yeah,

970
00:51:06,600 --> 00:51:09,520
Speaker 1: I saw this when nobody else did. That's an easy

971
00:51:09,560 --> 00:51:11,920
Speaker 1: one for me. We there was a kid. So when

972
00:51:11,920 --> 00:51:13,680
Speaker 1: I got the job, you know, we had a heat

973
00:51:13,760 --> 00:51:16,920
Speaker 1: Carson and I heard been there for a while and

974
00:51:17,000 --> 00:51:20,680
Speaker 1: we needed to really we needed to add to him

975
00:51:20,680 --> 00:51:23,440
Speaker 1: and Jordi Vascensky are our big kid in order to

976
00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:26,480
Speaker 1: give ourselves a chance to be a tournament team. And

977
00:51:26,520 --> 00:51:30,200
Speaker 1: I remember a buddy of mine from D two calling

978
00:51:30,239 --> 00:51:32,480
Speaker 1: me and say hey, sending me an email saying there's

979
00:51:32,480 --> 00:51:37,920
Speaker 1: this kids to kill mckisick up here, and you know

980
00:51:37,960 --> 00:51:43,520
Speaker 1: in in in Washington, and you need to You've gotta

981
00:51:43,600 --> 00:51:47,880
Speaker 1: you've gotta look at this kid. So he says in

982
00:51:47,960 --> 00:51:50,560
Speaker 1: a highlighting the kids is a freak athlete. Well, you know,

983
00:51:50,600 --> 00:51:53,960
Speaker 1: you do your background check and uh, you know as

984
00:51:54,000 --> 00:51:56,000
Speaker 1: a high school kid, he had had it, you know,

985
00:51:56,040 --> 00:51:59,720
Speaker 1: an issue. Um, he made a he made a bad choice,

986
00:52:00,640 --> 00:52:03,520
Speaker 1: but that choice really affected him. I mean he couldn't

987
00:52:03,560 --> 00:52:06,480
Speaker 1: go to his his scholarship and a a division at a

988
00:52:07,200 --> 00:52:11,680
Speaker 1: Junior college Division one school Juco D one got taken away.

989
00:52:11,840 --> 00:52:15,319
Speaker 1: He's got to go to school up in the Northwest,

990
00:52:15,400 --> 00:52:18,680
Speaker 1: and uh, you know those schools, they don't have scholarship.

991
00:52:18,760 --> 00:52:20,520
Speaker 1: So he's got to get a job. At some point.

992
00:52:20,560 --> 00:52:22,920
Speaker 1: He's homeless. And I'm like, you know, what is my

993
00:52:22,960 --> 00:52:25,320
Speaker 1: first year here. I don't know if I can bring

994
00:52:25,320 --> 00:52:29,239
Speaker 1: this to the table. So I ignore it for a

995
00:52:29,280 --> 00:52:31,680
Speaker 1: week and someone was just army. I came back to

996
00:52:31,760 --> 00:52:34,000
Speaker 1: and I brought it to herb and we take it

997
00:52:34,040 --> 00:52:35,279
Speaker 1: to the A D and he says, you know what,

998
00:52:35,400 --> 00:52:37,960
Speaker 1: let's bring him in and let's let's let's see what

999
00:52:38,000 --> 00:52:41,280
Speaker 1: he's like. And we bring this kid in Shakil McKissick.

1000
00:52:41,719 --> 00:52:45,880
Speaker 1: And he's just a beautiful kid, war class athlete, I mean,

1001
00:52:45,920 --> 00:52:49,320
Speaker 1: could really jump, has all the you know, the talent

1002
00:52:49,600 --> 00:52:52,560
Speaker 1: is just a little row we add into that mix

1003
00:52:52,800 --> 00:52:56,240
Speaker 1: and he ends up being, uh, you know, a huge

1004
00:52:56,440 --> 00:53:00,160
Speaker 1: part of our success. But even greater than that as

1005
00:53:00,440 --> 00:53:03,840
Speaker 1: a senior year, he's that much better. Now he's overseas

1006
00:53:03,840 --> 00:53:05,520
Speaker 1: and one of the big leagues over there, making a

1007
00:53:05,560 --> 00:53:08,840
Speaker 1: lot of money, and his whole life has changed because

1008
00:53:08,880 --> 00:53:12,319
Speaker 1: of that. Yeah, you know, I'm grateful for that that

1009
00:53:12,440 --> 00:53:15,399
Speaker 1: I took the chance and I came back and gave

1010
00:53:15,440 --> 00:53:17,719
Speaker 1: a guy a chance like that, because who knows where

1011
00:53:17,719 --> 00:53:20,799
Speaker 1: he would have been, you know, had had somebody not

1012
00:53:21,080 --> 00:53:23,600
Speaker 1: put their neck on the line for him. So that

1013
00:53:23,600 --> 00:53:26,360
Speaker 1: that's the one guy there that I'm I'm so prideful

1014
00:53:26,400 --> 00:53:30,719
Speaker 1: and so thankful that we took I say, so, now

1015
00:53:30,760 --> 00:53:33,759
Speaker 1: you're working for a guy and Herb Syndics. You know,

1016
00:53:34,440 --> 00:53:37,240
Speaker 1: between Sean Miller like you, you go all around the country.

1017
00:53:37,239 --> 00:53:39,719
Speaker 1: Herb Syndics got guys that have have worked for him.

1018
00:53:39,760 --> 00:53:42,759
Speaker 1: So I'm sure now you're thinking, head coach, head coach,

1019
00:53:42,800 --> 00:53:47,759
Speaker 1: head coach, how did you get to Marquette? So I'm

1020
00:53:47,760 --> 00:53:50,640
Speaker 1: with her, and then again I'm with her. Hers been

1021
00:53:50,680 --> 00:53:52,520
Speaker 1: there forever, I think, you know. When I was with her,

1022
00:53:53,040 --> 00:53:57,239
Speaker 1: we was working for two years. My first year, we

1023
00:53:56,920 --> 00:53:59,120
Speaker 1: we we get that team back to the tournament. We

1024
00:53:59,200 --> 00:54:01,279
Speaker 1: kind of third in the Act twelve. We come back

1025
00:54:01,280 --> 00:54:04,000
Speaker 1: with one of the youngest teams in Fact twelve. The

1026
00:54:04,120 --> 00:54:08,879
Speaker 1: following year, I think we finished like this. We were

1027
00:54:08,920 --> 00:54:14,880
Speaker 1: picked ninth. In December, we heard signed an extension. We

1028
00:54:15,040 --> 00:54:17,040
Speaker 1: get to the n I t and at the end

1029
00:54:17,040 --> 00:54:20,520
Speaker 1: of the year they decided to make a change. So, uh,

1030
00:54:21,719 --> 00:54:25,240
Speaker 1: you know, her losing his job b a d there again.

1031
00:54:25,360 --> 00:54:27,920
Speaker 1: He asked me to stay. He says, hey, whoever I

1032
00:54:27,960 --> 00:54:31,399
Speaker 1: interviewed with his job, one of the things that we're

1033
00:54:31,400 --> 00:54:33,160
Speaker 1: going to ask h him and they have to keep you.

1034
00:54:33,560 --> 00:54:36,000
Speaker 1: And he was a man of his word. He did that.

1035
00:54:36,040 --> 00:54:39,520
Speaker 1: They actually hired Bobby Hurley, and uh, you know, so

1036
00:54:39,680 --> 00:54:41,799
Speaker 1: coach Early and I were probably together for two or

1037
00:54:41,800 --> 00:54:47,040
Speaker 1: three weeks um, but you know, the Marquette thing came along,

1038
00:54:47,840 --> 00:54:52,240
Speaker 1: and uh, you know my I just I just felt

1039
00:54:52,280 --> 00:54:55,640
Speaker 1: like it was going to be the best fit for

1040
00:54:55,640 --> 00:54:59,840
Speaker 1: for my family. And we ended up coming to Marquette.

1041
00:55:00,280 --> 00:55:02,960
Speaker 1: And and you know, Marquette has been you know, I've

1042
00:55:02,960 --> 00:55:06,040
Speaker 1: said it it, it's been the icing on the cake

1043
00:55:06,120 --> 00:55:10,080
Speaker 1: for my career. I mean, so you have been unbelievable.

1044
00:55:10,640 --> 00:55:14,560
Speaker 1: So people, so is it in the kind of places places?

1045
00:55:14,600 --> 00:55:17,759
Speaker 1: So all right, so Marcus Howard was going to Arizona State,

1046
00:55:17,840 --> 00:55:23,480
Speaker 1: then he goes to Marquette, Is that all you Well? Yeah,

1047
00:55:23,480 --> 00:55:27,200
Speaker 1: I mean we had a tremendous relationship and Marcus and

1048
00:55:27,280 --> 00:55:32,280
Speaker 1: I you know, really connected when he when he obviously

1049
00:55:32,320 --> 00:55:34,480
Speaker 1: committed dressed there and then he just had a belief

1050
00:55:34,520 --> 00:55:37,560
Speaker 1: in me and he came across the country because of

1051
00:55:37,600 --> 00:55:42,520
Speaker 1: that relationship. Um. And you know, I mean it's amazing

1052
00:55:42,600 --> 00:55:46,960
Speaker 1: to think the guy from Arizona, how Parentti he was,

1053
00:55:47,320 --> 00:55:50,120
Speaker 1: was able to skip all those those schools in between

1054
00:55:50,120 --> 00:55:55,880
Speaker 1: Marquette and and Zona to come here. He Um. He

1055
00:55:56,320 --> 00:55:59,320
Speaker 1: fascinating kid, right because he's only seventeens freshman year, is

1056
00:55:59,400 --> 00:56:01,879
Speaker 1: super young and obviously becomes you know, the Big East

1057
00:56:01,920 --> 00:56:06,360
Speaker 1: all time scoring leader. Um. But I'm just wondering what

1058
00:56:06,480 --> 00:56:09,040
Speaker 1: it's like to coach a guy who is so tied

1059
00:56:09,080 --> 00:56:12,120
Speaker 1: to you, right, like he got Woe Joe and you

1060
00:56:12,120 --> 00:56:14,560
Speaker 1: know O Joe is he's cut from the same cloth,

1061
00:56:14,600 --> 00:56:17,279
Speaker 1: not just of his parents he's tough dude, but but

1062
00:56:17,400 --> 00:56:21,120
Speaker 1: of of coach k Um. But when you have a

1063
00:56:21,120 --> 00:56:24,319
Speaker 1: guy that you're that tied to his assistant coach. Did

1064
00:56:24,400 --> 00:56:27,480
Speaker 1: he allow you to coach him? Right? Because you're like

1065
00:56:27,560 --> 00:56:30,440
Speaker 1: in his corner, you're his guy, But he's got a

1066
00:56:30,520 --> 00:56:32,720
Speaker 1: player like that has to allow themselves to be coached

1067
00:56:32,840 --> 00:56:35,240
Speaker 1: by everybody, even the guy he's closest to. Did Marcus

1068
00:56:35,239 --> 00:56:40,360
Speaker 1: allow that? Yeah? Absolutely? And you know what I I

1069
00:56:40,360 --> 00:56:43,720
Speaker 1: mean with Marcus, I probably you know, I usually coached

1070
00:56:43,760 --> 00:56:47,040
Speaker 1: the bigs. So even in his time here, Marcus and

1071
00:56:47,080 --> 00:56:50,560
Speaker 1: I in terms of you know, that type of relationship

1072
00:56:50,600 --> 00:56:53,680
Speaker 1: on the court, you know, the other guys touched him

1073
00:56:53,960 --> 00:56:56,880
Speaker 1: and and we're with him, and that was I thought

1074
00:56:56,760 --> 00:57:00,239
Speaker 1: that was better that way because that allowed other people

1075
00:57:00,280 --> 00:57:02,800
Speaker 1: have to get closer to him. You know, I'm really

1076
00:57:02,800 --> 00:57:05,920
Speaker 1: not a guy I don't believe in my recruit. You know,

1077
00:57:06,000 --> 00:57:09,719
Speaker 1: we have the relationship, but I want everybody to have

1078
00:57:10,680 --> 00:57:12,919
Speaker 1: the same kind of relationship. And I think Marcus would

1079
00:57:12,960 --> 00:57:18,200
Speaker 1: tell you even though yeah, you know we we were close. Um,

1080
00:57:18,240 --> 00:57:21,200
Speaker 1: you know, he shares a very strong relationship with the

1081
00:57:21,240 --> 00:57:25,400
Speaker 1: rest of our staff, and h he allowed other people

1082
00:57:25,520 --> 00:57:28,720
Speaker 1: to to to really coach him like he needed to

1083
00:57:28,760 --> 00:57:31,680
Speaker 1: be coached. All right, You've always hooped wherever you've gone,

1084
00:57:31,680 --> 00:57:34,920
Speaker 1: still hoops Stale State in shape early on at Marquette.

1085
00:57:35,040 --> 00:57:41,040
Speaker 1: You guys had just a ridiculous hooping staff right, Oh

1086
00:57:41,080 --> 00:57:46,280
Speaker 1: my gosh, Doug, I'm talking about some battles man Chris Carroll,

1087
00:57:47,240 --> 00:57:54,760
Speaker 1: Steve Wozerhowski, Justin Gaine an NC State, Travis er Um,

1088
00:57:55,000 --> 00:58:02,680
Speaker 1: I mean I'm missing I'm missing Guyton, I mean Bretton Nelson. Uh.

1089
00:58:03,160 --> 00:58:08,080
Speaker 1: We we had so many dudes that could play. And no,

1090
00:58:08,280 --> 00:58:10,600
Speaker 1: I mean we played every day for a long time.

1091
00:58:10,680 --> 00:58:13,720
Speaker 1: We played every day to a hundred, every day to

1092
00:58:13,760 --> 00:58:16,760
Speaker 1: a hundred. And I'm not talking about your casual knights

1093
00:58:16,800 --> 00:58:19,680
Speaker 1: picked up every day to a hundred. You don't have

1094
00:58:19,720 --> 00:58:22,280
Speaker 1: to end down the ball, so if the ball goes

1095
00:58:22,280 --> 00:58:24,320
Speaker 1: through the net, you just take it out and you go.

1096
00:58:24,400 --> 00:58:26,600
Speaker 1: And I'm talking about when that thing got to to

1097
00:58:27,000 --> 00:58:32,280
Speaker 1: the fourth quarter and it was you know, ninety two.

1098
00:58:32,880 --> 00:58:35,440
Speaker 1: Those games ended up putting another thirty minutes on it

1099
00:58:35,560 --> 00:58:38,280
Speaker 1: because of the fouls and the physicality. I mean, you

1100
00:58:38,240 --> 00:58:41,320
Speaker 1: would come home and people your families be like, dude,

1101
00:58:41,440 --> 00:58:44,120
Speaker 1: are you coaching basketball or you playing? Why are you limping?

1102
00:58:44,240 --> 00:58:47,520
Speaker 1: Why are you looking like this? But we we had

1103
00:58:47,520 --> 00:58:54,480
Speaker 1: some heated, heated battles. Okay, so when Wojo did did

1104
00:58:54,520 --> 00:58:57,640
Speaker 1: he carry over those negative feelings into work. Right. That's

1105
00:58:57,680 --> 00:59:00,320
Speaker 1: the one thing is like you start playing pickup ball, dude,

1106
00:59:00,320 --> 00:59:03,480
Speaker 1: you work with and and you play with the same guys,

1107
00:59:03,520 --> 00:59:07,560
Speaker 1: you're on opposite teams, and you've got really competitive good dudes.

1108
00:59:07,960 --> 00:59:10,400
Speaker 1: Did would you ever like have a bad day, catch

1109
00:59:10,400 --> 00:59:13,240
Speaker 1: a bow, not make a shot, get beat, argue with

1110
00:59:13,280 --> 00:59:15,560
Speaker 1: the call, and then you guys go to practice and

1111
00:59:15,600 --> 00:59:18,960
Speaker 1: he's in and he's in a shitty mood. No, we

1112
00:59:19,080 --> 00:59:21,880
Speaker 1: never We never took that. And I'll give everybody that.

1113
00:59:22,160 --> 00:59:27,200
Speaker 1: I mean, we had some crazy competitive, uh in your

1114
00:59:27,240 --> 00:59:31,840
Speaker 1: face games, but once we walked out of that door,

1115
00:59:31,880 --> 00:59:34,600
Speaker 1: it was over. And everybody did a really really good

1116
00:59:34,680 --> 00:59:39,120
Speaker 1: job of of understanding that. And who was terrific that way? Uh,

1117
00:59:39,200 --> 00:59:41,360
Speaker 1: there was no heart feelings. Now when we came back

1118
00:59:41,400 --> 00:59:44,280
Speaker 1: the next day, we may bring that back in, but

1119
00:59:44,480 --> 00:59:47,920
Speaker 1: that that never went into our daily life and daily

1120
00:59:47,960 --> 00:59:51,600
Speaker 1: work or anything like that. What separates would you as

1121
00:59:51,600 --> 00:59:55,280
Speaker 1: a coach? You know, the greatest compliment I can give

1122
00:59:55,360 --> 00:59:57,880
Speaker 1: him is, you know he brings it every day as

1123
00:59:57,880 --> 01:00:01,920
Speaker 1: a coach and and and in practice, Like I've not

1124
01:00:02,040 --> 01:00:06,440
Speaker 1: been around a guy whose energy from the beginning of

1125
01:00:06,480 --> 01:00:10,880
Speaker 1: practice in terms of when the year starts to the end. Literally,

1126
01:00:10,880 --> 01:00:13,560
Speaker 1: if you walked in and Retten me into our practice

1127
01:00:13,600 --> 01:00:14,840
Speaker 1: and you didn't you didn't know what time of the the

1128
01:00:14,920 --> 01:00:17,840
Speaker 1: year was, you would have no idea. You would think

1129
01:00:17,840 --> 01:00:21,000
Speaker 1: it's the first day of practice. He was terrific that way,

1130
01:00:21,120 --> 01:00:23,600
Speaker 1: and that's really hard to do. They had that level

1131
01:00:23,600 --> 01:00:29,920
Speaker 1: of energy and passion every single day. Uh was ultra,

1132
01:00:30,240 --> 01:00:34,000
Speaker 1: ultra impressive. You know, he brought it every single day

1133
01:00:34,000 --> 01:00:38,040
Speaker 1: in practice. Um, you know, just an impressive, impressive feat

1134
01:00:38,880 --> 01:00:41,800
Speaker 1: Did you, guys? I guess my only question? Last year

1135
01:00:41,800 --> 01:00:44,400
Speaker 1: you lost six of your last seven. I I saw you, guys.

1136
01:00:44,480 --> 01:00:48,760
Speaker 1: I thought you were tremendous team, the Houser Boys, and um,

1137
01:00:48,800 --> 01:00:51,800
Speaker 1: you know, I I liked you know, THEO John's development

1138
01:00:51,800 --> 01:00:54,000
Speaker 1: as well. You know, everybody only talks about Marcus, but

1139
01:00:54,040 --> 01:00:57,200
Speaker 1: it was this year's team was surprisingly good and then

1140
01:00:57,240 --> 01:01:00,200
Speaker 1: again losing six out of seven. Did you did you

1141
01:01:00,280 --> 01:01:02,560
Speaker 1: leave too much on the practice floor this year? I

1142
01:01:02,640 --> 01:01:04,720
Speaker 1: think you probably overachieved most of the year and then

1143
01:01:04,760 --> 01:01:06,640
Speaker 1: people kind of started to figure you out a little bit.

1144
01:01:07,160 --> 01:01:09,840
Speaker 1: Um but but but why do you think end of

1145
01:01:09,840 --> 01:01:12,200
Speaker 1: the years struggles Outside of the fact it's a good league,

1146
01:01:12,200 --> 01:01:15,800
Speaker 1: will coach league everybody's playing that league, but struggled two

1147
01:01:15,800 --> 01:01:18,200
Speaker 1: different years. Yeah, we'll start backwards, you know. I think

1148
01:01:18,240 --> 01:01:20,560
Speaker 1: this year, I mean we got to a point where

1149
01:01:20,560 --> 01:01:23,120
Speaker 1: we were really rolling. I think we got to let's say,

1150
01:01:23,200 --> 01:01:26,400
Speaker 1: like nine foot in the country and we went to

1151
01:01:26,480 --> 01:01:30,880
Speaker 1: Villa Nova got beat by one, uh, and then came

1152
01:01:31,080 --> 01:01:34,560
Speaker 1: home and Creighton, you know, was just on a roll

1153
01:01:34,640 --> 01:01:38,800
Speaker 1: and got us uh and we we we got into

1154
01:01:38,800 --> 01:01:40,680
Speaker 1: a point this year where we really you know, we

1155
01:01:41,120 --> 01:01:46,120
Speaker 1: had we were struggling to score, you know in some regards,

1156
01:01:46,200 --> 01:01:49,280
Speaker 1: and then our defense, you know, in those last few

1157
01:01:49,280 --> 01:01:51,800
Speaker 1: games were not as good. And I mean you look

1158
01:01:51,800 --> 01:01:54,640
Speaker 1: at those games. Sometimes there's just literally the one possession games.

1159
01:01:54,680 --> 01:01:56,640
Speaker 1: I mean, we lose the one point game at home

1160
01:01:57,040 --> 01:02:00,720
Speaker 1: to the paul Um oh no polls in the road.

1161
01:02:01,040 --> 01:02:05,640
Speaker 1: Well yeah, now we lose too Province at home on

1162
01:02:05,800 --> 01:02:08,480
Speaker 1: uh you know it goes an overtime. You lose a

1163
01:02:08,560 --> 01:02:11,040
Speaker 1: one point game there. Uh, you lose a one point

1164
01:02:11,040 --> 01:02:14,720
Speaker 1: game at at at Villanova. So you know, we we

1165
01:02:14,760 --> 01:02:17,840
Speaker 1: had I think our problem this year down the stretch

1166
01:02:18,640 --> 01:02:23,480
Speaker 1: was finding a consistent second and third guy to to

1167
01:02:23,080 --> 01:02:26,520
Speaker 1: to really help Marcus. You know, so we really we

1168
01:02:26,520 --> 01:02:29,440
Speaker 1: we struggled. You know that way. I felt like the

1169
01:02:29,520 --> 01:02:34,040
Speaker 1: year before, you know, after we lost at Villanova and

1170
01:02:34,120 --> 01:02:36,560
Speaker 1: such a we had a chance to win the win

1171
01:02:36,640 --> 01:02:40,520
Speaker 1: the regular season title at Villanova last year and you know,

1172
01:02:40,600 --> 01:02:43,040
Speaker 1: it was the first time in a long time Marquette

1173
01:02:43,440 --> 01:02:45,680
Speaker 1: had been back in that situation. It was the first

1174
01:02:45,720 --> 01:02:48,960
Speaker 1: time our guys had been in that situation, and we

1175
01:02:49,000 --> 01:02:52,080
Speaker 1: didn't handle it well. You know, we took that loss again.

1176
01:02:52,160 --> 01:02:54,760
Speaker 1: I think it was a one possession game, and we

1177
01:02:54,840 --> 01:02:59,520
Speaker 1: really let that affect us. Uh, you know, the next

1178
01:02:59,520 --> 01:03:02,040
Speaker 1: couple of games and this gig is good, you do that,

1179
01:03:02,160 --> 01:03:04,320
Speaker 1: and all of a sudden, now you're second guessing yourself.

1180
01:03:04,840 --> 01:03:07,040
Speaker 1: You know, we play at home again the last night,

1181
01:03:07,360 --> 01:03:10,400
Speaker 1: last day of the season against Georgetown because Villa Nova

1182
01:03:10,520 --> 01:03:13,360
Speaker 1: gotten beat and we had a chance to to beat

1183
01:03:13,400 --> 01:03:16,040
Speaker 1: Georgetown at home to have a share of the league

1184
01:03:16,080 --> 01:03:20,240
Speaker 1: title and give Patrick Ewing and their team all the

1185
01:03:20,280 --> 01:03:23,560
Speaker 1: credit done. They played so good. I mean Ken Joe

1186
01:03:23,640 --> 01:03:29,760
Speaker 1: and I mean they're backcourt McClung. They made everything. I

1187
01:03:29,800 --> 01:03:31,640
Speaker 1: mean we went back and you watched the film. I

1188
01:03:31,640 --> 01:03:36,480
Speaker 1: mean they made everythty single shot, tough shots. Uh, we

1189
01:03:36,640 --> 01:03:38,720
Speaker 1: just got on the you know, on the on the

1190
01:03:38,800 --> 01:03:42,840
Speaker 1: on the raw end of the deal. But um, I

1191
01:03:42,840 --> 01:03:45,400
Speaker 1: don't know if I attribute that to practice. I think,

1192
01:03:45,760 --> 01:03:48,760
Speaker 1: you know, war Joe has gotten so much better, you know,

1193
01:03:48,960 --> 01:03:52,680
Speaker 1: shortening practice and being shot and being Chris. I think

1194
01:03:52,720 --> 01:03:54,160
Speaker 1: you know, two years ago it was a team that

1195
01:03:54,200 --> 01:03:57,160
Speaker 1: hadn't been there and got a little tight. I think

1196
01:03:57,200 --> 01:03:59,040
Speaker 1: this year it was a team when people start to

1197
01:03:59,040 --> 01:04:01,960
Speaker 1: figure out and they start to take away your second

1198
01:04:02,000 --> 01:04:05,280
Speaker 1: and third guy, you know, not having enough consists and

1199
01:04:05,320 --> 01:04:07,760
Speaker 1: see that way to to finish our close games like

1200
01:04:07,800 --> 01:04:12,360
Speaker 1: that fair enough? Um, okay, so you guys, this thing

1201
01:04:12,560 --> 01:04:14,960
Speaker 1: ends in strange fashion, right like you're in New York

1202
01:04:15,000 --> 01:04:17,000
Speaker 1: and ready for the Big East Tournament and all of

1203
01:04:17,040 --> 01:04:20,200
Speaker 1: a sudden it's over. So Marcus Howard's career is over.

1204
01:04:20,800 --> 01:04:27,520
Speaker 1: Weird fashion. Um, take me through the process, which you know,

1205
01:04:27,760 --> 01:04:29,240
Speaker 1: I think a lot of people thought the l m

1206
01:04:29,320 --> 01:04:30,960
Speaker 1: U job might come open. It took a couple of

1207
01:04:31,000 --> 01:04:33,640
Speaker 1: extra days. They did lose. Really three of the three

1208
01:04:33,640 --> 01:04:36,959
Speaker 1: starters didn't play all years. So some people thought that

1209
01:04:36,960 --> 01:04:40,000
Speaker 1: that Craig their their A D would maybe retain him

1210
01:04:40,040 --> 01:04:43,440
Speaker 1: for a year. He decides not to. Um, take me

1211
01:04:43,480 --> 01:04:46,080
Speaker 1: through the process from your perspective that led you to

1212
01:04:46,080 --> 01:04:49,600
Speaker 1: get the job. Well, of course, of all, there's a

1213
01:04:49,600 --> 01:04:51,480
Speaker 1: lot of things. And you know all this. You've been

1214
01:04:51,520 --> 01:04:54,080
Speaker 1: in there as long as anybody. And I tell people

1215
01:04:54,080 --> 01:04:56,880
Speaker 1: this all the time, and I've been in other jobs, like,

1216
01:04:57,880 --> 01:05:00,560
Speaker 1: there's so much that goes into getting a job, right, Doug.

1217
01:05:00,600 --> 01:05:03,840
Speaker 1: I mean, there's so many different factors, and when you're

1218
01:05:03,840 --> 01:05:07,760
Speaker 1: a candidate, you don't know you can't control it that.

1219
01:05:07,920 --> 01:05:10,880
Speaker 1: You don't know what alumni will booster or what boost

1220
01:05:10,920 --> 01:05:13,200
Speaker 1: going the shots, what what I mean, what what pressure

1221
01:05:13,240 --> 01:05:15,959
Speaker 1: there is on the ease president. There's there's so many

1222
01:05:15,960 --> 01:05:21,160
Speaker 1: moving pieces. Um, So I'm fortunate enough to get it,

1223
01:05:21,200 --> 01:05:24,720
Speaker 1: but I'm also realistic to know that there are so

1224
01:05:24,840 --> 01:05:28,479
Speaker 1: many guys that could have that job, so many guys

1225
01:05:28,520 --> 01:05:30,960
Speaker 1: who are qualified, so many guys who are really good.

1226
01:05:31,840 --> 01:05:35,160
Speaker 1: So it's a humbling feeling and and and I don't think, oh,

1227
01:05:35,240 --> 01:05:36,920
Speaker 1: look at me, I'm that good. No, there's a lot

1228
01:05:36,920 --> 01:05:39,360
Speaker 1: of guys that could have I'm very fortunate. You know,

1229
01:05:39,400 --> 01:05:41,080
Speaker 1: I thought guys all the time, and I said it

1230
01:05:41,160 --> 01:05:44,320
Speaker 1: to you earlier. I've learned that in this business you

1231
01:05:44,440 --> 01:05:47,400
Speaker 1: have to put yourself out there a little bit. I've

1232
01:05:47,440 --> 01:05:48,960
Speaker 1: always been a guy. I'm just gonna put my head

1233
01:05:48,960 --> 01:05:50,600
Speaker 1: down and work. I'm gonna put my head down and

1234
01:05:50,640 --> 01:05:52,840
Speaker 1: work that. Those are the guys I grew up around.

1235
01:05:53,080 --> 01:05:56,200
Speaker 1: That's what I was taught. But the last few years

1236
01:05:56,240 --> 01:05:59,360
Speaker 1: I've been so fortunate I've been invited to different consortium's

1237
01:05:59,400 --> 01:06:03,480
Speaker 1: coaching deal. There's a deal called the Next Chair, which

1238
01:06:03,480 --> 01:06:05,720
Speaker 1: replaces you know what used to be Villa six or

1239
01:06:05,720 --> 01:06:10,160
Speaker 1: whatever that was for you know, whoever they considered to

1240
01:06:10,200 --> 01:06:12,880
Speaker 1: be some of the higher end assistant coaches or what

1241
01:06:12,920 --> 01:06:15,880
Speaker 1: have you. So I go to this event last summer

1242
01:06:15,880 --> 01:06:19,080
Speaker 1: in Charlotte and part of the event they do this

1243
01:06:19,120 --> 01:06:22,120
Speaker 1: deal where you speed date and you know, there's three

1244
01:06:22,160 --> 01:06:25,840
Speaker 1: different rows and there's coaches on each row and administrators

1245
01:06:25,840 --> 01:06:28,840
Speaker 1: across you. Well, you never change your role. You're staying there,

1246
01:06:29,200 --> 01:06:31,640
Speaker 1: but you change seats. You just stay on that and

1247
01:06:31,880 --> 01:06:35,160
Speaker 1: on my role happened to be correct pitness and we

1248
01:06:35,240 --> 01:06:38,320
Speaker 1: had a five minute conversation. Again, I'm not sitting there

1249
01:06:38,360 --> 01:06:40,320
Speaker 1: and nobody in the room sitting there going home. The

1250
01:06:40,320 --> 01:06:42,560
Speaker 1: person I'm talking to, he's gonna have a job. You're

1251
01:06:42,560 --> 01:06:46,160
Speaker 1: just going through the exercise. And we did that, and

1252
01:06:46,320 --> 01:06:48,040
Speaker 1: throughout that, you know, the day and a half, I

1253
01:06:48,120 --> 01:06:50,240
Speaker 1: probably had a chance to spend twenty minutes or twenty

1254
01:06:50,280 --> 01:06:53,600
Speaker 1: minutes with him total, not thinking that a year from

1255
01:06:53,640 --> 01:06:56,880
Speaker 1: now he may have an opening and you know your

1256
01:06:56,880 --> 01:06:58,520
Speaker 1: phone's gonna ring and he wants to talk to you

1257
01:06:58,560 --> 01:07:01,720
Speaker 1: about the job. But that's that's really what happened. So

1258
01:07:02,560 --> 01:07:06,320
Speaker 1: my that crazy day when they started to shut everything

1259
01:07:06,360 --> 01:07:09,479
Speaker 1: down and cancel tournament games, and you know, I got

1260
01:07:09,480 --> 01:07:11,880
Speaker 1: a call that day from a prom saying, hey, they

1261
01:07:12,000 --> 01:07:13,760
Speaker 1: got you on the list and they'd like to talk

1262
01:07:13,800 --> 01:07:18,520
Speaker 1: to you. And that's where it started. When did you

1263
01:07:18,600 --> 01:07:21,480
Speaker 1: find out you had When did he tell you you

1264
01:07:21,600 --> 01:07:25,240
Speaker 1: got the job? So I think it was Friday night,

1265
01:07:25,560 --> 01:07:27,680
Speaker 1: And again, you know how this goes. It calls me

1266
01:07:27,720 --> 01:07:31,480
Speaker 1: and I've gotten calls like that, and well you don't

1267
01:07:31,480 --> 01:07:34,800
Speaker 1: get it, and you know, I picked up, and you

1268
01:07:34,840 --> 01:07:39,000
Speaker 1: know he's I'm going right there. So we're talking and

1269
01:07:39,040 --> 01:07:42,360
Speaker 1: he's like, uh, you know, we're down to stretch here,

1270
01:07:42,360 --> 01:07:46,240
Speaker 1: and you know, um, we love them for you to

1271
01:07:46,240 --> 01:07:48,360
Speaker 1: be our coach. I'm thinking he's trying to let me off,

1272
01:07:48,920 --> 01:07:51,280
Speaker 1: so you're not even I wasn't ready for that moment.

1273
01:07:51,680 --> 01:07:55,240
Speaker 1: But even when you accept it, Uh, there's so much

1274
01:07:55,280 --> 01:07:57,960
Speaker 1: that has to go through. Now your agent gets involved

1275
01:07:58,000 --> 01:07:59,840
Speaker 1: with the school lawyer and they're they're working out the

1276
01:07:59,840 --> 01:08:02,280
Speaker 1: contract deal. So that that wasn't done until about two

1277
01:08:02,280 --> 01:08:05,600
Speaker 1: in the morning Saturday morning. That's kind of when it

1278
01:08:05,680 --> 01:08:09,240
Speaker 1: became official. Um, you know the next day in terms

1279
01:08:09,240 --> 01:08:16,280
Speaker 1: of the contract. Who's your first call? Well, my dad,

1280
01:08:16,439 --> 01:08:21,080
Speaker 1: my parents, you know. See see dadd you told me

1281
01:08:21,120 --> 01:08:24,200
Speaker 1: I'm wasting my degree at but Midji State. Now look

1282
01:08:24,240 --> 01:08:27,479
Speaker 1: at me, Oh, what's funny. You know, it's funny. I

1283
01:08:27,479 --> 01:08:28,920
Speaker 1: didn't have to do it then because I've been telling

1284
01:08:28,960 --> 01:08:31,679
Speaker 1: that because my dad he will read up on even

1285
01:08:31,800 --> 01:08:34,040
Speaker 1: if I'm at market, and I was honesty. It's like

1286
01:08:34,040 --> 01:08:35,840
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, now, oh you're on the train.

1287
01:08:35,880 --> 01:08:38,360
Speaker 1: Now he could tell you everybody we're recruiting and what

1288
01:08:38,400 --> 01:08:41,639
Speaker 1: people are saying. So he's been invested. But my dad,

1289
01:08:41,840 --> 01:08:44,000
Speaker 1: you know, like all of us, and you can attest

1290
01:08:44,000 --> 01:08:46,040
Speaker 1: to this. You know, they start to get old and

1291
01:08:46,520 --> 01:08:49,559
Speaker 1: luckily he's uh, he's got good health and my parents

1292
01:08:49,600 --> 01:08:52,760
Speaker 1: are healthy, thank God. But you know, every time, you know,

1293
01:08:52,840 --> 01:08:54,840
Speaker 1: he would come and visit me, and he just always say, man,

1294
01:08:55,000 --> 01:08:57,639
Speaker 1: I just prayed to God, you know I'll be around

1295
01:08:57,640 --> 01:09:01,000
Speaker 1: to see that day, you know, And I actually get

1296
01:09:01,000 --> 01:09:03,720
Speaker 1: an emotional thinking about it because you know what, man,

1297
01:09:03,760 --> 01:09:06,280
Speaker 1: we've been through a lot, and uh, I've been through

1298
01:09:06,320 --> 01:09:10,960
Speaker 1: a lot, and I've watched my dad, uh, you know,

1299
01:09:11,080 --> 01:09:14,040
Speaker 1: lose his entire life, you know, to a war and

1300
01:09:14,160 --> 01:09:16,759
Speaker 1: come here and start at the bottom of his company

1301
01:09:17,600 --> 01:09:21,479
Speaker 1: and and retires as a CEO. So to be able

1302
01:09:21,520 --> 01:09:23,880
Speaker 1: to share that moment with him, you know that your

1303
01:09:23,880 --> 01:09:27,280
Speaker 1: son is you know, it's gone from the midjiy state

1304
01:09:27,320 --> 01:09:29,120
Speaker 1: to having a chance to lead a program and you

1305
01:09:29,120 --> 01:09:32,840
Speaker 1: can experience that. You know, it's It's something I'll never forget. Man,

1306
01:09:33,240 --> 01:09:37,400
Speaker 1: it was awesome. It's very pretty amazing, um elm used.

1307
01:09:37,400 --> 01:09:40,599
Speaker 1: An interesting job. It's a beautiful campus. I told Craig,

1308
01:09:40,640 --> 01:09:44,240
Speaker 1: I said, look like everybody makes this big deal, but Pepperdine.

1309
01:09:44,240 --> 01:09:49,800
Speaker 1: Pepperdine is incredible. But Pepperdine, you can't There's five ten

1310
01:09:49,840 --> 01:09:53,400
Speaker 1: million dollar houses around, so you're not really interacting. And

1311
01:09:53,439 --> 01:09:57,080
Speaker 1: there's you know, it's not like whereas playa Like there's

1312
01:09:57,080 --> 01:09:59,559
Speaker 1: a cool little area where you know your staff can

1313
01:09:59,600 --> 01:10:01,760
Speaker 1: actually live and walk on the campus or ride a

1314
01:10:01,760 --> 01:10:03,720
Speaker 1: bike to campus. There's places to get something to eat,

1315
01:10:03,760 --> 01:10:07,360
Speaker 1: like Malibu's Like, it's just unbelievable, bluff. Have you ever

1316
01:10:07,439 --> 01:10:11,400
Speaker 1: been to campus by the way with this thing good glasses.

1317
01:10:11,479 --> 01:10:15,400
Speaker 1: So uh, we talked about Loyal Marymount and how they

1318
01:10:15,479 --> 01:10:18,160
Speaker 1: used to host all these tournaments back in the day.

1319
01:10:18,160 --> 01:10:19,560
Speaker 1: When I was in Utah, we go there at a

1320
01:10:19,800 --> 01:10:23,240
Speaker 1: tournaments ghirston watch Games Park, Gross the Street. I te

1321
01:10:23,360 --> 01:10:24,840
Speaker 1: Ghost and I'm like, does this place you even have

1322
01:10:24,880 --> 01:10:28,240
Speaker 1: a campus? And I would leave right So I went

1323
01:10:28,280 --> 01:10:30,760
Speaker 1: there a week ago because we have five guys there.

1324
01:10:30,840 --> 01:10:32,200
Speaker 1: I just want to get in front of them, meet

1325
01:10:32,240 --> 01:10:34,559
Speaker 1: with them, talking to him, and I got out, but

1326
01:10:34,680 --> 01:10:38,760
Speaker 1: I went. I went in Rock Campus for the first time,

1327
01:10:40,000 --> 01:10:43,840
Speaker 1: and I'm going, you have got to be kidding me.

1328
01:10:44,360 --> 01:10:47,360
Speaker 1: I know it may be one of the most dug

1329
01:10:47,920 --> 01:10:50,160
Speaker 1: and I'm not saying this for like a recruiting thing

1330
01:10:50,240 --> 01:10:54,400
Speaker 1: right now that you're mong with you the most impressive,

1331
01:10:54,640 --> 01:10:58,519
Speaker 1: incredible places I've seen. When you get to the bluff

1332
01:10:59,360 --> 01:11:02,080
Speaker 1: and you're sitting top of l A and the beaches

1333
01:11:02,080 --> 01:11:05,479
Speaker 1: to your left and in the city see your right,

1334
01:11:08,040 --> 01:11:11,200
Speaker 1: that's I mean, it blew me away. No, it's unbelofod.

1335
01:11:11,240 --> 01:11:13,519
Speaker 1: It's unbelievable, like like look that that old league, that

1336
01:11:13,560 --> 01:11:15,679
Speaker 1: whole league, like San Diego. You can see the water

1337
01:11:15,800 --> 01:11:18,479
Speaker 1: from USD St. Mary's it's like out of a it's

1338
01:11:18,520 --> 01:11:21,559
Speaker 1: like out of a summer camp book or whatever. It's

1339
01:11:21,640 --> 01:11:23,839
Speaker 1: a beautiful campus, right, it's got a bunch of but

1340
01:11:23,840 --> 01:11:26,320
Speaker 1: but little literally nobody knows about. And I think one

1341
01:11:26,360 --> 01:11:28,639
Speaker 1: reason is because there's one of the entrances. If you're

1342
01:11:28,640 --> 01:11:31,920
Speaker 1: going to the Hurston the gym, you come in from

1343
01:11:31,960 --> 01:11:33,639
Speaker 1: play you take a right, you park of the gym,

1344
01:11:33,680 --> 01:11:35,200
Speaker 1: and then you leave. You don't go through campus. But

1345
01:11:35,240 --> 01:11:37,080
Speaker 1: when you go through campus, like, oh my god, this

1346
01:11:37,200 --> 01:11:41,160
Speaker 1: is amazing, it's really really amazing. And then I don't

1347
01:11:41,200 --> 01:11:43,240
Speaker 1: know if you know this, but down just below the

1348
01:11:43,240 --> 01:11:47,599
Speaker 1: bluff in Playa, you any of the tech companies. YouTube

1349
01:11:47,640 --> 01:11:49,240
Speaker 1: has got a place there. That's where the Clippers are

1350
01:11:49,400 --> 01:11:53,360
Speaker 1: building their their new facility. Like you're you're literally you

1351
01:11:53,360 --> 01:11:55,599
Speaker 1: can take a driver, hit it off the bluff and

1352
01:11:55,720 --> 01:11:58,920
Speaker 1: hit some of the biggest companies from you know, eBay

1353
01:11:58,960 --> 01:12:02,160
Speaker 1: to Facebook to YouTube. We got a studio over there.

1354
01:12:02,479 --> 01:12:04,760
Speaker 1: Like it's it's actually in a very very cool up

1355
01:12:04,760 --> 01:12:07,120
Speaker 1: and coming area and it's like two minutes from the beach,

1356
01:12:07,200 --> 01:12:10,160
Speaker 1: like it's a and no one knows and no one

1357
01:12:10,320 --> 01:12:12,120
Speaker 1: and I think a big and no one knows because

1358
01:12:12,160 --> 01:12:16,800
Speaker 1: they haven't haven't been good. Right, Well, that's that's what

1359
01:12:16,840 --> 01:12:19,360
Speaker 1: we gotta do. You know, we gotta we've gotta get

1360
01:12:19,400 --> 01:12:22,600
Speaker 1: to the point where people know. And that's you know,

1361
01:12:22,640 --> 01:12:24,920
Speaker 1: that's one of my biggest jobs. And we've we've got

1362
01:12:24,920 --> 01:12:26,920
Speaker 1: to do a good job even before we can get

1363
01:12:26,960 --> 01:12:30,000
Speaker 1: to the ws of of of putting in things in

1364
01:12:30,040 --> 01:12:34,599
Speaker 1: place where people go from you know, get curious too

1365
01:12:34,800 --> 01:12:38,160
Speaker 1: interested to commit it. And I'm trying to get people

1366
01:12:38,160 --> 01:12:40,679
Speaker 1: curious and then I want to get them really interested

1367
01:12:40,680 --> 01:12:42,559
Speaker 1: and I want to get them committed. And that's not

1368
01:12:42,640 --> 01:12:46,360
Speaker 1: only just players. That's our that's our community, that's our alumni,

1369
01:12:46,520 --> 01:12:50,640
Speaker 1: that's our university, that's our students. Um, that's that's a

1370
01:12:50,680 --> 01:12:54,800
Speaker 1: big part of of of this job. And you know,

1371
01:12:54,960 --> 01:12:57,320
Speaker 1: it's something that I'm really committed in doing because that's

1372
01:12:57,320 --> 01:13:00,000
Speaker 1: how you build a program. And uh, we gotta get

1373
01:13:00,040 --> 01:13:03,519
Speaker 1: to that point where where people care. Um what it

1374
01:13:03,600 --> 01:13:05,720
Speaker 1: would just say, because I mean I find Wojoe to

1375
01:13:05,760 --> 01:13:08,439
Speaker 1: be a phenomenal dude. I know, he promoted Dwayne Killings

1376
01:13:08,439 --> 01:13:10,759
Speaker 1: Whill he'll be a head coach probably next year. Brett

1377
01:13:10,760 --> 01:13:13,000
Speaker 1: got a job at holy Cross, which is that he'll

1378
01:13:13,040 --> 01:13:15,200
Speaker 1: turn that thing is gonna take a while because they're

1379
01:13:15,240 --> 01:13:18,080
Speaker 1: running Princeton and he wants play the opposite style. But

1380
01:13:18,120 --> 01:13:19,760
Speaker 1: you know, wo, Joe has got a really good sense

1381
01:13:19,800 --> 01:13:21,360
Speaker 1: of this thing. What what did he say when you

1382
01:13:21,360 --> 01:13:23,920
Speaker 1: when he told him you're taking the job. Oh he

1383
01:13:24,040 --> 01:13:26,360
Speaker 1: was happy, you know, I mean, Wolves and I've been together,

1384
01:13:26,680 --> 01:13:28,640
Speaker 1: you know a long time, you know, five years, and

1385
01:13:28,640 --> 01:13:31,479
Speaker 1: his business is long. I think he was really happy.

1386
01:13:31,600 --> 01:13:34,480
Speaker 1: He obviously he understands who I am, knows who I am,

1387
01:13:34,800 --> 01:13:38,720
Speaker 1: uh understands is a fit. But more importantly, you know,

1388
01:13:38,920 --> 01:13:41,439
Speaker 1: he understands how hard good jobs already to get. These

1389
01:13:41,479 --> 01:13:44,280
Speaker 1: jobs are hard, so hard to get any jobs alred

1390
01:13:44,280 --> 01:13:47,240
Speaker 1: to get uh, and to get one that kind of

1391
01:13:47,240 --> 01:13:52,360
Speaker 1: fits my personality and who I am and a place

1392
01:13:52,439 --> 01:13:54,000
Speaker 1: that you know, I feel like I can have an

1393
01:13:54,000 --> 01:13:57,840
Speaker 1: impact on. He was a static for me. Um, I got,

1394
01:13:57,840 --> 01:13:59,160
Speaker 1: I got two more than I know. You gotta go

1395
01:13:59,200 --> 01:14:02,240
Speaker 1: out here, I hear from the background. Okay, number one,

1396
01:14:02,960 --> 01:14:05,960
Speaker 1: did did you watch did you watch the documentary the

1397
01:14:07,240 --> 01:14:11,360
Speaker 1: um what's it called? Scheme? The Scheme? I have not yet.

1398
01:14:11,840 --> 01:14:14,120
Speaker 1: I know that was on yesterday, but I've been so

1399
01:14:14,320 --> 01:14:19,880
Speaker 1: tied up, so hopefully tonight, no problem. Here's the question

1400
01:14:19,920 --> 01:14:24,720
Speaker 1: that matters. I get I get frustrated because people in

1401
01:14:24,800 --> 01:14:30,160
Speaker 1: my business think everybody cheats. Everybody cheats, right, that's what

1402
01:14:30,200 --> 01:14:32,679
Speaker 1: they say. Everybody cheats. Yeah, what's a big deal. Everybody cheats.

1403
01:14:33,120 --> 01:14:35,360
Speaker 1: Blah blah blah blah blah blah. You've been a part

1404
01:14:35,400 --> 01:14:38,240
Speaker 1: of it your entire life since you left to go

1405
01:14:38,400 --> 01:14:41,439
Speaker 1: to Southern Utah to becoming a coach and obviously now

1406
01:14:41,439 --> 01:14:46,160
Speaker 1: on the Division one level for close to fifteen years. Right, Um,

1407
01:14:46,760 --> 01:14:49,720
Speaker 1: if somebody says everybody cheats, you're in the business. You've

1408
01:14:49,760 --> 01:14:52,439
Speaker 1: been a recruiter, you had. You got Marcus Howard to

1409
01:14:52,479 --> 01:14:54,719
Speaker 1: leave Phoenix at seventeen years old and come to Marquette

1410
01:14:54,760 --> 01:14:57,519
Speaker 1: because the all time we meaning a scoring leader. Is

1411
01:14:57,560 --> 01:15:00,800
Speaker 1: that in any way an accurate statement that everybody cheats? No,

1412
01:15:01,080 --> 01:15:05,840
Speaker 1: absolutely not. I don't believe that. I actually think, Um,

1413
01:15:05,920 --> 01:15:07,800
Speaker 1: there are a lot more people who do it right

1414
01:15:07,840 --> 01:15:10,600
Speaker 1: than those who don't do it right. And you know,

1415
01:15:11,120 --> 01:15:14,160
Speaker 1: I've worked for what seven or eight different coaches. I've

1416
01:15:14,160 --> 01:15:17,760
Speaker 1: been at seven or eight different places, and you know who,

1417
01:15:17,920 --> 01:15:20,760
Speaker 1: no one who in which I've worked with have ever

1418
01:15:20,920 --> 01:15:23,439
Speaker 1: functioned that way, No assistant coach that I've ever been

1419
01:15:23,439 --> 01:15:26,600
Speaker 1: allowed to There are funds in that way so to

1420
01:15:27,000 --> 01:15:29,719
Speaker 1: make a blanket statement like that, you know, I think

1421
01:15:29,880 --> 01:15:34,759
Speaker 1: is it's um, it couldn't be further from the truth.

1422
01:15:34,960 --> 01:15:37,880
Speaker 1: You know, we we have there are so many good

1423
01:15:38,120 --> 01:15:40,960
Speaker 1: people that do it right in our business. But like

1424
01:15:41,040 --> 01:15:46,080
Speaker 1: anything else, anytime somebody does something wrong, we we tend

1425
01:15:46,080 --> 01:15:49,680
Speaker 1: to want a group entire population in there. Uh. But

1426
01:15:49,960 --> 01:15:52,200
Speaker 1: that that certainly has not been the case of my

1427
01:15:52,320 --> 01:15:55,280
Speaker 1: career and what I've seen. Obviously, there are people who

1428
01:15:55,280 --> 01:15:57,840
Speaker 1: do that. That that's in any business. You know, there's

1429
01:15:57,880 --> 01:16:00,000
Speaker 1: a lot of businesses what people aren't doing things right,

1430
01:16:00,200 --> 01:16:04,520
Speaker 1: and that's not in collegion sports. But I wouldn't mischaracterize

1431
01:16:04,760 --> 01:16:09,960
Speaker 1: everybody in in the banking world or our wall streets

1432
01:16:10,240 --> 01:16:13,920
Speaker 1: has been guys who do it wrong. I think it's unfair. Uh.

1433
01:16:14,560 --> 01:16:16,240
Speaker 1: We have a lot of good people, and we have

1434
01:16:16,240 --> 01:16:18,080
Speaker 1: a lot of good people who do it right. And

1435
01:16:18,080 --> 01:16:20,120
Speaker 1: I've been lucky to just be around those types of people.

1436
01:16:20,840 --> 01:16:23,759
Speaker 1: I like, I have have two more now, okay, uh

1437
01:16:24,040 --> 01:16:26,760
Speaker 1: a Stan Johnson coach team, how do you when you

1438
01:16:26,800 --> 01:16:29,719
Speaker 1: want somebody to walk out of Gherston, which even before

1439
01:16:29,720 --> 01:16:31,680
Speaker 1: the tournament's just you know that place used to host

1440
01:16:31,840 --> 01:16:34,479
Speaker 1: NBA Summer League, you know, before the Longbie State. It

1441
01:16:34,560 --> 01:16:36,720
Speaker 1: was at l m U. You know, guys used to

1442
01:16:36,720 --> 01:16:38,880
Speaker 1: always play pick up all there. That that was because

1443
01:16:38,880 --> 01:16:41,320
Speaker 1: it's a great location and really nice Jim. But when

1444
01:16:41,560 --> 01:16:43,920
Speaker 1: somebody walks in and it's gonna be a process, that

1445
01:16:43,960 --> 01:16:46,759
Speaker 1: league is a bitch because you got going. Zaga buy

1446
01:16:46,840 --> 01:16:49,240
Speaker 1: used rolling. Now St. Mary's has got it going in

1447
01:16:49,360 --> 01:16:51,720
Speaker 1: the middle of the league. Between San Francisco and we

1448
01:16:51,720 --> 01:16:54,840
Speaker 1: talked about Santa Clara like that Pacific and what Damon

1449
01:16:54,840 --> 01:16:56,920
Speaker 1: Stodomer has done, that's a that's a It used to

1450
01:16:56,920 --> 01:16:59,120
Speaker 1: be everybody fighting for third place. Now it's it's fighting

1451
01:16:59,120 --> 01:17:01,439
Speaker 1: even lower than that because it's so good. But when

1452
01:17:01,479 --> 01:17:03,800
Speaker 1: somebody walks in and then walks out of Gherston and

1453
01:17:03,880 --> 01:17:06,840
Speaker 1: says he just stand Stan Johnson coach, team, what do

1454
01:17:06,880 --> 01:17:10,559
Speaker 1: you want them to say? Well, there's there's there's a

1455
01:17:10,560 --> 01:17:13,519
Speaker 1: couple of things. One, I hope people when they see

1456
01:17:13,560 --> 01:17:16,519
Speaker 1: us they say, well, that's a well conditioned team. I

1457
01:17:16,560 --> 01:17:19,880
Speaker 1: hope they'll say, man, that's a well prepared team. And

1458
01:17:20,040 --> 01:17:23,200
Speaker 1: I hope they'll say that it is a freaking competitive team.

1459
01:17:23,240 --> 01:17:25,760
Speaker 1: And the thing I told our guys is we're gonna

1460
01:17:25,840 --> 01:17:30,479
Speaker 1: do three things outside of that. We're gonna be unselfish.

1461
01:17:30,720 --> 01:17:33,560
Speaker 1: That means we have gotten over ourselves. That is controllable.

1462
01:17:34,080 --> 01:17:37,320
Speaker 1: We're gonna be unselfish. When people watch us play, they're

1463
01:17:37,360 --> 01:17:39,879
Speaker 1: gonna see that ball moving, They're gonna see us protecting

1464
01:17:39,920 --> 01:17:44,960
Speaker 1: each other defensively. We're gonna be a team that's connected again.

1465
01:17:45,040 --> 01:17:46,640
Speaker 1: We have to do the little things right before we

1466
01:17:46,640 --> 01:17:48,640
Speaker 1: can get to the big team. The big things. To me,

1467
01:17:49,160 --> 01:17:51,839
Speaker 1: we can lead the league in high fives and buck slaps,

1468
01:17:52,200 --> 01:17:54,679
Speaker 1: and people see us, they should see a connected team,

1469
01:17:55,000 --> 01:17:57,639
Speaker 1: guys that like each other, that care about each other,

1470
01:17:57,680 --> 01:18:00,800
Speaker 1: that look out for each other, and then a relentless man.

1471
01:18:01,080 --> 01:18:03,840
Speaker 1: I want a team that attacks. I want a team

1472
01:18:03,880 --> 01:18:07,200
Speaker 1: that puts people on their heels. I want a team

1473
01:18:07,200 --> 01:18:10,439
Speaker 1: that when you play Loyal and Murmouth, you may beat us,

1474
01:18:10,479 --> 01:18:13,519
Speaker 1: but even in beating us, we're gonna break you and

1475
01:18:14,640 --> 01:18:16,280
Speaker 1: get you to the point where, you know what, I

1476
01:18:16,280 --> 01:18:18,719
Speaker 1: don't want to play them again. That's what I want.

1477
01:18:18,760 --> 01:18:20,640
Speaker 1: And everything I just said to you are things that

1478
01:18:20,720 --> 01:18:24,040
Speaker 1: we can control. I haven't said anything, but man, we're

1479
01:18:24,040 --> 01:18:26,400
Speaker 1: gonna bang a bunch of threes and all that. We

1480
01:18:26,400 --> 01:18:29,600
Speaker 1: want to get to that point. But we have to

1481
01:18:29,800 --> 01:18:34,120
Speaker 1: master and be good at the little things, dominating the

1482
01:18:34,160 --> 01:18:36,920
Speaker 1: little things, and controlling the things that we're capable of,

1483
01:18:37,160 --> 01:18:39,719
Speaker 1: and all six of those things I just mentioned we're

1484
01:18:39,760 --> 01:18:43,759
Speaker 1: capable of regardless of talent. So I hope when people

1485
01:18:43,800 --> 01:18:46,800
Speaker 1: watch us they can see that. And for me this year,

1486
01:18:46,920 --> 01:18:49,599
Speaker 1: especially as I try to build this thing and create

1487
01:18:49,640 --> 01:18:51,600
Speaker 1: it the way I want it, that's what I'm evaluating.

1488
01:18:52,320 --> 01:18:54,360
Speaker 1: You know. We have to get that right because if

1489
01:18:54,360 --> 01:18:56,920
Speaker 1: we get that right, we'll get the talent in time,

1490
01:18:57,280 --> 01:18:59,360
Speaker 1: we'll get the right pieces to play in the right system.

1491
01:18:59,680 --> 01:19:03,759
Speaker 1: But that culture piece for l MU and that identity piece,

1492
01:19:04,720 --> 01:19:07,640
Speaker 1: that has to be right. Um, as we begin this

1493
01:19:07,720 --> 01:19:11,720
Speaker 1: thing to go down this road. Uh okay, So this

1494
01:19:12,160 --> 01:19:15,320
Speaker 1: the coronavirus has canceled the Big East Tournament, which stinks.

1495
01:19:16,040 --> 01:19:18,080
Speaker 1: Cancel the NT tournament stinks. Right now, we'd all be

1496
01:19:18,080 --> 01:19:20,679
Speaker 1: getting ready to go to the final four and there'll

1497
01:19:20,720 --> 01:19:22,479
Speaker 1: be a lot more jobs open. But everybody be hitting

1498
01:19:22,479 --> 01:19:24,200
Speaker 1: you up like no, no, I got my staff right.

1499
01:19:24,640 --> 01:19:27,080
Speaker 1: On the other hand, here you're about to move with

1500
01:19:27,160 --> 01:19:32,599
Speaker 1: your family cross country from Milwaukee to UH to Los Angeles. Um,

1501
01:19:33,040 --> 01:19:36,200
Speaker 1: there's there's gotta be the silver lining has got to be. Normally,

1502
01:19:36,240 --> 01:19:38,920
Speaker 1: a coach takes his job a and see his wife

1503
01:19:38,920 --> 01:19:41,840
Speaker 1: and kids for a month. That's not the case. Here,

1504
01:19:42,360 --> 01:19:44,760
Speaker 1: give me, give me one thing you're doing around the

1505
01:19:44,760 --> 01:19:46,880
Speaker 1: house outside of trying to build a program off a

1506
01:19:46,920 --> 01:19:50,040
Speaker 1: cell phone that you never thought you'd be doing this

1507
01:19:50,080 --> 01:19:52,840
Speaker 1: time of year. Now you're gonna give me in trouble

1508
01:19:53,120 --> 01:19:58,160
Speaker 1: because literally, that's all I've been doing for the most you.

1509
01:19:58,520 --> 01:20:00,840
Speaker 1: I'm sure you're getting evil. Would you get off the phone?

1510
01:20:01,560 --> 01:20:05,320
Speaker 1: Oh man, thank you, thanks a lot. That's all right. Listen,

1511
01:20:05,360 --> 01:20:06,920
Speaker 1: we're all we're all getting it. You're like trying to

1512
01:20:06,960 --> 01:20:10,040
Speaker 1: work like really, you know, I mean, you know, just

1513
01:20:10,520 --> 01:20:13,240
Speaker 1: just the fact that I could sit here in my

1514
01:20:13,360 --> 01:20:17,160
Speaker 1: house and start to piece this thing together and you

1515
01:20:17,400 --> 01:20:20,639
Speaker 1: have your family around, like you said, that would never

1516
01:20:20,760 --> 01:20:23,920
Speaker 1: have happened. You know, we'd be gone. I mean, my

1517
01:20:24,040 --> 01:20:26,400
Speaker 1: kids are doing homework. I can see that they're running

1518
01:20:26,439 --> 01:20:28,439
Speaker 1: around here. They can come in here and listen to

1519
01:20:28,520 --> 01:20:30,320
Speaker 1: my calls, they can sit on the cows, they can

1520
01:20:30,560 --> 01:20:32,120
Speaker 1: you know, they can feel like they're a part of

1521
01:20:32,280 --> 01:20:36,360
Speaker 1: what's happening. You know, that's pretty cool because that probably

1522
01:20:36,400 --> 01:20:40,760
Speaker 1: would not have happened until June, you know, or July,

1523
01:20:40,880 --> 01:20:42,599
Speaker 1: and then they show up and you're on the road again.

1524
01:20:43,240 --> 01:20:46,280
Speaker 1: So that's been the cool part to make them feel like,

1525
01:20:46,880 --> 01:20:49,479
Speaker 1: you know, they're they're a part of what's going on here.

1526
01:20:50,200 --> 01:20:55,000
Speaker 1: Um as we you know, take this new adventure. Well listen,

1527
01:20:55,360 --> 01:20:57,640
Speaker 1: what they can do is you can all on your

1528
01:20:57,640 --> 01:21:00,400
Speaker 1: way out of town, take all those jackets, give him

1529
01:21:00,400 --> 01:21:02,439
Speaker 1: down the good will or just light a match because

1530
01:21:03,439 --> 01:21:06,080
Speaker 1: it got it got really it gets really cold in

1531
01:21:06,640 --> 01:21:09,360
Speaker 1: in play a del Rey a couple of times a year,

1532
01:21:09,400 --> 01:21:12,800
Speaker 1: gets into the forties, maybe high forties or fifties. So

1533
01:21:13,000 --> 01:21:15,479
Speaker 1: I just, yeah, I hope you hope be prepared for

1534
01:21:15,520 --> 01:21:17,200
Speaker 1: the car. I hope be preparing for the cold coming

1535
01:21:17,200 --> 01:21:20,040
Speaker 1: from Milwaukee, you know, and uh that that it does,

1536
01:21:20,120 --> 01:21:23,240
Speaker 1: it gets down to occasionally to the high forties. Well

1537
01:21:23,280 --> 01:21:25,439
Speaker 1: you do know in Milwaukee when it's forty three people

1538
01:21:25,479 --> 01:21:30,439
Speaker 1: out playing golf, no question, that's like summer out here. Yeah.

1539
01:21:30,720 --> 01:21:34,599
Speaker 1: Well listen, Hey, great catching up, congrats, congrats on the gig,

1540
01:21:35,200 --> 01:21:37,560
Speaker 1: and I look forward when you finally do touchdown in

1541
01:21:37,720 --> 01:21:39,640
Speaker 1: l A again, let's catch up in person. Thanks so

1542
01:21:39,720 --> 01:21:43,679
Speaker 1: much for joining me. Yes, thanks. Be sure to catch

1543
01:21:43,800 --> 01:21:46,760
Speaker 1: the live edition of The Doug Gottlieb Show weekdays at

1544
01:21:46,840 --> 01:21:50,639
Speaker 1: three p m. Easter noon Pacific what a great story

1545
01:21:50,800 --> 01:21:54,519
Speaker 1: right starts in Liberia and ends in Pla del Ray

1546
01:21:54,560 --> 01:21:56,600
Speaker 1: at least for now as the head coach of l

1547
01:21:56,680 --> 01:21:58,560
Speaker 1: m um My. Thanks to Stan Johnson, all of that,

1548
01:21:59,439 --> 01:22:02,960
Speaker 1: all that time, time that he put in to give

1549
01:22:03,080 --> 01:22:05,080
Speaker 1: us this, uh, this interview. Hope you enjoyed it as well.

1550
01:22:05,200 --> 01:22:07,519
Speaker 1: Make sure you send it off to a friend, you

1551
01:22:07,640 --> 01:22:10,800
Speaker 1: tweeted out, you put it on Facebook. This is a

1552
01:22:10,840 --> 01:22:13,000
Speaker 1: great way to learn from coaches at different levels of

1553
01:22:13,040 --> 01:22:15,240
Speaker 1: different levels of experience and what they're thinking and guys

1554
01:22:15,320 --> 01:22:18,519
Speaker 1: they learned from kind of along the way. I appreciate

1555
01:22:18,600 --> 01:22:21,640
Speaker 1: you downloading, subscribing, and rating this podcast. Make sure you

1556
01:22:21,720 --> 01:22:24,599
Speaker 1: tell a friend about it and uh continue on with us.

1557
01:22:24,800 --> 01:22:26,960
Speaker 1: Thanks so much. We've got more up coming for you.

1558
01:22:27,040 --> 01:22:28,720
Speaker 1: I'm Doug Gottlieb. This is all ball