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Speaker 1: There's been a dog snoring throughout most of this. Has

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Speaker 1: Douglas been snoring? Yes, I remember you did our podcast

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Speaker 1: and you were talking about your mom and it was

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Speaker 1: really moving and lovely, and then you could just hear

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Speaker 1: this just crying. He was so and I don't think

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Speaker 1: it was empathy. I don't think he was going, oh,

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Speaker 1: miss driver, miss driver, speaking so movingly. I think he's

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Speaker 1: just thinking, I'm bored, I want to ut this room. Boy,

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Speaker 1: let me out. What's happening? Remember your word, brother, it's

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Speaker 1: so funny. I like dog interruptions very much. It seemed

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Speaker 1: quite disrespectful. I think that's entirely in keeping with like dogs. Hello,

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Speaker 1: I'm Mini Driver. Welcome to Many Questions Season two. I've

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Speaker 1: always loved Pruce's Questionnaire. It was originally a nineteenth century

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Speaker 1: parlor game where players would ask each other thirty five

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Speaker 1: questions aimed at revealing the other players true nature. It's

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Speaker 1: just the scientific method really. In asking different people the

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Speaker 1: same set of questions, you can make observations about which

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Speaker 1: truths appeared to me universal. I love this discipline, and

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Speaker 1: it made me wonder, what if these questions were just

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Speaker 1: the jumping off point. What greater depths would be revealed

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Speaker 1: if I ask these questions as conversation starters with thought

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Speaker 1: leaders and trailblazers across all these different disciplines. So I

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Speaker 1: adapted Pru's questionnaire and I wrote my own seven questions

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Speaker 1: that I personally think a pertinent to a person's story.

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Speaker 1: They are when and where were you happiest? What is

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Speaker 1: the quality you like least about yourself? What relationship, real

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Speaker 1: or fictionalized, defines love for you? What question would you

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Speaker 1: most like answered, What person, place, or experience has shaped

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Speaker 1: you the most? What would be your last meal? And

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Speaker 1: can you tell me something in your life that's grown

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Speaker 1: out of a personal disaster. And I've gathered a group

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Speaker 1: of really remarkable people, ones that I am honored and

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Speaker 1: humbled to have had the chance to engage with. You

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Speaker 1: may not hear their answers to all seven of these questions.

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Speaker 1: We've whittled it down to which questions felt closest to

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Speaker 1: their experience or the most surprising, or created the most

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Speaker 1: fertile ground to connect. My guest today is the polymorphous

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Speaker 1: wonder that is Graham Norton. Graham is perhaps best known

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Speaker 1: for his chat show The Graham Norton Show, for the

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Speaker 1: eight books he has written, for the radio shows he

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Speaker 1: presents in the UK, and on and on and on,

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Speaker 1: because the thing for me that makes him so known

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Speaker 1: is this extraordinary wit and spirit that just runs through

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Speaker 1: every single thing he does. I can't tell you how

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Speaker 1: many times I've been on his show over the years,

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Speaker 1: but it's quite a few. And I will tell you

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Speaker 1: that churches can really be a bit uphill, but I

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Speaker 1: long to go on his show because I have never

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Speaker 1: laughed so much in my life. After you've listened to

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Speaker 1: this episode of my podcast, please just google Funny race

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Speaker 1: Hall names the Graham Norton Show, and you will see

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Speaker 1: me genuinely crying with laughter at the hands of a

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Speaker 1: merciless Graham. It's quite hard to become a national treasure

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Speaker 1: in the UK, but Graham is one, and everyone knows it.

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Speaker 1: I always feel better for having talked to him, and

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Speaker 1: this interview right now proved to be no different at all.

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Speaker 1: Where and when were you happiest? I do know this,

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Speaker 1: but I always kind of think, I remember when I

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Speaker 1: was a kid, there was a Peanuts cartoon. I loved

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Speaker 1: Peanuts when I was a kid, but it's kind of

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Speaker 1: weirdly deep for kids. I think it's Charlie Brown and

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Speaker 1: Lucy maybe talking Charlie Brown, someone else talking, somebody saying,

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Speaker 1: you know, in every life, one day will be happier

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Speaker 1: than all the other days, and the other little child

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Speaker 1: is going yes, and then the first child goes, what

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Speaker 1: if you've had it? And as a child, you know,

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Speaker 1: that sort of blew me away because that's just seemed

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Speaker 1: the saddest thing in the world that if you're eleven

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Speaker 1: and you've had your happiest day, the rest of your

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Speaker 1: life is it lived out? Not as good as that.

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Speaker 1: So I think you've got to live your life assuming

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Speaker 1: your happiest days to come. I think that's very smart.

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Speaker 1: Oh my god, it's so existential Peanuts, isn't it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that is so deep for a little children's cartoon, And

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Speaker 1: it hit me to my core. That just seemed like

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Speaker 1: meaning of life, level of revelation. Happiest day might have happened.

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Speaker 1: The answer to your question is I had a wedding

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Speaker 1: weekend this summer in Ireland. Your wedding, my wedding is

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Speaker 1: my wedding. We got married already, but we had this

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Speaker 1: weekend and you know, there were party planners, and there

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Speaker 1: was this going to happen, This is going to happen.

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Speaker 1: People were flying in, but of course then the airports

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Speaker 1: were all messed up, COVID was still around. You know.

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Speaker 1: I picked these party planners basically out of the phone book.

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Speaker 1: So they're telling me, oh, yeah, we'll do this, and

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Speaker 1: you're thinking, I hope you do, because I have no idea. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: the weekend could not have gone better. We got amazing

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Speaker 1: whether the moment I was happiest was with my husband,

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Speaker 1: just as the party was drawing to the close on

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Speaker 1: the Sunday, where you know, we were surrounded by our friends. Still,

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Speaker 1: it was a beautiful night. The lights were all in

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Speaker 1: the trees, the music was playing, and it was just

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Speaker 1: I didn't need to worry about how the whole weekend

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Speaker 1: was going to go anymore. I didn't need to worry

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Speaker 1: about the catering, or the performers, or the weather or

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Speaker 1: people getting there. In that little probably fifteen minute, you know,

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Speaker 1: at the end, I could just be happy. In that

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Speaker 1: little tail end of all the anxiousness and the planning,

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Speaker 1: I felt supremely content and loved and loving and all

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Speaker 1: all those good things and all the anxiety and the

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Speaker 1: worry actually qualifies and probably has a huge amount to

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Speaker 1: do with how happy you felt. Yes, actually, you're absolutely right.

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Speaker 1: It is a correlation. All the things that could have

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Speaker 1: gone wrong didn't. Yeah. Yeah. I wonder if there are

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Speaker 1: people who when they die, I feel that they shually

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Speaker 1: went all the stuff is done. It's like, oh, phew,

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Speaker 1: you know, I'm night, and God, I don't have to

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Speaker 1: do another Christmas. On a different level, I see that

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Speaker 1: with people on my chat show all the time. What

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Speaker 1: do you mean at the very end they're really happy, Well,

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Speaker 1: they're kind of very happy, but also disappointed because they

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Speaker 1: were worried for the whole show. Sometimes I'll have, you know,

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Speaker 1: a newbe someone who's just doing their first movie or

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Speaker 1: their first single or whatever, and because I'm such an

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Speaker 1: old blag, I've been sat there for donkeys years and suddenly, really, oh,

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Speaker 1: you're really nervous, you know you kind of you just

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Speaker 1: want to hug them and kind of go, oh, really,

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Speaker 1: you shouldn't be nervous about this. Trust me, so many

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Speaker 1: words things are going to happen to you. This is

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Speaker 1: not one of them. This is one of the good things.

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Speaker 1: Trust me, nebe this highlight and I feel they were

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Speaker 1: worried for the whole show that was going to go wrong,

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Speaker 1: and they're going to say something stupid, or I was

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Speaker 1: going to ask them a weird question, or I was

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Speaker 1: going to make them look foolish, and then you see

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Speaker 1: them at the end kind of going, oh, I could

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Speaker 1: have just enjoyed that. I could have just let go

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Speaker 1: and enjoy that. And I wonder if people think that

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Speaker 1: on their deathbed, like, oh, I was such a fool. Well,

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Speaker 1: I worried about stains on my carpet when I could

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Speaker 1: have just been enjoying the coffee that I spilt on it.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's just that kind of approach to life

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Speaker 1: when someone who you've loved has died, has that thing

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Speaker 1: become really really present for you, of oh my god,

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Speaker 1: I'm really am going to let go of worrying about

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Speaker 1: all of that stuff because I've just seen how quickly

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Speaker 1: this is over. Like there's a clarifying moment. I felt

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Speaker 1: that when Mom died so extraordinarily like, holy shit, I

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Speaker 1: am never thinking about that thing again. That probably lasted

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Speaker 1: for a minute. Yes, I agree with you. I think

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Speaker 1: grief and loss gives you exactly that word, the clarity

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Speaker 1: it gives you perspective, it goes again. I'm a years ago,

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Speaker 1: in my twenty I got mugged and stabbed and kind

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Speaker 1: of lost over half my blood and ended up in hospital.

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Speaker 1: But I remember when I was in hospital, and maybe

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Speaker 1: it was just the drugs I was on or something,

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Speaker 1: I don't know, but I just remembered feeling like I

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Speaker 1: knew everything. I felt like in that moment, having survived that,

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Speaker 1: I felt like I could have you know, Palestine, Israel,

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Speaker 1: come sit by my bed. I will. I'll solve this

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Speaker 1: because I have this kind of huge wisdom. Like I said,

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Speaker 1: it was probably the drugs, but equally, I do think

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Speaker 1: there's something about extreme things like that, like grief, like

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Speaker 1: loss for a moment, as you say, like the window

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Speaker 1: shuts again. In that moment, you know everything, but you

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Speaker 1: remember this is so show biz. But remember when Kim

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Speaker 1: Catrall and Sarahisca Parker had the fuck Yeah, I remember

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Speaker 1: that burned into my memory. Serage Parker said something to

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Speaker 1: about the brother yea, about her brother and Kim, you

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Speaker 1: were not my friend, and everyone's like, oh, that's been harsh,

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Speaker 1: and I just thought, no, that's a woman in grief totally,

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Speaker 1: that's a woman in grief going, oh, you know what,

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Speaker 1: you fuck right out of this. Yes, it's the clarifier

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Speaker 1: you chop out the people that try to co opt

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Speaker 1: your brother's death for a tweet or whatever it was.

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Speaker 1: You respond with that clarity of emotion of like, I

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Speaker 1: have no time for this extraneous social contract bullshit nonsense. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but I also feel like that does maybe just what

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Speaker 1: we said about the anxiety qualifying the happiness those moments

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Speaker 1: and that kind of intensity. When I remember it, I

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Speaker 1: feel the happiness on the other side of it. I

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Speaker 1: feel how it helped throw into relief what real happiness

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Speaker 1: looked like. That sitting on that beach in Cornwall in

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Speaker 1: the rain, when we all complained about the barbecue not lighting,

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Speaker 1: and my mom laughed because she had cring tonics in

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Speaker 1: funny enough, a snoopy, you know, small child's drink holder.

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Speaker 1: All that happiness, it's just more clearly defined by all

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Speaker 1: that worry or anxiety or angst around certain things. And

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Speaker 1: I'm I'm kind of fascinated by that. But that is

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Speaker 1: part of I suppose the fundamental duality of being alive.

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Speaker 1: It is, but also I think an extreme thing like that,

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Speaker 1: you know, all that whanging on, living in the moment,

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Speaker 1: whanging on. But you know what I mean, because it's

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Speaker 1: like all that whanging on and living at the moment,

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Speaker 1: I totally do. So, yes, we know, we all are

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Speaker 1: to live in the moment. Yeah, yeah, Well, you know what,

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Speaker 1: I've got a diary and there's things in it and

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Speaker 1: I'm planning. You know, you just can't. But in that moment,

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Speaker 1: in that profound moment of loss, you are entirely in

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Speaker 1: that moment, I think, where nothing else is going on.

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Speaker 1: It's just that. Yeah, every book that I'd read on

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Speaker 1: any kind of personal growth or philosophy or religion or

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Speaker 1: whatever I've read in my whole life, it was so

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Speaker 1: extraordinary in those moments. And by moments, I mean months

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Speaker 1: after Mom died. It's like I knew, I knew, just

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Speaker 1: as you said, weirdly, I knew everything. I knew all

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Speaker 1: of the thing, all of the things that mattered, all

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Speaker 1: the things that actually held meaning, all of the things

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Speaker 1: that I wanted to let go of. It was so

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Speaker 1: incredibly clear. There's an extraordinary gift in that. There's not

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Speaker 1: much that's good about when your mom dies. And I

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Speaker 1: would only say that just in terms of like observing

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Speaker 1: stuff that happens. But I do believe in the clarifying

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Speaker 1: power of grief and the definition of happiness. I want

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Speaker 1: to see Gary Barlow from Take That, who if people

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Speaker 1: in America they may not know Take That. But he

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Speaker 1: was a you know, a young kid and a boy

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Speaker 1: band and then they disapparited a horrible time and they

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Speaker 1: came back and were successful. And he's doing this one

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Speaker 1: man show kind of a life and in the second

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Speaker 1: act he tells this really heartbreaking story about him and

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Speaker 1: his wife losing a baby. The baby is still born,

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Speaker 1: and it's so heartbreaking, it's very sad, everyone in the

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Speaker 1: audience sobbing. But he turns it into this positive. The

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Speaker 1: gift that that child gave him was perspective, and the

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Speaker 1: gift of that child gave him was being able to

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Speaker 1: say no to things, not you know, needing to please

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Speaker 1: people all the time. And that what you're talking about,

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Speaker 1: the happiness on the other side of something. I just

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Speaker 1: think that's what's that phrase, collateral beauty around awful things?

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Speaker 1: There is collateral beauty? Really tell me what relationship, real

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Speaker 1: or fictionalized, defines love for you? Oh, now it's fictional,

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Speaker 1: but it was profound when I watched it, and it's

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Speaker 1: still kind of profound because I think there's a kind

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Speaker 1: of a pureity to the love in this and it's

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Speaker 1: Elliott and et the love between those two, because so

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Speaker 1: much of it's unspoken, so much of it isn't thought

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Speaker 1: about or expressed or figured out, or you know, the

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Speaker 1: way in relationships there's a kind of a not a game,

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Speaker 1: but a kind of a dance, is sort of a

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Speaker 1: choreograph thing between you before you get to love and

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Speaker 1: staying in love. And there's something so pure about the

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Speaker 1: love between that little boy and the alien, and the

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Speaker 1: fact that you know one of them is an alien

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Speaker 1: makes it really lovely. And his heart lights up like

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Speaker 1: a bedside lamp. You can't get better than that. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I love John. Oh, but if his heart lit up

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Speaker 1: like a bedside lamb, but I could read by it,

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Speaker 1: I would love it. If my boyfriend's he lit up

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Speaker 1: like I'd be like, oh God, keep that going. I

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Speaker 1: can turn my phone off. I'll just turn this way

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Speaker 1: downing hard on. Yeah, that's lovely, so like a camp fire. Oh. Also,

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Speaker 1: you know what's beautiful about Elliot and Eats relationship as well,

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Speaker 1: is that Elliott his love doesn't weive when he knows

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Speaker 1: has got to go. Yeah, he doesn't sort of stop

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Speaker 1: helping him, and it doesn't diminish the love. That notion

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Speaker 1: that one person is going to really lose out because

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Speaker 1: I don't think it would really think twice about Elliott

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Speaker 1: after he's gone back home, frankly, because home is obviously

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Speaker 1: his passion and what defines love for him. It's all

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Speaker 1: he talks about when he does staying. But also, isn't

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Speaker 1: there something about that? Because Et nearly dies, so Elliott

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Speaker 1: thinks he's lost Et, and then he comes back to life,

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Speaker 1: and then I think that allows Elliott to let him

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Speaker 1: go because it's so lovely that he's alive. I don't

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Speaker 1: care if you're alive and not living with me, but

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Speaker 1: I'm so happy you're alive. You're absolutely right, it's a

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Speaker 1: really beautiful, pure expression of unconditional love that relationship. I

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Speaker 1: think you should stop asking this question now because I

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Speaker 1: think I've given the proper answer. I think I've've solved

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Speaker 1: that question for you. I've solved for that across it off. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's Eliot and e t thank you, thank you, good night. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So what is the quality that you like least about yourself.

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Speaker 1: Compromise is a good thing, but I feel I'm a pushover.

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Speaker 1: I feel like I never really stand up for anything.

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Speaker 1: I kind of just go, ho, well, I just roll over.

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Speaker 1: There's a lot of rolling over, and I feel like

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Speaker 1: that's the thing the young me would judge me the

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Speaker 1: most harshly about. I think the young me would be

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Speaker 1: pleased that I was success and but I think the

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Speaker 1: young me would stare at me, going, what you're going

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Speaker 1: to do that? Or you know what? That's okay? Isn't

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Speaker 1: that like, you know, path of least resistance. Isn't that

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Speaker 1: like a whole kind of philosophy in itself? Isn't that

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Speaker 1: a really amazing thing that you do that? No, see,

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Speaker 1: I don't think it's admirable at all. I look at

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Speaker 1: people with conviction, and I am in all of them.

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Speaker 1: They are annoying, but I am in all of them.

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Speaker 1: That's really interesting. It happens in my personal life to

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Speaker 1: where you know, like there's a lot of inner monologue

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Speaker 1: about that shouldn't happen or that, but I just don't

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Speaker 1: say anything because it's it's easier, but it's not easier.

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Speaker 1: But I think it is easier. It's easy because it's

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Speaker 1: like the thing is that once you've done it once

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Speaker 1: and you realize the whole world didn't stop and this

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Speaker 1: guy didn't fall in and it was actually fine, I

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Speaker 1: think it must then become quite a delicious thing to do,

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Speaker 1: which is to maybe not take a position. It takes

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Speaker 1: a lot of energy to have conviction. It does. And

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Speaker 1: like I said, I am in all of those people.

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Speaker 1: You know, I feel like, you know that thing kind

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Speaker 1: of like, oh that was quite good, that's fine, that's

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Speaker 1: all right, And you've gotta think, oh, why can't something

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Speaker 1: be exceptional? Why can't something be really good? And I

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Speaker 1: feel like I should aim a bit higher in all

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Speaker 1: parts of my life. But I don't find Jannah notice

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Speaker 1: about you? Oh no, no, he's my doing well, yeah,

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Speaker 1: he's my peak achievement. My husband is my peak achievement.

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Speaker 1: I think that's lovely. I do know what you mean.

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Speaker 1: But I'm just the complete opposite. I need to stop

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Speaker 1: trying to fight for everything and just getting exhausted and

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Speaker 1: disappointed as opposed to being pleasantly surprised when a few

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Speaker 1: things work out. There must be something in between, where

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Speaker 1: you know what battles are worth fighting. My boyfriends were

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Speaker 1: really good at that. He's like, I'm not going to

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Speaker 1: die on that hill. I am going to die on

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Speaker 1: that one. Except I'm not going to die. I'm going

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Speaker 1: to succeed. I'm going to plant my flag in the

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Speaker 1: top of that mountain and then he'll do it. It's

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Speaker 1: quite annoying. So maybe actually my worst quality is that

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Speaker 1: I'm just resentful of his good quality, of his good qualities.

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Speaker 1: My friends just moved into a new apartment and they're

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Speaker 1: having trouble with the neighbor. There's an upstairs neighbor. All

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Speaker 1: these like angry emails going around, and my friend ended

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Speaker 1: one email with do not fight me, I will win.

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Speaker 1: Oh my god, that's fantastic. I love that way to

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Speaker 1: win over your neighbors. Do not fight me, I will win. Also,

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Speaker 1: that is a rookie era never moving anywhere with upstairs neighbors.

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Speaker 1: It's hard. I mean, one a nightmare for cool thing,

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Speaker 1: but stairs neighbors are terrible to neighbors. Essentially, basically being

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Speaker 1: in a neighbor sandwich is fucking dreadful. Yeah, I don't

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Speaker 1: know I would take that into extreme consideration, but have

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Speaker 1: a whole neighbor thing nightmare. I used to do like

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Speaker 1: an agony uncle column in a paper here, and I

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Speaker 1: did it for about eight years. And those are the

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Speaker 1: problems I dreaded when people wrote in about the neighbors,

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Speaker 1: because there is no solution. There's no solution except move, yeah,

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Speaker 1: move at Even then it's hard because if they're noisy

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Speaker 1: or whatever, it's hard to sell your house and blah

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Speaker 1: blah blah blah blah. Yeah, you have to disclose all

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Speaker 1: of that stuff. Yeah, it's monsters. As if it weren't

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Speaker 1: hard enough trying to find a place to rent or

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Speaker 1: buy in this life. Now, what question would you most

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Speaker 1: like answered? I remember, and I'm sure all kids do this,

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Speaker 1: where you lie in the grass and look up and

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Speaker 1: you know the clouds move, but you think that's the

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Speaker 1: earth going and then you look beyond that into the

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Speaker 1: blue and it's just that. Even as an adult you

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Speaker 1: stop thinking about it. But as a child, that is

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Speaker 1: such a kind of mind fuck. There must be a

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Speaker 1: there there, but there is no there there. It goes

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Speaker 1: on forever, new they can't go on forever. There has

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Speaker 1: to be you know. I still don't understand it. But

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Speaker 1: do I want that question answered? I mean no, because

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Speaker 1: I think it would bore the chasses out of me.

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Speaker 1: I think just like someone would start explaining to me

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Speaker 1: are placed in the cosmos or the concept of infinity,

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Speaker 1: and I would find myself slowly looking away. Oh there's

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Speaker 1: someone I know. I wonder what's for dinner? Was up

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00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:32,000
Speaker 1: my phone? And that is the origin of the universe.

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Speaker 1: Cheese tasty? You know what. I'm just thinking. The one

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Speaker 1: thing I would quite like to be able to do.

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Speaker 1: I would quite like to be able to read dogs minds.

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Speaker 1: I know they're probably quite easy to read, you know.

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Speaker 1: Can I fuck it? Can I eat it? But I

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Speaker 1: couldn't scratch my tummy? There's that? Yes? And can I

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Speaker 1: eat that hand? Or fuck it? I think there's some

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Speaker 1: subtlety going on in there's something else going on. So

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Speaker 1: I would quite like someone to tell me what my

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Speaker 1: dog is thinking at all times. I really like that,

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Speaker 1: And that is a really true. Wait, can I tell you? Yes?

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Speaker 1: My dog ran away from me at this fair we

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Speaker 1: were at and I ran through the crowd and I

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Speaker 1: found him with his paws on the shoulders of this

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Speaker 1: woman and she was like, oh, oh yeah, oh oh goodness.

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Speaker 1: And I was like, oh my god, Oh my god.

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Speaker 1: My dog, and she was like, Hi, your dog was

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Speaker 1: just telling me a few things, like would you like

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Speaker 1: me to tell you? And I was looking around, what

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Speaker 1: is happening? Anyway? It turned out she was this really

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Speaker 1: famous pet psychic, and my dog told her. She said,

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Speaker 1: you have to get his bed back from the garage.

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Speaker 1: And I'd literally got him a new bed the day

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Speaker 1: before and thrown out his old one, and it was

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Speaker 1: upstairs in the garage where I lived, waiting to be

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Speaker 1: taken away. And he told her that. And then the

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Speaker 1: other thing he told her was that my sister used

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Speaker 1: to take him to work and my dog had most

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Speaker 1: of his tail missing from a terrible accident with the door,

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Speaker 1: and my sister's boss used to call him stubborn. His

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Speaker 1: name was Bubba, and he used to call him stumpy Stubba,

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Speaker 1: and he didn't like that, and he told the pets

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Speaker 1: psychic to tell me to tell him to fucking stop

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Speaker 1: calling him that. Wow, it was heaven. They couldn't have known.

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Speaker 1: She couldn't have known that. How could you have known

386
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Speaker 1: that we had a pet psychic on the TV show

387
00:21:15,359 --> 00:21:18,240
Speaker 1: years ago? And this woman she was literally from the

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Speaker 1: audience and actually had a dog and the dog told

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Speaker 1: the psychic that the woman needs to put carpet back

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Speaker 1: in the bedroom because he can't jump on the bed

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Speaker 1: anymore because he can't get purchased on the wooden floor.

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Speaker 1: And the woman, I mean, you saw the one's face,

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Speaker 1: she was just like Honestly, I think she thought we'd

394
00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:39,520
Speaker 1: broken into her house and taking pictures or something, because

395
00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:42,560
Speaker 1: she had just taken up the carpet and put in laminte.

396
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Speaker 1: Oh my god, my god. And I also love the

397
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Speaker 1: fact that dogs aren't like you know. I want you

398
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Speaker 1: to teach me the secrets of the universe and take

399
00:21:49,800 --> 00:21:52,320
Speaker 1: me on concorde. No. Have you seen that woman on

400
00:21:52,400 --> 00:21:55,600
Speaker 1: Instagram who thinks her dog can talk to her wait

401
00:21:55,640 --> 00:21:58,399
Speaker 1: when it hits the buttons? Yes, I've seen her a lot.

402
00:21:58,640 --> 00:22:01,760
Speaker 1: It's sent task stick. I like the way if he

403
00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:05,919
Speaker 1: just hits table and sleep. You dreamt about her table.

404
00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:10,200
Speaker 1: You treamt about a table. You was so smart. Well,

405
00:22:10,359 --> 00:22:13,760
Speaker 1: a major UK supermarket now sells a set of four

406
00:22:14,119 --> 00:22:18,440
Speaker 1: of those little things. Does it say fuck eat? Honestly,

407
00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:21,880
Speaker 1: you can record whatever you like. I God, that's amazing. Yeah,

408
00:22:22,200 --> 00:22:25,160
Speaker 1: we got them for Douglas the Dog. And what Starglass

409
00:22:25,200 --> 00:22:29,120
Speaker 1: done with them? Nothing? Occasionally he'll walk on one by accident,

410
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Speaker 1: and then we have to give him a treat or something.

411
00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:34,119
Speaker 1: One of them does they treat, even that one. He

412
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Speaker 1: hasn't figured out that hitting it will get him a treat.

413
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Speaker 1: But he's an older dog, so you know, there is

414
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Speaker 1: a saying about that. Also, it's like, you know, not

415
00:22:41,280 --> 00:22:44,280
Speaker 1: all dogs are like really smart. Like I've had very

416
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Speaker 1: smart dogs, and I've had really thick dogs, like really

417
00:22:47,280 --> 00:22:50,400
Speaker 1: thick dogs. Some dogs probably aren't chatty. Some dogs don't

418
00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:52,520
Speaker 1: want to talk to you, and they're like, look, love,

419
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Speaker 1: there's a whole reason I can't talk. They start trying

420
00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:56,760
Speaker 1: to talk to me. That's what this life is about.

421
00:22:56,840 --> 00:23:01,000
Speaker 1: It was about silence, about silence. Yeah, look, just feed

422
00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:04,040
Speaker 1: me twice a day. Like that was the arrangement. So

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Speaker 1: what's the buttons? Stuffed with the buttons? The buttons? Now,

424
00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:24,960
Speaker 1: what person, place or experience most also to your life?

425
00:23:25,359 --> 00:23:30,399
Speaker 1: I would say San Francisco. I was in a hippie

426
00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:34,919
Speaker 1: commune in San Francisco when I was twenty and twenty

427
00:23:35,000 --> 00:23:38,040
Speaker 1: sounds quite old, but I was an Irish twenty, which

428
00:23:38,200 --> 00:23:43,399
Speaker 1: is like a sort of international fourteen, let's say. And

429
00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:45,800
Speaker 1: I didn't know what I wanted to do with my life.

430
00:23:46,080 --> 00:23:50,479
Speaker 1: I had done two years at university studying French and English,

431
00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:53,240
Speaker 1: but I wasn't enjoying it. I didn't like being in Cork,

432
00:23:53,440 --> 00:23:55,800
Speaker 1: and so I ran away. I ran away to San Francisco,

433
00:23:56,760 --> 00:24:00,280
Speaker 1: and through various accidents and alchemy and luck, I ended

434
00:24:00,320 --> 00:24:02,520
Speaker 1: up in this hippie commune. It's still there. It's still

435
00:24:02,560 --> 00:24:04,840
Speaker 1: there in San Francisco. Oh my god, how amaze, just

436
00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:08,800
Speaker 1: off the Panhandle. And I had never met people like

437
00:24:08,920 --> 00:24:15,040
Speaker 1: this before. People with convictions put me right off, put

438
00:24:15,119 --> 00:24:18,320
Speaker 1: me off the life. But they treated me, you know,

439
00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:21,600
Speaker 1: they treated back in an adult there was the chore wheel,

440
00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:23,560
Speaker 1: and you know, we had to cook one night and

441
00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:26,159
Speaker 1: I'd have to cook for you know, twelve people, and

442
00:24:26,440 --> 00:24:29,760
Speaker 1: I couldn't cook for one. Can I just get twelve

443
00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:34,399
Speaker 1: pot noodles? Do that for everyone? That's okay, right? And

444
00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:36,399
Speaker 1: I went back. They had a kind of a twenty

445
00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:39,800
Speaker 1: five year anniversary ten years ago, and I went back

446
00:24:40,119 --> 00:24:43,439
Speaker 1: to see them, and this one woman, she said to me, oh,

447
00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:48,240
Speaker 1: we still make your soup. And I'm like what. Apparently

448
00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:51,600
Speaker 1: I had made some leak and potatoes soup, of course,

449
00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:53,879
Speaker 1: the potatoes in it. And she still makes it she

450
00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:56,719
Speaker 1: calls the Graham soup. But weirdly, that woman, I remember

451
00:24:56,800 --> 00:24:58,960
Speaker 1: she was studying to be a nurse, and she was

452
00:25:00,560 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 1: I think she was forty maybe forty one two, and

453
00:25:04,680 --> 00:25:07,040
Speaker 1: she was studying to be a nurse. And I remember

454
00:25:07,080 --> 00:25:09,639
Speaker 1: thinking of the time, like like, why would you bother?

455
00:25:09,960 --> 00:25:13,320
Speaker 1: Like really, really, lady, you're training to do something in

456
00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:17,920
Speaker 1: your forties. It's too late for you. And I must

457
00:25:17,960 --> 00:25:21,720
Speaker 1: have said that to her, hopefully not as boldly as that,

458
00:25:22,000 --> 00:25:25,800
Speaker 1: but I must have questioned starting a new career or

459
00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:28,120
Speaker 1: being a student in her forties, and she went, well,

460
00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:30,879
Speaker 1: if I am a nurse for rest of my life,

461
00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:35,080
Speaker 1: I'll have been nursing for twenty five years, you know,

462
00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:37,960
Speaker 1: untill her retirement. And I was like, oh, that's that's

463
00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:40,600
Speaker 1: longer than I've been alive. I can understand that is

464
00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:43,200
Speaker 1: a long time. And it gave me, in my little

465
00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:45,960
Speaker 1: young life, it gave me kind of the gift of time,

466
00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:49,480
Speaker 1: of realizing that in a life, although they go by

467
00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:51,840
Speaker 1: in a flash, we also have more time than we

468
00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:54,560
Speaker 1: think we do. And I think that's something that young

469
00:25:54,680 --> 00:25:57,400
Speaker 1: people should know. Don't be in such a rush. You've

470
00:25:57,440 --> 00:26:00,320
Speaker 1: got time to fail, You've got time to six seed.

471
00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:03,119
Speaker 1: You've got time to not succeed or succeeded the thing

472
00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:05,680
Speaker 1: you don't enjoy, and then find the thing you do enjoy.

473
00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:08,720
Speaker 1: You know, when I turned fifty, there is a sense, oh,

474
00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:10,960
Speaker 1: the bike is at the top of the hill and

475
00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:14,080
Speaker 1: the rest of my life is now downhill. But then

476
00:26:14,119 --> 00:26:17,520
Speaker 1: you realize, oh, no, I'm only fifty. Yeah, you know,

477
00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:20,280
Speaker 1: with a bit of luck, there's decades of this ship left.

478
00:26:20,520 --> 00:26:24,000
Speaker 1: I better find things to do and find challenges and

479
00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:26,040
Speaker 1: things that I haven't done yet that I want to

480
00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:28,800
Speaker 1: get done. So and that all came from that hippie commune.

481
00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:31,879
Speaker 1: Don't be scared of failure, because actually there's time. I

482
00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:36,240
Speaker 1: think it was Victor Hugo who said fifty is the

483
00:26:36,359 --> 00:26:39,399
Speaker 1: youth of old age. Yes, I really, I really like that.

484
00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:41,280
Speaker 1: And by the way, that when you're in your twenties

485
00:26:41,280 --> 00:26:43,920
Speaker 1: and I remember thinking I had to get it all done,

486
00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:46,719
Speaker 1: I didn't even know what that meant. But the amount

487
00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:50,000
Speaker 1: of time I spent worrying that I wasn't doing enough,

488
00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:52,879
Speaker 1: it's so interesting, like if one does think about it,

489
00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:55,080
Speaker 1: not that time is running out, but rather there is

490
00:26:55,119 --> 00:26:57,359
Speaker 1: a lot of time. I know. It's exact obverse of

491
00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:01,040
Speaker 1: the meters ticking. Yes, but also that thing that no

492
00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:05,800
Speaker 1: time is wasted in a way, no exactly, that if

493
00:27:05,840 --> 00:27:08,520
Speaker 1: you find out that you hate doing something, it's going

494
00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:11,120
Speaker 1: to help define what you do want to do. Yeah,

495
00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:13,920
Speaker 1: I think that's brilliant for all of us. Actually to go,

496
00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:15,639
Speaker 1: you've got a bit more time. You've got a bit

497
00:27:15,680 --> 00:27:17,560
Speaker 1: more time than you think, because how old were you

498
00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:20,159
Speaker 1: when you kind of thought I've made it. It was

499
00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:25,040
Speaker 1: for about fifteen minutes, but you thought it. It didn't

500
00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:27,119
Speaker 1: happen in the moment it happened. When I sort of

501
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:29,639
Speaker 1: looked back, I must say that I thought the zenith

502
00:27:29,760 --> 00:27:31,480
Speaker 1: of like being on the red carpet with my mom

503
00:27:31,520 --> 00:27:34,159
Speaker 1: and dad at the Oscars when I was nominated for

504
00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:37,280
Speaker 1: an oscar. They made it real, like seeing them right

505
00:27:37,320 --> 00:27:40,440
Speaker 1: there and like my dad squeezing my hand and not

506
00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:43,600
Speaker 1: being flustered by any of it, just seeing him sort

507
00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:47,000
Speaker 1: of dadding in that insane environment. There was a lot

508
00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:49,880
Speaker 1: going on that night. But looking back the next couple

509
00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:52,639
Speaker 1: of weeks, I did go, actually, it's kind of what

510
00:27:52,760 --> 00:27:54,760
Speaker 1: you said from the Snoopy cartoon, and I was like,

511
00:27:55,000 --> 00:27:57,560
Speaker 1: I'm not sure it's ever going to get better than that.

512
00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:01,200
Speaker 1: I think I peaqued I think I succeeded. We don't

513
00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:04,240
Speaker 1: feel that anymore, No, God, No, because that was this

514
00:28:04,359 --> 00:28:07,200
Speaker 1: barometer that I had said of what success look that. Yeah,

515
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:10,280
Speaker 1: And once you get rid of that barometer or beautifully

516
00:28:10,400 --> 00:28:12,760
Speaker 1: or wonderfully, if you're lucky, that life will sort of

517
00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:16,680
Speaker 1: teach you that that success and failure are lovers intertwined.

518
00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:19,240
Speaker 1: One is not bad and one is not good. You

519
00:28:19,320 --> 00:28:21,440
Speaker 1: have to name them differently, and you really start living

520
00:28:21,480 --> 00:28:23,560
Speaker 1: at once. I started letting other things into my life

521
00:28:23,680 --> 00:28:26,760
Speaker 1: that were great and amazing. I remember we had a

522
00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:29,800
Speaker 1: reunion for drama school. I think it was a twenty

523
00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:32,400
Speaker 1: five or thirty year reunion. And of course when your

524
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:35,119
Speaker 1: kids at drama school, we were all, you know, teenagers,

525
00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:38,560
Speaker 1: early twenties, and we only measured success in one way.

526
00:28:38,880 --> 00:28:43,440
Speaker 1: Success was being a star, or having your name up,

527
00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:46,400
Speaker 1: or working in theater or working in film and television.

528
00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:49,360
Speaker 1: We all there's a whole group of people twenty eight

529
00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:51,520
Speaker 1: of or something, and we all had one vision of

530
00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:54,480
Speaker 1: what success was. And so to meet up thirty years

531
00:28:54,560 --> 00:29:00,680
Speaker 1: later and realize how diverse success is. You know, some

532
00:29:00,880 --> 00:29:04,160
Speaker 1: people were still acting and that was their success. Some

533
00:29:04,360 --> 00:29:07,760
Speaker 1: people were now artists, some people who had families, some

534
00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:10,760
Speaker 1: people have started businesses. You know, there was one woman

535
00:29:10,880 --> 00:29:13,000
Speaker 1: and she had an illness and she was in her mission.

536
00:29:13,120 --> 00:29:16,719
Speaker 1: So just being there was her success. Because I kind

537
00:29:16,760 --> 00:29:19,680
Speaker 1: of thought, oh, it'll be a weird day because some

538
00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:23,160
Speaker 1: of these people will be you know, quote failures now

539
00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:27,640
Speaker 1: and I will be the only true star. They're all

540
00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:29,840
Speaker 1: going to hate me, Mini, They're going to hate me.

541
00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:32,960
Speaker 1: And I felt so stupid because when I got there,

542
00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:35,240
Speaker 1: I realized, oh, we've moved on. If we got in

543
00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:38,440
Speaker 1: a little tell transportation device when we were in drama

544
00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:40,440
Speaker 1: school and went to the future and found out that,

545
00:29:40,560 --> 00:29:42,120
Speaker 1: you know, a couple of us were still in the

546
00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:44,240
Speaker 1: industry and doing well, then it would have been a

547
00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:47,720
Speaker 1: very bitter, horrible day. But the fair that you didn't

548
00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:50,200
Speaker 1: and the fact that we lived all that life in

549
00:29:50,200 --> 00:29:52,920
Speaker 1: between and you got there, and I was so struck

550
00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:56,640
Speaker 1: by it. The people and it. It goes back to time,

551
00:29:56,800 --> 00:29:59,520
Speaker 1: doesn't it. You know, as you navigate life, you find

552
00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:02,320
Speaker 1: your job oi and you find your successes in all

553
00:30:02,480 --> 00:30:06,880
Speaker 1: different sorts of ways. As you now know. Yes, and

554
00:30:07,000 --> 00:30:09,400
Speaker 1: then I think we're brutal with our ideas of like

555
00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:12,560
Speaker 1: really adhering to a notion of what is success and

556
00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:16,520
Speaker 1: what is failure and being traumatized by this prescribed idea

557
00:30:16,600 --> 00:30:20,000
Speaker 1: of failing. Failure is so I can't remember the quote,

558
00:30:20,320 --> 00:30:23,960
Speaker 1: it's Winston Churchill. I'm totally paraphrasing and watching it. But

559
00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:28,560
Speaker 1: success is enjoying the failures in between failures like that,

560
00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:32,080
Speaker 1: it's all failing and trying not to and enjoying that process.

561
00:30:32,720 --> 00:30:34,440
Speaker 1: I thought you were going to say success is enjoying

562
00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:37,440
Speaker 1: the failure of others. By the way, that would be

563
00:30:37,600 --> 00:30:40,520
Speaker 1: something that would be something that Churchill could also said

564
00:30:41,640 --> 00:30:45,880
Speaker 1: he probably did. He probably did. It was so great,

565
00:30:45,920 --> 00:30:49,000
Speaker 1: Thank you so much, Thanks for this many It's been fun.

566
00:30:52,440 --> 00:30:56,520
Speaker 1: Graham's fourth novel, Forever Home, is out now and for

567
00:30:56,600 --> 00:30:59,200
Speaker 1: our friends in the UK, Graham will be on tour

568
00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:03,520
Speaker 1: to discuss the book through October. So if you've enjoyed

569
00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:06,680
Speaker 1: hearing his musings, and I know you have, please do

570
00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:12,320
Speaker 1: catch him live. Mini Questions is hosted and written by

571
00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:18,800
Speaker 1: Me Mini Driver, supervising producer Aaron Kaufman, Producer Morgan Lavoy,

572
00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:25,240
Speaker 1: Research assistant Marissa Brown. Original music Sorry Baby by Mini Driver,

573
00:31:26,080 --> 00:31:30,960
Speaker 1: Additional music by Aaron Kaufman. Executive produced by Me Mini Driver.

574
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:36,680
Speaker 1: Special thanks to Jim Nikolay, Will Pearson, Addison No Day,

575
00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:42,800
Speaker 1: Lisa Castella and Annique Oppenheim at w kPr de La Pescador,

576
00:31:43,520 --> 00:31:47,880
Speaker 1: Kate Driver and Jason Weinberg, and for constantly solicited tech

577
00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:49,560
Speaker 1: support Henry Driver,