WEBVTT - Dating Smart 0:00:02.200 --> 0:00:06.760 Hi there, it's me Laura Wasser, the divorce attorney and 0:00:06.800 --> 0:00:10.080 the founder of It's over Easy, the online divorce service. 0:00:10.960 --> 0:00:14.120 I've been practicing family law for over twenty years and 0:00:14.160 --> 0:00:17.560 I've worked on thousands of divorces, shepherding people through what 0:00:17.680 --> 0:00:20.320 may be one of the most terrifying times in their lives. 0:00:20.640 --> 0:00:22.959 Along the way, I often have to remind people to 0:00:23.120 --> 0:00:26.400 lower their expectations when dealing with matters of the heart. 0:00:26.640 --> 0:00:31.920 Rules simply don't apply because all's fair in love and war. 0:00:32.400 --> 0:00:36.080 So welcome to the All's Fair Podcasts. Fasten your seatbelts 0:00:36.080 --> 0:00:40.760 and let's go. Hi there, it's me Laura Wasser, and 0:00:40.880 --> 0:00:43.600 this is All's Fair. My name is Johnny Rains. Thanks 0:00:43.600 --> 0:00:47.160 for listening today. Y'all's Fair podcast is dedicated to all 0:00:47.240 --> 0:00:51.960 things relationship, from friendships to hook ups, to marriages, divorces 0:00:52.000 --> 0:00:54.760 and everything in between. But when it comes to marriage, 0:00:54.840 --> 0:00:57.720 though I do love a good wedding, I remain unconvinced 0:00:57.720 --> 0:01:00.200 that the idea of till death do us Part is 0:01:00.320 --> 0:01:02.760 as viable as it once may have been. Well, that 0:01:02.880 --> 0:01:05.199 article we just posted on the It's Over Easy Mighty 0:01:05.240 --> 0:01:08.119 network from Fatherly, written by Jeremy Brown sort of spells 0:01:08.120 --> 0:01:11.000 it out. Is your marriage just to pack to die together? 0:01:11.520 --> 0:01:13.720 What do you think about that article? I think, I mean, 0:01:13.760 --> 0:01:15.759 I do look now that I fall into the category 0:01:15.959 --> 0:01:19.240 of great divorce or silver divorce. I mean, it is 0:01:19.280 --> 0:01:21.560 something you start thinking about a little bit more as 0:01:21.720 --> 0:01:24.680 you get into dying with your the person you're with, 0:01:25.120 --> 0:01:28.640 having somebody to grow old with, absolutely, you know. I mean, 0:01:28.640 --> 0:01:30.480 it's no longer like, oh God, I'm gonna be with 0:01:30.520 --> 0:01:32.160 this person for the rest of my life. It's more like, 0:01:32.600 --> 0:01:34.319 oh my God, is this person going to take me 0:01:34.400 --> 0:01:37.479 into my hospice? You know? So I don't know. I mean, 0:01:37.520 --> 0:01:40.400 it's definitely something to think about. You know, when we 0:01:40.400 --> 0:01:43.760 were living until thirty five or forty, it was a 0:01:43.760 --> 0:01:46.640 lot easier to stay together until death do us part. 0:01:46.720 --> 0:01:48.960 Now that we're living so much longer, you have to 0:01:48.960 --> 0:01:52.720 really examine if you're happy in the relationship, makes sense 0:01:52.720 --> 0:01:54.800 to etcetera. And that's what they talk about in the 0:01:54.920 --> 0:01:58.320 article is kind of ways to keep it fresh, and 0:01:58.360 --> 0:02:01.520 how important intimacy is, and how easy it is to 0:02:01.600 --> 0:02:06.160 fall into the sort of just the comfort position without intimacy, right, 0:02:06.320 --> 0:02:11.760 I take comfort these days, However, when a relationship is 0:02:11.840 --> 0:02:15.040 toxic if it moves past comfortable into toxic, it can 0:02:15.040 --> 0:02:17.639 really bring you down, affecting all aspects of your life, 0:02:18.000 --> 0:02:21.480 whether you realize it or not. Peter Economy writes about 0:02:21.520 --> 0:02:31.000 this in I Love this Guy's Name. So. Peter Economy 0:02:31.280 --> 0:02:33.600 writes about this in inc Magazine. He points out that 0:02:33.639 --> 0:02:36.160 when a relationship is toxic, it stunts your growth and 0:02:36.200 --> 0:02:39.000 blocks you from growing in near full potential. But getting 0:02:39.040 --> 0:02:41.919 out of a toxic relationship is often easier said than done, 0:02:42.880 --> 0:02:47.000 and so he shares in the article seventeen super inspiring 0:02:47.080 --> 0:02:51.200 quotes to help you end a toxic relationship. M ready, 0:02:51.760 --> 0:02:54.720 this is a Steve Jobs one. Your time is limited, 0:02:54.760 --> 0:02:58.880 so don't waste it living somebody else's life. This was 0:02:59.240 --> 0:03:02.360 by Wayne Die at number sixteen on the list relationships 0:03:02.400 --> 0:03:05.720 based on obligation lack of dignity. I like that one. 0:03:06.280 --> 0:03:09.760 How about staying in and in a healthy relationship that 0:03:09.840 --> 0:03:12.160 robs you of peace of mind? Is not being loyal, 0:03:12.480 --> 0:03:17.079 It is choosing to hurt yourself mentally, emotionally and sometimes physically. Kemmy. 0:03:18.800 --> 0:03:20.640 These are all like things that you could put on 0:03:20.639 --> 0:03:26.360 an Instagram post as inspirational or completely uninspirational. Quotes in 0:03:26.400 --> 0:03:28.600 any way, thank you, Thank you INC Magazine, Thank you 0:03:28.639 --> 0:03:32.240 Peter Economy. Um. And then once you're out of a relationship, 0:03:32.440 --> 0:03:35.240 now what Well, that is what we're going to talk 0:03:35.280 --> 0:03:38.120 about today. It's up to the individual. But the next 0:03:38.200 --> 0:03:40.800 chapter is full of possibilities. You guys just need to 0:03:40.800 --> 0:03:43.320 be prepared, which is what our new video series is 0:03:43.360 --> 0:03:46.640 all about. It's called Next Chapter Life after Divorce. It 0:03:46.800 --> 0:03:50.480 is now available online at next Chapter series dot com. 0:03:50.520 --> 0:03:53.880 Today's show is all about next Chapter. So, without further ado, 0:03:54.040 --> 0:03:56.640 I am honored to introduce you all to our first guest. 0:03:57.080 --> 0:04:01.880 She is a behavioral relationship expert, personal success mentor, and 0:04:01.920 --> 0:04:05.160 the host of her own podcast, Deal with It. Welcome 0:04:05.200 --> 0:04:08.280 to All's Fair, Tracy Crossley, Thank you for having me 0:04:08.320 --> 0:04:12.640 on today. Welcome. So tell us what your advice is 0:04:12.680 --> 0:04:16.000 to people who settle in a relationship. Tracy, what do 0:04:16.040 --> 0:04:18.040 you tell these guys that call up on the podcast 0:04:18.120 --> 0:04:20.599 or that you work with. Well, I'm probably gonna go 0:04:20.640 --> 0:04:24.520 against mainstream advice, and that is first of all, people 0:04:24.560 --> 0:04:27.080 have to figure out what it is that makes them 0:04:27.080 --> 0:04:29.560 settle in the first place. A lot of times we 0:04:29.640 --> 0:04:33.159 have pressure from outside sources, society, our friends, so on 0:04:33.279 --> 0:04:36.560 and so forth. And they're telling us to get out 0:04:36.600 --> 0:04:39.800 of something we're settling for, right, and we have that 0:04:39.839 --> 0:04:41.240 little voice in our head, Oh my god, I can't 0:04:41.279 --> 0:04:43.479 believe I'm putting up with this. All of that, but 0:04:43.560 --> 0:04:46.320 that doesn't really solve the issue of why you would 0:04:46.360 --> 0:04:48.159 choose to be in a relationship and settle in the 0:04:48.200 --> 0:04:51.359 first place. So I'm all about you've got to look 0:04:51.400 --> 0:04:54.560 at what you're afraid of in leaving the relationship. What 0:04:54.600 --> 0:04:56.080 are you afraid is going to happen to you? Afraid 0:04:56.080 --> 0:04:58.760 you're gonna be alone? Are you afraid that it's a 0:04:58.760 --> 0:05:00.839 bad decision, that this is the best you're ever going 0:05:00.880 --> 0:05:04.640 to have? What is it? Okay? So now you've done that, 0:05:04.680 --> 0:05:06.720 you realize, Okay, I think I'm really I'm afraid of 0:05:06.720 --> 0:05:09.200 being alone. This is you know, there's so many good 0:05:09.200 --> 0:05:12.279 things about him or her. Do you then say to people, no, 0:05:12.360 --> 0:05:14.599 you're not going to be alone, or hey, be alone 0:05:14.680 --> 0:05:16.640 might be okay, not the worst thing in the world. 0:05:17.040 --> 0:05:19.080 I mean, are you do you generally find yourself and 0:05:19.120 --> 0:05:21.039 I of course it's a case by case, but do 0:05:21.080 --> 0:05:24.840 you generally find yourself saying deal with it, you gotta 0:05:24.880 --> 0:05:27.360 move on, You're just gonna stagn it here forever, or 0:05:27.440 --> 0:05:29.440 do you say, here's how we can work on this 0:05:29.480 --> 0:05:32.320 and make it better. I say, here's how we can 0:05:32.360 --> 0:05:34.200 work on this and make it better because a lot 0:05:34.200 --> 0:05:36.719 of times when you're settling, there's a part of you 0:05:36.839 --> 0:05:39.400 that just wants to get out right. You have that 0:05:39.720 --> 0:05:42.039 um I would call it energy of I need to 0:05:42.040 --> 0:05:44.480 get the hell out of here. And it really is 0:05:44.640 --> 0:05:47.400 about dealing with the other part of yourself that's settling 0:05:47.440 --> 0:05:50.760 and going, Okay, what is it I'm not doing because 0:05:50.760 --> 0:05:52.960 I'm probably not taking care of myself and probably not 0:05:53.000 --> 0:05:55.760 speaking up, I'm not being authentic, I'm not being honest, 0:05:56.200 --> 0:05:58.400 and so we start to delve into those areas and 0:05:58.440 --> 0:06:01.360 this is all learned from child. This is all coming 0:06:01.480 --> 0:06:05.440 from insecure attachment. For most people that settle, because there's 0:06:05.480 --> 0:06:08.840 a fear again that's bigger than the desire to leave. 0:06:09.040 --> 0:06:10.680 So you've got to make it where the desire to 0:06:10.760 --> 0:06:13.200 leave is bigger than the fear and it's just a 0:06:13.279 --> 0:06:15.560 small tipping point, it's not a huge tipping point. Do 0:06:15.600 --> 0:06:18.400 you find most people are settling from the beginning or 0:06:18.440 --> 0:06:22.440 does the settling happen as you settle into the relationship. 0:06:22.880 --> 0:06:25.039 A lot of times people have a fantasy going into 0:06:25.040 --> 0:06:28.320 a relationship. Right on the first date, they already start thinking, Oh, 0:06:28.360 --> 0:06:30.400 he would look great walking down the aisle with me, 0:06:30.920 --> 0:06:33.000 or wow, I want to introduce her to my parents. 0:06:33.040 --> 0:06:35.680 And they don't even know this person, but they're developing 0:06:35.760 --> 0:06:39.240 a dream just from what they're getting on that first date, 0:06:39.279 --> 0:06:42.000 and it just keeps continuing until it crashes and burns 0:06:42.040 --> 0:06:46.240 at some point with wow, Okay, I am settling here, right. 0:06:46.760 --> 0:06:48.400 So are these some of the things you talk about 0:06:48.440 --> 0:06:51.719 in your thirty day emotional cleanse Yes? I do, I 0:06:51.760 --> 0:06:54.240 really do get to the bottom of what it is 0:06:54.279 --> 0:06:57.719 that drives people to have either a relationship they're settling 0:06:57.720 --> 0:07:00.320 for or something that's toxic, and so of us some 0:07:00.400 --> 0:07:02.600 of the tips or the steps to get rid of 0:07:02.600 --> 0:07:05.120 those roadblocks. First of all, you have to look at 0:07:05.160 --> 0:07:08.599 where you have resistance. Resistance is a physical feeling in 0:07:08.640 --> 0:07:11.000 the body of heaviness. It makes you have a sense 0:07:11.040 --> 0:07:14.120 of inertia, like walking through cement, right, And so we'll 0:07:14.160 --> 0:07:17.840 avoid things in our lives that feel that way to us. 0:07:17.920 --> 0:07:20.800 Oh God, that's too hard, I'd rather do this. You 0:07:20.880 --> 0:07:23.920 got to do the hard stuff, right. So that's number one, 0:07:23.960 --> 0:07:26.200 which a cleans is By the way, I don't think 0:07:26.200 --> 0:07:29.280 I ever got to thirty days. It was that hard, 0:07:29.680 --> 0:07:32.080 not emotional. I never tried that. I'm would even harder. 0:07:32.160 --> 0:07:38.280 But but yeah, just even the dietary clean work started 0:07:38.360 --> 0:07:41.960 just drinking alcohol and it was really it isn't lemon juice, 0:07:42.080 --> 0:07:45.560 honey and cayenne and vodka. Yeah, it didn't work out. Okay, sorry, 0:07:46.600 --> 0:07:49.840 I don't know the vodka part. I'm thinking I added 0:07:49.880 --> 0:07:55.360 that I don't work out that all right, Okay, So yes, okay, 0:07:55.680 --> 0:07:59.120 So that's one thing. The other thing is about looking 0:07:59.160 --> 0:08:02.320 at what you focus on. Most of us focus outside 0:08:02.360 --> 0:08:05.000 of us. Were always focused on other people. But the 0:08:05.000 --> 0:08:07.240 truth is, you want to have an internal locus of control. 0:08:07.280 --> 0:08:08.760 You want to be able to come from the inside 0:08:08.800 --> 0:08:11.400 to the outside. So you have to start looking at 0:08:11.400 --> 0:08:14.240 how you personalize people, how you assume things about people. 0:08:14.480 --> 0:08:17.360 And this can be in your relationship but also around you, 0:08:17.680 --> 0:08:20.360 because the more you chip away at how you focus 0:08:20.400 --> 0:08:23.960 on everybody else and not on yourself, you start to realize, 0:08:23.960 --> 0:08:26.400 oh my gosh, I gotta get myself in hand. And 0:08:26.400 --> 0:08:29.640 that's why I'm always take your time with leaving a relationship, 0:08:29.960 --> 0:08:32.320 because that's the most important thing, absolutely and do you 0:08:32.320 --> 0:08:35.120 find this happens a lot, particularly with mothers, because you're 0:08:35.160 --> 0:08:39.400 focusing on the family, the kids. You know, your significant 0:08:39.400 --> 0:08:41.400 other does that? I mean I hear that a lot 0:08:41.440 --> 0:08:44.400 in my practice of you know, I can't focus on myself. 0:08:44.440 --> 0:08:46.040 I have all these things. I don't have a second 0:08:46.040 --> 0:08:49.079 to focus on me. I hear that a lot with mothers. 0:08:49.200 --> 0:08:52.680 I also hear that a lot with men. Um And 0:08:52.720 --> 0:08:55.160 the thing is with men, they start to feel and 0:08:55.200 --> 0:08:57.480 this isn't all men. This is men who usually run 0:08:57.800 --> 0:09:00.319 because they start to feel responsible for the other person, 0:09:00.400 --> 0:09:04.520 run away, right, got it? So talking about that, let's 0:09:04.559 --> 0:09:07.319 talk a little bit about dating after a divorce or 0:09:07.360 --> 0:09:10.880 breakup from a significant relationship. What are the signs that 0:09:10.960 --> 0:09:14.240 you tell people mean that they may be ready to 0:09:14.280 --> 0:09:17.200 get back out there and date. Okay, so I think 0:09:17.360 --> 0:09:21.280 dating is the greatest laboratory for self growth. Agree. Yah, 0:09:21.360 --> 0:09:23.920 you represent yourself. It's more for you than anybody else. 0:09:24.520 --> 0:09:26.880 I guess it really helps with this whole self exploration 0:09:26.960 --> 0:09:30.840 thing too. Yes, because in the crash test, dummy sitting 0:09:30.840 --> 0:09:32.760 and cross and reading a piece of swordfish and a 0:09:32.760 --> 0:09:35.880 glass of sardon. It's all about you. It is all 0:09:35.920 --> 0:09:38.200 about you. But most people make it about the other person. 0:09:38.600 --> 0:09:40.800 If I say, oh, how is the date, they'll go, well, 0:09:40.840 --> 0:09:42.520 he did this or he did that, or she did 0:09:42.520 --> 0:09:44.440 this or she did that. That has nothing to do 0:09:44.480 --> 0:09:47.000 with your experience, Right, what did you do? How did 0:09:47.040 --> 0:09:50.720 you feel? Would you date? You? Got it? And so 0:09:52.120 --> 0:09:54.760 how soon is too soon to date? I don't really 0:09:54.800 --> 0:09:57.000 have a limit on it. Some people can date right 0:09:57.040 --> 0:09:59.680 away because let's say eve been settling for last twenty 0:09:59.760 --> 0:10:03.320 years your relationship and you have nothing left, You're gonna 0:10:03.360 --> 0:10:05.600 be able to move on pretty easily. But let's say 0:10:05.640 --> 0:10:09.400 somebody is leaving you, then you're going to have to 0:10:09.400 --> 0:10:12.000 take some time and take care of yourself. So I 0:10:12.040 --> 0:10:14.800 never say that there's a day, you know, okay, three 0:10:14.880 --> 0:10:19.280 days a month. I always feel that it's whatever works 0:10:19.320 --> 0:10:22.720 for that individual got it. So now we've gotten them 0:10:22.720 --> 0:10:25.319 back out there, they're dating, they've got their online profile, 0:10:25.360 --> 0:10:28.200 they're ready to go. Let's talk about some of the 0:10:28.320 --> 0:10:31.600 pitfalls of dating in that you have to probably deal 0:10:31.679 --> 0:10:36.960 with the website. Plenty of fish says of millennial daters 0:10:37.080 --> 0:10:40.760 reported being ghosted or permanently ignored by the person they 0:10:40.760 --> 0:10:44.000 were dating. What do you first of all explain to 0:10:44.040 --> 0:10:47.040 our listeners how that happens, and what you tell people 0:10:47.040 --> 0:10:48.640 when they say I don't know. I thought I was 0:10:48.679 --> 0:10:50.320 going fine, and the next thing I knew I didn't 0:10:50.320 --> 0:10:52.240 hear from them. Again, Well, what is what does ghosting? 0:10:52.800 --> 0:10:59.800 Is that permanently ignored by the person. It's the same 0:11:00.720 --> 0:11:06.080 permanently ignored, gone, not coming back for the rest of 0:11:06.120 --> 0:11:11.080 the interview, Johnny, Okay, So we would never do that time. 0:11:11.360 --> 0:11:13.840 We love you. Okay. So when they call you and 0:11:13.880 --> 0:11:15.680 say I don't know what, how this happened? What do 0:11:15.679 --> 0:11:18.559 you say again that this is not about you, this 0:11:18.600 --> 0:11:21.199 is about them. Make it about you. And I really 0:11:21.200 --> 0:11:23.199 do say that because a lot of times we are 0:11:23.280 --> 0:11:27.920 choosing from alistic characteristics that we've had for a long time. Right, Oh, 0:11:27.960 --> 0:11:29.600 they have to be this tall, they have to have 0:11:29.679 --> 0:11:32.520 this job, they have to look at this way, whatever 0:11:32.559 --> 0:11:35.040 it happens to be. Oh, I've got to have intense 0:11:35.080 --> 0:11:38.959 sexual chemistry with them, otherwise forget it. Well, those are 0:11:39.000 --> 0:11:42.520 a lot of reasons why this happens in the first place. 0:11:42.600 --> 0:11:46.600 Because our checklist doesn't mean anything. It's I don't want 0:11:46.600 --> 0:11:48.320 to say it's stupid, but it is stupid most of 0:11:48.360 --> 0:11:50.840 the time. And what do you tell somebody what would 0:11:50.840 --> 0:11:52.760 you tell me if I was like, listen, I've been 0:11:52.760 --> 0:11:55.000 seeing this guy, I'm not into him, and it would 0:11:55.000 --> 0:11:57.640 just be so much easier since I don't have to 0:11:57.679 --> 0:12:00.520 see him all the time. If I, you know, permanently 0:12:00.559 --> 0:12:03.800 ignored him online or ghosted him. Do you do you 0:12:04.400 --> 0:12:08.079 kind of school your people in like dating etiquette. I do, 0:12:08.400 --> 0:12:11.719 and I make it all about you again because it's 0:12:11.720 --> 0:12:13.880 a growth opportunity to actually have to stand up and 0:12:13.920 --> 0:12:16.800 say I'm not really interested in dating you instead of 0:12:16.840 --> 0:12:21.319 just ghosting somebody. What's bread crumbing? So bread crumbing is 0:12:21.440 --> 0:12:31.880 a form of torture. It's basically where again, Um, it's 0:12:32.280 --> 0:12:35.360 it's a different kind of torture than the cleans the clans. Yeah, 0:12:35.440 --> 0:12:37.439 an emotional cleanse, by the way, is probably up there 0:12:37.480 --> 0:12:42.080 with the whole cayenne pepper. Yeah, it's hard to do anyways. Um, 0:12:42.120 --> 0:12:45.560 when it comes to bread crumbing, it's where you think 0:12:45.559 --> 0:12:48.760 you're being ghosted and you think things are great too. 0:12:48.760 --> 0:12:51.040 In the beginning, you think you're being ghosted, but then 0:12:51.040 --> 0:12:54.000 this person shows back up and this can go on 0:12:54.080 --> 0:12:56.640 for years where it's this yo yo relationship where they 0:12:56.720 --> 0:12:59.400 come and they give you just enough and you're in 0:12:59.440 --> 0:13:01.360 that fan of see of what you thought it was 0:13:01.360 --> 0:13:03.040 going to be on the first date, and you're sort 0:13:03.040 --> 0:13:05.560 of stuck in that mindset, right and every time he 0:13:05.679 --> 0:13:07.400 or she shows up, it pulls you right back in. 0:13:08.440 --> 0:13:12.000 Is this something that the bread crumber is doing purposely 0:13:12.120 --> 0:13:14.080 or is it just they're just kind of super selfish. 0:13:14.080 --> 0:13:15.480 They're out there and they're like, oh, that was a 0:13:15.520 --> 0:13:17.760 hot piece of ask maybe I'll text her again or something. 0:13:17.800 --> 0:13:22.280 I mean, or is it really a maniacal, machiavellian, sick 0:13:22.320 --> 0:13:25.240 old thing to do. It's a control thing, and it's 0:13:25.280 --> 0:13:27.840 a control thing that is developed from fear. I mean, 0:13:27.880 --> 0:13:30.920 I have clients like this where I have a client 0:13:30.960 --> 0:13:33.120 who goes out with a different woman every night, and 0:13:33.360 --> 0:13:35.400 he came to me because he wants a healthy relationship. 0:13:36.040 --> 0:13:39.440 And so the reason he does this is he's had 0:13:39.559 --> 0:13:43.160 bad relationships in the past. He's afraid of somebody, you know, 0:13:43.320 --> 0:13:46.679 being a meshed with it. So that's why a lot 0:13:46.720 --> 0:13:48.760 of these people will drop bread crumbs and they'll just 0:13:48.840 --> 0:13:51.240 keep it at a distance. But if he gets too close, 0:13:51.360 --> 0:13:53.520 then fear comes up and then they don't know what 0:13:53.640 --> 0:13:56.240 to do with themselves. But can you be a person 0:13:56.280 --> 0:13:58.720 that says I'm really not looking for anything serious. I'm 0:13:58.760 --> 0:14:00.600 in a period of self explorers and I want to 0:14:00.640 --> 0:14:02.920 go out with a different person every night because this 0:14:03.040 --> 0:14:06.439 is what is helping me heal and also helping me evolve. 0:14:06.520 --> 0:14:08.560 And as long as I'm honest with people about that, 0:14:09.240 --> 0:14:12.360 is that. Okay? It is, I think in the short term. 0:14:12.400 --> 0:14:15.480 But when it becomes a long term pattern, then you're 0:14:15.520 --> 0:14:18.960 just avoiding. Then there's fear about getting close. And everybody 0:14:18.960 --> 0:14:21.240 has fear about getting close. So we have to get close. 0:14:21.680 --> 0:14:23.720 If you want to have a healthy relationship, you do. 0:14:24.440 --> 0:14:26.640 If you want unhealthy and you like all the drama, 0:14:26.680 --> 0:14:28.640 which a lot of people do, like all the drama. 0:14:28.920 --> 0:14:31.080 What if you just want to be alone, but you'd 0:14:31.080 --> 0:14:33.160 like to have dinner with people and get to know people, 0:14:33.160 --> 0:14:35.920 but you're not looking for something more serious. Again, better 0:14:35.960 --> 0:14:39.040 short term? Well, it's better short term because that's a 0:14:39.040 --> 0:14:41.440 comfort zone and that's kind of a bubble that we 0:14:41.480 --> 0:14:43.800 can stay in. And from what I know, I was 0:14:43.840 --> 0:14:46.200 single for many years in between my first divorce and 0:14:46.240 --> 0:14:50.200 getting remarried, and I used it as an excuse. I 0:14:50.400 --> 0:14:52.720 used my kids as an excuse, I used everything as 0:14:52.720 --> 0:14:55.520 an excuse. So it was really comfortable to do that 0:14:55.560 --> 0:14:57.680 because I didn't have to push myself out of the nest, 0:14:57.880 --> 0:14:59.960 right And every time I pushed myself out of the nest, 0:15:00.000 --> 0:15:01.880 I had an excuse, Oh, there's only idiots out there, 0:15:02.000 --> 0:15:05.520 you know. All of that kind of stuff, got it. So, Tracy, 0:15:05.560 --> 0:15:08.240 tell us a little bit more about how you counsel 0:15:08.360 --> 0:15:11.600 people to prevent this from becoming a cycle that's unhealthy. 0:15:11.640 --> 0:15:13.760 Like you said, even you did it. So it's easy 0:15:13.800 --> 0:15:16.400 to fall into this pattern of I just want to 0:15:16.440 --> 0:15:18.800 keep a safe distance. But in terms of really being 0:15:18.840 --> 0:15:23.480 able to move into a healthier relationship when you're ready, 0:15:23.800 --> 0:15:25.720 how do you talk to people about taking the steps 0:15:25.760 --> 0:15:28.000 to do that. So, first of all, I have people 0:15:28.000 --> 0:15:29.880 slow down because a lot of times we're not in 0:15:29.920 --> 0:15:32.920 the present moment. We are out in the future already 0:15:33.360 --> 0:15:35.840 deciding things, Oh, this isn't gonna work, or this is 0:15:35.840 --> 0:15:38.200 gonna work, based on what I'm thinking is going to happen, 0:15:38.600 --> 0:15:41.040 rather than what is happening right now. The other thing 0:15:41.200 --> 0:15:44.160 is a lot of people don't enjoy dating. They tend 0:15:44.200 --> 0:15:47.200 to not find it fun. And I actually found it 0:15:47.240 --> 0:15:50.120 fun when I really got a clue that I was 0:15:50.160 --> 0:15:52.760 the one who was emotionally unavailable so you gotta check 0:15:52.800 --> 0:15:56.000 yourself and you gotta ask what am I doing when 0:15:56.000 --> 0:15:58.480 I go on on a date? How open am I? Am? 0:15:58.480 --> 0:16:00.680 I just so focused on the other person and reacting 0:16:00.720 --> 0:16:03.880 to them that this is this is what it becomes, 0:16:04.000 --> 0:16:06.520 is just a reaction, because that's usually what it is, 0:16:06.560 --> 0:16:09.080 instead of going, wait a minute, am I actually being real? 0:16:09.320 --> 0:16:11.080 And I used to check in with myself on dates 0:16:11.080 --> 0:16:13.160 and go, what are you saying right now? Are you 0:16:13.200 --> 0:16:15.240 actually saying something? Are you trying to get a second date? 0:16:15.640 --> 0:16:19.120 Right question? And I don't know if this is something 0:16:19.120 --> 0:16:22.280 that And again obviously case by case, how soon is 0:16:22.320 --> 0:16:25.400 too soon to sleep with somebody? Okay? So a lot 0:16:25.400 --> 0:16:27.160 of people ask me that question. In fact, I just 0:16:27.200 --> 0:16:29.800 answered it yesterday, I think, But anyway, I'm sure the 0:16:29.800 --> 0:16:33.160 answer changes every day. Well, the thing is there is 0:16:33.200 --> 0:16:37.120 no right time. Is the time of you emotionally being 0:16:37.160 --> 0:16:40.800 ready for that. And I believe that the relationship, especially 0:16:40.960 --> 0:16:43.800 if you're somebody who sleeps with people to try and 0:16:43.840 --> 0:16:46.120 hook them, or you sleep with people and you leave them, 0:16:46.600 --> 0:16:50.320 it's somebody where you feel you're building a relationship and 0:16:50.360 --> 0:16:53.560 that the relationship is in a stable position, it's progressing. 0:16:53.640 --> 0:16:57.120 There's consistency, it's growing. That's what you want. So when 0:16:57.160 --> 0:16:58.920 it's in that position, I think it's great to sleep 0:16:58.920 --> 0:17:00.720 with somebody if you're you and it for any other 0:17:00.760 --> 0:17:03.160 reason than you're doing it for the wrong reasons. What 0:17:03.240 --> 0:17:05.560 if your reason is you just want to hook up, well, 0:17:05.600 --> 0:17:07.600 then that's a whole different story. Then you're not really 0:17:07.600 --> 0:17:10.760 looking for a healthy relationship. Okay, all right? Speaking of 0:17:10.760 --> 0:17:13.240 healthy relationships, and when you are ready to get back 0:17:13.240 --> 0:17:15.600 out there, it should come as no surprise that out 0:17:15.640 --> 0:17:19.800 there these days actually means on your smartphone or your laptop. 0:17:19.960 --> 0:17:22.240 So if you haven't cracked the code yet on building 0:17:22.240 --> 0:17:29.000 the best online dating profile, stay tuned. This is All's 0:17:29.040 --> 0:17:32.040 Fair with Laura Wasser. I know divorce sucks, but it 0:17:32.080 --> 0:17:34.560 doesn't have to be that way, which is why we've 0:17:34.600 --> 0:17:38.520 expanded our content to embrace all types of relationships. As 0:17:38.520 --> 0:17:41.479 the saying goes, all's fair in love and war, and 0:17:41.560 --> 0:17:43.960 we plan to cover it all right here every week 0:17:44.119 --> 0:17:47.159 with you. Today's show is about turning the page on 0:17:47.200 --> 0:17:51.119 a relationship you've outgrown to reveal a fresh new next 0:17:51.200 --> 0:17:55.159 chapter and dating again. We've been speaking with behavioral relationship 0:17:55.240 --> 0:17:58.120 expert Tracy Crossley about getting ready to date and join 0:17:58.200 --> 0:18:01.960 our conversation by phone now Live from Chicago. Is someone 0:18:02.040 --> 0:18:05.440 well known across the media world for her expertise guiding 0:18:05.440 --> 0:18:09.080 people towards finding love the second time around. You can 0:18:09.119 --> 0:18:11.000 find her latest article on the It's Over is the 0:18:11.080 --> 0:18:14.119 Insights blog. She's the dating expert on The Steve Harvey 0:18:14.200 --> 0:18:17.000 Show and The Kelly Clarkson Show, and she's founder of 0:18:17.040 --> 0:18:20.640 the Smart Dating Academy. Welcome to All's fair, Bella Gandhi, 0:18:21.920 --> 0:18:24.080 happy to be here. We're happy to have Did you 0:18:24.080 --> 0:18:30.919 share that Midwestern accent? Guys, we're good corn fed people 0:18:30.960 --> 0:18:33.840 here in the Midwest. Yes, you are so so tell 0:18:33.920 --> 0:18:39.119 us Bella about the Smart Dating Academy. So I realized 0:18:39.119 --> 0:18:42.160 for when I was back in college that I had 0:18:42.480 --> 0:18:46.840 really good matchmaking instincts. I set up my college roommate 0:18:47.119 --> 0:18:49.520 with the guy that I met at a fraternity party, 0:18:49.680 --> 0:18:51.320 and all of a sudden I met him and I 0:18:51.480 --> 0:18:54.760 was like, the room got really quiet. It's like a 0:18:54.760 --> 0:18:57.160 scene from a movie. And when I when I sort 0:18:57.200 --> 0:18:59.160 of came to I looked at him and I said 0:18:59.160 --> 0:19:00.639 to him, I'm like, oh my god, you're gonna marry 0:19:00.640 --> 0:19:02.560 my roommate. And he looked at me. He's like, what 0:19:02.840 --> 0:19:05.160 did you just say? And then I realized how insane 0:19:05.200 --> 0:19:07.879 that sounded. I was like, you would be What I 0:19:07.960 --> 0:19:10.760 meant to say is you would be perfect for my roommate. 0:19:11.000 --> 0:19:15.320 And five years later they got engaged, they got married, 0:19:15.320 --> 0:19:18.439 they're happily living in the suburbs with three kids. And 0:19:18.480 --> 0:19:22.080 I did it again and again and just kept setting 0:19:22.080 --> 0:19:25.880 people up. My friends called me their dating Yoda. And 0:19:26.000 --> 0:19:29.879 so when I sold my last business, which was in manufacturing, 0:19:29.920 --> 0:19:32.000 I thought, what do I want to do for the 0:19:32.040 --> 0:19:34.760 rest of my life. I want to help people find love. 0:19:34.800 --> 0:19:38.200 So I started the business in two thousand nine, and 0:19:38.240 --> 0:19:41.560 what we do now is we help to fix people's pickers. 0:19:42.160 --> 0:19:45.800 Number one. Typically, if you're going around the relationship, married 0:19:45.920 --> 0:19:50.719 around once twice, three types, blown up relationships, maybe several divorces. 0:19:51.000 --> 0:19:54.000 The common denominator and that is usually US. And so 0:19:54.119 --> 0:19:56.640 we really help people to figure out their dating patterns, 0:19:56.920 --> 0:19:59.840 start to choose the right people. For women, we called 0:19:59.880 --> 0:20:03.160 the high GHQ guys. That's our trademark, High and Good 0:20:03.200 --> 0:20:06.800 Husband Qualities. And then so we coach them, We do 0:20:06.920 --> 0:20:10.800 their online photography, we write their profiles, and then they 0:20:10.840 --> 0:20:13.840 have us as like their personal trainers for their love 0:20:13.920 --> 0:20:17.320 lives for usually six to twelve months. Wow. Okay, so wait, 0:20:17.400 --> 0:20:19.960 let me just go back. So you're, what eighteen nineteen, 0:20:20.000 --> 0:20:22.359 You're at a frat party with a solo cup of 0:20:22.440 --> 0:20:25.080 bad Keg beer in your hand, and this came to 0:20:25.160 --> 0:20:27.680 you and then it happened again and again. So this 0:20:27.760 --> 0:20:29.800 is really your passion. So then you went into like 0:20:29.920 --> 0:20:33.960