WEBVTT - Never Cheat On A Therapist w/ Shahem Mclaurin

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<v Speaker 1>Do you think giving people a second chance after cheating

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<v Speaker 1>is okay? Not okay? What are your feelings? What's your

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<v Speaker 1>stance on it?

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<v Speaker 2>They will have to go about a lot of changes

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<v Speaker 2>to re earn that trust, and you, the person who

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<v Speaker 2>is violated, will have to go about a lot of

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<v Speaker 2>changes to open yourself back up to trusting that person.

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<v Speaker 2>That is a therapist answer.

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<v Speaker 1>Wow, that was a very great therapist answer. Okay, and

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<v Speaker 1>now what's your answer?

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<v Speaker 2>Hell? Fuck?

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<v Speaker 1>You know what we do here destroy shame around sex

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<v Speaker 1>by talking about sex. Now let me tell you something messy. Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>So I you know this has nothing to do with sex,

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<v Speaker 1>but it's my show. So sometimes the things are not

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<v Speaker 1>about sex, are just things that annoy me. And you

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<v Speaker 1>know what annoys the fuck out of me? And I

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<v Speaker 1>know not only one. When motherfucker's thumbs up a text.

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<v Speaker 1>One of my best friends loves a thumbs up, And

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<v Speaker 1>every time somebody thumbs up a text, I'm like, are

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<v Speaker 1>you mad?

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<v Speaker 2>It's like when.

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<v Speaker 1>People use a period, like if you use good punctuation,

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<v Speaker 1>like sometimes punctuation is necessary in your text. But if

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<v Speaker 1>you're somebody who goes hello, period, you're a serial killer. Girl,

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<v Speaker 1>Like what that to me feels like are you mad

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<v Speaker 1>at me? Are you annoyed at me? It's just not

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<v Speaker 1>a good time. Just like I have a friend and

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<v Speaker 1>she she just loves her punctuation. But for the longest

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<v Speaker 1>time I used to think she was pissed at me

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<v Speaker 1>because she would put a period at the end of

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<v Speaker 1>every fucking text message. And now my best mother best

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<v Speaker 1>friend thumbs up a text. I'd be like, hey, how

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<v Speaker 1>are you thumbs up? Okay, oh, I'm planning on and

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<v Speaker 1>this thing happened to thumbs up girl. If you don't

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<v Speaker 1>give me a heart, I need a heart, I need

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<v Speaker 1>an exclamation point. I'll even take a question mark if

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<v Speaker 1>you don't understand.

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<v Speaker 2>But a thumbs up.

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<v Speaker 1>That straight up disrespect. And I know I'm not the

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<v Speaker 1>only one who thinks this, And so this is this

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<v Speaker 1>is for those of us who are offended by your

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<v Speaker 1>motherfucking thumbs up. Anyone who knows me, Next time you

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<v Speaker 1>text me, and next time I text you, hearts hearts

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<v Speaker 1>love joy, smiley faces, a smirk, devil emoji. There's so

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<v Speaker 1>many fucking options. Don't thumbs up. I'll fucking break your

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<v Speaker 1>thumb Ooh that's what my mother used to say. My

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<v Speaker 1>mother black moms. You know, like if you be like

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<v Speaker 1>thumbs little birds, I'll break that finger off. And that's

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<v Speaker 1>how I feel. That's i'ma Actually I'm gonna text my

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<v Speaker 1>best friend right now. I'm gonna break your thumb off

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<v Speaker 1>the next time you thumbs up me and see what

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<v Speaker 1>he says. It's with the love. But respectfully, you know

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<v Speaker 1>what I'm saying, speaking of thumbs. Have I set this on?

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<v Speaker 1>I know I've said it on the internet, and I

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<v Speaker 1>know I've said it in shows, But have I said

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<v Speaker 1>on the podcast the thumb theory? Do you don't know

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<v Speaker 1>the thumb theory? Okay, listen, If you don't know the

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<v Speaker 1>thumb theory, if you if you follow me for a minute,

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<v Speaker 1>you probably know the thumb theory. If you don't know

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<v Speaker 1>the thumb theory, and if I've said it on a

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<v Speaker 1>previous episode, I apologize that I'm repeating it. But anyways,

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<v Speaker 1>you could tell the size of a dick, the length

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<v Speaker 1>with the girth by looking at us somebody's thumb. This

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<v Speaker 1>is science. Shut up, shut up wherever you are, shut up. Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm telling you this is this is whole science is hology,

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<v Speaker 1>all right, The whole ology of a thumb is that

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<v Speaker 1>you can tell. Now listen, Please don't come for me,

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<v Speaker 1>because I know that there are probably some medical professionals

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<v Speaker 1>that do be listening to this podcast. Listen. My friend

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<v Speaker 1>told me this, and honestly, honestly, I've found my research,

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<v Speaker 1>lots and lots of research, and I have discovered that

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of times the thumbs be matchined. Now, some

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<v Speaker 1>of y'all will say, no, it doesn't listen a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of times I didn't say all the time. Okay, this

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<v Speaker 1>theory works a solid I'm gonna say ninety percent of

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<v Speaker 1>the time. Okay, is what I is what I gather

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<v Speaker 1>from you know, my my private research that I self

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<v Speaker 1>funded research that the thumb you look at it, you

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<v Speaker 1>could tell you know the size of it, with the

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<v Speaker 1>girth right, that thumb is looking, you know, thickish, maybe

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<v Speaker 1>that dick will be thickish. Okay. If that thumb is

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<v Speaker 1>looking long, baby, that dick is probably gonna be nice

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<v Speaker 1>and long. And if that thumb is looking like short,

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<v Speaker 1>then that dick might also be short. Do me a favor.

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<v Speaker 1>Look at your partner's thumbs. Okay, look at your penis

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<v Speaker 1>owning partner's thumbs, and then look at that penis and

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<v Speaker 1>see and tell and see if I'm correct, and I

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<v Speaker 1>know that I am time. So the ten percent of

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<v Speaker 1>you go it's not true. Respect I heard, I understand,

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<v Speaker 1>But there will be ninety percent of you that I're

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<v Speaker 1>gonna be like, yeah, messy mom was correct. By the way,

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to the show. This is tell me something, Messie.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm your host, Brandon Kyle good Man. Most people call

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<v Speaker 1>me MESSI mom, but you could call me a hoologist. Hello. Yes, okay,

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<v Speaker 1>let's get this show started. Maybe you know what that means.

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<v Speaker 1>It's time for I guess now while they get situated

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<v Speaker 1>and before we do our whole manifestel and get up

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<v Speaker 1>into this messy key key a little bit of hoe keeping.

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<v Speaker 1>Now y'all may know by now, but maybe you knew here.

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<v Speaker 1>We're trying to get to our one hundred and fifty

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<v Speaker 1>ratings and reviews on Apple Podcasts and Spotify podcast before

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<v Speaker 1>this month is out, because it just helps us grow

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<v Speaker 1>this show. It helps get you know, the We gotta

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<v Speaker 1>play with this motherfucker algorithm. You understand, So if you

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<v Speaker 1>have it, and I know a lot of you haven't,

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<v Speaker 1>because there are thousands of you here and only like ratings.

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<v Speaker 1>So if you haven't it, just take a second give

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<v Speaker 1>us that five star rating and you can write us

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<v Speaker 1>a little review. It doesn't have to be anything in depth.

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<v Speaker 1>It could literally just be like this show is lit baby, Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>this is the one to check out. Very simple. It

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<v Speaker 1>really again does help the show. So thank you and

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<v Speaker 1>time for the whole manifestel Grant me the serenity to

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<v Speaker 1>unpack my shame, the courage to heal, the wisdom to

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<v Speaker 1>know that second is not just about penetration, the audacity

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<v Speaker 1>to advocate for my pleasure and boundaries, the strength to

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<v Speaker 1>not call my ex that fuck boy, fuck girl, or

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<v Speaker 1>fuck bay, for it is better to masturbate by myself

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<v Speaker 1>in peace than to let someone play in my motherfucker face.

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<v Speaker 1>Let the community say wolujah. I am so excited to

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<v Speaker 1>have Shahim on the show. Shahim McLaurin is a black

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<v Speaker 1>gender queer, licensed social worker, therapist and influencer born and

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<v Speaker 1>raised in Baltimore, Maryland, who is currently stationed in Brooklyn,

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<v Speaker 1>New York. With upwards of eight hundred thousand followers, Shahim

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<v Speaker 1>uses their platform to address a wide range of social

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<v Speaker 1>and mental health issues impacting people of color, patriarchy, impact

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<v Speaker 1>of people and members of the LGBTQ plus community. Shahim

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<v Speaker 1>has built a loyal community around their provision of mental

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<v Speaker 1>health advice, support and self care tips. Y'all please help me.

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome Shahhim Hashi. Welcome to the show.

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<v Speaker 2>Thank you for having me.

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<v Speaker 1>I am fangirling. I was so excited that you're here.

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<v Speaker 1>I love your videos. I'm obsessed. I repost them, as

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<v Speaker 1>you know, I send them to people. I always feel

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<v Speaker 1>like you. You deliver the truth with love, compassion, but

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<v Speaker 1>also it's the truth. It's just like it is what

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<v Speaker 1>it is.

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<v Speaker 2>I'll definitely try.

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<v Speaker 1>You and you succeed, You succeed. Okay, before we get

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<v Speaker 1>into our messy gi key, here's some messy mandates. One,

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<v Speaker 1>things get to be unprocessed. Any thoughts or opinion shared

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<v Speaker 1>have the right to evolve, shift or change today, tomorrow,

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<v Speaker 1>ten years from now. And if during the key key

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<v Speaker 1>something feels too personal or unintentionally offends, we use the

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<v Speaker 1>safe word foosball, which gives us a chance to pivot

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<v Speaker 1>and address accordingly.

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<v Speaker 2>Sounds nice, that sounds perfect, sounds lovely.

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<v Speaker 1>Shall we start with a lube breaker? Yes, it's great,

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<v Speaker 1>So we're gonna play around to fuck Mary block. Yes,

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<v Speaker 1>so fuck Mary block. Tongue in your ear, tongue in

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<v Speaker 1>your mouth, tongue in your ass. Oh you know you

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<v Speaker 1>really felt away?

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, Well, I will say immediately block tongue in the ear. Okay,

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<v Speaker 2>it does nothing for me, does nothing for me, all right.

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<v Speaker 2>I definitely would fuck tongue in ass, yes, and I

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<v Speaker 2>would marry tongue in the mouth floor Jesus.

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<v Speaker 1>Lord Jesus, Yes, okay, I'm with you. I'm in a

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<v Speaker 1>block tongue in the air. It does do something for me,

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<v Speaker 1>and I also does something for my boyfriend loves a

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<v Speaker 1>tongue in the air, and I'm so turned on when

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<v Speaker 1>I'm turning somebody else on. But unfortunately it doesn't do

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<v Speaker 1>it enough.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm just always like, well is it okay?

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<v Speaker 1>So, by the way, like, are people putting their tongue

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<v Speaker 1>in your ear with a with a pointy tongue, a

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<v Speaker 1>kermit tongue, or a flat tongue.

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<v Speaker 2>It doesn't does nothing.

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<v Speaker 1>For me because the pokey, the kerment that, yeah, that's

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<v Speaker 1>that I don't want like the sensation, but a nice

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<v Speaker 1>like flat Sorry, I am going to marry oh see

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<v Speaker 1>a tongue in the I love eating ass making out.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm gonna fun that. I'm gonna fuck the tongue in

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<v Speaker 1>the ass because I have nothing if we're not making out.

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<v Speaker 1>You know what I'm saying.

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<v Speaker 2>This is the most interesting way I've ever started a podcast.

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to the show. I'm going to marry. I'm marry

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<v Speaker 1>tongue in the mouth because I always want to make

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<v Speaker 1>out like nothing if we're not making out.

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<v Speaker 2>You know what I'm saying.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, fuck Mary block fuck Mary block. Spit play, come play, food.

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<v Speaker 2>Play, block food play immediately. Okay, absolutely know.

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<v Speaker 1>You don't want that food for the table.

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<v Speaker 2>Damn. The rest are tied low key for me. Okay,

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<v Speaker 2>so you fucking come play, Marry and come play. I'm

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<v Speaker 2>by that. I'll do that first.

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<v Speaker 1>You're gonna marry, come play.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, because you can't do that with everybody, that's something

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<v Speaker 2>you got to ask. But spin, I feel like I

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<v Speaker 2>can do that with everybody. So I'll marry, spit play,

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<v Speaker 2>come play. Okay.

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<v Speaker 1>I love that. Okay, I'm I'm only blocking food plate

0:10:23.160 --> 0:10:27.480
<v Speaker 1>because I haven't tried it yet, but I really I'm curious. Well,

0:10:28.520 --> 0:10:30.360
<v Speaker 1>all I've had is like a lollipop on somebody's asshole,

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<v Speaker 1>which I talked about way too many times. But that's

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<v Speaker 1>the most I've done. But I am ready to like

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<v Speaker 1>eat a cast roll or for somebody's titties. You know

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<v Speaker 1>what I'm saying.

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<v Speaker 2>I am.

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<v Speaker 1>I am hungry for it, but intended, I like, really

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<v Speaker 1>want to eat a cast roll off some titties and

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<v Speaker 1>call it a day. And it's like, I don't know,

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<v Speaker 1>maybe I'll love it, maybe I hate it, but I'd

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<v Speaker 1>like to try it. But for now, you'll block. I'll

0:10:55.920 --> 0:10:57.880
<v Speaker 1>block the food blade. Look at you. You cross your legs.

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<v Speaker 1>You said that's very nice. I mean, judge, what maybe

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<v Speaker 1>if you like it, I love it, I'm going to

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<v Speaker 1>I'm going to marry, come play, and I'm gonna spit

0:11:11.360 --> 0:11:14.079
<v Speaker 1>play wise decision. I always want your cum, you know

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<v Speaker 1>what I'm saying. Yes, every Yeah, I don't always want

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<v Speaker 1>to spit, but I always want to come. Okay, Amen,

0:11:21.600 --> 0:11:28.240
<v Speaker 1>fuck Mary block metal cock ring, Prince Albert Penis Cage.

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<v Speaker 2>Can I block all of them?

0:11:30.080 --> 0:11:30.440
<v Speaker 1>Listen?

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<v Speaker 2>You can't. Oh god, it can be. It can be

0:11:35.160 --> 0:11:38.520
<v Speaker 2>a you know, okay, a temporary marriage, a short marriage,

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<v Speaker 2>a short session, immediate block to the Prince Albert.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, this a piercing on your pee hole.

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<v Speaker 2>I can't do that, but I'll marry the cock ring

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<v Speaker 2>and I will fuck the page.

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<v Speaker 1>In the exact same way the Prince albert in theory sounds.

0:11:57.320 --> 0:12:02.400
<v Speaker 2>But like I feels good though, huh, I it feels good.

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<v Speaker 1>But I got my nipple pierced and that was enough

0:12:05.760 --> 0:12:09.000
<v Speaker 1>piercing for me. On like it hurts. By the way,

0:12:09.080 --> 0:12:11.560
<v Speaker 1>it took too long because my nipples were smaller, it

0:12:11.640 --> 0:12:14.120
<v Speaker 1>fell out. I had to have it repierced. I don't

0:12:14.120 --> 0:12:16.439
<v Speaker 1>want my Prince. If my Prince album falls out, I'm pissed.

0:12:17.200 --> 0:12:17.920
<v Speaker 2>I'm pissed.

0:12:18.320 --> 0:12:20.720
<v Speaker 1>I want to do that first round. Nah No, I

0:12:20.720 --> 0:12:23.800
<v Speaker 1>got a block, Prince Albert. I will marry a little

0:12:23.840 --> 0:12:26.440
<v Speaker 1>cock ring because you know, I'm always down to have

0:12:26.520 --> 0:12:28.480
<v Speaker 1>cock ring on. And I think a penis cach. I've

0:12:28.480 --> 0:12:31.640
<v Speaker 1>never been in the penis cage, but I find it.

0:12:32.120 --> 0:12:35.120
<v Speaker 1>I find it interesting and I'm I'm open to it,

0:12:35.720 --> 0:12:38.120
<v Speaker 1>but maybe, but I feel like it wouldn't be something

0:12:38.120 --> 0:12:41.679
<v Speaker 1>I would marry because I don't don't cage me. I

0:12:42.000 --> 0:12:42.960
<v Speaker 1>don't want to be a free bird.

0:12:43.000 --> 0:12:43.520
<v Speaker 2>You know what I'm saying.

0:12:44.440 --> 0:12:48.360
<v Speaker 1>You won the game, By the way, you don't want

0:12:48.360 --> 0:12:49.839
<v Speaker 1>any money, as I always say, you just want my

0:12:49.920 --> 0:12:50.760
<v Speaker 1>unconditional love.

0:12:50.840 --> 0:12:54.720
<v Speaker 2>So congratulations.

0:12:55.920 --> 0:12:58.280
<v Speaker 1>Don't talk to me like that. Okay, if y'all have

0:12:58.400 --> 0:13:01.839
<v Speaker 1>any uh lou breaker ideas or prompts, you can email

0:13:01.880 --> 0:13:05.920
<v Speaker 1>tell me something messy at gmail dot com. Speaking of which.

0:13:05.720 --> 0:13:08.880
<v Speaker 2>Shahim, do you want to tell me something messy? Yes,

0:13:10.800 --> 0:13:14.920
<v Speaker 2>I'm so anxious about Well, I'm not anxious. I recently

0:13:14.960 --> 0:13:18.679
<v Speaker 2>today found out that I was blocked by someone who's

0:13:18.720 --> 0:13:21.640
<v Speaker 2>a fellow content creator because of a boy.

0:13:23.400 --> 0:13:24.400
<v Speaker 1>What mean because of a boy?

0:13:24.720 --> 0:13:31.320
<v Speaker 2>Well? I was fucking him first, right and they Yeah,

0:13:31.640 --> 0:13:35.200
<v Speaker 2>I'm not gonna reveal too many details because it's I

0:13:35.200 --> 0:13:37.120
<v Speaker 2>don't want I don't want to have because people could

0:13:37.120 --> 0:13:39.760
<v Speaker 2>put two and two together. I was talking first, that's it.

0:13:40.720 --> 0:13:44.120
<v Speaker 2>I was first, before they did anything got together any

0:13:44.160 --> 0:13:45.600
<v Speaker 2>of that. I was fucking a man first.

0:13:45.640 --> 0:13:47.640
<v Speaker 1>But do you think that's a reason to be blocked.

0:13:48.320 --> 0:13:53.520
<v Speaker 2>Well, that's not the part. It's a more complicated story.

0:13:53.559 --> 0:13:56.880
<v Speaker 2>But I will say, you know, it was a lot

0:13:56.920 --> 0:14:03.240
<v Speaker 2>of gray area. There's a situation. I don't I don't

0:14:03.280 --> 0:14:05.560
<v Speaker 2>move that much over boys, Like why over a boy?

0:14:05.679 --> 0:14:07.520
<v Speaker 1>Over a boy? I really feel like we can have

0:14:07.559 --> 0:14:09.160
<v Speaker 1>a if we're friends, we can have a conversation.

0:14:09.520 --> 0:14:13.400
<v Speaker 2>Well, we weren't really friends and you are according to me,

0:14:13.559 --> 0:14:15.760
<v Speaker 2>we weren't friends according to them.

0:14:16.400 --> 0:14:19.200
<v Speaker 1>That's interesting. What do you classify as a friend.

0:14:20.000 --> 0:14:23.280
<v Speaker 2>Do we hang out like it could be even in

0:14:23.320 --> 0:14:25.680
<v Speaker 2>a group setting, like, or do we hang out? Do

0:14:25.760 --> 0:14:28.160
<v Speaker 2>we talk to each other like outside of running into

0:14:28.200 --> 0:14:34.800
<v Speaker 2>each other? Do you like call me? Do we like

0:14:35.520 --> 0:14:39.640
<v Speaker 2>intentionally spend time with time? Yes, if we don't do

0:14:39.760 --> 0:14:43.200
<v Speaker 2>those things and we just like are like high and

0:14:43.200 --> 0:14:45.280
<v Speaker 2>by when we see each other, like we're just like.

0:14:45.320 --> 0:14:48.560
<v Speaker 1>Cool, We're we're acquaintances and like I can.

0:14:48.440 --> 0:14:52.560
<v Speaker 2>Be friends with people like like more on the peripheral, Like,

0:14:52.640 --> 0:14:56.320
<v Speaker 2>but yes, if I'm not, if I don't have moments

0:14:56.360 --> 0:14:58.920
<v Speaker 2>where I'm connecting with you on an intimate level, and

0:14:59.040 --> 0:15:01.640
<v Speaker 2>every time I've seen you has been like running into

0:15:01.680 --> 0:15:05.000
<v Speaker 2>you in public, like I wouldn't necessarily classify us as friends.

0:15:05.080 --> 0:15:07.000
<v Speaker 1>I really love that you're saying this, and I think

0:15:07.000 --> 0:15:09.960
<v Speaker 1>that we need to bring bring back acquaintances because I

0:15:10.000 --> 0:15:13.720
<v Speaker 1>do think that like everybody's a friend, especially with social media, right,

0:15:13.760 --> 0:15:16.880
<v Speaker 1>like everybody is a friend. And you're like, no, you

0:15:16.880 --> 0:15:19.840
<v Speaker 1>don't even have my phone number, like you never text

0:15:19.840 --> 0:15:21.840
<v Speaker 1>to see how I'm doing. I never check up on you.

0:15:22.040 --> 0:15:23.520
<v Speaker 1>I don't know what's going on in your life if

0:15:23.520 --> 0:15:27.000
<v Speaker 1>it's not on the internet, So that wouldn't be a

0:15:27.040 --> 0:15:30.320
<v Speaker 1>friend to me. We're friendly, right, but we're not friends.

0:15:30.400 --> 0:15:33.880
<v Speaker 1>But but sometimes I do think people will try to

0:15:33.960 --> 0:15:37.280
<v Speaker 1>hold you to friends standards when you're only friendly, and

0:15:37.320 --> 0:15:38.680
<v Speaker 1>that gets confusing.

0:15:38.840 --> 0:15:41.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, well, I hope it.

0:15:42.120 --> 0:15:44.000
<v Speaker 1>You don't seem too pressed about it, but I hope

0:15:44.000 --> 0:15:50.280
<v Speaker 1>it's no you tried. I saw you look off to

0:15:50.360 --> 0:15:52.880
<v Speaker 1>try and be pressed, and you said, well, no, I'm

0:15:52.880 --> 0:15:53.480
<v Speaker 1>not gonna go there.

0:15:53.480 --> 0:15:56.040
<v Speaker 2>Okay, I love it.

0:16:01.040 --> 0:16:02.200
<v Speaker 1>Do you want to do some messy mail?

0:16:02.680 --> 0:16:03.000
<v Speaker 2>Sure?

0:16:03.440 --> 0:16:08.640
<v Speaker 1>Lovely? Okay, Patrons, As always, your submissions remain anonymous. So

0:16:08.760 --> 0:16:11.720
<v Speaker 1>this first one says ex's friend is hitting me up,

0:16:11.840 --> 0:16:14.120
<v Speaker 1>told myself, be the mess you wish to see in

0:16:14.200 --> 0:16:14.720
<v Speaker 1>the world.

0:16:14.920 --> 0:16:22.080
<v Speaker 2>It's on. Wow, your ex's friends are they still friends?

0:16:22.520 --> 0:16:23.640
<v Speaker 1>The excess friend?

0:16:23.760 --> 0:16:29.800
<v Speaker 2>Yeah? Friends still friends? That's messy me personally, like for

0:16:30.000 --> 0:16:33.280
<v Speaker 2>a fleeing maybe like And now I know people might

0:16:33.280 --> 0:16:36.240
<v Speaker 2>think that this is controversial, but like, I mean no,

0:16:36.440 --> 0:16:39.320
<v Speaker 2>because frankly, if you would do another bitch greasy, you

0:16:39.320 --> 0:16:40.920
<v Speaker 2>would do me greasy too.

0:16:41.640 --> 0:16:44.040
<v Speaker 1>Well, like if you had like a no attachment, you're like, ill,

0:16:44.040 --> 0:16:44.960
<v Speaker 1>fuck you, but like.

0:16:44.880 --> 0:16:48.120
<v Speaker 2>There's no Yeah, I mean it's just a little different different,

0:16:48.680 --> 0:16:51.720
<v Speaker 2>But I would like it's more so the question around

0:16:51.720 --> 0:16:54.880
<v Speaker 2>that X in their connection to their friends. It's weird.

0:16:55.120 --> 0:16:55.600
<v Speaker 2>Why I'd be.

0:16:55.560 --> 0:16:58.120
<v Speaker 1>Curious, like why you wishing out to me? Yeah, like

0:16:58.320 --> 0:17:00.520
<v Speaker 1>that's your friend, why you reaching out?

0:17:00.960 --> 0:17:01.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah?

0:17:01.720 --> 0:17:02.920
<v Speaker 1>And then I don't want that karma.

0:17:03.360 --> 0:17:07.560
<v Speaker 2>I'm thinking of all of my uh ex's friends, like

0:17:07.880 --> 0:17:10.000
<v Speaker 2>any of them reach out to me. I'm just I

0:17:10.040 --> 0:17:12.280
<v Speaker 2>wouldn't have anything very much to say.

0:17:12.800 --> 0:17:15.120
<v Speaker 1>You know what, I'm now that you think. I did

0:17:15.160 --> 0:17:18.639
<v Speaker 1>have one of my friends his ex reached out to

0:17:18.680 --> 0:17:22.360
<v Speaker 1>my best friend and we were all like, mmmm, coral

0:17:22.760 --> 0:17:25.320
<v Speaker 1>you played but nothing happened. But it was one of

0:17:25.320 --> 0:17:28.359
<v Speaker 1>those where like, oh, you greet your dirty for that,

0:17:28.480 --> 0:17:29.119
<v Speaker 1>Like why would you?

0:17:29.800 --> 0:17:33.560
<v Speaker 2>I actually had an ex friend reach out to an

0:17:33.560 --> 0:17:37.160
<v Speaker 2>ex of mine, like on one of the apps from

0:17:37.200 --> 0:17:43.800
<v Speaker 2>an anonymous page. That's a messy story. Mess that's messy friend.

0:17:44.080 --> 0:17:46.640
<v Speaker 2>But even it's like boy, you could have had the boy.

0:17:46.720 --> 0:17:47.800
<v Speaker 2>All you have to do is ask.

0:17:47.960 --> 0:17:50.040
<v Speaker 1>There are also so many boys, like.

0:17:51.440 --> 0:17:54.640
<v Speaker 2>Please, it's a boy, be serious, it's a boy.

0:17:54.720 --> 0:17:56.600
<v Speaker 1>At the end, of the day. It's a boy. Okay,

0:17:57.280 --> 0:18:00.199
<v Speaker 1>this one says, I'm happily married. However I have the

0:18:00.200 --> 0:18:02.960
<v Speaker 1>biggest gym crush and it's getting more intense. What do

0:18:03.040 --> 0:18:03.320
<v Speaker 1>I do?

0:18:04.160 --> 0:18:10.919
<v Speaker 2>Girl? Going about your day? Gone about your day, especially

0:18:10.960 --> 0:18:14.679
<v Speaker 2>if you're happily married, don't about your day. Do not

0:18:14.760 --> 0:18:16.800
<v Speaker 2>throw away your life for some fantasy.

0:18:17.400 --> 0:18:21.080
<v Speaker 1>Serious, honestly, that's that's tee, that's key. It's a fantasy.

0:18:21.320 --> 0:18:23.920
<v Speaker 1>And Jim crush fantasies are the best. And I love

0:18:23.960 --> 0:18:26.040
<v Speaker 1>a gym crush. And you have the fantasy of they've

0:18:26.080 --> 0:18:28.880
<v Speaker 1>never had a gym crush, You've never had a hold

0:18:28.880 --> 0:18:31.000
<v Speaker 1>on what do you mean you never had a Jim crush? Like,

0:18:31.040 --> 0:18:32.399
<v Speaker 1>what do you mean like or like a like a

0:18:33.119 --> 0:18:34.520
<v Speaker 1>sport crush or team crush.

0:18:35.280 --> 0:18:37.720
<v Speaker 2>I mean I find people attractive, of course, but it's

0:18:37.760 --> 0:18:39.280
<v Speaker 2>not it's just like in passing it.

0:18:39.880 --> 0:18:42.200
<v Speaker 1>But that's a Jim crush. I know that Jim crush

0:18:42.280 --> 0:18:42.840
<v Speaker 1>is in passing.

0:18:43.160 --> 0:18:45.919
<v Speaker 2>It's like I don't like that person is cute. Yeah,

0:18:46.320 --> 0:18:49.680
<v Speaker 2>that's a crush out of mind, don't give it.

0:18:50.160 --> 0:18:52.359
<v Speaker 1>It's just somebody that you see repeatedly that you're like,

0:18:52.400 --> 0:18:55.200
<v Speaker 1>oh they're cute, like a work crush, like.

0:18:56.359 --> 0:18:59.440
<v Speaker 2>I mean, the thought comes the first time and then

0:18:59.440 --> 0:19:02.679
<v Speaker 2>it's just like, okay, yeah, are you smooth?

0:19:02.680 --> 0:19:03.480
<v Speaker 1>It just rolls off.

0:19:03.640 --> 0:19:04.240
<v Speaker 2>Is it smooth?

0:19:04.640 --> 0:19:07.240
<v Speaker 1>I mean, I guess like I'm I'm be pressed about

0:19:07.240 --> 0:19:09.720
<v Speaker 1>my I'd be like, look at it, I'm lifting it

0:19:09.720 --> 0:19:10.320
<v Speaker 1>a little more.

0:19:10.800 --> 0:19:12.600
<v Speaker 2>I'd be pressed. But it takes a lot to get

0:19:12.600 --> 0:19:13.760
<v Speaker 2>me there. I'll tell you that much.

0:19:13.840 --> 0:19:16.040
<v Speaker 1>What gets you pressed, Like what does the person have

0:19:16.119 --> 0:19:17.199
<v Speaker 1>to do or how does it have to be?

0:19:17.840 --> 0:19:19.040
<v Speaker 2>I like a sensitive man?

0:19:19.240 --> 0:19:22.960
<v Speaker 1>Oh real bad, You're like a soft little tender m m.

0:19:24.240 --> 0:19:27.360
<v Speaker 1>How do you know they're sensitive? Like they they asked

0:19:27.359 --> 0:19:29.960
<v Speaker 1>you what your daying like? What what constitutes a sensitive.

0:19:29.880 --> 0:19:33.680
<v Speaker 2>Someone who is like, uh, one not afraid to express

0:19:33.720 --> 0:19:37.679
<v Speaker 2>themselves emotionally, but the full range of emotion and someone

0:19:37.720 --> 0:19:40.240
<v Speaker 2>who is like intentional about how they care for the

0:19:40.280 --> 0:19:44.280
<v Speaker 2>people around them. That turns me, oh jesus wow.

0:19:45.560 --> 0:19:49.119
<v Speaker 1>I love your standards. I love your standards. There are

0:19:49.600 --> 0:19:55.239
<v Speaker 1>never lower them. I on the other hand, I love

0:20:00.040 --> 0:20:03.359
<v Speaker 1>I do love, I do love a sensitive man. I

0:20:03.400 --> 0:20:05.800
<v Speaker 1>do have a lot of gym crushes, and I, you know,

0:20:06.080 --> 0:20:09.360
<v Speaker 1>a new one every time, and I kind of look

0:20:09.440 --> 0:20:11.680
<v Speaker 1>for them. I seek out a gym crush. It's just

0:20:12.040 --> 0:20:14.119
<v Speaker 1>fun to me for the hour that I'm there. I

0:20:14.119 --> 0:20:16.760
<v Speaker 1>love finding people to be attracted to. I love trying

0:20:16.800 --> 0:20:19.320
<v Speaker 1>to impress them with how run fast, how much? How

0:20:19.320 --> 0:20:22.080
<v Speaker 1>long I stay on the stairstupper because I'm not running

0:20:22.119 --> 0:20:24.919
<v Speaker 1>on nobody's trying to the stairstepper, getting of ask and

0:20:24.960 --> 0:20:29.679
<v Speaker 1>I want them to see it. But they also stressed

0:20:29.680 --> 0:20:32.240
<v Speaker 1>me out. I had one of my gym crushes, this

0:20:32.320 --> 0:20:35.359
<v Speaker 1>is months ago, finally walked up to me and like

0:20:35.560 --> 0:20:38.359
<v Speaker 1>said hi to me, but then he thought I was

0:20:38.359 --> 0:20:41.679
<v Speaker 1>somebody else. He thought. He was like get he like named,

0:20:42.320 --> 0:20:44.800
<v Speaker 1>He's like, You're I just I said, hey, I'm Brandon.

0:20:44.880 --> 0:20:47.040
<v Speaker 1>He was like, oh I thought you were and he

0:20:47.080 --> 0:20:47.719
<v Speaker 1>said another name.

0:20:47.800 --> 0:20:48.119
<v Speaker 2>I was like.

0:20:49.800 --> 0:20:54.520
<v Speaker 1>Devastating him and I never did and I never did

0:20:54.760 --> 0:20:56.880
<v Speaker 1>hardly because I never saw him again. But if I did,

0:20:56.920 --> 0:20:58.679
<v Speaker 1>I would never talk to him again, because don't you

0:20:58.720 --> 0:21:05.280
<v Speaker 1>fucking my name like that. This one says my BF

0:21:05.359 --> 0:21:08.040
<v Speaker 1>cheated and I gave him a second chance, And I'm

0:21:08.040 --> 0:21:10.160
<v Speaker 1>gonna couple that with another one that says girlfriend told

0:21:10.200 --> 0:21:12.280
<v Speaker 1>me she wanted to just be friends with a person

0:21:12.680 --> 0:21:15.440
<v Speaker 1>and ended up fucking them while I was away, And

0:21:15.520 --> 0:21:17.320
<v Speaker 1>so I'm using both of those. So we can talk

0:21:17.359 --> 0:21:21.560
<v Speaker 1>about cheating and where should we jump into cheating? Well,

0:21:21.600 --> 0:21:23.560
<v Speaker 1>let's start with this first question, which is I gave

0:21:23.600 --> 0:21:26.800
<v Speaker 1>him a second chance. Do you think giving people a

0:21:26.840 --> 0:21:31.359
<v Speaker 1>second chance after cheating is okay?

0:21:31.400 --> 0:21:31.480
<v Speaker 2>Not?

0:21:31.680 --> 0:21:34.960
<v Speaker 1>Okay? What are your feelings? What's your stance on it?

0:21:35.760 --> 0:21:38.200
<v Speaker 2>Life has taught me a lot about this question. Okay.

0:21:38.840 --> 0:21:41.560
<v Speaker 2>I can give you a therapeutic answer, or I can

0:21:41.600 --> 0:21:45.480
<v Speaker 2>give you my answer. She's a therat I've learned. Here's

0:21:45.480 --> 0:21:45.920
<v Speaker 2>what I want.

0:21:45.960 --> 0:21:48.440
<v Speaker 1>I want the therapist answer first, and then I want

0:21:48.440 --> 0:21:49.120
<v Speaker 1>your answer.

0:21:49.320 --> 0:21:54.000
<v Speaker 2>Okay. So the therapist's answer is that conflict can be overcame

0:21:54.119 --> 0:21:57.399
<v Speaker 2>in any connection. It will take a lot of dedication

0:21:57.880 --> 0:22:01.200
<v Speaker 2>and a lot of rebuilding of trust, which is possible.

0:22:01.600 --> 0:22:04.320
<v Speaker 2>It just takes two people who are dedicated to doing that.

0:22:04.560 --> 0:22:08.400
<v Speaker 2>The person who committed the violation of trust, they will

0:22:08.400 --> 0:22:10.600
<v Speaker 2>have to go about a lot of changes to re

0:22:10.640 --> 0:22:13.240
<v Speaker 2>earn that trust, and you, the person who is violated,

0:22:13.280 --> 0:22:15.000
<v Speaker 2>will have to go about a lot of changes to

0:22:15.520 --> 0:22:18.200
<v Speaker 2>open yourself back up to trusting that person. That is

0:22:18.280 --> 0:22:19.119
<v Speaker 2>a therapist answer.

0:22:19.240 --> 0:22:21.760
<v Speaker 1>Wow, that was a very great therapist answer. Okay, And

0:22:21.800 --> 0:22:22.679
<v Speaker 1>now what's your answer?

0:22:23.240 --> 0:22:32.280
<v Speaker 2>Hell? Fuck us? Oh I will say, why is it? Hell,

0:22:32.320 --> 0:22:36.200
<v Speaker 2>don't tell me from my experience. I will say, from

0:22:36.240 --> 0:22:40.480
<v Speaker 2>my personal experience, like sometimes sometimes because I'm not going

0:22:40.560 --> 0:22:43.800
<v Speaker 2>to make too broad of us sweeping statement, sometimes you

0:22:43.840 --> 0:22:47.000
<v Speaker 2>give people permission to mistreat you when they get away

0:22:47.000 --> 0:22:51.040
<v Speaker 2>with it the first time. And that is a lesson

0:22:51.119 --> 0:22:53.359
<v Speaker 2>I wish I could go back and tell younger me

0:22:55.119 --> 0:22:59.000
<v Speaker 2>that is something that cheating comes from a place often

0:22:59.359 --> 0:23:02.760
<v Speaker 2>not always, but often comes from a place where a

0:23:02.800 --> 0:23:06.560
<v Speaker 2>person's integrity is not like aligned with what I like

0:23:07.080 --> 0:23:12.720
<v Speaker 2>a person who I'm into residence integrity to be. Yeah,

0:23:12.760 --> 0:23:16.360
<v Speaker 2>And I learned that lesson the hard way. So I

0:23:16.400 --> 0:23:21.400
<v Speaker 2>personally don't believe that a person who cares about you

0:23:21.440 --> 0:23:23.879
<v Speaker 2>will put you in a predicament where they leave you

0:23:25.280 --> 0:23:30.520
<v Speaker 2>devastated from being violated like that. Personally, yes, but I

0:23:30.520 --> 0:23:33.600
<v Speaker 2>would also reflect within as to why you think that

0:23:33.600 --> 0:23:36.000
<v Speaker 2>that type of treatment is treatment that you should put

0:23:36.040 --> 0:23:36.200
<v Speaker 2>up with.

0:23:36.440 --> 0:23:40.280
<v Speaker 1>Oof, I need a moment. I really dropped a lot

0:23:40.320 --> 0:23:43.959
<v Speaker 1>of bars, truly, didn't I say at the top, like,

0:23:44.080 --> 0:23:50.119
<v Speaker 1>you really really tell it like it is? I am

0:23:50.240 --> 0:23:56.640
<v Speaker 1>you know this. I'm so fascinated by cheating because I'm

0:23:56.680 --> 0:23:59.800
<v Speaker 1>with you. And then I also have like a curiosity

0:23:59.800 --> 0:24:02.720
<v Speaker 1>of out the cheater, because I know so often when

0:24:02.720 --> 0:24:06.000
<v Speaker 1>we talk about cheating, it's very clear, like there's a

0:24:06.080 --> 0:24:08.720
<v Speaker 1>there's a transgression that happened, there's a right and a wrong.

0:24:09.359 --> 0:24:13.480
<v Speaker 1>And I am all like, if if my best friend

0:24:13.520 --> 0:24:16.920
<v Speaker 1>got cheated on, I would absolutely say leave them in hell,

0:24:17.400 --> 0:24:20.440
<v Speaker 1>and actually, in fact, you go check out. I will

0:24:20.440 --> 0:24:21.760
<v Speaker 1>handle this, you know what I'm saying, Like, I I

0:24:22.480 --> 0:24:25.119
<v Speaker 1>recognize that. But then I'm also I guess there's a

0:24:25.160 --> 0:24:29.720
<v Speaker 1>side of me that is curious about the cheater why

0:24:29.760 --> 0:24:33.200
<v Speaker 1>it happened, because some people just don't give a fuck.

0:24:33.520 --> 0:24:38.760
<v Speaker 1>But then there are those cases where trauma got the

0:24:38.760 --> 0:24:45.640
<v Speaker 1>best of somebody, where their baggage or the the self sabotage,

0:24:45.800 --> 0:24:50.719
<v Speaker 1>the inability to hold love or retain love, the fear

0:24:51.000 --> 0:24:54.880
<v Speaker 1>of the relationship getting deeper, the fe like all those

0:24:54.880 --> 0:24:56.760
<v Speaker 1>things act up. Now, that doesn't mean that the person

0:24:56.760 --> 0:24:58.960
<v Speaker 1>who's been cheated on should give them a second chance

0:24:59.040 --> 0:25:02.080
<v Speaker 1>or stay like that's totally up to you. But I'm like, oh,

0:25:02.119 --> 0:25:07.679
<v Speaker 1>where is the space to have conversations about people who've cheated,

0:25:09.080 --> 0:25:10.520
<v Speaker 1>Which now leads to me, I wasn't sure I was

0:25:10.520 --> 0:25:14.200
<v Speaker 1>going to share this piece, but I cheated once. And

0:25:15.040 --> 0:25:19.360
<v Speaker 1>I have so much shame around it. I finally told

0:25:19.359 --> 0:25:21.439
<v Speaker 1>my husband about it. It wasn't on my husband, it

0:25:21.440 --> 0:25:24.040
<v Speaker 1>was in a previous relationship, but I I never even

0:25:24.040 --> 0:25:25.680
<v Speaker 1>told him about it. And we've been together for nine years,

0:25:25.680 --> 0:25:27.200
<v Speaker 1>and I finally told him about it a year ago.

0:25:27.760 --> 0:25:29.920
<v Speaker 1>In my defense, the context of this cheating was that

0:25:29.960 --> 0:25:33.440
<v Speaker 1>I was in an emotionally abusive relationship and I did

0:25:33.480 --> 0:25:38.160
<v Speaker 1>not know how to get out. And I remember a

0:25:38.200 --> 0:25:42.439
<v Speaker 1>friend of mine cheated on her partner who I knew,

0:25:42.880 --> 0:25:46.320
<v Speaker 1>and we got lunch together. We were talking about it,

0:25:46.359 --> 0:25:47.720
<v Speaker 1>and she was like, I didn't know how to get

0:25:47.760 --> 0:25:50.240
<v Speaker 1>out of the relationship, and so I cheated because I

0:25:50.320 --> 0:25:52.200
<v Speaker 1>knew there was no way to come back. And then

0:25:52.200 --> 0:25:55.720
<v Speaker 1>a year after that conversation, I found myself unable to

0:25:55.720 --> 0:25:58.119
<v Speaker 1>get out of this relationship, and so I cheated. And

0:25:58.160 --> 0:26:01.320
<v Speaker 1>I never told that partner because I didn't want. I

0:26:01.359 --> 0:26:02.840
<v Speaker 1>knew that if we were to stay together, I'm a

0:26:02.920 --> 0:26:05.600
<v Speaker 1>terrible liar. I'm an awful liar, so I would have

0:26:05.680 --> 0:26:08.560
<v Speaker 1>to tell him. And so my choices were to tell

0:26:08.640 --> 0:26:11.520
<v Speaker 1>him and stay or to end the relationship and get out.

0:26:11.880 --> 0:26:14.040
<v Speaker 1>I ended the relationship and I got out, but I

0:26:14.480 --> 0:26:16.280
<v Speaker 1>just like I think about I don't know, so it

0:26:16.359 --> 0:26:19.960
<v Speaker 1>just like makes me always think about cheating and why

0:26:19.960 --> 0:26:22.239
<v Speaker 1>people are cheating and is there a space to have

0:26:22.320 --> 0:26:25.879
<v Speaker 1>empathy for cheaters, And of course there is, but I

0:26:25.880 --> 0:26:28.760
<v Speaker 1>don't know. Now I'm just rambling about the No.

0:26:28.880 --> 0:26:33.160
<v Speaker 2>I mean, I appreciate you for being vulnerable about that. Yeah,

0:26:33.160 --> 0:26:35.359
<v Speaker 2>I think it's okay to hold both of those troops

0:26:35.400 --> 0:26:38.000
<v Speaker 2>at the same time. Right, somebody can cheat and it

0:26:38.080 --> 0:26:40.800
<v Speaker 2>can come from a place of trauma, and it is

0:26:40.880 --> 0:26:43.840
<v Speaker 2>also trauma inducing for the person on the receiving end

0:26:43.880 --> 0:26:47.960
<v Speaker 2>of Yes, right, both of those things exist at the

0:26:47.960 --> 0:26:51.560
<v Speaker 2>same time. We have a tendency to try and break

0:26:51.600 --> 0:26:55.080
<v Speaker 2>something down to where it can only be one truth,

0:26:55.160 --> 0:27:01.040
<v Speaker 2>but it's multiple. Do I believe that those people deserve empathy? Yeah,

0:27:01.119 --> 0:27:03.680
<v Speaker 2>I know that's controversial because a lot of people are

0:27:03.720 --> 0:27:07.040
<v Speaker 2>like cheaters are all terrible people. Yeah, And it's like, well, no,

0:27:07.160 --> 0:27:09.359
<v Speaker 2>I don't believe that people are disposable, and I believe

0:27:09.400 --> 0:27:11.919
<v Speaker 2>people can learn from these things like I've been cheated

0:27:11.960 --> 0:27:16.600
<v Speaker 2>on yea, and I by no means like like my

0:27:16.720 --> 0:27:19.840
<v Speaker 2>ex who cheated on me? And no, by no means,

0:27:19.840 --> 0:27:23.080
<v Speaker 2>do I have any animosity towards them, Like we've done,

0:27:23.160 --> 0:27:26.560
<v Speaker 2>all the things, we've had, all the conversations. I've moved on.

0:27:27.440 --> 0:27:31.720
<v Speaker 2>Hopefully he's moved on. Yeah, And you can grow from it,

0:27:31.800 --> 0:27:34.600
<v Speaker 2>and hopefully he has grown. He's experienced some more life

0:27:34.680 --> 0:27:38.040
<v Speaker 2>after our relationship. It sounds like he's grown from it,

0:27:38.720 --> 0:27:41.320
<v Speaker 2>and you know, that's great. I wish him all the best.

0:27:41.920 --> 0:27:44.520
<v Speaker 2>The trauma that I endured as a result of being

0:27:45.000 --> 0:27:47.479
<v Speaker 2>cheated on, that was even deeper because it was in

0:27:47.520 --> 0:27:50.919
<v Speaker 2>a public way. But you know, I even have like

0:27:51.480 --> 0:27:54.919
<v Speaker 2>processed that, I've like sat with it, I've grieved it,

0:27:55.000 --> 0:27:58.240
<v Speaker 2>I've let it go, and I'm able to like open

0:27:58.320 --> 0:28:02.320
<v Speaker 2>myself up to probably right now but for separate reasons,

0:28:02.720 --> 0:28:04.679
<v Speaker 2>but like, I was able to open myself up to

0:28:04.840 --> 0:28:08.680
<v Speaker 2>romantic connections after like and I knew that his sheeting

0:28:08.840 --> 0:28:12.360
<v Speaker 2>was a result of him feeling the pressure of the relationship.

0:28:13.160 --> 0:28:15.400
<v Speaker 2>I don't know, I was like, I'll put pressure on him,

0:28:15.480 --> 0:28:19.359
<v Speaker 2>but the relationship itself was pressure. We were talking about

0:28:19.520 --> 0:28:22.840
<v Speaker 2>things like marriage. It was a very public facing relationship.

0:28:23.160 --> 0:28:27.160
<v Speaker 2>That was I think his first time like experiencing having

0:28:27.240 --> 0:28:30.840
<v Speaker 2>so many eyes on him at that time, and I

0:28:30.880 --> 0:28:33.399
<v Speaker 2>think it was just hard. You have all these people

0:28:33.480 --> 0:28:36.840
<v Speaker 2>constantly throwing themselves at you because of who you're dating,

0:28:37.040 --> 0:28:40.000
<v Speaker 2>or like how your relationship is set up. You are

0:28:40.040 --> 0:28:43.440
<v Speaker 2>young and like all that, like, and I understand also,

0:28:43.560 --> 0:28:47.480
<v Speaker 2>like he was struggling and we had these conversations, he

0:28:47.560 --> 0:28:49.800
<v Speaker 2>was struggling to keep up with me, Like I'm a

0:28:49.960 --> 0:28:52.720
<v Speaker 2>very like you know, yeah, I'm a go get it

0:28:55.280 --> 0:28:59.240
<v Speaker 2>maybe I know here on in these streets. And you know,

0:28:59.720 --> 0:29:03.040
<v Speaker 2>while I would, I went really hard for our connection, Like,

0:29:03.120 --> 0:29:06.360
<v Speaker 2>it was still like intimidating for him. Yeah, it was

0:29:06.520 --> 0:29:10.160
<v Speaker 2>fucked up. That part doesn't change. But I don't think

0:29:10.240 --> 0:29:13.440
<v Speaker 2>it was coming from a place of malice to it

0:29:13.560 --> 0:29:15.160
<v Speaker 2>hurt me. He knew it was going to hurt me.

0:29:15.280 --> 0:29:17.360
<v Speaker 2>He did it anyway, So it was fucked It was

0:29:17.400 --> 0:29:20.640
<v Speaker 2>a shitty thing to do. Yeah, and I knew that

0:29:20.680 --> 0:29:23.440
<v Speaker 2>he truly loved and cared about me. He just did

0:29:23.480 --> 0:29:28.000
<v Speaker 2>not know how to process that. And Yeah, for that

0:29:28.120 --> 0:29:32.160
<v Speaker 2>and many other reasons, it's important that people learn how

0:29:32.200 --> 0:29:34.960
<v Speaker 2>to process and deal with their emotions and how to

0:29:35.000 --> 0:29:39.600
<v Speaker 2>communicate effectively before they hop into relationships. We all should

0:29:39.600 --> 0:29:41.160
<v Speaker 2>work on ourselves a little bit, and none of us

0:29:41.160 --> 0:29:44.240
<v Speaker 2>get it right all the time. And we learned through relationships,

0:29:44.920 --> 0:29:47.520
<v Speaker 2>but it's important to keep in mind that it is

0:29:47.600 --> 0:29:52.320
<v Speaker 2>a constant process of reassessing yourself and growing. And if

0:29:52.360 --> 0:29:54.240
<v Speaker 2>he had done that while we were together, if he

0:29:54.320 --> 0:29:57.320
<v Speaker 2>knew how to effectively communicate at the time, I doubt

0:29:57.400 --> 0:29:58.479
<v Speaker 2>that he would have even done that.

0:29:58.920 --> 0:30:03.120
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean, would you say that. I don't know

0:30:03.200 --> 0:30:05.920
<v Speaker 1>if this is true, but I'm wondering if a lot

0:30:05.920 --> 0:30:10.120
<v Speaker 1>of cheating is a result of the inability to communicate clearly,

0:30:10.160 --> 0:30:13.840
<v Speaker 1>also the inability to process. But it's like if you

0:30:13.960 --> 0:30:19.200
<v Speaker 1>don't have I'm curious if you lack, if your communication

0:30:19.320 --> 0:30:24.240
<v Speaker 1>skills are rough, are you more likely to cheat? Or

0:30:24.360 --> 0:30:29.080
<v Speaker 1>it's before the communication, it's the inability to process your

0:30:29.080 --> 0:30:33.480
<v Speaker 1>emotions and then communicate, and that leads to usually.

0:30:33.920 --> 0:30:36.480
<v Speaker 2>I think it's hard to narrow it down to one

0:30:36.800 --> 0:30:40.680
<v Speaker 2>exact expression of it because some people are actually just like,

0:30:41.240 --> 0:30:43.480
<v Speaker 2>very selfish and want to have their cake and eat

0:30:43.640 --> 0:30:48.080
<v Speaker 2>and eat it too. Yeah. Some people literally couldn't emote

0:30:48.080 --> 0:30:51.240
<v Speaker 2>their way out of a paper bag, and you know, seriously,

0:30:52.160 --> 0:30:56.120
<v Speaker 2>And some people are traumatized because of how they were

0:30:56.120 --> 0:30:59.720
<v Speaker 2>conditioned and raised to not be able to express themselves.

0:31:00.200 --> 0:31:03.720
<v Speaker 2>They are afraid of expressing themselves and do horrible things

0:31:03.760 --> 0:31:04.880
<v Speaker 2>to people as a result.

0:31:05.080 --> 0:31:09.959
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I learned over and over again, if you are

0:31:10.000 --> 0:31:12.680
<v Speaker 1>not somebody engaging with your emotions and trying to heal,

0:31:12.720 --> 0:31:17.560
<v Speaker 1>then you are likely going to cause problems. Not that

0:31:17.680 --> 0:31:21.120
<v Speaker 1>like people who are doing that don't also cause problems.

0:31:21.160 --> 0:31:23.400
<v Speaker 1>But I think you're able.

0:31:23.120 --> 0:31:23.640
<v Speaker 2>To cheat it.

0:31:24.360 --> 0:31:32.920
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I cheat it back, though I don't regret that

0:31:34.360 --> 0:31:35.280
<v Speaker 3>I cheat it back.

0:31:36.480 --> 0:31:37.600
<v Speaker 2>Yeah I sure did.

0:31:37.800 --> 0:31:39.240
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, it happens.

0:31:39.360 --> 0:31:42.040
<v Speaker 2>Right, I wouldn't do that in this current iteration of myself.

0:31:42.080 --> 0:31:43.280
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, what thank.

0:31:43.160 --> 0:31:45.280
<v Speaker 1>You for saying it in that way, because I think

0:31:45.280 --> 0:31:49.600
<v Speaker 1>that also there are acknowledging that we are different versions

0:31:49.600 --> 0:31:52.400
<v Speaker 1>of ourselves, and so a version of yourself that wasn't

0:31:52.400 --> 0:31:56.520
<v Speaker 1>able to communicate a process or whatever made different choices

0:31:56.560 --> 0:31:59.240
<v Speaker 1>than the version that you are now. And I think

0:31:59.280 --> 0:32:02.200
<v Speaker 1>giving people this space that if they have cheated, that

0:32:02.280 --> 0:32:05.480
<v Speaker 1>they can have a runway to change. You can leave

0:32:05.480 --> 0:32:08.720
<v Speaker 1>them where you found them, for sure, but like understanding

0:32:08.720 --> 0:32:11.080
<v Speaker 1>that they aren't a bad person.

0:32:11.480 --> 0:32:15.000
<v Speaker 2>Can I also introduce another aspect that I think is

0:32:15.040 --> 0:32:19.360
<v Speaker 2>really important here. Right, I had to develop a politic

0:32:19.440 --> 0:32:23.440
<v Speaker 2>around dating, and I still have this politic, and although

0:32:23.520 --> 0:32:25.840
<v Speaker 2>many people do not have dating politics, it is so

0:32:25.880 --> 0:32:29.080
<v Speaker 2>important to me that when I walk away from a connection,

0:32:29.480 --> 0:32:32.040
<v Speaker 2>like I don't want that person to feel lied, to,

0:32:32.320 --> 0:32:35.960
<v Speaker 2>manipulate it, or controlled, so long as they don't feel

0:32:35.960 --> 0:32:38.640
<v Speaker 2>any of those things from my part, Like I feel

0:32:38.640 --> 0:32:42.920
<v Speaker 2>like I upheld my end of the deal, which requires transparency,

0:32:43.080 --> 0:32:45.960
<v Speaker 2>which is different from being just honest, like being transparent

0:32:46.000 --> 0:32:49.000
<v Speaker 2>and forthcoming with information that is pertinent to that person.

0:32:49.080 --> 0:32:51.600
<v Speaker 1>It's transparent more so like honest is like if you

0:32:51.600 --> 0:32:54.120
<v Speaker 1>ask me a question, I answered exactly, transparent as I'm

0:32:54.160 --> 0:32:55.200
<v Speaker 1>offering exactly.

0:32:55.400 --> 0:32:57.280
<v Speaker 2>You don't have to go digging for information. You know

0:32:57.320 --> 0:33:02.080
<v Speaker 2>what you need to know. Yeah, and that's all trust is. Unfortunately,

0:33:02.480 --> 0:33:05.960
<v Speaker 2>it is very difficult to come across people, at least

0:33:05.960 --> 0:33:09.320
<v Speaker 2>I feel in this state that I exist in, it

0:33:09.360 --> 0:33:13.480
<v Speaker 2>is very hard to come across people who maneuver through

0:33:13.640 --> 0:33:15.840
<v Speaker 2>life in a similar way. But I think that's why

0:33:15.880 --> 0:33:18.720
<v Speaker 2>it's important that we have conversations like this so people know,

0:33:18.800 --> 0:33:21.360
<v Speaker 2>like you should have a politic around this stuff, like

0:33:21.440 --> 0:33:24.560
<v Speaker 2>I practice with how you approach and engage people, and

0:33:24.600 --> 0:33:28.440
<v Speaker 2>not just like romantically, but even in your platonic connections

0:33:28.480 --> 0:33:31.880
<v Speaker 2>and your business connections and all your connections, like people

0:33:31.920 --> 0:33:34.480
<v Speaker 2>should feel at least that's my goal.

0:33:34.640 --> 0:33:39.480
<v Speaker 1>I agree. I agree. I think it's like people think

0:33:39.480 --> 0:33:43.480
<v Speaker 1>they should be nice and good, but I think it's

0:33:43.520 --> 0:33:46.400
<v Speaker 1>so helpful to hear like I have a politic around

0:33:46.440 --> 0:33:49.320
<v Speaker 1>how I show up with people and articulating that so

0:33:49.360 --> 0:33:51.880
<v Speaker 1>that you can also check yourself and make sure, like

0:33:51.960 --> 0:33:56.160
<v Speaker 1>am I living up to the standards that I'm setting

0:33:56.200 --> 0:33:58.240
<v Speaker 1>for myself with the expectations that I have for myself.

0:34:05.200 --> 0:34:07.240
<v Speaker 1>Both of these people who're written on have been cheated on.

0:34:08.080 --> 0:34:10.319
<v Speaker 1>So we've talked about the cheater and trying to make

0:34:10.360 --> 0:34:14.920
<v Speaker 1>space for you know, empathy around why somebody cheats. But

0:34:14.920 --> 0:34:18.520
<v Speaker 1>then if you've been cheated on, what is the I

0:34:18.560 --> 0:34:20.520
<v Speaker 1>guess what is the context in what you take somebody

0:34:20.560 --> 0:34:23.720
<v Speaker 1>back or what is what do you think that person

0:34:23.760 --> 0:34:27.480
<v Speaker 1>should be considering if they are thinking about a second chance.

0:34:28.000 --> 0:34:31.319
<v Speaker 2>Well, I will say, like cheating even looks different in

0:34:31.400 --> 0:34:34.960
<v Speaker 2>every connection, Like there are people who are even cool

0:34:35.080 --> 0:34:38.520
<v Speaker 2>like probably people who are cool with like seeing multiple people. Yes, right,

0:34:38.760 --> 0:34:41.640
<v Speaker 2>but if you don't communicate or express that like and

0:34:41.719 --> 0:34:43.800
<v Speaker 2>you do it like in a way that is behind

0:34:43.960 --> 0:34:46.399
<v Speaker 2>the person's fact, that's cheating in that connection. Right, Yes,

0:34:46.520 --> 0:34:49.319
<v Speaker 2>So first, like you should establish what cheating means and

0:34:49.360 --> 0:34:52.279
<v Speaker 2>your connection, and I think a lot of people to

0:34:52.360 --> 0:34:53.960
<v Speaker 2>the credit, I think a lot of people do it,

0:34:54.040 --> 0:34:56.440
<v Speaker 2>but I think there are enough people that don't wear it.

0:34:56.520 --> 0:34:59.200
<v Speaker 2>There's often like a lot of clashing when it comes

0:34:59.280 --> 0:35:02.239
<v Speaker 2>to like figuring out what that means. I like to

0:35:02.280 --> 0:35:05.399
<v Speaker 2>have conversations very early in relationships about what that looks

0:35:05.440 --> 0:35:06.720
<v Speaker 2>like in that So.

0:35:06.840 --> 0:35:08.719
<v Speaker 1>I've never done that, but I think that's so like

0:35:08.760 --> 0:35:10.880
<v Speaker 1>what do we do? What do we in this relationship

0:35:10.920 --> 0:35:13.920
<v Speaker 1>define cheating ass because some people say, oh, you're dming.

0:35:13.960 --> 0:35:16.440
<v Speaker 1>Somebody is cheating to me, and some people say, I

0:35:16.480 --> 0:35:17.920
<v Speaker 1>don't give a fuck about your DMS.

0:35:18.080 --> 0:35:18.799
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but like.

0:35:19.320 --> 0:35:23.200
<v Speaker 1>Knowing that is so important, Okay, yes, great, So defining.

0:35:22.719 --> 0:35:27.439
<v Speaker 2>That yeah, and like part of like and I'm really

0:35:27.480 --> 0:35:30.719
<v Speaker 2>big on this, like shared definitions, Like it's how we

0:35:30.800 --> 0:35:33.600
<v Speaker 2>keep each other accountable, Like if you know what is happening,

0:35:33.640 --> 0:35:35.960
<v Speaker 2>Like if we both agree that this is the thing,

0:35:36.680 --> 0:35:39.080
<v Speaker 2>if you violate that thing that we both define, then

0:35:39.120 --> 0:35:46.399
<v Speaker 2>you are like violating the contract clear and like when

0:35:46.600 --> 0:35:50.160
<v Speaker 2>it comes to repair after rupture. For me, one thing

0:35:50.160 --> 0:35:54.719
<v Speaker 2>that is really really important is remorse. And I like,

0:35:54.840 --> 0:35:58.640
<v Speaker 2>I trust me. I've had these conversations with Jesus. If

0:35:58.640 --> 0:36:03.799
<v Speaker 2>somebody violates my trust. One, are they remorseful? Yeah, And

0:36:04.200 --> 0:36:07.839
<v Speaker 2>expressing remorse is just the first step. What are they

0:36:07.840 --> 0:36:11.239
<v Speaker 2>willing to do to remedy? Like what what harm they've caused? Like,

0:36:11.239 --> 0:36:14.279
<v Speaker 2>how are they willing to change behavior? Or what are

0:36:14.280 --> 0:36:16.880
<v Speaker 2>they willing to like to do in order to like

0:36:17.480 --> 0:36:22.080
<v Speaker 2>basically address the rupture that they caused. Are they actually

0:36:22.120 --> 0:36:25.000
<v Speaker 2>putting in the effort to do that? Yeah? Yeah, and

0:36:25.120 --> 0:36:29.080
<v Speaker 2>you should not. My own personal experience has taught me this.

0:36:29.160 --> 0:36:30.920
<v Speaker 2>So this is my opinion. You don't have to live

0:36:30.960 --> 0:36:33.840
<v Speaker 2>by this. But I feel like I should never have

0:36:33.960 --> 0:36:38.359
<v Speaker 2>to instruct someone like or like prompt someone to try

0:36:38.360 --> 0:36:42.200
<v Speaker 2>and repair connection, because if that person is not eager

0:36:42.239 --> 0:36:45.719
<v Speaker 2>to try and do that on their own, that is

0:36:45.960 --> 0:36:46.720
<v Speaker 2>enough of a sign.

0:36:46.960 --> 0:36:50.040
<v Speaker 1>You doin that that makes sense, that's fair. Like if

0:36:50.040 --> 0:36:52.520
<v Speaker 1>they violated something, they know they violated something, they need

0:36:52.560 --> 0:36:56.000
<v Speaker 1>to come kiss the ring if you will not, even

0:36:56.560 --> 0:37:01.759
<v Speaker 1>like they need to be showing remorse and proactive about

0:37:02.040 --> 0:37:04.360
<v Speaker 1>the repair that it's not on the person who's been

0:37:04.440 --> 0:37:08.279
<v Speaker 1>violated shoulders to be like, this is how we repair this?

0:37:08.480 --> 0:37:12.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, do the work. And what I will say is

0:37:13.719 --> 0:37:16.320
<v Speaker 2>and it's really hard, and trust me, I've been on

0:37:16.800 --> 0:37:19.640
<v Speaker 2>the receiving end of this, and it has been really difficult,

0:37:20.239 --> 0:37:23.960
<v Speaker 2>and I didn't walk away in instances where I should have.

0:37:24.480 --> 0:37:27.480
<v Speaker 2>You really do have to dig deep, deep, deep, deep

0:37:27.560 --> 0:37:31.120
<v Speaker 2>down and try and find like that like self worth

0:37:31.200 --> 0:37:34.880
<v Speaker 2>when it comes to navigating these situations. Yeah, because ultimately,

0:37:35.280 --> 0:37:39.239
<v Speaker 2>like why why are you accept if a person is

0:37:39.280 --> 0:37:41.920
<v Speaker 2>not doing the things to try and repair, why are

0:37:41.960 --> 0:37:46.400
<v Speaker 2>you accepting this behavior? Right? But also like when you

0:37:46.440 --> 0:37:49.800
<v Speaker 2>take someone back if they violate again, like the behavior

0:37:49.840 --> 0:37:52.440
<v Speaker 2>didn't change. Yeah, just saying.

0:37:52.400 --> 0:37:55.040
<v Speaker 1>It's like I thought about like the Maya Angela quote

0:37:55.040 --> 0:37:56.680
<v Speaker 1>when somebody shows you who they are believed in the

0:37:56.719 --> 0:38:02.400
<v Speaker 1>first time, which kind of goes against the second chance

0:38:02.480 --> 0:38:05.680
<v Speaker 1>thing because there's a space in which you have empathy

0:38:05.719 --> 0:38:08.279
<v Speaker 1>and say, okay, like my partner was experiencing S Y

0:38:08.320 --> 0:38:09.960
<v Speaker 1>and Z, and I understand why they did it, and

0:38:09.960 --> 0:38:12.040
<v Speaker 1>so like I can give them a second chance, but

0:38:12.080 --> 0:38:15.480
<v Speaker 1>then if they do it again, then it's like, well,

0:38:15.560 --> 0:38:16.319
<v Speaker 1>the thing is a thing.

0:38:17.640 --> 0:38:20.719
<v Speaker 2>Love Cardi for example, Cardi B like she put up

0:38:20.719 --> 0:38:21.360
<v Speaker 2>with a lot of that.

0:38:22.200 --> 0:38:25.440
<v Speaker 1>I think about her often in this topic because I'm like,

0:38:25.480 --> 0:38:28.440
<v Speaker 1>oh wow, this like I think about her specifically because

0:38:29.200 --> 0:38:32.200
<v Speaker 1>you see her as this what she is. She's on

0:38:32.239 --> 0:38:37.799
<v Speaker 1>top of her game, incredibly powerful, beautiful, funny, talented, but

0:38:37.960 --> 0:38:40.319
<v Speaker 1>there is this cycle in which she is.

0:38:40.800 --> 0:38:42.440
<v Speaker 2>It can happen to any other of us.

0:38:43.280 --> 0:38:45.360
<v Speaker 1>We're all in our we can all be in our cycles,

0:38:45.400 --> 0:38:49.600
<v Speaker 1>and hopefully, I don't know, hopefully there's amends to be made.

0:38:49.640 --> 0:38:53.040
<v Speaker 1>But if we continue to go back into the cycle,

0:38:53.160 --> 0:38:55.759
<v Speaker 1>then it's a matter of like, well what is We

0:38:55.800 --> 0:38:58.160
<v Speaker 1>can appear to have our self worth together, but what

0:38:58.320 --> 0:38:59.920
<v Speaker 1>is actually going on beneath the surface.

0:39:01.000 --> 0:39:03.719
<v Speaker 2>And that is where I think, like this like the

0:39:03.760 --> 0:39:06.799
<v Speaker 2>soul search and commences, right, you have to like determine,

0:39:07.080 --> 0:39:10.879
<v Speaker 2>like and I'm specifically a trauma therapist, like I do EMDR,

0:39:11.880 --> 0:39:17.600
<v Speaker 2>so like sometimes happen that EMDR is an acronymic stands

0:39:17.600 --> 0:39:22.560
<v Speaker 2>for eye movement, Desensitization and reprocessing therapy. It is a

0:39:22.760 --> 0:39:27.480
<v Speaker 2>therapeutic model that is bottom up processing that uses bilateral

0:39:27.520 --> 0:39:31.799
<v Speaker 2>stimulation fancy word for activating both sides your brain, either

0:39:31.840 --> 0:39:35.960
<v Speaker 2>through tapping or eye movement is supposed to replicate, like

0:39:36.040 --> 0:39:38.640
<v Speaker 2>your brain when it's in rim sleep, like you know,

0:39:38.640 --> 0:39:41.080
<v Speaker 2>when your eyes are darting back and forth, because that

0:39:41.280 --> 0:39:45.080
<v Speaker 2>is theorized where memory is processed. So when you activate

0:39:45.120 --> 0:39:48.480
<v Speaker 2>both sides of your brain when you are going through

0:39:48.600 --> 0:39:53.640
<v Speaker 2>and processing traumatic memories. It helps you to process quicker.

0:39:54.719 --> 0:39:58.520
<v Speaker 2>So I have watched people in the span of minutes

0:39:58.560 --> 0:40:00.520
<v Speaker 2>like process like years trauma.

0:40:00.880 --> 0:40:01.280
<v Speaker 1>Wow.

0:40:02.120 --> 0:40:05.040
<v Speaker 2>So when I do like what I do, like I

0:40:05.040 --> 0:40:07.480
<v Speaker 2>have seen people really go back to the route and

0:40:07.560 --> 0:40:09.840
<v Speaker 2>things come up, like memories that you don't even remember

0:40:09.880 --> 0:40:12.440
<v Speaker 2>that you remember. Like I see people go back to

0:40:12.480 --> 0:40:15.239
<v Speaker 2>the root where they were first heartbroken, where they were

0:40:15.239 --> 0:40:17.920
<v Speaker 2>first taught that they are not lovable, when they were

0:40:17.920 --> 0:40:21.239
<v Speaker 2>first rejected. You know, I've done it myself. Yeah, And

0:40:21.320 --> 0:40:24.359
<v Speaker 2>I think, like what I compel anyone who is in

0:40:24.400 --> 0:40:27.839
<v Speaker 2>a situation where they have been violated, their trust has

0:40:27.880 --> 0:40:32.400
<v Speaker 2>been violated, someone has like disrespected like their their trust,

0:40:34.120 --> 0:40:37.880
<v Speaker 2>go back like who taught you this first? Is this

0:40:37.960 --> 0:40:39.480
<v Speaker 2>how you want to live for the rest of your life?

0:40:40.880 --> 0:40:41.800
<v Speaker 2>I found that I do not.

0:40:42.840 --> 0:40:46.040
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Well, when you put it like that, it in

0:40:46.120 --> 0:40:49.960
<v Speaker 1>some ways it becomes that much clearer. It's like such

0:40:50.000 --> 0:40:52.600
<v Speaker 1>a you know, like when I think, when you're navigating

0:40:52.719 --> 0:40:56.799
<v Speaker 1>the upset, it can be so grand mightey because it's

0:40:56.800 --> 0:40:59.640
<v Speaker 1>somebody you love and like we have all these years

0:40:59.640 --> 0:41:02.799
<v Speaker 1>together and it's time together, and I don't feel's. But

0:41:02.800 --> 0:41:04.799
<v Speaker 1>then when you break it down and it's like, but

0:41:04.960 --> 0:41:08.040
<v Speaker 1>is this how do you like, do you feel worthy

0:41:08.200 --> 0:41:09.759
<v Speaker 1>or not? Is this something that you want to put

0:41:09.840 --> 0:41:11.360
<v Speaker 1>up with for the rest of your life or not?

0:41:12.000 --> 0:41:18.320
<v Speaker 1>Is this a rupture that doesn't not even uh? Is

0:41:18.360 --> 0:41:20.680
<v Speaker 1>this a rupture that existed before you were even in

0:41:20.719 --> 0:41:23.520
<v Speaker 1>this relationship? Like is this something that needs to be

0:41:23.640 --> 0:41:26.680
<v Speaker 1>healed in you that would actually maybe move you away

0:41:26.680 --> 0:41:28.840
<v Speaker 1>from this person in general because it has something to

0:41:28.880 --> 0:41:33.080
<v Speaker 1>do with them? Are I think it also in many

0:41:33.120 --> 0:41:36.080
<v Speaker 1>ways gives you back the power that was taken from

0:41:36.120 --> 0:41:39.799
<v Speaker 1>you by the transgression. Absolutely, because I think that, like,

0:41:40.960 --> 0:41:44.600
<v Speaker 1>if you want to give somebody a second chance, fine,

0:41:44.840 --> 0:41:48.160
<v Speaker 1>but I feel like, do it with intention, and do

0:41:48.239 --> 0:41:50.759
<v Speaker 1>it with your eyes open, and do it with like

0:41:51.440 --> 0:41:54.360
<v Speaker 1>having done your work, Like, Okay, they've done what they did.

0:41:54.480 --> 0:41:56.200
<v Speaker 1>Let me take my time and figure out what the

0:41:56.200 --> 0:41:58.400
<v Speaker 1>fuck this is so that when I come back to

0:41:58.440 --> 0:41:59.520
<v Speaker 1>the table, I'm doing it.

0:41:59.440 --> 0:42:03.879
<v Speaker 2>For amen, Theresa. You know I love the eyes open part.

0:42:04.160 --> 0:42:06.400
<v Speaker 2>Wi your eyes open? Yes, you hate that.

0:42:06.680 --> 0:42:09.600
<v Speaker 1>Thank you Listen, You've been eating this all the time,

0:42:09.640 --> 0:42:10.400
<v Speaker 1>so I just catch it.

0:42:11.120 --> 0:42:12.920
<v Speaker 2>Thank you for being here, thank you for having me,

0:42:13.640 --> 0:42:15.840
<v Speaker 2>Thank you bye bye.

0:42:25.400 --> 0:42:28.240
<v Speaker 1>Well, you know we're hose here, but hose with heart.

0:42:28.360 --> 0:42:30.840
<v Speaker 1>So before we get out of here, let me speak

0:42:30.960 --> 0:42:37.240
<v Speaker 1>to yours ha Shahim is a true gem, a true angel,

0:42:37.440 --> 0:42:43.839
<v Speaker 1>and that conversation was just so nourishing. Some of my

0:42:43.880 --> 0:42:48.839
<v Speaker 1>favorite takeaways and reminders are, you know, no one is disposable,

0:42:49.840 --> 0:42:53.839
<v Speaker 1>and so as we talk about cheating or cheaters, there's

0:42:53.880 --> 0:42:58.279
<v Speaker 1>such there's you know, there's always such a black and

0:42:58.320 --> 0:43:02.640
<v Speaker 1>white binary look at it, such a moral high stance

0:43:02.719 --> 0:43:05.960
<v Speaker 1>or moral high ground about who the cheater is without

0:43:06.000 --> 0:43:12.239
<v Speaker 1>any kind of reflection or empathy. Which listen, the person

0:43:12.280 --> 0:43:14.960
<v Speaker 1>who's been cheated on, I'm not saying it's your time

0:43:15.040 --> 0:43:18.920
<v Speaker 1>to be empathetic, you know, like you've been violated, you've

0:43:19.160 --> 0:43:23.160
<v Speaker 1>managed that. But culturally, as we look at the conversation

0:43:23.320 --> 0:43:26.600
<v Speaker 1>around cheating and cheaters or people who have cheated, rather

0:43:27.920 --> 0:43:31.200
<v Speaker 1>instead of naming them a cheater, a person who has cheated,

0:43:32.360 --> 0:43:34.320
<v Speaker 1>you know, because as I'm saying that, I'm thinking about

0:43:34.320 --> 0:43:37.880
<v Speaker 1>like once a cheat, always a cheater, like that, some

0:43:37.960 --> 0:43:41.319
<v Speaker 1>of that language is really toxic because it removes the

0:43:41.440 --> 0:43:48.600
<v Speaker 1>humanity of the person. It completely ignores their history, their trauma,

0:43:48.640 --> 0:43:51.640
<v Speaker 1>their baggage. That can also be influencing the decisions that

0:43:51.680 --> 0:43:54.839
<v Speaker 1>they've made. Again, it's not to excuse it, but we

0:43:54.960 --> 0:43:58.279
<v Speaker 1>want to understand right, We want to have compassion and

0:43:58.320 --> 0:44:02.759
<v Speaker 1>it completely. It has a sense that, like everyone has

0:44:02.800 --> 0:44:06.440
<v Speaker 1>to be perfect right and perfection, perfectionism is a fallacy,

0:44:07.160 --> 0:44:12.000
<v Speaker 1>and so sometimes really wonderful people might cheat And I

0:44:12.040 --> 0:44:16.560
<v Speaker 1>think maybe our energy is best spent again, not if

0:44:16.600 --> 0:44:18.840
<v Speaker 1>you've been cheated on and you're dealing with that person,

0:44:19.000 --> 0:44:23.960
<v Speaker 1>but in general, our energy is best spent thinking about

0:44:23.960 --> 0:44:29.160
<v Speaker 1>the psychology of it, thinking about the trauma, the motives,

0:44:29.280 --> 0:44:35.120
<v Speaker 1>the reasonings, not to you know, judge and say right

0:44:35.200 --> 0:44:37.680
<v Speaker 1>or wrong, but just so that we can There's a

0:44:37.800 --> 0:44:40.520
<v Speaker 1>quote by the philosopher Terrence that I learned through my

0:44:40.600 --> 0:44:42.239
<v Speaker 1>Angelo that I actually put in the front of all

0:44:42.239 --> 0:44:43.840
<v Speaker 1>my scripts, and I think it's the front of my

0:44:43.880 --> 0:44:46.000
<v Speaker 1>book as well, which is I am a human being.

0:44:46.080 --> 0:44:49.279
<v Speaker 1>Thus nothing human can be alien to me. And so

0:44:49.600 --> 0:44:52.160
<v Speaker 1>I really like that is something that I live by,

0:44:52.239 --> 0:44:54.719
<v Speaker 1>which is that anything that anyone else is capable of

0:44:54.760 --> 0:44:58.160
<v Speaker 1>doing that is human. You are also capable of doing

0:44:58.160 --> 0:45:00.480
<v Speaker 1>that thing. You may not, you may not get to

0:45:00.520 --> 0:45:03.120
<v Speaker 1>that edge, but it doesn't mean that it's not within

0:45:03.239 --> 0:45:08.640
<v Speaker 1>your wheelhouse, and so we're best suited trying to understand

0:45:08.800 --> 0:45:12.640
<v Speaker 1>how people arrived the decisions that they arrived at. One

0:45:12.800 --> 0:45:14.960
<v Speaker 1>to have you know, love and compassion for them, but

0:45:15.000 --> 0:45:18.000
<v Speaker 1>two to prevent ourselves from doing that thing right, Like,

0:45:18.040 --> 0:45:20.359
<v Speaker 1>there's a lot that we can learn if you won't

0:45:20.400 --> 0:45:22.520
<v Speaker 1>be in a relationship. There's a lot you can learn

0:45:22.760 --> 0:45:26.640
<v Speaker 1>from somebody who's cheated, whether it's what not to do

0:45:26.840 --> 0:45:29.520
<v Speaker 1>or you know how to avoid the thing. But there's

0:45:29.560 --> 0:45:32.360
<v Speaker 1>a lot we can learn from each other. So no

0:45:32.400 --> 0:45:37.560
<v Speaker 1>one is disposable. Love that in general. I really also love,

0:45:37.760 --> 0:45:41.640
<v Speaker 1>you know, having a politic around dating. Yoshahim said, I

0:45:41.719 --> 0:45:43.600
<v Speaker 1>want to make sure I want to leave a connection

0:45:43.680 --> 0:45:47.440
<v Speaker 1>that no one has been lied to, manipulated or feels controlled.

0:45:47.800 --> 0:45:51.120
<v Speaker 1>And I love that because it really is about an intention.

0:45:51.320 --> 0:45:54.080
<v Speaker 1>What do you and and that again as Shahim, so

0:45:54.320 --> 0:45:57.240
<v Speaker 1>you know, beautifully expressed. That can be in your romantic relationship,

0:45:57.239 --> 0:46:00.560
<v Speaker 1>that can be in work family, Uh, you know, potonicallyationships.

0:46:01.080 --> 0:46:04.680
<v Speaker 1>How do you want people to feel after they've you know,

0:46:04.760 --> 0:46:08.080
<v Speaker 1>spent time with you? How do you want people to

0:46:08.200 --> 0:46:12.200
<v Speaker 1>feel in interactions with you? What is important to you?

0:46:12.640 --> 0:46:16.520
<v Speaker 1>I think when you know that you show up differently,

0:46:16.680 --> 0:46:19.120
<v Speaker 1>Like I know that in any interaction that I have,

0:46:19.640 --> 0:46:23.440
<v Speaker 1>I really want people to feel comfortable and safe. I

0:46:23.440 --> 0:46:26.560
<v Speaker 1>want them to feel held. And because I know that,

0:46:26.560 --> 0:46:28.879
<v Speaker 1>that's just how I show up. I'll show up that way,

0:46:29.120 --> 0:46:31.400
<v Speaker 1>you know, at the Walgreens with cashier, I'll show up

0:46:31.400 --> 0:46:33.760
<v Speaker 1>that way, you know, at dinner with my best friend,

0:46:33.800 --> 0:46:35.279
<v Speaker 1>I'll show up that way with the you know, the

0:46:35.320 --> 0:46:38.560
<v Speaker 1>stranger on the subway. I want everyone to when they

0:46:38.560 --> 0:46:42.560
<v Speaker 1>are interacting with me, to feel comfortable and to feel safe. Listen,

0:46:42.600 --> 0:46:44.840
<v Speaker 1>there are boundaries to this. There's context of this. Some

0:46:44.960 --> 0:46:48.480
<v Speaker 1>people you know are gon do some fuction and you

0:46:48.480 --> 0:46:51.680
<v Speaker 1>know whatever. But what what is always important is that

0:46:51.719 --> 0:46:54.200
<v Speaker 1>we keep our sides of the street clean, if you will,

0:46:54.280 --> 0:46:57.759
<v Speaker 1>if you'll allow me that expression transparency versus honesty. And

0:46:57.800 --> 0:46:59.440
<v Speaker 1>I talk about this a lot, you know, in terms

0:46:59.440 --> 0:47:03.239
<v Speaker 1>of polya memory. You know the importance of over communication.

0:47:03.360 --> 0:47:05.879
<v Speaker 1>But this is this works I think in anything, this

0:47:06.040 --> 0:47:09.880
<v Speaker 1>concept of in order to build trust or a great

0:47:09.920 --> 0:47:12.400
<v Speaker 1>way to build trust. It is not a wait for

0:47:12.440 --> 0:47:15.400
<v Speaker 1>your partner to ask you about the thing, but for

0:47:15.480 --> 0:47:17.360
<v Speaker 1>you to offer up the thing. I'm about to go

0:47:17.400 --> 0:47:19.200
<v Speaker 1>do this or I'm about to you know, go over

0:47:19.239 --> 0:47:22.240
<v Speaker 1>here or I'm seeing this right. It just helps build

0:47:22.280 --> 0:47:25.160
<v Speaker 1>trust because it allows the other person to know. I

0:47:25.200 --> 0:47:26.960
<v Speaker 1>don't ever have to go searching. I don't ever have

0:47:27.040 --> 0:47:30.560
<v Speaker 1>to go asking my partner, and our relationship is one

0:47:30.640 --> 0:47:33.879
<v Speaker 1>where we are transparent, where we offer these things up,

0:47:33.880 --> 0:47:37.600
<v Speaker 1>where we're not, you know, holding secrets. It doesn't mean

0:47:37.600 --> 0:47:41.239
<v Speaker 1>that you aren't allowed to have things that are private. Yeah,

0:47:41.320 --> 0:47:44.759
<v Speaker 1>there's a My therapist impressed upon me that there's a

0:47:44.760 --> 0:47:48.279
<v Speaker 1>difference between privacy and secrecy. So you are allowed to

0:47:48.400 --> 0:47:50.319
<v Speaker 1>have things that are private. I have a journal. I

0:47:50.320 --> 0:47:52.360
<v Speaker 1>have many journals. I've been writing a journal since I

0:47:52.440 --> 0:47:55.880
<v Speaker 1>was god a good since I was a tot, honestly,

0:47:56.360 --> 0:47:59.319
<v Speaker 1>so I have many private things that I don't have

0:47:59.400 --> 0:48:02.759
<v Speaker 1>to offer up to anyone. But there are things, and

0:48:02.840 --> 0:48:04.799
<v Speaker 1>you know, you know exactly what the things are where

0:48:04.840 --> 0:48:06.719
<v Speaker 1>you know, you know your partner would feel safer if

0:48:06.719 --> 0:48:09.800
<v Speaker 1>they knew that, then offer it. You know, there's nothing

0:48:09.880 --> 0:48:14.279
<v Speaker 1>to lose and everything to gain, which is trust. And

0:48:14.280 --> 0:48:18.320
<v Speaker 1>you do not have a relationship without trust, period point blank?

0:48:20.400 --> 0:48:24.040
<v Speaker 1>What else? What else? What else? Established? What cheating means

0:48:24.080 --> 0:48:27.880
<v Speaker 1>to you? I really, you know, we make a lot

0:48:27.920 --> 0:48:30.360
<v Speaker 1>of assumptions. It's honestly the same thing we do with sex,

0:48:30.440 --> 0:48:32.239
<v Speaker 1>like that thing. And you've heard us talk about this

0:48:32.320 --> 0:48:35.280
<v Speaker 1>on the show right that. I think Emilina Gosti brought

0:48:35.280 --> 0:48:37.319
<v Speaker 1>this up to right where she had a partner who

0:48:37.400 --> 0:48:39.719
<v Speaker 1>was doing something with her that he was doing with

0:48:39.760 --> 0:48:42.239
<v Speaker 1>another partner, and she was like, I get that you're

0:48:42.320 --> 0:48:45.040
<v Speaker 1>other partner like that, but I don't like that, right.

0:48:45.120 --> 0:48:46.560
<v Speaker 1>So I think the same thing is true here when

0:48:46.560 --> 0:48:50.560
<v Speaker 1>we're talking about cheating or any sort of expectations that

0:48:50.600 --> 0:48:53.319
<v Speaker 1>we're setting in a relationship. What might have been an

0:48:53.320 --> 0:48:56.680
<v Speaker 1>expectation in a previous relationship, what might be an expectation

0:48:56.719 --> 0:48:59.239
<v Speaker 1>that you've seen on television or in movies or you know,

0:48:59.400 --> 0:49:02.239
<v Speaker 1>read in a book, may not be the expectations in

0:49:02.280 --> 0:49:05.600
<v Speaker 1>your relationship. So it's really important that the two of

0:49:05.640 --> 0:49:08.440
<v Speaker 1>you or three four, however many of you are in

0:49:08.480 --> 0:49:11.800
<v Speaker 1>the relationship sit down and say, what are our expectations,

0:49:11.880 --> 0:49:14.520
<v Speaker 1>what do the like? What is our shared language? What

0:49:14.560 --> 0:49:15.439
<v Speaker 1>does cheating mean?

0:49:15.600 --> 0:49:17.080
<v Speaker 2>To us? Is cheating?

0:49:17.160 --> 0:49:21.640
<v Speaker 1>A DM is cheating? You know, a flirt at work

0:49:22.840 --> 0:49:26.840
<v Speaker 1>is cheating? Penetration? Like, what are we establishing as cheating?

0:49:27.320 --> 0:49:30.080
<v Speaker 1>I think is important for both of you to start

0:49:30.080 --> 0:49:33.480
<v Speaker 1>the relationship off knowing and in general like what are

0:49:33.520 --> 0:49:35.320
<v Speaker 1>the other what are the other things? You want to

0:49:35.360 --> 0:49:38.239
<v Speaker 1>make sure that you and your partner have agreed upon

0:49:38.760 --> 0:49:42.359
<v Speaker 1>what the shared definition of what your shared definitions are

0:49:42.840 --> 0:49:45.680
<v Speaker 1>also knowing, and I would encourage that those things get

0:49:45.680 --> 0:49:48.759
<v Speaker 1>to evolve and shift and change over time. Right, because

0:49:48.760 --> 0:49:51.319
<v Speaker 1>we're humans were and hopefully if we're doing our work,

0:49:51.360 --> 0:49:54.360
<v Speaker 1>we are growing, which means that we're going to shift

0:49:54.400 --> 0:49:57.479
<v Speaker 1>and something that might have meant might have had higher

0:49:57.560 --> 0:50:00.160
<v Speaker 1>stakes for us at the beginning of the relationship and

0:50:00.200 --> 0:50:02.759
<v Speaker 1>have the same intensity ten years in, right, or doesn't

0:50:02.800 --> 0:50:05.640
<v Speaker 1>have the same intensity you know, two months in, and

0:50:05.680 --> 0:50:10.000
<v Speaker 1>so being able to also check in about those expectations

0:50:10.040 --> 0:50:13.560
<v Speaker 1>and allow them to shift as need be, whether it's

0:50:13.560 --> 0:50:17.680
<v Speaker 1>to loosen or tighten. Yeah. And the final thing that

0:50:17.719 --> 0:50:19.640
<v Speaker 1>I do want to repeat is it is because you

0:50:19.640 --> 0:50:22.600
<v Speaker 1>know we've spent this episode talking about cheating. Second chances

0:50:22.640 --> 0:50:26.640
<v Speaker 1>are always a possibility. You can always give somebody a

0:50:26.680 --> 0:50:29.600
<v Speaker 1>second chance. People are allowed to grow, but you want

0:50:29.640 --> 0:50:31.680
<v Speaker 1>to make sure that one that person has done their

0:50:31.760 --> 0:50:35.960
<v Speaker 1>work and can and can articulate the work that they've

0:50:36.000 --> 0:50:40.120
<v Speaker 1>done and the changes that they're making and will be

0:50:40.200 --> 0:50:43.480
<v Speaker 1>making in order to earn your trust back. You want

0:50:43.480 --> 0:50:46.560
<v Speaker 1>to also make sure that you if you are the

0:50:46.760 --> 0:50:51.480
<v Speaker 1>person that the transgression was against. I believe I'm saying

0:50:51.520 --> 0:50:56.160
<v Speaker 1>that right, if you are the person that experienced that transgression,

0:50:56.200 --> 0:50:59.279
<v Speaker 1>you were you're impacted by that transgression. Rather, I should say,

0:50:59.600 --> 0:51:01.640
<v Speaker 1>you want to make sure that you have also done

0:51:01.719 --> 0:51:04.680
<v Speaker 1>your work, that you have taken the time that you

0:51:04.920 --> 0:51:08.160
<v Speaker 1>need to even understand if you want to give a

0:51:08.200 --> 0:51:11.360
<v Speaker 1>second chance, give a second chance, but make sure it

0:51:11.440 --> 0:51:14.160
<v Speaker 1>is with your eyes open, it's with intention that you

0:51:14.280 --> 0:51:18.839
<v Speaker 1>know what you're coming to the table and and you

0:51:19.040 --> 0:51:24.759
<v Speaker 1>know what your boundaries are, and you can articulate that. Right,

0:51:24.840 --> 0:51:27.520
<v Speaker 1>this is a line for me. You can't be in

0:51:27.560 --> 0:51:30.920
<v Speaker 1>the DMS. If you are in the DMS with other people,

0:51:31.600 --> 0:51:35.200
<v Speaker 1>then that is cause for this relationship to for me

0:51:35.239 --> 0:51:37.319
<v Speaker 1>to leave this connection, or for this relationship to come

0:51:37.320 --> 0:51:39.520
<v Speaker 1>to an end, whatever it is. Right, So, if you're

0:51:39.520 --> 0:51:43.480
<v Speaker 1>coming back income with your eyes open and also articulate

0:51:43.719 --> 0:51:48.800
<v Speaker 1>what the boundaries are, update the operating system of the relationship.

0:51:48.920 --> 0:51:52.279
<v Speaker 1>What are our shared definitions? What are we establishing in

0:51:52.360 --> 0:51:59.439
<v Speaker 1>this new path forward? Yeah? Yeah, ah, so I really,

0:51:59.520 --> 0:52:02.799
<v Speaker 1>really really I'm so grateful to shawhim for this conversation

0:52:04.320 --> 0:52:07.200
<v Speaker 1>and I hope that you took some stuff away from

0:52:07.200 --> 0:52:08.640
<v Speaker 1>it too, and I would love to hear from you,

0:52:08.680 --> 0:52:10.600
<v Speaker 1>so you can always you know, email me at tell

0:52:10.640 --> 0:52:14.000
<v Speaker 1>Me Something Messy at gmail dot com. You can also

0:52:14.280 --> 0:52:18.520
<v Speaker 1>DM me on Instagram or at our tell Me Something

0:52:18.560 --> 0:52:21.200
<v Speaker 1>Messy account as well. Yeah, I would love to know

0:52:22.680 --> 0:52:27.239
<v Speaker 1>what resonates for you, what you're struggling with, what you

0:52:27.280 --> 0:52:29.520
<v Speaker 1>what are your big O moments? If you will you're

0:52:29.680 --> 0:52:35.799
<v Speaker 1>oh yeah, yeah, anyways, I love you so so much.

0:52:38.239 --> 0:52:41.600
<v Speaker 1>If you are enjoying this podcast and you are vibing

0:52:41.800 --> 0:52:45.120
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0:53:20.560 --> 0:53:22.399
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<v Speaker 1>the show, out all, Right until next, time ask about

0:53:49.320 --> 0:53:51.279
<v Speaker 1>the politics of that dick before you make it, spit

0:53:51.719 --> 0:53:53.920
<v Speaker 1>make sure they eat the kitty before they beat the,

0:53:54.000 --> 0:53:59.120
<v Speaker 1>kitty before fuckation or succation. Communication and in case you

0:53:59.160 --> 0:54:03.000
<v Speaker 1>haven't heard it, yet today you are so deeply. LOVED

0:54:03.480 --> 0:54:07.840
<v Speaker 1>i love, You, Hi thank you so much for listening

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<v Speaker 1>It Tell Me Something messy was executive produced By Ali,

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