1 00:00:05,680 --> 00:00:09,320 Speaker 1: Still the Place with Laura Layton, Courtney Thorn Smith. 2 00:00:09,360 --> 00:00:12,400 Speaker 2: And Daphne's Aniga an iHeartRadio podcast. 3 00:00:15,600 --> 00:00:19,759 Speaker 3: Hello ladies, Hi, so good to say. Very excited today. 4 00:00:19,960 --> 00:00:22,919 Speaker 3: We're so excited. It's a very special guest, Chuck. 5 00:00:23,040 --> 00:00:25,160 Speaker 4: Have you heard that from the girls of Melrose before? 6 00:00:25,200 --> 00:00:31,600 Speaker 4: We're so excited we have Pratt on the show today. 7 00:00:31,760 --> 00:00:33,240 Speaker 4: I's a writer on Melroe's Place. 8 00:00:33,760 --> 00:00:36,040 Speaker 1: Also, what were you saying, daph And you had a 9 00:00:36,080 --> 00:00:37,240 Speaker 1: beautiful introduction. 10 00:00:37,520 --> 00:00:38,599 Speaker 3: How hot I am for him? 11 00:00:44,040 --> 00:00:46,720 Speaker 2: We've got Chuck's been around in this industry for so long, 12 00:00:46,760 --> 00:00:49,040 Speaker 2: and there should be like a game three degrees of 13 00:00:49,080 --> 00:00:52,560 Speaker 2: separation from Chuck because you've written for so many shows 14 00:00:52,600 --> 00:00:54,880 Speaker 2: and produced since you were probably a child. 15 00:00:55,040 --> 00:00:57,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, and if he doesn't know somebody from work, he 16 00:00:57,120 --> 00:00:58,640 Speaker 1: went to school with them, or his kids went to 17 00:00:58,680 --> 00:00:59,160 Speaker 1: school with them. 18 00:00:59,240 --> 00:01:00,640 Speaker 3: You know everybody. 19 00:01:00,880 --> 00:01:02,880 Speaker 5: No I don't, but he don't. 20 00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:11,280 Speaker 2: Beautiful woman, you've written General Hospital, Young and the Restless, 21 00:01:11,319 --> 00:01:15,200 Speaker 2: All My Children. Oh yeah, Melrose Place nine O two one, Oh, 22 00:01:15,319 --> 00:01:15,800 Speaker 2: keep going. 23 00:01:15,840 --> 00:01:22,760 Speaker 3: Then we did that little spinoff, Models Inc. Model But anyway, 24 00:01:22,760 --> 00:01:23,960 Speaker 3: you've done so many soaps. 25 00:01:24,240 --> 00:01:26,880 Speaker 6: So that's the pilot of Desperate Housewives. 26 00:01:27,760 --> 00:01:30,120 Speaker 2: Desperate Housewives can I just ask a question before they 27 00:01:30,120 --> 00:01:32,520 Speaker 2: get into all the juicy questions, because I was, as 28 00:01:32,600 --> 00:01:36,039 Speaker 2: I told you, looking up some info on you. You 29 00:01:36,040 --> 00:01:37,800 Speaker 2: you grew up in the business because your dad worked 30 00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:41,399 Speaker 2: in the business. Correct, Okay, did your dad produce The 31 00:01:41,440 --> 00:01:42,240 Speaker 2: Great Santini? 32 00:01:42,360 --> 00:01:47,280 Speaker 5: Yes, it's so great that you guys actually know where 33 00:01:47,400 --> 00:01:49,640 Speaker 5: the next generation has come along. And you say, yeah, 34 00:01:49,800 --> 00:01:52,560 Speaker 5: my father is a producer. His last film was The 35 00:01:52,560 --> 00:01:55,520 Speaker 5: Great Santini. And they go, oh, is it about a circus? 36 00:01:55,520 --> 00:02:01,000 Speaker 3: I go, wow, yeah, I know, Michael. 37 00:02:01,920 --> 00:02:05,800 Speaker 2: Blake, Danner, Oscars all nominated. 38 00:02:05,200 --> 00:02:06,440 Speaker 5: It was an amazing movie. 39 00:02:06,560 --> 00:02:08,959 Speaker 2: As a young actor coming up, I just was like that, 40 00:02:09,080 --> 00:02:11,120 Speaker 2: wait what, I know, you've done a ton of stuff, 41 00:02:11,120 --> 00:02:13,200 Speaker 2: but I'm like, dad produced a great thing. 42 00:02:13,240 --> 00:02:15,880 Speaker 5: Yeah, but your dad, Yeah, Well I got I got 43 00:02:15,880 --> 00:02:19,320 Speaker 5: to go to the premiere of it. I was just 44 00:02:19,560 --> 00:02:21,640 Speaker 5: out of college or about to be out of college 45 00:02:21,639 --> 00:02:27,440 Speaker 5: film school, and you know, met Robert Duval, Luke Carlino, 46 00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:32,119 Speaker 5: who wrote and directed the film. And but I got 47 00:02:32,120 --> 00:02:34,160 Speaker 5: to meet Pat Conray, you know, who wrote the book 48 00:02:34,200 --> 00:02:36,760 Speaker 5: it was based on. And I got to sit and 49 00:02:36,800 --> 00:02:38,640 Speaker 5: talk with him because I said, you know, you wrote 50 00:02:38,639 --> 00:02:41,720 Speaker 5: this book. My father is kind of the great sant 51 00:02:42,680 --> 00:02:45,120 Speaker 5: I know the minute, you know, he had to make it. 52 00:02:45,200 --> 00:02:46,560 Speaker 5: I was one of the first people who read it. 53 00:02:46,639 --> 00:02:48,600 Speaker 5: My dad used to you know, I was working in 54 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:51,040 Speaker 5: the mailroom at Paramount and he would throw me books 55 00:02:51,040 --> 00:02:53,920 Speaker 5: and go read this. Tell me what you think you know? 56 00:02:54,280 --> 00:02:57,160 Speaker 5: And I read. I remember reading Sounder and thinking, oh 57 00:02:57,200 --> 00:02:59,720 Speaker 5: my god, this would be such a great film. I said, 58 00:02:59,720 --> 00:03:01,280 Speaker 5: this would be a great film. He goes, yeah, for 59 00:03:01,320 --> 00:03:05,839 Speaker 5: somebody else to make it. Go OK, So I read 60 00:03:05,880 --> 00:03:08,399 Speaker 5: the great Santini and I and I went. I went 61 00:03:08,440 --> 00:03:10,600 Speaker 5: into his office and I said, Dad, this is uh, 62 00:03:11,400 --> 00:03:14,519 Speaker 5: this is sort of your story. And he goes, I 63 00:03:14,639 --> 00:03:19,080 Speaker 5: never hit your mother, no, no, But I said, you know, 64 00:03:19,320 --> 00:03:21,360 Speaker 5: we grew up with horses and they had names like 65 00:03:21,440 --> 00:03:24,520 Speaker 5: Trooper and sergeant, you know, and he was a veteran 66 00:03:25,040 --> 00:03:27,639 Speaker 5: and he got a good laugh on it. I said, 67 00:03:27,720 --> 00:03:29,840 Speaker 5: you have, I mean, you have to make this movie. 68 00:03:29,840 --> 00:03:31,840 Speaker 5: And he goes, We're going to make this movie. It 69 00:03:31,919 --> 00:03:35,160 Speaker 5: took a lot of it took it basically ended his 70 00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:38,600 Speaker 5: career because it took so long, really yeah, to get 71 00:03:38,600 --> 00:03:43,200 Speaker 5: the money Ryan and then united artists and uh, then 72 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:47,200 Speaker 5: he couldn't find a director. That's that's a whole story. 73 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:49,640 Speaker 5: I mean, Ulu gros Bar started it, but because of 74 00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:51,840 Speaker 5: the basketball scene where he bounces the basketball off his 75 00:03:51,920 --> 00:03:56,000 Speaker 5: kid's head, he backed u. Ulu gross Bar said he 76 00:03:56,040 --> 00:03:58,000 Speaker 5: wouldn't do it, and my father said, we won't cut 77 00:03:58,040 --> 00:04:01,280 Speaker 5: the scene. It's Past's favorite scene the book and that's 78 00:04:01,320 --> 00:04:06,880 Speaker 5: the way it goes. So they had, uh, okay, this 79 00:04:06,920 --> 00:04:09,600 Speaker 5: is a good start. My father was on a first 80 00:04:09,600 --> 00:04:12,160 Speaker 5: class flight to New York to go and talk to 81 00:04:12,280 --> 00:04:15,280 Speaker 5: U A about money for the picture, and Paul Newman 82 00:04:15,400 --> 00:04:18,080 Speaker 5: is on the same flight reading the script because they've 83 00:04:18,120 --> 00:04:20,240 Speaker 5: got it. He was the first person they went out 84 00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:22,520 Speaker 5: to and he was probably a little too old for 85 00:04:22,600 --> 00:04:24,440 Speaker 5: the part, but you know, they could. They figured they 86 00:04:24,480 --> 00:04:27,800 Speaker 5: could make it work. And uh, my father just saw him, 87 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:30,960 Speaker 5: watched him read the script. I mean, what an opportunity. 88 00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:33,680 Speaker 5: I thought, never in my life if I had that opportunity. 89 00:04:34,080 --> 00:04:37,640 Speaker 5: And yeah, and so he went up to UH as 90 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:39,920 Speaker 5: the flight was coming in. He looked over and Paul 91 00:04:40,000 --> 00:04:42,640 Speaker 5: new was going, you know, wiping a tiro and he goes, Okay, 92 00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:44,640 Speaker 5: the script did get to you. You know, it was 93 00:04:44,680 --> 00:04:47,560 Speaker 5: one of those and my father went up and he said, 94 00:04:48,920 --> 00:04:51,159 Speaker 5: you got to do this movie. You know, I just 95 00:04:51,160 --> 00:04:52,800 Speaker 5: saw you reading the script. I'm the guy, you know, 96 00:04:52,800 --> 00:04:55,719 Speaker 5: I'm the producer and uh and he said, you know, 97 00:04:56,720 --> 00:04:59,520 Speaker 5: it would be probably one of the greatest roles of 98 00:04:59,520 --> 00:05:02,440 Speaker 5: my life. He said, but I have a I have 99 00:05:02,520 --> 00:05:05,520 Speaker 5: a kid, and we have problems. Get had drug problems 100 00:05:05,560 --> 00:05:08,359 Speaker 5: and died actually I think of an overdose. And he said, 101 00:05:08,440 --> 00:05:11,599 Speaker 5: you know, he's made claims that I'm an abusive father 102 00:05:11,680 --> 00:05:14,120 Speaker 5: and stuff. He said, I can't, I can't do this. 103 00:05:15,480 --> 00:05:17,720 Speaker 5: My father said, so it's the basketball scene. He goes, 104 00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:20,560 Speaker 5: it's the whole thing. It's not just about so so 105 00:05:20,600 --> 00:05:23,760 Speaker 5: they lost him. And then they went to Gene Hackman, 106 00:05:24,880 --> 00:05:28,920 Speaker 5: Burt Reynolds and you know, and my father goes, you know, 107 00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:30,800 Speaker 5: and this went on and on and on, and I 108 00:05:30,839 --> 00:05:34,159 Speaker 5: thought other movies on the Orion schedule got moved up 109 00:05:34,200 --> 00:05:36,320 Speaker 5: in front of it, and it looked like it might not, 110 00:05:37,040 --> 00:05:41,600 Speaker 5: you know, get made. And I think it was Pat 111 00:05:41,680 --> 00:05:46,240 Speaker 5: Conroy h lived in the South, and so did Robert Devall. 112 00:05:46,760 --> 00:05:50,080 Speaker 5: So pat Conroy said it was his suggestion. How about 113 00:05:50,160 --> 00:05:55,040 Speaker 5: Robert Devall's perfect? Deval was perfect? And you know. 114 00:05:56,920 --> 00:06:00,839 Speaker 1: The next logical step, which is Melrose Place. Yes, you know, 115 00:06:00,839 --> 00:06:02,599 Speaker 1: there's so much, there's so much in common. 116 00:06:02,680 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 5: It was only a few years later. 117 00:06:06,279 --> 00:06:06,960 Speaker 6: The same genre. 118 00:06:07,960 --> 00:06:11,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, so we're so we've been watching it. We're only 119 00:06:11,440 --> 00:06:13,240 Speaker 1: in episode twenty three. I feels when doing it a 120 00:06:13,240 --> 00:06:16,200 Speaker 1: long time. And first it's like eight kids trying to 121 00:06:16,240 --> 00:06:18,839 Speaker 1: make it eight kids. And now it's starting to get 122 00:06:19,279 --> 00:06:23,279 Speaker 1: exciting and sexy and stuff is happening. Do you remember 123 00:06:23,560 --> 00:06:26,200 Speaker 1: that transition? Do you remember that? Do you was there 124 00:06:26,240 --> 00:06:29,080 Speaker 1: in the writer's room, people going, it's not working. Nobody 125 00:06:29,120 --> 00:06:31,400 Speaker 1: cares about these kids. We need to spice it up. 126 00:06:31,600 --> 00:06:33,839 Speaker 1: Were you brought in there? Were you there from the beginning? 127 00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:37,640 Speaker 5: This part? I remember so well, you know, I mean, 128 00:06:37,960 --> 00:06:41,120 Speaker 5: I'll say, God, yes, do I remember this? I mean, 129 00:06:41,160 --> 00:06:43,360 Speaker 5: it was it was a it was a number of things. 130 00:06:43,400 --> 00:06:46,320 Speaker 5: You know, ratings are always a big deal. And uh, 131 00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:50,680 Speaker 5: we had we'd been doing we were on like shooting 132 00:06:50,760 --> 00:06:57,920 Speaker 5: episode six or seven, and Darren pulls me into his office. 133 00:06:58,040 --> 00:07:00,920 Speaker 5: I was co producer, I think then I was supervising. 134 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:04,719 Speaker 5: Yet Eddie goes and he goes, Juck, I have something 135 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:06,880 Speaker 5: to tell you what Let's walk to the elevator together. 136 00:07:06,920 --> 00:07:09,440 Speaker 5: So we walked the elevator. I thought, oh, I'm getting fired, 137 00:07:09,920 --> 00:07:12,360 Speaker 5: you know, and I think i'd written, you know, a 138 00:07:12,440 --> 00:07:15,560 Speaker 5: number of episodes. When people liked my episode, I thought, wow, 139 00:07:15,640 --> 00:07:19,800 Speaker 5: this has never happened. This is scary. And Darren goes, 140 00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:22,200 Speaker 5: when we come back it was a Friday goes when 141 00:07:22,200 --> 00:07:24,640 Speaker 5: we come back on Monday, goes, none of the people 142 00:07:24,640 --> 00:07:26,120 Speaker 5: out there are going to be here. I go, what 143 00:07:26,160 --> 00:07:29,360 Speaker 5: do you mean the assistance? I thought, what the assistants 144 00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:29,960 Speaker 5: were getting rid of? 145 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:30,040 Speaker 1: This? 146 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:34,440 Speaker 5: Says they're great, Eddie goes. He goes, No, we're firing 147 00:07:34,480 --> 00:07:38,680 Speaker 5: three writers, you know, including the supervising. Uh, pretty sure, 148 00:07:38,680 --> 00:07:41,559 Speaker 5: and we have another guy's coming in. It was Frank South. 149 00:07:42,840 --> 00:07:45,600 Speaker 3: Did Frank have a history of soaps and dramas? 150 00:07:45,880 --> 00:07:49,120 Speaker 5: He was an episodic guy. I was, you know, I 151 00:07:49,280 --> 00:07:52,320 Speaker 5: was the soap guy riding up episodes in the beginning. 152 00:07:52,640 --> 00:07:54,200 Speaker 5: You know a lot of people have given, you know, 153 00:07:54,680 --> 00:07:57,520 Speaker 5: given me credits saying I was the reason it turned 154 00:07:57,560 --> 00:08:00,280 Speaker 5: to a soap. No, it was. It was as a 155 00:08:00,320 --> 00:08:03,360 Speaker 5: combination of people. But I sure as hell knew how 156 00:08:03,360 --> 00:08:03,800 Speaker 5: to do it. 157 00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:06,280 Speaker 2: You know, but in the beginning, you were writing your 158 00:08:06,600 --> 00:08:10,280 Speaker 2: soap style, but without the melrose esqueness of it. 159 00:08:10,400 --> 00:08:12,960 Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, no, it was uh, you know, I'd come 160 00:08:13,000 --> 00:08:17,640 Speaker 5: off shows like Santa Barbara where where you know, if 161 00:08:17,680 --> 00:08:20,120 Speaker 5: you know the history of the show, anything went. We 162 00:08:20,120 --> 00:08:23,600 Speaker 5: were insane. We just our ratings were so low and 163 00:08:23,640 --> 00:08:26,360 Speaker 5: the network was stopped caring about us. So we had 164 00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:30,560 Speaker 5: alien episodes we did. We turned daytime on it. You know, 165 00:08:30,600 --> 00:08:34,040 Speaker 5: we didn't care. And we won every you know, we'd 166 00:08:34,040 --> 00:08:37,560 Speaker 5: win twenty three Emmys, you know, each season, and you 167 00:08:37,559 --> 00:08:40,280 Speaker 5: know I would win Emmys, and it was it was 168 00:08:40,320 --> 00:08:42,839 Speaker 5: a great freedom. But then I moved to primetime. It 169 00:08:42,920 --> 00:08:45,319 Speaker 5: did Gabriel's Fire and Life Goes On, which were more 170 00:08:45,360 --> 00:08:49,640 Speaker 5: traditional shows, and learned the one camera you know world, 171 00:08:49,720 --> 00:08:50,520 Speaker 5: which I already knew. 172 00:08:50,559 --> 00:08:54,080 Speaker 1: But you know, so when when Darren said we have 173 00:08:54,120 --> 00:08:55,960 Speaker 1: to change it up, did you go, oh great, I 174 00:08:56,000 --> 00:08:57,319 Speaker 1: know how to do this and excited. 175 00:08:57,559 --> 00:09:00,800 Speaker 5: Actually it wasn't Darren that that said it the way 176 00:09:00,920 --> 00:09:06,000 Speaker 5: the way it happened, As I recall Wash, we were 177 00:09:06,040 --> 00:09:09,680 Speaker 5: called in uh by UH and I think I think 178 00:09:09,840 --> 00:09:14,040 Speaker 5: uh the former writers sumed and fired. Right before they 179 00:09:14,040 --> 00:09:16,439 Speaker 5: were fired. We were called in for big meeting. Aaron 180 00:09:16,640 --> 00:09:20,440 Speaker 5: was there. I remember writing a note to I think 181 00:09:20,440 --> 00:09:23,360 Speaker 5: to Darren, I said, I know why Fox likes I know, 182 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:26,520 Speaker 5: I know why Fox likes Aaron Spelling so much. And 183 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:32,680 Speaker 5: I said he looks like Bart Simpson. And I remember 184 00:09:33,000 --> 00:09:37,640 Speaker 5: thinking if Darren shows up to Aaron beyond that elevator. 185 00:09:38,400 --> 00:09:40,199 Speaker 3: And this is around episode six. 186 00:09:40,720 --> 00:09:42,719 Speaker 5: Yeah, I was around six, and and it was all 187 00:09:42,800 --> 00:09:45,200 Speaker 5: the network executives, all who became at some point or 188 00:09:45,200 --> 00:09:47,600 Speaker 5: another president of the network. There was Bob green Blatt, 189 00:09:47,880 --> 00:09:52,680 Speaker 5: you know, who went on to run NBC and Showtime. Uh. 190 00:09:52,760 --> 00:09:57,040 Speaker 5: There was Sandy Grushaw who ended up being president of Fox. 191 00:09:57,200 --> 00:10:01,200 Speaker 5: There was Jonathan litt Men who went on and did 192 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:05,160 Speaker 5: all the Bruckheimer shows and hired Carol mendelsoid not me 193 00:10:08,480 --> 00:10:15,440 Speaker 5: not better to this day does he ever? Litman He 194 00:10:15,559 --> 00:10:21,839 Speaker 5: owns O HI, I think, and Carol does too. They 195 00:10:21,880 --> 00:10:25,040 Speaker 5: were all there and Peter Chernan, who is the head 196 00:10:25,320 --> 00:10:28,080 Speaker 5: he was Fox, you know, and we were all called 197 00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:33,800 Speaker 5: in and they said, we love these episodes. Uh, you 198 00:10:33,840 --> 00:10:37,160 Speaker 5: guys are doing a great job, Darren. You know, you've 199 00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:41,000 Speaker 5: created great characters. Production Wise, I don't think ship was there, 200 00:10:41,040 --> 00:10:44,360 Speaker 5: but production wise it's looking really good. Uh, you know, 201 00:10:44,520 --> 00:10:47,839 Speaker 5: but we're a little concerned about the ratings. I thought 202 00:10:48,120 --> 00:10:50,520 Speaker 5: you should be, because I think we just had you know, 203 00:10:51,440 --> 00:10:55,679 Speaker 5: episode five, you know, five or six, and you know, 204 00:10:56,160 --> 00:10:58,720 Speaker 5: the scripts for seven, eight, nine and ten were in. 205 00:10:58,880 --> 00:11:03,360 Speaker 5: I know that we're sitting there and you could, you 206 00:11:03,400 --> 00:11:05,800 Speaker 5: could sense it. And afterwards, I said, what was that 207 00:11:05,880 --> 00:11:08,240 Speaker 5: meeting about? And Darren goes, I don't know, but they're 208 00:11:08,679 --> 00:11:12,160 Speaker 5: they're worried, you know, they were. They were telling Aaron 209 00:11:12,240 --> 00:11:14,400 Speaker 5: the only way they could because he was so powerful, 210 00:11:14,679 --> 00:11:18,240 Speaker 5: that we're a little worried about the show. So, you know, 211 00:11:19,400 --> 00:11:23,760 Speaker 5: everybody got fired and and we kind of reassembled and 212 00:11:23,800 --> 00:11:26,760 Speaker 5: then and I remember at the end of that meeting, 213 00:11:26,800 --> 00:11:30,199 Speaker 5: Sandy Grushaw was head of marketing, who I just had 214 00:11:30,240 --> 00:11:33,679 Speaker 5: an email from and he recalled this moment. I had 215 00:11:33,679 --> 00:11:37,000 Speaker 5: written the where Jane loses a baby, where Michael and 216 00:11:37,080 --> 00:11:40,040 Speaker 5: Jane had a miscarriage and my wife had just had 217 00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:42,920 Speaker 5: a miscarriage. And so it was really an episode, you know, 218 00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:45,960 Speaker 5: a very special episode that I got to write about 219 00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:47,960 Speaker 5: something I experienced. You know. Of course, I had a 220 00:11:47,960 --> 00:11:50,240 Speaker 5: Golden Retriever puppy in it, which I always had a 221 00:11:50,240 --> 00:11:54,760 Speaker 5: Golden Retriever puppy and everything I still do. And I 222 00:11:55,240 --> 00:11:58,160 Speaker 5: remember the puppy story about you very well. I told 223 00:11:58,240 --> 00:12:01,000 Speaker 5: you to everybody. Oh my god, you know, he said, Hi, 224 00:12:02,160 --> 00:12:05,880 Speaker 5: Robert Chavez, Ah. 225 00:12:05,559 --> 00:12:08,480 Speaker 1: Guys golf together I'm guessing, yeah, yes, so sweet. 226 00:12:08,760 --> 00:12:11,440 Speaker 5: He's so funny. He just he just had nothing but 227 00:12:11,600 --> 00:12:17,160 Speaker 5: wonderful things. Anyway, that I am really digressing now, Robert. 228 00:12:18,480 --> 00:12:20,679 Speaker 3: In my very early twenty gosh, it sounded like it 229 00:12:20,720 --> 00:12:21,319 Speaker 3: was the turn. 230 00:12:21,640 --> 00:12:24,360 Speaker 2: You know, you guys were all panicking about these numbers. 231 00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:27,800 Speaker 2: But we were only like a few episodes in. We've 232 00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:29,080 Speaker 2: noticed because we're on twenty three. 233 00:12:29,240 --> 00:12:31,400 Speaker 5: You know, it was it was, you know. Then we 234 00:12:31,440 --> 00:12:35,200 Speaker 5: had the famous meeting on a Saturday when the ratings 235 00:12:35,280 --> 00:12:37,200 Speaker 5: like for ten came out and I think they were 236 00:12:37,600 --> 00:12:40,280 Speaker 5: that was the miscarriage episode. They were the lowest of 237 00:12:41,080 --> 00:12:45,840 Speaker 5: the season. I thought, well, I liked it, and and 238 00:12:45,960 --> 00:12:51,200 Speaker 5: they called us on a Saturday into Into Fox. Chip 239 00:12:51,320 --> 00:12:52,679 Speaker 5: was not there for that either. 240 00:12:52,720 --> 00:12:54,800 Speaker 1: I know, because Chip was saying, oh no, they were worried. 241 00:12:54,800 --> 00:12:56,479 Speaker 1: We were fine with the ratings. 242 00:12:56,280 --> 00:13:01,560 Speaker 5: Missed, almost failed. It was exactly she says, we were losing. 243 00:13:01,679 --> 00:13:04,160 Speaker 5: We almost. Chip said, well, I think we had a 244 00:13:04,200 --> 00:13:06,360 Speaker 5: twenty two shor order. Oh no, we didn't, do. 245 00:13:06,360 --> 00:13:08,679 Speaker 1: You remember Andrew with the ratings, like waiting for the 246 00:13:08,760 --> 00:13:11,160 Speaker 1: ratings to come in and following Lisa. 247 00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:13,680 Speaker 5: Andrew, Oh my god, you could do an hour on 248 00:13:13,800 --> 00:13:17,520 Speaker 5: Andrew Andrew who what he got the part. We all 249 00:13:17,520 --> 00:13:19,840 Speaker 5: went out to the set to see him and meet him, 250 00:13:20,200 --> 00:13:24,360 Speaker 5: and we'd seen his pilot golf stream or Golf something 251 00:13:24,440 --> 00:13:30,320 Speaker 5: or other golf where he had a gun and you go, oh, no, 252 00:13:32,040 --> 00:13:35,040 Speaker 5: he's really handsome. But in one scene he goes down 253 00:13:35,160 --> 00:13:38,080 Speaker 5: and he fixes a woman's pipe in the pipes in 254 00:13:38,120 --> 00:13:45,280 Speaker 5: the cellar, you know, and he has I know, you 255 00:13:45,280 --> 00:13:47,400 Speaker 5: could tell the writers that's what they were thinking. And 256 00:13:47,440 --> 00:13:50,160 Speaker 5: the woman looks at him and she's extremely attracted to him, 257 00:13:50,200 --> 00:13:52,520 Speaker 5: and h and we all looked and we said he 258 00:13:52,520 --> 00:13:57,199 Speaker 5: could be billy, just don't open your mouth, and we're okay. 259 00:13:57,520 --> 00:14:00,440 Speaker 5: But we met him and he comes up and he goes, you, well, 260 00:14:00,480 --> 00:14:03,000 Speaker 5: it's nice to meet you guys. You know, you know 261 00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:05,800 Speaker 5: this Saturday me I wasn't in the Saturday meeting at 262 00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:10,199 Speaker 5: Spelling's house, but Darren called me right after. But he goes, 263 00:14:11,480 --> 00:14:14,800 Speaker 5: he goes, he said, look, you know I'm doing this show, 264 00:14:14,840 --> 00:14:18,800 Speaker 5: but you know what about Golf Springs. I mean, you 265 00:14:18,840 --> 00:14:22,520 Speaker 5: know I did that first, and I got I'm just 266 00:14:22,560 --> 00:14:25,160 Speaker 5: study liquing. But I go, I don't think that show's 267 00:14:25,520 --> 00:14:33,440 Speaker 5: going forward. He goes, really, oh, I just thought, oh 268 00:14:33,520 --> 00:14:37,440 Speaker 5: my god. I have had times in my career where 269 00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:39,520 Speaker 5: the show I was working on, or that I had 270 00:14:39,560 --> 00:14:42,840 Speaker 5: been one case created, was canceled and they called and 271 00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:45,280 Speaker 5: gave me the bad news. And then the next day 272 00:14:45,320 --> 00:14:46,920 Speaker 5: they called and said, we want to hire you on 273 00:14:47,000 --> 00:14:49,920 Speaker 5: another show that we're doing. And you go, okay, can 274 00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:51,400 Speaker 5: I take all the writers? I go yeah, I go, 275 00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 5: all right, well we're all still working. That's great, different show. 276 00:14:55,880 --> 00:14:59,280 Speaker 2: But so when you fired some of those initial writers 277 00:14:59,280 --> 00:15:01,320 Speaker 2: that were hired to write a certain kind of TV 278 00:15:01,400 --> 00:15:03,440 Speaker 2: show that wasn't working, and you got other ones in, 279 00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:04,520 Speaker 2: like Franky. 280 00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:09,640 Speaker 5: They brought Frank in. He was not comfortable with the 281 00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:11,960 Speaker 5: whole show. He was you know, he was working and 282 00:15:12,000 --> 00:15:16,200 Speaker 5: had written a pilot for Brand Follisy. I mean, he 283 00:15:16,360 --> 00:15:18,840 Speaker 5: was kind of you know, in a tier where we 284 00:15:18,880 --> 00:15:24,360 Speaker 5: worked and you know of you know not, you know not. 285 00:15:25,920 --> 00:15:28,440 Speaker 5: I never I never used the word camp and we 286 00:15:28,520 --> 00:15:30,920 Speaker 5: never used the word soap opera. But we were. 287 00:15:30,800 --> 00:15:34,680 Speaker 1: Doing you never did the wig thing happen? 288 00:15:34,840 --> 00:15:37,680 Speaker 5: No, No, we had certain we had rules. We had rules, 289 00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:41,280 Speaker 5: rules that have followed me to other shows that I've done. 290 00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:44,720 Speaker 1: So when Marsha takes off the wig, the scar that 291 00:15:45,000 --> 00:15:47,920 Speaker 1: was Shakespeare the words May Shakespeare. 292 00:15:50,880 --> 00:15:53,080 Speaker 5: You're really looking for a word, and you're a writer 293 00:15:53,160 --> 00:15:55,640 Speaker 5: and you want to save face. You can see there's 294 00:15:55,680 --> 00:16:00,200 Speaker 5: two Actually, you say melodrama. It was mellow. Melrose was 295 00:16:00,280 --> 00:16:04,080 Speaker 5: great melodrama or Melrose was great. 296 00:16:03,800 --> 00:16:07,080 Speaker 6: And noir and that so melodrama is better than camp 297 00:16:07,320 --> 00:16:07,920 Speaker 6: or so. 298 00:16:07,960 --> 00:16:13,680 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, okay, oh okay, did we descend in the 299 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:14,480 Speaker 1: last years. 300 00:16:14,560 --> 00:16:16,280 Speaker 5: I mean, luckily you didn't have to be there. 301 00:16:16,480 --> 00:16:18,240 Speaker 1: And you're thinking guys were doing soap opera. I know 302 00:16:18,240 --> 00:16:19,600 Speaker 1: we're not saying it, but I know what we're doing 303 00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:20,880 Speaker 1: because you knew. 304 00:16:20,880 --> 00:16:23,520 Speaker 5: But I knew, but we had certain thing ways and 305 00:16:23,640 --> 00:16:25,680 Speaker 5: I mean this was okay, I'll go back to we 306 00:16:25,720 --> 00:16:27,640 Speaker 5: have the meeting with the Fox meeting, and they were 307 00:16:27,640 --> 00:16:31,120 Speaker 5: all wearing really short tennis shorts and they looked ridiculous. 308 00:16:32,200 --> 00:16:34,720 Speaker 5: I mean they look I mean, if you can imagine 309 00:16:34,760 --> 00:16:39,920 Speaker 5: these guys without tennis shorts, they're kind of let's not 310 00:16:40,120 --> 00:16:44,560 Speaker 5: let's not imagine that the shorts because they had been 311 00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:47,240 Speaker 5: playing tennis at the Beverly Hills Tennis Club or whatever. 312 00:16:47,280 --> 00:16:51,040 Speaker 5: But so they they called us in and they said, 313 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:53,560 Speaker 5: and before the meeting, Darren looks at me, he goes, 314 00:16:53,880 --> 00:16:56,240 Speaker 5: you know what, this is about I bet you figured 315 00:16:56,240 --> 00:17:01,880 Speaker 5: it out. And I go, no, these people don't talk 316 00:17:01,920 --> 00:17:04,760 Speaker 5: to me, you know. I mean, Aaron barely you know, 317 00:17:04,760 --> 00:17:09,840 Speaker 5: knows Aaron knew I was. But he goes taking to 318 00:17:09,880 --> 00:17:11,600 Speaker 5: tell us to turn it into a soap. I know 319 00:17:11,720 --> 00:17:14,800 Speaker 5: they are, and I looked at I said, well, you know, 320 00:17:15,320 --> 00:17:17,520 Speaker 5: it'd be really easy to do, and we are kind 321 00:17:17,520 --> 00:17:22,120 Speaker 5: of tiptoeing into it a little bit, and and certainly 322 00:17:22,119 --> 00:17:25,600 Speaker 5: with the introduction of Marsha's character, but and. 323 00:17:25,520 --> 00:17:27,280 Speaker 3: You're like, I'm here, and I look at him on 324 00:17:27,320 --> 00:17:27,680 Speaker 3: my sad. 325 00:17:28,240 --> 00:17:30,040 Speaker 5: I said, well, let's just go listen to what they say. 326 00:17:30,080 --> 00:17:31,679 Speaker 5: And he goes, I don't want to do a soap, 327 00:17:32,200 --> 00:17:34,879 Speaker 5: and I go, oh, it's such a soap and I 328 00:17:34,920 --> 00:17:37,520 Speaker 5: went okay, I said. I said, okay, well, you know 329 00:17:38,720 --> 00:17:40,359 Speaker 5: there's no way we're going to make it one hundred 330 00:17:40,359 --> 00:17:43,680 Speaker 5: percent of soap, you know. And I said, so let's 331 00:17:43,680 --> 00:17:46,679 Speaker 5: not worry about it. So we went in and they said, 332 00:17:47,119 --> 00:17:49,919 Speaker 5: like right out of Bob Greenlet's mouth, we wanted to 333 00:17:49,920 --> 00:17:52,720 Speaker 5: turn it into a soap. What would you do? And 334 00:17:53,119 --> 00:17:56,040 Speaker 5: Aaron wasn't there, you know, And I said, they've talked 335 00:17:56,080 --> 00:17:59,919 Speaker 5: to Aaron for sure, because they used words like Dynas, 336 00:18:00,080 --> 00:18:05,080 Speaker 5: Steve Dallas and you know and everything, and we said okay, 337 00:18:05,240 --> 00:18:08,520 Speaker 5: and they sort of said it as an ultimatum, you know. 338 00:18:08,680 --> 00:18:11,520 Speaker 5: As we left, I said that was an ultimatum. And 339 00:18:11,600 --> 00:18:16,280 Speaker 5: Frank was was on at that point, and uh, and. 340 00:18:16,160 --> 00:18:19,080 Speaker 2: So who said, don't worry Darren, it'll be a melodrama. 341 00:18:20,400 --> 00:18:24,080 Speaker 5: That came later, but no. And then we went out 342 00:18:24,200 --> 00:18:26,919 Speaker 5: and I said, uh, let's give it a try, Darren. 343 00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:29,840 Speaker 5: You know, I think it'll be fun, you know, and 344 00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:32,600 Speaker 5: he goes, well, you know all the you know Chip used. 345 00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:35,880 Speaker 5: I listened to him and he used the you know, tropes. 346 00:18:36,119 --> 00:18:38,320 Speaker 5: It's not a word I love, but uh, you know, 347 00:18:38,800 --> 00:18:42,480 Speaker 5: there are certain conventions and soap operas and we introduced them, 348 00:18:42,720 --> 00:18:46,320 Speaker 5: which is why, you know, when you guys think about it, 349 00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:50,159 Speaker 5: why did Keith come in? You know, you had the 350 00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:53,520 Speaker 5: ex husband. Did he ever show up? I don't even yes, 351 00:18:55,359 --> 00:18:58,239 Speaker 5: Oh my god, I love Linda. He would show up 352 00:18:58,280 --> 00:18:59,880 Speaker 5: to he would show up to work with his surf 353 00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:05,040 Speaker 5: board and b m W convertible audience, you know, and oh, 354 00:19:05,119 --> 00:19:08,960 Speaker 5: there's there's Heather in her Porsche. A good story about 355 00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:18,120 Speaker 5: Heather's Porsche. I'm jumping around, I was. 356 00:19:15,800 --> 00:19:16,720 Speaker 1: I was. 357 00:19:16,880 --> 00:19:19,240 Speaker 5: I had written and directed an episode. It was really 358 00:19:19,400 --> 00:19:22,639 Speaker 5: late late in the in the run of the show, 359 00:19:22,680 --> 00:19:24,320 Speaker 5: and we were out at the beach House and we 360 00:19:24,359 --> 00:19:25,920 Speaker 5: were on and we were shooting a scene where she's 361 00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:27,840 Speaker 5: at a door and she says something and then she 362 00:19:27,920 --> 00:19:30,399 Speaker 5: goes out the you know whatever that front door was 363 00:19:30,720 --> 00:19:33,720 Speaker 5: and Lee's and uh, I have noise in my head, 364 00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:36,600 Speaker 5: sat under what that is? And Forrest calls over and 365 00:19:36,600 --> 00:19:39,840 Speaker 5: he goes, it's her car. I go, it's her car 366 00:19:40,080 --> 00:19:43,080 Speaker 5: and they go. He goes, somebody turned off Heather's car 367 00:19:43,280 --> 00:19:46,280 Speaker 5: and they turned it off. And so she set her line, 368 00:19:46,600 --> 00:19:49,359 Speaker 5: went out the door, closed the door, and then she's 369 00:19:49,359 --> 00:19:51,800 Speaker 5: standing out there and I say print and I hear 370 00:19:51,880 --> 00:19:57,560 Speaker 5: in the headseto. They backed it up right almost to 371 00:19:57,640 --> 00:19:59,960 Speaker 5: the door. So she got in the car and boom, 372 00:20:00,200 --> 00:20:02,639 Speaker 5: she was gone. I thought, it's really come to this. 373 00:20:02,800 --> 00:20:05,480 Speaker 5: It's like, I'm only going to work to the very 374 00:20:05,680 --> 00:20:06,520 Speaker 5: last second. 375 00:20:11,359 --> 00:20:12,399 Speaker 3: They were a long hours. 376 00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:15,480 Speaker 5: Oh I know, I know. Look when I started to direct, 377 00:20:15,560 --> 00:20:19,520 Speaker 5: I realized really how awful it was for you guys. 378 00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:22,960 Speaker 5: The doing scenes on the on the beach and during 379 00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:27,679 Speaker 5: El Nino with Heather, and she wore she wore ugs, 380 00:20:27,720 --> 00:20:29,760 Speaker 5: you know, and they showed up in like a key 381 00:20:29,800 --> 00:20:32,560 Speaker 5: shot and we go, oh, she's supposed to be barefoot 382 00:20:32,640 --> 00:20:34,720 Speaker 5: in the Dominican Republic. 383 00:20:37,359 --> 00:20:40,119 Speaker 2: Speaking, because that's all the last part of Melrose. Do 384 00:20:40,200 --> 00:20:43,920 Speaker 2: you feel like it was really different two different shows. 385 00:20:44,040 --> 00:20:46,200 Speaker 2: I mean a lot of people on the writer stuff 386 00:20:46,200 --> 00:20:47,600 Speaker 2: had gone, a lot of actors. 387 00:20:47,680 --> 00:20:50,240 Speaker 5: You know, we did so many episodes, as you guys know, 388 00:20:50,440 --> 00:20:53,080 Speaker 5: I know you've talked about double ups, and for us, 389 00:20:53,119 --> 00:20:55,440 Speaker 5: we had to write them that fast. Yeah, a lot 390 00:20:55,440 --> 00:21:00,320 Speaker 5: of inexperienced writers and very little rewriting more rewrite on 391 00:21:00,359 --> 00:21:03,119 Speaker 5: every show I've ever worked on, you know, just just 392 00:21:03,280 --> 00:21:08,320 Speaker 5: notes and you know, inner workings with the writers. But 393 00:21:08,440 --> 00:21:10,560 Speaker 5: you know, we would have to rewrite and hold the 394 00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:13,520 Speaker 5: hands of young writers just to get the scripts, you know, 395 00:21:13,640 --> 00:21:17,040 Speaker 5: get enough scripts ready to go. Uh. And we plotted 396 00:21:17,080 --> 00:21:18,760 Speaker 5: them one after the other, and we got to the 397 00:21:18,760 --> 00:21:21,439 Speaker 5: point where we could plot a show, you know, for 398 00:21:21,480 --> 00:21:26,000 Speaker 5: an outline, in a day, day and a half. We 399 00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:28,119 Speaker 5: we would then take a few days off to write 400 00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:31,320 Speaker 5: and take a breath, but then we would jump in, 401 00:21:31,440 --> 00:21:33,520 Speaker 5: you know, and my everyone said I was really good 402 00:21:33,560 --> 00:21:36,240 Speaker 5: in the room. But you know, and I've always kind 403 00:21:36,240 --> 00:21:39,080 Speaker 5: of had that reputation and I, and I thought, what 404 00:21:39,160 --> 00:21:41,440 Speaker 5: do I tell young writers now, because you know, I've 405 00:21:41,480 --> 00:21:45,200 Speaker 5: mentored a number of them now, And I said, well, 406 00:21:45,359 --> 00:21:48,080 Speaker 5: when the day ends at you know, seven or whatever 407 00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:50,960 Speaker 5: the writer's room, we're all exhausted, we're going home. There's 408 00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:54,080 Speaker 5: going to be some question about like, well, what's Sydney 409 00:21:54,160 --> 00:21:57,080 Speaker 5: going to do tomorrow? And you know, you know she's 410 00:21:57,359 --> 00:21:59,320 Speaker 5: trapped in this tunnel and how are we going to 411 00:21:59,400 --> 00:22:01,840 Speaker 5: get her out? What does this mean? You know? And 412 00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:05,080 Speaker 5: all the writers would come back, think, get their coffee 413 00:22:05,080 --> 00:22:07,560 Speaker 5: and say, okay, now what were you going to do? 414 00:22:07,720 --> 00:22:11,359 Speaker 5: I would go home and sit, you know, blank stare 415 00:22:11,480 --> 00:22:14,600 Speaker 5: you know, my wife always going he's writing again, you know, 416 00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:17,719 Speaker 5: and and sit and think and then I would have 417 00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:19,959 Speaker 5: the solution. So we start the meeting. I go how 418 00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:22,360 Speaker 5: about this? And I would go, oh my god, where 419 00:22:22,359 --> 00:22:24,240 Speaker 5: did you get that? I go, well, you know, it 420 00:22:24,280 --> 00:22:27,119 Speaker 5: took a little while when I was alone, and I 421 00:22:27,240 --> 00:22:31,399 Speaker 5: did it, but yeah, it might have been so priting. 422 00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:33,439 Speaker 3: But how far ahead were you plotting? 423 00:22:33,440 --> 00:22:35,520 Speaker 1: Because we talked about, you know, when Marcia came in 424 00:22:35,560 --> 00:22:38,400 Speaker 1: and she's got the early scenes with Thomas, or when 425 00:22:38,840 --> 00:22:41,280 Speaker 1: Laura came on, would you see someone who was like 426 00:22:41,320 --> 00:22:44,640 Speaker 1: a shorter arc and you'd see something and go oh 427 00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:45,840 Speaker 1: and get a storia. 428 00:22:45,560 --> 00:22:47,560 Speaker 5: And then we would and then we would change. Yeah, 429 00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:48,680 Speaker 5: it's when did. 430 00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:50,240 Speaker 1: You know that you were going to bring Laura back? 431 00:22:50,240 --> 00:22:52,960 Speaker 1: Because she was so adorable on the show, But did 432 00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:54,000 Speaker 1: you know right then? 433 00:22:54,240 --> 00:22:57,919 Speaker 5: It was you know, I can't think specific episodes, but 434 00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:02,760 Speaker 5: I remember that you had been in in Michael's It 435 00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:05,520 Speaker 5: was you were hired on a short run, as I recall, 436 00:23:05,520 --> 00:23:07,120 Speaker 5: I don't know how many episodes. 437 00:23:06,720 --> 00:23:09,280 Speaker 6: Two episodes as a guest in the first season, and 438 00:23:09,320 --> 00:23:10,200 Speaker 6: that was it, and. 439 00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:12,199 Speaker 5: That was it? Was it the first season or the 440 00:23:12,280 --> 00:23:15,520 Speaker 5: second season where you were walking away from the house, 441 00:23:15,680 --> 00:23:17,560 Speaker 5: you know, you walk away from the beach house and 442 00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:20,040 Speaker 5: Michael was looking out the window and you were kind 443 00:23:20,080 --> 00:23:24,800 Speaker 5: of dancing. Yeah, okay, so its being in the second season, 444 00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:27,320 Speaker 5: and you know, we used to play tricks in the 445 00:23:27,920 --> 00:23:31,120 Speaker 5: mixing booth, which is something Chipped and talked about because 446 00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:34,000 Speaker 5: he wasn't there, but we would, you know, we put 447 00:23:34,000 --> 00:23:36,440 Speaker 5: farts in you know, I mean the sound guys would 448 00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:42,000 Speaker 5: put farts into the most the first one. The first 449 00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:45,040 Speaker 5: one came really early because they knew that I loved it, 450 00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:48,359 Speaker 5: you know, and Frank two that we would laugh and Darren, 451 00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:49,480 Speaker 5: I mean we all just. 452 00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:51,520 Speaker 6: You think that Sydney was dancing down the beach and 453 00:23:51,560 --> 00:23:52,320 Speaker 6: she was making sarting. 454 00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:57,000 Speaker 5: But the first one we did was was Andrew and 455 00:23:57,040 --> 00:23:59,199 Speaker 5: he bent over and he opened refrigerator. I think it 456 00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:02,440 Speaker 5: ended up in the putting credits to get some orange 457 00:24:02,520 --> 00:24:05,320 Speaker 5: juice or something and he bends over and to get 458 00:24:05,359 --> 00:24:10,359 Speaker 5: the orgins and they just put a little you know literally, 459 00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:13,359 Speaker 5: you know, farts make people laugh. So we would just 460 00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:15,840 Speaker 5: sit there and laugh and laugh and laugh. 461 00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:16,760 Speaker 3: You can't leave it. 462 00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:18,320 Speaker 5: We take it out. 463 00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:21,720 Speaker 6: You have the they. 464 00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:23,400 Speaker 5: Have it on a stema and they pull it out. 465 00:24:23,800 --> 00:24:25,720 Speaker 1: But you know, I will say this, having worked on 466 00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:27,399 Speaker 1: two and a half men, they do put them in 467 00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:28,239 Speaker 1: and they keep them in. 468 00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:30,320 Speaker 3: They just they just add them. 469 00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:32,720 Speaker 1: It's like, oh, could you not please not? Yeah, like 470 00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:35,480 Speaker 1: they that's what they do and keep it in. 471 00:24:37,680 --> 00:24:40,440 Speaker 5: That's just But they did one with you. It was 472 00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:42,919 Speaker 5: the first one that we called it a talking you know, 473 00:24:43,080 --> 00:24:46,240 Speaker 5: goof and it's that as you were walking off the beat, 474 00:24:46,359 --> 00:24:49,040 Speaker 5: walking down the beach, you were going you would recorded 475 00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:51,920 Speaker 5: during you know, during when you were looping, you'd recorded 476 00:24:51,920 --> 00:24:54,440 Speaker 5: this whole thing about I'm going down the beach. Here, 477 00:24:54,560 --> 00:24:57,879 Speaker 5: I go down the beach. Darren Starr is going to 478 00:24:58,040 --> 00:25:00,920 Speaker 5: really put me in a lot of episodes. Now, you know, boy, 479 00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:03,360 Speaker 5: I mean you just. 480 00:25:03,400 --> 00:25:05,040 Speaker 3: Talked and you did that. 481 00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:07,919 Speaker 6: Somebody asked me to do that, and looping and I 482 00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:08,159 Speaker 6: did it. 483 00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:09,840 Speaker 5: Yeah you don't remember. 484 00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:14,760 Speaker 6: I mean it sounds possible, it sounds good for you, 485 00:25:14,840 --> 00:25:18,720 Speaker 6: and somebody asked me to do it and Granted. 486 00:25:23,320 --> 00:25:25,199 Speaker 1: Now did you because we noticed in watching it that 487 00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:26,840 Speaker 1: all of a sudden, it's like eight nice kids trying 488 00:25:26,880 --> 00:25:27,960 Speaker 1: to make it and all of a sudden, there's an 489 00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:32,480 Speaker 1: episode where it's just I think it was me and 490 00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:35,200 Speaker 1: Andrew and you and Grant, Right, all of a sudden, 491 00:25:35,200 --> 00:25:38,360 Speaker 1: it's just these romances against each other. 492 00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:41,000 Speaker 6: Yeah, because like carrying through they were. 493 00:25:41,000 --> 00:25:43,040 Speaker 3: Yeah, like they were like there were just two sexy. 494 00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:45,480 Speaker 1: It's just everybody. It was me and Keith, So it's 495 00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:48,120 Speaker 1: just it's just make out to make up everything. Did 496 00:25:48,119 --> 00:25:50,760 Speaker 1: we do anything but make out these No? 497 00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:55,320 Speaker 5: Well, you know what what happened at the end once 498 00:25:55,359 --> 00:25:59,480 Speaker 5: we turned into a sob the triangles start to Crisco. 499 00:26:00,280 --> 00:26:03,600 Speaker 5: We'll give Jane sister. We need this marriage is so boring. 500 00:26:03,680 --> 00:26:06,200 Speaker 5: We need to do something. They've had a miscarriage. We're 501 00:26:06,240 --> 00:26:11,040 Speaker 5: out of story, so I just want to read the 502 00:26:11,080 --> 00:26:15,840 Speaker 5: paper everywhere. So so so we were, you know, we 503 00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:18,639 Speaker 5: started experimenting with it, and Marcia was one and you 504 00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:24,119 Speaker 5: were the other. Marcia came in two show arc and 505 00:26:24,160 --> 00:26:27,200 Speaker 5: it was just supposed to be a slight flirtation and 506 00:26:27,280 --> 00:26:30,760 Speaker 5: it was I think it was Nancy Malone. And I 507 00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:33,080 Speaker 5: did the casting, so she had a co producer and 508 00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:35,040 Speaker 5: the director of the casting. You know, there weren't the 509 00:26:35,720 --> 00:26:39,080 Speaker 5: line of executive producers. No one was there. And she 510 00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:41,919 Speaker 5: walked in and I went, oh my god, she's Nicole Kidman, 511 00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:45,359 Speaker 5: only I think she's actually more beautiful and I and 512 00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:49,119 Speaker 5: then she gave this really good performance and we go great, 513 00:26:49,240 --> 00:26:52,040 Speaker 5: you know. So she did her scenes and I'm telling everybody, 514 00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:54,840 Speaker 5: look at dailies, look at this person. So right away, 515 00:26:55,320 --> 00:26:57,480 Speaker 5: you know a few of us went, oh my god, 516 00:26:57,560 --> 00:27:00,200 Speaker 5: lightning in a bottle. This is great. And we thought, 517 00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:03,560 Speaker 5: and this is what we used to mess with originally 518 00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:06,920 Speaker 5: to yeah to the the couple. 519 00:27:07,080 --> 00:27:10,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, because we've seen her on and it's so small. 520 00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:12,600 Speaker 2: I mean we saw her two different episodes. 521 00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:15,520 Speaker 5: She's in an elevator, there's a scene where she's literally 522 00:27:15,520 --> 00:27:17,560 Speaker 5: in an elevator and she just looks at him and 523 00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:20,119 Speaker 5: he looks at her. I mean, and I remember thinking, 524 00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:22,080 Speaker 5: oh my god, it was all subtext. 525 00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:23,720 Speaker 3: It was possibility, was there. 526 00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:28,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, she's disappeared, so yeah, it's interesting. 527 00:27:28,280 --> 00:27:31,119 Speaker 5: And she disappeared, and it took a while for us 528 00:27:31,160 --> 00:27:34,280 Speaker 5: to get her to come back, I mean, or to 529 00:27:34,600 --> 00:27:37,679 Speaker 5: get people to say, yeah, there's really something here, and 530 00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:39,639 Speaker 5: then you know the rest, and then we killed her 531 00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:40,640 Speaker 5: off and. 532 00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:44,639 Speaker 6: Then you need the whole started the whole Melrose, and 533 00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:46,400 Speaker 6: then why not Sydney and Kimberly? 534 00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:52,919 Speaker 3: Why not both crazy? Still waiting who did you have 535 00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:55,960 Speaker 3: an affair with? First? I don't remember, you know, that's 536 00:27:56,080 --> 00:27:57,560 Speaker 3: I think Michael didn't. 537 00:27:58,119 --> 00:28:02,480 Speaker 2: I don't think it was I think it was you. 538 00:28:03,240 --> 00:28:05,960 Speaker 5: And then after you, I don't remember. 539 00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:07,520 Speaker 6: Yeah, I feel like I feel. 540 00:28:07,359 --> 00:28:09,960 Speaker 5: Like somebody in this room is not on top of. 541 00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:13,840 Speaker 6: Things, watching in real time, and we're just not there yet. 542 00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:14,480 Speaker 2: Yeah. 543 00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:18,240 Speaker 5: So getting back to what you said, because it's really interesting. 544 00:28:18,280 --> 00:28:21,679 Speaker 5: So we have the meaning tonative. So so we said, okay, uh, 545 00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:23,359 Speaker 5: you know, and the first thing you do is you 546 00:28:23,400 --> 00:28:29,200 Speaker 5: create triangles, quadrangles, you bring in the bedroom so to speak. 547 00:28:29,240 --> 00:28:31,439 Speaker 5: I'm trying to be when do we even get rid 548 00:28:31,480 --> 00:28:34,520 Speaker 5: of the bedroom. It's I know, well, once we started, 549 00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:38,400 Speaker 5: we never did. And you know, the the initial concept was, 550 00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:42,480 Speaker 5: you know, a platonic relationship between you know, and Darren 551 00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:45,160 Speaker 5: always told me it was the platonic relationship he had 552 00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:48,040 Speaker 5: with you when you were roommates, that that was the 553 00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:49,040 Speaker 5: influence of the show. 554 00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:53,680 Speaker 2: Remember, well, do you remember I remember him saying he 555 00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:54,760 Speaker 2: based Allison on me. 556 00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:55,560 Speaker 5: We did. 557 00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:58,360 Speaker 3: We lived in a tiny little apartment. He had a 558 00:28:58,400 --> 00:29:00,880 Speaker 3: guy roommate. I have a girl roommate. 559 00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:03,680 Speaker 2: We shared one bathroom, I believe, in this tiny little 560 00:29:03,800 --> 00:29:05,840 Speaker 2: right off UCLA because we're uc together. 561 00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:08,640 Speaker 3: And uh, I mean, but I don't see how it 562 00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:12,720 Speaker 3: was me because it wasn't He wasn't. I not his type, Billy. 563 00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:15,000 Speaker 3: Those two kind of moon for each other. But that's 564 00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:17,240 Speaker 3: not it obviously. 565 00:29:19,040 --> 00:29:21,640 Speaker 1: But was that always the plan or was it just 566 00:29:21,840 --> 00:29:24,320 Speaker 1: that Andrew and I fell into bed so quickly. 567 00:29:24,360 --> 00:29:29,080 Speaker 5: They so interesting I thought it took forever to get 568 00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:31,040 Speaker 5: you to a bit I remember. 569 00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:35,000 Speaker 6: I mean, and you're talking about on camera the show 570 00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:39,320 Speaker 6: in real life, it was like we wanted to bring 571 00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:39,840 Speaker 6: the show to. 572 00:29:41,760 --> 00:29:43,600 Speaker 3: For a long time. And I'm a professional, I'm like, 573 00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:45,000 Speaker 3: oh my god, it was episode two. 574 00:29:46,640 --> 00:29:49,080 Speaker 5: Well it was. It was like two, I go, we 575 00:29:49,160 --> 00:29:51,760 Speaker 5: can't keep these guys platonic for long, I mean on 576 00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:56,280 Speaker 5: the show as characters, I mean, and so we thought, okay, 577 00:29:56,400 --> 00:29:59,040 Speaker 5: and you know, well, well we'll build to it. So 578 00:29:59,240 --> 00:30:01,719 Speaker 5: we put every kind of a you know, soap impediment 579 00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:04,560 Speaker 5: between the two of you, and it really it really worked. 580 00:30:04,640 --> 00:30:06,120 Speaker 5: I mean it really worked. 581 00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:06,720 Speaker 1: Heather. 582 00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:10,440 Speaker 5: Heather was you know, no different than Marsha Cross. I mean, yes, 583 00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:12,960 Speaker 5: she was the great Heather Locklayer. And there was you know, 584 00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:16,680 Speaker 5: I mean the casting of Heather. The writers were really 585 00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:20,400 Speaker 5: had nothing to do with it, including Darren for a while. 586 00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:22,920 Speaker 5: He might you know, correct me, and I just don't know. 587 00:30:23,040 --> 00:30:28,480 Speaker 5: But it was like we created the character first. We didn't. Wow, 588 00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:31,240 Speaker 5: somebody didn't come to us and say create a character 589 00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:36,800 Speaker 5: for Heather Locklayer. No, because you we said okay, well 590 00:30:37,000 --> 00:30:39,480 Speaker 5: and then I guarantee this was me. But you were 591 00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:44,360 Speaker 5: working you know, in an ad agency and with Lucy. 592 00:30:45,560 --> 00:30:46,000 Speaker 6: Every year. 593 00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:50,720 Speaker 5: Yeah, Deborah, and you know that was good. But it 594 00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:53,160 Speaker 5: was good on an episodic basis. It was she's a 595 00:30:53,200 --> 00:30:56,360 Speaker 5: small part. You two, you don't get along. She's an 596 00:30:56,440 --> 00:31:00,320 Speaker 5: evil boss, a Devilwar's product. Uh, you know, and that 597 00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:04,480 Speaker 5: that's a you know, episodic kind of a relationship. And 598 00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:06,920 Speaker 5: so when we turned it into a soap, we said, 599 00:31:07,240 --> 00:31:09,120 Speaker 5: we should get rid of Lucy and we should bring 600 00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:13,800 Speaker 5: somebody in who wants you know, who tortures you, but 601 00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:17,360 Speaker 5: wants your guy, you know, and that will slow down 602 00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:20,680 Speaker 5: Billy and Allison is if we bring somebody between him 603 00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:23,640 Speaker 5: who's beautiful, who he falls in love with and makes 604 00:31:23,720 --> 00:31:26,840 Speaker 5: all that stupid mistake and then it sends you to 605 00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:29,040 Speaker 5: the keys of the world and all of that. So 606 00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:31,760 Speaker 5: it kind of it happened that way. And then we 607 00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:35,640 Speaker 5: started casting and we actually did read some actresses I remember, 608 00:31:36,040 --> 00:31:38,600 Speaker 5: and then you know, with just you know, the lowly 609 00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:42,120 Speaker 5: producers and uh and then Aaron calls up and says, 610 00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:46,920 Speaker 5: how about Heather Lockleyar, I mean, he really, I'm doing 611 00:31:46,920 --> 00:31:50,520 Speaker 5: my errand imitation have we've done it years respect for 612 00:31:50,640 --> 00:31:54,480 Speaker 5: the you know, the dearly departed. But he said, guys, 613 00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:58,200 Speaker 5: you know Heather, she's she's great, she's magic, you know, 614 00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:01,120 Speaker 5: those eyes, and you know she's been real good for me. 615 00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:03,560 Speaker 5: She's my lucky penny, you know. And we had this 616 00:32:03,680 --> 00:32:05,920 Speaker 5: like conference call where we're all listening to this and 617 00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:09,440 Speaker 5: going oh okay, all right, uh, you know, and then 618 00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:11,080 Speaker 5: hung up the phone. We go, you know, she's going 619 00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:14,320 Speaker 5: to take over the show, you know, thank god, you know, 620 00:32:14,560 --> 00:32:19,040 Speaker 5: yea over things. Yeah, no, and uh and then we 621 00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:23,000 Speaker 5: all calmed down and then uh, Aaron had sent down, 622 00:32:23,520 --> 00:32:28,960 Speaker 5: you know, a VHS of a movie. She'd just done 623 00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:31,040 Speaker 5: something up in you know, movie of the week up 624 00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:34,719 Speaker 5: in Canada, and she she had done it. And we 625 00:32:34,760 --> 00:32:36,800 Speaker 5: looked at her and she looked fabulous. 626 00:32:36,960 --> 00:32:38,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, she didn't look any older. 627 00:32:38,600 --> 00:32:42,560 Speaker 5: I thought, oh my god, yeah, she looks amazing, amazing. 628 00:32:42,680 --> 00:32:45,440 Speaker 5: So so you know, we hired her. And then she 629 00:32:45,480 --> 00:32:47,959 Speaker 5: didn't want to be a bitch, and you know, so 630 00:32:48,400 --> 00:32:51,960 Speaker 5: we did some last minute rewriting which we weren't used 631 00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:55,280 Speaker 5: to make her not a bitch. And then you know, 632 00:32:55,320 --> 00:32:58,280 Speaker 5: we're looking at the cuts, going, it doesn't matter what 633 00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:02,480 Speaker 5: we wrote, it's coming out out. You know. The subtext 634 00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:05,280 Speaker 5: she she just she knew how to put. She was 635 00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:07,440 Speaker 5: the rival, you know, she was going to be a 636 00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:09,800 Speaker 5: little troublemaker, and you know it was I. 637 00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:12,680 Speaker 1: Thought it was her natural sweetness that sort of shone 638 00:33:12,720 --> 00:33:14,920 Speaker 1: through because you wanted to hate her, but you couldn't 639 00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:17,600 Speaker 1: fight because she was saying to Alison, is it okay? 640 00:33:17,680 --> 00:33:21,640 Speaker 1: There something going on? And Allison kept stumbling over herself. Yeah, yeah, 641 00:33:22,040 --> 00:33:24,440 Speaker 1: that's interesting that you wrote it that way. But then 642 00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:25,680 Speaker 1: has there such a good bitch later? 643 00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:28,760 Speaker 5: So yeah, but yeah, I mean she developed that way 644 00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:31,280 Speaker 5: once the you know, once the blinders are off. I mean, 645 00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:34,920 Speaker 5: when she slept with Billy, you know, it was like, okay, 646 00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:35,760 Speaker 5: you can't. 647 00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:37,560 Speaker 6: Keep playing it, and she kept throwing it in your 648 00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:39,240 Speaker 6: face and yeah. 649 00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:41,760 Speaker 5: And you'll have the proverbial wish that she'd never been born. 650 00:33:41,840 --> 00:33:48,240 Speaker 5: I wrote that line, that's right, it's a it's a 651 00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:53,080 Speaker 5: line that I taught writing at Chapman College for two 652 00:33:53,120 --> 00:33:56,959 Speaker 5: years a while back, while I was doing the Secrets 653 00:33:56,960 --> 00:34:01,360 Speaker 5: of Self Springs. But I would show them clips of Melrose. 654 00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:03,800 Speaker 5: You know, uh, you know these are young, you know, 655 00:34:03,880 --> 00:34:06,480 Speaker 5: they all are all gonna be great screenwriters in their minds, 656 00:34:06,560 --> 00:34:09,560 Speaker 5: you know, and uh, and I show them the line. 657 00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:12,399 Speaker 5: But I would show I'd show clips from YouTube because 658 00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:15,319 Speaker 5: there's no way that they would you know, read, or 659 00:34:15,400 --> 00:34:17,560 Speaker 5: that I could be able to find the script. And 660 00:34:17,960 --> 00:34:20,960 Speaker 5: the one I would do is is Heather backs you 661 00:34:21,040 --> 00:34:23,040 Speaker 5: into a corner at D and D. There were like 662 00:34:23,160 --> 00:34:26,200 Speaker 5: five of them after I wrote mine. Everybody started to 663 00:34:26,200 --> 00:34:28,600 Speaker 5: write it, and it's the thing. She goes, I'm gonna 664 00:34:28,600 --> 00:34:32,080 Speaker 5: make I'm gonna make your life so miserable, and then 665 00:34:32,120 --> 00:34:36,120 Speaker 5: you'll have that proverbial wish you'd never been born? Do 666 00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:39,160 Speaker 5: you remember? Was great? 667 00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:42,960 Speaker 3: I don't like And we said. 668 00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:45,000 Speaker 5: It was the you know, there were certain you know 669 00:34:45,160 --> 00:34:48,920 Speaker 5: moments we call them. You know, Uh, that's Melrose, we 670 00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:52,040 Speaker 5: would say, and we go that scene, we go, that's Melrose. 671 00:34:52,040 --> 00:34:54,239 Speaker 5: We're just sitting in the editing room. We go, that's 672 00:34:54,280 --> 00:35:01,960 Speaker 5: me and what's his name on Channel five? Who just 673 00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:06,520 Speaker 5: passed away? Yeah, yeah, he did his quote of the week. Uh, 674 00:35:06,680 --> 00:35:09,440 Speaker 5: you know, so we would all, you know, the competition, 675 00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:11,680 Speaker 5: you know, like that line. 676 00:35:11,880 --> 00:35:14,400 Speaker 6: Didn't Sydney say to her own mother, get back on 677 00:35:14,440 --> 00:35:15,600 Speaker 6: your broomstick and fly back. 678 00:35:16,200 --> 00:35:21,120 Speaker 5: That famous life life? I think Darren wrote that, I 679 00:35:21,120 --> 00:35:25,480 Speaker 5: don't remember. Yeah, it wasn't Frank. Frank. Frank was so 680 00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:29,000 Speaker 5: in the beginning uncomfortable with all of it. There was 681 00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:32,640 Speaker 5: a great, a great moment. Frank, he's not gonna be listening, 682 00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:35,080 Speaker 5: but if he is, he'll go, I'm gonna call Chuck. 683 00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:40,919 Speaker 5: But we were. It was his first episode. I think 684 00:35:41,080 --> 00:35:44,560 Speaker 5: that he wrote that's like episode eight, I want to say, uh, 685 00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:49,520 Speaker 5: and he had jake probably your door or it might 686 00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:53,200 Speaker 5: have been your door. I don't know whose doory was that, 687 00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:55,640 Speaker 5: but he was saying and he recited poetry. 688 00:35:56,840 --> 00:36:02,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, we were all like, oh Cashmire lyrics, cashmre. 689 00:36:02,480 --> 00:36:03,920 Speaker 3: Sweater and he does the thing. 690 00:36:04,160 --> 00:36:06,799 Speaker 5: But anyhow, it was so not what we've been doing 691 00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:09,439 Speaker 5: up until then. It was. It was well written. Frank. 692 00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:14,919 Speaker 5: That was his first script. And so we're in we're 693 00:36:14,920 --> 00:36:20,160 Speaker 5: in the editing room looking at it and going cut it, Frank, 694 00:36:20,239 --> 00:36:22,560 Speaker 5: cut it, cut it, cut it. Just having walk up, 695 00:36:22,640 --> 00:36:25,200 Speaker 5: We'll just you know, cut all the dialogue and just 696 00:36:25,239 --> 00:36:27,239 Speaker 5: a look and then we'll be out. You know, I 697 00:36:27,239 --> 00:36:31,520 Speaker 5: mean it was, it was. It was fine, but Frank's going, no, no, no, no, 698 00:36:32,120 --> 00:36:34,759 Speaker 5: it's the whole crux. It's the whole thing. It's the 699 00:36:34,840 --> 00:36:38,200 Speaker 5: whole theme that poem. I love that poem. I've read 700 00:36:38,200 --> 00:36:40,399 Speaker 5: read that poem to my wife and she said yes 701 00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:42,840 Speaker 5: when we got married. Anyway, he was passionate about. 702 00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:45,200 Speaker 2: It so well, the girls loved it, and. 703 00:36:48,040 --> 00:36:52,319 Speaker 5: I had bike liked it. You know, I think, you know, 704 00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:54,839 Speaker 5: I think it was it was you know, I don't 705 00:36:54,840 --> 00:36:58,000 Speaker 5: remember other people's reaction to it, except Darren was a 706 00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:01,560 Speaker 5: little like there was always a little like this with Frank. 707 00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:04,319 Speaker 2: And uh, how long did it take for Frank to 708 00:37:04,360 --> 00:37:04,759 Speaker 2: come around? 709 00:37:05,000 --> 00:37:08,400 Speaker 5: Well, no, this is this is a story. So you know, 710 00:37:08,520 --> 00:37:11,239 Speaker 5: we would all we would march up, you know, got 711 00:37:11,320 --> 00:37:13,680 Speaker 5: in the gutter, you guys. It was almost every week, 712 00:37:13,719 --> 00:37:16,759 Speaker 5: but we would be taking a producer's cut up to 713 00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:20,080 Speaker 5: Aaron for him to do his cut. Uh, you know, 714 00:37:20,239 --> 00:37:22,640 Speaker 5: and and I mean I have a lot of stories 715 00:37:22,640 --> 00:37:26,640 Speaker 5: about those. We'd all sit on the long couch and uh, 716 00:37:26,680 --> 00:37:29,680 Speaker 5: the editors would be there and all of us chip 717 00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:31,640 Speaker 5: for a while. But then I think year two he 718 00:37:31,719 --> 00:37:34,160 Speaker 5: stopped coming. But we'd all be sitting on the couch 719 00:37:34,280 --> 00:37:36,480 Speaker 5: and Duke would be there. I mean, it was it 720 00:37:36,560 --> 00:37:39,239 Speaker 5: was the brain trust and we would turn down the 721 00:37:39,320 --> 00:37:43,160 Speaker 5: lights and then Kenny his his his post guy would 722 00:37:43,520 --> 00:37:46,600 Speaker 5: run the thing, you know, and you go and stop, 723 00:37:46,680 --> 00:37:50,759 Speaker 5: don't go for me there, you know, and you go 724 00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:53,320 Speaker 5: and then you'd watch it and then you know, you 725 00:37:53,480 --> 00:37:56,040 Speaker 5: kind of watch it by act and he'd sometimes stop 726 00:37:56,160 --> 00:37:58,879 Speaker 5: twice in the whole episode and go a great episode guy. 727 00:37:59,120 --> 00:38:02,360 Speaker 5: Sometimes he'd you know, twenty times he was having a 728 00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:05,560 Speaker 5: bad day. We were screening Frank's episode, you know, and 729 00:38:05,600 --> 00:38:08,120 Speaker 5: it was going along fine, and it came to that 730 00:38:08,280 --> 00:38:14,759 Speaker 5: scene and the big log speech at Grant given it 731 00:38:14,840 --> 00:38:19,000 Speaker 5: us all and doing the poem, and in the in 732 00:38:19,480 --> 00:38:22,400 Speaker 5: Aaron's office, you had a different feeling for the show. 733 00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:25,799 Speaker 5: It wasn't necessarily you know, it's like, what is he 734 00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:28,000 Speaker 5: going to think of it? Because he didn't you know, 735 00:38:28,480 --> 00:38:31,600 Speaker 5: he loved the show, but he saw it in context 736 00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:33,680 Speaker 5: of nine to two, one zero and other shows that 737 00:38:33,719 --> 00:38:36,640 Speaker 5: were really very different, and we wanted to be very different. 738 00:38:37,120 --> 00:38:41,120 Speaker 5: And so Frank he just I could demonstrate, but it's radio, 739 00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:44,520 Speaker 5: but he just lowered his head and put his head 740 00:38:44,520 --> 00:38:47,239 Speaker 5: in his hands. Because Aaron stopped afterwards. 741 00:38:47,560 --> 00:38:49,279 Speaker 3: Oh and you just feel it. 742 00:38:49,360 --> 00:38:56,160 Speaker 5: He goes, guys, guys, and Frank just goes down like this. 743 00:38:56,360 --> 00:38:59,560 Speaker 5: Aaron looks looks at Frank, and you know, he hadn't 744 00:38:59,560 --> 00:39:01,400 Speaker 5: known him for very long, you know, none of us, 745 00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:03,759 Speaker 5: and we're all looking at Frank, and I thought, oh 746 00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:07,200 Speaker 5: my god, he's having like a nervous breakdown, or he's 747 00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:10,080 Speaker 5: he's going to start crying. I don't know what he's 748 00:39:10,120 --> 00:39:13,440 Speaker 5: gonna do. And and Aaron goes looks at me, and 749 00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:16,640 Speaker 5: I go, I don't know, I don't know what's wrong, 750 00:39:16,880 --> 00:39:20,439 Speaker 5: you know, and everybody, and I remember Darren. Darren would 751 00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:24,120 Speaker 5: just get so amused by these things. Nothing really bothered him, 752 00:39:24,120 --> 00:39:26,760 Speaker 5: and he would just sit there certain things. Bother memore 753 00:39:26,760 --> 00:39:29,479 Speaker 5: when he took out a phone one day about something 754 00:39:29,600 --> 00:39:34,600 Speaker 5: or other. I don't remember what early on, but we're 755 00:39:34,640 --> 00:39:38,319 Speaker 5: sitting there and then Frank just gets I go I 756 00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:42,400 Speaker 5: was the one who said, Frank like a father to 757 00:39:42,440 --> 00:39:45,279 Speaker 5: a kid. Frank, and he put his head up and 758 00:39:45,320 --> 00:39:50,879 Speaker 5: he goes, cut it, just cut it, and goes, well, 759 00:39:50,960 --> 00:39:57,080 Speaker 5: we agree on that. But it stayed. It stayed. I 760 00:39:57,120 --> 00:40:02,280 Speaker 5: think that Aaron had a change of mind. It stayed. 761 00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:05,200 Speaker 3: It did seem I mean, it worked for us. 762 00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:07,319 Speaker 5: It wasn't the show. I mean, it wasn't what we'd 763 00:40:07,360 --> 00:40:09,960 Speaker 5: been doing up until then. No, it was very. 764 00:40:09,960 --> 00:40:12,560 Speaker 6: They're also looking at it thirty years later, going oh 765 00:40:12,640 --> 00:40:15,839 Speaker 6: that's so sweet and that works. But maybe at the time, yeah, 766 00:40:15,920 --> 00:40:18,440 Speaker 6: we know, I think everybody may have been watching it differently. 767 00:40:18,640 --> 00:40:20,239 Speaker 3: So it was like, what was. 768 00:40:20,200 --> 00:40:23,279 Speaker 5: That screaming guitars? I mean we were we were more 769 00:40:23,320 --> 00:40:26,959 Speaker 5: screaming guitars now seen over two pages. That was my rule. 770 00:40:27,280 --> 00:40:30,080 Speaker 5: I said, you know, this audience they're going to lose interest. 771 00:40:30,440 --> 00:40:32,480 Speaker 6: And it was the whole poem. It wasn't just like, 772 00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:34,440 Speaker 6: oh yeah, a couple of a lot of it. 773 00:40:34,520 --> 00:40:36,920 Speaker 2: You know, he was this like literate writer, this you know, 774 00:40:37,280 --> 00:40:38,759 Speaker 2: fancy writer that comes in and. 775 00:40:38,680 --> 00:40:39,720 Speaker 5: Deals with you guys. 776 00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:42,560 Speaker 2: I know, I'm just trying to get some freaking poetry 777 00:40:42,600 --> 00:40:43,080 Speaker 2: in the show. 778 00:40:43,120 --> 00:40:46,600 Speaker 5: And you're like, no, he got down in the mud 779 00:40:46,640 --> 00:40:47,600 Speaker 5: with us pretty quick. 780 00:40:47,880 --> 00:40:49,319 Speaker 1: But we're coming to the end of our time, so 781 00:40:49,320 --> 00:40:51,920 Speaker 1: we want to get some really important questions, like what 782 00:40:52,120 --> 00:40:56,040 Speaker 1: was you remember the craziest storyline that you liked the 783 00:40:56,040 --> 00:40:58,960 Speaker 1: most or hated the most, Like what do you remember as. 784 00:40:58,800 --> 00:41:00,839 Speaker 5: A thing that you couldn't get in? 785 00:41:01,080 --> 00:41:03,960 Speaker 1: Maybe, Oh, that's a great question. So that's like nine 786 00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:04,719 Speaker 1: questions in one. 787 00:41:04,800 --> 00:41:08,799 Speaker 5: Yeah, we'll start with I couldn't get in And it's 788 00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:12,840 Speaker 5: the very last episode of Melrose and we wanted Courtney 789 00:41:12,880 --> 00:41:15,839 Speaker 5: to come back. Yeah, did they offer you money? Did 790 00:41:15,880 --> 00:41:16,160 Speaker 5: it ever? 791 00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:17,920 Speaker 3: Get to the know they wanted me to come back. 792 00:41:18,000 --> 00:41:20,160 Speaker 1: I was working on Alan mcbill at the time, and 793 00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:22,799 Speaker 1: that schedule was crazy and we just couldn't make it work. 794 00:41:22,840 --> 00:41:24,640 Speaker 1: And I remember trying to like, if I could get 795 00:41:24,680 --> 00:41:27,000 Speaker 1: there by the end, I could do something and we 796 00:41:27,000 --> 00:41:29,040 Speaker 1: were we were like eighteen hour days on the show. 797 00:41:29,160 --> 00:41:32,040 Speaker 3: So I'm so bummed. 798 00:41:32,080 --> 00:41:34,160 Speaker 5: I have the scene and we were going to bring 799 00:41:34,160 --> 00:41:36,160 Speaker 5: Billy back to We were going to bring them both 800 00:41:36,680 --> 00:41:43,560 Speaker 5: and Marcia uh and and sorry, well you could have 801 00:41:43,560 --> 00:41:48,080 Speaker 5: brought she was dead one three. 802 00:41:48,840 --> 00:41:51,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, I was so we couldn't get I couldn't get off. 803 00:41:51,400 --> 00:41:54,280 Speaker 5: Set literally, So so I wrote and directed the episode. 804 00:41:54,360 --> 00:41:57,400 Speaker 5: And there was a scene in a bar, yes, and 805 00:41:57,400 --> 00:42:01,080 Speaker 5: and and I had something. No, there was just an 806 00:42:01,120 --> 00:42:04,040 Speaker 5: empty stool, and I had the camera moves by and 807 00:42:04,120 --> 00:42:07,000 Speaker 5: stops and there's a bar with it just one stool, 808 00:42:07,080 --> 00:42:08,799 Speaker 5: you know, there are no other stools or there were 809 00:42:08,840 --> 00:42:11,120 Speaker 5: two stools, and it was going to be a Billy 810 00:42:11,360 --> 00:42:14,920 Speaker 5: and Alison moment. And I just had it. And I thought, 811 00:42:15,120 --> 00:42:18,520 Speaker 5: I'll always know that you know what that means. But 812 00:42:19,400 --> 00:42:26,200 Speaker 5: you know, so favorite favorite storyline was memorable. There were so. 813 00:42:26,440 --> 00:42:29,400 Speaker 1: Many that you like, people like that were that you 814 00:42:29,480 --> 00:42:31,319 Speaker 1: were that were the most fun. 815 00:42:31,440 --> 00:42:33,160 Speaker 3: Like I think of the building blowing up. 816 00:42:33,600 --> 00:42:36,560 Speaker 5: Yeah yeah, I mean the building. Everybody's made a big 817 00:42:36,600 --> 00:42:39,480 Speaker 5: deal of it, and it was you know it was 818 00:42:39,560 --> 00:42:43,800 Speaker 5: during the Oklahoma bombing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, he did except 819 00:42:43,800 --> 00:42:47,279 Speaker 5: the uh certainly on the production side, but uh that 820 00:42:47,640 --> 00:42:49,120 Speaker 5: we were going to do it at the end of 821 00:42:49,160 --> 00:42:52,680 Speaker 5: the season, but because of the Oklahoma bombing, we just 822 00:42:52,719 --> 00:42:55,480 Speaker 5: had her go it gets worse, which is my favorite 823 00:42:55,560 --> 00:42:57,279 Speaker 5: line on the show ever. I don't even know. 824 00:42:57,440 --> 00:42:58,040 Speaker 3: That's great. 825 00:42:58,320 --> 00:43:01,080 Speaker 5: You know, it goes this is ah, this is very bad. 826 00:43:01,239 --> 00:43:03,840 Speaker 5: She goes, No, it gets worse. That's great. 827 00:43:05,120 --> 00:43:08,480 Speaker 3: Yeah, who did Joe's baby? Let's give her a baby? 828 00:43:08,520 --> 00:43:13,240 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that was get Let's have her. 829 00:43:13,719 --> 00:43:16,520 Speaker 5: That's when I went on Models Inc. But I was 830 00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:19,640 Speaker 5: part of I was part of that. Yeah. Yeah, that 831 00:43:19,800 --> 00:43:22,080 Speaker 5: was a lot of Carol Mendelssohn. I think she came on, 832 00:43:22,719 --> 00:43:25,759 Speaker 5: you know, she had no experience and so but I'd 833 00:43:25,760 --> 00:43:28,399 Speaker 5: worked on Gabriel's Fire with her and I had suggested her. 834 00:43:28,520 --> 00:43:30,239 Speaker 5: I said, you're going to need someone to replace me. 835 00:43:30,680 --> 00:43:34,160 Speaker 5: I go. She has taped every episode of General Hospital. 836 00:43:34,400 --> 00:43:37,320 Speaker 5: She is a total soap fan, even though she writes 837 00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:40,000 Speaker 5: crime shows. And so they brought her in and you 838 00:43:40,000 --> 00:43:40,719 Speaker 5: know she was. 839 00:43:41,160 --> 00:43:43,919 Speaker 2: So you left as a writer producer for a while 840 00:43:43,960 --> 00:43:44,759 Speaker 2: to go do Models Inc. 841 00:43:45,560 --> 00:43:47,680 Speaker 5: Off the season. Then I came back season later. 842 00:43:47,800 --> 00:43:50,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, and did you stay till the end the last 843 00:43:50,400 --> 00:43:51,759 Speaker 1: of the seven seasons? 844 00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:52,880 Speaker 5: Yeah? 845 00:43:52,920 --> 00:43:54,680 Speaker 1: And how did it feel for you when it shifted, 846 00:43:54,680 --> 00:43:57,080 Speaker 1: because we talk a lot about you know, we left, 847 00:43:57,120 --> 00:43:59,560 Speaker 1: you left after four, we left after five, Like what 848 00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:00,600 Speaker 1: did that? 849 00:44:02,600 --> 00:44:05,120 Speaker 5: It was? Yeah, it did? 850 00:44:05,360 --> 00:44:10,600 Speaker 1: Which your real question to ask questions? My question was 851 00:44:10,600 --> 00:44:12,000 Speaker 1: where the three of us are very favorite. 852 00:44:12,239 --> 00:44:16,920 Speaker 5: Yeah, you know, we get down to like why did 853 00:44:16,960 --> 00:44:18,840 Speaker 5: you leave? And stuff? I know Chip talked to you 854 00:44:18,880 --> 00:44:22,000 Speaker 5: about that, and you know, sometimes it's money. Sometimes it's 855 00:44:22,040 --> 00:44:26,120 Speaker 5: some creative decision. And I honestly, with you, I don't remember, 856 00:44:26,560 --> 00:44:31,080 Speaker 5: and with you I kind of remember. I remember being 857 00:44:31,360 --> 00:44:36,000 Speaker 5: completely against it, but there were powers that be that 858 00:44:36,160 --> 00:44:38,040 Speaker 5: were I don't know if it was money or what 859 00:44:38,120 --> 00:44:41,040 Speaker 5: it was, but they were, you know, and and you 860 00:44:41,040 --> 00:44:45,760 Speaker 5: know Grant leaving, Uh, you know it. You know as writers, 861 00:44:45,760 --> 00:44:51,040 Speaker 5: you're just for writers. It's an opportunity to bring in 862 00:44:51,160 --> 00:44:54,480 Speaker 5: new characters that you know, you guys, we ran you 863 00:44:54,640 --> 00:45:00,200 Speaker 5: through a soap mill like unbelievable. You know, marriages and 864 00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:05,200 Speaker 5: you know deaths and crime and you know, god knows what, 865 00:45:05,360 --> 00:45:09,080 Speaker 5: going crazy and stuff. And you get to a point where, wow, 866 00:45:09,200 --> 00:45:11,160 Speaker 5: what did we do with the next You know, we 867 00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:15,560 Speaker 5: can't rehabilitate them or make this past go away and 868 00:45:15,640 --> 00:45:18,680 Speaker 5: ignore it like they do in daytime. So but so 869 00:45:18,880 --> 00:45:21,840 Speaker 5: it was a it was a case of, you know, 870 00:45:22,120 --> 00:45:24,960 Speaker 5: in some cases like we don't have any more story, 871 00:45:25,120 --> 00:45:26,720 Speaker 5: you know, we got to go in a different direction 872 00:45:26,719 --> 00:45:28,480 Speaker 5: of people. We got to give these put the new 873 00:45:28,480 --> 00:45:31,560 Speaker 5: people through new scenary people. But I remember I was 874 00:45:31,600 --> 00:45:35,080 Speaker 5: the one who said I took it like personally every 875 00:45:35,080 --> 00:45:38,560 Speaker 5: time somebody left, because I said, oh my god, you know, 876 00:45:38,600 --> 00:45:41,200 Speaker 5: I was here. I wrote to episode two and you know, 877 00:45:41,400 --> 00:45:45,760 Speaker 5: and and I just remember the whole journey and it's 878 00:45:45,920 --> 00:45:49,239 Speaker 5: like those for initial people walking down the street, you know, 879 00:45:49,280 --> 00:45:53,120 Speaker 5: walking down Melrose room was and it became and it evolved. 880 00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:55,960 Speaker 5: And believe me, I loved every person we brought on, 881 00:45:56,120 --> 00:46:00,200 Speaker 5: and I liked all of their their stories. You know, 882 00:46:00,520 --> 00:46:02,880 Speaker 5: we jumped the shark so many times that you know, 883 00:46:03,400 --> 00:46:07,120 Speaker 5: like when do we first jump the shark? And uh, you. 884 00:46:07,080 --> 00:46:07,400 Speaker 6: Know, I. 885 00:46:10,520 --> 00:46:13,320 Speaker 5: Like and you know, I wrote and directed that last 886 00:46:13,360 --> 00:46:17,080 Speaker 5: episode and uh it was so sad, you know, and 887 00:46:17,080 --> 00:46:19,840 Speaker 5: and uh it was so sad. I made sure the 888 00:46:19,920 --> 00:46:23,160 Speaker 5: last shot was of Heather, you know. And I think 889 00:46:23,200 --> 00:46:26,160 Speaker 5: the feeling was at Fox as long as Heather's on 890 00:46:26,200 --> 00:46:28,319 Speaker 5: the show, it doesn't matter who else is on the show. 891 00:46:28,360 --> 00:46:30,759 Speaker 5: They had they had moved on in their mind, but 892 00:46:31,280 --> 00:46:34,160 Speaker 5: you know, the ratings were starting to go down, you know, 893 00:46:34,400 --> 00:46:37,560 Speaker 5: and then the last year, I know why it was canceled, 894 00:46:37,600 --> 00:46:41,000 Speaker 5: why we didn't get an eighth season, which we really wanted. 895 00:46:41,640 --> 00:46:47,000 Speaker 5: Uh it was the show between the lawsuits and the stuff, 896 00:46:47,040 --> 00:46:50,440 Speaker 5: it was really tainted, and you know, and quite frankly, 897 00:46:50,680 --> 00:46:52,759 Speaker 5: they said, we can't afford to pay Heather. 898 00:46:54,080 --> 00:46:55,440 Speaker 3: Yeah. 899 00:46:55,200 --> 00:46:57,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, a lawsuit, the pregnancy lawsuit. 900 00:46:57,480 --> 00:47:00,880 Speaker 5: Yeah, the pregnancy lawsuit. And then uh the Jerry, remember 901 00:47:00,920 --> 00:47:05,880 Speaker 5: the assistant director Jerry. Yes, yeah, I was. I was 902 00:47:05,920 --> 00:47:08,680 Speaker 5: all a part of that. But luckily, you know, that's 903 00:47:08,760 --> 00:47:13,760 Speaker 5: what sent Frank and Chip and Harry, Oh god, Harry, 904 00:47:14,160 --> 00:47:15,080 Speaker 5: very greatest guy. 905 00:47:22,800 --> 00:47:24,960 Speaker 2: We have to have you back because clearly you have 906 00:47:25,120 --> 00:47:26,640 Speaker 2: like a treasure trope more. 907 00:47:26,520 --> 00:47:27,000 Speaker 5: We could do this. 908 00:47:30,960 --> 00:47:32,880 Speaker 3: I didn't even pick up my questions. I don't know, 909 00:47:32,960 --> 00:47:33,960 Speaker 3: we just do. 910 00:47:34,200 --> 00:47:36,239 Speaker 6: I have one more question, just based on something you 911 00:47:36,280 --> 00:47:39,080 Speaker 6: were describing as just the process of the writer's room, 912 00:47:39,600 --> 00:47:42,360 Speaker 6: the task of writing the episode would rotate amongst the writers. 913 00:47:42,440 --> 00:47:43,280 Speaker 3: Is that correct? 914 00:47:43,280 --> 00:47:45,560 Speaker 6: But like, did you find that you had like a 915 00:47:45,640 --> 00:47:48,160 Speaker 6: character or a voice that were the writers that were 916 00:47:48,200 --> 00:47:51,440 Speaker 6: particularly good at writing this particular voice? 917 00:47:51,480 --> 00:47:53,680 Speaker 5: And you know, did you have to be a writer 918 00:47:53,760 --> 00:47:55,840 Speaker 5: in the show. You had to. You had to be 919 00:47:55,920 --> 00:48:00,920 Speaker 5: able to write everybody. You know. I loved I like writing, Courtney. 920 00:48:01,040 --> 00:48:05,120 Speaker 5: I loved writing uh you know, Amanda, I you know, 921 00:48:05,280 --> 00:48:08,919 Speaker 5: I would say, uh in latter years, I loved Jack 922 00:48:08,960 --> 00:48:13,400 Speaker 5: Wagner because he was just so disgusting, you know. I 923 00:48:13,400 --> 00:48:15,680 Speaker 5: mean I thought, I thought I can just let out 924 00:48:15,760 --> 00:48:22,440 Speaker 5: my ikey icky, you know. But but and and there 925 00:48:22,440 --> 00:48:27,440 Speaker 5: were writers who loved to write certain things, you know. Uh, 926 00:48:27,560 --> 00:48:31,960 Speaker 5: I know, Carol loved writing Daphanie and all the women, 927 00:48:33,640 --> 00:48:38,440 Speaker 5: and uh, Darren, I think the original core group was 928 00:48:38,480 --> 00:48:41,759 Speaker 5: always his favorite. But uh, you know, but you know, 929 00:48:42,120 --> 00:48:44,759 Speaker 5: writing it, well, you had to write every character, you know, 930 00:48:45,040 --> 00:48:49,360 Speaker 5: And and we were going so fast. We'd break these things, 931 00:48:49,520 --> 00:48:51,839 Speaker 5: you know, up on a big board and then send 932 00:48:51,920 --> 00:48:54,440 Speaker 5: the writer off. And I was always writing. I mean 933 00:48:54,480 --> 00:48:56,640 Speaker 5: I was writing an episode, or I was something with 934 00:48:56,680 --> 00:48:59,000 Speaker 5: shooting that I wrote, or you know, and that was 935 00:48:59,040 --> 00:49:00,520 Speaker 5: true of all of us, you know. 936 00:49:00,719 --> 00:49:02,839 Speaker 6: And because you were writing at such a pace, did 937 00:49:02,880 --> 00:49:06,200 Speaker 6: you did you have to adjust and pivot when you go, 938 00:49:06,280 --> 00:49:07,920 Speaker 6: oh my gosh, the storyline that we thought was going 939 00:49:08,000 --> 00:49:09,440 Speaker 6: in this one way, and look at how it's turning. 940 00:49:09,440 --> 00:49:11,040 Speaker 3: Out, did you have to go a pivot? 941 00:49:11,120 --> 00:49:15,520 Speaker 5: And like completely, I mean a lot. And I think 942 00:49:15,520 --> 00:49:18,200 Speaker 5: that was one of the keys to the show's success 943 00:49:18,480 --> 00:49:21,840 Speaker 5: is that we were very fluid. We we didn't get 944 00:49:21,880 --> 00:49:25,080 Speaker 5: locked into stuff, you know, something better came along or 945 00:49:25,120 --> 00:49:28,320 Speaker 5: something didn't work, we would just you know, change gears. 946 00:49:28,400 --> 00:49:31,960 Speaker 5: The Marsha thing, we kill her, you know, in this accident. 947 00:49:32,040 --> 00:49:34,919 Speaker 5: And actually the way that happened was was a little 948 00:49:34,960 --> 00:49:37,600 Speaker 5: like Chip told it, but it was. It was actually 949 00:49:37,680 --> 00:49:40,239 Speaker 5: Darren and I and I think somebody else I don't 950 00:49:40,239 --> 00:49:45,120 Speaker 5: know who had dinner. This was a yeah, it was 951 00:49:45,200 --> 00:49:48,160 Speaker 5: during Frank, but Frank wasn't there. He was home. We 952 00:49:48,239 --> 00:49:50,560 Speaker 5: had we had a really nice you know, you always 953 00:49:50,600 --> 00:49:54,000 Speaker 5: eat well when you're around there. So we went to 954 00:49:54,239 --> 00:49:57,400 Speaker 5: in the valley somewhere, you know. We went to a 955 00:49:57,440 --> 00:50:00,759 Speaker 5: great French French meal and a bottle wine, and then 956 00:50:00,800 --> 00:50:02,839 Speaker 5: we drove out to watch Marsha get killed in this 957 00:50:03,080 --> 00:50:07,040 Speaker 5: in the spectacular car crash that did go beyond it, 958 00:50:07,280 --> 00:50:08,960 Speaker 5: and we just sat and talked to Marsha for the 959 00:50:08,960 --> 00:50:11,120 Speaker 5: longest time, and I never really had talked to her much, 960 00:50:11,560 --> 00:50:14,080 Speaker 5: and you know, and she went back and we shot 961 00:50:14,120 --> 00:50:17,439 Speaker 5: the scene and I looked at Darren. I go, let's 962 00:50:17,520 --> 00:50:20,880 Speaker 5: not kill her, and he goes, Chuck, we just killed 963 00:50:20,880 --> 00:50:23,040 Speaker 5: her on the film. And I said yeah, I said, 964 00:50:23,080 --> 00:50:25,880 Speaker 5: but you know, we we can keep her alive and 965 00:50:26,360 --> 00:50:28,080 Speaker 5: have her come back from the dead. You know, have 966 00:50:28,200 --> 00:50:33,719 Speaker 5: you the favorite it's a favorite story. I don't even 967 00:50:33,719 --> 00:50:35,880 Speaker 5: think they can do it anymore. They've done it so often. 968 00:50:35,920 --> 00:50:38,839 Speaker 5: Nobody really dies, you know. Yeah, and uh, and we 969 00:50:38,880 --> 00:50:41,759 Speaker 5: said our first thought was we were sitting there and 970 00:50:41,760 --> 00:50:45,120 Speaker 5: we go, Okay, we got to sell Aaron on this, 971 00:50:45,400 --> 00:50:47,839 Speaker 5: you know, got to sell the network on this. And 972 00:50:47,880 --> 00:50:49,880 Speaker 5: then I said we got to sell Frank because he 973 00:50:49,880 --> 00:50:52,680 Speaker 5: wrote the next episode where there's an open casket and 974 00:50:52,719 --> 00:50:56,759 Speaker 5: there's a scene in the hospital. Yeah, and and all this, 975 00:50:57,760 --> 00:51:00,600 Speaker 5: all this stuff, and so that we were all scratching 976 00:51:00,640 --> 00:51:04,480 Speaker 5: our ads, going, uh, you know, I mean, Darren and 977 00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:06,000 Speaker 5: I were going, how are we going to sell this? 978 00:51:06,040 --> 00:51:08,439 Speaker 5: How are we going to get this done? And so 979 00:51:08,480 --> 00:51:12,400 Speaker 5: we uh, what we did was we went back and 980 00:51:12,440 --> 00:51:16,000 Speaker 5: talked to Frank and he was very upset, and I said, 981 00:51:16,480 --> 00:51:21,439 Speaker 5: close the casket, put her in a coma, so she's 982 00:51:21,480 --> 00:51:24,719 Speaker 5: in a hospital bed, and then and then she's when 983 00:51:24,719 --> 00:51:27,000 Speaker 5: she's in the hospital bed, you did the scene where 984 00:51:27,000 --> 00:51:29,600 Speaker 5: he comes back and I think, this is the way 985 00:51:29,600 --> 00:51:32,240 Speaker 5: we did it. And we come back and Michael comes 986 00:51:32,280 --> 00:51:35,239 Speaker 5: back and the bed is empty, and they say she 987 00:51:35,360 --> 00:51:39,719 Speaker 5: passed away, and and Frank's going, yeah, and I said, well, 988 00:51:39,760 --> 00:51:41,640 Speaker 5: she didn't pass away. Her mother came and got her. 989 00:51:41,680 --> 00:51:45,560 Speaker 5: And her mother we've never even mentioned her mother. She's 990 00:51:45,600 --> 00:51:52,040 Speaker 5: in the Midwest somewhere, and she hated Michael, and Michael 991 00:51:52,080 --> 00:51:54,799 Speaker 5: did this to her. So so her daughter wasn't going 992 00:51:54,880 --> 00:51:57,200 Speaker 5: to die in front of him, so she took her 993 00:51:57,280 --> 00:51:59,280 Speaker 5: back to die, and then she wakes up in the coma, 994 00:51:59,400 --> 00:52:05,319 Speaker 5: you know, and then the you know, the the you know, 995 00:52:05,360 --> 00:52:10,400 Speaker 5: we wrote the scar but everybody went the set chip 996 00:52:10,400 --> 00:52:13,120 Speaker 5: and all them they were way over the top. We go, 997 00:52:13,440 --> 00:52:18,360 Speaker 5: oh my god, who's going to buy this? And is 998 00:52:18,400 --> 00:52:19,680 Speaker 5: this too much? Yes? 999 00:52:20,200 --> 00:52:25,319 Speaker 3: And the place that's why, that's a perfect place to 1000 00:52:25,400 --> 00:52:25,600 Speaker 3: end it. 1001 00:52:25,719 --> 00:52:28,480 Speaker 1: That's Chuck, Thank you so much. 1002 00:52:29,880 --> 00:52:33,279 Speaker 6: Would love We know there's many more stories, Okay, yeah, 1003 00:52:33,840 --> 00:52:35,160 Speaker 6: so many season two. 1004 00:52:36,320 --> 00:52:40,239 Speaker 3: I mean, we could do a specials. 1005 00:52:40,560 --> 00:52:42,279 Speaker 5: We could do a special one on models. 1006 00:52:43,600 --> 00:52:47,160 Speaker 2: They really do our listeners really and fans that write 1007 00:52:47,200 --> 00:52:50,240 Speaker 2: in or comment really ask about the behind the scenes 1008 00:52:50,560 --> 00:52:53,360 Speaker 2: everything that you talked about. So many people are curious about, 1009 00:52:53,400 --> 00:52:55,560 Speaker 2: you know, they're like, oh, these guys are cute to 1010 00:52:55,560 --> 00:52:55,879 Speaker 2: look at. 1011 00:52:55,920 --> 00:52:58,560 Speaker 3: But you know, you're like, we're in the room when 1012 00:52:58,600 --> 00:53:02,400 Speaker 3: it happened, so we have more and. 1013 00:53:02,480 --> 00:53:04,160 Speaker 5: We make it. We can't have that old 1014 00:53:06,040 --> 00:53:10,760 Speaker 2: I was in the room where it a thank you Jack, Thanks, 1015 00:53:11,200 --> 00:53:11,560 Speaker 2: thank you