WEBVTT - “I GREW UP ULTRA ORTHODOX JEWISH “ 0:00:02.120 --> 0:00:05.000 Hello, Yeah, you hear me, GK. 0:00:05.680 --> 0:00:06.520 Yeah, what's your name? 0:00:06.559 --> 0:00:06.760 Man? 0:00:07.960 --> 0:00:13.360 Uh call me Steve, Steve, Steve. I'm cool with Steve 0:00:13.400 --> 0:00:17.600 today too. I think it's a good name. Can I 0:00:17.640 --> 0:00:19.239 can I tell the people what it is that you 0:00:19.680 --> 0:00:20.800 texted me? Is that all right? 0:00:21.840 --> 0:00:24.200 Yeah? That's cool. Now we'll give a good start off. 0:00:25.079 --> 0:00:28.680 You said, Hey, Gek, I want to chat with you 0:00:28.800 --> 0:00:34.000 about growing up in ultra orthodox Judaism and now I 0:00:34.040 --> 0:00:37.440 have landed somewhere in between an absurdist and a nihilist. 0:00:38.080 --> 0:00:42.120 I left the fold years ago, managed to make a 0:00:42.200 --> 0:00:46.520 life for myself on the other side. I'll be scary. 0:00:46.520 --> 0:00:48.800 I wanted to hit you up about this because well, 0:00:48.840 --> 0:00:51.199 a few things is uh, you know, I grew up 0:00:51.240 --> 0:00:56.960 in somewhere let's call it reform Judaism, but I was 0:00:57.040 --> 0:01:02.520 around a lot of like Orthodox Judaism. And then also 0:01:02.600 --> 0:01:04.639 now i'm you know, living in New York, I'm around 0:01:04.680 --> 0:01:08.480 I see a lot of Orthodox Judaism, and I find it. 0:01:08.560 --> 0:01:11.920 I find it fascinating because it, yeah, it's always like 0:01:13.760 --> 0:01:18.840 it seems to be like intentionally isolated from like the 0:01:18.880 --> 0:01:21.960 rest of the world. So I'm curious, like how your 0:01:22.280 --> 0:01:25.720 experience growing up in that has been. 0:01:27.080 --> 0:01:29.280 Yeah, so I actually did grow up in New York City. 0:01:29.360 --> 0:01:31.040 I grew up in a small six I'm not going 0:01:31.120 --> 0:01:34.600 to be specific there, but yeah, I grew up Altra 0:01:34.680 --> 0:01:39.640 orthodox Kee nicola Asidic if you want, raised in the 0:01:39.760 --> 0:01:43.119 hole full. My whole life went through the system. They 0:01:43.160 --> 0:01:47.440 call it Yeshiva. It's like their type of school system. Yeah, 0:01:47.520 --> 0:01:51.000 I got my rabinical ordination once I was done the 0:01:51.080 --> 0:01:56.040 Yeshiva system, then I guess more to answer your question, 0:01:57.880 --> 0:02:00.920 it is very closed off, like it pretty insulated. But 0:02:00.960 --> 0:02:03.520 the SEC I grew up in is has more outreach, 0:02:04.360 --> 0:02:08.160 so like there's stopmer in like Williamsburg. Like the guys 0:02:08.240 --> 0:02:10.120 were the furry hats. They're the ones who are like 0:02:10.320 --> 0:02:12.639 cut off the outside wall. They can't have cell phone. 0:02:12.760 --> 0:02:16.200 They have like they kind of accident internet. They they 0:02:16.200 --> 0:02:18.639 are very strict. The one I was involved in is 0:02:18.680 --> 0:02:20.360 a little bit more relaxed, so I had a little 0:02:20.360 --> 0:02:24.720 bit more of like experiencing outside world. So I was 0:02:24.760 --> 0:02:26.320 able to collect you to get people on the other 0:02:26.400 --> 0:02:29.680 side even while I was in the SEC. M hm. 0:02:30.080 --> 0:02:33.639 So you weren't necessarily a Hasidic, uh. 0:02:33.760 --> 0:02:36.600 They call it acidic, but like if you asked like 0:02:36.760 --> 0:02:39.840 a real like Hasidic sect. If they consider that asidic, 0:02:39.880 --> 0:02:42.280 they'll say, no, it's going to real people or something 0:02:42.360 --> 0:02:45.120 like that. So it's debatable. 0:02:45.960 --> 0:02:51.840 But yeah, was it like serious enough that when you 0:02:53.280 --> 0:03:00.120 left your family was unsupportive to the degree with I 0:03:00.160 --> 0:03:00.919 stopped talking to you? 0:03:03.400 --> 0:03:07.200 Uh? Ish uh. There's other reasons why. So I still 0:03:07.200 --> 0:03:09.560 talk to my family, like I spent Thanksgiving with them. 0:03:09.680 --> 0:03:12.720 Most of them are still religious. I don't really talk 0:03:12.760 --> 0:03:14.079 to my parents that much, and then I much to 0:03:14.120 --> 0:03:18.880 say to them, it's just unfortunate. But you know, like 0:03:18.880 --> 0:03:21.160 ex communicayy, they every time they talk to me, they 0:03:21.160 --> 0:03:23.000 try to bring me back, like that's the thing, Like 0:03:23.320 --> 0:03:25.359 they think I'm a lost person and I just try 0:03:25.400 --> 0:03:28.240 to like guide me back to the right path. And 0:03:28.320 --> 0:03:29.760 I just got sick of it, and I'm like, this 0:03:29.800 --> 0:03:33.840 is not I'm not living a lifestyle. So it just 0:03:33.880 --> 0:03:36.040 got really frustrating. I just gave up on that and 0:03:36.120 --> 0:03:40.560 I just started, you know, just keeping myself more in 0:03:40.600 --> 0:03:43.960 touch with my siblings. And then yeah, once in a while, 0:03:43.960 --> 0:03:47.640 I see my parents maybe once or twice a year. Uh. 0:03:47.680 --> 0:03:49.400 Oh do you see your parents once I see year? 0:03:50.440 --> 0:03:52.720 Yeah, I don't go to visit them like I'll go 0:03:52.760 --> 0:03:55.200 in for like Honaker or Thanksgiving or something, and they'll 0:03:55.240 --> 0:03:56.880 be there, and I'll try to like avoid my dad 0:03:56.880 --> 0:03:58.480 because I don't want to talk to him to say 0:03:58.600 --> 0:04:02.160 me or whatever. But yeah, it's very anxious for me 0:04:02.200 --> 0:04:04.520 when I do that, Like I still like mentally prepare 0:04:04.600 --> 0:04:07.520 myself before and after that happens. Like, it's just a 0:04:07.560 --> 0:04:08.000 lot for me. 0:04:08.880 --> 0:04:11.320 What what's the deal with your Uh, you had a 0:04:11.360 --> 0:04:12.040 brother or sister. 0:04:13.680 --> 0:04:16.560 I got a bunch of siblings. Most of them are 0:04:16.640 --> 0:04:20.080 married with kids, so I have a lot of nieces 0:04:20.080 --> 0:04:23.920 and nephews. I would say most of them are like 0:04:24.080 --> 0:04:28.479 more modern orphodox, so they're not like old Shore Orthodox. 0:04:28.560 --> 0:04:31.240 They're kind of like chill about it. So I can 0:04:31.279 --> 0:04:33.760 more communicate with them than it's like my parents are 0:04:33.800 --> 0:04:37.719 still stuck in the same you know, ideas they brought 0:04:37.800 --> 0:04:39.400 us up with. Hm hmm. 0:04:41.560 --> 0:04:43.080 Are you are you married? Do you have kids? 0:04:44.120 --> 0:04:48.960 No? I am not married. I don't have kids, are you? 0:04:49.080 --> 0:04:51.720 The only one of the clients say again. 0:04:52.680 --> 0:04:54.400 Not that I know, I could have kids? 0:04:55.760 --> 0:04:58.120 Yeah, okay, all right, all right, you might have a 0:04:59.200 --> 0:05:01.599 what is it called, I guess a bastard child? 0:05:02.440 --> 0:05:08.720 Yeah, is the Yiddish word momser mom's area. 0:05:09.120 --> 0:05:11.479 Mom A, I've heard that word before. 0:05:11.839 --> 0:05:13.880 Yeah, yeah, it's been out there. 0:05:14.520 --> 0:05:16.080 Uh do you speak Yiddish? 0:05:16.920 --> 0:05:21.240 I do not fluently. Uh. So basically like growing up 0:05:21.440 --> 0:05:24.640 in like Yeshiva, they want to like teach you Yiddish. 0:05:24.760 --> 0:05:26.920 They would expect that you already spoke it at home 0:05:27.000 --> 0:05:29.320 so you understand it. So then they would like teach 0:05:29.320 --> 0:05:31.440 you in school you like read the Bible and Hebrew 0:05:31.720 --> 0:05:33.720 and then you yell out to get this translation over 0:05:33.760 --> 0:05:35.360 and over. It was like cult like you like you 0:05:35.360 --> 0:05:37.760 don't even know what you're saying. But yeah, I did 0:05:37.800 --> 0:05:40.280 speak Yiddish like growing up. I can understand it, like 0:05:40.279 --> 0:05:43.280 even German, like I could understand like high German. It's 0:05:43.360 --> 0:05:45.640 kind of weird. But when I try to talk German, 0:05:45.760 --> 0:05:48.560 like the vocablary and grammars like totally off. 0:05:49.920 --> 0:05:53.760 But yeah, did you do you also do like regular 0:05:53.880 --> 0:05:57.920 Jews stuff like, uh, there's I'm for for those who 0:05:57.920 --> 0:06:01.840 are not Jewish, there's a well, there's there's Jewish summer camp, 0:06:02.120 --> 0:06:05.280 although I guess religious summer camp is a general thing. 0:06:05.640 --> 0:06:09.800 And then for me, there was this thing called bb YO, 0:06:10.400 --> 0:06:17.120 which was like a youth Jewish youth organization type of thing. Uh, 0:06:17.240 --> 0:06:18.560 did you do any of that kind of stuff. 0:06:19.800 --> 0:06:23.880 No, we wouldn't like really mingle with like the other 0:06:24.000 --> 0:06:27.400 Jewish organizations. Like we had our own like summer camps, 0:06:27.440 --> 0:06:29.599 like all Boys summer camps, and those are like pretty 0:06:29.600 --> 0:06:31.000 fucked up places. 0:06:31.040 --> 0:06:32.280 Interesting if you ask me. 0:06:32.600 --> 0:06:36.480 Yeah, a lot of shit went down there, and then 0:06:36.600 --> 0:06:39.520 like that's where they say they don't vet their staff 0:06:39.640 --> 0:06:42.280 very well, and there are incidents where these like pedophiles 0:06:42.320 --> 0:06:44.960 and ship like oh Jesus roaming free over there. It's 0:06:45.000 --> 0:06:48.200 it's horrible. Yeah, I've had experiences there a lot of 0:06:48.240 --> 0:06:51.320 people I know how it's yeah, was it? What? 0:06:51.360 --> 0:06:52.440 Did you have any? Do you have any? Do you 0:06:52.480 --> 0:06:54.039 have any positive experiences there? 0:06:55.440 --> 0:06:57.279 Not that I know? No, I hated it. 0:06:57.839 --> 0:06:59.320 M m hmm. 0:07:00.720 --> 0:07:06.320 It's so it's so interesting how like a different the 0:07:06.480 --> 0:07:10.520 experience of like Orthodox Judaism and Reform Judaism is because 0:07:10.520 --> 0:07:13.520 we're both Jews, but it's like it's a different fucking 0:07:13.760 --> 0:07:15.840 world by like a billion degrees. 0:07:16.680 --> 0:07:22.040 Oh yeah, yeah. A lot of my friends now are 0:07:22.080 --> 0:07:25.400 like just like reform or non Jews or whatever, and 0:07:25.840 --> 0:07:27.840 they don't like I've been out of it so long, 0:07:28.320 --> 0:07:29.920 Like they don't believe me if I tell them like 0:07:29.960 --> 0:07:32.760 I grew up like a ultra orthodox or Ascidic in 0:07:32.800 --> 0:07:37.320 some small sect in New York City and yeah, and 0:07:37.360 --> 0:07:39.360 they're like, oh, it's crazy. I've heard about it, and like, 0:07:39.440 --> 0:07:42.280 I you know whatever, but like you don't seem like 0:07:42.320 --> 0:07:43.160 you're from there. 0:07:45.320 --> 0:07:46.240 Yeah, what's your life like? 0:07:46.280 --> 0:07:46.760 Now? Are you? 0:07:47.200 --> 0:07:48.560 Do you have any of it in you? Or are 0:07:48.640 --> 0:07:51.200 you completely atheist? Agnostic? 0:07:52.520 --> 0:07:57.280 Yeah, magnostic nihilists. I would mostly categorize myself as an absurdist, 0:07:58.040 --> 0:08:02.360 you know, like Albercamo, the myth of Sistypus. Yeah, so 0:08:02.400 --> 0:08:04.320 that really Like I went through some rough times and 0:08:04.320 --> 0:08:07.320 then I was like a philosophy major in my undergrad 0:08:07.360 --> 0:08:09.600 and I was like reading that shit and I'm like, 0:08:10.040 --> 0:08:12.680 first had an exidential crisis, and I was like, what 0:08:12.720 --> 0:08:14.600 the fuck does everything mean? Like everything to do? So 0:08:14.720 --> 0:08:17.000 I'm not going to heaven when I die or whatever 0:08:17.080 --> 0:08:21.040 and all the all the things I've done that doesn't 0:08:21.080 --> 0:08:23.360 count up. Maybe I'm not gonna go to heaven. But 0:08:23.600 --> 0:08:25.920 like I got after a couple of years of therapy whatever, 0:08:26.040 --> 0:08:28.280 and I calmed down about it and I started like 0:08:28.320 --> 0:08:29.960 looking into like I'm served as I'm like, hey, this 0:08:30.000 --> 0:08:32.079 shit's awesome, Like I can live by this. 0:08:34.840 --> 0:08:38.640 Yeah, that is a crazy exce. Okay, So when how 0:08:38.720 --> 0:08:41.840 old were you when you realized that there was no heaven? 0:08:44.000 --> 0:08:46.920 I would say my mid twenties, somewhere in college when 0:08:46.960 --> 0:08:50.080 I was like just studying philosophy and like my whole 0:08:50.120 --> 0:08:52.320 world just came crashing down. I was literally walking around 0:08:52.360 --> 0:08:54.160 like a dark cloud loving over my head. I was 0:08:54.160 --> 0:08:57.680 super depressed. Not I was not in a good place 0:08:57.720 --> 0:09:00.520 for years. But thank god I can ount on the 0:09:00.520 --> 0:09:06.360 either side, I want to think, just thankfully, Well I do. 0:09:06.480 --> 0:09:07.080 I believe, I. 0:09:08.800 --> 0:09:08.959 Don't. 0:09:09.000 --> 0:09:11.400 I've talked about this a bunch of fucking times, but like, uh, 0:09:12.000 --> 0:09:13.640 I don't know. I look at God as just like 0:09:13.840 --> 0:09:19.760 uh an allegory to mean that which is uh been 0:09:19.920 --> 0:09:22.240 beyond you or unknown to you. 0:09:22.480 --> 0:09:24.640 Yeah, you know, like God? 0:09:25.360 --> 0:09:27.280 Yeah, yeah, like if I, if I pray, like if 0:09:27.280 --> 0:09:31.360 I because here's the thing, like I'm listen like tomorrow 0:09:31.600 --> 0:09:35.559 or that today, a lot of people are gonna have 0:09:35.679 --> 0:09:40.720 random brain aneurysms and die and there's no real reason 0:09:40.920 --> 0:09:44.160 why it's gonna happen to them and not me, uh 0:09:44.280 --> 0:09:45.280 or or it might happen to me. 0:09:45.320 --> 0:09:45.680 I don't know. 0:09:45.760 --> 0:09:48.600 But when I guess when I'm praying to God, I'm 0:09:50.800 --> 0:09:52.640 I don't know. I guess it's just hope. It's just 0:09:52.640 --> 0:09:56.080 just like I hope that that I hope that these 0:09:56.160 --> 0:09:58.800 things that are out of my control. I don't think 0:09:58.800 --> 0:10:01.840 the prayers like go anywhere, but I guess it feels 0:10:01.920 --> 0:10:04.360 nice or something, or like when you say, like, I 0:10:04.360 --> 0:10:05.640 don't like, I don't know if I don't really like 0:10:05.720 --> 0:10:08.880 I don't pray for myself, but like or I guess 0:10:08.880 --> 0:10:10.719 sometimes I do. Yeah, But like if I pray to like, 0:10:10.720 --> 0:10:13.800 if I pray to you, it's like, hey, man, I 0:10:13.840 --> 0:10:16.240 hope that you don't get hit by a car that 0:10:16.280 --> 0:10:17.920 I have no control over it. I don't think the 0:10:17.920 --> 0:10:21.160 pray is going anywhere, but I'm expressing to you that 0:10:21.240 --> 0:10:23.720 I hope you don't get hit by a car. Uh 0:10:24.000 --> 0:10:26.480 and and that all of the things outside of your 0:10:26.600 --> 0:10:30.920 control go well, and not necessarily that I am sending 0:10:30.920 --> 0:10:34.680 an energy to a omnipotent force that is in control 0:10:34.720 --> 0:10:37.480 of those things. I don't believe in that, but yeah. 0:10:37.040 --> 0:10:39.640 You know, yeah, now I'm on the same level. I 0:10:39.679 --> 0:10:43.040 believe the universe is indifferent to us. It's just chaos, 0:10:43.080 --> 0:10:47.400 and you know, we're just living here and most things 0:10:47.400 --> 0:10:49.439 are just out of our control and man as well 0:10:49.559 --> 0:10:50.480 just enjoy the ride. 0:10:51.200 --> 0:10:54.240 But it's funny because yeah, I look at it like 0:10:54.400 --> 0:10:57.520 Orthodox studiaism, I guess, just all religions and all things 0:10:57.559 --> 0:11:01.520 where it's like why are why are we doing this? 0:11:03.040 --> 0:11:07.400 Like the certain religion, like the certain traditions and whatnot. 0:11:07.960 --> 0:11:10.240 Like if you like, I don't know, were you like, 0:11:10.280 --> 0:11:12.560 were you ever in Hebrew School and you're like why 0:11:12.600 --> 0:11:17.400 do we There's a thing about this. It's the fucking dude, 0:11:17.400 --> 0:11:19.400 you know the Four Questions? 0:11:20.040 --> 0:11:20.920 Oh on Passover? 0:11:21.440 --> 0:11:26.120 Yeah yeah, okay, So I'm gonna try to explain this 0:11:26.240 --> 0:11:28.600 and maybe you can help me fill in the gaps. 0:11:29.240 --> 0:11:37.319 But like Passover is a Jewish holiday where I believe 0:11:38.559 --> 0:11:42.600 it is commemorates a time where like the Jews were 0:11:42.760 --> 0:11:48.760 slaves and God freed them and like sent a bunch 0:11:48.760 --> 0:11:56.480 of plagues down to their like captors and whatnot. Yeah, yeah, 0:11:56.480 --> 0:12:02.640 we're slaves in Egypt, and like there there's a part 0:12:02.720 --> 0:12:05.280 of so we have a sayer which is like this 0:12:05.480 --> 0:12:13.560 fucking a dinner. Yeah, there's a dinner that kind of 0:12:13.600 --> 0:12:16.400 commemorates that. And there's a part of the sator called 0:12:16.440 --> 0:12:21.320 the Four Questions where you you reenact to this thing 0:12:21.520 --> 0:12:26.040 of these like four children who are asking why do 0:12:26.160 --> 0:12:27.280 we do this stuff? 0:12:29.440 --> 0:12:29.640 Yeah? 0:12:30.240 --> 0:12:35.440 And and the first three there's okay, wait, okay, there's 0:12:35.440 --> 0:12:36.240 a there's a. 0:12:39.240 --> 0:12:41.560 Sorry, two separate things. There's the four questions, and there's 0:12:41.559 --> 0:12:43.120 the four children. Two separate things. 0:12:43.240 --> 0:12:45.640 Okay, who are the four children? There's four different children. 0:12:46.600 --> 0:12:48.880 I know what I'm saying in Hebrew. So there's a 0:12:48.960 --> 0:12:52.439 smart one. There's the smart one who knows everything. There's 0:12:52.480 --> 0:12:54.640 a bad one who knows everything but goes against it. 0:12:55.400 --> 0:13:01.000 There's a tom I'm not say in English, but they 0:13:01.000 --> 0:13:02.720 got with the humor names. And then there's two like 0:13:02.760 --> 0:13:04.760 one who doesn't know what's going on. He's just like 0:13:04.920 --> 0:13:08.040 minded there somehow, and then one of them I forgot 0:13:08.040 --> 0:13:11.000 what the middle third one is he also doesn't know 0:13:11.040 --> 0:13:14.520 what it's just going on. But yeah, it's basically supposed 0:13:14.520 --> 0:13:16.600 to be like I don't know, some type of metaphor 0:13:16.600 --> 0:13:17.520 for life. 0:13:17.640 --> 0:13:18.719 I don't know, but. 0:13:18.679 --> 0:13:20.800 There's okay, so there's what there's a smart child, the 0:13:20.880 --> 0:13:23.640 dumb child or whatever child, the wicked child. Okay, this 0:13:23.679 --> 0:13:26.280 is what's always gotten. I'm sure I've said this on 0:13:26.360 --> 0:13:30.080 this stupid podcast. I've said this before, but this has 0:13:30.120 --> 0:13:35.480 always gotten to me, is okay. The wicked child asks 0:13:35.520 --> 0:13:40.160 the question that essentially goes, yo, why do we like 0:13:40.240 --> 0:13:42.200 do all this stuff? Like what's the point? 0:13:42.640 --> 0:13:43.480 You know? Yeah? 0:13:43.520 --> 0:13:45.640 And do you know what The answer to the wicked 0:13:45.720 --> 0:13:51.319 child's question is that slipped my mind if the wicked child. 0:13:51.440 --> 0:13:53.680 The wicked child asks, so, wait, why do we do 0:13:53.760 --> 0:13:56.440 all this stuff? And the answer the wicked child's question 0:13:56.600 --> 0:13:59.880 is how dare you question this? If you were an 0:14:00.080 --> 0:14:06.199 egypt you would not have been saved? Do you remember that? 0:14:06.440 --> 0:14:10.360 I'm not crazy? Right, that's the answer to that. Hold on, 0:14:10.360 --> 0:14:13.680 I'm like, I'm hold on, Jamie looked this up. I'm Jamie, 0:14:13.679 --> 0:14:23.680 I'm looking it up. The wicked child passover. Yeah, the 0:14:23.720 --> 0:14:29.080 wicked child is like, uh, why do you Oh? Yeah, okay. 0:14:29.120 --> 0:14:32.160 The wicked child says, why do you guys do this? 0:14:33.200 --> 0:14:37.720 And by saying you guys, he's signaling his own alienation 0:14:38.640 --> 0:14:40.440 from like, hey, why are you guys doing this stuff? 0:14:40.520 --> 0:14:42.360 As like he's signaling that he's not part of it. 0:14:43.000 --> 0:14:46.920 And then the answer in the book is because he 0:14:46.960 --> 0:14:50.200 has excluded himself from the community he is, he has 0:14:50.280 --> 0:14:55.359 committed heresy. Therefore, the Lord would not have saved him. 0:14:55.800 --> 0:14:58.040 See that ship. I just that's I don't know, that's 0:14:58.080 --> 0:15:00.400 there's a lot of you know what is I was, 0:15:02.120 --> 0:15:06.240 I'm in Brazil right now, and I was looking at 0:15:06.280 --> 0:15:09.280 the thing, the big statue with Jesus, and I was 0:15:09.320 --> 0:15:12.840 thinking about Jesus, and I was thinking about religion, and 0:15:14.320 --> 0:15:18.720 is a lot like Jesus said a lot of stuff 0:15:18.720 --> 0:15:20.920 that made sense. He was like, you know what, I 0:15:20.960 --> 0:15:24.000 love your neighbor, all that other stuff, and then I'm whatever, 0:15:24.040 --> 0:15:25.960 I'm sure Moses did a bunch of stuff. To all 0:15:26.000 --> 0:15:29.760 the religion, they're like nice things about them, but then 0:15:30.480 --> 0:15:34.560 they're all like, it's so weird because like at the 0:15:34.600 --> 0:15:36.880 core of a lot of them is like these nice 0:15:37.000 --> 0:15:44.400 things and then there's all these like traditions and fear 0:15:44.720 --> 0:15:50.800 and whatever that surrounds them. Yeah dogma. Yeah, it's a good, 0:15:50.840 --> 0:15:53.840 good way to put it, that surrounds them. And that's 0:15:53.880 --> 0:15:56.040 such a bummer to me. Could you imagine if it 0:15:56.040 --> 0:15:58.680 had gone differently, if it was like we had all 0:15:58.680 --> 0:16:03.600 the nice parts of religion without the dogma. 0:16:03.840 --> 0:16:05.320 I mean, in my opinion, it's like a lot of 0:16:05.320 --> 0:16:07.480 people how they interpret it. Yeah, I don't know much 0:16:07.480 --> 0:16:10.200 about Christianity or Jesus, but like in Judaism, most of 0:16:10.240 --> 0:16:13.920 the stuff we follow just as like some dude's interpretation 0:16:14.080 --> 0:16:17.440 of what the Bible said and they argue about it. 0:16:17.440 --> 0:16:20.040 It's something called atama and they argue about what it means, 0:16:20.080 --> 0:16:22.080 and whoever won that argument, that's how we have to 0:16:22.120 --> 0:16:26.120 live by. So it's like very like I don't know 0:16:26.120 --> 0:16:29.400 what's the word, not patriarch but very dogmatic. But there's 0:16:29.400 --> 0:16:32.160 like another word like what I say is the thing 0:16:32.280 --> 0:16:35.440 they have to follow or something Yeah I read it, well. 0:16:36.040 --> 0:16:41.600 Yeah, it's you know, it's it's funny because that feels 0:16:41.640 --> 0:16:50.680 to me like it feels like you can either like 0:16:50.800 --> 0:16:55.000 your parents for example, or or whoever is like you know, 0:16:55.080 --> 0:17:01.000 deeply ingrained in like a fundamentalist and interpretation of their 0:17:01.000 --> 0:17:04.640 religion is like there's a deep there's a deep comfort 0:17:04.680 --> 0:17:08.600 in that. But if you want to start asking yourself questions, 0:17:08.880 --> 0:17:12.800 you'll have an insane existential crisis. Oh yeah, and it'll 0:17:12.840 --> 0:17:15.000 take you to a place that's not it's they it'll 0:17:15.040 --> 0:17:18.920 take you to place it's just nowhere that's just terrifying. 0:17:21.280 --> 0:17:23.040 But you will pay but you but I think I 0:17:23.040 --> 0:17:26.240 don't know it's by the way, neither of those journeys 0:17:26.320 --> 0:17:30.879 is the correct one. You still you know, die, But 0:17:30.960 --> 0:17:32.600 I think if you're alive, it's but you I I 0:17:32.840 --> 0:17:35.199 I'm a fan. I think taking the journey is good. 0:17:35.880 --> 0:17:38.840 Yeah, I want to recommend it for everyone, like a 0:17:38.920 --> 0:17:40.760 lot of times, and I'm just thinking about it. I'm like, 0:17:40.840 --> 0:17:42.800 if I just stayed in the fold and never left 0:17:42.800 --> 0:17:45.560 and just live an ignorant, I might have been happier, 0:17:46.000 --> 0:17:49.080 you know, get get like matched up with a girl 0:17:49.160 --> 0:17:51.880 and have kids and just live a life and ignorance 0:17:51.920 --> 0:17:57.040 and don't know better. Yeah, coming out, But you know. 0:17:57.040 --> 0:17:59.520 What, here the the thing about like that arranged marriage 0:17:59.720 --> 0:18:03.320 stuff too. Maybe not the arranged marriage is a heavy 0:18:03.359 --> 0:18:06.280 thing for it. But like I had this thought the 0:18:06.280 --> 0:18:08.199 other I think nihilism is like a it's like a 0:18:08.280 --> 0:18:13.359 scale issue, you know, like yeah, of course you don't, 0:18:13.560 --> 0:18:16.280 like all the time the album walking around like I'm 0:18:16.320 --> 0:18:18.600 in Brazil, there's an eighty billion people, and I'm like 0:18:20.160 --> 0:18:23.240 and I'm like, I like, there's like I don't matter, 0:18:23.440 --> 0:18:25.280 you know, but you don't. But that's you don't have 0:18:25.320 --> 0:18:27.120 to matter, but you don't, but you don't. But it's 0:18:27.119 --> 0:18:29.119 a scale issue because you don't have to matter to 0:18:29.240 --> 0:18:32.840 the whole universe. You just have to matter in order 0:18:32.880 --> 0:18:35.840 to not go down like a crazy existential nihilistic path. 0:18:36.080 --> 0:18:41.280 You just have to matter to like something or someone 0:18:41.960 --> 0:18:43.240 outside of yourself. 0:18:44.560 --> 0:18:44.800 You know. 0:18:45.040 --> 0:18:47.720 That's where that's where I think I've gotten it. My 0:18:47.840 --> 0:18:50.920 nihilism's got out of controls because it's just a scale issue. 0:18:50.960 --> 0:18:52.840 It's like you want, you want to feel like you 0:18:53.040 --> 0:18:56.800 matter on a grand scale of things. But that's that's insane. 0:18:57.200 --> 0:18:59.679 You know, nobody. You could be the most in you 0:18:59.720 --> 0:19:01.760 could be the most talked about person ever, and you 0:19:01.760 --> 0:19:05.720 don't matter on a scale issue. Yeah, but if you 0:19:05.840 --> 0:19:09.040 just made whatever, if you just have like a friend 0:19:10.119 --> 0:19:13.040 who want who likes that you're not dead, or if 0:19:13.080 --> 0:19:17.200 you deliver mail and you got to deliver the mail 0:19:17.840 --> 0:19:20.720 to that one guy, like you know, just just scale it, 0:19:21.080 --> 0:19:22.879 scale it down until you matter. 0:19:24.080 --> 0:19:27.280 Yeah. Now I'm with you on that, But I mean 0:19:27.440 --> 0:19:29.439 I haven't had that feeling. Like you said, you're in 0:19:29.480 --> 0:19:32.320 Brazil eighty other people like I used to travel a lot, 0:19:32.480 --> 0:19:34.639 or go to Japan Tokyo on a whim and just 0:19:34.640 --> 0:19:36.399 go there alone for a couple of days, and I 0:19:36.400 --> 0:19:39.080 would just love getting lost there, not mattering at all, 0:19:39.200 --> 0:19:42.080 not understanding the language, just being a spec and just 0:19:42.119 --> 0:19:43.920 walking down the street. And I don't know, I just 0:19:43.960 --> 0:19:45.600 found a lot of comfort in that. At the time, 0:19:46.520 --> 0:19:48.080 I can't really do that anymore because they have a 0:19:48.160 --> 0:19:51.280 job responsibility. But back when I was in college and 0:19:51.320 --> 0:19:53.879 I just really enjoy doing that. But yeah, I do 0:19:55.600 --> 0:19:58.040 like if I matter to someone, Like sometimes I wonder, 0:19:58.080 --> 0:20:00.879 like what if I did die in my apartment I 0:20:01.400 --> 0:20:03.920 live alone, Like the name will have to complain until 0:20:04.000 --> 0:20:06.879 like start smelling outside or something like. I think my 0:20:06.920 --> 0:20:09.000 biggest fear like I was just choking to people or 0:20:09.000 --> 0:20:12.680 something and no one could find me until my body's 0:20:12.680 --> 0:20:13.520 decaying or some ship. 0:20:14.080 --> 0:20:15.800 Yep, No, I have I have that. I have that thing. 0:20:15.840 --> 0:20:18.000 I have that same thought where yeah, there's a lot 0:20:18.040 --> 0:20:20.560 I've had that same thought in my in my living alone. 0:20:20.760 --> 0:20:23.359 That's a classic living alone thing where I'm like, ship, 0:20:24.400 --> 0:20:26.160 it would take a long time for someone to find 0:20:26.160 --> 0:20:26.840 out if I died. 0:20:27.920 --> 0:20:33.240 Yeah, people will listen to your podcast. It's like, hey, kid, 0:20:33.240 --> 0:20:34.880 me come up with a podcast a long time, what's 0:20:34.920 --> 0:20:37.280 up with him? Yeah? 0:20:37.320 --> 0:20:39.399 I guess that I could be the case. Yeah, that 0:20:39.400 --> 0:20:41.320 could be. That could be the case. Do you have 0:20:41.359 --> 0:20:44.440 a girl? Do you have a girlfriend or anything like that? 0:20:45.600 --> 0:20:48.720 No, don't have a girlfriend, never really been in a 0:20:48.760 --> 0:20:53.560 serious relationship, Like I've only had like flings out lasted 0:20:53.640 --> 0:20:56.119 for a couple of months. Mostly when I was younger, 0:20:56.119 --> 0:20:58.840 I was just unstable, Like I couldn't commit to anybody, 0:20:58.960 --> 0:21:02.119 Like it was just tough. I was trying to find myself. 0:21:02.160 --> 0:21:05.240 And now that I'm older, you know, it's looking back. 0:21:05.320 --> 0:21:07.600 I mean, yeah, I'm trying to find someone to, you know, 0:21:07.640 --> 0:21:10.560 spend the rest of my life with. But it's tough 0:21:10.560 --> 0:21:13.840 when you get older too. 0:21:14.880 --> 0:21:15.919 How can I ask how old you are? 0:21:17.880 --> 0:21:18.680 Late thirties? 0:21:19.400 --> 0:21:21.600 Well, and why is why has it been getting getting 0:21:21.600 --> 0:21:24.280 tougher for you? I don't know. 0:21:24.320 --> 0:21:26.200 I used to rely on like dating apps a lot, 0:21:26.400 --> 0:21:28.240 and when I was like living in New York, like 0:21:28.280 --> 0:21:30.240 I would get like four or five days tonight, Like 0:21:30.320 --> 0:21:32.240 if I wanted to go on four or five days tonight, 0:21:32.560 --> 0:21:34.840 I would just go on four five days tonight. Like 0:21:34.920 --> 0:21:36.440 sometimes I'd go on a date and I forget the 0:21:36.480 --> 0:21:39.640 girl's name. I'll call her the girl I'll see earlier 0:21:39.680 --> 0:21:41.640 that night. I called her by her name, and they'll 0:21:41.640 --> 0:21:44.360