1 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:08,200 Speaker 1: This is what happens when the fourth Turning meets fifth 2 00:00:08,200 --> 00:00:12,800 Speaker 1: generation warfare. 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:19,200 Speaker 2: A commentator, international social media sensation, and form a Navy 4 00:00:19,239 --> 00:00:20,200 Speaker 2: intelligence veteran. 5 00:00:20,400 --> 00:00:24,040 Speaker 3: This is Human Events with your host, Jack Posoviet christ 6 00:00:24,320 --> 00:00:26,079 Speaker 3: is King, my fellow citizens. 7 00:00:26,960 --> 00:00:30,400 Speaker 4: At this hour, American and coalition forces are in the 8 00:00:30,400 --> 00:00:34,720 Speaker 4: early stages of military operations to disarm Iraq, to free 9 00:00:34,760 --> 00:00:37,880 Speaker 4: its people, and to defend the world from grave danger. 10 00:00:38,920 --> 00:00:43,159 Speaker 4: On my orders, Coalition forces have begun striking selected targets 11 00:00:43,200 --> 00:00:47,760 Speaker 4: of military importance to undermine Saddam Hussein's ability to wage war. 12 00:01:00,440 --> 00:01:02,600 Speaker 3: I take the threat very seriously. 13 00:01:04,240 --> 00:01:09,120 Speaker 4: I take the fact that he develops weapons of mass 14 00:01:09,120 --> 00:01:11,679 Speaker 4: destruction very seriously. 15 00:01:11,720 --> 00:01:14,240 Speaker 5: Twenty percent of the total amount added to the US 16 00:01:14,319 --> 00:01:17,880 Speaker 5: national debt between twenty one and twenty twelve were just 17 00:01:17,959 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 5: the costs of the wars in Iraq in Afghanistan. 18 00:01:20,760 --> 00:01:25,039 Speaker 1: Obviously, the war in Iraq was a big, fat mistake. 19 00:01:25,160 --> 00:01:27,479 Speaker 4: The main reason we went into Iraq at the time 20 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:29,440 Speaker 4: was we thought he had weapons of mass destruction. 21 00:01:29,560 --> 00:01:32,760 Speaker 3: It turns out he didn't. The central bag of this crowd, 22 00:01:32,840 --> 00:01:35,920 Speaker 3: the small crowd that has swelled to this now taking 23 00:01:35,959 --> 00:01:39,800 Speaker 3: off their shoes, throwing them at this statue which is 24 00:01:39,840 --> 00:01:44,760 Speaker 3: a deeply insulting Arab gesture. It would be coming down. 25 00:01:47,720 --> 00:01:48,520 Speaker 6: A few seconds. 26 00:01:48,640 --> 00:01:51,720 Speaker 5: Saddam will be executed before he manages to complete his 27 00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:54,960 Speaker 5: last prayer. The Shiate security guard opens the scaffold. 28 00:01:56,160 --> 00:02:00,200 Speaker 4: Major combat operations in Iraq have ended in the out 29 00:02:00,200 --> 00:02:05,200 Speaker 4: of Iraq. The United States and our allies have prevailed. 30 00:02:07,320 --> 00:02:12,720 Speaker 7: The individual strapped with explosives, But me in my fellow 31 00:02:12,720 --> 00:02:16,320 Speaker 7: three Marines that was injured, had no idea he was there. 32 00:02:16,600 --> 00:02:20,120 Speaker 7: Five years after the war began, the American death toll 33 00:02:20,200 --> 00:02:23,760 Speaker 7: has reached at least four thousand the military. So The 34 00:02:23,840 --> 00:02:28,800 Speaker 7: latest deaths occurred Sunday. A roadside bomb killed four US 35 00:02:28,800 --> 00:02:30,480 Speaker 7: soldiers in southern Baghdad. 36 00:02:30,639 --> 00:02:34,560 Speaker 4: President Bush said that he will leave Washington next week 37 00:02:34,919 --> 00:02:37,160 Speaker 4: with a great sense of accomplishment. 38 00:02:37,560 --> 00:02:38,920 Speaker 3: Do you feel the same way I do. 39 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:44,800 Speaker 1: Ladies and gentlemen, welcome a board to tales of the 40 00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:53,040 Speaker 1: Regime Change Iraq, the war that rewired the world. In 41 00:02:53,080 --> 00:02:56,359 Speaker 1: March of two thousand and three, the United States launched 42 00:02:56,440 --> 00:02:59,160 Speaker 1: one of the most consequential gambles in modern history. 43 00:03:00,120 --> 00:03:03,240 Speaker 3: Move Sodom, is saying, remake. 44 00:03:02,960 --> 00:03:06,360 Speaker 1: Iraq and reshape the entire Middle East in our image. 45 00:03:06,800 --> 00:03:10,400 Speaker 1: Washington believed that it was striking a blow against tyranny, 46 00:03:11,000 --> 00:03:14,359 Speaker 1: instead struck a match in a room full of gasoline. 47 00:03:15,000 --> 00:03:18,160 Speaker 1: Because the Iraq War wasn't just another intervention. It was 48 00:03:18,200 --> 00:03:22,360 Speaker 1: a blueprint for how intelligence, ideology, and hubris fused into 49 00:03:22,440 --> 00:03:27,120 Speaker 1: a foreign policy revolution that detonated across the world. And 50 00:03:27,160 --> 00:03:32,000 Speaker 1: then first came the certainty Sodom had weapons of mass destruction, 51 00:03:32,360 --> 00:03:36,840 Speaker 1: not maybe, not probably definitely. That confidence came from the 52 00:03:36,880 --> 00:03:41,320 Speaker 1: same intelligence pipeline that had spent a decade overestimating Soviet strength, 53 00:03:41,400 --> 00:03:45,320 Speaker 1: underestimating al Qaeda, and misreading Afghanistan, as we learned in 54 00:03:45,600 --> 00:03:48,600 Speaker 1: that episode. But now in the shadow of nine to eleven, 55 00:03:48,640 --> 00:03:52,080 Speaker 1: no one wanted to question anything. And then came Bush's 56 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:56,000 Speaker 1: great theory, the grand idea, remove a dictator and democracy 57 00:03:56,120 --> 00:04:00,760 Speaker 1: will bloom. Baghdad today, Damascus tomorrow, Tehran the day after 58 00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:05,040 Speaker 1: a wave of liberation radiating across the region, a new 59 00:04:05,040 --> 00:04:08,000 Speaker 1: Middle East, built not only by its people but by 60 00:04:08,120 --> 00:04:12,200 Speaker 1: the design sheets of Washington policymakers. But as we know, 61 00:04:13,040 --> 00:04:16,680 Speaker 1: Iraq was not a blank canvas. It was a nation 62 00:04:16,760 --> 00:04:21,360 Speaker 1: of rival sects, tribes, militias, clans, and loyalties that went 63 00:04:21,400 --> 00:04:24,599 Speaker 1: deeper than any constitution written in the Green Zone, and 64 00:04:24,680 --> 00:04:28,760 Speaker 1: the moment Sodom's regime fell, the moment the Bath State resolved, 65 00:04:28,880 --> 00:04:31,560 Speaker 1: all of those forces that Saddam Hussein had held in 66 00:04:31,720 --> 00:04:38,400 Speaker 1: check erupted at once. Every Neocon assumption collapsed, every projection failed. 67 00:04:38,640 --> 00:04:41,520 Speaker 1: The war for Iraq wasn't fought in neat phrases. It 68 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:44,120 Speaker 1: was fought in the streets, the mosques, the market places, 69 00:04:44,240 --> 00:04:48,039 Speaker 1: and the neighborhoods where neo Kan planners never bothered to look. 70 00:04:48,480 --> 00:04:51,919 Speaker 1: And out of that chaos came insurgency, sectarian war, al 71 00:04:52,000 --> 00:04:54,560 Speaker 1: Qaeda in Iraq, and eventually the rise of something the 72 00:04:54,560 --> 00:04:57,839 Speaker 1: world had never seen, the Islamic State, at least not 73 00:04:57,920 --> 00:05:01,400 Speaker 1: seen in hundreds of years. The Iraq War didn't just topple 74 00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:08,240 Speaker 1: a dictator. It remapped alliances, rewired global politics, destabilized entire regions, 75 00:05:08,360 --> 00:05:12,080 Speaker 1: birth movements that would shape the century. In At every step, 76 00:05:12,360 --> 00:05:17,080 Speaker 1: the same pattern emerged. An intervention sold by intelligence, powered 77 00:05:17,120 --> 00:05:23,400 Speaker 1: by neocon ideology, and undone by unintended consequences and folks, 78 00:05:23,960 --> 00:05:28,280 Speaker 1: let's be serious, America lost trillions in the Middle East, 79 00:05:29,160 --> 00:05:33,960 Speaker 1: trillions of dollars which devastated our own economy, which led 80 00:05:34,279 --> 00:05:40,279 Speaker 1: Washington to turn to massive financial printing, which devastated the 81 00:05:40,320 --> 00:05:43,880 Speaker 1: average American, devastated the middle class, and not to mention 82 00:05:44,520 --> 00:05:48,760 Speaker 1: the amount of blood that we spent that American boys 83 00:05:49,160 --> 00:05:56,000 Speaker 1: who went over to die in the sand for a lie. 84 00:05:56,200 --> 00:05:59,640 Speaker 1: That's what we're talking about today. And you need to 85 00:05:59,680 --> 00:06:03,360 Speaker 1: be dead serious, because this is dead serious. And there 86 00:06:03,360 --> 00:06:07,480 Speaker 1: are people right now want to do another one of these. 87 00:06:07,520 --> 00:06:10,159 Speaker 1: They say, let's go try it in Iran. It works 88 00:06:10,160 --> 00:06:12,640 Speaker 1: so well in Iraq, Let's go try it somewhere else 89 00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:17,560 Speaker 1: because it works so well. Now, the same ideology that 90 00:06:17,640 --> 00:06:20,720 Speaker 1: led to that war still exists today, and we need 91 00:06:20,760 --> 00:06:23,760 Speaker 1: to fight it with every breath that we have, and 92 00:06:23,800 --> 00:06:25,040 Speaker 1: I know that I certainly will. 93 00:06:25,480 --> 00:06:27,160 Speaker 3: Neo cons haven't left. 94 00:06:27,600 --> 00:06:31,600 Speaker 1: You need to be America first, and these are the 95 00:06:31,600 --> 00:06:36,280 Speaker 1: reasons why we are America first. This is Iraq, the 96 00:06:36,320 --> 00:06:40,359 Speaker 1: war that rewired the world. I'm Jack Pasobic, and today 97 00:06:40,680 --> 00:06:43,440 Speaker 1: we are stepping into the war that defined a generation 98 00:06:43,839 --> 00:06:47,880 Speaker 1: and revealed just how far superpower can fall when it 99 00:06:47,920 --> 00:06:51,400 Speaker 1: believes that reality itself will bend to the. 100 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:02,560 Speaker 5: Operation Iraqi Freedom, our effort. 101 00:07:02,320 --> 00:07:09,880 Speaker 8: To disarm Iraq and dismantled the Iraqi regime was fully underway. 102 00:07:10,200 --> 00:07:14,560 Speaker 5: But here's the twist. Saddam Hussein wasn't always America's enemy. 103 00:07:15,560 --> 00:07:18,760 Speaker 5: In fact, at one point the United States quietly supported 104 00:07:18,800 --> 00:07:22,680 Speaker 5: him with money, intelligence, and political cover. 105 00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:26,920 Speaker 1: All right, folks, Jack Pasivick were back tales of regime change, 106 00:07:27,160 --> 00:07:30,920 Speaker 1: the war that rewired the world Iraq. Now many people 107 00:07:30,960 --> 00:07:34,160 Speaker 1: ask why was it that the United States chose to 108 00:07:34,200 --> 00:07:38,320 Speaker 1: evade Iraq after nine to eleven? Two years later we 109 00:07:38,400 --> 00:07:41,720 Speaker 1: see this invasion. At the time, the Bush administration lied 110 00:07:41,880 --> 00:07:45,320 Speaker 1: and said that Saddam Usin was involved with nine to 111 00:07:45,360 --> 00:07:50,240 Speaker 1: eleven just wasn't true. We also found that they said 112 00:07:50,280 --> 00:07:52,760 Speaker 1: he was involved with weapons of mass destruction also was 113 00:07:52,800 --> 00:07:55,680 Speaker 1: not true. And in fact, the United States had backed 114 00:07:55,760 --> 00:08:00,600 Speaker 1: Saddam Hussein in his war against Iran in the nineteen eighties. 115 00:08:00,720 --> 00:08:04,160 Speaker 1: We had been his ally. But then along came something 116 00:08:04,360 --> 00:08:08,960 Speaker 1: called the Kuwait War. Saddam goes in for the oil 117 00:08:09,040 --> 00:08:11,920 Speaker 1: fields and the US launches the Gulf War against him. 118 00:08:12,960 --> 00:08:14,480 Speaker 1: He said, WHOA, I thought we were friends. 119 00:08:14,960 --> 00:08:15,320 Speaker 3: Guess not. 120 00:08:16,920 --> 00:08:21,080 Speaker 1: But then something interesting happens in the region in the 121 00:08:21,160 --> 00:08:28,040 Speaker 1: United States and new leaders begin to emerge, specifically after 122 00:08:28,080 --> 00:08:32,760 Speaker 1: America's victory in Desert Storm, and people realized, wait, perhaps 123 00:08:32,800 --> 00:08:35,920 Speaker 1: the US government can do more in the Middle East, 124 00:08:36,600 --> 00:08:40,440 Speaker 1: not just establish a permanent military blueprint or footprint in 125 00:08:41,559 --> 00:08:45,720 Speaker 1: the Persian Gulf, but a new doctrine. Some call it 126 00:08:46,320 --> 00:08:50,840 Speaker 1: the project for the New American Century. But there was 127 00:08:50,840 --> 00:08:54,880 Speaker 1: something that even came before that. In nineteen ninety six, 128 00:08:55,880 --> 00:08:59,480 Speaker 1: a policy memo was prepared for incoming Israeli Prime Minister 129 00:08:59,520 --> 00:09:02,200 Speaker 1: Benjamin net and Yahoo And we've spoken about this on 130 00:09:02,320 --> 00:09:06,800 Speaker 1: the show previously, And this was written, interestingly by a 131 00:09:06,840 --> 00:09:10,920 Speaker 1: group of American neo conservative policy advisors, several of which 132 00:09:10,920 --> 00:09:14,200 Speaker 1: would later become central figures in the Bush administration and 133 00:09:14,280 --> 00:09:17,480 Speaker 1: associated with PNAC. That's that project for the New American Century. 134 00:09:17,800 --> 00:09:21,120 Speaker 1: And this was called a Clean Break, a new strategy 135 00:09:21,200 --> 00:09:22,440 Speaker 1: for securing the region. 136 00:09:23,040 --> 00:09:23,920 Speaker 3: Here's what's interesting. 137 00:09:24,480 --> 00:09:30,040 Speaker 1: The Clean Break specifically called for the destabilization of what 138 00:09:30,760 --> 00:09:37,080 Speaker 1: were labeled hostile regimes and called for removing Saddam Hussein 139 00:09:37,240 --> 00:09:40,600 Speaker 1: from power and Iraq. It called for the rollback of 140 00:09:41,000 --> 00:09:46,040 Speaker 1: the government of Syria, the rollback of Hezbolah, and then 141 00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:50,960 Speaker 1: eventually the rollback of Iran. Then to strengthen ties with 142 00:09:51,360 --> 00:09:55,920 Speaker 1: Turkey and Jordan to encircle Syria. 143 00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:56,800 Speaker 3: They laid this. 144 00:09:56,840 --> 00:10:01,000 Speaker 1: Out as a policy, a strong policy for Israel in 145 00:10:01,040 --> 00:10:04,880 Speaker 1: the Middle East. But then, interestingly, many of those same 146 00:10:04,920 --> 00:10:10,720 Speaker 1: advisors began to apply this policy to the United States. 147 00:10:11,240 --> 00:10:15,240 Speaker 1: And in the wake of nine to eleven, you see 148 00:10:15,280 --> 00:10:21,760 Speaker 1: these policies being enacted by the Bush administration, and we're 149 00:10:21,760 --> 00:10:25,760 Speaker 1: told that this was to We're told that this was 150 00:10:25,800 --> 00:10:29,600 Speaker 1: to defend America. In the wake of nine to eleven, 151 00:10:29,679 --> 00:10:32,959 Speaker 1: we must restabilize and reshape the entire Middle East. But 152 00:10:33,040 --> 00:10:35,360 Speaker 1: what's interesting is that they were saying it even before 153 00:10:35,960 --> 00:10:38,280 Speaker 1: nine to eleven, because in nineteen ninety eight they sent 154 00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:43,240 Speaker 1: President Clinton a demand that said remove Saddam Husseiged from power, 155 00:10:43,600 --> 00:10:48,160 Speaker 1: not someday now, It's not fringe. These were people who 156 00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:50,040 Speaker 1: were later at the top of the Pentagon, the top 157 00:10:50,080 --> 00:10:53,640 Speaker 1: of the Vice President's office, and the National Security Council. 158 00:10:53,920 --> 00:10:56,880 Speaker 1: So by the time Bush took office in two thousand 159 00:10:56,880 --> 00:11:00,400 Speaker 1: and one, the blueprint for the Iraq War was all 160 00:11:00,960 --> 00:11:05,800 Speaker 1: ready drawn. And of course, the first Domino whose fall 161 00:11:06,040 --> 00:11:10,280 Speaker 1: was opposed to unleash a democratic wave from the Tigris 162 00:11:10,440 --> 00:11:14,679 Speaker 1: to Tehran, And of course that was the theory. Joshua Leaac, 163 00:11:14,720 --> 00:11:17,640 Speaker 1: I want to get you in on this. You've studied 164 00:11:17,640 --> 00:11:22,440 Speaker 1: this stuff, You've looked into it. This isn't conspiracy talk. 165 00:11:22,559 --> 00:11:25,040 Speaker 1: This is actually how our government functioned in those years, 166 00:11:25,080 --> 00:11:25,679 Speaker 1: isn't it. 167 00:11:26,760 --> 00:11:29,360 Speaker 3: That's correct. Yes, And there is a strange bit of 168 00:11:29,400 --> 00:11:30,199 Speaker 3: a sleight. 169 00:11:29,920 --> 00:11:34,400 Speaker 9: Of hand amongst the Bush administration and its allies and 170 00:11:34,480 --> 00:11:37,160 Speaker 9: advisors from two thousand and one to two thousand and two, 171 00:11:37,160 --> 00:11:40,320 Speaker 9: two thousand and three, sloding up to the invasion of Iraq. 172 00:11:40,600 --> 00:11:43,120 Speaker 3: And when we go and look at President George W. 173 00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:48,120 Speaker 9: Bush's speeches, the policy, the think tanks that were surrounding him, 174 00:11:48,559 --> 00:11:52,120 Speaker 9: the context of Afghanistan was this is a once off. 175 00:11:52,440 --> 00:11:55,880 Speaker 9: It is in the context it's going to be retribution 176 00:11:56,480 --> 00:11:58,000 Speaker 9: for nine to eleven. 177 00:11:58,400 --> 00:12:00,760 Speaker 3: There's not going to be long term change. 178 00:12:00,760 --> 00:12:06,040 Speaker 9: And this was explicit policy, This was explicit speech material. 179 00:12:06,240 --> 00:12:07,520 Speaker 3: We go back and we look at. 180 00:12:07,400 --> 00:12:10,040 Speaker 9: Two thousand and one, two thousand and two, and then 181 00:12:10,400 --> 00:12:15,400 Speaker 9: suddenly we see a strange turn of events where his 182 00:12:15,559 --> 00:12:17,839 Speaker 9: advisors and then President W. 183 00:12:18,040 --> 00:12:18,400 Speaker 3: George W. 184 00:12:18,480 --> 00:12:21,800 Speaker 9: Bush himself began talking almost out of nowhere about this 185 00:12:22,320 --> 00:12:26,880 Speaker 9: axis of evil. It's it's almost like marketing or advertising 186 00:12:26,960 --> 00:12:31,680 Speaker 9: where but wait, there's more and the military industrial complex 187 00:12:31,720 --> 00:12:35,400 Speaker 9: than needed to be reapplied. It was it was too successful, 188 00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:40,000 Speaker 9: too quick. Oh but behind al Qaeda behind the Taliban 189 00:12:40,360 --> 00:12:44,080 Speaker 9: is a threat that's far worse than anything we've seen before. 190 00:12:44,679 --> 00:12:49,520 Speaker 9: Now Clean Break advises Israel Bab specifically Prime Minister at 191 00:12:49,520 --> 00:12:55,520 Speaker 9: the time, advises them to engage in preemptive policy. That's 192 00:12:55,559 --> 00:13:00,520 Speaker 9: where we hit them so they can't hit us. And 193 00:13:00,559 --> 00:13:03,560 Speaker 9: that is the argument that was used by the Bush 194 00:13:03,559 --> 00:13:05,600 Speaker 9: administration with this. 195 00:13:06,200 --> 00:13:08,960 Speaker 3: Actually we're going to have way more nine. 196 00:13:08,880 --> 00:13:11,560 Speaker 9: To elevens if we don't stop Saddam Musin because that 197 00:13:11,679 --> 00:13:16,000 Speaker 9: was still part and parcel with the American patriotic experience, right, 198 00:13:16,040 --> 00:13:20,440 Speaker 9: we all got to come together and be patriotic citizens 199 00:13:20,440 --> 00:13:24,160 Speaker 9: and oppose those who oppose us, and that language began 200 00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:27,360 Speaker 9: to emerge where we have to fight them over there, 201 00:13:27,720 --> 00:13:30,719 Speaker 9: so we don't fight them over here again and have 202 00:13:30,840 --> 00:13:34,840 Speaker 9: more of these terrorist interventions and imagine just how awesol 203 00:13:34,880 --> 00:13:35,440 Speaker 9: it would be. 204 00:13:36,480 --> 00:13:38,800 Speaker 1: Go ahead and talk oh oh no, just to again 205 00:13:38,840 --> 00:13:41,920 Speaker 1: on that Iraq did not attack the United States and 206 00:13:41,960 --> 00:13:44,679 Speaker 1: in fact, the people who were who were on those 207 00:13:44,720 --> 00:13:48,280 Speaker 1: planes on nine to eleven and were and so people 208 00:13:48,360 --> 00:13:51,720 Speaker 1: understand for the scope of this project, Joshua and I 209 00:13:51,840 --> 00:13:56,160 Speaker 1: are not discussing nine to eleven itself because we are 210 00:13:56,160 --> 00:13:58,360 Speaker 1: focused on regime changes the same way, and non humans 211 00:13:58,360 --> 00:14:01,040 Speaker 1: we're focused on. Can people say when we wrote on humans, 212 00:14:01,080 --> 00:14:03,960 Speaker 1: people were asking us, why didn't you know mention certain things, 213 00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:05,920 Speaker 1: and I said, well, they were outside the scope of 214 00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:10,800 Speaker 1: our project, and we were focused on Marxist revolutions specifically 215 00:14:10,880 --> 00:14:13,240 Speaker 1: at that time. There were other places where Marxist came 216 00:14:13,280 --> 00:14:15,960 Speaker 1: to power and Marxist regimes that just didn't follow the 217 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:19,640 Speaker 1: model that we were looking at. So, but what's interesting is, 218 00:14:19,680 --> 00:14:22,600 Speaker 1: of course nine to eleven most of the hijackers were 219 00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:26,120 Speaker 1: of course from Saudi Arabia. They were not from any 220 00:14:26,200 --> 00:14:30,160 Speaker 1: of the countries that are labeled in this document, and 221 00:14:30,320 --> 00:14:35,160 Speaker 1: that obviously is yeah, an Egyptian right And Khalichik Muhammad 222 00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:38,320 Speaker 1: was a was Kuwaiti, so who was the planner and 223 00:14:38,400 --> 00:14:40,880 Speaker 1: who was down at at GITMOI did not get the 224 00:14:40,960 --> 00:14:45,240 Speaker 1: chance to meet him, by the way, but for the record, 225 00:14:45,640 --> 00:14:48,080 Speaker 1: I could have if I wanted to go to his trials, 226 00:14:48,120 --> 00:14:52,000 Speaker 1: but I never never did and I had work to do. 227 00:14:52,600 --> 00:14:57,040 Speaker 1: So the key here, right, the key here that's very 228 00:14:57,040 --> 00:15:00,280 Speaker 1: interesting I think for everyone is to understand that it's 229 00:15:00,360 --> 00:15:04,360 Speaker 1: very clear Iraq did not attack the United States, and 230 00:15:04,400 --> 00:15:07,400 Speaker 1: for people who in the fact that I need to 231 00:15:07,440 --> 00:15:09,960 Speaker 1: say that that I even need to pause and take 232 00:15:10,000 --> 00:15:12,880 Speaker 1: this second to say it over and over just shows 233 00:15:12,920 --> 00:15:18,760 Speaker 1: you how propagandized this time was. Because these lies still 234 00:15:18,840 --> 00:15:21,960 Speaker 1: exist even to this very day, where people will try 235 00:15:21,960 --> 00:15:24,240 Speaker 1: to think, well, they were our enemy. They were our enemy. 236 00:15:25,080 --> 00:15:27,080 Speaker 1: They didn't attack the United States. We beat them in 237 00:15:27,120 --> 00:15:31,280 Speaker 1: the Gulf War after we intervened on the side of Kuwait. Again, 238 00:15:31,280 --> 00:15:34,000 Speaker 1: they also did not attack the United States. They attacked Kuwait, 239 00:15:34,120 --> 00:15:38,680 Speaker 1: which again a separate country. And prior to that, we 240 00:15:38,680 --> 00:15:42,880 Speaker 1: were the ones who had propped up Saddam Hussain, working 241 00:15:42,920 --> 00:15:46,560 Speaker 1: with him in in the Reagan administration when Bush's vice president, 242 00:15:46,760 --> 00:15:49,880 Speaker 1: propping him up as a bulwark against Iran. And then 243 00:15:49,960 --> 00:15:53,720 Speaker 1: suddenly you just have this total shift in policy on 244 00:15:53,800 --> 00:15:56,720 Speaker 1: Saddam Hussein, where someone who thought he was an ally 245 00:15:56,920 --> 00:15:59,880 Speaker 1: of the US, someone who we had sold weapons to 246 00:16:00,000 --> 00:16:05,040 Speaker 1: so then turns around and becomes the enemy of all 247 00:16:05,120 --> 00:16:07,800 Speaker 1: that is good. We are told that he was gassing 248 00:16:07,840 --> 00:16:11,880 Speaker 1: his people, that they were killing babies and incubators in Kuwait, 249 00:16:11,960 --> 00:16:14,600 Speaker 1: and there's just all this war propaganda that gets spread, 250 00:16:14,880 --> 00:16:17,040 Speaker 1: and then even up to two thousand and three where 251 00:16:17,040 --> 00:16:18,560 Speaker 1: we're told, oh, he's a threat to the United States, 252 00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:20,320 Speaker 1: he's the threat to the United States. They went to 253 00:16:20,400 --> 00:16:22,320 Speaker 1: the United Nations and Joshua, if you could just take 254 00:16:22,320 --> 00:16:24,600 Speaker 1: two minutes, we have two minutes left in this talk 255 00:16:24,640 --> 00:16:28,240 Speaker 1: about the power of propaganda and persuasion that was used 256 00:16:28,240 --> 00:16:31,040 Speaker 1: to gin up support for this war. And I can remember, 257 00:16:31,080 --> 00:16:32,960 Speaker 1: you can remember for folks that were too young to 258 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:34,960 Speaker 1: know this, And it's true, there. 259 00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:36,280 Speaker 3: Was a lot of support for this war early on. 260 00:16:36,400 --> 00:16:40,560 Speaker 1: There was a lot, Yes, and they abused it. 261 00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:41,000 Speaker 3: Yes. 262 00:16:42,040 --> 00:16:45,200 Speaker 9: This is where the George Soros versus George Bush alignment 263 00:16:45,240 --> 00:16:49,640 Speaker 9: on Afghanistan begins to diverge on Iraq, because George Soros 264 00:16:49,720 --> 00:16:53,080 Speaker 9: did believe in turning Iraq as a closed society into 265 00:16:53,120 --> 00:16:54,680 Speaker 9: an open society. 266 00:16:54,960 --> 00:16:57,000 Speaker 3: Right where you have these neoliberal. 267 00:16:56,560 --> 00:16:59,280 Speaker 9: Values, you have feminism, you have secular government, you have 268 00:16:59,320 --> 00:17:03,080 Speaker 9: separation between church and state or Moscin state in this case. 269 00:17:03,560 --> 00:17:07,200 Speaker 9: And Soros seemed to resent the fact that George W. 270 00:17:07,280 --> 00:17:12,280 Speaker 9: Bush's let's say, coalition of regime change for Iraq was 271 00:17:12,359 --> 00:17:17,560 Speaker 9: using neo conservatism rather than neoliberalism, whereas there was almost 272 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:24,920 Speaker 9: like this Christian American patriotic flag waving propaganda that Soro 273 00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:29,000 Speaker 9: supposed to be used in Iraq. And what's interesting is 274 00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:34,240 Speaker 9: the commentary on the Clean Break report but later appeared 275 00:17:34,280 --> 00:17:36,240 Speaker 9: in the New York Times in two thousand and three 276 00:17:36,440 --> 00:17:39,199 Speaker 9: at around the time of the invasion, and it was 277 00:17:39,240 --> 00:17:43,800 Speaker 9: a description of the ideologues that were behind that report 278 00:17:44,359 --> 00:17:48,040 Speaker 9: for bb Net and Yahoo that the best way to 279 00:17:48,359 --> 00:17:52,480 Speaker 9: prevent conflict for Israel is to preemptively intervene in these 280 00:17:52,480 --> 00:17:56,080 Speaker 9: other countries. Those men behind that report, as you were saying, 281 00:17:56,200 --> 00:17:59,400 Speaker 9: show up inside of the Bush administration. And in this 282 00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:01,919 Speaker 9: commentary I'm reading from the New York Times two thousand 283 00:18:01,920 --> 00:18:09,360 Speaker 9: and three, a peculiar alliance of evangelical Christians, foreign policy hardliners, 284 00:18:09,920 --> 00:18:15,560 Speaker 9: lobbyists for the Israeli government, and neo conservatives. That's the 285 00:18:15,720 --> 00:18:20,520 Speaker 9: super nationalist alliance where we began to see for the 286 00:18:20,560 --> 00:18:23,560 Speaker 9: first time, and I remember this in two thousand and three, 287 00:18:24,240 --> 00:18:27,960 Speaker 9: we saw evangelical Christians across America put in their front 288 00:18:28,040 --> 00:18:32,720 Speaker 9: yard what the Israeli flag flying, the Israeli flag and 289 00:18:32,840 --> 00:18:37,280 Speaker 9: the American flag. So there becomes this moral, ethical, dear 290 00:18:37,320 --> 00:18:40,320 Speaker 9: we say, even religious connotation to the war. 291 00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:42,480 Speaker 1: This is very interesting, This is very deep. 292 00:18:42,560 --> 00:18:43,720 Speaker 3: But people need to understand. 293 00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:46,400 Speaker 1: This is where the Iraq warking you right back. 294 00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:50,240 Speaker 3: Soviet gentalized, good. 295 00:19:00,400 --> 00:19:05,359 Speaker 4: Fellow citizens. At this hour, American and coalition forces are 296 00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:09,040 Speaker 4: in the early stages of military operations to disarm Iraq, 297 00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:12,360 Speaker 4: to free its people, and to defend the world from 298 00:19:12,400 --> 00:19:13,080 Speaker 4: grave danger. 299 00:19:13,400 --> 00:19:16,560 Speaker 1: All right, Jack reclick, we are back live, Joshua Leisac. 300 00:19:16,800 --> 00:19:20,560 Speaker 1: You were talking about, and we're hearing this episode of 301 00:19:20,600 --> 00:19:24,880 Speaker 1: Tales of Regime Change Iraq, the war that rewired the world. 302 00:19:24,920 --> 00:19:28,160 Speaker 1: You were talking and really from personal experience about why 303 00:19:28,240 --> 00:19:32,800 Speaker 1: there were certain populations of the United States who fervently 304 00:19:34,119 --> 00:19:37,280 Speaker 1: agreed with regime change in Iraq, the war in Iraq. 305 00:19:37,400 --> 00:19:42,280 Speaker 1: The same people who fervently believe, many of whom are Christian, 306 00:19:42,840 --> 00:19:47,359 Speaker 1: fervently believe in regime change in Iran today. They backed 307 00:19:47,400 --> 00:19:51,800 Speaker 1: these wars to the hilt. And it's really a question, right, 308 00:19:51,960 --> 00:19:58,000 Speaker 1: why was the Bush administration, the second Bush administration, particularly 309 00:19:58,080 --> 00:20:03,640 Speaker 1: run by George W. Bush, so fervently in a belief 310 00:20:03,680 --> 00:20:06,280 Speaker 1: and you mentioned there was a religious aspect to this, 311 00:20:07,320 --> 00:20:10,320 Speaker 1: that we should have a war in Iraq. A lot 312 00:20:10,320 --> 00:20:12,040 Speaker 1: of people will say that, oh, it was just blood 313 00:20:12,040 --> 00:20:15,320 Speaker 1: for oil and that was Cheney and Halliburton, and other 314 00:20:15,320 --> 00:20:19,639 Speaker 1: people would say, oh, it's because they went after George HW. 315 00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:21,800 Speaker 1: Bush whenever saidominant after his father, So we wanted to 316 00:20:21,800 --> 00:20:24,920 Speaker 1: get rid of him. But perhaps you have another opinion, 317 00:20:25,520 --> 00:20:26,480 Speaker 1: or at least another angle. 318 00:20:28,400 --> 00:20:31,560 Speaker 9: Yes, we said moments ago, how this coalition of support 319 00:20:31,760 --> 00:20:35,159 Speaker 9: had a cast of characters that included a number of 320 00:20:35,320 --> 00:20:38,720 Speaker 9: high profile, prominent and powerful evangelical Christians, including those who 321 00:20:38,760 --> 00:20:42,840 Speaker 9: worked within the Bush administration and set and advocated for 322 00:20:42,880 --> 00:20:47,320 Speaker 9: the specific interventionist policy, this preemptive interventionist policy which goes 323 00:20:47,359 --> 00:20:49,679 Speaker 9: back to nineteen ninety six and the Clean Break Report, 324 00:20:49,960 --> 00:20:52,639 Speaker 9: which says that again, in order to have peace in 325 00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:55,879 Speaker 9: the Middle East, we need to advocate for a regime 326 00:20:56,000 --> 00:20:59,320 Speaker 9: change in these countries that are opposed to Israel. And 327 00:20:59,320 --> 00:21:02,520 Speaker 9: there was an express three down, two to go with 328 00:21:02,640 --> 00:21:07,840 Speaker 9: reference to Syria and to Iran right following the Lebanon 329 00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:11,480 Speaker 9: War in two thousand and six that said, remember act 330 00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:14,919 Speaker 9: one of regime change, as we saw in Afghanistan, and 331 00:21:14,960 --> 00:21:18,000 Speaker 9: we'll see in Syria Act one of same change. The 332 00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:24,000 Speaker 9: first stage is this demonization and preparation and ideological propaganda, 333 00:21:24,280 --> 00:21:28,080 Speaker 9: persuasion preparation where you build the case for going in 334 00:21:28,080 --> 00:21:30,880 Speaker 9: there and getting him out of there. And of course 335 00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:33,000 Speaker 9: there are a number of lies about chemical weapons and 336 00:21:33,040 --> 00:21:37,600 Speaker 9: weapons of mass destruction nuclear weapon, this enriched uranium from 337 00:21:37,640 --> 00:21:42,040 Speaker 9: Africa hypothesis that was of course debunked prior to the 338 00:21:42,080 --> 00:21:46,280 Speaker 9: invasion of Iraq. We should add, but I happen to 339 00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:50,000 Speaker 9: recall at this time that my network, limited as it 340 00:21:50,200 --> 00:21:54,240 Speaker 9: was as a youngster, it was representative of the national 341 00:21:54,640 --> 00:21:59,000 Speaker 9: evangelical support for the Bush administration in Fiji of Iraq, which, 342 00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:01,960 Speaker 9: by the way, is what George Soros opposed, was the 343 00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:06,840 Speaker 9: religiosity mixed with American patriotism where we need to use 344 00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:09,920 Speaker 9: the full force of the United States military to engage 345 00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:13,840 Speaker 9: in this righteous Christian war with how it was positioned, 346 00:22:13,880 --> 00:22:20,560 Speaker 9: which supposed he preferred the secular, neoliberal freedom, democracy, feminism, 347 00:22:20,640 --> 00:22:23,920 Speaker 9: women's rights, etc. Version of regime change, but it ultimately 348 00:22:23,960 --> 00:22:26,560 Speaker 9: leads to the same thing, the toppling of Saddam, which 349 00:22:26,560 --> 00:22:30,919 Speaker 9: Soro's advocated for. But in the Bush movie an Evangelical World, 350 00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:36,320 Speaker 9: you had prominent Christian preachers, past or televangelists like John Hagy, 351 00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:40,960 Speaker 9: like hal Lindsay who were saying Iraq today is literally 352 00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:44,320 Speaker 9: inviable prophecy. You know where it talks about Babylon and 353 00:22:44,400 --> 00:22:48,120 Speaker 9: the Old Testament, that's literally Iraq today. 354 00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:49,760 Speaker 3: So where it says. 355 00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:51,960 Speaker 9: That there's going to be this end times conflict, this 356 00:22:52,160 --> 00:22:55,000 Speaker 9: end of the world armageddon. We are right on the 357 00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:58,720 Speaker 9: eve of armageddon. Let's go when that happens the Rapture, 358 00:22:58,880 --> 00:23:01,560 Speaker 9: which is an evangelical Christian doctrine that's about one hundred 359 00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:05,840 Speaker 9: and fifty or so years old. When that happens, Jesus 360 00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:08,159 Speaker 9: Christ is going to return to Earth, and there's going 361 00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:11,080 Speaker 9: to be this Third Temple built, and there's this tribulation 362 00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:15,560 Speaker 9: in this whole world is sort of a religious theocratic 363 00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:19,960 Speaker 9: sci fi situation from the Left Behind novels, which also 364 00:23:20,359 --> 00:23:23,720 Speaker 9: were very popular at that time, and the film and 365 00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:26,800 Speaker 9: the number of films inspired by that also came out 366 00:23:27,080 --> 00:23:29,639 Speaker 9: right around this time, Like there was one called I 367 00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:32,160 Speaker 9: think it was called the Omega Code, and of course 368 00:23:32,160 --> 00:23:35,679 Speaker 9: there's Left Behind with Kirk Cameron, and I remember at 369 00:23:35,720 --> 00:23:38,800 Speaker 9: the megachurch I tended with my family, the preacher on 370 00:23:38,840 --> 00:23:43,040 Speaker 9: the eve of Invasion gave a sermon entitled what would 371 00:23:43,119 --> 00:23:48,040 Speaker 9: Jesus Say to Saddam Hussein? But the idea was that 372 00:23:48,440 --> 00:23:51,280 Speaker 9: for the first time Christians. 373 00:23:51,600 --> 00:23:53,440 Speaker 1: I gotta say, I'm just wait, can I pap in? 374 00:23:53,720 --> 00:23:55,040 Speaker 3: Because guess like. 375 00:23:54,960 --> 00:23:57,399 Speaker 1: This is me in Catholic world right, we did have 376 00:23:57,520 --> 00:23:59,520 Speaker 1: any of that, we have any And in fact, the 377 00:23:59,560 --> 00:24:01,960 Speaker 1: Pope was against the war. John Paul the second was 378 00:24:01,960 --> 00:24:04,439 Speaker 1: still Pope, and I remember him speaking out against this 379 00:24:04,520 --> 00:24:05,280 Speaker 1: and he said, do. 380 00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:05,879 Speaker 7: Not do this. 381 00:24:06,960 --> 00:24:09,480 Speaker 1: I remember Vladimir Putin coming out and saying, do not 382 00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:11,840 Speaker 1: do this. I don't know, you do not know what 383 00:24:11,880 --> 00:24:14,840 Speaker 1: you will unleash. And so you're saying that in this 384 00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:16,960 Speaker 1: world on your side of the house, where you know 385 00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:19,199 Speaker 1: where you were at the time, that there was this 386 00:24:19,359 --> 00:24:20,840 Speaker 1: fervent support for it. 387 00:24:21,040 --> 00:24:21,679 Speaker 3: Yes, that's right. 388 00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:25,359 Speaker 9: The evangelical Christian says, a voting block has been historically 389 00:24:25,720 --> 00:24:29,880 Speaker 9: one of the most powerful special interest groups. I think 390 00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:32,520 Speaker 9: you could refer it with any electorate, you know, kind 391 00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:36,399 Speaker 9: of a religious community. And that's why, of course Donald J. 392 00:24:36,520 --> 00:24:39,639 Speaker 9: Trump has done his best to persuade that community to 393 00:24:39,680 --> 00:24:42,000 Speaker 9: support him from the very beginning, and now he has 394 00:24:42,040 --> 00:24:47,040 Speaker 9: the faith counsel and PAULA White, who's evangelical Christian megachurch televangelist. 395 00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:52,000 Speaker 9: And at that time it was believed widely and many 396 00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:54,399 Speaker 9: of your viewers will back me up on this, and 397 00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:57,399 Speaker 9: we'll see their comments and the replies that the sense 398 00:24:57,600 --> 00:25:00,679 Speaker 9: was we can make the rap sure happened. 399 00:25:01,119 --> 00:25:04,720 Speaker 3: We can make Jesus come back. That was the subtext 400 00:25:04,840 --> 00:25:05,159 Speaker 3: of this. 401 00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:09,639 Speaker 9: It's called eschatology, where there's this idea that the United 402 00:25:09,680 --> 00:25:13,640 Speaker 9: States can sort of engage in this armageddon like crusade 403 00:25:14,200 --> 00:25:17,480 Speaker 9: and Russia is going to get involved on behalf of Iraq. 404 00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:20,480 Speaker 9: That's what the Bible prophecy of the cities of Gog 405 00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:22,159 Speaker 9: and Maygog are about. 406 00:25:22,359 --> 00:25:22,919 Speaker 3: And this is what. 407 00:25:24,600 --> 00:25:27,879 Speaker 9: Demogogues have done over the years. Within Evangelical Christianity. You 408 00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:30,879 Speaker 9: come in to do a little drifting is they'll say, look, 409 00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:35,320 Speaker 9: the time we are living in is literally here in 410 00:25:35,359 --> 00:25:38,840 Speaker 9: the Bible. Here's what happens next. Hellndsay, of course, claimed 411 00:25:38,840 --> 00:25:40,480 Speaker 9: that the rapture was going to happen prior to the 412 00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:44,439 Speaker 9: year nineteen eighty nine did not happen. I remember y 413 00:25:44,520 --> 00:25:48,280 Speaker 9: two k was seen as the time at which the 414 00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:49,480 Speaker 9: rapture was going to occur. 415 00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:52,680 Speaker 3: We were all ready for that. We reproduced to come back. 416 00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:55,320 Speaker 9: Everyone was getting their wills written up so that all 417 00:25:55,359 --> 00:25:58,040 Speaker 9: of their possessions would be given to their non Christian 418 00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:02,119 Speaker 9: family members. This was entire movement in a mood. And 419 00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:06,840 Speaker 9: because Evangelical Christianity was adhered to this rapture version of 420 00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:10,320 Speaker 9: it at all levels of society, including in the government. 421 00:26:11,080 --> 00:26:15,439 Speaker 9: There is this sort of alignment of pro regime change 422 00:26:15,480 --> 00:26:20,040 Speaker 9: individuals again, Evangelical Christians, those who are lobbyists for the 423 00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:24,800 Speaker 9: Israeli government who are aligned with clean break. And of 424 00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:28,040 Speaker 9: course you had the neoliberal and neo concern. 425 00:26:27,840 --> 00:26:33,719 Speaker 1: That I just resim changsts and and it's it's something 426 00:26:33,760 --> 00:26:38,639 Speaker 1: that I will never quite personally understand because Catholics we 427 00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:39,720 Speaker 1: don't have that theology. 428 00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:41,960 Speaker 3: But this belief that. 429 00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:48,400 Speaker 1: Invading Iraq would somehow hasten the return of Jesus Christ 430 00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:53,359 Speaker 1: to the world is something that quite right, I just 431 00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:55,680 Speaker 1: don't think it should be running or foreign policy. 432 00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:56,400 Speaker 3: Right back to. 433 00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:04,719 Speaker 7: Another grim milestone has been reached in Iraq. Five years 434 00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:08,199 Speaker 7: after the war began. The American death toll has reached 435 00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:12,000 Speaker 7: at least four thousand the military. So the latest deaths 436 00:27:12,040 --> 00:27:16,720 Speaker 7: occur at Sunday, a roadside bomb killed four US soldiers 437 00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:20,320 Speaker 7: in southern Baghdad and rockets and mortars pounded the heavily 438 00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:21,800 Speaker 7: four to five Green zone. 439 00:27:21,880 --> 00:27:24,960 Speaker 1: All Right, Jack Sebeker back with Joshua Lysac and Joshua 440 00:27:25,119 --> 00:27:27,280 Speaker 1: one of the things that I wanted to get into 441 00:27:27,359 --> 00:27:31,840 Speaker 1: in this is that we don't see the return of 442 00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:34,719 Speaker 1: Jesus coming from these wars in the Middle East. But 443 00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:38,040 Speaker 1: what do we actually see that's happening. We lose tons 444 00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:43,320 Speaker 1: of money, we lose tons of Americans, and ultimately, very 445 00:27:43,359 --> 00:27:46,359 Speaker 1: strange things seems to happen, at least strange from perhaps 446 00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:52,919 Speaker 1: our perspective. Christian communities throughout these regions, whether it be Iraq, 447 00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:56,600 Speaker 1: whether it be Afghanistan, whether it be Syria or anywhere else, 448 00:27:57,480 --> 00:28:01,200 Speaker 1: they get decimated, they get wiped out. And we sit 449 00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:03,639 Speaker 1: there and we say, oh gosh, what about the Christians 450 00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:06,880 Speaker 1: who are being persecuted? Oh gosh, And we never turn 451 00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:09,000 Speaker 1: around and point the finger at ourselves and say, wait 452 00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:12,919 Speaker 1: a minute, what if the forces that are conducting the 453 00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:17,000 Speaker 1: persecution of Christians in these regions are the same forces 454 00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:21,439 Speaker 1: that we've unleashed or that we've enabled to be able 455 00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:26,760 Speaker 1: to do so because of our own insane actions. Because 456 00:28:26,760 --> 00:28:29,680 Speaker 1: that's what I think has been going on in the 457 00:28:29,720 --> 00:28:32,400 Speaker 1: Middle East since two thousand and one, et cetera. When 458 00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:34,800 Speaker 1: it comes to these Christian communities, and I sit there 459 00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:36,400 Speaker 1: and I talk about it, and I go on on 460 00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:38,640 Speaker 1: this show, and I go on others, and nobody wants 461 00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:40,760 Speaker 1: to talk about it. Nobody wants to talk about how 462 00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:44,760 Speaker 1: these wars always seem to lead to more dead Christians. 463 00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:50,240 Speaker 9: Yes, what I would like to say to the evangelical 464 00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:56,400 Speaker 9: Christian community is that the Israel of the Bible is 465 00:28:56,440 --> 00:28:59,840 Speaker 9: not the modern state of Israel. Secular liberal organization found 466 00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:04,200 Speaker 9: in the year nineteen forty eight. Different people, different places, 467 00:29:04,280 --> 00:29:08,960 Speaker 9: different times, different world, and what is in Israel's economic 468 00:29:09,080 --> 00:29:12,360 Speaker 9: interest or their foreign policy interest is not necessarily in 469 00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:17,840 Speaker 9: the best interest of Christians in Iraq and in Syria. 470 00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:21,120 Speaker 9: Let us recall the three stages of a regime change. 471 00:29:21,160 --> 00:29:21,280 Speaker 8: Right. 472 00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:24,160 Speaker 9: Stage one is this is this demonization, this hard core 473 00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:29,560 Speaker 9: persuasion campaign to build this coalition of moral support against 474 00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:30,240 Speaker 9: your target. 475 00:29:30,520 --> 00:29:31,360 Speaker 3: That's Act one. 476 00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:35,920 Speaker 9: Acts two or stage two is the unleashing of your 477 00:29:36,280 --> 00:29:39,360 Speaker 9: intervention operation where you overthrow, you. 478 00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:42,440 Speaker 3: Execute, right, you get rid of the guys. We've got 479 00:29:42,440 --> 00:29:43,760 Speaker 3: to go in there and take him out. 480 00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:44,280 Speaker 8: Right. 481 00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:48,719 Speaker 9: That was what was believed by myriad households, both Republican 482 00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:52,440 Speaker 9: and Democrat in two thousand and three regarding Sadam Hussein. 483 00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:55,880 Speaker 9: There was bipartisan support. Usually bipartisan is code for oh, 484 00:29:55,920 --> 00:29:59,160 Speaker 9: this is bad. That was bipartisan support for Obamacare, right 485 00:29:59,200 --> 00:30:02,280 Speaker 9: A few years later. But it's an Act three that 486 00:30:02,360 --> 00:30:07,840 Speaker 9: regime changes are completely and totally botched. I was reading 487 00:30:07,880 --> 00:30:10,080 Speaker 9: our report by George Soros, in which two thousand and 488 00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:12,960 Speaker 9: three he suggested that it would take the United Nations 489 00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:19,200 Speaker 9: one or two years to stabilize Iraq after the fall 490 00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:22,320 Speaker 9: of Saddam Mussein. So this is not a neo conservative 491 00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:26,360 Speaker 9: evangelical issue. This is we can go into these countries 492 00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:29,520 Speaker 9: who do not share our culture, our stories, our values, 493 00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:32,680 Speaker 9: and we can make them like us in one or 494 00:30:32,760 --> 00:30:35,960 Speaker 9: two years. We just have to give them hospitals, We 495 00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:39,400 Speaker 9: have to give them roads and some schools. Act three 496 00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:41,640 Speaker 9: is the aftermath and the idea where you can simply 497 00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:46,000 Speaker 9: consolidate power and install your person and everything will be stable. 498 00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:48,800 Speaker 3: Well, what happened. We saw the rise. 499 00:30:48,520 --> 00:30:53,080 Speaker 9: Of the at first off all the insurgency that resulted 500 00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:57,000 Speaker 9: following the mission accomplished banner right of George W. 501 00:30:57,120 --> 00:30:57,400 Speaker 3: Bush. 502 00:30:57,400 --> 00:31:00,040 Speaker 9: There we had the insurgency, we had the viol and 503 00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:04,560 Speaker 9: for power. There were odd scenarios where the Iraqi soldiers 504 00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:08,640 Speaker 9: trained by Americans were siding with their own people against 505 00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:13,200 Speaker 9: the Americans. There was friendly fire, there was leaking of 506 00:31:13,320 --> 00:31:17,680 Speaker 9: class fit information, battle plans to the insurgents. There was 507 00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:21,280 Speaker 9: a course, isis right in both Syria and Iraq, And 508 00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:25,760 Speaker 9: what do those radicals do in Mass They rounded up 509 00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:29,240 Speaker 9: and they executed Christians wherever they go. And there was 510 00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:34,400 Speaker 9: a direct consequence in the line of dominoes from this 511 00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:37,400 Speaker 9: idea that we need to go into the Middle East 512 00:31:37,440 --> 00:31:42,200 Speaker 9: for religious reasons, to religious brothers and sisters of that 513 00:31:42,320 --> 00:31:48,400 Speaker 9: religion being murdered in Mass, men, women, children, tens of thousands, 514 00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:51,880 Speaker 9: hundreds of thousands. So if you're a Christian, war in 515 00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:54,160 Speaker 9: the Middle East is the very last thing that you 516 00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:56,280 Speaker 9: should want to happen to the Church. 517 00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:01,840 Speaker 1: And this this is key, folks, because what do we 518 00:32:01,880 --> 00:32:06,560 Speaker 1: see the sectarian violence we saw Iran, by the way, 519 00:32:06,840 --> 00:32:10,440 Speaker 1: became emboldened. Right, So you know, even if you're someone 520 00:32:10,520 --> 00:32:14,200 Speaker 1: if you're someone who's worried about Iran and worried about 521 00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:20,360 Speaker 1: stabilization of the region, well remember we talked about earlier 522 00:32:20,360 --> 00:32:24,360 Speaker 1: in the episode that Saddam was the US bulwark against 523 00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:29,120 Speaker 1: Iran originally, and so guess what, in fact, all those 524 00:32:29,200 --> 00:32:32,960 Speaker 1: years he had still been operating as that bulwark against Iran. 525 00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:36,160 Speaker 1: It turns out that actually that policy was quite useful. 526 00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:38,600 Speaker 1: That you prop up one of these guys and know 527 00:32:38,760 --> 00:32:41,920 Speaker 1: they are not a Jeffersonian democrat, but guess what, they're 528 00:32:41,920 --> 00:32:44,360 Speaker 1: a strong man, or you know, as I like to 529 00:32:44,400 --> 00:32:47,160 Speaker 1: call it, a zoo keeper. You know, because when an 530 00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:49,600 Speaker 1: area is a zoo, you need a zoo keeper. And 531 00:32:49,640 --> 00:32:52,920 Speaker 1: when the zookeeper gets removed, guess what happens. All the 532 00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:56,080 Speaker 1: animals get loose. And that's exactly what we will see 533 00:32:56,360 --> 00:32:59,640 Speaker 1: happens across the Middle East in every single one of 534 00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:04,000 Speaker 1: these instances, whether it be whether it be Afghanistan, whether 535 00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:07,200 Speaker 1: it be Iraq, whether it be Libya, whether it be Syria. 536 00:33:06,840 --> 00:33:07,800 Speaker 3: Et cetera. 537 00:33:08,200 --> 00:33:11,800 Speaker 1: It continues and it always plays out the same way. 538 00:33:11,920 --> 00:33:13,080 Speaker 3: This is what they do. 539 00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:16,760 Speaker 1: And so no, you can't just impose your beliefs on 540 00:33:16,800 --> 00:33:21,120 Speaker 1: these areas. They don't operate based on your schedule. And 541 00:33:22,840 --> 00:33:25,880 Speaker 1: Vladimir Putin, the President of Russia of all people, when 542 00:33:25,920 --> 00:33:29,840 Speaker 1: he came out against this war Iraq war, originally he said, 543 00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:35,080 Speaker 1: what you unleash will be one hundred times worse than 544 00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:38,840 Speaker 1: what is already there. And what was unleashed ultimately al 545 00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:44,520 Speaker 1: Qaeda in Iraq, which later became Isis, which later became 546 00:33:44,560 --> 00:33:47,040 Speaker 1: the Islamic State. And when Joshua when you and I 547 00:33:47,120 --> 00:33:50,640 Speaker 1: talked about Afghanistan. We talked about how the US backed 548 00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:54,280 Speaker 1: the Mujahadeen, and that the Mujahadeen led to the rise 549 00:33:54,560 --> 00:33:57,920 Speaker 1: of the Taliban and al Qaeda, al Qaeda which then 550 00:33:58,000 --> 00:34:03,440 Speaker 1: later attacked the United And so again we have these situations, right, 551 00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:09,719 Speaker 1: We have these situations where we need to understand that 552 00:34:10,080 --> 00:34:15,000 Speaker 1: the law of unintended consequences will always win. You don't 553 00:34:15,040 --> 00:34:17,560 Speaker 1: just get what you want out of life. That's not 554 00:34:17,760 --> 00:34:21,120 Speaker 1: the way that it works. You need to be very careful. 555 00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:23,560 Speaker 1: And for any of those people who think that I'm 556 00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:24,680 Speaker 1: just going to say it, right, I was just gonna 557 00:34:24,680 --> 00:34:26,920 Speaker 1: say it, I'm talking about the people who are calling 558 00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:29,360 Speaker 1: for more war in Iran. I am talking about the 559 00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:31,480 Speaker 1: people who are calling for regime change in Iran. 560 00:34:31,560 --> 00:34:32,239 Speaker 3: Say all of those. 561 00:34:32,200 --> 00:34:34,520 Speaker 1: Mullahs, they're so bad, and we've got to get rid 562 00:34:34,560 --> 00:34:36,600 Speaker 1: of them, and just look at the bad things they do. 563 00:34:36,719 --> 00:34:38,719 Speaker 1: We don't like them, and they don't believe the same 564 00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:42,120 Speaker 1: things we do. Okay, got it right, got it understood totally. 565 00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:47,600 Speaker 1: But what happens next? And that is the question that 566 00:34:47,640 --> 00:34:50,480 Speaker 1: they never seem to answer, is it Joshua. 567 00:34:51,800 --> 00:34:55,279 Speaker 9: No, And there's this id idea that is it is 568 00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:59,840 Speaker 9: both a secular utopian and also religious utopian. And this 569 00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:01,920 Speaker 9: case it's the it's the Kingdom of Heaven coming to 570 00:35:01,960 --> 00:35:04,640 Speaker 9: earth right, It's it's it's the sort of the the 571 00:35:04,680 --> 00:35:08,719 Speaker 9: George Soros evangelical alternative right where the Kingdom of God 572 00:35:08,840 --> 00:35:11,280 Speaker 9: is is on Earth. Need to take the secular version 573 00:35:11,360 --> 00:35:14,600 Speaker 9: of that. Both of those advocating for for regime change. 574 00:35:14,800 --> 00:35:16,400 Speaker 9: And if I'm going to give a quick tip to 575 00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:22,080 Speaker 9: evangelicals Christians who do believe in an interventionist foreign policy 576 00:35:22,560 --> 00:35:26,840 Speaker 9: who I was speaking at a Republican recently and I 577 00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:31,440 Speaker 9: fielded a question in which someone was claiming that, you know, 578 00:35:31,600 --> 00:35:36,760 Speaker 9: jd Vance, our vice president, is signaling isolationist foreign policy. 579 00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:41,239 Speaker 9: And I was thinking to myself, what and how we 580 00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:43,759 Speaker 9: need to oppose that in a strong America. Is an 581 00:35:43,760 --> 00:35:47,520 Speaker 9: America that's involved. It's a sort of Team America police 582 00:35:48,560 --> 00:35:51,719 Speaker 9: Shenanigan situation. With the quick tip I would give you, 583 00:35:52,160 --> 00:35:57,160 Speaker 9: go to Instagram, follow the account Eastern Christians. These are 584 00:35:57,160 --> 00:36:01,040 Speaker 9: the Lebanese Christians, the Syrian Christians, the Racky Christians, the 585 00:36:01,120 --> 00:36:05,200 Speaker 9: Jordanian Christians, the Palestinian Christians who are caught in the 586 00:36:05,320 --> 00:36:11,279 Speaker 9: crossfire between and among American Israeli and the insurgencies and 587 00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:14,400 Speaker 9: the militias and the armies that they're battling. And you 588 00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:18,279 Speaker 9: don't need to see but one or two videos of 589 00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:25,520 Speaker 9: churches wiped out by Western munitions before you think to yourself, 590 00:36:26,920 --> 00:36:29,840 Speaker 9: maybe we shouldn't be the World Police. Maybe we shouldn't 591 00:36:29,840 --> 00:36:35,080 Speaker 9: be following Operation Clean Break here. Maybe my allies are 592 00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:38,040 Speaker 9: my brothers and sisters in christ It may not be 593 00:36:38,120 --> 00:36:42,280 Speaker 9: the secular government of Israel here, and that's a difficult 594 00:36:42,360 --> 00:36:44,640 Speaker 9: situation to be in. But I believe that if you 595 00:36:44,719 --> 00:36:47,799 Speaker 9: spend some time on the Eastern Christian accounts on Instagram, 596 00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:51,560 Speaker 9: you will see the people who are being threatened by 597 00:36:51,680 --> 00:36:57,640 Speaker 9: Western interventionist American interventionist and Israeli interventionist foreign policy. These 598 00:36:57,680 --> 00:37:00,440 Speaker 9: are the people who are at risk of death, Eastern 599 00:37:00,520 --> 00:37:01,480 Speaker 9: Christians on Instagram. 600 00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:04,680 Speaker 1: You know, it's funny because I was actually on I 601 00:37:04,719 --> 00:37:06,440 Speaker 1: was on Twitter. I believe they have a couple of 602 00:37:06,480 --> 00:37:09,000 Speaker 1: Twitter accounts that are that are involved in this as 603 00:37:09,040 --> 00:37:11,480 Speaker 1: well that I was tracking and you could see it. 604 00:37:11,520 --> 00:37:13,840 Speaker 1: And by the way, we're not just seeing that Christian 605 00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:16,120 Speaker 1: persecution in the Middle East, boys and girls, oh no, 606 00:37:16,440 --> 00:37:17,560 Speaker 1: we see it across Europe. 607 00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:20,880 Speaker 3: At the hands of who Muslim migrants. 608 00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:26,680 Speaker 1: Which are also unleashed by these wars, coming soon to 609 00:37:26,719 --> 00:37:32,799 Speaker 1: a European capital. Hear you, right back, Jack Soviet. 610 00:37:35,600 --> 00:37:36,160 Speaker 7: Good. 611 00:37:38,760 --> 00:37:58,399 Speaker 6: On, good on you love. 612 00:38:00,520 --> 00:38:03,120 Speaker 8: Moments ago, the ceremony to mark the end of the 613 00:38:03,120 --> 00:38:06,400 Speaker 8: Iraq War wrapped up. All US troops are to be 614 00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:10,440 Speaker 8: out of Iraq by December thirty first, though President Barack 615 00:38:10,440 --> 00:38:14,400 Speaker 8: Obama has pledged the US will continue civilian assistance for 616 00:38:14,520 --> 00:38:18,040 Speaker 8: Iraq as it faces an uncertain future. 617 00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:21,440 Speaker 1: All right, Jack Posobic, we are back here. Human events, 618 00:38:21,520 --> 00:38:26,800 Speaker 1: daily tales of regime change. Iraq the war that rewired 619 00:38:26,840 --> 00:38:30,760 Speaker 1: the world. And to be clear, this is the reason 620 00:38:31,239 --> 00:38:33,400 Speaker 1: that the world is the way it is. America poured 621 00:38:33,440 --> 00:38:40,799 Speaker 1: trillions into Iraq. America shattered their own myth of liberal pagemony. 622 00:38:41,160 --> 00:38:45,040 Speaker 1: And in fact, ironically, it was the Iraq War and 623 00:38:45,080 --> 00:38:49,960 Speaker 1: the broader war on terror that destroyed America's physician its 624 00:38:49,960 --> 00:38:54,239 Speaker 1: pole position as the only superpower in the world. This 625 00:38:54,280 --> 00:38:59,360 Speaker 1: is what caused America to overstretch. It caused the American Empire, 626 00:38:59,440 --> 00:39:02,640 Speaker 1: as it were, to be poured out into the sands 627 00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:06,680 Speaker 1: of places thousands of miles away from America's shores, and 628 00:39:07,520 --> 00:39:10,920 Speaker 1: it is what ended this system, which it existed since 629 00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:14,520 Speaker 1: since the end of World War two, really since nineteen 630 00:39:14,600 --> 00:39:20,080 Speaker 1: forty five, this system of one sort of order in 631 00:39:20,120 --> 00:39:20,879 Speaker 1: the world and has. 632 00:39:20,840 --> 00:39:22,480 Speaker 3: Now led to multipolarity. 633 00:39:23,600 --> 00:39:25,960 Speaker 1: It was Iraq. It all goes back to that end. 634 00:39:26,800 --> 00:39:29,480 Speaker 1: It also has to be said, because we haven't and 635 00:39:30,160 --> 00:39:33,200 Speaker 1: particularly more so Assyria. But Iraq is what began the 636 00:39:33,239 --> 00:39:37,279 Speaker 1: migrant crisis. That's when we started originally to see these 637 00:39:37,360 --> 00:39:43,640 Speaker 1: migrants flooding out from Middle East and into our lands, 638 00:39:43,680 --> 00:39:50,080 Speaker 1: into European lands, into Christendom. We're now the attacks on Christians, 639 00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:54,840 Speaker 1: the rapes of our daughters, the burning of our churches 640 00:39:55,760 --> 00:39:59,520 Speaker 1: is all done in this clash of civilizations which continues 641 00:39:59,840 --> 00:40:04,040 Speaker 1: to this day. And so for me, my sense of this, 642 00:40:04,200 --> 00:40:06,120 Speaker 1: my conclusion on this is when you look at the 643 00:40:06,120 --> 00:40:11,080 Speaker 1: Iraq War, it's not enough to just say we're not 644 00:40:11,120 --> 00:40:12,840 Speaker 1: going to do it again. It's not enough, because we 645 00:40:12,880 --> 00:40:17,759 Speaker 1: said that about Vietnam. You have to understand the motivations 646 00:40:18,280 --> 00:40:23,440 Speaker 1: that drove it and extended it. To understand and unpack 647 00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:29,680 Speaker 1: that which you will face in another scenario, perhaps involving 648 00:40:29,840 --> 00:40:34,400 Speaker 1: Iran or any number of these countries you can insert 649 00:40:34,400 --> 00:40:39,880 Speaker 1: whichever one you want. Venezuela etc. These do not work, 650 00:40:40,360 --> 00:40:44,600 Speaker 1: and delies that you are told early on about how 651 00:40:44,680 --> 00:40:47,719 Speaker 1: great things will be once we topple the dictator or 652 00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:51,640 Speaker 1: topple the mola are always just that they are lies, 653 00:40:52,120 --> 00:40:56,160 Speaker 1: they are wrong, and the people saying them seldom actually 654 00:40:56,239 --> 00:40:58,400 Speaker 1: have that as their true motivation. 655 00:40:58,680 --> 00:40:59,560 Speaker 3: Joshua Isaac. 656 00:41:01,840 --> 00:41:04,680 Speaker 9: Yes, And as long as we can take away the 657 00:41:04,719 --> 00:41:09,640 Speaker 9: religious undertones and overtones of regime change, we can see 658 00:41:09,680 --> 00:41:18,400 Speaker 9: these for what they really are. They are supranationalist, interventionist Shenanians, frankly, 659 00:41:18,640 --> 00:41:21,479 Speaker 9: that never go the way that they're promised. We've talked 660 00:41:21,520 --> 00:41:24,840 Speaker 9: before about the three acts of regime change, and that 661 00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:30,440 Speaker 9: third one the aftermath and consolidation, where you install your 662 00:41:30,520 --> 00:41:33,200 Speaker 9: friendly regime a new one, and you build up this 663 00:41:33,200 --> 00:41:38,399 Speaker 9: wonderful infrastructure and you stabilize the situation. Both the neoliberal 664 00:41:38,480 --> 00:41:44,040 Speaker 9: supernationalists like George Soros and the neo conservative supernationalists like 665 00:41:44,160 --> 00:41:48,279 Speaker 9: those who ran policy for the Bush administration, Both of 666 00:41:48,320 --> 00:41:52,880 Speaker 9: those expectations fall flat. This mission accomplished two thousand and 667 00:41:52,920 --> 00:41:56,920 Speaker 9: three is as absurd as soros idea that the United 668 00:41:57,000 --> 00:42:01,279 Speaker 9: Nations can stabilize and create a prospers free, democratic and 669 00:42:01,400 --> 00:42:04,799 Speaker 9: dare I say, feminist society in an Islamic country ninety 670 00:42:04,880 --> 00:42:08,720 Speaker 9: nine point ninety nine percent in one or two years. 671 00:42:08,920 --> 00:42:11,759 Speaker 9: They're just not based on reality. And so in the 672 00:42:11,800 --> 00:42:15,120 Speaker 9: future as we look at any other regime change, we 673 00:42:15,160 --> 00:42:18,600 Speaker 9: need to be careful. As George Washington, our first president, 674 00:42:18,640 --> 00:42:23,399 Speaker 9: in his farewell address, advised us to beware certain foreign entanglements. 675 00:42:23,719 --> 00:42:26,880 Speaker 9: Something that is in the best interest of let's say, 676 00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:30,440 Speaker 9: even a friendly ally like Israel, may not be in 677 00:42:30,480 --> 00:42:33,040 Speaker 9: the best interests of the United States or of those 678 00:42:33,080 --> 00:42:36,800 Speaker 9: who are Christian brothers and sisters in these countries, Iran, 679 00:42:37,360 --> 00:42:40,719 Speaker 9: or or elsewhere. Something else that Data Republican and I 680 00:42:40,960 --> 00:42:44,000 Speaker 9: began to uncover on the research on our upcoming book 681 00:42:44,480 --> 00:42:48,600 Speaker 9: is the idea that George Bush, President George W. Bush, 682 00:42:48,680 --> 00:42:51,759 Speaker 9: advocated for that we fight them over there, so we 683 00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:56,120 Speaker 9: don't fight them over here. How that simply fell flat 684 00:42:56,360 --> 00:43:01,440 Speaker 9: because the fighting over there never actually ended, and we 685 00:43:01,520 --> 00:43:05,319 Speaker 9: have this open loop from two thousand and one, two 686 00:43:05,360 --> 00:43:10,680 Speaker 9: thousand and three, seven, nine, fifteen, twenty one and beyond, 687 00:43:11,640 --> 00:43:16,200 Speaker 9: where the aftermath and consolidation stage of regime change has 688 00:43:16,280 --> 00:43:20,960 Speaker 9: remained open because you can't open up a society that 689 00:43:21,120 --> 00:43:23,880 Speaker 9: is not capable of being opened up to use George 690 00:43:23,880 --> 00:43:28,040 Speaker 9: Soros language. So what's been done instead what we've seen 691 00:43:28,120 --> 00:43:34,319 Speaker 9: the data. Republican calls it the administrative NGO complex that 692 00:43:34,440 --> 00:43:39,640 Speaker 9: use both Republican and Democratic aligned institutions, religious charities, whether 693 00:43:39,680 --> 00:43:44,040 Speaker 9: it's Catholic charities or the Lutheran or Jewish alternative charities that. 694 00:43:44,000 --> 00:43:44,719 Speaker 3: They have set up. 695 00:43:45,239 --> 00:43:48,279 Speaker 9: Instead of fighting them over there, we don't fight them 696 00:43:48,320 --> 00:43:52,120 Speaker 9: over here. The idea now becomes beginning in about twenty fifteen, 697 00:43:53,000 --> 00:43:56,160 Speaker 9: realizing the war on terror globally did not go as planned. 698 00:43:56,480 --> 00:44:00,760 Speaker 9: Stage three failed of regime change. Let's bring them from 699 00:44:00,800 --> 00:44:05,480 Speaker 9: there to over here. We can democratize them and indoctrinate 700 00:44:05,520 --> 00:44:08,000 Speaker 9: them with new liberal and neo conservative values. 701 00:44:08,160 --> 00:44:08,879 Speaker 3: We can make them. 702 00:44:08,840 --> 00:44:11,360 Speaker 9: Good little citizens of the world who believe in democracy, 703 00:44:11,360 --> 00:44:14,720 Speaker 9: freedom and George Washington. And then because of the money 704 00:44:14,719 --> 00:44:18,759 Speaker 9: they're sending back, the remittances, because of the H and 705 00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:21,719 Speaker 9: B labor that's coming from those countries, because of this 706 00:44:21,840 --> 00:44:26,120 Speaker 9: cross cultural exchange, we can influence those governments and those 707 00:44:26,200 --> 00:44:29,760 Speaker 9: families and those groups back home by bringing them over here. 708 00:44:30,440 --> 00:44:34,720 Speaker 9: Yet another neoliberal and neo conservative disaster, which again both 709 00:44:34,760 --> 00:44:39,680 Speaker 9: Republicans and Democrats have historically supported over the last decade. 710 00:44:39,640 --> 00:44:43,040 Speaker 3: And into that. I guess you could say. 711 00:44:44,880 --> 00:44:50,160 Speaker 9: Weak glass frame ideology comes the wrecking ball of nationalist 712 00:44:50,239 --> 00:44:54,879 Speaker 9: populism under President Donald J. Trump and through powerful influencers 713 00:44:54,920 --> 00:44:59,280 Speaker 9: and super connectors like Charlie Kirk, and so those individuals 714 00:44:59,520 --> 00:45:06,080 Speaker 9: from both sides establishment become enemies of this supranationalist utopian 715 00:45:06,560 --> 00:45:10,360 Speaker 9: idea where everyone can get along all people are basically 716 00:45:10,400 --> 00:45:13,040 Speaker 9: the same. On the right, we jokingly call it magic 717 00:45:13,080 --> 00:45:16,040 Speaker 9: dirt theory, where you can bring a Haitian, plant them 718 00:45:16,080 --> 00:45:19,440 Speaker 9: in my sister town next door to me, Springfield, Ohio, 719 00:45:19,680 --> 00:45:23,480 Speaker 9: and they immediately become just like everyone else, if not better. 720 00:45:23,960 --> 00:45:27,040 Speaker 9: As some have said in the past that immigrants are 721 00:45:27,040 --> 00:45:32,080 Speaker 9: superior to citizens because we're lazy. As a certain mistakes 722 00:45:32,080 --> 00:45:35,200 Speaker 9: of Christmas Break have been known to report that said 723 00:45:35,840 --> 00:45:37,640 Speaker 9: I looked towards regime change. 724 00:45:37,760 --> 00:45:40,399 Speaker 3: We have to understand that it doesn't work that way. 725 00:45:40,719 --> 00:45:44,960 Speaker 9: Not all peoples and cultures are literally the same. That's 726 00:45:45,000 --> 00:45:49,520 Speaker 9: a both neoliberal and neo conservative over extension of Thomas 727 00:45:49,600 --> 00:45:53,200 Speaker 9: Jefferson's words that all men are created equal. That does 728 00:45:53,239 --> 00:45:56,279 Speaker 9: not mean that all men are created literally equally the 729 00:45:56,320 --> 00:45:59,680 Speaker 9: same and are therefore interchangeable. That's what neo conservative, neo 730 00:45:59,719 --> 00:46:03,839 Speaker 9: liberal role ideology is founded on what that means is 731 00:46:04,040 --> 00:46:06,920 Speaker 9: having equal dignity in the eyes of God. There's a 732 00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:09,640 Speaker 9: verse in Galatians I believe, in which the apostle Paul 733 00:46:10,239 --> 00:46:12,640 Speaker 9: Saint Paul says that you know, there is neither June 734 00:46:12,640 --> 00:46:15,040 Speaker 9: nor Greek, nor slave, nor free, nor male or female, 735 00:46:15,080 --> 00:46:16,280 Speaker 9: but all are one in Christ. 736 00:46:16,760 --> 00:46:16,960 Speaker 3: Right. 737 00:46:17,360 --> 00:46:20,600 Speaker 9: That is to say, from that perspective, all human beings 738 00:46:20,640 --> 00:46:25,280 Speaker 9: have an inherent dignity as creations of God. To over 739 00:46:25,360 --> 00:46:33,160 Speaker 9: extend that idea ironically, ironically violates separation of church and state. 740 00:46:33,680 --> 00:46:37,440 Speaker 9: It is a Christian doctrine that has legs through neoliberal 741 00:46:37,680 --> 00:46:41,959 Speaker 9: secular enlightenmentism. This is why we understand that the sort 742 00:46:42,000 --> 00:46:44,279 Speaker 9: of secular liberal perspective. 743 00:46:44,160 --> 00:46:46,520 Speaker 3: Is a is like a a riff. 744 00:46:46,440 --> 00:46:50,960 Speaker 9: On Christianity and Christian values where equality in terms of 745 00:46:50,960 --> 00:46:54,280 Speaker 9: dignity becomes equality of of everything else. 746 00:46:58,160 --> 00:47:00,960 Speaker 1: Getting into another subject there, but that that's similar to 747 00:47:01,480 --> 00:47:04,920 Speaker 1: that term I introduced recently on the show ex Evangelicals, 748 00:47:05,320 --> 00:47:08,920 Speaker 1: where they've take they're taking the Christian superstructure and then 749 00:47:08,960 --> 00:47:15,960 Speaker 1: applying that to progressivism. Folks, this has been tales of 750 00:47:16,040 --> 00:47:22,960 Speaker 1: regime change Iraq, the war that rewired the world. Understand 751 00:47:23,200 --> 00:47:27,920 Speaker 1: why this happened and understand why it can happen again. 752 00:47:28,440 --> 00:47:31,400 Speaker 1: Ladies and gentlemen, as always have my commission to lay sure. 753 00:47:32,880 --> 00:47:55,040 Speaker 6: This is good on. 754 00:47:47,239 --> 00:47:48,120 Speaker 5: You love. 755 00:47:50,360 --> 00:47:52,279 Speaker 6: Oh we go 756 00:48:00,120 --> 00:48:00,480 Speaker 7: Yo