WEBVTT - Ep 104: St. Vincent

0:00:01.280 --> 0:00:04.680
<v Speaker 1>Who I want to watch myself when I watch porn

0:00:04.880 --> 0:00:06.840
<v Speaker 1>like no, no, I do not?

0:00:07.480 --> 0:00:07.680
<v Speaker 2>Is this?

0:00:07.800 --> 0:00:09.120
<v Speaker 1>Who are the people who like this?

0:00:09.760 --> 0:00:14.160
<v Speaker 2>Welcome to Midnight Chats, a podcast of laid back conversations

0:00:14.440 --> 0:00:18.800
<v Speaker 2>with leading names in music. In keeping with these informal interviews,

0:00:18.880 --> 0:00:22.440
<v Speaker 2>each new one is published weekly at midnight. This week's

0:00:22.480 --> 0:00:25.160
<v Speaker 2>episode is hosted by me Greg cochrane from Loud and

0:00:25.239 --> 0:00:30.240
<v Speaker 2>Quiet magazine. Tonight we start a brand new series with

0:00:30.520 --> 0:00:34.479
<v Speaker 2>a brilliant guest, sent Vincent. Having started out playing in

0:00:34.560 --> 0:00:38.280
<v Speaker 2>fans including the Polyphonic Spree, over the past fourteen years,

0:00:38.320 --> 0:00:43.120
<v Speaker 2>Annie Clark has released a succession of incredible albums, from

0:00:43.320 --> 0:00:46.600
<v Speaker 2>Marry Me in twenty seven right up to Mass Seduction

0:00:46.840 --> 0:00:50.839
<v Speaker 2>back in twenty seventeen. In between, she's collaborated with some

0:00:50.880 --> 0:00:54.520
<v Speaker 2>of the biggest names in music, from David Byrne to

0:00:54.600 --> 0:00:59.040
<v Speaker 2>Sleeter Kinney, Dave Groll to Taylor Swift and just recently

0:00:59.160 --> 0:01:02.160
<v Speaker 2>some guy Paul McCartney. We get into that in the

0:01:02.320 --> 0:01:05.959
<v Speaker 2>conversation you were about to hear right now, Saint Vincent

0:01:06.080 --> 0:01:09.120
<v Speaker 2>is just about to release a new album, Daddy's Home,

0:01:09.240 --> 0:01:12.559
<v Speaker 2>out on the fourteenth of May. I spoke to Annie

0:01:12.560 --> 0:01:15.399
<v Speaker 2>back in early April, pretty much straight off the back

0:01:15.440 --> 0:01:19.399
<v Speaker 2>of her performance on Saturday Night Live. Do check that

0:01:19.400 --> 0:01:22.319
<v Speaker 2>out if you haven't already. We talk a bit about that,

0:01:22.760 --> 0:01:26.480
<v Speaker 2>this past year of not playing live shows, the family

0:01:26.560 --> 0:01:31.160
<v Speaker 2>circumstance that informed Daddy's home, and her love for, among

0:01:31.240 --> 0:01:35.559
<v Speaker 2>other things, New York Black Midi and tequila. So yeah,

0:01:35.640 --> 0:01:39.000
<v Speaker 2>we've got a bunch of fantastic guests lined up for

0:01:39.200 --> 0:01:42.880
<v Speaker 2>across the next ten weeks. We hope you enjoy listening

0:01:42.959 --> 0:01:46.280
<v Speaker 2>to these chats as much as we have enjoyed recording them.

0:01:46.560 --> 0:01:48.880
<v Speaker 2>It is great to be back and we start here again.

0:01:49.320 --> 0:01:58.720
<v Speaker 2>This is Saint Vincent on Midnight Chats. Just before we

0:01:58.760 --> 0:02:01.560
<v Speaker 2>get into the chat. This episode of Midnight Chats is

0:02:01.600 --> 0:02:06.640
<v Speaker 2>supported by Memphis Industries and Independent record label who've supported

0:02:06.680 --> 0:02:09.200
<v Speaker 2>what we do at Loud and Quiet from day one.

0:02:09.680 --> 0:02:13.320
<v Speaker 2>They've just released the eighth album from Sunderland band Field Music,

0:02:13.440 --> 0:02:17.000
<v Speaker 2>who over the past sixteen years have become your favorite

0:02:17.040 --> 0:02:19.600
<v Speaker 2>band's favorite band. I'm sure you're familiar with the group,

0:02:20.000 --> 0:02:23.760
<v Speaker 2>led by brothers David and Peter Brewis. The new record

0:02:23.840 --> 0:02:26.520
<v Speaker 2>has just come out and it's called Flat White Moon

0:02:26.600 --> 0:02:30.120
<v Speaker 2>and is available from your local record store or you

0:02:30.120 --> 0:02:33.480
<v Speaker 2>can order a copy from Field Dash Music dot co

0:02:33.639 --> 0:02:36.520
<v Speaker 2>dot uk, where you can also find dates for their

0:02:36.600 --> 0:02:41.520
<v Speaker 2>upcoming tour, happening in October twenty twenty one. Annie, Welcome

0:02:41.560 --> 0:02:44.520
<v Speaker 2>to Midnight Chats. I'm very, very excited to have you

0:02:44.600 --> 0:02:47.519
<v Speaker 2>join me on the podcast. Pretty much fresh from playing

0:02:47.520 --> 0:02:49.799
<v Speaker 2>Saturday Night Live at the weekend, which is the second

0:02:49.800 --> 0:02:51.840
<v Speaker 2>time we've been on the show. How is the experience

0:02:51.880 --> 0:02:52.320
<v Speaker 2>this time?

0:02:52.480 --> 0:02:55.520
<v Speaker 1>Let's see. I would say there's more fun that the

0:02:55.560 --> 0:02:59.080
<v Speaker 1>first time I played it, I was just a total

0:02:59.120 --> 0:03:05.560
<v Speaker 1>bundle of nerves. So I mean, yeah, this time it

0:03:05.600 --> 0:03:07.760
<v Speaker 1>was just just a lot of fun.

0:03:08.120 --> 0:03:11.560
<v Speaker 2>Obviously, it's still a slightly different version to the sort

0:03:11.560 --> 0:03:14.359
<v Speaker 2>of Saturday Night Live we're used to seeing, sort of

0:03:14.400 --> 0:03:16.560
<v Speaker 2>pre pandemic. There was only there was like a small audience.

0:03:16.600 --> 0:03:18.799
<v Speaker 2>Everybody was kind of obviously wearing their masks and sort

0:03:18.800 --> 0:03:21.200
<v Speaker 2>of socially distanced and stuff like that. Did it lend

0:03:21.280 --> 0:03:23.520
<v Speaker 2>us sort of slightly strange air to doing it? Or

0:03:23.600 --> 0:03:25.400
<v Speaker 2>was it? Was it all still totally fine?

0:03:25.639 --> 0:03:27.720
<v Speaker 1>No, it was all still totally fine. I mean, it's

0:03:27.800 --> 0:03:33.200
<v Speaker 1>really impressive how how the show has managed to keep going.

0:03:33.400 --> 0:03:36.880
<v Speaker 1>I mean they're super strict, you know, rightful, so on

0:03:37.240 --> 0:03:41.040
<v Speaker 1>COVID protocols for everything like that. So it really is

0:03:41.080 --> 0:03:43.760
<v Speaker 1>a pretty miraculous feet that they're able to put on

0:03:43.800 --> 0:03:46.600
<v Speaker 1>the show still and then also to even have the

0:03:46.640 --> 0:03:49.040
<v Speaker 1>audience as any audience and there in the first place

0:03:49.160 --> 0:03:51.240
<v Speaker 1>is really really cool.

0:03:51.600 --> 0:03:53.280
<v Speaker 2>It was still very much used to on like all

0:03:53.320 --> 0:03:55.720
<v Speaker 2>of the big kind of talk shows and entertainment shows

0:03:55.720 --> 0:03:57.720
<v Speaker 2>in the UK. Still they've got the kind of video

0:03:57.720 --> 0:04:00.360
<v Speaker 2>screens where there's like an audience buzzing in from home.

0:04:00.400 --> 0:04:02.800
<v Speaker 2>It still seems like the way of things at the

0:04:02.800 --> 0:04:05.640
<v Speaker 2>moment here that yeah, hopefully soon there will be people

0:04:05.640 --> 0:04:07.320
<v Speaker 2>to be able to get back in a room and

0:04:07.400 --> 0:04:10.520
<v Speaker 2>enjoy live music. I particularly enjoyed your performance of Melting

0:04:10.520 --> 0:04:13.000
<v Speaker 2>of the Sun, by the way. I thought it was brilliant. Well,

0:04:13.440 --> 0:04:15.600
<v Speaker 2>is that the sort of presentation of what we saw

0:04:15.640 --> 0:04:17.320
<v Speaker 2>there with the live band that you had and your

0:04:17.360 --> 0:04:19.920
<v Speaker 2>backing singers and everything like that. Is that how you're

0:04:19.960 --> 0:04:22.320
<v Speaker 2>going to hopefully perform this album generally? Is that the

0:04:22.320 --> 0:04:23.960
<v Speaker 2>sort of live setup you're hoping to put together?

0:04:24.680 --> 0:04:24.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah?

0:04:25.080 --> 0:04:25.640
<v Speaker 2>I think so.

0:04:26.000 --> 0:04:30.520
<v Speaker 1>This, I mean, this music is really it sounds redundant

0:04:30.560 --> 0:04:34.200
<v Speaker 1>or something, but it's really just about like musicians like

0:04:34.960 --> 0:04:39.840
<v Speaker 1>just playing together, just like vibing. So yeah, I mean

0:04:39.920 --> 0:04:43.120
<v Speaker 1>it takes it definitely takes like a certain kind of

0:04:43.120 --> 0:04:46.640
<v Speaker 1>singer and a certain kind of player to really really

0:04:47.000 --> 0:04:49.240
<v Speaker 1>pull it off. So yeah, this is the vibe.

0:04:49.560 --> 0:04:51.960
<v Speaker 2>Obviously, you've had the kind of enforced break like everybody

0:04:51.960 --> 0:04:53.839
<v Speaker 2>else and not being able to perform on stage for

0:04:54.400 --> 0:04:57.359
<v Speaker 2>however long it's been a year eighteen months. Was that

0:04:57.400 --> 0:04:59.599
<v Speaker 2>the first time you've sort of stepped back on stage

0:04:59.640 --> 0:05:04.160
<v Speaker 2>as it? Oh god, yeah, oh yeah.

0:05:02.920 --> 0:05:05.839
<v Speaker 1>Like everybody else, I've been in my you know, in

0:05:05.960 --> 0:05:11.479
<v Speaker 1>cozy clothes, am I home or basically is more like it.

0:05:11.560 --> 0:05:15.320
<v Speaker 1>But yeah, no, it was so fun. I mean, it

0:05:15.400 --> 0:05:18.680
<v Speaker 1>was so fun to play that music. It's it's really

0:05:19.400 --> 0:05:22.279
<v Speaker 1>music that's really meant to be played, you know, like

0:05:22.360 --> 0:05:25.520
<v Speaker 1>really just kind of played with great players and just

0:05:25.600 --> 0:05:29.040
<v Speaker 1>kind of leaned into like that. So it's so fun

0:05:29.080 --> 0:05:31.479
<v Speaker 1>to just the music part. And then also, my god,

0:05:31.600 --> 0:05:36.680
<v Speaker 1>the uh, the energy of any kind of crowd or

0:05:36.960 --> 0:05:39.280
<v Speaker 1>or or that kind of like three two one and

0:05:39.320 --> 0:05:39.640
<v Speaker 1>you're on.

0:05:39.839 --> 0:05:43.120
<v Speaker 3>I mean I haven't heard anything that even vaguely resembles

0:05:43.800 --> 0:05:48.840
<v Speaker 3>that feeling, and well over a year, so it's like, oh, yeah,

0:05:49.000 --> 0:05:51.200
<v Speaker 3>I forgot I used to do this.

0:05:53.000 --> 0:05:54.800
<v Speaker 2>What was that sort of rush of adrenaline, like in

0:05:54.839 --> 0:05:57.560
<v Speaker 2>the in the moments before performing, it was excitement.

0:05:57.760 --> 0:06:00.080
<v Speaker 1>It was like, let's get down and dirty with it.

0:06:00.480 --> 0:06:02.960
<v Speaker 1>That was really feeling and the you know, the band

0:06:03.040 --> 0:06:05.880
<v Speaker 1>is so good that it there wasn't really, there wasn't

0:06:05.880 --> 0:06:10.200
<v Speaker 1>any fear associated. It was just like excitement, like, let's

0:06:10.240 --> 0:06:15.320
<v Speaker 1>give the people something they won't forget. They has given

0:06:15.400 --> 0:06:17.599
<v Speaker 1>the people that some people will love and some people

0:06:17.640 --> 0:06:18.159
<v Speaker 1>will hate.

0:06:19.839 --> 0:06:22.240
<v Speaker 2>Do you think there's there's still people that would find

0:06:22.600 --> 0:06:24.160
<v Speaker 2>that what you do divisive? Do you think there would

0:06:24.160 --> 0:06:26.520
<v Speaker 2>still be people watching Saturday Night Live and I'm not

0:06:26.560 --> 0:06:27.000
<v Speaker 2>into this?

0:06:27.080 --> 0:06:29.600
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, of course, of course, of course. I mean

0:06:29.640 --> 0:06:33.919
<v Speaker 1>it's a it's a it's a big, massive broad audience.

0:06:35.040 --> 0:06:37.160
<v Speaker 1>You know, plenty of people that definitely haven't heard of

0:06:37.200 --> 0:06:39.880
<v Speaker 1>me or so, yeah, it's definitely going to be a

0:06:40.880 --> 0:06:45.120
<v Speaker 1>mix of like, loved it and what the fuck did

0:06:45.120 --> 0:06:48.599
<v Speaker 1>I just see? And and I hate this?

0:06:49.160 --> 0:06:49.880
<v Speaker 3>But that's fine.

0:06:49.960 --> 0:06:52.440
<v Speaker 1>I think that's good. It means you made something alive,

0:06:52.880 --> 0:06:54.320
<v Speaker 1>way better that than that.

0:06:55.480 --> 0:06:58.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Oh yeah, I'm much better to provoke some kind

0:06:58.279 --> 0:07:00.800
<v Speaker 2>of feeling than just forget about it. A minute later,

0:07:01.000 --> 0:07:03.400
<v Speaker 2>staying on the subject of not being able to perform live.

0:07:03.480 --> 0:07:05.599
<v Speaker 2>Is it through this sort of period of the pandemic,

0:07:05.760 --> 0:07:08.359
<v Speaker 2>is it felt if you felt a bit incomplete, like

0:07:08.480 --> 0:07:10.960
<v Speaker 2>not being able to do that, because obviously you've you've

0:07:10.960 --> 0:07:13.280
<v Speaker 2>always been somebody who's toured a lot and kind of

0:07:13.320 --> 0:07:15.560
<v Speaker 2>been out on the road and supported all of your

0:07:15.600 --> 0:07:18.480
<v Speaker 2>albums with tours. So has that felt like a little

0:07:18.520 --> 0:07:20.760
<v Speaker 2>piece of you's sort of been missing for a little while,

0:07:20.840 --> 0:07:23.840
<v Speaker 2>or have you actually embraced that chance to have a

0:07:23.840 --> 0:07:24.400
<v Speaker 2>little break.

0:07:25.000 --> 0:07:28.720
<v Speaker 1>It's a bit of both. I mean, definitely, starting at

0:07:28.760 --> 0:07:32.360
<v Speaker 1>the beginning, I spent my whole adult life adult and

0:07:32.480 --> 0:07:36.920
<v Speaker 1>quotes on the road like a real road dog, as

0:07:36.960 --> 0:07:42.160
<v Speaker 1>a real road dog for a long time, which I'm

0:07:42.280 --> 0:07:45.760
<v Speaker 1>you know, I'm glad and that it made me good

0:07:45.760 --> 0:07:48.920
<v Speaker 1>at being on the road. You know you definitely you

0:07:48.960 --> 0:07:52.480
<v Speaker 1>don't get, you know, good at performing without being bad

0:07:52.560 --> 0:07:57.240
<v Speaker 1>at it first. So that part I'm glad I sort

0:07:57.280 --> 0:08:00.680
<v Speaker 1>of have in my toolbox. I don't at first. I

0:08:00.720 --> 0:08:05.040
<v Speaker 1>was really nervous about the shutdown, even when obviously in

0:08:05.040 --> 0:08:07.360
<v Speaker 1>the beginning, when we thought it was going to be like, what,

0:08:07.400 --> 0:08:09.480
<v Speaker 1>we're going to be shut down for a month? You've

0:08:09.520 --> 0:08:12.000
<v Speaker 1>got to kidding me, what are we going to do

0:08:12.480 --> 0:08:16.040
<v Speaker 1>we were, and it was like, I don't know, how

0:08:16.040 --> 0:08:18.880
<v Speaker 1>do I be in one place for more than two

0:08:18.960 --> 0:08:22.080
<v Speaker 1>weeks at a time. But then, honestly, yeah, I guess

0:08:22.080 --> 0:08:27.280
<v Speaker 1>part of it was very nice because I hadn't I

0:08:27.320 --> 0:08:30.640
<v Speaker 1>hadn't stopped, I hadn't stopped being on the road for

0:08:30.640 --> 0:08:33.200
<v Speaker 1>for a long time, or definitely this is the longest

0:08:33.240 --> 0:08:37.280
<v Speaker 1>I've ever gone in well over a decade. You get

0:08:37.280 --> 0:08:41.240
<v Speaker 1>to kind of store up, I think, store up some energy,

0:08:41.640 --> 0:08:43.360
<v Speaker 1>maybe get a couple of years of your life back

0:08:43.400 --> 0:08:46.000
<v Speaker 1>before you go and do it again. But yeah, there's

0:08:46.040 --> 0:08:48.800
<v Speaker 1>not a feeling. There's not a feeling like being on

0:08:48.840 --> 0:08:52.400
<v Speaker 1>the road or performing in regular life. There's there's not

0:08:52.480 --> 0:08:57.040
<v Speaker 1>an analog. There's not a rush or a purpose in

0:08:57.120 --> 0:08:58.000
<v Speaker 1>quite the same way.

0:08:58.400 --> 0:09:00.840
<v Speaker 2>Well, yeah, I can't wait. I don't know what situation

0:09:01.000 --> 0:09:03.040
<v Speaker 2>is like there in the States, But at the moment

0:09:03.160 --> 0:09:05.640
<v Speaker 2>was still a few months away from being able to

0:09:05.679 --> 0:09:09.000
<v Speaker 2>get together again for any kind of live music in

0:09:09.040 --> 0:09:11.760
<v Speaker 2>the UK. But hopefully, hopefully it's not too far away.

0:09:11.880 --> 0:09:13.480
<v Speaker 2>So are you in New York at the moment?

0:09:13.760 --> 0:09:14.400
<v Speaker 1>I'm in New York.

0:09:14.480 --> 0:09:17.360
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Because the album Daddy Time is sort of indebted

0:09:17.360 --> 0:09:20.319
<v Speaker 2>to a certain chapter in New York music history and

0:09:20.679 --> 0:09:22.760
<v Speaker 2>kind of can you tell me a little bit more

0:09:22.800 --> 0:09:24.640
<v Speaker 2>about that and how there was a certain period that's

0:09:24.679 --> 0:09:27.559
<v Speaker 2>really really come to inform the film that the feel

0:09:27.600 --> 0:09:27.960
<v Speaker 2>of this.

0:09:27.880 --> 0:09:31.200
<v Speaker 1>Record, it's music made in New York City from seventy

0:09:31.200 --> 0:09:37.000
<v Speaker 1>one to seventy six, post Idealistic Flower Children, pre gay disco,

0:09:37.160 --> 0:09:41.439
<v Speaker 1>and pre punk. So it's really like the Steely Dan Records,

0:09:41.840 --> 0:09:45.679
<v Speaker 1>Stevie Wonder, Rudcords, Slime Family Stone. There's kind of like

0:09:45.800 --> 0:09:48.120
<v Speaker 1>music that I've listened to more than any other music,

0:09:48.440 --> 0:09:53.160
<v Speaker 1>if I'm honest, but that I'd never really kind of

0:09:53.320 --> 0:09:56.520
<v Speaker 1>bowed at the feet of it. Probably wasn't ready for

0:09:56.600 --> 0:10:00.840
<v Speaker 1>it in one way or another. So you know, these

0:10:00.840 --> 0:10:04.000
<v Speaker 1>songs just kind of came out, these stories of people

0:10:04.040 --> 0:10:08.040
<v Speaker 1>being down and out downtown and flawed people doing their

0:10:08.040 --> 0:10:11.600
<v Speaker 1>best to get by and things are too easy. I'm

0:10:11.640 --> 0:10:15.160
<v Speaker 1>sort of suspicious of them. But this particular record was

0:10:15.679 --> 0:10:21.319
<v Speaker 1>really fun to make. There was never a moment of like,

0:10:22.080 --> 0:10:24.400
<v Speaker 1>I'm standing on the precipice and I think I'm just

0:10:24.440 --> 0:10:27.120
<v Speaker 1>going to jump off because it sucks, And you know,

0:10:27.160 --> 0:10:28.920
<v Speaker 1>there wasn't that sort of dark night of the soul

0:10:29.000 --> 0:10:32.640
<v Speaker 1>that kind of usually happens in album making. It was

0:10:32.760 --> 0:10:37.599
<v Speaker 1>really joyful to make, which again I'm usually suspicious of,

0:10:37.720 --> 0:10:40.280
<v Speaker 1>but I went with that. I was like, well, maybe

0:10:40.280 --> 0:10:42.360
<v Speaker 1>I've earned one one.

0:10:42.280 --> 0:10:46.360
<v Speaker 2>Like this, I can go back to the painful process

0:10:46.360 --> 0:10:48.520
<v Speaker 2>of making records. Yeah, I'm just going to go with it.

0:10:49.200 --> 0:10:50.960
<v Speaker 2>I mean, New York has always had such a strong,

0:10:51.480 --> 0:10:54.920
<v Speaker 2>sort of detectable sound in so many eras, even up

0:10:54.960 --> 0:10:57.160
<v Speaker 2>to the past few decades, you know, the tenth of

0:10:57.160 --> 0:11:00.480
<v Speaker 2>the Century obviously, Yeah, yeah, yeahs the Strokes and later

0:11:00.559 --> 0:11:03.520
<v Speaker 2>on Animal Collective and all that kind of thing. What

0:11:03.559 --> 0:11:06.160
<v Speaker 2>does New York sound like sort of now in this decade?

0:11:06.200 --> 0:11:09.320
<v Speaker 1>Do you think in this decade? I don't I'm not

0:11:09.400 --> 0:11:13.200
<v Speaker 1>exactly sure. New York has always had a detectable sound.

0:11:13.200 --> 0:11:16.319
<v Speaker 1>There's more grit to it. There's there's an edginess to it.

0:11:16.880 --> 0:11:18.640
<v Speaker 1>If you look at the music that was happening in

0:11:19.120 --> 0:11:22.920
<v Speaker 1>California at the time, there's a lot of great music happening.

0:11:22.960 --> 0:11:25.800
<v Speaker 1>But I think of like I think of Steely Dan

0:11:25.920 --> 0:11:27.800
<v Speaker 1>as New York, and I think of like the fucking

0:11:27.840 --> 0:11:33.440
<v Speaker 1>Eagles is okay, which the thing with the thing the

0:11:33.520 --> 0:11:39.080
<v Speaker 1>stories in Steely Dan are cynical, but the music of

0:11:39.080 --> 0:11:42.959
<v Speaker 1>the Eagles is cynical. It's different. It's different. One is

0:11:43.040 --> 0:11:47.080
<v Speaker 1>intentionally cynical in the songwriting, and the other is cynical

0:11:48.160 --> 0:11:50.160
<v Speaker 1>in a way that thinks that people are stupid.

0:11:50.720 --> 0:11:53.920
<v Speaker 2>M maybe the Internet has come along and made things

0:11:53.920 --> 0:11:55.880
<v Speaker 2>a little bit more disparate. I don't know. I just

0:11:56.200 --> 0:11:58.120
<v Speaker 2>maybe there's not their pockets of sounds. You know.

0:11:58.840 --> 0:12:02.760
<v Speaker 1>I think we're pretty modern. I mean I think that

0:12:02.760 --> 0:12:06.280
<v Speaker 1>that in the same way where nineties the nineties have

0:12:06.360 --> 0:12:10.160
<v Speaker 1>made such a comeback. But it's interesting. I wonder if

0:12:10.160 --> 0:12:14.200
<v Speaker 1>this is how people who lived through the seventies felt,

0:12:14.200 --> 0:12:16.280
<v Speaker 1>but like when we were in the nineties and like

0:12:16.400 --> 0:12:20.080
<v Speaker 1>just randomly picking stuff from the seventies and being like cool, cool,

0:12:20.120 --> 0:12:21.920
<v Speaker 1>this is cool, and people who lived through it would

0:12:21.960 --> 0:12:26.200
<v Speaker 1>have been like, wait, no, that was no, that's fog hat.

0:12:26.240 --> 0:12:30.439
<v Speaker 1>You don't put fog hat with I don't know, bell bottoms,

0:12:30.440 --> 0:12:34.920
<v Speaker 1>I don't know whatever. So it's just this really interesting

0:12:35.000 --> 0:12:38.680
<v Speaker 1>kind of postmodern cherry picking of like, oh, okay, cool,

0:12:39.080 --> 0:12:42.640
<v Speaker 1>there were reviving that thing, which is legitimately cool in

0:12:42.640 --> 0:12:45.520
<v Speaker 1>the nineties, and then also like grabbing stuff that we

0:12:45.520 --> 0:12:48.400
<v Speaker 1>were like no, no, no, that was never that was

0:12:48.440 --> 0:12:51.920
<v Speaker 1>never cool. We didn't like, you know, it's like there

0:12:52.000 --> 0:12:56.720
<v Speaker 1>is no context. Things plucked from other times, devoid of

0:12:56.720 --> 0:13:02.200
<v Speaker 1>their context and then rearranged into something new. That's really cool,

0:13:02.520 --> 0:13:03.719
<v Speaker 1>Like that's how art gets made.

0:13:03.960 --> 0:13:05.960
<v Speaker 2>What's your relationship like with the city? Now? Can you

0:13:06.000 --> 0:13:07.840
<v Speaker 2>can you still walk around New York and get lost

0:13:07.920 --> 0:13:10.680
<v Speaker 2>in the history and the mythology of the place. There's

0:13:10.679 --> 0:13:13.079
<v Speaker 2>the sort of buildings and the streets and the smells.

0:13:13.120 --> 0:13:15.880
<v Speaker 2>Because last time I was there was a few years ago.

0:13:15.920 --> 0:13:18.080
<v Speaker 2>Now I went. I went to find the Chelsea Hotel

0:13:18.200 --> 0:13:21.360
<v Speaker 2>and found it all boarded up and there was security

0:13:21.400 --> 0:13:25.599
<v Speaker 2>and cct CCTV cameras and it was a sort of

0:13:25.600 --> 0:13:28.840
<v Speaker 2>strange experience but still felt like real history. So yeah,

0:13:28.840 --> 0:13:30.800
<v Speaker 2>I wondered what it was like. Oh yeah, how you

0:13:30.800 --> 0:13:33.080
<v Speaker 2>feel and how your relationship is now with New York?

0:13:33.160 --> 0:13:36.040
<v Speaker 1>I think New York it really is a relationship that

0:13:36.120 --> 0:13:39.679
<v Speaker 1>you have with New York. It's at times you're in

0:13:39.880 --> 0:13:43.600
<v Speaker 1>love and at times you know it torments you, and

0:13:43.679 --> 0:13:47.160
<v Speaker 1>at times you know it doesn't even care that you're there,

0:13:47.240 --> 0:13:50.160
<v Speaker 1>and you're like, wait, but I thought we were friends

0:13:50.240 --> 0:13:55.760
<v Speaker 1>and no, we've never heard of you in a while. Yeah, exactly.

0:13:56.040 --> 0:13:58.360
<v Speaker 1>So it's that kind of place. I mean, I think

0:13:58.400 --> 0:14:02.560
<v Speaker 1>for me, I lived of life and just a few

0:14:03.400 --> 0:14:07.120
<v Speaker 1>square blocks really, and when you're walking down the streets,

0:14:07.120 --> 0:14:09.680
<v Speaker 1>you're like, oh, yeah, I am walking with the ghost

0:14:09.720 --> 0:14:15.000
<v Speaker 1>of like every artist I loved, every you know, every

0:14:15.080 --> 0:14:18.720
<v Speaker 1>kind of person has been been in this place, which

0:14:18.760 --> 0:14:22.560
<v Speaker 1>is nice. I like that. I'm definitely a person who

0:14:23.520 --> 0:14:29.720
<v Speaker 1>much prefers a city than like some idyllic remote place

0:14:29.800 --> 0:14:32.680
<v Speaker 1>that that that I find terrifying. But you know, put

0:14:32.680 --> 0:14:34.200
<v Speaker 1>me in a city with a bunch of people and

0:14:34.240 --> 0:14:36.840
<v Speaker 1>things bustling, and I feel safe.

0:14:37.320 --> 0:14:39.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. It's funny that, Like, I've lived in London now

0:14:39.960 --> 0:14:41.760
<v Speaker 2>for a long time, and when I go I was

0:14:41.760 --> 0:14:43.800
<v Speaker 2>born in the countryside, and so when I go home

0:14:43.840 --> 0:14:46.320
<v Speaker 2>and visit family and it's sort of very quiet at night,

0:14:46.640 --> 0:14:48.760
<v Speaker 2>I'm just like, I'm pretty sure this is a horror

0:14:48.760 --> 0:14:51.520
<v Speaker 2>maybe ready to happen, because where are all the sirens?

0:14:51.560 --> 0:14:53.600
<v Speaker 2>I need it to sleep exactly.

0:14:53.800 --> 0:14:56.920
<v Speaker 1>I mean that there's there's no doubt that an ax

0:14:57.000 --> 0:15:00.880
<v Speaker 1>murder is going to come wrapping on your bedroom door

0:15:00.960 --> 0:15:03.120
<v Speaker 1>any minute. That's just simply how it goes.

0:15:03.440 --> 0:15:07.160
<v Speaker 2>Before we get into a bit more detail on Daddy's home,

0:15:07.200 --> 0:15:09.120
<v Speaker 2>I wanted to ask a little bit about the end

0:15:09.120 --> 0:15:11.160
<v Speaker 2>of the mass seduction era, Like when you finished sort

0:15:11.160 --> 0:15:13.800
<v Speaker 2>of performing that record, I saw you and ended a

0:15:13.840 --> 0:15:16.720
<v Speaker 2>road festival headlin in that festival with an amazing performance.

0:15:17.120 --> 0:15:20.360
<v Speaker 2>What are your reflections on that album and the and

0:15:20.680 --> 0:15:22.480
<v Speaker 2>the end of that period, because we're going back a

0:15:22.520 --> 0:15:23.240
<v Speaker 2>couple of years now.

0:15:23.320 --> 0:15:26.120
<v Speaker 1>I think of it in terms of color. I definitely

0:15:26.120 --> 0:15:31.400
<v Speaker 1>think about peeling off the latex after a show that

0:15:31.520 --> 0:15:34.120
<v Speaker 1>I was careering and just there was just a flood

0:15:34.440 --> 0:15:39.320
<v Speaker 1>of sweat, and that was kind of a metaphor for

0:15:39.440 --> 0:15:42.040
<v Speaker 1>the I think for the vibe as a whole. It's

0:15:42.040 --> 0:15:46.640
<v Speaker 1>definitely about structure, about being constrained in a certain way.

0:15:47.080 --> 0:15:51.440
<v Speaker 1>There's kind of nuclear bruise color palette, you know, there's

0:15:52.280 --> 0:15:56.400
<v Speaker 1>multi media show like let's take over the senses, let's

0:15:56.440 --> 0:15:59.960
<v Speaker 1>overwhelm them. Here's here's a slow motion of me getting

0:16:00.240 --> 0:16:05.920
<v Speaker 1>in the face. Anyway, just just a real more about

0:16:06.040 --> 0:16:12.120
<v Speaker 1>I think just power writ large. This one's definitely more

0:16:12.280 --> 0:16:16.440
<v Speaker 1>about like, hey, come sit in the beat up armchair

0:16:16.760 --> 0:16:20.440
<v Speaker 1>and like let's have a chat, the midnight chat as it.

0:16:20.400 --> 0:16:25.800
<v Speaker 2>Were, Yeah, exactly then.

0:16:24.080 --> 0:16:27.840
<v Speaker 1>Like so so forward.

0:16:28.200 --> 0:16:30.280
<v Speaker 2>I think I was listening again to it this morning

0:16:30.280 --> 0:16:33.760
<v Speaker 2>and it's just, yeah, what an amazing record. The what

0:16:33.760 --> 0:16:38.480
<v Speaker 2>what what's? What's your relationship generally like with your previous work.

0:16:38.760 --> 0:16:41.360
<v Speaker 2>Once it's it's out there and you've shared it with people,

0:16:42.000 --> 0:16:43.880
<v Speaker 2>is it almost sort of? I mean obviously there's the

0:16:43.920 --> 0:16:46.840
<v Speaker 2>live performance aspect, but the recorded side of things, is it?

0:16:46.880 --> 0:16:49.120
<v Speaker 2>Is it? Once it's done? It's done. Did you ever

0:16:49.200 --> 0:16:53.080
<v Speaker 2>return to listen back to your your discography as it were?

0:16:54.000 --> 0:16:58.080
<v Speaker 1>I really don't. I mean I do every every every

0:16:58.120 --> 0:17:02.200
<v Speaker 1>so often. Like I went back and listen to Mass

0:17:02.240 --> 0:17:08.040
<v Speaker 1>Deduction probably about six months ago. Well, I thought, whoa,

0:17:08.080 --> 0:17:11.520
<v Speaker 1>this is this is a pretty like it's a pretty

0:17:11.520 --> 0:17:16.479
<v Speaker 1>aggressive record. It's pretty aggressive sounding. It's not it's definitely

0:17:16.480 --> 0:17:20.400
<v Speaker 1>not docile. No, definitely, And I think listening back to

0:17:20.440 --> 0:17:25.600
<v Speaker 1>it with the kind of some of the the intimations

0:17:25.600 --> 0:17:28.879
<v Speaker 1>I got from press or whatever, you know, interviews that

0:17:29.000 --> 0:17:31.200
<v Speaker 1>was like, this is a very poppy record I listened

0:17:31.200 --> 0:17:34.720
<v Speaker 1>back to him, was like not really, I mean I

0:17:34.720 --> 0:17:40.960
<v Speaker 1>don't not I don't know that this this says middle

0:17:41.000 --> 0:17:41.520
<v Speaker 1>of the road.

0:17:42.560 --> 0:17:43.480
<v Speaker 2>No, it's definitely not.

0:17:43.960 --> 0:17:46.639
<v Speaker 1>So so yeah, I was like, whoa, this is this

0:17:46.680 --> 0:17:49.080
<v Speaker 1>thing kind of rips I really am fond of it,

0:17:49.520 --> 0:17:53.160
<v Speaker 1>really like fuck yeah. But but obviously you know, once

0:17:53.160 --> 0:17:56.760
<v Speaker 1>you're Once I'm done with the record, I'm I'm excited

0:17:56.800 --> 0:18:00.280
<v Speaker 1>to just kind of move on to to something else. Yeah, Like,

0:18:00.320 --> 0:18:02.240
<v Speaker 1>I don't think I've gone back and listened to self title.

0:18:02.280 --> 0:18:05.160
<v Speaker 1>I probably haven't heard that and since it came out.

0:18:06.119 --> 0:18:08.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean it's funny though, isn't it, Because I mean, yeah,

0:18:08.880 --> 0:18:12.000
<v Speaker 2>I can't imagine many artists kind of going settling down

0:18:12.040 --> 0:18:14.160
<v Speaker 2>in the living room for in drinks.

0:18:17.160 --> 0:18:24.400
<v Speaker 1>You wildly underestimate the narcissism. Yeah, I've heard of many

0:18:24.480 --> 0:18:27.200
<v Speaker 1>artists who insist that they have their own music playing

0:18:27.720 --> 0:18:30.879
<v Speaker 1>at photo shoots or you know, when they're doing press

0:18:31.000 --> 0:18:34.080
<v Speaker 1>or like come in and insist on playing either. I

0:18:34.280 --> 0:18:38.160
<v Speaker 1>definitely have been sat down, cornered at a party and

0:18:38.520 --> 0:18:41.280
<v Speaker 1>made to listen to an entire record.

0:18:41.480 --> 0:18:44.680
<v Speaker 2>By an artist a photo shoot. I think I would

0:18:44.720 --> 0:18:45.800
<v Speaker 2>just cringe inside out.

0:18:45.840 --> 0:18:49.840
<v Speaker 1>Oh my god listening to my oh God, And that

0:18:49.840 --> 0:18:51.639
<v Speaker 1>that happens too people like, so, do you want to

0:18:51.640 --> 0:18:53.520
<v Speaker 1>listen to your record to you know, get into the

0:18:53.520 --> 0:18:56.000
<v Speaker 1>mood for the photoshop and like, good god, no do

0:18:56.080 --> 0:18:59.000
<v Speaker 1>I want to do? I want to like watch myself

0:18:59.160 --> 0:19:02.560
<v Speaker 1>when I'm watching porn Like no, no, I do not

0:19:03.040 --> 0:19:05.720
<v Speaker 1>Who is this. Who are the people who like this? No?

0:19:05.880 --> 0:19:08.359
<v Speaker 2>Exactly, Please just put the Black Midi record on and

0:19:08.400 --> 0:19:08.920
<v Speaker 2>be done.

0:19:08.720 --> 0:19:11.480
<v Speaker 1>With it, exactly. Yeah, I'm going to get some real,

0:19:12.480 --> 0:19:14.840
<v Speaker 1>really really gnarly photos that way.

0:19:19.000 --> 0:19:21.320
<v Speaker 2>You've been really open about the sort of the origins

0:19:21.320 --> 0:19:23.800
<v Speaker 2>of Daddy's home and the experience of your father going

0:19:23.840 --> 0:19:25.960
<v Speaker 2>to prison, and it's released a couple of years ago.

0:19:26.200 --> 0:19:27.639
<v Speaker 2>I don't I don't really want to dwell on that

0:19:27.640 --> 0:19:29.040
<v Speaker 2>too much because I know you've spoken about it, and.

0:19:29.280 --> 0:19:31.480
<v Speaker 1>So I'd love to talk about it. Let's go there.

0:19:33.600 --> 0:19:35.199
<v Speaker 2>I can't. I can't see you any but I know

0:19:35.240 --> 0:19:38.640
<v Speaker 2>it's like, yeah, okay, here, I suppose, I mean, really

0:19:38.920 --> 0:19:41.359
<v Speaker 2>kind of it's a question about being asked about that.

0:19:41.400 --> 0:19:43.880
<v Speaker 2>I suppose, because you know, you have been very honest

0:19:43.880 --> 0:19:46.840
<v Speaker 2>about that experience, and so I suppose as music's been

0:19:46.840 --> 0:19:48.840
<v Speaker 2>coming out and you've been doing interviews and things like that,

0:19:49.320 --> 0:19:51.119
<v Speaker 2>how has that fact Has that been okay? Or is

0:19:51.119 --> 0:19:53.000
<v Speaker 2>it actually ended up feeling a bit intrusive.

0:19:53.720 --> 0:19:55.959
<v Speaker 1>It's a mix of both. I think that it's not

0:19:56.040 --> 0:19:59.000
<v Speaker 1>any kind of story that I would have led with,

0:19:59.560 --> 0:20:03.560
<v Speaker 1>except that it was told in the press already in

0:20:03.600 --> 0:20:06.719
<v Speaker 1>a way that was like, that's not that's not my story.

0:20:06.800 --> 0:20:09.320
<v Speaker 1>I didn't get to tell it. So in this case,

0:20:09.480 --> 0:20:13.040
<v Speaker 1>you know, as far as things, as far as happy

0:20:13.119 --> 0:20:16.080
<v Speaker 1>endings can go, this is this has a sort of

0:20:17.040 --> 0:20:20.600
<v Speaker 1>happy ish ending in that you know, he's out and

0:20:20.640 --> 0:20:23.800
<v Speaker 1>he's a contributing member to society and to the family

0:20:23.960 --> 0:20:26.800
<v Speaker 1>and all that stuff. So that that part I don't

0:20:26.960 --> 0:20:30.760
<v Speaker 1>That's like, fine, that's all. That's all good. I am

0:20:30.840 --> 0:20:35.480
<v Speaker 1>where I am with it, and everybody's okay. But yeah,

0:20:35.520 --> 0:20:39.840
<v Speaker 1>I guess I wanted to tell my story since it

0:20:39.880 --> 0:20:42.760
<v Speaker 1>had already been told by someone else and I could

0:20:42.760 --> 0:20:45.800
<v Speaker 1>tell it with like humor and compassion and the more

0:20:45.840 --> 0:20:50.880
<v Speaker 1>complexity and then but I probably would not have at

0:20:50.880 --> 0:20:55.400
<v Speaker 1>all mentioned it had it not been kind of uncovered

0:20:55.480 --> 0:21:00.199
<v Speaker 1>in a way that was really unfortunate. But also know

0:21:00.960 --> 0:21:03.479
<v Speaker 1>the title the record is called Daddy's Song, which is

0:21:03.760 --> 0:21:07.080
<v Speaker 1>to me, it's just the fact that it's I mean literally,

0:21:07.200 --> 0:21:11.040
<v Speaker 1>I mean it figuratively, I mean it metaphorically, I mean

0:21:11.080 --> 0:21:14.240
<v Speaker 1>it in a pervy way, I mean sincere way. It

0:21:14.400 --> 0:21:17.000
<v Speaker 1>just just like, oh my god, that's so I got

0:21:17.000 --> 0:21:17.560
<v Speaker 1>to call it that.

0:21:19.080 --> 0:21:21.159
<v Speaker 2>It almost sounds menacing to me. I mean, it's funny,

0:21:21.160 --> 0:21:23.639
<v Speaker 2>but it's also it sounds a bit menacing. I don't know.

0:21:23.720 --> 0:21:25.399
<v Speaker 2>I called on my finger on why I think.

0:21:25.280 --> 0:21:30.760
<v Speaker 1>That really, Oh, Daddy's phone like daddy's dad. There's so many,

0:21:30.920 --> 0:21:33.480
<v Speaker 1>so many meanings, but I hear you with the menacing.

0:21:33.520 --> 0:21:36.320
<v Speaker 1>It's like daddy's phone and he's got the belt.

0:21:38.240 --> 0:21:41.080
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I know. Yeah, I wanted to make a recommendation

0:21:41.119 --> 0:21:42.480
<v Speaker 2>to you. Actually I don't if you come across the

0:21:42.560 --> 0:21:46.440
<v Speaker 2>podcast called Prison Back. It's a British podcast, I'm not

0:21:47.200 --> 0:21:50.320
<v Speaker 2>it's it's it's brilliant, it's it's about I mean, I

0:21:50.359 --> 0:21:52.960
<v Speaker 2>know that sort of. I mean there are literally thousands

0:21:53.040 --> 0:21:57.560
<v Speaker 2>upon thousands of quite sort of mawkish but true crime

0:21:57.640 --> 0:22:00.200
<v Speaker 2>podcasts that are fascinated with this sort of this theme ovious,

0:22:00.240 --> 0:22:02.760
<v Speaker 2>we're talking about prison but like it's a British podcast

0:22:02.760 --> 0:22:06.240
<v Speaker 2>made by UK family about their experience as being the

0:22:06.280 --> 0:22:08.760
<v Speaker 2>family on on the on the outside. So it was

0:22:08.760 --> 0:22:11.040
<v Speaker 2>and all of the weight and emotional baggage and everything

0:22:11.040 --> 0:22:13.200
<v Speaker 2>that goes with that experience that people simply just don't

0:22:13.240 --> 0:22:15.840
<v Speaker 2>think about when a member of the family goes to prison.

0:22:15.880 --> 0:22:19.439
<v Speaker 2>And yeah, I thoroughly recommend it was one of the

0:22:19.440 --> 0:22:20.800
<v Speaker 2>best things I've heard in the last couple of years,

0:22:20.800 --> 0:22:23.840
<v Speaker 2>and I just thought, these stories never get told. The

0:22:23.880 --> 0:22:26.199
<v Speaker 2>people on the outside never get to they don't have

0:22:26.240 --> 0:22:28.800
<v Speaker 2>a voice. Generally, it's always like, oh, what's there's this

0:22:28.880 --> 0:22:30.879
<v Speaker 2>fascination with the other side of things, you know what

0:22:30.880 --> 0:22:31.400
<v Speaker 2>I mean.

0:22:31.800 --> 0:22:34.320
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, for sure. I mean there's a whole lot that

0:22:34.320 --> 0:22:37.800
<v Speaker 1>that that that being you know, the family of someone

0:22:37.840 --> 0:22:41.960
<v Speaker 1>incarcerated entails you really you do time with them. Yeah,

0:22:41.960 --> 0:22:44.399
<v Speaker 1>and there's all kinds of emotions that go along with it.

0:22:44.440 --> 0:22:49.320
<v Speaker 1>There's like there's the the sadness, the powerlessness, the anger,

0:22:49.440 --> 0:22:51.960
<v Speaker 1>the shame, the whole you know. Really it really runs

0:22:52.000 --> 0:22:55.919
<v Speaker 1>the gamut. But yeah, it sucks.

0:22:57.520 --> 0:23:00.760
<v Speaker 2>I mean I would say, like I can imagine, But

0:23:01.000 --> 0:23:03.840
<v Speaker 2>this podcast Prison Backs helped me imagine because it's very

0:23:03.840 --> 0:23:08.000
<v Speaker 2>like empathetic in terms of articulating that range of emotions

0:23:08.040 --> 0:23:11.000
<v Speaker 2>that families experienced when this stuff happens. We talked a

0:23:11.000 --> 0:23:13.639
<v Speaker 2>little bit earlier about how Daddy Tone was actually, in

0:23:13.680 --> 0:23:15.960
<v Speaker 2>spite of that, or parallel to that, was still a

0:23:16.000 --> 0:23:17.720
<v Speaker 2>really fun record to make because you got in the

0:23:17.720 --> 0:23:20.720
<v Speaker 2>studio again with Jack Antonoff, who've worked with before, and

0:23:20.960 --> 0:23:25.280
<v Speaker 2>it actually it does feel like a fun record. I mean,

0:23:25.280 --> 0:23:28.640
<v Speaker 2>it's so groove laden and kind of like and yeah,

0:23:29.160 --> 0:23:32.280
<v Speaker 2>it's it's fun. There's some pretty salty guitar solos on there,

0:23:32.560 --> 0:23:35.320
<v Speaker 2>and it's just really deep. It actually reminds me of

0:23:35.359 --> 0:23:38.000
<v Speaker 2>a record that I absolutely love, which is Childish Gambinos

0:23:38.040 --> 0:23:40.000
<v Speaker 2>Awake My Love from a few years ago. Just in

0:23:40.080 --> 0:23:43.200
<v Speaker 2>terms of that. Somehow it just catches this this this

0:23:43.480 --> 0:23:46.919
<v Speaker 2>energy that transports you to the area that we already

0:23:46.920 --> 0:23:47.760
<v Speaker 2>talked a little bit about.

0:23:48.080 --> 0:23:50.560
<v Speaker 1>The first time I wrote for the record was Somebody

0:23:50.600 --> 0:23:52.439
<v Speaker 1>Like Me, which I just did. I did in my

0:23:52.560 --> 0:23:58.080
<v Speaker 1>studio in Los Angeles, and I was just writing to Ray.

0:23:58.119 --> 0:24:01.760
<v Speaker 1>I didn't have the idea of the record necessarily, and

0:24:02.760 --> 0:24:05.080
<v Speaker 1>so Jack wasn't there for that, and I was just

0:24:05.119 --> 0:24:08.800
<v Speaker 1>like jamming in my studio listen kind of more jazz

0:24:08.840 --> 0:24:12.119
<v Speaker 1>players within the But I came to New York and

0:24:12.160 --> 0:24:15.120
<v Speaker 1>we were walking into Electric Lady Studios and I said

0:24:15.119 --> 0:24:16.640
<v Speaker 1>to Jack, like, yeah, I just kind of want to

0:24:16.680 --> 0:24:18.840
<v Speaker 1>make this like down and out downtown kind of thing.

0:24:19.240 --> 0:24:21.000
<v Speaker 1>So we go in and I had this song on

0:24:21.000 --> 0:24:24.000
<v Speaker 1>the holiday party that I was working on, and Jack

0:24:24.080 --> 0:24:27.639
<v Speaker 1>started playing Warlitzer and I just picked up an acoustic

0:24:27.680 --> 0:24:30.600
<v Speaker 1>guitar and it just the song kind of came to life.

0:24:31.520 --> 0:24:34.040
<v Speaker 1>Just in that session, I had my friend Michael Lindhardt,

0:24:34.040 --> 0:24:37.520
<v Speaker 1>who actually is the MD for Steely Dan commited warns

0:24:37.560 --> 0:24:40.840
<v Speaker 1>on it and it was just like, oh, this is it,

0:24:41.320 --> 0:24:44.240
<v Speaker 1>Like this is the vibe and we don't have to

0:24:44.320 --> 0:24:47.320
<v Speaker 1>overthink it. You know. It's like for a long time

0:24:47.680 --> 0:24:51.360
<v Speaker 1>I didn't want guitars to sound like guitars where I

0:24:51.400 --> 0:24:56.000
<v Speaker 1>wanted to be just kind of more abstract with sounds.

0:24:56.000 --> 0:24:59.159
<v Speaker 1>But in this case, they're really they're literal sounds. You

0:24:59.160 --> 0:25:03.520
<v Speaker 1>could make sure the instruments they're wooden. It's like wood

0:25:03.600 --> 0:25:06.480
<v Speaker 1>and leather kind of record.

0:25:07.000 --> 0:25:12.640
<v Speaker 2>It's earthy. Yeah, it feels earthy. Yeah, really really like acoustic. Yeah.

0:25:12.680 --> 0:25:16.680
<v Speaker 1>And for me it comes from a lower place and

0:25:16.840 --> 0:25:20.560
<v Speaker 1>my body, you know, for me it comes from like,

0:25:21.400 --> 0:25:26.080
<v Speaker 1>you know, guts and pelvis and abdomen area. It just

0:25:26.200 --> 0:25:29.800
<v Speaker 1>is a different you know, it's a different, different place.

0:25:30.160 --> 0:25:32.000
<v Speaker 2>I think the world it's there is a very underrated

0:25:32.000 --> 0:25:34.440
<v Speaker 2>instrument as well is that sits on there as well.

0:25:35.200 --> 0:25:35.560
<v Speaker 2>It sounds.

0:25:35.760 --> 0:25:38.359
<v Speaker 1>It's an electric it's a coral electric citar guitar.

0:25:38.880 --> 0:25:40.320
<v Speaker 2>It sounds, it sounds brilliant.

0:25:40.720 --> 0:25:41.160
<v Speaker 1>Thank you.

0:25:41.600 --> 0:25:43.439
<v Speaker 2>I was so My favorite track on the album is

0:25:43.480 --> 0:25:47.200
<v Speaker 2>Down and it just it really conjures some It makes

0:25:47.200 --> 0:25:50.159
<v Speaker 2>me want to grow like a handlebar mustache and then

0:25:50.200 --> 0:25:52.960
<v Speaker 2>slide across some carbonnets. It's just yeah, so.

0:25:54.359 --> 0:25:57.560
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. The thing with the sitar guitar is a song

0:25:57.720 --> 0:26:01.520
<v Speaker 1>like down treated a different way a would have been

0:26:02.320 --> 0:26:04.440
<v Speaker 1>could have been like new metal, you know what I mean,

0:26:07.040 --> 0:26:09.760
<v Speaker 1>you know, but and I for a second, I kind

0:26:09.760 --> 0:26:17.200
<v Speaker 1>of tried it with those you know that stuff being

0:26:17.320 --> 0:26:22.600
<v Speaker 1>like guitar, and then it just was all feeling too

0:26:23.720 --> 0:26:27.520
<v Speaker 1>heavy and it needed, like it needs like levity because

0:26:27.840 --> 0:26:31.400
<v Speaker 1>you're basically saying like if I ever see you, I'll

0:26:32.840 --> 0:26:36.800
<v Speaker 1>like I will ruin you. So it doesn't need uh,

0:26:37.119 --> 0:26:41.240
<v Speaker 1>doesn't need guitars doubling down you. You end up kind

0:26:41.240 --> 0:26:44.840
<v Speaker 1>of sounding again, it goes into like new metal territories.

0:26:44.840 --> 0:26:48.119
<v Speaker 1>So if you throw in the sitar guitar, it has

0:26:48.160 --> 0:26:51.720
<v Speaker 1>it has the brightness and a little kind of it's

0:26:51.760 --> 0:26:54.760
<v Speaker 1>like a little brittle and langy, but it has like

0:26:54.800 --> 0:26:59.000
<v Speaker 1>a levity to it that the distorted guitar definitely does not.

0:26:59.440 --> 0:27:02.040
<v Speaker 2>And specific reason makes me like just in terms of

0:27:02.720 --> 0:27:06.760
<v Speaker 2>vision countries that like the Beastie Boys, like Sabotage video

0:27:06.880 --> 0:27:09.159
<v Speaker 2>or something, I just really you know, completely separate, but

0:27:09.200 --> 0:27:10.879
<v Speaker 2>I love that. Well, I'm interesting to notice that, Like,

0:27:10.920 --> 0:27:12.639
<v Speaker 2>I think like a lot of the you said that

0:27:12.720 --> 0:27:14.600
<v Speaker 2>some of the lot of the material on the record

0:27:14.760 --> 0:27:17.240
<v Speaker 2>was first takes, So like, how did that feel?

0:27:17.480 --> 0:27:20.359
<v Speaker 1>Oh, I shouldn't have said that. I mean, okay, yeah,

0:27:20.440 --> 0:27:24.280
<v Speaker 1>that's something I'm rue to this day. What I mean

0:27:24.400 --> 0:27:26.320
<v Speaker 1>is that, I mean there are a couple of first

0:27:26.359 --> 0:27:29.080
<v Speaker 1>take vocals on there, like you know, the vocal and

0:27:29.240 --> 0:27:33.280
<v Speaker 1>down and out Downtown. I was like writing the lyrics

0:27:33.359 --> 0:27:37.000
<v Speaker 1>as I'm singing it and trying things out, and it

0:27:37.160 --> 0:27:40.479
<v Speaker 1>ended up that with some of the phrasing and stuff,

0:27:40.480 --> 0:27:43.560
<v Speaker 1>I just couldn't beat the first take. And it's definitely

0:27:43.640 --> 0:27:47.000
<v Speaker 1>like jamming, you know. It's definitely like, oh we play

0:27:47.040 --> 0:27:51.040
<v Speaker 1>through this song and see what's what. And same with

0:27:52.040 --> 0:27:56.720
<v Speaker 1>jacklineas bass takes and stuff. There's some things that were like, oh, yeah,

0:27:56.800 --> 0:27:59.879
<v Speaker 1>that's first thought, best thought, but no it's not. It

0:28:00.160 --> 0:28:03.320
<v Speaker 1>wasn't a it's not a record of like okay, well

0:28:03.320 --> 0:28:05.440
<v Speaker 1>we did it once and now we're you know, I

0:28:05.880 --> 0:28:09.159
<v Speaker 1>wasn't that. What I meant is it's all just performed.

0:28:09.320 --> 0:28:14.560
<v Speaker 1>It's not really a big, crazy production in that kind

0:28:14.560 --> 0:28:16.119
<v Speaker 1>of modern sense.

0:28:16.560 --> 0:28:18.920
<v Speaker 2>You've always been a collaborative artist throughout your career, from

0:28:19.080 --> 0:28:23.360
<v Speaker 2>David Byrne to Nirvana and Taylor Swift and Paul McCartney. Recently,

0:28:23.359 --> 0:28:25.160
<v Speaker 2>you created a version of Women and Wives for Paul

0:28:25.200 --> 0:28:29.720
<v Speaker 2>McCartney's Three Reimagined What goes through a person's mind when

0:28:30.040 --> 0:28:32.400
<v Speaker 2>you shoot an email off to knowing that the next

0:28:32.400 --> 0:28:34.439
<v Speaker 2>pair of ears it's going to hit those of an

0:28:34.480 --> 0:28:37.320
<v Speaker 2>actual beatle? Like how did that feel when you created

0:28:37.359 --> 0:28:39.200
<v Speaker 2>your version and you're like, Okay, the next person I

0:28:39.320 --> 0:28:39.760
<v Speaker 2>might hear this.

0:28:41.480 --> 0:28:48.720
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I'll tell you that. I did probably nine versions. Yeah, easily.

0:28:48.760 --> 0:28:49.360
<v Speaker 2>I tried this.

0:28:49.560 --> 0:28:52.960
<v Speaker 1>I tried that here and there with it before I

0:28:53.040 --> 0:28:56.360
<v Speaker 1>ended up where I ended up. I got the stems

0:28:56.600 --> 0:29:00.840
<v Speaker 1>from him, from his team, you know, and there was

0:29:01.160 --> 0:29:06.440
<v Speaker 1>gotten maybe four tracks is his vocal, a bass, a piano,

0:29:06.960 --> 0:29:10.400
<v Speaker 1>and drums. And I was like, okay, how can I

0:29:10.520 --> 0:29:16.120
<v Speaker 1>do this song justice, just do it in a different way.

0:29:16.920 --> 0:29:21.040
<v Speaker 1>And I listened to his vocal take I mean easily,

0:29:21.080 --> 0:29:24.520
<v Speaker 1>one hundred times easy, and every time I heard it,

0:29:24.560 --> 0:29:27.040
<v Speaker 1>I was like, Oh, this gets deeper and richer and

0:29:27.320 --> 0:29:30.000
<v Speaker 1>more powerful, means something more to me every time, And

0:29:30.040 --> 0:29:34.440
<v Speaker 1>I think that that's like, what incredible transcendence? What music.

0:29:35.560 --> 0:29:37.760
<v Speaker 1>This is where you want to be with music, where

0:29:37.760 --> 0:29:40.959
<v Speaker 1>every time you listen to it, you get something from it.

0:29:41.080 --> 0:29:44.000
<v Speaker 1>And there's a lot of music that that kind of

0:29:44.040 --> 0:29:49.400
<v Speaker 1>takes something from you, honestly, and his just absolutely gives

0:29:49.400 --> 0:29:53.080
<v Speaker 1>and gives and gives. So anyway, I did it all

0:29:53.400 --> 0:29:57.280
<v Speaker 1>just in my studio and tried to put a guitar

0:29:57.320 --> 0:30:00.400
<v Speaker 1>solo on there that would make Paul proud and you

0:30:00.440 --> 0:30:00.800
<v Speaker 1>know all.

0:30:00.720 --> 0:30:04.520
<v Speaker 2>This, Yeah, talk about like scrambling your brain when you

0:30:04.560 --> 0:30:07.240
<v Speaker 2>know that, Yeah, to go to deliver this to pul McCarthy.

0:30:07.440 --> 0:30:12.720
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah. So I finished it up and sent off

0:30:12.720 --> 0:30:15.560
<v Speaker 1>the master version and I got a call from him,

0:30:15.720 --> 0:30:18.160
<v Speaker 1>but you know a few months later saying that he

0:30:18.240 --> 0:30:20.960
<v Speaker 1>really liked it, and he was so nice, and he

0:30:21.040 --> 0:30:25.200
<v Speaker 1>sounded just like Paul McCartney, you know, and he was

0:30:25.280 --> 0:30:28.160
<v Speaker 1>just lovely and he talked about his process with making

0:30:28.160 --> 0:30:31.000
<v Speaker 1>the record and how excited he was about the other

0:30:31.080 --> 0:30:36.760
<v Speaker 1>collaborations and asked if I had done the backup singing.

0:30:36.840 --> 0:30:38.800
<v Speaker 1>I said yep, And he asked if I did the

0:30:38.840 --> 0:30:40.760
<v Speaker 1>guitar solo, and I said yep, And then I said

0:30:40.800 --> 0:30:46.280
<v Speaker 1>I did it all. Paul kind of vaguely regret that,

0:30:46.320 --> 0:30:50.400
<v Speaker 1>but but yeah, he was just as lovely as could be.

0:30:51.160 --> 0:30:54.720
<v Speaker 1>And then when at the end of the conversation, I

0:30:54.800 --> 0:30:56.720
<v Speaker 1>just remembered he said, it's it's a great thing. We

0:30:56.760 --> 0:30:59.520
<v Speaker 1>get to do this music thing, right, And I said, yes, yes,

0:30:59.560 --> 0:31:01.800
<v Speaker 1>fall it is. And if you've fet out on the

0:31:02.200 --> 0:31:06.440
<v Speaker 1>amount of hours that people have spent with music that

0:31:06.520 --> 0:31:10.880
<v Speaker 1>he has made, and these lifetimes and lifetimes and lifetimes

0:31:11.240 --> 0:31:17.800
<v Speaker 1>of just like joy and emotion and everything that he's

0:31:17.840 --> 0:31:22.520
<v Speaker 1>given to people, it's really really amazing. Not all music

0:31:22.600 --> 0:31:26.240
<v Speaker 1>gives you something. A lot of music takes it away. Personally,

0:31:26.280 --> 0:31:26.960
<v Speaker 1>I find like.

0:31:26.920 --> 0:31:31.360
<v Speaker 2>Oh, no, music that makes you you work hard or

0:31:31.680 --> 0:31:34.680
<v Speaker 2>take something from you. You mean, can you explain that

0:31:34.720 --> 0:31:35.239
<v Speaker 2>to you a bit more?

0:31:35.280 --> 0:31:38.440
<v Speaker 1>Well, I just seem like I just mean it's not

0:31:38.520 --> 0:31:40.360
<v Speaker 1>music that I seek out to listen to. I think

0:31:40.360 --> 0:31:43.880
<v Speaker 1>it's music that just happens like more more times than not.

0:31:44.000 --> 0:31:46.560
<v Speaker 1>I'm just damning something to be like, oh, remind me

0:31:46.640 --> 0:31:49.680
<v Speaker 1>never to this on and this is you're getting the

0:31:49.800 --> 0:31:53.240
<v Speaker 1>tired of me? Sorry, but yeah, no, where You're just like,

0:31:53.280 --> 0:31:56.479
<v Speaker 1>I don't this takes more energy for me to listen

0:31:56.520 --> 0:31:59.560
<v Speaker 1>to it than it does then it gives me in

0:31:59.600 --> 0:32:02.560
<v Speaker 1>the act listening. That's what I that's.

0:32:02.400 --> 0:32:05.560
<v Speaker 2>What I mean, You're involvement with them. Sleeza Kinney's record

0:32:05.600 --> 0:32:08.560
<v Speaker 2>The Censeer Won't Hold a couple of years ago, another

0:32:08.600 --> 0:32:10.480
<v Speaker 2>album that you've been involved with that I thought it

0:32:10.520 --> 0:32:14.560
<v Speaker 2>was fantastic. How was it that experience of producing that record.

0:32:14.800 --> 0:32:17.360
<v Speaker 2>Did it give you a taste of wanting to continue

0:32:17.400 --> 0:32:20.160
<v Speaker 2>doing that kind of thing, to work in that way

0:32:20.240 --> 0:32:22.040
<v Speaker 2>with with with other artists.

0:32:22.440 --> 0:32:26.040
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean I loved save, been a huge fan

0:32:26.160 --> 0:32:30.400
<v Speaker 1>since I was a teen, and Carrie's my bestie, so

0:32:30.800 --> 0:32:33.760
<v Speaker 1>like it was, it was so fun. Yeah, the process

0:32:33.880 --> 0:32:38.200
<v Speaker 1>was really it was really, really, really fun. I have

0:32:38.280 --> 0:32:41.400
<v Speaker 1>to say Carrie and Koran, who are the writers in

0:32:41.520 --> 0:32:46.080
<v Speaker 1>Sleater Kinney. Janet was the drummer, but she's not a writer.

0:32:47.040 --> 0:32:51.280
<v Speaker 1>So Carrie and Koran just wrote their wrote their asses

0:32:51.320 --> 0:32:56.920
<v Speaker 1>off and were they wanted to do something different. They

0:32:56.960 --> 0:33:00.240
<v Speaker 1>wanted to do something that they were just kind of

0:33:00.280 --> 0:33:02.800
<v Speaker 1>saying they're old tools. Just they were tired of their

0:33:02.840 --> 0:33:06.200
<v Speaker 1>old tools. They wanted to do something else. So we just, yeah,

0:33:06.280 --> 0:33:09.440
<v Speaker 1>we just had a lot of fun making the record.

0:33:09.720 --> 0:33:13.120
<v Speaker 2>We already mentioned or I mentioned Black Medy in the podcast.

0:33:13.160 --> 0:33:14.560
<v Speaker 2>I know that you're a fan of that band. We

0:33:14.640 --> 0:33:18.080
<v Speaker 2>love back. I love Black Men Social amazing band. When

0:33:18.120 --> 0:33:19.760
<v Speaker 2>and where do you do you love listening to Black

0:33:19.760 --> 0:33:22.640
<v Speaker 2>MIDI and you have kind of nice to see that

0:33:22.680 --> 0:33:25.360
<v Speaker 2>band live yet because they're sort of stunning live band.

0:33:25.520 --> 0:33:28.360
<v Speaker 1>Oh I got there. I mean I've seen I've seen

0:33:28.600 --> 0:33:33.000
<v Speaker 1>YouTube and they're great, but no, I've not. I've not

0:33:33.040 --> 0:33:34.840
<v Speaker 1>had a chance to see them live yet. I think

0:33:35.280 --> 0:33:37.680
<v Speaker 1>obviously we've been kind of out of commission in terms

0:33:37.720 --> 0:33:41.240
<v Speaker 1>of live music for a minute. So but I love

0:33:41.280 --> 0:33:44.800
<v Speaker 1>to listen to Black Midy in my car and trying

0:33:44.880 --> 0:33:48.160
<v Speaker 1>to fans listening to Black Mity it like threads the

0:33:48.240 --> 0:33:55.240
<v Speaker 1>Needles so so well. It's creepy and fucked up angular

0:33:55.400 --> 0:33:59.840
<v Speaker 1>but like not proggy in a way that is merely athletic.

0:34:00.160 --> 0:34:03.520
<v Speaker 1>That's like, you know, intentionally proggy. The drummers so sick.

0:34:03.600 --> 0:34:06.520
<v Speaker 1>It's just I love Black METI. I'm excited for the

0:34:06.880 --> 0:34:07.920
<v Speaker 1>new stuff that just came out.

0:34:07.960 --> 0:34:10.000
<v Speaker 2>To final question I was gonna ask you, is I

0:34:10.160 --> 0:34:12.120
<v Speaker 2>subscribe to a record club who send me like a

0:34:12.120 --> 0:34:14.840
<v Speaker 2>mystery piece of vineyl every month. When they send a record,

0:34:14.840 --> 0:34:17.000
<v Speaker 2>they send like a cocktail recipe with it as well,

0:34:17.200 --> 0:34:18.960
<v Speaker 2>And I just wondered if they were to send me

0:34:19.040 --> 0:34:21.920
<v Speaker 2>Daddy's home. What would you how would you best enjoy

0:34:21.960 --> 0:34:23.799
<v Speaker 2>that record? What would you sit down and enjoy that

0:34:23.840 --> 0:34:26.320
<v Speaker 2>record with? In terms of the refreshing.

0:34:25.880 --> 0:34:31.400
<v Speaker 1>Beverage, I'd say tequila neat nice a repersad or to

0:34:31.480 --> 0:34:33.719
<v Speaker 1>quiala neat. If it tastes good, you can sip it,

0:34:33.960 --> 0:34:37.320
<v Speaker 1>good quality tequila neat. That's what I think.

0:34:39.400 --> 0:34:43.040
<v Speaker 2>To find previous episodes of Midnight Chats, simply search your

0:34:43.080 --> 0:34:46.400
<v Speaker 2>podcast app. Don't forget to hit follow or subscribe to

0:34:46.480 --> 0:34:50.040
<v Speaker 2>keep up as they're published every week at midnight. For

0:34:50.080 --> 0:34:52.840
<v Speaker 2>more information on the music magazine that makes this series,

0:34:53.000 --> 0:34:56.200
<v Speaker 2>visit Loud and Quiet dot com.

0:34:56.400 --> 0:34:57.600
<v Speaker 1>Anyway, good night,