WEBVTT - Are you ready for a neo-evolution? 0:00:03.800 --> 0:00:06.680 Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind from how Stuff 0:00:06.680 --> 0:00:16.919 Works dot com. Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. 0:00:16.960 --> 0:00:20.079 My name is Robert Lamb and I'm Julie Douglas. And 0:00:20.120 --> 0:00:23.159 we're looking at the future again. That's weird. It's like 0:00:23.200 --> 0:00:26.400 we're letting our futurist flag fly again. Yeah, well we 0:00:26.440 --> 0:00:29.200 have to. I mean that we're talking about going to 0:00:29.280 --> 0:00:31.760 the edge of what's possible, and the edge of what's 0:00:31.760 --> 0:00:33.919 possible generally lines up with the edge of what has 0:00:33.960 --> 0:00:36.320 happened and what's going to happen in the future. So 0:00:36.360 --> 0:00:38.479 I have a question for you. Yes, are you ready 0:00:38.640 --> 0:00:41.680 for the neo evolution? I don't know, that's a really 0:00:41.680 --> 0:00:44.080 intimidating question. Yeah, especially when I say it like that. Huh. 0:00:44.080 --> 0:00:46.640 I would probably yell ya if it was like, you know, 0:00:46.760 --> 0:00:48.680 like a DJ yelling it, because it sounds like the 0:00:48.760 --> 0:00:51.320 kind of thing you would hear, like, are you ready? Yeah? 0:00:51.600 --> 0:00:53.800 Are you ready for the neo evolution? And then everybody 0:00:53.800 --> 0:00:56.200 goes yeah, but yeah, are the Beatles? Yeah? Are you 0:00:56.240 --> 0:01:01.600 ready for evlution? All right, so obviously we're gonna be 0:01:01.680 --> 0:01:06.920 talking about evolution today, specifically new evolution as defined by 0:01:07.240 --> 0:01:10.160 one guy. But before we get to that, let's talk 0:01:10.200 --> 0:01:13.720 a little bit about what is evolution. Yeah, let's go 0:01:13.760 --> 0:01:16.920 ahead and hammer this out, um. And I'm drawing from 0:01:17.120 --> 0:01:20.480 how Stuff Works own article how Evolution Works, which is 0:01:20.520 --> 0:01:24.640 a great read, especially if you don't understand evolution, or 0:01:24.680 --> 0:01:27.480 if you find yourself in the familiar situation of thinking 0:01:27.520 --> 0:01:31.200 you understand something that is so talked about, but but 0:01:31.240 --> 0:01:33.760 you're not really sure on the the finer points of it. 0:01:34.160 --> 0:01:36.400 It lays it out really nicely, like most How Stuff 0:01:36.400 --> 0:01:40.080 Works articles handle a topic, but basically it breaks down 0:01:40.080 --> 0:01:43.200 to three essential parts. First part is that it's possible 0:01:43.360 --> 0:01:46.720 for the DNA of an organism to occasionally change or mutate, 0:01:47.120 --> 0:01:49.920 And a mutation changes the DNA of an organism in 0:01:49.960 --> 0:01:52.920 a way that affects its offspring, either immediately or several 0:01:52.960 --> 0:01:56.920 generations down the line. So that's the first condition, right. 0:01:57.480 --> 0:02:00.360 The second one, the change brought about by a mute patient, 0:02:00.480 --> 0:02:04.160 is either beneficial, harmful, or neutral. I think I've hammered 0:02:04.160 --> 0:02:08.240 on this before, but the whole the word de evolved 0:02:08.320 --> 0:02:10.959 or devolved, like the idea that oh in a post 0:02:11.000 --> 0:02:14.560 apocalyptic movie, people devolved in the monsters and Chud's and 0:02:14.600 --> 0:02:18.520 they did not go backward. Right, there's evolution doesn't go backwards. 0:02:18.560 --> 0:02:25.240 Evolution always goes forward. It's possible cases very rare. But yeah, 0:02:25.240 --> 0:02:28.840 but but but evolution does. But no, evolution doesn't really 0:02:28.880 --> 0:02:31.799 go backwards. It's like it'll it's it's altering, but it's 0:02:31.840 --> 0:02:34.760 it's moving forward like it's well for adaptation is what 0:02:34.760 --> 0:02:37.919 I'm talking. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's moving forward and adapting, 0:02:39.280 --> 0:02:41.480 all right. So, yeah, it can be beneficial, it can 0:02:41.480 --> 0:02:44.200 be harmful, it can be neutral. It's still evolution. If 0:02:44.200 --> 0:02:46.880 the change is harmful, then it's unlikely that the offspring 0:02:46.919 --> 0:02:50.760 will survive to reproduce, so the mutation dies and goes nowhere. 0:02:51.120 --> 0:02:53.360 If the change is beneficial, then it's likely that the 0:02:53.400 --> 0:02:56.120 offspring will do better than the offspring uh, then the 0:02:56.120 --> 0:03:00.560 other offspring, and it will reproduce more and and through reproduction, 0:03:00.600 --> 0:03:04.240 the beneficial mutation spreads and eventually becomes dominant and the 0:03:04.280 --> 0:03:07.880 bad mutations disappear. Um all right. And the third thing 0:03:08.080 --> 0:03:11.280 is is as mutations occur and spread over long periods 0:03:11.320 --> 0:03:14.400 of time, they cause new species to form. So over 0:03:14.440 --> 0:03:17.520 the course of millions of years, the process of mutation 0:03:17.560 --> 0:03:20.680 and natural selection, which we cover in the first two points, 0:03:20.880 --> 0:03:23.640 have created every single species that we have in the 0:03:23.639 --> 0:03:27.320 world today, from the simplest bacteria to you know, elephants 0:03:27.320 --> 0:03:31.040 and dogs and cats and reptiles. And yeah, yeah, I 0:03:31.040 --> 0:03:33.799 mean we're talking about his variation, selection and heredity, right 0:03:34.240 --> 0:03:36.640 and um and you think about it, even with us, 0:03:36.720 --> 0:03:38.960 there are about twenty five species of hominids that came 0:03:39.000 --> 0:03:43.160 before us, right, and we just happened to have the 0:03:43.240 --> 0:03:47.000 ability to adapt to our environment. Um and and we 0:03:47.040 --> 0:03:50.280 have done so pretty successfully. But there is a medical 0:03:50.280 --> 0:03:53.000 ethicis named Harvey Fineberg. He has a talk on ted 0:03:53.080 --> 0:03:54.800 dot com and it's called are We Ready for a 0:03:54.800 --> 0:03:58.600 New Evolution? And he has talked about this this specific 0:03:59.240 --> 0:04:03.240 conditions for us evolving as humans, not necessarily talking about 0:04:03.240 --> 0:04:06.040 our animals or bacteria or anything else. Um. And he 0:04:06.080 --> 0:04:09.360 wants to talk really about what our future might hold 0:04:09.360 --> 0:04:11.440 in terms of evolution. He says that there are three 0:04:11.520 --> 0:04:14.640 different ways we could go. Yeah, because it basically comes 0:04:14.640 --> 0:04:18.240 down to these three key facts of evolution that we discussed, 0:04:19.000 --> 0:04:22.000 whether or not they're still relevant in modern human culture 0:04:22.480 --> 0:04:25.080 or if we've managed to sort of elbow them out 0:04:25.120 --> 0:04:29.920 of the conversation. Yeah. So, um, Like, one basic idea 0:04:30.120 --> 0:04:34.400 is if if we have through medicine managed to preserve 0:04:34.440 --> 0:04:37.200 a lot of genes that would otherwise otherwise be selected out, 0:04:37.240 --> 0:04:41.720 in other words, harmful mutations or or or just traits 0:04:41.760 --> 0:04:44.479 that would that we would eventually improve upon and and 0:04:44.560 --> 0:04:48.039 would be again elbowed out of the evolutionary conversation. Yeah, 0:04:48.040 --> 0:04:51.120 he's talking about the possibility that we might not evolve anymore, 0:04:51.200 --> 0:04:53.800 right because as you say, we have, we've sort of 0:04:53.800 --> 0:04:57.600 tinkered enough that we've, um, we've sort of flatlining as 0:04:57.600 --> 0:05:00.960 a species, right right, Um. And then he's also talking 0:05:00.960 --> 0:05:04.200 about how we have made our environment adapt to us 0:05:04.320 --> 0:05:07.320 rather than us adapt to it. Right. It's the idea 0:05:07.360 --> 0:05:09.240 that it's like, oh, the world's getting hot, or let's 0:05:09.440 --> 0:05:11.800 create air conditioning or let's you know, we even in 0:05:11.800 --> 0:05:16.840 our more drastic, hilarious and tragic examples where we talk 0:05:16.880 --> 0:05:22.919 about geoengineering or planet hacking, things like like like you know, 0:05:22.960 --> 0:05:27.520 tinkering with the atmosphere to reverse global climate changes, right, right, 0:05:27.880 --> 0:05:30.279 even with China and the Olympics, right when they were 0:05:30.279 --> 0:05:34.120 trying to change the weather by shooting. Um was it 0:05:34.160 --> 0:05:37.120 wasn't missiles, but it was some sort of munition up 0:05:37.160 --> 0:05:39.520 into the air that would make it rain. So yes, 0:05:39.600 --> 0:05:45.159 we're we're um, we're manipulating our our environment all the time, right, um. 0:05:45.279 --> 0:05:48.240 And then uh. He also says that we're so interspersed 0:05:48.279 --> 0:05:51.720 that there's very little isolation and populations now that would 0:05:51.720 --> 0:05:54.200 allow for the conditions of evolution. It's kind of like 0:05:54.240 --> 0:05:57.320 a Richie Rich scenario or something like the kid who 0:05:57.320 --> 0:06:00.719 has everything and doesn't have to grow up and maybe 0:06:00.720 --> 0:06:04.560 confusing involve and grow up arrested development as as sort 0:06:04.600 --> 0:06:07.280 of yeah, I guess you know. It's Um, it's the 0:06:07.320 --> 0:06:09.039 idea that, no, we don't have to adapt to the 0:06:09.040 --> 0:06:11.480 world around us because the world around us doesn't touch us. 0:06:11.480 --> 0:06:14.920 We're insulated in this bubble Umchi rich. Yeah, and it 0:06:14.920 --> 0:06:16.520 doesn't matter. You know. It's like I'm not that smart, 0:06:16.560 --> 0:06:18.159 but I got all this money, right, so you know, 0:06:18.160 --> 0:06:20.240 I'm good to go, right. And then the second thing 0:06:20.360 --> 0:06:22.240 he talks about this, the second route we could take 0:06:22.400 --> 0:06:25.039 is just the traditional evolution. In other words, evolution is 0:06:25.040 --> 0:06:28.120 a juggernaut. You cannot stop it in somewhere or another. 0:06:28.200 --> 0:06:30.800 It's going to continue. And he says, particularly if we 0:06:30.880 --> 0:06:34.360 colonize planets, right, yeah, we're sending people to other plant 0:06:34.400 --> 0:06:36.280 and of course we could really go off in a 0:06:36.279 --> 0:06:38.919 tangent here. But instead we'll just say see the episode 0:06:39.320 --> 0:06:42.599 titled the Werewolf Principle that we did about adapting humans 0:06:42.600 --> 0:06:44.839 for space, because yeah, there's this whole idea as we 0:06:44.920 --> 0:06:49.000 send people out to colonize distant worlds. We certainly have 0:06:49.160 --> 0:06:53.080 the the sci fi storybook idea of terraforming planet to 0:06:53.080 --> 0:06:55.080 make it just like Earth, which is it, which is 0:06:55.120 --> 0:06:57.560 again ties back into that hole. Let's change an environment 0:06:57.600 --> 0:07:01.600 to fit us, But realistically there's going to be at 0:07:01.640 --> 0:07:04.279 least a little us changing to fit that environment, whether 0:07:04.320 --> 0:07:06.440 we want it to happen or not. Right, And he's saying, like, 0:07:06.640 --> 0:07:08.280 you know, obviously if we tried to call anize Mars 0:07:08.320 --> 0:07:10.560 for example, which you know, this is what we've been 0:07:10.560 --> 0:07:14.040 proccupied with a lot in terms of um, you know, 0:07:14.160 --> 0:07:17.320 science technology. Um, you know, those are the conditions. You've 0:07:17.360 --> 0:07:20.480 got the isolation, you have this environment that is new 0:07:20.520 --> 0:07:22.640 to us, so you know you'd have to evolve in 0:07:22.680 --> 0:07:25.360 someone like and at the very basic level, if there 0:07:25.360 --> 0:07:30.920 were minimum physical requirements to colonize another planet, you're automatically 0:07:30.920 --> 0:07:35.200 selecting for those minimum requirements. Yeah, yeah, absolutely right. And 0:07:35.240 --> 0:07:37.000 then the big one, which is obviously the one that 0:07:37.040 --> 0:07:40.760 he's very interested in talking about is called new evolution, yes, 0:07:41.160 --> 0:07:42.800 which we are going to get to right after this 0:07:42.880 --> 0:07:50.720 quick break. This presentation is brought to you by Intel 0:07:50.880 --> 0:07:57.960 sponsors of Tomorrow. All Right, we're back and we're ready 0:07:58.000 --> 0:08:01.480 for the neo evolution. Okay, we are finally ready. Let 0:08:01.520 --> 0:08:06.520 the evolution begin. All right? What is he talking about? 0:08:06.560 --> 0:08:09.480 This guy? That's hard you fine, Bert. He's talking about 0:08:09.480 --> 0:08:13.120 new evolution as being UM guided and chosen by us. 0:08:13.160 --> 0:08:15.560 So what he's saying is that we are at a 0:08:15.600 --> 0:08:19.240 point technologically where we can begin to tinker with our 0:08:19.240 --> 0:08:23.080 own genes and select for ourselves, so we no longer 0:08:23.120 --> 0:08:26.440 need this randomness. We we can sit there and say, okay, 0:08:27.320 --> 0:08:31.440 self directed evolution, let's do this. Um. And he's even saying, 0:08:31.440 --> 0:08:33.520 you can see this in very basic ways, where people 0:08:33.520 --> 0:08:37.000 are choosing to have more females than males. Right because 0:08:37.040 --> 0:08:38.760 we know we can do this, we can choose the 0:08:38.760 --> 0:08:42.120 gender of a child. Um. And he's saying, like, let's 0:08:42.200 --> 0:08:44.559 let's look at this in a more specific way. Let's 0:08:44.559 --> 0:08:47.679 look at genetic changes. Let's talk about taking out diseases 0:08:47.679 --> 0:08:50.280 like diabetes and cancer in your genes so that your 0:08:50.360 --> 0:08:54.640 children's genes could be a better, a little bit more 0:08:55.200 --> 0:08:58.800 fit for their environment, um they would be healthier. And 0:08:58.840 --> 0:09:01.720 then he's talking about something called the one thousand dollar 0:09:01.880 --> 0:09:05.440 human genome, which I think is really an interesting concept. 0:09:05.559 --> 0:09:08.320 We all know about the Human Genome project. This was 0:09:08.880 --> 0:09:12.800 like a twelve year project UM two point seven billion 0:09:12.840 --> 0:09:16.880 dollars and they were able to um decode the human 0:09:16.920 --> 0:09:20.240 genome and it's had huge implications all over the place. 0:09:20.840 --> 0:09:23.760 But he's saying that today today you can have a 0:09:23.800 --> 0:09:26.640 complete sequence of the three billion base payers of the 0:09:26.679 --> 0:09:30.440 human genome for just twenty dollars in one week. I mean, 0:09:30.600 --> 0:09:33.160 you're talking about the comparison there. And this is what 0:09:33.160 --> 0:09:36.080 we're seeing here is that technology, just like your TV right, 0:09:36.120 --> 0:09:39.000 becomes cheaper over the years. So what he's saying basically 0:09:39.200 --> 0:09:41.240 is and no time at all, the costs will be 0:09:41.280 --> 0:09:43.480 down to a thousand dollars. You can sequence your own 0:09:43.520 --> 0:09:46.800 human genome, and then after that pretty much becomes available 0:09:46.840 --> 0:09:49.720 to anyone. So I can go in sequence my human 0:09:49.760 --> 0:09:53.720 genome and or my genome and see what might be 0:09:53.800 --> 0:09:56.840 in my children's future or what I might even be 0:09:56.920 --> 0:09:59.920 susceptible to and start to tinker with that. Now it's 0:10:00.040 --> 0:10:03.720 or to treat that those diseases now, which is really interesting. 0:10:03.720 --> 0:10:05.360 So this is what he's talking about in terms of 0:10:05.440 --> 0:10:12.040 neo evolution, is that we are genetically driving the ship 0:10:12.120 --> 0:10:15.120 here rather than nature. Right, we are taking the steering 0:10:15.160 --> 0:10:18.080 wheel away from natural selection and all these other properties. 0:10:18.280 --> 0:10:23.240 Not to personify evolution done in the past a little bit, 0:10:23.240 --> 0:10:25.720 just sort of in the in the name of storytelling. Well, 0:10:25.800 --> 0:10:28.760 you know, metaphors help us understand, right, so at least 0:10:28.760 --> 0:10:31.359 it does for me. Um. So he's saying that technology 0:10:31.400 --> 0:10:34.280 can make this happen. He's talking about doctors Francis Arnold 0:10:34.280 --> 0:10:37.880 and Willem Stemmer and the fact that they have been 0:10:37.920 --> 0:10:42.120 able to create desirable properties in proteins and cells. And 0:10:42.160 --> 0:10:45.560 this again is this directed evolution, um, and which they 0:10:45.600 --> 0:10:49.400 synthetically harness the power of natural selection to evolve proteins 0:10:49.559 --> 0:10:54.320 or rna to again create desirable properties not found in nature. 0:10:55.000 --> 0:10:58.080 And then he points to another person named Shinya Yamanaka, 0:10:58.240 --> 0:11:00.800 who in two thousand and seven discover how to tinker 0:11:00.880 --> 0:11:03.760 with human skin cells so that they behave like embryonic 0:11:03.840 --> 0:11:07.360 stem cells. This is huge because that could potentially morph 0:11:07.480 --> 0:11:10.000 into things like heart and nerve cells. You could repel 0:11:10.200 --> 0:11:13.880 repair yourself on a number of levels just with these 0:11:13.960 --> 0:11:17.480 human cells and this and this, and instantly flows into 0:11:17.559 --> 0:11:19.920 a number of ideas we've discussed before, such as the 0:11:19.960 --> 0:11:22.480 idea of defeating death or at least putting it off 0:11:22.520 --> 0:11:25.880 for nine centuries. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. And the podcast 0:11:25.960 --> 0:11:29.040 nine Birthday Candles, we talk about this guy named Aubrey 0:11:29.120 --> 0:11:32.920 De Gray who is a biogenerontologist, and in a very 0:11:32.960 --> 0:11:36.280 similar way, he's saying that it's very possible for us 0:11:36.280 --> 0:11:39.320 to extend our lives. We can very now, very it's 0:11:39.400 --> 0:11:42.040 very possible for a fifty year old man now to 0:11:42.120 --> 0:11:44.760 be able to extend his life significantly, maybe even five 0:11:44.840 --> 0:11:48.200 hundred years, if we are able to use these therapies 0:11:48.240 --> 0:11:51.960 that are available to us. UM, So all be de Gray, Um, 0:11:52.600 --> 0:11:55.040 Harvey Feinberg, they're talking the same thing, really, but just 0:11:55.120 --> 0:11:58.880 different ways. Harvey Feinberg is just bringing a bigger question 0:11:58.880 --> 0:12:01.720 into the picture, which is evolution, which is, you know, 0:12:01.800 --> 0:12:03.720 are we going to get to the point where we 0:12:03.800 --> 0:12:07.680 can so well manipulate our environment and ourselves that it 0:12:07.720 --> 0:12:11.640 becomes we become the evolution, but we become the catalyst 0:12:11.679 --> 0:12:15.160 for it, which is an interesting question, it is. And 0:12:15.000 --> 0:12:17.760 and also just like what is the end picture, because 0:12:17.760 --> 0:12:20.920 when when I think of us changing ourselves to meet 0:12:20.920 --> 0:12:23.760 our own ends, I instantly think of of like people 0:12:23.800 --> 0:12:28.080 have had tremendous amounts of plastic surgery, you know, and 0:12:28.080 --> 0:12:30.680 and granted hopefully you would have more of an ethical 0:12:30.720 --> 0:12:35.800 guidance system when it comes to choosing our genetic destinies 0:12:35.800 --> 0:12:40.079 and the genetic destiny of the of the species. Well 0:12:40.120 --> 0:12:42.440 we're talking about here is like a utopian version or 0:12:42.440 --> 0:12:45.880 a dystopian version, right, or just a really mismanaged version 0:12:46.000 --> 0:12:49.920 where you know, where people make sort of you know, 0:12:50.000 --> 0:12:54.280 surface level choices that have severe ramifications. Well, I mean 0:12:54.320 --> 0:12:56.920 the question is for me, I thought, well, okay, you 0:12:56.960 --> 0:13:01.240 can you can probably uh steer the ship so to speak, 0:13:01.840 --> 0:13:05.520 for a certain amount of time. But evolution, particularly in 0:13:06.000 --> 0:13:10.319 um bacteria viruses, those are gonna going to continue to mutate. 0:13:10.760 --> 0:13:13.200 This is what I think at least. But then I 0:13:13.240 --> 0:13:15.920 saw that there's an article UM that was talking about 0:13:15.920 --> 0:13:20.360 professor Floyd Romesburg and he looked at superbugs resistance to 0:13:20.360 --> 0:13:23.640 antibotics like E. Coli, and he actually found that you 0:13:23.760 --> 0:13:28.960 can you can stop evolution in certain strains, which is 0:13:29.000 --> 0:13:31.920 really interesting. He was, I mean, in order to evolve, 0:13:32.040 --> 0:13:35.080 organisms have to mutate, right, uh So they turn on 0:13:35.120 --> 0:13:38.000 the mutation process when they're threatened with extension. We see this, 0:13:38.360 --> 0:13:40.199 that we see this. This is why cancer cells are 0:13:40.280 --> 0:13:42.920 so aggressive sometimes, right, because they're they're turning on this 0:13:43.000 --> 0:13:48.640 sort of ancient pattern and trying to vanquished the disease um, 0:13:48.880 --> 0:13:53.079 they're actually ending up splitting more and more self. Uh So, 0:13:53.280 --> 0:13:56.400 Romesburg reason that since mutations can be turned on full force, 0:13:56.520 --> 0:13:58.679 perhaps they could be shut off as well, and doing so, 0:13:58.760 --> 0:14:02.120 he says, would put a halt to evolution. Wow, an 0:14:02.120 --> 0:14:05.040 interesting prospect. Because mutation is responsible for evolution, are the 0:14:05.080 --> 0:14:08.720 underlying causes of cancer and aging. So he says, evolution 0:14:08.840 --> 0:14:12.439 is not an unstoppable force. There is a biochemistry underlying, 0:14:12.559 --> 0:14:17.000 and it is subject to intervention. So I mean, can 0:14:17.040 --> 0:14:19.760 we be all The question is could we be all 0:14:19.800 --> 0:14:23.160 over evolution all the time in order to control every 0:14:23.200 --> 0:14:28.080 single variation um instance out there. So I don't think 0:14:28.120 --> 0:14:31.160 that you you could, as a species control evolution. This 0:14:31.240 --> 0:14:32.920 is my take on it. Yeah. I mean it just 0:14:33.000 --> 0:14:36.960 also sound like anytime we talk about controlling of evolution, 0:14:37.040 --> 0:14:39.920 I mean we're still talking about either keeping it, keeping 0:14:39.960 --> 0:14:43.160 things as they are, or we're basically tweaking things as 0:14:43.200 --> 0:14:45.880 they are to become an idealized version of what they are, 0:14:46.280 --> 0:14:49.400 like a best guest, best case scenario for for the 0:14:49.440 --> 0:14:53.720 species as it is today, instead of allowing the continued 0:14:53.720 --> 0:14:56.920 evolution of the species like that, you know that I 0:14:57.000 --> 0:14:58.840 don't think we should necessarily look at ourselves as a 0:14:58.920 --> 0:15:02.800 finished species. Well, I don't think that. Harvey Feinberg, the 0:15:02.800 --> 0:15:05.320 guy he's talking about new evolution, is really talking about 0:15:05.400 --> 0:15:07.920 us as as a finished species. In fact, what he's 0:15:07.920 --> 0:15:10.720 saying is that, I mean, his his real argument is 0:15:10.720 --> 0:15:13.280 that you could take this one hundred thousand year process 0:15:13.320 --> 0:15:15.880 of evolution that you see in humans and boil it 0:15:15.920 --> 0:15:18.280 down to one hundred years, and so you begin to 0:15:18.320 --> 0:15:20.840 select for traits like you could have the fast twitch 0:15:20.920 --> 0:15:23.320 muscle if you wanted to, and your child which would 0:15:23.360 --> 0:15:26.320 allow you to run faster and longer. Um that there 0:15:26.360 --> 0:15:28.480 are certain things that we can twinker tinker with, But 0:15:28.520 --> 0:15:30.920 the problem for me becomes the question of like are 0:15:30.920 --> 0:15:33.680 we talking about trans humanism or are we talking about eugenics? 0:15:34.520 --> 0:15:38.800 Um it can get a little dark, indeed, And I 0:15:38.840 --> 0:15:40.640 mean also it's like, I like I think of things 0:15:40.720 --> 0:15:45.000 like like what if the next phase of actual evolution 0:15:45.120 --> 0:15:50.080 would be the the consciousness, uh, the illusion of consciousness 0:15:50.120 --> 0:15:53.440 fades away. Then you know, then what are we doing 0:15:53.440 --> 0:15:55.200 by preventing that? Maybe that we would be better off 0:15:55.240 --> 0:15:57.680 if that was allowed to take place. But of course 0:15:57.680 --> 0:15:59.600 we've talked about I mean, if you're saying the illusion 0:15:59.600 --> 0:16:01.640 of conscious this is what has driven us quite a 0:16:01.640 --> 0:16:04.720 bit species, right, because we always need a story, um, 0:16:04.760 --> 0:16:07.400 and there's this the mystery, right right. So yeah, so 0:16:07.440 --> 0:16:11.840 maybe it's preventing us from from just turning into smoke. Yes, 0:16:12.640 --> 0:16:16.600 from on a semantic level anyway, Um, yeah, I mean, 0:16:16.640 --> 0:16:18.680 and I mean a lot of the utopian and dystopian 0:16:18.760 --> 0:16:21.520 ideas pretty much speak for themselves, like the idea of 0:16:21.600 --> 0:16:27.360 us becoming uh, you know, twisted monsters, or or are 0:16:27.360 --> 0:16:30.840 we becoming this perfect you know race of of idealized 0:16:31.640 --> 0:16:36.240 twenty one century humans, right, we'll become just um, taller 0:16:36.240 --> 0:16:40.280 and nicer. Yeah, it's a possibility. I instantly think to 0:16:40.400 --> 0:16:44.080 the work works of both Richard K. Morgan and Ian 0:16:44.120 --> 0:16:46.120 and Banks. They both have sci fi stores in which 0:16:46.160 --> 0:16:49.640 they have individuals who, through science have virtually don't have 0:16:49.680 --> 0:16:52.720 to worry about disease anymore. But they get bored so 0:16:53.400 --> 0:16:57.840 it's like among the sort of uh risk taking set, 0:16:58.000 --> 0:17:02.120 they'll they'll intentionally um get the flu just so they 0:17:02.120 --> 0:17:05.479 can experience it. Almost like we're a recreational drug. Well 0:17:05.480 --> 0:17:09.160 exactly recreational drug. It's kind of like the last high 0:17:09.240 --> 0:17:11.240 left to them is to well, I'm going to contract 0:17:11.440 --> 0:17:14.200 this flu and and to see what it's like flu 0:17:14.320 --> 0:17:17.720 for fun. That's fascinating. Yeah. So, I mean there is 0:17:17.760 --> 0:17:20.960 the the idea that that humans need, you know, we 0:17:21.000 --> 0:17:24.600 need strife. We need strife to to feel compassion and 0:17:24.640 --> 0:17:27.119 to and to to make us, you know, do the 0:17:27.160 --> 0:17:29.240 things that make us great. And I'm pretty sure that 0:17:29.320 --> 0:17:31.080 viruses are always going to be there to help us. 0:17:31.080 --> 0:17:34.520 Without the viruses are not going to stop evolving. No, 0:17:34.920 --> 0:17:38.359 So there's that there's that factor to consider as well. 0:17:38.440 --> 0:17:41.400 That's right. Well, there you go. We've got some new evolution. 0:17:41.440 --> 0:17:43.280 Are you ready for it? And are you ready for 0:17:43.320 --> 0:17:47.320 some listener email? Yes? Well I do have some listener email. 0:17:47.320 --> 0:17:49.360 Actually these are not emails. These are from our Facebook 0:17:49.359 --> 0:17:52.879 page where more and more people tend to comment there, 0:17:53.000 --> 0:17:57.000 and both methods are valid, but here're a few. Rachel 0:17:57.000 --> 0:17:59.400 writes and says, hey, guys, I'm halfway through your podcast 0:17:59.520 --> 0:18:01.879 you're so ain earth links so she had to stop 0:18:01.920 --> 0:18:04.760 halfway through the contact. And I like that. And one 0:18:04.760 --> 0:18:06.639 of you brought up the theory that we may be 0:18:06.720 --> 0:18:09.760 living in a matrix type type world. Isn't it the 0:18:09.760 --> 0:18:12.000 case that if at every point of our lives we 0:18:12.040 --> 0:18:15.720 are dreaming, then the word dream becomes synonymous with reality 0:18:15.760 --> 0:18:18.480 and we are simply playing a semantic game. For a 0:18:18.560 --> 0:18:20.639 dream to be a dream, we have to eventually become 0:18:20.680 --> 0:18:23.600 aware that it is a synthetic reality. So if we 0:18:23.640 --> 0:18:26.800 live inside a giant illusion, say the matrix that we 0:18:26.840 --> 0:18:29.880 never wake up from, isn't the matrix just plain old reality? 0:18:31.160 --> 0:18:33.680 The question is the red one or the blue one? 0:18:33.880 --> 0:18:37.080 Which one do you want? I forget which one he took, 0:18:37.880 --> 0:18:42.560 but now these are these are valid questions. It's really interesting, um, 0:18:42.640 --> 0:18:45.040 And I like the idea that someone would yeah, because 0:18:45.320 --> 0:18:47.040 part of what we do with these episodes, I feel 0:18:47.080 --> 0:18:51.359 like is we're stirring the imagination through science, through ponderings 0:18:51.400 --> 0:18:55.359 about trying well. I think we're doing it, stir in 0:18:55.400 --> 0:18:59.600 my mind and stirring these listeners mine. Um. We also 0:18:59.680 --> 0:19:02.399 heard from Thomas. Thomas writes in to say I just 0:19:02.440 --> 0:19:05.360 listened to the Day of the Dolphin podcast, not one 0:19:05.400 --> 0:19:07.920 mention of Douglas Adams The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, 0:19:08.280 --> 0:19:12.159 not one exclamation point at captain by the way, I 0:19:12.200 --> 0:19:14.320 love the podcast and it is awesome on fifteen and 0:19:14.359 --> 0:19:17.360 I live in Texas and I listen all the time. Sweet. 0:19:17.520 --> 0:19:19.600 Yeah that we did. Yeah, we kind of missed the 0:19:19.760 --> 0:19:22.960 missed the boat. I'm making a Hitchhiker's Guide reference. I 0:19:23.040 --> 0:19:25.439 love that we have younger listeners too, and they always 0:19:25.480 --> 0:19:30.600 have really interesting insights and good critiques. Yea that my 0:19:30.640 --> 0:19:33.159 main experience with fifteen year olds just uh through the 0:19:33.160 --> 0:19:35.200 ones that are our listeners, and it makes me think 0:19:35.200 --> 0:19:38.359 that all fifteen year olds are pretty smart and pretty cool. Yeah. 0:19:38.720 --> 0:19:41.399 We also heard from Edmundo, and Edmundo writes and to 0:19:41.440 --> 0:19:44.520 say just listen to the Math Invention or Discovery podcast, 0:19:44.560 --> 0:19:46.280 and I was sort of surprised you didn't cover what 0:19:46.359 --> 0:19:49.919 Dan Everett had to say about the Paraha and the 0:19:49.920 --> 0:19:54.560 apparent difficulty in teaching them how to do basic mathematical equations. 0:19:54.840 --> 0:19:58.480 Their language only has two numbers, one and two, but 0:19:58.600 --> 0:20:00.919 even that is in dispute, as there is a strong 0:20:01.040 --> 0:20:04.679 argument that they just indicate a quote small amount versus 0:20:04.760 --> 0:20:08.960 a quote bigger amount. Is this indicative of mathematics being 0:20:09.000 --> 0:20:13.560 a human construct or that the Paraha language socialization restricts 0:20:13.800 --> 0:20:18.560 innate mathematical capabilities to such a degree that reacquiring such 0:20:18.560 --> 0:20:22.400 a capable capabilities is extremely difficult. That's an interesting question, 0:20:22.600 --> 0:20:24.760 particularly since we're looking at it through the lens of 0:20:24.880 --> 0:20:29.280 our language, in our system of calculations. So you have 0:20:29.320 --> 0:20:32.359 to wonder for for that culture, is it a problem 0:20:32.400 --> 0:20:34.480 at all? Do you know what I'm saying? If that, 0:20:34.600 --> 0:20:38.879 if that's their reference material, Um, yeah, I don't know. 0:20:39.600 --> 0:20:41.520 There's there's something there that we need to scratch out. 0:20:41.560 --> 0:20:43.800 I think it's an interesting way of looking at the 0:20:44.000 --> 0:20:46.320 world around you though, that everything is perhaps either a 0:20:46.359 --> 0:20:48.879 small amount or a bigger amount. It's kind of like 0:20:48.960 --> 0:20:52.520 only viewing films as Coen Brothers films and other films. 0:20:55.080 --> 0:20:58.399 It makes things a little simple, and we know that 0:20:58.480 --> 0:21:01.440 makes happiness when things are simple, right, and we that's 0:21:01.480 --> 0:21:03.520 one of the reports out there. I don't know. Yeah, well, 0:21:03.560 --> 0:21:05.399 let me make it simple to our listeners. If you 0:21:05.440 --> 0:21:09.200 want to uh touch base with us about virtually any 0:21:09.200 --> 0:21:12.879 topic that we've covered UH or might cover in the future, 0:21:13.000 --> 0:21:15.080 or just some cool science that happens to be popping 0:21:15.080 --> 0:21:18.760 around your your your headspace. Then drop in at Facebook 0:21:18.800 --> 0:21:20.600 or Twitter. We are blow the Mind on both of those, 0:21:21.040 --> 0:21:23.160 and you can always drop us an email at blow 0:21:23.200 --> 0:21:29.760 the Mind at how stuff works dot com. Be sure 0:21:29.760 --> 0:21:32.679 to check out our new video podcast, Stuff from the Future. 0:21:33.040 --> 0:21:35.360 Join how Stuff Work staff as we explore the most 0:21:35.359 --> 0:21:38.200 promising and perplexing possibilities of tomorrow.