1 00:00:03,200 --> 00:00:06,519 Speaker 1: Welcome to stuff Mom Never told You. From how Supports 2 00:00:06,559 --> 00:00:14,480 Speaker 1: dot com. Hello and welcome to the podcast. I'm Kristen 3 00:00:14,720 --> 00:00:19,759 Speaker 1: and I'm Caroline. And today's episode on women in Trucking 4 00:00:20,400 --> 00:00:24,319 Speaker 1: has been requested by a number of listeners. It has. Yeah, 5 00:00:24,360 --> 00:00:26,759 Speaker 1: we we I don't know if you guys are in cahoots. 6 00:00:27,200 --> 00:00:31,320 Speaker 1: We've gotten a couple of emails from guys trucker guys 7 00:00:31,360 --> 00:00:35,760 Speaker 1: trucker guy, requesting that we tackle this issue of basically 8 00:00:35,800 --> 00:00:40,280 Speaker 1: like where where are the ladies in trucking? So, for instance, 9 00:00:40,280 --> 00:00:43,760 Speaker 1: we wanted to share a letter from listener Greg, who 10 00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:47,720 Speaker 1: wrote to us, I'm an old, broke down, worn out trucker. 11 00:00:48,240 --> 00:00:50,680 Speaker 1: I wanted to use my time behind the wheel more 12 00:00:50,720 --> 00:00:54,800 Speaker 1: productively and I found your podcast. I've really appreciated your 13 00:00:54,800 --> 00:00:57,200 Speaker 1: feminist viewpoint, as I don't really get the chance to 14 00:00:57,240 --> 00:01:00,680 Speaker 1: see things from a female perspective very often. I work 15 00:01:00,720 --> 00:01:03,120 Speaker 1: in an industry that, as I'm sure you are aware, 16 00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:06,080 Speaker 1: is dominated by men, and as I was listening to 17 00:01:06,120 --> 00:01:09,560 Speaker 1: your podcast on women and visual effects, it made me 18 00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:12,399 Speaker 1: curious to hear your take on women and trucking. The 19 00:01:12,440 --> 00:01:15,600 Speaker 1: trucking industry is essential to the country, yet women are 20 00:01:15,640 --> 00:01:20,480 Speaker 1: severely underrepresented among the ranks of professional drivers. Of course, 21 00:01:20,720 --> 00:01:23,800 Speaker 1: women are certainly capable of performing the job, but it's 22 00:01:23,840 --> 00:01:27,600 Speaker 1: extremely difficult for women to enter the industry, and the 23 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:31,479 Speaker 1: ones that do often face sexism that could be compared 24 00:01:31,840 --> 00:01:37,240 Speaker 1: to the construction industry. So before we go on, Greg 25 00:01:37,280 --> 00:01:40,440 Speaker 1: and all of the other truckers listening to this podcast, 26 00:01:40,560 --> 00:01:44,040 Speaker 1: this episode is for you and Greg, by the way, 27 00:01:44,080 --> 00:01:46,319 Speaker 1: you're spot on across the board. And also, I'm just 28 00:01:46,360 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 1: so excited to imagine Greg finding stuff I've never told 29 00:01:50,360 --> 00:01:54,080 Speaker 1: you and like listening to us like wax feminism as 30 00:01:54,120 --> 00:01:57,120 Speaker 1: he's driving down the road. This is really fun to 31 00:01:57,240 --> 00:01:59,400 Speaker 1: think about. Yeah, and we we love the idea and 32 00:01:59,440 --> 00:02:02,760 Speaker 1: we love the sign justestion. And I don't think though 33 00:02:04,080 --> 00:02:08,800 Speaker 1: that we quite expected the picture to be so grim 34 00:02:08,840 --> 00:02:11,600 Speaker 1: when we first dive into research. Yeah, and it's and 35 00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:15,840 Speaker 1: it's not grim in the way that you might expect. 36 00:02:16,680 --> 00:02:21,680 Speaker 1: But we'll get into that. Fasten your seatbelt, folks, because 37 00:02:21,680 --> 00:02:25,160 Speaker 1: we will get into that um later on. But first 38 00:02:25,160 --> 00:02:27,400 Speaker 1: we want to just give you an overview of the 39 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:30,840 Speaker 1: trucking industry because I mean, again, Greg, you're so right 40 00:02:30,880 --> 00:02:33,440 Speaker 1: across the board. I mean, it's true that the trucking 41 00:02:33,440 --> 00:02:38,040 Speaker 1: industry is so essential to the country, but there are 42 00:02:38,160 --> 00:02:42,720 Speaker 1: very few women, not surprisingly so there are around two 43 00:02:43,040 --> 00:02:45,600 Speaker 1: thousand female truckers on the road and that sounds like 44 00:02:45,639 --> 00:02:48,720 Speaker 1: a lot, sure, but that makes up just six percent 45 00:02:49,320 --> 00:02:53,560 Speaker 1: of all truck drivers, whereas there are three million fellas 46 00:02:53,600 --> 00:02:57,840 Speaker 1: behind the wheel. Yeah, and that six percent figure for 47 00:02:57,919 --> 00:03:01,040 Speaker 1: women is actually up slightly from four point six percent 48 00:03:01,840 --> 00:03:05,399 Speaker 1: according to the group Women in Trucking, and it's lower 49 00:03:05,440 --> 00:03:09,360 Speaker 1: in the UK. Hey, UK listeners, women make up just 50 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:14,160 Speaker 1: one point two percent of truckers over in the UK, 51 00:03:14,800 --> 00:03:19,480 Speaker 1: and we didn't find that much solid demographic information on 52 00:03:19,680 --> 00:03:23,560 Speaker 1: women and trucking. But over at the site Real Women Trucking, 53 00:03:23,600 --> 00:03:27,480 Speaker 1: which is run by trucker named Desiree, she says that 54 00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:30,079 Speaker 1: most women who get into it are between thirty nine 55 00:03:30,080 --> 00:03:32,200 Speaker 1: and fifty nine years old, which I thought was really interesting. 56 00:03:32,600 --> 00:03:39,160 Speaker 1: But it's not necessarily a dream job. Um Erica are Vizoo, 57 00:03:39,200 --> 00:03:43,120 Speaker 1: who's an admission supervisor at the dukes In School of Trucking, 58 00:03:43,760 --> 00:03:47,080 Speaker 1: told NPR quote, a lot of them are single women 59 00:03:47,160 --> 00:03:50,080 Speaker 1: trying to support their families, are just trying to help 60 00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:53,960 Speaker 1: their partner because of the economy and everything, just to survive. Yeah, 61 00:03:54,000 --> 00:03:55,840 Speaker 1: I mean we read a lot too, and this is 62 00:03:56,000 --> 00:03:58,840 Speaker 1: in comments, and I know, you know the refrain like 63 00:03:58,880 --> 00:04:01,320 Speaker 1: never read the comments, But the comments on articles about 64 00:04:01,440 --> 00:04:04,240 Speaker 1: women and trucking are actually pretty enlightening for the most part. 65 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:07,880 Speaker 1: Um because and I say that because I'm so far 66 00:04:07,960 --> 00:04:11,000 Speaker 1: removed from this industry and so it's fascinating to get 67 00:04:11,040 --> 00:04:14,000 Speaker 1: first person accounts. But a lot of the comments talk 68 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:17,960 Speaker 1: about how women who not all women, but a lot 69 00:04:18,000 --> 00:04:19,960 Speaker 1: of the women who come to trucking, especially those who 70 00:04:19,960 --> 00:04:22,360 Speaker 1: come later in life, are coming out of really bad 71 00:04:22,440 --> 00:04:26,719 Speaker 1: circumstances because it's a relatively well paying job for a 72 00:04:26,760 --> 00:04:28,480 Speaker 1: lot of women who have either maybe just gotten out 73 00:04:28,520 --> 00:04:31,960 Speaker 1: of prison, maybe women who have experienced homelessness. And not 74 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:34,240 Speaker 1: that that's not true for some of the guys too, 75 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:40,680 Speaker 1: but trucking presents sort of a unique and positive opportunity 76 00:04:40,720 --> 00:04:43,400 Speaker 1: for a lot of people. Yeah, I mean, it's a lifeline, 77 00:04:43,520 --> 00:04:46,520 Speaker 1: especially for g I s who have just come home. 78 00:04:47,040 --> 00:04:52,279 Speaker 1: Um and again, it is a crucial industry to all 79 00:04:52,279 --> 00:04:54,520 Speaker 1: of our day to day lives that we probably do 80 00:04:54,720 --> 00:04:59,200 Speaker 1: not think about very often because imagine, truckers move nine 81 00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:04,080 Speaker 1: point two billion tons of freight or of all us 82 00:05:04,160 --> 00:05:10,880 Speaker 1: fright every year, and there still aren't enough truck drivers. 83 00:05:11,200 --> 00:05:15,120 Speaker 1: The American Trucking Association estimates that we're about thirty thousand 84 00:05:15,200 --> 00:05:21,200 Speaker 1: drivers short already, and by I think it's that number 85 00:05:21,400 --> 00:05:25,719 Speaker 1: will probably be up to two hundred thousand if recruitment 86 00:05:25,960 --> 00:05:29,280 Speaker 1: doesn't pick up. Yeah, and so, as we've seen in 87 00:05:29,880 --> 00:05:34,560 Speaker 1: many an industry over our national history, people turned to 88 00:05:34,680 --> 00:05:38,320 Speaker 1: women to fill these traditionally male dominated roles, and anecdotally 89 00:05:38,320 --> 00:05:40,320 Speaker 1: it's working. Um, there are a lot of people in 90 00:05:40,360 --> 00:05:43,960 Speaker 1: the industry who say that more women are getting their 91 00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:47,600 Speaker 1: trucking licenses and that the work environment is female friendlier 92 00:05:47,640 --> 00:05:51,080 Speaker 1: than ever before. Although, as we will continue to discuss, 93 00:05:51,279 --> 00:05:54,840 Speaker 1: everything's relative, that's not saying all that much. Yeah. Ellen Voy, 94 00:05:55,200 --> 00:05:58,480 Speaker 1: who heads up the Women in Trucking Association that we've cited, 95 00:05:59,279 --> 00:06:02,120 Speaker 1: said that if we double the percentage of women working 96 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:05,840 Speaker 1: in the trucking industry, we could solve the immediate qualified 97 00:06:05,960 --> 00:06:09,760 Speaker 1: driver shortage, which saying quite a lot. Yeah, I mean, 98 00:06:09,800 --> 00:06:12,599 Speaker 1: but keep in mind, listeners, as we're talking about this 99 00:06:12,640 --> 00:06:17,080 Speaker 1: inciting sources that there is um a little bit of 100 00:06:17,080 --> 00:06:21,960 Speaker 1: conflict between women in trucking and real women trucking because 101 00:06:21,960 --> 00:06:26,760 Speaker 1: real women trucking was started to you know, give firsthand 102 00:06:26,760 --> 00:06:29,240 Speaker 1: insight into what it's like being a woman in the 103 00:06:29,279 --> 00:06:33,560 Speaker 1: trucking industry, and the woman who started it often talks 104 00:06:33,600 --> 00:06:37,680 Speaker 1: about how women in trucking, which is more organized. Um, 105 00:06:37,720 --> 00:06:41,039 Speaker 1: it's a bigger organization. It's more geared toward recruitment, right, Yeah, 106 00:06:41,120 --> 00:06:43,960 Speaker 1: and it has more industry connections and so real women 107 00:06:44,040 --> 00:06:47,919 Speaker 1: trucking often claims that women in trucking is a little 108 00:06:47,920 --> 00:06:51,800 Speaker 1: bit misleading and glosses over some of the details about, um, 109 00:06:51,839 --> 00:06:56,440 Speaker 1: what life is like on the road. Um, but women 110 00:06:56,560 --> 00:07:00,920 Speaker 1: are also a safer bet for trucking, come Bennie. Um. 111 00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:05,919 Speaker 1: Derek Leathers, who's the CEO of Werner Enterprises, told Bloomberg 112 00:07:06,000 --> 00:07:09,400 Speaker 1: that women drivers performed better than men across the board. 113 00:07:09,440 --> 00:07:12,240 Speaker 1: They tend to have fewer accidents, they have better inspections 114 00:07:12,440 --> 00:07:16,440 Speaker 1: and fewer compliance issues. Yeah. And VOI who we decided, 115 00:07:16,480 --> 00:07:18,960 Speaker 1: also told the BBC that women are so much better 116 00:07:18,960 --> 00:07:22,080 Speaker 1: with the customers and the paperwork in the equipment with 117 00:07:22,120 --> 00:07:24,960 Speaker 1: what with our tiny hands. Well, there's the equipment in 118 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:26,920 Speaker 1: there too. I know she had just stopped at paperwork, 119 00:07:26,920 --> 00:07:31,760 Speaker 1: it would have been like Ellen, But why is there 120 00:07:32,120 --> 00:07:36,400 Speaker 1: this scarcity of women in trucking? Well, I mean if 121 00:07:36,560 --> 00:07:40,760 Speaker 1: from the get go it's major job requirements like life 122 00:07:40,840 --> 00:07:45,280 Speaker 1: on the open road, hauling freight, even just driving are 123 00:07:45,320 --> 00:07:49,680 Speaker 1: all masculine gendered activities, though of course some women have 124 00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:52,320 Speaker 1: gotten behind the wheel anyway. Yeah, and this is the 125 00:07:52,360 --> 00:07:55,200 Speaker 1: part of the podcast where we have to talk about trailblazers. Yes, 126 00:07:55,280 --> 00:07:58,920 Speaker 1: let's do it, and and almost literally trailblazers. They were 127 00:07:59,320 --> 00:08:03,160 Speaker 1: the first people on these trails, sometimes blazing them, blazing, 128 00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:06,880 Speaker 1: blazing them. So before there was truck driving, you had 129 00:08:06,920 --> 00:08:11,360 Speaker 1: to have wagon driving. And so during the Western expansion 130 00:08:11,360 --> 00:08:15,720 Speaker 1: in this country, wives would typically take the reins so 131 00:08:15,760 --> 00:08:18,120 Speaker 1: that their husbands could sit on the back or in 132 00:08:18,160 --> 00:08:20,280 Speaker 1: the passenger seat with a gun. This is where we 133 00:08:20,320 --> 00:08:23,040 Speaker 1: get the term writing shotgun. You're welcome. I know, I 134 00:08:23,080 --> 00:08:25,480 Speaker 1: didn't know that before we was searching for this episode. Yeah, 135 00:08:25,520 --> 00:08:29,000 Speaker 1: I never I yelled shotgun a lot in high school. 136 00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:31,760 Speaker 1: I never do, still do. Yeah. I never understood where 137 00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:33,480 Speaker 1: it came from, never even really thought about it. And 138 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:37,040 Speaker 1: it's because of this, because women were holding the reins 139 00:08:37,559 --> 00:08:42,320 Speaker 1: while husband carried a shotgun, literally writing shotgun. Um. And 140 00:08:42,400 --> 00:08:45,520 Speaker 1: at this point we have to talk about Mary Fields, 141 00:08:45,559 --> 00:08:48,679 Speaker 1: who was a freed slave, who is better known by 142 00:08:48,720 --> 00:08:53,760 Speaker 1: her nickname Stagecoach Mary. She drove six horses and a 143 00:08:53,880 --> 00:08:58,440 Speaker 1: mule as a US Postal Services, second female higher and 144 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:02,240 Speaker 1: the first African and Eric and postal worker in the US. 145 00:09:02,960 --> 00:09:06,960 Speaker 1: And that happened in when PS she was sixty. Yeah, 146 00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:10,920 Speaker 1: she worked through her seventies in this job and was frequent. 147 00:09:11,000 --> 00:09:14,200 Speaker 1: She even worked. She was like worked as as protection 148 00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:19,719 Speaker 1: for nuns. Yeah. Like, she's a fascinating, fascinating figure. Um. 149 00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:24,160 Speaker 1: But you can consider her an early truck driver. Uh. 150 00:09:24,240 --> 00:09:27,320 Speaker 1: During World War One though, big old leap uh. In 151 00:09:27,480 --> 00:09:31,760 Speaker 1: nineteen nineteen, Luella Bates became one of the first female 152 00:09:31,760 --> 00:09:35,160 Speaker 1: commercial truck drivers, and certainly it's most well known. So 153 00:09:35,400 --> 00:09:38,840 Speaker 1: if you look at histories of commercial truck driving, Louella 154 00:09:38,840 --> 00:09:42,560 Speaker 1: Bates is usually cited as the very first lady. And 155 00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:46,439 Speaker 1: she was hired by Wisconsin's four wheel drive factory along 156 00:09:46,480 --> 00:09:50,160 Speaker 1: with other women to fill positions left by men at war. 157 00:09:50,360 --> 00:09:52,680 Speaker 1: So again a similar theme that we've heard before on 158 00:09:52,679 --> 00:09:55,640 Speaker 1: the podcast. And I love I love her story because 159 00:09:56,200 --> 00:09:59,720 Speaker 1: Bates took a shine to test driving and demonstrating the 160 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:04,720 Speaker 1: trucks and four wheel drive was like, hmm, we could 161 00:10:04,760 --> 00:10:08,800 Speaker 1: make her the face of our company. So they sent 162 00:10:08,840 --> 00:10:12,520 Speaker 1: her on this cross country marketing tour, and of course 163 00:10:12,559 --> 00:10:15,520 Speaker 1: the press described her as quote a pretty and petite 164 00:10:15,559 --> 00:10:19,600 Speaker 1: woman pilot. Well, yeah, because as you know, the more 165 00:10:19,600 --> 00:10:21,920 Speaker 1: things change, the more they stay the same. And you 166 00:10:22,080 --> 00:10:25,480 Speaker 1: apparently cannot have an article about a woman in a 167 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:29,880 Speaker 1: male dominated job that doesn't discuss her appearance. And like 168 00:10:30,360 --> 00:10:33,439 Speaker 1: there's always this effort on the part of writers, it 169 00:10:33,559 --> 00:10:38,600 Speaker 1: seems to assure readers that someone is still feminine, like, 170 00:10:38,679 --> 00:10:42,120 Speaker 1: don't worry, she's still pretty. And we see that in 171 00:10:42,280 --> 00:10:47,840 Speaker 1: coverage through today, which is a little bit mind boggling up, 172 00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:51,360 Speaker 1: like relax, okay, Like it's fine, I don't care what 173 00:10:51,440 --> 00:10:53,080 Speaker 1: she looks like. I don't care if she thinks her 174 00:10:53,160 --> 00:10:55,880 Speaker 1: nails it's cool. Yeah, I don't care. But I mean, 175 00:10:56,120 --> 00:10:59,280 Speaker 1: and it's something you hear echoed though in um the 176 00:10:59,320 --> 00:11:01,599 Speaker 1: actual end Street. There was an article we read that 177 00:11:01,720 --> 00:11:05,160 Speaker 1: was interviewing women truckers in the UK, and one woman 178 00:11:05,280 --> 00:11:07,600 Speaker 1: was saying that she always gets comments from other guys 179 00:11:07,600 --> 00:11:10,520 Speaker 1: being like, oh, I can't believe you're straight. Like there's 180 00:11:10,559 --> 00:11:14,160 Speaker 1: all of these preconceived notions about what a trucker is 181 00:11:14,160 --> 00:11:16,960 Speaker 1: supposed to look like. A but then what a lady 182 00:11:17,000 --> 00:11:19,480 Speaker 1: trucker is supposed to be. And so I just I 183 00:11:19,480 --> 00:11:22,600 Speaker 1: want to tell everybody, like relax. I want to borrow 184 00:11:22,920 --> 00:11:25,520 Speaker 1: um Holly from stuff in this in history costs like 185 00:11:25,600 --> 00:11:28,560 Speaker 1: be cool, wand like everybody be cool. It doesn't matter 186 00:11:28,600 --> 00:11:30,439 Speaker 1: what a human looks like if they are doing the 187 00:11:30,559 --> 00:11:33,720 Speaker 1: job that they want to do. Like, just relax, everybody, 188 00:11:34,800 --> 00:11:39,840 Speaker 1: Caroline says, relaxed t shirts. Yeah, exactly that. Um. But 189 00:11:39,920 --> 00:11:43,480 Speaker 1: if we hop back to the nineteen forties, Rusty Dow 190 00:11:43,760 --> 00:11:47,319 Speaker 1: became the first woman to drive the Alaska Highway and 191 00:11:47,440 --> 00:11:50,640 Speaker 1: she was one tough gal. Dal had worked as a 192 00:11:50,640 --> 00:11:53,800 Speaker 1: truck driver in California and then ended up operating her 193 00:11:53,840 --> 00:11:57,760 Speaker 1: own trucking and transfer service. And apparently she's a big deal. 194 00:11:57,800 --> 00:12:01,280 Speaker 1: She has like her own page on like Alaska's history website. Well, 195 00:12:01,320 --> 00:12:03,560 Speaker 1: I mean, she drove a ten wheel student Baker with 196 00:12:03,600 --> 00:12:07,720 Speaker 1: bald tires down what is a only a quote unquote highway, 197 00:12:07,720 --> 00:12:10,319 Speaker 1: like whatever highway you're on going to work. It wasn't 198 00:12:10,320 --> 00:12:15,680 Speaker 1: that like it was the wilderness. And she talked about 199 00:12:15,720 --> 00:12:19,840 Speaker 1: how she overheard some dude truckers saying, oh, yeah, you know, 200 00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:23,400 Speaker 1: if they ever make this trail easy enough for women 201 00:12:23,520 --> 00:12:26,080 Speaker 1: to travel like we know it'll be time to to 202 00:12:26,160 --> 00:12:32,520 Speaker 1: find another job, to move on. So patronizing. Um. But 203 00:12:32,679 --> 00:12:37,080 Speaker 1: today though, the industry is on the hunt for more 204 00:12:37,120 --> 00:12:41,280 Speaker 1: women like Luella Bates. And here's the big industry pitch 205 00:12:41,840 --> 00:12:45,439 Speaker 1: to women. The big thing that they often advertise is 206 00:12:45,480 --> 00:12:49,640 Speaker 1: how women you can make money, money, money, So in 207 00:12:49,679 --> 00:12:52,800 Speaker 1: pretty much any trucking story you read, it will mention 208 00:12:52,880 --> 00:12:56,240 Speaker 1: how thirty eight thousand is the media and pay and 209 00:12:56,360 --> 00:12:58,800 Speaker 1: there are long haul truckers who can pull in up 210 00:12:58,840 --> 00:13:04,200 Speaker 1: to seventy dollars a year, and many spokespeople insist that 211 00:13:04,280 --> 00:13:06,800 Speaker 1: truckers can start ranking in that cash and only a 212 00:13:06,800 --> 00:13:10,360 Speaker 1: few weeks, which sounds great, sounds amazing. Yeah, why are 213 00:13:10,360 --> 00:13:12,640 Speaker 1: we podcasting? I have no idea can be podcasts from 214 00:13:12,640 --> 00:13:14,960 Speaker 1: a truck? I think so. And of course they also 215 00:13:15,000 --> 00:13:17,240 Speaker 1: tell the fact that you are paid by the mile 216 00:13:17,559 --> 00:13:21,359 Speaker 1: or by the load, so that there's no gender specific 217 00:13:21,760 --> 00:13:24,040 Speaker 1: wage gap. If there's a gap, it's because you're not 218 00:13:24,160 --> 00:13:27,839 Speaker 1: driving as much as others, which of course will come 219 00:13:27,880 --> 00:13:31,439 Speaker 1: into play when we talk about retaliation by companies. But anyway, 220 00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:33,480 Speaker 1: I don't want to give too many spoilers away. Of course, 221 00:13:33,880 --> 00:13:35,920 Speaker 1: a lot of companies also tell that the job is 222 00:13:35,960 --> 00:13:40,679 Speaker 1: physically easier than ever before. You've got uh technological innovations 223 00:13:40,880 --> 00:13:44,679 Speaker 1: power steering, automatic transmissions. You've got people trying to make 224 00:13:44,720 --> 00:13:48,360 Speaker 1: sleeper cabs more comfortable and ergonomic so it can accommodate 225 00:13:48,400 --> 00:13:52,040 Speaker 1: all types of body sizes. Um And and that includes 226 00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:56,000 Speaker 1: making driver's seats even women friendly to accommodate smaller frames. 227 00:13:56,000 --> 00:13:58,920 Speaker 1: And one aspect of a job that's often advertised specifically 228 00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:02,559 Speaker 1: to women is how you can haul what's called no 229 00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:07,520 Speaker 1: touch cargo that doesn't demand any heavy lifting whatsoever. And 230 00:14:07,559 --> 00:14:10,360 Speaker 1: as far as I'm concerned, these are improvements for everyone. 231 00:14:10,480 --> 00:14:15,280 Speaker 1: Oh absolutely yeah, um And trucking companies are making intentional 232 00:14:15,440 --> 00:14:20,320 Speaker 1: changes to attract women, not just the technological innovations for 233 00:14:20,440 --> 00:14:23,640 Speaker 1: the trucks themselves. They're trying to clean up truck stops. 234 00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:27,280 Speaker 1: They're actually putting showers in the women's bathrooms at truck 235 00:14:27,280 --> 00:14:29,800 Speaker 1: stops because for a long time there were only showers 236 00:14:29,800 --> 00:14:33,440 Speaker 1: in the men's bathrooms. So I'm sure that was very welcoming. Uh, 237 00:14:33,720 --> 00:14:37,200 Speaker 1: Offering guaranteed home time because you were on the road 238 00:14:37,240 --> 00:14:43,160 Speaker 1: a lot, not surprisingly, and also just directly marketing to 239 00:14:43,360 --> 00:14:47,800 Speaker 1: potential women with messages of freedom, seeing the country. Your 240 00:14:47,800 --> 00:14:50,800 Speaker 1: truck is your home and your office. You can be 241 00:14:51,320 --> 00:14:54,480 Speaker 1: the mistress of your own mobile domain. All of this 242 00:14:54,640 --> 00:14:59,400 Speaker 1: sounds fantastic, it does what could possibly go wrong? So 243 00:14:59,520 --> 00:15:04,080 Speaker 1: the thing as regardless of who you are, man, woman, young, old, 244 00:15:05,240 --> 00:15:10,640 Speaker 1: driving a truck, especially long haul, is tiring, it's dangerous. 245 00:15:10,760 --> 00:15:12,840 Speaker 1: It's often cited as one of the top ten miss 246 00:15:12,920 --> 00:15:19,520 Speaker 1: dangerous occupations in the world. And it's lonely and underpaid. Yeah. 247 00:15:19,600 --> 00:15:22,920 Speaker 1: I mean, I think fourteen hour days and the fact 248 00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:27,120 Speaker 1: that trucking accidents account for twelve percent of all work 249 00:15:27,160 --> 00:15:30,520 Speaker 1: related deaths in the US, and there's been a huge 250 00:15:30,680 --> 00:15:36,000 Speaker 1: issue of that underpaid aspect. And I mean you are 251 00:15:36,120 --> 00:15:40,320 Speaker 1: working on a strict schedule, so you might be driving 252 00:15:40,920 --> 00:15:43,600 Speaker 1: for these long stretches at a time. I mean, there 253 00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:47,440 Speaker 1: are regulations as to I think fourteen hours is the max. 254 00:15:47,560 --> 00:15:51,520 Speaker 1: Truckers listening, correct me if I'm wrong. Um. But there's 255 00:15:51,560 --> 00:15:57,960 Speaker 1: also no unionization, and so these truckers have little power 256 00:15:58,000 --> 00:16:02,360 Speaker 1: to fight for at our compensation because they're doing such 257 00:16:02,880 --> 00:16:06,920 Speaker 1: important work. That's like the you know, the foundation of 258 00:16:06,960 --> 00:16:11,640 Speaker 1: a lot of our economy. Yeah, exactly. And Desiree would 259 00:16:11,640 --> 00:16:14,160 Speaker 1: who we cited earlier as the founder of real women. 260 00:16:14,200 --> 00:16:19,280 Speaker 1: Trucking does work to highlight these issues, because you know, 261 00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:21,320 Speaker 1: if you definitely want to be a trucker or you're 262 00:16:21,320 --> 00:16:24,280 Speaker 1: just thinking about it, she believes, and I agree with that, 263 00:16:24,520 --> 00:16:27,680 Speaker 1: you should know the risks and rewards. And she points 264 00:16:27,680 --> 00:16:29,760 Speaker 1: out with that whole underpaid thing, that there is a 265 00:16:29,800 --> 00:16:33,200 Speaker 1: lot of unpaid labor that goes into being a trucker, 266 00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:37,280 Speaker 1: since you're only paid per mile or per load when 267 00:16:37,320 --> 00:16:40,920 Speaker 1: you're driving, so you've got time spent standing on the 268 00:16:40,960 --> 00:16:43,800 Speaker 1: dock to count freight. You might end up being detained 269 00:16:43,800 --> 00:16:47,360 Speaker 1: at a shipper receiver for hours past your appointment, and 270 00:16:47,400 --> 00:16:49,600 Speaker 1: you've got to spend time climbing up inside that trailer 271 00:16:49,640 --> 00:16:51,960 Speaker 1: to clean them out before you load them up. And 272 00:16:51,960 --> 00:16:55,080 Speaker 1: there's also the issue with local jobs, which are the 273 00:16:55,080 --> 00:17:00,400 Speaker 1: ones that are often guaranteed, involving a lot more unpaid work, 274 00:17:00,600 --> 00:17:05,040 Speaker 1: according to Desiree would at least than long haul. And 275 00:17:05,080 --> 00:17:09,119 Speaker 1: then beyond that, there's the issue of no industry wide 276 00:17:09,280 --> 00:17:13,920 Speaker 1: training standards, which means some trucking schools will exploit students 277 00:17:13,960 --> 00:17:17,359 Speaker 1: with excessive team driving and try to lock them into 278 00:17:17,480 --> 00:17:20,920 Speaker 1: lease purchase deals for a truck, landing them in debt. 279 00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:24,480 Speaker 1: So you have to pay your tuition to even get 280 00:17:24,520 --> 00:17:26,960 Speaker 1: into the school so you can get a trucking license, 281 00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:29,919 Speaker 1: and some of these schools will try to get you 282 00:17:29,960 --> 00:17:33,040 Speaker 1: to you know, lock you into this lease, and if 283 00:17:33,080 --> 00:17:35,040 Speaker 1: you even make it out of the school, as we'll 284 00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:38,440 Speaker 1: talk about in just a second, um so before you're 285 00:17:38,440 --> 00:17:42,120 Speaker 1: even making any money, you're spending a lot of money sometimes. 286 00:17:42,119 --> 00:17:44,720 Speaker 1: I mean, this is just would I putting this information 287 00:17:44,760 --> 00:17:47,840 Speaker 1: out there just as a buyer beware, like, study your 288 00:17:47,880 --> 00:17:50,560 Speaker 1: school before you sign up for it. And she also 289 00:17:50,600 --> 00:17:53,080 Speaker 1: points out that you're generally not going to be making 290 00:17:53,080 --> 00:17:56,480 Speaker 1: that forty k right out of the gate. You're probably 291 00:17:56,520 --> 00:17:59,840 Speaker 1: more likely to earn about eighteen to thirty seven thousand 292 00:18:00,119 --> 00:18:03,240 Speaker 1: when you first become a trucker, and many women behind 293 00:18:03,280 --> 00:18:08,960 Speaker 1: the wheel often confront gender stereotypes and ridicule and even 294 00:18:09,000 --> 00:18:12,240 Speaker 1: harassment as a part of the job as well. Yeah, 295 00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:14,080 Speaker 1: I mean, we've already talked about how it seems like 296 00:18:14,080 --> 00:18:16,200 Speaker 1: every article has to mention the appearance and like, oh 297 00:18:16,280 --> 00:18:18,000 Speaker 1: my god, you can't be a driver because you're wearing 298 00:18:18,040 --> 00:18:21,480 Speaker 1: a scart. But there's also all of these gender assumptions 299 00:18:21,520 --> 00:18:24,119 Speaker 1: that krist and I have talked about in previous STEM 300 00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:27,679 Speaker 1: episodes about like, oh, well, you're a woman, so you 301 00:18:27,720 --> 00:18:30,000 Speaker 1: probably didn't play with legos enough, so you have no 302 00:18:30,119 --> 00:18:33,880 Speaker 1: spatial reasoning skills, you can't drive, and you're probably not 303 00:18:34,040 --> 00:18:36,439 Speaker 1: strong enough to do any of this work. And of 304 00:18:36,440 --> 00:18:38,920 Speaker 1: course that's all a bunch of huey. Yeah, I mean 305 00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:41,320 Speaker 1: it was to the point that Um, in an article 306 00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:46,800 Speaker 1: over the BBC Shamim Aktar, whose Pakistan's only female professional 307 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:50,760 Speaker 1: truck driver, she said that she basically has to divorce 308 00:18:50,800 --> 00:18:55,240 Speaker 1: herself from her womanhood in order to do this job. Yeah, 309 00:18:55,320 --> 00:18:57,639 Speaker 1: my eyes got so wide when I read that, because 310 00:18:57,680 --> 00:19:01,680 Speaker 1: she was essentially saying, Um, you know, I pray that 311 00:19:02,119 --> 00:19:06,280 Speaker 1: women who want to stay home can afford to stay home, 312 00:19:06,440 --> 00:19:08,879 Speaker 1: because I know that when I'm on the road, I 313 00:19:08,960 --> 00:19:12,239 Speaker 1: have to kill the woman inside of me. And you're like, 314 00:19:12,359 --> 00:19:15,719 Speaker 1: oh my god, Like that goes against kind of everything 315 00:19:15,760 --> 00:19:17,960 Speaker 1: that we preach in terms of like be who you are, 316 00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:20,360 Speaker 1: like be a proud lady if that's who you are, 317 00:19:20,880 --> 00:19:23,399 Speaker 1: even if you're a trucker, or because you're a trucker, 318 00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:28,119 Speaker 1: like you know, be authentically yourself. And um, Shamim Aktar 319 00:19:28,160 --> 00:19:31,040 Speaker 1: definitely has a different coping mechanism for facing the type 320 00:19:31,040 --> 00:19:33,240 Speaker 1: of harassment that comes along with being a lady trucker 321 00:19:33,280 --> 00:19:35,520 Speaker 1: in Pakistan. Yeah, I mean, and of course a lot 322 00:19:35,600 --> 00:19:40,520 Speaker 1: of women truckers just I mean, the stereotyping. They just 323 00:19:40,560 --> 00:19:42,480 Speaker 1: kind of have to let it roll off their backs, 324 00:19:42,680 --> 00:19:46,520 Speaker 1: but understandably it can wear you down a bit, and 325 00:19:47,440 --> 00:19:51,000 Speaker 1: men and women arelike. Turnover in the industry is huge. 326 00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:57,639 Speaker 1: The American Trucking Association in celebrated a record low of 327 00:19:57,800 --> 00:20:02,000 Speaker 1: eight percent annual turn up. Mind blown. And the more 328 00:20:02,080 --> 00:20:07,400 Speaker 1: frequent statu you see is a d which, in case 329 00:20:07,400 --> 00:20:09,959 Speaker 1: you're not sure what a hundred percent turnover means, it 330 00:20:10,000 --> 00:20:14,159 Speaker 1: means that everyone is leaving. Responding to this discussion, one 331 00:20:14,320 --> 00:20:18,040 Speaker 1: NPR commenter said, well, consider the pay and the fact 332 00:20:18,040 --> 00:20:20,159 Speaker 1: that you're on the road, away from home and family 333 00:20:20,280 --> 00:20:22,480 Speaker 1: for weeks and months at a time, living out of 334 00:20:22,520 --> 00:20:25,600 Speaker 1: the truck, eating on the road, not working a set schedule, 335 00:20:25,640 --> 00:20:27,400 Speaker 1: but available for work at any hour of the day 336 00:20:27,440 --> 00:20:30,720 Speaker 1: or night in any weather, and should I add sleep deprived. 337 00:20:31,119 --> 00:20:33,080 Speaker 1: And he goes on to say, it's not just a job, 338 00:20:33,119 --> 00:20:35,919 Speaker 1: but a lifestyle, and it's not suitable for most people. 339 00:20:36,119 --> 00:20:39,040 Speaker 1: Like and he's not talking gender, He's like talking whoever 340 00:20:39,160 --> 00:20:42,200 Speaker 1: you are. It might not be your kind of work. Yeah, 341 00:20:42,520 --> 00:20:45,600 Speaker 1: I forget the exact source, but I was reading an 342 00:20:45,680 --> 00:20:50,920 Speaker 1: article about both the psychological and physical told and druck driving, 343 00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:54,000 Speaker 1: especially long haul truck driving takes, because I mean, think 344 00:20:54,000 --> 00:20:56,639 Speaker 1: about if you have a desk job, how often we're told, 345 00:20:56,680 --> 00:20:59,080 Speaker 1: you know, you make sure you stand up. Sitting is killing, 346 00:20:59,320 --> 00:21:02,480 Speaker 1: Sitting is killing you stand up every hour. If you're 347 00:21:02,520 --> 00:21:05,880 Speaker 1: a trucker, you can't do that. You are sitting in 348 00:21:05,920 --> 00:21:11,680 Speaker 1: that fixed position for hours on end, and sometimes by yourself. 349 00:21:11,720 --> 00:21:14,639 Speaker 1: Although I am hartened to know that we are offering 350 00:21:14,680 --> 00:21:18,440 Speaker 1: at least some podcast company to truckers out there. Yeah, 351 00:21:18,440 --> 00:21:21,679 Speaker 1: and there are people who drive in teams. There are 352 00:21:21,720 --> 00:21:23,760 Speaker 1: lots of husband and wife teams out there, which I 353 00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:27,359 Speaker 1: didn't realize, But so that could at least let you 354 00:21:27,440 --> 00:21:30,000 Speaker 1: switch off and keep driving. But more often than not, 355 00:21:30,400 --> 00:21:33,800 Speaker 1: you're still driving that twelve hour shift. Let's say so, 356 00:21:34,119 --> 00:21:36,600 Speaker 1: and your spouse or your partner, whoever's in the cab 357 00:21:36,680 --> 00:21:39,040 Speaker 1: with you, will then take the next twelve hour shifts, 358 00:21:39,040 --> 00:21:41,960 Speaker 1: so it's not like you're switching off every hour necessarily. Yeah, 359 00:21:42,200 --> 00:21:45,040 Speaker 1: But then on top of that too, let's say you 360 00:21:45,040 --> 00:21:49,240 Speaker 1: get hungry, it's time for dinner. Uh, if you've noticed 361 00:21:49,560 --> 00:21:53,320 Speaker 1: the immediate food options that are closest to the road 362 00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:55,320 Speaker 1: are usually not all that good for you. I mean, 363 00:21:55,359 --> 00:21:58,560 Speaker 1: you have gas station food you have. I mean even 364 00:21:58,600 --> 00:22:01,880 Speaker 1: if you get like an ice roast chicken and some 365 00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:04,880 Speaker 1: potatoes and carrots, Like, how are you going to eat? Yeah, 366 00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:07,760 Speaker 1: when you know, when you've got to be somewhere in 367 00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:10,880 Speaker 1: a certain set amount of time. Yeah. So um. But 368 00:22:11,359 --> 00:22:15,800 Speaker 1: on top of all of these issues, which I personally 369 00:22:15,840 --> 00:22:18,399 Speaker 1: think the industry needs to take a closer look at 370 00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:22,560 Speaker 1: or at least compensate their employees better. For um, we 371 00:22:22,680 --> 00:22:26,040 Speaker 1: next need to talk about the biggest road hazard for 372 00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:28,880 Speaker 1: women behind the wheel, and we're going to dive into 373 00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:31,160 Speaker 1: that when we get right back from a quick break. 374 00:22:41,960 --> 00:22:45,479 Speaker 1: Now going into this research, Caroline, I mean, I was 375 00:22:45,600 --> 00:22:50,879 Speaker 1: prepared to read about safety and sexual assault issues for 376 00:22:51,160 --> 00:22:55,280 Speaker 1: women on the road, assuming that you're alone, if you 377 00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:58,639 Speaker 1: have to stay at a truck stop, stranger danger, that 378 00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:02,880 Speaker 1: it's it's all happening there after you've gotten the job, 379 00:23:02,960 --> 00:23:07,600 Speaker 1: once you're in the industry. But it turns out that 380 00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:13,960 Speaker 1: the major sexual harassment problem within the trucking industry takes 381 00:23:14,000 --> 00:23:21,080 Speaker 1: place most often during training. Yeah. Yeah, uh so horrified 382 00:23:21,640 --> 00:23:24,439 Speaker 1: to read about this and so glad to be reading 383 00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:27,879 Speaker 1: about it because it seems like nobody wants to talk 384 00:23:27,920 --> 00:23:31,040 Speaker 1: about it, especially I mean especially recruiters. I mean, as 385 00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:33,000 Speaker 1: you can imagine, why would they want to highlight anything 386 00:23:33,040 --> 00:23:36,240 Speaker 1: like that. Um. But we we tend to focus so 387 00:23:36,359 --> 00:23:42,400 Speaker 1: much on sexism in the workplace, on issues of promotion 388 00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:45,280 Speaker 1: and gender wage gaps, and we of course sexual harassment 389 00:23:45,280 --> 00:23:50,960 Speaker 1: and sexual assault. But this, it's the issue is so concentrated. 390 00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:55,880 Speaker 1: It seems like in the trucking industry, UM and sexual 391 00:23:55,920 --> 00:23:58,240 Speaker 1: harassment and we're not just talking like a slap on 392 00:23:58,280 --> 00:24:00,480 Speaker 1: the butt or like hey, hot thing, you want to 393 00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:06,640 Speaker 1: have sex. It's like violent, there's violent sexual harassment going on. 394 00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:10,480 Speaker 1: And it's one of the major complaints that desiree would 395 00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:14,480 Speaker 1: who started real women trucking hears from people. Yeah, because 396 00:24:14,800 --> 00:24:18,520 Speaker 1: what typically happens steering driver training. When you're training to 397 00:24:18,560 --> 00:24:22,600 Speaker 1: get your trucking license, you have to drive in teams 398 00:24:22,640 --> 00:24:25,400 Speaker 1: for a set amount of time, so you'll be driving, 399 00:24:25,440 --> 00:24:28,480 Speaker 1: you know, with someone who's your trainer. But a lot 400 00:24:28,520 --> 00:24:32,960 Speaker 1: of times those trainers are not in official positions of authority, 401 00:24:33,400 --> 00:24:38,040 Speaker 1: so this often leads to sketchy situations that deters some 402 00:24:38,119 --> 00:24:43,960 Speaker 1: women from completing training school, which landsome in debt um 403 00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:46,920 Speaker 1: And we've got to talk about these cases that have now, 404 00:24:46,960 --> 00:24:49,280 Speaker 1: I mean that are already like in court. So in May, 405 00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:55,200 Speaker 1: three lead plaintiffs filed a federal class action suit against 406 00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:59,760 Speaker 1: c r ST Expedited Trucking alleging sexual harassment, assault, and 407 00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:03,639 Speaker 1: rape during training. And according to the lawsuit, this issue 408 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:07,240 Speaker 1: is so well known and brushed aside in the industry 409 00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:12,840 Speaker 1: that cr ST is jokingly referred to as constantly raping 410 00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:16,479 Speaker 1: student truckers. Yeah, I mean, we read its stories about 411 00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:21,320 Speaker 1: women having to carry knives, tasers, even screw drivers as 412 00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:26,359 Speaker 1: weapons to fend off abusive trainers. Women talking about waking 413 00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:27,840 Speaker 1: up in their bunk in the middle of the nine 414 00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:30,960 Speaker 1: having a naked man on top of them, all sorts 415 00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:35,840 Speaker 1: of insane scenarios. And like Kristen was just saying, you're 416 00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:40,000 Speaker 1: sort of locked in because if you leave the CRST training, 417 00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:44,040 Speaker 1: for instance, early, because of sexual assault or sexual harassment, 418 00:25:44,760 --> 00:25:47,840 Speaker 1: you wind up with tuition debt because so they'll front 419 00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:50,360 Speaker 1: you some tuition money, but they will only forgive that 420 00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:55,120 Speaker 1: debt if you pass your training and then sign an 421 00:25:55,119 --> 00:25:58,199 Speaker 1: eight month commitment after graduating. And so you know, we 422 00:25:58,280 --> 00:26:00,119 Speaker 1: read about all of these women who were saying that, 423 00:26:00,560 --> 00:26:02,199 Speaker 1: you know, I held on by the skin of my 424 00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:05,120 Speaker 1: teeth dealing with all of this horrifying stuff and still 425 00:26:05,720 --> 00:26:07,680 Speaker 1: couldn't make it. I still had to be dropped off 426 00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:09,880 Speaker 1: at a at a terminal or a truck stop and 427 00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:13,119 Speaker 1: ask for help. Yeah, because this, I mean, the training 428 00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:17,520 Speaker 1: environment with the code driving for weeks at a time 429 00:26:17,840 --> 00:26:23,480 Speaker 1: sometimes sets the stage for coercion because trainers might threaten 430 00:26:23,600 --> 00:26:27,199 Speaker 1: not to pass them as a way to, you know, 431 00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:31,800 Speaker 1: try to lure them into unwanted sexual activity. And lawyers 432 00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:36,080 Speaker 1: told Fast Company magazine that when women to CRST due 433 00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:40,000 Speaker 1: to sexual harassment, the company is known to counterclaim to 434 00:26:40,119 --> 00:26:42,879 Speaker 1: recover the cost of training. And then there seems to 435 00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:46,840 Speaker 1: be a particular issue with this trucking company. Um. And 436 00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:48,919 Speaker 1: also I want to give a shout out to and 437 00:26:49,280 --> 00:26:52,639 Speaker 1: really in depth piece over at Jezebel um where a 438 00:26:52,640 --> 00:26:55,600 Speaker 1: lot of this information is coming from as well. Yeah, 439 00:26:55,600 --> 00:26:57,879 Speaker 1: and coming from that Jezebel article, there was actually a 440 00:26:57,920 --> 00:27:02,920 Speaker 1: case in when CRST lost a lawsuit. Uh, they had 441 00:27:02,960 --> 00:27:07,560 Speaker 1: to pay a driver one point five million dollars because 442 00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:11,080 Speaker 1: she alleged that her trainer, this guy named John Wilson, 443 00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:14,800 Speaker 1: subjected her to constant sexual comments in touching, and that 444 00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:17,399 Speaker 1: her reports of the corporate office were ignored. And we 445 00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:19,159 Speaker 1: hear this over and over again, all the stuff we 446 00:27:19,240 --> 00:27:22,880 Speaker 1: read that it doesn't matter what you've experienced and who 447 00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:25,520 Speaker 1: you tell it tends to get laughed off and just 448 00:27:25,560 --> 00:27:28,840 Speaker 1: brushed under the rug. And again, it does seem to 449 00:27:28,880 --> 00:27:31,840 Speaker 1: be an issue with this particular company, and how it 450 00:27:31,880 --> 00:27:34,840 Speaker 1: has gone on for so long boggles my mind, because 451 00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:37,800 Speaker 1: if we go back to two thousand seven, there was 452 00:27:37,840 --> 00:27:42,760 Speaker 1: a case brought to the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission alleging 453 00:27:43,119 --> 00:27:47,959 Speaker 1: seventy two women two at CRST complained of sexual harassment 454 00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:52,080 Speaker 1: and two thousand five alone just in one year, and 455 00:27:52,119 --> 00:27:55,639 Speaker 1: that case was eventually dissolved because of they were like 456 00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:59,840 Speaker 1: bureaucratic steps that weren't taken um. But the thing about 457 00:27:59,880 --> 00:28:03,360 Speaker 1: it is, as Jezebel and Fast Company reported, what typically 458 00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:07,880 Speaker 1: happens to the trainers in these situations is not much. 459 00:28:07,960 --> 00:28:11,720 Speaker 1: They may have their pay docked and they're typically shuffled 460 00:28:11,760 --> 00:28:17,600 Speaker 1: around two different students, like training students labeled as just 461 00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:20,600 Speaker 1: having quote personality problems. Yeah, but you, as the person 462 00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:24,879 Speaker 1: being trained, you don't know who has personality problems, and 463 00:28:24,920 --> 00:28:26,560 Speaker 1: you don't know if it's just like, oh, they don't 464 00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:29,560 Speaker 1: brush their teeth so they're kind of smelly, or if 465 00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:32,639 Speaker 1: it's because they tried to rape someone. And then the 466 00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:36,560 Speaker 1: company is saying, Okay, get in the car, get in 467 00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:39,160 Speaker 1: a truck with this person that you're gonna have to 468 00:28:39,160 --> 00:28:41,600 Speaker 1: sleep on the road with these tiny sleeper cabs, and 469 00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:44,280 Speaker 1: a truck stops and out in the middle of nowhere. 470 00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:46,560 Speaker 1: Go ahead, just go on the open road for a 471 00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:49,720 Speaker 1: few weeks. Yeah. And a lot of women uh in 472 00:28:49,840 --> 00:28:53,240 Speaker 1: these articles brought up the point that many of the 473 00:28:53,280 --> 00:28:56,160 Speaker 1: trainers that they worked with were recently out of prison 474 00:28:56,640 --> 00:28:59,720 Speaker 1: and no, there's nothing wrong with that in a vacuum. 475 00:28:59,800 --> 00:29:03,200 Speaker 1: How However, just like we don't know what these personality 476 00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:06,280 Speaker 1: problems on these charts indicate. If a man went to 477 00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:09,880 Speaker 1: prison for rape or sexual assault and then he becomes 478 00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:11,600 Speaker 1: a trainer and he's locked in a cab with this 479 00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:15,920 Speaker 1: woman for three weeks at a time, that's a dangerous situation. 480 00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:18,360 Speaker 1: It seems like pertinent information you would you would want 481 00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:22,960 Speaker 1: to know as a student. Um And one thing that 482 00:29:23,560 --> 00:29:26,200 Speaker 1: a fast Company and Jezebel pointed out about this is 483 00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:30,480 Speaker 1: how this issue of sexual assault within our Sexual harassment 484 00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:37,160 Speaker 1: within the trucking industry is just it's so stunning to 485 00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:40,520 Speaker 1: the to a greater degree than the issue of sexual 486 00:29:40,560 --> 00:29:44,720 Speaker 1: harassment and Silicon Valley. Yet we hear about Silicon Valley 487 00:29:44,760 --> 00:29:47,600 Speaker 1: and the issues um within the tech industry so much 488 00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:50,160 Speaker 1: more often. And I think it was a writer in 489 00:29:50,160 --> 00:29:54,440 Speaker 1: in Fast Company saying that this is a clear issue 490 00:29:55,000 --> 00:30:01,760 Speaker 1: of class discrimination. Yeah, you know exactly, um. Reflecting on 491 00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:05,000 Speaker 1: the Fast Company stats, the Jezebel writer said, it's hard 492 00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:07,440 Speaker 1: to miss the class element that's likely at work a 493 00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:10,360 Speaker 1: greater interest in the suffering of women in a money flush, 494 00:30:10,800 --> 00:30:14,480 Speaker 1: very public, buzz heavy industry. And although trucking is a 495 00:30:14,480 --> 00:30:17,920 Speaker 1: core part of how the American economy functions, there's a 496 00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:21,800 Speaker 1: general ignorance about how it works, a lack of visibility 497 00:30:21,840 --> 00:30:25,560 Speaker 1: that's benefited some in the trucking industry and hurt many others. 498 00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:27,880 Speaker 1: And of course this isn't to create some kind of 499 00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:31,320 Speaker 1: hierarchy of like which sexual erasma should we care about more, 500 00:30:31,920 --> 00:30:35,240 Speaker 1: But the fact that we aren't more informed about this 501 00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:39,600 Speaker 1: is troubling. And it's even more troubling when you think 502 00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:43,080 Speaker 1: about proposed safety solutions because a lot of times it's 503 00:30:43,160 --> 00:30:47,680 Speaker 1: left up to the women themselves. Carry weapons, install a 504 00:30:47,720 --> 00:30:49,720 Speaker 1: camera in your truck, don't park in the back of 505 00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:53,880 Speaker 1: a parking lot at a truck stop, or walk between trucks. 506 00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:56,240 Speaker 1: That is one piece of advice. Don't walk between trucks, 507 00:30:56,560 --> 00:31:00,640 Speaker 1: And it's also troubling in the context of these super 508 00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:03,960 Speaker 1: strong recruiting efforts that are going on now. It's like, yeah, 509 00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:08,360 Speaker 1: it's I'm always an advocate for getting more women into 510 00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:12,280 Speaker 1: positions where they can make a study living, support themselves 511 00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:15,040 Speaker 1: and or their families, feel empowered do what they want 512 00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:19,360 Speaker 1: to do. However, I think it's a little shady when 513 00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:24,120 Speaker 1: you're recruiting strongly a group of people who are at 514 00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:30,000 Speaker 1: an incredible statistical risk of sexual violence. Like we should 515 00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:34,560 Speaker 1: probably be following Desiree Woods lead would of real women 516 00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:38,840 Speaker 1: trucking and trying to inform ourselves and women at large 517 00:31:38,920 --> 00:31:44,760 Speaker 1: about these issues, especially when the question of sexual harassment 518 00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:48,880 Speaker 1: comes up. If you're talking to someone with closer industry ties, 519 00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:52,360 Speaker 1: they're usually like, oh, yeah, I mean, we definitely need 520 00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:55,480 Speaker 1: to fix that problem now now that more women are 521 00:31:55,520 --> 00:31:57,880 Speaker 1: coming into the job, we should absolutely look into it. 522 00:31:57,960 --> 00:32:01,720 Speaker 1: It's like, so it was fine, you know, five ten 523 00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:07,040 Speaker 1: twenty years ago. Like yeah, and and you know, we 524 00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:08,720 Speaker 1: we read a lot. There were again a lot of 525 00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:11,120 Speaker 1: comments on these articles from from women who've been in 526 00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:15,200 Speaker 1: trucking for a while, who said, you know, I experienced 527 00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:19,600 Speaker 1: nothing but politeness. I was treated with respect. You know. 528 00:32:19,680 --> 00:32:22,600 Speaker 1: The worst I ever had to deal with was surprised 529 00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:25,040 Speaker 1: that a woman was doing this job. And to them, 530 00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:28,680 Speaker 1: I say, congratulations, Like that's great. I think it's fabulous 531 00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:30,360 Speaker 1: that you're getting to do this job and make this 532 00:32:30,440 --> 00:32:33,200 Speaker 1: money and not have to deal with this. But that 533 00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:37,440 Speaker 1: positive experience doesn't discount the horrifically negative experience that so 534 00:32:37,480 --> 00:32:39,360 Speaker 1: many women have had. Yeah. I mean, and this is 535 00:32:39,400 --> 00:32:42,040 Speaker 1: one reason why you do see a lot of husband 536 00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:44,560 Speaker 1: wife duos a because then you get to like hang 537 00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:47,360 Speaker 1: out together. But also for safety's sake, I mean, it 538 00:32:47,400 --> 00:32:50,080 Speaker 1: helps to have a guy that you know and trust 539 00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:54,600 Speaker 1: in the truck with you. But I mean it seems 540 00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:58,760 Speaker 1: like if you are a female trucker, you often take 541 00:32:58,800 --> 00:33:01,920 Speaker 1: the good with the bad. Um. This was something reflected 542 00:33:02,040 --> 00:33:07,440 Speaker 1: in a number of comments on a BBC article we read. 543 00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:11,520 Speaker 1: Um Rebecca horsefull Uh said I was a lorry driver 544 00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:14,680 Speaker 1: twenty five years ago and it was really abnormal for 545 00:33:14,840 --> 00:33:18,560 Speaker 1: women to drive trucks. The porn photos all over the 546 00:33:18,600 --> 00:33:20,880 Speaker 1: walls of depots where I picked up or dropped off 547 00:33:20,920 --> 00:33:24,440 Speaker 1: machine parts and cables were incredible because no women ever 548 00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:27,440 Speaker 1: went there. And of course the men were sexist. They 549 00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:30,720 Speaker 1: were always trying to take overloading my wagon or roping 550 00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:32,640 Speaker 1: it for me because they didn't believe I could manage. 551 00:33:32,840 --> 00:33:36,320 Speaker 1: But it added fun sides too, And it's funny because 552 00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:39,160 Speaker 1: that just reminded me of when we talked about pin 553 00:33:39,240 --> 00:33:42,640 Speaker 1: up girls and men having in in any industry, not 554 00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:46,080 Speaker 1: just trekking men having all of these sexy pin up 555 00:33:46,120 --> 00:33:50,160 Speaker 1: calendars all over the place, and how in so many 556 00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:53,760 Speaker 1: other episodes where we've discussed men being so reluctant to 557 00:33:53,880 --> 00:33:59,600 Speaker 1: welcome women into a previously or currently male dominated field 558 00:33:59,600 --> 00:34:01,880 Speaker 1: because it's like, oh wait, you expect me to act 559 00:34:02,000 --> 00:34:05,040 Speaker 1: like a person, like that's crazy. I have to act 560 00:34:05,080 --> 00:34:08,960 Speaker 1: like a normal human being. But I do want to 561 00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:12,480 Speaker 1: end the episode on a positive note because there were 562 00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:17,160 Speaker 1: women reread about, including Desiree Wood, who enjoy trucking. It's 563 00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:19,839 Speaker 1: just clear that it's it regardless of who you are. 564 00:34:20,040 --> 00:34:23,360 Speaker 1: It is a particular, very particular kind of lifestyle that 565 00:34:23,400 --> 00:34:27,040 Speaker 1: not a lot of people are cut out for um. 566 00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:31,279 Speaker 1: But Lindsay Williams commented over the BBC, I've had a 567 00:34:31,280 --> 00:34:34,520 Speaker 1: Class one license for about twenty four years. My childhood 568 00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:36,560 Speaker 1: was spent on the family farm, and I was driving 569 00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:39,160 Speaker 1: a tractor at eleven years old, so I guess that's 570 00:34:39,200 --> 00:34:42,080 Speaker 1: how I started. I drive a big rig and it's 571 00:34:42,120 --> 00:34:44,960 Speaker 1: given me confidence and self esteem, and it gives me 572 00:34:45,000 --> 00:34:48,239 Speaker 1: a chance to see the country and appreciate nature. I've 573 00:34:48,280 --> 00:34:51,319 Speaker 1: earned the respect of my driving colleagues, and it's a 574 00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:55,000 Speaker 1: wonderful feeling to know that I've earned their respect. But 575 00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:57,600 Speaker 1: the bad pits are I hate being in big queues 576 00:34:58,000 --> 00:35:03,960 Speaker 1: of stationary traffic. I hear you like I driving in Atlanta. 577 00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:06,960 Speaker 1: I lose my mind every time I've in traffic. But 578 00:35:07,040 --> 00:35:10,680 Speaker 1: also I watch how the idiots and jerks in Atlanta 579 00:35:11,320 --> 00:35:15,400 Speaker 1: drive around truckers and I can't imagine it, like, Hello, 580 00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:20,160 Speaker 1: they are driving a massive vehicle that weighs a lot. 581 00:35:20,280 --> 00:35:23,799 Speaker 1: You can't just cut them off in Atlanta traffic on 582 00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:27,360 Speaker 1: I seventy five in the middle of rush hour and 583 00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:29,520 Speaker 1: expect your car to be in one piece when you 584 00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:32,279 Speaker 1: do it, Like I feel like I just want a 585 00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:35,440 Speaker 1: bumper sticker. That's like, I love truckers because I will 586 00:35:35,480 --> 00:35:37,520 Speaker 1: always let them in the lane. If they have a 587 00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:39,719 Speaker 1: blinker on, I will let them over. Because so many 588 00:35:39,760 --> 00:35:43,200 Speaker 1: people in Atlanta are so awful to truckers. Uh. And 589 00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:45,560 Speaker 1: yet again, Caroline, we need we need to make those, 590 00:35:45,600 --> 00:35:48,200 Speaker 1: Caroline says, relaxed t shirts so you can, you know, 591 00:35:48,280 --> 00:35:51,640 Speaker 1: throw it, throwing those passenger seats as you're driving by them. Yes, 592 00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:54,480 Speaker 1: I know, everybody, just relax. It doesn't matter what you 593 00:35:54,520 --> 00:36:01,680 Speaker 1: look like in general period set the takeaway. UM. So 594 00:36:01,880 --> 00:36:06,000 Speaker 1: clearly this is an industry looking for a lot of women. Um. 595 00:36:06,040 --> 00:36:09,600 Speaker 1: But it needs to make some major reforms in order 596 00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:12,400 Speaker 1: for that to be sustainable. And and I don't I 597 00:36:12,440 --> 00:36:15,800 Speaker 1: appreciate people like our listener Greg who wrote in wanting 598 00:36:15,840 --> 00:36:19,280 Speaker 1: us to talk about this issue, because people like Ellen 599 00:36:19,360 --> 00:36:23,440 Speaker 1: Boy have pointed out that so many people still just 600 00:36:23,480 --> 00:36:25,799 Speaker 1: like flat out don't want women in the industry and 601 00:36:25,880 --> 00:36:28,120 Speaker 1: don't think they should be there, which I think is 602 00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:33,680 Speaker 1: so it's so ridiculous when there are so many open 603 00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:38,279 Speaker 1: jobs in trucking, women who get into the industry are 604 00:36:38,360 --> 00:36:41,840 Speaker 1: literally taking nothing away from men. They're literally taking nothing 605 00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:44,200 Speaker 1: away because the job is open. There are tens of 606 00:36:44,239 --> 00:36:50,160 Speaker 1: thousands of unfilled trucking jobs. So I I would frankly 607 00:36:50,239 --> 00:36:52,520 Speaker 1: love to hear from our trucker audience. I need, I 608 00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:55,120 Speaker 1: need to know some more firsthand stuff well, and also 609 00:36:56,239 --> 00:36:59,000 Speaker 1: I want to hear from men and women too, because, 610 00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:04,239 Speaker 1: as listener Greg demonstrates, I mean, there are obviously men 611 00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:10,240 Speaker 1: in this industry who are you know, perfectly great people 612 00:37:10,480 --> 00:37:14,759 Speaker 1: who realize that there's a problem and are invested in 613 00:37:14,760 --> 00:37:18,520 Speaker 1: in helping solve it too. So I'm just so curious 614 00:37:18,560 --> 00:37:19,960 Speaker 1: to know because there are so many issues. There's the 615 00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:25,440 Speaker 1: pay issue, there's health, there's you know, um employee organization. Um. 616 00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:27,759 Speaker 1: So I just I'm just curious to hear from from 617 00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:30,160 Speaker 1: folks on the road what it's really like, what it's 618 00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:33,680 Speaker 1: been your experience. Mom Stuff at house stuff works dot 619 00:37:33,719 --> 00:37:36,600 Speaker 1: Com is our email address. You can also tweet us 620 00:37:36,600 --> 00:37:40,120 Speaker 1: at mom Stuff podcast or message us on Facebook, and 621 00:37:40,120 --> 00:37:42,200 Speaker 1: we've got a couple of messages to share with you 622 00:37:42,239 --> 00:37:50,520 Speaker 1: when we come right back from a quick break. I 623 00:37:50,520 --> 00:37:52,680 Speaker 1: have a letter here from Sarah in response to our 624 00:37:52,719 --> 00:37:56,160 Speaker 1: miscarriage episode. Sarah writes, I've wanted to write you for 625 00:37:56,200 --> 00:37:58,719 Speaker 1: a while, but when I saw your new podcast pop up, 626 00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:01,400 Speaker 1: I figured now was the time. Time. Last year, my 627 00:38:01,440 --> 00:38:04,680 Speaker 1: baby was still born at thirty eight weeks. Doctors told 628 00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:06,640 Speaker 1: us pretty early on that there were some problems with 629 00:38:06,680 --> 00:38:09,400 Speaker 1: my placenta. I learned that when they tell you you 630 00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:12,800 Speaker 1: have a thick placenta, it's not meant as a compliment. Boops. 631 00:38:13,239 --> 00:38:16,360 Speaker 1: But we ran every test possible and everything always looked fine. 632 00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:18,560 Speaker 1: So we planned for the best and never assumed that 633 00:38:18,600 --> 00:38:21,600 Speaker 1: the worst would happen. Well, it was and still can 634 00:38:21,640 --> 00:38:24,319 Speaker 1: be a deeply sad time. Something that helped me to 635 00:38:24,360 --> 00:38:27,000 Speaker 1: avoid a lot of the guilt and shame you described 636 00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:30,000 Speaker 1: was asking my doctor a lot of questions about why 637 00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:32,880 Speaker 1: it happened. I found that understanding at least some of 638 00:38:32,880 --> 00:38:35,480 Speaker 1: the science steered me away from the magical thinking that 639 00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:38,799 Speaker 1: doctor Zucker described and gave me a concrete reason for 640 00:38:38,880 --> 00:38:41,719 Speaker 1: why it happened. It also helps offen the blow when 641 00:38:41,719 --> 00:38:45,239 Speaker 1: people inevitably told me everything happens for a reason, I 642 00:38:45,239 --> 00:38:48,040 Speaker 1: could respond in my head with yes, and the reason 643 00:38:48,200 --> 00:38:51,200 Speaker 1: is that sometimes cells don't divide normally, creating a challenging 644 00:38:51,239 --> 00:38:54,480 Speaker 1: environment in which to sustain a healthy baby. It didn't 645 00:38:54,520 --> 00:38:57,279 Speaker 1: make the loss of my daughter any less devastating, but 646 00:38:57,360 --> 00:38:59,240 Speaker 1: it at least gave me an answer to the big 647 00:38:59,320 --> 00:39:03,840 Speaker 1: question of why something so horrible could happen, science happens. 648 00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:07,160 Speaker 1: What really resonated with me is when Dr Zucker talked 649 00:39:07,160 --> 00:39:09,560 Speaker 1: about people not knowing how to approach you after such 650 00:39:09,560 --> 00:39:12,439 Speaker 1: a loss. After the initial I'm sorry for your loss, 651 00:39:12,440 --> 00:39:14,160 Speaker 1: people would tell me that they didn't want to bring 652 00:39:14,160 --> 00:39:16,839 Speaker 1: it up because they didn't want to remind me, which 653 00:39:16,880 --> 00:39:19,719 Speaker 1: basically meant that it almost never came up again. I 654 00:39:19,800 --> 00:39:21,960 Speaker 1: knew in my head that I wasn't forgotten and she 655 00:39:22,080 --> 00:39:24,399 Speaker 1: wasn't forgotten, but it sure felt like that and made 656 00:39:24,400 --> 00:39:26,799 Speaker 1: me feel very alone. One thing that I would like 657 00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:28,680 Speaker 1: to tell people who want to be there for someone 658 00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:31,440 Speaker 1: going through a loss is this, I'm thinking about it 659 00:39:31,520 --> 00:39:33,319 Speaker 1: whether you bring it up or not, so you might 660 00:39:33,360 --> 00:39:35,879 Speaker 1: as well show your support and bring it up. I'm 661 00:39:35,920 --> 00:39:38,319 Speaker 1: sure that's not true for everyone, but it was and 662 00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:41,239 Speaker 1: still is very true for me. Also, just because I'm 663 00:39:41,280 --> 00:39:44,319 Speaker 1: the one going through it doesn't mean I necessarily know 664 00:39:44,360 --> 00:39:46,759 Speaker 1: how to approach the subject or have the language to 665 00:39:46,800 --> 00:39:49,920 Speaker 1: talk about it either. The kindest thing you could do 666 00:39:50,080 --> 00:39:52,319 Speaker 1: is talk with me, even if it's uncomfortable for you, 667 00:39:52,640 --> 00:39:55,600 Speaker 1: because it is way more uncomfortable for me, and it's 668 00:39:55,680 --> 00:39:59,000 Speaker 1: hard to get comfortable with something you can't talk about 669 00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:02,600 Speaker 1: any When I was on quote unquote maternity leave afterward, 670 00:40:02,680 --> 00:40:04,560 Speaker 1: I was looking for things to read and listen to 671 00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:06,800 Speaker 1: to occupy my brain, and that's how I found you, guys. 672 00:40:07,160 --> 00:40:09,040 Speaker 1: Thank you for being there for me and getting me 673 00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:11,520 Speaker 1: re engaged with the world. I'm a teacher and your 674 00:40:11,520 --> 00:40:14,840 Speaker 1: podcast always gives me ideas for topics to introduce to kids, 675 00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:18,480 Speaker 1: to broaden their beliefs and challenge their expectations. Well, thank 676 00:40:18,520 --> 00:40:21,480 Speaker 1: you so much, Sarah. We really appreciate your story. And 677 00:40:21,560 --> 00:40:24,400 Speaker 1: I've got a let her here from an anonymous listener 678 00:40:24,520 --> 00:40:29,680 Speaker 1: about our infertility episode, and she writes that episodes stood 679 00:40:29,719 --> 00:40:31,799 Speaker 1: out to me personally for a number of reasons. Though 680 00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:34,560 Speaker 1: I'm only sixteen, the reality that I will never be 681 00:40:34,600 --> 00:40:37,440 Speaker 1: able to bear children is something I was recently faced with. 682 00:40:37,920 --> 00:40:41,160 Speaker 1: I developed an eating disorder at thirteen, which persisted in 683 00:40:41,239 --> 00:40:44,880 Speaker 1: phases throughout my adolescence. The effects of malnutrition on a 684 00:40:44,920 --> 00:40:47,960 Speaker 1: developing body vary, but for me, with my naturally small 685 00:40:48,000 --> 00:40:52,520 Speaker 1: size and severe state of anorexia, it caused chronic amenorrhea 686 00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:55,480 Speaker 1: and damage to my ovaries and uterus. As I recently 687 00:40:55,560 --> 00:40:58,279 Speaker 1: learned from my kind of colleges. The reality of this 688 00:40:58,520 --> 00:41:00,759 Speaker 1: is heavy, and I have yet to fully comprehend it. 689 00:41:01,120 --> 00:41:03,919 Speaker 1: As an absinent teenager, I've never given much serious thought 690 00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:06,440 Speaker 1: to my possible future as a mother. I guess now 691 00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:08,359 Speaker 1: the decision is made for me that if I ever 692 00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:11,600 Speaker 1: choose to have children, I'll have to go through alternate methods. 693 00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:14,640 Speaker 1: Your episode on this topic was somewhat of a stress 694 00:41:14,640 --> 00:41:16,839 Speaker 1: reliever for me on the matter, and gave me lots 695 00:41:16,840 --> 00:41:19,840 Speaker 1: of great information about infertility across the globe and in 696 00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:22,640 Speaker 1: different cultures. I know that if or when the right 697 00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:26,120 Speaker 1: time comes, my inability to conceive does not define who 698 00:41:26,160 --> 00:41:28,400 Speaker 1: I am as a woman or as a person, and 699 00:41:28,440 --> 00:41:31,120 Speaker 1: that there are many other paths to take toward parenthood. 700 00:41:31,480 --> 00:41:33,400 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for your time and dedication to 701 00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:35,880 Speaker 1: talking about these topics and how they pertain to women 702 00:41:35,880 --> 00:41:39,520 Speaker 1: in all walks of life. The show has certainly educated, entertained, 703 00:41:39,520 --> 00:41:41,840 Speaker 1: and encouraged me to be a more inclusive and aware 704 00:41:41,840 --> 00:41:44,800 Speaker 1: of feminist as well as more accepting of myself and others, 705 00:41:45,040 --> 00:41:46,839 Speaker 1: and I hope this has done the same for many 706 00:41:46,880 --> 00:41:50,560 Speaker 1: other fans of the show. Well, thank you so much, Anonymous. 707 00:41:50,640 --> 00:41:56,320 Speaker 1: That is um so so kind to hear and listeners again. 708 00:41:56,480 --> 00:41:59,160 Speaker 1: Our email address is mom stuff at house at work 709 00:41:59,280 --> 00:42:01,600 Speaker 1: dot com and fur links to all of our social 710 00:42:01,600 --> 00:42:04,120 Speaker 1: media as well as all of our blogs, videos, and 711 00:42:04,320 --> 00:42:07,640 Speaker 1: podcasts with our sources so you can learn more about 712 00:42:07,640 --> 00:42:10,440 Speaker 1: women in the trucking industry. Head on over to stuff 713 00:42:10,600 --> 00:42:18,040 Speaker 1: Mom Never Told You dot com for more on this 714 00:42:18,200 --> 00:42:20,680 Speaker 1: and thousands of other topics. Is it how stuff Works 715 00:42:20,719 --> 00:42:28,920 Speaker 1: dot com